Bay 12 Games Forum

Other Projects => Other Games => Topic started by: Mephansteras on February 12, 2018, 11:30:26 am

Title: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 12, 2018, 11:30:26 am
Rather surprised this game hasn't gotten a thread here yet.

Slay the Spire (http://store.steampowered.com/app/646570/Slay_the_Spire) is a Rogue-like Deck-Building card game currently in early access.

You make your way up a monster infested tower level by level, fighting a boss monster every Act (3 total). So, rather light on story. But it makes up for it in mechanical fun and each run takes only an hour or two to finish. And, like many rogue-likes, it is the particulars of the run that make it interesting and replayable.

This is very much a Deck-Builder in a pc game. For those that are not aware of the board game mechanic, a deck-builder is a mechanic where you start with a small set of core cards and then modify that deck as you play, adding and removing cards to try and build an effective set of cards to use. In Slay the Spire there are two characters, the Ironclad and the Silent. Each has their own unique set of cards to play with (both starting decks and the cards they can add during play). There is a third class planned, but no information about them is available yet that I have seen.

In addition to the decks, there are also Relics that you pick up that will alter how the game works for. Some of these are minor, others can completely alter your strategy. Each class starts with a Relic that helps define how the character plays. The Ironclad has one which heals him for a small amount after every fight while the Silent has one which gives her more cards in hand at the start of every battle.

The game works by having each 'floor' of the spire be an encounter. These can be Combats, Events (which generally give you choices to make that effect your health or deck), Shops, Chests, and Camps (where you can heal or upgrade cards in your deck). Each acts also has several paths you can take up the spire. Some will meet up or branch off, others might be a narrow line all the way up to the boss. But picking what path to take (and what combination of combats, events, camps, etc you encounter) is a very important part of the game.

In a combat, you have only a few basic stats and your deck to work with. You have your health, your mana, and your cards. Mana is what lets you play cards, with each card having a cost from 0-3. By default you have 3 mana to use each round. You then draw a hand of cards (5 by default), play the cards you can/want, then discard the remaining. Repete the cycle each round as you fight the monster(s). When you can't draw any new cards your discard is shuffled into a new draw deck and things continue until you or the monsters are dead.

At the end of most fights, and often from events/shops/chests, you will be given a choice of cards to add to your deck. This is about half the strategy in the game, since what you have in your deck and how well things work together is critical to succeeding. Sometimes the best choice is not to add a card at all, since the more cards in your deck the less likely it is you'll get the ones you want when you need them.

Overall, I've been having a blast with it! Makes a great short session game and even unfinished as it is I've gotten 60+ hours out of it.

Sheesh, didn't realized I'd played that much.

Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: IWishIWereSarah on February 12, 2018, 12:04:52 pm
Played it a bit and I love it.

It's one of those games where the rewards are random enough that 2 following playthroughs with the same class don't feel the same : one will be focused on poison, the following one on blocking with spiky-armor, the next one on creating 0-cost attacks, ....

The amount of randomization makes me a bit sad, though, because it means that you do not really choose how you play. It depends much more on which relics/rare cards you get early, around which you can construct your deck.

I also like some of the refreshing mechanics : when you draw all the cards in your deck, your discard is shuffled to make your new drawing stack. It's basic, but it gives an advantage in keeping you deck small (because you can find your rare cards more often) but opens you to a weakness : some monsters put bad cards in your deck/discard when casting debuffs.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 12, 2018, 10:54:49 pm
The basic mechanics of the deck builder (slowly adding/removing cards and reshuffling the deck when you need to draw and can't) are all basic for a genre of physical cards games. You may want to look into them, there are a lot of good ones out there that are a ton of fun. Dominion, Core Worlds, Star Realms, and Ascension are all pretty good. Some of those even have pc or mobile versions.

-----

Found an interesting combo. Normally I don't like Corruption (Skills cost 0 but are Exhausted when used), but it pairs incredibly with the Dead Branch relic (When a card is exhausted, put a random card into your hand). You end up with a deck that is incredibly random, but you can play 20+ cards in a single turn if you start getting powers that mesh with the combo well. I had the ones that gave you block after Exhausting a card and Draw 1 after Exhausting a card, and just ended up doing insane combos with tons and tons of block. Absolutely wrecked the run I did. Poor final boss never had a chance.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: thegoatgod_pan on February 13, 2018, 12:38:08 am
I've been sickeningly addicted to this. Silent is fairly easy to ascend with. Demon-dude less so. Really interested in seeing what the final character will be.

The really brutal combos for me have been shiruken+all the shiv related abilities for silent, which translates to a lot of 0 cost attacks that make themselves insanely damaging.

I also really enjoy the various ways of exhausting cards, and benefiting from exhausted cards with demon-dude.

My strategy is basically: always avoid fights if you can and take every available opportunity to remove cards from your deck.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: RangerCado on February 13, 2018, 09:49:50 pm
Doing an Ironclad Berserker Build... and then grabbed Pandora's Box... I now have a Debuff Deck with literally no block beyond the Self-Forming Clay Relic. This will be interesting.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 13, 2018, 10:04:23 pm
Amusingly enough, I think my most successful run so far has been my first. Been winning with others, but the first run was hilariously dominating and a victory right out the gate. Managed to roll over multiple curse related artifacts and a good bit of strength buffing cards, the last hit I made was a base strike hitting in the 50s, 120+ hp despite not even seeing feed, so on, so forth. I nabbed up every curse I could find, gladly had an immolate or two in my deck, and lolorolled over the last act~

Most memorable fight of it was a life link trio critter fight, where I unintentionally stalled for a bit and then hit them with like a 20+ strength boosted reaping, wiping the entire enemy for more damage than their max health. 92 hp heal from it :3

... also those byrds. Those damned byrds. Those friggin' degenerate monkey bird byrds. Every time I see them is a nudge to the hind brain I should be worrying about running into a minga melon.

The zaku slimes are great, though. For whatever reason seeing them leaves me with no expectation of a heat axe, only a continued appreciation of the monoeye.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: ThtblovesDF on February 14, 2018, 03:24:14 am
I also enjoy this greatly, being a big fan of all card games (magic mostly, but only in person), this does singleplayer card games very right. It would be very intresting if one could have a game vs another player that beat the boss as a last huraah (spoiler: if you go first, you win).

I totally agree, silent has a lot of exploitable mechanics, while our bruiser-type just needs a bit more work, but is more newb friendly.

I just can't get to the 11th ascend, but I'm working on it.

Right now some artifacts are just broken af, others near worthless - but I like that there are bosses that counter specific approches a little (time boss for example).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ygdrad on February 14, 2018, 06:58:15 am
I overlooked this one for a long time since I didn't enjoy most card games. I decided to give it a chance after weeks of it being in the best sellers, most played, and most streamed games, it had to be doing something right. I don't regret the purchase, the mechanics and cards/relics/enemies are obviously well thought out and I've been having a blast streaming it.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: FakerFangirl on February 14, 2018, 09:09:11 am
Is there a difficulty curve? It looks like it has a low skill-ceiling?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: ThtblovesDF on February 14, 2018, 10:17:16 am
Well every run is very different, some you can stumble through if you are good at deck building and mess up the gameplay, but in later accensions it just gets really unforgiving and you have to be pretty good in everything.

The game is hard, a novice user will fail many times (see northernlion players Slay the spire, ha) before seeing the boss once and even if you are good, no run is 100% safe.

Every successful run increases the difficulty of the next run (if you want it to).

As with everything, its Early Access, feel free to set it as a wanted game, wait for a big sale and grab it, its already worth its money.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 14, 2018, 11:08:36 am
I agree that skill does matter a good bit. I've gone from beating the first boss most of the time but rarely even getting to the last boss to pretty reliably able to win a non-ascension run. You can always get a bad run where you just don't get any good card/relic synergy but the better you are the more likely you'll end up picking the right cards and adapting your deck to a winning strategy.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: FakerFangirl on February 15, 2018, 12:10:58 am
Thanks! Well I like deck-building and the scaling difficulty sounds entertaining :)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: RangerCado on February 15, 2018, 03:35:13 pm
I got an event that wanted me to have the Red Mask relic, or spend all my gold for a random relic. I GOT the Red Mask from the gold. x.x
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 15, 2018, 04:20:02 pm
I got an event that wanted me to have the Red Mask relic, or spend all my gold for a random relic. I GOT the Red Mask from the gold. x.x

Yeah, that one always gives you the Red Mask. Never had it show up after having the Red Mask first, myself. I wonder what it does?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: FakerFangirl on February 15, 2018, 07:04:40 pm
So at first glance the card abilities seem oversimplistic. I checked some of the Steam reviews and agree with this one:
Quote from: Gallen
If you were to have a computer that randomly plays through the game and compare it with a skilled player over 100 runs, the player would likely only be ahead by ~5 wins. Why? Because how you play is so insignificant compared to the RNG of the game. [...] It does not matter how you play, because you aren't even the one really playing the game. The computer is, you're just watching the random pictures it decides to show you, and clicking when you're ready to see the next random result it'll decide.
I don't enjoy Hearthstone so I doubt I would enjoy this game.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: StagnantSoul on February 16, 2018, 12:44:45 am
So at first glance the card abilities seem oversimplistic. I checked some of the Steam reviews and agree with this one:
Quote from: Gallen
If you were to have a computer that randomly plays through the game and compare it with a skilled player over 100 runs, the player would likely only be ahead by ~5 wins. Why? Because how you play is so insignificant compared to the RNG of the game. [...] It does not matter how you play, because you aren't even the one really playing the game. The computer is, you're just watching the random pictures it decides to show you, and clicking when you're ready to see the next random result it'll decide.
I don't enjoy Hearthstone so I doubt I would enjoy this game.

That kinda describes the vast majority of card games though, just tilting it so you have a negative light.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: kilakan on February 16, 2018, 08:30:06 am
That's also not particularly fair to this game since there's no minimum deck size unlike other deck builder games.  Once you know what all cards you can get in a run, what the different routes can actually do for you card removal/upgrade wise, and what the relics do... I'd say you'd sit around a solid 50% greater win-rate than a true rng game?  At the very least you'll get closer to winning every time if you play smart.


On a different note, best deck shiv-dead stick deck.  Shiv exhaust giving you random cards is bloody hilarious.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 19, 2018, 01:22:00 pm
I'd have to disagree with that review. Yes, of course, you have hands that give you basically no choice in what to do. However, I've had many runs where specific decisions of what to play mattered a TON. That and, of course, what you add/remove/upgrade in your deck has a tremendous difference on how a given run goes. This is very much a strategy game.

As for the cards being simple in effect...yes, no particular card is all that complex. The trick is setting up combos and synergies between your cards and relics. There are cards that are very poor choices by themselves, but with the right set of cards or with the right relic they become very powerful.

I do not enjoy Hearthstone all that much and I love this game. Very different card games. Now, if you dislike card games in general, then, sure, you may not enjoy this one.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: chevil on February 20, 2018, 03:51:08 am
It took a couple of runs for me to figure out that you don't have to pick a card after every fight but I now know that choices about not picking cards are the ones that make or break the run.

Loving the game.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: ThtblovesDF on February 20, 2018, 04:14:38 am
You really want to beat the first stage with one cheesy op card and no-none-exhaust/power pickups.

I love starting the fight with 20 card and then only having 7-ish cards left in the deck, as every other card is exhausted or a power.

Card like fiend fire (exhaust your hand) can also be very useful to pretend you have a small deck. Other then that, just cheese everything with the doubling cards (Burst and that one for the fighter)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: FakerFangirl on February 20, 2018, 05:08:06 am
I'd have to disagree with that review. Yes, of course, you have hands that give you basically no choice in what to do. However, I've had many runs where specific decisions of what to play mattered a TON. That and, of course, what you add/remove/upgrade in your deck has a tremendous difference on how a given run goes. This is very much a strategy game.
Ok. I suppose the negative review was very exaggerated or he had terrible RNG.

As for the cards being simple in effect...yes, no particular card is all that complex.
I find Faeria and The Far Wilds quite challenging.

I really do like deckbuilding, Darkest Dungeon was surprisingly enjoyable, so you've all tempted me to buy Slay the Spire.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: ukulele on February 20, 2018, 08:20:56 am
I was quite interested in this game, and iv seen quite a few lets plays of it, maybe so many that now i feel that iv seen it all and its not worth playing, it seems it lack something, i dont know if its depth or maybe a little more player agency, lets say im looking forward to Slay the Spire 2.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on February 20, 2018, 10:23:31 am
I'm really enjoying the game. It's amazing how much of a difference what artifacts you get can have on a run - especially if you decide to trade out your starting artifact for a new one (the Silent is the best for this, since her +2 cards on opening hand is much weaker than gaining 6 health after every fight). My latest run, I ended up with the artifact that automatically upgrades any power card you get. As a result, I picked up pretty much every power card I happened across - ended up with a pretty great deck - got the "stack 100 points of poison" achievement with it.

