Post by: NJW2000 on February 15, 2023, 12:35:39 pm
W O R M W O O D M A F I A
Wormwood. Bitter, hardy and tough. Distilled to rough and heady liquors, triple figure proofs barely enough to numb you to the taste of soured earth. Ground into potent pharmakons, purging worms, bile and breakfast indiscriminately from invalids unlucky enough to need it. It hardly burns and doesn't taste good. You wouldn't call it pretty.
Life. Bitter, hardy and tough. The land here isn't good for much. Rocky slopes, dry soil, heaps of scree, and blasting winds see to that. But it's good for wormwood. Ruthless enough to outcompete the local weeds, stunting their roots with subtly poisoned soil, too wiry and bitter for parasites or beasts, it survives the winds and frosts with a whiteknuckle deathgrip on the poor fields and stony crevices. The people aren't too different.
You get by. Sure, it's the wrong end of Canada, a shoddy nameless town crouched in a nowhere valley in the Northwestern Territory, an unlikely congregation of opportunists, sharp dealers, roughnecks, and last-chancers. But as long as the harvest comes in and the wagons roll away piled with greenery and dark bottles, they bring back a thin trickle of food, fuel and frontier barter. Not much, but enough to survive.
So when black rings of festering Wormrot appear on leaves, townsfolk worry. And when Wormrotten plants are found uprooted, cut up, and spread over healthy crops, they start looking for a culprit.
Spoiler: Setup and Roles (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Roles (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Rules (click to show/hide)
Please do PM me or ask in thread if you have any questions.
Players: 8/9
Webadict
EuchreJack
Jim Groovester
ToonyMan
a1s
TricMagic
MaximumSpin
Fluffe9911
notquitethere
Post by: webadict on February 15, 2023, 07:28:25 pm
In.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 15, 2023, 08:06:56 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 15, 2023, 08:41:49 pm
I expect a very swingy game.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 15, 2023, 10:16:59 pm
Post by: Knightwing64 on February 16, 2023, 05:30:54 am
School is going by very slowwwwwwww
Post by: a1s on February 16, 2023, 08:20:54 am
Post by: TricMagic on February 16, 2023, 09:12:15 am
| Root | Stem | Flower |
| Stem | Flower | Root |
| Flower | Root | Stem |
Post by: notquitethere on February 16, 2023, 05:50:27 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 16, 2023, 07:20:53 pm
Put me on the replacement list.Will do, thanks for doing that.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 19, 2023, 08:51:32 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 20, 2023, 09:25:21 am
Post by: NJW2000 on February 21, 2023, 05:59:49 pm
Never played a (df forum) mafia game before but I'll give this a shot INWelcome to the subforum!
That's nine in theory, but I know Knightwing is taking a week's sabbatical, so if someone else wants to hop in in the meantime, I'll probably start the game with them.
To be honest there's some self-interest at play here, because the sooner we get this show on the road, the sooner I get to play his BYOR game :P
Post by: EuchreJack on February 21, 2023, 07:27:28 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 23, 2023, 02:46:57 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 24, 2023, 04:10:09 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 24, 2023, 04:49:08 pm
D A Y O N E
Secrets.
Every town has them. Lies, omissions, pretences and cons. And then there are the things that you just never tell anyone. The things you take with you to your grave.
You're here because you have secrets, or at least because you know them. Your average townsperson is an open book, written on in a crabbed hand by an uninspired hack with a tendency to digression. But not you. You're something else, and people can feel it. You have secrets.
Of course, some secrets are harmful. Some secrets need to be told.
But tell too many, and the whole town burns.
Day 1 has begun. You may now post.
Five to hammer. Day ends in approximately 72 hours, or at 22:00 GMT 27th Feb.
Post by: TricMagic on February 24, 2023, 04:52:17 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 24, 2023, 05:04:25 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 24, 2023, 05:38:46 pm
Let's do
*dice roll*
TricMagic, I can feel it my bones that he is scum.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: notquitethere on February 24, 2023, 05:44:41 pm
Webadict let's beef.
Post by: webadict on February 24, 2023, 07:15:13 pm
Let's not help scum strategise as to who to kill by revealing our roles. I'm going to assume that Tric is trying to bluff or double bluff as that's the only thing that makes sense here.Nah, I'm Town.
Webadict let's beef.
Also, do not claim anything fuck you, Tric, even if you're lying.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 24, 2023, 10:16:48 pm
Stem, I am tired tonight.Hehehe
heheheeeeeeeeeee
Let's not help scum strategise as to who to kill by revealing our roles. I'm going to assume that Tric is trying to bluff or double bluff as that's the only thing that makes sense here.I mean, at least he's town now right?
Post by: ToonyMan on February 24, 2023, 10:18:16 pm
Oh, we don't know who the other members of our group are? I see. I thought we would.How delightfully ignorant you are Jim.
I should probably read how this game works...
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 24, 2023, 10:22:08 pm
You're ignorant!
Kind of a quiet game so far.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 24, 2023, 10:55:25 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 24, 2023, 11:19:17 pm
So far, I think there's mafia inside ToonyMan, Jim, and webadict. We should try surgery to get them out, or maybe some kind of Inner Space thing. I think I'll plan to use my power on Jim unless something changes.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 24, 2023, 11:25:54 pm
I don't think we can mass-claim to solve because all of our abilities are one-shot. There aren't enough blocks and protects to keep everyone alive as the trackers find the mafia since we're all one-shot.
There's a 66% chance a person in your plant part is mafia, there's a 33% everyone in your plant part is town.
I think Tric is town because he read "Think carefully before using or revealing your role." as "Reveal your role". He's a Town Stem.
Max could be mafia, he says he doesn't plan to reveal his power "yet" but if I understand this setup correctly town shouldn't reveal their power unless they've caught mafia. Let's put Max down as either maybe Town Flower or maybe Mafia...Flower? Could be anything if Mafia I guess.
Jim could be playing dumb, let's say he's town though this has never backfired before when Max and Jim both posted together at game start or anything. I'll say he's a Stem because he voted TricMagic and said stuff like feeling it in his bones using dice as a cover. I don't understand why you would vote Tric here unless you're Stem or mafia. So maybe Town Stem or Mafia.
NQT could be anything, let's say town for now. Plant part could be anything, can't tell.
Web could be anything, not as judicious here as NQT. Plant part could be anything.
Jack, a1s, and Fluffe haven't posted yet. I want to safely guess that at least one player here is mafia, probably not two.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 24, 2023, 11:30:00 pm
Oh right, this is going on.I think there's one at most (Web more likely than Jim?), but I don't believe there's any currently.
So far, I think there's mafia inside ToonyMan, Jim, and webadict. We should try surgery to get them out, or maybe some kind of Inner Space thing. I think I'll plan to use my power on Jim unless something changes.
I think it's funny you're making a possible conclusion of three players here while I'm doing the same thing for three players not here.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 24, 2023, 11:45:45 pm
My impression of this setup is that it's a race. Mafia need to kill two specific players before town finds them. They could also kill three players in the untainted part but that would take one more player, I guess it'll depend what happens. Town could lose this before Day 2 even starts if mafia get really lucky or players like Tric reveal themselves. Mafia have no way to determine a player's plant part besides what a town player says. Meanwhile town have tools to stop the kill (protect/block) or potentially find a killer (track).Why are you trying to solve roles after explicitly acknowledging that solving roles helps the mafia.
I don't think we can mass-claim to solve because all of our abilities are one-shot. There aren't enough blocks and protects to keep everyone alive as the trackers find the mafia since we're all one-shot.
There's a 66% chance a person in your plant part is mafia, there's a 33% everyone in your plant part is town.
I think Tric is town because he read "Think carefully before using or revealing your role." as "Reveal your role". He's a Town Stem.
Max could be mafia, he says he doesn't plan to reveal his power "yet" but if I understand this setup correctly town shouldn't reveal their power unless they've caught mafia. Let's put Max down as either maybe Town Flower or maybe Mafia...Flower? Could be anything if Mafia I guess.
Jim could be playing dumb, let's say he's town though this has never backfired before when Max and Jim both posted together at game start or anything. I'll say he's a Stem because he voted TricMagic and said stuff like feeling it in his bones using dice as a cover. I don't understand why you would vote Tric here unless you're Stem or mafia. So maybe Town Stem or Mafia.
NQT could be anything, let's say town for now. Plant part could be anything, can't tell.
Web could be anything, not as judicious here as NQT. Plant part could be anything.
Jack, a1s, and Fluffe haven't posted yet. I want to safely guess that at least one player here is mafia, probably not two.
I think there's one at most (Web more likely than Jim?), but I don't believe there's any currently.I'll level with you, I just wanted to make the pun.
I think it's funny you're making a possible conclusion of three players here while I'm doing the same thing for three players not here.
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 24, 2023, 11:53:42 pm
Jim could be playing dumb, let's say he's town though this has never backfired before when Max and Jim both posted together at game start or anything. I'll say he's a Stem because he voted TricMagic and said stuff like feeling it in his bones using dice as a cover. I don't understand why you would vote Tric here unless you're Stem or mafia. So maybe Town Stem or Mafia.
You're putting more thought into this than I did.
analysis
We're absent three players and nothing has happened. Do I like ToonyMan doing this? I think I do.
So far, I think there's mafia inside ToonyMan, Jim, and webadict. We should try surgery to get them out, or maybe some kind of Inner Space thing. I think I'll plan to use my power on Jim unless something changes.
This is one of the safest ways to hedge bets I think I've seen in mafia.
I think there's one at most (Web more likely than Jim?), but I don't believe there's any currently.I'll level with you, I just wanted to make the pun.
I think it's funny you're making a possible conclusion of three players here while I'm doing the same thing for three players not here.
...make the pun...?
Oh, I get it.
You forgot this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oShTJ90fC34
Post by: ToonyMan on February 25, 2023, 12:34:27 am
Why are you trying to solve roles after explicitly acknowledging that solving roles helps the mafia.I'm only laying down what players have said themselves.
Think about what town should be doing, what mafia are unable to do.
We're absent three players and nothing has happened. Do I like ToonyMan doing this? I think I do.You give me too much credit.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 25, 2023, 02:54:08 am
Hm, Toony = Town, thus Web = Scum?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 25, 2023, 02:55:34 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 25, 2023, 06:29:38 am
a1s & Fluffe9911 need to post, or I'll switch to voting themSorry just woke up timezones and all that jazz
Feels a bit early to really sus anything out other than Tric probably being town since they just went up and role revealed assuming it's not some 4d chess mafia maneuver.
Post by: notquitethere on February 25, 2023, 07:10:24 am
I like Toony's stuff, though I know he can do that effortposting as scum too.
As usual, gut says Max is scum. Need to sanity check that a bit.
Post by: webadict on February 25, 2023, 07:42:10 am
Also, Toony, I'm a Stem, that's why I'm mad at Tric.
Post by: TricMagic on February 25, 2023, 07:52:26 am
Let's not help scum strategise as to who to kill by revealing our roles. I'm going to assume that Tric is trying to bluff or double bluff as that's the only thing that makes sense here.I like how you assume I wouldn't. Even late at night super tired, this post is off.
Webadict let's beef.
Last person to post is scum, A1S.And this one is just way too quick given I was asleep. Why would the last person to post be scum if they weren't even awake NQT?
I like Toony's stuff, though I know he can do that effortposting as scum too.
As usual, gut says Max is scum. Need to sanity check that a bit.
Toony's definitely Town, and I'm busy moving this weekend, so I'm just gonna vote whatever he votes and generally not post.Waves in 1 IQ Brain. Knowing who we are, Roots have a target. Knowing who we are, Flowers can find people. And knowing all this, we can get to the Stem of the problem. This would be 6AM thinking. Almost 7 now, but eh.
Also, Toony, I'm a Stem, that's why I'm mad at Tric.
Post by: notquitethere on February 25, 2023, 08:46:30 am
The thinking is, scum are less proactive, tend to get to the thread later. Just a holistic reason for an RVS vote. Get some more sleep.
Post by: TricMagic on February 25, 2023, 10:09:37 am
This has been brought to you by Phonepost. Have a good day.
Post by: webadict on February 25, 2023, 12:06:00 pm
Waves in 1 IQ Brain. Knowing who we are, Roots have a target. Knowing who we are, Flowers can find people. And knowing all this, we can get to the Stem of the problem. This would be 6AM thinking. Almost 7 now, but eh.Shhh... This is definitely a high IQ play where Toony is guessing if I'm lying or not and not a way to disguise my busy/lazy play.
Post by: Mamobo on February 25, 2023, 12:14:42 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --1-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456587#msg8456587),
-> notquitethere --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456593#msg8456593),
-> TricMagic --1-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456474#msg8456474),
-> webadict --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456560#msg8456560),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
Maximum Spin --0--
ToonyMan --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --5-- a1s, Fluffe9911, Maximum Spin, ToonyMan, webadict,
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (~52 hours remaining).
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Post by: ToonyMan on February 25, 2023, 01:52:22 pm
I'm prepared to give Tric a town pass for now, for reasons others have said. That could change if Tric disappears.Why?
Hm, Toony = Town, thus Web = Scum?
Last person to post is scum, A1S.I also think Max feels like scum, so he's probably town.
I like Toony's stuff, though I know he can do that effortposting as scum too.
As usual, gut says Max is scum. Need to sanity check that a bit.
Toony's definitely Town, and I'm busy moving this weekend, so I'm just gonna vote whatever he votes and generally not post.Darn it Web! It was obvious but you didn't have to go and say it.
Also, Toony, I'm a Stem, that's why I'm mad at Tric.
We have to get to the root of this problem, which means you can't just 99.999% likely tell the truth about your role like that.
Now mafia are going to kill you tonight, because they're not going to kill Tric first! If only there was a way for Webadict to survive the night!
Post by: webadict on February 25, 2023, 02:15:08 pm
No, wait, let me bait fate, no one ever kills me here.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 25, 2023, 03:31:37 pm
As for web vs. Toony: It was a thought that I had. Something about how you two sometimes aren't on the same team, and how we could figure both you out by comparing you. But now, I'm seeing Web as town from this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456590#msg8456590). Most of my scumreading of web was that I though he was too angry at Tric.I'm prepared to give Tric a town pass for now, for reasons others have said. That could change if Tric disappears.Why?
Hm, Toony = Town, thus Web = Scum?Last person to post is scum, A1S.I also think Max feels like scum, so he's probably town.
I like Toony's stuff, though I know he can do that effortposting as scum too.
As usual, gut says Max is scum. Need to sanity check that a bit.
I also tend to agree that since everyone thinks Max is scum, that means Max is probably town. I would also add that Max usually seems townie when he is scum.
Checking their profile A1S hasn't been active since the day started, which puts AlS in the clear on this point. I still want to see a post before I move though.Ok, I think this is town NQT. Humorously incompetent NQT is town NQT.
The thinking is, scum are less proactive, tend to get to the thread later. Just a holistic reason for an RVS vote. Get some more sleep.
What I would like to see:
a1s post
Fluffe9911 (and everyone else) post a bit more
Much less plant puns (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456650#msg8456650)
Post by: TricMagic on February 25, 2023, 03:50:48 pm
Post by: notquitethere on February 25, 2023, 03:54:23 pm
Thanks Euchre, I will try to keep being incompetent going forward so I can keep your faith.
[bFluffe][/b], editing posts is not allowed in forum mafia. You're fine on a first offence, but something to remember.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 25, 2023, 04:05:03 pm
Fluffe9911 (and everyone else) post a bit moreI frankly just don't know what to say it's literally the first day other than blindly pointing fingers at someone based off very little evidence or role-claiming which will probably get me killed not much to talk about right now other than the bare minimum to not get lynched for not talking.
[bFluffe][/b], editing posts is not allowed in forum mafia. You're fine on a first offence, but something to remember.I'll keep that in mind.
Post by: NJW2000 on February 25, 2023, 04:08:03 pm
Do not edit your posts.
Do not post in the thread after you have been killed.
Do not quote the mod (me) directly.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 25, 2023, 04:52:13 pm
Post by: TricMagic on February 25, 2023, 04:55:50 pm
Today, I want to know who Tric thinks is scum.NQT, Max, Jack
Post by: EuchreJack on February 25, 2023, 05:10:01 pm
Good. Now we know who is town. Thanks Tric!Today, I want to know who Tric thinks is scum.NQT, Max, Jack
...I'm saying this because I townread all three of them.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 25, 2023, 05:14:03 pm
Fluffe9911 (and everyone else) post a bit moreI frankly just don't know what to say it's literally the first day other than blindly pointing fingers at someone based off very little evidence or role-claiming which will probably get me killed not much to talk about right now other than the bare minimum to not get lynched for not talking.[bFluffe][/b], editing posts is not allowed in forum mafia. You're fine on a first offence, but something to remember.I'll keep that in mind.
This community has an unfortunate habit of lynching the new guy on Day 1. So you'll have to put in 150% effort to survive to play Day 2.
I'm routing for you, though.
Discussion prompt: Is it better to use one-off powers on Night 1, or later?
Discussion prompt 2: How likely is town to give away too much information Day 1 that mafia can figure out enough of the roles to win on Night 2?
Post by: TricMagic on February 25, 2023, 06:24:41 pm
Moving it over to discussion is a topic change. To answer 1: Depends. To answer 2: You're mafia trying to shut down information.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 25, 2023, 07:26:56 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on February 25, 2023, 08:13:21 pm
Well I'm going to join NQT and vote A1S by virtue of not really feeling anyone else.That seems kinda lazy...
Post by: webadict on February 25, 2023, 09:08:21 pm
Not as lazy as this: a1sWell I'm going to join NQT and vote A1S by virtue of not really feeling anyone else.That seems kinda lazy...
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 25, 2023, 10:20:42 pm
Am I comfortable putting a1s at l-1 to see what happens?
Yes, yes I am.
Discussion prompt 2: How likely is town to give away too much information Day 1 that mafia can figure out enough of the roles to win on Night 2?In this community? YES. The likelihood is "yes".
I assume that means we have to win by day 2.
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 26, 2023, 01:01:47 am
I think I'll plan to use my power on Jim unless something changes.
I probably do nothing on Night 1.
I'm prepared to give Tric a town pass for now, for reasons others have said. That could change if Tric disappears.
Hm, Toony = Town, thus Web = Scum?
I have nothin to base this off of and I might change my opinion before the end of Day 1 and maybe before the end of this post but I think they might both be town.
Last person to post is scum, A1S.
This is a frivolous opinion but I'm not bothered by notquitethere saying it.
Well I'm going to join NQT and vote A1S by virtue of not really feeling anyone else.
This always makes me suspicious especially when coming from a player with a good scum game.
Doesn't this mean the scum team likelier skews more towards the experienced players?
A1S
A1S
a1s
a1s
*salivates*
I think I can confidently say TricMagic is town. Less confidently that Fluffe9911 is town. Leaning town on ToonyMan and webadict.
Undecided about notquitethere, EuchreJack, Maximum Spin.
a1s needs to show up.
Do I think there is two scum in the players I'm undecided about + a1s? Mmmmmmmmmm, doesn't feel right to me. If there's only one scum in that group, then among the group I read town I'd pick ToonyMan, Fluffe9911, webadict, and TricMagic for scum in that order.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 03:22:20 am
I don't know Fluffe and I can't say either way.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 03:34:10 am
I'm like 80% sure Jim is town. Maybe my second most confident read after Tric.
Jack is like 70% town. I haven't seen any clear "yeah this is obviously town Jack", but they also haven't said anything alarming which I think is a lot more valuable.
Everyone else (Web, Max, NQT, Fluffe) is around 50% but I don't see anything vote worthy.
If a1s isn't mafia then I think our two mafia are inside these four players currently.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 03:37:34 am
If I use the Tric radar test, then mafia are inside Web, Fluffe, and a1s.Today, I want to know who Tric thinks is scum.NQT, Max, Jack
Post by: EuchreJack on February 26, 2023, 05:48:52 am
I think you're forgetting to factor in "Tric is so wrong he's right", which means one of Tric's guesses is probably mafia.If I use the Tric radar test, then mafia are inside Web, Fluffe, and a1s.Today, I want to know who Tric thinks is scum.NQT, Max, Jack
Post by: EuchreJack on February 26, 2023, 05:54:47 am
Oh right, this is going on.
So far, I think there's mafia inside ToonyMan, Jim, and webadict.
Now, this is suspicious! Max actually sharing reads, instead of keeping them to himself even upon threat of elimination!
@Max: If a1s shows up and posts something town-worthy, who are you going to vote? Who is everyone else going to vote?
Post by: notquitethere on February 26, 2023, 06:01:05 am
SO
EuchreJack
Discussion prompt: Is it better to use one-off powers on Night 1, or later?This is a bit fishy. Scum would like to know the likelihood that town are going to track them on D1. They could just lay low until the powers are exhausted. I don't think players should be answering this, no?
I think you're forgetting to factor in "Tric is so wrong he's right", which means one of Tric's guesses is probably mafia.This is a weak attack. If you think one of me or Max is scum, which is it? (Or are you just telling on yourself?)
Post by: NJW2000 on February 26, 2023, 06:48:16 am
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456705#msg8456705), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456723#msg8456723), MaximumSpin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456732#msg8456732)
-> notquitethere --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456593#msg8456593),
-> TricMagic --1-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456474#msg8456474),
-> webadict --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456560#msg8456560),
-> EuchreJack --1-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456793#msg8456793)
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
Maximum Spin --0--
ToonyMan --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --2-- a1s, Fluffe9911
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (~34 hours remaining).
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
a1s has been prodded
Post by: webadict on February 26, 2023, 08:13:12 am
Reads:
a1s - Hasn't posted, but may not be the best vote. But I'll probably keep voting him anyway because I wanna see what Toony does with two votes.
EuchreJack - I think EuchreJack is Town here. I'll pretend like I'm stealing Toony's read, but also NQT tends to misread Jack, so that more points in favor.
Fluffe9911 - Newbtown. Completely unafraid of saying the wrong thing on the one post I remember them posting
Jim Groovester - Leanscum, too calm, called me leantown, I have posted three times and copied Toony. Am I doing a recurring gag where I call Jim scum every game? I need to ask Jim more questions to find this out?
Maximum Spin - Has not posted as much as expected, do not like, is Max more likely to post when I post? Leanscum? I feel bad hesitating here, bit only because I haven't posted much either
notquitethere - I am more likely to think NQT is Town here because I feel like his misreading of EuchreJack is in line with Town. Must read NQT logically and not emotionally, which is flip of EuchreJack, create conflicting reads. I also admit that I am against voting out nqt if only because it happens so often and that biases my judgment.
Toony - Literally the most readable player here. There isn't even a point to putting down his alignment because everyone is already aware of what it is and I'd be wasting everyone's time doing so, so I won't, but it should be obvious which one I'm referring to.
TricMagic - ... I have to wonder what changed in TricMagic to suddenly get good at Mafia. I will put him down as surprisingly null, because newTric I have not seen as Mafia yet.
@Jim: Say we vote out Mafia and I then claimed to be the same role as the dead Mafia, what would your thought process be?
@Max: What assumption(s) would one naturally conclude from your statement that there's scum in Jim, Toony, and I?
@nqt: What play from EuchreJack would cause you to think he's Town?
@Tric: Which player are you the most positive about?
@Euchre: What's your feeling on Tric?
And none for
Anyway, more moving, probably won't post for a couple hours, but probably will read posts as they come in
Post by: TricMagic on February 26, 2023, 09:31:06 am
That means either you or NQT, unless it's Max. Flip a coin jack.I think you're forgetting to factor in "Tric is so wrong he's right", which means one of Tric's guesses is probably mafia.If I use the Tric radar test, then mafia are inside Web, Fluffe, and a1s.Today, I want to know who Tric thinks is scum.NQT, Max, Jack
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 10:06:51 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 10:13:14 am
If I use the Tric radar test, then mafia are inside Web, Fluffe, and a1s.Only two mafia though so I think you may gotta update your radar a bit.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 10:19:04 am
So everyone's voting a1s cause they aint talking at all?I'd rather vote a player that isn't here then someone I don't really think is mafia.
Who do you think dies tonight? Or at least, who do you think mafia will want to kill most?
readsI'm right about Jim more than you're right though.
The one time Jim was mafia recently I switched my vote to him after you convinced me.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 10:20:05 am
1. Tric gave 3 scumreads for me to inverseIf I use the Tric radar test, then mafia are inside Web, Fluffe, and a1s.Only two mafia though so I think you may gotta update your radar a bit.
2. Mafia being inside a group doesn't mean they're all mafia
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 10:22:42 am
I'm very intrigued by the rapid wagon formation. a1s hasn't posted on the forum in six days (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=178913.msg8455608#msg8455608). Assuming that keeps up, I don't see that much pressure is being had here.Jack wasn't on the bandwagon though?
SO
EuchreJack
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 10:36:09 am
I'd rather vote a player that isn't here then someone I don't really think is mafia.Fair enough and I'm not gonna go into specifics cause then mafia are probably gonna kill that person because they think they are funny. But probably a person they think is too close to the truth (somehow) or they know tends to be competent. What branch they are on will also probably have a large effect in the decently likely chance they are on the same level as a person who has pretty much already revealed their role. Or who knows maybe they throw darts!
Who do you think dies tonight? Or at least, who do you think mafia will want to kill most?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 26, 2023, 11:33:37 am
I'm very intrigued by the rapid wagon formation. a1s hasn't posted on the forum in six days (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=178913.msg8455608#msg8455608). Assuming that keeps up, I don't see that much pressure is being had here.Discussion prompt is a discussion prompt. Do you think Mafia wins if they lay low?
SO
EuchreJackDiscussion prompt: Is it better to use one-off powers on Night 1, or later?This is a bit fishy. Scum would like to know the likelihood that town are going to track them on D1. They could just lay low until the powers are exhausted. I don't think players should be answering this, no?I think you're forgetting to factor in "Tric is so wrong he's right", which means one of Tric's guesses is probably mafia.This is a weak attack. If you think one of me or Max is scum, which is it? (Or are you just telling on yourself?)
I'm not much of an "attacker". But you did omit this:
And I'll back it up with a vote on MaxOh right, this is going on.
So far, I think there's mafia inside ToonyMan, Jim, and webadict.
Now, this is suspicious! Max actually sharing reads, instead of keeping them to himself even upon threat of elimination!Or maybe a sign of improving play.But nobody improves here!
@Max: If a1s shows up and posts something town-worthy, who are you going to vote? Who is everyone else going to vote?
@Euchre: What's your feeling on Tric?I believe he is town.
My limited views of scum!Tric indicate a much more subdued playstyle.
I'm using the Dragon!Tric game (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180394.0) as a baseline, where Tric won as third-party. Really didn't see that coming.
Post by: notquitethere on February 26, 2023, 11:48:35 am
@nqt: What play from EuchreJack would cause you to think he's Town?If he flips town, that'd be a good indicator.
But in serious, if I'm convinced it looks like he's trying to catch scum and not work out best play for the mafia team, I'll move my vote to someone else. Or maybe I'll vote someone else when they're more obviously scummy. Usual.
Jack wasn't on the bandwagon though?I know? The first part was my giving myself permission to unvote when a person hadn't responded to the initial vote, something I'd not normally do. My reason for voting Jack is separate.
Discussion prompt is a discussion prompt.Hmm
Do you think Mafia wins if they lay low?I think there are solid mechanical reasons for mafia to not kill N1 but kill every other night, though whether they do or not depends on the personalities of the mafia team and what role flips.
Rolefishing as a scumtell is usually kind of bullshit (though as scum I have fished sometimes, just as I have as town- I like to understand what's going on in the game), but appearing to work out in public whether it's safe for you to use your kill is a very bad look!
Post by: TricMagic on February 26, 2023, 11:59:10 am
If you flip mafia, that will be a good indicator. If you flip town, that will be a good indicator. Indicator of what NQT?@nqt: What play from EuchreJack would cause you to think he's Town?If he flips town, that'd be a good indicator.
But in serious, if I'm convinced it looks like he's trying to catch scum and not work out best play for the mafia team, I'll move my vote to someone else. Or maybe I'll vote someone else when they're more obviously scummy. Usual.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 12:02:44 pm
Post by: notquitethere on February 26, 2023, 12:42:08 pm
If you flip mafia, that will be a good indicator. If you flip town, that will be a good indicator. Indicator of what NQT?I was using irony and understatement when I said that Jack flipping town would be a good indicator that he is town. I'm not sure what you are meaning by 'indicator' here. Rephrase your question if you want it answered.
Post by: TricMagic on February 26, 2023, 12:50:37 pm
Guess my TricMagic has revealed your false faith. Not even an attempt to answer? Just deflection.If you flip mafia, that will be a good indicator. If you flip town, that will be a good indicator. Indicator of what NQT?I was using irony and understatement when I said that Jack flipping town would be a good indicator that he is town. I'm not sure what you are meaning by 'indicator' here. Rephrase your question if you want it answered.
If you flip mafia, it's a good indicator of who you are. If you flip town, it's a good indicator of who you are. Not that that matters, cause the indicated happens to be dead town.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 01:14:28 pm
Do you think mafia have a good idea what branch each player is right now?I'd rather vote a player that isn't here then someone I don't really think is mafia.Fair enough and I'm not gonna go into specifics cause then mafia are probably gonna kill that person because they think they are funny. But probably a person they think is too close to the truth (somehow) or they know tends to be competent. What branch they are on will also probably have a large effect in the decently likely chance they are on the same level as a person who has pretty much already revealed their role. Or who knows maybe they throw darts!
Who do you think dies tonight? Or at least, who do you think mafia will want to kill most?
If there's a mafia in Stem we're a little fucked since they just have to find the non-Tric Stem, but whatever.
extremely calm postI don't like this or the vote on Max. I think your justification here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456790#msg8456790) is a sudden turn from your previous stance (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456662#msg8456662) and sounds phony to me.
Post by: notquitethere on February 26, 2023, 01:33:25 pm
Guess my TricMagic has revealed your false faith. Not even an attempt to answer? Just deflection.Mate you were just being incoherent. Of course my flip indicates who I am. That's obvious. I didn't answer that because it didn't occur to me you were asking something so brain dead. Come on.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 26, 2023, 01:42:29 pm
I should have thought of that before joining this.
Oh well. Anyway. Uhhh, unvote. I usually like voting someone out just for inactivity, but it's probably a bad idea in this game.
That's Tric. Do you really not know Tric yet?Guess my TricMagic has revealed your false faith. Not even an attempt to answer? Just deflection.Mate you were just being incoherent. Of course my flip indicates who I am. That's obvious. I didn't answer that because it didn't occur to me you were asking something so brain dead. Come on.
Post by: TricMagic on February 26, 2023, 01:45:47 pm
I've been taking weekends mostly off the internet lately, and it's been nice.Apparently not, since NQT was the one who said it would be a good indicator in the first place. What does that make them?
I should have thought of that before joining this.
Oh well. Anyway. Uhhh, unvote. I usually like voting someone out just for inactivity, but it's probably a bad idea in this game.That's Tric. Do you really not know Tric yet?Guess my TricMagic has revealed your false faith. Not even an attempt to answer? Just deflection.Mate you were just being incoherent. Of course my flip indicates who I am. That's obvious. I didn't answer that because it didn't occur to me you were asking something so brain dead. Come on.
News flash, a Dead Town is never a Good indicator. Just an informative one.
Post by: notquitethere on February 26, 2023, 02:33:17 pm
---
Fluffe, I recommend voting early and often if you would like other players to be able to read you. Shooting from the hip, who would you eliminate now if you had to?
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 02:46:37 pm
Do you think mafia have a good idea what branch each player is right now?Considering the (almost) complete lack of data I'd frankly be shocked if they did and wonder if they are very lucky or literal Einstein mathematical and social geniuses in which case I probably shouldn't be playing this game.
Fluffe, I recommend voting early and often if you would like other players to be able to read you. Shooting from the hip, who would you eliminate now if you had to?Frankly, No One there is simply not enough evidence for me to be confident enough to vote for literally anyone right now. If that aint satisfying enough and im literally forced at gunpoint then I say the guy currently forcing me to vote at gunpoint haha. I will say though I think voting for a1s right now is a bad idea if they are town then we are one step closer to losing and if they are mafia then well they are pretty much dead weight right now considering they aint been online at all for about two days. Of course, if they come back then that changes things but I have a feeling it's in our best interest to keep em around for now. (They will probably get auto yeeted by NJW if they stay inactive anyway)
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 03:24:49 pm
Frankly, No One there is simply not enough evidence for me to be confident enough to vote for literally anyone right now. If that aint satisfying enough and im literally forced at gunpoint then I say the guy currently forcing me to vote at gunpoint haha. I will say though I think voting for a1s right now is a bad idea if they are town then we are one step closer to losing and if they are mafia then well they are pretty much dead weight right now considering they aint been online at all for about two days. Of course, if they come back then that changes things but I have a feeling it's in our best interest to keep em around for now. (They will probably get auto yeeted by NJW if they stay inactive anyway)Do you think someone will catch mafia on N1?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 26, 2023, 03:33:16 pm
Amazing, every word of what you said is wrong. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sRS1dwCotw)Do you think mafia have a good idea what branch each player is right now?Considering the (almost) complete lack of data I'd frankly be shocked if they did and wonder if they are very lucky or literal Einstein mathematical and social geniuses in which case I probably shouldn't be playing this game.Fluffe, I recommend voting early and often if you would like other players to be able to read you. Shooting from the hip, who would you eliminate now if you had to?Frankly, No One there is simply not enough evidence for me to be confident enough to vote for literally anyone right now. If that aint satisfying enough and im literally forced at gunpoint then I say the guy currently forcing me to vote at gunpoint haha. I will say though I think voting for a1s right now is a bad idea if they are town then we are one step closer to losing and if they are mafia then well they are pretty much dead weight right now considering they aint been online at all for about two days. Of course, if they come back then that changes things but I have a feeling it's in our best interest to keep em around for now. (They will probably get auto yeeted by NJW if they stay inactive anyway)
There is unfortunately too much date on roles currently. I'd rather not point it out, but there have been at least hints of player roles.
To make things worse, mafia know two roles on default, whereas town only know one without analyzing the game.
As for a1s, a missing townie is a useless townie, whereas a missing mafia is an extra life for the active mafia player.
Although, in this particular game, a dead townie brings us a lot closer to losing.
Oh, and screw you Toony.extremely calm postI don't like this or the vote on Max. I think your justification here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456790#msg8456790) is a sudden turn from your previous stance (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456662#msg8456662) and sounds phony to me.
...
My thought process was the following:
I had originally intended to unvote web, but forgot. Hence having a vote on web that wasn't accurate to my current mind state.
Then, upon reviewing Tric's list of suspects, I figured "well, maybe one is scum?"
I had originally had higher suspicion of NQT, but just wasn't feeling it.
So I figured that I would check Max out. And then I noted Max was communicating more like his scum-self than his town-self. So I followed that up with a question. NQT giving me shit had me figuring I should double down on Max with a vote.
...and here we are.
