Bay 12 Games Forum

Dwarf Fortress => DF Modding => Utilities and 3rd Party Applications => Topic started by: Poonyen on February 04, 2014, 03:30:25 pm

Title: Toadese Language Utility v0.4.4 (Read, add to or change game languages)
Post by: Poonyen on February 04, 2014, 03:30:25 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/VvGG8nM.png?1?1595)
TOADESE LANGUAGE UTILITY

Ever want to change the language words and tags (cultural place names, or possible names of battles)? How about write or translate entire texts into or from the game's language? Want to create your own language rules for some meta !fun!?

As part of my learning how to code, I've made an application to search, view and edit the DF dictionaries to see translations or add new words to the game. I mostly began this project because I wanted to start composing songs in Toadese and this seemed a lot more convenient than Notepad++.

List of features:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Changelog 0.4.4:

Changelog 0.4:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Changelog 0.3:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Changelog 0.2:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Planned Features:

Screenshot 0.4:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

DOWNLOAD LINK V0.4.4:http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8397 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8397)
INSTALL INSTRUCTIONS: Place anywhere. Set the Objects folder. A cfg.ini file will be made where you run it, but that's it.
INCLUDED FILES: Toadese Language Utility.exe, cfg.ini (generated),props.txt,TLU_Readme.txt
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.1
Post by: Baffler on February 04, 2014, 09:11:05 pm
PTW, with great interest. If you don't have it already, here is a wordlist in an easily searchable format, (http://pastebin.com/QhSAEhQc) courtesy of Halfling.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.1
Post by: Poonyen on February 05, 2014, 02:42:43 am
Quote from: Baffler on February 04, 2014, 09:11:05 pm
PTW, with great interest. If you don't have it already, here is a wordlist in an easily searchable format, (http://pastebin.com/QhSAEhQc) courtesy of Halfling.

Thanks! I want to start looking into community proposals. Would you recommend that I use the Language Wiki (http://dflangs.wikidot.com/) as my primary reference? I'm especially interested in the languages propositions section, for example.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.1
Post by: Xantalos on February 05, 2014, 02:49:41 am
Hmm! PTW.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.1
Post by: Baffler on February 05, 2014, 02:42:21 pm
Quote
Thanks! I want to start looking into community proposals. Would you recommend that I use the Language Wiki (http://dflangs.wikidot.com/) as my primary reference? I'm especially interested in the languages propositions section, for example.
.

Go for it. Unfortunately, the wiki page was somewhat outdated even before the project petered out. I'll try to save you the trouble of trawling the thread if possible, but not much was ever decided on.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.1
Post by: Poonyen on February 06, 2014, 03:03:39 am
Quote from: Baffler on February 05, 2014, 02:42:21 pm
Quote
Thanks! I want to start looking into community proposals. Would you recommend that I use the Language Wiki (http://dflangs.wikidot.com/) as my primary reference? I'm especially interested in the languages propositions section, for example.
.

Go for it. Unfortunately, the wiki page was somewhat outdated even before the project petered out. I'll try to save you the trouble of trawling the thread if possible, but not much was ever decided on.
Thanks a lot, I would appreciate it.

I've been skimming the Wiki, and I think that I will try to introduce the KISS proposition as the default. The main reasons are:

(1) Its similar appearance and adherence to Toadese (i.e. Loam, for example, employs the Latiny -a -o -i which indeed seems kinda Europeany; I LOVE the following about KISS, for example: "Long plural is formed by adding -an (derived from shàmman, 'many')").
(2) The simplicity and minimal use of affixes.
(3) No verb "to be", that changeable bastard.
(4) The dependence on word order and context for meaning.
(5) Functional, but compact (opposed to the Owlbread/Dwarfhoplite repetition of words for intensity)

If you or anyone else reading this are the author of any of these propositions and don't agree with my arguments (they might still be superficial at this point), I'd love to hear from you. Otherwise, I'm going to get to work implementing KISS just to get the ball rolling and keep myself working and motivated.

mëlistan am!
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.1
Post by: Baffler on February 06, 2014, 04:04:31 pm
No argument here, but if you also intend to do a high variant, I recommend taking a gander at  this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=130434.msg4863549#msg4863549). I don't know if Loam still intends to rework sentence structure, but it's an interesting concept as it is. Either way, akam nabår dural (I hope I did that right.)
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Poonyen on February 12, 2014, 06:47:33 am
New Version:

Changelog 0.2:
If possible, I would really appreciate some feedback of my progress so far. Also, please let me know about any bugs.

Enjoy!

Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Meph on February 12, 2014, 09:44:05 am
Quote
Masterwork support
This is nice to see. :)

Quote
Ability to add new words to specific languages.
This would be a hundred times nicer to see. (As in: If I could request a feature, that would be it)
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Poonyen on February 12, 2014, 12:16:19 pm
Quote
This would be a hundred times nicer to see. (As in: If I could request a feature, that would be it)

!Sciencing!...
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Eric Blank on February 12, 2014, 07:54:49 pm
ooh, I like this idea very muchly.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Loam on February 12, 2014, 08:49:40 pm
Quote from: Baffler on February 06, 2014, 04:04:31 pm
No argument here, but if you also intend to do a high variant, I recommend taking a gander at  this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=130434.msg4863549#msg4863549). I don't know if Loam still intends to rework sentence structure, but it's an interesting concept as it is.

