There's a thread for this already, it's just cooling down.
Ok guys, I'm locking this up, it was fun, but the shitposting is just getting too much. Feel free to create other threads as needed.
*hides his steel beams*You better get rid of these more permanently. I got some jet fuel if you need some, I know a guy...
What steel beams? *whistles a tune*
Does he work on the inside?*hides his steel beams*You better get rid of these more permanently. I got some jet fuel if you need some, I know a guy...
What steel beams? *whistles a tune*
Does he work on the inside?
Page 1 shitposting.
*tennis clap*
This is why Europe can't have nice things.
Malvinas
So apparently sweden may be trying something interesting? (http://www.sciencealert.com/sweden-is-shifting-to-a-6-hour-workday) Starting to shift over and run experiments and whatnot on rolling with six hour workdays. Anyone closer to the place hear anything about this?I wonder what it is about Sweden that makes it a country so receptive to social experiments. I'd say they're the world's human petri dish but that title belongs quite literally to Iceland. Nonetheless I am appreciative that they run headlong first, if they succeed they succeed.
So apparently sweden may be trying something interesting? (http://www.sciencealert.com/sweden-is-shifting-to-a-6-hour-workday) Starting to shift over and run experiments and whatnot on rolling with six hour workdays. Anyone closer to the place hear anything about this?I often wonder if I should be jealous of Sweden, having a government that seems to care about being sensible.
Yes, it's an internal work, as it were. Met him through a friend of mine who used to be his co-worker, now works in gardening, specializes in grooming shrubbery. Tough business, because most people want it done on Saturdays and he refuses to work then for religious reasons.Does he work on the inside?*hides his steel beams*You better get rid of these more permanently. I got some jet fuel if you need some, I know a guy...
What steel beams? *whistles a tune*
Apparently one more high-speed train was stopped for several hours for security reason after someone locked himself in the toilet.Is this a metaphor for your locked toilet thread being derailed by loud whispers high speed shitposting ?
You mean original post shitposting right?Page 1 shitposting.
*tennis clap*
This is why Europe can't have nice things.
To be fair, most of them are saving on PTW-style empty posts. Mainiac is the only person in that chain that's posted more than once in this thread.
...no relation to any other threads whatsoever....This qoute is the shitation for my shitpost.
Rules for the thread:
- No Catalonia
- No Malvinas
- No accusing other forumites of ruining your country, even if true
- No accusing other forumites of runing their own country, even if true
- No ruining other forumites country intentionally
But in all seriousness:
- If you must shitpost, end every shitpost with "I am a shitposter disregard my opinions."
- Do not spam the thread. Spamming the thread with shitposts is twice as bad, and in an emergency will result in temporary
MerkelMartial Law.- Leave your steel beams by the door.
- Be calm and chill, remember to post citations to your assertions.
I'm pretty sure USA has been centralized for a couple centuries already, and if you're implying that USA has experienced "death of innovation", then I've a bridge to sell.
1) Goal post shifting.I'm pretty sure USA has been centralized for a couple centuries already, and if you're implying that USA has experienced "death of innovation", then I've a bridge to sell.
Innovation in a technological sense, No. But innovation In a social economic sense? Fuck yes.
SirQuiamus, actually its partly the case, when you look at sutff like state shelling hundreds of millions to try to bring spaceport within their border and so on.
Anyway, I was browsing the economist to avoid meaningful work, and I stumbled on this snippet (http://www.economist.com/news/britain/21670501-another-northern-city-says-yes-elected-mayor-and-lots-more-money-sheffield-steals-march) about Sheffield signing some kind of deal with the Central government, agreeing to elect a mayor in exchange for some cash. It also mentioned that Manchester signed a deal giving the city control over health-care spending. What the hell is going on, is England turning into a confederation of city-state or what?
SirQuiamus, actually its partly the case, when you look at sutff like state shelling hundreds of millions to try to bring spaceport within their border and so on.
SirQuiamus, actually its partly the case, when you look at sutff like state shelling hundreds of millions to try to bring spaceport within their border and so on.
Anyway, I was browsing the economist to avoid meaningful work, and I stumbled on this snippet (http://www.economist.com/news/britain/21670501-another-northern-city-says-yes-elected-mayor-and-lots-more-money-sheffield-steals-march) about Sheffield signing some kind of deal with the Central government, agreeing to elect a mayor in exchange for some cash. It also mentioned that Manchester signed a deal giving the city control over health-care spending. What the hell is going on, is England turning into a confederation of city-state or what?
The bolded bit sounds rather corrupt to me. Unless theres something wierd about English politics that I'm missing.
2) I'm pretty sure that USA still has more "social economical" innovation than most of the world's countries. Africa, South America, East Asia...More than Europe, really. Most new trends regarding ideology, civil rights, economics, etc etc come to Europe from the US. All we have are intellectuals who don't really have an impact on society-wide dialogue. Hell, how many people here have even heard of Habermas?
Flame-haired firebrand McKenzie, 47, also warned the museum that having a top and hat and cape hung on a peg in the room would "cause offence to every victim of sexual abuse".You know at least when maoists destroyed their own culture they had the excuse of having nothing better to do. Plus, they looked much snazzier whilst doing so. I never did and never will understand why postmodernist cultural marxists are so fond of destroying any semblance of European heritage. I will defend London's kosher killer not in spite of his ugliness, but because of it. Also haha, east london again. From history till contemporary it's always been a bit dodgy. Alas, from my Jamaica roads to Olaf courts the marxists seem fond of making everything look the same. Then on the national level you have that thing where they teach nothing of their own nation's history if only to disparage it, and hilarious do stuff like rebuilding a Prussian palace as a postmodernist museum of African art. And the European Union spends billions of Euros bribing Yuros with their own money in their "regional development" funds to make millions of red haired architects, so many they blot out the sun and tear down all your historical buildings to make way for stone vaginas.
"Not that they'd admit now, but all three were very generous about Jeremy Corbyn and were supporting him. Now he's come into the centre more, they are not so keen."
McKenzie and Nicholl are both members of Class War's Women's Death Brigade who will be leading today's protest.
Mr Walker added: "They wanted the Ripper's sitting room removed and replaced by an exhibition space promoting socialism, anti-capitalism and rallying against the banks.
"That was a daft idea frankly for a Jack the Ripper Museum and we said no."
*snip*What's "European heritage" supposed to mean in this context? Jack the Ripper? Post citations to your assertions, m8.
I think that the distinction between GM and GM-free crops is completely frivolous, and that people will eventually get over it. They got over dehydrated food, after all. Preservatives are a bit more of a stickler (it is actual ingestion of questionable chemicals into the body which aren't 100% studied, but we've gotten really good at making sure that it's all safe at this point), but that one's dying down too.GM crops are not genetically engineered to be resistant to pests, they are genetically engineered to be resistant to stronger pesticides that they shouldn't have to spray too much of since it's a strong one and the plants don't mind it
Is it ironic that GM-free foods can frequently wind up being less safe than GM foods because of the pesticides used in GM-free foods versus foods that can be genetically modified to simply resist the pest? Not sure if any company has actually done that though; if not, they should.
GM problems are mainly one of Monsanto being almost cartoon-evil, or so I've heard.They're a bit Disney evil from time to time
I think that the distinction between GM and GM-free crops is completely frivolous, and that people will eventually get over it. They got over dehydrated food, after all. Preservatives are a bit more of a stickler (it is actual ingestion of questionable chemicals into the body which aren't 100% studied, but we've gotten really good at making sure that it's all safe at this point), but that one's dying down too.GM crops are not genetically engineered to be resistant to pests, they are genetically engineered to be resistant to stronger pesticides that they shouldn't have to spray too much of since it's a strong one and the plants don't mind it
Is it ironic that GM-free foods can frequently wind up being less safe than GM foods because of the pesticides used in GM-free foods versus foods that can be genetically modified to simply resist the pest? Not sure if any company has actually done that though; if not, they should.
Well, I know that generally that is the case. I'm saying that they could genetically engineer a resistance to pest. They just prefer to make money selling both the crop and the pesticide.
Jack the Ripper is knife deep in East London history m8,You mean he's some kind of folk hero around there? Gr8!
*architecture rant* [LW confirmed Prince Charles.]That's very enlightened of you, but how is that a Cultural Marxist thing if people of every possible political orientation have been eager to demolish old buildings at some point of time? The biggest architectural atrocities in Finland were committed during the 60s and 70s, and they absolutely, positively had nothing to do with culture, Marxism, or indeed any ideology besides cold, hard cash.
So apparently sweden may be trying something interesting? (http://www.sciencealert.com/sweden-is-shifting-to-a-6-hour-workday) Starting to shift over and run experiments and whatnot on rolling with six hour workdays. Anyone closer to the place hear anything about this?I often wonder if I should be jealous of Sweden, having a government that seems to care about being sensible.
Monsanto is one of those companies that has scary amounts of power, scary amounts of potential to abuse and grow that power, combined with a scary history.Private armies, private armies of lawyers, private bees, private scientists, secret science bases; on the one hand this is horrible but on the other hand I am most pleased that Bond villains are real. I hope Monsanto finds an excuse to build a volcano base in Hawaii or something, and begins employing Serbian war criminals with robotic prosthetics.
Not saying that our cyberpunk future is inevitable, but Monsanto would have to be one of the major considerations for it.
Monsanto is one of those companies that has scary amounts of power, scary amounts of potential to abuse and grow that power, combined with a scary history.Yeah, some of the companies peddling the newer stuff is a bit concerning, but GM in general is seriously good shit. Potential to do a hell of a lot in a lot of areas, already helping out pretty substantially in a bunch of places -- the pesticide related parts isn't even half the equation. Ruggedization (or whatever the hell it's called) of crops is a bit part of already existent and up and coming stuff, just as a example, and opens up some hella' venues for a lot of the rougher parts of the world. We've been doing this stuff for a long bloody time, s'nice to see the development of better tools and techniques finally kicking into high gear. Just a bit of a shame about the reactionaries, heh.
