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Finally... => Creative Projects => Topic started by: Lord Dullard on August 11, 2008, 12:29:22 am

Title: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on August 11, 2008, 12:29:22 am
MOST RECENT UPDATES
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Time/date/weather: This is the newest addition. Type +today in the game to see the current time/date/weather/moon phase. There are +help files available for the time system's use and how to use it while building to create time- and season-flexible room descriptions.

Time currently moves at a 4:1 ratio.

+Help System: As of yet there's not a whole yet here, but keep checking back for more. Eventually this command will contain documentation for all of the major in-game commands available to players.

Global Bulletin Board: The global bulletin board can be viewed with the +bbread command. For further instructions on how to read and post entries, see +help.

Game Appearance: I'm working on adding a lot of pizazz to the visual aspects of the MUX (at least, as far as text-only coding will allow). If you haven't check in for a while things are likely to look radically different.

Short Descriptions: Players can use the command: '&shortdesc me=<text>' to change their short descriptions. Short descriptions are snippets of information about what a player's character is currently doing that can be seen by looking at the room. These are eventually intended to function as a roleplaying aid. Players can also add &shortdescs to objects that will show up in the room.

==================

I'm at least marginally interested in the possibility of a Dwarf Fortress MU* and I want to know what others think of the idea.

I've set up a (temporary) MUX server for interested folks to poke around on, since MUSH/MUX are the only codebases I personally know how to work with.

You can get there by using a MU* client (I prefer SimpleMU*, but there are others), or by using telnet (the not-so-preferred method).

The connect info: striketheearth.dragonsoldier.com, port 1050.

The telnet link is: telnet://striketheearth.dragonsoldier.com 1050 (You'll need to manually copy/paste this into your browser bar.)

The following will direct you to a rudimentary guide to MUSH (link courtesy of Tahin):

http://www.gammon.com.au/mush/mush.htm
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Zako on August 11, 2008, 12:55:42 am
A what? Could you explain this more clearly to me please?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on August 11, 2008, 01:02:10 am
Quote from: Zako on August 11, 2008, 12:55:42 am
A what? Could you explain this more clearly to me please?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MU* (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MU*)
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 01:21:16 am
Weeee! I shall log in at once!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Aqizzar on August 11, 2008, 01:30:05 am
I haven't gotten on a MU* in like 7 years.  Could you walk me through how to conenct?  I tried copy/pasting telnet://striketheearth.dragonsoldier.com 1050 into the browser, and it launches something but closes it immediately.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: A_Fey_Dwarf on August 11, 2008, 01:33:04 am
I have the same problem. You are not hacking into my PC are you?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Zako on August 11, 2008, 01:33:32 am
My God...

Sir, you are a genius!  ;D

Im getting into it at once!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 01:35:20 am
You'll need a telnet client. Windows comes with a built-in one, but it sucks. Just google free telnet client or something. I use mushclient, personally.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on August 11, 2008, 01:36:12 am
I'm not! I never use telnet, so maybe I goofed up with that link. Anyhow, I KNOW this will work:

http://simplemu.onlineroleplay.com/

Go there ^, and download the client on the site.

Open it once it's installed, hit the 'File' tab at the top-left, and select 'New Connection Wizard...'.

From there, just enter the information in my original post, and name your new connect info 'DF MUX' or whatever you'd like to call it. You should then be able to connect.

Obligatory Warning: There's nothing there yet, really. Just commands to communicate. Anything else would need to be coded in. Once in-game you can use 'say <blah>' and 'pose <blah>' or just '"<blah>' and ':<blah>' to 'speak' and use actions.

Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Cajoes on August 11, 2008, 01:51:38 am
I sense dark days ahead...

Dark with huge walls of needlessly detailed ascii.



        ^_^b

Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 03:51:15 am
Well, I'm off for tonight. I've spent the last few hours screwing around with various things, just figuring out how to build rooms and items and such. This should be fun, though I doubt I'll be able to spend that much time on it. I mean, I just got my Morrowind disc working, so now I have two things pulling on my life. Alas, I shall have to choose one or the other in the end. The code scares me, though.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Aqizzar on August 11, 2008, 03:58:24 am
I tried using SimpleMU.  I put striketheearth.dragonsoldier.com in for the address, 1050 for the port, and I get this-

SimpleMU - Unregistered - Please Register and gain more features!
Cannot connect - Host address or Port cannot be blank!

Any help?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 04:09:00 am
Try mushclient. It's what I use. And seriously, I'm going to bed, now. Maybe.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: A_Fey_Dwarf on August 11, 2008, 04:13:53 am
I tried simpleMU as well but I couldn't seem to install it. The set-up got to checking previous updates and then bailed on me. I think I might give up on trying.  :-\
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 04:15:18 am
MUSCHCLIENT!!!!!

http://www.gammon.com.au/mushclient/mushclient.htm

It's freeware, now.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: A_Fey_Dwarf on August 11, 2008, 04:19:47 am
Ahhh!! Confusing instructions, I really can't be bothered with this. It's to much effort.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 04:21:57 am
Download the program, install it. Run it. Create a new world, put Strike the Earth for the name, and the address and port as required, hit okay. Follow the instructions. But I am going to bed (seriously) and I can't stick around to help you get your bearings, and there isn't really anything to do at the moment, so it's kind of pointless until tomorrow when we can get some stuff up.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: A_Fey_Dwarf on August 11, 2008, 04:26:38 am
O.K thanks, I think I got it sorted. My problem was that I didn't know what link to click on the download pages.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Davion on August 11, 2008, 03:41:53 pm
If you're having problems, or are generally confused on how to connect to one of these games I've put together this package for GMud:

Download here (http://davionshores.250free.com/GMudClient.zip)

Everything is already entered for you, all you have to do is connect.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Gaulgath on August 11, 2008, 04:00:56 pm
Can we get a current feature list for those who can't connect yet? (I'll have to contact my network admin to get port 1050 open...)
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Aqizzar on August 11, 2008, 04:04:02 pm
Current feature list is Tahin, Dullard's OOC body, me as of a few minutes ago, and several sentences of descriptive text.  It needs a lot of grunt room building.  Tahin's going to show me how later, don't know what we should do yet.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 04:11:11 pm
The plan is to have a simple RP Mush built around a single fortress. We'll need a backstory, map, combat system, etc etc. It will be a lot of work.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Fualkner on August 11, 2008, 04:55:23 pm
Thing is, MUDs are relatively easy to code, just a lot of busy work. You have to write room descriptions, command instructions... but usually nothing too impossible to actually code. The problem is that all the flavor has to be written by a few people, or it gets to be to varied in quality and feel.

If I were to make a MUD like this, it'd allow people to build their own forts, but to prevent ridiculous amounts of dug-out land, if no one "Cleans" the area for a couple days, everything in the room is destroyed, and it fills back in. Basically, people that quit playing are buried in the space of a few days.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Dasleah on August 11, 2008, 05:27:53 pm
Anyone care to post up a small tutorial on room building and other common world-expanding things? I often find myself with copious amounts of spare time and the need to distract myself from doing something constructive, so I'd be more than happy to help - if only I knew how ;)

And what's the theme? Are we building a fort for people to explore, or a whole world, or a mix of both?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 05:39:15 pm
At the moment we need to figure out the engine and theme, and such, first. This (http://www.gammon.com.au/mush/mush.htm) is a useful tutorial on how to navigate and build and stuff. Feel free to come in and ask questions. You're welcome to try your hand at building a few rooms and items for practice, too.

The currently agreed-upon theme is a single, small, outpost fortress. Players would be free to grab a pick and dig out a few rooms, sit down in a craftsdwarf workshop and build any item they can imagine, or just sit down in the dining room and have a +felsite mug+ of plump helmet wine while telling tales, singing, and generally just be a dwarf. My hope is to eventually have a simple combat system which will allow for a military and the need for fortress defense to come up, but that might take a while. I don't intend to do any actual coding, at least for a while, so I can't really tell you what the more complicated stuff will take.

It is, however, worth noting, that absolutely none of this implemented. Feel free to come in, hang out, and try to figure out the system, but there isn't anything right now.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 11, 2008, 07:58:20 pm
Hm... I wonder if we might see Toady One or Three Toe visiting our fortress from time to time...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 08:06:29 pm
That's what I was thinking, actually.... Could be interesting to see Toady's or Threetoe's take on roleplaying a dwarf.

One thing that I would like to see implimented: A wear command, but not in the usual sense. Rather than just wearing an item and it going into it's appropriate slot, you would type something like "wear sword = on belt" and it would then display in your inventory as "Sword (On Belt)." Or something. Just a thought, but I can't code yet so I can't do it myself.

I don't really want to see this turn into an interactive novel. I mean, that's what it will be in the end, but not in the sense of "EACH EMOTE AS TO BE A PAGE LONG AT LEAST OR YOU GET BANNED." I would like to see it be pretty loose, and things like this would help make it more accessible, as you wouldn't have to constantly emote about what you look like to keep people updated as to what you are wearing, and you wouldn't have to constantly change your description to match whether you are wearing a particular hat that day. Of course, for many items, simply having them in your inventory is enough to suggest that you're wearing it, but I'd like to see a bit more detail than that. And I doubt it would be that difficult to impliment. But I have yet to learn to code. I guess I should do so before I start making judgements about what may or may not be difficult.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on August 11, 2008, 10:32:49 pm
Quote from: Fualkner on August 11, 2008, 04:55:23 pm
Thing is, MUDs are relatively easy to code, just a lot of busy work. You have to write room descriptions, command instructions... but usually nothing too impossible to actually code. The problem is that all the flavor has to be written by a few people, or it gets to be to varied in quality and feel.

