Bay 12 Games Forum

Dwarf Fortress => DF General Discussion => Topic started by: [P]sYDoNiA on July 06, 2009, 01:01:33 am

Title: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: [P]sYDoNiA on July 06, 2009, 01:01:33 am
So, when I made the 'Age of DF Gamers' I was not aware of the 'poll' button. (Shock! Horror!)

So... just out of pure curiousity...

What is your most recent IQ score?

If you know it, then go ahead and vote. If you don't, then you can take the test... For the lazy man/woman, heres a link (http://www.iqtest.com)

If you are uncomfortable with your score, then just do it anonymously. If you are paranoid and uncomfortable, I suggest you see a therapist.
(From what I have seen so far, I don't think you can directly tell who has voted in a poll...)

Oh, one more important thing:

Intelligence is relative.

It is especially true with your intelligence quotient, because 100 is the average for your age

Which means,

If at 14 years of age you score 116
and then,

At 19 years of age you score 112

This does not necessarily mean you are dumber!

It just means, when you were 14, you were smarter than the average person of your age.

At 19, you still are, but less above the average.

So think about that the next time you try to compare IQs with your previous ages...

EDIT:

It would be nice if you drop in your IQ score and your age too... just be more awesome.

Please no bullshitting, or anything like that.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 06, 2009, 01:29:34 am
This poll is flawed in the sense that nearly no one on the forum will value themselves under 100. Nearly everyone in this forum is too busy being egocentric on their ASCII high horse and thinking themselves superior to everyone to realize that we're all probably around 100 or so.

My apologies to the top 1%.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Keiseth on July 06, 2009, 01:36:05 am
Really? I thought the problem was that I've never found a free online IQ test that seemed legitimate and I have no idea how to get any other.

Also, to me, not knowing is more fun than knowing. Also more face-saving.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 06, 2009, 01:37:54 am
Really? I thought the problem was that I've never found a free online IQ test that seemed legitimate and I have no idea how to get any other.

Also, to me, not knowing is more fun than knowing. Also more face-saving.

This is the standardized test. I have not taken it in 2 years. I'm going to retake it now.
http://www.3smartcubes.com/pages/tests/iq-test/iq-test_instructions.asp
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: kalida99 on July 06, 2009, 01:46:56 am
hehe, just took mine, i was surprised, it was quite a bit higher than i anticapated. I guess now i can brag to some of my friends about being smarter than them hehe!
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Enzo on July 06, 2009, 01:54:17 am
Fact : IQ tests are garbage. Especially internet IQ tests. I've taken a couple, I always get a score of 140-160 (I am NOT a "genius"), and then they try to sell me a certificate with my score on it.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 06, 2009, 01:56:17 am
And I quote: Im_Sparks, your IQ is 132

I'm calling shenanigans on this test. There is no way I'm that smart, as many of the questions were quite simple for me, and I'm a high school student.

Unless I am that ungodly smart, which in that case it is hilarious.

Fact : IQ tests are garbage. Especially internet IQ tests. I've taken a couple, I always get a score of 140-160 (I am NOT a "genius"), and then they try to sell me a certificate with my score on it.
Exactly. I don't believe any "test" will correctly gauge your intelligence in 30 questions.

It's all rubbish, anyways. If you know you're smart, you don't need a test to reinforce your belief that you are.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 06, 2009, 01:58:13 am
EDIT: Terribly sorry for double-posting.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: kalida99 on July 06, 2009, 02:05:04 am
The internet ones are not as spot on as the actual ones because, well face it no one wants to sit on thier computer for three hours taking a 300 question quiz, these one are pretty close, being off from any where from 1-20 basically, the more questions the more accurate, but off course there are un documented sides to your intelligence rating, fatigue, hunger, etc which simply can't be put into your test so ALWAYS expect you test to be off by quite a few points.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Jualin on July 06, 2009, 02:07:38 am
150 of IQ.

I prefer to think that an IQ is not a measurement with any innate value, and cannot account for physical skills, physical talents, unusual thinking patterns, and sheer dumb luck.

But I'd be lying if I said deep down that result didn't give me this giddy sense of glee.  ::)

Now I've got to find a video of some child ubermensch online doing something improbably awesome to kick my ego down to size. Like curing cancer, or knocking out adult grizzly bears at the tender age of 10.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Skid on July 06, 2009, 02:11:17 am
I normally score in the 100-110 range but I got 126 on this one. o_0
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Enzo on July 06, 2009, 02:13:43 am
The problem I have with IQ tests (to clarify further than "they're garbage"), is that what defines intelligence is really subjective. Some of the best writers and musicians I know couldn't do Grade 9 level math to save their life. They would score badly on IQ tests. They are, as far as I'm concerned, brilliant people.

It's like asking someone if they know how to paint and having them respond "Yes, I am a 27."
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Morbo on July 06, 2009, 02:34:34 am
I wonder how I only got 92.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sowelu on July 06, 2009, 02:43:29 am
I drag this link out whenever an IQ discussion comes up:

http://www.bash.org/?758032

Seriously though, I'm great at tests, and I'm especially great at IQ tests.  Which kind of sucks when you get placed based on them as a kid, instead of a more realistic assessment.  Any kid with a good interest in math should know everything they can find on an IQ test, and most people who are in a good mood can ace those questions at which point it becomes "how fast can you read".

Nine year olds should not score 160 on a written IQ test, just because they aced it in under the time limit :x The official, written ones seemed really simple..  In any case, yeah, it wasn't all that accurate.  But I'm answering the poll anyway WOO!

I'm 25, and my last score was something like 149, but I don't remember the last time I didn't ace one of those tests so I'm just taking the last official written score I got, which was 160 at age 9.  Internet ones rarely go up as high.  Kind of funny how your score can vary so widely based on what the highest the test goes up to is :x


You know what would be awesome?  A test designed for well-rounded college graduates, where having all the knowledge would mean taking at least second-quarter classes in a wide variety of subjects.  Obscure literature is way better than vocabulary tests!  Advanced logic!  Math that's higher than geometry!  Chemistry!

(because seriously, I was pissed off when I aced the math part of my GRE and got, like, 90th percentile for a perfect score...and 97th or something for a less-than-perfect english score.)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Vampire Penguin on July 06, 2009, 03:07:39 am
Apparently 131. Though I did get impatient and guess on some of them. I got bored. Plus Asperger's.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: IndonesiaWarMinister on July 06, 2009, 03:21:27 am
I got 132 in my midschool's enterance exam.
I'm now highschool.

So expect it to be 'not' true.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Organ on July 06, 2009, 03:23:58 am
On the one linked to in the OP I got 149, and then I realized that I put in a fake age by habit. Tried the one Im_Sparks linked to, wrote my real age, and got 159. Should I say something profound? For what it's worth, the last time I took one of these internet IQ tests about a year ago, I distinctly remember getting a 136.

edit: Anyone know the answer to question 12 in the 3smartcubes test?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: [P]sYDoNiA on July 06, 2009, 03:38:43 am
Well guys, like I said, your IQ is relative to your age.

I remember my first IQ test, it was when I was 8 and I got something like 150ish...

Then 2 years later it was 130 sumthin.

That doesn't mean my mental capabilities have reduced, it means that the average intelligence of my age demographic is increasing.

Me, well I did a test again and I predicted it to be 120ish... and I got 130+

I only half surprised though...

.:INITIATING BRAGGING SEQUENCE:.

I wasn't that surprised as I am in the top academic class... In a school of over 2300 pupils I was selected out of 21 students as having the best scores in the school... I am currently being marked against the IGCSE Cambridge O-Level (3 years above my age) Marking rubric and I am achieving 23+ (Out of 25 baby!) in timed 40 minuted essays...

.:END RANT:.


Damn, I am a fucking nerd.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Capntastic on July 06, 2009, 03:44:04 am
Why do the options only go down to 80?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Organ on July 06, 2009, 04:01:19 am
Why do the options only go down to 80?
Do you mean even if you answer every question wrong and sit there for hours before pressing finish you still get 80?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: [P]sYDoNiA on July 06, 2009, 04:03:32 am
Why do the options only go down to 80?
Do you mean even if you answer every question wrong and sit there for hours before pressing finish you still get 80?

Noticed I typed in the minus symbol infront of 80

Which means 80 and below.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Impaler[WrG] on July 06, 2009, 04:04:55 am
A more reliable method is to use your SAT score, the dirty little secret of the entire educational establishment is that the SAT is nothing more then a glorified IQ test.  Your combined verbal/math score in can be converted to an IQ rather easily.

Use this converter and your last SAT score, it should be a lot more reliable.  But in any event a standard deviation is about as much accuracy as should be assumed here.  My score of 1410 puts me some ware in the third standard deviation, which I suspect a lot of DF players will be in (about half of us are Programmers for one thing).

http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/oldSATIQ.aspx (scores before 1995)
http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/SATIQ.aspx (after 1995)

Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Karlito on July 06, 2009, 04:12:29 am
I got 150 on Im_Spark's test.  I think the OP's test send my score to the completely made up email address I provided, so I'll never find that one out.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Von Krieger on July 06, 2009, 04:37:24 am
Was tested in elementary school, and had it come out to be 155. The internet tests reliably place me around 150-160. The 3 cubes one linked here gave me 156.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: umiman on July 06, 2009, 04:43:09 am
Heh...

I have a hard time believing those scores in the poll...
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: cerapa on July 06, 2009, 04:52:45 am
Got a 141 on that test that was posted.

I dont trust these IQ tests. You cant measure someones intelligence by asking a few questions. Not to mention that I dont even know what they are actually trying to measure.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ChJees on July 06, 2009, 05:05:48 am
Mine is... 0 :P. (Hasn't bothered to take one)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Broose on July 06, 2009, 05:06:43 am
Mine is... 0 :P. (Hasn't bothered to take one)

LOL I GET IT
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: asper on July 06, 2009, 05:18:43 am
IQ tests measure.... the ability of solving IQ tests.

Now, whether this ability is equivalent to what we call intelligence, is a hard question to answer.

The skills needed to solve IQ tests are predominantly based on math. They may be important, but is 'intelligence' not broader than that? A historian which proposes a new way to look at some historic event may be called "brilliant", but being a dunce in math, would be do good on an IQ test?

For sure, it is an accomplishment if you do well on IQ tests, but I do think that a very narrow set of skills is measured by it.

These tests reward people who have an interest in math, puzzles, games like chess and go, programming, etc. These are specific interests and hobbies, and if someone has different interests, it does not mean he is stupider. However, an IQ test will reward the person who likes to solve math problems every evening, while someone who prefers to read literature, go to the pub or to play computer games, will have a harder time. Does this mean this person is less intelligent?

Attitude is very important. Some people simply don't have the patience to solve these problems. Maybe they haven't been put through school, where they were trained to sit down and do problems. Does this mean they're stupid? Also, it has been shown that people generally do better on their second try of an IQ test, than on their first one.

Basically, IQ tests are important, but it is a bit of an stretch to say that what they measure is 'intelligence', at least in the everyday meaning of this word.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ampersand on July 06, 2009, 05:25:23 am
I'm not sure anyone here has taken a legitimate IQ test, such as the WAIS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wechsler_Adult_Intelligence_Scale). However, I took such a test at around 16 that marked my IQ at 162. I don't remember what it was called, but it was a professional affair at the school I attended.

I am now 20, so assuming I answer the questions exactly the same way, my score would be somewhere around 130 or 140.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: GFXiNXS on July 06, 2009, 05:29:08 am
As per Im_Sparks test, I'm only sitting on 129. I can't remember the last time I haven't recieved that score in an IQ test.

