Bay 12 Games Forum

Dwarf Fortress => DF Modding => Topic started by: Shukaro on July 05, 2010, 11:19:51 pm

Title: [0.34.XX] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on July 05, 2010, 11:19:51 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/HWq9Z.png)

Have you ever wondered to yourself, "Man, my dwarves are such idiots, I wish I could chisel some intelligence into their heads."? No? Then, er, disregard that last bit. What I present to you, here and now, no strings attached, is a workshop to solve a problem that you probably didn't even know you had! I call it, the Dwarven Higher Learning Mod. Now, what this thingawazzit does, is give your dwarves an opportunity to polish up some skills that they may have trouble practicing elsewhere. You know the situation, Urist McDoctor has your legendary axedwarf on your table, and he's got no idea how to stop him from bleeding out from wounds caused by rogue fluffy wamblers. Or you have precious little metal available on the glacier you so stupidly bravely embarked on, so you can't afford to waste it on dabbling weaponsmiths who've never handled a hammer before in their lives. This mod's workshops allow training through the time-honored traditions of; hitting rocks until your hands bleed, performing repetitive actions that will sap your will to live, practicing your skills on subjects that are worth less than most peasants (and won't sue for malpractice), and studying the works of your fellow dwarves, knowing full-well that you'll never be quite as good as them. Any questions, comments, suggestions (especially these), complaints, offers of money, or threats of lawsuits (I have an awesome lawyerdwarf, just sayin') should be presented in this thread.

------------------------------------------------

This mod contains five new workshops.

The Training Workshop
This workshop gives your unskilled laborers a chance to hone their skills (overseers not included).
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The Library
A quiet place for scholarly pursuits, the honing of all social skills, and booze.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The Medical Ward
Where dwarves who've failed out of the Mountainhome Medical School for Dwarves go to practice their skills.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The Training Dummy
A construct of incredibly intricate design, which dwarves may whack to improve their skills. Beware, it may fight back. Sometimes with water.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The Printers Workshop
The place where dwarves get down to the dirty work of producing literature. And paper.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Please use profiles to determine which dwarves you want to train.

------------------------------------------------------------

So, you've been enticed by these morsels and promises of epic, er, something or other? Yes? Then follow these simple instructions and you'll be running my mod in no time. No? Then carefully create a lever, connect it to an adjacent support, build a wide floor on said support, use the profile screen to restrict the lever's use to you, and add the Pull task to the lever. Then recieve your prize.

------------------------------------------------------------

Download HERE (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=3535)

Simply extract the .zip file directly into your Dwarf Fortress folder.
If you have mods that change the entity_default already installed, then do not extract entity_default.
Instead, add these lines to the Mountain entry (Typically the first one) in entity_default in your raw/objects folder after you have extracted the other files. (If you aren't playing as dwarves, then add it to the appropriate entry)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

------------------------------------------------------------

Remember, adding new buildings or reactions to an existing world will not work. You must generate a new world after adding these files to raw/objects and/or adding lines to entity_default.

Many thanks to everybody with their helpful suggestions and feedback. Special thanks go to Shaostul (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=55259.0), without his amazing guide this mod would not be possible. To Zared (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=2068) for his amazing workshop drawing tool. And of course special thanks to Toady, without his amazing game, our lives would be bleak, desolate, and quite dull.

Changelog
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

FAQ
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Dummedu on July 05, 2010, 11:53:34 pm
Cool mod bro, there was such threads time ago, and there was a hard discuss about the skills. (It was possible to learn all the skills and people was like "wtf, how can dorrf become an uber-fighter reading literature?")
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: rgon842 on July 06, 2010, 01:05:44 am
Cool mod bro, there was such threads time ago, and there was a hard discuss about the skills. (It was possible to learn all the skills and people was like "wtf, how can dorrf become an uber-fighter reading literature?")

Because the pen is mightier than the sword.  :P

Nice job, Shukaro! This workshop will be helpful to my little schizophrenics; learning to smelt steel through reading a pamphlet show clearly demonstrate the comprehension capacities of the bearded ones.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: BoomClap on July 06, 2010, 01:09:05 am
what's the point.. and I just feel like this is just a cheap rip-off of deon's genesis mod.

I mean, studying mining in library? WTF?

studying medical skills and social skills in library makes sense.

Not some ... mining.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Passive Fist on July 06, 2010, 01:31:35 am
Cool idea, I'll try it out.

And mining doesn't seem like the thing you'd care about wasting on an unskilled dwarf. More important, expensive-to-train skills on the other hand... Like Siege Engineering, Gemcutting if you have no sand, you get the picture.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: UmbrageOfSnow on July 06, 2010, 01:38:40 am
what's the point.. and I just feel like this is just a cheap rip-off of deon's genesis mod.


Seriously?  The thing that impresses you about Genesis is that he has some training workshops?  Not the Dwarf castes or the other races or the dozen extra mods folded in?  It's the anatomical theatre and the training dummy and the library that has 0 overlap with this one?

Some people maybe want to just have a library, not a Snakemen invasion in the middle of Obsidian Dwarf induced stockpile fire.  (Not me though, I'm really liking the flaming dorfs).

And honestly, I can see wanting to vary what you have.  Maybe have training dummy and anatomical theatre and both libraries.

I'm with you on the mining thing though.  Siege engineering would not be amiss.

Also, what about adding more skills, but making the library bigger.

But the name Library isn't exactly trademarked by Deon.  Still maybe several different libraries could be named: Reference Library, Trade Library, Public Library, Technical Library, Stacks, etc.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: The Architect on July 06, 2010, 02:09:08 am
Marking this very interesting thread so I don't forget about it.

I think making a single large workshop would defeat the purpose of a large library. You'd want to make dozens of small workshops or "sections" and arrange them into a large dwarven library, so many dwarves could read at once. Hopefully in an atmosphere of huge, imposing carved columns and engraved walkways.

Don't you love it when posting or reading gives you a new great idea for your fortresses!?
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Acanthus117 on July 06, 2010, 02:18:13 am
Marking this very interesting thread so I don't forget about it.

I also agree with him on the smaller workshop part.

Imagine if they're like study tables, and they use 'books' in the reaction to train or something...
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: HammerHand on July 06, 2010, 05:09:51 am
Also marking this thread.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Patchouli on July 06, 2010, 05:14:19 am
Marking this very interesting thread so I don't forget about it.

