Post by: Halfling on June 21, 2013, 09:34:44 am
DF from scratch- literally freezing hell over.
My first version of the Vespulae, intended to be a swarming predator...does not seem to be able to breathe. Or see. Or, for that matter, stand. I suspect I made an error somewhere...nobody ever said Creation would be this...annoying...at God College. But then, they were competent there.
I finally managed to read up on this thread a bit and I must say It's one of the most amusing things I have seen in some time. It's like watching a train wreck, but the train has chicken legs instead of wheels and instead of rolling off a track it's been flung into the sky which has inexplicably become a giant custard pie.
Don't build a lumberyard unless you go into my reactions and make prepare cave lemons not automatic. For some reason it accepts any log. This can cause infinite loops and produces incendiary lemons. So not only dose it cause the lumberyard to be useless it also produces fire.
I didn't find this out till after I uploaded.
DF "from scratch". We start with a vanilla version of DF, delete all raws with their creatures and bodies and templates and materials, and build an entire new player-made universe by hand.
One full of player-made creatures and all-new mechanics, hand-built turn by turn from the body templates and language symbols up to entire new dwarf civilizations and untold realms of possibility. You've imposed your madness on the world in your forts, now make it part of the fabric of reality itself!
A modding (or more like world-building) succession with stories of an emerging reality in between.
Currently at
Github: (brought to you by vyznev)
https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch
Latest raws download: https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-latest.zip
Latest raws/development: https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/master.zip
Installation instructions: https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki
Wiki projects (work in progress - please contribute):
| Wiki | Admins |
| http://dfscratch.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page | Zanzetkuken, Gnorm |
| http://df-from-scratch.wikia.com/wiki/DF_from_Scratch_Wiki | Zanzetkuken |
| http://dffs.wikia.com/wiki/DFFS_Wiki | Gnorm |
Downloads:
Starting point, minimal world: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7776 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7776) | player's guide (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4343668#msg4343668)
+ BFEL's modding turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7797
+ StLeibowitz's modding turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7811 | player's guide (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4384001#msg4384001)
+ laularukyrumo's modding turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7834
+ sackhead's http://www.mediafire.com/?n23ps889fojunx5 | Customized Obsidian graphics http://www.mediafire.com/?wj1f8gk7720z7ya
+ bugfixes for sackhead's turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7881
+ HugoLuman's turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7886 | Description: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4475810#msg4475810 | Obsidian graphics version (by sackhead) http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7888
+ Zanzetkuken's turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7901 | Description http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4501918#msg4501918
+ reemer30's turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7943
+ HugoLuman's bugfix pack for reemer30 + contribs http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7984
+ Putnam's turn http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8009
+ Gnorm's turn http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8109 | Github download (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-09-gnorm.zip)
Current: kopout's turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8158 | Github download (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-10-kopout.zip)
Download last package above to get the newest version of everything, or one of the earlier ones to experience features added by that turn and earlier only.
Turns:
| # | Modder | Player | |
| 0 | Halfling | laularukyrumo | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4349041#msg4349041) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4352501#msg4352501) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4352787#msg4352787) |
| 1 | BFEL | various | |
| 2 | StLeibowitz | A Spoony Bard | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4387520#msg4387520) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4390338#msg4390338) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4393496#msg4393496) |
| 3 | laularukyrumo | StLeibowitz | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4415319#msg4415319) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4415947#msg4415947) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4416657#msg4416657) 4 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4418553#msg4418553) |
| 4 | sackhead | Gnorm | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4444412#msg4444412)2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4446109#msg4446109) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4447615#msg4447615) 4 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4448762#msg4448762) 5 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4450242#msg4450242) 6 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4454942#msg4454942) 7 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4456231#msg4456231) 8 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4457247#msg4457247) 9 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4460187#msg4460187) 10 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4461636#msg4461636) 11 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4462036#msg4462036) 12 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4465336#msg4465336) 13 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4468152#msg4468152) 14 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4470945#msg4470945) 15 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4476394#msg4476394) |
| 5 | HugoLuman | no endorsed report | |
| 6 | Zanzetkuken | ZMC | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4543586#msg4543586) |
| 8 | reemer30 | Xieg | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4587430#msg4587430) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4599973#msg4599973) |
| bugfix | HugoLuman | HugoLuman Xieg Gnorm | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4614898;topicseen#msg4614898) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4615570;topicseen#msg4615570) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4616353#msg4616353) 4 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4616790#msg4616790) 5 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4622104#msg4622104) 6 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4626304#msg4626304) 7 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4627417#msg4627417) 8 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4627853#msg4627853) 9 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4643732#msg4643732) 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4624422#msg4624422) 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4627970#msg4627970) |
| 12 | Putnam | TBA | |
| 14 | TBA | ||
| 15 | TBA | ||
| 15 | Gnorm | vyznev Zanzetkuken Xyon Gnorm | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4733616#msg4733616) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4734905#msg4734905) 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4734190#msg4734190) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4735351#msg4735351) 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4734496#msg4734496) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4738192#msg4738192) 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4736264#msg4736264) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4736441#msg4736441) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4736710#msg4736710) 4 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4737121#msg4737121) |
| 16 | kopout | Gnorm | 1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4782138#msg4782138) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4782267#msg4782267) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4783949#msg4783949) |
| 17 | Xieg | TBA | |
| 18 | vyznev | TBA |
Spoiler: old player pool (click to show/hide)
How to play:
- First of all, feel free to just enjoy the mod without having anything to do with this thread. If you like to contribute:
- You may sign up for a modding turn, share a player story, or just contribute from the sidelines. Modding turns consist of developing the world, adding any creatures, materials, entities and so on that you see fit.
- Modding turns take one week (plus 1 week of bugfixing duty for modding turn). Player stories can be as long or as short as you like.
- Feel free to start a player report anytime after the mod is uploaded, and please give feedback. Your contribution is as important as the modding turns. If it's a detailed report with some play time, I will add it to this first post. If there are several I'll edit the table to contain them all. Reports from older versions are welcome too and may help us improve the new version still.
- Mod turns go in order. First, you have 1 week to make your additions. Then, upload your work. Your bugfixing turn starts immediately. At the same time, the next modder may start adding on his work. Please only sign up for a full modding turn if you are relatively competent at this and can contribute more than just a little content in one week.
Spoiler: Player report guidelines (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Mod turn proceedings (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Post-turn content editing rules (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Contribution advice (click to show/hide)
"Scratch" guides, info and accessories
Compatibility, assuming all goes well: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4343299#msg4343299
Halfling play guide: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4343668#msg4343668
Background creature theme music script: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4379467#msg4379467
Play guide to the formics: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4384001#msg4384001
Lizardfolk play guide: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4541936#msg4541936
Fanart
1 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4405404#msg4405404) 2 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4486271#msg4486271) 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4583124#msg4583124) 4 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4583326#msg4583326) 5 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4583593#msg4583593) 6 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4584023#msg4584023) 7 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4584287#msg4584287)
Aseaheru's Youtube series: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sum1QxzpoX0
Things we found useful/Modding resource collection
Perl scripts for editing DF data files: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4641172#msg4641172
Wiki rip reference of modding tokens: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=6588
Workshop graphics utility: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=2068 (honorable mention for providing source)
Language generator: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7174
To take either kind of turn, just post in this thread. First come, first serve! Have fun!
Post by: Matoro on June 21, 2013, 09:50:06 am
Normally the community just builds insane fortresses and bring the death and madness to everyone visiting their fort. Now the same for the whole world.
In other words, this is awesome.
We will probably get a world with everything exploding into dlood and gore with wagon and giant sponge civs fighting about their ethics in the world gen. And candy man megabeasts killing everything and dwarves eating slade boulders and elves that combust upon contact with wood and so on.... Man this is going to be so goddamn awesome. Especially in the next release, since we can retire the fortresses and history goes on.
I see this totally possible. I think we should start by making the civs and creatures, just by "everyone can post their creatures and entities to this thread" way. Someone glues all those chaotic things into the objects floder and generates a world. Then reactions and other stuff. We could make stories from its legends or adventure mode while the main succession fortress in being played. This is just crazy. It's going to be the most fucked-up universe ever. Even Armok couldn't make weirder.
Post by: zubb2 on June 21, 2013, 10:34:21 am
I have a creature but its not on this computer, so later for that.
This will be very FUN to watch. :)
ITS BEEN A FEW POSTS EDIT: Here is my small contribution, I won't feel bad if nobody uses it.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on June 21, 2013, 10:49:40 am
I was thinking I would first create a very, very simple world which only has one type of rock, one ore, one type of wood, a few plants, one type of intelligent creature (primitive man) and four unintelligent creatures: primitive dog, primitive bird, primitive hamster and tyrannosaurus (first megabeast), but would include all the things DF requires to run and make working creatures, such as a basic language and several minimalist material and body templates. Then, on top of that, everybody could add their stuff, including new templates, new languages, creatures, civilizations etc etc.
But come to think of it, if we want to include everyone, which is a good idea, how would the turns go? I'm drawing kind of a blank here. It would be good if we could have players who don't need to know about modding who could take turns playing this brave new world, and it would also be very good if everyone could just toss homebrewn creatures and items in. But to make this work, there should be some step where raws are read, bugtested, and collected into packs too, by which I mean that they basically work and don't ruin your game instantly such as send a berserk adamantine colossus caravan to your fort the first summer, nor knock each other out and destroy part of the world. But there probably wouldn't be many takers for a bugfixing turn?
That's why I originally suggested that everyone first develops and then plays their own creation on top of previous turns, but if there's a way to make something more interesting work...
Post by: darklord92 on June 21, 2013, 11:52:29 am
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1z74o2uh4xfk2bk/inorganic_stone_crazyworld.zip
Spoiler: contents of zip (click to show/hide)
Post by: Matoro on June 21, 2013, 01:41:41 pm
But come to think of it, if we want to include everyone, which is a good idea, how would the turns go? I'm drawing kind of a blank here. It would be good if we could have players who don't need to know about modding who could take turns playing this brave new world, and it would also be very good if everyone could just toss homebrewn creatures and items in. But to make this work, there should be some step where raws are read, bugtested, and collected into packs too, by which I mean that they basically work and don't ruin your game instantly such as send a berserk adamantine colossus caravan to your fort the first summer, nor knock each other out and destroy part of the world. But there probably wouldn't be many takers for a bugfixing turn?
Since civs cannot be created without creating a new world, I suggest making them (with basic materials etc.) first - everything that needs world regeneration would be made first (well there could be a test worlds) so we would have just one playing world, where we could to start adding things during the game.
I don't really see the public reading of the raws necessary. Everyone who adds something has to test it out by himself in a different save/arena. Minor bugs aren't bad, they are hilarious/weaponizable. It would be a good surprise for the next player to see what creatures and building the former overseer added.
Post by: Krevsin on June 21, 2013, 02:17:40 pm
This is the most epic idea I've heard all week.
I would love to see this, but I could not personally partake in it due to my appaling modding skills (although, If I begin practicing....)
"minimalist" universe which would probably be something like humans mining "rock", forging "metal", waging wars and farmingSounds like Minecraft DF mod to me. :Pcabbageswheat.
Post by: Halfling on June 21, 2013, 02:37:37 pm
snip
Since civs cannot be created without creating a new world, I suggest making them (with basic materials etc.) first - everything that needs world regeneration would be made first (well there could be a test worlds) so we would have just one playing world, where we could to start adding things during the game.
I don't really see the public reading of the raws necessary. Everyone who adds something has to test it out by himself in a different save/arena. Minor bugs aren't bad, they are hilarious/weaponizable. It would be a good surprise for the next player to see what creatures and building the former overseer added.
Can't add in new creatures, reactions or interactions either without regenning, so the "succession" will have to be more like a spiritual succession where previous features are kept and new ones are added.
I got some ideas for how this just might work now. Here's what I'm thinking:
* You may sign up for a "mod" turn or a "play" turn, which run on separate lists and all take one week.
* Mod turns and play turns may occur simultaneously, but every mod turn's result must be followed by a play turn. If there are no players, you must demonstrate your own mod. The minimum playtime is one fort surviving two years.
* The following rules apply during play turn:
Spoiler: player turn rules (click to show/hide)
* The following rules apply during mod turn:
Spoiler: mod turn rules (click to show/hide)
* Everyone watching is invited to share their own contributions (in raw format), but again, to make this work more smoothly they must be accompanied by a screenshot and a short description of the result. Sorry, nasty surprises are only for modders.
* Because we can't have dwarfings, we'll have creaturings (objectings?). Players may request a creaturing and modders may name a creature or a non-layer individual material after a player and one after themselves (Halfling lizard, Halflingite).
One major obstacle here is I'm going to be really busy with studies again momentarily. So I'll be able to maintain the thread and turn list but definitely not bugfix other than my own mod turn.
Tell me what you think.
EDIT: I think there should also be something about preventing "cheating" reactions, but I don't know how exactly to define "cheating". Is magically turning your dwarves into pet dragons cheating or awesome? Maybe there should be something about realism, but on the other hand maybe not so it's not boring.
Post by: Krevsin on June 21, 2013, 03:06:25 pm
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on June 21, 2013, 03:16:10 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 21, 2013, 05:38:30 pm
I VOLUNTEER HARDER THEN ANY MAN, DWARF, ELF, CARP, SPONGE, OR AMPERSAND HAS EVER VOLUNTEERED BEFORE.
THE IDEAS! THE WONDERFUL, HORRIBLE IDEAS ;)
Ok so first off, I will make a Halfling race (based on the creator of this thread) that will be the "main" race, thus very dwarf like.
So quick poll, should they require alcohol or not?
Post by: Halfling on June 21, 2013, 06:33:44 pm
Bodysize: 40000
Not alcohol dependent
Use all plants
Only weapons allowed: wooden club, short bow
No armor except clothes
Can do interaction: throw rock, usage hint:attack, 1x/day
Neither siegers nor ambushers, nor counted among the very wise
Active seasons: spring, summer, autumn
[INSTRUMENT:ITEM_INSTRUMENT_FIDDLE]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_PIPE_SMOKING]
In fact now that it's out there I could make it the first playable race of the "minimal" world if this gets going. Or shall I rather make the uber-vanilla generic humans and give the first "modding" turn to you?
There seems to be a lot of interest, so if everyone is fine with the rules above, then I'll be now taking "modding" and "playing" turn sign-ups. I'll get to work on the minimal world tomorrow, I actually have to figure out exactly what DF minimally needs to work.
Post by: sackhead on June 21, 2013, 06:46:51 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 21, 2013, 09:37:52 pm
Post by: squiddwarf16 on June 22, 2013, 01:35:00 am
Post by: Meph on June 22, 2013, 03:38:16 am
Post by: BFEL on June 22, 2013, 05:14:15 am
This is a nice idea, but most modding changes do require a new world-gen, so the fortresses would be short-lived. Each modding update would require the fortress to be abandoned, and a new, virgin world to be created.
Halfling has addressed this, and we feel that would hardly break the concept.
It won't be a "true" succession game, but it will be awesome spiritual succession.
Post by: Krevsin on June 22, 2013, 06:19:18 am
Like Sparkgear! ish.This is a nice idea, but most modding changes do require a new world-gen, so the fortresses would be short-lived. Each modding update would require the fortress to be abandoned, and a new, virgin world to be created.
Halfling has addressed this, and we feel that would hardly break the concept.
It won't be a "true" succession game, but it will be awesome spiritual succession.
Post by: BFEL on June 22, 2013, 09:43:48 am
that you can find in my signature (hopefully...if it changed correctly....I'll just link the thread after I put this up)
EDIT: ok got the signature to work, just click "The Elf- A Theory"
Post by: Yuli Vlasi on June 22, 2013, 10:27:09 am
Watching.
Post by: Halfling on June 22, 2013, 11:13:06 am
I'm currently still working on basics of the minimal world to get it to gen... they're going to be a little different from vanilla DF. If all goes right, everything including the language symbols will be shiny, new and very basic. The raws folder now contains body templates and plans and the basics of a language and is currently at a whopping 67.3 kB, compared to vanilla's 2.7 MB.
Post by: Krevsin on June 22, 2013, 11:42:31 am
Post by: Halfling on June 22, 2013, 11:43:52 am
i would actually like to play Very Basic DF. Because i like Very Basic things.
How about taking the first "play" turn while BFEL gets to adding stuff? You'll get to play with like five things existing in the world. At least it should run fast.
Post by: Krevsin on June 22, 2013, 11:46:53 am
Post by: Mesa on June 22, 2013, 03:23:51 pm
Count me in!
Post by: sculleywr on June 22, 2013, 03:54:17 pm
Post by: DVNO on June 22, 2013, 07:55:36 pm
Are RAWS based off internet memes accepted? I've made plenty of those. Don't know if you'll accept just plain anything or want to stick to a theme or not.
In fact, I have a poor, poor, abused DF copy somewhere where I mashed together the Rise of the mushroom Kingdom mod, the pokemon mod, The Lolmod, Valdiku's demented my little pony mod, Sergal mod, the final fantasy mod, the Deadspace mod and the Elder Scrolls mod to practice stripping out dupes.
It produces a rainbow colored splotch of internet culture vomit. It's entirely in ASCII, no tile sets, because conflicts.
The error log is clean-ish but warning; the EXE cries openly when you ask it to gen a medium - large world.
Post by: Halfling on June 22, 2013, 11:54:53 pm
The starting point be about done soon, works in fortress mode now. There's now 97.3 kB of raw material. Features the halfling, the hound, the mallard, the bank vole, flax, the pumpkin, the apple tree, the templates used to make those and that's it, all built "from scratch". Also, other than hardcoded ones, eight items are available (cudgel, shortbow, small arrows, small buckler, dress shirt, short pants, fiddle, smoking pipe). I'll probably need to tweak it just a bit to make it more reasonable and break fewer eyes since I originally figured I'd use different tiles for everything. And also make a few more things like interactions for halflings to throw rocks and clean themselves.
Spoiler: random halfling (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: raws sample (click to show/hide)
Post by: sackhead on June 23, 2013, 04:11:58 am
Post by: Mesa on June 23, 2013, 04:29:46 am
Post by: sculleywr on June 23, 2013, 10:18:54 am
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 10:21:36 am
Here's mine: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7776
It currently makes DF cry bitter tears over not being able to generate its precious random creatures at all, and includes vanilla items in raws because the game crashes otherwise for reasons unknown to me, even if nobody uses those items.
EDIT: which is most likely due to them being needed for preferences and unremovable reactions. Derp. To start with a completely blank slate, you must make a new product for every reaction.
Post by: StLeibowitz on June 23, 2013, 01:01:19 pm
There needs to be horrific predators flying around. My modding skills have atrophied from "abysmal" to "nonexistent", but that should only make whatever I produce more fun. How would we submit raws and such? Just post them here for inclusion, or what?
EDIT: having read the thread, it seems that you have some sort of "turn system". If that's how submissions should be made, sign me up for a turn :)
Also, how has DF reacted to you stripping out the candy?
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 01:30:29 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This has really been a superior learning experience. For example, did you know that DF generates a world properly but just plain crashes if you move your cursor over water if there are no things that ocean floors are specified to be made out of? I didn't. There's also so many wonderful things you can easily do and apply to every creature now, like a creature variation:cleans self daily. I thought I could mod, turns out that not really, but doing things without falling back on the standard templates being defined will definitely improve anyone's skills.
How I was planning this would go is - sign up for a modding turn, you get to do whatever you want with the raws for your turn (as long as you preserve previous content and according to the rules, of course). Including implementing community suggestions. I should have a playable version of this ready tonight, the above version was full of omissions of things I just forgot about such as the ability to be a carpenter. I'll also try to make a "shutupDF"-file that makes it stop crying about not being able to make random creatures at worldgen. Then it would be up to the next player to add whatever they like to this very minimal world, including dwarves and terrible beasts.
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 23, 2013, 01:43:29 pm
Also please sign me up for a mod turn and a play turn, cause it doesn't look like we have a lot of people playing.
Post by: sculleywr on June 23, 2013, 01:44:08 pm
What do you mean someone who knows what they are doing? :D
Someone who doesn't cause the world to gen with every embark site having an open clown car. I was just going to run Randcreature on it and see what happens.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 23, 2013, 01:51:31 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 01:52:59 pm
Can you not define zero titans/FBs/night trolls/bogeys/vamps/werewolves/demons in worldgen parameters and just not have DF whining?
No, unfortunately. It will always give you the business about not having the default bodies and templates it's married to. You can't even turn off forgotten beasts without removing caverns. My plan is to give it a bunch of stuff pretending to be that but that is actually empty or nonsensical and well, hope that it doesn't make DF crash if a forgotten beast arrives.
Currently it's actually somehow using hounds and even vermin to fill the void, sending them to wander the caverns, giving them cool names and noting that they were the only ones of their kind, although only a few per world. I wonder what that's about. Regardless, they die of old age too soon to be encountered in fort mode.
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 01:54:02 pm
I want to sign up for a 'mod' turn.
Also please sign me up for a mod turn and a play turn, cause it doesn't look like we have a lot of people playing.
Happy to have you. I'll fill the turns in order and edit the first post once this initial save is working.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 23, 2013, 02:43:06 pm
Happy to have you. I'll fill the turns in order and edit the first post once this initial save is working.
Expect many varieties of dragons to show up in worlds after my turn.
Post by: BFEL on June 23, 2013, 02:59:18 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I love this game :D
Also downloading and starting my additions. (I think I'm supposed to do that now, since you posted a download)
EDIT: WHAT THE MONKEY CRAPPING BALLSACKS IS UP WITH THESE FILES???? I LOOKED AT ONE AND IT WAS ALL HORIZONTAL INSTEAD OF VERTICAL OMG WTF HALFLING?
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 03:22:34 pm
However, as luck would have it, I just managed to fix the most glaring errors and suppress random creature generation error messages so it doesn't generate random creatures but only gives one error message (and not one for every tissue, body part and material it could not place, which was a little annoying).
Uploading momentarily. Finishing touches.
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 03:46:21 pm
Have at it, BFEL! The version I'm happy with is now up at: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7776
So this marks the starting of your modding turn, my bugfixing week if any are noted and a "play" turn with these raws. Any volunteers for doing a minimalistic two years, or shall I?
Updating thread next.
Post by: squiddwarf16 on June 23, 2013, 03:51:19 pm
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on June 23, 2013, 03:53:50 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 03:58:55 pm
Here is a question. Is there a way to use this mod without messing up my normal dwarf fortress? How would I do that?
Well... since I'm going to enforce compatibility with the _XYZ endings, all the creature and item stuff is now and is going to be compatible with, I think, everything. The parts that aren't are parts that replicate, replace and suppress parts of vanilla.
That is: All the other files I made and that are spawned by this succession are, when used together, out of the box compatible with vanilla AND any other mods, and furthermore will always be if the rules are followed. The language files are not. The file item_default is not. The files ending in _shutupdf are not. The descriptor_color_standard file is vanilla and so is interaction_material_emission. The /text files are there so DF will think it has them but don't contain anything and are not compatible.
So to add this to vanilla DF, you need to go to the entity file and change the halfling language to another one, then copy all files except the language files, item_default, _shutupdf, descriptor_color_standard, interaction_material_emission, and the /text folder into your raws. That's actually basically how I kept working on it when it was crashing without error messages at one point. Ignoring the part about languages will make names look weird but otherwise work.
Post by: BFEL on June 23, 2013, 04:24:26 pm
Mostly just a copy of masterworks elves (with the masterwork parts taken out) right now, with some major exceptions.
The biggest one is that elves are no longer a creature, they are now just a caste, with "treelords" i.e. sentient trees as the other parts of the caste.
Only the treelords have [MALE] and [FEMALE] tags, meaning that the elves themselves are both completely androgynous and also sterile.
All elves are made when trees "birth" them.
Also the treelords each only have a [POP_RATIO] of 10, while elves have one of 80.
This means 80% of the "species" will be elves, and we have 10% for each gender of the breeding trees.
This will probably become a problem in worldgen, hoping to even it out by making the treelords fairly tough in comparison to most creatures.
Might also have to find a way to limit military jobs to the elf caste in the entity file.
One other major problem for now- All the body detail plans that the regular elves use are gone. So I'll have to find some way to rewrite the ENTIRE ELVEN BODY STRUCTURE. Dammit Halfling :P you just had to make this difficult :'(
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 04:31:56 pm
Ok, got the real download, and have started the creation of my new and improved elves (no they aren't on fire. Yet. That's the players job :P)
Mostly just a copy of masterworks elves (with the masterwork parts taken out) right now, with some major exceptions.
One other major problem for now- All the body detail plans that the regular elves use are gone. So I'll have to find some way to rewrite the ENTIRE ELVEN BODY STRUCTURE. Dammit Halfling :P you just had to make this difficult :'(
Ha ha, yeah. I did. ;D
Remember, we are making this from scratch. Copying code from other established mods or vanilla is not allowed... reproducing features is fine and unavoidable, but do it by your own hand. And to make it so much more attractive, I naturally had to write new body templates incompatible with everything else.
You can either refer to my templates or write your own to make the elves. The choice is yours. Doing the latter will give you more control.
>EDIT: WHAT THE MONKEY CRAPPING BALLSACKS IS UP WITH THESE FILES? I LOOKED AT ONE AND IT WAS ALL HORIZONTAL INSTEAD OF VERTICAL OMG WTF HALFLING?
Uh, sup. Yeah, they may be in unix line termination format right now. I'll convert them to a Windows/DOS line termination format... or did the problem resolve itself?
Post by: squiddwarf16 on June 23, 2013, 04:35:20 pm
>EDIT: WHAT THE MONKEY CRAPPING BALLSACKS IS UP WITH THESE FILES? I LOOKED AT ONE AND IT WAS ALL HORIZONTAL INSTEAD OF VERTICAL OMG WTF HALFLING?
Uh, sup. Yeah, they may be in unix line termination format right now. I'll convert them to a Windows/DOS line termination format... or did the problem resolve itself?
Yea i noticed that. Couldn't even find the language file you told me to change. Still seems to work without it though... it might just break something that I don't know about...
Post by: sculleywr on June 23, 2013, 04:36:13 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 23, 2013, 04:43:37 pm
Remember, we are making this from scratch. Copying code from other established mods or vanilla is not allowed... reproducing features is fine and unavoidable, but do it by your own hand. And to make it so much more attractive, I naturally had to write new body templates incompatible with everything else.
You can either refer to my templates or write your own to make the elves. The choice is yours. Doing the latter will give you more control.
I know, lol.
And don't worry, I plan to make the elves more then just a copy, that's just how I mod things, I copy a made file to use as "reference" so I don't forget some major detail of the raws, then I edit it piece by piece till its totally unrecognizable and totally new.
Figured I would use the regular elf file as a starting point just for simplicities sake.
Uh, sup. Yeah, they may be in unix line termination format right now. I'll convert them to a Windows/DOS line termination format... or did the problem resolve itself?
Nope its still in crazy horizontal clusterfuck land :P
But don't worry, I'll manage.
P.S. also started a fun little language file, probly not gonna have anything use it right now, its just there for lols right now:
Code: [Select]
language_hungarian
[OBJECT:LANGUAGE]
[TRANSLATION:HILARIOUS]
[T_WORD:CAN:my]
[T_WORD:I:hovercraft]
[T_WORD:PLEASE:is]
[T_WORD:BUY:full]
[T_WORD:SOME:of]
[T_WORD:MATCHES:eels]
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 04:45:49 pm
I tried it, but without any picks, or metals to choose from, the halflings can't do anything :/ No digging, no tree chopping, nothing. They all died. All the precious halflings of Tigershield succumbed to hunger because they had nowhere to butcher the ducks they had.
I'll write a guide to playing the halflings too, just give me a minute. They play VERY differently from vanilla. Just give me a minute. First the unix -> windows conversion. :D
Short:
Halflings don't get ANY metals, anvils or digging equipment at worldgen, nor are there any metals that can be forged by them into anvils in worldgen in the world at this time.
Instead, to dig, you must first make a shovel from a cudgel and a piece of wood at a craftsman's workshop (since DF mechanics don't normally allow wooden digging implements and I wrote a reaction to circumvent that)
To get your first anvil, you must either trade for one (in a future version where there are non-halfling creatures to trade with), or make coal, refine metal, and use the "cast a crude anvil" reaction at a smelter.
Long:
coming soon
Post by: sculleywr on June 23, 2013, 04:57:43 pm
I tried it, but without any picks, or metals to choose from, the halflings can't do anything :/ No digging, no tree chopping, nothing. They all died. All the precious halflings of Tigershield succumbed to hunger because they had nowhere to butcher the ducks they had.
I'll write a guide to playing the halflings too, just give me a minute. They play VERY differently from vanilla. Just give me a minute. First the unix -> windows conversion. :D
Short:
Halflings don't get ANY metals, anvils or digging equipment at worldgen, nor are there any metals that can be forged by them into anvils in worldgen in the world at this time.
Instead, to dig, you must first make a shovel from a cudgel and a piece of wood at a craftsman's workshop (since DF mechanics don't normally allow wooden digging implements and I wrote a reaction to circumvent that)
To get your first anvil, you must either trade for one (in a future version where there are non-halfling creatures to trade with), or make coal, refine metal, and use the "cast a crude anvil" reaction at a smelter.
Long:
coming soon
So, now how do we get wood?
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 05:08:46 pm
So, now how do we get wood?
0. Download my newest bugfixed version (I suddenly realized uploaded version did not allow Halflings to make axes. Yeah, I know. It would be funny if you weren't trying to play it. This is exactly why we need the playing and bugfixing turns.)
0.5. Optionally tell me if it's still in unix format, it shouldn't be
1. Make a small hatchet at either a carpenter's or a forge
Post by: sculleywr on June 23, 2013, 05:16:30 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 05:22:18 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 06:13:00 pm
Tell me if it's good or bad and I'll fix it. I hope it gets the idea across.
DarkDXZ, Leibowitz - I wasn't sure exactly what you wanted. But tell me which kind of participation you would like and I'll add you according to when you first posted. Hence the question marks.
Krevsin, laula - my world is extremely limited so I feel I should ask. Want to play it now or shall I demonstrate it and you play something else later?
Post by: BFEL on June 23, 2013, 06:27:26 pm
Code: [Select]
creature_treelords
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CASTE:TREELORDMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][MALE]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE:TREELORDFEMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][FEMALE]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE:ELF]
[POP_RATIO:80]
[DESCRIPTION:A medium-sized creature claiming to be a ruthless protector of nature. In truth it is a mere pawn of the forests and has no will of its own.]
[NAME:elf:elves:elven]
[CASTE_NAME:elf:elves:elven]
[CREATURE_TILE:140][COLOR:7:0:0]
[CREATURE_SOLDIER_TILE:140]
[CAN_SPEAK][SLOW_LEARNER][VERMIN_HATEABLE]
[CANOPENDOORS][NOTHOUGHT][WAGON_PULLER]
[BENIGN][NO_SLEEP]
[MAXAGE:1000:2000]
[PREFSTRING:dying screams]
[BODY:HUMANOID:2EYES:2EARS:NOSE:2LUNGS:HEART:GUTS:ORGANS:HUMANOID_JOINTS:THROAT:NECK:BRAIN:SKULL:5FINGERS:5TOES:MOUTH:TONGUE:FACIAL_FEATURES:TEETH:RIBCAGE]
[USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:EYEBROW:EYEBROW_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW:ABOVE:BY_CATEGORY:EYE]
[USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:EYELASH:EYELASH_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:EYELID:EYELASH:FRONT]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:NAIL:NAIL_TEMPLATE]
[USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:NAIL:NAIL_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:FINGER:NAIL:FRONT]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:TOE:NAIL:FRONT]
[SELECT_TISSUE_LAYER:HEART:BY_CATEGORY:HEART]
[PLUS_TISSUE_LAYER:SKIN:BY_CATEGORY:THROAT]
[TL_MAJOR_ARTERIES]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SINEW:SINEW_TEMPLATE]
[TENDONS:CREATURE_MAT:ANIMAL:SINEW:200]
[LIGAMENTS:CREATURE_MAT:ANIMAL:SINEW:200]
[HAS_NERVES]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:BLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE]
[BLOOD:CREATURE_MAT:ELF:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:PUS:PUS_TEMPLATE]
[PUS:CREATURE_MAT:ANIMAL:PUS:LIQUID]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:INTUITION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:150:600:800:900:1000:1100:1500] -
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000] max
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MUSICALITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:15000]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:60000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CLOSE_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:DEEP_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:ROUND_VS_NARROW:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LARGE_IRIS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:LIP]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:THICKNESS:50:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:lips:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:UPTURNED:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CONVEX:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:nose bridge:SINGULAR]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EAR]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SPLAYED_OUT:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HANGING_LOBES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:GAPS:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:100:100:100:100:100:100:100] for vampires
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:1000]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HIGH_CHEEKBONES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROAD_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:JUTTING_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SQUARE_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[ATTACK:PUNCH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:punch:punches]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK:KICK:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:kick:kicks]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:SCRATCH:CHILD_TISSUE_LAYER_GROUP:BY_TYPE:GRASP:BY_CATEGORY:FINGER:NAIL]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:scratch:scratches]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:BITE:CHILD_BODYPART_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[BABY:1]
[CHILD:12]
[EQUIPS]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[MANNERISM_FINGERS:finger:fingers]
[MANNERISM_NOSE:nose]
[MANNERISM_EAR:ear]
[MANNERISM_HEAD:head]
[MANNERISM_EYES:eyes]
[MANNERISM_MOUTH:mouth]
[MANNERISM_HAIR:hair]
[MANNERISM_KNUCKLES:knuckles]
[MANNERISM_LIPS:lips]
[MANNERISM_CHEEK:cheek]
[MANNERISM_NAILS:nails]
[MANNERISM_FEET:feet]
[MANNERISM_ARMS:arms]
[MANNERISM_HANDS:hands]
[MANNERISM_TONGUE:tongue]
[MANNERISM_LEG:leg]
[MANNERISM_LAUGH]
[MANNERISM_SMILE]
[MANNERISM_WALK]
[MANNERISM_SIT]
[MANNERISM_BREATH]
[MANNERISM_POSTURE]
[MANNERISM_STRETCH]
[MANNERISM_EYELIDS]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:GOLDENROD:1:MOSS_GREEN:1:ORANGE:1:PUMPKIN:1:RED:1:SAFFRON:1:SCARLET:1:SILVER:1:WHITE:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyebrows:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyelashes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:1000:0:0:NO_END]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:10:25:75:125:200:300]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:SKIN]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BROWN:1:BURNT_UMBER:1:CINNAMON:1:COPPER:1:DARK_BROWN:1:DARK_PEACH:1:DARK_TAN:1:ECRU:1:PALE_BROWN:1:PALE_CHESTNUT:1:PALE_PINK:1:PEACH:1:PINK:1:RAW_UMBER:1:SEPIA:1:TAN:1:TAUPE_PALE:1:TAUPE_SANDY:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:skin:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:IRIS_EYE_AQUA:1:IRIS_EYE_AQUAMARINE:1:IRIS_EYE_AZURE:1:IRIS_EYE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_CERULEAN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_EMERALD:1:IRIS_EYE_FERN_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_JADE:1:IRIS_EYE_LIGHT_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_MINT_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_MOSS_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_PALE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_PINE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SEA_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SKY_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_SPRING_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_TEAL:1:IRIS_EYE_TURQUOISE:1:IRIS_EYE_AMBER:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLD:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:IRIS_EYE_YELLOW:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]Many, MANY changes will need to be made soon. (pretty much everything after the Prefstring is gonna have to go)
Gonna work on some body detail plans now.
BTW, is this "keeping everyone informed of everything I'm doing/modding step by step" thing cool, or is it just annoying?
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 06:46:04 pm
BTW, is this "keeping everyone informed of everything I'm doing/modding step by step" thing cool, or is it just annoying?
Well, why wouldn't you? But remember to go by the rules, this is extremely important or the world will get cluttered with clashing and crashing mods. If you're going to define a body like "humanoid", you must name it eg. HUMANOID_BFE after yourself so that if someone else also makes a (different) body named humanoid, it doesn't cause problems. You probably get it already, just saying.
Also, are my files still looking crazy?
Quick and (very) dirty guide to playing the halflings in the first and minimal world, compared to vanilla dwarves:
Basics:
- Do not use "just play". That's a terrible idea. It's designed for dwarves. Design your embark carefully. Don't take booze. What you need is LOTS of seeds, wood, and hatchets if you're lazy. Having a herbalist and a grower is good for your survival.
- You do not need alcohol, nor can you make it in the minimal world. You must have fresh water to drink at all times. Settling next to a river is the smart thing to do. In newer additions to DF from scratch you can brew alcohol and use it as a source of drink, but beware - it can give halflings hangovers leading to nausea.
- To dig, you must first make a shovel. This takes a special reaction called "make wooden shovel" and consumes 1 wood. It is available at the craftsman's workshop. The relevant skill is wood crafting. It is used similarly to a metal pick. It's not available at embark due to DF's restrictions about items.
- You can make your default equipment at the carpenter's from wood similarly to how dwarves make training equipment, except bows are made at a bowyer's shop and arrows at a craftsman's. You can also make all equipment out of metal, and bows and arrows from bone. If any of these reactions are not visible, re-download - they were accidentally unavailable for a while.
- In the minimal world, you have only above ground crops. You have two options: pumpkins and flax. Flax can be made into (pricey) flax cloth and the seeds can be eaten when cooked. Pumpkins produce a lot of food and nothing else, except seeds after being eaten. Flax can be grown in spring and summer. Pumpkin grows in spring, summer, autumn. NOTHING grows in winter, beware. -- If you are playing with later additions to the mod, you will have other plants to farm. Hobbits can grow things underground as well.
- Plants now take a realistic time to grow. You must plant crops at the start of a season to harvest them at its end. Plant yields are more abundant to compensate.
- Halflings and their pets clean themselves of contaminants automatically once per day to preserve frame rate. This does not need water, nor does it take a job.
- Halflings can and will throw hard rocks at anything they consider threatening. No item is needed, but the halfling must have at least one hand.. The range is 20 squares. These can do some damage. They also have a creature variation that allows them to occasionally do higher-damage roundhouse kicks when fighting with fists, but are still generally squishy in melee.
- Halflings DO need to wear shoes. This is a problem because they couldn't make shoes until bugfix 2. As above, re-download mod to get newest version if issue
Digging and working metal:
- Halflings do not get any metal items during worldgen, but can still work metal in theory. This is very significant because DF requires items that are used for digging to be made out of metal, as well as anvils.
- You can therefore
- As halfling, you can never embark with an anvil in the minimal world. You can trade for one later after there is someone else to trade with, but you can also make one yourself. Halflings, shockingly, have figured out something dwarves never could: metal items can be made by non-forging methods without anvils. Currently you can only make anvils by this method. You must first process metal into bars at a smelter, and you must have fuel (halflings can never use magma). Then you can use the "cast crude anvil" to melt those metal bars into anvil shape. After you have an anvil, you can work metals normally and make your normal equipment out of metal.
- If playing a later version, since laularukymo's turn, you are able to embark with an expensive iridium anvil if you want to. There's no benefit to this over a cast crude anvil.
- You have five items of equipment in the minimal world (labeled as "small"): cudgels, hatchets, shovels, bucklers and short bows. These are worse than human-sized equipment, but you'll have to make do. There are only two items of clothing in the minimal world: dress shirts and short pants. This is bad, considering there are beasts in this world. UPDATE: as of Putnam's turn, you now can make leather armor. The pieces are: one of two types of hats, one of two types of coat, gloves, and if you're lucky (it's uncommon but possible halflings can make them) leather boots. These are superior to vanilla leather armor.
Government:
- Halflings start with a mayor. This is a settlement, not an expedition. Mayor demands are lower than for dwarves, in particular halflings never want armor stands or weapon racks. There is no other form of government - you will never see a baron or a monarch.
- You may appoint doctors, record keepers, managers, military commanders and traders at the nobles screen. You may appoint and later remove as many of each as you need. They all need an office once appointed.
- To use military, military commanders must be appointed first as nobles, then squads can be assigned in the military screen. The mayor can lead one squad himself.
- Halflings have some natural skill in sneaking and growing, and learn these skills faster than vanilla dwarves. Depending on your preferences, this may mean they come with the hunting and growing labors enabled by default and those may be disabled as needed.
Survival:
- You are small. Very small, and this affects a lot of things. The way size works in DF, a mallard can occasionally kill a halfling - and your hounds are larger than you are.
- To make matters worse, halflings have a "realistic" body plan with connecting ankles, knees, wrists, bony spine, and major arteries in the throat and organs.
- You have bad equipment and your unique smoking pipes don't (yet?) help you survive. Avoid melee if possible. Use your bows and use your hounds.
- Prepare in advance. You can't grow crops fast to compensate for bad planning. Herbalism helps a lot, because unless other plants are added to the world, wild flax and pumpkin are ridiculously common.
- This is meant to be a challenging (but still usable) race, more faithful to an idea than easy to play. More user-friendly races like dwarves will come later. On the other hand, the unique abilities and more effective government do have their advantages. One major downside to the current world is that without a hostile civilization, all your 'fun" is going to come in one big package very late game, and 'til then it's just farming pumpkins.
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 06:53:01 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on June 23, 2013, 07:38:06 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 23, 2013, 07:38:52 pm
Also I MIGHT be able to use these body plans on the elves (definitely not the treelords though, gonna make them from scratch)
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 07:52:42 pm
Ok, after looking through the new raws, yes you fixed the issue.
Also I MIGHT be able to use these body plans on the elves (definitely not the treelords though, gonna make them from scratch)
Great about the raws. I always forget windows uses a different line format.
Not to blow my own horn but I think at least [APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG] is pretty reusable for any playable civilization and pet creature, so everything doesn't get coated in ten kinds of grime. Unless you like that for some reason. Currently works on every creature regardless of body and magically removes some dirt 1x/day.
I wanted to do some modding, and then maybe a succession turn much later after some madness has had time to really express itself.
Sweet. Since you asked for it before laularykumo, I'll put you at 3rd turn.
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 08:41:42 pm
Really, really should playtest this stuff longer and not just be like okay, the mechanics work, the world gens and embarking works, this'll be fine. :D But in a week it'll be perfect.
Post by: BFEL on June 23, 2013, 10:03:03 pm
Minor update... I was wondering what made halflings unhappy, and it turns out it's pretty embarrassing to not have shoes even if you don't even know what they are. Completely forgot. So I went ahead and defined sandals now, it's in the newest version (re-download from same DFFD page if that's bothering you).
Really, really should playtest this stuff longer and not just be like okay, the mechanics work, the world gens and embarking works, this'll be fine. :D But in a week it'll be perfect.
O.o
IN A WEEK I'LL HAVE REDONE EVERYTHING 47 TIMES
Post by: Halfling on June 23, 2013, 10:07:12 pm
You can wait until the end of the week and only get my newest version to go with your raws then, since it doesn't really matter other than that the "whole package" has the fixes, but I figured I should update that fast since it might annoy people who are playing.
Post by: Poldon on June 23, 2013, 10:26:09 pm
Post by: sculleywr on June 24, 2013, 12:12:09 am
edit: I will note that I started out with meteoric items after a 250 year embark
Edit 2: I finally got a record keeper and a broker with appraisal skills assigned. Current fortress wealth after 1 year, 221500000 * :o
Is that weird?
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 04:04:11 am
I decided to appoint a broker too, probably should have earlier. Turns out mallard meat is worth so much negative money that it causes the universe to twist and wrap around itself and makes you incredibly rich.
Turns out that's because my material templates didn't include default material values. Wiki said it defaults to 1 so never having built a whole universe and its materials' materials, I was like "well okay, why am I defining this for everything if it's going to assume anyway".
Fixed in the newest update (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7776), for all materials defined by me or my templates. This patch you can apply to your save too, by overwriting its raws. Takes effect immediately.
Post by: sculleywr on June 24, 2013, 04:56:35 am
Yeah, uh, I did make organics more valuable, but still, that shouldn't be :D
I decided to appoint a broker too, probably should have earlier. Turns out mallard meat is worth so much negative money that it causes the universe to twist and wrap around itself and makes you incredibly rich.
Turns out that's because my material templates didn't include default material values. Wiki said it defaults to 1 so never having built a whole universe and its materials' materials, I was like "well okay, why am I defining this for everything if it's going to assume anyway".
Fixed in the newest update (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7776), for all materials defined by me or my templates. This patch you can apply to your save too, by overwriting its raws. Takes effect immediately.
I actually was very scared what would happen should some dangerous civs be added. I mean, imagine what it would be like. Yeah, migration waves get bigger with wealth, but so do invasions. Imagine what 90 angry orcs could do to our halflings!
On a tangent, though, is it possible to have a multi-racial fort, like dwarves, halflings, and other creatures we create all working side by side?
Post by: BFEL on June 24, 2013, 12:59:20 pm
I actually was very scared what would happen should some dangerous civs be added. I mean, imagine what it would be like. Yeah, migration waves get bigger with wealth, but so do invasions. Imagine what 90 angry orcs could do to our halflings!
On a tangent, though, is it possible to have a multi-racial fort, like dwarves, halflings, and other creatures we create all working side by side?
The orcs would have a nice cup of tea with our upscale halflings, while discussing the best positioning for a monocle.
And as for the multi-racial thing, [CASTE]s man, [CASTE]s.
That's kinda what I'm doing with the elves, instead of being a race of whiny hippies its a race of sentient trees creating thousands of whiny hippy zombies from the remains of creatures that decomposed in the forests, and controlling this army with a parasite that replaces the natural position of the heart. So yeah.
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 01:41:46 pm
Maybe we'll have a world of insane necro-elves, dwarves that add random steam-powered cybernetic body parts to themselves including prehensile mechanical beards, orcs programmed to talk like pirates and collect and wear hats by the dozens, and that's the vanilla races... or who even knows where this'll go.
You can sure create an "alliance" race just copying creatures into its castes, but they'll interbreed which might bother you or be just as planned.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 01:48:26 pm
You can sure create an "alliance" race just copying creatures into its castes, but they'll interbreed which might bother you or be just as planned.
Of course, castes don't pay attention to genetics, so you can wind up having a human and an elf marrying, and have a kobold child.
Oh, I'm going to start work on my additions now, and splice them in when my turn arrives. I mean, why wait if we are each (apparently) going to code everything new for our additions?
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 24, 2013, 01:53:27 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 02:10:26 pm
Oh, I'm going to start work on my additions now, and splice them in when my turn arrives. I mean, why wait if we are each (apparently) going to code everything new for our additions?
Well, the main reason to wait is that you can use the previous players' materials, interactions, items and templates, so it gets easier and easier to add stuff (it's supposed to be a collaborative effort to build stuff from scratch, technically, not that every player does it all over every time). This is a little useful because it's surprisingly painful to make EVERYTHING even for a few races, as I've learned.
However, if you are going to want to control everything and build it all from scratch, say make your own dragon bodies, layers, equipment, attacks, materials, and metals, then there's no reason to wait at all. When the turn comes you'll probably want/need to fine-tune it to work and be sort of balanced with other races existing at the time, and maybe use their items too. The race balance is likely going to be sort of different from norm, for example my races have thicker tissues... at least had at some point... but also several hundred times higher velocity modifiers on their attacks so their internal balance is supposed to be similar, but I don't know how they work vs. vanilla. Likewise entities will have different ethics you need to relate or not relate to. If you have environment_spec minerals you may want to make them more widespread by adding them to existing stones. And so on.
Or you could start preparing stuff like interactions and bodies now, and simply migrate them to already defined materials when the time comes... something in between.
Damn that idea of mechanical dwarves had me excited by the way. You could have different castes with different augments. They could have actual axe blades hidden in their/instead of beards. They could release steam in combat. But you guys are more imaginative than me so it'll probably eventually be even better.
Post by: Poldon on June 24, 2013, 02:18:07 pm
For some reason "Meteoric Iron! Praise the miners!" really cracked me up.
I probably will have fun just playing each iteration as it comes up on the side, since I don't have much confidence in my ability to either play in a timely fashion or to actually make a decent write-up.
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 02:25:24 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 03:02:43 pm
-snip-
Current Progress and Plans
I've already ripped out the body parts from vanilla's body_default, and my mod's body_dragonic_civilization, and cobbled the parts together in the file so that if anyone wants to define their own creatures using the dragon template, all they need to do is use [Body:Dragon_Ztg] since I put everything into that.
I've also defined one creature from a rip of the dragons from vanilla, and have modified it into a [pet] creature that may be worse than cats, because of its [Mischievous], [Curiousbeast_item], [Curiousbeast_Eater], and [Adopts_Owner] tags.
I've got some more creature additions planned, but I am keeping those under wraps to be discovered.
I'm probably going to make my civilization additions will be various forms of dragon humanoids (nonplayable), and those whom are against them and kidnap various civilized creatures to help in the fight (playable).
The second civilization will have access to an interaction that modifies the meteoric iron into a metal that is stronger against the dragon humanoids and dragons I am adding, when another metal I will add is forged with it.
-more will be added as I come up with it-
Edit: Why is there a question mark next to my name on the turn list? ???
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 03:14:55 pm
-snip-
Current Progress and Plans
I've already ripped out the body parts from vanilla's body_default, and my mod's body_dragonic_civilization, and cobbled the parts together in the file so that if anyone wants to define their own creatures using the dragon template, all they need to do is use [Body:Dragon_Ztg] since I put everything into that.
I've also defined one creature from a rip of the dragons from vanilla, and have modified it into a [pet] creature that may be worse than cats, because of its [Mischievous], [Curiousbeast_item], [Curiousbeast_Eater], and [Adopts_Owner] tags.
I've got some more creature additions planned, but I am keeping those under wraps to be discovered.
I'm probably going to make my civilization additions will be various forms of dragon humanoids (nonplayable), and those whom are against them and kidnap various civilized creatures to help in the fight (playable).
The second civilization will have access to an interaction that modifies the meteoric iron into a metal that is stronger against the dragon humanoids and dragons I am adding, when another metal I will add is forged with it.
-more will be added as I come up with it-
Cool additions but ripping bodies and creatures from vanilla, or a mod that's already out, kind of breaks the "from scratch" thing that's supposed to be going on and breaks the rules. Sorry to rain on your parade. The goal ITT is to make something new entirely.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 03:26:29 pm
Cool additions but ripping bodies and creatures from vanilla, or a mod that's already out, kind of breaks the "from scratch" thing that's supposed to be going on and breaks the rules. Sorry to rain on your parade. The goal ITT is to make something new entirely.
I'm only doing that to save time, because I am working at my neighbors house a few hours out of the day, learning java, and having to read a book over the summer for a class at my school. I could type up everything, but it would wind up exactly the same. If you still want me to type it in manually, then I will, but I would rather perform a rip and modify to save time.
Post by: BFEL on June 24, 2013, 03:37:03 pm
Cool additions but ripping bodies and creatures from vanilla, or a mod that's already out, kind of breaks the "from scratch" thing that's supposed to be going on and breaks the rules. Sorry to rain on your parade. The goal ITT is to make something new entirely.
I'm only doing that to save time, because I am working at my neighbors house a few hours out of the day, learning java, and having to read a book over the summer for a class at my school. I could type up everything, but it would wind up exactly the same. If you still want me to type it in manually, then I will, but I would rather perform a rip and modify to save time.
I think Halfling is just concerned because you made it sound like you were outright copying things, which you seem to be doing what I do, which is to use the ripped raws as a baseline with which to edit into unrecognizability.
In modding news, I have made my first stone, it should cause the suicide rate in OCD people to increase dramatically:
Code: [Select]
inorganic_stone_bfel
[OBJECT:INORGANIC]
[INORGANIC:JADED_SLADE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:jaded slade][DISPLAY_COLOR:2:0:1][TILE:176]
[ITEM_SYMBOL:'*']
[DISPLAY_COLOR:2:0:1]
[AQUIFER]
[ALL_STONE]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:24]
[SPEC_HEAT:500]
[MELTING_POINT:12718]
[BOILING_POINT:14968]
[ITEMS_WEAPON][ITEMS_DIGGER][ITEMS_ARMOR]
[SOLID_DENSITY:7850]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:6980]
[MOLAR_MASS:55845]
[IMPACT_YIELD:1505000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:2520000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:940]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:1505000]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:2520000]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:940] 160
[TENSILE_YIELD:430000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:720000]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:225] 200
[TORSION_YIELD:430000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:720000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:215]
[SHEAR_YIELD:430000]
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:720000]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:215] no data, used 200
[BENDING_YIELD:430000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:720000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:215]
[MAX_EDGE:10000]
[ITEMS_HARD]
[IS_STONE]
[VEIN]
[UNDIGGABLE]
[DO_NOT_CLEAN_GLOB]
The name is a work in progress....also hoping that color is as green as I think it is.
But yeah, its [UNDIGGABLE] and occurs in veins in every stone/biome type.....HAVE !FUN!
secret: there are reports of people being able to mine undiggable stone through complex usage of ramps and such, so don't despair TOO much, you might even be well rewarded for your efforts :)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 03:43:38 pm
I think Halfling is just concerned because you made it sound like you were outright copying things, which you seem to be doing what I do, which is to use the ripped raws as a baseline with which to edit into unrecognizability.
That is what I was trying to say. I'm just not good with trying to describe my thoughts.
Post by: Poldon on June 24, 2013, 03:51:24 pm
Glad you're enjoying it. You should dig that meteoric iron and see what happens. I actually didn't try that yet. There are currently no clowns in the world even if you enabled them in worldgen, so who knows?
I just tried, I get the discovery message but not the invasion one, and nothing spawns either immediately or later, it seems.
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 03:59:46 pm
Cool additions but ripping bodies and creatures from vanilla, or a mod that's already out, kind of breaks the "from scratch" thing that's supposed to be going on and breaks the rules. Sorry to rain on your parade. The goal ITT is to make something new entirely.
I'm only doing that to save time, because I am working at my neighbors house a few hours out of the day, learning java, and having to read a book over the summer for a class at my school. I could type up everything, but it would wind up exactly the same. If you still want me to type it in manually, then I will, but I would rather perform a rip and modify to save time.
I understand how that is and what you're saying. Prepare for a rant.
I'm feeling two ways about this issue. Here's the thing: if we allow ripping vanilla stuff, we could just as well do a succession game where we trash vanilla creatures only. Keep the vanilla body templates and keep the vanilla materials, their templates and vanilla tissue templates, and use those to define all-new creatures that fill the empty world. Could let people import anything they've modded themselves. And that's not a bad idea. It would go faster and it would result in more content since it requires less skill and time. It might be more balanced. It could make a very good modding succession game and I would not be offended if someone does that and it wins over and kills this one, I would possibly contribute.
However, there is something to be said about doing it the hard way and working without Toady's pre-defined, already working stuff, and here it is. I personally originally figured my halflings would be just smaller vanilla humans with different equipment, and I could have just copied their raws, maybe adjusting the names and obfuscating it a little. But I didn't, and once I got to working with the materials and body plans, I realized I could make them do whatever I want. I started making differently behaving bones, gave creatures knees and wrists that can be severed and their cartilage destroyed, faces, necks that contain major arteries, bony spines concealing nervous tissue. And it only got better when it came time to make a working creature. They caught on fire a lot, didn't work a lot, but I ended up creating a whole different creature organization with reusable appearance varying, attack and interaction modules that takes half the space on paper, and it was so worth it. I've learned so much more about how the game works than I ever did working with established conventions, and even done a little "science" by accident.
It's really not a competitive advantage, I think. The first mentioned type of thread would be the more popular one. However, I am 100% sure that the creative rush that you get from doing things without convention - and I only had two days to get this started and did very little - will lead to much more unique results over time, all new creatures and mechanics and worlds. It's so much more interesting to know and build rather than copy and adjust that I'm actually not interested in the latter here.
So that said, for this thread, I'm going to stick to the no copying from vanilla or established mods rule, and sorry. Copypasting or rewriting by hand is irrelevant. If they're the exact same raws as vanilla for either the body or creature, they're going to be denied. They must be new.
Anyone get what I'm saying here?
Just read the new posts. I guess I was mistaken so as to your intent. If what you're going to do is start by copypasting the vanilla/mod raws and then edit and mutilate them until they're nothing like the vanilla, that is fine. The result counts, not the method. If you create something unique, it's welcome, and if not, then not.
Post by: BFEL on June 24, 2013, 04:06:10 pm
And now I'm going to start up a fun new race that should be the first cavern entity of the mod ;D
Relegating "make custom body plans for treelords" to "whenever I stop being lazy and get around to figuring that crap out"
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 04:10:46 pm
I just tried, I get the discovery message but not the invasion one, and nothing spawns either immediately or later, it seems.
Yep, tried it myself too. Too bad. The game now occasionally sends hounds etc. underground to fill the void of underground beasts, so I was kind of hoping for an explosion of hounds, mallards and beasts.
We will need to find a way to make demons at some point, probably by exploiting the RCPs somehow... or who knows. As it is you could try to
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: BFEL on June 24, 2013, 04:20:12 pm
Wonder if we can assign creatures to the hell layer?
Actually I think Masterwork did that with the adamantine beetle.....
Hmmm.....anyone want !ICE!hell to be inhabited by fifty foot evil snowmen?
"They conquered the demons in ancient times....now you have disturbed their eternal slumber, and you shall spend eternity at [HOMEOTHERM:0]"
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 04:26:28 pm
So when someone makes a really cool and dangerous one, we can use that. Or could make hand-made random creature generation raws instead.
Well, actually I did just read how Meph made that. Add:
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_CHASM]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:5:5]
to any creature you want to inhabit hell, apparently. Make some snowmen if you please!
For demons that rush your fort and user-made forgotten beasts, I think the first idea is what needs to be done. Furthermore, come to think of it some more (I really should think more before posting)...
There are likely some random creature parts that should only be added once and seem exclusive. They don't have multiple upper bodies, right? We could probably make each of these add an entire player-made creature, and make the rest empty. Then, edit the df executable so the descriptors for those add the creature description. If it works and doesn't make the universe vomit on itself, so could have many player-made nonrandom creatures as FBs and demons?
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 05:32:48 pm
Using a stream editor, you can to a limited extent manually point the DF random creature generation parts at user defined raws, at least for bodies.
experiment:
Starting errorlog:
Cannot generate random creatures -- missing body gloss RCP_GLOSS_PAW
Add to raws custom BODYGLOSS:RCP_GLOSS_WAP
sed -i 's/RCP_GLOSS_PAW/RCP_GLOSS_WAP/g' Dwarf_Fortress
random creature generation is now enabled (bodygloss WAP was used instead of PAW). Furthermore a string dump of DF contains what is apparently a list of randomly generated creature abilities and I'm assuming this can be modified similarly.
So I'm thinking user made random creatures with user made bodies and abilities at least are definitely on the table if it ever gets to that point. This'll wreck any compatibility and require using a modded .exe however.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 05:54:04 pm
-snip-
*jaw slowly drops*
I thought this was impossible! Who knows what could result from this if the modding community was made aware of this...
As for breaking compatibility, I say we go for it. We'll delve into areas that haven't been tried before, and Science on this must be done.
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 06:16:54 pm
Here's (most of?) what you can modify for forgotten beasts, I think. Actually no, there's way more than I have here especially descriptions, but this is something. I'm not sure which RCPs are used to make f. beasts:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
There's more you could do by using other things, but there's such a thing as going too far.
Anyway, I think we should delve into this when the world is at that point if it ever gets there. No point altering forgotten beast raws when there aren't even enemy civs or fish in the sea. It's not very useful for the average mod.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 06:32:21 pm
That is true that we should wait, but we now know it can be done.
Post by: BFEL on June 24, 2013, 06:33:26 pm
Also, think you could have someone start a player turn up right now with just your stuff Halfling?
I just got an image of UristMcHalfling going "don't worry kid, theres plenty more fish in the sea!" "the fuck are you talking about Urist? Everyone knows nothing exists in the sea."
Yeah its retarded but it made me chuckle a bit :P
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 06:59:02 pm
Speaking of fish in the sea you just reminded me of something I need to do....
Also, think you could have someone start a player turn up right now with just your stuff Halfling?
I just got an image of UristMcHalfling going "don't worry kid, theres plenty more fish in the sea!" "the fuck are you talking about Urist? Everyone knows nothing exists in the sea."
Yeah its retarded but it made me chuckle a bit :P
Yeah... I asked earlier if laula or Krevsin want to play, didn't get reply yet.
My universe is so minimal I don't feel like drafting anyone tbh, since all you can do is mine rock and grow pumpkins and wait to get slaughtered by a beast. If nobody wants to show off their halfling storytelling, then I'll tell you a story in a couple of days.
The seas are barren... actually this world is a horrible place now unless you like pumpkin and dogs and literally only pumpkin and dogs, as there's barely anything else.
Even the creation myth reads like a horror story. Unlike in some myths, here God was definitely not a natural craftsman. After creating the stars and the earth, god brought forth the first of all creatures on a plain of rock, in a temple where magma and water meet. The first of the firstborn, the halflings Adam and Eve, instantly conflagrated and burned with inner heat while trying to kill each other out of mercy. So god declared living creatures should not have a higher inner temperature than it takes to melt their flesh. Next verse, god decides the spine and the skull are to be inside a halfling's body and not on the surface, and that clothing is to be worn on the skin and not on the skeleton. Later still, trying to create hair, the creator makes everyone grow hair as thick as their bones all over their bodies, that's in all the colors of the rainbow in patches. Next verse details the creation of the "face" in the front of the head to be home to various formerly randomly scattered body parts. Then god possesses one halfling to murder a hundred in order to test whether their skulls are sufficiently thick. And it's just downhill from there on when the combat prowess of all the rest of creation is measured by how many halflings they can kill. That's why leading halfling academicians craft and bury elaborate fossils in the earth to later uncover and theorize on - to protect everyone from having to know the horrible truth of the world.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 07:14:08 pm
Oh wait, I forgot to multiply by three to get the three horn variants, then times two to include visibly fanged and 'fangless'. 612. *gulp* please tell me that creature variants will help me reduce it back to 102.
Edit: I was wrong. I forgot to include hornless, which makes it 816...
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 07:30:23 pm
They'll need to be 51 separate creatures, as castes can't be given different biomes (says wiki). Then it should be relatively easy... just build a basic hornless, toothless dragon body and separate dragon horn and tooth parts. Makes it very easy to make the different castes by using or not using the tooth and horn. Once you've defined one you'll probably want to use COPY_TAGS_FROM and creature variations to make the rest (look up animal men in vanilla). Don't know more about that, never used the former tag much. Things like colors can be applied by creature variations too, look at the halfling raws for that.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 07:38:16 pm
816 types of dragon? I don't even know what to say to that :P
They'll need to be 51 separate creatures, as castes can't be given different biomes (says wiki). Then it should be relatively easy... just build a basic hornless, toothless dragon body and separate dragon horn and tooth parts. Makes it very easy to make the different castes by using or not using the tooth and horn. Once you've defined one you'll probably want to use COPY_TAGS_FROM and creature variations to make the rest (look up animal men in vanilla). Don't know more about that, never used the former tag much. Things like colors can be applied by creature variations too, look at the halfling raws for that.
Gotta tame 'em all. :P
After I finish the rest of my addition, I might come back to them, in order to create variates. Since the naming is going to be along the lines of "{Insert_Name}'s dragons" after their 'discoverer', then we have 51 slots for 'dwarfings'.
Edit: By the way, why is there a question mark next to my name on the 'turn' list?
Post by: Halfling on June 24, 2013, 07:43:21 pm
Edit: By the way, why is there a question mark next to my name on the 'turn' list?
Waiting for DarkDXZ, he wasn't clear on what he wants to do. If he takes a modding turn he'll go before you due to asking first.
Post by: BFEL on June 24, 2013, 08:18:25 pm
Even the creation myth reads like a horror story. Unlike in some myths, here God was definitely not a natural craftsman. After creating the stars and the earth, god brought forth the first of all creatures on a plain of rock, in a temple where magma and water meet. The first of the firstborn, the halflings Adam and Eve, instantly conflagrated and burned with inner heat while trying to kill each other out of mercy. So god declared living creatures should not have a higher inner temperature than it takes to melt their flesh. Next verse, god decides the spine and the skull are to be inside a halfling's body and not on the surface, and that clothing is to be worn on the skin and not on the skeleton. Later still, trying to create hair, the creator makes everyone grow hair as thick as their bones all over their bodies, that's in all the colors of the rainbow in patches. Next verse details the creation of the "face" in the front of the head to be home to various formerly randomly scattered body parts. Then god possesses one halfling to murder a hundred in order to test whether their skulls are sufficiently thick. And it's just downhill from there on when the combat prowess of all the rest of creation is measured by how many halflings they can kill. That's why leading halfling academicians craft and bury elaborate fossils in the earth to later uncover and theorize on - to protect everyone from having to know the horrible truth of the world.
I lol'd
I literally laughed out loud.....it reverberated through the house.
Seriously, that was fucking gold.
Also do you watch DBZ Abridged?
Because I just thought of how they rate power levels by how many Raditz (a very weak character) each person is worth :P
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 24, 2013, 08:32:23 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 24, 2013, 08:37:26 pm
Well, by combining biomes (and ignoring ones that didn't make sense) I managed to reduce it from 51, to 17. So it is now at 272, 1/3 what was formerly there. Huzzah!
That is still a, and I must emphasize here, ENTIRE UNHOLY SHITBUCKET OF DRAGONS
But anyway, I've been working on making bodies for the creatures I'm working on, here are the current results:
Code: [Select]
body_bfel
[OBJECT:BODY]
[BODY:SEA_ANGEL]
[BP:UB:upper body:upper bodies][UPPERBODY][HEAD][THOUGHT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:2000]
[BP:LB:lower body:lower bodies][CON:UB][LOWERBODY]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RW:right wing:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][RIGHT][FLIER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:750]
[BP:LW:left wing:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LEFT][FLIER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:750]
[BP:ORG:organ bundle:STP][CON:UB][INTERNAL][GUTS][BREATHE][UNDER_PRESSURE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:TL:tail:STP][CON:LB][GRASP]
[BODY:CLAYMAN]
[BP:UB:upper body:upper bodies][UPPERBODY][CONNECTOR][NERVOUS]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:3000]
[BP:LB:lower body:lower bodies][LOWERBODY]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BODY:CLAYMAN_LIMBS]
[BP:RA:right arm:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LA:left arm:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RH:right hand:STP][CON:RA][GRASP][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LH:left hand:STP][CON:LA][GRASP][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RL:right leg:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LIMB][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LL:left leg:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LIMB][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RF:right foot:right feet][CON:RL][STANCE][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF:left foot:left feet][CON:LL][STANCE][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BODY:TREELORD]
Post by: sackhead on June 25, 2013, 12:17:11 am
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 25, 2013, 12:32:54 am
wait we have malards hounds and halfling's elves and somthing else and your adding 51 dragons roughly 9/10 species will be dragons... this sounds safe
Well, these dragons wind up at a maximum size of [BODY_SIZE:120:0:92500] and have [MAXAGE:100:120], but also have [CURIOUSBEAST_ITEM],[CURIOUSBEAST_EATER],[BUILDINGDESTROYER:1],[ADOPTS_OWNER] (uses [PET] instead of [PET_EXOTIC]), and [MISCHIEVOUS]
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 25, 2013, 01:56:46 am
Ahem, if nobody else wants to take the first turn, I'll do it. This first version of the world is actually pretty cool, I like it as a way to slowly introduce a new person to DF. Give them halflings instead of dwarves, it's a nice, controlled, less lethal way to introduce them to concepts. Then drop the vanilla game on them and watch them shit bricks.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 02:02:32 am
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 05:37:15 am
Did nobody else notice the presence of a stone with both [AQUIFER] and [UNDIGGABLE]? Good lord... that's frightening.
Ahem, if nobody else wants to take the first turn, I'll do it. This first version of the world is actually pretty cool, I like it as a way to slowly introduce a new person to DF. Give them halflings instead of dwarves, it's a nice, controlled, less lethal way to introduce them to concepts. Then drop the vanilla game on them and watch them shit bricks.
Fortunately it's in veins though. Anyway, sweet! I added minor fixes (one unlisted, hounds were not being present everywhere they should be). Get the newest version and start when you're ready, have fun. I'll fix any remaining issues when they come up. :)
Holy crap how did I miss this!? May I have a modding turn, please?
Happy to have you!
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 05:43:15 am
wait we have malards hounds and halfling's elves and somthing else and your adding 51 dragons roughly 9/10 species will be dragons... this sounds safe
Well, these dragons wind up at a maximum size of [BODY_SIZE:120:0:92500] and have [MAXAGE:100:120], but also have [CURIOUSBEAST_ITEM],[CURIOUSBEAST_EATER],[BUILDINGDESTROYER:1],[ADOPTS_OWNER] (uses [PET] instead of [PET_EXOTIC]), and [MISCHIEVOUS]
So they're fire breathing giant keas that also eat your food and there are more species of them than there are of any other creature combined. :D
Well, that's what makes stuff fun. Someone will probably need to develop a dragon spray though.
Post by: sculleywr on June 25, 2013, 06:35:33 am
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 07:01:17 am
Did nobody else notice the presence of a stone with both [AQUIFER] and [UNDIGGABLE]? Good lord... that's frightening.
8)
Yeah, I'm not the best modder, but I'm certainly one of the more devious ones....don't worry too much though, its in veins so it probably won't do much other then make peoples OCD flare up in the worst way ever.
But yeah, my additions are going to generate plenty of FUN.
UPDATE: Heres the newest version of body_bfel:
Code: [Select]
body_bfel
[OBJECT:BODY]
[BODY:SEA_ANGEL]
[BP:UB:upper body:upper bodies][UPPERBODY][HEAD][THOUGHT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:2000]
[BP:LB:lower body:lower bodies][CON:UB][LOWERBODY]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RW:right wing:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][RIGHT][FLIER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:750]
[BP:LW:left wing:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LEFT][FLIER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:750]
[BP:ORG:organ bundle:STP][CON:UB][INTERNAL][GUTS][BREATHE][UNDER_PRESSURE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:TL:tail:STP][CON:LB][GRASP]
[BODY:CLAYMAN]
[BP:UB:upper body:upper bodies][UPPERBODY][CONNECTOR][NERVOUS]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:3000]
[BP:LB:lower body:lower bodies][LOWERBODY]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BODY:CLAYMAN_LIMBS]
[BP:RA:right arm:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LA:left arm:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RH:right hand:STP][CON:RA][GRASP][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LH:left hand:STP][CON:LA][GRASP][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RL:right leg:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LIMB][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LL:left leg:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LIMB][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RF:right foot:right feet][CON:RL][STANCE][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF:left foot:left feet][CON:LL][STANCE][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BODY:CLAYMAN_HEAD]
[BP:HE:head:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][HEAD]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BODY:TREELORD]
[BP:TRU:trunk:STP][UPPERBODY][LOWERBODY][HEAD][THOUGHT][CONNECTOR]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:6000]
[BODY:TREELORD_BRANCHES]
[BP:RBR:right branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][RIGHT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:RBR:right branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][RIGHT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:RBR:right branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][RIGHT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:LBR:left branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][LEFT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:LBR:left branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][LEFT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:LBR:left branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][LEFT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BODY:TREELORD_ROOTS]
[BP:RRT:right root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][RIGHT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RRT:right root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][RIGHT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LRT:left root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][LEFT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LRT:left root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][LEFT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BODY:TREELORD_VEG]
[BP:LVS:leaf:leaves][CON_CAT:BRANCH][BREATHE][EMBEDDED][SMALL][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:RVN:right vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][RIGHT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:RVN:right vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][RIGHT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:LVN:left vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][LEFT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:LVN:left vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][LEFT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]That's right, I got the Treelord parts defined! SENTIENT TREES AWAY! Also Claymen.
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 08:33:34 am
Sorry to nag about the rules but you should also give the individual objects your handle, e.g. SEA_ANGEL_BFEL, JADED_SLADE_BFEL, to make everyone's life easier in the future, and for compatibility with other stuff (and also because makes it cool to later instantly see which parts are from where). Can make without and add it later, but it's probably easier to add it from the start.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 08:47:42 am
Great! I think some of those body parts may become named a bit confusingly? Since I think you'll have three first right branches, and so on. They'll apparently have 25 body parts and 60 digits they can use to wrestle. Wonder how the AI handles that.
I THINK that the [NUMBER] tag is pretty much just cosmetic. That's what DF wiki makes it sound like anyway. (it says that when one of the things with the tag gets severed they all go, thus the redundant limbs and such.)
Sorry to nag about the rules but you should also give the individual objects your handle, e.g. SEA_ANGEL_BFEL, JADED_SLADE_BFEL, to make everyone's life easier in the future, and for compatibility with other stuff (and also because makes it cool to later instantly see which parts are from where). Can make without and add it later, but it's probably easier to add it from the start.
Wouldn't that kinda make things harder for the next players though?
Knowing that the body part you want is [SEA_ANGEL] is one thing, but having to remember which person created it as well could become a bit much?
Still, your thread/game so I guess you make the rules.
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 08:57:11 am
Sorry to nag about the rules but you should also give the individual objects your handle, e.g. SEA_ANGEL_BFEL, JADED_SLADE_BFEL, to make everyone's life easier in the future, and for compatibility with other stuff (and also because makes it cool to later instantly see which parts are from where). Can make without and add it later, but it's probably easier to add it from the start.
Wouldn't that kinda make things harder for the next players though?
Knowing that the body part you want is [SEA_ANGEL] is one thing, but having to remember which person created it as well could become a bit much?
Still, your thread/game so I guess you make the rules.
Well, whether it's harder or easier depends on what you're trying to do and how far we will have come.
I would argue that especially later on, especially if people are planning to add dozens of creatures per turn, it's going to be easier to look for the name of a body part that you want by looking at a previous player's raws (I want to make a creature/thing similar to this one. Let's look and see what the exact tokens are), if you want to reuse something, than it is to have to remember the name of every body and object that has been added when making a new one (Hey! I figure I'll make a clay man! Let's see if anybody has ever defined a clay man yet before I can get started. [much later] Drat, there is a clay man already. I want to make a different clay man. Let's see all the names of the body parts he used and make my names different).
We could also use an utility to manage this, but then everyone would have to learn to use that before they can join in effectively. So I think this is the smartest way to do it.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 09:20:22 am
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 04:19:29 pm
wait for it.....
....
DOUBLE POST!!!!!!!
So yeah, bump, but also heres the progress I've been making:
Treelord tissues:
Code: [Select]
tissue_template_bfel
[OBJECT:TISSUE_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:BARK_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:bark:bark]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL:BARK]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:5]
[HEALING_RATE:1000]
[VASCULAR:1]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:2]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:SOLID]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[THICKENS_ON_ENERGY_STORAGE]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SAP_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:sap:sap]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL:SAP]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:1]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:LIQUID]
[INSULATION:40]
[TISSUE_LEAKS]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:VINE:VINE_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:vine:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG:VINE]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:2]
[HEALING_RATE:30]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:STRANDS]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:4]
[THICKENS_ON_STRENGTH]
[MUSCULAR]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:LEAF:LEAF_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:leaf:leaves]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG:LEAF]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:1]
[FUNCTIONAL]
[SUBORDINATE_TO_TISSUE:BARK]And the Elfwood material that is referenced there:
Code: [Select]
material_template_organic_bfel
[OBJECT:MATERIAL_TEMPLATE]
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BROWN]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:wood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:wooden]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:BROWN]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:sap]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:sappy]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:BROWN]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:n/a]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:n/a]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:0]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:-2]
[SPEC_HEAT:420]
[IGNITE_POINT:10458]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:10250]
[COLDDAM_POINT:9001]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:NONE]
[SOLID_DENSITY:500]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:NONE]
[MOLAR_MASS:NONE]
[IMPACT_YIELD:10000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:10000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[TENSILE_YIELD:10000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:10000]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[TORSION_YIELD:10000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:10000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[SHEAR_YIELD:40000] used pine
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:40000]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[BENDING_YIELD:10000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:10000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[MAX_EDGE:1500]
[ABSORPTION:0]
[ITEMS_HARD]
[ITEMS_WEAPON]
[ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED]
[ITEMS_AMMO]
[ITEMS_ARMOR]
[ITEMS_SIEGE_ENGINE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:sneaky elven bastards]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:TREELORD:ALL]
[SYN_CONTACT]
[SYN_INGESTED]
[SYN_INHALED]
[CE_BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:EAR:APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:110:SEV:10:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:5:PEAK:403200:END:500000]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:PROB:1:START:302400
[CE:CREATURE:TREELORD:ELF]
[WOOD][HARDENS_WITH_WATER][GENERATES_MIASMA]
[REACTION_CLASS:REFINE_WOOD][BLOCK_NAME:plank:planks]
Yes it has a syndrome attached, which SHOULD be transferred when the trees get wounded and their sap leaks out.
Also thinking of adding that kind of effect to the normal elves as well.
And finally the body detail plan where I tie all this nonsense together:
Code: [Select]
b_detail_plan_bfel
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:BARK_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:SAP_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:VINE_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:LEAF_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:BARK:100:SAP:30:BARK:10]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BRANCH:SAP:10:BARK:35]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ROOT:BARK:50:SAP:20:BARK:10]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LEAF:SAP:1:LEAF:3]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:VINE:SAP:2:VINE:10]
[BP_POSITION:BY_CATEGORY:ROOT:BOTTOM]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:ABOVE:BY_CATEGORY:ROOT]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:VINE:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:30]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:BRANCH:ABOVE:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:BRANCH:SURROUNDED_BY:BY_CATEGORY:LEAF]I'm starting to have concerns as to whether I will get all this stuff finished within the time limit....this is all just ONE body template, and its taken me half the week just to get it done.....and I still have like, 5 more creatures I want to add.....shitbuckets.....
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 04:27:45 pm
Post by: squiddwarf16 on June 25, 2013, 04:30:16 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 25, 2013, 04:33:49 pm
I just re-downloaded the new update and am genning a world now. Small island, 15 megabeasts 40 semimegabeasts, no titans/demons/night trolls/bogeys/etc etc etc, 400 year history, minimum cavern water 5 instead of 0 (to guarantee spores, just in case that's relevant), only 4 civilizations instead of 10 because there are only halflings, other settings unchanged from default.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 04:43:39 pm
Still concerned about time though....
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 25, 2013, 04:46:42 pm
Well, I could make approximately 500 species of bizarre animals to water down the dragon population a bit. How do you feel about land-bound bovid squid things?
Well, technically there are only 17 individual species of dragons. There are just 8 varieties of the male/female caste, which brings it up to 272 types.
So, you don't need to program 500 species, more like 34 or so.
Quote
I'm starting to have concerns as to whether I will get all this stuff finished within the time limit....this is all just ONE body template, and its taken me half the week just to get it ALMOST done.....and I still have like, 5 more creatures I want to add.....shitbuckets.....
And this is why I am working on everything now.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 04:51:51 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 04:55:48 pm
I'm making the Treelord creature file now (finally finished the damn body plans...jesus...) however I have no idea what creature tile would be appropriate for a sentient tree.
This is of course assuming that DFFS (Dwarf fortress from scratch) will be compatible with tilesets like Phoebus (fat chance, but figured I would make the effort regardless.)
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 05:19:39 pm
This is of course assuming that DFFS (Dwarf fortress from scratch) will be compatible with tilesets like Phoebus (fat chance, but figured I would make the effort regardless.)
It is absolutely not. I used different tiles for every creature than is vanilla and phoebus raws couldn't be patched into these anyway... there would have to be a new tileset or a manual change of these raws. If I were you I'd just make them tile 05 or 06 (trees) and give them a different color than usual, though. Or make them look like trees but make them flash 165 (night creature) or 38 (demon).
Let's hope you make it in time. Those raws still definitely need to be playtested and proofread. There's stuff like:
[CE_BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:EAR:APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:110:SEV:10:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:5:PEAK:403200:END:500000] <--- SEV does not apply here
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:PROB:1:START:302400 <--- no closing bracket
It'll probably come together pretty fast once the creature is done... but if you don't make it in time, you can keep developing and post/upload more stuff as suggestions and updates, and the guy who is modding it next can update your files if they're feeling good about it?
I'm awake!
I just re-downloaded the new update and am genning a world now. Small island, 15 megabeasts 40 semimegabeasts, no titans/demons/night trolls/bogeys/etc etc etc, 400 year history, minimum cavern water 5 instead of 0 (to guarantee spores, just in case that's relevant), only 4 civilizations instead of 10 because there are only halflings, other settings unchanged from default.
Nice. I was going to suggest exactly that kind of world. The new raws make things a bit more challenging, but not that much. Let's see how your brave halflings do!
Let's all make at least one. I'll do an ancient war machine.
That's a pretty good suggestion for all takers. If you have time, could make a "signature megabeast". Preferably stupidly hard but not unkillable. :D
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 25, 2013, 05:22:18 pm
1)I'm making the Treelord creature file now (finally finished the damn body plans...jesus...) however I have no idea what creature tile would be appropriate for a sentient tree.
2)This is of course assuming that DFFS (Dwarf fortress from scratch) will be compatible with tilesets like Phoebus (fat chance, but figured I would make the effort regardless.)
1) You can use numbers of the various symbols in the creature tile option, so why not just make their tiles be those of trees?
2) Any mod is compatible with tilesets (with varying degrees of accuracy based on how much is changed), but graphical sets need to be defined separately.
Oh, I may want to mention this tool I find useful for my modding: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=6588. There are still some things you need to look up, but this provides most of what you need.
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 25, 2013, 05:51:20 pm
Anyway. Starting! Embarked along a river, flowing between a shrubland and a rocky wasteland. Well, apparently "temperate" means "frozen", cause the river is frozen and everything's snowed over in the northern (forested) biome. Goody goody!
I did, however, find something interesting. Rock! Genuine rock! Not something I'd expected to see, to be frank. I'm quite pleased, and will be sending my miner to go dig it out... later. Right now we need to get our asses inside and prepare plans for an underground cistern. Not having drinking water during the frozen months will not be acceptable. The biome WAS listed as temperate, so it should thaw. Good thing, because I was briefly tempted to embark on the tundra..... Yeah. Haha. Funny, right?
Anyway, first order of business is going to be getting these halflings out of the cold. I've ordered a rudimentary underground halfling hole to be dug out, containing the area where I will eventually build a series of cage traps, a barracks, and a drawbridge for defense, and then past that, a small area for halflings to congregate. I've got a tiny farm on the surface, because it's telling me "No mud/soil for farming" even though there's clearly dirt. I'm not sure if it'll let me farm, so I'm testing that out.
I brought the following supplies to start us off:
1 shovel
2 hatchets
11 flaxseeds
11 pumpkin seeds
11 pumpkins
5 sheets of flax cloth
3 flax ropes
3 wood buckets
3 wood crutches
3 wood splints
45 wood logs
3 ducks, 2 female 1 male
3 hounds, 2 female 1 male
I'm gonna be training the hounds for war, have them follow my archer around. I took with me a miner/cook, two farmers, a wood cutter/herbalist, an archer, a butcher/tanner/noble, and a carpenter, who will likely be very busy here.
One week in and the halflings have proved quite industrious. We're still carving out the barracks, as we came across an unexpected deposit of stone, which takes far longer to dig through. We're having the nearby wood chopped down and nearby plants gathered, to be stored in an aboveground stockpile until we can move everything to the fortified underground bunker. I may build the bridge now that I can get it hooked up with stone mechanisms. Our carpenter has produced several nest boxes for the ducks to use, and is starting on the bows next. The farmers have finished sowing the pumpkin seeds, and I may have them do the same with flaxseeds just to increase our potential yield, even if we don't have much of a need for a textile industry yet... not to mention the workforce to support one. The snow finally melted on the 11th, and it looks like the river might thaw soon. We're hopeful that it does, because I'm going to need to dig out a cistern soon. If we don't get a holding tank for water during the winter, we'll starve. Period. At least now I can see the ground...
20th Granite: The river is thawed at last! One halfling rushes off for his first drink.
17th Slate: Progress is being made... We've got beds and tables installed, and we're digging out underground workshop areas. Suddenly I get a notification that someone threw a rock at a hound! Luckily the bastard ran off with its toes bleeding, but still. Yikes. That's frightening. Our mayor mandated we make some bows. I already made some bows. We don't need five bows for our one archer.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 05:55:34 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 25, 2013, 06:03:31 pm
Plus I can cage ducks and get more eggs. Mmm. Eggs
EDIT: speaking of eggs. I've got a stack of 11 eggs and a stack of 13 eggs sitting in my stockpile. Z-screen kitchen doesn't show eggs as cookable. That may need to be fixed, since I KNOW you can't eat raw eggs. :( So much for that plan. I guess I'll have to butcher baby ducks instead.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 25, 2013, 06:14:56 pm
Quote
I've got a tiny farm on the surface, because it's telling me "No mud/soil for farming" even though there's clearly dirt. I'm not sure if it'll let me farm, so I'm testing that out.
You should be able to farm. Don't worry about that message unless you are trying to farm on what you know is rock.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 06:16:02 pm
Ducks are as big as halflings, Hounds even bigger and more vicious, and I'm fairly certain there are mega and semimegabeasts already ingame. Potentially other surprises. I'm not taking chances.
Are there? I thought it was just ducks, halflings, hounds, and elf-freaks. I'll check the raws. Still, caution is good.
Also, until we feel up to making our own, we might want to leave the vanilla RCP stuff in, so we can get titans and stuff made of our materials.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 06:21:14 pm
What is there to defend against? Treelords and elves? Are they set to be pure evil cannibalistic monsters or something?
No, no....they are far FAR worse....just click on "The Elf- A theory" in my sig, and you will know how much worse.
Also, update.
Specifically, interactions:
Code: [Select]
interaction_bfel
[OBJECT:INTERACTION]
[INTERACTION:ELF_RESURRECT_BFEL]
[I_SOURCE:CREATURE_ACTION]
[I_TARGET:A:CORPSE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_BP]
[IT_AFFECTED_CREATURE:TREELORD:ELF]
[IT_REQUIRES:FIT_FOR_RESURRECTION]
[I_EFFECT:RESURRECT]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[INTERACTION:CLAYMAN_ANIMATE_BFEL]
[I_SOURCE:CREATURE_ACTION]
[I_TARGET:A:CORPSE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_BP]
[IT_AFFECTED_CREATURE:CLAYMAN:ALL]
[IT_REQUIRES:FIT_FOR_ANIMATION]
[I_EFFECT:ANIMATE]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[INTERACTION:CLAYMAN_REGEN_BFEL]
[I_SOURCE:CREATURE_ACTION]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_AFFECTED_CREATURE:CLAYMAN:ALL]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:START:0:END:1]
[CE:CREATURE:CLAYMAN:ALL]Yeah you guys are gonna hate me SOOOOO much when this is done 8)
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 06:29:16 pm
Ducks are as big as halflings, Hounds even bigger and more vicious, and I'm fairly certain there are mega and semimegabeasts already ingame. Potentially other surprises. I'm not taking chances.
Are there? I thought it was just ducks, halflings, hounds, and elf-freaks. I'll check the raws. Still, caution is good.
Also, until we feel up to making our own, we might want to leave the vanilla RCP stuff in, so we can get titans and stuff made of our materials.
There's some stuff, but it would be a fair assessment to say the world is not going to be that dangerous of a place if you employ cage traps. Ducks are the size of ducks, but halflings are pretty small and can die fighting ducks (they still win by default though). Come to think of it, my next balance fix probably gives some creatures trapavoid. But really, how dangerous can a world without hostile civilizations and tons of beasts ever be? I trust subsequent turns will make it more so. It's looking like it anyway.
The RCP stuff from vanilla refers to vanilla tissues bodies and materials. What's worse is that it assigns the creatures the same attributes, interactions and tokens according to a particular design and you can only change that by editing the DF executable. That's possible, but we don't have enough stuff of our own to make beasts yet. So as it is bringing them in would make it completely not "from scratch".
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 06:33:03 pm
Yeah you guys are gonna hate me SOOOOO much when this is done 8)
One of us will just create an equally overpowered playable race. A race of complete indestructibles. Yes, the infinitely regenerating versus the completely indestructible. Yes... A race of atomic supermen! That will not conquer the world!
Or, more likely, a race of telekinetic eyeballs encased in glass spheres.
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 06:45:59 pm
EDIT: speaking of eggs. I've got a stack of 11 eggs and a stack of 13 eggs sitting in my stockpile. Z-screen kitchen doesn't show eggs as cookable. That may need to be fixed, since I KNOW you can't eat raw eggs. :( So much for that plan. I guess I'll have to butcher baby ducks instead.
Thanks for finding that one! Eggs are actually made of organ tissue right now if you use my EGGS_HLG template (because I didn't see the point of having a separate tissue for eggs), but I hadn't set that to be cookable.
Since it only alters existing materials, if you download my newest raws that I just uploaded and overwrite save raws with them, your eggs should become cookable instantly. :)
I'm a bit of a klutz, but it's really hard to remember to add everything too.
So:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 07:05:33 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 07:09:29 pm
Raws:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:TREELORD]
[CASTE:TREELORDMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][MALE]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE_NAME:treelord:treelords:forested]
[CREATURE_TILE:][COLOR:]
[INTELLIGENT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DIZZINESS][NO_FEVERS]
[NOBONES][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NO_SLEEP][UTTERANCES]
[MOUNT][EXTRAVISION][CANOPENDOORS][BUILDINGDESTROYER:1]
[PREFSTRING:natural majesty]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ELF_RESURRECT_BFEL]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:100:170:230:280:350:390:450]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:10]
[BODY_SIZE:10:90:200000]
[BODY_SIZE:100:168:2000000]
[BODY_SIZE:400:37:8000000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:10]
[CHILD:50]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:25000]
[SPEED:5000]
[CASTE:TREELORDFEMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][FEMALE][LITTERSIZE:7:30]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE_NAME:treequeen:treequeens:forested]
[CREATURE_TILE:6][COLOR:6:0:0]
[CHILDNAME:seedling:seedlings]
[INTELLIGENT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DIZZINESS][NO_FEVERS]
[NOBONES][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NO_SLEEP][UTTERANCES]
[MOUNT][EXTRAVISION][CANOPENDOORS][BUILDINGDESTROYER:1]
[PREFSTRING:natural majesty]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ELF_RESURRECT_BFEL]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:100:170:230:280:350:390:450]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:10]
[BODY_SIZE:10:90:200000]
[BODY_SIZE:100:168:2000000]
[BODY_SIZE:400:37:8000000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:10]
[CHILD:50]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:25000]
[SPEED:5000]
[CASTE:ELF]
[POP_RATIO:80]
[DESCRIPTION:A medium-sized creature claiming to be a ruthless protector of nature. In truth it is a mere pawn of the forests and has no will of its own.]
[CASTE_NAME:elf:elves:elven]
[CREATURE_TILE:140][COLOR:7:0:0]
[CREATURE_SOLDIER_TILE:140]
[CAN_SPEAK][SLOW_LEARNER][VERMIN_HATEABLE]
[CANOPENDOORS][NOTHOUGHT][WAGON_PULLER]
[BENIGN][NO_SLEEP]
[MAXAGE:1000:2000]
[PREFSTRING:dying screams]
[BODY:HUMANOID:2EYES:2EARS:NOSE:2LUNGS:HEART:GUTS:ORGANS:HUMANOID_JOINTS:THROAT:NECK:BRAIN:SKULL:5FINGERS:5TOES:MOUTH:TONGUE:FACIAL_FEATURES:TEETH:RIBCAGE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_NO_LATCH_HLG]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:INTUITION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:150:600:800:900:1000:1100:1500] -
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000] max
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MUSICALITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:15000]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:60000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CLOSE_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:DEEP_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:ROUND_VS_NARROW:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LARGE_IRIS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:LIP]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:THICKNESS:50:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:lips:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:UPTURNED:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CONVEX:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:nose bridge:SINGULAR]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EAR]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SPLAYED_OUT:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HANGING_LOBES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:GAPS:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:100:100:100:100:100:100:100] for vampires
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:1000]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HIGH_CHEEKBONES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROAD_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:JUTTING_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SQUARE_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:1]
[CHILD:12]
[EQUIPS]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[MANNERISM_FINGERS:finger:fingers]
[MANNERISM_NOSE:nose]
[MANNERISM_EAR:ear]
[MANNERISM_HEAD:head]
[MANNERISM_EYES:eyes]
[MANNERISM_MOUTH:mouth]
[MANNERISM_HAIR:hair]
[MANNERISM_KNUCKLES:knuckles]
[MANNERISM_LIPS:lips]
[MANNERISM_CHEEK:cheek]
[MANNERISM_NAILS:nails]
[MANNERISM_FEET:feet]
[MANNERISM_ARMS:arms]
[MANNERISM_HANDS:hands]
[MANNERISM_TONGUE:tongue]
[MANNERISM_LEG:leg]
[MANNERISM_LAUGH]
[MANNERISM_SMILE]
[MANNERISM_WALK]
[MANNERISM_SIT]
[MANNERISM_BREATH]
[MANNERISM_POSTURE]
[MANNERISM_STRETCH]
[MANNERISM_EYELIDS]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:GOLDENROD:1:MOSS_GREEN:1:ORANGE:1:PUMPKIN:1:RED:1:SAFFRON:1:SCARLET:1:SILVER:1:WHITE:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyebrows:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyelashes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:1000:0:0:NO_END]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:10:25:75:125:200:300]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:SKIN]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BROWN:1:BURNT_UMBER:1:CINNAMON:1:COPPER:1:DARK_BROWN:1:DARK_PEACH:1:DARK_TAN:1:ECRU:1:PALE_BROWN:1:PALE_CHESTNUT:1:PALE_PINK:1:PEACH:1:PINK:1:RAW_UMBER:1:SEPIA:1:TAN:1:TAUPE_PALE:1:TAUPE_SANDY:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:skin:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:IRIS_EYE_AQUA:1:IRIS_EYE_AQUAMARINE:1:IRIS_EYE_AZURE:1:IRIS_EYE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_CERULEAN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_EMERALD:1:IRIS_EYE_FERN_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_JADE:1:IRIS_EYE_LIGHT_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_MINT_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_MOSS_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_PALE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_PINE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SEA_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SKY_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_SPRING_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_TEAL:1:IRIS_EYE_TURQUOISE:1:IRIS_EYE_AMBER:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLD:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:IRIS_EYE_YELLOW:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]One of us will just create an equally overpowered playable race. A race of complete indestructibles. Yes, the infinitely regenerating versus the completely indestructible. Yes... A race of atomic supermen! That will not conquer the world!
Or, more likely, a race of telekinetic eyeballs encased in glass spheres.
Oh, claymen don't just regenerate, they MULTIPLY.
They have the ability to reanimate their own severed limbs, and also the ability to regenerate.
Also their arms and legs have the [SOCKET] tag, which is what makes vanilla teeth so prone to flying out.
All these facts combine to mean that in combat, nearly any attack that isn't an instant kill will sever a limb, that limb will then be animated. Then it will regenerate into a FULL CLAYMAN. And then you are fighting two claymen, and then it repeats until you are overwhelmed in a sea of them.
Yeah, don't piss off Claymen.....
Ok, this is all assuming my interactions work how they are supposed to....which......well let me put it like this, I once copy-pasted a fireball interaction from a fire imp ONTO A FIRE IMP, and the interaction broke.....XD yeah interactions hate me
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 07:21:38 pm
A seperate tissue for eggs enables them to be made of a different material.
...actually looking at it more closely they never had their own tissue, just their own set of materials that that token imports, my bad... But that notwithstanding, the point of that (having a separate egg material template) for us is unclear. If you just make them out of the creature's edible materials, they'll be edible, they'll be called creature eggs, they'll work the exact same. It's going to make a difference to have a separate egg material template that you link to creatures if you suddenly want to make all egg material by default be super heavy or burn at a different temperature by default...? If you want some individual creature's egg mats to be different, you can import them separately or define so when defining the egg.
It's not even one material template in vanilla used to make eggs, it's three. I get why Toady would want to make stuff like that, because if he's going to add some awesome function to eggs made of egg materials that doesn't exist now, that's going to work and this won't. But right now for my creatures it seemed like a waste of resources. Of course anyone else can make their eggs be more complex and add such templates, not saying that.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 07:24:56 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 07:31:32 pm
Code: [Select]
[ATTACK:SMASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:smash:smashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:WHIP:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:whip:whips]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[ATTACK:SLASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:slash:slashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]And that wraps up everything Treelord, now to test it all and see if they actually work :P
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 25, 2013, 07:33:23 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 07:35:52 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 07:36:41 pm
Because eggs arent made of blood, bones, or muscles. They're made of eggshell and yolk. But it is a matter of preference, in this case, as is almost everything.
True enough. Since you can't see it in any way in the game right now, I prefer to make it smaller and simpler. If you think about it more, then you might not. I don't know if it's even going to affect performance. Maybe setting all such materials that aren't really significant, like egg mats, to have a fixed temp would make the game run faster by eliminating temperature calculations, but that would violate common sense for others and lead to funny things in case of magma.
Similarly my creatures automatically clean themselves occasionally to reduce grime and lag, others might prefer to have it. We'll probably have a pastiche of different approaches here and its going to be interesting to see.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 07:39:59 pm
However I do know that Halflings stuff doesn't crash it, the Elves don't crash it, but both genders of treelord crash DF.
FUCK
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 07:42:07 pm
Halfling, can you please tell me why you didn't import all of the words from DF, and then add your own in? I have a utility that randomly generates a language, so that is how I noticed it (135 kb file from the two variants I was going to use for my civilization!).
For the same reason that I didn't import all the material and body templates from DF and then add my own. :P
It's much cooler this way. You can add your own symbols and words to mine and we'll eventually have a complete, different language and symbol set, leading to very different names as it already does... assuming nobody just copies and pastes words and symbols en masse.
Ok, after some science I don't know what the problem is. snip FUCKRead your errorlog.txt, it's your best friend
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 07:46:43 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Ok, DF is apparently telling me I suck.
No idea which of these was ultimately fatal though.....
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 07:55:55 pm
It looks like your treelords actually do not have any bodies at all defined, which would probably be first on DF's hate list.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 07:59:26 pm
That's a lot of errors. Some of them look like they are from improper usage of tokens... that's going to take a bit to fix.
It looks like your treelords actually do not have any bodies at all defined, which would probably be first on DF's hate list.
GODDAMMIT I THOUGHT I HAD THAT SHIT FIGURED OUT.
Code: [Select]
material_template_organic_bfel
[OBJECT:MATERIAL_TEMPLATE]
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BROWN]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:wood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:wooden]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:BROWN]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:sap]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:sappy]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:BROWN]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:n/a]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:n/a]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:0]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:-2]
[SPEC_HEAT:420]
[IGNITE_POINT:10458]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:10250]
[COLDDAM_POINT:9001]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:NONE]
[SOLID_DENSITY:500]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:NONE]
[MOLAR_MASS:NONE]
[IMPACT_YIELD:10000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:10000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[TENSILE_YIELD:10000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:10000]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[TORSION_YIELD:10000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:10000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[SHEAR_YIELD:40000] used pine
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:40000]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[BENDING_YIELD:10000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:10000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:1000]
[MAX_EDGE:1500]
[ABSORPTION:0]
[ITEMS_HARD]
[ITEMS_WEAPON]
[ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED]
[ITEMS_AMMO]
[ITEMS_ARMOR]
[ITEMS_SIEGE_ENGINE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:sneaky elven bastards]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:TREELORD:ALL]
[SYN_CONTACT]
[SYN_INGESTED]
[SYN_INHALED]
[CE_BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:EAR:APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:110:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:5:PEAK:403200:END:500000]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:PROB:1:START:302400]
[CE:CREATURE:TREELORD:ELF]
[WOOD][HARDENS_WITH_WATER][GENERATES_MIASMA]
[REACTION_CLASS:REFINE_WOOD][BLOCK_NAME:plank:planks]
Code: [Select]
body_bfel
[OBJECT:BODY]
[BODY:SEA_ANGEL]
[BP:UB:upper body:upper bodies][UPPERBODY][HEAD][THOUGHT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:2000]
[BP:LB:lower body:lower bodies][CON:UB][LOWERBODY]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RW:right wing:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][RIGHT][FLIER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:750]
[BP:LW:left wing:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LEFT][FLIER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:750]
[BP:ORG:organ bundle:STP][CON:UB][INTERNAL][GUTS][BREATHE][UNDER_PRESSURE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:TL:tail:STP][CON:LB][GRASP]
[BODY:CLAYMAN]
[BP:UB:upper body:upper bodies][UPPERBODY][CONNECTOR][NERVOUS]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:3000]
[BP:LB:lower body:lower bodies][LOWERBODY]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BODY:CLAYMAN_LIMBS]
[BP:RA:right arm:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LA:left arm:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RH:right hand:STP][CON:RA][GRASP][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LH:left hand:STP][CON:LA][GRASP][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RL:right leg:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LIMB][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LL:left leg:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LIMB][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RF:right foot:right feet][CON:RL][STANCE][RIGHT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF:left foot:left feet][CON:LL][STANCE][LEFT][SOCKET]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BODY:CLAYMAN_HEAD]
[BP:HE:head:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][HEAD]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BODY:TREELORD]
[BP:TRU:trunk:STP][UPPERBODY][LOWERBODY][HEAD][THOUGHT][CONNECTOR][CATEGORY:TRUNK]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:6000]
[BODY:TREELORD_BRANCHES]
[BP:RBR:right branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][RIGHT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:RBR:right branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][RIGHT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:RBR:right branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][RIGHT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:LBR:left branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][LEFT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:LBR:left branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][LEFT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BP:LBR:left branch:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][DIGIT][LEFT][NUMBER:10][CATEGORY:BRANCH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:4000]
[BODY:TREELORD_ROOTS]
[BP:RRT:right root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ROOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RRT:right root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ROOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LRT:left root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][LEFT][CATEGORY:ROOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LRT:left root:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][STANCE][NUMBER:3][CIRCULATION][LEFT][CATEGORY:ROOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BODY:TREELORD_VEG]
[BP:LVS:leaf:leaves][CON_CAT:BRANCH][BREATHE][EMBEDDED][NUMBER:2000][SMALL][SOCKET][CATEGORY:LEAF]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:RVN:right vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][RIGHT][CATEGORY:VINE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:RVN:right vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][RIGHT][CATEGORY:VINE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:LVN:left vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][LEFT][CATEGORY:VINE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:LVN:left vine:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][LIMB][GRASP][NUMBER:5][INTERNAL][LEFT][CATEGORY:VINE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
Code: [Select]
tissue_template_bfel
[OBJECT:TISSUE_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:BARK_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:bark:bark]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL:BARK]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:5]
[HEALING_RATE:1000]
[VASCULAR:1]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:2]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:SOLID]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[THICKENS_ON_ENERGY_STORAGE]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SAP_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:sap:sap]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL:SAP]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:1]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:LIQUID]
[INSULATION:40]
[TISSUE_LEAKS]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:VINE:VINE_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:vine:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG:VINE]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:2]
[HEALING_RATE:30]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:STRANDS]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:4]
[THICKENS_ON_STRENGTH]
[MUSCULAR]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:LEAF:LEAF_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:leaf:leaves]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG:LEAF]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:1]
[FUNCTIONAL]
[SUBORDINATE_TO_TISSUE:BARK]Code: [Select]
b_detail_plan_bfel
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:BARK_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:SAP_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:VINE_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:LEAF_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:BARK:100:SAP:30:BARK:10]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BRANCH:SAP:10:BARK:35]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ROOT:BARK:50:SAP:20:BARK:10]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LEAF:SAP:1:LEAF:3]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:VINE:SAP:2:VINE:10]
[BP_POSITION:BY_CATEGORY:ROOT:BOTTOM]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:ABOVE:BY_CATEGORY:ROOT]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:VINE:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:30]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:BRANCH:ABOVE:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:BRANCH:SURROUNDED_BY:BY_CATEGORY:LEAF]Any ideas as to where this broke down?
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 08:11:30 pm
snip
There may be more errors in there, but one that jumps to the eye is [TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL:BARK]. That's just not how you define a material for a tissue. You can either first add BARK material to the creature with a body detail plan (like ... ADD_MATERIAL:BARK:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG) and then make the tissue use that (TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BARK), or add a new material like INORGANIC:BARK_BFEL and use TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:BARK_BFEL.
This is going to sound stupid but you may want to check the wiki a bit with these tags that it's giving you alerts about, for example the TISSUE_MATERIAL entry has a link under "arguments" that shows you how you can use it. A lot of them sound, from the alerts, like they're just typed in a way that DF doesn't understand.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 08:19:19 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 25, 2013, 08:34:12 pm
It's much cooler this way. You can add your own symbols and words to mine and we'll eventually have a complete, different language and symbol set, leading to very different names as it already does... assuming nobody just copies and pastes words and symbols en masse.
It may be cool, but it isn't as practical as modifying the files would probably have been a better idea, because if someone creates a custom language for their creatures, then when more words are added, that file wouldn't be, and with the current version, there is barely anything to build a language around, unless someone dedicates a major amount of time to put in all of the words. If someone covers their bases and adds words that are yet to be implemented without the copy-paste, then there will be a large errorlog.txt each time.
Post by: BFEL on June 25, 2013, 08:40:56 pm
I'll try and figure out all the crap I did wrong tomorrow....or something.......anyone wanna fix things for me? :P yeah didn't think so
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 08:53:11 pm
It's much cooler this way. You can add your own symbols and words to mine and we'll eventually have a complete, different language and symbol set, leading to very different names as it already does... assuming nobody just copies and pastes words and symbols en masse.
It may be cool, but it isn't as practical as modifying the files would probably have been a better idea, because if someone creates a custom language for their creatures, then when more words are added, that file wouldn't be, and with the current version, there is barely anything to build a language around, unless someone dedicates a major amount of time to put in all of the words. If someone covers their bases and adds words that are yet to be implemented without the copy-paste, then there will be a large errorlog.txt each time.
Mm. Thing is, starting from a modified vanilla file wouldn't actually help it... we would have the same problem anyway, even if we kept the vanilla language file and only added to it. If people add new word definitions (and I would prefer that), those words become part of ALL languages immediately. Then translations for them must be added to any language (translation) that exists regardless of whether it's based on the vanilla files or scratch, or it will start looking glitchy. Random language gen utilities would be equally useless as the new words would have to be manually added to any randomly generated language too. The only difference would be that we would also have the vanilla words drowning out all our own words like vanilla creatures would bury our creatures under their sheer numbers if they were there.
The only way to completely avoid the problem would be to freeze language from the start and not let people add words, but that's just so limiting. For example expanding the NATURE symbol with your new creatures is just good all around.
What to do? I'm thinking could add a rule stating that if you add a word definition, add a translation for it to existing languages. It's simple as copying and pasting it into form T_WORD:WORD_ID:translation into that language's file. That means languages will eventually contain words added by many people, but doesn't add any constraining limits.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 25, 2013, 09:05:22 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 09:13:44 pm
I don't really get what you mean by finding and labeling every word. If you add a word, you label it and add it to symbols it's part of. If you create a new translation based on a working one, all the words are already there. If you want to use automatic tools you're out of luck unless they're flexible, if we've added new words, and if they are flexible like that then they'll work with a file full of new words too.
If you meant re-adding all vanilla's words, that's not a desirable goal for reasons above.
I can write a little script that you can use to configure a new language or add words, if that makes it more palatable.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 25, 2013, 09:15:35 pm
Why don't we just get language out of the way to begin with? We start with the vanilla words file, add to it, and just base our new languages on a single, unified file. I realize the rush of excitement in doing things from scratch, but finding and labeling every word, having a million word definition files with umpteen duplicates between them will just be a pain in the ass, no fun whatsoever. We'd have to spend months to get anything near as good as what's already there.
Exactly my point.
Quote
my starting set took like two hours.
The starting set isn't that large, truthfully.
Quote
What's already there is vast but has still been seen a billion times over.
Welcome to language.
Post by: Halfling on June 25, 2013, 09:43:59 pm
Vanilla with added words:
- You are going to have a metric shit-ton of vanilla words with their usage tokens and then you add some to them.
- If you're going to make a new translation you must add the vanilla words AND STILL the new words and still "hunt them down". Doing this manually is impossible considering the vanilla word definitions' number. You're basically forced to use a random translation generator, and after that "hunt" and add the new words manually anyway, unless it's configurable - in which case you can use it to generate a translation for a new vocabulary as well.
- If you're going to add new words later they will still need to be added to all existing translations, regardless of whether you have the vanilla words, since you can't choose which translations get the new words.
- You are also never going to see any new words anyone adds because the vanilla word definitions file is as larger than a dictionary, making the whole effort pointless unless we collectively put hundreds of hours into it.
New, smaller vocabulary:
- You are going to have new words only, or when vanilla words are re-added, they can be defined to be used differently.
- Creating a translation manually is faster because fewer words exist. A procedural random translation generator will generate a full translation for this just as well and a fixed one wouldn't for either.
- The same difficulties with adding new words later still exist, but you're working with smaller files.
- Vanilla vocab is removed and new words show up and actually make the place and creature names.
I really don't see the advantage... unless your point is we should have all the same words as vanilla.
Post by: StLeibowitz on June 25, 2013, 10:05:16 pm
The starting set isn't that large, truthfully.
Just going to point out: nothing is that large yet. We have halflings, ducks, and dogs, and however many dragons have been added (which I'll admit is a bit of an exception for "nothing"). We have one type of metal and Hell is made of ice, and all of it will probably change. The language files would grow as more modding occurred.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 12:39:45 am
I'm talking about just leaving the english vocabulary which the game defines all the translation files from in there, because for many words we'd just be recreating what's in there anyway.
I know I for one don't want to deal with:
Code: [Select]
[TRANSLATION:CUSTOMRACE]
[T_WORD:FIBBLTYSNORP:rularuu]
[T_WORD:BIBBITY:clabble]
[T_WORD:CROOPAGA:cabbage]Why limit names because someone forgot to remind the game that "stone" works as an adjective form? Why limit names to various combinations of "matches," "hovercraft," "eels," and whatever else we think to add ourselves when most people will also want to use "boring vanilla words" like "fire," "stone" or "dale" in their names?
Post by: Halfling on June 26, 2013, 02:48:28 am
>Why limit names because someone forgot to remind the game that "stone" works as an adjective form?
This is still going to happen. The vanilla words are not allowed to be used freely, instead they are limited to make place names look better I assume.
For example looking at the top, we have...
[NOUN:ace:aces]
[FRONT_COMPOUND_NOUN_SING]
[REAR_COMPOUND_NOUN_SING]
[THE_NOUN_SING]
[REAR_COMPOUND_NOUN_PLUR]
[OF_NOUN_PLUR]
[ADJ:ace]
[ADJ_DIST:1]
[FRONT_COMPOUND_ADJ]
[THE_COMPOUND_ADJ]
they don't have all the permissions they grammatically could at all, limiting stuff to being "of aces" for example.
As for
>Why limit names to various combinations of "matches," "hovercraft," "eels," and whatever else we think to add ourselves when most people will also want to use "boring vanilla words" like "fire," "stone" or "dale" in their names?
Well, so we can have names with "matches" "hovercraft" and "eels" show up more with ease. Also it doesn't really make sense and kind of hurts the atmosphere to have words like "griffon" or "lion" when nobody has added such yet. And if everyone agrees it should be different, for example when they want to say "realm" they may add "sphere" and "principality" instead of "domain" or "realms" and it just makes the game look a lot different.
Why not add a large number of different words initially? So that it takes less space and until someone misses those words, they can remain absent and we get to see "hovercraft" more, and have an easier time making our new language without that. But it's true, it does lead to more need to add words later if you want to say something that already was there... which on the other hand is also an opportunity for creativity every time. It's another one of these convenience vs. creativity issues, like abandoning vanilla mat templates, but I agree this one is less significant and there are more downsides to the creative option.
There's also a middle ground of using them but auditing the vanilla words once, removing stuff like "lion" and definitely ones like "beguiler" until missed but leaving some of the basic stuff in to get a larger starting vocab. Again the point of this is to improve atmosphere and make your custom words more common, which makes the appearance more different overall. Easy to do with a script, but not really delivering on the promise of deleting it all (but then and again that wasn't done completely anyway).
Anyone else have an opinion so as to what should do with this?
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 05:44:13 am
Though to be honest, I'll probably include something simple but insane.. like Dwarven castes.. Examples include:
Regular Dwarves (Won't leave them out, though they'll be gaining two extra livers)
Badgerdwarves that enrage themselves at a pindrop at random animals
Spiderdwarves with a mild poison and webshooting capabilities
Frogdwarves that can swim!
Dragondwarves.. yes they breath fire, but are thankfully rare.
Stranglerdwarves with four arms!
Elephantdwarves with tusks and thick hides!
And finally.. Boozedwarves, morbidly obese dwarves with alcohol instead of blood, which sprays out and intoxicates their attackers, not to mention the ability to breath alcholic fumes, and inject alcohol through their bites!
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:CREATURE_EXTRACT_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen boozedwarf venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen boozedwarf venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:boozedwarf venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:boozedwarf venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling boozedwarf venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling boozedwarf venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:boozedwarf bite]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:NO_POISON]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:NEVER_POISON]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_NAUSEA:SEV:35:PROB:100:START:50:PEAK:100:END:600]
[CE_DROWSINESS:SEV:35:PROB:100:START:50:PEAK:100:END:600]
[CE_DIZZINESS:SEV:35:PROB:100:START:50:PEAK:100:END:600]
Luckily for me, I think I have most of my old work I did on this. Each 'caste' would have a bonus to certain skills in addition to their more extreme abilities. I could instead do this for a secondary, unplayable Dwarven race if you guy's would prefer it that way.
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 06:13:41 am
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 10:18:41 am
Vegipygmies! Small, halfling-sized evil plant humanoids who primarily eat meat. (Note I say primarily, because they will grow fleshy-meat-like mushrooms as well.
These Vegipygmies come in 11 different varieties. 95% of the population are female, and are of the same variety. 5% of the population are males, and there are 10 different types of males. Some might breath poisonous gas, another might be fire resistant, and another might shoot webs, etc.
As a result of the low male population, Vegipygmies spawn young in bunches, and the females grow fast, becoming adults in 5 years, though reaching their maximum size (Still small) at 10 years. Males take twice as long to grow, but live far longer. Females only live 40 years. Males might live upwards of 300-500 years.
All Vegipygmies are made up of mostly the same materials. They have tough, hide-like 'skin', leaf or moss-like hair, bark-like nails and teeth, highly-alcoholic blood that causes mild dizziness upon contact, and probably a few minor organs. They have no bones. Some males may differ in what they are made of. All Vegipymies drop a special kind of plant upon death - Halfings prize these plants for their tastiness or quality, depending on the type. Some are edible, some are cookable, some are brewable, some can be turned into dye or cloth, etc. They do not give seeds, so are unplantable. One type is highly poisonous, causing death upon consumption - though its tasteyness might cause halfings to eat it anyways.
Veigpygmies are cannibals and love meat - they'll butcher sentient beings without issue, particularly favoring the meat of Halflings. They can extract marrow from bones, which they then eat. They also will be able to extract the blood from domesitic animals and vermin. They then can brew the blood with special types of plants into 'Blood Brew', a type of alcoholic beverage favored by Vegipygmies. It is poisonous to other creatures. They'll consume any type of alcohol, though, and can get by on water, though they prefer not to.
Most of the plants they can grow are brewable, but not cookable. Only one type is edible, and it is more like a small, immobile animal with a very meat-like texture. Most of the plants they favor are poisonous to other creatures. They can also fish, if need be.
They live underground, much like Dwarves - They are unable to smelt metal. Instead, they are able to 'grow' a specific type of metal - this is actually a type of mushroom that, when forged properly, can be made into weapons and armor that is similar in quality to iron. They can also make weapons and armor out of wood and bone and to a lesser extent, stone. They can make picks out of stone.
What do you guys think? And yes, for those curious, I did get the idea name from the Pathfinder Vegipygmy. Love those little buggers.
*Edit* Also, the reason I came up with Vegipygmies, is about a year ago running a homebrew Pathfinder game, I had an encounter where the players fought vegipygmies who were using halflings to breed their kin. They also had infected stew fed to customers that caused Vegipygmies to burst from their stomaches.. :D Halflings need an archnemesis race!
Post by: sculleywr on June 26, 2013, 12:52:35 pm
You guys don't seem to realize that if we're going to add new words, starting with the vanilla language file would not help. Maybe it's a communication problem. Let's look at this more clearly:
Vanilla with added words:
- You are going to have a metric shit-ton of vanilla words with their usage tokens and then you add some to them.
- If you're going to make a new translation you must add the vanilla words AND STILL the new words and still "hunt them down". Doing this manually is impossible considering the vanilla word definitions' number. You're basically forced to use a random translation generator, and after that "hunt" and add the new words manually anyway, unless it's configurable - in which case you can use it to generate a translation for a new vocabulary as well.
- If you're going to add new words later they will still need to be added to all existing translations, regardless of whether you have the vanilla words, since you can't choose which translations get the new words.
- You are also never going to see any new words anyone adds because the vanilla word definitions file is as larger than a dictionary, making the whole effort pointless unless we collectively put hundreds of hours into it.
New, smaller vocabulary:
- You are going to have new words only, or when vanilla words are re-added, they can be defined to be used differently.
- Creating a translation manually is faster because fewer words exist. A procedural random translation generator will generate a full translation for this just as well and a fixed one wouldn't for either.
- The same difficulties with adding new words later still exist, but you're working with smaller files.
- Vanilla vocab is removed and new words show up and actually make the place and creature names.
I really don't see the advantage... unless your point is we should have all the same words as vanilla.
Honestly, Halfling, They do have you here. Since the language files are used, primarily, for place name generators, all that cutting the size of the language file will do is shorten the work of things like I would do, which is create a language file where every English word was replaced with the Japanese equivalent (something I plan on doing for my Vanilla game). Instead of wiping back to a baseline, you create a language block for people who would, otherwise, be interested in this modding adventure.
In addition to this issue, you also create an extremely repetitive name set in our "brave new world". Considering that many people create language mods which have nearly twice as many words as the language files on the vanilla game, this creates nearly three times as much work for people who want to have a language file of that size, because they have to do something that, most of the time, only professional translators have to do, which is write down both the in-game-language equivalent AND the English word itself.
Just coming from a common sense point of view, since the language files aren't really used in combat, events, or other in-game mechanics, and the focus of the modding is to create a new feel to the GAME, such a rule makes as much sense as Armok shitting out thousands of rose petals onto a bunch of dancing fairy goblins.
Instead of serving to entice people, you make it possible that someone might just decide to start a competing thread where that rule does not exist. To be honest, they would certainly attract more players AND modders, which would mean the death, most likely, of this thread, as the new thread becomes more complex and fleshed out. By the time you came up with a version as fleshed out as the vanilla DF, they could have a fully functional and complete version which makes the vanilla look like an infant in a stroller.
I would advise dropping the stringent rules about the icing of the game, whilst keeping the rules for the actual mechanics and races the same.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 01:00:59 pm
Aren't the Treelords already arch-nemesis to the Halflings? Well, I guess a funnier enemy might by a race of giant, sentient hawks who prey on them. Thus potentially explaining why they live in holes.
Post by: Halfling on June 26, 2013, 01:13:34 pm
You guys don't seem to realize that if we're going to add new words, starting with the vanilla language file would not help. Maybe it's a communication problem. Let's look at this more clearly:
Vanilla with added words:
- You are going to have a metric shit-ton of vanilla words with their usage tokens and then you add some to them.
- If you're going to make a new translation you must add the vanilla words AND STILL the new words and still "hunt them down". Doing this manually is impossible considering the vanilla word definitions' number. You're basically forced to use a random translation generator, and after that "hunt" and add the new words manually anyway, unless it's configurable - in which case you can use it to generate a translation for a new vocabulary as well.
- If you're going to add new words later they will still need to be added to all existing translations, regardless of whether you have the vanilla words, since you can't choose which translations get the new words.
- You are also never going to see any new words anyone adds because the vanilla word definitions file is as larger than a dictionary, making the whole effort pointless unless we collectively put hundreds of hours into it.
New, smaller vocabulary:
- You are going to have new words only, or when vanilla words are re-added, they can be defined to be used differently.
- Creating a translation manually is faster because fewer words exist. A procedural random translation generator will generate a full translation for this just as well and a fixed one wouldn't for either.
- The same difficulties with adding new words later still exist, but you're working with smaller files.
- Vanilla vocab is removed and new words show up and actually make the place and creature names.
I really don't see the advantage... unless your point is we should have all the same words as vanilla.
Honestly, Halfling, They do have you here. Since the language files are used, primarily, for place name generators, all that cutting the size of the language file will do is shorten the work of things like I would do, which is create a language file where every English word was replaced with the Japanese equivalent (something I plan on doing for my Vanilla game). Instead of wiping back to a baseline, you create a language block for people who would, otherwise, be interested in this modding adventure.
In addition to this issue, you also create an extremely repetitive name set in our "brave new world". Considering that many people create language mods which have nearly twice as many words as the language files on the vanilla game, this creates nearly three times as much work for people who want to have a language file of that size, because they have to do something that, most of the time, only professional translators have to do, which is write down both the in-game-language equivalent AND the English word itself.
Just coming from a common sense point of view, since the language files aren't really used in combat, events, or other in-game mechanics, and the focus of the modding is to create a new feel to the GAME, such a rule makes as much sense as Armok shitting out thousands of rose petals onto a bunch of dancing fairy goblins.
Instead of serving to entice people, you make it possible that someone might just decide to start a competing thread where that rule does not exist. To be honest, they would certainly attract more players AND modders, which would mean the death, most likely, of this thread, as the new thread becomes more complex and fleshed out. By the time you came up with a version as fleshed out as the vanilla DF, they could have a fully functional and complete version which makes the vanilla look like an infant in a stroller.
I would advise dropping the stringent rules about the icing of the game, whilst keeping the rules for the actual mechanics and races the same.
I really have to appreciate well-written rebuttals you are making... If the majority of you feel this way, then let's rethink starting the language over. Sound up now, everyone who has an opinion. I'm not going to make it a poll because anonymous people shouldn't decide it.
Don't really care about a popularity contest mentality, as I'm sure if anyone wants to make a similar world where vanilla bodies and materials are used, it will be more popular and will kill this, but be so much less interesting. That said, I really don't want to hinder the creative effort by being a stickler about the "from scratch" stuff. It's facilitated by removal of materials... but maybe this would hurt it. Besides, it should be everyone's thread, not mine.
Suggest how we should go about making languages, please. We'll still face the problem with language words additions having to be added to every translation if they are added as turns go along.
Post by: Rose on June 26, 2013, 01:13:58 pm
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 01:33:04 pm
Also noticing that they are unscarrable.. and don't have the 'functional' or 'structural' tags, though I'm not sure what those do exactly.
Post by: Halfling on June 26, 2013, 01:38:46 pm
I could swear my "organ tissue" is functional, but I'm not at my home computer so I can't check
Post by: bsnott on June 26, 2013, 01:41:47 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 26, 2013, 01:44:40 pm
I'll sign up to play.
Added you and CrustyPeanut to the list :)
Post by: sculleywr on June 26, 2013, 02:04:45 pm
I really have to appreciate well-written rebuttals you are making... If the majority of you feel this way, then let's rethink starting the language over. Sound up now, everyone who has an opinion. I'm not going to make it a poll because anonymous people shouldn't decide it.
Don't really care about a popularity contest mentality, as I'm sure if anyone wants to make a similar world where vanilla bodies and materials are used, it will be more popular and will kill this, but be so much less interesting. That said, I really don't want to hinder the creative effort by being a stickler about the "from scratch" stuff. It's facilitated by removal of materials... but maybe this would hurt it. Besides, it should be everyone's thread, not mine.
Suggest how we should go about making languages, please. We'll still face the problem with language words additions having to be added to every translation if they are added as turns go along.
I think you know what my opinion on it is, but we could have a compromise, too. If someone wants to create a "from-scratch" language file, they can. It just has to follow the rules that it doesn't look like monkey shit ingame.
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 02:06:28 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 26, 2013, 02:26:28 pm
Halfling, what were your thoughts on my Vegipygmy race? Looks good so far? :D
Looks good so far. Even though I haven't played Pathfinder, I'm all for two races of midgets fighting each other over rights to eat each other's bodies, and everybody needs a nemesis... They're both probably going to get creamed by the hundreds of murder machines eventually added, but so far, so good. :D
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 02:28:23 pm
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 02:39:38 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This is a Vegipygmy. They're grown from Brown Russet Mold spores, which cause Vegipymgy young to gestate inside the host until he dies, at which 1-2 of them burst out of the host. Their chieftains grow the mold on their bodies, too.
So, although mine'll be a bit different, syndromes will be a major part of their physiology! Not to mention they breed quickly and grow quickly. Even if one or two are sacrificed to say, a dragon, that dragon might not be feeling too well after he's hit with their syndromes. Nothing directly fatal, but annoying at least.
In fact, in Pathfinder Lore, they were originally developed by the Drow to serve as a semi-intelligent food source, but they gained sentience and rebelled.
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 04:00:14 pm
*Edit* Or it could be THAT error. You know, the part about not having any sort of tissue at all. Heh funny error, that.
Post by: Halfling on June 26, 2013, 04:35:36 pm
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 04:41:01 pm
Might also give me time to make Murlocs, which a friend of me wants to put in. XD
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 04:52:57 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 26, 2013, 05:03:32 pm
For the english words that every translation will be based on, perhaps we should start with the extended vocabulary mod's word file (thousands more words), since that way we can focus on adding things like the names of each custom race. Remember, unless you define no symbols, symbols are what define how often words show up in a language. I vote for a single LANGUAGE_WORDS.txt file but as many [SYMBOL] files as we need to give our races a unique vocab.
That sounds like it would actually work well. Questions, though:
- Are there actually utilities that let you create languages for that? I realized I'm too lazy to learn how to make one for Windows.
- Any idea so as to how to best deal with the problem of adding new words after some people have already made languages? We can't know the racial words needed before they're needed... always defining a subset of symbols for your race and being thus unaffected by later changes would work if not for the fact that any language that exists can be used for worldgen, I think.
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 26, 2013, 05:07:51 pm
Just thought I'd bring that up, since, y'know. Someone's planning on adding undiggable aquifers. ;)
Post by: MonkeyHead on June 26, 2013, 05:08:28 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 05:15:43 pm
It's simple. Starting with the massive english vocabulary file, we can generate our languages with DFLang by providing several example words of what our language will sound like. For every new major race that gets added, we add a name for them to each of our languages and repost them. We don't necessarily need a word for every species.
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 26, 2013, 05:29:40 pm
*Edit*: Also, got one of the caste types to shoot webbing! >:D Helloo Vegipygmy Silk Webbing, which can then be collected and woven!
Post by: BFEL on June 26, 2013, 08:30:28 pm
Secondly, I REALLY doubt I'll have everything (or possibly anything) done by the time my turn is up.
I'll keep working on it regardless, just realize you might have to skip me. I didn't even attempt anything today because I was so mad from everything being bugged to the frozen hell and back, will try and fix some shit tomorrow hopefully.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 08:49:55 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 26, 2013, 09:14:22 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 09:31:47 pm
Post by: reemer30 on June 26, 2013, 10:16:37 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 26, 2013, 10:27:45 pm
And AT_PEACE_WITH_WILDLIFE may not even be necessary given that there are currently no random demons.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 26, 2013, 11:29:53 pm
AT_PEACE_WITH_WILDLIFE and UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:5
And AT_PEACE_WITH_WILDLIFE may not even be necessary given that there are currently no random demons.
Have you tested this? Because everyone I've asked told me it doesn't work, and I've never had it work.
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 26, 2013, 11:49:47 pm
Anyway... It's a couple days off of the first of Autumn, and it's time once again to report in on our lovely little halflings! The halfling dwelling of Mistyrocks is coming along nicely... I've added a giant 21x21 stockpile to the main underground floor for me to hold all my crap, of which there is quite a bit. Mostly chopped wood and gathered plants, but still. I've set up several workshops, including a few looms to start on the first crop of flaxes. The first caravan came, though I didn't have anything I could afford to trade to them, and they didn't have anything I desperately needed RIGHT NOW.
I also got the first migrant wave. Batch of 6 adults and a child. Of course, they had the decency to spawn on the far upper right corner of the map, across the river, and I was wondering about a week later why they hadn't gotten inside yet.
I'm gonna give you a moment to let that sink in.
Yeah. So I had a bridge built across the river, and I'll probably have it linked to a lever at some point, since I have stone now! I started digging straight down, and hit the caverns. I have to say, the single color of moss is nice, and I love the shade itself. The fact that it's actually called "luminescent moss" is just gravy to me. I also found huge deposits of Taenite, and so once I get off my ass and get a proper militia to help me secure the caverns (hey, there might be awful horrid beasts down there, I don't know since I haven't really looked at the raws real close), I'm going to be strip mining THAT. I was, upon breach, also informed about a Downward Passage and a Deep Pit... things I've heard about, but not actually seen. Looks like our site has a direct link between the first and second cavern layers, which is cool. I'll have to send
EDIT: HOLY FUCK. So we got notified that the hounds had given birth. No less than TWENTY ONE hound babies. Should I butcher them for food/bones or stuff them in a cage and puppybomb the inevitable megabeast? Because I know that Storm Dragons are already in the game... their meat shows up in the food stockpile options. I also came across my first vermin recently... it's going to bug me that we don't have vermin hunters.
EDIT the second: You can't Render Fat into tallow. I knew you wouldn't be able to make soap out of it since there's no soap maker workshop, but tallow doesn't rot while fat can. This means I'll have to have my fat cooked up asap. Ugh. They also drop generic "tissue" instead of the old nervous tissue... not sure what's up with that. Also unsure if Keratin can be used to make crafts, I'll check real quick here. Concerned about the fat, because I've got TWENTY ONE FUCKING DOGS to slaughter.
EDIT the third: hahaha cartilage rots, I've got about 11/14 units of rotten hound baby cartilage sitting in my dump zone. I approve and deem this a Feature, whether or not it was intended as such. I now have enough prepared meals to feed a small army and will never have to farm again.
TIME TO DRAFT AN ARMY TO FEED!
Scratch that, reverse it. :( I just remembered that the river freezes. Because the river froze. Time for an emergency underground cistern to be constructed. Consequences be damned.
MISSION FAILED
CISTERN NOT CONSTRUCTED IN TIME
YOUR FORTRESS HAS CRUMBLED TO ITS END.
So that happened. I remember when I started out, I decided "As soon as I have myself settled, that's the first thing I'm gonna do, wintertime water source, because I'm dead if I don't." Then I got distracted along the way, forgot that the river freezes in winter, and... well... the river froze and everyone died. :( I'm confident I could've survived the two years if I'd planned better, but... well, I didn't. Kinda glad I decided not to embark in the tundra like I was briefly tempted to. That would not have gone well.
Anyway, I have a few ideas on what I wanna mod in, so I'm gonna turn my sights to that. If nobody else signs up to play a turn, I guess I"ll play the next turn after the next modding round is done and at least partially bugtested.
Post by: sculleywr on June 27, 2013, 01:36:51 am
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 27, 2013, 02:24:59 am
Post by: WillowLuman on June 27, 2013, 02:25:14 am
I'm having some trouble with the Raptorians, due to unfamiliar bodyplans, so I'll start with the simpler: the Watchers. I'll just make a new bodyplan and materials for them from scratch, as I once did with the Daleks.
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 27, 2013, 02:34:02 am
They can be milked, and their beards sheared for wool.
Post by: Halfling on June 27, 2013, 03:22:20 am
I've never actually heard anybody say it doesn't work, actually. I will have to do some science on that, though.
Anyway... It's a couple days off of the first of Autumn, and it's time once again to report in on our lovely little halflings! The halfling dwelling of Mistyrocks is coming along nicely... I've added a giant 21x21 stockpile to the main underground floor for me to hold all my crap, of which there is quite a bit. Mostly chopped wood and gathered plants, but still. I've set up several workshops, including a few looms to start on the first crop of flaxes. The first caravan came, though I didn't have anything I could afford to trade to them, and they didn't have anything I desperately needed RIGHT NOW.
I also got the first migrant wave. Batch of 6 adults and a child. Of course, they had the decency to spawn on the far upper right corner of the map, across the river, and I was wondering about a week later why they hadn't gotten inside yet.
I'm gonna give you a moment to let that sink in.
Yeah. So I had a bridge built across the river, and I'll probably have it linked to a lever at some point, since I have stone now! I started digging straight down, and hit the caverns. I have to say, the single color of moss is nice, and I love the shade itself. The fact that it's actually called "luminescent moss" is just gravy to me. I also found huge deposits of Taenite, and so once I get off my ass and get a proper militia to help me secure the caverns (hey, there might be awful horrid beasts down there, I don't know since I haven't really looked at the raws real close), I'm going to be strip mining THAT. I was, upon breach, also informed about a Downward Passage and a Deep Pit... things I've heard about, but not actually seen. Looks like our site has a direct link between the first and second cavern layers, which is cool. I'll have to sendthe childa geonaut down there to go look at what we have. The Deep Pit is also pretty cool.... I don't have all of it explored yet, so I'll have to do that, but it looks like a good place to seal off and conduct ritual executions of ducks every few months. Praise Armok, after all!
EDIT: HOLY FUCK. So we got notified that the hounds had given birth. No less than TWENTY ONE hound babies. Should I butcher them for food/bones or stuff them in a cage and puppybomb the inevitable megabeast? Because I know that Storm Dragons are already in the game... their meat shows up in the food stockpile options. I also came across my first vermin recently... it's going to bug me that we don't have vermin hunters.
EDIT the second: You can't Render Fat into tallow. I knew you wouldn't be able to make soap out of it since there's no soap maker workshop, but tallow doesn't rot while fat can. This means I'll have to have my fat cooked up asap. Ugh. They also drop generic "tissue" instead of the old nervous tissue... not sure what's up with that. Also unsure if Keratin can be used to make crafts, I'll check real quick here. Concerned about the fat, because I've got TWENTY ONE FUCKING DOGS to slaughter.
EDIT the third: hahaha cartilage rots, I've got about 11/14 units of rotten hound baby cartilage sitting in my dump zone. I approve and deem this a Feature, whether or not it was intended as such. I now have enough prepared meals to feed a small army and will never have to farm again.
TIME TO DRAFT AN ARMY TO FEED!
Scratch that, reverse it. :( I just remembered that the river freezes. Because the river froze. Time for an emergency underground cistern to be constructed. Consequences be damned.
MISSION FAILED
CISTERN NOT CONSTRUCTED IN TIME
YOUR FORTRESS HAS CRUMBLED TO ITS END.
So that happened. I remember when I started out, I decided "As soon as I have myself settled, that's the first thing I'm gonna do, wintertime water source, because I'm dead if I don't." Then I got distracted along the way, forgot that the river freezes in winter, and... well... the river froze and everyone died. :( I'm confident I could've survived the two years if I'd planned better, but... well, I didn't. Kinda glad I decided not to embark in the tundra like I was briefly tempted to. That would not have gone well.
Anyway, I have a few ideas on what I wanna mod in, so I'm gonna turn my sights to that. If nobody else signs up to play a turn, I guess I"ll play the next turn after the next modding round is done and at least partially bugtested.
:D
Thanks for trying it out! The one thing I felt was needed was screenshots. So here's some shots of Halfling Hamlet:
(http://s16.postimg.org/x4dak2fet/hh1.png)
(http://s16.postimg.org/tnb8h3gcl/hh2.png)
(http://s16.postimg.org/jeirb9sat/hh3.png)
(http://s16.postimg.org/6bn4s022t/hh4.png)
(http://s16.postimg.org/4xvhwp2th/hh5.png)
(http://s16.postimg.org/8ivytnwqt/hh6.png)
What all that suggests to me should be added:
* Butchering returns marked more clearly (I called both organ and nervous tissue just "tissue" when working on it)
* Creatures with the keratin material actually have enough keratin to be obtained (yes, it can be made into items, because why not?). Birds have large amounts of it due to it being used for beaks and claws, but now dogs drop some too.
That will now affect all creatures based on my templates and don't require any fixes to the creature itself.
Cartilage being useless yet rotting is intentional. No tallow existing right now is intentional, someone must add that and the reaction to make it before we can have such. Hound littersize is 3-10 so I have no idea what's up with that. I'm going to leave it in for now. I'm also going to make hounds come in packs and like fighting to make them more dangerous.
Just implemented those fixes and reuploaded. Adding everyone to the turn list now. If you don't see your name there, holler. :)
EDIT: Also added, as suggested, a screw into items_default and halfling entity.
Post by: sackhead on June 27, 2013, 04:27:54 am
Post by: Halfling on June 27, 2013, 04:31:18 am
coul i move my modding turn down the list 3 or so turns i am busy at the moment
Done. That puts Leibowitz up next.
Post by: Halfling on June 27, 2013, 06:38:52 am
Spoiler: c_variation_vampire_halfling (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: interaction_vampire_halfling (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: inorganic_vampire_halfling (click to show/hide)
Description: Any sentient creature can be cursed into becoming a famous vampire. To make vampirism more common, you can add creature variation HAS_VAMPIRES to creature - that makes 0.1% of that creature's population be unidentifiable "unnamed" vampires that don't have a history you could screen for. Vampires suck blood and receive physical attribute boosts, but unlike in vanilla they still eat and drink to avoid any stupidity with alcohol dependence and they do gain physical attributes with training. They are also not allied with the undead. Vampirism is properly contagious - if a vampire is present in your fort for one year, they will start converting other sentients present into vampires at a rate of 2 per year. If a vampire is threatened (fleeing), they may release a cloud of "dark blood" and gain insane physical attribute boosts for a few in-game seconds, going berserk for the time and trying to kill anybody nearby. This results in limbs flying and blood spraying a lot, and actually makes them strong enough to tear apart a storm dragon. But they will go for anybody nearby first when scared, so this is supposed to be pretty bad for you, but can be weaponized with some effort.
That last part can easily be removed if it seems excessive.
Edit: Alt version where they turn into a small and fast flying vampire bat instead when threatened:
Spoiler: creature_vampire_halfling (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: interaction_vampire_halfling (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on June 27, 2013, 11:30:38 am
...is there no file from BFEL to download? I should just commence work using the original ducks-and-halflings version?
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 27, 2013, 12:22:04 pm
Oh, it's my turn already? Yay!
...is there no file from BFEL to download? I should just commence work using the original ducks-and-halflings version?
I think he meant that you are being moved up one so that you are after BFEL rather than after Sackhead. I'm pretty sure it is BFEL's turn (until the 30th).
Post by: StLeibowitz on June 27, 2013, 12:29:23 pm
Oh, it's my turn already? Yay!
...is there no file from BFEL to download? I should just commence work using the original ducks-and-halflings version?
I think he meant that you are being moved up one so that you are after BFEL rather than after Sackhead. I'm pretty sure it is BFEL's turn (until the 30th).
Right. I knew that...
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 27, 2013, 12:38:22 pm
Oh, it's my turn already? Yay!
...is there no file from BFEL to download? I should just commence work using the original ducks-and-halflings version?
I think he meant that you are being moved up one so that you are after BFEL rather than after Sackhead. I'm pretty sure it is BFEL's turn (until the 30th).
Right. I knew that...
No reason you can't start now!
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 27, 2013, 02:10:00 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 27, 2013, 02:38:21 pm
Aw, you added a screw. After I mentioned it, I had the idea of making the screw myself as part of my turn, and having it only creatable out of certain non-layer stones (to give them an actual use). That's fine though. I'll just start on some of my stuff now.
Sorry :P but it's not like we'll run out of things to make. Did you know the pump screw is now the only trap weapon component in existence, and programmed to suck compared to the giant screw?
Here's some more fun things for my proposed vampires since they were kind of boring:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Short: Vampires have bat form for fleeing (they don't really flee though), and will now occasionally slash enemies in combat with their claws, causing bleeding. This is arena tested to make small creatures up to horse size die after a short while; larger creatures like dragons don't really care. They will also slash friendlies just for fun, 3x/year, leading to that unfortunate person's death unless treated immediately.
Post by: BFEL on June 27, 2013, 03:19:43 pm
I don't think the math on that was accurate, but if it IS, I just might have something appreciable to upload :)
Ok I looked up "Mallard" on Wikipedia and found that, no that isn't just a term meaning "male duck"
Which totally ruins the joke I was gonna make about having breeding pairs of homosexuals who ignore biology through sheer gay pride.
Alas, no booty babies for us.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 27, 2013, 04:27:43 pm
Wait my turn still has three days left? o.o
I don't think the math on that was accurate, but if it IS, I just might have something appreciable to upload :)
The original file was uploaded upon the 23rd, and you had a week, so you had until the 30th, and today is the 27th.
It's accurate.
Post by: BFEL on June 27, 2013, 04:31:49 pm
Post by: Gargomaxthalus on June 27, 2013, 07:58:06 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 27, 2013, 08:04:54 pm
it is impossible to have to many dragon variations,
Already done with them and have moved onto the civilizations.
Post by: Timeless Bob on June 27, 2013, 08:14:23 pm
I look at the arms race in biology that produced shelled tortoises, fast, toothy hounds, amphibious mallards and dandelion seeds (which are ground into a powder, producing the neurotoxin "malathion" for many insect sprays) and think to myself: you guys could mod in a creature, then mod in the prey for that creature or predators for it - this is a golden opportunity to create your very own biological arms race, depending on which answer to the last beastie was added in.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 27, 2013, 09:31:00 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on June 27, 2013, 09:42:20 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on June 27, 2013, 10:10:17 pm
Things like Giant Cave Spiders and Ogres probably evolved (perchance under guidance), but people can mark in history when werebeasts began.
Post by: Timeless Bob on June 28, 2013, 12:50:49 am
Maybe DF Gods are like mosquitoes, parasites of mortals but dependent on them for sustenance. It's possible that candy is like the shell of an egg sac - once breached, the new godlings are "born". I wonder what Gods would become at the end of their life cycles? Maybe they dissipate into magma or step "sideways" into new worlds, seeding them with candy birthing sacs...
Post by: WillowLuman on June 28, 2013, 02:49:10 am
But we get to decide who and what gods are. Not through modding, since we can't affect them that much with it, but through RPing, since so much of their nature is left open to interpretation. Bear in mind we don't even have a Hell-sealing material yet.
Post by: Halfling on June 28, 2013, 03:29:56 am
Completely sidetracking here but the curse interaction is very moddable thanks to the hist strings being available, though. You could have minor and major blessings and gifts as well as curses.
"Urist McGod blessed Halfling McHalflingpie with the gifts of eternal youth and an ability to heal disease, and was praised..."
"Urist McGod appointed Humie the Human as her justiciar angel, giving him eternal life, the gift of flight, and a burning spear to strike down her enemies"
"Humie the Human, angel Fish Dissector, makes a judgment!
Urist McVanillaDwarf has been found innocent!
Obok McVampire has been found guilty!
The angel Fish Dissector throws a ball of fire!"
I think the dark gods would still primarily use those though, interspersed with curses.
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 28, 2013, 12:53:48 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on June 28, 2013, 02:24:42 pm
I'd love to see people being "blessed" as well as "cursed" by deity interactions - even the "dark gods" would want to set up paladins and high priests to their cause. "Dark" would just mean "active".
I don't know anything about modding hist strings, but it would be very interesting to see Player's names as megabeasts worshiped by the inhabitants of a pre-genned world. I was thinking of trying just that with the "Mythic Greece" thing I'm working on. Each Titan and Olympian God is a megabeast defined with the historic powers of those Gods and after a couple millenia, of world gen, Legends mode should have some of them defeated (sent to "Tartarus" as one of the clowns) and the others still worshiped.
I wonder if there's there a way to disable non-corporeal gods altogether? That way, even your deities could be defined "from scratch".
Just checked: Elves don't spawn gods (only "forces") because they don't build temples.
So: No Temples = no Gods
interesting.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 28, 2013, 03:26:15 pm
I just got shivers... Meteoric Iron could equal "Cold Iron". Wasn't it "cold iron" that had such a negative effect on so called "magical" creatures? What if instead of demons, you had the snow and ice down there be the food for "magical" creatures, a type of "magic dust" or something? That way, each cavern closer to the source would be closer to the source of magic and thus more magically powerful/diverse. (It would explain underground plants, since there's no sunlight or other energy sources outside of magma pools to draw from)
If no one does this before my turn, I request the ability to remove [DEEP_SPECIAL] from 'Meteoric Iron' and make the [DEEP_SPECIAL] become 'Cold Iron'
I'd love to see people being "blessed" as well as "cursed" by deity interactions - even the "dark gods" would want to set up paladins and high priests to their cause. "Dark" would just mean "active".
Unfortunately, the temple has to be defiled in order for either to start, so 'blessings' would probably be more along the lines of 'cursed to serve {diety} for the remainder of their days.'
Just checked: Elves don't spawn gods (only "forces") because they don't build temples.
So: No Temples = no Gods
interesting.
This is wrong. Elves do not spawn gods because they utilize REGIONAL_FORCE in their [RELIGION:] tag rather than PANTHEON, which other races have that spawns gods. Since PANTHEON is (apparently, I think) needed for the entity to adopt megabeasts as gods, it is a no-win situation, unfortunately.
Progress on the entities:
The lizardfolk (humanoid reptiles) needs quite a bit left, but most of it can be extracted for use by the dragonkin (lizardfolk using magic to become humanoid dragons) due to the heritage. The dragonkin will be using [ANY_LAND] for their biome, but the lizardfolk I am limiting to marshes/swamps of any temperature, and tropical moist broadleaf forests. Considering how limited their range will be (and having a site population cap of 40, with an entity population cap of 10000), I would like to request that people have no one create any more marsh-only entities, because I feel that, with another, the marshes will fill up too quickly, and lead to an unembarkable upon biome in longer worlds.
Post by: WillowLuman on June 28, 2013, 08:11:19 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 28, 2013, 08:33:23 pm
I don't know anything about modding hist strings, but it would be very interesting to see Player's names as megabeasts worshiped by the inhabitants of a pre-genned world. I was thinking of trying just that with the "Mythic Greece" thing I'm working on. Each Titan and Olympian God is a megabeast defined with the historic powers of those Gods and after a couple millenia, of world gen, Legends mode should have some of them defeated (sent to "Tartarus" as one of the clowns) and the others still worshiped.
This is possible. God and megabeast names come from a limited subset of symbols/words in a way I haven't fully figured out yet. Symbol:ASSERTIVE seems to figure into the latter a lot? This also has the downside that if you don't have many of those words, because gods like to sometimes have long names, you would end up with something like Bob Bob-Bob, the Bob Bob of Bobs (actually before I upped the vocab a bit, "Secret Secretsecret Secret Secret" was a typical god name).
Anyway, figuring out exactly which symbols they use, and defining what we want for those symbols, and using others for race-related stuff, should let us do that if wanted.
Yeah, Meteoric iron being found only at the bottom of the earth doesn't make much sense.
Hm. Actually it exists in two (real) smeltable forms of meteoric iron that occur in abundant clusters in stone right now. There were screenshots of that to go with the play turn report.
Adamantine spires are, however, made of shiny, metallic meteoric iron, not ore. I think it can be worked into swords without smelting using the stone swords reaction if that reaction is enabled. I did not specifically define it as DEEP_SPECIAL although that is how you would do that; I believe it just went for the first material defined by my raws and this turned out to be cool enough to keep. Hell will probably be made of ice until someone defines a DEEP_SURFACE... but it's actually pretty sweet as is. If you don't have water, just dig down and pour some magma in from above.
Spoiler: more things (click to show/hide)
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 28, 2013, 09:05:26 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on June 28, 2013, 11:41:04 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on June 29, 2013, 12:34:54 am
Post by: WillowLuman on June 29, 2013, 02:20:10 am
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 04:19:45 am
(http://s21.postimg.org/9lc467n7b/hh7.png)
Some further testing in hell shows that it does not melt with magma, though, so that turned out to be bad advice. Just dig a cistern, kids, don't rely on hell for drinking water.
Post by: Krevsin on June 29, 2013, 06:15:24 am
A recap would be nice.
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 06:30:43 am
Okay, so I'm too lazy to read everything that has been posted in my absence.
A recap would be nice.
It's just been a lot of theories and thoughts about what to do in the future, people posting the cool stuff they're making ahead of their turn, and some exploration of the world as is. The minimal world is playable and bug-free now, should be. If you want the minimalist experience, try it. BFEL should be making his upload with more stuff in a day or two. After that I think I'll hijack the save for just a bit and update the language words file, because most people were arguing that creating language from scratch is largely pointless work, and then it's up to Leibowitz.
There have been some cool ideas, but summarizing them all would be a lot of work and not very useful.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 11:36:21 am
However yesterday saw nothing get done as I came down with a minor case of food poisoning, sorry bout that.
So I do know how to fix this now (for the most part) and I should be able to at least get the elves un-bugged before it becomes upload time. (worst case scenario, I get the elves and that stone uploaded, and nothing else.)
EDIT: Ok started doing some more fixins and its going pretty well now. Still having issues with materials but I got the Treelords to have actual body parts! WOOOO! (those body parts are made of "first tissue" instead of bark, sap, and leaves....but still PROGRESS)
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 29, 2013, 11:55:23 am
I do have all of the castes of the Vegipygmies defined, but not finished. Some have their special abilities, such as being fire-proof, spitting webs, one with his nasty bite (and tendancy to latch on), one being able to trance, and another able to enrage. However, they're mostly using Halfling attributes for their tissue, with the exception of the skin, which is more resistant to blunt trauma.
I still need to work on the rest of their body parts, in addition to making the materials they drop upon death. Not to mention I haven't even started making their civilization - right now they're spawnable in Arena mode, and can use halfling-sized weapons and clothing, considering they're the same size.
The web spitters are particularly viscious in Halfling vs Pygmy fights.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 12:16:00 pm
Code: [Select]
tissue_template_bfel
[OBJECT:TISSUE_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:BARK_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:bark:bark]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD:BARK]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:5]
[HEALING_RATE:1000]
[VASCULAR:1]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:2]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:SOLID]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[THICKENS_ON_ENERGY_STORAGE]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SAP_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:sap:sap]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD:SAP]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:1]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:LIQUID]
[INSULATION:40]
[TISSUE_LEAKS]Ok these ones are giving me some grief, in particular the [TISSUE_MATERIAL:] part. I have tried ELFWOOD and ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL, do I have to make a separate elfwood material elsewhere? And if so how would I begin that?
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 12:22:35 pm
[ADD_MATERIAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE:<insert template name here>]
then you may use that in a tissue:
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:bark:bark]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:PLANT_STRUCTURE]
either that or you can use an inorganic material
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[TISSUE_NAME:bark:bark]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:METEORIC_IRON_HLG]
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 12:32:36 pm
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:BODY_DETAIL_PLAN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:PLANT:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:WOOD:ELFWOOD]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:BARK:BARK_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:SAP:SAP_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:VINE:VINE_TEMPLATE_BFEL]
[ADD_TISSUE:LEAF:LEAF_TEMPLATE_BFEL]Yes I am using your plant structure thing for some parts (vines and leaves)...and yes I know I still have to fix that one too, trying to figure out how to fix it up for mine first.
EDIT: Ok this might help, full current errorlog:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 01:05:28 pm
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Material_token
Don't need to fix using my template - the idea is not to import stuff from vanilla or other mods, not that we can't even use each others' work as that would be a little sisyphean.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 01:12:35 pm
Regardless of whether you've added an elfwood mat to your creature, [TISSUE_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD:BARK] is an incorrect way to define a tissue (or any) material. The format is LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:ELFWOOD.
Well I herped and I derped and I made trees made of mystery meat.
sisyphean.
O.O a word I don't know? Holy shit, this just got real.
EDIT: ok, disregarding further silliness.......WHY THE LITERAL FUCK ARE TREELORDS LISTED AS "Nothing" IN ARENA?
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 29, 2013, 01:30:42 pm
I have my different Vegipygmy castes named with placeholders right now, such as bluepygmy, greenpygmy, etc.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 01:38:56 pm
THE FUCKER BROKE ARENA MODE.
THE HALFLING CANT KILL IT BUT IT CANT GET BACK TO CONSCIOUSNESS AND I CANT DO ANYTHING GODDAMMIT WHY CANT YOU FUCKING TURN DF OFF WITH THE GODDAMN RED "X"?
EDIT: ok, got it turned off with the resource manager.....hopefully.....It might just be sentient and playing dead.
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 01:46:52 pm
Should prob post the raws indeed. If windows like it sounds, use your task manager at ctrl+alt+del to kill DF.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 01:51:19 pm
Going to add[NOEXERT] because that was retarded.
Also prob gonna give them natural awesome skills at striker and kicker, as they can't use weapons and they have insanely terrible speed.
They are hilariously hard to kill though.
Code: [Select]
creature_bfel
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:TREELORD]
[CASTE:TREELORDMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][MALE]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE_NAME:treelord:treelords:forested]
[CREATURE_TILE:][COLOR:]
[INTELLIGENT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DIZZINESS][NO_FEVERS]
[NOBONES][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NO_SLEEP][UTTERANCES]
[MOUNT][EXTRAVISION][CANOPENDOORS][BUILDINGDESTROYER:1]
[PREFSTRING:natural majesty]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY:TREELORD:TREELORD_BRANCHES:TREELORD_ROOTS:TREELORD_VEG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ELF_RESURRECT_BFEL]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:100:170:230:280:350:390:450]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:10]
[BODY_SIZE:10:90:200000]
[BODY_SIZE:100:168:2000000]
[BODY_SIZE:400:37:8000000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:10]
[CHILD:50]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:25000]
[SPEED:5000]
[ATTACK:SMASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:smash:smashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:WHIP:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:whip:whips]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[ATTACK:SLASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:slash:slashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CASTE:TREELORDFEMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][FEMALE][LITTERSIZE:7:30]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE_NAME:treequeen:treequeens:forested]
[CREATURE_TILE:6][COLOR:6:0:0]
[CHILDNAME:seedling:seedlings]
[INTELLIGENT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DIZZINESS][NO_FEVERS]
[NOBONES][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NO_SLEEP][UTTERANCES]
[MOUNT][EXTRAVISION][CANOPENDOORS][BUILDINGDESTROYER:1]
[PREFSTRING:natural majesty]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY:TREELORD:TREELORD_BRANCHES:TREELORD_ROOTS:TREELORD_VEG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ELF_RESURRECT_BFEL]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:100:170:230:280:350:390:450]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:10]
[BODY_SIZE:10:90:200000]
[BODY_SIZE:100:168:2000000]
[BODY_SIZE:400:37:8000000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:10]
[CHILD:50]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:25000]
[SPEED:5000]
[ATTACK:SMASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:smash:smashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:WHIP:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:whip:whips]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[ATTACK:SLASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:slash:slashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CASTE:ELF]
[POP_RATIO:80]
[DESCRIPTION:A medium-sized creature claiming to be a ruthless protector of nature. In truth it is a mere pawn of the forests and has no will of its own.]
[CASTE_NAME:elf:elves:elven]
[CREATURE_TILE:140][COLOR:7:0:0]
[CREATURE_SOLDIER_TILE:140]
[CAN_SPEAK][SLOW_LEARNER][VERMIN_HATEABLE]
[CANOPENDOORS][NOTHOUGHT][WAGON_PULLER]
[BENIGN][NO_SLEEP]
[MAXAGE:1000:2000]
[PREFSTRING:dying screams]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_NO_LATCH_HLG]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:INTUITION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:150:600:800:900:1000:1100:1500] -
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000] max
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MUSICALITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:15000]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:60000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CLOSE_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:DEEP_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:ROUND_VS_NARROW:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LARGE_IRIS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:LIP]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:THICKNESS:50:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:lips:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:UPTURNED:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CONVEX:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:nose bridge:SINGULAR]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EAR]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SPLAYED_OUT:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HANGING_LOBES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:GAPS:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:100:100:100:100:100:100:100] for vampires
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:1000]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HIGH_CHEEKBONES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROAD_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:JUTTING_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SQUARE_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:1]
[CHILD:12]
[EQUIPS]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[MANNERISM_FINGERS:finger:fingers]
[MANNERISM_NOSE:nose]
[MANNERISM_EAR:ear]
[MANNERISM_HEAD:head]
[MANNERISM_EYES:eyes]
[MANNERISM_MOUTH:mouth]
[MANNERISM_HAIR:hair]
[MANNERISM_KNUCKLES:knuckles]
[MANNERISM_LIPS:lips]
[MANNERISM_CHEEK:cheek]
[MANNERISM_NAILS:nails]
[MANNERISM_FEET:feet]
[MANNERISM_ARMS:arms]
[MANNERISM_HANDS:hands]
[MANNERISM_TONGUE:tongue]
[MANNERISM_LEG:leg]
[MANNERISM_LAUGH]
[MANNERISM_SMILE]
[MANNERISM_WALK]
[MANNERISM_SIT]
[MANNERISM_BREATH]
[MANNERISM_POSTURE]
[MANNERISM_STRETCH]
[MANNERISM_EYELIDS]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:GOLDENROD:1:MOSS_GREEN:1:ORANGE:1:PUMPKIN:1:RED:1:SAFFRON:1:SCARLET:1:SILVER:1:WHITE:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyebrows:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyelashes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:1000:0:0:NO_END]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:10:25:75:125:200:300]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:SKIN]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BROWN:1:BURNT_UMBER:1:CINNAMON:1:COPPER:1:DARK_BROWN:1:DARK_PEACH:1:DARK_TAN:1:ECRU:1:PALE_BROWN:1:PALE_CHESTNUT:1:PALE_PINK:1:PEACH:1:PINK:1:RAW_UMBER:1:SEPIA:1:TAN:1:TAUPE_PALE:1:TAUPE_SANDY:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:skin:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:IRIS_EYE_AQUA:1:IRIS_EYE_AQUAMARINE:1:IRIS_EYE_AZURE:1:IRIS_EYE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_CERULEAN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_EMERALD:1:IRIS_EYE_FERN_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_JADE:1:IRIS_EYE_LIGHT_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_MINT_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_MOSS_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_PALE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_PINE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SEA_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SKY_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_SPRING_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_TEAL:1:IRIS_EYE_TURQUOISE:1:IRIS_EYE_AMBER:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLD:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:IRIS_EYE_YELLOW:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 29, 2013, 01:58:34 pm
Code: [Select]
creature_vegipygmi
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:VEGIPYGMY_NUT]
[DESCRIPTION:Short, thin, and green, this small humanoid wields a spear. Tendrils of fungus dangle from its arms, midsection, and legs. Its hair is made of mossy dreadlocks.]
[NAME:vegipygmy:vegipygmies:vegipygmy]
[CREATURE_TILE:1][COLOR:3:0:0]
[CREATURE_SOLDIER_TILE:2]
[PREFSTRING:mossy dreads]
[PREFSTRING:dangling tendrils]
[INTELLIGENT][MUNDANE][NOCTURNAL][CANOPENDOORS]
[CAVE_ADAPT][LIKES_FIGHTING][NO_SLEEP][NONAUSEA]
#better creature classification - easier syndrome targeting
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID][CREATURE_CLASS:NO_POISON]
[CREATURE_CLASS:PLANT][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[LITTERSIZE:1:10]
[HAS_NERVES][EQUIPS][HOMEOTHERM:10070]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:vegipygmy seedling:vegipygmy seedlings]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:3000]
[MANNERISM_LAUGH]
[MANNERISM_SMILE]
===================================
#any special interactions here so they're visible. I'm adding CLEANS_SELF_DAILY to any domestic creature to avoid lag due to contaminants.
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
#basic body structure: humanoid core (torso, abdomen, head), back legs, humanoid arms, external ears, teeth)
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG]
#add relevant materials and tissues
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VEGICORE_MATERIALS_NUT]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VEGICORE_TISSUES_NUT]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
#then layers
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
#the following adds hair material, tissue (first token) and puts them where they should be
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
#for two legged creatures this should be added so there's no mention of "back feet"
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
#tendons are included in CORE, now we just make them tendons and ligaments
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
#blood is included in CORE, just define it
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
#attacks
[ATTACK:PUNCH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:punch:punches]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK:KICK:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:kick:kicks]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:BITE:CHILD_BODYPART_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
#appearance variations
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_HEAD_HAIR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_FOOT_HAIR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_SKIN_COLOR_HLG]
#Listing the 11 different castes
#The standard Vegipygmi, and the only female caste; includes info on age and body size for females.
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[CASTE_NAME:vegipygmy:vegipygmies:vegipygmy]
[FEMALE]
[BABY:1][CHILD:5]
[MAXAGE:30:40]
[BODY_SIZE:40000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:10000]
[BODY_SIZE:10:0:40000]
#Male caste 1 - breaths noxious gas, unleashes spores, explodes into goodies and spores upon death; obese; spores cause chronic disease
[CASTE:BROWNPYGMY]
[CASTE_NAME:brown vegipygmy:brown vegipygmies:vegipygmy]
[MALE]
#Male Caste 2 - fireproof, spits webs, immune to webs, has extra eyes, and has numerous extra tendrils; also immune to paralyzation
[CASTE:REDPYGMY]
[CASTE_NAME:red vegipygmy:red vegipygmies:vegipygmy]
[MALE][FIREIMMUNE_SUPER]
[THICKWEB][WEBIMMUNE][PARALYZEIMMUNE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SILK:VEGISILK_TEMPLATE_NUT]
[WEBBER:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SILK]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Spray web]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:BP_REQUIRED:BY_TOKEN:LB]
[CDI:MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SILK:WEB_SPRAY]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:5]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:30]
#Male Caste 3 - amphibious, friendly to local wildlife, strong bite and a good grappler/tamer; can latch with bite
[CASTE:BLUEPYGMY]
[CASTE_NAME:blue vegipygmy:blue vegipygmies:vegipygmy]
[MALE][AMPHIBIOUS][AT_PEACE_WITH_WILDLIFE]
[ATTACK:BITE:CHILD_BODYPART_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
#Male Caste 4 - immune to traps, can pick locks, can enrage, can see regardless of having eyes
[CASTE:GREENPYGMY]
[CASTE_NAME:green vegipygmy:green vegipygmies:vegipygmy]
[MALE][LOCKPICKER][TRAPAVOID][PRONE_TO_RAGE:10]
#Male Caste 5 - extremely tough, strong, but slow; can trance, feels no fear
[CASTE:GREYPYGMY]
[CASTE_NAME:grey vegipygmy:grey vegipygmies:vegipygmy]
[MALE][TRANCES]
#Certain attributes that all male Vegipygmies share, such as age and body size by age.
[SELECT_CASTE:BROWNPYGMY]
[SELECT_ADDITIONAL_CASTE:BLUEPYGMY]
[SELECT_ADDITIONAL_CASTE:REDPYGMY]
[SELECT_ADDITIONAL_CASTE:GREENPYGMY]
[SELECT_ADDITIONAL_CASTE:GREYPYGMY]
[BABY:1][CHILD:20]
[MAXAGE:400:600]
[BODY_SIZE:40000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:10000]
[BODY_SIZE:20:0:40000]
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 02:06:08 pm
You're missing the creature's name. That's why it's called "nothing". That wouldn't make it crash though, the reason for the crash would probably be in errorlog. Suggest wipe it, remove all the cosmetic stuff for now, re-try and post new log.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 02:26:44 pm
There's some things clearly wrong, like [CREATURE_TILE] specified many times when you probably want caste tiles. And those vanilla-style appearance modifiers aren't all compatible with my body parts at all. But let's try to make it run first.
You're missing the creature's name. That's why it's called "nothing". That wouldn't make it crash though, the reason for the crash would probably be in errorlog. Suggest wipe it, remove all the cosmetic stuff for now, re-try and post new log.
It didn't actually crash, just became a loop of being unconscious and I was unable to exit back to arena mode/use escape to turn the damn thing off, right now the issue is it being called "Nothing"
And where am I missing the creatures name? I specified Caste names for all of them.
Also thanks on the Caste tiles.
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 02:29:29 pm
There's some things clearly wrong, like [CREATURE_TILE] specified many times when you probably want caste tiles. And those vanilla-style appearance modifiers aren't all compatible with my body parts at all. But let's try to make it run first.
You're missing the creature's name. That's why it's called "nothing". That wouldn't make it crash though, the reason for the crash would probably be in errorlog. Suggest wipe it, remove all the cosmetic stuff for now, re-try and post new log.
It didn't actually crash, just became a loop of being unconscious and I was unable to exit back to arena mode/use escape to turn the damn thing off, right now the issue is it being called "Nothing"
And where am I missing the creatures name? I specified Caste names for all of them.
Also thanks on the Caste tiles.
K. Unless I'm missing it, the treelord creature should have a [NAME:] token in addition to caste names.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 02:43:42 pm
K. Unless I'm missing it, the treelord creature should have a [NAME:] token in addition to caste names.
So where would that go? At the top?
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 02:45:48 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 02:48:17 pm
Could you put it in where its supposed to go?
Heres the updated raws:
Code: [Select]
creature_bfel
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:TREELORD]
[CASTE:TREELORDMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][MALE]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE_NAME:treelord:treelords:forested]
[CASTE_TILE:6][COLOR:6:0:0]
[INTELLIGENT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DIZZINESS][NO_FEVERS]
[NOBONES][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NO_SLEEP][UTTERANCES]
[MOUNT][EXTRAVISION][CANOPENDOORS][BUILDINGDESTROYER:1][NOEXERT]
[PREFSTRING:natural majesty]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY:TREELORD:TREELORD_BRANCHES:TREELORD_ROOTS:TREELORD_VEG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ELF_RESURRECT_BFEL]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:100:170:230:280:350:390:450]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:10]
[BODY_SIZE:10:90:200000]
[BODY_SIZE:100:168:2000000]
[BODY_SIZE:400:37:8000000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:10]
[CHILD:50]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:25000]
[SPEED:5000]
[ATTACK:SMASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:smash:smashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:WHIP:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:whip:whips]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[ATTACK:SLASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:slash:slashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CASTE:TREELORDFEMALE]
[POP_RATIO:10][FEMALE][LITTERSIZE:7:30]
[DESCRIPTION:A sentient tree, progenitor of the elven menace.]
[CASTE_NAME:treequeen:treequeens:forested]
[CASTE_TILE:6][COLOR:6:0:0]
[CHILDNAME:seedling:seedlings]
[INTELLIGENT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DIZZINESS][NO_FEVERS]
[NOBONES][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NO_SLEEP][UTTERANCES]
[MOUNT][EXTRAVISION][CANOPENDOORS][BUILDINGDESTROYER:1][NOEXERT]
[PREFSTRING:natural majesty]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY:TREELORD:TREELORD_BRANCHES:TREELORD_ROOTS:TREELORD_VEG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_TISSUES_BFEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_LAYERS_BFEL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ELF_RESURRECT_BFEL]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:100:170:230:280:350:390:450]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000]
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:10]
[BODY_SIZE:10:90:200000]
[BODY_SIZE:100:168:2000000]
[BODY_SIZE:400:37:8000000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:10]
[CHILD:50]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:25000]
[SPEED:5000]
[ATTACK:SMASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:smash:smashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:WHIP:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:whip:whips]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[ATTACK:SLASH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:slash:slashes]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:30]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CASTE:ELF]
[POP_RATIO:80]
[DESCRIPTION:A medium-sized creature claiming to be a ruthless protector of nature. In truth it is a mere pawn of the forests and has no will of its own.]
[CASTE_NAME:elf:elves:elven]
[CASTE_TILE:140][COLOR:7:0:0]
[CASTE_SOLDIER_TILE:140]
[CAN_SPEAK][SLOW_LEARNER][VERMIN_HATEABLE]
[CANOPENDOORS][NOTHOUGHT][WAGON_PULLER]
[BENIGN][NO_SLEEP]
[MAXAGE:1000:2000]
[PREFSTRING:dying screams]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_NO_LATCH_HLG]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:RECUPERATION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:DISEASE_RESISTANCE:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:INTUITION:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:PATIENCE:150:600:800:900:1000:1100:1500] -
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MEMORY:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000:5000] max
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:LINGUISTIC_ABILITY:1250:1500:1750:2000:2500:3000:5000] +++
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:SPATIAL_SENSE:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:MUSICALITY:450:950:1150:1250:1350:1550:2250] +
[MENT_ATT_RANGE:KINESTHETIC_SENSE:700:1200:1400:1500:1600:1800:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:15000]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:60000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CLOSE_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:DEEP_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:ROUND_VS_NARROW:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LARGE_IRIS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:LIP]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:THICKNESS:50:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:lips:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:UPTURNED:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CONVEX:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:nose bridge:SINGULAR]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EAR]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SPLAYED_OUT:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HANGING_LOBES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:GAPS:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:100:100:100:100:100:100:100] for vampires
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:1000]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:30:60:90:110:150:190]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HIGH_CHEEKBONES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROAD_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:JUTTING_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SQUARE_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:91:94:98:102:106:109]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[BABY:1]
[CHILD:12]
[EQUIPS]
[DIURNAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[MANNERISM_FINGERS:finger:fingers]
[MANNERISM_NOSE:nose]
[MANNERISM_EAR:ear]
[MANNERISM_HEAD:head]
[MANNERISM_EYES:eyes]
[MANNERISM_MOUTH:mouth]
[MANNERISM_HAIR:hair]
[MANNERISM_KNUCKLES:knuckles]
[MANNERISM_LIPS:lips]
[MANNERISM_CHEEK:cheek]
[MANNERISM_NAILS:nails]
[MANNERISM_FEET:feet]
[MANNERISM_ARMS:arms]
[MANNERISM_HANDS:hands]
[MANNERISM_TONGUE:tongue]
[MANNERISM_LEG:leg]
[MANNERISM_LAUGH]
[MANNERISM_SMILE]
[MANNERISM_WALK]
[MANNERISM_SIT]
[MANNERISM_BREATH]
[MANNERISM_POSTURE]
[MANNERISM_STRETCH]
[MANNERISM_EYELIDS]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:GOLDENROD:1:MOSS_GREEN:1:ORANGE:1:PUMPKIN:1:RED:1:SAFFRON:1:SCARLET:1:SILVER:1:WHITE:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYEBROW]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyebrows:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:EYELASH]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:50:80:90:100:110:120:150]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyelashes:PLURAL]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:55:70:90:110:130:145]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHEEK_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:CHIN_WHISKERS]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MOUSTACHE]
[PLUS_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:SIDEBURNS]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:1000:0:0:NO_END]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:10:25:75:125:200:300]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:SKIN]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BROWN:1:BURNT_UMBER:1:CINNAMON:1:COPPER:1:DARK_BROWN:1:DARK_PEACH:1:DARK_TAN:1:ECRU:1:PALE_BROWN:1:PALE_CHESTNUT:1:PALE_PINK:1:PEACH:1:PINK:1:RAW_UMBER:1:SEPIA:1:TAN:1:TAUPE_PALE:1:TAUPE_SANDY:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:skin:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:IRIS_EYE_AQUA:1:IRIS_EYE_AQUAMARINE:1:IRIS_EYE_AZURE:1:IRIS_EYE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_CERULEAN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_DARK_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_EMERALD:1:IRIS_EYE_FERN_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_JADE:1:IRIS_EYE_LIGHT_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_MINT_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_MOSS_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_OLIVE:1:IRIS_EYE_PALE_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_PINE_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SEA_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_SKY_BLUE:1:IRIS_EYE_SPRING_GREEN:1:IRIS_EYE_TEAL:1:IRIS_EYE_TURQUOISE:1:IRIS_EYE_AMBER:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLD:1:IRIS_EYE_GOLDEN_YELLOW:1:IRIS_EYE_YELLOW:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 02:55:34 pm
[NAME:treelord:treelords:forested]
[CASTE:TREE...
etc.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 02:59:30 pm
Post by: Crustypeanut on June 29, 2013, 03:00:01 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 03:02:08 pm
Now they are all called "TREELORD" in all caps.
So do Caste names actually do....well....ANY GODDAMN THING?
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 03:24:05 pm
No idea about the allcaps. You must have a CASTE_NAME or NAME in all caps or a missing bracket or typo somewhere.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 04:11:09 pm
Because really this is the only issue left before I get back to adding more things instead of fixing old mistakes.
Post by: Halfling on June 29, 2013, 04:26:52 pm
If wondering how it all looks like in real game, can gen a world, first view legends, and then start as adventurer of that species and look around.
Post by: BFEL on June 29, 2013, 05:04:26 pm
EDIT: Ok did not need quite as much sleep time as thought, got the Entity file for the elves done, but want Halfling to tell me if the default weapon/armor/misc items stuff needs to go, if so will replace with the Halfling item stuff (with some slight modification naturally)
Entity for elves:
Code: [Select]
entity_bfel
[OBJECT:ENTITY]
[ENTITY:FOREST]
[CREATURE:ELF]
[TRANSLATION:SIMPLE_ENGLISH_HLG] <-----placeholder for now
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SWORD_SHORT]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SPEAR]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_BOW]
[AMMO:ITEM_AMMO_ARROWS]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SWORD_LONG]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_BREASTPLATE:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_MAIL_SHIRT:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_COAT:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_SHIRT:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_CLOAK:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_TUNIC:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_TOGA:UNCOMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_CAPE:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_VEST:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_DRESS:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ITEM_ARMOR_ROBE:COMMON]
[HELM:ITEM_HELM_HELM:COMMON]
[HELM:ITEM_HELM_CAP:COMMON]
[HELM:ITEM_HELM_HOOD:COMMON]
[HELM:ITEM_HELM_TURBAN:UNCOMMON]
[HELM:ITEM_HELM_VEIL_HEAD:UNCOMMON]
[HELM:ITEM_HELM_SCARF_HEAD:UNCOMMON]
[GLOVES:ITEM_GLOVES_GAUNTLETS:COMMON]
[GLOVES:ITEM_GLOVES_GLOVES:COMMON]
[GLOVES:ITEM_GLOVES_MITTENS:COMMON]
[SHOES:ITEM_SHOES_SHOES:COMMON]
[SHOES:ITEM_SHOES_BOOTS:COMMON]
[SHOES:ITEM_SHOES_BOOTS_LOW:COMMON]
[SHOES:ITEM_SHOES_SANDAL:COMMON]
[SHOES:ITEM_SHOES_CHAUSSE:UNCOMMON]
[SHOES:ITEM_SHOES_SOCKS:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_PANTS:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_GREAVES:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_LEGGINGS:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_LOINCLOTH:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_THONG:UNCOMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_SKIRT:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_SKIRT_SHORT:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_SKIRT_LONG:COMMON]
[PANTS:ITEM_PANTS_BRAIES:UNCOMMON]
[SHIELD:ITEM_SHIELD_SHIELD]
[SHIELD:ITEM_SHIELD_BUCKLER]
[CLOTHING]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:WAR:NAME_WAR]
[SUBSELECT_SYMBOL:WAR:VIOLENT]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:BATTLE:NAME_BATTLE]
[SUBSELECT_SYMBOL:BATTLE:VIOLENT]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:SIEGE:NAME_SIEGE]
[SUBSELECT_SYMBOL:SIEGE:VIOLENT]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:ROAD:NAME_ROAD]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:TUNNEL:NAME_TUNNEL]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:BRIDGE:NAME_BRIDGE]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:WALL:NAME_WALL]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:REMAINING:NATURE]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:REMAINING:FLOWERY]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:DOMESTIC]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:SUBORDINATE]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:EVIL]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:NEGATIVE]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:UGLY]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:NEGATOR]
[WOOD_WEAPONS]
[WOOD_ARMOR]
[OUTDOOR_WOOD]
[OUTDOOR_FARMING]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PACK]
[USE_GOOD_ANIMALS]
[USE_GOOD_PLANTS]
[USE_GOOD_WOOD]
[USE_ANY_PET_RACE]
[IMPROVED_BOWS]
[EQUIPMENT_IMPROVEMENTS]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:PLANTS:3840]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:TREES:5120]
[ART_FACET_MODIFIER:EVIL:0]
[ART_FACET_MODIFIER:GOOD:384]
[ART_FACET_MODIFIER:OWN_RACE:5120]
[ART_IMAGE_ELEMENT_MODIFIER:ITEM:32]
[ART_IMAGE_ELEMENT_MODIFIER:PLANT:3840]
[ART_IMAGE_ELEMENT_MODIFIER:TREE:5102]
[ITEM_IMPROVEMENT_MODIFIER:SPIKES:0]
[ADVENTURE_TIER:2]
[FRIENDLY_COLOR:2:0:1]
[DEFAULT_SITE_TYPE:TREE_CITY]
[LIKES_SITE:TREE_CITY]
[TOLERATES_SITE:CITY]
[TOLERATES_SITE:TREE_CITY]
[START_BIOME:ANY_FOREST]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_LAKE:1]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_FOREST:3]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_RIVER:1]
[TREE_CAP_DIPLOMACY]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POPULATION:1]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_PRODUCTION:1]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE:1]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POP_SIEGE:3]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_PROD_SIEGE:0]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE_SIEGE:0]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:SPRING]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:SUMMER]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:AUTUMN]
[AMBUSHER]
[MAX_STARTING_CIV_NUMBER:100]
[MAX_POP_NUMBER:10000]
[MAX_SITE_POP_NUMBER:120]
[RELIGION:REGIONAL_FORCE]
[WANDERER]
[SCOUT]
[MERCHANT_BODYGUARDS]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BOWYER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ANIMAL_CARETAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOODCRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WEAVER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLOTHIER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:HERBALIST]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRADER]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:TREASON:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:LYING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:THEFT:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:UNTHINKABLE]
[POSITION:WILL_OF_THE_FOREST]
[NAME:will of the forest:will of the forest]
[REJECTED_CREATURE:ELF:ELF]
[NUMBER:100000] <-----should make all treelords into one, as they shouldn't be born that often
[RESPONSIBILITY:MANAGE_PRODUCTION]
[RESPONSIBILITY:ESTABLISH_COLONY_TRADE_AGREEMENTS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_MAKING]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MEET_WORKERS]
[ELECTED]
[COMMANDER:RANGER_CAPTAIN:ALL]
[PRECEDENCE:1]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[RULES_FROM_LOCATION]
[MENIAL__WORK_EXEMPTION]
[CONQUERED_SITE]
[FLASHES]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[POSITION:RANGER_CAPTAIN]
[NAME:ranger captain:ranger captains]
[ALLOWED_CREATURE:ELF:ELF]
[NUMBER:AS_NEEDED]
[SQUAD:10:ranger:rangers]
[RESPONSIBILITY:ATTACK_ENEMIES]
[RESPONSIBILITY:PATROL_TERRITORY]
[RESPONSIBILITY:BUILD_MORALE]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY]
[APPOINTED_BY:WILL_OF_THE_FOREST]
[PRECEDENCE:30000]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[POSITION:DIPLOMAT]
[NAME:diplomat:diplomats]
[NUMBER:1]
[ALLOWED_CREATURE:ELF:ELF]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_INTRODUCTIONS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_PEACE_AGREEMENTS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_TOPIC_AGREEMENTS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS]
[APPOINTED_BY:WILL_OF_THE_FOREST]
[PRECEDENCE:30000]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[COLOR:7:0:1]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[POSITION:TRADER]
[NAME:trader:traders]
[NUMBER:1]
[SITE]
[ALLOWED_CREATURE:ELF:ELF]
[RESPONSIBILITY:TRADE]
[APPOINTED_BY:WILL_OF_THE_FOREST]
[PRECEDENCE:30000]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[STONE_SHAPE:OVAL_CABOCHON]
[GEM_SHAPE:OVAL_CABOCHON]
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 07:50:58 am
Suggest you make a few weapons and equipment pieces for them. Not particularly time-consuming, plus you can make your own like longbows, sickles, sabers, hippie dresses, etc. that elves should have.
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Item_definition_token
Post by: greycat on June 30, 2013, 10:49:58 am
Post by: sculleywr on June 30, 2013, 12:21:56 pm
Post by: BFEL on June 30, 2013, 01:35:20 pm
Right this second the only fully finished things are the Elves and one new type of stone.
Not exactly the march of progress :P
Finally got all the bugs sorted out of the elves.....well ok all the ones that hampered functionality, there are a couple that are just aesthetic at this point (one works perfectly fine, but spams the errorlog, the other isn't seen unless you look REALLY hard at legends mode....I think....that's what play turns are for right? :P)
Have a lot of other ideas to implement if I still have time, like the Claymen, some other animals that should flesh things out, and even some more stone that should make people weep openly ;)
Anyway, waiting for confirmation.
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 03:05:11 pm
If there is a play turn not taken, I'll take the next one. :) This week is my free week.
If I'm not mistaken, the next play turn should go to bsnott who asked for a turn on page 12. But after that or if he doesn't want it/is not ready, its yours. :)
How's it looking bsnott?
Ok so do I have the rest of today, or do I have to post it now?
Have a lot of other ideas to implement if I still have time, like the Claymen, some other animals that should flesh things out, and even some more stone that should make people weep openly ;)
Anyway, waiting for confirmation.
I don't see that you're in that much of a hurry that you have to post it right now. But just for it to be fair, you should post it today, your timezone, I suppose, so that Leibowitz can get to work on it. After all, how this works is that you're going to always have more stuff that you want to implement (like me, I could think of a million things I want to add), but we want it to be a collaborative effort...
If you can make claymen fast, why not. But more importantly, get ready to upload, and make sure it doesn't leave an errorlog, because that makes development so much harder for the next person. Hence the rule that it must not do so during play turn. Also what is added right now should work correctly and stuff that is not working right now should be commented out (just e.g. auto-replace [ with # and ] with !, makes it easy to turn it back on later), for the same reason and also to make playing it possible. Next, you should provide fixes and upgrades as needed as no matter how hard you tried, there's very likely going to be oversights to be discovered.
You can always make additional content later - make it and post it, address to whoever's in charge at that time as to whether they would add it in. AFAIC you're free to re-use stuff from this to make your own mod too if you want to keep working on stuff independently, it's not that serious.
Upload to DFFD and with a short description of what was added if you don't mind, I'll link to it in the first post when it's up!
Post by: BFEL on June 30, 2013, 03:49:28 pm
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_bfel.txt"
ELF BP Mod THICKNESS Was Not Used <------still searching for this one, so I can delete it
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature ELF
ELF:TREELORDMALE:leaf, right branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instead\
ELF:TREELORDMALE:leaf, right branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instead|
ELF:TREELORDMALE:leaf, right branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instead|
ELF:TREELORDMALE:leaf, left branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDMALE:leaf, left branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDMALE:leaf, left branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDMALE:right vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDMALE:right vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDMALE:left vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead |----The "Spam" I told you about, works fine, still trying to fix
ELF:TREELORDMALE:left vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:leaf, right branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue inste|
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:leaf, right branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue inste|
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:leaf, right branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue inste|
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:leaf, left branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instea|
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:leaf, left branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instea|
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:leaf, left branch, layer 1: Tissue LEAF was not found, using first tissue instea|
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:right vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:right vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:left vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead |
ELF:TREELORDFEMALE:left vine, layer 1: Tissue VINE was not found, using first tissue instead /
*** Error(s) finalizing the interaction CLAYMAN_ANIMATE_BFEL \
Unrecognized corpse target affected creature token: CLAYMAN |
*** Error(s) finalizing the interaction CLAYMAN_REGEN_BFEL |-----------Haven't added Claymen, but made the interactions for em
Unrecognized corpse target affected creature token: CLAYMAN |
Unrecognized Caste Token in Body Transformation Effect: CLAYMAN:ALL /
Cannot generate random creatures -- missing body gloss RCP_GLOSS_PAW <------what was that bout not leaving errors for next guy? :P just kidding, I get it XD
EDIT: *** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_bfel.txt"
ELF BP Mod THICKNESS Was Not Used <-------------HA! GOTCHA! IT WAS THE LIPS! STUPID ELVES AND THEIR BIG THICK LIPS!
Ok yeah the big spammy mass has me a bit stumped, I'll admit.
Anyone else wanna take a crack at figuring that part out? Halfling?
Also note that once this bug gets fixed I'm going to upload the save (after taking out the Clayman reactions naturally)
Getting kinda bored of this, its starting to feel less like a creative venture and more like a second job XD.
Maybe later I'll request a second modding turn to add in the rest of the stuff I wanted, its been pretty awesome as a learning experience (I did not even know errorlog existed until this)
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 06:51:02 pm
It is, isn't it? Once you can do this, you can do pretty much anything in DF.
...post your treelord body detail plans and tissues. It seems you don't have those leaf and vine tissues set up correctly. I'll not be around for long today though... if all else fails, copy however you set up bark and use that for leafs and vines, it's all just plant material anyway.
Post by: BFEL on June 30, 2013, 07:00:33 pm
So yeah here ya go, fix it if you know how: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7796
if all else fails, copy however you set up bark and use that for leafs and vines, it's all just plant material anyway.
Tried that, error persists, although it really just turns them into bark anyway....like I said, its aesthetic, it puts some more crap in the errorlog, but other then that its harmless, files up anyway now, so if you want to look into that you can do so before the play turn starts, as for me, I am sleepy now.
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 07:22:18 pm
I think I found the issue. Materials and tissues were not defined properly (you can't define a subtype of material like below).
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Resolves errors and clears the errorlog, making it fit to build more on.
However, there was one more issue I was slightly unhappy about. Namely that the halfling raws bundled with this one were not the newer, bugfixed ones (should download any new bugfixes and add them before uploading). What this means is that if nobody had checked, all those fixes would have been lost and then at some point we might be wondering why stuff isn't working.
Anyway, I'll upload the fixed raws with that done momentarily.
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 07:37:46 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7797
Fixed BFEL's raws' tissue definitions, updated minimal world raws to newest versions, and added that vampirism set I posted earlier while I was at it. Checked to provide no errorlog for now.
So that means...
- Thanks for your contribution BFEL! I'll change it to your description for it if you give me a good one.
- StLeibowitz, you're up to mod next!
- bsnott, you're up to play next! Show us how the new stuff works if you please!
Post by: StLeibowitz on June 30, 2013, 10:22:14 pm
I have some stuff already done a little (mainly templates and tissues and such). Should I put those up for examination?
In general, my plans:
-giant insects with chitin that can be made into armor (esp. spiders, wasps, and a few custom chitiny beasties)
-an unholy crossbreed of halflings and giant spiders. With bows.
-Crystalline pseudolife varieties
-Glass Angels entity of hippy, tree-hugging, animal-loving goodness, with the added perks of disintegrating into coma-inflicting dust on death, and magical spells
-a vermin for evil biomes that makes colonists go mad and fall upon each other like rabid wild hounds
EDIT: Noticed there does not seem to be a [DEFAULT_RELSIZE] assigned to the Sea Angel tail. Would this cause issues?