I used to dislike Monsanto too, but I realized recently that they do the things they do for the same reason the pharmaceutical industry is so protective of their intellectual property. It probably won't surprise anyone who cares to think about it that genetic engineering is a difficult and expensive process, that requires an even greater amount of difficult and expensive research to get right. If they slack off on protecting their IP, they'll be in a situation where they sink ridiculous sums of money into developing new strains of crops only to have that strain get out there one way or another and they won't be able to recoup their investment.Easy for em to sell infertile seeds, it's also the responsible thing to do so ubercrops don't end up dominating the countryside
They're in an even more precarious position than the pharmaceutical industry in that regard, because it's much easier for people to reproduce their product. Easy enough that it can happen accidentally. When you consider their standing from their shoes, the litigiousness and the terminator genes start making a little bit more sense. I don't know enough about their business to say whether or not it's actually necessary, but it's certainly more understandable thought of that way.
Edit: And I'm ninja'd by Strife for the third time today.
The hilarious part is that Greenpeace and Co. are pushing Bt toxin really hard as an alternative to chemical pesticide... when it's produced by its native bacteria, and not in a plant.I suppose it's like planting clover instead of using fertilizer, sometimes there really is a better way :P
If the Scots don't like it then it gives me cause for concern too. Can Bt toxins kill things like bees, moths and other innocent insects and arachnids?
Yeah, re:agriculture, I'm way more excited by agroecology and agroforestry than by gene technology, at least for the major crop. We already went so far to improve germplasm, we're hitting diminishing return on investment.
What did Greenpeace do to the Nazca lines?
Edit: mainiac, the Green Revolution was accomplished using conventionally bred varieties, not GM crops. GM crops only started popping up in the 90's.
Edit: mainiac, the Green Revolution was accomplished using conventionally bred varieties, not GM crops. GM crops only started popping up in the 90's.
Ideally most GM crops would be researched as a public investment by governments and then made freely available rather than made by corporations and copyrighted, but the budget for public/academic funding is pretty abysmal and usually goes into more immediate interests. As is it we just need to maintain proper regulations of GM crops and try to sort out issues of copyright infringement that come from GM crops crossbreeding with non-GM crops in their vicinity, that's still an odd situation legally as I recall.Honestly that sounds like a great idea. Make it all public domain and allow it to be vigorously peer reviewed.
In general though GM is something to welcome, though I am biased in it's favour somewhat seeing as it's the direction much of my education has been dedicated to.ermagerd monsanto owns the schools
Last time I checked the information on that was indicating that it doesn't hurt bees, but it was being introduced around the same time as a few other things that caused problems for some insects, especially bees, that muddied the waters so to speak. I think the pollen is toxic to some butterflies though, the American monarch butterfly certainly, but they only get exposed to wind blown pollen from most crop plants rather than direct exposure, so it can be manageable.Hmph. Well, on the bright side they could just phase out usage of Bt toxins and still use genetic engineering to increase crop yields. I'm interested to see if whether the GM crop causes death in these pollinators, or whether the farm itself is what caused their deaths. For example some English farms precipitated the death of local bumblebees when the local countryside was cleared for farm use, but when rows of wild flowers were planted bumblebee populations began to return to normal levels. It would be interesting to see if this is also the case where GM crops are used.
Most of the studies done on the subject are based on American fauna, so it's not clear how they'd affect European insects. :-\True as well.
What did Greenpeace do to the Nazca lines?In a botched stunt they permanently damaged the only [formerly] unblemished and perfect lines.
LW, if you like stupid regulation, you will love the ones about genetic engineering. Randomly mutating a gene through PCR will make your organism GM and will cause you endless regulatory pain, but mutating that gene by frying it with UV is fine. There is a whole industry of biologist trying to find ways around the regulations to have their creating declared not GM. The biggest group in my lab work on ways to get yoghurt bacteria to incorporate DNA from their environment into their own chromosomes, so you don't need to GM them, you just "let that interesting piece of DNA lay about" and let nature do its work.How strange. The combination of science and lawyerese has been... Incredibly productive. The future of science could be artificially imposed problems and restrictions for scientists to overcome and find new solutions. In short? Aperture science.
Mario Olaechea Aguije, Nazca’s regional head of culture, said the limestone quarry was located within private property, and that the owner was free to work the land.
However, according to the daily, the private property is located within an area that was designated as a UNESCO World Heritage Site, 18 years ago.
Where does everyone here stand on GM crops?
Well, it's a damn shame people Monsanto was demonized for trying to introduce Terminator crops now, eh?Where does everyone here stand on GM crops?
As long as we have no way to ensure that altered genes cannot escape into the wild, GM crops should only be grown under strictly quarantained, indoors closed-system conditions.
It might sound great, making crops that grow faster on poorer soil, or crops that are highly resisitant to natural pests, but when such a trait manages to cross-over to an unwanted wild plant, we could be facing superweeds that overgrow our crop fields, that we can't get rid of.
BURN DOWN THOSE MONSANTO FIELDS, AND KEEP DOING IT (at least that's what my genetics and ecology professors at biology university kept saying)
Also, NO to TTIP. Keep those GM crops out of Europe. Go full Australian ecology protection border control on them.
Terminator crops?
All I can think of is Arnold Schwarzenegger with a cob of corn instead of his face now.
"We have to be careful about this and consider the consequences" is a bit different than "durr evulz".As far as I know, the biggest danger involved in GM crops is that they all have the same genetical structure, which means that they can be all suddenly wiped out by a single parasitical organism or a disease, a la what happened to this variation of banana. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gros_Michel_banana)
Don't most farmers already purchase seed every year?In the case of things like potato, they just buy more potato since it's cheaper and more efficient than growing from seed. As for the topic of purchasing seed, depends. Due to propriety rights some farmers are not allowed to store or use seeds that have come off of plants they've just grown. Landraces (farmer bred seed) are still sown by a significant number of farmers across the world but they're understandably under a bit of pressure to adopt high yield crops which they will inevitably not be allowed to replant.
And I can't imagine any health consequences for humans from eating genetically modified crops, simply by virtue of their being genetically modified. It's like claiming that you shouldn't eat pork that came from Red Wattle pigs because the breed is fairly new and hasn't been scientifically proven to be safe for consumption.It's like, but not exactly alike - conventional selective breeding still takes place and is tried and tested whilst messing with DNA is very fresh ground. There's room to make mistakes with our goat spiders and the like :P
TBH, I never really understand the argument against having to buy new seeds every years. It's not like a farmer can re-use fertilizer, or pesticide, or tractor fuel or any of the other inputs used on a modern farm.And interestingly no-one ever gave a shit about non-replantable seeds until they became useful to construct an argument against GM plants...
TBH, I never really understand the argument against having to buy new seeds every years. It's not like a farmer can re-use fertilizer, or pesticide, or tractor fuel or any of the other inputs used on a modern farm.
TBH, I never really understand the argument against having to buy new seeds every years. It's not like a farmer can re-use fertilizer, or pesticide, or tractor fuel or any of the other inputs used on a modern farm.And interestingly no-one ever gave a shit about non-replantable seeds until they became useful to construct an argument against GM plants...
That would make sense if the people decrying non-reusable GM seeds would also decry the use of hybrid seeds. They don't, though, so you just go shove that ad hominem where the sun don't shine, alright?TBH, I never really understand the argument against having to buy new seeds every years. It's not like a farmer can re-use fertilizer, or pesticide, or tractor fuel or any of the other inputs used on a modern farm.And interestingly no-one ever gave a shit about non-replantable seeds until they became useful to construct an argument against GM plants...
Or, you know, people have just become more aware of the circumstances because of gm crops. But I guess that won't make you feel as superior to others, so it's probably just people pretending to care for the sake of arguing against gm food.
Actually people did give a shit about non-replantable seeds, largely because they were angry by the fact that replantable seeds were pointlessly being treated as non-replantable for profit and not for sanityTBH, I never really understand the argument against having to buy new seeds every years. It's not like a farmer can re-use fertilizer, or pesticide, or tractor fuel or any of the other inputs used on a modern farm.And interestingly no-one ever gave a shit about non-replantable seeds until they became useful to construct an argument against GM plants...
I apologize, I got too engaged over Helgoland's self-righteous assitude that I lost track of the argument. Would you mind reformulating your point for me?Yes:
if you sell super-good crops that can reproduce in the wild, you're evil because what if they cause superweeds to appearI would bet that if Monsanto gave away super-good crops for free, these people would still bitch and call them evil
if you sell super-good crops that can't reproduce in the wild, you're evil because you force the poor farmers to buy new seeds every year
if you don't sell super-good crops at all you're evil because millions of hungry africans
you can't do anything good to people without them calling you out as evil in this modern society
I would bet that if Monsanto gave away super-good crops for free, these people would still bitch and call them evil
oh wait that has actually happened (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_rice)
Vandana Shiva, an Indian anti-GMO activist, argued the problem was not the plant per se, but potential problems with poverty and loss of biodiversity. Shiva claimed these problems could be amplified by the corporate control of agriculture. By focusing on a narrow problem (vitamin A deficiency), Shiva argued, golden rice proponents were obscuring the limited availability of diverse and nutritionally adequate food.Sounds like a reasonable criticism. Greenpeace, obviously excluded. Sometimes I feel sorry for them. One of the saddest things I've seen was one of their fundraisers to help fix one of their arctic icebreakers, after it had been impounded by the Russians who then promptly took icepicks and axes to all the electronics before handing the ship back and saying it was like that when they took it. Dick move, but at least they have a sense of humour.
Actually people did give a shit about non-replantable seeds, largely because they were angry by the fact that replantable seeds were pointlessly being treated as non-replantable for profit and not for sanity
Agriculture is already wasteful enough as is, does not need to be more so just because; seeds grow plants which grow more seeds
Critics of genetically engineered crops have raised various concerns. An early issue was that golden rice originally did not have sufficient vitamin A.So, it's worse than having none at all?