Would've won, too, but final boss was the Time Eater (or whatever he's called) - bugger hits like a truck, and his 12-tick power/auto-end your turn gimmick messed with my "play ALL the +energy cards" strategy that had been serving me so well up to that point.

I actually ended up screwing myself - I didn't want to play shivs, since the damage wasn't really good enough to justify the tick on his clock... but I was earning a new shiv every turn, thanks to my power. As a result, my final turn saw me draw a hand of nothing but shivs when he went for a 3x10 attack.  :'(
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: DemonOfWrath on February 20, 2018, 10:22:02 pm
Yeah it does feel a bit too hard-countery at times. You're encouraged by relic+card synergies to go all-in on a specific playstyle usually, and since you have no way of getting out of a fight once it's started if you go against something that hard counters your deck quite often you're somewhat done. Time Eater feels particularly egregious, with the 30+ damage attacks most turns.

That said, love the game, I just feel like it needs more cards/options (or maybe they're hidden behind the bloody unlocks). Sort of feels like both classes have 2 or 3 obvious playstyles, and you're just seeing which one the first few relics point you to.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 20, 2018, 10:29:38 pm
Time Eater's a bastard, through and through :P

Still, it's interesting trying to finagle a win out of it when you're running a hard draw/mill deck and meet senior 12 step interrupt. Poor shiv decks, ehehe.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Chosrau on February 21, 2018, 03:49:51 am
Getting the Black Star Relic right from the start always seems to herald a good run. The amount of Relics you can get is just silly.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Shame neither Kunai nor Shuriken dropped. But even without them Dead Branch(get random card whenever a card is exhausted)+bandages(get 3 block whenever a card is discarded) on a Shiv Deck are insane. I dont think I took any damage on floor 3.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 21, 2018, 10:00:41 am
Nice!

Yeah, I had a run like that where I got 30 relics by the end. Ends up super powerful.

Pity a lot of the time when I got for a boss relic instead of my normal one the game likes to throw the cursed bell at me. That goes...less well.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: kilakan on February 21, 2018, 02:52:29 pm
Taking boss relic is almost never worth it I find, what with cursed bell, tiny house, specimen, pandora's box and white beast being in that pool.  Honestly the more I play the more I find myself just skipping boss relics that aren't sozu or the choker (when playing demon-dude).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: thegoatgod_pan on February 21, 2018, 03:42:59 pm
Taking boss relic is almost never worth it I find, what with cursed bell, tiny house, specimen, pandora's box and white beast being in that pool.  Honestly the more I play the more I find myself just skipping boss relics that aren't sozu or the choker (when playing demon-dude).

Not sure why you think these are bad:

Specimen is amazing for Huntress, making poison builds very powerful and useful in all situations where there is one big boss mob with a bunch of smaller buddies.

Pandora's box is literally my favorite artifact in the game, removing all the strikes and blocks which otherwise I painstakingly remove manually at great expense, and replacing them with stuff that may or may not be useful, but won't be trash either.

Cursed Bell is three artifacts for the price of one, and sure you get curses, but numerous artifacts benefit from curses, and, honestly three artifacts in the store is waaay more than three card removals.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 21, 2018, 05:31:06 pm
The bell's friggin' great if you've managed to run into some curse related artifacts, and fairly solid on an iron-critter regardless if you've nabbed up an immolate or two. It's not exactly bad in any situation, though, since the cost/benefit is stupid good, as pan notes.

Curse runs are honestly kinda' fun, though. More or less have to run into some applicable relics early on, but if you do it can get pretty sexy pretty fast. Works nicely with discard/exhaust type junk, too, obviously enough.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 21, 2018, 05:40:18 pm
Cursed bell can be good, yeah. It's just lousy as an initial artifact unless you get super lucky with the three artifacts it gives you. I've had runs end very early due to the curses screwing me over before I could remove/mitigate them.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: kilakan on February 21, 2018, 09:51:02 pm
Taking boss relic is almost never worth it I find, what with cursed bell, tiny house, specimen, pandora's box and white beast being in that pool.  Honestly the more I play the more I find myself just skipping boss relics that aren't sozu or the choker (when playing demon-dude).

Not sure why you think these are bad:

Specimen is amazing for Huntress, making poison builds very powerful and useful in all situations where there is one big boss mob with a bunch of smaller buddies.

Pandora's box is literally my favorite artifact in the game, removing all the strikes and blocks which otherwise I painstakingly remove manually at great expense, and replacing them with stuff that may or may not be useful, but won't be trash either.

Cursed Bell is three artifacts for the price of one, and sure you get curses, but numerous artifacts benefit from curses, and, honestly three artifacts in the store is waaay more than three card removals.
Ok, they aren't bad but they are all worse than having your starting relic which is what we were talking about.  I mean sure, pandora's box CAN be great or it can make it so you can do zero damage and have no chance of finishing the first floor.  Cursed bell also CAN be great, but having 3/15 cards in your deck be curses immediately is no beuno.

Same deal with specimen, if you have poison stuff set up by the time you hit the end of the first floor it's amazing, until you get poison it does nothing.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 22, 2018, 04:44:32 pm
Eh... worse than burning blood or whatever it is anyway, sure. Silent's starting relic is kinda' meh, unless it's changed since I last played, I guess.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on February 24, 2018, 07:47:56 pm
While I'll certainly admit that it must be a crapshoot, my first experience with Pandora's Box was crazy-successful: I perfected two bosses and two elites, and I would've earned the Impervious achievement (as the Silent) if I hadn't already had it. My deck was just so crazy fast without having to deal with strikes/blocks.

That said, I could see getting an entire deck littered with those unplayable cards (that have effects when you discard them) - that would suck.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 24, 2018, 11:09:10 pm
I've very curious to see what they'll do with the third class. I can guess two aspects pretty easily. Probably a mage and the color will almost certainly be blue. But what mechanics could it use? They have them pretty well split between the two existing classes, so I have to think they'll be adding new mechanics in.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 24, 2018, 11:28:44 pm
I'unno, the iron and silent seem to be respectively attack and skill themed in a general sense, so it'd be a fairly obvious pattern for it to finish the trio with something power tilted. Just have to see, heh.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: IWishIWereSarah on February 25, 2018, 02:09:25 am
I don't feel like the Silent is that much Skill oriented (except for poison), but may already be power oriented... I had games where I had a third of my deck as Powers... (Dexterity, Precision, infinite Shivs, and Caltrops in multiple copies).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 25, 2018, 09:58:03 am
Both poison and shivs are mostly skill related, tho' -- the shivs themselves are attacks, but outside the power cards related to them you're mostly getting them via skill cards. Plus lots of their stuff is based on card draw/discard/etc., which is primarily enabled by skill cards (backflip, acrobatics, etc.). So on, so forth -- even caltrops and dexterity are heavily reliant on playing skills to leverage them (generate dat block so the reflect damage doesn't chunk yer health pool, et al), ferex.

Both of the existing two definitely (can) use powers a good bit, o'course, but there feels like a noticeable enough slant to both. Is why it'd be an obvious-ish thing to slant critter three towards powers. Exactly how, I'unno, but eh. We'll find out when we find out :P
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on February 25, 2018, 09:23:53 pm
I'm really impressed by some of the relic interactions that show up in this game - it really adds some new twists on what are otherwise the "same old" events. Examples that I can think of are turning your +gold relic into the +health relic, or, as I just discovered on my most recent run, that running into the vampires when you've got the vial of blood lets you sacrifice the vial to turn into a vampire without the 30% maxhp hit.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Draignean on March 01, 2018, 06:31:35 pm
So, got the game fairly recently, so this is something of a ptw.

Snecko eye is an amazing artifact, and I love it dearly. It looks at any idea of a carefully crafted deck and begins laughing while playing tri-wielded zero cost demon forms and trying to sell you a three-drop anger.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on March 01, 2018, 07:05:10 pm
I find it to be a really good early artifact (either swapped for the starter or first boss drop) where you can load up on expensive cards to really use it. Much less useful for later game decks where you generally have a specific build going that the confusion just messes with.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on March 05, 2018, 06:53:22 pm
I just had a really fun run with the Silent on Ascension level 1.

It basically came down to four things:
The Tingsha relic (whenever you discard a card, deal 3 damage to a random enemy)
Tactician+ (Unplayable, if card is discarded, gain 2 energy)
Calculated Gamble+ (0, discard your hand, then draw that many cards)
and Expertise+ (1, draw cards until you have 8 in hand)

Honorable mention to the Sundial relic, which gave me 2 extra energy every 3 deck shuffles.

Best score yet at 868, mostly buffed by 2 perfect bosses and 4 perfect elites.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on March 05, 2018, 06:56:15 pm
Nice! For whatever reason the game tends to give me discard abilities OR stuff that procs on discards but not enough of both to make the strat work well. I keep trying, though.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on March 15, 2018, 03:46:04 am
Let it be known that blue candle + dead branch + necronomicurse is a thing of utter hilarity. All the cards forever for the low, low price of 1 hp per draw. yes I want to add thirty new cards to my draw pile in one turn why are you asking

... until you somehow manage to run the supposedly inescapable curse out of your hand, anyway :3

I'd say until you run out of health or energy, but at the absolute least the red critter just laughs at that. Reaper/offering draws ftw. The only barrier to the unending turn is boredom or managing to reach the end of the hand size limit.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on March 15, 2018, 11:03:13 am
I'm really enjoying the revised daily runs. Initially it was just a massively harder run. Now they're throwing in all kinds of fun and wacky stuff.

I missed one a day or two ago that sounded amazing - you can take a relic instead of a card when you beat a combat. However, the one I did yesterday (which I think might still be up) was interesting too: 200% gold, but you cannot upgrade cards at campsites; sleeping at a campsite restores 100% HP, but you lose 5 maxHP.

I ended up taking a wildly circuitous route that avoided all camps till the one right before the boss. Took all the events and relics that upgraded cards, and pretty much bought out all the relics of any stores I came across. Worked out pretty well - I even managed to get a feed off on Donu for the achievement.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on March 20, 2018, 08:47:54 pm
So I just finished my first successful run with the Ironclad and... wow, that was an awkward build.

Key relics were the Thread and Needle, Bronze Scales, Nilry's Codex, and Cursed Key. (Girya, and the Bird-Faced Urn were a handy bonus too.) I was packing a ton of curses by the end, courtesy of the Cursed Key, but they were largely irrelevant. Every battle basically consisted of mitigating damage until my Barricade showed up, then it was all pumping armor until Body Slam or (ideally Dual Wielded...) Mind Blast could finish it off. Just for fun, I ended up hitting the second boss for about 300 damage in a single shot. (Loving Nilry's Codex...)

Do most people keep taking cards whenever they're offered (even if they're of dubious utility), or skip them?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: lemon10 on March 21, 2018, 12:19:28 am
I have so far (and have two wins under my belt) but I'm pretty sure that unless you have a specific strategy that revolves around it in someway its heavily sub-optimal. You can still win that way of course, but in general it just waters down your deck and makes it less consistent and less likely you will draw what you need.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on March 21, 2018, 09:07:22 am
Yeah, knowing when to add a card and when to pass on cards that don't fit your deck is important. Even when it is really painful to pass on that normally great card, if it doesn't work for your build don't add it.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Orb on March 21, 2018, 09:33:19 am
Generally there are a couple really powerful cards that set the tone of your deck. Cards like catalyst (double/triple poison) or barricade (block is no longer removed). From there you should build your deck around those cards. Before I get one of those cards I tend to pick up more generic cards (anything that gives more draw, a better generic attack, etc).

It's important to skip, especially when you reach the third act.

Edit: Powerful combinations of relics can also set the tone of your deck, for example bandages (discard card -> gain 3 block) and gambling chip (discard any number of cards from your starting hand and redraw that many).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on March 21, 2018, 09:53:40 am
Not only should you not be picking up cards after every battle, you should in fact be looking to slim down your deck whenever possible - removing your starting attacks and blocks through the store and events.

The reasoning of such being that your basic starting cards are just that - basic. Every card you find will be better than them, either in damage (done or blocked), or will include bonuses like card draw, less energy used, etc. By removing the starter cards, you'll be playing your stronger cards more often.