If I were to make a MUD like this, it'd allow people to build their own forts, but to prevent ridiculous amounts of dug-out land, if no one "Cleans" the area for a couple days, everything in the room is destroyed, and it fills back in. Basically, people that quit playing are buried in the space of a few days.

You have this backwards (or, perhaps, a MUD is radically different from a MUX). Building and thematic compilation is a cakewalk, coding is rigorous, brain-breaking work. Or at least any coder would be able to tell you this.

Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Fualkner on August 11, 2008, 10:47:06 pm
Hah, I code. When you get right down to it, RPG's are all equations and lists. Not exactly brain-busting work. Just alot of it, plus deciding how exactly how you want the equations to work, tweaking, updating, etc.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on August 11, 2008, 10:50:39 pm
Quote from: Fualkner on August 11, 2008, 10:47:06 pm
Hah, I code. When you get right down to it, RPG's are all equations and lists. Not exactly brain-busting work. Just alot of it, plus deciding how exactly how you want the equations to work, tweaking, updating, etc.

Let me show you the code for my virtual inventory program sometime...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 11, 2008, 10:54:27 pm
I second that motion. That thing is going to give me nightmares.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 12, 2008, 12:26:00 am
This is a rough draft of the races page. It needs a lot of editing. Feel free to comment on it.

Dwarves:

The Nobles Dwarves live in halls of stone deep beneath the ground. They are rarely seen above ground, and tend to get so adapted to the dark that the very sun makes them nauseous. As is tradition, when a city gets too large a small team of brave young dwarves who have not yet adapted to the dark may be sent out over land to find a suitable place to settle. The parent fortress will then send out immigrants in small groups until the new fortress is a decent size, and the cycle will begin again, forever insuring that Dwarfkind has a place in the mountains.

Dwarves are significantly short and rounder than humans, generally standing between 3 and 4 feet in height. They are virtually androgynous to other races, mostly due to their impressive beards which are common to both genders, yet somehow they manage to tell the difference with nearly 80% accuracy.

Dwarves are a particularly honorbound race, and marry for life. If a dwarf's lover dies, he or she will truly never love again. As honorable as they are, they are equally stubborn. Oftentimes a dwarf who is incapable of finishing a particularly engrossing project will go insane.

All of them, even the children, cannot function without a steady supply of alcohol. In fact, unlike humans, they have no need for water unless they are deprived of alcohol. Drinking water is both embarrasing and unhealthy for a dwawrf.

It is requested that you only play this race, as this is the race upon which the entire game focuses.

Humans:

Humans are the "average" race. They stand slightly shorter than an elf, yet taller than a dwarf. There are vast differences between the male and female individuals of this race, and most other races have little difficulty telling the difference. Their male members generally fall somewhere between 5 and 6.5 feet, while their female members are generally slightly shorter. They are not as industrious as dwarves, and tend to live aboveground in wooden dwellings. They only drink alcohol in celebration, though a small percentage of their population are addicted to alcohol. These are called drunks. The behavior of a human while intoxicated is similar to that of a dwarf while sober.

Elves:

Elves are frail, forest-dwelling creatures. They stand a few inches taller than a human, and their sexes are slightly more difficult to tell apart. whereas most female dwarves look male, most male elves look female. Elves live in harmony with nature, reviled by the butchering of animals and cutting of trees. While they do not like dwarves to eat meat and use animal products (such as leather, bone, etc.) they themselves will eat their slain enemies. Once, when asked why he did this, an elf replied: "It would be a worse sin to let good meat go to waste than to eat it." Dwarves tend to consider elves hypocritical and pansieish.

Goblins:

Contrary to the belief of most "civilized" races, goblins are actually quite intelligent. Brutal and lazy, they will kidnap the children of other races to serve as slaves for them. Little is know of actual goblin culture, as every kidnappee that was ever rescued was only capable of babbling incoherently and biting at its rescuers, and the goblins themselves tend to be considerably less tactful. They make a habit of sending wave after wave of troops against the larger, more lucrative dwarven fortresses, apparently hoping to wear them down gradually. Throughout history, a number of fortresses have been taken by the hordes.

Kobolds:

Small, fast, and frail. These are all commonly used adjectives to describe the lizard-like kobolds. Of all the intelligent races, kobolds are known the least about, perhaps because no one has ever really bothered to study them. Their language largely consists of yipping and growling sounds, that no other intelligent race can likely make. They will ocassionally show up at fortresses to steal small trinkets, and it has been theorized that they do this because they have no normal sense of ownership. This is a hotly-debated topic in the academic circles of the dwarven empires, as it is sometimes considered the final piece of evidence as to whether or not morality is inherent inintelligent races, while some would argue that Kobolds are not actually intelligent and merely run on instinct. Other still would argue that the behavior of the goblins flatly contradicts any claims that a race cannot be intelligent without being moral.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Aqizzar on August 12, 2008, 01:28:40 am
You know, considering the name is "Dwarf Fortress" and people are encouraged to play no other race, isn't it rather pointless to consider humans the "average" race?  I think it would be refreshing to see a fantasy milieu primer that uses another race (dwarves here) as the average, and compares humans against them the way other games would compare dwarves to humans.

It would good to move the physical description of dwarves above the society description.  Some mention of the frequent conflicts between elves and humans (and other races) would also help establish this as something other than a rote high-fantasy setting.  Elves have turned into something akin to badguys after all.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 12, 2008, 10:16:49 am
That is an interesting point. My use of the term "average" race, nowever is due to that the fact that Humans are kind of right in between all the other races as far as weight and stature. However, I might change it to compare everything to dwarves.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 12, 2008, 10:38:14 am
I like the descriptions, but remember that Kobolds are the literal scum of the earth, a big reptilian cockroach. Getting smote into gore in the name of Armok is the best thing that can happen to them.

I'm working on some doodles for a map. I'm thinking of having a 2D style terrain area, with the same basic structure. To make it more interesting, I'd have the cave river flow out from the mountain an become a creek, and possibly have the chasm reach out too. But I'll see what looks good on paper.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 12, 2008, 11:16:12 am
I was kind of trying to write it from an "unbiased" view, but I guess it would be good to make it from the dwarven viewpoint, as that is what we shall be playing. I'll revise it eventually.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 12, 2008, 11:23:08 am
Is there anything interesting going on in this fortress? About what size is the population?
what are some things that MUST be in?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 12, 2008, 11:30:31 am
I want it to be a fresh fortress, young. I don't want there to be more than a few rooms when we begin. Probably just a trade depot, entrance hallway, hub, food stockpile, and whatever else is aboslutely necessary for a fortress that's just getting off the ground. And I just added aboslutely to my dictionary. Damn you, Firefox and your spellchecker.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Helmaroc on August 12, 2008, 12:07:18 pm
If this actually happens, I may never leave my desktop again.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 12, 2008, 12:48:00 pm
Well, here's what I have so far:

-Edge of Fortress Territory: The starting point. Later paths can lead to trading partners and so on. A path East goes to the Road.

-Road: Traverses the area. Exits to Forest, Creek, Entrance.

-Creek: Water supply. Exits to Forest, Road, Creek Cave.

-Creek Cave: Point where Cave River becomes Creek. Exits to Creek, River Passage(Not mapped yet), Forest.

-Forest: Surrounding terrain; source of lumber and plants. May be jungle or other terrain, and may be split into quadrants. Exits to Creek, Creek Cave, Road, and Uphill.

-Uphill Slope: Scree-strewn rocky slope. This is climbing up into the mountains. Exits to Surface Chasm, Lower Mountains(Not mapped yet), Forest.

-Surface Chasm: The place where the Chasm meets the edge of the cliff. Exits to Upper Chasm, Uphill Slope.

-Upper Chasm: The highest reaches of the Chasm. Exits to (rest of chasm)(Not mapped yet), Surface Chasm.

Going back to the Road:

-Entrance: An ordinary hole in the cliff surrounded by a few workshops. Exits to Depot, Trapped Corridor.

-Depot: The trading post. Perhaps until shops open up inside, players can trade here too. Exits to Forest, Entrance.

-Trapped Corridor: Narrow passage, gently downward. Close inspection reveals latches and doorways in the stone that conceal rockfalls and a few cruel blades. Exits to Entrance, Main Hall.

-Main Hall: Starts small, but grows more ornate as fortress is improved. Also a good meeting area for players. Exits to Trapped Corridor, Hub, Barracks.

-Barracks: Place where newbies and "peasants" sleep, and where some sparring can take place. "peasants" being NPCs to liven up the place and get blown into gore by megabeasts. Exits to Main Hall (as guards should be close to any invaders entrance).

-Hub: Abstract-ish area. A tangle of corridors to the east of the Main Hall, connecting most areas of the fortress. Dropped items should move to the Main Hall, as this is not a room in the normal sense. Exits to Main Hall, Food Stockpile, Workshops Room, Quarters, Mines.

-Food Stockpile: Later to be the Dining Hall. Exits to Hub.

-Workshops Room: Mason's Shop, ect. Exits to Hub.

-Quarters: A hub devoted to private rooms. This is the hallway which all the Dwarve's quarters connect to. There is always an empty room and a generic occupied room, as well as each player's room. Exits to Hub, (player rooms), Empty Quarters(Not mapped yet). Dropped items stay here.