I also agree with him on the smaller workshop part.

Imagine if they're like study tables, and they use 'books' in the reaction to train or something...
That's what I did for my game. I just put a low percent chance of getting the book back, so you have to keep printing books to get "easy" skills.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 07:49:02 am
What I want with this workshop is to make it so skills that are difficult to train elsewhere can be trained here, at a cost. About the smaller workshops, I think I'll split it into two or possibly three workshops for different skills. Thanks for all the input guys! And the books are sounding pretty good, I might do something like "tablets" or something.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Moontayle on July 06, 2010, 08:07:35 am
Create a reaction and tack it onto the soap makers workshop that allows for the creation of wax tablets. Since wax is highly malleable it would work well as a writing tablet that can be used over and over again. Just set the return rate at 90% for the studying reaction which allows you to simulate when the wax tablet is no longer usable. And wax is just a tallow product so it would fit. Just a suggestion.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 08:30:53 am
That actually sounds pretty realistic, although it suffers from the problem of being crippled in forts without animals, I'll check it out.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: jaked122 on July 06, 2010, 08:45:34 am
what's the point.. and I just feel like this is just a cheap rip-off of deon's genesis mod.

I mean, studying mining in library? WTF?

studying medical skills and social skills in library makes sense.

Not some ... mining.
proper swinging technique
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Ratbert_CP on July 06, 2010, 09:02:15 am
If you could tie it to the dwarfs Student skill, perhaps toss in a "Librarian" with Teaching skill...  Set limits on how high you could train, based on these factors (and perhaps the availability of lab materials), then this would be a very cool mod.  Not that it isn't as it stands!

I do like the idea of individual workshops for each skill (or skill cluster), that you could then arrange into your own library/community college/university.  Hmmm...  How to require an appointed dwarf to enable the reactions?  If possible, how to tie that dwarfs skill to the quality of reactions?

Library = pamphlets only, low skill increases.  Librarian noble required.
Community college = books, low-grade teachers and poor lab materials, moderate skill gains.  Librarian noble required.
University = books, high-grade teachers and fine lab materials, significant skill gains.  Provost/chancellor noble required.

Again, depends on if/how the quality of the reagents and custom positions can be worked into the equation.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 09:09:33 am
Those are great ideas, but right now you sadly can't tie nobles to workshops. But you can, if you want set maximum skill "allowed" in the workshop via profiles, and you can also set quality limits on custom stockpiles. As for quality, I'm not sure, if a custom workshop's items can have a quality modifier, I'll have to test that, or someone else will say. Much of the stuff that it would be awesome to be able to get at is still hardcoded and out of reach.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Ratbert_CP on July 06, 2010, 09:18:15 am
Darn.  You can still add the nobles into the raws, and use them for flavor.  And in preparation for Toady someday opening up the noble/workshop interactions...  :)
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 09:43:42 am
Yeah, then people could make a library burrow, and assign them to it, pretty cool, if purely aesthetic.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 10:05:30 am
Ok, I think I've got what I want to do for v2.0 down pretty well. There will be 3 workshops, a training workshop, a library, and a combat dummy (got the idea from the genesis mod (awesome mod by Deon, we should give him cookies)). The training workshop will have physical nonmilitary skills like mining and engraving, the library will have nonphysical nonmilitary skills like organizing and surgery, and the dummy will have combat skills. I'm also adding a new item called chalk slate which will be used as a reagent for most of the reactions and can be produced in the training workshop.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: jaked122 on July 06, 2010, 11:08:37 am
Yeah, then people could make a library burrow, and assign them to it, pretty cool, if purely aesthetic.
build a noble into a workshop... place workshop into path of lava flow.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Eagleon on July 06, 2010, 11:40:25 am
More book materials:
Slate
Shale
Mica
Leather
Cloth
Metal sheets

Thicker materials (like Slate and Leather) would probably require more individual items. Metal is the ultimate dwarfy book material IMO. And don't forget the dyes available! If I were making a library mod I'd add those to the reactions if it made sense. Cloth and leather books would last a lot longer than slate, shale and mica would fall apart easily, and metal would last the longest. And if you made books something ownable, dwarves could wander off with them to their rooms, an annoying but amusing problem (especially if they can still be used in the training "reactions" and are subsequently destroyed)
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: SquirrelWizard on July 06, 2010, 12:11:26 pm
Awesome idea, but i have a couple of question, int he library reaction to practice surgery, suturing, and wound dressing requires meat to practice with. I'm not big on leaving meat around to rot (not for the loss of food, but more for concerns regarding the creation of miasma.)

would it be possible to remove the meat parts from teh reaction and have it work?
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Ratbert_CP on July 06, 2010, 12:28:35 pm
Awesome idea, but i have a couple of question, int he library reaction to practice surgery, suturing, and wound dressing requires meat to practice with. I'm not big on leaving meat around to rot (not for the loss of food, but more for concerns regarding the creation of miasma.)

would it be possible to remove the meat parts from teh reaction and have it work?

New reaction: Convert corpses (or meat) into cadavers for learning...  :)
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Star Weaver on July 06, 2010, 12:29:42 pm
I noticed in the error log that it was complaining about an invalid BUILD_LABOR of MASONRY for the building. I changed it to MASON and it stopped complaining. Looks like there's not full overlap with SKILL tags for that :\
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 02:14:52 pm
Thanks for the heads up on the labor, I'll fix it in the next release. As for the meat, I think I'll make a fourth workshop for medical skills, and it will probably use a conversion reaction or two like that. As for the different properties of books, really the only distinction that I could make would be between things that can rot and those that can't without heavy item modding (so that isn't out of the realm of possibility for later releases), but as far as any functional difference, I can't make reactions give more or less experience at the moment. As for ownership, right now, the slates are classified as toys, so that's entirely possible.

EDIT: By next release I meant right now
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: SquirrelWizard on July 06, 2010, 04:31:51 pm
you dont have to rework the mod regarding the meat, I was just wondering what would happen if I took that particular tag out.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 04:38:05 pm
Nothing bad would happen, if you want to remove meat use, just remove all reagent and product tags that have meat in them.
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 06:39:52 pm
Tada! Ultramegaawesome new major big update!
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: SeigeOps on July 06, 2010, 08:38:54 pm
Tada! Ultramegaawesome new major big update!