My personal spending ranking whenever I hit a store is:
Crazy powerful relics (most of the rares - especially things like Ice Cream, or the Eggs if you get them floor 1 or early floor 2) -> Apotheosis (because it means you never have to upgrade anything in your deck other than Apotheosis) -> card removal (curses -> basic cards) -> the card currently on sale (if relevant to my deck) -> all other cards offered (if relevant to my deck).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on March 21, 2018, 10:00:39 am
There are some builds that are exceptions to that (such as a perfected strike build), but generally I agree with AlStar that slimming your deck is important for most builds. Given the choice between buying a card or removing a basic card from my deck I often spend the money removing a card rather than adding one.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on March 21, 2018, 11:23:19 am
I think I took this sentiment a bit too dearly on this latest run... I just realized I removed all of my offensive cards except for Neutralize. (Courtesy of Purity, so at least it'll just be one looooong fight.)

Also, traded my default relic in for... Ectoplasm. Byebye, merchant.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Karlito on March 21, 2018, 04:03:35 pm
I picked this game up a few days ago and I've been hitting it hard.

I missed one a day or two ago that sounded amazing - you can take a relic instead of a card when you beat a combat.
I played that one. Ended up with both the kunai and shuriken, then just used Endless Agony and a bunch of card draw to kill things, ideally followed up by a Finisher. Had 31 total relics by the end.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on March 24, 2018, 02:23:54 pm
People who like a concise deck must be hating today's challenge (Ironclad, Curse-based artifacts, 2 untyped, 50 random cards)... I'm kind of having a field day with it though.

Pulled a Barricade off the first boss, got that artifact that makes a skill Innate like three rooms later. Mix with Salisk Eye, Apothesis, draw-on-exhaust, skills-cost-0-but-exhaust, and 6 energy, and I have no idea what I'm playing on a given hand, but it's going to hurt.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on March 24, 2018, 07:41:05 pm
Least from what I've seen, there's a gap between too big to use well and too big to fail particularly easily. A thirty/forty card deck can get rolled over pretty easily, a fifty+ card deck lolorolls the game. It's fairly interesting, really. Suggests the balance tuning is pretty on point for normal gameplay.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on March 25, 2018, 12:59:39 am
I don't think it's inherently the size; I suspect that it's just easier to pile together a deck with random junk in it and have it be passable than to construct a tight deck, given the RNG in card accessibility and relics.

Update/Edit: 9 After Images in an Shiv/Agony deck is bloody ridiculous.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on March 27, 2018, 04:25:08 am
I picked this game up a few days ago and I've been hitting it hard.

I missed one a day or two ago that sounded amazing - you can take a relic instead of a card when you beat a combat.
I played that one. Ended up with both the kunai and shuriken, then just used Endless Agony and a bunch of card draw to kill things, ideally followed up by a Finisher. Had 31 total relics by the end.

Today's is even better for messing about with relics-- you get one from every normal combat. I finished it off with 41. (And I know I didn't take the optimal route; missed at least two on the third map, plus I spent some gold on cards, instead.)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on April 29, 2018, 01:26:49 pm
New character is out if you opt-in to the beta. Note that you'll need to go to the game folder and copy the contents of your preferences folder into your betaPreferences folder in order to load up your normal progress.

The character is very interesting. A robotic mage who uses these orbs that build up around you. By default you can have up to 3 orbs at one time. They each have a passive effect that goes off at the end of the round and an Evoke effect that goes off when you channel them. Some abilities channel them (which removes the orb), and you channel your oldest orb when you summon a new one.

I have only done 1 run so far, but it is an interesting character. No idea how to build an effective deck yet, but at least I got past the 1st boss.

Note that there is a lot of [beta] tagged missing artwork, so clearly they are still working on that side of things.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: RangerCado on May 08, 2018, 12:57:35 am
A lot of placeholder artwork is in now, as well as some actual art.

Also, there is likely a lot of balance still to be done because this seems a bit broken imo.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: IWishIWereSarah on May 08, 2018, 01:55:25 am
I mean, you are at the 40th floor.

I've had build where, after 5-10 turns, I had 30 strength, there, with a deck with Limit Breaks, the curse themed artifacts, and a few other things...
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: ThtblovesDF on May 08, 2018, 04:45:07 am
I find with the defect, just suriving is good enough. Avoid some elites until you have a exploitable decks (or self repair power), then start messing with the big boys. He feels far more late game then the others.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on May 08, 2018, 10:07:20 am
Yeah. Loving it, though. Probably my favorite character to play so far.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: RangerCado on May 09, 2018, 12:38:56 pm
Its nice to see the complexity and learning curve grows with the subsequent characters. Silent is much more difficult to learn than the IronClad, and the Defect is the same in regards to both.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on May 09, 2018, 03:12:50 pm
Indeed.

And I must say, it is really satisfying to beat the Awakened boss with a giant power deck. Kind of like the feeling you get when you beat the Time Turner with a Shiv deck.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: RangerCado on May 09, 2018, 05:47:54 pm
Buffer is the best power against the Awakened One. "Oh, 32x3? TOO BAD! I have 5 stacks of Buffer! YOU ARE DOOMED!"
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on May 09, 2018, 05:51:53 pm
Buffer is great for that. Although I did it with several Glaciers and mass amounts of Defragment so they were each adding 11 block per turn, plus cycling through many many orbs a turn. I then killed the Awakened one with a Lightning Strike that hit 28 times for 9 damage a hit. It was glorious!
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: RangerCado on May 10, 2018, 12:56:55 am
My two favorite runs I won win were very enjoyable for different reasons. The first is a massive deck that just tried to never run out of energy. Keep playing cards and never stop until its dead or you run out of card draw. 46 cards of pure doom.

The other was a 27 card deck with everything upgraded. I literally got to the last campfire and couldn't upgrade anything, just went in and outlasted you with a superior deck.

The Ironclad was my favorite character, and the Silent my most consistant. Now The Defect is my favorite, the Ironclad my go to for a relaxing win, and the Silent to switch things up... and go for the shiv achievement.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: thegoatgod_pan on May 10, 2018, 12:21:22 pm
I beat it with a ridiculous Defect deck--Spinning top and lots and lots of those cards that double your energy (for 0 energy, when upgraded).  I'd double and double and double my energy, and then take 20+ actions in a row (I upgraded as many cards as I could to cost 0, and took the cards for drawing 0-cost cards too)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on May 10, 2018, 12:35:30 pm
Oh, yeah, spinning top is amazing for the defect. I don't get it with it nearly often enough.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on June 11, 2018, 02:31:29 am
I've always wondered what the intended use of Silent's endless agony card (0 cost, 4/6 damage, every time you draw this card add a copy to your hand.  Exhaust).  Traded in my starting relic (and deck) for pandora's box, giving me a completely random, and in this case completely ridiculous deck.  Which showed me what the card is good for.
Spoiler: near the end of act 1 (click to show/hide)
Basically, the trick to Endless Agony is to play it with discard + draw cards.  So let's say I get acrobatics (discard 1 card, draw 3/4).  I play it, I get endless agony, I discard one copy of endless agony.  Now its back in my deck, I get a free strike (justifying the energy spent on acrobatics) and I get 2 more cards in my hand than I had before.  And if your deck happens to be full of 0 cost cards... yeah.
Spoiler: the end result (click to show/hide)
Final verdict on endless agony: there's no way this would have worked in a deck clogged with starter cards.  Still, if you have cards which require you to discard, endless agony is almost strictly better than slice (0 cost, 5/8 damage).  And slice is already a solid card.  So... 8/10?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on June 11, 2018, 06:39:04 am
The other primary trick, mind, is basically to branch it (or other exhaust synergy artifacts). Not really as good as shivs for that, but it's passable.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on June 11, 2018, 09:08:44 am
Yeah, it works well in a discard deck of any sort, since it gives you a 'free' card to discard instead of something you might want. It's also a good compliment for any deck that has Shuriken/Kunai since you can use it for an extra 1 or 2 hits to get the buff as needed.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on June 11, 2018, 01:22:55 pm

The other primary trick, mind, is basically to branch it (or other exhaust synergy artifacts). Not really as good as shivs for that, but it's passable.
I've never seen dead branch in a Silent run... that is a good idea tho, I'll remember that.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on June 11, 2018, 08:33:54 pm
Yeah, if you have the energy through one means or another, a silent running shiv is... probably at-least tied for best dead branch deck. Other runner being the obvious corruption ironclad.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: thegoatgod_pan on June 29, 2018, 05:11:10 pm
The claw cards for the Defect are amazing, they add to each other. Last win I ended up with 4 in my deck along with a bunch of draw 0 cards and steamrolled everything. The Time keeper died in three turns.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on June 30, 2018, 12:16:15 am
I just had a ton of fun with the new custom mode - playing as silent, with drafting and diverse (all cards available) enabled. Ended up with a mostly claws deck, supported by backflips and shrug it off.

I will say though, the random cards - like white noise - are really, really random - to the point that it was pretty much useless. Too many different archetypes to draw for - you're almost guaranteed that whatever you draw won't mesh well with your deck.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on June 30, 2018, 12:49:17 am
I have eaten Donu in two different ways.  I have achieved Slay the Spire nirvana.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on June 30, 2018, 07:32:45 am
I just had a ton of fun with the new custom mode - playing as silent, with drafting and diverse (all cards available) enabled. Ended up with a mostly claws deck, supported by backflips and shrug it off.
It might be vaguely worth noting modding is apparently a thing that exists for slay the spire, now. There's a handful of classes, some content expansion, and a few utility things (custom mode actually had a mod doing the same thing a bit before this latest update, there's an always whale mod, etc.).

Can take a gander at modthespire if anyone's interested.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: StagnantSoul on June 30, 2018, 08:01:04 am
Just played my first three games... The first two classes are rather straight forward and boring, but damn, is that mechanical class with the orbs broken. Went from not being able to reach the first boss with the first two to being an untouchable 40 guard a turn at minimum milling monster. Sadly I died on this boss who revived himself twice in a row and kept getting more damage...
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on June 30, 2018, 08:45:55 am
There's... only one boss that revives itself, and it only does it once, though? At least in the base game. The sleepy one with the cultists. jackass time master or whatever it is has a heal mechanic, too, but it's not a straight revive and I'm fairly sure it either only does it once or is supposed to have a sizeable gap in between uses. Both (well, all three end bosses) have a strength scaling mechanic, too (though time jackass is probably the worst of them).

That said, if there's anything that will blow a mill deck to hell it's the jackass time jackass. You can conceptually outpace the bugger with a scaling block deck, but you basically need kunai and the ability to put out six to nine attacks in a turn while still being able to play some defense. Not at all easy, heh, and you'd probably just kill it in the process if you actually have a deck that could manage it.

... well, unless you happen to be playing with mods and running a mad scientist. Then you just get (a few) copies of power armor, stack up the fuel, and laugh and laugh and laugh after you're putting out passive triple digit block figures by like turn three. Legitimately unbalanced as all hell, but hilarious :P
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: DeKaFu on June 30, 2018, 09:06:55 am
This game actually looks extremely relevant to my interests.

I generally have a policy of not buying/playing early access games, though, so... Does anyone know how close this is to being a completely finished product, and how close to its actual release?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on June 30, 2018, 09:12:12 am
No clue, but as is it's pretty damn solid for a deck building game of its ilk. I don't regret getting it for the current base price (didn't notice the sale was coming, heh), and wouldn't hesitate to say it has ten bucks worth of game already, never mind whatever comes in the future.

That said, quick check says the devs are actually expecting full release, or at the absolute least leaving early access, this summer. So within a month or three, expectations holding.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: StagnantSoul on June 30, 2018, 09:15:19 am
There's... only one boss that revives itself, and it only does it once, though? At least in the base game. The sleepy one with the cultists. jackass time master or whatever it is has a heal mechanic, too, but it's not a straight revive and I'm fairly sure it either only does it once or is supposed to have a sizeable gap in between uses. Both (well, all three end bosses) have a strength scaling mechanic, too (though time jackass is probably the worst of them).

That said, if there's anything that will blow a mill deck to hell it's the jackass time jackass. You can conceptually outpace the bugger with a scaling block deck, but you basically need kunai and the ability to put out six to nine attacks in a turn while still being able to play some defense. Not at all easy, heh, and you'd probably just kill it in the process if you actually have a deck that could manage it.

... well, unless you happen to be playing with mods and running a mad scientist. Then you just get (a few) copies of power armor, stack up the fuel, and laugh and laugh and laugh after you're putting out passive triple digit block figures by like turn three. Legitimately unbalanced as all hell, but hilarious :P

Wait that thing only revived itself once? I swear it just popped up from being killed twice... Next time I play I'm definitely removing those cards that give you focus but then lose it, the way I play until I set up right I can't nuke so losing focus is a nightmare.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: DeKaFu on June 30, 2018, 09:18:25 am
No clue, but as is it's pretty damn solid for a deck building game of its ilk. I don't regret getting it for the current base price (didn't notice the sale was coming, heh), and wouldn't hesitate to say it has ten bucks worth of game already, never mind whatever comes in the future.

