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Other Projects => Other Games => Topic started by: Dunamisdeos on August 29, 2020, 04:29:13 pm

Title: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on August 29, 2020, 04:29:13 pm
It's on sale for 50% off. It's quite the DF-style sort of game, in that it has a large amount of obscure things to do to progress and also gives you exactly zero help in learning how to do it. Also, brutal death is coming in every shape and form on a constant basis. So far I have learned that you can die of Pumbaa, poison, crocodile, small snake, big snake, terror puma, gravity, and bird.

The point is to start as an ape and work your way up the evolutionary chain to human. Or at least pre-human. You have to evolve everything from switching items between your own hands to the ability to digest fish and meat. It's quite good, and purportedly based on evolutionary science. So far I am yet an ape in the starting area, but I have mastered the unbridled power of [a stick] and am therefore the uncontested monkey king of all that my clan (The Crow Magnums (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_early_modern_humans)) surveys.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/536270/Ancestors_The_Humankind_Odyssey/ (https://store.steampowered.com/app/536270/Ancestors_The_Humankind_Odyssey/)

(https://cdn.cloudflare.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/536270/header.jpg?t=1598563741)

I recommend minimal HUD, full tutorial.

Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: dragdeler on August 29, 2020, 05:22:11 pm
I've seen footage, I kept wondering what game that was...

Want my opinion? "ba-ah-ack off off off this my tree."
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: sluissa on August 29, 2020, 06:03:18 pm
It's a very weird game, but the indescribable feeling of banging two rocks together to make a slightly different rock in front of your other monkey friends and watching their brains visibly change at the new information is something unique.

The feeling of having this new rock and then running around the world trying this new rock on everything to figure out what you can do with this new rock is exciting each time.

It also perfectly captures the feeling of being completely and utterly helpless in a world where lots of things can kill you... BUT with the right knowledge, some work, and the right mix of luck and skill, you can change that. Literally no balance* except that which you create yourself.

Granted I am still but a smol ape, and there is apparently much more to this game to see, I have no clue what further playing will bring me, but it is a very slow burning game thus far. I feel like I've made great progress with my differently shaped rocks and discovery that I can eat not only the obvious berries but also certain leaves. But despite that feeling of great progress, I also feel like I'm just barely scratching the surface.

I would heavily suggest though, if any of this sounds interesting, try to play it knowing as little as possible. The game is largely about not knowing stuff, and learning as you go, trying stuff, figuring things out. There's enough context help for commands to let you know WHEN you can try something that it's not overly frustrating. Spoiling yourself too much will likely ruin it.

*except the "first time" scenario starting you in a relatively peaceful area with guaranteed basic resources within easy reach.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on August 29, 2020, 06:05:52 pm
I would heavily suggest though, if any of this sounds interesting, try to play it knowing as little as possible. The game is largely about not knowing stuff, and learning as you go, trying stuff, figuring things out. There's enough context help for commands to let you know WHEN you can try something that it's not overly frustrating. Spoiling yourself too much will likely ruin it.

*except the "first time" scenario starting you in a relatively peaceful area with guaranteed basic resources within easy reach.

Absolutely my own experience. It's got the right feel.

Also holy geez I didn't know it unlocked later playthroughs like that. So what, selecting something other than "first time" could place you in a different starting zone??? Also, note that peaceful is indeed relative. There were angry mambas in between me and the closest fishing hole in my peaceful spot.

That sounds like NBD, but it opens up some notable replayability.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Naturegirl1999 on August 29, 2020, 06:12:47 pm
What does NBD stand for?
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on August 29, 2020, 06:13:55 pm
What does NBD stand for?

No Big Deal.

The game thus far has been hugely shaped by my remembering the locations of various needed resources. A new starting area entirely would shake things up nicely.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Loud Whispers on August 29, 2020, 07:07:09 pm
The trailer where ooga booga primape finally avenges his monkey ancestor was very powerful
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: sluissa on August 29, 2020, 08:46:04 pm


Also holy geez I didn't know it unlocked later playthroughs like that. So what, selecting something other than "first time" could place you in a different starting zone??? Also, note that peaceful is indeed relative. There were angry mambas in between me and the closest fishing hole in my peaceful spot.