Greenpeace opposes the use of any patented genetically modified organisms in agriculture and opposes the cultivation of golden rice, claiming it will open the door to more widespread use of GMOs.Well it would do that if the program is proven to help people...
Vandana Shiva, an Indian anti-GMO activist, argued the problem was not the plant per se, but potential problems with poverty and loss of biodiversityGrowing a different type of rice isn't going to imporverish people or reduce biodiversity any more than intensive rice agriculture is already...
Other groups argued that a varied diet containing foods rich in beta carotene such as sweet potato, leaf vegetables and fruit would provide children with sufficient vitamin A.That sounds really expensive to pull off in poor communities where they may not have electricity for refrigeration. It sounds a little like a "let them eat cake" solution from a middle-class person who doesn't understand how hard it is to pull all that together. Maybe we can put the third-world on the paleo diet instead :D
I apologize, I got too engaged over Helgoland's self-righteous assitude that I lost track of the argument. Would you mind reformulating your point for me?Yes:if you sell super-good crops that can reproduce in the wild, you're evil because what if they cause superweeds to appearI would bet that if Monsanto gave away super-good crops for free, these people would still bitch and call them evil
if you sell super-good crops that can't reproduce in the wild, you're evil because you force the poor farmers to buy new seeds every year
if you don't sell super-good crops at all you're evil because millions of hungry africans
you can't do anything good to people without them calling you out as evil in this modern society
oh wait that has actually happened (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_rice)
QuoteCritics of genetically engineered crops have raised various concerns. An early issue was that golden rice originally did not have sufficient vitamin A.So, it's worse than having none at all?
I was gonna make a point about plant breeders' rights, which have existed since the '50s and nobody is giving a shit about even today, but I guess I'd rather take myActually people did give a shit about non-replantable seeds, largely because they were angry by the fact that replantable seeds were pointlessly being treated as non-replantable for profit and not for sanityTBH, I never really understand the argument against having to buy new seeds every years. It's not like a farmer can re-use fertilizer, or pesticide, or tractor fuel or any of the other inputs used on a modern farm.And interestingly no-one ever gave a shit about non-replantable seeds until they became useful to construct an argument against GM plants...
Agriculture is already wasteful enough as is, does not need to be more so just because; seeds grow plants which grow more seeds
self-righteous assitudeelsewhere.
I think that the distinction between GM and GM-free crops is completely frivolous, and that people will eventually get over it. They got over dehydrated food, after all.
farmer's would have a very hard time to keep their fields from being overgrown with weed.
Monsanto (and to be fair, many others, it's just that everyone knows Monsanto) cannot guarantuee that this will not happen.... reality guarantees that guarantee cannot happen. It doesn't take GM products to have that sort of mutation occur. Makes it more likely and/or more rapid, I guess? But it's not like existent less!GM crops are some kind of weird indefinitely static... thing. They also change, the bacteria involve change, etc., etc., etc. Your profs appear to be complaining about a process that already exists and that GM is not introducing, which makes it kinda' weird to be focusing their tirade against GM.
... reality guarantees that guarantee cannot happen. It doesn't take GM products to have that sort of mutation occur. Makes it more likely and/or more rapid, I guess? But it's not like existent less!GM crops are some kind of weird indefinitely static... thing. They also change, the bacteria involve change, etc., etc., etc. Your profs appear to be complaining about a process that already exists and that GM is not introducing, which makes it kinda' weird to be focusing their tirade against GM.
... beyond that, again, there's a lot more to GM than the pesticide related stuff. If folks are really going to get in a panic about that, just legislate specifically against that and leave all the other good stuff be instead of just blanket condemning the lot of it.There probably are some modifications that I would be willing to agree on being harmless. I just feel that that classification should only be made by cynical and pessimistic biologists, who look at everything from a worst case scenario perspective. It should never be decided by economic interest.
Horizontal gene transfer between two eukaryotes is very, very, very rare though.Knowledge of soil microbial life is only now starting to catch up from being a very undeveloped section of our scientific database of life on our planet.
glyphosphateCannot resist being That Guy: it's glyphosate.
If evolution would throw us a similar mutation, it would probably start very local, and be more containable.Err, where do you think the Roundup resistance gene, the most famous of those, came from? It wasn't designed from the ground up. It was nicked from a naturally evolved gene of a strain of Agrobacterium tumefaciens (CP4, specifically). A bacterium.
There probably are some modifications that I would be willing to agree on being harmless. I just feel that that classification should only be made by cynical and pessimistic biologists, who look at everything from a worst case scenario perspective. It should never be decided by economic interest.You definitely don't want the cynical pessimist biologists, then. They tend to be significantly easier to buy off, heh. Probably would rather have some variation of idealist, instead. Much less likely to have given up on ethical action or be easily swayed by moolah.
Europe's highest court rejects 'Safe Harbor' agreement used by American tech companies: Safe Harbor Now Invalidated (http://www.businessinsider.com/european-court-of-justice-safe-harbor-ruling-2015-10?r=UK&IR=T)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I never noticed that. Makes sense, since the critter's not a phosphate, but I'd always thought it was named Glyphosphate anyway...glyphosphateCannot resist being That Guy: it's glyphosate.
The difference between evolution and GM is that the former reacts, and the latter acts.
There is indeed no guarantuee that, in the example case of pesticides, resistant soil bacteria, or resistant weed species will evolve through process of random mutation and natural selection. Our tendency for monoculture (relative to natural biodiversity) and extensive use of (only a select few types of) pesticides probably have increased the probabilty of this happening by increasing selective pressure. Still, evolution is usually a process of 10s of thousands, if not millions of years, and seeing how very short our species has been using pesticides, on a evolutionary timescale, it is not very likely that we would see this happen within our, or our children's lifetimes, at least not on an uncontrollable scale.
However, if geneticists actively tailor genes, specifically deisgned to provide resistance against commonly used pesticides, knowing that there are already existing organisms in nature that can basically copy-paste genes, it is like handing it to said organisms on a gold platter, especially if you proceed to go about distributing your GM product to every niche on the globe were it can economically be grown. If evolution would throw us a similar mutation, it would probably start very local, and be more containable.
Horizontal gene transfer between two eukaryotes is very, very, very rare though.Knowledge of soil microbial life is only now starting to catch up from being a very undeveloped section of our scientific database of life on our planet.
EDIT: the "blackmail" consisted of video messages demanding ZIGGO and KPN do more about their internet security, while warning that a much larger attack (by less benevolent parties) is to be expected. The DDOS attacks forced ZIGGO to upload new settings to the modems of 6 million users.So, they're still going behind the bars?
No, you do not know what I'm talking about. Landraces can be replanted, are replanted and are done so across the world. America is not the world, and it is the country that is most responsible for the rest of the world slowly adopting American crops over their own local seed. It's easy to address criticism when you're not addressing it, and again, America is not in fact the world. Farmers the world over who grow from locally grown seed need not buy seed for they can merely replant their own or that of their neighbour.Actually people did give a shit about non-replantable seeds, largely because they were angry by the fact that replantable seeds were pointlessly being treated as non-replantable for profit and not for sanityI am sorry, but you just don't know what you are talking about. F1 hybrids (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F1_hybrid) cannot be replanted (Well, technically they can, but the offspring lack the parent's quality). F1 hybrids have been used for close to 100 years now. By 1960, virtually all corn grown in the US was hybrid. Rice, wheat, sunflower, sugar beets are all crops which are almost only grown as hybrids in develloped countries.
Agriculture is already wasteful enough as is, does not need to be more so just because; seeds grow plants which grow more seeds
Didn't NATO deploy SAM missiles to Turkey a couple of years ago after a few buzz by the Syrian Air Force?
Didn't NATO deploy SAM missiles to Turkey a couple of years ago after a few buzz by the Syrian Air Force?Yes, it were actually Patriot systems owned by our Dutch forces. They have been retreated back to the Netherlands already though, I think last year or maybe 2013.
And what about the fiction over friction? Cameron is not accused even of “having sex with a pig” as mad Corbynites claimed on twitter. He’s accused of something I won’t repeat here involving cooked food and placement of bits thereon, not a sexual act. It was an “initiation ceremony” for a society he wasn’t in. There’s nothing to it, other than that one shouldn’t get drunk and take clothes off.
It was an “initiation ceremony” for a society he wasn’t in.
The week before last, the German chancellor flew to the Big Apple to address the United Nations summit on sustainability, women's rights and climate change. But what she took home with her was the surprising realization that Horst Seehofer actually has a lot in common with Ahmet Davutoglu and Nawaz Sharif.Far too late for that now in my porkine opinion, now is the time to see Germany reap her own reward
Seehofer is the governor of Bavaria and the head of the conservative Christian Social Union (CSU), the sister party to Merkel's Christian Democratic Union (CDU); Davutoglu is the prime minister of Turkey; Sharif the prime minister of Pakistan. All three have recently conveyed the same message: Merkel must get tougher in the refugee crisis. (https://archive.is/mjpyF#selection-829.1-833.342)
As a continuation of the Afghan/Syrian fight and the Turk/Kurd fight in Germany the most recent fight was between Albanians and Afghans (https://archive.is/8qjSc), these Syrian migrants sure are whacky and not Syrian or refugees, but that's because
So anyways another German (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11902296/Second-German-woman-evicted-from-her-home-to-make-way-for-refugees.html) has been evicted to make way for more migrants, so this time they didn't TOK ER JERB and instead TOK ER HOUSE
Also after some cross hailers (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11896855/Christian-and-Muslim-refugees-should-be-housed-separately-says-German-police-chief.html) got religion of peace'd the German deputy head of police has said refugees should be housed separately by creed, presumably because he's a shitlord of the land
For committing international suicide Merkel's in the running to get the nobel peace prize (http://thinkprogress.org/world/2015/10/05/3709179/why-angela-merkel-could-win-the-next-nobel-peace-prize/) and will rub shoulders with Obama who got his whilst blowing off the little legs of Yemeni children, the checki brekci bugger
In britbortion news Al Shabaab militiants have disagreed with Britain's aim to build a stable Somalian government with mean words which is not very nice
Jokes on them, they have shit flip flops
It's legit (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34376652); French have been beefing it up in West Africa and Brits beefing it up in East Africa; also don't forget that for as long as Somalia is in turmoil there will always be pirates disrupting British maritime commerce so there's a vital reason to not fuck up and help the Somalian government retake its lands. It's working (http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/10/06/uk-somalia-attacks-idUKKCN0S02NL20151006), with shit flipflop lads losing ground. The 70 troops have been part of an effort to essentially build a Somalian military from scratch out of militias just as likely to be a part of the problem as well as fix it, Britain's been at it for a while (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/british-military-team-will-be-sent-to-somalia-to-train-troops-and-help-combat-human-rights-abuses-8606428.html) and this is additional manpower to an already existing operations. Officer, Combat, Medical and Logistics training - all of these will make the African peacekeepers the far superior fighting force when fighting shit flipflop lads, and more troops are on the way. Oh and of course there's a very practical contribution in that the Royal Engineers will be busy building up Somalian infrastructure, and I don't doubt Americans are at work behind the scenes with their strategic fund to try and get some investment going into Somalia so that Somalia will eventually one day turn from a failed state to a self-building state.QuoteIn britbortion news Al Shabaab militiants have disagreed with Britain's aim to build a stable Somalian government with mean words which is not very niceNow this is interesting. The north has always been more stable than the south, but is a whole 70 people an actual contribution, or is it just a PR move?