Honestly, I'd like a1s to post so we could decide properly on them. If they don't post, I'm quite happy to eliminate them. What I suspect will happen is they'll vote with less than 24 hours, so we'll be stuck scrambling for the Day 1 lynch. Which is gonna suck. So we should probably start working on secondary lynches.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 03:42:41 pm
A ton of stuff.I'm sorry but I don't consider subtle hints to be actual evidence in a game where the goal of the mafia is to deceive and yeah normally I'd agree that no talk = lynch but in this case we could literally lose on day ONE if they happen to be the wrong role it's not worth the risk.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 03:47:46 pm
Do you think someone will catch mafia on N1?It's possible but it would require the Stem or Flower to use their oneshot on the very first day and to get quite lucky. I say it's unlikely but not impossible.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 04:18:08 pm
Shouldn't we vote someone today then?Do you think someone will catch mafia on N1?It's possible but it would require the Stem or Flower to use their oneshot on the very first day and to get quite lucky. I say it's unlikely but not impossible.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 04:21:43 pm
Shouldn't we vote someone today then?Depends if you are comfortable risking a day one loss or not I don't quiet get the logic.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 04:23:38 pm
What are you going to say on Day 2?Shouldn't we vote someone today then?Depends if you are comfortable risking a day one loss or not I don't quiet get the logic.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 26, 2023, 04:27:23 pm
What are you going to say on Day 2?I don't know aint like I got a script depends on what ends up happening frankly im not sure how your actually supposed to sus out mafia other than through people dying since they got the same roles as us and people dying just brings em closer to victory it's quiet the predicament we really need a ton of luck to win this.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 26, 2023, 04:37:10 pm
Oh, and screw you Toony.I still think your response here is way too cool-headed now that I scrutinize you more, am I wrong?
...
My thought process was the following:
I had originally intended to unvote web, but forgot. Hence having a vote on web that wasn't accurate to my current mind state.
Then, upon reviewing Tric's list of suspects, I figured "well, maybe one is scum?"
I had originally had higher suspicion of NQT, but just wasn't feeling it.
So I figured that I would check Max out. And then I noted Max was communicating more like his scum-self than his town-self. So I followed that up with a question. NQT giving me shit had me figuring I should double down on Max with a vote.
...and here we are.
Honestly, I'd like a1s to post so we could decide properly on them. If they don't post, I'm quite happy to eliminate them. What I suspect will happen is they'll vote with less than 24 hours, so we'll be stuck scrambling for the Day 1 lynch. Which is gonna suck. So we should probably start working on secondary lynches.
Post by: notquitethere on February 26, 2023, 05:07:47 pm
Help me work through the scenarios here...
Post by: a1s on February 26, 2023, 05:19:05 pm
Anyway, I'm town and I will say more tomorrow.
Post by: NJW2000 on February 26, 2023, 05:20:00 pm
Rule Correction: The mafia win when all players in a segment are dead, and no mafia players in the segment have been killed by day elimination.
Post by: TricMagic on February 26, 2023, 06:13:00 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 26, 2023, 07:14:38 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --2-- ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456705#msg8456705), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456723#msg8456723)
-> notquitethere --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456593#msg8456593),
-> TricMagic --1-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456474#msg8456474),
-> EuchreJack --1-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456793#msg8456793)
-> Maximum Spin --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456850#msg8456850)
-> No One --1-- Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456883#msg8456883)
webadict --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
ToonyMan --0--
Not Voting --2-- a1s, MaximumSpin
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (~22 hours remaining).
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Post by: Mamobo on February 26, 2023, 08:41:14 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456587#msg8456587), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456705#msg8456705), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456723#msg8456723),
Maximum Spin --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456850#msg8456850),
notquitethere --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456593#msg8456593),
TricMagic --1-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456474#msg8456474),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
ToonyMan --0--
webadict --0--
No One --1-- Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456883#msg8456883),
Not Voting --2-- a1s, Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456874#msg8456874),
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (20 hours and 17 minutes remaining.)
Post by: webadict on February 26, 2023, 08:41:44 pm
Post by: webadict on February 26, 2023, 10:55:22 pm
This post slightly spews Town, but it's not a bad idea to discuss who you think might die, especially since the Mafia have a slightly different win condition than normal. If you're afraid of the Mafia framing you through kills, you're worried about the wrong thing because there's much easier ways to frame a player, and even much easier ways to frame you in specific.I'd rather vote a player that isn't here then someone I don't really think is mafia.Fair enough and I'm not gonna go into specifics cause then mafia are probably gonna kill that person because they think they are funny. But probably a person they think is too close to the truth (somehow) or they know tends to be competent. What branch they are on will also probably have a large effect in the decently likely chance they are on the same level as a person who has pretty much already revealed their role. Or who knows maybe they throw darts!
Who do you think dies tonight? Or at least, who do you think mafia will want to kill most?
In short, think about who and why a player might be killed, and stop worrying about how you're going to look saying something.
Same, but Tric has moved into a quieter type of play, and it's far more effective. I have moved him from "Expendable" to "Less expendable", which is a solid improvement.@Euchre: What's your feeling on Tric?I believe he is town.
My limited views of scum!Tric indicate a much more subdued playstyle.
I'm using the Dragon!Tric game (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180394.0) as a baseline, where Tric won as third-party. Really didn't see that coming.
I don't exactly see him not doing that. Is there something about his play in specific that looks like he's not trying to catch scum, even if through that methodology?@nqt: What play from EuchreJack would cause you to think he's Town?If he flips town, that'd be a good indicator.
But in serious, if I'm convinced it looks like he's trying to catch scum and not work out best play for the mafia team, I'll move my vote to someone else. Or maybe I'll vote someone else when they're more obviously scummy. Usual.
Hmm I like NQT's attitude towards Jack.I agree with this.
If there's a mafia in Stem we're a little fucked since they just have to find the non-Tric Stem, but whatever.Rude >:(
I've been taking weekends mostly off the internet lately, and it's been nice.Max, what can I trade you to give me some insight into other players?
I should have thought of that before joining this.
Oh well. Anyway. Uhhh, unvote. I usually like voting someone out just for inactivity, but it's probably a bad idea in this game.
Also, I did ask a question, but it's kinda just a question to get you to talk and on re-reading it, it's shit, so forget it and here's a new one: Are you will to vote one of those three you suspected?
Hmm, that's the true question of the game, though: Are you able to tell if someone knows something you don't know? Are you able to tell if someone knows only the things that they're supposed to know? Therein lies the fundamental concept of the game. There's two informed players that are trying to pretend like they aren't. To pretend like we're geniuses is incorrect: We're not. We're experienced at this game, though, and we've learned that it's hard to hide that information, but that's the fun of the game. Can you tell if someone is lying, and are they lying for the Town's benefit?Do you think mafia have a good idea what branch each player is right now?Considering the (almost) complete lack of data I'd frankly be shocked if they did and wonder if they are very lucky or literal Einstein mathematical and social geniuses in which case I probably shouldn't be playing this game.Fluffe, I recommend voting early and often if you would like other players to be able to read you. Shooting from the hip, who would you eliminate now if you had to?Frankly, No One there is simply not enough evidence for me to be confident enough to vote for literally anyone right now. If that aint satisfying enough and im literally forced at gunpoint then I say the guy currently forcing me to vote at gunpoint haha. I will say though I think voting for a1s right now is a bad idea if they are town then we are one step closer to losing and if they are mafia then well they are pretty much dead weight right now considering they aint been online at all for about two days. Of course, if they come back then that changes things but I have a feeling it's in our best interest to keep em around for now. (They will probably get auto yeeted by NJW if they stay inactive anyway)
The point is, do not be afraid to say anyone at any point in time. I will be the one holding you at gunpoint, if you'd like, but I am in agreement with everyone else saying that you should absolutely vote someone you think is suspicious. We won't pick No One, since that's accepting that we cannot rely on our ability to vote out people without evidence, which means that we have no faith in the Town at all.
Waves in Stem. Knowing I'm a stem doesn't really help, now that I think about it. I'm only suspicious if another died. And probably dead next night, so.. For all this, my suspison is NQT/Jack as the scumteam this time around. No lynch is a perfectly valid idea this early if you think you can get info. Relying on flowers is a valid method.... Ya know, sometimes, I think you're getting better, and then you do this, and I shake my head.
Anyway, that's my take, I got distracted and finished it before bed, see ya.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 26, 2023, 11:15:17 pm
Also, I did ask a question, but it's kinda just a question to get you to talk and on re-reading it, it's shit, so forget it and here's a new one: Are you will to vote one of those three you suspected?Yes.
Quote
Max, what can I trade you to give me some insight into other players?How about... a vote for Jim. A vote for Jim is a vote for... Jimming... Jim.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 12:26:27 am
I also think Fluffe is probably town.
I'm not convinced in a Jim vote.Also, I did ask a question, but it's kinda just a question to get you to talk and on re-reading it, it's shit, so forget it and here's a new one: Are you will to vote one of those three you suspected?Yes.QuoteMax, what can I trade you to give me some insight into other players?How about... a vote for Jim. A vote for Jim is a vote for... Jimming... Jim.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 12:27:41 am
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 12:28:51 am
oh, wow, there are 7 pages to read here.Looking forward to changing my vote an hour before day end.
Anyway, I'm town and I will say more tomorrow.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 12:40:07 am
Actually, given that it's game over if two town of the same type die... we could lose N1 if we mislynch. So as it's MYLO (more or less), is there a good rationale for no-launch?I don't think there is.
Help me work through the scenarios here...
If we don't lynch then we can't lose before D2, but we can't get closer to winning either.
If some of us fire off our one-shots on N1 we could catch mafia...or mafia chooses not to kill and we get false positives as Roots and Stems out themselves thinking they stopped the kill. If mafia nokill then Flowers also can't get concrete results. If anything I feel like mafia are more likely not to kill if we no lynch to make us waste our one-shots.
Earlier Jim said he probably wasn't going to use his one-shot tonight when Jack asked everyone. That makes me feel good about Jim even if I can't think of why it would be alignment indicative.
When is it correct to use our one-shot? I don't think this question should be answered. Did Jim answer because he's being honest? Maybe.
Right now I feel like mafia are a1s and Jack after some back and forth in my mind.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 27, 2023, 01:04:45 am
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 01:26:08 am
Anyways, here's what I've been up to in Noita. (https://i.imgur.com/933P8Tv.mp4)
Thanks for reading my post. I'll see you guys tomorrow.
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 02:11:23 am
Jim Groovester - Leanscum, too calm, called me leantown, I have posted three times and copied Toony. Am I doing a recurring gag where I call Jim scum every game? I need to ask Jim more questions to find this out?
dammitwebadictwhydoesithavetobeliterallyeverygame
@Jim: Say we vote out Mafia and I then claimed to be the same role as the dead Mafia, what would your thought process be?
"Hm, is this the truth or some stupid gambit? If it is a gambit, does this make more sense for town webadict or scum webadict to do?"
Even if I do townread you from time to time I'd be stupid if I take anything you say at face value. Figuring you out is figuring out whether your deception makes more sense from a town or a scum perspective. In your question, there are very good reasons for both town and scum to claim the same role as the dead mafia, but it is far riskier for scum to fake claim in this setup. So I'd guess I'd probably believe you until other claims come out and there are four of the role you claimed, at which point I immediately assume the worst and vote you.
Hmm I like NQT's attitude towards Jack.
I do too.
I don't like this or the vote on Max. I think your justification here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456790#msg8456790) is a sudden turn from your previous stance (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456662#msg8456662) and sounds phony to me.
I largely see your point but expressing opinions that contradict previous opinions is not out of the ordinary for EuchreJack.
@Webadict:
I also think Fluffe is probably town.
I do too.
I'm not convinced in a Jim vote.
Neither am I.
Actually Jim why are you voting Tric still?? Do you think he's mafia or what?
No, he's my strongest town read.
Guess my TricMagic has revealed your false faith. Not even an attempt to answer? Just deflection.If you flip mafia, that will be a good indicator. If you flip town, that will be a good indicator. Indicator of what NQT?I was using irony and understatement when I said that Jack flipping town would be a good indicator that he is town. I'm not sure what you are meaning by 'indicator' here. Rephrase your question if you want it answered.
If you flip mafia, it's a good indicator of who you are. If you flip town, it's a good indicator of who you are. Not that that matters, cause the indicated happens to be dead town.
This is incomprehensible. I have no idea what this says or doesn't say about notquitethere.
This is unmistakably town TricMagic.
Waves in Stem. Knowing I'm a stem doesn't really help, now that I think about it. I'm only suspicious if another died. And probably dead next night, so.. For all this, my suspison is NQT/Jack as the scumteam this time around. No lynch is a perfectly valid idea this early if you think you can get info. Relying on flowers is a valid method.
Does NQT/Jack make sense as a scum team? I don't think it does.
Frankly, No One there is simply not enough evidence for me to be confident enough to vote for literally anyone right now. If that aint satisfying enough and im literally forced at gunpoint then I say the guy currently forcing me to vote at gunpoint haha. I will say though I think voting for a1s right now is a bad idea if they are town then we are one step closer to losing and if they are mafia then well they are pretty much dead weight right now considering they aint been online at all for about two days. Of course, if they come back then that changes things but I have a feeling it's in our best interest to keep em around for now. (They will probably get auto yeeted by NJW if they stay inactive anyway)
You've already been taken to task by other players for this attitude so I'm not going to belabor it much more. But...,
If you are town you literally cannot win the game unless you vote and lynch mafia, and you can't lynch mafia without a majority vote. So, what's your plan to i) identify who the mafia players are, and ii) get enough players to agree with you to lynch them?
Voting to no lynch does not help you win the game whatsoever since you are not trying to lynch mafia, and no lynching also does not let you test any theories about who the mafia could be either.
oh, wow, there are 7 pages to read here.
Anyway, I'm town and I will say more tomorrow.
This is a very unsatisfying first post two days into Day 1. I'm tempted to even call it evasive.
When you do post it better blow my socks off.
Psssssssssssssssssh seven pages. That's nothing.
How about... a vote for Jim. A vote for Jim is a vote for... Jimming... Jim.
Jimmin deez nutz
I think my opinions are largely unchanged from my previous post. Leaning strong town on TricMagic. Leaning town on ToonyMan, webadict, and Fluffe9911. Going to move notquitethere to lean town as well.
a1s has a very disappointing first post. Maximum Spin feels quiet. I think I see where other players are coming from regarding EuchreJack but I can't really put a finger on what's dissatisfying about his play so I might be letting my town reads influence my opinion about him.
Let's vote EuchreJack and see what happens.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 03:36:09 am
Actually, given that it's game over if two town of the same type die... we could lose N1 if we mislynch. So as it's MYLO (more or less), is there a good rationale for no-launch?I don't think there is.
Help me work through the scenarios here...
If we don't lynch then we can't lose before D2, but we can't get closer to winning either.
If some of us fire off our one-shots on N1 we could catch mafia...or mafia chooses not to kill and we get false positives as Roots and Stems out themselves thinking they stopped the kill. If mafia nokill then Flowers also can't get concrete results. If anything I feel like mafia are more likely not to kill if we no lynch to make us waste our one-shots.
Earlier Jim said he probably wasn't going to use his one-shot tonight when Jack asked everyone. That makes me feel good about Jim even if I can't think of why it would be alignment indicative.
When is it correct to use our one-shot? I don't think this question should be answered. Did Jim answer because he's being honest? Maybe.
Right now I feel like mafia are a1s and Jack after some back and forth in my mind.
Actually, if everyone fires off their one-shots on Night 1, Town roleblocks will likely cancel up to three one-shots, which will then be usable on Night 2.
Anyways, I'm done talking to Toonyman. He's either doing his town "Jack is scum" or his scum "Jack is scum", and further engagement is unproductive.
Also:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'm going to switch my vote to a1s
I just don't think it's Jack.Yes, this might be part of why.
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 04:50:52 am
I'm going to switch my vote to a1sYou're making a mistake here. But whatever, with 3 votes to my name I was already dead. which is sad, because I'm Town.
Post by: notquitethere on February 27, 2023, 05:08:51 am
This kind of post just makes me want to vote you. Where's the fight? Where's the moxie? Are you going to perish like a dog? Three votes is nothing! I eat three votes for breakfast. Do something! You're not even voting. How you going to catch scum like that?I'm going to switch my vote to a1sYou're making a mistake here. But whatever, with 3 votes to my name I was already dead. which is sad, because I'm Town.
Web it looks like Mamobo didn't pick up my Jack vote. I even said "EuchreJack" so I'm not sure what its problem is.
Post by: notquitethere on February 27, 2023, 05:29:31 am
Unofficial Vote Count
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- ToonyMan*, webadict, EuchreJack
-> notquitethere --1-- TricMagic*,
-> EuchreJack --2-- notquitethere, Jim Groovester
-> No One --1-- Fluffe9911*
webadict --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
ToonyMan --0--
Not Voting --2-- a1s, MaximumSpin
Let's take a quick look at these votes:
notquitethere: Vote on Jack for reasons. Not earth shattering reasons, but the bar is very low in this game
ToonyMan*, webadict: Voting for the lurker. Boring but relatively legit. Not that impressive as a1s was absent the entire forum for the period of the game, so it wasn't like they were deliberately lurking
Jim Groovester: Vote on Jack to see what happens. Sure.
EuchreJack: Voting to save his skin. Null. Ish.
TricMagic: Incoherent vote on NQT. Must make sense in Tric-land.
Fluffe9911: Wants a no lynch. I can sort of see the rationale but this is incredibly passive and Not Good
a1s: Won't even vote to save their own save skin! This feels like newbie weak woe-is-me play. I don't like it though.
Max: Not voting. Max often doesn't vote at EOD, or puts a vote on a no hope wagon. While this can't exactly be called effective play, unfortunately it's a null tell for this guy
TricMagic, get real.
Web/Toony: Is there a good way to discern between town giving up and scum giving up? I've seen this situation play out loads of times with both alignments. Players just giving up. I feel like mafia are in such a strong position in this game that they have no reason to be so easily demoralised, but some players fold under pressure.
Fluffe9911, looks like the "no one" vote isn't going through. Who are you going to pick instead?
Max now remind me again, what is town's most powerful weapon?
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 06:06:53 am
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 06:13:02 am
What's your point? Are you arguing that everyone should be using their one-shots on N1 because then we may have three non-block oneshots for N2? It's also important to remember that blocks can't stop other blocks.
@a1s:
Vote Jack and I'll switch, he has better things to do with his time anyway.
PPE:
Oh...well then. I'll Unvote and consider this a vote on Jack and see if he gets less snarky. I don't want to L-1 in case of accident hammer.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 06:17:21 am
Web/Toony: Is there a good way to discern between town giving up and scum giving up? I've seen this situation play out loads of times with both alignments. Players just giving up. I feel like mafia are in such a strong position in this game that they have no reason to be so easily demoralised, but some players fold under pressure.I don't know. It's easier to tell if I've played with them before, but the general rule I go by is that a new player throwing in the towel is usually town.
Is a1s town? Maybe, I don't think they've really thrown in the towel though, but highlighting town in green is very convincing. What was their behavior like in other games?
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 08:22:24 am
Is a1s town? Maybe, I don't think they've really thrown in the towel though, but highlighting town in green is very convincing.It's basic psychology, my man. I try to associate the color green with town and a1s.
Admittedly I would do that even if I was Scum.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 08:23:21 am
Web/Toony: Is there a good way to discern between town giving up and scum giving up? I've seen this situation play out loads of times with both alignments. Players just giving up. I feel like mafia are in such a strong position in this game that they have no reason to be so easily demoralised, but some players fold under pressure.I don't know. It's easier to tell if I've played with them before, but the general rule I go by is that a new player throwing in the towel is usually town.
Is a1s town? Maybe, I don't think they've really thrown in the towel though, but highlighting town in green is very convincing. What was their behavior like in other games?
In their only other game, they were mafia, so we have no frame of reference.
@Jack:That is my general theory, yes.
What's your point? Are you arguing that everyone should be using their one-shots on N1 because then we may have three non-block oneshots for N2? It's also important to remember that blocks can't stop other blocks.
Although I'm starting to think that there is utility in exactly one roleblock and one protect not being used by town.
But scum have at least one roleblcck or protect, possibly both.
So probably any "save things for later" tactic is a losing tactic.
Why do you want town to lose, Toonyman? ???
Could this be the legendary Toony/Web scumteam?
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Does voting me out as town help town win? I mean, if so, I don't particuarly mind going out. But what are we NOT looking at?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 08:24:59 am
very well, I vote for EuchreJack.
Good job, fine chap.
Now we fight!
You are scum! SCUUMMMMMY SCUMMM SCUMMMBUCKETTEDY SCUMMM!
I mean, you can't even be bothered to read!
And, and, you didn't make a reads list yet!
You are so soo ssooooo scum!
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 08:25:44 am
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 08:30:18 am
very well, I vote for EuchreJack.
Good job, fine chap.
Now we fight!
I am scum! SCUUMMMMMY SCUMMM SCUMMMBUCKETTEDY SCUMMM!
I mean, you can't even be bothered to read!
And, and, you didn't make a reads list yet!
You are so soo ssooooo scum!
a what list?
Post by: notquitethere on February 27, 2023, 08:34:40 am
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 08:41:55 am
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 09:07:47 am
Going to stick to my gut and go with Jack then. Almost hammered. Any last pleas, maybe that read list you promised to do later?
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 10:49:14 am
So probably any "save things for later" tactic is a losing tactic.How does town coordinate who uses actions at night without mafia knowing? Why are you encouraging players to use their one-shots as soon as possible? People can do whatever they want, I decided to give NQT"s question some thought and the conclusion I came to is everyone using their ability on N1 sounds like it will probably work out poorly, especially if mafia nokill because we then don't learn anything.
Why do you want town to lose, Toonyman? ???
The most ideal situation would be if a kill actually happened and a Flower caught it in the act, the chances of this happening are low. We trade one of our Flowers for a mafia, and even then we could have our Roots then protect the confirmed town Flower for at least a night or two (or at least scare mafia enough not to try for it). This wouldn't be possible if all our Roots blew their one-shots on N1.
I guess if you do use your one-shot early it's important not to make that obvious to mafia and bluff that you can still action. This will create uncertainty for them which is important to keep our high priority town players alive.
Could this be the legendary Toony/Web scumteam?What are you gonna do about it?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Does voting me out as town help town win? I mean, if so, I don't particuarly mind going out. But what are we NOT looking at?Does town!Jack not care about living? I think your nonchalance is suspicious.
Jack why are you insincerely playfighting here?very well, I vote for EuchreJack.Good job, fine chap.
Now we fight!
You are scum! SCUUMMMMMY SCUMMM SCUMMMBUCKETTEDY SCUMMM!
I mean, you can't even be bothered to read!
And, and, you didn't make a reads list yet!
You are so soo ssooooo scum!
Ok, that's a valid point- I'm pretty shit at "reading" people. In my other game a1s didn't have to read anyone (because a1s wasn't town.)How does each player make you feel? If you got more to say even better.
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 12:27:47 pm
Does voting me out as town help town win? I mean, if so, I don't particuarly mind going out. But what are we NOT looking at?
You tell me.
You are scum! SCUUMMMMMY SCUMMM SCUMMMBUCKETTEDY SCUMMM!
Yeah this bothers me too.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 27, 2023, 12:40:13 pm
Could this be the legendary Toony/Web scumteam?I don't see it. They're not doing the thing. Remember Radio City?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Man, is this really the voting spread we're getting today? I guess out of these options I'd vote for a1s. Would anyone be tempted into switching to someone else, though? I'll even vote for web or Toony if you want, Jack, just to see what it's like.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 12:51:11 pm
So probably any "save things for later" tactic is a losing tactic.How does town coordinate who uses actions at night without mafia knowing?
Why do you want town to lose, Toonyman? ???
I had an idea on that.
Each player says who they want to protect, track, and roleblock.
For example, I would Protect Jim, Track ToonyMan, and Roleblock a1s/Web.
Players can then use that info to analyze what I might do, and avoid double-town-roleblock/track/protects.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 12:52:05 pm
Toonyman, I demand an apology!Jack why are you insincerely playfighting here?very well, I vote for EuchreJack.Good job, fine chap.
Now we fight!
You are scum! SCUUMMMMMY SCUMMM SCUMMMBUCKETTEDY SCUMMM!
I mean, you can't even be bothered to read!
And, and, you didn't make a reads list yet!
You are so soo ssooooo scum!
I was very sincere in my playfighting!
Post by: notquitethere on February 27, 2023, 12:56:42 pm
I had an idea on that.I see, so scum can check which one of them isn't being tracked, and which of their potential targets isn't being protected? I don't think this is a pro town suggestion!
Each player says who they want to protect, track, and roleblock.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:07:32 pm
Or, town can cover everyone.I had an idea on that.I see, so scum can check which one of them isn't being tracked, and which of their potential targets isn't being protected? I don't think this is a pro town suggestion!
Each player says who they want to protect, track, and roleblock.
And town can figure out who scum would have picked to do the kill.
Hey, at least I'm trying to strategize! What have you done lately, pal?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:09:09 pm
MaximumSpin - Isn't trying to get me lynched
TricMagic - Seems like his town self. As said before, his scumself is more subdued
Fluffe9911 - Is trying to figure out their first game of forum mafia, is not hyper-defensive (would be a more normal behavior in first game as mafia). The desire to not vote wrong is normal for newbie town, whereas newbie scum tends to be bloodthirsty in voting
notquitethere - I think more likely to vote me Day 1 as town. Lack of graphs is concerning, but seems like a happy cloud instead of a nightmare cloud.
Webadict - Who knows? 50% chance is lying about being a stem, for whatever that is worth
Jim Groovester - Seems like an ass, and not the good kind.
ToonyMan - Doing that "Jack is town" then flipping the switch and going "nah, Jack is scum". Dunno if that is just normal Toony interrogation behavior, or maybe he just doesn't like me. Maybe I've been mafia too often, so he's just panicking.
a1s - Hasn't been around much, and hasn't contributed. Both things they did in the previous game as scum.
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 01:14:24 pm
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 01:16:24 pm
Are the Blues SKs Jack?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:16:56 pm
Ok, that's a valid point- I'm pretty shit at "reading" people. In my other game a1s didn't have to read anyone (because a1s wasn't town.)Example above.
Although it generally is more persuasive if you don't make it about yourself.
I of course think it should go from town to scum, and have threatened to lynch people over that. But since I am voting you, you can put your reads list in any order.
Start with:
TricMagic
Webadict
Fluffe9911
Jim Groovester
ToonyMan
MaximumSpin
notquitethere
EuchreJack
And add your thoughts. You don't put your own name in the reads list, since it reflects your thoughts on other players.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:17:51 pm
EuchreJack, might want a better reason than "haven't been around." And you have 3 blues.God, you are SO town.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:18:36 pm
It is now Hammertime by the way. Fluffe9911 the last one to have voted, though they could just vote no one and have no one die. (Sadly, that's rarely a case that happens since we need info)Blues are "I dunno". Null. Gray isn't a default color.
Are the Blues SKs Jack?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:22:03 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:24:10 pm
@Jack:FUCK YOU TOONYMAN
What's your point? Are you arguing that everyone should be using their one-shots on N1 because then we may have three non-block oneshots for N2? It's also important to remember that blocks can't stop other blocks.
@a1s:
Vote Jack and I'll switch, he has better things to do with his time anyway.
PPE:
Oh...well then. I'll Unvote and consider this a vote on Jack and see if he gets less snarky. I don't want to L-1 in case of accident hammer.
P.S. - I WILL be laughing at you in dead chat. Loser
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:25:55 pm
Oh, we don't know who the other members of our group are? I see. I thought we would.
Let's do
*dice roll*
TricMagic, I can feel it my bones that he is scum.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Notice how Jim is allowed to be carefree. Am I? NO
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:26:29 pm
Let's not help scum strategise as to who to kill by revealing our roles. I'm going to assume that Tric is trying to bluff or double bluff as that's the only thing that makes sense here.
Webadict let's beef.
NQT is allowed to be chill. Am I? NO
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:27:14 pm
Oh, we don't know who the other members of our group are? I see. I thought we would.How delightfully ignorant you are Jim.
I should probably read how this game works...
Even Toony is allowed to be carefree.
Am I? NO
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:27:31 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 01:29:50 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:31:13 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 01:34:15 pm
I think NQT is fairly suspicious if you're town, do you think his prodding at you is reasonable or is he being scummy? You have him pretty neutral in your reads.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 01:37:16 pm
Oh hey, Toony isn't voting me. I'm sure he'll fix that soonish.I'm not hammering anyone. I think it's pretty rude when there's day left.
I don't think players should be put at L-1 either especially with newer people here.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:39:23 pm
@Jack:I think he got that idea from you. But you tell me when I get my ISO done.
I think NQT is fairly suspicious if you're town, do you think his prodding at you is reasonable or is he being scummy? You have him pretty neutral in your reads.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 27, 2023, 01:40:56 pm
My suspicions are the scumteam is Jim & Toonyman.I did promise, but I want to see a vote count before changing right now.
You guys see that it is absolutely not Jack now, right?
Post by: notquitethere on February 27, 2023, 01:42:19 pm
I'm not hammering anyone. I think it's pretty rude when there's day left.There's about three hours left.
I think there's a non-zero chance Jack's meltdown is town-centric. I've had that kind of frustration before. A1s barely even bothered to do anything other than pre-emptively give up. I'm going to switch.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 01:44:15 pm
My suspicions are the scumteam is Jim & Toonyman.I'm just pushing your buttons.
Fluffe and a1s are newbs.
Tric is Tric.
Players like myself, Max, Jim, NQT, and Web should honestly see more pressure since only noobs and Jack have been shaken.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:46:17 pm
Yeah, I can see that as one possible explanation.My suspicions are the scumteam is Jim & Toonyman.I'm just pushing your buttons.
Fluffe and a1s are newbs.
Tric is Tric.
Players like myself, Max, Jim, NQT, and Web should honestly see more pressure since only noobs and Jack have been shaken.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 01:46:42 pm
You guys see that it is absolutely not Jack now, right?Yeah I'm not really feeling Jack unless it's with you.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 01:50:45 pm
Maybe NQT and Web?
Web being busy has made this more difficult let me read their posts again and find a computer.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 27, 2023, 01:54:30 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 01:56:30 pm
Spoiler: ISO on Toonyman, I guess (it kinda sucks) (click to show/hide)
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:00:26 pm
Kinda wish a1 did more to defend themselves or atleast gave their view on things when asked about it. What is the current vote count?Let me whip one up fer youz..
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:05:14 pm
(I think since Web hasn't been around much, scum!Toony wouldn't be so much out in front).
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 02:06:11 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:08:22 pm
You win Jack. You're town. No amount of poopy pants Toony can stop your wrath.And I just wanted a chill game. Well, at least your avatar matches. Should I switch mine to Sonic on a typewritter?
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:08:51 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- webadict, MaximumSpin, notquitethere,
-> EuchreJack --3-- Jim Groovester, a1s, TricMagic,
No One --1-- Fluffe9911
notquitethere --0--
TricMagic --0--
Maximum Spin --0--
webadict --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester--0--
ToonyMan --0--
Not Voting --2-- ToonyMan, EuchreJack,
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:12:03 pm
a1s wagon: webadict who ain't around, MaximumSpin that wants to be elsewhere, and NQT...why is NQT there again? (but at least he's not voting me)
EuchreJack wagon: Jim (who's just being mean, why else?), a1s trying to stay alive, TricMagic who must be on a wagon at all times
@Toony: Want to create a wagon?
Post by: Fluffe9911 on February 27, 2023, 02:14:19 pm
Post by: webadict on February 27, 2023, 02:15:42 pm
Would prefer not to vote NQT, if only because that feels like a poor default for every game.
Would be somewhat okay voting Jim.
Would be somewhat okay voting Max.
Would be okay defaulting Tric even though he's Town.
Would be somewhat okay voting a1s.
Would be somewhat okay voting ToonyMan.
Would not be okay voting Fluffe9911.
You can convince me on a1s, Jim, Max, or Toony. JK, you can't convince me on Toony, he's too useful to the game.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:16:54 pm
I guess ill change my vote to a1s if only because I don't think its jack after that mini outburst and I kinda expected a1 to say more once they came back frankly im pretty disappointed. I still don't really wanna vote for anyone due to how high stake this game is but if people feel it's very important for the sake of information I guess ill take the risk. (Although if a1 actually gives a rundown on how they feel about things ill probably go back to being nobody assuming they aint hammered by then)
That is a very mature and well-informed opinion. Keep doing stuff like that!
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 02:20:43 pm
Are they with Web? Probably not.
Jack? Probably not.
Max? Probably not.
NQT? Probably not.
Fluffe? Probably not.
Jim? Maybe.
Tric? Maybe.
Out of those I don't really see Jim or Tric being with a1s. Maybe Jim at best.
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:26:54 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 02:29:13 pm
If a1s is scum, we're probably seeing a bus.Why? Votes were evenly divided between you and a1s until recently, no reason to bus especially in this setup.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 27, 2023, 02:31:04 pm
I guess ill change my vote to a1s if only because I don't think its jack after that mini outburst and I kinda expected a1 to say more once they came back frankly im pretty disappointed. I still don't really wanna vote for anyone due to how high stake this game is but if people feel it's very important for the sake of information I guess ill take the risk. (Although if a1 actually gives a rundown on how they feel about things ill probably go back to being nobody assuming they aint hammered by then)Shady NQT was right to say that, or uh, imply that voting is town's greatest weapon. Your vote is more than just your say in who gets lynched: it's also your only way of communicating with the rest of the players in a form with actual consequences attached and, therefore, not just so many words in the wind.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 02:31:11 pm
It's not Jack, no way he does whatever tf that was.How about you and Max convince me it's Jim again in like...one hour. Otherwise I think I will vote a1s.
Would prefer not to vote NQT, if only because that feels like a poor default for every game.
Would be somewhat okay voting Jim.
Would be somewhat okay voting Max.
Would be okay defaulting Tric even though he's Town.
Would be somewhat okay voting a1s.
Would be somewhat okay voting ToonyMan.
Would not be okay voting Fluffe9911.
You can convince me on a1s, Jim, Max, or Toony. JK, you can't convince me on Toony, he's too useful to the game.
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 02:33:32 pm
If a1s is scum, we're probably seeing a bus.
This doesn't feel right.
How about you and Max convince me it's Jim again in like...one hour. Otherwise I think I will vote a1s.
IT AIN'T MEEEEEEE
IT AIN'T MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I AIN'T NO FORTUNATE OOOOOOONE
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 02:43:47 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on February 27, 2023, 02:46:55 pm
I like Max, but that doesn't mean I trust Max.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 02:54:26 pm
Well, let me give my perspective. If you're town and a1s is a miss I suspect NQT the most and think they would be with Web or Jim. Web seems more likely?
I'm not really feeling Max as scum since they're being antisocial but also coming in with solid advice like backing you up. I feel like they would be more likely to do that as town since I think scum!Max would be smart enough to see I was seriously accusing you and would rather let it play out or instigate it.
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 03:01:56 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 03:05:21 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 27, 2023, 03:08:57 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --4-- webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456723#msg8456723), MaximumSpin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457085#msg8457085), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457118#msg8457118),Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457135#msg8457135)
-> EuchreJack --3-- JimGroovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457010#msg8457010), a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457030#msg8457030), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457094#msg8457094)
Maximum Spin --0--
webadict --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
ToonyMan --0--
notquitethere --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --2-- Toonyman, EuchreJack
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (~1hour 50 mins remaining).
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Do inform me if the count is wrong.
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 03:15:00 pm
When I die and you learn a1s was town, I will have said "I told you so" in advance. ::)
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 03:18:52 pm
I don't really think Jack is scum, so now that there is no tie, I will withdraw my vote.Damn that's oddly and frustratingly convincing.
When I die and you learn a1s was town, I will have said "I told you so" in advance. ::)
Can you at least vote NQT or someone for me to join instead of suiciding yourself.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 03:24:24 pm
a1s - Hasn't been around much, and hasn't contributed. Both things they did in the previous game as scum.Is this true? How much confidence do you have in a1s here?