That said, quick check says the devs are actually expecting full release, or at the absolute least leaving early access, this summer. So within a month or three, expectations holding.
Excellent!
In that case, I might buy it now (on sale at early access price) and wait until it's released to play it. Thanks.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on June 30, 2018, 09:53:20 am
This game actually looks extremely relevant to my interests.

I generally have a policy of not buying/playing early access games, though, so... Does anyone know how close this is to being a completely finished product, and how close to its actual release?
I don't know if *more* features are planned, but as is its a finished, complete game.

(that's slightly a lie, the devs have said they want more than 3 characters, but only for after release)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: thegoatgod_pan on June 30, 2018, 02:15:24 pm
Yeah, the only thing early access about it is that some of the art has been changing, otherwise it is a finished, and surprisingly but free and incredibly addictive game
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on June 30, 2018, 07:21:42 pm
Well, this just happened:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

... for those that haven't played around with mods, that's the mad scientist, and the thing of note is that little A with a 15 besides it. Mad scientists have a skill that, for the cost of a point of fuel (the class's unique resource), let's you plays a card X (where X is the number of automate stacks you have) more times for the rest of the turn -- echo form as a skill, basically, and without echo form's sanity check.

Of particular note is that automate stacks, and moreover stacks with itself. So if you play it once, you play a card twice. If you play automate with a stack of automate already running, well, now you have three stacks of automate. Play it again, and, well...

... you can potentially end up with fifteen (or more, particularly if you have, say, lightbulb and unceasing top, which I didn't have the energy gain card) stacks of automate, and gain multiple hundred block off a single card replicated fifteen extra times. Whee~

Sadly, deca didn't live long enough for things to get even sillier. Alas. also, fyi, while the rest of the mad scientist builds are relatively more reasonable, fuel builds are all kinds of broke as all hell. It's pretty great :V
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: ThtblovesDF on July 02, 2018, 09:38:52 am
Endless mode is intresting and the downsides you get after a while tend to avoid the "small deck = autowin" system, since they lay on the curses pretty heavy.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on July 04, 2018, 03:12:11 pm
Mod gifts keep giving. Shield burst construct is a delightful farce. Giving it an endless attempt, my first two third act boss fights (both donu and deca) were both one-shot on the first turn.

Outside that, biggest single hit I think I've seen so far was... either three or six thousand-ish (vuln + 999 block burst + pen nub). Not even trying for it, sometimes hammer down draws just mean I incidentally end up with 999+ dex, which makes for a sodding huge kaboom when it empowers a block card.

... any case, build's fairly simple. I have a handful of dex/block cards (my starting strikes are all gone, as is attack mode), a couple mega-upgraded hammer downs (because somehow, someway, a non-exhaust card that quadruples your dex and strength made sense to someone), and then a couple shield bursts (which eats all your block, then deals 3x the amount to all enemies). Add in calipers because of course having to build up one-hit tko levels of go-bugger-yourself in a single turn was apparently too much to ask, and you got a faceroll and a half.

It's pretty great :V
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on July 05, 2018, 12:23:42 am
Endless mode is intresting and the downsides you get after a while tend to avoid the "small deck = autowin" system, since they lay on the curses pretty heavy.
Reddit memes got you covered
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on July 05, 2018, 09:44:16 am
Yeah, the only thing early access about it is that some of the art has been changing, otherwise it is a finished, and surprisingly but free and incredibly addictive game

When was this ever available for free?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on July 05, 2018, 10:50:46 am
I think that's supposed to be "bug free"
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on July 05, 2018, 11:52:14 am
*butt free
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on July 07, 2018, 01:31:50 am
(https://i.img.ie/uR3.jpg) (https://img.ie/image/uR3)

Screw you time turner! For once, the game was one point off of lethal!

Always feels good to beat that jerk with a Shiv deck.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on July 07, 2018, 11:39:07 pm
I've apparently got an unhealthy obsession with relics -  Spirelogs has me at ~3 more relics than average for all three characters. This would not normally be a problem, as such, but I decided that I might give the 1 relic achievement a try. Playing with the Silent with ascension mode off, both times I tried I ended up with my starter relic exchanged for the +energy -potions relic - not a horrible choice, overall (although I think the Snecko Eye would probably be the relic of choice for the achievement.)

First try lasted until I hit a ? room that gave me the chance to get the golden idol. Picked it up without a second thought. *headdesk* Killed the level 1 boss, then reset.

Second try lasted until I hit an elite. Beat them, then gleefully picked up the relic dropped. *headdesk* Killed the level 1 boss, then called it a night.

I'm debating if this achievement might just be out of my reach - I can't seem to help myself with picking up any relic offered.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: StagnantSoul on July 09, 2018, 02:23:35 pm
Decided to give the Silent another try, man is poison fun. I tossed out all my attack skills that didn't involve poison, and picked up some cheap skills for doubling poison and detonating the poison like a bomb... bosses melt like butter because of the bouncing poison vial+that skill that multiplies your cards the next turn giving you three, in three turns if I'm lucky I can easily drop a 200 damage nuke.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Rowanas on July 10, 2018, 08:58:35 am
Anyone been having tremendous trouble with The Defect? I can't seem to build up a deck that reliably allows me to take on the second zone.  Ice orbs are only effective if you're running a super-fast orb cycle deck, and otherwise you don't have enough reliable block to stop yourself getting mushed into pace before you get your engine going. I've unlocked all of The Defect's stuff, so what am I missing?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on July 10, 2018, 09:06:12 am
Charge Battery & Leap are both very solid block options. Buffer is amazing. Genetic algorithm is also very good, though you have to get it early. Stack can be good if you're going for a thick deck.

For ice orbs Glacier is probably best for actually defending you. Mostly they just take the sting off of attacks unless you get high focus. Or get lots of orb slots to fill with them, in which case you can get yourself to the point where you're getting quite a bit of block automatically every turn.

Personally I find the Defect to be the strongest of the three characters for me, so I haven't really had that issue.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: ThtblovesDF on July 10, 2018, 09:28:19 am
They seem to fill there roles ok. Poison sielent is hard to beat, the strong boi is just very stable and good in most situations and the defect offers more utlity and options then all others.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: StagnantSoul on July 10, 2018, 10:55:38 am
Defect seems best, to me at least, with just 2-3 lightning and the rest ice, spamming as much focus as you can and using Leap and Glacier to hide. Melt is very nice against those monsters who hide behind tons of block.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: StagnantSoul on July 11, 2018, 04:25:00 am
How am I supposed to beat that clock guy? I've tried hitting him with 6 shivs and then some finishers, tossing tons of poison on him, hitting him with eight 7 damage lightnings a turn and invoking 3 every turn, hitting him with +10 strength 32 damage double tapped perfected strikes... Everything I can think of, every time I run into it I die.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on July 11, 2018, 08:08:09 am
Well, with strength build... perfected strikes are kinda' shite, most of the time, honestly. Strength deck or otherwise. Heavy blade (upgraded one would have been, what, fifty, sixty damage at +10? Double tap that three or four times and you win), sword boomerang, twin strike, maybe pummel, definitely that one exhaust card (fiend fyre?) are all much, much better if you're rolling strength. Every extra attack the card has is effectively another pip of strength.

+10 is also low (that's like all of three turns of demon form, and basically nothing if you have upgraded limit break), really. End-game strength deck can often break triple digit strength (this entails playing limit break like, three, four times if you have something for them to build off of?) and literally one-shot the time jackass.

... for the rest, it mostly sounds like you're just neglecting defense, to some degree. Eight seven damage lightning shots would probably be fine if you have (echoed) reinforced body or somethin'. If you got the damage, you ultimately want to play as few cards as possible and weather the assault as it dies. Keeps the strength scale under control.

E: if you want an easy-ish defect one, get a source of dark, multi-cast, and some energy gen. Hunker down until you have a shadow bomb big enough to explode the thing in one go. Sixty point boom'll do it from full health if you have six energy, iirc, and that's fairly easy for an end-game defect to have.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on July 11, 2018, 08:41:20 am
How am I supposed to beat that clock guy? I've tried hitting him with 6 shivs and then some finishers, tossing tons of poison on him, hitting him with eight 7 damage lightnings a turn and invoking 3 every turn, hitting him with +10 strength 32 damage double tapped perfected strikes... Everything I can think of, every time I run into it I die.
The goal with the time slug is to hit him as hard - and in as few cards - as possible. Shivs are just about the worst thing you could possibly play against him (unless you're running massive accuracy), since they're a low damage card and you'll just end up buffing him massively.

Something else to remember is that since your turn ends the moment he powers up, you ideally want to play either all 12 cards in a turn, or try to play 6 - you want to try to avoid turns where you only get to play 1 or 2 cards.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on July 11, 2018, 09:07:36 am
You also have to remember that every time he ends your turn after you hit card 12 his strength goes up, so unless you have a deck that stacks defense as time goes on you'll want to minimize the number of times you hit that limit.

It's what makes Shiv decks so bad, really. Which isn't to say that you can't win using a Shiv deck, but generally you need the right combination of artifacts to do so. Ideally you'll want Shuriken, Kuani, and the battle fan that gives you block when you play three attacks.

Poison decks are best for the Silent, generally, or Skewer based ones if you can get a ton of energy. Poison is easiest if you have good defense since you can hunker down and let the poison do the work while you play a minimum of cards each turn.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on July 11, 2018, 09:34:29 am
Defect seems best, to me at least, with just 2-3 lightning and the rest ice, spamming as much focus as you can and using Leap and Glacier to hide. Melt is very nice against those monsters who hide behind tons of block.
Every time you build a shiv or draw deck as silent add a malaise.  That’s your insurance against time eater.  If you put him down to -3 strength at the start of the fight and he’s at 1 when he purges debuffs, he won’t jump up to 4.  He’ll stay at 1 strength.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Orb on July 11, 2018, 04:13:25 pm
That sounds more like a bug  :-\
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on July 11, 2018, 04:23:25 pm
Its not.  The only status effects in Slay the Spire are the ones listed under a character, there's no "memory" of past buffs/debuffs.  If time eater is at +1 strength, there's no visible debuff on his character, so nothing gets purged.

Also without that interaction many Silent decks would have a 1/3rd chance of losing the game at higher ascensions.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Rowanas on July 30, 2018, 08:15:29 am
Just a sidenote - My mate is convinced that the game generates an end-boss that most fucks you up depending on your deck style. Since nearly getting a successful run with a Power/Lightning Defect run last night that was ended by the big blue bird (my first fail against it ever), I'm tempted to agree.

Your thoughts, Bay 12?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on July 30, 2018, 09:02:48 am
Nah. It's just that there are only 3 and each one is designed to counter a specific deck type, so there is a 33% chance that if you get to the boss it'll be the one designed to counter your deck. And given the human tendency to notice stuff that goes wrong over stuff that goes right, that can feel like way more than 33%.

And that is assuming you have a fairly 'pure' deck type and aren't running a hybrid (which is common due to not really picking a deck type until after act 1). In which case chances are 2 of them will counter your deck pretty well.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on July 30, 2018, 09:28:01 am
I'm almost certain that I've seen the dev post on Reddit that the game doesn't cherry-pick bosses on you. They also don't (despite popular opinion) always give you the three byrds fight right after you pick the Alchemist's Stone.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on July 31, 2018, 11:55:16 am
Most runs have 3 byrds.  This is one of several reasons I never pick up that relic.  The other that it will greatly power up all of the final bosses.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on August 01, 2018, 07:28:00 pm
Last boss is pretty random, though I've never really noticed any of them except the time jackass countering a specific deck type. Sleepy could maybe be considered countering power heavy decks but you kinda' have to have a pretty sketchy power loadout to not explode the thing before its scaling becomes a problem. Similarly the remaining one basically boils down to "can you kill the donut hole fast enough?"... or out scale the strength gain, I guess. Time jackass is about the only one that ever kills me if I actually make it to the act 3 boss, heh.

And yeah, most runs have three minga melon jerkeybyrds. Pretty sure you occasionally get it more than once, even. I'm not sure the alch stone actually makes their fight harder, though. The extra energy means it's that much easier to knock them out of the air.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: EnigmaticHat on August 01, 2018, 08:24:29 pm
At ascension 15 all 3 of the final bosses become absurd.  They have a little more health but a LOT more damage, it becomes a race to see if you can kill them before they grind you into the floor with 40+ damage per turn.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on August 17, 2018, 11:16:02 am
Looks like they added in an interesting new colorless power: Mayhem. It automatically plays the top card of your deck for free at the start of the round (after you draw your cards).

It works with Echo Form. Makes for a very unpredictable but potentially super powerful combination. Sometimes it plays a 0 cost card twice, sometimes it plays a 3 card cost twice (for free). It even did an X cost card for free that went off for as much Energy as I had without using any up.