Jokes on them, they have shit flip flops
It was inevitable.It is terrifying.
It's legit (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34376652); French have been beefing it up in West Africa and Brits beefing it up in East Africa; also don't forget that for as long as Somalia is in turmoil there will always be pirates disrupting British maritime commerce so there's a vital reason to not fuck up and help the Somalian government retake its lands. It's working (http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/10/06/uk-somalia-attacks-idUKKCN0S02NL20151006), with shit flipflop lads losing ground. The 70 troops have been part of an effort to essentially build a Somalian military from scratch out of militias just as likely to be a part of the problem as well as fix it, Britain's been at it for a while (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/british-military-team-will-be-sent-to-somalia-to-train-troops-and-help-combat-human-rights-abuses-8606428.html) and this is additional manpower to an already existing operations. Officer, Combat, Medical and Logistics training - all of these will make the African peacekeepers the far superior fighting force when fighting shit flipflop lads, and more troops are on the way. Oh and of course there's a very practical contribution in that the Royal Engineers will be busy building up Somalian infrastructure, and I don't doubt Americans are at work behind the scenes with their strategic fund to try and get some investment going into Somalia so that Somalia will eventually one day turn from a failed state to a self-building state.QuoteIn britbortion news Al Shabaab militiants have disagreed with Britain's aim to build a stable Somalian government with mean words which is not very niceNow this is interesting. The north has always been more stable than the south, but is a whole 70 people an actual contribution, or is it just a PR move?
Jokes on them, they have shit flip flopsIt was inevitable.It is terrifying.
Though really, it is most amusing to see how differently French and Brits handle humanitarian crises than Germany. I don't think anyone's going to forget how pointlessly Germany exacerbated the crisis to span from one end of the Med to the other just to bypass opponents to mass immigration and then herself backpedaled when immigrants unsurprisingly arrived en masse; all in the effort to exploit migrants for cheap labour or in an attempt to save the already safe by enticing them to take a dangerous journey. Countries are not rational, they really are the sum of their parts; so it should come as no surprise that Germany thrust itself into such a situation in spite of so many warnings literal, spoken and seen - the political machine simply could not be stopped. With recent porkiness, you might even say it was:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I haven't watched that as I'm on my phone yet too impatient not to respond, but since it's the science guy I assume he's going to talk about the science parts, so: the science stuff is not the main thing people object to and in the few details it is it can be dealt with by thorough, conservative and foresightful jurisdiction and bureaucracy. The thing people mainly object to is the socio-economical issues. Ie GMO is not evil, Monsanto is evil.its a podcast and he does address those issues as well though not in as much depth obviously.
Post-disclaimer: I apologise if I am in the wrong about context here, having not get seen the movie.
He points out that sociopolitical reasons were part of why Americans were provided with home mortgages at a reduced rate of interestWhich does not sound bad but within economic circles is a racist dog whistle, blaming the Great Recession on welfare for black Americans.
As Mr. Schäuble sees it, the Americans simply don’t want to understand.
That sounds like a kind of economic declaration of war and, in fact, Schäublenomics must be understood as an alternative concept to the Anglo-Saxon understanding of economics. Mr. Schäuble’s approach is coupled with a missionary dimension. Which is why he recruited Ludger Schuknecht, who is the only high-caliber economist in Mr. Schäuble’s immediate entourage that mostly consists of legal experts. Mr. Schuknecht is the director general for economic policy in the Ministry of Finance; in economic circles he is called the "Taliban." Mr. Schuknecht is actually a humorous and sociable character, but as soon as things get down to business, he knows no mercy. He studied under James Buchanan, an American Nobel Prize winner in economics, who had further developed the ideas of the Freiburg School and enjoys cult status among his followers.
It may be news to you, but in Germany no-one - or no-one significant - really cares whether welfare goes to black or white people, and Schäuble certainly doesn't.
Protesters throw petrol bombs at water cannonsThat seems... counter-intuitive as far as ways to disable water cannons go. I know it floats, but still...
Protesters throw petrol bombs at water cannonsThat seems... counter-intuitive as far as ways to disable water cannons go. I know it floats, but still...
It is rumoured that quite a few of the casualties in Ankara could have been saved if the police had not started spraying tear gas and water cannons on the people who tried to provide first aid
2. Monsanto etc.:
- Of course Monsanto is evil, as any corporation is evil. How could they not be? Their goal is to make as much money as they possibly can, at the lowest cost to themselves (disregarding costs caused other than to themselves, of course). [spoiler=more rant]What do you think happens to Monsanto if they tried to act like benevolent actors? What do you think shareholders would say to the CEOs responsible for such a change? Yes, they would kick them out and find more ruthless executives. Monsanto just has worse PR than e.g. Google, who (yes they are legally persons, aren't they?) is certainly equally evil, as is any other company above a certain scale (yes, VW too, and H&M and Coca Cola). The only way is to regulate them fiercely, by hopefully not yet bought governments.
Yup! That's why all laws look the same everywhere, people act the same everywhere, think the same things everywhere. We're all just really one person!
[soap-post]Swede-laws, Finn-jails, Syrian health-meat-vegan falafel and Kibbutzim, Universal non-toxic-glycene-free Merkels and Kraut, All-One! We're ALL-ONE! All-one or NONE! Exceptions eternally? NONE![/soap-post]
EDIT:
...
In all seriousness... no. Cultural studies can get pretty barmy sometimes, but I don't think anyone over there has ever suggested that things and people are exactly the same everywhere, because they fucking well aren't, and that's a fact. However, quite a few totally sane people have argued time and time again that this 'thing' called "Culture" is not actually a tangible thing (in the same way as rye bread, vodka, and falafel are tangible things) and that, I think, is a perfectly uncontroversial idea.
She was saying that because of historical foreign influences and because people have immigrated to Sweden throughout history there is no such thing as Swedish culture. Which is just ridiculous.Look, it's just some stock piece of rhetoric she learned back in the swingin' pos'structuralis' 80s, and people like her have been constantly giving similar speeches by rote ever since: "There is no such thing as X," with such things as Nature, Humanity, Reason, Truth, and Reality routinely playing the role of X in that formula. If you look through the fustian, she isn't saying that you, as a Swedish person, do not "have" any culture of your own, because that would indeed be rock-eatingly stupid and delusional. From cultural studies' point of view, it's not bloody possible for a human being to not have a culture, because pretty much everything that human beings do and think is culture by definition, no two ways about it. But then again, it's perfectly reasonable to wonder why some things are included in the category of "Swedish" or "Finnish" culture while others are left out for no apparent reason...
Look, it's just some stock piece of rhetoric she learned back in the swingin' pos'structuralis' 80s, and people like her have been constantly giving similar speeches by rote ever since: "There is no such thing as X," with such things as Nature, Humanity, Reason, Truth, and Reality routinely playing the role of X in that formula. If you look through the fustian, she isn't saying that you, as a Swedish person, do not "have" any culture of your own, because that would indeed be rock-eatingly stupid and delusional. From cultural studies' point of view, it's not bloody possible for a human being to not have a culture, because pretty much everything that human beings do and think is culture by definition, no two ways about it. But then again, it's perfectly reasonable to wonder why some things are included in the category of "Swedish" or "Finnish" culture while others are left out for no apparent reason...
The point is that national cultures that are presumed to be monolithic and unchanging in lay discussions are anything but for people who actually study them: It's just a simple fact that cultures change, and if you're a multi-kulti-hugs-and-kisses progressive, of course you're going to draw on facts of cultural history to argue for pluralism and diversity. Because you realize that your culture was never all that un-diverse to begin with...
EDIT: I think I'll make a dedicated thread for worthy discussion of this worthy topic...
A Dutch investigation has found that the missile that shot down flight MH17 seemed to have come from rebel controlled parts of Ukraine and was an SAM missile, probably to very few peoples surprise. (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34511973)
Just the closest thread I could find, since the older 'whole of Europe' thread and the Russian politics thread are both dead.
Just saying that there's now been an actual investigation into it, no need to be so hostile.
Well, I'm afraid to say it came across that way.
And I'm just saying it now seems to have been verified by a reliable source, instead of Russia's 'Nononononono, was totes Ukraine' thing.
I'm just saying it now seems to have been verified by a reliable source...Nothing is reliable source.
Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergey Ryabkov called the Dutch crash investigation "biased in nature" and said Russia was "ready to present its own information."
Yes, we know the rebels shot down a civilian airliner by accident. The significance of this is?Emmmm. It is wrong. We know that Russian army personell shot down a civilian airliner.
I would not consider the warhawk BBC a reliable source on matters related to Ukraine.