That sounds like NBD, but it opens up some notable replayability.

I don't know how it works exactly. But there were multiple starting options from the main menu that made it sound like there were possibly alternate starting locations that were more difficult than the "first time" option.

I'm still only barely venturing out from that starting oasis myself and often getting chased back, bruised and broken (or worse.) I'm not sure how well I'd fare somewhere more difficult.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Grim Portent on August 30, 2020, 04:34:19 am
Once you finish the game you do unlock the option to start at other oasis locations, and the option to start with no clan members.

So you can start in the most inhospitable locations and work backwards towards the jungle rather than the other way around for example. Surviving in places with little drinkable water, scarce food and few trees to hide from predators in when you're just a basic monkey is quite different.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: scriver on August 30, 2020, 05:11:32 am
Posting to remember this later.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: George_Chickens on August 30, 2020, 05:14:14 am
How 'scripted' is the game? It seems interesting, but how much of it is actually style over substance?
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Grim Portent on August 30, 2020, 05:26:59 am
How 'scripted' is the game? It seems interesting, but how much of it is actually style over substance?

There's a few prescripted events in the first run, basically all part of the tutorial segment of gameplay, but in the actual gameplay the only scripted thing is the 'stalker cat'. Basically there is a cat who exists to attack you periodically and a new one spawns when killed. Unlike normal cats it can spawn in most areas of the game, so even in otherwise very barren terrain there's still something dangerous that might pop up.

That said the game isn't super deep or anything, you can do basically everything at the start, you just progress to be better at it over time. Moving upright and swimming, eating, fighting, scavenging, detecting things, surviving with low amounts of food and water, crafting and so on all get better by increments until you're a bipedal early hominid apex predator.

It's a fun game, and the evolution system can make each run a bit different from the others. My first run I never evolved the ability to eat mammal meat, I just got so devloped in other areas that I leapfrogged into completion before I could digest mammals. Next run I started at the end of the map and worked back into the main area, and due to food scarcity I developed the ability to eat eggs and meat early on.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Cthulhu on August 30, 2020, 05:50:50 am
I hit my first evolution leap going by the first-game objectives, now kind of stalling like what do I do next, the next objective is in the savannah but I dont' think I'm ready for that, we're still just monke

Game is extremely monke, yes.  The tutorials basically just tell you what the buttons do, as far as I can tell there's a ton of crafting and  building, but it doesn't tell you what you can craft or how to craft it, so you really do feel like a monke standing there with a rock and a coconut and trying to bootstrap causal logic all by yourself.

There are some bugs, I haven't seen how well NPC monke defend themselves with the proper neurons but you probably want to get those neurons ASAP.  There's some kind of bug that can make you unable to climb when a predator is on your ass, and if affects NPCs too.  You'll be up safe watching as one of your monke just reaches up to a tree and then drops back down over and over, I thought it was just bad AI at first but it's happened to me too, you have to get some distance from the predator before it'll let you climb and NPCs won't do that.  As far as I know without the combat/dodging neurons they're completely helpless when attacked.

Another bug, after an evolution your clan will respawn in a new oasis, NPCs inside the camp have basic pathing and stuff for hanging out and eating and sleeping, depending on where you spawn you might end up with some monke treading water in a lake, which will break their pathing.  Use clan's call if you see them, because they won't be able to eat or drink until you get them out of the water.

Starting to get annoyed with the "stalker cat."  It shows up without fail every time I meet a hominid to try to recruit.  I have to have a sharp stick on me at all times because there's a cat waiting to ambush me at every hominid and if I just leave then they're dead.  Managed to recruit two on my latest run and they both got killed by cats on the way back.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on August 31, 2020, 03:29:54 pm
Stalker cat is a bit much, I hope they tune him down. I do go everywhere armed at all times as a result. A lot of reviews/post I see people don't realize that you can just pick up any old rock and whap stalkercat in the face with it when he comes after you. He runs off.