Excellent looking mod, will definitely try it. As clarification, any non-eco stone can be used as a reading slate?
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Star Weaver on July 06, 2010, 10:47:53 pm
Cool. I threw 1.0 in as an alternative to making my own medical library, since I mainly want something for my dedicated doctors to do aside from stare at the wall and whine that they can't put their seeds back in the stockpile.

I'll probably throw 2.0 or whatever you're up to in next time I need to gen a new world ^_^.
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Acanthus117 on July 06, 2010, 10:51:12 pm
This is some awesome shiz man!
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 06, 2010, 11:05:42 pm
To SiegeOps, yes, any noneconomic stone can be used. It will respect economic status.

And thanks everyone for the support.  :D
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Ratbert_CP on July 07, 2010, 08:34:24 am
I find it somehow comforting that cadavers are classified as "toys"...  In a purely dwarfy way, of course!  :)
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 07, 2010, 08:39:21 am
Yeah, that just seemed to be the least risky of the item definition tokens to use. I'll probably change it to something else to avoid "microcline cadavers" from craftdwarfs workshops if I can make sure it won't cause any wonky behavior.
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: shadow_slicer on July 07, 2010, 01:53:03 pm
Shouldn't the bar produced by the smithing practice (weapon and armor smithing) be the same type as the bar used as a reactant?

[REACTION:TRAIN_WEAPONSMITHING]
   [NAME:practice weaponsmithing]
   [BUILDING:TRAINING_WORKSHOP:CUSTOM_W]
   [REAGENT:A:1:WEAPON:NONE:METAL:NONE][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
   [REAGENT:B:150:BAR:NONE:METAL:NONE]
   [REAGENT:C:1:TOY:ITEM_CHALK_TABLET:NONE:NONE]
   [PRODUCT:90:1:TOY:ITEM_CHALK_TABLET:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:C:NONE]
   [PRODUCT:90:1:BAR:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT: A B:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
   [SKILL:FORGE_WEAPON]
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 07, 2010, 02:05:32 pm
Yeah, thanks for pointing out the error, fixed now.
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: drayath on July 08, 2010, 01:50:20 pm
Hi,
   Just been playing around with this have a couple of minor bugs for you

*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/building_library.txt"
Unrecognized Labor Token:
CARPENTRY    (soulkd be CARPENTER)
CARPENTRY    (soulkd be CARPENTER)
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/reaction_library.txt"
TRAIN_SURGERY:Unrecognized Material Token: GET_MATERIAL (GET_MATERIAL:FROM_REAGENT instead of GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT)
TRAIN_WOUND_DRESSING:Unrecognized Material Token: GET_MATERIAL (etc)
TRAIN_SUTURING:Unrecognized Material Token: GET_MATERIAL (etc)
TRAIN_BONE_SETTING:Unrecognized Material Token: GET_MATERIAL (etc)
TRAIN_DIAGNOSING:Unrecognized Material Token: GET_MATERIAL (etc)
Unrecognized Skill Token: SUTURING   (should be SUTURE)
Unrecognized Skill Token: SUTURING   (should be SUTURE)

Just as a note if you are not aware, after you start the gen of a world there is an errorlog.txt written to the df folder containing any syntax error in the raw files, though without suggested corrections :)
Title: Re: Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 08, 2010, 03:07:58 pm
Alright thanks for the bug report! Didn't know about the error log before now, whole lot easier than manually finding typos.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: dennislp3 on July 09, 2010, 06:03:08 pm
I am getting (after the above changes) one error

*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/reaction_library.txt"
TRAIN_BONE_SETTING:Unrecognized Material Token: C

I am not a modder and I cant figure out for the life of me any C that is out of place in my file...here is the section

[REACTION:TRAIN_BONE_SETTING]
   [NAME:practice bone setting]
   [BUILDING:MEDICAL_WARD:CUSTOM_B]
   [REAGENT:A:1:SPLINT:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
   [REAGENT:B:1:WOOD:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
   [REAGENT:C:1:TOY:ITEM_CHALK_TABLET:NONE:NONE]
   [PRODUCT:75:1:WOOD:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:B:NONE]
   [PRODUCT:90:1:TOY:ITEM_CHALK_TABLET_GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:C:NONE]
   [SKILL:SET_BONE]

I assume it has something to do with reagent C...but I am too stupid to see what...
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 09, 2010, 06:15:22 pm
That's odd, I have the same raw. What version of DF are you using, and do you use any other mods?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: dennislp3 on July 09, 2010, 06:25:49 pm
I am using version 31.08 and I am using version .42 of the Ironhand Graphics set (so most recent of everything)

I am totally baffled by it...I will try it with Vanilla 31.08 real quick and see what happens...although I see absolutely NO reason why this would be affected by the graphics set...

EDIT

Ok so I dont understand it....at...all...

I reproduced it with the graphics set one about 4 times (deleting the error log every time)

I then used vanilla and got no error

I then deleted my reaction_library file and repasted the corrected one you have posted...and it worked

I dont know where the error came from or anything...but it is resolved so....idk...perhaps I accidentally added a C somewhere else in the file that affected that particular thing?

spose at least now I dont feel so stupid...simply because I couldnt find an answer and its fixed now lol
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 09, 2010, 09:09:29 pm
That's weird, seems like it was just a typo of some sort. Although if it's reproducible with the Ironhand graphics set, then I'll check for possible conflicts.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 10, 2010, 05:40:28 pm
Just a heads up, I'll be gone for the next week. So, can't do more updates until afterward. So, yeah.
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: The Architect on July 10, 2010, 10:26:25 pm
If you could tie it to the dwarfs Student skill, perhaps toss in a "Librarian" with Teaching skill...  Set limits on how high you could train, based on these factors (and perhaps the availability of lab materials), then this would be a very cool mod.  Not that it isn't as it stands!

Wow, what a great idea! I can imagine this becoming the first mod officially adopted into DF by Toady if you got it to such a balanced polish.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Snook on July 11, 2010, 12:45:37 pm
You have no idea how happy this mod makes me. Haven't even used it yet (installing now...) but I'm really looking forward to setting up a library wing in my new fortress for my doctors, smiths, jewelers, and engravers. :D
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Snook on July 12, 2010, 07:04:38 am
Question: Why can I not find the library & such in any build menu?