Shepple? Is that, like, a Snapple made from sheep?I would not consider the warhawk BBC a reliable source on matters related to Ukraine.
Ohhhh you are soooo edgy and cool, telling those Shepple you dont believe the hawkish government lies.
Shepple? Is that, like, a Snapple made from sheep?I would not consider the warhawk BBC a reliable source on matters related to Ukraine.
Ohhhh you are soooo edgy and cool, telling those Shepple you dont believe the hawkish government lies.
Shepple? Is that, like, a Snapple made from sheep?
Germany and France don't conduct covert operations to keep Belgium in their sphere of influence, right?If they are covert operations, you wouldn't exactly know about them. Well, at least not as them being German or French operations.
In other news: Turkey shout down a Russian drone or something similar. I only have a German source, though.
The travelers refused to board the plane because of the current security situation, saying that they would only agree to board with an Israeli team.
You can't break people down into small enough groups to eliminate conflicts like these. If you create a Kurdish state and conditions get shitty enough, tensions will rise and conflict can break out across some other social division. Maybe Kurds of different religions will start fighting more. Will more dividing and subdividing help that?
Ethnic/religious divides often frame how a conflict plays out rather than causing that conflict initially. The Middle East has a significant history of different religions and cultures coexisting peacefully under the same government - why can't they do it again? I think these kind of "solutions" paint the region as primitive and unable to handle diversity like Western countries can.
Ya, it's more about getting rid of this pseudo-imperial mindset where a place either belongs to us, or them, or someone else entirely. Stop this vying for influence, and replace it with a more productive sort of competition. Germany and France don't conduct covert operations to keep Belgium in their sphere of influence, right? Why should they? Getting the various (big, relevant, and not earmarked for eradication) players in the middle east into a similar state looks like the only long-term solution to me.
In other news: Turkey shout down a Russian drone or something similar. I only have a German source, though.
In other news: Turkey shout down a Russian drone or something similar. I only have a German source, though.I am rather interested what Russia will do if Turkey\Israel will shoot down their fighter jet.
Israel will never shoot a Russian fighter jet and have began mutual exercises to make sure they wont do so even by mistake. Turkey will not shoot a Russian fighter jet because they don't have the guts, nor sufficient reason to do so. Russia is probably the only legitimate force in Syria right now. well, maybe the Iranians too.
My bet is that Syria airspace would become... highly unwelcome for Turkey/Israel aircraft. There are enough anti-air assets there to make sure that any stupid stunts like that are going to end badly for the perpetrators.In other news: Turkey shout down a Russian drone or something similar. I only have a German source, though.I am rather interested what Russia will do if Turkey\Israel will shoot down their fighter jet.
My bet is that Putin will simply pretend that nothing ever happened. After all it is easy to hide death of pilot from Russian public.
I wonder, who exactly you refer to when you write the "Big, relevant and not earmarked for eradication" players in the Middle East?Iran. Saudi Arabia. Israel. Turkey. Egypt. The other stable states of the region. The Muslim Brotherhood, probably. Maybe the PLO, I dunno how independent they are. Prime examples of players 'earmarked for eradication' would be Hamas, the IS, and presumably Hisbollah in its current form - basically all those radical Islamists who don't stand to gain from lasting stability.
PS. Russians assuming that their air-defence can hurt Western warplanes amuse me sooooo muchThe wank is strong within you. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_F-117A_shootdown)
PS. Russians assuming that their air-defence can hurt Western warplanes amuse me sooooo muchThe wank is strong within you. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_F-117A_shootdown)
Honestly I think the Turkish - and possibly the Iranians, depending on modernization and political development - could fit in very well in the EU, given enough time. Before the usual people claw at my throat again: I'm talking 50 - 100 years. They're both countries with a strong and independent citizenry, both have embraced secular nationalism in the past, which is a defining characteristic of European-style development, etc etc. At the very least we should consider them as powers with interests fundamentally aligned with out own, and thus as potential partners in the necessary re-ordering of the middle east and, if it remains necessary in the future, the organized resistance - mostly political, cultural, economic - against Russia.Dammit Helgo stop trying to borg into everyone else's nations!
TL;DR: I think that politically we should at Turkey and Iran like we should look at Russia: As different, sure, but not essentially foreign - as potential partners we should talk eye-to-eye with and treat as equals*.
*And nothing less, but in the case of Russia as nothing more either.
Honestly I think the Turkish - and possibly the Iranians, depending on modernization and political development - could fit in very well in the EU, given enough time. Before the usual people claw at my throat again: I'm talking 50 - 100 years. They're both countries with a strong and independent citizenry, both have embraced secular nationalism in the past, which is a defining characteristic of European-style development, etc etc. At the very least we should consider them as powers with interests fundamentally aligned with out own, and thus as potential partners in the necessary re-ordering of the middle east and, if it remains necessary in the future, the organized resistance - mostly political, cultural, economic - against Russia.
TL;DR: I think that politically we should at Turkey and Iran like we should look at Russia: As different, sure, but not essentially foreign - as potential partners we should talk eye-to-eye with and treat as equals*.
*And nothing less, but in the case of Russia as nothing more either.
Still better than when he try to borg into philosophers' asses in drunken English.You know perfectly well that I was actually trying to read what was written on the back of her shirt - borging above her ass, not into it-, even though I admit I may not have taken the optimal approach. Plus she doesn't speak any English anyway, so... And she seemed fairly friendly yesterday, which kinda gives me hope that I have not left her with a lasting overly bad impression.
Still better than when he try to borg into philosophers' asses in drunken English.You know perfectly well that I was actually trying to read what was written on the back of her shirt - borging above her ass, not into it-, even though I admit I may not have taken the optimal approach. Plus she doesn't speak any English anyway, so... And she seemed fairly friendly yesterday, which kinda gives me hope that I have not left her with a lasting overly bad impression.
@Iran: Well, they probably shouldn't join the EU, but the EU is a regional project anyway - I don't see why we couldn't organize states in a similar manner one level higher.
Eh, there are some problems that can't be properly addressed on the levels we currently have. Climate change is the obvious example, but there's plenty more.
How do you then address global-scale issues without some kind of global-scale body though?
I mean, I get it, you hate the EU
but in general, you should agree that some problems are better addressed at a supra-national level, right? And likewise, some other are better addressed at a sub-national level. Now, we can disagree on which prerogatives should go to which level (I think defense should be handled at the EU level for example, and I think you'd disagree), but do you agree with the general principle?
Whats the state of nuclear power plants/ opinion about nuclear power in EU?You can look it up yourself. (https://www.iaea.org/PRIS/CountryStatistics/CountryStatisticsLandingPage.aspx) France is, predictably, in the lead there, being the best European country and all.
This leads to an interesting issue: The world-wide reserves for Uranium are a very limited resource. It is estimated to last for about 50 to 70 years with the current demand. If additional nuclear reactors are built, the supply will last correspondingly shorter.
the top available contender
Sadly, solar and wind are not really applicable in many places where lots of humans live. Many parts of Europe are purpetually shaded by mountains, and the temperate climate mitigates high wind, making wind generation less viable..
But it is not viable everywhere. Fusion would be, and fusion is (gasp *horror*) a form a nuclear energy.
Many ordinary people, regardless of locality (yes, I know the US is statistically the least literate when it comes to science), do not really comprehend the serious difference between a potential fusion based power plant, and a dirty "makes waste that is radioactive of hundreds of thousands of years!" fission plant. They hear "nuclear" and their buttholes tighten.
Basically, at current usage, uranium ores will be depeted, call this 60 years. Clearly, if we build a huge amount of exta plants, that gets much sooner. Nuclear makes up 13% of current world generation. If we, say, build enough nuclear plants to power 50% of the world, then that would quadruple the rate of uranium depletion, meaning total depletion of known sources within 15 years. If the plants have a 15 year lifespan, then up the average CO2 output per plant accordingly (since much of the CO2 cost is in building nuclear plants).
the figure I posted was correct for known sources. The figure you have is for hypothesized sources. Going off known sources in your link gives 79 years, which is close to my link. Are we going to be the future of our entire species on guesses or known things?
Also, since the estimates come from the NEA, with obvious close ties to the nuclear industry that you get in such things (the entire body is pretty much dependent on nuclear industry for their jobs to exist), you should definitely look at bias in their estimates. It's like listening to the DEA about the drug problem back in the 1930's.
the figure I posted was correct for known sources. The figure you have is for hypothesized sources. Are we going to be the future of our entire species on guesses or known things?Have you looked up at the predictions of "when will oil reserves run out"? They've been at the state of "known oil reserves will run out in about 30-60 years" for more than half a century now.
A German representative in the European parliament is first and foremost a representative of the German and only then a representative of the European people, and the same holds for the other countries. I guess there's no quick fix for this though.
snip
the figure I posted was correct for known sources. The figure you have is for hypothesized sources. Are we going to be the future of our entire species on guesses or known things?Have you looked up at the predictions of "when will oil reserves run out"? They've been at the state of "known oil reserves will run out in about 30-60 years" for more than half a century now.
I accidentally the link, it was supposed to be the second one. What's there now is what the scientific american article drew its figures, I'll edit it back in. here it is. (http://www-formal.stanford.edu/jmc/progress/cohen.html)
Like many aspects of nuclear power, fast breeder reactors have been subject to much controversy over the years. In 2010 the International Panel on Fissile Materials said "After six decades and the expenditure of the equivalent of tens of billions of dollars, the promise of breeder reactors remains largely unfulfilled and efforts to commercialize them have been steadily cut back in most countries"
Uranium depletion is a non issue if we start seriously using liquid salt thorium reactors
BN-1200 Commercial, pool, sodium 2900/1220 oxide, nitride Russia From mid-2020soh wait that's why
So, whadayathink, Portugal can still be considered a democracy (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/portuguese-election-austerity_562c0346e4b0443bb5643170)?This article may be relevant here. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_centralism)
So, whadayathink, Portugal can still be considered a democracy (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/portuguese-election-austerity_562c0346e4b0443bb5643170)?If you're in the EU, you're nothing more than a province of a greater Empire. When Ireland rebuked the EU, they just held another referendum until they got the choice they wanted. When Greece wanted to get public spending back up they decided that Greece wanted more public cuts. Now Poortugal is demonstrating quite clearly why if you surrender your own currency to a foreign power you are under their control; your parliament has no teeth and cannot control anything.