Post by: BFEL on June 30, 2013, 10:33:01 pm
(The idea was to have a flying carnivorous manta ray, and later have a whale-like ocean animal for it to prey on...with a insane beach frequency, because lol)
Also with the vermin idea, please note that we currently lack vermin hunters, I was going to make a bird that did that....and that shot its feathers machine-gun style....because I'm weird like that.
Sounds like the caverns are going to get more interesting during Leibowitz('s?) (OMG how do you make that possessive? NYAH) turn
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 30, 2013, 10:34:24 pm
-giant insects with chitin that can be made into armor (esp. spiders, wasps, and a few custom chitiny beasties)
-an unholy crossbreed of halflings and giant spiders. With bows.
-Crystalline pseudolife varieties
-Glass Angels entity of hippy, tree-hugging, animal-loving goodness, with the added perks of disintegrating into coma-inflicting dust on death, and magical spells
-a vermin for evil biomes that makes colonists go mad and fall upon each other like rabid wild hounds
EDIT: Noticed there does not seem to be a [DEFAULT_RELSIZE] assigned to the Sea Angel tail. Would this cause issues?
Don't worry, it doesn't actually mean anything. (confirmed via modder's resource - an offline wiki rip by HugotheDwarf that contains all of the tags necessary for modding (link posted earlier in the thread))
Your second one seems to remind me of driders.
Post by: Meph on June 30, 2013, 11:03:30 pm
Quote
-a vermin for evil biomes that makes colonists go mad and fall upon each other like rabid wild hounds
Be sure not to use CE_ADD_TAG:CRAZED, because it causes loyality cascades. Try OPPOSED_TO_LIFE instead, or transform the creature into a new creature, then add crazed. If you add crazed to civ members, they are still civ members and telling your military to kill them is a bad idea.
Otherwise I find this project quite amusing to read. :) It's a really nice idea. One could make the "Learn Dwarf Fortress Edition" of the game, with different levels. Lvl 1, only 1 type of grass, rock, sand, tree, no invaders and such. Lvl 2, add ores and gems and more plant and tree types. Lvl 3, add wildlife and volcanoes and aquifers. Lvl 4, add kobolds thieves and alllies. Lvl 5, add invaders and ambushes. Lvl 6, add vampires, werebeasts, evil-biome rains and undeads. Lvl 7, vanilla DF. ;)
Post by: StLeibowitz on June 30, 2013, 11:11:56 pm
Quote-a vermin for evil biomes that makes colonists go mad and fall upon each other like rabid wild hounds
Be sure not to use CE_ADD_TAG:CRAZED, because it causes loyality cascades. Try OPPOSED_TO_LIFE instead, or transform the creature into a new creature, then add crazed. If you add crazed to civ members, they are still civ members and telling your military to kill them is a bad idea.
Actually, OPPOSED_TO_LIFE had been my plan in the first place :) Would this also have the effect of the crazies attacking each other, or will they just ignore each other?
To anyone who knows: would adding NOSTUN and making a creature unconscious in the same syndrome cause eternal sleep? The wiki claims creatures with NOSTUN can't wake up from sleep, and as I can't make a creature "sleep" via syndrome I'd like to know if unconsciousness causes roughly the same effect.
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 11:26:21 pm
I have some stuff already done a little (mainly templates and tissues and such). Should I put those up for examination?
-giant insects with chitin that can be made into armor (esp. spiders, wasps, and a few custom chitiny beasties)
-an unholy crossbreed of halflings and giant spiders. With bows.
-Crystalline pseudolife varieties
-Glass Angels entity of hippy, tree-hugging, animal-loving goodness, with the added perks of disintegrating into coma-inflicting dust on death, and magical spells
-a vermin for evil biomes that makes colonists go mad and fall upon each other like rabid wild hounds
That is freaking awesome. For me, being such a casual, the first thing that came to mind...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
As for letting us read your work, don't sweat it. Post as much or as little as you like - the results matter and we'll see your work as you upload anyway. But it's maybe fun and can be enlightening to share and discuss your designs as they come up, plus I can nag about the rules earlier... :P
Don't worry, it doesn't actually mean anything. (confirmed via modder's resource - an offline wiki rip by HugotheDwarf that contains all of the tags necessary for modding (link posted earlier in the thread))
Wtf man? Wiki says doesn't have absolute meaning, but I can't imagine that meaning that it has no meaning. Some body parts are obviously larger than others, like compare teeth to lower bodies. If not from RELSIZE, how is the game supposed to tell? There's no other reference to body part sizes in the game AFAIK. Can you post the exact quote?
In fact it's pretty easy to confirm it affects things. Just set a creature's head to radically different sizes and try lopping it off and examine the results - different sized heads (e.g. 6 urists vs 2 urists in my testing). Now, in the vanilla raws it doesn't affect anything all the time, because it's (often? sometimes?) specified twice, redundantly, e.g. in
[BODY:HUMANOID and then later [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HUMANOID_RELSIZES]
so if you tweak the former, it won't matter because the latter overrides it. But my halflings for example don't have that redundancy so body part size should be important.
> If you add crazed to civ members, they are still civ members and telling your military to kill them is a bad idea.
I'm going to test this one next. I still don't understand why it would be not okay to add the CRAZED tag to someone and then kill him before it wears off but it would be okay with the OPPOSED_TO_LIFE tag. It's the same exact thing, dwarf gains a tag and becomes hostile. It's not like he dies from the opposed to life part as with undead animation.
Post by: sculleywr on June 30, 2013, 11:29:49 pm
Quote-a vermin for evil biomes that makes colonists go mad and fall upon each other like rabid wild hounds
Be sure not to use CE_ADD_TAG:CRAZED, because it causes loyality cascades. Try OPPOSED_TO_LIFE instead, or transform the creature into a new creature, then add crazed. If you add crazed to civ members, they are still civ members and telling your military to kill them is a bad idea.
Otherwise I find this project quite amusing to read. :) It's a really nice idea. One could make the "Learn Dwarf Fortress Edition" of the game, with different levels. Lvl 1, only 1 type of grass, rock, sand, tree, no invaders and such. Lvl 2, add ores and gems and more plant and tree types. Lvl 3, add wildlife and volcanoes and aquifers. Lvl 4, add kobolds thieves and alllies. Lvl 5, add invaders and ambushes. Lvl 6, add vampires, werebeasts, evil-biome rains and undeads. Lvl 7, vanilla DF. ;)
Meph, give this project a few months, and you might be left with a challenge that Masterwork is equal to. I have to say, I'm loving the use of RandCreature in MWDF. Now that I've mastered getting started on it, I've started throwing in 500 new random critters with it. Apparently, it is possible to be a were-megabeast, I got a were-adele, which was one of the megabeasts generated by rand-creature.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 30, 2013, 11:35:00 pm
Wtf man? Wiki says doesn't have absolute meaning, but I can't imagine that meaning that it has no meaning. Some body parts are obviously larger than others, like compare teeth to lower bodies. If not from RELSIZE, how is the game supposed to tell? There's no other reference to body part sizes in the game AFAIK. Can you post the exact quote?
Sure.
Quote from: wiki
DEFAULT_RELSIZE
Size
This command establishes the relative size of body parts within a creature. The numbers have no absolute meaning or units.
Link:http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Body_token
Features for it probably aren't or aren't fully implemented, yet.
Post by: Meph on June 30, 2013, 11:37:52 pm
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 11:41:16 pm
Wtf man? Wiki says doesn't have absolute meaning, but I can't imagine that meaning that it has no meaning. Some body parts are obviously larger than others, like compare teeth to lower bodies. If not from RELSIZE, how is the game supposed to tell? There's no other reference to body part sizes in the game AFAIK. Can you post the exact quote?
Sure.Quote from: wikiDEFAULT_RELSIZE
Size
This command establishes the relative size of body parts within a creature. The numbers have no absolute meaning or units.
Link:http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Body_token
Features for it probably aren't or aren't fully implemented, yet.
I think you misunderstand "absolute" here. That means the units themselves don't specify an amount of weight of such, instead it depends on the creature. However, it sets how large the body parts are compared to each other.
Again, try it yourself. Set a head to tooth size, keeping in mind that in vanilla it's defined TWICE so adjust both to be sure, and see what happens when you lop one off - it's a different size. Furthermore there's no other way for the game to tell that teeth should be smaller than lower bodies.
Post by: Halfling on June 30, 2013, 11:48:20 pm
Next, gotta try it with OPPOSED_TO_LIFE. Results momentarily.
Post by: Meph on July 01, 2013, 12:13:02 am
Opposed to life is narhirils solution, I usually transform them into a "berserking dwarf"-creature. For three reasons: I can easier control how good the creature is (so your epic-legendary super-soldier that gets turned doesnt murder everyone), because they drop their gear (again, balancing, its worse enough to lose the berserking dwarf, but if he is armed and armored its even worse. Or a legendary miner with a pick), and the last point is the most important: I modded the anouncements to focus the camera and pause the game and show a pop-up once a creature transforms. This way the player can see whats up.
It happened quite often that players missed that one anouncement: dude has gone berserk, and then find their dining room swimming in blood. Adding a notification to threats that appear inside your fort makes them a lot fairer for the player.
Post by: Halfling on July 01, 2013, 12:22:59 am
But yeah, you're right, as can be expected, even though I still absolutely don't understand how it works this way. Opposed to life - no sign of loyalty cascades. Crazed - instant cascade. I suppose becoming opposed to life or a hostile creature instantly removes your status as a civilization member while becoming just a regular berserk dwarf does not.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 01, 2013, 12:53:56 am
Post by: Halfling on July 01, 2013, 12:57:11 am
Post by: sculleywr on July 01, 2013, 01:26:38 am
I believe that this might get very big very soon, but I seriously doubt that any resemblance of balancing will be found in the end :P
Balancing? What is balance? This is Dwarf Fortress! bring me the giant beasts made of steam, breathing deadly dust, and make him a building destroyer!
Post by: BFEL on July 01, 2013, 01:27:12 am
Oh, since you're not complaining about defining tissue layers for every body part yet, I'm assuming you're not there with that yet. But it does you so much good too. :D
8)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 01, 2013, 08:27:48 am
IhatedefiningbodypartsfromscratchsomuchIhatedefiningbodypartsfromscratchsomuchIhatedefiningbodypartsfromscratchsomuch
Body parts are the fun part! It's the freaking tissue layers and body layers that suck.
What I have wrought so far in terms of bodies:
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:BODY]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL]
[BP:HD:head:STP][CON:UB][HEAD][CATEGORY:HEAD]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:UB:thorax:thoraxes][UPPERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:250]
[BP:LB:abdomen:STP][CON:UB][LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:300]
[BP:RA1:right foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RF1:right front tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:RA2:right midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RF2:right middle tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:RA3:right hindleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HINDLEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RF3:right hind tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA3][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HINDFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:LA1:left foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LF1:left front tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:LA2:left midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LF2:left middle tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:LA3:left hindleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:HINDLEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LF3:left hind tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA3][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:HINDFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BODY:4LEG_ARACHNID_STL]
[BP:UB:cephalothorax:cephalothoraxes][UPPERBODY][HEAD][CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER] I dearly hope this will make large intelligent spiders able to wear both a fuzzy sweater and a woolen cap on the same body part.
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:300]
[BP:LB:abdomen:STP][CON:UB][LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:RA1:right foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF1:right front tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RA2:right midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF2:right middle tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA1:left foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF1:left front tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA2:left midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF2:left middle tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BODY:BASIC_ARACHNID_STL]
[BP:UB:cephalothorax:cephalothoraxes][UPPERBODY][HEAD][CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:300]
[BP:LB:abdomen:STP][CON:UB][LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:RA1:right foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF1:right front tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RA2:right midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF2:right middle tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RA3:right second midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF3:right posterior tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RA4:right hindleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HINDLEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF4:right hind tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HINDFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA1:left foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF1:left front tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA2:left first midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF2:left anterior tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA3:left second midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF3:left posterior tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA4:left hindleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:HINDLEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF4:left hind tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:HINDFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BODY:SPIDER_CENTAUR_STL]
##The parts which are Halfling##
[BP:HD:head:STP][CON:UB][HEAD][CATEGORY:HEAD]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:MOUTH:mouth:STP][CON:HEAD][EMBEDDED][APERTURE][CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:UB:torso:STP][UPPERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:270]
[BP:RUA:right upper arm:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:UPPER_ARM]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RLA:right forearm:STP][CON:RUA][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FOREARM]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RH:right hand:STP][CON:RLA][GRASP][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
[BP:LUA:left upper arm:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:UPPER_ARM]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LLA:left forearm:STP][CON:LUA][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:FOREARM]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LH:left hand:STP][CON:LLA][GRASP][LEFT][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
##The parts which are an abomination##
[BP:LB:abdomen:STP][CON:UB][LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:RA1:right foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF1:right front tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RA2:right midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF2:right middle tarsus:right tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RA3:right second midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF3:right posterior tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:RA4:right hindleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HINDLEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RF4:right hind tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HINDFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA1:left foreleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:FORELEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF1:left front tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA1][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:FOREFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA2:left first midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF2:left anterior tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA3:left second midleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF3:left posterior tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:MIDDLE_FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:LA4:left hindleg:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:HINDLEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LF4:left hind tarsus:left tarsuses][CON:RA2][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:HINDFOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BODY:MANDIBLES_STL] Om nom nom
[BP:MANDIBLES:mandibles:NP][CONTYPE:HEAD][CATEGORY:MANDIBLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BODY:MAW_STL] Om nom nom
[BP:MAW:maw:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][CATEGORY:MAW][APERTURE][EMBEDDED][MOUTH][SMALL]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BODY:ANTENNAE_STL] Can't feel someone up without feelers
[BP:R_ANTENNAE:right antenna:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][RIGHT][SMELL][CATEGORY:ANTENNA]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:L_ANTENNAE:left antenna:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][LEFT][SMELL][CATEGORY:ANTENNA]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BODY:ANT_TENNAE_STL] jointed ant antennae
[BP:LR_ANTENNAE:right lower antenna:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][RIGHT][CATEGORY:LOWER_ANTENNA]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:LL_ANTENNAE:left lower antenna:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][LEFT][CATEGORY:LOWER_ANTENNA]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:UR_ANTENNAE:right upper antenna:STP][CON:LR_ANTENNAE][RIGHT][SMELL][CATEGORY:UPPER_ANTENNA]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:UL_ANTENNAE:left upper antenna:STP][CON:LL_ANTENNAE][LEFT][SMELL][CATEGORY:UPPER_ANTENNA]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BODY:WINGS_STL] BZZ BZZ
[BP:RIGHT_WING:right wing:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][FLIER][RIGHT][CATEGORY:WINGS]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:350]
[BP:LEFT_WING:left wing:STP][CONTYPE:UPPERBODY][FLIER][LEFT][CATEGORY:WINGS]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:350]
[BODY:STINGER_STL] Because it's not a giant wasp unless it can stab you and pump lovely paralytic neurotoxins into your flesh to keep you still while it lays eggs in you with its ovipositer.
[BP:STINGER:stinger:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:STINGER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
[BODY:2EYES_STL] Because Halfling didn't seem to have a separate BODY for for this.
[BP:RIGHT_EYE:right eye:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][RIGHT][SIGHT][CATEGORY:EYES]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
[BP:LEFT_EYE:left eye:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][LEFT][SIGHT][CATEGORY:EYES]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
[BODY:4EYES_STL] No, this is not glasses.
[BP:RIGHT_EYE1:upper right eye:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][RIGHT][SIGHT][CATEGORY:EYES]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:70]
[BP:LEFT_EYE1:upper left eye:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][LEFT][SIGHT][CATEGORY:EYES]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:70]
[BP:RIGHT_EYE2:lower right eye:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][RIGHT][SIGHT][CATEGORY:EYES]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:70]
[BP:LEFT_EYE2:lower left eye:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][LEFT][SIGHT][CATEGORY:EYES]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:70]
[BODY:CYCLOPS_STL] "Nobody has blinded me!" "Are you /sure/ it wasn't a dwarf?"
[BP:EYE:eye:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][SIGHT][CATEGORY:EYES]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BODY:BOOK_LUNGS_STL]
[BP:RIGHT_BOOK_LUNG:right book lung:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][RIGHT][INTERNAL][SMALL][BREATHE][CATEGORY:BOOK_LUNGS]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
[BP:LEFT_BOOK_LUNG:left book lung:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][LEFT][INTERNAL][BREATHE][SMALL][CATEGORY:BOOK_LUNGS]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
##Some internal organy bits##
[BODY:BRAIN_STL]
[BP:BRAIN:brain:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][THOUGHT][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:BRAIN]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200] Bugs am smrt. Has beeg bran.
[BODY:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BP:HEART:heart:STP][CONTYPE:LOWERBODY][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:HEART]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:250] Bug hearts run the length of the abdomen
comments in the code are my way of amusing myself and keeping my own attention focused on modding, rather than on, say, the shortcut to DF I have in my taskbar.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 01, 2013, 09:59:47 am
All I want to do is make a flaming guy is that so hard to ask come on cut me a break
Post by: Halfling on July 01, 2013, 10:45:05 am
comments in the code are my way of amusing myself and keeping my own attention focused on modding, rather than on, say, the shortcut to DF I have in my taskbar.
Adding fun comments is definitely encouraged. Sorry about not having 2eyes as a separate body part - I wanted to save space and leave room and only made the basic humanoid body that can be made into vertebrate animals.
Honestly I can wrap my head around tissue layers and tissue definitions and tissues in general pretty well, but the body part system is completely obtuse when you don't have ANY predefined parts to work from--except the halfling parts, and I'm absolutely not sure at all how to properly scavenge them. I just can't see wtf is going on. :(
All I want to do is make a flaming guy is that so hard to ask come on cut me a break
:D
>-except the halfling parts, and I'm absolutely not sure at all how to properly scavenge them. I just can't see wtf is going on.
Well, you can either 1) make a simpler, new body, 2) copy parts of Leibowitz' or BFEL's stuff now too, or 3) ask for clarification if you want to re-use mine?
Here's the raw with comments. I thought it was pretty simple:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
In my bodies, all you absolutely must add is CORE. It adds an upper body (torso), an abdomen, a head, a face, a core skeleton, a central nervous system and internal organs required for basic functions. No arms, no legs, no ears, no teeth. I thought that saved some space, was easier to use to make humanoids/vertebrates with just a few body tokens, and that people would and should want to add more bodies with their own organization anyway to make different things. Then you probably want to add ears, possibly teeth, have a choice of tails and can add back legs if desired. For front legs there's a choice of ARMS (with grasping hands and fingers), BIRD_ARMS (detailed wings with a bony internal structure), or DOG_ARMS (quadruped). Then there's tissue organization for those in b_detail_plan and the ability to add feathers, beaks, claws or hair (for upper beak, the bodygloss above renames the nose an upper beak and a detail plan then defines it as made of keratin and bone underneath instead of nose tissues).
Looks like Leibowitz' system is going to work quite differently, looking much more modular, so you may want to go for that instead. Or own. IDK. Overall, new body development is going to be one of the foundations of originality and creativity here I should think.
EDIT: re-reading that, someone might think it's just reinventing the wheel re-making bodies that "already exist". If that's how it sounds, try my creatures in combat - they're a lot different despite having humanoid body parts, just from the body plans. Most visible is how body parts are now named properly (thigh, not upper leg), blows to your neck which now exists open major arteries, your hand can be severed at the correctly placed wrist and spray blood everywhere, organ/CNS injuries are less frequent and you can slash things in the face. Definitely value added right there IMHO.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 01, 2013, 12:57:34 pm
Interesting question. I know that tissue relsizes are, indeed, relative. But are they relative to the numbers within the specified creature, or across all the raws? AKA, if I have two identical creatures, same bodysize, same body (1PARTBODY for simplicity and proof of concept), etc... except that the tissues on one have relsize 2 and the other has tissues relsize 200, will one be easier to puncture than the other?
Post by: bulborbish on July 01, 2013, 01:25:02 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 01, 2013, 03:03:32 pm
The problem is that I'm making a guy made of fire and as such don't want him to have a central nervous system, bones, organs, etc. I suppose I'll just reinvent the HUMANOID_SIMPLE that DF uses, and tweak it enough to try and fit the new system.
Interesting question. I know that tissue relsizes are, indeed, relative. But are they relative to the numbers within the specified creature, or across all the raws? AKA, if I have two identical creatures, same bodysize, same body (1PARTBODY for simplicity and proof of concept), etc... except that the tissues on one have relsize 2 and the other has tissues relsize 200, will one be easier to puncture than the other?
For the fire-man, there's creature tags for that kind of stuff - "NOTHOUGHT" combined with "NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT" removes need for a nervous center, "NOBONES" does what you'd think, and organs really aren't necessary in the first place. Intestines only make you weak, and vanilla dwarves have been known to survive and recover from heart removal.
The relsizes are relative only within that creature, I believe, though I'd like some confirmation on that too - otherwise all my "giant" spiders will probably be only slightly abnormally sized when compared to the halflings.
Post by: BFEL on July 01, 2013, 03:19:11 pm
Second, laularuk, stop complaining :P, the defining of body parts is probably the least obtuse part of this process, just go on the wiki, look up body tokens, compare to how other people did them and your basically set. You probably THINK you have tissues and such down, but I bet you have an errorlog that is quite frightening, I know I did.
And for the fire-man, you could easily just copy halflings stuff and adjust it to not have certain stuff. Frankly most of the "fire" part could be accomplished with tissues and creature tags....I mean, after all, that's how TOADY did it :P
Post by: WillowLuman on July 01, 2013, 03:20:43 pm
BODY_SIZE isn't relative, but relsizes are relative within the creature only. If your giant spiders have greater BODY_SIZE than the halflings, then they're bigger, no matter what.
Post by: BFEL on July 01, 2013, 03:23:01 pm
ninja'd
BODY_SIZE isn't relative, but relsizes are relative within the creature only. If your giant spiders have greater BODY_SIZE than the halflings, then they're bigger, no matter what.
And if they are a LOT bigger then the halflings....squish :o
Also WHEN THE HELL IS THE PLAYER TURN GONNA START? I AM LITERALLY TREMBLING WITH EXCITEMENT
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 01, 2013, 03:26:07 pm
ninja'd
BODY_SIZE isn't relative, but relsizes are relative within the creature only. If your giant spiders have greater BODY_SIZE than the halflings, then they're bigger, no matter what.
Okay, that's good to know. Thanks!
Post by: Halfling on July 01, 2013, 03:28:41 pm
The problem is that I'm making a guy made of fire and as such don't want him to have a central nervous system, bones, organs, etc. I suppose I'll just reinvent the HUMANOID_SIMPLE that DF uses, and tweak it enough to try and fit the new system.
Interesting question. I know that tissue relsizes are, indeed, relative. But are they relative to the numbers within the specified creature, or across all the raws? AKA, if I have two identical creatures, same bodysize, same body (1PARTBODY for simplicity and proof of concept), etc... except that the tissues on one have relsize 2 and the other has tissues relsize 200, will one be easier to puncture than the other?
Sup.
It's easy to replace any unwanted layer of the halfling with stuff that you want. Look to the vanilla bronze colossus raws for a prime example. Instead of using a simple body made of one thing, you can just take a humanoid body made in any way out of anything and make it entirely out of anything that you wish, like fire. :)
If you want to make a simple humanoid bodyplan that's 100% kosher, you can just take one of our body plans and remove all the stuff that you don't want. Such as for the halfling plans just take CORE, note that you don't want skulls or spines or guts, and if it has the NO THOUGHT CENTER, NOBREATHE etc. type of tags it doesn't even need the lungs or brains - so just delete them. Removing stuff from what was before is never that complicated.
I suppose the logic on that last part would be that since both represent the entire creature, they'd be the same?
Post by: BFEL on July 01, 2013, 03:31:17 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 01, 2013, 03:32:58 pm
Also WHEN THE HELL IS THE PLAYER TURN GONNA START? I AM LITERALLY TREMBLING WITH EXCITEMENT
LOL
Well, did you playtest it yourself yet? Now would be a good chance to do that and take out some of the most glaring bugs (they are still there... for example I don't think your elves can keep records or wear or wield anything [intentional?] and tree lord sap removed in combat is named "molten skin" likely due to a malformed name tag).
I'm thinking we should make the player pool literally an unordered pool though. Like, first one who is there and wants it, gets it. This is so it always comes in a timely fashion and we don't get a backlog. Thoughts?
If I could take a modding round, I would like to take a crack at implementing myI'll take that as my cue to add you :)evilperfectly fair additions.
Post by: squiddwarf16 on July 01, 2013, 03:41:23 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 01, 2013, 03:42:52 pm
Post by: BFEL on July 01, 2013, 03:45:25 pm
Well, did you playtest it yourself yet? Now would be a good chance to do that and take out some of the most glaring bugs (they are still there... for example I don't think your elves can keep records or wear or wield anything [intentional?] and tree lord sap removed in combat is named "molten skin" likely due to a malformed name tag).
Well the elves can't do those things because I ran out of time that I could've used to make a bunch of items for them to use, something I noticed is that since the treelords have [UTTERANCES] the elves get the weird kobold names as well (the trees have it, the elves don't, as the elves are supposed to be the "face" of the trees.) So I'm not sure exactly how much of an effect that will have on gameplay.
Also FUCK YOU STUPID NAME TAG SHIT.
I am nothing if not a magnet for weird bugs :P
Post by: Halfling on July 01, 2013, 04:12:02 pm
Vanilla creatures-made-of-fire suffer ludicrous gibs, but I'm going to do some testing to see if that's required. But yeah, I can handle this. I actually have an interesting plan in mind...
That's exactly the type of stuff/silliness/feature we can avoid here. I'm not that great on materials science but I think the vanilla variety of fire tissue is ridiculously fracturable and that's why it just breaks. Now, if you make those values more reasonable (like those of bone), the creature will be much more dangerous. But preferably don't make it resemble adamantine with a tissue layer thickness of thousands :P
Well the elves can't do those things because I ran out of time that I could've used to make a bunch of items for them to use, something I noticed is that since the treelords have [UTTERANCES] the elves get the weird kobold names as well (the trees have it, the elves don't, as the elves are supposed to be the "face" of the trees.) So I'm not sure exactly how much of an effect that will have on gameplay.
Also FUCK YOU STUPID NAME TAG SHIT.
I am nothing if not a magnet for weird bugs :P
Yeah... there's some tags that apply creature wide. I think maybe the pack animal stuff does too? Like making one caste of a creature a wagon makes them all wagons, it's a creature wide attribute.
Anyway, you can keep adding stuff during your bugfix turn to make up for oversights as much as you should fix any raws issues. Else it would be mostly impossible to fix things. It just needs to, you know, work from now on.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 01, 2013, 09:09:12 pm
I'm just trying to trim the error log and I've hit a pair of walls.
First of all...
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/inorganic_DOOM_laularu.txt"
Unrecognized CE_BLEEDING token: 5
Code: [Select]
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:20000:PROB:100:BP:BY_TOKEN:ALL:START:5:PEAK:6:END:2500]Tried BY_TOKEN as well as BY_CATEGORY... I don't know if that's the problem, but I just can't seem to get that stupid error to go away. The syntax I'm using SHOULD parse. Should.
Anyway, the other one is...
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_underground_laularu.txt"
PALE_RIDER:Unrecognized Creature Token: MELTING_POINT
PALE_RIDER:Unrecognized Creature Token: BOILING_POINT
PALE_RIDER:Unrecognized Creature Token: IGNITE_POINT
PALE_RIDER:Unrecognized Creature Token: HEATDAM_POINT
PALE_RIDER:Unrecognized Creature Token: COLDDAM_POINT
Code: [Select]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL]
[IF_EXISTS_SET_MELTING_POINT:55000]
[IF_EXISTS_SET_BOILING_POINT:57500]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[COLDDAM_POINT:NONE]The problem is that I basically took that format right out of the vanilla Dragon raws and it CLEARLY works there. :(
Post by: BFEL on July 01, 2013, 10:45:49 pm
Post by: Nahere on July 02, 2013, 12:03:55 am
For this one I think it's parsing it as:
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/inorganic_DOOM_laularu.txt"
Unrecognized CE_BLEEDING token: 5Code: [Select][CE_BLEEDING:SEV:20000:PROB:100:BP:BY_TOKEN:ALL:START:5:PEAK:6:END:2500]
Tried BY_TOKEN as well as BY_CATEGORY... I don't know if that's the problem, but I just can't seem to get that stupid error to go away. The syntax I'm using SHOULD parse. Should.
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:20000:PROB:100:BP:BY_TOKEN:ALL:START:5:PEAK:6:END:2500],
so it isn't sure what the 5 is doing. Try this:
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:20000:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:ALL:START:5:PEAK:6:END:2500].
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 02, 2013, 01:11:24 am
>.> fuckin raws how do they work
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 02:18:03 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
works like what you're probably going for. As for the other thing, is it in the raws AFTER you've added all materials to the creature? Cause it sure sounds like [SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL] is not working and that is not an issue of which materials or bodies you're using.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 09:09:06 am
Code: [Select]
b_detail_plan_insect_STL
[OBJECT:BODY_DETAIL_PLAN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CHITIN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TEMPLATE_STL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:TENDON:TENDON_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:HEMOLYMPH:HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[ADD_TISSUE:CHITIN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TEMPLATE_STL]
[ADD_TISSUE:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:HEART_TISSUE:INSECT_HEART_TEMPLATE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HEAVY_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CHITIN:HEAVY_CHITIN_TEMPLATE_STL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:TENDON:TENDON_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:HEMOLYMPH:HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HEAVY_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[ADD_TISSUE:CHITIN:HEAVY_CHITIN_TEMPLATE_STL]
[ADD_TISSUE:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:HEART_TISSUE:INSECT_HEART_TEMPLATE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER:MUSCLE:100:CHITIN:55]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER:MUSCLE:70:CHITIN:65]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MUSCLE:40:CHITIN:65]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LEG:MUSCLE:70:CHITIN:55]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FOOT:MUSCLE:70:CHITIN:55]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HEART:HEART_TISSUE:75]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:NERVE_TISSUE:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:MAW:MUSCLE:70:CHITIN:25]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:MANDIBLE:MUSCLE:20:CHITIN:40]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ANTENNAE:MUSCLE:20:CHITIN:20]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LOWER_ANTENNA:MUSCLE:20:CHITIN:20]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:UPPER_ANTENNA:MUSCLE:20:CHITIN:20]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BOOK_LUNGS:ORGAN_TISSUE:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:WINGS:CHITIN:15] Insect wings are actually flexible, movable outgrowths of the exoskeleton itself.
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:HEART:100]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:100]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:BOOK_LUNGS:80] they open to the outside directly
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:CREATURE_VARIATION]
The standard sting-bite attacks for bugs
[CREATURE_VARIATION:STING_STL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:STING:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:STINGER]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:sting:stings]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:5]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:400]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:BITE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:MANDIBLE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:10]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:500]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MAW_STL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:BITE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:MAW]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:15]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:450]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:NOBONES]
[CV_NEW_TAG:HAS_NERVES]
[CV_NEW_TAG:GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[CV_NEW_TAG:GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[CV_NEW_TAG:NO_SLEEP]
[CV_NEW_TAG:BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CV_NEW_TAG:GENERAL_BABY_NAME:larva:larvae]
[CV_NEW_TAG:CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:CREATURE_CLASS:INSECT]
[CV_NEW_TAG:CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 09:38:10 am
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:WATER_STRIDER_STL]
[NAME:water strider:water striders:water strider]
[CREATURE_TILE:'S'][COLOR:6:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:A roughly wolf-sized, aquatic arachnid with the disturbing ability to breath air. It has a deadly stinger and a large maw on the underside of its cephalothorax, and prefers fresh meat.]
[PREFSTRING:strength]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[LARGE_PREDATOR][CARNIVORE]
[MUNDANE][CARNIVORE][CHILD:3]
[BODY_SIZE:24500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:8166]
[BODY_SIZE:5:0:24500]
[BODY:4LEG_ARACHNID_STL:MAW_STL:STINGER_STL:CYCLOPS_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:4000]
[AMPHIBIOUS]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:5][FREQUENCY:35]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MAW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:STING_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[BODY_SIZE:7:35500]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
From the Journal of an Entomological God
And on the second day I created the Water Strider. As with the gods before me, I decided to test its combat skill against the Firstborn of the world.
The results were...disappointing. Very...disappointing. It seems I forgot to attach a material to the stinger, thus rendering it useless. So embarrassed was the universe that it refused to refer to my beast by its proper name, and instead called it a "nothing". While I appreciate the Polyphemic potential of such a name, it was most...annoying.
thusly, a question: Why was it referred to as a "nothing" in the testing arena?
EDIT: Something seems to have gone wrong with the tissue layers and it doesn't recognize chitin, that's why they're dying so easily - they're just horrific gangly lumps of muscle!
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 09:57:49 am
Anyway, it's called "nothing" because your creature lacks a caste name. It's needed even if you don't want your castes to be named anything special, and can be defined on the creature level - just add a copy of NAME with the token CASTE_NAME instead below it.
If you need help with the tissues, post the errorlog :)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 10:04:37 am
I got the armor issue and stinger issue fixed, thankfully, and downgraded to fighting ducks. Amusingly enough, you can, in fact, rip the neck out of a mallard - and only the neck. Also a positive: giant water spiders are more than a match for ducks.
EDIT: And halflings are now fully within their capabilities! A suit of organic armor and a spear on your butt does that to you, I guess. Time to give them a syndrome, and I'll be moving right along.
MOAR EDIT: New bug: instead of bleeding hemolymph like I'd intended, it seems Water Striders bleed molten glass. I...I'm not sure how I did that.
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 10:17:18 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 10:19:40 am
"HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STLUnrecognized Material Template Token: MATERIAL"
Upon review of the offending entry, no such token exists, unless it's rejecting the whole entry.
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 10:22:49 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 10:33:34 am
Code: [Select]
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STL] Hemolymph - the gray stuff that fills bugs' insides. "Ichor" - ha! I defy thee, Toady. Name it right.
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:GRAY]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen hemolymph]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen hemolymph]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:BLUE]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:hemolymph]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:hemolyph]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:BLUE]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:spattering hemolymph]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:spattering hemolymph]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:3:0:0]
[SPEC_HEAT:1000]
[MELTING_POINT:10000]
[BOILING_POINT:10180]
[HEATDAM_POINT:10100]
[COLDDAM_POINT:8950] Lower colddam point because hemolymph confers some protection against freezing. Hopefully this will do something.
[LIQUID_DENSITY:1010]
[MAX_EDGE:0]
[IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL]
[ROTS]
[BLOOD_MAP_DESCRIPTOR]
Here it is!
EDIT: I moved the blood definition or whatever from the creature variation to the actual creature, and now it bleeds nothing. I'm uncertain whether this is an improvement, but it seems to at least be a step in the right direction.
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 10:42:25 am
Second, other than that, nothing actually wrong with the hemolymph template it seems. Works fine when you replace halfling blood with it, too. So no idea what's wrong - is your material template file header correct? If that's not it, does the problem still occur if you define blood: hemolymph manually and not with a c variation?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 10:45:20 am
EDIT: Changed "[ADD_MATERIAL:HEMOLYMPH:HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STL]" to "[ADD_MATERIAL:BLOOD:HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STL]" in the body detail plans, and now water striders leave pools of n/a around when they bleed. All should be well soon.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 11:21:38 am
Code: [Select]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:water strider sting]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:WATER_STRIDER_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_NUMBNESS:SEV:100:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:600]
[CE_IMPAIR_FUNCTION:SEV:100:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:5:PEAK:80:END:600]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:70:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:600:PEAK:800:END:1500]
A suitable syndrome to inject hobbits with, for a minor predator. Modding potentially on hold for a few hours due to an opthamologist checkup. I fully intend to add in many more insectile beasties today, including representatives of Formicidae and Hymenoptera.
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 01:09:16 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
More importantly, as discussed above, the next play turn with BFEL's stuff added in is now up for grabs. Holler if you're interested! Whoever wants it first, gets it!
If we don't get takers, then it's up to BFEL to demonstrate his additions.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 02:21:40 pm
Wasp swarms I have planned. Gods help the Halflings.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 02:50:52 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:VESPULA_STL]
[NAME:vespula:vespulae:vespula]
[CASTE_NAME:vespula:vespulae:vespula]
[CREATURE_TILE:'V'][COLOR:6:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A swarming, omnivorous species of giant wasplike organisms. Their numbers and painful stings make them a foe to beware.]
[BODY_SIZE:16500]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:4000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:16500]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:15:25][FREQUENCY:30]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[LARGE_ROAMING][MUNDANE]
[BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MAW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:STING_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:ANT_TENNAE_STL:WINGS_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:STINGER_STL:4EYES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen vespula venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen vespula venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:vespula venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:vespula venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling vespula venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling vespula venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:vespula sting]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:VESPULA_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_IMPAIR_FUNCTION:SEV:100:PROB:50:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:5:PEAK:80:END:600]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:100:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:1800]
[CE_SWELLING:SEV:70:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:2400]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
Ladies and gentlemen, the Vespulae. Weapons testing in progress.
EDIT:
From the Journal of an Entomological God
My first version of the Vespulae, intended to be a swarming predator...does not seem to be able to breathe. Or see. Or, for that matter, stand. I suspect I made an error somewhere...nobody ever said Creation would be this...annoying...at God College. But then, they were competent there.
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 03:13:56 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 03:21:13 pm
Also, I am honored :D
EDIT: Yeah, Test Vespula #3 would probably be saying rude things to you if he could breathe. However, it did change my errorlog, and it seems that the game is somehow having difficulty fitting his brain inside his head. I imagine that could be a problem.
The rest of the new stuff:
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/material_template_organic_STL.txt"
HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STLUnrecognized Material Template Token: MATERIAL
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_insects_wild_STL.txt"
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: ANT_TENNAE_STL
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: MANDIBLES_STL
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: 4EYES_STL
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: BRAIN_STL
VESPULA_STL:Attack BITE seems to have correct format but could not find proper BPs in any caste, so not added
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature WATER_STRIDER_STL
WATER_STRIDER_STL:FEMALE:eye: No tissue thickness
WATER_STRIDER_STL:FEMALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
WATER_STRIDER_STL:MALE:eye: No tissue thickness
WATER_STRIDER_STL:MALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature VESPULA_STL
VESPULA_STL:FEMALE:right hindleg: No tissue thickness
VESPULA_STL:FEMALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
VESPULA_STL:MALE:right hindleg: No tissue thickness
VESPULA_STL:MALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
Cannot generate random creatures -- missing body gloss RCP_GLOSS_PAW
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/material_template_organic_STL.txt"
HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STLUnrecognized Material Template Token: MATERIAL
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_insects_wild_STL.txt"
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: ANT_TENNAE_STL
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: MANDIBLES_STL
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: 4EYES_STL
VESPULA_STL:Body Token Recognized But Could Not Connect: BRAIN_STL
VESPULA_STL:Attack BITE seems to have correct format but could not find proper BPs in any caste, so not added
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature WATER_STRIDER_STL
WATER_STRIDER_STL:FEMALE:eye: No tissue thickness
WATER_STRIDER_STL:FEMALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
WATER_STRIDER_STL:MALE:eye: No tissue thickness
WATER_STRIDER_STL:MALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature VESPULA_STL
VESPULA_STL:FEMALE:right hindleg: No tissue thickness
VESPULA_STL:FEMALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
VESPULA_STL:MALE:right hindleg: No tissue thickness
VESPULA_STL:MALE:heart, layer 1: Tissue HEART_TISSUE was not found, using first tissue instead
and at the end is the usual fussy code bit complaining about the random creatures and its inadequacies in making them, but nobody cares.
EDIT2: The old stuff, if still relevant, was whining that no tissue thickness had been assigned to any body parts on the Vespula, but I think that got solved by moving the BODY token in the raw.
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 03:36:23 pm
Also I did notice your body templates not making tissue layers to create eyes earlier, but I figured maybe you'll make them out of nerve tissue or something, or maybe insects aren't supposed to have working eyes. Apparently they don't have anything to make up the heart either.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 03:50:34 pm
I'll try the head thing. Maybe Test Vespula #7 will be able to draw breath.
EDIT: :D LIFE! That did the trick, thanks!
Now, to kill it in more imaginative ways...
EDIT2:
From the Journal of an Entomological God
Is there anything more beautiful than the keening death wail of a Quetzalcoatlus? A sound few have heard, true, but in the arena today I have heard it. The Vespulae worked together in a pack, dueling the storm dragon in a battle that took them to the highest reaches of the "sky", swarming the megabeast. Though two of the five were smote from the air by wing blows, one of their brethren managed to sting the beast in the back of the head and pump its nerve-igniting venom into the wound. It was all over then; the Quetzalcoatlus plummeted from the sky under the searing weight of a dozen Vespula stings, and as it lay broken on the cold stone the swarm reformed above it and continued to sting him until he finally gave his death shriek. Beautiful.
Against armored halflings, they are similarly effective. The lack of appreciable armor technology amongst the foolish hobbits does not help them. I deem these specimens worthy.
We've got some good titles right now. The Vespula that killed the Quetzalcoatlus received the rather awesome name "Bluereaver" - fitting, considering the location of the duel.
Post by: BFEL on July 02, 2013, 03:59:24 pm
If we don't get takers, then it's up to BFEL to demonstrate his additions.
OH GODDAMN FUCKBUCKETS
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 04:05:27 pm
If we don't get takers, then it's up to BFEL to demonstrate his additions.
OH GODDAMN FUCKBUCKETS
Dude, you're supposed to make stuff you yourself are comfortable playing. Modding is fun but it's not a game about only that :P
Every turn must be followed by a play turn to make sure it all works so far and for everyone's entertainment. It's more fun if we can get a player who didn't mod it so things come as a surprise, but if not, then not.
I suppose that turn will be playing as halflings since elves aren't playable, and repelling incursions by naked, unarmed elves and their tree lords.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 04:08:21 pm
If we don't get takers, then it's up to BFEL to demonstrate his additions.
OH GODDAMN FUCKBUCKETS
Feel happy you don't have to come up against the Vespulae. In a group of 5, they killed a megabeast. They're set to spawn in swarms of between 15 and 25.
I'm thinking I should reduce the strength of "light" chitin, too. It can take a blow from a meteoric iron cudgel in the hands of a trained Halfling and only suffer a dent.
I'm moving from deadly predators to more benign insects now. Pack beetles and shearable giant bumblebees are up next, followed by milkable giant aphids.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 02, 2013, 04:21:29 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 02, 2013, 04:23:20 pm
Isn't it a bit much, to have common roving wild animals stronger than megabeasts?
Megabeasts will probably be more along the lines of Rarebeasts... we must have the language define 'mega' as 'rare'.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 04:32:13 pm
Isn't it a bit much, to have common roving wild animals stronger than megabeasts?
My thought exactly, which is why I'm reducing chitin strength. Honestly, though, the megabeast lost because it was swarmed by five stinging giant wasps - I tried a one-on-one battle, and it picked up the Vespula and hurled it bodily across the arena, where it lay stunned against a wall until he came over and squashed it. Alone, they're manageable - but like the wasps I based them on, in groups they're just plain evil.
Post by: Halfling on July 02, 2013, 04:38:12 pm
That way:
a) It doesn't bother players just trying to survive in a calm biome
b) If you want a challenge, you can by your own choice head over to a savage biome and have
c) The variety in the world increases
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 02, 2013, 08:07:38 pm
Code: [Select]
creature_underground_laularu
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:PALE_RIDER]
[DESCRIPTION:A hellish beast composed of molten stone. The source of their power and life force is an incredibly hot stone at their core. They were once fearsome reapers who have since fallen out of favor with the gods and are cursed to wander the underworld forever.]
[NAME:pale rider:pale riders:pale rider]
[CASTE_NAME:pale rider:pale riders:pale riders]
[PREFSTRING:magmaline cores]
[PREFSTRING:extreme heat]
[CREATURE_TILE:'R'][COLOR:4:0:1]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID][CREATURE_CLASS:ELEMENTAL]
[LITTERSIZE:1:3][BABY:1][CHILD:2][HOMEOTHERM:12500]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:halfling child:halfling children]
[FIREIMMUNE_SUPER][LIKES_FIGHTING][MAGMA_VISION]
[IMMOLATE]
[FANCIFUL]
[LARGE_ROAMING]
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_LAVA]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:3:4]
[FREQUENCY:1][DIFFICULTY:2]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:25:100]
[NOPAIN][EXTRAVISION][NOBREATHE][NOSTUN][NONAUSEA][NOEMOTION]
[NOTHOUGHT][NOEXERT]
[NO_DIZZINESS]
[NO_FEVERS]
[FIXED_TEMP:12500]
[BUILDINGDESTROYER:2]
[LARGE_PREDATOR]
[NO_DRINK][NO_EAT][NO_SLEEP]
[NOT_LIVING]
[CANOPENDOORS]
[NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[NOFEAR]
[PREFSTRING:flowing movement]
[NOBONES]
####################################################################################### Needs to be totally overhauled so it's not vanilla anymore (EDIT needs to be fixed now, is no longer vanilla)
[BODY:HUMANOID_ELEMENTAL_LKR:ELEMENT_CORE_LKR]
[NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT]
[TISSUE:MAGMA]
[TISSUE_NAME:magma:NP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:ROCK_HLG]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:LIQUID]
[MUSCULAR]
[FUNCTIONAL]
[STRUCTURAL]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:20]
[HEALING_RATE:85]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:MAGMA]
[TISSUE:CORE]
[TISSUE_NAME:magmaline core:NP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:MAGMALINE_LKR]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:SOLID]
[FUNCTIONAL]
[STRUCTURAL]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:ELEMENT_CORE:CORE]
#####################################################################################
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:70000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[ITEMCORPSE:STONE:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:MAGMALINE_LKR]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL]
[MELTING_POINT:55000]
[BOILING_POINT:57500]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[COLDDAM_POINT:NONE]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:6]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:breathe solar fire]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]
[CDI:VERB:shoot a jet of solar fire:shoots a jet of solar fire:shoots a jet of solar fire]
[CDI:BP_REQUIRED:ELEMENT_CORE_LKR]
[CDI:FLOW:DRAGONFIRE]
[CASTE:FEMALE][FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE][MALE]Code: [Select]
[BODY:HUMANOID_ELEMENTAL_LKR]
[BP:TORSO:torso:STP][UPPERBODY][CATEGORY:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1200]
[BP:ABDOMEN:abdomen:STP][CON:TORSO][LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:ABDOMEN]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:HEAD:head:STP][CON:TORSO][HEAD][CATEGORY:HEAD]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:FACE:face:STP][CON:HEAD][SMALL][CATEGORY:FACE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:REYE:right eye:STP][CON:FACE][SIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][RIGHT][CATEGORY:EYE] ##used DF's bp so maybe glow will work
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:10]
[BP:LEYE:left eye:STP][CON:FACE][SIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][LEFT][CATEGORY:EYE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:10]
[BP:NOSE:nose:STP][CON:FACE][SMELL][SMALL][CATEGORY:NOSE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:10]
[BP:MOUTH:mouth:STP][CON:FACE][MOUTH][INTERNAL][SMALL][APERTURE][CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:40]
[BP:RARM:right arm:STP][CON:TORSO][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:600]
[BP:LARM:left arm:STP][CON:TORSO][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:600]
[BP:RHAND:right hand:STP][CON:RARM][GRASP][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:LHAND:left hand:STP][CON:LARM][GRASP][LEFT][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:RLEG:right leg:STP][CON:ABDOMEN][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LLEG:left leg:STP][CON:ABDOMEN][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:LEG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:RFOOT:right foot:right feet][CON:RLEG][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:120]
[BP:LFOOT:left foot:left feet][CON:LLEG][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:120]
[BODY:ELEMENT_CORE_LKR]
[BP:ELEMENT_CORE:elemental core:STP][CON:TORSO][SMALL][INTERNAL][CATEGORY:ELEMENT_CORE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:75]
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 09:07:31 pm
Code: [Select]
And now for some less terrifying things!
[CREATURE:PACK_BEETLE_STL]
[NAME:pack beetle:pack beetles:pack beetle]
[CASTE_NAME:pack beetle:pack beetles:pack beetle]
[CREATURE_TILE:'B'][COLOR:1:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:A typically docile, large beetle, used as a pack animal by merchants due to its impressive endurance.]
[PREFSTRING:unyielding persistence][PREFSTRING:stubbornness and tenacity]
[BODY_SIZE:2495000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:166333]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:499000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:180:1497000]
[BODY_SIZE:4:0:2495000]
[BODY:BEETLE_BASE_STL:ANTENNAE_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:BEETLE_WINGS_STL:2EYES_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:4:6][FREQUENCY:40]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[LARGE_ROAMING][MUNDANE][CHILD:3][NATURAL][COMMON_DOMESTIC]
[BIOME:NOT_FREEZING][POPULATION_NUMBER:9000:13000]
[GRAZER:120]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[PET][PACK_ANIMAL][WAGON_PULLER]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:STING_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[CREATURE:BOMBUS_STL]
[NAME:bombus:bombuses:bombus]
[CASTE_NAME:bombus:bombuses:bombus]
[CREATURE_TILE:'b'][COLOR:6:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION: A large, landbound beelike insect with a long wooly coat.]
[PREFSTRING:wooly coats][PREFSTRING:adorable features, and wants you to stop laughing]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:WINGS_STL:STINGER_STL:2EYES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL:MANDIBLES_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:635000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:79375]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:158750]
[BODY_SIZE:4:0:317500]
[BODY_SIZE:6:0:635000]
[CHILD:5]
[LARGE_ROAMING][PET][ALL_ACTIVE]
[BIOME:NOT_FREEZING][MUNDANE][NATURAL][COMMON_DOMESTIC]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:4:7][POPULATION_NUMBER:4000:7000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:FLUFFY_BUG_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:STING_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL] copied wholesale from sheep, then tweaked slightly.
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:WOOL]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:YELLOW:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:fuzz:SINGULAR]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:fuzz:SINGULAR]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:300:0:0:NO_END]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:10:50:100:150:200:300]
[SHEARABLE_TISSUE_LAYER:LENGTH:300]
And the latest two insectile beasties to emerge from the divine forge, whose operator seems to have finally stumbled into competence (no glaring, species-extinct-at-birth errors! Hooray!). The Bombus is a fuzzy giant bumblebee who can be sheared to make fuzzy woolen sweaters for the hobbits. The Pack Beetle is a beetle the size of a rhino that can be employed to lug all the shit we haven't gotten around to modding in around. These are the first two things I've made that don't have the sole intent to make life a buzzing hell for the natives.
Up next will be the glorious Vermin Hunter we've all needed - a lovely, slightly oversized version of the venerable Goliath Bird-Eating Spider.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 02, 2013, 09:17:55 pm
And the latest two insectile beasties to emerge from the divine forge, whose operator seems to have finally stumbled into competence (no glaring, species-extinct-at-birth errors! Hooray!). The Bombus is a fuzzy giant bumblebee who can be sheared to make fuzzy woolen sweaters for the hobbits. The Pack Beetle is a beetle the size of a rhino that can be employed to lug all the shit we haven't gotten around to modding in around. These are the first two things I've made that don't have the sole intent to make life a buzzing hell for the natives.
Up next will be the glorious Vermin Hunter we've all needed - a lovely, slightly oversized version of the venerable Goliath Bird-Eating Spider.
Themes of turns, so far as I can figure out
Halfling: Initial Chaos worked into Order
BFEL: Parasite Elves and their Overlords
St.Leibowitz: Insectoid and Insectoid-devouring creatures
Laularukyrumo: (Too early for me to tell)
Zanzetkuken (me): Reptilians and Draconic creatures
Feel free to add to this list.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 02, 2013, 09:47:05 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:THERAPHOSA_STL]
[NAME:theraphosa:theraphosae:theraphosa]
[CASTE_NAME:theraphosa:theraphosae:theraphosa]
[CREATURE_TILE:'T'][COLOR:6:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:A mid-sized, tame tarantula, valued for its diet, which consists almost solely of pests.]
[PREFSTRING:vigilance][PREFSTRING:ability to eat vermin]
[BODY:BASIC_ARACHNID_STL:4EYES_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:70000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:23333]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:70000]
[CHILD:2]
[VERMINHUNTER]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD]
[PET][COMMON_DOMESTIC][MUNDANE]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen theraphosa venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen theraphosa venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:theraphosa venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:theraphosa venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling theraphosa venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling theraphosa venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:theraphosa bite
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:THERAPHOSA_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:50:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:300]
[CE_SWELLING:SEV:30:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:5:PEAK:90:END:1800]
Vermin hunter! The Theraphosa, a spider massing in at around one cougar that likes to munch upon annoying vermins. Basically, it's a cat in spider form, and is able to also kill a halfling (it was close, though - it won thanks to the wimpy halfling fainting from the pain of a neck wound). Somebody better add in some amazing metals and some genuine armor, because hobbits are exceptionally fragile. As of now, there isn't any armor that I see in the Arena; I intend to make chitin armor a reality during my turn, so that should help their survivability.
EDIT: read some more about cougar size. Yeah...this fellow's likely to shrink.
EDIT2: Unrelated, but in minor combat testing for my own amusement I discovered that Treelords are remarkably resilient to Vespulae, to the point that six of them are having great difficulty actually killing one. The treelord is missing most of his sap, it seems, and isn't fighting back anymore, but he's perfectly able to run around and continue living.
EDIT3: Nevermind, it actually just killed one of its attackers. BFEL, what have you created? It can resist the swarm where even a Quetzalcoatlus fell!
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 02, 2013, 10:50:31 pm
I do have one eeeeeeeeeeeevil plan in the works, but I'm still running some tests to see if it's even viable before I start construction.
On that note, anybody care to tell me wtf is wrong with the Pale Rider? Because it REALLY shouldn't be having those problems... I do NOT want to have to define a specific material template for it, instead of just telling it to use the generic rock like I'm trying. It doesn't like me giving it dragonfire immunity.
I wonder if, since there's only two materials, if I could select them individually. I'm gonna try that and see if it works.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 02, 2013, 10:58:26 pm
On that note, anybody care to tell me wtf is wrong with the Pale Rider? Because it REALLY shouldn't be having those problems... I do NOT want to have to define a specific material template for it, instead of just telling it to use the generic rock like I'm trying. It doesn't like me giving it dragonfire immunity.
No need to define the materials differently, just add [FIREIMMUNE_SUPER] and you should be fine.
Post by: BFEL on July 02, 2013, 11:17:04 pm
Feel happy you don't have to come up against the Vespulae. In a group of 5, they killed a megabeast.
HAHAHAHA
A Treelord (as in a single one) can fight a Storm Dragon.
The Storm Dragon won, but still, its pretty bad.
Also the Storm dragon won by SUFFOCATING THE TREE.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 02, 2013, 11:23:08 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 02, 2013, 11:26:57 pm
I'm thinking that the problem might be that I didn't actually declare a material explicitly, simply telling the tissue layer to use a material that's been predefined, which would mean it doesn't have an identifier. That's annoying, because I might have to go out of my way to do things.
EDIT: I'm trying a new approach and getting an error that I don't even understand.
Code: [Select]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:LIVING_MAGMA:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[TISSUE:MAGMA]
[TISSUE_NAME:magma:NP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LIVING_MAGMA]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:LIQUID]
[MUSCULAR]
[FUNCTIONAL]
[STRUCTURAL]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:20]
[HEALING_RATE:85]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:MAGMA]results in the following from errorlog.txt:
PALE_RIDER:MAGMA:Unrecognized Material Token:
PALE_RIDER:Creature Tissue Material Failure: MAGMA:(no mat1):(no mat3):(no mat3)
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 01:47:22 am
Laula, it doesn't know what material you're trying to tell it to use.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 02:17:52 am
Suggested fix: Make treelords actually have sap as blood as is probably intended anyway, so they can bleed out if enough of their tissue is damaged. This makes a bunch of people with axes able to kill them.
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SAP:LIQUID]
There's still the issue of treelord bleeding sap, bark, layer sap and even body parts being called "skin" or "molten skin". This is caused by the malformed token [ADD_MATERIAL:WOOD:ELFWOOD] in b_detail_plan_bfel. What you mean is [ADD_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL] and that makes them tree materials again.
Frankly I'm a little miffed that I have to be finding and fixing this stuff since these problems were 9001% obvious if you ever put a treelord in an arena.
Post by: BFEL on July 03, 2013, 05:51:22 am
K. I think there's something wrong with the treelord. Namely, it is incredibly resistant to just dying, probably more than is intentional considering 30 halflings, some with axes and some with bows, simply could not take ONE treelord down.
Suggested fix: Make treelords actually have sap as blood as is probably intended anyway, so they can bleed out if enough of their tissue is damaged. This makes a bunch of people with axes able to kill them.
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SAP:LIQUID]
There's still the issue of treelord bleeding sap, bark, layer sap and even body parts being called "skin" or "molten skin". This is caused by the malformed token [ADD_MATERIAL:WOOD:ELFWOOD] in b_detail_plan_bfel. What you mean is [ADD_MATERIAL:ELFWOOD:ELFWOOD_TEMPLATE_BFEL] and that makes them tree materials again.
Frankly I'm a little miffed that I have to be finding and fixing this stuff since these problems were 9001% obvious if you ever put a treelord in an arena.
HEY! I put lots of them in arenas, and I never had the specific problems your talking about, I never saw any body parts called "skin" or "molten skin" in any of my tests.
I did have a couple of "plant slurry" but that was because I initially tried using some of YOUR stuff in defining them....and that didn't work too well, so I THOUGHT I scrapped that part and made everything effectively made of the elfwood, since the errors that I was getting pretty much did that anyway.
And yes, I realize there are a bunch of bugs and stuff in the code still, and I'm sorry you ended up fixing so many of them, but I'm kinda new at the whole "from scratch" thing, what with defining materials and tissues and whatnot, and quite frankly, I didn't even know about errorlog till you told me, so you clearly have a HUGE amount of experience over me, at least in those areas.
Frankly I think I did pretty decent for a first run with all this.
Also the Treelords ARE supposed to be crazy hard to kill, granted I did intend for them to be able to bleed out, but I certainly did intend for a small army of halflings to have a hard time with it. Especially since its also hard for the Treelord to kill things, seeing as it acts only once for about every 20 turns of anything else :P
To top that off, Treelords aren't even supposed to be going into combat all that often, I expected them to MAYBE be seen once in a typical forts lifetime, and only if said fort was at war with the elves to begin with. They are supposed to rely on the elves as shocktroopers and if shit gets REALLY fucked, THEN maybe one will lead a bunch of elves to war.
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 06:40:06 am
Considering they have UTTERANCES, they are ALWAYS at war with you. They make up 20% of elf population IIRC, and sieges do bring dozens of creatures - you will see them.
PM'd sculleywr about playing.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 08:15:17 am
KK. My bad I guess. They are crazy hard to kill even if they can die from tissue damage though, they don't need to be mobile giant sponges. :P
Considering they have UTTERANCES, they are ALWAYS at war with you. They make up 20% of elf population IIRC, and sieges do bring dozens of creatures - you will see them.
PM'd sculleywr about playing.
Didn't he make a noble position for the treelords exclusively? That could help with preventing them from arriving like the babbling kobold shocktroopers of the God of Sponges. Mainly, I'm just in awe that they can withstand a vespulae swarm. As is fitting, only fire can adequately deal with these wooden monstrosities.
Goal for today: Milkable mega-aphid that produces honeydew, then a dragonfly vermin-eater to make use of "DIVE_HUNTS_VERMIN", and probably a few large and violent spiders. Then I'll take a peek at the world itself and see what we've got in the way of flora and fishes.
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 08:40:50 am
Meanwhile I'm building some language utilities... should have some pretty comprehensive non-Toady-made language files shortly. I'll also make a script for creating translations.
Spoiler: teaser (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 09:22:15 am
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:APHIDIDA_STL]
[NAME:aphidida:aphididae:aphidida]
[CASTE_NAME:aphidida:aphididae:aphidida]
[CREATURE_TILE:'A'][COLOR:2:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A large aphidlike creature, domesticated and tamed for its valued ability to produce the liquid honeydew.]
[PREFSTRING:delicious excrement][PREFSTRING:bulbous appearance]
[BODY:BEETLE_BASE_STL:2EYES_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:PROBOSCIS_STL:ANTENNAE_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:70000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:14000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:23333]
[BODY_SIZE:5:0:70000]
[CHILD:3]
[GRAZER:100]
[PET][COMMON_DOMESTIC][MUNDANE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[BIOME:ANY_FOREST][CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:7][POPULATION_NUMBER:4000:6000]
[LARGE_ROAMING][FLEEQUICK]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_PROBOSCIS_SUCK_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:HONEYDEW:ANIMAL_LIQUID_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen honeydew]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen honeydew]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:honeydew]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:honeydew]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling honeydew]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling honeydew]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[MILKABLE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HONEYDEW:9600] Both can be milked, as honeydew is basically aphid poop, and both sexes produce excrement.
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
The aphidida! No, I didn't just mess up the word "aphid". This is genuinely a taxonomical family for the little guys, which is how I've been naming the others.
Its delicious excrement should help halflings survive long winters when the river freezes solid and they've gotten distracted and forgotten to build a reservoir. They do tend to be a bit skittish, even though mano-a-mano they can end a vespula in a few hits. The might of the swarm is preserved, though - five vespula put an aphidida down permanently, because despite it not being dead, you don't really ever recover from brain rot.
EDIT: Ingame test confirms that aphididas can be milked properly. The halflings, however, didn't quite seem to grasp "fuzz" as shearable, and instead just peeled off the Bombus's entire abdomen exoskeleton. Bugfixing phase entered before spider-forging phase can commence.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 12:21:01 pm
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:BREW_HONEYWINE]
[NAME:brew honeywine]
[BUILDING:STILL:CUSTOM_M]
[REAGENT:A:30:LIQUID_MISC:NONE:CREATURE_MAT:APHIDIDA_STL:HONEYDEW][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:A_HOLDER:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][CONTAINS:A][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[REAGENT:B_HOLDER:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][FOOD_STORAGE_CONTAINER][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[PRODUCT:100:5:DRINK:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:A:DRINK_MAT][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:B_HOLDER][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:BREWING]
I modified the Halfling entity so they could do this. Any objection that I shouldn't have done this?
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 12:59:15 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 02:00:50 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:SALTICIDA_STL]
[NAME:salticida:salticidae:salticida]
[CASTE_NAME:salticida:salticidae:salticida]
[CREATURE_TILE:'S'][COLOR:2:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:A wolf-sized spider of the forest. It tends to hunt in packs and spins thick webs to trap prey.]
[PREFSTRING:silken webs][PREFSTRING:terrifying features]
[BODY:BASIC_ARACHNID_STL:4EYES_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:44000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:11000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:22000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:44000]
[CHILD:1]
[PET_EXOTIC][MUNDANE][LIKES_FIGHTING]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[BIOME:ANY_FOREST][CLUSTER_NUMBER:4:5][POPULATION_NUMBER:400:1000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[BODYGLOSS:CHELICERAE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SILK:SPIDER_SILK_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:silk]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:silk]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:unset silk]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:unset silk]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:ash]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:ash]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[WEBBER:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SILK][THICKWEB][WEBIMMUNE]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Spray web]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:BP_REQUIRED:BY_TOKEN:LB]
[CDI:MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SILK:WEB_SPRAY]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:5]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:60]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen salticida venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen salticida venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:salticida venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:salticida venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling salticida venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling salticida venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:salticida bite]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:SALTICIDA_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:50:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:300]
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:50:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:40:PEAK:120]
[CREATURE:AASIAAT_STL]
[NAME:aasiaat:aasiaat:aasiaat]
[CASTE_NAME:aasiaat:aasiaat:aasiaat]
[CREATURE_TILE:'S'][COLOR:3:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A large spider native to the colder regions of the world, and adept in using its environment for ambush. Its icy venom inflicts damage similar to frostbite.]
[PREFSTRING:icy gaze]
[BODY:BASIC_ARACHNID_STL:4EYES_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:66000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:16500]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:33000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:66000]
[CHILD:1]
[BIOME:GLACIER][BIOME:TUNDRA]
[PET_EXOTIC][MUNDANE][LIKES_FIGHTING]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:4:6][POPULATION_NUMBER:600:2000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[BODYGLOSS:CHELICERAE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen aasiaat venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen aasiaat venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:aasiaat venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:aasiaat venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling aasiaat venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling aasiaat venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:aasiaat bite]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:AASIAAT_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:60:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:7200]
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:60:PROB:60:LOCALIZED:START:2400:PEAK:3600:END:7000]
[CE_BLISTERS:SEV:50:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:60:PEAK:120:END:2400]
[CE_NUMBNESS:SEV:80:PROB:70:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:5:PEAK:1200:END:2400]
Glaciers, however, might still be a bad idea, for those are stalked by the Aasiaat spider. I'm still fiddling with the interaction that would let them camouflage themselves, but they will have it eventually, fear not.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 03, 2013, 02:50:54 pm
Also, fucking tissues. Local creature mat, of course. GRRRRRRR
Now to see if I can properly load in the pertinent properties with the little addition. Hopefully this beast will be done and then I can get back to more inorganics.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 03:12:10 pm
Also, more spider! This time for the caverns:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:NEPHILA]
[NAME:nephila:nephilae:nephila]
[CASTE_NAME:nephila:nephilae:nephila]
[CREATURE_TILE:'S'][COLOR:6:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A large spider found in the deepest caverns, where it spins webs of the purest gold. They are relatively non-aggressive, and their chitin comes in a wide variety of hues.]
[PREFSTRING:glittering webs][PREFSTRING:ethereal beauty]
[BODY:BASIC_ARACHNID_STL:4EYES_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:27000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:3:0:5400]
[BODY_SIZE:6:0:10000]
[BODY_SIZE:12:20000]
[BODY_SIZE:15:27000]
[CHILD:6]
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_CHASM][CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:7][POPULATION_NUMBER:200:500]
[LARGE_ROAMING][MEANDERER][CAVE_ADAPT]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[BODYGLOSS:CHELICERAE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_NEPHILAE_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:GOLDEN_WEB:GOLDEN_WEB_SILK_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:aurum]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:aurum]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:liquid aurum]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:liquid aurum]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:aurum vapor]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:aurum vapor]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[WEBBER:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:GOLDEN_WEB][WEBIMMUNE]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Spray web]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:BP_REQUIRED:BY_TOKEN:LB]
[CDI:MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:GOLDEN_WEB:WEB_SPRAY]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:5]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:60]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen nephila venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen nephila venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:nephila venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:nephila venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling nephila venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling nephila venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:nephila bite]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:NEPHILA_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:60:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:3600] You'll be put out for a couple of days if you get bit by this guy.
[CE_BLISTERS:SEV:50:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:60:PEAK:120:END:2400]
The Nephilae, golden web-weavers below the world's surface. Golden spider silk has the strength of gold and can be woven into fabric for clothes, so this should also aid halflings in surviving, and doing it stylishly...if they can find the Nephilae.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 03, 2013, 04:01:11 pm
I will, however, be adding at least one creature to the third caverns... mwehehehe
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 04:27:16 pm
I have almost finished creating a new, 50 000 word vocabulary for DF (Toady's is slightly over 2000 words). Wrote a script to mine it from http://scrabble.wonderhowto.com/inspiration/ultimate-scrabble-word-list-resource-0115617/ , especially Rebekka Slivka's theme word lists (Thanks).
It's still a little buggy (no idea why so many tigers are called Flossier) and I'm not sure if it's the best thing ever or a little stupid:
(http://s23.postimg.org/pkcmgh0rv/whoah_halfling_names.png)
Anyway, I'll upload my KING SIZE DWARVEN DICT with the tools used to make it when it's no longer buggy, and make some more scripts to create languages and symbols based on it since you obviously don't want to define that many words by hand. I'm not sure if an added vocabulary that's this big exists before. Then can decide whether should use with this mod.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 03, 2013, 04:50:54 pm
Anyway. Error logs done! Now time for arena testing....
First thing I noticed. One Rider vs Six Halflings....
Halfling 6 throws a rock!
Halfling 5 throws a rock!
Halfling 3 throws a rock!
Halfling 2 throws a rock!
Halfling 1 throws a rock!
The spinning rock strikes You in the abdomen and the severed part sails off in an arc!
You have been shot and killed.
So that's a thing. I was worried about that... I'm thinking it might just be that tissues in the liquid state with no solid pieces are really easy to sever. Those were unskilled unarmed halflings. I might have to go with the solid-but-fixed-temp, or give it a non-molten skeleton. That's a little annoying, I was hoping to avoid that particular problem. It was, however, highly amusing. About ten seconds AFTER it happened. :P
Post by: mastahcheese on July 03, 2013, 04:51:42 pm
I would definitely want to try this out.
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 05:22:02 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Let's hope I can figure out what's causing the names to go partially blank. I'm thinking it might be a lack of symbols and some duplicate words that have managed to sneak in (my system has the plural as the default form, but apparently some things, 190 words in total, have similar plurals but different singulars in these dictionaries, which is why they weren't weeded by the check for duplicates?) which are filling the errorlog, but it might also be that DF just can't handle this much stuff in which case it's a bust.
Post by: Halfling on July 03, 2013, 05:35:39 pm
Wow, just wow.
I would definitely want to try this out.
Shall I sign you up? :)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 05:57:12 pm
What.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 03, 2013, 06:20:06 pm
Yes, for modding or for playing, either one.Wow, just wow.Shall I sign you up? :)
I would definitely want to try this out.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 03, 2013, 08:13:05 pm
Pale Rider testing shows that they're vicious in unarmed combat with most things, but they're fairly fragile. However, if you don't take them out, they'll get away and recover fairly swiftly with their Healing Rate of like, 10 or 20. It's crazy. However, Storm Dragons and Man-Eaters pretty much lop limbs off with each strike--though it's dangerous, because they're perpetually burning. Also, once I fixed a tiny problem with the CDI tags on the dragonfire emission (renamed to Solar Fire since it's clearly not dragon-exclusive anymore), the Storm Dragon that attacked it literally melted to nothing. It was awesome. Ranged attacks are recommended now. ;)
I might change to just regular fire if I get too many complaints about pale riders being impossible to kill, though.
I found a problem with the treelords, though. Namely, they can't resurrect elves properly. The elf is revived and immediately bleeds to death. This may or may not have something to do with the method of death--namely, combat with a Pale Rider--but it's notable to mention. I also definitely saw the Molten Skin problem.... Also, Elven by-products are occasionally referred to by the creature name and not the caste name. !!Treelord Muscle!! existed from me butchering the elf corpse to stop the spam from happening.
EDIT: Yeah, they still burn to death pretty hardcore from firejets.... I changed DRAGONFIRE to FIREJET and while the storm dragon got close enough to behead the Pale Rider in one shot, it still burned to death eventually. Dragonfire just instantly disintegrates anything. I made them breathe fire a lot less frequently, too--they were set to wait_period of 100, and now they're at 1000. For comparison, vanilla dragons have wait_period 50.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 08:29:42 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:SEA_SCORPION_STL]
[NAME:sea scorpion:sea scorpions:sea scorpion]
[CASTE_NAME:sea scorpion:sea scorpions:sea scorpion]
[CREATURE_TILE:'s'][COLOR:4:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A man-sized predator that swims the open ocean. It bears a slight resemblance to its landbound counterpart, but cannot sting - instead, its spiny legs are used as weapons.]
[PREFSTRING:graceful swimming]
[BODY:SEA_SCORPION_BASE_STL:SEA_SCORPION_SPINES_STL:2EYES_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:BRAIN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:70000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:10000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:30000]
[BODY_SIZE:4:0:50000]
[BODY_SIZE:6:0:70000]
[CHILD:5][ALL_ACTIVE]
[LIKES_FIGHTING][LARGE_PREDATOR]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD]
[AQUATIC][UNDERSWIM][IMMOBILE_LAND]
[BODYGLOSS:CHELICERAE_STL]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:500]
[NO_DRINK][CARNIVORE]
[MUNDANE][CLUSTER_NUMBER:2:3][POPULATION_NUMBER:200:300]
[BIOME:ANY_OCEAN][FREQUENCY:30]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[ATTACK:CLUB:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:PODOMERE]
[ATTACK_VERB:club:clubs]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:150]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[CREATURE:SEA_ANT_STL]
[NAME:sea ant:sea ants:sea ant]
[CASTE_NAME:sea ant:sea ants:sea ant]
[DESCRIPTION:Antlike creatures that frolic through the oceans, serving as a food source for creatures larger than them.]
[CREATURE_TILE:172][COLOR:4:9:0]
[BODY:VERMIN_BODY_HLG]
[PREFSTRING:meatball-like characteristics]
[VERMIN_FISH][FISHITEM][IMMOBILE_LAND][VERMIN_NOTRAP][VERMIN_GROUNDER]
[MUNDANE][NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[BIOME:ANY_OCEAN][POPULATION_NUMBER:1000:1500]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD]
[BODY_SIZE:100]
[NO_DRINK]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:1500] They're like rocket-propelled meatballs!
[CASTE:QUEEN]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE_NAME:sea ant queen:sea ant queens:sea ant queen]
[POP_RATIO:1]
[CASTE:DRONE]
[MALE]
[CASTE_NAME:sea ant drone:sea ant drones:sea ant drone]
[POP_RATIO:10]
[CASTE:WORKER]
[CASTE_NAME:sea ant worker:sea ant workers:sea ant worker]
[POP_RATIO:1000]
[CREATURE:AMMONITE_STL] Rocket-propelled meatballs with shells!
[NAME:ammonite:ammonites:ammonite]
[CASTE_NAME:ammonite:ammonites:ammonite]
[DESCRIPTION:A shelled, squidlike organism, that drifts happily around the ocean, until it gets netted and pried out of its shell by halflings.]
[CREATURE_TILE:172][COLOR:6:11:0]
[PREFSTRING:shells, which are really the only notable things they have]
[BODY:VERMIN_BODY_HLG:SHELL_STL] Made a whole body part just for these guys. I am a caring god, unless you're a halfling. Then I suck.
[VERMIN_FISH][FISHITEM][IMMOBILE_LAND]
[VERMIN_NOTRAP][VERMIN_GROUNDER]
[MUNDANE][NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[RETRACT_INTO_BP:BY_CATEGORY:SHELL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:AMMONITE_STL] So goddamn caring
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:1500]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
Up next: evil vermins for evil places. Also, sandstorms.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 03, 2013, 09:20:59 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 03, 2013, 09:36:33 pm
Anywho, I've created some trees and grass to help liven up the environment a bit:
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:PLANT]
[PLANT:TALL_GRASS_STL]
[ALL_NAMES:tall grass]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[GRASS]
[GRASS_TILES:242:243:169:170]
[ALT_GRASS_TILES:243:242:170:169]
[ALT_PERIOD:300:200]
[GRASS_COLORS:2:0:1:2:0:0:6:0:1:6:0:0]
[WET]
[DRY]
[BIOME:ANY_WETLAND]
[PLANT:PEPPERSEED_GRASS_STL]
[ALL_NAMES:pepperseed grass]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[GRASS]
[GRASS_TILES:'.':',':';':'`']
[GRASS_COLORS:7:0:0:0:0:1:7:0:0:6:0:0]
[WET]
[DRY]
[BIOME:ANY_TEMPERATE]
[PLANT:CAM_VERSARAI_STL]
[NAME:cam versarai tree]
[NAME_PLURAL:cam versarai trees]
[ADJ:cam versarai]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:three-lobed canopy]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:WOOD:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:cam versarai wood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:cam versarai wood]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:DARK_RED]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:4:0:0]
[WOOD]
[TREE:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:WOOD]
[WET][DRY]
[BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
[TREE_TILE:169]
[TREE_COLOR:4:0:0]
[SAPLING_COLOR:4:0:0]
[PLANT:BLACKWOOD_TREE_STL]
[NAME:blackwood tree]
[NAME_PLURAL:blackwood trees]
[ADJ:blackwood tree]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:midnight wood]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:WOOD:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:blackwood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:blackwood]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BLACK]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:0:1:0]
[WOOD]
[TREE:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:WOOD]
[WET][DRY]
[BIOME:ANY_FOREST]
[TREE_TILE:05]
[TREE_COLOR:0:1:0]
[SAPLING_COLOR:1:0:1]
[PLANT:HEARTWOOD_TREE_STL]
[NAME:heartwood tree]
[NAME_PLURAL:heartwood trees]
[ADJ:heartwood tree]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:delightful aroma]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:WOOD:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:heartwood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:heartwood]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BLACK]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:0]
[WOOD]
[TREE:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:WOOD]
[WET]
[BIOME:ANY_TROPICAL_FOREST]
[TREE_TILE:05]
[TREE_COLOR:2:0:0]
[SAPLING_COLOR:2:0:0]
[PLANT:BLAZEWOOD_STL]
[NAME:blazewood tree]
[NAME_PLURAL:blazewood trees]
[ADJ:blazewood tree]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:ability to make things combust]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:WOOD:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:blazewood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:blazewood]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:ORANGE]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:1]
[WOOD]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMPERATURE:10400] BURN HALFLING BURN AHAHAHA
[TREE:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:WOOD]
[WET]
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_WATER]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:2]
[TREE_TILE:179]
[TREE_COLOR:6:0:1]
[SAPLING_COLOR:6:0:1]
[PLANT:FROSTHEART_STL]
[NAME:frostheart tree]
[NAME_PLURAL:frostheart trees]
[ADJ:frostheart tree]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:iciness to the touch]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:WOOD:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:heartwood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:heartwood]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BLACK]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:3:0:1]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMPERATURE:8999] Should freeze water
[WOOD]
[TREE:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:WOOD]
[WET]
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_WATER]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:2]
[TREE_TILE:6]
[TREE_COLOR:3:0:1]
[SAPLING_COLOR:3:0:1]
And here's that demon vermin that sows madness amongst the halflings that I promised originally:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:WISP_OF_RAGE_STL]
[NAME:wisp of rage:wisps of rage:rage wisp]
[CASTE_NAME:wisp of rage:wisps of rage:rage wisp]
[DESCRIPTION:A meatball that contains the essence of homicidal fury, and likes to share.]
[CREATURE_TILE:172][COLOR:4:0:0]
[VERMIN_MICRO][VERMIN_HATEABLE][VERMIN_NOTRAP][VERMIN_GROUNDER]
[EVIL][VERMIN_ROTTER]
[BIOME:ANY_LAND]
[BODY_SIZE:1][NO_DRINK][NO_EAT][NO_GENDER]
[SMALL_REMAINS]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:100:200][NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[NOT_LIVING]
[BODY:VERMIN_BODY_HLG:WINGS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[FLIER]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen wisp venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen wisp venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:wisp venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:wisp venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling wisp venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling wisp venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:uncontrollable rage]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:WATER_STRIDER_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_ADD_TAG:OPPOSED_TO_LIFE:LIKES_FIGHTING]
[VERMIN_BITE:50:corrupted:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:POISON]
Again, not sure how to test a vermin, so I'll have to go with just theoretical functionality.
EDIT: Er...yeah. Always proofread before posting. It seems water striders are immune to homicidal fury...I should fix that...
Post by: Meph on July 04, 2013, 12:23:16 am
The dew-beetle for honeymead sounds familiar too, but I would really like to see that gold-web spider. I havent worked with custom webs yet, and I wonder if they are collected for the loom correctly or not. I think there was a problem with inorganic webs, because the material is missing the SILK tag ?
I would LOVE to see that dictionary, and instantly add it into MasterworkDF. It has always bothered me that the names are always the same. No matter the NSFW stuff, it would go in. :)
Sandstorms are indeed regional weather interactions, you can just ramp up the frequency to test them. I plan a blizzard/freezing rain/sleet and hail for glaciers in the future, and you have to wear fur-clothing to counteract those.
Post by: Halfling on July 04, 2013, 05:54:04 am
I would LOVE to see that dictionary, and instantly add it into MasterworkDF. It has always bothered me that the names are always the same. No matter the NSFW stuff, it would go in. :)
You'll see it soon. I shrunk it down to 20 000 words by removing alternative spellings though.
Here's some progress I've made on the utilities to use this language file, for anyone interested (demonstration of symbol script):
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
EDIT: another demonstration, now with better search functionality:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: HDViper on July 04, 2013, 08:03:24 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 04, 2013, 08:08:05 am
Hi! I am just reading.Is there a playable version?I wanna try it.
First post has the raws for download. Just remove the vanilla raw folder and put ours in its place, start it up, and gen a new world! You'll have to wait a few more days for the glorious inclusion of insects that I've been working on, but right now it's got haflings, BFEL's elves, and various forms of moss and ducks and such.
Post by: HDViper on July 04, 2013, 08:11:08 am
Post by: Halfling on July 04, 2013, 02:22:04 pm
Yes, for modding or for playing, either one.Wow, just wow.Shall I sign you up? :)
I would definitely want to try this out.
Let's make it both! You don't have to jump out of the player pool if you're not feeling like it at the time since we're going it auction style.
In other news, the language utility scripts are mostly done, a 20k word vocabulary is done, creating symbols works like this: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4374256#msg4374256
And creating things like this:
Spoiler: Some of the notable residents of the region of Warlordsshetlands (click to show/hide)
There's so many possible names everyone pretty much has their own unique first name and definitely unique last name in a small world. However, creating symbols is going to take time (my limited ones make it use Abapical a lot for kingdoms and groups) and I don't want to release it with stupid symbols, I think, since those will stick and it doesn't demonstrate its capabilities. But if you want this version, PM me.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 04, 2013, 04:57:59 pm
Post by: Graknorke on July 04, 2013, 05:13:33 pm
This is neat.
Post by: BFEL on July 04, 2013, 06:16:04 pm
I found a problem with the treelords, though. Namely, they can't resurrect elves properly. The elf is revived and immediately bleeds to death. This may or may not have something to do with the method of death--namely, combat with a Pale Rider--but it's notable to mention. I also definitely saw the Molten Skin problem.... Also, Elven by-products are occasionally referred to by the creature name and not the caste name. !!Treelord Muscle!! existed from me butchering the elf corpse to stop the spam from happening.
GODDAMMIT! I am getting so sick of the phrase "problem with the Treelords" :'(
But yeah, thought I fixed that, but I'm pretty sure them bleeding to death is because the interaction uses [REQUIRES:FIT_FOR_RESURRECTION] instead of [REQUIRES:FIT_FOR_ANIMATION].....or something.....Interactions just kinda hate my guts. I once copy-pasted the vanilla imps Fireball interaction into my creature raws and it broke. Yeah that's ridiculous.
Also I hate this crap with the Creature/Caste name bullshit and the stupid "molten skin" crap. I NEVER HAD THIS PROBLEM BEFORE, WHY DOES THIS MOD HATE ME SO?
Post by: mastahcheese on July 04, 2013, 06:26:48 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 04, 2013, 06:39:36 pm
Code: [Select]
item_STL
[OBJECT_ITEM]
[ITEM_ARMOR:ROBE_STL]
[NAME:robe:robes]
[ARMORLEVEL:0]
[UBSTEP:MAX]
[LBSTEP:MAX]
[METAL_ARMOR_LEVELS]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:6]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:OVER]
[SOFT]
[COVERAGE:100]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_WOVEN_THREAD]
[ITEM_ARMOR:ROBE_CHAIN_STL]
[NAME:chain robe:chain robes]
[ARMORLEVEL:2]
[UBSTEP:MAX]
[LBSTEP:MAX]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:6]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:ARMOR]
[METAL]
[COVERAGE:100]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_CHAIN_ALL]
[ITEM_PANTS:PANTS_STL]
[PREPLURAL:pairs of]
[NAME:pants:pants]
[LBSTEP:MAX]
[LAYER:UNDER]
[COVERAGE:100]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:6]
[SOFT]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_WOVEN_THREAD]
[ITEM_SHOES:BOOTS_CLOTHING_STL]
[NAME:boot:boots]
[LAYER:OVER]
[COVERAGE:100]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:2]
[SOFT]
[LEATHER]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_WOVEN_THREAD]
[ITEM_HELM:HEADSCARF_STL]
[NAME:headscarf:headscarves]
[LAYER:OVER]
[COVERAGE:70]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:2]
[SOFT]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_WOVEN_THREAD]
[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_LANCE_STL]
[NAME:lance:lances]
[SIZE:600]
[SKILL:SPEAR]
[TWO_HANDED:49000]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:6000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:3]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20:10000:stab:stabs:NO_SUB:1000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:10:15000:impale:impales:NO_SUB:1250]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:10000:5000:bash:bashes:shaft:1250]
The sole entries related to them in the errorlog are about them being unrecognized in the entity file. From the entity file for the Formics:
Code: [Select]
##Armory##
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_LANCE_STL]
[WEAPON:SHORT_BOW_HLG]
[AMMO:SMALL_ARROW_HLG]
[WEAPON:SMALL_HATCHET_HLG]
[WEAPON:SMALL_HATCHET_METAL_HLG]
[ARMOR:ROBE_STL:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ROBE_CHAIN_STL:COMMON]
[PANTS:PANTS_STL:COMMON]
[SHOES:BOOTS_CLOTHING_STL:COMMON]
Located at the end of the file. Their absence is annoying me greatly. I cannot seem to make items work, so something must be wrong somewhere, and so far as I know only the entity and items file are related to these things.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 04, 2013, 06:43:10 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 04, 2013, 06:44:31 pm
Quote from: Halfling
The first of the firstborn, the halflings Adam and Eve, instantly conflagrated and burned with inner heat while trying to kill each other out of mercy. So god declared living creatures should not have a higher inner temperature than it takes to melt their flesh. Next verse, god decides the spine and the skull are to be inside a halfling's body and not on the surface, and that clothing is to be worn on the skin and not on the skeleton. Later still, trying to create hair, the creator makes everyone grow hair as thick as their bones all over their bodies, that's in all the colors of the rainbow in patches. Next verse details the creation of the "face" in the front of the head to be home to various formerly randomly scattered body parts
later:
Bugfix 1: no longer in unix linefeed format (durr)! Halfling carpentry reaction fixes
Bugfix 2: it came up that Halflings were upset about not having shoes. Created open sandals for now.
Bugfix 3: MEAT IS NO LONGER WORTH INFINITE NEGATIVE MONEY
Moral of the quote: we all have serious, ridiculous problems because creating new, original stuff is hard, especially if you're not someone who has been modding since the beginning of time. I mean, my world was originally crashing and broken. Leibowitz's giant wasps had no head and could not breathe or stand initially. It's not just you, so don't take it personally. What's important is how you pick yourself up and keep going. Furthermore most things are going fine for your elves. Have this from legends mode:
(http://s23.postimg.org/xa3sazqd7/treequeen.png)
...but that said, try to work on those remaining bugs. We'll have a look at them too but they're your legacy for the mod.
I took the liberty of reuploading a version of your addons where the "molten skin" part is fixed, it's downloadable on the first page (redownload pack with BFEL's stuff).
Post by: WillowLuman on July 04, 2013, 06:48:30 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 04, 2013, 06:51:38 pm
What the? Why did you make the whole species male, and then make a caste that's female? You should have just made a male caste and left the species genderless by default.
No wonder castes hate you.
Looking more into it now.
Post by: Halfling on July 04, 2013, 06:59:52 pm
Okay, somebody help, please. Tell me why these items fail to show up in the arena:
snip
Located at the end of the file. Their absence is annoying me greatly. I cannot seem to make items work, so something must be wrong somewhere, and so far as I know only the entity and items file are related to these things.
The item raws are perfect. Comments are perfectly fine too. What's wrong is your header. It's [OBJECT:ITEM], not [OBJECT_ITEM]. Prevents the whole file from being used. :D
We need perhaps to use more symbols, those names are even more baffling than vanilla.
Yeah, the symbols are currently broken. I have the symbol making script ready, which can be used to search and add words into symbols that you name, but it needs using. That's (probably) why everything's "Abapical" right now.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 04, 2013, 07:06:19 pm
EDIT: Well, that allowed me to discover a sadistic little bug. You can craft chain robes out of Blazewood...the material with a fixed temperature higher than the ignition point of skin. While this could be an interesting method of execution, it is not intended at all.
Post by: Halfling on July 04, 2013, 07:17:40 pm
So if the same logic applies to bolts, you could use blazewood to make naturally burning arrows and have your enemies occasionally fire them at you too. But it might not, if the quiver burns. That one is not so easy to test in arena.
Still... upon further consideration might want to tweak that a bit. Might make life a bit difficult for creatures set to wear wooden armor, occasionally. If you want burning stuff you could make it unusable by default and do it as above, making a new reaction to "reinforce weapon/bolts with blazewood".
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 04, 2013, 07:31:55 pm
Also, do we actually have quivers, or should I make that too? I haven't noticed them in the arena.
Post by: Halfling on July 04, 2013, 07:35:27 pm
I think you could make a reaction to create them in arena mode if necessary, but it would be such a pain to use for any large amount of testing.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 04, 2013, 10:01:55 pm
Code: [Select]
[ENTITY:DESERT_STL]
[INDIV_CONTROLLABLE]
[CIV_CONTROLLABLE]
[ADVENTURE_TIER:3]
[CREATURE:FORMICS_STL]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_DESERT:5]
[START_BIOME:ANY_DESERT]
[DEFAULT_SITE_TYPE:CAVE_DETAILED]
[LIKES_SITE:CAVE_DETAILED]
[TOLERATES_SITE:CITY]
[WORLD_CONSTRUCTION:ROAD]
[WORLD_CONSTRUCTION:BRIDGE]
[WORLD_CONSTRUCTION:TUNNEL]
[START_GROUP_NUMBER:20]
[MAX_POP_NUMBER:5000]
[MAX_SITE_POP_NUMBER:1000]
[MAX_STARTING_CIV_NUMBER:5]
##JOBS##
[PERMITTED_JOB:MECHANIC]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MINER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:PLANTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:HERBALIST]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BREWER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BOWYER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOODCUTTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CARPENTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BLACKSMITH]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WEAPONSMITH]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ARMORER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:METALCRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MASON]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ANIMAL_CARETAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ANIMAL_TRAINER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRAPPER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOODCRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:STONECRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:LEATHERWORKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BONE_CARVER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WEAVER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLOTHIER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:FISHERMAN]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CHEESE_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MILKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SHEARER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SPINNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:COOK]
[PERMITTED_JOB:THRESHER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MILLER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BUTCHER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TANNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:DYER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SOAP_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:POTASH_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:LYE_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLERK]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ADMINISTRATOR]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRADER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ARCHITECT]
[PERMITTED_JOB:GLAZER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:POTTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:PRESSER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BEEKEEPER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WAX_WORKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:GLASSMAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOOD_BURNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:DIAGNOSER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BONE_SETTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SUTURER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SURGEON]
##PHILOSOPHY##
[RELIGION:PANTHEON]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:CREATION]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DEATH]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DAWN]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DARKNESS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:STARS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:TRAVELERS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:BALANCE]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:LOYALTY]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:TREACHERY]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:CREATION:1000]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:DEATH:900]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:STARS:900]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:BALANCE:800]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:LYING:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:THEFT:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:MISGUIDED]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:APPALLING]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TREASON:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
[WILL_ACCEPT_TRIBUTE]
[SCOUT]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:SUMMER]
[AMBUSHER]
[BUILDS_OUTDOOR_FORTIFICATIONS]
[DIPLOMAT_BODYGUARDS]
[INVADERS_IGNORE_NEUTRALS]
[MERCHANT_BODYGUARDS]
[SIEGER]
[USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS]
[USE_CAVE_ANIMALS]
[CLOTHING]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_MOUNT]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PET]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PACK]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PULL]
[INDOOR_FARMING]
[METAL_PREF]
[STONE_PREF]
[INDOOR_WOOD]
[OUTDOOR_WOOD]
[USE_MISC_PROCESSED_WOOD_PRODUCTS]
##Armory##
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_LANCE_STL]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SCIMITAR_STL]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_PICK_STL]
[WEAPON:SHORT_BOW_HLG]
[AMMO:SMALL_ARROW_HLG]
[WEAPON:SMALL_HATCHET_HLG]
[WEAPON:SMALL_HATCHET_METAL_HLG]
[ARMOR:ROBE_STL:COMMON]
[ARMOR:ROBE_CHAIN_STL:COMMON]
[PANTS:PANTS_STL:COMMON]
[SHOES:BOOTS_CLOTHING_STL:COMMON]
[HELM:HEADSCARF_STL:COMMON]
##Reactions##
[PERMITTED_REACTION:BREW_HONEYWINE_STL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:EXTRACT_CELESTIUM_STL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:PREPARE_CHITIN_STL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CAST_CRUDE_ANVIL_HLG]
##Caste Hierarchy##
[POSITION:QUEEN]
[NAME_MALE:what the hell:whats the hells]
[NAME_FEMALE:Everqueen:Everqueens]
[NUMBER:1]
[ALLOWED_CREATURE:FORMICS_STL:QUEEN]
[CHAT_WORTHY]
[BRAG_ON_KILL] You can, but it's a bad idea. The Formics will rip you apart. Best to lay low.
[COLOR:6:4:1] regal yellow-on-red
[DUTY_BOUND]
[RULES_FROM_LOCATION]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[PRECEDENCE:1]
[RESPONSIBILITY:RELIGION]
[RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_MAKING]
[SUCCESSION:BY_POSITION:PRINCESS]
[KILL_QUEST]
[GENDER:FEMALE] failsafe
[DO_NOT_CULL] "who was the immortal goddess-queen in 372?" "that's too unimportant to remember." "Correct!"
[DETERMINES_COIN_DESIGN]
[DEMAND_MAX:5]
[MANDATE_MAX:2]
[EXPORTED_IN_LEGENDS]
[LAND_NAME:the Great Hive]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[SPECIAL_BURIAL]
[POSITION:PRINCESS] Heir Apparent to the Everqueen
[NAME_MALE:what the hell:whats the hells]
[NAME_FEMALE:Princess:Princesses]
[NUMBER:1]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[BRAG_ON_KILL] Still an awful idea
[COLOR:6:5:1]
[APPOINTED_BY:QUEEN]
[ALLOWED_CREATURE:FORMICS_STL:QUEEN]
[GENDER:FEMALE]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[EXPORTED_IN_LEGENDS]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[PRECEDENCE:2]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[POSITION:ASSEMBLY_OF_QUEENS]
[NAME_MALE:GTFO:GTFOs]
[NAME_FEMALE:Queen:Queens]
[NUMBER:100000] Hopefully this will encompass all queenlydom
[DUTY_BOUND]
[BRAG_ON_KILL] You idiot
[PRECEDENCE:3]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[GENDER:FEMALE]
[MANDATE_MAX:0]
[FLASHES]
[ELECTED] "we vote for you because of our DNA"
[POSITION:REGENT]
[NAME_MALE:regent:regents]
[NAME_FEMALE:GTFO:GTFOs]
[NUMBER:1]
[SITE]
[CONQUERED_SITE]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[PRECEDENCE:4]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[GENDER:MALE]
[EXPORTED_IN_LEGENDS]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[ELECTED]
[KILL_QUEST]
[RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_MAKING]
[RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS]
[LAND_HOLDER:1]
[REQUIRED_BEDROOM:300]
[REQUIRED_OFFICE:300]
[REQUIRED_DINING:300]
[REQUIRED_TOMB:500]
[DEMAND_MAX:2]
[MANDATE_MAX:1]
[SPECIAL_BURIAL]
[COLOR:5:0:0]
[POSITION:SCRIBE]
[NAME:scribe:scribes]
[SITE]
[RESPONSIBILITY:ACCOUNTING]
[APPOINTED_BY:ALLET]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MANAGE_PRODUCTION]
[REQUIRED_OFFICE:1]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[COLOR:5:0:0]
[NUMBER:3]
[PRECEDENCE:50]
[POSITION:ALLET]
[NAME:allet:alletae]
[SITE]
[NUMBER:1]
[RULES_FROM_LOCATION]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[PRECEDENCE:40]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MEET_WORKERS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_GOALS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_ENFORCEMENT]
[RESPONSIBILITY:TRADE]
[RESPONSIBILITY:BUILD_MORALE]
[POSITION:CHIRURGEON]
[NAME:chirurgeon:chirurgeons]
[SITE]
[NUMBER:1]
[RESPONSIBILITY:HEALTH_MANAGEMENT]
[APPOINTED_BY:ALLET]
[PRECEDENCE:45]
[COLOR:5:0:0]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[POSITION:VOX_REGINA]
[NAME:vox regina:vox reginae]
[NUMBER:1]
[RESPONSIBILITY:ESTABLISH_COLONY_TRADE_AGREEMENTS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_INTRODUCTIONS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_PEACE_AGREEMENTS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_TOPIC_AGREEMENTS]
[COLOR:6:4:1]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[APPOINTED_BY:QUEEN]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[PRECEDENCE:10]
##Army##
[POSITION:SHALADIN]
[NAME:shaladin:shaladin]
[NUMBER:1]
[SQUAD:10:shal-scutus:shal-scuteri]
[APPOINTED_BY:QUEEN]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY]
[COMMANDER:DANALIN:ALL]
[PRECEDENCE:20]
[SPECIAL_BURIAL]
[KILL_QUEST]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[FLASHES]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[POSITION:DANALIN]
[NAME:danalin:danalin]
[NUMBER:AS_NEEDED]
[SQUAD:10:dan-scutus:dan-scuteri]
[APPOINTED_BY:SHALADIN]
[COMMANDER:KETALMIN:ALL]
[PRECEDENCE:25]
[KILL_QUEST]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[FLASHES]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[POSITION:KETALMIN]
[NAME:ketalmin:ketalmin]
[NUMBER:AS_NEEDED]
[SQUAD:10:ket-scutus:ket-scuteri]
[APPOINTED_BY:SHALADIN]
[PRECEDENCE:30]
[KILL_QUEST]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[FLASHES]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[POSITION:ASHALIM]
[NAME:ashalim:ashalim]
[SITE]
[NUMBER:1]
[SQUAD:10:as-scutus:as-scuteri]
[APPOINTED_BY:ALLET]
[COMMANDER:MESARTHIM:ALL]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY]
[RESPONSIBILITY:EXECUTIONS]
[EXECUTION_SKILL:SWORD]
[PRECEDENCE:35]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[POSITION:MESARTHIM]
[NAME:mesarthim:mesarthim]
[SITE]
[NUMBER:AS_NEEDED]
[SQUAD:10:mes-scutus:mes-scuteri]
[APPOINTED_BY:ASHALIM]
[COMMANDER:MESARTHIM:ALL]
[PRECEDENCE:45]
[KILL_QUEST]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[MILITARY_SCREEN_ONLY]
[DUTY_BOUND]
The Formics! A second playable race.
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:FORMICS_STL]
[NAME:formic:formics:formic]
[CREATURE_TILE:'A'][COLOR:4:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:Sapient, humanoid ants. Their society is heavily regimented by a biological caste system and religious devotion to their immortal Queens, though the queens prefer to let the lesser castes run the nation while they breed.]
[BIOME:ANY_DESERT][CAVE_ADAPT]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[PERSONALITY:LIBERALISM:0:24:39]It's a biological caste system. Hierarchy is as natural as breathing, and they all know their place.
[PERSONALITY:ALTRUISM:25:76:100] One does not get far in a eusocial species if one dislikes cooperation and helping others.
[PERSONALITY:COOPERATION:25:76:100]
[PERSONALITY:SELF_DISCIPLINE:25:76:100]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[EQUIPS][BENIGN][MUNDANE][ALL_ACTIVE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_ANT_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[CASTE:QUEEN]
[CASTE_NAME:formic queen:formic queens:formic queen]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE_ALTTILE:'Q'][CASTE_TILE:'A']
[CAN_LEARN][CAN_SPEAK][PET] According to the dwarven cognitive science thread by Di that someone necroed, this should make them civ members AND quite prolific.
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:ANT_TENNAE_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:2EYES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_ANT_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[PERSONALITY:VULNERABILITY:0:24:39]
[POP_RATIO:1]
[BODY_SIZE:100000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:4000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:20000]
[BODY_SIZE:4:0:50000]
[BODY_SIZE:6:0:100000]
[BABY:2][CHILD:6]
[LITTERSIZE:4:8] they took 'go forth and multiply' very seriously
[CASTE:DRONE]
[CASTE_NAME:formic drone:formic drones:formic drone]
[MALE]
[CASTE_ALTTILE:'d'][CASTE_TILE:'A']
[BODY:INSECT_HUMANOID_STL:ANT_TENNAE_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:2EYES_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_ANT_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CAN_LEARN][CAN_SPEAK]
[POP_RATIO:10]
[BODY_SIZE:80000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:4000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:40000]
[BODY_SIZE:4:0:80000]
[BABY:1][CHILD:2]
[MAXAGE:20:30]
[CASTE:WORKER]
[CASTE_NAME:formic worker:formic workers:formic workers]
[CASTE_ALTTILE:'w'][CASTE_TILE:'A']
[BODY:INSECT_HUMANOID_STL:ANT_TENNAE_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:2EYES_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_ANT_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CAN_LEARN][CAN_SPEAK]
[POP_RATIO:1500]
[BODY_SIZE:70000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:4000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:40000]
[BODY_SIZE:4:0:70000]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATES:60]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:MINING:120] Very good at basic infrastructure tasks, but you're not going to get quality crafts out of them.
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:WOODCUTTING:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:PLANT:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:FISH:120]
[CHILD:2][BABY:1]
[MAXAGE:7:10] Numerous but short-lived and dull.
[CASTE:SOLDIER]
[CASTE_NAME:formic soldier:formic soldiers:formic soldier]
[CASTE_ALTTILE:'s'][CASTE_TILE:'A']
[BODY:INSECT_HUMANOID_STL:ANT_TENNAE_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:2EYES_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_ANT_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CAN_LEARN][CAN_SPEAK][TRANCES][TRAPAVOID]Soldiers have heightened reflexes that let them dodge traps, and give them an edge in battle.
[NOFEAR] FOR THE QUEEN!
[POP_RATIO:500]
[BODY_SIZE:90000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:5000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:50000]
[BODY_SIZE:4:0:90000]
[BABY:1][CHILD:3]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:SPEAR:120] Good at combat thanks to reflexes
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:SWORD:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:PIKE:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:SHIELD:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:MELEE_COMBAT:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:DODGING:120]
[MAXAGE:15:20]
Not very long-lived (might tweak workers to give them a lifespan of about 4 years), caste-based species. Only the Queens can breed (they don't lay eggs because I didn't feel like making my own non-edible eggstuffs, and the idea of formics using their own eggs as a food source was...distasteful), and they form a very small part of the population.
They live in deserts primarily, and their weapons of choice are lances (slightly larger spears with more attacks) and scimitars (also with more attacks - hack, slash, impale, stab). They wear robes made of cloth or chainmail, headscarves, and boots. They have four arms. Spent all free time today on them :)
Also, Halfling - permission to modify the halfling entity to allow them to extract Celestium strands and thus access that metal?
Post by: mastahcheese on July 04, 2013, 10:43:51 pm
I went through the eye-burning sludge that was the raws for the elves, and I rewrote it, not from scratch, I just copied and pasted BFEL's stuff so that is should function completely identically to how it has been, however, the file itself is now about half the size it was before because I consolidated the vast amount of redundant terminology.
Seriously, who taught you to mod?
This is how I made it look, it should be the same as before, but less of an eyesore, and primarily, easier to navigate.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
The prefstring of "dying screams" has been lost because it's a creature token, not a caste token.
When a person likes dogs, they like all dogs, not just female ones. At least in DF.
If you want to put it back in so hobbits like Treelords for their dying screams, go right ahead and put it back in.
Post by: Halfling on July 04, 2013, 11:10:25 pm
Eh, it'll have to remain a mystery then. New stuff!
snip
Also, Halfling - permission to modify the halfling entity to allow them to extract Celestium strands and thus access that metal?
Sure. The idea with halflings is that if correctly played they should be able to do pretty much anything vanilla dwarves can in fortress mode (except make fine armor and weapons), but be wimps otherwise. So considering they have wooden weapons and armor set, that will keep that idea going nicely.
OK PEOPLE, well, BFEL, at least.
snip
Seriously, who taught you to mod?
This is how I made it look, it should be the same as before, but less of an eyesore, and primarily, easier to navigate.
snip
The prefstring of "dying screams" has been lost because it's a creature token, not a caste token.
When a person likes dogs, they like all dogs, not just female ones. At least in DF.
If you want to put it back in so hobbits like Treelords for their dying screams, go right ahead and put it back in.
Yow! Don't be too mean, it's come out that he doesn't have that much experience already, so unobfuscating formatting and lack of redundancy probably weren't the prime concerns there. That said, very nicely done, shows your competence.
BFEL, your take on this upgrade? Wouldn't be fair to just suggest overwriting your raws without consulting you. Implement?
FWIF if there's a way to make the halfling creature files more efficient while accomplishing the same I'd be happy to make the change, so feel free to suggest if something comes up.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 04, 2013, 11:14:11 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 04, 2013, 11:23:35 pm
Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:CELESTIUM_METAL_STL] Averaged stats of iron and bronze to get this.
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:METAL_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:celestium]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten celestium]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:boiling celestium]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:0:0:1]
[BUILD_COLOR:0:8:0]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:15]
[SPEC_HEAT:435]
[MELTING_POINT:11868] bronze
[BOILING_POINT:14140] bronze
[ITEMS_WEAPON][ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED][ITEMS_AMMO][ITEMS_DIGGER][ITEMS_ARMOR]
[SOLID_DENSITY:8050]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:7500]
[MOLAR_MASS:67923] rounded up from half
[IMPACT_YIELD:572250]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:964250]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:433]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:572250]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:964250]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:433]
[TENSILE_YIELD:163500]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:275500]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:115]
[TORSION_YIELD:163500]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:275500]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:173]
[SHEAR_YIELD:163500]
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:275500]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:173]
[BENDING_YIELD:163500]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:275500]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:115]
[MAX_EDGE:10000]
[IS_METAL]
[ITEMS_HARD][ITEMS_METAL][ITEMS_BARRED][ITEMS_SCALED]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BLACK]
[STOCKPILE_THREAD_METAL]
[WAFERS]
[INORGANIC:CELESTIUM_ORE_STL]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:1][TILE:'*']
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:celestite]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten celestite]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:dust]
[ENVIRONMENT_SPEC:CELESTIAL_MARBLE_STL:CLUSTER_SMALL:100]
[ITEM_SYMBOL:'*']
[SOLID_DENSITY:6000]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:13]
[IS_STONE]
[MELTING_POINT:12000]
[INORGANIC:CELESTIAL_MARBLE_STL]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:celestial marble]
[TILE:176][DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:1]
[ENVIRONMENT:METAMORPHIC:CLUSTER:50]
[IS_STONE]
[SOLID_DENSITY:6500]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:10]
Some fancy pebbles to help populate the underground. I intend to add a gem called "fallen star" in the celestial marble, too.
I've got a final wave of critters planned for tomorrow and then I'll probably start bugfixing and working on the environment more. Planned for final wave:
-Bandit Moth
-Reaver Ant (cavern flightless Vespulae equivalent)
-Spiderling (Halfspider?)
-Giant Cave Scorpion
-Desert Scorpion (name subject to latinization)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 04, 2013, 11:37:26 pm
Also, the rocks that Halflings throw are technically liquid, I find this amusing, even though the token difference is relatively meaningless.
I can't find any room for improvement in the Halfling raws, although the information for them are spread out among multiple documents that simply refer to each other, rather than defining everything in one place like I do. But having the creature attacks as part of a variation system is a very genius way of making future additions more streamlined. Well done.
Post by: BFEL on July 05, 2013, 07:51:12 am
Cool, just downloaded it, looking at BFEL's stuff right now...
What the? Why did you make the whole species male, and then make a caste that's female? You should have just made a male caste and left the species genderless by default.
No wonder castes hate you.
Looking more into it now.
I didn't do that...at least not intentionally. I had intended for the Elves/Treelords to have three castes from the beginning so I actually started doing the Caste stuff before the Creature stuff. Probably a bad idea, but hindsight.
I THOUGHT I had just made the male and female castes, then left the elves genderless. Oops.
Seriously, who taught you to mod?I taught myself. Using the wiki.
Most of the insults were meant in a joking manner, as I know him from Necrothreat, and know some of the horrors he's capable of making. :PActually I didn't make...well really ANYTHING in Necrothreat. I made the High Lord Threadnecromancers (who didn't work and all died in worldgen, consistently) and because I was having so many problems with it I eventually pretty much just handed it all to Talvieno and said "Fix this" and he did. And he made the entire mod. So yeah, pretty much all the insults, totally deserved. I'm working on it.
Post by: mocman on July 05, 2013, 09:00:04 am
Having gotten a better insight in to how DF uses the raws I've actually gotten some of my projects working for once.I was purposely making my creatures quite obtuse and bizarre, and had no idea about the error.txt
After this i might put up some of my modifications, never thought of actually letting people see my creations.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2013, 10:49:51 am
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:REAVER_ANT_STL]
[NAME:reaver ant:reaver ants:reaver ant]
[CASTE_NAME:reaver ant:reaver ants:reaver ant]
[CREATURE_TILE:'a'][COLOR:4:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:Dog-sized ants that march in massive columns through the underground. They tear apart whatever they find in their path, and their sheer numbers make them a deadly challenge.]
[PREFSTRING:terrifying columns]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:ANT_TENNAE_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:2EYES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:30:40][FREQUENCY:100]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[LARGE_PREDATOR][MUNDANE][CHILD:1][NATURAL][LARGE_ROAMING]
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_CHASM][POPULATION_NUMBER:8000:12000][UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:2]
[LIKES_FIGHTING]
[PET_EXOTIC][PETVALUE:100]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:STING_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_ANT_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CASTE:QUEEN]
[CASTE_NAME:reaver ant queen:reaver ant queens:reaver ant]
[FEMALE]
[POP_RATIO:1]
[BODY_SIZE:48000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:5000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:48000]
[CASTE:MALE]
[CASTE_NAME:reaver ant drone:reaver ant drones:reaver ant]
[POP_RATIO:10]
[BODY_SIZE:32000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:5000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:32000]
[MALE]
[CASTE:REAVER]
[CASTE_NAME:reaver ant:reaver ants:reaver ant]
[POP_RATIO:1000]
[BODY_SIZE:32000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:5000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:32000]
[MAXAGE:2:3]
The Reaver Ant! Like vespulae for the caverns, but with less wings and poison and more numbers. Combat testing shows that a single competent halfling with a celestium lance and chainmail robe can easily deal with two of them, but will be overrun by twenty. Formic soldiers, bred for combat, working in a phalanx of four competent lancers, with their biological armor and combat trances, were similarly overrun, though the cost to the reaver swarm was great. I'm pleased with them.
Bugfix: Petvalues added to all my prior creations that can be made minions. 1-point-cost venomous vermin hunters was a bit ridiculous.
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 05, 2013, 12:32:17 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2013, 01:20:59 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:BANDIT_MOTH_STL]
[NAME:bandit moth:bandit moths:bandit moth]
[CASTE_NAME:bandit moth:bandit moths:bandit moth]
[CREATURE_TILE:'M'][COLOR:0:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A giant moth that is uncontrollably attracted to shiny objects, and objects in general.]
[PREFSTRING:larcenous ways][PREFSTRING:mighty wingspan]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:ANTENNAE_STL:WINGS_STL:PROBOSCIS_STL:2EYES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:1100000] The size, roughly, of a beluga whale. With wings.
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:9000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:48000]
[BODY_SIZE:5:0:70000]
[BODY_SIZE:10:0:140000]
[BODY_SIZE:20:0:500000]
[BODY_SIZE:40:0:1100000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LEPIDOPTERID_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_PROBOSCIS_SUCK_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_MOTH_WINGS_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[BIOME:ANY_LAND][FREQUENCY:20][CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:1][POPULATION_NUMBER:20:80]
[FLEEQUICK][CURIOUSBEAST_ITEM][FLIER]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
The mighty Bandit Moth. Hide your valuables, because this thing is the size of a winged whale and it is greedier than a kleptomaniac mandrill. It will not be denied.
Scorpions in progress. Also, flaming slugs. And would I be correct to assume that a grass with no heat damage point would burn forever?
Post by: WillowLuman on July 05, 2013, 01:51:39 pm
Hmm, maybe you should make that a megabeast/semimegabeast? It's not really fair to the players to make every single animal out for blood. Do we have anything non-domestic that isn't?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2013, 02:15:25 pm
As for non-domestics...well, er...uh...There's wild pack beetles?
Yeah...adding in those giant benign millipedes would be a good idea now...
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2013, 02:51:47 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:TRILOBITE_STL]
[NAME:trilobite:trilobites:trilobite]
[CASTE_NAME:trilobite:trilobites:trilobites]
[DESCRIPTION:Hardy, diverse organisms, found in varying forms across the oceans and rivers of the world.]
[CREATURE_TILE:172][COLOR:4:9:0]
[BODY:VERMIN_BODY_HLG]
[PREFSTRING:meatball-like characteristics]
[VERMIN_FISH][FISHITEM][IMMOBILE_LAND][VERMIN_NOTRAP][VERMIN_GROUNDER]
[UBIQUITOUS]
[MUNDANE][NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[BIOME:ANY_OCEAN]
[BIOME:ANY_LAKE]
[BIOME:ANY_RIVER][POPULATION_NUMBER:1000:1500]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD]
[BODY_SIZE:70]
[NO_DRINK]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:800] They're like rocket-propelled meatballs!
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[CREATURE:AESHNIDA_STL]
[NAME:aeshnida:aeshnidae:aeshnida]
[CASTE_NAME:aeshnida:aeshnidae:aeshnida]
[CREATURE_TILE:'d'][COLOR:2:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:A large dragonfly that darts through the air with precision and inborn skill as it searches for prey.]
[PREFSTRING:precise movements]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:ANTENNAE_STL:4WINGS_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:2EYES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:4600]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:500]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:2000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:180:4600]
[CHILD:2][PET][PETVALUE:100]
[BENIGN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_DRAGONFLY_COLOR_STL]
[DIVE_HUNTS_VERMIN]
[FLIER]
[LARGE_ROAMING]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:900:1100][CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:5][LOOSE_CLUSTERS]
[BIOME:ANY_TROPICAL]
[BIOME:ANY_SAVANNA]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
So, some benign, wimpy bugs to fool the halflings into thinking that not everything wants them dead. The trilobites should also make river fishing possible, I think, or at least profitable, since nothing lived there before to my knowledge.
Code: [Select]
[PLANT:UMBRELLA_TREE_STL]
[NAME:umbrella tree]
[NAME_PLURAL:umbrella trees]
[ADJ:umbrellawood]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:shady canopy]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:WOOD:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:umbrella wood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:umbrella wood]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BROWN]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:0:0]
[WOOD]
[TREE:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:WOOD]
[WET][DRY]
[BIOME:ANY_SAVANNA]
[TREE_TILE:226]
[TREE_COLOR:2:0:0]
[SAPLING_COLOR:2:0:0]
[PLANT:CINDERWOOD_TREE_STL]
[NAME:cinderwood tree]
[NAME_PLURAL:cinderwood trees]
[ADJ:cinderwood]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:volatility][PREFSTRING:choking shroud of smoke]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:WOOD:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:cinderwood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:cinderwood]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:RUST]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:4:0:0]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE] "Like eternal columns of the blackest smoke they stand, grim sentinels holding vigil o'er the endless sand..."
[IGNITE_POINT:9000]
[WOOD]
[TREE:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:WOOD]
[DRY]
[BIOME:ANY_DESERT]
[TREE_TILE:198]
[TREE_COLOR:4:0:0]
[SAPLING_COLOR:4:0:0]
And a few more trees, one usable, the other basically a flaming stick that never burns away and chokes its host desert in smoke.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2013, 03:44:14 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
THE GRASS HAS BECOME EVERYTHING.
All I did was add the plants above and then an underground crop for the formics:
Code: [Select]
[PLANT:CORAL_FUNGUS_STL]
[NAME:coral fungus]
[NAME_PLURAL:coral fungi]
[ADJ:coral fungus]
[FREQUENCY:100]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:10]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_RAW]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:exotic color]
[PREFSTRING:branches]
[SUMMER][SPRING][AUTUMN][WINTER]
[GROWDUR:500][CLUSTERSIZE:3]
[PICKED_TILE:3][PICKED_COLOR:5:0:0]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[SEED_MAT]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[SEED:coral fungus spore:coral fungus spores:5:0:0:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
[WET][DRY]
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_WATER][UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:3]
[SHRUB_TILE:3][SHRUB_COLOR:5:0:0]
[DEAD_SHRUB_TILE:3]
[DEAD_SHRUB_COLOR:6:0:0]
And then I embarked on a desert. Now the grass is having a rave party and the Formics are very sad :(
More minor question: How does one make a weapon a digging tool? I intended for formics to use pickaxes, but for whatever reason they failed to show up on the embark preparation thing.
EDIT: Okay, it's not the GRASS that has become everything, it's the surface of the desert - whatever it's supposed to be. There's a moss tile in the far north that steadfastly remains moss, even as the universe spazzes out around it (admirable), but everything else is switching materials extremely rapidly and flickering through all the colors of the dwarven rainbow.
EDIT2: The boulders themselves that litter the area are completely fine and made of lovely rock. It's just the surface. Help?
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 05, 2013, 04:11:08 pm
No, but look at the top level of your embark site. Notice every instance of pebbles, or stone floor, or boulders? None of those can be composed of [SOIL] and that's hard-coded. When you embark with every [STONE] set as [SOIL], those spots are, according to the game, not made of *anything*. Which means, apparently, that they're made of *EVERYTHING*.
So they strobe, flashing every color available to the game. Trying to examine the tiles reveal that they're changing the material that defines them many times per second. It's eye-breaking.
This also happens if you embark with stone existing, then use CHANGELAYER to turn all of the stone into soil layers, or turn the existing stone into soil by modding.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2013, 04:43:00 pm
I abandoned and embarked on a different desert area, a rocky one this time. Everything's perfectly fine. Maybe we don't have any sand, or something?
(The story of that embark, for the interested. It was...exciting, to say the least.)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 05, 2013, 08:46:55 pm
I would love to be the first to add proper drinks to this.
Post by: Putnam on July 05, 2013, 09:23:00 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2013, 10:52:17 pm
Wait, do we have any alcohol in this yet?
I would love to be the first to add proper drinks to this.
Too late - aphid honeywine I added, because evidently honeydew in its raw form was "inedible". There is a certain lack of variety, though, I will admit.
I think I solved the rave party issue - we didn't have any inorganic materials tagged with "SOIL_SAND", or whatever the sand tag is (working from memory here), and I'd embarked on a sand desert. This yielded an effect similar to what laularukyrumo posited. I've yet to test this fix, but it is the only one that makes any sense, so I feel comfortable declaring that bug dealt with.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 06, 2013, 12:41:04 am
I'm scared to see what Putnam does to us
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 01:30:19 am
Not having any sand was apparently an oversight on my part. That post by Talanic is not accurate though, I did what he described as impossible later in the thread. :P
There's a bit of a problem, namely BFEL's creation STILL hasn't been tested in fort mode for the suggested 2 years AFAIK since sculleywr apparently didn't end up playing after all.
Let's be honest, it was a pretty small addition and doesn't include a new fortress mode, so we could maybe say it's arena mode tested, and Leibowitz has confirmed it doesn't break fort mode and I can confirm it works in legends as intended and let that be it for now. Or, if any other player wants to test it now, that would be okay. Or I could declare BFEL will now show it off as per the rules.
So what do, guys? I honestly wasn't prepared for people just skipping out when making the rules. Generally not testing is unacceptable if we want to stay playable, but this has been tested somewhat, however.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 02:18:34 am
Rave deserts are unacceptable, even if you're playing the minimal world. To fix them, added
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
to inorcanic_halfling in the currently uploaded versions. Please redownload & overwrite. Screen:
(http://s14.postimg.org/lv50nk0hd/hh8.png)
Also, since BFEL didn't seem to mind, replaced treelord raws with mastahcheese's clear version in the BFEL pack.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 02:27:42 am
Post by: WillowLuman on July 06, 2013, 02:43:09 am
Hehe, I'd like a modding turn.
It was only a matter of time. BTW, I call dibs on telekinetic eyeball people.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 07:41:37 am
Spoiler: /df/simplesoundloop.sh (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: /df/musiclist.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: /df/encountermusic/ (click to show/hide)
(http://s8.postimg.org/fai0swx6d/hh9.png)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 08:04:31 am
Third post in a row, but since they're all on different topics I feel it's clearer this way for everyone. Leibowitz, are you sure that cinderwood tree won't again make poor wood-using races make their equipment out of it? This one seems to be available on the surface.
That does seem to be an issue, doesn't it? Silly hippies...ruining my plans for incendiary flora...
I'll fix it.
EDIT: Arena testing has revealed that a fix actually isn't necessary, and cinderwood gear actually must look pretty damn terrifying to people. It ignites at 9000 degrees Urist, which is well below the ignition point of skin...and thus appears not to do any damage to its bearer/wearer. Two halflings armed with cinderwood hatchets killed each other with them first, without even minor melting from holding flaming weapons. I've got another halfling being chased around while wearing full flaming cinderwood chainmail, and he's completely fine. Only issue is that they obscure the battlefield with smoke, but flaming armor and weapons is worth it, to the point that I think I'll add in a metal based on this principal.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 08:28:55 am
It might still be best, even if boring, to make it a reaction to set equipment on fire like that.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 08:45:01 am
Verdict: Useless in fort mode, usable as gear without killing anyone (unlike blazewood) in combat. Enemies that show up in the stuff would be the only source of flaming wooden stuff - cold, incendiary goblinite. Since I am not entirely unbiased here - I want my creation to be used - I leave it up to the thread whether or not this is acceptable.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 08:52:21 am
1) Your starting gear and items
2) Trader items (it's actually a huge problem if they burn away or vaporize their contents or the wagon, or scare the merchants)
Regardless of the ignition point I should think once it's on fire it sets to fire temperature and not ignition temperature.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 09:09:14 am
EDIT: Yeah, you can embark with them, and the tools are unusable. Probably have to cut it, then. I'll just replace it with Leadwood.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 09:15:19 am
I'll check on the issue of embark items, but the six cinderwood logs in the wagon when I tested first didn't cause any harm at all to anything else, or even themselves really since there's no heatdam point.
1. Barrels, filled with liquid, made of the stuff? HF when traders lose all their precious golden salve... if we ever make stuff like that.
2. Bins snip goods snip? snip drop all crafts/insane amounts of silk snip.
Edit: read your edit - K. But there's the alternative of don't make the wood [WOOD] and make it workable by custom reactions instead - thus making it usable in fort mode, but not by civilizations.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 09:38:25 am
Leadwood has taken the place of cinderwood - a tree with a density greater than cinnabar. Seems to work well for hobbit cudgels.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 11:06:05 am
Work begun on Spiderlings/Halfspiders/Spider-Centaurs.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 11:08:09 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 11:36:35 am
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 06, 2013, 12:36:12 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 12:43:41 pm
Spider-Centaur progress...proceeding. They're at the same stage the vespulae were at on first playtest, which is to say Spiderling Uno fell over and suffocated. I can work with that.
Post by: BFEL on July 06, 2013, 12:44:11 pm
Is it ok if I take the BFEL play turn? I'll go ahead and start now, but I won't be shocked if you say no.
Yes, PLEASE. We seriously need someone to do that XD
Pretty sure we were working on a first come, first serve basis. You want to play, play! :)
Spider-Centaur progress...proceeding. They're at the same stage the vespulae were at on first playtest, which is to say Spiderling Uno fell over and suffocated. I can work with that.
What is your problem with creatures that breathe? XD Is it too loud for you? *ragged breathing* "STOP DAT!" *suffocates*
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 12:56:08 pm
Pretty sure we were working on a first come, first serve basis. You want to play, play! :)
Spider-Centaur progress...proceeding. They're at the same stage the vespulae were at on first playtest, which is to say Spiderling Uno fell over and suffocated. I can work with that.
What is your problem with creatures that breathe? XD Is it too loud for you? *ragged breathing* "STOP DAT!" *suffocates*
It's not the breathing that bothers me, it's those damn heads! So bulbous...and they have mouths...and can think...
*shudders*
It was the same issue as last time - I forgot to give them a functional head. They have them now and are working beautifully.
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:SPIDER_CENTAUR_STL]
[NAME:spider-centaur:spider-centaurs:spider-centaur]
[CREATURE_TILE:'C'][COLOR:7:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:The horrifically deformed victims of the Gods' Arena, merged with spiders by the Entomologist. The damage wreaked by their almost-deaths has stripped them of their self control and sanity, reducing them to gibbering wrecks.]
[PREFSTRING:horrific visages][PREFSTRING:deadly accuracy with the bow]
[CAN_SPEAK][CAN_LEARN]
[NOFEAR][PRONE_TO_RAGE:20]
[BODY:SPIDER_CENTAUR_STL:ARMS_HLG:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIDERLING_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_SIZE:46000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:4000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:12000]
[BODY_SIZE:10:0:46000]
[EXTRAVISION]
[MANNERISM_LAUGH]
[MANNERISM_BREATH]
[MANNERISM_HANDS:hand]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_NO_LATCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_SKIN_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_SPIDERLING_COLOR_STL]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE_NAME:spider-centauress:spider-centauresses:spider-centauress]
[LITTERSIZE:3:5]
[POP_RATIO:10]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[CASTE_NAME:spider-centaur:spider-centaurs:spider-centaur]
[POP_RATIO:9]
[CASTE:BRUTE]Bigger, smarter, more violent, and altogether a tougher foe.
[CASTE_NAME:spider-centaur brute:spider-centaur brutes:spider-centaur brute]
[POP_RATIO:1]
[BODY_SIZE:57000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:4000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:18000]
[BODY_SIZE:10:0:57000]
[TRANCES][PRONE_TO_RAGE:30]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:BOW:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:MACE:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:RANGED_COMBAT:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:MELEE_COMBAT:120]
[SKILL_LEARN_RATE:DODGING:120]
Say hello to the spider-centaur! They will be the first evil race - essentially, goblins. Combat testing, unarmed, has shown the average spiderling dies pretty easily to a Formic soldier...but the Spider-Centaur Brute squashes Formic troops like the bugs they are in one-on-one fisticuffs.
The relsizes for their bodies are slightly...uncanny, I'd think, if they were in real life. Imagine Slenderman with the body of a giant spider from the stomach down, and a mouth that wraps around to his ears. Then make him roughly 1.5X your size.
Code: [Select]
[ENTITY:CENTAUR]
[ADVENTURE_TIER:4]
[CREATURE:SPIDER_CENTAUR_STL]
[START_BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_WETLAND:5]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_TROPICAL_FOREST:3]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:TUNDRA:1]
[DEFAULT_SITE_TYPE:CAVE]
[LIKES_SITE:CAVE]
[TOLERATES_SITE:DARK_FORTRESS]
[TOLERATES_SITE:CITY]
[WORLD_CONSTRUCTION:TUNNEL]
[START_GROUP_NUMBER:10]
[MAX_POP_NUMBER:10000]
[MAX_SITE_POP_NUMBER:400]
[MAX_STARTING_CIV_NUMBER:4]
##JOBS##
[PERMITTED_JOB:MECHANIC]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MINER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:PLANTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:HERBALIST]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BREWER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BOWYER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOODCUTTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CARPENTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BLACKSMITH]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WEAPONSMITH]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ARMORER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:METALCRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MASON]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ANIMAL_CARETAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ANIMAL_TRAINER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRAPPER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOODCRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:STONECRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:LEATHERWORKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BONE_CARVER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WEAVER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLOTHIER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:FISHERMAN]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CHEESE_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MILKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SHEARER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SPINNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:COOK]
[PERMITTED_JOB:THRESHER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MILLER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BUTCHER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TANNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:DYER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SOAP_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:POTASH_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:LYE_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLERK]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ADMINISTRATOR]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRADER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ARCHITECT]
[PERMITTED_JOB:GLAZER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:POTTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:PRESSER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BEEKEEPER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WAX_WORKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:GLASSMAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOOD_BURNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:DIAGNOSER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BONE_SETTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SUTURER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SURGEON]
##PHILOSOPHY (SUCH AS IT WERE)##
[RELIGION:PANTHEON]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DEATH]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DARKNESS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:STARS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DEFORMITY]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:CHAOS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:NIGHTMARES]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:TREACHERY]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:DEFORMITY:1000]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:DEATH:900]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:DARKNESS:900]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:CHAOS:800]
"Ethics? We have what, now?"
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:LYING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:JUSTIFIED_IF_NO_REPERCUSSIONS]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:THEFT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TREASON:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:ACCEPTABLE]
[AMBUSHER]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:WINTER]
[ABUSE_BODIES]
[BEAST_HUNTER]
[SCOUT]
[ITEM_THIEF]
[LOCAL_BANDITRY]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POPULATION:2]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE:2]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POP_SIEGE:2]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE_SIEGE:2]
[SIEGE]
##ARSENAL##
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SPIKED_WHIP_STL]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_MORNINGSTAR_STL]
[WEAPON:SHORT_BOW_HLG]
[AMMO:SMALL_ARROW_HLG]
[WEAPON:SMALL_HATCHET_HLG]
[WEAPON:SMALL_HATCHET_METAL_HLG]
[HELM:HEADSCARF_STL:COMMON]
##Reactions##
[PERMITTED_REACTION:BREW_HONEYWINE_STL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CAST_CRUDE_ANVIL_HLG]
[USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS]
[USE_EVIL_ANIMALS]
[USE_EVIL_PLANTS]
[USE_EVIL_WOOD]
[USE_MISC_PROCESSED_WOOD_PRODUCTS]
[INDOOR_FARMING]
[OUTDOOR_FARMING]
[METAL_PREF]
[STONE_PREF]
[WOOD_WEAPONS]
[OUTDOOR_WOOD]
[POSITION:WARLORD]
[NAME:warlord:warlords]
[ALLOWED_CREATURE:SPIDER_CENTAUR_STL:BRUTE]
[SUCCESSION:BY_HEIR]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[CHAT_WORTHY]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[EXPORTED_IN_LEGENDS]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[FLASHES]
[PRECEDENCE:1]
[NUMBER:1]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION]
[RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_MAKING]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_GOALS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY]
[RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS]
[POSITION:SPEAKER]
[NAME:speaker:speaker]
[APPOINTED_BY:WARLORD]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[DUTY_BOUND]
[FLASHES]
[PRECEDENCE:2]
[NUMBER:5]
[PUNISHMENT_EXEMPTION]
[RESPONSIBILITY:ESTABLISH_COLONY_TRADE_AGREEMENTS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_INTRODUCTIONS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_PEACE_AGREEMENTS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MAKE_TOPIC_AGREEMENTS]
And their entity. [PROGRESS:DONE]
Time to see what other fun things I can add.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 01:56:43 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/uIdkJl9.jpg)
You can cut off someone's face...and they'll survive. I'm going to assume this is not intended behavior; any ideas on how to fix this?
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 04:29:31 pm
Also, consider that play turn yours :) update when on my comp.
Post by: squiddwarf16 on July 06, 2013, 04:54:45 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 04:56:37 pm
No, it's a completely intentional feature. Face enables slashing to face but is non-essential and non brain damaging unlike entire head - look at real life facial reconstruction needing people.
Well, it's odd, but it makes a kind of strange sense, I guess.
I did another...interesting playtest, to see that everything's working...and I learned at the worst possible time one particularly annoying, unplanned for thing that was removed: rock pots.
The poor hobbits of Aetherwild had nowhere to put their booze.
On top of that, I think the vaporization point of structural plant material might be a bit low to survive a scorching desert biome, as when I embarked not only did the wood hatchets vanish, the entire heartwood wagon disappeared. So, we had no way of storing booze, and no way of getting a way to store booze. The stagnant ponds became our sole source of water, and they evaporate very quickly, so I started digging basins next to the ponds, but underground, and linking them to the pond - the pond would flow into the basin and stay liquid long enough for us to drink. Unfortunately, the summer heat vaporized the water before it could collect underground, and everyone died of thirst and tantrumming - sometimes of thirst while tantrumming.
I'm going to genetically engineer a water worm species that we can milk for pure water to solve this problem. Rock pots are for dwarves.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 06, 2013, 05:20:01 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 05:26:01 pm
Code: [Select]
[MILKABLE:INORGANIC:WATER:9600]evidently does not work.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 06, 2013, 05:31:00 pm
You want [MILKABLE:WATER:9600]
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 05:53:19 pm
We now have Water Grubs.
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:WATER_GRUB_STL]
[NAME:water grub:water grubs:water grub]
[CASTE_NAME:water grub:water grubs:water grub]
[CREATURE_TILE:'w'][COLOR:1:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:A small grubworm prized by desert-dwellers for its ability to absorb and concentrate moisture in the air.]
[PREFSTRING:ability to secrete water]
[BODY:WORMY_BODY_STL:CYCLOPS_STL:MAW_STL:BRAIN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:1000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:1000]
[CHILD:1]
[LARGE_ROAMING][PET][ALL_ACTIVE][BENIGN][PETVALUE:70]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[BIOME:ANY_DESERT][MUNDANE][NATURAL][COMMON_DOMESTIC]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:3][POPULATION_NUMBER:4000:7000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MAW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[MILKABLE:WATER:9600]
They can be milked for one bucket of water every 8 days, and can be killed quite easily. Unless you somehow breed a small army of these and sequester them in a fortified chamber deep in the halfling fort/Formic hive (which would actually be in-character for Formics, I guess), they shouldn't be a viable source of water for a large settlement, but they should be able to help a small population survive the unforgiving desert early on, or tide a fort over during a siege if its reservoir gets captured, poisoned by future critters, or otherwise made an even less viable source of water.
Post by: Halfling on July 06, 2013, 05:55:12 pm
I did another...interesting playtest, to see that everything's working...and I learned at the worst possible time one particularly annoying, unplanned for thing that was removed: rock pots.
The poor hobbits of Aetherwild had nowhere to put their booze.
On top of that, I think the vaporization point of structural plant material might be a bit low to survive a scorching desert biome, as when I embarked not only did the wood hatchets vanish, the entire heartwood wagon disappeared.
snip
My material templates define a significantly lower temperature damage value and higher cold damage value (at -33 degrees Celsius) for materials by default because I felt like temperature was mostly insignificant in vanilla unless you're on fire, and this should be more interesting. Is it a feature or an issue? Changeable if latter. :P
Ok, I need some help here, I made an interaction that currently does nothing (since it's a test) other than give someone a title, and an ability to transfer that same interaction to another person. However, when ever I try the interaction in the Arena, it automatically uses it on itself, instead of allowing me to target someone else. I already gave it the tag that it won't work if they already have it, but it still does it. Any advice?
That shouldn't be, the design will work. Post raws!
Incidentally, I may not know much, but interactions are the thing I feel like I do know after making disease mod, interaction-based romance (for self only), demon quasispecies and some other things.
EDIT: I actually need to get offline for now and will take a look at it later, but did you have a [IT_MANUAL_INPUT:target] and [CDI:TARGET: line?
Post by: mastahcheese on July 06, 2013, 06:36:49 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This just a test, obviously, the interaction doesn't let them throw fireballs or anything, and the cooldown of the power is shortened so I can test it in the arena.
In an unrelated note, I had to make an alcohol template because there wasn't one first.
Also, we now have a booze making plant that I will now be testing.
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 06, 2013, 06:41:58 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Here is a map as of the end of Spring:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
The river is a few tiles to the north. As for the vampire thing, I am unsure of what happened, but it probably has something to do with the new vampire syndrome.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 06, 2013, 06:50:29 pm
First off, never seen the Age of Fairy Tales before, world started in it.
In 1, the Halfling Idiot Mightyflirty became the exalted stupidity of The Zealous Elder.
There is also mention of "The Darling of Dirts" and "The Halfwit of Past"
I like these languages.
Post by: BFEL on July 06, 2013, 07:39:56 pm
Wow, I just genned my first world of this to test my stuff, and laughed so hard when I looked at the Legends.
First off, never seen the Age of Fairy Tales before, world started in it.
In 1, the Halfling Idiot Mightyflirty became the exalted stupidity of The Zealous Elder.
There is also mention of "The Darling of Dirts" and "The Halfwit of Past"
I like these languages.
OH. MY. GOD. DASH HIRARIOUS
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 08:13:02 pm
Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:PROMETHIUM_ORE_STL]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:2:7:0][TILE:'*']
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:kazbekite]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten kazbekite]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:dust]
[ENVIRONMENT:IGNEOUS_ALL:VEIN:80]
[ITEM_SYMBOL:'*']
[TILE:156]
[METAL_ORE:PROMETHIUM_METAL_STL:100]
[SOLID_DENSITY:6000]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:15]
[IS_STONE]
[MELTING_POINT:12570]
[INORGANIC:PROMETHIUM_METAL_STL] Averaged stats of nickel and copper.
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:METAL_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:promethium]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten promethium]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:boiling promethium]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:2:0:0]
[BUILD_COLOR:0:2:0]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:15]
[SPEC_HEAT:435]
[MELTING_POINT:12286]
[BOILING_POINT:14927]
[ITEMS_ARMOR]
[SOLID_DENSITY:8865]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:7915]
[MOLAR_MASS:61120]
[IMPACT_YIELD:157500]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:665000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:107]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:157500]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:665000]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:107]
[TENSILE_YIELD:45000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:190000]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:34]
[TORSION_YIELD:45000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:190000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:86]
[SHEAR_YIELD:45000]
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:190000]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:86]
[BENDING_YIELD:45000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:190000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:34]
[MAX_EDGE:1000]
[IS_METAL]
[ITEMS_HARD][ITEMS_METAL][ITEMS_BARRED][ITEMS_SCALED]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:GREEN]
On names: My most recent world generated the delightful deity of balance "Halfwit the Tea of Brains". The current languages amuse me.
At JacenHanLovesLegoes (Star Wars much? :) ) : I feel an odd mix of irritation and embarrassment that I've been using halflings as test embarks and never once thought to call their delvings "hobbit holes".
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 06, 2013, 08:34:47 pm
About hobbit holes: I assumed that Halflings was a reference to Lord of the Rings, so it seemed natural to use the word hobbit-hole.
Also I appear to have stumbled upon a bug.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
EDIT: Nevermind, the wood-chopper became a vampire as I was playing.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 06, 2013, 09:10:24 pm
So many dead halflings...
EDIT: Confusion - very bad.
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:BREW_HONEYWINE_STL]
[NAME:brew honeywine]
[BUILDING:STILL:CUSTOM_M]
[REAGENT:A:30:LIQUID_MISC:NONE:CREATURE_MAT:APHIDIDA_STL:HONEYDEW][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:A_HOLDER:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][CONTAINS:A][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[REAGENT:B_HOLDER:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][FOOD_STORAGE_CONTAINER][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[PRODUCT:100:5:DRINK:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:A:DRINK_MAT][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:B_HOLDER][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:BREWING]
What did I do wrong? shouldn't [PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:B_HOLDER] make the honeywine go into the barrel properly?
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 06, 2013, 09:24:54 pm
Post by: Slothman400 on July 06, 2013, 10:31:36 pm
EDIT:I just thought about something that makes this idea so much cooler. Forgotten Beasts based on these creatures are going to be crazy.
Post by: Putnam on July 06, 2013, 10:34:00 pm
This is an awesome thread. I seriously need to learn how to work with the RAWs.
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Modding
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 07, 2013, 12:15:04 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 12:28:08 am
So the vampires have drained the blood of 5 of the six migrants that came in the summer. I think this is a pretty major bug and someone should look into it.
A quick peek into the raws and my own experience in the arena shows that the large number of vampires is actually probably more an unexpected feature than a bug. Vamps can spread their vampirism once (twice? it's a bit ambiguous) a year, and all halflings have an interaction to pray for vampirism. There's a low chance for their prayer to be granted, so perhaps you've just gotten particularly unlucky.
Post by: Putnam on July 07, 2013, 12:31:49 am
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 07, 2013, 12:41:37 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 12:59:53 am
There's nothing wrong with interactions that spread themselves. That's how my epidemics stuff works, and it does. But the parameters must be wrong here.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 07, 2013, 01:10:07 am
-Due to how halfling initially set things up to reduce lag, there are no eyes/noses/mouths, just "face"
-Vampires are prolific and everyone wants to be one, asking the gods for it yearly
-Almost all animals are insects, arachnids, or dragons, except for ducks and dogs.
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 01:15:40 am
Holy crap this thread moves fast. Can someone fill me in? From what I gather:
-Due to how halfling initially set things up to reduce lag, there are no eyes/noses/mouths, just "face"
-Vampires are prolific and everyone wants to be one, asking the gods for it yearly
-Almost all animals are insects, arachnids, or dragons, except for ducks and dogs.
1. No. That would be stupid and would be extremely visible in game. They have all the normal face parts, they are just connected to the face which is its own thing in the front of the head. They're right below the face in the raws, so, what? What they don't have, though, is eyelids and that is to save space and resources.
2. No. Creatures with the HAS_VAMPIRES ask for it ONCE in their lifetime, and asking it sets a syndrome flag that prevents repeating it ever. However, there may be some mistake in how this is executed - but I'll find it.
3. Yes :D
Post by: WillowLuman on July 07, 2013, 01:23:05 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 01:30:23 am
It just seems a bit odd that everyone's fondest dream is to become a vampire, so much that everyone prays for it at least once. Obviously, we must add some severe downsides to the whole vampire thing. I see we've got bat transformation, any skin-boiling metal syndromes?
>It just seems a bit odd that everyone's fondest dream is to become a vampire, so much that everyone prays for it at least once.
That's just fluff text. It could be cut just off as easily, since halflings autoperform that interaction. They must perform an interaction on themselves so that a fixed percentage of them are vampires regardless of world gen. Adventurers don't do it automatically no matter what you do, and this text shows for them and is semi-informative there.
>Obviously, we must add some severe downsides to the whole vampire thing.
Your vampires randomly clawing everyone else, including migrants, traders, diplomats and so on, to death?
Post by: WillowLuman on July 07, 2013, 01:33:52 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 01:36:23 am
No, downsides for the vampires themselves. There are ways to ensure vampires and other transformees, namely by having several semi-megabeast "Ur" ones generate who are set to be more prolific but die out relatively quickly.
How does the latter work?
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 01:38:58 am
Post by: WillowLuman on July 07, 2013, 01:41:07 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 01:43:46 am
Post by: WillowLuman on July 07, 2013, 01:53:04 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 02:03:10 am
On that note - my 60 halflings and hounds in a room with 4 vampires have produced zero additional vampires in what is almost half a year. The vampires have already begun slashing stuff, and it seems to work as intended. As it should since I did test them before too... making me all the more baffled. They show no signs of making more vampires in under a season.
(http://s24.postimg.org/4dbb9v885/hh10.png)
Can I get that save where they're breeding madly to inspect? Or even better, some clue as to how it looks in the raws on Windows?
Post by: WillowLuman on July 07, 2013, 02:07:32 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 02:45:42 am
(http://s18.postimg.org/uvmuikcuh/hh11.png)
Spoiler: syndrome status, non-vampire (click to show/hide)
Next up: let's see if fortress mode somehow messes it up.
Found one bug straight up: vampires are visible right away. That's going to go.
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 03:06:02 am
Apparently everything works fine until you save and reload in fort mode, and at that point EVERYONE TURNS INTO A VAMPIRE. There's no problem with the interactions themselves and I have absolutely no explanation. And this does not happen in the disease mod either.
Seriously, what the "#¤%"#%?
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 03:40:11 am
The exact changes were
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
New version with apparent fix uploaded. Please redownload and overwrite... and sorry, Jacen.
There seems to be some confusion so as to how this all works, so short explanation
- The "pray for vampirism" is available to all with HAS_VAMPIRES and can be targeted on self daily, but target cannot have VAMPIRISM_SET class syndrome. So once it's done once, cannot target self -> anyone again.
- Using it gives with 100% certainty a VAMPIRISM_SET syndrome that's permanent (only pray once per lifetime) and with 10% probability a chance to go to the next step via another similar interaction. Cannot proceed to next step if you have VAMPIRISM_DETERMINED, a redundant safeguard.
- The next step always sets VAMPIRISM_DETERMINED permanently, and with 1% chance makes you able to spread vampirism to yourself only as if you were a vampire already. This then makes you a vampire once done. So all in all you have a 0.1% chance in lifetime to become a vampire if you are a creature with HAS_VAMPIRES.
- Vampires, then, can spread it, bypassing all other interactions, 2x/year after a DF year (28x12x1200 phases) and start slashing things with a delay too. These effects don't start immediately so as to not have cascades.
What seemed to be the problem was that not having defined whom the syndrome affects somehow made it affect everyone upon DF reload? Still not sure, but my test saves and reloads no longer turn people who aren't supposed to be vampires into vampires.
Post by: BFEL on July 07, 2013, 09:26:53 am
I mean really VAMPIRESPLOSION? I love that this happened. I feel much less stupid now.
Not to say Halfling is stupid, just nice to know the inexplicable bugs happen to other people
In entirely unrelated news, I have just made my first cheesecake.
It is chocolate, and menaces with spikes of chocolate chips. Also finely-minced blueberry topping.
Post by: JacenHanLovesLegos on July 07, 2013, 10:01:28 am
Also, this might be one of the most hilarious bugs I've encountered.
Post by: squiddwarf16 on July 07, 2013, 10:20:53 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 10:35:10 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 11:00:50 am
I mean really VAMPIRESPLOSION? I love that this happened. I feel much less stupid now.
Not to say Halfling is stupid, just nice to know the inexplicable bugs happen to other people
Also, this might be one of the most hilarious bugs I've encountered.
That's why playtesting is like the second most common word I've said this thread. :D
Also, I found a vein of jaded slade in fortress mode. Saved my halflings from dying of thirst, too. Nice. Interesting how it had an aquifer deep in the earth.
Is today the day I must upload my work? I think it's been a week, but it's summer and my time sense is on vacation.
Yes, I think today's the day. I'm not assuming you don't really know what to do, but here's the checklist for the benefit of all:
. Download and merge with newest raws from previous turns if you didn't yet
- Make sure it still works without errorlog (other than the PAW and WORD SELECTOR stuff)
- Upload - providing a (preferably longer) description of what you added, these summaries are probably going to be most important way for people to follow what actually happened during turns later because it's been 10 pages of discussion per turn. I'll then link it in the first post.
- We'll auction the play turn
- You now have 1 week bugfixing time. I'm actually going to change this to say "until end of play turn" in the rules because that makes more sense. You are allowed to add more stuff as needed or if you really want to, but it must work, and don't remake your old things like bodies anymore unless a fix needs it because laula will be working based on them.
- After that, feel free to make further suggestions anyway!
I can start a play turn later today as long as you guys are fine with videos instead of in character stories.I think we'll be fine with that. Would you mind giving BFEL raws a whirl? :)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 11:17:37 am
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 11:24:58 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 11:30:30 am
Code: [Select]
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:HEMOLYMPH_TEMPLATE_STL] Hemolymph - the gray stuff that fills bugs' insides. "Ichor" - ha! I defy thee, Toady. Name it right.
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:GRAY]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen hemolymph]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen hemolymph]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:BLUE]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:hemolymph]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:hemolyph]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:BLUE]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:spattering hemolymph]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:spattering hemolymph]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:3:0:0]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:1]
[SPEC_HEAT:1000]
[MELTING_POINT:10000]
[BOILING_POINT:10180]
[HEATDAM_POINT:10100]
[COLDDAM_POINT:8950] Lower colddam point because hemolymph confers some protection against freezing. Hopefully this will do something.
[LIQUID_DENSITY:NONE]
[SOLID_DENSITY:500]
[MOLAR_MASS:NONE]
[IMPACT_YIELD:10000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:10000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[TENSILE_YIELD:10000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:10000]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[TORSION_YIELD:10000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:10000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[SHEAR_YIELD:6600] used high salinity ice
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:6600]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[BENDING_YIELD:10000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:10000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:100]
[MAX_EDGE:500]
[ABSORPTION:100]
[IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL]
[ROTS]
[BLOOD_MAP_DESCRIPTOR]
The template, and how I define the blood material in the creature raws:
Code: [Select]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 11:31:09 am
The following raws provide the intended result - hemolymph bleeding halflings:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
So I'm going to say the problem could be
1. Either incorrect material reference in creature or b_detail_plan
2. Incorrect file header or similar bug outside the materials
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 11:50:56 am
I'm just cleaning up some unused templates I made. I'll upload the raw folder soon.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 01:05:40 pm
There we go! Changelog is included on the file download page. Next modder, go ahead - and playtesters, go ahead and playtest, if you will.
EDIT: Um...yeah. There seems to be some sort of glitch in the title naming for the Formic High Queen, as a legitimate member of the Queen caste held the position in my latest world and received the name I'd intended for males to make glitches obvious.
All Hail Alhalal Whitewaves, "What the Hell" of the Red Gods!
EDIT2: And the question from a few days prior has been answered: there are quivers, definitively.
Post by: squiddwarf16 on July 07, 2013, 02:27:53 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 02:41:55 pm
Reading those raws made me a little giddy. So much loving attention to detail, apt usage of tags and funny commentary. I'm also really curious to see how some of those creatures work in fortress mode. Definitely recommended.
Adding to first post.
I wonder if there's some clever way to make creatures worship proper gods like "the Entomologist" without manual dfhack renaming.
Post by: squiddwarf16 on July 07, 2013, 02:59:44 pm
Also fraps is being difficult and slow so im gonna try to just do a written update
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 03:18:18 pm
Slight problem, things made of frostheart tree heartwood immediately self-destruct because the tree's fixed temperature (-555.6 Celsius, well below absolute zero?) is lower than the colddam point specified by the plant structure material template it uses.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 03:25:06 pm
@Halfling: Huh...did not foresee that issue. I should probably boost the temperature, too. And good to know the ants are asserting themselves properly :)
EDIT: A warning for those playing Formics - the Regent is not afraid to mete out punishments by himself, it seems, and if he's of the soldier caste he can really do a number on his worker brethren. Bastard put my best miner out of commission for months...
EDIT2: Also, don't make your doors non-pet-passable. For whatever reason, even the non-Queen Formics can't use them then, it appears.
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 03:41:17 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 03:43:29 pm
Well, the mandatory post-release day 1 patch is looking like it'll have an amusing changelog.
EDIT: And in pride-salving other news, the formics just made the river god their bitch and tapped a brook to make an underground river.
EDIT2: VESPULAE SWAAARM
FINAL EDIT: Yep, all seems to be working well. First caravan came alongside the vespulae swarm, the Vox Regina showed up as expected, the traders were using pack beetles, and the guards were actually of the soldier caste. I'll fix the door issue and the frostheart quirks. Any other bugs that have jumped out?
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 04:14:40 pm
Post by: squiddwarf16 on July 07, 2013, 04:44:32 pm
Year 78. Age of The Two Storm Dragons
Granite the 1st. This seems like a good place to stop... A nice meandering river... A hill for some hobbit holes...
only problem is the hill is on the other side of the river. No one here is good at anything so I sent
Elder Blackplain to chop trees while I gather some plants. We should have prepared better..
11th of Granite Dark Reaperheroic said that her dad was an architect so she knows how to build a bridge, so I sent him to build one out of apple-wood.
12th Yore piepast looks smart... Gonna make her the official book keeper.
I also heard from Elder that Aether Darlinghog is in a relationship with Guard Seatundras... Interesting.
Also the bridge is done. Blossom Glacierdeadly has been sent to dig.
13th Sent Guard to start tilling fields. We will have Pumpkins soon!
16th the holes are done! now we just need to make some doors...
20th Had Blossom dig an area for some workshops. doors are on their way!
22nd set Dark up to build beds, chairs, and doors. Aether is gonna start moving logs in near the workshop area.
27th gonna start on a trade depot. Yore can build it.
`
4th of Slate I've decided to ban the export of amulets. ALL THE AMULETS SHALL BE MINE!!
12th Blossom says he wants to try his hand at making wooden crafts. It cant hurt to let him try can it?
16th it seems we have run out of food. at least we have pumpkins growing...
25th A pack of wild hounds has arrived! I think Your chucked a rock at one of them...
10th of Felsite. I now have a fairly decent area to work in my hole now. It could be better but it will suffice for now.
14th Yore just told me that he killed one of the wild hounds... tore up its guts with a thrown rock.
20th We just about used p all of this hill with hobbit holes... there is one to the south of us that we can use to expand.
25th it started raining today. Yore now has an office for record keeping.
This is the end of the spring entry.
(OOC) I decided to try the halflings out since I thought that playing as bugs was a bug at first. also no photos. sorry.)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 07, 2013, 05:09:15 pm
StLeibowitz, did you make an alcohol template for your stuff? I've made one but I want it to be more distinguished.
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 05:25:11 pm
snip
I'm loving that "hobbit holes" carved in the hillside are how you play hobbits now. As it should be. Looking forward to seeing what happens when the fort grows!
Ok, Since my interaction is still failing, I've been working on a crop that actually gives alcohol.
StLeibowitz, did you make an alcohol template for your stuff? I've made one but I want it to be more distinguished.
Oh yeah, sorry. Your interaction to make contagious wizards works fine, with the following changes:
in target A, +[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:target] for easier testing
and result -
(http://s23.postimg.org/u9shyajwb/wiztest.png)
If you at some point want to make a fixed part of the population contagious wizards without using extra castes or needing to rely on divine curses, could pretty much reuse my vampire parts too since they do exactly that except for vampirism.
Leibowitz has an alcohol template, but as with everything above, that doesn't mean you can't make your own :P
Edit: also, I think you want to add a START:0 to the display name part.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 05:59:47 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 07, 2013, 06:25:28 pm
1. This probably shouldn't have happened:
(http://s8.postimg.org/g05my7f79/jadedslade.png)
Also, should those be larva and not children? :P
2. Playing as the formics is very cool. Very alien feeling. Congrats. Might need a play guide though, or a summary of what the castes and new nobles do for one who does not want to read the raws.
3. I had no problems with milking aphids and brewing honeydew. However, is 1 unit of honeydew supposed to produce 25 units of wine? That's how much you get from milking one aphid once.
If not, I think it's because the dimension 30 determines the product amount and does not correspond to "1 unit of honeydew". Could set it to a higher number, with 150 being for 1, or add 1 more [DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT] - using one bucket of honeydew always nets 5 units of wine.
The latter also makes it go into barrels properly. A stack of 25 honey wine does not fit in a barrel and that's why they were just pouring it on the floor.
(http://s16.postimg.org/htpb42511/honeywine.png)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 07:48:28 pm
Also, a suggestion for the next modder: cheaper metal for tools. Meteoric Iron, Jaded Slade, and Celestium are all pretty high-quality, and very pricey, and Promethium isn't a tool metal (I could make it one in the patch as a stopgap, perhaps).
EDIT: Missed Item 1 in your list. Properly, they should really be 'nymphs', as I don't know how to make DF model metamorphoses or a larval stage well. They're mini-adults, so nymphs would make sense. Also, what shouldn't have happened? The mallard fat food?
EDIT2: Ah, crap. I'll have to define the general child name for each creature; seems hiding it in the variation isn't working like I thought.
Post by: Slothman400 on July 07, 2013, 08:12:51 pm
We need humans to battle the formics, but humans with swords and shields and castles would be too vanilla. Modern humans would be much more interesting. Vanilla humans with better tech would out-compete everything in world gen, and be boring. So here's my idea; Human survivors. They could wear lots of leather and fight with golf clubs, baseball bats, knives and guns. They could act quite a bit like kobolds, i.e. living in camps, stealing, ambushing.
Sadly, I have made little progress learning to mod. What do you guys think of my ideas?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 10:23:56 pm
=======================
Formics: An Introductory Course
Well, first things first: Formics are a caste-based society that is modeled on ant hives. They are divided into four castes, which I'll get into in a second, but one of the most important things to remember is this: don't get attached to the buggers. The vast majority of them will not see their eighth* birthday.
Two other important differences from Halflings and the mythical dwarves: they do not sleep, and they have exoskeletons. Their chitinous exteriors make them far more durable than only-flesh-and-bone softskins could be, but due to the rather violent and equally chitinous nature of much of the fauna they need this advantage just to be able to go toe-to-tarsus in battle. Their lack of sleep means you will never need to build a bed outside of a hospital - the tyranny of the Third Migration Wave is over! No more rush to build a giant dormitory or (oh God why) individual bedrooms for the new migrants; they wouldn't appreciate it even if you did. This does, however, come with drawbacks.
The Caste System
Workers
These are the bedrock of Formic society, and of Formic colonies that you found. They are by far the most numerous, but also a bit dim-witted - they learn all skills except fishing, farming, mining, and wood cutting at 60% efficiency. At fishing, farming, mining, and wood cutting, they improve their skills 20% faster, though - and they'll need all that speed, because they'll keel over at the ripe old age of 5. They are literally born ready to work, though, or very nearly so, so any domestically produced workers will provide more use than immigrants. Their tiles flash between 'A' and 'w', to help pick them out of a crowd.
Soldiers
Born shock troops, Formic soldiers are bigger than any other caste save the Queens. They learn Formic-related combat skills faster (spear, sword, dodging, shield, and fighting), but where they really shine is their ability to enter martial trances. The also feel no fear, and so will fight to the death to defend the hive. As a downside, they have 3 years of useless resource sucking before being able to take up a scimitar; they do, however, live longer than the workers - up to 12 years if you're lucky, allowing them time to earn some experience and train the next generation. Their tiles flash from 'A' to 's'.
For those poor softskin-players whose Halflings start at war with the Formics, take note that Formic Soldiers are trapavoid. Have fun with that :)
Drones
Drones are there for breeding. That is basically all they should be used for - producing babbies, and artisan jobs that workers have trouble grasping. They have neither skill bonuses nor maluses, and are larger than the average worker (not quite soldier-size); they also live for up to thirty years. Most importantly, they are exceptionally rare - 150 times less likely to be born than workers, and 50 times less likely than a soldier - and thus should be protected almost as well as a Queen. Whatever you do, don't send these guys to the front lines against the spider-centaurs - not unless you have backups. If you only have one, send a legendary miner worker to battle ahead of him, for the Queen's sake. Workers are expendable. Drones, less so.
Queens
The immortal female caste of the Formics. They are incredibly rare - 1500 times less likely than a worker! - and incredibly valuable. A single queen is not picky about what male she mates with (no husbands!), and can produce as many as 8 nymphs at once. If you get a Queen, protect her - keep her in a well-provisioned chamber deep under a mountain, with a labyrinth of atom smashers between her and potential threats, or something similarly thorough, because in all likelihood if she dies you will never see another. If you have a queen, workers are basically expendable, and a single Queen and Drone together could theoretically repopulate an entire hive after some kind of magma-related apocalypse, though how that would happen I'm not sure, since I don't think we have any magma-safe materials to make a pump stack out of.
Queens are the largest caste of Formics as well, so their size should provide some measure of defense against the average home invader, but I recommend not ever letting it become a factor.
The Nobility
Allets
Formic word for "chief". This is an expedition leader. He is your broker and that guy who meets with dissatisfied workers and such, as well as judge and jury in the Hive in the Everqueen's name.
Ashalim
...and this guy is your executioner. None of those sissy dwarven hammerings, either - just a sharpened scimitar to cut down any fool worker who decided to disobey his superior. Additionally he fills the role of militia commander, and leads the as-scuteri squad in defense of the hive.
Scribe
A combination manager/record keeper, of whom you can have three.
Mesarthim
The Ashalim's subordinates, in charge of mes-scuteri squads (basically, the militia, though thanks to the biological caste system this holds a bit more weight than it does among softskins)
Chirurgeon General
Chief medical formic. Not much else to say.
Regent
The chief representative of the Everqueen in each settlement. Properly, a drone, though often a member of a lower caste if they prove capable. They expect rather odd quarters for Formics, but then, folks in power tend to be a bit eccentric, right? In any case, they'd very much like a bedroom, and some other rooms. They can impose demands and mandates, too, so you'll have those to deal with.
The Everqueen
The immortal goddess-queen herself. Always a member of the Queen caste, and if she ever shows up at your fortress I had no part in it because I haven't a clue how to properly work monarch-arrival thing, if it's even possible. If she does, though, hey - free Queen!
On Alcohol
Insects are not immune to drunkenness, sadly. While Honeywine is safer than water reservoirs due to its inability to be contaminated with lovely syndromes, Formics will get drunk off of it as well. Like with haflings, it's a good idea to maintain some form of safe water cistern for drinking purposes.
----------------------------------------
*eighth is perhaps the single most awkward word in english to spell, which I realized when typing.
===============================
And that's the quick-reference guide to Formic society. Have fun, don't talk to strange insects, etcetera.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 07, 2013, 11:40:48 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 01:11:21 am
And actually, rather than bothering with castes or whatever, I was thinking on adding in a friendly trading race that would bring in the wizards.
Also, on that note, I read on the wiki that if a creature has the SUPERNATURAL tag, along with a sphere token, it will automatically give that creature access to any secrets that sphere has.
Would my interaction allow me to infect people with supernaturalism and a sphere token? That way adding new powers for them along with new sphere would be relatively easy, along with giving magic a more distinct flavor in-game.
And yeah, I went ahead and made my own alcohol template.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 08, 2013, 01:25:04 am
Also I suppose I'll start working on some more inorganics. That was going to be the focus of my turn anyways, since everybody else went to town on creatures and/or entities. I've got my uber-metal and its requisites mostly complete, and I still haven't finished my TESTING to see if you can, indeed, put creatures in Hell, so now seems like a good time to make things from our templates. We also need a gem template, I'll be getting on that.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 01:27:16 am
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 02:24:12 am
Sadly, I have made little progress learning to mod. What do you guys think of my ideas?
An alternative human civ might be good. There's many ways it could go like dark, militaristic humans, steampunk humans, thrall humans, indeed thieving human survivalists... the latter is a pretty cool idea. I'm not sure if I would go for modern tech, but if someone adds it, why not. There's plenty of older tech that could be used too, like arquebuses and catapults.
I haven't tested this explicitly, but I have a feeling that Jaded Slade is showing up as a usable material because it lacks [SPECIAL]. I know from the wiki that [SPECIAL] is implied by both [DEEP_SURFACE] and [DEEP_SPECIAL], and from experience that adamantine and slade will never show up in caravans... so theoretically, [SPECIAL] would keep it out of caravans without restricting it to hell
Yes, my point was that since BFEL's jaded slade is supposed to be undiggable and a special material, it's a little stupid that you can just buy it at embark or from caravans. That might work, should try it.
We definitely need some minerals in this, so great timing!
I don't know how to make DF model metamorphoses or a larval stage well.
First you would need something that sorts creatures by body size. Then:
- Create a "larva" creature, either generic for all insects or one for every insect. Either one will work.
- Your creature has an interaction to transform itself into a larva for the development period if its bodysize is small (or age is small)
Would be several advantages to that approach, like larva not being able to open doors. The main problem here is you need something that lets the creature know what age or size it is.
Linking your play guide to 1st post.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 02:31:09 am
Also, I made my alcohol template give people nausea to simulate being drunk. Vomit, just vomit everywhere.
I spent so long making a tower out of the nice, uniform, generic "rock" and my Halflings painted it a lovely hue of vomit.
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 02:45:39 am
Post by: BFEL on July 08, 2013, 06:44:42 am
Also, I found a vein of jaded slade in fortress mode. Saved my halflings from dying of thirst, too. Nice. Interesting how it had an aquifer deep in the earth.
NOOOOOOOOOOOO that was supposed to annoy you not save you dammit LOL. Just kidding, though it IS meant to annoy people, its nice someone found a use for it. And on that note:
Oh man, OCD people are going to flip the freak out when they play this mod, all right. That Jaded Slade, man, you are one cruel person.
And don't you forget it! I might be really newbish in my modding technique, but damned if I can't give you an aneurism when I want to :P
Also the Jaded Slade being brought by caravans and such IS kinda intentional. As some people have found ways to mine undiggable stone, I wanted the world to reflect that, its supposed to be really rare and crazy valuable though, don't know how well I did on that part.
By the way, has anyone made any vermin hunting pets yet? If not I would like to put together a few raws for that sorta thing and submit them to whoevers turn it is, if that's ok with you guys?
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 06:55:26 am
(http://s22.postimg.org/5t4yfyb0x/hh13.png)
However, there's some new issues.
(http://s12.postimg.org/i0iwepbql/hh14.png)
(http://s24.postimg.org/4pmq33l0l/hh15.png)
1. Heartwood furniture and goods slowly self-destruct in adventure mode (but not always for some unknown reason), and so your gear if that's the wood type it's made of at embark/start. If you happen to be there at the right time you can actually see the XXdoorsXX before they evaporate. Not only is this probably inconvenient in many ways in e.g. trade, it results in significant lag spikes with the game getting stuck for seconds at a time every 10 steps or so, at least for me, when moving around in towns and villages as the furniture around me is periodically destroy en masse. Overall, this was annoying enough for me to manually fix by setting the fixed temp to 9970 (9999 would be enough to make it freeze water).
2. Spider centaur bandits do not apparently have equipment, or clothes, despite being able to wield items in arena mode.
3. Tall grass waving in the wind is a really nice touch. Neat.
4. Pack beetles are insane. Never, ever piss one off or even go near one - lost two good adventurers, one of them a formic soldier, to instakills by them (lower body ripped off). This is to be expected if you look at their raws.
5. Jaded slade is crazy common. Finding stuff made of it in keeps, fortresses etc. is not unusual at all. In fact the first castle I visited was made entirely of it and contained a slade bow among other things, and people of various civilizations can come with slade equipment. This is probably because you can make most anything from it, it's present everywhere and civs don't care that you're not supposed to be able to mine it. It's not even a metal so your civ doesn't need to be able to smelt to use it, you can just magically make it into anything that's [ITEMS_HARD] or WEAPON] or ARMOR] or the rest. If this is not the intention, could make a gateway reaction for its use (process jaded slade chunk to usable form) or the [SECRET] part above.
>has anyone made any vermin hunting pets yet?
Leibowitz has one, the theraphosa. Still free to suggest more though.
Post by: mocman on July 08, 2013, 07:06:21 am
So basicly my idea for this would be that the popRatio whisps would be equivilant to 2 times the total of all other castes.
And thus on modder turns anyone could add to these unique creatures types.
Also my Artisans Civilization based on trading aspects that when used in a 'Aspect Assembler' can create any generic version of raw material like 'low quality metal bars' or 'brick stone' or 'generic wood' possibly jaded slade aswell for a lot of aspect.
Basicly you are rewarded for making peace with the Artisans.
Post by: BFEL on July 08, 2013, 07:09:36 am
As much as I like the idea that everyone else in the world finds it completely common and uninteresting while your civ finds it frustrating and undiggable, that was certainly not the intention.
And I personally like the custom reaction idea, though I don't know how to implement it.
I'll go start work on the Sea Angels, a race of flying manta rays that hunt vermin (as well as larger prey) for their Halfling masters.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 08, 2013, 07:18:54 am
If the wood is cyan, then it's actually frostheart wood - genuine heartwood should be brown. I just fixed the fixed temperature of the stuff, so frostheart should no longer freeze itself into nonexistence.
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 07:25:10 am
To be fair, I just visited a halfling keep completely without slade items, so it's not always. Still, if nobody else wants to try their hand, I'll make a reaction needed to make jaded slade chunks you can mine usable later today (move all usability tokens from jaded_slade to jaded_slade_usable copy material, and add reaction item:none:none:inorganic:jaded_slade -> stone:none:inorganic:jaded_slade_usable at smelter).
Also I've now seen a halfling city loyalty cascade and go down in genocidal civil war and madness twice, eerily. I wonder if it has something to do with a halfling child with a formic name being present at both places.
EDIT: a closer look at legends shows that those strange kids were probably innocent and it was rather my adventurer who had (somehow?) ended up getting the blame for killing someone I had not even met. This probably happened when there was a random bloodbath near an evaporating door at the start of the adventure. If it happens again needs to be looked into, but happens in vanilla too occasionally.
Post by: BFEL on July 08, 2013, 08:26:21 am
First I forgot their body doesn't include eyes, so fixed that quickly with EXTRAVISION, and have found their Fire Stinger interaction is awesome, probably overpowered actually (I just copied the throw rocks from halflings, but made it rapid fire. So yeah scary.)
Secondly I forgot to give them a tissue thickness, so every attack made on them "passes right through" making them invincible.
One is now fighting a treelord to a standstill in the background (I have now seen "treelord molten skin" for the first time :P)
Oh, also the Sea Angels cant swim. :P
BTW did you know a Treelord thrown into lava will drown before it melts? I do!
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 08:48:11 am
(http://s22.postimg.org/61k7geitt/formic_1.png)
Aasalkh... forgive me, I'm not going to repeat that - a formic worker axeman. He had a small meteoric iron hatchet and was part of the fortress guard.
(http://s22.postimg.org/mdu964x5d/formic_2.png)
"Praise death." Cheerful folk. This one was armed with a jaded slade lance.
(http://s22.postimg.org/le3yafhzl/formic_4.png)
This bowman of the guard did not carry any arrows and was looking a little weak and exhausted, despite performing his duty like a busy ant.
(http://s22.postimg.org/54ds7j7bl/formic_5.png)
A closer look revealed why. Furthermore this seemed to be a common condition among the fortress soldiers. I was given no explanation. [note: this is without the fix. It's likely their arrows or equipment was destroyed and also froze them. It's possible it still does if the temperature is not something relatively modest, even if it no longer auto-destructs]
(http://s22.postimg.org/3msbvz2kx/formic_3.png)
I had the honor of meeting the Formic Everqueen. She had an... interesting... past, having been a shearer since long before the beginning of time.
I then went to meet the spider-centaurs. These strange creatures scream with rage and attack you on sight, completely in the nude and without equipment. They would be easy to take down, if not for the fact that they do not have or need blood of any kind, nor bleed. I have been trying to kill one for what seems like an eternity. It is passed out there on the moss, completely helpless, and seemingly invulnerable to attack by my halfling-sized tools of violence no matter what I try. As I write this I have built a campfire under it to see if that would kill it. On the positive side, I'm starting to really get the hang of axe-fighting after all my futile attempts at chopping it to death.
Note: Finally killed one after half a day of chopping away at its skull with my new +small celestium hatchet+ I found just lying there on the floor of the formic fortress.
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 10:12:57 am
(http://s8.postimg.org/pe4y6ya1h/hh16.png)
The more notable ones kill thousands in worldgen as they should. They are also a freaking pain to kill because given the chance, they'll just transform into bats and fly away much faster than you can run. Definitely suggested to bring a lynch mob. And "you are bleeding all over" syndrome does not seem to work well in adv. mode, only killing very slowly if at all, because of the time frame difference, but there's probably no good way to fix this while keeping it still remotely survivable in fort mode.
(http://s21.postimg.org/ag2fe8qyf/hh17.png)
That's so much DF for one day, gotta stop. Just so much fun to have a new world and so many new things. :P
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 10:51:25 am
I'm going to add a bit more to the alcohol template to simulate a hangover and then I will ask for it to be added in.
Then on get back to work on wizards.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 08, 2013, 11:01:26 am
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 11:09:49 am
Make sure to add [SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:BOOZER] so we can have alcohol dependent races if need be.YYEESSSS.............
EDIT:Posted (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7812)
Post by: WillowLuman on July 08, 2013, 11:38:56 am
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=42059.810
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 11:45:40 am
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 12:26:11 pm
Jaded slade fixes! Added them to the BFEL raws pack since I'm still managing that. Can be downloaded there. New files (overwrite):
Spoiler: reaction_slade_processing_hlg.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: inorganic_bfel.txt (click to show/hide)
Description: Jaded slade is initially in unusable form, leaves chunks titled "raw jaded slade" if dug. This or any form of raw jaded slade, when obtained by any means, can then be "reconstituted" at a smelter for free using strand extraction to yield the omni-usable material that was before called simply "jaded slade". Also fixes incorrect object names and purges "CLAY" which was a copypaste of vanilla's MATERIAL_TEMPLATE_STONE with tail part of vanilla's CLAY copypasted at the end (so also declaring solid_density twice, once for both sources of copypasting).
Update & overwrite when you have the time to fix issues <3
Edit: fixed according to below
Post by: Person on July 08, 2013, 02:15:50 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 02:24:12 pm
However, there's more bad news:
Finding jaded slade regardless has uncovered a new critical bug. Civs don't have access to metals. It apparently just picks a plausible material at random when a civ does not have access to suitable materials, as seems to be always the case for formics' weapons and halflings' shovels. That's something we may need to work on too. It went unnoticed so far because halflings aren't supposed to have metals and when they randomly had meteoric iron it seemed plausible.
This has the following consequence specifically, showing how it's bugged: You get random material items at embark. If you remove your selection of that item (e.g. jaded slade shovel) then you can in no way select a new one or replace it.
With halflings this is semi-intended as they shouldn't have access to metals anyway, the problem is only they get those random shovels and the game insists they must be metal regardless of whether logically possible. Thus I can fix this pretty easily: add [STONE_PREF] just to be sure, remove [DIGGER:SMALL_SHOVEL_HLG] (can still be made at craftsman's via my custom reaction to make wooden shovel, and used). Since I'm forced to tinker around with halflings more I'm going to add some more flavor stuff too I hadn't figured out earlier:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
As for formics, I have no idea why they don't actually have access to metals and are forced to fall back on random picks. Maybe it's related to the problem of unarmed spider centaurs? Maybe not.
That said, yeah, it keeps happening, but please update & overwrite minimal world/BFEL pack when you have the chance/interest.
Edit: It's possible formics don't have access to metals because they aren't allowed to be furnace operators. One way how this could have happened is if you took part of my halfling professions. They don't get to have furnace operators so they don't get metal by default (can still train operators in fortress mode), but formics probably should be allowed that job. Just a guess, not that knowledgeable about entities.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 08, 2013, 03:54:14 pm
Mastahcheese, I'll incorporate your alcohol template and switch honeywine over to using it. Should make water grub unions happy! :)
Also, Halfling again: The frostbite effect happened even with the temperature fix I added, so I'm thinking it might be a result of chitin's colddam point. Makes sense, lore-wise, if you were in a snowy biome (my test adventurer was, and experienced frostbite); they're a desert species and shouldn't handle cold well. If not, well...frostheart might be moving down a cavern layer to join its incendiary cousin, and I'll need to add another cavern wood for level 1.
EDIT: I manually merged the new BFEL raws. The extraction reaction has been inserted straight into the original halfling reaction file - that okay?
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 04:10:43 pm
Sure, don't really care where it is, although why not just download, copy and paste the files? :P
Make sure to get the new halfling creature and entity raws too to fix the shovels issue (and to make hobbits more capable of passing unseen by most if they choose). Either from newest upload of minimal world or BFEL, updated both. Thanks.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 08, 2013, 04:26:18 pm
EDIT: Tweaking of Breakbone Fever to make it more realistic is amusing. Dengue has generalized muscle pain as a symptom, but it seems translated into DF terms that SEV:50 pain from every muscle in the body is literally like breaking every bone he has, in terms of visible results (i.e., collapses like a sack of potatoes).
EDIT2: Even SEV:5 is too much for him. Wimp.
EDIT3: SEV:1. That is the most they can stand. This makes me want to never experience what DF considers SEV:100 pain.
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 04:43:58 pm
In other news, I came across this.
(http://s23.postimg.org/p6j3m3bfv/elf_civ.png)
Actually I found a halfling town ruled by a castle full of elves. With halfling names. No treelords in sight. This is a little surprising to me since elves have UTTERANCES in this mod.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 04:58:59 pm
Mastahcheese, I'll incorporate your alcohol template and switch honeywine over to using it. Should make water grub unions happy! :)Sweet! Drunkenness for everyone!
Post by: Person on July 08, 2013, 05:19:18 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 05:36:41 pm
As for the formics, the problem was that they had copied the halflings' incomplete metalworking jobs. Their equipment must be made of metal and was set to be made of random things as a consequence. Once I manually gave them the furnace operating job to try it, they gained access to metals at embark. Leibowitz's current uploaded version does not have this fix yet though.
We'll probably get more stone and materials by that time, but shall I sign you up for a turn regardless?
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 08, 2013, 05:38:30 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 05:38:48 pm
They keep using their interaction that grants a friendly the gift of magic on enemies. Not sure how big of a problem this will be in actual play, since the odds of it recharging while in the middle of a fight are very low, since they can only use it about twice per season (might decrease after some testing), but it's still irritating, and potentially lethal having an enemy steal magic from you.
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 05:51:34 pm
(http://s8.postimg.org/w6cghq2qd/formic_7.png)
Might be cool as a feature. Probably from [ITEMS_HARD] in stone template. I'm assuming can't be done in fort mode because there's no reaction to make armor from stone/gem.
Edit: wait, what?
(http://s12.postimg.org/ys7j05bjh/formic_8.png)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 05:53:59 pm
What other spells should be known?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 08, 2013, 06:21:46 pm
Formics can make armor entirely of gems in worldgen/pre-embark mode:
*snippety*
Might be cool as a feature. Probably from [ITEMS_HARD] in stone template. I'm assuming can't be done in fort mode because there's no reaction to make armor from stone/gem.
Edit: wait, what?
*snippety-snip*
It's not from the stone template; vanilla gems use a stone template that has [ITEMS_HARD] as well, and they don't have that quirk. It may be a problem with the Fallen Star gems themselves, I'll check. Actually, from the second pic, that's what it looks like, if they can be made into bars.
On magic: perhaps druids of some kind, able to cast webs, and at peace with nature?
EDIT: I'll upload Update 2. Maybe it's just a side effect of the lack of furnace operators - the gem cutters finally had their spot in the limelight and cornered the armor market or something :-\
Post by: Halfling on July 08, 2013, 06:33:46 pm
Is the spider centaurs not having any kind of blood intentional? That's more important I think.
In fort mode, those bars can't be used to make anything - except anvils with the cast anvil reaction. Doing this yielded no less than 37 fallen star anvils from 4 fallen star bars.
(http://s22.postimg.org/juuymdl8x/anvils.png)
I'm going to assume this is pretty profitable. However, you can't melt those anvils back into fallen star bars, so no infinite raw materials here. I'd say it's a pretty small bug by our standards.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 08, 2013, 06:57:48 pm
Update 2 of my turn is now up.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 08:02:09 pm
Post by: Putnam on July 08, 2013, 08:07:56 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 08:12:06 pm
The same way spiders web through interactionssigh... I mean giving someone without webs, through an interaction, the correct tokens required to web.
You can't add the WEBBER token through the add token interaction token.
Until I can do that, I've given them an entangling roots spell, pretty similar, in any case.
Post by: Putnam on July 08, 2013, 08:13:41 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 08:16:49 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on July 08, 2013, 08:16:59 pm
Post by: Putnam on July 08, 2013, 08:20:43 pm
Ok, then, what's keeping this from working like a spider?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
You're trying to use a template like it's an inorganic. You need to actually make the inorganic.
Post by: BFEL on July 08, 2013, 08:40:41 pm
Actually I found a halfling town ruled by a castle full of elves. With halfling names. No treelords in sight. This is a little surprising to me since elves have UTTERANCES in this mod.
Those damned rebels! Lead by that Cacame Aweminade no less I bet :P
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 08, 2013, 08:57:02 pm
Wait, both Fallen Star and Meteoric Iron?
What are you asking? ???
Post by: A Spoony Bard on July 08, 2013, 09:02:37 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 08, 2013, 11:30:53 pm
All right, I just made the inorganic, changed reaction to use it instead, still does absolutely nothing.You're trying to use a template like it's an inorganic. You need to actually make the inorganic.Ok, then, what's keeping this from working like a spider?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I made the inorganic the exact same way you make a local one within a creature, does not do anything.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 08, 2013, 11:31:30 pm
Wait, both Fallen Star and Meteoric Iron?
What are you asking? ???
Seems a little redundant. Maybe we should rename one of those materials.
Post by: Nahere on July 09, 2013, 12:04:01 am
Code: [Select]
[CDI:MATERIAL:INORGANIC:CUSTOMMATERIAL:WEB_SPRAY]Your interaction has nothing to actually define it as a web.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 09, 2013, 12:11:01 am
Shouldn't it be:That did it, thank you so much, that was the last link of it. It now works.Code: [Select][CDI:MATERIAL:INORGANIC:CUSTOMMATERIAL:WEB_SPRAY]Your interaction has nothing to actually define it as a web.
I'm still keeping their entangling roots spell, though.
Post by: A Spoony Bard on July 09, 2013, 12:20:16 am
Spoiler: Start/Spring 1 (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 12:31:40 am
Seems a little redundant. Maybe we should rename one of those materials.
Not redundant at all, actually. The fallen stars are gemstones, and their usability for casting anvils was a glitch; the meteoric iron is a metal. The fallen stars I intended as basically magical stars embedded in celestial marble, hence the very high density; meteoric iron is merely weapons-grade metal. They serve different functions and have different names, though they are along the same theme of space-related ground materials, but I don't think that's cause enough for renaming.
@A Spoony Bard: Yay pictures! Good writing too. The Entomologist is pleased :)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 09, 2013, 12:59:04 am
Post by: Halfling on July 09, 2013, 03:10:14 am
- "Liquid"? Are you sure we'll need that in Peacesblack, allet?
- Silence, underling. Ants are more than half liquid. I would rather not need it and have it.
(http://s10.postimg.org/dm9rryexl/formic_9.png)
Besides, for every 5 that you take, the royal colony gives you a beautiful glass vial that looks like a halfling to hold it. That alone makes it worth it.
(http://s10.postimg.org/ffcoga049/formic_11.png)
Water, however, comes in barrels as expected.
Also, currently honey wine shows up under both plant and creature alcohol.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 11:19:22 am
EDIT: And the ridiculous density for fallen stars is because I intended for them to literally be fallen stars :) Properly, they should really be black holes, but that would just be cruel to the miners.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 09, 2013, 11:50:31 am
Post by: Halfling on July 09, 2013, 12:05:05 pm
How are we supposed to mine? DF wont give my halflings any form of digging implement. Which means they'll die of dehydration almost instantly come winter.
DF won't by default let primarily wood-using races have digging implements*. I moved the part about that in the player's guide a bit to make it easier to spot, guess that's my bad. Make a wooden shovel at a craftsman's shop to get started. :)
Ah, that'd be a side effect of using MC's alcohol template. Should be a quick fix, just need to duplicate his template and change the alcohol type token. No idea what's happening with the generic liquid; might be related to honeydew itself. Is it drinkable?
EDIT: And the ridiculous density for fallen stars is because I intended for them to literally be fallen stars :) Properly, they should really be black holes, but that would just be cruel to the miners.
Not sure. At least it's not under drinks. The fact that's in a vial probably further makes it undrinkable in fort mode.
Some other things:
Spider centaurs still don't have any equipment at all.
Queens are pretty easy to kill if you just slash them in the abdomen, but this may be intentional. Didn't look at your bodies again to check this. Anyway, two instakills that way.
(http://s14.postimg.org/fw5pdlkch/killing_a_queen.png)
What kind of pants does a many-legged insect wear over its abdomen? :P Darling Darkflax later went on to become known as the Wave of Gobblers and killed several megabeasts and an entire town of halflings as well. Formics are on average a thousand times tougher, especially the soldiers - very hard to kill with default halfling equipment.
On second thought, the queens are not that squishy to the average creature in the arena either. I guess they may be mostly squishy if you're a demigod vampire with a scimitar attacking them unexpectedly. The soldiers knew what was coming.
(*it will create bugged, random-material versions of such if you just add the token and just embark, that's been discussed above, but not desirable)
Post by: Poldon on July 09, 2013, 12:13:48 pm
(http://i958.photobucket.com/albums/ae69/Poldon19/Names_zps1b681e89.png)
Then I started noticing all the names of his family and his previous membership. Clearly this guy is pure evil, married to someone who knows but doesn't mind and won't tell with a kid who's blissfully ignorant and he has a dark and disturbed past. Even his parents sound like villains. He also happens to be both hunter and animal trainer for my settlement, so he has access to both a bow and the hounds.
I feel like this is a story waiting to happen, but I do not have the motivation to actually write anything. XD
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 12:26:11 pm
Some other things:
Spider centaurs still don't have any equipment at all.
Queens are pretty easy to kill if you just slash them in the abdomen, but this may be intentional. Didn't look at your bodies again to check this. Anyway, two instakills that way.
*snippety*
On second thought, the queens are not that squishy to the average creature in the arena either. I guess they may be mostly squishy if you're a demigod vampire with a scimitar attacking them unexpectedly. The soldiers knew what was coming.
(*it will create bugged, random-material versions of such if you just add the token and just embark, that's been discussed above, but not desirable)
Yeah, I'd say under those conditions anything could be considered "squishy" :P Formic queens also use the standard insect body instead of the humanoid insect one, unlike the rest of the species, so that may have an impact on their durability.
I looked at the Spider-Centaur entity again and realized I may have given them conflicting tags; metal pref and wood weapons. Wood weapons has been removed, hopefully they'll have some decent gear now, but I will check before uploading this time :) . They also have banditry now.
Post by: Halfling on July 09, 2013, 12:53:06 pm
So I was playing the minimal version some, and I noticed one of my Halflings with a peculiar name.
Then I started noticing all the names of his family and his previous membership. Clearly this guy is pure evil, married to someone who knows but doesn't mind and won't tell with a kid who's blissfully ignorant and he has a dark and disturbed past. Even his parents sound like villains. He also happens to be both hunter and animal trainer for my settlement, so he has access to both a bow and the hounds.
I feel like this is a story waiting to happen, but I do not have the motivation to actually write anything. XD
Glad you're enjoying it :D My favorite was still the village of "Murderbaggins" (the translation "simple english" features some "extra", namely bag -> baggins and treasure -> precious IIRC). I'm still... very slowly working on that new language file. There's a bit of a problem that it slows down the game speed - in fact even just the vanilla files slow down the game compared to this new smaller language - and I don't like that. Not at all, now that I'm used to the new fast speed.
I'm thinking I should write a guide to vampirism too. But there's something that I'm not sure whether it's good or bad:
It's very easy to become a vampire unintentionally. Becoming a vampire intentionally is a little harder than in vanilla, and converting your fort entirely to vampires is all but impossible due to the new system, but becoming one unintentionally is easy by comparison: you just need to find and fight a vampire alone, survive a few rounds in melee, and you'll become one as they infect you (pretty much like a werecreature but faster). If you send in a companion first you're mostly safe, but then that companion will be a vampire. You need to really beware of approaching vampires alone if you do not want to become one.
Being a vampire is very useful or a huge pain depending on your viewpoint. It does make you stronger, tougher and more agile (but not faster due to the known bug), but in this version you have to juggle both regular hunger, regular thirst and thirst for blood now - drink, eat, and feed on sleeping things all. The ability to turn into a vampire bat is a lifesaver if used correctly, letting you escape from almost anything (although it loses all of your gear), and suicide if used incorrectly, because enemies will 1-hit-kill the poor bat occasionally.