Post by: webadict on February 27, 2023, 03:45:41 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 03:53:41 pm
Kind of feeling like it's Max since he is very below the radar.
Why isn't it Max?
Post by: webadict on February 27, 2023, 03:55:55 pm
Fluffe doesn't feel like newbscum unless they're amazing, so let's ignore for now.
Let's stop not wanting to default NQT.
Also, Jim stole my idea, so he can stay.
I'll push Max, Toony, NQT.
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 27, 2023, 04:02:26 pm
Why isn't it Max?I'm with ToonyMan on this one!
I don't really think I've been below the radar, though. Maybe a little less talkative than usual, but it's been a boring d1 with a low signal to noise ratio.
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 04:10:16 pm
Alright, Max, is it a1s for you still?
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:12:38 pm
Don't feel like it's EuchreJack or a1s.You say that like it isn't unusual for Max.
Kind of feeling like it's Max since he is very below the radar.
Why isn't it Max?
Also, Jim stole my idea, so he can stay.Noooo....
I'll push Max, Toony, NQT.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:13:41 pm
Let's stop not wanting to default NQT.But NQT is always mafia.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:16:52 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on February 27, 2023, 04:17:58 pm
Maaan I need to focus on my job.I guess I think so, yes. Feels pointless to switch now.
Alright, Max, is it a1s for you still?
Let me do my best webadict impression.
I could be somewhat okay with voting a1s.
I could be somewhat okay with voting Fluffy9/11.
I could be somewhat okay with voting Jim.
I could be somewhat okay with voting NQT, but I always find him shady d1 so I'm a little ehhhh.
I don't think it's Jack or Tric.
I don't really think it's web or Toonyman, because they're not doing the thing, but I guess it could be.
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 04:23:29 pm
Vote Count
------------------------
-> a1s --4-- webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456723#msg8456723), MaximumSpin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457085#msg8457085), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457118#msg8457118),Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457135#msg8457135)
-> EuchreJack --3-- JimGroovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457010#msg8457010), a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457030#msg8457030), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457094#msg8457094)
Maximum Spin --0--
webadict --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
ToonyMan --0--
notquitethere --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --2-- Toonyman, EuchreJack
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (~1hour 50 mins remaining).
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Do inform me if the count is wrong.
Kind of feeling like it's Max since he is very below the radar.
How about Webadict instead of NQT?wait... are you guys just going down the list of people it's possible to accuse in order? :P
That being said, why not Max?
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:25:18 pm
That being said, why not Max?No. Bad vote. Veto'd. Denied.
Post by: Jim Groovester on February 27, 2023, 04:31:06 pm
Don't feel like it's EuchreJack or a1s.You say that like it isn't unusual for Max.
Kind of feeling like it's Max since he is very below the radar.
Why isn't it Max?
I mean, yeah. I feel like in that one game where he carried me on his back to victory he was much more visibly helpful than in this game.
How about Webadict instead of NQT?
webadict has been a name in the back of my mind for people who it could be.
Let's try i-
That being said, why not Max?No. Bad vote. Veto'd. Denied.
I agree.
Uh uh uh uh
webadict I guess.
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:33:36 pm
These wagons suckI'll point out I've pointed at NQT, why he's there is simple, it's an easy vote avoid suspicion, and not a single chart to be had for his course. Arr.
a1s wagon: webadict who ain't around, MaximumSpin that wants to be elsewhere, and NQT...why is NQT there again? (but at least he's not voting me)
EuchreJack wagon: Jim (who's just being mean, why else?), a1s trying to stay alive, TricMagic who must be on a wagon at all times
@Toony: Want to create a wagon?
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:37:09 pm
I guess ill change my vote to a1s if only because I don't think its jack after that mini outburst and I kinda expected a1 to say more once they came back frankly im pretty disappointed. I still don't really wanna vote for anyone due to how high stake this game is but if people feel it's very important for the sake of information I guess ill take the risk. (Although if a1 actually gives a rundown on how they feel about things ill probably go back to being nobody assuming they aint hammered by then)What Jack just did was called an Emotional Appeal. As noted by Toony a few posts down,
I still think a1s could be mafia because of their lackluster play, but then who are they with? I think it's definitely possible they're an easy picking newbtown target.Not much. No connection. Meanwhile NQT switches off Jack at the end? Scans illogical, processing.
Are they with Web? Probably not.
Jack? Probably not.
Max? Probably not.
NQT? Probably not.
Fluffe? Probably not.
Jim? Maybe.
Tric? Maybe.
Out of those I don't really see Jim or Tric being with a1s. Maybe Jim at best.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:37:49 pm
Says the guy not voting NQT?These wagons suckI'll point out I've pointed at NQT, why he's there is simple, it's an easy vote avoid suspicion, and not a single chart to be had for his course. Arr.
a1s wagon: webadict who ain't around, MaximumSpin that wants to be elsewhere, and NQT...why is NQT there again? (but at least he's not voting me)
EuchreJack wagon: Jim (who's just being mean, why else?), a1s trying to stay alive, TricMagic who must be on a wagon at all times
@Toony: Want to create a wagon?
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:40:11 pm
If it's not Jack, it's Max. If it's not Max it's NQT. It definitely not webadict nya~Maaan I need to focus on my job.I guess I think so, yes. Feels pointless to switch now.
Alright, Max, is it a1s for you still?
Let me do my best webadict impression.
I could be somewhat okay with voting a1s.
I could be somewhat okay with voting Fluffy9/11.
I could be somewhat okay with voting Jim.
I could be somewhat okay with voting NQT, but I always find him shady d1 so I'm a little ehhhh.
I don't think it's Jack or Tric.
I don't really think it's web or Toonyman, because they're not doing the thing, but I guess it could be.
I'm doing a ninja bit, sue me. Or be a dragon.Says the guy not voting NQT?These wagons suckI'll point out I've pointed at NQT, why he's there is simple, it's an easy vote avoid suspicion, and not a single chart to be had for his course. Arr.
a1s wagon: webadict who ain't around, MaximumSpin that wants to be elsewhere, and NQT...why is NQT there again? (but at least he's not voting me)
EuchreJack wagon: Jim (who's just being mean, why else?), a1s trying to stay alive, TricMagic who must be on a wagon at all times
@Toony: Want to create a wagon?
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:41:01 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 27, 2023, 04:45:41 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- MaximumSpin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457085#msg8457085), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457118#msg8457118),Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457135#msg8457135)
->Maximum Spin --2-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457183#msg8457183), Webadict
notquitethere --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457192#msg8457192)
->webadict --2-- Jim Groovester, Toonyman
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
ToonyMan --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --1-- EuchreJack
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (~12 mins remaining).
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Do inform me if the count is wrong.
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:48:36 pm
It definitely not webadict nya~How are you so sure?
Town
Tric - makes zero sense, claimed Stem immediately like a crazy person
Jack - "FUCK ALL YOU GUYS", spewed a bunch of posts after seemingly not caring
Max - feels scummy and withdrawn but with random observations like town!Max
Jim - kind of throwing their vote around willy-nilly, town!Web usually thinks they're scummy even when Jim is town, Web thinks Jim is scummy in this game like usual
Fluffe - newbtown? Web backs them quite a bit
a1s - newbtown? Hasn't done much either, less than Fluffe even, seems to embrace their death with "I told you so" syndrome
NQT - pushing for Jack and a1s which both feel wrong, is this town!NQT being misguided or the usual scummy NQT?
Webadict - mafia with Fluffe? mafia with NQT?
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:49:49 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:51:47 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:52:30 pm
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:53:08 pm
Post by: a1s on February 27, 2023, 04:53:34 pm
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:53:57 pm
Post by: webadict on February 27, 2023, 04:54:24 pm
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:54:33 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:54:57 pm
Fine. WebadictIf you're alive for D2 you need to post your thoughts on players and stuff or we're going to have a bad time again.
Post by: webadict on February 27, 2023, 04:55:11 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:55:50 pm
a1s, do not let the fire drill sway you, just vote Max an you're fine.This is oddly evil sounding.
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:56:20 pm
Thanks.a1s, do not let the fire drill sway you, just vote Max an you're fine.This is oddly evil sounding.
Post by: webadict on February 27, 2023, 04:57:01 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on February 27, 2023, 04:57:34 pm
Post by: TricMagic on February 27, 2023, 04:57:54 pm
You did this Toony, not anyone else!
Post by: NJW2000 on February 27, 2023, 04:58:03 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on February 27, 2023, 08:16:34 pm
In fact, you are still debating long after night has drawn over the sickening harvest, wan faces glowing in the weak lamplight. Slowly, in ones and twos, you withdraw to your rooms, the need for rest and sleep overcoming your finely honed sense of self-preservation.
Of course, not everyone plans on sleeping.
Vote Count
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- MaximumSpin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457085#msg8457085), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457118#msg8457118),Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457135#msg8457135)
->Maximum Spin --1-- Webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457208#msg8457208)
->webadict --3-- Jim Groovester, Toonyman, a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457199#msg8457199)
->ToonyMan --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457210#msg8457210)
notquitethere --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --1-- EuchreJack
The day has ended in a drawn vote. No player will be eliminated.
The night will end at 11am GMT, or 5am CST, on the 1st March, in approximately 34 hours. Please send any actions to me by PM before this point, or "none" if you do not wish to act.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 01, 2023, 12:46:13 pm
D A Y T W O
Far, far too early, the harsh white morning light pushes through the shutters. You huddle beneath the thin bedsheets as long as you can, but hunger and cold force you downstairs, and back to the main room of the inn.
Outside, the townsfolk are constructing some kind of gibbet. They seem to be arguing over who has to provide the rope.
Nobody was killed on Night 1.
Vote Count
------------------------
a1s --0--
Maximum Spin --0--
webadict --0--
ToonyMan --0--
notquitethere --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --9--
Day 2 has begun. You may now post.
Five to hammer. Day ends in approximately 72 hours, or at 18:00 GMT 4th March (12:00 CST).
Post by: a1s on March 01, 2023, 12:50:02 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 12:58:26 pm
First, don't claim if you actioned last night. It's very possible mafia didn't kill. If you did action just keep it in the back of your mind.
Second, I miscounted and thought Web was at 3 and everyone else was 2 or less, but maybe that's a blessing. Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.
Third, Web seems like town based on end of day. They missed a free kill on a1s and instead voted me and Max. This logic also applies to Tric. Maybe they miscounted as well. Either way it makes me feel good about him.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 01:09:49 pm
Pretty sure we all know what happens if web is left alive long enough.
Post by: a1s on March 01, 2023, 01:12:07 pm
Third, Web seems like town based on end of day. They missed a free kill on a1s and instead voted me and Max. This logic also applies to Tric. Maybe they miscounted as well. Either way it makes me feel good about him.This goes double for Jack, who could have killed me or web, but did neither. We can't all be mafia together, so at least one of those kills would be beneficial.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 01:20:06 pm
Can probably agree with that, yeah. For me that just leaves 6 people to go through, with web and jack.Third, Web seems like town based on end of day. They missed a free kill on a1s and instead voted me and Max. This logic also applies to Tric. Maybe they miscounted as well. Either way it makes me feel good about him.This goes double for Jack, who could have killed me or web, but did neither. We can't all be mafia together, so at least one of those kills would be beneficial.
I can tenatively rule out Jim/Max based on a page 8. Mostly cause Max says they don't think it's jack, then Jim votes Jack when they come on.
NQT is still suspisous, but.. shrugs. If there is anyone I want to see flip today, it's Max.
Fluffles is probably clear? So
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 01:22:52 pm
So, with no new info, how should we proceed?
a1s: Whom would you like to see eliminated today?
Max: Which three players do you find most suspicious?
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 01:25:11 pm
hi ninja jack.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 01:26:54 pm
Note, Jim could also be Mafia with Toony. Unlikely to be anyone else. Lack of deaths last night is likely cause it was deemed sketchy to do so. Too much info for town from that, and too many powers.Ninja-san Tric:That, said, if any stems blocked someone last night, speak up.Having written this, it's a dumb idea. Given then they'd know who to kill with my role reveal.
hi ninja jack.
Would Toony need to buddy Jim so blatantly and obviously if they were scum buddies?
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 01:28:24 pm
Second, I miscountedI see.
So, coaching one of the noobs to tie the vote in a "seemingly innocuous way" at the last minute was an accident.
This goes double for Jack, who could have killed me or web, but did neither. We can't all be mafia together, so at least one of those kills would be beneficial.Of course it means nothing for anyone who wasn't there for it.
Max: Which three players do you find most suspicious?Toonyman, a1s, and, for the bonus point, Jim "The Groovester" Groovester.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 01:30:16 pm
Do you think both Jim and Toony are scum, versus just one being scum?Second, I miscountedI see.
So, coaching one of the noobs to tie the vote in a "seemingly innocuous way" at the last minute was an accident.This goes double for Jack, who could have killed me or web, but did neither. We can't all be mafia together, so at least one of those kills would be beneficial.Of course it means nothing for anyone who wasn't there for it.Max: Which three players do you find most suspicious?Toonyman, a1s, and, for the bonus point, Jim "The Groovester" Groovester.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 01:33:13 pm
Do you think both Jim and Toony are scum, versus just one being scum?I don't think it's impossible but it is not my focus, no.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 01:36:46 pm
Post by: a1s on March 01, 2023, 01:38:26 pm
a1s: Whom would you like to see eliminated today?Toony and Max seem the most suspicious to me, if for diametrically opposed reasons. I am not good at this.
Also, I have a question: do stems need to block both mafias to prevent a kill? Or either one? Or does the mafia decide who carries out the hit and it is they who need to be blocked?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 01:43:41 pm
Two facts to consider:Do you think both Jim and Toony are scum, versus just one being scum?I don't think it's impossible but it is not my focus, no.
1) Toony is an unrepentant buddier regardless of alignment.
2) Jim as scum bolsters his partner and only buses at the last possible moment. He probably waits too long, from what I recall.
Given enough time, they both tend to look Scummy if they're scum and tend to look Townie if town. I think the community can trust their gut on both players.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 01:46:52 pm
Typically, Mafia chooses one player to perform the kill. If that player is roleblocked, then the kill is prevented.a1s: Whom would you like to see eliminated today?Toony and Max seem the most suspicious to me, if for diametrically opposed reasons. I am not good at this.
Also, I have a question: do stems need to block both mafias to prevent a kill? Or either one? Or does the mafia decide who carries out the hit and it is they who need to be blocked?
I have no reason to believe it would be different in this game, especially since the other mafia player could use their plant power, but you could ask the mod to confirm.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 01, 2023, 03:14:59 pm
My gut still says it could be webadict or Maximum Spin but I'll need to reevaluate now that Day 2 has started and nothing has happened. The reevaluation will happen once I get off work.
Second, I miscountedI see.
So, coaching one of the noobs to tie the vote in a "seemingly innocuous way" at the last minute was an accident.
This feels a lot like a bad faith reading of the intent behind ToonyMan's end of Day 1 actions.
Toonyman, a1s, and, for the bonus point, Jim "The Groovester" Groovester.
Yeah I don't like your reads and think they're bad. Mostly because I don't like your reading of a1s.
Post by: notquitethere on March 01, 2023, 03:31:12 pm
I'm happy to go with Max for now. He had to be prodded to do anything useful D1 and acted in a way that looks like opportunistic scum. I'm going to check in and properly read through hopefully in the morning.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 03:42:16 pm
This feels a lot like a bad faith reading of the intent behind ToonyMan's end of Day 1 actions.I don't understand the intent of ToonyMan's end of Day 1 actions. Can you explain it to me? The only way it makes sense to me is scum desperately trying to move the vote. It's not something I would ever do as town.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 03:48:31 pm
He had to be prodded to do anything useful D1 and acted in a way that looks like opportunistic scum.You always say that!
Post by: notquitethere on March 01, 2023, 03:54:17 pm
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 03:55:58 pm
I had 10 minutes to post from my phone at the end of the day because someone (I wonder who) last minute brigaded me while I was driving to move some more things. I genuinely thought I was dead, so I said fuck it, gave my last suspicions.
No way Toony ties the votes on accident, he aneurysms at Day end every fucking time.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 04:00:18 pm
Haha maybe so. I've got to, uh, re-calibrate my heuristics.Please keep talking tech-y. :D
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 04:05:48 pm
Fuckin' sweet I love Day 1 reduxes.@Jim: How come you have a giant blindspot regarding Toonyman?
My gut still says it could be webadict or Maximum Spin but I'll need to reevaluate now that Day 2 has started and nothing has happened. The reevaluation will happen once I get off work.Second, I miscountedI see.
So, coaching one of the noobs to tie the vote in a "seemingly innocuous way" at the last minute was an accident.
This feels a lot like a bad faith reading of the intent behind ToonyMan's end of Day 1 actions.Toonyman, a1s, and, for the bonus point, Jim "The Groovester" Groovester.
Yeah I don't like your reads and think they're bad. Mostly because I don't like your reading of a1s.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 04:07:38 pm
a1s you need to switch to Webadict or you're dying currently. I'll be switching to you to prevent nonsense.
I'll be switching to a1s if they don't move to Webadict, that is.This is in no way good faith.
Also this right before that. I made a post stating it was now chinese fire drill time. Toony claiming not to notice is a bit of a blatant lie given the vote list was right before this anyway. webadict got that vote placed on him, which only tied the two.It definitely not webadict nya~How are you so sure?
Town
Tric - makes zero sense, claimed Stem immediately like a crazy person
Jack - "FUCK ALL YOU GUYS", spewed a bunch of posts after seemingly not caring
Max - feels scummy and withdrawn but with random observations like town!Max
Jim - kind of throwing their vote around willy-nilly, town!Web usually thinks they're scummy even when Jim is town, Web thinks Jim is scummy in this game like usual
Fluffe - newbtown? Web backs them quite a bit
a1s - newbtown? Hasn't done much either, less than Fluffe even, seems to embrace their death with "I told you so" syndrome
NQT - pushing for Jack and a1s which both feel wrong, is this town!NQT being misguided or the usual scummy NQT?
Webadict - mafia with Fluffe? mafia with NQT?
Can say you've been playing Devil's Advacte tryi to shift votes around.That being said, why not Max?No. Bad vote. Veto'd. Denied.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 04:36:23 pm
I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die. I don't think a1s is likely to be scum with anyone but Jim. You'd have to argue a1s is mafia with me or Jim or I don't think your argument has much merit.
I didn't really want to vote Max after Jim proposed it since I felt good about them so I was deciding between NQT and Webadict. I decided on Webadict because honestly Webadict saying that NQT always gets D1 sus lynched made me feel bad.
I think NQT and Max are the most likely to be scum right now, but NQT's recent vote on Max and their behavior between each other D1 would mean they're distancing. I'm not really sure.
I think Jim is correct that Max's attack on me today looks agenda-driven, which is scum behavior.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 04:42:53 pm
Is Max scum buddies with Toonyman or Webadict?
If we assume that one between Toonyman & Webadict is Mafia, what does that mean about Max's alignment?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 04:53:31 pm
I genuinely thought I was deadMe too.
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 04:55:32 pm
Saying that Max's argument against you is bad is wrong. Max's arguments against a1s are incredibly stupid, but I'm pretty sure you're both scum, so that's fair.
I had 10 minutes to post from my phone, in case a last minute shift happened, and I could do something, which was silly, but I drove too slowly.I genuinely thought I was deadMe too.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 04:55:37 pm
Yes, that's one way to put it.Second, I miscountedI see.
So, coaching one of the noobs to tie the vote in a "seemingly innocuous way" at the last minute was an accident.
Do you think I'm mafia alone or with a1s here?
This is a valid point, Jack wasn't here.This goes double for Jack, who could have killed me or web, but did neither. We can't all be mafia together, so at least one of those kills would be beneficial.Of course it means nothing for anyone who wasn't there for it.
Post by: a1s on March 01, 2023, 04:56:50 pm
I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die.
Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.That's a bit of a contradiction, unless a1s is town, but you'd kill me anyway?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 05:03:55 pm
The problem I have here, Toony, is that you nixed the idea of Max yesterday. I'll be honest and say that I agreed that NQT often gets susvoted, which is also why I thought Max was a good vote Yesterday.I didn't like the Max vote at the time, I gave some thoughts on why. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457155#msg8457155)
Saying that Max's argument against you is bad is wrong.What do you mean?
Max's arguments against a1s are incredibly stupid, but I'm pretty sure you're both scum, so that's fair.I don't mind dying alongside Max if it comes to that. I'll even die first!
Side note, I don't see the point in pursuing a Jim/a1s team since I'm 90% confident they'll lose even if I die today. a1s doesn't have any clout and Jim will get beat down by a town Web and Max in that scenario.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 01, 2023, 05:05:41 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 05:05:55 pm
It's not a contradiction. Even if I think a player is town it's possible I'm wrong. Voting for you to be eliminated would have been better than a tie I think most people would agree.I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die.Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.That's a bit of a contradiction, unless a1s is town, but you'd kill me anyway?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 05:07:38 pm
It's why I said this here. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457197#msg8457197)It's not a contradiction. Even if I think a player is town it's possible I'm wrong. Voting for you to be eliminated would have been better than a tie I think most people would agree.I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die.Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.That's a bit of a contradiction, unless a1s is town, but you'd kill me anyway?
Ok finally checking the thread I'm honestly pretty shocked no one died today not sure if someone got lucky with their one use abilities or mafia are trying to do some 4d chess maneuvers that I frankly can not begin to understand.wow
much insight
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 01, 2023, 05:12:42 pm
wowYes yes my statement is a nothingburger by the way what the hell did you mean by "web backs them quite a bit" like I'm obviously not that observant but I don't see how he backed me up anymore than the average person backed me up your views on things feels quiet inconsistent.
much insight
Post by: a1s on March 01, 2023, 05:16:25 pm
Vote ToonyMan/Maximum Spin 2023!
(inb4 I get murdered for being AFK: I'm going to sleep.)
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 05:19:04 pm
I swear I thought Web was going to die at the end of D1. [...] I think Jim is correct that Max's attack on me today looks agenda-driven, which is scum behavior.Okay, I spent the last like half an hour looking at your post history to find examples but I got bored midway through webadict's Supernatural.
But the point I was trying to make is: I have seen you panic about ties at end of day enough times that it's hard to believe you would just miscount the votes, with a recent votecount right there and only a handful of changes, and not, well, "aneurysm". You did that a little in KJJTN, but it wasn't a great example. Still, I think you have to admit that it's something you do.
But okay, maybe I'm being too harsh. I admit I'm not sure about you and a1s as a team and that's the only real reason you'd have to do that. So who do you think is scum (other than me, I am not going to be convinced of that)?
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 01, 2023, 05:19:57 pm
Or you were protecting Max, it's why you said that there (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457184#msg8457184).No editing posts by the way I already got scolded for that just letting ya know.
Vote ToonyMan/Maximum Spin 2023!
(inb4 I get murdered for being AFK: I'm going to sleep.)
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 05:45:53 pm
I was thinking of this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456989#msg8456989) series (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457136#msg8457136) of posts (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457170#msg8457170) when I was making those reads. The progression also looks natural in general, but I would expect a mafia!Web to pull this off as well.wowYes yes my statement is a nothingburger by the way what the hell did you mean by "web backs them quite a bit" like I'm obviously not that observant but I don't see how he backed me up anymore than the average person backed me up your views on things feels quiet inconsistent.
much insight
And yes, I do think he's been a standout case in your favor, not that I disagree with that.
Or you were protecting Max, it's why you said that there (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457184#msg8457184).I protected Max and also voted Web instead of getting you lynched for free as someone I was willing to vote if I had to?
It's what you'll have to believe. I'm not a perfect player.I swear I thought Web was going to die at the end of D1. [...] I think Jim is correct that Max's attack on me today looks agenda-driven, which is scum behavior.Okay, I spent the last like half an hour looking at your post history to find examples but I got bored midway through webadict's Supernatural.
But the point I was trying to make is: I have seen you panic about ties at end of day enough times that it's hard to believe you would just miscount the votes, with a recent votecount right there and only a handful of changes, and not, well, "aneurysm". You did that a little in KJJTN, but it wasn't a great example. Still, I think you have to admit that it's something you do.
But okay, maybe I'm being too harsh. I admit I'm not sure about you and a1s as a team and that's the only real reason you'd have to do that. So who do you think is scum (other than me, I am not going to be convinced of that)?
I could tell you who I think is town instead.
I think Tric is town. I was thinking at one point maybe he's with Web or something crazy, but then a lot of stuff doesn't add up so I'm going to say nay to that. They're our annoying Stem bro through and through.
I think Jack is town. Their freakout (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457103#msg8457103) on D1 after I pushed them looks legit, they get props if they're acting.
I think Jim is town. They weren't feeling Jack or a1s lynches which I don't think look like good lynches anymore. I think if a1s is mafia it'd literally have to be just with Jim.
I think a1s is town. They are a new player that did the suicide bait thing that I've seen constantly from newb!town. I just don't see a mafia!a1s posting like this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457162#msg8457162). I would like if Jack could share some insight on a1s from that other game I had a question about a1s for Jack in their reads as since I still feel uncomfortable due to the unknown factor.
I think Fluffe is town. I think everything Web has said is basically correct and don't really think Fluffe could be mafia unless Web is as well.
I think Web is town. Their post "So Toony + Max" (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457208#msg8457208) at the very end off D1 looks like the desperate finger point of a man who thinks they're about to die, which they back up on D2 by saying they did think they were going to die. I want to believe Web is being honest with their D2 thoughts here and I can think of at least one game where mafia!Me tried to get town!Web lynched last minute so that probably upsets him.
And that's why I'm most suspicious of Max and NQT currently.
I liked Max sticking up for Jack on D1, and maybe their suspicion of me right now is genuine.
I can't think of anything I've liked about NQT in this game so far, but that is literally always the case. So I would say NQT is still more suspicious than Max currently. I don't really see a connection between them though.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 05:48:19 pm
I can't think of anything I've liked about NQT in this game so far, but that is literally always the case. So I would say NQT is still more suspicious than Max currently. I don't really see a connection between them though.Oh, that's right. I liked NQT pursuing Jack at the time on D1, but I no longer feel that way.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 01, 2023, 05:58:46 pm
I was thinking of this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456989#msg8456989) series (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457136#msg8457136) of posts (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457170#msg8457170) when I was making those reads. The progression also looks natural in general, but I would expect a mafia!Web to pull this off as well.Alrighty, fair enough thank you for explaining! I wish I had more to say in general but I still aint confident enough to outright go that guy is SUS yet the only thing that really stood out to me so far is Webadict claiming Stem not long after Tric did im still frankly not sure why he would do that at all considering how easy it would make it for mafia if they had a stem member.
And yes, I do think he's been a standout case in your favor, not that I disagree with that.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 06:10:14 pm
I swear I thought Web was going to die at the end of D1.That underlined part is emotional. And Max doesn't have many other options in the first place but to distance.
I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die. I don't think a1s is likely to be scum with anyone but Jim. You'd have to argue a1s is mafia with me or Jim or I don't think your argument has much merit.
I didn't really want to vote Max after Jim proposed it since I felt good about them so I was deciding between NQT and Webadict. I decided on Webadict because honestly Webadict saying that NQT always gets D1 sus lynched made me feel bad.
I think NQT and Max are the most likely to be scum right now, but NQT's recent vote on Max and their behavior between each other D1 would mean they're distancing. I'm not really sure.
I think Jim is correct that Max's attack on me today looks agenda-driven, which is scum behavior.
You ay you feel bad about NQT, then say NQT/Max is the scum pairing. Without any evidence against NQT, jut Max sociology. Not even an in-depth look into why it could be.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 06:15:05 pm
ToonyMan, just for that I'm voting you unless you can tell me what you've done here.I was thinking of this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456989#msg8456989) series (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457136#msg8457136) of posts (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457170#msg8457170) when I was making those reads. The progression also looks natural in general, but I would expect a mafia!Web to pull this off as well.wowYes yes my statement is a nothingburger by the way what the hell did you mean by "web backs them quite a bit" like I'm obviously not that observant but I don't see how he backed me up anymore than the average person backed me up your views on things feels quiet inconsistent.
much insight
And yes, I do think he's been a standout case in your favor, not that I disagree with that.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 06:15:54 pm
Pretty sure I said something like that before. If you're town, that's good info, if you're mafia, that's good info. (Never a good thing when town's voted out, remember that line Toony?)I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die.Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.That's a bit of a contradiction, unless a1s is town, but you'd kill me anyway?
I'd disagree, but I'm me. Why you speaking for others?It's not a contradiction. Even if I think a player is town it's possible I'm wrong. Voting for you to be eliminated would have been better than a tie I think most people would agree.I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die.Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.That's a bit of a contradiction, unless a1s is town, but you'd kill me anyway?
ToonyMan, just for that I'm voting you unless you can tell me what you've done here.I was thinking of this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456989#msg8456989) series (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457136#msg8457136) of posts (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457170#msg8457170) when I was making those reads. The progression also looks natural in general, but I would expect a mafia!Web to pull this off as well.wowYes yes my statement is a nothingburger by the way what the hell did you mean by "web backs them quite a bit" like I'm obviously not that observant but I don't see how he backed me up anymore than the average person backed me up your views on things feels quiet inconsistent.
much insight
And yes, I do think he's been a standout case in your favor, not that I disagree with that.
And this is why I just like to chain post, I accidently hit post on the entirely wrong section when making something.
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 06:20:30 pm
I don't want a quickex without analyzing.
Post by: notquitethere on March 01, 2023, 06:37:51 pm
Humorously incompetent NQT
the usual scummy NQT?
Shady NQT was right to say that
But NQT is always mafia.
I can't think of anything I've liked about NQTI'm beginning to feel unappreciated in this subforum! I think I used to have an okay rep as a player... somehow I managed to squander it through bad play and rolling mafia repeatedly.
More pressingly, why do you say that when you also said this, Toony?
Hmm I like NQT's attitude towards Jack.
It's like he dropped his earlier read when it was no longer convenient. I'm the obvious patsy from a scum!Toony perspective. D1 a newb could be mislynched, but D2+ he needs me to be available as the next mislynch. So he's setting his ducks in a row.
NQT could be anything, let's say town for now. Plant part could be anything, can't tell.
Moreover, going back to this post, why would a town!Toony be speculating about the plants? It's like he forgot to save that analysis for the scumchat. He's blurring his roles here.
Start of D2, what does he do? This is what he was thinking about foremost during the night:
First, don't claim if you actioned last night. It's very possible mafia didn't kill. If you did action just keep it in the back of your mind.If scum did try and kill and were blocked he DOES NOT want town to claim that. Even if they were lying low, he doesn't want a mass claim at this stage in case it confirms town. On D1 he already tried to dissuade town from mass-acting, as he says it's not likely to mutually confirm people:
I decided to give NQT"s question some thought and the conclusion I came to is everyone using their ability on N1 sounds like it will probably work out poorly, especially if mafia nokill because we then don't learn anything.
But he didn't share his workings out, so who knows, maybe a scum!Toony came to the conclusion that it would help town if they all shot their shot on N1.
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 06:38:49 pm
Post by: Mamobo on March 01, 2023, 06:40:44 pm
------------------------
-> ToonyMan --4-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457687#msg8457687), a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457734#msg8457734), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457742#msg8457742),
a1s --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
Maximum Spin --0--
notquitethere --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --5-- Fluffe9911, Jim Groovester, Maximum Spin, ToonyMan, webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457736#msg8457736),
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (-49 hours and -42 minutes remaining.)
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 06:42:16 pm
Post by: notquitethere on March 01, 2023, 06:42:34 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 06:45:15 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 06:45:42 pm
Hey, I was clear that I always find you shady and it probably didn't mean anything. Which, after all, is mutual.Humorously incompetent NQTthe usual scummy NQT?Shady NQT was right to say thatBut NQT is always mafia.I can't think of anything I've liked about NQTI'm beginning to feel unappreciated in this subforum! I think I used to have an okay rep as a player... somehow I managed to squander it through bad play and rolling mafia repeatedly.
So I back off for a second and suddenly everyone hates Toony except... web and Jim? (And Fluffy.) Okay, I guess. I mean, I buy that it's him. If web hadn't pointed it out I actually came this close to accidentally hammering because I didn't notice Jack's vote. So consider me spiritually on board, I guess.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 06:49:42 pm
UnvoteNo, I don't like this. ToonyMan
Keep the pressure high, don't back off.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 06:51:16 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 06:52:04 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 06:55:41 pm
Toony's never answered, so I'm perfectly fine with it going for another day of discussion. As is, you're cutting webadict off with that vote.Well, I'm not saying to hammer.
But it's like this.
This is no time to bus, especially with NJW's rule change (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456925#msg8456925).
So there are three possibilities:
ToonyMan is town;
ToonyMan is mafia and the other mafia is not on the wagon;
or ToonyMan is mafia and the other mafia is on the wagon, and is going to have to play chicken and jump off before someone hammers or day ends.
Keeping up the pressure is the only way to find out which.
Post by: TricMagic on March 01, 2023, 07:00:02 pm
Rules lawyering that only matters if that specific mafia segement is dead. Remember there is no rule against self-hammering?Toony's never answered, so I'm perfectly fine with it going for another day of discussion. As is, you're cutting webadict off with that vote.Well, I'm not saying to hammer.
But it's like this.
This is no time to bus, especially with NJW's rule change (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456925#msg8456925).
So there are three possibilities:
ToonyMan is town;
ToonyMan is mafia and the other mafia is not on the wagon;
or ToonyMan is mafia and the other mafia is on the wagon, and is going to have to play chicken and jump off before someone hammers or day ends.
Keeping up the pressure is the only way to find out which.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 07:04:28 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 07:06:54 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 01, 2023, 07:07:38 pm
Rules lawyering that only matters if that specific mafia segement is dead. Remember there is no rule against self-hammering?That has nothing to do with anything? Self-hammering would be extremely destructive to the mafia since they need both mafia players alive OR they can only win by killing the three players in the "pure" tranche. That happens if just one mafia player gets lynched by any means.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 07:16:01 pm
It's a mindplay by Web. I think that's fine.I was thinking of this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456989#msg8456989) series (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457136#msg8457136) of posts (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457170#msg8457170) when I was making those reads. The progression also looks natural in general, but I would expect a mafia!Web to pull this off as well.Alrighty, fair enough thank you for explaining! I wish I had more to say in general but I still aint confident enough to outright go that guy is SUS yet the only thing that really stood out to me so far is Webadict claiming Stem not long after Tric did im still frankly not sure why he would do that at all considering how easy it would make it for mafia if they had a stem member.
And yes, I do think he's been a standout case in your favor, not that I disagree with that.
All of my feelings are emotional Tric. The other half is when I use logic/reasoning.I swear I thought Web was going to die at the end of D1.That underlined part is emotional. And Max doesn't have many other options in the first place but to distance.
I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die. I don't think a1s is likely to be scum with anyone but Jim. You'd have to argue a1s is mafia with me or Jim or I don't think your argument has much merit.
I didn't really want to vote Max after Jim proposed it since I felt good about them so I was deciding between NQT and Webadict. I decided on Webadict because honestly Webadict saying that NQT always gets D1 sus lynched made me feel bad.
I think NQT and Max are the most likely to be scum right now, but NQT's recent vote on Max and their behavior between each other D1 would mean they're distancing. I'm not really sure.
I think Jim is correct that Max's attack on me today looks agenda-driven, which is scum behavior.
You ay you feel bad about NQT, then say NQT/Max is the scum pairing. Without any evidence against NQT, jut Max sociology. Not even an in-depth look into why it could be.