LOL.
I'm not sure what "the bloodlust of their gods" maps to in EU context...
Indeed. If you shitpost at least make it shitpost with content, and at the very least more than just a 1 word personal reaction.LOL.How constructive.
It sure looks to me like Silva thinks he knows what his constituents want better than his constituents. He says outright that his goal is to avoid challenging Eurozone fiscal policy, as the article notes, in direct opposition to his own democratic mandate and against Portuguese political tradition.This is not a democracy
If you see it differently then let's hear it.
This is not a direct democracy
Is the Germany really that much brutally dominating greece and other not so rich EU countries with its iron fist?
Yes.No.
Thanks, pretty much what I meant before.This is not a direct democracyFTFY
Except for the implication that it is being done purely out of self-interest - which no doubt is one reason, but hardly the only one - I do agree with this post of yours. You appear to be going soft, mainiac~Is the Germany really that much brutally dominating greece and other not so rich EU countries with its iron fist?"Germany" is dominating Europe in the sense that "Bush" created the abuses of the Iraqi prisons. There is a bad system and they are promoting it out of self interest. That bad system produces bad results.
I'm rather proud of the fact that people round here keep saying I change when the topics of conversation change. A week ago a bunch of the liberal americans in the political thread were asking why I had changed into such a bullheaded Clinton partisan who was denying that Bernie Sanders had won the debate.
Austria wants to build a fence along its border with Slovenia.A border on the border between two schengens? Well that's sort of new.
"This is our future." (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=315wkXbzPcY) Hahahahahaha good job GermanyBut there's no such thing as no-go zones, that's just a racist conspiracy theory! :^)
Also a Swede reporter tried to go into a no go zone (http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/reporter-jagades-i-vag-med-stenkastning/), did not realize why they're called no go zones and got pelted with rocks the tolerant swedish way
"They thought we crossed the border and that we were standing on their land, says Valentina Xhaferi."
Top lel
Thanks Yuros, you are best entertainment, very good at eurovision
In all seriousness though welcome to obvious consequences yet again, I really shouldn't laugh but I'm being vindicated in the most hilarious ways, it's like parody come to life. By the way the "refugees" have broken through the Slovenian border so you can be enriched some more ;P There is no need to be upset, it is merely zuspät4u
But there's no such thing as no-go zones, that's just a racist conspiracy theory! :^)
"This is our future." (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=315wkXbzPcY) Hahahahahaha good job Germany
Also a Swede reporter tried to go into a no go zone (http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/reporter-jagades-i-vag-med-stenkastning/), did not realize why they're called no go zones and got pelted with rocks the tolerant swedish way
"They thought we crossed the border and that we were standing on their land, says Valentina Xhaferi."
Top lel
Thanks Yuros, you are best entertainment, very good at eurovision
In all seriousness though welcome to obvious consequences yet again, I really shouldn't laugh but I'm being vindicated in the most hilarious ways, it's like parody come to life. By the way the "refugees" have broken through the Slovenian border so you can be enriched some more ;P There is no need to be upset, it is merely zuspät4u
"This is our future." (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=315wkXbzPcY) Hahahahahaha good job Germany
Also a Swede reporter tried to go into a no go zone (http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/reporter-jagades-i-vag-med-stenkastning/), did not realize why they're called no go zones and got pelted with rocks the tolerant swedish way
"They thought we crossed the border and that we were standing on their land, says Valentina Xhaferi."
Top lel
Thanks Yuros, you are best entertainment, very good at eurovision
In all seriousness though welcome to obvious consequences yet again, I really shouldn't laugh but I'm being vindicated in the most hilarious ways, it's like parody come to life. By the way the "refugees" have broken through the Slovenian border so you can be enriched some more ;P There is no need to be upset, it is merely zuspät4u
so what happened? i get the impression from what you said that a Swedish reporter or a few went into some area and some idiots thought they were refugees and threw stuff at them. is that right?"This is our future." (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=315wkXbzPcY) Hahahahahaha good job Germany
Also a Swede reporter tried to go into a no go zone (http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/reporter-jagades-i-vag-med-stenkastning/), did not realize why they're called no go zones and got pelted with rocks the tolerant swedish way
"They thought we crossed the border and that we were standing on their land, says Valentina Xhaferi."
Top lel
Thanks Yuros, you are best entertainment, very good at eurovision
In all seriousness though welcome to obvious consequences yet again, I really shouldn't laugh but I'm being vindicated in the most hilarious ways, it's like parody come to life. By the way the "refugees" have broken through the Slovenian border so you can be enriched some more ;P There is no need to be upset, it is merely zuspät4u
Wait, no-go zones are real? That's just stupid and shouldn't be tolerated IMO.
Herein lies the problem with universal tolerance. It is impossible. Universal tolerance requires tolerance of intolerance.
If you are intolerant to intolerance, then you have to infringe on groups who's creed revolves around elitism. This includes orthodox judaeism, and islamic extremism. (Both groups hold views that their group is the bestest best thing ever, and is naturally blessed with divine favor, so they can do all kinds of terrible things to other groups of people. It's right in their religious texts.)
It sure would be nice if people could be sensible, but people who's religious faith centers around non-sensible things, like divine favor enabled biggotry, makes this impossible.
The best that you can do is say something along the lines of "you can have your religious faith, but you cant always act on it, if doing so results in violating the law."
If Sweden is allowing religious freedoms to trump civil behavior and citizen rights under the law, (such as the implication of these "no go zones") then they are screwing up hard.
Wierd, we know what a no-go zone is, I just doubt that they really exist in Sweden.
Thanks Yuros, you are best entertainment, very good at eurovisionDunno what are you on about, but "refugees" have been "breaking through Slovenian border" for some time now (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34657187), or 85k+ in 10 days if you believe that filthy liberal outlet called BBC. Totes nothing to do with some certain country creating a complete bottleneck by going the Madagascar route. Though there is also talk on both Slovenian and Austrian side about erecting a fence... buuuut at least in Austria's case with an intention of creating more orderly passage instead of complete lock-down. *shrug* Makes sense I guess. Of course, posh-Austrian are accusing real Austrian of transporting refugees at night to their borders... sounds like Balkan is leaking. Upwards. Now THAT'S fun time.
In all seriousness though welcome to obvious consequences yet again, I really shouldn't laugh but I'm being vindicated in the most hilarious ways, it's like parody come to life. By the way the "refugees" have broken through the Slovenian border so you can be enriched some more ;P There is no need to be upset, it is merely zuspät4u
Yeah but then they deployed the military, barricades and presumably fluorescent traffic cones. Broke them too! Ha!Thanks Yuros, you are best entertainment, very good at eurovisionDunno what are you on about, but "refugees" have been "breaking through Slovenian border" for some time now (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34657187), or 85k+ in 10 days if you believe that filthy liberal outlet called BBC.
In all seriousness though welcome to obvious consequences yet again, I really shouldn't laugh but I'm being vindicated in the most hilarious ways, it's like parody come to life. By the way the "refugees" have broken through the Slovenian border so you can be enriched some more ;P There is no need to be upset, it is merely zuspät4u
Totes nothing to do with some certain country creating a complete bottleneck by going the Madagascar route.State clearly what you are asserting.
Though there is also talk on both Slovenian and Austrian side about erecting a fence... buuuut at least in Austria's case with an intention of creating more orderly passage instead of complete lock-down. *shrug* Makes sense I guess. Of course, posh-Austrian are accusing real Austrian of transporting refugees at night to their borders... sounds like Balkan is leaking. Upwards. Now THAT'S fun time.BUENO
"This is our future." (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=315wkXbzPcY) Hahahahahaha good job GermanyProgression of progressive niqab housewives with deadly prams and explosive bearded babies. Git gud, Kafirs.
Austria wants to build a fence along its border with Slovenia.The closed Schengen border: The philophers' stone of right-wing populists. "Close the borders close the borders close the borders what borders there are no fucking borders how do they work?"
Similarly, several people are refusing their housing in a military complex (http://www.svt.se/nyheter/regionalt/dalarna/flera-asylsokande-vill-inte-kliva-av-i-trangslet). "The forest is scary"."Never seen a forest before?"
BUENOSkimmed over that liveleaks video, I could be sassy and say I don't understand the language they are using and thus am unable to comment on what they are really all about, but frankly it's yet another flag-weaving, slogans-shouting we-are-right mob. It's funny how identical they seem to their mirrored counterparts (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AMEnrOUte8).
Btw did you see the progressive refugee marches I posted earlier?
Yeah but then they deployed the military, barricades and presumably fluorescent traffic cones. Broke them too! Ha!I heard of no fluorescent traffic cones-related violence, stop spreading your gay fasci anti-EU propaganda, nazi scum.
State clearly what you are asserting.Never.
Generally when something sounds incredible and I have not learned the details about the subject, I conclude that there is important information I dont know.
Doubleplustolerant ISIS flags to boot ;P"This is our future." (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=315wkXbzPcY) Hahahahahaha good job GermanyProgression of progressive niqab housewives with deadly prams and explosive bearded babies. Git gud, Kafirs.
The closed Schengen border: The philophers' stone of right-wing populists. "Close the borders close the borders close the borders what borders there are no fucking borders how do they work?"Oi m8 not having millions of "Syrians" begin taking over bits of your country is very different from having a sensible immigration policy and also different from just plain isolationism
I don't know what the actual political situation is in Austria, but it's pretty certain that if one the central EU countries emphatically says "Fuck Schengen," others will soon follow suit. Judging by how things are going around here, I get the feeling that the only thing sustaining Schengen at this point is sheer political inertia and fear of salty Merkels – just one more nudge and the political scales will tip in favour of isolationism, because that's what the terror-stricken electorate is clamouring for.