What do you think - is this how it should be, that you should beware of close combat with a vampire for fear of becoming one? Because I'm thinking if this is undesirable, I could add a companion power to vampirism powers called "pray for spiritual purity" or something, that would give you powers that allow you to make yourself and any allies you choose permanently immune to vampirism (no other benefit), as a choice to opt out of vampire stuff. But that's just clutter if it's not needed.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 01:09:22 pm
EDIT: And now I've just found something that's a bit eerie. In a Halfling temple, deep in the catacombs, there is a large room littered with the skeletons of 28 halflings. Directly in the center is a celestial marble coffin flanked by two memorials to its occupant - its Formic occupant. I'm not sure if this was the last stand of some kind of cult or some kind of burial ritual similar to how pharaohs were buried with their slaves.
EDIT2: The priest is the "high pants". Halflings have such odd religions...
Post by: Halfling on July 09, 2013, 01:26:15 pm
Sample interaction for supernatural opt-out for players who want to never become vampires or similar:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Should be added to the end of interaction_vampire_halfling and then to c_variation_vampire_halfling:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 02:07:09 pm
According to legends mode, he was a criminal even amongst his own kind, whose ethics can be summed up as "You killed and ate my mother in public? Eh." He and his group, the Sacred Pocks, moved to the city of Calmlords in spring of 76, somehow sneaking into the castle basement and becoming notorious criminals there, too. His reign was only ended when a storm dragon attacked the city; he died in battle with it. I'd assume the halflings in his tomb were his gang members, killed in battle, but that leaves no explanation of who interred him in a celestial marble coffin.
From the lack of murders he committed, I'd say this guy was some kind of master thief. His best skill was weaving, and his most notable combat skill was that he was a competent bowman. Knowing spider-centaur tool use at this point, I doubt he ever held a bow in his life.
EDIT: Poking through legends mode via the Legends Viewer, it becomes exceedingly apparent that you do not want to be killed by a spider-centaur chief. Crucifixion and being hacked to pieces seem to be popular methods of disposing of enemies.
Post by: Halfling on July 09, 2013, 02:33:28 pm
(http://s10.postimg.org/e2lzf0dy1/centaurs.png)
Giving spider centaurs furnace operators (they were still missing in your latest) and removing wooden weapons seems to have given them metal gear, at least available at embark and to an adventurer. However, I was unable to quickly see whether NPCs have it now because going to a spider centaur keep crashed DF repeatedly without errorlog.
This may be a non-issue if spider centaurs aren't supposed to build cities ever. Those places suck anyway. Everybody around you is constantly randomly falling into states of rage.
It could also have to do with other mods I put in:
- Fixed name from CENTAUR to CENTAUR_STL
- For my own adventure mode fun, gave them robes and formic body armor to provide better synergy with halflings, namely to give halflings a source of halfling-sized body armor and clothes that aren't halfling clothes
but probably not.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 03:07:03 pm
EDIT: Oh, for the love of...I found another desert that's spazzing out. Interestingly enough, you seem to be able to pick up the ground cover as an adventurer, and it will stabilize; I grabbed a fallen star out of the earth and killed a hound with it. It is a desert made of the very essence of chaos.
EDIT2: New name for cave entrances: Reaver Hives. The reaver ants appear to love caves, and will swarm anyone who invades their home. Considering they can spawn in groups of up to 40, I don't suggest venturing into them without good training.
Post by: Halfling on July 09, 2013, 03:45:09 pm
I found some rave sand too, where a river meets the ocean. Since we have all the different types of soil and stone listed in the wiki now implemented, maybe it just wants more types? Laula's making some, I hear, and it's no longer very common to find places made of *EVERYTHING*, so we could let the chaos be for now and see if that fixes it...
Nobody has given any opinion on the adventure mode opt out of magic system, but I thought it was a pretty neat idea. I guess can assume that nobody's going to veto it at least. Could you merge that into next update too if that's okay?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 03:50:22 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 09, 2013, 04:07:28 pm
Never enough screenshots so here's some of the paladin process. Basically you can make a team that gains permanent immunity to vampirism and, later, learning magic and so on. Great for extra challenge and to purge vampires without ever risking becoming one. You also stop aging, mostly just for your own protection in case a supernatural interaction is checking whether you're mortal, but if you want to start a crusade that lasts a thousand years... now you have the chance.
Spoiler: Paladins (click to show/hide)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 09, 2013, 04:38:05 pm
You also stop aging, mostly just for your own protection in case a supernatural interaction is checking whether you're mortal, but if you want to start a crusade that lasts a thousand years... now you have the chance.You see, that's why Wizards checked for mortality at first, for stuff like this.
Also, I think that once I put in some ways for people to actually contract magic, then I'll post it in for addition. Right now there are 4 types of wizards that you can find.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 06:26:44 pm
I've made the edit and am uploading Update 3 of the raws. Hopefully this will finally squash this bug.
EDIT: It's up.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 09, 2013, 09:44:52 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:SHADOW_STL]
[NAME:shadow:shadows:shadow]
[CASTE_NAME:shadow:shadows:shadow]
[CREATURE_TILE:'S'][COLOR:0:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:The implacable shades of the past that the new gods thought had been erased. They lurk in the deep shadows of the frozen cavern at the root of the world, waiting for their chance to break free and relegate the new creatures of the world to shadows as well.]
[CREATURE_CLASS:SHADOW]
[INTELLIGENT]
[NO_EAT][NOBREATHE][NO_SLEEP][NO_DRINK][NOSTUN][NOBONES] Haha
[NOEMOTION][NOEXERT][NOFEAR][NOPAIN] Hahahhaha
[NOSKIN][NOT_LIVING][NOSTUCKINS][NO_GENDER] AHAHAHAHHAHA
[NOTHOUGHT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT] MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
[OPPOSED_TO_LIFE] We replaced them. They want us only to die.
[PARALYZEIMMUNE]
[CANOPENDOORS]
[EXTRAVISION][MAGMA_VISION]
[WEBIMMUNE]
[EQUIPS]
[BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_CHASM][UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:5]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:5:7][POPULATION_NUMBER:10000:20000]
[MATERIAL_FORCE_MULTIPLIER:INORGANIC:CELESTIUM_METAL_STL:10:1]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen shadow taint]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen shadow taint]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:shadow taint]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:shadow taint]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling shadow taint]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling shadow taint]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:shadow taint]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:1000:PROB:100:LOCALIZED:START:0:END:1500]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:PROB:100:START:20]
[CE:CREATURE:SHADOW_STL:SHADE]
[CE_ADD_TAG:NOT_LIVING:START:20]
[CE_ADD_TAG:OPPOSED_TO_LIFE:START:20]
[CASTE:DWARF_SHADOW]
[CASTE_NAME:dwarven shadow:dwarven shadows:dwarven shadow]
[BODY:HUMANOID_OUTLINE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SHADOW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SHADOW_CLAW_INFECT_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:60000]
[BUILDINGDESTROYER:2]
[CASTE:HUMAN_SHADOW]
[CASTE_NAME:human shadow:human shadows:human shadow]
[BODY:HUMANOID_OUTLINE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SHADOW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SHADOW_CLAW_INFECT_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:70000]
[LOCKPICKER]
[CASTE:GOBLIN_SHADOW]
[CASTE_NAME:goblin shadow:goblin shadows:goblin shadow]
[BODY:HUMANOID_OUTLINE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SHADOW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SHADOW_CLAW_INFECT_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:60000]
[BUILDINGDESTROYER:1]
[CASTE:KOBOLD_SHADOW]
[CASTE_NAME:kobold shadow:kobold shadows:kobold shadow]
[BODY:HUMANOID_OUTLINE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SHADOW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SHADOW_CLAW_INFECT_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:20000]
[LOCKPICKER]
[MISCHIEVOUS]
[CASTE:SHADE]
[CASTE_NAME:shade:shades:shade]
[BODY:HUMANOID_OUTLINE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SHADOW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SHADOW_CLAW_INFECT_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:60000]
[BUILDINGDESTROYER:2]
[NO_EAT][NOBREATHE][NO_SLEEP][NO_DRINK][NOSTUN][NOBONES]
[NOEMOTION][NOEXERT][NOFEAR][NOPAIN]
[NOSKIN][NOT_LIVING][NOSTUCKINS][NO_GENDER]
[NOTHOUGHT][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT]
Battle-tested in the arena. The syndrome is especially fun; I think these would make worthy successors to the demons of yore.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 09, 2013, 10:17:21 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 10, 2013, 12:15:41 am
I still haven't gotten around to the testing I meant to do, because Hugo and I disagree on whether or not AT_PEACE_WITH_WILDLIFE and UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:5:5 actually does work. You do actually need two parameters there or else it won't work, I just remembered.... the first param is minimum depth, the second is maximum.
I'm kind of both giddy and sad at the same time, though, that you called them "shadows". When I mentioned Shadows and Tartarus, it was a Persona reference. I -suppose- your shadows are close enough, but I'm just not sure if the reference was there, given that the more likely idea was that "remnants of the old RAWs was the intention."
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 10, 2013, 12:40:02 am
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 10, 2013, 01:11:54 am
Post by: A Spoony Bard on July 10, 2013, 01:44:44 am
Spoiler: Formic Playtest Update 2 (click to show/hide)
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 10, 2013, 03:57:33 am
I have a save where I gave Keas [UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:0:5] so they'll appear on the surface, in the caves, in magma pipes, and (hopefully) in hell. I just need to breach the candy spires and we'll know eventually if it worked.
Post by: Halfling on July 10, 2013, 04:25:24 am
While it may be kind of funny to have the spires change over time, it's kind of annoying if hell is supposed to be accessible. I think now would be about the time to make one decided hell-sealing material (additional deep specials will likely be random so as to which an embark contains).
Toady's special material for hell surface is called Slade (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slade). We could call our deep special stuff hard rock, heavy rock, styx (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Styx_(band)), or if it's supposed to be a superior metal, death metal (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_metal). Probably not something obscure and overtly identifiable like demetori (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-WmpoP6ZSs) smeltable into finntroll (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1bE2ozy6a0) even though we'd all like to insert references to our favorite stuff, because everybody will eventually be digging this. :P
Alternatively just make up a smart non-reference-to-a-reference name for it. Ps. those shadows are cool.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 10, 2013, 04:54:58 am
no, what I did was gen a vanilla world with Kea set to spawn at all underground depths.
It didn't work. Q_Q
I'm gonna have to ask around to see what was done to create custom demons, because I don't know if the Shadows will actually spawn in Hell as intended.
edit: Specifically, I dug all the way down to hell, had a hastily drafted squad go explore and reveal every tile down there, and then just sat around for 10 minutes, dfhack slayrace-ing everything that spawned on the surface, in the hopes I could get Kea to show up in hell.
When that didn't work, I cracked the caverns, and continued casting scrolls of genocide. Eventually I gave up and decided that it wasn't working. :(
I will, however, be for-sure defining a pseudo-ice material and giving it DEEP_SURFACE. I might do the DEEP_SPECIAL too... It would be funny to use my supermetal for it, as it's a pain in the royal ass to smelt. I probably won't, unless we really can't figure out how to spawn guys in hell, as the clown car is supposed to be the deterrent.
We could even just make a semi-generic stone to replace the jaded slade in the spires until we decide on what we're actually going to use.
Post by: Halfling on July 10, 2013, 04:57:40 am
Post by: Halfling on July 10, 2013, 05:05:11 am
edit: Specifically, I dug all the way down to hell, had a hastily drafted squad go explore and reveal every tile down there, and then just sat around for 10 minutes, dfhack slayrace-ing everything that spawned on the surface, in the hopes I could get Kea to show up in hell.
When that didn't work, I cracked the caverns, and continued casting scrolls of genocide. Eventually I gave up and decided that it wasn't working. :(
I will, however, be for-sure defining a pseudo-ice material and giving it DEEP_SURFACE. I might do the DEEP_SPECIAL too... It would be funny to use my supermetal for it, as it's a pain in the royal ass to smelt. I probably won't, unless we really can't figure out how to spawn guys in hell, as the clown car is supposed to be the deterrent.
We could even just make a semi-generic stone to replace the jaded slade in the spires until we decide on what we're actually going to use.
Were your kea present in all biomes with 100% frequency? They won't show up ever if they're just not there after all.
Also,
- I'm not sure if specifically defining hell as ice makes it undiggable. Needs to be tested if you do. Hugo said he couldn't make a diggable hell material, don't know why - but as it is it's permanently diggable ice no matter what we add, apparently, so defining it as ice might actually cause loss of function
- For a placeholder DEEP_SPECIAL material, could just make a copy of the generic "rock" and set it to DEEP_SPECIAL for now. "Rock! Praise the miners!" (would still be funnier with "Classic rock! Praise the miners!")
Post by: Knight Otu on July 10, 2013, 05:22:39 am
Post by: BFEL on July 10, 2013, 05:32:52 am
Post by: Halfling on July 10, 2013, 09:08:15 am
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 10, 2013, 10:41:49 am
Was thinking about something. Q for all: does DF scratch run faster for you than vanilla? For me the startup, even to arena, at least is so much faster it's amazing. Logic says this should be faster all around.
It does for me.
I'm going to request my turn be moved down a slot or two, because I am not going to have any access to any form of electronics between the 18th and 26th.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 10, 2013, 10:55:08 am
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 10, 2013, 12:06:21 pm
Edit: it is also called "Blackidiot" by the new RNG. One of the members is called "Halfling Flaxoaf"
Post by: Halfling on July 10, 2013, 12:32:36 pm
My Halfling Fortress is progressing nicely. But for some reason, they all have little flashign X's on them, and there are large amounts of dried vomit all over the place. Whats up with that?
If it's the newest version, they're probably hung over from drinking alcohol all day. Try using a well as your main source of drink instead. Also report how it goes :)
Yeah, I've noticed a speed-up, particularly when genning new worlds. That may have something to do with the rather small pool of words with which to name things.
Masterwork and accelerated DF claims to work faster by having removed redundant components if I'm not mistaken, and we're doing that to the extreme, so there should be other reasons too.
Adding the vanilla vocab to scratch makes it slower, but not NEARLY as slow as vanilla. So we can pat ourselves on the back for removing some serious clutter. (When clutter is defined to be everything.) Adding the 20k word dic makes it somewhat slower, but does not kill it.
Adding the king size dictionary to vanilla is suicidal. It's like DF inhaled a peanut. For my poor virtualbox with 1GB ram it takes so long to start I'll start watching something on youtube. Maybe it's designed so it needs to read the whole language file every time it starts and creates objects or something, since it even affects arena start. :(
Anyway, this is making me re-think the language issue a bit. It's clearly going to impact performance if we add lots of words, and most people don't seem to be feeling like we need so many anymore.
The new language files without symbols, a semi-recent version, are here:
http://www.speedyshare.com/9jNt7/language-english-mega.txt
http://www.speedyshare.com/AbkPh/language-words-mega.txt
they will not work correctly without symbols, but unfortunately I lost my symbols (and my scripts) when randomly installing alpha software borked my VM and I was feeling lazy and like, well let's reset to a snapshot (click). Snapshot didn't have these. I think I should have the scripts in my e-mail though.
Edit: Also, Zanzetkuken, granted. Moving you two steps down. That puts sackhead up next. How's that sound, sacks?
Post by: WillowLuman on July 10, 2013, 12:37:37 pm
The much smaller pool of total creatures/objects to select from probably helps. AFIK we barely have any vermin varieties.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 10, 2013, 12:44:11 pm
My Halfling Fortress is progressing nicely. But for some reason, they all have little flashing X's on them, and there are large amounts of dried vomit all over the place. Whats up with that?
Edit: it is also called "Blackidiot" by the new RNG. One of the members is called "Halfling Flaxoaf"
Hm...red X's and vomiting...did you embark on a savage tropical marsh, perchance? If those X's mean fevers, you may have encountered the delightful Dengue Mosquito, and it then bit some of your hobbits and gave them breakbone fever. If you're not on a savage tropical marsh, then yeah it's probably the booze.
It's like DF inhaled a peanut.
I'm sigging that :D
The much smaller pool of total creatures/objects to select from probably helps. AFIK we barely have any vermin varieties.
Well...there may be a few more vermin varieties than before...I forgot to comment out the "optional" plague fly swarms in the last update :-[ . I'll be fixing that in tonight's update, along with adding in the shadows since people seemed to like that, and fixing whatever bugs other people find.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 10, 2013, 12:55:30 pm
I've got a well built now (finally) at the cost of one of my miners. He decided, as soon as he dug the channel which let the river into the cistern, to JUMP IN, and was swept away, drowning shortly after.
Does DF simulate well contamination>?
EDIT: His name was "Secret Bluepeace." I love how the Halfling language is just a caveman english.
Post by: Halfling on July 10, 2013, 01:10:23 pm
Ooh, thanks for explaining it was the fact they were surviving off booze.
I've got a well built now (finally) at the cost of one of my miners. He decided, as soon as he dug the channel which let the river into the cistern, to JUMP IN, and was swept away, drowning shortly after.
I think I should probably add the part about hangovers from alcohol to the player's guide, especially since now you can make it. It's there now. :D
Yes, it'll give unhappy thoughts if they are forced to drink from it.
Feels weird to be sigged on such a random thing to say but it's yours, man :)
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 10, 2013, 01:31:37 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 10, 2013, 02:07:46 pm
Do we still have the first version of the raws up somewhere? I might just load up Super_Minimal_DF, then, after applying various bugfixes that might have been addressed in later versions, give all the creatures the capacity to spawn in Hell as well as the surface. Throw in freq 100 and ubiquitous, and I should hopefully be able to get something down there.
Although, I DID get Kea to spawn above ground before I broke into hell.... they even took some of my shit.
Regarding Ice, that would be an interesting experiment, explicitly defining hell out of a diggable material and seeing what happens. If I make an "ice", though, I'm definitely giving it fixed-temp, absurd melting points, undiggable, etc.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 10, 2013, 02:21:26 pm
The first version of the raws is in the OP.
Post by: Halfling on July 10, 2013, 02:36:41 pm
Uh oh. Is there any way i can get rid of his corpse? I'd hate for hisidiocysacrifice to have been in vain
Probably not. But you could just build the well on the river :D
I know Masterwork DF has some creatures that spawn in Hell, but I've never actually breached the HFS in that mod to see them in action. A test would be a good thing.
The first version of the raws is in the OP.
Yes. Masterwork's "Adamantine beetle", believed to spawn in hell:
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Masterwork:Adamantine_beetle/raw
This copy seems a little broken with the loose [SELECT_MATERIAL at the end and all, but maybe the essential stuff for us is correct.
Post by: Knight Otu on July 10, 2013, 03:41:57 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 10, 2013, 03:52:57 pm
I posted a topic asking in the mod forum, and all I got was a three letter reply. "LFR." So first I did some forum searching, and it took about five minutes before I found the Legend of Forlorn Realms thread. Looks like, if I want to ever play that mod, I have to give up my dreams of putting working creatures in hell. Because it seems I'm expected to download the entire mod, pick through its raws, guess which creatures spawn in hell, pick apart the entries to isolate which tags are causing this behavior, and replicate them.
Instead of, y'know, confirmation that UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:5:5 actually works. Cause that would be too easy.
Why no, I am absolutely not mad and/or taking passive aggressive potshots at those blessed with knowledge. Not at all. Whatever gave you that absurd idea?
Post by: Putnam on July 10, 2013, 04:04:48 pm
I'm not blessed with knowledge, I'm blessed with the ability to know what to search on the wiki and, if that fails, which mods to look at.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 10, 2013, 04:28:06 pm
Remove all equipment, make your adventurer into a ghost, fly down to Hell, unghost, then wander around until something tries to kill you. Trying to sneak helps more, since if there's a creature within your LOS it won't let you sneak.
Post by: Knight Otu on July 10, 2013, 04:33:37 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 10, 2013, 08:56:44 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 10, 2013, 11:33:27 pm
My Halfling Fortress is progressing nicely. But for some reason, they all have little flashing X's on them, and there are large amounts of dried vomit all over the place. Whats up with that?LOLOLOLOLOLOL. Ahem, cough cough ha.
Anyway, the reason they have flashing X's in not because of any mosquitos, at least not if it happened at the time they drank.
The reason they have fevers is because of what they drank.
Specifically, they drank some tarnished vodka from a tarnish stalk, now alcohol can be bad in this game, but drinking that stuff will literally make you sick, it causes fevers, numbness, increased nausea, and in severe cases, coughing blood. And that's in addition to the normal problems with drinking.
My tip? That stuff is terrible for your health. Don't drink it, use it for cloth instead.
Post by: A Spoony Bard on July 11, 2013, 12:24:13 am
Spoiler: Formic Playtest Update 3 (click to show/hide)
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 11, 2013, 12:42:14 am
Error log says "Unrecognized creature variation:HAS_VAMPIRES_HLG" (c_variation_halfling.txt confirms, 'vamp' not found in file)
Not sure if that does anything weird or not.... but I'm too lazy to comment vampire stuff out of this cause I'm just testing for hfs anyways.
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 04:12:27 am
Not much happened in this update. There's only one picture, I would have taken more, but not much that happened seemed like it needed a picture to go along with it.Spoiler: Formic Playtest Update 3 (click to show/hide)
Nice! Looking forward to seeing where this goes.
To please the allet, you could dig for kamacite or taenite and make a statue of those/room in a cluster. Meteoric iron is expensive, because it's supposed to be rare (but is not yet). Although maybe it's not an option if your miners are getting mauled because of violated production orders :D
I'll put you on the turn list as the player for this turn and link to these if you manage the 2 years.
Spoiler: Stuff I'm thinking of making next, maybe (click to show/hide)
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 11, 2013, 10:22:45 am
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 11, 2013, 11:34:27 am
If you can't get your hands on some meteoric iron ore in the caverns, you're pretty screwed, looks like. ;)
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 11, 2013, 11:56:43 am
EDIT: The Hut Of Idiots has produced it's first artifact.
(http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/219/qs1z.png)
Have i mentioned just how much i love the new names?
Also: One of the Halflings somehow managed to climb up onto a pillar as it was being constructed, and if I hadn't noticed in time would have died of dehydration. :?
Post by: WillowLuman on July 11, 2013, 12:31:18 pm
Say, I've noticed stupidity shows up quite a lot in halfling names. Is that intentional?
Post by: Person on July 11, 2013, 12:42:50 pm
Can we only make additions to this if we sign up for a modding turn? I only want to do some minor things, such as add a little variety to metals.This is in the first post. ;p
Posting your unpublished raws in this thread is awesome. It's up to the modder whose turn it is to implement it if he wants. You are obviously allowed to throw anything and everything at us. However it would be swell ifI recommend using the code tags if you post any raws, but spoilers should be fine too. Here's some things I think we need more of: Sand/Soil/Clay(Pretty sure we have 0 types of clay. Of course if we can't redesign clay enough for it to be considered from scratch, so be it. I'm almost certain that's what's causing the ground to think it's everything sometimes though), Stone(possibly some magma safe types if we don't have many), tree types, surface and cavern(If i remember correctly the first cavern is completely empty of trees) and metal(weapons grade or otherwise. a cheap metal to make initial tools cost less would be great).
- You posted the raws as text
- There's a short description of what it does
- and maybe a screenshot to show it works
As for justice, I recommend rope restraints if you don't want your prisoners to starve. By the way, can our civs drink water directly from buckets/barrels? If not, prisoners might only be able to drink booze right now unless someone/thing brings them food, since I don't remember if wells can be used while chained.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 11, 2013, 12:48:39 pm
Then two ticks later he was found dead.
Theres a massive mess in one of my corridors
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 12:56:22 pm
They will show up more in anything that natively uses symbol UNTOWARD. I'm still not clear on which uses what. Symbols can't be just made up - it seems like megabeasts, for example, use ASSERTIVE a lot IIRC from my testing with even smaller languages (try only adding one or two words per symbol).
Can we only make additions to this if we sign up for a modding turn? I only want to do some minor things, such as add a little variety to metals.
You're free to suggest stuff without taking a turn. That's the idea. It's up to whosever turn it is to implement it. For example it wasn't mc's turn yet but his raws giving hangovers from alcohols were immediately added by Leibowitz. It should probably be more visible in the first post but I'm not sure how I could make it more concise, it just has such a lot of stuff that needs to be there. Fakeedit - ninja'd
(Pretty sure we have 0 types of clay. Of course if we can't redesign clay enough for it to be considered from scratch, so be it. I'm almost certain that's what's causing the ground to think it's everything sometimes though)
Unlikely. There's no special tag for soil about being clay. Vanilla clay is just a soil with [MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:FIRED_MAT:INORGANIC:CERAMIC_EARTHENWARE] - I don't believe reaction products affect where something should be placed in worldgen. That said, who knows for sure? But we did have BFEL's vanilla ripoff "clay" for a while and I think there were those small spots even then.
It could be something like, DF wants to make the very bottom of a different material than some other layers, this is not possible due to there being only "rock" and that affects the surface in places (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7721). Or it could be something very simple we've overlooked so far. Incidentally, I did a little embarking on suspected problem areas (river deltas), and they were surprisingly made entirely of rock in fort mode, even the surface. Todo: confirm one is a problem area in adv mode, then embark on that exact spot and see if DF setting the deeper materials in fort mode fixes it.
Underground vegetation was improved a lot by Leibowitz. But yeah, more stone, more metals, please. More everything would be nice but those are probably a priority. :D
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 11, 2013, 01:09:08 pm
Here's some things I think we need more of: Sand/Soil/Clay ... Stone ... and metal[/size].
more stone, more metals, please. More everything would be nice but those are probably a priority. :D
Huh. I keep saying that my entire turn is focusing on inorganics. Weird. >.>
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 11, 2013, 01:10:36 pm
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:INORGANIC]
[INORGANIC:BLUESTEEL_DSD]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:METAL_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:bluesteel]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten bluesteel]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:gaseous bluesteel]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:7:8:2]
[BUILD_COLOR:7:8:2]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:10]
[ITEMS_WEAPON][ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED][ITEMS_AMMO][ITEMS_DIGGER][ITEMS_ARMOR]
[ITEMS_HARD][ITEMS_METAL]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:AZURE]
[INORGANIC:BLUESTEEL_ORE_1_DSD]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:6:7:2][TILE:'*']
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:shimmerrock]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten shimmerrock]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:shimmerock dust]
[ENVIRONMENT_SPEC:ROCK_HLG:CLUSTER:100]
[ITEM_SYMBOL:'*']
[METAL_ORE:METEORIC_IRON_HLG:100]
[SOLID_DENSITY:52000]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:5]
[IS_STONE]
[MELTING_POINT:11500]
[INORGANIC:JAGGED_SAND_DSD]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BUFF]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:jagged sand]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:n/a]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:airborne jagged sand]
[TILE:178][DISPLAY_COLOR:7:12:0]
[SOIL_SAND]
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 01:18:30 pm
Here's some things I think we need more of: Sand/Soil/Clay ... Stone ... and metal[/size].more stone, more metals, please. More everything would be nice but those are probably a priority. :D
Huh. I keep saying that my entire turn is focusing on inorganics. Weird. >.>
Sorry. I was thinking of what already is there, forgetting you're already working to fix our problems. :) But more suggestions aren't bad, are they?
Basic stuff, but variety is variety, and this is the first time I've ever even LOOKED at the df files.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
That was fast. However, it might be good if new metals also had different values otherwise from the already existing ones to not just create renames.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 11, 2013, 01:39:11 pm
Post by: Knight Otu on July 11, 2013, 01:39:50 pm
They will show up more in anything that natively uses symbol UNTOWARD. I'm still not clear on which uses what. Symbols can't be just made up - it seems like megabeasts, for example, use ASSERTIVE a lot IIRC from my testing with even smaller languages (try only adding one or two words per symbol).
Creature/deity naming depends heavily on the spheres the creature has - vanilla dragons get names with words drawn from the FIRE and WEALTH symbols, as fitting for a creature with the FIRE and WEALTH spheres. Your storm dragons do seem to love the NATURE symbol, and they are associated with the NATURE sphere and some of its children. Of course not all spheres have symbols associated to them, and I don't think you can associate your custom symbols with spheres of the same name. Haven't really tried that, though. (The UNTOWARD symbol doesn't exist in vanilla anymore, by the way.)
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 02:16:08 pm
UNTOWARD was present in .31 but shows up in neither the wiki's nor my own .34 stringdump. Is there a list of valid symbols in .34? I'm reading things like BOUNDARY and FESTIVAL among the symbols in the stringdump that I'm not sure whether it's a symbol or not. If it has a new set of symbols like it does, the language needs to be adjusted. Mine was erroneously based on .31, and the wiki claims it's still the same as 40d in these parts which is apparently not true.
Nature symbols show up in storm dragon names as they should, but if you look closely they also use ASSERTIVE (lord, mean, gall, mighty, brave) and SAVAGE a lot. However, this MUST come from one of the spheres (hunting, day, nature, freedom, sky, storms) because deleting all those also makes them not use ASSERTIVE and SAVAGE excessively, instead seemingly going to all random names.
Now it's a matter of figuring which symbol corresponds to which sphere :D
Post by: WillowLuman on July 11, 2013, 02:25:47 pm
Post by: Knight Otu on July 11, 2013, 02:28:06 pm
Apart from UNTOWARD, no symbol has been removed from the language files, so in that regard you're good to go. You can keep it in, if you like - there's no problem with having more symbols than vanilla, if you want to use them for the SELECT_SYMBOL and SUBSELECT_SYMBOL tokens. I think NAME_BUILDING_TOMB is the only symbol that has been added in that time. The full list of vanilla symbols is this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 02:36:16 pm
As a guess, assertive could relate to freedom, and savage from storms, but that's just guessing.
Apart from UNTOWARD, no symbol has been removed from the language files, so in that regard you're good to go. You can keep it in, if you like - there's no problem with having more symbols than vanilla, if you want to use them for the SELECT_SYMBOL and SUBSELECT_SYMBOL tokens. I think NAME_BUILDING_TOMB is the only symbol that has been added in that time. The full list of vanilla symbols is this:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Thanks. What's the source of that symbol list? Modding forum didn't find it.
Symbols CAN just be made up, they're defined in the RAWs. I think spheres are hardcoded, though.
Right. However the vanilla symbols are present in the DF binary and I would assume your custom symbols won't affect hardcoded things, nor will DF work correctly if your vanilla symbols are unpopulated. This is actually just guesswork though, they might be anywhere in the vanilla code and might even not be used at all, instead reading things from file, as who knows how it works.
Post by: Knight Otu on July 11, 2013, 02:39:28 pm
Thanks. What's the source of that symbol list? Modding forum didn't find it.My vanilla DF install. I just used grep and sorted the output.
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 02:55:31 pm
Thanks. What's the source of that symbol list? Modding forum didn't find it.My vanilla DF install. I just used grep and sorted the output.
This is the point where you tell me to RTFM but how do I just grep a binary with a string for useful output? Or was that one of the save files? Command will be fine :D
Post by: Knight Otu on July 11, 2013, 03:09:02 pm
grep -e'\[SYMBOL:' language_SYM.txt > all_symbols.txt
sort all_symbols.txt > all_symbols_sorted.txt
The symbols that DF has been taught to understand would be more difficult. The string dump seems to have them in at least two parts (one including most of the NAME_* symbols, the other the MYTHIC symbol used for region naming), so I'm not sure if there are other parts, or if the lists are complete in that regard.
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 03:15:02 pm
Post by: Knight Otu on July 11, 2013, 03:17:28 pm
That... would seem like the logical place to go to rather than strings > stringdump > manual search which was my MO. :D Oh wow. Anyway, great, thanks.Of course, that is the best way to find undocumented tokens on release days. :)
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 11, 2013, 04:09:56 pm
Bug or just feature unimplemented?
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 04:29:49 pm
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 11, 2013, 04:48:11 pm
Oh, by the way - the rock thrower ability you gave them is brutal. A couple halflings decimated a pack of wild hounds easily using only thrown stones. I like!
Post by: Halfling on July 11, 2013, 04:55:30 pm
Any chance of some screenshots of your halfling home? :)
Post by: Metruption on July 11, 2013, 07:10:43 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 11, 2013, 10:01:38 pm
Post by: Metruption on July 12, 2013, 12:42:16 am
My work on modding in the new race that will deliver the wizard syndromes in coming along..... sort of. They keep wanting to give the magic powers to each other, even though their race is exempt from being targeted, or to wild animals, despite them not being intelligent. I'll get it one of these days! Also, the new race will be mainly for a friendly trade race.That's the only post I've read other than the first 3 pages.
I REALLY want to play this.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 12, 2013, 12:49:07 am
That is amazing, for that, I will get to work on it.My work on modding in the new race that will deliver the wizard syndromes in coming along..... sort of. They keep wanting to give the magic powers to each other, even though their race is exempt from being targeted, or to wild animals, despite them not being intelligent. I'll get it one of these days! Also, the new race will be mainly for a friendly trade race.That's the only post I've read other than the first 3 pages.
I REALLY want to play this.
Post by: Halfling on July 12, 2013, 02:31:58 am
I'll play this.
Great :D
Put you in the player pool, take it up and report what needs fixing, or just play it by your lonesome?
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 12, 2013, 03:18:31 am
Post by: emeralis00 on July 12, 2013, 07:43:56 am
Post by: Halfling on July 12, 2013, 10:17:23 am
Throw me in the player pool too. This sounds fantastic.
Added.
Its been a few months since I played DF, and I wanted to see what themodding section has done in the meantimethis is apparently in the games and stories, I wonder how I got here... I find this and am intrigued, may I play? (I should also brush up on modding as well, though don't add me to the modder list.)
It's not really a case of may you play. You absolutely may. :D Maybe I took that too literally. Try it and share a story if one writes itself, fun for all!
I'm guessing that'll mean I'll also list you in the 'pool? Although the pool is now more symbolic than intended tbh. If we get a (longer) player report or several in response to a new mod I'll put just it/them on the front page as they come, that makes more sense considering how this is going.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 12, 2013, 11:00:16 am
Spoiler: IMAGE DUMP ALERT (click to show/hide)
There are a few other levels, of course, and a huge amount of tunnels.
In other news, my miner is all sad because she was friends with the mysterious explosive-puberty peasant. Nothing seems to cheer her up.
EDIT: Also, why are my halflings always sleeping on the floor? There are more than 5 unclaimed bedrooms and several beds designated as dorms, but every time i flick through the fort, theres at least one moron snoozing on the stone. And then they get a bad thought for it.
EDIT EDIT: Oh god, 30 migrants. HALP ME!
Post by: WillowLuman on July 12, 2013, 11:42:09 am
Quote
You have no idea how many logs this has taken
Obviously what we need is a highly violent race with tree cap diplomacy.
Say, are the Treelords/elves set to be automatically hostile, or do they just behave mostly like vanilla elves?
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 12, 2013, 11:47:55 am
I accidently offered them a wooden block and they got angry. So i stole all their valuables and sent them home. Surprisingly, another caravan has arrived.
Post by: Metruption on July 12, 2013, 12:56:33 pm
Post by: Rose on July 12, 2013, 07:15:07 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 12, 2013, 08:06:30 pm
Hey guys, can I make a request? could you all add appropriate STATE_COLOR to all the new materials you make? This will make things work much better in Stonesense, since it reads that when it doesn't have its own color definitions.
Seems reasonable. I'll put it into rules as a suggestion, but what exactly is required? Is [STATE_COLOR:ALL:] acceptable?
AFAIK treelords are a lot like vanilla elves, except with [UTTERANCES], different nobles, and without any equipment (not even clothing). The latter part sort of accidentally makes sense because if they did have clothing the living tree castes would also wear it. They're not bandits or such.
It's pretty confusing with the elves. Nobody has seemingly tested them much or at least they haven't shared it :P Modding forum had me thinking, although maybe I misunderstood, that [UTTERANCES] leads to war. At least someone suggested using it to that effect somewhere. Yet these guys are peaceful. Also they can get proper names by joining another civ. Also when in their own home they are tame (unless they are of a military profession? their military profession is recruit btw since they don't have any weapons), whatever that means:
Spoiler: visiting an elf hamlet (click to show/hide)
These elves could probably use some tweaking (unless the tame part and this state of affairs is intended) and an additional content pack (items, gear?), tbh.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 12, 2013, 09:05:34 pm
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_devil_vermin_STL.txt"
Unrecognized CE_BLEEDING token: 4800
Unrecognized CE_BLEEDING token: 7200
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_insects_STL.txt"
FORMICS_STL Color Mod Ending With (MAROON,2) Was Not Used
FORMICS_STL Color Mod Ending With (RED,2) Was Not Used
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature BANDIT_MOTH_STL
BANDIT_MOTH_STL:FEMALE:right wing, layer 1: Tissue WING_SCALES was not found, using first tissue instead
BANDIT_MOTH_STL:FEMALE:left wing, layer 1: Tissue WING_SCALES was not found, using first tissue instead
BANDIT_MOTH_STL:MALE:right wing, layer 1: Tissue WING_SCALES was not found, using first tissue instead
BANDIT_MOTH_STL:MALE:left wing, layer 1: Tissue WING_SCALES was not found, using first tissue instead
Cannot generate random creatures -- missing body gloss RCP_GLOSS_PAWNow off to see the frozen over hell.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 12, 2013, 09:12:01 pm
Post by: Rose on July 12, 2013, 09:49:10 pm
Hey guys, can I make a request? could you all add appropriate STATE_COLOR to all the new materials you make? This will make things work much better in Stonesense, since it reads that when it doesn't have its own color definitions.
Seems reasonable. I'll put it into rules as a suggestion, but what exactly is required? Is [STATE_COLOR:ALL:] acceptable?
Yeah, [STATE_COLOR:ALL:] is perfectly fine.
Easiest way would be just to pick a color from here: http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Color#Color_tokens but if you want to be really fancy, you can always add new tokens if the color you wan't isn't there. That's entirely optional, though.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 12, 2013, 10:33:10 pm
When I start an embark (waiting for the wizards :P) I'm going to make eight posts in a row, one per season in my two year trial.Lol, I'm working on tehm, they're very tricky. The thing is, the races that brings in the wizards doesn't actually have magic at all, they just give it to those that come in contact with them, but I'm still working on it. Nice to see some enthusiasm, though, any particular wizard types you'd like to see?
Post by: A Spoony Bard on July 12, 2013, 10:43:14 pm
Spoiler: Formic Playtest 4 (click to show/hide)
Also, is it normal for newborn hounds to be on the ground even if nothing is on top of them?
And, to whomever is going to be the featured modder in the next update, I may make a creature for it, if you want to include it.
EDIT: Creating the creature in question took little to no time, nor did bugtesting it. Introducing the growth grub, this little bugger is born the same size as a water grub, but keeps growing its entire life, it can died of old age at anywhere from 4 to 19 years old. If one somehow manages to survive to 20 years, it will stop growing, albeit, it will be four times the size of a formic queen. It can also be milked for it's secretion, though it will take a very long time to milk it again, possibly longer than the grubs lifespan. This secretion can be refined int a drinkable state that causes any formics that drink it to grow 5x their size. Or it should, at least. I've bugtest it, in arena it holds its own against water grubs, but still dies to an unarmed halfling. You can take it at embark with little to no problems (aside from its large cost), and it can be milked. The refined secretion is drinkable by formics. Unfortunately, I don't know whether the growth portion works, as it doesn't appear as if the formics had descriptors set for height, broadness, or length. It also leaves nothing in the error log. I have to thank St. Leibowitz, though, as most of the raws for it I copied from his water grub (is that okay, halfling?)
Anyway, the raws are as follows:
Creature:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:GROWTH_GRUB_ASB]
[NAME:growth grub:growth grubs:growth grub]
[CASTE_NAME:growth grub:growth grubs:growth grub]
[CREATURE_TILE:'g'][COLOR:2:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:A grubworm that is considered invaluable to desert-dwellers due to the fact that it continues growing for its entire life.]
[PREFSTRING:ability to grow endlessly]
[BODY:WORMY_BODY_STL:CYCLOPS_STL:MAW_STL:BRAIN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100]
[BODY_SIZE:20:0:400000]
[CHILD:1]
[LARGE_ROAMING][PET][ALL_ACTIVE][BENIGN][PETVALUE:1300]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[BIOME:ANY_DESERT][MUNDANE][NATURAL][COMMON_DOMESTIC]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:3][POPULATION_NUMBER:4000:7000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MAW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:growth grub nymph:growth grub nymphs]
[MAXAGE:4:19]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[LITTERSIZE:1:5]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:GROWTH_SERUM:INSECT_LIQUID_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen growth grub secretion]
[MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CREATE_GRUB_BREW_ASB:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:GROWTH_SERUM]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen growth grub secretion]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:growth grub secretion]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:growth grub secretion]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling growth grub secretion]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling growth grub secretion]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:grown]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CREATURE:FORMICS_STL]
[SYN_INGESTED]
[CE_BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:500:PROB:100:START:10:PEAK:20000:END:26000]
[CE_BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:500:PROB:100:START:10:PEAK:20000:END:26000]
[CE_BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:500:PROB:100:START:10:PEAK:20000:END:26000]
[MILKABLE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:GROWTH_SERUM:500000000]Reaction:Code: [Select]
[REACTION:CREATE_GRUB_BREW_ASB]
[NAME:Refine Growth Grub Secretion]
[BUILDING:STILL:CUSTOM_M]
[REAGENT:A:150:LIQUID_MISC:NONE:CREATURE_MAT:GROWTH_GRUB_ASB:GROWTH_SERUM][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:A_HOLDER:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][CONTAINS:A][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[REAGENT:B_HOLDER:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][FOOD_STORAGE_CONTAINER][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[PRODUCT:100:5:DRINK:NONE:CREATURE_MAT:GROWTH_GRUB_ASB:GROWTH_SERUM][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:B_HOLDER][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:BREWING]Don't forget to add [PERMITTED_REACTION:CREATE_GRUB_BREW_ASB] to the formic entity if you do decide to add it in!
Post by: Halfling on July 13, 2013, 02:48:06 am
Thanks for reporting!
>Unrecognized CE_BLEEDING token: 7200
Sounds like the arguments for CE_BLEEDING were missing or had an extra token somewhere.
>BANDIT_MOTH_STL:FEMALE:right wing, layer 1: Tissue WING_SCALES was not found, using first tissue instead
Bandit moth body materials detail plan does not apparently give them WING_SCALES despite another body detail plan asking for them later. These are all errorlogs to do with Leibowitz's raws. It's an issue that should be fixed because we can't have those building up.
Spoony,
>most of the raws for it I copied from his water grub (is that okay, halfling?)
Yeah. The point is not to make everything from scratch every time (which would be pretty nice though, but impractical in the long run) but to make a world from scratch. So the idea is that directly importing stuff from outside is not allowed, building on stuff that's already there is. :)
Post by: Meph on July 13, 2013, 06:36:55 am
Post by: emeralis00 on July 13, 2013, 06:44:01 am
@halfling: How is the language update coming along? :)
speaking of language pack, Halfling, I think you might want to check out a potential bug in fortress naming.
It seems like there is a mismatch between plural and singular words, I've been getting the fortress name and "translation" as stuff like:
woodhome
woodshome
reaperwave
reaperswave
darlingappletree
darlingsappletrees
and so on. Its relatively minor as bugs go though.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 13, 2013, 07:05:08 am
Post by: Knight Otu on July 13, 2013, 07:06:40 am
speaking of language pack, Halfling, I think you might want to check out a potential bug in fortress naming.Not a bug per se - the in-game languages have no concept of plurals (or several other grammatical constructs for that matter), so the in-game English lacks plurals that the translated word has.
It seems like there is a mismatch between plural and singular words, I've been getting the fortress name and "translation" as stuff like:
Had some free time, so I went into the arena and had a Halfling deathmatch. Here is the errorlog.txt that was generated, though none of it refers directly to Halflings.Code: [Select]*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_devil_vermin_STL.txt"
Unrecognized CE_BLEEDING token: 4800
Unrecognized CE_BLEEDING token: 7200
Same problem like earlier in the thread - the bleeding syndromes lack the target tissue, so it thinks that START is supposed to be the tissue, and then is confused what that number is supposed to be (which reminds me of an interaction/syndrome suggestion I keep wanting to post). This should be the correct syntax for the dengue mosquito:
Code: [Select]
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:10:PROB:60:BP:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH:ALL:START:4800:PEAK:6000:END:7200]
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:70:PROB:5:BP:BY_CATEGORY:GUT:ALL:START:7200:PEAK:7800:END:8400] Only a very few cases of dengue fever become hemorrhagic.
Quote
[/code]*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_insects_STL.txt"There is a block with
FORMICS_STL Color Mod Ending With (MAROON,2) Was Not Used
FORMICS_STL Color Mod Ending With (RED,2) Was Not Used[/code]
Code: [Select]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_ANT_COLOR_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]before the castes and thus bodies and tissues are defined. Removing that block (between [APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL] and [CANOPENDOORS]) solves these particular errors.Edit - also, for everyone, the body size syntax is [BODY_SIZE:years:days:size]. If you want creatures to be born at their full size to avoid the size bug, use [BODY_SIZE:0:0:full size], not [BODY_SIZE:full size]. I don't know how DF will read the latter, but I doubt it works as you want it to.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 13, 2013, 08:26:06 am
Post by: BFEL on July 13, 2013, 10:00:44 am
These elves could probably use some tweaking (unless the tame part and this state of affairs is intended) and an additional content pack (items, gear?), tbh.
Eh, its kinda hit or miss with what is "intended" as there are really two main "intended" facets of these elves, one where they trade with you and such, stealthily sabotaging you with tainted wood, and one where they openly war on you-which is intended to be after the dwarves figure out "oh they are actually total pricks and slaves to a buncha trees" :P
Post by: Halfling on July 13, 2013, 11:10:56 am
I started up a world and sent out the brave little halflings. However, during the first couple months they kept getting nauseous and puking everywhere. I can't find any vermin on the map, and the river appears to be clean. The halflings also complain about dirty water and drinking puke so I am not sure what the exact cause is.
Probably alcohol hangovers if you took a lot of booze at embark.
snip
STL is away so I'm just going to say thanks so much on his behalf. This'll make his life easier. Also for explaining the language issue. :) In what was supposed to be the new language I made the default translated form plural and it seemed better TBH, but speaking of...
I get that too. Its like there is no "language" for the halflings at all.
DF languages consists of words that are objects that have grammar and their translations, which don't. Halfling language is specifically a translation to what the "word objects" (like DAGGER, "urist" in dwarven) would be in English with a few tweaks, but as Otu said, the translation section does not allow for grammar so this is as close as you're going to get, unfortunately. You don't notice it with non-English languages but it's there, the "plural" of urist is urist.
@halfling: How is the language update coming along? :)
Issues. I lost my scripts and latest versions in a crash. Will have to rebuild. Also, such a large vocab slows down the game and I dislike it - I should probably make a new one from smaller scrabble dictionaries. Hm.
A version of the words and translations without symbols is here: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4391294#msg4391294 . But that's not very good without the symbols and I'm not sure if it's the one where I had fixed all the duplicates, it's more of a sample. Having said that, I guess if you just fuse it with the vanilla language using vanilla symbols you will get a ton more words for vanilla to use with random names, while still having working symbols. Making symbols too is the intention though.
Did I send you my scripts earlier by PM? If I did, it would actually be really great if you could send them back. :P Especially the symbol script, I think it was makesymbols.sh
Eh, its kinda hit or miss with what is "intended" as there are really two main "intended" facets of these elves, one where they trade with you and such, stealthily sabotaging you with tainted wood, and one where they openly war on you-which is intended to be after the dwarves figure out "oh they are actually total pricks and slaves to a buncha trees" :P
Would you be okay with someone who wants to improve the elves adding more stuff to them later?
Post by: BFEL on July 13, 2013, 02:41:59 pm
Would you be okay with someone who wants to improve the elves adding more stuff to them later?
Yeah, so long as it stays in line with the "lore" of them, then sure, edit them to oblivion and back :P
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 13, 2013, 05:27:29 pm
Post by: emeralis00 on July 13, 2013, 06:28:23 pm
Probably alcohol hangovers if you took a lot of booze at embark.
Nope. I brought zero booze. Though I did find a single tile of dirty water that I had missed, so mystery solved.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 13, 2013, 11:23:03 pm
Probably alcohol hangovers if you took a lot of booze at embark.Nope. I brought zero booze. Though I did find a single tile of dirty water that I had missed, so mystery solved.
Scratch that, checked the raws I wrote up for them, you don't have to drink it, just eating them raw will do the trick.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 14, 2013, 08:11:01 am
Many thanks to Knight Otu; those bugs have been fixed now. Will update my raws soon.
As for the wing scales:
Code: [Select]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LEPIDOPTERID_STL]
[BP_LAYERS_OVER:BY_CATEGORY:WINGS:WING_SCALES:5]
[ADD_TISSUE:WING_SCALES:WING_SCALES_TISSUE_TEMPLATE]
[ADD_MATERIAL:WING_SCALES:LIGHT_CHITIN_TEMPLATE_STL]
[BP_RELSIZE:BY_CATEGORY:WINGS:500]
That's the body detail plan I use for the bandit moth to give scales to their wings like proper lepidoptera. I'm fairly certain I defined a material for the scales, making them out of light chitin, but body detail plans are still a bit alien to me.
Post by: Halfling on July 14, 2013, 08:32:12 am
It's annoying how atm they're always saying the same crap as vanilla elves
This is hardcoded into DF and can't be modded easily via raws. It's just like halfling liaisons announcing they are from the mountainhomes. You can edit the strings in the binary to change it though. For windows users there's a Russian app called df-i18n to do it, linux users can use sed as below:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
If someone wants to make a modified executable to go with this mod later, why not.
laula - how's your turn looking?
Post by: Godlysockpuppet on July 14, 2013, 08:50:29 am
Post by: Halfling on July 14, 2013, 08:51:27 am
I want a modding turn! :)
You're after Putnam :)
Post by: Godlysockpuppet on July 14, 2013, 11:09:04 am
Hehe I hope who ever plays my mod is a masochist for their own sake..I want a modding turn! :)
You're after Putnam :)
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 14, 2013, 03:08:02 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 14, 2013, 05:57:22 pm
Putting something in the frozen hell would be nice, but inorganics are more important.Yes, we need more inorganics.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 14, 2013, 07:03:22 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7831 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7831)
They have been kinda playtested, so if there are any problems that arise from them, let me know and I'll fix it if I can.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 14, 2013, 09:09:08 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 14, 2013, 10:05:24 pm
You should probably define the tissue and its material before adding the tissue.It's annoying how atm they're always saying the same crap as vanilla elves
This is hardcoded into DF and can't be modded easily via raws. It's just like halfling liaisons announcing they are from the mountainhomes. You can edit the strings in the binary to change it though.
Actually, (Wherever you put Dwarf Fortress)\data\dipscript has all of the trade dialogues. Of course, you need to know how to decode the files...
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 14, 2013, 10:05:43 pm
I just realized that it's technically "legitimately" my turn now. I'm gonna start hammering out as much as I can right now. Gonna download the latest pack, check to see when my deadline is and start scheduling stuff out.
EDIT: There's a file called b_detail_plan_bfel.txt and another one called b_detail_plan_bfel.txt~ and I'm fairly certain that isn't intended. I don't know exactly what WAS intended, though. Not sure who's responsible, but, somebody fucked up. I redownloaded and extracted, no change.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 14, 2013, 10:10:50 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoilered (and apologies) for size. Now there is fanart for this endeavor :)
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 15, 2013, 12:58:23 am
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 05:25:05 am
You should probably define the tissue and its material before adding the tissue.It's annoying how atm they're always saying the same crap as vanilla elves
This is hardcoded into DF and can't be modded easily via raws. It's just like halfling liaisons announcing they are from the mountainhomes. You can edit the strings in the binary to change it though.
Actually, (Wherever you put Dwarf Fortress)\data\dipscript has all of the trade dialogues. Of course, you need to know how to decode the files...
Correct. Upon looking more closely, appears that is indeed where part of the dialog and the fortress intro is located, and not in Dwarf_Fortress with the rest of the strings. Thanks.
Post by: BFEL on July 15, 2013, 07:25:59 am
Heres the current creature raws:
Code: [Select]
creature_ocean_BFEL
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:SEA_ANGEL]
[DESCRIPTION:A large sea creature likened unto an angel, it fires stingers at its prey and can fly unto dry land, making them a common pet]
[NAME:sea angel:sea angels:sea angel]
[CREATURE_TILE:224][COLOR:3:0:1]
[CASTE_NAME:sea angel:sea angel:sea angel]
[BABY:1][CHILD:2][GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:sea angel:sea angel:sea angel]
[LARGE_ROAMING][PET][UBIQUITOUS][HUNTS_VERMIN][RETURNS_VERMIN_KILLS_TO_OWNER]
[FLIER][DIVE_HUNTS_VERMIN][GOBBLE_VERMIN_CLASS:ALL][LARGE_PREDATOR]
[AMPHIBIOUS][BENIGN][NATURAL][CARNIVORE][EXTRAVISION]
[PETVALUE:50][COMMON_DOMESTIC][TRAINABLE]
[MAXAGE:5:10]
[BIOME:OCEAN_TEMPERATE]
[BIOME:OCEAN_TROPICAL]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:15:30][TRIGGERABLE_GROUP:15:30]
[PREFSTRING:large numbers][PREFSTRING:stinger firing]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:FIRE_STINGER_BFEL]
[BODY:SEA_ANGEL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[CASTE_NAME:sea angel:sea angels:sea angel][FEMALE]
[LITTERSIZE:10:40]
[CASTE:MALE]
[CASTE_NAME:sea angel:sea angels:sea angel][MALE]
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 15, 2013, 10:31:54 am
Post by: Godlysockpuppet on July 15, 2013, 11:48:18 am
Fairly sure that's a body raws problem. I know for a fact it's not a creature raws issue; I believe it's caused by body parts not having anything to connect to.That's body detail plan problems, not body problems. I get them frequently.
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 12:34:24 pm
@laula, I think StL ended his turn on the 7th, so by that logic if you started on the 8th, now would be about time to pass on the torch. How's it looking?
On a completely different note, spider centaurs now work perfectly after latest update. They are a very welcome addition to adventure mode as (angry) bandits and seem to have clothing too. :)
Also, Darling Petaloath the female halfling just shot a spider-centaur commander in the face with a small leadwood arrow, tearing the face's muscle and tearing the mouth's muscle and causing them to give into pain. Not in the head, in the face. Awesomeness achieved. Was later instakilled in one turn by a hound that bit her in the abdomen and shook her around by it, ripping her in twain.
However, fallen stars are still a viable material for making items. Just spotted a fallen star door.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 15, 2013, 04:53:45 pm
For that reason, if you were to somehow obtain a boulder of black dirt, you could probably build stuff out of it. I'm surprised we haven't seen that yet.
Also shit, I thought I had more time than that, I never noticed StL's raws go up. I'm hammering out finishing touches on stuff, should have it up today or tomorrow. I'd been spending almost all of my time getting Iridium and all its dependencies working, and haven't actually had time to test since my next project was working on the frozen hell. I guess I'll leave that up to someone else... we DO have shadows, after all.
Post by: Broseph Stalin on July 15, 2013, 05:05:25 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 15, 2013, 05:05:48 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 05:11:45 pm
So, this is what it looks like to achieve divinity.
I could create a plant that only grows in the underworld that, when eaten, makes you breathe fire on everything before rotting your brain out.
Yes, this is what it's like to achieve divinity.
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 05:17:18 pm
Also shit, I thought I had more time than that, I never noticed StL's raws go up. I'm hammering out finishing touches on stuff, should have it up today or tomorrow. I'd been spending almost all of my time getting Iridium and all its dependencies working, and haven't actually had time to test since my next project was working on the frozen hell. I guess I'll leave that up to someone else... we DO have shadows, after all.
No worries, I don't think anyone's going to be that pedantic about it. Just want to make sure everyone gets to play equally. When you're done, upload with comment and I'll put it in the first post as usual :)
Leibowitz, I'm still getting that moth error btw.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 15, 2013, 06:28:08 pm
God dammit. Well, at least it's not the only bugfix I have to do; I'd feel silly uploading a whole new raw folder just for a moth. I'll write up a new material template for gemstones and assign that to Fallen Stars, though I'm not sure if that's the actual main issue, considering nobody has reported doors or anvils or whatever made out of the other two gems I added :-\ It should be noted here that vanilla uses the stone template for its gemstones, which is where I got the precedent.
So, this is what it looks like to achieve divinity.
No, no; what that looks like is a Vespula with no head, but this is kind of similar :)
Also, what units does DF measure density in? The wiki's claim of kg/m-3 seems kind of suspect to me, if what it means is actually kilograms per cubic centimeter.
EDIT: The moth issue was because I forgot to append "_STL" to the tissue definition in the body detail plan. Things should work perfectly now. Heh...
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 06:44:30 pm
kg/m3 is kilograms per square meter, a reasonable (small) unit of density and the liquid density of water in DF is 1000, corresponding to the real life value of 1000 kg/m3.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 15, 2013, 06:49:19 pm
EDIT: Revision 6 up. Suggest to Laularukyrumo upgrading my raws before posting his.
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 07:16:34 pm
Some more post-adventure notes about the current state of things, after losing half a dozen halflings. Man, they die easily. Anyway:
1. Paladinism is awesome. Being a vampire is such a hassle in this version, you basically want to pick it every time just so you don't become one.
The major problem with vampirism is that you have three hunger counters, and Toady apparently did not have vampire customization in mind when designing the UI - your regular thirst counter and hunger counter are obscured from view and only vampiric thirst is visible if you are a bloodsucker, even if you don't have NO_DRINK and NO_EAT. They are still there, however, and visible on the health screen and have their effects on you as usual. Unfortunately I don't think there's anything we can do about this. Well, there is one thing.
Spoiler: Leibowitz, feel like adding this to your final update? (click to show/hide)
That should logically work, does in arena so far and produces no errorlog. Explanation: players turned into vampires can optionally remove hunger and thirst to not have to deal with the broken interface. The AI never does so vampires not drinking are not a problem otherwise.
2. Spider centaur gear is not compatible with halflings or any other race right now. I wonder what the threshold is? I think it might be good for adv mode if their body size were set to 40k after all, but OTOH the lack of foreign equipment variety in adv mode is a transient problem as more races are added.
Post by: greycat on July 15, 2013, 07:26:51 pm
That's the unit? kg/m3? That makes a great deal more sense than what the wiki claims it to be - per cubic millimeter ( m-3 ).
On Density (http://dfweb3.dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Density) it says kg·m−3 which is just a silly way of writing kg/m3.
In fact, I'm going to go change it right now.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 15, 2013, 07:34:37 pm
On Density (http://dfweb3.dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Density) it says kg·m−3 which is just a silly way of writing kg/m3.
In fact, I'm going to go change it right now.
I may have mistranscribed the actual writing, which is pretty inexcusable since I have the webpage open right in front of me. :-[
And doubly :-[ because it seems that over the summer I completely forgot how to read units. Uh...sorry, folks, nothing to see here...
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 07:48:46 pm
Revision 6.5 is great. One thing to keep in mind is that the more revisions there are... well, when there are few revisions, it's possible you did everything right from the start. But considering the success we've had in creating unexpected, sometimes hilarious bugs like the "37 fallen star anvils" thing, river deltas of rave or meat being worth infinite negative money, in addition to the classic "my creature does not have a head/internal skeleton/mouth to scream" issues, it's more like the more revisions there are, the more you cared to finish and polish things.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 15, 2013, 07:50:41 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 15, 2013, 08:03:20 pm
So when are we going to upload the newest revision, anyhow? Did you guys get the stuff I added in?
Are you referring to the wizard stuff you uploaded? Because honestly, before Laula realized it was actually his turn, I thought it was your turn to mod, and that was your turn's raws, and thus did not add them to mine.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 15, 2013, 08:28:50 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 08:31:06 pm
Mastahcheese's wizards are here, were mentioned in earlier posts. http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7831
Can't speak as to whether people who are now having modding turns (technically that's laula but stl has also included lesser new features) included them yet.
I'm personally a bit concerned about the rate of wizardry propagation, but needs playtesting. Wizard propagation starts 103200 phases after "infection" and happens every 53200 phases (44 days) since. Meaning that for every wizard in the fort there will be a new one every 44 days. Does that mean this is correct?
[snip]
Giving us roughly this amount of wizards in the fortress after n days (horizontal axis):
[snip]
edit: had incorrect plots. Will make new ones soon. Edit2: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4408196#msg4408196
Post by: emeralis00 on July 15, 2013, 08:46:05 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 09:05:35 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Giving this result:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Assuming I did that correctly, I guess it's not that excessive in the short term. But it should be expected that any form of geometric growth in wizardry will turn your entire fortress into wizards eventually and it tends to snowball. The same happens with vampires incidentally, but slower (delays are a year) and they'll kill more than they convert if not stopped.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 15, 2013, 09:13:29 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 15, 2013, 09:22:12 pm
CHANGES BEING ADDED:
Explicitly defined a hell material.... but it's still ice, basically. It has a fixed temp, no melting/boiling/ignite points, is undiggable, and it looks like ice.
Iridium, a high-tier metal that takes a lot of effort to smelt. Comes in the form of Native Iridium, and I tried to make it semi-rare, but not impossible to find. However, in order to smelt it.... 1 boulder of native Iridium, 1 boulder of Oxyline, and 1 bar of fuel, steel-making style, will return... a boulder of Processed Iridium. You still can't use it for metal. You need to smelt 2 boulders of Processed Iridium and a boulder of Magmaline, and it'll give you a single bar of Iridium. Have fun!
Oxyline, as it turns out, comes in clusters in sedimentary layers. It holds aquifer and is not magma-safe.
Magmaline is not found in the earth. You need to kill a Pale Rider in order to get one. They can be found in the magma sea and in the third caverns, and are !!fun!!.
Two new metals, Aeresium and Lunanium. The former is a semi-dense, magma-safe metal that can be used for constructions, while Lunanium is not magma-safe, but is very dense and is weapons-grade. Their ores, Aeresiumite and Lunaniumite, can be found in igneous and sedimentary rock, respectively. Aeresiumite is also found in alluvial stone.
Lots of new soils, using the new soil template. I couldn't be arsed to figure out clay, so no clay for you. You do get a new kind of sand (Red sand, available everywhere but the oceans), two new kinds of dirt (brown dirt and blue dirt, the latter of which is Aquifer-ready), and two kinds of ooze (Black ooze and blue ooze, both of which are oceanic soil, and the blue ooze is aquifer-enabled.)
New stones! Horichoko is a generic magma-safe rock that shows up in sedimentary clusters--pretty much its only purpose is to make oxyline slightly less common. Everything else is layer stones. We have Tetraline and Leylite, both igneous intrusive; Polynzite, igneous extrusive; Azurine and Kazurot, both sedimentary; and Zhorale, Nechetite, and
I'm gonna redownload the latest update, merge my raws with it, add the reactions required for Iridium Processing to all civilized, metal-using races, and then upload.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 15, 2013, 09:28:33 pm
I'm quite literally including it solely to see if metamorphic, aquifer stone will flood caverns. Mwehehehehe.....
Noooo! The cave mold! You monster :'(
Actually, now I'm kind of curious, too.
Post by: Halfling on July 15, 2013, 09:30:05 pm
Sounds good. Halflings too should probably count as metal-using for this purpose, since they're supposed to be allowed to use metal in fort mode (but not have it in worldgen mode due to being set to wooden equipment and not generating furnace operators).
Why is hell no longer diggable for water? :o
Post by: Putnam on July 15, 2013, 09:53:16 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 15, 2013, 10:04:30 pm
Also good to know about the halflings. Gave them reaction, uploading.....
DING! File's up... (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7834)
EDIT: Ninja'd by Putnam... decided to take aquifer off of Nechetite because, as funny as that would be, the FPS damage is no Fun.
I will begin my tests now. Genning a world under similar conditions as the first time I played..... Let's see how long we last this time. At least now I have aquifers so I'm not necessarily fucked if I forget to dig an underground cistern before winter, oops.
LOL!
(http://i1307.photobucket.com/albums/s599/LaularuKyrumo/DF%20From%20Scratch/DFFromScratch001_zps2b7cef41.png~original)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 15, 2013, 11:33:56 pm
No, the wizards should not propogate that rapidly, those were lowered numbers for testing that I forgot to put back up, the wait time should not be 44 days, it should be more like 200 or so.
Here you go, (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7836) replace the interaction file with this fixed version.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 15, 2013, 11:55:59 pm
Halflings are also apparently cutting tetraline, as if it were a gemstone. It can be purchased on embark, from 'Small Cut Gems' and from 'Large Cut Gems'. That's not supposed to happen--tetraline is a stone, not a gem.
Ugh...
Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:TETRALINE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[TILE:176]
[IS_STONE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:tetraline]
[MELTING_POINT:13000]
[BOILING_POINT:16000]
[IGNEOUS_INTRUSIVE]Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:HELL_ICE]
[DEEP_SURFACE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SOIL_TEMPLATE_LKR] Used "soil" template because the only difference is absence of ITEMS_HARD, and I don't want people making crafts out of the frozen hell. Yet. We can change it later if we want.
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:WHITE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:ice]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:CLEAR] [STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:water] [STATE_COLOR:GAS:CLEAR] [STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:steam] [STATE_NAME_ADJ:SOLID_POWDER:snow] [STATE_NAME_ADJ:SOLID_PASTE:slush] Failsafes in case wacky stuff happens. It SHOULDN'T, but, you never know.
[BASIC_COLOR:1:0]
[BUILD_COLOR:3:0:0]
[TILE_COLOR:7:7:1]
[SPEC_HEAT:4181]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[COLDDAM_POINT:NONE]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:9999]
[SOLID_DENSITY:920]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:1000]
[IS_STONE]
[UNDIGGABLE]I also caught them with access to iridium... I dunno if that's avoidable, as if they don't have the reaction in worldgen then you can't use iridium in fort mode. You CAN embark with Processed Iridium, though, which is weird, as that shouldn't be allowed. Oh well.
More strangeness.... I've got cliffs made out of Blue Dirt, and they're not wet. Which is odd. I've unpaused exactly long enough to see if they would start generating water, but not long enough for any digging. It'll happen soon enough, though, because....
(http://i1307.photobucket.com/albums/s599/LaularuKyrumo/DF%20From%20Scratch/DFFromScratch002_zpsbcce50e1.png~original)
I don't know exactly where, but somebody fucked up hardcore.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 12:19:10 am
(http://i1307.photobucket.com/albums/s599/LaularuKyrumo/DF%20From%20Scratch/DFFromScratch002_zpsbcce50e1.png)
I don't know exactly where, but somebody fucked up hardcore.
Damn, beat me to it. I was about to ask what was up.
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 16, 2013, 12:22:39 am
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 12:23:35 am
I'm quite literally including it solely to see if metamorphic, aquifer stone will flood caverns. Mwehehehehe.....
Noooo! The cave mold! You monster :'(
I'm also sigging this.
EDIT: Mining the frozen blood leaves an item on the ground simply called "blood". It appears to be classed as a contaminant, as a halfling came in and "cleaned" it.
What the fuck.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 16, 2013, 01:05:57 am
EDIT: Mining the frozen blood leaves an item on the ground simply called "blood". It appears to be classed as a contaminant, as a halfling came in and "cleaned" it.it would awesome if the underworld were made of this
What the fuck.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 16, 2013, 01:15:37 am
@Armok's Revenge: My God, Laula...what have you done? I know for a fact the world didn't do that when I uploaded Revision 6.5. I'm pretty sure that's your glitch...and it just displaced my bleeding molten glass as most awesome.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 01:47:29 am
I get the feeling that this might be caused by raw duplication somewhere. Because I've got dry Blue Sand, and that Should Not Be. It would also explain why the fuck you can embark with Nevermelting Hell Ice, despite it very clearly being DEEP_SURFACE.
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 16, 2013, 03:43:20 am
Yeah, duplicate raws sounds fairly reasonable. Now the hard part is FINDING the damn thing.
Post by: Nahere on July 16, 2013, 03:55:38 am
Crtl-F, anyone?Duplicate raws should show up in the error log.
Yeah, duplicate raws sounds fairly reasonable. Now the hard part is FINDING the damn thing.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 04:22:59 am
Aw, dang it.
No, the wizards should not propogate that rapidly, those were lowered numbers for testing that I forgot to put back up, the wait time should not be 44 days, it should be more like 200 or so.
Here you go, (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7836) replace the interaction file with this fixed version.
K. Still, wizards will overtake your fort eventually due to their geometic growth in number.
If you want wizards to be a minority always, you could make them also spread "non-wizardry" that makes you never learn to be a wizard 2x faster than they do wizardry, leading to about 1/3 of the fort being wizards at most.
Also I'd say it's definitely laula's new raws, as Leibowitz 6.5 works fine. I'm not linking them on the front page til this is settled to avoid massive confusion :p
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 04:39:14 am
Also I'd say it's definitely laula's new raws
I do not have Laula's raws and this popped up.
(http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/6422/5d4c.png)
EDIT: picture of the frozen blood, found using dfhack
(http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/9589/79oj.png)
EDIT dos: prospect says something about dark blood HLG. The one in inorganic_vampire_halfling.txt
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 04:54:37 am
If you have access to a linux command line then just go to raws and
cat *.txt | grep "\[*:*]" | sed 's/].*//' | sort | uniq -c | less to fetch and browse all tokens from all raws without comments and list how many times they occur. Output for inorganics:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This reading also seems to indicate that a LOT of things are missing _LKR and honeywine is missing STL :P
Also I'd say it's definitely laula's new raws
I do not have Laula's raws and this popped up.
Correct. Access to gems made of blood actually seems to be a problem in earlier versions too. However, never saw blood walls before, they seem to be pretty common now, and they could have to do with the duplicate inorganic, maybe.
Need to fix both, but the latter is probably the more critical issue.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 04:55:32 am
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 05:04:32 am
Did you see my edits, and I do not have his raws.Oh wow, I'm dumb. Just ignore me. :-X
It's an interesting find, didn't actually notice before... why would my dark blood show up as gems?
Spoiler: inorganic_vampire_halfling (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: material_template_organic_halfling (click to show/hide)
I don't see anything there that should make it happen. Anyone else? That said it's only used for vampires to be able to emit a cloud of blood when escaping in vampire form so it might just as well be removed. (must be also removed the following lines:
Spoiler: interaction_vampire_halfling (click to show/hide)
or they can then spew magma instead)
The above post was in response to the assumption that he didn't have the newest raws. Disregard :P
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 05:05:51 am
(http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/6184/g204.png)
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 05:10:41 am
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 05:14:07 am
If you want to get rid of "dark blood" altogether, you can try deleting inorganic_vampire_halfling file, and then you must make the modification described above in interaction_vampire_halfling. But does it, then, occur in the earth as gems in older versions too?
I don't actually have his raws, I thought I did when I found the file I downloaded, but I never actually put them in the game yet. The picture I put up of the frozen blood is not his doing. I'm making the changes to the vampire and will let you know if I find more frozen blood.
EDIT: I made the changes, and now there are no gems at all. No diamonds.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 05:21:36 am
The duplication in fine sand that I listed above has occurred in STL's raws. Could it be that this is what's leading to strange material behavior overall, see: blood gems and fallen star bars/armor?
The answer seems to be "yes, of course and why did it take you so long?" (don't be so mean DF, we're trying our best) -- removing STL's duplicate inclusion of FINE_SAND_HLG and returning ITEMS_HARD to STL gems results in no fallen star bars or fallen star armor available at embark (tried in 4 worlds) and no more blood gems (2 worlds). Furthermore "normal" gems and armor made of "normal" materials is available instead, which wasn't before.
Adding new materials like Laula did must have made it more obvious by causing the game to make the glitched material something really visible (walls of blood), which it must not have been before.
Sorry about the bold but I know that problem has been annoying some of us for some time.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 05:27:19 am
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 05:30:59 am
If you want it immediately, laula's raws are in http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7834 and to fix strange use of materials in laula or StL raws, and both need the fix although it's less visible in the other, go to inorganic_STL.txt and remove [INORGANIC:FINE_SAND_HLG] and its subordinate lines entirely.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 05:33:06 am
A very reasonable position. :P This'll be fixed soon.
If you want it immediately, laula's raws are in http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7834 and to fix strange use of materials in laula or StL raws, and both need the fix although it's less visible in the other, go to inorganic_STL.txt and remove [INORGANIC:FINE_SAND_HLG] and its subordinate lines entirely.
*looks at the raws* Yep, didn't have those. You might want to put them in the link in the OP. After the fixes of course.
Post by: Putnam on July 16, 2013, 05:36:26 am
I really shouldn't stay up this late.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 05:39:22 am
my head is shaking so hard right now my hair is flipping all this water around and I look goddamn fabulous because of you and your not-reading-the-dang-errorlog.
I really shouldn't stay up this late.
This errorlog? http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4399641#msg4399641
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 05:46:20 am
my head is shaking so hard right now my hair is flipping all this water around and I look goddamn fabulous because of you and your not-reading-the-dang-errorlog.
I really shouldn't stay up this late.
LOL
but we did deserve it.
This errorlog? http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4399641#msg4399641
"Duplicate Object: inorganic FINE_SAND_HLG" actually does show up, but at embark, not at worldgen or arena, which I believe we checked and where that log is from too ;p
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 05:48:31 am
"Duplicate Object: inorganic FINE_SAND_HLG" actually does show up, but at embark, not at worldgen or arena, which I believe we checked and where that log is from too ;p
I admit that I had no idea the errorlog existed until this thread. My mistake.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 05:53:37 am
Post by: BFEL on July 16, 2013, 06:08:59 am
also
NEWSUPDATE: A TV station has released the names of the pilots of the plane that crashed in Seattle: Sum Ting Rong, We To Lo, Ho Lee Fuk, Bang Ding Ao.
Needless to say, the station is in a bit of trouble.
Post by: emeralis00 on July 16, 2013, 06:11:08 am
Ok first off, someone has to make the blood walls be what hell is made of, because FUCKING BLOOD WALLS. That is undeniably awesome.Well, there is already an actual Ice thing for hell now, can Hell me made of multiple things?
alsoAhaha, yeah. Heard it on the radio one/two days ago (not sure because third shift is messing up my sense of timing), it was highly amusing.
NEWSUPDATE: A TV station has released the names of the pilots of the plane that crashed in Seattle: Sum Ting Rong, We To Lo, Ho Lee Fuk, Bang Ding Ao.
Needless to say, the station is in a bit of trouble.
Post by: Atomic Chicken on July 16, 2013, 07:20:20 am
This is amazing.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 16, 2013, 08:08:56 am
I should never be granted godlike powers in real life.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 08:18:49 am
Typical god committee procedural error, in this case leading to mountains of frozen blood and such. The universe kept complaining and we got around to fixing it in a somewhat timely fashion.
Post by: NRDL on July 16, 2013, 08:39:41 am
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 16, 2013, 10:29:20 am
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 02:52:51 pm
I also cracked open the .txt~ file, and it turns out that it was an exact copy of the matching .txt file, except that apparently it had a borked material definition or something, was using bad syntax for templates. Deleted it, since, we don't need it and it causes both confusion and may lead to more stupidity in the future.
Fixed the fine sand, too... Same download link, but everything SHOULD be good to go now. Until we find something else hilariously wrong and/or we find out that I packaged the files wrong somehow, because I've got copies of them in like, 3 different places for SUPER REDUNDANCY.
Man. I fulfilled my obligatory Super Wacky Bug requirement, except it wasn't even my fault. I almost hope something silly goes wrong, because so far, the worst I've done is forget to put _LKR on a bunch of names, and that didn't even break the game.
EDIT: I can't believe I haven't mentioned this before. I love the idea that, instead of Armok, these particular worlds are being created by a committee of recent graduates from the God College, and they just keep royally fucking things up.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 04:02:45 pm
1. It's a little confusing that the archive is named Scratch 3.1 but the folder inside it is Scratch 3.0. Not a bug per se but gives an odd impression :P
2. I embarked on some landlocked hills and below me on z-level 96 was a layer of blue ooze. I then embarked on an ocean beach and the ocean floor was actually made of rock while the rest of the embark was blue ooze. Then I embarked in a forest and the forest floor was blue ooze. It is everywhere except where it should be.
(http://s7.postimg.org/x4p0g76sb/ooze.png)
3. Hell is still inaccessible due to adamantine pipes being made of raw jaded slade, so you'll never see it. This is a bit of an issue if there's supposed to be awesome new content there.
4. Hell ice looks extremely weird and not at all like ice:
(http://s21.postimg.org/ejicqv48n/hellwut.png)
5. The new caverns look really cool. Very nice:
(http://s21.postimg.org/h5k32krav/caverns.png)
6. Meteoric iron is now rare, which is as it should be (it is found only in "rock"). By extension minerals are very rare in some embarks as only yours and StL's are present. This is not really a bug, but for example this latest embark only had usable ore in 10 layers of 100. Another one, a mountain embark, had it on 8 z-levels of 146. Might need to turn up frequencies before more ores are added:
(http://s24.postimg.org/pysno0zr9/prospect.png)
(http://s8.postimg.org/tnyiz0wsl/prospect2.png)
7. Halflings now have access to iridium anvils at embark. Whatever. Let's leave it as is since their gear is still wood. Otherwise there are no funny materials available for either playable civ. Random cap:
(http://s7.postimg.org/gtb4enq57/embark.png)
Overall, good start.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 04:08:21 pm
Let us know if you're ready to start/when you do.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 04:28:31 pm
Yeah, a lot of my materials are going to look ugly for now... I'm not good with assigning tiles/colors. Anybody want to change those, PLEASE. Feel free to. I will update my files accordingly.
Also. Completely unrelated to anything we're doing, as this is a problem with DF.exe itself. You know those single raised tiles with the slopes to the south and east, and no slopes north or west? Toady mentioned that he'd fixed it in the next update so that those wouldn't generate anymore, and I'm glad. Because I just embarked on a location that had one of those in the center of the map, and it tried to put my wagon there. It couldn't, so it didn't give me a wagon at all, dumped all my crap on that one tile, and squeezed all my halflings and animals on it.
(http://i1307.photobucket.com/albums/s599/LaularuKyrumo/DF%20From%20Scratch/DFFromScratch003_zpsb2b1ffdd.png)
EDIT: Fuck. Just cracked open inorganic_stone_soil_laularu.txt and blue ooze has [SOIL] instead of [SOIL_OCEAN]. I'm gonna update my files. Whoops!
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 04:35:04 pm
I'm not sure where your hell ice is located but its color should probably be 3:0:1 (light cyan). Edit: found it- yeah, it looks like it should, your colors are the same as vanilla's but vanilla water behaves differently. You are specifying that the floor should be the same color as water (deep blue), the walls should be white with a white background, and any buildings should be dark cyan. Just overwrite all the colors with display color: 3:0:1 and it should look fine.
It's better if you fix these and reupload as they come up, as most people who play it won't read the entire thread :P
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 04:41:00 pm
Gonna fix ice at least... everything else is fine how it is for now. I might update the other colors later, when I have better experience with what combines with what to make what. The issue I have is that there's no good logical way to tell which pixels get the foreground color and which ones get the background color.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 04:46:36 pm
Well, fixing the ice won't really do much good if the spires leading down to it are still slade, and the omnipresent blue ooze is a more visible issue than either. I'd rather change those...
As for which pixel gets which, look here - http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Tilesets
(white is foreground color)
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 04:48:55 pm
I also did fix the omnipresent blue ooze already. By "everything else" I meant to say "all the other colors," he he he.
I'll study that in my off hours and work on squashing any other bugs that crop up.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 04:54:09 pm
A ridiculously roundabout way of doing it would be making a light cyan grass called "ice" that only grows in hell and the tile of which is ▓. Then you would have "dense ice" floors... if it can grow without water down there.
I suppose then your fort might also start getting ice floors after breaching hell. Don't really know if it would work.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 16, 2013, 05:08:19 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 05:13:36 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And here's the fake ice plant, covering the world randomly in dense ice:
(http://s18.postimg.org/mjs8thw0p/dense_ice.png)
Spoiler: Raws (click to show/hide)
Now, a science award to whoever can put that in hell. Just setting it to subterranean chasm at 5:5 did not work.
I guess it could also be used to simulate frost on the ground (but no deeper) if added to tundra biomes, if desired.
Post by: Godlysockpuppet on July 16, 2013, 05:52:07 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 16, 2013, 05:54:58 pm
Post by: Putnam on July 16, 2013, 05:55:37 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 06:02:56 pm
Grass, however, shouldn't require soil to grow. Underground moss grows on stone. I don't think plants grow in hell no matter what you do, though. Unless you make mud.
Post by: Halfling on July 16, 2013, 06:26:02 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spires leading to hell, on the other hand, seemingly have to be made of something that has IS_STONE (slapping DEEP_SPECIAL on soil -> ignored, adding it to meteoric iron -> ignored, adding it to meteoric iron and adding is_stone to meteoric iron -> meteoric iron spires).
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 16, 2013, 10:54:49 pm
Literally nothing else was changed in v3.4 so if you don't care, don't bother redownloading.
Post by: Mapleguy555 on July 17, 2013, 11:18:55 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 17, 2013, 12:47:48 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 17, 2013, 12:54:31 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 17, 2013, 04:08:47 pm
EDIT: Decided to chronicle my playthrough in version 3.4 of my update to this project of madness, half because I haven't really opened it up since the original minimal version, complete with rave deserts, and half because I don't know if there's anyone up for playing through my stuff, and since the only stuff I added was a single magma-layer creature and a fuckton of inorganics, it's not super spoiler ridden so I'll play through. I was gonna play through for bugtesting and for fun anyways.
So. Embarked on this lovely place....
{PIC_004}
It's classed as badlands, with no trees or shrubs, but I brought enough wood and plants to tough it out. There's a brook in the far north of the map, the embark is 4x4 and straddles two roughly-equal but split biomes, it's listed as having deep soil, aquifers, shallow metal and multiple deep metals. This excites me, because while I haven't unpaused yet, I saw that we're in a sedimentary layer (Kazurot is a sedimentary stone), and the two soils I saw so far were black dirt and red sand, neither of which can have that aquifer mentioned. I'm hoping there's no jaded slade, though... because it means that we might have Oxyline on site. If I can smelt some iridium, I'm gonna be ecstatic.
Embark supplies.... 12 flaxseeds, 12 pumpkin seeds, 10 pumpkins, 5 units of tarnish stalk cloth (BTW, both kinds of cloth exist as "tarnish stalk cloth cloth" and "flax cloth cloth", pretty sure that's unintentional), 3 apple wood buckets, 10 bags of red sand, 5 boulders of lunaniumite, 21 boulders of leylite (because we could embark with it for some reason, and it's dragonfire safe, fuck yeah), and 40 apple wood logs. We also brought a pair of water grubs, three ducks, and a couple pack beetles. I intend on using stone for things that don't need to be wooden, so we should last until we get to the caverns and harvest the wood down there. The brook isn't frozen (although I don't know how the game handles freezing of brooks since there's the invisible brook-floor on top), but the embark was mentioned to be temperate I believe... time to go find that aquifer.
Halfway through the first month... relatively routine hobbit hole preparations. Started working the stone into nest boxes for the ducks, channeled out a few edges of the cliffs to make things look slightly less ugly, started to dig underground. Dropped 1 z-level, hit brown dirt. Probably due to the biome differences. The z-level below has blue dirt, though.... and true to its name, it's soaking wet. We're gonna try to go around it.
Dammit. Dug down, hit horichoko instead of oxyline. This is depressing. Ah well. There are huge deposits of Aeresiumite down here, so that's good. Not weapons grade, but maybe we can trade it for some iridium nuggets. Of course, we can't work the stuff without oxyline in the first place...
At least the blue dirt provides an endless, safe source of drinking water, so we won't die. I'm also gonna set up pumpkin farms nearby, so we won't starve that way either. Yes sirree, hobbit life is a fine life.
Post by: Halfling on July 18, 2013, 07:17:17 am
Decided to chronicle my playthrough in version 3.4 of my update to this project of madness, half because I haven't really opened it up since the original minimal version, complete with rave deserts, and half because I don't know if there's anyone up for playing through my stuff, and since the only stuff I added was a single magma-layer creature and a fuckton of inorganics, it's not super spoiler ridden so I'll play through. I was gonna play through for bugtesting and for fun anyways.
snip
(BTW, both kinds of cloth exist as "tarnish stalk cloth cloth" and "flax cloth cloth", pretty sure that's unintentional)
snip
Nice.
Incidentally does anyone want to take the player turn for laula's mod? I'll add the above to the first post as a playtest too if it reaches 2 years, but we should be having the play turn after laula now. First one to call it gets it. I'll also add Spoony Bard's story from StL version as the one for that turn (and will add any continuation episodes in if the formic hive still lives). Thanks.
I'm going to PM sackhead in the meantime.
Also, "cloth cloth" is semi-intentional. It makes it more specific in other contexts. Seemed easier for the reader to have a "flax cloth shirt" (or tarnish stalk cloth shirt) than a "flax shirt" (or tarnish stalk shirt), but I'm not a native speaker so this might be my unfamiliarity with how words are used.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 18, 2013, 10:38:51 am
Post by: Baffler on July 18, 2013, 11:30:35 am
Post by: mastahcheese on July 18, 2013, 12:37:37 pm
There are only 3 Travelers still alive after a 1050 history. One was a counselor who became a vampire, one had apparently hopped from town to town every 5 years or so, and was listed as a former member of probably every single civilization in the world. The last one was another counselor, who, for half the history of the world, fought the oppressive edicts of vampire counselors (Because the Travelers have 10 counselors, and each one can make new laws, the vampire counselors will keep making oppressive edicts and the good counselors will keep shutting them down) until she herself became a vampire, and then town-hopped to every civilization in the world.
Just so you can see how crazy this world was.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Also, until I started playing this mod, I've never encountered cases of people being buried alive or drowned by other people in world gen before.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 18, 2013, 12:58:47 pm
Also, until I started playing this mod, I've never encountered cases of people being buried alive or drowned by other people in world gen before.
Spider Centaurs are such pleasant folk, are they not? :) And those travelers sound intriguing. Any backstory?
I'll have the first update playtesting Laula's raws up in a bit; going to try seasonal updates initially and see what happens after that.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 18, 2013, 01:08:57 pm
Spider Centaurs are such pleasant folk, are they not? :) And those travelers sound intriguing. Any backstory?Yes, they are.
And the backstory for the Mysterious travelers is that they don't have one.
They always make their cities on coasts, so they're supposed to have entered the world from ships that nobody knows the origin of.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 18, 2013, 01:56:37 pm
===================
MAYORAL LOG, CHIEF BLOSSOMWRY, HOBBITDATE 26 OPAL 125
So...the mayor's daughter. Best night of my life. Sadly, it seems that makes this morning the worst of my life.
Crusty old bastard walked in on us in...shall we say, a compromising position. Barely avoided getting clubbed when I made a break for it, but I doubt that'll last long. I'm skipping town tonight, hijacking a wagon and a few hounds and running for it.
27 OPAL 125
Haha! Made it out. Oceanpumpkin is a fading memory on the horizon now. I can barely see the tallest tower, and I have no intentions of moving to a better vantage point. Pity about his daughter - can't even remember her name now - but there was chemistry there, I could tell.
Probably turn my wagon south for greener pastures now, see if I can sleep my way to one of those formic burghs past the southern deserts. Hopefully, the rumors of their workers' performance aren't exaggerated, and I might be able to have some fun with this exile yet! Even more hopefully, I won't get jumped by some of those creepy walking trees, or - gods help me - a band of spider-centaurs. They might be half-halfling, but they're all freak where it counts.
Ending entry here. There's some rustling in the bushes. Gods, please don't let it be a centaur...
4 OBSIDIAN 125
Damn my cursed luck! Six worthless, unskilled, pathetic excuses for hunters stumbled upon my camp a week or so back. Not a bow between them, just a half-ton of boulders they'd nicked from some fool caravaneer out of the quarries. They hardly even have any food! What kind of hunter doesn't have food? These idiots, that's the kind. Only reason they haven't slit my throat is because their "leader" is a bonnie lass who's taken a shine to me, and I'm on the run from the law myself.
Idiots. What kind of bandit outfit raids a caravan and only steals five knotted bolts of cloth, thirty rock boulders, and a few crates of stone bricks? I mean, ye gods, they've got a lot of rocks - filled my entire damn wagon with the stuff! The hounds I have pulling it are wheezing under the load. You could probably build a damn village out of this many rocks.
Gods. What morons...
5 OBSIDIAN 125
They heard me muttering to myself. Lady Bandit-in-Chief simply loved the idea of building a village out of this stuff - a proper campsite for raiding wagons, she said! As if a wagon would ever come closer than twenty miles to a bandit fortress. You'd have to be some kind of dragon-addled fool to think a trader would brave a road next to a bandit castle. Only way you could profit from that kind of moronic idea is if you went legitimate and started trading with people.
She loved that idea too.
Ah, fuck me. We have three dogs, a mountain's worth of rock, six unskilled migrant workers, no seeds, no food, and we're going to found a godsdamned city. I should've just stayed back home and taken the jail time.
1 GRANITE 126
Well, we're fucking here.
(http://i.imgur.com/cLypRHE.jpg)
I took a knife to the hounds' harnesses personally and told the idiots that are my new subjects that we're founding our blasted village right here on this spot. The river's frozen, but there's a river. Wood's plentiful, and we managed to wrangle a few aphididas on the way in. I had one of the hunters picking wild pumpkins on the way, so we've got some seeds at least - pumpkin seeds, like civilized hobbits, not tarnish stalk seeds like what these idiots were gnawing on. Is it any wonder they're morons?
Also, I am evidently the mayor now. Lady chief gave me the post since, and I quote, "Ye seems t' be the one o' us wit the most experience in fancy city-living." With a mind like that, it's a godsdamned miracle these idiots actually even managed to steal the rocks.
8 GRANITE 126
Well, the "village" that I dubbed Wooddeath is taking shape. By which I mean, the idiot mason stood on top of his fucking wall and tried building it on top of himself. He literally stood in place, placed a brick on his head, declared that the wall was "almost finished" but that "there's a creature blocking the site", stepped over to the left, and shouted in surprised pain when the brick fell onto his foot. I think he's delusional.
In order to stay out of the maniac's way, I've started digging a root cellar to store our food beneath "town hall", which looks more like an arcane standing stone ring at this point. Maybe if I use it to sacrifice myself to the gods, they'll make sure the souls of these idiots stay away from me in the afterlife.
16 SLATE 126
(http://i.imgur.com/gu5Gc7Y.jpg)
The "village" is proceeding nicely. A few hovels have been thrown together, wall-to-wall; I live in a spacious stone condo on top of the town hall, as a mayor should. Roughly half of the idiots are sleeping under the stars.
Food supply is gone. We've got some pumpkins growing in a plot to the north, gods only know when those'll sprout. I've ordered the butchering of the six mallards one of the resident morons was feeding our last breadcrumbs to, which tamed them AND wasted our food supply. Fortunately, tame mallards are a food supply. We'll be having meat stew like they made back in Oceanpumpkin within the fortnight.
...is it sad that we can make restaurant-quality meals by hitting a wild duck on the head and boiling it for a bit?
20 SLATE 126
Mallards have almost literally no meat on their damn bones. We're eating a dog now.
26 SLATE 126
(http://i.imgur.com/dppHqcT.jpg)
Mmmmm...hound fat pies. Just like mom used to make. They were disgusting and slimy then, too, but what the hell can you expect? I mean, the chef is the same genius who brought you Creature Foundations, that stunningly futuristic construction style that will make everything we do an endless source of stubbed toes. Frankly, I'm stunned he managed to make them vaguely circular, and I'm cautiously attributing their edibility to a happy accident.
22 FELSITE 126
Pumpkins finally started sprouting! I never thought I'd ever be so ecstatic to see one of those things ripe for the harvest, except maybe on Samhain. In celebration, I've ordered a still to be set up and the aphididas to be milked so we can brew some honeywine.
On a less celebratory note, we've run out of rocks. Managed to use the last of them for the still and a crafts building, but we're fresh out now. Going to have to make us a few more shovels and set the subhalfling intelligences a-digging for stone if we want the village to expand any further. We need a barn, at least - chitin is sensitive to cold, and I don't want our only sources of drunken bliss dying of frostbite in the heart of winter. An inn would be a nice thing to have, too.
23 FELSITE 126
(http://i.imgur.com/ZSDXBD3.jpg)
Idiots. Idiots! One of the godsdamned morons got stuck on the roof a month ago, and nobody saw fit to inform me! I was walking past the damned hovels and saw him poke his head over the side.
"What're you doing up there, lad?" I shouted up at him. By up, I mean maybe six feet away, vertically.
"I cannae git dow', master Mayor!" he sobbed. "I bin stuck up here fer a month with no water or food!"
"You didn't miss much," I grumbled. With a sigh and a shake of my head, I asked, "Why haven't you just jumped down, then, if you're so hungry?"
"I'm afeared o' heights, master Mayor," he admitted. "Much afeared."
I rubbed a hand across my face. He was one of those halflings, which is to say, one of the morons I'd been saddled with. "Too afraid to jump?"
"Aye, master Mayor." Good to know he remembered my Edict of Address. If only he could remember to breathe in the mornings, I might be able to do something with him.
"Do you have anything up there with you?"
"A tree log, master Mayor."
I gave him the most longanimous look of disdain I was capable of producing (I've improved since then). "Build a godsdamned staircase, you idiot."
The look of vacuous shock told me a great deal about these fools. Mainly that, similar to the Norns of mythology, these folk all shared one brain, passing it between themselves occasionally. Obviously, this moron didn't get the brain before he got stuck up there.
16 HEMATITE 126
(http://i.imgur.com/JdVFoDy.jpg)
Here stands the village on the cusp of summer. We've gotten through some annoying times together, and I can honestly say my opinion of these idiots has not improved whatsoever. Our wooden buildings are ugly hodgepodges of whatever the hell we could chop down, one of the idiots is sleeping under an awning in the skeleton of the farming annex, and I barely have a bedroom much less a proper office, but at least we're not in imminent danger of starvation, which is probably an improvement for these folk.
Primary danger consists entirely of a roving pack of hounds in the uncleared woods to the east of the "village", but the rocks here are hard and dense - perfect for hurling. If the idiot brigade figures out how to aim, we should be safe for now.
================
They don't live in hobbit holes because sadly, I forgot to check for hills on embark :( Things are progressing nicely anyways. No severe issues detected, only minor issue is that Honeywine does not appear in the still reactions list :-\ I shall press on, nevertheless.
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 18, 2013, 04:06:09 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on July 18, 2013, 04:30:51 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Things are progressing nicely anyways. No severe issues detected, only minor issue is that Honeywine does not appear in the still reactions list 
I shall press on, nevertheless.Superb start. Bonus points for the story, and for starting with no skills, almost no supplies and an above ground village if I read that correctly. :D
Halflings don't have honeywine making enabled in laula's raws, it turns out. That should probably be added in. If you want to include it in your game you could probably overwrite anvil- or shovel making after having enough of those.
I'm adding it to the first page. Oh, I hope nobody's mad that didn't just allow people from the player pool. It wasn't working too well as you can see from our turns list; since we actually NEED to have the turn going in a week or so (not in principle, but in practice everyone will probably just drop the older version including the player), they need to start pretty fast.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 18, 2013, 05:20:58 pm
========================
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I know for a fact this region freezes in winter, because the river was solid when I first embarked. Not sure about snow, but...poetic license.
Minor Issue? : Halflings evidently do not have an official liaison position, or a national leadership. I could see this being intentional, easily - a nation of city-states, perhaps, without centralized colonization efforts - but confirmation would be appreciated.
Next turn I'm digging for caverns, and we'll see if the cavern creatures - both mine and Laula's - work as hoped and expected :)
EDIT: And thanks for the compliment :)
Post by: Halfling on July 18, 2013, 05:52:23 pm
I know for a fact this region freezes in winter, because the river was solid when I first embarked. Not sure about snow, but...poetic license.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Minor Issue? : Halflings evidently do not have an official liaison position, or a national leadership. I could see this being intentional, easily - a nation of city-states, perhaps, without centralized colonization efforts - but confirmation would be appreciated.
Next turn I'm digging for caverns, and we'll see if the cavern creatures - both mine and Laula's - work as hoped and expected :)
Correct. These are just any hobbits; politics don't really play a part in their life (other than electing the mayor). The liaison you get is not a thain-appointed noble, just some slightly adventurous halfling who took up trading on the side. Assume that they come with the caravan. This also fit well with the minimalist theme. :)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 18, 2013, 06:56:05 pm
All the plants in this game are so expensive, with the exception of the tarnish stalk, and those things are so bad for your health, I can see why they would be cheaper. I like how that worked out.
Also, we don't have the 3 by 3 wagons at all. Someone needs to make one in the creature files unless we're all ok with just using the smaller space carried by animals.
I mean, I'd be ok with just animals, since that makes the fortress a lot easier to defend. I'm just saying.
Post by: Halfling on July 18, 2013, 07:27:03 pm
Good point on the wagon issue. Now you could just go ahead and make a "wagon", but that's kind of boring. Remember that it doesn't have to be like a vanilla wagon at all, I don't think, and I believe we could have several different types. Here's some I made just now. Note that it's good to include a caste type so you can test them in arena mode (with a transformation syndrome at least) (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=128593.msg4409202#msg4409202):
Spoiler: body (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: wagon creatures (click to show/hide)
Tested them briefly, feel free to just add them in or make your own or do both. With equipment it's probably the more variety that exists, the merrier.
Sadly, they still look like ordinary wagons in arena mode. On bottom left is tile 10 in the color that I was hoping for:
(http://s23.postimg.org/cuok8p3u3/palanquin.png)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 18, 2013, 07:43:21 pm
We could even mount wagons with machine gun if we wanted too.
Update on traveler test = Failed, my fort went mad and by the time the travelers got there, the depot had been destroyed and only 3 sane people were left, so they didn't even come in and say hello.
Here's what I mean.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on July 18, 2013, 07:47:07 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 18, 2013, 07:51:52 pm
They just went mad? Was someone's art defaced and someone drunk on tarnish vodka vomit in the well? :PYep, every body got fed up with people throwing up in the water pit that didn't have a proper well, and the lack of chairs, and the miasma, and the hunger, and the rotting corpses of their friends and loved ones...
You know, really stupid stuff.
Although the flood in the dormitories is probably what did it.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 18, 2013, 08:51:14 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 18, 2013, 09:43:09 pm
=============================
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Minor Quirk: Making wood crafts at a craftsman shop can yield wood gems.
Post by: A Spoony Bard on July 19, 2013, 12:13:18 am
Those water grubs that grow as they age reminded me of sand trouts (http://dune.wikia.com/wiki/Sandtrout), but in the Dune universe they eventually grow into one of these.If your water grubs were able to "go feral", it'd be cool to see them converted into a desert megabeast "Sandworm" that creates labyrinths like minotaurs from vanilla.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Sadly, water grubs are a little too small to be dangerous if they go feral - only one kilogram. A shai-hulud would be fun to add, though...Actually, reading that article on the sand trout, the Growth Grubs I made a while back are similar, though instead of producing spice when squeezed, they produced growth formula. If you guys are interested, the raws are here:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: sackhead on July 19, 2013, 12:25:27 am
I will focus on areas of modding i havn't tried before firstly Graphics set support. then creature graphics (interpreting some creatures will be interesting)
then i will add more materials for diversity
Post by: mastahcheese on July 19, 2013, 12:48:44 am
cool i have got this and will start work tomorrow.If you make a graphic for my mysterious travelers, just make them look like short, robed guys, they're actually smaller than halflings.
I will focus on areas of modding i havn't tried before firstly Graphics set support. then creature graphics (interpreting some creatures will be interesting)
then i will add more materials for diversity
Come to think of, I think I inadvertently made a race of Jawas.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 19, 2013, 01:01:49 am
Post by: emeralis00 on July 19, 2013, 02:06:09 am
Quote
grey rock, boring and dull and without a green thing growing in itThis gives me an idea. Mossy Rock: When you mine it, instead of dropping a boulder, it drops rock moss, which can be brewed into a healthy drink. It would probably be a vein stone.
If no one picks it up, I might start making it.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 19, 2013, 02:11:59 am
Post by: Halfling on July 19, 2013, 04:32:22 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
We currently don't have any fuel for smelting other than food. How about growable fuel that you can farm? Might make it more viable as an alternative to magma even in the long run.
My suggestion: reaction to burn tarnish stalks for fuel, kitchen/kiln/smelter (with kitchen you could make it automatic). Consume 1-5 tarnish stalks, produce charcoal. Also great as a way to get rid of the damn things which seem to be genuinely annoying at times.
Post by: Person on July 19, 2013, 04:59:19 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 19, 2013, 11:57:04 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:ENTLING]
[NAME:entling:entlings:entling]
[CASTE_NAME:entling:entlings:entling]
[CREATURE_TILE:'e'][COLOR:2:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:Smaller, docile versions of the mighty Ents that roam the world. Their fruits are delicious, though you'll have to tame one in order to get at them.]
[PREFSTRING:delicious fruit][PREFSTRING:inability to stomp all over their house.]
[DIURNAL]
[BODY:2PART_HEAD_FRAME:BRANCHES:ROOTS:TAPROOT]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PLANT_MOBILE_MATLAYER]
[EXTRAVISION]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BRANCHES_APPEARANCE_MODIFIERS]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BARK_APPEARANCE_MODIFIERS]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:LEAF_COLOR_NORMAL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ATTACK_BRANCH_STRIKE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_MOTILE_PLANT]
[GOOD]
[BIOME:ANY_FOREST][CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:7][POPULATION_NUMBER:200:400]
[PET][PETVALUE:200][MOUNT] see "Isengard", "Last March of the Ents"
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:8000]
[BODY_SIZE:10:0:60000]
[BODY_SIZE:40:0:90000] Smaller but still larger than humans
[LARGE_ROAMING][MEANDERER][BENIGN]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SAP:LIQUID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[SWIM_SPEED:3000]
[ITEMCORPSE:WOOD:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:ENTWOOD]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[SELECT_CASTE:FEMALE]
[SELECT_ADDITIONAL_CASTE:MALE]
[TISSUE:FRUIT]
[TISSUE_NAME:fruit:NP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:ENTFRUIT]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[SELECT_TISSUE:FRUIT]
[TISSUE_LAYER_OVER:BY_CATEGORY:BRANCH:FRUIT]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:FRUIT]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:300:0:0:NO_END]
[SHEARABLE_TISSUE_LAYER:LENGTH:90]
Shearable, fruit-making little trees. Well, "little" is relative, as they're bigger than a human, let alone a halfling, but still smaller than the megabeast version I'm working on. It took me a little, but poking through the MLP mod I finally figured out how to make more advanced descriptors, and now I shall create races of needlessly detailed monsters to terrorize the earth!
...well, if the next guy wants to add them in.
EDIT: Combat testing shows that these things are kind of like the Womping Willow with legs. Six branches, all being used at random for a clubbing attack while a terrified hobbit tries to dodge.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 19, 2013, 01:09:53 pm
Post by: Baffler on July 19, 2013, 02:28:41 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 19, 2013, 02:36:27 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 19, 2013, 02:48:10 pm
===============================
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Nothing has emerged to massacre us yet, so I'm going to find them. Blade will be digging a staircase to Cav2 while Chief and his boys reveal the rest of Cav1. Hopefully there's an underground passage to Cav3 or - gods help us - something more interesting down there :)
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 19, 2013, 04:28:44 pm
I think i have a bug report - in every world that i have generated with the latest version, there have been no shallow metals except for sites which are actually in the sea.
That's interesting to note, but I can't help but feel the RNG is merely spitting in your face, not that it's necessarily my fault. Let's see....
Out of the three metals I personally added, one is found in metamorpic rock only (and infrequently, in small clusters no less), so that won't ever be listed as shallow. The other two I added, one is sedimentary only, and another is found in alluvial veins and both types of igneous rock.
As for the other metals I had nothing to do with, a quick inspection of the raws turns up some likely culprits. Both ores of meteoric iron, Taenite and Kamacite, appear only as clusters within layers of "rock". The generic rock, while once ludicrously common, is actually not so anymore. While it can appear in literally any environment, it has to compete with the other types of rock I've added to the game. Azurine and Kazurot can also make up sedimentary layers, and they cannot contain meteoric iron ores, only Lunaniumite. Leylite and Tetraline are igneous intrusive, meaning they are most likely to appear underground and/or in highly volcanic regions, and Polynzite is igneous extrusive, and can appear above-ground in volcanic areas. All these stones will contain Aeresiumite, but will exclude the presence of meteoric iron within themselves--you need to get lucky and get a layer of 'rock'. (I feel like we should also rename generic rock to something else, just for the sake of naming conventions.) Celestium is also extremely rare--it appears as small clusters only within celestial marble, which itself only appears as large clusters within metamorphic rock--so it can't be a shallow metal either. Promethium comes from Kazbekite, which comes in igneous rock, both intrusive and extrusive, and so it's possible to be shallow metal if you get a highly volcanic region. Then I guess there's aurum, which isn't -explicitly- a metal, since you can't take it to the forge and make stuff out of it, but it is highly valuable silk with the material properties of gold, so I guess there's that... but it's a creature emission and never shows up in the dirt.
So it looks like, for shallow metals, your options are the occasional Lunaniumite vein in sedimentary stone, potentially Kazbekite and Aeresiumite in shallow igneous rocks. If you haven't jacked up the mineral frequency from default, you're also going to get a lot less metal in the world, period, and that can contribute to your lack of shallow metal. The world I'm playing, I genned a medium island with only a few tweaks from vanilla (mainly turning off random creatures to make DF whine slightly less). I set the mineral scarcity to somewhere around I think 1000-1200, something in that range, and I have shallow metal all OVER the damn place. In and out of the oceans. Yes, there is a lot of shallow metal in the oceans, and I think that has something to do with the fact that I didn't define a stone that can make up oceanic regions, so the only one available is Halfling's Rock, which contains meteoric iron. But that shouldn't affect the ability to find shallow metal elsewhere.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 19, 2013, 08:33:09 pm
Cool stuff, all. I'm especially happy with everything.Yeah, there have actually been a couple times I've seen people die from blows to the head that didn't involve the brain being punctured.^ very nicely shows off many differences from vanilla bodies and attacks in one screencap.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
YES, I will do this. And I absolutely love how hateable they are, if only they could be detestable.
We currently don't have any fuel for smelting other than food. How about growable fuel that you can farm? Might make it more viable as an alternative to magma even in the long run.
My suggestion: reaction to burn tarnish stalks for fuel, kitchen/kiln/smelter (with kitchen you could make it automatic). Consume 1-5 tarnish stalks, produce charcoal. Also great as a way to get rid of the damn things which seem to be genuinely annoying at times.
Post by: kopout on July 19, 2013, 10:57:32 pm
Edit: every part but the eyes.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 19, 2013, 11:23:11 pm
every part but the eyes.
That's so they can see the cold desperation of their situation and marvel at the lovely patterns of thickening ice on their exoskeleton as winter comes to claim them as its own :D
Post by: kopout on July 19, 2013, 11:30:32 pm
Edit: cruising through the raws I saw that the back half of the wormy body was marked as being a [head] as well as [LB] is that intentional? Can things with the wormy body plan function if either part is destroyed?
Post by: Putnam on July 19, 2013, 11:46:01 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 19, 2013, 11:49:21 pm
It'll work.
Wait, woah - what? You can bisect a wormy and it will just keep on ticking? :o Or were you referring to something else entirely?
Post by: kopout on July 19, 2013, 11:54:37 pm
Edit: unless he thought I meant that only the lower body is the head instead of both upper and lower
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 20, 2013, 12:19:30 am
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 20, 2013, 12:24:44 am
...if the interior bit of a wormy has a syndrome fluid inside like the steam in the Masterwork "automatons", that creates 2 wormies as a reaction to being let out, you could certainly have fun with exponential wormie progressions that may be fun until you get FPS death.This. I want.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on July 20, 2013, 01:12:32 am
It might be tine for me to dif out my. files for bluesteel
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 20, 2013, 01:14:47 am
...if the interior bit of a wormy has a syndrome fluid inside like the steam in the Masterwork "automatons", that creates 2 wormies as a reaction to being let out, you could certainly have fun with exponential wormie progressions that may be fun until you get FPS death.
Holy shit, that'd be awesome. Doubt it's possible, but I'm still new at this stuff, especially interactions (copy-pasted the vampire reactions from these raws to my own personal raws and somehow broke it irreparably while tweaking).
Post by: Halfling on July 20, 2013, 01:37:31 am
In this case it's going to be a bit convoluted, though. Could be: worms contain syndrome fluid that gives worms syndrome. This syndrome transforms them into a creature that promptly loses a limb, that limb having been connected to it via a limb of material that vanishes at room temperature (not my idea, but I'm too lazy to find & link the original "hoops"), and animates that limb, simultaneously transforming it into a worm part. Then the temporary creature also transforms into a worm part due to the syndrome. Ergo 1 worm bisected -> 2 living worm parts. Or 4 if both bisected parts survive, but I didn't know that was possible.
Post by: Putnam on July 20, 2013, 01:40:23 am
Post by: sackhead on July 20, 2013, 03:21:29 am
(http://i42.tinypic.com/svs3zc.png)
there shirt colour responds to that of the colours for professions on the z menu.
unfortunately i will be away Monday to Thursday (i live in GMT +12:00 so that will be Sunday to wednesday US time)
i will try to get trees' plans and minerals to display nicely with the tile set i am using (obsidians tile set) .
tomorrow mourning i need to finish my comitmint to The luckiest tourist ever succession game. Then tomorrow afternoon i may add some materials.
Do we have Coal yet?
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 09:10:51 am
Post by: Meph on July 20, 2013, 11:33:24 am
...if the interior bit of a wormy has a syndrome fluid inside like the steam in the Masterwork "automatons", that creates 2 wormies as a reaction to being let out, you could certainly have fun with exponential wormie progressions that may be fun until you get FPS death.
Holy shit, that'd be awesome. Doubt it's possible, but I'm still new at this stuff, especially interactions (copy-pasted the vampire reactions from these raws to my own personal raws and somehow broke it irreparably while tweaking).
You guys should probably open my raws and search for a creature and some interactions with the word "soggoth" in them. Because I do have self-replicating, exponentially-growing monsters. :)
Post by: BFEL on July 20, 2013, 12:12:44 pm
I was using the "werewolf necromancer" effect with them though.
Basic idea: Clayman1 gets his easily-popped-off arm popped off, Clayman1 necros Clayman1's severed arm, Clayman1's severed arm regenerates creating Clayman2 etc.
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 03:01:21 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 20, 2013, 03:11:00 pm
I don't know if the weather works, though. The interactions are tied to specific biomes, and I believe that happens during world-gen, and I don't know if there's a way to convince the game to accept the sandstorm as a viable target.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 20, 2013, 04:49:12 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 20, 2013, 06:18:27 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 20, 2013, 08:31:38 pm
The world's first kerosine-like biofuel... Call it Moonshine maybe. (Or tarnish remover)Actually, I was planning on having you be able to run it through a screw press or processed at a farmer's workshop to produce "Tarnish Tobacco" which you could then burn into fuel at some other building using a Halfling smoking pipe, so they finally have a use.
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 08:36:57 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 20, 2013, 08:54:30 pm
those poor halflings that have to smoke your death weedI'm sigging this.
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 08:57:25 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 20, 2013, 09:18:08 pm
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 09:30:54 pm
Though halflings smoke all kinds of crazy stuff so maybe have them be immune to Tarnish Smoke (and smoke based syndromes in general). Everyone else can die from it.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 20, 2013, 09:34:55 pm
And yes, it'll be super toxic.
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 09:47:33 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 20, 2013, 10:08:00 pm
Congratulations, you made the worlds most killtastic plant.Not yet, there's another plant I want to make when I'm done with the tarnish stalks.
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 10:30:07 pm
Also, Meph, do you know if custom weather works?
Post by: Aseaheru on July 20, 2013, 10:37:03 pm
Post by: Meph on July 20, 2013, 10:40:12 pm
On the other hand my new glacier weather which adds cold and disorientation and numbness, but can be countered by wearing fur clothing, doesnt seem to naturally occur, so I dont know whats up with that. I just posted about it in the modding questions thread, maybe you guys can have a look.
But in general, yes, custom weather works.
Post by: kopout on July 20, 2013, 10:54:51 pm
But in general, yes, custom weather works.
So I was looking for one of St Leibowitz's sandstorms and I cant find one.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Meph on July 20, 2013, 11:14:39 pm
Code: [Select]
[INTERACTION:DUST_STORM_NEUTRAL_LFR]
[I_SOURCE:REGION]
[IS_REGION:NORMAL_ALLOWED]
[IS_REGION:SAVAGE_ALLOWED]
[IS_REGION:EVIL_ALLOWED]
[IS_REGION:DESERT]
[IS_FREQUENCY:75]
[I_TARGET:B:MATERIAL]
[IT_MATERIAL:MATERIAL:INORGANIC:SAND_BLIND:WEATHER_CREEPING_DUST]
[I_EFFECT:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[IE_TARGET:B]
[IE_INTERMITTENT:WEEKLY]
[INTERACTION:GOOD_MILK_AND_HONEY_RAIN]
[I_SOURCE:REGION]
[IS_REGION:GOOD_ONLY]
[IS_REGION:SAVAGE_ALLOWED]
[IS_REGION:ANY_TERRAIN]
[IS_FREQUENCY:25]
[I_TARGET:A:MATERIAL]
[IT_MATERIAL:MATERIAL:INORGANIC:MILK_AND_HONEY:WEATHER_FALLING_MATERIAL]
[I_EFFECT:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_INTERMITTENT:WEEKLY]Both of those I have seen ingame, but I cant reliably have them all the time, in all deserts and all good biomes. I dont know if regional weather interactions that are procedually generated drown them out, and if a worldgen with evil_rain:0 would help.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 21, 2013, 02:34:44 am
Dose wearing cloth made from it give you blisters?Normally? No. But you reminded me that the tarnish stalks can be made into cloth, and they currently lack a contact syndrome.
Also, for fans of contact syndromes, Halflings don't wear gloves!
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 21, 2013, 02:52:59 am
Post by: mastahcheese on July 21, 2013, 02:59:51 am
We're going to have to make tarnish stalks obscenely useful - past just being an easy fuel source and dirt cheap - to justify ever even scrolling over them in the trade interface, much less farming them. Maybe make them required in some kind steel-like metal production, too, for fun :)Well, currently I'm working on them, and I'm making the tobacco value at 12, to be a cash crop.
But advanced metallurgy would be cool.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 21, 2013, 05:56:22 am
Post by: Halfling on July 21, 2013, 08:42:59 am
Apple trees (and other trees) yield an unit of "tree" that does not have [WOOD] tag -> must be taken to custom building "lumber yard" where it is sawed (wood cutting) into 1-3 logs + any other products such as apples (LY_REACTION_MATs).
I didn't implement that due to a lack of time and wanting to preserve overall familiarity to get started. But I think if more advanced production chains are devised we'd all be fine with them implemented retroactively to old materials in new updates.
A more realistic smelting process might have at least some of the following details, based on my poor understanding of metallurgy:
Have one or several "smelting preprocessors" (kilns, but could call them something else and have several different ones) that feed into the vanilla "smelter", with the following details.
* Native minerals (meteoric iron, gold, copper, native silver, native lead, etc) do not require either flux or fuel to make into bars, and do not yield slag. They don't need to be processed further. This is to balance more difficulty in the others.
* For the rest, they must first be processed. This takes x amount of nuggets and yields y amount of separated metal and x-y slag. Realistically you would have to figure out exactly what is needed ore by ore, but for our purposes could generalize to:
- Higher value (harder, higher melting point) metals need more fuel (for a higher temperature, common sense), up to 10 units per unit of ore
- More rare metals yield more slag and less metal, up to 10 nuggets yielding 9 slag and 1 metal (again common sense, reflects how much metal is in the ore)
- Most metals require flux as a purifying agent to smelt. Potash should also work as a flux.
* There could be alternative metal-dependent processing routes that give less slag and more metal for ore in return for a more difficult setup, such as using various chemicals for leaching. If we had "copper ore" (e.g. bornite), could have "roast copper ore": 10 ore + 10 fuel -> 5 slag and 5 separated copper and "leach copper ore":5 slag + 5 ore + bucket of acid -> 7-8 separated copper.
I think civilizations would still have material access, because the permitted reactions seem to deliver that. (like halfling access to iridium currently despite no access to smelting).
It would take some concentrated effort to make the basics of all the above but after that it would be only slightly more work per metal to add in new stuff than usual. I'm not sure if the above would be total overkill or just more fun though. :P
Post by: mastahcheese on July 21, 2013, 06:15:02 pm
Post by: kopout on July 21, 2013, 08:06:26 pm
Edit: So now I've turned the crafts shop into a horrifying black hole that eats anything wooden and spits out useless "plants". I'm not very good at reactions.
Edit2: So, They use any logs for the reaction, which produces logs and useless "plants". I put it on repeat and my mayor hasn't moved in days. SCIENCE!
Post by: mastahcheese on July 21, 2013, 08:30:37 pm
Wood chippers for the win.
Post by: kopout on July 21, 2013, 08:32:26 pm
Edit: here's the reaction
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 21, 2013, 08:35:45 pm
Possibly your tarnish-stalk substances could give a boost to happiness if drunk as a vodka and impart [nopain] for a little while as a smoke. It would certainly be medically useful for the badly wounded, even though like RL opiates too much would surely kill them instead.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 21, 2013, 08:36:08 pm
Post by: kopout on July 21, 2013, 08:38:43 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
and the apple plant it self
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: kopout on July 21, 2013, 08:39:32 pm
I want to make a tumbleweed creature that just stumbles around and gives a log when killed.I might be able to do that. Trade you the apple tree problem?
Post by: Halfling on July 21, 2013, 08:44:55 pm
So, I'm working on the "apple trees can be processed for apples and wood" thing and I've run in to a few problems. At the moment the reaction produces a "logs' and a "plants". The logs can be used for building and everything but the plants are useless as food.
Edit: So now I've turned the crafts shop into a horrifying black hole that eats anything wooden and spits out useless "plants". I'm not very good at reactions.
Edit2: So, They use any logs for the reaction, which produces logs and useless "plants". I put it on repeat and my mayor hasn't moved in days. SCIENCE!
Thanks for the effort. If they use logs for the reaction and the reaction produces logs then it will just loop forever (and produce infinite apples), never getting new material. I learned this with my "make everything out of any material" reaction set.
I think for the apples you may actually want to define a separate plant called apple that's edible raw but doesn't occur anywhere and make it produce that. Bonus points for making it brewable into Applejack.
Ninja'd:
[REAGENT:A:1:NONE:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:RAW_APPLE_TREE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:APPLE_WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:NONE]
try that. I actually haven't much experience with plants so not 100% sure.
Also hm. The three P:s in "raw_APPPLE_tree" may cause an issue.
Post by: kopout on July 21, 2013, 09:05:21 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 21, 2013, 09:21:15 pm
Hm. If it's not too much trouble, try making apple wood and raw apple wood separate materials, make apple trees be made of raw apple wood as original, make apple wood a reaction product of raw apple wood, and make the reaction to require something which has that reaction product. I think that should fix all the issues except plants.
Post by: Meph on July 21, 2013, 09:21:53 pm
Code: [Select]
[REAGENT:A:1:NONE:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:RAW_APPLE_TREE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:APPLE_WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:NONE]to:
Code: [Select]
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_WOOD_HLG:WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT]You will accept any felled apple-tree log as reagent, you wont need different wood templates, you will produce a log of wood and a plant. You will need a second tree for the second type of wood, (done to avoid the product wood being used as reagent) and you will need the plant for the edible apple. I would just copy plump helmets, remove biomes and add frequency:0,then rename some stuff. This way you cant make mistakes and you can make "apple cider" alcohol easily.
You could call the tree-wood "rough apple tree" log, and after running the reaction you would have "apple tree" log and "apple". I personally would rather do this:
[PRODUCT:25:2:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT]
[PRODUCT:25:2:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT]
[PRODUCT:25:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT]
[PRODUCT:25:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT]
[PRODUCT:25:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT]
then this:
[PRODUCT:100:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT]
simply because I think that one apple-tree should have a change for more then one apple. Or maybe yield no apples.
You can also experiment with fake-plants called "apple-tree sapling" that can be planted in farmplots, which give seeds, wood and apples.
EDIT: Sneaky edit to replace structural with plant. One is for reagents, the other products, sorry.
Post by: kopout on July 21, 2013, 09:36:04 pm
Edit: [PRODUCT:100:1:PLANT:NONE:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:PLANT] still doesn't work. Just gives "plants" :(
Post by: Meph on July 21, 2013, 09:56:57 pm
[PLANT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT]
[NAME:apple]
[NAME_PLURAL:apples]
[ADJ:apple]
[FREQUENCY:100]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:10]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_RAW]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[PREFSTRING:cheerful color]
[SUMMER][SPRING][AUTUMN][WINTER]
[GROWDUR:700][CLUSTERSIZE:10]
[PICKED_TILE:111][PICKED_COLOR:4:0:1]
[SHRUB_TILE:236][SHRUB_COLOR:4:0:1]
[DEAD_SHRUB_TILE:236]
[DEAD_SHRUB_COLOR:6:0:0]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL] ;)
Like I said, it would be easier to copy an existing plant and rename it, then to try writing something yourself. Clustersize and growdur and all that are not needed, since its a fake-plant that doesnt exist in natural biomes. Active seasons as well, you dont need those.
Post by: kopout on July 21, 2013, 10:04:31 pm
Post by: Meph on July 21, 2013, 10:06:58 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 21, 2013, 10:17:31 pm
That said... Okay, you could easily rename STRUCTURE to STRUCTURAL, because why not. The difference to vanilla is insignificant and just a byproduct of my writing, not necessarily how it needs to be (but I think it's more logical the reference to it is PLANT_ID:STRUCTURE and not PLANT_ID:STRUCTURAL). But could that really, logically be the problem? According to wiki's plant tokens, that pair of tokens first defines an internal material called STRUCTURE and then makes the plant's basic material be that.
By all means try it but that shouldn't be it.
To determine whether the reaction or plant is faulty you can, however, try to make it create a pumpkin or a vanilla plump helmet which we know do work.
Post by: Mapleguy555 on July 21, 2013, 11:23:42 pm
...
Unless structures(?) can't accommodate this sort of thing?
Post by: Putnam on July 22, 2013, 12:46:22 am
Mh... in that case I will quietly step away, because I cant possibly know whats right or wrong with it. But good luck.
Especially since the STRUCTURE thing is a completely arbitrary thing and doesn't matter at all :P
Post by: Gnorm on July 22, 2013, 10:44:32 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 11:19:09 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Since I just finished Bioshock Infinite, I was also considering adding Vigor-like potions in that would allow the drinker to perform an interaction (such as hurling a fireball), and I have an idea for abusing werecreature-ism to make a healing potion, too. Plus, I'll need to add some new creatures and plants to supply ingredients. I'll post it as a separate download from my raws once I've got everything working :)
EDIT: Also, how fares the tarnish-stalk-as-a-fuel thing?
Post by: Baffler on July 22, 2013, 12:40:18 pm
Also, I just recently finished bioshock infinite as well, and holy shit. I don't think a video game will ever blow my mind so completely as that.
Edit: Also, the elves don't seem to have access to weapons. Their caravan came guarded by wrestlers.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 12:42:31 pm
Also, I just recently finished bioshock infinite as well, and holy shit. I don't think a video game will ever blow my mind so completely as that.
Agreed wholeheartedly :D
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 12:59:44 pm
Numbing Incense: Yep, that worked. Jumped off an arena tower, broke the dummy's everything, summoned a few blocks of volatile numbing incense and he stopped complaining about the pain instantly. Hooray!
Bloodletting Incense: Very erratic. Test Subject 1 bled out in under ten ticks, thanks to everything suddenly bleeding at once, but Subject 2 is being toyed with. Random parts of his body start spraying blood for a few ticks or so and then just stop. May have to do with dosage - 1 had three boulders, 2 had only 1.
Post by: Aseaheru on July 22, 2013, 01:02:10 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 01:12:04 pm
Subject 2 from Bloodletting died eventually. One boulder of incense burned seems a good deal more balanced than three, perhaps - less ridiculous-spontaneous-exsanguination and more internal-bleeding-caused-by-poison-gas. He lived long enough that I tried to draw a giant smiley face with his blood by walking in a pattern, but he didn't quite make it.
EDIT: Haste incense works. Could work very well alongside numbing incense to prepare soldiers for battle - speed-demon, nopain halfling clubmen of doom. As long as the battle doesn't last long enough for the side effect of the numbing incense to kick in, that should be a good tactic.
Post by: Baffler on July 22, 2013, 01:19:39 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 01:28:05 pm
Using smoking pipes to ignite these at the braziers sounds like a good idea - I'll employ that for the reactions.
EDIT: the only one that should be very easy to make will be the numbing incense; its side effect is dangerous enough in battle (sudden unconsciousness) that it counters the six or so days of nopain it grants. Probably least dangerous use would be a medical anaesthesia.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 22, 2013, 02:05:52 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 02:14:31 pm
Mastahcheese made wizards, seems to be working on some form of outsider civilization, and created the much-lamented Tarnish Stalk plant, which will soon be a fuel (I think). Booze now causes drunkenness and hangovers for the uninitiated.
Laula populated the underground with many types of stone, and the Pale Rider.
That's the highlights as I recall them.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 22, 2013, 02:23:28 pm
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 02:29:28 pm
How many passive, non-monster animals do we have? Do we currently have just livestock and monsters, or do we have random wandering passive things that aren't wild versions of domestic things?I don't think we have any passive wildlife except fishable vermin.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 02:49:14 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on July 22, 2013, 02:51:18 pm
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 02:53:44 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 22, 2013, 02:53:44 pm
This is a particularly interesting idea. Might I be added to the player pool?
Yes, you might. In fact you are there now. Although it's mostly ceremonial at this point. Pick up the save, post a report, I'll add it to the play turn it if spans enough time. That's the new system. :P
We really could use more playtesting logs. I'm not sure there will be a time when this is basically not true, but it's very true now.
How many passive, non-monster animals do we have? Do we currently have just livestock and monsters, or do we have random wandering passive things that aren't wild versions of domestic things?
There's vermin (tits and voles), and STL's insects above (ninja'd). If you count those as non-monsters. That said, we could probably use some non-insect mundane roaming wildlife that's not a hound or a mallard.
Also, you should know sackhead is currently working on some cool graphics for us for his turn.
Playtesting is going well. The only significant issue I've come across is the halfling caravan (from Lake Tit) arrived in the late summer, then again in the late autumn. I guess they left something behind :P
Also, I just recently finished bioshock infinite as well, and holy shit. I don't think a video game will ever blow my mind so completely as that.
Edit: Also, the elves don't seem to have access to weapons. Their caravan came guarded by wrestlers.
True. Elves don't have any equipment, not even clothes. BFEL could not finish them in time, but he has given permission for anyone to modify and develop the elves so long as the original idea of tree thralldom is preserved. Of course if you don't like that, you can just make another race and call it elves too. :P
Anyone with a thing for elves, feel free to give them something cool to wear and wield. And don't look at me like that.
The halfling caravan currently arrives up to 3 times per year. That can be adjusted if it's excessive, but it's good for the minimal world where there are no other civilizations.
I plan to make them difficult to make, especially paralysis incense because that's like being bitten by a vanilla GCS (tested; it works beautifully :) ). The plant ingredients for the combat ones are rare and expensive, and some will require animal ingredients like Basilisk Tears - which are needed to make stoneward, which lets you safely harvest those by making halflings immune to petrification, so you'll have to make a sacrifice to the basilisk to safely get those.
Using smoking pipes to ignite these at the braziers sounds like a good idea - I'll employ that for the reactions.
EDIT: the only one that should be very easy to make will be the numbing incense; its side effect is dangerous enough in battle (sudden unconsciousness) that it counters the six or so days of nopain it grants. Probably least dangerous use would be a medical anaesthesia.
Do you know what this means?
Using smoking pipes to ignite these at the braziers sounds like a good idea - I'll employ that for the reactions.
Using smoking pipes to ignite these at the braziers
Bloodletting incense defense
your unique smoking pipes don't (yet?) help you survive
Well then. I should have known you guys would not let me known. Not bay forum. :)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 03:59:27 pm
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:PLANT]
[PLANT:WIZARDSBANE_STL]
[NAME:wizardsbane][NAME_PLURAL:wizardsbane][ADJ:wizardsbane]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:5]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
[GROWDUR:2016]
[PICKED_TILE:'*'][PICKED_COLOR:1:0:1]
[WET][DRY][BIOME:ANY_WETLAND]
[VALUE:5]
[AUTUMN][SUMMER]
[FREQUENCY:25]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[PREFSTRING:soft luminescence at night]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:5]
[SEED:wizardsbane seed:wizardsbane seeds:0:0:1:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
[PLANT:STINKWEED_STL]
[NAME:stinkweed][NAME_PLURAL:stinkweed][ADJ:stinkweed]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:3]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
[GROWDUR:2016]
[PICKED_TILE:'$'][PICKED_COLOR:6:0:1]
[WET][DRY][BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
[VALUE:3]
[AUTUMN][SUMMER]
[FREQUENCY:45]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[PREFSTRING:pungent aroma]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:3]
[SEED:stinkweed seed:stinkweed seeds:6:0:1:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
[PLANT:CALMROOT_STL]
[NAME:calmroot][NAME_PLURAL:calmroot][ADJ:calmroot]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:3]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
[GROWDUR:2016]
[PICKED_TILE:';'][PICKED_COLOR:3:0:0]
[WET][DRY][BIOME:ANY_WETLAND]
[VALUE:3]
[AUTUMN][SUMMER]
[FREQUENCY:45]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[PREFSTRING:calming tea]
[PREFSTRING:anaesthetic properties]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:3]
[SEED:calmroot seed:calmroot seeds:3:0:0:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
[PLANT:NUMWORT_STL]
[NAME:numwort][NAME_PLURAL:numwort][ADJ:numwort]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:3]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
[GROWDUR:2016]
[PICKED_TILE:231][PICKED_COLOR:0:0:1]
[WET][DRY][BIOME:NOT_FREEZING]
[VALUE:3]
[AUTUMN][SUMMER]
[FREQUENCY:45]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[PREFSTRING:calming tea]
[PREFSTRING:anaesthetic properties]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:3]
[SEED:numwort seed:numwort seeds:3:0:0:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
[PLANT:CINNAMON_STL]
[NAME:cinnamon][NAME_PLURAL:cinnamon][ADJ:cinnamon]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:6]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
[GROWDUR:1008]
[PICKED_TILE:232][PICKED_COLOR:4:0:0]
[WET][DRY][BIOME:ANY_FOREST][GOOD]
[VALUE:6]
[SUMMER][SPRING]
[FREQUENCY:100]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[PREFSTRING:light-absorbing aura]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:6]
[SEED:cinnamon berry:cinnamon berries:1:0:0:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
[PLANT:SHADOWCAP_STL]
[NAME:shadowcap][NAME_PLURAL:shadowcaps][ADJ:shadowcap]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:6]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
[GROWDUR:1008]
[PICKED_TILE:232][PICKED_COLOR:1:0:0]
[WET][DRY][BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_CHASM][UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:2:3]
[VALUE:6]
[AUTUMN][SUMMER][SPRING][WINTER]
[FREQUENCY:100]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[PREFSTRING:light-absorbing aura]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:6]
[SEED:shadowcap spawn:shadowcap spawn:1:0:0:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
[PLANT:BLOODSTALK_STL]
[NAME:bloodstalk][NAME_PLURAL:bloodstalks][ADJ:bloodstalk]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURAL:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:6]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURAL]
[GROWDUR:1008]
[PICKED_TILE:152][PICKED_COLOR:3:0:0]
[WET][DRY][BIOME:ANY_DESERT]
[VALUE:6]
[SUMMER][SPRING]
[FREQUENCY:30]
[CLUSTERSIZE:5]
[PREFSTRING:vein-like appearance]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SEED:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:6]
[SEED:bloodstalk seed:bloodstalk seeds:0:0:1:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:SEED]
The alchemical herbs and spices and fungi - the easier-to-acquire (and make) ingredients for the incenses. They're scattered pretty well, I think - most aboveground, one in the deeper caverns, one only in good forests, one only in deserts, and two only in wetlands, plus two that can grow anywhere that isn't coated in inch-thick ice year long.
The reactions I've made so far:
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:REACTION]
## Incense-ivizing ##
[REACTION:MAKE_NUMBING_STL]
[NAME:Mix numbing incense]
[BUILDING:ALCHEMY_LAB_STL:CUSTOM_N]
[REAGENT:A:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:STINKWEED_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:B:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:CALMROOT_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:NUMBING_STABLE]
[PRODUCT:25:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:NUMBING_VOLATILE] Chance of leak; keep animals far away!
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
[REACTION:MAKE_BLOODLETTING_STL]
[NAME:Mix bloodletting incense]
[BUILDING:ALCHEMY_LAB_STL:CUSTOM_SHIFT_B]
[REAGENT:A:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:STINKWEED_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:B:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:BLOODSTALK_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:C:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:NUMWORT_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:BLOODLETTING_STABLE]
[PRODUCT:25:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:BLOODLETTING_VOLATILE] WELL away
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
[REACTION:MAKE_BLINDING_STL]
[NAME:Mix blinding incense]
[BUILDING:ALCHEMY_LAB_STL:CUSTOM_B]
[REAGENT:A:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:STINKWEED_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:C:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:SHADOWCAP_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:BLINDING_STABLE]
[PRODUCT:25:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:BLINDING_VOLATILE] Urist McUnluckyKitty cancels catsplosion: cannot see mate
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
[REACTION:MAKE_HASTE_STL] Make haste, make haste! Hurry! Get inside! That crazy alchemist from next door is coming this way!
[NAME:Mix hastening incense]
[BUILDING:ALCHEMY_LAB_STL:CUSTOM_H]
[REAGENT:A:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:STINKWEED_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:B:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:WIZARDSBANE_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[REAGENT:C:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:CINNAMON_STL:STRUCTURAL][UNROTTEN]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:HASTE_STABLE]
[PRODUCT:25:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:HASTE_VOLATILE]
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
Paralysis and Stoneward both need basilisk tears, which I've not added yet, so I haven't created their reactions quite yet. All proceeds smoothly.
Well then. I should have known you guys would not let me known. Not bay forum. :)
It was wholly accidental, I can assure you, but it works out nicely :D
Post by: Halfling on July 22, 2013, 04:18:40 pm
Quote from: StLeibowitz
Well then. I should have known you guys would not let me known. Not bay forum. :)
It was wholly accidental, I can assure you, but it works out nicely :D
No, no. In retrospect it was inevitable. Everything can be weaponized. Everything that can be weaponized will be weaponized eventually. Smoking pipes are a thing. Therefore smoking pipes can and will be weaponized. Such is the way of things, even in modding.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 04:46:27 pm
Also, I made them nastier, it's quite funny.
Post by: BFEL on July 22, 2013, 05:39:37 pm
No, no. In retrospect it was inevitable. Everything can be weaponized. Everything that can be weaponized will be weaponized eventually. Smoking pipes are a thing. Therefore smoking pipes can and will be weaponized. Such is the way of things,Fix'devenESPECIALLY in modding.
Also as for the MOAR PASSIVES thing, I'm kinda working (SLOWLY) on a pet amphibious manta-ray that flies and shoots stingers at vermin/anything else that needs hunted. Also giving them their primary prey: Max sized meat blobs that act like whales, but with a hilariously high beaching frequency. Basically if you find one that isn't rotted on the shores YOU CAN EAT FOREVER. <----Claims of "eating forever" are untested and most likely incredibly farcicle
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 05:46:24 pm
Speaking of which, has anyone failed to properly stockpile tarnish stalks yet?
Doesn't matter what you do, those things will find some way to slowly kill you.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 06:06:01 pm
Post by: Gnorm on July 22, 2013, 06:08:28 pm
Yes, you might. In fact you are there now. Although it's mostly ceremonial at this point. Pick up the save, post a report, I'll add it to the play turn it if spans enough time. That's the new system. :PGood to hear, though I think I'll wait until the next stable version to make a log. I think I'll practice for now.
We really could use more playtesting logs. I'm not sure there will be a time when this is basically not true, but it's very true now.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 06:31:12 pm
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:BURN_BLINDING_STL]
[NAME:Burn blinding incense]
[BUILDING:BRAZIER_STL:CUSTOM_B]
[REAGENT:A:1:BOULDER:NONE:INORGANIC:BLINDING_STABLE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:PIPE_SMOKING_HLG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:BLINDING_VOLATILE]
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
[REACTION:BURN_BLOODLETTING_STL]
[NAME:Burn bloodletting incense]
[BUILDING:BRAZIER_STL:CUSTOM_SHIFT_B]
[REAGENT:A:1:BOULDER:NONE:INORGANIC:BLOODLETTING_STABLE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:PIPE_SMOKING_HLG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:BLOODLETTING_VOLATILE]
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
[REACTION:BURN_HASTENING_STL]
[NAME:Burn hastening incense]
[BUILDING:BRAZIER_STL:CUSTOM_H]
[REAGENT:A:1:BOULDER:NONE:INORGANIC:HASTE_STABLE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:PIPE_SMOKING_HLG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:HASTE_VOLATILE]
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
[REACTION:BURN_NUMBING_STL]
[NAME:Burn blinding incense]
[BUILDING:BRAZIER_STL:CUSTOM_B]
[REAGENT:A:1:BOULDER:NONE:INORGANIC:NUMBING_STABLE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:PIPE_SMOKING_HLG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BOULDER:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:NUMBING_VOLATILE]
[SKILL:ALCHEMY]
Halfling smoking pipes now have a use...and Formics now must look forlornly at their tiny cousins in intellect, for no Formic can puzzle out how the hell halfling pipes are made. Formic player wants to use alchemical defensive braziers? Gas-spewing poison pits? Medical anaesthesia? Better hope the halflings like whatever low-quality mugs the workers were able to churn out :)
======
A Reminder from the Halfling Alchemist's Union of Oceanpumpkin
No oven operator or furnace-handler is to come within thirty feet of a block of incense. We all know what we tell everyone about how "only an alchemist by trade can properly handle incense while it's burning, and keep it from killing us all too". Yes, we in the union management snicker whenever we hear someone outside the Union repeat that, too. Yes, we've sworn to "spread knowledge and science to fight the tide of ignorance", and this kind of shit isn't really helping that cause. However, how many of you really like having your apprentices hovering around you like mosquitoes all day? Hm? That's what I thought.
Remember, fellow Alchemists: For our peace of mind, keep it secret, and keep our apprentices' busywork safe.
~Union Management
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 07:06:34 pm
I love how the main enemy for forts in this thing is a plant.They nearly killed my first fort. Though water striders were the only things that killed one of my Halflings.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 07:39:20 pm
This is just plain awesome how my tarnish stalks turned out.I love how the main enemy for forts in this thing is a plant.They nearly killed my first fort. Though water striders were the only things that killed one of my Halflings.
Originally I just wanted a booze-planted that tasted like you were drinking rust, and it evolved into a tantrum-causing, phycho vegetable that spews death.
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 07:51:09 pm
trees can now be processed for fruit!
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 07:52:18 pm
I did it!!! :DYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
trees can now be processed for fruit!
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 07:57:14 pm
The reaction!
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
The wood tree
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
the fruit plant
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
and the apple tree with changes
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 07:58:56 pm
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:MAKE_WOOD_PLANKS_STL]
[NAME:make wooden planks]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:CUSTOM_P]
[REAGENT:WOOD:1:WOOD:NO_SUBTYPE:NONE:WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:4:BLOCKS:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:WOOD:NONE]
[SKILL:CARPENTRY]
Seeing as above-ground forts will likely be more common, I made this. Feel free to add into raws :)
Also, on the trees, yay! Now those apple trees that are everywhere can ensure we will never starve again. Probably should reduce their frequency, actually.
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 08:05:56 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 08:16:15 pm
Post by: Putnam on July 22, 2013, 08:32:19 pm
The reaction!Code: [Select]
[REACTION:PREPARE_APPLE_TREES_KPT]
[NAME:prepare apple trees]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:CUSTOM_T]
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:LOGS:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:RAW_APPLE_TREE] WOOD:LOGS?
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_WOOD_KPT:APPLE_WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]
I think you mean this:
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:RAW_APPLE_TREE]
You could have made it more universal too, but that's fine.
By more universal, I mean something this, which would work for any fruit tree built in a particular way:
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:PREPARE_FRUIT_TREES_P]
[NAME:prepare fruit trees]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:CUSTOM_T]
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:NONE:NONE:NONE][HAS_MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:FRUIT_TREE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:A:WOOD_MAT]
[PRODUCT:100:1:PLANT:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:A:FRUIT_MAT]
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 09:06:57 pm
Post by: emeralis00 on July 22, 2013, 09:07:30 pm
No, no. In retrospect it was inevitable. Everything can be weaponized. Everything that can be weaponized will be weaponized eventually. Smoking pipes are a thing. Therefore smoking pipes can and will be weaponized.I must sig this, please.
Also, the incense thing is pretty awesome. I might make it compatible with my (still planned) mossy rock if that is okay.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 09:29:58 pm
Post by: emeralis00 on July 22, 2013, 09:32:30 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 09:46:05 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 10:11:33 pm
Spoiler: Plant (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Reaction (click to show/hide)
Now, I've finally got it to mill properly, and I got it to be smoked before, but it grabbed a raw plant instead of the tobacco.
Now I'm trying to make it just grab tobacco, and in a way to make it universal, and it won't allow it, the reaction still comes up red.
When it did work with a whole plant, it make the coke right, and it made the smoke right, so the only thing with it that is wrong is the reaction class garbage as far as I can tell.
What did I do wrong? I've tried altering it about 50 different ways, and this is the last freaking step of this before I'm finished.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 10:13:52 pm
EDIT: Mastahcheese, did you specify that the tobacco material in the tarnish stalk as having that material reaction product? I think you have to do that.
EDIT2: Also, hardens with water makes it usable in casts. Tobacco casts?
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 10:16:17 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 10:17:52 pm
EDIT: Yes. Turning off somebody's brain does, in fact, kill them. By suffocation. They are fully capable of moving around without guidance of the brain, however, which I guess shows how often it's really used.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 10:21:48 pm
EDIT: Mastahcheese, did you specify that the tobacco material in the tarnish stalk as having that material reaction product? I think you have to do that.Yes, I did, its at the bottom of the page.
EDIT2: Also, hardens with water makes it usable in casts. Tobacco casts?
Yes, they can form casts, tarnish stalks are very strange plants.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 10:25:04 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 10:25:59 pm
Perhaps it's not working because in the reaction you defined the reagent as a plant, and not a milled powder?There's a difference?
(Checking Wiki, I hope that's what it was.)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 10:43:44 pm
But that didn't fix it, I changed the item tokens to all NONE, so now it should even accept a rock with the TOBACCO token, if someone wants to toke rocks.
But it still is not accepting it, and the errorlog won't make any mention of it, so I don't know what I did wrong.
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 10:50:29 pm
Post by: emeralis00 on July 22, 2013, 10:50:59 pm
Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:MOSROCK_EM]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:mossy rock]
[TILE:178][DISPLAY_COLOR:2:7:0]
[IGNEOUS_EXTRUSIVE][IGNEOUS_INTRUSIVE][SEDIMENTARY]
[SEDIMENTARY_OCEAN_SHALLOW][SEDIMENTARY_OCEAN_DEEP][METAMORPHIC]
[IS_STONE]Code: [Select]
[REACTION:CRUSHMOSROCK_EM]
[NAME:Crush mossy rock]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:NONE]
[REAGENT:MOSROCKBOULDER:1::NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:MOSROCK_EM]
[PRODUCT:33:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:METEORIC_IRON_HLG][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:STONECRAFT]The meteoric iron is a placeholder until I make the mossball. Anyone spot any immediate problems?
Post by: mastahcheese on July 22, 2013, 10:55:16 pm
I can't figure it out.
EDIT: Would the fact that the tobacco is milled into a bag make any difference whatsoever?
Post by: Meph on July 22, 2013, 11:01:25 pm
Quote
[REACTION:CRUSHMOSROCK_EM]
[NAME:Crush mossy rock]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:NONE]
[REAGENT:MOSROCKBOULDER:1::NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:MOSROCK_EM]
[PRODUCT:33:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:METEORIC_IRON_HLG][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:STONECRAFT]
Quote
[REACTION:CRUSHMOSROCK_EM]
[NAME:Crush mossy rock]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:1:BOULDER:NONE:INORGANIC:MOSROCK_EM]
[PRODUCT:33:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:METEORIC_IRON_HLG][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:STONECRAFT]
Question: Why does crushing mossy rock create meteoric iron?
Post by: kopout on July 22, 2013, 11:04:54 pm
lumberyard
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
apple tree processing
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
apple fruit (now with 100% more hard cider!)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
apple wood
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
and of course the tree itself ( for bookkeeping, no changes)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 22, 2013, 11:22:45 pm
I've even tried changing all of the material reaction stuff to just the REACTION_CLASS tags to see if it would make a difference, it didn't.
I can't figure it out.
EDIT: Would the fact that the tobacco is milled into a bag make any difference whatsoever?
...Maybe? I think vanilla reactions list the container of the reagent as a separate reagent, too. Try poking through Toady's raws and finding something that uses a powder as a reagent, and follow that form.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 12:13:08 am
EDIT: Okay, it works now, and in a moment of supreme irony Dwarf Fortress decided that the statue the petrified halfling would become...would be a statue of the Oculentibus, the bug-basilisk I have created.
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:OCULENTIBUS_STL]
[NAME:oculentibus:oculentibi:oculentibus]
[CASTE_NAME:oculentibus:oculentibi:oculentibus]
[CREATURE_TILE:'O'][COLOR:4:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:An insectoid monster with a long neck, rear-facing antennae, and a hairy back. Its gaze is petrifying, making it a true challenge to tame and harvest for its tears.]
[PREFSTRING:petrifying gaze]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:ANTENNAE_STL:2EYES_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BIOME:ANY_FOREST][POPULATION_NUMBER:30:40][CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:2]
[LARGE_ROAMING][LARGE_PREDATOR]
[CHILD:1][MAXAGE:30:40]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:5000]
[BODY_SIZE:3:0:10000] Smallish, but deadly.
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PETRIFY_STL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Petrify]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:are turned to stone:is turned to stone]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:7]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[CREATURE:STATUE_STL]
[NAME:statue:statues:statue]
[CASTE_NAME:statue:statues:statue]
[DESCRIPTION:The petrified victim of a magical attack. When its soul finally deserts its body, you can use it as a nice lawn ornament.]
[CREATURE_TILE:'@'][COLOR:0:0:1]
[NO_DRINK][NO_EAT]
[NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[NOT_LIVING]
[BODY:VERMIN_BODY_HLG:WINGS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[IMMOBILE][NO_GENDER][NOEXERT]
[AQUATIC] To make it die.
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:40000]
[ITEMCORPSE:STATUE:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:ROCK_HLG]
[CASTE:STATUE]
The interaction:
Code: [Select]
[INTERACTION:PETRIFY_STL]
[I_SOURCE:CREATURE_ACTION]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:victim]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:petrified]
[CE_PARALYSIS:SEV:1000:PROB:100:START:0]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:START:0]
[CE:CREATURE:STATUE_STL:STATUE]
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 02:21:11 am
The reaction actually works now that the bag is included in the reaction.
There's only one problem to address now...
Why the $%^&* did I get over 800 coke from only 5 tobacco?!?!?
Well, I'll just have to fix that part, then, but that's a lot easier to do.
Post by: Nahere on July 23, 2013, 02:57:22 am
Why the $%^&* did I get over 800 coke from only 5 tobacco?!?!?Slap a [PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150] on the cokes product line.
Well, I'll just have to fix that part, then, but that's a lot easier to do.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 03:00:15 am
I did, it didn't change it.Why the $%^&* did I get over 800 coke from only 5 tobacco?!?!?Slap a [PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150] on the cokes product line.
Well, I'll just have to fix that part, then, but that's a lot easier to do.
I went ahead and just made it always give 5 for now, may change it later, but I could post it now if I wanted too.
Also, first test of smoking success, the guy died from smoke inhalation that caused his lungs to bleed out.
I made it less hardcore, will work on it more tomorrow.
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 05:53:33 am
No, no. In retrospect it was inevitable. Everything can be weaponized. Everything that can be weaponized will be weaponized eventually. Smoking pipes are a thing. Therefore smoking pipes can and will be weaponized.I must sig this, please.
Go right ahead. :D
lookit what I made!
lumberyardSpoiler (click to show/hide)
apple tree processingSpoiler (click to show/hide)
apple fruit (now with 100% more hard cider!)Spoiler (click to show/hide)
apple woodSpoiler (click to show/hide)
and of course the tree itself ( for bookkeeping, no changes)Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Nicely done. Incidentally, generally when Putnam says something you can assume it works, he has his own modding subsection entirely. :P And generally the more general solution is preferable, as that makes it easier to keep adding things in the future while a special solution not so much. However, having separate reactions for separate fruit trees may make sense if you want fine control. I'm not assuming we'll eventually have all the fruit in the world.
On the other hand, if someone is planning to add figs, durians, walnuts, soursops, pawpaws etc. then apples can easily be moved to a more general reaction for easier fruit tree adding. Anyway, it seems like everyone likes this addition, so now it's just up to laula or sackhead to include it if they want.
I did, it didn't change it.Why the $%^&* did I get over 800 coke from only 5 tobacco?!?!?Slap a [PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150] on the cokes product line.
Well, I'll just have to fix that part, then, but that's a lot easier to do.
I went ahead and just made it always give 5 for now, may change it later, but I could post it now if I wanted too.
Also, first test of smoking success, the guy died from smoke inhalation that caused his lungs to bleed out.
I made it less hardcore, will work on it more tomorrow.
Try adjusting the reagent quantity to 150. If plants are measured by volume like some other things, then your reaction would be expected to produce hundreds of units of the product per unit of reagent as the product quantity is 150 times greater than the reagent.
This: [REAGENT:A:1:
It seems like you really like to make people suffer for their pleasures. At least they don't smoke automatically yet as they do with drinking that vodka. :D
Post by: emeralis00 on July 23, 2013, 06:18:39 am
Thanks, had to rush it since I had to go to work.Quote[REACTION:CRUSHMOSROCK_EM]
[NAME:Crush mossy rock]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:NONE]
[REAGENT:MOSROCKBOULDER:1::NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:MOSROCK_EM]
[PRODUCT:33:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:METEORIC_IRON_HLG][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:STONECRAFT]Quote[REACTION:CRUSHMOSROCK_EM]
[NAME:Crush mossy rock]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:1:BOULDER:NONE:INORGANIC:MOSROCK_EM]
[PRODUCT:33:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:INORGANIC:METEORIC_IRON_HLG][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:STONECRAFT]
Question: Why does crushing mossy rock create meteoric iron?Not done with the product yet, it will be something else. I just wanted to see if I was getting the reaction right.
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 09:28:37 am
Extending the standard DF palette. Okay, you can't really do that, but what you can do is repurpose some of the color IDs entirely. Normally color schemes/mods don't do that, but since we don't have to worry about compatibility with vanilla, we could. Now would be a good time to get it started. Note when reading the following that you CAN use colors independently of brightness values (just type in 8 when you mean 7 and brightness 1).
I'm not a color designer but here's my suggestion.
(http://s23.postimg.org/xcd3kfasb/colors.png)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Justification:
What do we look at by far most of the time in the game? What are we most frustrated by that we don't have many colors for when modding? (okay, just speaking for myself. Still) Answer:
1. Stone and metal
2. Vegetation
3. Wood
Keeping that in mind, do we really need two kinds of cyan, two kinds of purple, two kinds of blue and two kinds of red to make up 50% of our color set? IMHO, no. We could use one blue, one red (tinted slightly better for use in blood and meat), one purple and no cyan.
This frees up many colors for use. In the above set we have many more colors I feel are more suitable to making vegetation, stones, wood and metal. Of course this was just a quick mock up without much deep thought.
Your thoughts?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 09:40:08 am
Some of those colors, I agree with - orange for example. God, yes, please, but I use the dark blue, dark grey, and like the color of the cyan for cave moss. I can barely see a worthwhile color difference between Gold and Yellow, too, and those colors are really too similar to be separate when we have such a limited availability of slots, in my opinion.
EDIT: Also, Dark Sea Green? Eh. Not a fan. Such are my thoughts on this matter.
==============
Finalized form of the Oculentibus:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:OCULENTIBUS_STL]
[NAME:oculentibus:oculentibi:oculentibus]
[CASTE_NAME:oculentibus:oculentibi:oculentibus]
[CREATURE_TILE:'O'][COLOR:4:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:An insectoid monster with a long neck, rear-facing antennae, and a hairy back. Its gaze is petrifying, making it a true challenge to tame and harvest for its tears.]
[PREFSTRING:petrifying gaze]
[BODY:BASIC_INSECT_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:ANTENNAE_STL:2EYES_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BIOME:ANY_FOREST][POPULATION_NUMBER:30:40][CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:2]
[LARGE_ROAMING][LARGE_PREDATOR]
[CHILD:1][MAXAGE:30:40]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:5000]
[BODY_SIZE:3:0:10000] Smallish, but deadly.
[PET_EXOTIC][PETVALUE:400][TRAINABLE]
[MILKABLE:INORGANIC:OCULENTIBUS_TEARS_STL:8000]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PETRIFY_STL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Petrify]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:are turned to stone:is turned to stone]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:7]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PETRIFY_STL] Makes keeping them difficult unless you successfully milk their tears and make Stoneward incense.
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Petrify]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:GREETING] LOL
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:are turned to stone:is turned to stone]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:7]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:4000]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
Dangerous to catch, dangerous to keep, dangerous to train, but worth it for the ability to turn attackers into lawn ornaments at will. Plus, their tears will be needed for a vigor that gives halflings the ability to petrify enemies as well :) I'll start work on those today.
Post by: Rose on July 23, 2013, 10:15:40 am
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 10:58:06 am
Buh...but - the dark blue? The cyan? Ye gods, man, what did you do to the brown?
Some of those colors, I agree with - orange for example. God, yes, please, but I use the dark blue, dark grey, and like the color of the cyan for cave moss. I can barely see a worthwhile color difference between Gold and Yellow, too, and those colors are really too similar to be separate when we have such a limited availability of slots, in my opinion.
EDIT: Also, Dark Sea Green? Eh. Not a fan. Such are my thoughts on this matter.
Hm, first of all, I would really like to figure out a good color to use for luminescence. That would, I think, merit 1 color of its own. Let me know if you have one, for luminescent things like that moss.
However, there will always be casualties when large changes are made. That's why I said I should have thought of it at the start. Now, I was thinking dark greys would migrate to either slate or a different color, to give more hues to stone. You may be right on the gold. It seemed natural to include it because gold is such a special metal. Dark sea green was intended to be used to give some stone a jade-like color.
Also, turns out you can't change colors completely arbitrarily due to hard-coded materials and things (thanks Japa for pointing it out, I did forget). Here's a rethought version with some hints of what the game may/will/should, depending on whether it's moddable or not, use those for. Here if you want "gray" as in metallic you are supposed to go for gray90, and if you want a dark, calm, stone-like color you should choose a tint (slateg, rosequartz, burlywood).
(http://s15.postimg.org/61ke8m3or/colors2.png)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I have a feeling the idea of making magma on your level orange and water on your level turquoise may cause a lot of controversy, but it's a matter of what you're used to.
Feels a little neutered this way. Well, again, thoughts - just an idea for now.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 11:07:28 am
Aren't we getting a tileset from Sackhead? Maybe wait for that before implementing any color scheme changes. What looks good in ASCII might not look as good with a graphical tileset.
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 11:20:46 am
Better...ish? Not certain what Wheat could be useful for
Basically, anything that you want to be white but not an attention-grabbing, text on black white is the intention. Such as fat. The names for the colors may actually chain the imagination a little, but I wanted to keep them for my own reference.
If this set seems reasonable I'll make a playable version later and let's have a look at how undersea tiles look if turquoise. I personally actually think the deep blue color of water on your level is not really appropriate (since that's not how water is ever), and it's turquoise in stonesense too.
Aren't we getting a tileset from Sackhead? Maybe wait for that before implementing any color scheme changes. What looks good in ASCII might not look as good with a graphical tileset.
True enough, but it's good to get started regardless. Also on the other hand the sooner stuff like this is added or announced the less work needs to be done to adapt, and it might be nice for him and everyone else planning stuff to know in advance they'll be able to make things orange, turquoise or wheat-colored.
Hm, speaking of - if the above doesn't seem like a good solution could also just implement the orange, overwriting light magenta, as that's definitely missed. But having a completely different look and more new options would be even sweeter, I think.
Post by: arbiter787 on July 23, 2013, 12:33:43 pm
I don't want a turn, but I'm gonna be playing each update, obviously :P
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 01:06:32 pm
Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:VIGOR_FIREBALL_STL]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:VIGOR_DRINK_TEMPLATE_STL_MC]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:CRIMSON]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:Dragon's Breath vigor]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:n/a]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:smoke]
[TILE:178][DISPLAY_COLOR:1:0:1]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Dragon's Breath]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_INGESTED]
[CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:START:0]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:hurl fireball]
[CDI:INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:BP_REQUIRED:BY_CATEGORY:HAND]
[CDI:FLOW:FIREBALL]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:10]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:75]
Other planned vigors: Oculentibus's Gaze (petrification), Embrace of Shadows (hide interaction), Agent Provocateur (enrage enemies), and Hydra (were-halfling for a month to regen limbs). Yes, you can stack these things for an alchemical super-halfling army. Also yes - Guzzling curiousbeasts should be able to chug these things if they find them. This could lead to, for a vanilla example, a fireball-casting black bear that can turn invisible that also possessed a paralyzing gaze.
Do we have any guzzlers yet?
EDIT: Append to the list of planned vigors Titan - a strength-booster steroidal atheletes wished they had.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 23, 2013, 01:16:11 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 01:23:18 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 01:41:26 pm
Okay, this is a minor thing that updating my raws seems like too much effort for. Aasiaats are supposed to "burrow into the snow" and hide until they leap out in ambush at your creatures. Unfortunately, their AI behavior with the ability didn't really do as I intended. I've removed the usage hint from their CDI token and added AMBUSHPREDATOR for good measure, to fix this.
For those who wish to implement this fix, just overwrite the entry for the Aasiaat in my creature file with the following.
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:AASIAAT_STL]
[NAME:aasiaat:aasiaat:aasiaat]
[CASTE_NAME:aasiaat:aasiaat:aasiaat]
[CREATURE_TILE:'S'][COLOR:3:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A large spider native to the colder regions of the world, and adept in using its environment for ambush. Its icy venom inflicts damage similar to frostbite.]
[PREFSTRING:icy bite]
[BODY:BASIC_ARACHNID_STL:4EYES_STL:MANDIBLES_STL:BOOK_LUNGS_STL:BRAIN_STL:HEART_ABDOMEN_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:66000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:16500]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:33000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:66000]
[CHILD:1]
[BIOME:GLACIER][BIOME:TUNDRA]
[PET_EXOTIC][MUNDANE][LIKES_FIGHTING][LARGE_PREDATOR][LARGE_ROAMING][PETVALUE:300]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ARTHROPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:4:6][POPULATION_NUMBER:600:2000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIGHT_CHITIN_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_LAYERS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:INSECT_POSITIONS_STL]
[BODYGLOSS:CHELICERAE_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MANDIBLE_INJECTION_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:IS_INSECT_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_INSECT_EYES_STL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HEMOLYMPH:LIQUID]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:aasiaat nymph:aasiaat nymphs]
[MAXAGE:12:14]
[AMBUSHPREDATOR]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:SNOWBLIND_SPIDER_STL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Hide in snow]
[CDI:TARGET:A:SELF_ONLY]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:600]
[CDI:FREE_ACTION]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISON:INSECT_POISON_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen aasiaat venom]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen aasiaat venom]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:aasiaat venom]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:aasiaat venom]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling aasiaat venom]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling aasiaat venom]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[ENTERS_BLOOD]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:aasiaat bite]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:AASIAAT_STL:ALL]
[SYN_INJECTED]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:60:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:0:PEAK:60:END:7200]
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:60:PROB:60:LOCALIZED:START:2400:PEAK:3600:END:7000]
[CE_BLISTERS:SEV:50:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:60:PEAK:120:END:2400]
[CE_NUMBNESS:SEV:80:PROB:70:RESISTABLE:LOCALIZED:START:5:PEAK:1200:END:2400]
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 01:47:09 pm
1. Opened arena
2. Traveled a bit as an adventurer
3. Played some halfling hamlet
Here's the data file to add the colors, and screencaps of all that.
Spoiler: df/data/init/colors.txt (click to show/hide)
Screencaps:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
(http://s16.postimg.org/v76n7j0ed/ncs25.png)
I'm not sure if it's cool, boring, or what to think. Except orange pumpkins are now a thing, finally. But I like how the surface and the rock colors look.
Again, give opinions and I'll develop.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 01:52:01 pm
Post by: Rose on July 23, 2013, 01:57:00 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 02:58:27 pm
Now, my selling point was to add new colors that would be used more than some of vanilla's more "strange" ones, and while the above caps showed the normal colors, some don't get shown almost at all if you just replace the colors, because if it's designed for the vanilla palette then you're obviously going to have very few things with color 6:0:1 for bright magenta. To show how it might look if all materials had been calibrated to use the new colors, I edited some materials and took a screencap of an underground landscape:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Admittedly, there's a lot of bluish things with somewhat subtle differences now available.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 23, 2013, 03:33:23 pm
I dunno about removing brown and rich blue. The water and ice just don't look right. This palette needs some tweaking.
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 03:39:32 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 03:52:16 pm
Also, can anyone explain why this:
Code: [Select]
[INTERACTION:REGEN_STL]
[I_SOURCE:CREATURE_ACTION]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_CANNOT_TARGET_IF_ALREADY_AFFECTED]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:REGEN]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:START:0:END:100]
[CE:CREATURE:HYDRA_HEALING_STL:HYDRA]
[I_EFFECT:CLEAN]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[IE_GRIME_LEVEL:2]
Turns the creature into an Oculentibus instead of a hydra healing cocoon? I can't for the life of me figure out why, though I guess this form of the Hyrda healing interaction works too - I'd prefer one that doesn't give the creature a brief opportunity to petrify a target.
EDIT: FUCK YES! It actually DOES work, perfectly, except for the odd transform. HAHAHAHA.
I set the usage hint to clean_self, so if the halfling gets blood on him - like, say, if he got cut in battle - he'll use the transform and become a cocoon (or an Oc), and clean himself in the process, thus healing him and ensuring he won't trigger it again instantly. Could have some odd behavior with other contaminants, but really - how does a creature get something on him that needs cleaning in a way that DOESN'T cause injury? There's cave-ins, which can hurt; monster dust, which causes harmful syndromes; and maybe water, but cocoons don't need to breathe so Hydra could buy a few seconds of life when drowning.
I am pleased :)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 04:18:36 pm
It seems like you really like to make people suffer for their pleasures. At least they don't smoke automatically yet as they do with drinking that vodka. :DOh yes, I do, the only reason it's not automatic is for testing purposes.
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 04:49:33 pm
EDIT: FUCK YES! It actually DOES work, perfectly, except for the odd transform. HAHAHAHA.
I set the usage hint to clean_self, so if the halfling gets blood on him - like, say, if he got cut in battle - he'll use the transform and become a cocoon (or an Oc), and clean himself in the process, thus healing him and ensuring he won't trigger it again instantly. Could have some odd behavior with other contaminants, but really - how does a creature get something on him that needs cleaning in a way that DOESN'T cause injury? There's cave-ins, which can hurt; monster dust, which causes harmful syndromes; and maybe water, but cocoons don't need to breathe so Hydra could buy a few seconds of life when drowning.
I am pleased :)
Congrats! I wonder if it makes a creature actually survive in water, if drowning is interrupted by the transformation?
There's also syndromes and walking on a contaminant, by the way.
It seems like you really like to make people suffer for their pleasures. At least they don't smoke automatically yet as they do with drinking that vodka. :DOh yes, I do, the only reason it's not automatic is for testing purposes.
If it's automatic it definitely must have its own building so that you can get actual work done despite people barging in to smoke. :D
In that proposal I made the brown more faded to make it better suited to use in stone. Here's an alternative color set based on the same principle but not focused on stone, making the brown more brown, and otherwise not trying as much to restyle DF but rather more trying to give access to more useful colors by merging existing ones (one basic "blue" and one red).
(http://s17.postimg.org/pyjnp18i7/newnewcolors.png)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'm really not keen on the traditional light cyan when there's turquoise, most people seem to hate microcline and ice being cyan probably came from the limited color set rather than cyan being made for ice. :P
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 04:52:25 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And their reactions to make them:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
@Pretty Colors
I could live with that set. Brown actually looks brown now, and dark blue is there, and those were my main gripes that I was holding onto, so yay.
Post by: Putnam on July 23, 2013, 04:56:02 pm
Also keep in mind light and dark blue are used for water, light and dark red are used for magma, and cyan is used for sky and ice, and that can't be changed.
Sky can be changed.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 04:58:39 pm
That's part of the point! Not only does it harm the smoker, but it messes up work everywhere else! Just like real life!If it's automatic it definitely must have its own building so that you can get actual work done despite people barging in to smoke. :DIt seems like you really like to make people suffer for their pleasures. At least they don't smoke automatically yet as they do with drinking that vodka. :DOh yes, I do, the only reason it's not automatic is for testing purposes.
I just need to remove the skill tag so that everyone does it.
Post by: Halfling on July 23, 2013, 05:06:58 pm
Also keep in mind light and dark blue are used for water, light and dark red are used for magma, and cyan is used for sky and ice, and that can't be changed.
Sky can be changed.
Then that frees up one more color nicely, the color of night doesn't matter so much so long as it's dark. Could honestly use the opinion of someone with some knowledge of visual art so as to which color is often interesting in this context and we don't have. Indigo?
That's part of the point! Not only does it harm the smoker, but it messes up work everywhere else! Just like real life!If it's automatic it definitely must have its own building so that you can get actual work done despite people barging in to smoke. :DIt seems like you really like to make people suffer for their pleasures. At least they don't smoke automatically yet as they do with drinking that vodka. :DOh yes, I do, the only reason it's not automatic is for testing purposes.
I just need to remove the skill tag so that everyone does it.
It messes up work already when everyone will quit their job to to go to do their smoking "job" intermittently. Maybe if it messes up your order queues in an important building too it gets a little excessive. Although I guess you can just avoid having tobacco, which is what every sane person will do now anyway.
Maybe there should also be an incentive to use it sometimes? Like a chance of a creativity boost. Just an idea. Not that real tobacco (probably) has that, but then, hm.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 05:31:12 pm
------------
The alchemy raws:
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7854 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7854)
Version 1. Any playtesting would be nice :)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 06:10:04 pm
These are weird plants.Understatement of the day.
Post by: kopout on July 23, 2013, 08:39:20 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 08:45:30 pm
I noticed that Tarnished Vodka doesn't have any syndrome of it's own. Just regular drunkenness and hangover. What's up with that? This is the most dangerous plant in the world! How is it safe (ish) to drink?It's not, the syndrome is attached to the plants material itself, which is applied to ALL forms of it, even the seeds would do it if you ate one.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 23, 2013, 08:51:24 pm
Fortunately, I'm relatively sure that only contaminants transfer contact syndromes, and that, say, a solid plant wouldn't do it.
Post by: kopout on July 23, 2013, 08:55:10 pm
I knew there was a reason I was so scared of those things :PI noticed that Tarnished Vodka doesn't have any syndrome of it's own. Just regular drunkenness and hangover. What's up with that? This is the most dangerous plant in the world! How is it safe (ish) to drink?It's not, the syndrome is attached to the plants material itself, which is applied to ALL forms of it, even the seeds would do it if you ate one.
Edit: something is very wrong with your new stuff StLeibowitz.
Post by: Meph on July 23, 2013, 09:00:20 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 09:04:36 pm
I'm just waiting for the damn things to get a contact syndrome.That's actually what I'm working on now, but the blisters don't seem to be doing anything yet, so I need to amp them up a notch or twenty.
Fortunately, I'm relatively sure that only contaminants transfer contact syndromes, and that, say, a solid plant wouldn't do it.
Dumping vodka and tobacco on people to watch them break out in hives never gets old.
Post by: kopout on July 23, 2013, 09:25:16 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 09:29:57 pm
I just had a wild hound get it's hair chipped by a Halfling rock. Hair chipped. Must use a lot of hair product.Hair product made from Tarnish Stalks.
Post by: kopout on July 23, 2013, 09:34:01 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 23, 2013, 09:34:38 pm
That's horrible. But if you waxed it into a horn you could get a poison head-butt attack.Hmm, that gives me an idea....
Post by: kopout on July 23, 2013, 09:36:38 pm
Post by: kopout on July 23, 2013, 10:04:17 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 10:25:09 pm
Dammit. I'll take a look.
EDIT: What do you mean, embark profile? I've genned a world and can't find anything obviously wrong on the embark screen.
Post by: kopout on July 23, 2013, 10:38:58 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 23, 2013, 10:42:09 pm
Plant materials in the raws appear to be perfectly fine. I brought some Numwort and Stinkweed seeds along with me, so that's working. I'd say it's probably an error with that embark profile - make a new profile and see if the same thing happens.
Post by: sackhead on July 24, 2013, 04:10:29 am
on a different note i went on a tour of an open cast coal mine which has given me some ideas. they ussed to do shaft minning in the same place and there is a shaft that has been burning continuosly since 1926
so i will try to replicate this in game
Post by: Halfling on July 24, 2013, 08:55:14 am
sory for the delay i just got back and have finished tileset compatibility and graphics formalards.
on a different note i went on a tour of an open cast coal mine which has given me some ideas. they ussed to do shaft minning in the same place and there is a shaft that has been burning continuosly since 1926
so i will try to replicate this in game
Sweet. I wonder how you'll do that.
Speaking of real lfe inspiration, have you seen this? This place I thought is wonderful inspiration for dwarf mode: http://www.kuriositas.com/2011/08/wieliczka-salt-mine-astounding.html
Can we have a preview of the graphics set? :P
Post by: Sarzael on July 24, 2013, 09:51:43 am
I mean, can we edit other player creature, or if we want a creature we have to make it ourselves?
Anyways i request a turn as player. And im not sure yet wether i want or not to be a modder, im not very skilled at it, but i could do something simple, mostly subtypes of current creatures or modifications.
Post by: kopout on July 24, 2013, 10:19:28 am
Edit2:
StLeibowitz, although the problem with the embark screen was my fault (and I found and fixed the problem) the error log still thinks something is wrong with the regen reaction for the hydra vigor.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Knight Otu on July 24, 2013, 11:52:25 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 24, 2013, 12:29:04 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 24, 2013, 01:08:20 pm
I see that the [CASTE:HYDRA] token is right at the end of the creature definition. DF might not like that, and expect more tokens to come after a caste definition. Try moving it to an earlier point in the raws.
But I have the exact same setup with the statue creature right above it, and the Petrification interaction that changes a creature into a statue works perfectly. I don't believe it's that.
EDIT: The rain as a source of contaminants I had not considered. You can't really butcher them, though, as the interaction only transforms the creature for a single tick in the version I uploaded. Or, it could happen, but you'd have to have both the single least lucky Hydra-Halfling alive to have gotten wet INSIDE the butcher shop with another halfling butcher there too, and a butcher good enough to reduce a creature to its component parts in less than DF's equivalent of the Planck time, in addition to possessing reflexes good enough to pause and issue the order while he/she was transformed. I'd say odds are good nobody could butcher a Hydra cocoon :)
Post by: Knight Otu on July 24, 2013, 01:28:17 pm
hang on... the opening bracket on CREATURE:HYDRA_HEALING_STL] is missing in the raws I've downloaded.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 24, 2013, 03:22:50 pm
Post by: BFEL on July 24, 2013, 04:29:52 pm
I noticed that Tarnished Vodka doesn't have any syndrome of it's own. Just regular drunkenness and hangover. What's up with that? This is the most dangerous plant in the world! How is it safe (ish) to drink?
Hehe someone hasn't looked over the Elfwood raws very carefully :P
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 24, 2013, 05:00:16 pm
...
:o
BFEL, what have you done?
Post by: mastahcheese on July 24, 2013, 05:11:49 pm
Hehe, I remember those.I noticed that Tarnished Vodka doesn't have any syndrome of it's own. Just regular drunkenness and hangover. What's up with that? This is the most dangerous plant in the world! How is it safe (ish) to drink?
Hehe someone hasn't looked over the Elfwood raws very carefully :P
I laughed when I found them, but made a point of not saying anything.
them guys be sneaky...
Post by: kopout on July 24, 2013, 06:18:37 pm
I've uploaded the alchemy raws version 2.were?
Post by: Halfling on July 24, 2013, 06:41:21 pm
Anyway, it's relevant to this thread since we talked about it earlier. Custom forgotten beasts and titans are officially possible:
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=128593.msg4431318#msg4431318
so we can add those too, if there's material.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 24, 2013, 07:06:27 pm
were?
Same place, just updated the uploaded file.
Link if lost:
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7854 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7854)
Also, customized randomly generated creatures...that's going to be fun to play around with :D
Post by: kopout on July 24, 2013, 08:06:15 pm
Post by: sackhead on July 24, 2013, 08:06:37 pm
(http://i39.tinypic.com/25al0yp.png)
i am going to add coal that has a chance of exploding when you mine it (it will be high yield say 10 coke to compensate)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 24, 2013, 08:13:33 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7855 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7855)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 24, 2013, 08:27:38 pm
Post by: kopout on July 24, 2013, 09:21:40 pm
Code: [Select][REACTION:MAKE_WOOD_PLANKS_STL]
[NAME:make wooden planks]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:CUSTOM_P]
[REAGENT:WOOD:1:WOOD:NO_SUBTYPE:NONE:WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:4:BLOCKS:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:WOOD:NONE]
[SKILL:CARPENTRY]
Seeing as above-ground forts will likely be more common, I made this. Feel free to add into raws :)
I added this into the raws. Is it alright for me to make the reaction take place at the lumberyard?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 24, 2013, 09:23:04 pm
Post by: sackhead on July 24, 2013, 11:25:00 pm
Code: [Select]
inorganic_stone_mineral_SKH
[OBJECT:INORGANIC]
[INORGANIC:COAL_SKH]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:coal][DISPLAY_COLOR:0:7:1][TILE:136]
[ENVIRONMENT:SEDIMENTARY:VEIN:100]
[ENVIRONMENT:METAMORPHIC:VEIN:100]
[ITEM_SYMBOL:34]
[IGNITE_POINT:11000]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:14000]
[SOLID_DENSITY:1400]
[IS_STONE]
[INORGANIC:COAL_DOOM_SKH]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:coa l][DISPLAY_COLOR:0:7:1][TILE:136]
[IS_GEM:coal:STP:OVERWRITE_SOLID]
[ENVIRONMENT_SPEC:COAL_SKH:CLUSTER_ONE:100]
[ITEM_SYMBOL:34]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:32000]
[IGNITE_POINT:11000]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:14000]
[SOLID_DENSITY:1400]
[IS_STONE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Monoxide]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_INHALED]
[SYN_CONTACT]
[CE_IMPAIR_FUNCTION:SEV:100:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:EYES:ALL:START:0:END:6000]
[CE_IMPAIR_FUNCTION:SEV:100:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:ALL:START:0:END:6000]
[CE_IMPAIR_FUNCTION:SEV:100:PROB:5:BP:BY_CATEGORY:EYES:ALL:START:0] Slight chance of perma-blinding vicitm
[CE_IMPAIR_FUNCTION:SEV:100:PROB:5:BP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:ALL:START:0]
[SYN_INHALED]
[CE_COUGH_BLOOD:SEV:100:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:5:PEAK:100:END:1000]
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:100:PROB:100:LOCALIZED:VASCULAR_ONLY:RESISTABLE:START:0:PEAK:100:END:2000]
[CE_BLISTERS:SEV:100:PROB:100:LOCALIZED:VASCULAR_ONLY:RESISTABLE:START:0:PEAK:100:END:2000]
also the heat can start grass fires
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 12:51:37 am
I think the only things by now that are unqualifiedly not out for the blood of the players are the meat, and the atmosphere itself.
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 25, 2013, 01:49:45 am
Also the coal itself isn't toxic, nor does it combust. That would be the occasional toxic byproduct. Something similar to what I did with iridium, but haven't seen due to not seeing any iridium or oxyline. I may have to tweak the frequencies.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 25, 2013, 02:00:50 am
I think the only things by now that are unqualifiedly not out for the blood of the players are the meat, and the atmosphere itself.I'm working on both of these issues.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 25, 2013, 02:24:40 am
1)More benevolent/passive animals
and
2)An indestructible race of otherworldly observers.
Post by: sackhead on July 25, 2013, 02:46:20 am
Waiting for Evil Rain to get customized :P
Also the coal itself isn't toxic, nor does it combust. That would be the occasional toxic byproduct. Something similar to what I did with iridium, but haven't seen due to not seeing any iridium or oxyline. I may have to tweak the frequencies.
Waiting for Evil Rain to get customized :P
Also the coal itself isn't toxic, nor does it combust. That would be the occasional toxic byproduct. Something similar to what I did with iridium, but haven't seen due to not seeing any iridium or oxyline. I may have to tweak the frequencies.
actually it is in the main coal veins (about 1 in 60) not a byproduct when you mine it
so anyway when you mine it it explodes.
i am also going to add peat, which will appear in the soil layers and be gaverable as clay so you can burn the boulders to get bars, it will be inefficient but an infinite fuel source
Post by: Gnorm on July 25, 2013, 03:37:08 am
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 25, 2013, 05:53:30 am
i am also going to add peat, which will appear in the soil layers and be gaverable as clay so you can burn the boulders to get bars, it will be inefficient but an infinite fuel source+1.
Infinite fuel that isn't as hard to acquire as magma? Awesome.
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 25, 2013, 09:04:09 am
Therefore, I humbly suggest a rare caste of mutant "superhalflings" who are dumb as rocks (and about as tough) but who produce offspring at a prodigious rate. Perhaps make these mutants have a lifespan of only a couple years as an adult and be incredibly naturally agile to survive the rigors of the world and keep the halfling race alive "in spurts" as it were?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 09:21:58 am
Also the coal itself isn't toxic, nor does it combust.
O really?
Code: [Select][MAT_FIXED_TEMP:32000]
[IGNITE_POINT:11000]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:14000]
On further review, it seems the sole reason this does not spontaneously combust is because it explodes into a cloud of monoxide gas first. Carry on.
Post by: Halfling on July 25, 2013, 09:34:39 am
It would be interesting from an evolutionary standpoint to see what "defenses" the halflings and other creatures will develop to counter the extreme toxicity of the world as it stands. Halflings have "free(ish) will, of course, but it would be strange for them to be living unchanged in an environment where they didn't evolve defenses to the "natural" dangers around them.
Therefore, I humbly suggest a rare caste of mutant "superhalflings" who are dumb as rocks (and about as tough) but who produce offspring at a prodigious rate. Perhaps make these mutants have a lifespan of only a couple years as an adult and be incredibly naturally agile to survive the rigors of the world and keep the halfling race alive "in spurts" as it were?
Sorry to be wet blanket... While sort of cool, my take on all this is that despite environmental toxicity the world must remain playable for a vanilla human-like race (halflings) without enhancements like that. If we freely embrace an arms-race mentality, we'll eventually end up with a world of our version of hardened adamantine colossi trying to survive against interactions instantly nuking the entire embark site with fire burning at 150 million degrees urist (just let your thermonuclear fusion demon cause an instant material emission on every target on the map). Sort of awesome, but a genuine design problem because a) it constantly obsoletes and makes irrelevant the contributions of earlier players and b) reduces this to something that's fun to play for 5 minutes.
So that's why the rules say it must remain playable with any vanilla-like race choice and I think not hardening the halflings makes them a good "base" race to test the world against. This means any attempt to make the atmosphere deadly will be rejected by the rules, even if there were another race that could deal with it. :P Also I feel that if the world becomes too hostile it's time to take a step back and reconsider whether your contributions are actually contributions to the world at that point and not just "hey let's see if I can make players die faster". Furthermore if player reactions are like, this makes me not want to play, it's time to remove that part as this thing is pointless if it's just us demonstrating new raws we write and nobody wants to or can play the world anymore. But we're not there yet, all that's there is just more risks and those are good.
I'm going to mostly trust mod turn holder judgment on this one to simply not include completely broken things or ones that ruin player experience, even if they are posted. You probably want people to be able to enjoy your additions after all.
Post by: sackhead on July 25, 2013, 11:14:45 am
i am going to add somethings to try and make the half lings lives easier. i have done my peat so i might add some kind of large halfling war beast. this way we can have our fat little hobbits comfortable in their villages shut out from the rest of the world.
and then i may add some harmless wild creatures to dilute all the others
Post by: Halfling on July 25, 2013, 11:34:39 am
Post by: WillowLuman on July 25, 2013, 12:03:11 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 12:06:14 pm
dirigible antelope
Please make that :o
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 01:57:39 pm
Post by: sjm9876 on July 25, 2013, 02:50:43 pm
And I've now been inspired to brush up on my modding skills.
I will be following this :D
Post by: WillowLuman on July 25, 2013, 02:53:59 pm
Giant floating [GRAZER]s with horns? Yes please.
Also, they deflate if you puncture them, temporarily allowing them to move very fast as the gas escapes. This makes them hard to catch. Presumably attaching one to a restraint would look hilarious.
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 03:44:16 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on July 25, 2013, 03:50:16 pm
remember:
[PREFSTRING:bouyancy]
[PREFSTRING:dopey expression]
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 04:47:02 pm
Good luck on air gazelle, I await them with hunting rifle ready :D
Post by: WillowLuman on July 25, 2013, 04:55:14 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 25, 2013, 05:26:07 pm
according to wiki (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Body_token) [FLIER] is needed for both body part and creature. Creature with [FLIER] can fly without any [FLIER] parts but disabling [FLIER] parts when they are there apparently causes plummeting. Is this incorrect? Honestly not sure.
How about
- air sac has [FLIER] indeed
- air sac leaks syndrome-causing fluid that causes the creature itself to emit bursts of gas for a while ("gas escaping") and move very fast for a few phases?
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 05:54:55 pm
HmThat's about what I was thinking
according to wiki (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Body_token) [FLIER] is needed for both body part and creature. Creature with [FLIER] can fly without any [FLIER] parts but disabling [FLIER] parts when they are there apparently causes plummeting. Is this incorrect? Honestly not sure.
How about
- air sac has [FLIER] indeed
- air sac leaks syndrome-causing fluid that causes the creature itself to emit bursts of gas for a while ("gas escaping") and move very fast for a few phases?
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 06:58:54 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 25, 2013, 07:06:15 pm
If that doesn't work, could make it cause paralysis to the creature. That's pretty much implying they are immobile without their sac. If they're not supposed to suffocate then they need to not need to breathe, but otherwise probably would work.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 25, 2013, 07:07:52 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 08:18:39 pm
The relevant tissue and material, for those working on the blimp-gazelle:
Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:AIR_STL]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:RED]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:air]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:liquid oxygen]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:air]
[BOILING_POINT:9671] Used oxygen
[MELTING_POINT:9606]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:9672]
Code: [Select]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:DIRIGIBLE_AIR_STL]
[TISSUE_NAME:air:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:AIR]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:0]
[VASCULAR:0]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:0]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:GAS]
[FUNCTIONAL]
[STRUCTURAL]
[TISSUE_LEAKS]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 08:31:27 pm
Code: [Select]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:LIFT_GAS_TEMPLATE_KPT]
[TISSUE_NAME:lift gas:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:
[FLIGHT]// wiki says this might or might not do any thing
[TISSUE_LEAKS]
[FUNCTIONAL]// Should remove functionality from gas bag when lost due to LEAKS (covers bases in case FLIGHT dose nothing)
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:GAS]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:100]
[HEALING_RATE:300]//three times as long as vanela skin to heal. slowly replenishing it self after being rapidly lost.
Material is left blank because I haven't gotten to it yet
Post by: Halfling on July 25, 2013, 08:39:14 pm
STRUCTURAL - Holds the body part together. A cut or a fracture disables the body part it's in.
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 08:44:02 pm
Code: [Select]
[BODY:GAS_BAG]
[BP:GASBAG:gas bag:gas bags][FLIER][CATEGORY:GASBAG][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:2500]
Code: [Select]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:LIFT_GAS_TEMPLATE_KPT]
[TISSUE_NAME:lift gas:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:
[FLIGHT]// wiki says this might or might not do any thing
[TISSUE_LEAKS]
[FUNCTIONAL]// Should remove functionality from gas bag when lost due to LEAKS (covers bases in case FLIGHT dose nothing)
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:GAS]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:100]
[HEALING_RATE:300]//three times as long as vanela skin to heal. slowly replenishing it self after being rapidly lost.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 08:51:34 pm
Code: [Select]
[BODY:DIRIGIBLE_FRAME_STL]
[BP:UB:body:bodies][UPPERBODY][LOWERBODY][HEAD][CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:300]
[BP:GAS_SACK:gas sack:STP][CON:UB][FLIER][CATEGORY:GAS_SACK]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1200]
[BODY:4TENTACLES_GRASP_STL]
[BP:R_TENT:first right tentacle:STP][CON:UB][RIGHT][GRASP][CATEGORY:TENTACLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:225]
[BP:L_TENT:first left tentacle:STP][CON:UB][LEFT][GRASP][CATEGORY:TENTACLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:225]
[BP:R_TENT2:second right tentacle:STP][CON:UB][RIGHT][GRASP][CATEGORY:TENTACLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:225]
[BP:L_TENT2:second left tentacle:STP][CON:UB][LEFT][GRASP][CATEGORY:TENTACLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:225]
Their attacks:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:ATTACK_BITE_NOLATCH_NOTEETH_STL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:BITE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:10]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:300]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:ATTACK_TENTACLE_STRIKE_STL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:STRIKE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:TENTACLE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:whip:whips]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:5]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:400]
We could probably create an entire airborne-style ecosystem - air plankton vermin, blimp-things that dive-hunt them, flying predators to eat them, and some kind of dirigible megabeast to preside over the squabbling masses (and by preside over I mean eat).
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 09:00:22 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 09:08:57 pm
Should the bones be weaker for these creatures? Less dense, to float easier, and weaker as a result?
EDIT: Adapted.