I don't know what you want from me, Web would back up Fluffe as town or mafia in my opinion.ToonyMan, just for that I'm voting you unless you can tell me what you've done here.I was thinking of this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456989#msg8456989) series (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457136#msg8457136) of posts (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457170#msg8457170) when I was making those reads. The progression also looks natural in general, but I would expect a mafia!Web to pull this off as well.wowYes yes my statement is a nothingburger by the way what the hell did you mean by "web backs them quite a bit" like I'm obviously not that observant but I don't see how he backed me up anymore than the average person backed me up your views on things feels quiet inconsistent.
much insight
And yes, I do think he's been a standout case in your favor, not that I disagree with that.
postI don't like any of this. I think this is most disingenuous argument against me out of everyone, like you're an actor speaking on a stage.
This is an all town wagon. Scum are in [Fluffe9911, Jim Groovester, Maximum Spin, ToonyMan] we got this game in the bag.This doesn't sound like a town player to me. I think you're trying to stir a lynch mob since you know I'm a danger to you.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 07:22:34 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 07:24:35 pm
Post by: notquitethere on March 01, 2023, 07:27:19 pm
Toony what's disingenuous about my argument? And what justification would I have for piling on? If I were mafia, I could just go to bed and let town do the work.
My positions on Jack and A1s yesterday were crystal clear. Jack was dodgy but I thought his meltdown was genuine, I never liked a1s's disengagement, but when I woke up D2 and saw end of day, I thought their sacrificial play was townsided. I've been more forthcoming D1 about actual reasons to vote than most players. You're not convincing me you're town here, Toon!
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 07:39:51 pm
I was just trying the Toony trick of confidently calling the scum team. Toony has managed to catch the exact team this way in two recent games. I'm saying it's Toony/Fluff....the trick only works if you don't explain it.
Toony what's disingenuous about my argument? And what justification would I have for piling on? If I were mafia, I could just go to bed and let town do the work.
My positions on Jack and A1s yesterday were crystal clear. Jack was dodgy but I thought his meltdown was genuine, I never liked a1s's disengagement, but when I woke up D2 and saw end of day, I thought their sacrificial play was townsided. I've been more forthcoming D1 about actual reasons to vote than most players. You're not convincing me you're town here, Toon!
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 01, 2023, 07:44:01 pm
I was just trying the Toony trick of confidently calling the scum team. Toony has managed to catch the exact team this way in two recent games. I'm saying it's Toony/Fluff.Ay don't rope me into this! I'm a perfectly law-abiding part of this here... plant I guess!
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 01, 2023, 08:04:39 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 08:32:18 pm
Hey everybody calm down a little and ease off on the votes. I don't want the end of Day 2 to happen so soon.Thanks Jim.
I'm writing posts I guess I'll just release them in chunks at a time.
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 08:32:33 pm
This post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456534#msg8456534).
I don't like this post. It jokingly fishes, which is entirely scummy. It's been bugging me for a while because it doesn't really have any real outcomes that could benefit Town except to obscure roles. It's also nothing words. Dislike.
What was the purpose of this post?
I do like this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456857#msg8456857).
It feels like Toony is probing, but it's not as in depth as others. But, it feels very limited in scope. Can I judge Toony for that when other players don't do as much? Unsure.
Do you still find EuchreJack to be suspicious? Why/why not?
This fucking post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456998#msg8456998)
Feels really apt. This kinda feels partnery. There's not much of a question, but it made me mad.
The next post down makes me feel like you're trying really hard to identify everyone's role. Am I right in that assumption?
This post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457139#msg8457139) with regards to a1s. I'm not sure why a1s tickles me, but it might be that I don't like the green Town thing they're doing each post, but also, I... Hold on, let me re-organize my thoughts:
So, say that the team is a1s/Toony. Toony convinces Jim to unvote Max and vote me. Toony convinces a1s to vote me. Does Town Toony pull a Houdini for his scummate? He absolutely can and has successfully done it before. He's also last minute brigaded me as scum. These are not outside Toony's scumplay. In order for me to accept that Toony is Town, I have to accept that I was the most suspicious there. No, that's not entirely true. NQT might have been the most suspicious, but leveraging that NQT is always the most suspicious, he chose to take a different route and vote me out.
Okay, thoughts organized, continuing.
This is me noting that you're definitely aware of the votes (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457143#msg8457143).
"Let's not vote Max, let's vote Web!" (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457178#msg8457178) The best part about this post iis it happens right as I start driving, so this is where I'm no longer around. That's really fucking lucky for ToonyMan, but not anything I made obvious, so I can't blame him for that.
a1s you need to switch to Webadict or you're dying currently. I'll be switching to you to prevent nonsense.Alright, back to quotes, URLs suck. I think this post is more evidence that ToonyMan's watching the vote.
Locking thread, do not post.I think this is actually the more likely reason Toony didn't shift his vote to a1s last second. There's still over a minute left in the Day (or there should've been.) Toony has posted at the end of the Day with seconds to go before, so I know he can. That's actually also evidence that Max may be his partner as well, since Max has also done this.
The downside to this, is that I can't prove I wasn't trying to do the same, but my vote shifting should prove that I was under the impression that I was dead and wanted to leave behind who I thought was scum.
Were you trying to post at the end of Day once more, Toony? Would you have shifted your vote to a1s had you known that a1s was tied with me?
Pfp at workI feel like this post covers up Mafia potentially being roleblocked or protected against as a way to not narrow down the Mafia. I also don't like that this might be used to assuage my hostility coming out of the Day, assuming that he did miscount. Although, it does answer my last question.
First, don't claim if you actioned last night. It's very possible mafia didn't kill. If you did action just keep it in the back of your mind.
Second, I miscounted and thought Web was at 3 and everyone else was 2 or less, but maybe that's a blessing. Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.
Third, Web seems like town based on end of day. They missed a free kill on a1s and instead voted me and Max. This logic also applies to Tric. Maybe they miscounted as well. Either way it makes me feel good about him.
Anyway, that's some of my thoughts written down. Here's some side notes on this I saw while typing this. Apologies for how fucking disorganized my brain is here, but I was doing something else and this is the result of my multitask.
Extra thoughts to consider:
Would Town!Jim do this? (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457185#msg8457185) Maybe. Would Toony + Jim do this? Less likely. Jim is hiding under the radar and looks Town to most people, and Toony's would be taking advantage of a lucky break to vote me out. It'd make sense why the final vote never materialized, but it's not exactly subtle.
I think that EuchreJack and TricMagic are legitimate on ToonyMan. I do not think they are likely to be scum. TricMagic had every reason to vote me Yesterday, so I can't reasonably conclude TricMagic is scum unless TricMagic is legitimately amazing, terrible, or also thought I was already dead and so didn't join the wagon. I refuse to believe that, so I'm going with Tric = Town. EuchreJack
/Toony doesn't appear to be a viable team here, so if one's scum, the other is definitely Town.
Or you were protecting Max, it's why you said that there (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457184#msg8457184).This vote makes me want to vote a1s over ToonyMan.
Vote ToonyMan/Maximum Spin 2023!
(inb4 I get murdered for being AFK: I'm going to sleep.)
The reason he pointed this out is because what you said was legitimately scummy for reasons you won't understand, but he may also be trying to build a Fluffe/Web team, which you'll notice if you look at the end of Day 1.wowYes yes my statement is a nothingburger by the way what the hell did you mean by "web backs them quite a bit" like I'm obviously not that observant but I don't see how he backed me up anymore than the average person backed me up your views on things feels quiet inconsistent.
much insight
I was just trying the Toony trick of confidently calling the scum team. Toony has managed to catch the exact team this way in two recent games. I'm saying it's Toony/Fluff.I don't think that's supported by this exchange:
Fluffe/Toony (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456906#msg8456906) doesn't feel like a viable pairing. Toony/a1s is viable. Toony/Jim is viable. Toony/Max is viable. Toony/??Tric?? is really pushing it, but maybe somehow possible if I eat some space honey. I don't think Toony/Euchre is possible. And I'm not sure you're possible to be paired with Toony unless he's hard committed to the bus.
Now I feel dumb for calling Max's a1s/Toony pair stupid.
Also, the wagon on Toony built really fucking fast. So, ToonyMan, who's Town on this wagon?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 09:00:09 pm
I was just trying the Toony trick of confidently calling the scum team. Toony has managed to catch the exact team this way in two recent games. I'm saying it's Toony/Fluff.I actually have a wild theory it's NQT/Jack if Max is town. But I can only believe that if I believe Jack's outburst was staged and that a town!Max would be incorrect, which I haven't put any serious thought into and would need to look over. At the time I just saw angry uppercase letters and let Jack have the W.
Toony what's disingenuous about my argument?
1. I thought your points of Jack being suspicious were sound arguments but grew misgivings later when Jack was more convincing.Hmm I like NQT's attitude towards Jack.It's like he dropped his earlier read when it was no longer convenient. I'm the obvious patsy from a scum!Toony perspective. D1 a newb could be mislynched, but D2+ he needs me to be available as the next mislynch. So he's setting his ducks in a row.
2. I failed to lynch any newbs on D1.
3. You're settings your own ducks in a row for D2.
In that post I wanted to label players as plant parts while justifying reasons, I think I did this for Jim or Max. I'm completely guessing and giving other players labels as a way to have fun (or if you want to be serious business, mind games). Webadict did something similar by claiming Stem alongside Tric.NQT could be anything, let's say town for now. Plant part could be anything, can't tell.Moreover, going back to this post, why would a town!Toony be speculating about the plants? It's like he forgot to save that analysis for the scumchat. He's blurring his roles here.
Start of D2, what does he do? This is what he was thinking about foremost during the night:No, I stand by my belief it's correct not to claim right now. I'm really confident mafia did not try to kill last night, like at least 85% sure. One of the reasons is that if I were mafia!Toony I wouldn't want to kill on N1 in this game either.First, don't claim if you actioned last night. It's very possible mafia didn't kill. If you did action just keep it in the back of your mind.If scum did try and kill and were blocked he DOES NOT want town to claim that. Even if they were lying low, he doesn't want a mass claim at this stage in case it confirms town. On D1 he already tried to dissuade town from mass-acting, as he says it's not likely to mutually confirm people:I decided to give NQT"s question some thought and the conclusion I came to is everyone using their ability on N1 sounds like it will probably work out poorly, especially if mafia nokill because we then don't learn anything.But he didn't share his workings out, so who knows, maybe a scum!Toony came to the conclusion that it would help town if they all shot their shot on N1.
I don't like you attacking me for wanting players to keep quiet when you attacked Jack on D1 for wanting players to speak up about what they planned on doing. Here. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457089#msg8457089) You also say yourself (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456855#msg8456855) that mafia not killing on N1 would have solid mechanical reasoning behind it. In other words, you're saying whatever comes to mind to try to get me lynched.
And what justification would I have for piling on? If I were mafia, I could just go to bed and let town do the work.I can't argue this. Not doing anything would definitely be more scummy.
My positions on Jack and A1s yesterday were crystal clear. Jack was dodgy but I thought his meltdown was genuine, I never liked a1s's disengagement, but when I woke up D2 and saw end of day, I thought their sacrificial play was townsided. I've been more forthcoming D1 about actual reasons to vote than most players. You're not convincing me you're town here, Toon!Okay we've confirmed your feelings have turned around on Jack and a1s. Why is Fluffe suspicious?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 09:06:01 pm
This post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456534#msg8456534).I sort of answered this for NQT. I'm not allowed to have fun at game start I guess...I mean, actually I'm confusing the mafia man. It's like claiming Stem or saying Root for no reason. I was picking up what players were putting down because what's a bluff without a few more bluffs on top.
I don't like this post. It jokingly fishes, which is entirely scummy. It's been bugging me for a while because it doesn't really have any real outcomes that could benefit Town except to obscure roles. It's also nothing words. Dislike.
What was the purpose of this post?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 09:08:33 pm
Do you still find EuchreJack to be suspicious? Why/why not?Currently, not really. I want them to explain to me how confident they are that a1s is mafia or not based on the game they were in together where a1s was mafia. Jack had them at the bottom of their reads D1 as a solid mafia pick. I wasn't able to get an answer before the day ended.
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 09:11:20 pm
Do you think this is a FUCKING GAME?!?This post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456534#msg8456534).I sort of answered this for NQT. I'm not allowed to have fun at game start I guess...I mean, actually I'm confusing the mafia man. It's like claiming Stem or saying Root for no reason. I was picking up what players were putting down because what's a bluff without a few more bluffs on top.
I don't like this post. It jokingly fishes, which is entirely scummy. It's been bugging me for a while because it doesn't really have any real outcomes that could benefit Town except to obscure roles. It's also nothing words. Dislike.
What was the purpose of this post?
PEOPLE DIE IN MAFIA, TOONY! I was almost killed Yesterday, and you're talking about having FUN!?!?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 09:21:06 pm
This fucking post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456998#msg8456998)First part is a total coincidence but I would be lying if I said I didn't think it would happen.
Feels really apt. This kinda feels partnery. There's not much of a question, but it made me mad.
The next post down makes me feel like you're trying really hard to identify everyone's role. Am I right in that assumption?
This setup is different than anything I've played before. I think I'm just wording out my thoughts on optimal play there. I think (most likely) wasting our one-shots early is a way to lose the late-game. That's still how I feel. For example if we kill one of the mafia there will only be one left and that makes all of our one-shots more useful if we still have them. If we block a player and a kill still happens, then we know for sure that player is town, instead of not being sure because there's still two mafia. Same logic applies to like if a Flower tracks a player and they visit someone else who didn't die, the player is also town-confirmed. This is just an ideal example off the top of my head but there's probably situations with two mafia left where later is better still.
PPE:
Do you think this is a FUCKING GAME?!?I was going to like...play video games after work today, but I would apparently rather spend hours getting beat up by strangers.
PEOPLE DIE IN MAFIA, TOONY! I was almost killed Yesterday, and you're talking about having FUN!?!?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 09:35:50 pm
Were you trying to post at the end of Day once more, Toony?No, I swear. I left the forums after I saw NJW locked the thread and goofed off for awhile, when I came back NJW still hadn't posted the results. Then some more time after that the proper D1 end happened and that's when I realized it was a tie. I was relieved when I saw that because I regretted the Web lynch afterwards. You'll know 100% for sure I'm an idiot when I die or this game ends, but I swear I didn't realize it was a tie until hours or whatever later when NJW posted EoD results.
Now that I think about it, if I just sheeped Tric and Web and voted Max at day end then Max almost certainly would have died since Jim was onboard that and a1s would probably have joined too. I think I can argue that my actions sheltered a1s and Max, not just a1s. This also means I gave up the easy path of letting Max get lynched, you would have to believe I'm not pulling a dumb stunt though. In a world where I was partners with Max I could have just taken it easy and gotten a1s lynched instead of pushing for Web. These arguments can't be debated since it's WIFOM but I figure since I'm having the thoughts I would type them.
Would you have shifted your vote to a1s had you known that a1s was tied with me?I probably would have, yes. I can't say 100% since we can't ask that version of me, but if I look at other games where some asshole made a tie at day end I'm constantly breaking ties whether I want to or not.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 09:43:55 pm
Now I feel dumb for calling Max's a1s/Toony pair stupid.It would be even dumber if it's a1s/Max since that means I sheltered both at end of Day 1.
Also, the wagon on Toony built really fucking fast. So, ToonyMan, who's Town on this wagon?Out of Jack, a1s, Tric, NQT?
Tric for sure. Jack and a1s probably. NQT not probably.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 09:51:31 pm
Post by: webadict on March 01, 2023, 09:57:01 pm
PPE:Why did you type the same thing twice in a row?Do you think this is a FUCKING GAME?!?I was going to like...play video games after work today, but I would apparently rather spend hours getting beat up by strangers.
PEOPLE DIE IN MAFIA, TOONY! I was almost killed Yesterday, and you're talking about having FUN!?!?
Right, that's actually what I was more wary of there. I'm on a weird fence with a1s because on the one hand, I don't really see them as scum and then they do really scummy things in a weirdly Town way, but I also honestly don't believe you'd stick your neck out that far for a1s to vote me out because that looks hella bad for you. But, I would believe you'd stick your neck out for Max, because Max is a really solid player, which is why my assumption is that you were trying to protect Max and potentially frame a1s.Were you trying to post at the end of Day once more, Toony?No, I swear. I left the forums after I saw NJW locked the thread and goofed off for awhile, when I came back NJW still hadn't posted the results. Then some more time after that the proper D1 end happened and that's when I realized it was a tie. I was relieved when I saw that because I regretted the Web lynch afterwards. You'll know 100% for sure I'm an idiot when I die or this game ends, but I swear I didn't realize it was a tie until hours or whatever later when NJW posted EoD results.
Now that I think about it, if I just sheeped Tric and Web and voted Max at day end then Max almost certainly would have died since Jim was onboard that and a1s would probably have joined too. I think I can argue that my actions sheltered a1s and Max, not just a1s. This also means I gave up the easy path of letting Max get lynched, you would have to believe I'm not pulling a dumb stunt though. In a world where I was partners with Max I could have just taken it easy and gotten a1s lynched instead of pushing for Web. These arguments can't be debated since it's WIFOM but I figure since I'm having the thoughts I would type them.
The other reason I'm wary is that scum can win with good kill luck, and shielding your teammate is far more broken in this game than I think anyone actually realizes, but I know you adapt really well to games, so I don't put that past you.
The other issue I have is that I can't talk any further about roles, and I'm pretty sure you know exactly why, so I'll leave it there.
If it's somehow a1s and Max, I'm going to be very upset with you.Now I feel dumb for calling Max's a1s/Toony pair stupid.It would be even dumber if it's a1s/Max since that means I sheltered both at end of Day 1.Also, the wagon on Toony built really fucking fast. So, ToonyMan, who's Town on this wagon?Out of Jack, a1s, Tric, NQT?
Tric for sure. Jack and a1s probably. NQT not probably.
As for those Town picks, I don't think anyone could reasonably suspect Tric, so he's a freebie. I can agree with Jack, and I can understand NQT.
Anyway, I'm willing to wait on this, unless anyone else has any information, but I'm not gonna hound anyone for anything. I'd like to have some solid leads before hammering, at the very least.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 01, 2023, 10:01:20 pm
I was paying attention pretty closely at the end of the day and that sequence of events didn't really bother me since it was consistent with ToonyMan's stated intentions to that point.
I'm inclined to believe ToonyMan when he says he didn't think the vote was tied because why does he apologize to webadict like a doofus if he does that knowingly.
Locking thread, do not post.I think this is actually the more likely reason Toony didn't shift his vote to a1s last second. There's still over a minute left in the Day (or there should've been.) Toony has posted at the end of the Day with seconds to go before, so I know he can. That's actually also evidence that Max may be his partner as well, since Max has also done this.
The downside to this, is that I can't prove I wasn't trying to do the same, but my vote shifting should prove that I was under the impression that I was dead and wanted to leave behind who I thought was scum.
Forum time and actual time are out of sync by two minutes. The day ended right on the hour, but forum time lagged behind by two minutes. I was paying attention and it caught me off guard. Unlike everybody else I counted a tie at the end of the day and was confused by people acting like you were going to die and thought maybe I had made the mistake, but the day suddenly ending stopped me from doing anything to sort it out.
I believe ToonyMan when he says we would have switched his vote if he knew there was a tie since I was there and had all of the same concerns he has been expressing after the fact.
I'm going to go deadlift and wish I hadn't drunk all my beer last night and I'll probably return to this game later in the evening.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 10:07:47 pm
Right, that's actually what I was more wary of there. I'm on a weird fence with a1s because on the one hand, I don't really see them as scum and then they do really scummy things in a weirdly Town way, but I also honestly don't believe you'd stick your neck out that far for a1s to vote me out because that looks hella bad for you. But, I would believe you'd stick your neck out for Max, because Max is a really solid player, which is why my assumption is that you were trying to protect Max and potentially frame a1s.The main thing for me is I can't see a1s with anybody but Jim, but I don't think Jim is scum at all. So while I do agree a1s is on a weird fence I still town read them. I'm willing to vote them today if that happens. I think I'm willing to vote NQT, Max, a1s in that order.
The other issue I have is that I can't talk any further about roles, and I'm pretty sure you know exactly why, so I'll leave it there.Heh I can guess. Well on the plus side I really don't think mafia!Webadict wastes time thinking about the game so productively and maybe even lolhammers me so that makes me feel better.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 10:12:34 pm
@web: Does town!Jim completely and utterly ignore any question I ask him?
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 01, 2023, 10:22:15 pm
I'll get to your question eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 10:49:21 pm
If it isn't obvious by me not posting a wall of text, I'm not caught up with Day 2 so far.Well, ignoring me annoys me, so we're even.
I'll get to your questions eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 01, 2023, 11:47:55 pm
...Yeah who would do that?If it isn't obvious by me not posting a wall of text, I'm not caught up with Day 2 so far.Well, ignoring me annoys me, so we're even.
I'll get to your questions eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 01, 2023, 11:56:43 pm
If you got a specific question you want answered, could you please repeat it? You've written two full pages so far......Yeah who would do that?If it isn't obvious by me not posting a wall of text, I'm not caught up with Day 2 so far.Well, ignoring me annoys me, so we're even.
I'll get to your questions eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
Post by: notquitethere on March 02, 2023, 06:02:06 am
Fluffe9911, ok, we got what you wanted out of D1, a no kill. Now what? Who is scum?
Because this here is beetlejuicing, only appearing when someone mentions you, while having no drive to actually develop suspicions or catch scum:
Ay don't rope me into this! I'm a perfectly law-abiding part of this here... plant I guess!
Post by: TricMagic on March 02, 2023, 09:09:10 am
You conspiculously do not mention Max voting you. Why?Now I feel dumb for calling Max's a1s/Toony pair stupid.It would be even dumber if it's a1s/Max since that means I sheltered both at end of Day 1.Also, the wagon on Toony built really fucking fast. So, ToonyMan, who's Town on this wagon?Out of Jack, a1s, Tric, NQT?
Tric for sure. Jack and a1s probably. NQT not probably.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 09:57:49 am
You said a1s seemed like mafia because they were acting like the previous game you were in together. How confident is this? Can you show comparisons?If you got a specific question you want answered, could you please repeat it? You've written two full pages so far......Yeah who would do that?If it isn't obvious by me not posting a wall of text, I'm not caught up with Day 2 so far.Well, ignoring me annoys me, so we're even.
I'll get to your questions eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
I was using the latest vote count. Do you think Max is bussing me?You conspiculously do not mention Max voting you. Why?Now I feel dumb for calling Max's a1s/Toony pair stupid.It would be even dumber if it's a1s/Max since that means I sheltered both at end of Day 1.Also, the wagon on Toony built really fucking fast. So, ToonyMan, who's Town on this wagon?Out of Jack, a1s, Tric, NQT?
Tric for sure. Jack and a1s probably. NQT not probably.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 10:01:47 am
Web thinks I'm tied with Max or a1s (or Jim) if I'm mafia. From an objective standpoint my actions could make sense if that was true for Max or a1s. Why do you think Fluffe is mafia specifically with me?
Post by: notquitethere on March 02, 2023, 10:35:34 am
Post by: webadict on March 02, 2023, 10:48:15 am
@NQT:I don't really see a Fluffe Toony team, but I'm really wanting Jim to talk.
Web thinks I'm tied with Max or a1s (or Jim) if I'm mafia. From an objective standpoint my actions could make sense if that was true for Max or a1s. Why do you think Fluffe is mafia specifically with me?
Post by: webadict on March 02, 2023, 10:54:17 am
I haven't got any reason why Fluff is with you specifically, I just independently think Fluffe is scummy. Why don't you?The reason I don't is because I think Toony is scum, but what's your case?
Post by: a1s on March 02, 2023, 10:59:10 am
I assure you, the behaviour is different.You said a1s seemed like mafia because they were acting like the previous game you were in together. How confident is this? Can you show comparisons?If you got a specific question you want answered, could you please repeat it? You've written two full pages so far......Yeah who would do that?If it isn't obvious by me not posting a wall of text, I'm not caught up with Day 2 so far.Well, ignoring me annoys me, so we're even.
I'll get to your questions eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
for example:
I'm not sure why a1s tickles me, but it might be that I don't like the green Town thing they're doing each postWith all due respect, bite me.
Post by: a1s on March 02, 2023, 11:02:19 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 02, 2023, 11:08:14 am
Time enough to try a different tact.First off there's a difference between me not being confident enough to vote for anyone and me wanting no one to be lynched at all if you paid attention you would know I did end up voting for a1 at the end there granted it ended in a tie due to last minute shenanigans but still. As for who the scum is I still have no damn clue I'm still pretty surprised over the whole no one died last night thing also if you can't tell by now I do not like pointing fingers based on gut feelings there are a couple of things that people have done that I don't exactly like such as webadict claiming stem after Trick or Toony pulling that last minute vote shenaniganery but my level of confidence aint enough to go it's totally them guys get 'em!
Fluffe9911, ok, we got what you wanted out of D1, a no kill. Now what? Who is scum?
Post by: TricMagic on March 02, 2023, 11:28:34 am
The unconscious connection between a1s and town is scientifically proven to work, even if you're aware I'm doing it. Well, you can obviously still vote for me, but you will do so against your gut.This is a very Dragon thing to say, good work fellow Dragon.
So, A1s is town, I can recognize that scent anywhere. That of a solo player.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 02, 2023, 11:30:18 am
Webadict: Claims Stem (Why would he do that?)
EuchreJack: Had a mini mental breakdown so probably town not gonna trust em again though if he turns out to be scum.
Jim Groovester: Toony Claims he is Stem (Somehow?)
ToonyMan: Talks Alot
a1s: Likes the color green.
TricMagic: Claims Stem
MaximumSpin: Claims Town (Duh)
Fluffe9911: [REDACTED] (It's me)
notquitethere: Wants me dead.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 02, 2023, 11:35:38 am
Jim, where you at?
Here, but lazy.
I didn't deadlift yesterday like I said I would and my power started going out late last night so I didn't bother with posting but I also wouldn't have bothered with posting anyway.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 02, 2023, 12:28:04 pm
The unconscious connection between a1s and town is scientifically proven to work, even if you're aware I'm doing it. Well, you can obviously still vote for me, but you will do so against your gut.Haha what? No it isn't, basically 100% of that whole genre of studies fail to replicate.
Maybe you're just joking around, but that whole implicit association thing was a fad for a while before it got debunked so I want to be sure.
Anyway, your last few posts have not impressed me. You actually DO remind me of when you were scum before.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 02, 2023, 12:42:52 pm
Gut read, I feel less sure a1s is scum. Slight town read, but that was my impression of a1s in the last game, so I am still suspicious.You said a1s seemed like mafia because they were acting like the previous game you were in together. How confident is this? Can you show comparisons?If you got a specific question you want answered, could you please repeat it? You've written two full pages so far......Yeah who would do that?If it isn't obvious by me not posting a wall of text, I'm not caught up with Day 2 so far.Well, ignoring me annoys me, so we're even.
I'll get to your questions eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 02, 2023, 12:47:18 pm
1) Toony claims Max is scum with Web
2) Web claims Max is scum with Toony
3) I feel one of Toony or Web is scum, and I am reasonably sure that is Toony.
...
If Toony or Web is scum, they have outed their partner if Max is Mafia. Therefore, Max is Town, since that is stupid
Post by: notquitethere on March 02, 2023, 01:00:24 pm
Just putting this out there, I think Max is town according to the following logic:This kind of clearing reads as town to me. Obviously this chain only works if one of Web or Toony is scum. I think Toony is, but if it turns out neither are, then...
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:05:54 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:08:07 pm
I agree.The unconscious connection between a1s and town is scientifically proven to work, even if you're aware I'm doing it. Well, you can obviously still vote for me, but you will do so against your gut.This is a very Dragon thing to say, good work fellow Dragon.
So, A1s is town, I can recognize that scent anywhere. That of a solo player.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:17:34 pm
I haven't got any reason why Fluff is with you specifically, I just independently think Fluffe is scummy. Why don't you?Because I agree with Web's read.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:21:22 pm
Also here are my pretty useless notes so far for anyone interested in that for some reason.I appreciate the notes. I haven't taken any for this game which has been a trend for me lately. Could you say how confident you think each of these players are town? Literally just a percentage if you have to.
Webadict: Claims Stem (Why would he do that?)
EuchreJack: Had a mini mental breakdown so probably town not gonna trust em again though if he turns out to be scum.
Jim Groovester: Toony Claims he is Stem (Somehow?)
ToonyMan: Talks Alot
a1s: Likes the color green.
TricMagic: Claims Stem
MaximumSpin: Claims Town (Duh)
Fluffe9911: [REDACTED] (It's me)
notquitethere: Wants me dead.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:23:57 pm
WEE WOO WEE WOOJim, where you at?
Here, but lazy.
I didn't deadlift yesterday like I said I would and my power started going out late last night so I didn't bother with posting but I also wouldn't have bothered with posting anyway.
Lazybones! You're a lazybones!
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:30:58 pm
Meh, that's lukewarm which I don't like but I see where you're coming from. You had them bottom on your D1 reads but now aren't as sure, but conflictingly you say this is just like how you felt last game where a1s was mafia so it puts you in a bind.Gut read, I feel less sure a1s is scum. Slight town read, but that was my impression of a1s in the last game, so I am still suspicious.You said a1s seemed like mafia because they were acting like the previous game you were in together. How confident is this? Can you show comparisons?If you got a specific question you want answered, could you please repeat it? You've written two full pages so far......Yeah who would do that?If it isn't obvious by me not posting a wall of text, I'm not caught up with Day 2 so far.Well, ignoring me annoys me, so we're even.
I'll get to your questions eventually, or I'll deliberately ignore it because accusing me of ignoring it annoys me.
Well, let me unclear that bind by saying I think a1s is town. There now you don't have to worry about it. This is especially important for players like you and NQT if you're both town.
Post by: TricMagic on March 02, 2023, 01:32:38 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:37:29 pm
I really like Jim's reply to Web's about the 2 minute time delay thing because I didn't even realize that myself even though I did remember the day ending right at the hour. I can excuse Web for bringing it as an arguing point because he probably genuinely wasn't aware of that because he was driving or whatever. But the point is I really appreciate Jim talking about that when he didn't have to at all.
Post by: TricMagic on March 02, 2023, 01:49:24 pm
Yeah isn't it crazy how most people like you until you accidentally cause D1 to happen again? I'd kill me too.ToonyMan, that's the last buddying you will do today.
I really like Jim's reply to Web's about the 2 minute time delay thing because I didn't even realize that myself even though I did remember the day ending right at the hour. I can excuse Web for bringing it as an arguing point because he probably genuinely wasn't aware of that because he was driving or whatever. But the point is I really appreciate Jim talking about that when he didn't have to at all.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 02, 2023, 01:51:49 pm
I appreciate the notes. I haven't taken any for this game which has been a trend for me lately. Could you say how confident you think each of these players are town? Literally just a percentage if you have to.Sure ill give that a shot.
Webadict: 50% Town 50% Scum: I appreciate that he has been defending me but I still am so damn confused why he role claimed I simply can't comprehend how it would help town at all.
EuchreJack: 90% Town 10% Scum: will drop way lower in future games if he ends up being scum after pulling that outburst stunt and attempts a similar stunt again.
Jim Groovester: 50% Town 50% Scum: Jim just molds into the background for me for some reason.
ToonyMan: 55% Scum 45% Town: The cause of the last minute shenaniganry some of his questions feel like traps for good or bad probably gonna be hammered today.
a1s: 60% Scum 40% Town: Even less helpful than me everytime they repeat the green ai town thing I get a bit more annoyed.
TricMagic: 70% Town 30% Scum: Claimed Stem as the very first post mostly has been memeing in the background could still be bad but meh.
MaximumSpin: 55% Town 45% Scum: Pretty good at making reads I think, hasn't done anything really worth of me calling em scum.
Fluffe9911: 100% Town 0% Scum (It's me)
notquitethere: 60% Town 40% Scum he want's me dead but I think it's simply him mistaking my general incompetence and passiveness for malicious intent probably not bad though wish he would lay off me.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:53:40 pm
Everyone
Jim is town! Tric is town! Web is town! Fluffe is town! a1s is town! Jack is town! Max is a good player! NQT makes nice graphs!
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 01:55:45 pm
^ this is a town player who wants to help ^I appreciate the notes. I haven't taken any for this game which has been a trend for me lately. Could you say how confident you think each of these players are town? Literally just a percentage if you have to.Sure ill give that a shot.
Webadict: 50% Town 50% Scum: I appreciate that he has been defending me but I still am so damn confused why he role claimed I simply can't comprehend how it would help town at all.
EuchreJack: 90% Town 10% Scum: will drop way lower in future games if he ends up being scum after pulling that outburst stunt and attempts a similar stunt again.
Jim Groovester: 50% Town 50% Scum: Jim just molds into the background for me for some reason.
ToonyMan: 55% Scum 45% Town: The cause of the last minute shenaniganry some of his questions feel like traps for good or bad probably gonna be hammered today.
a1s: 60% Scum 40% Town: Even less helpful than me everytime they repeat the green ai town thing I get a bit more annoyed.
TricMagic: 70% Town 30% Scum: Claimed Stem as the very first post mostly has been memeing in the background could still be bad but meh.
MaximumSpin: 55% Town 45% Scum: Pretty good at making reads I think, hasn't done anything really worth of me calling em scum.
Fluffe9911: 100% Town 0% Scum (It's me)
notquitethere: 60% Town 40% Scum he want's me dead but I think it's simply him mistaking my general incompetence and passiveness for malicious intent probably not bad though wish he would lay off me.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 02, 2023, 02:11:02 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 02, 2023, 02:12:09 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 02:12:46 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on March 02, 2023, 03:07:53 pm
------------------------
->ToonyMan --4-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714), MaximumSpin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457749#msg8457749), EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457687#msg8457687), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457963#msg8457963)
->notquitethere --1-- ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457762#msg8457762)
->Fluffe9911 --1-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457866#msg8457866)
EuchreJack --0--
a1s --0--
Maximum Spin --0--
webadict --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --3-- Webadict, Fluffee9911, Jim Groovester
Five to hammer. Day ends in approximately 46 hours, or at 18:00 GMT 4th March (12:00 CST).
Post by: TricMagic on March 02, 2023, 03:11:39 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 02, 2023, 03:12:23 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 02, 2023, 03:12:53 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 02, 2023, 03:16:11 pm
Oh, btw, Hi Max! Where have you been?Between last night and this morning when I started posting? Sleeping.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 02, 2023, 05:05:52 pm
Webadict: 50% Town 50% Scum: I appreciate that he has been defending me but I still am so damn confused why he role claimed I simply can't comprehend how it would help town at all.
Perfectly normal read of web in general, but especially when he's town.
Web likes to run crazy gambits. Web can claim anything he wants, as I rate his truthfulness at a consistent 50%. Web lies...as town
Best way to try to read Web is to ask "Is this guy trying to solve the game, or has he already been told much of the info?"
That could bite us in the @$$, since mafia has to figure out the town roles to win. But they know two roles, so they have a lead. In addition, Mafia only need to uncover 2 roles to win, two that match one of their roles. Thus, the standard "Town need to find Mafia, but Mafia just need to survive" is still mostly applicable.