I've reworked it a bit, actually. One of these days I'll flesh it out and put it on the wiki, or wherever. I got sidetracked working on an Elvish script.
Also, the image in that link isn't working as of now... hopefully it'll sort itself out.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Poonyen on February 13, 2014, 03:16:45 am
Quote from: Loam on February 12, 2014, 08:49:40 pm
Quote from: Baffler on February 06, 2014, 04:04:31 pm
No argument here, but if you also intend to do a high variant, I recommend taking a gander at  this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=130434.msg4863549#msg4863549). I don't know if Loam still intends to rework sentence structure, but it's an interesting concept as it is.

I've reworked it a bit, actually. One of these days I'll flesh it out and put it on the wiki, or wherever. I got sidetracked working on an Elvish script.
Also, the image in that link isn't working as of now... hopefully it'll sort itself out.

Greetings Loam!

Great to hear. I don't have ablaut support yet, but I'll keep it in mind and add it to the to-do list.

The vowel inflection that you suggest shouldn't be a problem, but it does complicate things a bit since it would require the introduction of new rule concepts:

(1) Where is the vowel in the word? First syllable? Last syllable? I want this to be modifiable.
(2) Which vowel substitutes which and when?
(3) Which symbols are vowels and which are not?

I want to keep the props.txt file as simple as possible for now (I both suck at and abhor writing parsing functions). Short of creating separate rule files for each prop, it could get tricky given how inherently different the KISS and Loam systems. HOWEVER, let's give it a shot:

I'd probably have to introduce rule archetypes since the Vowel Star rules would need to be set:

[VOWEL_RELATIONSHIPS]
a(past)=>o
a(fut)=>e
a(cross)=>u
etc.

So, using the verb "zat":

Currently specific rules are divided into three parts:'ar'-'im' or --'im'

These rules produce "arzatim" and "zatim" respectively.

For ablaut implementation, if we want to inflect a certain vowel, maybe it could look like this: 'ar'#final(fut)'im'

Extrapolated, this means:

(1) 'ar' = Prefix "ar-"
(2) #final(fut) = Modify the final vowel, look up the future counterpart of said vowel and replace.
(3) 'im' = Suffix "-im"

This produces "arzetim".

Lastly, if you submit this: #(cross)#final(part)'im'

You'd get "uzetim"

Is it getting to complex? Tell me what you think.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Loam on February 13, 2014, 04:02:48 pm
What are the "ar" and "im" from? They're confusing me.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Poonyen on February 13, 2014, 05:29:28 pm
Quote from: Loam on February 13, 2014, 04:02:48 pm
What are the "ar" and "im" from? They're confusing me.

Sorry, forgot to mention. They are just hypothetical, in case someone would want to use affixes in combination with inflection.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.2
Post by: Loam on February 14, 2014, 06:56:16 pm
Looks fine, then.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.3
Post by: Poonyen on February 20, 2014, 05:26:41 am
New version released:

Changelog 0.3:

I'm gonna work on some songs for a week or two, so I might not get back to an update for a while. I will do short bugfixing if required. Also, I have to look for IRL work again, so there's that. In any case, I hope this holds up for a while. Enjoy!
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.4
Post by: Poonyen on February 26, 2014, 06:43:32 am
(http://i.imgur.com/hphBv21.png)

New version released:
Changelog 0.4:


Download link: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8397 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8397)
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.4 (English to Toadese and vice versa!)
Post by: TheCoolSideofthePIllow on March 28, 2014, 12:52:15 am
My only gripe is that the input boxes for the search are CaSe SeNsItIvE. Kinda throws me off.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.4 (English to Toadese and vice versa!)
Post by: Poonyen on March 28, 2014, 02:27:04 am
Ooh, the first bug reported!

It seems to only affect the Toadese->English search box.  I've been very busy lately, but I'll upload a fixed version as soon as I can.

You'll also notice that some two-word lemmas aren't being filtered as nouns etc. This is because they have to be hand-selected for filtration. I'll add a feature later to tag words as specific parts of speech in the config file.

Any other suggestions?
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.4 (English to Toadese and vice versa!)
Post by: Urist Da Vinci on March 28, 2014, 07:54:52 pm
Oh, so this is a translator between english to the languages defined in the raws? From the thread title I thought it translated from english to "Tarn Adams language". Like, someone took the devlogs or df talk transcripts and analyzed them for word usage.
Title: Re: Toadese Language Utility v0.4 (English to Toadese and vice versa!)
Post by: Orange Wizard on March 28, 2014, 07:59:06 pm
PTW. This looks cool!
Title: Toadese Language Utility v0.4.4 (Read, add to or change game languages)
Post by: Poonyen on May 15, 2014, 10:40:53 am
Finally, an update!

Changelog 0.4.4:

Here's the complimentary picture.

(http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2014/125/e/9/the_birth_of_the_oscar_empire_by_simonswerwer-d7h7li2.png)

I drew it in honour of one Oscar (you know who you are, sir). Also, thanks to TheCoolSideofthePIllow for my very first bug report (ever).