Code: [Select]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DIRIGIBLE_MATLAYERS_STL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:AIR:AIR_STL]
[ADD_TISSUE:AIR:LIFT_GAS_TEMPLATE_KPT]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:GAS_SACK:AIR:50:SKIN:2]
A specific detail plan just for aerozoans.
EDIT2: And the aeroplankton:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:AEROPLANKTON_STL]
[NAME:cloud of aeroplankton:clouds of aeroplankton:cloud of aeroplankton]
[CASTE_NAME:cloud of aeroplankton:clouds of aeroplankton:cloud of aeroplankton]
[CREATURE_TILE:176][COLOR:7:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A cloud of tiny insects, microbes, and algae, most spending their entire lives without once touching the ground. They act as food for larger airborne creatures.]
[VERMIN_GROUNDER][FREQUENCY:100][UBIQUITOUS]
[BIOME:ALL_MAIN][CLUSTER_NUMBER:5:10][POPULATION_NUMBER:10000:20000]
[FLIER]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[BODY:VERMIN_BODY_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERMIN_TISSUE_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERMIN_LAYERS_HLG]
[NO_SLEEP]
[MUNDANE][NOT_BUTCHERABLE][SMALL_REMAINS]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:5]
[VERMIN_NOTRAP]
[CASTE:MALE] ## Yes, there are male and female clouds. They're, uh...they're very strict about separate spheres. Yeah, that's the ticket...
[MALE]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 09:42:44 pm
Should the bones be weaker for these creatures? Less dense, to float easier, and weaker as a result?probably yes
What I've got at the moment. let me know what you think.
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:DIRIGIZELLE]
[DESCRIPTION:A strange flying ungulate. They drif peacefuly through the air and flee quickly from danger.]
[NAME:dirigizelle:dirigizelles:dirigizelle]
[CASTE_NAME:dirigizelle:dirigizelles:dirigizelle]
[CREATURE_TILE:104][COLOR:4:0:0]
[PREFSTRING:bouyancy]
[PREFSTRING:dopey expression]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:12]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:QUADRUPED][CREATURE_CLASS:UNGULATE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:BLIMP]
[BIOME:GRASSLAND_TEMPERATE]
[BIOME:SAVANNA_TEMPERATE]
[BIOME:GRASSLAND_TROPICAL]
[BIOME:SAVANNA_TROPICAL]
[FREQUENCY:50]
[LARGE_ROAMING]
[MUNDANE][DIURNAL][PET_EXOTIC]
[FLEEQUICK]
[FLIER]
[PETVALUE:500][LITTERSIZE:3:10][MAXAGE:15:25][NATURAL]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:100:1000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT][CHILD:3][HOMEOTHERM:10070]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:fawn:fawns]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:2000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:14000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:50000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:90000]
[BODY_SIZE:3:0:1400000]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:AIR:AIR_STL]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:GAS_BAG_KPT:DOG_ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG:TAIL_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DOG_ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TAIL_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ALL_OVER_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DIRIGIBLE_MATLAYERS_STL]
[BODYGLOSS:FOOTPAW_HLG]
[GRAZER:428]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_ANIMAL_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SCRATCH_PAW_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODY_HAIR_HLG]
[CASTE:FEMALE][FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE][MALE]
Post by: mastahcheese on July 25, 2013, 10:09:27 pm
As to Halfling stating that things should make the game "fun" rather than simply hard, I'd like to point out that my plants will only kill you if you are ill-prepared, and you can fight them perfectly well. They won't one-shot anybody. Except that one guy who was killed in testing, but that was fixed.
Post by: kopout on July 25, 2013, 10:56:46 pm
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:BODY_DETAIL_PLAN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DIRIGIBLE_MATLAYERS_STL]
[ADD_MATERIAL:AIR:AIR_STL]
[ADD_TISSUE:AIR:LIFT_GAS_TEMPLATE_KPT]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:GAS_SACK:AIR:50:SKIN:2]
Code: [Select]
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:AIR_STL]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:RED]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:air]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:liquid oxygen]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:air]
[BOILING_POINT:9671] Used oxygen
[MELTING_POINT:9606]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:9672]
Code: [Select]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:LIFT_GAS_TEMPLATE_KPT]
[TISSUE_NAME:lift gas:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:ARI_STL:AIR]
[FLIGHT]// wiki says this might or might not do any thing
[TISSUE_LEAKS]
[FUNCTIONAL]// Should remove functionality from gas bag when lost due to LEAKS (covers bases in case FLIGHT dose nothing)
[STRUCTURAL]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
[TISSUE_MAT_STATE:GAS]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:100]
[HEALING_RATE:300]//three times as long as vanela skin to heal. slowly replenishing it self after being rapidly lost.
Code: [Select]
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:DIRIGIZELLE]
[DESCRIPTION:A strange flying ungulate. They drif peacefuly through the air and flee quickly from danger.]
[NAME:dirigizelle:dirigizelles:dirigizelle]
[CASTE_NAME:dirigizelle:dirigizelles:dirigizelle]
[CREATURE_TILE:104][COLOR:4:0:0]
[PREFSTRING:bouyancy]
[PREFSTRING:dopey expression]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:12]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:QUADRUPED][CREATURE_CLASS:UNGULATE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:BLIMP]
[BIOME:GRASSLAND_TEMPERATE]
[BIOME:SAVANNA_TEMPERATE]
[BIOME:GRASSLAND_TROPICAL]
[BIOME:SAVANNA_TROPICAL]
[FREQUENCY:50]
[LARGE_ROAMING]
[MUNDANE][DIURNAL][PET_EXOTIC]
[FLEEQUICK]
[FLIER]
[PETVALUE:500][LITTERSIZE:3:10][MAXAGE:15:25][NATURAL]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:100:1000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT][CHILD:3][HOMEOTHERM:10070]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:fawn:fawns]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:2000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:14000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:50000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:90000]
[BODY_SIZE:3:0:1400000]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:AIR:AIR_STL]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:GAS_BAG_KPT:DOG_ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG:TAIL_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DOG_ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TAIL_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ALL_OVER_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DIRIGIBLE_MATLAYERS_STL]
[BODYGLOSS:FOOTPAW_HLG]
[GRAZER:428]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_ANIMAL_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SCRATCH_PAW_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODY_HAIR_HLG]
[CASTE:FEMALE][FEMALE]
this error keeps coming up, its mocking me
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_kopout.txt"
DIRIGIZELLE:Unrecognized Material Template: AIR_STL
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature DIRIGIZELLE
DIRIGIZELLE:FEMALE:gas bag, layer 2: Tissue AIR was not found, using first tissue instead
DIRIGIZELLE:MALE:gas bag, layer 2: Tissue AIR was not found, using first tissue instead
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 11:03:03 pm
They won't one-shot anybody. Except that one guy who was killed in testing, but that was fixed.
Excerpt from General Organizational and Developmental (GOD) Committee records
Quality Control testing of the latest batch of Tarnish Stalk roast reports a 100% fatality rate among testers due to spontaneous internal hemorrhaging and severe nausea. Recommendation from Textiles subcommittee is to never let this plant be made into cloth. Alcohol department memo unreadable due to vomit coating. Wildlife subcommittee points out likelihood of eater curiousbeasts being driven extinct by wild plant growth. Halfling liaison lodged formal complaint over public beta of raw-edible version of stalk. Lethality overwatch determines patch of genetic code necessary but not recommended.
Committee Chair has given the go-ahead for deployment, and cordially extends mercy on your souls.
@Kopout - you seem to have misspelled "air" in the lift gas template. That may be a source of error.
EDIT: Also, isn't it usually "LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:AIR", and then AIR is defined in the body detail plans? For that I think "INORGANIC:AIR_STL" would work, too, though I am unsure.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 25, 2013, 11:10:05 pm
I would ask what happened to the report that the people who tested smoking it gave, but I doubt any of them are left.
Also, that gave me an idea for a use for them!
Bunch of curious eaters at your doorstep? Leave out some tarnish stalks for them to munch on!
Now we just need a holiday for it.
Post by: Halfling on July 25, 2013, 11:27:13 pm
I wish this didn't update so fast sometimes.
As to Halfling stating that things should make the game "fun" rather than simply hard, I'd like to point out that my plants will only kill you if you are ill-prepared, and you can fight them perfectly well. They won't one-shot anybody. Except that one guy who was killed in testing, but that was fixed.
Yes, it's going crazy fast now. Worse, I'm not sure how the person doing the modding turn can possibly handle all this info. We might need a different structure if this is to work as intended, but I'm not sure how... I personally will have even more trouble keeping up since life is getting kind of busy.
The comment was about not letting it escalate too much, indeed as you said "fun" rather than "i kill you". Seems like it did not go there for now. Anyway I agree, tarnish stalks are an example of the kind of stuff that's nice. In fact it would be reasonable, "realistic" and cool to have poisonous mushrooms that a) kill you or b) make you go berserk for a while. Preferably they would be extremely similar to delicious mushrooms in appearance.
Oh, incidentally, nobody explicitly mentioned it earlier but should think the wild success of tarnish stalks as the bane of fortresses everywhere (including my own as I was testing the color additions, did see the color of vomit nicely though) may be the low cost. In fact I should think that since they are the least expensive plants around, the game just gets you a large amount of tarnish everything by default. It may be poisonous and cause untold grief, but it's such a bargain.
So keeping that in mind, if any more poisonous plants are so deadly nobody wants them and they cost 0, you can guess what most expedition leaders stocking up a wagon will choose to do...
Post by: mastahcheese on July 25, 2013, 11:36:31 pm
I specifically made them with the intention that they would be highly versatile, I even tried to make them usable in weapon and armor production, but that didn't work out. I also wanted them to be the only thing growing in winter, but since coral fungus came out first, that didn't happen.
I'm actually thinking of making a "tree" version of the tarnish stalk so that weapons/armor can be produced, as well as stuff like beds, because that sounds comfy! I think it'd be a sort of "tarnish column", that would basically just be a ton of stalks that grew in one spot until you need an axe to clear it out, it would also produce a bunch of stalks when you process the tree.
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 25, 2013, 11:41:24 pm
Post by: sackhead on July 25, 2013, 11:44:02 pm
Code: [Select]
creature_SKH
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:MAMAPHINT_SKH]
[DESCRIPTION:A large golden haired beast with large tusks and a long sensitive trunk, comonly kept for its large amounts of meat, ivory and valuable fur.]
[NAME:goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint]
[CASTE_NAME:goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint]
[CREATURE_TILE:104][COLOR:4:0:0]
[PREFSTRING:Size and grace]
[PREFSTRING:gentle nature]
[PREFSTRING:Intelagenc]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:12]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:QUADRUPED]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]][CREATURE_CLASS:PACKADERM]
[WAGON_PULLER]
[MUNDANE][DIURNAL][COMMON_DOMESTIC][TRAINABLE][PET]
[PETVALUE:2000][LITTERSIZE:1:2][MAXAGE:40:80][NATURAL]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:100:1000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[SPEED:400]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT][BABY:1][HOMEOTHERM:10070]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:calf:calves]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:2000]
[BODY_SIZE:7000000]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:OLI_LEGS_SKH:TUSKS_SKH:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG:TAIL_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DOG_ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TAIL_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ALL_OVER_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TRUNK_MATERIALS_SKH]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TRUNK_TISSUES_SKH]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TRUNK_LAYERS_SKH]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:HAIR]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:GOLD:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:wool:SINGULAR]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:wool:SINGULAR]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:900:0:0:NO_END]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:10:50:100:150:200:300]
[SHEARABLE_TISSUE_LAYER:LENGTH:400]
[NATURAL_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE:4]
[NATURAL_SKILL:MELEE_COMBAT:4]
[NATURAL_SKILL:DODGING:4]
[CAN_LEARN]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:OLI_SKH]
[BODYGLOSS:FOOTPAW_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:ANKLEHOCK_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[CASTE:FEMALE][FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE][MALE]
Yes, it's going crazy fast now. Worse, I'm not sure how the person doing the modding turn can possibly handle all this info. We might need a different structure if this is to work as intended, but I'm not sure how... I personally will have even more trouble keeping up since life is getting kind of busy.
i am ignoring most of it and will try and add it at the end. i have given up on graphics for other people's creatures for now but might do some some other time.
Post by: Halfling on July 25, 2013, 11:49:31 pm
Yes, everything can be made from a tarnish stalk!
I specifically made them with the intention that they would be highly versatile, I even tried to make them usable in weapon and armor production, but that didn't work out.
Meph did comment on the possibility of artificial trees earlier (plants yielding lumber). Mm...
(http://s12.postimg.org/5p4awhtot/tarnish_whip.png)
I made this for you. It was such a beautiful dream.
Reactions:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 25, 2013, 11:57:47 pm
ok here is what i have been making, a new pet for our halflings. i will be making some more elaphants later
*snippety*
Hm...some minor spelling errors I have seen. "Pachyderm" instead of "Packaderm", and also, "intelligence" instead of "Intelagenc". Maybe "golden", too seeing as how it's not capitalized like a proper noun to indicate someone's name. In the description, "commonly" instead of "comonly".
On the technical side, there appears to be an extra "]" after "[CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]".
Also, yay elephants :)
@Plant weaponry: Oh GODC, now we'll be flooded by cheap toxic weapons, too. Lovely.
Post by: Halfling on July 26, 2013, 12:18:29 am
It's not even that bad of a weapon. Nor is it edible, sadly.
NOTE: unless you want to be able to make other things made of tarnish stalk into whips, such as other tarnish stalk whips leading to infinite loops, change reagent line to
[REAGENT:A:1:PLANT:NO_SUBTYPE:PLANT_MAT:TARNISH_STALK_MC:STRUCTURAL][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
it was at NONE:NONE to try other parts of the reaction first.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 26, 2013, 01:19:31 am
But yes, I need to make a tarnish column tree so that people can form shivs out of them, I've been thinking of a new race that I could make that would use wooden shivs and clubs.
Post by: sackhead on July 26, 2013, 10:30:28 am
thanks for the spelling check.ok here is what i have been making, a new pet for our halflings. i will be making some more elaphants later
*snippety*
Hm...some minor spelling errors I have seen. "Pachyderm" instead of "Packaderm", and also, "intelligence" instead of "Intelagenc". Maybe "golden", too seeing as how it's not capitalized like a proper noun to indicate someone's name. In the description, "commonly" instead of "comonly".
On the technical side, there appears to be an extra "]" after "[CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]".
Also, yay elephants :)
@Plant weaponry: Oh GODC, now we'll be flooded by cheap toxic weapons, too. Lovely.
also you cant see this but the trunk has the grasper token, this combined with the [CAN_LEARN] token means it can wrestle a weapon from someone then gain experience with it.
i had some fun in the arena where it stole a cudgel and leveled up in it
Post by: reemer30 on July 26, 2013, 03:09:33 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 26, 2013, 03:15:55 pm
Post by: kopout on July 26, 2013, 04:49:00 pm
@Kopout - you seem to have misspelled "air" in the lift gas template. That may be a source of error.Fixing the spelling error doesn't help. I'm going to try local creature mat, but I think I tried that already.
EDIT: Also, isn't it usually "LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:AIR", and then AIR is defined in the body detail plans? For that I think "INORGANIC:AIR_STL" would work, too, though I am unsure.
EDIT: I tried to fix the problem but I brock the game :(
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 26, 2013, 07:15:53 pm
Also, I don't see a male caste on the Dirigizelle, but either I'm missing something or that kind of thing just doesn't register an error log.
Post by: kopout on July 26, 2013, 07:50:24 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 26, 2013, 09:04:27 pm
Post by: kopout on July 26, 2013, 09:40:32 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 26, 2013, 09:53:09 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 26, 2013, 10:15:12 pm
If you count my alchemy stuff as an update, there's that, and then sackhead has made this compatible with the Obsidian tileset. Not sure when his turn's up though.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 26, 2013, 10:54:08 pm
Post by: kopout on July 26, 2013, 10:54:45 pm
material
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
tissue template
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
critter
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
body detail plan
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: mastahcheese on July 26, 2013, 10:56:28 pm
Post by: kopout on July 26, 2013, 11:01:52 pm
EDIT:
And they explode in a cloud of lift gas when they die
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 27, 2013, 12:02:48 am
Ah, whatever. I think I'll just use your stuff, since that works and (I'm assuming it) doesn't cause skin disintegration.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 27, 2013, 12:05:20 am
Post by: sackhead on July 27, 2013, 12:47:27 am
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:PLESIOPHINT_SKH]
[DESCRIPTION:An unimagably large marine Predatore with large tusks and a long sensitive trunk used to catch fish, it patrols the oceans in search of
pray.]
[NAME:plesiophint:plesiophint:plesiophint]
[CASTE_NAME:plesiophint:plesiophint:plesiophint]
[CREATURE_TILE:104][COLOR:4:0:0]
[PREFSTRING:share scale]
[AQUATIC][UNDERSWIM][IMMOBILE_LAND][BEACH_FREQUENCY:10]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:2:3]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:QUADRUPED]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:PACHYDERM]
[MUNDANE][TRAINABLE][PET_EXOTIC]
[PETVALUE:20000][LITTERSIZE:1:2][MAXAGE:400:800][NATURAL]
[LARGE_PREDATOR][CARNIVORE]
[BIOME:ANY_OCEAN]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:20:60]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[SPEED:400]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT][BABY:1][HOMEOTHERM:10070]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:calf:calves]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:400]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:250000000]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:FLIPPERS_SKH:TUSKS_SKH:TEETH_HLG:TAIL_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DOG_ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TAIL_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TRUNK_MATERIALS_SKH]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TRUNK_TISSUES_SKH]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TRUNK_LAYERS_SKH]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[CAN_LEARN]
[NATURAL_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE:6]
[NATURAL_SKILL:MELEE_COMBAT:6]
[NATURAL_SKILL:DODGING:6]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:OLI_SKH]
[BODYGLOSS:FOOTPAW_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:ANKLEHOCK_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL]
[MULTIPLY_VALUE:15]
[CASTE:FEMALE][FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE][MALE]and here are its atacksCode: [Select]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:STOMP:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:strike:stikes]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:600]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:GORE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:TUSK]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:gore:gores]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:10]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:150]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:1100] and ivory
Code: [Select]
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:IVORY_TEMPLATE_SKH]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:WHITE]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:10][STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:ivory]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:ivory]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:WHITE]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:ivory slurry]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:ivory slurry]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:WHITE]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:ivory ashes]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:ivory ash]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:7:0:1]
[SPEC_HEAT:1000]
[IGNITE_POINT:10300]
[MELTING_POINT:11000]
[BOILING_POINT:12000]
[HEATDAM_POINT:10200]
[COLDDAM_POINT:9950]
[SOLID_DENSITY:3000]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:1000]
[IMPACT_YIELD:600000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:600000]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:600000]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:600000]
[TENSILE_YIELD:300000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:300000]
[TORSION_YIELD:300000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:300000]
[SHEAR_YIELD:300000]
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:300000]
[BENDING_YIELD:300000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:300000]
[MAX_EDGE:10000]
[ABSORPTION:100]
[IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL]
[TOOTH]
[ITEMS_HARD]
[ITEMS_AMMO]
however in combat test it did not seem to be very effective against see scorpions (its attacks glanced off) it could not even kill one and they are only the size of people, anyone have any ideas why?
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 27, 2013, 04:41:09 am
Does their skin disintegrate? Because for some reason, I was having that issue with my air jellies. They'd take a hit to the gas sack and be enveloped in "dirigible jellyfish skin ash". The trail of it following a falling jelly was cool, but it left me perplexed.This, if nothing else, is why this game (and by extension, this mod) is the most amazing thing in the world.
Ah, whatever. I think I'll just use your stuff, since that works and (I'm assuming it) doesn't cause skin disintegration.
Post by: Halfling on July 27, 2013, 05:59:54 am
Counting that sackhead started a bit late, now it's been about a week (actually slightly over). So, it's time for an upload and for HugoLuman to take his turn.
The procedure is
1. Integrate newest versions of old packs, as well as any suggestions
2. Make sure it doesn't leave an errorlog
3. Upload and I'll put it up on the first page
Since you included compatibility with obsidian tiles, requesting both obsidian and ascii version.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 27, 2013, 06:42:26 am
this is what i have been working on think of a leopleradon crossed with an elephant and make it the size of a giant sperm whale
*snippety*
A few more spelling errors - "unimaginably" instead of "unimagably", "predator" instead of "Predatore", maybe "that" instead of "it" after the comma in the description to make it flow a bit better, and "prey" instead of "pray" there at the end.
however in combat test it did not seem to be very effective against see scorpions (its attacks glanced off) it could not even kill one and they are only the size of people, anyone have any ideas why?
I'm thinking its either that the sea scorpion chitin is too much for them (very unlikely, it's merely light chitin after all), or you may have inadvertently deployed the Giant Sea Scorpion variant against them...which are also the size of Giant Sperm Whales :) The oceans are worse than the land in terms of wildlife-that-doesn't-want-you-dead, at this point.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 27, 2013, 11:51:28 am
Okay. Nice stuff, all.
Counting that sackhead started a bit late, now it's been about a week (actually slightly over). So, it's time for an upload and for HugoLuman to take his turn.
The procedure is
1. Integrate newest versions of old packs, as well as any suggestions
2. Make sure it doesn't leave an errorlog
3. Upload and I'll put it up on the first page
Since you included compatibility with obsidian tiles, requesting both obsidian and ascii version.
Already? Crap, I barely know what's going on... kopout, may I finish the Dirigizelle raws?
Post by: kopout on July 27, 2013, 06:10:09 pm
I was kind of hoping to finish them myself if that's alright.Okay. Nice stuff, all.
Counting that sackhead started a bit late, now it's been about a week (actually slightly over). So, it's time for an upload and for HugoLuman to take his turn.
The procedure is
1. Integrate newest versions of old packs, as well as any suggestions
2. Make sure it doesn't leave an errorlog
3. Upload and I'll put it up on the first page
Since you included compatibility with obsidian tiles, requesting both obsidian and ascii version.
Already? Crap, I barely know what's going on... kopout, may I finish the Dirigizelle raws?
Does their skin disintegrate? Because for some reason, I was having that issue with my air jellies. They'd take a hit to the gas sack and be enveloped in "dirigible jellyfish skin ash". The trail of it following a falling jelly was cool, but it left me perplexed.No skin disintegration. It looks like your stuff causes the skin around it to sublimate. I kinda wish my did, that sounds more like an unintended feature than a bug :P
Ah, whatever. I think I'll just use your stuff, since that works and (I'm assuming it) doesn't cause skin disintegration.
Post by: Timeless Bob on July 27, 2013, 07:03:29 pm
Post by: kopout on July 27, 2013, 07:47:53 pm
Post by: sackhead on July 27, 2013, 08:24:28 pm
if i have missed your stuff i am sorry there are likely to be mistakes and if you find any tel me. Stuff may look weird in either version as i haven't tested everything.
also i would like to request a play turn
Post by: kopout on July 27, 2013, 08:30:16 pm
Post by: sackhead on July 27, 2013, 08:37:55 pm
and ACII http://www.mediafire.com/?n23ps889fojunx5 (http://www.mediafire.com/?n23ps889fojunx5)
Post by: kopout on July 27, 2013, 08:51:09 pm
EDIT: removed fixed tem from lift gas and gave it the flashpoint of hydrogen (low end). they now burst into flame if they get to close to magma
Post by: sackhead on July 27, 2013, 10:21:11 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 28, 2013, 06:47:25 am
Hugo's modding turn is up :)
In other matters, how do we get more player stories and testing in? Do you think the high pace of modding may be causing the shortage?
Post by: sjm9876 on July 28, 2013, 08:16:25 am
they now burst into flame if they get to close to magmaI may well begin unofficially playtesting in a week or so. Would be earlier, but i'm away next week.
Post by: Baffler on July 28, 2013, 10:44:35 am
Edit: Aaaand I've lost my settlement. A group of 40 water striders came along, the poor guys didn't stand a chance :(
Post by: WillowLuman on July 28, 2013, 01:08:46 pm
Post by: Gnorm on July 28, 2013, 03:21:03 pm
On an unrelated note, progress on my wheelers is trudging along, though I might want to nerf them slightly, seeing how dangerous the world is as-of-now.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on July 28, 2013, 07:49:29 pm
See? Too many wild animals are automatically hostile and extremely dangerous.In general, almost all of the creatures made by this community want to kill you. Most of them are also very good at doing so.
Post by: bulborbish on July 28, 2013, 08:27:21 pm
See? Too many wild animals are automatically hostile and extremely dangerous.In general, almost all of the creatures made by this community want to kill you. Most of them are also very good at doing so.
Indeed, the test for most of them was their capability of killing poor Halflings. We're probably starting to approach the thousands for Halflings sacrificed in the arena.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 28, 2013, 09:04:34 pm
See? Too many wild animals are automatically hostile and extremely dangerous.
I never thought I would say this, but my wild dragons will be a welcome relief. I made them to annoy. Now the reaction will be "Good, it's only a dragon."
Post by: mastahcheese on July 28, 2013, 10:42:41 pm
"Good, it's only a dragon."Only in Bay12.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 28, 2013, 11:20:20 pm
See? Too many wild animals are automatically hostile and extremely dangerous.
I never thought I would say this, but my wild dragons will be a welcome relief. I made them to annoy. Now the reaction will be "Good, it's only a dragon."
But that's still hostile. Everything's out to either kill or pester, nothing just passing through looking pretty, only interacted with if you decide to capture or kill them. Many of our wild animals are equivalent to the semi-megabeasts (at least) in vanilla. That's the thing about game design: everyone wants to make bosses, no one wants to go through the world adding ambient butterflies.
Post by: sackhead on July 29, 2013, 12:01:33 am
i didn't realy help in my turn but i am not good at creature editing
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 29, 2013, 12:09:20 am
Post by: mastahcheese on July 29, 2013, 12:22:56 am
I'm up for adding a crapload of nonsensical and [BENIGN] animals, if I can take a modding turn.As long as they can all be milked, sheared, and harvested for personal gain!
Oh, wait, we're hobbits, not dwarves.
Carry on, good sir.
Post by: Gnorm on July 29, 2013, 01:29:47 am
-----
From the journal of Gnorm, the halfling mayor of Mastertea, found at the ruins of the settlement:
26th Obsidian, 550
What a spectacular turn of events the last few months have been. It all began when my friend, who happens to be a bookkeeper of my hometown, told me about a rumor that The Galls of Pumpkin, our home civilization, was planning to expand its borders further into The Calm Hill. Immediately, I realized that the halflings migrating into this new area would need a town, and I was soon determined to be the first in this new frontier.
I have spent the last couple of months recruiting willing workers, gathering supplies, and studying atlases for the ideal area. Below is the area that I have selected for my town.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/acsytz.png)
The area is, according to my atlas, in range of the closest formic, tree lord, and spider-centaur civilizations, so I must be cautious to stay on good terms with the peaceful ones and to defend myself from the dangerous ones.
I have made careful preparations to ensure that I have all of the supplies that I require. I have compiled my list below for easy reference.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2nrpij7.png)
(http://i44.tinypic.com/wlueea.png)
I have decided to call our local government "The Mighty Halflings," as a testament to our bravery of this new frontier. In addition, my town shall go by the name of "Mastertea."
(http://i40.tinypic.com/292pjc6.png)
1st Granite, 551
We have arrived at last! Upon surveying the area, it seems to be filled mostly with colorful flora and mallards.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/29dfkn8.png)
First things first. I set my men at work to build basic workshops, bridge the brook, build our basic necessities, and give our pack beetle an area to graze at.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/30wm5bt.png)
17th Granite, 551
Started work on a basic mine. It turns out that there is a pretty blue stone called "azurine" beneath the earth. It will make an excellent stone for my town hall.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/jtm336.png)
27th Granite, 551
A basic farm has been constructed in the sand beneath the earth. It will provide us with our much needed food.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/qp33t0.png)
13th Slate, 551
Incredible! As I was digging deeper into the earth with the intention of finding some extra stone, I found myself within an enormous underground cavern.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/1hpgyg.png)
I shall have my men explore it at once; I do hope that there aren't any hostile creatures.
24th Slate, 551
Built a temporary dormitory until we are prepared to construct actual buildings. Moss has strangely begun to grow out of the cavern into our tunneled areas. I must think of a way to combat this nuisance.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2l886r7.png)
27th Slate, 551
Finally have a functional well built in preparation for winter. Hopefully, this shall keep us from drinking all of our vodka when the brook is frozen solid.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/xqcffq.png)
Before I left to this site, my bookkeeper friend promised me that he would inform the government of our settlement, and that traders would come to us. Thus, I have started work on some trinkets to trade with.
24th Felsite, 551
This shall, most likely, be my last entry before the Summertime, so I shall summarize all that has happened in this last month. We have several workshops built, though no true buildings have been constructed with the exception of the trade depot. Two farms have been constructed: one above ground and one beneath it. We have a dormitory and a well built in the sand near our mine, which is leaking moss from the cavern. I have also made 100 coins worth in smoking pipes. I hope to begin construction of more advanced buildings in the next season.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/v8h2q.png)
May Mastertea live forever!
Post by: Halfling on July 29, 2013, 08:44:37 am
I would like a modding turn, please.See? Too many wild animals are automatically hostile and extremely dangerous.In general, almost all of the creatures made by this community want to kill you. Most of them are also very good at doing so.
Added. I'm also adding Mastertea to the front page.
Post by: Halfling on July 29, 2013, 08:59:00 am
Just genned a world and I've begun play testing. the first thing I noticed was that the apple tree processing reaction at the lumber yard doesn't work (or I'm doing it wrong). It requires something called "Apple Tree Plant Logs" and I haven't been able to acquire those. Are they supposed to drop from the apple trees you cut down or do I have to gather/cut a special "fruit bearing" apple tree?
Edit: Aaaand I've lost my settlement. A group of 40 water striders came along, the poor guys didn't stand a chance :(
Confirmed. Water strider cluster size is 3-5 so the reason for there being 40 is unknown. Apple tree processing currently does NOT work, since apple trees leave apple wood logs usable for building and not apple tree logs. This is because changes were not added to the apple tree (which is correct by the rules but I did give permission to add them, I don't know if this was the cause of the confusion).
Current:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Should be:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
After that change, the reaction is automatic and seems to work as intended. (the only strange thing is it leaves e.g. "apple [2], apple, apple" which will probably be then stockpiled separately, but this is seemingly unavoidable for now unless you want to get rid of the randomness)
Post by: Baffler on July 29, 2013, 09:45:55 am
Quote
Water strider cluster size is 3-5 so the reason for there being 40 is unknown.Sorry, I should clarify. I was at the convergence of two minor rivers, with a big lake down in a crater.A few groups of them drifted in and settled in the crater lake. I had no idea what to expect from them, so I ignored them because they were, as far as I knew, unable to see my halflings at the top of the cliffs. My fisherman went down there at some point and they started chasing him. He ran away and led them back to my wagon.
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 10:52:09 am
Cherry trees are now more or less functional. They still need some polish though. Ultimately I plan to have apple, cherry, avocado, coconut, lemon, and some sort of made up deep tree as my fruit trees. Banana is probably going to be a very long lived shrub, I don't think it gives useful wood IRL. Exploding lemons might wind up being a thing eventually.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 29, 2013, 11:36:38 am
We should give them a syndrome that mimics mercury poisoning.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 29, 2013, 11:40:50 am
@HugoLuman, feel free to start posting lovely butterflies and such :) We've provided the predators, and if you want some happy non-domesticated critters to dilute them, go ahead and make them yourself. I look forward to them (especially if you can get the dirigizelle functioning). Also, I'm trying to make a few benign wild animals myself, so that should help.
@mastahcheese, We have actual fish - trilobites, ammonites, and sea ants, as sea vermin, and sea scorpions (and giant ones) as ocean predators that are aquatic. I think someone else posted some sea life, too, but I can't for the life of me remember who. Sackhead, perhaps?
Post by: Halfling on July 29, 2013, 11:42:07 am
Do we have actual fish yet?
We should give them a syndrome that mimics mercury poisoning.
There are fish*, and that only makes sense if there's mercury pollution from industrial use.
Instead, add pufferfish (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugu), that cause numbness of the tongue and then full paralysis if prepared and eaten, to the fish repertoire. It's better if they are somewhat rare so you may think fishing is still a somewhat good idea.
*water insects
Post by: mastahcheese on July 29, 2013, 11:48:02 am
Would give fish extraction a purpose.
Post by: Halfling on July 29, 2013, 11:57:39 am
Likewise you could actually have a lot of toxic animals and things that only become safe to eat after dissecting/broiling/processing.
Post by: mastahcheese on July 29, 2013, 12:04:54 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 29, 2013, 12:16:22 pm
that would save a thousand tears. Even our newest playtesting story fort brought a ton of toxic stuff and is just waiting to find out.
Then you could also add a "dump toxic barrel/bucket contents" reaction to get rid of the toxins or spread them on the ground if that works.
Post by: Meph on July 29, 2013, 12:21:04 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on July 29, 2013, 12:21:27 pm
Tarnish stalk ---broil tarnish stalks (herbalism, kitchen)---> broiled tarnish stalks + tarnish stalk tarnish (usable for invader defense) ---> tarnished vodka/prepared foodI just set mine to dump, then they pick it up with their bare hands somehow and chuck it wherever you tell them.
that would save a thousand tears. Even our newest playtesting story fort brought a ton of toxic stuff and is just waiting to find out.
Then you could also add a "dump toxic barrel/bucket contents" reaction to get rid of the toxins or spread them on the ground if that works.
But I think I might do that.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 29, 2013, 12:50:47 pm
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 03:12:47 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on July 29, 2013, 03:40:45 pm
@mastahcheese, We have actual fish - trilobites, ammonites, and sea ants, as sea vermin, and sea scorpions (and giant ones) as ocean predators that are aquatic. I think someone else posted some sea life, too, but I can't for the life of me remember who. Sackhead, perhaps?
I know I am making varieties of water-based dragons.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 29, 2013, 03:53:36 pm
Post by: Gnorm on July 29, 2013, 04:01:41 pm
-----
From the journal of Gnorm, the halfling mayor of Mastertea, found at the ruins of the settlement:
11th Hematite, 551
Had to slaughter our pack beetle today for its meat, as we were running low on food. We didn't have much use for the beast anyway.
14th Hematite, 551
I've designated some areas to be dug underground for some more permanent stockpiles; these shall replace the small ones on the surface.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2wnzm7a.png)
7th Malachite, 551
Due to the dangerous nature of any frontier, I have begun construction of a personal tomb for myself, should the worst befall me.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/npi6ty.png)
If I am to die, I must be buried within a complex, maze like cavern, where no one can find my body.
My men say that they have seen strange new halflings in the distance.
8th Malachite, 551
(http://i39.tinypic.com/atuftl.png)
Migrants! here! already! I'm not sure how to react to the recent migration. I had no idea that word would spread of a settlement this quickly. Nevertheless, I must be professional in an event such as this. The migrants are as follows:
1 Presser
1 Wood Burner
1 Stonecrafter
1 Blacksmith
2 Aphidida Nymphs (I wonder how much meat are on them)
1 Woodcrafter
1 Potter
Our total population is now 13 halflings. Some of the migrants will not be able to make use of their current professions, though.
19th Malachite, 551
Ordered both the nymphs to be slaughtered. Their meat is necessary for the survival of this frontier.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/105d2bt.png)
Work on my tomb is progressing steadily.
14th Galena, 551
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2hfq8tj.png)
At last we have the beginning of an actual militia to defend this town (though I use the term loosely) from hostiles. I hope that we shall not have to make use of our captain for a while.
17th Galena, 551
At last! the diplomat and the merchant caravan have come! I have ordered immediate preparations to trade our goods for theirs.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/35d3yn9.png)
19th Galena, 551
(http://i44.tinypic.com/30kg9c2.png)
The diplomat began his meeting, and desired to know what we require to survive. I gave him the basic list: food, seeds, weapons, wood, etcetera. In return, he told me that there was a shortage of certain items in the capital, and that they would pay top dollar for them next year.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/52c64h.png)
I'm not sure what use figurines have, but I shan't question it. After our discussion, the diplomat wished me luck and left.
28th Galena, 551
This shall be my last entry this season. The work on the first real building in our village (the dining hall) is slowly progressing. It shall hopefully be done early this Autumn.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2dk02f7.png)
We are ready to trade with the merchants, a task that I shall undertake shortly.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/28clny9.png)
My tomb is officially finished! It contains eight engravings around my coffin, mainly of plants, the symbol of "The Mighty Halflings" (two stinkweed), and the symbol of our parent civilization (four pumpkins). In addition, two statues by me (one of an historical hound-slaying; another of two pack beetles) are featured. Finally, there is a stone coffer for my personal possessions.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/4nm94.png)
May the coming season usher in new progress to our evolving frontier!
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 04:23:49 pm
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 06:11:49 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 29, 2013, 06:40:03 pm
I'm trying to think of new ways to manage all the chaos. Here's something that may or may not happen depending on if something more important comes up, not very functional yet but I may personally use it for quick searches:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Script - obviously works by default only for linux with kate:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on July 29, 2013, 06:54:17 pm
Hugo, are you working on the dirigible antelope or am I?I'll finish them. Send me what you have so far, I want to add some variations to them.
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 07:00:07 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on July 29, 2013, 07:03:37 pm
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 07:58:36 pm
Critter
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
tissue (not that the game recognizes it >:( )
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Body
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
body detail plan
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
lift gas material
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
to do:
-remove scratch attack
-create attacks for ungulate limbs
-test and make sure hooves work properly
-(optional) reduce thickness of bones making them brittle
-(optional) add syndrome to lift gas reducing speed and adding "deflating" to the name
Post by: WillowLuman on July 29, 2013, 08:55:12 pm
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 09:03:36 pm
Post by: Ora_the_Owlish on July 29, 2013, 09:04:18 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on July 29, 2013, 09:09:53 pm
I gave 'em front legs but not hind legs because I figured they would need to be able to make contact with the ground to feedThey'll drift past the trees and eat leaves. Should they be tamed, they probably won't be [GRAZER]'s, needing hand-feeding. That, or they'll wind up starving cause halflings don't know how to take care of them.
Probably there'll be a [GRAZER] species called "telescopic dirigible antelope" who can reach the ground from the air.
Post by: kopout on July 29, 2013, 09:17:45 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on July 29, 2013, 10:02:16 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 29, 2013, 11:05:31 pm
Well, and a defense mechanism, but fireball-spewing blimp gazelle kinda defeats the purpose of having benign animals wandering about :P
Post by: Gnorm on July 30, 2013, 01:44:44 am
-----
From the Journal of Gnorm:
4th Limestone, 551
Traded with the supply caravan today.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2qi2oi1.png)
Bought several useful items, including a male hound. I'll try to have it trained as soon as possible. I sold all of our pipes, though, so I'll have to order new ones.
21st Limestone, 551
Due to the shortage on stone, I have designated a small underground section to be dug out. This will hopefully give us more to work with.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2ilcupe.png)
24th Limestone, 551
(http://i44.tinypic.com/w89nro.png)
The last thing we needed at this moment was more migrants. We're hardly a proper town yet they still come as if we were. For my convenience, the migrant list is as follows:
1 Brewer
1 Hunter
2 Masons
1 Cook
1 Surgeon
Surprisingly, unlike the last wave of migrants, I actually have use for all of their professions. I shall put them to good work immediately.
15th Sandstone, 551
Built a stone floor around my well. Surprisingly, this has been the only progression of moment for weeks. Work has been quite slow, lately.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/nq6xyg.png)
25th Sandstone, 551
At last! we have an actual building in our town!
(http://i41.tinypic.com/30ngnc6.png)
We have just finished building our dining hall. It can only seat eight, but it is a building. Plus, my manager and bookkeeper have been bothering me for offices, so I have given them both spots in the dining room as temporary "offices."
2nd Timber, 551
We now have an area for our only soldier to train her skills. I know not what may be a threat to us, so she'll need to be prepared for the worst.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/33z5g5g.png)
I have been nervous about the cavern and what might live in it; I am considering constructing traps.
7th Timber, 551
The time has come to harvest our tarnish stalk farm. It shall be used to sustain our people.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2znuzo8.png)
11th Timber, 551
We now have pumpkins at our disposal. I shall make sure that they are put to good use.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2ut5cbb.png)
18th Timber, 551
A merchant caravan from the forested civilization "Jribidleelus" has been spotted in the distance. I have heard rumors that the elves are not as they seem. However silly they are, I still feel that I must exercise caution when dealing with them.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/21a0gno.png)
We currently have nothing to trade with, so I have ordered five pipes to be made.
Supplementary Entry
What timing! A caravan from our civilization has come right behind the elves. I'm not sure how this shall end.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/t6p93d.png)
23rd Timber, 551
(http://i40.tinypic.com/qodduq.png)
I met with the diplomat, today, which proceeded almost exactly as it did the time before.
1st Moonstone, 551
Winter has arrived. Both caravans are still at the depot, waiting. We have not yet churned out the pipes need to trade. Soon, I hope, I shall meet with them.
7th Moonstone, 551
Today I traded with both civilizations.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2ppfn9h.png)
The elves didn't bring too much, and of what they brought little was useful. I decided to not bother wasting any of my pipes on their cheap crap this year.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/30t6yxg.png)
Our fellow halflings had much more for us to use. I purchased all of their wood, as well as some more tarnish stalks and seeds.
The elfish guard uneases me. Being that the elf is unarmed, I feel that even our captain could take it out. The living tree, on the other hand, looks as if it would be harder to kill. If we are ever to make an attack on the forested merchants, it must occur when we have a stronger army.
23rd Moonstone, 551
Both caravans have started packing today. Thank the gods! Diplomacy may be important, but the walking tree was just making me nervous. Seeing how often merchants seem to come, I have designated many more pipes to be made.
11th Opal, 551
The river has finally frozen over today. We, fortunately, still have enough water in our reservoir to last until it thaws. I am hoping to put the ice to good use.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2pq3w4n.png)
22nd Opal, 551
Our stone crafter has created a masterpiece of a pipe today!
(http://i39.tinypic.com/20uy3jd.png)
This shall fetch a decent prize on any caravan.
26th Opal, 551
The brook is running once again. The cold season in these hills seems to last hardly two weeks. This has put to rest all of my hopes of crafting pipes out of ice.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/4gso5v.png)
13th Obsidian, 551
Two furnaces have been constructed outside. These shall allow us to smelt our metal ore in the foreseeable future. Perhaps we shall soon see our captain with some new equipment.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/4zzzi9.png)
27th Obsidian, 551
After almost one whole year, we now have metal bars at our disposal.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/4q4k0h.png)
With metal comes industry, and with that industry we shall grow and thrive. I plan on giving the captain the weapons she deserves, and perhaps I shall improve the design of our well.
This is my last entry for the year 551; in two days time, it shall be 552. I plan on progress this coming year; construction on the town hall must begin. Our finest year awaits us!
Post by: WillowLuman on July 30, 2013, 01:57:23 am
Post by: mastahcheese on July 30, 2013, 02:22:35 am
Wait, the elves have [UTTERANCES]?Yup
Post by: Halfling on July 30, 2013, 04:46:53 am
Regardless, maybe this is the play turn that finally meets some megabeasts and invaders. Titillating.
Post by: The Urist on July 30, 2013, 05:26:28 am
Post by: Gnorm on July 30, 2013, 12:45:01 pm
-----
From the Journal of Gnorm:
4th Granite, 552
In my excitement over finally having metal bars in the town I had completely forgotten that we have no sort of anvil to work with. Thus, I have ordered our metal to be melted into a crude substitute, until we can either forge or purchase a superior one.
I worry that our captain is not getting the best training on her own. Perhaps I shall find her a sparring partner when the next wave of migrants comes.
From an Official Mayoral Mandate, Dated 5th Granite, 522:
Citizens of Mastertea,
(http://i40.tinypic.com/6ezndt.png)
Due to their use, cultural importance, and scarcity in our settlement, the export of boxes and bags is strictly forbidden until further notice.
Signed,
Gnorm Greenwitch, Mayor of Mastertea
From the Journal of Gnorm:
19th Granite, 552
Unbelievable! Since our blacksmith was on a break, I told the presser to handle the anvil production. I told him to simply melt a bar into a sort of an anvil-esque shape. When I returned later, I found him and some workers lugging off a whole supply of them!
(http://i43.tinypic.com/99q3r4.png)
I don't know how he managed to make so many anvils with just one bar, but I don't think that we'll even need to purchase another one.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/350w2hk.png)
By the gods! we're rich!
10th Slate, 552
The first babies of our town have been born, and our stone crafter has become a loving mother of three.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/346s0o2.png)
The two sons are Fairy Lovingplain and Aether Volegreen, respectively. The daughter is named Expedition Halflingpast, an honorable name for any halfling, in my opinion.
18th Slate, 552
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2z9i6ts.png)
Another migrant wave; it's time once again to list off the incoming professions.
1 Animal Caretaker
1 Blacksmith
1 Trapper
1 Pack Beetle Nymph
1 Leatherworker
3 Clothiers
1 Cook
1 Golden Mamaphint Miller (Pet)
1 Weaver
3 Mallard (Pets)
1 Bombus Nymph
1 Tanner
In other news, the captain has given birth to a daughter named Stupidity Titdragon. With all due respect to our dear captain, I have no idea what she was thinking.
Our total population is now 33 halflings (4 of which are babies), 4 pets, 1 caged hound, and 4 livestock animals.
21st Slate, 552
Today our miner and our woodcutter from the original expedition team have been married to each other. While they have decided to forego any formal celebrations, there is an air of jubilation about the hamlet.
In other uplifting news, we now have meteoric iron at our disposal. The captain shall be pleased.
2nd Felsite, 552
We have had another marriage today, again between two of our original expedition team. They have, as the others did, forgone any formal festivities.
3rd Felsite, 552
(http://i39.tinypic.com/11se1oi.png)
We finally have metal equipment for our captain. She is quite pleased. I shall try to find her some subordinates soon.
7th Felsite, 552
Progress occurs! I have at last begun to plan out the first walls of our future town hall! It shall be my home and workplace in this hamlet. In addition, I am considering plans to dig beneath the cavern to see what exists beneath.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/qzg9ol.png)
12th Felsite, 552
A merchant caravan and a diplomat from our civilization are nearing our hamlet. I have taken immediate measures to ensure that they are properly received. Many anvils and pipes have been ordered to be moved to the depot.
13th Felsite, 552
A forested caravan has arrived now, and, as the last one did, it uneases me. I am considering sending my troops against it.
19th Felsite, 552
Today I, once again, attempted to trade with the elfish merchants.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/9rhycl.png)
And, once again, I found them to have absolutely nothing of use.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/1604g07.png)
Trade with my fellow halflings got me much more in the means of useful items. Even if many of the things that I bought were over-priced seeds, they are still more useful than the elves and their cheap wood. At the very least, I bought a new sort of metal from the caravans.
25th Felsite, 552
(http://i44.tinypic.com/nz2fdz.png)
I met with the diplomat today. As always, he asked me what I need. I answered that we needed new sorts of seeds for our farms. In return, he informed me that cut gems were "in vogue" and that many merchants would pay top dollar. Gems, unfortunately, are something that we have never had an access to.
2nd Hematite, 552
I hardly noticed when the seasons changed. It is now the second Summer of Mastertea's existence. I must say, while it still hardly qualifies as a hamlet, we are progressing. Once our town hall is finished, I'll commission a jail and a hospital.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/5lrjwk.png)
Our captain now has two subordinates that she has begun to train. I have confidence that they shall become fine soldiers. I have nothing but high hopes for the future of this hamlet!
Supplementary Entry
Gods! the dining hall is coated in vomit!
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2ag47dk.png)
Post by: Halfling on July 30, 2013, 02:24:03 pm
Sign me in for modding, please :). Oh, I have already made two creatures for this this.
Adding. Welcome :)
Gnorm, tarnish stalks and tarnish stalk products cause vomiting when consumed. That's why they're so cheap.
Also, looks like the anvil casting reaction broke again. Probably should add [DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT] to the reagent to be safe.
Post by: Gnorm on July 30, 2013, 02:38:25 pm
Gnorm, tarnish stalks and tarnish stalk products cause vomiting when consumed. That's why they're so cheap.I am well-aware of the issues that surround consumption of the tarnish stalks, though sometimes one has to make do with tarnish stalk pie. The last post was more an expression of annoyance than surprise.
Post by: Aseaheru on July 30, 2013, 02:40:09 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on July 30, 2013, 04:57:12 pm
Also curious what the "new type of metal" you obtained from the caravan is. I saw them bring an oxyline block and I just groaned. I'm almost considering modifying the reaction to allow blocks, because apparently oxyline is far more scarce than I thought. They HAVE oxyline, though, so you can probably order some from the mountainhomes. If you do, please try to smelt some Iridium for me. I'm curious how that goes. Remember, Iridium is found in the caverns (metamorphic rock, so basically caverns), in small clusters a la vanilla gem formations, so you're gonna have to do exploratory mining to find them. In addition to the oxyline, you'll also need to go kill some Pale Riders to get your hands on some magmaline. They DO breed (at least they should, unless I fucked that up), so if you can capture a breeding pair, you're good to go. Of course.... good luck with that. ;)
Also HOLY FUCK anybody check their error log lately? Mine is FOUR HUNDRED AND NINETY SIX KILOBYTES. Two instances of "missing rcp_gloss_paw", which is expected (and convenient, as it acts as an automatic delimiter between play sessions", 49 instances of "Impoverished word selector", another instance of rcp_gloss_paw, and then the entire rest of the file is "Midmap effective coordinate check out of bounds" over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 30, 2013, 04:59:49 pm
Mine is
Is what? Is WHAT? TELL US!
Post by: kopout on July 30, 2013, 05:15:02 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 30, 2013, 07:19:04 pm
If you're just referring to alchemy jobs and reactions and such, go ahead :)
@Laula and errorlog: I tend to delete mine every other play session, otherwise it gets unreadably long...like yours seems to have.
Post by: Gnorm on July 30, 2013, 08:43:11 pm
-----
From the Journal of Gnorm
12th Hematite, 552
I have finally dug out an area for that hound to be trained. If we are to brave the deeper, darker crevices of the world, we'll need larger support.
14th Hematite, 552
I have officially ended my ban on the export of boxes and bags. We don't even have enough of them that we would give them up!
19th Hematite, 552
The elves have finally begun to leave, and the walking tree is lagging behind. Now is my chance, I have ordered the captain to take her squad and to finish it quickly and quietly.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/28b5urt.png)
20th Hematite, 552
Things seem to be going well for our troops.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/308f8zn.png)
21st Hematite, 552
The tree can only last so much longer.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2sbjwhj.png)
22nd Hematite, 552
The tree-like beast has taken a victim! Evil Etherealhame, the wife of the captain's only other subordinate, now lies dead on the ground.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/aev2tx.jpg)
Nearby, the widower axeman lies down tending to his broken and smashed arm. Tragic as this event is, I am positive that the captain shall make the beast pay. As of now, she has only a scratch as a wound of battle.
23rd Hematite, 552
Amid the intense fighting between halfling and beast, our brewer has given birth to triplets. Her children are Peace Fairyevil, Son Hazyflax, and Red Blackcozy. I swear, they shall be sleep in bed made of tree lord carrion!
Supplementary Entry
As I was finishing my last entry, our cook just gave birth to twins. Their names are Pumpkin Oafguardian and Champion Dragonwry.
25th Hematite, 552
(http://i41.tinypic.com/124vqz6.png)
One of our cooks seems to be acting quite strange lately; I'll be sure to keep an eye on her.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/qy7met.png)
She just now barged into our (rarely used) bowyer's shop and claimed it as her own. I'll be interested to see what she does next.
26th Hematite, 552
I was forced to withdraw our two remaining soldiers from the battlefield today. Soon afterward, the tree lord coward began to flee, likely back to its home civilization. It has become clear to me that the sentient trees are strong enough to face the meteoric iron hatchet. I'll need something stronger.
1st Malachite, 552
I have designated a small area in the dormitory to serve as a temporary hospital for our wounded soldiers.
The cook that claimed the workshop is demanding that she be provided with silk cloth. I've already informed her that we have not the means to obtain such a cloth, yet she continues to scream all day and all night.
I'm having proper burial rites prepared for our fallen warrior. One who has died in battle such as she must entombed in the caverns, as will I, when the time comes.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/11uxgz9.png)
4th Malachite, 552
I have ordered another "crude anvil" to be cast, thus that we may have things with which we shall trade once another caravan arrives.
14th Malachite, 552
(http://i39.tinypic.com/saxid2.png)
I have ordered my craftsmen to create for our settlement a small number of boxes and bags. These containers shall enhance the way that we in store our items in Mastertea!
17th Malachite, 552
The training has paid off. We now have a vicious war hound to tear apart any intruders from the land or from the cavern!
(http://i40.tinypic.com/5ee1q0.png)
23rd Malachite, 552
(http://i40.tinypic.com/zk1mo9.png)
Another wave of migrants has arrived. I'm starting to realize how desperately we need actual buildings. The migrants are:
1 Animal Caretaker
1 Woodworker
1 Tanner
1 Bowyer
2 Mechanics
1 Shearer
1 Woodcrafter
1 Woodcutter
1 Lye Maker
1 Weaver
There are now 48 citizens in Mastertea, and I feel that now is the time to put them to use.
4th Galena, 552
I've decided that, in order to lighten the mood, an amulet must be created at once!
7th Galena, 552
Our fallen comrade has been entombed within the earth at last. The engravings are fairly standard specimens of halfling art, being mainly of plants and gourds.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/uo3k3.png)
When her husband's time comes, I will do all in my power to ensure that he is buried next to her.
13th Galena, 552
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2edp10h.png)
Another forested caravan has arrived; I'll not attack this one.
Meanwhile, the cook that demanded silk has now gone absolutely mad! She is running wildly about whilst screaming. I fear for her and her future.
17th Galena, 552
Our halfling caravan and liaison has arrived. As always, I think that I'll trade with this one instead.
19th Galena, 552
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2m65qf5.png)
I'll not waste much ink in over my meeting; as always it was uneventful. I have put in a request for more types of metal.
27th Galena, 552
The season is coming to an end, and, come next season, I shall trade with our parent civilization.
I have started a new military squad while the other one is recovering in the hospital. This one, as of now, shall not be used in any attempts against the tree lords.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2yucdc3.png)
There is much to do next season, but I am determined to get it all done.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 30, 2013, 09:01:17 pm
Post by: kopout on July 30, 2013, 10:06:10 pm
Post by: Orange Wizard on July 30, 2013, 11:27:34 pm
Well, OK, not really, but I like to think we need that.
Post by: sackhead on July 31, 2013, 12:32:44 am
Post by: Halfling on July 31, 2013, 01:06:39 am
>Midmap effective coordinate check out of bounds
>Midmap effective coordinate check out of bounds
Anyone have a clue so as to what this is? I didn't see it there before. Is some creature's pathfinding now bugged? If it keeps making errorlogs unreadable, that's actually pretty bad.
Post by: Putnam on July 31, 2013, 01:18:32 am
Post by: Nahere on July 31, 2013, 01:22:22 am
>Midmap effective coordinate check out of boundsI've never seen any error like that, and googling it gives me a few results about a hard to track down crash bug back in 0.31.03 and 0.31.11.
>Midmap effective coordinate check out of bounds
>Midmap effective coordinate check out of bounds
Anyone have a clue so as to what this is? I didn't see it there before. Is some creature's pathfinding now bugged? If it keeps making errorlogs unreadable, that's actually pretty bad.
PRE-EDIT: Ninja'd by Putnam
Post by: Halfling on July 31, 2013, 02:01:21 am
Also, "dripping treelord molten skin"? Again? I thought we dealt with that already. Current raws:
Spoiler: creature (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: b_detail_plan (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: tissue templates (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: material_template_organic_bfel (click to show/hide)
So yeah, it has a sap tissue but not a sap material to bleed. Fix: either repair it properly by making a sap material (BFEL?), or add
[ADD_MATERIAL:SAP:BLOOD_TEMPLATE_HLG]
to b_detail_plan_bfel:PLANT_MATERIALS_BFEL for a quick fix.
Post by: TheClam on July 31, 2013, 05:20:36 am
Damn, I need to learn to mod
Post by: Meph on July 31, 2013, 06:11:14 am
Post by: kero42 on July 31, 2013, 08:53:18 am
Post by: TheClam on July 31, 2013, 10:29:02 am
Quote
Its easy. Even I managed to learn it. ;) But really, not coding knowledge is needed.
Thanks. I think I'm already picking it up. Working on making a race of sentient, flying jellyfish from scratch ATM. If I manage to get it to work, I'll submit it here. I have some pretty neat ideas for what I want to do with them as a civ, so we'll see if I can work out how to put them all in the game ;)
Post by: WillowLuman on July 31, 2013, 12:46:21 pm
Post by: Meph on July 31, 2013, 12:58:52 pm
And the flying blimp-gazelle of course.
Post by: Putnam on July 31, 2013, 01:05:53 pm
Yeah, I'd be interested to have a look as well. Just professional curiosity, I want to know how bad you guys messed up all the nice DF raws, and added fancy-pants words like "STRUCTURE" instead of "STRUCTURAL" and all that. :P
Pah! There's no need to follow Toady's conventions when writing these raws.
Post by: Meph on July 31, 2013, 01:13:15 pm
And then, the errorlog will explode my netbook, because all tags and names and ids are wrong. :P
Post by: Godlysockpuppet on July 31, 2013, 02:42:54 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 31, 2013, 02:53:00 pm
No, there isnt. But lets just hypotheticaly assume (omg, I hope that is more or less correct english) that someone (Not-Meph) would like to steal something from here... maybe not the blimb-gazelle, but I am sure that someone (Not-Meph) would have a close look at the raws and shamelessly take all the good ideas he (or she) can find, and put it in another mod.
And then, the errorlog will explode my netbook, because all tags and names and ids are wrong. :P
Well, it's not like we're capable of making new tokens here, plus this is a self-contained ecosystem of mods by design. If you want to borrow something, well, if you use our materials too it's fine, and if you use yours you'll have to rewrite that part anyway - there are no references to outside materials. Whether ours is called STRUCTURE or STRUCTURAL is immaterial (and in this case irrelevant anyway since it's completely internal to that creature :p)
Post by: WillowLuman on July 31, 2013, 02:56:29 pm
Post by: Halfling on July 31, 2013, 03:02:16 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 31, 2013, 03:03:54 pm
Honestly, thanks to the fact that we all use our own code at the end of our raws, and we all seem to be using separate files for our stuff, using the most recent raw set isn't even necessary. If you used an older version, your raw folder and the actual most recent raw folder could be merged and the stuff you didn't edit overwritten safely.
Post by: WillowLuman on July 31, 2013, 03:05:35 pm
I was using the link from someone's post a few pages ago, I must have mistaken it. It didn't have any of the alchemy stuff or new metals.
Post by: Halfling on July 31, 2013, 03:07:31 pm
However, in principle yes, if you're just building say, on my and BFEL's and Leibowitz's stuff, don't need Laula's or Sackhead's, then you could just use his raws pack, build your addition on it and if it's named according to the rules then it can just be plugged in to the newest version.
Sackhead did include alchemy. Mm... would actually be really good to have a list of all the new stuff that was included.
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 31, 2013, 03:19:36 pm
Uh...I'll fix that.
EDIT: Update the 7th, hopefully Update the Last, is now up. Duped raw has been eliminated. Sorry it took so long for me to fix that :)
Post by: sackhead on August 01, 2013, 12:55:43 am
Most recent version should be Sackhead's, uploaded on download-site-that-is-not-DFFD; most complete would be Sackhead's graphicalized raws plus my alchemy stuff, if he didn't add that in (my memory timeline is a bit vague; he may not have had the chance).yes your alchemy is in.
Honestly, thanks to the fact that we all use our own code at the end of our raws, and we all seem to be using separate files for our stuff, using the most recent raw set isn't even necessary. If you used an older version, your raw folder and the actual most recent raw folder could be merged and the stuff you didn't edit overwritten safely.
on bugfixes i will upload if anyone notices bugs.
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 01:21:15 am
Code: [Select]
[BP:RTENTACLE_ONE:first right arm:STP][GRASP][CON:BELL][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]Here's the attack I'm trying to give them (basically an enhanced version of the punch which halfling put in to start off with)
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:BLUDGEON_ATTACK_CLAM]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:BLUDGEON:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:ARM]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:bludgeon:bludgeons]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:5]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:400]and here's the errorlog which is generated every time I start up the arena:
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_clam.txt"
NETCH_CLAM:NETCH:Attack BLUDGEON seems to have correct format but could not find proper BPs in any caste, so not addedI know that it's basically saying it can't find anything to give the attack, but since I've tested it and the above limbs do indeed appear on the creatures I've being making when I spawn them into the arena, I can't work out what's wrong. Since you guys seem to be much better than me at this, I wondered if any of you might know what the problem is.
EDIT:fixed the code to how it currently looks. The problem was apparently not the hand/arm mismatch since I'm still getting the exact same error message. Any other ideas?
EDIT 2: Okay, I found the solution. Having been modding for all of one day, I didn't know you had to define the body used by a creature before you started giving them attacks. I probably should have thought of it sooner. Anyway, I'll probably be posting my civ of jellyfish before long.
Post by: Putnam on August 01, 2013, 01:39:28 am
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 02:02:38 am
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 01, 2013, 09:51:42 am
Post by: Poldon on August 01, 2013, 10:32:53 am
It's going to be a world very different from DF, a world wholly conflicting and yet in a strange sort of harmony. It's wacky, it's crazy, it'll treat you to powerful tools, amusing creatures and many new, interesting and horrible deaths. It's a great example of an idea gone very right, and man is it cool to look at. The origins, the hilarious bugs, the numerous ideas and implementations, it's a hotbed of creativity and variety that one world created by one person just could not achieve, especially since it is not limited by conventions of realism.
I for one really enjoy where this is going and am eager what else comes in and what is the final result, should it come to a conclusion. I also think that it might serve as an excellent example of what can be accomplished by modding the RAWs.
Keep up the fun, hilarity and FUN!
Post by: Gnorm on August 01, 2013, 10:56:38 am
-----
From the Journal of Gnorm
16th Limestone, 552
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2hrjsjd.png)
I traded today with my fellow halflings. I see now why they carry so much with them. The weight of all of the anvils I was trading with caused the merchant to complain about how how his animals couldn't carry the weight. This forced me to purchase heavier, more expensive goods. On top of that, he would continuously demand I gave him more anvils to pay for thousands more than what I owe. Those traders are just lucky that they're not hanging out with walking trees.
24th Limestone, 552
The cook that went mad over the lack of silk has finally screamed her self to death.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/28r1njc.jpg)
Her death was dishonorable; she shall be buried in a clay tunnel.
12th Sandstone, 552
The cook has been entombed in in a simple grave beneath the earth. It seems as if the days are going by without anything of moment to report.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2i296b5.png)
26th Sandstone, 552
Gods above! a monster!
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2csgb5k.png)
I've heard legends of these creatures, but never did I believe that I would actually meet one. A Man-eater is within range of Mastertea! The military must be mobilized immediately. I'll not stand to have my village destroyed!
28th Sandstone, 552
(http://i44.tinypic.com/r6xws4.png)
The diplomat was just killed. What a shame; he never gave me the export agreements.
1st Timber, 552
A soldier and a war dog have been killed. As unfortunate as this is, while the beast was distracted, one of our recruits surprised the beast and has it on the defensive.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2vbplk1.png)
2nd Timber, 552
(http://i44.tinypic.com/25qupav.png)
This brave soul is the one that dealt the killing blow on the beast. His bravery is a true testament to this town. I'll see to it that his deed is not forgotten.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2a64lrb.png)
Odds bodkins! not again!
Supplementary Entry
(http://i40.tinypic.com/219z9l4.png)
More migrants have arrived, and thank goodness they didn't arrive just a few days earlier.
The list is:
1 Animal Trainer
1 Bone Carver
1 Mason
1 Thresher
2 Bowyers
1 Potter
1 Wax Worker
The population is now up to 54 bodies.
13th Timber, 552
(http://i39.tinypic.com/zvsh1x.png)
This happens far too often these days.
14th Timber, 552
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2rcwt2s.png)
Good gods! the walking trees have returned. They seem awfully accepting of the fact that we practically maimed one of their own.
18th Timber, 552
I met today with the liaison; he seemed unconcerned about the recent attack and the dead former liaison.
23rd Timber, 552
What the hell is going on? In the distance I can see a great forest fire approaching our town! Where it came from I have no idea, but immediate measures must be taken!
(http://i43.tinypic.com/sg21ib.png)
26th Timber, 552
Everyone has taken shelter in the tunnels to avoid being burnt to a crisp. Everyone except the mason who refuses to leave the workshop. I feel sorry for him.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2uij76p.png)
27th Timber, 552
Miasma from the rotting tarnish stalk is getting everyone on edge, but it's better than burning to a crisp.
1st Moonstone, 552
The fire has stopped, and just in time for winter. I wonder how such a fire could have started; certainly it could not have been intentional.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2i6gt9e.png)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 11:26:16 am
Also, I may have to bugfix the alchemy stuff, as I forgot to mark the volatile incenses as "special", to prevent caravans from bringing them along. That might be the cause of the fire...
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 12:35:46 pm
If possible, please include an exact description of the fix and include a link so it doesn't take them forever to look for it.
Mine:
Urgent bugfix:
1. Fix anvil reaction to only give 1 anvil ever: in reaction_halfling.txt, in [REACTION:CAST_CRUDE_ANVIL_HLG], after [REAGENT line add [DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT] token
2. Fix the apple tree reaction inclusion not actually working (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4444948#msg4444948)
3. Fix treelords not bleeding any material -> bleeding molten skin (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4451054#msg4451054)
4. StL's suggestion about adding [SPECIAL] to alchemy materials (I assume he will post more detail)
Wishlist:
1. Wagons for trade caravans (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4416313;topicseen#msg4416313)
2. Remove summer from halfling active seasons (entity_halfling.txt) - my permission
(3. If someone else posts finished dirigible antilope raws or the new tarnish stalk scheme, those are on my wishlist too)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 12:57:08 pm
EDIT: Wagons added to body_simple_halfling and creature_halfling
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 01:52:37 pm
Kopout, I need the BLIMP_LAYERS_KPT body detail plan.
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 02:16:16 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Would it be alright if I included mine with limbs if you include yours without? I could make mine Gazeplin or somthing to avoid raw duplication problems
Post by: Poldon on August 01, 2013, 02:26:57 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 02:31:17 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 02:36:34 pm
Here ya go. I thought you were removing the limbs?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Would it be alright if I included mine with limbs if you include yours without? I could make mine Gazeplin or somthing to avoid raw duplication problems
Well, first I'm trying to get it to work. The raws I got were a bit messy, so after rearranging the body definition the only problem I have is with hooves.
Actually, anyone know why the game isn't recognizing kopout's body detail plans or tissue templates?
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 02:39:58 pm
sorry about the mess :(Here ya go. I thought you were removing the limbs?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Would it be alright if I included mine with limbs if you include yours without? I could make mine Gazeplin or somthing to avoid raw duplication problems
Well, first I'm trying to get it to work. The raws I got were a bit messy, so after rearranging the body definition the only problem I have is with hooves.
Quote
Actually, anyone know why the game isn't recognizing kopout's body detail plans or tissue templates?Gremlins!
(I have no idea, this is not even the strangest problem I ran into, just one of the few I couldn't solve)
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 02:44:27 pm
Here ya go. I thought you were removing the limbs?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Would it be alright if I included mine with limbs if you include yours without? I could make mine Gazeplin or somthing to avoid raw duplication problems
Well, first I'm trying to get it to work. The raws I got were a bit messy, so after rearranging the body definition the only problem I have is with hooves.
Actually, anyone know why the game isn't recognizing kopout's body detail plans or tissue templates?
Please post the complete content of raw files you're trying to use including headers. It's a little confusing otherwise at this point, you've been passing so many notes.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 02:53:40 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Tissue template
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Creature
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Error Log
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 03:10:39 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 03:27:55 pm
Also, if you're going to use the latter (or the former for that matter) then I would assume that it needs to come before you declare the layers, as now it comes after and it's probably like
"This is bone, this is muscle... (not listing hoof)
...use BONE for this and use HOOF for the hooves"
"ERROR: WHAT IS HOOF" -> error to log
"Oh and for HOOF use HOOF_TEMPLATE"
That error choked StL's vespids.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 03:41:25 pm
LIFT_GAS isn't working either, you'll note. I want to find the root of this problem, because not being able to specify tissues in b_detail_plan files is a huge problem.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 03:46:10 pm
4. StL's suggestion about adding [SPECIAL] to alchemy materials (I assume he will post more detail)
Well, the more detail is this: the incenses are made in a stable state. The burning reactions take the stable state (and a pipe) and output a "volatile" boulder of that incense, which has the syndrome attached, and explosively boils at a low temperature thanks to shenanigans with the MAT_FIXED_TEMP token and boiling point. I forgot to attach the [SPECIAL] token to that volatile material...which means caravans could theoretically bring boulders that explosively boil on arrival, gassing themselves with all sorts of lovely syndromes. That fixed temperature to make the volatile materials boil may have been the cause for the sudden forest fire that was experienced in the current play turn.
@HugoLuman: did you add the hoof material to the creature? Using the tissue template in the creature raws does not obviate the need for the material the template calls for.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 03:48:14 pm
And bear in mind it's not just hooves, it's the LIFT_GAS as well. Any non HLG tissue added by kopout's bdp's
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 03:53:06 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 04:04:55 pm
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 04:06:33 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 04:08:19 pm
Hmph. I am puzzled, then. It's probably a minor typo in the middle of a word somewhere, or a missing header on kopout's tissue template file, or something ridiculous like that, if my experience is anything to go by.
Precisely. On closer inspection tissue_template_kopout does not read [OBJECT:TISSUE_TEMPLATE] before defining any tissues. Said tissue templates therefore are not recognized. Fix that and set the body part of the creature to the more normal
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
and it gives no errors.
-- edit: you caught it in time, as I was typing :)
Sorry if I'm distracting from what you're talking about, but have you decided what's going to replace the adamantine yet? Because if not I think I may have an idea.
No. I did suggest this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4390548;topicseen#msg4390548) but it didn't catch on. What's your idea?
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 04:14:40 pm
Ah, there we go. The tissue template file was missing the header.head desk. I can't belive I mised that.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 04:15:31 pm
According to the slade article on the wiki, there are in fact methods for digging the undiggable. This would make getting to Hell a feat of engineering, and extremely worth the possibility of shadows being able to escape. Armok kind of slacked on his methods of containing the beasts of hell (copper picks are all that's needed? Really?); I think the GOD Committee can do better.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 04:21:53 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Not that you aren't allowed to do it some other way, it just may be easier :P
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 04:24:51 pm
Sorry if I'm distracting from what you're talking about, but have you decided what's going to replace the adamantine yet? Because if not I think I may have an idea.
No. I did suggest this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4390548;topicseen#msg4390548) but it didn't catch on. What's your idea?
I was just thinking that rather than making it another relatively generic "this metal has really good material attributes" version of adamantine, it would be nice to have an incentive to breach hell for some other reason (particularly since, let's be honest, there are probably going to be several supermetals in this mod by the time you're done). One idea I was having was that rather than the boulders dropped being workable into a metal, instead you could put in a reaction to convert the boulders into artifacts. I don't know how possible that is, but it seems like it should be so long as there is a way to control the quality of a product from a reaction. This property would be sufficiently unique to encourage breaching hell, particularly if there were some way to control which artifact you got back. I know that I, for one, would be pretty tempted by the lure of indestructible doors, unjammable mechanisms, full suits of artifact armor etc. But, as I say it's just an idea, you're running the show and should take it where you want. If you do like it, I'll start trying to find out if it's even possible. I'm not sure, but I think some of the reactions in Masterwork do something similar?
EDIT: Of course, that being said, I do also like Leibowitz's idea of making it entirely undiggable, just to make hell a bragging-rights reward as well as providing some utility. And I agree, what on earth was Armok thinking when he gave his uber-metal a weakness to copper? The only problem is that, so far as I know, the methods you're thinking of only work from the bottom up without some rather funky glitching. If we made the adamantine undiggable, then we'd have to go through SMR in order to get at the stuff (not that that's impossible at the moment)
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 04:29:28 pm
We should make the adamantine stuff fantasically, obscenely amazing for weapons, ridiculously valuable, absurdly dense, and completely undiggable.
According to the slade article on the wiki, there are in fact methods for digging the undiggable. This would make getting to Hell a feat of engineering, and extremely worth the possibility of shadows being able to escape. Armok kind of slacked on his methods of containing the beasts of hell (copper picks are all that's needed? Really?); I think the GOD Committee can do better.
But can you actually mine it in such a way as to make your way through it reliably? I don't understand it well enough, honestly. So I'm actually going to -1 that one unless it's guaranteed to work if done right (the difficulty doesn't matter), going to be super annoying to just be locked out of the "final boss" battle.
How about the more conservative solution: just digging that stone releases gas that turns the miner into a demon host that breaks into separate body parts that are then animated as demons and assault the fortress, leaving behind demon materials that can be forged into obscenely good items that are always on fire and hence only last for some months unless they are artifacts.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 04:40:02 pm
I was just thinking that rather than making it another relatively generic "this metal has really good material attributes" version of adamantine, it would be nice to have an incentive to breach hell for some other reason (particularly since, let's be honest, there are probably going to be several supermetals in this mod by the time you're done). One idea I was having was that rather than the boulders dropped being workable into a metal, instead you could put in a reaction to convert the boulders into artifacts. I don't know how possible that is, but it seems like it should be so long as there is a way to control the quality of a product from a reaction. This property would be sufficiently unique to encourage breaching hell, particularly if there were some way to control which artifact you got back. I know that I, for one, would be pretty tempted by the lure of indestructible doors, unjammable mechanisms, full suits of artifact armor etc. But, as I say it's just an idea, you're running the show and should take it where you want. If you do like it, I'll start trying to find out if it's even possible. I'm not sure, but I think some of the reactions in Masterwork do something similar?
Can't make a reaction make artifacts. With dfhack I'm sure it would be possible, but do we want to include that as the component? We may, it does improve the experience with all the bugfixes and so.
The "vanilla" way of doing such would be with syndromes, reactions and interactions. Some possibilities would be creating a set of "reward" items making which requires this material (such as a sword with contact area 1 and speed 9001, armor which covers everything possible and can be worn on top of anything, super-shield, incredibly valuable doodad, "purity seal" which sets paladinism fort-wide via a syndrome-interaction-combo or "cursed seal" which sets vampirism fort-wide similarly), setting a creature's attributes to something very desirable (4x creativity? Speed 1?) temporarily or permanently, body transformation... it can also be applied to other creatures by interactions (mining it increases your fort population's creativity by 10% for every stone mined).
I'm sure that if we agree it can have some great reward then you can come up with lots :P
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 04:45:06 pm
But can you actually mine it in such a way as to make your way through it reliably? I don't understand it well enough, honestly. So I'm actually going to -1 that one unless it's guaranteed to work if done right (the difficulty doesn't matter), going to be super annoying to just be locked out of the "final boss" battle.
How about the more conservative solution: just digging that stone releases gas that turns the miner into a demon host that breaks into separate body parts that are then animated as demons and assault the fortress, leaving behind demon materials that can be forged into obscenely good items that are always on fire and hence only last for some months unless they are artifacts.
Since spires to hell are hollow, aiming some kind of cave-in device at the top of a spire would break through, wouldn't it? If not, a brute force (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=128226.0) method of carving a new entrance to hell might be possible, though I've never tried that...ever.
And if my memory serves me well, spires have odd projections off the side, don't they? To chip off a chunk of one, you could erect some kind of scaffolding beneath it and carve upwards.
Also, we have no randomly generated creatures, so the "boss battle" of the clown car isn't a factor. The shadows are more properly Doomsday-bringers - plaguelike spreading through clawing attacks, nigh-indestructible without Celestium or supermetals - which is why they cannot fly.
Finally, after my Blazewood, I somehow doubt flaming items will be looked upon well by the halflings :)
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 04:50:38 pm
Can't make a reaction make artifacts.Well, blast. Still, the solution you suggested sounds like a good workaround. I was just thinking that having the material make items that were inherently superior to other items in terms of utility beyond "good at killing stuff" was a more interesting alternative to just having hax-stats, it doesn't really matter how we implement that, if we even decide to implement it at all. As for making the 'adamantine' undiggable... while it is ultimately up to you guys, I'm inclined to side with Halfling on this one. It would be a cool idea for a regular rock, like the jaded slade you have at the moment, but I don't think that digging down through undiggable rock works. Probably a different kind of threat needs to be suggested to keep people away from the 'adamantine'.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 04:55:26 pm
Post by: Dorsidwarf on August 01, 2013, 05:00:36 pm
That should make people cautious about breaching hell.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 05:07:58 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 01, 2013, 05:08:37 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 05:10:25 pm
EDIT: Also, similar to warpstone/coal dust, except the syndrome could be spread by those afflicted. A plague-bearing rock, to replace demons.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 05:12:13 pm
Perhaps release some sort of contagious disease, if we're going the syndrome route - random chance of one or more interaction-spreadable diseases, to be created by whomever cares to do so.
As it happens I have a mod to do exactly that if desired. Copying from it would still be treif but can take the idea...
Basically you want a syndrome that causes a creature to do two kinds of interactions: 1. add symptoms to itself and 2. spread the aforementioned syndrome to others. That way you have a propagating syndrome that adds symptoms (with desired time parameters). Make sure the syndrome does NOT keep spreading to creatures again and again but instead passes like a wave leaving a permanent flux of symptoms, creatures constantly spreading it to each other causes huge amounts of lag.
I personally think supernatural things like demons, angels and curses would be more appropriate when in the vicinity of hell though, diseases could rather be something that rats or animals can spread (or civilized creatures like migrants as in my mod).
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 05:18:24 pm
Possibly could go with other Horsemen references - Pestilence=some kind of virulent plague, Famine=wasting disease or a curse, War=adding OPPOSED_TO_LIFE and boosting strength, Death=turning victims into zombies that can turn others into zombies.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 05:20:42 pm
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 05:24:18 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 05:24:58 pm
I was just thinking that rather than making it another relatively generic "this metal has really good material attributes" version of adamantine, it would be nice to have an incentive to breach hell for some other reason (particularly since, let's be honest, there are probably going to be several supermetals in this mod by the time you're done). One idea I was having was that rather than the boulders dropped being workable into a metal, instead you could put in a reaction to convert the boulders into artifacts. I don't know how possible that is, but it seems like it should be so long as there is a way to control the quality of a product from a reaction. This property would be sufficiently unique to encourage breaching hell, particularly if there were some way to control which artifact you got back. I know that I, for one, would be pretty tempted by the lure of indestructible doors, unjammable mechanisms, full suits of artifact armor etc. But, as I say it's just an idea, you're running the show and should take it where you want. If you do like it, I'll start trying to find out if it's even possible. I'm not sure, but I think some of the reactions in Masterwork do something similar?
Can't make a reaction make artifacts. With dfhack I'm sure it would be possible, but do we want to include that as the component? We may, it does improve the experience with all the bugfixes and so.
The "vanilla" way of doing such would be with syndromes, reactions and interactions. Some possibilities would be creating a set of "reward" items making which requires this material (such as a sword with contact area 1 and speed 9001, armor which covers everything possible and can be worn on top of anything, super-shield, incredibly valuable doodad, "purity seal" which sets paladinism fort-wide via a syndrome-interaction-combo or "cursed seal" which sets vampirism fort-wide similarly), setting a creature's attributes to something very desirable (4x creativity? Speed 1?) temporarily or permanently, body transformation... it can also be applied to other creatures by interactions (mining it increases your fort population's creativity by 10% for every stone mined).
I'm sure that if we agree it can have some great reward then you can come up with lots :P
I'm sorry, but making the Adamantine-like material undiggable is COMPLETELY POINTLESS.
Why? Because the hardcoded Semi-molten Rock is already undiggable, and requires the engineering method to dig through. Digging through the special hollow tube veins isn't exactly a cheat, because getting through that way spawns dozens/hundreds of hell denizens directly underneath.
We don't need a gas to transform the miner into a horde of demons, because a horde of demons invades by default when you breach Hell. We don't have any RCP demons, but we do have assimilating shades.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 05:28:03 pm
Having the rock turn the victim into Death Himself would probably be cooler if the syndrome didn't affect everyone in range :) Having numerous copies of Death galloping about might be a tad more inconvenient than a clown car.
I'm sorry, but making the Adamantine-like material undiggable is COMPLETELY POINTLESS.
Why? Because the hardcoded Semi-molten Rock is already undiggable, and requires the engineering method to dig through. Digging through the special hollow tube veins isn't exactly a cheat, because getting through that way spawns dozens/hundreds of hell denizens directly underneath.
We don't need a gas to transform the miner into a horde of demons, because a horde of demons invades by default when you breach Hell. We don't have any RCP demons, but we do have assimilating shades.
There are no random demons, and those are the only thing that appears in the clown car. The shadows will only wander in from the map edge after the fact. We need something else to make breaching Hell challenging and fun - like undiggable spires that require halfling ingenuity to crack open, or spire-stone that unleashes the Horsemen on the hamlet.
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 05:33:45 pm
Mm... generally when you are unable to do something by the normal workflow (materials and templates -> plans -> creatures) then the smarter thing to do is probably look for an error somewhere in the previous step rather than try to come up with hacks to make it work regardless e.g. start defining tissues inside creatures, because we do know the "normal" way works if everything goes correctly.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Not that you aren't allowed to do it some other way, it just may be easier :P
I looked for errors, a lot! I just didn't find the error. Though in my defence encounter problem-> look for solution-> find none-> invent ridiculously over complicated workaround is more dwarfy :P
Edit: you could make it so the the stone makes your miners into statues made out of it. OR, they get turned into things that can turn other halflings into tube stone. A kind of "you brake it you become the replacement" deal. Or even [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE] monstrosities that turn the corpses of their victumes into more of them selves and produce a bar of uber-metal when killed.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 05:35:12 pm
>We don't need a gas to transform the miner into a horde of demons
Oh, but then, we don't really NEED magma traps and lethal giant bee swarms, do we?
Srsly though I believe the shades don't invade your fort due to not being randomly generated, it was discussed earlier. RCP can be enabled as soon as we have alternative RCP stuff though, why not. It'll require switching to a custom .exe/binary though (and using that Russian program to edit the Windows version), or for linux, alternatively and preferably providing a script that edits your DF binary to use the new stuff.
Having the rock turn the victim into Death Himself would probably be cooler if the syndrome didn't affect everyone in range :) Having numerous copies of Death galloping about might be a tad more inconvenient than a clown car.
No no. It would make a random demon. You'd have Death, Famine and Pestilence...
Also how often do you have several people mining DEEP_SPECIALs? But if it's a legit concern there should be only one it's just a matter of syndrome writing. Make the syndrome cause a random delay in how soon you can do a TARGETING interaction targeting one creature (can be self), then the creature targeted by TARGETING immediately disables the syndrome from all others and then transforms.
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 05:46:00 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 05:48:04 pm
You wouldn't have to have several people mining, just several in proximity - say, one mining and a few running down to fetch the mined stone or something, though I guess if it's just going to explode into gas that may not be as much of an issue. Or a player unfamiliar with what we've done to Hell could have the army standing by when the mining starts. Any number of scenarios.
The idea of an interaction solution didn't really occur to me, though that could work, I suppose. Have I mentioned how interactions and I don't really get along well? :)
@TheClam
The horsemen-demon-transformations and special-material-tissue ideas aren't necessarily mutually exclusive. Halfling becomes Death demon -> Kill death-demon -> Harvest bones for material. Or something.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 05:54:25 pm
What I mean about turning a miner into an army of demons is that we already have assimilating demons in hell. Doing that makes the Shades we already have a bit pointless. Why not just turn the cluster size on the Shades WAY up and have them drop the awesome reagents?
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 05:56:37 pm
This whole "four horsemen" thing does sound very interesting. I still like the idea of the material you would otherwise get straight from the colums actually being from the tissues in the demons produced by the spire. Perhaps there is a way to be more subtle about this, though. Have the first person infected hang around for a while with the interaction infecting other people, then at some (preferably as unpredictable as possible) point after you mined the first piece of the spire, everybody who got infected turns at once and all hell breaks loose. That sounds to me like some serious high-level !!FUN!!
Entirely possible.
Draft of what's needed all in all:
Digging the special stone causes a burst of gas causing syndrome 0
Syndrome 0: 5% prob of able to do interaction 0 starting at 0 phases, 10% able to do interaction 0 at 100 phases, etc... ending at 2100 phases
Interaction 0: add supernatural to self and all others for 2100 phases, target cannot have supernatural, add to self syndrome 1
Syndrome 1: adds a recognizable set of tokens, can do interaction 1 starting at 1200 phases, can do interaction 2 starting at 0 phases, can do interaction 2 starting at 12000 phases
Interaction 1: spread syndrome 1 (free action, touch, delay 3600 phases)
Interaction 2: spread syndrome 2 (self only), target requires: mischievous
Syndrome 2: body transformation into <DEMON>
Interaction 2: targets all affected by syndrome 1 (identified by tokens) anywhere on the map, adds mischievous
Result:
* Unless you're very unlucky (.25% chance for >1) only one person is infected regardless of how many are affected by burst of gas; the initial infection time varies by 2100 phases based on luck
* After 1 day and then every 3 days, any infected creature infects another creature (leading to, optimally, something like 10+3+2+2+2+1+1+1+1=23 infected total during countdown)
* After 10 days, all infected transform immediately into demons
Since I already have lots of syndrome and interaction related raws, those being my modding focus before this, making the above framework would take me barely any time at all I should think. Just need the material and creatures.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 05:59:02 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 06:06:39 pm
-Make a [DEEP_SPECIAL] material that's undiggable but has no syndromes or special effects. It's just an obstacle.
-Now the only way into Hell is by using engineering to dig through the magma sea and Semi-molten rock.
-Turn the [CLUSTER_SIZE] on the Shades up to the hundreds
-Make Shades drop an item that can be converted to 1 bar of the Amazing Material.
Benefits:
-People have to actually go into hell and set up defenses there if they want the special material, because the Shades don't path to the fort automatically.
-Shades likely WILL path into the fort if defenses fail
-Shades don't actually have to kill to swell their ranks, just inject once.
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 06:10:45 pm
It's like some kind of horrible, delayed clown car.I think that's the point.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 06:16:38 pm
For extra awesome, demons could still initially be demon hosts that split into 5-10 demonlings and 1 demon overlord for the true doom experience. Although there is such a thing as going too far with stuff like this when we just a little earlier agreed that the world largely needs something that doesn't try to kill you.
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 06:26:30 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 06:30:36 pm
And we already have something in Hell, Shades, so why not work with what we have? Why make a whole new set of demons that eliminates any purpose for the Shades to exist?
Look, if Demons spawn from infected fortress denizens who have mined the [DEEP_SPECIAL], then HELL ITSELF IS POINTLESS. People wouldn't have to actually go into hell to get the demon material. Whereas, if the demon material came from the Shades, people would have to build constructions to get into Hell (risking their civillian workers and them leading the Shades back to the fort as they flee), and would have to bring people into harm's way to get the Shades' attention at all. It thus be considerably more difficult and riskier to try strategies such as dropping the ceiling on them, as you'd either have to make your own ceiling or lure an army of Shades all the way up into the fort.
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 06:36:46 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 06:38:11 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:DIRIGIBLE_ANTELOPE_TELESCOPIC]
[COPY_TAGS_FROM:DIRIGIBLE_ANTELOPE]
[NAME:telescopic dirigible antelope:telescopic dirigible antelopes:telescopic dirigible antelope]
[CASTE_NAME:telescopic dirigible antelope:telescopic dirigible antelopes:telescopic dirigible antelope]
[DESCRIPTION:Close cousin of the Dirigible Antelope. It has a telescopic neck for browsing on grass from the air.]
[RETRACT_INTO_BP:BY_CATEGORY:GAS_SACK:ALL]
[CREATURE_TILE:'D'][COLOR:6:0:0]
[PREFSTRING:stretchy necks]
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 06:40:51 pm
It's not a matter of resources as we're not working on the clock. If something inspires people then it will happen and if not, then not, so, just throwing ideas about and seeing what sticks is best, rather than announcing official goals.
Speaking of, incidentally, does anyone know whether friendly body parts that you resurrect (not animate) would be part of your civilization, or know the right keywords for finding it on the modding forum?
Because...
Spoiler: Formics on steroids (click to show/hide)
For the dirigibles, making the bladder material liquid and a contact poison should make it affect the creature reliably as creatures do get covered in their own blood. It could emit puffs as part of the syndrome (material emission)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 06:53:52 pm
Speaking of Hell, the problem with having assimilating monsters born from mining the spires is that the Shades are already assimilating monsters. It's still a bit redundant if you have both and just make the Spire monsters drop somewhat inferior material.
Post by: Halfling on August 01, 2013, 07:00:37 pm
Antelope: I like them as they are, though. They leak gas until they don't have enough to fly (since the tissue has [FLIGHT]), then plummet to the ground and keep leaking until they run out. It's funny as hell. I might instead give them a USAGE_HINT:FLEE interaction that boosts their speed when they flee (after someone attacks them), but right now I'll work on other stuff.
True. Definitely a DF from Scratch success story. :P
(I was able to harvest the body needed from earlier in the thread and test them)
Speaking of Hell, the problem with having assimilating monsters born from mining the spires is that the Shades are already assimilating monsters. It's still a bit redundant if you have both and just make the Spire monsters drop somewhat inferior material.
Different assimilations. Stone turning creature into a one time demon boss you have to face before hell != demon that turns others into similar demons (that resides in hell). Still, my offer is to make the interactions but not the creature necessarily as I'm not that inspired yet, so it could be anything, from a balrog to a succubus.
Incidentally I should think it's also possible with some interaction hacks to make it so that you only face ONE demon boss (that your miner turns into, or even one that splits from your miner while the miner escapes with some extra hoops again involving spawn creatures) ONCE after you mine the special stuff, and it doesn't happen again after that. Basically you make the interaction affect the entire fortress and immunize them to it while at the same time only transforming one person.
Post by: TheClam on August 01, 2013, 07:03:16 pm
Speaking of Hell, the problem with having assimilating monsters born from mining the spires is that the Shades are already assimilating monsters. It's still a bit redundant if you have both and just make the Spire monsters drop somewhat inferior material.
Looks like Halfling ninja'd me, but I'll make my point anyway.
I see your point, but I do think that the problems presented by each scenario are different enough to make it interesting even were we to have both. The shades assimilate you on contact, necessitating a careful approach, lots of planning and fortifications in order to retrieve their material with maximum efficiency. You know that if they get in close, you're going to have to quarantine off an entire section of the populace, and you need to plan extremely carefully if you're trying to actually conquer hell. By contrast, the "delayed clown car" is specifically meant to be unpredictable- or at least that's what I was getting out of it. You don't know which of the miners is infected unless you only have one miner, there is no real way to tell who they've given the syndrome too, there is really only so much planning you can do for it. While the concepts are both that of "assimilating monster", I think that if we pull it off well we can get two very distinct and fun challenges out of it. The shades would require extreme care and planning, while if you choose to go for the really endgame stuff in the spires, you have to take it as it comes and react to it, because you don't know exactly what is going to happen except that it's going to involve copious amounts of !!FUN!!
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 07:20:58 pm
Antelope: I like them as they are, though. They leak gas until they don't have enough to fly (since the tissue has [FLIGHT]), then plummet to the ground and keep leaking until they run out. It's funny as hell. I might instead give them a USAGE_HINT:FLEE interaction that boosts their speed when they flee (after someone attacks them), but right now I'll work on other stuff.They also have a tendency to burst into flame near magma. (well if the gas bag is punctured)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 07:39:28 pm
To dig through undiggable stuff from below, you need to dig (not construct) an upward ramp below it, which requires a diggable tile of natural stone wall directly beneath the undiggable layer in question. Since there is only empty space directly underneath the bottom of spires, and you can't dig through constructions, and you wouldn't be able to cast obsidian with no head room, you would not be able to dig them from beneath.
The only way you'd be able to access material from the Spires is if you make them diggable, or if you get a rare circumstance to do the channel glitch on them from above. Therefore, making them the ultimate endgame, rather than Hell itself, doesn't make much sense.
@TheClam: The Shades seem to Assimilate through a poison inject attack, so fully armored warriors wouldn't likely be assimilated, the Shades would have to slowly beat them down instead. If they got at the civilian population, though, then your fort would quickly become Shades.
Post by: Gnorm on August 01, 2013, 08:34:37 pm
-----
From the Journal of Gnorm:
9th Moonstone, 552
(http://i39.tinypic.com/sgl2kn.png)
Traded for the last time of this year today. Now that our town is a bit more self-sufficient, I find myself spending less and less at the depot.
27th Moonstone, 552
The mason has been stricken with the same sort of madness as the cook had before she died. I'll prepare a casket for him.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/25ftvsm.png)
28th Moonstone, 552
(http://i39.tinypic.com/10fstj7.png)
Today I looked over the iridium statue that I ordered as a centerpiece for the lobby of our future town hall. I believe that it shall do nicely.
12th Opal, 552
The river has once again frozen over. If last year was any indication, though, it shall be a thawed in a week.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/xp8sp5.png)
19th Opal, 552
The soldier that died in the fight against the Man-eater has finally been put to rest. I fear that these caverns shall be full of chambers such as this many years from now.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2093e4k.png)
20th Opal, 552
Our leatherworker has given birth to twins: Blade Zealousblue and Elder Tundrachief.
22nd Opal, 552
Our woodcutter has also been blessed with twins: Darling Appletreevole and Lord Brewedsteward.
25th Opal, 552
Our stone crafter has given birth to triplets. She is now a mother of six!
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2hh2fyp.png)
20th Moonstone, 552
(http://i42.tinypic.com/20s9455.png)
I had forgotten that the atlas mentioned spider-centaurs within range. A worker spotted a thief trying to reach our stockpiles.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/15zp3jp.png)
Fortunately, our men were ready to show it how we handle thieves in Mastertea!
21st Moonstone, 552
(http://i39.tinypic.com/34i6cqx.png)
My word! not another one!
Supplementary Entry
Good gods! now there are four of them running about!
23rd Obsidian, 552
One thief lies dead. Her companions, all wounded and gone without any stolen goods. Our mad mason has finally died.
24th Obsidian, 552
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2hhkpop.png)
Huzzah! the great lobby of our town hall is finally finished. Now we may socialize with a roof over our heads.
28th Obsidian, 552
This shall be my last entry for this year. We have had decent progression this year. Our militia is growing, our industry is expanding, and buildings are growing. We have faced and destroyed a mighty foe, and we have shown a new enemy that we will not come quietly. Next year, will will triumph.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2czcbhz.png)
Copy of the 552 Mayoral Report:
(http://i41.tinypic.com/16m0xoh.png)
Post by: Aseaheru on August 01, 2013, 08:48:35 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 08:53:41 pm
Code: [Select]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_MANTLE]
[BP:MANTLE:mantle:STP][UPPERBODY][CATEGORY:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1200]
[BP:HEART:heart:STP][CON:TORSO][CIRCULATION][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:HEART]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:LUNGS:respiratory sack:NP][CON:TORSO][BREATHE][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:LUNG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:GUT:digestive tract:NP][CON:TORSO][GUTS][INTERNAL][UNDER_PRESSURE][SMALL][CATEGORY:GUT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:300]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_8ARMS]
[BP:LBASE1:first arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE2:second arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE3:third arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE4:fourth arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE1:fifth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE2:sixth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE3:seventh arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE4:eight arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LARM1:first arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM2:second arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM3:third arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM4:fourth arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM1:fifth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM2:sixth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM3:seventh arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM4:eighth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
Post by: Gnorm on August 01, 2013, 08:54:27 pm
Whys the ground all red?After the great fire, all the remained was red sand.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 01, 2013, 08:59:28 pm
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 09:11:24 pm
Post by: tahujdt on August 01, 2013, 09:16:10 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 01, 2013, 09:17:05 pm
Large apple wood gems? is that a longer name that got cut off or is the game making gems out of apple wood now?These occurred when I ordered wood crafts. Likely a glitch.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 09:18:12 pm
Also, yay Spider-Centaur thieves work! My monstrosities LIVE!
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 09:29:32 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 01, 2013, 09:47:39 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 01, 2013, 09:51:54 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
They were originally going to exist and eat halflings, but I decided that, as water insects can easily kill an entire city of halflings, I wouldn't complete them. I figured I might as well make their image into the game.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 01, 2013, 10:12:09 pm
It's like some kind of horrible, delayed clown car.I think that's the point.
Still not as delayed as something I'm adding. You have to wait 3 months to find out the results.
Post by: Putnam on August 01, 2013, 10:53:45 pm
Code: [Select][COLOR:86:163:205]
You mean 6:3:1 (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Color#Modding_color) (yellow with cyan background)? :P
Post by: WillowLuman on August 01, 2013, 11:19:57 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on August 01, 2013, 11:33:46 pm
I'd like to review this project for DFBT, my podcast. Anything special I should include?Woo! We're being mentioned in a podcast!
I really have no idea what stuff you would want to know, though.
On a modding note, I simply lack the time to do any work on my tarnish stalks.
As much as I like them, and as possessive as I am over them, I haven't wanted to have someone else do any work on them but me, but I don't really have much of a choice, so I'll explain how I was meaning to make them so that someone with more time than myself can get them to my vision of completion.
The way I want them to work is that when they are "processed" by reaction, you will get a tarnish stalk shaft, and tarnish root or 2, some tarnish fronds, and a tarnish bulb.
The shaft is the edible/brewable part, the root is the seed, obviously, the fronds are turned into the thread or tobacco, and the bulb can be pressed (like rock nuts) into oil and a press cake. The oil could be made into soap (Tarnish soap! Muahahaha! I was hoping to keep this plan a secret until I actually made this.) and the press cake could be... I don't know, used for something.
Spoiler: Here is a picture of a tarnish stalk (click to show/hide)
Thanks to whoever can do this for me, it pains me that I can't so it myself.
Post by: kopout on August 01, 2013, 11:44:34 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on August 01, 2013, 11:52:56 pm
I thought you smoke the whole thing, otherwise how do you get charcoal instead of just ash?Actually, that's a good point.
Smoke the whole cigar.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 02, 2013, 12:13:04 am
-little landbound ones that scavenge fallen fruit and carrion, found pretty much everywhere non-freezing.
-big stocky landbound ones, filling a buffalo niche, found in grass and shrubland
-big armored ones that live in temperate forests and taiga
-medium sized ones with shells that live in tropical forests
-all kinds of amphibious and aquatic ones.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 02, 2013, 12:15:23 am
Post by: kopout on August 02, 2013, 12:18:58 am
So, the better part of the wildlife will be invertebrates, and have more than four limbs. This sounds like a world I want to live in :DI think you are very strange :P
Post by: Gnorm on August 02, 2013, 12:59:09 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 02, 2013, 01:03:48 am
Also, that is a properly impressive name for a monster.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 02, 2013, 01:35:10 am
Post by: Orange Wizard on August 02, 2013, 01:49:47 am
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 03:20:38 am
It bothers me that a commonly found giant spider is 10x more deadly than our Megabeast.
10x? It's not though. Put them in the arena and try it out, storm dragon wins against anything in the game that exists at this point that I cared to test and mops the floor with the average theraphosa. This is more like one of those cases where a stray cat kills x. If we take every such report as cause to give mad buffs to things we'll end up with things that are completely undefeatable in combat.
That said when they were created the world was very different. Wasn't full of giant spiders for one thing. Now when we have new megabeasts people will be like, whew, it's only a storm dragon and not a HugoBeast. But that's fine. These were intended to be the "vanilla" megabeast, like a vanilla hydra, among many more exotic ones.
Oh btw, who was it that suggested that everyone should add one "signature" megabeast during their turn? Because that was a pretty cool idea. I'm sure they could be added retroactively.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 02, 2013, 03:26:54 am
When creating creatures, we should probably use the Storm Dragon as a watermark. If it can beat the dragon in a fight relatively often, then it probably shouldn't be a roving animal (except maybe in the Caverns or an Evil Savage region)
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 03:35:26 am
I'd like to review this project for DFBT, my podcast. Anything special I should include?
It started as a peaceful fantasy world with halflings and some hounds and ducks; then, successive contributions made it full of giant bees and tarantulas and otherwise 90% giant insects, with poisonous edible flora and alcohol hangovers. Definitely cover the dirigible antelope and land whales if they're done at that time. That is the story here. Then add whichever of the other things/plans you feel like is more awesome/absurd.
I personally feel though that one of the coolest things was the ability to do some things "right" silently in the background by re-making the templates, like more sensible creature organization, connecting knees, necks with major arteries, brain cases that protect the brain, pecking birds, humanoids don't latch and shake things around and their punches are more powerful while animals do and their bites are more powerful, properly named body parts and so on. At least I and StL paid a lot of attention to this (I'm not saying others didn't, just didn't study the work enough to confirm yet). My plan to add useful new colors, replacing and merging useless old ones like bright magenta, would be an extension of this I feel but didn't get that much interest (and maybe it shouldn't as it's not finished yet).
Post by: sackhead on August 02, 2013, 04:57:58 am
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 06:42:38 am
1. Implement bugfixes for bugs that have been found (I collected some for you here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4455187#msg4455187) and asked others to post, but I don't think anyone else did)
2. Make your signature megabeast and pack it with the new raws
3. Upload this updated version - I'll link it to first post
Two birds, one stone :P
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 08:54:20 am
However...
How about splitting it into 3 leather types to make creature origin make more difference?
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
To implement:
1. Add the two extra leather types to a new material templates file
2. To any creature that should have improved leather, after adding core materials add
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:LEATHER:SPECIAL_LEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG] ## leather is 2x more valuable than usual and as strong as bone
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:LEATHER:ELITE_LEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG] ## leather is brightly colored, 3x more valuable than usual and as strong as meteoric iron
Edit: more semi-necessary types:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
FIREIMMUNE_LEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG : red, 2x value, does not take heat damage below 100000U, "fireproof leather"
COLDIMMUNE_LEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG : 2x value, does not take cold damage above 0U, "warm leather"
FIXEDTEMP_LEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG : blue, 3x value, above attributes and temperature fixed at 10001, "cold leather"
LIGHT_LEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG : grey, 2x value, almost weightless, "arcane leather"
Edit2, one more:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
SPECIALREWARD_DONTOVERUSE_LEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG: 10x value, white, meteoric iron strength, weightless, fire-and coldimmune, fixed temp at 10030, "legendary leather"
Post by: tahujdt on August 02, 2013, 10:10:59 am
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 11:18:59 am
I finished the podcast, you can find it here (http://www.spreaker.com/user/5712525/s1e3f). I hope I can review this project in a lot more detail later.
Welcome anytime.
Still playing in Mastertea, even though the play-session is over. Ran into a storm dragon recently, and I took some screenshots.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Oh, forgot... I'll add these extended installments to the first post too. If the saga of Mastertea continues, there's no reason why it should not be read. The 2 years rule was there to ensure a minimum amount of play a turn should get, not to dictate a maximum :)
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 02, 2013, 02:34:50 pm
Post by: kopout on August 02, 2013, 02:50:26 pm
if you survived I hope you keep playing, this sounds like !!FUN!!
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 02, 2013, 04:19:09 pm
I think the first item that was on fire was a tarnish stalk cloth seed bag full of numwort or stinkweed seeds; there might have been a few other things that spontaneously combusted. There was no wildlife around, and it was on a snow-covered mountain slope. It is extremely unlikely that it was caused by the lava. Reclaiming on the location, the gear didn't combust.
Spoiler: Embark (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 04:24:35 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 02, 2013, 05:03:45 pm
I somehow doubt this spontaneous combustion is caused by alchemy stuff now, though, as it appears I used a different method for explosive boiling in my raws - the volatile incense just boils at below absolute zero. No FIXED_MAT_TEMP monkeying performed ??? If this fixes that, then I guess having something boil at embark just tricks the game into pyromaniac mode :-\
Something funny appears to be going on here. A tarnish stalk cloth bag, you say, Lost in Nowhere? Mastahcheese, have you snuck in any new tarnish stalk effects that could cause this?
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 05:52:55 pm
Actually it may cause stuff to freeze to death because material that vaporizes is set to boiling point temperature... so incense vapor should have a temperature approximately at 1000U, in our units, 9000 F below the freezing point of water, at -5000 C (compare to absolute zero at -273.15 C), which is somewhat cold.
However, some of your things cause creatures to be able to set things on fire. Could that be it?
Here's some fixed raws:
1. Implemented fix above, and renamed incorrectly named materials (_STABLE -> _STABLE_STL etc)
Spoiler: reaction_alchemy_STL.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: inorganic_alchemy_STL.txt (click to show/hide)
2. Took the liberty of making the boiling material have a more sensible temperature of 10100 (slightly hot rather than extremely cold)
Spoiler: material_template_alchemy_STL.txt (click to show/hide)
Please implement these asap so we can know if they were the problem.
Post by: Halfling on August 02, 2013, 06:07:51 pm
Spoiler: material_template_leather_types_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
If that goes in then I would like man-eaters to yield tier 2 "special" leather and storm dragons to yield tier 3 "elite" leather. Creature file with the added 2 lines doing so:
Spoiler: creature_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Tested, can just plug in. Note that you don't need to change my original leather template, this just adds the new leather options in another file.
I like the idea of killing semi/megabeasts giving you somewhat worthwhile special resources and not just meat, I like the idea of making more professions useful (leatherworking in this case), and this is a pretty simple way to do both.
Edit: and if it's not too much trouble, here's leather "armor" so halflings can actually use this meaningfully, making them able to benefit from if they can obtain very good leather...
Spoiler: item_new_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Halfling entity changed to use them, again copy-and-pasteable:
Spoiler: entity_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Yeah, this is stuff I should probably have made earlier, but can't always think of everything. I think it'll add to the game.
Finaledit: Nice.
(http://s18.postimg.org/7gi2czf7d/inventory.png)
(went and edited gloves and boots a bit more after this - halflings shouldn't wear them by default (they qualify as armor) but can commonly make gloves and uncommonly make tall boots that cover the legs for combat)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 02, 2013, 09:01:43 pm
I seriously doubt the fireball vigor could be causing these spontaneous combustions. The potion itself is about as inert as normal alcohol; only when drunk does it become related to fireballs.
EDIT: Okay, updated alchemy raws uploaded (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7854)! Download and overwrite/merge as needed.
Post by: mastahcheese on August 03, 2013, 12:51:23 am
Post by: Gnorm on August 03, 2013, 02:16:21 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 03, 2013, 02:38:35 am
The "mega" part of this is that the nomads will only visit after your fortress recovers itself a little in worth, but it'll steal pretty much everything, over and over again. Other than the gnome cages (wood), their clothing and the meat their pack-beasts might bring, they drop nothing of value. Plus, kidnapped babies might come back all grown up as nomads themselves. They're not dangerous, just annoying and maybe also fun.
Post by: The Urist on August 03, 2013, 03:05:04 am
Post by: Dorsidwarf on August 03, 2013, 03:29:19 am
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 05:46:56 am
(http://s24.postimg.org/kag7b4kyd/xeno1.png)
(http://s24.postimg.org/ng0t1c3kl/xeno2.png)
(http://s24.postimg.org/nikoo6785/xeno3.png)
(http://s24.postimg.org/uab3r0w7p/xeno4.png)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 03, 2013, 07:35:10 am
I just started up a new fortress, with the Formics - but I couldnt make any shovels. I spent the entire year deforesting and building overground houses, and was forced to steal all of the caravans stuff because i desperately needed the pick they were hanging on to.
Formics don't make shovels. They forge picks instead; find some metal to get new ones. On an ignorable playstyle note, formics are sort of antlike, so underground hives for them are justified :)
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 08:36:27 am
Sadly I discovered on my own and then found out Meph had tried it earlier: while my queen can spawn-resurrect "friendly" creatures to join your fort, these won't actually be fortress members. So Xenomorph Fortress is kind of hard because the economy I'm planning on depends entirely on constantly having massive amounts of drones, because getting work done actively sacrifices them. As you can't actually control your larva that I was planning you would use workshops and "overlord" creatures to transform into drones, this is impossible.
However, apparently intelligent appropriate-creature offspring of friendlies will join your fort. So I'm thinking...
Queen spawns a very large "queen's court" of friendly female and male larva (it is recommended to keep them indoors) that give birth to drones in massive numbers. (drones can then be converted into resources, into "goo" on the map that hinders enemies, into more useful creatures that can do actual work, etc).
Anyone know that this wouldn't work?
Post by: Meph on August 03, 2013, 09:14:21 am
You can do that easily. Have your normal workers, larvae, male. Pop-ratio:999999. make a cheap workshop with a free reactions to transform one larva into the queen. Queen is female, has litter-size 10-20 (or whatever you like), only female in fort. Queen has interaction that targets all civ-members and gives a syndrome class that blocks the reaction to make a queen. That way you can only have one queen at a time. (i use this for my black/white mages).
You now have a breeding queen and a lot of larvae. Now make workshops that have reactions using truetransform to mutate these larvae into bigger, more interesting creatures. Maybe some breeders as well, female, littersize 1-5, or a immobile male caste that has a ranged material interaction.
You can also give larvae (or any other castes) a timed interaction that transforms them into a stronger version, so every year for 5 years or so they upgrade on their own.
All castes would have a pop-ratio of 1, except the larva. So (almost) all born creatures are larvae.
What do you think? Alien/Zerg Fortress coming up?
EDIT: Now that I wrote all this... you know what? I'll put that into my todo list as a playable race for Masterwork. The idea is too good to pass up, because the gameplay mechanics are fundamentally different from vanilla DF.
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 09:18:41 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I may take up that timed interaction, except actually make it make higher tier creatures die after a while so you have to keep making new ones. I can't work on it right now (going somewhere in 10 minutes) but it shouldn't take that long and is pretty cool, so maybe this weekend.
Oh, megabonusfeature: "despoiler" (is there really a point to renaming these when it's so obvious they're zerg :P) can convert civilized races into infested variants. Infested halfling... now should it explode or just have tentacles?
If you remember it was reported that friendly, uncontrollable larva that you would just have there in your queen's den could spawn civ members for you (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=106301.15), which is more cool than just the queen being pregnant all the time and then once per year giving birth to 100 drones, but needs re-testing.
Mm...
Some extra notes:
- Could actually make the queen do a job at the hatchery to spawn more larva so you can control the number of offspring, so you don't get in a situation where you just have to kill stuff off to not drown in drones
- To make sure there's only one queen even if fancy tricks are used, if a syndrome-gas-transformation is used, could use the random number gen system of making them transform at a random time with PROBs and the first to transform disables the ability from others
Post by: Meph on August 03, 2013, 10:21:33 am
I dont quite know why you want to do creep... it only works if civ members walk barefoot on it, and I'd assume that they have some sort of clothing, even if it is called "chitinous plating" or something, because otherwise you get tantrums from "emberassed to be naked" thoughts. Even "creep covering" as clothing would work, with itemsyndrome it can get the speed bonus, and it degrades just like clothing, getting tattered and worn.
Dont know how feasable no diggin/no woodcutting is, because you have very little surface space, making hive/fortress design very difficult, and rather boring. In general I'd say that an underground hive would be very fitting, lore-wise... and of course they have access to vanilla DF buildings and reactions, no way to change that. But without access to the caverns and magma and candyland its quite a short game till you are maxed out.
I wouldnt make higher-tier units die after a while, I wouldnt like to play with it, but thats just personal preference.
And yes, I remember making units from this... I use it in MasterworkDF as well, look at the raws for "Broodmother". A drow pet, pop-ratio 1, gives birth to broodling, pop-ratio 100000, broodling has a secretion that affects itself with a transformation, transforms in the dwarven caste of slave, pop-ratio 1. They can do basic tasks, but they need to be a historical figure (killing something, making a masterwork or artefact) before you can make them nobles or put them in the military.
PS: Hundrets of throwaway drones causes tantruming. I made the kobolds in masterwork rely on throwaway military as well, and made them tantrum resistant. You can have a look at their personality values if you like. creature_kobold_camp.txt.
EDIT2: Oh, and have a look at the custom ZOMBIE creature in creature_masterwork.txt, it constantly emits stale blood. When they walk somewhere you have a bloodtrail following them... could be used for the creep... even if so many contaminants will hurt FPS afte a while.
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 10:35:13 am
I should think surface only fort is a nice way to break from tradition. You have limitless organic blocks for building. Or embark on a cave. If you can just mine, why not play normally? But I guess could add an expensive short lived burrower :P
Covering the surface, trees and all in homogenous creep is just cool. I wasn't planning on having them wear much, just optional armor. Instead make them emotionless. Zerg shouldn't care about shoes.
Post by: Meph on August 03, 2013, 11:47:19 am
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 02:47:44 pm
An egg connector between the eggs and abdomen is made of a material that vaporizes immediately. This needs to happen at significantly above room temperature, else the creature will consider everything too hot and you can't designate a meeting area, so queens need to be hotter than usual...
The eggs then splatter everywhere, and are animated. Despite being marked as "friendly", the animated living eggs are hostile. However, this step is necessary as the game won't resurrect something that hasn't been alive in fort mode, despite doing so in the arena just fine.
The queen and any others then must slaughter the animated eggs. Good thing they like that, else they would just run from their own eggs. After that, the queen resurrects them as friendly larva, that are actually friendly and living and everybody loves them. This appears to work and now I can move on to the rest.
(http://s10.postimg.org/j5jumr5fd/larva.png)
larva are brown @, queen are large Z
(http://s10.postimg.org/5d5fr4ent/larva2.png)
"Larva larva" is a temporary designation :P
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 03, 2013, 03:00:54 pm
Hmm... pale rider children are called ''halfling children''
That is not good. Should be a laughably easy fix though. I'll throw that in with the other updates I have eventually planned. Such as making Iridium and Oxyline slightly less ludicrously rare. :x That was kind of disappointing that I never once ever encountered them.
I'm also pretty sure that, while I REALLY support the idea for the Gnomes, they won't actually work. Creatures can't escape from non-artifact cages, because of bugged games. So unless you have some kind of MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMAGIC solution, I don't think that can happen.
I also need to decide on what I'm going to do for my megabeast. Hmm....
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 03, 2013, 03:08:45 pm
Additionally, from that description of their bodies, I conclude that they are probably scarier than spider-centaurs. I'm envisioning a porcelain-doll-like face surrounded by rows of bloody tentacles, on the end of a somewhat wormlike, slightly humanoid body...
Damn you for giving me a fanart idea when I already have no time >:(
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 03:18:51 pm
I'll also add an eye glow to the queen (so her eyes glow in perfect dark). But yes, they're supposed to be sort of humanoid and have some recognizable parts including the face. It'll be up to the interpreter whether they are actual transformed humanoids of this world, a product of parallel evolution, or completely alien beings with an eerie form.
The other evolved forms will have 8-12 limbs, often several arms with claws or just blade arms, often wings, several pairs (if I'm not too lazy, making those functional is an upgrade you can buy), a tentacled mouth, large fangs or mandibles depending on the creature, head crests and segmented armor occasionally... but no humanoid features.
Post by: Baffler on August 03, 2013, 04:01:03 pm
I heartily approve of their inclusion, of course, but still. Terrifying.
Post by: AutomataKittay on August 03, 2013, 04:43:55 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 04:48:07 pm
(http://s11.postimg.org/fzocyd0z7/larva3.png)
You will get 30% male and 70% female larva for efficient procreation. Also, since fiddling with transformations from one type of evolved creature into another is tricky, you can actually make as many queens as you like and only get 32 larva for each one - one time purchase, the queen is useless except as a defender after that. If you make too many, you'll have to figure out a creative way to squish them as they can't be moved (not immobile, just can't be controlled. Spawn them somewhere and lock the door).
Interesting note: they even get professions when made this way, they are larva peasants. This is hidden when you give them a display name like I did, but becomes visible if that's removed.
Post by: Gnorm on August 03, 2013, 04:50:56 pm
Part 1: In which the entire population of the settlement go completely insane and much tarnish stalk in consumed
-----
From the Journal of Gnorm:
1st Granite, 555
Well, I completely destroyed two years worth of my journal entires in an ink well spill. All that remain are two short entires on the fight with the storm dragon and on the completion of the town hall. In order to preserve the history of this town, and so that I can have a good reference book when I choose to write my autobiography, I will record all that I can remember here.
Our military has grown to two full squads, and the original captain has recovered from her injuries to resume command. The military recently gained a victory against the treelords, resulting in the death of one elfish wrestler and one treelord merchant. While I am happy with this victory, I fear retaliation, and I plan to expand our army.
The trading depot has been relocated to accommodate for the future paved roads. It is, fortunately, close enough to the original site that merchants won't get confused.
One of our woodworkers has taken over a carpenter's workshop, and is demanding gems. Being that none have been found in the caverns, I have started a mining project to dig deeper into the earth. Hopefully, gems shall be found.
3rd Slate, 555
Our miners have been running into issues recently. Apparently, they have dug a tunnel right above a deposit of stone known as "jaded slate." This stone is filled with water that has seeped into it. Our miners have taken great measure to not flood our mines, which has resulted in some winding tunnels.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2lvcn07.png)
6th Slate, 555
Perhaps the smallest migrant wave arrived today. Exactly one dyer came to our town. Our whole population is 220, so I cannot complain. Almost half of our population is children, though.
Meanwhile, one of our axemen got into a fight with a mechanic. I am trying to think of a way to keep remove him as a threat quickly and quietly.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2znzn0p.png)
11th Slate, 555
Our woodworker has gone completely mad from the lack of gems. A casket shall be prepared for him.
15th Slate, 555
There seems to be an issue with a shortage of food. No doubt the 106 children are responsible for this.
26th Slate, 555
Apparently, a group of underground creatures known as "reaver ants" have been harassing my men.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/ixwdy0.png)
Their entry in my copy of "The Halfling's Almanac 554" is less than encouraging. But my army will make short work of them nonetheless.
6th Felsite, 555
(http://i42.tinypic.com/e8l3cx.png)
Damn it! I knew that the spider-centaurs would not wait long before bringing war to our settlement. An armed group has arrived to avenge the blasted thieves that we have put to justice. I shan't stand for such an assault. The military has been mobilized, and shall strike!
8th Felsite, 555
Our army has been all but decimated! The enemy that seeks to destroy us approaches!
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2hcm914.png)
13th Felsite, 555
The enemy has been annihilated, but at a great cost. Many halflings have been killed, and many more have been injured. The military, including the captains, has been completely destroyed, with only one wounded axeman as a memory of it's power. I have ordered many caskets, thus that those who have fallen can be properly entombed
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2r6jegy.png)
17th Felsite, 555
The destruction of the military has put the entire town into a state of panic. I was recently attacked by a butcher, resulting in a broken arm and a wounded leg. I've noticed many others murdering each other, and I worry about the future of this civilization.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/24yr7rl.png)
21st Felsite, 555
The wild citizens have destroyed the trade depot, and have stolen many goods from the traders. As for me, I'm not sure I even care anymore.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/dqn7fo.png)
26th Felsite, 555
(http://i40.tinypic.com/w7ogeb.png)
In all of the chaos one of the children began to laugh like a maniac, and has recently claimed a tanner's shop as his own. Whatever he wants, be it gems, shell, or silk, I doubt he'll find it.
28th Felsite, 555
Spring is almost over, and this past Spring has been one of the worst experiences in my life. I am currently recovering from my injuries in the makeshift hospital. It's more of a freakish circus than a hospital, with insane halflings running here and there beating each other up. Blood coats the floor; I wish, for once, that it was vomit. As soon as I recover, I'm going to seal of the entrance to these catacombs, leaving the crazies inside.
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 05:19:07 pm
Drones done... 2 segments, otherwise similar to larva except much larger. Have pincer claws instead of forefeet. Overlords mostly likewise. Immobile, huge flying creatures with 16 eyes, many hanging limbs, a large head, claws, mouth tentacles and large teeth underneath. If you can disable their gas bladder they'll fall like an antelope.
Turns out this race will die in worldgen because larval procreation does not work there. So, for worldgen purposes, all drones are female and all overlords are male, and 70% of the population is drones and 30% overlords to begin with. They will procreate in worldgen mode, but not in fortress mode because overlords are immobile there.
Cont'dedit: happy day! The first queen was born "naturally" at a hatchery today and immediately gave birth to larva eggs.
(http://s9.postimg.org/f349mm2cv/firstqueen.png)
Notice also the beginnings of a healthy purple covering the landscape, and the spatter of blood. I didn't actually look up Meph's method but I assume it involves SPATTER_LIQUID?
Spoiler: glamourshot (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 03, 2013, 07:30:10 pm
@Halfling Xenoentomologist: Do Queens serve any purpose after their eggs fall off, or are they expendable after that?
Also, I love how these worlds will be completely dominated by hive-minded or otherwise eusocial insect species. This is turning into a very interesting succession game.
Post by: Gnorm on August 03, 2013, 07:34:17 pm
-----
From the Journal of Gnorm:
3rd Hematite, 555
One of the fellow patients has informed me of a rumor that the crazy child has murdered a fellow halfling, grabbed its corpse, and dragged it to the tanner's workshop. I fear the worst.
7th Hematite, 555
The child has revealed the fruits of his labor; I am thoroughly disgusted.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/sbron9.jpg)
This scepter will, no doubt, only serve to further the great madness present in this town.
13th Hematite, 555
One of the bowyers in the "hospital" went berserk today. He was quickly silenced, but it causes me to fear for my life even more now than before. I'm requesting a transfer.
17th Hematite, 555
The diplomat finally left today. Frankly, I'm surprised that he decided to stay as long as he did.
22nd Hematite, 555
The hospital becomes bloodier and bloodier as more patients go insane and attempt to murder me. They want my town; they are envious of my success.
1st Malachite, 555
(http://i40.tinypic.com/f2ornl.jpg)
The assassins think that they have won. They have incapacitated me and left me to rot in this despicable hospital. They have run amok throughout my town with the intent to destroy the balance of this town's structure and society. In crippling me in their assault, they believe that they have effectively murdered me; they are wrong.
The city's population, including me, is 145. That means that there are 144 usurpers wandering about. I am among the dregs of halfling society. They wish to ruin my testament to halfling life and liberty! I realize now, that I must take arms against those who wish to destroy me. Either I defeat the usurpers and retake command of my settlement, or I die a martyr, forever hailed as a halfling hero.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/9gva52.jpg)
They'll never truly understand; there is but one halfling worthy of being mayor of this town! I finally understand what must happen! In order to save my town, I must destroy it, its population, and its mayor!
From the Notes of Foul Chiefdesert, a cook, found inserted into the journal:
The founder and leader of Mastertea is dead, killed at the hands of his own people that he himself attempted to destroy.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2qtdc44.jpg)
Before he breathed his last, he, in his final act as mayor, declared me the new mayor of Mastertea, and that I was to finish what he started.
I feel like the most unlucky girl on the planet.
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 07:52:13 pm
Ahahahhaha, Mastertea. Your army was probably screwed either way :D Reavers come in groups of forty - I doubt your halflings could have survived that, no matter how many you had. Your playthrough is making me very happy, Gnorm.
@Halfling Xenoentomologist: Do Queens serve any purpose after their eggs fall off, or are they expendable after that?
Also, I love how these worlds will be completely dominated by hive-minded or otherwise eusocial insect species. This is turning into a very interesting succession game.
Queens are large, tough (they need to survive losing a large part of their body) and can spit thorns - I didn't originally mean to add this, but it turns out sometimes egg fragments get stuck on top of trees and you need early anti-air. That's about it. They could serve any purpose you want them to though, they're still in the making.
Research note for anyone following: removing NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT from queens apparently stopped them resurrecting larvae in fort mode, again... and new, more important note: Forgot that creatures that are already body-transformed can't body-transform anymore. This is a significant obstacle as it prevents making artificial queen parts into larvae... queens will have to split into larva, not eggs.
(http://s9.postimg.org/o5t7d0j1r/healingmaster.png)
On the bright side of things, I have a new pet now. Healingmaster is large and very muscular. I'm almost sad she doesn't have any other attributes that are different from other larva, as I didn't make any yet.
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 08:38:09 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 03, 2013, 08:42:56 pm
I'm going to check the raws for the alchemy plants and see if I left a fixed-temperature artifact somewhere in there.
EDIT: Nope, not that. Has anyone added any creatures with [IMMOLATE] perhaps? Any burning-hot secretions?
Post by: NRDL on August 03, 2013, 08:48:25 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 03, 2013, 08:51:17 pm
Ah, twenty pages ago. I did miss a few things: Sackhead's raws have been uploaded, so there's an option of a graphical tileset now, I've added alchemical reactions and gas weapons/buffs to the game, along with potions that give the drinker magical powers, BFEL hinted at a special surprise inside the elf raws, and dirigible gazelles were and I think still are being worked on.
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 08:58:50 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 03, 2013, 09:03:23 pm
This will be fun :D
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 09:08:23 pm
I finally figured reproduction out despite the problems above. You still start with only drones and don't need to wait for a queen.
1. Make a queen at a hatchery using a drone. Drone transforms permanently into queen.
2. Spawn larva at a hatchery using a drone. Drone transforms into eggbearer that splits into 32 parts and dies (it didn't to begin with but I felt it should be added to fit the theme).
3. Queen animates eggs. Eggs de-transform into drone larva and are slaughtered.
4. Queen animates these as friendly female and male larva that should spawn drones and overlords at a 7/3 ratio.
Repeat as necessary for more larva.
Post by: kopout on August 03, 2013, 10:01:43 pm
The world itself is spontaneously combusting. Lovely.I really ought to sig this.
Quote
EDIT: Nope, not that. Has anyone added any creatures with [IMMOLATE] perhaps? Any burning-hot secretions?The lift gas for dirigible gazelles burns at 10074 Uo. Scorching biomes can reach as high as 10080 Uo. It possible that scorching savannahs could have wild fires as the wildlife spontaneously combusts. Homoeotherm should prevent this like it did in arena tests but it might work differently in fortress mode.
Post by: Meph on August 03, 2013, 10:15:14 pm
Oh, and my Antmen arrive with 1 weapon and 3 shields, because they have 4 arms. If you have some with 32, then that might cause a problem when you meet them as siegers.
The creep trick:
Code: [Select]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:CREEP:CREATURE_EXTRACT_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen creep]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen creep]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:creep]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:creep]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling creep]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:boiling creep]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL:PURPLE] => didnt test, but purple should fit fine.
[PREFIX:NONE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:creep speed]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ZERG] => whatever your creature is.
[SYN_CONTACT]
[CE_SPEED_CHANGE:SPEED_PERC:110:START:0:END:2000] => guess end doesnt really matter, since it affects again and again if its a contagiant on the creature.
[SECRETION:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:CREEP:LIQUID:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:SKIN] => makes their skin constantly spawn creep. must be the outer tissue layer, so if its chitin in your case, just change the tags.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 03, 2013, 10:35:27 pm
Code: [Select]
creature_sleeper_megabeast_STL
## Recommendation for fighting? Range. Extreme range. Maybe gas weapons, but extreme range would be a safer bet. ##
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:SLEEPER_IN_THE_DARK_STL]
[NAME:Sleeper in the Dark:Sleepers in the Dark:Sleeper in the Dark]
[CREATURE_TILE:'S'][COLOR:6:0:0]
[DESCRIPTION:Immense, incomprehensible horrors that shelter in the dark spaces of the world. Their origin is unknown, but some believe they slipped into creation through portals opened by vile sorcery and blood rituals. They resemble an immense, centerless mass of writhing tentacles, and oftentimes the natural world functions...differently around them.]
[CREATURE_CLASS:SLEEPER][CREATURE_CLASS:HORROR]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:100000]
[BODY_SIZE:10:0:1000000]
[BODY_SIZE:2000:0:1000000000]
[AMPHIBIOUS]
[BODY:1PART_FRAME_STL:8TENTACLES_GRASP_STL:NERVE_CLUSTER_STL:MAW_STL] Define it once for normalcy
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SLEEPER_LAYERS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_MAW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ATTACK_TENTACLE_STRIKE_STL]
[MEGABEAST][DIFFICULTY:20]
[ATTACK_TRIGGER:80:5000:50000]
[LAIR:LABYRINTH:90]
[LAIR:SHRINE:10]
[LAIR_HUNTER]
[LARGE_ROAMING][LARGE_PREDATOR][LIKES_FIGHTING]
[LISP]
[BUILDINGDESTROYER:2]
[FIREIMMUNE_SUPER]
[EXTRAVISION][GRASSTRAMPLE:100]
[MAGMA_VISION][SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:1000]
[INTELLIGENT][POWER][SPHERE:CHAOS]
[NO_GENDER][NO_EAT][NO_DRINK][NO_SLEEP]
[NOEMOTION][NOEXERT][NOPAIN]
[TRAPAVOID]
[BIOME:MOUNTAIN][BIOME:ANY_OCEAN][BIOME:ANY_DESERT]
## Now, we define the secreted reality-bending substances ##
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SECRETION_DREAMER:VOLATILE_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen dreamer aura]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen dreamer aura]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:liquid dreamer aura]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:liquid dreamer aura]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:dreamer aura]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:dreamer aura]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:mind torment]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:SLEEPER_IN_THE_DARK:ALL]
[SYN_INHALED]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:100000:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:ALL:START:0] Severe brain pain, held at bay by madness at first
[CE_ADD_TAG:NOPAIN:START:0:END:2000] Time till collapse
[CE_ADD_TAG:OPPOSED_TO_LIFE:TRANCES:START:0] Always insane, always hallucinating, alway paranoid. Their mind is shattered beyond help or reason, for what use is reason in the presence of a dreamer?
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SECRETION_CALLER:VOLATILE_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen caller aura]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen caller aura]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:liquid caller aura]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:liquid caller aura]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:caller aura]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:caller aura]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:dead hand's touch]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:SLEEPER_IN_THE_DARK:ALL]
[SYN_INHALED]
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:1000:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:ALL:START:0:PEAK:100]
[CE_ADD_TAG:NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT:NO_PHYS_ATT_GAIN:NO_PHYS_ATT_RUST:NO_SLEEP:OPPOSED_TO_LIFE:LIKES_FIGHTING:NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT:NO_EAT:NO_DRINK:NOEXERT:NOT_LIVING:NOPAIN:NOSTUN:NOTHOUGHT:PARALYZEIMMUNE:START:0] The caller calls, and the dead listen...and claw their way back to the present from the future to heed it.
[CE_REMOVE_TAG:CAN_LEARN:CAN_SPEAK:START:100] Kept just long enough for them to realize what's happening.
[CASTE:SLEEPER]
[CASTE_NAME:Sleeper in the Dark:Sleepers in the Dark:Sleeper in the Dark]
[BODY:1PART_FRAME_STL:8TENTACLES_GRASP_STL:NERVE_CLUSTER_STL:MAW_STL] Define it twice to yield a fractal body
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SLEEPER_LAYERS_STL]
[CASTE:DREAMER]
[CASTE_NAME:Dreamer in the Dark:Dreamers in the Dark:Dreamer in the Dark]
[NOT_LIVING]
[BODY:1PART_FRAME_STL:8TENTACLES_GRASP_STL:NERVE_CLUSTER_STL:MAW_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SLEEPER_LAYERS_STL]
[SECRETION:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SECRETION_DREAMER:GAS:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:ALL]
[CASTE:CALLER]
[CASTE_NAME:Caller in the Dark:Callers in the Dark:Caller in the Dark]
[NOT_LIVING]
[BODY:1PART_FRAME_STL:8TENTACLES_GRASP_STL:NERVE_CLUSTER_STL:MAW_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SLEEPER_LAYERS_STL]
[SECRETION:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SECRETION_CALLER:GAS:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:ALL]
Who's up for some eldritch horrors? These guys are immense, and best engaged at extreme range. The secretions of two of the three castes will cause a melee defense force to fall upon itself in homicidal fury, and they have bodies on their body parts. On the plus side, killing and butchering a little more than half of one of these things (couldn't get one to die intact in arena) yields over 3000 meat, so victory over one will basically ensure your food supply for the next decade or so.
Supporting files:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 10:39:24 pm
I currently have the adjustable
Code: [Select]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Spread creep]
[CDI:MATERIAL:INORGANIC:CREEP_HLG:SPATTER_LIQUID]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:30]
[CDI:TARGET:C:SELF_ONLY]
I'll try both and see which fits better. Those tentacles aren't GRASP (but they are LIMB for wrestling), so no worries.
And yes, purple is the exact color by the way. I originally had violet which was eye-destroying :D
Creep speed should end off creep, because the creatures clean themselves occasionally, so it definitely could have something like end:100. Am not really that far yet, I currently just added the resorption pool and organic mass for building ("organic mass walls") and need to sleep now. Zerg in the snow:
(http://s18.postimg.org/wn0nm9xux/xeno5.png)
Also, discovered the most annoying thing in the world. Adjusting someone's job preferences and then wondering why no work gets done... only to realize you gave the job to an overlord.
The larva should give birth to drones... they are the same creature and drones are easily the most populous caste. Let's hope it works, that's next on my testing list (wasn't earlier due to various annoyances like uncontained larva running off after hounds, just took it on confidence).
Post by: WillowLuman on August 03, 2013, 10:59:59 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on August 03, 2013, 11:03:34 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 03, 2013, 11:04:59 pm
So, personal megabeasts. Yeah.
That's the spirit! I don't even know what to say about the syndromes. Don't fight this one. But at the risk of sounding like a pop-up ad... it seems like you've imported CORE_MATERIALS_HLG meaning that thing actually can be skinned and tanned. Want to make it drop a reward leather (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4459378#msg4459378) too?
Not that a "Sleeper in the Dark leather waistcoat" isn't pretty special in itself :P
Those cephalopods have [LIMB]s? Creatures wrestling with everything, including mallards strangling things with their wings, is just par for the course, the only way to remove it is remove those tokens...
Post by: WillowLuman on August 03, 2013, 11:09:26 pm
Code: [Select]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_8ARMS]
[BP:LBASE1:first arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE2:second arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE3:third arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE4:fourth arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE1:fifth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE2:sixth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE3:seventh arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE4:eight arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LARM1:first arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM2:second arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM3:third arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM4:fourth arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM1:fifth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM2:sixth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM3:seventh arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM4:eighth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
Post by: Orange Wizard on August 04, 2013, 04:10:30 am
I'm noticing some weird-ass shit in testing with the first cephalopod. They're naturally Adept wrestlers, but in fights with Hounds, they only use "push," having no non-wrestling attack, while the Hound, instead of biting, prefers to initiate grabs with every part of its legs, including the knees.That is weird. Is the hound's bite specified as [ATTACK:PRIMARY] or something? I don't recall what the correct tag is, but it's something along those lines and it makes something something.
Post by: Halfling on August 04, 2013, 08:40:40 am
They have Eight [LIMB]sCode: [Select][BODY:CEPHALOPOD_8ARMS]
[BP:LBASE1:first arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE2:second arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE3:third arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE4:fourth arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE1:fifth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE2:sixth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE3:seventh arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE4:eight arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LARM1:first arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM2:second arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM3:third arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM4:fourth arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM1:fifth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM2:sixth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM3:seventh arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM4:eighth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
Can those limbs be actually used? One way to test is enable standing on them. Another to try to wrestle yourself in arena adv mode.
There are many reasons why it couldn't...
- Improper connections or otherwise messy body: try [NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT] in creature
- No brain/nervous system... " + "THOUGHT_CENTER"
- Tissue errors
I'm noticing some weird-ass shit in testing with the first cephalopod. They're naturally Adept wrestlers, but in fights with Hounds, they only use "push," having no non-wrestling attack, while the Hound, instead of biting, prefers to initiate grabs with every part of its legs, including the knees.That is weird. Is the hound's bite specified as [ATTACK:PRIMARY] or something? I don't recall what the correct tag is, but it's something along those lines and it makes something something.
Yes, and no, that does not stop wrestling. Hound bite:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_ANIMAL_HLG]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK:BITE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:10]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:400]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[CV_NEW_TAG:ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 12:13:02 pm
EDIT: I have them a bite attack to put them in the same situation as the hounds, but now they just exclusively bite.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 03:47:21 pm
I've noticed a major problem with the dirigible antelope. I defined skin and hair color variations within the Antelope, like vanilla creatures have, but I wind up with the hair using the skin using the hair colors, the hair not showing up in the description, the eyes using the skin colors, and "her left eye's eye tissue is black"
Code: [Select]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:SKIN]
[TLCM_NOUN:skin:SINGULAR]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BROWN:1:PEACH:1:PINK:1]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:HAIR]
[TLCM_NOUN:hair:SINGULAR]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BROWN:1:CINNAMON:1:TAN:1:DARK_TAN:1]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE]
[TLCM_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:BLACK:1]
Post by: Halfling on August 04, 2013, 03:57:03 pm
>have we somehow set it up so that color variations can ONLY be set up in c_variation?
Nope, that is impossible as c_variations only add tokens that could be added otherwise. Also those tokens look exactly like the ones added by my c_variations so again I have no clue. Cf, this is how you set hair color with my raws:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODY_HAIR_HLG]
[CV_NEW_TAG:SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:HAIR]
[CV_NEW_TAG:TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:CHOCOLATE:1:FLAX:3:GRAY:1]
[CV_NEW_TAG:TLCM_NOUN:fur:SINGULAR] it's the exact same thing except in different order. WTF? Are dirigible antelope tissue layers actually in correct order?
also sorry for anyone waiting on the zerg, unexpected business for some days :(
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 04, 2013, 04:01:51 pm
Hmm... pale rider children are called ''halfling children''
OK, so make the cages out of ice and have the nomads only active during the summer. Cages will melt... Bingo!
Post by: Putnam on August 04, 2013, 04:04:02 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 04:04:35 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 04:12:22 pm
What causes our handless creatures to initiate wrestling so much, when vanilla creatures don't?
Post by: Putnam on August 04, 2013, 04:31:53 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 04:34:01 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 04, 2013, 04:42:17 pm
The snapping parts off at the elbow is new. That's because you can snap a joint and well... here joints connect the part distal to them to the body, in vanilla they don't and are instead lumps inside the appendage. So if you rip the elbow out the rest of the arm comes off.
One reason why you might be more vulnerable is that halflings are about half smaller than vanillites, while mallards are... actually about 3/4 the size of a vanilla penguin. Not that we actually need to calibrate sizes to vanilla, what matters is the relative size.
Now that you mention it... there may be truth to that. I put vanilla ducks in an arena and they do not wrestle that much.
If anyone can figure out the cause here - why some things wrestle and some don't despite both having limbs - then I move that we make all animals (except ones that really should) not wrestle immediately. That would definitely be good.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 04:50:44 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 04, 2013, 04:55:48 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 05:16:23 pm
Formics are quite brittle, it seems.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 04, 2013, 05:18:47 pm
Post by: AutomataKittay on August 04, 2013, 05:25:57 pm
Granted this' going off combat reports I gets in fortress mode, I don't know how it goes in adventure mode :D
Taking quick glance through vanilla raw, it seems the creature bodyplan that tend to wrestle have smaller RELSIZE for their limbs compared to upper/lower body than those that don't?
Post by: Halfling on August 04, 2013, 05:32:40 pm
But generally, in adventure mode, be armed, pick your fights and aim your shots, and you can take out anything including a storm dragon with just a cudgel.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 05:43:30 pm
Oddly, hunters and soldiers in fort mode seem to have little trouble taking down the "passive" creatures (mallards, antelope) but they shred adventurers like confetti.
Also, whats with all the wild hounds? They come in massive swarms and though only hostile in ambush, it seems weird that domestic dogs should be the most common animal anywhere, wild or not. Glaciers are absolutely plastered with mallards and hounds since nothing else seems to live there. Is this to give access to them no matter where they are? Because [COMMON_DOMESTIC] already does that, no wild population required.
The more I explore, the more I see we've created a very strange world that clearly still needs work ???
Post by: Halfling on August 04, 2013, 05:56:34 pm
Hounds are supposed to be closer to a wolf than a vanilla domestic dog... actually they resemble the vanilla wolf more. Think feral, primitive dog. They compensate for halfling melee weakness. Keep in mind we are not trying to rebuild the same world again, that would be completely pointless. They come in large packs to give an element of danger to the minimal world. They are set to everywhere because there were no other fauna at the time when they were created.
Now, the intention was that hounds and mallards and all once dominant creatures would become less common as more creatures are added. The rules have a special provision that you may, when creating new creatures to populate biomes, reduce the frequency of old ones or the biomes they appear in (with a minimum of a reasonable biome and 10% of the original frequency). I don't think anyone has done that yet though, but it's how it should go. So for example when you make a blizzard man you may remove hounds from there.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 06:06:54 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 04, 2013, 06:25:25 pm
Code: [Select]
[BIOME:TUNDRA]
[BIOME:DESERT_BADLAND]
[BIOME:DESERT_ROCK]
[BIOME:SHRUBLAND_TEMPERATE]
[BIOME:SAVANNA_TEMPERATE]
-- places where you might expect to find dogs gone feral, and smaller than original frequency. With the provision that once more creatures are out, can remove [BIOME:SHRUBLAND_TEMPERATE][BIOME:SAVANNA_TEMPERATE] and make hound packs dwell mostly in badlands.
I'm not supposed to be in a position to dictate this though, and it's your modding turn... the one biome that would be nice for them is [BIOME:DESERT_BADLAND] which is probably barren of other creatures anyway (how would a giant spider hunt there?).
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 04, 2013, 07:45:02 pm
(how would a giant spider hunt there?).
Right - badlands! I'd intended to add giant scorpions in the desert, instead of giant spiders :) . I should probably should get around to doing that, if we need more animals to live out there. Those hounds'll need company, after all!
Post by: Person on August 04, 2013, 07:48:22 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on August 04, 2013, 07:53:32 pm
Maybe my mega-beast should be Deer-clops.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 04, 2013, 08:04:51 pm
(how would a giant spider hunt there?).
Right - badlands! I'd intended to add giant scorpions in the desert, instead of giant spiders :) . I should probably should get around to doing that, if we need more animals to live out there. Those hounds'll need company, after all!
Don't forget the incoming dragons that exist in every biome.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 04, 2013, 08:23:32 pm
@ Zanzetkuken: How many of those are going to breathe fire, by the way? Because I could see a few dozen species of firebreathers forcing a name change from "Halfling Hamlet" to "Halfling Vault" :)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 04, 2013, 08:41:18 pm
Say, how about we create a duplicate of hounds, remove all [PET] and [COMMON_DOMESTIC] stuff, and rename them "Feral Hounds"? It's not much but it helps with flavor.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 04, 2013, 10:52:54 pm
Honestly, I don't see how desert ecosystems would support mostly giant predators.
Well, if we must be sensible about it, I suppose I could come up with a plausible scenario for it.
Look at the python, for a start. After a good meal, it can fast for months, even years, and still be able to catch another morsel, and those things can get pretty big. What helps is that they're cold-blooded - mammals and such have to expend energy to maintain body temperature, and so need more food than, say, a scorpion. If said scorpion was an ambush predator, laying burrowed in wait beneath the sand, it would cut out the caloric requirements of actively hunting for prey; the sand might also keep it at a fairly constant temperature. A paralyzing venom would make even a single sting enough to net it food from an ambush, and if that prey was large - say, camel-sized, and camels manage to live out in the deserts - said scorpion could easily survive a good long while off it.
As for size, well, if meals are going to be scarce, it makes sense to make as much from one camel as you possibly can. The scorpion could just leave the carcass of its victim laying out in the sand after it's finished eating - which could attract scavengers to snack on - but that would be more wasteful than the python's method of just engulfing the victim whole and digesting it slowly, extracting every last calorie from each meal. The scorpion could experience evolutionary pressure towards a system like that as well; for coolness factor, let's say it develops a large gash of a maw on its underside, the better to take in and fit this camel-sized prey inside a digestive sack. The size of the prey a "scorpion" could ingest like this would be limited by its size, and if most things were fairly large, gigantism would be selected for.
And thus do we end up with a species of ultra-venomous, giant desert scorpions, which lie in wait for prey in hidden burrows in the sand. Ta-da! :D
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 04, 2013, 10:57:58 pm
@ Person: I think the deadly toxins and web-spitting might also have a great deal to do with their lethality :P
@ Zanzetkuken: How many of those are going to breathe fire, by the way? Because I could see a few dozen species of firebreathers forcing a name change from "Halfling Hamlet" to "Halfling Vault" :)
The river, ocean, tundra, glacier, and cave levels 1-3 dragons don't breathe fire. Magma's use fireballs and
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: AutomataKittay on August 05, 2013, 12:09:13 am
Honestly, I don't see how desert ecosystems would support mostly giant predators.
Well, if we must be sensible about it, I suppose I could come up with a plausible scenario for it.
Look at the python, for a start. After a good meal, it can fast for months, even years, and still be able to catch another morsel, and those things can get pretty big. What helps is that they're cold-blooded - mammals and such have to expend energy to maintain body temperature, and so need more food than, say, a scorpion. If said scorpion was an ambush predator, laying burrowed in wait beneath the sand, it would cut out the caloric requirements of actively hunting for prey; the sand might also keep it at a fairly constant temperature. A paralyzing venom would make even a single sting enough to net it food from an ambush, and if that prey was large - say, camel-sized, and camels manage to live out in the deserts - said scorpion could easily survive a good long while off it.
As for size, well, if meals are going to be scarce, it makes sense to make as much from one camel as you possibly can. The scorpion could just leave the carcass of its victim laying out in the sand after it's finished eating - which could attract scavengers to snack on - but that would be more wasteful than the python's method of just engulfing the victim whole and digesting it slowly, extracting every last calorie from each meal. The scorpion could experience evolutionary pressure towards a system like that as well; for coolness factor, let's say it develops a large gash of a maw on its underside, the better to take in and fit this camel-sized prey inside a digestive sack. The size of the prey a "scorpion" could ingest like this would be limited by its size, and if most things were fairly large, gigantism would be selected for.
And thus do we end up with a species of ultra-venomous, giant desert scorpions, which lie in wait for prey in hidden burrows in the sand. Ta-da! :D
That reminds me of trapdoor spiders and other large hairy spiders that like to burrow. Water's usually much bigger issue in desert ecosystem than food, but if there're enough poor critters wandering in and oasises, I don't see why not :D
Post by: Gnorm on August 05, 2013, 12:15:29 am
-----
From the Journal of
2nd Malachite, 555
I have perused the past few entries of this journal for the last two hours, looking over the thoughts of the madman that was once in charge of this village. I know not why he chose me to take command of the town, as his last entries seem to indicate that he had planned to kill me along with the others in the hospital. Perhaps, right before he died, he came back to his senses and hoped I could right his wrongs; perhaps he was just under the delusion that his settlement was still alive and well, and that it simply needed a new leader. Whatever the case, I am now the official leader of whatever government is left in this town. I'll need to quickly formulate a plan, as injuries have trapped me in the same hospital as Mayor Greenwitch found himself in, and I fear that I'll succumb to a similar insanity.
7th Malachite, 555
(http://i39.tinypic.com/6oj2p4.jpg)
Even during the collapse of this settlement, some still cling to the concept that there is a better life for them here. Following my predecessor's example, I shall list the migrants by their professions.
1 Bone Carver
1 Hunter
1 Child
This small family may indeed serve me in my plan.
15th Malachite, 555
Today, I make my final act as mayor of this settlement. Going by my predecessor's original plan, I am going to seal the exit of these catacombs; the difference between my plan and his, however, is that I will remain inside. There are four whom I have ordered to remain outside and entomb us, the current sheriff who seems to be safe, and the recently arrived family.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/10hvrye.jpg)
If, by the sheer providence of the gods, I recover from my injuries, I shall make my escape through the caverns beneath, avoid the reaver ants, and find an exit to the surface. Some must, however, remain on the surface and take charge of the town, to rebuild it for future migrants to live in. For this purpose, I have relinquished my mayoral authority to the sheriff, who will control the city by herself. This journal is my gift to her. I feel that, since the first two mayors recorded their thoughts in this book, the third should continue this tradition.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2nbrjnq.jpg)
Farewell, sun and moon that reign over the skies. Never again shall I behold the beauty of ye.
From the Journal of
18th Malachite, 555
I have completed the floor that has sealed the insane population within the earth. The only souls that remain above are the family of three, a few melancholiacs who did not obey to orders to go inside, and myself. Mayor Chiefdesert promised that she would return as soon as she found a means to escape, and that she would help me rebuild this town; we both knew that she would die down there.
As the new mayor, I do indeed has a mission: to save the small family that has not been here long enough to be insane yet. The farm yields pumpkins, and the mother and her daughter seem to be willing to help grow food. It won't last long, but there are only four of us.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2a7z9cp.png)
I have ordered the depot rebuilt; it will be necessary to reestablish connections with the neighboring civilizations. Lastly, I plan on building and moving to a new town hall, as the former one is covered with bodies, blood, and vomit.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/ftplyf.png)
Whatever should happen, I am determined to fulfill my duty as mayor of these lands.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 05, 2013, 12:18:14 am
Deserts tend not to be awash with either giant predators or herbivores. Water and nutrients are just too scarce. Also selective pressure might evolve for scavengers to be able to drive desert scorpions from their prey. However, there are GDS in vanilla DF, so about something a little more supernatural for dangers in the desert? Djinn, maybe? Or perhaps tribal, desert-dwelling sentient giant hawks? Or maybe, instead of creatures, we populate our deserts with dangerous, magical dust storms of various effects?
Of course, as I've said before, we don't have to make everywhere an ultra-deadly death land (and deserts tend to be those in real life without giant monsters). We should at least try to make a world that makes sense for halflings to exist in. Currently, halflings may love all things that grow, but things that grow certainly do not love them. Their pastoral culture makes little sense in this world, seems more like they should have developed an extremely paranoid, warlike culture.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 05, 2013, 12:24:46 am
Of course, as I've said before, we don't have to make everywhere an ultra-deadly death land (and deserts tend to be those in real life without giant monsters). We should at least try to make a world that makes sense for halflings to exist in. Currently, halflings may love all things that grow, but things that grow certainly do not love them. Their pastoral culture makes little sense in this world, seems more like they should have developed an extremely paranoid, warlike culture.
How are swamps and marshes, by the way? I'm creating a (playable!) civilization that will spawn exclusively in those, and I need to know what to build around in terms of adaptations and development.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 05, 2013, 12:43:43 am
ninja'd
Deserts tend not to be awash with either giant predators or herbivores. Water and nutrients are just too scarce. Also selective pressure might evolve for scavengers to be able to drive desert scorpions from their prey. However, there are GDS in vanilla DF, so about something a little more supernatural for dangers in the desert? Djinn, maybe? Or perhaps tribal, desert-dwelling sentient giant hawks? Or maybe, instead of creatures, we populate our deserts with dangerous, magical dust storms of various effects?
Of course, as I've said before, we don't have to make everywhere an ultra-deadly death land (and deserts tend to be those in real life without giant monsters). We should at least try to make a world that makes sense for halflings to exist in. Currently, halflings may love all things that grow, but things that grow certainly do not love them. Their pastoral culture makes little sense in this world, seems more like they should have developed an extremely paranoid, warlike culture.
Well, I tried to add a sandstorm, but that doesn't appear to be working very well :P And nothing says we can't have djinni, giant hawks, magic dust clouds, and giant scorpions :D
Also, on the scarce nutrients: surprisingly enough, life lives in deserts in the real world. Cacti grow, numerous animals are adapted to them. The majority of deserts aren't like the sand dunes of the Sahara, devoid of vegetation; plants besides cacti grow there, especially shortly after rainfall. Herbivores can live there, and thus predators can as well, and food webs in those areas are every bit as diverse as in other, more hospitable regions. Water, as AutomataKittay pointed out, is usually the bigger issue, and yet even that is not an insurmountable obstacle, as the camel and oryx and others prove. One camel could provide food for an engulfer scorpion or similarly adapted critter for almost a year, which opens up the possibility for larger predators, through the evolutionary scenario I hacked together.
On the scavenger point: engulfing the prey and retreating underground once more makes scavengers a nonissue, I would think. Though thinking of how such scavengers might work in that scenario is interesting - maybe a pack-minded creature, hyena-style, that stalks animals until an engulfer stings them, and then sweep in to scare off or overwhelm the scorpion. I doubt that can be modeled in-game, sadly, unless Halfling comes up with some more interaction magic that I am unable to fathom at this late hour.
And I would love to see a culture of paranoiac, heavily militarized midgets, smaller even than dwarves :) As it is, their peaceful culture could be seen as a sort of retreat from the harsh reality of the world - peace and order being seen as the hallmarks of true civilization, since murder, mayhem, and chaos seem to be nature's bent. The world is so violently opposed to them, making their villages islands of calm and slow-paced, safe agriculture could be the only way they could stay sane.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 05, 2013, 01:09:18 am
Why not have Giant Desert Scorpions plus that other stuff? 'Cuz it's boring, that's why. What we have right now: almost every region filled with giant, venomous, killer arthropods (and ducks and mallards). We don't need to develop giant, venomous killer arthropods for every climate, instead we need to diversify. Why make each land a palette-swap in terms of feel and gameplay? Deserts could be "We're here, lets get set up to get water and avoid the dust that turns us into jackals." How boring would it be if, in every region, it was "We're here, let's get set up to avoid the giant bugs."
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 05, 2013, 08:05:52 am
What's "boring" is trying too hard to match life in the real world - and thus in vanilla DF - especially considering that evolution is largely a random process, and any number of other strategies could be viable, from underground modes of living like my suggested engulfer scorpion, to plantlike methods like developing a taproot organ of some kind and trying to tap the water the desert plants use when you're thirsty.
The giant bugs - especially the engulfer scorpion - are not just "palette swaps". I did not copy and paste them to fill up the earth with thirty gameplay-identical species of giant spider. There are giant bumblebees that are docile and provide wool and alcohol; giant, docile pack beetles; amphibious wolf-packs of Water Striders; web-spinning forest spiders; non-web-spinning, frostbite-envenomed aasiaat spiders on glaciers, capable of invisibility; swarming giant wasps; swarming giant ants that will eat all your food; bandit moths that steal your stuff but run if confronted; docile, dive-hunting dragonflies; water grubs in deserts that can be milked for water...none of them are identical in gameplay terms. None! I didn't plan for the engulfer scorpion to be, either - it would have the ability to hide itself and become invisible, like the aasiaat, but would be an ambush predator - you'd have to be careful of sending scouts or woodcutters out in desert regions, otherwise they could stumble upon one of them and be eaten; it could necessitate walls, as well, to maximize the chance of detecting them before they enter your hamlet. It'd be a heck of a lot more interesting trying to keep out invisible giant scorpions than just digging underground to avoid a magic sandstorm.
Post by: kopout on August 05, 2013, 10:04:40 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 05, 2013, 12:16:53 pm
It just wouldn't feel like a desert if it was teeming with life, because no matter how you slice it, deserts do not have as much life as other areas. If you want to say "why follow reality?" and make deserts teeming with life, then why not just call them "sand jungles?" I personally think vanilla DF deserts have too much life in them. If you want to fill them with monsters, then we should at least fill them with something other than giant bugs, because right now everything is giant bugs. Even half of the civs are giant bugs. If we had "near-lifeless wasteland" as the theme of our deserts, we could still have all kinds of other threats, like various undead or evil spirits.
I think it would be more interesting to try something new, like nasty dust storms and region interactions that simulate dehydration, rather than just bringing out the monsters. Perhaps deserts are somewhere people flee to escape the many monsters infesting the rest of the world, only to face the extreme harsh conditions. When playing in deserts, we should have to work hard to avoid "Halfling Carpenter has been found dead, dehydrated," unlike how easy it is to keep everyone hydrated in vanilla DF.
EDIT: Oh, adding [LIMB] to the "Armbase" body parts connecting the arms to the mantle causes the cephalopods to wrestle. Huh.
BTW, cephalopods are built much like IRL, so instead of a central brain, theirs is divided up into segments located at the base of each arm. May cause weird effects, yet to be seen though.
Post by: kopout on August 05, 2013, 02:02:41 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 05, 2013, 02:11:23 pm
Post by: kopout on August 05, 2013, 02:17:08 pm
BTW, speaking of deserts, your apple trees seem to be the dominant feature of deserts right now ???I'm fixing that. Its an artifact from when they were the only trees and were found in any land biome at 100 frequency. the latest version is found in teprate brodleaf forest, teprate grass/shrublands, and temprate marshes and swamps at a frequency of 80. and only away from water so it shouldn't show up that often in swamps
Post by: WillowLuman on August 05, 2013, 02:32:29 pm
I've also reduced Mallards from [ANY_LAND] to [ANY_LAKE], [ANY_RIVER], and [ANY_POOL]. This causes them to appear only on the edges of freshwater areas and ponds.
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:HOUND_FERAL_HUGOL]
[DESCRIPTION:Hounds abandoned by civilization, turned vicious to survive in the wild. Rarely, some are descended from the original beasts from which the peoples bred their strains.]
[NAME:feral hound:feral hounds:feral hound]
[CASTE_NAME:feral hound:feral hounds:feral hound]
[CREATURE_TILE:104][COLOR:4:0:0]
[PREFSTRING:cooperation]
[PREFSTRING:will to survive]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:12]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:QUADRUPED][CREATURE_CLASS:CANINE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL][CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[BIOME:MOUNTAIN][BIOME:DESERT_BADLAND][BIOME:TUNDRA][BIOME:TUNDRA][BIOME:ANY_TEMPERATE_FOREST][FREQUENCY:20]
[LARGE_ROAMING][LARGE_PREDATOR][PACK_ANIMAL][WAGON_PULLER]
[MUNDANE][DIURNAL][TRAINABLE][PET_EXOTIC][LIKES_FIGHTING]
[PETVALUE:200][LITTERSIZE:3:10][MAXAGE:10:20][NATURAL]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:100:1000]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT][BABY:1][HOMEOTHERM:10070]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:whelp:whelps]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:2000]
[BODY_SIZE:50000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:3000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:50000]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:DOG_ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG:TAIL_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:DOG_ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TAIL_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ALL_OVER_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:FOOTPAW_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:ANKLEHOCK_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_ANIMAL_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SCRATCH_PAW_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODY_HAIR_HLG]
[CASTE:FEMALE][FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE][MALE]
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 05, 2013, 02:39:21 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 05, 2013, 05:02:17 pm
Whether it's a non-webspinning spider or a giant desert scorpion, the object of the game is still keeping out giant bugs in every region. Filling everywhere with monsters just makes everywhere into a savage James Cameron jungle by another name. We should make each region more unique, far moreso than vanilla DF.
It just wouldn't feel like a desert if it was teeming with life, because no matter how you slice it, deserts do not have as much life as other areas. If you want to say "why follow reality?" and make deserts teeming with life, then why not just call them "sand jungles?" I personally think vanilla DF deserts have too much life in them. If you want to fill them with monsters, then we should at least fill them with something other than giant bugs, because right now everything is giant bugs. Even half of the civs are giant bugs. If we had "near-lifeless wasteland" as the theme of our deserts, we could still have all kinds of other threats, like various undead or evil spirits.
I think it would be more interesting to try something new, like nasty dust storms and region interactions that simulate dehydration, rather than just bringing out the monsters. Perhaps deserts are somewhere people flee to escape the many monsters infesting the rest of the world, only to face the extreme harsh conditions. When playing in deserts, we should have to work hard to avoid "Halfling Carpenter has been found dead, dehydrated," unlike how easy it is to keep everyone hydrated in vanilla DF.
Everything is giant bugs right now because my mod turn's goal was literally "make giant bugs", and I'm fairly sure that was an unqualified success :)
I'm not saying we should make deserts into some kind of sand ocean, teeming with krill and shai-hulud and erg whales; I acknowledge they should be less "alive" than other areas. They would still, however, be plausibly able to support a large predator under the scenario I proposed - sparse life, with predators adapted to survive long periods of fasting. One species of giant scorpion is not filling the deserts with giant bugs, and even if I submitted eighty subspecies of them, deserts could still be given a lifeless feel by just lowering cluster and population numbers - fewer creatures overall, and fewer on the map at once. Zombies and spirits, however, are more the province of evil biomes.
Also, if you can get magic dust storms working, please, add them! And maybe fix my sandstorm, too :) I'd love to see those, but for whatever reason there has been no evidence of them working consistently in terms of actually showing up. Furthermore, the dearth of alcohol has already made arid, hot regions into very harsh embarks - when I started a test fort a while back, to see my sandstorms in action (I didn't), everyone died of thirst because the ponds boiled off. It got to the point where I tried to make basins adjoining the dry ponds so the spring rains would flow in and prolong their suffering for a few weeks.
Also, I can't help but feel you bear some sort of hostility towards large insects :P . Live in Australia, perchance?
Post by: WillowLuman on August 05, 2013, 05:17:59 pm
If the scorpions were few and far between, that would make sense, as desert predators tend to be fairly spread out due to limited availability of prey in a small area. I was just bugged (no pun intended) by mention of "larger food chains" that the giant ambush scorpions would not be on top of.
Perhaps they could have some form of immobility, so that if you happen to embark with one on the map, it would be there until you found it and dealt with it, waiting in ambush the whole time. I still think there should be something supernatural about them, though.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 05, 2013, 06:01:23 pm
I should probably start making these guys. Also, reading about that spider, I am very glad I live nowhere near their range. *shudder*
Post by: Gnorm on August 06, 2013, 01:08:19 am
-----
From the Journal of
14th Galena, 555
Today, a forested caravan has braved entry into this forsaken town. For once, I feel that we might have to trade with them, if no halflings come.
19th Galena, 555
(http://i43.tinypic.com/34iptec.png)
Thank the gods! We may be saved after all.
2nd Limestone, 555
A group of the halflings that eluded entombment scared off the caravan from Gall Pumpkin, thus I was forced to make do with the elves.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2j14sia.png)
All I did was give them some of the cloth we had stolen from a previous caravan in exchange for all of their pumpkins. The four of us will need them to survive.
3rd Limestone, 555
(http://i43.tinypic.com/96yr6h.png)
I met with the liaison today, and I demanded that he escort the four of us back to civilization. He refused, and told us that, due to the expanding boundaries of Gall Pumpkin, we are to remain an outpost for migrants. I told him that he was mad, and showed him all of the corpses in our meeting room; he still refused. I told him then, that if we were to stay, we would need lots of food, tools, and building materials.
24th Sandstone, 555
(http://i42.tinypic.com/sv30h2.png)
Something has come over me; I cannot quite explain what is going on. I no longer feel a desire to continue working. Instead, I must get to a workshop immediately!
25th Sandstone, 555
The voice inside of my head ordered me to take the metalsmith's forge, so I did so. I feel that I must do exactly as it tells me.
28th Sandstone, 555
(http://i40.tinypic.com/27xjfwx.png)
Some more migrants are coming, but I don't care. Right now, I just need gems!
From the Journal of
11th Moonstone, 555
(http://i44.tinypic.com/27xfe6e.jpg)
Whatever evil spirit possessed the mayor and forced her to abandon work and to demand gems has left her, but it has also damaged her. Whatever it did, the strong-willed and determined mayor I knew is gone, replaced by the childish thing that now babbles in her place. She is no longer fit to be mayor of this town, that is a task that I, for the sake of my wife and daughter, must undertake. I am nervous; since the death of the one called Gnorm Greenwitch, his successors have been dropping like flies.
18th Obsidian, 555
(http://i42.tinypic.com/aotmjr.png)
This site is haunted, I swear of it. I can hear the cries of the dead and the damned all day and all night. I've got to get my family out of here.
21st Obsidian, 555
I've not seen the former mayor for a week now. It's probably for the better, as the sight of the broken soul saddened me.
1st Granite, 556
If what I've heard is true, then five hears ago, this very day, Gnorm Greenwitch and his followers arrived at this site to establish Mastertea. Now, five years later, my family, a broker, and I are the only ones that remain alive and sane in this broken settlement.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2urs0pj.png)
I've had a small underground bunker dug, this should help protect us from what lurks outside. I have chosen to name it "Fort Mastertea," in honor of the old town. This journal contains the thoughts and plans of those who tried to build this city up; I hope to find a means to escape it. No halfling can say for certain how things will turn out in Mastertea.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 01:54:16 am
Post by: Halfling on August 06, 2013, 02:46:08 am
Feral hounds replacing hounds in nature is a-okay by me. In addition to feral hounds you could also make feral halflings. "Tribal halfling", not intelligent but otherwise similar, curiousbeast that steals your items and eats your food, added bodypart: wooden club.
@Timeless Bob - very interesting list. What's it based on?
Some news:
- Hugo's turn is due to end tomorrow. How's things looking? After that it will be Zanzetkuken.
- I'm thinking we could later have extra "balancing" and "ecology" teams so modders can just work on adding stuff and somebody else can figure out how it fits into this at large... if there's interest and if this goes that far.
- I contacted sackhead by pm, and it appears there was some confusion about whether you are required during your turn to add bugfixes that aren't to your own things as new bugs are found. You are.
Three reasons:
1) The bugfix may depend on things that were added later/not by the author of the bugged thing
2) If we all implement out fixes in our own uploads, then you actually have to download them all, apply them all (and this is bad, as they may contain outdated other files, so you can't just overwrite when we've made changes to some old stuff now), and then upload, which is impractical
3) You are supposed to be able to leave this thread at some point without causing problems for everyone else
Considering he knows the matter, knows the fixes required, the fact that there's one more day left of his bugfixing turn is not an acceptable escape.
Quote from: Rules
...you must provide a fix for any bugs that appear during this time in a reasonable amount of time (asking for help is fine), or your turn will be voided. Your bugfixing duty ends after a week...
Whatever content we have is useless if it's buggy and broken, whatever rules we have are pointless if you can stall as much as you like. I will make the point that not fixing during your bugfixing turn is absolutely unacceptable, and unless the fixes are delivered in 48 hours his contribution will be removed from the first post and should be deleted from the mod, as it says in the rules that he agreed to.
List of files to be removed:
Code: [Select]
b_detail_plan_SKH.txt
body_SKH.txt
creature_SKH.txt
c_variation_SKH.txt
inorganic_stone_mineral_SKH.txt
material_template_organic_SKH.txt
reaction_SKH.txt
tissue_template_SKH.txt
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 06, 2013, 03:45:01 am
I've been researching this stuff on and off for a couple decades now, so there's quite a bit rattling around in my noggin waiting to spill out.
Post by: Halfling on August 06, 2013, 04:01:13 am
If you wanted to make there always be a large variety of creatures on the map, I suppose you would instead make such as ecosystem creatures, like a creature called RAINFOREST, which would contain eg. castes
IGUANA: POP_RATIO 100
TREE_SNAKE: POP_RATIO 350
SLOTH: POP_RATIO 45
JAGUAR: POP_RATIO 5
and a cluster size of 100. Define all bodies and all possible tokens inside castes. So then on average when you have 1 cluster on the map, you would have 1 jaguar, 9 sloths, 20 iguanas and 70 snakes on the map. Maybe that's a bit overkill on the snakes but you get the idea. Then set the jaguar to CRAZED so it kills the other castes. RAINFOREST_1 would be the creature most prevalent in rainforests containing that, while RAINFOREST_2 could be another sample with a pack of monkeys among them that you may alternatively get.
This could also be used to remove extinctions, because if one member of the cluster escapes it gets regenerated in entirety I've heard. So add a "nature spirit" caste to any such creature with a middling population ratio, that is indestructible, flying, and set to always run, always hide. Even if you kill all others you can't actually extinguish life in the biome that way without some clever tricks killing the spirits too (an obsidianizing/caving-in spawn trap would eventually do it).
Post by: The Urist on August 06, 2013, 05:36:31 am
Spider-centaurs won, but lost 52 centaurs and managed to kill only 8 halflings.
Post by: NRDL on August 06, 2013, 05:45:15 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 06, 2013, 09:07:42 am
Post by: Halfling on August 06, 2013, 09:31:48 am
This was originally intended for flavor and to be a little pesky if fighting halflings, but it turned out to be an important ability for survival, as civilians throwing rocks at hostile animals that come near your fort keeps them nicely at bay, despite how almost all wildlife is out to get you and halflings will die facing anything in melee. So I'm happy I added that.
The bow on the other hand has, IIRC, significantly reduced projectile speed compared to a vanilla railgun crossbow and should not be as lethal, and the arrows are smaller. At least that is what I remember trying to keep in mind there, vanilla crossbows are a little much.
Post by: kopout on August 06, 2013, 10:27:08 am
Post by: Meph on August 06, 2013, 10:32:07 am
Post by: kopout on August 06, 2013, 10:37:54 am
How exactly are you doing the fruit-trees? Do they drop logs using a material_template that is missing all wood-tags, so that the log cant be used as one, and is then consumed in a reaction to make the products and an actual log?Yes. though the game still treats them as logs so I made the procesing reaction automatic so you don't get a chance to use them.
Post by: emeralis00 on August 06, 2013, 10:59:32 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 12:04:31 pm
Been using my Daleks to test the world, since they only have 4 lines in their raws dependant on vanilla DF. They are not included in my modding contributions to this project, I'm just using them to test as compared to vanilla creatures they are quite overpowered. Interesting finding: due to the increased number of [LIMB] parts, they get fatal shots less often as these distract from the torso and head.
About bows: although vanilla bows need a nerf to not pierce through armor as easily, bear in mind the only armor we have so far is caps and chain robes. Arows should still be quite deadly to unarmored or lightly armored foes, though I have yet to test. You guys probably can speak from experience though.
Post by: Halfling on August 06, 2013, 12:16:07 pm
Armor is very rare - speaking of, to make it less so, when you upload, could you add my halfling leather armors from that more leather tiers post earlier? (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4459378;topicseen#msg4459378) So I have to say I honestly don't know how they work against armor either at this point.
Adding features you were working on but didn't have time to finish during your bugfixing turn is almost a tradition at this point. It just should work reliably at that point so we shouldn't need another bugfixing turn after the bugfixing turn :P
Formics, possibly due to their fast reproduction, tend to form large hives of formic vampires around villages btw. It's pretty funny. I once had a row of something like 10 lairs full of formic vampires. And you may have a lot of formics in just one.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 12:31:36 pm
Post by: AutomataKittay on August 06, 2013, 12:40:14 pm
Adding features you were working on but didn't have time to finish during your bugfixing turn is almost a tradition at this point. It just should work reliably at that point so we shouldn't need another bugfixing turn after the bugfixing turn :P
Famous last words, aren't those? ;)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 12:51:26 pm
Without Forgotten Beasts, the game uses the creatures defined in the raws. However, most of them succumb to age. In my year 200 world, there's still a hydra cocoon, cart, palanquin, and storm dragon wandering around down there.
EDIT: Dirigible Antelope now have [MOUNT_EXOTIC] :D
I imagine people dangle from the underside, using the vestigial legs as straps.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 01:17:32 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:MACTOPUS_HUGOL]
[DESCRIPTION:An enormous, landbound cephalopod. They plod through the grassland on eight thick legs, eating grass, shrubs, insects, and the occasional small rodent.]
[NAME:mactopus:mactopi:mactopus]
[CASTE_NAME:mactopus:mactopi:mactopus]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:mactopina:mactopinans]
[CREATURE_TILE:'M'][COLOR:2:0:0]
[PREFSTRING:size]
[PREFSTRING:trunk-like arms]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:CEPHALOPOD][CREATURE_CLASS:CEPHALOPOD_LAND]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_MANTLE:CEPHALOPOD_FACE:CEPHALOPOD_8ARMS_STANCE:CEPHALOPOD_BRAINS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_CHITIN_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_LAYERS_HUGOL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[NOBONES]
[NATURAL][BENIGN][HUNTS_VERMIN][GRAZER:200]
[LARGE_ROAMING][ALL_ACTIVE]
[BIOME:ANY_GRASSLAND][BIOME:ANY_SAVANNA][BIOME:SHRUBLAND_TROPICAL][BIOME:ANY_TROPICAL_BROADLEAF]
[FREQUENCY:50]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:200:2000]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:7]
[PET_EXOTIC][PETVALUE:600]
[NATURAL_SKILL:WRESTLING:8]
[ATTACK:BITE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:50]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:60000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:250000]
[BODY_SIZE:5:0:5050000]
[CHILD:3]
[MAXAGE:19:25]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:1800]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[SELECT_TISSUE:MUSCLE]
[TL_VASCULAR:2]
Post by: Meph on August 06, 2013, 01:40:19 pm
I just noticed something in legends mode. At the top of the list, with the megabeasts and such, there is a unique version of every single one of our critters, who "began wondering the depths of the world in a time before time."
Without Forgotten Beasts, the game uses the creatures defined in the raws. However, most of them succumb to age. In my year 200 world, there's still a hydra cocoon, cart, palanquin, and storm dragon wandering around down there.
I had something similar once from a bug. The game uses the first creatures it finds in the raws, alphabetically. But what do you mean: Without Forgotten Beasts? How did you mod them out?
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 01:42:24 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 06, 2013, 01:53:39 pm
@Meph: body_RCP raws were replaced with blank raws of the same name to silence error messages, and one (RCP_GLOSS_PAW) was removed entirely - this disables random creature generation completely until we have enough material to make our own. But I am not convinced it is using the first creatures in the raws as there's a variety of "normal" creatures it sends roaming the underground now, like Hugo listed.
@Hugo - by the way, did you ever watch The Future is Wild? Because there's this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7yQ9Yf6mO4).
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 02:17:43 pm
Squid gibbons? Hmm.....
Post by: Halfling on August 06, 2013, 02:25:29 pm
Feel free to make them a tree-dwelling civilization if it inspires your fancy :D
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 02:47:41 pm
Well it is inspiring but now I feel somewhat unoriginal. Anyway, I notice they didn't do any land nautiloids, so that's still good.
Gave the Mactopus a pummel attack so they don't use the bite except as a last resort. It should realistically be very hard for such a large cephalopod to bite mid-struggle as the beak is beneath the body. Also, it was somewhat overpowered at their size. Anyway, should you tame them, they will fill their pastures with dead bank voles :D
With that, moving on to third cephalopod.
Post by: Halfling on August 06, 2013, 03:00:39 pm
Sadly, no tree-dwelling civilizations until the next release :-[
Not as sites, but it would be pretty hilarious to have a giant octopus demand you cut fewer trees. :P Incidentally those diplomats should work for us even though they're bugged in vanilla, without any dfhacking, if done right (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Diplomat)
Also thing is, with every idea, it's been done before regardless of whether you know about it or not. Take it as inspiration while making what you think is cool.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 03:33:29 pm
Post by: sackhead on August 06, 2013, 05:05:39 pm
i have added the [SPECIAL] tag to the alchemical raws. as well as fixing the anvil and apple tree reactions.
link is here (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7881)
i have no idea how to fix the other bugs but this should work on those ones.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 05:19:02 pm
It would seem that eye tissue has WAY too much bleed associated with it. Arena testing shows that any injury to the eye causes bleedout lightning fast. To remedy this, I have removed [MAJOR_ARTERIES] from the eye tissue template. The only arteries in real eyes are relatively small, and should not even come close to the bleedout caused by puncturing the heart if punctured.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 05:43:23 pm
It seems like the weapons cannot penetrate the armor layer, but sometimes they just ignore it and damage the creature as if the armor didn't exist.
Spoiler: creature (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: body detail plans (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: armor tissue (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: armor material (click to show/hide)
Post by: kopout on August 06, 2013, 05:48:19 pm
Hmm. What's the error log look like? The body raws?
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 05:56:16 pm
Here's all the body parts in the creature, though I doubt the problem stems from them:
Code: [Select]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_MANTLE]
[BP:MANTLE:mantle:STP][UPPERBODY][CATEGORY:TORSO]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1200]
[BP:HEART:heart:STP][CON:MANTLE][CIRCULATION][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:HEART]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:LUNGS:respiratory sack:NP][CON:MANTLE][BREATHE][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:LUNG]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:GUT:digestive tract:NP][CON:MANTLE][GUTS][INTERNAL][UNDER_PRESSURE][SMALL][CATEGORY:GUT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:300]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_8ARMS_STANCE]
[BP:LBASE1:first arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE2:second arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE3:third arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LBASE4:fourth arm base:STP][LEFT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE1:fifth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE2:sixth arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE3:seventh arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RBASE4:eight arm base:STP][RIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][CATEGORY:ARMBASE][CON:MANTLE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LARM1:first arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM2:second arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM3:third arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:LARM4:fourth arm:STP][LEFT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:LBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM1:fifth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE1]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM2:sixth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE2]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM3:seventh arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE3]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BP:RARM4:eighth arm:STP][RIGHT][LIMB][GRASP][STANCE][CATEGORY:ARM][CON:RBASE4]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:800]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_BRAINS]
[BP:BRAIN:brain segment:STP][CON_CAT:ARMBASE][INTERNAL][SMALL][THOUGHT][CATEGORY:BRAIN]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:90]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_FACE]
[BP:REYE:right eye:STP][CON:MANTLE][SIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][RIGHT][CATEGORY:EYE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:30]
[BP:LEYE:left eye:STP][CON:MANTLE][SIGHT][EMBEDDED][SMALL][LEFT][CATEGORY:EYE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:30]
[BP:MOUTH:beak:STP][CON:MANTLE][MOUTH][INTERNAL][SMALL][APERTURE][CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:40]
Post by: kopout on August 06, 2013, 06:20:33 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 06:34:30 pm
I'm don't your fix will work, but I'll try it. Problem is, body detail plans add layers relative to body parts, not tissues. Wiki says BP_LAYERS_OVER adds the layers on top of the existing ones.
Tested, I was right. Didn't work.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 07:08:50 pm
Post by: kopout on August 06, 2013, 08:06:03 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 08:11:48 pm
Got an idea for an eldricht abomination, but it would take a while to make, so it's not going in right now.
It's called The Carousel. It's one big wheel-shaped thing, with about 14 armored knights on it. The knights are fully formed on their own but attached to the Carousel by poles. Should they be severed, the Carousel reanimates them, fully healed. While whole, the monster attacks with all the swords and body parts of 14 knights.
Post by: kopout on August 06, 2013, 08:32:50 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 08:34:43 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 06, 2013, 09:18:16 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 09:22:14 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 06, 2013, 09:40:06 pm
Did I add large poisonous insects to swamps? I think the only thing I meddled with there was the dengue mosquitoes. So, normal-sized bugs. Maybe some water striders, too, but I think I limited those to rivers :-\
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 09:47:30 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 06, 2013, 09:59:12 pm
I foresee problems when I am defining bodies like this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: kopout on August 06, 2013, 10:20:46 pm
Zanzetkuken, I think you'll be the first modder to actually focus on vertebrates since the invention of the duck by Halfling.The dirigible gazelles are vertebrates! Of a sort. And water striders will leave the rivers to attack any thing else on the embark. I once had them follow me to the edge of the map (were I had retreated when, to my horror, the river turned out to be a stream not a brook) to kill the expedition's doctor. Those things are worse than tarnish stalks in that tarnish stalks can be deselected on the embark screen but water striders force you to avoid all water bodies larger than brooks.
Did I add large poisonous insects to swamps? I think the only thing I meddled with there was the dengue mosquitoes. So, normal-sized bugs. Maybe some water striders, too, but I think I limited those to rivers :-\
I'm going to be adding in river, lake and ocean wildlife after I finish the trees so that the number of waters striders will be reduced.
Post by: sackhead on August 06, 2013, 10:45:42 pm
Zanzetkuken, I think you'll be the first modder to actually focus on vertebrates since the invention of the duck by Halfling.i added elephants (kind off)
Did I add large poisonous insects to swamps? I think the only thing I meddled with there was the dengue mosquitoes. So, normal-sized bugs. Maybe some water striders, too, but I think I limited those to rivers :-\
also i am thinking of making a bunch of elephant like harmless animals to fill in the world, if anyone is interested.
one idea i had was was a "Rocketphant" a small (about the size of a miniature horse) grazer that can use a flee reaction that shoots a blast of air out its trunk letting it fly very fast for a short amount of time (much like leting the air out of a balloon) and then crashing to the ground for Hilario results.
i was going to make them in my modding turn but i ran out of time
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 06, 2013, 10:55:15 pm
Interesting thing to note, I made the tile colors for dragons blend in with the terrain, in addition to the scale color variations. (ex. glacial biome dragons have a white tile to signify their scale coloration. While it is easy to see inside your fort, you won't see them coming before it is too late. Mountain ones have an opposite effect, in that, while you will likely be able to pick them out with minor difficulty outside, it will be a pain trying to find them in a fortress mined in gray stone.)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 06, 2013, 11:25:01 pm
That's kind of the dirigible antelope's thing, though.Zanzetkuken, I think you'll be the first modder to actually focus on vertebrates since the invention of the duck by Halfling.i added elephants (kind off)
Did I add large poisonous insects to swamps? I think the only thing I meddled with there was the dengue mosquitoes. So, normal-sized bugs. Maybe some water striders, too, but I think I limited those to rivers :-\
also i am thinking of making a bunch of elephant like harmless animals to fill in the world, if anyone is interested.
one idea i had was was a "Rocketphant" a small (about the size of a miniature horse) grazer that can use a flee reaction that shoots a blast of air out its trunk letting it fly very fast for a short amount of time (much like leting the air out of a balloon) and then crashing to the ground for Hilario results.
i was going to make them in my modding turn but i ran out of time
Post by: Gnorm on August 07, 2013, 01:19:26 am
-----
From the Journal of
16th Granite, 556
We now have an underground farm in the fort. This should help us maintain our food stocks.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/14dh5a8.png)
Two drawbridges have been built in the entrance. I hope to have them connected to levers soon.
17th Slate, 556
A few of migrants have arrived; they likely expected a city, and not a hole in the sand. We have:
1 Shearer
3 Hunters
1 Blacksmith
1 Mechanic
1 Potash Maker
1 Metalcrafter
1 Wood Burner
1 Weaponsmith
I'll see if I can make any use out of them.
14th Felsite, 556
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2hnsui1.png)
The caravan has arrived today. Trading shall commence shortly.
15th Felsite, 556
Those idiotic traders! As soon as they got within ranger of the fort their cargo blew up and they fled for the hills! When will halflings learn to not tamper with nature?
On a happier note, my wife has given me three more daughters: Siege Fieldhalfling, Loving Blackpumpkin, and Gall Homechief.
16th Felsite, 556
The forested caravan has arrived today. We might actually get a chance to trade with this one, as they tend to not dabble in alchemy.
26th Felsite, 556
We finally have a working well in Fort Mastertea!
(http://i40.tinypic.com/212cmxy.png)
Now, if we ever have to completely close up the entrance, we'll be able to survive with drinking water.
17th Hematite, 556
(http://i40.tinypic.com/k4xvh4.jpg)
Damn it! Just as I was beginning to believe that my family and I would make it, a Man-eater has arrived to ruin everything. I have but one hope, I must order everyone inside and shut the gate. I hope there is time.
20th Hematite, 556
Some more migrants have come; I hope they'll make it past the Man-eater.
21st Hematite, 556
Thank the gods! thank the theraphosae!
(http://i44.tinypic.com/etb1nr.png)
The beast has been slain, and the fort is safe once again. We can now resume our ordinary functions.
23rd Malachite, 556
Today our craftsman withdrew from society, for lack of a better term. If the observations of my predecessors are accurate, this may be bad for the fort.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2nj0op.png)
12th Galena, 556
Our secretive craftsman claimed our new clothier's shop today. I hope, for the sake of this fort, that he completes his project.
18th Galena, 556
The merchant's caravan has arrived today. If it doesn't explode, I might be able to obtain cut gems for my craftsman.
28th Galena, 556
We managed to get some gems to satisfy our craftsman. The last thing we need is another madman running about. Fort Mastertea is, however, gradually growing, and it may actually grow into a decent place to live. Below is a crude drawing of it.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/zjbjtt.png)
Autumn arrives tomorrow; I swear that this fort will last as long as is necessary for the survival of us all!
Post by: sackhead on August 07, 2013, 02:25:15 am
That's kind of the dirigible antelope's thing, though.Zanzetkuken, I think you'll be the first modder to actually focus on vertebrates since the invention of the duck by Halfling.i added elephants (kind off)
Did I add large poisonous insects to swamps? I think the only thing I meddled with there was the dengue mosquitoes. So, normal-sized bugs. Maybe some water striders, too, but I think I limited those to rivers :-\
also i am thinking of making a bunch of elephant like harmless animals to fill in the world, if anyone is interested.
one idea i had was was a "Rocketphant" a small (about the size of a miniature horse) grazer that can use a flee reaction that shoots a blast of air out its trunk letting it fly very fast for a short amount of time (much like leting the air out of a balloon) and then crashing to the ground for Hilario results.
i was going to make them in my modding turn but i ran out of time
I disagree , the Dirigible antelope drifts around slowly snacking on tree tops and remains in the year unless shot down.
the Rocketphint however is ground dwelling and shoots air out of its trunk when spooked moving very quickly and erratically, often coming down in an explosion of gore hence the "Rocket" apposed to the slow elegant Drifting of the "Dirigible" antelope.
basicly a bottle rocket made out of meat compared to a helium balloon
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 07, 2013, 04:20:07 am
I suppose a caste biome where one race diverged into various castes filling the roles needed to perpetuate the biome (like Niven's Ringworld) would be another way to do it: farms requiring fertilizing each regrowth, that fertilizer coming from a necro-dwarf processing a dead body at a special workshop, "vampire" or "were-creature" dwarves fulfilling the roles of predators (always-on = "carnivores", sometimes on="omnivores"), while normal dwarves fulfill the roles of herbivores, consuming the products of the new farms. The trick in a setup like that would be in keeping enough new births happening to replenish but not overburden the system. A fine balancing act.
Post by: The Urist on August 07, 2013, 04:27:20 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 07, 2013, 01:19:28 pm
Post by: Putnam on August 07, 2013, 01:36:40 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 07, 2013, 02:07:30 pm
Just saying, the Dirigible Antelope have a syndrome in their gas which makes them move incredibly fast for a bit once punctured, like a leak in a balloon propelling it. If they are airborne, this often results in them slamming into the ground in a bloody mess when they loose lift. Currently does not work reliably, but it is there.
Post by: kopout on August 07, 2013, 02:56:05 pm
Trees as they are on the over world
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
apple trees (replaces halfling's in the same file)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
reactions
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
fruit
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
wood
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
a few bugs remain such as the game treating raw trees as wood even though they lack wood tags
Edit: there will eventualy be figs, dates, coconuts (if I ever get them working) two kinds of deep tree( one harmles the other deadly, they look exactly the same in game 8)) and maybe deep lemons in the caves that burn forever at body temp
Post by: WillowLuman on August 07, 2013, 03:28:10 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:SQUID_RIVER_HUGOL]
[DESCRIPTION:A many-armed invertebrate commonly found in rivers. They prey on large water insects, yet are in turn preyed upon by them.]