21 Years old, Full Time Graphic artist (Currently running the department at a broadcast corporation). I'd be curious to know the profession of the average, employed DF player. How many engineers do you think we have running amock?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: G-Flex on July 06, 2009, 05:32:32 am
I don't know what my IQ is, but I like to think I'm knowledgeable enough to know that the online tests are usually bunk.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sir Pseudonymous on July 06, 2009, 06:04:13 am
 :-[

I voted the last score I remembered, 129. Then I looked at the SAT conversion chart, and bothered to do the quiz Im_Sparks posted, ending up with 137 and 139, respectively.

I had some more to say, but stopped caring halfway through writing it. That would be the number one reason I rarely post anywhere.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sowelu on July 06, 2009, 06:11:27 am
I'd be curious to know the profession of the average, employed DF player. How many engineers do you think we have running amock?

I previously wrote C++ for Windows Mobile for Automotive, currently I'm writing javascript (in another window as we speak!) for a slightly less-engineering-ish position...but it's server-side scripting so it's still Honest Work (tm), not web monkey stuff.  So, engineer.  :)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Blargityblarg on July 06, 2009, 06:31:38 am
I completed the test, only guessed one answer, am confident i got the rest right.

Then I saw it asking for e-mail address and age, and thought 'oh-ho, you aren't fooling me!' and left the site.

Everything is a scam.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Kittah_Khan on July 06, 2009, 06:37:20 am
Intelligence cannot be quantified so easily.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sir Pseudonymous on July 06, 2009, 06:44:25 am
I completed the test, only guessed one answer, am confident i got the rest right.

Then I saw it asking for e-mail address and age, and thought 'oh-ho, you aren't fooling me!' and left the site.

Everything is a scam.
I just gave it a throwaway email and 'null' as the name. It's the screen after that that's the scam, where it asks for significantly more, and money. It does email the results to you anyways, though.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: shadow_archmagi on July 06, 2009, 07:00:26 am
Intelligence is not a number that can be quantified easily, nor is "intelligence" really a useful word. People's brains will always be like their computers; divided up into any number of sections any one of which may be better or worse or better or much better with a tendency to burst into flame or...


That said, your internet test gives me 135 (I actually just realized that Age is relevant but I put myself in as being a year older than I am out of habit. I also registered as hilter (hitler is always taken) out of habit.)

My ACT scores say that in everything but math I'm superior to 90% of students.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Organ on July 06, 2009, 07:03:30 am
A more reliable method is to use your SAT score, the dirty little secret of the entire educational establishment is that the SAT is nothing more then a glorified IQ test.  Your combined verbal/math score in can be converted to an IQ rather easily.

Use this converter and your last SAT score, it should be a lot more reliable.  But in any event a standard deviation is about as much accuracy as should be assumed here.  My score of 1410 puts me some ware in the third standard deviation, which I suspect a lot of DF players will be in (about half of us are Programmers for one thing).

http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/oldSATIQ.aspx (scores before 1995)
http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/SATIQ.aspx (after 1995)
Interesting. Though there isn't a conversion chart for the new 2400 SATs, which I did better on. Using my old 1600 SAT scores (taken as a 6th grader), my IQ is an estimated 136-138.
I'm not sure anyone here has taken a legitimate IQ test, such as the WAIS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wechsler_Adult_Intelligence_Scale). However, I took such a test at around 16 that marked my IQ at 162. I don't remember what it was called, but it was a professional affair at the school I attended.

I am now 20, so assuming I answer the questions exactly the same way, my score would be somewhere around 130 or 140.
Course it's unlikely that you would, that's the whole point of adjusting for age. What I'm really curious about is whether your consciousness, the sum of your everyday thoughts, is significantly different from mine.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sir Pseudonymous on July 06, 2009, 07:18:35 am
A more reliable method is to use your SAT score, the dirty little secret of the entire educational establishment is that the SAT is nothing more then a glorified IQ test.  Your combined verbal/math score in can be converted to an IQ rather easily.

Use this converter and your last SAT score, it should be a lot more reliable.  But in any event a standard deviation is about as much accuracy as should be assumed here.  My score of 1410 puts me some ware in the third standard deviation, which I suspect a lot of DF players will be in (about half of us are Programmers for one thing).

http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/oldSATIQ.aspx (scores before 1995)
http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/SATIQ.aspx (after 1995)
Interesting. Though there isn't a conversion chart for the new 2400 SATs, which I did better on. Using my old 1600 SAT scores (taken as a 6th grader), my IQ is an estimated 136-138.
My understanding is that the 2400 point SAT is the old 1600 one with a 100% meaningless writing section tacked onto the end. I remember something about that being ignored by universities and such because "the scoring isn't properly calibrated yet" or something along those lines.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Puck on July 06, 2009, 07:23:05 am
We did several IQ tests back at school during the years, and if I remember correctly my lowest result was 130 and my highest was 137.

I dont even know how they calculate that and I still fail at several areas of life, so I guess it doesnt mean all that much  ;D

The online test is just timing out on me when it comes to sending the result, also it seems awfully short for a proper IQ test, doesnt it?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Agdune on July 06, 2009, 07:36:20 am
I remember getting 140 when I was young... Got 129 now at age 21.

Remembering that IQ scores are an average of the general population's scores, the tests aren't exactly updated in real-time. We're all smarter than the average was when the original version of that cheap little test was compiled, not a gang of mega-intellects come together on the web. Could probably help contribute a fair bit to the high scores we're all getting?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Tormy on July 06, 2009, 07:45:09 am
+ 150  9 (20%) - Impressive!  :o
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Tenebrais on July 06, 2009, 07:48:19 am
The last couple of times I took online IQ tests I got 138. I'm in Mensa, so this is believable (my original IQ when applying at age 7 was 160).

I have a friend of IQ 119 who says DF seems too smart for her.


On the subject of IQ itself, it's really more a measure of puzzle-solving skills than anything else.

EDIT: This IQ test gave me 145. I think it's a little higher than is accurate.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Rowanas on July 06, 2009, 09:07:17 am
rowan, your IQ is 144

SCore. it's gone up by two points. I argue with the validity of this test though.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Samus1111111 on July 06, 2009, 09:34:13 am
I sense something is up with the test due to almost 1/3 of the people having taken it scoring in the 130-139 range

either that or there are a lot of people here with a close IQ, maybe we're all just that smart :P
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Taritus on July 06, 2009, 09:39:16 am
When I got tested for my school's gifted education program I tested around 165 or something.  Mother refuses to give an exact, but I know I'm eligible for MENSA with my score (though I may need to retake one).
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Rowanas on July 06, 2009, 09:43:08 am
Well, you've got to be clever or very stubborn to make it past the first 3 minutes of impenetrable dwarf fortress creation :D
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 06, 2009, 10:03:52 am
I've never trusted standardized tests for measuring intelligence . . . not since I was little anyway. You see, my older sister is the smartest person I know. She read the complete works of Shakespeare by the age of 12, got straight A's all throughout her school career (and her school career included such topics as Astrophysics, Biochemistry, and Molecular Virology at the most advanced prep school in our state), and found a vaccine for a virus that causes cancer in chickens as her high school project. Not to mention that she recently graduated magna cum laude with a dual degree in Biology and Chemistry and is currently working with autistic children in helping them communicate with the outside world. (One of her charges began to speak for the first time in his entire life under her care.)

And I have always, always scored higher than her on standardized tests. Not by a small margin either.

The fact of the matter is that I'm not nearly as smart as she is, nor do I have the excellent track record she has for accomplishments. I've never read the complete works of Shakespeare. I almost flunked out of AP Biology, and my school project wasn't a practical application of science. I'm a stay-at-home wife and professional artist. There's no way I'm smarter than her. So if the standardized tests say that I'm smarter then they're wrong.

*gets off the soapbox* :D

EDIT: Though I would like to make it clear that I don't begrudge anybody a feeling of pride for having scored well or taken the test or anything. Whatever makes you feel smart/happy is a good thing! I just don't trust standardized tests.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Greiger on July 06, 2009, 11:00:20 am
Back when I was a freshman in high school, the school gave out IQ tests and I had gotten a whopping 136. 

A couple semesters ago some proctoring agency gave out IQ tests at my college to anyone with the time and interest.  On that one I got 112.

8 year difference. I don't know if it was because I was an honors student in middle school and pretty much stopped paying attention in high school, or something else.  Internet tests I have taken all vary wildly with the results.

Oh and I'm 26.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 11:12:11 am
I'MA GENISIS.

Beat that Nintedno!
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Krash on July 06, 2009, 11:22:57 am
Intelligence is always nice to have, but from my experience at university, discipline and interest beats it hands down most of the time.  When you get off the beaten path though, intelligence rocks; all the memorize everything types don't stand a chance then.  That's when I get to shine (for a change :D)

Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 11:25:36 am
If you have good logic skills (if you're smart) you can figure out something, without knowing what it is.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 06, 2009, 11:25:56 am
Lol, we now know that the bay12 forums are full of 13-20 year old geniuses.

How interesting.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: jamoecw on July 06, 2009, 11:39:29 am
so i voted, then took the test.
<img src="http://www.3smartcubes.com/images/iq_scores/141.gif" style="border: none;"> (http://www.3smartcubes.com?iq-score)
3SmartCubes.com - <a title="IQ Test" href="http://www.3smartcubes.com?iq-score">IQ Test[/url]
141 if it doesn't show up.  i agree that iq tests are garbage, i have gotten anywhere from 128 to 180 from various iq tests, frankly i'd like to lower the score i voted with to reflect the test i just took.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 11:46:03 am
Lol, we now know that the bay12 forums are full of 13-20 year old geniuses.

How interesting.

Isn't it amazing! ;D
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Creamcorn on July 06, 2009, 11:47:31 am
Haaah, I got 101, hah   hah   hah.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: sonerohi on July 06, 2009, 12:00:48 pm
126 at 14.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: G-Flex on July 06, 2009, 12:02:04 pm
Lol, we now know that the bay12 forums are full of 13-20 year old geniuses.

How interesting.


Online tests tend to give damn near everyone a high IQ.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Karlito on July 06, 2009, 12:42:03 pm
Worst. Bell curve.  Ever.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 12:42:42 pm
Worst. Bell curve.  Ever.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Best. Slope. Ever.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: SniHjen on July 06, 2009, 12:44:53 pm
I'm not going to take that test.

4 years ago, I got a draft letter.

at the site:
Hearing and vision was tested first.
Then there was a IQ test, specifically designed so that it was impossible to fully complete in the 1 hour given.
I buggered them until they told me how well I did, (I was so scared that I had epicfailed it or something)  I... apprently... scored in the top1%

I raised my brow at him with a WTF kind of look on my face, but when I spoke with the other draft'es... I had so much trouble, (and still have trouble,) understanding why so many had problems with the questions off the test, the first 1/4 of it was ludicrously simple, and everyone should be capable of figuring it out... or so I thought.

And I now know why.

Have you heard of The Dunning-Kruger effect.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyOHJa5Vj5Y


On a completely unrelated note, I found this in Youtubes souces code:

Code: [Select]
msg["koreaFail"]
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 12:46:08 pm
Give me 7 minutes.


EDIT:  Wow, I never knew that, hmmm.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: cerapa on July 06, 2009, 01:02:09 pm
The high IQ of DF players might come from its complexity. Those who think its too confusing usually leave in the first minute.

Its a stupidity filter!
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 01:05:40 pm
I agree with that, but many don't.  I don't know why.   ;D
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Pandora on July 06, 2009, 01:08:12 pm
I think the stupidity filter theory is plausible.
But, there is a fairly high range of error on these internet tests. I took two tests in a row just now. on the first I got 133 and the second i got 147. seriously, i wouldn't be surprised if statistically that would all average out to about 130. I know I'm not that smart. :)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Enzo on July 06, 2009, 01:11:52 pm
Karlito : awesome graph. That made me happy.

I'm not contesting that the DF community would probably be smarter on average than a random sampling, but does anybody actually believe we're averaging over 130? Maybe even 140, depending on what all those "150+" people think they score? That's completely ridiculous.