And yes, I gen'd a new world.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: profit on July 12, 2010, 08:35:52 am
Nice little mod Shukaro.   Just to let you know, from my experience with my stone destroyer mod, a lot of the professions listed in the entity default.txt file do not work in custom buildings yet, but I think as the versions move up more and more will.

  So if any of them do not actually train the skills yet just give it some time and I think they will.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Urist McAddict on July 12, 2010, 10:38:25 am
Why not have teacher's use some workshop to create books from logs and those books would be used in the reaction for the library?
That would make a little bit more sense opposed to creating things from nothing =P
Just a thought here...
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.0.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 17, 2010, 11:15:06 pm
Snook - Have you created and filled the correct files? And added the lines to entity_default under the mountain entry?

Profit - That seems to be a fairly serious problem, I'll have to go through my reactions and make a list of any that don't work.

McAddict - None of the reactions create something from nothing, they all have 1-3 reagents.

I just wish I could mess with skill training rates and level caps with reactions. The closest I could get now is to create two or more reactions for each skill with varying reagents. As for the level caps, I can't touch those now, although you can set them with the profiles menu.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge!
Post by: Shukaro on July 22, 2010, 07:33:14 pm
Good news everybody! Knowledge of paper and books has now reached the mountainhome!

Addendum: Back-to-back out of town trips truly wreak havoc on updates.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Snook on July 31, 2010, 11:45:23 am
*cough* Does this still work for 31.12? I guess I'll try. And maybe it'll work for me this time!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: SeigeOps on July 31, 2010, 02:34:26 pm
*cough* Does this still work for 31.12? I guess I'll try. And maybe it'll work for me this time!

Works fine for me, although I can't seem to get all of the training shop options, primarily the smithy jobs. Am I doing something wrong or is it not implemented yet?

On the positive side, my doctors are no longer rusty at their trade and I have something to do with all the vermin remains (although I think you may need to devalue the cadavers a bit, Shukaro; I'm getting 40-80 dwarfbucks on average). Right now, I am setting up a training room for my military and training up a 'Drill Sargent' (with weapons, armor and teaching skills) to whip all the recruits into shape. Maggots.

One last question, do books do anything aside from look nice and be a decent trade good?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on August 01, 2010, 11:15:21 am
If not all the options are available to you (not all of the professions have a reaction, see the list), and you installed it correctly, then you should check to make sure you have the required reagents for the reactions (books, slates, weapons, shields, metal bars, etc). As for the cadaver values, I think the value of toys is hardcoded, so I can't do much about it. The books are used in the library reactions.

As for compatibility, it should be compatible with anything 31 onward, provided Toady doesn't change up the raw syntax again.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Snook on August 02, 2010, 10:47:39 am
Yeah, I got it working. Sweeet!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: martinuzz on August 09, 2010, 06:46:43 am
I like this simple little mod.
It does not feel cheaty, since you actually need to put effort into the materials for learning, and the learning process itself is pretty slow.
As long as the military training is not working properly, I'll be using this.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: dennislp3 on August 09, 2010, 07:25:11 am
I like this simple little mod.
It does not feel cheaty, since you actually need to put effort into the materials for learning, and the learning process itself is pretty slow.
As long as the military training is not working properly, I'll be using this.

As far as I know it is working properly....am I missing something?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: martinuzz on August 09, 2010, 07:33:06 am
My previous fort, after 4 years of normal military training (demonstrations mostly, every now and then they spar, but way too little), my dwarves hadn't even reached skilled yet in the basic fighting skills.
This learning mod gets them up to adequate in 5 combat skills of choice in about 2 years of grinding.

Also, I've found no way to prevent the 'depressed/angered/enraged by long patrol duty' thought, which is a pretty harsh negative.
Even with a legendary dining room, great booze and meals, decent personal rooms and a mist generator in their training barracks, I had a hard time keeping my military happy after a few years of training.
Even when setting military to 'inactive' / no orders only gets them to go on individual combat training sessions, keeping the negative thought.
I guess that's a bug still to be fixed.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: dennislp3 on August 09, 2010, 07:40:42 am
What you need to do is go into the orders menu and there is an option to select how many dwarfs are required for the scheduled task (default 10) if you put this to 1 or 2 below how many dwarfs or in your squad it should take care of most of the unhappy thoughts because it allows them time off on shifts of there choice and it allows you to not waste months on being inactive.

as for speed of training....train them in teaching/student....these will make demonstrations much more efficient...you can also put the people in training in small squads of about 3 and this will have them spar a lot more often.

this is because demonstrations happen when one dwarf gets ahead of the other dwarfs in a skill....essentially the system tries to keep everyone on the same level and so when someone falls behind demonstrations are used to bring them up to speed
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Lytha on August 11, 2010, 05:53:02 am
Now this is an extremely useful looking mod. I read about the library workshop in the Genesis mod while browsing the skill rusting thread, and then saw that the Genesis mod seems to have 99.99999% stuff that I don't want.

Thank you for creating just the library without the flameball spitting sylvan dwarves and norse speaking aryans or whatever that was.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: martinuzz on August 14, 2010, 04:00:07 pm
I'm curious: What exactly are the tracking, and the reading /writing skills used for? I have not seen them in vanilla dwarf fortess, but I suppose they're already hardcoded in?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: dennislp3 on August 14, 2010, 04:37:24 pm
yes they are hardcoded but I think they are merely placeholders right now. I have seen nothing that indicates otherwise
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: jocan2003 on August 18, 2010, 04:50:25 pm
Is it me or there is lot of typpo from the product entry in the various task like getregentmaterial from A when it should be B and so on?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: drayath on August 19, 2010, 06:19:35 am
Here's the (completely unofficial) reactions files i'm using in my game that fixes the reaction product material types and a wood duplication bug in one of the reactions.

Should just be able to replace the file in an existing game.

reaction_library.txt
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on August 20, 2010, 11:07:03 pm
Thanks for pointing out those errors, I've updated the OP now, so it should be fine.

If only notepad++ could tell me, "Hey, stupid, you put an A there instead of a B."  :'(
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Vince7403 on August 22, 2010, 03:07:41 am
Unintended silliness: At embark, you can take things like paper and cadavers, made from such materials as bronze, silver, rose gold, etc.

Seven dwarves abscond with the gilded remains of their saintly ancestors in their wagon. Ford the river, then STRIKE THE EARTH!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on August 22, 2010, 09:41:37 am
And that, my friends, is exactly what a true dwarf would do.