[NAME:river squid:river squid:river squid]
[CASTE_NAME:river squid:river squid:river squid]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:larval river squid:larval river squid]
[CREATURE_TILE:'s'][COLOR:4:0:1]
[PREFSTRING:orange colour]
[PREFSTRING:many arms]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:CEPHALOPOD]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_MANTLE:CEPHALOPOD_FACE:CEPHALOPOD_8ARMS:CEPHALOPOD_TENTACLES:CEPHALOPOD_BRAINS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_CHITIN_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_LAYERS_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SOFT_EGG_MATS_HUGOL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[NOBONES]
[NATURAL]
[LARGE_ROAMING][ALL_ACTIVE]
[BIOME:ANY_TEMPERATE_RIVER][BIOME:ANY_TROPICAL_RIVER]
[FREQUENCY:60]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:200:2000]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:5][LOOSE_CLUSTERS]
[PET_EXOTIC][PETVALUE:30]
[AQUATIC]
[NATURAL_SKILL:WRESTLING:6]
[ATTACK:BITE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:50]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:30]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:30000]
[CHILD:1]
[MAXAGE:5:7]
[CARNIVORE][BONECARN]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[SPEED:2000]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:900]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[LAYS_EGGS]
[EGG_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:EGGSHELL:SOLID]
[EGG_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:EGG:LIQUID]
[EGG_SIZE:10]
[CLUTCH_SIZE:31:80]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[SELECT_TISSUE:MUSCLE]
[TL_VASCULAR:2]
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 07, 2013, 07:09:07 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 07, 2013, 07:33:15 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 07, 2013, 09:02:21 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 07, 2013, 09:11:00 pm
Post by: kopout on August 07, 2013, 09:53:52 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 07, 2013, 10:07:43 pm
Post by: kopout on August 07, 2013, 10:40:06 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 12:23:03 am
Post by: sackhead on August 08, 2013, 12:39:06 am
Suggestion: Make the rocketphants shoot indirected dust (called pressurised air or something) that flings them into air and adds them some tags so they survive the impact. They should have no cooldown so the rocketphants would fly insanely around when threatened :Pi don't particularly want them to survive. they are supposed to be a bit like lemmings.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 12:55:09 am
This would make them ridiculously deadly, though.Suggestion: Make the rocketphants shoot indirected dust (called pressurised air or something) that flings them into air and adds them some tags so they survive the impact. They should have no cooldown so the rocketphants would fly insanely around when threatened :Pi don't particularly want them to survive. they are supposed to be a bit like lemmings.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 08, 2013, 02:42:54 am
Post by: mastahcheese on August 08, 2013, 02:45:09 am
There's a difference between "lemming" and "suicide bomber"I'm sigging this.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 02:58:42 am
Before uploading, could you please make sure that it adds these known fixes: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4455187;topicseen#msg4455187
Most up to date raws with sackhead's patch (put it on the front page) should add numbers 2 and 4 on the bugfixes list.
Special leathers (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4459378;topicseen#msg4459378)are also on my wish-list but that's just add-on stuff, the above is necessary so we can forget about those issues. But they should work just by plugging said files in if wanted.
You don't need to upload it so fast you get in a hurry. It saves us all grief if the initial upload is well prepared, much more so than is caused by any potential miff from taking a little longer.
I'm reposting the checklist for uploading:
1.
2. Make sure it doesn't leave an errorlog after.
3. Upload (please, with a little description of what was added) and I'll put it up on the first page.
Post by: Knight Otu on August 08, 2013, 10:29:48 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 01:00:44 pm
Adding those other fixes. Carts/Palanquins already included, as seen in previous posts.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 01:35:52 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7884
Just overwrite it over the most recent version. I didn't include all the other raws because other people have made changes to them since.
Anyway:
-Six new creatures: 2 varieties of dirigible antelope, 4 wildly different Cephalopods
-Mallards now limited to lakes, rivers, ponds, and wetlands. [COMMON_DOMESTIC] still lets any civ anywhere use them, though.
-Hounds no longer exist in the wild, replaced by "Feral Hounds". They are restricted to badlands, tundras, mountains, and temperate forests, making room for other creatures to appear.
-Halfling's eye template changed so that eye injuries don't cause instantaneous bleedout
-Carts and palanquins added
-Had to move the Dirigible Antelope to my creatures file so that the variant would work
-Halflings no longer active during the summer
-Numerous bugs fixed, including all the fixes Halfling requested, no errorlog on my end.
I recommend playing with some Mountain or Tundra tiles on your map, so you get a good chance to see some of my new creatures.
More critters coming soon!
Post by: The Urist on August 08, 2013, 01:48:41 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 08, 2013, 02:03:30 pm
Also, are there any files not in rar format?
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 02:16:06 pm
They (rocketphants) wouldnt be so deadly if you give all other creatures [MATERIAL_FORCE_MULTIPLIER:<your air material here>:1:100](or add that tag to some creature variations like CLEANS_SELF_DAILY_HLG so all playable races and most pets would have it)( also im not sure if i wrote that tag right but it is something like that BTW). And you can add tags [NOPAIN] [NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT], [NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT] and [NOTHOUGHT] so they dont die from the fall and maybe even werecurse full heal with interactions.
It's not the material that does the damage, though, it's the cave-in dust physics sending people flying, skidding, and crashing into things at high speed. And it's a pretty big gameplay changer to make every creature into husk-like invulnerables just for one joke.
Post by: kopout on August 08, 2013, 02:38:36 pm
Also, are there any files not in rar format?^This I can't do dot rar and I can't do media fire. :( I wish I could, masterwork sounds like fun but is only in dot rar.
But in case you ment any version and not just the most recent nearly all of them on the first post are in the much more sane dot zip format. I have been working from laularukyrumo's version.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 02:44:50 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7884
Post by: Aseaheru on August 08, 2013, 03:07:22 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 03:14:09 pm
Spoiler: Jobs and Philosophy (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 03:29:40 pm
Please use zip FWIW. RARv3 is not free open source software and this somewhat limits its availability, even if windows users are used to downloading and installing winrar for their system.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 03:54:49 pm
Zanzetkuken, have at it please!
Already working! Unzipped my files are at 110 kilobytes, and counting. Going to use black color MTG cards for ideas on what to add to swamps. Marshes are going to remain how they are, so they can serve as an area Lizardkin can build up within.
Also, who has made syndromes? I need to contact them for buffing Lizardkin immune systems.
Post by: Meph on August 08, 2013, 04:03:07 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 04:07:20 pm
EDIT: And [EVIL] biomes, too! Breathstealer sounds like an [EVIL] creature.
Post by: Putnam on August 08, 2013, 04:08:43 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 04:17:04 pm
Yeah, Urborg Panther, Breathstealer and the Spirit of the Night... ;)
Spoiler: These look worse (click to show/hide)
Bear in mind that when adding danger to swamps (or any other region!) you don't have to fill ALL of them with super deadly creatures, you can restrict some to savage biomes.
EDIT: And [EVIL] biomes, too! Breathstealer sounds like an [EVIL] creature.
Marshes are kind. Swamps are going to be harder than hell.
...
...
That was an unintentional pun.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 04:29:35 pm
I don't see file format really making that much of a difference considering we're working with small text files. If this becomes even megabytes large it is humongous by mod standards considering it's all raws.
I've resolved I'll work more on the zerg in the weekends. Turns out making larva make useful creatures is hard. I'll try making them pets next so maybe then they'll breed. I also want to make a fairy/pixie civilization which are size 2-10 and indestructible in combat, but killable with temperature and their wings can be pulled off... just to see how well minuscule arrows from micro-bows work at killing large things, but I don't mind if someone else wants to steal and run off with that idea (or really, either).
Unfortunately from now on weeks will have to be owned by university business. Expect slower updates, with apologies in advance.
Post by: Gnorm on August 08, 2013, 04:44:28 pm
Part 6: In which we bid the town of Mastertea adieu
-----
From the Journal of
7th Limestone, 556
Dug out a section of the fort for a food stockpile. It'll all rot if left outside.
10th Limestone, 556
I've not seen my wife for about a week now; I hope that she's all right.
11th Limestone, 556
The craftsman has finally begun his mysterious construction; thank the gods! I was worried that we would have another madman on our hands.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/wm1hth.png)
16th Limestone, 556
(http://i40.tinypic.com/1zcixrb.png)
The craftsman has finally revealed his creation to be a bag.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/1070046.png)
It's pretty glorified, but it is also pretty cool. I think I'll put it in my room.
17th Limestone, 556
Today I found my wife, dead, on our bed, drained of all her blood. I'll find whatever monster did this, and I will murder him with my bare hands.
7th Sandstone, 556
Some more migrants have arrived; this quite possibly means more vampires in my fort. I'll keep a close watch on these ones.
17th Sandstone, 556
Today, my late wife was interred in a private tomb in the fort. I shall have the entrance walled off, to prevent any possible defilement.
13th Timber, 556
Our mechanic has become possessed today. I fear for him, considering what happened the last time someone became possessed here.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2n8diy0.png)
Supplementary Entry
The mechanic has claimed a mechanic's workshop, and has set about to collect materials. A merchant caravan has arrived, which I could easily predict by the sound of an explosion in the distance. The wounded merchants are leaving bloody trails all over this site.
16th Timber, 556
The forested ones have arrived as well. Perhaps we'll be able to obtain the thread the mechanic requires.
21st Timber, 556
My third daughter has been lost to me, but I believe that I have found the murderer in this fort. The potash maker will pay for his crimes!
1st Moonstone, 556
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2uppmvp.png)
I have beaten the criminal senseless, but I'm not finished yet. I'll punish him for other crimes that have been committed in the past. I'll make this beast pay with its life!
4th Moonstone, 556
Yet another daughter of mine has died in this cursed place! I no longer wish to survive out in this land. I now realize that I must purge the planet of this site!
1st Opal, 556
Our mechanic has become stricken with melancholy upon being unable to complete his construction. My family is down to my eldest daughter and I. The fort is too crowded; nothing ever gets done.
7th Obsidian, 556
Fort Mastertea is becoming just like what the original catacombs of Mastertea were. It is brought with anger, blood, and death. I am seriously considering taking my child, and leaving.
17th Obsidian, 556
Damn it! the spider-centaurs may serve to prevent my escape from occurring. Their army, however small it may be, is stronger than anything that we have! I have little hope.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2vtds0z.png)
19th Obsidian, 556
I have sent a small group to attempt to stop the centaurs. I doubt that they will succeed, but it may buy me time to execute my plan. I hope to dig into the original catacombs and hide there; the stench of death will keep the centaurs out.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2s64qat.png)
28th Obsidian, 556
I've heard reports of yet another spider-centaur force; I must work more quickly!
(http://i43.tinypic.com/11h6uxc.png)
8th Granite, 557
The spider-centaur force has been fought off. Now is the time to cut my losses, and leave. I'm taking my daughter and closing the fort. To those halflings who wish to follow me, I will not stop you. I believe that I shall leave this journal here, just in case any halfling decides that he wants to build this town back up to whatever glory it once had.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/15ch5rd.png)
Mastertea, I bid you adieu.
P.S.
Halfling, I believe that you forgot to update the file size on the main page for the last two versions.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 04:45:53 pm
Many of those cards look like Megabeasts. If you're going to make them wandering creatures, PLEASE put them in evil and/or savage swamps :(
I was unable to create as many creatures as I wanted due to college orientation, but I have many unfinished, passive creatures for swamps. Making an entire biome into a Deadly Deathland of Doom, whether [GOOD], [EVIL], [SAVAGE] or normal, kind of undermines what I've been trying to do (dilute the number of megabeasts-disguised-as-normal-animals) and limits the designs of other players for those regions. Why not go by alignment/temperment, and put those creatures in [SAVAGE]/[EVIL] swamps AND marshes? That way it's actually possible to distinguish which regions have which creatures from the world map, as swamps/marshes look identical and have the same name patterns but alignments are distinguished.
Look, it's fun to make monsters, but we also want the game to be playable and somewhat balanced. We've got to start restricting some of our deadlier wandering creatures to [SAVAGE] and/or [EVIL] areas. Some outside is fine and good for story/gameplay, but making EVERYWHERE alike to evil/savage places we start to ask how halflings even exist in the first place. Yes, bear in mind this is a world where HOBBITS have to make sense somewhere.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 04:59:08 pm
The time has come to formally end this.
[go read this part in his post]
Halfling, I believe that you forgot to update the file size on the main page for the last two versions.
We got to see megabeasts, halls covered in vomit, spider-centaurs, vampires and a very decent artifact. Good show, Gnorm. Thank you. Now would be a perfect time to present any wishes (balance changes or otherwise) and suggestions if you have some.
I did indeed forget. If nobody minds, I'll just update it with the latest info.
Post by: kero42 on August 08, 2013, 05:02:18 pm
I first copied Vanilla DF into a new folder which I have temporarily dubbed "Mod Fort", so as to not confuse it with vanilla
Then I downloaded :
Quote
+ sackhead's http://www.mediafire.com/?n23ps889fojunx5 | Customized Obsidian graphics http://www.mediafire.com/?wj1f8gk7720z7yafrom the front page
+ bugfixes for sackhead's turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7881
+ HugoLuman's turn: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7884
I deleted the original raws,
I unzipped these, then replaced the object folder with the object folder from the files, and tried to start did deleted things like language dwarf then ran the df from the mod folder, but the game said the book text instructions were in the wrong place, but i moved them and it then worked.
I tested the arena but found no creatures where on the list, so i quit and examined the files. Turned out I had put the "object" folder inside another object folder, so that was quickly fixed.
After genning a smallest possible world, I tested embarks. they didn't crash, so everything seemed fine. I abandoned, then tried to gen a medium world to play with the formics who hadn't lived in the small world.
And thats where I hit a snag. It would gen the world fine, allow me to examine it, etc, but when I selected to use the world as it was, the game would load/unload, freeze (which is normal for me during world gen), then I would get a "DF is not responding" popup , then the game would close.
I'm not sure what's wrong exactly, but I figured I'd ask any way. It's most likely some silly, stupid error on my part as opposed to some error with the mod though, as I've never modified raws before. Perhaps I deleted something important, or didn't delete something I need to? I apologise for wasting your time, but I honestly seem to have bitten off more than I can chew here. I also apologise in advance if I forgot to post any vital details.
EDIT: forgot to mention I also downloaded this
Quote
This file (hopefully) contains all the raws I have created or altered:
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7884
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 08, 2013, 05:03:35 pm
Fucking Obliterator
Though I'm hella tempted to try and implement Phyrexian Obliterator as a megabeast, myself. I'd also love to try and implement Infect (syndrome that gives -% to physical attributes and stacks), but I don't think there's a good way to make a syndrome stack unlimited times without some serious workaround. Though I guess I could just make 10 separate syndromes, each one checking for the previous before applying its effect, and have them each decrease attributes by (synstage x10) percent of maximum, and the last stage just outright kills the creature. Hmm... Sign me up for a second modding turn? I could do with adding a handful more inorganics, I have some issues with material frequency, and I never did do my megabeast.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 05:10:08 pm
The current way to make it work, because Hugo only uploaded a "delta" containing his changes, is
1. delete your objects/raw folder
2. unzip sackhead's
3. unzip Hugo's and overwrite
...assuming everything works. I haven't tested the newest add-ons yet.
Hm - Hugo, could we have an upload of a complete objects folder like the earlier ones? That way you don't have to mess around with it so much to start playing.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 08, 2013, 05:13:31 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 05:20:30 pm
I'll put everything into an up-to-date bundle, but first I need the right version of the other files. Bear in mind my files include changes to all of kopout's files and adding [SPECIAL] to the alchemy stuff.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 05:26:38 pm
This is why the original idea was that you do not edit the old files but rather add new ones, as much as possible. But unfortunately sometimes it is required.
I could compile this myself but I would prefer it to be on your DFFD so you can add updates to it.
Also I am going to edit the rules to clearly say that you should compile and upload a complete set of raws since that was the original intention anyway (hence all the talk about first updating everything to newest version, then uploading) - also prevents raws clashing which is a risk if you only have additions and didn't test them as a whole. This is rapidly turning into chaos.
Post by: kero42 on August 08, 2013, 05:33:46 pm
Players being unable to play it is a very serious thing. You're not wasting anyone's time :p
The current way to make it work, because Hugo only uploaded a "delta" containing his changes, is
1. delete your objects/raw folder
2. unzip sackhead's
3. unzip Hugo's and overwrite
...assuming everything works. I haven't tested the newest add-ons yet.
Hm - Hugo, could we have an upload of a complete objects folder like the earlier ones? That way you don't have to mess around with it so much to start playing.
Thanks, it seems to be working now. It looks a bit strange, but that's just my graphic pack. I can always download the ones on the front page later, but for now these will do. I haven't downloaded everything yet, but I think I'll just play around with what I have.
I'm not sure if It's already been discussed, or whether it's just my game, but doesn't it seem weird that the Formics noble titles aren't capitalized like most Civs' are? Not really major, just something I thought was strange.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 05:43:56 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7886
All my complete files plus the most recent version of everything else. Modders, work off this, as it includes all current fixes.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 05:52:19 pm
>Modders, work off this, as it includes all current fixes.
^this
And with that, we are officially at 425.6 kB
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 08, 2013, 06:05:32 pm
This is rapidly turning into chaos.
So in other words, it's Dwarf Fortress.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 06:17:09 pm
Many of those cards look like Megabeasts. If you're going to make them wandering creatures, PLEASE put them in evil and/or savage swamps :(
I was unable to create as many creatures as I wanted due to college orientation, but I have many unfinished, passive creatures for swamps. Making an entire biome into a Deadly Deathland of Doom, whether [GOOD], [EVIL], [SAVAGE] or normal, kind of undermines what I've been trying to do (dilute the number of megabeasts-disguised-as-normal-animals) and limits the designs of other players for those regions. Why not go by alignment/temperment, and put those creatures in [SAVAGE]/[EVIL] swamps AND marshes? That way it's actually possible to distinguish which regions have which creatures from the world map, as swamps/marshes look identical and have the same name patterns but alignments are distinguished.
You want to know why I am putting them exclusively in swamps? I'll show you why.
This is a marsh:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Look, it's fun to make monsters, but we also want the game to be playable and somewhat balanced. We've got to start restricting some of our deadlier wandering creatures to [SAVAGE] and/or [EVIL] areas. Some outside is fine and good for story/gameplay, but making EVERYWHERE alike to evil/savage places we start to ask how halflings even exist in the first place. Yes, bear in mind this is a world where HOBBITS have to make sense somewhere.
I've noticed that most of the deadly creatures have been sorted out to places that are considered to be difficult to survive in, such as deserts, badlands, and (at the end of my turn) swamps, and in those areas, civilized races have adapted, by living underground, such as the formics, or getting tougher in body (and hopefully immune system, if I can get a response to who made syndromes, then get permission to add some [SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:SWAMP_DWELLER] to some of them) like the Lizardfolk (I've been refering to them as Lizardkin by accident).
Post by: Gnorm on August 08, 2013, 06:22:12 pm
Now would be a perfect time to present any wishes (balance changes or otherwise) and suggestions if you have some.
There ought to be some sort of armor for the halflings to wear. A simple leather cuirass or basic chain mail should suffice, considering there seems to be a "no heavy armor" rule.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 06:30:47 pm
Now would be a perfect time to present any wishes (balance changes or otherwise) and suggestions if you have some.
There ought to be some sort of armor for the halflings to wear. A simple leather cuirass or basic chain mail should suffice, considering there seems to be a "no heavy armor" rule.
Indeed they should not be heavily armored. Still, did end up making halfling leather armors already (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4459378#msg4459378), but that addition didn't make it to the latest version. If you want it though, just overwrite the files in the lower part of the post with the spoilered content.
Reference: Top hat and tail cap - corresponds to cap; vest and tail coat - corresponds to leather armor; tall boots - boots with max ubstep; gloves - leather armor gloves
If you want to make the names less silly that's fine, the vest should be a cuirass and the tail coat an armor coat (since it covers the neck, arms, and upper legs).
Leather armor should be inherently better in this mod, but of course it's not been tested... and come to think of it, that would've been pretty hard since we don't actually have leather armor other than those pieces I made for that addition above.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 06:41:59 pm
Giant poisonous bugs, the main current deadly creatures, are potentially found in all rivers and in grasslands and forests. This includes other, non-predatory bugs given annoyance tags, thus leading them to violent conflict with fort members.
Swamps and marshes in real life have often served as the birthplace of civilizations, as they are easily converted to amazing farmland (being often found at river deltas). But turning ALL SWAMPS EVERYWHERE into deadly deathlands just isn't fair to other modders. It reduces diversity and available thematic choices. People are unable to make natural swamps if all swamps.
In real life people avoid such areas because they're logistically difficult and other places have more readily available resources, not because they're full of monsters. Eldricht abominations should be only an additional hazard, not an unavoidable one. People should have the choice between the challenge of getting through the water-logged soil of a swamp, and the challenge of that plus horrible death monsters.
It shouldn't be "ALL swamps are evil," it should be "EVIL swamps are evil."
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 07:39:59 pm
@Zanzetkuken:
Giant poisonous bugs, the main current deadly creatures, are potentially found in all rivers and in grasslands and forests. This includes other, non-predatory bugs given annoyance tags, thus leading them to violent conflict with fort members.
I agree, those should be nerfed, but without the modder's permission, can't do that easily.
...But turning ALL SWAMPS EVERYWHERE into deadly deathlands just isn't fair to other modders. It reduces diversity and available thematic choices. People are unable to make natural swamps if all swamps.
Considering the track record, how likely do you think natural swamps will be? In fact, I am going to create a more balanced swamp than what you are thinking of, because the cards I showed off are some of the bigger creatures.
Swamps and marshes in real life have often served as the birthplace of civilizations, as they are easily converted to amazing farmland (being often found at river deltas).
[snip]
In real life people avoid such areas because they're logistically difficult and other places have more readily available resources, not because they're full of monsters. Eldricht abominations should be only an additional hazard, not an unavoidable one. People should have the choice between the challenge of getting through the water-logged soil of a swamp, and the challenge of that plus horrible death monsters.
While that is true, in the current raws, everywhere else is of greater danger level. There needs to be a greater reason for them to have wanted to leave the swamps, and I am providing it.
It shouldn't be "ALL swamps are evil," it should be "EVIL swamps are evil."
See: counter-points 2 and 3
Hey, Halfling!
Could I modify the start biome and biome support segments of the halfling entity to be grassland/hill oriented, rather than any land? Thematically, it makes more sense for them to settle primarily in those areas, and players can still embark wherever they want.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 08, 2013, 07:52:08 pm
The intended net effect is "Enemy creature's attack connects with an Obliterator, and this is the trigger that causes GENERIC BAD THING to happen."
I was thinking, let's start with a generic bear, for simplicity's sake. We then add two auxiliary tissue layers that go on the outside of the creature. The outermost of these auxiliary layers is paper-thin, so it should break apart from literally any attack (hopefully allowing the force of the attack to continue through and actually do what it was intended, instead of just being SUPER ARMOR) and it will have healing rate 1, so that it regenerates instantly. The innermost auxiliary layer would be gaseous, and have a syndrome attached that would cause GENERIC BAD THING to happen.
There are problems I can envision, however. First, I don't know if tissue layers regenerate at all while combat is "ongoing". For instance, if I give bones max healing rate, break one bone, and then uselessly grab and release the bear's ear until the end of time, will the bone ever heal? Because if not (like I fear), then this is going to cause bad things to happen. Furthermore, I don't know if gaseous tissues have a different clause for healing than normal tissues (like, maybe the fake-skin repairs itself but the gas doesn't regen until combat is broken). I briefly thought that causing the gas layer to have a second syndrome, one that only affects the Obliterator, and causes it to heal via transformation, but that would have the unintended consequence of healing everything, and rendering it immune to attacks that don't kill it outright.
I also know from experience that [SECRETION] is semi unreliable, and that contaminants can be kind of finicky, not transferring the way I would like, so that workaround is likely unsuitable. Short of forcing every single attack from every single creature to induce a syndrome or interaction that only works on Obliterators and enables them to cause GENERIC BAD THING, I'm not sure what to do about this.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 07:56:04 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 08:02:57 pm
Just put the syndrome on the blood?
That has the tendency to proliferate...
...
'proliferate': put another counter of the same type that is already upon a creature/permanent/player/etc...commonly used on infect counters
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 08, 2013, 08:05:26 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 08, 2013, 08:14:35 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 08:22:26 pm
Actually, wetlands are currently near the HIGHEST danger level compared to everything else. There are only 2 creatures in the current raws assigned to them specifically: water striders and mallards. Water striders are relatively large, highly aggressive, and highly poisonous. Go to a swamp ingame, they're crawling with them and mallards. Swamps need more diversity, sure, but close to half of all animals there are giant horrific predators already.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 08, 2013, 08:24:54 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 08:34:11 pm
Quote from: Zanzetkuken
Hey, Halfling!
Could I modify the start biome and biome support segments of the halfling entity to be grassland/hill oriented, rather than any land? Thematically, it makes more sense for them to settle primarily in those areas, and players can still embark wherever they want.
Go ahead. "Any land" was intended to assure that they are always playable no matter what you do to the world and no matter how many weird races you add, as they were an intended "testing"/"vanilla" race as specified by the rules (one to be used to check whether the world is still habitable to regular humanoids)... But I suppose that will work too, rarely do you not have a more suitable place for a halfling to live than a glacier especially as we're not (yet) including worldgen parameters as part of this project anyway, and they're not choking on other civs yet either.
Oh yeah, on your debate about how to develop the world... first of all I think it's a pretty good discussion. The long-term solution to the problem of excessive deadliness would of course be creating lots of non-deadly animals. But if you feel it's urgent (I'm not sure, as we're not hearing that many stories of water strider related slaughter as player reports, but maybe that's because they quit playing after being slaughtered :P), then you could try persuading StL to nerf the original bugs a bit to create some less deadly species instantly. I personally have no strong opinion here, I consider it work in progress that could roll either way.
On the other hand creating lots of mammals for example could be done as easily as adding a few bodyglosses to copies of my HOUND. Or - add less deadly versions of things that you want to see nerfed. That's completely legit... by some standard. So for example if the toxicity of water striders is bugging you, add "poisonless water strider" copy creature that is more common and reduce frequency of original as you are allowed to. But that's one way to also make it so much more industrial and less lovingly hand-crafted.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 08:50:43 pm
We don't really need to nerf the creatures we already have, we just need to dilute them with more relatively harmless creatures.
We could also use a non-insect common domestic wagon puller, as those poor pack-beetles suffer terribly during the winter or in cold biomes.
Post by: Halfling on August 08, 2013, 08:55:19 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 08:57:47 pm
We don't really need to nerf the creatures we already have, we just need to dilute them with more relatively harmless creatures.
As I said, I showcased the big creatures. I'm setting the wizard's cupboard search to a low power level, and using a fair amount of those creatures, as well.
Go ahead. "Any land" was intended to assure that they are always playable no matter what you do to the world and no matter how many weird races you add, as they were an intended "testing"/"vanilla" race as specified by the rules (one to be used to check whether the world is still habitable to regular humanoids)... But I suppose that will work too, rarely do you not have a more suitable place for a halfling to live than a glacier especially as we're not (yet) including worldgen parameters as part of this project anyway, and they're not choking on other civs yet either.
Thanks! I was a little concerned about the spread of the Lizardfolk, since their limited to wetlands only, and have max site populations of 40 in world gen.
Hounds are wagon pullers too (for halfling fluff). Or cart- and palanquin-pullers as it stands. You might want to add others though... It might be fun to try the dirigible antelope, but that probably shouldn't go into any release
I can add a few green-color beasts to forests to serve that purpose!
Post by: kopout on August 08, 2013, 09:11:57 pm
I like the water striders all right. I don't think people have been going into swamps much in their gameplay, but the water striders are encountered often. Then again, since people have been playing mostly with the previous versions, they may just have seen hounds and mallards wherever they went, and little of anything else.I have gone to a lot of salt water swamps in my quest to perfect the coconut. I can honestly say that water striders are overly fond of murder-death-kill. Hounds back off when hit with a rock, water dtriders try harder to kill you. worse, they come in packs of 25
We don't really need to nerf the creatures we already have, we just need to dilute them with more relatively harmless creatures.
We could also use a non-insect common domestic wagon puller, as those poor pack-beetles suffer terribly during the winter or in cold biomes.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 09:31:16 pm
I have gone to a lot of salt water swamps in my quest to perfect the coconut. I can honestly say that water striders are overly fond of murder-death-kill. Hounds back off when hit with a rock, water dtriders try harder to kill you. worse, they come in packs of 25
Looking at the code, I think I saw that the clusters are only supposed to be in the 3-5 range. I wonder what is happening?
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 08, 2013, 09:34:51 pm
Maybe the game hardcode-style spawns "an instance" of a river creature in schools, since they're all fish. And so a cluster size above 1 is multiplicative. I don't know, I'm guessing.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 09:35:35 pm
Try and change up the MTG creatures some to make yours more original. While there's no specific rule, copying stuff straight from other settings doesn't seem quite... from scratch, you know? Heavily influenced is fine, though.
Of course, I can't force you, just a request.
For everyone:
When creating your megabeast, try listening to boss battle music for inspiration.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgpYfCnLhAo - Thought up "The Carousel" while listening to this one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xG1R8rk-M9E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8Yp3Pdo4ho
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcBrqqrCJTY
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 08, 2013, 10:00:05 pm
@Zanz
Try and change up the MTG creatures some to make yours more original. While there's no specific rule, copying stuff straight from other settings doesn't seem quite... from scratch, you know? Heavily influenced is fine, though.
Of course, I can't force you, just a request.
I'll try not to use overtly direct copies.
Post by: kopout on August 08, 2013, 10:10:02 pm
@ZanzPersonally I like this music
Try and change up the MTG creatures some to make yours more original. While there's no specific rule, copying stuff straight from other settings doesn't seem quite... from scratch, you know? Heavily influenced is fine, though.
Of course, I can't force you, just a request.
For everyone:
When creating your megabeast, try listening to boss battle music for inspiration.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgpYfCnLhAo - Thought up "The Carousel" while listening to this one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xG1R8rk-M9E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8Yp3Pdo4ho
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcBrqqrCJTY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkZo6T_-14k
Post by: WillowLuman on August 08, 2013, 11:39:53 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 09, 2013, 12:11:42 am
Post by: sackhead on August 09, 2013, 12:27:50 am
they are in .zip format.
and to all you foke who keep complaining about rar format GET WINRAR OR &-ZIP IT IS FREE SAFE AND EASY!!!
i plan to keep updating this to be obsidian graphics set compatible. I also plan to slowly create creature graphics as well.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 09, 2013, 12:35:19 am
Post by: sackhead on August 09, 2013, 12:40:17 am
Non-windows OS existsdoesn't 7-zip work on mac ect, never mind i t does not
any way for mac there is always this (http://www.unrarx.com/)
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 02:33:38 am
As for using rars, you are not compressing gigantic files where saving every byte is advantageous. And if you were, and wanted to save space, then you would go for 7-zip which is the superior compression and also more freely available. You don't need to save advanced NTFS options (which would be pointless since we don't all have NTFS and why would you even need them here). You don't need to encrypt, and if you did you would instead use 7-zip. So using .rar and obliging others to download extra bloatware programs to use it with you is like attempting to organize the mass games of futility. :P
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 09, 2013, 02:57:03 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 03:03:49 am
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 04:01:33 am
Code: [Select]
reaction_STL
[OBJECT:REACTION]
[REACTION:PREPARE_CHITIN_STL]
[NAME:prepare chitin]
[BUILDING:TANNER:CUSTOM_T]
[REAGENT:A:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][USE_BODY_COMPONENT][UNROTTEN][HAS_MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CHITIN_METAL_STL]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:METAL:CHITIN_METAL_STL]
[SKILL:TANNER]
Apparently a somewhat little used feature. Available to formics.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 04:03:30 am
Being an AP chemistry student, it's really odd to see Iridum used as the 2x better than iron metal when IRL it's a heavy, squishy gold-family metal.
Also, I think we ought to have gold and silver, just so we can make vanity things out of them to boast about in other threads.
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 04:14:30 am
Mm... meteoric iron, the iron that there currently is, if it weren't insanely precious in real life, could actually probably be worked into modern contemporary steel with superior tensile strength, since it is already alloyed with nickel, by just adding carbon (vanilla uses flux stones for this, but it might as well be charcoal for a very different experience) - that is, the vanilla steelmaking way.
Gold, silver, diamonds, rubies... anyone here who thinks we really SHOULD NOT have these ever? To make 'em different, give the materials different properties, uses, make gems more valuable so they're desirable and not clutter. Seems like an effort? No - just don't look at the vanilla version while making it and it'll become a new thing naturally. :P Can give different names like "brilliant diamond" or "pure gold" for extra coolness (so you would have such as a "pure gold goblet"). But those are such fantasy staples that basically you would need them.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 04:26:58 am
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 04:28:04 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 04:32:21 am
Code: [Select]
inorganic_metal_HugoL
[OBJECT:INORGANIC]
[INORGANIC:STEEL_HUGOL]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:METAL_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:steel]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten steel]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:boiling steel]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:0:7:1]
[BUILD_COLOR:0:7:1]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:30]
[SPEC_HEAT:496]
[MELTING_POINT:12718]
[BOILING_POINT:14968]
[SOLID_DENSITY:7850]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:6980]
[MOLAR_MASS:55845]
[IMPACT_YIELD:1505000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:2520000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:940]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:1505000]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:2520500]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:940] 160
[TENSILE_YIELD:434400]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:724080]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:225]
[TORSION_YIELD:430000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:720000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:215]
[SHEAR_YIELD:430000]
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:720000]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:215]
[BENDING_YIELD:431000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:720000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:215]
[MAX_EDGE:10500]
[ITEMS_WEAPON][ITEMS_WEAPON_RANGED][ITEMS_AMMO][ITEMS_DIGGER][ITEMS_ARMOR][ITEMS_ANVIL]
[ITEMS_HARD][ITEMS_METAL][ITEMS_BARRED][ITEMS_SCALED]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:SILVER]
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 04:37:29 am
Well - http://www.efunda.com/materials/alloys/alloy_home/steels_properties.cfm
If it's made from a source of pure iron (nonexistent at this time) then it should correspond to "carbon steel", while if it's made from meteoric iron then it would actually represent "alloy steel" or "tool steel" and so could be slightly harder and more durable... honestly I don't know enough about metallurgy to know for sure though, modern steels have chromium and other things too and not just nickel. But any excuse to make interesting differences, it's not like we're completely realistic.
Post by: sackhead on August 09, 2013, 04:44:35 am
There are other operating systems. And anyway... last time I checked, although it was some time ago, Windows has built-in zip functionality (send to archive) so why would you even need a separate program here?I am uploading .zip from now on so everyone can access them. (including the file i just uploaded),
As for using rars, you are not compressing gigantic files where saving every byte is advantageous. And if you were, and wanted to save space, then you would go for 7-zip which is the superior compression and also more freely available. You don't need to save advanced NTFS options (which would be pointless since we don't all have NTFS and why would you even need them here). You don't need to encrypt, and if you did you would instead use 7-zip. So using .rar and obliging others to download extra bloatware programs to use it with you is like attempting to organize the mass games of futility. :P
i just use rar because it is my default setting and i just need to right click to compress (I always compress files no matter how small as in my opinion it makes them easier to manage) also i a do acknowledge their are other operating systems out their but they make up less than 10% of the market, so if you use one you have to be prepared to make sacrifices
But seriously, though, if we don't have anything like steel, I'm just adding steel. It's so much more satisfying to say "draw steel, villain!" than "draw iridium, villain!" Also, need it for certain creatures.i Agree with you here their is no point in making fantasy alternatives to real metals when they have the same stats.
Being an AP chemistry student, it's really odd to see Iridum used as the 2x better than iron metal when IRL it's a heavy, squishy gold-family metal.
Also, I think we ought to have gold and silver, just so we can make vanity things out of them to boast about in other threads.
Also we al know roughly how strong steel is but most people would have no idea about some of the added metals they could be as strong as adamantine or as weak as wood. We could use adding them as a chance to rebalance them compared to normal DF ass well.
If you are going to make a fantasy metal with unique characteristics go for it but do we rarely need a metal that is exactly like copper but called Xexceanium which by the way the Forums spell check reads as "Germanium".
of course this is just my opinion and your welcome to disagree.
Post by: sackhead on August 09, 2013, 04:50:29 am
Okay.
Well - http://www.efunda.com/materials/alloys/alloy_home/steels_properties.cfm
If it's made from a source of pure iron (nonexistent at this time) then it should correspond to "carbon steel", while if it's made from meteoric iron then it would actually represent "alloy steel" or "tool steel" and so could be slightly harder and more durable... honestly I don't know enough about metallurgy to know for sure though, modern steels have chromium and other things too and not just nickel. But any excuse to make interesting differences, it's not like we're completely realistic.
sorry for the double post but we could treat the new steel as if substance such as carbon and metals were added as it was worked and just give it all round good stats (i am not sure which stats are used for what in game so i cant be more specific)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 04:52:11 am
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 05:01:17 am
Okay.
Well - http://www.efunda.com/materials/alloys/alloy_home/steels_properties.cfm
If it's made from a source of pure iron (nonexistent at this time) then it should correspond to "carbon steel", while if it's made from meteoric iron then it would actually represent "alloy steel" or "tool steel" and so could be slightly harder and more durable... honestly I don't know enough about metallurgy to know for sure though, modern steels have chromium and other things too and not just nickel. But any excuse to make interesting differences, it's not like we're completely realistic.
sorry for the double post but we could treat the new steel as if substance such as carbon and metals were added as it was worked and just give it all round good stats (i am not sure which stats are used for what in game so i cant be more specific)
Probably nobody has a problem with doubleposting when you actually have two different things to respond to. Actually, advanced steelmaking where you would have one generic "steel" and then could make different varieties of steel by adding in different metals into the alloy (+chromium -> stainless steel, +nickel -> maraging steel, +chromium and nickel -> surgical steel, but probably called something different) would be extremely sweet. But it would be some work to make.
Having a metric for materials is good, yes. I suppose meteoric iron can't really be used as such because nobody is that familiar with it.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 05:03:59 am
Code: [Select]
[BODY:ARM_PLATEMAIL_HUGOL]
[BP:PAULDRON:pauldron:STP][CON_CAT:ARM][EMBEDDED]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:COWTER:cowter:STP][CON_CAT:EBLOW][EMBEDDED] //aka Elbow plate
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:GAUNTLET:gauntlet:STP][CON_CAT:FOREARM][EMBEDDED]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BODY:LEG_PLATEMAIL_HUGOL]
[BP:CUISSE:cuisse:STP][CON_CAT:THIGH][EMBEDDED]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:POLEYN:poleyn:STP][CON_CAT:KNEE][EMBEDDED] //aka Knee plate
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:100]
[BP:GREAVE:greave:STP][CON_CAT:SHIN][EMBEDDED]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:SOLLERET:solleret:STP][CON_CAT:FOOT][EMBEDDED]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:120]
Post by: The Urist on August 09, 2013, 05:30:45 am
Sidenote: My herbalist absolutely detest treelords
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 05:50:28 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 09, 2013, 07:14:56 am
Are the pack beetles supposed to be cold-blooded killers? I embarked with formics somewhere (i didnt check the biome) with formics.I took 60 mallard ducks and 2 mallard drakes with me (they are pretty cheap).Almost instantly after arriving to my outpost,a group of 5 pack beetles wandered to my little colony. First I thought that they were harmless herbivore wild animals but they managed to kill 4 of my ducks and rip my herbalist's left lower arm off.
Sidenote: My herbalist absolutely detest treelords
They have the "BENIGN" token and are intended to be peaceful herbivores ??? Did the formics do anything to provoke them? If it were halflings, I'd think the answer would be an unqualified "yes", but unless I erred somewhere, Formics can't throw rocks.
Post by: AutomataKittay on August 09, 2013, 07:38:55 am
Are the pack beetles supposed to be cold-blooded killers? I embarked with formics somewhere (i didnt check the biome) with formics.I took 60 mallard ducks and 2 mallard drakes with me (they are pretty cheap).Almost instantly after arriving to my outpost,a group of 5 pack beetles wandered to my little colony. First I thought that they were harmless herbivore wild animals but they managed to kill 4 of my ducks and rip my herbalist's left lower arm off.
Sidenote: My herbalist absolutely detest treelords
They have the "BENIGN" token and are intended to be peaceful herbivores ??? Did the formics do anything to provoke them? If it were halflings, I'd think the answer would be an unqualified "yes", but unless I erred somewhere, Formics can't throw rocks.
I've had some benign-tagged animals go hostile on me in vanilla fortresses, or be provoked by running into pets. I'd guess it's their wandering path accidentally running into a crowd then acting up. Or possibly an hunter provoking them. I've pretty much long learnt to just kill anything that wanders in too close or seal things up out of the way.
Post by: kero42 on August 09, 2013, 09:22:30 am
Post by: kopout on August 09, 2013, 11:03:34 am
Post by: kero42 on August 09, 2013, 11:32:24 am
edit: It would appear I can still give her a room though, so it should be fine
Post by: kopout on August 09, 2013, 11:37:38 am
Post by: kero42 on August 09, 2013, 11:55:31 am
Edit: also, treelord wrestlers are going in and out my fort for no apparent reason, despite my depot being at the forts entrance, and even though the first corpse "died" and the formics continued walking, it came back to life and is still called "elf mutilated corpse" and is now interrupting again.
EDIT: sorry if I refered to my formics as "dwarves", force of habit, :-[
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 11:58:31 am
Post by: kero42 on August 09, 2013, 12:02:31 pm
What I'm not sure of is why there are dwarves.
Force of habit, sorry, I typed "Dwarves" without thinking. :-[.
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 01:51:39 pm
Small question. Are golden mamaphints supposed to be able to learn skills? because I my first formic migrant wave came with a "Goldan Mamaphint Strand Extractor". Also, will he actually be able to extract strands? Or is he like those tiger people you can buy in vanilla, who can have medical skills but don't use them?
Uh, first of all congrats on finding a bizarre animal by even this world's standards. Let's hope he's useful... but really, he's not going to be. Exactly like the tigermen. Not that you probably have many strands to extract anyway.
Sackhead -- is it intentional that mamaphints are both CAN_LEARN and trainable? Because you don't need the first for the latter and the first actually gives them civilian professions... and it's rather conspicuously in a sea of whitespace in the middle of the creature so I'm not sure.
Also the name thing. You don't mind spelling corrections, right? They're no disrespect. So it currently reads
goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint, so even the plural of those is mamaphint
Goldan should be golden, right? If it refers to the color of the creature. Mamaphint... now it can be called mamaphint all it wants, but did you mean "mamaphant" (mama + elephant) or maybe "mammophant" (mammoth + elephant)? And should the plural be mamaphint or mamaphints?
I'm adding your newest update to the front page btw, forgot earlier.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 01:55:33 pm
Probably best to ask first, though.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 09, 2013, 01:57:18 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 01:59:42 pm
Ok, so, coconut shell as a tool works but I now have a +coconut shell+ . Yes, finly crafted shells. Oh well, maybe they didi a realy good job of making sure it came out usable.
Coconut shells as tools is going to be more than a bit of a problem as you will need custom reactions to work those, and you have to enable those for the entity in every entity for them to be able to make them if they're tools.
Try this instead:
- coconut shell is an inorganic material with usage tokens
- reaction produces a type BOULDER:NONE item made of coconut shell
this should yield a stone-like item called simply "coconut shell" that can be used in vanilla reactions according to the tokens you gave it
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 02:15:00 pm
Hi, I know I've been asking a lot of questions recently, but I have one more. I'm trading with the elves, buying some pumpkins and cloth etc, then I keep getting these "X cancels (drink/move object/ eat/etc), Interrupted by mutilated elf corpse". I look around and then find one outside my forts entrance, near the depot. Its head is gone and its arms are dented. I'm not sure why its dead, or why my Formics are being interrupted on their way from the embark caravan to the fort proper.
Edit: also, treelord wrestlers are going in and out my fort for no apparent reason, despite my depot being at the forts entrance, and even though the first corpse "died" and the formics continued walking, it came back to life and is still called "elf mutilated corpse" and is now interrupting again.
EDIT: sorry if I refered to my formics as "dwarves", force of habit, :-[
We're not that vicious about what you call your pet ants so don't worry :D
Hm. Treelords raise elves... but actually, looking at it more closely, they ANIMATE the elves, not RESURRECT. This makes the raised elf always hostile, even if you are friendly with the other elves (found this out when making zerg queen spawn larva). So this can mean that
1. Forested caravan arrives
2. An elf dies to a water strider
3. Treelord resurrects elf
4. You now have a hostile elf zombie to deal with that a friendly treelord keeps resurrecting
Post by: WillowLuman on August 09, 2013, 02:16:04 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 09, 2013, 02:25:05 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 02:27:08 pm
It's simple: Don't give raised elves [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE]
Figured I gave that to the larva? :P
His raws don't specify OPPOSED_TO_LIFE or indeed any syndrome, just animation. It works like I said - feel free to test.
Post by: kopout on August 09, 2013, 02:31:17 pm
opposed to life is hardcoded onto things that get animated :(It's simple: Don't give raised elves [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE]
Figured I gave that to the larva? :P
His raws don't specify OPPOSED_TO_LIFE or indeed any syndrome, just animation. It works like I said - feel free to test.
dosn't work. just because the material is [SHELL] dosn't meen tha item is. It has to be a corps part to work in the vanela crafing reactions and you can produce corps parts in a reaction ( thats what caused the crash) Alternativly I could just have coconut shells be useles refuse, but they are so useful IRL that that feels wrong. If I do that I might as well get rid of coconuts.Ok, so, coconut shell as a tool works but I now have a +coconut shell+ . Yes, finly crafted shells. Oh well, maybe they didi a realy good job of making sure it came out usable.
Coconut shells as tools is going to be more than a bit of a problem as you will need custom reactions to work those, and you have to enable those for the entity in every entity for them to be able to make them if they're tools.
Try this instead:
- coconut shell is an inorganic material with usage tokens
- reaction produces a type BOULDER:NONE item made of coconut shell
this should yield a stone-like item called simply "coconut shell" that can be used in vanilla reactions according to the tokens you gave it
Hold on! a "+coconut shell+"? Did you just invent a method to tell good fruit from bad?!! Wow!sort of
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 02:36:24 pm
dosn't work. just because the material is [SHELL] dosn't meen tha item is. It has to be a corps part to work in the vanela crafing reactions and you can produce corps parts in a reaction ( thats what caused the crash)
Well obviously. But since you can make coconut shell crafts anyway if you make it a boulder, I thought it would be sufficient...
But sure you can produce corpse parts in a reaction. You just need to make the coconut processing produce a gas that transforms the creature doing the processing into a "creature working on a coconut" which has a coconut shell shell that comes off immediately, and then transforms back. That way you get a coconut shell that's an actual shell body part.
Lord Titpants, coconut processor, has transformed into a creature carving a coconut shell!
Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.
Post by: kopout on August 09, 2013, 02:44:05 pm
Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right :P
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 02:49:16 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 09, 2013, 02:53:08 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 09, 2013, 03:12:48 pm
Anyone interested in giving our newest version (Hugo's) a play turn, by the way?
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 09, 2013, 05:17:26 pm
As far as why it's the better-than-steel equivalent, I'll admit I took a little creative liberty, but aside from the MAX_EDGE I wouldn't expect it to be -that- weird. Iridium is the second-densest element and second-most resistant to elastic strain, and is very hard. I intended for it to be excellent in armor and blunt weapons... perhaps I should nerf its effectiveness in blades, sort of like an anti-Adamantine--bluemetal gives you whiffle bats while Iridium gives you butterknives. Perhaps I should demand that bars of Iridium be alloyed with some other metal in a very low quantity (say, 10-20% alloy composition) before being worked? I'll admit that Iridium was kind of a bust due to being far more difficult to actually get than I had anticipated.
Post by: Gnorm on August 09, 2013, 05:59:12 pm
Post by: sackhead on August 09, 2013, 07:42:32 pm
Small question. Are golden mamaphints supposed to be able to learn skills? because I my first formic migrant wave came with a "Goldan Mamaphint Strand Extractor". Also, will he actually be able to extract strands? Or is he like those tiger people you can buy in vanilla, who can have medical skills but don't use them?
they are supposed to have [CAN_LEARN] as in real life Elephants are very smart and can be trained to do crazy things , also their trunk is a grasper so they can wrestle weapons away and level up in them it was meant as an Easter egg when you find one of you Mamaphant's has stolen an invaders sword and levels up in it. On the Strand extraction it would be nice if it could but i doubt it.
I believe the only labors pets can do is fishing and hunting.
too bad there is no way to train them
He told me via PM that the "-phint" is intentional, sort of like the "-phont" in "oliphont," but I'm not sure about the Goldan. And, given the spelling mistakes in the description...the Goldan is miss spelling my raws are shocking like that, i probably should type out descriptions on word so i have spell check
Probably best to ask first, though.
is it a mammoth+plant?
that would be mamaplant, not a bad idea actually
Small question. Are golden mamaphints supposed to be able to learn skills? because I my first formic migrant wave came with a "Goldan Mamaphint Strand Extractor". Also, will he actually be able to extract strands? Or is he like those tiger people you can buy in vanilla, who can have medical skills but don't use them?
Uh, first of all congrats on finding a bizarre animal by even this world's standards. Let's hope he's useful... but really, he's not going to be. Exactly like the tigermen. Not that you probably have many strands to extract anyway.
Sackhead -- is it intentional that mamaphints are both CAN_LEARN and trainable? Because you don't need the first for the latter and the first actually gives them civilian professions... and it's rather conspicuously in a sea of whitespace in the middle of the creature so I'm not sure.
Also the name thing. You don't mind spelling corrections, right? They're no disrespect. So it currently reads
goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint:goldan mamaphint, so even the plural of those is mamaphint
Goldan should be golden, right? If it refers to the color of the creature. Mamaphint... now it can be called mamaphint all it wants, but did you mean "mamaphant" (mama + elephant) or maybe "mammophant" (mammoth + elephant)? And should the plural be mamaphint or mamaphints?
I'm adding your newest update to the front page btw, forgot earlier.
it should be mamaphints
Post by: sackhead on August 09, 2013, 07:45:02 pm
Will be interesting to see how migrating goes if this is still active at the time.sorry for the double post.
Anyone interested in giving our newest version (Hugo's) a play turn, by the way?
firstly i would like to sign up for a play turn.
and now i am signed up i can give hugo's a play turn
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 09, 2013, 08:43:40 pm
Code: [Select]
[MATERIAL_FORCE_MULTIPLIER:AERESIUM_LKR:1000000000:1]
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 09, 2013, 09:44:41 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 09, 2013, 10:09:20 pm
That's a really bad idea. Aeresium is not supposed to be weapons-grade. Would you make a creature that has a material weakness to lay pewter, for instance?
Why do you think I made it that large? And through custom reactions and a custom workshop, lizardkin can make weapons from it.
Post by: sackhead on August 09, 2013, 11:34:49 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 10, 2013, 01:37:48 am
That's a really bad idea. Aeresium is not supposed to be weapons-grade. Would you make a creature that has a material weakness to lay pewter, for instance?
Why do you think I made it that large? And through custom reactions and a custom workshop, lizardkin can make weapons from it.
The point is that you're not supposed to be able to make weapons out of it in the first place! It's not hard to define your own metal, give it an ore, and use that instead of modifying-but-not-really something that someone else did and perverting it for your own purposes. It's also much less unethical.
Post by: sackhead on August 10, 2013, 02:31:54 am
it does reduce the amount of pointless bloat metals and it is nice for Aeresium to have a purpose beyond a building materialThat's a really bad idea. Aeresium is not supposed to be weapons-grade. Would you make a creature that has a material weakness to lay pewter, for instance?
Why do you think I made it that large? And through custom reactions and a custom workshop, lizardkin can make weapons from it.
The point is that you're not supposed to be able to make weapons out of it in the first place! It's not hard to define your own metal, give it an ore, and use that instead of modifying-but-not-really something that someone else did and perverting it for your own purposes. It's also much less unethical.
Post by: Halfling on August 10, 2013, 05:34:52 am
What do you think of the idea of doing an actual succession fort with this mod once we get this to a stable/finished(esque) state?
As soon as it's ready for it, anytime. That would be very nice. And if that's your plan I'm sure none of us would object if it started whenever. At this time I don't know if there's enough content yet to keep it entertaining. But it would obviously be the best, most thorough playtesting we could have and many upgrades can be applied on the fly (balances and bugfixes, but no new content), so it doesn't have to be exactly finished yet.
firstly i would like to sign up for a play turn.
and now i am signed up i can give hugo's a play turn
Go right ahead!
Post by: Halfling on August 10, 2013, 05:44:11 am
Small question. Are golden mamaphints supposed to be able to learn skills? because I my first formic migrant wave came with a "Goldan Mamaphint Strand Extractor". Also, will he actually be able to extract strands? Or is he like those tiger people you can buy in vanilla, who can have medical skills but don't use them?
they are supposed to have [CAN_LEARN] as in real life Elephants are very smart and can be trained to do crazy things , also their trunk is a grasper so they can wrestle weapons away and level up in them it was meant as an Easter egg when you find one of you Mamaphant's has stolen an invaders sword and levels up in it. On the Strand extraction it would be nice if it could but i doubt it.
I believe the only labors pets can do is fishing and hunting.
too bad there is no way to train them
...
it should be mamaphints
Then I suggest the following fixes to mamaphints:
1. Name line and caste name line should read
Code: [Select]
golden mamaphint:golden mamaphints:golden mamaphint2. Set natural skill: strand extraction to e.g. 10. (they will always be listed as strand extractors by civilian profession, note that they still don't do the job) This is for step 3
3. Set custom profession title: strand extractor: beast
So what this accomplishes is: mamaphints can gain skills, but they are always listed as "mamaphint beast", not e.g. "mamaphint woodcutter" or "mamaphint animal trainer", which is confusing because they can't do those jobs. Also it makes it more of an easter egg when they learn wrestling.
Code: [Select]
[NATURAL_SKILL:EXTRACT_STRAND:10] # grand master strand extractor, which overrides their other skill titles but not the skills
[PROFESSION_NAME:STRAND_EXTRACTOR:beast:beasts] # with the above, they are now always called beasts and not by identifiable civilian profession
Post by: kopout on August 10, 2013, 12:19:24 pm
It's good to have things that are just flavour though. Maybe have the monster killing mettle made from Aeresium and something else as an alloy?it does reduce the amount of pointless bloat metals and it is nice for Aeresium to have a purpose beyond a building materialThat's a really bad idea. Aeresium is not supposed to be weapons-grade. Would you make a creature that has a material weakness to lay pewter, for instance?
Why do you think I made it that large? And through custom reactions and a custom workshop, lizardkin can make weapons from it.
The point is that you're not supposed to be able to make weapons out of it in the first place! It's not hard to define your own metal, give it an ore, and use that instead of modifying-but-not-really something that someone else did and perverting it for your own purposes. It's also much less unethical.
Quote
Would you make a creature that has a material weakness to lay pewter, for instance?I would. and then make something like lay pewter brass knuckles so you have to punch the monster to death.
( woot page 100)
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 12:44:16 pm
We really need all the files as zips...
or atleast laularukyrumo's modding turn as one.
you know what, just ingnore me. I can just use the latest one for everything.
and I find "the lords of idiot." you guys sure find some interesting things for this to turn up.
Post by: The Urist on August 10, 2013, 02:31:17 pm
Edit:On my modding turn I'm going to add animal-loving, robe- and slipper-wearing, peaceful, sissy
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 10, 2013, 05:54:35 pm
We really need all the files as zips...
or atleast laularukyrumo's modding turn as one.
I resent that! I uploaded mine as a .zip. DFFD confirms it.
Worldgen crashing is generally a bad sign though. There have been so many updates by now that I think we need to rectify this. I haven't changed my files much (except for a couple of extremely minor edits that I plan on integrating with my eventual second modding turn in the distant future), but anybody that has updates to make should probably, IN CHRONOLOGICAL ORDER OF TURNS, apply all fixes to their own files and then merge.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 06:37:29 pm
you guys also need more brewables. I think all there is now is tarnish root and honey.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 10, 2013, 07:26:39 pm
Bug or Intended?: formics cant build nest boxes(but can embark with mallards?)[note that i'm not uring the Sackhead's version because of the infernal RAR]
Do we still have nest boxes? If we do, I may not have added the tool entry for their entity raw, but rock pots were stripped out, so hey - why not nest boxes too?
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 07:31:45 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 10, 2013, 07:38:20 pm
I can't fathom how laula's turn save could crash but Hugo's would not, since the latter is supposed to be based on the former. And laula's turn has been downloaded so many times without issue... are you positive it was the correct link?
While alcohol is the lifeblood of DF, it's probably not been high on the list as neither of the playable races prefers to drink alcohol (actually since alcohol induces hangovers for them, drinking it is worse than water).
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 10, 2013, 07:48:03 pm
Looks like simple modification to the body detail plan won't work. Oh, halfling, nice three-part wings. If only you didn't code them as arms...
The link for it is a RAR.
you guys also need more brewables. I think all there is now is tarnish root and honey.
Well, you will need to wait for the next turn. Farming is not on the list for my carnivorous race.
Oh, to offset water striders, I added slimes to all brackish water, and to offset some of the dangerous land creatures, I added wandering spirits. One of them is crashing the game, though. I want the error log cleared up, first.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 07:58:29 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 10, 2013, 08:15:45 pm
Post by: sackhead on August 10, 2013, 08:54:25 pm
Anyone fix the burning caravans yet?my bug-fix turn may have. i fixed what was suspected to cause it, i am not sure if it is included in the later versions however.
we think it was coulsed by either the Alchemy RAWS or my doom coal lacking the [SPECIAL] tag. i did think it was funny.
this does give me and idea. we add a boiling stone to caravans that should boil as soon as they enter the map and after enough time for them to have reached the depo it transforms them into crazed saboteurs
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 08:57:14 pm
also, I think I have the newest raws and all my halfling caravans burn...
Post by: sackhead on August 10, 2013, 09:04:32 pm
i'll upload them in a zip format they should be compatible with hugo's turn
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 09:13:49 pm
Post by: sackhead on August 10, 2013, 09:19:53 pm
screw press and soap makers are gone as they were coded for in the raws.
their have been alot of problems with the lumberyard tree jems does sound new to me. is it like "Apple wood gems" or literaly "Tree Gems"
I dont think you need to process jugs of honey beyond brewing them
in vanila you got "Honey comb" items that neaded to be pressed then made into meed
EDIT: IF YOU ARE USING HUGO"S RAWS MY BUG FIXES ARE INCLUDED
Aseaheru are you sure you are using the latest raws? because if so we should to find out what is actually causing the exploding wagons
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 10:21:47 pm
also, some of the caravans seem to explode and emerge unscathed. I think the incense is doing something odd.
Post by: sackhead on August 10, 2013, 10:38:14 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 10, 2013, 10:39:49 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 10, 2013, 10:59:23 pm
Well, I try to transfer the body system over from DF-modded to halfling's, with my own changes, and then the whole thing falls apart giving me a 300 kilobyte file...
Looks like simple modification to the body detail plan won't work. Oh, halfling, nice three-part wings. If only you didn't code them as arms...
Heh. Wasn't thinking clearly at the time about the benefits of not making them mutually exclusive with my arms. They are not mutually exclusive with any other arms though since my LARM/LELBOW/LFARM/LWRIST/LHAND BP scheme did not catch on. Feel free to just steal them and rename the BPs as necessary.
also, some of the caravans seem to explode and emerge unscathed. I think the incense is doing something odd.
Inre your earlier post, yes we did delete everything and that will cause some issues such as most likely the wood gems (lack of valid crafts or lack of gem variety - they have been there from the start), and lack of screw presses unless someone makes one. That's just how it works. Until new fruit trees are implemented, lumberyards only process apple trees (and are required to be built to get apples from apple trees).
Mm... also, there should be no such thing as honey at this time...? You probably mean honeydew. It can be brewed at a still. Once we do have something that makes honey, then we might want to add a honey workshop. Apiary that has a reaction to produce bees if there are none on your map and to get the honey? But that's not yet here.
The exploding caravans however were supposed to be dealt with... This is to do with alchemy. StL, new ideas?
The alchemy volatile materials do now have [SPECIAL] in the newest version so it should not be those exploding. Any chance a creature is extremely explosive and the merchants could be bringing them in cages? Blazewood is another thing that burns, could something have access to that? Could something cause something to be made of a random wood so it might be blazewood? Does anything newly added have a very low ignition point? Vigor template has an ignition point of 10150 so that shouldn't be it.
Blazewood maybe should have [SPECIAL] anyway as in no case should a civilization have access to it... but it seems unlikely this is blazewood as it was not noticed earlier unless some error somewhere is causing things to be made of it.
Post by: kopout on August 10, 2013, 11:31:43 pm
lumberyards seem to be uselessThis is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.
Post by: Halfling on August 10, 2013, 11:35:16 pm
lumberyards seem to be uselessThis is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.
Excuse my dumb question but... uh, why was it changed? That not only breaks rules but also apparently the reaction then. Seems like a somewhat bad move.
Post by: sackhead on August 11, 2013, 02:51:13 am
i have added [SPECIAL] in my bug fixes but it is not in the newest version
Post by: The Urist on August 11, 2013, 04:18:16 am
The secret:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 11, 2013, 04:30:28 am
Making coal [SPECIAL] should be an urgent bugfix for the newest version as well. Exploding caravans are kind of funny but not really. Maybe that also fixes the random forest fires - did you know that the flammable version of coal actually currently has a fixed temperature of 32000 U, that is, about 12000C, twice as hot as the surface of the sun? (10000U=0C and 22000F T-difference =~ 12000C) If that does not cause the world to occasionally burn if you embark with something made of coal (the flammable version, too, can be used by civs to produce items in worldgen since it is IS_STONE, which it maybe shouldn't be), I don't know what would.
However, there's a bit of a problem. It is already tagged [SPECIAL] in the newest version. So either there's another explanation or that token does not work like we think it does. Could the fact that it has IS_STONE result in merchants bringing crafts made of it even though it is SPECIAL?
Does anyone know why my hydromancers wont work?(They DO work in arena, but won't appear in worldgen or build towers)
The secret:Elemental summoning interaction:Spoiler (click to show/hide)secret_hydro_zap.txtSpoiler (click to show/hide)Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Note unrelated to the question: since your water elementals ANIMATE instead of RESURRECT, they will be always hostile regardless of who made them, so "peaceful" may be the wrong choice of words. One thing to also note is that your mancer syndrome does not have an affected class which sometimes leads to bugs (specifically on save and reload - I don't know enough about how secrets work in worldgen to know if it could be a cause, probably not if it's not in the vanilla sample, but should be fixed anyway).
Post by: The Urist on August 11, 2013, 05:32:31 am
Oh...
Making coal [SPECIAL] should be an urgent bugfix for the newest version as well. Exploding caravans are kind of funny but not really. Maybe that also fixes the random forest fires - did you know that the flammable version of coal actually currently has a fixed temperature of 32000 U, that is, about 12000C, twice as hot as the surface of the sun? (10000U=0C and 22000F T-difference =~ 12000C) If that does not cause the world to occasionally burn if you embark with something made of coal (the flammable version, too, can be used by civs to produce items in worldgen since it is IS_STONE, which it maybe shouldn't be), I don't know what would.
However, there's a bit of a problem. It is already tagged [SPECIAL] in the newest version. So either there's another explanation or that token does not work like we think it does. Could the fact that it has IS_STONE result in merchants bringing crafts made of it even though it is SPECIAL?Does anyone know why my hydromancers wont work?(They DO work in arena, but won't appear in worldgen or build towers)
The secret:Elemental summoning interaction:Spoiler (click to show/hide)secret_hydro_zap.txtSpoiler (click to show/hide)Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Note unrelated to the question: since your water elementals ANIMATE instead of RESURRECT, they will be always hostile regardless of who made them, so "peaceful" may be the wrong choice of words. One thing to also note is that your mancer syndrome does not have an affected class which sometimes leads to bugs (specifically on save and reload - I don't know enough about how secrets work in worldgen to know if it could be a cause, probably not if it's not in the vanilla sample, but should be fixed anyway).
I mean, they are peaceful as wild animals, not when enthralled by hydromancers.
Edit: I found ''lunanium small bucklers'' from the arena - not ''small lunanium bucklers'' is this intended? (note that i dont have the newest version)
Post by: Halfling on August 11, 2013, 06:29:21 am
Post by: Aseaheru on August 11, 2013, 08:25:15 am
Post by: Halfling on August 11, 2013, 09:02:07 am
By the way, is the apple tree reaction working for you at the lumber yard?
Your criticism is very welcome. Here's a summary of what might be good, simple fixes to add at this point that have come up so far and are unimplemented
1. Remove IS_STONE from the variety of coal that is supposed to explode, so civilizations don't even have a chance of making their goods out of it. Should not affect layering.
2. Add [SPECIAL] to iridium
3. Formics should have access nest boxes (StL will probably provide the exact code)
4. Mamaphint naming fixes so they don't have visible civilian professions (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4481810;topicseen#msg4481810)
-- unless the author objects. It's pretty hard to tell who is idling and who's gone at this point so let's just make it a policy to fix what seems like an obvious bug ASAP and discuss later if needed? Let me know if I forgot something.
Also yeah, as that implies, once you stop reading this thread your content may be bugfixed freely, because that's the only way it could be bugfixed if you do. Common sense since there's no intellectual property legal issues here. :P
I'm also roughly calling language and spelling fixes and balance fixes bugfixes because a game does not need to be glitchy to be broken.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 11, 2013, 09:06:11 am
oh, and anyone think this would work for a plant?
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 11, 2013, 09:29:49 am
Anyone confirm that the lumberyard reaction is actually not working anymore?
Specifically: You have apple trees on your map and have cut one. You have built a lumber yard. You cannot use the process apple tree reaction.
There seems to be nothing immediately wrong with the raws and I tested it myself last version. One possible issue: "plant_kopout.txt" is now named "plant_koput.txt" but the header for reading the file still reads plant_kopout... -> fixes
I added a set of new "Post-turn content editing rules" because bugfixing needs to be getting done. It's currently not going at all.
Summary: after your turn, modder/bugfixer may bugfix (remove seemingly unintended behavior), rebalance and spellcheck your content and apply the edit immediately, with the restriction that it respects your stated intended behavior. You may veto it and tell us that you actually want it to be that way if you care. If you feel like this is going too far, let me know and let's figure out some other scheme instead.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 11, 2013, 10:20:14 am
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 11, 2013, 12:49:25 pm
Ah heck. This will be harder than I thought... Ah well. To the wiki!
Incredibly useful offline wiki made by Hugo_The_Dwarf (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=6588)
Post by: Halfling on August 11, 2013, 01:54:47 pm
Things on the lookout for:
1. General information and resources that help you learn to/mod or work as a reference
2. "Scratch" specific stuff such as descriptions of our new bodies and body plans, material templates, etc (but generally speaking, you can either read them from the raws already and see what a PLANT_STRUCTURE template is getting at, or you're in for a hard modding turn)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 11, 2013, 02:21:41 pm
I see it right in the first line after the BODY_DETAIL_PLAN begins to be defined. Please tell me what is going on. It is causing a 2 megabyte errorlog.
Code: [Select]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:REPTILE_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:SCALE:SCALE_TEMPLATE_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:CLAW:BONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:SINEW:SINEW_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:HORN:BONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:FIN:SCALES_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:BONE:BONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:FAT:FAT_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:CARTILAGE:CARTILAGE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:BLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_TISSUE:TOOTH:TOOTH_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:SCALE:SCALE_TEMPLATE_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CLAW:BONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:SINEW:SINEW_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:HORN:BONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:FIN:SCALES_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:BONE:BONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:FAT:FAT_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CARTILAGE:CARTILAGE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:BLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:TOOTH:TOOTH_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:CLAW:CLAW:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FIN:FIN:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:TORSO:MUSCLE:100:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:UPPER_BONY_SPINE:BONE:20]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:RIBS:BONE:30:CARTILAGE:25]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HEART:MUSCLE:25:FAT:10]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LUNG:ORGAN_TISSUE:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ABDOMEN:MUSCLE:100:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LOWER_BONY_SPINE:BONE:20]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:GUT:ORGAN_TISSUE:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:NECK:BONE:20:ORGAN_TISSUE:5:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:RIBS:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:HEART:100]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:RIBS:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:LUNG:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MUSCLE:30:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL:BONE:30]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:NERVE_TISSUE:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FACE:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE:20]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH:MUSCLE:25:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE:CARTILAGE:10:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SCALE:1]
[BP_POSITION:BY_CATEGORY:FACE:FRONT]
[BP_POSITION:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:FRONT]
[BP_POSITION:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE:FRONT]
[BP_POSITION:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH:FRONT]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:UPPER_NERVOUS_SPINE:NERVE_TISSUE:20]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LOWER_NERVOUS_SPINE:NERVE_TISSUE:20]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:UPPER_BONY_SPINE:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:UPPER_NERVOUS_SPINE:90]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:LOWER_BONY_SPINE:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:LOWER_NERVOUS_SPINE:90]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:THIGH:BONE:30:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:KNEE:BONE:20:CARTILAGE:5:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:SHIN:BONE:30:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ANKLE:BONE:20:CARTILAGE:5:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FOOT:BONE:30:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:TOE:BONE:10:MUSCLE:5:SKIN:1:KERATIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ARM:BONE:20:MUSCLE:10:FAT:1:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ELBOW:BONE:10:CARTILAGE:5:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FOREARM:BONE:20:MUSCLE:10:FAT:1:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:WRIST:BONE:20:CARTILAGE:5:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FOOT:BONE:20:MUSCLE:10:FAT:1:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:TOE:BONE:10:MUSCLE:5:SKIN:1:KERATIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:WING:BONE:20:MUSCLE:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:WRIST:BONE:10:CARTILAGE:5:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:TAIL:BONE:20:MUSCLE:5:SCALE:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH:TOOTH:30]
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH:100]
Post by: Halfling on August 11, 2013, 02:24:15 pm
How do you get 2 megabytes of 1 message? :P
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 11, 2013, 02:27:27 pm
Post the file SCALE_TEMPLATE_ZTG is in and any other files that template references such as the material templates.
How do you get 2 megabytes of 1 message? :P
Code: [Select]
[TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SCALES_ZTG]
[TISSUE_NAME:scale:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SCALE]
[SCARS]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:5]
[HEALING_RATE:100]
[VASCULAR:1]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:5]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:SCALES]To answer your question: All of the body parts of every caste of every species gets the error, and I have 17 species with 8 castes of both genders for the dragons alone...
Edit1:
Modding utilities
utility to simplify creating workshop graphics (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=2068)
a language fenerator created by Talvieno (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7174)
Edit2:
Sonofa...
I see what is wrong, now. I forgot to remove 'template', when I was shortening things.
Post by: Gnorm on August 11, 2013, 07:48:49 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 11, 2013, 10:29:41 pm
Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right :P
The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.
As far as why it's the better-than-steel equivalent, I'll admit I took a little creative liberty, but aside from the MAX_EDGE I wouldn't expect it to be -that- weird. Iridium is the second-densest element and second-most resistant to elastic strain, and is very hard. I intended for it to be excellent in armor and blunt weapons... perhaps I should nerf its effectiveness in blades, sort of like an anti-Adamantine--bluemetal gives you whiffle bats while Iridium gives you butterknives. Perhaps I should demand that bars of Iridium be alloyed with some other metal in a very low quantity (say, 10-20% alloy composition) before being worked? I'll admit that Iridium was kind of a bust due to being far more difficult to actually get than I had anticipated.But if you're actually going the realistic route with Iridium (and not the fantasy-metal-with-cool-sounding-name-of-real-metal route), why not use something slightly more common, like Aluminum? People didn't even discover Iridium until 1803, and can barely even work it with modern technology.
Worldgen crashing is generally a bad sign though. There have been so many updates by now that I think we need to rectify this. I haven't changed my files much (except for a couple of extremely minor edits that I plan on integrating with my eventual second modding turn in the distant future), but anybody that has updates to make should probably, IN CHRONOLOGICAL ORDER OF TURNS, apply all fixes to their own files and then merge.My upload on DFFD is in .zip format, and includes all the latest files and fixes. Unless you merged it with another version of the raws, there should be no crashes.
"Poinless bloat metals"!? In DF!? That's what makes this game so great is the attention to detail. It's not "these are the tier 1-4 combat metals, and the 1 metal for jewelry to sell to vendors for GP," instead you can have 7 different metals as studs or spikes on your hammer, instead of just "gold." As long as they have different properties of any sort, non-combat metals are not pointless. We don't want minimalist bland, we want a game with tasty flavor!it does reduce the amount of pointless bloat metals and it is nice for Aeresium to have a purpose beyond a building materialThat's a really bad idea. Aeresium is not supposed to be weapons-grade. Would you make a creature that has a material weakness to lay pewter, for instance?
Why do you think I made it that large? And through custom reactions and a custom workshop, lizardkin can make weapons from it.
The point is that you're not supposed to be able to make weapons out of it in the first place! It's not hard to define your own metal, give it an ore, and use that instead of modifying-but-not-really something that someone else did and perverting it for your own purposes. It's also much less unethical.
Problem is, this would affect all caravans (and possibly your civilians) unless you made a civ specifically for this purpose, with the syndrome specific to them. But then why not just have them seige, instead of a predictable and easily destroyed caravan? People see the caravan from this civ, they put the depot in a deathtrap and the caravan offers no resistance whatsoever.Anyone fix the burning caravans yet?my bug-fix turn may have. i fixed what was suspected to cause it, i am not sure if it is included in the later versions however.
we think it was coulsed by either the Alchemy RAWS or my doom coal lacking the [SPECIAL] tag. i did think it was funny.
this does give me and idea. we add a boiling stone to caravans that should boil as soon as they enter the map and after enough time for them to have reached the depo it transforms them into crazed saboteurs
Post by: sackhead on August 11, 2013, 11:55:26 pm
Mm. Actually since iridium is supposed to be unobtainable without special means yet all civs have access to it and can trade for it, that IS a bit of a contradiction, nevermind the price. Consider making it [SPECIAL]?
By the way, is the apple tree reaction working for you at the lumber yard?
Your criticism is very welcome. Here's a summary of what might be good, simple fixes to add at this point that have come up so far and are unimplemented
1. Remove IS_STONE from the variety of coal that is supposed to explode, so civilizations don't even have a chance of making their goods out of it. Should not affect layering.
2. Add [SPECIAL] to iridium
3. Formics should have access nest boxes (StL will probably provide the exact code)
4. Mamaphint naming fixes so they don't have visible civilian professions (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4481810;topicseen#msg4481810)
-- unless the author objects. It's pretty hard to tell who is idling and who's gone at this point so let's just make it a policy to fix what seems like an obvious bug ASAP and discuss later if needed? Let me know if I forgot something.
Also yeah, as that implies, once you stop reading this thread your content may be bugfixed freely, because that's the only way it could be bugfixed if you do. Common sense since there's no intellectual property legal issues here. :P
I'm also roughly calling language and spelling fixes and balance fixes bugfixes because a game does not need to be glitchy to be broken.
no objections
Post by: kopout on August 12, 2013, 09:35:35 am
I just go camping for 2 days...True. As I thought about it over the weekend I realized that, being a transformation, carving coconuts would cure any wound. Missing a lung, an arm, and the use of your legs? go carve a coconut!Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right :P
The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.
I think I'd rather go the "tool with specific reactions" root.
Post by: kopout on August 12, 2013, 09:50:46 am
You would need to ask hugo to be sure but I think it was to fix a minor bug were the error log kept geting "unrecognized workshop token ' " or some such. I don't know why it was complaining about an ' there wasn't one but it looks like, maybe, the game dosn't like to have underscors in the workshop tokens :-\lumberyards seem to be uselessThis is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.
Excuse my dumb question but... uh, why was it changed? That not only breaks rules but also apparently the reaction then. Seems like a somewhat bad move.
Post by: Halfling on August 12, 2013, 10:10:53 am
I just go camping for 2 days...True. As I thought about it over the weekend I realized that, being a transformation, carving coconuts would cure any wound. Missing a lung, an arm, and the use of your legs? go carve a coconut!Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right :P
The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.
I think I'd rather go the "tool with specific reactions" root.
Wouldn't the boulder model, or making them pieces of lumber, or thinking up something else entirely be more sensible? It's still going to be a huge pain in the long run to enable both the tool and coconut tool reactions on all races, and you will need a new reaction for every single thing.
You would need to ask hugo to be sure but I think it was to fix a minor bug were the error log kept geting "unrecognized workshop token ' " or some such. I don't know why it was complaining about an ' there wasn't one but it looks like, maybe, the game dosn't like to have underscors in the workshop tokens :-\lumberyards seem to be uselessThis is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.
Excuse my dumb question but... uh, why was it changed? That not only breaks rules but also apparently the reaction then. Seems like a somewhat bad move.
First, assume the reasonable, that the game does not have a special undocumented way to process particular characters in names of objects of particular type, because that's the sensible thing to do. If there is an error like that, it's much more likely incorrect token usage like always. That will help even if you don't remember the first custom vanilla workshop is called SOAP_MAKER :P
Post by: kopout on August 12, 2013, 10:42:24 am
True. As I thought about it over the weekend I realized that, being a transformation, carving coconuts would cure any wound. Missing a lung, an arm, and the use of your legs? go carve a coconut!Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right :P
The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.
I think I'd rather go the "tool with specific reactions" root.
Wouldn't the boulder model, or making them pieces of lumber, or thinking up something else entirely be more sensible? It's still going to be a huge pain in the long run to enable both the tool and coconut tool reactions on all races, and you will need a new reaction for every single thing.
The boulder model didn't work in my tests ( I could try making it stone but then it would be used for all the things rocks are inclugding mechanisums, rock pots, and such) and if I make it lumber then the game will try making coconut shell bukets, axes, bukalers, and beds. At the moment I have it prity much working (though unpolished) with the shells being a type of tool and being used in two special reactions ( make crafts and make intraments). A reaction with this item tag as the product [CRAFTS] will randomly produce a craft from the crafts list. Realy, you only need three reactions, cocnut shell crafts, coconut shell instraments (cloppers!) and coconut shell bras (if thats ok).
What we might be able to get away with is having it make a boulder that is useless but the material it self has a REACTION_CLASS that makes it used in the make instraments/crafts/bras reactions. what that would do is remove the tool step from the equation and oppen up forwards compatability with other shelled plants if some one whated to make them in the future.
Post by: Halfling on August 12, 2013, 12:35:31 pm
I'm fine with coconut shell bras personally :P
Post by: WillowLuman on August 12, 2013, 02:06:44 pm
You would need to ask hugo to be sure but I think it was to fix a minor bug were the error log kept geting "unrecognized workshop token ' " or some such. I don't know why it was complaining about an ' there wasn't one but it looks like, maybe, the game dosn't like to have underscors in the workshop tokens :-\lumberyards seem to be uselessThis is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.
Excuse my dumb question but... uh, why was it changed? That not only breaks rules but also apparently the reaction then. Seems like a somewhat bad move.
I think it was already "Lumberyard" when I got it, but the error I saw was that one of the tiles of the workshop was specified as ']', which confused the game because it though that was a closing bracket in the raw line. This is what caused it to think there was an apostrophe, because unless you put a character in single quotes, the game only recognizes the numerical id's of characters as tiles.
Post by: Gnorm on August 12, 2013, 10:40:11 pm
Post by: sackhead on August 13, 2013, 12:01:26 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 13, 2013, 12:02:32 am
Post by: sackhead on August 13, 2013, 01:08:10 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 13, 2013, 01:22:51 am
Post by: kopout on August 13, 2013, 10:50:48 am
Post by: Gnorm on August 13, 2013, 09:58:18 pm
Post by: sackhead on August 14, 2013, 04:36:06 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 14, 2013, 11:08:20 am
Post by: Halfling on August 14, 2013, 03:57:21 pm
Gnorm, welcome :) you are added to the first page. If you want to, you can start making and suggesting things now... and hopefully by following this thread for some time you can already learn a lot.
The play turn should really go in such a way that whoever posts a detailed report of some duration is featured. If there are multiple reports then I'll expand my table to feature them all. I should fix the rules to state that but the exact wording escapes me.
Anyone, please give it a go. Zanz - how's the next modding update looking?
Edit - attempted to rewrite first post but I'm so tired I can't feel my brain right now. Tell me if it's bad or incorrect.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 14, 2013, 10:14:36 pm
Also I'll rock the play turn if Sackhead can't do it. Point me to the latest hellscape and I'll start this madness.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 14, 2013, 10:19:50 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 14, 2013, 11:30:31 pm
Anyone, please give it a go. Zanz - how's the next modding update looking?
Wasn't able to create the wandering spirit creature, which is what was going to have the Aerisium multiplier. Still need to get a couple things worked out of the errorlog. I'll need to get it done tomorrow. I should actually be asleep right now...
Post by: Halfling on August 15, 2013, 03:34:05 pm
If you're unable to maintain the OP, we could hand it off to someone else and start a new thread. Good excuse for integrating bugfixes throughout the various turns and making sure everything fits.
Also I'll rock the play turn if Sackhead can't do it. Point me to the latest hellscape and I'll start this madness.
I am able to maintain if once per day updates are enough. And seriously now, the latter should be done regardless of what's in the first post, and by the modder/bugfixer in turn, not by someone who had an excuse. :P
That said, I would have no objection if someone wants to take over the thread after 100 pages. It might be kind of communal and emphasize it is not my mod, it is our mod. Preferably it should be kind of like a vote or consensus, and someone who took a successful modding turn already, so they have perspective into what it's about and what kind of rules there should be and why, I should think, if they'll maintain those. But I have no problem keeping a few updates going either...
You'll find the latest hellscape in the first post as usual!
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 15, 2013, 08:03:45 pm
Won't...freaking...DIE!!!!!
Relevant Code:
Code: [Select]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_MATERIALS_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:AETHER:ETHER_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CORE:ETHER_2_ZTG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_TISSUES_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:AETHER:ETHER_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:AETHER_2:ETHER_2_ZTG]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ETHER:AETHER:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:CORE:AETHER_2:100]Error:
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature SPIRIT_ZTG
SPIRIT_ZTG:DEFAULT:core, layer 1: Tissue AETHER_2 was not found, using first tissue insteadWhen this is fixed, I can upload. It is the only thing wrong with a single creature, and I would rather not lose it to just this one thing. I can't get rid of the core, it is the only thing you can hit on the creature, since the Ether_ZTG is gaseous, and Ether_2_ZTG is solid.
Edit: removed the core and shifted the layer to 'ETHER'. Error still persists.
Post by: reemer30 on August 16, 2013, 01:22:20 pm
Here you go, fixed up your tea with the current templates, and added one so its not causing hangovers to your halflings/formics
oh, and anyone think this would work for a plant?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Heres your plant:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And the template:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Thinking about possibly adding a caffeinated syndrome to it, so its a bit more like tea. Also want to make a reaction to dry the tea leaves before they can be brewed, I will get that worked on, maybe wait til my turn rolls in to put it out. I didn't test it yet, I just threw it together real fast. If anyone wants to try it, go ahead, but I plan on doing so tonight.
EDIT:fixed a little raw error
Post by: Aseaheru on August 16, 2013, 01:25:11 pm
perhaps there are other sorts of tea, more rare, that take longer to make but are worth more...
Post by: Halfling on August 16, 2013, 01:35:15 pm
One...error...left...
Won't...freaking...DIE!!!!!
Relevant Code:Code: [Select][BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_MATERIALS_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:AETHER:ETHER_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CORE:ETHER_2_ZTG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_TISSUES_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:AETHER:ETHER_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:AETHER_2:ETHER_2_ZTG]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ETHER:AETHER:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:CORE:AETHER_2:100]
Error:Code: [Select]*** Error(s) finalizing the creature SPIRIT_ZTG
SPIRIT_ZTG:DEFAULT:core, layer 1: Tissue AETHER_2 was not found, using first tissue instead
That is because you do not define a tissue called AETHER_2 and instead define a material called AETHER_2 twice. Correct code:
Code: [Select]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_MATERIALS_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:AETHER:ETHER_ZTG]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CORE:ETHER_2_ZTG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_TISSUES_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:AETHER:ETHER_ZTG]
[ADD_TISSUE:AETHER_2:ETHER_2_ZTG]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ETHER:AETHER:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:CORE:AETHER_2:100]Also calling it both "aether" and "ether" when defining stuff is just asking for trouble. :P
Upload fixed version and to the first page it goes if it works.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 16, 2013, 06:36:54 pm
What I Added:
All those dragon variants.
Lizardfolk, large bipedal lizards, as a playable civilization. This civilization has the child snatcher tags, so all civilizations are hostile to them. (Manual will come later.)
Dragonkin, the bipedal draco-morphed lizardfolk. Currently needs an item snatching civilization. I give a later modder freedom to create this civilization.
Wandering spirits that are only vulnerable to Aerisium (needs testing). You don't really need to worry about them, though. All they can do is emit a small cloud of ether occasionally.
Post by: Halfling on August 16, 2013, 06:40:33 pm
Crustypeanut, ready to go?
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 16, 2013, 07:11:12 pm
All they can do is emit a small cloud of ether occasionally.
This ether (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diethyl_ether)? Because I could foresee that being...annoying. :)
Post by: Cain12 on August 16, 2013, 09:35:31 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Pic of halfling (armed with aeresium scimitar) vs spirit report:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 16, 2013, 09:53:27 pm
Ok, downloaded today, one/two comments/questions (the following was gathered via arena mode, sorry if that's useless for some reason):Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Pic of halfling (armed with aeresium scimitar) vs spirit report:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
No data is entirely useless. This in fact tells me that I need to reinstate the 'core' body part in order for the creature to be harmed, because, apparently, having a gaseous layer covering a solid layer doesn't work in allowing the creature to be harmed.
The melting was unintentional. I'm not going to classify it as bug, instead, it will be called the 'dispersing' feature.
All they can do is emit a small cloud of ether occasionally.
This ether (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diethyl_ether)? Because I could foresee that being...annoying. :)
More like the mist you see around Ghosts.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 16, 2013, 10:16:01 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 16, 2013, 10:32:46 pm
Didn't the guy complain about you doing this with his Aeresium?
Well, since it completely flopped from not being able to come into contact with the creature, he doesn't have anything to complain about anymore.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 16, 2013, 11:46:49 pm
Post by: kero42 on August 17, 2013, 09:39:06 am
All they can do is emit a small cloud of ether occasionally.
This ether (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diethyl_ether)? Because I could foresee that being...annoying. :)
I immediately thought of Aether (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aether_(classical_element)) (particularly as the fifth element or in alchemy) instead, but that's just the result of a recent wiki walk.
Edit: Does ether actually do anything, or is it merely aesthetic? I imagine it's kind of like mist, or have I misunderstood?
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 17, 2013, 04:50:25 pm
The fact that you can HAVE Aeresium weapons (which I explicitly forbade in the material files) is the point of issue, not the material weakness for the specific creature. So Lucy, you do, in fact, have some 'splaining to do.
I didn't modify the definition in the slightest, and the custom reactions necessary for the lizardfolk to create weapons (I removed all standard smithing jobs) are set up to use any bar, and Aeresium is one of the metals they can work. I have no idea why they are showing up in arena mode, because I had absolutely nothing to do with that.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 17, 2013, 05:26:25 pm
Post by: Cain12 on August 18, 2013, 08:14:32 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
ax:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 18, 2013, 08:17:33 pm
On embark (as Lizardkin) I found I can't bring an ax of any kind and on building a carpenters shop I can't make one (or any wooden weapon), intentional/error on my part? Also, I built a Lizardkin forge which I found had zero options for new tasks.
The only weapons that can be created at a carpenter's workshop are training weapons, which the lizardkin don't have.
They don't appear to have any axes as a permitted weapon either, only bladed longbows, spears, and mining equipment.
Also, the forge reactions are missing an underscore. In the entity file they are called [PERMITTED_REACTION:LIZARDKIN1_ZTG] through [PERMITTED_REACTION:LIZARDKIN14_ZTG], but in the reactions file they are [REACTION:LIZARDKIN_1_ZTG] through [REACTION:LIZARDKIN_14_ZTG].
finally, PTW.
Post by: Halfling on August 18, 2013, 08:37:50 pm
Hi again, if your not busy I have a question:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
ax:Lizardkin forge:Spoiler (click to show/hide)Spoiler (click to show/hide)
On embark (as Lizardkin) I found I can't bring an ax of any kind and on building a carpenters shop I can't make one (or any wooden weapon), intentional/error on my part? Also, I built a Lizardkin forge which I found had zero options for new tasks.
The only weapons that can be created at a carpenter's workshop are training weapons, which the lizardkin don't have.
They don't appear to have any axes as a permitted weapon either, only bladed longbows, spears, and mining equipment.
Also, the forge reactions are missing an underscore. In the entity file they are called [PERMITTED_REACTION:LIZARDKIN1_ZTG] through [PERMITTED_REACTION:LIZARDKIN14_ZTG], but in the reactions file they are [REACTION:LIZARDKIN_1_ZTG] through [REACTION:LIZARDKIN_14_ZTG].
finally, PTW.
Needs urgent bugfixing. Thanks for pointing out the exact problem too. Zanzetkuken? Also, this should have been caught earlier. Please playtest stuff you make for fort mode too.
I will assume Crustypeanut does not want his turn. Reemer30, how's it? 24h to report in, then passing on to bulborbish, then mastahcheese.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 18, 2013, 09:40:10 pm
Needs urgent bugfixing. Thanks for pointing out the exact problem too. Zanzetkuken? Also, this should have been caught earlier. Please playtest stuff you make for fort mode too.
It's updated now. If I wasn't hit with so many time drains that wound up hitting me at once, I probably would have found it. If my turn had been one week earlier...oh well, bugfix out.
Post by: reemer30 on August 19, 2013, 07:08:05 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 20, 2013, 03:06:32 pm
is Zanzetkuken's turn all done, and bug-free? Gotta try to think of a week's worth of ideas, any suggestions you got I will try to implement.
It should be all done as in it has all the features. It is bug-free like a Microsoft program on release, as usual... well, not that bad but the idea is: since it hasn't been playtested so much, we don't know. There are no obvious signs of error we look for but something might not work. If something turns out to not work, ZTG should provide a fix ASAP as it's his bugfixing turn now.
There's a lot of stuff that needs to be done. One thing is more natural natural things. You could work on some items and minerals, we have very few forms of armor (my special leather pack adds some too, you can plug it in if you like). The elves are notably bare-bones, they are currently naked and have no weapons, nor any defining cultural traits (they aren't even hostile, ever). Their author BFEL has given you free license to modify them so long as the original idea that they are slaves to tree-lords is respected. So improving elves by adding equipment and culture and traits is a big to-do.
Post by: reemer30 on August 20, 2013, 06:52:06 pm
The elves are notably bare-bones, they are currently naked and have no weapons, nor any defining cultural traits (they aren't even hostile, ever).Well, I do believe that the nudity does reinforce the slavery idea of them. But yeah, some natural stuff sounds like I can do it.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 20, 2013, 07:47:25 pm
Gotta try to think of a week's worth of ideas, any suggestions you got I will try to implement.
As I said, you can create the dragonkin entity. The creature is done, I just never got the time to create their militaristic society.
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 21, 2013, 06:52:53 am
Post by: Aseaheru on August 21, 2013, 08:47:45 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 21, 2013, 02:34:16 pm
Somebody should build a small avian creature (perhaps named a swallow) that specifically steals coconuts. It would be interesting to see exactly what the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow (http://style.org/unladenswallow/) would be in the game, as well as distribute coconut trees to a wide variety of biomes.I think we should start making flora for specific regions. Right now, pretty much all plants are found everywhere, every biome is coated with apple trees and "moss" grass. Sometimes you see some "tall grass", but most everywhere there are apple trees, like some kindergartener's painting.
Post by: Halfling on August 21, 2013, 02:40:45 pm
Somebody should build a small avian creature (perhaps named a swallow) that specifically steals coconuts. It would be interesting to see exactly what the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow (http://style.org/unladenswallow/) would be in the game, as well as distribute coconut trees to a wide variety of biomes.I think we should start making flora for specific regions. Right now, pretty much all plants are found everywhere, every biome is coated with apple trees and "moss" grass. Sometimes you see some "tall grass", but most everywhere there are apple trees, like some kindergartener's painting.
If kindergarteners had a thing for giant spiders, horse-sized insects and now dragons, and painted them under every tree and in every river. But yes... feel free to make apple trees less than omnipresent like with the hounds :P
We actually do have other trees in already, and there's potentially more. Kopout, are those other fruit trees ready for addition?
Post by: WillowLuman on August 21, 2013, 02:42:52 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 21, 2013, 02:50:52 pm
> Plus, the apple trees drown them out in terms of actual trees seen.
As they should, their frequency is 100 while STL's trees have no set frequency (resulting in 50). Just a matter of turning it down, you have my permission but don't even need it; adjustments like this should happen naturally as we get more creatures and plants to populate biomes.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 21, 2013, 03:50:12 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 21, 2013, 03:54:22 pm
because if there where cats I would see halflings not wanting to eat them or hounds.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 21, 2013, 03:56:17 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 21, 2013, 04:06:51 pm
Them and their converts, lacking real bodies, will be very squishy but have powerful mental and telekinetic interactions.
For this to work, though, we'll have to add [SPOUSE_CONVERSION_TARGET] to a few other civ races.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 21, 2013, 04:11:04 pm
also: awww. Thats a pain.
Post by: Gnorm on August 21, 2013, 06:32:44 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 21, 2013, 07:04:54 pm
Post by: reemer30 on August 21, 2013, 07:52:34 pm
Gotta try to think of a week's worth of ideas, any suggestions you got I will try to implement.
As I said, you can create the dragonkin entity. The creature is done, I just never got the time to create their militaristic society.
Can do.
As far as my turn so far, I'm Working on some biome specific plants now. But so far, I got some desert stuff ready to be tested. I may move on to animals, but I am not too proficient with bodies and detail plans and the such. I do have an idea for a civilization, kinda nomadic like. Probably just use that one for a private pack I am working on.
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 21, 2013, 08:11:07 pm
Are there any boogeymen in this mod as of now?
There are not. We have absolutely no randomly generated creatures - no demons, no FBs, no Titans, no bogeymen - and nobody has bothered to add in a horror to emulate night terrors. A giant bug could fill that niche...but then, I'm not quite that sadistic yet.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 21, 2013, 08:30:30 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 21, 2013, 11:25:06 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 21, 2013, 11:40:45 pm
Oh god. I'm not sure about them, they will make testing hard. As bad as our world is, at least it doesn't have them. Can we live like that a little longer?Nay! A true halfling warrior bests foes of all sizes!
Post by: WillowLuman on August 22, 2013, 01:05:55 am
Post by: PDF urist master on August 22, 2013, 11:54:27 am
Post by: mastahcheese on August 22, 2013, 12:04:53 pm
can you mod in a capapult that throws eggs as ammo as a joke weapon?You could make a reaction to turn eggs into stones suitable for catapults.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 22, 2013, 01:17:50 pm
Also, people are engraving nothing.
and by nothing I mean images of nothing.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 22, 2013, 01:24:20 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 22, 2013, 01:27:25 pm
also, NEVER EMBARK IN FROZEN AREAS.
NO WATER RESULTS IN ALL DEATH DUE TO THOSE FREAKING ROCKS.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 22, 2013, 01:46:45 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 22, 2013, 01:52:15 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 22, 2013, 01:56:07 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 22, 2013, 01:59:34 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 22, 2013, 02:11:33 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 22, 2013, 02:19:34 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 22, 2013, 02:22:58 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 22, 2013, 02:28:39 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 22, 2013, 02:29:17 pm
Also, people are engraving nothing.I had one of those engravings during my "Mastertea" playthrough. The tile was actually that of a dwarf. This probably occurs when an image of a tile that doesn't exist is engraved.
and by nothing I mean images of nothing.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 22, 2013, 02:30:34 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 22, 2013, 05:36:12 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 22, 2013, 06:05:38 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 22, 2013, 06:42:31 pm
To know for sure...
We'll need to see your raws
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 22, 2013, 06:44:44 pm
Those are the reasons I can think of for why critters might fail to exist.
Post by: Gnorm on August 22, 2013, 10:15:28 pm
Added [OBJECT:CREATURE] after that, before the raws for all your new critters?
I forgot to do that... oops. Thanks for the advice; I feel like a fool.
Post by: Putnam on August 23, 2013, 12:48:25 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on August 23, 2013, 02:33:24 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 23, 2013, 03:26:02 pm
Trial #: Lost Count
Report: The experiment, I suppose I can say, has made a step in the right direction. There is an issue, however, with its stability.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Subject needs fundamental changes to its structure in order for it to exist.
Post by: Halfling on August 23, 2013, 04:01:23 pm
Subject: New Creature
Trial #: Lost Count
Report: The experiment, I suppose I can say, has made a step in the right direction. There is an issue, however, with its stability.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Subject needs fundamental changes to its structure in order for it to exist.
That's the spirit!
Make sure to connect creature's head to body before bringing it to life.
If problem persists:
- Does the creature have functional tissues that allow it to do things it was designed to do, such as see, breathe, and grasp things?
- Specifically, did you add a (usually internal) brain and nervous system?
Several other gods/universe designers/creation workers found the above useful earlier.
Post by: Putnam on August 23, 2013, 04:17:10 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 23, 2013, 04:17:58 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 23, 2013, 07:28:06 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 23, 2013, 07:51:58 pm
[NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT]
Post by: Gnorm on August 23, 2013, 09:28:58 pm
[NO_THOUGHT_CENTRAL_FOR_MOVEMENT] should beThank you, HugoLuman.
[NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT]
My creation is now fully functional in arena mode, but I cannot seem to find any mention of it in any of the three game modes. What tags are necessary to have the creature even spawn?
Post by: WillowLuman on August 23, 2013, 09:30:29 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 23, 2013, 09:47:33 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Putnam on August 23, 2013, 09:50:25 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 23, 2013, 09:53:49 pm
[CREATURE_CLASS:SPIRIT]
and
[CREATURE_CLASS:SPIRIT_CORPOREAL]
So we can have certain mystical beings and things that effect only them. Our setting will likely feature both intangible ghost-like spirits and ones with solid or even fleshy physical forms.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 23, 2013, 10:12:19 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 23, 2013, 11:23:35 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 24, 2013, 12:02:52 am
Progress! After checking the error log, I found out that the creatures were not spawning due to typos in my raws. Now I have a new problem: there is only ever one of the creature in the world, instead of many. Thoughts?Use [POPULATION_SIZE:number] and [CLUSTER_SIZE:number]. For example, [POPULATION_SIZE:20] [CLUSTER_SIZE:5] would make 20 groups of 5 creatures. (Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 24, 2013, 12:17:01 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 24, 2013, 12:18:54 am
Post by: Halfling on August 24, 2013, 04:18:33 am
Well, I've resolved the sight and breathing issue, but my creature still cannot grasp, fly, or stand. I have added both a brain and the [NO_THOUGHT_CENTRAL_FOR_MOVEMENT] tag, but neither seem to be helping.
Using NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT should not be used as a permanent workaround for not having a functional brain though, because that makes the creature immune to having its brain smashed in - unless that's your intended result. In the long run, we will end up with a world that behaves very strangely under any nonstandard conditions (ie. the average df game) if we just care about making it work for a testing instance and not enough about making it work correctly.
If it works with that token, have correctly identified it's a brain issue. Make sure the brain is connected to something, is made of nervous tissue and has [THOUGHT] and try removing the token again.
Post by: Gnorm on August 24, 2013, 12:33:05 pm
I have actually managed to correct this issue. I had a [NERVOUS] tag, but not a [THOUGHT] one. My mistake.Well, I've resolved the sight and breathing issue, but my creature still cannot grasp, fly, or stand. I have added both a brain and the [NO_THOUGHT_CENTRAL_FOR_MOVEMENT] tag, but neither seem to be helping.
Using NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT should not be used as a permanent workaround for not having a functional brain though, because that makes the creature immune to having its brain smashed in - unless that's your intended result. In the long run, we will end up with a world that behaves very strangely under any nonstandard conditions (ie. the average df game) if we just care about making it work for a testing instance and not enough about making it work correctly.
If it works with that token, have correctly identified it's a brain issue. Make sure the brain is connected to something, is made of nervous tissue and has [THOUGHT] and try removing the token again.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 24, 2013, 01:08:08 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 24, 2013, 05:45:45 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 24, 2013, 06:19:32 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 24, 2013, 06:54:23 pm
Have you added those items to their entity raw?Yes, and they're the only items that don't seem to be working, so the error must be in them.
Post by: Putnam on August 24, 2013, 07:03:08 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 24, 2013, 07:06:51 pm
ARMORLEVEL:1?Is that an issue?
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 24, 2013, 07:36:06 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 24, 2013, 09:30:30 pm
Post by: reemer30 on August 25, 2013, 01:40:47 am
Post by: Halfling on August 25, 2013, 02:00:14 am
Post by: reemer30 on August 25, 2013, 02:35:01 am
Code: [Select]
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: COPPER
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: COAL_BITUMINOUS
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: COPPER
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: COPPER
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: COPPER
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: IRON
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: COPPER
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: IRON
etc.
Post by: Putnam on August 25, 2013, 02:39:42 am
Post by: Halfling on August 25, 2013, 03:04:42 am
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 25, 2013, 03:19:12 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 25, 2013, 03:50:47 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 25, 2013, 04:46:17 pm
Post by: Gnorm on August 25, 2013, 04:54:00 pm
Selecting the modded creature from Adventurer Mode:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Inventory with modded items:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Fighting feral hounds whilst in the air:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Fighting halflings in a city:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Archery in the air:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Interesting things that I noticed in previous tests:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 25, 2013, 05:00:03 pm
Also evil Shades from hell. Treelords are necromantic. And we've got hobbit vampires. We don't have anything like werebeasts, though.
Slight correction, both halflings and formics can be vampires [that are quite different from vanilla]. Formic vampires are supposed to be more rare, while hobbit vampires are more common than vanilla.
I haven't adventured in the latest versions, but some versions ago this used to actually be completely not so as concerns vampire rarity by species, and overall a slight annoyance, since formics have a high reproduction coupled with a short lifespan to keep their population from exploding. Vampirism, of course, makes them live forever. So you end up with huge amounts of formic vampires. Underground lairs full of them, workers, soldiers, queens all. Once I had a row of >10 formic vampire lairs extending to the map edge near a city, every one of them packed with formic vampires. I looted two nearby formic fortresses for their arrow supply in an effort to extinguish the vampire ant menace and still ran out of arrows trying to kill them all.
(There's also vampirism-immune paladins, although I don't think anyone used that feature in a report yet. Highly recommended for trying something like this unless you want to catch it too.)
Post by: WillowLuman on August 25, 2013, 05:02:27 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 25, 2013, 05:05:06 pm
Behold! the spoils of mine absolute suffering and my toils!
Selecting the modded creature from Adventurer Mode:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Inventory with modded items:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Fighting feral hounds whilst in the air:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Fighting halflings in a city:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Archery in the air:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Interesting things that I noticed in previous tests:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Congrats! These are apparently angelic beings in thongs? A flying adventurer is a nice thing to have for variety.
I'm pretty sure that last thing's not normal by the way. Would actually be interesting to know what caused it. Something that reanimates without LOS?
Edit - from screenshot above that it seems to be partially in an evil region and that's probably it
Post by: Gnorm on August 25, 2013, 05:11:14 pm
Congrats! These are apparently angelic beings in thongs? A flying adventurer is a nice thing to have for variety.Thank you. They indeed angelic, and evil. So far, they don't interact with fortresses in Fortress Mode, but they're fully playable in Adventurer Mode. Creatures will attack them on sight, but it's still more interesting than: "I'm flattered, but I have no need of you." They also have [LOCAL_BANDITRY].
Encountered any Cephalopods yet? If not, try the mountains!Found one type in the mountains; I don't remember what it was called, but I believe it was represented by a "P." It was also one of the only things that I could hardly scratch, and it stole my boot.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 25, 2013, 05:17:01 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 25, 2013, 05:34:20 pm
Teeth are materially roughly 2x as strong and resistant to deformation as bone. Bone materially is mostly like vanilla bone.
If you're referring to animal attacks, there's more things to consider.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Gnorm on August 25, 2013, 06:00:06 pm
Creature:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Body:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Body Detail Plan:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Organic Materials:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Tissue Template:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Entity:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Items:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on August 25, 2013, 06:21:58 pm
I'll expand a bit more on why teeth, leather, attacks and tissues are different from the start, 'cause I may be away for a bit again and since that can of worms was opened. Thinking about it some more, if I were to start this thread over again, I would maybe make the values more like vanilla.
My original intention was that this is not just about adding creatures and materials, but instead making completely new stuff with new values, new balances, new layout etc. A lot of (attempts at) "doing it right" was intended. Hence my creatures' layout for example attempts to be so straightforward and small compared to vanilla (the aim was to be easily legible), with stuff as c_variations instead, and why my body parts work like
"torso (TORSO), head - CON:TORSO, brain - CON:HEAD" rather than
"upper body (UB), head - CON:UB, brain - CON:HD" (which is what everybody else ended up using out of familiarity/reference).
The intended balance method was "test it against existing things" more so than "compare to vanilla values" so as to create a new balance organically, and I even mixed up balance a bit intentionally to begin with. Also, it's good to have a default creature attack speed of e.g. 300 rather than 1 - if you must deduce it by 10%, how do you do it in the latter case?
While I originally assumed this too would be part of the sexiness of the mod, I think actually more people aren't really turned on by this meta-modding stuff than are. Not a criticism, we all like what we like. However, that being so, then this stuff creates more confusion than good for the majority of people who would like to just make something a lot like vanilla in foundation such as material values and body part names, but different on the higher levels. Since the goal was a community universe, I've created a bit of an obstacle to my own goals here.
Now that it's in there though, what's done is done.
Also, teeth may very well be broken by this universe's standards regardless. I didn't test them much and bite attacks do seem to be deadly. FWIW if this is the case feel free to balance them a bit.
Post by: kero42 on August 25, 2013, 06:48:42 pm
Quote
[DESCRIPTION:A servant of the Blood God; its kind is send to collect live offerings for their master.
I quite like their description text, they sound so neat.
Post by: Gnorm on August 25, 2013, 06:51:55 pm
Thanks Gnorm. I like the bit about the Grand Cathedral, but above it you seem to have an unset bit about ethics ( "[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION]").Thanks for pointing that out, it should be ACCEPTABLE.
Oh my, those look so awesome, I might have to download the newest version (when it's ready) just to play with them :). Glad to see Armok is still relevant in this unfamiliar and dangerous game. I look forward to killing enemies from above.Thank you; I'm flattered.Quote[DESCRIPTION:A servant of the Blood God; its kind is send to collect live offerings for their master.
I quite like their description text, they sound so neat.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 25, 2013, 06:57:59 pm
Also, is my tea going to be a thing?
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 25, 2013, 07:37:55 pm
why my body parts work like
"torso (TORSO), head - CON:TORSO, brain - CON:HEAD" rather than
"upper body (UB), head - CON:UB, brain - CON:HD" (which is what everybody else ended up using out of familiarity/reference).
For what it's worth, I reverted to UB and HD and such for two reasons: insects don't really have "torsos" per se, so upper body was more fitting, and I didn't use copy-paste ever in my first turn. Typing out "torso", "head", "left lower tarsus", etc., would have been time-consuming and offered many more opportunities for spelling-error-caused bugs, which I had enough of already.
The meta-modding of switching to c_variations all over the place was a good idea, in any case :)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 25, 2013, 09:37:52 pm
why my body parts work like
"torso (TORSO), head - CON:TORSO, brain - CON:HEAD" rather than
"upper body (UB), head - CON:UB, brain - CON:HD" (which is what everybody else ended up using out of familiarity/reference).
Hey, I used yours for my creations!
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 25, 2013, 09:53:11 pm
Here are the raws for the Daemonic Cherubim, and all other related raws:
-snip-
IMPORTANT:You probably should add the _XYZ before uploading.
- To force compatibility with both vanilla DF and other players' contributions, so that raws never clash, and novelty so that copypasting simply does not work, you must add _XYZ to the end of every object that you newly add/define, where XYZ is an at least 3 letter handle that you chose. Mine was HLG, so that I would add a "BODY:REALLY_SIMPLE_BODY_HLG" instead of "BODY:REALLY_SIMPLE_BODY". The exception to this is language words. Not doing this will eventually destroy everything. Referring to other players raws of course does not need this, if XYZ came before me I could use BODY_XYZ in my creature, but if I make a new body... as above.
- Similarly name your files by turn, eg. "creature_domestic_halfling", so we can keep track of things.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 26, 2013, 12:16:04 am
I'm not getting it to work though, because apparently, if you attempt to apply two different syndromes with CE_PHYS_ATT_CHANGE tags, the second one just doesn't do anything. It doesn't even overwrite the first one. Which is bollocks, because not only does it make vamps and maybe paladins immune to infect damage, but since there's no way to delete a syndrome from a creature, not even transformation, it doesn't appear to be possible to implement the way I intended, with progressive decreases to physical stats.
Post by: Putnam on August 26, 2013, 02:32:11 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 26, 2013, 02:38:58 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 26, 2013, 02:57:19 pm
I, for one, love the idea of having C_Variations all up in the everywhere. I'm working on c_variation_infect, which causes the affected creature to have attacks that cause the victims to become permanently weaker, and causes them to instantly die if too many of the debuffs stack on them.
I'm not getting it to work though, because apparently, if you attempt to apply two different syndromes with CE_PHYS_ATT_CHANGE tags, the second one just doesn't do anything. It doesn't even overwrite the first one. Which is bollocks, because not only does it make vamps and maybe paladins immune to infect damage, but since there's no way to delete a syndrome from a creature, not even transformation, it doesn't appear to be possible to implement the way I intended, with progressive decreases to physical stats.
Anything is possible with interactions and syndromes if you use your imagination. Like, really, I'm not even kidding. They probably make a Turing complete language and you could build a dwarven syndrome computer.
For example to make a syndrome that you can also make end when you like:
Syndrome 1: Can do interaction 1, duration t+100; Target cannot have syndrome class: SYN_CLASS; Self only, free action
Interaction 1: Target cannot have syndrome class STOP_SYN_CLASS; Add syndrome [syndrome content] to target, duration t, syndrome class is SYN_CLASS; Add copy of syndrome 1 to target;
Simple loop. Now the creature will
1) Suffer from the syndrome for t phases, and be able to restart the syndrome for t+100 phases
2) During the 100 phases when the creature does not suffer from the syndrome but can restart it, go to 1, except
3) If it at that time is also infected with a syndrome of class STOP_SYN_CLASS, instead let the syndrome expire
That would work for your system. For example. Then you make various severities of the syndrome - they only need the one loop, you can have multiple syndrome "branches" and define conditions for when each one is applied.
In case that doesn't work and the timer doesn't get extended correctly (it's been a while), then:
Syndrome 0: Can do interaction 0, start:t+101, duration 100; Self only, free action
Interaction 0: [Add syndrome 1 to self]
Syndrome 1: Can do interaction 1, duration t+100; Target cannot have syndrome class: SYN_CLASS; Self only, free action
Interaction 1: Target cannot have syndrome class STOP_SYN_CLASS; Add syndrome [syndrome content] to target, duration t, syndrome class is SYN_CLASS; Add copy of syndrome 0 to target;
is sure to work, adding a step where you wait for the content and loop syndromes to clear before restarting the loop. It's obviously not optimized at all and a mess, but you get the idea.
Post by: Halfling on August 26, 2013, 03:50:41 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Requires that one dwarf is transformed into an INTEGER_CREATURE affected by the INTEGER syndromes. Increments and decrements the integer when things happen on the map for x phases, then prints it by near-instantly killing as many random creatures on the map as the integer is at that point.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 26, 2013, 05:12:43 pm
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on August 26, 2013, 05:34:58 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 27, 2013, 12:24:47 am
Hey guys! May I do a play turn? I've been playing a little bit of this in the older versions and thought it might be cool to do a play turn.
Please do, we need one
The principle sounds useful, though that specific example is weird.
Not at all, the idea is that you can use it to read, increment and decrement an integer value, so it's possible to discriminate which state and which square of memory you are in by syndromes alone (compare to the classic tape, state, table, r/w Turing machine, however, with limited pre-initialized memory as is often the case). When you can further use this value to point to itself or other values (INTEGER_N: CDI: TARGET_DWARF_N) and perform operations on them it is clear that syndromes in fact form a programmable computer.
I will not be spending hours actually proving this as there is a line, though.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 27, 2013, 03:04:39 am
Post by: Halfling on August 27, 2013, 08:43:58 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
but if I ever am bored enough to do that, I'll make it its own thread. It doesn't look like I have a chance to be that bored in a long while though.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 27, 2013, 09:15:49 am
Hey guys! May I do a play turn? I've been playing a little bit of this in the older versions and thought it might be cool to do a play turn.If you're playing Halflings, build a wall around your town. It helps immensely.
Post by: Kazimuth on August 27, 2013, 09:52:23 am
Some random quibbles:
Formics are extremely weak to eye hits; eye attacks pretty much always open major arteries, and then they bleed out pretty quickly.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
There does not appear to be any way to manufacture quivers. You can spawn with them in adventure mode (silk quiver) but aside from that they are nonexistent. I think this may be interfering with hunting; my halfling hunters generally refuse to hunt, even if there are animals, bows, and arrows available (and they don't appear to use rocks to hunt).
On embark, if you pick 'prepare for the journey carefully', you start out with no points available, as they are all invested in a 400-coin iridium anvil. You can get rid of it, but it's still initially disconcerting. Also, some odd items show up for purchase: 'nothing leather' and 'tarnish stalk cloth cloth', if I remember correctly.
I'm also getting 'unrecognized inorganic token' spam in the errorlog:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This universe is coming along great though. Pitting dragons against swarms of dirigible antelopes in the arena is hilarious :D
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 27, 2013, 12:07:48 pm
This universe is coming along great though. Pitting dragons against swarms of dirigible antelopes in the arena is hilarious :D
I'm curious as to the results.
Lizardfolk Play Guide (Not Finished!)
-Get rid of the anvil. The Lizardfolk have their own custom type of forge that does not need the anvil.
-Smithing is entirely tied to the 'Woodburner' profession. This is necessary in order to have a limit to the number of metals that they have the ability to utilize.
-Don't bother with getting plants, the Lizardfolk race is entirely carnivorous. Instead, get a decent amount of tamed animals. Preferably not dragons, they won't eat anything that has scales.
-All of the other races are hostile, due to the child snatching tag on the Lizardfolk. In universe, this was intended to represent the fact that other races use the Lizardfolk as warriors, and the Dragonkin take Lizardfolk to use their magic upon the Lizardfolk to turn them into more Dragonkin.
-Lizardfolk nobility is an evolving system. If you are less than a certain population, then they are named one way, but after that population is reached, then they gain new names.
-Lizardfolk do not build up walls. The most that they build in terms of defenses is the occasional barricade in the marshes. (Note: they are an aboveground race.)
-A word to authors: Lizardfolk do not believe in the concept of good and evil. The closest they come is the concepts of chaos and order.
Post by: kero42 on August 27, 2013, 01:04:58 pm
-Don't bother with getting plants, the Lizardfolk race is entirely carnivorous. Instead, get a decent amount of tamed animals. Preferably not dragons, they won't eat anything that has scales.
-All of the other races are hostile, due to the child snatching tag on the Lizardfolk. In universe, this was intended to represent the fact that other races use the Lizardfolk as warriors, and the Dragonkin take Lizardfolk to use their magic upon the Lizardfolk to turn them into more Dragonkin.
-Lizardfolk do not build up walls. The most that they build in terms of defenses is the occasional barricade in the marshes. (Note: they are an aboveground race.)
This should give fortress defense an interesting twist, at least for people like me who are used to digging into hills :). Are the lizardfolk stronger than other races, to compensate for the (as I see it) openness and vulnerability that comes with being enemies with everyone and unable to build or dig enclosures? Still, I really wish I had the time and patience to learn how to mod so that I could work on this too.
On a side note, how many playable races do we have thus far, and where do they live? Just curious to see where they overlap map-wise.
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 27, 2013, 02:27:07 pm
Are the lizardfolk stronger than other races, to compensate for the (as I see it) openness and vulnerability that comes with being enemies with everyone and unable to build or dig enclosures?
Lizardfolk are a bit faster than other races, with a speed of 900. I believe they also mature younger, but I know they grow larger than most other races, reaching 70000 at age 10 and 95000 at age 30.
Quote
On a side note, how many playable races do we have thus far, and where do they live? Just curious to see where they overlap map-wise.
We have halflings, who build towns on any land, Formics, who create mountain-homes in any desert or tropical regions, and lizardfolk, who live in forest retreats in any wetlands and tropical forests.
Non-playable races include elves, who live in forest retreats in any forest and in rivers and lakes, and spider centaurs, which live in dark fortresses in any wetland, tropical forest, and tundras.
Also, while playing I found a lizardfolk that apparently likes to consume statues and n/a? I'm assuming these are related to some custom creatures, since I doubt that this strange young man consumes rocks and non-existent matter.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 27, 2013, 02:29:28 pm
Post by: Godlysockpuppet on August 27, 2013, 02:38:08 pm
900 is the default speed for all creatures, BTWI thought it was 2000 or something? Dont quote me on that though. Can you share the wiki page? I'm on a phone so it's a pain to go looking. Is it the creatire tokens page?
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 27, 2013, 02:44:37 pm
Huh, so it is. I thought it was 1000.
The lizardfolk have [SPEED:900] in their raws though...
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 27, 2013, 02:51:37 pm
while playing I found a lizardfolk that apparently likes to consume statues and n/a?
If anyone knows how to make the Statue creature not edible, feel free to modify that in. I lack the time, though I'm pretty sure it's just an easy material body detail plan swap.
Also, the Formics are weak to eye hits because eye tissue apparently bleeds a lot. Stab the eye of anything, pretty much, and it will bleed out before it can blink its shredded eyelids.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 27, 2013, 03:07:36 pm
Post by: Halfling on August 27, 2013, 03:52:55 pm
while playing I found a lizardfolk that apparently likes to consume statues and n/a?
If anyone knows how to make the Statue creature not edible, feel free to modify that in. I lack the time, though I'm pretty sure it's just an easy material body detail plan swap.
Make it drop an item corpse?
I changed Halfling's eye template during my turn to fix that (there are no major arteries in the eye!), but I guess the insect one was copied from his and I forgot to change that one.
Sure there are major arteries, the retina needs a lot of blood and the ophthalmic artery is extremely voluminous in relation to body part size. It's close (2/3?) to the diameter of the radial and ulnar arteries despite how much smaller your eye is than your hand. So major arteries in the eye is correct, but not major arteries in "eye tissue", but that's what we have... However, I didn't take into account that the game does not scale bleeding by body part size. It shouldn't have you bleed to death immediately and so your fixed material is better.
Also, while playing I found a lizardfolk that apparently likes to consume statues and n/a? I'm assuming these are related to some custom creatures, since I doubt that this strange young man consumes rocks and non-existent matter.
This n/a thing needs to be fixed. Something now contains a material that's defined improperly. It's new. This may also affect the creature since part of it is made of n/a.
I'd also be interested in a play turn; I've been playing with the most recent raws from Zanzetkuken's turn, and I realized I might as well contribute :)
--
There does not appear to be any way to manufacture quivers. You can spawn with them in adventure mode (silk quiver) but aside from that they are nonexistent.
--
I'm also getting 'unrecognized inorganic token' spam in the errorlog:And I've just started getting these errors:Spoiler (click to show/hide)Spoiler (click to show/hide)
To do a playing turn, just drop a story with pics and I'll add it as one :)
Quivers are very possible. You must make quivers out of leather.
The path fail errors are not related to our modding according to Putnam. "Cloth cloth" is intentional. Nothing is another improperly defined creature, this one lacks a name.
The unrecognized inorganic token part, however... that needs to die. Something is obviously referencing materials in a way that's copied from vanilla.
A quick search of the text files in Zanzetkuken's turn shows that there are no instances of GYPSUM or COAL_BITUMINOUS included. So what the hell is causing this?
Kazimuth, please describe exactly what files you have and/or upload if possible.
The rampant corruption in the world is not happy news at all, because things used to work more correctly. If it's like this after a few turns and this becomes a trend, then it will be worse later and at that time it's easier to just let it die than to fix it, when it's not just a few things that are broken. Can't depend on me to find and fix it either because, I'm really genuinely too busy with studies with a full working week on top of regular university study... can mostly do thread maintenance and I'll hand it over too if someone wants it.
We don't have anyone obligated to bugfix at this time, of course, since ZTG's bugfixing turn ended earlier. Not good.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 27, 2013, 04:00:28 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 27, 2013, 04:55:07 pm
There's different claims. Even I'm not sure and I've used syndromes a ton. Research is needed...I, for one, love the idea of having C_Variations all up in the everywhere. I'm working on c_variation_infect, which causes the affected creature to have attacks that cause the victims to become permanently weaker, and causes them to instantly die if too many of the debuffs stack on them.
I'm not getting it to work though, because apparently, if you attempt to apply two different syndromes with CE_PHYS_ATT_CHANGE tags, the second one just doesn't do anything. It doesn't even overwrite the first one. Which is bollocks, because not only does it make vamps and maybe paladins immune to infect damage, but since there's no way to delete a syndrome from a creature, not even transformation, it doesn't appear to be possible to implement the way I intended, with progressive decreases to physical stats.
Anything is possible with interactions and syndromes if you use your imagination. Like, really, I'm not even kidding. They probably make a Turing complete language and you could build a dwarven syndrome computer.
For example to make a syndrome that you can also make end when you like:
Syndrome 1: Can do interaction 1, duration t+100; Target cannot have syndrome class: SYN_CLASS; Self only, free action
Interaction 1: Target cannot have syndrome class STOP_SYN_CLASS; Add syndrome [syndrome content] to target, duration t, syndrome class is SYN_CLASS; Add copy of syndrome 1 to target;
Simple loop. Now the creature will
1) Suffer from the syndrome for t phases, and be able to restart the syndrome for t+100 phases
2) During the 100 phases when the creature does not suffer from the syndrome but can restart it, go to 1, except
3) If it at that time is also infected with a syndrome of class STOP_SYN_CLASS, instead let the syndrome expire
That would work for your system. For example. Then you make various severities of the syndrome - they only need the one loop, you can have multiple syndrome "branches" and define conditions for when each one is applied.
In case that doesn't work and the timer doesn't get extended correctly (it's been a while), then:
Syndrome 0: Can do interaction 0, start:t+101, duration 100; Self only, free action
Interaction 0: [Add syndrome 1 to self]
Syndrome 1: Can do interaction 1, duration t+100; Target cannot have syndrome class: SYN_CLASS; Self only, free action
Interaction 1: Target cannot have syndrome class STOP_SYN_CLASS; Add syndrome [syndrome content] to target, duration t, syndrome class is SYN_CLASS; Add copy of syndrome 0 to target;
is sure to work, adding a step where you wait for the content and loop syndromes to clear before restarting the loop. It's obviously not optimized at all and a mess, but you get the idea.
Holy shit. Tiiiiime to lock myself in a bunker and study this arcane tome to unlock its secrets of comprehension!
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on August 27, 2013, 07:36:29 pm
(There was a small problem with the images so they are enormous)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Problems I noticed with this race:
- They didn't have clothing other than boots and would complain about no clothing
- They couldn't seem to make mechanisms but requested a well
- They had no metalworking skills and their forge didn't even seem to work
I think that I will make a new attempt at playing this but with halflings or formics.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 27, 2013, 07:43:43 pm
We don't have anyone obligated to bugfix at this time, of course, since ZTG's bugfixing turn ended earlier. Not good.
I will still bugfix. I just don't have the time to search for the things myself. School and a club I am in take up a fair portion of my day.
Problems I noticed with this race:
- They didn't have clothing other than boots and would complain about no clothing
- They couldn't seem to make mechanisms but requested a well
- They had no metalworking skills and their forge didn't even seem to work
I think that I will make a new attempt at playing this but with halflings or formics.
-This is what I am talking about. I would have found this, if I had the time.
-Going to need to build a workaround.
-The forge uses the Woodburner skill.
Post by: Gnorm on August 27, 2013, 07:56:06 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 27, 2013, 08:07:01 pm
I myself tried using the wood burning skill in an attempt at lizardfolk, but it wouldn't even let me order the job. It said that I needed the ore and fuel, but I had both of those things. Maybe I am just doing something wrong?
Which ore was it? They can only work meteoric iron, aeresium, and lunanium ores, and each one has their own individual job.
Edit: Clothing/Mechanisms bugfix up.
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 27, 2013, 08:17:51 pm
We don't have anyone obligated to bugfix at this time, of course, since ZTG's bugfixing turn ended earlier. Not good.
I will still bugfix. I just don't have the time to search for the things myself. School and a club I am in take up a fair portion of my day.Problems I noticed with this race:
- They didn't have clothing other than boots and would complain about no clothing
- They couldn't seem to make mechanisms but requested a well
- They had no metalworking skills and their forge didn't even seem to work
I've found why they don't wear clothes, at least. They don't have the leather making reaction, and since they don't use plants they can't make fiber cloth. That also means they can't brew drinks, but since they don't need alcohol that isn't as much of an issue.
I tried using the wood burning skill in a different attempt at lizardfolk, but it wouldn't even let me order the job. It said I needed the ore and fuel but I had both of those things. Maybe I am just doing something wrong?
Shouldn't [REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:METEORIC_IRON_HLG] in the smelting reaction be [REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:METEORIC_IRON_STONE_1_HLG] or [REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:METEORIC_IRON_STONE_2_HLG], since taenite and kamacite are the ores for meteor iron?
Aeresium and lunanium appear to be fine.
Also, [FUEL] appears multiple times in some reactions, which doesn't work, unfortunately. You could just add coal as another reagent.
Post by: Putnam on August 27, 2013, 08:19:27 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 27, 2013, 08:26:52 pm
Also, [FUEL] appears multiple times in some reactions, which doesn't work, unfortunately. You could just add coal as another reagent.
This is now fixed.
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on August 27, 2013, 08:35:12 pm
Post by: Kazimuth on August 27, 2013, 08:41:57 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 27, 2013, 09:40:11 pm
Anyways, it looks like the smelting reactions reference the stones aeresiumite and lunaniumite in the reagent instead of the ores aeresium and lunanium. Could that be why they aren't working?
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_1_ZTG]
[NAME:make meteroic iron bars]
[BUILDING:LIZARDKIN_FORGE_ZTG:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:METEORIC_IRON_HLG]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:METAL:METEORIC_IRON_HLG][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[FUEL]
[FUEL]
[SKILL:WOOD_BURNING]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_2_ZTG]
[NAME:make aeresium bars]
[BUILDING:LIZARDKIN_FORGE_ZTG:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:AERESIUMITE_LKR]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:METAL:AERESIUM_LKR][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[FUEL]
[SKILL:WOOD_BURNING]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_3_ZTG]
[NAME:make lunanium bars]
[BUILDING:LIZARDKIN_FORGE_ZTG:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:LUNANIUMITE_LKR]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BAR:NO_SUBTYPE:METAL:LUNANIUM_LKR][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[FUEL][FUEL]
[SKILL:WOOD_BURNING]
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 27, 2013, 09:44:29 pm
Code: [Select]
[METAL_ORE:AERESIUM_LKR:100]
....
[METAL_ORE:LUNANIUM_LKR:100]
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 27, 2013, 09:46:57 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 27, 2013, 09:51:46 pm
So METAL_ORE works for both ores and stones that carry ores? I need to look into reaction creation more often.
When the METAL_ORE tag is added to a material, a smelting job is automatically created in the game for the hardcoded smelters, and when the job is used at the smelter, it transforms the material into the material that comes after METAL_ORE, at the percentage that is after the metal in the METAL_ORE tag.
Post by: Halfling on August 27, 2013, 10:14:06 pm
@ZTG:
I think he's asking whether there's a problem using
[REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:AERESIUMITE_LKR]
instead of
[REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:AERESIUM_LKR]
in the reaction
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 27, 2013, 10:14:46 pm
So METAL_ORE works for both ores and stones that carry ores? I need to look into reaction creation more often.
When the METAL_ORE tag is added to a material, a smelting job is automatically created in the game for the hardcoded smelters, and when the job is used at the smelter, it transforms the material into the material that comes after METAL_ORE, at the percentage that is after the metal in the METAL_ORE tag.
Oh, I meant for use in a reaction, I already knew about putting it into a material when I wanted to make cobaltite smeltable. Granted, I spent hours ripping apart several mods looking for non-existent reactions before I found out how to do it.
It's just that your reaction had [REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:LUNANIUMITE_LKR] and [REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:AERESIUMITE_LKR] and I wasn't sure if that's what was causing people problems with smelting since those are the stones for lunanium and aeresium, and not the metals.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 27, 2013, 10:19:55 pm
That lizardfolk story was hilarious. Exiled by their halflings generals to live in the wild without clothes or working equipment... poor reptiles. I would put it on the first page but it might be confusing now that the bugs are fixed.
@ZTG:
I think he's asking whether there's a problem using
[REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:AERESIUMITE_LKR]
instead of
[REAGENT:A:1:METAL_ORE:AERESIUM_LKR]
in the reaction
*slow facepalm*
It's fixed, now. Interesting to note: I had the exact same problem with clothing in the first mod I made.
Post by: blademan9999 on August 28, 2013, 04:25:40 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on August 28, 2013, 04:57:43 am
This game is incompatible with normal DF it crashes everytime I click create new world.
I'd suggest heading to the OP and finding the link for the "Compatibility" post, and reading the third paragraph of Halfling's words on the matter. The gist of things is that there are somefiles you shouldn't copy over for compatibility - mainly, the edited vanilla ones we had to include to prevent the game from coughing up its innards and dying on startup all the time. The post I refer you lists them.
Post by: Cain12 on August 28, 2013, 01:22:38 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on August 28, 2013, 01:37:29 pm
This game is incompatible with normal DF it crashes everytime I click create new world.Don't overwrite anything, just delete everything in raw/objects and then fill the folder with our stuff.
Post by: Halfling on August 28, 2013, 01:58:20 pm
Hi again, demonic cherubim sound cool, just here to say lizardfolk can't open doors.
![CANOPENDOORS] strikes again!
@Zanzetkuken & al: please keep a changelog on your upload page. Your (Z) upload page currently reads "Most up to date raws." While this is true, it does not give you any info about whether you should download it or not if you already have an older version. You can't even deduce from this that you do have an older version, much less whether the newest fix is fixing reactions or making lizardfolk able to open doors; the assumption is people won't read the thread. People won't remember the downloads counter either.
Post by: BlackFlyme on August 28, 2013, 02:08:38 pm
Hi again, demonic cherubim sound cool, just here to say lizardfolk can't open doors.
I'm now imagining some poor lizardman installing a front door to his fort, only to realize that he just locked himself out :P
But since we are on the subject, they are also missing a [CHILD] token and don't have any permitted tools in their entity. I don't believe the Formics have any tools either. I'm not sure if that's intentional.
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 28, 2013, 05:01:29 pm
I'm honestly wondering if we should just excise these from the raws and let Odin over here fix his shit on his own time.
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on August 28, 2013, 05:05:48 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 28, 2013, 06:01:55 pm
Hi again, demonic cherubim sound cool, just here to say lizardfolk can't open doors.But since we are on the subject, they are also missing a [CHILD] token and don't have any permitted tools in their entity. I don't believe the Formics have any tools either. I'm not sure if that's intentional.
All of this is fixed. Those types of tools aren't needed.
Post by: WillowLuman on August 28, 2013, 06:03:15 pm
Post by: reemer30 on August 28, 2013, 06:04:32 pm
Figured out my notification spam problem- it was because I had made a copy of my usual DF folder and installed the raws into that. My usual DF folder uses lazy newb pack, so dfhack and other things were still launching when I ran the modded game. Downloaded a fresh copy of DF from bay12, modded that, and it has worked without spam so far. So, fault on my end :-\
Thank you for this. I was going apeshit searching for what was producing this. As for my modding turn, its very small additions, as I happened to be starting at a new school the day I picked up my turn. I added some plants to the deserts and tundra/taiga biomes, still working on trying to add some more during my bugfix phase, since I always check for bugs as I work.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 28, 2013, 08:34:51 pm
Except, they'll need nest boxes to reproduce if they lay eggs
...fixed.
Post by: reemer30 on August 28, 2013, 09:32:33 pm
Changes:
~Added two types of cacti to deserts, the spiny cactus and the Dragon's Tail cactus
~Added a type of fruit to the desert, brewable/edible, and semi-valuable, the heart of the desert
~Added extra ground cover to the Taigas, along with a fern, edible when cooked, and the frost nettle, which was planned for some kind of fireproofing process
~Added snowcaps to the taigas, a wide, tall, white tree-like mushroom to the taigas
~Changed apple tree spawning to temperate only
~Added purple tea, which is only usable by the hobbits, bushes must be dried before brewed into purple tea
[/glow]]http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7943 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7943[glow=red,2,300)
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 28, 2013, 09:54:35 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on August 28, 2013, 09:59:40 pm
Also, Lizardkin can't do anything with coal. Specifically, make coke.
This is on purpose. As I recall, charcoal was the original substance used in metal smithing.
Post by: sackhead on August 29, 2013, 01:05:57 am
Also, Lizardkin can't do anything with coal. Specifically, make coke.you tried to mine coal.. how many deaths?
Post by: Halfling on August 29, 2013, 03:50:27 am
Zanz, thanks for editing your download page, what I really meant by changelog though is that it would say e.g. "newest update - added nest boxes" so people will know when they need to update.
bulborbish, ready? Your turn starts once reemer has uploaded a version with newest base raws.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 29, 2013, 08:28:55 am
Zero. I just brought some on embark...Also, Lizardkin can't do anything with coal. Specifically, make coke.you tried to mine coal.. how many deaths?
Along with one charcoal and no axe...
Time to try that fort again...
Post by: laularukyrumo on August 29, 2013, 12:59:23 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on August 29, 2013, 05:15:41 pm
I feel like the game treats coke and charcoal identically. Unless you just mean "they don't have the reaction to smelt coal available to them" as opposed to "I brought pre-refined coal and they refuse to use it", which is an actual problem.Fortunately, the former, not the latter. Still, at least I didn't find that out after mining a vein of coal...
Post by: reemer30 on August 29, 2013, 09:52:33 pm
Post by: Mesa on August 30, 2013, 05:57:03 am
I've been occasionally skulking this thread, and I absolutely adore what you guys can come up with.
Because I'm too lazy to go through all those pages...
Do you have a set of raw files that contain JUST enough for the game not to crash due to lack of some crucial items (for some reason), but without anything truly new?
I just want to fiddle around with DF from scratch myself.
KTHXBAI
Post by: Ombragon on August 30, 2013, 07:16:03 am
EDIT: wooops missing word
Post by: Halfling on August 30, 2013, 01:41:50 pm
Hi there.
I've been occasionally skulking this thread, and I absolutely adore what you guys can come up with.
Because I'm too lazy to go through all those pages...
Do you have a set of raw files that contain JUST enough for the game not to crash due to lack of some crucial items (for some reason), but without anything truly new?
I just want to fiddle around with DF from scratch myself.
KTHXBAI
That would be the first pack, "Starting point: minimal world" good man. This one: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7776 Took many crashes to figure out what's needed. (It does include extra items)
You get halflings, some minimal equipment for them, the mallard, the hound, two megabeasts, pumpkins, flax, apple trees, moss and underground luminescent moss. You can remove most of those very easily too.
If someone is interested I have many idea and probably can't all of them
Share it then ;)
Post by: Ombragon on August 31, 2013, 02:01:43 am
Post by: WillowLuman on August 31, 2013, 02:07:20 am
Post by: Halfling on August 31, 2013, 05:14:58 am
Post by: reemer30 on August 31, 2013, 01:29:00 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7943 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7943)
Post by: Halfling on August 31, 2013, 01:34:50 pm
It doesn't end yet, though. You'll now be our designated bugfixer or at least implementer of those until we get the next upload, since you have the opportunity to edit what's the most recent revision. Signed up for the whole package after all ;)
As far as modding goes, let's wait a bit for mastahcheese to show up and get started.
Post by: Aseaheru on August 31, 2013, 01:38:50 pm
Er... I just made a world with it and found a "creature" that lives a single year.
Post by: Halfling on August 31, 2013, 01:52:26 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on August 31, 2013, 01:55:30 pm
It also seems that every creature in the game is born as a FB or something as I have seen carts with that sort of name and sutch.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 01, 2013, 09:16:14 am
Post by: reemer30 on September 01, 2013, 12:39:29 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 01, 2013, 01:05:55 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 01, 2013, 01:09:38 pm
Tea is dried in the kitchen, and I only gave halflings the reaction to dry the leaves. That's because I just couldn't imagine ant/lizards sitting around a fireplace sipping fine teas. After that they should be brewed in the still in the normal fashion.
Plus, well, the lizardffolk couldn't even grow the tea in the first place (there is no farming for them [On_Purpose]), and everyone else is hostile to them, so they can't trade for it.
Post by: Halfling on September 01, 2013, 02:29:57 pm
Mocman, up next if no word from him. Ready?
Post by: reemer30 on September 01, 2013, 02:33:36 pm
BTW, did my river squids and swamp nautilus make it into the release?I did not add them, I could throw it in though.
Also, I'm getting the feeling we are gonna have to skip til Putnam's turn.
One more thing, I suggest we throw masta a PM, since he/she is still active on the DF forums.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 01, 2013, 02:44:05 pm
BTW, did my river squids and swamp nautilus make it into the release?I did not add them, I could throw it in though.
Also, I'm getting the feeling we are gonna have to skip til Putnam's turn.
One more thing, I suggest we throw masta a PM, since he/she is still active on the DF forums.
I just sent MC one.
Post by: Halfling on September 01, 2013, 02:49:05 pm
Post by: mocman on September 01, 2013, 03:56:39 pm
I've been working on a few things with all the other versions
I think masta will be here, but if not I'm ready to get stuff working with the latest version.
Post by: Kazimuth on September 01, 2013, 06:24:15 pm
Anyone seen this problem before?
Also, the interactions to test out the hydra vigors are still around in adventure mode; just FYI.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 01, 2013, 07:15:41 pm
Tea is dried in the kitchen, and I only gave halflings the reaction to dry the leaves. That's because I just couldn't imagine ant/lizards sitting around a fireplace sipping fine teas. After that they should be brewed in the still in the normal fashion.I dont see that option, just the three meal ones. And I think the logs are still broke.
Post by: reemer30 on September 01, 2013, 09:45:51 pm
Post by: kopout on September 01, 2013, 10:28:45 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 01, 2013, 11:04:00 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on September 01, 2013, 11:21:57 pm
Good luck to whoever's turn it is.
Oh, and thanks for the PM, Zan, I've been to busy to even read through this thread much, so I had no idea it was my turn.
Post by: kopout on September 01, 2013, 11:33:25 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 01, 2013, 11:37:10 pm
Post by: reemer30 on September 01, 2013, 11:39:49 pm
Post by: kopout on September 01, 2013, 11:39:57 pm
Edit: I just embarked on 22 river squid. Thank god they don't leave the water
Post by: Ombragon on September 02, 2013, 02:22:49 am
Post by: reemer30 on September 02, 2013, 03:06:21 am
Post by: Aseaheru on September 02, 2013, 03:18:02 pm
Are you playing as halflings? I only gave halflings the ability to dry the leaves. Also, if you downloaded them right after I uploaded, I did accidentally use a raw file without the reaction in it. I fixed that within the first 20 minutes of it being up though.I am halflings and I will try to redo the save as I may have caught it just after the upload, I dont know.
Post by: mocman on September 02, 2013, 03:21:12 pm
I noticed that there were already "Wandering Spirits" in the mod, i had been making a creature similar that would be able to change into any number of creatures. Who is 'ztg'? And if you would allow me to modifying this creature in your raws to do the same?
My plans are to somehow get a civilization to have an unattainable material to sell to yours and using this in a new workshop to transmute into most useful things and if there are any yet to be implemented ideas from people without turns I will be listening.
Post by: PDF urist master on September 02, 2013, 03:35:01 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 02, 2013, 04:00:18 pm
someone should do a wiki on this mod.I was, myself, considering undertaking such a bold task. I'll have to wait until I have some spare time, though.
Post by: Cain12 on September 02, 2013, 04:49:01 pm
I noticed that there were already "Wandering Spirits" in the mod, i had been making a creature similar that would be able to change into any number of creatures. Who is 'ztg'? And if you would allow me to modifying this creature in your raws to do the same?
Provided you haven't already been answered:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Also downloaded the latest version, attacks on wandering spirits are still glancing away (sorry I should have checked if that was fixed or whatever was happening with it like 10 days ago):
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Edit:Also does it matter if wandering spirits can't see?:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on September 02, 2013, 05:03:33 pm
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on September 02, 2013, 05:18:42 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 02, 2013, 05:54:38 pm
I noticed that there were already "Wandering Spirits" in the mod, i had been making a creature similar that would be able to change into any number of creatures. Who is 'ztg'? And if you would allow me to modifying this creature in your raws to do the same?
I don't want that contribution modded. What you are creating sounds more like shapeshifters, so I don't see how that would even be related to my spirits.
Also downloaded the latest version, attacks on wandering spirits are still glancing away (sorry I should have checked if that was fixed or whatever was happening with it like 10 days ago):Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Edit:Also does it matter if wandering spirits can't see?:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It would have been neat, but when I first found out that the material wasn't working, I just left it.
It doesn't really matter that they can't see. They aren't intended to be played as, only seen wandering.
Oh, and thanks for the PM, Zan, I've been to busy to even read through this thread much, so I had no idea it was my turn.
Thou art velcome.
Post by: Gnorm on September 02, 2013, 06:45:47 pm
I just updated the DFFD file to include the cherubs, so next modder make sure you get this version.The latest version does seem to include the cherub civilization and its related mods, but I was unable to find the actual creatures in the raws. I believe that you forgot to include them.
Post by: Cain12 on September 02, 2013, 07:12:46 pm
It would have been neat, but when I first found out that the material wasn't working, I just left it.K, sorry to have bugged you.
It doesn't really matter that they can't see. They aren't intended to be played as, only seen wandering.
Post by: kopout on September 02, 2013, 07:28:16 pm
I have success with the coconuts! The milk is perfectly drinkable and the meat, thread, and shells are all properly produced.
Post by: reemer30 on September 02, 2013, 09:29:12 pm
Post by: kopout on September 02, 2013, 10:01:55 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 03, 2013, 10:18:18 am
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 10:58:07 am
In bugfixing news, Halfling raws do not currently contain drying tea leaves as a permitted reaction that I can find.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 03, 2013, 11:30:10 am
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 11:36:13 am
Awww...
Until there's a new patch up, can hotfix by adding [PERMITTED_REACTION:DRY_LEAVES_PURPLE_REM] to the halfling entity in entity_halfling.txt and generating a new world. Post a report on if it works otherwise if you do. :)
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 12:06:34 pm
I would like to sign up for an actual moding turn. Also, the trees are done (again) including coconuts. One last round of test ting (for cheese) is all I need. Because of how pervasive the changes are (and I have a patch making lumberyards and plank making work) I was wondering if I could upload the whole objects folder even though it is not my mod turn.
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 12:23:38 pm
You'll want to post the list of files that you changed anyway, because two people are working on patches at the same time. Reemer will want to know what files he'll have to not overwrite when merging.
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 12:46:30 pm
material_template_organic_kopout
entity_halfling
plant_koput (misspelling came with the raws)
reaction_kopout
Have all been changed. I'm probably going to change the Halfling creature entry as well unless you want the to be lactose intolerant. The name of the lumberyard has been changed both in the building definition and in the Halfling entity file to bring it in line with our standards and with the reactions that should take place there. I also added reaction_plankmaking_STL because it wasn't there. I don't need to upload the raws but it would be easer for me and probably for who ever has to integrate them.
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 12:54:48 pm
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 12:58:47 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 03, 2013, 01:08:45 pm
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 01:12:40 pm
Edit: Yup, drink and make cheese are mutually exclusive :(
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 02:01:35 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7957 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7957)
no coconut bras though
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 02:29:47 pm
Code: [Select]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:MILK:MILK_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen cow's milk]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen cow's milk]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:cow's milk]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:cow's milk]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling cow's milk]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling cow's milk]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[MILKABLE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:MILK:20000]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:CHEESE:CREATURE_CHEESE_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME:SOLID:cow cheese]
[STATE_ADJ:SOLID:cow cheese]
[STATE_NAME:SOLID_POWDER:cow cheese powder]
[STATE_ADJ:SOLID_POWDER:cow cheese powder]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:melted cow cheese]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:melted cow cheese]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling cow cheese]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling cow cheese]
[PREFIX:NONE]What happens if you just add [ALCOHOL_CREATURE] to the milk?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 03, 2013, 02:30:57 pm
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 02:39:56 pm
Quote
Because milk is considered a food and not a drink, dwarves will not drink it, even if they are dying of thirst.
If you add alcohol tags to milk the game no longer considerers it milk. Only water and alcohol are drinkable in fort mode so milk can only be eaten and not drunk. as it stands you can drink plant milk and make cheese from animal milk. (mostly moot, only coconuts produce milk at the moment)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 03, 2013, 02:41:38 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 02:53:11 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 03, 2013, 02:57:57 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 03:03:34 pm
Milk that's drinkable by default would make the DFFS experience more refreshing and give another little chance for "doing it right" to shine.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 03, 2013, 03:07:17 pm
Scratch that, we'd need to label the custom cheese reaction so people can tell.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 03, 2013, 03:08:21 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 03, 2013, 03:09:27 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 03, 2013, 03:12:04 pm
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 03:20:19 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 03:22:05 pm
It might be a little confusing. But I think we already took the path where you should read a DFFS player guide for your race before playing.
At this time, pressing "just play", unless you're formics, will give you an iridium anvil that's too expensive for you to take much else (when you should just cast a cheap anvil), with poisonous plants to eat, and make it very hard for you to get started. Playing vanilla style without a care you'll end up cultivating more poison, brewing alcohol that gives your people hangovers and is unnecessary, generally just dying to any invaders and occasionally the wildlife, and If you don't know about fruit trees you're getting less food and fruit. In short, extra fun. I don't think we should switch gears and start worrying about that too much at this point. Doing differently is cool and ultimately what makes this interesting. So making milk work differently would be just a logical continuation of that process.
That said I'm not the player-base nor am I actively developing because I'll feel too guilty taking away from university activities, so whatever works.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 03, 2013, 03:25:18 pm
Also, I vote for not making anything that needs DFhack to work. Not everyone can run it.
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 03:52:31 pm
TrueSpoiler: I dislike distributing unsigned binaries and telling people to "just run it" on systems where you typically log in as administrator and the typical user doesn't know/care, I don't like the idea of making this very difficult and complex to run, I don't want to support anything that didn't share its source code when it would take 2-3 clicks to do that, and I don't want to shut Mac users out, or provide inadequate support to different/better operating systems than mainstream, etc. It would be simplest and cleanest if this is just a raws mod and doesn't include any utilities as then it's easy for everyone, including the modders. But there's also lots, very many cool things to do with DFhack, these days, like light effects, diplomacy-affecting reactions, etc. that you will see in Masterwork that are amazing, and it's not like there can't be different forks. So eventually if that's what's needed to reach new frontiers, then I don't want to cut off that possibility either. I'll not veto it if people want to include DFhack or other utilities at some point. It's a discussion we'll eventually have. Just saying for discussion.
Post by: Putnam on September 03, 2013, 03:53:36 pm
Literally color=transparent.
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 03:55:05 pm
I find the regular spoiler annoying because it stands out more than the usual text. It's more like "make post shorter", not "hide text" (a very good feature to have though).
For anyone interested the non-transparent choices are #292929 and #444444
Post by: WillowLuman on September 03, 2013, 04:04:42 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on September 03, 2013, 04:15:01 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 04:18:23 pm
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 04:27:20 pm
The first step in making cheese is curdling the milk into, well, curds. This produces the curds as well as a thin watery milk called whey. We could have a reaction that takes raw milk (drinkable) and makes curds(cheeseable) and whey(drinkable). the curds would then be used in the hardcoded "make cheese" reaction. We would need to tell people though so they don't wonder why they can't make cheese even though they have plenty of milk.
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 04:33:39 pm
the curds would then be used in the hardcoded "make cheese" reaction
How does one accomplish this? There's no such item token as MILK or one assigned to milk in the wiki. I assumed therefore milk usable that way can only be made by milking.
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 04:35:24 pm
[REACTION_CLASS:MILK]
[MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CHEESE_MAT:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:CHEESE]
and maybe this one
[LIQUID_MISC_CREATURE]
Are all that make milk milk. Cheese making is a hard coded reaction that requires a reagent with [REACTION_CLASS:MILK] and produces what ever is listed as the cheese mat. It's kind of like tanning in that regard, we just can't see it is all. The reagent must also not have any alcohol tags apparently.
Edit: sorry, computer gliched
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 04:39:00 pm
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 04:42:16 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 03, 2013, 04:52:27 pm
If you then go and make it alcohol instead, maybe it becomes classified as DRINK. So then the reaction would have to require DRINK:NONE or NONE:NONE for it to work. The 1st makes no sense for Toady's non-drinkable milk scheme and the 2nd it probably is not. That would explain why it would not work if you add that token.
Post by: reemer30 on September 03, 2013, 07:20:35 pm
EDIT: I found that the file was indeed uploaded in the wrong version, as I have a few dozen DF folders. Fixed the file, just testing to make sure its working right.
Post by: kopout on September 03, 2013, 07:38:01 pm
Post by: reemer30 on September 03, 2013, 08:02:14 pm
Post by: kopout on September 04, 2013, 08:18:00 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 05, 2013, 04:20:05 pm
Spoiler: Stats from DFFD download pages (click to show/hide)
Post by: reemer30 on September 05, 2013, 07:09:07 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on September 06, 2013, 09:08:07 am
Post by: Halfling on September 06, 2013, 10:29:47 am
Well, maybe I should agree on the "compile" part.
Here's how I see it: at around your (@LKR) turn, there was massive buzz here. People were talking about what to add, how things should be, and so on. Lots of new ideas and discussion. Lots of player reports, good ones. I remember noticing that this thread never falls below first page, and that was without any attempt at spamming it, just from all the talk.
Not so anymore. Now it seems more like modding for modding's sake. The same amount of people should be downloading and playing it, but they're more quiet now. That's fine too.
If more activity is desired the answer is simple - more buzz (and non-modding participation). More player reports, more fanart, more description of stuff, somebody say a wiki? That. That's what makes this thing run. Nobody will be too interested in modding either if there's no visible reaction when you create something awesome. That requires a bit of a community to happen.
Mm... I was originally thinking about how to encourage such more. Because really, people who make stories contribute as much to the project as the modders, for the above reasons, and should be "rewarded" equally. But I didn't come up with a good answer.
I'm also not sure whether my relative inactivity... which will only get worse, my next uni. rotation is such that I will mostly not be sleeping home... is an issue, since the thread is in my name (and I maintain it, but do people expect more?).
I guess it's also to do with how it's September and we're back to work in our non-virtual lives again, collectively.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 06, 2013, 10:39:57 am
I guess it's also to do with how it's September and we're back to work in our non-virtual lives again, collectively.
I would say that this is one of the main hindrances for me. Taking a lot of honors classes this year.
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 06, 2013, 01:30:00 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 06, 2013, 02:52:37 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 06, 2013, 03:32:39 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 06, 2013, 07:33:13 pm
I would say that this is one of the main hindrances for me. Taking a lot of honors classes this year.
Situation is basically the same for me :( Plus I've got another modding project for a different game I'm trying to bring up to a functional level so I can try releasing it, which is eating the rest of my free time. CK2 is much less convenient to mod than DF, if only for the sheer drudgery of setting up provinces...
I don't start Fall Term until the 26th, fortunately.
You lucky duck. I've been stuck in calculus trying to survive the tide of review worksheets :(
And:
Your thread is one I visit almost daily to read what new bits have been added to this project.
Very much this. I visit Bay12 basically every two hours just to see what's been going on in here.
Maybe now that we've got a slowdown in activity, we should try the actual "succession game" part after a focused, bugfixes-only turn? See how everything works in a traditional madness-inducing setting, do deeper testing than possible before, have fun, terrorize wooden-elves and such with trained spiders?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 06, 2013, 07:40:22 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 06, 2013, 08:17:37 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 06, 2013, 08:41:20 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 06, 2013, 10:01:11 pm
I'm curious, what do civ Ethics look like?
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 06, 2013, 10:20:35 pm
I've begun work on a wiki to compile information on this mod. It's hardly anything as of now, but it will hopefully bring in new players, eventually.
A link, if you please.
Very interesting. I'm up to page 93.
I'm curious, what do civ Ethics look like?
For which race?
Post by: Vgray on September 06, 2013, 10:28:15 pm
Scratch elves are like Vanilla elves I suspect.
Ethics wise I mean...
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 06, 2013, 10:30:44 pm
I'm mostly interested in the Formics and Lizardfolk.
Scratch elves are like Vanilla elves I suspect.
Ethics wise I mean...
Don't know about the Formics, but here is the Lizardfolk:
Code: [Select]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:JUSTIFIED_IF_GOOD_REASON]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:JUSTIFIED_IF_GOOD_REASON]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:JUSTIFIED_IF_GOOD_REASON]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TREASON:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:LYING:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
[ETHIC:THEFT:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
Post by: Vgray on September 06, 2013, 10:39:29 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 06, 2013, 10:47:38 pm
Code: [Select]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:LYING:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:THEFT:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:MISGUIDED]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:APPALLING]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TREASON:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
Formic ethics are based around what my view of what a hive of insects organized around a racial caste system would likely follow. Trespassing and theft aren't punished harshly if at all, since everything belongs to the Queen anyways (though stealing could be viewed as and punished as stealing from the Queen herself), while treason is utterly unthinkable. Oaths are similarly inviolable. Lying is unthinkable because of the aforementioned communal views on property ownership - information being property.
Spider-Centaurs:
Code: [Select]
"Ethics? We have what, now?"
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:LYING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:JUSTIFIED_IF_NO_REPERCUSSIONS]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:THEFT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TREASON:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:ACCEPTABLE]
Spider-Centaur ethical codes mainly consist of "whatever we can get away with without being murdered by the victim, and then some, is allowed." I imagine their race is confined to barbarism because any spider-centaur with a half ounce of common sense and a set of working legs has hightailed it out of the towers and lives as a solitary paranoiac hermit in the tropics, unwilling to give you the time of day much less share any philosophical thoughts they might have had with you.
Post by: Vgray on September 06, 2013, 10:54:29 pm
Which race is more ethically bankrupt? Spider-Centaurs or Vanilla Goblins?
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 06, 2013, 10:55:27 pm
So...I guess Lizardfolk can't eat a sentient that's still alive?
Correct. They aren't barbaric. They're practical, and you're able to cook dead stuff easier.
Now I wonder...
Which race is more ethically bankrupt? Spider-Centaurs or Vanilla Goblins?
Spider Centaurs. At least Vanilla Goblins have PERSONAL_MATTER for everything, rather than ACCEPTABLE and REQUIRED.
Post by: Vgray on September 06, 2013, 11:06:21 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 06, 2013, 11:08:04 pm
Hmm...don't those Ethics mean they can't scavenge? They have to kill it themselves?
Steep Warrior Tradition.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 06, 2013, 11:09:28 pm
Now I wonder...
Which race is more ethically bankrupt? Spider-Centaurs or Vanilla Goblins?
Spider Centaurs. At least Vanilla Goblins have PERSONAL_MATTER for everything, rather than ACCEPTABLE and REQUIRED.
You're not a man in spider-centaur society until you've committed at least three felonies and mounted the stuffed head of a romantic rival above your front door. The taxidermy business in their towers is thriving :D
Post by: Vgray on September 06, 2013, 11:30:51 pm
Undead giant bugs anyone?
Post by: kopout on September 06, 2013, 11:57:28 pm
Post by: reemer30 on September 07, 2013, 01:01:18 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 07, 2013, 01:40:35 am
For my part, I'm having a blast just reading everyone's posts each day. It's part of my breakfast/evening reading.
Post by: reemer30 on September 07, 2013, 03:12:24 am
Post by: Rose on September 07, 2013, 09:43:36 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 07, 2013, 11:18:27 am
Post by: Vgray on September 07, 2013, 02:24:18 pm
Trees are the most obvious one.
Post by: Putnam on September 07, 2013, 02:35:44 pm
Post by: reemer30 on September 07, 2013, 02:40:54 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Vgray on September 07, 2013, 02:41:29 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 07, 2013, 02:50:31 pm
So Here are the concept drawings of the different stuff I added, the nettles are kinda hard to see through the eraser marks, but its just a bush with some icicle-like spikes on it.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Adding as "fanart" for now even if it's not really.
So happy to hear from you guys who follow. It wouldn't be as much fun without you.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 07, 2013, 02:53:51 pm
Just imagine how much more dangerous the giant bugs will be...or the cuttlefish.
Hey! Those cuttlefish are cuddly!
...
...
Actually, I've had little luck encountering them in-game. How are they?
Post by: Vgray on September 07, 2013, 02:57:30 pm
The new politicking in the next version will seem weird with laid-back Hobbits won't it?
Post by: Xieg on September 07, 2013, 03:31:30 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 07, 2013, 03:53:31 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I imagined them to dress like colonial Americans: spats, sleeve garters, double-breasted waistcoats, big ties, and ponytails on the men. I might do another one for the female halflings, if I get the chance.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 07, 2013, 04:17:38 pm
Post by: kero42 on September 07, 2013, 05:22:52 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
So there they are. I'm honestly quite proud of myself, despite my lack of artistic skill. It was a good way to use up an hour or so of my weekend if nothing else.
Post by: Halfling on September 07, 2013, 05:50:42 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Good on you for getting the relative sizes right. The expression is about right too, hounds are large predators and like fighting according to their tags after all :D
Halflings wear "open sandals" which actually cover 0% of the foot according to their raws. This is a workaround; in DF, if an intelligent race does not wear any shoes, it invariably gets unhappy thoughts about not having shoes, even if it's physically incapable of wearing shoes, does not know what shoes are, and does not have a word for them.
You can imagine they look something like:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_nok6TY4APb8/SvRL2DyiS6I/AAAAAAAACAw/bquARMpA-pk/s400/DSC05110.jpg
http://trainyourfeet.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/trail-rocks.jpg
except with more hair on the feet of course.
Switched the fanart gallery to a number system due to the soaring amount of entries and added everyone's posts.
Post by: Gnorm on September 07, 2013, 06:12:11 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 07, 2013, 06:47:09 pm
I'm reading another DFFS wiki by Zanzetkuken. Exciting :P
Anyway, such a resource will be great, 100+ pages is a lot to read for anyone and we're already at 124. Especially good would be a proposals system for unimplemented content too, so anyone on their turn can easily find it, although it would have to be safe from funny third party edits.
Post by: Gnorm on September 07, 2013, 06:56:29 pm
I'm reading another DFFS wiki by Zanzetkuken. Exciting :PAnother wiki! The Great Wiki Race is on!
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 07, 2013, 07:29:48 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
You can sorta still see the faint outlines of some wings. I decided in the end that a flying basilisk bug erred on the side of "extreme overkill" and kept it landbound. The halflings don't even know how close they came to extinction at the gaze of a race of airborne horrors.
Might see what I can interpret off the raws for other folks' critters later.
@Kero42, on the topic of formic limbs, they've got four arms and two legs. Nice picture of one nevertheless :D
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 07, 2013, 08:09:21 pm
I'm reading another DFFS wiki by Zanzetkuken. Exciting :PAnother wiki! The Great Wiki Race is on!
I had taken it down when I saw that you were working on one, but with that comment, here it is (http://df-from-scratch.wikia.com/wiki/DF_from_Scratch_Wiki), with, for some reason, three pages in existance, when only 1 can be reached.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 07, 2013, 08:47:12 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
The one standing protectively over the dead grub is raising its front tentacles in a threat display to warn the foreign cuttler off. Stalk-eyes were a bit of creative license on my part, as when I hear "small land squid" I immediately think "squibbon" from the cartoon The Future is Wild. The weird spherical plant in the back behind the foreign cuttler is actually a pumpkin. I'm fairly certain pumpkin stalks do not normally look like that, but plugging that into Google Images was too much effort, so yeah :P
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 07, 2013, 09:14:26 pm
Edit: Just checked. You don't need to make an account to create pages.
Post by: Halfling on September 07, 2013, 09:27:51 pm
While that's a good start, and no reason not to refine it, I'd like to have a look at Gnorm's wiki too that he's been working on, and then I think we should decide rationally which wiki to concentrate on, since both are now functional. Having two will not work.
Unfortunately it'll probably not be here this instant as Wikia admins probably don't do personal requests on weekends. Edit: or who knows. Wikia's actually a pretty big thing apparently. Maybe they do have round the clock "customer service". My money's still on "not".
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 07, 2013, 09:38:46 pm
I guess I sparked a minor wiki war accidentally.
The creation of mine was an accident of not noticing Gnorm was creating one. I only saw the idea, not the post that said he was creating one. When I saw he was (a couple minutes after I made the wiki), I couldn't find anyway to take it down, so I just deleted everything. The comment about the war made me restore it.
Oh, I edited the navigation. The guides category, when pointed to, opens up a list of playable races. Point towards the names of anyone whom has made a turn, 'creatures', 'plants', and 'rocks and minerals' appears. If someone didn't have something of those, there could simply be '[Name] did not add any [subcategory] on their modding turn' or something.
Edit: Copy and pasted the guides as they currently are.
Post by: Gnorm on September 07, 2013, 09:57:25 pm
The Daemonic Cherubim Player's Guide
I. Introduction
The daemonic cherubim are indeed an interesting race. Sent by Armok himself to collect live offerings, they build large cathedrals into the mountains in which they worship. You, as a player, will not be erecting one of these structures, however; instead, you will take the role of an individual cherub, tasked with spilling as much blood as thy scimitar can spill. Adventurer mode as these beings is a game of fun, a game of adventure. A game of rats and lice and the Black Death. A game of speared eyeballs and dripping guts and the smell of rotting gardenias. This guide is designed to help you brave this queer and treacherous world.
II. Beginning
The daemonic cherubim rarely abandon their allegiance to Armok, thus there are no outsiders to play as. There should only ever be one complete, unified entity to which they belong, so you won't be forced to make a choice. For weapon skills, you will be able to make the choice of a swordsman, who wields a scimitar, a spearman, who wields a trident, or a bowman, who wields a longbow. Choosing none of these automatically makes you a recruit with a trident.
It should be noted that the "knapper" skill is currently completely useless, and should be ignored entirely.
III. Beginning the Adventure
You will start your adventure in a halfling settlement, usually a small hamlet. You will immediately be told that you should ask these "friends" for advice. Do not listen to it! The halflings, as with all other creatures, have a deep-seated hatred for you and your brethren. Even entering on of these homes will likely get you stoned to death immediately. Instead, you should fly away immediately! Halflings, as a whole, should be approached with extreme caution at all points of your adventure, due to their numbers and their throwing rocks.
Interestingly, it appears as if you won't be declared an enemy of the state until either you or your foe make a true attack. This means that their livestock that will chase you across their fields on sight will not stop you from settling down until you attack them.
After you flee the town and make your way into the wilderness, you will probably take note of the following:
- You are clothed in a cloth tunic, skirt, thong, and boots.
- You have neither backpack nor waterskin; pay no mind to this, as all daemonic cherubim are eternally sustained by Armok. You'll never have to eat, sleep, or drink.
- You can fly with '<' and descend with '>.'
You will now find yourself without a definite goal; for this reason, I shall supply you with one. You should open up your map screen and locate the nearest fortress; this shall be your first target. Fortresses contain many things that a daemonic cherub would enjoy, such as guards and nobles to kill for reputation and experience, and equipment to aid in your quest.
Travelling to this site can be a quest in its own right, depending on the distance you must travel. In order for you to prepare for your siege, I would suggest that you avoid fast-travelling, and instead spend your entire time sneaking and killing the local wildlife. Do note that the arrows you will find in civilized areas will not fit the daemonic cherubim longbows. For this reason, the "archery" skill should be trained, primarily, by throwing rocks.
IV. The Siege
If you have, by this point, managed to kill or evade the wildlife and have made it to a fortress, it is time to begin your attack. It is most likely that the fortress is that of a formic civilization, as those made by the lizardfolk are less common. Thus, it should be noted that your ant-like enemy will not sleep, so laying siege at night will not benefit you extraordinarily. There are three major ways to besiege the fortress in question:
1. Evasion & Attack
The most basic means of attack: simply flying in and killing anyone in your way. The benefit of the daemonic cherubim is that they can fly over any foot-soldier that tries to stop you. Unfortunately, a single arrow can break your wing, sending you spiraling down onto the ground, to be flayed alive by your enemy. Remember: A flightless cherub is at the mercy of his enemies! Always make sure that you can fly away, or your adventure is over.
Another downside to this strategy is that, once you enter the tower, your ability of flight shall become much less useful. For this reason, and those mentioned above, it is advised that you not always choose this strategy, and should sometimes use one of the methods listed below.
2. Assasination
Note that you can sneak whilst flying. Sometimes it is best to simply grab some sand to throw at the guards in the towers and take them out one by one. This strategy requires more patience, but it is fairly safe.
To be concluded soon.
If anyone recognizes the reference in the introduction, I applaud you.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 07, 2013, 10:08:55 pm
-snip-
...Did Reemer add these? I was a little too busy to look through the thread for other contributions during my turn.
Edit to the Wiki: Information has been changed to 'other'. It still includes guides, but now also includes another category for contributions by other people/temporary storage for those who haven't gotten a category because they have yet to take their turn.
Post by: Gnorm on September 07, 2013, 11:02:20 pm
While that's a good start, and no reason not to refine it, I'd like to have a look at Gnorm's wiki too that he's been working on, and then I think we should decide rationally which wiki to concentrate on, since both are now functional. Having two will not work.Oh, what the heck!
http://dffd.wikia.com/wiki/DFFD_Wiki (http://dffd.wikia.com/wiki/DFFD_Wiki)
As you can see, the typo is that it there is a 'D' where an 'S' should be. Currently, there are creature pages, both with varying levels of completeness.
The comment about the war made me restore it.I hope that you realize that my comment was not intended to be belligerent.
Post by: Halfling on September 07, 2013, 11:07:34 pm
For comparison, WikiSpaces has a more attractive layout and has no ads. However, creating the wiki requires phone verification from somebody in the USA (apparently) to avoid spam. So I was unable to do that.
Sample site from googling: http://bpushistory.wikispaces.com
Sample image:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
PBWorks on the other hand would provide a clear layout, is free without ads for nonprofit use and also provides access controls. The downside is guests can't edit:
http://dfscratch.pbworks.com
Your thoughts? Obviously I didn't put in content yet.
Of the previous ones, I prefer Gnorm's look (colors and links on front page) but that's just me. Zanz' upper right navigation bar is good though.
Post by: Gnorm on September 07, 2013, 11:25:58 pm
Your thoughts?While I respect your opinion, I believe that the upside to wikia is that it provides a layout that most people are familiar with. The example you linked to would take a certain amount of navigation to get used to it; this might drive people away. Being that you're the leader of this thread, (at least, in my opinion) you should have the final say.
P.S. Your image link is broken.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 07, 2013, 11:33:57 pm
The comment about the war made me restore it.I hope that you realize that my comment was not intended to be belligerent.
Honestly, I thought it was a good idea.
After some thought and review of wiki farms, I'm not sure wikia is the best platform even though it's the most popular. The double bars of ads and even more ads embedded in the page are not too attractive.
For comparison, WikiSpaces has a more attractive layout and has no ads. However, creating the wiki requires phone verification from somebody in the USA (apparently) to avoid spam. So I was unable to do that.
Sample site from googling: http://bpushistory.wikispaces.com
Sample image:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
PBWorks on the other hand would provide a clear layout, is free without ads for nonprofit use and also provides access controls. The downside is guests can't edit:
http://dfscratch.pbworks.com
Your thoughts? Obviously I didn't put in content yet.
Going to wikispaces using the url: www.wikispaces.com shows that the site is intended for use by educational organizations. I don't think our wiki has a place there.
Pbworks...the interface seems a little strange, and, as Gnorm said, it could drive people away.
Of the previous ones, I prefer Gnorm's look (colors and links on front page) but that's just me. Zanz' upper right navigation bar is good though.
Well, I put mine up quickly. I was mainly working on the navigation bar (which I need to work on, since it can only get to Lost In Nowhere's turn with the current turn formatting).
Post by: Halfling on September 07, 2013, 11:54:37 pm
PBWorks is different looking and different software. The editing is actually easier because you can drag and drop files in; this would make adding raws a breeze. But the no guest editing feature and more desktop metaphor looks may make it a huge loser anyway, I agree.
@Zanz
Going to wikispaces using the url: www.wikispaces.com shows that the site is intended for use by educational organizations. I don't think our wiki has a place there.
Protip: click on "Not in education" ;D
https://www.wikispaces.com/content/frontpage
It's definitely free for this purpose.
If you want Mediawiki (similar to Wikia) specifically rather than an alternative wiki type, then the options are more limited. Basically you're stuck with ads.
There's the alternative choice of shoutwiki: http://fishhooks.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page http://ufo-wiki.shoutwiki.com/ http://war.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page http://educacionsecualenjovenes.shoutwiki.com/ which I think looks pretty good, and that's about all I can think of where you don't have to apply for a wiki or have it have some greater purpose.
I'd prefer it to be discussion rather than myself making the choice. I won't have time to admin the wiki anyway. :P
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 08, 2013, 12:09:14 am
If you want Mediawiki (similar to Wikia) specifically rather than an alternative wiki type, then the options are more limited. Basically you're stuck with ads.
Honestly, the ads aren't in the way that much. Granted, that one on the first page is an annoyance, but besides that, they are only at the top and bottom of the page, fairly easily ignored.
There's the alternative choice of shoutwiki: http://fishhooks.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page http://ufo-wiki.shoutwiki.com/ http://war.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page http://educacionsecualenjovenes.shoutwiki.com/ which I think looks pretty good, and that's about all I can think of where you don't have to apply for a wiki or have it have some greater purpose.
This seems to be a fairly good one. How are contributions handled?
Post by: Halfling on September 08, 2013, 12:39:27 am
If you want Mediawiki (similar to Wikia) specifically rather than an alternative wiki type, then the options are more limited. Basically you're stuck with ads.
Honestly, the ads aren't in the way that much. Granted, that one on the first page is an annoyance, but besides that, they are only at the top and bottom of the page, fairly easily ignored.There's the alternative choice of shoutwiki: http://fishhooks.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page http://ufo-wiki.shoutwiki.com/ http://war.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page http://educacionsecualenjovenes.shoutwiki.com/ which I think looks pretty good, and that's about all I can think of where you don't have to apply for a wiki or have it have some greater purpose.
This seems to be a fairly good one. How are contributions handled?
Anyone may edit (but pages may be protected too). Unsigned users' contributions are logged by IP. There's also a hierarchy of admins and mods.
Here's my sample. Thoughts?
http://dfscratch.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page
If it seems good, may as well add sample content to test it out further. Feel free to edit the main page too. Since it's mediawiki, I think you could easily even just loot stuff from other CC licensed pages :P
Post by: WillowLuman on September 08, 2013, 02:36:14 am
Well, Cuttlers seemed interesting, so here's a fanart of two cuttlers squabbling over a dead water grub in a forest:Nice! When I created them, I was thinking "What if cuttlefish filled the role of raccoons?" But those look cool. The pumpkin looks fineSpoiler (click to show/hide)
The one standing protectively over the dead grub is raising its front tentacles in a threat display to warn the foreign cuttler off. Stalk-eyes were a bit of creative license on my part, as when I hear "small land squid" I immediately think "squibbon" from the cartoon The Future is Wild. The weird spherical plant in the back behind the foreign cuttler is actually a pumpkin. I'm fairly certain pumpkin stalks do not normally look like that, but plugging that into Google Images was too much effort, so yeah :P
Post by: Halfling on September 08, 2013, 02:40:52 am
All wiki designers please see below image:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Pay attention to that array of buttons at the bottom. Sorry, I have to go this instant and don't have time to make it look better or add category samples. You can see the interactive design at: http://dfscratch.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page
The idea here is:
These links point to categories where you can add separate pages that users add to the wiki (eg: idea:myideaaboutwhales), by adding eg: [[CATEGORY:IDEAS-SUGGESTED]] at the idea page
You would then move between categories by editing that token.
Report bugs into category bugs - investigated or bugs - confirmed, then when fixed, move them to category bugs - fixed
Ideas - suggested would hold ideas like "Dear DFFS, how cool would it be to have a landwhale? That breathes fire? love petitchkaxoxox"
Ideas - recommended would be "Dear DFFS, how cool would it be to have a landwhale? That breathes fire? love petitchkaxoxox || I second this - StLeibowitz"
Ideas - implemented would be where you move it when you add it during your turn
Contributions would be the same, except with actual raws made by people who didn't take a turn.
I think this might actually really help coordinate the effort. Would be great if any wiki that we settle on has something similar or equivalent in function IMHO! Or what do you think?
Post by: Cain12 on September 08, 2013, 08:48:26 am
Spider-centaurs:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 08, 2013, 09:14:06 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 08, 2013, 12:49:25 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:NAUTILUS_SWAMP_HUGOL]
[DESCRIPTION:A small, skittish cephalopod protected by a thick shell. They feed on small fish and crustaceans in wetlands and estuaries.]
[NAME:swamp nautilus:swamp nautili:swamp nautilus]
[CASTE_NAME:swamp nautilus:swamp nautili:swamp nautilus]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:swamp nautilus larva:swamp nautilus larva]
[CREATURE_TILE:'n'][COLOR:4:0:1]
[PREFSTRING:shells]
[PREFSTRING:backwards motion]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:CEPHALOPOD]
[BODY:CEPHALOPOD_MANTLE_SHELL:CEPHALOPOD_FACE:CEPHALOPOD_8ARMS:CEPHALOPOD_BRAINS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_CHITIN_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_SHELL_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_LAYERS_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CEPHALOPOD_LAYERS_SHELL_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SOFT_EGG_MATS_HUGOL]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:CEPHALOPOD_ARM_LENGTH]
[NOBONES]
[NATURAL]
[LARGE_ROAMING][ALL_ACTIVE][MEANDERER]
[BIOME:ANY_TROPICAL_WETLAND][BIOME:SWAMP_MANGROVE][BIOME:ANY_POOL]
[FREQUENCY:30]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:200:2000]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:3:5]
[PET_EXOTIC][PETVALUE:50]
[AMPHIBIOUS]
[NATURAL_SKILL:WRESTLING:6]
[ATTACK:BITE:BODYPART:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:50]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:300]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:4000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:7000]
[CHILD:10] //Nautili are fairly long lived for cephalopods, and take a long time to mature.
[MAXAGE:20:30]
[HAS_NERVES][GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS][GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[SPEED:1300]
[SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:900]
[RETRACT_INTO_BP:BY_CATEGORY:TORSO:hide in <pro_pos> shell:hides in <pro_pos> shell:come out of <pro_pos> shell:comes out of <pro_pos> shell]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[LAYS_EGGS]
[EGG_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:EGGSHELL:SOLID]
[EGG_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:EGG:LIQUID]
[EGG_SIZE:10]
[CLUTCH_SIZE:25:40]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[SELECT_TISSUE:MUSCLE]
[TL_VASCULAR:2]
Post by: Halfling on September 08, 2013, 02:00:17 pm
Turns out I'm pretty bad at designing logos. Which do you like more?
Spoiler: "The token-vomit" (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: "The Lawnmower Dorf" (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: "the Scratch" (click to show/hide)
Feel free to post better ones too.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 08, 2013, 02:07:20 pm
Or from Zanzetkuken's wiki,Spoiler: "the Scratch" (click to show/hide)
I honestly don't know who added this. All I know is that it wasn't me.
Of all of those options, I think the Lawnmower Dorf looks the best.
Anyone else is free to make another shoutwiki. I don't think we'll have equally motivated people if I created it, I'm old news. :P
Since it doesn't have your name as its creator, other than in the history, I don't think this really matters.
Post by: Halfling on September 08, 2013, 02:43:44 pm
I added Zanzetkuken as a full administrator of the wiki, so I really hope that's you :D
Post by: Poldon on September 08, 2013, 04:06:08 pm
Formic ethics are based around what my view of what a hive of insects organized around a racial caste system would likely follow. Trespassing and theft aren't punished harshly if at all, since everything belongs to the Queen anyways (though stealing could be viewed as and punished as stealing from the Queen herself), while treason is utterly unthinkable. Oaths are similarly inviolable. Lying is unthinkable because of the aforementioned communal views on property ownership - information being property.
This all sounds pretty good, but I'm a bit confused as to why killing enemies is only allowed when specifically sanctioned and killing neutral parties is a personal matter that can happen at any time. I'd like to know your thought process behind that, so as to better understand it myself.
I would think that attacking neutrals being treated as a personal matter could lead to making enemies, and a single member making a faction the enemy of an entire hive-based civilization would seem very punishable to me.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 08, 2013, 04:10:07 pm
I added Zanzetkuken as a full administrator of the wiki, so I really hope that's you :D
It is me. Thank you for the promotion.
Post by: Gnorm on September 08, 2013, 04:23:36 pm
Post by: Xieg on September 08, 2013, 05:17:49 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I think I'm going to try Formics next.
Post by: Dragromblue on September 08, 2013, 05:51:17 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 08, 2013, 06:03:54 pm
This all sounds pretty good, but I'm a bit confused as to why killing enemies is only allowed when specifically sanctioned and killing neutral parties is a personal matter that can happen at any time. I'd like to know your thought process behind that, so as to better understand it myself.
I would think that attacking neutrals being treated as a personal matter could lead to making enemies, and a single member making a faction the enemy of an entire hive-based civilization would seem very punishable to me.
I was kind of thinking along the lines of the Ender's Game Formics on that matter, actually. The Formics in that book killed humans on first contact not out of malice, but because they didn't see them as individuals - just tools of a Queen. My Formics have similar thinking - workers are expendable, more or less, and nothing really to get worked up about if they happen to be killed and dismembered in the line of duty. Non-Formics are valued about as much, since there's no Queens to offend by killing them; if a halfling gets in the way of the Hive's business, said halfling will be killed, dismembered, and in all probability eaten by the obstructed Formic. While other races may not see this as "civilized" or "ethical" or even "sane", that's how they roll :)
The attacking-enemies-only-with-sanction is intended to reflect the caste system they have. They need direct command from superior castes to go to war in an official capacity, otherwise they'll just proceed normally with their lives, even if there's an invasion going on, so long as they don't fall under attack personally. Even then, the worker caste really isn't all that bright, and a Formic worker would flee a halfling raid despite its impressive size advantage unless specifically ordered by a Soldier, Drone, or Queen.
@Xieg: Did you have the moth cornered in melee combat? They're supposed to run away very quickly when confronted, so if they aren't using combat as a last resort that may warrant a bugfix. And good to know the reaver ants are working well :D
Post by: Vgray on September 08, 2013, 07:00:11 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on September 08, 2013, 07:06:07 pm
What does [EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER] affect anyway?
EAT_SAPIENT_KILL determines whether or not a civilization will eat sentients they kill.
EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER is for whether they will eat sentients they come across that are already dead.
I'm not sure if the game can make that distinction yet outside of world-gen, though. Never played a cannibalistic race before. I know it doesn't work in Adventure Mode, but that's because the game is hard-coded to not let you eat sentients unless you are starving.
Post by: Vgray on September 08, 2013, 07:12:13 pm
I like how 2/3 of the playable races have no problem eating sentients.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 08, 2013, 07:44:54 pm
I wish there was an "INDIFFERENT" tag for ethics, as it doesn't make sense for a race that cannot eat to have strong feelings about it.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 08, 2013, 07:50:31 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 08, 2013, 07:52:45 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 08, 2013, 08:02:57 pm
Anything in particular I should watch out for?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 08, 2013, 08:06:37 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 08, 2013, 08:12:08 pm
Is it intentional that you can play as a Spider-Centaur in adventure mode?
Post by: Aseaheru on September 08, 2013, 08:12:47 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 08, 2013, 08:24:26 pm
I am currently playing a Formic bow....Fromic?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 08, 2013, 10:42:13 pm
For my incorporeal mental civ, should they be physically indestructible, or should they be gaseous and thus destroyable in physical combat?
Post by: kopout on September 08, 2013, 11:17:52 pm
I just downloaded this.tarnish stalks
Anything in particular I should watch out for?
Post by: Orange Wizard on September 09, 2013, 12:14:56 am
I have a balance questionIndestructible. It should balance out the wildlife.
For my incorporeal mental civ, should they be physically indestructible, or should they be gaseous and thus destroyable in physical combat?
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 12:17:28 am
Halflings don't have quivers, is that a bug?
And one last note about the grass...why is it moving? It looks terrible.
Post by: Halfling on September 09, 2013, 12:35:05 am
Regarding the wiki, I must say that the design you have chosen seems to be based less on providing information about the game, as I had intended mine to be, and more on reporting bugs and modding idea, which is the purpose that this thread has been serving. Nevertheless, the selection of website and layout seem to be popular, I'll drop the discussion.
Mm... Please make it more player-oriented if you like.
I added Zanzetkuken as a full administrator of the wiki, so I really hope that's you :D
It is me. Thank you for the promotion.
The way I see it, I actually semi-accidentally demoted you and Gnorm. I would like for you to admin the wiki as it was your idea. Please also make Gnorm an admin if he decides to register.
Also, if it doesn't get used (because it would have been cooler to start from your templates), then we'll revert to your pages which had more content. However, since I may not have good quality internet the coming week due to a uni. rotation, I'm adding this wiki to the first page now as I might be unable to easily do it later.
Miscellaneous replies:
- Halflings having two right elbows is a bug that I thought I fixed but apparently didn't. The left elbow is incorrectly described as a right elbow in text.
- Xieg's report added. Thanks for sharing it :)
- mocman, how's it looking?
- Lumberyard works automatically.
- Mamaphints, yeah... they will be able to become anything that's not a position limited to a caste. Not much we can do about that so long as they're intelligent, I think.
- "Cloth cloth" is intentional because it makes its other uses less ambiguous, but seems to be confusing people so maybe should be fixed.
- Halflings should have quivers (unless something crazy has happened; they're hard-coded), but the hunters whom you get as immigrants don't bring any equipment. This is because their choice of profession is from the innate halfling skillset rather than history, I assume. Quivers must be made out of leather as in vanilla.
Post by: Cain12 on September 09, 2013, 01:48:35 am
I just downloaded this.Don't fast travel if you can help it, spider-centaurs are fair enough but daemonic cherubim ambushes are a death sentence, if it is still at full speed and next to you with its friends not far behind it then you are dead already. Also, Panserblekks. That may just be my bad luck though.
Anything in particular I should watch out for?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 02:09:36 am
EDIT: Seriously, I didn't get the chance to test them much.
Post by: Halfling on September 09, 2013, 04:42:29 am
About the Wikis still, preparing for a week possibly without much Internet...
What is going to matter is contribution more than design. So I've decided to put all three in the first post. Whichever gets seeded properly with content in a reasonable amount of time "wins" and the rest are eliminated (from the post) to reduce duplicated effort.
I'm putting them in as
Quote
Wiki projects (work in progress - please contribute):Whichever wiki gets the most contribution will be officially recommended later.
Wiki Admins http://dfscratch.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page Zanzetkuken, Gnorm http://df-from-scratch.wikia.com/wiki/DF_from_Scratch_Wiki Zanzetkuken http://dffd.wikia.com/wiki/DFFD_Wiki Gnorm
I'm giving you free reign to make them work if that wasn't obvious (the Wiki initiative wasn't mine to begin with). Edit the main page, navigation, categories etc. as you think is best. Add more admins if you need too.
In response to Gnorm's comment above about the Shoutwiki being more dev-focused, well, I feel like this thread is not doing that good of a job of collecting contributions and bug reports. Sure they're here, but when you need to go back to one to actually implement it, figure out if it was added, or look at it for reference or to re-implement it, your choices are to either try to guesstimate which page it is on and browse (a royal pain) or try to remember the exact words of the report for a search (very inconvenient). Having tried that first hand I believe that's a major reason why suggestions and bug reports don't make it to the raws as fast or often as they should. Not good at all.
So I think it would be really good to have that modding interface somewhere and have information for people on how to use it. Tuck it in an easily accessible "modding portal" if it's intimidating.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 09, 2013, 08:14:43 am
I just downloaded this.
Anything in particular I should watch out for?
Everything that moves. Even some of the things that don't, in the case of tarnish stalks, but especially watch out for the swarming insects like vespulae. Do vermin bite adventurers? If they do, watch out for mosquitoe swarms in savage swamps, too. This is not a world conducive to peaceful frolicking in the wilderness.
Is it just me, or do Spider-Centaurs have a low tolerance for pain?
Everything has a low tolerance for pain if you inflict enough of it :) And I'd say, playing as an archer, you are likely inflicting a lot of it. Having a two-foot-long shaft of metal forcibly embedded in an internal organ isn't something you should realistically be able to shrug off, unless you're Boromir (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc6aciIhO6c), and even he could really only take two before being incapacitated.
The Lumberyard won't work, it wants "apple tree plant logs", I already have apple wood logs for some reason. Golden Mamaphints are still are called "Goldan Mamaphints", I had the option of bringing coal gems on embark, and all cloth is called "cloth cloth".
Halflings don't have quivers, is that a bug?
And one last note about the grass...why is it moving? It looks terrible.
Cloth is cloth cloth due to some quirks of how we named materials. Halflings do have quivers, or at least they did when I checked; where were you trying to find a quiver for them?
And lastly, tall grass is moving and wavy because tall grass blows in the wind. I think it looks better than boring stubby grass that just sits there like a fine dusting of commas and periods. Different tastes :)
Post by: Cain12 on September 09, 2013, 10:35:38 am
What about Panserblekks?Just to be wary of them, Lost every adventure that dared to fight one so far.
EDIT: Seriously, I didn't get the chance to test them much.
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 12:08:24 pm
Two things I noticed on embark.
You can't embark with quivers.
You can't give your Halflings any skill in Fish Cleaning.
Not that fishing is viable with those damn river squids around...my fisher won't go near them.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 12:23:38 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 12:29:16 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 12:31:07 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 09, 2013, 02:22:29 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 02:24:27 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 02:28:31 pm
They haven't struck back at my meanie Halflings yet though.