Isn't is painfully obvious internet IQ tests inflate your score? This is so they become popular ("I scored 168! You try it!") and make money from adspace, and almost always so that they can try to sell you a certificate with your score for bragging rights. It's a really transparent ploy.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Karlito on July 06, 2009, 01:15:21 pm
Isn't is painfully obvious internet IQ tests inflate your score? This is so they become popular ("I scored 168! You try it!") and make money from adspace, and almost always so that they can try to sell you a certificate with your score for bragging rights. It's a really transparent ploy.

Yes, but then the question is "How smart do you have to be to recognize their scheme?"
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Pandora on July 06, 2009, 01:16:44 pm
hahaha, yah. Hopefully the take home message today is DF gamers know not to 'buy the test score analysis' bit at the end.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: SniHjen on July 06, 2009, 01:17:58 pm
Yes, but then the question is "How smart do you have to be to recognize their scheme?"

Of Cause!

The test isn't the test itself, but is in realizing that the test is a sham!
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 01:21:17 pm
Unless it's trying to make itself look like a sham by making it not look like a sham!

PARANOIA.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sowelu on July 06, 2009, 01:24:42 pm
My understanding is that the 2400 point SAT is the old 1600 one with a 100% meaningless writing section tacked onto the end. I remember something about that being ignored by universities and such because "the scoring isn't properly calibrated yet" or something along those lines.

It's still used in case of an anomalously low score.  More people than you would think try to get into college with absolutely NO writing ability, and then crash and burn hardcore.  Speaking as a grader for a few intro engineering classes (okay, programming really), people who can't write to save their lives really shouldn't be in college until they improve...they drop out really, really fast.

I'd say that the writing section is the best indicator of actual ability, or at least it's the hardest thing to get inappropriately high scores on.  Anyone with very narrow training can do very good on math, and plenty of people can do very good on the reading kinda stuff without much true comprehension.  The writing part weeds out the people that -need- weeding out.


Yes, but then the question is "How smart do you have to be to recognize their scheme?"

Of Cause!

The test isn't the test itself, but is in realizing that the test is a sham!

I've seen one that ACTUALLY DID THAT.  You entered your email address at the beginning...and it sent you your results ten minutes after you stopped submitting pages, where your score was solely based on how early you stopped playing.  I got up to somewhere around 34 pages, even after I realized that the questions seemed to be repetitive and randomly generated >.> I wonder what that says about me, but let's just say my results weren't triple-digit.

Another awesome one I saw...it logs the IP address you took the test from, and it gives you a special image URL to post your results, with a picture of a rabbit with one of those fancy graduation caps on his head along with the number you got (which I think was a minimum of 120+).  But it only shows that picture to your IP address.  Everyone else loads a different picture, rabbit in a dunce cap, score around 89...which meant that for a couple days, Livejournal was full of people with sub-100 IQs and posts saying "Wow, I didn't expect to do this well, I'm really surprised!"
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: umiman on July 06, 2009, 01:28:35 pm
Sowelu: Hah, those are awesome. Do you know where those sites are? And why did you take so many IQ tests?/
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ampersand on July 06, 2009, 01:42:02 pm
I would like to direct everyone here to, oh, browse through the GameFAQs forums for a few minutes. Not to see any specific thing, but rather to see the rather obvious dichotomy between the ability of the posters there to string together coherent sentences compared to the posters here.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Balathustrius on July 06, 2009, 01:42:42 pm

Have you heard of The Dunning-Kruger effect.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyOHJa5Vj5Y


Wow, that explains a lot of human behavior I've found very mystifying.  But of course; if you're not competent at something, why would you be able to recognize that competence in others?

I wonder if that makes me competent, since I didn't recognize other people's incompetence at recognizing competence.  Hmmmmm.  Well, since I post on the DF boards, I must have at least a 150 IQ!   ;D

...which meant that for a couple days, Livejournal was full of people with sub-100 IQs and posts saying "Wow, I didn't expect to do this well, I'm really surprised!"

Lol!
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Balathustrius on July 06, 2009, 01:44:58 pm
I would like to direct everyone here to, oh, browse through the GameFAQs forums for a few minutes. Not to see any specific thing, but rather to see the rather obvious dichotomy between the ability of the posters there to string together coherent sentences compared to the posters here.

We probably have a higher average age-level here, though.  Isn't GameFAQs mostly 11-yo-old console kiddies?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Granite26 on July 06, 2009, 01:45:11 pm
The high IQ of DF players might come from its complexity. Those who think its too confusing usually leave in the first minute.

Its a stupidity filter!

There's also a selection bias towards people
A: Knowing their IQ in the first place
B: Hanging out on internet forums as a social activity
C: (as discussed) playing DF in the first place
D: Hanging out on this forum
E: Reading a topic about IQ
F: Self Reporting IQ.


Sowelu:  I took that same test too.  Fortunately I gave them a dummy email address cause damn...  I noticed the first repeat question on the 3rd page, but decided it was probably confirming consistancy.  I must have taken 30 mins worth of them (I was REALLY bored at work and didn't have anything better to do with my time).  I've always gone with 'it says you are persistant as my excuse.

Edit: For no YouTube at work types (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning-Kruger_effect)

Editer: More people are dumb (http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/07/stupider-than-you-realize.html)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sowelu on July 06, 2009, 01:48:30 pm
Sowelu: Hah, those are awesome. Do you know where those sites are? And why did you take so many IQ tests?/

Sadly, last time I saw either of those was ~4 years ago, they're quite likely not even online anymore.

And because EVERYONE likes a program that tells them they're smart!  Why think, when you have a machine that tells you you're thinking instead!  Also I was bored.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Puck on July 06, 2009, 02:44:49 pm
Nice, the IQ test site managed to fire off its mail to my junk adress, finally.

It says 140, and I call bullshit. I bet it adds 20 points when you decide not to pay and substracts 40 when you start to give them your money... But seeing what I did to my brain in the last decades I just dont think 140 is in anyway true. Especially since I was overly tired and still on strong pain medication when I took the test. I estimate I have to hover somewhere around 120 or so, maybe a bit lower.

I can see it in everydays life, I'm a bit faster than most folks when it comes to grasping stuff, and a bit slower than some of them.

And either way, I dont fit in. I'm the jockiest of all nerds and nerdiest of all jocks ...  :'(
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ampersand on July 06, 2009, 02:46:52 pm
And either way, I dont fit in. I'm the jockiest of all nerds and nerdiest of all jocks ...  :'(

Reminds me of me. Lets steal a table in the cafeteria.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Puck on July 06, 2009, 02:48:42 pm
ALRIGHT! and lets build a skate/bikeramp out of it, but letz calculate the angle with SCIENCE !
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sutremaine on July 06, 2009, 02:49:27 pm
Sadly, last time I saw either of those was ~4 years ago, they're quite likely not even online anymore.
The endless IQ test was from thespark.com, which now redirects you to a sparknotes site.

I got 129, which is alright for an online test and considering I haven't sat down and done any maths for several years (I'm 24). I'm shocked at how long I needed to think about things that I would have worked out as quickly as 2+2 ten years ago.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: [P]sYDoNiA on July 06, 2009, 06:13:38 pm
And either way, I dont fit in. I'm the jockiest of all nerds and nerdiest of all jocks ...  :'(

Reminds me of me. Lets steal a table in the cafeteria.

Brothers. Let this be meeting be three.

And THIS just gave me an awesome idea for a new thread.... :D
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Mad Larks on July 06, 2009, 06:47:05 pm
I took the test

Got a 126. I used to score a...118, I think.

While yes, it did make my ego swell with pride, I very much doubt this test is legit.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Slappy Moose on July 06, 2009, 07:33:18 pm
OH WOW COOL I wasted minutes of my life taking the stupid test and now I have to pay to get my results.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 06, 2009, 07:37:14 pm
Just choose 150+ to be cool like everyone else.   8)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Mad Larks on July 06, 2009, 07:39:49 pm
Nope, Slappy. Just check your email. You have to waste money if you want the "complete" version, whatever the hell that means. I guess its just auxiliary poppycock.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Areyar on July 06, 2009, 07:53:48 pm
so... that test is flawed. Even for such a short test.
 
I got a 138 (very gifted), while I should score much lower as
1- I'm a non-native english speaker
2- I wasted lots of time messing with the batteries in my faltering mouse.
3- Never did an IQ test before, so score should be fairly low-end.
I'd have expected a fair score of 110-120 as I'm on the topside of average intellect. According to this test most of us are a genius. :P

Now those people have my email, I feel stupiderer already.   
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Puck on July 06, 2009, 07:55:46 pm
I think 3 doesnt matter.

But yeah, the email part is true  ;D

But that's what disposable mail adresses are for...

edit: but I'd like to see the three people that voted  <80 speak up... if they can type, that is  ;D
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sensei on July 06, 2009, 08:03:47 pm
To be fair, I wouldn't have guessed Areyar wasn't native to english- you're certainly better in text than most of the people on popular forums.

Anyway, those that voted <80 are probably either brave or have serious self-confidence issues.

I voted 130-139 because that's where I usually score on Bellevue school district tests... and Bellevue seems to (generally) be tougher than most, although we took a dent just like everyone else from No Child Left Behind and similar stuff. IMO, people with developmental issues should be in their own programs, not normal people taking everything and a developmentally issued pace...

Anyway, the IQ tests here are probably skewed a bit.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Puck on July 06, 2009, 08:04:29 pm
I'm a stay-at-home wife and professional artist. There's no way I'm smarter than her.
Arguable. I guess I'd prefer your life over hers, so maybe you ARE the smarter one  :P
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: PsyberianHusky on July 07, 2009, 01:20:58 am
I got 134 and I am 20?
I still find it hard to believe I am more intelligent then the average Joe , however I seem to be average for a DF player, so perhaps birds of a feather play DF together.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: KoE on July 07, 2009, 07:37:49 am
I have to agree with the many-pages-ago bit on standardized testing being charitably described as 'bunk'. I 'excelled' through school by merely coasting through and bothering to do the work presented to me, be it hard or busy. The only places I didn't get all A's were in math (post-geometry), as that is a discipline I hate with a passion normally reserved for telemarketers and lawyers, and a couple of goofs were I was intentionally lazy. I bring this up because somebody mentioned the woeful tendency to teach towards the lowest common denominator (see: No Child Left Behind) over the past several decades, as I understand it. (My parents were segregated into A / B / C / D classes with different curriculums. Mom was in A class, dad was in D class, and even then I believe the primary thing was an issue of motivation and not raw mental ability.)

Back on the testing thing, the state standardized test was again something I aced, without trying. I distinctly remember doing the exact opposite of most test prep suggestions (stayed up late, overslept, did not eat breakfast) for at least one of the damn things. My mind being what it is, one of my most vivid high school memories is being deeply confused when my Freshman geography teacher winds up in the lunch line beside me and congratulates me on something. When queried, he informed me of my absurdly high scores which I had completely ignored (or not gotten yet, I don't remember.) It was like being congratulated for not sucking. Which I suppose to some extent, it was.

Another vivid memory surrounds the same tests (at a lower grade level) wherein an acquaintance failed one portion of the test or another and broke down on me, which I found very awkward in that I hate being touched and I had no idea what to say. The only way I could fathom at the time to fail the thing was to either intentionally not do it, be extremely sloppy, or be able to lose a contest of wits to a box of rocks. Funnily enough, I don't remember it as having much to do with the test as being the one time I've had someone crying on my shoulder. Go figure.

Anyway, enough of that crap aside - about the IQ test! I apparently scored 134 - this in less-than-ideal conditions such as 'just woke up' and 'felt the sudden need to go to the restroom in the middle of the test'. I also reported my age as 21 because I'll be so in a few days, though I doubt that impacted it much.