-Mines: The active digging area and source of ores, gems and stone (although most rooms start with a pile of loose stone in them, too.) Exits to Hub.

There you go. That's about the spring of the second year; we might just have gotten a few immigrants, everybody has a room or two, and we still have some areas that need expansion; particularly we need underground farms, more internal workshops, a well for the wounded, connections to a the features...

Also, presume that we have a few dozen stone trinkets and that the elves will visit in a few weeks.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: LeoLeonardoIII on August 12, 2008, 01:04:15 pm
My god.

What have you done?

*Leo has been struck down by a Grue*

(Now I'm going to spend several hours fooling around with this)
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on August 12, 2008, 01:57:25 pm
If you can all manage to either a.) export a map from DF that fits your specifications using the paint tool or b.) simply give me a detailed description of the area using cardinal directions, I'll do an ASCII map for you that we can put into the MU*.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 12, 2008, 02:11:25 pm
Well, I finally figured out how to use @odrop to create an "enters from" message, so I think I have all the basic concepts of building figured out. That's good. I think the current goal is to train enough people that they can train each other and everyone can build intelligently. I say we get some of the map done and then do the ASCII map.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Fualkner on August 12, 2008, 06:04:50 pm
Quote from: Lord Dullard on August 11, 2008, 10:50:39 pm
Quote from: Fualkner on August 11, 2008, 10:47:06 pm
Hah, I code. When you get right down to it, RPG's are all equations and lists. Not exactly brain-busting work. Just alot of it, plus deciding how exactly how you want the equations to work, tweaking, updating, etc.

Let me show you the code for my virtual inventory program sometime...

Well, I do use python, may be easier then in whatever you're using.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 12, 2008, 06:51:39 pm
regarding the general structure of the map, I propose that we don't have a hub, but rather an expandable grid of intersections. In this way, you go to the intersection you are interested in and dig there, allowing for more structure ("my quarters are in the northeast corner, by the butcher's shop") and easier navigation (instead of "you are in the hub exits are N, nne ,ne ,ene ,e ,ese ,se ,sse ,s ,ssw ,sw ,wsw ,w ,wnw ,nw ,nnw ,up ,down ,door ,my door ,+felsite door,...). I'll try some doodles to see what looks good.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 12, 2008, 06:57:20 pm
Makes sense. I used the hub only because it was so much work to link it all up. Now that we have the zones, even though most people can't place them, it should be easier.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Gaulgath on August 12, 2008, 07:17:42 pm
What about eating and drinking? Will it be required to survive? I've never played a MUD that required it (note: I have played very few of them) but I think it would be in the spirit of DF... of course, the main problem is that we could start having people dying because they weren't able to log in to their account for whatever reason and start dying of dehydration if they don't have any booze in their inventory.


Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Aqizzar on August 12, 2008, 08:37:08 pm
Quote from: Gaulgath on August 12, 2008, 07:17:42 pm
What about eating and drinking? Will it be required to survive? I've never played a MUD that required it (note: I have played very few of them) but I think it would be in the spirit of DF... of course, the main problem is that we could start having people dying because they weren't able to log in to their account for whatever reason and start dying of dehydration if they don't have any booze in their inventory.

I've played MUD's that tracked drink and food and it was annoying as hell.  Of course, that was a MUD and this doesn't have to work the same way.  Obviously the first point there would be that logged off characters don't get hungry/thirsty, like any sane MUD.  Having a system like that would help the DFness of the game, but any complaints will have to be addressed quickly.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 12, 2008, 11:33:39 pm
I don't think we're going to leave eating/drinking coded in, at least not to start. It's kind of a complex thing to do, and even more complex to do right. I think I'd rather just leave it as something that can be roleplayed.

We're getting closer and closer to launching the actual game, but feel free to come in and poke around. If I'm online, I can give you a few lessons on building, though that link I posted at the top should get you started.

EDIT:Grah! Did it just go down?
EDIT2:Guess not. Something funny is happening, though.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 12, 2008, 11:41:54 pm
(http://www.2funnyguys.com/layout plans.jpg)

The top left one is my idea.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 13, 2008, 12:42:31 am
We have exactly one official policy decision. All exits are to be named in the manner of: North;N or South;S. This will display North as the name, but accept N as a command, as well. Any exits not adhering to this code of conduct, at least in the final game, are subject to be changed without warning. Also, when creating a new room inside the fortress that is not a private room, please type @set here=chown_ok and then notify me or whoever is handling new constructions so that we I may come by and make it public, so that others can edit it as they need to.

Also, once we start building the actual fortress, please abide by the blueprints we will have set up. You have room to be creative in the descriptions, but we want the layout to be as uniform as possible.

EDIT: Notice that the above room exit rule has one exception; if you are making a bedroom or a similar room, please make the exit something like: "Tahin's Bedroom;TB" Unless TB is already taken by another exit in the same "hub" room. It is worth noting that I have been informed that eventually the room exits will be displayed in the format of "Name<FirstAlias>" Such that the above example would appear as "Tahin's Bedroom<TB>."

Also, the fortress layout is ICly debatable. Feel that we need a second dining room to match the second bedroom cluster? Ask your resident noble about it, and we'll see about changing the plans.

This is all just planning for the near future, of course, and everything is likely to change.
Please just get used to building with the "North;N" exit style, as otherwise it will be annoying and immersion breaking to move between rooms written by different players, as the exit styles might all be different.

Also, about the setting; This is not supposed to be strictly based on Dwarf Fortress. It's all right to make the occasional DF in-joke, but please don't make characters completely revolving around the flaws in the AI, and such. A joke is only funny the first few thousand times, although much of the internet doesn't seem to understand this.

Tahin sighs.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Nonanonymous on August 13, 2008, 12:52:16 pm
Considering running a kobold babysnatched by elves and sold to the dwarves...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 13, 2008, 01:16:42 pm
A question about map detail; on this scale, where do we want to fall, assuming the clearing is a good-sized meadow about 80 feet across.

0- You are in the forest. There is a big tree, a stream with a pond, a clearing, and a road here.
1- You are in the southwestern forest. There is a clearing, a stream, and a road here.
2- You are in the clearing; there is a road east from here, and a stream to the north.
3- You are in the northern end of the clearing. You could go south, or into the forest.
4- You are in the north-central clearing. You could go into the forest, or south into the center of the clearing, or wander around the edges to the east and west.
5- You are 40 feet from the center of the clearing. You can go n,ne,e,se,s,sw,w,nw.

In 0, the approximate size of the room is 400 feet squared; but a better metric is "the entire local area"
In 1, the size is more like half of that and is something like "everywhere within a five-minute walk of the center"
in 2, the size is "everywhere you can see from the center"
in 3, "everywhere you can see clearly enough to read"
in 4, "everywhere within three paces"
in 5, "a room for every tile in DF"

Personally, I think 3 is best because it gives you a very clear scale for a room.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Katsuun on August 13, 2008, 01:24:16 pm
Is anyone allowed to join the MU? I wont mess anything up.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 13, 2008, 01:26:26 pm
Quote from: Katsuun on August 13, 2008, 01:24:16 pm
Is anyone allowed to join the MU? I wont mess anything up.

Absolutely!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Katsuun on August 13, 2008, 01:41:24 pm
Well, my first try was met with disaster...  :-\
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Helmaroc on August 13, 2008, 05:10:26 pm
Nevermind.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 14, 2008, 01:18:57 am
We currently have two other topics related to this MUX:
A poll on how big an area each outdoor room should represent by PTTG (http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=22921.0), and
A contest to decide who can generate the best world to use for a history and worldmap, by me. (http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=22932.0)

Please visit these two topics, as we need your input.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on August 14, 2008, 05:43:38 pm
UPDATES
==================

I just want to let everyone know about some of the features that have been added so far:

Time/date/weather: This is the newest addition. Type +today in the game to see the current time/date/weather/moon phase. There are +help files available for the time system's use and how to use it while building to create time- and season-flexible room descriptions.

Time currently moves at a 4:1 ratio.

+Help System: As of yet there's not a whole yet here, but keep checking back for more. Eventually this command will contain documentation for all of the major in-game commands available to players.

Global Bulletin Board: The global bulletin board can be viewed with the +bbread command. For further instructions on how to read and post entries, see +help.

Game Appearance: I'm working on adding a lot of pizazz to the visual aspects of the MUX (at least, as far as text-only coding will allow). If you haven't check in for a while things are likely to look radically different.

Short Descriptions: Players can use the command: '&shortdesc me=<text>' to change their short descriptions. Short descriptions are snippets of information about what a player's character is currently doing that can be seen by looking at the room. These are eventually intended to function as a roleplaying aid. Players can also add &shortdescs to objects that will show up in the room.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Katsuun on August 15, 2008, 11:46:23 am
I'm still working on the wiki/tutorial. Once tahts up, I'll post the link on this board as well.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Asheron on August 15, 2008, 12:22:16 pm
Woohoo! I managed to get in and strike a most intrigueing conversation with PTTG. And I saw the staggering beauty of the dining hall. :D

Anyway, I haven't been able to find out yet how to do anything else for now. I'll be eagerly waiting for Katsuun's tutorial.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Katsuun on August 15, 2008, 12:53:06 pm
Here ya all go. To join up, passwords burningsock:

http://dfmux.wikidot.com/ (http://dfmux.wikidot.com/)

Its still not done and it still looks crappy, but I'm going off for now so I'm going to put it up anyways. There should be enough there to help you off for now.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 15, 2008, 01:46:37 pm
http://www.2funnyguys.com/Fortress%20Plans.dia

These are the existing plans for the Exterior area of the fortress. side-to-side connections are n/s and e/w doors, and corner connections are ne/se/sw/se.