Post by: kopout on September 09, 2013, 03:30:47 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 03:33:06 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 09, 2013, 03:44:43 pm
Mamaphint bugs added to http://dfscratch.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Category:Bugs-Investigating , with fixes. Via cell phone. Ugh...
These aren't really new issues except the politics. I hope having them there might get the fixes in some day - please look there occasionally. Can't post exact raw code changes there because no computer internet.
Also, anyone else, feel free to add your pet peeves there too (and suggestions in the similar category). I plan to ask people finishing their turn/saying they're out of ideas to have a look at these.
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 03:49:57 pm
The big kind. With a keep and everything. The only sign of life was the keep itself. It had the usual guards and priest with a funny name.
They don't build tombs or have a proper leader though.
Post by: kero42 on September 09, 2013, 04:11:08 pm
Halflings throw rocks at things that scare them. The A.I. is afraid of almost everything (not a bad Idea in this mod :P). Therefore Halflings attempt to stone all the wild life. I've had them snipe river squids from the bank before. They attack any thing that isn't live stock or a member of a friendly civ, its like they are aggressively pastoral, remaking the world into a facsimile of the English country side at all costs.
From your description of the halfling aggression, I couldn't help but think of the shadowmoor version of kithkin, particularly http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=158695 (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=158695) and http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=158690 (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=158690), though I imagine they're more like the nicer Lorwyn kithkin when not throwing rocks.
For some reason I imagine halflings as diplomatic, acquiescent, yet crafty and best-not-messed-with in good mood (think villagers who trick bandits into leaving their town un-pillaged, perhaps by making it seem abandoned or haunted or other somewhat peaceful scare tactics) , while being mildly paranoid, reclusive, and territorial as their mood decreases until they go mad and try to kill anyone who looks at them funny (think villagers who in response to being raided put up walls and traps and execute strangers who wander nearby). I suppose it depends on the personality of their mayor. At least thats how I would try to roleplay the slow descent of any halfling fort playtest I may do in the future.
Post by: Cain12 on September 09, 2013, 04:58:27 pm
For some reason I imagine halflings as diplomatic, acquiescent, yet crafty and best-not-messed-with in good mood, while being paranoid, reclusive, and territorial as their mood decreases until they go mad and try to kill anyone who looks at them funny. At least that's how I would try to roleplay the slow descent of any halfling fort playtest I may do in the future.I kinda get the image of a simple folk with no walls (except for the rich who have their land walled up), small huts for families with fields outside that everyone tended to. A peaceful lot, they drink despite not being able to handle it in their local tavern during festivals, the kind that with no real ambition expect for the rare halfling that wanted more from his life than comfort and community. The kind of home that gets razed not far into the beginning of a heroes quest due to their lack of real defenses against the spider-centaur invaders. But that is just me projecting the peaceful race I wish to play sometimes that never felt right with dwarfs.
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 05:05:11 pm
Post by: Cain12 on September 09, 2013, 05:43:36 pm
Why do Formics drink booze anyway?I figured it was an efficiency thing, if rivers freeze or they have nothing else, tarnish stalk booze is cheap and easy enough to make, that its worth puking for a season or two to sustain the colony/hive.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 09, 2013, 06:26:31 pm
Also, the idea of Halflings as an aggressively pastoral hegemonizing swarm, stoning to death the invertebrate ecology and replacing it with ducks and hounds wherever they go, amuses me greatly :D
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 06:54:06 pm
Nearly done with my Civ...
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 07:27:14 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 09, 2013, 07:32:53 pm
Added a few pages on bugs onto Best Wiki (http://dfscratch.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page), just an FYI. It's best wiki because it most resembles the official wiki for DF and it has fewest ads.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 09, 2013, 07:34:38 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 09, 2013, 07:42:05 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 09, 2013, 07:46:46 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 08:30:56 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 08:32:03 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 08:34:40 pm
Post by: Kazimuth on September 09, 2013, 08:34:48 pm
There's a giant herd of panserblekk at the south end of the map- luckily my hobbits haven't engaged them yet, but they seem to be getting closer. (Note: in their description, 'cephalopod' is misspelt as 'ceolapod' or something, so we should fix that.) Also, the river squid are scaring the fishermen half to death, and they keep complaining about the lack of things to catch, which may or may not be a bug?
I like this settlement... might write it up if I have enough energy in the next few days. Can't wait to start growing tea.
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 08:38:58 pm
Post by: kopout on September 09, 2013, 08:41:05 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 08:45:19 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 08:57:53 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 09:01:34 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 09, 2013, 09:03:44 pm
Post by: kopout on September 09, 2013, 09:05:07 pm
And can river squid survive on land? I'm curious now.raws say they are stuck in the river
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 09:18:40 pm
There is also something called a nothing egg that repeats several times.
Is the mayor supposed to be in charge of the militia?
Two more river squid down for the count. Those Halfling rocks are lethal.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 09, 2013, 09:54:01 pm
The dragon eggs repeat so much because ZTG's dragons have many different castes of both genders, and thus multiple egg definitions due to many female castes.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 09, 2013, 09:56:37 pm
Well, the mayor does have [MILITARY_GOALS], but that might be unintentional.
The dragon eggs repeat so much because ZTG's dragons have many different castes of both genders, and thus multiple egg definitions due to many female castes.
8 female castes per race, 17 races.
Post by: Halfling on September 09, 2013, 09:59:31 pm
If you wanted to make alcohol addictive, but only if you drink it, you could modify my disease mod diseases (really, repeating self-targeting syndrome interactions) so that alcohol both causes a chronic condition and treats its symptoms :P
Post by: Vgray on September 09, 2013, 10:07:57 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on September 09, 2013, 10:21:36 pm
I'm still on phone only. Someone else mind figuring out which two places have the same tissue?
This is affecting gameplay, so reemer, as you maintain Current, when the cause is out, could you update with the fix?
The tree issue was specifically fixed earlier (edit: now that I think, not actually sure if fix made it to official raws, but I posted it myself and it was confirmed...). I don't know what exactly happened, with the duplicates around, but just gonna say, patch before you upload your turn, all, or we have to do stuff again and again. Seriously.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 10, 2013, 12:26:27 am
Here's the raws so far. Ignore any errors about body parts not having tissue thickness, as they're not supposed to:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:PSIONIC_HUGOL]
[NAME:psionic:psionics:psionic]
[CREATURE_TILE:143][COLOR:0:0:1]
[PREFSTRING:eeriness]
[PREFSTRING:power]
[CREATURE_CLASS:INCORPOREAL][CREATURE_CLASS:PSIONIC]
[BODY:FLOATING_ROBE_HUGOL:TELEKINESIS_3_HUGOL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:PSI_PLAN_HUGOL]
[INTELLIGENT][CANOPENDOORS][CANNOT_UNDEAD]
[NATURAL_SKILL:THROW:6][NATURAL_SKILL:CONCENTRATION:8][NATURAL_SKILL:SITUATIONAL_AWARENESS:6]
[SWIMS_INNATE]
[NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT][EXTRAVISION]
[NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT]
[NO_DIZZINESS]
[NO_EAT][NO_DRINK][NO_SLEEP]
[NO_FEVERS]
[NO_PHYS_ATT_GAIN][NO_PHYS_ATT_RUST]
[NOBONES][NOMEAT][NOSKIN][PARALYZEIMMUNE]
[NOBREATHE][NOEXERT][NONAUSEA][NOPAIN][NOSTUN][NOSTUCKINS]
[SUPERNATURAL][POWER][SPHERE:WISDOM]
[SPHERE:ORDER][SPHERE:SCHOLARSHIP][SPHERE:LONGEVITY]
[PROFESSION_NAME:WRESTLER:missionary][PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_WRESTLER:missionary][PROFESSION_NAME:RECRUIT:missionary][PROFESSION_NAME:STANDARD:monk]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:65000]
CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PSI_HOLD_HUGOL
CDI:ADV_NAME:Bind
CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK
CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT
CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:15
CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1
CDI:VERB:will their motion to cease:wills motion to cease
CDI:TARGET_VERB:are held completely motionless:is held completely motionless
CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100
[SELECT_MATERIAL:FABRIC]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:fabric]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:0:0:1]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL:BLACK]
[CASTE:NORMAL]
[CASTE_NAME:adherent of the mind:adherents:adherent]
[DESCRIPTION:A being of pure thought, its presence marked only by a robe. They are people who have exchanged their bodies for immense mental powers]
[POP_RATIO:100]
[CASTE:MASTER]
[CASTE_NAME:Gifted adherent:Gifted adherents:Gifted]
[DESCRIPTION:A being of pure thought, its presence marked only by a robe. They are people who have exchanged their bodies for immense mental powers. Some minds posess natural talent that makes them extremely potent.]
[POP_RATIO:1]
[FLIER]
// [SELECT_CASTE:NORMAL]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PSI_BRAINATTACK_HUGOL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Brain stab]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:CAN_BE_MUTUAL]
[CDI:VERB:overloads the organic mind:overloads the organic mind:overload each others' minds]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:bleed from the mind:bleeds from the brain]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:50]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PSI_KO_HUGOL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Render unconscious]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:CAN_BE_MUTUAL]
[CDI:VERB:jostle the mind:jostles the mind:jostle each others' minds]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:fall unconscious:falls unconscious]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]
// [SELECT_CASTE:MASTER]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Psychokinetic Storm]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:MIND:UNDIRECTED_DUST]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:VERB:unleash a wave of pure force:unleashes a wave of pure force:unleash waves of pure force]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:500]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Psychokinetic Shove]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:MIND:TRAILING_DUST_FLOW]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:VERB:will all matter before you shoved aside:wills all matter in front shoved aside:unleash waves of pure force]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:200]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PSI_BRAINATTACK_HUGOL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Brain stab]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:5]
[CDI:CAN_BE_MUTUAL]
[CDI:VERB:overloads the organic mind:overloads the organic mind:overload each others' minds]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:bleed from the mind:bleeds from the brain]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:50]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PSI_KO_HUGOL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Render unconscious]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:3]
[CDI:CAN_BE_MUTUAL]
[CDI:VERB:jostle the mind:jostles the mind:jostle each others' minds]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:fall unconscious:falls unconscious]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]
// [SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PSI_SLOW_HUGOL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Slow]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:VERB:will against their motion:pushes against motion with will:lock wills, opposing each others' motions]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:can barely move against the opposing force:can barely move against the opposing force]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PSI_FRENZY_HUGOL]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Frenzy]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:8]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:VERB:amplify rage:amplifies rage:amplify rage]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:must kill everything:goes into a berserk frenzy]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:900]Code: [Select]
[ENTITY:MONASTIC_HUGOL]
[ADVENTURE_TIER:5]
[FRIENDLY_COLOR:0:7:0]
[CREATURE:PSIONIC_HUGOL]
[SCOUT][WANDERER]
[STONE_PREF]
[GEM_PREF]
[INVADERS_IGNORE_NEUTRALS]
[BABYSNATCHER]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CAST_CRUDE_ANVIL_HLG] ## allows wood-using race to make the first anvil even in a world with no anvil-grade metals
[PERMITTED_REACTION:IRIDIUM_MAKING_STAGE1_LKR]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:IRIDIUM_MAKING_STAGE2_LKR]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_WHEELBARROW]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_HIVE]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_HONEYCOMB]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_NEST_BOX]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_JUG]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:WAR:NAME_WAR]
[SUBSELECT_SYMBOL:WAR:VIOLENT]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:BATTLE:NAME_BATTLE]
[SUBSELECT_SYMBOL:BATTLE:VIOLENT]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:SIEGE:NAME_SIEGE]
[SUBSELECT_SYMBOL:SIEGE:VIOLENT]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:ROAD:NAME_ROAD]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:TUNNEL:NAME_TUNNEL]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:BRIDGE:NAME_BRIDGE]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:WALL:NAME_WALL]
[SELECT_SYMBOL:REMAINING:THOUGHT]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:DOMESTIC]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:SUBORDINATE]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:EVIL]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:NEGATIVE]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:UGLY]
[CULL_SYMBOL:ALL:NEGATOR]
[OUTDOOR_WOOD]
[INDOOR_WOOD]
[USE_GOOD_PLANTS]
[USE_GOOD_WOOD]
[USE_EVIL_PLANTS]
[USE_EVIL_WOOD]
[OUTDOOR_FARMING]
[INDOOR_FARMING]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PACK]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_MOUNT]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PET]
[DEFAULT_SITE_TYPE:CITY]
LIKES_SITE:FORTRESS
[LIKES_SITE:CITY]
[LIKES_SITE:CAVE]
[LIKES_SITE:CAVE_DETAILED]
[START_BIOME:ANY_LAND]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_LAND:12]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:SPRING]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:SUMMER]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:AUTUMN]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:WINTER]
[START_GROUP_NUMBER:20000]
[MAX_STARTING_CIV_NUMBER:10]
[MAX_POP_NUMBER:100000]
[MAX_SITE_POP_NUMBER:200]
[RELIGION:PANTHEON]
[SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:SCHOLARSHIP:512]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:SCHOLARSHIP]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:WISDOM]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:TRUTH]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DISCIPLINE]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:DREAMS]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLERK]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRADER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ARCHITECT]
[WORLD_CONSTRUCTION:ROAD]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:JUSTIFIED_IF_EXTREME_REASON]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TREASON:NOT_APPLICABLE]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:LYING:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:NOT_APPLICABLE]
[ETHIC:THEFT:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:NOT_APPLICABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:NOT_APPLICABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:UNTHINKABLE]
[POSITION:ABBOT]
[NAME:Abbot:Abbots]
[SITE]
[NUMBER:1]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MEET_WORKERS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_GOALS]
[RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY]
[RESPONSIBILITY:RELIGION]
[RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_MAKING][RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_ENFORCEMENT]
[SQUAD:10:adept:adepts]
[ELECTED]
[PRECEDENCE:20]
[FLASHES]
[BRAG_ON_KILL]
[DO_NOT_CULL]
[KILL_QUEST]
[COLOR:5:0:0]Code: [Select]
[INTERACTION:PSI_SLOW_HUGOL]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_CANNOT_TARGET_IF_ALREADY_AFFECTED]
[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:animate object]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Slowed]
[CE_SPEED_CHANGE:SPEED_PERC:1:SPEED_ADD:50000:START:0:END:1000]
[CE_SKILL_ROLL_ADJUST:PERC:20:PERC_ON:100:START:0:END:1000]
[INTERACTION:PSI_BRAINATTACK_HUGOL]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_FORBIDDEN:NOTHOUGHT]
[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:living being]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Cerebral hemorrhage]
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:1000:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:ALL:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:1000]
[CE_BLEEDING:SEV:10000:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:ALL:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:1000]//I count treelords as living minds. Still doesn't phase them much.
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:10000:PROB:1:BP:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:ALL:RESISTABLE:START:0]//Chance to be instantly lethal, but thankfully low
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:10000:PROB:1:BP:BY_CATEGORY:TRUNK:ALL:RESISTABLE:START:0]
[CE_PAIN:SEV:1000:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:ALL:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:200]
[CE_DIZZINESS:SEV:1000:PROB:50:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:300]
[CE_NAUSEA:SEV:1000:PROB:40:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:300]
[INTERACTION:PSI_HOLD_HUGOL]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_CANNOT_TARGET_IF_ALREADY_AFFECTED]
[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:animate object]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Bound]
[CE_REMOVE_TAG:PARALYZEIMMUNE:START:0:END:100]
[CE_ADD_TAG:NOBREATHE:START:0:END:100]
[CE_PARALYSIS:SEV:10000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:100]
[INTERACTION:PSI_KO_HUGOL]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_FORBIDDEN:NOTHOUGHT]
[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:conscious being]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Mental blank]
[CE_REMOVE_TAG:NOSTUN:START:0:END:300]
[CE_UNCONSCIOUSNESS:SEV:1000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:300]
[INTERACTION:PSI_FRENZY_HUGOL]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_CANNOT_TARGET_IF_ALREADY_AFFECTED]
[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:conscious being]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Frenzied]
[CE_ADD_TAG:CRAZED:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:1000]
[INTERACTION:PSI_SECRET]
[I_SOURCE:SECRET]
[IS_NAME:the secrets of bending the world with will]
[IS_SPHERE:SCHOLARSHIP]
[IS_SECRET:SUPERNATURAL_LEARNING_POSSIBLE]
[IS_SECRET:MUNDANE_TEACHING_POSSIBLE]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_REQUIRES:CAN_LEARN]
[IT_REQUIRES:CAN_SPEAK]
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[IE_ARENA_NAME:Psionic]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:Psionic]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:PSIONIC_HUGOL:MASTER]
[CE_DISPLAY_NAME:NAME:convert:converts:convert:START:0]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:START:0]
[CE:CREATURE:PSIONIC_HUGOL:NORMAL]
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 10, 2013, 05:12:21 am
Ignore any errors about body parts not having tissue thickness, as they're not supposed to
Bad bad bad bad bad idea. We have enough difficulty solving errors in a timely manner without throwing bugs-that-are-signs-of-intended-features-working thrown onto the pile. I would suggest finding a new manner of imitating incorporeality, to avoid spamming the errorlog, unless these folk have dirt-simple bodies.
Post by: Halfling on September 10, 2013, 05:34:09 am
But seriously, the dupes.
Post by: kopout on September 10, 2013, 09:23:26 am
[TISSUE_SHAPE:FEATHERS]
should make most attacks pass through.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 10, 2013, 12:26:47 pm
But I know what the issue is there, which is why I asked you to ignore it just for now. What I don't get is why the other bugs.
But seriously, the dupes.
We need to test a fresh build, see if the problem is with a clean download or if vgray just unzipped improperly. The error log he's posted contains repeats, though, it's just this repeating:
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/item_gnorm.txt"
THONG_GNORM:Unrecognized Item Token: LAYER_UNDER
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/b_detail_plan_gnorm.txt"
CORE_TISSUES_GNORM: ADD_TISSUE needs 2 tokens: FEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG:
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature DAEMONIC_CHERUB
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right wing, layer 4: Tissue FEATHER was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left wing, layer 4: Tissue FEATHER was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right wing, layer 4: Tissue FEATHER was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left wing, layer 4: Tissue FEATHER was not found, using first tissue instead
Cannot generate random creatures -- missing body gloss RCP_GLOSS_PAW
Duplicate Object: tissue_template NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_HLG
Duplicate Object: tissue_template TOOTH_TEMPLATE_HLGEDIT: A quick search of a freshly downloaded objects folder confirms that gnorm's tissue template contains duplicates of 2 of Halfling's tissues.
Post by: Vgray on September 10, 2013, 12:48:18 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 10, 2013, 01:00:36 pm
-Thongs
-Feathers in Gnorm's BDP
-Duped teeth and nerves.
All we have to do for the dupes is replace "HLG" with "Gnorm"
Post by: Halfling on September 10, 2013, 01:20:06 pm
You might just as well remove the duplicates. If the creatures reference them with the appended _HLG they'll have no problem accessing them from my files.
The issue with thongs is the correct form is [LAYER:UNDER], not [LAYER_UNDER]. This
"CORE_TISSUES_GNORM: ADD_TISSUE needs 2 tokens: FEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG:"
may fix all the feather bugs once adding the tissue is done right.
Post by: reemer30 on September 10, 2013, 06:55:37 pm
Uploaded version with the original errors fixed, as I cannot locate a misspelling or anything similar in the body raws.
Post by: Gnorm on September 10, 2013, 09:37:22 pm
Post by: kopout on September 10, 2013, 09:47:13 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Ombragon on September 11, 2013, 12:40:56 pm
I have a new bunches of ideas !!
A drunian-man civilization
A dragonbee (crossbreed between a bee and a dragonfly) a cave vermin who can be pressed for honey-like juice
Ash-based plant for the fourth layer (cinderbulb, ashbush, blackthorn)
Oh yeah and maybe some useful colony ? (like cactus-farming-desert-ant or honey producing mice ?)
And finally large fishes like shark-guppy or giant salamanderfish
Post by: WillowLuman on September 11, 2013, 01:46:05 pm
Post by: kopout on September 11, 2013, 01:50:31 pm
Great! Except there is no fourth layer or any Drunians.the 4th layer is the magma sea, I don't think you can put plants there though
Post by: Ombragon on September 11, 2013, 01:51:48 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 11, 2013, 01:54:48 pm
1. I pm'd him (but he hasn't been here for days)
2. 48 hours for him to show up, then it's skipsville
3. I'm thinking we could extend turns to 2 weeks since people seem to have about half the time now. Good/bad idea?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 11, 2013, 02:37:07 pm
If you break into the magma sea all the plant will be released and start to populate your caverns
Unless they didn't spawn there in the first place, which they didn't. Needs testing.
I support 2-week modding turns.
Post by: kopout on September 11, 2013, 02:47:55 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 11, 2013, 04:18:10 pm
Post by: Poldon on September 11, 2013, 05:21:09 pm
Hey Halfling, you still working on those Zerg-like creatures?
Yeah, those would be awesome to see. They'll function very differently from the Formics, too, so it wouldn't be too redundant to include them.
Also for some reason I'm now imagining TLO, Scarlett or Jaedong playing DF. Think about the APM one could achieve in unpaused DF! *is totally derailing, sorry will stop*
Post by: Vgray on September 11, 2013, 06:45:18 pm
By "people" I mean Spider-Centaurs. Wresting with your mandibles and using "shake" is very effective.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 11, 2013, 06:47:09 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 11, 2013, 08:48:22 pm
Additionally, formic soldiers are purpose-bred killing machines that (I think) outmass spider-centaurs, are covered in natural armor, can enter martial trances, and in general are designed for the express purpose of messing other things up. Against a halfling, a spider-centaur - particularly a Brute - is dangerous; against a Formic soldier, a spider-centaur brute would have difficulty. It's like putting a Sherman Tank up against a Greek Phalanx, matching a soldier against a spiderling.
So, short answer: nope, not ridiculous at all :D They're pretty balanced from what I've seen in my trials - six soldiers versus a reaver ant swarm ended with a reaver victory, and trying to gnaw the face off a bandit moth is highly inadvisable at best. Spiderlings are squishy softskins over half their body, so some lack of durability is to be expected.
Post by: Vgray on September 11, 2013, 09:26:24 pm
If you don't get a breeding pair as part of your starting seven, do migrant waves offset the low lifespan of your Fromics?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 11, 2013, 09:52:29 pm
Well, they are intended for ranged combat, like halflings. Keep in mind they're not humans+giant spiders, they're halflings plus giant spiders, minus the intelligence needed to weaponize pebbles and plus a vicious streak that would make a goblin cringe.'
Additionally, formic soldiers are purpose-bred killing machines that (I think) outmass spider-centaurs, are covered in natural armor, can enter martial trances, and in general are designed for the express purpose of messing other things up. Against a halfling, a spider-centaur - particularly a Brute - is dangerous; against a Formic soldier, a spider-centaur brute would have difficulty. It's like putting a Sherman Tank up against a Greek Phalanx, matching a soldier against a spiderling.
So, short answer: nope, not ridiculous at all :D They're pretty balanced from what I've seen in my trials - six soldiers versus a reaver ant swarm ended with a reaver victory, and trying to gnaw the face off a bandit moth is highly inadvisable at best. Spiderlings are squishy softskins over half their body, so some lack of durability is to be expected.
Hey, I'm not complaining. It's a good thing to have the most hostile race be relatively mortal.
Post by: Halfling on September 11, 2013, 10:11:59 pm
Hey Halfling, you still working on those Zerg-like creatures?
Not at this time. I'm not consciously working on anything except studies and some other real life things.
If someone wants to take over their development, pm me. I'll share all findings. Else they'll come eventually, or not. I agree they would be cool to have finished.
Post by: Cain12 on September 12, 2013, 11:08:56 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 12, 2013, 04:47:09 pm
So, summary, then main content list, and then maybe a list of other notable contributions (ideas eventually implemented, that sort of thing).
Post by: WillowLuman on September 12, 2013, 06:07:11 pm
Post by: kopout on September 12, 2013, 06:53:47 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 12, 2013, 06:54:38 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 12, 2013, 07:13:49 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 12, 2013, 07:49:41 pm
Who's got all the files right now?
Post by: Vgray on September 12, 2013, 08:25:22 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 12, 2013, 09:18:40 pm
Post by: Xieg on September 12, 2013, 09:36:04 pm
On thing of note, traders arrived towards the end of my last session and exploded in the depot. The only thing I noticed in the early stages burning were panserblekk leather boots.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 12, 2013, 10:04:05 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 12, 2013, 11:22:46 pm
That shouldn't work...
Code: [Select]
[BODY_SIZE:40000]...that's weird
EDIT: There's a lack of secrets, curses and hiveable creatures. I think I should work on those.
EDIT 2: Some books you can find on my third secret:
Code: [Select]
Appellations of the Divine
The Sobriquets of Creation
The Instruments of Actuality
Denotations of Comportment
Symbols of MienAnd the raw token:
Code: [Select]
[INTERACTION:SECRET_METAPHYSICAL_PUTNAM]It's open-ended as hell; I have an idea, but I'd rather it come up naturally as DFFS continues with other's ideas, get a nice big mythology going. It's fun that way, and makes for some interesting stuff.
Spoiler: my idea (click to show/hide)
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 13, 2013, 04:14:11 am
Post by: Putnam on September 13, 2013, 04:37:56 am
Sounds like a mashup of the Platonic Ideals and the Tao becoming yin/yang which in turn becomes the five major elements (and twenty minor ones)
Spoiler: how I came up with this (click to show/hide)
I really like this mythology-writing jazz, so I may come up with a sort of creation myth that also explains worldgen and such.
Post by: Halfling on September 13, 2013, 04:44:34 am
Remember there's vampires and paladins already though. Being a paladin is meant to protect you from turning into something else such as a night creature, a "purist" mode like mutation resistance. Personally love the option to stay without strange, even useful alterations easily - Would be great if that stays working. You can add backstory to and tweak those as you see fit too, however.
I see no reason to not add creature classes, since that doesn't change the actual creature. Can probably just assume permission for those absent no*w (edit: damn phone)
Post by: Putnam on September 13, 2013, 05:02:34 am
Spoiler: Mythology of Our World (click to show/hide)
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 13, 2013, 05:21:55 am
Post by: Ombragon on September 13, 2013, 09:50:50 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And the "juice" material
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
and yeah they aren't hiveable, just pressable (a reward for surviving the caves)
and I don't think cheese mice are a good idea, I think I need better critter, like I don't know... valuable juice producing worms/wasp/lizard ?
Post by: Vgray on September 13, 2013, 12:02:44 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 13, 2013, 12:23:09 pm
Likely swamps, since that's where the last modding turn was focused.
If you are refering to mine, due to lack of time I was unable to create even 1/4 of what I wanted to do. A week earlier, and I would have been able to.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 01:39:54 pm
Speaking of which, I'll be uploading the updates to my stuff soon. If the 8 error lines is too much, I will not include my Adherents of the Mind.
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 13, 2013, 02:02:43 pm
When you look at it, it really just comes down to authority over form and inspiration being the measures of relative Divine Power.
The in-game Gods, however, where would they be classified? How about the Titans and FB's?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 02:27:10 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 13, 2013, 02:36:58 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
but that's a much nicer spin on things.
If we're to be gods in this myth, which is fun :P, I'm a bit opposed, on a personal level, to "Greater" and "Lesser" creators because I feel that puts more merit on the other, while to it me it seems that this project will absolutely die if there's no players and no stories, and nobody will want to mod if there's no buzz and no interest and no fantasy, so anyone who submits good stories should definitely be on equal terms with anybody who has modded a few creatures...
I would easier see these in theological terms in relation to the world as both are transcendent (from outside the world), some are emanant, "outsiders" (the world is created from them, but they do not dwell in it) vs. some are immanent, "insiders" (the ones who dwell and are involved in the world). That's what it's come to anyway. And then separate from all is the material world.
On the other hand if it doesn't seem like it bothers people then no issue.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 02:42:01 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 13, 2013, 03:12:33 pm
Spoiler: Lesser Creators (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 03:17:44 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 13, 2013, 03:21:55 pm
And yeah, that latter part's true. That's why it's open-ended :P I can't write well enough.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 13, 2013, 03:24:33 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 03:30:05 pm
I think it would be cool if the players came up with "god names" for all the modders. We've already got "The Entomologist" :D
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 04:24:55 pm
EDIT: Sorry for double post
Post by: Vgray on September 13, 2013, 04:43:21 pm
Slash, Stab, Hack, and Impale.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 04:52:35 pm
(http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/206/8/6/small_black_knight_axe_parry_by_alo81-d6f3p7n.gif)
Post by: Putnam on September 13, 2013, 05:01:51 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 05:23:43 pm
-I can have FORTRESS as the default site type, limiting each Adherent civ to a single monastery, but it only works if I have no positions defined. Or, I can have them form hamlets/towns, spreading out, but each can have it's own Abbot. Which would be better?
-If a civ has clothing but only some casts of the creature have [EQUIPS], will only those castes wear clothing?
Post by: kero42 on September 13, 2013, 07:35:27 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Perhaps not the most original idea*, and I figure with a little tweaking it could be better. It's missing some rather major points, but it's mainly a base to work a more coherent idea off of.
Depending on how aware the cherubs are, I imagine the creation myth and Armoks place in it would figure into roleplay for adventure mode quite a bit. BTW, for some reason I picture the cherubs a being somewhat contemptuous of other living things, how accurate would you lot find that?
*partially based on a discussion I had with someone else, and I imagine they would write it somewhat differently and the end result would vary from mine to a decent extent, but I think I got most of the main points. They also frequent this thread, so I suppose they can add in or correct any details I got wrong when they read it in the morning.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 13, 2013, 08:27:59 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 13, 2013, 08:46:31 pm
As for Armok, I personally theorized that, during the creation of one of his worlds, the new gods (modders) that he created rose up and defeated him in a mighty war, during which Armok created the cherubim to aid in his battles. Eventually, Armok was defeated, dethroned, and lost much of his power, resulting in him becoming little more than a lesser spirit. He lives on, however, through his last existing creations: the cherubim. These creatures seek to kill the creations of the new gods and sacrifice their blood to Armok in order to sustain him. I hope that this has resolved any lore-based issues that I have created.
Post by: Putnam on September 13, 2013, 11:43:10 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on September 14, 2013, 12:10:52 am
Makes me want to change the description for my Hell Riders though. Maybe, instead of having fallen out of favor with their god (whoever that was), they were servants of Armok who were banished.
Although I feel like that role is filled by the Shades already...
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 14, 2013, 12:22:41 am
Then they created the universe, and ran into the completely unforeseen issue of it being completely empty.
After a few false starts, they manage to get the Big Bang to stay Banged and not collapsed back into a singularity (reading more of their textbooks and test prep guides than they've ever had cause to before in the process) and try to create minions. The first attempts of the General Organization and Development Committee (GOD, for short) to make worshippers resulted in beings that spontaneously combusted while desperately trying to end each others' misery. They fiddled around with them a bit to make them less hideously unstable and more longer-lived, and thus GOD created Halflings, Ducks, and Hounds, and then things sort of went downhill from there after somebody started creating lifeforms based entirely off of his myriad tiny unofficial roommates, and the others tried to pull matching horrors out of their varied orifices. The Halflings worship out of absolute terror as they try to enforce some semblance of England's countryside on the chaos, and pray the committee gets deadlocked and doesn't add anything new for a bit. It's notable in the history of religions for being the sole faith in which followers pray fervently for the Gods not to intercede on their behalf.
Essentially, the creation myth is a Universe Requisition Application Form, filled out in triplicate and stained with pizza sauce, and the Garden of Eden was equipped with an automatic fire suppressant system as a necessity for a while. Armok walked in while they were planning one day, declared they needed blood angels, and promptly made a few to look comparatively harmless and insignificant next to the dragons and giant sea scorpions and Tarnish Stalks.
Post by: Gnorm on September 14, 2013, 01:37:46 am
[...]I, personally, assumed that the shades were not the remaining minions of Armok, but rather the essence of them.
Although I feel like that role is filled by the Shades already...
Post by: mastahcheese on September 14, 2013, 01:40:15 am
-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
Post by: kero42 on September 14, 2013, 02:28:17 am
-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
I quite like this one too.
Post by: reemer30 on September 14, 2013, 02:59:54 am
I third this-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
I quite like this one too.
Post by: Orange Wizard on September 14, 2013, 06:13:12 am
Fourthded.I third this-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
I quite like this one too.
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 08:29:06 am
Proposition: Trolls.
Description:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Content added:
Trolls - large, green-skinned, long-living, violent, alcohol-dependent civilized but non-playable creatures who live lives of hunting in the forest. Occasionally have peg-legs or only one arm due to their lifestyle. They are heavily armed. Prone to rage and to hunting and killing random animals. Also, 60% of them are bandits. Will be very angry if you cut trees. Long, often greasy hair, dark green skin, eyes in shades of yellow.
Troll mutation: all trolls, including peg-legged and one-armed ones, further mutate (when map is loaded, not in worldgen), with the following probabilities:
10% - troll master. Greatly enhanced strength, agility and endurance
20% - blind troll. Exactly what it says. No eyes.
20% - giant troll. 2x size, 80% speed.
10% - troll midget. 0.5x size, 120% speed.
35% - regular troll. Experiences tooth decay.
5% - madtroll. Attacks all on map.
This means there's 24 different combinations of troll to face, in addition to their choices of weapon.
Night creatures - mutated civilized beings (halflings only for now) who have found their place among the troll hordes. Pale-skinned, otherwise resemble halflings. Have either 8 tentacles for legs or 2 tentacles for arms and a grasping mouth. Fight more violently than halflings. Can either spit blood or vomit poison that causes rot.
Fiends - huge, furry humanoids that have large horns they can gore you with, muzzles, tails and hooves. Can breathe jets of fire (1x/3 days) and cast an evil eye on an enemy (1x/life, causes unconsciousness for 100 days, and after that random mutation, gives custom title of "cursed"). Greatly amplified strength and combat skills. Dark crimson fur, black skin, glowing red or yellow eyes.
Troll items -
Weapons: large hammers, axes and javelins. All weapons have two attacks (hammer: smack from side, smash from above; axe: slash from side, cleave from above; javelin: stab with tip, impale). Axes and javelins also give access to throwing quivered axes and javelins, which the trolls use as weapons.
Armor: hunting capes, loincloths, tribal masks and fancy hats (worn among other things by regular trolls), leather armor and tribal shields (worn by troll warriors)
Misc: food item "x in a jar", instrument: bone kantele and drums, tools: skinning axe, totem, rune amulet, toys: shrunken head. New colors: glowing yellow, glowing red, glowing blue, glowing green.
Civilization: playable in adventure mode. Trolls, night creatures and fiends living together with trolls being the large majority. Greedy, misanthropic, uses evil plants and evil and cave creatures, builds cities in mountains and forests and settles caves. Custom profession titles for warriors. Sends shamans to negotiate tree caps.
As for why these creatures all live together, unlike in the hierarchical or stoning-foreign-things-to-death societies that exist in this world, basically you're free to live among the trolls as you are to live among the trees; they will mostly ignore you if you don't bother them or their forests, but may also randomly attempt to kill you for fun or hunt you if you look weak and tasty, which is why creatures with a choice don't do that.
Raws:
Spoiler: creature_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: body_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: interaction_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: item_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: entity_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: descriptor_color_glow_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
You can also use [INTERACTION:TROLL_TAUNT_HLG] with appropriate parameters to cause them to throw insults and funny remarks at people once those are written.
Arena-tested, errorlog-free, playtesting later.
Edit: properly implemented regenerating muscle
Edit2: troll weapons more balanced. They actually use leather products. Added "primitive" language for trolls (two posts below due to character limit), replacing words with ostensibly more violent ones. Leads to translations sounding weird, however. Playing as one works fine.
(http://s7.postimg.org/qhg9bctaz/troll4.png)
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on September 14, 2013, 08:35:44 am
Fifthed.Fourthded.I third this-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
I quite like this one too.
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 11:30:44 am
Spoiler: language_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
And their appearance variations.
Spoiler: c_variation_troll_halfling (click to show/hide)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 14, 2013, 12:17:21 pm
Fifthed.Fourthded.I third this-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
I quite like this one too.
Further support that what Leibowitz said is the lore.
Post by: Gnorm on September 14, 2013, 12:43:19 pm
While I do like this as well, I feel that it is too silly to be the "official" lore of the worlds.Fifthed.Fourthded.I third this-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
I quite like this one too.
Further support that what Leibowitz said is the lore.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 01:08:31 pm
-Quote Pyramid-I'm fine with Armok being a mere interloper, though. If not this, then at least keep that aspect.
While I do like this as well, I feel that it is too silly to be the "official" lore of the worlds.
@Halfling: As cool as the trolls are, the Treelords are fearsome enough guardians. When one shows up, they are nigh indestructible and raise their elven minions ad infinitum. The reason tree-cap diplomacy isn't a threat currently is because the game doesn't use it unless you fix it with DFhack. Still, we could use an underground civ...
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 01:24:10 pm
@Halfling: As cool as the trolls are, the Treelords are fearsome enough guardians. When one shows up, they are nigh indestructible and raise their elven minions ad infinitum. The reason tree-cap diplomacy isn't a threat currently is because the game doesn't use it unless you fix it with DFhack. Still, we could use an underground civ...
Meh, elves will always be elves and people will be dismissive. The fact that they're naked, never hostile by default and have no equipment doesn't help. If someone ever manages to make them hostile, any resurrected elves will attempt to kill the treelord (who still keeps resurrecting them) because the modder used ANIMATE instead of RESURRECT and treelords are living.
Also, I thought tree cap diplomacy doesn't work because elves don't have a diplomat position. At least that's what it says in the bug report (http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=3295). I specifically added one to fix that.
But either way, they can be changed if you think they would fit in better in a different role, any use you have for any part suits me. More variety in hostiles and bandits might be good, as the only bandit groups that you get at this time should be spider centaurs (and very rarely formics); lizardfolk are local bandits but don't have dedicated banditry and halflings are never bandits. So trolls could definitely be good for that.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 01:33:46 pm
Do we have permission to alter elves?
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 01:37:25 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 01:41:04 pm
In other news, my civ is ready for a release, provided 8 error lines is tolerable. If not, I'll keep trying fixes.
Post by: kero42 on September 14, 2013, 01:44:34 pm
I'm not going to vote - just pointing out that if you like, you can also think that both are true in a way. One is the gods' perspective ("I've known Apollon since god middle school when he got into trouble for shoplifting ambrosia. The mortals think he's great but god he's such a self-indulgent mooch"), the other is the way they present themselves to the universe/mortal theologians view them.
Yeah, leaving the thing somewhat open for interpretation would probably be best. That way we could have a varying level of silliness/seriousness for roleplay purposes.
Regarding the trolls, I wasn't too interested in the idea at first due to assuming treelords already did that, but having read the whole post, I'm somewhat intrigued. The idea of them having a primitive language appeals to me. Whether we keep their tree limit function or not, I certainly think they should be included in some way or form.
@Hugo: Looking forward to seeing what they're like.
Post by: Putnam on September 14, 2013, 01:45:08 pm
While I do like this as well, I feel that it is too silly to be the "official" lore of the worlds.Fifthed.Fourthded.I third this-snip-I like this, I like this a lot.
I quite like this one too.
Further support that what Leibowitz said is the lore.
I like silly just as much as serious. I'll probably ditch Lesser Creators for this :V
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 01:46:28 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 01:55:33 pm
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature PSIONIC_HUGOL
PSIONIC_HUGOL:NORMAL:mind: No tissue thickness
PSIONIC_HUGOL:NORMAL:mental grip: No tissue thickness
PSIONIC_HUGOL:NORMAL:mental grip: No tissue thickness
PSIONIC_HUGOL:NORMAL:mental grip: No tissue thickness
PSIONIC_HUGOL:MASTER:mind: No tissue thickness
PSIONIC_HUGOL:MASTER:mental grip: No tissue thickness
PSIONIC_HUGOL:MASTER:mental grip: No tissue thickness
PSIONIC_HUGOL:MASTER:mental grip: No tissue thickness
Post by: Gnorm on September 14, 2013, 02:07:32 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 02:12:41 pm
@Gnorm: Halfling mayors have [RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS] for this purpose.
Regarding the trolls, I wasn't too interested in the idea at first due to assuming treelords already did that, but having read the whole post, I'm somewhat intrigued. The idea of them having a primitive language appeals to me. Whether we keep their tree limit function or not, I certainly think they should be included in some way or form.
Their language also very occasionally generates new universe and place names such as "Talenetherworld". And I just met chief Shack Redsboss Biggestunder Sniffer in adventure mode. He had a crown and earrings made of people.
I think the best function is that you'd be able to fight a blind peg-legged troll head hunter and his variously crippled but fearsome minions in adventurer mode. I've had great feedback on how much that adds personality to the adventure in the disease mod, and these are even more varied. That'll work whether they're tree cap diplomats or bandits or anything. :P
Basically, once I saw this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEzuxkkGyWQ , which they're looted from, I immediately thought of DF goblins, and I knew I must mod them a little or a lot to be more fun before I can be at peace. And then I figured that instead of making a vanilla mod I could add more content to DFFS.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 02:25:52 pm
Do you mean select the tissue from within the creature and change it? Can that even be done?
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 02:29:54 pm
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Creature_token#Important_Related_Tokens
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 03:05:00 pm
Oh, one more question. If a creature's civ has clothing but only certain castes have [EQUIPS], will only those castes wear it or will everyone wear it regardless? Ditto for weaponry
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 03:10:28 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 03:27:02 pm
I notice there are no robes, so I have added them.
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 03:29:50 pm
What happens if you make the body parts you want it to be impossible to hit unreasonably small or large?
Also, noting that DF is coded in the widely praised C language and accepts integer overflows no problem, what happens if you make the tissue extremely thick or the body part extremely large in general? This will result in it having a negative thickness or size if you have the right number. (Just typing in something extremely large should give a 50% probability)
Post by: Gnorm on September 14, 2013, 03:58:23 pm
@Gnorm: Halfling mayors have [RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS] for this purpose.They need [RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_MAKING] to receive the tree-loving diplomats and those which just visit to compliment your base.
P.S. My wiki finally got its name changed, so the front page link shall have to be updated.
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 04:02:24 pm
@Gnorm: Halfling mayors have [RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS] for this purpose.They need [RESPONSIBILITY:LAW_MAKING] to receive the tree-loving diplomats and those which just visit to compliment your base.
P.S. My wiki finally got its name changed, so the front page link shall have to be updated.
Interesting. On Wiki it says "effect unknown". If so, that should be added as a bugfix, the mayor was definitely intended to do so. Thanks.
Updating first post.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 05:03:23 pm
Code: [Select]
reaction_HugoL
[OBJECT:REACTION]
[REACTION:PSIWEAVE_HUGOL]
[NAME:make psiweave]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:CUSTOM_W]
[PRODUCT:100:120:CLOTH:NONE:CREATURE_MAT:PSIONIC_HUGOL:FABRIC]
[SKILL:CONCENTRATION]
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 05:13:12 pm
In other, not so informational news, holy crap, panserblekks.
(http://s22.postimg.org/aayb2gw41/trolladv1.png)
doop de doo adventuring business as usual in the Mountains of War
(http://s22.postimg.org/gd5xsykk1/trolladv2.png)
Damn but there sure are a lot of panserblekks around. This is like the fifth herd that I saw. Is there anything else around these parts?
(http://s22.postimg.org/nixovetn5/trolladv3.png)
OH GOD IT JUST GRABBED AND RIPPED AWAY MY ARM
Well, they are much larger than trolls and larger than six halflings after all. Letting one sneak up on you is definitely bad.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 05:16:12 pm
Anyway, there really isn't much more in the Mountains than Panserblekks, feral Hounds, and now Trolls.
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 05:43:10 pm
Even though they're mostly not aggressive, I've so far taken to only sneaking in the mountains when on the warpath. But then I made the mistake of leaving the safety of the shadows and slept in the open in the forest, and when I woke up...
(http://s12.postimg.org/8qj1vpelp/trolladv4.png)
(and yes, those are panserblekks. Armored octopodes larger than vanilla grizzly bears, with vicious natural skill in wrestling and eight flexible limbs. But really, they are a bane of peoples of the far north and far south only, living in tundras, taigas, coniferous forests and mountains.)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 05:58:08 pm
Anyway, working, error-free release of my Adherents of the Mind, plus some critters I didn't include in my turn because they were unfinished, and an update to Panserblekks.
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7977
Each civ the game generates for them occupies only a single site, a Monastery (fortress) that you can visit in adventure mode. They live there, meditating, alongside tribes of shaven halflings known as "acolytes" who live similar monastic lives, until they too can give up their bodies and become beings of pure thought.
Just a warning, I haven't added a good way to kill Adherents of the Mind yet, so try not to antagonize them (unless you want to experiment). That said, they're easy to get along with and you'd have to really try to make them mad.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 14, 2013, 06:19:21 pm
OH GOD IT JUST GRABBED AND RIPPED AWAY MY ARM
I don't want to go into the woods anymore...
Also, it's probably good you get amazing sneak training there, if your quest was to kill an oculentibus and you went alone. Minions or the ability to turn invisible at will or a cache of stoneward incense from an old fort or just being able to sneak well enough to strangle it without its awareness are probably the only way you'll be able to get a shot in before it petrifies you :D
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 06:21:19 pm
My adventure was eventually ended by a blind (!) troll bandit bowman landing an arrow in my neck with a stolen halfling bow, of all the things that could happen. So goes Big Hunt Cursedchief the Drunk of Mountains.
In that spirit here's the troll raws as a pack. This upload also should fix an issue where night creatures regenerated too. They're not fully bugfixed yet; at this time troll axe throwers do not seem to actually have or use throwing axes, instead they just charge at you madly with just the one axe. I'll try to figure that one out but as of now it's stumping me a little. Completely playable and without errorlog, however.
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7978
Post by: kopout on September 14, 2013, 06:29:15 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 06:33:39 pm
@Halfling
The AI never uses throwing weapons, unfortunately. You'd have to make them ammunition for a ranged weapon.
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 06:38:49 pm
@Halfling
The AI never uses throwing weapons, unfortunately. You'd have to make them ammunition for a ranged weapon.
Yes, to circumvent that, in the troll raws specifically the troll axe is a melee weapon but also a launcher using the axe skill that launches throwing axes stored in a quiver.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I know that should basically work because it does in the arena, both the items and the AI use.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 06:45:05 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 06:54:50 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 06:58:03 pm
-Does the Troll civ have [AMMO:QUIVER_AXE_HLG] underneath [WEAPON:TROLL_AXE_HLG]?
Then the non-obvious:
-Perhaps they need a melee-only axe as well, because the game is currently giving axes only to designated melee "axeman" troops?
Post by: Halfling on September 14, 2013, 07:07:15 pm
The less than obvious - you may be on to something there. I've not seen a troll bowman yet, but it sort of makes sense the game would only generate melee equipment for troll axemen.
I suppose I could try switching the bow skill for the axe skill and so on. Edit: yep, that fixed it. Uploaded with fix (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7978) using the currently unused crossbow and blowgun skills. Also limited trolls to mountains and limited the maximum number of trolls in the world to 2000 so that they don't wipe the poor halflings out every time.
For some reason I just found Gloomy Pickledjuices the troll weaver living with a Treequeen weaver called Sludges Stoneseas, with no less than eight tame elves in their shop.
(http://s7.postimg.org/pn3wumn2z/trolladv6.png)
What a wonderful world.
Post by: Gnorm on September 14, 2013, 07:28:36 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Kazimuth on September 14, 2013, 08:58:05 pm
All the bears in this universe will stop to chat with you while ripping your throat out.
Post by: Vgray on September 14, 2013, 09:04:07 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 14, 2013, 09:19:07 pm
Original Image:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 14, 2013, 10:31:28 pm
Post by: kopout on September 14, 2013, 10:59:40 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 15, 2013, 12:04:22 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 12:13:10 am
Now that we have bears, we need Triple-Bears.
Post by: Knight Otu on September 15, 2013, 06:47:41 am
Question, If I make a solid material that has a contact syndrome and have my Halflings make clothes from it will they get the contact syndrome when they where the clothes?Contact syndromes are only spread through contaminants right now.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 09:08:17 am
(http://s8.postimg.org/4drwnam1x/trolltaunt2.png)
(http://s23.postimg.org/jacweq3aj/trollstaunting.png)
To reduce spam, this works so: 10% chance a troll is a taunting troll, shouting at enemies 1x/day. 5% chance a troll is a bantering troll, talking to friendlies 1x/day.
Speech file:
Spoiler: /data/speech/speech_troll_hlg.txt (click to show/hide)
Raws with speech enabled:
Spoiler: interaction_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: creature_troll_halfling.txt (click to show/hide)
Also, if there's stuff you think trolls should say, I'll be happy to include.
Edit: increased percentage chances. Lower favors fortress mode, higher favors adventure mode. It's about finding a balance.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 15, 2013, 09:55:06 am
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 11:21:37 am
So...many...troll jokes...in that speech file...what have you wrought, Halfling? :'(
Says the guy who wrote the creation myth where the gods are inept grad students inspired to create horrors by various pests living in their dorm :P
I'm pretty happy with the balance of joke/serious there actually. Talking occasionally gives the trolls very cool moments in combat and outside of it too, while the occasional puns make the atmosphere not too dark. Maybe too many aggressive one-liners, they get a little monotonous, but meh, writing 100 lines without having any is hard.
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 12:32:41 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 12:47:01 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 01:41:30 pm
Code: [Select]
creature_hell_STL.txt::
[CASTE:DWARF_SHADOW]
[CASTE_NAME:dwarven shadow:dwarven shadows:dwarven shadow]
[BODY:HUMANOID_OUTLINE_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SHADOW_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SHADOW_CLAW_INFECT_STL]
[BODY_SIZE:60000]
[EQUIPS]
[BUILDINGDESTROYER:2]Anyway... Honorable? They want to hunt and eat you and take your skull and skin. But they're not subhuman like LOTR/D&D trolls, that's true. I never thought unintelligent trolls were that neat, you can have more fearsome beasts than humanoids fill that role. These are instead chaotic beings that you can negotiate with if you're strong but who like to make you disappear if you travel in the wilderness alone, as in what I think is the nordic original (the black elves refers to Svartálfaheimr). Spiced with a little bravado, stupidity and head-hunting a la orc/ks.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 01:47:42 pm
Actually, it would be cool if they were a little like LOTR trolls, because those weren't unintelligent. Ever read The Hobbit? They care somewhat about what they eat (in the discerning sense, not the sympathetic sense).
Post by: kopout on September 15, 2013, 01:58:20 pm
Question, If I make a solid material that has a contact syndrome and have my Halflings make clothes from it will they get the contact syndrome when they where the clothes?Halfling, what do you think about this? I got differing answers from different people.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 02:03:34 pm
I meant about the "wind of the hunt" sort of thing. Seems a bit Native brave/sportsman-like.
Actually, it would be cool if they were a little like LOTR trolls, because those weren't unintelligent. Ever read The Hobbit? They care somewhat about what they eat (in the discerning sense, not the sympathetic sense).
Well, they're tribal hunters. I just took cliches and bits and pieces from everything including Native Americans obviously. There's even some Australian Aborigine references in there.
While it would also be fun to have groups of Toms, Berts, and William Hugginses out hunting adventurers,
1. I don't think this troll template is fit for them, as this was supposed to be Nordic trolls/fierce, nocturnal tribal hunters at the core, includes a society, groups and interactions with others, with clear alignment with nature and the night, alliances with other night creatures, and interest in dominating their "hunting grounds", and
2. Even if I wanted to, I couldn't write it well. Even if it would add to the game. My English skills probably wouldn't be sufficient even if I could write stupid proficiently - it's a third language to me after all. That's actually another major reason why these trolls don't speak more colloquially. (Although maybe it would also be silly on closer inspection if they had a Cockney or Appalachian accent as they're not actually from there)
Question, If I make a solid material that has a contact syndrome and have my Halflings make clothes from it will they get the contact syndrome when they where the clothes?Halfling, what do you think about this? I got differing answers from different people.
As far as I know, solid items don't transmit contact syndromes. There should be a DFHack plug-in to add that out there.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 02:20:07 pm
Well, it's just I've never seen trolls talking about worthy opponents, which was the "honorable" thing. I think the being discerning about food would tie into that, prefering more succulent meat like comfortable halflings to dumb and lean Dirigible Antelope.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 02:23:59 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 02:58:18 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on September 15, 2013, 03:07:28 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 03:14:30 pm
(http://s11.postimg.org/kvgjx7bv7/boss.png)
Two, the game is very meticulous about respecting the personality and ethics I gave the trolls in worldgen. The most common cause of death for them by far is murder by another troll (and then they'll very possibly make trophies of the murdered party). What's more, it's not just strangers. Look closely at the below. I was a bit surprised at first but I guess I shouldn't have been:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: PDF urist master on September 15, 2013, 04:24:27 pm
to my understanding, treelords can spawn minions. what frequency do they have? i feel like with minion spawning, they should have similiar properties to necromancers of lore or be semi-megabeasts.
Post by: BlackFlyme on September 15, 2013, 04:48:39 pm
i'm sorry for asking this question but i check on this thread every once in a while and it's hard check everything in a 136 pg article.
to my understanding, treelords can spawn minions. what frequency do they have? i feel like with minion spawning, they should have similiar properties to necromancers of lore or be semi-megabeasts.
Last I checked there were 20 treelords, (10 female, 10 male) for every 80 elves. Their animation interaction specifically animates elves, and can only animate one at a time. The interaction is a free action; it has no wait period and doesn't take any time to do.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 15, 2013, 05:09:00 pm
Well, I discovered a few things. One, you should avoid drinking lizardfolk blood. Turns out that will permanently paralyze you.
(http://s11.postimg.org/kvgjx7bv7/boss.png)
:D
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 05:29:11 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 15, 2013, 05:34:01 pm
Well, I discovered a few things. One, you should avoid drinking lizardfolk blood. Turns out that will permanently paralyze you.
(http://s11.postimg.org/kvgjx7bv7/boss.png)
:D
That is a wonderful hidden feature.
On a related note, we need a tarnish-stalk-esque creature - a cheap, useful animal, every body part of which causes horrible syndromes. Eating its brain causes nerve necrosis, eating its meat caues vomiting for days on end, its blood leaves blisters, and its skin secretes numbness-inducing hallucinogenic mucus, or something like that. It should lay eggs that cause blindness and be milkable for a liquid that makes joints swell up like balloons. And it should have a really innocuous name, one that doesn't make it stand out as the bane of animal husbandry.
I'd make it myself if I had time :(
Post by: Putnam on September 15, 2013, 05:36:47 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 06:37:01 pm
Post by: kopout on September 15, 2013, 06:42:28 pm
That's not a cheap, useful animal. That's a cheap horrible animal.I'm sorry, what mod have you been playing :P
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 06:45:31 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on September 15, 2013, 06:47:09 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 06:49:22 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 06:52:06 pm
Code: [Select]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:POISONBLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen lizardfolk blood]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen lizardfolk blood]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:lizardfolk blood]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:lizardfolk blood]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling lizardfolk blood]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling lizardfolk blood]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:lizardfolk blood poisoning]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:REPTILE]
[SYN_CONTACT]
[SYN_INGESTED]
[CE_PARALYSIS:SEV:100:PROB:50:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:36000]
[CE_BLISTERS:SEV:100:PROB:75:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:34800]
[CE_NAUSEA:SEV:100:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:33600:PEAK:34800:END:36000]
[CE_VOMIT_BLOOD:SEV:100:PROB:50:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:36000]
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:100:PROB:25:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:36000]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:POISONBLOOD:LIQUID]
Notice the effects are permanent. This means that anything that's not covered head to toe (impossible with existing equipment for any race) cannot fight lizardfolk in melee and survive more than 50% of the time, and I'm not sure if you're 100% protected against spatters with any armor. Even if you're a vampire you'll become an immobile vomiting husk (50% chance). The SIZE_DILUTES doesn't really mean much when it's a high chance to perma-paralyze a troll. Seriously - try pitting anything against a lizardman in arena mode.
Suggestion: rethink this, eating lizardmen being fatal is enough; or reduce effects for contact poisoning.
There's worse things out there like the oculentibus I guess. But these things are some of your main adversaries in adventure mode because they insta-attack you near their cities.
Well, edit: I guess it's not unbearable like I originally thought, specifically since they aren't bandits. You can just not go near their cities. I still wonder if they're supposed to be this lethal.
Post by: kopout on September 15, 2013, 06:54:24 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 06:55:26 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 06:56:41 pm
That squid was vicious...my novice swimmer Halfling bled to death before he could drown.
Very difficult to use without maiming everyone who comes into contact with the products, will kill everyone in the settlement if one dies and is not forbidden.
You'd have to warn new players about it, or else it just wouldn't be fair. The unprepared would find their settlement quickly destroyed for something they couldn't possibly anticipate.
Ninja Edit:
That squid was vicious...my novice swimmer Halfling bled to death before he could drown.Try not to enter the water next to one, they should flee halfling-sized creatures. Any animal will attack if you're next to it, though.
I think removing the contact part might be bestYes. Contact poison blood in an entire civilization is way too much.
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 06:58:48 pm
And he dodged into the lake...the squid got a name and a place in legends mode too.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 07:10:27 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 07:16:23 pm
I will make it my mission to kill as many squid as possible though.
I'll be sure to make a sacrifice to the god of cephalopods.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 07:25:55 pm
[SYN_CLASS:ALL] means organic creatures, right? Inorganic beings are not included? Because I didn't give my inorganic beings that class.
EDIT: In fact, now that we have a wiki, I say we refresh our standardized syndrome classifications. From earlier
BTW, I propose 2 new creature classes for us to use:
[CREATURE_CLASS:SPIRIT]
and
[CREATURE_CLASS:SPIRIT_CORPOREAL]
So we can have certain mystical beings and things that effect only them. Our setting will likely feature both intangible ghost-like spirits and ones with solid or even fleshy physical forms.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 07:40:20 pm
My intention was that ALL contains literally all creatures, so syndromes can explicitly list that if they're meant to target everything. This is because of some problems at save/reload with syndromes that don't state an affected class (that was a problem with making the disease mod - when you had running syndrome loops, if they didn't specify GENERAL_POISON, upon fortress mode save/reload, they would explode in such a way as to make everybody on the map have everything). If something is supposed to be never affected by any syndrome, then it may be outside of ALL.
For inorganic you might want to have ALL and INORGANIC instead. Hm. Actually thinking about it having ALL and then after that ORGANIC or INORGANIC etc would have been smart from the start.
Edit. Wait, it happened in this mod too. Remember the vampiresplosion where my original vampire tokens could cause everybody in your fort to become a vampire? That was fixed by adding the targeted syndrome class (which was ALL). All in all good reason to have it I think, even if the details of possible buggy behavior aren't exactly known.
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 07:49:17 pm
I also agree that all the modders need god names.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 08:18:40 pm
We have 3 Syndrome classes, representing the basic construction of a creature:
-ALL for organics (so we don't have to change too much retroactively); INORGANIC for statues, mud men, machines, etc; and INCORPOREAL for ghosts, spirits, Adherents of the Mind, etc.
-For organic creatures, we have further classifications based on taxonomy, for instance [ALL]->[VERTEBRATE]->[MAMMAL], etc like we already do.
-We have [SPIRIT] for certain mythical/supernatural beings, with [SPIRIT_CORPOREAL] to differentiate those with bodies. We could further add the organic taxanomic classes to such flesh-cloaked spirits, but have some syndromes with [SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:SPIRIT] to differentiate them from their mundane bretheren. Or, even have syndromes targeting spirits in the shape of mortal creatures.
-Oh, and a [CREATURE_CLASS:UNDEAD], of course. We could differentiate between spirits of the dead and nature spirits, if we want.
-People who want an all-affecting syndrome would need only give it all three of the basic syn affected classes.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 08:22:42 pm
Generally your proposal is reasonable, I just think people will be confused when making syndromes about what they affect or not if ALL means organic. Could go either way.
Spirit classes may eventually be useful. UNDEAD class less so as you will not be able to give it to zombies, but why not.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 08:27:22 pm
That said, I think we should consolidate all currently finished files into a package so we can go back and change everything. I think people assumed [ALL] meant organic only because they gave [SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ALL] to all their creature venoms. Unless everyone intended their poisons to affect golems and other inorganics, but that's just overpowered.
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 08:44:15 pm
Does praying to the dark gods for vampirism not always work?
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 08:48:51 pm
All currently finished files? Since reemer's turn is right there on the first page, I assume you mean other things too. That's a tall order if you mean contributions.
Here's the finished trolls, with speech, rendered in the new order.
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7978
Specifically trolls are [ALL], [VERTEBRATE], [HUMANOID] and [NIGHT_CREATURE] while fiends are additionally [SPIRIT], [SPIRIT_CORPOREAL] and [DEMON].
My avenger Halfling Oath Rumpshard is ready with cudgel in hand.
Does praying to the dark gods for vampirism not always work?
No, it very rarely does (but it can, very occasionally). Try finding a vampire if you want better chances of eternal life that way. :P
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 08:56:19 pm
I'll get to work reclassifying things right away. Of course, I might need people to state intentions for their poisons.
You don't need to transform creatures to give them classes. [SYN_CLASS] gives the creature a class as long as the syndrome lasts, and zombies can receive a syndrome when they animate.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 08:59:45 pm
Or restarting your adventure until it works. A bit tedious, mind you.
I'll get to work reclassifying things right away. Of course, I might need people to state intentions for their poisons.
You don't need to transform creatures to give them classes. [SYN_CLASS] gives the creature a class as long as the syndrome lasts, and zombies can receive a syndrome when they animate.
True but that's a syndrome class, not a creature class. If you have a syndrome that targets creature class UNDEAD, it won't target one with syndrome class UNDEAD. Or am I mistaken? I think you can only use the latter with IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS.
I think you can reasonably assume for now that the poisons are supposed to target organics only, since those are (almost) all that have existed so far, unless someone specifically says they should target spirits and mechanisms too. It doesn't really make sense for insect poisons and lizardfolk blood to affect those... maybe. That's how it was working anyway, since it wasn't possible to target inorganics with ALL anyway, so it's a reasonable assumption that that was the intent. If something should target more it's easy to add the target by comparison.
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 09:05:47 pm
And I started as a maceman forgetting Halflings don't get daggers. I wanted to become rich selling squid parts.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 09:06:50 pm
I believe syndromes and interactions do not distinguish between SYN_CLASS and CREATURE_CLASS. It needs testing/confirmation, but I'm fairly confident.
NINJA EDIT: Do halflings have waterskins? If not, no water.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 09:10:39 pm
Hugo, if you're poking around in there and making a temporary package with bugfixes, would you mind...? :P
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 15, 2013, 09:14:30 pm
That's not a cheap, useful animal. That's a cheap horrible animal.
Oh, it's useful - just like tarnish stalks! It's just the worst possible thing to use. You can survive entirely off of tarnish stalks, feeding your halflings nothing but tarnish vodka and raw stalks, and they'll be miserable vomiting wretches forever and ever, but they'll neither starve nor dehydrate. Likewise with this horrible critter - you can eat its meat as much as you want, and drink its milk exclusively, and cook fine meals from its eggs, but you'll suffer endless stomach cramping and vomiting, occasionally sink into hallucinatory fits, and break out in blisters while butchering it. But it will be absolutely dirt cheap, and breed fast - some kind of noxious guinea pig, maybe. You can bring wagonloads of masterwork boulders and whatnot, and be able to bring along a breeding population of these animals to feed everyone!
Granted, everyone may hate you for it and want to die enough to run out with open arms to greet the spider-centaurs, but honestly, if I was a spider-centaur war leader, I would turn the band around if a wave of plague-ridden halflings came charging out at me wanting hugs while spewing their guts across the grass.
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 09:16:44 pm
These squid are fast...
Hugo, I just saw a squid leave the water.
It's drowning though...huh...
Their respiratory sacks bleed a lot by the way. Is that intended?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 09:21:34 pm
Halflings don't get waterskins because they currently don't use animal leather for equipment by default. I suppose they could do with [USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS] in their entity because they're not vegetarians by default after all.
Hugo, if you're poking around in there and making a temporary package with bugfixes, would you mind...? :P
Sure, bring out the bugs.
While we're at it, should [HUMANOID] be a taxanomic classification or a structural one? I'm thinking structural, but maybe it should be reserved for "xyz-men" and other such creatures, instead of anything human-shaped?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 09:23:20 pm
Their respiratory sacks bleed a lot by the way. Is that intended?
Well, they are analogous to lungs. Did you injure it, or did it just start bleeding randomly?
EDIT: sorry for double-post
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 15, 2013, 09:26:04 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 09:27:08 pm
I'm just surprised because I've seen creatures survive lung wounds in vanilla DF.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 09:28:46 pm
HUMANOID as structural (similar to "monstrous" etc.) makes sense, as some things simply don't have a well defined taxonomy. For example trolls. I'm not sure if there even should be a clear definition of how they are born and what they are evolved from. The same will be an issue for many mythical beasts.
The exact word for being related to particular apes would be hominid, I think
...also there's no way all the possible humanoids are the same taxon.
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 09:36:25 pm
I can see about six river squid corpses on land slightly south of the three I have piled up next to the river.
I suspect they left the river and airdrowned.
Post by: Halfling on September 15, 2013, 09:37:58 pm
Hitting the digestive tract also makes them bleed out.Internal organs often have major arteries in this mod. Are you hitting and tearing those?
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 09:41:08 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 10:39:44 pm
-Should "Wisps of Rage" be spirits? And should they be ORGANIC or INORGANIC?
-Should Treelords be counted as spirits, and/or among the ORGANIC? Should they be given a [PLANT] class?
-Should Dragons be counted as corporeal spirits, or should they be animals with magical properties? Corporeal spirits in organic bodies probably means the mortal forms of spirits, rather than products of ecosystems.
-By HUMANOID being a structural thing, I mean literally structural. As in golems, machines, and other such things would have it. Is that what you mean too? Or do you mean just use it for any organic, human-shaped things? In other words, ABSOLUTELY structural, or just for fleshy humanoid things?
-Ditto for [QUADRUPED]
-Are the Shades in Hell incorporeal?
-Do I have permission to remove SYN_CONTACT from lizardkin blood?
-Do I have permission to change the Elf raise interaction from ANIMATE=>RESURRECT?
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 10:45:15 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 10:46:52 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 15, 2013, 10:53:27 pm
Farewell Oath Rumpshard, slayer of three cephalopods.
The names of the squids are "Hiddenhazy" and "Wavedark" if you're interested.
Post by: kopout on September 15, 2013, 11:30:54 pm
-Should Treelords be counted as spirits, and/or among the ORGANIC? Should they be given a [PLANT] class?I think they ought to be organic and [PLANT] but that's just my opinion
Quote
-By HUMANOID being a structural thing, I mean literally structural. As in golems, machines, and other such things would have it. Is that what you mean too? Or do you mean just use it for any organic, human-shaped things? In other words, ABSOLUTELY structural, or just for fleshy humanoid things?I vote they only apply to fleshy things. that way a disease that affects all humanoids doesn't affect the robot people or the mud men
-Ditto for [QUADRUPED]
Post by: WillowLuman on September 15, 2013, 11:54:25 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 12:14:19 am
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) finalizing the creature DAEMONIC_CHERUB
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:upper body, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:lower body, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:head, layer 3: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right upper arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left upper arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right lower arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left lower arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right hand, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left hand, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right wing, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right wing, layer 5: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left wing, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left wing, layer 5: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right upper leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left upper leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right lower leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left lower leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:right foot, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:left foot, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:MALE:face, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:upper body, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:lower body, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:head, layer 3: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right upper arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left upper arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right lower arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left lower arm, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right hand, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left hand, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right wing, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right wing, layer 5: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left wing, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left wing, layer 5: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right upper leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left upper leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right lower leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left lower leg, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:right foot, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:left foot, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:face, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
DAEMONIC_CHERUB:FEMALE:chest, layer 1: Tissue SKIN was not found, using first tissue instead
Cannot generate random creatures -- missing body gloss RCP_GLOSS_PAW
Post by: Putnam on September 16, 2013, 01:22:21 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 01:30:05 am
Code: [Select]
creature_angels_gnorm
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:DAEMONIC_CHERUB]
[NAME:daemonic cherub:daemonic cherubim:daemonic cherub]
[CASTE_NAME:daemonic cherub:daemonic cherubim:daemonic cherub]
[DESCRIPTION:A servant of the Blood God; its kind is send to collect live offerings for their master.
[CREATURE_TILE:1][COLOR:49:0:98]
[GLOWTILE:1][GLOWCOLOR:75:0:130]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:2500:5000]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:SPIRIT][CREATURE_CLASS:SPIRIT_CORPOREAL][CREATURE_CLASS:ANGEL][CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[INTELLIGENT]
[HAS_NERVES]
[OPPOSED_TO_LIFE][FANCIFUL][FLIER][CRAZED]
[NO_FEVERS][NO_SLEEP][NO_DIZZINESS][NO_EAT][NO_DRINK][NOSTUN]
[NOPAIN][NOEXERT][NOBREATHE][CAN_SPEAK][CANOPENDOORS][NOSTUCKINS][PARALYZEIMMUNE]
[FREQUENCY:50][UBIQUITOUS]
[BIOME:ANY_LAND][UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:0:3]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:3]
[EQUIPS]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:1000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:40000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:70000]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[BODY:CHERUB_DAEMONIAC]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_GNORM]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_GNORM]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_GNORM]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIMBS_LAYERS_GNORM]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ROUNDHOUSE_KICK_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:daemonic cherub spawn:daemonic cherubim spawn]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:daemonic cherub spawn:daemonic cherubim spawn]
[BABY:1]
[CHILD:2]
[LITTERSIZE:1:5]
[CASTE:MALE][MALE]
[CASTE:FEMALE][FEMALE]
[BODY:CHEST]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CHEST_LAYERS_GNORM]Code: [Select]
b_detail_plan_gnorm
[OBJECT:BODY_DETAIL_PLAN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:SKIN:SKIN_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:BONE:BONE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:FAT:FAT_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:CARTILAGE:CARTILAGE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_MATERIAL:FEATHER:FEATHER_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:SKIN:SKIN_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:MUSCLE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:BONE:BONE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:FAT:FAT_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:CARTILAGE:CARTILAGE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE:NERVE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE:ORGAN_TISSUE_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:KERATIN:KERATIN_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[ADD_TISSUE:FEATHER:FEATHER_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_GNORM]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER:MUSCLE:100:FAT:10:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER:MUSCLE:100:FAT:10:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:MUSCLE:30:FAT:10:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:NERVE_TISSUE:100]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FACE:MUSCLE:10:FAT:10:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE:CARTILAGE:10:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:WING:BONE:20:MUSCLE:10:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR:5:TOP]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:WING:FEATHER:5:TOP]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:WING:BONE:20:MUSCLE:10:SKIN:1]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:LIMBS_LAYERS_GNORM]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER:BONE:20:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER:BONE:20:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HAND:BONE:20:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LEG_UPPER:BONE:20:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:LEG_LOWER:BONE:20:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SKIN:1]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:FOOT:BONE:20:MUSCLE:5:FAT:1:SKIN:1]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CHEST_LAYERS_GNORM]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:CHEST:MUSCLE:10:FAT:30:SKIN:1]
Post by: Putnam on September 16, 2013, 01:33:12 am
Code: [Select]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_GNORM]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER:MUSCLE:100:FAT:10:SKIN:1]Does the CHERUB_DAEMONIAC have the correct categories for its BPs?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 01:36:37 am
Code: [Select]
body_gnorm
[OBJECT:BODY]
[BODY:CHERUB_DAEMONIAC]
[BP:UB:upper body:upper bodies][UPPERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LB:lower body:lower bodies][CON:UB][LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:HD:head:STP][CON:UB][HEAD][HEAR][CATEGORY:HEAD]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:300]
[BP:RUA:right upper arm:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LUA:left upper arm:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RLA:right lower arm:STP][CON:RUA][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:LLA:left lower arm:STP][CON:LUA][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BP:RH:right hand:STP][CON:RLA][GRASP][RIGHT][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:80]
[BP:LH:left hand:STP][CON:LLA][GRASP][LEFT][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:80]
[BP:RWING:right wing:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][RIGHT][FLIER][CATEGORY:WING]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:LWING:left wing:STP][CON:UB][LIMB][LEFT][FLIER][CATEGORY:WING]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:RUL:right upper leg:STP][CON:LB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:LEG_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:LUL:left upper leg:STP][CON:LB][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:LEG_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:500]
[BP:RLL:right lower leg:STP][CON:RUL][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:LEG_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:LLL:left lower leg:STP][CON:LUL][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:LEG_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:400]
[BP:RF:right foot:right feet][CON:RLL][STANCE][RIGHT][CATEGORY:FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:120]
[BP:LF:left foot:left feet][CON:LLL][STANCE][LEFT][CATEGORY:FOOT]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:120]
[BP:NO:nose:STP][CON:FE][BREATHE][SMELL][CATEGORY:NOSE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:20]
[BP:FE:face:STP][CON:HD][SIGHT][CATEGORY:FACE]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:BN:brain:STP][CON:HD][NERVOUS][THOUGHT][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:BRAIN]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
[BODY:CHEST]
[BP:CS:chest:STP][CON:UB][CATEGORY:CHEST]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:160]
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 01:48:58 am
1. Your "turn" will be listed as unofficial addition before Putnam
2. Therefore, since he has to deal with it, ask his permission about content. It must be fit for addition - complete with no errors. Putnam, may he add stuff? Specifically, his adepts of the mind and allies? What about the trolls, would you plug those in too? Not that I'm pushing them or anything :P
The leather armors made earlier might help halfling survival and are ready too.)
3. When fixing, use the logic of "it is easier to ask for forgiveness than to get permission". See the newest content editing rule. You can easily spend more time calling people about changes and permissions than you would writing and listing the bugfix and reverting if they yelp. Just honor their intentions, flavor and objections. I love good manners, but our goal must be playability and code correctness (and speedy development), not political correctness long term, when those conflict Ps. Phone post
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 01:51:56 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 01:58:36 am
Putnam, it's up to you if any of it's included. As of right now, the Adherents, Trolls, and Talking Bears are error-free (it's the Cherubim that are the problem, currently).
The previously unfinished (but now finished) creatures of mine I wanted to include are:
-Swamp Nautilus (And Great Swamp Nautilus)
-Giant Squid (Oceanic only, like IRL.)
-Common Nautilus (Fishable vermin)
-Fishable vermin squid (Of 3 varieties)
EDIT: An excerpt from Gnorm's tissue template:
Code: [Select]
tissue_template_gnorm
[OBJECT:TISSUE_TEMPLATE]
[TEMPLATE_TEMPLATE:SKIN_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[TISSUE_NAME:skin:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SKIN]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:75]
[PAIN_RECEPTORS:2]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 02:02:58 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 02:04:45 am
Hmm, I think the Talking Bears can wait until Gnorm's turn officially begins, unless there's a strong demand for otherwise.
Post by: Putnam on September 16, 2013, 02:06:31 am
Putnam, may he add stuff?
Always.
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 02:16:59 am
The mat. template?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 02:26:37 am
Code: [Select]
material_template_organic_gnorm
[OBJECT:MATERIAL_TEMPLATE]
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SKIN_TEMPLATE_GNORM]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:WHITE]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:1][STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:skin]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:RED]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:fluid skin]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:fluid skin]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:RED]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:skin smoke]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:skin smoke]
[DISPLAY_COLOR:255:255:255]
[SPEC_HEAT:1000]
[IGNITE_POINT:15000]
[MELTING_POINT:20000]
[BOILING_POINT:20000]
[HEATDAM_POINT:13000]
[COLDDAM_POINT:9950]
[SOLID_DENSITY:1500]
[LIQUID_DENSITY:1000]
[IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:40000]
[IMPACT_YIELD:10000]
[IMPACT_FRACTURE:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_YIELD:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_FRACTURE:10000]
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:50000]
[TENSILE_YIELD:10000]
[TENSILE_FRACTURE:10000]
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:50000]
[TORSION_YIELD:10000]
[TORSION_FRACTURE:10000]
[TORSION_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:50000]
[SHEAR_YIELD:20000]
[SHEAR_FRACTURE:20000]
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:50000]
[BENDING_YIELD:10000]
[BENDING_FRACTURE:10000]
[BENDING_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:50000]
[MAX_EDGE:0]
[ABSORPTION:100]
[IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL]I hope for this fix to take only 2 days. If I get no reply from someone over the course of tomorrow, I'll just go by consensus.
Afterwards, I'd like to write a guide to classifying creatures and targeting syndromes/interactions, including a treemap. I've taken the liberty of adding a "resistance class" based on radiation syndromes I found in the inorganic raws. No creature uses the class yet but people can add them later, or request them for existing creatures during bugfixing.
Wisps of Rage are now classified as any other organic bug, but also as corporeal spirits and demons.
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 02:32:05 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 02:35:13 am
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 02:41:22 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 02:53:18 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 02:56:23 am
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 02:58:51 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 03:11:59 am
Alright, turns out the trolls did have 2 errors:
-An "IT_CANNOT_HAVE" instead of an "IT_FORBIDDEN" (FORBIDDEN is for tokens, the other one is IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS)
-The speech file goes in data/speech
Both fixed now. Clean Errorlog.
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 03:40:41 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 12:23:39 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 12:38:57 pm
Post by: Meph on September 16, 2013, 12:46:06 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 12:49:22 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 16, 2013, 01:00:53 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 01:02:26 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 03:51:27 pm
Introducing, the Burdle!
Spoiler: It's like a pond turtle. Except it's a flightless bird. With a shell. (click to show/hide)
I think I shall add some kind of penguin-whale, too.
In other news, simply adding [USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS] will let Halflings use leather, right?
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 03:53:04 pm
Post by: Poldon on September 16, 2013, 04:26:43 pm
And then...
"It likes vampire bats for their appeal to their dark and poetic soul, and they would prefer you not to laugh."
Well I laughed. My apologies.
I also had an encounter with a water strider which killed a wayward worker, but a single unskilled soldier was able to put it down with only a scimitar and a minor injury. I remember reading reports of them being terrifyingly numerous, but I have tons of squid on the map and only saw a couple of them thankfully.
I'm loving this mod even more now, by the way, simply because I know what almost nothing is. Exploring anew the very rocks and bushes and creatures around me is a lot of fun and often mysterious and frightening. I don't know what to expect and am eager to discover what everything is and does. Not having a wiki is forcing me to explore it on my own. Thanks for the fun, everyone, and keep up your good work!
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 04:33:21 pm
(Hint: not mutch and nothing to do with meds)
In the same world the god of laws and oaths is also the god of lies and trickery.
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 16, 2013, 04:38:44 pm
In the same world the god of laws and oaths is also the god of lies and trickery.
The god of Lawyers?!! Now that's scary.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 04:41:30 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 05:09:41 pm
People should be finishing up their school day soon. While we wait, any bugs people want to point out?
Post by: Poldon on September 16, 2013, 05:12:11 pm
Also loving the Burdle and the Groon.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 05:22:04 pm
Post by: kero42 on September 16, 2013, 05:31:47 pm
Also was amused by the god "Belokh the Black White of Bright". What an interesting and odd combination of words.
Lol, I've I just genned a world and found some somewhat funny names myself. "The Dark Spider-centaur fortress of Oldreaper" in "The Loving Woods", "The Sea of Deserts", "The Red Hill" in "The Blue of Hero", "The Lethal Peaces". I also got two large mountains, one named "The Cursed Mountain", the next called "The Mythic Mountains", which I think contrasts nicely. Plus two small ones right next to each other named "The Pumpkin Mountain" and "The Mountains of Tea". Unlike the last world I genned, there appears to be a few surviving halfling villages.
Edit: My civ options are quite nice too:
The Sons of Appletree (Formic)
The Guardian of Blossom (Halfling)
The Wrong Rump (Halfling)
The Darling Guards (Formic)
The Ugly Lord (Halfling)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 05:35:01 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 06:00:32 pm
Post by: reemer30 on September 16, 2013, 06:04:41 pm
Post by: kero42 on September 16, 2013, 06:15:52 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
"This nameless being is a deity of the darling guards. the Formic worker most often takes the form of a formic worker and is associated with the night and stars."
While I find the idea of a nameless god interesting, I wasn't sure of if was a bug or not, so I figured I'd ask. I have the latest raws (well, the one detailed as latest on the front page a few days ago, so I don't have the robes, trolls, or panserblek fix yet.).
Also, I concur about the bird-seals. First large monster insects, now aquatic life spliced with birds (or is it the other way round?)! Gosh, what will you people come up with next?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 06:21:01 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 16, 2013, 06:21:09 pm
If it's a bug I don't think it's one of our causing, unless the language symbol file is a bit impoverished still. Nobody's done a lot of linguistical stuff lately, now that I think of it.
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 16, 2013, 06:42:03 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 16, 2013, 07:05:57 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 07:08:35 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 07:12:28 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 16, 2013, 07:14:40 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 16, 2013, 07:18:29 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 07:24:55 pm
@Hugo, I'd go with corporeal. Incorporeal things tend to have some difficulty mauling others properly, what with the incorporeality and all.
Alright. In an exception, I've made them [INCORPOREAL] for basic structure, yet [SPIRIT_CORPOREAL], because shadow seems more like some kind of energy or magic than stone or metal or ooze.
Post by: Poldon on September 16, 2013, 07:27:05 pm
AGH. I'm having ridiculous modder's block. I can't think of anything cool/fun to add...
Well we can always use more variety in wildlife, especially mundane creatures, and more types of rocks, metals and alloys. Also more trees.
Maybe add some funny critters here and there. Look at other games you play for ideas you like, maybe. Or maybe look some places you don't usually go very often. You don't have to add too much craziness, everyone seems to want that, it'd be cool to have some more 'normal' things around to relax things a little. *may be imagining sitting out in the wilderness somewhere watching some random animals wander by*
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 07:31:56 pm
Speaking of which, can anyone think of a good name for bird-seals?
Post by: Gnorm on September 16, 2013, 07:35:26 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 07:38:49 pm
EDIT: All we're waiting on for uploading this bugfix is Bfel's answer on the Treelords. If we don't get one, I'll go with the concensus.
BTW, Occulentibus gaze now petrifies Organics and Incorporeals, but not Inorganics. So there's one way to kill Wandering Spirits and Adherents of the Mind.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 07:46:47 pm
Of course, I need to learn things first. Ah well.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 16, 2013, 07:47:35 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 07:51:39 pm
I want to make dwarves now... But nearly purely underground ones.
Of course, I need to learn things first. Ah well.
But we've already got "shades" of them. Maybe we shouldn't try to recreate vanilla races.
NINJA EDIT: If that's how you feel. I was thinking of it as a balance thing, as things like ghosts that exist as some kind of Ethereal image could be solidified, or for things made of some kind of ectoplasm or mystic energy. But those things could be viewed as placeholders for actualy non-substance. I'll make it organics only for now.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 07:52:54 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 07:54:37 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 08:05:55 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 08:07:33 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 16, 2013, 08:12:35 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 16, 2013, 08:15:33 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 08:17:55 pm
Post by: Kazimuth on September 16, 2013, 08:19:42 pm
Also, re: bird-seals: penguins? :P
Actual names, though- something like mareformes? Scientific names for birds tend to end in 'formes' (which apparently means 'ugly' in latin)
Ninja-edit: anyone know how the [CAVE_ADAPT] token works?
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 16, 2013, 08:28:15 pm
Personally I prefer "Birdeal" or just "Breal" for bird-seals.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 08:45:05 pm
Kind of like penguins, but bigger, higher on the food chain, and with 4 flippers. I would go for something scientific, but I want something more vernacular. Like, most people don't go around calling seals pinnipeds.
Post by: Kazimuth on September 16, 2013, 08:59:43 pm
Ack, ninja'd. Welp.
You can't go wrong with weird nordic roots. What about, like, skurl? For 'shore'.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 09:17:35 pm
Post by: kopout on September 16, 2013, 09:19:27 pm
Like, most people don't go around calling seals pinnipeds.I do sometimes :P
I was planing on adding filter feeding flamingo seals with strainer beaks. I'll have to work extra hard at making them different enough.
Cave dwarves. No eyes. and no skin color. Also they burn in light. Get underground ASAP.Their is light in the caverns from the moss. I would suggest HUGE eyes instead of no eyes. And instead of burning they are blinded and in a world of pain when they step out side.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 10:18:39 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 16, 2013, 10:23:28 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 10:30:25 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 16, 2013, 10:31:25 pm
It gives no meat. Just muscle, fat, skin, nervous tissue, and "Organs' not a list of different organs just "Organs".
Post by: Putnam on September 16, 2013, 10:34:02 pm
Shadowrun Returns inspiration?
Nope. Generic inspiration.
Far better, IMO. I usually don't make original content.
...
:(
Post by: BlackFlyme on September 16, 2013, 11:30:08 pm
Hmm...I just butchered a River Squid in advent mode.
It gives no meat. Just muscle, fat, skin, nervous tissue, and "Organs' not a list of different organs just "Organs".
In this mod, muscle is meat. And I think there are just generic 'organs' to reduce clutter. I'm not 100% sure, using the search tool didn't bring any answers up.
Post by: Vgray on September 16, 2013, 11:34:37 pm
And none of the merchants even want to barter.
I think it's more a bug with vanilla DF, but it amuses me that the merchants don't care if I just stuff my face with the pumpkins I was just trying to buy.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 16, 2013, 11:35:28 pm
Hmm...I just butchered a River Squid in advent mode.
It gives no meat. Just muscle, fat, skin, nervous tissue, and "Organs' not a list of different organs just "Organs".
In this mod, muscle is meat. And I think there are just generic 'organs' to reduce clutter. I'm not 100% sure, using the search tool didn't bring any answers up.
They have some organs, but the organ tissue templates don't have the tokens to produce "prepared x" upon butchery, so all organs just get minced into a pile of "organ tissue"
It's getting late. I'll give it half an hour more to hear from Bfel, then I'm uploading this bugfix.
Post by: mastahcheese on September 16, 2013, 11:46:56 pm
It would appear that Halflings don't use currency. It's not like we have gold or silver though is it?I don't think they have the proper currency tokens, so they won't have them when you see them in adventure mode (they'll never have it in fortress mode.)
And none of the merchants even want to barter.
I think it's more a bug with vanilla DF, but it amuses me that the merchants don't care if I just stuff my face with the pumpkins I was just trying to buy.
I made sure that my travelers had coins, though, 5 kinds if I remember right.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 12:03:52 am
If it's alright with everyone, I'm going to classify treelords as ORGANIC, PLANT, and SPIRIT_CORPOREAL.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 12:19:59 am
I'll write up a diagram of the new system and a guide to syndromes tomorrow.
Enjoy, Putnam! And everyone else, too...
Post by: Halfling on September 17, 2013, 04:07:04 am
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 09:44:37 am
Also I noticed a minor worldgen problem, when using a medium world the game really struggles to place even a medium number of civilizations. I did manage to get one that worked within a few minutes, but it had a lot of rejections. I suppose this isn't really something you can fix, but it may be worth noting now. I would guess that the biome-specific races make things harder on it, but I don't really know.
Edit: While playing as the Formics I had a repeatable crash to desktop when attempting to access the "supplies" part of th military menu. This only happened after I had created a squad, and I could access it fine while there was no military. There is nothing in the error log. I'm not really sure what to guess might be the cause. It's not a very important screen, admittedly, but a hard crash is still annoying if accidentally triggered.
Edit2: Actually, do we have any flask items? If not, might that be the cause?
Post by: Halfling on September 17, 2013, 10:31:50 am
Strange on the worldgen too. I've not experienced worldgen problems generating worlds of any size before. Could it be the psionics or something else that has changed now? Did you use default settings?
Flasks etc. are hard-coded and we have them, so that can't be the issue. But it's something that should be looked into and if it's due to a missing item that should go into items_default.txt - items that are there to keep DF from crashing.
On another note, do people feel humans should be in the mod? I'm not going to make them. But I'm going to pitch a few ideas.
First of all, they should be rare and interesting somehow. Humans should probably not be the majority race, it's more interesting that way. Maybe limit civs to one or two and the number of people to a thousand or so? Here's two ideas based on the idea that the world has undergone a terrible change, with poisonous, rapidly breeding creatures, unfeeling again rapidly breeding humanoid insects, lizardmen with their paralyzing blood and various bear-sized eight-limbed rampaging aberrations and so on ruling the world now and humans simply not being able to keep up.
Second, writing lines for human armies is just so much fun. By subdividing them into noble, warrior and peasant castes you could write in cowardly, decadent, bossy nobles, zealot warriors and timid, uneducated peasants. So they could be another race to talk.
Spoiler: Idea 1. Grimdark failing human empire. (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Idea 2. The last human survivors. (click to show/hide)
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 10:50:23 am
Strange on the worldgen too. I've not experienced worldgen problems generating worlds of any size before. Could it be the psionics or something else that has changed now? Did you use default settings?
Yes, I used the simple world Gen. Everything was on default except history, which was on short, and minerals, which were set to frequent. This may have been in previous versions, I only just now noticed it however. It certainly gets a number of rejections, but it's not unusable by any means either. It seems to only have issues on large and medium maps. *testing right now*
Edit: Golden Mamaphints strangely appear as a dark red "h", much like hounds do. I brought both on an embark and am unable to tell them apart. I would suggest having them be a gold or yellow "M", as that might make more sense.
Edit2: On the subject of humans, those suggestions sound pretty cool. I do feel like they should also be unplayable in fortress mode, though.
Also I feel very limited on clothing and armor production in general, and I think perhaps a few various items being common to multiple entities might help alleviate that. Currently much of what can be made is still very minimalistic, and often there's no armor available of certain types. There's only one type of handwear even though we have several playable races for instance, and it's not even armor. I think this area needs some attention for a bit.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 11:02:03 am
Eternal Knights, human Knights who survived the end of the previous Universe through sheer tenacity, roam the world searching for feats of valor and bravery. Such feats range from slaying the mighty and strange monsters of this continuum, to raiding an entire settlement single-handedly (they're somewhat deranged). As well as their legendary skills as great Knights, changing universes has altered their nature (as the Shades were), and they have become near-demigods.
EDIT: I've updated the Bugfix package so that tea shrubs are actually fixed now. I swear, I did it before, but I must have edited the txt in the wrong folder...
Post by: kero42 on September 17, 2013, 11:19:32 am
make them. But I'm going to pitch a few ideas.
First of all, they should be rare and interesting somehow. Humans should probably not be the majority race, it's more interesting that way. Maybe limit civs to one or two and the number of people to a thousand or so? Here's two ideas based on the idea that the world has undergone a terrible change, with poisonous, rapidly breeding creatures, unfeeling again rapidly breeding humanoid insects, lizardmen with their paralyzing blood and various bear-sized eight-limbed rampaging aberrations and so on ruling the world now and humans simply not being able to keep up.Spoiler: Idea 1. Grimdark failing human empire. (click to show/hide)Spoiler: Idea 2. The last human survivors. (click to show/hide)
I actually feel quite conflicted on this point. On one hand, I am somewhat reluctant to have the humans back in any form other than shades. On the other, I think these are interesting enough to be included anyway and are suitably different from their original.
I think I prefer the second one, but I have issues with both. It would seem rather weird for the humans to be a falling empire with memories of a better time even from the beginning of each world at its very conception. But I'm sure that could be explained or otherwise handwaved away with a little work. So, other than that small bit, I have no complaints/problems.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 11:33:48 am
Even if the human civ is somewhat different, bringing back 3/4 vanilla races makes it less from scratch and more heavily modded vanilla
Post by: Halfling on September 17, 2013, 11:59:24 am
Anyway... I think we discussed the issue of what "from scratch" means earlier. Although having different opinions of it is fine... well, it is a fantasy setting as is. Or at least mostly one. Didn't we sort of agree earlier that therefore you would very likely want to have such as gold, silver and steel? Diamonds too? "Draw iridium, villain" not sounding cool and all that. I think the same applies and we will eventually want to have the staples... or get them anyway, alternatively, done with less consideration, difference and imagination, when someone decides to "just do it" (allowing which is a staple of this project).
Hell, the original idea was to make something which resembles Dwarf Fortress but is made entirely by the players and works differently. Not e.g. a Starcraft-inspired space-themed total conversion which could have been the outcome if we had had enough fanatic Starcraft and sci-fi fans at the start. Not saying that that couldn't still be an acceptable outcome but... my original idea was to make a different fantasy setting to play in, with different mechanics.
Now, there exist fantasy settings where all is alien and nothing is recognizable. But those seem to me to always be much less popular for a story and for players. And I do sometimes get the feeling that while different is cool, the tagline shouldn't be "DF from scratch - weird for the sake of weird".
I should think that creating things with the same name but different role in the story is fine. Such as you would make wolves or bears. Remaking the same stuff as is in vanilla is pointless, exactly as you said. Here I feel that those concepts of humans as a minority, mostly insignificant and either dark and dangerous or sad are sufficiently different to propose; they force the player to relate differently to humans; the latter concept even has your species auto-killing them as scum in fort mode. Their body mechanics wouldn't be the same made from these templates either. Definitely not vanilla. I also think that being able to play as a "human outsider" which a human civilization brings can make for amusing stories with that perspective.
So that's my point of view, but I want to distance myself from saying that as any sort of administrator here. Rather as one of the modders as my opinion of what kind of content we can make.
But the last word is of course that if the people who enjoy this setting largely feel that humans would detract from the setting then they probably shouldn't be made.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 12:14:04 pm
Another take would be to have them as some kind of mysterious "precursor" race, long since vanished but perhaps existing in small pockets. Possibly as underground "madmen" or something. Or just make them part of the roving creature population, appearing in groups sometimes in the 3rd cavern layer, and describe them as "The legendary big-folk, ancestors of the halflings. They ruled the world once long ago but have since declined such that some doubt they ever existed."
I still like my idea of megabeast human Knights from the last universe, though...
Also, another Megabeast idea:
It's out for a purpose. It shall take revenge for every merchant robbed by an adventurer, every Caravan destroyed and looted, every Elven trader blown off or offered wood. It is... THE CABBAGE MAN!
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 12:21:08 pm
Speaking of which, I really like the cave-humans idea, though I'm more hesitant on the gunpowder part. I like things with little side touches, and humans being mysterious and deep in the caves is kinda cool. In fact I may like the mystery of it more than the backstory Halfling provided, but either way.
I don't really think we need another type of civilization on the surface at the moment though.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 17, 2013, 12:25:24 pm
I think it's okay to have them. Just because they're "humans" doesn't mean they're vanilla humans. We could make the cave-humans idea and change the name and tweak them a tiny bit and they wouldn't necessarily be recognizable as such. Really I don't mind, since they'll be a completely different thing from vanilla "humans" and built by a modder anyway. There's more to them than the name.
Speaking of which, I really like the cave-humans idea, though I'm more hesitant on the gunpowder part. I like things with little side touches, and humans being mysterious and deep in the caves is kinda cool. In fact I may like the mystery of it more than the backstory Halfling provided, but either way.
I don't really think we need another type of civilization on the surface at the moment though.
I'd prefer to keep humans out of this. As it was said, this is a player-made, from-scratch universe. If we add too much, we could wind up getting the feel of a modded DF, and I am pretty sure there will be quite a few whom do not like that.
Here's a better idea: rather than humans, why don't we use Neanderthals?
Post by: Halfling on September 17, 2013, 12:26:46 pm
Most probably think "fortress mode" only. But in adventurer mode, specifically, having a large number of races you can meet with small geographical boundaries is a huge boon. Hence the adherents were a great addition too. It gives you places to go and things to do where normally the adventure wears pretty thin pretty fast. That's why I prefer suggestion #1 or both, they would be cool to meet and greet.
Megabeast knights are cool too. You could have both. You could have all three. You could also have the last surviving humans use the night creature mechanic to go on rampages and capture humanoid beings to breed with... if you're like that.
Quote
It's out for a purpose. It shall take revenge for every merchant robbed by an adventurer, every Caravan destroyed and looted, every Elven trader blown off or offered wood. It is... THE CABBAGE MAN!
wat
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 17, 2013, 12:30:43 pm
Most probably think "fortress mode" only. But in adventurer mode, specifically, having a large number of races you can meet with small geographical boundaries is a huge boon. Hence the adherents were a great addition too. It gives you places to go and things to do where normally the adventure wears pretty thin pretty fast. That's why I prefer suggestion #1 or both, they would be cool to meet and greet.
Still, I would prefer to have humans remain out. Why not use Neanderthals? They would fit better with the 'from-scratch' idea, in my opinion.
Post by: Vgray on September 17, 2013, 12:30:58 pm
Halflings are the only ones who actually build towns you can visit right?
Post by: Halfling on September 17, 2013, 12:36:13 pm
Most probably think "fortress mode" only. But in adventurer mode, specifically, having a large number of races you can meet with small geographical boundaries is a huge boon. Hence the adherents were a great addition too. It gives you places to go and things to do where normally the adventure wears pretty thin pretty fast. That's why I prefer suggestion #1 or both, they would be cool to meet and greet.
Still, I would prefer to have humans remain out. Why not use Neanderthals? They would fit better with the 'from-scratch' idea, in my opinion.
Because cavemen are more boring than knights and shouting "I command in the name of the king! Back to the darkness with you!" makes for a cooler line to say in a fight than "Ugh!", I pitched knights rather than cavemen. My opinion. :P
I would support adding dwarves too. It makes it more relatable. But not vanilla ones, steam-cyborg ones or such. When not one of their body parts uses vanilla things, when their attacks and tissues even are balanced differently and their necks bleed from major arteries, you can't really say it's just modded vanilla.
In the next version maybe.
Halflings are the only ones who actually build towns you can visit right?
No, trolls and lizardmen build towns too. Once mountain halls, tree cities and dark fortresses become visitable trolls should move to one of those, whichever can best fit with their theme.
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 12:39:35 pm
Well, off the topic of humans for the moment, I've found that digging and building in an Azurine layer is incredibly confusing, as the wall tile has the exact same symbol as one of the possible ground variations, making some tiles visually indistinguishable. This would be a bit easier if there were a background color for the wall tiles, or perhaps one could straight up change the foreground symbol. I will turn off ground variation for now, but I kinda like having it on.
Also, how good is Aeresium for various purposes? I can look at the numbers, but I don't know well enough how it would compare to other materials. Is it better for edge or blunt? What about armor or arrows? And if someone actually takes the time to look and tell me, maybe it should also be on the wiki(s).
Post by: Putnam on September 17, 2013, 12:41:17 pm
Code: [Select]
[CDI:MATERIAL:ETHER_ZTG:UNDIRECTED_VAPOR]Where's ETHER_ZTG? If it's an INORGANIC, it needs that.
EDIT: It is. Bugfixing, unless there are complaints.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 12:46:27 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiMhue3iSd4QuoteIt's out for a purpose. It shall take revenge for every merchant robbed by an adventurer, every Caravan destroyed and looted, every Elven trader blown off or offered wood. It is... THE CABBAGE MAN!
wat
Halflings are the only ones who actually build towns you can visit right?
Trolls and lizardmen build towns, you can't visit Mountain Halls but Formics also build Forts you can visit, and Adherents build Monasteries.
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 12:52:15 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiMhue3iSd4QuoteIt's out for a purpose. It shall take revenge for every merchant robbed by an adventurer, every Caravan destroyed and looted, every Elven trader blown off or offered wood. It is... THE CABBAGE MAN!
wat
That poor man! Heads shall roll as vengeance for the heads that rolled!
Post by: Halfling on September 17, 2013, 12:59:47 pm
Also, how good is Aeresium for various purposes? I can look at the numbers, but I don't know well enough how it would compare to other materials. Is it better for edge or blunt? What about armor or arrows? And if someone actually takes the time to look and tell me, maybe it should also be on the wiki(s).
Aeresium was specifically designed by LKR to be worthless as a metal for weapons. It is neither very dense nor good for bladed ones. Actually it was supposed to be so useless for weapons he got a little mad when ZTG made a reaction allowing it to be made into those.
Mmm... what's your thought on creatures speaking? Personally so long as there are measures to avoid spam and there's more than 10 lines, I think it's the best thing ever in adventurer mode. It also lets you give your race a lot of fluff.
I was thinking halflings could eventually randomly, occasionally sing and hum things like
Too-ra-loo-ra-loo-ral, too-ra-loo-ra-li (women) or the only brew for the brave and true comes from the Green Dragon (men). Except maybe original. And no Green Dragon because that's not in the game. They could scream when running away. Some of them could be marked "brave" and jeer at the enemy a bit.
Anyone into stuff like that, feel free to steal the stuff from the troll raws. Specifically there's just an interaction that adds a syndrome but doesn't actually have any contents for the syndrome, and they use this to talk to others.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 17, 2013, 01:04:29 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 01:09:46 pm
Anyway, right now the story is small groups of halflings seeking enlightenment build these monasteries, and some of them attain Mental enlightenment and become Adherents. Now, I'd like at some point to have other "offshoot" groups doing the same. But which other races would make sense to have some of theirs seeking enlightenment? Not the Formics, as only the Queens have much mind (Maybe the queens should get some psionic powers by default?). Basically, I'd make duplicates of the Adherent creature entity but replace the "halfling" castes.
Post by: kopout on September 17, 2013, 01:35:23 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 01:49:25 pm
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 02:59:56 pm
Also, how good is Aeresium for various purposes? I can look at the numbers, but I don't know well enough how it would compare to other materials. Is it better for edge or blunt? What about armor or arrows? And if someone actually takes the time to look and tell me, maybe it should also be on the wiki(s).
Aeresium was specifically designed by LKR to be worthless as a metal for weapons. It is neither very dense nor good for bladed ones. Actually it was supposed to be so useless for weapons he got a little mad when ZTG made a reaction allowing it to be made into those.
Okay, so it's a decorative metal. Darn. Still cool though, I'll just have to find something else deeper.
What about Promethium? What's that used for? Also how good is Metoeric Iron versus Lunanium?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 03:04:49 pm
We might want to do some kind of material overhaul, too (but not right now). For instance it's always seemed a bit odd that Meteoric iron is the baseline metal, since Meteors are pretty rare, especially compared to other Iron ores. Unless it's supposed to be a major component of the planet, but then it's not really Meteoric. If we had the standard, everyday materials (iron, copper, precious metals, 10 or so mundane kinds of stone), it would give some point of reference to our own, unique materials.
Post by: Sassnad on September 17, 2013, 03:10:44 pm
Then it looks like the grass has overgrown everything
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 03:11:26 pm
Post by: Dorsidwarf on September 17, 2013, 03:25:29 pm
One thing that bugs me: that one stone that looks like a green ". It looks just like vanilla bushes, or like random terrain tiles, it's very distracting.Rather than generic df stones, we should make up cool, fantasy/ye olde-esque ones. I liked it back before all the "blahblah-ites" we're introduced. Would be perfectly happy with just Rock, Black Rock, Whitestone, Greenstone, Shimmering rock, fire-rock, etc. I figured it made sense to have the science-like names in normal df, because it is dwarves, and dwarves know all about rock. But, since in DFFS, we have halflings and bug-people, less advanced names would really Fit the over setting better in my opinion.
We might want to do some kind of material overhaul, too (but not right now). For instance it's always seemed a bit odd that Meteoric iron is the baseline metal, since Meteors are pretty rare, especially compared to other Iron ores. Unless it's supposed to be a major component of the planet, but then it's not really Meteoric. If we had the standard, everyday materials (iron, copper, precious metals, 10 or so mundane kinds of stone), it would give some point of reference to our own, unique materials.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 03:33:19 pm
Then we have all the other more, obscure rocks replaced by our unique ones.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on September 17, 2013, 03:38:55 pm
People had names for all kinds of rock well into antiquity. Most of the rock names in DF existed well before modern science. For our game, I mean staple stones like Sandstone, Marble, Granite, Basalt, Slate, and Limestone. The kind of rocks commonly used by people in any era. Perhaps we can even have white AND black marble.
Then we have all the other more, obscure rocks replaced by our unique ones.
Oh, okay. I thought you meant the annoying science ones. Staple stones are cool.
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 03:53:49 pm
Post by: kero42 on September 17, 2013, 04:12:21 pm
How do water grubs work exactly? If milked, water goes into a bucket. However, nobody will use this bucket to fill a pond (instead dumping it out at the workshop and going to get other water) and as far as I can tell nobody drinks out of it either, though I have not had a test without an external water source yet. The bucket also contains only a single unit of "water" instead of the usual "water(10)". How am I supposed to use the water for drinking?
I was wondering this too. I have been embarking with water (the extract) barrels because I didn't want to use tarnish vodka (plus,despite the idea of tarnish stalks being cheap but rather shit in quality, they're rather expensive). But my people seem to prefer drinking out of the rivers instead. Also while I'm asking item related questions, I once accidently removed my formic luminum pickaxes, only to find I couldn't add them back again in the (n)ew screen, has this happend to anyone else, or is it just me? Finally, where do we get Honey dew from and what do we use it for?
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 17, 2013, 05:17:39 pm
The water grub water not being used is odd. The quantity is probably important for its usage, I'd think. I give people full permission to fiddle around with the water grub raws to make it work as intended; I have no time for experimentation right now :(
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 17, 2013, 06:08:41 pm
Code: [Select][CDI:MATERIAL:ETHER_ZTG:UNDIRECTED_VAPOR]
Where's ETHER_ZTG? If it's an INORGANIC, it needs that.
EDIT: It is. Bugfixing, unless there are complaints.
What are you wanting to bugfix?
...ZTG made a reaction allowing it to be made into those.
IT DOESN"T USE AERESIUM SPECIFICALLY AS A MATERIAL! IT JUST USES ANY METAL BAR!
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 06:10:19 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 17, 2013, 06:23:40 pm
What ZTG did specifically that made him mad was adding an attack multiplier vs spirits to Aeresium.
Became a moot point after it didn't work.
Post by: Putnam on September 17, 2013, 06:38:16 pm
Code: [Select][CDI:MATERIAL:ETHER_ZTG:UNDIRECTED_VAPOR]
Where's ETHER_ZTG? If it's an INORGANIC, it needs that.
EDIT: It is. Bugfixing, unless there are complaints.
What are you wanting to bugfix?...ZTG made a reaction allowing it to be made into those.
IT DOESN"T USE AERESIUM SPECIFICALLY AS A MATERIAL! IT JUST USES ANY METAL BAR!
It says MATERIAL:ETHER_ZTG instead of MATERIAL:INORGANIC:ETHER_ZTG.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 17, 2013, 06:40:22 pm
It says MATERIAL:ETHER_ZTG instead of MATERIAL:INORGANIC:ETHER_ZTG.
Okay, you can do that.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 07:37:49 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 17, 2013, 07:46:22 pm
So... which wiki would be best for posting my guide to creature and syndrome classification?
I would say to go with the Scratchwiki one. It is more complete than the others.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 07:54:14 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 17, 2013, 08:07:32 pm
This one? http://dfscratch.shoutwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page
Yes.
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 08:12:13 pm
Edit: Didn't fix it.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 08:27:00 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 17, 2013, 08:29:50 pm
/me suddenly realizes every word he add will have to have 3 corresponding translations
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 08:32:16 pm
Here's an idea. Every time you want to use a world in the game but can't find it, POST IT HERE. I'll start:
-New, Old
-Haven
-Harbor
-North, South, East, West
-Fire
-Ice
-Wind
-Tree (have appletree, but not tree)?
-Shovel, Pick, Axe
-Weapon
Post by: Vgray on September 17, 2013, 08:40:46 pm
Post by: Poldon on September 17, 2013, 08:51:53 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 08:56:00 pm
Why do Halflings have to use English words at all?
Here's how language in DF works:
The vocabulary words that the game uses are all defined in a great big txt file, in English. Each "language" is a collection of translations for those English words, for instance [T_WORD:DAGGER:urist]. Every language must have a translation for every word in the basic vocabulary, or else you get names that include " " because the game generates names based on the basic vocabulary, and displays the translation of it.
Our basic vocabulary was originally created under the mistaken assumption that each language could have it's own "words.txt" file, so it began as an "ABC's for Halflings dictionary". Then many more words were added after this was corrected. But we're still missing many needed words, thus all languages are somewhat "hobbit-flavored" because of the basic vocabulary the translations are based on.
Post by: Putnam on September 17, 2013, 08:58:11 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 09:01:23 pm
Anyway, no language has a word for "tree", but everyone, even bloodthirsty swamp lizards, has a word for "appletree". In fact, carnivorous swamp lizards have a word for "tea" but not for "blood" or "meat"
Post by: Putnam on September 17, 2013, 09:03:28 pm
word.
I worded the wrong word.
Anyway, I found this in STL's insects file:
Code: [Select]
[MILKABLE:WATER:9600]Should be WATER:NONE. Odd amount of malformed material tokens, actually.
Post by: Vgray on September 17, 2013, 09:08:29 pm
But is the Halfling word for "Hill", "Hill"?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 09:38:25 pm
By contrast, the Formic word for hill is "khabarim"
Post by: Putnam on September 17, 2013, 09:42:42 pm
Code: [Select]
reaction_hivestuff_putnam
[OBJECT:REACTION]
[REACTION:CHURN_BUTTER_PUTNAM]
[NAME:churn butter from milk]
[BUILDING:KITCHEN:CUSTOM_B]
[REAGENT:milk:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][HAS_MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:BUTTER_MAT][MIN_DIMENSION:150]
[REAGENT:container:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][CONTAINS:milk][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[PRODUCT:100:5:GLOB:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:milk:BUTTER_MAT]
[SKILL:COOK]
[REACTION:MAKE_CHEESE_PUTNAM]
[NAME:make cheese from milk]
[BUILDING:KITCHEN:CUSTOM_C]
[REAGENT:milk:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][HAS_MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CHEESE_MAT][MIN_DIMENSION:150]
[REAGENT:container:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][CONTAINS:milk][PRESERVE_REAGENT][DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
[PRODUCT:100:5:CHEESE:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:milk:CHEESE_MAT]
[SKILL:CHEESEMAKING]
I've made these reactions for a hive creature I've also made and now I need somewhere to put them. Whose playable entities can have these?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 09:47:49 pm
We don't actually have any creatures that lactate at the moment. Some can be "milked", yes, but in much the same way as one would milk a snake. None of them actually produce milk or even something analogous to it. We have a milk template, but not milk creatures.
This is something you could remedy ;)
Post by: Putnam on September 17, 2013, 09:49:12 pm
Hehe, I guess I did forget to post that:
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:MYOMORPH_PUTNAM]
[NAME:myomorph:myomorphs:myomorph]
[CASTE_NAME:myomorph:myomorphs:myomorph]
[DESCRIPTION:A very small creature that lives in hives and stockpiles milk.]
[CREATURE_TILE:250][COLOR:6:0:0]
[VERMIN_SOIL_COLONY][FREQUENCY:100]
[VERMIN_NOTRAP]
[NOFEAR][NOEXERT][NO_DRINK][NO_EAT][NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_FEVERS][NO_GENDER][NO_SLEEP][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NOBONES][NOBREATHE][NOEMOTION][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOPAIN][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NOSMELLYROT][NOSTUCKINS][NOSTUN][NOT_BUTCHERABLE][NOT_LIVING][NOBONES]
[ARTIFICIAL_HIVEABLE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:MILK:SOIL_TEMPLATE_LKR] odd choice of template, right? But material properties don't matter for a liquid, and this template was the only one with nothing but material info
[STATE_COLOR:ALL:WHITE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:SOLID:frozen myomorph milk]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:gaseous myomorph milk]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:POWDER:powdered myomorph milk] shh
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:myomorph milk]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:10180]
[MELTING_POINT:10000]
[SPEC_HEAT:3930]
[EDIBLE_RAW]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[ROTS]
[GENERATES_MIASMA]
[ALCOHOL_CREATURE]
[MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:BUTTER_MAT:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BUTTER]
[MATERIAL_REACTION_PRODUCT:CHEESE_MAT:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:CHEESE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:BUTTER:SOIL_TEMPLATE_LKR]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL:WHITE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:myomorph butter]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:gaseous myomorph butter]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:melted myomorph butter]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:10300]
[MELTING_POINT:10070]
[SPEC_HEAT:3930]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[ROTS]
[STOCKPILE_GLOB_SOLID]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:CHEESE:SOIL_TEMPLATE_LKR]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL:WHITE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:SOLID:myomorph cheese]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:gaseous myomorph cheese]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:melted myomorph cheese]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:10200]
[MELTING_POINT:10080]
[SPEC_HEAT:3930]
[EDIBLE_RAW]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[ROTS]
[GENERATES_MIASMA]
[CHEESE_CREATURE]
[HIVE_PRODUCT:5:33600:DRINK:NONE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:MILK]
[FLIER]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:250:500]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:100:200]
[SMALL_REMAINS]
[PETVALUE:1]
[PETVALUE_DIVISOR:1000]
[SPEED:2900]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:1]
[BODY:SPIRIT_ZTG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_MATERIALS_ZTG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SPIRIT_TISSUES_ZTG]
[PREFSTRING:cuteness]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ETHEREAL][CREATURE_CLASS:INCORPOREAL]
[HOMEOTHERM:10000]
[BIOME:ANY_TEMPERATE]I should probably add milk, butter and cheese templates based on what I have here.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 10:12:05 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 17, 2013, 11:09:29 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 17, 2013, 11:58:27 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 18, 2013, 12:19:09 am
Why do Halflings have to use English words at all?
Here's how language in DF works:
The vocabulary words that the game uses are all defined in a great big txt file, in English. Each "language" is a collection of translations for those English words, for instance [T_WORD:DAGGER:urist]. Every language must have a translation for every word in the basic vocabulary, or else you get names that include " " because the game generates names based on the basic vocabulary, and displays the translation of it.
Our basic vocabulary was originally created under the mistaken assumption that each language could have it's own "words.txt" file, so it began as an "ABC's for Halflings dictionary". Then many more words were added after this was corrected. But we're still missing many needed words, thus all languages are somewhat "hobbit-flavored" because of the basic vocabulary the translations are based on.
Slight correction. The assumption was that everyone would add needed words as they go.
I still support that. But remember we established words are a MAJOR source of lag and the impoverished vocab is what makes Scratch go faster to a surprising extent (try plugging in the normal words and feel the pain if you're used to fast) and keeps it faster even creatures being equal :). That's why I myself didn't want my large vocabulary file in myself. So while I realize the original words aren't efficiently chosen, as I wasn't aware of this then.
Please add words that you really want, but try to avoid word bloat and adding ones you don't really want but get a feeling of "maybe this should be there", okay? Keep small.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 18, 2013, 01:09:18 am
Priorities: we need more adjectives, and we need each word that is a Sphere title.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 18, 2013, 02:34:00 am
So we have chosen to leave, and find a new home. Our parents remain, along with some of our siblings and cousins, to try and continue the old ways, but we need a safer place for our children. They wish us luck, though. I have decided we shall go to the ocean's edge, to live off its bounty, and to follow the coast North until it becomes too cold for the insects. It might be unknown to us, but anything must be better than this.
So it was that the Bright Expedition set out from their homeland, Mightymountain, in the Year of the Pumpkin 108...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Baekin on September 18, 2013, 04:08:57 am
I also changed the ordering of the tags, in case syntax is important. The format used in vanilla seems to be Name stuff, Site, Land_Holder, Land_Name (not sure this is definitely required, but it is in all vanilla entries I could find for land holders. I suspect if it is missing you would at least get a message that "you have now become a ." Also, it was set to be appointed by MONARCH, but formics have no such office, but rather a QUEEN. I also removed the number tag, because as far as I can see, Land_Holders usually do not have it.
Lastly I removed the CONQUERED_SITE tag. This is the one I am fairly certain actually hosed it. I am not sure if it is because it can't be set to both, or because CONQUERED_SITE was interrupting the syntax and it would work if placed elsewhere. Anyway... someone feel free to look at what I did, and either use it, if starting with a regent is indeed unintended or just fix only the minimum that needs fixing, as I am in no means sure that all of this is needed to make it work.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 18, 2013, 04:29:59 am
Post by: Baekin on September 18, 2013, 05:09:50 am
That theoretically should be handled by this line further up in the entity:
[LAND_HOLDER_TRIGGER:1:50:10000:100000] Trigger for a Regent to be appointed, to govern in the Queen's name.
So it's already specified by this tag that he should only show up after you have 50 formics, 10,000 exported wealth and 100,000 fortress value.
Why it doesn't work, I don't know. In that respect STL's original raws are the same as vanilla raws.
edit: I am now quite certain it was the CONQUERED_SITE tag. A version which changes nothing except the typo (QUEEN instead of MONARCH) and removing CONQUERED_SITE now starts with no regent.
This minimally modified version as compared to STL's original raw is below. This is from entity_STL:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 18, 2013, 01:00:05 pm
Spoiler: story (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on September 18, 2013, 02:19:14 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 18, 2013, 06:12:38 pm
Spoiler: story (click to show/hide)
Some thing's I've noticed:
-Many plants with custom reactions don't yield seeds from those reactions, so to make them edible and replant you have to buy more seeds from the caravan.
-The only edible parts of an animal are the muscles. We need to add [MEAT] to the organ and brain material templates, so much of the flesh is going to waste...
Post by: Vgray on September 18, 2013, 06:18:21 pm
Post by: Poldon on September 18, 2013, 06:54:24 pm
Some thing's I've noticed:
-Many plants with custom reactions don't yield seeds from those reactions, so to make them edible and replant you have to buy more seeds from the caravan.
-The only edible parts of an animal are the muscles. We need to add [MEAT] to the organ and brain material templates, so much of the flesh is going to waste...
This explains the lack of seeds when I played, I noticed that I was unable to maintain any sort of seed stockpile when growing pumpkins and coral fungi. This does need to be fixed.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 18, 2013, 08:38:59 pm
Spoiler: More Story (click to show/hide)
Post by: Poldon on September 18, 2013, 10:07:25 pm
Edit: Man, pack beetle caravans move freaking fast. Also I just noticed Coal Blocks in the cart. I am already highly suspicious of these now.
Edit2: Two carts arrived in quick succession, each with one "coal block". I recall that both types are named identically, so I wondered whether either would actually blow up. First one unloaded fine, the second exploded. I'm pretty certain that the explosive coal is the culprit, however.
Edit3: In order to be completely sure, I have changed the doom coal's in-game name to "coaldoom" and will watch for syndromes on soldiers stationed nearby. Also I'm going to attempt to go frame by frame and see if I can see it ignite.
Edit4: A caravan arrived without any coal at all and nothing blew up. I did notice a couple of very strange items, however:
Various kinds of wood gems
Prepared chitin chain robe
I'm guessing that these should not be possible.
Post by: Baekin on September 18, 2013, 11:25:03 pm
Post by: Poldon on September 18, 2013, 11:42:42 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 18, 2013, 11:45:13 pm
Checking the most recent upload, it does have [SPECIAL]
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 19, 2013, 04:57:49 am
Wood gems seem odd, but the chitin chain robe is actually less so. Prepared chitin is treated as a metal by the game, and thus a valid choice for the game to produce metal items from, including the chain robe. At least I think.
Wood gems are an oddity, but prepared chitin chain robes are intended, in the sense that prepared chitin is a metal. Actually, I've only ever seen them use it for weaponry, so this is a step in the right direction :)
Post by: Poldon on September 19, 2013, 09:09:59 am
Wood gems seem odd, but the chitin chain robe is actually less so. Prepared chitin is treated as a metal by the game, and thus a valid choice for the game to produce metal items from, including the chain robe. At least I think.
Wood gems are an oddity, but prepared chitin chain robes are intended, in the sense that prepared chitin is a metal. Actually, I've only ever seen them use it for weaponry, so this is a step in the right direction :)
Okay, I was assuming "prepared chitin" was somehow chitin that had been prepared as food and then after that turned into a chain robe. Seemed a bit odd to me.
Also I do see the special tag. Going to test a bit more this morning to see if I can determine whether it's still showing up or what's happening.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 19, 2013, 11:50:12 am
Post by: laularukyrumo on September 19, 2013, 12:47:09 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 19, 2013, 01:36:28 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 19, 2013, 02:06:20 pm
Halflings don't have reactions to work chitin, nor should have. Organs are EDIBLE_COOKED (as makes sense for most species, considering it is the template used for intestines), does that not work? If so, any permission to fix so that they actually are edible cooked (but not raw) is of course given as that's the intention.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 19, 2013, 02:13:20 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 19, 2013, 02:20:18 pm
And it's not just the template used for intestines, it's used for ALL organs, having been consolidated into a singe "organs," so giving ORGAN_TISSUE the properties of intestines alone is a bad idea.
Post by: Halfling on September 19, 2013, 02:29:34 pm
I left out meat because it's not meat - but didn't think that would lead it to being refuse. And I was unaware that one needs [MEAT] for this to work, so that should be added next bugfix. :P
Apple tree issues, part II:
Code: [Select]
reaction_kopout
[OBJECT:REACTION]
[REACTION:PREPARE_APPLE_TREES_KPT]
[NAME:prepare apple trees]
[BUILDING:LUMBERYARD:CUSTOM_A]#a for apple
[AUTOMATIC]
[SKILL:CARPENTRY]
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:LOGS:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:STRUCTURAL] <--------------------------
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_WOOD_KPT:APPLE_WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:2:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]
[PRODUCT:50:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]
[PRODUCT:25:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]The origin of this bug is unknown. I know it used to work previously and this must therefore be an untracked change. Fix: marked line should read
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:LOGS:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:RAW_APPLE_TREE]
Post by: Putnam on September 19, 2013, 02:40:33 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 19, 2013, 02:48:07 pm
Kopout's original post of the reaction read
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:LOGS:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:RAW_APPLE_TREE]
so someone must have changed it in an effort to fix the problem at some point, only to make it worse as apple tree structure is not actually raw apple tree.
Post by: Putnam on September 19, 2013, 02:55:54 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 19, 2013, 03:00:47 pm
The anonymously attempted fix would have worked if
a) It had not used the vanilla token "STRUCTURAL" when referring to plant STRUCTURE in this case
b) the apple tree were designed more sensibly
but considering the trouble we've had with this, I say just fix the reaction.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 19, 2013, 03:11:40 pm
eating the brain raw should give you kuru, and so on.
Eating a human brain should give you kuru. People eat the brains of other animals all the time to no ill effect, the brain being rich in nutrients. It's cannibalism that builds up prions in the system, which is why prion diseases come mainly from the brains of humans (cannibal tribes) and cattle (factory farms feed the refuse parts of dead cows back to the living).
In European cooking, intestines are most often used as the skin of sausages. Maybe we should have sausage reaction requiring organs?
Post by: Halfling on September 19, 2013, 03:23:01 pm
But I guess you would say it should give you painful dementia rather than kuru. And while the real rate is one in a million, in this mod's logic it should be always :P
Post by: WillowLuman on September 19, 2013, 03:42:55 pm
We're used to the "choice cuts" being the only considered meat in our modern society, all haunches and sidemeat and thighs. In a simple agrarian society, though, people would use as much as the animal as they could in various ways (even the intestines are used, as sausage skin). The brain (rich in fat and vitamins) and the tongue (very tender) are delicacies in traditional rural English farms, and without large factory farms feeding the dead back to the living (because Americans think brains are icky), livestock didn't build up prions in their population back then.
Since most of the livestock here are invertebrates, eating the brain should really be no problem at all.
Post by: Halfling on September 19, 2013, 03:52:22 pm
New animals could have any transmissible diseases you want to imagine though.
Post by: Dorsidwarf on September 19, 2013, 03:57:44 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 19, 2013, 04:13:48 pm
I think I've finally gotten the beast trained, so we can let it out of its cage without it wandering off.
January 1st, 110
We've been here for an entire year now. It's been hard work, and we've gone without many things, but we've made it. Star made a statue to commemorate the occasion, which I've had installed in my office. It's rather nice.
Our home is cozy and warm, though a bit bare. This year I hope to get everyone their own rooms, to make people happier, and to build a roof over our workshops. Everyone else feels hopeful too, ecstatic even! Whelp put together a party to celebrate that we've made it this far.
January 23rd, 110
Leash Teastone, one of our former refugees, gave birth to triplets today! Her husband and her are blessed with the boys Past, Halfwit, and Chief. This place has become a new homeland now; there are hobbits whose land of birth is here, not back at our old home. Truly we have succeeded!
February 6th, 110
A massive group of Refugees arrived today, fully doubling our number once more! It seems the new beds won't be going to personal rooms after all, as the main bedroom will need more. I wish more of them knew how to dig, or thought to bring more shovels.
February 26th, 110
Trees! Trees have grown! We could not believe our eyes, we had almost lost hope. Of course we had to cut them down immediately, so badly do we need more wood, but they seem to be growing quickly.
March 11th, 110
They're back. We're currently building some walls on the surface, and there they are, the wild hounds. We keep throwing rocks, and we've badly wounded one of them, but they're taking far too long to go away. It's time to make some arrows.
March 13th, 100
The Elves and their Lords have returned, though I thought we had angered them. Perhaps we shall have better luck this year. And with them, our own merchants cannot be far behind. Well, good thing we have an amazing stonecrafter...
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 19, 2013, 06:35:36 pm
I have no problem with your assessment of prion disease ecology. Most of them aren't transmissible to humans (afaik? who has eaten a cat or mink brain in a time when such a thing as diagnostics exist?).
To the extent of my knowledge, prions are misfolded proteins that cause other proteins to misfold into more prions. They're not species-specific in the same way as viruses and bacteria; it's kind of like a biological nanobot plague, sorta. A prion gets in and starts catalyzing the folding of healthy proteins into more prions, regardless of the animal, which is why humans can get a variant of CJD from infected cow tissue and such. Kuru spreads because you've basically just swallowed a poison pill by eating the infected victim's brains - and nothing I've read anywhere has said anything about a link between a relationship between the victim and his/her eater and prions, and the same goes for prions being made by digestive processes, HugoLuman, so I'm a bit curious where you got that from.
Also @Hugo, I find your blame of factory farms amusing :) Scrapie, a very similar prion-caused disease in sheep, has been known since the 1700s, and tests have shown that environmental contamination through prion-containing dirt occurs. While factory farming animals and feeding them each other will definitely not help keep them healthy, they didn't cause the problem, and agrarian societies suffered the same issues with their livestock.
And I'm almost certain that if a giant bug ate another giant bug that was suffering from a prion disease, the eating bug would probably be infected as well. They don't have spines - they do have brains and other nervous systems that would be affected by and carry the infectious prions.
And on a completely unrelated note, your story reports are great Hugo!
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 19, 2013, 06:52:11 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 19, 2013, 08:15:04 pm
Prions don't permeate the entire body and turn it into some kind of prion mush, they are misfolded proteins that only affect proteins of the same type. A misfolded protein bumps into a correctly folded protein of the same kind and causes it to become misfolded as well, and they aggregate into clumps, forming holes in the tissue around them. For some reason, the proteins which seem to become misfolded are those involved in the nervous system. Nerves permeate most of the body, so any tissue can contain Prions, but they become most concentrated in the spinal cord and brain.
Proteins become misfolded in the first place from genetic mutation, as proteins are what DNA affects directly. Species, and even individuals have different encoding for their proteins, so it is more likely to be transmissible between related individuals. They can "mutate" while inside the endoplasmic reticulum and golgi aparatus of cells, as these are where proteins are created and folded, thus creating prions that can affect other nervous proteins. They can then spread throughout a population after waste or dead tissue has decomposed into the soil, or from contact with discarded tissue, but ingestion of meat is a more reliable method. Thus, cannibalistic practices magnify transmission but are not the only way.
Invertebrate neural proteins are too different for vertebrate prions to destablize, and the mutations which cause prions aren't known in them.
Post by: Putnam on September 19, 2013, 08:17:46 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 19, 2013, 09:36:56 pm
I don't think we should include Prions, because people want to make it "Eat brain = instant grey goo scenario," which it really, REALLY isn't.
It's a different world, not this one. Obviously, since we have such things as monkeys and hominids, and few land-dwelling squid like this one doesn't now. It can have as many misfolded prions as it wants. Hell, it can have a misfolded protein that builds up in all tissues and is similarly infectious. But remember, you don't need to just say no because people may think differently, you can negotiate with the people about whether something's reasonable. I for one can say for my part it was thrown as more what you would call half of a joke in a subordinate clause as I did not actually expect prions to go in anytime soon and with the general deadliness. :P
Speaking of, if nobody wants to add prions then let's not be too concerned about their implications. I would assume that viruses could be modded first if there's one with fascination for transmissible diseases here.
Post by: Gnorm on September 19, 2013, 09:37:36 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 20, 2013, 12:49:14 am
@Halfling: Viruses are way more interesting than Prions, anyway. They can do much more, including directly mess with the DNA of living cells. Not to mention Prions are less scary in a world of invertebrates, too, because arthropod nervous systems are less complex (except the brain) and all invertebrate nervous systems are far less centralized than vertebrate ones. The brains of Cephalopods, for instance, are seperated into 8 segments located at the base of the arms. many insects have an "Hourglass" brain, with a large segment behind each compound eye and a third, smaller segment in the middle. Most arthropod body motion is controlled by dual nodes in each segment of the body.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 20, 2013, 07:23:42 pm
The trading went much better this year. With Swamp's crafts, we managed to purchase all the wood from the Elves and several water grubs from our own kind, though we could not afford their anvils. Additionally, the Elves, contrary to their reputation, immediately bum-rushed the feral hounds harassing our builders. Together, we killed 4 of them and caged one, which we shall also eat. Now we can get back to work on building some surface shelters.
I hope that with these grubs, we shall soon no longer have a thirst problem.
April 10th, 110
That Panserblekk of ours has multiplied! A female she must be, since she gave birth to twins today. Well, what a stroke of luck! If we wean the babes ourselves, we might get these beasts properly domesticated!
April 28th, 110
Here comes another pack of feral dogs. I now know what to think of them: food. Our aim is true, our rocks are hard, and they're the only animal we get often that isn't covered in armor. I've finally armed our hunters, now they shall deal with these pests.
May 16th, 110
Sadly, it seems this place is too much for our Aphidadas, after all. They are starving, the ground cover does not grow back quickly enough to feed them. One nymph has dropped dead already. I'm afraid we shall have to butcher the lot. They served us well, even saved our lives, but we must do the humane thing.
May 28th, 100
This season's arrivals came today, 11 in total. Them and the many children we've had lately bring our total up to 65. A thriving, small village we've got here, now. What good fortune! My job as mayor is getting complicated and busy now, but I don't mind.
June 13th, 100
Goodness! Another caravan from the Elves? Well, we must really have done better!
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 20, 2013, 08:50:52 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
They will be missed.
Post by: Putnam on September 20, 2013, 10:01:02 pm
Code: [Select]
[SHAPE:SHAPE_TESSERACT_PUTNAM]
[NAME:tesseract:tesseracts]
[ADJ:entirely unseemly]
[ADJ:disgusting]
[ADJ:writhing]
[ADJ:rotating]
[ADJ:calming]
[ADJ:slithering]
[ADJ:quite annoying]
[TILE:35]I'm confused by my motives in making this.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 20, 2013, 10:28:09 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 21, 2013, 02:55:19 am
Post by: Putnam on September 21, 2013, 03:00:53 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 21, 2013, 03:19:56 am
Post by: Halfling on September 21, 2013, 04:30:15 am
In short, I assumed PROGRESS_TRIGGERs default to something reasonable, because you get caravans of dwarves in vanilla. They don't. Please add:
Halfling entity:
Code: [Select]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POPULATION:1]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POP_SIEGE:3](Halfling traders visit any places relatively soon, but halflings should not kill you in fortress mode as they only attack large fortresses of the enemy.)Troll entity:
Code: [Select]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE:2]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE_SIEGE:2]
(Trolls visit places that they learn are wealthy, and may attempt to take that wealth for themselves. They're too primitive and tribal to listen to rumors from faraway lands or participate in cooperative intelligence, so they'll only learn about your forest cutting antics as it becomes common knowledge.)The explanation here is they're not really, as a group, that interested in protecting the forests against all threats, although they engage in hunting there and forests are important in their religion. That would require a kind of goal-based organization and a type of thinking that's not based on immediate personal or small group level gain. Rather they're looking for any good excuse to get collectively mad and go to war with you and/or demand ransom, once they learn that you have something they want like anything shiny.
An alternative explanation is that most trolls really are indifferent to any collective effort, including the nominal chief, so they may kill you and make personal deals but won't go to war for no reason; the shamans, who only have time to visit wealthier settlements, who negotiate trees with you, are the only ones who really care about whether you cut trees, and once you make them mad, their religious influence can persuade trolls and allies to join forces against you.
These lines can be added to your save raws without regenerating the world in order to trigger the proper behavior for the existing save.
Post by: Putnam on September 21, 2013, 01:43:17 pm
Post by: Xieg on September 21, 2013, 02:14:52 pm
And panserblekks are brutal, but apparently grazers. My solution was to train every single one I have for war then setup a bunch of pastures on the surface. Other than that they are very efficient war machines.
Oooh, and while I'm here put me in for a modding turn at some point in the future. Have finally started to poke around the raws and it all actually makes some kind of sense to me. Have some ideas that could be fun, in the traditional DF sense anyway.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on September 21, 2013, 03:10:06 pm
Also, sorry about the progress triggers mess, really. Thanks for adding the fix Putnam, and any raws-savvy playtesters - please feel free to incorporate it too, it should work straight away if just added to save raws (entity files).
Is adding you to the end of the turns list fine?
Post by: Dorsidwarf on September 21, 2013, 03:28:54 pm
It's engraved into a wall and visibly 4D, is the implication.
That tesseract needs a prefstring: insanity if you ask me.
Post by: Halfling on September 21, 2013, 03:50:47 pm
On a balance note, regular creatures will probably kill you a lot more though. We''ve not had one fort die to a megabeast yet. :P
Post by: Putnam on September 21, 2013, 03:55:24 pm
Ohoho!
I also came up with a new swamp grass. Since all the other grass is moss, I figure that grass itself took a different path:
Code: [Select]
plant_putnam
[OBJECT:PLANT]
[PLANT:INTELLIGENT_GRASS_PUTNAM]
[ALL_NAMES:creeping grass]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[BASIC_MAT:LOCAL_PLANT_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[GRASS]
[GRASS_TILES:'.':',':';':'`']
[GRASS_COLORS:2:0:0:2:0:0:7:0:0:0:0:1]
[WET]
[DRY]
[BIOME:ANY_WETLAND]Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:INTELLIGENT_GRASS_CREATURE_PUTNAM]
[NAME:creeping grass growth:creeping grass growths:creeping grass]
[CASTE_NAME:creeping grass growth:creeping grass growths:creeping grass]
[DESCRIPTION:A moving growth of the creeping grass underneath. It moves to absorb any that tread upon the grass. Draining it of water should force it to stop moving.]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:ORGANIC][CREATURE_CLASS:PLANT][CREATURE_CLASS:PLANT_LAND][CREATURE_CLASS:PLANT_SWAMP]
[BIOME:ANY_WETLAND]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:5000:10000]
[BLOOD:WATER:NONE]
[CREATURE_TILE:'o'][CASTE_TILE:'o']
[COLOR:2:0:0]
[NO_WINTER][NO_AUTUMN]
[NO_DIZZINESS][NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DRINK][NO_EAT][NO_FEVERS][NO_GENDER][NO_PHYS_ATT_GAIN][NO_PHYS_ATT_RUST][NO_SLEEP][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NOBONES]
[NOBREATHE][NOEMOTION][NOEXERT][NOFEAR][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOPAIN][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NOTHOUGHT][NOSTUN][NOT_BUTCHERABLE][NOT_LIVING][PARALYZEIMMUNE]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:STRENGTH:600:600:600:600:600:600:600]
[PHYS_ATT_RANGE:AGILITY:1000:1000:1000:1000:1000:1000:1000]
[SPEED:2500]
[UBIQUITOUS]
[PREFSTRING:grassy nature]
[BODY:TREELORD]
[BODYGLOSS:INTELLIGENT_GRASS_GLOSS_PUTNAM]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[EDIBLE_RAW]
[EDIBLE_COOKED]
[EDIBLE_VERMIN]
[TISSUE:STRUCTURE]
[TISSUE_NAME:grass:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:STRUCTURE]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:30]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:STRANDS]
[MUSCULAR]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:STRUCTURE]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:60000]
[FANCIFUL]
[BONECARN]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:1]
[DIURNAL]
[CURIOUSBEAST_EATER]
[CURIOUSBEAST_GUZZLER]
[ITEMCORPSE:PLANT:NONE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:STRUCTURE]Post by: Dorsidwarf on September 21, 2013, 04:03:16 pm
That is evil.
Post by: Halfling on September 21, 2013, 04:19:27 pm
[ITEMCORPSE:PLANT:NONE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:STRUCTURE]
What does this line do in practice? Will it leave an edible "creeping grass growth plant" when killed?
Post by: Putnam on September 21, 2013, 04:20:49 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 21, 2013, 05:49:38 pm
1. In adventurer mode, despite them being [INTELLIGENT], they automatically lose their skills as soon as the game begins.
2. Despite being allowed certain weapons in their entity file, they will only ever spawn with lances.
Here are the raws for reference:
Creature:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Entity:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Items:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 21, 2013, 06:03:30 pm
And then as I read further and saw you got an Oculentibus I chuckled. You'll probably need the both of them to repopulate if that gets loose(r than it already is). :)
Post by: Xieg on September 21, 2013, 06:28:25 pm
@StLeibowitz - Yeah two queens. I thought it odd, but once they start breeding I can do stupid things and not worry too much about population. And that Oculentibus already has a small statue garden surrounding it from people getting too close. Have to keep an eye on it and forbid statues as they pop into existence.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 21, 2013, 07:04:13 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 21, 2013, 07:04:29 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 21, 2013, 07:10:42 pm
The whole moss thing started because we began with just one grass, a generic "moss" that covered everywhere, cavern and surface. Now we have long fields of "Tall grass" and "Tall dry grass", with some nifty "snow fern", so it's not as if moss has filled entirely the grass niche in this world, but some kind of all-devouring swamp grass intelligence is awesome.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 21, 2013, 07:32:12 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 21, 2013, 07:39:31 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 21, 2013, 07:41:16 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 21, 2013, 07:42:22 pm
and speeking of witch, have a creature file.
Code: [Select]
Little Ones
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:LITTLE ONE]
[NAME:little one:little ones:littles]
[CASTE_NAME:little one:little ones:littles]
[DESCRIPTION: A race of verry small, harry mountan men. They pefer not to fight, but will if provoked. The live in small dougouts doug into the hillside or halfway berried into the chost lines and are only found in cold reagons.]
[CREATURE_TITLE: '*'][COLOR:152:118:84]
[CREATURE_SOLDIER_TILE:'#']
[INTELLIGENT]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:125:500]
[FREQUENCY: 40]
[UBIQITOUS]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:50]
[BIOME:MOUNTAN:TUNDRA:TAIGA]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:4]
[BENGIN]
[CANOPENDOORS]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_HEAD_HAIR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_SKIN_COLOR_HLG]
[HAS_NERVES]
[CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[BODY_SIZE:15000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:1500]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:7500]
[BODY_SIZE:20:0:15000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[MAXAGE:175:230]
[BABY:1]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:tiny one:teeny ones:teenies]
[BABY_NAME:tiny one:teeny ones:teenies]
[CHILD:14]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:small one:small ones:smalls]
[CAVE_ADAPT]
[DIURNAL]
[PROFESSION_NAME:CROSSBOWMAN:sling one:sling ones]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_CROSSBOWMAN:sling master:sling masters]
[PROFESSION_NAME:SPEARMAN:staff one:staff ones]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_SPEARMAN:staff master:staff masters]
[PROFESSION_NAME:WRESTLER:brawler:brawlers]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_WRESTLER:master brawler:master brawlers]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2000]
[MANNERISM__POSTURE]
[EQUIPS]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BEARD_COLOR_LITTLE]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BEARD_LITTLE]
Post by: WillowLuman on September 21, 2013, 07:48:40 pm
Wow, those gnomes are tiny. I like that they're nomadic and simple but still have firearms.
Interestingly enough, there is an IRL tribal people who use firearms as traditional weapons, since the 1400's. Arquebuses, made from things they get from hunting and scavenging (bambo, lashed together with various fibers). They keep eagles for hunting and use their guano + plant starch to make the powder (more like a gel), and use stone balls for ammunition.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c9/Tibetan_Soldier_at_Target_Practise.jpg)
Post by: Aseaheru on September 21, 2013, 07:54:22 pm
I got an entity thing for my people now... want it?
Post by: Aseaheru on September 21, 2013, 08:20:12 pm
Code: [Select]
Little Ones
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:LITTLE ONE]
[NAME:little one:little ones:littles]
[CASTE_NAME:little one:little ones:littles]
[DESCRIPTION: A race of verry small, harry mountan men. They pefer not to fight, but will if provoked. The live in small dougouts doug into the hillside or halfway berried into the chost lines and are only found in cold reagons.]
[CREATURE_TITLE: '*'][COLOR:152:118:84]
[CREATURE_SOLDIER_TILE:'#']
[INTELLIGENT]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:125:500]
[FREQUENCY: 40]
[UBIQITOUS]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:1:50]
[BIOME:MOUNTAN:TUNDRA:TAIGA]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:4]
[BENGIN]
[CANOPENDOORS]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_HEAD_HAIR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_SKIN_COLOR_HLG]
[HAS_NERVES]
[CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[BODY_SIZE:15000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:1500]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:7500]
[BODY_SIZE:20:0:15000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[MAXAGE:175:230]
[BABY:1]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:tiny one:teeny ones:teenies]
[BABY_NAME:tiny one:teeny ones:teenies]
[CHILD:14]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:small one:small ones:smalls]
[CAVE_ADAPT]
[DIURNAL]
[PROFESSION_NAME:CROSSBOWMAN:sling one:sling ones]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_CROSSBOWMAN:sling master:sling masters]
[PROFESSION_NAME:SPEARMAN:staff one:staff ones]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_SPEARMAN:staff master:staff masters]
[PROFESSION_NAME:WRESTLER:brawler:brawlers]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_WRESTLER:master brawler:master brawlers]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2000]
[MANNERISM__POSTURE]
[EQUIPS]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BEARD_COLOR_LITTLE]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BEARD_LITTLE]
[TENDONS]
[SPOUSE_CONVERSION_TARGET]
[CAN_LEARN]
[CAN_SPEAK]
[MUNDANE]Code: [Select]
entity_littleones_aseaheru
[OBJECT:ENTITY]
[ENTITY:LITTLE_ONES]
[LAYER_LINKED]
[CREATURE:LITTLE ONE]
[WEAPON:SLING]
[AMMO:STONE_LITTLE]
[ARMOR:DRESS_SHIRT_HLG:COMMON]
[TOOL:PIPE_SMOKING_HLG]
[INDOOR_WOOD]
[USE_CAVE_ANIMALS]
[USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS]
[EQUIPMENT_IMPROVEMENTS]
[FRIENDLY_COLOR:1:0:1]
[MAX_STARTING_CIV_NUMBER:25]
[MAX_POP_NUMBER:500]
[MAX_SITE_POP_NUMBER:125]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:JUSTIFIED_IF_SELF_DEFENSE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:NOT_APPLICABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:MISGUIDED] Not serious, just a tad queer.
[ETHIC:TREASON:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:LYING:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:NOT_APPLICABLE] No one really owns property.
[ETHIC:THEFT:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:UNACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:SHUN] Not a crime, just really messed up.
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:SHUN] See above.
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:SHUN]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[AMBUSHER]
[INDIV_CONTROLLABLE]
[SCOUT]
[AT_PEACE_WITH_WILDLIFE]
[INVADERS_IGNORE_NEUTRALS]
[CLOTHING]
[DIGGER:item_weapon_shovel]
[RELIGION:PANTHEON]
Code: [Select]
item_littleones_aseaheru
[OBJECT:ITEM]
[ITEM_WEAPON:SLING]
[NAME:sling:slings]
[SIZE:220]
[SKILL:CROSSBOW]
[RANGED:CROSSBOW:STONE_LITTLE]
[SHOOT_FORCE:400]
[SHOOT_MAXVEL:2500]
[TWO_HANDED:0]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:4000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:2]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:7000:4000:bash:bashes:NO_SUB:1000]
[ITEM_AMMO:STONE_LITTLE]
[NAME:little stone:little stones]
[CLASS:STONE_LITTLE]
[SIZE:8]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:2:50:poke:pokes:NO_SUB:1000]
Post by: Gnorm on September 21, 2013, 08:52:45 pm
(http://i39.tinypic.com/4qr3oz.png)
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2v0bd4z.png)
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2gv3foz.png)
In addition, here is some initial concept art I made.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/14bgh3.png)
Post by: Gnorm on September 21, 2013, 09:11:52 pm
Code: [Select]
item_gnomes_gnorm
[OBJECT:ITEM]
[ITEM_WEAPON:LONG_GUN_GNORM]
[NAME:long gun:long guns]
[SIZE:220]
[SKILL:SWORD]
[RANGED:CROSSBOW:BALL_GNORM]
[SHOOT_FORCE:3000]
[SHOOT_MAXVEL:2500]
[TWO_HANDED:0]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:5000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:2]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:7000:4000:bash:bashes:NO_SUB:1000]
[ITEM_AMMO:BALL_GNORM]
[NAME:long gun ball:long gun balls]
[CLASS:BALL_GNORM]
[SIZE:10]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:2:50:poke:pokes:NO_SUB:1000]
[ITEM_ARMOR:OVERCOAT_GNORM]
[NAME:greatcoat:greatcoats]
[ARMORLEVEL:0]
[UBSTEP:MAX]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:OVER]
[COVERAGE:100]
[ITEM_PANTS:TROUSERS_GNORM]
[NAME:trousers:trousers]
[PREPLURAL:pairs of]
[ARMORLEVEL:0]
[LBSTEP:MAX]
[COVERAGE:100]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:OVER]
[COVERAGE:100]
[ITEM_HELM:FEZ_GNORM]
[NAME:fez:fezzes]
[COVERAGE:50]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:OVER]
[ARMORLEVEL:0]The problem being that they are not appearing, at all, in arena mode. Does anyone know that is causing this issue?
Post by: Aseaheru on September 21, 2013, 10:04:08 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 02:01:59 am
August 10th, 110 (I think)
We've decided to expand our greenhouse to make room for flax growing. After 2 years, and with all this cold, we're going to need to repair our clothes and make new ones for these growing infants.
September 12th, 110
The third Elven caravan this year! Either they must really love our crafts, or they really want to see us do well. Hopefully both! A good thing, too, as we've had another skilled stonecrafter join us since. We're quite the little village now, 77 hobbits in all with 13 born right here!
I recieved a letter-mallard this morning, our own Caravan is on the way as well. Twice in one year! My, my, how good it is to be a success!
September 20th, 110
Once more we bought out the lumber of the Elves, and even more, acquired an anvil from our own people! Sadly, a thought occurs, that with wood so precious, we might not have any to spare for lighting a forge. Perhaps soon we shall get some picks, and begin digging for coal.
October 15th, 110
Our Aphidadas are all but dead, as is an infant Pack Beetle unfortunate enough to be brought by one of the refugees. In their place we shall one day pasture Panserblekks, who from our first captured female have grown into a family of 5. Her descendants shall be as cattle to us. Mighty armored cattle who protect us from the cruel creatures of this world.
Every one of our Theraposa has in time come to adopt old farmer Whelp. His collection is growing, and he has come to appreciate their interest, though would still prefer a dog.
October 16th, 110
I ordered our hunter captain to go kill a wild dog today. What a weirdo! Instead of going out and shooting it, he simply stripped naked, waded out into the snow, and kicked it to death. I don't know why he did this, but it greatly disturbs me. Honestly, I'm beginning to lose my patience with the man, I simply cannot convince him to even carry a bow! I ought to replace Mr. Mythickingdom. I don't care if we share a first name, this is getting ridiculous.
October 27th, 110
Dear mercy! That man is insane! He makes the excuse that he doesn't like the feel of a freezing bowstring on his fingers, then goes out into the snow! Comes back later, nursing a badly bleeding arm, and we find 3 dead dogs out there. Perhaps I shall give him something to hit with instead, if he's so keen on not using bows.
More things I've noticed
-Adherents are supposed to get a caravan, so someone please add a PROGRESS_TRIGGER to them.
-Can't seem to get my one military guy to equip any weapons. Help?
-Wow, Elves and Halflings are trading all the time. I don't mind in the least, it's just not what I'm used to.
Post by: Gnorm on September 22, 2013, 02:12:57 am
Raws:
Creature:
Code: [Select]
creature_nomads_gnorm
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:GNOME]
[NAME:gnome:gnomes:gnomish]
[CASTE_NAME:gnome:gnomes:gnomish]
[DESCRIPTION:A nomadic race of short, beard-wearing humanoids. Unlike the halflings, its kind has not developed advanced civilizations on the surface; its comrades live in small camps beneath the earth, living off the wildlife and the rivers.]
[CREATURE_TILE:'g'][COLOR:3:0:0]
[CREATURE_SOLDIER_TILE:'G']
[INTELLIGENT]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:125:500]
[FREQUENCY:45]
[UBIQUITOUS]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:10:25]
[BIOME:ANY_LAND]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:4]
[BENIGN]
[CANOPENDOORS]
[PREFSTRING:temerity]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_HEAD_HAIR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_SKIN_COLOR_HLG]
[HAS_NERVES]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[BODY_SIZE:15000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:1500]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:7500]
[BODY_SIZE:20:0:15000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[MAXAGE:175:230]
[BABY:1]
[GENERAL_BABY_NAME:gnomish baby:gnomish babies]
[BABYNAME:gnomish baby:gnomish babies]
[CHILD:16]
[GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:gnomish child:gnomish children]
[CHILDNAME:gnomish child:gnomish children]
[CAVE_ADAPT]
[DIURNAL]
[PROFESSION_NAME:SPEARMAN:speargnome:speargnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_SPEARMAN:spearchief:spearchiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:SWORDSMAN:swordsgnome:swordsgnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_SWORDSMAN:swordchief:swordchiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:RECRUIT:ensign:ensigns]
[PROFESSION_NAME:CROSSBOWMAN:riflegnome:riflegnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_CROSSBOWMAN:riflechief:riflechiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:HAMMERMAN:hammergnome:hammergnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_HAMMERMAN:hammerchief:hammerchiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:BOWMAN:bowgnome:bowgnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_BOWMAN:bowchief:bowchiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:WRESTLER:wrestlegnome:wrestlegnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_WRESTLER:wrestlechief:wrestlechiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MACEMAN:macegnome:macegnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_MACEMAN:macechief:macechiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:PIKEMAN:pikegnome:pikegnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_PIKEMAN:pikechief:pikechiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:BLOWGUNMAN:spitgnome:spitgnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_BLOWGUNMAN:spitchief:spitchiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:LASHER:lashgnome:lashgnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_LASHER:lashchief:lashchiefs]
[PROFESSION_NAME:AXEMAN:axegnome:axegnomes]
[PROFESSION_NAME:MASTER_AXEMAN:axechief:axechiefs]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[MANNERISM_POSTURE]
[EQUIPS]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BEARD_COLOR_GNORM]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BEARD_GNORM]Body Detail Plan:
Code: [Select]
b_detail_plan_gnomes_gnorm
[OBJECT:BODY_DETAIL_PLAN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BEARD_GNORM]
[BP_LAYERS:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR:1:IN_FRONT:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH]Creature Variation:
Code: [Select]
c_variation_gnorm
[OBJECT:CREATURE_VARIATION]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BEARD_COLOR_GNORM]
[CV_NEW_TAG:SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:HAIR]
[CV_NEW_TAG:TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:60:65:70:75:80:85:90]
[CV_NEW_TAG:APP_MOD_NOUN:beard:SINGULAR]
[CV_NEW_TAG:APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:2000]Entity:
Code: [Select]
entity_gnomes_gnorm
[OBJECT:ENTITY]
[ENTITY:UNDERDARK_GNOMES]
[LAYER_LINKED]
[CREATURE:GNOME]
[WEAPON:LONG_GUN_GNORM]
[AMMO:BALL_GNORM]
[WEAPON:SMALL_CUDGEL_METAL_HLG]
[ARMOR:DRESS_SHIRT_HLG:COMMON]
[SHOES:BOOTS_CLOTHING_STL:COMMON]
[HELM:FEZ_GNORM:COMMON]
[ARMOR:OVERCOAT_GNORM:COMMON]
[PANTS:TROUSERS_GNORM:COMMON]
[TOOL:PIPE_SMOKING_HLG]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SCIMITAR_STL]
[INDOOR_WOOD]
[USE_CAVE_ANIMALS]
[USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS]
[EQUIPMENT_IMPROVEMENTS]
[FRIENDLY_COLOR:1:0:1]
[MAX_STARTING_CIV_NUMBER:150]
[MAX_POP_NUMBER:5000]
[MAX_SITE_POP_NUMBER:125]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:PUNISH_EXILE] The thought of wandering alone through the underground worlds of "DFFS" discourages such acts.
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:JUSTIFIED_IF_SELF_DEFENSE] Wouldn't wan't to anger the underground creatures unless absolutely necessary.
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:ACCEPTABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:NOT_APPLICABLE] No other sentient creatures live down below (as of now, anyway).
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:UNTHINKABLE]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:MISGUIDED] Not serious, just a tad queer.
[ETHIC:TREASON:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
[ETHIC:LYING:PUNISH_REPRIMAND]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:PUNISH_EXILE] Thou shalt not trash the camp.
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:NOT_APPLICABLE] No one really owns property.
[ETHIC:THEFT:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:PUNISH_EXILE]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:PERSONAL_MATTER] Some gnomes feel it is wrong to own another sapient being, others contend that, because the gnomes spend most of their time hunting and gathering, others are needed to attend to cooking, crafting, and cleaning.
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:SHUN] Not a crime, just really messed up.
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:SHUN] See above.
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:SHUN]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[AMBUSHER]
[INDIV_CONTROLLABLE]
[BEAST_HUNTER]
[RELIGION:REGIONAL_FORCE]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:RIVERS]Item:
Code: [Select]
item_gnomes_gnorm
[OBJECT:ITEM]
[ITEM_WEAPON:LONG_GUN_GNORM]
[NAME:long gun:long guns]
[SIZE:220]
[SKILL:SWORD]
[RANGED:CROSSBOW:BALL_GNORM]
[SHOOT_FORCE:3000]
[SHOOT_MAXVEL:2500]
[TWO_HANDED:0]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:5000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:2]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:7000:4000:bash:bashes:NO_SUB:1000]
[CAN_STONE]
[ITEM_AMMO:BALL_GNORM]
[NAME:long gun ball:long gun balls]
[CLASS:BALL_GNORM]
[SIZE:10]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:2:50:poke:pokes:NO_SUB:1000]
[ITEM_ARMOR:OVERCOAT_GNORM]
[NAME:greatcoat:greatcoats]
[ARMORLEVEL:0]
[UBSTEP:MAX]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:OVER]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_WOVEN_THREAD]
[COVERAGE:100]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:3]
[SOFT]
[ITEM_PANTS:TROUSERS_GNORM]
[NAME:trousers:trousers]
[PREPLURAL:pairs of]
[ARMORLEVEL:0]
[LBSTEP:MAX]
[COVERAGE:100]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:OVER]
[SOFT]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_WOVEN_THREAD]
[COVERAGE:100]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:2]
[ITEM_HELM:FEZ_GNORM]
[NAME:fez:fezzes]
[COVERAGE:50]
[LAYER_SIZE:1]
[LAYER_PERMIT:1]
[LAYER:OVER]
[ARMORLEVEL:0]
[STRUCTURAL_ELASTICITY_WOVEN_THREAD]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:1]
[SOFT]In addition, here is a complete gnome inventory in the arena:
(http://i44.tinypic.com/28k4wvr.png)
And it was on the day they came to meet
After their joyous victory. Then came
He, high and great and mighty; he whom all
The angels grew to fear: Gnormistocles!
He strutted to the gilded table, and
Spake to those, the other gods, who sitting
In His audience, waited with intent:
"Brethren, brethren, behold these works, which I
Have given unto thee to aid in
Our most righteous cause: lordship of a world!"
The gods were soon surprised by this; this small
And timid shape. The creation of this strange god
Became a mighty disgrace to his name!
Piqued by their humiliating laughter,
Gnormistocles, the mighty, cursed His own work
To crawl beneath dirt of the world,
And shoot the creatures roaming on the earth!
-Stupidity Titdragon, Paradise Misplaced
Post by: Halfling on September 22, 2013, 03:15:46 am
Turn 17 is yours. That's currently somewhat less than 3 months from now with the 2 week turns. It may come sooner if people skip, but - feel free to suggest things in advance too. Welcome :)
@Hugo, you could update your bugfix pack to contain the progress triggers by default. Just list it on the page so people know they should re-download.
@Gnorm: wonderful concept with the gnomes, first of all. Nomadic rifle hunters - very cool. I'm a little confused by [CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BEARD_COLOR_GNORM]
though. It does not appear to actually give their beards colors, rather a (short) length
The poem was wonderful too. Mind writing one of our entire creation? :P
Post by: Gnorm on September 22, 2013, 03:27:57 am
@Gnorm: wonderful concept with the gnomes, first of all. Nomadic rifle hunters - very cool. I'm a little confused by [CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BEARD_COLOR_GNORM]The creature variation was originally going to alter their beard colors as well, but I decided that, since their hair color is already defined on their scalps, defining it in the beards would be both redundant and (often) contradictory; I didn't want a bunch of Karl Marx gnomes wandering about. I apologize that I never got around to changing the name of the raw.
though. It does not appear to actually give their beards colors, rather a (short) length
The poem was wonderful too. Mind writing one of our entire creation? :P
As for the poem, I'm quite glad you like it. I might actually get around to writing more, if I should ever have time on my hands.
Post by: Halfling on September 22, 2013, 03:48:05 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 22, 2013, 05:15:17 am
"A race of verry small, harry mountan men. They pefer not to fight, but will if provoked. The live in small dougouts doug into the hillside or halfway berried into the chost lines and are only found in cold reagons."
should read:
"A race of very hairy mountain men. They prefer not to fight, but will if provoked. They live in small burrows dug into a hillside or half-way buried into the chost lines and are only found in cold regions."
(I have no idea what "chost" is - can you describe it?)
Post by: Halfling on September 22, 2013, 06:17:14 am
Especially because this is not going to work out for you:
[FREQUENCY: 40]
[UBIQITOUS]
[BIOME:MOUNTAN:TUNDRA:TAIGA]
[BENGIN]
I can just see DF weeping tears of confusion :D
Post by: Covenant Ringthane on September 22, 2013, 08:49:06 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 11:08:49 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 11:23:57 am
It's done. I've also made organs edible, though not brains, since that would also make nerve tissue edible.
Post by: Halfling on September 22, 2013, 11:36:29 am
How about [STOCKPILE_GLOB] and [EDIBLE_COOKED]?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 11:53:25 am
Without the MEAT token, it cannot be eaten. Making it a glob would make little difference. If you want to make organs different, we'd have to make new material templates and change the BDP's. Right now the only organs are "guts" and "lungs," both made of ORGAN_TISSUE, so we'd also have to add other organs.
Post by: Halfling on September 22, 2013, 12:04:15 pm
Well, thanks for noticing and fixing it. Even if it had become edible raw it would have been more correct than just rotting :)
Post by: Aseaheru on September 22, 2013, 01:29:24 pm
I'd like to help out the English on the "little ones" post:I cant spell. It is supost to be coast. Also I dont really know what I am doing. What things do I need to remove?
"A race of verry small, harry mountan men. They pefer not to fight, but will if provoked. The live in small dougouts doug into the hillside or halfway berried into the chost lines and are only found in cold reagons."
should read:
"A race of very hairy mountain men. They prefer not to fight, but will if provoked. They live in small burrows dug into a hillside or half-way buried into the chost lines and are only found in cold regions."
(I have no idea what "chost" is - can you describe it?)
Oh, I am also in the midst of making some videos on this. they are getting uploaded in an odd order, and some may be very short. Go youtube for requiring cellphones to get longer videos.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 01:58:32 pm
November 25th, 110
We've had quite a few births recently, bringing our numbers to 87. We must speed up building these igloos, and we must make more room elsewhere as well. More traditional rooms shall be dug in the next layer of soil, though it will be too deep for any decent sunlit windows. Perhaps I can use the opportunity to find the bedrock.
December 11th, 110
Struck bedrock today! It was much deeper than we'd anticipated, under many layers of hard-packed dirt. I suppose we shall begin mining it for material and coal, as soon as we get something harder than wooden shovels.
January 1st, 111
Goodness, another year has gone by! We are beginning to reclaim something absent from the Halfling life for far too long... monotony. A simple, unsurprising existence. Different from traditional life, sure, but soon this shall be our new tradition. Ah, but it would be nice to have a bit more variety in our drinks. One day we shall be able to buy. One day...
February 11th, 111
(http://imageshack.com/scaled/large/703/9ml8.png)
Post by: Aseaheru on September 22, 2013, 03:28:27 pm
And have a link to my DFFS series.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sum1QxzpoX0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sum1QxzpoX0)
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 22, 2013, 03:36:41 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 22, 2013, 03:44:47 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 03:49:18 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 22, 2013, 04:09:33 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 04:53:26 pm
February 12th, 111
It was over in 15 minutes. The beast came at us from the North, announcing its presence with a clap of thunder. We looked upon it, the largest thing we'd ever seen, its wings almost blocking out the sun...
The beast was met with a cloud of flying rocks, striking everywhere simultaneously. It came down with a crash that might have split this place in half, its wings perforated, and captain Blade charged at it naked, chucking stones at its face. He kicked it savagely about the head and neck, doing little damage, and the wounded beast might have swept him away were it not for the Panserblekk.
Our own beast rushed to the captains aid, joining him in the mutilation. He had drawn blood with his bare feet, and the mighty pummeling of those eight arms drew much more. With one final pound upon the head, the legendary Vine was a pile of pulped, bloody flesh.
We shall eat well for some time. We shall eat well indeed.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 22, 2013, 05:08:12 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 05:12:41 pm
Post by: Gnorm on September 22, 2013, 05:30:02 pm
I started out by creating a small world with only 125 years to its history. Geographically, it is a large continent, with one or two major outlying islands. The spider-centaurs have made their civilizations in the harsh south of the world, if I remember correctly, and they have remained a small people that has contributed little to history. To the far north, the only formic civilization thrives along with its neighbors the psionics, the lizardfolk, and the trolls. The halflings have, wisely, sought their land away from these war-like nations, whilst the cherubim have largely taken control of the wide mountain ranges near the trolls.
A single formic soldier, wishing to bring glory to the name of his queen and his people, left the hive and, in his journies, found himself within a peaceful troll hamlet. Wishing to gain a name for himself amongst the local populace, he inquired as to whether or not there was anything to kill. The locals informed him that their law-making noble was believed to be a bloodsucking vampire, responsible for the deaths of 22 citizens. Upon checking his map, he discovered that a noble's fortress was in range of the hamlet, and that there would likely be soldiers to recruit. Taking some tarnish stalks as emergency supplies, the formic left for the manor.
Upon arriving at the fortress, the combat-trained warrior was piqued to find that the soldiers refused to go with "someone such as he," and he was forced to, dejectedly, cross the mountains by himself. He swore, however, that he would return to gain followers once he had accomplished his goal.
He soon found out, however, what a dangerous place the mountains could be. Rivers were scarce feral hounds were ubiquitous. Fortunately, this meant a ready supply of food, but the hounds had strength in numbers. An even greater threat, still, was the constant threat of cherubim attacks. The winged beasts, remnants of the old times, built their mighty cathedrals on these mountains, and were eager to sacrifice any intruders. From their first attack, fortunately, he was able to sneak away; they ambushed him in his sleep for their second. He was forced to pull arrows from his arms, legs, and body whilst he ran from the bowmen. Losing two of his shields, he managed to escape once more.
Their third attack was even more harmful to the formic; again assaulting him in his sleep, he lost a thumb and a section of his leg to his aggressors that night. Formic soldiers, however, never surrender. He managed to cripple the two cherubim that attacked him and, although he failed to kill either, he managed to replace his lost shields with those which they dropped.
When he finally made it to the troll capital, he was stunned. The city was no more than a burrow into a mound of azurine. In the distance, he could hear the piercing screams of trolls, and he rushed towards the mound to find that they were fighting one of the most dangerous creatures from below: reaver ants. This attack crippled the numbers of the trolls, but the tide was turned by the formic soldier, who fought defeated the last of the ants.
Unfortunately, the vampire was killed in the attacks, and upon trying to explain his true form to the other trolls, they simply dismissed it as a rumor. Disappointed, though still eager to fight, our hero rested under the stars, letting his injuries heal.
His rest was cut short, however, by a fourth cherubim attack. This time he wasn't going to let them escape; with the help of the trolls, he slaughtered the two daemons sent to destroy the capital, and was finally able to rest at ease.
In the morning, he looked upon the wreckage of the troll burrow. Bodies were scattered everywhere, and the stench of death wrought in the air. The remaining trolls were, nonetheless, eager to continue on with their lives. With this job finished, the soldier prepared himself to, once again, visit the manor of the troll lord.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/21ca3vl.jpg[/IMG[IMG]http://i41.tinypic.com/6fma9d.png)
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2iar81y.png)
This has been, so far, an unexpectedly satisfying and exciting adventure. There are some things, however, that I should point out.
- My adventurer lost his upper right leg, but he can still walk, and has his lower leg and foot.
- The troll capital does not seem to extend below the earth, meaning the reaver ants shouldn't have been able to come out of the caverns
- Azurine walls and floors looking exactly the same is really annoying.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 05:37:50 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 22, 2013, 05:57:52 pm
Additionally, I love the fact that reaver ants seem to be the main thing inhabiting caves. They have their own anthills and I didn't even have to do anything :D
EDIT:
@Aseaheru: Just saw the episode in your video series where the caravan comes in and spontaneously combusts. I hadn't seen this bug in action until now, and it is hilarious. We should still probably figure out what, precisely, is bursting into flames, though...
Also, the halflings charging the salticidae (I think that's what they were) amused me too. Great series so far!
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 06:06:33 pm
His hypothesis is that it's something to do with the fireball vigor, while I've heard it could also be the doom coal.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 22, 2013, 06:09:51 pm
As for the cause, I'm going to say doom coal, unless I seriously messed up with the fireball vigor. Vigors should be at normal room temperature and boil/combust/change somehow with heat in a negative fashion at alcohol-like temperatures.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 06:11:51 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 22, 2013, 06:16:46 pm
Check anyways, Aseaheru. It may not be too late!
Post by: Aseaheru on September 22, 2013, 07:16:42 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 22, 2013, 07:35:14 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 22, 2013, 07:39:05 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 22, 2013, 07:49:34 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 22, 2013, 07:55:23 pm
Perhaps we can get two new teas? Something cold and something dark?
Heck, if we get a grain that when ground we also get straw to make things with that would be cool.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 22, 2013, 07:59:15 pm
Post by: laularukyrumo on September 22, 2013, 09:51:17 pm
Aseaheru, check that caravan for burning doom coal.
Moar quote material!
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 23, 2013, 01:00:52 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 23, 2013, 01:12:01 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 23, 2013, 01:23:08 am
I've set the site cap to -1, but to keep my RAM from crying too hard, set pop cap to 1. Doing this in Vanilla doesn't seem to hamper the civ from expanding organically during world-gen. There are just far fewer "bit players" floating around (the histories become that much more of a heroic read.)
I'm going to turn off megabeasts and see if that affects anything...
Nope - even with Titans, megas and semi-megas turned off, we still get continual Age of Myth. How very mysterious.
I'll let it run the full course this time, with only the various peoples of the world to contest it.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 23, 2013, 04:51:33 am
Post by: Halfling on September 23, 2013, 05:54:12 am
I'm still thinking about making halflings sing. Furthermore what they sing would reflect and could be used to identify traits. Such as the rare adventurous halflings would sing songs of foreign cultures, among other things. For formics, of course, they might have nasheed.
Regular, fearful halfling:
(Master Dragonrump sings!)
"Hush now baby halfling, hush now don't you cry"
Adventurous halfling, sings the normal songs but may occasionally also:
(Tit Stupiditypumpkin imitates a busy, high-pitched voice chittering with zeal and fervor!)
...in the night of her absence, soldiers did not forget jihad-ah...
...we now come to you with veiled face, lance and saber (clatters jaw madly) elucidating the mandate of the Queen!
Feel free to opt out of thisoic I the pla It just seems cool there would be actual limited knowledge of other cultures, visible. While leaving the leap of log
Post by: Halfling on September 23, 2013, 05:57:29 am
They would also sing troll songs and ballad of Mastertea and such.
What kind of damn smartphone undergoes a massive memory leak to the point of unresponsiveness from writing two paragraphs? Piece of crap. Well, more when I get home.
I suppose Ender's game Formics would never sing though :P
Post by: Halfling on September 23, 2013, 11:00:21 am
- HugoL and Gnorm, your newest reports are added to the front page under HugoL bugfixing turn
- Aseaheru's videos are now linked under "fanart". Thanks! :)
Here's some new stuff. This time it's animal sounds!
Generic vocalization interactions:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Vocalizing creature variations, four of them:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Speech files:
Code: (speech_hound_hlg.txt) [Select]
Woof!
Woof!
Woof!
Woof!
Woof!
Woof! Woof!
Bark!
Bow-wow-wow!
(the hound pants loudly)
Arooooooooooooo!
(the hound whimpers)Code: (speech_tit_hlg.txt) [Select]
Chirp!
Tweet! Tweet! Tweet!Result? When inserting
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:DOG_BARK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:GROWL_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:WHIMPERS_FLEEING_HLG]
into feral hounds, this happens when attacking a pack:
(http://s12.postimg.org/owpbqwnql/hound_voices.png)
Note that they growl at you when you are further away (20 squares, not in picture), then start barking when you're at 15 squares, and whimpering when they're scared. Adds character.
It's actually extremely useful for an adventurer. When you see "Woof!" or "The Feral Hound growls!" flashing at the lower boundary of your screen, it's time to consider evasive action.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 23, 2013, 12:34:57 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 23, 2013, 12:39:10 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 23, 2013, 01:23:01 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE_VARIATION:DOG_BARK_HLG]
[CV_NEW_TAG:CAN_DO_INTERACTION:VOCALIZATION_HLG]
[CV_NEW_TAG:CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK] <-----------------Changing the usage hint to GREETING would mean that they bark at friendly halflings like they're puppies happy to see their owner, and why not. :)
Leaving it blank would mean they bark at everything, which is how bird chirping works (any bird with the variation will chirp at any creature in range 2x/day).
Post by: WillowLuman on September 23, 2013, 02:57:35 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on September 23, 2013, 03:02:24 pm
Post by: kero42 on September 23, 2013, 03:25:09 pm
I think domestic dogs should just wag their tails. It's adorable.
Perhaps also yip?
+1 on the Yipping and Tail-wagging .(OwO).
Post by: WillowLuman on September 23, 2013, 03:29:20 pm
Might make dogsplosions even laggier, though.
Post by: Halfling on September 23, 2013, 03:52:00 pm
Spoiler: variations for wagging tail and yipping (click to show/hide)
Code: (puppy_yip_hlg.txt) [Select]
Yip!
Yip!
Yip yip!-> Creatures with variation can wag tail at friendlies 1x/3 days (to reduce spam), can yip at a friendly 1x/2 days. :)
Actually, having halflings have them do tricks is very simple. The blueprint is:
Dog uses an interaction to transmit a syndrome to a nearby halfling. This syndrome permits the halfling to target the dog and say "sit!". Then, the dog sits. Sitting may then enable it to give the previous halfling another syndrome causing them to say "good boy" and cause a report of "Fairy Volepants throws the dog a small treat!" "The Hound looks pleased!".
Entirely possible. I've made entire dialogs occur outside of talk mode that way in a private mod. But it might indeed cause fortress mode to lag, a LOT. :P
Could be added as an easter egg in adventurer mode.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 23, 2013, 03:57:47 pm
As for how Arabic they are, the idea of Jihad wouldn't be a big one, if at all present, as they do have a pantheon (which doesn't really lend itself well to holy war, considering how polytheism tends to be more accepting of new gods) though a near-religious attitude towards the Queen is something they have. Considering they live in deserts and wastelands, and I mainly associate Arabs with those areas, past the jihad thing they're pretty Arabic :)
EDIT: Considering the droning sound cicadas make, bagpipes might be a good instrument for them if we start adding in trade goods like that. They are fanatically-devoted-to-their-queen, Arabic bagpipers, essentially, when it comes to music. The Highlands and the Sahara.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 23, 2013, 04:01:59 pm
Post by: Dorsidwarf on September 23, 2013, 04:07:11 pm
In other news, I have a request for the modders: An item that produces syndrome gas. And has a prefstring.
Edit: oh god, I just described cigarettes.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 23, 2013, 04:08:22 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 23, 2013, 04:09:24 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 23, 2013, 04:22:39 pm
Jihad just means "duty". The idea of it as "holy war" is a fairly recent one. But that aside, I don't see ants doing the whole "put the nonbelievers to the sword" thing.
Well... their description states their society is ruled by their religious devotion to the queen, hierarchy comes as naturally to them as breathing, it's commented, they have ultra-low liberalism as a species-wide personality trait, and they consider even their own kin completely expendable in pursuit of the interests of the queen as StL later described it. Allets are notorious for killing those who disobey in the slightest, in player reports. You might expect them to put unbelievers (in the Queen's divine authority) to the sword after all. Although more likely to kill them on the spot.
Nonetheless, the design and final word is StL's. If I include "songs of foreign cultures", I'll try to accommodate them to whatever the person who made it wants that culture to sing, of course.
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 23, 2013, 05:02:20 pm
That IS odd. Even with Titans turned off, I'm still seeing the "Age of Myth" past year 500. What flags determine this in vanilla DF, I wonder?
I've set the site cap to -1, but to keep my RAM from crying too hard, set pop cap to 1. Doing this in Vanilla doesn't seem to hamper the civ from expanding organically during world-gen. There are just far fewer "bit players" floating around (the histories become that much more of a heroic read.)
I'm going to turn off megabeasts and see if that affects anything...
Nope - even with Titans, megas and semi-megas turned off, we still get continual Age of Myth. How very mysterious.
I'll let it run the full course this time, with only the various peoples of the world to contest it.
I let it run all last night as I was sleeping, and until 3PM this afternoon. It crashed at year 9133... of the Age of Myth. I'd say that more than likely, (if StLeibowitz is correct), that was the year the last free sentient was consumed by the halfling vampire hordes.
I'll try again tonight using the same seeds but to the year 9132 instead. Hopefully, we will see the historic trends of each population as the millenia roll past.
Post by: Halfling on September 23, 2013, 05:12:00 pm
Might also be the trolls producing lots of vampires. But probably not, since their numbers stay limited due to not only the population cap, but also getting killed by other trolls some 20-80 years after birth despite having the potential to live forever. The vampire would have to get out of there pretty fast before it's murdered.
Man-eaters are also relatively good at making more, probably due to being the only semimegabeast so there's lots of them to start with.
We'll know...
Maybe 8000 years would be enough if you want to be sure. Or even 5000. :P
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 23, 2013, 06:19:28 pm
Well... their description states their society is ruled by their religious devotion to the queen, hierarchy comes as naturally to them as breathing, it's commented, they have ultra-low liberalism as a species-wide personality trait, and they consider even their own kin completely expendable in pursuit of the interests of the queen as StL later described it. Allets are notorious for killing those who disobey in the slightest, in player reports. You might expect them to put unbelievers (in the Queen's divine authority) to the sword after all. Although more likely to kill them on the spot.
It's more when lesser Formics step out of line, not an expansionistic type of religious enforcement and spread like I think when I hear "jihad" (I admit my opinion of that word may be colored slightly by Dune). Members of the Hive that disobey the Queen or their superiors must die as an example and punishment, but outsiders are Outside the Hive and thus not subject to the same punishment, unless they try to harm the Hive in which case they become people-burgers for the nymphs. This also takes into account Formic bandits - they left the Hive, and thus so long as they stay out of the way mostly they won't be killed for their blasphemy.
For an Arab/Islamic equivalent, they enforce the death penalty for apostasy (from the Queen), but not for outsiders, and an apostate that runs away and stays out of the way isn't worth hunting down. Holy War in the name of the Queen, in the sense of a formal declaration of "we kill you now heathen" backed up by pointy metal things, isn't a main point of their culture, but I guess zealous steamrolling of obstacles of the Hive could be seen as a holy war in her name.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 23, 2013, 07:01:37 pm
Post by: Xieg on September 23, 2013, 07:56:27 pm
However, I'm noticing that we already have different tags that really define the same thing ie. FLYING and FLIER or REPTILE and LIZARD. I see that as something that could only get worse as different people play at god, which may or may not lead to different kinds of fun. Any complaints if I collect a list of current tags and stick it on one of the Wikis for easy reference for budding plague bearers? Or has that already happened and I'm just blind.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 23, 2013, 08:28:41 pm
So, while prepping for my turn in the far flung future, I got to the topic of CREATURE_CLASS, and decided to take a walk through the RAWs accumulated so far to see what we have. I like how easy it is to target specific groups of creatures thanks to the shear diversity of tags, and it's going to make the fun I have planned that much easier.
However, I'm noticing that we already have different tags that really define the same thing ie. FLYING and FLIER or REPTILE and LIZARD. I see that as something that could only get worse as different people play at god, which may or may not lead to different kinds of fun. Any complaints if I collect a list of current tags and stick it on one of the Wikis for easy reference for budding plague bearers? Or has that already happened and I'm just blind.
Go for it on the shoutwiki. It should prove useful.
Post by: Putnam on September 23, 2013, 09:23:00 pm
I've also made an element of order. It's much simpler in design,
EDIT: I've revised it from a tesseract to a 4-sphere. It is now 1,728,182,899 cm4, 8 times as tall as a halfling. Don't know how that made it bigger. Of course, now I need a material that exists in 4 dimensions.
EDIT 2: Eh, Lunanium works well enough.
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 24, 2013, 03:52:50 am
For a 3-brane material, how about an ice that sublimes into an explosion of gas when it is dug out called "dark matter"? Basically, a strike of the pick pushes it into n-space rather than along any of it's 3-dimensional surfaces. The sudden vacuum concussion blows the dwarf away slightly. (It would make objects composed of dark matter quite rare, if not impossible)
Post by: Halfling on September 24, 2013, 04:14:08 am
Most people wouldn't want to live there :P
Read also the description for "Book of the Warp" from that game's wiki.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 24, 2013, 11:59:20 am
So, while prepping for my turn in the far flung future, I got to the topic of CREATURE_CLASS, and decided to take a walk through the RAWs accumulated so far to see what we have. I like how easy it is to target specific groups of creatures thanks to the shear diversity of tags, and it's going to make the fun I have planned that much easier.
However, I'm noticing that we already have different tags that really define the same thing ie. FLYING and FLIER or REPTILE and LIZARD. I see that as something that could only get worse as different people play at god, which may or may not lead to different kinds of fun. Any complaints if I collect a list of current tags and stick it on one of the Wikis for easy reference for budding plague bearers? Or has that already happened and I'm just blind.
Feel free to change all instances of [CREATURE_CLASS:FLIER] to [CREATURE_CLASS:FLYING]. [FLIER] on its own is just a token that lets creatures fly, so make sure not to change that.
I think [CREATURE_CLASS:LIZARD] is a good addition to reptiles, so we can further distinguish between them, snakes, and dragons.
Which reminds me, I think the only vertebrate taxa not represented so far is fish. We've got mammalian people, dogs, and mamaphints; we've got reptilian lizards and dragons; we've got land and ocean birds; and I think there's salamanders somewhere.
Post by: Xieg on September 24, 2013, 09:00:56 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 25, 2013, 12:45:39 am
But personally, I'd prefer if we didn't remake every extant genera. We could turn to extinct ones, like Hallucinogenia, or make up our own. I created "ocean birds", for instance, which are to normal birds kind of like what cetaceans are to ungulates (well, more like if an entire offshoot order evolved from penguins).
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 25, 2013, 01:57:30 am
That IS odd. Even with Titans turned off, I'm still seeing the "Age of Myth" past year 500. What flags determine this in vanilla DF, I wonder?
I've set the site cap to -1, but to keep my RAM from crying too hard, set pop cap to 1. Doing this in Vanilla doesn't seem to hamper the civ from expanding organically during world-gen. There are just far fewer "bit players" floating around (the histories become that much more of a heroic read.)
I'm going to turn off megabeasts and see if that affects anything...
Nope - even with Titans, megas and semi-megas turned off, we still get continual Age of Myth. How very mysterious.
I'll let it run the full course this time, with only the various peoples of the world to contest it.
I let it run all last night as I was sleeping, and until 3PM this afternoon. It crashed at year 9133... of the Age of Myth. I'd say that more than likely, (if StLeibowitz is correct), that was the year the last free sentient was consumed by the halfling vampire hordes.
I'll try again tonight using the same seeds but to the year 9132 instead. Hopefully, we will see the historic trends of each population as the millenia roll past.
And here we go: 8,000 years of history using the "HugoLuman's bugfix pack for reemer30" game file.
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8004 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8004)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 25, 2013, 10:44:34 am
Alright, list is up on the shout wiki. I believe I got them all. You are right, we currently have no fish. Also have no amphibians and a distinct lack of crustaceans. Pretty sure the most common creature type is arthropod or cehpalopod.
There are some amphibious and ocean-dwelling dragon species...
Post by: WillowLuman on September 25, 2013, 11:11:24 am
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 25, 2013, 11:18:18 am
But they're not froggy dragons, are they?
They are if you want to visualize them that way...
Post by: WillowLuman on September 25, 2013, 11:32:51 am
EDIT: Oh, and about that world. All of the Storm Dragons had lengthy rampages but were struck down by treelords, except for one, who was killed by an Adherent. There's a 7,000+ year old tiger named "Savage" wandering the depths of the earth :D Also, there was a nautilus that wandered the depths of the earth and went on a rampage before dying of old age in 18 (?)
Post by: Halfling on September 25, 2013, 12:10:01 pm
See the documentation at http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Contents (ctrl+f e.g. table) -- linked on shoutwiki front page in the instructions collapsible.
Found a previously unlisted creature class, [CREATURE_CLASS:VERTABRATE]. Currently this includes all ZtG's dragons, as well as lizardmen and dragonkin. They are targeted separately from class VERTEBRATE as is.
Post by: vyznev on September 25, 2013, 02:18:38 pm
Ps. Has anyone considered putting the raws in a git (http://git-scm.com/) repo and publishing it on GitHub (https://github.com/)? Seems like that would be the appropriate tool for collaborative development. Of course, the down side is that you'd need to learn how to use git (https://github.com/blog/120-new-to-git), but that's not really so hard as long as you stick to the basics (and preferably use a GUI front-end (http://git-scm.com/downloads/guis)).
Also, Halfling, I hope you don't mind that I sigged one of your posts from downthread. :)
Post by: Aseaheru on September 25, 2013, 02:22:18 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 25, 2013, 02:29:54 pm
Awesome thread, posting to watch. Actually, scratch that, can I sign up for a modding turn? It's been a while since I've done any DF modding, but I should be able to handle it.
Ps. Has anyone considered putting the raws in a git (http://git-scm.com/) repo and publishing it on GitHub (https://github.com/)? Seems like that would be the appropriate tool for collaborative development. Of course, the down side is that you'd need to learn how to use git (https://github.com/blog/120-new-to-git), but that's not really so hard as long as you stick to the basics (and preferably use a GUI front-end (http://git-scm.com/downloads/guis)).
Also, Halfling, I hope you don't mind that I sigged one of your posts from downthread. :)
I'll add you and of course I don't. :P Welcome!
I briefly considered collaborative development tools, but the short of it is, we already have trouble with keeping the mods working and having people use ZIP instead of RAR. And we don't have that many people participating, and especially few who would like to put in concentrated effort long term. This is easier, requires little extra effort, importantly more visible, attracting players from without our small circle to try the stuff out, and therefore the better course... maybe? It's also important there's one version to test at a time because testing comes slower than the new ideas.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 25, 2013, 02:34:25 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 25, 2013, 02:48:19 pm
...and having people use ZIP instead of RAR.
Which reminds me.
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7984
It's now a .zip
Post by: Aseaheru on September 25, 2013, 02:49:57 pm
Post by: vyznev on September 25, 2013, 05:27:34 pm
I briefly considered collaborative development tools, but the short of it is, we already have trouble with keeping the mods working and having people use ZIP instead of RAR. And we don't have that many people participating, and especially few who would like to put in concentrated effort long term. This is easier, requires little extra effort, importantly more visible, attracting players from without our small circle to try the stuff out, and therefore the better course... maybe? It's also important there's one version to test at a time because testing comes slower than the new ideas.
Actually, I thought of GitHub precisely because the current system seems to be generating so many separate versions with different fixes and features in each. Merging fixes from many sources together is what DVCSes like git are good for, and having a single official GitHub repository would make it easy to tell what the latest official version is at any given time.
You do have a point about the learning curve, though. I suppose, even if we did have a GitHub repo (and I just might set up an unofficial one anyway, just for personal use if nothing else), those who didn't want to use git could still contribute the traditional way, by sending their raws to someone designated as a repo maintainer. (And yeah, I guess by saying that I'm kind of volunteering to do that job, if you feel you're too busy for it. Although I should note that, so far, there isn't even any repo to maintain yet.)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 25, 2013, 05:36:07 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 25, 2013, 05:42:56 pm
Elements of order go down to 10 halflings with lunanium weapons and steel shields or 1 element of balance with a lunanium weapon. They also lose to elements of fire.
Elements of fire go down to anything that can get to them. They're only 1.5 times the size of a halfling and they bleed all over the place when hit. However, they tend to kill things easily. Elements of order are far too slow to get to them.
Elements of Balance are terrifying. They take the appearance of halflings (same size, no castes, no gender), but their fighting skills and strength are completely off the charts compared to halflings. Elements of balance are my attempt to make an extremely difficult megabeast that:
1. Is the same size as the local humanoid playable (40000 in this case)
2. Has no different offense interactions than said humanoid race (due to the method I used to make them, they can throw rocks, same with giants, can't do anything about it)
3. Doesn't have anything that makes them truly invincible (like general material force multiplier that makes them immune to every material or something).
I'd say I succeeded. I pitted a giant against an Element of Balance and it died within 500 ticks. The element of balance roundhouse kicked the giant in the neck until it died.
EDIT: Okay, a good few minutes of letting a bunch of halflings wail on me shows that elements of balance are nearly impossible to it. I should tone them down in that regard.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 25, 2013, 05:47:09 pm
Didn't we also make some kind of horseman lava elemental?