Another, actually related tale from high school was in my first Computer Science class (sophomore year of HS if memory serves), we had a day where the assignment was done and we were jerking around on the Internet. This eventually turned into taking Internet IQ tests as a measure of manhood. I can't remember the exact numbers, but I do remember taking great pleasure in my good friend scoring something like a 148, gloating over it and laughing at me for taking so much time (he was always a faster mathmetician than I), and within a few moments I had pressed submit... And had something in the neighborhood of 5 to 10 points over it. He was crushed.

But yeah, enough rambling.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Kalimar on July 07, 2009, 07:42:49 am
I got that super cool autism that makes me super bright and super cool. Asperger's to be exact. Yes, I know, I know that you wish you were certified autistic like me, but you're not and I am and I'm super cool and super bright thanks to Aspergers. Oh yeah, only one drawback bros -- I can't talk to girls or look them in the eyes. Weirds me out bros. OK, later super cool super bright bros.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Muz on July 07, 2009, 08:43:05 am
I hate IQ tests. I could go on a full scale ramble on them if I had time.

Suffice it is to say that the smartest person in the world is apparently the person who made the test.

Pick the one that doesn't fit in.
A. Apple
B. Pineapple
C. Orange
D. Carrot

The right answer? Pineapple, because it has 3 syllables.
Well, my advanced brain says carrot, because carrot doesn't have an e.
Someone else could argue that it's carrot because it's not sweet.
Or apple because there's no such thing as an orange colored apple.

IQ tests are for nerds.

I'm autistic too. bah
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: cerapa on July 07, 2009, 08:46:38 am
Id say carrot cause its the only one that you eat the roots of.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ralith on July 07, 2009, 08:54:17 am
According to that test, 150. (3cubes that is)
According to two credible tests, 144 and 142.(Real life)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Volfram on July 07, 2009, 08:59:13 am
I voted 138, scored 140 on the OP's test, and generally score 99% on standardized tests that don't involve Literature(where my score drops to 97%).  I also have about a 2.5 GPA.(that's "barely passing," for those of you too lazy to think about it.)

Yesterdy, my mom suggested I should take an IQ test to quantify exactly how smart I am.  The last official one I took was about 15 years ago, I pegged it, and being smarter than everyone else just made them hate me.  I'd prefer not to know, and have all of my friends admire me for being smart than hate me for knowing I'm smarter than them.

I've never trusted standardized tests for measuring intelligence . . . not since I was little anyway. You see, my older sister is the smartest person I know. She read the complete works of Shakespeare by the age of 12, got straight A's all throughout her school career (and her school career included such topics as Astrophysics, Biochemistry, and Molecular Virology at the most advanced prep school in our state), and found a vaccine for a virus that causes cancer in chickens as her high school project. Not to mention that she recently graduated magna cum laude with a dual degree in Biology and Chemistry and is currently working with autistic children in helping them communicate with the outside world. (One of her charges began to speak for the first time in his entire life under her care.)

And I have always, always scored higher than her on standardized tests. Not by a small margin either.

The fact of the matter is that I'm not nearly as smart as she is, nor do I have the excellent track record she has for accomplishments. I've never read the complete works of Shakespeare. I almost flunked out of AP Biology, and my school project wasn't a practical application of science. I'm a stay-at-home wife and professional artist. There's no way I'm smarter than her. So if the standardized tests say that I'm smarter then they're wrong.

*gets off the soapbox* :D

EDIT: Though I would like to make it clear that I don't begrudge anybody a feeling of pride for having scored well or taken the test or anything. Whatever makes you feel smart/happy is a good thing! I just don't trust standardized tests.
You are not your sister.  Don't compare yourself to what she's good at.  You're good at different things.

To be fair, I wouldn't have guessed Areyar wasn't native to english- you're certainly better in text than most of the people on popular forums.
Most non-native English speakers are.  They take more care with what they type than native speakers do, because they had to work to learn it, and don't take it for granted like Squeakers do.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 07, 2009, 09:09:34 am
I got that super cool autism that makes me super bright and super cool. Asperger's to be exact. Yes, I know, I know that you wish you were certified autistic like me, but you're not and I am and I'm super cool and super bright thanks to Aspergers. Oh yeah, only one drawback bros -- I can't talk to girls or look them in the eyes. Weirds me out bros. OK, later super cool super bright bros.

I've heard of that.  Makes you real smart, right?  *starts grinning
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 07, 2009, 09:16:12 am
I'm a stay-at-home wife and professional artist. There's no way I'm smarter than her.
Arguable. I guess I'd prefer your life over hers, so maybe you ARE the smarter one  :P

You are not your sister.  Don't compare yourself to what she's good at.  You're good at different things.

That would be true if she hated her life, but luckily she doesn't. :D

Okay, I'm just being difficult now.

I get what you're saying (both of you), in that there's an inherent cultural bias on what we consider to be genius/excellence based almost solely on whether people are working in careers that are seen as "good" or "beneficial" or "hard." Scientist working with autistic kids? Totally hard mode. Stay-at-home wife (soon to be mother!) who doodles and does fractals all day? Totally not.

I just really don't know how else to explain how much smarter than me she is than reciting things which are seen to have an inherent cultural value. Of course, you could then make the argument that I'm basing my evaluation of her intelligence on these culturally biased things, in which case I don't know how to respond to that and will just shrug my shoulders. :D To me it's a question that doesn't really have any meaning except to explain why I hate standardized tests. I'm happy with my life, she's happy with hers, we get along great, and I'm proud to death of everything that she's accomplished. I love to hear her talk about her work, and she loves that I am giving her a niece or nephew soon. I also feel like she's smarter than me, but that feeling doesn't cause me any angst or unhappiness; it's just a statement of fact. I guess it must sound really self-deprecating and negative, but to me it isn't.

So, I guess what I'm saying is, thank you for your concern over my self-esteem, but no worry needed! :D

Pick the one that doesn't fit in.
A. Apple
B. Pineapple
C. Orange
D. Carrot

The right answer? Pineapple, because it has 3 syllables.
Well, my advanced brain says carrot, because carrot doesn't have an e.
Someone else could argue that it's carrot because it's not sweet.
Or apple because there's no such thing as an orange colored apple.

My answer to that would be carrot because it's a vegetable and the others are fruits. But the point still stands: all the answers given here are valid, so the question needs to be rewritten or discarded. Incidentally, this is why IQ tests are given in supervised environments. Your reactions to questions like this are much more indicative of intelligence than happening to pick the right answer because you think the same way that the test writer does. In an actual IQ test, you'd be monitored and reactions such as this would be taken into the final score if I'm not mistaken.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Maggarg - Eater of chicke on July 07, 2009, 09:23:33 am
I picked them at random, giving me a score of 123.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 07, 2009, 09:25:42 am
I picked them at random, giving me a score of 123.

That's explains everything!   ;D  It must mean that if you pick at random on a test you get a higher score then the average joe (who most likely picked wrong answers on purpose to support this theory).
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Volfram on July 07, 2009, 09:41:39 am
I just really don't know how else to explain how much smarter than me she is than reciting things which are seen to have an inherent cultural value.

Please bear with me a bit, I've been watching The Big Bang Theory lately.(hilarious!)

Anyone who's seen the series knows, Sheldon and Leonard are a pair of PhDs working in a physics lab, and a pretty farm-girl moves in across the hall.(and if you haven't seen the show, there's your premise.)  In the pilot episode, Sheldon mentions that he and Leonard have a combined IQ over 360, and Sheldon is the smarter of the two.  And Sheldon is arguably "smarter" in the "inherent cultural value" you're talking about.

But anybody who's watched the show also knows that Sheldon is a complete and utter moron.  He can calculate dozens of dimensions in his head and is obsessed with String theory, is basically given to be the brainiest character on the show, but he has no social skills whatsoever, and if given a task which doesn't involve theoretical physics, he chokes.(He's also violently OCD and a spineless mamma's boy, to boot.)

Penny, the attractive neighbor, is actually top-tier intelligence for the show.  Most of what the "genius" characters say goes whizzing right over her head, but she handles it just fine, often talks it down to normal-speak on her own, and more importantly, is fairly well-adjusted.  "Oh, why didn't you just get a universal remote at Radio Shack?"

"Hey look, it's raining you!"


Or without the pop culture references, who's smarter: the graduate student still living in his parents' basement, or the high-school drop-out five-star chef who never needs a recipe?

Answer: neither.  They're both geniuses, just in different fields.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 07, 2009, 09:51:29 am
I just really don't know how else to explain how much smarter than me she is than reciting things which are seen to have an inherent cultural value.

Please bear with me a bit, I've been watching The Big Bang Theory lately.(hilarious!)

Anyone who's seen the series knows, Sheldon and Leonard are a pair of PhDs working in a physics lab, and a pretty farm-girl moves in across the hall.(and if you haven't seen the show, there's your premise.)  In the pilot episode, Sheldon mentions that he and Leonard have a combined IQ over 360, and Sheldon is the smarter of the two.  And Sheldon is arguably "smarter" in the "inherent cultural value" you're talking about.

But anybody who's watched the show also knows that Sheldon is a complete and utter moron.  He can calculate dozens of dimensions in his head and is obsessed with String theory, is basically given to be the brainiest character on the show, but he has no social skills whatsoever, and if given a task which doesn't involve theoretical physics, he chokes.(He's also violently OCD and a spineless mamma's boy, to boot.)

Penny, the attractive neighbor, is actually top-tier intelligence for the show.  Most of what the "genius" characters say goes whizzing right over her head, but she handles it just fine, often talks it down to normal-speak on her own, and more importantly, is fairly well-adjusted.  "Oh, why didn't you just get a universal remote at Radio Shack?"

"Hey look, it's raining you!"

Seen the show (entirely thanks to my sister, actually), so I get what you're talking about. :D I'd argue that the show has characters that seem to have inversely proportional IQs to Emotional IQs. Seems like in the show the higher your EIQ is, the lower your IQ is, and vice-versa.

I haven't seen much of the show though. I think I've seen up to the episode where they sneak into Penny's room and clean it while she's sleeping. :D
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Granite26 on July 07, 2009, 09:55:36 am
I hate IQ tests. I could go on a full scale ramble on them if I had time.
The right answer? Pineapple, because it has 3 syllables.

Yeah, this was about the time I gave up on standardized tests.  I believe in intelligence, just not in tests to measure it.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: SniHjen on July 07, 2009, 09:55:56 am
I'm rambling, ignore me.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 07, 2009, 10:11:44 am
Dear reader, if you are offended here, then it was on purpose.

Please no trolling, I'm really enjoying this thread. :( Please?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: SniHjen on July 07, 2009, 10:19:31 am
Dear reader, if you are offended here, then it was on purpose.

Please no trolling, I'm really enjoying this thread. :( Please?
It was not ment as trolling, but more of: "I am taking the time to make it sound nicer, if it sounds like I offends you, then thats my fault, (and yours too)"

as in: please be aware that I might/might-not-be saying hurtful things, please do not take them personal.

I suck at explaining.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Asehujiko on July 07, 2009, 10:21:22 am
By abuse of my skills as a former starcraft player, software cookies and previous knowledge of the questions, i managed to glitch one timed test into awarding me a 250.

For the poll i picked 142, which is the highest i ever got on a test that didn't involve adds for naked ladies or "free" mortgages in the sidebar.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: DJ on July 07, 2009, 10:30:41 am
I would say that apple pineapple and orange all grow on trees.
They don't.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 07, 2009, 10:34:34 am
Dear reader, if you are offended here, then it was on purpose.

Please no trolling, I'm really enjoying this thread. :( Please?
It was not ment as trolling, but more of: "I am taking the time to make it sound nicer, if it sounds like I offends you, then thats my fault, (and yours too)"

as in: please be aware that I might/might-not-be saying hurtful things, please do not take them personal.

I suck at explaining.