To open the program, use Dia diagramming program:

http://dia-installer.de/index_en.html

Feel free to modify the file and post it here.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Katsuun on August 15, 2008, 02:32:37 pm
Quote from: PTTG?? on August 15, 2008, 01:46:37 pm
http://www.2funnyguys.com/Fortress%20Plans.dia

These are the existing plans for the Exterior area of the fortress. side-to-side connections are n/s and e/w doors, and corner connections are ne/se/sw/se.

To open the program, use Dia diagramming program:

http://dia-installer.de/index_en.html

Feel free to modify the file and post it here.

What does "immigrant spawn" refer to? Is that where new dwarves start off, or will there literally be npc dwarves?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 15, 2008, 06:45:22 pm
That's an excellent question. That would be "home" and it can be where any (N)PCs spawn.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: IndonesiaWarMinister on August 15, 2008, 08:13:57 pm
Well, the mu* is good. Because I can't code (yet) feel free to pick me as a tester!

 ;D
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Strife26 on August 16, 2008, 01:59:42 pm
This is intriging. Let's see if I can get it to work . . .
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on August 16, 2008, 02:56:27 pm

 While confusing(Mostly because I have never caught on to MUSH's), I find many fun moments here
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on August 16, 2008, 09:54:11 pm
I've posted a lot of stuff on the wiki. Check it out:
http://dfmux.wikidot.com/start

There's been a lot of progress, and I have created a new policy on exits:

They should be in the format of A Towercap Door;N;North or A Rubble-filled Corridor;W;West or A Rusted Ladder;U;Up.

This will make it display as <U>........A Rusted Ladder, and will be generally more navigable.
The previous format as related to private rooms branching off of a common hallway, however, stays.

All of this available in more detail on the wiki page, Building Guidelines.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Katsuun on August 20, 2008, 09:46:42 am
The wiki is coming on great, we have a lot done. Anyone who needs a guide for starting the game, check out our beginners guides:

http://dfmux.wikidot.com/basics (http://dfmux.wikidot.com/basics)

There are even more where that came from. And thanks to Tahin, who contributes to the wiki just as much, if not more, than me!  :)
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 21, 2008, 11:15:03 am
Anybody able to connect to the server? I couldn't get through.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Katsuun on August 21, 2008, 12:08:11 pm
Yeah, the server seems to be down today.  ???
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on August 21, 2008, 02:33:11 pm
It's Back! It's Back!!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 03, 2008, 11:35:17 pm
Second page? This unacceptable. In other news, Lord Dullard appears to have disappeared. I am offering nothing more than my eternal gratitude for his return, but it's rather important that he comes back as he's the only one here who knows how do code a combat system. Plus he's the only wizard, and our host.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on September 04, 2008, 02:57:31 am
I'm still about, I've just been on an incredibly tight schedule. I've just started up classes but my boss (one of them, anyhow) failed to make the appropriate schedule changes despite my having told him I was starting school. So for now I'm working WAY too much and getting way too little sleep.

I'll be back around ASAP.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 04, 2008, 03:23:54 am
Hehe. It's good to see you're still alive.

Well, hopefully you'll figure something out. That sounds unpleasant.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on September 04, 2008, 05:44:45 pm
Has oddities happen to Server???
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 05, 2008, 12:22:03 am
Quote from: PTTG?? on September 04, 2008, 05:44:45 pm
Has oddities happen to Server???

Apparently something happened. I didn't want to complain about it as I know how overworked you (LD) are at the moment, but I guess it needs to be brought to your attention.
In other news, my laptop is pretty much dead, now. It won't even get to the BIOS 99 percent of the time.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on September 05, 2008, 12:41:09 am
Hm. My apologies for the downtime, folks. I'm looking into what has caused this (at the moment I'm not certain, the server appears to be functioning correctly and I can't find any errors in the IP tracing services). I'll post back soon with any progress.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Lord Dullard on September 05, 2008, 12:43:27 am
The game is back up!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 05, 2008, 12:54:02 am
Yay!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Poltifar on September 21, 2008, 02:31:19 pm
not to sound rude, but is this still being worked on?
also, after seeing on the wiki the list of stuff and coding required before the DF MUX is ready to be played, i wanted to point out that it would be better to not use MUX or MUSH programming and coding and object libraries etc. simply because MUX and MUSH were not meant to support combat, crafting, and all the other stuff you are planning to code. after all, why re-invent the wheel? it would be much easier for the coders working on this project to simply start off from a MUD library which already has the combat backbone programmed.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on September 21, 2008, 07:34:19 pm
Yes, it is regularly worked on by a few members.
While they work, a couple more of us screw around with codes and creating insane objects, and generally having fun.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 21, 2008, 07:46:28 pm
It's being worked on. The main reason we're starting from scratch is that we want something that actually feels like Dwarf Fortress. Hacked off limbs and ridiculously overpowered arrows are a must, as are suicidal moods, artifacts, and masterpieces. The reason development is so slow is that we have only two coders, Lord Dullard and myself, and I'm still trying to learn enough to be useful, and LD is horribly busy right now.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Impending Doom on September 21, 2008, 08:37:06 pm
What gives? I tried to log in tonight, and it doesn't appear to recognize me. Is there some kind of server problem?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 22, 2008, 03:24:01 am
You can't log in, or you can't connect?

Sounds like you're trying to log in, and it's not letting you. Are you surrounding your name in quotation marks? Is you password right? We could try getting LD to change your password.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on September 22, 2008, 04:32:08 pm
More people should log in.
I basicly leave it running all the time I'm home.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Vaiolis on September 22, 2008, 06:57:26 pm
Sorry I'd get on more but I'm swamped with things to do, I shall return soon!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Poltifar on September 23, 2008, 06:40:45 am
Sadly i have no idea what to do on the MU* ounce i'm logged on... my creative processes are lacking. so i rarely log on anyways
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 28, 2008, 04:55:35 pm
There really isn't much to do yet. Sorry. We're working on getting some of the code out the way. Hopefully LD will have some more time on his hands soon.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on September 29, 2008, 03:58:10 pm
Is it just me or is the game down?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on September 29, 2008, 04:12:37 pm

 Down for me, too.

 Damn, and it seems somebody would be on now.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on September 29, 2008, 04:55:14 pm
I would be.
And I had an idea for somthing too...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 29, 2008, 10:53:47 pm
Comfirmed to be down. Ah well. Nothing happening anyhow.

I promise you we'll get this thing started/finished soon. I have plenty of spare time on my hands and I'm kind of learning to code, so I'll do it all myself if I have to.

If anyone with experience with MUXes, MUSHes, or MUCKs, or just coding in general would like to come forward to help, I'm sure it would be appreciated at this point.

EDIT: Oh, and if anyone wants me to put up a secondary server just in case this one goes down and you need something to do, I've been leaving my desktop on constantly lately, so I could potentially host something.

EDIT 2: It's back up, now.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on September 30, 2008, 08:41:38 am

 Hurah!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: IndonesiaWarMinister on September 30, 2008, 08:43:25 am
By the god! Quick! MAke the GCS!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on September 30, 2008, 08:48:57 am

 Without a combat system, it would not be quite as scary.

 But then again, we all have access to the kill command.

 Hmmm...

 
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on September 30, 2008, 04:39:33 pm
Is it down again?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Kalur on September 30, 2008, 05:36:23 pm
This is my first post :D anyway Yeah its down.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on September 30, 2008, 06:35:04 pm
It's down. Grr...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Kalur on September 30, 2008, 07:38:33 pm
It's up again  ;D
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on October 17, 2008, 05:20:21 pm
And down again.

Also, bump back to first.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: lastofthelight on January 06, 2009, 05:51:33 pm
Sorry to necromancy this - but did anything ever come of this? Reading over the old post, it seems like the idea died out. A pity. I found out about Dwarf Fortress from mushing, and know DF is a rather popular game for mushers. If it had been advertised on some of the popular mush-advertisement areas (mudconnector.com, OGR/Gateway, etc) I'm sure it could have worked.

Of course, this post will mean nothing to most of you, I guess...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on January 06, 2009, 06:09:08 pm
Quote from: lastofthelight on January 06, 2009, 05:51:33 pm
Sorry to necromancy this - but did anything ever come of this? Reading over the old post, it seems like the idea died out. A pity. I found out about Dwarf Fortress from mushing, and know DF is a rather popular game for mushers. If it had been advertised on some of the popular mush-advertisement areas (mudconnector.com, OGR/Gateway, etc) I'm sure it could have worked.

Of course, this post will mean nothing to most of you, I guess...

Lord Dullard vanished, and with him went the server.
A shame, we had some fun times on there.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Strife26 on January 06, 2009, 08:49:13 pm
The we have to find Dullard, don't we?

Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 06, 2009, 09:37:31 pm

 Ah, memories. I really wanted to connect that grotto to everybody else's rooms. Even a few days ago I thought of a fishing game that would be nifty.

 We must find Dullard and make him get it back up!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on January 06, 2009, 09:40:00 pm
Quote from: Duke 2.0 on January 06, 2009, 09:37:31 pm

 Ah, memories. I really wanted to connect that grotto to everybody else's rooms. Even a few days ago I thought of a fishing game that would be nifty.