Arming your monkes with sharp sticks turns you from a huddle of terrified apes into a squad of incredible badasses. I also highly recommend the neuron that allows you to direct them to make their own sharp sticks. Team Crow Magnum wandered over to an area that I found out later was aptly named crocodile isle. Two dead crocodiles, one pig, and a stalker cat later, we strutted out with a meteor fragment. There was one injury. Mind you I've had the defense fail and a chimp get injured, but it's still quite effective.

Also, holy SHIT the game world is enormous. I just made it within view of the Savannah myself. I've been greeted with 6 new kinds of wildlife thus far in that general vicinity. I also found that there are cave areas scattered about various biomes with unique wildlife and plant life there as well. I've passed by two other clear paths that might or might not lead to other biomes/areas. I'm too far to go back and check em out now. There are tunnels, plateaus, sinkholes, swamps all kinds of places to settle and explore.

Also pro tip don't fuck with otters, I saw an otter get ambushed by a stalkercat and it's retort was to whip around and maul the fuck out of it until the cat ran off.

How 'scripted' is the game? It seems interesting, but how much of it is actually style over substance?

I've been sandboxing my way around the entire game. It provided "objectives" but they are suggestions on how to proceed. By the time it asked me to pass a generation I'd already done it twice.

I'm also head of the evolutionary curve, supposedly. So it's a valid gameplay style.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Grim Portent on August 31, 2020, 05:44:42 pm
The game world is actually quite small, it's just that early on you move slowly and, if you're like me, have a tendency to meander. The Jungle is the single biggest biome, the woodland between it and the Savannah is quite small, then the Savannah is a decent size, the last two biomes are also on the small side but getting to them and then through them while unevolved is quite the feat due to the inhospitable nature.

Once you start walking upright you can traverse the whole map in no time at all. Once you get used to the methods involved in long distance journeys and know the way around you can walk the whole thing in about 3-4 in game days at a relaxed pace even as the basic monkey.

That said the world does manage to feel huge, especially at the beginning when you're a knuckle-walker. Once you become a biped the world seems so much different because your camera perspective shifts upwards.

Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Ozyton on September 01, 2020, 01:47:20 am
I remember watching some gameplay of this a while ago and the concept was interesting. Unfortunately, from my understanding, the way the evolutions works is a little backwards, at least it was when the game first released. It's a little hard to explain but... as you evolve your progress is compared to estimates of 'actual' human evolution. This is fine, except it goes by 'golf rules' where evolving too quickly means that you won't get to unlock most of the evolutions or just lock you out of certain ones(???). I imagine this is fine for most players but I'm the kind of person that needs to have 'all the things' so I would probably end up gaming the system to not evolve too quickly while still unlocking as many nodes as possible.

On another note, the playthrough I watched had the option to unlock metabolism early on, so I assume that's supposed to be the 'tutorial evolution' but the player completely misunderstood how the game mechanics worked and that node never popped up again, at least for the videos I did watch. Perhaps he was just unlucky?
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Cthulhu on September 01, 2020, 01:54:34 am
Starting to feel like the game's going stale.  I'm at the species that can control its emotions, which as far as I can tell doesn't really do anything, and likewise as far as I can tell I can craft most of the useful stuff.  It doesn't look like there's gonna be any way to like make stone-tipped spears, storage containers, or stuff like that.  Unless the game drastically changes when you hit the savannah, I dunno what else there is beyond running up the brain tech tree and evolving up to homo sapiens, without unlocking any major new gameplay aside from bipedalism.

I actually kind of liked the game more as True Monke.  Sticking to the trees, terrified of predators, the small, mysterious, frightful world.  Now things aren't as thrilling, I feel like I've got most of it down pat.  Haven't lost a monke in a long time, at the point where I actively chase the stalker cat cause I need to eat more meat to acclimate to it.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: scriver on September 01, 2020, 07:20:43 am
Sounds a lot like it's comparable to the real world now.