I don't know where we're headed at this rate, but barbed wire and German shepherds will not solve the humanitarian crisis in the Middle East, and the problems caused by people smuggling will get worse with every restriction imposed on free mobility.Pardon, but as restrictions were relaxed the volume of migrants entering Europe increased. You cannot solve the humanitarian crisis in the Middle East by creating a humanitarian crisis in Europe.
Jesus, how sodding picky can you be?They're not even running away from war, famine or disease.
'I know we're running away from war/famine/disease, but we want GOOD housing, dammit! Not this... forest or stuff out in the middle of nowhere!'
Skimmed over that liveleaks video, I could be sassy and say I don't understand the language they are using and thus am unable to comment on what they are really all about, but frankly it's yet another flag-weaving, slogans-shouting we-are-right mob.One waving ISIS flags?
It's funny how identical they seem to their mirrored counterparts (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AMEnrOUte8).And we'd have neither were it not for the EU
I heard of no fluorescent traffic cones-related violence, stop spreading your gay fasci anti-EU propaganda, nazi scum.Traffic cones will fluoresce into the sunset, like so many cones in the sea of nashid
This is a shitpostState clearly what you are asserting.Never.
Meanwhile (a few days ago), in the country that's sort of like Sweden but with less beheadings and no-go zones and spoopy forests and jihad and all that: https://vimeo.com/143481565 (https://vimeo.com/143481565)Also politics aside, that bit about the police horses - police horses could soon disappear from much of Yurope's police arsenal as they're quite costly and don't provide many good numbers to judge their efficacy by. On the other hand their one excelling point is crowd control (since time immemorial peasants and plebes have been trampled by those god damn hooves, I mean jesus christ those horses are fucking massive and now they have guns on top) and crowd control (the friendly variety which involves guiding crowds and blocking off dangerous chokepoints with big horse in order to stop a crush forming (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillsborough_disaster)). Also Sweden antifa are adorable <3, not like French antifa where they're like libertarian skinheads (that was supposed to be more flattering but you get the idea)
Explanation: Anti-immigrant demonstration and anti-fascist counter-demonstration in front of Helsinki Cathedral; ~20 wingnuts, ~20 anarchists, and a full-blown cop festival with storm troopers in full riot gear and gorillion party vans and fucking police horses.The police keeps complaining how they have no money and no manpower to do anything, and yet, this has to be some kind of record for pointless security theatre...Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And we'd have neither were it not for the EUThis is an interesting point though. I do seem to remember the rise of neo-nazis in mid-90s, both in countries of then-EU and countries that were not part of it. Were those movement just copy cats, imported from EU? Or a genuine movements that rose due to (in)direct existence of EU? We could have a fruitful discussion.
Ma'am put the baby down. Put the baby down or I'll fucking shoot you for brandishing a weapon in my face OH SHIT THE BABY'S HOLDING A FUCKING ANIMAL CRACKER OPEN FIRE
This is an interesting point though. I do seem to remember the rise of neo-nazis in mid-90s, both in countries of then-EU and countries that were not part of it. Were those movement just copy cats, imported from EU? Or a genuine movements that rose due to (in)direct existence of EU? We could have a fruitful discussion.Reactionaries react - you've deliberately left out that Islamism was imported by the EU. An interesting omission.
Daesh flag is a funny thing. You could argue there is no such thing as "ISIS flag" and they are all just a bunch of uninspired cretins (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/isis-flag-what-do-the-words-mean-and-what-are-its-origins-10369601.html) and you'll probably be right at least on one occasion.You could argue there is no such thing as a nazi swastika and they are all just a bunch of uninspired cretins, and you'll probably be right at least on one occasion.
Then again even if one DOES fly an ISIS flag, whatever it may be, you could still get away relatively easy (http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-33406768). It is a slope more slippery than teenage's girl crotch on a random boyband concert, but if you are not openly indorsing beheading of filthy infidels, you could theoretically walk down the Stamford Hill draped in that sorry excuse of a flag while humming Salil as-Sawarim tune and all coppers could do to you is to charge you for reciting bad teenage poetry.To be honest I'd much prefer cheeki nashid than having police cover up systematic raping of thousands of girls by Muslim gangs
It would of course be a colossal dick move though, at the least.Quite the dickings
Git gud, Kafirs.Joshua, a Pakistani Christian fleeing threats of violence in his home country has told the German state broadcaster Zweites Deutsches Fernsehen (ZDF) that life “in the refugee camp is not really different from that in my home country. 98 per cent of asylum seekers there are Muslims and they threaten me, call me a Kufr, an unbeliever. I’m afraid there, very afraid. Mostly I stay in my room.”
How do you know, if they have isis flag? May be they are arab nihilists or anarchists.This is EU leadership in a nutshell.
Dude, remember why Sheb locked the old thread?
my county alone is noteworthy for being the #1 malaria spot in the UK ;P
A lot of big cities probably share a lot of mosquito positive features with swamps.Pretty much any city where it is mildly hot and rains frequently will probably end up being infested by mosquitoes and whatever diseases the species carries.
1. The NHS does screen for itmy county alone is noteworthy for being the #1 malaria spot in the UK ;PMalaria isn't transmitted from human-to-human unless you actually had a blood transfusion from the sick person - something I would expect the NHS should screen for. I'd assume that a high malaria rate means you live in an area where people take holidays in at-risk countries more often. If you live in a rich area then that might explain it.
A lot of big cities probably share a lot of mosquito positive features with swamps.Yeah we got mosquitoes and midges, though usually in such insignificant numbers (destroyed many of the old marshlands) that they aren't an issue. This summer was good for them but that's just general climate change weirdness making everywhere hospitable for mosquitoes. As far as I can tell our mosquitoes currently no longer spread much serious disease, or if they do it's just that the diseases are easily treatable.
PTW; Forgot Sheb destroyed his like a tramp.To be fair it was a filthy demented tramp who kept babbling about lizard people Eurovision and "schengan" whatever that is.
We need to reform Eurovision so Poland can winPTW; Forgot Sheb destroyed his like a tramp.To be fair it was a filthy demented tramp who kept babbling about lizard people Eurovision and "schengan" whatever that is.
(http://i.imgur.com/AARa7l4.jpg)We need to reform Eurovision so Poland can winPTW; Forgot Sheb destroyed his like a tramp.To be fair it was a filthy demented tramp who kept babbling about lizard people Eurovision and "schengan" whatever that is.
The director is Jens Meier:“If I thought we couldn’t handle the challenge, I wouldn’t be here. I think we’re working very well together here in Sumte and that we’ll handle this challenge and succeed.”wew lads, idle noos but crisis continues
The village has no shops, no school and no police station.
Initially Sumte was told to accept 1,000 asylum seekers a number that would overwhelm to local sanitation system.
Some of the migrants are helping to finish off the shelter:“I came here to build my new life. I don’t want to stay and wait. I want to help because I was looking around, and everybody was helping us, so I had to do something. It is small, but I had to do it,” said Rouhi Safwa from Syria.
Many Sumte residents are concerned that the situation in the village could play into the hands of far-right extremists.
Ehm, how can you overwhelm sanitation system?
Ehm, how can you overwhelm sanitation system?
I'm going to regret this but, source?
Ehm, how can you overwhelm sanitation system?
In India and the Indian subcontinent, over 95% of the population use water for cleansing the anal area after defecating. In places where water is scarce or not closely available, a stone or similar hard material is used instead. Use of paper as in the western world is rare in this region and is seen only in some urban and westernised societies. The cleaning of hands after this cleansing process is mandatory and is done using soap. If soap is not available, soil, ash or sand could be used to clean the used hand or both hands. Modern toilets use spray bidets. Older toilets may or may not have running water source, but buckets, bails and mugs are used for storage and for the purpose of cleaning.
Ehm, how can you overwhelm sanitation system?
In a share house i was in with a lot of travellers there was one Indian guy who would go to the toilet, wipe his ass with the paper then put the paper in the bin next to the toilet. I'm like "WTF?" and the landlord explained that in India the sewer systems are so bad that literally too much toilet paper can cause a major blockage. So this guy decided he'd help out by not flushing the paper.
They must not know about the three seashells.Ehm, how can you overwhelm sanitation system?
In a share house i was in with a lot of travellers there was one Indian guy who would go to the toilet, wipe his ass with the paper then put the paper in the bin next to the toilet. I'm like "WTF?" and the landlord explained that in India the sewer systems are so bad that literally too much toilet paper can cause a major blockage. So this guy decided he'd help out by not flushing the paper.QuoteIn India and the Indian subcontinent, over 95% of the population use water for cleansing the anal area after defecating. In places where water is scarce or not closely available, a stone or similar hard material is used instead. Use of paper as in the western world is rare in this region and is seen only in some urban and westernised societies. The cleaning of hands after this cleansing process is mandatory and is done using soap. If soap is not available, soil, ash or sand could be used to clean the used hand or both hands. Modern toilets use spray bidets. Older toilets may or may not have running water source, but buckets, bails and mugs are used for storage and for the purpose of cleaning.
Wow, Indian people wipe their ass with a rock? Then they wash their hands with dirt, ash and sand? Talk about living the good life!
Ehm, how can you overwhelm sanitation system?1. Plumbing, water treatment and sewerage
In other noos, Angela Merkel says Germany 'will do what we can' to ensure that Britain stays in the European Union and that she shares many of the same concerns (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/11972490/Angela-Merkel-urges-Britain-to-stay-in-the-European-Union.html)
She told an audience of business leaders: “I agree that the UK should remain a member of the European Union But, of course, the decision isn’t up to us, it is up to the British.
Germany needs the migrants. Each German woman only has 1.4 babies, which is exactly the same as Japan. And Japan is headed to a halving of the current population within a few decades.Why does Germany need migrants? Why is Japan's overpopulation solving itself bad?