Post by: webadict on March 02, 2023, 08:46:46 pm
Webadict: 50% Town 50% Scum: I appreciate that he has been defending me but I still am so damn confused why he role claimed I simply can't comprehend how it would help town at all.I like the reads, but I've been ignoring your saying this for a while for a specific reason, and that's because my goal is to reasonably sow doubt about what my role is or isn't. This is because I generally am a
So, am I a Stem? Am I not a Stem? Those are questions that cannot be answered in good faith, because they're fundamentally problematic to give out, UNLESS you're playing some type of super roulette gambit, which I always am, so you can either believe what I'm saying, not believe what I'm saying, or both. The thing is, it could literally be anything and it fundamentally doesn't matter which is the right answer.
Post by: webadict on March 02, 2023, 08:56:30 pm
Yeah isn't it crazy how most people like you until you accidentally cause D1 to happen again? I'd kill me too.I actually didn't realize that when it was happening, because I noticed my time, but I was also using forum time and thought I had more. I was in the middle of typing out a small blurb, and then I was confused why the day ended early. But, Jim is fundamentally correct about that notion, and I didn't realize it at the time either, so I can't use that evidence against you.
I really like Jim's reply to Web's about the 2 minute time delay thing because I didn't even realize that myself even though I did remember the day ending right at the hour. I can excuse Web for bringing it as an arguing point because he probably genuinely wasn't aware of that because he was driving or whatever. But the point is I really appreciate Jim talking about that when he didn't have to at all.
The problem I have, Toony, is that I have to make a series of poor decisions: If I believe you, I have to go all in on the believing you because you'll never be voted again. You wouldn't lie to me over the internet, would you? I can reasonably see nqt as a viable vote, especially from your perspective, and for the most part, I feel like you've resigned yourself to the fate of dying. You're not super pot committed, which is a reasonable stance for Town or scum here, but I feel like there's reason to believe you'd try harder if you were scum, since scum being alive is far more important. And that's concerning to me, because if I get this wrong, I'll have to justify making a(n only slightly) poor decision, but my credibility goes down regardless.
So, if I were to hammer you, what would your message be to everyone?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 10:03:50 pm
The problem I have, Toony, is that I have to make a series of poor decisions: If I believe you, I have to go all in on the believing you because you'll never be voted again.Probably true. I want to be cocky and say town probably wins too, but that's obvious from my point of view.
You wouldn't lie to me over the internet, would you? I can reasonably see nqt as a viable vote, especially from your perspective, and for the most part, I feel like you've resigned yourself to the fate of dying. You're not super pot committed, which is a reasonable stance for Town or scum here, but I feel like there's reason to believe you'd try harder if you were scum, since scum being alive is far more important.I am trying to live here as long as possible. I swear there is a good townie reason why I want to be alive as long as I can. This is probably playing a part in my behavior.
And that's concerning to me, because if I get this wrong, I'll have to justify making a(n only slightly) poor decision, but my credibility goes down regardless.Use your one-shots wisely. Trust Jim. Trust Webadict. Trust Tric but don't listen to him because he's a moron. I think Fluffe and a1s are newbtown (although I like Fluffe more than a1s). Jack upsets me but is probably okay. I don't trust Max or NQT. I'm willing to bet the two mafia are inside a1s/Jack/Max/NQT. Please read what I've said during this D2 as a factor in your thoughts.
So, if I were to hammer you, what would your message be to everyone?
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 02, 2023, 10:13:32 pm
So, if I were to hammer you, what would your message be to everyone?
I mean, you could do that, but do you have to? I haven't done any work during Day 2 yet and I don't really want ToonyMan lynched.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 10:29:20 pm
Maybe I can bribe him with a WALL OF TEXT ANALYSIS (WOTA) of Day 1 or more likely Max and NQT specifically that I will attempt to do on Friday. It's that thing where I look at every post and make comments and come to a conclusion that I find is usually accurate, a recent example was FBYOR5 where I got 3/4 scum.So, if I were to hammer you, what would your message be to everyone?
I mean, you could do that, but do you have to? I haven't done any work during Day 2 yet and I don't really want ToonyMan lynched.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 02, 2023, 11:00:34 pm
If you flip town, your thoughts become platinum.And that's concerning to me, because if I get this wrong, I'll have to justify making a(n only slightly) poor decision, but my credibility goes down regardless.Use your one-shots wisely. Trust Jim. Trust Webadict. Trust Tric but don't listen to him because he's a moron. I think Fluffe and a1s are newbtown (although I like Fluffe more than a1s). Jack upsets me but is probably okay. I don't trust Max or NQT. I'm willing to bet the two mafia are inside a1s/Jack/Max/NQT. Please read what I've said during this D2 as a factor in your thoughts.
So, if I were to hammer you, what would your message be to everyone?
But, in what I suspect is more likely, you flip mafia, then you've successfully hid your scumbuddy.
My experience of playing against mafia!Toony is limited, however I have followed several games where Toony was mafia (often due to my dying early, but sometimes as a spectator), and is the basis for my belief in this matter. I have also (almost) let mafia!Toony off the hook before, which is why I'm keeping his jugular firmly on the pavement.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 02, 2023, 11:13:19 pm
Ninja-san Tric:
Would Toony need to buddy Jim so blatantly and obviously if they were scum buddies?
Fuck you, I like ToonyMan.
@NQT & Jim
Is Max scum buddies with Toonyman or Webadict?
If we assume that one between Toonyman & Webadict is Mafia, what does that mean about Max's alignment?
I feel like I should do more research into the game before answering your question but since you bitched about me ignoring your questions you get my opinion at the moment.
If Maximum Spin is scum I don't think he partners well with either webadict or ToonyMan. My gut is leaning towards thinking the latter two are town.
If one of ToonyMan and webadict is scum I don't really think that means anything for Max's alignment.
@Jim: How come you have a giant blindspot regarding Toonyman?
Not my only blindspot, I assure you.
But I don't get it. I'm really not bothered by ToonyMan's end of Day 1.
@Jim: Does town!Toony play to emotion so much?
The only person I'd say who really plays to emotion on this board is Knightwing64,
and you during Day 1.
ToonyMan hasn't been swearing at people and cursing them so it really doesn't feel like he's appealing to emotion at all.
Just putting this out there, I think Max is town according to the following logic:
1) Toony claims Max is scum with Web
2) Web claims Max is scum with Toony
3) I feel one of Toony or Web is scum, and I am reasonably sure that is Toony.
...
If Toony or Web is scum, they have outed their partner if Max is Mafia. Therefore, Max is Town, since that is stupid
This doesn't make any sense but I read you slightly more favorably for it.
This feels a lot like a bad faith reading of the intent behind ToonyMan's end of Day 1 actions.I don't understand the intent of ToonyMan's end of Day 1 actions. Can you explain it to me? The only way it makes sense to me is scum desperately trying to move the vote. It's not something I would ever do as town.
I probably don't need to insert words into ToonyMan's mouth, but he wasn't hot on an a1s lynch (something I was not hot on either) and tried to do something about it. There's decent town reasons why a town ToonyMan would do this.
Rapid vote changes and bargaining aren't uncommon for end of day CFD scenarios so I'm pretty confused what everybody is upset about.
I didn't think a1s was scum at that point and didn't want to see them die.Would I have voted a1s last second to ensure an elimination? I probably would have.That's a bit of a contradiction, unless a1s is town, but you'd kill me anyway?
Not really.
Given a choice between a good lynch and a bad lynch, obviously the good lynch is preferable.
Given the choice between a bad lynch and no lynch, the bad lynch is preferable.
Lynches provide information, which is important to help the town narrow down possibilities about what valid scum teams are possible.
Or you were protecting Max, it's why you said that there (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457184#msg8457184).
Vote ToonyMan/Maximum Spin 2023!
(inb4 I get murdered for being AFK: I'm going to sleep.)
Maximum Spin isn't opposed to a good bus and if a ToonyMan/Maximum Spin scum team decided that there was advantage to do it, they would. But, Maximum Spin has been keeping ToonyMan within hammer range which is something he doesn't need to do to his scum partner when they could go after other targets.
So,
if you really think about it,
and I mean really,
you know, in your opinion,
how much sense does a ToonyMan/Maximum Spin scumteam make?
I'm beginning to feel unappreciated in this subforum! I think I used to have an okay rep as a player... somehow I managed to squander it through bad play and rolling mafia repeatedly.
Maybe I haven't caught on to all the super secret scumtells that everybody else has but I don't think you're bad.
More pressingly, why do you say that when you also said this, Toony?Hmm I like NQT's attitude towards Jack.
It's like he dropped his earlier read when it was no longer convenient. I'm the obvious patsy from a scum!Toony perspective. D1 a newb could be mislynched, but D2+ he needs me to be available as the next mislynch. So he's setting his ducks in a row.
Egh, I don't like this.
People's opinions develop as the game goes on, don't they? Wow he changed his opinion oh no it's not like there was a specific reaction of EuchreJack's he pointed to that changed his mind.
If ToonyMan is town I think the odds are pretty good it's you/Max because it really doesn't feel like either of you are coming from genuine places with your criticisms of ToonyMan.
NQT could be anything, let's say town for now. Plant part could be anything, can't tell.
Moreover, going back to this post, why would a town!Toony be speculating about the plants? It's like he forgot to save that analysis for the scumchat. He's blurring his roles here.
"ToonyMan meant to post his plant speculation in scumchat instead"
This is farcical criticism.
I don't like your case against ToonyMan. It's pretty bad. It feels a lot like you're working backwards from the conclusion 'ToonyMan needs to be lynched' and finding reasons to support this even if they're poor or invalid.
postI don't like any of this. I think this is most disingenuous argument against me out of everyone, like you're an actor speaking on a stage.
How is ToonyMan scum when I agree with him more than any other player??????????
Reads:
Town:
TricMagic
a1s
Fluffe9911
ToonyMan
Lean Town:
EuchreJack
webadict
Don't like:
notquitethere
Maximum Spin
I thought somewhat positively about notquitethere until I read his Day 2 case justifying his vote on ToonyMan, which was pure garbage.
Fluffe9911 mocks me by saying I blend into the background but Maximum Spin has been less impressive during Day 2. Max's suspicions towards ToonyMan bother me but I dislike his read on a1s less; a feeling I've had regarding his read on a1s is that after trying for a1s on Day 1 (and doing fuckall during the CFD) he's boxed in to keep suspecting a1s which doesn't feel exceptionally genuine to me. I want to reread the game to verify and refine this opinion though.
I think a1s and TricMagic are town but I really don't know what either of them are on about by voting ToonyMan.
I should be engaging webadict since the posts he's making like he has his finger on the trigger of the gun pointed at ToonyMan don't feel as perfectly reasoned as I feel like they should be but I'm also struggling to articulate particular objections.
Going to go with notquitethere and also ask people not to lynch ToonyMan.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 02, 2023, 11:29:00 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 11:30:46 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 02, 2023, 11:35:10 pm
^A reasonable case for his vote, and sufficient response to my questions. Jim seems slightly more hostile than I might expect from town!Jim.
Maybe if SOEMBODY hadn't gotten SNIPPY about it yesterday.
That post is town as fuck.
I am going to feel very stupid if you actually are scum.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 02, 2023, 11:40:38 pm
Fluffe9911 mocks me by saying I blend into the background but Maximum Spin has been less impressive during Day 2.Maybe I have. That's probably fair. There's nothing I hate more than Day One Again. Several times now I've thought about making a post and then just... didn't bother. It feels pointless.
A lot of the rest of what you said about me is off-base. For one thing I don't even care about a1s right now. But honestly, that's probably my bad for keeping my thoughts to myself.
Well, whatever. The question for me now is whether I should believe in the Toony and Jim who disbelieve in me.
... ehhhh, alea iacta est. You two better not be the team or I'll be mad.
notquitethere
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 11:50:56 pm
No man, I can tell. We are on the exact same wavelengths.^A reasonable case for his vote, and sufficient response to my questions. Jim seems slightly more hostile than I might expect from town!Jim.
Maybe if SOEMBODY hadn't gotten SNIPPY about it yesterday.That post is town as fuck.
I am going to feel very stupid if you actually are scum.
I (just like you) also think NQT and Max have the fishiest reasons for voting me and since EVERYBODY is voting me or intends to vote me that's why I want to focus on those two.
I think a1s is a newb and isn't thinking that clearly which us why they voted me.
I think Jack and Web are mad at me for various reasons which is why they voted me. I think some reasons are rational and others aren't.
Fluffe isn't voting me but I'm his other suspect besides a1s I think.
Tric has voted me on and off because he's Tric.
Post by: Mamobo on March 02, 2023, 11:52:08 pm
------------------------
-> notquitethere --3-- ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457762#msg8457762), Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458102#msg8458102),
ToonyMan --2-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457687#msg8457687), a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
Fluffe9911 --1-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457866#msg8457866),
Maximum Spin --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
a1s --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --2-- Fluffe9911, webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457736#msg8457736),
5 to Hammer. Day ends on February 27, 2023 at 16:00 Central Standard Time (-78 hours and -54 minutes remaining.)
Post by: ToonyMan on March 02, 2023, 11:56:21 pm
Well, whatever. The question for me now is whether I should believe in the Toony and Jim who disbelieve in me.Who's with a mafia!NQT you think?
... ehhhh, alea iacta est. You two better not be the team or I'll be mad.
notquitethere
Post by: webadict on March 02, 2023, 11:58:15 pm
I'm gonna take a better look at NQT Tomorrow, but I'll be busy for a lot of it. I'm okay with an NQT vote, but I'm still more okay with a Toony vote.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 03, 2023, 12:03:32 am
Who's with a mafia!NQT you think?What do you think "believing in the ToonyMan and Jim who disbelieve in me" means here?
It means I'm not supposed to have to think about it.
But honestly, out of the options I guess I'd have to say webadict most of all, followed by... uh, Jack, actually. I'm kind of surprised to realize I think that, but it makes sense with their interaction d1. Well, to me at least.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 12:05:32 am
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 03, 2023, 12:12:46 am
I firmly believe it's NQT/Jack if you're town, Max.Yeah, I can see it.
Toony, I believe in you. Believe in the me that believes in you.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 12:13:51 am
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 04:24:55 am
I'm going to keep my vote on Toony, but he's put in great effort to win everyone over, so I understand if folks decide to let him live. It's not like he didn't earn it.
Post by: notquitethere on March 03, 2023, 05:12:46 am
Toonyman, obviously. But I actually prefer actually-useless Fluffe as a candidate for today.
A thing people should know if they've been scum with me is that I don't actually like to bus. Especially at the start of the game, it's usually counterproductive. No way am I in a scum team with Jack. Firstly, I'm not scum. Secondly, I don't reckon he is either. Well probably not. But thirdly, if I was scum, I wouldn't have tried to launch him so hard on D1.
Anyway, I suspect that this kind of defence will not be well received. More in a bit.
Post by: notquitethere on March 03, 2023, 07:51:23 am
Three votes is nothing! I eat three votes for breakfast.It is breakfast time in NQT-time.
Right so let's have a look at these votes.
Toony on NQT
I (just like you) also think NQT and Max have the fishiest reasons for voting me and since EVERYBODY is voting me or intends to vote me that's why I want to focus on those two.This is the sort of reasoning that I'd do myself, so I don't object to Toony's approach here. I do reject his conclusion that I have a fishy reason for voting him. I was very clear why I was voting him. It wasn't just a bandwagon vote, but a rundown of a bunch of reasons why Toony's attitude towards me felt like scum opportunistically setting aside an 'acceptable' target. Web even says as much: that I'd be a default target. And Toony agrees, saying I'm "always" scum. Well I've been scum a disproportionate number of times in recent games, but I'm not always the bad guy and I don't think any serious attempt has been made to say why my play is currently like my play in those previous games (because... it's not!).
Doesn't like my D1 votes (but he likes Max, Fluff a lot better??). Toony has been drowning all D2 under pressure and this feels like an elaborate OMGUS. But you know, I've taken Jim's words to heart. Was I being motivated in my reasoning against Toony? Could a town!Toony hold his beliefs against me? Well, literally yes. Town spend most of their time being wrong. And Toony has a residual suspicion against me:
I can't think of anything I've liked about NQT in this game so far, but that is literally always the case. So I would say NQT is still more suspicious than Max currently.
And I get it! I always think Max seems scummy. These meta effects persist and warp each new game. But if Toony is town, he's going to have to get over that if he doesn't want to throw the game with a pointless mislynch.
Fluffe9911 - doesn't want to vote
After being pushed repeatedly, by me voting and Toony coaching, Fluffe finally came through on some reads, (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457964#msg8457964) with some scum percentages. Still doesn't actually act on those reads. This sort of play is difficult to assess because it's there's not much difference between Fluff as a low-effort scum or Fluff as a no-conviction town. Mafia is a hard game and people bounce off of it hard because there's often little solid to go on.
Max on NQT
Max putting a boot in as usual. Feel disheartened because it's a repeat of D1. I get it. There's little solid here. Anyway he just brazenly sheeps Toony and Jim. Max is lazy, no two ways about it. And if he's successful, he's going to cause a mislynch. This to me reads as scum inability to find a valid target on his own.
Jim on NQT
Egh, I don't like this.This is fair, people do change their mind, but I was pointing out that Toony literally contradicted himself. He said there was something he liked in my play then later he said he had seen nothing he liked in my play all game. Well, maybe this is null and I'm being too sensitive as I'm the target of his slander here, but it felt to me that his play matched that of someone setting me up as a viable lynch candidate. You know, something he's just done.
People's opinions develop as the game goes on, don't they? Wow he changed his opinion oh no it's not like there was a specific reaction of EuchreJack's he pointed to that changed his mind.
If ToonyMan is town I think the odds are pretty good it's you/Max because it really doesn't feel like either of you are coming from genuine places with your criticisms of ToonyMan.
"ToonyMan meant to post his plant speculation in scumchat instead"This wasn't what I was saying. I'm saying that plant speculation is something that may come from a scum perspective. I'm not saying he literally slipped and put it in the wrong place.
This is farcical criticism.
I don't like your case against ToonyMan. It's pretty bad. It feels a lot like you're working backwards from the conclusion 'ToonyMan needs to be lynched' and finding reasons to support this even if they're poor or invalid.Motivated reasoning is a big danger in mafia, but it's also hard to avoid. We have a bad feeling about someone, we go looking and lo there are reasons to support that feeling. At the time I made that case that's about all I had to work with.
TricMagic on MaxSpin
Literally just a vote for lurking. Boring. But everyone has decided that this must be Town Tric because of the role obsession... hmm.
a1s on Toony
Just a sheep vote as far as I can tell. Joined the wagon Web started, along with Jack, and hasn't reassessed or done much of anything since.
Jack on Toony
Jack had a meltdown on D1. I've gone back and forth in my mind about how towny that was. I recall now times when I've acted similarly as scum. On D2 he's pursued an all-Toony strategy, trying to team build from there, working out that EOD D1 was thrown by scum. This sort of speculation:
@NQT & Jim(I don't think either is a safe assumption to make now, I need to re-read the Fire Drill.)
Is Max scum buddies with Toonyman or Webadict?
If we assume that one between Toonyman & Webadict is Mafia, what does that mean about Max's alignment?
READS
TOWN
Jim - Reasonable attempt to understand the game, clearly examines the arguments
Tric - Being incoherent, making unnecessary claims, but also voting a lot. Seems town-Tric. Tries to hammer Toony!
a1s - Genuine sacrificial behaviour on D1, seems like a newbie town sort of play
Webadict - Tries to push a last minute wagon on Max, a1s supports, Toony denies. That's fine but he's tunnel-visioned.
Jack - I didn't like D1 play, but the meltdown felt genuine at the time. Has been thinking about team composition, which is hunting of a sort
Fluff - No conviction. Very passive. But not completely without opinions.
Toony - Bad OMGUS-type argument against me I can't see clearly on this one. Stepped up a lot with the pressure, but I don't really see why people think he's lock town now.
Max - Lazy opportunistic wagoner whose defence is he's always like that.
Let's get some Max pressure up in this house. Shake these trees, see what falls out.
Max, any reads?
Post by: notquitethere on March 03, 2023, 08:05:16 am
Jack/a1s/Webadict, work me through the case on Toony. My prior reasons to vote him might have been wrong, but that doesn't mean he's not scum. So why do you think we should be launching the Toon today?
Toony, how would you act if you were scum in this game right now? Is anyone acting like that right now?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 08:52:28 am
Hold up. I log back in and I'm the lynch lead? Serves me right for taking my foot off the pedal.Relevant: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0)
Toonyman, obviously. But I actually prefer actually-useless Fluffe as a candidate for today.
A thing people should know if they've been scum with me is that I don't actually like to bus. Especially at the start of the game, it's usually counterproductive. No way am I in a scum team with Jack. Firstly, I'm not scum. Secondly, I don't reckon he is either. Well probably not. But thirdly, if I was scum, I wouldn't have tried to launch him so hard on D1.
Anyway, I suspect that this kind of defence will not be well received. More in a bit.
In that game, NQT should have bussed hector13, but instead hard-defended. Town still lynched hector13, roleblocked NQT, then lynched NQT the next day for the win.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 08:55:03 am
Sorry, but I have to go to work now.
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 09:12:40 am
An issue is, Toony, why do you say I make no sense?
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 03, 2023, 09:40:13 am
Fluffe9911 mocks me by saying I blend into the background but Maximum Spin has been less impressive during Day 2.Wasn't meant to be in a mocking tone just more of a neutral observation I genuinely didn't remember a single thing you said on D1 without having to double-check first and the things ya said today have been pretty short up till now.
Anyway why the hell are people voting NQT all of the sudden? I genuinely think it aint him because I genuinely think he wouldn't of been going after me this hard if he was a mafia. Trying to kill me right now simply aint a popular option and while he did relent I feel like he went too far for it to be a simple testing of the waters by scum or anything. I think if he was actually mafia he would not accuse me in the first place/support me like everyone else because his core belief around all this is that I'm either "low-effort scum or Fluff as a no-conviction town." which from his POV is just as bad (even if I don't personally agree considering how important town are in a game like this.)
If it's between Toon or NQT im going to vote ToonyMan although personally i'd rather vote A1 I just ain't gonna cause I feel trying to start a bus at this point for A1 would be futile and I don't actually have much in the way of evidence to back it up.
Post by: notquitethere on March 03, 2023, 11:10:12 am
Spoiler: Prior Early Game Reads (click to show/hide)
I've looked back on some previous games, and it turns out, as I suspected, I'm just really bad at reading Toony. Or to say, if I thought he was scum in my initial reads then he's more likely to actually be town.
It also shows I'm often right about players with weak or non-existent cases being scum.
Further, it shows me I shouldn't be town-reading Jim just for being helpful and analytic, he's more than capable of acting like that as scum.
Here's a revised list of who I think may be worth ejecting today:
Not worth ejecting D2:
Fluff - Last post was solid gold, really strongly shined through as a town kind of perspective. I no longer wish to remove Fluff today.
Tric - Most likely this is town!tric. Actively changes votes.
Probably not worth ejecting D2:
Toony - If I thought Toony was scum before, I was probably wrong.
Jim - He seems fine, which apparently means nothing, I want to give him a bit longer
Jack - Has been expanding out associate reads, even if his vote is tunnely. His jokey refusal to give an actual case on Toony is a red flag
a1s - Most likely town, actively reassessed their votes D1. Not impressed by D2 play.
Worth ejecting D2:
Max - Just wagons - weak vote reason
Webadict - Tunnelled on Toony, but without conviction to hammer
Actually I don't think Web-Max is a team due to EOD D2, but I think clearing from the bottom of this pool is a good move.
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 11:52:32 am
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 11:53:08 am
Which is it?
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 11:57:46 am
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 11:59:26 am
Max
a1s
nqt
Fluffe
Jim
EuchreJack
TricMagic
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 12:12:57 pm
Man this game is hard. The new NQT posts look good and show significant effort. I still think mafia are in a1s/Jack/Max/NQT.
ToonyMan.I could claim my role but it would literally only exaggerate the situation of "do I trust Toony and lose if he's scum or probably win if he's town?". I probably will today since I think I'm the most likely to die here being constantly at L-1 and there's no reason not to claim since I believe it's revealed on death.
I think you're rating Jack too highly, if Jack is town though I would be more suspicious of Max over NQT.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 12:22:43 pm
Toony, how would you act if you were scum in this game right now? Is anyone acting like that right now?I would have gotten a1s or Max lynched on D1, depending on the situation.
Assuming that didn't happen and we're just looking at D2...I think I would be acting exactly the same as I am now. I would raise legitimate beef with players I think are voting me bad, I would buddy players that like me, I would point at other options that weren't me. The main difference is that I would be lying, but nothing I have said today has come from a mind of deceit.
No one besides you NQT and myself have seen any strong pressure today so I don't believe any other player is behaving like I am since there's no equivalent.
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 12:26:08 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 12:29:27 pm
My one morning question is thus, who is partners with NQT? I'll keep my vote on Max since that seems to be the common thread in both cases. Ergo more likely to be mafia.You wouldn't believe how much trouble you've actually caused me Tric.
An issue is, Toony, why do you say I make no sense?
Put some presssure on max then instead of resigning yourself to die.Okay, I will take your advice Tric. Max. I still want to do a write up when I'm free.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 12:31:54 pm
Jack - Has been expanding out associate reads, even if his vote is tunnely. His jokey refusal to give an actual case on Toony is a red flag.Dude, my needing to go to work ain't no joking matter.
I've joined the workforce for real as an employee instead of being self-employed. In fact, I have to go back to work in like 10 minutes.
And furthermore, if you can wade through the 3+ pages of Toony Spam, you'll see that I have been making a case for Toony.
Hell, the Toony Spam alone is the case, I don't see him wasting out time like that as Town.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 12:35:45 pm
Hell, the Toony Spam alone is the case, I don't see him wasting out time like that as Town.Me taking my time away from work and personal time to post is not a legitimate case, at all.
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 12:38:26 pm
Or at least, I have a good guess.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 03, 2023, 12:39:07 pm
Anyway he just brazenly sheeps Toony and Jim. Max is lazy, no two ways about it. And if he's successful, he's going to cause a mislynch. This to me reads as scum inability to find a valid target on his own.I started the push on Toony. The only reason I only voted later, after it was a wagon, is because it instantly shot from "I just want to hear his explanation for now" to "Toony is suddenly one vote away from the lynch" without my having a chance to react. Surely you have to accept him as a valid target when he was also your target at the time.
After that, sure, once I decided to put my trust in him I followed his vote. I do that a lot, especially on day one, which I contend this still is. Consider how many times I've made vote deals with webadict. Okay, so you think "I always do that" is a weak argument, but what do you want from me? I'm not putting my vote back on ToonyMan when I don't suspect him anymore. And I said from the start that I suspected you. I wouldn't have followed a vote on Tric or something.
Ultimately this complaint is lazy as hell and reads like the nitpicking in web's Supernatural.
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 12:40:14 pm
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 12:48:26 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 03, 2023, 01:00:50 pm
Max, who's Town to you?Most strongly, Tric and Jim.
I have no idea about Fluffy at this point. I don't think I've seen him before. I lean to thinking a1s seems fine, but there's no conviction behind it and I wouldn't be surprised if it's wrong.
After that, I'm extending the benefit of the doubt to Toony, and I'd put you at about that level as well since the two of you are kind of interacting the way you do as town.
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 01:06:11 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 03, 2023, 01:10:10 pm
Who would you willingly vote?NQT, Jack, Fluffy, a1s.
Switching back to Toonyman would just feel like backtracking now, and I feel like I shouldn't vote you if I'm not willing to vote him since I put you at the same tier. And also I assume you wouldn't ask me to anyway.
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 01:54:20 pm
Be more decisive Max. Don't be like Fluffe.
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 03:21:01 pm
Post by: notquitethere on March 03, 2023, 03:23:05 pm
I don't think NQT knows, or he's not realizing something very important.I probably missed whatever you're alluding to...
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 03, 2023, 03:34:29 pm
Well, whatever. The question for me now is whether I should believe in the Toony and Jim who disbelieve in me.
... ehhhh, alea iacta est. You two better not be the team or I'll be mad.
notquitethere
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
But what does it mean when people I suspect suddenly join me in voting other people I suspect?
Hrrrrmmmm.
This is fair, people do change their mind, but I was pointing out that Toony literally contradicted himself. He said there was something he liked in my play then later he said he had seen nothing he liked in my play all game. Well, maybe this is null and I'm being too sensitive as I'm the target of his slander here, but it felt to me that his play matched that of someone setting me up as a viable lynch candidate. You know, something he's just done.
'he said a nice thing about me and then he lied and said he never said nice things about me'
lmao its okay notquitethere, it'll all be okay, it's nothing to get sad about
Motivated reasoning is a big danger in mafia, but it's also hard to avoid. We have a bad feeling about someone, we go looking and lo there are reasons to support that feeling. At the time I made that case that's about all I had to work with.
I understand, but what it should be, at least in my opinion, is 'my bad feelings are directly caused by these things' rather than 'i have a bad feeling, here is a collection of evidence that support that'. There's a difference between the two and by my reading you're admitting to doing the latter rather than the former.
Max - Lazy opportunistic wagoner whose defence is he's always like that.
Now THAT'S a barb and a not completely unconvincing one as well.
So, if NQT flips town, we all lynch Toony, right? Right.
I'm going to keep my vote on Toony, but he's put in great effort to win everyone over, so I understand if folks decide to let him live. It's not like he didn't earn it.
Hrmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
Run me through how you think there is exactly one scum between notquitethere and ToonyMan.
Not really a fan of the either/or attitude here.
Hold up. I log back in and I'm the lynch lead? Serves me right for taking my foot off the pedal.Relevant: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0)
Toonyman, obviously. But I actually prefer actually-useless Fluffe as a candidate for today.
A thing people should know if they've been scum with me is that I don't actually like to bus. Especially at the start of the game, it's usually counterproductive. No way am I in a scum team with Jack. Firstly, I'm not scum. Secondly, I don't reckon he is either. Well probably not. But thirdly, if I was scum, I wouldn't have tried to launch him so hard on D1.
Anyway, I suspect that this kind of defence will not be well received. More in a bit.
In that game, NQT should have bussed hector13, but instead hard-defended. Town still lynched hector13, roleblocked NQT, then lynched NQT the next day for the win.
Thank you for providing evidence supporting the assertion that you and notquitethere are not likely to be on a scumteam together.
Why do you bring this up?
Why does this feel like it's answering questions nobody asked? I know people have theorized you and NQT as partners but I don't think people are executing Day 2 as if it's the dominant theory.
And furthermore, if you can wade through the 3+ pages of Toony Spam, you'll see that I have been making a case for Toony.
I have no idea what your case is on ToonyMan and I read Day 2 last night.
If it's between Toon or NQT im going to vote ToonyMan although personally i'd rather vote A1 I just ain't gonna cause I feel trying to start a bus at this point for A1 would be futile and I don't actually have much in the way of evidence to back it up.
Why not vote a1s and see if you can convince people to join you?
Choosing a lynch often comes down to negotiation and compromises between players on who they are okay with removing from the game. You might find people to take you up on voting a1s (but not me).
The game got much more complicated since my last post. I have a lot of concern focused within notquitethere/Maximum Spin/EuchreJack.
I'll be traveling today to visit family so I might not be around as much. I probably miss the deadline tomorrow.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 03, 2023, 03:42:07 pm
Okay, so Max knows...
You know who else knows?
Not me!
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 03:51:51 pm
It's not a big deal, but Toony + NQT isn't possible.I don't think NQT knows, or he's not realizing something very important.I probably missed whatever you're alluding to...
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 03:52:40 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 05:11:06 pm
Toony, you don't need to claim. I'm pretty sure we both know everything at this point, and that's why you can see what NQT can't...Ye-yeah exactly. I'm three steps ahead of everyone.
Or at least, I have a good guess.
I'm glad you probably realize my predicament.
If I unvote you, I'm hard fucking committed, and riding the No Brain Train, which does sound hella fun...It is the winning move if you trust me. It is statistically the wrong thing to do, but it's actually the correct move here.
I think you're being honest here. Interestingly, NQT has pursued every other player on your vote list.Who would you willingly vote?NQT, Jack, Fluffy, a1s.
Switching back to Toonyman would just feel like backtracking now, and I feel like I shouldn't vote you if I'm not willing to vote him since I put you at the same tier. And also I assume you wouldn't ask me to anyway.
Okay, so Max knows...He probably does, the way he spoke about it seems to imply that he does, if we're seeing the same thing.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 05:12:32 pm
Okay, so Max knows...
You know who else knows?
Not me!Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And that's why you have the dunce hat.
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 05:16:23 pm
Post by: notquitethere on March 03, 2023, 05:25:57 pm
This feels like the 4D chess moves Web was pretending to make when he was actually just a mafia ally in that BYOR.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 05:26:40 pm
It's not a big deal, but Toony + NQT isn't possible.
Actually, neither is Max + NQT.Yep, that's true unless NQT is playing dumb but I don't think he is.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 05:30:17 pm
Web seems to be implying that Toony revealed his plant role??I have.
Web is really observant when I do stuff like this, just look at when I was (fake)claiming Agent in Paranormal 27.
I'm don't even think it's safe to openly speculate about this sort of thing.It's not, unless I'm bullshitting lolol haha??
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 05:34:45 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 05:35:09 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 03, 2023, 05:35:39 pm
Web seems to be implying that Toony revealed his plant role??He 100% has.
Quote
I also don't know why Web thinks that I would reach the conclusion that I can't be on the same team as Max or Toony... I already know I can't be because I'm not. What could he be saying?That you can't be on a team with either of us because you don't know.
Unless you do know and this is a fakeout.
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 05:37:40 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on March 03, 2023, 05:54:10 pm
------------------------
notquitethere --2-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458102#msg8458102)
->ToonyMan --4-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457687#msg8457687), a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458207#msg8458207), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458207#msg8458207)
Maximum Spin --3-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), Toonyman* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458207#msg8458207)
a1s --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
Five to hammer. Day ends in approximately 19 hours, or at 18:00 GMT 4th March (12:00 CST).
Please correct me if wrong.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 06:41:12 pm
One thing to note is mafia can be in any segment. They can be a Root, a Flower, or a Stem. Nevermind a Root Mafia can't really do anything.I think the team combo analysis with !secret! Stuff is based upon the fact that two Mafia CAN NOT be on the same segment.
I'm not gonna try and figure out people's roles.
Toony does truthfully point out his ability to fake his role.
@Web: Have I slipped and revealed my role? I tried to be careful not to do so, but I think my posts may have accidentally revealed.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 06:44:20 pm
Re: EuchreJack's D1 meltdown: People have brought it up and used it to townread EuchreJack. I don't think it strongly indicates alignment in his favor. I could see him doing that as scum.I think this is Scummy, since it seems to be more of Jim trying to control the day, and seems to lack the valuable analysis that I typically see in Town!Jim.Well, whatever. The question for me now is whether I should believe in the Toony and Jim who disbelieve in me.
... ehhhh, alea iacta est. You two better not be the team or I'll be mad.
notquitethere
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
But what does it mean when people I suspect suddenly join me in voting other people I suspect?
Hrrrrmmmm.This is fair, people do change their mind, but I was pointing out that Toony literally contradicted himself. He said there was something he liked in my play then later he said he had seen nothing he liked in my play all game. Well, maybe this is null and I'm being too sensitive as I'm the target of his slander here, but it felt to me that his play matched that of someone setting me up as a viable lynch candidate. You know, something he's just done.
'he said a nice thing about me and then he lied and said he never said nice things about me'
lmao its okay notquitethere, it'll all be okay, it's nothing to get sad aboutMotivated reasoning is a big danger in mafia, but it's also hard to avoid. We have a bad feeling about someone, we go looking and lo there are reasons to support that feeling. At the time I made that case that's about all I had to work with.