Final stage of evolution will be you sitting in an open environment office filling out forms and typing away and trying to hide the fact that you're looking at monkey porn instead of working from your co-workers and the middle manager monkey walks whenever he walks by in the isle between desks. Desperately fighting your co-workers for that one desk place that's angled so they can't see you watching monkey porn at all. As your stress meter builds ever higher you retreat to the water cooler, desperately trying to let off some steam with some chit chat with your co-workers about the new girl with the big red buttocks and what you would like to do with her, but oh no middle manager monkey suddenly show up and your stress meter goes into red and you hurry in shame and worry for HR consequences off to the toilets, your last refuge, to pretend to piss and maybe cry a bit. A booth is empty, you hurry over and open the door and BAM! Stalker cat. You died.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Grim Portent on September 01, 2020, 10:32:00 am
Starting to feel like the game's going stale.  I'm at the species that can control its emotions, which as far as I can tell doesn't really do anything, and likewise as far as I can tell I can craft most of the useful stuff.  It doesn't look like there's gonna be any way to like make stone-tipped spears, storage containers, or stuff like that.  Unless the game drastically changes when you hit the savannah, I dunno what else there is beyond running up the brain tech tree and evolving up to homo sapiens, without unlocking any major new gameplay aside from bipedalism.

I actually kind of liked the game more as True Monke.  Sticking to the trees, terrified of predators, the small, mysterious, frightful world.  Now things aren't as thrilling, I feel like I've got most of it down pat.  Haven't lost a monke in a long time, at the point where I actively chase the stalker cat cause I need to eat more meat to acclimate to it.

That is more or less what happens. You get to a point that you're the apex and nothing is a real threat. The real challenge is in the early game, especially in the first run when you aren't clear on how things work.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Loud Whispers on September 01, 2020, 10:58:28 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
MONKE
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: nenjin on September 01, 2020, 11:41:00 am
MONKEIGH
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: andrea on September 01, 2020, 12:32:32 pm
Well, got kind of wiped out by stalker cat. I stillcan't quite understand how I am supposed to fight stuff, so if a stalker cat arrives either I evade, or even in a group full of pointy sticks everyone is dead.
Will get better I suppose, as I unlock more nodes.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Glloyd on September 01, 2020, 12:58:28 pm
Yeah, the problem with this game is that the early game is a blast, but the late game is a brutal boring repetitive slog. Part of the problem is that the best part of the game is swinging through the trees in the jungle, while in the late game you're just meandering around a desert. The other part of the problem is that there is no progression past the basic tools you can make on day 1. So at some point, the only new thing to do is find new areas and kill new stuff, and the former has the issue mentioned previously, while the latter is hampered by the lackluster combat (which really just becomes a chore once you figure it out/get enough upgrades to make it overly easy) and really simplistic animal AI that just adds to fighting feeling like a chore, because there's no real challenge in the actual hunting part of it. It's too bad. I got as far as Lucy, but I was never able to get the motivation to finish the game, because it just felt like a chore to play. But I had a great time with the first couple evolutions. Going on huge treks across the map as an ape was both terrifying and fun, especially once I realized that you could hold space while falling and grab onto leaves and branches and swing your way around like that.

I just wish they'd either shortened the length of evolutions, or added other features to the late game evos besides bipedalism to spice up the late game. Even new tools or constructions would make a difference. I guess that'd have to wait for a hypothetical sequel (although despite announcing that they were working on a sequel around launch, they've now said they're working on something else because of lacklustre sales [im assuming in part due to launching first on EGS exclusively, because I know a lot of people who'd never even heard of the game before it came to steam])
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on September 01, 2020, 01:29:10 pm
For emotions, holding R trigger to put yourself in alert state lets you run faster.

Yeah, it does lack in end-game challenges. I just made it to Australopithecus, so I assume I'm near the end. I live in the Savannah, close to the

Spoiler: spoiler regions (click to show/hide)


But I don't really run into anything that can challenge me (Mind you I maxed out aspects of my combat tree eons ago). I suppose that's the point, becoming the apex predator and evolving from there. There's a heat mechanic, but not much else. Loads of new wildlife to bludgeon and devour. I haven't run into the "evolving too fast locks you out" issue, though. I don't think that's possible. I'm a million years ahead of the curve right now, and the only thing I might have missed out on was that there was probably a swimming branch, but I avoided swimming like the plague because the waterlife is terrifying. Now I live in a place without swimming water. Becoming fully bipedal was the real snowball point for me.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Glloyd on September 01, 2020, 02:36:09 pm
Yeah, there is a swimming tree, but I can't remember any interesting unlocks. It was mostly just swim longer/faster iirc. Plus sprint swimming.