It's also what comes of using the toy token for those items.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: 3 on August 22, 2010, 09:43:56 am
It's possible to avoid the issue entirely if you're willing to create everything through reactions, as then the toy doesn't even need to be added to the dwarf entity entry.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on August 22, 2010, 09:55:01 am
True, that's probably the best thing to do now. I'll update the OP.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Kamudo on August 27, 2010, 12:05:07 am
Lovely Mod.

I plan on using it in my Washington D.C. Mega Project in the Library of Congress.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on August 27, 2010, 04:48:26 pm
Ah, if only the real library of congress was staffed by a horde of short, drunk, insane people.  :'(
Title: Re: Dwarven Library v1.0 - Menaces with Spikes of Knowledge! - A Masterwork Workshop
Post by: Vercingetorix on August 28, 2010, 12:24:33 am

I mean, studying mining in library? WTF?

studying medical skills and social skills in library makes sense.

Not some ... mining.

Well, IRL mining and mining engineering do require a fair amount of study and training to make sure you don't screw up and cause a cave-in and/or to actually access the deeper veins.  This isn't really modeled in DF because you're the one designating mining and all that, but it's a real issue when it comes to actual mining.

On a related note, I would sort of like having skill in mining or a related skill required to identify stones, gems, and ores.  It's sort of odd that some random peasant can pick up a pick and automatically identify different ores when digging in to the rock.  Of course, this can be explained by the likely fact that, dwarves being dwarves, pretty much everyone has some education regarding types of stone...
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Jake on September 08, 2010, 08:09:03 am
Just found this via the original poster's signature and really like the sound of it, but I have a suggestion for making it even more realistic and challenging.

Wax and slate etc could be used to create blank slates, which are then used in a reaction called 'write instruction manual' to create a 'wax/slate [skill] text' using the relevant workshop. This is then used in a reaction in a 'reading room' built from one chair and one table (do you need one block of stone as well to build all custom workshops?) with about a 98% chance of keeping the original tablet afterwards to simulate wear and tear or breakages.
Producing instruction manuals for skills that don't have their own workshop could be done in a 'study' or something similar, which could also be used for creating duplicate tablets using the prose skill.

There's not much we can do about the lack of item-quality modifiers in the reactions mechanic, but it would add a bit of flavour by enabling proper libraries with texts stacked by subject and dwarves liking particular types of text.

Also, why not make parchment behave as a type of cloth?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on September 08, 2010, 11:45:26 am
Adding in a second tier of tablet/books for different skills sounds like something that would add a lot more realism to the whole learning thing, so I'll look into that, I'll also be checking out more unique reactions, and probably a bookshelf workshop of some sort. As for making parchment behave like cloth, that's an interesting idea, but then you have dwarves running around in tower cap paper trousers and stuff like that.  :-\
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Jake on September 08, 2010, 06:22:10 pm
Actually, the paper of that era would be quite weatherproof if waxed; it'd be fairly thick and stiff, and even modern paper makes a good insulator. And when you consider the fact that dwarves make almost everything out of stone and their primary domestic source of cloth is also an important source of booze, parchment as a means of producing cheap clothing isn't all that illogical.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Moonshine Fox on September 09, 2010, 12:33:01 am
Awesome, I most definately need to try this when I get home. Sweet! Btw, you should totally name this mod "Dwarven University" ;)


EDIT: I heard proper spelling helps communication. *doh*
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: They Got Leader on September 10, 2010, 09:24:34 pm
Is there a read me?

I am having some issues with getting my dwarves to train, and what they train in.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on September 11, 2010, 12:44:42 pm
The best way to use these workshops is, first, make sure that the dwarves you want to train have the appropriate labor enabled (Don't need to do this for the combat and social skills) then use the workshop profile feature of the workshops to restrict usage of the workshop to only the dwarf(s) you want to train and add the skill-task you want to train on repeat. You'll also want to construct a printer's workshop, which is used to produce the reagents for the majority of the reactions. The medical ward makes it's own reagents (cadavers) out of meat and/or vermin remains, library uses books (made at the printer's workshop out of paper (also from that workshop) and leather), the training dummy and workshop use tablets (made at the printer's workshop). As for what skills each reaction trains, their names should be fairly self-explanatory (practice swords, study prose, practice mining, etc). You can also forgo using workshop profiles, so that someone will always be training in the workshop during their downtime.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Jake on September 13, 2010, 01:28:38 pm
A few more thoughts for the next version.

1. A single training workshop for every skill is rather unrealistic, and would get cluttered quickly, so why not assign the reaction to the most relevant workshop? As far as something like mining or fishing goes, I'd simply have a textbook on them and encourage players to set the 'reading room' workshop being used to train them to be open only to dwarves between Dabbling and Novice.

2. If you're adopting my earlier suggestion of skill-specific texts, I wouldn't go for one text for every skill. Individual texts should be involved in more than one reaction each, and some skills would require multiple different texts to train. Texts about woodwork and mathematics would be used to train a seige engineer, but texts on geology and mathematics (plus metalworking once metal mechanisms are back in) would train a mechanic, and a text on 'plantlife' or something could be used to train both farmers and herbalists.

3. The training-dummy workshop should use be built from unit of wood, one rope and one bag of sand, and be renamed the gym bag. ;) On a more serious note, I'd ditch the reactions that train the Fighter and Archer skills, as they represent things you can't learn just by pummelling a dummy. A 'military history' tablet makes sense, however.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Deon on September 13, 2010, 02:49:29 pm
Quote
2. If you're adopting my earlier suggestion of skill-specific texts, I wouldn't go for one text for every skill. Individual texts should be involved in more than one reaction each, and some skills would require multiple different texts to train. Texts about woodwork and mathematics would be used to train a seige engineer, but texts on geology and mathematics (plus metalworking once metal mechanisms are back in) would train a mechanic, and a text on 'plantlife' or something could be used to train both farmers and herbalists.
That's a nice idea actually. I have tomes for each skill to read in "Library" in genesis, but some mix would be fun. It would require a separate wiki page though, to avoid the confusion and spoiler the things up a bit :).