I understand, but what it should be, at least in my opinion, is 'my bad feelings are directly caused by these things' rather than 'i have a bad feeling, here is a collection of evidence that support that'. There's a difference between the two and by my reading you're admitting to doing the latter rather than the former.Max - Lazy opportunistic wagoner whose defence is he's always like that.
Now THAT'S a barb and a not completely unconvincing one as well.So, if NQT flips town, we all lynch Toony, right? Right.
I'm going to keep my vote on Toony, but he's put in great effort to win everyone over, so I understand if folks decide to let him live. It's not like he didn't earn it.
Hrmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
Run me through how you think there is exactly one scum between notquitethere and ToonyMan.
Not really a fan of the either/or attitude here.Hold up. I log back in and I'm the lynch lead? Serves me right for taking my foot off the pedal.Relevant: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0)
Toonyman, obviously. But I actually prefer actually-useless Fluffe as a candidate for today.
A thing people should know if they've been scum with me is that I don't actually like to bus. Especially at the start of the game, it's usually counterproductive. No way am I in a scum team with Jack. Firstly, I'm not scum. Secondly, I don't reckon he is either. Well probably not. But thirdly, if I was scum, I wouldn't have tried to launch him so hard on D1.
Anyway, I suspect that this kind of defence will not be well received. More in a bit.
In that game, NQT should have bussed hector13, but instead hard-defended. Town still lynched hector13, roleblocked NQT, then lynched NQT the next day for the win.
Thank you for providing evidence supporting the assertion that you and notquitethere are not likely to be on a scumteam together.
Why do you bring this up?
Why does this feel like it's answering questions nobody asked? I know people have theorized you and NQT as partners but I don't think people are executing Day 2 as if it's the dominant theory.And furthermore, if you can wade through the 3+ pages of Toony Spam, you'll see that I have been making a case for Toony.
I have no idea what your case is on ToonyMan and I read Day 2 last night.If it's between Toon or NQT im going to vote ToonyMan although personally i'd rather vote A1 I just ain't gonna cause I feel trying to start a bus at this point for A1 would be futile and I don't actually have much in the way of evidence to back it up.
Why not vote a1s and see if you can convince people to join you?
Choosing a lynch often comes down to negotiation and compromises between players on who they are okay with removing from the game. You might find people to take you up on voting a1s (but not me).
The game got much more complicated since my last post. I have a lot of concern focused within notquitethere/Maximum Spin/EuchreJack.
I'll be traveling today to visit family so I might not be around as much. I probably miss the deadline tomorrow.
Post by: TricMagic on March 03, 2023, 06:59:17 pm
Should I? Or shouldn't I not. That vote count is so interesting.
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 07:30:46 pm
@Web: Have I slipped and revealed my role? I tried to be careful not to do so, but I think my posts may have accidentally revealed.I have a guess as to what you are, but it is fundamentally different from ToonyMan.
...Fuck it. You win, Toony. notquitethere.
Let's see how this tie shakes out.
Post by: webadict on March 03, 2023, 07:35:37 pm
Fluffe doesn't know.
a1s doesn't know.
notquitethere doesn't know.
Jim Groovester doesn't know.
EuchreJack doesn't know.
That actually eliminates a lot of teams.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 07:40:49 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 03, 2023, 08:01:05 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 08:17:17 pm
Re: EuchreJack's D1 meltdown: People have brought it up and used it to townread EuchreJack. I don't think it strongly indicates alignment in his favor. I could see him doing that as scum.I guess he is entitled to his opinion. But have he ever seen me do that as scum? Could he reference any particular game where I was successful with such a gambit? Or even unsuccessful? I mean, he should totally fill those holes, but my point is that he is not even trying to explain himself. And we were on a team together as mafia. Interesting that he doesn’t bring that up.
So, with this post, Jim is throwing shade on NQT. Trying to keep his options open, without actively attacking.Well, whatever. The question for me now is whether I should believe in the Toony and Jim who disbelieve in me.
... ehhhh, alea iacta est. You two better not be the team or I'll be mad.
notquitethere
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
But what does it mean when people I suspect suddenly join me in voting other people I suspect?
Hrrrrmmmm.
I have no idea what this is about. I think it exists just to mock and discredit NQT, making it easier to get the lynch on NQT by marginalizing him.This is fair, people do change their mind, but I was pointing out that Toony literally contradicted himself. He said there was something he liked in my play then later he said he had seen nothing he liked in my play all game. Well, maybe this is null and I'm being too sensitive as I'm the target of his slander here, but it felt to me that his play matched that of someone setting me up as a viable lynch candidate. You know, something he's just done.
'he said a nice thing about me and then he lied and said he never said nice things about me'
lmao its okay notquitethere, it'll all be okay, it's nothing to get sad about
This is an asinine argument over semantics that means nothing. Whether a player is building a proper case or tunneling doesn’t mean jack about their alignment. It also marginalizes NQT’s more valid point about how sometimes players tunnel as town.Motivated reasoning is a big danger in mafia, but it's also hard to avoid. We have a bad feeling about someone, we go looking and lo there are reasons to support that feeling. At the time I made that case that's about all I had to work with.
I understand, but what it should be, at least in my opinion, is 'my bad feelings are directly caused by these things' rather than 'i have a bad feeling, here is a collection of evidence that support that'. There's a difference between the two and by my reading you're admitting to doing the latter rather than the former.
Jim is doing two things here:Max - Lazy opportunistic wagoner whose defence is he's always like that.
Now THAT'S a barb and a not completely unconvincing one as well.
1) Jim is stirring the pot, feeding the argument between NQT and Max. Get them to kill each other.
2) Jim is establishing himself as the godfather that can tell you what to do. Jim says your argument is good, you good, capiche?
A mischaracterization of what I said by Jim. I never said only one scum between NQT Toonyman. At the time, I could totally see both NQT and Toony being scum. What I couldn’t see is NQT & Toony being both town. It appeared that Toony was actively trying to get NQT lynched, more than a simple “I gotta get someone who ain’t me lynched because I only know that I’m town” to the “Me bad mafia, gonna lynch town, he he he”. I am now rethinking this, only because I’m rethinking Toony due to Web rethinking Toony.So, if NQT flips town, we all lynch Toony, right? Right.
I'm going to keep my vote on Toony, but he's put in great effort to win everyone over, so I understand if folks decide to let him live. It's not like he didn't earn it.
Hrmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
Run me through how you think there is exactly one scum between notquitethere and ToonyMan.
Not really a fan of the either/or attitude here.
More mischaracterization, slander, and marginalization by Jim-bo.Hold up. I log back in and I'm the lynch lead? Serves me right for taking my foot off the pedal.Relevant: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=180323.0)
Toonyman, obviously. But I actually prefer actually-useless Fluffe as a candidate for today.
A thing people should know if they've been scum with me is that I don't actually like to bus. Especially at the start of the game, it's usually counterproductive. No way am I in a scum team with Jack. Firstly, I'm not scum. Secondly, I don't reckon he is either. Well probably not. But thirdly, if I was scum, I wouldn't have tried to launch him so hard on D1.
Anyway, I suspect that this kind of defence will not be well received. More in a bit.
In that game, NQT should have bussed hector13, but instead hard-defended. Town still lynched hector13, roleblocked NQT, then lynched NQT the next day for the win.
Thank you for providing evidence supporting the assertion that you and notquitethere are not likely to be on a scumteam together.
Why do you bring this up?
Why does this feel like it's answering questions nobody asked? I know people have theorized you and NQT as partners but I don't think people are executing Day 2 as if it's the dominant theory.
1) Pretty sure that backing up NQT’s argument would be an argument that it is MORE likely that we’re on a team together.
2) I brought it up because I noticed something due to an encounter with a player, and felt it would be relevant to town. You know, because I want town to WIN. It’s called “being helpful”. The opposite of what Jim is doing with this comment.
3) I was responding to NQT’s statement. Thus, at least one player had made a comment, so “questions nobody asked” is disingenuous. I will also add “Everyone stop talking” is a scumtell for Jim. I know that from our time as scumbuddies. I even made a role based upon that trait for Kill Jim Jack Tric Now. Why do you think I made Jim a Roleblocker?
Note that Jim left OUT the part of that message where I said the Toony Spam IS part of the evidence against Toony. I originally thought mafia!Toony was buddying town!Jim, but now I’m thinking mafia!Jim is buddying town!Toony.And furthermore, if you can wade through the 3+ pages of Toony Spam, you'll see that I have been making a case for Toony.
I have no idea what your case is on ToonyMan and I read Day 2 last night.
“Hey Fluffe9911, go waste your vote”If it's between Toon or NQT im going to vote ToonyMan although personally i'd rather vote A1 I just ain't gonna cause I feel trying to start a bus at this point for A1 would be futile and I don't actually have much in the way of evidence to back it up.
Why not vote a1s and see if you can convince people to join you?
Choosing a lynch often comes down to negotiation and compromises between players on who they are okay with removing from the game. You might find people to take you up on voting a1s (but not me).
The game got much more complicated since my last post. I have a lot of concern focused within notquitethere/Maximum Spin/EuchreJack.
I'll be traveling today to visit family so I might not be around as much. I probably miss the deadline tomorrow.
But out of all of the above, this is actually solid advice, and Jim did pick three for his person of interest, for whatever that is worth. But, it’s advice that is generally good, instead of touching on the specifics of this game.
Having read all that, has Jim taught me more about the game state? Uh, no.
Has Jim tried to bully, intimidate, and assert dominance? Oh yeah.
Thus, I am going to take Jim’s sage advice and vote Jim Groovester
Post by: EuchreJack on March 03, 2023, 08:28:48 pm
I am so confused.Let me get you an updated votecount
notquitethere --3-- Jim Groovester, Maximum Spin, webadict
Maximum Spin --3-- TricMagic, notquitethere, Toonyman
ToonyMan --2-- a1s, Fluffe9911
Jim Groovester --1-- EuchreJack
a1s --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
Webadict has decided that he can trust Toony due to !!secret!! knowledge above our security clearance.
I stopped voting Toony primarily because I trust Web, and started voting Jim because I recognize his scummy controlling behavior.
The Toony lynch currently lacks votes, and might not get them back, so now might be an ideal time for you to start building a case on someone else.
Personally, I don't see Max, but I have a blindspot for Max. I also don't see NQT.
I don't know anything about the roles, and we haven't been talking mechanics nor strategy to the degree that I would like, but some players are more valuable and less expendable than others. So it's possible Web & Toony votes are taking that into consideration.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 10:02:47 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 10:28:56 pm
The only other person who probably knows is Tric, and he's Town.It does. Tric should know, but it's hard to tell with the guy.
Fluffe doesn't know.
a1s doesn't know.
notquitethere doesn't know.
Jim Groovester doesn't know.
EuchreJack doesn't know.
That actually eliminates a lot of teams.
I'm convinced Jim and Tric are town and I'm putting my trust in Web.
Jim badno
Post by: ToonyMan on March 03, 2023, 11:48:18 pm
a1s
#112 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457023#msg8457023) - Jack votes a1s so they now have three votes. a1s goes "woe is me" and says they're already dead which upsets NQT immediately after.
I guess NQT looks worse than Jack here since Jack is attacking a1s while NQT is telling a1s to stand up and fight, but I could see town!NQT wanting to help, NQT also votes a1s later for the remainder of Day 1. Kind of null.
#115 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457030#msg8457030) - a1s votes Jack back and that's about it.
Pretty much all of a1s' posts are like this, short and simple. They vote Webadict later in basically the same way because I tell them to. They seem to be doing whatever the heck they want. Jack thinks they're like their play in their other game but doesn't seem to feel that strong about it. Webadict seems to usually think they're scum.
#179 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457162#msg8457162) - Near end of Day 1. a1s is at 4 votes. Jack is at 3 votes. a1s unvotes Jack and declares that when they die they will have said "I told you so" in advance.
This is the post that convinced me I didn't want to vote a1s for Day 1. Web, Max, NQT, and Fluffe are on a1s. Jim, a1s, and Tric are on Jack. Me and Jack aren't voting anybody. a1s unvotes and just...that's it, waits to die. I don't really see a case where this happens unless a1s is town or a1s is with Jack, but that would mean literally every vote in the game at that point was on a mafia member which is kind of absurd.
Fluffe
#85 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456883#msg8456883) - Fluffe doesn't want to vote anybody and thinks voting a1s is a bad idea since they haven't been around.
Null.
#156 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457126#msg8457126) - Fluffe is disgruntled that a1s isn't defending themselves or at least giving their view on things when asked.
Null.
#164 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457135#msg8457135) - Fluffe votes a1s since they found Jack's mini-outburst townie and are pretty disappointed with a1s' responses so far.
I think this is evidence that Fluffe isn't with a1s. I think Fluffe feels pretty independent here which Web supports later. Honestly in my opinion Fluffe is town as fuck or an amazing newbmafia.
Jack
#87 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456892#msg8456892) - Jack scolds Fluffe for not wanting to lynch anyone. Jack says they're "quite happy to eliminate" a1s if they don't show up and thinks it's gonna to suck when they inevitably show up near day end and we all scramble for a new lynch, so we should probably figure out secondary lynches in the meantime.
I think this is soft evidence that Jack isn't with a1s.
#120 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457044#msg8457044) - Jack jokingly attacks a1s after a1s votes them back.
This seems...really silly? Tric doesn't like Jack joking and suspects them more for it. This seeeems like evidence that Jack and a1s aren't together. a1s doesn't even know what a readslist is until NQT informs them.
#129 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457087#msg8457087) - Jack feels okay lynching a1s since a1s' lack of activity reminds them of their last game where they were scum.
I think this is evidence that Jack isn't with a1s.
#133 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457091#msg8457091) - Jack gives reads Town reads are Max, Tric, Fluffe. Neutral reads are NQT, Web, Jim. Suspicious read is Toony. Top suspect read is a1s.
I think this is evidence Jack isn't with a1s unless they're hella bussing for no benefit, especially in this setup. I think they're quite positive of NQT here even though they're in the neutral bracket.
#139 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457100#msg8457100) - Jack starts his outburst seemingly out of nowhere.
Jack was pretty calm beforehand, he just gave a reads list, informed a1s how to do a readslist, and stated how town Tric was. After that he starts yelling out of nowhere and says how me, Jim, and NQT are allowed to have fun and he isn't then says the scumteam is Jim and me. I ask Jack if he finds NQT suspicious and Jack kind of gives a non-answer.
NQT
#131 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457089#msg8457089) - NQT sarcastically counters Jack's suggestion.
I think NQT is right. Interaction is kind of null to me.
#151 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457118#msg8457118) - NQT responds to Jack's outburst by saying there's a nonzero chance it's town-centric and relates to the frustration. He then switches to a1s for the remainder of Day 1.
To be fair Max just said right before how Jack is most likely town which I also agreed with after. What annoys me here is later when I asked Jack about their a1s read they never responded to me until the day was over and I think they were definitely online long enough to at least reply to that. So we have NQT voting Jack and then switching to a1s and then Jack voting a1s for D1 end.
Other
Waves in Stem. Knowing I'm a stem doesn't really help, now that I think about it. I'm only suspicious if another died. And probably dead next night, so.. For all this, my suspison is NQT/Jack as the scumteam this time around. No lynch is a perfectly valid idea this early if you think you can get info. Relying on flowers is a valid method.... Ya know, sometimes, I think you're getting better, and then you do this, and I shake my head.
The funny part is he might be right, and I think Tric is the first person to suspect NQT/Jack here.Waves in Stem. Knowing I'm a stem doesn't really help, now that I think about it. I'm only suspicious if another died. And probably dead next night, so.. For all this, my suspison is NQT/Jack as the scumteam this time around. No lynch is a perfectly valid idea this early if you think you can get info. Relying on flowers is a valid method.Does NQT/Jack make sense as a scum team? I don't think it does.
Both Web (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8456989#msg8456989) and Jim (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457010#msg8457010) agreed with my statement here:
Hmm I like NQT's attitude towards Jack.I think this is soft evidence that NQT's case against Jack contained valid points since three veteran players liked it.
Conclusions?
1. Fluffe is really townie or an amazing newbmafia.
2. It doesn't feel like a1s is with anybody, Tric actually supports this later in D2 here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457928#msg8457928).
3. NQT/Jack seems the most viable in this pool of four players mainly due to Fluffe and a1s not really fitting.
4. Max is an unknown because I ignored them.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 04, 2023, 01:07:38 am
So don't fuck it up.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 04, 2023, 04:56:00 am
------------------------
notquitethere --3-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458102#msg8458102), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458322#msg8458322)
ToonyMan --2-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458207#msg8458207)
Maximum Spin --3-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), Toonyman* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458207#msg8458207)
Jim Groovester --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458332#msg8458332)
TricMagic --0--
a1s --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
Five to hammer. Day ends in approximately 8 hours, or at 18:00 GMT 4th March (12:00 CST).
Please correct me if wrong.
Post by: notquitethere on March 04, 2023, 05:41:23 am
Day 1 thoughts about a1s, Fluffe, Jack, and NQT.Looking for teams here is pointless because there aren't two scum in this pool, but I agree with one thing: on balance Fluff does look pretty town.
Well I watched the Sonic 2 movie like I said I would near the start of the game and now I am here. Let's read through this thread!!Your secret role reveal better not be Sonic The hEdgehog Movie because that's the dumbest clue, it doesn't even match up properly.
We might almost have enough votes cast for my famous vote analysis... we'll see.
Post by: TricMagic on March 04, 2023, 07:35:02 am
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 08:12:18 am
Vote CountHm, I think this might actually catch scum.
------------------------
notquitethere --3-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458102#msg8458102), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458322#msg8458322)
ToonyMan --2-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458207#msg8458207)
Maximum Spin --3-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), Toonyman* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458207#msg8458207)
Jim Groovester --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458332#msg8458332)
TricMagic --0--
a1s --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
Five to hammer. Day ends in approximately 8 hours, or at 18:00 GMT 4th March (12:00 CST).
Please correct me if wrong.
I think, between NQT and Max, one is scum.
The questions are: Which one?
Could it be both?
I also think we'll actually get info if we hit town, which I rate at 30% chance.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 08:19:16 am
OK I'm awake and active. We better not end this in another tie!Oh hey, you're awake. What is the point of this post?Day 1 thoughts about a1s, Fluffe, Jack, and NQT.Looking for teams here is pointless because there aren't two scum in this pool, but I agree with one thing: on balance Fluff does look pretty town.Well I watched the Sonic 2 movie like I said I would near the start of the game and now I am here. Let's read through this thread!!Your secret role reveal better not be Sonic The hEdgehog Movie because that's the dumbest clue, it doesn't even match up properly.
We might almost have enough votes cast for my famous vote analysis... we'll see.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 04, 2023, 10:42:15 am
Yeah, I don't really think Fluffe is mafia here. I think a1s being mafia is still possible. If you're really town NQT then is it actually Jack/a1s? This is a hard pill to swallow, but maybe Jack's best option is to throw a1s under the bus and just avoid the lynch for game. It would also explain a1s' attitude at EoD1. I would be more willing to accept this theory if I trusted NQT more, which I'm having a hard time doing.Day 1 thoughts about a1s, Fluffe, Jack, and NQT.Looking for teams here is pointless because there aren't two scum in this pool, but I agree with one thing: on balance Fluff does look pretty town.
How confident are you NQT that both mafia aren't within these four players?
No, that's dumb.Well I watched the Sonic 2 movie like I said I would near the start of the game and now I am here. Let's read through this thread!!Your secret role reveal better not be Sonic The hEdgehog Movie because that's the dumbest clue, it doesn't even match up properly.
I think, between NQT and Max, one is scum.You tell me, Jack.
The questions are: Which one?
Could it be both?
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 10:46:14 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 04, 2023, 12:07:19 pm
Frankly, I'm both confused and impressed that webadict pulling the equivalent of passing the uncomfortable chair check in Disco Elysium was enough to completely destroy the Tonny bus like I'm not sure if there is actually some secret that I missed or he just said it with such confidence that people think he is onto something even if he is actually just completely bullshiteing but hats off to you regardless.
(Semi relevant song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcEkS9tcIjg)
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:11:44 pm
I guess in the interest of attempting to not make this end in a tie since apparently that's bad for town ill change my vote to Maximum Spin (even though frankly I don't think it's either of them) see my previous statement though for why I really don't think it's NQT.Who do you think it is? I'll switch with you.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 04, 2023, 12:21:08 pm
a1 and maybe Jim or Toony (getting less confident about this though) we would need a third person to hop on the a1 train for that to have a chance though.I guess in the interest of attempting to not make this end in a tie since apparently that's bad for town ill change my vote to Maximum Spin (even though frankly I don't think it's either of them) see my previous statement though for why I really don't think it's NQT.Who do you think it is? I'll switch with you.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:23:47 pm
Let's see what happens if we try.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 04, 2023, 12:25:33 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 04, 2023, 12:26:05 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:30:54 pm
I feel like I have to vote Max at this point, but I'll switch to prevent ties, ideally onto one of Jack/NQT/a1s.If you switch, there won't be a tie. :P
Post by: ToonyMan on March 04, 2023, 12:36:15 pm
That's true. You cool with dying first if a1s flips town and people want our heads tomorrow?I feel like I have to vote Max at this point, but I'll switch to prevent ties, ideally onto one of Jack/NQT/a1s.If you switch, there won't be a tie. :P
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:37:28 pm
I won't be thrilled, but it's fair.That's true. You cool with dying first if a1s flips town and people want our heads tomorrow?I feel like I have to vote Max at this point, but I'll switch to prevent ties, ideally onto one of Jack/NQT/a1s.If you switch, there won't be a tie. :P
Post by: Mamobo on March 04, 2023, 12:42:58 pm
------------------------
-> Maximum Spin --3-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458233#msg8458233), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
a1s --2-- Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458460#msg8458460), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458462#msg8458462),
notquitethere --2-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458322#msg8458322),
Jim Groovester --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458332#msg8458332),
ToonyMan --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (0 hours and 15 minutes remaining.)
Post by: NJW2000 on March 04, 2023, 12:43:56 pm
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:44:19 pm
What now?
Also, Mamobo is NOT slow, so its time is correct.
Post by: Mamobo on March 04, 2023, 12:45:22 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458460#msg8458460), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458462#msg8458462), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458470#msg8458470),
-> Maximum Spin --3-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458233#msg8458233), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
Jim Groovester --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458332#msg8458332),
notquitethere --1-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090),
ToonyMan --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (0 hours and 12 minutes remaining.)
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:46:17 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 04, 2023, 12:48:19 pm
You guys wouldn't want another tie, would you?Not really, no.
I'll switch to a1s if nothing changes.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 12:48:31 pm
a1s
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:49:04 pm
I'm still here, I just wanna know if anyone wants to vote or push a different vote.You guys wouldn't want another tie, would you?Not really, no.
I'll switch to a1s if nothing changes.
Post by: Mamobo on March 04, 2023, 12:49:33 pm
------------------------
-> a1s --4-- Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458460#msg8458460), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458462#msg8458462), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458470#msg8458470), EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458474#msg8458474),
Maximum Spin --3-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458233#msg8458233), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
notquitethere --1-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090),
ToonyMan --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (0 hours and 8 minutes remaining.)
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 12:49:47 pm
Maybe I should vote Max, but that wagon seems weaker, and I'm sick of ties.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:50:03 pm
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:50:18 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 12:50:55 pm
notquitethere?
Too risky.
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:51:23 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 12:51:32 pm
Maximum Spin
Post by: ToonyMan on March 04, 2023, 12:52:27 pm
notquitethere?
Too risky.
Why?
Post by: Mamobo on March 04, 2023, 12:52:38 pm
------------------------
-> Maximum Spin --4-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458233#msg8458233), EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458483#msg8458483), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
a1s --2-- Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458460#msg8458460), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458462#msg8458462),
notquitethere --2-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458479#msg8458479),
ToonyMan --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (0 hours and 5 minutes remaining.)
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:53:30 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 12:53:55 pm
EuchreJackAt this point, that is a vote I can get behind... >:(
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:54:29 pm
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:54:39 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 04, 2023, 12:54:50 pm
Post by: webadict on March 04, 2023, 12:55:10 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:55:38 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 12:55:51 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 04, 2023, 12:56:04 pm
NQT
Post by: EuchreJack on March 04, 2023, 12:56:23 pm
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 04, 2023, 12:56:40 pm
Hey guys, why not let mafia decide? I mean, that is basically what you're doing?Not an option with this ruleset, or we would have had a much easier time reaching an ending.
Not a good ending, but at least it would be over.
Post by: Mamobo on March 04, 2023, 12:56:46 pm
------------------------
-> notquitethere --5-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458493#msg8458493), Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458494#msg8458494), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458496#msg8458496), EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458498#msg8458498),
Maximum Spin --2-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
a1s --1-- Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458462#msg8458462),
ToonyMan --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (0 hours and 1 minute remaining.)
Post by: NJW2000 on March 04, 2023, 12:57:34 pm
Post by: NJW2000 on March 04, 2023, 06:17:23 pm
notquitethere was a root.
Quote
You are town.
You are a Root. Once during the game, you may act at night to protect a chosen player, so that they survive to morning even if targeted by a kill. You may not self target.
Think carefully before using or revealing your role.
'The fibrous roots of Northern wormwood protect the plant from weeds and insects. They may be made into preserves or herbal teas, which while bitter have widely appreciated prophylactic benefits.'- Northwestern Territory Almanac, 1861
Night Two has begun.
The night will end at 9am GMT, or 3am CST, on the 6th March, in approximately 34 hours. Please send any actions to me by PM before this point, or "none" if you do not wish to act.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 06, 2023, 07:59:21 am
D A Y T H R E E
You wake from uneasy dreams, the cries of the innocent man torn to shreds by the townsfolk last night audible in the squealing of doorhinges and the creaking of floorboards.
One of your number does not come downstairs in the morning. You force entry to his room, finding vials of pungent chemicals, neat cuttings of Wormrotten plant matter, and a pallid corpse.
MaximumSpin was killed in the night.
MaximumSpin was a root.
MaximumSpin was mafia.
Vote Count
------------------------
a1s --0--
webadict --0--
ToonyMan --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --7--
Day 3 has begun. You may now post.
Four to hammer. Day ends in approximately 72 hours, or at 13:00 GMT 9th March (07:00 CST).
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 09:16:33 am
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:17:13 am
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 09:19:35 am
So, we have two choices: Massclaim and Elo, or don't claim and hope scum don't find the last Root.
Personally, I think the first option is best for a couple of reasons, but I'm not opposed to the second for other reasons.
And Tric, you're not Mafia, stfu.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:20:41 am
Suicide? I blocked them last night, so I expect a track claim to come up against me.Mafia can kill each other. There's no other way for mafia to die unless they deliberately kill one another, as far as I can tell.
NQT was correct to suspect Max.
Post by: a1s on March 06, 2023, 09:22:17 am
Also, I don't understand what is happening in this game! Why does the mafia kill a mafia? I'm assuming this is retribution for Town killing a town?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:23:00 am
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:24:13 am
I was going to use my ability on Max, now I'm glad I didn't....
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 09:24:48 am
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 09:27:07 am
I see...because Max was killed at night that dodges the rules and means if the last Root dies we lose.That's my take. Otherwise, a selfkill makes no sense.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:28:58 am
Suicide? I blocked them last night, so I expect a track claim to come up against me.Clearly a ruse by Tric why would he let us know he can't block anymore??
Right. So, they either thought Max was going to be voted out Today... or... They think this was the best way to hide the other scum?I mean it's not lylo technically if we can block the mafia tonight.
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 09:33:37 am
For the record Toony, you did the fire drill again. Somehow. Despite me warning about it, again. Your next target is a1s.Suicide? I blocked them last night, so I expect a track claim to come up against me.Clearly a ruse by Tric why would he let us know he can't block anymore??Right. So, they either thought Max was going to be voted out Today... or... They think this was the best way to hide the other scum?I mean it's not lylo technically if we can block the mafia tonight.
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 09:36:53 am
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:38:14 am
@Toony: True, but that's less viable for reasons. If we can narrow it down, we can win, but we might not have any extra blocks, so it's still giving scum a potential instant win.I still have my block.
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 10:05:42 am
Tric we should be able to win this game as long as it's literally not Web/Max, but that would be the most mindblowing play from them. Lynching me or Web today is an extremely bad idea for various reasons.... You do know that means it's a 50% chance it's one of you. Or me, but web has made his statement clear on that.@Toony: True, but that's less viable for reasons. If we can narrow it down, we can win, but we might not have any extra blocks, so it's still giving scum a potential instant win.I still have my block.
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 10:07:15 am
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 10:21:23 am
Yep.Tric we should be able to win this game as long as it's literally not Web/Max, but that would be the most mindblowing play from them. Lynching me or Web today is an extremely bad idea for various reasons.... You do know that means it's a 50% chance it's one of you. Or me, but web has made his statement clear on that.@Toony: True, but that's less viable for reasons. If we can narrow it down, we can win, but we might not have any extra blocks, so it's still giving scum a potential instant win.I still have my block.
Which also clears up web's statement about going all in on trusting you. There isn't any way to take advantage of your block but to trust you, but the fact you didn't use it is suspicious. Surely you had an idea of who it was?I had no idea who to block and figured the odds of mafia hitting the other Root were low enough that it would be the correct play.
Turns out it was the correct play.
I really don't think it's Tric or Web. I really really really really don't think it's Jim. a1s is confirmed town with the softclaim. That leaves Fluffe and Jack.
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 10:29:13 am
Now, the thing is, I could claim Root or I could claim Flower, but I probably have to stop lying for everyone's sake.
I'm a Flower. I tracked ToonyMan on Night 1, and he did nothing. I figured I could pressure you into admitting you were blocked, but I also didn't want the scum to learn who was what, so I tried to leave my being a Stem implied to see what I could learn about it.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 10:34:03 am
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 10:35:55 am
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/640911259474329601/1082326170416189531/image.png)
Into the fire you go Toony, it's the only way to make sure.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 10:42:25 am
I think we have to claim since a1s outed themselves without caution.Actually that was me under the impression that every Stem was known. The way a1s said it meant they had to be Root or Stem, but I guess they could still be a Stem now since Web isn't. Oops.
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 10:44:56 am
True, but my claiming was forced either way.I think we have to claim since a1s outed themselves without caution.Actually that was me under the impression that every Stem was known. The way a1s said it meant they had to be Root or Stem, but I guess they could still be a Stem now since Web isn't. Oops.
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 11:06:53 am
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 06, 2023, 11:26:12 am
Uhhhhhhhhhh uhhhh uhhhh am I on board with claiming uhh uhhhhh uhhhhhhhhhhh
I mean if webadict is on board with claiming truthfully (lmao) I mean I should be too uhh uhhhh uhhhhhhh
I think I want to reread the game before slinging claims around.
Toony
It's not ToonyMan, come on.
I had concerns within notquitethere/Maximum Spin/EuchreJack and now two out of those players are gone, leaving just EuchreJack as a lingering suspect, but I'll have to reread the game for clues now that Max has flipped.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 11:48:43 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 12:01:06 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 12:27:59 pm
After an interminable day of squabbles, oaths and accusations, the nine of you appear no closer to reaching an agreement than when you began.Going from day 1, NQT is town, Max is scum. I've assumed webadict is also town, Fluffe is likely town, Jack maybe town. Note that brings it down to Jim, a1s, and Toony.
In fact, you are still debating long after night has drawn over the sickening harvest, wan faces glowing in the weak lamplight. Slowly, in ones and twos, you withdraw to your rooms, the need for rest and sleep overcoming your finely honed sense of self-preservation.
Of course, not everyone plans on sleeping.
Vote Count
------------------------
-> a1s --3-- MaximumSpin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457085#msg8457085), notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457118#msg8457118),Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457135#msg8457135)
->Maximum Spin --1-- Webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457208#msg8457208)
->webadict --3-- Jim Groovester, Toonyman, a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457199#msg8457199)
->ToonyMan --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457210#msg8457210)
notquitethere --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --1-- EuchreJack
The day has ended in a drawn vote. No player will be eliminated.
The night will end at 11am GMT, or 5am CST, on the 1st March, in approximately 34 hours. Please send any actions to me by PM before this point, or "none" if you do not wish to act.
a1s was pushed into voting webaict, making it a push by Toony. Max was not online, nor was Jack.
Reads list:This quote is most interesting if assuming Jack is mafia. If so he's played really well.
MaximumSpin - Isn't trying to get me lynched
TricMagic - Seems like his town self. As said before, his scumself is more subdued
Fluffe9911 - Is trying to figure out their first game of forum mafia, is not hyper-defensive (would be a more normal behavior in first game as mafia). The desire to not vote wrong is normal for newbie town, whereas newbie scum tends to be bloodthirsty in voting
notquitethere - I think more likely to vote me Day 1 as town. Lack of graphs is concerning, but seems like a happy cloud instead of a nightmare cloud.
Webadict - Who knows? 50% chance is lying about being a stem, for whatever that is worth
Jim Groovester - Seems like an ass, and not the good kind.
ToonyMan - Doing that "Jack is town" then flipping the switch and going "nah, Jack is scum". Dunno if that is just normal Toony interrogation behavior, or maybe he just doesn't like me. Maybe I've been mafia too often, so he's just panicking.
a1s - Hasn't been around much, and hasn't contributed. Both things they did in the previous game as scum.
Vote CountJim, webadict, Max, Toony, Jack. Jim's the first vote for this. I'll move over to another suspect though.
------------------------
-> notquitethere --5-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458493#msg8458493), Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458494#msg8458494), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458496#msg8458496), EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458498#msg8458498),
Maximum Spin --2-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
a1s --1-- Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458462#msg8458462),
ToonyMan --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (0 hours and 1 minute remaining.)
Or you were protecting Max, it's why you said that there (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457184#msg8457184).A1s was asleep at the time of the vote, so the push didn't happen from them. Fluffe also wasn't part of it, and thinks it's a1s. Fluffe, look forward to your own post against a1s, though it's a competeing view. It does mark you as town however, with Max dead.
Vote ToonyMan/Maximum Spin 2023!
(inb4 I get murdered for being AFK: I'm going to sleep.)
tl;dr wtf why does everybody hate ToonyMan?Cut for length, though go read the entire thing. You know, like Toony forced you to do without any direction. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457734#msg8457734)postI don't like any of this. I think this is most disingenuous argument against me out of everyone, like you're an actor speaking on a stage.
How is ToonyMan scum when I agree with him more than any other player??????????
Reads:
Town:
TricMagic
a1s
Fluffe9911
ToonyMan
Lean Town:
EuchreJack
webadict
Don't like:
notquitethere
Maximum Spin
I thought somewhat positively about notquitethere until I read his Day 2 case justifying his vote on ToonyMan, which was pure garbage.
Fluffe9911 mocks me by saying I blend into the background but Maximum Spin has been less impressive during Day 2. Max's suspicions towards ToonyMan bother me but I dislike his read on a1s less; a feeling I've had regarding his read on a1s is that after trying for a1s on Day 1 (and doing fuckall during the CFD) he's boxed in to keep suspecting a1s which doesn't feel exceptionally genuine to me. I want to reread the game to verify and refine this opinion though.
I think a1s and TricMagic are town but I really don't know what either of them are on about by voting ToonyMan.
I should be engaging webadict since the posts he's making like he has his finger on the trigger of the gun pointed at ToonyMan don't feel as perfectly reasoned as I feel like they should be but I'm also struggling to articulate particular objections.
Going to go with notquitethere and also ask people not to lynch ToonyMan.