 We must find Dullard and make him get it back up!

I agree.
I miss the MU*.
Dullard just vanished, with no warning or anything, I wonder what happened to him.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Kaelem Gaen on January 07, 2009, 06:00:31 am
CURSES! And I just found out about this now.   I bet them damn elves are behind it.  *Glares at their forests*  Anyone wanna throw a bonfire?
 
Anyways, sucks... wonder if anyone else will try and make their own version of it.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: mainiac on January 07, 2009, 11:17:50 am
I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, but it just ocured to me might be cool to make a MU* modeling a very disfunctional fortress instead of one where people co-operate.  Dwarven interactions are, to put not too fine a point on it, insane and it might be cool to go that route.  Everyone would be clawing at each other to try to ascend to the top of the pack and become mayor/treasurer/dungeon master (DM might not be an immigrant position in the MU*) etc. where upon they would mercilessly exploit their position to force others to do their ends (insane mandates much?) while at the same time trying to keep down the proletariot revolt.  Those who are successful enough at staying at the top can be considered to have "won" the rat race and would be given noble rank from which they can look down upon the peasant rabble and can now happily feud and backstab with other nobles, giving fresh blood a shot at competing for the lower rank.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 07, 2009, 11:43:04 am
Wow. I had nearly forgotten about this...

I wonder what happened to LD. If anyone out there with a decent connection and a spare computer is willing to host something, I'm more than happy to work as a builder or moderator or whatever. I'd love to see something like this.

I'd set something up myself, but my connection is terrible and goes down all the time. I do have a few spare computers, and it might be fast enough to handle a small number of connections with minimal lag... Hm.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on January 07, 2009, 04:12:44 pm
He is still around(last post late december, last active yesterday)
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: PTTG?? on January 07, 2009, 04:30:40 pm
Yeah, I'm for bringing this back, perhaps with some of Tahin's techno-magic engine. Or any kind of visualization, frankly.

Come to think of it, I belive we had an idea for giving each room a text description and a DF-style map. That would solve the argument over how long it should take to carve a room, too, as it would be simple enough to say it takes x minutes per square in the map.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 07, 2009, 04:35:21 pm

 No need to worry about traffic and lag. The most we ever had at once was six people online at the same time.

 I dunno, custom descriptions had their charm. Not to mention it was annoying as hell to type the quality modifiers every time you types an item. It would be best if it was formatted so you don't need to add the - on each side of the tiem name.

 Also, LD was working on a custom system for most DF things like combat and crafting.

 
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on January 07, 2009, 06:36:10 pm
I managed to write actual network code(!)  that would draw a 25x80 grid of #s to telnet.
(http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/3307/teldc7.png)
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Strife26 on January 07, 2009, 06:45:08 pm
Let's do this!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 08, 2009, 12:03:23 am
I really don't think a MUD/Roguelike would work terribly well.

What if we tried a different system? Dead Souls mudlib (http://dead-souls.sourceforge.net/) is pretty good, uses a C-like scripting language, and has a prebuilt combat system that's rather nice and detailed.

Oh, and it has some crazy detail. There's even scripts for diseases. Giving myself a cold when I was playing around with it was just eerie.

Also worth noting is that pretty much everything is softcoded, so there's none of the awkward commands like "+look" to get around the hardcoded commands of the same name. If you want the look command to do something else, you simply open up the appropriate file and change it.


EDIT:
Quote from: PTTG?? on January 07, 2009, 04:30:40 pm
Come to think of it, I belive we had an idea for giving each room a text description and a DF-style map. That would solve the argument over how long it should take to carve a room, too, as it would be simple enough to say it takes x minutes per square in the map.

Wait, what? How does that simplify it at all? How long should it take per tile, then?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 08, 2009, 12:36:19 am

 Of course, what system we use depends on how easily we can make custom commands. Digging our own rooms, crafting, etc.

 Although on looking at it, it does seem useful. Lets see.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 08, 2009, 01:02:58 am
Well, the only issue with LP-muds (That system I posted above falls under this category) is that items are handled in an object/instance fashion. You create a new file for each unique object you want, and simply spawn a copy of them. If we wanted truly customizable craftable objects, I'd have to find a way around this. It's possible that I could find a way to have object "classes" which the instances of could then store their individual quality and description, but I'm not sure if that's possible.

But I do really love that system. I think my favorite thing I ran into while playing around with it was when I "killed" an NPC with a wizard command, and his weapons and armor fell to the floor, rather than just disappearing along with his body.

Edit: All right, I take back everything I've said, except that this mudlib is fucking amazing.
It appears to store a "template" of the object as a file, but each individual instance of an object is stored separately as its own object. I may be way off with this, though, as I haven't really spent that much time digging around.

So, is anyone with extensive experience with LP-muds going to step forward?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Mephisto on January 08, 2009, 08:56:37 pm
If you guys are still looking for a system, how about taking a look at CoffeeMud? Setting up a server is super easy. From what I recall (which is from at least three years ago; lots of updates have happened since then), players could create rooms and all that good stuff. I believe there may have been a crafting system, too.

Admin-types can login through a web browser and modify all aspects of the game, including creating new rooms and setting up a map.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 08, 2009, 09:22:01 pm
Hm. That looks interesting, but it might be a bit complicated for what I'd like to do.

Does anyone here actually have some decent experience with a codebase?

I wish LD was still interested... Heh.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: lastofthelight on January 08, 2009, 10:21:23 pm
You know, if you guys do try and do this, I know of someone who offers free mu* hosting. I've never spoken to him, but I did (used to) have a paid account with his service, and it was very good. I saw his +finger on Gateway (its a mush which serves to advertise mushes, sortof like a mudconnector, but...for mushes)

This is his finger:

    Email: pmesritz@gmail.com
    Games: Staff Roles: Loon@AngrealMOO (1994-1996 - Roleplay); Destruction@BalanceMUSH (1995-1997 - Co-Head Admin); Kiri-Jolith@DragonlanceMUSH (1995-1996, 2004 - Code); Stranger@Shadowrun:Detroit (1997-2000 - Code, Head Coder, Head Wizard); Eclipse@Shadowrun:Seattle (1999-2002 - Head Coder, Head Roleplay); Asmodeus@Treyvan (2000-2002 - Head Admin); Kiri-Jolith@DL:AoM (2004-2007 - Head Admin); Xandar@DL:What If? (Alpha - 2008-Present - Lead Project); Xandar@many places (Game Consultant; Coder; Roleplay). Player Roles: Don't make me do this!
      WWW: http://www.isunlimited.net/ 
     Info: Looking for FREE hosting? Check out http://www.isunlimited.net/index.php/hosting/shared -- We have been up and running since January, 2006 and have a significant number of clients! Please feel free to @mail or page me with questions or follow the instructions on the website if you're interested in either the free or paying accounts. You can also log onto our information MU at isunlimited.net 2500. YES, the free accounts /really/ are free within the specs!
           We now offer colocated and dedicated hosting packages as well!
           http://clients.isunlimited.net/store allows you to sign up and request an account.
           @tel to our offices (#1154) and join our channel (addcom isu=ISUnlimited)   
    Quote: Involved in a call center? Take a look at my blog @ http://blog.mesritz.us/


As he notes, the site is http://www.isunlimited.net/index.php/hosting/shared

I don't really know why he'd offer free mu* hosting though, and I think someone else earlier said they had hosting. I'm just in favor of Dwarf Fortress, so I thought I'd point (the above) out, since I happened to  notice his advert while looking about for a mu* to play on.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 12:43:33 am
I think I could host easily enough, and I'd rather maintain control if at all possible. I have nothing against having someone else host, but it would be good if they were also the admin. Anyway, there are enough free mud hosts out there that that shouldn't be an issue.

I managed to compile and run Dead Souls, but my copy seems to be missing a few important commands and helpfiles. It all works fine on the demo mud, so I'm going to try an older version...

Okay, I got it compiled and it's running. It all seems to be working... Awesome.
If anyone's interested in learning LPC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LPC_(programming_language)) and helping me with this, I think this would be the way to go.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 09, 2009, 12:46:04 am

 I'll take a stab at it, but expect me to generally just dick around in the MUD with pre-built commands.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 12:53:03 am
Well there are some prebuilt building commands. I'll end up adding some skill-based building, crafting, digging, and whatnot, commands, at some point, if I actually get around to this. I'll have to balance this and my zombie action-roguelike, now... Oh well.

If anyone's interested, I guess you can telnet to 192.168.1.4 port 1050. I'll be up for another two hours. I'm interested in hearing if anyone can connect, actually.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 09, 2009, 01:03:19 am
 Got a connection timed out message. Code 10060.

 Does it have a name?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 01:10:05 am
Hm. I'm not terribly surprised...

Give me a half hour. I'll figure this out.

EDIT: Huh. They suddenly updated the download page to show that the one I was using previously was completely unsupported, and the one I'm using now is a bit behind, so I'll try compiling the latest stable release.

EDIT2: I stand corrected. The one I was just using was an unsupported alpha... Huh.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Mephisto on January 09, 2009, 01:13:40 am
192.168.*.* is a private address. It's also what many home routers use as the default range. Check out WhatsMyIP (http://whatsmyip.org) to find your external address.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 01:42:42 am
Thanks for the tip, Mephisto. All right, try 12.183.160.30 port 1050...

It's giving me a connection refused error when I try it... Something's wrong here...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 09, 2009, 01:44:31 am

 Yup, same error from me.