I feel like I can't answer your post because I fail at not being offended by it. I like to avoid arguments so, this is probably where I check out of the thread.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: jamoecw on July 07, 2009, 10:42:08 am
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Anonymous on July 07, 2009, 10:46:23 am
From what I've seen in my time on the Internets, you can post this same poll on any forum and get the same results.

I don't really have the patience to do the math, but I'll bet if you looked at the number of people in this thread who have received genius level scores compared to the number of people who have been online since it was posted, you'd see a percentage of geniuses far above the statistical norm. Which would be fine, except you'd see the same thing on any forum. So maybe people who post on internet forums are more intelligent than average? LOL, I think we all know that's not true. The only other explanation as far as I can tell (and I'm a genius obv), is that the test is flawed.

I did some playing around with the 3cubes test, and it seems that the worst possible score you can get is a 90. How does it make sense that you can only score as low as the 25% percentile, but you can score as high as the 99.9xxx percentile? I'll admit that I don't have the first clue as to how these tests actually work, but that seems odd to me.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 07, 2009, 11:34:59 am
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.

Well, um, isn't boiling water steam?  When water boils it evaporates into steam.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Joakim on July 07, 2009, 11:49:38 am
Here's a good, reliable intelligence test:

If you believe what an internet site tells you about your IQ, you're not intelligent (but not dumb either).
If you actually buy their certificate, you're dumb.

Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Granite26 on July 07, 2009, 01:13:52 pm
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.

Well, um, isn't boiling water steam?  When water boils it evaporates into steam.

depends on what the air pressure is (water boils at different temperatures at altitude), what the purity of the water is(Salt = less boil).  In general though, changing states takes energy, so the boiling water will be hotter and releasing energy by going up a state into steam.  On the other hand, steam can get hotter yet, while boiling water is as hot as it gets.

Like most questions, it's bullshit.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Karlito on July 07, 2009, 02:12:14 pm
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

I think it depends on which one is hotter.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Mohreb el Yasim on July 07, 2009, 03:26:31 pm
Actualy i abandoned these test when i saw thet most questions are grammatical ( i am not english, and i migth not have too much IQ cause i don't find on those pages how to change to hungarian ...) or flawed (honestly they just don't think on all possibilities so many answers can be rigth ...)
so maybe i will just chose -80 (it could be funny to have negative IQ-s like op suggested in his poll) to say i don't really belive in such things as IQ (really astrology is much more reliable then those questions ...)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 07, 2009, 03:36:52 pm
One good reason why people are getting high on IQ tests is because the school system has been restructured specifically to allow students to score high on IQ tests. (Thanks IQ tests...

Mind you Internet IQ tests are structured around making you feel good about yourself while not allowing you to get a score high enough to seriously doubt your results. I've specifically aced some Internet IQ tests and found that they stop at the 130-140 range. Afterall, you wouldn't like an IQ test that says your average, no you want one that says your much smarter then everyone else.

MANY of the questions I seen on IQ tests were copy and paste from actual school work I have done in elementary. A^2+B^2=C^2

I've taken Non-IQ tests outside the internet before... but I can't actually translate it into an IQ. For example I have WAY below average number short term memorisation but amazing cause and effect logic.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Rysith on July 07, 2009, 03:59:25 pm
Seen the show (entirely thanks to my sister, actually), so I get what you're talking about. :D I'd argue that the show has characters that seem to have inversely proportional IQs to Emotional IQs. Seems like in the show the higher your EIQ is, the lower your IQ is, and vice-versa.

For a very, very narrow definition of IQ (focusing around math/science/etc. aptitude, which that show seems to focus on from your descriptions), I've found that to be true in real life as well: people very far off in that kind of intelligence tend to have trouble relating to people who can't make the same kinds of mental leaps that they can, and (in some cases, particularly around aspergers/autism) have trouble understanding that other people don't think in the same terms, or at the same levels, that they do. Thus, low EIQ.

IQ was originally to measure logic and pattern recognition. Used for that, it does a fairly good job. I've taken professional "IQ" tests that had several different sections that tried to measure different areas, and I can see those being reasonably valid as well. Of course, the tests were three hours or so with a trained observer taking notes, not multiple-choice tests on the internet. No multiple choice at all, if I remember correctly, and no math/grammar/general knowledge questions either.

That said, the idea of IQ, EIQ, etc. are kind of bogus. I'm a programmer, good at math and logic. My brother is poor at math, excellent at linguistics and music. How can you even compare those two skill sets and their underlying natural aptitude? Some people are good at thinking about certain kinds of problems (how to make a program to do X), some people are good at thinking about other kinds of problems (what notes will sound good together?), nobody short of brain damage/development issues is bad at thinking about all kinds of problems, and it's all modified by mood, persistence, focus, competing interests, and outside stimuli. Trying to generate a single number to encompass all of that is not only pointless, but misleading.

And that said, and not to derail the thread, but I wonder how many DF players are (officially | self-diagnosed) out in the abnormal range of the autism spectrum?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 07, 2009, 04:07:00 pm
This is the In ternet Rysith apperantly it is a fad to believe your Autistic.

Though that comes from the fact that people apperantly confuse "Quirks" with "Autism" (Even News Stations have confused this)

So you put up "How autistic are you?" You are going to get a lot of people who believe they have a high functioning Autism rather then simply being Intrapersonal or secluded.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Shadowgandor on July 07, 2009, 04:10:15 pm
I've done 2 IQ tests 2 months ago, one was 118, the other 121. Ah well :P
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Rysith on July 07, 2009, 04:27:05 pm
This is the In ternet Rysith apperantly it is a fad to believe your Autistic.

Though that comes from the fact that people apperantly confuse "Quirks" with "Autism" (Even News Stations have confused this)

So you put up "How autistic are you?" You are going to get a lot of people who believe they have a high functioning Autism rather then simply being Intrapersonal or secluded.

Well, yes. That's why I put in the differentiation between officially diagnosed Autism Spectrum Disorder and self-diagnosed ASD. The entire thing is a bit less fuzzy when you apply actual diagnostic criteria to it, though the line between "introverted nerd" and "aspergers" can be a bit fuzzy even then.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 07, 2009, 04:28:38 pm
I'm diagnosed with aspergers, what's it to yah?
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: G-Flex on July 07, 2009, 04:44:08 pm
So's everybody. It is, unfortunately, not a very difficult diagnose to get.

Then you have all the people who self-diagnose, which is marginally worse. I say "marginally" because if you're remotely intellectual/nonsocial/weird you can doctor-shop and get professionally diagnosed with it without much trouble at all.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 07, 2009, 06:06:09 pm
Quote
the line between "introverted nerd" and "aspergers" can be a bit fuzzy even then

Aspergers is very specific I find it hard to find a Fuzzy line unless you pick and chose what Aspergers is (Which is what people do).

Though as odd as the "Aspergers is just a really nerdy person" thing is, the "Aspergers is some sort of serious mental disorder" line of reasoning is even more Bizaar.

I kid you not there is a crime drama out there where someone used Aspergers as a defense for a crime of a sexual nature.

Uhh though this is getting SLIGHTLY off topic... Not too far but any further and we would have derailed it.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Jude on July 07, 2009, 06:11:34 pm
I've never taken a real IQ test (aka, not an internet one) so idk
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Volfram on July 07, 2009, 06:32:24 pm
In this post, Wolfram makes an ass of himself, proves that he has no idea what IQ means, and deply insults einstein and tesla. (but he doesn't realize this.)

Yeah, actually, I don't realize it.  Enlighten me?

(Tesla was awesome, by the way.)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Zironic on July 07, 2009, 06:41:05 pm
This test doesn't test half the things that truly signify intelligence just, simple basic analysis. Memorization is also key.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 07, 2009, 06:44:26 pm
Well there are multiple kinds of intelligence anyhow.

IQ tests are generally there to test intelligence applicable to academics or something... Though I think they were first invented before people came up with ideas that intelligence can apply to more then what you can put down on a peice of paper however.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Zironic on July 07, 2009, 09:16:32 pm
edit:double post.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Zironic on July 07, 2009, 09:19:45 pm
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.
It depends on your definition of steam and boiling water, however scientifically, boiling water is hotter, because it is producing gaseous water. Steam, or the common definition of it, is mostly water vapor or liquid water suspend in the air and gaseous water, but it is decreasing in temperature, so it has to be cooler than boiling water.

I hate IQ tests. I could go on a full scale ramble on them if I had time.

Suffice it is to say that the smartest person in the world is apparently the person who made the test.

Pick the one that doesn't fit in.
A. Apple
B. Pineapple
C. Orange
D. Carrot

The right answer? Pineapple, because it has 3 syllables.
Well, my advanced brain says carrot, because carrot doesn't have an e.
Someone else could argue that it's carrot because it's not sweet.
Or apple because there's no such thing as an orange colored apple.

IQ tests are for nerds.

I'm autistic too. bah
I say carrot because it's a vegetable and the rest are fruit.
Isn't that the most obvious RIGHT answer?

That's the problem with an internet IQ test, it only predicts subjective knowledge. In person to person IQ test, they can analyze why you chose certain answers and actually define Intelligence Quotient through your reasoning. Which is much superior over a computer which can only analyze your answer, not your reason.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 07, 2009, 09:26:25 pm
Quote
Pick the one that doesn't fit in.
A. Apple
B. Pineapple
C. Orange
D. Carrot

Yeah but the Pineapple has two differences. Three Sylables and a color that isn't in the Red Range using RBY

All of them have differences. For example the Carrot is the only one without a general round shape, it also has the least sugar content and is a vegetable which also means it has the least water content of all of them. Along with this a Carrot grows in the ground while the rest grow from trees.

Which means the question is moot.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 07, 2009, 09:29:40 pm
Obviously E. Pear doesn't fit there.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sir Pseudonymous on July 07, 2009, 11:01:57 pm
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.
It depends on your definition of steam and boiling water, however scientifically, boiling water is hotter, because it is producing gaseous water. Steam, or the common definition of it, is mostly water vapor or liquid water suspend in the air and gaseous water, but it is decreasing in temperature, so it has to be cooler than boiling water.
Steam would have to be hotter. If it were cooler, then it wouldn't be steam, it would be sub-boiling water, possibly dissolved in the air. Assuming the air pressure is one atmosphere, and the water is undiluted, the water will only get up to 100 degrees celcius, after that the energy absorbed goes into the phase change. You're then left with steam at 100 degrees, assuming the energy being dumped into the water also gets into the steam, that would leave the steam marginally hotter than the water, but it has significantly more energy than the water regardless of that.

If it's a trick question, you're probably right. Ugh, it's too fucking ambiguous, and depends on whatever particular interpretation was going through the head of the person that wrote it. Shit like that on tests always pisses me off, when a question is ambiguous, wholly subjective, or both. Fortunately, I have a tendency to guess which of the right answers the writer was thinking...
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 07, 2009, 11:31:49 pm
And there you go the secret to a lot of IQ tests

It isn't JUST about actually being smart

It is also about predicting what the writer actually wants you to say.

So if you eat leaves and apples will kill you... and a test asks you "What is good to eat, leaves or apples?" your answer should be Leaves... No matter HOW much I likely misspelled it.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Zironic on July 07, 2009, 11:47:30 pm
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.
It depends on your definition of steam and boiling water, however scientifically, boiling water is hotter, because it is producing gaseous water. Steam, or the common definition of it, is mostly water vapor or liquid water suspend in the air and gaseous water, but it is decreasing in temperature, so it has to be cooler than boiling water.
Steam would have to be hotter. If it were cooler, then it wouldn't be steam, it would be sub-boiling water, possibly dissolved in the air. Assuming the air pressure is one atmosphere, and the water is undiluted, the water will only get up to 100 degrees celcius, after that the energy absorbed goes into the phase change. You're then left with steam at 100 degrees, assuming the energy being dumped into the water also gets into the steam, that would leave the steam marginally hotter than the water, but it has significantly more energy than the water regardless of that.