Or maybe here would be better. Links upon links upon links (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458361#msg8458361), with a bit of blurb, not even a proper wall.
Getting back to Jim's post, his vote is on MS, which would either be already planned to kill them, planned to bus them. But completely unlikely, check the Razor (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor). As the first vote, and no shift, the chances are very slim that Jim was partners with Max.
Lo and behold, by assuming Webadict is town, I have managed to cut down every other possibilty, simply off the vote counts. Voting your partner is good smokescreening, but pointless as you never planned to vote them off unless you absolutely had to. You saw an opportunity, and chose to take it Toonyman.
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 12:54:41 pm
Anyway it's Jim or Web I'll give my logic when I get back home God two days have passed and I'm still fuming!You're gonna have to make a good case if you think it's Jim, considering he and I were both trying to Fire Drill Max Day 1.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 01:00:45 pm
Fluffe, look forward to your own post against a1s, though it's a competeing view. It does mark you as town however, with Max dead.You aint gonna get one cause now I'm certain it aint a1 I gave Max three people to choose from and they choose 1i and it's only by webadict changing the voting target and everyone just hopping aboard (for some feken reason) that a1 avoided getting lynched.
Ok I remembered it before the Toony train crashed max was the 4th person to vote to "Keep the pressure high, don't back off." now why the hell would a mafia do this to his fellow mafia member? All it would of taken was a SINGLE person to jump on for Toony to get lynched and it wasn't until the next day that he backed off due to people starting to change their votes. I don't believe mafia would take such a stupid risk like this.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 01:08:11 pm
You're gonna have to make a good case if you think it's Jim, considering he and I were both trying to Fire Drill Max Day 1.The hell are you talking about? Your gonna have to link me to a post cause the only "Fire Drill Max" I see is near the end of D1 where he voted for max for like 20 minutes with almost no convention before switching to you. Like maybe im misunderstanding what "Fire Drill" means but if that is meant to put pressure on a mafia it is an extremely half-assed attempt.
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 01:14:30 pm
Fluffe, look forward to your own post against a1s, though it's a competeing view. It does mark you as town however, with Max dead.You aint gonna get one cause now I'm certain it aint a1 I gave Max three people to choose from and they choose 1i and it's only by webadict changing the voting target and everyone just hopping aboard (for some feken reason) that a1 avoided getting lynched.Anyway I swear I had a reason for why it is probably not Toony but I seemed to of completely forgot it on the ride home so
Ok I remembered it before the Toony train crashed max was the 4th person to vote to "Keep the pressure high, don't back off." now why the hell would a mafia do this to his fellow mafia member? All it would of taken was a SINGLE person to jump on for Toony to get lynched and it wasn't until the next day that he backed off due to people starting to change their votes. I don't believe mafia would take such a stupid risk like this.
Distancing. Hard. Day 1 was not a good look for Toony, and Max's vote does exactly what you're drinking, WIFOM.
As is web is probably all in on his insanity train and not going to vote Toony even as the evidence has stacked up. So we need 5 people who aren't Toony or web to actually get Toony out. (I'm one of them, a1s is likely.)
And keep in mind I hammered Toony yesterday. Or thought so at the time. He lived.
It's very interesting that as soon as Jim voted NQT Max hopped on that wagon.
He didn't hammer, just "kept on the pressure." ... Ya know, it's not much pressure if he literally never makes a case.UnvoteNo, I don't like this. ToonyMan
Keep the pressure high, don't back off.
Quote
Like Max, NQT is also dead thanks to mafia. This may not be up to date, but give a listen, which of these are mafia?I think NQT is my top pick if I'm killed suddenly. I think his votes on Jack and a1s during D1 are suspicious and same for their vote on me today. Like Jack and a1s are both voting me today but now NQT says scum are inside Fluffe/Jim/Max/Me. I would like to be more articulate if I could.
Ninja. That is what a CFD boils down to. Ha to make a vote, so Jim made a vote.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 01:19:08 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 01:19:27 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 01:23:42 pm
Uh, didn't Tric just hammer?This. This right here? It's a Mafia post, fullstop. Try and end discussion.
Conga line of following votes. Does this seem like town?
Fluffe9911 mocks me by saying I blend into the background but Maximum Spin has been less impressive during Day 2.Maybe I have. That's probably fair. There's nothing I hate more than Day One Again. Several times now I've thought about making a post and then just... didn't bother. It feels pointless.
A lot of the rest of what you said about me is off-base. For one thing I don't even care about a1s right now. But honestly, that's probably my bad for keeping my thoughts to myself.
Well, whatever. The question for me now is whether I should believe in the Toony and Jim who disbelieve in me.
... ehhhh, alea iacta est. You two better not be the team or I'll be mad.
notquitethere
I mean, I could be down, EuchreJack
a1s.
Let's see what happens if we try.
Okay, I think you need me for this too, so notquitethereIt is clearly not, and no message in this time frame was a push against toony, or any of them. You'd have to mark Jim for it. A vote at the beggining of the day to "keep the pressure on" is not one town is ever going to hammer. We want time to discuss things. Toony never cracked, and instead focues on Max. Which was one of the only things he could do to stay alive long-term, as his CFD results put him firmly on my radar. That was and will never be Town Play to swing the votes entirely off of their partner.
Nin. Web's dismissed Jim, which doesn't really leave any option but a1s. (Who was freaking asleep and couldn't shift the votes. I was too when it happened. It can only be one of those four, and Jack wasn't pushing it.)
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 01:31:14 pm
Toony, who do you think is most likely to be mafia?I think it's more likely to be a Flower because mafia killing each other on a night where people are likely to fire their actions is super risky if a Flower catches them. We're dealing with very devious players here, I think they would be accounting for if there was two or three town flowers. It's not a guarantee obviously. Between Fluffe and Jack I'm more suspicious of Fluffe actually since a Max/Jack team benefits less from this action? I can't tell currently I need to look into it.
Throws hands into the air Fine maybe mafia are just stupid! I'll give Toonyman a shot but if it ain't him I expect you to help me figure out who it is between Web and Jim and if you somehow think it's someone else im strangling you metaphorically.Stop throwing votes around willy-nilly, mafia can and will quickhammer me if they're sure there's no other blocks left.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 01:32:18 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 01:37:13 pm
I'm at school so can't make a long post but did you guys seriously have to lynch the one guy I was almost certain was town at that point?!? Did not a single one of you read my post or think it made sense and if not why the hell did you not attack me for it! I'd vote Max right now if he was still alive god I can't believe that happened.I read your townread of NQT and liked it, this is what makes mafia hard.
Post by: a1s on March 06, 2023, 01:38:19 pm
I don't really think Jack is scum
That being said, why not Max?
I'll be switching to a1s if they don't move to Webadict, that is.
Fine. Webadict
a1s: Whom would you like to see eliminated today?Toony and Max seem the most suspicious to me
Vote ToonyMan/Maximum Spin 2023!
So, now that Max is dead, my vote must go (back) to b]ToonyMan[/b].
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 01:38:32 pm
Stop throwing votes around willy-nilly, mafia can and will quickhammer me if they're sure there's no other blocks left.Convince Tric to back off and ill back off I don't know if you can tell but I been getting increasingly furious over the NQT vote the more I engage with this game people completely ignored my reasoning without trying to even attack it and now we got a town I was sure was a town dead. Also it's not me or Jack and this may sound pretentious but the fact you think im suspicious at all at this point is frankly absurd.
I read your townread of NQT and liked it, this is what makes mafia hard.THEN WHY DID YA VOTE FOR HIM! Die.
Post by: a1s on March 06, 2023, 01:39:51 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 06, 2023, 01:40:06 pm
Quote
ToonyMan at L-1
Fucking morons.
I FOLLOWED TOONYMAN DURING N2 AND HE WENT NOWHERE
HE CANNOT BE MAX'S PARTNER
REMOVE ALL YOUR VOTES
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 01:40:16 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 06, 2023, 01:41:03 pm
Post by: a1s on March 06, 2023, 01:41:18 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 01:43:57 pm
Seriously why do none of you understand the consequences of putting somebody at L-1 in a game where the mafia only need to kill one player to win.I understand the consequences I just don't give a shit cause im not in the mental state to feel anything but unbridled rage right now. I'll unvote for now since ya gave some proof it ain't him and im gonna take a couple of hours to calm down. I hope you feel goddamn silly Jim
Post by: a1s on March 06, 2023, 01:44:56 pm
Suicide? I blocked them last night, so I expect a track claim to come up against me.
Are you both sure you want to claim this?QuoteToonyMan at L-1I FOLLOWED TOONYMAN DURING N2 AND HE WENT NOWHERE
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 01:48:00 pm
Can we all put our heads together now and figure out who last mafia is?
Why would you vote me if you said earlier you had a case for it being Web or Jim? Feeding into Tric's nonsense is almost always a losing play.Seriously why do none of you understand the consequences of putting somebody at L-1 in a game where the mafia only need to kill one player to win.I understand the consequences I just don't give a shit cause im not in the mental state to feel anything but unbridled rage right now. I'll unvote for now since ya gave some proof it ain't him and im gonna take a couple of hours to calm down. I hope you feel goddamn silly Jim
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 06, 2023, 01:50:27 pm
Suicide? I blocked them last night, so I expect a track claim to come up against me.Are you both sure you want to claim this?QuoteToonyMan at L-1I FOLLOWED TOONYMAN DURING N2 AND HE WENT NOWHERE
No I didn't want to claim it but great job putting somebody I know is confirmed town at L-1 so great work there.
Seriously why do none of you understand the consequences of putting somebody at L-1 in a game where the mafia only need to kill one player to win.I understand the consequences I just don't give a shit cause im not in the mental state to feel anything but unbridled rage right now. I'll unvote for now since ya gave some proof it ain't him and im gonna take a couple of hours to calm down. I hope you feel goddamn silly Jim
Not in the slightest.
Calm down. It's a game.
Post by: a1s on March 06, 2023, 02:01:05 pm
Tric has admitted there is a trace from them to Max. That is suspicious.
Jim would know Toony is town if he was Mafia.
I don't think Fluffe is Mafia- there's no good point in lynching Toony as Mafia, all 3 stems are still alive (it would be better to kill someone in the damaged parts of the plant.)
I just said I didn't believe Jack was mafia, though I kinda forgot why. I trust my past self.
That leaves web, who hasn't posted since daybreak. Is that suspicious? I don't think so, but most of you do.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 02:01:42 pm
Why would you vote me if you said earlier you had a case for it being Web or Jim? Feeding into Tric's nonsense is almost always a losing play.Cause im (pretty) sure Tric is town and there reasoning seemed good enough even if I wasn't completely convinced although now that Jim pulled that I don't think it's him or you either which leaves in my mind only webadict until someone inevitably convinces me it ain't him and im just left confused.
Not in the slightest.Yeah got a bit too heated there sorry about that also I thought I was making a reference to one of your earlier posts but turns out you were talking about Toony not NQT my bad.
Calm down. It's a game.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 02:28:50 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 02:30:11 pm
Quote
The mafia have a shared kill action, which either of them may use each night. This kills the target. If both mafia are alive, they must both agree on how the kill is used for it to take place. The mafia kill may be used on another member of the mafia. The mafia are not obliged to use their kill action every night. No single mafia player can use both a kill and another action on the same night.
No player may self-target.
Post by: webadict on March 06, 2023, 02:46:37 pm
Ok, if Toony is not mafia, who is?Yeah, I normally never post ever, so that's understandable, except for the times I do, but definitely not ever.
Tric has admitted there is a trace from them to Max. That is suspicious.
Jim would know Toony is town if he was Mafia.
I don't think Fluffe is Mafia- there's no good point in lynching Toony as Mafia, all 3 stems are still alive (it would be better to kill someone in the damaged parts of the plant.)
I just said I didn't believe Jack was mafia, though I kinda forgot why. I trust my past self.
That leaves web, who hasn't posted since daybreak. Is that suspicious? I don't think so, but most of you do.
I, personally, don't see web as scum, but I'm extremely biased. I do appreciate that people think he's good enough to stop his partner from being executed at Day end and then escape an execution at the last minute, too. I like thinking he has little strands of webs that can control everyone subtly. I'd have to argue that, if he's scum, he's either extremely lucky, or he's just the best (or possibly worst?) Mafia ever. It's really a tough call on that.Why would you vote me if you said earlier you had a case for it being Web or Jim? Feeding into Tric's nonsense is almost always a losing play.Cause im (pretty) sure Tric is town and there reasoning seemed good enough even if I wasn't completely convinced although now that Jim pulled that I don't think it's him or you either which leaves in my mind only webadict until someone inevitably convinces me it ain't him and im just left confused.
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 02:49:06 pm
Least the pressure got something. K, so it's not Toony. Nor is it Jim cause he could have let it go.
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 02:52:21 pm
Could be webadict. Just sayin.
More seriously, I've already gone over things beforehand. With Jim vouching for Toony.. Could it be Jack...
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 06:31:45 pm
So, it appears Toony & Jim are cleared.
Tric's still town.
So it comes down to Fluffe991, a1s, or webadict.
Any reason it's definitely not web?
Post by: NJW2000 on March 06, 2023, 06:56:29 pm
------------------------
a1s --0--
webadict --0--
ToonyMan --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
EuchreJack --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
TricMagic --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --7--
Four to hammer. Day ends in approximately 61 hours, or at 13:00 GMT 9th March (07:00 CST).
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 07:21:19 pm
We can probably conclude Jim is telling the truth about his tracking Toony, since he chose to jump in and scream at everyone instead of hammering.End of Day 1. That was a complete mess.
So, it appears Toony & Jim are cleared.
Tric's still town.
So it comes down to Fluffe991, a1s, or webadict.
Any reason it's definitely not web?
Was also waiting for you to make that comment Jack. Either you or a1s.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 07:38:11 pm
Point.We can probably conclude Jim is telling the truth about his tracking Toony, since he chose to jump in and scream at everyone instead of hammering.End of Day 1. That was a complete mess.
So, it appears Toony & Jim are cleared.
Tric's still town.
So it comes down to Fluffe991, a1s, or webadict.
Any reason it's definitely not web?
Was also waiting for you to make that comment Jack. Either you or a1s.
Web could have just let a1s die, instead tried to get the Lynch onto Max. Whom we now know is Mafia.
I figure that is enough to put Web onto the Do Not Vote list.
So for me, it's a1s vs. Fluffe9911
Actually, for me, I think that is the best option for this Day phase.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 07:46:10 pm
So for me, it's a1s vs. Fluffe9911Why would I defend NQT if I was a mafia.
Actually, for me, I think that is the best option for this Day phase.
Also see below for a reminder of why I don't think it's a1 anymore.
You aint gonna get one cause now I'm certain it aint a1 I gave Max three people to choose from and they choose a1 and it's only by webadict changing the voting target and everyone just hopping aboard (for some feken reason) that a1 avoided getting lynched.I don't think Max would choose their own mafia buddy on that day as a last minute voting target to save their own skin, especially when given two other perfectly valid options.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 07:48:40 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 07:52:34 pm
@Fluffe9911: So who's Mafia?The literally only option I can think of is webadict if it aint him then I frankly don't know maybe tric's been pulling us along for a ride secretly this whole time.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 07:56:15 pm
@Fluffe9911: Care to elaborate on your voting history?
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 07:58:20 pm
Damn, I wish NQT was alive to do vote analysis.Yeah, I do as well I REALLY do.
@Fluffe9911: Care to elaborate on your voting history?Sure what part needs elaborating?
Post by: TricMagic on March 06, 2023, 08:07:40 pm
Then again.
There won't be another day phase Jack. Did your partner dying mess with you?Point.We can probably conclude Jim is telling the truth about his tracking Toony, since he chose to jump in and scream at everyone instead of hammering.End of Day 1. That was a complete mess.
So, it appears Toony & Jim are cleared.
Tric's still town.
So it comes down to Fluffe991, a1s, or webadict.
Any reason it's definitely not web?
Was also waiting for you to make that comment Jack. Either you or a1s.
Web could have just let a1s die, instead tried to get the Lynch onto Max. Whom we now know is Mafia.
I figure that is enough to put Web onto the Do Not Vote list.
So for me, it's a1s vs. Fluffe9911
Actually, for me, I think that is the best option for this Day phase.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 09:00:44 pm
I wish I was at this point.Let me know when you catch up. I ain't the scum here.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:04:38 pm
I don't think there's a reason to conceal your role especially when a1s is most likely our Root anyway.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:11:42 pm
We can probably conclude Jim is telling the truth about his tracking Toony, since he chose to jump in and scream at everyone instead of hammering.Jim is most likely town, yes. We literally aren't winning if they're mafia because they're the one player who actually helps me.
So, it appears Toony & Jim are cleared.
Current feelings:
Jim is town. Tric is town. Web is town. a1s is town.
More likely to vote Fluffe, if we're wrong then I block Jack tonight. Thus sealing the game as long as we can guess correct within two players.
I want to read the game over again while looking closely at Fluffe and Jack. Web is like a distant third I guess, but I'm really not seeing it.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 09:15:06 pm
Try to convince me it's Webadict, I'm listening.@Fluffe9911: So who's Mafia?The literally only option I can think of is webadict if it aint him then I frankly don't know maybe tric's been pulling us along for a ride secretly this whole time.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 09:36:40 pm
Damn, I wish NQT was alive to do vote analysis.Yeah, I do as well I REALLY do.@Fluffe9911: Care to elaborate on your voting history?Sure what part needs elaborating?
My apologies, but it looked like you were following Max the mafia for a minute there.
I am curious why you didn't hammer Toony on Day 2.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 09:41:55 pm
More likely to vote Fluffe, if we're wrong then I block Jack tonight. Thus sealing the game as long as we can guess correct within two players.
Assuming you don't get an answer from Fluffe, sounds like a solid plan.
I would like Fluffe to claim first, as I know my claim won't help anything, not like Jim tracking you at any rate.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 09:43:35 pm
Try to convince me it's Webadict, I'm listening.I can't my logic is based off who I think it aint rather than who I think it is Webadict is simply the only guy in my head right now I don't got a strong reason to think ain't bad right now.
Can everyone claim?I mean if mafia kill the root tonight it's game over so having them have to guess who among us is the Root rather than mass claiming is probably a good idea.
I don't think there's a reason to conceal your role especially when a1s is most likely our Root anyway.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 09:47:14 pm
My apologies, but it looked like you were following Max the mafia for a minute there.Because I simply lacked the confidence too at the time as previously iterated while this aint my first time playing mafia games (and infact I have tons of hours in mafia and mafia like games) this is my first time playing such a slow-paced version of mafia on this here forums I didn't wanna fuck up.
I am curious why you didn't hammer Toony on Day 2.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 09:51:57 pm
Was there a point later that you would have hammered Toony?My apologies, but it looked like you were following Max the mafia for a minute there.Because I simply lacked the confidence too at the time as previously iterated while this aint my first time playing mafia games (and infact I have tons of hours in mafia and mafia like games) this is my first time playing such a slow-paced version of mafia on this here forums I didn't wanna fuck up.
I am curious why you didn't hammer Toony on Day 2.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 09:55:27 pm
Was there a point later that you would have hammered Toony?Considering I tried to hop on a train to murder them a couple of hours ago I say yes that point is passed now that Jim pretty much proved both him and Toony as town though.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 10:41:42 pm
I mean if mafia kill the root tonight it's game over so having them have to guess who among us is the Root rather than mass claiming is probably a good idea.Let me rephrase my question.
a1s is almost certainly the Root, but on the weird off chance either you or Jack is the Root then all you literally have to do is claim Root and you're confirmed town and thus win the argument against the other.
I want to know which one of you is the last Stem, and which one of you is the last Flower.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 10:45:44 pm
Tric - Stem
NQT - Town Root
Max - Mafia Root
a1s - almost certainly Root
Web - Flower
Jim - Flower
Jack - ?
Fluffe - ?
There isn't any wiggle room at this point, we can't hide who last Root is.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 10:47:36 pm
I mean if mafia kill the root tonight it's game over so having them have to guess who among us is the Root rather than mass claiming is probably a good idea.
Let me rephrase my question.
a1s is almost certainly the Root, but on the weird off chance either you or Jack is the Root then all you literally have to do is claim Root and you're confirmed town and thus win the argument against the other.
I want to know which one of you is the last Stem, and which one of you is the last Flower.
But confirming either of us doesn't help us find the mafia does it? Like I aint the Root but in the off chance Jack is the Root id rather mafia have that uncertainty about it I rather not potentially throw the game by role claiming unless it is 100% guaranteed to net us a mafia.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 06, 2023, 10:49:43 pm
I mean if mafia kill the root tonight it's game over so having them have to guess who among us is the Root rather than mass claiming is probably a good idea.
Let me rephrase my question.
a1s is almost certainly the Root, but on the weird off chance either you or Jack is the Root then all you literally have to do is claim Root and you're confirmed town and thus win the argument against the other.
I want to know which one of you is the last Stem, and which one of you is the last Flower.
But confirming either of us doesn't help us find the mafia does it? Like I aint the Root but in the off chance Jack is the Root id rather mafia have that uncertainty about it I rather not potentially throw the game by role claiming unless it is 100% guaranteed to net us a mafia.
I'd rather not waste my time thinking whether a player is mafia if they're confirmed town.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 10:52:55 pm
I'd rather not waste my time thinking whether a player is mafia if they're confirmed town.Well too bad cause I aint role claiming unless Jack does and at that point you already know what I am. You don't need my damn role to figure out if im good or not I like to think my past actions is already enough evidence.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 06, 2023, 11:21:59 pm
Ok, if Toony is not mafia, who is?
Tric has admitted there is a trace from them to Max. That is suspicious.
Jim would know Toony is town if he was Mafia.
I don't think Fluffe is Mafia- there's no good point in lynching Toony as Mafia, all 3 stems are still alive (it would be better to kill someone in the damaged parts of the plant.)
I just said I didn't believe Jack was mafia, though I kinda forgot why. I trust my past self.
That leaves web, who hasn't posted since daybreak. Is that suspicious? I don't think so, but most of you do.
Would a1s have a better understanding of the state of the game if he were on a team with another player?
Also see below for a reminder of why I don't think it's a1 anymore.You aint gonna get one cause now I'm certain it aint a1 I gave Max three people to choose from and they choose a1 and it's only by webadict changing the voting target and everyone just hopping aboard (for some feken reason) that a1 avoided getting lynched.I don't think Max would choose their own mafia buddy on that day as a last minute voting target to save their own skin, especially when given two other perfectly valid options.
We're talking about a player who either concocted or at minimum endorsed a plan that left him the target of his own team's night kill. Assuming Maximum Spin would perform the most straightforward action is poor reasoning.
@MOD: Can the Mafia self-kill? I think this is something we should all know.
Why does EuchreJack ask this? Does he want to confirm my assertion that ToonyMan is town or cast doubt on it?
Reads:
Confirmed Town:
ToonyMan
Town:
TricMagic
Lean Town:
a1s
Fluffe9911
webadict
Zone of Uncertainty:
EuchreJack
I need to reread the game, but EuchreJack keeps coming up as I think about the game as the player whose play bothers me the most and the likeliest Max partner for whatever reason.
ToonyMan literally cannot be scum from my role results. I'm pretty sure TricMagic is town. Fluffe9911's anger at notquitethere's mislynch feels genuine, so it's hard to see him getting worked up about that if he's on a team with Max and they agree Max is the right person to nightkill. a1s feels confused and if I'm Max I'm not sure I entrust the success of this gambit with a1s. I've felt webadict is town before and my opinion hasn't changed but I don't perfectly recall why I feel that way. Him saying he's a bad team member for Maximum Spin because he tried to steer the CFD onto him rings true at least. Jack is... I have literally nothing to say about Jack.
I need to reread the game.
I'd rather not waste my time thinking whether a player is mafia if they're confirmed town.Well too bad cause I aint role claiming unless Jack does and at that point you already know what I am. You don't need my damn role to figure out if im good or not I like to think my past actions is already enough evidence.
The targets of any Night 2 block claims and the targets of any N2 track claims that don't lead to Max are confirmed town and can be crossed off the suspects list. This would help out a lot with some of the less certain cases.
It's also possible that scum were prevented from killing during N1, so N1 block claims can be useful in narrowing down who the remaining scum is.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 11:25:18 pm
Sir, I shall take you up on that offer!I'd rather not waste my time thinking whether a player is mafia if they're confirmed town.Well too bad cause I aint role claiming unless Jack does and at that point you already know what I am. You don't need my damn role to figure out if im good or not I like to think my past actions is already enough evidence.
I am a Flower. I tracked Jim, and saw him visit Toony.
I think, if folks look at how I have acted throughout the game, it should support that I was a tracker all along.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 06, 2023, 11:31:06 pm
I mean if mafia kill the root tonight it's game over so having them have to guess who among us is the Root rather than mass claiming is probably a good idea.Let me rephrase my question.
a1s is almost certainly the Root, but on the weird off chance either you or Jack is the Root then all you literally have to do is claim Root and you're confirmed town and thus win the argument against the other.
I want to know which one of you is the last Stem, and which one of you is the last Flower.
I had thought that was a decent enough clue, but I guess not. Deferring to confirmed townies, and giving Jim the info he needs when he re-reads the game.More likely to vote Fluffe, if we're wrong then I block Jack tonight. Thus sealing the game as long as we can guess correct within two players.
Assuming you don't get an answer from Fluffe, sounds like a solid plan.
I would like Fluffe to claim first, as I know my claim won't help anything, not like Jim tracking you at any rate.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 06, 2023, 11:35:06 pm
Sir, I shall take you up on that offer!Alright then well there you go now you know what role I am also I will add that I have not used my ability yet.
I am a Flower. I tracked Jim, and saw him visit Toony.
I think, if folks look at how I have acted throughout the game, it should support that I was a tracker all along.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 06, 2023, 11:40:36 pm
I am a Flower. I tracked Jim, and saw him visit Toony.
Why me on N2?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 12:07:45 am
I suspected you were Mafia.I am a Flower. I tracked Jim, and saw him visit Toony.
Why me on N2?
I was impressed that you tracked Toony. Didn't think you suspected him.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 12:10:12 am
Vote Count
------------------------
-> Maximum Spin --3-- notquitethere* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458186#msg8458186), ToonyMan* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458233#msg8458233), TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457999#msg8457999),
a1s --2-- Maximum Spin* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458460#msg8458460), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458462#msg8458462),
notquitethere --2-- Jim Groovester* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458090#msg8458090), webadict* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458322#msg8458322),
Jim Groovester --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8458332#msg8458332),
ToonyMan --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457714#msg8457714),
EuchreJack --0--
Fluffe9911 --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --0--
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (0 hours and 15 minutes remaining.)
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 01:09:40 am
Interesting.Sir, I shall take you up on that offer!Alright then well there you go now you know what role I am also I will add that I have not used my ability yet.
I am a Flower. I tracked Jim, and saw him visit Toony.
I think, if folks look at how I have acted throughout the game, it should support that I was a tracker all along.
New plan.
We lynch Web today.
I block Fluffe tonight.
Fluffe blocks Jack tonight.
If Web is mafia we win.
If Fluffe is mafia then he can't kill a1s and we go to D4 to decide between Fluffe and Jack.
If Jack is mafia then blocks can't stop blocks so Fluffe stops Jack from killing a1s and we go to D4 to decide between Fluffe and Jack.
This way we can remove Web as a possible suspect while still getting a choice between Fluffe and Jack if it's not him. Web should be okay with this because he can give as much thoughts as he wants about Jack and Fluffe if he's town.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 01:17:10 am
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 01:35:42 am
Tric blocking Max last night is the most Tric thing ever since it's the second worst thing he could have done N2.
Jim is just town.
a1s is confirmed town.
I'm not looking at these players, if it's one of them then whatever we lose. Tric is the most likely, but he's acting so much like himself.
Possible partners are Jack, Fluffe, and Webadict. What makes me uncomfortable is that mafia willingly chose to kill Max, so they were confident enough to go for this play. This also suggests to me that mafia have a Flower which I think makes Jack and Web more suspect.
I am seriously considering Web here I think because Web/Max totally does this, and I want to hear his insight about the other two.
Fluffe ranges from feeling really town to I don't know what this guy is thinking.
Jack has been relatively suspicious this whole game and treated me bad on D2, although this might have been because they're mad at me?
To do in the future:
1. Max/Web - thoughts
2. Max/Jack - thoughts
3. Max/Fluffe - thoughts
We just need to be right within two players.
Post by: a1s on March 07, 2023, 02:46:27 am
I want to know which one of you is the last Stem, and which one of you is the last Flower.I am the last Stem. And I still have my block.
Post by: TricMagic on March 07, 2023, 07:48:23 am
Hi, bzzt. Wronganswer.Sir, I shall take you up on that offer!I'd rather not waste my time thinking whether a player is mafia if they're confirmed town.Well too bad cause I aint role claiming unless Jack does and at that point you already know what I am. You don't need my damn role to figure out if im good or not I like to think my past actions is already enough evidence.
I am a Flower. I tracked Jim, and saw him visit Toony.
I think, if folks look at how I have acted throughout the game, it should support that I was a tracker all along.
Post by: TricMagic on March 07, 2023, 07:52:16 am
Then read A1s is the last stem, which makes Fluffe the Root and completely within reason not to reveal that.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 08:07:13 am
And I'm the mayor of Whoville.I want to know which one of you is the last Stem, and which one of you is the last Flower.I am the last Stem. And I still have my block.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 08:54:35 am
This should havve been info you gave us earlier. It's not, rather, you just came up with it as a way to survive. Are you sure you're thinking things through?It wasn't my fault that Toony & Jim's reveal predates my logging in.
Then read A1s is the last stem, which makes Fluffe the Root and completely within reason not to reveal that.
Post by: TricMagic on March 07, 2023, 10:12:38 am
... That isn't Jackspeak. What did you do with the real EucrheJack?This should havve been info you gave us earlier. It's not, rather, you just came up with it as a way to survive. Are you sure you're thinking things through?It wasn't my fault that Toony & Jim's reveal predates my logging in.
Then read A1s is the last stem, which makes Fluffe the Root and completely within reason not to reveal that.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 10:15:16 am
Fuck you, Tric... That isn't Jackspeak. What did you do with the real EucrheJack?This should havve been info you gave us earlier. It's not, rather, you just came up with it as a way to survive. Are you sure you're thinking things through?It wasn't my fault that Toony & Jim's reveal predates my logging in.
Then read A1s is the last stem, which makes Fluffe the Root and completely within reason not to reveal that.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 11:24:43 am
Post by: TricMagic on March 07, 2023, 11:27:08 am
I'd consider that a mafia win even if I technically lose then.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 11:28:35 am
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 11:33:19 am
Fluffe didn't seem to notice at all because they responded to my question with reads.Here. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457964#msg8457964)
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 12:45:21 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 01:04:57 pm
Fluffe didn't seem to notice at all because they responded to my question with reads.I mean I knew you weren't hammered because I knew NQT changed his vote to me even double-checked once Tric/Max started acting confused about it to make sure.
Here. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457964#msg8457964)
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 02:42:34 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 02:44:04 pm
Okay, so Max knows...Regarding Toony's role
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 02:45:53 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 05:01:15 pm
Did you notice how long Max was confused about the hammer drop?Probably a minute if he's even being honest. By the time I responded to his first post he had already corrected himself.
I did the same thing, this sounds honest.Fluffe didn't seem to notice at all because they responded to my question with reads.I mean I knew you weren't hammered because I knew NQT changed his vote to me even double-checked once Tric/Max started acting confused about it to make sure.
Here. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8457964#msg8457964)
Did Mafia want a Toony Lynch?I don't think they cared.
Theory: Mafia planned to kill one of their own Night 2 during/prior to Day 2, in order to avoid town's roleblocks and protects.It's true, killing one of your own guys means if a block or protect gets in the way at least...you don't kill each other. It's fucking bad if a Flower tracks you though.
Here's the thing:
There's probably no reason to kill your own guy unless you think your partner is in deep cover (has a lot of town cred) and want to just quickly identify the last Root for game. If you wanted to avoid blocks and protects you could simply do nothing and now you have two mafia instead of one for the next day.
The other possibility is that maybe mafia thought it was likely Max would be lynched on Day 3 (it's certainly possible) and they probably also thought I would be an easy scapegoat for Day 3 the same way I was for Day 2 if Max flipped mafia. If Max was around for Day 3 there's a good chance he gets lynched first before me which means killing the last Root would not let them win.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 05:10:23 pm
At the End of Day 2, where did town cred lie?
Who were players with high town cred? Tric and Fluffe. (me, NQT, Web, and most others vouched for these players)
Who were players with middling town cred? Jim and Web. (some of us vouched for these players but not all)
Who were players with low town cred? Jack and Max. (not a lot of us vouched for these players)
Does everyone agree with this?
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 05:15:59 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 05:23:43 pm
I disagree Jack had low town cred cause alot of people (including me) thought/think he is good because of his breakdown around the first day I say it's closer to high middling.Which players do you think have no chance of being Max's partner?
Post by: webadict on March 07, 2023, 07:33:34 pm
Post by: Mamobo on March 07, 2023, 07:35:31 pm
------------------------
-> EuchreJack --1-- TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459094#msg8459094),
-> Fluffe9911 --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459085#msg8459085),
a1s --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
Maximum Spin --0--
notquitethere --0--
ToonyMan --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --7-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459020#msg8459020), Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459021#msg8459021), Jim Groovester, Maximum Spin, notquitethere, ToonyMan, webadict,
5 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (-78 hours and -37 minutes remaining.)
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Post by: NJW2000 on March 07, 2023, 07:39:08 pm
Post by: webadict on March 07, 2023, 07:45:27 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 08:53:26 pm
Sorry, I took a bunch of naps yesterday and today. I think it's one of Fluffe, Jack, or a1s, but I have no brain power to solve this.Damn, hope you feel better.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 09:47:35 pm
Which players do you think have no chance of being Max's partner?Me, you, a1s, and jim those are the people with 0% chance in my eyes of being mafia (with me only being from my POV)
This leaves three people
EuchreJack: Averted suspicion on Day 1 through having a mental breakdown on page 10, was not hammered by max even when he would of been the last vote needed max also defended him quite a bit even while Jack had a vote against him Max didn't seem to care about this, after the mental breakdown bet the scumteam was Jim & Toonyman changed their mind on this literally an hour later on Page 10 now claiming they don't think it's Toony. Page 3 said this ("I also tend to agree that since everyone thinks Max is scum, that means Max is probably town. I would also add that Max usually seems townie when he is scum."). Page 5 noticed Max sharing reads which he claimed is sus backed this up later with a vote for max which was a flip flop from his views at the end of Page 3 Toony called him out on this and Jack justified it by pretty much reiterating what he already said.
webadict: Hasn't been talking too much, joined the web bad train with Jim on Day 1, Claimed Toony is town on Day 1 and they would be mostly voting for what he is voting for. Claimed stem but in hindsight gave a very obvious hint they were actually a flower.
TricMagic: Role claimed as the very first post. Asked who they think is scum by max said on page 4 said ("NQT, Max, Jack"). Called out Jacks mental breakdown of potentially being a emotional appeal on page 14, said this on page 14 ("If it's not Jack, it's Max. If it's not Max it's NQT. It definitely not webadict nya~)
And those are my day 1 reads after carefully considering it I think the person least likely to be mafia outta the three of them is webadict and the person most likely is EuchreJack I have not reread through the day two shenanigans yet but day 1 seems to be quiet telling already.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 09:54:15 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 07, 2023, 10:00:40 pm
I agree.Which players do you think have no chance of being Max's partner?Me, you, a1s, and jim those are the people with 0% chance in my eyes of being mafia (with me only being from my POV)
If we vote Jack today and he's town, can you block Tric tonight?