 Although I have to go to bed soonish. If you can get it working within the hour, I'll be on.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 01:46:01 am
It would be nice to figure this out. I've never had any luck with networking, so that's probably the biggest hurdle, right now...

According to all my googling, this should just be working. Help?

Edit: All right, I just realized that my router is probably the issue. Now I need to dig up the tiny piece of paper I have its info written on...
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 09, 2009, 01:50:02 am

 You checked the Dead Souls FAQ?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 01:59:05 am
Try it now.

Mwa hahahahaha!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 09, 2009, 02:02:33 am

 Works. Currently in default start place.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 02:34:14 am
Awesome. I'll get started learning this stuff so I can actually create something decent.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 09, 2009, 08:40:22 am

 Hmm, seems to be down again.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 11:53:17 am
Yeah. I was hosting it on my main computer, which I don't necessarily want to leave on all the time.

I'll get my old broken laptop set up hosting it so we at least have some sort of permanent meeting place.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 09, 2009, 12:03:20 pm

 I don't think it would be too intensive to host, so an old crappy thing would likely work fine.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 12:45:25 pm
Well, it's a little crappier than I thought. It refuses to boot up at all now, whereas previously it would boot about one in ten tries. I'll see what happens when I stick the ram I borrowed for another laptop back in, and then I'll tear it apart and see if anything is loose or broken.

For the record, it doesn't even power the screen on. Plugging a different screen in doesn't help. It appears to be a bios issue or something... Hm.

I'll just host on here, I guess. I'm leaving in a few minutes, though, but feel free to come on in and screw around.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 09, 2009, 11:19:39 pm
Sorry about the double post, but this is important.

I moved the server over to my desktop, which should work semi-permanently. The address is 12.183.160.30 and the port is 1050.

I have yet to touch anything, but feel free to come in and say hi and check out the system. Also, tell me if there's unbearable lag.

I'll figure out how to set up some sort of static address at some point. I'll have something interesting to play with soon, I promise.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 10, 2009, 12:38:55 am

 Now now, don't feel too rushed. As far as I can tell, it really is only us now. Also, I thought you had issues with having your desktop on all the time? Unless it's just a cooling thing, in which case you can get rid of some overclocking you must have done.

 I think. Never messed with that stuff myself.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 10, 2009, 01:17:33 am
No, it's issues with my laptop on. It crashes if I leave it on for more than 8 hours ever since I upgraded to Ubuntu 8.10. I'd install 8.04 again, but it works well enough otherwise and I hope a fix will be released eventually.

Have you tried logging in?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Strife26 on January 10, 2009, 01:29:56 am
Is it sort of working? I'm clueless for everything except this site, so I'll help if it's relaively stable.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 10, 2009, 03:47:35 am
What do you mean "working"? I haven't really touched any of the code, if that's what you mean, but it's all functioning well enough.

There's a sort of sample mud there that you can log in and play around with, if you want.
I'll work on learning LPC and figuring out how to work everything and such.

My plans for the immediate future are to write some simple commands for crafting and digging and such. It should be relatively easy to create a few "class" objects that describe a wide variety of potential items. For instance, I could make a sword class, each instance of which would function more or less as a sword, but would have its own quality, description, value, various statistics such as sharpness and durability, and so on and so forth based on the skill and decisions of the smith that made it. For  all I know, this may not be possible, but based on what I've read, instances of an object don't necessarily have to be exact copies of the object, so I should be able to get away with quite a bit.

Also, a grid-based digging system should be possible, where by if you choose to dig north, then west, then south, then east, you'll end up in the room you started in. I'll just assign each room x, y, and z coordinates, and check if the coordinates overlap with an existing room before creating a new one.

There's already a "Quick Creation System" coded into the game, so I should be able to copy most of that code and add some skill checks.

Overall, I'm pretty optimistic about this, but I could use some help.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 10, 2009, 05:35:09 am

 Sorry for not being on. Got two DF things to complete and lots of real-world stuff to work on.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Ryo on January 10, 2009, 09:11:16 am
I might be able to help - I'm fairly comfortable with C++, so I'd be happy to give LPC (You're using that, right?) a try. Though keep in mind that it may take me a while to get used to.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on January 10, 2009, 01:05:12 pm
So, how does the dwarf fortress aspect work?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 10, 2009, 01:25:35 pm
Well, I'm trying to get used to it as well, so that's hardly an issue.
If you want, log in and I'll make you a creator so you can mess around, or just download and set up your own copy so you don't have to use the terrible built-in editor while you're still trying to get used to other things. I'll see about setting up an FTP server once I have a few people helping me.

Quote from: qwertyuiopas on January 10, 2009, 01:05:12 pm
So, how does the dwarf fortress aspect work?

I intend for the game to function as a multiplayer dwarf mode game. You'll start in a wilderness area with a pick and some supplies and have to carve out a fortress. Each player will play a dwarf, and be able to use a variety of skills. Roleplaying will be enforced in In-Character areas, as I want the game to be about being a part of a community as much as possible.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on January 10, 2009, 01:51:11 pm
Well, after looking at it, this seems to be a good system.
When does the dev start?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 10, 2009, 01:55:38 pm
As soon as I figure out what the hell I'm doing and/or get someone else who does.

Oh, and sorry about it going down, just now. A breaker popped. It's back up. Damn my desktop's lack of batteries.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Denisius on January 10, 2009, 02:59:16 pm
This is a great idea, I hope it works out. You might want to take a look at the EmpireMud codebase, it might just be what you are looking for.

By the way, I have a shell lying around that I barely use, I can give you access to host the project on, if you want.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 10, 2009, 06:33:59 pm
Well, this seems to be working well enough at the moment, hosting it on my home computer. I found EmpireMUD on google, but it wouldn't load the website. I think I'll stick with Dead Souls, anyway. It seems to fit well enough. If some huge, glaring issue comes up, I'll see about switching to something else.

Unless of course, you're incredibly skilled at coding inn the EmpireMUD codebase and are interested in helping, then I'd definitely consider switching over.

Also, important:

The MUD can now be accessed at dfmud.no-ip.org port 1050. This should be more or less permanent, as long as nothing goes disastrously wrong.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Mephisto on January 11, 2009, 04:22:31 am
I'm getting pretty good with the QCS and CreWeb, if you happen to need another creator. ed seems to be fairly straightforward, also. There are two commands I'm thinking about trying to code that would be useful, also.

I can already program in one language and am learning a bit of C++ whenever I get back to school.

I'll screw around on my home computer a bit more and come back if I learn anything useful.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Denisius on January 11, 2009, 05:54:17 am
I have a copy of EmpireMUD on my computer, and I've uploaded it to my shell in-case you want to check it out.

"Offers a beautiful ASCII world map, along with the ability to craft, forge, mold, plant, harvest, dig, mine items. Along with players creating their very own empire which they build. Or join another players empire. (Just replace Empire with Fortress, and voila :-)"

www.erandia.net/empire.zip (http://www.erandia.net/empire.zip)
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Ryo on January 11, 2009, 08:40:12 am
I was just reading about Dead Souls and found this:
Quote
You may be surprised to learn that almost any manipulable object can be wielded as a weapon, or thrown as a missile. You can wield a can of Spam and try to kill an orc with it...and you may even succeed, if you are strong and tough enough.

You have to admit, this mudlib does seem extremely dwarven.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 11, 2009, 09:24:45 am

 Not to mention it tracks limbs and their respective damages.

 I had grabbed Tahins left foot the other day.

 I felt very dwarven when I threw it at a test fighter.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Mephisto on January 11, 2009, 01:09:48 pm
Quote from: Duke 2.0 on January 11, 2009, 09:24:45 am

 Not to mention it tracks limbs and their respective damages.

 I had grabbed Tahins left foot the other day.

 I felt very dwarven when I threw it at a test fighter.

Another dwarvenly trait: I took off two of a man's limbs that are never in a line with each other in the same hit. It was one of those "holy crap, I'm at home!" moments. Separated the left foot from the leg and the leg from the body.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 11, 2009, 02:45:34 pm
Yeah, it does that. If you sever a leg, it counts the foot as a separate body part, but tries to keep them together, so they fall off separately. Same with arm/hand.

Anyhow, I'm currently upgrading to the alpha, as it has support for persistent rooms, which means you'll be able to drop a piece of furniture and it will stay there between reboots. I'll edit this once it's back up. Expect it to take a few minutes.

EDIT: All right, it's up. Post here if you can't get in.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Hawkfrost on January 11, 2009, 07:48:57 pm
How do you get out of the ocean?
I walked into the water and sunk.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 11, 2009, 09:07:34 pm

 Happened to me too. Upon thinking this over, we should keep the deadliness but post warning signs.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on January 11, 2009, 09:29:13 pm
say yeah
say that would be a great idea
say I spent almost all of yesterday playing from TELNET
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 12, 2009, 01:32:37 am
What's there at the moment isn't something I made or anything. It's just the examples. It's far from perfect, but once I set up the actual game, you'll never see it.

Also, I have per-room persistence figured out. It works exactly as it should, preventing the mud from wiping any objects within the room.

I don't know if there's a way to toggle mud-wide persistence, but it shouldn't be necessary, as it will be trivial to create an in-character room parent with this feature.

I'm close to figuring out how to write "crafting" commands. I don't currently have a runnable command, but I think I'm close.