Post by: Putnam on September 25, 2013, 05:52:59 pm
Nerfed it. Still kills 20 halflings without issue...
Spoiler: EDIT: Still needs nerfing (click to show/hide)
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 25, 2013, 06:03:10 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 25, 2013, 06:03:51 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 25, 2013, 07:16:11 pm
Now pit it against a Gifted Adherent.
Interactions >:I
EDIT: Creeping grass works. Now to test Myomorphs.
EDIT 2: Wuh-woh. I's crashed.
EDIT 3: Fixed crash. Duplicated a LAIR token. Megabeasts are finicky as hell. Now I need to fix this:
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) finalizing the interaction SECRET_METAPHYSICAL_PUTNAM
Error Initializing Text: raw/objects/text/book_metaphysics_titles_dffs.txt
-snip-
This is mysterious, given that all of these texts certainly do exist.
EDIT 4: forgot ".txt" on most of them, that one has a straggling _dffs :X
EDIT 5: "Lord Brighthealing was a creature born in 1. It was of unknown parentage.
In a time before time*, Lord began wandering the depths of the world.
In 2, Lord died of old age."
*It was born in 1, though!
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 25, 2013, 08:28:28 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 25, 2013, 08:44:22 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:FIRE_ELEMENTAL_PUTNAM]
[NAME:element of fire:elements of fire:element of fire]
[CASTE_NAME:element of fire:elements of fire:element of fire]
[DESCRIPTION:A living ball of fire.]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:INCORPOREAL][CREATURE_CLASS:SPIRIT][CREATURE_CLASS:ELEMENTAL]
[BIOME:ANY_DESERT]
[MEGABEAST]
[LAIR:SHRINE:100]
[LARGE_PREDATOR]
[CREATURE_TILE:'o'][CASTE_TILE:'o']
[COLOR:4:0:1]
[NO_DIZZINESS][NO_CONNECTIONS_FOR_MOVEMENT][NO_DRINK][NO_EAT][NO_FEVERS][NO_GENDER][NO_PHYS_ATT_GAIN][NO_PHYS_ATT_RUST][NO_SLEEP][NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT][NOBONES]
[NOBREATHE][NOEMOTION][NOEXERT][NOFEAR][NOMEAT][NONAUSEA][NOPAIN][NOSKIN][NOSKULL][NOTHOUGHT][NOSTUN][NOT_BUTCHERABLE][NOT_LIVING][PARALYZEIMMUNE][FIREIMMUNE_SUPER][EXTRAVISION]
[SPEED:500]
[IMMOLATE]
[GRASSTRAMPLE:100]
[ATTACK_TRIGGER:110:10000:100000]
[PREFSTRING:firiness]
[BODY:TREELORD]
[BODYGLOSS:GENERIC_1PART_BODY_GLOSS_PUTNAM]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Shoot fireball]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:FLOW:FIREBALL]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:300]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Spray jet of fire]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:FLOW:FIREJET]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:5]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:300]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:MATERIAL_EMISSION]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Shoot dragonfire]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:FLOW:DRAGONFIRE]
[CDI:TARGET:C:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:15]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:600]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:FIRE:SOIL_TEMPLATE_LKR]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:FIRE:SOLID]
[TISSUE:FIRE]
[TISSUE_NAME:fire:STP]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:FIRE]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[HEALING_RATE:3000]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:STRANDS]
[MUSCULAR]
[VASCULAR:100]
[ARTERIES]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:FIRE]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:60000]
[FANCIFUL]
[SPHERE:FIRE]
[POWER]
[SUPERNATURAL]EDIT: 'sit okay if I change this:
Code: [Select]
reaction_kopout
[OBJECT:REACTION]
[REACTION:PREPARE_APPLE_TREES_KPT]
[NAME:prepare apple trees]
[BUILDING:LUMBERYARD:CUSTOM_A]#a for apple
[AUTOMATIC]
[SKILL:CARPENTRY]
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:STRUCTURE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_WOOD_KPT:APPLE_WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:2:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]
[PRODUCT:50:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]
[PRODUCT:25:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]to this:
Code: [Select]
reaction_kopout
[OBJECT:REACTION]
[REACTION:PREPARE_APPLE_TREES_KPT]
[NAME:prepare apple trees]
[BUILDING:LUMBERYARD:CUSTOM_A]#a for apple
[AUTOMATIC]
[SKILL:CARPENTRY]
[REAGENT:A:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_HLG:RAW_APPLE_TREE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:WOOD:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_WOOD_KPT:APPLE_WOOD]
[PRODUCT:100:2:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]
[PRODUCT:50:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]
[PRODUCT:25:1:PLANT:NONE:PLANT_MAT:APPLE_FRUIT_KPT:APPLE_FRUIT_STRUCTURE_KPT]/code]
? After all, the former doesn't work; the latter does.EDIT 2: I know I've still got a couple days, but I'm pretty much done over here. Can't really think of anything to add and I'm satisfied with what I've got.
Post by: Halfling on September 26, 2013, 12:08:30 am
Does the apple tree reaction work now? If not, please fix before uploading. Would be super.
Anyone got anything else?
Post by: mastahcheese on September 26, 2013, 12:10:23 am
When the new version comes out, are you guys going to try to revamp everything you made?
Or are you going to go at it from scratch again?
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 26, 2013, 12:18:09 am
Post by: Gnorm on September 26, 2013, 12:20:11 am
So...I assume that, unless it is a complete overhaul of the game (e.g. 23a to 40d), our raws will work. If not, we shall adapt them to work. We'll not yield to the toad-like tyrant!
When the new version comes out, are you guys going to try to revamp everything you made?
Or are you going to go at it from scratch again?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 26, 2013, 12:37:48 am
Halfling, my upload already fixes Mamaphint spelling errors. "Golden Mamaphints" they are, currently.
Post by: Putnam on September 26, 2013, 12:50:06 am
And how about leather armor for halfllings?: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4459378;topicseen#msg4459378
Does the apple tree reaction work now? If not, please fix before uploading. Would be super.
Anyone got anything else?
Done, fixed.
contributions. I'd really like you to include those hound and bird sounds I posted earlier.
I'm guessing you mean contributions from the wiki? Also, hound and bird sounds? Can't quite found them. I think I found the hound ones, but I'm not sure how you'd want them put together.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 26, 2013, 01:34:34 am
There will be several castes, all male but each with a different weapon "body part". I'm thinking a spear caste, a sword caste, and maybe an axe or lance caste.
Post by: Halfling on September 26, 2013, 05:09:44 am
And how about leather armor for halfllings?: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4459378;topicseen#msg4459378
Does the apple tree reaction work now? If not, please fix before uploading. Would be super.
Anyone got anything else?
Done, fixed.contributions. I'd really like you to include those hound and bird sounds I posted earlier.
I'm guessing you mean contributions from the wiki? Also, hound and bird sounds? Can't quite found them. I think I found the hound ones, but I'm not sure how you'd want them put together.
Here http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4629786;topicseen#msg4629786
Please add those as files, the three variations for hounds into feral hounds (creature_hugol) and the bird one into tits. Thanks!
Mamaphints have more bugs than just spelling. See wiki: bugs investigating.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 26, 2013, 01:53:09 pm
Limiting the mayor to certain castes may have other unintended consequences. Why not reduce the rate gain of Mamaphint social skills? Those are what gets them elected.
Post by: Putnam on September 26, 2013, 01:59:50 pm
Code: [Select]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_HEAD_HAIR_HLG]with no [APPLY_CURRENT_CREATURE_VARIATION] around. In my experience, that usually crashes the game, so it's kind of odd that it doesn't seem to have too many adverse affects here.
Post by: vyznev on September 26, 2013, 03:11:41 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 26, 2013, 03:15:05 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 26, 2013, 03:19:21 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 26, 2013, 03:23:18 pm
Besides, there are very good reasons to have the two separate tokens:
Code: [Select]
[COPY_TAGS_FROM:HALFLING_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:SPECIALBEAST_VARIATION_PUTNAM]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:MALE]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:FEMALE]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:CREATURE_CLASS]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:NATURAL_SKILL]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:CASTE]
[CV_CONVERT_TAG]
[CVCT_MASTER:ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER]
[CVCT_TARGET:300]
[CVCT_REPLACEMENT:5000]
[CVCT_TARGET:600]
[CVCT_REPLACEMENT:10000]
[APPLY_CURRENT_CREATURE_VARIATION]Here, I copy from HALFLING_HLG, load SPECIALBEAST_VARIATION_PUTNAM, then I add a few things to SPECIALBEAST_VARIATION_PUTNAM that relate specifically to elements of balance. If APPLY_CURRENT_CREATURE_VARIATION were a relic, that wouldn't work, but it does.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 26, 2013, 04:21:08 pm
I'm not going to question it too deeply. If it ain't broke, don't fix it, as the adage goes.
Post by: Halfling on September 26, 2013, 09:28:47 pm
@Hugo: strand extraction is used to extract celestium strands, but that's irrelevant as they still won't do it.
The social skills idea is interesting, but is it enough? Mamaphints can be so common, and I'd like them to not become mayors too often. It's funny if it happens sometimes, like once a thousand games, "this elephant is so great (not that he can speak) that we decided to make him our mayor", but if it has a significant chance of happening it's just stupid. Also it removes the whole mayors make mandates yet are needed to run your village thing. And if there's more intelligent pets coming, they all need the fix so politics doesn't look like a zoo where it's occasionally a bear that's the mayor and occasionally some kind of smart octopus or killer whale with legs.
At least for halflings, the mayoral position could very well have
[ALLOWED_CREATURE:HALFLING_HLG:FEMALE][ALLOWED_CREATURE:HALFLING_HLG:MALE]
Post by: WillowLuman on September 26, 2013, 11:09:05 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 26, 2013, 11:36:31 pm
Oh hey. Do they show up on halflings' list of friends? Do they get thoughts about losing friends when those dies? Because that's really... another thing. Do they qualify as sapients for ethics?
Seriously I think this is WAY too much trouble for what sackhead wanted as an easter egg: that a mamaphint could wrestle an enemy's weapon away with its trunk and then learn to use it. That would have been achievable with just natural skill in wrestling and natural skill in all weapons.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 26, 2013, 11:42:02 pm
They don't have a "friends" list or bad thoughts, but they do show up in others friends lists (indicating how many they have) and citizens do get "lost a friend" thoughts when they die. This is going of Tigermen, but it works the same.
Post by: Halfling on September 26, 2013, 11:45:22 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 26, 2013, 11:57:25 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 12:04:14 am
Post by: Dorsidwarf on September 27, 2013, 01:08:52 am
It isn't that ridiculous - one local council was defeated in the elections... By a pet cat.
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 06:08:37 am
I'll just PM sackhead about this.
If we don't get a response in time, before you upload Putnam, suggest push: social skills fix (mamaphint aptitudes for social skills minimal or overflown to negative if possible) and halfling mayoral position limited to halflings only. Other races can still have inevitable mamaphint nobles such as as a formic regent.
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 07:19:52 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 10:15:23 am
Post by: vyznev on September 27, 2013, 11:39:39 am
We started out by wiping the raw/objects folder and recreating it from scratch, but with the addition of the troll speech file, we've now expanded into data/speech. Also, while looking at what else there is under the data folder, I figured out a nifty new (at least to me, might be old news to others) modding trick:
(http://vyznev.net/misc/df/dfscratch_fortressintro_halfling.png)
More pragmatically, should we amend the installation instructions? "Delete your raw/objects folder and unzip this file in its place." doesn't really work anymore if we start messing with the data folder too.
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 11:58:07 am
That window frame looks a lot like aurorae. Now, I'm not sure we should be editing those into anything specific for a given race, but - what's the correct command to open said files?
Considering multiple races are playable and do everything, now that I think of it, replacing fort mode dialog screens with something more neutral would be desirable.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 12:07:33 pm
AFAIK, we're just replacing raws and adding some new data files, possibly editing them. We want to make something that people can install if they only have a fresh copy of DF, with a little file-moving. No external programs or hacks, just a new raw folder and unzip/replace the data folder.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 12:10:48 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 12:21:45 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 12:26:57 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 01:00:36 pm
Ah well... but since he can do it and is interested, so much the better. Pm'd about it too. :P
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 01:43:44 pm
"Dig that dirt!" doesn't quite have the dramatic appeal of "Strike the Earth!", and neither match that not all play styles in this mod revolve around digging. Though, even for aboveground constructions, some "Striking the earth" is involved, i.e. groundbreaking, so perhaps it still works.
"A new chapter of your history" or "your people's history" could be what we're looking for.
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 02:39:24 pm
I never figured out how to use that utility putnam made. Damn. I guess vyznev can do it for us.
I didn't make it, I just spam it everywhere whenever people ask and use it for a couple of my mods.
Post by: vyznev on September 27, 2013, 03:35:02 pm
Considering multiple races are playable and do everything, now that I think of it, replacing fort mode dialog screens with something more neutral would be desirable.
Yeah, the screenshot above was really just a test to see if it worked at all. We really should come up with something that works for any playable race. (It would also be nice to know what substitution strings work; with luck, we might be able to get, say, the name of the race inserted into the text.)
Incidentally, how did you edit that file?
I made a pair of Perl scripts to convert them to plain text files and back:
Spoiler: Perl scripts (click to show/hide)
That's why I'm a little miffed at the creators of the original so far to be unnamed utilities. They could have just told us how to do it instead of distributing a stupid chunk of useless binary.
Agreed. So here's the meat of it:
- Each file contains a 4-byte little-endian length tag, followed by a zlib (RFC 1950) DEFLATE stream.
- The decompressed stream starts with a 4-byte count, followed by the indicated number of text records.
- Each text record starts with two little-endian length tags, first a 4-byte one and then a 2-byte one. Both contain the same value. Don't ask me why. These length tags are followed by the indicated number of bytes of text.
- Each file seems to contain at least three text records, sometimes more. The first record just repeats the name of the file, the second contains the title, and the remaining records contain the body of the announcement. There doesn't seem to be any obvious logic in how the body is split into records; I suspect the splitting points may simply correspond to manual line breaks in whatever text file these were originally generated from, and my scripts behave accordingly (i.e. they map each record to one line, and vice versa).
Code: [Select]
fortressintro
[TITLE]A Dwarven Outpost[/TITLE]
[P]You have arrived. After a journey from the Mountainhomes into the
forbidding wilderness beyond, your harsh trek has finally
ended. Your party of seven is to make an
outpost for the glory of all of [VAR:NATIVENAME:GLOBAL:YOURCIV].
[P]There are almost no supplies left, but with stout labor
comes sustenance. Whether by bolt, plow or hook, provide
for your dwarves. You are expecting a supply caravan just before
winter entombs you, but it is Spring now.
Enough time to delve secure lodgings, ere the [VAR:NAME_PLURAL:GLOBAL:LOCAL_LARGE_PREDATOR] get hungry.
A new chapter of dwarven history begins here at this place, [VAR:NATIVENAME:GLOBAL:YOURFORT],
"[VAR:TRANSLATEDNAME:GLOBAL:YOURFORT]". Strike the earth!
Things to test:
- Can there be more than one DEFLATE stream per file? The presence of the length tag would allow it, but I suspect it may just be there to simplify the input code.
- What happens if the first record doesn't match the file name?
- Does the title need to be a separate record, or can it share a record with the body? What happens if you have more than one title? No title?
- What tags can we use in the body? The decoded text above shows a few, but are there more?
Ps. I just tested, and it seems the Perl scripts above can decode all the files under data/announcement, data/dipscript and data/help folders. The data/index file is also in the same format, but the strings in it have been further obfuscated somehow,
Edit: The subtraction trick works, except that after the fifth byte, you loop back to 255 again. In Perl code:
Code: [Select]
my @str = unpack "C*", $str;
for my $k (0 .. $#str) {
$str[$k] = 255 - ($k % 5) - $str[$k];
}
$str = pack "C*", @str;
And here's the decoded index file:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'm not sure how all those lines relate to each other, but I do see some modding potential here.
Post by: Vgray on September 27, 2013, 04:12:51 pm
Post by: vyznev on September 27, 2013, 04:19:50 pm
Should someone fix the entities so that, for example, Formic sword-users are "Swordformics" instead of Swordsmen?Swordsbugs? ;)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 04:39:31 pm
snip
Try decoding the invasion announcements and the caravan ones, see which variable refers to race names.
Should someone fix the entities so that, for example, Formic sword-users are "Swordformics" instead of Swordsmen?
That's in the creature files. And I don't think it's really necessary. Linguistically, "man" just means "person" or "male person" in many languages. As seen in many ancient languages, when people were even more seperate, they didn't think of people from elsewhere as the same "species", and so had other names for them, like "men who wear their beards this way" or "men whose language sounds like 'barbararbarbar to us' ", but still called them men.
So, it's conceivable that a fantasy culture might see the same difference between themselves and a nation of foreign humans and a nation of foreign lizardmen.
But point is, the roots of words like "man" or "human" are as descriptions of people. Not wanting to dictate to STL here, but I'm guessing the Formic word for themselves would more likely translate to "person" than "bug". Or at least, more like "nation" than "nest".
Terry Pratchett puts it better than me. He has this story called "Only you can save Mankind", where some aliens ask this guy to save their race, but the universal translator renders their name for themselves as "mankind" and their name for their planet as "earth", because those are our words for "all our people" and "our planet"
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 27, 2013, 04:57:26 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 05:02:24 pm
snip
Try decoding the invasion announcements and the caravan ones, see which variable refers to race names.
I actually know this one.
Code: [Select]
GLOBAL
CHAR
IKEY
CHOICE
LOCX
LINK
TREESREMOVED
DIPLOMACYFLAG_SUCCESS
DIPLOMACYFLAG_FAILURE
YOURCIV
YOURFORT
NULL
LOCAL_LARGE_PREDATOR
RANGE
DIPLOMAT
ASSOCIATE
ACTOR
NOBLE
ADD_FLAG
REMOVE_FLAG
NATIVENAME
TRANSLATEDNAME
TITLENAME
HISTNAME
These should all be valid in the weird text files. Not sure what a few of them do.
News: Got a pm from sackhead - removing CAN_LEARN from mamaphints instead to fix these issues is okay by him. Should add natural skills to make them skilled instead.
Wouldn't CAN_SPEAK being removed fix the problem without making them able to become mayor?
Post by: kero42 on September 27, 2013, 05:12:24 pm
Some formic merchants have been sitting on the border of my map for a while, as my little insect men are too busy to finish the depot. Apparently I left them waiting so long that the merchant fell into melancholy. The weird thing is that his pack beetle did too. Is that normal? I'll admit to having little experience with these things, even in vanilla, but I was pretty sure pack beetles weren't meant to sucumb to melancholy.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
While I'm posting:
Also, can any one think of a reason that my formics can't butcher the other dead pack beetles (that belong to me and starved due to neglect). The're in a refuse stockpile, my ants have butchering enabled, and the butchers workshop is slaughtering live animals (namely hounds and water grubs, did not anticipate how much they could breed when I decided to bring ten grubs :P) quite fine. Apart from that, everything seems to be working fine, but its annoying not being able to see what caste a formic is when creating a squad, (as while I would like to use workers as an emergency "defend the queen at all costs" squad, I would prefer to leave the soldiering to the soldier caste).
Overall, I'm quite enjoying myself here.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 05:21:41 pm
I think, without the stockpile, bodies are just treated like refuse.
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 06:08:28 pm
Considering multiple races are playable and do everything, now that I think of it, replacing fort mode dialog screens with something more neutral would be desirable.
Yeah, the screenshot above was really just a test to see if it worked at all. We really should come up with something that works for any playable race. (It would also be nice to know what substitution strings work; with luck, we might be able to get, say, the name of the race inserted into the text.)Incidentally, how did you edit that file?
I made a pair of Perl scripts to convert them to plain text files and back:Spoiler: Perl scripts (click to show/hide)That's why I'm a little miffed at the creators of the original so far to be unnamed utilities. They could have just told us how to do it instead of distributing a stupid chunk of useless binary.
Agreed. So here's the meat of it:For example, here's the decoded version of data/announcement/fortressintro from vanilla DF, with one line per record:
- Each file contains a 4-byte little-endian length tag, followed by a zlib (RFC 1950) DEFLATE stream.
- The decompressed stream starts with a 4-byte count, followed by the indicated number of text records.
- Each text record starts with two little-endian length tags, first a 4-byte one and then a 2-byte one. Both contain the same value. Don't ask me why. These length tags are followed by the indicated number of bytes of text.
- Each file seems to contain at least three text records, sometimes more. The first record just repeats the name of the file, the second contains the title, and the remaining records contain the body of the announcement. There doesn't seem to be any obvious logic in how the body is split into records; I suspect the splitting points may simply correspond to manual line breaks in whatever text file these were originally generated from, and my scripts behave accordingly (i.e. they map each record to one line, and vice versa).
Code: [Select]fortressintro
[TITLE]A Dwarven Outpost[/TITLE]
[P]You have arrived. After a journey from the Mountainhomes into the
forbidding wilderness beyond, your harsh trek has finally
ended. Your party of seven is to make an
outpost for the glory of all of [VAR:NATIVENAME:GLOBAL:YOURCIV].
[P]There are almost no supplies left, but with stout labor
comes sustenance. Whether by bolt, plow or hook, provide
for your dwarves. You are expecting a supply caravan just before
winter entombs you, but it is Spring now.
Enough time to delve secure lodgings, ere the [VAR:NAME_PLURAL:GLOBAL:LOCAL_LARGE_PREDATOR] get hungry.
A new chapter of dwarven history begins here at this place, [VAR:NATIVENAME:GLOBAL:YOURFORT],
"[VAR:TRANSLATEDNAME:GLOBAL:YOURFORT]". Strike the earth!
Things to test:
- Can there be more than one DEFLATE stream per file? The presence of the length tag would allow it, but I suspect it may just be there to simplify the input code.
- What happens if the first record doesn't match the file name?
- Does the title need to be a separate record, or can it share a record with the body? What happens if you have more than one title? No title?
- What tags can we use in the body? The decoded text above shows a few, but are there more?
Ps. I just tested, and it seems the Perl scripts above can decode all the files under data/announcement, data/dipscript and data/help folders. The data/index file is also in the same format, but the strings in it have been further obfuscated somehow,and I haven't fully figured out the method yet. (Subtracting the first byte of each string from 255, the second from 254, etc. seems to be enough for the first few bytes, but then it breaks down.)
Edit: The subtraction trick works, except that after the fifth byte, you loop back to 255 again. In Perl code:Code: [Select]my @str = unpack "C*", $str;
for my $k (0 .. $#str) {
$str[$k] = 255 - ($k % 5) - $str[$k];
}
$str = pack "C*", @str;
And here's the decoded index file:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'm not sure how all those lines relate to each other, but I do see some modding potential here.
Wonderful, wonderful. Now this is something I'll be happy to endorse. Thanks for your contribution. I'll also put it in the first post.
So with that, would you like to write the "neutral" intro yourself or is there another volunteer? I think he should get to do it if he wants to because he brought it up and made it easy.
Oh, how did you figure this one out?
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 06:26:36 pm
Wouldn't CAN_SPEAK being removed fix the problem without making them able to become mayor?
They don't have CAN_SPEAK, only CAN_LEARN and that is enough to cause all the issues.
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 06:27:56 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 27, 2013, 06:29:58 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 07:34:09 pm
If the game comes up with a corrupt compressed file error, replace kingarrival with a vanilla one. I had no opportunity to test it, since it's not exactly the easiest thing to test.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 27, 2013, 08:31:43 pm
Vids shall be up shortly.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 09:53:51 pm
We've got monks that learn to unravel and reshape the universe through sheer thought, and also the possibility of people doing the same by learning metaphysical truths. Both are knowledge/philosophy based, and both currently do similar things within the game.
There must be a link between the practices, I think, and if not we may have to change them to differentiate them a bit. But they are thematically similar, so I would prefer to find the connection rather than rewriting them.
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 10:13:20 pm
So, uh.
Uh.
Holy fucking shit. I just ran a batch file to decode every single one of the weird text files in the game and... the help files are arranged by hyperlinks:
Code: (Adventurer's manual code) [Select]
a_first
[TITLE]The Manual: Your First Adventurer[/TITLE]
Before you begin, you need to create your adventurer.
[B]
First, you choose from among the available human, dwarf and elf civilizations or choose a retired adventurer once you have one. All characters are currently associated to a human hamlet or town when they begin as those are the only ones that have fleshed-out sites. New adventurers also pick a status from among peasant, hero and demigod. The only effect of this status is to determine how powerful your character is at the beginning of the game. The status will be indicated in your introduction in legends mode.
[B]
Second, you need to select attributes and skills to improve. Among skills, most of the mental ones have no use in adventure mode currently, but kinesthetic sense and spatial sense can be used in combat. Fighter and Observer are useful skills for combat. Fighter influences your aiming chances greatly, relatively to your opponent's skill. Your weapon skill will determine your starting equipment. In the final screen you can select a name and gender for yourself.
[B]
Unless your world was somehow catastrophically depopulated, you should start in a hamlet or town with many cottages. Feel free to explore, but in order to give yourself some direction, you can talk ([IKEY:A_TALK]) to people to get information and recruit followers. The number and quality of the people that will join you depends on your overall skill and reputation. You can ask people in town for numerous tasks at a time, though you might want to avoid this to reduce clutter in your log. If somebody refers you elsewhere for a task, you can still ask for tasks again to obtain any additional tasks that person is interested in mentioning.
[B]
Once you are ready to go, you can press [IKEY:A_TRAVEL] (in friendly locations). This takes you to the travel map, where you can move more quickly to your destination. View your adventurer log ([IKEY:A_LOG]) to help you locate sites you know about or to remind you of your tasks. You cannot enter certain sites from the travel map. Stop travel ([IKEY:A_END_TRAVEL]) from the outskirts to approach these places carefully.
[B]
You'll need to eat and drink. You start with some water, and you can refill your waterskin at a river or well. Food is sold in town and you can also butcher animals that you kill in the wilderness. It is important to stay well-rested, but it is dangerous to sleep outside, especially at night. Travel with others or obtain permission to sleep in cottages or castles for the night.
[B]
If you cannot make use of the objects you find, remember that you can still sell them at towns and obtain more useful ones there. There are many currencies in use in the world, and you may find that you have to trade in some types of coins as regular objects. This devalues them significantly at this time.
[B]
Remember to check the key bindings to see a list of your options. There are many commands that were not described here.
[B]
[LINK:data/help/a_keys]Key Bindings[/LINK]
What this means is that help files can be included in-game. For any mod.
Wowee zowee.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 10:18:34 pm
Holy fuck! Well, we'll need to be careful. Wouldn't want to provide confusion, but also wouldn't want to give people a whole wiki from within the game. And wouldn't want to remove quick help reminders from those who haven't entirely figured out the UI (most people). Still, getting the play guides in there would be awesome.
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 10:20:28 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 10:22:24 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 10:34:14 pm
Post by: Vgray on September 27, 2013, 10:39:28 pm
"Create barrel" and "Test vigor" I think it was.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 27, 2013, 10:42:13 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 27, 2013, 10:50:24 pm
Adventurer already has a full control listing.
Yeah, which is why we don't need to replace it entirely.
But I'm thinking you meant add to when you said replace?
Post by: Putnam on September 27, 2013, 11:26:39 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 08:09:34 am
That was a very quiet announcement. After 2 weeks of work, Putnam's turn is now current. Features lots of new things. Please feel free to try it out :)
Pming Godlysockpuppet.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 08:15:07 am
Should the create barrel and summon test vigor reactions for adventurers maybe be deleted by now? I think they must date back to when "alchemy" was the thing and they're obviously just for testing.
Well, the rules don't exactly allow that straight up (rather, StL, is deleting them okay?) but having them visible in adventure mode by default could be considered a bug caused by the adventure mode enabled token being present even for uploaded versions, even though these are test reactions.
(http://s15.postimg.org/hja2q2crf/adventure.png)
I find the adventure mode is much enhanced in many ways since a few versions ago. It's quite pleasing to play. The full list of new things I'm particularly happy about such as proper starting equipment, new materials, new creatures etc. would be exhausting to write. Some things:
- There can be huge amounts of psionic fortresses, even though one civilization only builds one, because they form many civilizations.
- Tea plants are still a garish color.
- This is old news but I'm not sure if it has been said explicitly before - skilled, hostile formic soldiers can be amazing shield walls with their 3 shields per ant. An adept bowman, I shot a full 25 arrows at one master, and they were all blocked.
(http://s10.postimg.org/4rzwfex2x/adventure2.png)
- Halflings can wear two (leather) top hats if they choose. I'm not sure how that works. They should probably have been "shaped".
- Found a chunk of magmaline in a dungeon among a pile of corpses (corpse of a pale rider). Nice.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 28, 2013, 11:33:20 am
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 11:49:16 am
- Change tea plant color to something less awesome than "purple on bright magenta background"
- Remove alchemy testing reactions
- Halfling top hats should be [SHAPED] so you can't wear several at once, that doesn't really make sense the same way as being able to wear a waistcoat under a tailcoat does.
I got in touch with Godlysockpuppet and Lost in Nowhere. Godlysockpuppet will skip. Lost in Nowhere is ready to take his turn. If you read this, your turn starts now. Hf :)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 12:07:01 pm
Also, now I'm tempted to re-add the barrel thing to my game and make an adventurer who's only allowed to attack by throwing barrels.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 12:17:09 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on September 28, 2013, 12:20:24 pm
K. Putnam, when you have the time, sugg fixes:Already fixed the tea plant color issues; I might as well fix the other things.
- Change tea plant color to something less awesome than "purple on bright magenta background"
- Remove alchemy testing reactions
- Halfling top hats should be [SHAPED] so you can't wear several at once, that doesn't really make sense the same way as being able to wear a waistcoat under a tailcoat does.
I got in touch with Godlysockpuppet and Lost in Nowhere. Godlysockpuppet will skip. Lost in Nowhere is ready to take his turn. If you read this, your turn starts now. Hf :)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 12:38:06 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 12:46:47 pm
They definitely have potential to have very many civilizations survive worldgen compared to other races and be relatively commonplace (as the player sees it - even if they only have a few sites, if there's a longer list of their civs than anything as you start they don't really get an air of mystery).
If this is intended then why not. If this is unintended you could set the civ cap to say 3 (they'll still survive, in all likelihood) or make them not indiv. controllable so you don't see it to begin with.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on September 28, 2013, 01:03:31 pm
Edit: Found them.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 01:06:12 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 01:10:29 pm
Attention halfling players/playtesters: It's not listed in the changelogs, but as of Putnam's upload halflings can make and wear leather armor to improve survivability. The player guide has been updated to reflect this. You can also discover halfling-sized leather armor pieces in adventure mode.
The pieces are hat/cap, coat, gloves and boots. Whether you can make leather boots is up to luck; most halfling civs don't bother making them, some do. The coats cover the arms and neck (waistcoats don't, however). There is no piece for greaves: coat tails cover the legs, but not the feet.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 01:43:06 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 01:43:34 pm
@Halfling That's odd, I see their historical figures killed off in droves and most of them fail fatally while attempting to slay beasts in legends. I'd rather not give them a low civ cap, since that would make them very, very rare in larger worlds.
NINJEDIT: Wait, no actual leather armor? Just the ability to make their normal clothes out of leather? That's not much protection. Some actual armor, set to be thicker than a coat, would be nice.
March 3rd, 111
Lake Skullcavern, one of our hunters, has been cagey recently, but we're impressed to see what he's been working on. A shield made of hound bone, carved with an image of one of those snow-mushroom-trees. He demonstrated that his creation is remarkably sturdy, bone worked such that it is almost metal. Well, we shall hang the shield in our dining hall for all to enjoy, and I think we've found someone to carve all that dragon bone.
In other news, digging ever deeper, we struck a vein of saturated Jaded Slade, and now we've got fresh water! It's a bit too deep to be convenient, but with a steady bucket train, we're filling our long-dry cistern near the surface. No more shall we worry about our water grubs or drink-crops!
March 6th, 111
Oh dear! We've gone too low! Our diggers breached into a massive cavern today - just the sort of cavern that sent a flood of murderous ants into the hobbit-holes back home. We've only punched through the ceiling, and perhaps these Northern caves contain no ants, but I'm having the hole sealed off. Can't be too careful.
March 12th, 111
Here come the Elves' traders for the season. And no doubt our own soon behind. Well, welcome, traders! We are well prepared with many wonderful things. Not only lumber, but leather and cloth we shall buy.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 01:52:47 pm
NINJEDIT: Wait, no actual leather armor? Just the ability to make their normal clothes out of leather? That's not much protection. Some actual armor, set to be thicker than a coat, would be nice.
Well, first of all, shouldn't the adherents be kind of esoteric and unusual rather than something found in every corner of the world? I mean you don't have shaolin monasteries all over the world, and would they be special if they were? That's how I imagined them originally, as such that you would have to travel all the world to find their monastery, not visit the one close by.
Anyway... How do you actually set something to be thicker than a coat? I don't know that DF makes the distinction of armor thickness. The armorlevel is set to 1 (leather), they have high coverage and the structural elasticity flag to make them useless as armor that you use for clothes is not set. The fact that they're leather padded versions of civilian clothing is just for flavor and coolness; since my organic materials have from the start had values that are superior to vanilla, in a conscious decision to boost the usability of organic material equipment, gameplay mechanics-wise, they should be inferior to metal but superior to vanilla leather.
Also, I see that jaded slade, originally added to annoy, saves another fort :P
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 01:58:36 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 01:59:35 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 02:03:02 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 02:08:51 pm
Well, if I added a cap I'd prefer it to be something like 10 or 15, as they were optimized with medium-large worlds in mind. A better solution might be to lower the littersize of their breeding "halfling" castes.
Your current civ cap is 10 and if you gen a medium world with "Create New World!" (tested five) that typically makes them present in every region of the world (they're ANY_LAND). So if the intent is that they're unusual this is not the case for medium worlds and if the intent is that they're found everywhere, this is how it is already. You definitely don't need more.
Also, while the breeding rate is super duper high, making them breed less would make it less deterministic. Isn't that the inferior solution? Let's say you want there to be 5 monasteries in the world. Isn't it better to know you're going to get 5 (high survivability, cap 5) than aim for 1-10 (variable survivability, cap 10)?
Again, I don't see this as a problem or a bug, it just kind of conflicts with my earlier image of them as something rare and unique in the world.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 02:19:33 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 02:24:55 pm
There's also one more factor that affects it. I typically aim for "pangaea" style worlds for easy adventuring and reject ones with separate islands and continents manually. This may weigh down civilizations that go to war (?).
Post by: Gnorm on September 28, 2013, 02:25:16 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 02:27:47 pm
I've never seen Lizardfolk, or anyone else, do that. Strategically, it would actually be better to space forts out and have some within the rest of the territory, but it is most curious. Please upload the save, I want to see these "Great Walls"
They stopped after around 100 years, but still...
Since I'm just using the default putnam files, so using the gen parameters shouldn't result in anything different:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 02:29:18 pm
Should the capitalization be "Daemonic Cherub"? Because now it may show up as "Daemonic cherub Dark Fortress".
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 02:39:52 pm
I guess it could be due to chance. The mentioned five trials were "Create New World!", all other settings unadjusted, size medium.
There's also one more factor that affects it. I typically aim for "pangaea" style worlds for easy adventuring and reject ones with separate islands and continents manually. This may weigh down civilizations that go to war (?).
Even if a civ gets wiped out, their sites should still show up as ruins. They can't actually be wiped off the map, leaving nothing.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 02:43:21 pm
My first time visiting an adherent monastery. I just stumbled into one, it was right next to other civs' fortresses. It was very bizarre. Holy crap there's many of these guys:
(http://s22.postimg.org/64ddbyzs1/adherents.png)
(http://s22.postimg.org/fq6xs9qxt/adherents2.png)
(http://s22.postimg.org/82k19ys9t/adherents3.png)
(http://s23.postimg.org/ba5q7yo7v/adherents4.png)
The large courtyard of the monastery was full of them. Everywhere I turned, there were more and more adherent missionaries meditating in silence. (every part of the fortress courtyard was equally full of missionaries)
I then entered the monastery proper, a lonely tower rising inside its walls. Therein was a crowd of adherents of various intellectual professions, as well as dozens of beekeepers. I counted 11 beekeepers on the first floor alone. So many adherent beekeepers, clerks and architects were there that they had to literally stand on top of each other, some lying down to make more room.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 02:59:06 pm
What I meant by my previous comment was that even if halfling civs or adherent civs were wiped out, you'd see their sites on the map.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 03:04:01 pm
...
...
Did no one pay attention to this? I'm going to say 'screw it' to running the lizardfolk turn, and instead get some cheap, weapons-grade materials made for this.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 03:06:44 pm
I wonder if there's any way to not make them join you. That would be good for balance. Because one of them joined me as soon as I asked and has killed three bandit groups single-handedly now.
(http://s8.postimg.org/lkyqxiyat/adherents5.png)
Just took a look at all our weapons-grade materials. The cheapest I could find is lunanium, with a material value of 14...in vanilla, Iron and Silver have values of 10...
...
...
Did no one pay attention to this? I'm going to say 'screw it' to running the lizardfolk turn, and instead get some cheap, weapons-grade materials made for this.
No, materials being more expensive than vanilla is intentional at least for my part. Feel free to change that.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 03:10:28 pm
@ZTG Please make iron and copper. We sorely need some standard materials, to give context to the others.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 03:20:43 pm
So, sorry to be so hard on the adherents. After some experience adventuring with one as my companion I'm now taking a closer look... 100% chance to inflict unconsciousness and bleeding from the brain at will? That they can keep chaining so it continues forever, having a shorter wait period than effect? Instantly killing any adventurer that goes against them? That may be "resistable" in theory but works against storm dragons in arena in practice?
I just had a gifted adherent take out 4 storm dragons. Considering earlier the thought was that if something can take out a megabeast consistently it should be a megabeast... Are you sure that's balanced? I mean I don't see any way you can criticize lizardman contact poison and have this.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 03:24:54 pm
Just took a look at all our weapons-grade materials. The cheapest I could find is lunanium, with a material value of 14...in vanilla, Iron and Silver have values of 10...
...
...
Did no one pay attention to this? I'm going to say 'screw it' to running the lizardfolk turn, and instead get some cheap, weapons-grade materials made for this.
No, materials being more expensive than vanilla is intentional at least for my part. Feel free to change that.
I realize that it would be difficult to gain meteoric iron makes sense. The other metals being rare finds or hard to make - makes sense. No one making a single cheap, maybe piece of s*** metal - What the?!?
@ZTG Please make iron and copper. We sorely need some standard materials, to give context to the others.
I would say yes to the copper, but no to the iron.
I mean I don't see any way you can criticize lizardman contact poison and have this.
When was this, by the way?
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 03:28:02 pm
Just took a look at all our weapons-grade materials. The cheapest I could find is lunanium, with a material value of 14...in vanilla, Iron and Silver have values of 10...
...
...
Did no one pay attention to this? I'm going to say 'screw it' to running the lizardfolk turn, and instead get some cheap, weapons-grade materials made for this.
No, materials being more expensive than vanilla is intentional at least for my part. Feel free to change that.
I realize that it would be difficult to gain meteoric iron makes sense. The other metals being rare finds or hard to make - makes sense. No one making a single cheap, maybe piece of s*** metal - What the?!?@ZTG Please make iron and copper. We sorely need some standard materials, to give context to the others.
I would say yes to the copper, but no to the iron. I'll add cobalt instead, along with a few bastardizations of periodic table elements.I mean I don't see any way you can criticize lizardman contact poison and have this.
When was this, by the way?
I guess you have a point. But we could do with some familiar materials. :P
Lizardman blood being contact poison was removed in HugoL bugfix because it lead to no creature having a higher than 50% chance of survival from fighting a single lizardman (even ones that don't breathe end up being paralyzed forever, and this works on massive megabeasts too). This is a game where blood spatters everywhere. Thought you knew.
If you want to make it a contact poison again, it should probably have a weaker effect. People pretty much agreed it was too much.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 03:42:17 pm
Okay.
So, sorry to be so hard on the adherents. After some experience adventuring with one as my companion I'm now taking a closer look... 100% chance to inflict unconsciousness and bleeding from the brain at will? That they can keep chaining so it continues forever, having a shorter wait period than effect? Instantly killing any adventurer that goes against them? That may be "resistable" in theory but works against storm dragons in arena in practice?
I just had a gifted adherent take out 4 storm dragons. Considering earlier the thought was that if something can take out a megabeast consistently it should be a megabeast... Are you sure that's balanced? I mean I don't see any way you can criticize lizardman contact poison and have this.
I really need more data on them. In my arena tests, it actually takes a very, very long time for them to actually kill anything when using only their interactions, except for the rare Gifted ones who can make undirected dust.
In my experience, I'd say they're balanced because you have to go out of your way to piss them off, they're kind of flimsy in worldgen due to creatures not using interactions in history (in my worlds most of their historical figures live only 20 years before a maneater or storm dragon gets them). In practice they are virtually indestructible, but their attacks do little damage and are mostly focused on disabling.
It's not like lizardfolk where they'd ambush you and you couldn't defend yourself without poisoning yourself. They're utterly passive, no bandits, and their ethics don't allow them to start wars, only to defend themselves. True it should be harder to recruit them, but we have yet to figure out a way.
Making their monasteries rarer ought to help with that. Instead of a hard cap on civs, how about turning their global population cap down? I don't remember what it is, but if you set it to 10,000, then there could never be more than 10 thousand of them at a time, or 10 monasteries. In practice there would probably be far less. The most I've ever seen is 4,000 with the current cap.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 03:50:00 pm
In adventure (and I assume, fortress) mode this is different. Note, as in the log I screencapped above, that they have metal spears. This makes them able to single handedly kill... anything I've pitted them against so far. Squids in the river, packs of hounds, groups of bandits, I'm sure megabeasts too. Their ethics makes this less relevant but it's still pretty broken mechanically.
How about setting the wait period to 1000 instead of 100? That way a single adherent can only cause unconsciousness in 1 creature for 30% of the time instead of 3 creatures 100% of the time. Seems slightly less insane.
Current is [MAX_POP_NUMBER:11000].
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 03:53:01 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 03:54:38 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 03:58:53 pm
I guess you have a point. But we could do with some familiar materials. :P
Lizardman blood being contact poison was removed in HugoL bugfix because it lead to no creature having a higher than 50% chance of survival from fighting a single lizardman (even ones that don't breathe end up being paralyzed forever, and this works on massive megabeasts too). This is a game where blood spatters everywhere. Thought you knew.
If you want to make it a contact poison again, it should probably have a weaker effect. People pretty much agreed it was too much.
...You couldn't have at least f****** pm'ed me before you did so to make sure I knew!?!? I would have been f****** open to allowing people to change it, and would have made the changes myself, if someone f****** told me! [/rant]
You know why I put the syndrome that is supposed to take several months before it takes effect in there? To provide a challenge of varying the fortress military. Granted, I could have, and probably should have, raised the Pop_triggers by a bit to offset it, but still that was the point. Well, one of the points. As you recall, I was planning on trying to add multiple things to the swamps, and most of it would have had poisonous blood, so naturally, the lizardfolk would have had their own poisonous blood from being in those areas.
It's not like lizardfolk where they'd ambush you and you couldn't defend yourself without poisoning yourself. They're utterly passive, no bandits, and their ethics don't allow them to start wars, only to defend themselves. True it should be harder to recruit them, but we have yet to figure out a way.
If I had known, I would have changed it, but I never had the time to test it, and not a single person gave me any data on the lizardfolk besides ZMC. That is it. All the data I had to work with was from a short stint of someone in fortress mode, whose problems I had fixed, even after my official bug-fixing turn. But besides that, I didn't know anything. And don't ask why I didn't know about the later discussion, I am a senior in high school with, in my line-up of classes: Dual-Credit Calculus and Advanced Placement English. Add in a few other things that like to do in my time, and I have nothing left.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 04:08:56 pm
The whole blood thing worked differently in adventure mode, because something that takes months in fort mode can happen in 2 days or less in Adventure mode. A certainly fatal contact syndrome from hostiles with the potential to show up in dozens, without any provocation, seems a bit much, though. Maybe a fatal syndrome from drinking their blood, and blisters or nausea from contact?
About iron: we've already got meteoric iron, which is far too common (and deep) than any meteor has a right to be. In it's current state it's not very meteoric. I think we should have some regular iron (with a single kind of ore), and make meteoric iron use gem behavior, so it shows up uncommonly as relatively "meteor" sized clusters within most kinds of rock.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 04:12:52 pm
I guess you have a point. But we could do with some familiar materials. :P
Lizardman blood being contact poison was removed in HugoL bugfix because it lead to no creature having a higher than 50% chance of survival from fighting a single lizardman (even ones that don't breathe end up being paralyzed forever, and this works on massive megabeasts too). This is a game where blood spatters everywhere. Thought you knew.
If you want to make it a contact poison again, it should probably have a weaker effect. People pretty much agreed it was too much.
...You couldn't have at least f****** pm'ed me before you did so to make sure I knew!?!? I would have been f****** open to allowing people to change it, and would have made the changes myself, if someone f****** told me! [/rant]
No need to get all mad. You yourself state you were busy. It's really hard to get a hold of busy people, people even leave these forums all the time, and this needs to go forward to ever make completion, whatever that is. So we change things and then when you scream, we can change them back. These things aren't permanent and they're not finalized, nor personal.
There's two ways to play the game: fortress and adventurer mode. Even if lizardfolk contact poison weren't op for fortress mode - which it was, consider how fast stains spread and how much trouble such poisons can be - it definitely is for adventurer mode. You get ambushed, and then often die inevitably some time later. So it needed to be changed urgently. PMing you would have been good though, so sorry about that.
How the hell do they have metal spears? Are you sure that's not an adventurer? They have neither metal nor any weapons permitted in their entity file. I think something happened to the raws you're using, they're producing much different results than mine.
Obviously it is an adventurer companion (stated). I would not test with anything but fresh downloaded raws. But now that you said it, sorry, he may have picked it up somewhere. He must have killed the one he picked it up from, though, since I did not interfere. I'll try to find another monastery and verify.
But consider the following:
1) These creatures WILL come visit your fortress 4 times per year.
2) They are capable of killing anything in the game that has a brain; even one of them can defeat a horde of armed opponents or a megabeast. The above makes it a valid strategy to let them kill any siege.
3) They may be limited to push attacks by default but they are definitely capable of acquiring equipment, being able to grasp.
4) They are capable of going mad if something bad happens.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 04:20:13 pm
I've never seen a siege arrive with anything but the weapons specified in their entity file, so I doubt they'd ever show up armed. And you'd have to intentionally piss them off by attacking them or seizing their goods, as local wildlife or other civs aren't likely to destroy their caravan.
Caravans don't show up during a seige, I think, but a Seige can arrive while a caravan is still present. So if they only came once a year, the chances of them saving your fort are fairly slim.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 04:29:46 pm
Food for thought: they may (I'd say will) kill a
Furthermore I just feel that in an open world game something being able to unavoidably instakill you, like these will an adventurer, is bad game design. It's kind of like a forced choice; an invisible wall. You're not supposed to go there. Something being massively hard is okay, literally impossible is not really.
Also halfling caravan frequency was already found annoying when it was 3x/years so 4x is just worse :P
So how about both a nerf to their unconsciousness abilities and a reduction of the frequency of their visits, both?
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 04:36:16 pm
About iron: we've already got meteoric iron, which is far too common (and deep) than any meteor has a right to be. In it's current state it's not very meteoric. I think we should have some regular iron (with a single kind of ore), and make meteoric iron use gem behavior, so it shows up uncommonly as relatively "meteor" sized clusters within most kinds of rock.
Too common? I prefer to see it as the gods decided to throw a f***ton of meteors at the place and see what happened. The moon that causes syndromes is just the debris that got shot up high enough, and the gods decided to make it not look like a mistake.
Well, we apologize. We were having trouble hearing from people when we did it, so we went with "ask for forgiveness rather than permission, we need to get this done quickly."
That, honestly, is never a good policy.
Now that we do have time, and you've heard about it, we can figure something better out.
The whole blood thing worked differently in adventure mode, because something that takes months in fort mode can happen in 2 days or less in Adventure mode. A certainly fatal contact syndrome from hostiles with the potential to show up in dozens, without any provocation, seems a bit much, though. Maybe a fatal syndrome from drinking their blood, and blisters or nausea from contact?
That time dichonomy is a pain, isn't it? I've got some ideas on how to get it balanced, don't worry.
No need to get all mad. You yourself state you were busy. It's really hard to get a hold of busy people, people even leave these forums all the time, and this needs to go forward to ever make completion, whatever that is. So we change things and then when you scream, we can change them back. These things aren't permanent and they're not finalized, nor personal.
I've calmed down. Still, I'm on the forums a fair amount of time, and a fair amount of that time beyond the classes was running the forum games I have, so I would have noticed.
Also halfling caravan frequency was already found annoying when it was 3x/years so 4x is just worse :P
So how about both a nerf to their unconsciousness abilities and a reduction of the frequency of their visits, both?
Considering the amount of civilizations we have now, I think one or two should be enough for any race, maybe three if they are aggressive hostiles.
Post by: Putnam on September 28, 2013, 04:47:46 pm
Note that I was reminded by these recent posts; I'm not reacting to them. I think ZtG is perfectly reasonable in wanting permission for editing of his additions, but since my modding turn started I've wanted it to be made known that I need none and I just kinda forgot to mention it.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 04:50:48 pm
Well, we apologize. We were having trouble hearing from people when we did it, so we went with "ask for forgiveness rather than permission, we need to get this done quickly."
That, honestly, is never a good policy.
Disagree on this one. It is the best policy. Well, what the best policy is depends on your intended result. For ours, this is the best one.
We can either get bogged down on asking everybody's permission every time, and shut down when there's more and more people and more and more have moved on to other things. Or we can see if they really care; if they don't their permission is implicit, and if they do they'll balk if we act against their intention.
It can take several days and a lot of idle discussion to formulate the exact fix pondering what the original idea was, then ask and announce someone's permission, and it's already pretty hard to get even something as silly as mamaphints being sapients or apple trees being unprocessable or tea plants making the ground below bright magenta fixed. We don't need any more challenges there. Dealing with how hard it is to get this bugfixed is the big challenge. Compare this to the expense of taking 5 minutes to fix it, another 5 to announce it and then letting it stay fixed or changing it later and you can see which is the rational solution.
The goal is not to be pleasant (edit: or rather it is to be pleasant, but to a different group: the players and followers, not the modders). It is to make working content. We don't have voters and the audience is players, not political scientists. That's why this was made the rule. :P
I will change it if it causes more controversy than it's worth or if most people who are active here feel, even after hearing the argument, like it's not a good idea to act fast, but I see it as the best way.
The analogy is a software project rather than a parliamentary democracy.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 28, 2013, 06:58:04 pm
I am in full agreement on this matter with Halfling. If major bugs or balance issues are allowed to stick around for long periods of time, they'll accumulate and DFFS will quickly become unfun to play. Poison blood? Great idea! Wish I'd thought of it back on my turn. Implementation was overpowered thanks to the Dwarven Law of General Relativity, and it was better to remove it than spend modder time balancing it.
And on a tangentially related note (it was touched upon in Zanzetkuken's post, at least :P ) we should probably just have one caravan per civilization per year. There's a bunch of them now, so that should give at least one caravan per season.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on September 28, 2013, 07:25:07 pm
Also, how do you find world populations?
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 07:29:22 pm
The psychological conflict, I think, is that one may view somebody's "code" as a sacrosanct expression of their personality. However, this is rather a work of putting many things together and building a machine than putting them side by side and making a gallery; a badly thought out part is not just like a part you might not like, it affects everything else. I would rather advocate the simple view that your code is only meaningful if it's fun to play. Therefore, any well-meant improvements should be, by default and so assumed, welcome (unless we completely missed the point of what you were trying to do).
I mean, who cares if you made something that's very cool but breaks the game? The universe is littered with pointless mods. If nobody wants to play it, it's irrelevant and it doesn't express or deliver anything to anyone. And on the contrary it's relevant if it makes people happy. Therefore, players come first. Therefore, bug and balance fixes, keeping players happy and constructive criticism come first, politics and keeping modders happy later.
That's how it must be to work efficiently... on the other hand, to paraphrase someone, who should care if the cat is a punk rocker with a safety pin in his nose so long as he catches mice. This is not principle, it's just an attempt to make things work.
In bug news, this:
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:RAW_APPLE_TREE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:apple tree] <--
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:apple tree] <--
causes you to find "apple tree bolts" in adventurer mode. Suggest change to "apple tree wood" or "apple wood" in marked lines.
@Lost in Nowhere: you would want the creature to shoot jets of fire, perhaps? Material emission is your friend. The vanilla version is included in this mod because it's so near "hard coded"; see the wiki syndrome page for usage.
Post by: BlackFlyme on September 28, 2013, 07:32:24 pm
How would you make a creature light stuff on fire in general, such as cloth and wood items (Equipped and not)?
Also, how do you find world populations?
Lighting stuff on fire by virtue of simply existing?
[IMMOLATE]
Though it will not be able to control this ability. I'm not sure if it affects worn equipment though.
You can get population data by exporting map/gen information in legends mode, according to the wiki.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 07:43:38 pm
How about you use the middle ground? What I mean by this is that you complete the change, but inform the modder you are doing so, in order for them to know it has actually happened, rather than the person coming back in anger of how they were never informed that something of theirs was removed/changed without contacting them.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 07:54:34 pm
@Halfling
How about you use the middle ground? What I mean by this is that you complete the change, but inform the modder you are doing so, in order for them to know it has actually happened, rather than the person coming back in anger of how they were never informed that something of theirs was removed/changed without contacting them.
The assumption was that if you're still present and interested, you'll see it in the thread. We did discuss it and it's listed in the changelog for HugoL's upload.
But I agree it would have been classier to fire a pm at you, did apologize earlier.
Now, in that case, it simply escaped the mind, but there's a tiny bit of logic to not actually sending that pm that you may or may not agree with. Some people do sometimes get irrationally possessive when asked about something. Like, if asked whether they can part with something that they haven't used in a decade (and that has no emotional significance), they may say "no" in strong terms, even though they would never in their lifetime have noticed if it had just been removed from their possession (and gone on to someone who actually wants/needs it). So it may actually be less trouble to not ask and just do it and let them protest if it's really significant and not just if we ask. Now I'm not sure if anyone who's modded in this mod would actually be like that but that's generally speaking an issue that's just pointless to deal with when it's a case of shared development where it's only as relevant as it is good.
I'll let everyone decide how ruthless they want to be. I basically trust the logic that if you care you'll know. But since you're active after all, and we all know it, it would have been reasonable to pm you.
Post by: Gnorm on September 28, 2013, 08:11:06 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 08:18:01 pm
In other news, I too, as was voiced earlier, was pretty annoyed that I was barely able to tell some LKR raw stone walls from the ground. It's kazurot, I think? walls made of which look exactly like shrubs on the ground (while unilluminated tiles of the wall look like gray squares). I don't have a good screenshot now, but...
So I asked Laula about it by PM and he says it's fine to change them. Specifically to change them to anything that looks "non-ugly". How about a grey background for all stone tiles, or anyone have a better idea?
Post by: Gnorm on September 28, 2013, 08:25:56 pm
So I asked Laula about it by PM and he says it's fine to change them. Specifically to change them to anything that looks "non-ugly". How about a grey background for all stone tiles, or anyone have a better idea?Gray backgrounds work for ores, but it would look a tad queer for a rock such azurine. By the by, has anyone made an obsidian-esque stone yet? If not, I have plans for one.
Post by: Aseaheru on September 28, 2013, 08:30:01 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 28, 2013, 08:31:57 pm
Personally, I think all common stone types (ie, layer stones, non-ore vein stones) should use that tile, but variety's nice too :)
@Aseaheru: Is the jaded slade our lava stone?
Yeah, I'm just going to download the raws now and see if I can stick together some form of play turn...
EDIT: Okay, Putnam's raws are 666kb. Great work, everyone :D
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 08:35:49 pm
The current lava stone is still "rock" (ROCK_HLG), originally intended as a placeholder in this role, so feel free to make another and remove this.
Post by: Gnorm on September 28, 2013, 08:46:37 pm
The current lava stone is still "rock" (ROCK_HLG), originally intended as a placeholder in this role, so feel free to make another and remove this.All right then:
Code: [Select]
inorganic_gnorm
[OBJECT:INORGANIC]
[INORGANIC:OBSIDIAN_GNORM][LAVA]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[MELTING_POINT:14000]
[BOILING_POINT:17520]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:blue obsidian]
[TILE:177][DISPLAY_COLOR:1:1:1]
[MAX_EDGE:20000]
[MATERIAL_VALUE:3]
[MELTING_POINT:13000]
[SOLID_DENSITY:3000]
[IGNEOUS_EXTRUSIVE][IGNEOUS_INTRUSIVE][METAMORPHIC]
[IS_STONE]
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 28, 2013, 08:55:03 pm
The Tale of Pantstraitors shall be posted within the night.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 08:56:20 pm
@Gnorm, why is the lava stone also sedimentary and metamorphic and occurs in ocean floors (ie. everywhere, rather than just volcanic areas)?
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 09:49:31 pm
Code: [Select]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:lizardfolk blood poisoning]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ORGANIC]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:POISON_IMMUNE]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:SWAMP_DWELLER]
[SYN_CONTACT]
[CE_BLISTERS:SEV:100:PROB:50:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:34800:END:72000]
[CE_NAUSEA:SEV:10:PROB:20:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000:END:72000]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:lizardfolk blood poisoning]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ORGANIC]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:POISON_IMMUNE]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:SWAMP_DWELLER]
[SYN_INGESTED]
[CE_PARALYSIS:SEV:1000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000]
[CE_VOMIT_BLOOD:SEV:1000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000]
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:1000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000]
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 10:01:31 pm
How's this for a modification of the syndrome? Contact: Nothing Major. Ingested: You are freaking screwed. There's going to be a far weaker ingested for the dragonkin.Code: [Select][SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:lizardfolk blood poisoning]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ORGANIC]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:REPTILE]
[SYN_CONTACT]
[CE_BLISTERS:SEV:100:PROB:50:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:34800:END:72000]
[CE_NAUSEA:SEV:10:PROB:20:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000:END:72000]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_NAME:lizardfolk blood poisoning]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ORGANIC]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:REPTILE]
[SYN_INGESTED]
[CE_PARALYSIS:SEV:1000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000]
[CE_VOMIT_BLOOD:SEV:1000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000]
[CE_NECROSIS:SEV:1000:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:SIZE_DILUTES:START:0:PEAK:36000]
Seems okay for balance as far as you can tell without playtesting, but because the paralysis probably instakills you with 100% prob if you go and drink the blood, the rest seems a little superfluous :P
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 28, 2013, 10:12:51 pm
Seems okay for balance as far as you can tell without playtesting, but because the paralysis probably instakills you with 100% prob if you go and drink the blood, the rest seems a little superfluous :P
Only if you are an adventurer in the field. If you use body swap on the king, have him drink it, then swap back to your character...
By the way, has someone made a civilization for the dragonkin, yet? I gave permission for anyone to do so, but I don't know if anyone has.
Files changed and added for cheap metals and the syndromes (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8014)
Post by: Gnorm on September 28, 2013, 10:42:29 pm
@Gnorm, why is the lava stone also sedimentary and metamorphic and occurs in ocean floors (ie. everywhere, rather than just volcanic areas)?That was my mistake; I'll fix that.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 10:55:05 pm
(http://s7.postimg.org/9s7yuhv3v/adventure3.png)
Post by: Aseaheru on September 28, 2013, 10:56:26 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 10:57:38 pm
@Halfling: The clothing of larger creatures being much thicker than that of smaller creatures is a fundamental bug with no known workaround, aside from nudity.
Adherents:
Okay. Found a monastery. They don't have spears, they just take them from the enemy. So that was my bad.I agree with reducing their visits (how about to Winter only?), but...
Food for thought: they may (I'd say will) kill asiege(forgot about sieges blocking caravans) or a megabeast if they arrive at the same time. If they bring a gifted adherent they kill anything in the game. This is standard behavior for caravans. They may pick up equipment on the map. If they're unable to leave, or sometimes due to a bug fail to path correctly, they may go berserk as merchants sometimes do and cause a lot of trouble, more so than anything else.
Furthermore I just feel that in an open world game something being able to unavoidably instakill you, like these will an adventurer, is bad game design. It's kind of like a forced choice; an invisible wall. You're not supposed to go there. Something being massively hard is okay, literally impossible is not really.
...
So how about both a nerf to their unconsciousness abilities and a reduction of the frequency of their visits, both?
They're not an "unavoidable" obstacle, they do not railroad you in ANY way or force you to avoid certain areas. They might be able to trounce you, but you'd have to actively pick a fight with them. They are never initially hostile. I don't see what the problem is. Occulentibus can destroy you without you being able to do much about it and they'll target you even if you're friendly. If you really want to kill an Adherent, you can take all the time you want to prepare one of the few things that can kill them (like the Occulentibus gaze vigor), because they'll never strike the first blow. You can still sneak up on them after provoking them, too. It's a challenge, but fights with them are 100% avoidable in adventure mode.
As for fortress mode, I purposefully disallowed them wagons to ease their pathfinding. If they're staying on the map too long, just do what DF players always do: wall them in and/or drop a ceiling on them once they go berserk. And in my experience, destroying three or four caravans doesn't start a war, giving the player years to correct the issue. I want them to be very, very difficult to defeat, but at the same time, it's the players' choice whether or not to face that challenge. It's like demanding a nerf to dragons because they get mad when you strike them.
Also, their powers are pretty much useless against things that don't have minds. People have golems, zombies, machines, and other things in the works, so the list of things they can't kill is growing, and already nonzero. Likely there will eventually be something made from endgame materials that will kill them, too. In short, they're a challenge to fight, but you have to actively seek out such a fight.
Materials:
About iron: we've already got meteoric iron, which is far too common (and deep) than any meteor has a right to be. In it's current state it's not very meteoric. I think we should have some regular iron (with a single kind of ore), and make meteoric iron use gem behavior, so it shows up uncommonly as relatively "meteor" sized clusters within most kinds of rock.
Too common? I prefer to see it as the gods decided to throw a f***ton of meteors at the place and see what happened. The moon that causes syndromes is just the debris that got shot up high enough, and the gods decided to make it not look like a mistake.
Yes, but it's not really "meteoric" if it constitutes a good chunk of the planet. The Earth is essentially made entirely of meteorites, but we don't call just any mineral "meteoric". If it's gone through the geologic cycle and become veins within layers of rock, it is by no means meteoric any longer. Therefore, we should either change it from veins to clusters (since then the material would be grouped in clumps, like burried meteorites), or rename it just "iron". Thematically, we ought to have regular iron if we have a supposedly rarer, better form of iron. And linguistically, wouldn't people just call it "iron" if it was the only kind of iron?
Hobbits work exclusively with Iridium, one of if not the most rare and precious metals on earth, yet don't have any iron to make simple tools for their pastoral lifestyle. Iridium, a fairly obscure metal which requires industrialized technology to make into anything useful, but no iron.
It's very important that we have the standard materials of most any setting, so people have a reference point for the fantastic materials. What the hell is Lunanium and Aeresium? Sounds like jargon, is of no meaning to people who hear it or find it in game. They can hardly conceptualize it without something known to compare it to. I say we need copper, iron, and steel so people can compare stuff to them for combat properties; we need silver and gold so people can see how valuable stuff is compared to those. Hell, we have Iridium but not platinum, and people didn't even know there was a difference between the two until the 1800's.
Stone layers:
I think all stone should have a background, but not necessarily grey. Any color is fine, as long as it's not black. We have way too many stones with a colored icon on a black background, which is very confusing as it looks like either the ground cover or a whole bunch of items. In vanilla, you can tell at a glance what's open space/ground and what's solid wall because walls look solid. Too often in this, a quick glance cannot distinguish between the walls, the floor, open space, and rock walls. So just give it a background, ANY background.
Let's not use Jaded Slade as a lava rock. It's undiggable and contains water, which would make a massive mess and eliminate much of the fun of playing with fluids.
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 11:15:54 pm
I guess when you put it that way, making them only appear in winter will be a good step.
The reason why these guys being able to trounce everything stays on the mind and oculentibus does not, I guess, is that while in adventurer mode I still have not in all this time run into an oculentibus once, these guys are not rare. But it's true they don't force you to fight them. Oh, the oculentibus should probably be a semimegabeast too.
Various examples of rare super-strong monsters notwithstanding, I still think e.g. "paralyze one creature for 30-50% of the time and cause a variety of debuffs" would be more reasonable for an ordinary member of that civilization than "paralyze possibly several creatures forever and cause a variety of debuffs". I mean even if they don't pick a fight with you, are they all supposed to be walking gods? That you have thousands of?
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 11:26:35 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 28, 2013, 11:28:04 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 11:29:15 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 28, 2013, 11:38:43 pm
Note that in adventurer mode visiting fortresses looking for equipment is very commonplace so that would be how you meet your local adherents. Or how I do.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 28, 2013, 11:54:55 pm
They're very powerful, yes, but also detached from the world. The solution to meet my thematic goal would be to ensure the rarity of their monasteries. Adding more civs would help, since the game tries to add 1 of everything before it goes back around for 2nds. Turning the biome support down a notch could help, too.
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 12:10:49 am
However, to convey the mood here better, consider that now appealing to the precedent of the adherents that they're in, I could make a race of "supermen". They're a civilization of magical golems from another star. This civilization is never hostile to you, the player, so it doesn't strictly speaking break the game. There's only five thousand of them, a few towns on every continent. They come visit you occasionally. They're made of a modded unbreakable iridium, simply can't be killed and can turn everything hostile on the map into stone (oculentibus interaction, range 100, no LOS, attack).
The adherents obviously have more fluff and work slower, but that's the general idea. Does this contribute to the gaming experience or detract from it? Good or bad ambiance?
Anyway rarity would be good but I don't know. That's just my POV. Would be nice to hear from someone else in this debate too.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 01:07:20 am
I'd intended that the main reason for trading with them would be some nifty cloth they make by telekinetically arranging molecules, but the don't seem to produce it. With Putnam's update, their useful goods will be flax, logs, and hive products.
Right now there's two things (that I know of) that they're vulnerable to:
-Occulentibus
-Each other
-Plus the usual things (crushing, freezing, encasing in obsidian).
Bear in mind that when I introduced them, I said there's currently no convenient way to kill them. I wanted to avoid some "hit with silver bullet" method, so I'd intended to allow Adventurers to learn mind powers and be able to slay them in a mental battle. At some point there should be other creatures who possess mental powers, perhaps not as broad as those of beings of pure thought, but potent enough to allow them to do non-physical battle. I think it would make sense for Formic Queens to have innate Psionic ability, what with the whole hive mind thing.
PS: I have never, EVER seen anyone but the player actually pick up an item in adventure mode, and never seen non-player units in fort mode pick up weapons lying around, so I'm still skeptical of the claim that they're grabbing spears. It's quite odd and puzzling.
Also, try pitting them against Treelords. I've never seen that fight end.
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 01:32:36 am
Ironically if they could be killed with weapons of a particular material easily this would seem much less ridiculous. I wish I had read the raws before. And I honestly didn't realize all the things that can follow from "a civilization that can't be killed by ordinary means", I imagined they'd be like one monastery of a few people that you explore, admire and don't go challenging, comparable to a vanilla tower and necromancers, not regular players in the game.
PS: I have never, EVER seen anyone but the player actually pick up an item in adventure mode, and never seen non-player units in fort mode pick up weapons lying around, so I'm still skeptical of the claim that they're grabbing spears. It's quite odd and puzzling.
Above is the screencap, page 169. Unless the claim is that I hacked, altered the raws or shopped it. The adherent in question may have grabbed it in wrestling. There's plenty of reports of creatures grabbing equipment in fortress mode (the special sock a bronze colossus will kill your military with).
Seriously though, anyone else, let us know what you want. Is the inclusion of invulnerable instant unconsciousness-causing civilizations k/not? These are just our opinions here.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 01:55:24 am
Not accusing you of hacking or photoshopping, because why would you, I was just confused as to what I was seeing.
I imagined they'd be like one monastery of a few people that you explore, admire and don't go challenging, comparable to a vanilla tower and necromancers, not regular players in the game.
This was the intent. I don't know why they're appearing en masse in your worlds, but ideally there should only be 1-2 monasteries in a small world, and 5-10 in a large one.
I'd hardly call them a frequent gameplay element, nor is that the intent. They send a tiny caravan (soon only in the Winter), sell practically nothing, and otherwise can only be encountered by visiting their remote sites. Their only purpose in fort mode right now is so people can see them, and pick on them if they feel like it. They don't even do much in history, just sit there and try to defend themselves against monster rampages.
Even as is, they're not really intrusive to the game experience. They don't even have siege tokens right now, so I'm not sure if you even can pick a fight with them in fort mode.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 02:10:51 am
I think I see what's happening. [MAX_POP_NUMBER] is by civ, not by race, so 11000 might be too high. Set it to 2000 to accommodate for hermits and mass deaths, see if that reduces the number of monasteries.
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 02:15:05 am
Yeah, the only explaination I can think of is that is wrestled the spear away. I was referring to picking up weapons, though, not wresting them from their wielders. Never seen other units in adventure mode or fort mode pick them up off the ground. Not ever. So they wont arrive with weapons, and won't get them unless they just happen to grapple with a unit, by the weapon itself.
Not accusing you of hacking or photoshopping, because why would you, I was just confused as to what I was seeing.I imagined they'd be like one monastery of a few people that you explore, admire and don't go challenging, comparable to a vanilla tower and necromancers, not regular players in the game.
This was the intent. I don't know why they're appearing en masse in your worlds, but ideally there should only be 1-2 monasteries in a small world, and 5-10 in a large one.
I'd hardly call them a frequent gameplay element, nor is that the intent. They send a tiny caravan (soon only in the Winter), sell practically nothing, and otherwise can only be encountered by visiting their remote sites. Their only purpose in fort mode right now is so people can see them, and pick on them if they feel like it. They don't even do much in history, just sit there and try to defend themselves against monster rampages.
Even as is, they're not really intrusive to the game experience. They don't even have siege tokens right now, so I'm not sure if you even can pick a fight with them in fort mode.
Yeah, okay. And honestly, despite all the steam I've blown (I tend to rant and get excited if you didn't notice), the adherents are not that bad at all, as I've experienced. I mean, all you say is true - I wouldn't call them intrusive. They don't pick fights with you. They kill megabeasts in worldgen but if they send one caravan per year, they won't probably help you so much with one (potential for four is excessive but that's agreed). You can hire one, but then you can sneak+throw pebbles too. I'm more worried about what might result here, and principles of design. And that this mod has a huge tendency to leave anything unfixed and later fixing attempts ending in confusion, so if there's something bad that might result, it should be addressed sooner. So it's more nitpicking and theory than omgfixnow...
The 1 season idea is good. If you wanted to make their monasteries more remote, so you don't just stumble into one, they could be located in unusual biomes so they're not right next to regular ones rather than reducing the number.
Let's let it rest waiting more experiences since nobody else seems to mind right now, or maybe they've gone to bed, as will I :P
Post by: Timeless Bob on September 29, 2013, 02:17:51 am
Feel free to use these as an example:
"Acolyte" 9:10 - 10% chance of mind effects with a long duration recharge timer
"Initiate" 9:100 - 30% chance of mind effects with a long duration recharge timer
or 10% chance of mind effects with a medium duration recharge timer
"Adept" 9:1,000 - 60% chance of mind effects with a long duration recharge timer
or 30% chance of mind effects with a medium duration recharge timer
or 10% chance of mind effects with a short duration recharge timer
"Master" 9:10,000 - 100% chance of mind effects with a long duration recharge timer
or 60% chance of mind effects with a medium duration recharge timer
or 30% chance of mind effects with a short duration recharge timer
or 10% chance of mind effects with an instant recharge timer
"Grandmaster" 1:10,000 - 100% chance of mind effects with a medium duration recharge timer
or 60% chance of mind effects with a short duration recharge timer
or 30% chance of mind effects with an instant duration recharge timer
As to "common metals", You guys already have lots of big bugs in your world, why not set up a workshop to boil chitin into resin ingots, then do "resin molding" using numbers of remelted ingots poured into whatever mold you want to make out of sand or dirt or clay? Shields, armors, furniture and mechanisms could be made this way quite well without having to dig it out of the ground.
Post by: Cain12 on September 29, 2013, 04:47:51 am
By the way, has someone made a civilization for the dragonkin, yet? I gave permission for anyone to do so, but I don't know if anyone has.Well it's not on the latest version, I haven't seen it mentioned, and no one else replied so I assume they either PMed you (based on the last few days that ain't likely) or are waiting to see if someone did make it and didn't mention it/was forgotten to crop up. So I assume no one has.
Edit: In regards to an adherent, they sound over powered, cool fluff or not. Like Bob's idea, would make them less over powered.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 08:21:31 am
Post by: kero42 on September 29, 2013, 08:26:04 am
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 11:38:36 am
Hey, Hugo and Halfling, you're forgetting something when you say they are non-hostile: because of a tag for civilization fluff, Lizardfolk have everyone hostile to them (I had added that to simulate other civilizations snatching lizardfolk children to raise the proud warriors for their army). You cannot say "This civilization is never hostile to you, the player" because the Lizardfolk break that paradigm.
Although, they have no siege tags, and ethics that prevent them from starting wars in worldgen. I am confident that if you're playing as lizardfolk, the Adherents will not attack.
Fun fact, the Adherents are already split into 3 ranks: Acolytes, who are identical to Hobbits; Adherents, the standard caste; and Gifted Adherents, who are rare but have more powerful attacks.
Here's the thing: We don't actually know if any of the things we're saying are actually happening. We have a lot of speculation but not much test data, especially for Fort mode. Therefore, we ought to play the game and see if there is actually a problem before we start nerfing things.
As to "common metals", You guys already have lots of big bugs in your world, why not set up a workshop to boil chitin into resin ingots, then do "resin molding" using numbers of remelted ingots poured into whatever mold you want to make out of sand or dirt or clay? Shields, armors, furniture and mechanisms could be made this way quite well without having to dig it out of the ground.
Why not have both? "Chitin ingots" are still a bizarre fantasy material, and could use a standard point of comparison, but are also cool. Chitin is not a resin, though, it's a protein, similar to keratin. It burns rather than melts. I think we already have something like this, with "prepared chitin" stuff.
Post by: Putnam on September 29, 2013, 12:00:04 pm
The lack of siege tags doesn't mean they can't send ambushes if they have any other pop triggers.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 12:04:55 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 12:26:11 pm
If they're indeed able to send ambushes to the lizardfolk that just pretty much means they can't be immortal without making playing as them unduly difficult. Is that how it goes if they have trade tags only?
They're definitely at war with lizardfolk in my newest world, just checked.
In other news, I've now grown to occasionally hate my creation. Trolls sure like to hang out in dungeons. You can expect to find them there, living under the city, among piles upon piles of rings, earrings, figurines and crowns made of various creature materials such as mallard keratin where I'm sure they're happy. Never in big groups, always in narrow corridors... or maybe I just don't make it that far. I must have lost five adventurers now this way: open door, stepping in. You have been spotted!! The troll smacks you around with his troll meteoric iron hammer. You have fallen unconscious. You died. Time to restart, again. (Well, to be fair, this used to happen with goblins too in vanilla. And they're not impossible to win one on one in melee even as a starting out halfling hero if you have a good weapon, but it's pretty damn hard if they get a first shot in.)
Sending in a troop of halflings with superior numbers is very valid strategy. Even a few useless hunters can overwhelm a troll when they just wrestle it like angry lemmings while you're free to deliver a killing blow. Luring them out of the dungeon for halfling peasants to rip them apart works too. And since halflings can wield one two-handed, appropriating a troll hammer and swinging it around is then so much more fun.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 01:01:01 pm
Seriously, that Lizardfolk problem needs testing. We don't know if it occurs or not, and I don't want to "fix" it if there are no ambushes.
EDIT: I'm going to do some testing myself, but I'll need help. As halflings I barely see the Adherents, so I don't know how long it will take for them to show up, if at all, for Lizardfolk.
Post by: Putnam on September 29, 2013, 01:04:58 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 01:06:48 pm
Post by: Putnam on September 29, 2013, 01:08:32 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 01:30:46 pm
You could lower their triggers to zero and have the full 4 active seasons; embark next to a psionic fort just in case that matters, for the worst case scenario.
Post by: Putnam on September 29, 2013, 01:31:42 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 01:37:34 pm
We know the wiki is often unreliable on anything more esoteric. The lizardmen need more playtesting anyway, it's two birds with one stone. Any reports will be featured ;P
I'm going to start testing them.
Also, I put up the cheap metals/syndromes stuff a short time ago, please have the files added.
Files changed and added for cheap metals and the syndromes (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8014)
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 01:40:39 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 01:43:27 pm
Lowering all the triggers to zero would just make them never do anything.
I meant zero value, not zero number :P But upon closer inspection that disables the trigger rather than setting it to minimum. Let's pretend I said "one".
@ZtG, looking forward to results. It's up to Putnam or Lost to add on their judgment. But on their behalf it would help if you gave a summary of all the changes, since that's a lot more files than just metals and a syndrome.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 01:53:00 pm
Lowering all the triggers to zero would just make them never do anything.
I meant zero value, not zero number :P But upon closer inspection that disables the trigger rather than setting it to minimum. Let's pretend I said "one".
@ZtG, looking forward to results. It's up to Putnam or Lost to add on their judgment. But on their behalf it would help if you gave a summary of all the changes, since that's a lot more files than just metals and a syndrome.
The reaction and entity files are there in order to allow the Lizardfolk to use the metals, since I used a different methodology for them to gain metals. The two creature files are there for the changes to the syndromes, since I changed the immune creature class of REPTILE to POISON_IMMUNE and SWAMP_DWELLER. The latter of the two is why I have the dragons file, in order to add that to the marsh/swamp based dragons.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 02:09:34 pm
I did a hack-intensive test on the Adherents. As lizardfolk, I embarked directly on a monastery, outside the walls so I don't get attacked. Then I used DFhack to force a siege from them. Instant loyalty cascade, they turned each other berserk and just stayed put blasting themselves. Then I used slayrace. Oddly enough, they appear to dissolve into smoke when killed, except for the fleshy acolytes.
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 02:13:32 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 02:19:00 pm
I don't think [POISON_IMMUNE] is such a good idea, since an organic creature can hardly be immune to all kinds of toxicity. Using the classifications probably makes more sense. [SWAMP_DWELLER], for instance, could make stuff from the swamp be immune to poisons from the swamp (like those of other swamp dwellers), but other creatures could have poisons they're not adapted to resist, and there's still stuff like radioactivity, or cyanide, or arsenic.
What would a POISON_IMMUNE creature class be good for? Supernatural Creatures, such as angels and demons, for one.
I did a hack-intensive test on the Adherents. As lizardfolk, I embarked directly on a monastery, outside the walls so I don't get attacked. Then I used DFhack to force a siege from them. Instant loyalty cascade, they turned each other berserk and just stayed put blasting themselves. Then I used slayrace. Oddly enough, they appear to dissolve into smoke when killed, except for the fleshy acolytes.
That proves absolutely nothing. If you embark upon a site with other creatures, they wind up as being friendly/defenders, if I am recalling correctly.
Post by: Putnam on September 29, 2013, 02:26:52 pm
1. Remove all the unit's blood.
2. If that fails due to unit having no blood, set the unit's vanish_countdown (usually used for bogeymen) to 2 so that it vanishes in 2 ticks.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 02:29:03 pm
While fun, what does that test? :P
They were all hostile. I did it in the wrong order, though. I should kill everyone first, then force invasion, so there's no risk of loyalty cascade. They didn't even encounter the ones within the monastery before they attacked themselves, but the cascade was still probably the result of the already present units somehow.
They still haven't appeared in the non-hack game I'm running in the other window. Can't force them either unless there's already a unit of their civ on the map.
What would a POISON_IMMUNE creature class be good for? Supernatural Creatures, such as angels and demons, for one.It's redundant. If you don't want a poison to affect those, just give it [SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:ANGEL], or [SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:SPIRIT].
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 02:33:16 pm
There's also class DEMON used by exactly two creatures: fiends and wisps of rage at this time.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 02:36:14 pm
What would a POISON_IMMUNE creature class be good for? Supernatural Creatures, such as angels and demons, for one.It's redundant. If you don't want a poison to affect those, just give it [SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:ANGEL], or [SYN_IMMUNE_CLASS:SPIRIT].
That could be done, but there is a problem, what if someone wants to create something with an advanced enough immune system that nothing affects it. SPIRIT wouldn't really make sense on the creature, but POISON_IMMUNE does.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 02:40:19 pm
@Zanz: except you'd have to go back and add it to every single syndrome. If you want something completely unpoisonable, make it [CREATURE_CLASS:INORGANIC]. Why classify them as organic if they're not affected by things that only affect organics?
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 02:52:20 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 02:54:50 pm
@Zanz: except you'd have to go back and add it to every single syndrome. If you want something completely unpoisonable, make it [CREATURE_CLASS:INORGANIC]. Why classify them as organic if they're not affected by things that only affect organics?
Being immune to poison does not equal inorganic.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 03:07:24 pm
Post by: vyznev on September 29, 2013, 05:03:38 pm
Basically, I've imported all the .zip (and .rar) archives listed in the first post (except the graphics packs, which I still need to deal with) into the repository, and I've volunteered to try and keep it up to date as new patches are released. I've talked with Halfling, and he's basically said he'd be OK with using this repo as the official place for publishing our raws from now on, obviously assuming that it works and meets our needs.
Anyway, all the raws are there, and I've written some instructions for:
- downloading and installing the latest release for playtesting (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki#how-to-play) and
- contributing patches and new features (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki#how-to-contribute).
Ps. If you notice any problem with the Git repo or have trouble getting it to work, please let me know. Also feel free to ask if you have any questions; if this post seems kind of vague, it's because I've tried to put all the important stuff on the GitHub project wiki. (Yes, we now have yet another wiki. :P) Oh, and if you already know how to use Git and would like direct push access to the repo, just ask -- I'd be happy to have other people to help with maintaining it.
Pps. Stuff I'd still like to do:
- A lot of the old releases still have bugs that have been fixed in the later releases. It'd be nice to backport those fixes to the release branches.
- I'd like to make a separate branch (or branches) for sackhead's Obsidian graphics. I've actually got them imported into my local Git repo, but they're still kind of a mess, with a whole bunch of vanilla stuff mixed in. I need to untangle that stuff somehow, unless someone (sackhead?) could send me a "bare-bones" version with only the new/modified files.
- The data file decoding/encoding scripts I posted earlier should be added to Git. In fact, it might be nice to store plain-text versions of all the compressed data files, and have a script to regenerate the compressed versions from those as needed.
- I've also been thinking of trying to write a script to run some basic consistency checks for DF raws, both for basic stuff like misspelled tags or duplicate raws, but especially for anything that DF itself doesn't always report in the error log. That's going to take some work, but it ought to make merging in changes a lot easier and more reliable.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 05:11:47 pm
Post by: vyznev on September 29, 2013, 05:18:26 pm
Basically, my proposal would be that:
- We should avoid adding any [CREATURE_CLASS] or similar tokens unless we're actually going to use them.
- Adding new [CREATURE_CLASS] tokens to existing creatures for use in targeting new syndromes should be explicitly allowed.
OK, I guess I was wrong about this being completely unrelated to Git, because the thing is that using a proper version tracker like Git lets us do this cleanly: when you submit your new syndrome raws, just submit the necessary changes to existing creatures too, so that they can be merged into the repo in a single commit.
This does require that, if you're not submitting your changes via Git (or otherwise as diffs), you should let me (or whoever's maintaining the repo) know which version your raws are based on, so that we can easily merge in only the changes you intended to make. Of course, I'm going to try to review and test any commits anyway before pushing them to GitHub, and I'll hopefully catch any accidental regressions that way, but it's still better to make sure they don't happen in the first place.
Post by: Gnorm on September 29, 2013, 05:20:20 pm
Post by: kero42 on September 29, 2013, 05:22:25 pm
I'm not too keen on fixing the bugs of previous versions. Little quirks and glitches are what makes occasionally revisiting past versions of games fun.
Seconded.
Post by: vyznev on September 29, 2013, 05:25:26 pm
Why bother fixing previous releases?Somebody might want to try playing them, too. Or I suppose somebody might want to fork them and try taking them in some different direction. Or maybe not, but it could happen.
At least I'd say that's true for Halfling's original "version 0" minimal raws, which really do play quite differently to the later, more diverse versions, and which also make a nice potential starting point for other mods. Certainly I think those at least should have any applicable bugfixes backported to them (and I think they actually pretty much do have that). The other versions, I suppose, aren't that critical -- as Gnorm notes, the glitches might be considered a valid "historical" element.
Post by: Poldon on September 29, 2013, 05:46:35 pm
On the bugfixing old versions, I think only some bugs should be fixed. Say someone wants to come and play each iteration as it was made, but can't because several major bugs render a couple of iterations difficult or impossible to play well. I think they should be made playable and then maybe ignore most minor bugs.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 06:56:31 pm
(http://i1079.photobucket.com/albums/w505/Zanzetkuken/Untitled_zpsdd7ca582.png)
Edit: All in one civilization, "the Clever Vine". And the northernmost tomb of that huge complex is a 10x10 on the embark screen.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 07:13:48 pm
Why bother fixing previous releases?Somebody might want to try playing them, too. Or I suppose somebody might want to fork them and try taking them in some different direction. Or maybe not, but it could happen.
At least I'd say that's true for Halfling's original "version 0" minimal raws, which really do play quite differently to the later, more diverse versions, and which also make a nice potential starting point for other mods. Certainly I think those at least should have any applicable bugfixes backported to them (and I think they actually pretty much do have that). The other versions, I suppose, aren't that critical -- as Gnorm notes, the glitches might be considered a valid "historical" element.
If someone wants to make a new mod based on one of the previous versions, let them apply the bugfixes themselves.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on September 29, 2013, 07:41:48 pm
The grand chieftain has sent us out beyond the southern borders of the Shield. Preliminary reports have determined from samples of the area that there is a supply of metallic ore near the surface of the area. These findings rose the morale of the nation after reports of the prior minres beginning to run low, and the formics managing to garner some metals from their southern neighbors to resupply. Once the sector is secured, we will begin output of metals and weaponry to assist in the primary assault upon the primary formic metal fields. Stiff resistance is expected from the southern civilizations, whom the formics have managed to influence. May Shaman Pathices, God of Freedom, and Hound, God of Valor watch over us all.
Holy s***, I just went through some of the gods people worship, and one of them worships a god of Death, named Death. That one also worships a god of twilight and the dawn. Another god is one of Law, Discipline, and Order; another is of minerals, metals, and fire; yet another is wisdom; another is day and duty; and a final is of chaos. That is one realistic pantheon, there.
Post by: StLeibowitz on September 29, 2013, 08:46:18 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 09:50:02 pm
Post by: Halfling on September 29, 2013, 10:22:27 pm
From what we discussed about the git, it seems like this would be a way that allows us to avoid exactly this type of issue. When a patch is applied, it stays in. Wasn't trivial to set up either. So let's try to pay attention to how it works. I put a link in the first post.
As it is you can also use it to browse all raws at all points now, which is pretty neat.
Quote
I've talked with Halfling, and he's basically said he'd be OK with using this repo as the official place for publishing our raws from now on, obviously assuming that it works and meets our needs.
So long as the results make it back to this thread too, mind :P
The minimal world was updated... well, bugfixed when bugs were discovered in later versions, exactly because someone may want to play or build on a minimal world. I myself really like to go there to make new things; you can be sure any bugs are with your new creatures if there are any. Some other modders (ie. everyone) have decided not to update their turn and it's probably not worth the effort to do it for them.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 29, 2013, 11:58:50 pm
Been hacking food and drinks to ensure the fort lives on, so that's a possible (though unlikely) variable. So, I'd feel more confident with some hack-free testing.
Post by: Gnorm on September 30, 2013, 12:19:30 am
Post by: mastahcheese on September 30, 2013, 12:24:33 am
I've been working on a new race for when my turn comes around, and I was wondering what the [SPECIAL_BURIAL] token does. The wiki has no mention of it.I know, it's annoying.
I think it allows mummies, but they wouldn't be in this version, because nobody added them.
Or maybe it just means they are given special tombs.
Post by: Gnorm on September 30, 2013, 12:29:51 am
How would one - for the sake of argument - add such undead creatures into the game?I've been working on a new race for when my turn comes around, and I was wondering what the [SPECIAL_BURIAL] token does. The wiki has no mention of it.I know, it's annoying.
I think it allows mummies, but they wouldn't be in this version, because nobody added them.
Or maybe it just means they are given special tombs.
Post by: mastahcheese on September 30, 2013, 12:35:11 am
I never really delved into that one.
Post by: WillowLuman on September 30, 2013, 12:45:03 am
Post by: vyznev on September 30, 2013, 12:02:26 pm
If the game comes up with a corrupt compressed file error, replace kingarrival with a vanilla one. I had no opportunity to test it, since it's not exactly the easiest thing to test.
You'll probably get an in-game dialog message saying "Text generation failed: data/announcement/kingarrival". At least that's what happened when I tried to use your empty announcement file as the fortressintro announcement.
The same message appears if I:
- delete the file entirely,
- make the first line say something other than the name of the file,
- delete all but the first line,
- delete all but the first line and some whitespace, or
- delete all but the first line and the title.
However, it does turn out that line breaks past the first line don't matter: putting the entire announcement, title and all, on the second line works just fine. Also, if you use multiple [TITLE] tags, the last title appears to override the earlier ones.
Also, in related news, the master (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/tree/master) branch on GitHub now contains the full vanilla data/announcement, data/dipscript, data/help and data/speech folders, as well as our additions to them. More usefully, the "data_src (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/tree/master/data_src)" folder contains the uncompressed text versions of those files (except the speech files, which are already plain text), and there's also a Perl script (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/blob/master/text_to_data.pl) to compress (or uncompress) those files. Thus, you can simply edit the text files under data_src and then run the Perl script to update the compressed versions.
Post by: Putnam on September 30, 2013, 01:41:49 pm
Post by: vyznev on September 30, 2013, 02:44:31 pm
My fortressintro isn't blank...
No, but your kingarrival is. I just moved it to fortressintro for testing, based on the assumption that the game treats all the announcements the same way. Which I could be wrong about, of course.
Post by: Putnam on September 30, 2013, 02:45:31 pm
Anyway, kingarrival shouldn't be empty either. I guess I made a mistake.
Post by: vyznev on October 01, 2013, 08:29:55 am
Those tweaks are currently in a separate "WIP" branch on GitHub (which was sort of the point -- I wanted to test that feature), but if everyone and especially Lost In Nowhere thinks they're OK, I can merge them into the master branch, for inclusion in the next release.
(Also, I did the bugfix changes (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/compare/master...wip-vyznev-bugfix) suggested by Halfling upthread -- removing the vigor test reactions, making top hats [SHAPED] and fixing the tea plant tile color -- before noticing that Lost In Nowhere said he'd already done that(?). Lost In Nowhere, would you like me to merge in those fixes too, or should I just wait for your version with your own fixes?)
Post by: Putnam on October 01, 2013, 09:06:16 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on October 03, 2013, 04:22:54 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:SLIME_RED_LIN]
[NAME:red slime:red slimes:red slime]
[CASTE_NAME:red slime:red slimes:red slime]
[DESCRIPTION:A small, red slime that inhabit the depths of the earth. They use their heat to digest their victims.]
[CREATURE_TILE:'s'][COLOR:4:0:1][GLOWCOLOR:4:0:1][GLOWTILE:'s']
[FREQUENCY:50][BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_LAVA][UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:4:4]
[EXTRAVISION][NOBREATHE][MAGMA_VISION][FIREIMMUNE][IMMOLATE][SWIMS_INNATE][SWIM_SPEED:1100]
[LIKES_FIGHTING][AMPHIBIOUS][NOPAIN][NOFEAR][CARNIVORE][LIGHT_GEN]
[DIURNAL][MUNDANE][BENIGN][CHILD:0][GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:red slime:red slimes][PET_EXOTIC]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:50:80][CLUSTER_NUMBER:8:12]
[MAXAGE:40:50]
[BODY_SIZE:18000]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:2600]
[BODY_SIZE:0:100:9400]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:18000]
[BODY_SIZE:5:0:24000]
[BODY_SIZE:10:0:38000]
[BODY_SIZE:50:0:70000]
[BODY:1PBODY_BRAIN_LIN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SLIME_MATERIALS_LIN]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:SLIME]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:RED]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:RED]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:RED]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:13000]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:MEMBRANE]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:VERMILION]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:VERMILION]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:VERMILION]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:13000]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:NERVE_TISSUE]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[MELTING_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:13000]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SLIME_TISSUES_LIN]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:SLIME_LAYERS_LIN]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:SLIME][CREATURE_CLASS:INVERTEBRATE][CREATURE_CLASS:ORGANIC]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[LITTERSIZE:20:40]Currently, the only time anything lights on fire is when you pick up a piece of its corpse. Then you combust and start melting.
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 04:26:07 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on October 03, 2013, 05:09:23 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 05:29:00 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on October 03, 2013, 06:12:27 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on October 03, 2013, 06:14:48 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 06:19:09 pm
Plus, there's no way to make anything react with anything else right now. Especially not water. They only thing that can trigger explosions is flash-boiling caused by immolation.
Post by: StLeibowitz on October 03, 2013, 06:29:30 pm
Alternatively, the combustion could be a result of self-destructive enzymes being released on death that would break down alkaline compounds in their skin and body, making the corpse liable to combust at the slightest provocation.
I don't have any evolutionary hand-waving for the reaction thing. Maybe some kind of interaction creatures can do if they have slime goo and water on them that sets themself on fire, to simulate it?
Post by: Nahere on October 03, 2013, 06:30:54 pm
Plus, there's no way to make anything react with anything else right now. Especially not water. They only thing that can trigger explosions is flash-boiling caused by immolation.Not true. HARDENS_WITH_WATER lets a material become a different one on contact with water. This can include a material that immediately boils into a burning hot vapour.
(Warning: side effects may include explosives being used as casts.)
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 06:32:57 pm
And they don't become a different material, they just change to a different state of the same material.
Post by: Nahere on October 03, 2013, 06:39:16 pm
Ah, found it:
PLASTER has [HARDENS_WITH_WATER:INORGANIC:GYPSUM], pointing to a separate material.
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 06:42:49 pm
Post by: Putnam on October 03, 2013, 07:00:37 pm
Also I'm pretty sure I've seen Putnam use this sort of thing in his science mod before.
I actually took that straight out of Dwarf Chocolate, which you should totally play.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on October 03, 2013, 08:06:08 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 08:08:48 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on October 03, 2013, 08:12:37 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 08:31:28 pm
Wait, slimes with brains?
Spoiler: sorry, it reminds me (click to show/hide)
Post by: StLeibowitz on October 03, 2013, 09:08:43 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 09:14:25 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on October 03, 2013, 09:49:21 pm
Code: [Select]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SLIME_EXPLODING:SLIME_TEMPLATE_LIN]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:RED]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:RED]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:RED]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[IGNITE_POINT:12000]
[BOILING_POINT:12000]
[MAT_FIXED_TEMP:13000]Code: [Select]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:SLIME]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:RED]
[STATE_COLOR:LIQUID:RED]
[STATE_COLOR:GAS:RED]
[HEATDAM_POINT:NONE]
[IGNITE_POINT:NONE]
[BOILING_POINT:NONE]
[HARDENS_WITH_WATER:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SLIME_EXPLODING]There was something else I was thinking of, but I forgot...edit:
Just noticed this in the errorlog:
Code: [Select]
*** Error(s) finalizing the reaction LIZARDKIN_19_ZTG
Unrecognized Inorganic Token: ZIRECON_LKR
Post by: Gnorm on October 03, 2013, 10:22:11 pm
New idea: those are one of the sources of the gnome's accelerant for their firearms.Thy idea hast received mine official approval.
Post by: Timeless Bob on October 03, 2013, 10:51:51 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 10:54:27 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on October 03, 2013, 11:10:02 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 03, 2013, 11:11:54 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on October 04, 2013, 02:36:42 pm
(see purple tea for details)
Also, is there a way to get a race that is immune to certain syndromes?
Post by: Putnam on October 04, 2013, 02:43:50 pm
Also, is there a way to get a race that is immune to certain syndromes?
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:CREATURE:CASTE]
Post by: WillowLuman on October 04, 2013, 04:10:48 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 05, 2013, 12:33:51 pm
Post by: vyznev on October 06, 2013, 09:56:20 am
When are the bug-fixes for Putnam's turn due to be released?
Since nobody seems to have actively objected (or otherwise reacted) when I asked about it a few pages ago, I've just merged this set of bugfixes (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/6b66c8b15e4f44efb6b4cae1d80c9be190201653) (suggested by Halfling earlier) to Putnam's raws on GitHub (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/tree/release-08-putnam) (and to the master (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/tree/master) branch too).
If you have any other bugfixes that you believe should be made, send them to me (or post them here) and ask me to merge them in too. As I understand the current set of rules, obvious bugfixes may be merged in immediately, although the person whose code is being fixed can veto them (subject to further override by general consensus) if they disagree with them.
Post by: Halfling on October 06, 2013, 12:39:52 pm
About a week of Lost in Nowhere's turn left. How's it going? :)
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on October 06, 2013, 01:59:54 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 06, 2013, 02:27:09 pm
Post by: Putnam on October 06, 2013, 02:46:29 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 06, 2013, 04:08:10 pm
REAGENT:TOOL:CUSTOM_TOOL:MATERIAL:SUBTYPEWhat do I define as the material and the subtype?
Post by: Halfling on October 06, 2013, 04:12:24 pm
Another game I was waiting for for months came out earlier this week...
Wanna skip it? It's the better option if you're not feeling like playing this now. It's just a game after all, but this is multiplayer too.
REAGENT:TOOL:CUSTOM_TOOL:MATERIAL:SUBTYPEWhat do I define as the material and the subtype?
That which the tool is made of. The exact tokens. (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Material_token)
Post by: Putnam on October 06, 2013, 04:42:50 pm
Post by: vyznev on October 06, 2013, 05:32:19 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 06, 2013, 09:13:51 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 06, 2013, 09:28:27 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 06, 2013, 09:57:37 pm
Do they have [CRAZED]?No, and they have [EQUIP] and are allowed to do all important professions.
Post by: BlackFlyme on October 06, 2013, 10:03:01 pm
Do they have [CRAZED]?No, and they have [EQUIP] and are allowed to do all important professions.
Are you getting any error messages, or are they just standing around for no reason?
Do they have a [GRASP] body part, and are they [INTELLIGENT]?
Post by: WillowLuman on October 06, 2013, 10:11:36 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 06, 2013, 10:55:27 pm
Post by: Putnam on October 06, 2013, 11:01:35 pm
I know for a fact that they can grasp
Are you sure?
Post by: WillowLuman on October 06, 2013, 11:02:58 pm
I know for a fact that they can grasp, and they have the [INTELLIGENT] token. Isn't it unnecessary and redundant to add [CAN_SPEAK], or is only having the aforementioned intelligent token hindering me?
It would be redundant, I believe. [INTELLIGENT] is a shortcut for [CAN_SPEAK] + [CAN_LEARN]
Play adventure or Arena with one. Can they pick things up?
Post by: Gnorm on October 07, 2013, 12:16:14 am
Play adventure or Arena with one. Can they pick things up?They work fine in Adventurer, and will fish in Fortress Mode, but they will not cut down trees or dig.
Post by: Putnam on October 07, 2013, 12:19:11 am
Do they have thought?
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 12:27:54 am
Post by: Gnorm on October 07, 2013, 12:31:01 am
Fishing doesn't require graspers.I assure you that they do, indeed, have thought.
Do they have thought?
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 12:43:13 am
For that matter, let us see the Entity raws, too.
Post by: Gnorm on October 07, 2013, 12:53:52 am
Creature:
Code: [Select]
...
[INTELLIGENT]
[HAS_NERVES]
[BENIGN]
[CANOPENDOORS]
...
[BODY:CORE_HLG:BACK_LEGS_HLG:ARMS_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:TEETH_HLG:EXTERNAL_GEARS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_MATERIALS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_TISSUES_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:TEETH_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CORE_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BACK_LEGS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:ARMS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:EXTERNAL_EARS_LAYERS_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HAIR_ON_HEAD_HLG]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:GEAR_MATERIALS_GNORM]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:GEAR_TISSUES_GNORM]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:GEAR_LAYERS_GNORM]
[BODYGLOSS:TWOLEGS_HLG]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:TENDON:400]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:PUNCH_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_HEAD_HAIR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_EYE_COLOR_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_SKIN_COLOR_HLG]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:HUMANOID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MAMMAL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:VERTEBRATE]
[CREATURE_CLASS:MACHINE]
[BODY_SIZE:17250]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:1850]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:8000]
[BODY_SIZE:20:0:17250]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:100:108:115:121:130:145]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:70:75:81:88:90:94:99]
[MAXAGE:140:165]
...
[DIURNAL]
[EQUIPS]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
...Entity:
Code: [Select]
...
[CIV_CONTROLLABLE]
[ADVENTURE_TIER:7]
[OUTDOOR_WOOD]
...
[STONE_PREF]
[GEM_PREF]
[METAL_PREF]
[SIEGER]
[INVADERS_IGNORE_NEUTRALS]
[CURRENCY_BY_YEAR]
[CURRENCY:AERESIUMITE_LKR:1]
[CURRENCY:CELESTIUM_METAL_STL:15]
[USE_GOOD_ANIMALS]
[USE_GOOD_PLANTS]
[USE_GOOD_WOOD]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_MOUNT]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PACK]
[COMMON_DOMESTIC_PULL]
[RIVER_PRODUCTS]
[EQUIPMENT_IMPROVEMENTS]
[INDOOR_WOOD]
[OUTDOOR_WOOD]
[USE_MISC_PROCESSED_WOOD_PRODUCTS]
...
[USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS]
[START_BIOME:ANY_FOREST]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_DESERT:5]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_FOREST:5]
[BIOME_SUPPORT:ANY_RIVER:1]
[DEFAULT_SITE_TYPE:CAVE_DETAILED]
[LIKES_SITE:CAVE_DETAILED]
[LIKES_SITE:CITY]
[WORLD_CONSTRUCTION:ROAD]
[WORLD_CONSTRUCTION:BRIDGE]
[START_GROUP_NUMBER:25]
[MAX_POP_NUMBER:16320]
[MAX_SITE_POP_NUMBER:625]
[MAX_STARTING_CIV_NUMBER:7]
[BUILDS_OUTDOOR_FORTIFICATIONS]
[BUILDS_OUTDOOR_TOMBS]
[SCOUT]
[BEAST_HUNTER]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POPULATION:2]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_PRODUCTION:3]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE:3]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_POP_SIEGE:3]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_PROD_SIEGE:3]
[PROGRESS_TRIGGER_TRADE_SIEGE:4]
[ACTIVE_SEASON:WINTER]
[EQUIPMENT_IMPROVEMENTS]
[MERCHANT_BODYGUARDS]
[DIPLOMAT_BODYGUARDS]
[WILL_ACCEPT_TRIBUTE]
[BANDITRY:20]
[UNDEAD_CANDIDATE]
[RELIGION:PANTHEON]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:FORTRESSES]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:JEWELS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:METALS]
[RELIGION_SPHERE:WEALTH]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENTITY_MEMBER:JUSTIFIED_IF_SELF_DEFENSE]
[ETHIC:KILL_NEUTRAL:JUSTIFIED_IF_EXTREME_REASON]
[ETHIC:KILL_ENEMY:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:KILL_ANIMAL:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:KILL_PLANT:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_AS_EXAMPLE:JUSTIFIED_IF_GOOD_REASON]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_INFORMATION:ONLY_IF_SANCTIONED]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_FOR_FUN:SHUN]
[ETHIC:TORTURE_ANIMALS:PERSONAL_MATTER]
[ETHIC:TREASON:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:OATH_BREAKING:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:LYING:JUSTIFIED_IF_EXTREME_REASON]
[ETHIC:VANDALISM:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:TRESPASSING:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:THEFT:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:ASSAULT:PUNISH_SERIOUS]
[ETHIC:SLAVERY:REQUIRED]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_OTHER:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:EAT_SAPIENT_KILL:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAME_RACE:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT:PUNISH_CAPITAL]
[ETHIC:MAKE_TROPHY_ANIMAL:ACCEPTABLE]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MECHANIC]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MINER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:PLANTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:HERBALIST]
[PERMITTED_JOB:FURNACE_OPERATOR]
[PERMITTED_JOB:STRAND_EXTRACTOR]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BREWER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BOWYER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOODCUTTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CARPENTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BLACKSMITH]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WEAPONSMITH]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ARMORER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:METALCRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MASON]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ANIMAL_CARETAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ANIMAL_TRAINER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRAPPER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOODCRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:STONECRAFTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:LEATHERWORKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BONE_CARVER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WEAVER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLOTHIER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:FISHERMAN]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CHEESE_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MILKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SHEARER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SPINNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:COOK]
[PERMITTED_JOB:THRESHER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:MILLER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BUTCHER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TANNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:DYER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SOAP_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:POTASH_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:LYE_MAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:CLERK]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ADMINISTRATOR]
[PERMITTED_JOB:TRADER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:ARCHITECT]
[PERMITTED_JOB:GLAZER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:POTTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:PRESSER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BEEKEEPER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WAX_WORKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:GLASSMAKER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:WOOD_BURNER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:DIAGNOSER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:BONE_SETTER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SUTURER]
[PERMITTED_JOB:SURGEON]
[PERMITTED_JOB:JEWELER]
[ARMOR:DRESS_SHIRT_HLG:COMMON]
[SHOES:BOOTS_CLOTHING_STL:COMMON]
[ARMOR:OVERCOAT_GNORM:COMMON]
[PANTS:TROUSERS_GNORM:COMMON]
[HELM:HOMBURG_GNORM:COMMON]
[ARMOR:LEATHER_TAILCOAT_HLG:UNCOMMON]
[ARMOR:LEATHER_WAISTCOAT_HLG:UNCOMMON]
[HELM:LEATHER_TOP_HAT_HLG:UNCOMMON]
[SHOES:LEATHER_ARMOR_BOOTS_HLG:UNCOMMON]
[GLOVES:LEATHER_ARMOR_GLOVES_HLG:UNCOMMON]
[ARMOR:GEAR_ARMOR:COMMON]
[PANTS:GEAR_LEGGINGS:COMMON]
[GLOVES:GEAR_GAUNTLET:COMMON]
[SHOES:GEAR_BOOTS:COMMON]
[HELM:GEAR_HELM:COMMON]
[SHOES:BOOTS_CLOTHING_STL:COMMON]
[WEAPON:PISTOL_SWORD_GNORM]
[WEAPON:METAL_WHIP_GNORM]
[WEAPON:METAL_AXE_GNORM]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_LANCE_STL]
[WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SCIMITAR_STL]
[DIGGER:ITEM_WEAPON_PICK_STL]
[WEAPON:SMALL_HATCHET_HLG]
[AMMO:BULLET_GNORM]
[SHIELD:METAL_SHIELD_GNORM]
[TOOL:GEAR_GNORM]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_WHEELBARROW]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_HIVE]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_HONEYCOMB]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_NEST_BOX]
[TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_JUG]
[TRAPCOMP:ITEM_TRAPCOMP_ENORMOUSCORKSCREW]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_CLOCKWORK_ARMOR_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_CLOCKWORK_LEGGINGS_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_CLOCKWORK_BOOTS_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_CLOCKWORK_GAUNTLET_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_CLOCKWORK_HELM_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_PISTOL_SWORD_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_METAL_WHIP_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_METAL_AXE_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:FORGE_METAL_SHIELD_GNORM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:BREW_HONEYWINE_STL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:EXTRACT_CELESTIUM_STL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CAST_CRUDE_ANVIL_HLG]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:TAN_A_HIDE_HLG]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:ADD_SHOVEL_TIP_TO_CUDGEL_HLG]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:IRIDIUM_MAKING_STAGE1_LKR]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:IRIDIUM_MAKING_STAGE2_LKR]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:COAL_TO_COKE_SKH]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:PREPARE_APPLE_TREES_KPT]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:DRY_LEAVES_PURPLE_REM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CHURN_BUTTER_PUTNAM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:MAKE_CHEESE_PUTNAM]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:MAKE_MILK_PUTNAM]
[PERMITTED_BUILDING:LUMBERYARD]
[PERMITTED_BUILDING:PEAT_TO_COKE_SKH]
[PERMITTED_BUILDING:ARMORY]
[PERMITTED_BUILDING:ARSENAL]
...
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 01:09:27 am
Post by: Gnorm on October 07, 2013, 01:16:32 am
How many embarks have you tried? Does it happen every time?Every time; any explanation?
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 01:20:34 am
Post by: Gnorm on October 07, 2013, 01:27:30 am
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 01:32:14 am
Post by: Gnorm on October 07, 2013, 01:34:00 am
So they will move materials. They can do some things that require objects in fort mode. Will they haul?Thus far, I've only experimented with stone, though they seem to be perfectly capable with it.
Post by: mastahcheese on October 07, 2013, 01:41:10 am
As a work-around, can you assign the picks and axes to them through the military screen and see if they will follow designations then?
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 01:45:42 am
Wait, is it just designations? Can they do things at buildings?
Post by: Halfling on October 07, 2013, 04:51:36 am
- All limbs are connected and the brain exists and is connected
- Tissues have appropriate tokens
- No tissue error has caused any part to be made of nonexistent materials
Post all raws for more eyes to see. So far I would say pretty much every intractable problem with creatures has been due to silly mistakes that the creator just missed.
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 04:55:24 am
Post by: Halfling on October 07, 2013, 05:09:35 am
Post by: vyznev on October 07, 2013, 01:53:33 pm
Also, there was a typo in the hound speech file name ("speeh" instead of "speech") causing error log noise. I fixed (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/9017fda63b1f8f7d29ef8034b0aae4575d75ff71) that one too.
Ps. I noticed that mallards apparently have beaks instead of bills (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bill#Etymology_2). I know it's not technically wrong as such, it just sounds odd to my ear, kind of like speaking of a dog's feet instead of its paws. It wouldn't be hard to fix, just make a new pair of bodyglosses and add them to the mallards. Halfling?
Post by: Halfling on October 07, 2013, 03:12:11 pm
Post by: vyznev on October 07, 2013, 06:58:31 pm
Post by: Halfling on October 07, 2013, 11:35:16 pm
Hair and feathers are made of keratin, but feathers should be "feathers". This affects items hypothetically made of them. But maybe it would be better for combat reports if it were a tissue more like skin so that you would "tear" it rather than "fracture" it, so if that's a change you feel is good then that's fine too.
Post by: WillowLuman on October 07, 2013, 11:42:26 pm
Post by: Halfling on October 08, 2013, 07:04:12 am
Post by: vyznev on October 08, 2013, 08:58:26 am
Uh, wow. You have a good eye. I welcome these fixes.
OK, done (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/e78538b4b0809a3f9875d28bd97d7ddb29e4b6e7) and done (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/9539e7845978b1b799f0edb5fad9fca632c6f2fc).
I think this change probably makes hairy/feathery creatures using these templates a bit less tough, since they no longer effectively have a layer of keratin armor around them. The HAIR and FEATHER templates seem to have the same physical values as skin (and they do have comments suggesting that this is deliberate).
BTW, does anyone know of a way to give a creature an (almost) completely harmless attack, or, alternatively, to keep them from attacking at all (even as counterattacks)? I've tried [ATTACK_VELOCITY_MODIFIER:1], which does seem to make a difference, but they still occasionally manage to sever nerves or arteries with lucky hits. Or do the creatures I've been testing them against (hounds and mallards, mostly) just have their nerves and arteries somehow really exposed?
Post by: Halfling on October 08, 2013, 09:58:50 am
Quote from: material_template_organic_halfling.txt
[MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:HAIR_TEMPLATE_HLG] Hair and feathers are both made of keratin, sure, but the layer should not be more protective than skin.
Ha ha oh wow. I had forgotten what I wrote already.
Well, good thing it's restored to how it was intended.
You could try giving them a tiny body part made of marshmallow and making them attack with that as their main, but I'm not sure. Even creatures that can only push can be mighty deadly in DF in general.
If they're not supposed to succeed at anything you could make them curse themselves to fail at everything 100% of the time, including combat, probably; and if they're not supposed to do anything they can paralyze or knock unconscious themselves.
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on October 08, 2013, 08:41:06 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 09, 2013, 06:56:32 pm
It's not unheard of. Check the body, that the following are in order:
- All limbs are connected and the brain exists and is connected
- Tissues have appropriate tokens
- No tissue error has caused any part to be made of nonexistent materials
Post all raws for more eyes to see. So far I would say pretty much every intractable problem with creatures has been due to silly mistakes that the creator just missed.
I posted all of the raws for the creatures and the entity that I honestly believe have anything to do with the creatures. The bodies seem to work, but just in case:
Body Detail:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Body:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Tissue:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
As described in the creature raws:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
If no one can honestly make anything out of this, I'll post everything.
Post by: Baffler on October 10, 2013, 10:00:42 pm
I don't know yet if this holds true for all craft materials, or just wood.
Post by: vyznev on October 11, 2013, 03:48:10 am
Post by: Halfling on October 11, 2013, 04:06:13 am
Good idea though. Should also check the reaction. Maybe we can finally eliminate wood gems.
The Urist, your turn is now. Ready?
Post by: vyznev on October 12, 2013, 02:42:31 pm
My guess is that, when you tag something with [WOOD] but not [ITEMS_HARD] (or any other similar tags) and try to make crafts from it, the game loops through the list of item types (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Item_token) and tries to find an allowed type of craft. But since it can't find any, it runs off the end of the crafts section (which ends with type 42, BRACELET) and onto the next item type in the list, number 43, GEM.
Anyway, I'd suggest creating the following new material template, and making all wood materials use it:
Spoiler: material_template_wood_vyznev.txt (click to show/hide)
This also lets us get rid of the individual [WOOD] tags inside the specific wood material definitions.
Any objections?
Post by: Gnorm on October 12, 2013, 09:08:16 pm
Any objections?None to switching all current types of wood to the new template. I will, however, say that I personally liked the wood gems, and found them a quaint part of this mod. The old template should be preserved, even if it is not the primarily used version.
Post by: vyznev on October 13, 2013, 06:27:36 am
Post by: Gnorm on October 13, 2013, 07:32:51 pm
I suppose we could always add a new "make wood gems" reaction. Or possibly add [IS_GEM] to wood, and see if that lets it be used for normal gem-cutting reactions.Fine by me.
Post by: Poldon on October 13, 2013, 07:45:24 pm
I suppose we could always add a new "make wood gems" reaction. Or possibly add [IS_GEM] to wood, and see if that lets it be used for normal gem-cutting reactions.
I would vote for the "make wood gems" reaction, because then we could specify only certain races allowed to make them. I feel like elves and halflings would be more inclined to it than Formics would be.
Post by: Halfling on October 14, 2013, 03:39:22 pm
I pm'd The Urist two days ago. He hasn't replied. So, Gnorm, that makes it your turn now. Have fun! :)
Post by: Gnorm on October 14, 2013, 04:05:24 pm
No objections vyznev. Impressive.Very well then! I'll not let you down.
I pm'd The Urist two days ago. He hasn't replied. So, Gnorm, that makes it your turn now. Have fun! :)
Post by: blademan9999 on October 15, 2013, 07:45:20 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on October 15, 2013, 10:11:57 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 15, 2013, 10:42:32 pm
Why do we have 3 wikis.Thrice as many sources, thrice as much knowledge!
Post by: WillowLuman on October 15, 2013, 10:55:03 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on October 16, 2013, 12:14:48 pm
Why do we have 3 wikis.
I created one on wikia, saw Gnorm was making one, and didn't know how to take it down. Gnorm found it and made a comment about a 'war of the wikis', so I reopened it, and then halfling made one on scratchwiki to eliminate the state of ads.
Post by: Halfling on October 16, 2013, 01:28:36 pm
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on October 16, 2013, 04:04:41 pm
Post by: Putnam on October 16, 2013, 04:06:42 pm
Question, how do I make my halfling adventurer throw rocks?
the same as you do any other interaction
Post by: WillowLuman on October 16, 2013, 04:09:20 pm
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on October 16, 2013, 04:11:21 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 16, 2013, 06:45:57 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on October 16, 2013, 06:50:36 pm
If one turns into a vampire bat in adventurer mode, will he ever turn back?
Checking the raws, it looks like you will turn back to normal after about 300 ticks.
Post by: Gnorm on October 21, 2013, 06:08:32 pm
Post by: Putnam on October 21, 2013, 06:09:55 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 23, 2013, 01:34:48 am
Post by: WillowLuman on October 23, 2013, 01:38:21 am
Post by: JimiD on October 23, 2013, 01:54:14 pm
Post by: Halfling on October 23, 2013, 02:41:11 pm
I'm still very interested. It would help to keep discussing the content, keeps everyone interested.
Count myself in among the interested too. I'm still checking daily for new posts, requests. What we need is player reports. And awesome new stuff is always needed. My current real life workload is still excessive for that, but come winter holidays...
In the meantime, Gnorm, we're waiting to see what you can make happen. What are you working on now?
Post by: reemer30 on October 23, 2013, 06:51:43 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 23, 2013, 09:47:13 pm
In the meantime, Gnorm, we're waiting to see what you can make happen. What are you working on now?Creatures in the evil regions. After that, I'll work on some exotic wildlife for the good regions.
Post by: HissinhWalnuts on October 23, 2013, 11:51:33 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 24, 2013, 12:57:28 am
Perhaps bicorns.Perhaps, or perhaps the chichevache.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on October 24, 2013, 12:22:57 pm
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on October 24, 2013, 03:35:52 pm
Post by: HissinhWalnuts on October 24, 2013, 03:40:37 pm
I can't mod, but I can give ideas.Same, I'm looking to try next month probably. Generally too busy.
Post by: Gnorm on October 24, 2013, 09:53:57 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 24, 2013, 10:18:50 pm
Post by: Halfling on October 25, 2013, 12:29:43 am
If you use a resurrection-transformation (or reanimation-transformation) whereby the same interaction both animates and applies a body change, does worldgen mode remember the transformation? Because either way, you could have more interesting creatures in towers than (just) zombies.
Post by: Putnam on October 25, 2013, 12:30:36 am
Post by: Halfling on October 25, 2013, 12:35:43 am
Post by: Putnam on October 25, 2013, 12:37:13 am
Post by: WillowLuman on October 25, 2013, 12:59:28 am
Post by: Putnam on October 25, 2013, 01:02:25 am
Post by: WillowLuman on October 25, 2013, 01:10:33 am
Post by: Gnorm on October 25, 2013, 02:00:29 am
Post by: Halfling on October 25, 2013, 06:46:03 am
Post by: Proto105 on October 25, 2013, 10:52:58 am
Post by: WillowLuman on October 25, 2013, 12:39:48 pm
Post by: Proto105 on October 25, 2013, 12:44:46 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 25, 2013, 12:46:59 pm
Post by: Proto105 on October 25, 2013, 01:11:05 pm
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on October 25, 2013, 03:46:02 pm
Post by: Putnam on October 25, 2013, 03:47:09 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on October 25, 2013, 03:59:20 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on October 25, 2013, 04:34:29 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on October 25, 2013, 07:06:11 pm
Post by: Mr Frog on October 26, 2013, 07:31:20 pm
E: Mother of run-on sentences, sorry :-[
Post by: Gnorm on October 27, 2013, 04:41:42 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 27, 2013, 09:48:47 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8087 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8087)
The version contains a few bugs that have been noted on the download page, but they have been worked around and the game is perfectly playable. I'll be out with the bugfixes soon, but I'd recommend starting some play-tests, both to find new bugs and to attract attention to this mod.
EDIT: Be sure to update the file-size, halfling.
Post by: kopout on October 27, 2013, 09:56:00 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 27, 2013, 10:08:08 pm
Whos turn is it? I haven't been very active latelyAfter my turn is yours.
Post by: Halfling on October 28, 2013, 01:19:42 am
Next up - yes, it's you, kopout. How's it looking for you?
Post by: Halfling on October 28, 2013, 01:22:34 am
Post by: vyznev on October 28, 2013, 02:41:08 pm
The new version is here:
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8087 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8087)
The version contains a few bugs that have been noted on the download page, but they have been worked around and the game is perfectly playable. I'll be out with the bugfixes soon, but I'd recommend starting some play-tests, both to find new bugs and to attract attention to this mod.
Cool! It looks like there's a few bugfixes on GitHub (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch) that didn't make it into your initial version, though. I just merged your raws into the master branch on GitHub, could you please download it (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/master.zip) back so that all the fixes will be included in your bugfix version? (Ps. Kopout, could you please do the same? Thanks!)
Pps. Also, Kopout, I can't remember if I already asked this before, but since it's your turn now, would you mind including these (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/9ed9863556366f9debb9f05b156d7a40b945ed10) tweaked announcements (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/99e33eedeaa775426a190a0fe84a6a2aafda57b8) in your turn? (You can just say "OK" and I'll merge them into the "master" branch on GitHub -- that's what I envisioned it being for (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki/Dfscratch-and-Git): collecting third-party contributions and half-finished stuff during a turn.)
Also, I really should make those wood gem fixes I mentioned earlier, I've just been kind of busy lately. I'll post about them here once I've got them fixed. Unless someone else finds the time to do it sooner, of course.
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on October 28, 2013, 06:41:25 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 28, 2013, 09:08:22 pm
Cool! It looks like there's a few bugfixes on GitHub (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch) that didn't make it into your initial version, though. I just merged your raws into the master branch on GitHub, could you please download it (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/master.zip) back so that all the fixes will be included in your bugfix version? (Ps. Kopout, could you please do the same? Thanks!)Will do, and don't worry about anything. I honestly forgot about the raws you posted, though I will add them to the bug-fix, and I hope to be just as efficient for the final release of my turn as I was for the initial.
By the by, you seem to be a more experienced modder than I. If it is not too much trouble, perhaps you could look into the clockworker raws to see as to why they refuse to follow designations?
EDIT: I'm having trouble with the format of the merged files. I appreciate the effort, but I'll merge them myself.
Post by: vyznev on October 29, 2013, 01:36:04 am
EDIT: I'm having trouble with the format of the merged files. I appreciate the effort, but I'll merge them myself.
OK. Out of curiosity, what kind of trouble? If I knew what it is, I might be able to fix that for others.
Post by: Gnorm on October 29, 2013, 01:41:17 am
When the merged raws are downloaded and run in Notepad,t the text is untraversable and tangled, so much so that it would be easier to do it myself than to try to navigate the files.EDIT: I'm having trouble with the format of the merged files. I appreciate the effort, but I'll merge them myself.
OK. Out of curiosity, what kind of trouble? If I knew what it is, I might be able to fix that for others.
Post by: Putnam on October 29, 2013, 02:16:39 am
Post by: vyznev on October 29, 2013, 03:38:35 am
When the merged raws are downloaded and run in Notepad,t the text is untraversable and tangled, so much so that it would be easier to do it myself than to try to navigate the files.
Ah... I think it's probably a newline issue. If you download the raws using a Git client on Windows, it gives you Windows line endings (CR+LF), but if you just download the zip file you get Unix-style line endings (LF only) by default. Notepad doesn't recognize those as line breaks. (Wordpad does, as do most third-party editors.)
Anyway, I think the easiest solution is to just make Git always use CRLF line endings for text files; that way Notepad will be happy, and Unix editors should cope. I think I managed to do that (and fixed one broken data file in the process); could you download the zip file from GitHub again and check whether it's more Notepad-friendly now?
Post by: vyznev on October 29, 2013, 04:44:25 pm
I've fixed it on GitHub; please download the latest version, or at least delete plant_koput.txt from your copy to avoid any surprising alligator housing incidents.
Also, the files c_variation_glass_angel_STL.txt, creature_disease_insects_STL.txt and creature_syntest_STL.txt are missing an [OBJECT:foo] tag (in the latter two it seems to be commented out), while in interaction_good_happy_weather_STL.txt the tag is misspelled (underscore instead of colon). I think that means that DF will ignore anything in those files. Is that intentional?
(Ps. As you might've guessed, I'm working on a DF raw sanity checker script. Will put it on GitHub once it's a bit more complete. At the moment, those are exactly the issues it will detect.)
Post by: WillowLuman on October 29, 2013, 04:45:47 pm
Post by: Putnam on October 29, 2013, 04:47:45 pm
(Ps. As you might've guessed, I'm working on a DF raw sanity checker script. Will put it on GitHub once it's a bit more complete. At the moment, those are exactly the issues it will detect.)
You mean like this? (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=107340.msg3192060#msg3192060)
Post by: vyznev on October 29, 2013, 05:21:26 pm
Actually, we were perplexed as to why good weather wasn't working, as we intended to have that and sandstorms. Good find!
OK, I can fix that typo.
I also finally figured out what all those "nothing" creatures that show up in the arena mode list are. Zanzetkuken, would you mind if I add a [NAME:] tag to your generic base dragons while I'm at it? (It shouldn't show up in-game anyway, since they don't have any biome tags.)
You mean like this? (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=107340.msg3192060#msg3192060)
Cool, that looks a lot better than my half-assed Perl script. I'll have to download and play with that.
Post by: kopout on October 29, 2013, 05:30:38 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on October 29, 2013, 06:03:53 pm
Also, the files c_variation_glass_angel_STL.txt, creature_disease_insects_STL.txt and creature_syntest_STL.txt are missing an [OBJECT:foo] tag (in the latter two it seems to be commented out), while in interaction_good_happy_weather_STL.txt the tag is misspelled (underscore instead of colon). I think that means that DF will ignore anything in those files. Is that intentional?
In the commented ones, aye that's intended; same for the Glass Angel one, which was a species of eldritch wing-ed hippies I never got around to creating. And if the good weather is fixed by fixing that error (underscores, colons, what's the difference? Apparently it's enough to make DF stomp off in disgust ::) ) then good regions are about to get a lot more !!fun!!
And I do mean that in the flamey sense of the word. Fair warning :D
Post by: Gnorm on October 29, 2013, 09:50:35 pm
By the by, when creating a syndrome that causes a body transformation, what does one do if the creature that the target is to transform into has no castes?
Post by: kopout on October 29, 2013, 09:51:00 pm
Post by: Gnorm on October 29, 2013, 09:55:59 pm
In the commented ones, aye that's intended; same for the Glass Angel one, which was a species of eldritch wing-ed hippies I never got around to creating.If that is the case, should we just delete them?
Post by: BlackFlyme on October 29, 2013, 10:05:45 pm
By the by, when creating a syndrome that causes a body transformation, what does one do if the creature that the target is to transform into has no castes?
Looking through a few other mods, and the vanilla examples, it looks like the line should be
[CE:CREATURE: creature name :DEFAULT]
For caste-less creatures.
Post by: Gnorm on October 29, 2013, 11:09:30 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Do you approve?
Post by: vyznev on October 30, 2013, 01:10:36 am
Seriously though, I downloaded it numerous times and each time I go to 'extract all files' it comes up and the folders are all their but their is nothing in them.Their is stuff in them when I don't extract but that stuff is unusable.
Is that with Gnorm's .zip file from DFFS, or the GitHub version? In either case, all I can say is that it seems to work for me.
I assume you know this, but just in case, remember that since Putnam's turn, the .zip files contain both a "raw" and a "data" folder, and need to be extracted into the main DF dir (preferably after deleting the original DF raw folder). The version now on GitHub actually contains a full (and partially modded) copy of the DF data folder, so you can just delete both original DF folders before extracting it. The GitHub version also contains a bunch of other files that aren't really needed for just running the mod, but should do no harm either.
(BTW, it occurs to me that, now that we've started to mod the data folder, we really ought to try rewriting all that stuff "from scratch" too, at least as far as we can. I might make that a project when my turn comes up, if nobody gets around to it sooner.)
Post by: Gnorm on October 31, 2013, 01:04:33 am
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on October 31, 2013, 10:47:45 am
Files changed and added for cheap metals and the syndromes (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8014)
Post by: vyznev on October 31, 2013, 01:28:18 pm
Anyway, I just tentatively added them (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/3af96dd1e2727c2e5a5befc6bafcc6d00976821f) to the master branch on GitHub, assuming nobody objects. AFAICT, the major changes are the addition of two metal ores -- copper and zirecon (sic) -- and the splitting of the lizardfolk blood poisoning syndrome into two forms: a mild contact syndrome (someone needs to test if it really is mild) and a severe one if the blood gets ingested.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on October 31, 2013, 07:15:28 pm
I guess they just fell through the cracks? Were they supposed to be part of your bugfix turn?
I was a contribution of mine after the bugfix turn of HugoLuman. I'm pretty certain it was lost in transition.
Post by: Halfling on November 01, 2013, 12:08:52 am
Halfling, I noticed that the Troll speech c-variations were never actually made. Would you like me to set them up during my bugfixes?
Please. That would be great.
They weren't intended as c_variations this time, but those can work too. Rather troll speech works by nested interactions. HugoL did actually include the interactions to make them taunt and banter, but did not put them in the creature. That would probably be because I myself posted raws without them.
It seems creature vocalizations were not added to the creatures too, even though the c_vars are there.
Since I had deleted my working copy, I had to write some new tags.
This should go into feral hounds (creature_HugoL):
Code: [Select]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:DOG_BARK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:GROWL_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:WHIMPERS_FLEEING_HLG]This should go into tits (creature_halfling):
Code: [Select]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BIRD_CHIRP_HLG]This should go into trolls:
Code: [Select]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:TROLL_BANTER_HLG]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:speak your mind]
[CDI:FREE_ACTION]
[CDI:BP_REQUIRED:BY_CATEGORY:MOUTH]
[CDI:TARGET:A:SELF_ONLY]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:8400]
[CDI:VERBAL_SPEECH:speech_troll_hlg.txt]
Thanks!
Post by: vyznev on November 01, 2013, 07:23:27 am
Also, do we want more vocalizations? Quacks for mallards, maybe?
Post by: WillowLuman on November 01, 2013, 04:37:41 pm
Post by: vyznev on November 01, 2013, 04:55:58 pm
Already noticed one bug: the "make zirecon bars" reaction in ZtG's "new cheap metals" patch has a typo in the reagent/product names, causing DF to complain in the error log. Fixed and pushed to GitHub. (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/3cd7d3ae185e0d1b41813ce7db3f8794710fc8d0)
Genning a medium world with all default settings now. Quite a few rejects in the civ placement stage, but after 20 failures it's now generating history.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Here are the worldgen params (http://vyznev.net/misc/df/dfscratch/playtest01/region1-world_gen_param.txt), history (http://vyznev.net/misc/df/dfscratch/playtest01/region1-world_history.txt), sites (http://vyznev.net/misc/df/dfscratch/playtest01/region1-world_sites_and_pops.txt) and the world map (http://vyznev.net/misc/df/dfscratch/playtest01/world_map-region1-250--10081.png).
Looking at the history dump, I'm struck by how the names are a mixture of the inspired and the inane, even more so than in vanilla. For instance, the spider-centaur civilization "The Tit of Minds" worships "Secrete the Secret Secrets of Secret", a god of the stars, the night and dreams. ::) On the other hand, the very same civ also worships the death god "Skull the Lethal Reaper", a god of deformity named "Moto the Pock of Foul", and "Khur Liemisty the Secret Traitor of Evil", a god of treachery, lies and trickery.
I also rather like this list of troll gods:
Quote
Reaver, deity: victory, war
Homewood, deity: nature, water
Sniffer Blademurders, deity: revenge
Badland Vinetits the Tricksy Beards, deity: freedom, hunting
Gall, deity: trade, wealth, the wind, the sky
Dunno what to think about the halfling civ names. I'd love to know what went through this one particular civ's founders' minds when they decided to name themselves "The Flowering Idiots". :P
Also, apparently the clockworkers speak French. ???
Tried to find a good region to embark in, since I want to see if the happy weather finally works. They're pretty scarce, though, except for one ocean and this rather inappropriately named glacier:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Finally found a reasonable-looking embark spot. It's not really what I imagine as typical lizardfolk habitat, but it's got a good-aligned forest, a brook and some mountains. It should do.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Also, as a bonus, those purple "I"s are clockworker towers, so I might get to meet them too.
Looks like the French is rapidly becoming the lingua franca of the local lizardfolk civ:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Here's what the game initially suggests I should bring. Looks like the cheap metals are working, at least in this respect:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Looks like I can embark with some "liquid". ??? Also, nest boxes can apparently be made from coal and "unmined copper". Is that intentional?
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Anyway, here are my final embark choices:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And here's Putnam's fortressintro announcement in action:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
...and here's what the place actually looks like:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It's getting pretty late, so I think I'll continue the actual game tomorrow. See you until then.
Post by: Aseaheru on November 01, 2013, 08:24:49 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on November 01, 2013, 09:06:29 pm
Looks like I can embark with some "liquid". ??? Also, nest boxes can apparently be made from coal and "unmined copper". Is that intentional?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It's getting pretty late, so I think I'll continue the actual game tomorrow. See you until then.
"Liquid" is a vanilla problem, AFAIK.
And the coal and "unmined copper" tools look like they are the equivalent of lignite/bituminous coal or native copper tools in vanilla, it's just the way the materials are named.
That said, best of luck with your play-testing!
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 01, 2013, 09:26:08 pm
I realized that we haven't had a proper playtest turn in a while, so I thought I'd step up to the challenge. I'm going to be playing the latest raws from the GitHub master branch, probably as lizardfolk because they don't seem to have received much playtesting.
Oh hey, that's cool. I was about to create one myself. Twice as much testing!
Jikhatbal Khabarimalnebkarat, Captain of the Guard and Chieftan of Dragonsdeath
Worshiper of Lokhal Darlingprecious, god of marriage and birth.
Worshiper of Reaper Skull Reaper, the creator of Deadlydeath and god of day, suicide, and death
Messages to the Tactical Squad #304, the High Command, and sources which will remain unnamed for security reasons.
Worshiper of Lokhal Darlingprecious, god of marriage and birth.
Worshiper of Reaper Skull Reaper, the creator of Deadlydeath and god of day, suicide, and death
Messages to the Tactical Squad #304, the High Command, and sources which will remain unnamed for security reasons.
Date: Opal 28, 199
Spoiler: Enclosed Image (click to show/hide)
Date: Obsidian 13, 199
Expeditionary party determined. I am chosen to lead. Entering with two others from my squad, one civilian, and three prisoners.
Date: Obsidian 17, 199
Briefing on artifact. Little known.
Spoiler: Enclosed Image 1 (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Enclosed Image 2 (click to show/hide)
Date: Obsidian 20, 199
Left primary encampment. Heading towards site.
Date: Granite 1, 200
Spoiler: Enclosed Image (click to show/hide)
-Nevermind what was here, I apparently got a pre-fix download-
Post by: Gnorm on November 01, 2013, 10:29:55 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on November 01, 2013, 11:10:20 pm
The only change in yours I dislike is the land name of "a regency hive" as that reminds me of a certain genre of romance novels for some reason. Just "Hive" would be a better option in my opinion :) Thanks for looking that over.
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on November 01, 2013, 11:14:59 pm
From the journal of Lord Xyon:
It is time for us to begin our expedition. I have decided to build a city for our civilization. Just to show my confidence, I have chosen the most sinister lands known to us. And just to show how much temerity I really have, I will build it right next to a centaur fortress. I could only seem to find 6 people willing to volunteer for some reason.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/25irq6v.png)
While we were getting ready, I noticed that the man in charge of supplies simply didn't know what he was packing. When I took a look at the list, the items that caught my eye were:
(http://i43.tinypic.com/mht7aa.png)
(http://i43.tinypic.com/29c6jbt.png)
I am going to bring them anyway. He probably knows what he's doing.
1st Granite, 251
We have finally arrived on top of a hill.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/34h6y48.png)
I think we should build our town down there.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2j2aq86.png)
13 Felsite, 251
This city is going to be the greatest underground complex in the world! There haven't been any problems yet. Progress in the mines have stopped in favor of digging the complex.
25 Hematite, 251
Migrants! Finally some extra help. 2 of them were metalworkers, so I should probably get some metal going.
18 Malachite, 251
Everyone has been sleeping in the dirt. Production of beds is top priority. Actually, MY bed is top priority, the rest can be made later.
20 Malachite, 251
I have just noticed that all of the arrows that were brought with us have been wasted on shooting squid swimming around.
7 Galena, 251
Finally got the well built. Now perhaps people will drink from that instead. Can't have vomit all over the glorious city.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/10sd84w.png)
17 Galena, 251
It seems that no one really knows what it was that we brought, because the bag full of nothing is still in the wagon.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2q1upeu.png)
Post by: Gnorm on November 01, 2013, 11:20:04 pm
The only change in yours I dislike is the land name of "a regency hive" as that reminds me of a certain genre of romance novels for some reason. Just "Hive" would be a better option in my opinion :) Thanks for looking that over.No problem, I'll go with your suggestion. Since they should now act as ordinary land-holders, I presumed that the message that indicates that your fortress's status has risen would look silly without an actual name.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 01, 2013, 11:34:34 pm
Post by: vyznev on November 02, 2013, 06:12:27 am
I also copied the fixed raws into my initial savegame for the playtest, and it looks like at least so far the zirecon hasn't melted.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Started by ordering a clearing to be made in the forest, so that we get some wood and room for building.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It's kind of weird starting the game with a noble, but since my usual embark style is to assign one person as the leader/admin type anyway, it doesn't really make that much difference. Made the best of the situation anyway, and assigned her to all the vacant roles:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'll have to build her some quarters ASAP, though. I think a bed, a table and a chair just placed outdoors should do for now.
Anyway, here are the initial seven lizardfolk:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'm noticing some odd-ish preferences here, including "river squid keratin" (do squid really have that?), "cloud of insects" (apparently a material??), "crystalized soul" (what's that?) and something called "n/a" which, apparently, is supposed to be a drink. I think that last one at least counts as a bug. Also, and this is a really minor issue, but there's some inconsistent capitalization in some places like prefstrings and creature names. It's completely harmless, but it just sort of bugs me. :-\
Also, speaking of minor issues, there's always spelling / typos. For example, I think the "whom" in the lizardfolk description should just be "who" (it's not referring to the object of the sentence), and I'm not sure if the "chieftan" noble name is really supposed to be "chieftain" or not. Also, "serated" -> "serrated".
Yay, it's raining liquid sunshine! :D
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
The lizardfolk don't seem to appreciate this unusual weather phenomenon much. They'd probably just prefer plain ordinary rain.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Alerted by the freakish weather, I have decided to prioritize the excavation of an underground shelter. We may not be the mythical dwarves, but we brought that expensive mining equipment for a reason, and this disgusting rain definitely qualifies as a reason to use it!
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 02, 2013, 12:13:22 pm
Journal of Champion Blancheros, Captain of the Guard of the Outpost Domainerouge
Worshiper of Bulle the Bubbling Bubble, God of Coasts
Worshiper of Bulle the Bubbling Bubble, God of Coasts
Granite 1, 223 WC, 1 AW
It has been suggested to me by the mayor that I keep this journal in order to chronicle the story of the military of this outpost. Might as well put the location in as well.
Spoiler: Enclosed Image (click to show/hide)
This area is not one we would normally consider for habitation. However, our recent war four years ago that resulted in our annihilation of the clockwork entity towards our northern border took its toll. We barely have any metal ores remaining for us to construct new weaponry. So, this expedition was set-up to collect new ores and construct weaponry to send back with the caravans. I sincerely have very little doubt that someone is going to be coming for us soon. Thankfully, I managed to scrounge up a few longbows and arrows left over, as well as a recently trained doctor and two after-war recruits. I will write further whenever the we have the some buildings set-up. I do not want to have to put up with the Chieftain's complaining any more than I need to.
Edit: Can someone please tell me why coal is not registering as a fuel source? Oh, and another reaction is needed for the Lizardkin to burn wood, because for some unknown reason, creating a wood furnace, rather than using wood burner as I was expecting, instead uses a metalsmithing job.
Post by: vyznev on November 02, 2013, 12:37:14 pm
Edit: Can someone please tell me why coal is not registering as a fuel source?
Did you try making coke from it first? That's how it works in vanilla, at least. Didn't get around to trying that in my playtest yet, but I noticed the issue.
Oh, and the inability to burn wood, if true, is going to be a problem at least for me, since I didn't bring any coke or charcoal to kickstart the production. Oh well, maybe I can trade for it. (Ps. patches gladly accepted.)
Anyway, I won't be continuing my playtest today, since I don't have the save on this computer. Will try to test tea and metalworking tomorrow.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 02, 2013, 01:05:23 pm
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_20_ZTG]
[NAME:burn wood into charcoal]
[BUILDING:LIZARDKIN_FORGE_ZTG:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:3:WOOD:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:FIRESTARTER_ZTG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:COAL:CHARCOAL:NONE:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:50:1:COAL:CHARCOAL:NONE:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:25:1:COAL:CHARCOAL:NONE:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:WOOD_BURNING]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_21_ZTG]
[NAME:burn wood into ash]
[BUILDING:LIZARDKIN_FORGE_ZTG:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:2:WOOD:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:FIRESTARTER_ZTG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:75:1:ASH:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:75:1:POTASH:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:25:1:ASH:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:25:1:POTASH:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:WOOD_BURNING]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_22_ZTG]
[NAME:craft firestarter]
[BUILDING:CRAFTSMAN:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:2:WOOD:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:TOOL:FIRESTARTER_ZTG:NONE:NONE]
[SKILL:WOODCRAFT]Code: [Select]
[ITEM_TOOL:FIRESTARTER_ZTG]
[TILE:219]
[NAME:firestarter:firestarters]
[SIZE:100]I'm not 100% certain whether I made the tool interaction right, though...
Edit: Getting errors about unrecognized tokens on the 20 and 21 reactions. Doesn't recognize coal:charcoal, ash, and potash as valid.
Post by: WillowLuman on November 02, 2013, 02:26:58 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 03:45:44 pm
Also, speaking of minor issues, there's always spelling / typos. For example, I think the "whom" in the lizardfolk description should just be "who" (it's not referring to the object of the sentence)[...]You are correct.
However, our recent war four years ago that resulted in our annihilation of the clockwork entity towards our northern border took its toll.Has their presence in the world been completely destroyed, or just the one civilization?
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 02, 2013, 04:17:04 pm
However, our recent war four years ago that resulted in our annihilation of the clockwork entity towards our northern border took its toll.Has their presence in the world been completely destroyed, or just the one civilization?
Just one civilization. Might not have even been the lizardfolk, I just ran with it being destroyed. Though with the addition of the firestarter item, just to be safe, I'm going to generate a new world when someone could tell me how to fix the two wood burning interactions.
Post by: BlackFlyme on November 02, 2013, 04:29:04 pm
Hopefully these will work for you, I'm not getting any errors from them in my game.
Code: [Select]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_20_ZTG]
[NAME:burn wood into charcoal]
[BUILDING:LIZARDKIN_FORGE_ZTG:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:3:WOOD:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:FIRESTARTER_ZTG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:BAR:NONE:COAL:CHARCOAL][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:50:1:BAR:NONE:COAL:CHARCOAL][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:25:1:BAR:NONE:COAL:CHARCOAL][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:WOOD_BURNING]
[REACTION:LIZARDKIN_21_ZTG]
[NAME:burn wood into ash]
[BUILDING:LIZARDKIN_FORGE_ZTG:NONE]
[REAGENT:A:2:WOOD:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[REAGENT:B:1:TOOL:FIRESTARTER_ZTG:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:75:1:BAR:NONE:ASH:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:75:1:BAR:NONE:POTASH:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:25:1:BAR:NONE:ASH:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[PRODUCT:25:1:BAR:NONE:POTASH:NONE][PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150]
[SKILL:WOOD_BURNING]
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 04:42:36 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on November 02, 2013, 04:43:43 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 04:45:19 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 04:50:02 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8109 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8109)
They do not include some of the most recent contributions, though they are mostly up-to-date. I recommend deleting your entire objects folder first, even if it already carries the previous version.
Whoever has the current turn should add their raws to this version.
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 04:54:16 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 04:56:58 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 04:57:23 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 04:58:15 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 05:03:01 pm
Edit: Got to the age of myth, hope it works...
Dear lord, 30000+ people? NOTABLE people? nowonder why it was slow...
And crash. the last eight sites killed it.
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 05:08:25 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 05:09:31 pm
EDIT: Just delete the file; I'll update the download.
Post by: vyznev on November 02, 2013, 05:18:52 pm
The bugfixes are up!
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8109 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8109)
They do not include some of the most recent contributions, though they are mostly up-to-date. I recommend deleting your entire objects folder first, even if it already carries the previous version.
Whoever has the current turn should add their raws to this version.
Excellent! The GitHub update will have to wait until tomorrow, it's quite late and I'm not on my usual computer.
Post by: Aseaheru on November 02, 2013, 06:18:16 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 06:56:13 pm
Chapter I: The Hunt
Tea Blackbrewed was a rather unremarkable halfling. Not particularly smart, not particularly strong, and not particularly attractive, he wasn't too noiceable and lived an ordinary life in his small hamlet. He did, however, have something fairly uncommon to his race: a sense of adventure and determination. He wanted to be a hunter since he was a small boy, to delve into the wilderness and bring back the bodies of great beasts. He trained with his bow for years, until finally, the day came when he was accepted by his homeland as a hunter, and tasked with bringing a body back to the buthcer. This, is where his adventure begins.
Snealthily moving out of the hamlet's limits, he found himself surrounded by the beatiful flora of the forest.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/35hmjqh.png)
It was as beautiful and as colorful as he had always dreamt it would be. Despite the beauty of the natural world, he did not want to get distracted on his first mission, and tried hhis best to ignore it.
After travelling westward for almost an hour, he came across a group of armored beasts.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/sy1i7s.png)
(http://i44.tinypic.com/m9of2c.png)
He looked tentatively at his small, blackwood arrows, and began to doubt their ability to pierce the armor of these creatures. Such beasts would have to wait, he decided, and began travelling to the south.
He soon found himself in an area that was far clearer than the forest whence he came. He had entered a grassy plain, and found himself without the natural concealment of the forests. If he was spotted by a mighty foe, he realized, he would be unable to find cover. He needed to be extra careful.
After travelling carefully travelling southward more many hours, he finally came across the ideal group of targets.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/25ov3ux.png)
These healthy mallards would yield an excellent supply of meat, he thought. Without hesitating, he took an arrow out of his quiver, and fired it from his short bow. This first shot completely missed, nevetheless, Tea was quite undeterred. He fired another shot, which came closer to the birds, yet still did not hit any of them. His next six shots failed to hit, and started to become impatient. He grabbed a rock from the ground and threw it at the mallards, unintentionally giving away his position. As the birds began to scatter, he fired to more arrows, the second of which yielded a satisfying result.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2nu1w0z.png)
He was so pleased with his kill that he forgot completely about the other mallards, and ran right to the body of the slain bird. Grabbing it carefully, he placed the body in his backpack, and headed back towards his village.
He finally arrived at the butcher's shop just as night had begun to fall and, much to the surprise of the butcher and the more experienced hunters, placed the plump mallard on the ground before the butcher.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2i06q1z.png)
The tired butcher gave him a friendly nod, and taking his knife in his hand, made a start towards the bird's body. Tea stopped him, however, and requested that he teach him how to butcher his own kills. With a slight groan, the butcher requested that Tea take his hunting dirk out of his backpack, and began to show him where to cut. After a short period of time, Tea was a dabbling butcher with a new supply of mallard meat. Tired from a long day of work, Tea asked the butcher if he could sleep in the shop, and slept for nine hours.
Post by: Vgray on November 02, 2013, 07:56:18 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 02, 2013, 08:00:20 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 08:31:23 pm
Chapter II: The Clockwork Castle
When morning came, Tea exited the shop and heated his mallard breakfast by an open fire. After eating, he decided to take a short stroll around his town and talk with his friends for a short while. Once his social activity was finished, Tea decided once more to delve into the western forests to see what beasts there were. Soon he found himself surrounded again by the beauteous colors of nature. He noticed a small pack of mallards on his way through the forest, though he ignored them. After all, he had already killed one of these creatures; it was time for other beasts to fall. Finally, he found himself in front of a great river.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/5y883q.png)
Looking into it, he could see several river squid swimming about through the water. Tea took out his short bow and fired three arrows into the water, resulting in one of the creatures noticing his presence and leaping out of the river. Tea fired an arrow at this squid, which pierced its third arm. Tea dove into the water and swam to the other side of the river to chase after this creature, but one of the squid bit him in the shin on his way out of the water. Tea collapsed to the ground, his right leg no longer able to support his weight.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/ebbu55.png)
Tea was determined to kill at least one of these vile creatures. He crawled his way in the direction that the squid had fled, only to find that it had died from its lack of water.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/sg0gmd.png)
This didn't bother Tea much, as the creature's death was satisfying enough for him. Taking his dirk, he carefully butchered the creature for its meat. Taking what he could carry, he crawled off in a random direction, hoping it would lead him to safety. He was fearful as he crawled around trees, over hills, and across plains that he would run into an unseen enemy, and that he would meet his end. Most cautiously he moved, carefully observing every movement around him.
Finally, he found himself at the base of a modest castle.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2ajuv12.png)
He became quite fearful; he knew that not all beings that created such structures were friendly. Still in hiding, he took a glance at one of the guard towers and was relieved to find it inhabited by a clockworker, a friend to his race. He came out of hiding and called up to it, making sure it saw him.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/28wf539.png)
The guard allowed Tea entrance into the fortress. Tea soon felt safe behind the walls of the structure, and made his way into the main tower to rest. Inside, he found the castle's owner, the civilization's champion, standing against the wall.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/2n7k34.png)
Tea had heard of these clockworkers, the one's whose jobs were to patrol the lands and strike down enemies, yet he would not have expected such a creature as the one before him to hold such a position. A tan, redheaded young woman, she was quite average looking. Though if she held such a position, Tea realized, there must be more to her.
Tea decided to converse with the champion, who told him that her name was Hame Regimehame. She told him a bit of her history, of her civilization, and of her family. She also imparted to him small bits of her personal research on the gnomes that lived beneath the earth. She told him that, with a simple tarnish stalk as a base, one could replicate their firearm producing technique. Tea was amazed, for although he had heard of the long guns which were said to make bows such as his seem like children's toys, he had never imagined that they could be so easily made. He thanked her for the knowledge greatly, before proceeding to the top of the tower to sleep.
When he awoke, he found that he could once again walk on two feet. He decided to ask Hame if she had any work for him. She politely told him that she had no use of him. Slightly disappointed, he requested bodyguards from her to escort him back to his home. She told him that she was able to spare two for him. He then set off from the castle with his two female companions, a swordsman and a spearman, looking for a way back to his home village.
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 09:58:59 pm
Chapter III: The Tower
After travelling northward for hours in search of Tea's home hamlet, his group encountered a group of wild hounds.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/309n4nk.png)
Whilst his companions began to attack them directly, Tea stayed hidden, firing arrows at his foes. This turned out to be a credible fighting strategy, as the two clockworkers were quickly swarmed by the angry beasts. Although they found valiantly and killed many of the hounds, the swordsman ended up killed and the spearman became quite injured. Despite this setback, Tea saw opportunity in this encounter. He took the meteoric iron shield from his fallen companion and felt it in his hand, realizing how useful it could be to him. He then took his dirk and practiced his butchery on the already mutilated hounds. Afterwards, he called to his limping companion to continue on her way.
Travelling for a few hours more, the two found themselves before a tall tower of nechatite in the middle of the forest. It was surrounded by walking troll corpses, and Tea heard the crack of a clockworker's pistol coming from it. He turned around to see two bullets stuck into the ground near his companion. He wondered what vile work was going on in such a place.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/24m7txg.png)
He fired an arrow at one of the corpses, missed, and was surprised to see the anger and speed of these undead creatures. Not noticing him, the zombie and its companions ran after his companion. It only took one, however, to beat down the already wounded clockworker and decapitate her with its axe. To Tea's horror, the body and the head of his fallen companion then began to move and moan once more. This terrifying act of witchcraft enraged Tea, and he sought vengeance.
First he retreated a few more paces away from the tower. He then began to fire arrows at the trolls, most of which simply bounced off of their thick armor. He was feeling quite discouraged, when he suddenly heard the boasts of the leader of the tower: a clockwork lord of the dead.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/n4zkf9.png)
(http://i40.tinypic.com/353d36o.png)
He realized that this monster was responsible for his friend's current state, and that she was to be his target. He moved into a better position to see her and began to fire arrows at her. None of his shots hit, and he soon realized that he was out of arrows. Not willing to surrender, he found a patch of blue obsidian rocks and began to sharpen them. After throwing several of these sharpened stones, one finally hit one of the mighty troll zombies.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/dbplas.png)
Tea's excitement was short lived however, when he witnessed firsthand the power of his enemy's magic.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/1tadk8.png)
Tea realized that he would have to continously beat down his enemy's forces if he had any hope of victory. He continued throwing the sharpened rocks at the zombies, however he soon realized that his enemy had more than one trick up her sleeve.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/eg713c.png)
The troll did not become a zombie, but rather transformed into a fully-healed creature with long, pointed fangs. Tea began to wonder if defeating the army of a lord of the dead was even possible. He continued to throw his obsidian rocks, and eventually killed the fanged creature once again, only to have it reanimated once more. Tea continued throwing rocks until he decided that he would have to return to avenge his companion on another day. He stealthily made his way into the wilderness once more.
Travelling beyond the tower, he found himself at yet another clockwork castle, this one of a much larger size. This one was owned by a priestess, who offered him refuge in her tower. Inside the keep of her tower, he found several items that he deemed of use to him. One of these was a pistol sword made of lunanium, as well as ammunition for it. In addition, he found a clockwork shield and a clockwork axe, which he knew were far superior to his dirk and buckler. Feeling the weight of his new equipment in his hands, he knew that it would assist him in his quest for vengeance. Until then, however, he would rest.
Post by: WillowLuman on November 02, 2013, 10:03:05 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 02, 2013, 10:47:43 pm
You didn't have to make them actual necromancers, you could've had them transform the zombies into clockworks or something... but damn if that interaction isn't funny :DThe clockworkers, as a race, have nothing to do with the necromancers; any humanoid race can become one. I also wanted to give them something extra, hence the addition of the nosferatu (called 'corpses' for some reason). As for the reaction text, I'm glad you like it.
Post by: Gnorm on November 03, 2013, 01:09:28 am
Chapter IV: The Lord of the Dead
It was at the priestess' castle that Tea Blackbrewed came across the soldiers that would accompany him to the tower. The clockwork gunner and axeman were quite eager to smite evil and to avenge their fallen comrade. The small group travelled a small distance before coming upon the accursed tower of which the reader is already familiar. The axeman rushed inside in an attempt to avenge the fallen spearman, and he was quickly murdered by the zombie trolls. His body then began the transformation into one of the long-fanged creatures, though Tea put it down in one shot from his pistol sword.
Tea decided then that it was time to reveal himself. Running into the tower, the zombies finally noticed him, along with the concealed lord of the dead, who fired several shots from her gun. Tea then retreated away from the tower, giving his companion a chance to shoot at the advancing hoardes, whilst providing covering fire of his own. The plan, however, failed, and Tea once again was left with no companions.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/34pnx5l.png)
Tea fired more shots into the tower, but the zombies were now after him. He was forced to hide behind a tree and abscond to the side, leading the zombies off track. Tea now had yet another opportunity to kill the zombies. He shot the one nearest to him dead, picked it up, and threw it as far away from the tower as he could. He continued to do the same to the next zombie, as well as that of the gunner. When he moved back up to the tower, he was reminded of how tenacious his necromantic foe was, constantly reviving the corpses as soon as they were killed. He decided to repeat his previous strategy, revealing himself and running back into hiding. He repeated this strategy several times, before realizing that, in addition to his quiver beginning to grow light, the lord of the dead had exited her tower.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/r9k6ex.png)
Tea wasted no more time, and began to fire off his shots as quickly as he could. The shots he fired hardly phased the army of the witch, and Tea was forced to make use of his axe for the first time. He rushed towards the witch, his axe raised above his head. Her army, however, would not allow its queen to die. It rushed for him, swarming him and tearing him apart. It was a simple zombie, just like the many that he had fought before, that dealt the killing blow.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/qx2hwl.png)
At the very moment the pickaxe head, he made one last realization in his adventuring life before his nervous system gave out completely.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2lwq1zk.png)
The lord of the dead was not going to let this body go to waste; rather, she would allow him entry into her army's ranks.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/5p30qh.png)
(http://i41.tinypic.com/348ng5e.png)
The spell made two nosferatu out of one; the witch was quite pleased. She made her way back to her tower, where she would continue her quest for world domination.
Historical Notes:
- Tea Blackbrewed would be remembered by the civilized races as "the Righteous Siege of Hound" for slaying the legendary zombie Battlesyore eight times
- The zombie that defeated this hero is referred to as "Petalsfield"
- The story of this hero is, interestingly enough, told both by adventuresome young halflings as an epic tale of bravery, and by halfling mothers as a cautionary tale to their young
Post by: Halfling on November 03, 2013, 12:39:28 pm
Also: adding that and Gnorm bugfixes to first page. Gnorm, you could just have uploaded over the unbugfixed one, though.
edit: saw your edit
Post by: vyznev on November 03, 2013, 03:41:37 pm
Ps. Halfling, do you think it would be a good idea to include GitHub download links in the first post, in addition to (or maybe even instead of) the DFFD links? Here are all of them so far:
- Starting point, minimal world by Halfling (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-00-halfling.zip)
- Turn 1 by BFEL (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-01-bfel.zip)
- Turn 2 by StLeibowitz (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-02-stleibowitz.zip)
- Turn 3 by LaularuKyrumo (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-03-laularukyrumo.zip)
- Turn 4 by Sackhead (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-04-sackhead.zip)
- Turn 5 by HugoLuman (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-05-hugoluman.zip)
- Turn 6 by Zanzetkuken (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-06-zanzetkuken.zip)
- Turn 7 by Reemer30 (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-07-reemer30.zip)
- HugoLuman's bugfix pack for turn 7 (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-07bis-hugoluman.zip)
- Turn 8 by Putnam (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-08-putnam.zip)
- Turn 9 by Gnorm (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-09-gnorm.zip)
Also, this download link (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-latest.zip) always points to the GitHub version of the most recent turn's raws, while this link (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/master.zip) gives you the absolute latest version of the raws from the master branch, which might include extra contributions not yet officially part of any turn. And here's a wiki page with installation instructions (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki).
(Honestly, the whole master/release branch system I set up seems a bit overcomplicated for how we're mostly using it, but I think I'll hang on to it at least until my own turn -- I'm sort of planning on tossing any and all untested stuff onto the master branch for public testing as I write it.)
Post by: Aseaheru on November 03, 2013, 03:57:49 pm
And here it is! Please tell me what you think, and also if I should continue it.
http://youtu.be/xEJdK6y70kc (http://youtu.be/xEJdK6y70kc)
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on November 03, 2013, 03:59:08 pm
1st Sandstone, 251
Gods, the workers must have lived in total poverty if they think crushed, wet rocks are worth keeping around as a useful "glob."
(http://i40.tinypic.com/352i6xf.png)
21st Sandstone, 251
More migrants came! only 3 though. I wonder why not very many are coming.
12th Timber, 251
It looks like the capital finally sees the potential in this city and sent a caravan. I hope we can make some transactions; I have some smoking pipes ready.
Supplementary entry:
Good gods! the merchant and his hound are bleeding! They look injured! I hope no centaurs are on their way. Not that I am worried or anything.
15th Timber, 251
The merchants are selling the stuff too. It seems as though no one knows what it really is. They seem to think that they are plants.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/25p31om.png)
They are also carrying the mysterious plant substance.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/whigk7.png)
16th Timber, 251
Oh gods! The merchants have brought gems filled with souls! What kind of witchcraft is this? I can see a face in it! It is staring right at me! I need a nap; my broker will handle the trading.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/21b27mh.png)
1st Granite, 252
Happy new year!
27th Granite, 252
Babies! This settlement is becoming more and more like a real city every day!
(http://i39.tinypic.com/28k29nm.png)
2nd Slate, 252
More migrants! Lots more this time. I should probably make bedrooms for them. People are finally realizing the true potential of this city.
15th Slate, 252
I have decided to dig to the center of the earth and build my mansion there.
17th Slate, 252
We have dug into an underground cavern filled with rivers. This would be a great spot, but I shall check further down just in case.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/69gowg.png)
22nd Slate, 252
We have dug as far down as physically possible, and have discovered mysterious warm stones. This is the perfect place.
25th Slate, 252
I have found a huge magma sea and a large vein of metal, I shall make my mansion out of this! Although I sea a strange creature swimming around.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2unwot1.png)
8th Felsite, 252
It appears as though my miner has found himself in a bit of a pickle. He dug out the wrong stone and released lava and fried himself. Bummer.
11th Felsite, 252
A forested caravan came. I don't care what they have, but I don't want it. I am too close to my goal.
12th Felsite, 252
One of our own caravans came, I will be willing to trade with them. I have the windows they ordered.
16th Felsite, 252
At last! I have reached the center of the world!
(http://i39.tinypic.com/milw5.png)
Construction on my villa shall begin immediately!
20th Felsite, 252
A mysterious creature has been spotted traveling up into the fortress. I hope its friendly. : D
(http://i42.tinypic.com/23w7llz.png)
As I die, slain by the monster, I realize something: It wasn't friendly. D:
(http://i41.tinypic.com/jr4hdt.png)
(http://i39.tinypic.com/wj6ohh.png)
(http://i39.tinypic.com/amsb3n.png)
:(
Post by: WillowLuman on November 03, 2013, 04:24:12 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on November 03, 2013, 04:25:23 pm
Post by: Halfling on November 03, 2013, 05:06:32 pm
OK, Gnorm's bugfixes are on GitHub now. I also went ahead and merged in the recent fixes already in the master branch (Zanzetkuken's cheap metals and missing hound vocalizations) to the release branch. If that's not OK, I can always revert it.
Ps. Halfling, do you think it would be a good idea to include GitHub download links in the first post, in addition to (or maybe even instead of) the DFFD links? Here are all of them so far:(The Obsidian graphics versions aren't on GitHub yet. Remind me to do something about that.)
- Starting point, minimal world by Halfling (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-00-halfling.zip)
- Turn 1 by BFEL (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-01-bfel.zip)
- Turn 2 by StLeibowitz (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-02-stleibowitz.zip)
- Turn 3 by LaularuKyrumo (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-03-laularukyrumo.zip)
- Turn 4 by Sackhead (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-04-sackhead.zip)
- Turn 5 by HugoLuman (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-05-hugoluman.zip)
- Turn 6 by Zanzetkuken (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-06-zanzetkuken.zip)
- Turn 7 by Reemer30 (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-07-reemer30.zip)
- HugoLuman's bugfix pack for turn 7 (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-07bis-hugoluman.zip)
- Turn 8 by Putnam (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-08-putnam.zip)
- Turn 9 by Gnorm (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-09-gnorm.zip)
Also, this download link (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/release-latest.zip) always points to the GitHub version of the most recent turn's raws, while this link (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/master.zip) gives you the absolute latest version of the raws from the master branch, which might include extra contributions not yet officially part of any turn. And here's a wiki page with installation instructions (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki).
(Honestly, the whole master/release branch system I set up seems a bit overcomplicated for how we're mostly using it, but I think I'll hang on to it at least until my own turn -- I'm sort of planning on tossing any and all untested stuff onto the master branch for public testing as I write it.)
Well, why not.
Also, I'll add your, ZtG's and Zorg Master's playtesting turns to the first post too under Gnorm. Sorry about the delay.
Edit: there, and also now easier to read in logical order :)
To save a little space, I'll add git links from Gnorm's turn on.
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on November 03, 2013, 05:31:13 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 03, 2013, 05:38:23 pm
Post by: Halfling on November 03, 2013, 05:48:01 pm
I'm counting at least the following bugs that need investigating:
- Mysterious plant substances, nameless substances, and "n/a" (duplicated raws again?)
- Incorrect materials included in squid, and probably other creatures
- Strange colors in hell
- Lizardfolk reaction problems(?)
...Those may take some time. Still, I'm really happy with what we've created.
Post by: Gnorm on November 03, 2013, 05:51:50 pm
No, hell grass was an actual grass which just looked like an ice floor. It was never implemented. This is a new thing.Most of the plant glitches have been fixed in bugfix 1.0.2, I believe the n/a is the result of someone accidentally making a plant make a drink that it isn't supposed to. Also, I've noticed that although the mamaphints are supposed to have ivory, they seem to have horn instead.
I'm counting at least the following bugs that need investigating:
- Mysterious plant substances, nameless substances, and "n/a" (duplicated raws again?)
- Incorrect materials included in squid, and probably other creatures
- Strange colors in hell
- Lizardfolk reaction problems(?)
...Those may take some time. Still, I'm really happy with what we've created.
Post by: Halfling on November 03, 2013, 06:00:39 pm
Could you add the verbal interactions so trolls can actually speak? These: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg4732163;topicseen#msg4732163
Also, here's where it can get confusing: If you download from github, the vocalizations are fixed already. If you download from DFFD you don't have duplication but you don't get the vocalizations fix either. Hm.
Post by: WillowLuman on November 03, 2013, 06:10:41 pm
Post by: Halfling on November 03, 2013, 06:21:29 pm
Duplicate Object: plant APPLE_WOOD_KPT
Duplicate Object: plant APPLE_FRUIT_KPT
pre-embark.
In Gnorm v. 1.0.2 / Git turn 9 the errorlog is empty at fortress start, however, "n/a" can still be bought at embark under extracts in both versions. (no blank items though)
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on November 03, 2013, 08:06:50 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on November 03, 2013, 08:15:42 pm
Post by: vyznev on November 04, 2013, 12:37:40 am
No, hell grass was an actual grass which just looked like an ice floor. It was never implemented. This is a new thing.Most of the plant glitches have been fixed in bugfix 1.0.2, I believe the n/a is the result of someone accidentally making a plant make a drink that it isn't supposed to. Also, I've noticed that although the mamaphints are supposed to have ivory, they seem to have horn instead.
I'm counting at least the following bugs that need investigating:
- Mysterious plant substances, nameless substances, and "n/a" (duplicated raws again?)
- Incorrect materials included in squid, and probably other creatures
- Strange colors in hell
- Lizardfolk reaction problems(?)
...Those may take some time. Still, I'm really happy with what we've created.
I think you're right -- I'm not seeing any duplication, but I do count 29 occurrences of [STATE_NAME:LIQUID:n/a] or [STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:n/a] in the raws. Any one of those could be the issue.
(In the future, may I suggest using slightly more descriptive names for "impossible" states. If all of those were named, say, [STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:n/a (material name)], with the actual material name in parentheses, this would be much easier to debug.)
Actually, though, I think I found the problem (or at least one of them):
Code: (inorganic_alchemy_STL.txt) [Select]
[INORGANIC:OCULENTIBUS_TEARS_STL]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:INSECT_LIQUID_TEMPLATE_STL]
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:CLEAR]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:oculentibus tears]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:n/a]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:smoke]
[TILE:178][DISPLAY_COLOR:1:0:1]
Speaking of which, I also notice that the stoneward / paralyzing incense reactions in reaction_alchemy_STL.txt call for [REAGENT:C:1:PLANT:NONE:INORGANIC:OCULENTIBUS_TEARS_STL], which I don't think is going to work; it should be LIQUID_MISC (I think) instead of PLANT.
Post by: vyznev on November 04, 2013, 02:54:14 am
- Oculentibus tears are no longer named "n/a", and should now work properly in reactions (needs testing!). Also, any remaining "n/a" state names now include the material name in parentheses for easier debugging. (Still haven't figured out where the "liquid" extract comes from, though; it's not from INSECT_LIQUID_TEMPLATE_STL.)
- Statues and hydra cocoons are now made of rock, so people should no longer prefer to consume them (I hope). Also, statues now die by freezing instead of air-drowning, which is more reliable. (Previously they could survive indefinitely in water.) They'll still drown in magma, though.
- The lizardfolk "chieftain" position is now spelled correctly, and the "grand chieftain" position actually has a name.
- Some capitalized creature names and prefstrings have been uncapitalized for consistency.
- Miscellaneous spelling / grammar fixes.
- fix oculentibus tears name and reactions, disambiguate any other "n/a" state names (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/69c33b8f65076510d715cf7a1bca830f27207aae)
- remove edible tissues from statues and hydra cocoons (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/15df731f6bc4db4b81fbf8ba95f5ca58d6305cc1)
- spellcheck mamaphint/plesiophint prefstrings (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/05247f578bf4bcc7d54364ecde184be15f7fa9b0)
- uncapitalize "giant squid" for consistency with other animal names (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/f6d946ce95bcf2a3ed689f751e1d75a4fb88e656)
- fix spelling of "chieftain", add missing [NAME] tag for grand chieftains (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/b989df1015ab80ee7aaac74b929f10e8f9a51382)
- fix spelling in lizardfolk/dragonkin descriptions (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/3d21c5ca9d26da281e95b408c5c535e9c47b968d)
- uncapitalize "gifted adherent" caste (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/54ce11794732b796a98a346f74cbda6bc0529f22)
- remove wings from statues and cocoons, make statues die by freezing instead of air-drowning (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/c9b4ec4a1a77eb8fd38f61752182dc4d541875e6)
- actually fix stoneward / paralyzing vigor reactions to use LIQUID_MISC instead of PLANT for oculentibus tears (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/d129f7a180b015e021fd649f06b774709fb8b343)
Post by: WillowLuman on November 04, 2013, 03:20:02 am
Also, I think someone had the gas state name for something that wasn't supposed to be gas as "problem" :) sounds like we could use more like that.
Post by: Halfling on November 04, 2013, 08:04:27 am
On a related note, nobles demanding stuff made of squid bone is not that unusual, right? (It should probably still be fixed)
vyznev's master and release links can now be found in the first post. I'm impressed with how well this git stuff is working out, but I'm not sure how to integrate it better.
Post by: vyznev on November 04, 2013, 08:45:31 am
I had Giant and Gifted capitalized for emphasis, but if everyone else feels strongly about it it's not that big a change.
I don't really feel strongly about it either -- it just feels a bit inconsistent to me, but if it's supposed to be that way, I can just put it back the way it was and suppress my OCD. :)
Also, I think someone had the gas state name for something that wasn't supposed to be gas as "problem" :) sounds like we could use more like that.
That'll work too, at least as long as people are creative enough in their naming: finding something made of "problem" becomes somewhat less helpful if there are a dozen different materials using the same name. Still, that's what synonyms are for...
vyznev's master and release links can now be found in the first post. I'm impressed with how well this git stuff is working out, but I'm not sure how to integrate it better.
I think it's about as well integrated now as it can be, without more people actually using Git to track their own contributions. Admittedly, there's a bit of a learning curve there -- maybe not quite as bad as learning to play DF, but close. ;)
Post by: BlackFlyme on November 04, 2013, 09:02:19 pm
Checking the Dwarf Fortress wiki's colour scale (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Color), 10:0 is the same as 2:1, which is bright green. 11:0 or 3:1 would have been the blue expected of ice.
I've set the basic colour to [BASIC_COLOR:3:1] in my game and it seems to work.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on November 04, 2013, 09:07:13 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on November 04, 2013, 09:16:24 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on November 04, 2013, 10:11:02 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on November 04, 2013, 10:21:09 pm
I'm sure someone who actually knows will clear up why we have special ice before too long.
Post by: Halfling on November 04, 2013, 11:38:54 pm
Why is hell no longer diggable for water?
Because "ice" melts into 833 water, which is a contaminant, and not drinkable.
That's how it went. It seems he got the color wrong. Also, he said he hadn't much experience with colors and we can freely change the colors, in response to his black backgrounds for minerals annoying people, IIRC. :P
Post by: vyznev on November 05, 2013, 11:46:58 am
I also added a script to render the color and tiles of various stones as an HTML table (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/blob/master/utils/stone_colors_to_html.pl). Here's a dump of the current colors of all our inorganic materials (http://vyznev.net/misc/df/dfscratch/colors_20131105_ebe0654.html) after the changes above.
Oh, and Giant squid and Gifted adherents are capitalized again. (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/2497b347d493b7b9c21d09dc8d195cb6e41f1105)
Post by: vyznev on November 05, 2013, 06:33:16 pm
Besides simple typo-fixes, a few more extensive changes I ended up making include:
- The insect body parts now have fancier plurals ("tarsi", "opisthosomata", "prosomata", "proboscides", "antennae"). Also corrected the singular of "elytra" to "elytron".
- Standardized the British spelling "colour" to the American "color". Not that I think there's anything intrinsically better about American spelling, but I felt consistency would be good. Can revert this if other disagree.
- Removed the (AFAIK) unused third parameter from some child/baby name tags. If that parameter actually is used for something, let me know and I'll restore it.
- The clockworker entity spouse titles now consistently include the suffix "consort".
- Lizardfolk shamans no longer have the hypercorrect plural "shamen". (Not changed: the plural of "mactopus" is still "mactopi", instead of "mactopuses" or "mactopodes".)
- Changed the adjective name of flax from "flaxen" to "linen", so we can have "linen cloth shirts". (Edit: actually, this needs to be a prefix on the thread material. Fixed. (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/16ed309fe36012eb3765a13d207d304b0c4fcd43))
Also, in case anyone else wants to do this later, I included a simple Perl script (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/blob/master/utils/ispell_deformat_raws.pl) that can be used as an ispell deformatter to avoid wasting time spell-checking DF tokens and comments.
Post by: WillowLuman on November 05, 2013, 06:41:38 pm
Like the normal names, the third parameter is the adjective form. Without it, body parts, spatters, and crafts wind up called "nothing blood" or "nothing leather", etc.
Post by: kopout on November 05, 2013, 08:12:07 pm
* the problem was my computer,I still don't know what's wrong but I downloaded it on the library computer and moved it over with a flash drive
Post by: vyznev on November 05, 2013, 09:15:31 pm
Why would you remove something if it wasn't a misspelling and didn't cause bugs?
Like the normal names, the third parameter is the adjective form. Without it, body parts, spatters, and crafts wind up called "nothing blood" or "nothing leather", etc.
Because it looked to me like it was broken the way it was. The wiki (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Creature_token#G) says those tags only take two parameters, and I don't see what it could use the third one for anyway: DF doesn't differentiate materials or tissues according to whether they came from an adult creature or a child. Dwarf blood is dwarf blood, even if it was bled by a dwarven baby.
Anyway, I was kind of concerned since I had noticed while testing the linen that "nothing leather" is available as a material in arena mode. So I went and rolled back the chances and tested it again. In conclusion, I can report that the presence or absence of a third parameter to those baby/child name tags does not seem to have any effect on the availability of "nothing leather"; that's clearly a bug, but these changes did not cause it.
Besides, every single baby/child name tag in the vanilla raws has only two parameters. AFAIK, vanilla DF isn't filled with "nothing leather".
Post by: WillowLuman on November 05, 2013, 09:25:58 pm
Post by: Putnam on November 05, 2013, 09:26:07 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 05, 2013, 09:32:09 pm
Post by: vyznev on November 05, 2013, 10:34:09 pm
While I was at it, I also fixed another problem (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/fe3dfbd50075a5a3a9e08aad4938e58112964688) where creeping grass growths would drop a nameless itemcorpse. Apparently, DF gets confused if it's told to make a plant out of animal tissue. :D
Post by: Putnam on November 05, 2013, 11:24:22 pm
Apparently, DF gets confused if it's told to make a plant out of animal tissue. :D
That's odd.
Post by: Gnorm on November 07, 2013, 12:59:05 am
Post by: Halfling on November 07, 2013, 05:13:29 am
There's a small fixed chance any troll is murderously insane. The leading cause of troll deaths is other trolls after all.
Post by: StLeibowitz on November 07, 2013, 06:02:21 am
Post by: vyznev on November 07, 2013, 06:17:13 am
(There are also two hateable species of fly in creature_disease_insects_STL.txt, but the OBJECT tag in that file is commented out, effectively disabling them.)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 08, 2013, 10:29:14 pm
Quote
Hey, (if I do so) would it be alright for me to utilize some content of this as a basis for the full revamp of my dragonic civilization mod that I am thinking about doing?
Post by: Halfling on November 09, 2013, 03:51:18 pm
Zanzetkuken, I personally don't mind, but it might be polite to ask the person whose content you wold be borrowing individually. :)
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on November 09, 2013, 03:57:33 pm
Zanzetkuken, I personally don't mind, but it might be polite to ask the person whose content you wold be borrowing individually. :)
Well, since I am basically only going to be using yours, as far as I can tell...
Post by: Fen on November 09, 2013, 10:21:18 pm
It is GLORIOUS and DWARFY and I have no idea how you people are making it not collapse in on itself.
Post by: Halfling on November 10, 2013, 03:13:21 am
Well, since I am basically only going to be using yours, as far as I can tell...
Then go right ahead. Credit if you feel it's due.
I finally managed to read up on this thread a bit and I must say It's one of the most amusing things I have seen in some time. It's like watching a train wreck, but the train has chicken legs instead of wheels and instead of rolling off a track it's been flung into the sky which has inexplicably become a giant custard pie.
Featured quote. :D
Post by: vyznev on November 10, 2013, 03:43:50 pm
Kopout, please take the full two, unless Xieg or vyznev object. Or do people feel this is unfair?
I have no objections.
Post by: Fen on November 10, 2013, 04:51:10 pm
Featured quote. :D
Why thank you, I'm honoured to be quoted on such a fine topic!
Post by: kopout on November 11, 2013, 08:21:46 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 11, 2013, 08:26:16 pm
Good news, I figured out why everyone's naked! Their pants have been melting off. I'll have to fix that.That's excellent, I suppose.
Post by: kopout on November 11, 2013, 08:34:14 pm
Does anyone know what the units of tensile strength and shear yield are?
Post by: Putnam on November 11, 2013, 08:43:40 pm
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:319] bulk modulus 170 GPa
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:73] young's modulus 211 GPa
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:189] shear modulus 82 GPa
Copper:
[COMPRESSIVE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:175] 140
[TENSILE_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:58] 120
[SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:145] 48
Yeah, the units are GPa, in some way. Not sure what Toady's doing with them.
Post by: kopout on November 11, 2013, 10:16:21 pm
Post by: Halfling on November 12, 2013, 03:05:32 am
Post by: Putnam on November 12, 2013, 04:39:07 am
Post by: vyznev on November 12, 2013, 02:30:05 pm
(http://vyznev.net/misc/df/dfscratch/df_vanilla_strain_at_yield.png)
(Not shown: the compressive strain at yield for bismuth, at 3387 (tag) / 31 (comment).)
As far as I can tell, the correlation is pretty much zero.
Post by: Putnam on November 12, 2013, 11:43:32 pm
Post by: Halfling on November 13, 2013, 10:13:14 am
Well, we don't even have any real values to correlate to, so nobody can say we're not being realistic. :D
In short, make it up, use other values for some reference, plug it in the arena to see that it's not game-breaking, and people will be happy.
Post by: WillowLuman on November 13, 2013, 11:18:38 am
Post by: Putnam on November 13, 2013, 09:46:32 pm
Post by: kopout on November 13, 2013, 09:57:15 pm
Post by: Putnam on November 13, 2013, 10:01:00 pm
Post by: Korbac on November 14, 2013, 09:23:58 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 17, 2013, 02:58:46 pm
Post by: kopout on November 17, 2013, 05:23:09 pm
Post by: kopout on November 17, 2013, 10:37:26 pm
In moding news, I'll be done with my turn tomorrow and Will upload no latter than Tuesday.
Post by: WillowLuman on November 17, 2013, 11:47:33 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 17, 2013, 11:48:46 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on November 17, 2013, 11:52:09 pm
Really, they shouldn't be appearing in the wild, I removed all their biome and frequency tokens.
Post by: Gnorm on November 17, 2013, 11:53:56 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on November 18, 2013, 02:43:16 am
Post by: vyznev on November 18, 2013, 03:45:28 am
Post by: Halfling on November 18, 2013, 01:16:38 pm
Post by: kopout on November 18, 2013, 06:21:57 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on November 18, 2013, 06:40:56 pm
Post by: kopout on November 18, 2013, 06:48:19 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 20, 2013, 07:08:17 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on November 20, 2013, 08:06:11 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on November 20, 2013, 08:27:34 pm
Post by: vyznev on November 20, 2013, 08:30:21 pm
Huh... on GitHub, the hounds have [BIOME:ANY_LAND][FREQUENCY:100]. It looks like the whole creature_halfling.txt file got reverted to an older version during Putnam's turn. I guess I should re-revert it?
That's done now. It turned out to be a bit trickier than I thought it would be; I basically had to revert the file to the version before Putnam's turn (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/16857c443bf1e90dede9060562d24e9e3eea7dda) and then manually add back any changes that seemed deliberate (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/809f571ab03081fea201592f806460057cd653bf). I'd appreciate any extra eyeballs on this, just to check that I didn't mess up anything.
Oh, and kopout, could you please make sure to include the fixed creature_halfling.txt in your turn's raws?
Post by: kopout on November 20, 2013, 10:51:15 pm
EDIT:The game is complaining about not finding NOSEBILL and MOUTHBILL body glosses. I'm just going to add those in manually.
Post by: kopout on November 21, 2013, 01:17:59 am
There is a whole bunch of new stuff I'll itemize and explane in the morning but it is after 1 am now and I'm going to sleap. (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8158)
Post by: Gnorm on November 21, 2013, 01:58:18 am
EDIT: You did not include my text and speech files; this will have to be fixed. On a positive note, I did appreciate the baskervills.
Post by: vyznev on November 21, 2013, 07:11:45 am
here (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8158) is the latest update. Sorry it took so long but I think it should be worth it ( I hope).
Got it. GitHub update coming soon.
EDIT:The game is complaining about not finding NOSEBILL and MOUTHBILL body glosses. I'm just going to add those in manually.
EDIT: You did not include my text and speech files; this will have to be fixed. On a positive note, I did appreciate the baskervills.
OK, looks like there will be some merging to do. I'll try to make sure that the final GitHub version has everything from both turns.
Post by: vyznev on November 21, 2013, 11:12:21 am
To get the Kopout's and Gnorm's raws merged properly, I ended up starting with Kopout's raws from DFFS and basically reapplying all changes in the GitHub master branch since Putnam's turn (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/1aa26880ecd692c39b3b041065b72890143e84e5) on top of them. Here's a handly link showing what actually changed on the master branch (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/compare/809f571...1aa2688) as a result of this merge.
I also ran another spellcheck on the raws (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/9981fce7217e0d9eb312ebc74ea6206b068b78d9) and fixed one minor bug (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/be42240df8ed93cb087a822b55946e2efe912312) I happened to spot that caused stink dogs to emit "smoke" instead of "stink".
Also, to make future merges easier, I decided to turn on a special Git feature (http://git-scm.com/book/ch7-2.html#Keyword-Expansion) that automatically expands the tag "$Id$" in files to something like "$Id: 774df473ada032118d3e66ca91fe87a834cf4195 $", where the random hex string changes every time the file is changed in Git. (In case you're curious, the hex string is the SHA-1 hash of the file contents, excluding the hex string itself.) This means that, if you download a tagged file from GitHub and edit it, I can (fairly) easily tell which revision of the file on GitHub it came from, which in turn makes it less likely that it accidentally gets reverted to an older version in a merge. It's currently enabled only for .txt files in the raw/objects folder, and I added such a tag to all of them.
Ps. Kopout, do you think adding [VERMIN_HATEABLE] to stink dogs would be a good idea? (AFAIK, despite the name, it doesn't actually make them vermin -- treelords have it, and they seem to work just fine.) We don't have a lot of hateable creatures currently.
Post by: Gnorm on November 22, 2013, 05:47:48 pm
Excerpt from the Journal of Dirt Championblue, Manager of The Masters of Battle and Oldgreen:
1st Granite, 501
I should have listened to my family. I could have gotten a simple job carving out pipes for my home village, make a modest profit, and manage to retire with a wife and children, smoking everyday on my porch and playing my fiddle before bed. Instead, I made the foolish decision to brave the dangers of the world looking for fame and fortune. Wave Pastold had similar desires as mine, and was putting together a trade caravan to travel the world in. She approached me personally, claiming that she needed “smart men to crunch the numbers for a woman such as her.” I thought this was my chance for adventure, so I readily agreed, and was dragged along with all the other halflings foolish enough to accompany her.
The caravan was a disaster from the very start. Wave took nothing of value with her for trade, so we were unable to find any actual clients. Yet she was persistent, and we continued to travel further and further away from our civilization in search of buyers. Eventually, we found ourselves hit hard by winter, which slowed us down severely and caused our wagon to weaken severely. Eventually, the inevitable happened and the wheels gave out, right in the middle of this forest near the central mountain ranges.
Here I have attempted, as best as I could, to depict our current location:
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2m4zij7.png)
The following sketch comes directly from our national atlas:
(http://i41.tinypic.com/23morop.png)
My initial idea was to grab our pack beetle immediately with some food and ride it to the nearest Formic hive, but the animal is too tired and frostbitten to be of any use to me. The only thing we can do, I told Wave, is build proper lodgings for ourselves and to hope we can survive in this wilderness until we are found. Wave’s small mind, quite clearly, began to form ideas as soon as I told her this, and she declared then that she was the proud mayor of this Halfling settlement, which she called: “Oldgreen.” She wants a proper town hall for her “office,” and demands that we get to constructing it immediately.
Since we never had any customers or sales to record, I never actually used this book. For this reason, I have decided to use it as a journal, so that if anyone ever comes across the pathetic ruins of a small outpost in the woods, he will know what happened here.
Post by: Gnorm on November 22, 2013, 06:51:35 pm
1st Hematite, 501
This past month has, unexpectedly, fairly well. The winter ice has finally thawed, and our pack beetle, that has been adopted by our hunter and named Blue Wavefield, has recovered from its frostbite. It now runs around with its owner, occasionally bumping into our workers.
Here is my best drawing of the pack beetle:
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2wplajb.png)
Out of fear for the next winter, we have built a well and a cistern beneath the earth, away from the cold outside air.
Copy of the floor plan, including halflings:
(http://i42.tinypic.com/125t2xv.png)
Two small houses have been built so far. Each one is designed to hold two halflings and a chest for their things. It isn’t much, but we’re not trying to build a metropolis in these woods.