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 10:06:08 pm
If we vote Jack today and he's town, can you block Tric tonight?I should be able to yeah.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 10:13:34 pm
Which players do you think have no chance of being Max's partner?Me, you, a1s, and jim those are the people with 0% chance in my eyes of being mafia (with me only being from my POV)
This leaves three people
EuchreJack: Averted suspicion on Day 1 through having a mental breakdown on page 10, was not hammered by max even when he would of been the last vote needed max also defended him quite a bit even while Jack had a vote against him Max didn't seem to care about this, after the mental breakdown bet the scumteam was Jim & Toonyman changed their mind on this literally an hour later on Page 10 now claiming they don't think it's Toony. Page 3 said this ("I also tend to agree that since everyone thinks Max is scum, that means Max is probably town. I would also add that Max usually seems townie when he is scum."). Page 5 noticed Max sharing reads which he claimed is sus backed this up later with a vote for max which was a flip flop from his views at the end of Page 3 Toony called him out on this and Jack justified it by pretty much reiterating what he already said.
webadict: Hasn't been talking too much, joined the web bad train with Jim on Day 1, Claimed Toony is town on Day 1 and they would be mostly voting for what he is voting for. Claimed stem but in hindsight gave a very obvious hint they were actually a flower.
TricMagic: Role claimed as the very first post. Asked who they think is scum by max said on page 4 said ("NQT, Max, Jack"). Called out Jacks mental breakdown of potentially being a emotional appeal on page 14, said this on page 14 ("If it's not Jack, it's Max. If it's not Max it's NQT. It definitely not webadict nya~)
And those are my day 1 reads after carefully considering it I think the person least likely to be mafia outta the three of them is webadict and the person most likely is EuchreJack I have not reread through the day two shenanigans yet but day 1 seems to be quiet telling already.
But what about this?
Why wasn't I your Public Enemy #1 yesterday?@Fluffe9911: So who's Mafia?The literally only option I can think of is webadict if it aint him then I frankly don't know maybe tric's been pulling us along for a ride secretly this whole time.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 10:16:42 pm
But what about this?Simple I didn't bother actually looking back through the posts yesterday and still wanted to believe your mental breakdown was genuine/something a scum wouldn't of done not much else to it.Why wasn't I your Public Enemy #1 yesterday?@Fluffe9911: So who's Mafia?The literally only option I can think of is webadict if it aint him then I frankly don't know maybe tric's been pulling us along for a ride secretly this whole time.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 10:17:59 pm
@a1s: You should vote either Tric or Fluffe9911, since by this statement, you know one of them to be lying. There are not 4 stems.I want to know which one of you is the last Stem, and which one of you is the last Flower.I am the last Stem. And I still have my block.
Toony is mechanically cleared as town.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 10:20:30 pm
@a1s: You should vote either Tric or Fluffe9911, since by this statement, you know one of them to be lying. There are not 4 stems.Ok first off a1 is lying and is the root secondly you realize that if a person is lying about being a stem that doesn't mean they are mafia but rather means they must be the root which instantly confirms them right?
Toony is mechanically cleared as town.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 10:24:43 pm
And what part of my "mental breakdown" do you think was faked? I took up most of page 10 with my frustration, so what part(s) do you think lack authenticity?But what about this?Simple I didn't bother actually looking back through the posts yesterday and still wanted to believe your mental breakdown was genuine/something a scum wouldn't of done not much else to it.Why wasn't I your Public Enemy #1 yesterday?@Fluffe9911: So who's Mafia?The literally only option I can think of is webadict if it aint him then I frankly don't know maybe tric's been pulling us along for a ride secretly this whole time.
What I would really like to know is why you and Max figured it was better to read me as town, suspect web, then swing onto me. Maybe our more experienced mafia players know?
I mean, I KNOW that I look like a potential scumbuddy to Max. That is painfully obvious to everyone, including me. I think we all saw that before Max flipped.
Except you. Why was that?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 07, 2023, 10:26:00 pm
I don't deal in hypotheticals. Are you claiming to be the stem or the root?@a1s: You should vote either Tric or Fluffe9911, since by this statement, you know one of them to be lying. There are not 4 stems.Ok first off a1 is lying and is the root secondly you realize that if a person is lying about being a stem that doesn't mean they are mafia but rather means they must be the root which instantly confirms them right?
Toony is mechanically cleared as town.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 07, 2023, 10:33:44 pm
And what part of my "mental breakdown" do you think was faked? I took up most of page 10 with my frustration, so what part(s) do you think lack authenticity?1. Honestly none of it but I realize now you can have a mental breakdown and still be scum.
What I would really like to know is why you and Max figured it was better to read me as town, suspect web, then swing onto me. Maybe our more experienced mafia players know?
I mean, I KNOW that I look like a potential scumbuddy to Max. That is painfully obvious to everyone, including me. I think we all saw that before Max flipped.
Except you. Why was that?
2. This is such a silly way to try to group me up with Max that it is frankly absurd alot of this honestly feels like you grasping at straws at this point.
3. Are you attacking me for... not trying to hammer you till now... what? Are you serious? I already explained anyway I thought your mental breakdown at the time meant it couldn't of been you and now im rethinking that.
I don't deal in hypotheticals. Are you claiming to be the stem or the root?As I said before stem
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 04:02:05 am
ToonyMan and myself are confirmed town, with everybody else being unconfirmed losers. I think how the unconfirmed losers make cases within each other is going to be interesting, especially how popular suspects justify players other than themselves as Maximum Spin's teammate. Jack comes up with some frequency on people's suspects list. Jack, for his part, identifies Fluffe9911 and a1s as suspects, which does not ring true for me for a few reasons. webadict avoids being a suspect somehow for most remaining players.
a1s could be the last root but between the four stem claims only TricMagic realistically has no chance of being the final root. ToonyMan is quick on his feet so it wouldn't be outside his capabilities to identify fakeclaiming stem as a viable strategy to avoid scum narrowing him down and it would also be within his capability to identify other players as the final root instead of him to direct attention away from him. Fluffe9911 hesitating on claiming would be a reasonable but also the most ordinary response to being the final root. Fluffe9911 seems sharp enough to know that contesting ToonyMan as he identifies a1s as the remaining root would not be in his interests if he himself is the remaining root.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 07:55:39 am
This is why I am pressuring Fluffe9911 on that point.
Overall, I think his Day 3 posts are super Scummy, especially when you compare them to his mostly inactive Day 1 & 2 posts.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 08:41:53 am
The problem is that mafia is going to try to convince you that they are the remaining root in order to avoid getting lynched.Do you mean tomorrow?
If there is a tomorrow every player but two will be confirmed town.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 09:01:00 am
Tomorrow explicitly, but they'll probably try to imply it today.The problem is that mafia is going to try to convince you that they are the remaining root in order to avoid getting lynched.Do you mean tomorrow?
If there is a tomorrow every player but two will be confirmed town.
Today, a fakeclaim of Root makes Mafia vulnerable to counterclaim.
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 09:12:49 am
Jack, I've never not claimed Stem. Any chance of me fakeclaiming is 0. Toony/Jim are confirmed. Fluffle/webadict removed from cloth.
It's either you, or a1s. Why are you attempting to spread suspicion beyond those two?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 09:17:13 am
So long as A1s is blocked, I'm fine with also being blocked. Though it's not really the best use of it.What do mean "Fluffe/Webadict removed from cloth"?
Jack, I've never not claimed Stem. Any chance of me fakeclaiming is 0. Toony/Jim are confirmed. Fluffle/webadict removed from cloth.
It's either you, or a1s. Why are you attempting to spread suspicion beyond those two?
I think they're both suspicious.
I also think if town blocks you, they lose, so don't talk crazy.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 09:19:44 am
I was going to use my ability on Max, now I'm glad I didn't.This player is not Mafia, unless you believe this statement is fake.
Also, I don't understand what is happening in this game! Why does the mafia kill a mafia? I'm assuming this is retribution for Town killing a town?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 09:24:13 am
I'm pretty confident Fluffe is going to have to thunderdome whoever he chooses to block tonight.
Jack, it's probably Fluffe right? What do you think are the chances it's anyone else?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 09:38:33 am
I actually did write N2 notes but I haven't shared them because they're embarrassingly wrong about everything. The only Max mafia teams I speculated were Max/Jack and Max/Fluffe but I don't remember my exact words I can check when I'm at home today. They weren't likely possibilities in my head though.
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 09:42:17 am
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 09:46:14 am
Our other option is the completely silent a1s hiding in the background.Is it your habit to vote confirmed town players?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 10:06:12 am
YesOur other option is the completely silent a1s hiding in the background.Is it your habit to vote confirmed town players?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 10:14:47 am
I mean, duh.Yes, it's most likely Fluffe.
I'm pretty confident Fluffe is going to have to thunderdome whoever he chooses to block tonight.
Jack, it's probably Fluffe right? What do you think are the chances it's anyone else?
There is a slight chance it's Web or a1s, but if you Lynch me, then you should block Fluffe.
I mean, if either Web or a1s could at least vote, it would make them look a lot better.
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 10:20:23 am
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 10:23:26 am
... Why is this something that exists?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 10:38:58 am
Well, I'm just confused who's confirmed or not. How is A1s confirmed?Pop quiz!
Why is Fluffe 100% sure that a1s isn't mafia?
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 10:44:03 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 10:47:37 am
Pop quiz!A true mystery for the ages.
Why is Fluffe 100% sure that a1s isn't mafia?
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 10:48:45 am
The only way you can both be Stems is if I'm the Lier. But I literally revealed myself day 1. While I did visit Max last night, that's by my own claim.
Ninja.One of us is lying, so which of us is it Fluffe?Pop quiz!A true mystery for the ages.
Why is Fluffe 100% sure that a1s isn't mafia?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 10:50:39 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 12:20:15 pm
Fluffe, this is what is known as a Thunderdome. Two people have two statements that oppose each other. Both cannot be true, therefore one is lying, Lynch all Liers.This is literally only a "thunderdome" in a vacuum cause in this situation lynching the person who is lying literally losses us the damn game you can't just say a buzz word and go off the precedent for it you gotta use context or you make a fool of yourself.
The only way you can both be Stems is if I'm the Lier. But I literally revealed myself day 1. While I did visit Max last night, that's by my own claim.
I already said I'm almost certain ai is the root and is lying how many times I gotta repeat this.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 12:25:11 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 01:07:22 pm
You can call it a buzzword, but that doesn't work.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 01:14:14 pm
Your argument is A1s is lying. Which would make them mafia.No my argument is A1 is lying. Which would make them town. Do you not understand what the damn implications of being the Root is?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 01:16:07 pm
To further iterate it is astromincally unlikely your the root since as you already iterated you claimed on day 1 before any of this even happened for you to be the root would require a level of oracle foresight or luck I'm comfortable making a bet on."Astronomically unlikely?!"
If Tric was the root, and he figured lying about his role would be an optimal tactic, he only needed, at most, a 1-in-3 chance of being correct.
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 01:18:09 pm
You can't just say they're lying...Your argument is A1s is lying. Which would make them mafia.No my argument is A1 is lying. Which would make them town. Do you not understand what the damn implications of being the Root is?
I know the term for this,(even if I can't remember it right now) but you're just ignoring facts that don't fit your hypothesis. Which is more likely, that they are lying in a way that is easily seen through, or that they are telling the truth?
The implication you imply doesn't matter. What matters is who the Mafia is. So who is it?
Ninjajack. And I wouldn't lie, I'd just tell the truth. Far less likely to bite me.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 01:22:26 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 01:27:44 pm
HahahaTo further iterate it is astromincally unlikely your the root since as you already iterated you claimed on day 1 before any of this even happened for you to be the root would require a level of oracle foresight or luck I'm comfortable making a bet on."Astronomically unlikely?!"
If Tric was the root, and he figured lying about his role would be an optimal tactic, he only needed, at most, a 1-in-3 chance of being correct.
Hahahahahaha
Haaaaah
Haaaaah
Haaaaaaaaaaaaah
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 01:35:49 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 01:38:31 pm
TricMagic and EuchreJack I'm thinking of you just in case you somehow think what I'm saying doesn't apply to you in fact it only applies to you two.
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 01:51:16 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 01:55:53 pm
Again, the final mafia is either a genuine stem claim
or a genuine flower claim
Sorry guys, long day. I skimmed that there are now 4 stems? I will pick one to vote for as soon as I read the thread closer.
OIC. I vote Fluffe9911 unless they explain why they lied (on the off chance that town!Fluffe9911 doesn't understand why lying=mafia).
Stop, please, and think about what you're doing for ten seconds.
AGAIN SINCE APPARENTLY NOBODY FUCKING READS
VOTING A STEM PLAYER FOR FAKECLAIMING THEIR ROLE IS VOTING A TOWN PLAYER
THE FINAL MAFIA IS A GENUINE STEM CLAIM OR A GENUINE FLOWER CLAIM
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 02:00:25 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 02:06:12 pm
I'm sorry, Fluffe9911 is cleared because they lied?
You've missed the point of what I'm saying.
Is Fluffe9911 lying about being a stem? Maybe, maybe not.
But if you think Fluffe9911 is lying about being a Stem, then you are saying you think he is the last root fakeclaiming being a stem, which would make him town, and therefore it's completely braindead of you to vote for Fluffe9911 because of that.
So, go outside, go stare at some far off object for a couple minutes, and think about the game and whether what you're doing actually makes any sense at all.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 02:07:02 pm
I'm sorry, Fluffe9911 is cleared because they lied?Have you never lied once in your life?
We're all really liars on the inside.
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 02:10:15 pm
Oh, I lied my ass off on multiple occasions. But not as a town in a game of Mafia.I'm sorry, Fluffe9911 is cleared because they lied?Have you never lied once in your life?
We're all really liars on the inside.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 02:20:33 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 02:23:08 pm
Jim Groovester: Flower
ToonyMan: Stem
TricMagic: Stem
a1s: Stem?
EuchreJack: Flower?
Fluffe9911: Stem?
MaximumSpin: Root
notquitethere: Root
...Jack, did you ever tell us your own roll? Mafia must be within these three.
Assuming A1s is telling the truth, it's Fluffe. Assuming a1 is lying as town, it's Jack. Assuming a1s is lying as mafia, it's them.
You can yell at me toony, I'm just following the logic chain from the start again, and this is what occurs.
Only if they are lying town does it mean jack is Mafia. Don't lie town, it just confuses things. If a1s is telling the truth, then we have a Thunderdome. Is this true Fluffe?
... Granted, Jim's thing. Which makes no sense, only Jack could be Mafia in this scenario. And a1s or Fluffe would have to be lying, so we Lynch all Lyers. Which brings us back to our previous point, is Fluffe deranged enough to think lying about your ability to block is a good thing?
baps ninjaman
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 02:26:43 pm
Webadict: FlowerBehold what Lies reap you Toonyman. If you're the lier who tried to get out of being lynched, then it all falls into MYLO tomorrow.
Jim Groovester: Flower
ToonyMan:StemRoot
TricMagic: Stem
a1s: Stem?
EuchreJack: Flower?
Fluffe9911: Stem?
MaximumSpin: Root
notquitethere: Root
baps ninjaman
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 02:29:08 pm
OIC. I vote Fluffe9911 unless they explain why they lied (on the off chance that town!Fluffe9911 doesn't understand why lying=mafia).Oh. My. God. Ok fine damn it Ill admit it I'm the damn Root I had this whole elaborate big brain plan of trying to trick mafia into thinking the root was a1 in the hope of buying us an extra damn day if the mafia was somehow not Jack I was going to protect a1 hope a1 was able to put two and two together and block tric and we woulda won easy peasy lemon squisy but since CLEARLY a1 aint able to read between the damn lines I feel like I can't trust them anymore to not fuck it up so instead ill outright say once again I am the Root and this is what we should do if it aint Jack, a1 what you need to do is block Tric not me not max not literally anyone else but Tric if you do not do this during the night and it aint Jack we LOSE.
I apologize for trying to be clever about it I can guarantee this won't happen again and a1 if you're somehow the mafia then honestly great fuckin job.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 02:32:58 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 02:33:57 pm
Webadict: FlowerSo it's narrowed back to Jack and a1s.
Jim Groovester: Flower
ToonyMan: Stem
TricMagic: Stem
a1s: Stem?
EuchreJack: Flower?
Fluffe9911:Stem?Root
MaximumSpin: Root
notquitethere: Root
From the Day 1 vote, unlikely to be a1s, so Jack.
Unvote
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 02:35:05 pm
EuchreJack
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 02:35:29 pm
SighYeah again my bad I was really hoping a1 would realize what the hell I was trying to do here and play along since clearly they ain't gonna and my plan kinda hinges on them blocking Tric for the extra safe guard I might as well just outright say it.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 02:37:08 pm
ME HAVE LARGE CRANIUM FOR LARGE BRAIN
Don't do Big Brain plans to flush out mafia- mafia literally has an extra brain on you. Well, not anymore, I guess, but you know what I mean.
EuchreJack
I REALLY WISH YOU FUCKING WOULDN'T SINCE NOW JACK IS AT L-1 AND I DON'T WANT THE DAY TO END PREMATURELY
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 02:38:04 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 02:38:28 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 02:38:44 pm
Don't be so quick with the votes we still need to hear from Web.
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 02:40:26 pm
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 02:42:25 pm
I REALLY WISH YOU FUCKING WOULDN'T SINCE NOW JACK IS AT L-1 AND I DON'T WANT THE DAY TO END PREMATURELYJack was never in any danger. chillax.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 02:44:30 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 02:45:47 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 02:47:09 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 03:25:39 pm
Well, at least we have time to digest this.OIC. I vote Fluffe9911 unless they explain why they lied (on the off chance that town!Fluffe9911 doesn't understand why lying=mafia).Oh. My. God. Ok fine damn it Ill admit it I'm the damn Root I had this whole elaborate big brain plan of trying to trick mafia into thinking the root was a1 in the hope of buying us an extra damn day if the mafia was somehow not Jack I was going to protect a1 hope a1 was able to put two and two together and block tric and we woulda won easy peasy lemon squisy but since CLEARLY a1 aint able to read between the damn lines I feel like I can't trust them anymore to not fuck it up so instead ill outright say once again I am the Root and this is what we should do if it aint Jack, a1 what you need to do is block Tric not me not max not literally anyone else but Tric if you do not do this during the night and it aint Jack we LOSE.
I apologize for trying to be clever about it I can guarantee this won't happen again and a1 if you're somehow the mafia then honestly great fuckin job.
If you had said it any later in the day, it would have been a real problem.
To be fair, I never thought you were the root, and don't believe you now.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 03:27:54 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 03:32:47 pm
To be fair, I never thought you were the root, and don't believe you now....Town wins if Fluffe is lying because the real Root counterclaims and we lynch either one, doesn't matter, if we're wrong I block the other and that's game.
So real Root if you're out there please counterclaim so we win on the spot.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 03:38:40 pm
Doesn't matter since only players that can counterclaim are me, Tric, and a1s and none of us are going to.
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 03:39:32 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 03:43:36 pm
To be fair, I never thought you were the root, and don't believe you now.(https://i.ibb.co/cKWHkXs/areyouarealperson.jpg)
@Fluffe: How come your Big Brain plan didn't include Toony or Web?Toony is confirmed by Jim and Web has been so anti-Max that I am willing to bet 5 actual bucks they are town unless you mean why I didn't consider Toony could also block then I kinda just memory-holed it not much else to it. I guess Toony can block Web to be extra safe.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 03:44:53 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 03:46:36 pm
Web is more likely to be mafia than Tric.
If it's not Jack.
Post by: a1s on March 08, 2023, 03:51:29 pm
Or hell block me if ya want ain't like I can defend myself.You being root clears you of being considered mafia.
And I disagree- Tric is more likely then Web. Luckily with 2 stems we can block both, as long as we agree who blocks who during the day.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 03:52:42 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 03:56:59 pm
Post by: TricMagic on March 08, 2023, 03:57:15 pm
If Jack isn't mafia I'll block Web and a1s can block Tric.I am perfectly okay with this. Please murder me a1s. If you are the mafia stem.
As this point it's Deny Deny Deny me a River, ey Jack?
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 04:42:12 pm
If Jack isn't mafia I'll block Web and a1s can block Tric.It does mean that if a1s is Mafia, then they probably win, but it has always come down to you, Toonyman.
I can die now, if it's inevitable. Sounds like I still win with Town, which was my Day 3 plan all along.
Spoiler: Jack's plan (click to show/hide)
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 04:44:54 pm
Well, I guess I lose with town.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 04:48:22 pm
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 04:53:09 pm
@Fluffe: If you get a win as Mafia, you are contracturally obligated to play 5 more Mafia games on this forum.If I get a win as Town, you are contractually obligated to admit to being a big dumb dumb.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 04:55:06 pm
If Jack isn't mafia I'll block Web and a1s can block Tric.It does mean that if a1s is Mafia, then they probably win, but it has always come down to you, Toonyman.
if a1s is Mafia
(https://i.imgur.com/wH2Pu95.gif)
I was going to use my ability on Max, now I'm glad I didn't.This player is not Mafia, unless you believe this statement is fake.
Also, I don't understand what is happening in this game! Why does the mafia kill a mafia? I'm assuming this is retribution for Town killing a town?
This player is not Mafia
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 08, 2023, 05:01:38 pm
(https://i.imgflip.com/2h3m3n.jpg)
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 05:22:32 pm
I'm home now so I can share my embarrassingly wrong N2 notes.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: webadict on March 08, 2023, 06:02:39 pm
But, that's okay. How's it going guys, I'd sum the days I missed really fast, but I was promised I could no-brain-train, so I'm vastly disappointed that that isn't the case. Let's get a Mamobo.
Post by: Mamobo on March 08, 2023, 06:04:13 pm
------------------------
-> EuchreJack --1-- a1s* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459625#msg8459625),
-> Fluffe9911 --1-- EuchreJack* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459085#msg8459085),
a1s --0--
Jim Groovester --0--
ToonyMan --0--
TricMagic --0--
webadict --0--
No One --0--
Not Voting --5-- Fluffe9911* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459628#msg8459628), Jim Groovester, ToonyMan, TricMagic* (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=181411.msg8459624#msg8459624), webadict,
4 to Hammer. Day ends on March 04, 2023 at 12:00 Central Standard Time (-101 hours and -6 minutes remaining.)
NOTE: In the event of a tie, no one dies, which is a severe injustice!
Post by: webadict on March 08, 2023, 06:04:51 pm
Post by: webadict on March 08, 2023, 06:05:56 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 06:08:28 pm
But, that's okay. How's it going guys, I'd sum the days I missed really fast, but I was promised I could no-brain-train, so I'm vastly disappointed that that isn't the case. Let's get a Mamobo.I don't know I think we were doing okay.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 08, 2023, 06:12:12 pm
Post by: webadict on March 08, 2023, 06:12:54 pm
What hasn't been solved yet?But, that's okay. How's it going guys, I'd sum the days I missed really fast, but I was promised I could no-brain-train, so I'm vastly disappointed that that isn't the case. Let's get a Mamobo.I don't know I think we were doing okay.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 07:24:23 pm
Who's mafia?What hasn't been solved yet?But, that's okay. How's it going guys, I'd sum the days I missed really fast, but I was promised I could no-brain-train, so I'm vastly disappointed that that isn't the case. Let's get a Mamobo.I don't know I think we were doing okay.
Post by: webadict on March 08, 2023, 07:54:19 pm
It's Jack or it's a1s.
Or are we also including Tric? Because it ain't likely Jim, and it ain't you for sure. It isn't Fluffe. I'm pretty sure that's everyone. If it's Tric, he's got me convinced on the same level as Jim, so if it's either of them, frankly, I wasn't going to beat them. Are we including me? Because while it's certainly possible for me to be scum, I'd have to have banked on some extraordinary conditions, or I'd have gone on a really hardcore bus, and I personally think I'd probably avoid bussing in this game.
Your answer implies that we were done thinking, but we're either not done, or we are done and we're twiddling thumbs, which I'd like to avoid as I might not be awake at Day end. So, we arrive at the question again: What needs to be solved?
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 09:47:32 pm
I'll be awake tomorrow before day ends so I'll vote Jack then if I need to.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 10:53:03 pm
Confirmed Town:
ToonyMan - confirmed by Jim
Jim Groovester - confirmed by EuchreJack
Fluffe9911 - confirmed by virtue of an uncontested root claim
Unconfirmed Losers:
webadict
EuchreJack
a1s
TricMagic
Doing a quick reread of the game.
Max puts his vote on a1s on Day 1 but when prompted about it near the end of Day 1 holds it there. Max also doesn't participate in the CFD. a1s also tosses a vote on Max near the end of Day 1. TricMagic and webadict do as well. These are high risk plays coming out of Max and a1s, TricMagic, and webadict. Nightkilling a scum team member makes a certain amount of sense but bussing a scum partner has a lot of deleterious consequences that make it very unattractive to do. I'd like to think Max understands those consequences at least and would be able to inform any potential teammate. I think webadict would have the least hesitation to bus Max on Day 1 but I still think it's a bad idea. EuchreJack I believe never seriously suspects Max during Day 1 and Max covers and defends EuchreJack at times.
TricMagic and a1s start Day 2 suspecting Max but then everybody goes stupid about ToonyMan. webadict starts Day 2 suspecting ToonyMan. Jack joins Max and webadict in suspecting ToonyMan.
During Day 2 Max pours cold water on the idea of bussing teammates as scum in this game. Does he say this while also trying to have a bus happen on Day 1? I don't think so. Odds are that any votes on Max near the end of Day 1 are probably legitimate in that case.
Day 2 is really dumb.
Jack townreads Max on Day 2; one of the few people to do so I believe.
Max townreads TricMagic and states he's willing to vote Jack and a1s.
webadict holds ToonyMan's feet to the fire all of Day 2 and then relents to vote notquitethere. It bothers me a bit.
Jack's Day 2 case on me is terrible. It's spiteful more than anything else.
Jack despite not saying much of anything regarding Max on Day 2 decides that scum is likely within NQT/Max for whatever reason.
Max convinces Fluffe9911 to switch their votes to a1s near the end of Day 2. He joins webadict in voting EuchreJack before finally voting NQT.
Day 3 is really dumb.
After reading through the game I don't think it's TricMagic or a1s. TricMagic has it out for Maximum Spin and Maximum Spin tries to eliminatee a1s on a couple of occasions. It could be webadict but I think it's likelier to be EuchreJack. webadict's end of Day 1 makes me think it's likely not to be him but I dislike his Day 2 and how much grief he gave ToonyMan. Both TricMagic's and EuchreJack's arguments don't make much sense during Day 3 (a useful measure for how convincing the solution that doesn't eliminate them if they're scum is) but TricMagic makes a much worse partner for Maximum Spin than EuchreJack.
Yeah I think it's EuchreJack.
I can't participate in any N3 plan and don't have any objections to the one presented but I didn't thoroughly check it over.
Consider me ready to vote EuchreJack.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 11:26:08 pm
Jack
If Jack is town:
Toony block Web.
a1s block Tric.
Lose to a1s being mafia and me hard defending both Max and a1s during end of D1.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 11:38:22 pm
I've mostly been trying to help give Town info before my inevitable mislynch. Something to read on Night 3 (mostly Toonyman).
I know that voting me is suboptimal, hence why I would prefer someone else, but it's mostly inevitable, so I guess I am trying to keep town calm so they don't fuck up Night 3.
Toony and possibly one other stem has to choose 1-2 people to roleblock. Some plans have been made regarding that.
If Jack isn't mafia I'll block Web and a1s can block Tric.I guess this plan works?
Gladly. It's a small price to pay for a win.@Fluffe: If you get a win as Mafia, you are contracturally obligated to play 5 more Mafia games on this forum.If I get a win as Town, you are contractually obligated to admit to being a big dumb dumb.
Well, I probably won't bother with a final message, so let's go with this: I blame Mafia for everything, Town can avenge/atone my death by winning, so that I win too.
Unvote since it ain't my problem anymore.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 11:40:48 pm
I think that's as much insight as we're getting.I'm slightly confused but best you keep to a solid plan rather than I confuse it by asking questions.
Jack
If Jack is town:
Toony block Web.
a1s block Tric.
Lose to a1s being mafia and me hard defending both Max and a1s during end of D1.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 11:44:55 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 08, 2023, 11:45:22 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 08, 2023, 11:49:16 pm
I'm tempted to hammer but since I'm confirmed by Jack it's not informative for me to hammer in the event that the game continues after Jack's lynch.Well, my death would confirm you by confirming that I am a Town Flower. You are town, since I saw you tracking Toony when Max was killed by his partner.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 11:52:51 pm
Post by: ToonyMan on March 08, 2023, 11:55:46 pm
Well, I probably won't bother with a final message, so let's go with this: I blame Mafia for everything, Town can avenge/atone my death by winning, so that I win too.You could help us win by identifying who is more suspicious.
Dying isn't the end, NQT's posts at the end of D2 helped and were needless effort which I respect.
Post by: a1s on March 09, 2023, 04:22:45 am
I'm tempted to hammer but since I'm confirmed by Jack it's not informative for me to hammer in the event that the game continues after Jack's lynch.hammer or not, the day is ending in 3.5 hours with Jack dangling from that noose. You're just postponing the inevitable.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 09, 2023, 08:06:56 am
Elimination results shortly.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 09, 2023, 12:57:00 pm
EuchreJack was a flower.
Quote
You are a Flower. Once during the game, you may act at night to track a chosen player, learning who if anyone they targeted at night. You may not self target.
Think carefully before using or revealing your role.
'The pale yellow flowers of Northern wormwood are small and numerous. It is rumored that they are used in invigorating cordials, heightening the perceptions of the imbiber and improving vision in dark places. These claims, while colourful, do not merit serious consideration.'- Northwestern Territory Almanac, 1861
Night Three has begun.
The night will end at 9pm GMT, or 3pm CST, on the 10th March, in approximately 27 hours. Please send any actions to me by PM before this point, or "none" if you do not wish to act.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 11, 2023, 09:01:15 am
D A Y F O U R
Sending an innocent man to his death the second time is no easier than the first. Nonetheless, some of you manage to sleep.
In the morning, one person is conspicuously absent, to be found nowhere in the inn. His scant possessions are gone, but cuttings of wormrotten plants remain scattered about his room. You conclude that the saboteurs have fled town.
webadict was mafia.
Mafia has conceded.
Town has won.
Spoiler: roles (click to show/hide)
Deadchat (https://discord.gg/4VqWEcz5)
Post by: notquitethere on March 11, 2023, 10:06:56 am
Worth ejecting D2:
Max - Just wagons - weak vote reason
Webadict - Tunnelled on Toony, but without conviction to hammer
I enjoyed the self-murder gambit that mafia tried. It could have worked!
Post by: ToonyMan on March 11, 2023, 10:07:25 am
Post by: TricMagic on March 11, 2023, 10:56:47 am
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 11, 2023, 12:01:17 pm
I honestly thought it was a1s. On me for trusting webadict. Flawed data in, flawed data out.If the game didn't end right now due to the mafia conceding I woulda pointed out that if it was a1 we woulda already lost since literally nothing would of stopped them from killing me and winning the game. Regardless gg was a pretty fun game if a bit frustrating sometimes glad we pulled a victory out in the end.
Post by: Fluffe9911 on March 11, 2023, 12:21:11 pm
@EuchreJack@Fluffe: If you get a win as Mafia, you are contracturally obligated to play 5 more Mafia games on this forum.If I get a win as Town, you are contractually obligated to admit to being a big dumb dumb.
Post by: ToonyMan on March 11, 2023, 12:26:48 pm
Shout outs to Jim for saving me on both D2 and D3.
Shout outs to Fluffe for doing well in their first forum mafia game.
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 11, 2023, 01:16:58 pm
It feels weird to celebrate a win because the mafia self-eliminated though. Three people got confirmed on Day 3 because of how the setup works and because of role claims, so I'm not surprised to see a concession here since that looks really rough to play around.
Good game though.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 11, 2023, 04:37:25 pm
The game was slightly too swingy, especially because losing one mafia member lowered the chance of a mafia win far too much, as Web pointed out. The team-kill gambit was impressive, but I think web and Max felt a bit more forced into it than I'd have liked... I think it would have been better to allow the last person in each section to self-target, so scum could self-kill and roots could self-protect. This would make play a bit more stable.
I'm not sure if the mass roleclaim/confirms D3 were overpowered - as people noted, if the last scum was outside of Jack/webadict, it would have been game over for town, as revealing information is potentially pretty deadly. As it happened, scum had a very good idea of which roles people had by that point anyway, so it didn't actually hurt town, and did really narrow down the pool of suspects. I'm not sure if this is a genuine imbalance, or just the result of both scum and town massively escalating the situation N2 and D3 - I'd appreciate any input on that.
The night game only proved important once or twice - Toony's block on Web, Jim's confirm on Toony - so broadly speaking, town won by finding other town in the day. Everyone played a fine nightgame, people showing a lot of self-restraint in action use, and acting based on a pretty good assessment of people's roles. Shoutout to Tric for hitting scum N2, even if it didn't end up helping.
Spoiler: action summary (click to show/hide)
Scumchat will be posted at discretion of mafia.
Post by: Maximum Spin on March 11, 2023, 04:59:09 pm
Half of all the players will think I'm scum if I'm helpful and engaged, while the other half will think I'm scum if I'm selfish and shady! What do you people want from me, anyway?
We came really close to backing out of the sacrifice plan at the last minute. I think we absolutely should have. Tric blocking me and mafia killing anyway would probably have been enough to get me off the hook d3, and it turned out that, while we had a pretty good idea about roles, we were wrong about the 'last one' of every type, so we didn't have as solid a plan as we'd hoped. If our guess about the roles had been right, we would have won - we thought Jack was the last root.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 11, 2023, 07:25:00 pm
@Jim: Can I borrow your dunce cap?@EuchreJack@Fluffe: If you get a win as Mafia, you are contracturally obligated to play 5 more Mafia games on this forum.If I get a win as Town, you are contractually obligated to admit to being a big dumb dumb.
Post by: EuchreJack on March 11, 2023, 07:27:44 pm
You know, I'm a little miffed.
Half of all the players will think I'm scum if I'm helpful and engaged, while the other half will think I'm scum if I'm selfish and shady! What do you people want from me, anyway?
We came really close to backing out of the sacrifice plan at the last minute. I think we absolutely should have. Tric blocking me and mafia killing anyway would probably have been enough to get me off the hook d3, and it turned out that, while we had a pretty good idea about roles, we were wrong about the 'last one' of every type, so we didn't have as solid a plan as we'd hoped. If our guess about the roles had been right, we would have won - we thought Jack was the last root.
I'm redeemed!
...like seriously, what flaws of logic lead you to that conclusion?
Could we pretty please have the mafia logs?
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 11, 2023, 11:19:06 pm
@Jim: Can I borrow your dunce cap?
Absolutely.
I'll never ask you for it back.
Spoiler: Here you go. (click to show/hide)
Post by: webadict on March 12, 2023, 11:26:30 am
I was wondering how Webadict was going to argue Tric was mafia.I wasn't. I was going to claim being Root. And then I was gonna be voted out.
Post by: NJW2000 on March 12, 2023, 12:02:11 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on March 12, 2023, 04:14:01 pm
Thanks!@Jim: Can I borrow your dunce cap?
Absolutely.
I'll never ask you for it back.Spoiler: Here you go. (click to show/hide)