I was able to win a non-ascension run using it so...not too bad, all told.

I can see if being a really powerful card if you have the artifact that lets you see your upcoming cards.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on August 17, 2018, 12:17:25 pm
The effect's fun. Mad Scientist mod had it before it was introduced to the base game, albeit class instead of generic.

Can kinda' screw you if you have the wrong cards in your deck (mass exhaust or discard, self damaging stuff, etc.), but generally there's not many situations where playing a more or less random card is going to hurt you.

Knowing what card is coming isn't necessarily particularly helpful, though. You also would need to be able to manipulate it, to get much control over the effect. Which ain't impossible, but it's probably more trouble than it's worth.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on January 31, 2019, 05:01:32 pm
I can get the Silent through the 4th boss regularly, the Defect sometimes, and accomplished Ascension 2 with Ironclad.

My last run was defensive, with the only wasted relics being calipers (after I had the card that prevents loss of block) and the pillow (I already had a relic that prevented resting). I seem to have bad luck getting either block cards (one run I got a single iron wave), or any reliable way to generate energy. Suggestions?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: MrRoboto75 on January 31, 2019, 05:18:26 pm
IME Ironchad often succeeds by having such a relentless offense that defense is irrelevant because everyone is dead.  He heals after every fight, so its no big deal if you take a scratch here or there.  Or if you can consistently "waste" burning blood by not really taking damage, consider the self harm cards like offering for draw and energy.

Usually the dream team is Flex + Limit Break + Heavy Blade or Whirlwind.  Limit Break makes Flex buffs basically permenent and generally can scale faster and more energy efficiently than say demonform.  Meanwhile Heavy Blade or any multihit card takes advantage of strength multiple times.  If the cards fall right you can get a fairly consistent alpha strike.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on January 31, 2019, 07:22:46 pm
Eh... blockade and silly block crushes the game pretty easily, too. Probably easier, most of the time -- defense generally seems to win out over offense for most (vanilla, particularly) StS fights (exception being probably the nob and maybe the statue, iirc... could argue the cultists I guess but they're too squishy to matter). Also more comfortably opens up the option of, y'know, taking one of the neow options that dumps your starter relic. Ironclad's is probably the best but none of them (well, without getting mods involved as some those have hella' sexy starters) are really that good. Aiming to replace isn't exactly a terrible idea if you're running a vanilla critter.

though why you'd run a vanilla critter at this point when the mod scene has more or less taken off running I dunno :P

E: Though getting more block cards when the RNG's screwing you... I got nothin'. You can try mods that add more cards, or roll with endless in hopes of getting them in the second go through, but ultimately if the seed decides all you're getting is an iron wave then all you're getting is an iron wave. Bout all you can do at that point is go reproductive organs out and roll full offensive.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 03, 2019, 10:02:51 am
I think I got it this time. I just fought an orb walker.

My anchor starts me with 10 black, it does 11 damage. One of the cards I played was Dark Embrace (draw a card when you exhaust a card). Next turn, my Mark of Pain gives me a wound, so I play it using the Medic Pack artifact, and draw Barricade. After that, when I got a burn in my hand, I played it to draw a different card. Each turn my block increased. I also have Feel no Pain, which helps, as I exhaust a few times each fight (2 wounds and an intimidate). And, as a bonus, Entrench. Now to find all of those Body Slams RNG gives me when I can't find a single block card.

Edit: And Incence Burner is great for getting enough block saved up that Entrench is amazing.

Edit2: Reptilomancer killed me right before a campsite near the 3rd boss.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on March 27, 2019, 02:53:11 pm
As of today the game is also available from GOG. (Just saying it for anyone that might be interested in it, I'm in no way associated with either gog or the devs)

I bought it a couple of hours ago (version 1.0 23-1-19) and so far the only thing that seems off is that I can't find the score ladder for the daily runs. Is it a steam only feature?

Quick update that doesn’t really need a new post:

While unlocks seem to work properly the game doesn’t seem to register some scores like the total damage to the heart when you complete the first 3 acts.

Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on March 27, 2019, 03:51:43 pm
After many (many) tries, I've finally managed to defeat the Heart with the Ironclad, thus completing the ending with all three characters. No idea why it was so difficult - I managed to do it on my first try with the Silent, and after only a handful of tries with the Defect, but for some reason, I kept dying on late 3rd floor, or several times on the Heart itself.

MVP of the victory was the Torii relic, which reduced the incoming damage of the Heart's x12 attack to a mere 12 damage several times in a row.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on March 29, 2019, 05:57:19 am
I don’t remember how many times I died but I’ve finally finished act 3 with the silent (non ascension  :-[ ). Double footwork + blur for the win
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on March 29, 2019, 08:00:19 am
I don’t remember how many times I died but I’ve finally finished act 3 with the silent (non ascension  :-[ ). Double footwork + blur for the win

As far as I can tell, Silent decks are a) poison and defense b) shivs and defense or c) defense and passive damage (caltrops and noxious). Agreed that blur is great, especially with the "your next skill (or 2, if upgraded) is played twice."
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on April 03, 2019, 10:19:13 am
[A LOT of extra deaths later...]

It seems to me that goingfull on defences is the best way in either class.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on April 03, 2019, 10:48:39 am
Yep, until you hit one of the hard counters to defensive decks (Goblin Nob, summoners who increase strength regularly). Then you need to change your strategy (deck) in the middle of the fight. So uh, good luck with that.

I think the major failing of this game is that there are hard counters to whatever your strategy is, and if you encounter them "I guess build your deck to a different strategy and get hard-countered a different way next time" is the only answer. That, or "play 1,000 times, and hope one of them has everything you want for your deck and also doesn't have opponents who overcome that strategy." It's like rock-scissors-paper, except you choose one of those 3 to stick with, then go up against enemies who can choose.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on April 03, 2019, 01:00:23 pm
Eh, those guys show up like first act and nowhere else, barring the last few fights. You need some offense (even if it's just body slam or that posion power or something), but if you go hard defense you can mitigate most things in the game once you start rolling, and generally more reliably than an offense build.

You do tend to need to hybridize to some degree, though, sure. There's not actually many hard counters in the game (I've outscaled gobbo nobs with dex before, on second+ pass infinite runs, heh), but there's enough that are really hard to faceroll over you do yourself a favor if you're giving yourself an out if something is a bad match for your deck.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on April 03, 2019, 02:04:30 pm
The goblin nob with the Sentry or whatever is still a pain during that special encounter in the 2nd act, and the Gremlin Leader is the summoner I was thinking of (also Act 2). The lady who summons knives can usually be handled, if you survive that long.

Also, I'm glad no enemy had melter.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on April 03, 2019, 05:06:49 pm
I want to say some mod or another adds an enemy with the effect? There's definitely a few that adds cards that strip block from you voluntarily. Construct (I think... the triangle-y one) has a stupidly powerful build based off it, if it hasn't changed -- stacking huge amounts of block and then popping it with a card that burns it all to inflict a multiple of your value on all enemies.

E: Ah, the infinite spire mod has one, I think! Sorta'. Its second or third cycle super boss has a phase where it resets basically everything (except your health and played powers, of course), that will strip any existing block in the process. It's a pretty nasty fight, really.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on April 06, 2019, 11:38:19 am
I feel as the biggest downfall of the ironclad is deck manipulation : /

Most of my deaths seem to happen because I draw little to no defences when the enemies are about to hit hard.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on April 07, 2019, 12:15:14 am
That's why Shrug It Off is such a great card for Ironclad - defense plus card draw. Otherwise, I'll usually try to take at least a couple upgraded Pommel Strikes (2 draw each).

Theoretically, there's also Warcry and Battle Trance, but I never pick up either outside Pandora's Box. I do pick up at least one Offering if I get the chance, although its HP cost has been upped so much in the releases up to v1.0 that it's almost not worth it anymore.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Sindain on April 07, 2019, 10:59:53 am
Ironclad just kinda sucks at blocking. One of the biggest weaknesses of the class. A lot of successful Ironclad decks survive just by face tanking things then having either Reaper or Feed (or both) to get a bunch of HP.

Also Battle Trance is probably one of the best cards in the game. 0 energy draw 3-4 is crazy in any deck without snecko eye or velvet choker.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on April 07, 2019, 01:14:11 pm
I agree that it should be a great card, but I repeatedly shoot myself in the foot with it. It's my own fault - I'll forget that I've got the "no draw" debuff, then play an Offering or something and screw myself.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on April 07, 2019, 01:24:58 pm
And then there is adrenaline: 0 cost, card draw and extra energy on the top...

On the ironclad I’m beginning to grow really fond of both rage and shockwave for protection.

edit: and then the game throws me a successfull barricade + impervious + entrenched with demon form on the side.... Ascencion 8, facing Donu and deca as the final boss and I'm down to 9 hp when I'm finally in a position to start the block engine in full swing. It peaked at about 350 block :D :D
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on April 11, 2019, 04:08:25 pm
999 block + intangible :o  8)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on September 30, 2019, 07:13:39 pm
So, I'm playing the new character. Any guess what wish/wish+ do?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on September 30, 2019, 09:56:05 pm
... isn't that just the dump-miracles-on-you card? *checks* Ah, apparently not. 25% current health for choice of gold (probably the only one worth that cost, eyeballing it), strength, or plated armor. Upgrade just increases the values. That. Does not seem at all worth, save maybe as some kind of low HP clutch thing. If you got reliable (and hefty) healing it might be an okay cash maker, though.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on October 01, 2019, 08:16:59 am
... isn't that just the dump-miracles-on-you card? *checks* Ah, apparently not. 25% current health for choice of gold (probably the only one worth that cost, eyeballing it), strength, or plated armor. Upgrade just increases the values. That. Does not seem at all worth, save maybe as some kind of low HP clutch thing. If you got reliable (and hefty) healing it might be an okay cash maker, though.

And the Watcher doesn't have much healing. The only healing I know of (other than generic stuff everyone has) is the heal 4X health card. She is not the Ironclad. Might be interesting for one of the hybrid runs (getting Miracle on the Ironclad might work out ok).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on October 01, 2019, 08:30:03 am
Yeah, you'd need relic and/or colorless (bandages) support for that one. Mods would help on that front, but vanilla it's a pretty sketchy proposition. Deva with the 4x heal and a stall inclined deck might be able to manage things, I guess? That's asking for deva, wish, and the heal card all in one run, though. And the means to play them effectively. It's a bit of a stretch, heh.

E: Man, I forget. Is the xylophone a vanilla relic? The one that lets you turn a 0 or 1 cost card into a X cost card. That plus deva form could get pretty ludicrous.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: IcyTea31 on October 02, 2019, 06:22:30 am
Won the fourth boss for the first time. Silent with dexterity, shivs and draw-discard. Finding both the Kunai and the Shuriken is probably what made that deck so powerful.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on October 02, 2019, 10:03:29 am
Won the fourth boss for the first time. Silent with dexterity, shivs and draw-discard. Finding both the Kunai and the Shuriken is probably what made that deck so powerful.

Nice. Silent is one of my favorites, but I've never managed to get shivs and also the +damage for shivs cards/relics (wrist blade) together on the same run. The fourth boss seems like they fight well against the "play piles of free attacks and deck manipulations" decks (which are fun decks), but also improve slowly enough that even those decks can win. The Time Eater is a pain for those decks, as well.

Poison/defense is a fairly easy deck to put together, especially if you can get a calipers, thread and needle, or something else that gives more consistent defense. Fights get long with the poison deck, and with more rounds, you're more likely to have an unlucky draw where you don't have the necessary defense. Tradeoffs, right?

Which character has the power that does damage every time they gain block? That's a pretty hilarious combination (only defensive cards and powers, and that defense is your offense).


Also, I don't do the daily challenges enough. I just finished Watcher starting with cards from all 3 colors (the non-block/strike cards were zap from blue and bash from red), normal enemies drop relics instead of cards, and a third thing I can't remember. You build a deck way differently when you know you probably will never see the cards you need to take advantage of combinations. Especially when my strikes were doing 10 damage un-upgraded with the strike dummy. I had a lot of relics and a few decent powers at the end, and ended up just skipping turns occasionally against the Time Eater. Doing nothing at all still let mantra build up, and the ice cream cone meant I still gained the energy. It felt like I was fighting the Time Eater like I am "supposed to." Doing the minimum to get the maximum gains. I find with the daily challenges, I end up bashing my head against a wall for a bit until something accidentally works out well, and maybe I learn something or at least view certain effects differently.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on October 02, 2019, 01:15:48 pm
Ironclad's juggernaut is the damage on block gain power, iirc. There's some mods with similar interactions (the construct's shield burst thing can get hilarious, if it hasn't been nerfed, ferex), too.