Rough sketch of the two homes, next to the entrance to the well area:
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2n1cpkp.png)
A small mine has been dug to obtain stone for our constructions and for our crafts, for many of us have taken to making pipes and fiddles in our spare time to combat the boredom. Interestingly enough, the mayor, to whom I have begun to take a liking, mandated that we construct her three rock slabs. After we did so, she ordered us not to “export” them. I sincerely wonder to whom she was fearing that we would “export” them.
Post by: kopout on November 22, 2013, 07:53:47 pm
I didn't find this out till after I uploaded.
Post by: BlackFlyme on November 22, 2013, 08:10:39 pm
Important knowledge for Gnorm! Don't build a lumberyard unless you go into my reactions and make prepare cave lemons not automatic. For some reason it accepts any log. This can cause infinite loops and produces incendiary lemons. So not only dose it cause the lumberyard to be useless it also produces fire.
I didn't find this out till after I uploaded.
I think I found out why.
The plant is called LEMON_CAVE_KPT but the reaction calls for CAVE_LEMON_KPT
Post by: kopout on November 22, 2013, 08:29:23 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 23, 2013, 04:12:42 pm
26th Malachite, 501
A small group of halflings was spotted today, making haste towards our small settlement. At first, I thought that we were saved, but I quickly realized that they were as stranded as we are. Apparently, they are the remnants of a bandit group that had been trailing us for weeks before being caught in the harsh winter. They must have been as good at banditry as we were at caravan trading, otherwise they would have looted us and been able to return home. Blade, who recently won our general election to become the new mayor, decided that, because they would have nothing to gain from looting us now, we should accept them into our society as workers. I'm still keeping an eye on them.
Updated roster of denizens:
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2ef0v92.png)
In the meantime, construction of the town hall, more houses, and a food cellar is underway. Traps have also been set in various areas of the settlement, for we have seen a baskervill wandering about in the northern section of the forest. If that beast gets too close, we'll probably all die.
Post by: WillowLuman on November 23, 2013, 05:18:12 pm
Post by: kero42 on November 23, 2013, 07:06:26 pm
What the heck is a Baskervill?
I suppose you'll get an answer soon, but if I had to take a (nigh baseless and rather unlikely) guess, maybe something to do with "The Hound of the Baskervilles"? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hound_of_the_Baskervilles). A quick Google search redirected to "Baskervill" which is a place/ business, but showing results for "Baskervil" shows mainly dog related images/pages. So (unless the name is unimportant/ a reference to something else) my first guess is that its some kind of doggy.
Post by: Meph on November 23, 2013, 07:12:54 pm
Quote
This can cause infinite loops and produces incendiary lemons.
I love this thread.
Post by: kopout on November 23, 2013, 07:22:05 pm
What the heck is a Baskervill?
I suppose you'll get an answer soon, but if I had to take a (nigh baseless and rather unlikely) guess, maybe something to do with "The Hound of the Baskervilles"? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hound_of_the_Baskervilles). A quick Google search redirected to "Baskervill" which is a place/ business, but showing results for "Baskervil" shows mainly dog related images/pages. So (unless the name is unimportant/ a reference to something else) my first guess is that its some kind of doggy.
Indeed, a very large dog. They are lethal in the arena and routinely kill bears. They are the size of an English mastiff and have natural skill in bite and dodge. They will kill you if you go up against them with out armor and weapons. I recommend you bring mastiffs with you on embark they have the same stats and
Post by: WillowLuman on November 23, 2013, 07:58:42 pm
EDIT: Also since when do we have Bears?
Post by: Vgray on November 23, 2013, 08:02:35 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 23, 2013, 08:37:58 pm
Hello gentlemen. I've just made talking bears!Does this answer the question?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on November 23, 2013, 09:47:07 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on November 23, 2013, 10:13:38 pm
Though all of these seem a bit small to me, personally. Polar bears are pretty huge, though. 400,000.
Post by: Gnorm on November 24, 2013, 07:59:20 pm
Spoiler: Creature File (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Add to body_gnorm (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Add to b_detail_plan_gnorm (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Add to material_template_organic_gnorm (click to show/hide)
Post by: HissinhWalnuts on November 25, 2013, 03:14:52 pm
Post by: Halfling on November 26, 2013, 04:11:50 pm
Anyway, thanks for your contribution kopout, it is now at long last in the first post. Would be great if you listed all the new things at some point. Gnorm's yarn will go there as well, as well as that delicious quote.
Xieg - feeling like modding? :)
Post by: Cain12 on November 27, 2013, 03:28:50 am
This can cause infinite loops and produces incendiary lemons.Well when life gives you lemons, use them to burn life's house down. (maybe not the best reference, don't have time to think up a good one.)
Post by: vyznev on November 27, 2013, 01:02:52 pm
I have realized that I never made any megabeasts during my turn. To combat this issue, I churned the following raws out. I request that whoever makes the next release include them.
I put these on a WIP branch on GitHub (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/commit/f262e218afd43f52347cf21f1eb2fc1f090bef78). I can merge them into the next official bugfix if you OK it, kopout. In the mean time, here's a zip file of Gnorm's turn's raws with the megabeasts added (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/archive/wip-gnorm-megabeasts.zip).
Edit: Also, I just realized that I'll be next up after Xieg. Guess I'd better start planning what I'm going to do. I have a few ideas for harmless silly fauna, and maybe one demon/megabeast, but other than that I'm not too sure. Is there something we're acutely missing that should be added? Any biomes that feel too sparse?
Or how about some infectious diseases? I think I might have an idea on how to make a fairly realistic seasonal flu, although it's gonna take a lot of testing...
(Oh, wait, I think I said I'd try to rewrite the in-game help files if no-one else does it. That's a whole bunch of stuff to do right there.)
Also, nobody's claimed a modding turn after mine, yet. What are we going to do if nobody signs up before my turn ends? Start claiming second turns, or maybe just take a break and focus on playtesting and bugfixes for a while?
Post by: WillowLuman on November 27, 2013, 01:35:04 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 27, 2013, 07:12:10 pm
Also, nobody's claimed a modding turn after mine, yet. What are we going to do if nobody signs up before my turn ends? Start claiming second turns, or maybe just take a break and focus on playtesting and bugfixes for a while?I like the idea of us having second turns, though I also believe that more time needs to be taken for playtests. I think that this thread should, at one point, host a true succession fortress that we could participate in. That would hopefully attract interest in addition to simply being fun.
Post by: Gnorm on November 27, 2013, 08:06:04 pm
11th Galena, 501
The baskervill wandered too close to our settlement, and I for one thought that we were done for. Mayor Cavernhero, however, was not prepared to let her town fall to some dog. She threw a rock right at its leg, a crack was heard, and the beast fell comatose. The mayor then ran to our supplies, grabbed an enormous cudgel, and began to beat the dog's head until its brain was sludge.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2s6118z.png)
Perhaps a halfling can manage himself against the beasts of this world.
19th Limestone, 501
More migrants came today to our happy home. Their story is that they were a search party sent by the halfling towns to find us. Quite flattering, but the fools did not bring enough supplies to allow for a return voyage, so we're still stuck here for now. One of them brought a pet terrier, which might be useful against the wildlife when it grows older. For the sake of proper management, I have updated our denizen roster.
(http://i42.tinypic.com/20utvu1.png)
Post by: WillowLuman on November 27, 2013, 08:16:24 pm
Post by: Gnorm on November 28, 2013, 12:39:36 am
Post by: Gnorm on November 29, 2013, 05:14:22 pm
27th Sandstone, 501
All of the lakes and rivers have frozen solid. The cistern beneath our well seems unaffected for now, but that won't last forever. If this frozen period lasts long and we do not obtain any drink, we'll be in deep trouble.
12 Timber, 501
(http://i39.tinypic.com/a12ukz.png)
(http://i40.tinypic.com/20zqik5.png)
Providence has smiled upon us for our work! Two trade caravans, one from our home civilization and one from a Forested civilization have arrived at our settlement today. I've already begun to pack up my things, it will be quite nice to get out of these woods and back home to my small cottage. Wave has requested to trade with the caravns before we leave; I suppose she wants to make use of her bartering skills one last time.
1st Moonstone, 501
Trade has concluded with both caravans, and we were able to obtain some trivial items in exchange for the pipes and fiddles we had been making out of sheer boredom. Neither caravan had very much to offer, unfortunately, but that doesn't matter now. What matters is that we have a way home now, especially as the snow begins to fall on our buildings.
11th Moonstone, 501
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2lnfu34.png)
We have been betrayed! This morning, both of the caravans left the trade depot and headed away from our the town. We all shouted for them, begged for them to take us with them. The simply continued, headed farther and farther away. I noticed that one of them had stayed behind, the one that was calling himself "Calm Boundpsyche." He seems to be a trained hunter, and was definitely their leader. I rushed up to him, grabbed him by the collar, and demanded to know what was going on. He grinned insidiously, and told me that this site was too rich in raw materials to be abandoned. The bastards are going to leave us here to freeze based on the prospect of azurine smoking pipes! I punched him right in the chest, but the mayor grabbed me before I could do anything more. I that she'll have the diplomacy necessary to sort out this situation, or we'll all die here.
19th Moonstone, 501
Calm Boundpsyche exited from our town hall today, and rushed into the wilderness beyond. The mayor slowly left her office immediately after; she looked completely forlorn and walked slowly up to me, clutching a piece of paper tighly in her palm. When I saw the paper, I saw the reason for her mood.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2qsbclc.png)
Post by: Gnorm on December 01, 2013, 05:23:23 pm
3rd Granite, 502
Our settlement has been so busy lately that I found myself unable to find time to write until now. Our outpost is just over one year old, and we are still working on obtaining proper lodgings for everyone. Our livestock pens are beginning to run out of grass in this winter, and we were forced to place two animals in one pen; I hope that our decision does not lead to fighting. Meanwhile, our mechanics have cleverly placed cage traps in the south-western area of this site, and we have managed to capture almost an entire herd of panserblecks. These animals will, once trained, make excellent weapons against the baskervills.
On the subject of military, a small militia has been put together to properly keep those beasts at bay. We have built a range for the soldiers to practice at, though they do not seem to be willing to use it. For this reason, we have had them train against live targets in the area, and they actually managed to take down another baskervill. Perhaps the bones of these animals shall be of some use to us.
Below I have, as best as I could, attempted to depict our village in its current state:
(http://i41.tinypic.com/24exjrq.png)
Post by: darkpaladin109 on December 03, 2013, 08:43:58 am
Post by: Person on December 03, 2013, 09:54:30 am
Are there any races that somehow produce metals not found elsewhere, but the playable race can melt them down for the ingots?Not sure if this was answered, but I'm pretty sure the roundabout way of doing this is to give the race (and only that race) a reaction to make the metal bars from something else. It probably doesn't matter for now since civs technically have infinite resources, but it'll like matter after the next release. Everyone else will just smelt their gear down to bars as normal and forge it however they do so.
Post by: Gnorm on December 04, 2013, 12:09:31 am
I started playing adventure mode with this and I have one question to ask. Would it be okay to post screenshots of my charachter dying horribly in adv. mode?I think that such an action would be quite encouraged.
Post by: darkpaladin109 on December 04, 2013, 09:10:52 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I think the only bug I found was the zombies that ambushed me.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 04, 2013, 03:15:11 pm
Sound good?
Post by: HissinhWalnuts on December 04, 2013, 03:31:32 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 04, 2013, 03:34:41 pm
I wonder if I could maybe ad something to this; if so, my current idea is a type of Evil Bread, using a syndrome with a 50% chance of reviving (syndromes can revive creatures, right? Or is that some type of dust?) the Bread and a 50% chance of turning the Evil Bread corpse into bread, a prepared meal. The pref would be "pathetic screaming" and I think I might be able to add a speak function to allow the creatures to say "Grains...Graiiins!...GRAIIINS!!!"
Sound good?
Just so I'm clear on what you're asking for, as I think I may have read that wrong, but you want the bread to be a creature found in the wild, not made by players, correct?
You can't resurrect or animate a creature with a syndrome, that's an interaction you're thinking of. I don't believe it is possible to set a chance for animation, it will always happen. But I may be wrong. As a work-around you could give it two interactions, one to raise dead loaves of bread and another to turn the bread into a creature that dies and leaves behind bread.
It should certainly be possible to create, though.
Post by: Putnam on December 04, 2013, 04:54:31 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on December 04, 2013, 06:14:34 pm
That's a lot of Panserblekks :o
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 05, 2013, 07:01:03 am
Post by: Cain12 on December 05, 2013, 10:48:01 am
From the first post. So post it, say where it goes plus any notes, and leave it to the modder to decide if they want it. Evil bread huh, neat if a little strange, would probably remove it from any version I download tbh.Spoiler: Contribution advice (click to show/hide)
Post by: Gnorm on December 06, 2013, 11:57:47 pm
5th Felsite, 502
Our small hamlet has actually managed to achieve some minor accomplishments this year. The water has all thawed out, so our fishermen can now continue to provide for our needs. Our production of goods has increased, and our militia continues to train beneath the earth in the small barracks. The cellar has been expanded, and now includes another room that leads into an entirely different section for storage. Soon, we wont have to leave our valuables strewn across the ground.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2czvoko.png)
More houses are being constructed for our residents. Paved roadway will soon be placed to better connect our town, though I believe we will start with dirt ones, simply to map out their path.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/29mq0s6.png)
Finally, a large number of migrating halflings came across the river and into the hamlet recently. They are mostly artisans, farmers, and animal workers. They refuse to disclose any of their intentions, but I suspect that they were sent by the Trade Guild to increase our production level. We now have forty-three mouths to feed.
(http://i43.tinypic.com/59px5.png)
Post by: kero42 on December 07, 2013, 12:56:27 pm
While I'm here; Does DF from Scrath have any Good or Evil area specific animals? I'm more curious about good regions to be honest.
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 07, 2013, 02:20:32 pm
Lol, poor little halflings, I'm sure they'll be providing the caravans with many-a-good.
While I'm here; Does DF from Scrath have any Good or Evil area specific animals? I'm more curious about good regions to be honest.
Looking at Github, there's only one evil creature, which are black angels. There are also wisps of rage, but those are vermin. I haven't seen any good creatures, but cognac grapes are the only good plant. No evil plants though.
It seems that there's only one interaction that's for both good and evil areas, which is just fog.
E: I accidentally a word, but I fix'd it.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 07, 2013, 02:32:21 pm
Post by: Gnorm on December 07, 2013, 03:27:40 pm
While I'm here; Does DF from Scrath have any Good or Evil area specific animals? I'm more curious about good regions to be honest.I'm currently working on a few types of good creatures, including goats, pussycats, and birds.
On another note, if anyone has any suggestions for my fort, feel free to post them. I feel it helps to have a definite goal.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 07, 2013, 03:37:37 pm
Post by: Cain12 on December 07, 2013, 04:26:06 pm
Maybe be a tad dull/silly or unimaginative.
Post by: kero42 on December 07, 2013, 05:10:11 pm
Are Wisps of Rage edible? Another Formic likes to eat them, but I assumed it wasn't possible because they're vermin. Others include a preference for consuming vigors, and oculentibus tears. I assume those are intentional, but I do wonder about the poison thing.
PS: How good is zirecon for weapons/tools? It's rather cheap, so I assume It's not very good for those things, but I figured it safer to ask.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 07, 2013, 08:41:58 pm
I find it pretty funny that you asked that, since Zirecon came from a suggestion to include baseline metals to give people a point of comparison to. We got copper from the resulting raws, but also this additional fantasy metal.
Post by: Gnorm on December 07, 2013, 11:33:42 pm
24th Felsite, 502
Caravans from the Forested civilization and the Trade Guild recently arrived at our depot, and we were able to trade our burdle shell crafts and our azurine pipes for various odds-and-ends. We obtained some exotic wood, vokda, food, clothing, and an aphidida from our fellow halflings, and a bit of clay from the treelords. Currently, their representative is speaking with the mayor to work out the next trade agreement, and our workers are chruning out more goods for the next merchants. Until we have the strength to properly resist, we shall have to give into the demands of the Guild.
22nd Galena, 502
(http://i39.tinypic.com/igxcba.png)
The terrible beast known as Hill arrived almost one week ago. Despite the great legends associated with its kind, the monster fell easily to our archers. The only casualty was a single baby, who will be interred in a glass coffin and will have a proper slab to memorialize its death.
(http://i41.tinypic.com/ntbvc.png)
Meanwhile, the mayor has created a mighty cape made of leather. I suspect that she will wear it with pride as she hunts for our meat.
9th Sandstone, 502
The past few months have been so busy that it is only now that I have had time to write of our developments. We have had two more migrant waves; no doubt the Guild took note of our increased production and sent more workers to boost work level even higher.
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2942lu1.png)
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2s85huc.png)
The first group of houses is complete. With the amount of new halflings that are coming in, many more will need to be constructed soon.
(http://i39.tinypic.com/2ywg51l.png)
Azurine hives have been built so that we can make use of the myomorphs that roam the area. I hope that their products are of use to us.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/dz9tw2.png)
A powered mill has been constructed with four wind-turbines powering it. The millers no longer have an excuse to laze about.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2a9pgds.png)
Finally, the lizardfolk have figured out the location of this village and have already sent four thieves to snatch our children. Needless to say, they were slaughtered, though we must increase our defenses if we wish to survive against the more hostile members of this world.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 07, 2013, 11:38:38 pm
Also YAY! Burdle shells are working properly
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on December 08, 2013, 08:24:04 am
Also, I discovered some kind of bug:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Cain12 on December 08, 2013, 11:54:44 am
Seeing as it is the only artifact in the whole world, I find it fitting that my goal be to retrieve this holy relic. However, I have a few questions first (just in case their are any difference from vanilla I need to know of):
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on December 08, 2013, 02:11:29 pm
Post by: Gnorm on December 08, 2013, 02:46:45 pm
1: For whatever reason, it seems that almost all of the zombies are trolls. I am looking into this matter at the moment, but for now you'll need either (a.) extreme sneaking abilities or (b.) pure brute strength.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
2. The trolls are the largest clothes-wearing creatures in the game, I believe, so their zombies are going to be well protected against most races. I would recommend a troll, as will be a better match against the zombies. The daemonic cherubim would be a second choice, but (if I modded correctly) they are immune to the powers of the slabs, thus the victory would be pyrrhic. Also note that the death gods will also grant the powers of the Dead directly to those who defile their temples, so there may be several towers in the world, with only one actual slab.
3. Simply have novice reading level and be a non-angelic creature, and you'll be able to reap your rewards.
Another thing to note is that there are actually two types of zombies, though as of now, the second type does not do much.
Post by: Cain12 on December 08, 2013, 05:55:43 pm
The guy who has the slab, he found it in 31 and at some point became a warlord of a bandit gang, then went on to do a whole lot of nothing for 94 years. There are a few others like him, if by some miracle I succeed, I will have to pay them a visit. Thanks for the advice.
Post by: MDFification on December 08, 2013, 07:32:01 pm
1: For whatever reason, it seems that almost all of the zombies are trolls. I am looking into this matter at the moment, but for now you'll need either (a.) extreme sneaking abilities or (b.) pure brute strength.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
2. The trolls are the largest clothes-wearing creatures in the game, I believe, so their zombies are going to be well protected against most races. I would recommend a troll, as will be a better match against the zombies. The daemonic cherubim would be a second choice, but (if I modded correctly) they are immune to the powers of the slabs, thus the victory would be pyrrhic. Also note that the death gods will also grant the powers of the Dead directly to those who defile their temples, so there may be several towers in the world, with only one actual slab.
3. Simply have novice reading level and be a non-angelic creature, and you'll be able to reap your rewards.
Another thing to note is that there are actually two types of zombies, though as of now, the second type does not do much.
The trolls being the most prominent zombies might have something to do with other entities lacking the [UNDEAD_CANDIDATE] tag. Nobody really knows what that does, only that it might generate animate corpses from that entity's race in necro towers and underground fortresses. It might also simply have something to do with math; troll corpses being harder to kill, more of them will survive worldgen than any other type of corpse.
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on December 08, 2013, 10:45:10 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on December 09, 2013, 01:17:31 pm
PANSERBLEKK STEED TIME
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 10, 2013, 11:15:13 am
Incidentally, I've come up with some nice syndrome- and reaction-based systems, plus some weirder creatures. Does giving a creature both the [FEMALE] and [MALE] tags allow it to spawn units on it's own?
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on December 10, 2013, 02:20:32 pm
Post by: Gnorm on December 12, 2013, 09:06:39 pm
With the people who created DFFS, I'd like to use and edit it for my own project.I can't exactly speak for everyone, but I don't believe that would be a problem. Just don't pass other people's work off as your own.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 12, 2013, 11:09:07 pm
Post by: MDFification on December 12, 2013, 11:36:00 pm
If nobody minds, I have a few ideas you could incorporate into the mod:
-Peat as a soil type.
-Bog Iron as a cluster stone found in peat.
-The ability to make anvils out of stone (done historically)
-Cooking blood into sausages/blood pudding (also done worldwide)
-Cremating bodies
-Grinding bones into bonemeal (for consumption or to be mixed with ash to make fertilizer?)
-Scale Mail (similar in function to chain mail shirts, but only covers the area of a breastplate)
-Trilobites (aquatic bug-vermin)
Maybe I'll sign up later when I've got less on my plate.
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 12, 2013, 11:52:05 pm
The rest of it sounds good, though.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 13, 2013, 12:29:01 am
I like the other ideas a lot. This game badly needs iron and steel.
Post by: MDFification on December 13, 2013, 10:07:54 am
We've already got trilobites, and amonites, I think.
I like the other ideas a lot. This game badly needs iron and steel.
Glad to be of service :D although you'll probably want to add some sort of metal veins for balance purposes, peat isn't found everywhere.
Post by: HissinhWalnuts on December 17, 2013, 05:16:43 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on December 17, 2013, 07:44:21 pm
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on December 20, 2013, 09:11:18 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 20, 2013, 09:40:41 pm
Does anyone know if it is possible to have a workshop reaction that changes the creature performing it into a different creature? Like some sort of shape shifting chamber. :)
Just create a material that boils at low temperatures but has a fixed temperature that is higher than the boiling point, then have it carry a syndrome that turns anything caught in the gas into a different creature. The reaction should create a boulder of the syndrome material, and it should immediately boil into a cloud that will affect everything that touches/inhales it, depending on how the syndrome is set to transfer.
In case you need it, here's a link to syndrome tokens. (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Syndrome)
What types of transformations were you thinking of doing, if you don't mind me asking?
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on December 20, 2013, 10:48:14 pm
Also, would this syndrome material be stuck to the new creature and anything that it touches becomes the desired creature?
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 20, 2013, 11:06:12 pm
Thanks for your help! I wanted to have an advanced race that has a workshop to turn themselves into cyborg soldiers, and I might have more ideas in the future.
Also, would this syndrome material be stuck to the new creature and anything that it touches becomes the desired creature?
I don't believe smoke created by boiling materials will leave residue. Though melting materials will leave puddles. Also, creatures who are currently transformed will be immune to other transformation syndromes until the first transformation wears off, since syndrome effects don't stack.
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on December 20, 2013, 11:16:35 pm
Do you know if it is possible to have a c_variation that throws a boiling material, like a gas bomb?
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 20, 2013, 11:30:46 pm
Anyways, valid material emission types can be found on the syndrome page on the wiki, at the very bottom. They are under the header Breath Attack Types. (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Syndrome#Breath_Attack_Types)
Post by: Zorg Master Xyon on December 21, 2013, 12:45:14 am
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 21, 2013, 12:51:28 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on December 21, 2013, 02:53:56 am
Post by: WillowLuman on December 21, 2013, 03:03:51 am
Post by: Putnam on December 21, 2013, 03:38:15 am
Now that's an interesting idea: a material that when made into clothing, armor or jewelry causes those wearing said clothing to transform by touching it. Seven league boots, cloaks of flight or invisibility, thinking caps... magic of a sort. Also blessed/cursed items and wizard's staffs/wands...
That requires DFHack
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 21, 2013, 08:28:46 am
EDIT: Here's my start on the bodyplan raws for another creature I'm making for this mod, my signature megabeast:
Code: [Select]
[BODY:ROLLSPAWN]
[BP:RB:right body:right bodies][UPPERBODY][HEAD][STANCE][CATEGORY:BODY_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:LB:left body:left bodies][CON:CAL1][CON:CAL2][CON:CAL3][CON:CAL4][CON:CAL5][CON:CAL6][CON:CAL7][LOWERBODY][HEAD][STANCE][CATEGORY:BODY_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:1000]
[BP:CAL1:first left crossarm:STP][CON:CAJ1][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAR1:first right crossarm:STP][CON:RB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAJ1:joint of first crossarm:STP][CON:CAR1][GRASP][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:CAL2:second left crossarm:STP][CON:CAJ2][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAR2:second right crossarm:STP][CON:RB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAJ2:joint of second crossarm:STP][CON:CAR2][GRASP][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:CAL3:third left crossarm:STP][CON:CAJ3][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAR3:third right crossarm:STP][CON:RB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAJ3:joint of third crossarm:STP][CON:CAR3][GRASP][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:CAL4:fourth left crossarm:STP][CON:CAJ4][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAR4:fourth right crossarm:STP][CON:RB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAJ4:joint of fourth crossarm:STP][CON:CAR4][GRASP][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:CAL5:fifth left crossarm:STP][CON:CAJ5][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAR5:fifth right crossarm:STP][CON:RB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAJ5:joint of fifth crossarm:STP][CON:CAR5][GRASP][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:CAL6:sixth left crossarm:STP][CON:CAJ6][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAR6:sixth right crossarm:STP][CON:RB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAJ6:joint of sixth crossarm:STP][CON:CAR6][GRASP][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]
[BP:CAL7:seventh left crossarm:STP][CON:CAJ7][LIMB][LEFT][CATEGORY:ARM_UPPER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAR7:seventh right crossarm:STP][CON:RB][LIMB][RIGHT][CATEGORY:ARM_LOWER]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:150]
[BP:CAJ7:joint of seventh crossarm:STP][CON:CAR7][GRASP][CATEGORY:HAND]
[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:50]I'm still planning to add four tentacles, two per body, consisting out of six segments each, with the last three segments of tentacle having the [GRASP] tag. Apart from rearranging the code so the ones that others connect to come first, does anyone see any errors in this so far?
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on December 21, 2013, 07:55:11 pm
Post by: Gnorm on December 21, 2013, 09:29:40 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 22, 2013, 04:37:55 am
You'll need to use interactions, not reactions.My mistake, then. Gnorm, if necessary, I'd be willing to implement some more creations as a full modding turn, and test for bugs while I'm at it. All I ask is to be allowed to implement some of my more insane creature designs.
EDIT: I'm having a bit of trouble getting the mod to work. Where should I put the download's files? There's a part marked "raws", which should probably go where the normal raws for the game go, but when it comes such things as "data", "data_src" and "utils" I have no clue what I should do.
EDIT2: The finished body plan raws for my megabeast:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: vyznev on December 22, 2013, 12:35:40 pm
The last update to this mod occurred over one month ago. I think someone should call up vyznev and see if he'd be willing to do some modding.
Who dares speak my name... er, I mean, yes? :D
I'd been kind of wondering if Xieg was taking a turn or not, and if not, whether that meant it was my turn now. I didn't ask because I've also been kind of busy with real work, and I was afraid the answer would be yes. ;D I don't really have much else to do over the holidays, though, so I wouldn't mind starting my turn now if there's no-one else actively modding.
Post by: vyznev on December 22, 2013, 12:45:51 pm
EDIT: I'm having a bit of trouble getting the mod to work. Where should I put the download's files? There's a part marked "raws", which should probably go where the normal raws for the game go, but when it comes such things as "data", "data_src" and "utils" I have no clue what I should do.
Here's the instructions. (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki#how-to-play) Should probably stick those directly in the .zip file, maybe in the README file that's already there.
Anyway, to make it brief: replace the DF "raws" folder with the one from the mod, and copy the "data" folder over DF's "data" folder to get the new speech files and announcements. The rest of the stuff isn't needed for playing or basic modding, although you'll need the "data_src" folder and the "utils/text_to_data.pl" script if you want to mod the announcement or help files.
Oh, and you'll have to wait for Halfling to make it official, but I certainly can't see any reason why you shouldn't have a modding turn. Welcome! :D
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 22, 2013, 07:30:18 pm
EDIT: After the last update, I realized my raws were missing most of the rollspawn's internal organs, so I added them.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: vyznev on December 23, 2013, 07:40:45 am
Okay, new problem. Why do all the raws have the phrase "$ID: randommishmashofnumbersandletters $" at the top? And if it's actually used for something, what mishmash should I use for my files?
My fault again:
Also, to make future merges easier, I decided to turn on a special Git feature (http://git-scm.com/book/ch7-2.html#Keyword-Expansion) that automatically expands the tag "$Id$" in files to something like "$Id: 774df473ada032118d3e66ca91fe87a834cf4195 $", where the random hex string changes every time the file is changed in Git. (In case you're curious, the hex string is the SHA-1 hash of the file contents, excluding the hex string itself.) This means that, if you download a tagged file from GitHub and edit it, I can (fairly) easily tell which revision of the file on GitHub it came from, which in turn makes it less likely that it accidentally gets reverted to an older version in a merge. It's currently enabled only for .txt files in the raw/objects folder, and I added such a tag to all of them.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 23, 2013, 07:50:02 am
Post by: vyznev on December 23, 2013, 10:10:49 am
I'm guessing this means all I have to do is download Git and activate that function, but please tell me if I'm in error here. Anyway, so far work on my other, non-megabeast creatures is progressing well.
Ah, no, sorry, you don't have to do anything (although you might want to give Git a try (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch/wiki/Dfscratch-and-Git#setting-up-git-with-dfscratch) anyway; it's pretty neat once you get the hang of it). Just try to leave the $Id$ strings in existing files alone if you're not using Git, so that it's easier to tell which version of the raws in Git they're based on.
Post by: Putnam on December 23, 2013, 11:03:56 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 24, 2013, 07:49:05 am
Post by: Mesa on December 24, 2013, 08:26:03 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 24, 2013, 10:00:57 am
Post by: vyznev on December 24, 2013, 11:12:47 am
It's under the filename, so it won't break the raws.
Besides, I noticed a while ago that we already have several raw files with first lines that don't match the file name, and DF seems to accept them just fine. IIRC, the only special treatment I could observe when I tested it was that any [tags] on the first line would be ignored by DF. (I don't think I tested what happens if two files have the same first line, though; it might serve as some kind of de-duplication mechanism.)
Post by: Knight Otu on December 24, 2013, 05:52:07 pm
Post by: Putnam on December 25, 2013, 05:05:11 am
Seeing as Toady is mostly working on the programming and not on the actual creatures, I think that at most we'll just get a few more tags to play around with.
The movement overhaul means that all creatures will need to be fixed to accommodate for the gaits. Similarly, values will need to be added to civilizations and maybe some personality traits added.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 25, 2013, 02:07:15 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 25, 2013, 02:22:02 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Also, won't the current connections of the crossarms cause the corresponding joint and right part of the crossarm to fall off if the left part is severed?Too bad this was never answered. I'm going to ask it again:
Won't the current connections of the crossarms cause the corresponding joint and right part of the crossarm to fall off if the left part is severed?
In other news, I'm trying to add a bodypart to the Evil Bread which is hard to hit and is the only part which will actually kill it if it is hit. I don't want it to be specifically attackable, though, so I'll have to add [SMALL], correct?
My creature file for the rollspawn so far:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Quote
//The attack rollfordamage will be replaced with candointeraction rollfordamage later, to allow it to attack using all the weapons it can hold in it's seven arms.Is it possible to get a creature to attack with multiple weapons at once? If not, how should I set it up so it will use a single attack several times in a row, once for each weapon?
Otherwise, are there any suggestions or thoughts?
EDIT: Why have some of my raws suddenly jumped sideways?
Post by: Nahere on December 25, 2013, 05:14:55 pm
Quote
Why have some of my raws suddenly jumped sideways?Because RIGHT and LEFT tokens are parsed by the forums as BBCode. Put your raws in code tags next time.
Code: [Select]
Like so.
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 02:21:32 am
How did you all get this to work in the beginning? What did you do to vanilla dwarf fortress to stop it from totally screwing up? Just been wanting to do something like this for myself for awhile.
Anyway, at some point in the future I do intend to contribute to this if i can ever get my schedule straightened out. I have some interesting ideas.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 26, 2013, 08:01:57 am
After all, this world has also seen insects that bleed molten glass and caravans that explode because of coal.
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 08:32:51 am
I just got to the Shadow creature point in the thread.
By the way, do we have any semi normal benign creatures yet?
If not, if I get the chance, I'll take a halfdecent crack at it.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 26, 2013, 08:55:42 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 09:07:00 am
Not that buggy is bad.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 26, 2013, 09:11:24 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 09:15:19 am
Lotta insects that I've seen so far. Though only read to page 41 so far... so.
Currently I am on a phone that believes itself to be 'smart'
Typing on it is a pain.
Gimme a bit to type everything out please.
Edit: Knowing my luck things have already been made to fit my ideas...
Are there any things that still happen to need to be made?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 26, 2013, 09:49:10 am
On the other hand, we don't have anywhere near enough plants or rock types.
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 10:01:26 am
And mammal fits in well with what i have in mind.
And i would like to work in some additions to the tundra. Including a civilization if my failed modding turns out that well...
Edit: Considering I am on my phone, I cant open the mod files currently. If there isnt a too many, could someone summarize what rock types or plant types we currently have so that i could briefly sketch out my ideas for new ones?
That is, if its not to much trouble.
I dont wanna be a burden on anyone.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 26, 2013, 11:18:12 am
EDIT: Does anyone know what the "identifiers" the wiki mentions you need for the [ADD_TISSUE:IDENTIFIER:TISSUETEMPLATE] bit of the body detail raws? They're just the names of the body parts in the simple body plan raws, right?
Post by: WillowLuman on December 26, 2013, 02:48:14 pm
So far I believe the only animal-related fields we haven't satured to ridiculous levels are mammals, sponges, sea anemones and jellyfish.
On the other hand, we don't have anywhere near enough plants or rock types.
We've got:
Mammals (halflings, dogs, maneaters, dirigible antelope)
Birds (Ducks, tits, wholly aquatic birds)
Reptiles (Many many dragon varieties, lizard folks)
Insects/Arachnids (including 2 civs)
Cephalopods (on land and in sea)
Several supernatural beings
AFAIK, we don't have any fish or amphibians. We have several creatures that can be caught by a fishing rod, but not gilled scaly finned things that drown on land.
We could certainly use more flora diversity, as well as soil types.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 26, 2013, 03:50:25 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 05:08:27 pm
I'll come up with some fish and amphibians, maybe expand the reptiles a little past being draconian. And plants
I am pretty inexperienced though, so I might need some help with some problems.
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 05:32:53 pm
I'll tell you my civilization/race idea but its probably the very last idea I'll work on.
They will be a pretty primitive race.
There will be two different castes. A medium sized humanoid capable of doing work/hauling etc. with little strength, speed or other military prowess.
The second caste will be a four legged savage creature capable of being quite deadly in packs.
They will be designed to live in tundras, growing plants designed specifically for the cold and hopefully having a reaction to convert ice into an edible form.
They will be covered in an outer layer of 'fur' that is actually a layer of frost that melts in warm climates, leaving them more vulnerable to enemy attack.
I want to add a game animal, some kind of large deer or such, if i can.
It may be awhile before i start working on this, because of life issues.
I have other ideas if you'd like to hear them?
Post by: WillowLuman on December 26, 2013, 05:54:28 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 06:10:02 pm
If I am going to be a god, I'm going to be a crazy... er... creative one!
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 26, 2013, 06:10:29 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 06:15:07 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 26, 2013, 10:16:19 pm
My ideas will be mostly centered around amphibians, plants and fish. And making the tundra more interesting. Sound good to everyone?
First off,
The Dotorian. It has a life cycle like a frog, living in one place one way before growing into another. It starts out as a little more than a living helium balloon, just floating along in clouds of dozens of others. They are easy punctured, and have a habit of reaching full growth over land, resulting in a huge splatter of blood. To counter act this they are born in huge litters of 12-30. Upon reaching adult hood they plop down into the ocean as a huge benign starfish. If a limb is detached it will regenerate into a new Dotorian. This makes up for how fragile they and their offspring are. As adults they have an inner sac of digestive acid that they spray liberally on threats. Butchering them is very worthwhile however, and their ability to breath air makes them great guards against the deadly creatures of the world.
Next we have the lumbering beast that is the Collosal. For every three moves of a halfling these creatures take two. Its a whale sized arthropod covered in armor plating that curls up into a ball when attacked, despite its ability to knock holes into most other creatures. Will a medium beaching rate you will be sure to find atleast one of these curled up on a beach in your lifetime.
Stonefish, one of the most useless creatures on your custom generated planet. Its little more than a tender pink inside covered in a hard shell. You might be able to crack it, but doing so isnt worth the effort to get to the substandard meat.
Onto plants, does anyone know if its possible to make a plant only grow on bloody soil? I had an idea for red-weed.
Edit: Okay, so most of the Dotorian wont work. I was a bit misinformed... Hmm
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 27, 2013, 02:02:06 am
Onto plants, does anyone know if its possible to make a plant only grow on bloody soil? I had an idea for red-weed.
You can't make plants grow on specific soil types, or on specific contaminants. You have some control (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Plant_token#Environment_Tokens) over where a plant may grow, but not to that degree.
Also, if I'm reading it right, you want the dotorian to change body features and biomes as it ages? If so, I'm afraid that is not possible. Children are physically the same as an adult of the same caste, only they are usually smaller and are unable to work or be trained for hunting or war. Additionally, biomes cannot be given to specific castes, they affect the whole creature.
The only workaround I can think of would be with multiple creatures and some interactions to change between them.
Your other two creatures seem good though.
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 02:34:39 am
What i had planned was its larva form existing as basically a balloon before relanding where it should at adulthood.
Hmm, is there a way to either change castes or have a creature spawn another creature through a reaction?
Something tells me no, but as I my knowledge seems to be flawed I will let someone elses knowledge help me.
Edit: Couldn't I give them an interaction to make them convert their severed limbs into their 'larval' stage, and then give those creatures an interaction to convert themselves into their 'adult' form?
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 27, 2013, 03:03:06 am
Hmm, is there a way to either change castes or have a creature spawn another creature through a reaction?
Spawning a creature through a reaction requires DFHack. I think you are thinking of an interaction, in which case yes you can create creatures, although it is only in the roundabout way you edited in. At least, to my knowledge. There may be other ways that I'm unaware of.
Quote
Edit: Couldn't I give them an interaction to make them convert their severed limbs into their 'larval' stage, and then give those creatures an interaction to convert themselves into their 'adult' form?
This will work, you just need to make sure you take care when resurrecting the limb. It's a bit tricky only because there is animation and there is resurrection. Animation makes zombies that are hostile towards anything that lives, while resurrection brings the creature back to life. Animation works almost any body part, while resurrection is limited to the head and the upper body, to my knowledge.
Though you should set the initial transformation to end once they are old enough to reach adulthood instead, since only one transformation can be active at a time, so the larva would not be able to change itself back to normal.
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 03:15:29 am
Edit: As in, if I transformed my 'Adult' Dotorians(I shall refer to them as Stage 1) to 'Larval' Dotorians(Stage 2) could the stage 2 breed?
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 03:29:10 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 03:34:25 am
Stage 1 can not breed. Stage 2 can.
Stage 1 has a interaction that changes the entire creature(not just a limb) into a Stage 2 creature. It breeds then the interaction wears off changing it back into Stage 1. Stage 2 creatures have an interaction that changes them to Stage 1 where they have a chance to lose a limb or two, then it wears off and they change back.
This way natural Stage 1 and Stage 2 Dotorians can switch back and forth with out worrying about not being able to transform while already transformed.
Thoughts?
Edit: So you basically have two breeding forms that switch between the two forms.
One breeds through limb loss, the other through actual reproductive processes.
This is a very complicated sea animal...
Its also very derivative of a few other things that hopefully work the way i think they do...
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 03:58:05 am
Phase 2 is a caste of the phase 1 creature, with population ratio of zero. That way, it will always birth the phase 1 creature, and never itself.
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 04:01:54 am
Actually I like the implications of that...
Edit: I will have stage 1 be reproductive as originally intended and have the transformation never wear off, making it an 'adult' phase.
Now to get to a computer and put together this crazy setup.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 04:32:41 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 04:41:17 am
I highly recommend doing it as castes, with the reproductive not able to be born. Seperate species requires too many unreliable syndromes.Sorry, I wasnt clear what I meant. I am going to use castes, but stage 1 is going to be reproductive.
Stage 1 is the large adult sea creatures
Stage 2 is the flying small versions.
Stage 2 is born, and they then permanently become Stage 1 after a certain period of growth through use of an interaction.
Post by: Putnam on December 27, 2013, 04:42:05 am
How about this:
Phase 2 is a caste of the phase 1 creature, with population ratio of zero. That way, it will always birth the phase 1 creature, and never itself.
POP_RATIO:0==POP_RATIO:100. 0 is an invalid pop_ratio. That's why people use POP_RATIO:1 for this kind of thing.
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 04:53:45 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 27, 2013, 07:18:20 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 06:09:07 pm
Well if it wont work, I'll just have to fix it.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 10:36:38 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 11:00:51 pm
So I have two questions, which probably have highly obvious answers that I cant remember because I'm half awake. Plus this is more complex than I usually mod.
My Collosal are going to curl up when attacked. I know there are creatures in vanilla that do this or something similar, but I can't remember how the hell they do... and I cant remember how they did that.
I cant access my DF computer(this was a great time to lend my laptop to someone) right now.
Two, for my tundra civilzation, how would I go about giving them their meltable outer layer in such a way that it regenerates?
Edit: I could make the creature secrete an easily freezable material all over its body, right?
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 11:01:22 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 11:17:33 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 11:24:56 pm
You can't curl up, per-se, but you can retract into a body part and call it "Curling up"
That works! How would I go about doing that?
Most of my ideas for this arent my typical thing.
By the way, thank you for being so helpful, all of you!
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 11:26:52 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 11:29:23 pm
Thank you.
Sorry if I ask a lot of questions.
Most of what I am usually comfortable with has been over done, so I decided I would try to work some magic with something new.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 11:32:25 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 27, 2013, 11:35:48 pm
Do you think they'll fit well into the general scheme of things?
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 27, 2013, 11:44:50 pm
Code: [Select]
[RETRACT_INTO_BP:BY_CATEGORY:SHELL:roll into a ball:rolls into a ball:unroll:unrolls]For your civilization, you could give them a custom outer tissue made of a material that melts in temperate temperatures. I'm unsure of whether a secretion would work the way you want it to, since it counts as a contaminant on the body, and not as a tissue layer.
An example of a tissue could be:
Code: [Select]
[TISSUE:FROST]
[TISSUE_NAME:frost:frost]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:WATER]
[RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1]
[CONNECTS]
[TISSUE_SHAPE:LAYER]I'm not sure of how well the default water would work as a tissue, however. You may want to use a custom one, since that would give you control over the attributes of the material.
Your ideas are good. The idea of a massive arthropod that roams the ocean is an interesting one.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 27, 2013, 11:51:22 pm
Probably. The collosal sounds pretty interesting, and the baloony thing could be a predator of dirigible antelope.
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 12:05:49 am
And a tad more benign.
The flying creatures(Dotorians) 'adult form' was kinda designed as a way to keep you safe from the evils of this world.
If you can tame them anyway.
The Collosals ability to roll up results in basically a giant, near impenetrable distraction for most predators.
The stonefish is basically a living sea coconut.
Can vampires drink blood from barrels?
Post by: WillowLuman on December 28, 2013, 01:07:44 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 01:19:54 am
I have a few other ideas if you'd like to hear them?
Post by: StLeibowitz on December 28, 2013, 01:54:04 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 02:26:31 am
As a benign herd creatures:
Antlered Ratlike creatures a little under halfing height capable of being sheared and milked.(Could I make the antlers shearable?)
A fish that secrets liquid just over waters boiling temperature.
Add a species of ironwood(that means its extremely hard) tree.
Extra miscellaneous plant species to add variety.
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 02:31:45 am
If no one wants it and I can get to someplace with wifi this week I'll take it.
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 28, 2013, 02:48:09 am
Do we have any shearable creatures at the moment? In any case, yes, it is possible to have shearable horns. Just about anything can be made shearable, really.
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 02:53:00 am
I know we have a plant that poisons us(tarnish root) but are there any plants that can be used to poison the enemy?
Post by: BlackFlyme on December 28, 2013, 03:05:15 am
E: Symptoms of tarnish poisoning include nausea (80% chance), numbness (50% chance), fever (50% chance), and in uncommon instances, coughing up blood (35% chance).
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 03:08:29 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 05:40:32 am
I'm just interested in the maximum temperature a freezing biome can get to, such as a glacier or the tundra.
Edit: Heres a question.
We have a lot of invertebrates and insects, but do we have any thing that technically has 'bone'? Considering the fact that they are primitive beings they will be using a great deal of animal products.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 28, 2013, 12:51:50 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on December 28, 2013, 12:56:36 pm
Wanted to make sure.
I know we have a plant that poisons us(tarnish root) but are there any plants that can be used to poison the enemy?
I added a bunch of alchemical plants in back a while. They can't technically be used to poison the enemy directly, but they can be used to create blocks of incense that, when burned, inflict such delightful syndromes as permanent blindness, spontaneous total exsanguination, and a few other nasty effects. They can also be turned into vigors that let halflings hurl fireballs or petrify foes or such.
Do we have any shearable creatures at the moment? In any case, yes, it is possible to have shearable horns. Just about anything can be made shearable, really.
The bombus can be sheared for its fuzz. I seem to recall slight issues with shearing it actually causing the removal of its exoskeleton on its abdomen, though. Not sure if that was ever fixed, or even found to be repeatable.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 28, 2013, 03:10:04 pm
Edit: Heres a question.
We have a lot of invertebrates and insects, but do we have any thing that technically has 'bone'? Considering the fact that they are primitive beings they will be using a great deal of animal products.
We have dogs (hounds and "baskerviles"), ducks (mallards), dirigible antelope, tigers (maneaters), bird-turtles (burdles, both bones and shells) and other aquatic birds, halflings themselves, dragons, lizard folk, and a few other things I can't quite recall.
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 04:33:10 pm
I shall make good use of that
Post by: MDFification on December 28, 2013, 06:16:39 pm
Seriously, just pick the wiki that's easiest to use and stick with it. Having 3 wikis doesn't seem to be very productive - people don't seem to want to put effort into posting on a wiki that might end up being dumped, and posting on all 3 to make sure their work is useful leads to there being a tie/people not posting at all because it's 3x the effort they originally intended. Although, I'm not speaking from experience.
Also do you folks want centaurs? I have a decent centaur body template if anyone feels the need to use it;
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
If I wasn't in such a hectic time, I'd totes sign up for a modding turn. :(
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 06:24:27 pm
I'm pretty sure it's my modding turn. It hasn't been approved by Halfling though, and if you want just go ahead and upload your finished raws; I'm having a lot of trouble learning how to make the body detail plans, so I'll just add my files to the raws once you've finished your turn, if that's okay.
Well, I can't even start till atleast Tuesday because I lent out my laptop to a friend.
Post by: WillowLuman on December 28, 2013, 10:50:35 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 11:14:07 pm
Well, we already have spider-centaurs.
Just mod in anti-centaurs. Horse torsos on halflings lower bodies.
Actually that sounds a lot like a minotaur...
Post by: WillowLuman on December 28, 2013, 11:16:31 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 28, 2013, 11:25:47 pm
Edit: But we dont have horses yet.
Half dirigible gazelle(or is it antelope?)
Post by: WillowLuman on December 29, 2013, 12:05:28 am
Half-halfling-half-balloony ungulate monster men ftw!
Post by: Urdothor on December 29, 2013, 12:08:51 am
Edit: I think we just invented the deadliest creature in the game...
Post by: Urdothor on December 29, 2013, 03:01:44 am
Though all of them end in death.
Would make this world all the harder.
Maybe thats a bad idea...
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 29, 2013, 08:57:05 am
Post by: Urdothor on December 29, 2013, 05:43:16 pm
Its lower body makes it too heavy to fly, but it can release a syndrome similar to its gas syndrome that makes things fly and go faster for just a few seconds so they rise up then collapse then rise up and collapse.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 29, 2013, 05:54:53 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 29, 2013, 06:05:10 pm
I think that would just result in it flying for a few seconds, then plummeting down like a normal dirigible antelope does when it loses the gas bag. So yeah, go for it.
Thats sorta the point.
Its going to fire its syndrome at its enemies, who then fly... then dont fly.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 29, 2013, 06:52:43 pm
Post by: Urdothor on December 29, 2013, 07:08:49 pm
With hoof punches.
Centalope...?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on December 30, 2013, 08:46:58 am
Centawalk?
Post by: Urdothor on December 30, 2013, 11:12:20 am
Centalope might be best.
Post by: Urdothor on December 30, 2013, 08:44:43 pm
Are there any MAJOR bugs I should know about now so I dont just re-report them?
Post by: Rose on January 01, 2014, 11:53:58 am
Post by: Aseaheru on January 01, 2014, 12:09:38 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 01, 2014, 02:29:53 pm
Just a bit too much halfling.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 03, 2014, 06:17:16 pm
Feel free to use however you want. In other news, I've been working on a small four-legged, four-armed creature with four pairs of wings. I really need to know in which file this is located though:
Speech files:I can't find this anywhere.Code: (speech_hound_hlg.txt) [Select]Woof!
Woof!
Woof!
Woof!
Woof!
Woof! Woof!
Bark!
Bow-wow-wow!
(the hound pants loudly)
Arooooooooooooo!
(the hound whimpers)Code: (speech_tit_hlg.txt) [Select]Chirp!
Tweet! Tweet! Tweet!
Post by: WillowLuman on January 03, 2014, 08:31:22 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 03, 2014, 09:26:19 pm
I really need to know in which file this is located though:Speech filesI can't find this anywhere.
Speech files are located in the speech folder, which is stored in the data folder.
Post by: Urdothor on January 03, 2014, 09:36:54 pm
Couldnt get anything downloaded like I planned...
Unreliable wifi location.
Should be able to get it done once school starts up again.
I really wanna start!
I have everything written out already too...
Edit: So I am trying to replicate the effects of stomach acid on skin... Necrosis and blistering sound about right?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 04, 2014, 08:48:33 am
Except there is no "Regeneration time" for body parts. To grow them back, you need to transform the entire creature then turn them back.I must have confused concerning the way tissue regeneration works. Oh well, most of the idea still works.
Speech files are located in the speech folder, which is stored in the data folder.Thanks for the help!
EDIT: As the Evil Bread are supposed to reanimate/transform into bread only after a while and without help from other members of their species, would using a second, stationary creature (that appears upon the death of the Evil Bread) to apply the appropriate interaction work?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 04, 2014, 02:07:57 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 05, 2014, 12:57:27 am
Wood only staffs can only do so much damage of course, but they make them with metal caps on the end.
Is it possible to have a weapon with two materials?
Such as, if you were to hit them with the end of the staff it would be metal but if you hit them with the middle of the staff it be wood?
Probably asking for a bit too much...
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 05, 2014, 01:15:31 am
So, I'm considering adding long staffs in once I get around to it.
Wood only staffs can only do so much damage of course, but they make them with metal caps on the end.
Is it possible to have a weapon with two materials?
Such as, if you were to hit them with the end of the staff it would be metal but if you hit them with the middle of the staff it be wood?
Probably asking for a bit too much...
Multi-material items aren't possible at the moment.
Wooden weapons are possible if you mark the weapon as a training weapon in its raws, or by creating a custom reaction. But training weapons can only be made of wood, so if you want metal staves as well they will have to be a separate weapon.
Stone weapons are also possible. By marking the weapon with the [CAN_STONE] tag you will be able to make a stone weapon with one weapon-type stone and one piece of wood in the craftsman's workshop. Unlike training weapons, weapons marked with [CAN_STONE] can be still be made of metal as well. In vanilla, the only weapon that can be made of stone is the short sword, and the only stone that can be used to make a weapon is obsidian.
Post by: Urdothor on January 05, 2014, 01:19:38 am
Bah!!!
Full metal staffs aren't realistic...
But close enough.
Just gonna have to fudge the attack values for any attacks using the 'wooden' part of the metal staff
Edit: Plain wood staffs CAN do quite a bit of damage on their own...
Hm... Must research this a bit more.
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 04:07:34 am
There are several instances of nothing in Arena mode. All have black eyes and spikes, as evidenced by the combat logs. I have yet to see any in world gen.
Three quarter of all trolls encounter were blind.
I genned several small worlds with medium civs that contained no formics or halfling civs... ever.
Rygics are a little over powered.
Their venom paralysises, caused pain and severe bleeding came from their attacks.
One alone killed a tree queen.
Halfings fully armored faced similar fates.
Otherwise, things seem fine with it, besides cutting off their wrists and ankles, and not their hands and feet.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 17, 2014, 04:12:25 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 08:41:47 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 17, 2014, 09:21:35 am
And their prey, the flying screamer, is the fastest creature in the game, trainable (and has [ADOPTS_OWNER], so feel free to scream :P in rage as you experience screamsplosion), flying, similarly magma-proof, amphibious and fast to breed. They'll be excellent for use in magma-traps once I'm done with them.
I'm thinking of adding a new NPC race, that features machines that can deploy troops. Any objections?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 17, 2014, 11:54:57 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 17, 2014, 12:13:51 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 17, 2014, 12:18:30 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 17, 2014, 02:50:42 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 17, 2014, 02:57:59 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 17, 2014, 03:03:12 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 17, 2014, 03:24:59 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 17, 2014, 04:18:26 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 17, 2014, 04:27:41 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 04:29:49 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 17, 2014, 04:33:01 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 17, 2014, 04:33:49 pm
Anyone know what the fourteen instances of nothing are?
No idea. Could you provide more context as to where you saw these?
It could be a creature/material named nothing or a creature missing its caste name.
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 04:36:14 pm
If it helps, the only description is that they have black eyes. According to the combat logs they have back spikes.
I searched the files for spikes and to the best of my memory, I found dragons.
They only appeared in arena mode.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 17, 2014, 04:38:45 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 04:40:18 pm
I'll check all the instances of nothing in case they're each seperate creatures
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 04:43:29 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 04:44:22 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 17, 2014, 04:54:05 pm
Also, what size worlds are you generating? There are quite a few civilizations, and there may not be enough space for every race.
E: Just a quick list of civs:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 05:18:05 pm
IT IS DEFINITELY A DRAGON!
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 05:21:08 pm
The dragon base that he has everything copying its tags off of is spawning in the arena
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 17, 2014, 05:55:49 pm
Unless the proper ones have this issue too, in which case we should find what's going on.
Disregard.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 17, 2014, 06:00:39 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 17, 2014, 06:04:39 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 06:29:13 pm
Its a minor issue.
Just a tad bit of a nuisance, but I have yet to see Nothing in any world gen so it should be fine.
Oh, and sandstorms are working great in case you were wondering.
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 06:48:14 pm
Why can I play as water grubs hounds and mamaphints in adventure mode?
Is this like those cases where it there isnt any other civs you can be a goblin?
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 17, 2014, 06:51:57 pm
It sounds more like there is a raw duplicate somewhere.
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 06:54:24 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 07:02:00 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 17, 2014, 07:19:33 pm
I deleted the raws I had and replaced it with the ones extracted from the .zip in case I screwed something up myself.
Which version are you using? Github should be the most up-to-date.
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 07:22:19 pm
School wifi has a problem wih github.
I think that fixed it anyway. Must have screwed something up looking for Nothing..
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 07:57:10 pm
I hadnt realized how many panserblekks there were either. I was killed instantly...
Awesome.
I found insectoid weapons.
Are these the shaped chitin weapons?
Post by: BenLubar on January 17, 2014, 08:13:54 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 09:51:08 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 11:16:44 pm
It leaves a great number of dented shins and faces. On low levels unarmed halflings are nearly equal to low level staff wielding halflings.
I havent tested high levels yet, but I'm sure it shall do just fine.
If any of you want to test it I can post the raw.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 17, 2014, 11:29:44 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 17, 2014, 11:45:13 pm
Needs a little nerfing.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 18, 2014, 03:33:53 am
Post by: BenLubar on January 18, 2014, 12:36:10 pm
I never really got to try it out in combat, since I had a bunch of halfling macemen following me everywhere and the vampires I got assigned to kill were attacked by their 30 housemates.
Is there some special requirement for feeding a treelord? I read the raws briefly, but I couldn't find anything.
Post by: Urdothor on January 18, 2014, 02:21:29 pm
Did you try heating your food up?
Post by: BenLubar on January 18, 2014, 04:14:23 pm
Maybe you were in a cold location.I doubt it. The civ was on the warmer half of the map, and water wasn't frozen.
Did you try heating your food up?How would I do that?
I remember having a waterskin full of ice on vanilla DF and trying to heat it over a campfire, but I couldn't figure out the command for it.
Post by: Aseaheru on January 18, 2014, 04:17:57 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 18, 2014, 04:20:56 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 18, 2014, 04:23:53 pm
EDIT: From personal experience, most of the map is too cold for most creatures.
Post by: Urdothor on January 18, 2014, 08:21:38 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on January 18, 2014, 08:22:50 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 18, 2014, 08:26:28 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 18, 2014, 09:19:42 pm
It can knock you like halfway across the arena... but doesnt move unless ticked off.
Edit:Need to tone down that attack a bit...
Post by: Urdothor on January 18, 2014, 10:07:03 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 19, 2014, 12:03:16 am
What would cause an impoverished word selector error?Disproportionate distribution of wealth among otherwise similar phonemes...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Urdothor on January 19, 2014, 12:17:07 am
What would cause an impoverished word selector error?Disproportionate distribution of wealth among otherwise similar phonemes...Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I have half a mind to strangle you through my computer screen.
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 19, 2014, 12:45:40 am
What would cause an impoverished word selector error?Disproportionate distribution of wealth among otherwise similar phonemes...Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I have half a mind to strangle you through my computer screen.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 19, 2014, 12:51:04 am
No idea how exactly this will affect the game.
Post by: Urdothor on January 19, 2014, 01:02:22 am
I just found a male nothing...
It cant be my creature because mine die of old age fourty years later.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 19, 2014, 05:23:53 am
Would it be possible for me to make a race with a technological advantage, such as a type of modded windmill that doesn't use the map's actual wind conditions? Or some other building that provides energy with different conditions than normal?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 19, 2014, 07:42:05 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 19, 2014, 08:19:50 am
Post by: BenLubar on January 19, 2014, 10:47:07 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 19, 2014, 04:22:18 pm
Looking through my legends mode I found a few instances of nothing. All died after around 60 years. My creature, because I wanted to see if it would appear in the raws, dies of old age after about 100 years. That means the Nothing isnt the creature I made.
I plan to go into adventure mode and see if the Nothings appear where it says they are.
Post by: Putnam on January 19, 2014, 08:37:41 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 19, 2014, 08:52:33 pm
But as there is no biomes set for them to spawn in, we assumed Nothing would not occur.
Post by: Urdothor on January 19, 2014, 09:19:50 pm
Post by: BenLubar on January 20, 2014, 01:15:10 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 01:20:43 am
Check your temperature.
Post by: 20firebird on January 20, 2014, 02:45:27 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 03:13:33 am
Are we still allowed to add things?
Considering all the things I'm currently cooking up, I hope so.
Would anyone be willing to look at my creature and tell me why exactly it may not be spawning in game? I feel like the reason is obvious and I just missed it.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 20, 2014, 12:34:36 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 01:25:26 pm
Still doesnt seem to pop up...
They can live just fine... They work great in the arena... They just arent spawning.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 20, 2014, 01:31:43 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 01:45:33 pm
I'll gen another world and look at it again.
Dwarf Fortress hates me... Even this version.
Edit: I'll try cranking up the population numbers.
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 01:57:58 pm
There was an error in part of the file making them spontaneously turn to ice in my chosen locales.
Edit: Now that my colossals are no longer becoming colossalsicles it appears they are as abundant as flies.
Time to fix that too.
Edit2: This may seem like a stupid question but whats the difference between BY_TYPE BY_CATEGORY and BY_TOKEN?
Post by: BenLubar on January 20, 2014, 03:18:27 pm
They dont melt in the arena
Check your temperature.
They melt in the arena in adventure-like mode, just not in fortress-like mode.
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 03:30:47 pm
Hmm...
They did melt once when killed I think...
Post by: BenLubar on January 20, 2014, 03:56:25 pm
I've yet to see them melt...They're made of ether (material_template_ztg.txt), which has a boiling point of -9966°F.
Hmm...
They did melt once when killed I think...
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 03:58:39 pm
Edit: I think I read somewhere that they fixed that...
What version are you using
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 20, 2014, 04:02:17 pm
Would you mind the arena spawn list being clogged up with another hundred varieties of mecha? Or should I just add the basic types with a few combinations, leaving the rest restricted so as to make navigation easier?
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 04:09:38 pm
The 16 versions of each of 14 dragons(16x14 dragons) spamming the list is bad enough.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 20, 2014, 04:23:41 pm
What do you think about sock-o-mancers? They use an interaction to spawn seventeen !!socks!! (socks made from material with an ignition temperature below 9500 Urist) near their enemies. Too much like traditional DF, maybe?
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 04:29:04 pm
I kinda want to hug you and at the same time I want to run away screaming...
Post by: BenLubar on January 20, 2014, 04:30:15 pm
Restricted please...It'd be okay if the names weren't all identical.
The 16 versions of each of 14 dragons(16x14 dragons) spamming the list is bad enough.
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 04:32:29 pm
So many of them identical...
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 20, 2014, 04:36:41 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 04:38:29 pm
Then you have freeze rays..
Post by: Aseaheru on January 20, 2014, 08:27:48 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 08:32:36 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 20, 2014, 09:16:56 pm
Yeah, they're functionally identical in most cases.
What do you think about sock-o-mancers? They use an interaction to spawn seventeen !!socks!! (socks made from material with an ignition temperature below 9500 Urist) near their enemies. Too much like traditional DF, maybe?
Unfortunately, interactions cannot spawn anything but material.
Where are these mechs coming from? While they're cool and all, they might not fit thematically... we already have an "advanced" race as medieval-steampunk. A future-tech civ would be upstaging them a bit.
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 09:22:04 pm
There are certain niches being filled already so we have to avoid repeating those niches.
Post by: Aseaheru on January 20, 2014, 09:24:13 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 09:26:30 pm
Now to make my civilization.
Are there any current civilizations a long staff might fit with while I'm at it?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 20, 2014, 09:32:16 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 09:33:53 pm
Would there be a way to make only the lower class 'soldiers'?
Edit:Like I think formics do something like that.
Edit2: Who made the psionics?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 20, 2014, 09:58:09 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 10:01:29 pm
And which castes do you want to have wield staffs it so?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 20, 2014, 10:06:54 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2014, 10:08:45 pm
Your monks shall be that much more dangerous!
EDIT: Time to murder the world.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 21, 2014, 01:23:21 am
So your chances of ever encountering one of these, even in legends mode, is pretty much zero. And the adherents are probably a greater threat, even to the mecha (which have a [THOUGHT] token and in some cases [NERVOUS]).
Post by: WillowLuman on January 21, 2014, 01:28:05 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 21, 2014, 01:50:09 am
If not, let's put it to a vote. Both ideas sound good, so I have no idea which to choose.
Post by: Knight Otu on January 21, 2014, 03:27:25 pm
Could I specify both a specific biome and the cavern layer? If so, what results would that have?I don't think you can specify an aboveground biome and a cavern layer unless you have the creature on "underground depth" 0, and I'm pretty sure you can't double up on underground depth tokens.
If not, let's put it to a vote. Both ideas sound good, so I have no idea which to choose.
Post by: BenLubar on January 21, 2014, 03:59:51 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 21, 2014, 04:17:40 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 21, 2014, 06:13:48 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 21, 2014, 07:33:54 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 21, 2014, 08:03:28 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 21, 2014, 08:08:37 pm
Post by: BenLubar on January 21, 2014, 10:46:48 pm
I just found a night creature and it was offended when I called it a night creature.
Post by: Urdothor on January 21, 2014, 11:07:21 pm
Night creatures are just funny trolls.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 22, 2014, 01:53:10 am
Also, the dirigible antelope bugs are hilarious.
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 02:05:46 am
From Scratch has more problems than the original.
Purge the world with fire.
It must be reborn like the phoenix!
...Totally adding phoenixs...
Post by: WillowLuman on January 22, 2014, 02:08:44 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 02:14:15 am
I dont want to add things no one is interested in.
Edit: It wouldnt be generic of course, generic is boring.
I would add a twist.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 22, 2014, 03:00:00 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 03:06:56 am
It has an interaction to raise certain stats of a creature once every _____ years, much in the way that paladins bless people.
Sound cool?
Edit: *Phoenix raises stats. Character punches Phoenixs face. Phoenix melts Character.*
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 03:16:14 am
Colossals.
Stonefish.
Dotorians.
Icemen wielding long staffs.
Long staffs.
Centalopes.
Phoenixs.
Fixed Dirigible antelope.
Rat like herbivores that can be sheared for horns.
Have I forgotten anything?
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 05:22:08 am
One, I cant get psionics to use my long staffs. Balls.
Two, I dont see any of these dirigible antelope problems.
Try the nongithub download guys.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 22, 2014, 09:56:39 am
Evil Bread (and associated semimegabeast)
Rolling Abomination (signature megabeast. You might want to make a signature megabeast for yourself, Urdothor. Maybe the Phoenix?)
Flying Screamer ("normal" flying creature, four wings, four stubby arms, four legs and a rotor, plus a screech vocalization with very temporary stunning effect)
Technologically advanced "mad scientist-esque" entity (still needs name. Mechanical plus maniac = mechaniac? That sounds slightly wrong, for some reason)
Fossils of old versions of DFScratch, such as headless Vespulae, along with more fictional new "creatures" (I'm not sure whether to add these. If I do, they will be added alongside paleontologists, who would have a revive and an animate-transform ability if added, and a new building for fossil processing)
70-foot chickens with minor magical abilities (based off of an aside comment in a book)
Also, I'll be downloading your version ASAP Urdothor. I want to see the combat potential of Dirigible Antelopes in action.
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 01:28:26 pm
Dirigible antelope (the function ones) are pretty deadly when pissed.
I am making my stone fish milkable for 'liquid stone' to make armor and other crafts.
I would have to give all the entities the custom reactions right?
Need to get in touch with some modders.
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 01:58:39 pm
I feel the urge to make flaming version of halflings as reference to the original phenomenon.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 22, 2014, 03:36:49 pm
Liquid stone sounds interesting. Like some kind of natural glue that hardens to rock-like consistency? There's several IRL marine plants and animals that use stuff like that to cement themselves to rocks and whatnot, but the idea of something that makes enough for armor and building materials is pretty cool. You probably would need to give everyone custom reactions, though.
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 04:01:03 pm
Ugh...
This is gonna take forever.
I have had to make tissue templates, body plans, material template... EVERYTHING... for what is little more than a sea potato.
I actually gave it POTATO as a creature class...
Just incase anyone else makes something similar.
Edit: I FIGURED IT OUT!
All I have to do is make a reaction to turn liquid stone into a 'metal'
Post by: BenLubar on January 22, 2014, 04:08:47 pm
Also: there are several non-liquids that look like water. Some plants have letters for their icon, and some animals (notably halflings) have symbols for their icon.
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 04:13:46 pm
And your point? We are secretly all plants.
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 04:14:18 pm
What if instead of a signature megabeast I make a few semimegabeasts?
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 10:39:41 pm
What if I gave phoenixs an interaction to morph into their immobile ash/fire form(caste). That would completely heal them right? That would work?
Edit: Ice phoenix subspecies?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 22, 2014, 11:15:42 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 11:33:39 pm
So my ideas are good right?
That makes me happy. I put a lot of work into them.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 22, 2014, 11:48:55 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 11:54:08 pm
A giant living piece of ice.
That doesnt fight people.
Until punched.
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2014, 11:57:14 pm
What if there were a creature or plant that gave creatures the alchol dependency tag?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 23, 2014, 12:03:34 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 12:07:55 am
I like it!
And alcohol dependency causing creatures?
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 23, 2014, 12:17:59 am
And alcohol dependency causing creatures?
Not possible, to my knowledge. According to the wiki, all the creature tags that can be given or removed by a syndrome/interaction are
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
But the idea of an ice phoenix is pretty neat. I don't believe I've seen many of those in games.
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 12:23:27 am
Two, Yeah I thought it would be cool.
I'll still check and see if the alcohol depencency tag syndrome works
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 12:34:36 am
Can someone explain to me how to do this?
Post by: Putnam on January 23, 2014, 01:50:08 am
So you know how some creatures have color variations(brown hair, black hair, etc)?
Can someone explain to me how to do this?
TL_COLOR_MODIFIER (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Creature_token#TL_COLOR_MODIFIER).
It takes a tissue, selected earlier, and adds colors with COLOR:frequency:COLOR:frequency etc. Frequency is relative; if they're all 5, they're all the same chance, but if there are 10 and one is 10 times the rest that one will show up 50% of the time.
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 02:51:28 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 05:20:45 am
Problem?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 23, 2014, 12:07:34 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 23, 2014, 01:24:29 pm
DF says it cant find the tissue I used.
Problem?
Could you post the creature's raws? There could be a few different things wrong.
About syndromes, can a syndrome change a creatures speed? And, even if it can't, can someone please help me figure out what the appropriate syndrome code would be?
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Syndrome#The_anatomy_of_a_syndrome
[CE_SPEED_CHANGE:SPEED_PERC:60:START:0:END:403200]
The above will make the creature move at 60% of its normal speed. It takes affect immediately and lasts for a whole year before wearing off.
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 01:54:58 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 23, 2014, 04:22:28 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 23, 2014, 05:12:14 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 05:38:52 pm
Its currently too round for my tastes.
You said there are a few reason that 'tissue ___ cant be found' would appear in the errorlog. I cant currently post the raws, so could you explain what might cause that?
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 23, 2014, 05:59:29 pm
The body part that the tissue is attached to may not be connected properly either, though you would have gotten an error if that happened.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 23, 2014, 06:12:58 pm
Post by: Putnam on January 23, 2014, 06:13:56 pm
EDIT: I mean, technically I could make one, and I in fact have made one for the DBZ mod, but it's awfully inefficient and I wouldn't include DFHack just for that.
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 06:45:04 pm
Considering all the screwing around I did trying to fix it, I might have to redo it.
Plus, I had to make custom... well everything.
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2014, 06:51:54 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 24, 2014, 06:21:25 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 24, 2014, 06:38:12 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 24, 2014, 06:41:43 pm
Isnt it when [STANCE] limbs get damaged you slow down?
When enough [STANCE] body parts are damaged you will fall on your ass and will not be able to stand back up. Which will definitely slow you down, yeah.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 24, 2014, 06:44:02 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 24, 2014, 06:47:10 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2014, 12:01:38 am
I was screwing around with the language file and some how made Gollum-speak.
I'm gonna need to fix that.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 25, 2014, 07:49:07 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2014, 09:00:21 pm
I dont enough know what caused it...
I was looking at it and my computer kinda...
spasmed.
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2014, 10:43:54 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 25, 2014, 10:45:20 pm
When weapons are named, how are names chosen?
The same way as just about everything else: completely at random.
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2014, 10:49:23 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2014, 03:28:40 am
I think it made be a good idea if I stop messing with my raws...
Things are spontaneously combusting...
Edit: How many vermin do we have?
Post by: WillowLuman on January 26, 2014, 03:39:13 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2014, 03:55:24 am
Is that a no to explosive rats then?
I had intended to just make some garden variety pests.
Maybe a type of bat vermin(if bandit moths were vermin eaters that would be a fun food chain switch.
Edit: Can I give a vermin tags that make it a vermin hunter?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 26, 2014, 07:16:15 am
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2014, 01:48:19 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 26, 2014, 03:23:22 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2014, 04:30:10 pm
I had hoped that might happen.
Be careful where you store your prized vermin now.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 26, 2014, 04:34:55 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 26, 2014, 04:37:24 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2014, 04:39:56 pm
Put, like in vanilla, when I am in an area with valuable vermin, I set up a certain area for them and avoid nearby catsplosions.
Now this is going to be harder.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 27, 2014, 11:05:01 am
Post by: WillowLuman on January 27, 2014, 11:10:39 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 27, 2014, 11:20:44 am
Also, I think I may give the flying screamers both prefstrings and [VERMIN_HATEABLE], to make them more of a nuisance rather than a great advantage.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 27, 2014, 11:43:25 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 27, 2014, 11:54:36 am
I think these things may be overpowered.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 27, 2014, 01:06:07 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 27, 2014, 03:16:33 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 27, 2014, 03:30:29 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 27, 2014, 03:53:48 pm
On the plus side, this creature is more of a nuisance than a tool (as noted above), so anyone with a shred of common sense will avoid it. I may have to set up a system that makes it incapable of flying after a certain age, to allow people to rid themselves of plagues like this, but it's relatively rare status as a wild creature should prevent them from wild ones becoming as such.
Post by: Urdothor on January 27, 2014, 04:20:22 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 27, 2014, 04:26:27 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 27, 2014, 04:30:06 pm
Or a thrown fluffy wambler.
Unless you mean the halfling rocks.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 27, 2014, 07:48:23 pm
This type of creature is why my hobbits live underground.Nah, it's just a nuissance.
The giant killer wasps, ants, spiders, moths, and tigers, on the other hand...
Post by: Aseaheru on January 27, 2014, 07:49:46 pm
Afterall, hobbits.
Halflings are designed to live underground too.
We need round doors.
Post by: WillowLuman on January 27, 2014, 07:51:17 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on January 27, 2014, 08:02:04 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 27, 2014, 08:30:49 pm
Bridges are much better
Post by: WillowLuman on January 27, 2014, 08:32:23 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 27, 2014, 08:33:46 pm
Habit I acquired from vanilla.
Too many vampires in comparison to tbe number of playthroughs
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 28, 2014, 02:06:24 am
Unless you mean the halfling rocks.Yes, those. These creatures are tiny as can be.
Post by: Urdothor on January 28, 2014, 05:26:37 pm
Your creatures terrify me(well... their ability to spread like cats and such actually) to be frank.
So I am going to destroy them.
ALL OF THEM.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 29, 2014, 10:22:13 am
Also, the spheres they have are mostly despair-related ones.
Post by: Urdothor on January 29, 2014, 04:18:37 pm
Post by: kopout on January 29, 2014, 09:43:41 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8375 (http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8375)
I understand that others have been working on their own stuff so these are just the relevant files. Stink dogs are now [VERMIN_HATEABLE] and I fixed the bug where cave lemons trigger an infinite loop at the lumberyard. As I was catching up with this thread I noticed that people think the rygics are over powered. Considering I made them to hunt panzerblecks they ought to be :P
Post by: Urdothor on January 29, 2014, 09:44:56 pm
Any other changes?
Post by: kopout on January 29, 2014, 09:48:04 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on January 29, 2014, 09:52:06 pm
IDK what rygics even are, though, I must confess that I haven't downloaded in a while.
Post by: kopout on January 29, 2014, 10:00:48 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 29, 2014, 10:18:20 pm
I cant download the patch(on my phone for the next like month...)
How did you stop infinite automatic combustible lemons?
Post by: kopout on January 29, 2014, 10:26:29 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Urdothor on January 29, 2014, 10:28:54 pm
Post by: Urdothor on January 30, 2014, 04:08:34 am
TWO.
I have spent all this time trying to get a single bloody tissue to work.
I'm just done right now
Modding is a pain sometimes...
Post by: Urdothor on January 30, 2014, 06:33:44 pm
I have 3 unique castes worked out.
Sterile Dog like quadrapedal soldiers.
Basic workers and crafters.
An extremely rare Abominable snowman guardian type creature that is entirely meltable as opposed to a meltable outer shell.
Post by: Urdothor on January 30, 2014, 10:51:54 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on January 30, 2014, 10:56:24 pm
Should the bird form of the phoenix be a solid manifestation or completely fire?
I would make it at least somewhat solid, so that it won't die too easily.
Post by: Urdothor on January 30, 2014, 10:58:50 pm
Extremely hot feathers and solid tissue?
Post by: Urdothor on January 30, 2014, 10:59:13 pm
What are your thoughts on diseases?
Post by: Urist McFluffles on January 31, 2014, 02:12:44 am
P.S. of course i didn't design Creature Carl i just added him into my game
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on January 31, 2014, 01:17:01 pm
In terms of diseases, as long as it stops after a reasonable period of time (and depending on whether it is chronic or temporary, the effects vanish), it's okay. DF can't handle multiple syndromes at once.
Oh, and your Glacier-Men quadrupedal caste sounds like it consists out of horror movie aliens. That completely meltable caste will be a godsend for people who like magma traps.
Post by: Urdothor on January 31, 2014, 11:28:10 pm
Outside the frozen biomes they're all completely harmless.
Post by: Urdothor on February 01, 2014, 01:02:38 am
Simple little quick things.
Cureable things.
One or two... FUN things.
Like coughing up blood.
Or other pleasant diseases.
I'm actually baseing it off of Halflings mod.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 01, 2014, 05:49:30 am
Also, does anyone know a way to get creatures to not be spawned by worldgen, but still not be fictional?
Post by: Urdothor on February 01, 2014, 08:36:08 am
They dont completey melt.
Post by: Urdothor on February 01, 2014, 04:11:15 pm
That then melts.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 01, 2014, 04:15:19 pm
Post by: Putnam on February 01, 2014, 04:26:41 pm
There's a problem you'll have to address: the glacier creatures will start wars with civs outside their biome, which, while the melting won't happen in worldgen, will cause massive problems when an entire civ dies off within the span of a single fortress.
Also, does anyone know a way to get creatures to not be spawned by worldgen, but still not be fictional?
Don't give it a biome
Post by: Urdothor on February 01, 2014, 04:34:26 pm
I kinda want them to die out often.
They're a primitive tribe stuck behind everyone else.
An exaggeration of Russia before its industrial reforms long long (long) ago.
Isolated. Cold. Stubborn.
Drunk.
They are supposed to be a rare race, clinging to life on the edges of the world.
Your job as overseer is too try to bring them to a point of notability.
Or not.
They dont care. They die either way.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 01, 2014, 05:11:02 pm
-snip-So like vanilla Dwarves then. Or basically everything, if you wait for long enough.
Or not.
They dont care. They die either way.
Also, thanks Putnam!
Post by: Urdothor on February 01, 2014, 07:26:15 pm
The whole race suffers depression basically.
They dont care because they all are going to die anyway.
Its the alcohol.
Post by: Urdothor on February 01, 2014, 08:49:31 pm
Elves and others wont like their indifference...
But they wont reciprocate bad feelings...
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 02, 2014, 06:07:40 am
Post by: Urdothor on February 02, 2014, 01:41:57 pm
Dont want to loose your armor now do yah
Post by: Urdothor on February 03, 2014, 09:41:10 pm
So... the insides of them melted upon spawning do to body temperature and there outsides never melted.
This is the reverse of what should be happening.
This is why I dont mod.
Post by: WillowLuman on February 03, 2014, 11:02:32 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 03, 2014, 11:41:22 pm
I have learned to look at other peoples creatures before making my own.
Saves a lot of time.
Post by: Putnam on February 03, 2014, 11:47:05 pm
Every single other one I've copy+pasted from another creature.
Post by: Urdothor on February 03, 2014, 11:52:56 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on February 04, 2014, 12:01:25 am
And at the very least, you know what went wrong! More than can be said for me and the bombus fuzz.
...have I ever mentioned that bug before? I should probably see if that still exists...
Post by: Urdothor on February 04, 2014, 03:26:24 am
Now I just feel bad for my creations...
Ones insides shouldnt melt.
Post by: Urdothor on February 04, 2014, 07:42:49 pm
Would be a cool idea.
Post by: Urdothor on February 05, 2014, 09:47:48 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on February 05, 2014, 09:58:13 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 05, 2014, 10:26:43 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 06, 2014, 03:35:21 am
Should halflings be capable of climbing? Or elves, for that matter?
Post by: StLeibowitz on February 06, 2014, 10:20:28 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 06, 2014, 10:31:15 am
What about bears? Or dragons? Those have hands or [GRASP]-ing appendages, but seem far too heavy for normal climbing.
What typesof multi-tile trees this game will have is another thing we should think about. I think a tree, with outer branches made of permanently ice-cold material, with an inner part so hot that it can set stuff on fire, would be interesting, but we'll have to wait for the release before we can see how the new trees work.
Post by: Urdothor on February 06, 2014, 02:03:48 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on February 06, 2014, 06:17:43 pm
Really? Some creatures are great at climbing, while others just don't have the right limb build for it. Larger pterosaurs were great at galloping, reaching impressive speeds (quite a few were land predators, rather than aerial ones) and pathetic at climbing, yet their ancestors were great at climbing, but quite slow on flat terrain.
What about bears? Or dragons? Those have hands or [GRASP]-ing appendages, but seem far too heavy for normal climbing.
What typesof multi-tile trees this game will have is another thing we should think about. I think a tree, with outer branches made of permanently ice-cold material, with an inner part so hot that it can set stuff on fire, would be interesting, but we'll have to wait for the release before we can see how the new trees work.
Sure, some creatures are better than others at climbing, but the ability should probably be there if it has hands - not any generic [GRASP] part, but an actual hand, like elves or halflings or formics. Exceptions can be made for handed critters that have...questionable anatomies, but it works as a rule of thumb.
Also, on bears climbing:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Depending on the size of the dragon, I could see them climbing as well. Or depending on the size of the tree, really - who's to say a great lizard wouldn't roost in an eighty-feet-in-diameter, branches-thicker-around-than-a-grain-silo wood behemoth?
Sonethings without graspers should be able to climb too. Like slugs
Eugh, slugs...they should climb too, yeah. I kinda wish I'd made my [IMMOLATE] giant fire-slug now.
Post by: Urdothor on February 06, 2014, 06:24:44 pm
Or the golden elephant thingies...
Hooves and elephant feet.
Post by: WillowLuman on February 06, 2014, 08:18:05 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 06, 2014, 09:15:34 pm
Actually, I very humerously caused the drowning of one in adventure mode.
Post by: Urdothor on February 06, 2014, 09:52:38 pm
In adventure mode how often do you all see water creatures?
Post by: Urdothor on February 07, 2014, 11:10:10 pm
Or kills them.
Either way.
Edit: Nope.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 08, 2014, 06:26:26 am
Anyway, how many of your creatures are finished, Urdothor?
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 04:02:21 pm
Its a good thing this wasnt really an official modding turn.
Sorry that I dont really have anything to show after all this time.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 08, 2014, 04:08:58 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 04:15:10 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 08, 2014, 04:37:01 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 05:07:32 pm
Most of the tokens have no real explaination too them.
The wiki is no place for modders
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 06:33:28 pm
I feel like what I have so far is just barely hanging on by a thread, so if I could get a little help, things would get a lot better.
Post by: WillowLuman on February 08, 2014, 07:47:08 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 08:03:02 pm
I cant for awhile.
I'm stuck on my phone right now. Sometime this week.
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 10:09:58 pm
The wiki one isnt very helpful...
Post by: BlackFlyme on February 08, 2014, 10:25:05 pm
Is there a better modding guide than the one currently on the wiki? That way I dont have to question even the basics.
I don't believe I have ever used the guide on the wiki. The token pages are immensely helpful though. Here's the master page of tokens on the wiki. (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Token) It should help direct you to individual token pages.
The only guide I've seen other than the one on the wiki is Shaostoul's (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=55259.0), though it's somewhat old.
I've personally learned to mod by dissecting other people's mods to try and figure out what does what.
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 11:20:43 pm
know what something does and I go to test it and everything screws up.
Maybe I'm dyslexic...
I think I'm going to end up with lots of explosions.
Alright... so, I want to make a body detail plan that uses stone as a tissue.
My previous attempts at this resulted in my tissue not being recognised. I substituted in another body detail plan and it worked.
I think it was screwing up at the add/use tissue and add/use material part(I think thats the tags I was thinking of) What would I need to refer to for it to use that tissue?
Post by: BlackFlyme on February 08, 2014, 11:40:43 pm
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:name:template] and [USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:name:template] are only for actual material/tissue templates, I know that much. My attempts to get those tags to use inorganics have always failed.
[EDIT: though [USE_MATERIAL:material:old material] may accept inorganics. I just did an edit in my game and it isn't spitting error messages at me. /EDIT]
Though you can define your own tissues within a creature using something like this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Or you could create a custom material that has similar properties to stone and a tissue template to use with it for a body detail plan.
I'm not actually sure of how Scratch's body detail plans work, as I haven't look though them before.
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2014, 11:56:36 pm
I had meant to say I was using a tissue similar to stone.
I attempted before and it failed.
This should hopefully help.
Post by: Urdothor on February 09, 2014, 12:31:12 am
I have news.
As my Glacier men are meant to be mostly 'aboveground' people, they are going to have a reaction to make ice into a 'metal' usable in tools, atleast until you have glacial creatures that contain bones. Then use those
Post by: BlackFlyme on February 09, 2014, 12:38:58 am
Would the metal still melt like ice, or is it going to be usable in warmer climates as well?
Post by: Urdothor on February 09, 2014, 12:42:39 am
But otherwise, yes it would melt like normal.
Post by: Urdothor on February 09, 2014, 02:08:28 am
Or keep it normal...
Thoughts?
Post by: Urdothor on February 09, 2014, 06:04:51 am
Yay.
Now quick question.
What effects should have?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 09, 2014, 06:40:31 am
Post by: Urdothor on February 09, 2014, 03:17:24 pm
Edit: I said dwarves.
Ha... I need sleep
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 10, 2014, 01:20:54 am
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 03:38:05 am
Too the best of my knowledge, the alchemy works, so this should.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 03:41:50 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 10, 2014, 11:12:37 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2014, 03:54:07 pm
"Music of the Spheres" could speed up healing
"Recite an Epic Saga" could increase wakefulness
"Badly Sing the National Anthem" could cause all the halflings within earshot to berzerk... (AKA: The Rossanne Barr (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ru2BYd3c90w).)
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 10, 2014, 04:14:13 pm
And "Music of the Icy Wastes" could...freeze things? I don't know, just thought you might want some music specifically for your new race, Urdothor. Specific music for each race is something we've all thought about implementing, now that I think of it. The cricket-like worker hymns of the Formic, for one, maybe some church-y ominous organ music for the cherubim, techno for the mechaniacs.
How is the music represented in adventure mode?
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 04:28:28 pm
I'm going to attempt to change it into a instrument specific interaction.
Currently, it spawns a boulder that immediately combusts into syndrome gas.
So you all want race specific adventure mode songs with specific effects?
I'll try that.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 04:33:05 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 10, 2014, 04:35:54 pm
You're adding a lot of much-wanted stuff to DFScratch, Urdothor. Good job ;)!
*this allows you to have a line of text scroll over the bottom of the screen once used.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 04:38:51 pm
Oh!
Isnt there a way to make specific interactions occur at certain skill levels?
I could make it to where after a certain level you learn a new song.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 10, 2014, 04:41:14 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 10, 2014, 04:42:21 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 04:47:22 pm
In arena mode spawning syndrome boulders seems to not be doing anything syndromey...
To the person who made Alchemy, when you tested the syndromes in the arena, did it work?
Maybe it will work in normal adventure mode.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 04:53:10 pm
Does anyone know how?
Post by: WillowLuman on February 10, 2014, 05:07:57 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 05:19:39 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on February 10, 2014, 05:44:13 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 05:47:33 pm
Will they still appear in world gen and such?
Post by: WillowLuman on February 10, 2014, 05:48:58 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on February 10, 2014, 05:52:55 pm
So...
In arena mode spawning syndrome boulders seems to not be doing anything syndromey...
To the person who made Alchemy, when you tested the syndromes in the arena, did it work?
Maybe it will work in normal adventure mode.
I did test them in the arena, and they seemed to function perfectly fine. All the incense materials (the boulders that vaporize immediately into a gas) use the same template with a low boiling point. Is your music boulder set up to explosively boil at a low temperature? If that's not the problem, is the associated syndrome set to be inhalable?
Posting the raws in code tags would be helpful in figuring this out.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 06:06:57 pm
So, I give them the reaction, but dont make the reaction actually possible?
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 06:10:24 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 06:43:54 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 06:44:29 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on February 10, 2014, 06:52:05 pm
CAN_DO_INTERACTION is a special syndrome effect, and like others, can have a stoptime. For your syndrome, it should probably be the only symptom. If you put it on a timer, and make the syndrome a contact syndrome, then people will get it refreshed as long as they hold the item with bare hands, but will loose it shortly after ceasing to touch it.
You don't want the material to evaporate like the alchemy ones do, since that means the instruments will evaporate as well.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 07:01:28 pm
I was thinking of using instruments in a reaction called 'practice instrument' that would give you different interactions(songs) with different effects.
Or, for the ethnic songs, I could have each civilization get a material that gives special songs, so using an x material fiddle might give you a lively country ballad while using y material bagpipes gives you a solemn dirge.
Post by: WillowLuman on February 10, 2014, 07:09:14 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 07:18:57 pm
I could make one material that has a syndrome set to give specific races certain songs since no one cares about other peoples race songs anyway, EX. Halflings would get three specific cultural songs, Formics gets their three, etc,
OR
I have each race get a specific material that gives specific songs, so if you want to play a lively country ballad you have to have a halfling violin regardless of race,
And I know.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 07:47:35 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 11:06:36 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on February 10, 2014, 11:26:34 pm
Is there a way to specify what instrument you make in a reaction?
Yes, make the reagent something like:
Code: [Select]
[REAGENT:A:1:INSTRUMENT:FIDDLE_HLG:NONE:NONE]This will only accept halfling fiddles in the reaction. If you don't want the instrument used up, then add [PRESERVE_REAGENT] after the reagent, but before the next reagent or the product.
Code: [Select]
[REAGENT:A:1:INSTRUMENT:FIDDLE_HLG:NONE:NONE][PRESERVE_REAGENT]E: Read a bit too quick, and thought you were asking for the reagent, not the product.
Here's a product:
Code: [Select]
[PRODUCT:100:1:INSTRUMENT:FIDDLE_HLG:INORGANIC:ROCK_HLG]This will make a rock fiddle.
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2014, 11:34:36 pm
Do you all mind me sorta spamming the adventure mode reaction list with instrument making reactions?
Edit: I want a way to specify what instrument you want to make.
Too bad I cant just specify a certain races instrument to be made...
Post by: Urdothor on February 11, 2014, 12:04:42 am
Post by: BlackFlyme on February 11, 2014, 12:11:50 am
Fiddles are exclusive to halflings.
Drums and violins are Lizardfolk only.
Trolls have kanteles.
No one uses flutes.
I'm curious; how many adventurer reactions do we even have at the moment? I may just check myself.
E: Three reactions. One to knap rocks, one to make a crude gun, and one to make ammunition for the gun.
Post by: Urdothor on February 11, 2014, 12:15:18 am
Four if you count the clean self.
I might actually make it race specific just because some playable races dont have instruments.
Post by: Urdothor on February 11, 2014, 12:22:42 am
Songs specific to the instrument or songs specific to race?
Edit: What about generic songs? Would anyone like generic songs in addition to the race specific songs?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 11, 2014, 11:08:29 am
To tell you the truth, I think you should start with a single generic song and perhaps that/those of your own Glacier Men. If you then tell us what things we would have to copy and change to make our own songs, we'll be able to put more of our own ideas in.
Post by: Urdothor on February 11, 2014, 05:26:31 pm
I need to figure that out first myself.
Figuring out how I wanna set it up.
Post by: Urdothor on February 11, 2014, 06:46:09 pm
Quad State band and such.
Post by: Urdothor on February 16, 2014, 12:12:49 am
What if I made an addition race, Bards, who are specifically crafted by the gods to bring joyous sounds to the world.
To obtain instruments you have to disarm said musicians.
The instruments are the bards only weapons.
Thoughts?
It lets you reduce the number of instruments to have to be made, and be a specific just bard class.
Edit: Just a thought.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 24, 2014, 07:32:21 pm
Anyway, while it may help with getting the effects you want, it seems like it could disrupt storytelling to some degree. Then again, having your adventurer learn from the "Bard of legend So-and-so" could help storytelling. Depends on what you want, really.
By the way, does anyone think a mascot would be a good idea? I'm thinking dirigible spider, with icy spines along it's back, mechanical chelicerae, "coding error" mind grip, some dragon-like features (presumably just wings) and possibly tentacles due to the land squid. And root tentacles (treelords) and mallard duck beaks somehow figured into the whole mess. On the other hand, it may just seem like a bit too much self-insertion, so...yes/no?
Post by: Urdothor on February 24, 2014, 08:49:49 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 25, 2014, 08:57:23 am
Post by: Kazimuth on February 25, 2014, 11:24:31 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 25, 2014, 11:31:19 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 27, 2014, 06:25:27 am
Post by: Poldon on February 27, 2014, 09:52:53 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 27, 2014, 11:47:15 am
Post by: StLeibowitz on February 27, 2014, 02:22:37 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 27, 2014, 04:21:36 pm
The french Danse Macabre.
The pied piper...
This is going to be fun.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 27, 2014, 07:15:00 pm
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 27, 2014, 07:20:54 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 27, 2014, 07:39:12 pm
And, speculation is the pied piper actually brought the rats so as to warrant his services
Post by: StLeibowitz on February 27, 2014, 07:56:46 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on February 27, 2014, 08:10:18 pm
A shrewd man he was, in that case. Can interactions summon creatures, though?
Not directly, unfortunately.
You can resurrect corpses and force them to transform into a different creature though.
Post by: Urdothor on February 27, 2014, 09:29:53 pm
What if I turned the children into rats?
Edit: Flesh eating rats.
Post by: BlackFlyme on February 27, 2014, 09:44:17 pm
You can force transformations on creatures right?
What if I turned the children into rats?
Edit: Flesh eating rats.
You can force a transformation on living creatures just fine.
The only problem is that they will not follow you like a zombie would, and you cannot restrict a transformation to children. Plus the creature that they transform into will have to either be [CRAZED] or [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE], otherwise they will still act the same to others around them, since they will retain their civilization affiliations.
Post by: Urdothor on February 27, 2014, 10:38:32 pm
How to get something close to what I want..
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on February 28, 2014, 09:44:00 am
Post by: Urdothor on February 28, 2014, 05:31:58 pm
And I dont think we're really doing any turns...
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on February 28, 2014, 05:52:15 pm
If we use material emission, could we then transform the material into a creature?
I think that the next version might make some sort of mind controlling creature more possible, incidentally.
Post by: Putnam on February 28, 2014, 06:04:02 pm
Also DF don't have no 'splosions, just things what resemble them slightly (I.E evaporations).
Post by: Urdothor on February 28, 2014, 07:56:14 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on February 28, 2014, 11:43:44 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on February 28, 2014, 11:45:27 pm
Fine, then just a pressure induced meltdown event causing the still to deconstruct and vomit booze everywhere. It's not like I meant for the stills to just explode, I meant to add a booze pressure stat to where one can't overuse a still or bad things happen.Not possible, unfortunately.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on February 28, 2014, 11:47:21 pm
Anyways, if we're not doing turns, how are we doing this?
Post by: WillowLuman on February 28, 2014, 11:48:24 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on February 28, 2014, 11:51:34 pm
Post by: Urdothor on February 28, 2014, 11:59:43 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 12:03:25 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 01, 2014, 12:22:01 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 12:26:13 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 01, 2014, 12:31:53 am
Edit: That isnt meant as an insult. I find the bugs quite amusing.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 12:42:30 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 01, 2014, 02:08:24 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on March 01, 2014, 02:11:00 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 01, 2014, 02:53:28 pm
- Setting up the basic paleontology stuff, with a basis similar to vampires, along with a fossil-cleaning building and the appropriate materials.
- Finally finishing the Mechaniacs and coming up with a better name for them.
- Adding the 70-foot Chicken of Death.
- Nerfing the Rolling Abominations till they're semimegabeast status, then adding a gigantic Jormundragr dragon, with ridiculous body size, a heck of a lot of limbs and other body parts, along with material emission of a multi-effect syndrome-based poison. Truly massive wings, with large sections having major arteries allow for it to be killed. Y/N?
- Giving the paleontologists a necromancy interaction. Y/N?
- Adding the titles of our god characters as fanciful, non-existent creatures. Y/N?
- Should I change the name of the Mechaniacs, and, if so, what to?
EDIT: Platypus-porpoise creatures anyone? Plorpoyse(i for the plural form) would be my suggested name, although I'm partial to just calling them Polyps and waiting to hear the stories of people not checking what it actually is. Also, I have an idea for a creature with it's legs on the inside of a ring-like structure, using the two parts of the claws each of it's three legs possess one of for it's STANCE, and I need a name for it. Any ideas?
EDIT2: Another idea, birds that look like rocks. Outer layer is guano, as other birds often confuse them for, well...rocks. The guano carries a 2% chance for a mild temporary nausea syndrome, 98% chance for harmlessness. Both syndrome "paths" end within less than a day. Seem reasonable?
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 04:40:06 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 01, 2014, 04:48:41 pm
About the necromancy+paleontology: Indiana Jones style expeditions for necromancy artifacts would be fun. Quest for the Carbon Nanotube Tyrannosaur Jaw, anyone?
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 04:53:07 pm
Yeah! Let me get my Legendary +1 Lasher ready!
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 01, 2014, 05:58:52 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 06:10:25 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 01, 2014, 06:28:59 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on March 01, 2014, 08:43:44 pm
The birds that look like rocks sound like they'd be involved with trolls somehow.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 09:55:03 pm
Mm. We should have other rock animals.
Post by: Urdothor on March 01, 2014, 10:46:01 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 10:55:57 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 01, 2014, 11:00:37 pm
Its a no.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 11:16:23 pm
Just gotta... Y'know, I should actually just get one of my notebooks.
Anyway, I'm still gonna put in giant moths, they'll just not actually go through metamorphosis then. ( Mmf. If I could figure out Creature Variations... They're like my Achilles heel tho. Besides, where would the triggers be? )
Post by: StLeibowitz on March 01, 2014, 11:34:06 pm
Mmm. Gotcha.
Just gotta... Y'know, I should actually just get one of my notebooks.
Anyway, I'm still gonna put in giant moths, they'll just not actually go through metamorphosis then. ( Mmf. If I could figure out Creature Variations... They're like my Achilles heel tho. Besides, where would the triggers be? )
Oh! Oh! More giant insects! Woo! The Bandit Moths were getting lonely :)
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 01, 2014, 11:38:04 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 06:56:33 am
The good thing about DF2014 is that our underground races can now have sites, which will be important for the Mechaniacs.
Supplementing our arthropod and semi-arthropod collection, what about a kaiju-sized tardigrade? Extremely slow, weak armor (weak enough to fall apart at the application of even minor weaponry) due to the stress applied by the square-cube law, but a pretty good biting attack. That should make the wildlife a little more survivable, and possibly provide an extra source of food.
Will the flying fish actually fly?
EDIT:
And if there's more intelligent pets coming, they all need the fix so politics doesn't look like a zoo where it's occasionally a bear that's the mayor and occasionally some kind of smart octopusI may have found yet another idea to implement. Think octopus' upper body with four tentacles (each ending in a fin) on it as the back and the front being a killer whale's head.orkiller whale with legs.
Along with the flying fish question, here are two more:
What do you consider the weirdest creatures of this mod to be?
Shouldn't we ask for this to be added here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=28829)?
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 11:45:30 am
And I can't even begin to tell you what the weirdest creatures are. I've only scratched the surface of weird here.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 12:35:57 pm
For some reason, none of this seems weird to me anymore, which is why I asked.
Does anyone know the maximum [SIZE] you can give a creature before it loops around? On a side note, what does it loop around to, zero (counting upwards/downwards?) or a negative number?
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 01:00:29 pm
And that's an amusing concept, the whole looping back around to a negative. You are a negative size, your body physics loop around into a Mobius loop and therefore make a spacetime-bending black hole paradox.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 01:16:32 pm
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on March 02, 2014, 01:20:04 pm
Post by: Gnorm on March 02, 2014, 01:21:59 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 01:24:56 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 01:28:35 pm
The maximum size is one less than 2^31, which is 2147483647. Presumably, it would be possible for it to loop around and become negative.So, enough for a 2 meter tall, 2 meter wide, 536 meter long Jörmungandr, but apparently too small for all but the smallest incarnation of Godzilla. Would anyone like me to come up with an incarnation for their god character?
Post by: Urdothor on March 02, 2014, 01:41:00 pm
I think we have all been pretty busy
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 01:47:16 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 02:24:13 pm
That was the plan, is there any reason it wouldn't work?No particular reason, just that it would be hard to code properly, and would take a lot of time to debug, if creatures with "normal" lifecycles are anything to go by.
Post by: Urdothor on March 02, 2014, 02:26:26 pm
Edit: I should be able to continue in a few days
Post by: DrKillPatient on March 02, 2014, 02:39:34 pm
The maximum size is one less than 2^31, which is 2147483647. Presumably, it would be possible for it to loop around and become negative.
Surely creature size is unsigned; there's no reason it should take on negative values — in that case, the max size would be (2^32)-1 = 4,294,967,295 cm³ ≈ 4.3 million liters (which is, apparently, about 1.7 times the minimum volume of an Olympic swimming pool).
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 02:48:08 pm
Footnote 1:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
EDIT: Here's a way to estimate the size of a tile: 10 km/h corresponds to 920 speed, a deduction made by comparing the average human speed in RL to that in vanilla DF.
Post by: WillowLuman on March 02, 2014, 03:17:05 pm
Any creature going over the size limit is NOT negative, but rather goes back around and becomes tiny (size-2147483647).
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 03:38:38 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 03:39:46 pm
( Later, I imagine that Toady One will make creature sizes an unsigned long because of the infamy of this thread. )
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 03:41:42 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 03:51:19 pm
... This game is written in C++ right?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 03:53:46 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 03:59:55 pm
Explain for the dumb and tired. And me.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 02, 2014, 04:11:45 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 02, 2014, 04:17:39 pm
Post by: DrKillPatient on March 02, 2014, 04:20:19 pm
What does "unsigned" mean anyway?
(Note: I'm not formally learned in computer science... YET — however, I think my understanding as detailed below is at least accurate on a basic conceptual level.)
To simplify things a bit, it means that that the type can only take on positive values; a signed type gains an 'extra' bit as a result (relative to a signed version of the value) and its max is thus about half that of an unsigned type. Suppose you have a four-bit integer (max value is 1111 in binary, or 2^4-1 = 15 in decimal). If you want it to take on both negative and positive values (that is, to be signed), one of those four bits needs to represent the sign. Which bit it is depends on the implementation details, I suppose, but let's say it's the first one, and that 0 indicates negative and 1 indicates positive. Now, 1111 might represent +7 (1000 to 1111 -> 0 to 7) and 0111 might represent -7 (0000 to 0111 -> -0 to -7), since a signed four-bit type is essentially a three-bit number with an additional bit for holding the value of the sign. The 0000/1000 overlap here is not a problem in more efficient implementations, which is why you see ranges like [-128, 127] for a signed 8-bit number. However, I think this implementation is conceptually the easiest... There are more computationally efficient ones such as the two's complement (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two%27s_complement), where the negative version of an N-bit binary number, I, can be represented as 2^N-I. (The two's complement is a better choice since that representation is compatible with standard binary arithmetic operators and can represent values from -2^(N-1) to +2^(N-1)-1 — for instance, -128 to 127 for an 8-bit signed integer).
Post by: WillowLuman on March 02, 2014, 04:44:51 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 03, 2014, 12:52:18 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 02:14:05 am
What should I draw?
Edit, is there anyway to post images straight from my phone to the forum?
Post by: WillowLuman on March 03, 2014, 02:16:55 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 02:21:18 am
Post by: WillowLuman on March 03, 2014, 02:56:01 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 03:11:29 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 03:33:09 am
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 03, 2014, 03:41:54 am
Heres a question, what does a formics foot look like?
Like an ant's foot would, I suppose. Though probably a bit larger and wider, since drones, workers, and warriors stand on only two legs.
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 05:04:42 am
I had a really cool looking formic and i screwed it up
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 03, 2014, 09:21:07 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 03, 2014, 01:11:57 pm
Considering some of the hilarious bugs we've had, you could even make a golem out of frozen blood if you want.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 03, 2014, 01:28:13 pm
A frozen blood golem? Wow.
Post by: WillowLuman on March 03, 2014, 01:39:31 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 03, 2014, 01:45:44 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 03:16:05 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 03, 2014, 04:15:37 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 04:39:36 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on March 03, 2014, 06:20:40 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on March 03, 2014, 06:46:59 pm
We could come up with similar (yet not completely identical) materials of our own. It's a world where we have 70-foot chickens, giant squid and trees with a tendency to kill dragons. Why would it have similar minerals? Could we make a metal that functions as an aquifer before being mined? Or does the aquifer mining exploit not leave boulders?Real life has giant squids, you know. And our mod lacks 70-foot chickens.
Also, this mod has had Iridium and Meteoric Iron from near the beginning. Both of which are real-world materials, though because we lack other metals, they appear almost everywhere as tools and weapons, despite the rocks they're mined from being relatively rare. I posted a lengthy rant about why our make no sense a while back, but to sum up "Why would the natives even call if meteoric iron if it forms so much of the planet that it would be impossible to tell that it came from meteors?"
And; " 'Draw Iridium, villain!' just doesn't sound as good as 'Draw steel, villain!' "
And there's no reason we can't have mundane metals and fantastic metals at the same time: In fact, we MUST. When ONLY fantastic metals exist, people have no point of comparison. "Stronger than steel" tells me something about the metal; "Stronger than Lunalium" tells me nothing, because that's just more jargon. "Gold" brings to mind riches. "Selenite" does not, unless I know it's "almost as valuable as gold" or "twice as valuable as platinum", etc.
You may as well ask "Why does our world need boring old lances and clubs? People should wield Asjhajksdf's and Tierioyeir's!"
Take halflings for a good example. We know they're about half the size of humans, and so they provide a good point of comparison that let's us visualize the size of the other creatures of the world.
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 03, 2014, 06:51:04 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 03, 2014, 07:01:22 pm
Post by: tahujdt on March 04, 2014, 02:44:08 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 04, 2014, 03:02:59 am
Post by: Poldon on March 04, 2014, 08:23:43 am
I am no modder, however, and don't have large amounts of time to spend on this.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 04, 2014, 09:43:59 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 04, 2014, 11:03:43 am
Also, seeing as we already have elves, could we make Cobalt Kobolds? Think semiorganic bronze golem.
Post by: WillowLuman on March 04, 2014, 01:35:15 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 04, 2014, 01:55:58 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on March 04, 2014, 02:05:59 pm
While we should have reference points for our custom stuff, we do still want to be original. Adding in more (albeit alternate versions of) vanilla races makes this resemble vanilla DF more in terms of flavor.
I'll agree on this. No copies of DF races, no minorly-tweaked vanilla races, no creatures taken wholesale or minorly modified - let's use our thinkers, people :)
Also, seeing as we already have elves, could we make Cobalt Kobolds? Think semiorganic bronze golem.
If one wants a race of tiny thieving stone golems, make it a race of tiny thieving stone golems. Don't call it a kobold. If it be a smeerp, let it be known as a smeerp.
Elves are an exception. It's just not a DF-based game without elves to mulch.
What is the flavour of this mod? I'm guessing more sci-fi because of Iridium
I'd say definitely fantasy. We've got psionic monks, more species of dragons than species of mammals, alchemy, the shades of the damned lurking in Hell, giant spiders and various other oversized insects; there's some SF influences here and there (my Formics, for example) but overall it's pretty solidly in the realm of fantasy.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 04, 2014, 03:04:11 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on March 04, 2014, 03:07:40 pm
What is the flavour of this mod? I'm guessing more sci-fi because of IridiumWe already established these clockwork necromancer whatevers as the advanced race, so having anything more advanced than that (in any great quantities at least) kind of deflates them. So no mechs, but clockwork golems are fine.
I once had an idea for a megabeast that's a mysterious war machine from the distant past, but adding more clockwork stuff makes it a bit less mysterious so I guess I'll come up with something else.
Post by: Urdothor on March 04, 2014, 08:22:38 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 05, 2014, 01:50:04 am
We already established these clockwork necromancer whatevers as the advanced race, so having anything more advanced than that (in any great quantities at least) kind of deflates them. So no mechs, but clockwork golems are fine.So the (extremely fragile and low-population) race I was planning to add=no?
Okay, time for me to come up with some new ideas, then.
Post by: WillowLuman on March 05, 2014, 01:54:50 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 05, 2014, 02:00:10 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 05, 2014, 02:11:02 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 05, 2014, 09:07:24 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 05, 2014, 09:25:37 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 05, 2014, 10:17:30 am
We do, however, have Hel (probably the correct spelling for this incarnation of the concept) filled with "shades" of the past RAWs.
Post by: WillowLuman on March 05, 2014, 11:31:18 am
We have aquatic life than you might think. Much of it is large, but we still have a few fishable "vermin." Ammonites, Red Squid, Burdle, Trilobites, and Sea Ants. We could use some more, but it might be better if we kept actual fish a minority. Currently our oceans are filled mostly with insects, birds, cephalopods, and some dragons.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 05, 2014, 12:03:15 pm
@HugoLuman: What's wrong with fish? Eh. I'll hold back to just the main few species I really wanted to add then. ( Anglerfish, catfish, dogfish, giant catfish, and koi. )
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 05, 2014, 01:11:11 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on March 05, 2014, 01:15:23 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 05, 2014, 01:20:36 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 12:18:36 am
Their caste abilities shall reference their piece type.
Why? Because I can.
It will make my additions more interesting to say the least.
Though Phoenixs,(Phonei!), Centalopes, ice men, and secret music ability is pretty interesting already.
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 01:40:38 am
If music is a secret does that mean that my bards will attack fortresses like necromancers?
Post by: WillowLuman on March 06, 2014, 01:48:49 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 01:49:59 am
Didnt want my bards assaulting those people with poor musical taste.
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 02:25:20 am
Shoot.
Edit: Unless I make the ability to make the instrument a secret.
Would that work?
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 06:53:17 am
HUZZAH!
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 06, 2014, 09:32:57 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 06, 2014, 11:09:54 am
Also, the melting of the icemen was an intended feature, in case you didn't know.
Also ideas: there was one type of prehistoric shark which had a jaw so weird that people thought it was an ammonite at first. Current theories include it being a type of organic whip.
*humanoid zombie-esque creatures. No clothes, though. They're powerful enough as it is, what with their 50% chance of auto-resurrect.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 06, 2014, 11:29:40 am
Well yea, wouldn't be much of an iceman if it didn't melt!
Whoa. Strange. That would also be horrifying to fight, I'd think.
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 06, 2014, 01:04:27 pm
Thinking about it, I just realized that I cant make music both a secret AND make it require an instrument.
Shoot.
Edit: Unless I make the ability to make the instrument a secret.
Would that work?
Not really. Interactions cannot create items in any direct way, nor can they add reactions to entities/adventurers.
The only roundabout way I know of to get items from an interaction would be by having a corpse resurrected, then transformed into a creature that dies instantly, leaving behind the instrument as an item-corpse.
The only other way that I know of requires DFHack.
Also ideas: there was one type of prehistoric shark which had a jaw so weird that people thought it was an ammonite at first. Current theories include it being a type of organic whip.
If we are thinking of the same shark, then the saw-like jaw was just designed to help tear up food.
Though a shark with a tooth-lined whip in its mouth is a pretty terrifying idea.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 06, 2014, 01:24:46 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 06, 2014, 01:30:02 pm
If you mean saw-shaped, then no, but you're probably thinking of the same one. Just to check: the one you mean seems to have it's jaw rolled up in some way, right?
I mean this guy:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Though from what I can tell, scientists think that it likely looks more like this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
E: Though there is a shark known as the carpenter shark or sawfish, which has a long nose that resembles a double-sided saw.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 06, 2014, 01:39:16 pm
E: Though there is a shark known as the carpenter shark or sawfish, which has a long nose that resembles a double-sided saw.
That is one of the ones to which I referred.
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 01:52:03 pm
Long story short, dont piss off creatures made of ice.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 06, 2014, 02:00:29 pm
Also, yeah, that's the one I was thinking of. Even with a more reasonable interpretation of it's jaw, it still looks horrifying.
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 02:25:21 pm
The ice is brittle, but thick enough to block several attacks before shatfering
Five vs five resulted in no ice halfling casualties.
Due to the relative thickness of ice, the halflings are much smaller and weaker upon melting.
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 06:50:44 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 06, 2014, 07:15:22 pm
If I wanted to prevent a tissue from getting frostbite, what values would I need to change, and to what?
Set their materials to have a lower cold-damage point. To do this for every part of their body, give them the following:
Code: [Select]
[SELECT_MATERIAL:ALL]
[COLDDAM_POINT:NONE]
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 07:18:03 pm
My icepeople getting frostbitten isnt a good thing.
Post by: Urdothor on March 06, 2014, 10:49:49 pm
Edit. Spelling fixed
Post by: Urdothor on March 07, 2014, 02:12:09 am
Post by: WillowLuman on March 07, 2014, 03:33:52 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 07, 2014, 03:35:24 am
Edit, The wiki shows a slight difference but I wondered how far it extended.
Post by: WillowLuman on March 07, 2014, 04:01:45 am
All structural ice is the same. The different ice is the kind produced from frozen water globs/spatters, such as within an adventurer's waterskin in cold areas. Or from any creature that secretes solid water or emits it through interaction. A creature defined as being made of ice will use the structural kind, though.
Post by: Urdothor on March 07, 2014, 04:03:45 am
The wiki is a bit unclear, and a bit off on these things.
Post by: Urdothor on March 07, 2014, 06:13:24 pm
Once you get underground you are safe to heal your people.
Heres a question. Can melted off tissue be healed?
Post by: WillowLuman on March 07, 2014, 11:05:30 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 07, 2014, 11:08:11 pm
Time to melt some ice halflings(they are my placeholder creatures until I get the tissues figured out)
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 08, 2014, 07:17:55 am
Post by: WillowLuman on March 08, 2014, 03:07:21 pm
If the armor is just a tissue layer on top of the skin (and not a separate BP), then yes, but only if you set a time.Wait, what armor?
Post by: Urdothor on March 08, 2014, 03:30:55 pm
Post by: Gnorm on March 08, 2014, 03:40:44 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 08, 2014, 03:50:35 pm
I'm still bug fixing and finishing EVERYTHING.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 09, 2014, 11:28:22 am
Currently, I have the bodyplans for most of my creatures done, but I'm on a (forced) hiatus right now, and then I'll have to figure out the byzantine complexities of detail plans and writing the code for materials.
Post by: Symmetry on March 10, 2014, 05:27:00 pm
First I think I'll change the halflings back to dwarves. Sorry Halfing.
(later : that would've gone better if I hadn't used dfmm. but it sort of worked. I need to add beards now. Thanks for the work setting it up!)
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 11, 2014, 08:26:21 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 11, 2014, 12:34:52 pm
This looks fun. I think I'm going to take the minimal world and see what I can make with it as a way to learn modding. It should be easier to see the effects if there's nothing else in the way.Do you have any further plans for what to do with this world? Cause, if you modified the dwarves slightly, your version could act as a simple introduction to the DFfs' playing styles. I look forward to seeing what your world turns into.
First I think I'll change the halflings back to dwarves. Sorry Halfing.
(later : that would've gone better if I hadn't used dfmm. but it sort of worked. I need to add beards now. Thanks for the work setting it up!)
If there are any horribly hilarious bugs, please post the raws. If we took just some of the mistakes we've made during the course of this
Post by: Urdothor on March 14, 2014, 12:00:48 am
Its making everything take, FOREVER.
Half my glitches just seem to be me being to tired to properly right out the tags
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 18, 2014, 05:25:54 pm
I will be the one to make the crystal butterflies! And the crystal tortoises. And other crystal creatures...
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 18, 2014, 05:36:39 pm
I would like to take a turn soon, if I can. Good places still have nothing, right?
I will be the one to make the crystal butterflies! And the crystal tortoises. And other crystal creatures...
I'm not quite sure if we are even doing turns at the moment.
But yes, good regions are a bit empty at the moment.
Just going by the Github repository, it looks like they only really have a single plant (cognac grapes) and an interaction that makes it rain alcohol.
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 18, 2014, 05:51:55 pm
I would like to take a turn soon, if I can. Good places still have nothing, right?
I will be the one to make the crystal butterflies! And the crystal tortoises. And other crystal creatures...
I'm not quite sure if we are even doing turns at the moment.
But yes, good regions are a bit empty at the moment.
Just going by the Github repository, it looks like they only really have a single plant (cognac grapes) and an interaction that makes it rain alcohol.
Well, that's good. I guess I can just make my crystal things then. And add them later?
Do we have any gemstones now?
Post by: WillowLuman on March 18, 2014, 05:55:06 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 18, 2014, 06:41:04 pm
There is also one more that I've not counted, since it doesn't function like a normal gem.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 18, 2014, 07:08:17 pm
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8483
My mod is turning out to have a rather ambitious scope. It has reactions, fish, monsters, items, stones, and metals.
Post by: Urdothor on March 18, 2014, 08:08:24 pm
i've been busy...
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 18, 2014, 08:14:48 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 19, 2014, 07:08:07 pm
I could make the phoenix or the centalope into my megabeast, or do something else entirely...
Post by: PDF urist master on March 19, 2014, 10:55:13 pm
I wonder if it's possible to define different body parts out of different materials.
If you can, make a beast with a lion's body, a goat's head make of iron and a scorpion tail. give it a syndrome that causes full body necrosis.
Post by: Timeless Bob on March 19, 2014, 11:45:19 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on March 19, 2014, 11:48:38 pm
You need exploding potatoes. Bomb de Terre!Of all the things I was expecting to see today, a good French pun was not among them. Bravo, good sir.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 20, 2014, 08:13:15 am
Also, @PDF urist master: I'm making a rose chimera, does that count? ( I'm guessing no, but still thought I'd mention it. )
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 03:28:58 pm
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 20, 2014, 08:20:34 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 08:44:20 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 08:51:10 pm
Beer in this mod isnt really much of a good thing...Sorry 'bout that.
Heheheh
*Mastahcheese walks out*
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:07:31 pm
My icemen essentially frozen Russian Halflings.
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 20, 2014, 09:11:15 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:18:08 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 20, 2014, 09:29:15 pm
Vermin make hives if given the proper tokens. But non-vermin creatures cannot. Civilizations can live in caves, which can sort of be like a giant hive I suppose.
They can definitely be made of topaz though.
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:36:35 pm
If knowing the 'storyline' behind their concept would help I would be happy to explain them.
Edit. Second question, if I wanted to pull some species from the realworld(with modification), what time period best describes this world currently?
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 09:41:42 pm
How would a game like that run? It would be impossible to train anyone in anything, as they would only have a single year of adult life before dying.
That would be interesting to try... I may do that.
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:43:29 pm
If you raise their learning speeds high enough they can atleast be decent enough to defend themselfs before they die.
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 09:48:17 pm
Do we even have vampires in this mod?
Also, a race that dies in two years would likely breed very fast, with many offspring, so actually vampires would be a good thing, as you'd have the population to spare, and they could retain skills.
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:50:09 pm
Their population would explode so fast that their deaths wouldnt matter.
And there are vampires in the mod.
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 09:51:49 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:52:28 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 09:53:14 pm
If you don't then I might, it's been a while since I've modded, though.
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:53:59 pm
I shall make an uncultured swarm of pseudoRussians!
That die nearly instantly.
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 09:54:55 pm
Fear my death-booze!
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:55:40 pm
Icemanish Vodka for all!
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 09:56:09 pm
They shall be immune as they are blocks of icewrapped flesh!...Good point.
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 09:57:17 pm
They will have a guttural monosyllablic language.
Post by: Urdothor on March 20, 2014, 10:00:58 pm
Post by: nomoetoe on March 20, 2014, 10:05:15 pm
I made walrus men c:
Post by: mastahcheese on March 20, 2014, 10:09:21 pm
Can you set a child age of less than a year?I don't think so?
I may be wrong.
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 22, 2014, 06:20:56 pm
That depends. Are they vermin or full-sized creatures? Are they a civilization or are they wild?Vermin, I don't know how to make the hive give you a statue.
Vermin make hives if given the proper tokens. But non-vermin creatures cannot. Civilizations can live in caves, which can sort of be like a giant hive I suppose.
They can definitely be made of topaz though.
Actually I don't really know how a bee hive works.
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 22, 2014, 06:50:20 pm
That depends. Are they vermin or full-sized creatures? Are they a civilization or are they wild?Vermin, I don't know how to make the hive give you a statue.
Vermin make hives if given the proper tokens. But non-vermin creatures cannot. Civilizations can live in caves, which can sort of be like a giant hive I suppose.
They can definitely be made of topaz though.
[VERMIN_SOIL_COLONY] Will make them create their own hives in the wild.
[ARTIFICIAL_HIVEABLE] Will allow you to hive them like you can do with bees in a normal game of DF.
In a standard game, bees will produce royal jelly and honeycombs after about half of a year because of these tags:
[HIVE_PRODUCT:1:201600:TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_HONEYCOMB:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:WAX]
[HIVE_PRODUCT:1:201600:LIQUID_MISC:NONE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:ROYAL_JELLY]
The first argument in the tag controls how many items are produced.
The second argument is how long it takes in game ticks for the item to be produced. This should help explain how time is broken down, if you want to know. (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Time)
The next few tags are to define what items are produced, and if there is an item subtype that is used, and what material they are made of.
So if you want to produce a topaz statue, it would look something like this:
[HIVE_PRODUCT:1:201600:STATUE:NONE:INORGANIC:TOPAZ]
Though we don't actually have topaz in the game yet.
Post by: mastahcheese on March 22, 2014, 08:27:10 pm
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 22, 2014, 10:43:13 pm
Thanks, my attempts looked nothing like that...That depends. Are they vermin or full-sized creatures? Are they a civilization or are they wild?Vermin, I don't know how to make the hive give you a statue.
Vermin make hives if given the proper tokens. But non-vermin creatures cannot. Civilizations can live in caves, which can sort of be like a giant hive I suppose.
They can definitely be made of topaz though.
[VERMIN_SOIL_COLONY] Will make them create their own hives in the wild.
[ARTIFICIAL_HIVEABLE] Will allow you to hive them like you can do with bees in a normal game of DF.
In a standard game, bees will produce royal jelly and honeycombs after about half of a year because of these tags:
[HIVE_PRODUCT:1:201600:TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_HONEYCOMB:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:WAX]
[HIVE_PRODUCT:1:201600:LIQUID_MISC:NONE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:ROYAL_JELLY]
The first argument in the tag controls how many items are produced.
The second argument is how long it takes in game ticks for the item to be produced. This should help explain how time is broken down, if you want to know. (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Time)
The next few tags are to define what items are produced, and if there is an item subtype that is used, and what material they are made of.
So if you want to produce a topaz statue, it would look something like this:
[HIVE_PRODUCT:1:201600:STATUE:NONE:INORGANIC:TOPAZ]
Though we don't actually have topaz in the game yet.
Ok, I might just have them make soul crystal statues...
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 23, 2014, 09:08:42 am
...If you made honey bees as the playable race, could they hive themselves? What would they be counted as, citizens or vermin or pets?Probably wouldn't work (the vermin tag would probably contradict the playable tag), but, if not, I think they'd be counted as both citizens and vermin. Also, I think they'd be capable of teleporting and randomly generating and dissapearing. Your fort might end immediately if you don't set orders.
Too bad we can't just make a race of ants which possess a vermin and a full-sized caste. Actually, making a type of vermin which can transform themselves into a miniscule "proper" creature would be great for making creatures with ridiculously high breeding rates. Probably would be worse than cats.
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 23, 2014, 12:49:45 pm
Citizens will show up in the pet/livestock menu instead of the normal citizen menu. Vermin hunters will not hunt them, which I find even more odd. They will behave more like normal creatures instead of vermin, and don't flicker in and out of existence on a whim like vermin do. I can even (v)iew them. Though you can only view their description, they have no thoughts, no relations menu, etc.
You cannot appoint anyone as a noble or as military. According to the neighbour menu on the embark screen everyone is hostile or cannot trade, but that may be because the vermin I used cannot speak or learn. And they cannot seem to do tasks, but that was probably because the vermin I used couldn't grasp.
Too bad we can't just make a race of ants which possess a vermin and a full-sized caste. Actually, making a type of vermin which can transform themselves into a miniscule "proper" creature would be great for making creatures with ridiculously high breeding rates. Probably would be worse than cats.
Regular vermin cannot use interactions, unless it is an interaction spread through an attack they have, such as a bee's sting. I don't know if it would work different for civ-vermin, though.
Post by: mastahcheese on March 23, 2014, 03:51:26 pm
We must do SCIENCE! of the non-flaming variety!
Post by: Urdothor on March 23, 2014, 03:59:12 pm
Theres no such thing.
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 23, 2014, 04:00:50 pm
The neighbour menu on embark showed trade possibilities as well.
I completely forgot how important intelligence was. This isn't quite new info; we've known about non-intelligent civ members being pets for awhile now, I just completely spaced on that fact while I was screwing around. Verm-Fort may actually be possible. I have a grasp-capable ant pulling fish up from a nearby pond.
Post by: Urdothor on March 23, 2014, 04:04:39 pm
Post by: Poldon on March 23, 2014, 04:38:06 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 23, 2014, 04:42:15 pm
I'm really curious what vermin civ combat looks like. Can they be attacked? Will enemies show up and have no idea how to fight your citizens properly?
A wild eagle killed three ants by barely tapping them.
They are so small that they have next to no blood, so they bleed out near instantaneously. They don't even produce a spatter.
One broke its leg and just sort of expired right then.
They also leave standard corpses instead of vermin remains.
Post by: Poldon on March 23, 2014, 04:43:47 pm
A wild eagle killed three ants by barely tapping them.
They are so small that they have next to no blood, so they bleed out near instantaneously. They don't even produce a spatter.
One broke its leg and just sort of expired right then.
For some reason I found this so hilarious I actually kinda want to play it. Maybe make vanilla dwarves into vermin and never have to run a hospital again.
Post by: mastahcheese on March 23, 2014, 04:57:45 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on March 23, 2014, 09:42:20 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on March 23, 2014, 09:51:36 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 24, 2014, 08:57:34 am
To avoid Formic similarities, please don't make these guys playable. It'd be too easy, anyway, although the fact that they'd need to be slow would help balance things.
Post by: WillowLuman on March 24, 2014, 12:55:59 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 24, 2014, 02:57:50 pm
At any rate, if that's how [VERMIN_HUNTER] works, the ludicrously high breeding rate will be necessary, or else entire forts will be slaughtered by a single tarantula. Does [VERMIN_HUNTER] still work if the vermin is intelligent and civilized?
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 24, 2014, 03:05:01 pm
I know that. I just wondered if there was any difference in the way size was assigned. I think I just misread something somewhere.
At any rate, if that's how [VERMIN_HUNTER] works, the ludicrously high breeding rate will be necessary, or else entire forts will be slaughtered by a single tarantula. Does [VERMIN_HUNTER] still work if the vermin is intelligent and civilized?
As I mentioned earlier, my little guys were ignored by the cats that were brought along. I'm hoping that the same can be said for wild vermin hunters that wander onto the map.
Intelligence won't matter to a vermin hunter, and vermin hunters will even go after pet vermin. But civ-vermin seem to be treated as full creatures, so they would be ignored. One of the cats seemed to be following some of the ants around the map, but I'd chalk that up to them just wandering around like they normally do without a pasture or a meeting zone to go to.
Post by: mastahcheese on March 24, 2014, 07:02:26 pm
Post by: tahujdt on March 26, 2014, 03:30:51 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on March 27, 2014, 01:04:50 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 27, 2014, 03:29:37 pm
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 27, 2014, 08:41:15 pm
but, more importantly, I finished the ants.
Ants:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Edit - The bombus still have their whole abdomen shaved off, and I found Plankton muscle and burdle mutilated corpses in the fishery when I tested. Did you know formics cannot make nest boxes?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on March 28, 2014, 11:38:15 am
Post by: WillowLuman on March 28, 2014, 07:17:55 pm
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 29, 2014, 01:24:00 pm
but it should be easy to give them [CREATURE_CLASS:INORGANIC]
Post by: BlackFlyme on March 29, 2014, 03:04:49 pm
Spoiler: All Of Our Current Classes (click to show/hide)
Classes are a way of organizing creatures, and can be used to specify what creatures an interaction can and cannot affect. Vermin cannot be affected by interactions, to my knowledge, but it would still be helpful to categorize them, in case we need a list of certain types of creatures for whatever reason.
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on March 29, 2014, 04:35:55 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on March 29, 2014, 04:42:50 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 29, 2014, 08:12:21 pm
Once I get it nerfed i can move on
Post by: PDF urist master on March 30, 2014, 07:35:43 am
Post by: Urdothor on March 30, 2014, 01:50:24 pm
Post by: Aseaheru on March 30, 2014, 02:24:11 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 30, 2014, 02:27:31 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on March 30, 2014, 08:23:29 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on March 30, 2014, 11:44:09 pm
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on March 31, 2014, 12:27:56 pm
Post by: Urdothor on March 31, 2014, 12:34:06 pm
I better go test that.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 01, 2014, 10:36:55 am
It surprises me that bacon isn't a metal/gem yet.
Adding in bacon dragons as a crunchy and delicious mode of defense now. Should they have the ability to fire bacon as a boulder or just the fat as a liquid?
Post by: WillowLuman on April 01, 2014, 01:35:11 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 01, 2014, 02:32:15 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 01, 2014, 02:51:13 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on April 01, 2014, 05:47:25 pm
That sounds good, but why not just make a reaction "Process flesh to bacon" so we can still have other meats? Also... I don't know when ( or if ) I'll get back to working on my contributions, anyone want me to just send in the unfinished raws and work them instead?I wasn't suggesting replacing the muscle with bacon. Just adding bacon. In order to have specific bacon, you need to put bacon in the material/tissue templates (once again, adding it, not replacing meat or muscle), just like how leather needs its own template in order to be named according to the creature that gives it. Like with skin->leather, you might not need an actual bacon tissue, or for there to be any on the living creature, but you do need the material in the creature's material list. It could be and EBO (extra butcher object).
Too bad. I just thought it would be funny to have dragons that an adventurer (or a fortress inhabitant) could eat rather than the reverse. Are there any ideas for stuff to make the wildlife more survivable, though?Anything that has flesh (and some things that don't technically) you can eat. Same in vanilla DF. You just have to kill it first. It's not like all wildlife has poisonous or inedible meat (just the lizard folk really). If you meant edible as in easily killable, we already have several creatures that aren't too hard to kill. Could use a few more, though.
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 02, 2014, 06:57:12 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 02, 2014, 08:08:14 am
That sounds good, but why not just make a reaction "Process flesh to bacon" so we can still have other meats? Also... I don't know when ( or if ) I'll get back to working on my contributions, anyone want me to just send in the unfinished raws and work them instead?I wasn't suggesting replacing the muscle with bacon. Just adding bacon. In order to have specific bacon, you need to put bacon in the material/tissue templates (once again, adding it, not replacing meat or muscle), just like how leather needs its own template in order to be named according to the creature that gives it. Like with skin->leather, you might not need an actual bacon tissue, or for there to be any on the living creature, but you do need the material in the creature's material list. It could be and EBO (extra butcher object).
Oh, gotcha. I understand now.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 02, 2014, 10:35:58 am
Can i also try to contribute to this mod? I'm not that good at modding, so I'll just be Doing basic things like expanding the wildlife and adding plants.Sure. Just make something from scratch (or with the templates provided by the mod, just don't use any raws from vanilla) and post it.
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 02, 2014, 01:39:34 pm
Arena testing
After some arena testing, these were the results:
There are 1.8 (unequipped and untrained) halflings needed to kill a Dune Crocodile
There are 2.5 (unequipped and untrained) clockworkers needed to kill a Dune Crocodile
There are 3.75 (unequipped and untrained) lizardfolk needed to kill a Dune Crocodile
Butchery:
Butchering a Dune Crocodile will give you:
1x bone stack of 39 bones
1x bone stack of 38 bones (i didn't even know you could get multiple bone stacks from creatures but whatever)
1x stack of 40 muscles
1x stack of 33 fat
1x teeth
1x organs
1x skull
1x cartilage
1x nervous tissue
should I post the raws here right now or post them another time?
Post by: Urdothor on April 02, 2014, 01:57:22 pm
Arena testing is giving me some rather odd results. I think I screwed up one of my values because random hits seem to be completely shattering armor randomly.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 02, 2014, 04:29:00 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 02, 2014, 05:31:12 pm
So many giant armored squid things... the horror...
Panserblekks have killed 9/10 of all my adventurers...
Maybe I just walk in the wrong places
Edit:Arent they herbivores though?
Why am I getting completely screwed up by them?
Post by: WillowLuman on April 02, 2014, 05:44:10 pm
If they kill you because you picked a fight with them, though, it's not really a problem. Don't pick on animals that are much larger than you unless you have a good plan.
Post by: Urdothor on April 02, 2014, 05:53:39 pm
I attacked one of the new crab things(rygic?) but thats it.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 02, 2014, 05:54:38 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 02, 2014, 06:02:44 pm
I did come close only once that I know of
Post by: WillowLuman on April 02, 2014, 06:06:00 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 02, 2014, 08:17:54 pm
I'll check the raws I have.
Maybe I screwed something up
Post by: WillowLuman on April 02, 2014, 08:23:44 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 02, 2014, 08:24:58 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 02, 2014, 08:26:28 pm
I throw things at my enemies. Maybe I missed them...
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 03, 2014, 06:20:18 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 03, 2014, 08:33:17 am
Would it be too silly to make coprolite a gem?
Probably not. What's coprolite?
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on April 03, 2014, 09:02:19 am
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 03, 2014, 09:31:42 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Code: [Select]
[INORGANIC:COPROLITE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_TEMPLATE_HLG]
[TILE:15][IS_GEM:coprolite:STP:OVERWRITE_SOLID][DISPLAY_COLOR:0:0:1][MATERIAL_VALUE:20]
[ENVIRONMENT:ALL_STONE:CLUSTER_SMALL:100]
[SOLID_DENSITY:2200] copied from petrified wood
[STATE_COLOR:ALL_SOLID:BLACK]
Post by: WillowLuman on April 03, 2014, 11:41:16 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 03, 2014, 01:46:11 pm
On a different note, I suspect our coprolites would come from the errorVespulae* if it weren't for the fact that their digestive systems probably weren't connected by that point.
*Fossils of these are one of the things I'm adding for my turn.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 03, 2014, 01:51:37 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 03, 2014, 02:09:08 pm
Post by: mastahcheese on April 03, 2014, 02:10:52 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 03, 2014, 03:27:45 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on April 03, 2014, 05:42:10 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 03, 2014, 06:07:55 pm
E: We are talking about blood, right?
Post by: WillowLuman on April 03, 2014, 06:12:04 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 03, 2014, 06:16:49 pm
MOAR EDIT: New bug: instead of bleeding hemolymph like I'd intended, it seems Water Striders bleed molten glass. I...I'm not sure how I did that.
Water striders, apparently. I'm not sure if that is more or less horrific though.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 04, 2014, 08:33:18 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 04, 2014, 10:29:53 am
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 05, 2014, 05:26:05 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 05, 2014, 10:11:22 am
Post by: Timeless Bob on April 05, 2014, 11:54:13 am
Post by: WillowLuman on April 05, 2014, 12:34:48 pm
Two or three sapient species, the red goo blob thingies, some other stuff. I'd say it's relatively little.We've got the Horsemen (made of lava I think), reaver ants, gnomes (with primitive muskets), and some other stuff. Could use more, if you want.
Now that's an interesting idea: A DF world where all the mobile life is also sentient, but only the elves have "do not eat sentient beings" as their ethics. Get a whole prey/predator/scavenger cycle going...In this mod, though, the elves are even creepier cannibals. They're not born, but rather pieced together from carrion that has rotted in the forest.
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 05, 2014, 02:54:02 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 05, 2014, 05:33:53 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 05, 2014, 07:11:31 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 05, 2014, 08:11:18 pm
Oh if there's little underground life, I'll be focusing on those creatures. Does anyone like the idea of cave lynxes and albino owls?
We don't have regular lynxes or regular owls, last I checked. These cavern variants would be the main branch of the species. It's a funny enough idea that I say go for it :D
Post by: Urdothor on April 06, 2014, 07:06:15 pm
I really hate the people I Oversee apparently.
Post by: nomoetoe on April 08, 2014, 07:42:03 pm
Also this needs more walrus, Lots more walrus. Pweex? C:
Post by: WillowLuman on April 08, 2014, 07:44:18 pm
The more I read the morevoluptuousscrumptious I get.
Also this needs more walrus, Lots more walrus. Pweex? C:
I already have the equivalent of seals and leopard seals in bird form. Think large, ferocious penguin-like birds. So Pinniped-like bodyplan, but birds. I suppose you could come up with a walrus equivalent. Tusked Skurl, maybe.
Or maybe you could do something else with the walrus. I put birds in the sea, maybe you can put walruses on land.
Post by: nomoetoe on April 08, 2014, 08:33:58 pm
Quote
I already have the equivalent of seals and leopard seals in bird form. Think large, ferocious penguin-like birds. So Pinniped-like bodyplan, but birds. I suppose you could come up with a walrus equivalent. Tusked Skurl, maybe.
Or maybe you could do something else with the walrus. I put birds in the sea, maybe you can put walruses on land.
That is an idea, now I just have to get good at modding. :3 (I only recently got good enough to make a creature that doesn't collapse and die in seconds/be overpowered beyond belief.)
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 08, 2014, 11:02:53 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on April 08, 2014, 11:04:03 pm
Walruses (Walri?) are already only semi-aquatic, aren't they? Or are you suggesting some sort of mountain walrus?Precisely. Walruses spend most of their time in the water and are ungainly upon land, so land walrus still works.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 09, 2014, 12:23:09 pm
Sound good?
Post by: WillowLuman on April 09, 2014, 02:51:06 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 09, 2014, 03:23:41 pm
I'm thinking of having it just cause numbness. Would that be overpowered if they were covered in numbness causing liquid?
Its probably not. Just wanting an opinion. Thats all.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 09, 2014, 03:24:50 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 09, 2014, 03:26:03 pm
So numbness causing ax swinging savages.
Sounds good.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 09, 2014, 03:29:08 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 09, 2014, 03:31:04 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 10, 2014, 08:40:01 pm
One: Is it possible to make burnable incense that produces an aroma cloud that behaves like mist and gives happiness?
Two: Is it possible to add tags that require a building to be built on the surface.
Three: Any advice on what I should be working on now that I have some spare time?
Post by: Urdothor on April 10, 2014, 09:07:45 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on April 10, 2014, 09:16:33 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 01:28:56 pm
Okay for number three, try filling up the oceans and cold places with less deadly species. The tundras are boring right now...
Barren places don't necessarily need to be full of life. Variety is always nice but constant wildlife isn't necessary. Just keep the population density down somewhat.
Mmm... Yea, I intended to make many more fish. Among other things. By the way. I'm adding potatoes and vodka, so don't anybody else do it.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 11, 2014, 02:33:25 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 04:30:42 pm
That fits my Russian Icemen theme....
Thats good.
I'll give my ice men the ability to make your vodka when your done.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 06:14:20 pm
Go ahead and fill up the oceans all you want. But it doesn't necessarily have to be boring old fish. If it's gotta be fish, make them cool unusual fish, like extinct ones or completely original ones.
Sorry, I'm just not winning the creativity. I have got unique other things, but mostly boring regular fish in the fish. I was just thinking in terms of catching fish for food. Especially with all these creatures that supposedly eat fish.
Potatoes and vodka!
That fits my Russian Icemen theme....
Thats good.
I'll give my ice men the ability to make your vodka when your done.
Sure! Just so long as vodka.
---
Anyway, elsewhere. I'm making a race of humanoid vampire hunters, with like sun obsessed culture and fanaticism. They're called "Solar Children" and I haven't well developed them yet. However, noone ever answered my question. Is there anyway to force a building to require light?
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 06:20:47 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 06:22:49 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 06:24:49 pm
If you need creativity for fish I have plenty of ideas to give.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 06:28:10 pm
Sorry...
If you need creativity for fish I have plenty of ideas to give.
Ah well, the challenge of an artist is working within the confines of a medium.
Sure! Go ahead. Cos like... I'm just thinking of real life fish like trout and stuff. ( I'm going to add Marlin and Catfish no matter what, but I'd like to be more creative about the generic food fish. ) Also, fish will be the first body template I've ever made, so feel free to check my work when I upload it.
Post by: Timeless Bob on April 11, 2014, 06:35:52 pm
How about requiring the "outside" tag? Sorta the inverse of chairs or beds that require the "inside" tag to be true to be built, perhaps it forbids when the "inside" flag is present...
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 06:37:41 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 11, 2014, 06:44:12 pm
Re: Solar Forge requiring light
How about requiring the "outside" tag? Sorta the inverse of chairs or beds that require the "inside" tag to be true to be built, perhaps it forbids when the "inside" flag is present...
That's not something you could do with the raws though. Maybe with DFHack, but I'm not sure, plus I think it's already been agreed to not mod in anything that requires DFHack.
What type of fish do you want? Vermin fish or the other kind?
I'm guessing vermin, since those are the only kind that can be caught and cooked in vanilla.
Some of the deep sea fish are interesting, or terrifying, depending on how you look at them.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 06:45:33 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on April 11, 2014, 07:02:10 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 07:07:49 pm
I would but my contributions are seriously delayed for now.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 07:14:00 pm
Someone do foot long triops! Like seriously.
I would but my contributions are seriously delayed for now.
Sure! I'll give it a shot.
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 07:14:55 pm
72 legs. Long narrow body with armor.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 07:23:51 pm
Three eyes. Breathing through skin.
72 legs. Long narrow body with armor.
Mmhmm... I'm downloading the Wikipedia page. I can see why you like them.
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 07:25:45 pm
They are awesome.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 08:31:49 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 08:52:51 pm
For awhile triops feed themselves... Cannibals.
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 08:58:31 pm
No actual fish yet?
For awhile triops feed themselves... Cannibals.
Oh wow? Really?
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 09:00:01 pm
Outta thirty-fourty that hatch you get 3-5 large ones.
There eggs can last huge amounts of time without water
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 09:04:07 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 09:08:46 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 11, 2014, 09:14:57 pm
Carnivore and bone carnivore will make it so that you cannot eat plants.
Specific food lets you specify a certain plant or animal that can be eaten. This is used for pandas and red pandas in vanilla, who can only feed on the various types of bamboo.
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 09:21:10 pm
Can you set specific food and carnivore?
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 11, 2014, 09:29:25 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 09:31:34 pm
Idea... make a creature that only eats a certain creature, that only eats it.
A tiny food web circle
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 11, 2014, 09:55:54 pm
Can you set several specific foods?
Yep. Just add another SPECIFIC_FOOD token. Like this:
Code: (Taken from pandas) [Select]
[SPECIFIC_FOOD:PLANT:BAMBOO, ARROW]
[SPECIFIC_FOOD:PLANT:BAMBOO, GOLDEN]
[SPECIFIC_FOOD:PLANT:BAMBOO, HEDGE]I suppose for a creature it would be something like [SPECIFIC_FOOD:CREATURE:DWARF]
Post by: Urdothor on April 11, 2014, 09:57:12 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 12, 2014, 09:19:20 pm
And it boiled instantly...
Might need to balance my temperatures a tad better...
Post by: PDF urist master on April 13, 2014, 09:02:13 am
EDIT: I've made the creature now. It's made of and uses basalt as a weapon, but I don't think this world has basalt. if you guys want to use it, just switch basalt for any other in game stone. This is actually the first creature I've ever made.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 13, 2014, 09:47:05 am
Post by: PDF urist master on April 13, 2014, 10:08:19 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on April 13, 2014, 02:36:30 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on April 13, 2014, 03:11:59 pm
also what is this society called?
Post by: WillowLuman on April 13, 2014, 04:57:16 pm
If it's a megabeast or semimegabeast, then that's fine I suppose. I don't think we have a single semimegabeast.
Post by: PDF urist master on April 13, 2014, 08:26:40 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on April 13, 2014, 11:06:37 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 14, 2014, 08:16:08 am
Post by: PDF urist master on April 14, 2014, 11:08:41 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 14, 2014, 11:11:03 am
Post by: WillowLuman on April 14, 2014, 03:04:58 pm
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 14, 2014, 07:25:48 pm
Well, you could give the plant several similar but slightly modified syndromes, each designed to only infect certain creatures, thus allowing it to lengthen everyone's life.
That's a pretty good idea actually! Thanks Hugo. However, I probably will only have it infect entity races if that's the case. Meaning that each subsequent race addition will have to be set to be affected by it.
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 15, 2014, 10:08:45 am
(http://snag.gy/qkw9G.jpg)
These are the castes I've currently added. Does anyone have ideas for more castes? Also, to what creature classes should I add them?
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 15, 2014, 10:17:56 am
Because I'm too lazy to mod in several similar creatures, I decided to make a basic creature and just add castes that are the different "Species". All of the creatures are vermin shellfish that can only be found in caves. (caves in DFscratch still have water in it, right?)
-snippy-
These are the castes I've currently added. Does anyone have ideas for more castes? Also, to what creature classes should I add them?
No idea for castes, but there are a number of creature classes that may apply. Aquatic and vermin seem the most obvious, but feel free to create your own, if needed.
Spoiler: All Of Our Current Classes (click to show/hide)
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 15, 2014, 11:00:57 am
I've never created a class before, how does this work? Will [CREATURE_CLASS:name of the class I want] just create a new class?
-snip- but feel free to create your own, if needed.
-another snip-
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 15, 2014, 11:06:16 am
I've never created a class before, how does this work? Will [CREATURE_CLASS:name of the class I want] just create a new class?
-snip- but feel free to create your own, if needed.
-another snip-
Pretty much. Classes are whatever you want them to be.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 15, 2014, 11:10:16 am
Fish should also be FISH, feel free to add the relevant classes to the others.
Be warned, though, that since they all share a population, being the same technical creature, that if you overfish one, they all disappear from the area. To counter this, give them an extremely large population density. Oh, and to avoid weirdness, you might want to make male and female versions of each caste.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 15, 2014, 11:36:40 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 15, 2014, 01:20:37 pm
You'll need ORGANIC for all of them, VERTEBRATE for the fish, and INVERTEBRATE for everything else.
Fish should also be FISH, feel free to add the relevant classes to the others.
Be warned, though, that since they all share a population, being the same technical creature, that if you overfish one, they all disappear from the area. To counter this, give them an extremely large population density. Oh, and to avoid weirdness, you might want to make male and female versions of each caste.
Guys, why not just make several species that import the traits of the first instead of trying for a 20-caste species?
Post by: Urdothor on April 17, 2014, 08:13:33 pm
I'm trying really hard to increase the amount of time that I get to mod. I have so many ideas that are just waiting to come to
life in this mod.
Post by: PDF urist master on April 18, 2014, 03:48:20 pm
I was thinking of a final boss type of creature, stronger than all current megabeasts but rarer because its locked in the caves.
I guess it would be like a FB, but FBs have really variable lethality.
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 18, 2014, 09:33:56 pm
I say go ahead and try it. If it works, maybe we can do a personal megabeast thing for the caverns, too.
Post by: Gnorm on April 18, 2014, 09:42:58 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 18, 2014, 09:48:13 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 19, 2014, 08:51:32 am
Post by: PDF urist master on April 19, 2014, 09:21:45 am
The main danger would be its massive size (200,000,000 cm^3, same size as a giant sperm whale), immunity to stun and pain, high natural skill in biting and dodging (skill = 6, ie talented) as well as the tag [NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT], which would prevent instant kill attacks to the brain (though attacks to the heart is still fair game). Also it's trap avoid, because cage traps are kinda cheap.
Post by: PDF urist master on April 19, 2014, 09:23:35 am
I kinda have an idea for a creature with webs. basically, It's completely incapable of harming you (size 1000cm^3) but also completely invulnerable to damage (could be made of meteoritic iron to make this a reality). it will be non hostile, but if you provoke it, it will keep shooting webs at you until you starve to death.
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 19, 2014, 11:12:53 am
The nidhogg creature sounds like something to avoid at all costs. If anything, it's more OP than the meteoric iron web-shooters. Try making it into a non-hostile creature, albeit a very large one. Maybe lower it's natural skills a bit too.
Post by: PDF urist master on April 19, 2014, 12:29:37 pm
the demonic spiders, are a little OP, which is why I think they work better as non hostiles. I guess it would make sense for them to be really rare, seeing how they're essentially alien lifeforms dropped from meteorites. [FREQUENCY:1] should ensure that you rarely see them, if ever. You can train them to be on your side and they are not trap avoid. seeing how rare these little buggers are, especially once even more creatures start popping up, I think it should be fair.
I'm not very familiar with the tissue templates in modding, which really sucks since I really want them to be in DFFS
Post by: WillowLuman on April 19, 2014, 12:43:12 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on April 19, 2014, 01:26:23 pm
here's the raws, for anyone who wants to experiment further.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on April 19, 2014, 08:16:07 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on April 20, 2014, 02:20:36 am
Post by: PDF urist master on April 20, 2014, 05:42:07 am
does anyone have the material properties for meteoric iron that i can use?
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 20, 2014, 09:44:46 am
Post by: PDF urist master on April 20, 2014, 04:04:48 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I used the balanced elemental schematic for the tissue layers (rock on the outside, flesh on the inside). it should work fairly well. I've also finished the raws for the meteorite spider using meteoritic iron as the new tissue template.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Lost in Nowhere on April 20, 2014, 10:20:37 pm
Code: [Select]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SILK:SILK_TEMPLATE]Code: [Select]
[BODY:SPIDER:2EYES:HEART:GUTS:BRAIN:MOUTH]
Post by: PDF urist master on April 20, 2014, 10:42:50 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on April 20, 2014, 11:54:40 pm
1) download a fresh copy of DF
2) delete the contents of the raws folder
3) install the current release of this mod.
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 23, 2014, 09:32:10 am
I pitted a Panserblekk and a Dwarven Shadow against each other. It wasn't even a contest - the 'blekk pulverized the shadow. Didn't get touched once. The shadow ended the fight completely dismembered, and from the combat logs it seems the 'blekk actually killed it by ripping its arms off, Wookie-style, and pummeling the rest of its limbs off piecemeal - first a foot, then the lower leg, another foot, the upper leg - until it finished off the hellspawned being carved from near indestructible shadows by pummeling it in half.
Is it something about that pummel attack? Are they just really, really big? Is it speed? I have to admit I haven't played with some of the recent additions, and I don't have the time to investigate the raws right now.
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 23, 2014, 02:04:21 pm
But their attacks don't have any velocity modifiers. Pummels have a much smaller contact size than normal though, which focuses the hit much more. Their bites are smaller as well, though not as small as their pummels.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 23, 2014, 02:28:48 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 23, 2014, 02:57:46 pm
I didn't think I'd find an organic beast capable of defeating these shades in combat. It's fascinating to watch. I've got to see how one fares against the Vespulae...
Post by: WillowLuman on April 23, 2014, 03:03:55 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 23, 2014, 03:07:14 pm
They prove remarkably resilient to lava euthanasia it seems, but that might be because I'm doing it wrong. I got it encased on try 3. Commencing treelord testing.
EDIT: Yeah, treelords retain the title of King of Beasts. It landed two shots on the Panserblekk's eyes and then just endured while the blekk bled out. I'll have to test a few dragons against a blekk when I get home.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 23, 2014, 03:12:50 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 23, 2014, 04:07:03 pm
EDIT: Okay, lava dragon = mutual annihilation. The blekk ripped the dragon's wrist off and caused the dragon to bleed out a few steps before it was burned to a crisp. Too close to accurately call, more tests doing.
EDIT2: Science has been conducted.
In total, fifteen trials were conducted where the first male entry in the list of Adder's Magma Dragon was pitted against a male panserblekk. Distance between the combatants at start was held constant at four (4) tiles. All tests were conducted on level ground with several z-levels of open air above, and at the end of each trial not resulting in the deaths of both combatants, the victor was euthanized via obsidian encasement or, in one case, isolated by being sealed in a tunnel after managing to flee, and in another case via death by Giant Squid. Environmental hazards such as water and magma were kept away from combatant pairs to avoid giving the flight-capable dragons an unfair advantage.
The results recorded were as follows:
- Out of fifteen (15) trials, the Panserblekk outright won only a single (1) trial, victory being defined as "not bleeding out within ten seconds of the opponent".
- Out of fifteen trials, Adder's Magma Dragon outright won six (6) matches, although one was very close (Victor condition summarized thus: "His head is smashed open. His skull is broken.").
- Out of fifteen trials, a draw resulted in eight (8.) matches, with both combatants dying within ten seconds of each other.
- Out of those eight trials, all eight saw the dragon dying first, and could conceivably be counted as Panserblekk wins.
The dragon won 40% of the matches, the Panserblekk 6.7%, and a draw favorable to the blekk resulted 53.3% of the time.
Based on this data, I would conclude that a magma dragon can mostly hold its own against a panserblekk, winning outright 40% of the time. However, if the draws are counted as Panserblekk victories, the Panserblekk would appear to be more than a match for Adder's Magma Dragon, winning 60% of all battles fought. Terrain would have an impact, of course - blekks might win more in the tunnels, or at least force mutual death - and if the dragon was canny and simply flew out of the blekk's range, its fireballs would make short work of the beast. Under arena conditions though, they're pretty evenly matched.
So yeah, science supports that Panserblekks are like flightless dragons that come in herds. That one Panserblekk victory, by the way? It was because the dragon missed its opening fireball and the blekk eviscerated it before it could lob a second :) Pleasant creatures!
EDIT3: And whoever made the Wailing Maid creature, or the creature that's a caste of, that thing seems to be very effective at killing Panserblekks in large groups. The blekk literally froze to death just trying to kill them all - its lungs went to ice and it suffocated. Impressive.
Post by: Urdothor on April 23, 2014, 09:35:23 pm
Can i do the same thing with blood?
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 23, 2014, 10:22:58 pm
So... i know the dirigible antelope explode gas when the sac is hit..
Can i do the same thing with blood?
Yes, though it wouldn't be exactly the same as the blood in the creature.
It could be the exact same material, but the properties would be slightly different, as it would act as a tissue would, and would have no bearing on the base blood within the body.
There may be an issue with the blood tissue bleeding. Though setting the tissue's vascular to zero will keep that from happening.
Post by: Urdothor on April 24, 2014, 07:34:11 am
Thats all i wanted to know
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 24, 2014, 11:58:33 am
What are the Wailing Maids exactly? I thought they were made by the same guy who made the elements of balance.
Post by: squidgen on April 24, 2014, 07:34:01 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 24, 2014, 07:51:29 pm
I just read the entire thread and... Wow. This is awesome. I came up with a bunch of things to add, but then I remembered I don't know how to mod. At all. Oh well, I'll defenately be following this.
Try it anyways! The wiki's got lists and explanations of usage for every token, and past that we've kinda gotten used to debugging things in this thread :D I didn't know how to mod except for a hazy, foggy notion in the beginning anyways, and I still managed to contribute a good chunk. Hands-on is the best way to learn.
And on an unrelated note, I'm starting to tinker with inorganic, crystalline and rock lifeforms to further populate the underground and surface. Materials testing progresses nicely; I have a few ideas for some...fun...critters. Hopefully, magma can be used as a blood material in the same way water can be milkable.
EDIT: Looked back into the past and spotted my personal megabeast, the Sleeper in the Dark, which never seems to have made it in-game :-\ I'll include it when I upload some inorganic critters.
EDIT2 IDEA: Oh God, I'm laughing. We've got all these weird fusions of animals - seaigos and such - and nobody thought to fuse an electric eel and a sheep? An Electric Sheep? Since my conception of inorganic life is sorta like androids, we should really have some electric sheep for them to dream of!
Post by: Urdothor on April 24, 2014, 08:38:41 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 25, 2014, 05:23:58 am
Post by: TheFlame52 on April 25, 2014, 02:35:57 pm
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 25, 2014, 02:43:22 pm
I'm thinking of joining with no context, for the hilarity. Before I actually do so, do you have any coded demons? Creatures (especially terrifying ones) are my specialty.
Off the top of my head I know there are shadows in the HFS. I could do a quick look through the repository though.
E: There's also a Hell Dragon. There's a dragon just about everywhere, so it's no surprise. That's all I found for now.
Post by: TheFlame52 on April 25, 2014, 02:57:12 pm
Post by: Urdothor on April 25, 2014, 03:15:41 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on April 26, 2014, 06:43:12 pm
Post by: squidgen on April 26, 2014, 07:10:26 pm
Anyways, is there a way to give body parts sharpness?
Post by: WillowLuman on April 26, 2014, 07:13:06 pm
I feel like a mod like this has to have a phallic shaped monster for a megabeast.A phallus? How mundane! How about the concept of sexuality itself, manifest as a whirling ideomorph, absorbing the sexuality of every living thing and leaving them infertile?
I've been reading the wiki a bit on modding, and it seems manageable, if a bit difficult. I was kind of disappointed that even when they are natural swimmers, creatures won't path through it.You can give a part an attack, as each creature attack comes from a specific part, and make it an edged attack, with whatever edged properties you want, but it would only be sharp for the purposes of that attack.
Anyways, is there a way to give body parts sharpness?
Post by: Urdothor on April 26, 2014, 08:16:25 pm
Though, that was a great response Hugo.
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 26, 2014, 09:11:33 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on April 26, 2014, 09:32:08 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 26, 2014, 09:42:29 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 26, 2014, 09:56:27 pm
Code: [Select]
[CREATURE:EELECTRIC_SHEEP]
[NAME:eelectric sheep:eelectric sheep:eelectric sheep]
[CASTE_NAME:eelectric sheep:eelectric sheep:eelectric sheep]
[CREATURE_TILE:'s'][COLOR:7:0:1]
[DESCRIPTION:A metallic creature like a sheep with an eel's head, covered in crysteel wool. It has special organs allowing it to shock an attacker when provoked.]
[PREFSTRING:soothing baas][PREFSTRING:electrified wool]
[NOCTURNAL]
[CREATURE_CLASS:ALL][CREATURE_CLASS:INORGANIC][CREATURE_CLASS:METALLIC]
[GRAZER:1200]
[BENIGN][MEANDERER][PET]
[LARGE_ROAMING]
[NATURAL]
[PETVALUE:110]
[BODY:CORE_HLG:EXTERNAL_EARS_HLG:UNGULATE_FORELIMBS_KPT:UNGULATE_HINDLIMBS_KPT:LIGHTNING_GLANDS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CRYSTAL_TISSUES_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:CRYSTAL_MATERIALS_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STEEL_WOOL_STL]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:METALLIC_LAYERS_STL]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:KICK_HLG]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:BITE_ANIMAL_HLG] It has the face of an eel, and thus its long pointy teeths
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:APPEARANCE_VARIABILITY_BODYSIZE_HLG]
[MAXAGE:10:15]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:5000]
[BODY_SIZE:1:0:25000]
[BODY_SIZE:2:0:52000]
[CHILD:1][GENERAL_CHILD_NAME:eelectric lamb:eelectric lambs]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:BUZZ_BUZZ_STL] BUZZ BUZZ BITCHES
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Shock]
[CDI:TARGET:A:TOUCHABLE]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:are shocked with lightning:is shocked with lightning]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:210]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[CASTE_NAME:eelectric ewe:eelectric ewes:eelectric ewe]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[CASTE_NAME:eelectric ram:eelectric rams:eelectric ram]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL] Wholesale from wiki
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:STEEL_WOOL]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:ASH_GRAY:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:steel wool:SINGULAR]
[TISSUE_LAYER_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:0:0:0:0:0:0:0]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:steel wool:SINGULAR]
[APP_MOD_RATE:1:DAILY:0:300:0:0:NO_END]
[APP_MOD_DESC_RANGE:10:50:100:150:200:300]
[SHEARABLE_TISSUE_LAYER:LENGTH:300]
And its buzzbuzz attack:
Code: [Select]
[INTERACTION:BUZZ_BUZZ_STL]
[I_SOURCE:CREATURE_ACTION]
[I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
[IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE]
[IT_MANUAL_INPUT:buzzee]
[IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS:BUZZED] The potential double meaning of this in DF context hit me an instant later.
[I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
[IE_TARGET:A]
[IE_IMMEDIATE]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:BUZZED]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:ORGANIC]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CLASS:METALLIC]
[SYN_IMMUNE_CREATURE:EELECTRIC_SHEEP_STL:ALL]
[CE_PARALYSIS:SEV:100:PROB:100:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:5] Sudden comical stiffening from jolt
[CE_NUMBNESS:SEV:100:PROB:100:BP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:START:0:END:200]
[CE_SKILL_ROLL_ADJUST:PERC:50:PERC_ON:75:START:0:END:200] Since numbness doesn't seem to do this.
[CE_DIZZINESS:SEV:50:PROB:35:START:0:END:200] Possible secondary effect
[CE_UNCONSCIOUSNESS:SEV:100:PROB:35:RESISTABLE:START:0:END:400] Possible secondary effect
Post by: WillowLuman on April 26, 2014, 10:08:28 pm
It'd be particularly bad for a Formic hive, if it hit the Queen. Hive death, right there.
"In 105 the Great Formic Hive of the South was ruined when the Sexuality Monster stole the Queen's fertility."
Post by: Urdothor on April 26, 2014, 10:28:59 pm
And that sheep is shockingly cool.
Post by: MDFification on April 27, 2014, 12:03:45 am
It'd be particularly bad for a Formic hive, if it hit the Queen. Hive death, right there.
"In 105 the Great Formic Hive of the South was ruined when the Sexuality Monster stole the Queen's fertility."
It sounds like a bad health class PSA.
"Don't have sex, kids, or the Sexuality Monster will render your Hive Queen infertile!"
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on April 27, 2014, 04:03:54 am
It sounds like a bad health class PSA.
"Don't have sex, kids, or the Sexuality Monster will render your Hive Queen infertile!"
How do I sig something?
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on April 27, 2014, 04:05:54 am
Powers over weather, so lightning attacks, acidic blood/bone rains(can creatures create weather?), wind gust attacks, other weather stuff...
I would do it, but I don't really know how to mod stuff like that.
Post by: BlackFlyme on April 27, 2014, 04:08:11 am
It sounds like a bad health class PSA.
"Don't have sex, kids, or the Sexuality Monster will render your Hive Queen infertile!"
How do I sig something?
Go to your profile.
Mouse over the 'MODIFY PROFILE' tab.
In the menu that appears, select 'Forum Profile'.
In the new page, one of the options can be to set your signature. Just copy and paste the quote into there.
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on April 27, 2014, 04:12:15 am
It sounds like a bad health class PSA.
"Don't have sex, kids, or the Sexuality Monster will render your Hive Queen infertile!"
How do I sig something?
Go to your profile.
Mouse over the 'MODIFY PROFILE' tab.
In the menu that appears, select 'Forum Profile'.
In the new page, one of the options can be to set your signature. Just copy and paste the quote into there.
Thanks!
Post by: squidgen on April 27, 2014, 04:44:06 pm
EDIT: It looks like it will require a new world to get giant desert scorpions on embark. Oh well
Post by: Gnorm on April 27, 2014, 05:42:47 pm
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on April 28, 2014, 02:10:45 am
All of this stuff sounds pretty interesting, but I think that someone should compile this all into the mod and release it before people continue posting. There hasn't been a release in too long.I completely agree. Halfling has not been active for waaaay to long. Maybe we should start a new thread?
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 28, 2014, 04:56:59 am
And once we have a new thread, holding folks to some kind of release schedule again might be smart :)
Post by: WillowLuman on April 28, 2014, 10:40:38 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on April 28, 2014, 10:43:19 am
I'd say starting a new thread should be reserved for the imminent release of DF2015. It's in the final bugfixing phase after all, and a new DF version would seem to be an ideal breaking point.
And once we have a new thread, holding folks to some kind of release schedule again might be smart :)
Sounds good. I'd have to start all over again anyway cos I lost all my raws. And to be honest with the impending college-going and other things in my life I'm legitimately too busy, rather than just making excuses.
Post by: Gnorm on April 28, 2014, 10:45:58 am
Ugh I dread how much we'll have to change our raws to make them work again.We could always just start fresh.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 28, 2014, 02:35:40 pm
Ugh I dread how much we'll have to change our raws to make them work again.We could always just start fresh.
That would be even more work, though.
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 28, 2014, 09:17:20 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on April 28, 2014, 09:30:36 pm
Post by: Gnorm on April 28, 2014, 09:40:51 pm
i was actually wondering if we should put this in the modding section of the forum, seeing how it's primarily modding, and the concept of turns has seemingly vanished.I'd be perfectly willing to play a turn in Fortress Mode and in Adventurer Mode if someone would actually post a new version.
Post by: Urdothor on April 28, 2014, 09:56:10 pm
Not much i can do currently.
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 28, 2014, 10:14:41 pm
i was actually wondering if we should put this in the modding section of the forum, seeing how it's primarily modding, and the concept of turns has seemingly vanished.I'd be perfectly willing to play a turn in Fortress Mode and in Adventurer Mode if someone would actually post a new version.
Aye, same here. Fortress mode mainly, though. I shudder at the mere thought of bumping into a panserblekk in the open without a meter and a half of steel plate between my vitals and it.
Post by: WillowLuman on April 29, 2014, 12:58:50 am
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on April 29, 2014, 10:28:50 am
Actually, what are the current behaviour-related tokens for the Panserblekk, and which of the remaining tokens could syndromes add?
EDIT: Also, would anyone like me to make a taxonomic list of our current creatures?
Post by: WillowLuman on April 29, 2014, 11:01:06 am
Post by: Halfling on April 30, 2014, 06:08:25 am
Sorry, people. I was in the hospital for a time, and after coming back, well, I decided to make a change, that I don't want to do video games every day. I started working really hard on my studies and forgot to come here for a long time. I just assumed this had died.
Instead you've made some new, wonderful things, and the project keeps on going. Makes me feel ashamed that I should be a negative influence on this. Looking at what has happened it seems a system of free contribution is more fruitful in the long run than one of turns. The turn-based thing frequently lead to frustration.
The downside is, without organization and testing, it would be extremely laborous to cobble what has been posted into a new release, unless people are willing to post a list of what they have tested in-game and works. For example, most of the designs posted on the last few pages don't work, since they use vanilla templates.
Making a new thread would be sane. This is one of the longest threads in this forum. It has a lot of history and extremely good material, but is also the length of a book. Alternatively, if you want to keep it going I can give control of this account to e.g. StL and HugoL, the people who've been active and interested in this since the beginning, for purposes of maintaining this thread. I can always make a new one, I'm not particularly attached to names.
Post by: StLeibowitz on April 30, 2014, 09:27:49 am
But seriously, sorry you were hospitalized and glad you got better. Things got a bit...shall we say, fluid, in your absence. With exams coming up, I might lack the time to adequately manage the thread (I guess a little is better than nothing though), so turning over the keys to Hugo might be wiser, if he doesn't have anything going on for him. If he does, though, a joint management might work, splitting the work between us.
Compiling all the recent stuff might be too much effort for how long it'd be usable for. I mean, DF2014 (there's probably error bars on that number) is coming out at some point very soon, and there'll be some pretty extensive raw changes coming, what with the separation of combat speed and movement speed, the inclusion of jumping and climbing, multi-tile trees, a tracking system, a basic system of smell (if I interpreted the devlog right), and all the rest. Thinking over it, it might actually make more sense to start over from scratch again. That's practically what we would be doing anyways. Plus, it would give us a chance to further refine our improvements, like the taxonomy classes, and add a few - with the proliferation of body parts in everyone's body raws, I was toying with the idea of making a sort of Body Building Kit, lego minifigure style, of a bunch of basic body parts, ie BODY_2EYES, BODY_1EYE, BODY_3EYES, BODY_2EYES_CHEST, BODY_1EYE_CHEST... that sort of thing. It'd help make body tissue layers and stuff easier since everything would have the same class (it's a problem I've been bumping into trying to set up inorganics in my spare time).
It'd have to be a group decision, though. Chucking the work we've all done and starting over again is a big move, and even with my ideas I'm still a little leery of it.
Now, that being said...
@Dwarf4Explosives: A taxonomic list would be cool to have. If you want to do it, I see no issues with having one :)
Post by: squidgen on April 30, 2014, 10:01:51 am
Post by: WillowLuman on April 30, 2014, 03:38:47 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on May 01, 2014, 05:35:35 am
At any rate, I'd say we should start with a new thread for DF2014. I think the best way for us to deal with the changes is to make a list of what creatures have been looked over (and perhaps changed) and which still need to be. If we can compile a list of traits that have changed in the change to DF2014, it'll be a lot easier.
I don't think changing all of the body plans is a good idea, though. I do agree that we should remake the creature and syndrome classes, however. I guess my list will come in handy with that.
Post by: Urdothor on May 01, 2014, 03:43:42 pm
Post by: Halfling on May 02, 2014, 04:18:09 am
Sending over the passwords for thread administration to both. We're a trinity now, in principle.
Post by: WillowLuman on May 02, 2014, 10:51:05 am
Post by: CaptainMcClellan on May 02, 2014, 01:23:16 pm
Also @HugoLuman: have I actually submitted anything?
Post by: WillowLuman on May 02, 2014, 02:46:57 pm
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on May 02, 2014, 07:51:54 pm
Ants:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Topaz:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: WillowLuman on May 02, 2014, 07:59:29 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 02, 2014, 10:27:23 pm
Also, @Kaladin: Minor typo in your creature description; that comma should be a period, to make the description read: "An ant made of pure topaz. They capture the souls of the dead and create statues from them." Otherwise, pretty cool! Any plans for what those souls will be useful for?
Post by: Scarlet on May 03, 2014, 04:15:14 am
Post by: WillowLuman on May 03, 2014, 01:16:33 pm
Post by: darkpaladin109 on May 03, 2014, 02:07:26 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 03, 2014, 05:06:36 pm
The content on the Shoutwiki is easily transferred over to the other two, should one of those be chosen.
Post by: FallenAngel on May 03, 2014, 05:50:06 pm
As a Skilled Modder myself, I'd like a turn in either this one or the DF2014 one when it comes out.
In the meantime, how exactly do I contribute? I have a race that relies on five new additions and two previous files for its functionality. Since the whole thing was slapped together when I was only Adequate, I had based stuff off of existing things (their entity file, for starters, is a heavily altered version of the one used by Dwarves. Completely different ethics, spheres, items they can make, but almost identical nobles, mostly out of pure confusion. My entire edit was renaming the Chief Medical Dwarf the Chief Medical Angel. Besides that, nada.
The summary of my additions to the raws are:
The creature itself (based on Humans but with 6 arms)
Their entity files (based off of Dwarves with major modifications)
A new sword (made from scratch)
A new "crossbow" (made from scratch)
The new "crossbow"s ammo (altered from the Blowdart)
"Crossbow" is in quotes since it's actually a pistol.
That is my newest addition from a few weeks back when I got really bored.
brb downloading raws and chucking into fresh Dwarf Fortress to see what inane creatures have been invented and how quickly I can paste them into my raws
Post by: WillowLuman on May 03, 2014, 06:00:17 pm
Post by: PDF urist master on May 03, 2014, 07:49:30 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 03, 2014, 08:35:14 pm
Post by: FallenAngel on May 03, 2014, 10:23:00 pm
And the 6-armed humanoids are some horrific fusion of mammal and spider. My current theory is that they're what happens when Armok gets drunk on too much Dwarven Beer and he is half-blind due to that.
Post by: WillowLuman on May 04, 2014, 01:01:56 am
Post by: Urdothor on May 04, 2014, 01:38:43 am
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on May 04, 2014, 11:40:49 am
I hope I understood it right, because a whole lot of raws are coming now.
Spoiler: creatures (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: plants (click to show/hide)
Edit: I also posted coprolite raws here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=127552.msg5148588;topicseen#msg5148588)
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 04, 2014, 12:22:20 pm
EDIT: Okay, picking through some of the older pages (c. page 80) to see if we missed anything in the chaos of those early days.
From Gnorm (unsure if included):
Code: [Select]
creature_wheeler_fanciful
[OBJECT:CREATURE]
[CREATURE:WHEELER]
[NAME:wheeler:wheelers:wheelish]
[CREATURE_TILE:'w'][COLOR:86:163:205]
[FANCIFUL]
[DOES_NOT_EXIST]
[PREFSTRING:squeaky wheels]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
My personal megabeast that never seems to have gotten in:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on May 04, 2014, 02:35:50 pm
Would _LLP be acceptable for you when we compile the next update?Sure, ain't got no problems with that
Post by: BlackFlyme on May 04, 2014, 02:41:28 pm
The seeds of all three plants are missing a closing bracket for their material value tags. They all have [MATERIAL_VALUE:4
Bloodmint apparently grows in [FALL], which is not an acceptable token.
The turnips are found in subterranean caverns, but are lacking an [UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:#:#] to tell them which cavern to grow in.
Other than that, they seem to be fine.
Post by: Gnorm on May 04, 2014, 08:49:42 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 04, 2014, 09:47:52 pm
On the unrelated topic of raws that never got added, Ombragon's dragonbee (might need some adapting to DFFS templates) from page 133:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
They're evidently supposed to be pressable for juice, though no reaction was included in the post. Unsure if that's possible, but it could very well be with a little work.
Post by: BlackFlyme on May 04, 2014, 09:59:48 pm
You capture a live one, then start an 'extract from dead animal' job at the butcher's workshop. No new reactions necessary.
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 04, 2014, 10:54:14 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on May 05, 2014, 03:27:40 am
Also, StLeibowitz, I believe "who" in the dragonbee's description should be "which".
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 05, 2014, 05:05:11 am
Post by: StrikaAmaru on May 05, 2014, 05:49:30 am
[PLANT:NYLON_KPT]
[NAME:nylon]
[NAME_PLURAL:nylon plants]
[ADJ:nylon]
[FREQUENCY:100]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:NYLON_THREAD_TEMPLATE_KPT]
changing the last line to
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STRUCTURE:PLANT_STRUCTURE_HLG]
makes the problem go away.
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on May 05, 2014, 03:56:28 pm
Has anyone actually added anything to the wikis in a while, or should we just strike them from the OP? It's been bugging me a while.
Also, @Kaladin: Minor typo in your creature description; that comma should be a period, to make the description read: "An ant made of pure topaz. They capture the souls of the dead and create statues from them." Otherwise, pretty cool! Any plans for what those souls will be useful for?
That wasn't exactly a typo, so it just doesn't fit perfectly with the others? I fixed it though.
Well, the souls were just already a gem, and I thought it would be cool... They are statues. You can place them.
Post by: WillowLuman on May 05, 2014, 04:12:38 pm
Post by: Cptn Kaladin Anrizlokum on May 06, 2014, 05:03:02 pm
Post by: Redzephyr01 on May 13, 2014, 08:37:28 pm
Post by: DVNO on May 14, 2014, 03:20:08 am
Where do I go to get the latest release to work off of?
Or was the latest release really six months ago?
Post by: BlackFlyme on May 14, 2014, 03:23:20 am
I'd like to contribute but this thread is kinda impenetrable?
Where do I go to get the latest release to work off of?
Or was the latest release really six months ago?
Github (https://github.com/vyznev/dfscratch) should be the most up-to-date, I believe.
But it has been quite a while since the last major release.
Post by: StLeibowitz on May 14, 2014, 10:43:46 am
Post by: DVNO on May 14, 2014, 04:00:37 pm
Github can make the adding and assembling of all those snippets much easier, but I don't see any pull requests ...
I'd suggest cloning the most recently updated version (looks to be BenLubar's version (https://github.com/BenLubar/dfscratch/pulls) from the Network Graph) And start asking for people to start merging with a version you can moderate.
It's so much less work than sifting through the whole thread yourself and you can moderate everything that goes in so silly stuff that doesn't fit or looks horribly overpowered at a glance can be filtered out by you.
I'd look at what PJF has done with Masterwork: Studded with Patches (https://github.com/pjf/masterwork-dwarf-fortress) as a example for a really efficent way to get more updates from everyone on this project.
Post by: WillowLuman on May 14, 2014, 05:11:32 pm
Post by: sal880612m on May 27, 2014, 09:22:42 pm
If there are it might be a good time to start discussing whether it will be free for all modding or if it will be more structured and how that would work. Not very good at modding, so I probably can't/wouldn't contribute but if it ended up being like this started out as I would be willing to do test plays.
Also maybe a good idea to discuss what to do with the content here and if it is being done in the new version what to keep, chuck, and not allow to be done again.
Really kind of hope someone is intending to keep this idea going.
Post by: WillowLuman on May 27, 2014, 09:23:57 pm
Post by: Zanzetkuken The Great on June 09, 2014, 12:04:19 am
Really kind of hope someone is intending to keep this idea going.
I did make this thread in preparation for when I thought the new version would be coming out soon... (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=134122.msg4821968#msg4821968)
Post by: DVNO on June 27, 2014, 10:31:22 pm
I was playing around with git-hub, writing a easy to read guide for it, but even still, git-hub accounts and special software for windows and mac are still needed. I want this to be so accessible even somebody on a Chromebook could do it.
So how about this? A fully editable folder in google drive.
>>Click Here to View<< (https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B-kOejru5QTlZWNrOUd3dGowdkk&usp=sharing#list)
(click here for a handy Chrome native text editor) (https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/drive-notepad/gpgjomejfimnbmobcocilppikhncegaj?hl=en)
Just sign in and add it to your own Drive (which you already have for free along with 15GB of free space if you have a Gmail account) and with that you can add and edit your own raw text files to the public folder for the world to enjoy.
I'm still fiddling with the permissions - maybe when the next release rolls around I'll set it so only files users add can be edited. If kept to the the already established format, everybody can work on their own little piece of the raws, and only that piece. I don't know, just playing around with it still.
Looking for opinion all around.
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on June 28, 2014, 09:45:00 am
Post by: DVNO on June 28, 2014, 04:10:56 pm
edit:
added a changelog and a couple of foods to the mod. :)
Post by: DVNO on June 29, 2014, 08:35:30 pm
Can I get a quick poll of who'll potentially be interested in another DF from scratch for next release, if any?
Post by: Gnorm on June 29, 2014, 08:56:26 pm
bump -I'd be cool with that. We could use the "minimal world" raws from this one, though edit the starting race slightly to make it new.
Can I get a quick poll of who'll potentially be interested in another DF from scratch for next release, if any?
Post by: WillowLuman on June 29, 2014, 09:56:05 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on June 29, 2014, 10:00:19 pm
bump -It is done.
Can I get a quick poll of who'll potentially be interested in another DF from scratch for next release, if any?
Post by: sal880612m on June 29, 2014, 10:27:40 pm
Post by: DVNO on June 30, 2014, 12:40:13 am
I kinda want to keep some of my critters, since I put a lot of work into them, but as they'd have to be retooled anyway I guess it would count as from scratch.
Yeah, porting specific things over is cool if the authors want to support them.
Just can't bring the whole thing over, for obvious reasons
Post by: Lord_lemonpie on June 30, 2014, 10:29:50 am
Is this a good or bad idea?
Post by: WillowLuman on June 30, 2014, 11:40:15 am
Post by: Gnorm on June 30, 2014, 06:18:32 pm
Post by: Urdothor on July 02, 2014, 02:59:42 pm
Post by: DVNO on July 05, 2014, 08:25:38 pm
Yes on starting a new DF from scratch series after the new release.
Yes on collaborating using Google drive and no more single modding turns. ( not a lot of replies about it, but also there was zero pushback on the topic so i'll chalk it up to on of those 'yeah, duh' sort of ideas )
Yes to porting creations from the old version and only the old version.
Here's some more ideas to stir up some discussion.
No halfling race - and to take it even a step further ...
No copyrighted works of fantasy fiction in general as a rule. As in, if it can be found in J.R.R Tolkien's Similarion, or World of Warcraft, or a D&D book, it should be rejected, or at least be given a more unique flavor that fits the tone of the game that we'll eventually sculpt out.
I like this rule because Fantasy is, by it's very characteristic, limitless with ideas. If somebody wants to play with Dwarves & Orcs in a fleshed out stock fantasy setting, there will always be Forlorn Realms and Masterwork DF and of course Vanilla. So, Why do we have to be constrained in the generic fantasy pulp of elves and goblins? This project always shined most when a unique, crazy little idea took center stage or some strange piece of lore entered the mix, so why not always strive for and enforce a unique fantasy universe with lots a cool little things over the already well trodden and established?
Expanding on Lord_Lemonpie's idea
I agree, only one all inclusive race is too small to have fun with, But what about three multiple race inclusive civilizations?
Let distill what typically happens when somebody embarks in vanilla, right? Usually the situation is this; You are allied with your civ, the goblins are hostile to you, and either the elves or humans want to trade or siege you, rarely both at the same time.
Would that experience change much, other than in more variety in trade and sieges, if instead of a dwarf civ and a goblin civ constantly butting heads, There was (stealing some Warcraft here) an 'Alliance' civ and a 'Horde' civ constantly opposed to each other? And for trade, perhaps there could be a third, neutral group that agrees with exactly half of the 'Alliance' civs ethics, and half of the 'Horde' civs ethics, making the neutral civ constantly flip flop between the two with trade deals and pledges of war support at the beginning and during every world gen like an indecisive girlfriend?
This would likely help newer modders, because if they make a cool race creature file but don't really know what to put into the entity file that would be balanced, they can just hook their creature into the coalition that suits their flavor and not have to worry about it.
streamlining the raws
Do we still want to keep the format 'item_username' in the raws? This creates a lot of individual little raw snippets and can be messy to edit, especially if something is game crippling and needs to be bug fixed.
Maybe it would be a better system to just have one file for entities, objects, creatures, ect, but inside the files, segment the token like this;
Code: [Select]
c_variation
[OBJECT:CREATURE_VARIATION]
### contributor 1 ###
[TOKEN]
[TOKEN]
[TOKEN]
### contributor 2 ###
[TOKEN]
[TOKEN]
[TOKEN]
Post by: WillowLuman on July 05, 2014, 08:29:32 pm
Post by: Gnorm on July 05, 2014, 08:43:57 pm
Post by: StLeibowitz on July 05, 2014, 09:39:06 pm
I agree on the originality bit, but maybe it should be more of a strong guideline rather than a hard rule. And for what creatures that are made purely original, they should probably have good lines on their physical appearance in the description, to help people envision the world. I mean, everyone knows what a dwarf looks like, so you can get away with "A short, sturdy creature fond of drink and industry." Odds are good that people who know what a Segmented Pentapod or a Golden Arravis look like are significantly rarer, so giving the rest a bit more to work with might be a good idea.
Also, one entity per sentient playable race is best. More variety is best. And it could very well end up different, if two different playable races had wildly divergent morals - if you play as the Dwarves, say, you're probably in conflict with goblins, maybe with elves, will be raided by 'bolds, and will have good trade relations with humans...but if you play as goblins, you'll have to deal with sieges of steel-clad, crossbow-armed dwarves, probably skirmish with elves and humans, and will look forward to the kobold trade caravan every winter. As dwarves, you look at goblinite as a rich source of iron for your industry, though it can be passed up - but as goblins, dwarfite will be the sole source of steel, and likely indispensable for that purpose. Dwarves will have to lay traps to catch kobold thieves, but goblins wouldn't have to worry. And this is only considering vanilla races, which truthfully aren't too hugely different from each other. With Scratch races, things could get intricate.
It could get especially fun if each entity had a particular trade good it produced, like the pipes Halflings make. You'd have to play halflings or be friendly to Halflings to access pipes, which are then used in alchemy for incense and stuff. Enemies of halflings would be locked out of aspects of alchemy, but could trade with foes of the halflings for, say, some kind of reinforced magical glass for use in really good cutting weapons. Something to consider, perhaps.
Post by: DVNO on July 05, 2014, 09:56:35 pm
I agree that one should use his imagination and try to create something other than an orc, though one should be able to take inspiration from mythologies and literature.
And yes, if someone takes a vague, obscure myth from the 14th century like the Cockatrice to create? Sure, that would be perfectly valid. A Tauren is not. That is exactly what I meant by copyrighted work.
Post by: Gnorm on July 08, 2014, 04:04:21 pm
Post by: WillowLuman on July 08, 2014, 04:23:58 pm
Post by: Gnorm on July 08, 2014, 04:32:19 pm
Post by: DrKillPatient on July 08, 2014, 04:41:14 pm
Yeah, it sticks to grid view for reasons beyond me. It looks much nicer if you switch it over to list view. I'll see if there's a setting around to keep it in a list.
Add #list to the end of the URL and it will go to listview automatically, as in this link (https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B-kOejru5QTlYkxNVURNQjcxcGc&usp=sharing#list).
Post by: WillowLuman on July 08, 2014, 04:44:06 pm
Post by: Gnorm on July 08, 2014, 05:00:44 pm
I would recommend getting a headstart on any raws you want to convert. As we use our original bodyplan, we don't have to worry about the neck problem vanilla-derived raws face (we already added necks!), but we do need to worry about vision arcs and sense of smell.How much of our raws are we converting to the new game?
Post by: DrKillPatient on July 08, 2014, 05:09:59 pm
I would recommend getting a headstart on any raws you want to convert. As we use our original bodyplan, we don't have to worry about the neck problem vanilla-derived raws face (we already added necks!), but we do need to worry about vision arcs and sense of smell.How much of our raws are we converting to the new game?
Do we know precisely what parts of the raws need to changed? If it's just additions of things like the tracking stuff, one could easily have a script insert those items (with sane defaults) into the current raws as a placeholder so that they at least function properly
Post by: WillowLuman on July 08, 2014, 06:03:47 pm
Post by: Dwarf4Explosives on July 13, 2014, 04:30:46 pm
I'll try to convert my raws to the current version, at any rate.
Post by: DVNO on July 13, 2014, 05:10:03 pm
@Hugo
Yup, had the same thought about stability. I'm writing up the introduction for the first post now, and I plan on starting the new thread on the 15th. That cool with everyone?
@ Gnorm
If the original author wants to convert their original DFFS v1 work and wants to keep up the commitment of continually updating them as the new v 40.X versions roll out, then it'll be accepted. So, for how much is converted, it really depends on how many original contributors jump back on the project and want to continue their ideas.
I'd like to remind everyone, though, The material files will be from scratch, so keep checking for dependencies that may not still exist or need to be re-created in mind as you update.
I'm excited about this you guys :)
Post by: WillowLuman on July 13, 2014, 09:50:34 pm
Post by: DVNO on July 15, 2014, 07:26:12 pm
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=140715.0 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=140715.0)