But I don't really run into anything that can challenge me (Mind you I maxed out aspects of my combat tree eons ago). I suppose that's the point, becoming the apex predator and evolving from there.

That's part of the problem though, the combat tree unlocks make combat so trivially easy it becomes a chore. That'd really due to the combat system though. There's no variance to it, so the only way to make your ape "better" at it is to give you more time to dodge/strike, so by late game you will just never be hit unless you're doing it intentionally to get the points for healing from it.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Cthulhu on September 01, 2020, 02:39:04 pm
Well, got kind of wiped out by stalker cat. I stillcan't quite understand how I am supposed to fight stuff, so if a stalker cat arrives either I evade, or even in a group full of pointy sticks everyone is dead.
Will get better I suppose, as I unlock more nodes.

The only way to fight is to counter-attack, where you dodge towards the enemy instead of away from it, otherwise the same as dodging.  NPC monke won't dodge or counterattack until you have the right neurons, so they're completely helpless early game.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on September 01, 2020, 03:12:47 pm
Yeah, there is a swimming tree, but I can't remember any interesting unlocks. It was mostly just swim longer/faster iirc. Plus sprint swimming.

But I don't really run into anything that can challenge me (Mind you I maxed out aspects of my combat tree eons ago). I suppose that's the point, becoming the apex predator and evolving from there.

That's part of the problem though, the combat tree unlocks make combat so trivially easy it becomes a chore. That'd really due to the combat system though. There's no variance to it, so the only way to make your ape "better" at it is to give you more time to dodge/strike, so by late game you will just never be hit unless you're doing it intentionally to get the points for healing from it.

Ya, agreed. I haven't found it to be a chore but it does not change from the start of the game. You just get upgrades that let you do it easier. Even big enemies boil down to "force it to attack you, counter, repeat 5 times until it dies".

I'm not too bothered by it, it doesn't feel like combat is meant to be the focus of the game. Otherwise we'd just run around picking fights with everything for funsies instead of roleplaying an evolving ape. If that makes sense. I still agree combat is less than interesting and could use some work.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Yoink on September 01, 2020, 07:29:20 pm
Team Crow Magnum
   
Why did this make me laugh so much   
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on September 02, 2020, 01:03:46 pm
I'm not quite sure how to progress. I've hit Australopithecus which in theory is the very last before you win.

However, I can't unlock any neurons to progress. I'm not sure what feats I'm missing in order to evolve. I have a large number of pathways open, but they don't seem to unlock. Things for smell/hearing/injury/injury treatment don't seem to unlock despite it saying they need "more training".

I also have the mutations needed to unlock these things. Not sure what's up.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: scriver on September 20, 2020, 10:42:23 am
I've been playing this for some time. I named my species Homo Monkelus and resettled my tribe next to the hunting grounds of a big cat, found a hominid named Ken (and of course dumped my old mate for her) and got eaten by a big cat. Am I doing it right?
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Grim Portent on September 20, 2020, 12:09:25 pm
I've been playing this for some time. I named my species Homo Monkelus and resettled my tribe next to the hunting grounds of a big cat, found a hominid named Ken (and of course dumped my old mate for her) and got eaten by a big cat. Am I doing it right?

Have you bashed things with rocks?
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: scriver on September 20, 2020, 12:18:52 pm
Yes! I have bashed many rocks, rocks with rocks, and things with rocks. I tried to bash a snake with a rock but it bit me
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on September 22, 2020, 05:49:08 pm
It is in fact possible to bash snake with rock.

remember to try and bash things with hand before bash with rock, sometime.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: scriver on September 23, 2020, 07:37:43 am
I prefer sticks, they make food
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: Dunamisdeos on September 23, 2020, 12:51:48 pm
Ironically you need to use a bashing rock (differentiated from a non-bashing rock by it's ability to bash things) to bash the food out of a recently sticked foodbeast.
Title: Re: Ancestors - The Humankind Odyssey
Post by: scriver on September 23, 2020, 03:01:26 pm
That's true! I always keep another homonkelus around to carry my choppy rock