Once I figure a few things out, setting the game up should be pretty simple. The only hard part I foresee is making sure that the digging and crafting commands can't be exploited to bring my computer to a halt.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 24, 2009, 06:49:30 pm
To generate a little new interest (which is the only thing that keeps me working on this at times) and to show that I am still at least thinking about it:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Yes, it's horribly messy and is probably missing a lot of stuff. Tell me if I forgot anything.

Once I have all that done, it's just a pretty simple overhaul (complete gutting) of the class/leveling system and a long list of purely aesthetic changes.

If I could get a few people with some programming experience to help me out, that would be great. The system I'm working with isn't too terribly complicated, it's just a little messy and poorly-documented, but the community is surprisingly helpful.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Duke 2.0 on January 24, 2009, 07:02:13 pm

 So, working on changing the flavor? Did you get the digging skill code done, or is that still yet to be made?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 24, 2009, 07:34:58 pm
I haven't really done any actual coding, yet. I'm still trying to figure out it's all going to be structured. Those there are my preliminary plans.

As I said, I could really use some help.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Fenrir on January 25, 2009, 03:03:46 pm
I wish that I was above Dabbling Programmer so that I could help. Is there no one else willing to help Tahin?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 25, 2009, 03:54:26 pm
I'm actually happy to teach anyone who's willing to learn. I myself am pretty much a dabbling programmer, but I'm getting it.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on January 25, 2009, 04:34:36 pm
Partial room solution: The decsription is ONLY a function, with no text. The function can check the whole room for interesting changes each time.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Fenrir on January 25, 2009, 06:19:51 pm
Fenrir says, "Thanks again for the wolf costume, Tahin."
Fenrir smiles happily.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 26, 2009, 12:49:03 am
In response to Qwertyuiopas, I can overwrite the GetLong() and such functions of the various objects, which would allow me to keep it updated without constantly updating it. The issue is that I'd also have to copy most of the GetLong() code over to a new function, as I think the inventory display and whatnot is in there, too. That doesn't sound too complicated, actually.

I'm not going to get started on the code just yet. I think I'll work on learning the system better by making small, asthetic changes, swapping out useless OOC commands like "shout" and "tell" for commands that make more sense in an IC context. Also, it should tell you which direction someone enters from.

To Fenrir, you're welcome. Tell me if you want a different description; I can do it in a few seconds.

Also, I need to figure out a way to stop someone from moving around while they're crafting or digging. I think "paralyzing" them is the simplest answer, but I don't know yet if that is linked to stamina or not, and whether or not it will force them to fall down. Maybe I can copy over some existing code, or something.

Also, I need to figure out how to add things to the "stop" command so you don't get stuck digging while a goblin hacks your legs off.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on January 26, 2009, 07:44:30 am
In-string functions. you know, the "(:function:)".
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on January 26, 2009, 11:17:41 am
Oh, those. I haven't really gotten into those yet, but they look promising. That's actually a good idea. Hm.

I'll try that.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 01, 2009, 12:28:29 am
Update:
I have the following changes completed thus far:
*Shout and yell are now synonyms, no mudwide in-character communication.
*Shout/Yell now tell you the direction which they come from, rather than just being from a distance. This was a huge pain in the ass, but I now understand how it's all set up a lot better.
*OOC command to speak out-of-character. Works exactly like say except bypasses the language code.
*I may have a host lined up. We'll see.

A few things that haven't changed:
*I still need help. Badly. Just someone with a decent understanding of programming who can be on occasionally. I can't pay you.
*I'll have it done eventually. Progress is slow because I'm still learning the system.

Things that will be done soon:
*I hope to have some preliminary digging/crafting code in place soon so people can come in and try it break it.
*Now that I have yell directions figured out, I'll tackle entrances. Currently it just says "<name> enters" which isn't very descriptive. It should be simple if I can figure out where in the code the actual message is sent, which can be difficult.

Things that will be done eventually:
*The wilderness map
*The digging/crafting/woodcutting/farming/etc. code.
*I'll need to figure out a way to let people install doors. It might be a bit tricky, but overall simpler than the digging code will be.
*Levelless/Classes skill-based experience system

Sorry about the triple post. I feel that this should be bumped. Maybe I should make a new thread in the other games forum, as that seems to be the place for this kind of thing...

I guess I should mention that the reason I haven't taken up the person who offered to host it or asked for a host here was because I'm cautious about letting someone with an "interest" in the MUD host it. I'd just rather have a quasi-professional relationship with my host.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Mephisto on February 01, 2009, 12:36:56 am
Quote from: Tahin on February 01, 2009, 12:28:29 am
*Now that I have yell directions figured out, I'll tackle entrances. Currently it just says "<name> enters" which isn't very descriptive. It should be simple if I can figure out where in the code the actual message is sent, which can be difficult.

I may be off track, but are you talking about ./lib/lib/messages.c? It's got what appears to be the enter/leave text right at the top.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 01, 2009, 01:29:30 am
Yeah, but I need to write code that looks at the direction you went and formats it properly and all that.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: qwertyuiopas on February 01, 2009, 11:48:37 am
lib/lib/living.c, morre than halfway down.
Quote
Code: [Select]
varargs int eventMoveLiving(mixed dest, string omsg, string imsg, mixed dir){
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 01, 2009, 02:44:26 pm
Well, that's interesting... Thanks!

This system can be hard to navigate at times because of the way all those libs are entangled like that. Breaking talk.c causes about 5 other libs to fail to load; It's insane.

I'll see if I can get that working today, and then I'll look into the digging code, as it's going to be a lot more complicated than anything else.

I guess I should mention that if anyone tries to log on and it either logs you out immediately or throws up an error about "work being done right now" it probably means I'm screwing around with something and managed to generate a syntax error. Wait a few minutes and try again.

I just got around to looking at that function, and that's it! Thanks, Qwertyuiopas!
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 01, 2009, 10:52:49 pm
I got it! Woo!

I've got movement announcing the direction one enters from, now, even with crawling and flying and such. If I could get a few people to come in and bug test it, that would be awesome. I think it mostly works, now.

I had to wipe all the players because I'll be damned if I have to go through each player file and update it for the new system. This is not the first time this will happen. All the creators are still there, however. Your playerfiles have been manually updated, so tell me if I screwed something up.

I've also added a "time" command, which is probably a bit buggy right now. Tell me if the time of day is off for the actual hour. It also doesn't round; it just takes the hour and gives you that as the time. I'll fix that eventually.

If I could get a few people to help me test these things out, that would be nice. They're small, but very prone to bugs.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Rockphed on February 05, 2009, 01:56:21 am
Too bad Lord Dullard isn't around anymore, else we could get him to put a link to a useful Mud Client(as well as the current address for the Mud) in the first post.

I was messing around yesterday, and discovered that I can chase beggars around town while brandishing a flashlight.  I therefore approve of this Mud's Engine.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 05, 2009, 05:00:18 pm
Heh. I'm going to start a new thread in the "Other Games" forum once I have something interesting to show off other than a few minor tweaks. Also, the address and port is in my sig which is all throughout this thread anyway, but a list of decent mud clients would be nice to put up somewhere.

In other news... I'm going to see if I can get a basic digging system up and running using virtual rooms this weekend.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Bouchart on February 05, 2009, 10:54:17 pm
I'm interested in helping, though I'm pretty much a dabbling programmer myself.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 06, 2009, 12:35:42 am
Dabbling is fine. I'm just looking for someone who can be on a lot, providing moral support and the like, and possibly help with the coding. I'm willing to make anyone a trial creator at this point, as I could really use some help.

If you log in some time (I should be available all day tomorrow and until about midnight, Pacific time, tonight) I'll get you started and show you around a bit.

Also worth noting: I'm actually more or less happy to teach people with very little experience with coding. It's almost better because then we'll be on the same page. All I request is that if you aren't good at remembering things, please take notes. I hate explaining something to the same person more than twice.

Worth noting, as well: all of the trial creatorships are a very short-term thing, so don't be surprised if you log in one day to find yourself demoted to player. I'm happy to let people play around with the code, but if you're generally inactive, I probably will demote you after a while, as the creator save directory filling up kind of bugs me. If you want to take a look at the code without the risk of your precious creations being spontaneously deleted, check out the demo mud at alcatraz.wolfpaw.net port 8000. I don't think he makes a point of deleting inactive accounts.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 08, 2009, 08:21:50 pm
All right, I've made quite a bit of progress, though most of it isn't visible at the moment.

The Who output is now a bit... nicer. I might have overdone it, though, so tell me what you think.
I've changed the welcome screen.
I'm now updating the news page on a regular basis as I change things or make progress in my various projects. This is as much for your benefit as for my own, as I need a place to keep notes on what I've changed so if I upgrade to a newer version (which I really should sometime soon to get that damn atmosphere code working...) I'll know what I need to copy over. Note that you'll now need to type "news" to access this, as I've received complaints that having a few screens of text pop up when you first log in is none too pleasant.

Anyway, the main thing I've done is my virtual room code. They can't be accessed from the game world, nor can they be edited with commands, but they're almost in working order. In fact, they work perfectly aside from spewing up error messages every time I update them, but they update fine otherwise. I'll track that down and then see about writing some commands. Then I'll add some skills and whatnot and get mining working. From there, I'll probably figure out the crafting code, and then rip out the leveling system and code something else in its place.