Quote
3. The training-dummy workshop should use be built from unit of wood, one rope and one bag of sand, and be renamed the gym bag. ;) On a more serious note, I'd ditch the reactions that train the Fighter and Archer skills, as they represent things you can't learn just by pummelling a dummy. A 'military history' tablet makes sense, however.
Well, the general "fighter" should be trained along with combat skills, but because we can't do that yet, I would suggest it's a "lore" for now too. And I use a bucket, a wooden log and a cloth (for a bucket-headed dummy :P). A sand bag would make more sense though, but whatever.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Jake on September 13, 2010, 05:16:14 pm
I'm pretty sure 'Fighter' and 'Archer' are supposed to represent skill in spotting feints, recognising an opponent's weaknesses and adapting your repertoire of moves to the situation. You can't learn that from katas or a workout on the heavy bag, you know?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Moonshine Fox on September 16, 2010, 05:30:06 pm
Well, apparently I'm an effing retard, because I can't get the workshops to show up in game. I have the Librarian position and can appoint it, all files in the right place, but no workshops to be seen. What the heck am I doing wrong?  (Yes, did gen a new world)

Relevant parts of entity_default in spoiler.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on September 16, 2010, 09:35:18 pm
Hmm, did you copy the other files from the OP to the appropriately named files in the main DF folder, with the header? (Looks like you did.) Do Civilization Forge's workshops show up? Does installing it on a clean DF copy work for you? Could you upload your raw/objects folders from the main folder and the world folder?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Quietust on September 16, 2010, 11:35:13 pm
I haven't done much modding myself, but what happens if you use a CORPSE as a reagent for a reaction? Will it take any available corpse, or will it obey ethics and only take a killed wild animal? If it works, you could theoretically use [REAGENT:B:1:CORPSE:NONE:NONE:NONE][UNROTTEN][PRESERVE_REAGENT] instead of [REAGENT:B:1:TOY:ITEM_CADAVER:NONE:NONE] + [PRODUCT:75:1:TOY:ITEM_CADAVER:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:B:NONE] for the medical training reactions, so instead of simply having a random chance of the cadaver disappearing, you can keep practicing on the same corpse until it starts to rot. Of course, I'm not quite sure how far [UNROTTEN] goes - while it'd probably reject a corpse that has started to rot, it might start accepting it again once it turns into a (partial) skeleton...
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Moonshine Fox on September 17, 2010, 03:42:37 am
Hmm, did you copy the other files from the OP to the appropriately named files in the main DF folder, with the header? (Looks like you did.) Do Civilization Forge's workshops show up? Does installing it on a clean DF copy work for you? Could you upload your raw/objects folders from the main folder and the world folder?
Yes, CivForge works correctly. That's what really stumps me. I tried installing on my vanilla DF, but there I failed horribly and I was on to testing on CivForge before I realized my first mistake (gen a new world, idiot). By that time I got the noble position to work by putting all the files in the right places and fixing the entity file. I even tried putting all the entries by similar entries (all reactions in one place, all permitted buildings in one place and so on), but no go.

World and save objects link (http://jump.fm/WYMLH)
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: lastofthelight on September 18, 2010, 02:02:55 pm
I'm a bit unclear....how exactly does training weaponsmithing work with this mod? I just tried it out for the first time, and my carpenter went out and grabbed my most expensive weapon and my most expensive type of metal and has brought it back to this workshop, and I'm afraid to unpause.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on September 19, 2010, 09:31:28 am
How weaponsmithing and armorsmithing work, is that they grab a weapon, a metal bar, and a tablet, and then work on the bar. There's a slight chance of the bar or tablet being destroyed, but they're usually fine. You'll also want to mess with the workshop's profile settings if you want specific dwarves to use it.

Also, Moonshine, your problem is you forgot to put the headers that say the files name at the top of the new files.
For example:
Code: [Select]
building_library

[OBJECT:BUILDING]

BLAH BLAH BLAG
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Moonshine Fox on September 19, 2010, 09:48:46 am
Also, Moonshine, your problem is you forgot to put the headers that say the files name at the top of the new files.
For example:
Code: [Select]
building_library

[OBJECT:BUILDING]

BLAH BLAH BLAG
O.o

*stares in disbelief*
I could've SWORN I did that! Oh well, thanks for pointing out the VERY obvious fail xD
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on September 19, 2010, 09:50:34 am
Hehe, believe me, I've done stuff like that too, very annoying.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Moonshine Fox on September 20, 2010, 05:35:31 am
Hehe, believe me, I've done stuff like that too, very annoying.
Yup, that did it, of course. Thanks mate :D
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: fledermaus on September 21, 2010, 01:07:11 pm
Hi.
This mod looks really cool and your sales-pitch was quite funny, thanks for both.
I'm pretty new to DF and even newer to modding it, so I had a question about the install.

I'm using Deon's Genesis. In entity_default.txt there are some duplicate reactions (such as [PERMITTED_REACTION:TRAIN_SWIMMING] and the weapon skills) and buildings (LIBRARY and TRAINING_DUMMY). I assume this will cause problems but I don't know for sure.

If this is a problem, can I change the name of your reactions and buildings (maybe adding a number or letter at the end) and get both sets of reactions/buildings (yours and Deon's), or do the names have to be the way they are? I understand that I would have to change those names wherever they occur in your files as well as change the file names and headers.

If that won't work is there some way to make sure your buildings and reaction's override those in Genesis? I really don't know much about DF modding.

Thanks for any help.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on September 21, 2010, 04:22:34 pm
Ok, if the reaction tags are duplicate (should make mine more unique to avoid this) then what you need to do to prevent errors is change the [REACTION:XXX] tags in the non-entity files and the [PERMITTED_REACTION:XXX] in the entity file to something unique. That also goes for any other duplicate object. You can also delete duplicates from the entity/other files. Since my mod conflicts, I'll change the reaction tags in the next update.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: fledermaus on September 21, 2010, 10:32:28 pm
That helps a lot, thanks!