I don't tend to do dailies, but I do usually run customs. Heirloom, deadly events, big game hunter, certain future, is my go-to combo. Go big or go home. Usually low ascension, tho'.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on October 04, 2019, 03:30:20 am
I 've finaly beat ascension 18 with the Ironclad. Bludgeon, whirlwind, brimstone and necronomicon are one hell of a combo, especially when you can get enough gold to keep that deck thin enough :D

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on October 04, 2019, 08:24:53 am
I 've finaly beat ascension 18 with the Ironclad. Bludgeon, whirlwind, brimstone and necronomicon are one hell of a combo, especially when you can get enough gold to keep that deck thin enough :D

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Those shurikens (+1 strength every time you do 3 attacks in a round) don't hurt, either. Nice work.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on October 04, 2019, 08:32:18 am
Not just shuriken, that's the full ninja set -- shuriken, kunai, and fan. Sounds like they didn't really build the deck to leverage them, though. More a high energy instead of attack spam play. Would have been nice enough but probably not core to the deck.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: IcyTea31 on October 04, 2019, 08:42:31 am
Won the fourth boss for the first time.
Did it again. Ironclad with Corruption and Dead Branch. I don't think I need to say anything else about my deck after those two.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on October 04, 2019, 09:00:55 am
I mean, considering after those two you don't so much have a deck as a pile of RNG checks, yeah. Extra fun with that is some mod item I've forgotten the name of that... actually, I forget the exact effects, but it was something like reduce attack card energy costs by 1 every time they're used, exhausting if 0 cost. Everything has to go, nothing can stay :P

... actually, there's another one that just sets everything to 0 cost/exhaust. Never actually tried it, much less in conjunction with a dead branch, but it'd probably be fun.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on October 04, 2019, 11:15:48 am
Sounds like they didn't really build the deck to leverage them, though. More a high energy instead of attack spam play. Would have been nice enough but probably not core to the deck.

This.

They came late enough in the game that while they were helpful in their own right the deck was already all about "draw bludgeon/whirlwind - use bludgeon/whirlwind" with a bit of "uppercut" on the side.  The strength bonus from the shuriken was always present after the second act when I finally got some extra energy and I was able to use a second attack after my big hitters but it was often overshadowed by the brimstone.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on October 06, 2019, 10:36:19 am
The new relic that causes your first attack to do +9 damage (Akabeko) is hilarious on the ironclad with pummel (2 damage 4 times, 5 times if upgraded).

Edit: 2x4, not 4x4.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on October 09, 2019, 09:32:22 am
I found a very unexpected combo that I feel it would have been quite viable if I had build my deck a bit more carefully.

Ironclad, with the pain* curse (1 damage to hp for every card played), rupture (+1 strength every time you lose hp due to a card) and self forming clay (+3 defence in the next turn each time you lose hp). Playing rupture as early as possible is a vital step so either good card draw or the relic that ensures you have it in your opening hand is also necessary.

*I got it from the event that gives the relic that upgrades a random card in your hand each turn.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: IcyTea31 on October 09, 2019, 10:07:41 am
I think the 'official' way to build that deck is to use cards like Combust and Bloodletting to deal damage just as you take it. curses aren't the ideal way to do it, in my opinion.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on October 09, 2019, 11:04:52 am
Yeah. But it is a decent curse to have if you're going for that style of deck anyway.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on October 09, 2019, 11:12:42 am
Well yes, hence the "unexpected" part. Thing is, in the right deck it might be better than pairing rupture with either Combust or Bloodletting, since it allows the player to build up lots of strength in a single turn instead of having to wait for multiple turns like in the traditional combo.

Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on October 09, 2019, 11:35:01 am
Well yes, hence the "unexpected" part. Thing is, in the right deck it might be better than pairing rupture with either Combust or Bloodletting, since it allows the player to build up lots of strength in a single turn instead of having to wait for multiple turns like in the traditional combo.

Yeah, but for the Ironclad, 3 is a lot of cards.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on October 09, 2019, 11:46:28 am
As in playing 3 cards/turn or having a combo that relies on 3 cards?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on October 09, 2019, 12:31:15 pm
As in playing 3 cards/turn or having a combo that relies on 3 cards?

Playing 3 cards in the same turn. Ironclad relies on a lot more 2+ cost cards.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on October 09, 2019, 12:39:42 pm
He does have easy access to some cards that can help up cards/turn (0 cost or extra energy) but it does need some good will from RNGesus to work so..yes I see your point  :)
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: MrRoboto75 on October 09, 2019, 06:15:02 pm
sounds like you need to embrace sneko
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Sindain on October 09, 2019, 08:31:20 pm
Another way to pull of this same curse stuff is necronomicurse + blue candle. Blue candle lets you exhaust a curse for 1 hp and necronomicurse returns to your hand any time you exhaust it. Infinite health damage procs and exhaust procs for 0 mana (until you die anyway).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on October 09, 2019, 08:40:42 pm
That plus bite is fun times.

Though I'm not sure it's actually infinite returns. I've had a blue candle/necronomicurse combo manage to make the curse stop coming back before, heh. Might have been a bug, I'unno, and since fixed, but at the time it was hilarious and iirc unfortunate. That deck was pretty reliant on that particular abuse :P
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on October 12, 2019, 01:42:14 pm
Corruption + dead branch is too OP1!!1!11!1 :D :D :D

Ascension 20, Ironcald vs Donu&Deca and then Time Eater. The deck turned out surprisingly tanky due to the power that gives defence every time a card is exhausted. Body slam was the main damage dealer along with the occasional fiend fire. Time Eater was the only real threat in this run and it would have finished me if it wasn't for the liazrd tail.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on December 04, 2019, 06:28:44 pm
Ascension 20, Ironcald vs Donu&Deca and then Time Eater. The deck turned out surprisingly tanky due to the power that gives defence every time a card is exhausted. Body slam was the main damage dealer along with the occasional fiend fire. Time Eater was the only real threat in this run and it would have finished me if it wasn't for the liazrd tail.

Man, I can't even get past ascension 10 as ironclad. Even with a decent Entrench/Barricade/Body Slam deck (to be fair, it's rare to get all 3 in one run). How do I get better?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on December 05, 2019, 07:27:04 am
There are a few pointers I could give you but honestly they won’t make a difference if the rng decides to screw you!

In terms of general gameplay I’ve noticed that conserving hp* is becoming increasingly important as you go up the ascensions, learning the attack patterns of certain creatures/elites also helps. Personally I favor a thinner decks but these are easier to get screwed with by status cards, having a way to draw more cards is necessary once you have 18-20 cards in my opinion. I also think that a standard 4 energy/turn is ironclad’s sweetspot since I’ve oftenly found myself with spare energy if I went beyond that (unless you’re going big on “X energy”  cards or have a lot of card draw).

*That AOE attack that heals you back can really help you with that, especially if you had the chance to build some strength..

In terms of specific combos, I ‘m not too keen on full on defense. Entrenched is useless by itself and requires too much of a set up before it can be used effectively. Barricade/demon form are awesome powers but they cost a lot and effectively force you to “lose” a turn in order to play them, take  them if you have the energy to spare but they aren’t a must have. I prefer inflame/some relic and limit break for strength generation.

For damage dealing I prefer a heavy hitter ( bludgeon, heavy blade, whirlwind, pummel) + vulnerable combo. Perfect strike is a nice card but requires specific deck builds, take 1-2 of them if you don’t have any of the heavy hitters. Searing blade/rampage require too much set up to become effective in higher ascensions. An upgraded bodyslam is always nice either for damage or for the play x number of cards relics. Most importantly you really need some AOE damage, for when you are outnumbered, whirlwind is probably the best of the bunch.

For defense, I really like metallicize, rage and flame barrier. The first two allow you to focus on  taking out enemies quickly and the last one gives you plenty of bang for your buck. Upgraded armaments is a nice card but it will become a dead draw eventually, still it’s nice to have one if you haven’t had the chance to upgrade your key cards or if you can't upgrade your cards anymore.

Lastly I'd like to give extra attention on a couple relics/cards/potions.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on December 05, 2019, 10:44:28 am
... wait, what? The shovel that gives you more relics over the course of a run is mostly useless? Card removal pipe is also serious mojo if you're going for a slim deck. I'd agree the dreamcatcher is mostly shite, but those other two are pretty golden.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on December 05, 2019, 10:59:37 am
In terms of specific combos, I ‘m not too keen on full on defense. Entrenched is useless by itself and requires too much of a set up before it can be used effectively. Barricade/demon form are awesome powers but they cost a lot and effectively force you to “lose” a turn in order to play them, take  them if you have the energy to spare but they aren’t a must have. I prefer inflame/some relic and limit break for strength generation.

Yeah, I've started disliking Demon Form's cost. It's an amazing card after a few turns, but 3 energy is too much for a card that also takes time to get good. Also, upgraded entrenched is probably just a second block card, up until you get barricade, so taking it is gambling a campfire and a card take hoping you get Barricade. Barricade is expensive, but it's also a nice way to use your energy for those turns when the RNG gives you only block cards (although, at that point, it's equivalent to an ice cream cone, except it takes 2 energy each fight and also smooths out your only/mostly got attack cards hands.) I've also seen rampage being a low-damage card a lot lately (although it kind of works in long fights like donu and deca, or if you have headbutt as well). I'll probably completely avoid them for a few runs to see how that works out for me.

My only problem with limit break is getting my strength above zero. Flex doesn't work, because it's hard to get them at the same time.


For damage dealing I prefer a heavy hitter ( bludgeon, heavy blade, whirlwind, pummel) + vulnerable combo. Perfect strike is a nice card but requires specific deck builds, take 1-2 of them if you don’t have any of the heavy hitters. Searing blade/rampage require too much set up to become effective in higher ascensions. An upgraded bodyslam is always nice either for damage or for the play x number of cards relics. Most importantly you really need some AOE damage, for when you are outnumbered, whirlwind is probably the best of the bunch.

Ah. Thank you for reminding me why I used to like whirlwind even though it's 5*x damage. That's (potentially) much better than cleave. Pummel+vulnerable+strength gain is a fun combo.


For defense, I really like metallicize, rage and flame barrier. The first two allow you to focus on  taking out enemies quickly and the last one gives you plenty of bang for your buck. Upgraded armaments is a nice card but it will become a dead draw eventually, still it’s nice to have one if you haven’t had the chance to upgrade your key cards or if you can't upgrade your cards anymore.

Agreed. Rage and metallicize are almost auto-picks for me, and I have similar feelings about armaments.


  • Preserved insect is a really strong relic to have, since it will help you get stronger. Pair it with the Black Star if possible.
  • The bird cage relic (I'm not sure how it's called) is a valid option if you haven't had the chance to remove the cards you want to.
  • Dreamcatcher, that pipe, and the shovel are mostly useless as relics.
  • Upgraded Infernal Blade/exhume isn't a necessary addition in your deck but I find it quite a fun way to play, without sacrificing much in terms of efficiency.
  • The smokescreen potion can save you from a bad fight, like that sphere that has the barricade ability and opens the fight with a ton of defense.

I'd consider adding Giryu to the list of relics that are bad because they require you to use campfire actions. I got it in the recent daily challenge with the ironclad, but never used it. Starting with 3 strength is great, though.

I can't figure out how I feel about exhume/dark embrace/feel no pain, because I usually only see them early and I don't know that I'll get much use out of them. I'll usually take exhume, but not dark embrace.


I like taking Evolve, because so many enemies throw statuses at you. It really shines against "dazed (https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/Dazed)" spammers. Mostly ignoring statuses is also nice when you play with a thinner deck or a lot of power cards.


... wait, what? The shovel that gives you more relics over the course of a run is mostly useless? Card removal pipe is also serious mojo if you're going for a slim deck. I'd agree the dreamcatcher is mostly shite, but those other two are pretty golden.

Yeah, they're great if you somehow have too many campfires and no more cards to upgrade, but that's not a common situation.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on December 05, 2019, 11:05:43 am
Apotheosis makes the various campfire relics much more useful.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on December 05, 2019, 11:08:37 am
... wait, what? The shovel that gives you more relics over the course of a run is mostly useless? Card removal pipe is also serious mojo if you're going for a slim deck. I'd agree the dreamcatcher is mostly shite, but those other two are pretty golden.

If you can afford to not rest.

Edit: Bold are mine.

I've also seen rampage being a low-damage card a lot lately (although it kind of works in long fights like donu and deca, or if you have headbutt as well). I'll probably completely avoid them for a few runs to see how that works out for me.

I see rampage as an improved strike. It's almost always better to have rampage than a strike but I probably wouldn't base my deck around it. In the same vein, Iron wave is also a nice substitute.