If it's a trick question, you're probably right. Ugh, it's too fucking ambiguous, and depends on whatever particular interpretation was going through the head of the person that wrote it. Shit like that on tests always pisses me off, when a question is ambiguous, wholly subjective, or both. Fortunately, I have a tendency to guess which of the right answers the writer was thinking...
Your still thinking wrong. Visible steam is not GASEOUS water thus it is less hot, because it is suspend water vapor and gaseous water, and it is cooling down and condensing. However boiling water is becoming gaseous water and is not cooling down it is heating up, so in the idea of heat or the excitement of particles and how it transfers - how hot it is, boiling water is hotter than steam. Steam doesn't have to be heated to exist. It can exist below 100 celsius. Boiling water cannot in normal earth pressures (1 atm) exist below 100 celsius.

Pfffft.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sir Pseudonymous on July 08, 2009, 01:25:58 am
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.
It depends on your definition of steam and boiling water, however scientifically, boiling water is hotter, because it is producing gaseous water. Steam, or the common definition of it, is mostly water vapor or liquid water suspend in the air and gaseous water, but it is decreasing in temperature, so it has to be cooler than boiling water.
Steam would have to be hotter. If it were cooler, then it wouldn't be steam, it would be sub-boiling water, possibly dissolved in the air. Assuming the air pressure is one atmosphere, and the water is undiluted, the water will only get up to 100 degrees celcius, after that the energy absorbed goes into the phase change. You're then left with steam at 100 degrees, assuming the energy being dumped into the water also gets into the steam, that would leave the steam marginally hotter than the water, but it has significantly more energy than the water regardless of that.

If it's a trick question, you're probably right. Ugh, it's too fucking ambiguous, and depends on whatever particular interpretation was going through the head of the person that wrote it. Shit like that on tests always pisses me off, when a question is ambiguous, wholly subjective, or both. Fortunately, I have a tendency to guess which of the right answers the writer was thinking...
Your still thinking wrong. Visible steam is not GASEOUS water thus it is less hot, because it is suspend water vapor and gaseous water, and it is cooling down and condensing. However boiling water is becoming gaseous water and is not cooling down it is heating up, so in the idea of heat or the excitement of particles and how it transfers - how hot it is, boiling water is hotter than steam. Steam doesn't have to be heated to exist. It can exist below 100 celsius. Boiling water cannot in normal earth pressures (1 atm) exist below 100 celsius.

Pfffft.
But condensing water isn't steam, if you're speaking in scientific terms. It's referred to as steam in layman's terms...

As I said, assuming pressure of one atm, and that the water is undiluted, the water can get no hotter than 100 celsius, however, the steam can get no cooler than 100 degrees, or it ceases to be steam, and becomes condensing water vapor.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Zironic on July 08, 2009, 01:32:31 am
Wrong. In a perfect scenario, water can reach way about boiling point temperatures through surface tension.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 08, 2009, 01:43:03 am
Wrong. In a perfect scenario, water can reach way about boiling point temperatures through surface tension.

Water can also reach the freezing temperature but not freeze
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Zironic on July 08, 2009, 01:45:09 am
Thus thus thus. Water and Steam are neither hotter. They don't exist. The water is lie.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Neonivek on July 08, 2009, 01:46:47 am
Thus thus thus. Water and Steam are neither hotter. They don't exist. The water is lie.

Alright please don't go into that level of science... it really scares me in the fact that it basically says Nothing exists.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sensei on July 08, 2009, 02:05:15 am
No, but water is in this case a far less accurate term than H2O. Water is only water at a given amount of energy (thermal or kinetic) at any given amount of pressure.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: AtomicPaperclip on July 08, 2009, 04:37:50 am
To be fair, I wouldn't have guessed Areyar wasn't native to english- you're certainly better in text than most of the people on popular forums.

Anyway, those that voted <80 are probably either brave or have serious self-confidence issues.

I voted 130-139 because that's where I usually score on Bellevue school district tests... and Bellevue seems to (generally) be tougher than most, although we took a dent just like everyone else from No Child Left Behind and similar stuff. IMO, people with developmental issues should be in their own programs, not normal people taking everything and a developmentally issued pace...

Anyway, the IQ tests here are probably skewed a bit.

I used to know a guy who's never left Brazil who could totally lose me with his English vocabulary.

Ugh our entire education system is based on trying to pass lazy pot-heads who couldn't care less about school.

I was put in the TAG (talented and gifted) program in kindergarten and they didn't do SHIT except make me take surveys to which every answer was "No, they don't do ANYTHING special", until high school where Honors/AP classes are available and the stupid shit surveys are optional.

Scored 140 on the test in OP, it's mostly math and efficiency of methods.

Like you can mentally add up all the odd numbers, or simply count how many there are and know that it's going to add to an even number if there's an even number of them.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Cheeetar on July 08, 2009, 05:22:42 am
I wasted a few minutes on this test, and never got a result because I didn't want to give them my email. I'm pretty sure that the result is randomised or very innacurate.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Rowanas on July 08, 2009, 05:25:18 am
efficiency is more important than intellect. Unfortunately I appear to have lots of the latter and not a single drop of the former :(

IQ is a silly way to test intellect. Until we understand the human brain, we shouldn't try to quantify intellect.  It's like counting to 1000 without knowing what 1000 is, or what most of the numbers in between are.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Areyar on July 08, 2009, 05:52:00 am
Why, thank you Sensei.  :blush:

In academia, knowing to write proper english is paramount if you want to be taken serious.  ::) (not using smileys too BTW)
Also reading untranslated books helps, as my favorite genres are scifi,fantasy and pop.sci, which are predominantly in english.
I prefer brittish spelling to americana, not only because my highschool teacher was a pedantic twit, but because my first contact with the language was through early games(+dictionary). hehe

You are right about the methodology thing [AP]: there is always the lazy (smart) way and the stupid (doggedly stubborn) way to solve any problem. Probably smart people are just better at managing their resources.

Water is the generally accepted name for H2O in any form in chemistry. While ice and steam are special cases/states of water, they are immediately translated to water(s) and water(g) by chemists, or H2O(s)/(g) for those very rigidly trained. ;)
Remember too that human normal conditions assume 1bar ambient pressure and 'roomtemperature' (15-25C).
The sementics of special terms for the states of water are critically important only in poetry.
....Can't remember the term used for 'non-scientific name', is it nomenclature?

Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Broose on July 08, 2009, 06:21:59 am
efficiency is more important than intellect. Unfortunately I appear to have lots of the latter and not a single drop of the former :(

IQ is a silly way to test intellect. Until we understand the human brain, we shouldn't try to quantify intellect.  It's like counting to 1000 without knowing what 1000 is, or what most of the numbers in between are.

It is also harder to judge when some people have different ideas of an intelligent person. I think, sometimes, I base what I see intelligence as too much on personality
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Areyar on July 08, 2009, 07:24:21 am
I find it very hard to fairly rate the intellect of people who cannot be persuaded by logic (or facts!).
Or people who treat you like a moron when they find out you don't belief what they do....maybe I'm guilty of that a little too.  :o

heh. My neighbours for example: they cannot have a discussion, if you disagree then it becomes an argument.
A while back we were having a wineparty in the garden (neighbour is a wino) and he was talking about fermentation etc, he made a very basic mistake (it requiring O2 I think) and I corrected him, while thinking "finally, a topic I know about". This was not acceptable. While I have a degree in biology and have done some microbrewing, even after showing him some diagrams (http://www.bio.miami.edu/~cmallery/255/255atp/mcb8.5.fermentation.jpg) of the Crebs cycle (http://vincentimbe.files.wordpress.com/2007/11/krebs-cycle.jpg) and fermentation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermentation_(biochemistry)) he was not convinced but just grudgingly dropped the subject.

Maybe a case of that blissfull competence blindness as described for the ignorant in one of the above links,
as he's fairly intelligent/coherent on other subjects.
Probably he just remembered a winery tourguide's blurb wrongly or mixed two ideas together, maybe plant dark-metabolism with fermentation. Couldn't admit he might be mistaken though. :sigh:
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sir Pseudonymous on July 08, 2009, 09:27:37 am
....Can't remember the term used for 'non-scientific name', is it nomenclature?
"Layman's terms" is all that comes to mind. "Nomenclature" is usually used in the sense of "scientific nomenclature", if I'm not mistaken.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Granite26 on July 08, 2009, 09:41:38 am
Wrong. In a perfect scenario, water can reach way about boiling point temperatures through surface tension.
But then it's not boiling (Not that that negates your point, just saying)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Rafal99 on July 08, 2009, 10:20:14 am
This is the standardized test. I have not taken it in 2 years. I'm going to retake it now.
http://www.3smartcubes.com/pages/tests/iq-test/iq-test_instructions.asp

I got 159 in this test. The only 2 questions i didn't know the answer for were the ones with some scrambled words. I bet they will be much easier for me if I was a native english speaker...

I voted before making this test and I voted 130-139, because I remember that I had done a test by a psychologist when I was about 12, and i had a result of 139 then.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: jaked122 on July 08, 2009, 11:49:30 am
15, asbergers+ADHD, 140 :).
asberger's+aderal=paranoia(heightened state of awareness)=cheating on IQ test.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 08, 2009, 12:13:10 pm
You cheat by actually paying attention to the test?!  I SHOULD OF THOUGHT OF THAT.   ;D
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 08, 2009, 12:22:31 pm
This thread is horrible, the poll is bullshit and the quality of posting has hit HFS bottom.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 08, 2009, 12:24:57 pm
This thread is horrible, the poll is bullshit and the quality of posting has hit HFS bottom.

Hah, delicious irony is delicious.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: jamoecw on July 08, 2009, 12:37:27 pm
hehe, looks like all those that answered are smarter than every test that i have taken that wanted to know what i knew about the subject.  of course that also means that everyone would have failed with the answers they gave.  every child knows that it takes longer to get burnt by steam, than boiling water, and when a person is taught about boiling point and the transition to gas, for some reason we are supposed to forget all of our past experiences with the subject.  so if you understood the subject matter taught, then at the very least you should be quite confused by the question, or you understand that it is a trick question and don't care what you answer, or you know what answer they want and just give it to them.  since i have only encountered this question on multiple choice tests, i would say that in such a circumstance it is impossible to answer the question correctly.

which also means that on the subject of non native english speakers speaking english better than native english speakers is also not a simple answer, the simplest answer is that they speak more academically.  since native english speakers are the stick to which english speaking is measured it would be impossible to speak english better than a native english speaker, unless you put that native english speaker in a different category of english, such as non-academic english.

....Can't remember the term used for 'non-scientific name', is it nomenclature?
"Layman's terms" is all that comes to mind. "Nomenclature" is usually used in the sense of "scientific nomenclature", if I'm not mistaken.
layman nomenclature would be laymen's terms, scientific nomenclature would be scientific terms, basically nomenclature is the terms a group uses.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 08, 2009, 12:46:43 pm
heh. My neighbours for example: they cannot have a discussion, if you disagree then it becomes an argument.
A while back we were having a wineparty in the garden (neighbour is a wino) and he was talking about fermentation etc, he made a very basic mistake (it requiring O2 I think) and I corrected him, while thinking "finally, a topic I know about". This was not acceptable. While I have a degree in biology and have done some microbrewing, even after showing him some diagrams (http://www.bio.miami.edu/~cmallery/255/255atp/mcb8.5.fermentation.jpg) of the Crebs cycle (http://vincentimbe.files.wordpress.com/2007/11/krebs-cycle.jpg) and fermentation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermentation_(biochemistry)) he was not convinced but just grudgingly dropped the subject.