I love it when a plan comes together. ;)
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: daftfad on November 17, 2010, 10:23:05 am
Two additions that you might find useful/cool:

Code: [Select]
[REACTION:TRAIN_ARCHITECTURE]
   [NAME:study architecture]
   [BUILDING:LIBRARY:CUSTOM_W]
   [REAGENT:A:1:TOY:ITEM_BOOK:NONE:NONE]
   [PRODUCT:90:1:TOY:ITEM_BOOK:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:A:NONE]
   [SKILL:DESIGNBUILDING]

[REACTION:TRAIN_MILITARY_TACTICS]
   [NAME:study military tactics]
   [BUILDING:LIBRARY:CUSTOM_X]
   [REAGENT:A:1:TOY:ITEM_BOOK:NONE:NONE]
   [PRODUCT:90:1:TOY:ITEM_BOOK:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:A:NONE]
   [SKILL:MILITARY_TACTICS]

Code: [Select]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:TRAIN_ARCHITECTURE]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:TRAIN_MILITARY_TACTICS]
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Viken on December 06, 2010, 10:39:48 pm
Shukaro, I love the idea behind this mod and the fact it can be used as an alternate way of training otherwise 'unskilled' dorfs to do what you want.  8)

But sadly, I've seemed to have run into a bit of a problem.  I'm playing with Phoebus' 31.18, and the only things I've been able to learn is mining and masonry.  I've made paper and tablets and built the small library expansion, but it doesn't do anything, and the dorfs ignore it.  Any help would be apprehiated, or unless I missed something in the previous posts on the issue or that's its incompatiable with .18. Thanks.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Troas on December 07, 2010, 12:17:50 pm
I'm using this mod in otherwise vanilla 31.18 to keep my Chief Medical Dwarf's skills from going rusty.  So the medical ward works OK with 31.18.  However I did manage to screw up the mod the first time I tried to apply it in 31.18 - I put the mod text within the mountain entity instead of at the very end (as specified in the instructions).  This caused crashes after embark.

So there may be an incompatibility with Phoebus or you may want to try re-applying the mod.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on December 07, 2010, 11:24:24 pm
Viken - The library takes books as a reagent, which are made from paper and leather, so that's probably the problem

Troas - I'd try getting a new copy of the entity file from Phoebus, then take the entity text from my mod and put the different tags in the various regions of the mountain entity with the same tags. Like putting the [PERMITTED_JOB:XXX] tags with all the other [PERMITTED_JOB:XXX] tags.

daftfad - I've added those in, thanks for suggesting them!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Viken on December 08, 2010, 03:40:01 am
The library doesn't even have the reaction chain to MAKE the books. >.>' Which I guess would make it invalid, then. Although, I put the lines in the Mountain entry too; which may be a major part of the problem.  :-\

Oh well, I'll just try, try again. Its not like I can't just make a new world and go to work on it, mwhahahahaha.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Viken on December 08, 2010, 04:24:01 am
Shukaro, your download is blank, mate.  You get the raw and objects folders, but there isn't anything in them. Natta.  Just thought you'd like to know so you could fix it. >.>''
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on December 08, 2010, 04:19:15 pm
Doh, that's what happens when you work on 2 hours of sleep. Fixed.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Viken on December 09, 2010, 12:05:13 am
Thanks for the fix; makes my life a lot easier.  Mwhahaha.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Troas on December 09, 2010, 11:41:08 am
Shukaro: I'm not using the Phoebus mod, and the initial problem with 31.18 was all my fault.  The medical ward works just fine for me, and I haven't bothered with the other training buildings, although I may try the military tactics training in my next fort.

Thanks for taking the time to make this mod!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: neil_v on December 09, 2010, 06:38:47 pm
Great job, Thanks for the awesome mod!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on December 10, 2010, 03:15:57 pm
Hehe, thanks Troas and neil_v.

Just a tip, the best way to use the workshop is to use the workshops is to set up the profiles settings if you only want certain dwarves to train, or leave them be if you want any passing dwarf to work there. Not sure if that was already in the OP, just came to mind.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Jwguy on January 03, 2011, 10:06:09 pm
Hey. Just downloaded the Mod, recently, and I'd like to say it's pretty cool, though I am not really sure how it works. How do you train with the training dummy? I've attempted to assign my dwarves to it, but there are no tasks that can be set from it, nor do my dwarves spar with it if it's in a barracks.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on January 07, 2011, 03:21:02 pm
Hmm, that seems to be a common question, so I'll update the OP with detailed instructions on specific use.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on January 07, 2011, 04:41:46 pm
I've updated the OP with much more detailed information and a FAQ.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Troas on January 08, 2011, 01:29:56 am
Is the Librarian noble an honorary position?  re: does assigning one do anything?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on January 08, 2011, 12:58:37 pm
It is indeed just an honorary position. They aren't required for anything, just to look cool.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: saltbush on January 09, 2011, 10:48:09 pm
is there any way to make it so dwarves won't sew or encrust/decorate tablets and books?
It seems a waste to have my dwarves go round adding pretty decorations to these consumables when they could be doing it to the trade goods
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on January 10, 2011, 03:19:37 pm
I don't believe there is a practical way to prevent decoration, as all the items are classified as toys. You could forbid/unforbid them if you're up for a lot of micromanagement though, I guess.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: The Architect on January 20, 2011, 02:27:31 pm
Bump
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: AdeleneDawner on February 09, 2011, 09:14:58 am
I like this mod, but it's giving me a bit of trouble: What labor do I have to turn on on my scribe-dwarf to get him making tablets?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on February 09, 2011, 04:12:30 pm
Tablets can be made at the printer's press with masonry, or at the training workshop with engraving (train stone detailing).
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: AdeleneDawner on February 10, 2011, 05:06:04 am
Got it, thanks.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Viken on February 17, 2011, 09:19:26 pm
Just to renew interest, I have greatly enjoyed using Higher Learning Mod; but I am moving up to the new .19 version of DF.  I just wish to know if the mod still works in the new version, or if changes will have to be made to the coding to get it to function properly.

Feel free to PM me with results, or if ya need a tester.  8)
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: dennislp3 on February 18, 2011, 10:04:55 pm
I will have to check (or have someone verify) but its a pretty light mod that only adds a few simple things...should be good to go.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Chibale on February 24, 2011, 12:26:16 am
I am using it currently in .19, and though I don't have everything built yet, my dwarves spent some time practicing crutch walking. :D
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Fullmoon on February 24, 2011, 01:12:07 am
Uh, sorry for asking here, what would happen if some reaction had assigned several skills? Will it train all or only first listed?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Heavenly Creature on February 26, 2011, 10:16:08 am
I haven't tried the mod out, actually, but I just wanted to say I really enjoyed reading the description. :)
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: billybobfred on February 26, 2011, 06:37:03 pm
Gahhh, I just finished genning a new world when I found this mod. OH WELL