My only problem with limit break is getting my strength above zero. Flex doesn't work, because it's hard to get them at the same time.

0 cost damage boost? Yes please! I like flex. Flex/limit break can work with lots of draw and/or the right bottle relics.

I'd consider adding Giryu to the list of relics that are bad because they require you to use campfire actions. I got it in the recent daily challenge with the ironclad, but never used it. Starting with 3 strength is great, though.

I wouldn't dismiss it if it means I can reliably start the strength engine. A one time use (especially early on) isn't that bad of a trade off, more uses depending on maps/luck.

I can't figure out how I feel about exhume/dark embrace/feel no pain, because I usually only see them early and I don't know that I'll get much use out of them. I'll usually take exhume, but not dark embrace.

Upgraded exhume is a nice card to have but not crucial. Feel no pain can be powerful in a corruption+dead branch deck. Dark embrace seems useless to me.


I like taking Evolve, because so many enemies throw statuses at you. It really shines against "dazed (https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/Dazed)" spammers. Mostly ignoring statuses is also nice when you play with a thinner deck or a lot of power cards.

A nice but very situational relic is charon's ashes. I can't really recommend it but it's nice to see those dazes/slimes used against your enemies.

Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on January 17, 2020, 03:25:07 am
Version 2.0 hit GOG's deck yesterday and I took it out for a test drive. Right off the bat:
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on January 17, 2020, 08:54:05 am
On my silent run I had the luck to use a potion based deck that is rather new to me. It relied on the sacred bark (x2 on potion effects), toy ornithocopter (heal 5hp when using a potion) and alchemize and was complemented with noxious fumes (x2), footwork, smooth stone, shuriken, pen nib for damage and tanking. On the last boss (donu and deca) I used the new ritual potion (+ strength every turn) and I found myself throwing 25/50 dmg shivs  :D

Yeah, that's a solid build for the silent, and the new potions are really good. Calling bell is also a pretty good deal now (1 curse that does nothing but can't be removed for 3 relics).

The watcher is great when you can steamroll enemies, and terrible when you're stuck in rage mode taking double damage. It's tougher to make it through a full ascension than other characters, but you're beating enemies in 2 rounds when you're beating them.


Edit: If you can get to an early card removal and upgrade wrath (at least), you can handle quite a few elites. Just make sure you choose paths that you can leave easily when a fight goes bad.
You end up with quite a few 0-cost cards, and extra energy (if you use stances), so you want to avoid the boss relic that gives +1 energy/round in exchange for only playing 6 cards/round. You also want to avoid the timekeeper boss with that build, but there's not much of a way to do that.
A pretty good build is the power that reduces the cost of any card by 1 each time you retain it, and cards that get more attack/defense when you retain them.
I also had fun with blue candle + tungsten bar. Remove curses for 1 damage, and also reduce all damage by 1. I guess I'll just get cursed, then.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on January 17, 2020, 03:41:27 pm
For what it's worth, there's some mod or another that actually gives you a chance to influence which act 3 boss you get. Don't remember which one, or if vanilla has something similar, but there's a thing where you can drop cash to, uh. It's either guarantee a specific boss or guarantee you won't fight it, don't quite remember. Nice, in any case.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on January 17, 2020, 04:19:27 pm
On metered internet right now so I can't grab it... but (ignoring the menu screens and whatnot) can you smoothly play with a pure keyboard interface now? I remember it working well 90% of the time, but you'd occasionally have weird targeting problems, like you couldn't switch off of the first card, or target anything other than whatever was targeted by default.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on January 18, 2020, 10:13:23 am
Been enjoying the Watcher, but man is she easy to screw up with. Use Wrath at the wrong time and it is very easy to end up losing a fight that shouldn't be all that hard. Very satisfying to steamroll stuff with her, though.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: MrRoboto75 on January 18, 2020, 10:26:56 pm
you pizza'd when you shoulda french fried.  Gonna have a bad time.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on January 19, 2020, 10:48:15 am
Been enjoying the Watcher, but man is she easy to screw up with. Use Wrath at the wrong time and it is very easy to end up losing a fight that shouldn't be all that hard. Very satisfying to steamroll stuff with her, though.

Yeah, I like to pick up an empty body and/or a tranquility as early as I can, because it smooths things out. Empty fist ends your fighting when you still want to fight, so it's not as good.

The transient fight is...uh...it's a thing. 3-4 no damage rounds, then you get crushed.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on January 20, 2020, 10:23:18 am
What are everyone's thoughts on the 'mantra' line of skills? The Watcher's enlightened form is crazy (3x damage, no penalty when taking damage) but most of the cards that give mantra don't actually do anything that affects the board.

I find Pray to be decent - enough mantra that you might actually trigger it during a hallway fight, while the insights it generates guarantee that you'll have plenty of attacks to play when you trigger the form. Worship, on the other hand, just doesn't seem worthwhile - sure, you only need two for the trigger, but it costs an unupgradeable two energy. Prostrate is free and gives (a little) block, but needing 4 or 5 pretty much assures that you'll never get the trigger in hallway fights.

Haven't played around with Blasphemy yet - definitely a card you want to triple-check your damage numbers before you play, and avoid anything that auto-plays your cards.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Il Palazzo on January 20, 2020, 11:01:09 am
I've found that it works for me with high-turnouver decks and just a few prostrate cards. Having the relevant relic and/or stance helps, of course.
But I kinda never built specifically towards it, more towards frequent stance changes, where having it trigger once in a while is a nice boon and synergises well with that build.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on January 20, 2020, 01:58:31 pm
I just did a Mantra/Calm deck and at no ascension it was plainly put broken. My main mantra generators were initially a "pray" and a "worship", but I gradually phased worship out when I got a "prostrate" and that power that gives 2 mantra/ turn. For tankiness I relied on two copies of the power that gives block when in calm plus the starter block+calm card. For damage dealing I used two copies of the Battle hymn power (each giving a retaining damage dealing card/turn).

The whole concept was quite simple. Put down those battle hymns, gather mantra, ues scry to manipulate the draws, unload any damage card when in divinity and try to end your turn in calm. To top it off by act 2 I had also become a vampire so keeping my hp high was quite trivial.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Sindain on January 20, 2020, 06:13:46 pm
I think mantra is OK. It's mostly just a way for Watcher to scale up her damage for the late game. Most mantra cards are pretty mediocre for first act and a half or so since they're slow and Watcher has plenty of damage from wrath stance.

Pray I think tends to be the weakest of the mantra cards. It doesn't generate enough mantra to be do much by itself and the insights get really awkward sometimes.

Worship is probably the best by itself. It generates a lot of mantra so it can let you enter divinity regularly without any support. The retain upgrade is also very nice, since it lets you control when you enter divinity and also means you don't have to keep drawing it if you don't want to play it.

Prostrate is nice since it actually does something in addition to generating mantra. A 0 energy block card can be pretty nice in a high draw deck or if you can get some dex.

The power is OK but tends to be pretty slow. probably best if your using it to support some of the other mantra cards.

Blasphemy is very strong but pretty much the opposite of the others in terms of application. Rather than scaling its used to get extra burst to finish fights off. It can do a helluva alot of damage so its great  in the mid-game, but it drops off late game. Watcher already has really good burst so late game she tends to need consistent damage (to kill burst resistant enemies like the heart) or block, and blasphemy helps with neither.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on January 26, 2020, 06:32:50 am
I've been playing a bit more with the watcher lately (reached ascension 7) and the more I play the duller I find the mantra line compared to the high risk/ high reward style of a wrath based deck. So far the only fun mantra decks that I've managed to build were the one I posted before and another that was based on the "Brilliance" attack ( extra dmg for each mantra genn'ed). Likewise the Α-Β-Ω line can be powerfull but it can be a pain in the ass to set up without screwing yourself in the long run.

What are your thoughts on those "synergy" ( does x if last card was Y) cards? I've made limited use of those, mostly the "crush joint" (apply vulnerable), but I'm not sure if it's worth it to try to set them up.

Overall, I'm still undecided about the watcher, her playstyle offers a lot of options but ultimately a lot of them are just boring :-\
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Sindain on January 26, 2020, 08:36:48 pm
What are your thoughts on those "synergy" ( does x if last card was Y) cards? I've made limited use of those, mostly the "crush joint" (apply vulnerable), but I'm not sure if it's worth it to try to set them up.

I think those kind of cards are OK. The conditions are pretty simple so I rarely find I have difficulty activating them.

Crush joints is quite nice since it's pretty much the only source of vulnerable for Watcher, and vulnerable is really valuable since shes does so much damage through attacks. Though it (and sash whip) really need an upgrade to be good.

Sash whip is pretty similar to crush joints, but it suffers since Wave of the Hand is is often a much better source of weak.

Sanctity is solid card. Basically just a slightly better, conditional backflip.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on January 27, 2020, 03:47:29 pm
What are everyone's thoughts on the 'mantra' line of skills? The Watcher's enlightened form is crazy (3x damage, no penalty when taking damage) but most of the cards that give mantra don't actually do anything that affects the board.

I find Pray to be decent - enough mantra that you might actually trigger it during a hallway fight, while the insights it generates guarantee that you'll have plenty of attacks to play when you trigger the form. Worship, on the other hand, just doesn't seem worthwhile - sure, you only need two for the trigger, but it costs an unupgradeable two energy. Prostrate is free and gives (a little) block, but needing 4 or 5 pretty much assures that you'll never get the trigger in hallway fights.

Haven't played around with Blasphemy yet - definitely a card you want to triple-check your damage numbers before you play, and avoid anything that auto-plays your cards.

A devotion (the 1 energy power that gives 2/turn, 3/turn upgraded) and one or more prostrates (0 cost, 4 block and 2 mantra, 3 upgraded) makes it worth using. Adding in the relic is nice as well. Especially with brilliance. All of my successful decks have been devotion decks or establishment decks with a lot of luck.

I only ever had one of the Worship cards, because of a Neow transform. I even used it once because the enemy wasn't attacking, and I only had that and blocks. It's not a good card unless you're planning on having bad draws or a lot of extra energy (which, being the watcher, isn't entirely unreasonable).


What are your thoughts on those "synergy" ( does x if last card was Y) cards? I've made limited use of those, mostly the "crush joint" (apply vulnerable), but I'm not sure if it's worth it to try to set them up.

Crush joints is the easiest to set up, because you start with a miracle. Wrath, miracle, crush joints, then 2 attacks is a nice opener. Also, agree with Sindain that any debuff needs to be upgraded to a second round to be good.


As I ascend, the issue I've had with Watcher is 2nd or 3rd act enemies that scale (and, depending on card draws, Nob). If you don't have a source of calm or an Empty Body coming next draw, popping Wrath to take them down quickly is a huge gamble. Not doing that means you don't take them out before they outstrip your ability to attack/defend. Watcher really doesn't have much that scales.

Also, I'd like a Neow option to add one basic character-specific card to your deck (or trade out a strike/block for one). Empty Body would be a great additional starter for Watcher, maybe ball lighting or cold snap for Defect, backflip for silent, and probably iron wave for ironclad (I'd say bodyslam, but that's not as build-agnostic as I'd like). Not something that would define your build, but something that's useful for most builds that interface at all with the thing your character does (watcher has stances, defect has orbs, etc.).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: IcyTea31 on January 27, 2020, 04:54:30 pm
I reached the fourth boss with a Watcher cycling deck, but lost due not getting it up to speed quickly enough.

Empty Body, Empty Mind, Evaluate, Fear No Evil, Flurry of Blows, Inner Peace, Study. I had other cards, of course, but these were the core of my strategy.

Once you have a good supply of Insights, these cards should make an indefinite loop for energy, damage, block and card draws. I didn't draw the right cards to get the loop going, so I failed. Did I miss a rare card or maybe a relic to make it actually viable? I had about 25 cards, which might have been too many.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on January 27, 2020, 06:06:25 pm
I'd like to try Unceasing Top and Deva Form (https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/Deva_Form). One is mostly useless because you don't have enough energy to play the infinite cards. One is mostly useless because you don't have enough cards to use the unreasonably-high amount of energy. Together they fight crime.

But I came to post that an upgraded Talk to the Hand is hilarious against the Guardian. You gain 3 shield for attacking, then take 3 damage from the sharp hide. Against the version without sharp hide, you only need 1 block to cover most of the 5x4 damage.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on January 27, 2020, 06:42:05 pm
Deva form could work well wth Conjure Blade, which works great with Talk to the Hand, which gets hard countered by mobs/bosses with artifacts whic...wait a minute... they are already dead.

Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on January 29, 2020, 08:01:06 pm
I just figured out the third character's symbol isn't a bear with a ball in its mouth.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 17, 2020, 10:35:28 am
I've been stuck on ascension 8 with watcher and defect for a while, and have given up advancing them for now. Ascension 10 with ironclad just isn't coming together for me either, but Silent is only sometimes struggling as I just got through ascension 14. It makes sense that the most difficult to unlock characters are more difficult, but the watcher surprised me with how difficult she is.

The silent has snecko skull, so a defense and poison deck is really good when the RNG is nice enough to provide it.


Edit: I just got snecko skull in the second room of ascension 15. Now I just need to survive long enough to start accumulating sources of poison, and thin out non-poison attacks.

I just hit the 3rd boss with riddle with holes (3 damage 5 times), with the envenom power (+1 poison per unblocked hit), and snecko skull. With my strength that's 30 damage plus 10 poison. Not bad for 2 energy.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 22, 2020, 11:45:05 am
I just got to the room where vampires offer to replace all of your strikes with 4 bites (~strikes that also heal you 2 when used) in exchange for some of your max health, and I had 4 strikes left and less than half health, so I agreed.

The next room gave me a striking dummy (all strikes +3 damage).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 22, 2020, 04:37:36 pm
Gotta' love it when the RNG gets cheeky.

On the bright side, though, then you had bites which are probably better than even upgraded strike dummy strikes. Now you can stall your way to a full heal a bunch and be happy :P
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 23, 2020, 09:13:32 am
Gotta' love it when the RNG gets cheeky.

On the bright side, though, then you had bites which are probably better than even upgraded strike dummy strikes. Now you can stall your way to a full heal a bunch and be happy :P

It was 7 damage vs the 8 the unupgraded strikes would do with the strike dummy. So slightly better with the 2 healing, but I didn't have enough health to stall well. I killed one of the slavers on the second round, but drew no defense.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Lapoleon on February 24, 2020, 03:48:44 am
Tried the Daily Challenge yesterday, I thought I'd just play it for a bit to unlock the custom mode (just got the game).

I started out with 50 cards, and not being able to remove any of them at the shop. Every time I got a new card, I received two extra copies as well. My thought was that this was just a recipe for deck pollution/dilution. Then after beating the first few enemies by simply drawing some decent cards I got a card called Mind Blast. I read the description and starting laughing like a madman immediately.
"Innate - Deal damage equal to the cards in your draw pile". This meant that from that point on I started with three cards each dealing about 70 damage. The only downside was that I couldn't play all three due to their energy cost. It didn't matter though, I started adding cards like a madman and was soon dealing 150+ damage per card. This became even more OP when I got a relic which made my first attack each combat happen twice.

I oneshotted every single Elite Enemy and boss. The only combats which lasted more than one turn were those with three enemies. It was just glorious.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 24, 2020, 11:18:20 am
Tried the Daily Challenge yesterday, I thought I'd just play it for a bit to unlock the custom mode (just got the game).

I started out with 50 cards, and not being able to remove any of them at the shop. Every time I got a new card, I received two extra copies as well. My thought was that this was just a recipe for deck pollution/dilution. Then after beating the first few enemies by simply drawing some decent cards I got a card called Mind Blast. I read the description and starting laughing like a madman immediately.
"Innate - Deal damage equal to the cards in your draw pile". This meant that from that point on I started with three cards each dealing about 70 damage. The only downside was that I couldn't play all three due to their energy cost. It didn't matter though, I started adding cards like a madman and was soon dealing 150+ damage per card. This became even more OP when I got a relic which made my first attack each combat happen twice.

I oneshotted every single Elite Enemy and boss. The only combats which lasted more than one turn were those with three enemies. It was just glorious.

Yeah, there are a few cards, and the feather relic that are better with larger decks. Even the terrible-sounding dailies can be fun, but they can also be as tedious as they sound.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 27, 2020, 07:57:32 pm
Played the daily with Silent that could get red cards. After Image + juggernaut. Every card played gives me 1 shield, which does 7 damage. Including free cards like rage (more armor) and adrenaline (more cards and energy to play more cards).
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: CABL on February 28, 2020, 12:36:06 am
Hello there! I also play Slay The Spire, but I do wonder what's a good deck to win as The Watcher. She's the only character with whom I didn't score a single win so far.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on February 28, 2020, 03:20:57 am
I prefer to play with wrath decks. Get some copies of that 0 cost aoe card, some draw and a couple reliable ways to switch between calm/wrath and you are good to go.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 28, 2020, 08:59:33 am
Hello there! I also play Slay The Spire, but I do wonder what's a good deck to win as The Watcher. She's the only character with whom I didn't score a single win so far.

Grab a second source of leaving wrath (You want ~1/7 of your cards to get you out of wrath, because taking 2x damage will kill you. Tranquility being a retain mitigates this somewhat, once.), and some multi-hit or attack all cards. Devotion power with another source or 2 of mantra works well on bosses, I'd recommend the 0-cost blocks that also give mantra. Grab every +str item you can (which may well be zero). I'd also recommend windmill and perseverance, even if you don't get Establishment (cost of retains lowers by 1 each round they're retained).

Don't try to build a deck out of retains, because your deck doesn't get enough turn-over.


I reached the fourth boss with a Watcher cycling deck, but lost due not getting it up to speed quickly enough.

Empty Body, Empty Mind, Evaluate, Fear No Evil, Flurry of Blows, Inner Peace, Study. I had other cards, of course, but these were the core of my strategy.

Once you have a good supply of Insights, these cards should make an indefinite loop for energy, damage, block and card draws. I didn't draw the right cards to get the loop going, so I failed. Did I miss a rare card or maybe a relic to make it actually viable? I had about 25 cards, which might have been too many.

It looks like the loop generates energy from leaving calm? The relic that adds 1 energy every time you leave calm would actually be quite nice in that. The Bag of Preparation also helps set up that first turn.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on February 28, 2020, 09:55:27 am
Hello there! I also play Slay The Spire, but I do wonder what's a good deck to win as The Watcher. She's the only character with whom I didn't score a single win so far.
If you're up for youtube vids, you might check out jorbs. Guy posts ascension 20 runs (most heart kills) more or less daily, and does watcher fairly often. Can see some examples of winning decks, some parts of the thought process/decision making involved in building and using them.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on March 09, 2020, 05:17:25 pm
It feels like there's an easy way to determine if your Silent with the Noxious Fumes power (add 2 poison per round, 3 upgraded) should use your catalyst card now or save it for later. Later means more of an increase, but now means more time with the higher damage.

I'm guessing earlier is usually better, as long as you have several poison, but I'm not sure what the breakpoint is.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Frumple on March 09, 2020, 07:27:54 pm
From what I've picked up, it mostly boils down to how many turns left you think you'll be taking damage?  Or... something like that. Basically run the math and see if you're satisfied with how much longer the whatever is going to stay alive. If yes, catalyze. If no, hold off. That could be early, it could be later for bigger effect, just... depends.

Alternatively get more catalyst. Or more other poison cards. Fumes is pretty good, but one upgraded crippling poison is 2-3 turns of it, basically the same for the base poison card or even more with flask. It's not super sexy with catalyst, more or less. Better for holding a poison count steady while you draw your catalyst(s) than actually pumping the count for the kill.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on March 10, 2020, 09:17:43 am
From what I've picked up, it mostly boils down to how many turns left you think you'll be taking damage?  Or... something like that. Basically run the math and see if you're satisfied with how much longer the whatever is going to stay alive. If yes, catalyze. If no, hold off. That could be early, it could be later for bigger effect, just... depends.

Alternatively get more catalyst. Or more other poison cards. Fumes is pretty good, but one upgraded crippling poison is 2-3 turns of it, basically the same for the base poison card or even more with flask. It's not super sexy with catalyst, more or less. Better for holding a poison count steady while you draw your catalyst(s) than actually pumping the count for the kill.

Oh yeah, I grab about one of each of the poison cards that I find on a given run (usually 3-4), because they each have a different purpose (attack card that poisons, big reusable poison, overpriced poison that also kills off all other enemies, etc.). I just meant that Noxious Fumes changes the math from poison slowly decreasing each turn to poison slowly increasing each turn. That's a minor change, but it's also what the math on catalyst is based on.

A pair of catalysts is pretty nice against the enemies who clear poison partway through the fight like slime, champion, time eater, and the awakened. I care significantly less that they clear the poison when they're almost dead (or I have another catalyst to start in on the awakened a second time), but is otherwise overkill.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: MCreeper on August 18, 2020, 03:54:25 pm
De ascend, thread!
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
God, this was even below Anamnesis.  :o
Since Yohane mod no longer runs out of memory for me, ??? i decided to check it out. Pictures are thoroughly hilarious. And i stumbled on a OP combo on first run.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Well, i guess any character haves an OP combo of three golden cards or something. And can defeat most inappropriate boss with it.  :P
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Inarius on February 08, 2021, 02:40:08 am
I just discovered this game, and i quite enjoyed it.

But I found it quite easy. First ascend at the third game, and >50% WR since.
Is it me or is it easy for everyone ?
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on February 08, 2021, 04:07:53 am
I'd say it's an easy game overall. The mechanics are simple and even in the higher ascencions most difficulty arises from RNG but is ultimately countered by building your deck right.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: AlStar on February 08, 2021, 08:26:34 am
I just discovered this game, and i quite enjoyed it.

But I found it quite easy. First ascend at the third game, and >50% WR since.
Is it me or is it easy for everyone ?
If you know what you're doing, it's not an unfairly difficult game.

The hardest part of the game - getting the keys and defeating the Heart - is an optional challenge: if you've got a deck that can handle it, then you go up against the elite encounter, skip the treasure, and burn a campfire. If not, then you just take a normal win.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Sindain on February 08, 2021, 01:16:50 pm
The ascension mechanic is built specifically to make the game easy to get into. If you're good at deck builders you shouldn't have too much difficulty winning on lower ascensions. The difficulty does ramp up a lot though, and once you're on Asc 20 heart runs the game gets very difficult. Though most people say the current patch is quite a bit easier than it has been in the past.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Aoi on February 08, 2021, 01:46:54 pm
I must be a special kind of bad. I think my best on StS is Ascension 5 (3 with the heart) on a standard game... But I have max or near-max difficulty wins on Endless Voyage, Blood Card, Neoverse, Deck of Ashes, and a few other deck builders. It's mostly just StS (and Monster Train) that breaks me in half.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Iduno on February 08, 2021, 02:23:06 pm
The ascension mechanic is built specifically to make the game easy to get into. If you're good at deck builders you shouldn't have too much difficulty winning on lower ascensions. The difficulty does ramp up a lot though, and once you're on Asc 20 heart runs the game gets very difficult. Though most people say the current patch is quite a bit easier than it has been in the past.

The newest patch made absolutely terrible cards you'd never want to use just regular bad cards you'd never want to use except in edge-case decks. Maybe a quarter of the rewards for fights actually make your character worse, which increases to 3/4 or more depending on how important your build is (higher ascensions are worse). Once you learn how a character runs, the game is fairly easy, as long as the RNG allows you what you need. Knowing more ways to play the character somewhat increases your chances of being able to use what you're allowed to have, but it's still real easy to think you can go with a particular playstyle early on and then never get what you need to make your deck actually work right. Or you correctly guess which items/cards to keep and then die before you start getting the fun stuff later because your deck is unfinished. It's fun and helps get you willing to be more flexible up to a point, then it's just frustrating.

Actually, I'm finding that with more and more games lately.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: MrRoboto75 on February 08, 2021, 05:56:53 pm
I've heard the better spire players largely ignore deck themes/architypes over just grabbing what will help them in tough fights in the near future, mostly so they can punch many elites and take their relics.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Ulfarr on February 08, 2021, 07:37:48 pm
I wouldn’t count myself among the “better” players but I do agree that hunting for a specific  archetype is a bad way to play. You just can’t be sure whether you’ll get the cards that you need. Plus, it’s equally important to not get cards that don’t work well with each other (ie rampage + anger).

A tip (for mental health if you will):

Don’t bother with runs that don’t go smoothly. If you have to hunt down campfires to heal yourself then you aren’t going to win.


Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: Mephansteras on February 08, 2021, 08:08:31 pm
I gave up on ascensions when I realized that I have more fun playing the game without a serious challenge (except for the Heart, which is kinda tough no matter what). Lets me try weird builds and stuff without caring too much if it might ruin the run.
Title: Re: Slay the Spire - Deck-building to Death or Glory
Post by: MrRoboto75 on February 08, 2021, 10:07:09 pm
I gave up on ascensions when I realized that I have more fun playing the game without a serious challenge (except for the Heart, which is kinda tough no matter what). Lets me try weird builds and stuff without caring too much if it might ruin the run.

That's a problem I have with most roguelikes.  I'd probably win more if I bothered to play optimally but I'd rather play quick and sloppy, and see what happens.