There's a book that deals in this subject that I'm very fond of, called "How to Win Friends and Influence People." From the title it sounds like it should be the most terrible tract on manipulation known to man, but surprisingly it actually isn't. It's more about phrasing things in such a way as to be an unoffensive as possible, and ways to make yourself a more pleasant person to be around. (For example, it includes rules like "become genuinely interested in people" and "talk in terms of the other person's interest.") From reading that book, and from my own experiences, being unable to accept education or correction is a common human failing--but luckily one that can be gotten around with enough work. It does take work and a lot of patience though. :)

Quote
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

It seems to me that this would depend on several different factors, including how pure the water is, whether it has been superheated, what altitude we are at, where you are measuring the steam in relation to the water (remembering that the further away from steam you go, the less hot it gets, though it might not necessarily condense back to water), ambient temperature, and whether we are talking about steam that comes from the same boiling water or a different source. For example, the steam that comes from a cup of hot cocoa on a cold winter's day will be cooler than the water that has been boiled under extreme pressure in the middle of a volcano. Does the steam come from the same source?

The problem is that steam doesn't have a set heat. Without a set heat we can't absolutely say that in every situation steam would be hotter than water.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Granite26 on July 08, 2009, 01:00:18 pm
There's a book that deals in this subject that I'm very fond of, called "How to Win Friends and Influence People."

Widely regarded as the first self help book.  Changed my life.  I still use it's lessons on a daily basis. 

Mostly because prior to that I had crap for social skills, and there was a lot of 'holy crap, I can see how that's true' moments while reading it.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sowelu on July 08, 2009, 01:27:59 pm
The questions I'm used to seeing on IQ tests are usually stuff like "The fish's tail is twice the length of its head; its total length is twice the length of its head plus the length of its tail; if the fish is 72 inches long then how long is its tail", and random stuff like "mary is taller than ellen, ellen is taller than stacy, is mary taller than stacy yes/no/impossible to determine".

People who can't answer those questions, there's just no way to relate to them--all communication beyond the most formal of communication is based on assumed knowledge, and if you can't assume that someone knows the same rules of logic that you do, well, they're going to be a wild card.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 08, 2009, 01:32:06 pm
There's a book that deals in this subject that I'm very fond of, called "How to Win Friends and Influence People."

Widely regarded as the first self help book.  Changed my life.  I still use it's lessons on a daily basis. 

Mostly because prior to that I had crap for social skills, and there was a lot of 'holy crap, I can see how that's true' moments while reading it.

Same here. :D I basically picked it up because I wanted to see how many manipulative, horrible techniques I could spot. Now I read it at least twice a year to make sure it stays cemented in my brain.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Areyar on July 09, 2009, 12:29:55 pm
hehe, looks like all those that answered are smarter than every test that i have taken that wanted to know what i knew about the subject.  of course that also means that everyone would have failed with the answers they gave.  every child knows that it takes longer to get burnt by steam, than boiling water, and when a person is taught about boiling point and the transition to gas, for some reason we are supposed to forget all of our past experiences with the subject.  so if you understood the subject matter taught, then at the very least you should be quite confused by the question, or you understand that it is a trick question and don't care what you answer, or you know what answer they want and just give it to them.  since i have only encountered this question on multiple choice tests, i would say that in such a circumstance it is impossible to answer the question correctly.

which also means that on the subject of non native english speakers speaking english better than native english speakers is also not a simple answer, the simplest answer is that they speak more academically.  since native english speakers are the stick to which english speaking is measured it would be impossible to speak english better than a native english speaker, unless you put that native english speaker in a different category of english, such as non-academic english.

....Can't remember the term used for 'non-scientific name', is it nomenclature?
"Layman's terms" is all that comes to mind. "Nomenclature" is usually used in the sense of "scientific nomenclature", if I'm not mistaken.
layman nomenclature would be laymen's terms, scientific nomenclature would be scientific terms, basically nomenclature is the terms a group uses.

So true!
I once met a bunch of english teens on a holiday, all were pretty drunk, and I could not understand half they were saying. Naturally they were using cockney or londonese street slang, while I had only been exposed to 90sTV+oxford english. They kept shouting at me they were "totally pissed!" etcetera. :) ah, mamaries... 

yeah 'laymans terms' is one way of putting it, but I was looking for
'common name / nomenclature', I think... or maybe 'trivial name', as opposed to 'rational name' (literal translation from Dutch).
Don't have access to a chemists catalog to make sure. :)

--
My best friend has a few of those books... '180 rules of seducing women' or some such... also one about 'power' and how to get people to do what you want. . . more in fun than for practical purposes. He's one of the nicest, most timid people I know and used to be a real pushover. Naturally now that he has a GF, she's the boss of him exclusively. ;)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: de5me7 on July 10, 2009, 09:46:53 am
i usually pull in at 119/120 Ive had an education physcologist report carried out on me because im dyslexic, i got 119 on that (I am smarter than the average bear). my scores on the internet tests usually come pretty close to the 120s. i think they are reasonably good. Ive just graduated witha  1st so 119 whilst not an absolute score of intellegence seems pretty good to me. Ive got 138 on the one linked above, unless ive become a lot smarter in the last 3 years its a crap test.

Oxbridge grads tend to pitch in around the 130 mark and above, and 150  = genius. I find it difficult to believe that 40+ of the people on this pole are certified genius.

Having said this DF does seem to be a more interlectual game than gears of war or halo, which are pitched at people with IQs bellow 60.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: woose1 on July 10, 2009, 09:53:29 am
Hah! I love the post results. Just reinforces my opinion that 90% of DF players have a bloated ego.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Muz on July 10, 2009, 10:40:24 am
Well, seriously, though, I think DF players do have a higher IQ. Because looking at ASCII guys scurrying about indicates patterns. Pretty much two thirds of IQ tests are about pattern recognition.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 10, 2009, 11:29:43 am
Hah! I love the post results. Just reinforces my opinion that 90% of DF players have a bloated ego.

Would you want to say you suck at everything?  No!  I wouldn't I'm the best.

*starts floating from awesomeness
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Tenebrais on July 10, 2009, 12:19:26 pm
Well, seriously, though, I think DF players do have a higher IQ. Because looking at ASCII guys scurrying about indicates patterns. Pretty much two thirds of IQ tests are about pattern recognition.

It's definitely a significant part of it. The monthly Mensa magazine has a puzzle section at the back. Almost all of them are about spotting and completing patterns, with one or two based on obscure trivia.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 10, 2009, 07:23:18 pm
You know, I know why everyone's so damn smart.

It's because that instead of looking at 3d models like all the idiots, we look at 2d pictures and symbols, and tell the symbols what to do and where to go!

That needs an IQ of 130+! No way an idiot could EVER play the game, EVER.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 10, 2009, 07:26:42 pm
You know, I know why everyone's so damn smart.

It's because that instead of looking at 3d models like all the idiots, we look at 2d pictures and symbols, and tell the symbols what to do and where to go!

That needs an IQ of 130+! No way an idiot could EVER play the game, EVER.

Yes indeed.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sevrun on July 10, 2009, 10:55:37 pm
Call me arrogant, self-serving, egocentric, etc. all you want.  My response is the same.  pucker up to a hairy cheek :p

I'm sitting at a 137 IQ, which I'm not particularly proud of.  Why?  Because it's just another statistic, and doesn't much matter when things get messy.

Yes, I have a bad attitude, which usually only flairs up when people get snide or look down on people around them... which happens a lot more online than real life, kinda funny huh? 

My point is this, if someone is going to lie about their IQ for a poll among a bunch of people they're most likely never going to see face to face, whose opinions of them are not going affect anything _real_...  then why attempt to attack their egos through the same medium?  The lie is just as pointless as trying to look down at them. 

  Ya'll can believe me on my IQ, or not...  and the rest as well.  Or not.  Personally I don't particularly care now that I've spoken my piece against some of the arrogance I've seen displayed in this thread.

  Although on another sidenote of my little rant.  I wouldn't be surprised if the IQ of most of the players of DF really is significantly above average.  It is a very involved game whose complexity would seem to appeal most to more intelligent people.  Just a thought that people really should take in the FULL picture before making accusations.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Megaman on July 10, 2009, 11:32:47 pm
I'mm a 11 years old so don't critisize, I got 111(and I play Df, Sparks is wrong).
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Muz on July 11, 2009, 01:40:46 am
OK, you guys are too smart for me. I have no idea who's trolling and who's being serious now.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Im_Sparks on July 11, 2009, 01:42:55 am
I'mm a 11 years old so don't critisize, I got 111(and I play Df, Sparks is wrong).

Don't worry, the concept of sarcasm will come quick, young one.

Sit down and enjoy your nobles.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Ohaeri on July 11, 2009, 04:18:32 pm
OK, you guys are too smart for me. I have no idea who's trolling and who's being serious now.

I never do. Seems like I always get it wrong no matter how hard I try, so I just treat everybody as if they're speaking seriously and telling the truth. It may make me look like a fool, but at least I'm not constantly second-guessing myself! :)
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 11, 2009, 04:23:19 pm
Doubt never wins against strong-will!
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Phen on July 11, 2009, 04:35:59 pm
I havn't bothered to read through the 12 pages, but you guys are aware that there's different ways of calculating IQ, right? It just strikes me, especially in this poll, because it'd be impossible to get more than 140 in the figure reasoning test I took a couple of years ago. According to that one, I'm in the best 1% of the population and it gave me a score of 135.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Lord Snow on July 11, 2009, 05:43:15 pm
snow, your IQ is 150


Offline i scored 136 some years ago, if i recall correctly.

Of course this online test is rubbish, as it needs you to have knowledge of geography i.e., while your mental capacity is in no way linked to how much you know or dont about any given topic.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Phen on July 11, 2009, 05:56:11 pm
snow, your IQ is 150


Offline i scored 136 some years ago, if i recall correctly.

Of course this online test is rubbish, as it needs you to have knowledge of geography i.e., while your mental capacity is in no way linked to how much you know or dont about any given topic.
That depends on which kind of test it is. A figure reasoning test doesn't require any knowledge at all, it measures how good you are at finding patterns. Of course you need to find a proper test to use.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Arathanar on July 11, 2009, 07:26:42 pm
122.

*insert self-justification here*
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sensei on July 11, 2009, 07:29:32 pm
I personally always thought of how smart someone is being influenced by a few areas- now, I'm not trying to quantify the human mind, which seems like an impossible task, but...

Knowledge/Skill (a master mechanic might look like an idiot if you quiz them about videogames, so this depends on the subject- keep it out of IQ tests, in other words)

Logic/reasoning/patterns (dwarf fortress is one big logic puzzle)

Creativity (this might be a skill, I strongly believe that creativity can be exercised, it also ahs to do with recognizing when you have a good idea)

Wisdom (hardest to describe... if you are easily tricked or keep putting in the remote backwards, you still might be good at chess. Includes personal skills. Another example would be that if you often act without using your full cognitive capacity due to emotions, you are 'unwise')

Obviously, some of these are very hard to gauge in any form of traditional test.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 11, 2009, 07:41:55 pm
Wisdom is like being a Jedi!
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Grimlocke on July 11, 2009, 07:51:11 pm
Well, that test scored me at 140.

Which cant be all that accurate as I guessed a bunch due to language problems and impatience.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Kalimar on July 12, 2009, 06:12:29 pm
Logic/reasoning/patterns (dwarf fortress is one big logic puzzle)

Yes bro, figuring out 2cat and purple spade = purple helmet was an impressive feat of my heuristic mind.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: zarmazarma on July 12, 2009, 06:16:02 pm
No online test could ever possibly guage your IQ, especially not the ones that ask you purely factual knowledge questions... I don't consider IQ to have much to do with how intelligent you are... It appeals mainly to the idea that some one with a altered way of thinking has the potential to elaborate more, absorb more, and more easily, and have a higher potential to learn... I never pull an online IQ test as a way to brag. There's also extreme flaws in IQ test, the biggest being that online ones are multiple choice, normally consisting of 4-9 answers. After evaluating the problem you may just be guessing...
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 12, 2009, 06:28:39 pm
Logic/reasoning/patterns (dwarf fortress is one big logic puzzle)

Yes bro, figuring out 2cat and purple spade = purple helmet was an impressive feat of my heuristic mind.