(let's face it, there needs to be a way to train doctoring other than jumping right in to the job, that's worth a regen)
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Troas on March 06, 2011, 11:47:11 pm
It looks like the saved raw files need updating for 31.19+ as entity_default.txt does not contain clay and bee related items.  You should be able to manually add the entity_default lines from the original post spoiler though.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Serval on March 07, 2011, 01:06:04 pm
You need to manually add the entity_defaults spoiler to your entity_defaults.txt file. The files on the first post haven't been updated since January 7, 2011, and there have been changes to entity_default since then.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Vince7403 on March 28, 2011, 07:12:11 pm
Very nice, lets you prevent your doctors from rusting. Haven't tried training gemcutters yet. For 31.23 and afterwards you must apply the raw modification manually, if you overwrite you will lose some of the new core reactions including nest boxes for poultry. Of course, I only figured that out after I had already established my irrigation system and now I have to generate a new world, but at least I learned something.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Viken on March 28, 2011, 07:37:09 pm
Vince, I'd suggest you use the new Mod Manager you can find here in the DF Modding forum.  Its good, and the only thing you have to edit is the entity_defaults.txt, put it in a new folder with the workshop files, and then load it up with the Manager and enable it/install and then there aren't any problems. lol.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: jamesadelong on June 24, 2011, 10:29:45 am
Hey, brilliant mod. But I can't seem to get my guys to make paper. My Librarian has everything he could possibly want. I have a well designed place set up to produce paper, no walls around the printing press with a TON of wood laying around it, leather by the butload but still... nothing. Nobody decides to make the paper. Have I missed something?

Any help would be brilliant. I want to have an entire fortress as an archive fortress, pumping out and storing the worlds knowledge in vast underground vaults, medical journals, war diaries. Everything. That is my hope. Hopefully this issue can be cleaned up quickly.

Thankyou in advance.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Viken on June 24, 2011, 10:31:56 am
Make sure you have a Librarian noble set, and other than that... I'm not sure.  I'm not even sure what 'skills' affect those of paper making in Higher Learning. lol.  Sad as it is to say, anyway.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: jamesadelong on June 24, 2011, 10:33:50 am
Librarian is set and lounging in his vast opulent throne room. He's a happy dorf.

EDIT: Good news! I have paper. My dream of an archive fort has come true!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: idgarad on August 16, 2011, 09:44:18 am
Nothing better then setting up a training dummy with Learn Swimming on repeat and setting the workshop profile to Accomplished as the max skill. Once a dwarf gets Accomplished they stop using it. Great way to train idle civilians.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: jocan2003 on September 11, 2011, 10:34:01 am
Somebody has a copy link is down and no mirror....
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: ulan on September 15, 2011, 04:17:27 pm
uh seems like an awesome mod and all


E: kk found a way to make stone barrels, now what about nest boxes?
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Karatela on September 25, 2011, 07:04:22 am
I'm really impressed with things, it fills in a few spaces.

One thing, though. I've found since adding it that a number of other things like making anything out of clay, or making pots of any kind, or the like, have all vanished as options on their respective buildings. From what I can tell, everything else looks normal, so... I am confused.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: ansontan2000 on October 23, 2011, 08:19:57 pm
Is this mod compatible with Simple Fortress? It seems it will not run when i use a simple fortress world.
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Molay on January 04, 2012, 03:42:47 pm
Hello! I was wondering of those new labors also show up in Dwarf Therapist, and if this mod doesn't conflict with other edits of the raws (aside from the dwarven race)? Thanks, it's really a interesting one and the first mod I might try!
Title: Re: [0.31.X] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.1.1 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on April 24, 2012, 08:40:57 am
Sorry about the lack of updates guys, I'll be bringing this back up to date in the next few days. :)
Title: Re: [0.34.07] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on April 25, 2012, 06:02:52 pm
Alright, updated to 34.07 now, enjoy!

(Also please leave bug reports and other feedback.)
Title: Re: [0.34.07] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Dohon on April 28, 2012, 08:26:04 am
Cheers, Shukaro! This mod remains one of my all-time favourite mini-mods. :)
Title: Re: [0.34.07] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Troas on June 20, 2012, 10:57:36 am
Have cadavers been removed in 2.2?  I finally got a 34.10 fortress far enough along to set up the medical ward and the create cadaver options don't show up.  Looking at the raws it looks like books and body parts are now required where your earlier version used cadaver parts and tablets.

Would restoring the old functionality simply require adding the old reactions back in the library_reactions file using the new format and a different shortcut key?
Title: Re: [0.34.07] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Shukaro on June 20, 2012, 11:06:10 am
Yes, cadavers have been removed, they were just a hacky workaround to some weird behavior that reactions had with bodies/whatnot. If you'd want to revert to them, you'd have to add the reaction, add the toy entry, modify entity default, and gen a new world. :(
Title: Re: [0.34.XX] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: Troas on June 20, 2012, 09:40:28 pm
Using Vellum to make the books avoids depleting my few limited trees, and while leather isn't boundless like rock I usually have excess.  So the primary issue is that bones are now used in the medical ward, which I'd like to avoid.  I can work around it somewhat by placing the medical ward near the outdoor butchery area or creating a separate refuse pile beside it set to accept items I'd like to use for medical experimentation.

Title: Re: [0.34.XX] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: sirdave79 on January 31, 2014, 10:17:10 am
After installing this mod for the first time Ive discovered that the lines in entitiy_default for wheelbarrows and minecarts are not present, meaning that when I went to build wheelbarows they were not listed. A quick google search pointed me right at the relevant lines, when checked they were not present. The same post suggested a world respin was not necessary but the fort ive built planning to test the new learning opportunities does not allow me to build the missing items after adding the lines to the entity_default.txt but a new fort does.

Those lines might possibly want to be added to the download.

I cant quite beleive theres not more activity on this thread.

Thanks for making the mod. (still not tested it properly but the description makes for happy reading)

EDIT just realised im changing the default raws and changing the ones in my save will probably get the barrows and carts working in my current game.
Title: Re: [0.34.XX] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: dennislp3 on February 01, 2014, 12:58:55 am
I am sure it will get more active when the new version comes out
Title: Re: [0.34.XX] Dwarven Higher Learning Mod v2.2 - Menaces with Spikes of Paper!
Post by: sirdave79 on February 02, 2014, 08:28:41 pm
Hmm adding the tag for minecarts and wheelbarrows to the saved game raws doesnt seem to work. Looks like it has to be a world regen, a new fort at the very least.