My point is, this all seems promising.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Bluerobin on February 10, 2009, 01:50:30 pm
Well this is neat.  I've devved on another MUD before, but I got swamped with real life before I made any meaningful contributions  :-\.  It's been around long enough that the base has been pretty heavily modified and I think it started with a different MUD base system anyway... I'm going to say I'm interested in helping out and I want to get in on this.  I'm Zyll in the MUD, just so you know. 

EDIT: That being said, I have a fair amount of coding experience, but none of it is with C/C++ and the MUD devving experience I have was abstracted out a level, so I wasn't fiddling with the guts of the MUD, just room descriptions and NPC creation mainly.  I'll read up a bit on the LPC wiki link you sent and the mudlib when I get a chance.

EDIT AGAIN: I just read through the wikipedia site and I feel like I know what I'm doing, so that's bound to be a good sign.

AND A THIRD (and fourth and beyond) TIME (I'm bored, so sue me): A killed a rat!  Apparently there's a fake wall in the basement of the school.  Neat.  Also, I decided I should actually read the news you posted on the MUD and saw the stuff about the digging system.  I'm really interested to see how you're doing that.  This just struck me as something that might actually be possible, which is pretty cool.

After looking into LPMUD a bit it turns out the MUD I was devving for (Lost Souls) is originally based on LPMUD. Funny how that works out.  Anyway, they've done a heck of a lot with it, but nothing that lets players mess with the actual rooms (yet anyway, I hear there's something about a player-run area in the works) or craft anything.  I don't see why that wouldn't be possible though, with enough determination on the part of coders.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 10, 2009, 08:20:26 pm
I've got digging more or less figured out, actually. I'm just using a virtual room with the individual room info stored in a daemon.

Crafting's easy, as objects are stored as instances and can store their own values for things separately of everything else. I can just clone a generic sword item and give it the appropriate description and stats based on how well it was crafted and the choices made.

Anyhow, welcome aboard.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: XD! on February 13, 2009, 08:49:22 pm
-Snip- Question answered ingame.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 14, 2009, 02:25:26 pm
Sorry if anyone has been unable to connect. My power's been off and on lately, and I've given up trying to keep the server up, for now.

There isn't much to see anyway, but sorry, Zyll, if you wanted to work on that code a bit more. If you have any questions feel free to email me at tahin23@gmail.com or send a private message through this forum. I don't know how much longer my connection's going to hold out.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 14, 2009, 05:01:58 pm
It's back up again, if anyone's interested. Not sure how long that will last.

Each time my router reboots it gives my computer a new internal ip, which means I have to change all my port forwarding stuff. I hate winter.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Bluerobin on February 14, 2009, 07:20:34 pm
You might be able to give your computer a static IP address on your router so you don't have to change it each time.  I know that works on my router at my parents' house, but my router in my apartment doesn't save them for some reason, so yours may or may not work.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 20, 2009, 08:37:25 pm
Yeah. I can't figure that out without everything dying horribly. Damn Linux... Luckily the power has ceased turning on and off, for now.

Now, an update. I've been sick. Very sick. Ill. Lying in bed, virtually unable to move, cursing the gods for my condition.
I'm feeling a bit better now, but I've gotten nothing done in the last 8 days if my "devlog" is to be trusted.

I've noticed some weird bugs cropping up, so I am starting over with a clean slate. Persistent rooms are now working properly again, which is a good thing, and all of my old commands and aesthetic changes are back in place. However, I fear to move any of the save files over from the old copy lest issues start up again, so all character information, even for creators, has been wiped. I still have the backups, so if anyone has a project they were working on that they'd like me to restore, I can easily copy the files over.

This will likely be my last post in this thread, as I intend to move over to the "Other Games" forum. It's safer there.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Rockphed on February 21, 2009, 12:18:07 am
Quote from: Tahin on February 20, 2009, 08:37:25 pm
This will likely be my last post in this thread, as I intend to move over to the "Other Games" forum. It's safer there.

When you start the new thread, could you please put a link at the end of this one?
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 21, 2009, 12:56:11 am
Sure. I'm not going to post the new thread until I have a rough alpha type thing up, which will probably be a few weeks assuming I do get better soon. Damn my weak immune system.

I guess that wasn't my last post in this thread.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Bluerobin on February 21, 2009, 01:30:54 pm
Hey Tahin, just wanted to let you know I found this: http://lpmuds.net/forum/index.php?topic=916.0

That should help a bunch with crafting once I figure out all of what's going on there.  If nothing else, it's a really nice example of a pretty much complete system.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on February 21, 2009, 05:53:57 pm
I've looked at that briefly. It's interesting, but I think I want to do something a little different.

Also, this seems to be a decent enough place for this thread, for now. Once I'm ready for an alpha/beta test, I'll start a new thread so I can have the actual address in the first post. In fact, maybe I'll just start a new thread, as that's probably really confusing.

EDIT: Well we've got some exciting new developments. The digging system is now "functional." It's very rough, isn't skill-based, is instantaneous, and doesn't even echo to you or the room what you just did, but it works. I'll work on making it take some time, be skill-based, and then get all the descriptions and whatnot figured out. Then on to crafting.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Deon on February 28, 2009, 12:42:27 pm
Wow, a MU* with digging AND dwarves? I'd love to play it.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Poltifar on March 04, 2009, 10:16:55 am
Yay, I was hoping the mud would come back up. now for my two cents:

-As I've mentioned before in this mud's development (i think i did, i'm too lazy to check), if you want a REALLY object-based system to program a mud, AND one that can be coded 100% 'real-time', go with a MOO-type MU*, like LambdaMOO. Not only is EVERYTHING object based, every single item, room, and every command right down to stuff like the logging in system and such (ok, some very basic commands are still hardcoded, but really, that doesnt count...), its also all stored in a single 'database' file seperate from the 'server' files, and all those codes are typed and inserted right into the database and able to run instantly without any loading or whatever. I'm not sure if its the same thing with LP muds, but it seems not, as you've mentioned 'stuff.c' files and such. with MOOs, its just one big active file. Sadly, the big disadvantage to using a MOO is that, although its incredibly flexible, there are no publically-available 'starting packages' for RPG games. So everything down to the basic combat system would need to be coded by us. If we could manage that, it would be an awesome and quite flexible thing, but i think all here would prefer to not start something that could be really complicated. But other that that, atleast there are decent enough tutorials and a few extensive 'programmer's manuals' that detail all the commands available and such.

-Whatever MU* server you end up using, i'd like to join in! After reading Tahin's post about him not liking to have too many creators around, and preferring active ones, I think i'd join just as a player, because although i know how to code a bit in a few languages (mostly VisualBasic, PHP, and MySQL), i'm highly unreliable and have a quite random schedule :P
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Bluerobin on March 04, 2009, 11:22:33 am
haha yeah... so far I've basically been moral support.  Hopefully once the mini-hell of today is over I'll be coding up the ground work for the crafting system, though.  That should be fun.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on March 04, 2009, 04:42:08 pm
I have yet to see any of your code for that, if you even have some, but it sounds like you're figuring it out.

About the thing about full object oriented and real-time coding, that's what this codebase does. I've never used MOO before, but it sounds about the same. The code is an interpreted c-like language, and it uses .c and .h file just like C, but it's entirely realtime, no recompiling involved.

And Zyll/Bluerobin427, you've been pretty helpful thus far, actually. Even just having someone with a basic knowledge of the code around to help me with debugging is helpful, and you're learning quickly. In quite a few ways you're a better programmer than I am, which isn't really saying much.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Bluerobin on March 04, 2009, 05:16:46 pm
Aww... *warmfuzzies*.

Anyway, time for crafting!
...after a brief WoW interlude.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: eerr on March 05, 2009, 01:32:21 am
i downloaded one of the clients but it won't connect

new info please

:current download link
:server location
:login information
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on March 05, 2009, 01:48:07 am
It's all in my sig, but I guess it doesn't hurt to post it again. Seriously, I'll start a new thread and have it in the first post once I don't feel like it would be overeager start one at this point.

Address: dfmud.no-ip.org
Port: 1050

To login, just type a character name and hit enter. This can be up to 20 characters not including punctuation (Spaces, apostrophes, dashes, and so on), and 25 including. Then you'll have to type a password twice and answer a bunch of annoying questions which I'll remove once I care enough to figure out how. Logging in after this is just a matter of typing your character name, hitting enter, then your password, and enter again, and you're in, assuming you typed it correctly.

I've been meaning to mention this for a while, and now is as good time as any, but this system doesn't include spaces and such when parsing character names. If you are faced with three characters, named Urist Axeblazes, Urist Sabrestorms, and Urist Handgods, the command "say to Urist Axeblazes Hello." will likely result in the output "You say to Urist Handgods, "Axeblazes Hello."" What you would want to type is "say to uristaxeblazes Hello." Which would target the proper character. Note that "look Urist Axeblazes" will still work properly, as it's not actively looking for a space in there, and "look first/second/third urist" should work as well.

Also, Zyll, check your mail.

EDIT: Oh, and I should really add: Sorry about the lag. It gets pretty bad sometimes. Of course, everything's currently under development anyway, so it's not like it would be playable without lag.
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: eerr on March 05, 2009, 11:23:12 pm
what if i would like to help code?

edit: mushclient is great for logging on

don't know what i would do now though
Title: Re: Dwarf Fortress MU* Discussion
Post by: Tahin on March 06, 2009, 02:44:41 am
Welcome aboard. We'll see if this works out.

I've started a new thread at http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=31865.0 as this one was getting out of hand. Unfortunately I can't lock this one. Please let this monstrosity sink to the murky depths of the forum.