You'll be amazed by some people.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: G-Flex on July 12, 2009, 08:52:33 pm
Logic/reasoning/patterns (dwarf fortress is one big logic puzzle)

Yes bro, figuring out 2cat and purple spade = purple helmet was an impressive feat of my heuristic mind.

I think he was referring to a hell of a lot more than that, but if you like your strawman version of the argument, I guess that's your choice.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: diefortheswarm on July 12, 2009, 11:10:54 pm
147 bitches

On the test Sparks posted.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: PencilinHand on July 13, 2009, 01:06:08 am
I took the IQ test that the OP posted and it suggested I had an IQ of 134(I am 25 and am job hunting hence have no profession at the moment) which seemed to me to be within a reasonable margin of error(+20 points...probably -20 points....).

I don't think I am any smarter than most people.  However, I do think that I have applied myself more effectively than many.  In this way I am not smarter but I have trained myself to try to think along different lines and from multiple approaches compared to "the average" approach.  Which is, I think, a more generally useful indication of mental ability than what IQ tends to measure, until you get out into the far extremes in either direction which are anomalous anyway.

If nothing else were wrong with the concept of testing someones raw intelligence, the application of an IQ test score is misleading.  Intelligence can not accurately be turned into a linear system without dramatic oversimplification.  Furthermore, the accuracy of a score becomes increasingly less significant as you increase the distance from the mean.  Lastly, the only thing a test can ever conclusively determine is the ability of a person to succeed at taking said test!

ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.

I have given some thought to this and have found there to be many layers of uncertainty which could swing an answer.

The first thought is to ask if the boiling water and steam are under the same relative ambient conditions.  Second, depending on what those conditions are, the idea of separate water and steam isn't necessarily valid(see "supercritical steam".  Generally speaking in practical applications steam can attain a much higher temperature than that of "liquid" water(see "superheated steam").  Let us however discard such thinking and assume that the steam is from a pot of boiling water on a stove in some typical kitchen(neglecting property differences caused by any minor elevation change from steam rising a trivial distance).

A rudimentary analysis of this steam tells us that it begins to cool as soon as it exits the immediate vicinity of its heat source.  More precisely, the kinetic energy(on the atomic level) has an increasing probability of decreasing as time and distance increase from the moment/place of the escape of the steam from the heat source.  For the sake of practical analysis and simplicity we will then talk in terms of time and space averaged samples.

As the exact nature of the boiling water and the steam generated there from will vary with spacial position let us assume that we are considering a pot with a trivial quantity of water in it(so the temperature is consider the same throughout the content of water and the heat input to the system immediately exits in the form of steam) and are only measuring steam in the immediate vicinity of boiling water.

The last critical point in the analysis, and the point which I think most have overlooked is how we are measuring and defining "hotter."  If we talk in terms of how "hot" something feels, using the human sense and experience, then steam is hotter because what we feel as heat is actually heat flux which steam is superior at compared with boiling water as it penetrates flesh quicker.  However, if we are speaking in terms of temperature, and bear in mind that the concepts of heat and temperature are distinct and different, then the steam and boiling water in our simplified example should be the same(unless I am forgetting some factor).  Suppose, instead that the measure of "hotter" is actually a question of which has more heat in it then the answer is again steam.

If, however and this one is stretching it a bit, we take a approach more befitting a limit analysis(if we think of the transition to steam as passing through a peak) then the boiling water to steam system is at its hottest the moment the water is turned to steam which would make the boiling water the hotter of the two.

There you have 3(maybe 4) reasonable approaches to a simplified system of a vague and imprecise question that each has some plausible argument. 
So which is the correct one?

 ???

Heck if I know I only have an internet IQ score of 134, but if I had to guess I would say that the question was based on human sense interpretation so steam is the hotter of the two.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Sindayven on July 13, 2009, 02:59:20 am
That test gave me 156. It's clearly full of shit.

Not to mention the knowledge bias it has. IQ shouldn't be about memorizing European country capitals or any facts.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Rowanas on July 13, 2009, 07:46:19 am
eurgh. I hate those american ones with questions about dimes and nickels. These are not memory tests, nor are they foreign currency/location tests. they should be purely about things you have to process.

Anyway, IQ tests are (when they're done right) merely tests to show operating speed. Imagine if someone sold you a computer and would only tell you the rough specs, and that it ran on a linux variant without tech support. Not very useful.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: ToonyMan on July 13, 2009, 11:40:54 am
I rate my brain 5 TB/s.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Floirt on July 13, 2009, 11:58:01 am
Actually the brain processes, like, 20 MB/s of data, roughly the equivalent of a LAN cable's maximum rate of transfer.
This means we could jack DF into our mind and play it at a reasonable speed!


Also, 149 at the test. I guess it would have been more if English was my first language.
This test IS full of shit. I bet it doesn't compare past results with the present ones, thus those numbers mean actually nothing.

The last official IQ test I took, through, rated me over 140, but that was a few years ago.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: jamoecw on July 13, 2009, 12:03:05 pm
stuff

There you have 3(maybe 4) reasonable approaches to a simplified system of a vague and imprecise question that each has some plausible argument. 
So which is the correct one?

 ???

Heck if I know I only have an internet IQ score of 134, but if I had to guess I would say that the question was based on human sense interpretation so steam is the hotter of the two.

while you have grasped the purpose of asking the question (as it is effectively a trick question), you are perhaps the first to try to equate the test to an everyday encounter applicable to everyone regardless of intelligence.  however your answer given for this angle is wrong, and in fact even stresses one reason why i do not consider school an institution of learning.  pretty much everyone has boiled water in which to use at one point or another, and then reached into the steam in which to manipulate an object in the boiling water, or to place an object into it, etc.  a very early lesson in life is that boiling water will burn you, while steam is just hot.  in school we are taught, before higher levels of instruction, that steam is hotter than boiling water.  many people accept this fact even though throughout their life they have first hand experience to the contrary.

and for the factors you gave in which will sway the answer one way or the other, isn't nearly as many as there is.  just contemplating the variables in such a question puts you at above the average college graduate in my book.

[edit]
@Areyar:
i finally looked up the term: colloquial (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colloquial)
[/edit]
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Soadreqm on July 13, 2009, 12:52:19 pm
ok if we are going to talk about questions that are flawed but are in tests:
what is hotter, boiling water, or steam?

talk it over and i'll give you the answer in a day.
That is indeed a very interesting question to be in an IQ test. If there was a human analyzing the results and the subject was required to also say WHY he think whatever he answered is hotter, you could get some information about how the subject thinks, but internet IQ tests don't have those.

But yeah. In a typical scenario of boiling water in a kettle, the steam pretty much instantly mixes with the cold air of the kitchen, leaving the boiling water exactly 100°C, meaning that the water would be hotter. If you're boiling water in a sealed container, they'll probably be equally hot. Most steam-powered machinery, such as turbines, are made of a boiler, a cooler and some machinery in between; and since you're boiling the water and cooling the steam, the steam should probably be colder.

Actually, you'll be heating the water and cooling the steam in pretty much ALL systems that include both boiling water and steam, so unless you keep them in separate containers (which would really be cheating), the water will be hotter.

And if by "hot" you mean that it feels hot, the water will STILL be hotter, since it's a lot denser than the steam, resulting in more collisions with the cruel, uncaring water molecules and the surface of your scalded skin.

And if you were using "hot" as in "She's hot" or perhaps "hot-headed", I really have no idea. We are treading in dangerous, uncharted territory and may go mad with the revelation should we pursue the elusive answers any farther. We are standing in the Sea of Knowledge, on an Island of Ignorance, from whose shores it was not meant for Man to journey far, lest we end up in a current of Truth without a paddle.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: PencilinHand on July 13, 2009, 04:00:43 pm
while you have grasped the purpose of asking the question (as it is effectively a trick question), you are perhaps the first to try to equate the test to an everyday encounter applicable to everyone regardless of intelligence.  however your answer given for this angle is wrong, and in fact even stresses one reason why i do not consider school an institution of learning.  pretty much everyone has boiled water in which to use at one point or another, and then reached into the steam in which to manipulate an object in the boiling water, or to place an object into it, etc.  a very early lesson in life is that boiling water will burn you, while steam is just hot.  in school we are taught, before higher levels of instruction, that steam is hotter than boiling water.  many people accept this fact even though throughout their life they have first hand experience to the contrary.

and for the factors you gave in which will sway the answer one way or the other, isn't nearly as many as there is.  just contemplating the variables in such a question puts you at above the average college graduate in my book.

[edit]
@Areyar:
i finally looked up the term: colloquial (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colloquial)
[/edit]

Thank you for taking the time to consider my lengthy response. 

However, for the record, I have been burned by boiling water(kitchen accident) and by steam(bumped the cap on the overflow reservoir on a car that had just been overheating).  The boiling water reddened the skin and was tender for a few days.  The steam seemed to cook the skin of my hand which pealed over then next few days and felt tender for over a week.

Granted my experience with steam was not an ideal reference and hence may not be entirely applicable in addition to situational uncertainties(length of expose is presumed by me to be approximately the same for boiling water and steam, etc. etc.) and subjective nature of memories and personal experience.  It remains my opinion that, for a human, steam would feel hotter than boiling water for the duration of expose*.  Until we start using hard numbers I do not want to get into an argument about which is hotter but do wish to clarify my position and explain my reasoning.

*The tendency of water to stay on the surface of the skin combined with its relatively high specific heat capacity might tend to burn more by continuing to transfer heat even after exposure(dipping ones hand in a pot of boiling water for example) was stopped.  Where steam would stop burning almost immediately as a hypothetical hand was removed from the flow of steam.
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Leartes on July 13, 2009, 04:33:14 pm
I didn't read through all of this, just took the posted test - and took it serious (not calculating stuff with calculator / making drawings) but thinking serious and I scored 150. - Usually I score about 125 to 130 in larger tests, so I'd conclude this one is really bad with higher ratings.

Anyway, what does it tell me now ? That I am a genious ? Most likely not! It only tells I am good at working on logical problems and that I am good at working under time pressure - at least for half an hour  ;D
 
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Papa Cauldur on July 13, 2009, 05:41:06 pm
Mine said 150, but I seriously doubt it.

IQ tests remind me of a quote about Nethack. "The DevTeam has arranged an automatic and savage punishment for pudding farming. It's called pudding farming."
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: jamoecw on July 14, 2009, 01:56:27 am
you're welcome, i try to read all those that reply to my posts.  first off let me say that we are in agreement that the question is bogus due to all sorts of unaccounted variables.  second would be the observation that your given experience involved a sealed container, which as the water became steam, it increased the pressure, which in turn made the steam hotter (more so than the water since water isn't as effected by pressure).

you're right an argument would be pointless, after all real world experiences trumps both text books and faceless people on the internet ;D.

since you shared your insight into your answer i'll do the same.  having taken many iq tests in school, which as part of the physics section sometimes ask "which is hotter boiling water or steam, choose the best answer from those given." and i always answered steam.  then when i got to biology i was taking a test that had that same question, and since the teacher was big on lab work i had boiled water in class on more than one occasion.  as i was mindlessly going to pencil in the letter for "steam" it hit me that i had been in fact in contact with the steam while working with the boiling water, and that i had always done this with boiling water, so i thought for a second about if they were talking about the steam bubbles in boiling water, but realized that the rate at which it cooled would have to be greater than when it hit the cooler air above the water, which to me didn't make sense, so i put down "boiling water" instead, knowing full well that i would get that question marked wrong (which it was).
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Mu. on July 14, 2009, 07:18:21 am
over 9000
Title: Re: IQ of DF gamers?
Post by: Cthulhu on July 14, 2009, 08:15:46 am
I took a real doctor-administered test when I was little and got 148.