It's easy to do the maths. Germany either gets immigrants now and has some problem assimilating them. OR Germany waits until they've depopulated down to about 30 million people, then they start letting immigrants in then, at a time there will be so few native Germans that you have no hope in hell of intergrating a large number of people."Some problem assimilating" hahahahahahaha
Sure, some neonazi types won't like you bringing in more people right now, but it's infinitely smarter to try and integrate more people into the culture while you still have a culture than let the entire German-speaking nation decline to zero population then worry about it afterwards. Some people say they're destroying the culture by allowing in immigrants? More like saving the culture ...War is peace, love is hate
Population decrease is a bad thing if you want to preserve your own culture and other countries are still growing.A baseless assertion which flies in the face of received wisdom with no explanation or evidence? Well then.
They should look at maintaining a stable population.Too late, they fucked up big time
Population decrease is a bad thing if you want to preserve your own culture and other countries are still growing. They should look at maintaining a stable population.
I always love how LW is so proud that the UK doesn't have a refugee problem, like he dug the English channel by himself using the corpse of Margaret Thatcher for a shovel.Is that how the iron lady got so rusty in the end? All the salt water?
I always love how LW is so proud that the UK doesn't have a refugee problem, like he dug the English channel by himself using the corpse of Margaret Thatcher for a shovel.Yeah exactly, we have refugees - not a refugee problem, and certainly not the German "PLEASE YOU HAVE TO GO BACK BUT WE'RE STILL TOLERANT BTW" knicker twisting
I came here for info on the worlds biggest vehicle.
BAGGER 288! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azEvfD4C6ow)
Check out some of their other stuff too. The Axolotl Song, the Spine Song, etc etc.BAGGER 288! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azEvfD4C6ow)
The heck did I just watch?
BAGGER 288 BAGGER 288
Does all that refugee thing affect average EU citizen?
Does all that refugee thing affect average EU citizen?Who's the average EU citizen? From what country, from what city, from what town or county? Italians and Belarusians are not in the same boat.
Does all that refugee thing affect average EU citizen?
Does all that refugee thing affect average EU citizen?That refugee thing causes paralyzing hysteria and frothing insanity in the average EU citizen. It's like memetic rabies.
average EU citizen
Belarusianstopkek
I'd expect the Russian to get that joke :P
I am russian, and it still looks more as mistake then as joke.That's cos you are Russian
Handle the banter like Gandalf m8Spoiler (click to show/hide)
So, LW, what do you think of that new spying bill?Double edged sword. Forcing ISPs to keep data sets off red flags but I suspect they do it anyways, if they don't GCHQ does. Judges being able to halt operations except in dire circumstances is a welcome addition. Really I am not most worried about that, but am most worried about the requirement that operators be required to maintain the technical capabilities to remove encryption. I've always suspected Theresa May of being an Elizabethan spylord.
Given they want a year's storage for IP access for everyone, I dread to imagine how much memory that's gonna take.Nah they'd probably just say that's why ISPs need to be directly managed by GCHQ
They can also tell an ISP to start logging the specific pages someone accesses, which is more information to store.
THEN the security system, no matter how labyrinthine, WILL be broken through. And when everyone on BT's information is out in the open, you can guarantee the government will find someone else to blame for the fact IPs are required to store this data.
Given they want a year's storage for IP access for everyone, I dread to imagine how much memory that's gonna take.
They can also tell an ISP to start logging the specific pages someone accesses, which is more information to store.
THEN the security system, no matter how labyrinthine, WILL be broken through. And when everyone on BT's information is out in the open, you can guarantee the government will find someone else to blame for the fact IPs are required to store this data.
Top kek weapons cache found in Swedish refugee centre (https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=sv&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Favpixlat.info%2F2015%2F11%2F03%2Fvapengomma-hittad-vid-asylboende%2F&edit-text=)
S W E D E N
W O
E L
D A
E N
N O L A N
OMG, examples of failure exist in a large program.I can't even tell if this is serious or not lol
Back to LW's article though - it should be noted that Avpixlat ("Depixled") is a notorious right wing conservative site. Furrhermore, while I didn't read the Swedish version of the article I don't think it was made clear what kinds of weapons it was, and the rural border to Norway is well known for it's large amount (relatively speaking) of illegal stashes of WW2 weapons in various states of disrepair. So I would need clarification that this stash was really owned or brought in by immigrants, and preferably by a less biased source, and not just kept there by the owner of the housing site, before I could conclude if this I'd trustworthy or not. Because because it is from Avpixlat I immediately think it's likely to be angled somehow or otherwise kit telling the whole truth.Whether the source is Russia or Norway the consumer market is of most significance :D
It's relevant since the system is overstretched by the amount of people arriving, which would allow for other stuff like this to slip through the net. Sweden (either immigration bureau or the government) did go out yesterday and officially statedthat they aren't show to provide housing any more and that people should stay where they are if they have housing there rather than risk not getting it here. There might have been something about not taking any more asylum applications as well (the waiting period for the asylum process is now 3 years - longer than you have the right to stay according to the new asylum policy), but I'm not 100 on if I remember that correctly.The Swedish definition of "notorious right wing conservative" is roughly equivalent to the American definition of "Moderate".
Back to LW's article though - it should be noted that Avpixlat ("Depixled") is a notorious right wing conservative site. Furrhermore, while I didn't read the Swedish version of the article I don't think it was made clear what kinds of weapons it was, and the rural border to Norway is well known for it's large amount (relatively speaking) of illegal stashes of WW2 weapons in various states of disrepair. So I would need clarification that this stash was really owned or brought in by immigrants, and preferably by a less biased source, and not just kept there by the owner of the housing site, before I could conclude if this I'd trustworthy or not. Because because it is from Avpixlat I immediately think it's likely to be angled somehow or otherwise kit telling the whole truth.
An UK flight en route to that sharm el-sheilh airport had to dodge a missile (http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-34754577)And the Egyptian delegation got mad we grounded flights because they could handle it apparently
Yeee. I think both UK and Russia may need to send fighter escorts to intercept missiles just in case during those rescue flights.
Edit: Wait, that was way back in August.
That's probably the Pirate Party's youth organisations' collaboration group, or something.Julia Reda is a German Pirate Party member and a MEP. That's her website.
Semanticism rules the day again!But it rules over nothing...
The idiocy never ends. (https://juliareda.eu/2015/11/ancillary-copyright-2-0-the-european-commission-is-preparing-a-frontal-attack-on-the-hyperlink/)I'm pretty sure I read about this like half a year ago.
Chances that Google does not abuse their power = 0%
You don't get rid of your don't be evil clause for no reason
Thats an interesting development (http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/11/09/454670739/for-some-muslim-asylum-seekers-in-germany-christianity-beckons)I wonder what would Sweden say about this...
Mmm Christianity bacons.Thats an interesting development (http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/11/09/454670739/for-some-muslim-asylum-seekers-in-germany-christianity-beckons)I wonder what would Sweden say about this...
Thats an interesting development (http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/11/09/454670739/for-some-muslim-asylum-seekers-in-germany-christianity-beckons)I wonder what would Sweden say about this...
As I've understood by listening to LW, Sweden is the European center for a certain kind of people that would react very strongly to an attempt at changing native cultural and religious habitats of foreign immigrants.Thats an interesting development (http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/11/09/454670739/for-some-muslim-asylum-seekers-in-germany-christianity-beckons)I wonder what would Sweden say about this...
What do you mean?
As I've understood by listening to LW, Sweden is the European center for a certain kind of people that would react very strongly to an attempt at changing native cultural and religious habitats of foreign immigrants.
The "cultural appropriation" people, which would fall under "liberals" label, I guess.As I've understood by listening to LW, Sweden is the European center for a certain kind of people that would react very strongly to an attempt at changing native cultural and religious habitats of foreign immigrants.
Are you speaking about Islamists? Misguided liberals? Something else?
taqiyyaPunishment for death = apostasy and the Afghan who got lynched by not!Syrians for converting says that if they see it as sincere the individuals see it as sincere. The only time you'd see mass fake conversions if there was some Kraut inquisition shit going on.
And you'll note the only time I ever cite myself as a source is with my own personal experience mostly in regards to the UK. All other times I talk about foreign countries is only with sources.As I've understood by listening to LW, Sweden is the European center for a certain kind of people that would react very strongly to an attempt at changing native cultural and religious habitats of foreign immigrants.Ehn. I'll be 100% honest and say that LW doesn't seem to be a terribly accurate source for things that aren't blatant fact in Europe (outside the UK of course)
As far as I'm aware, there's not any particular strength behind that kind of thinking here. Maybe people who listens to much to what Americans say and then attempt to apply that world view directly unto Sweden without regarding our different social and cultural dynamics. It seems to be a mostly American line of thinking.Besides when they try deporting converts to their homelands where they face death and torture (http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/world/2013/March/Sweden-Deports-Iranian-Christians-to-Face-Persecution-/)
As for how Swedes would react in general, Sweden is a very irreligious place, so I don't think anymany would care much about it.
Helmut Schmidt just died. May he rest in peace - he was the best Chancellor we ever had, and that includes Bismarck :PI love that the son of a Jew was awarded an iron cross for fighting in Stalingrad
E: Have an English-language article about the guy. (http://www.zeit.de/politik/deutschland/2015-11/helmut-schmidt-dead-english)
You know there are links and then there are links. For instance I picked the "swedes will be a minority" link and vetted it. I found it was made by the Gatestone Institute, founded 2012. It is headed by John Bolton (Neocon famous for pissing off the UN) and consists mostly of b-list neocons. (The odd man out is Elie Wiesel which is just kind of bizarre.) The think tank, like many of the neocons, has accusations of anti-muslim bias.It's not like this is out of thin air, they gave sources for their assertions. Also, these days absolutely anything critical of Islam in any way is accused of Islamophobia, racism, and countless other meaningless buzzwords. Regardless, it doesn't matter whether they're anti-Islam or not. What matters is the truth. Unless Gatestone has done something truly heinous such as blatantly lying or trying to defend pedophilia like Salon Magazine has, then what's the issue?
When the first source you find when looking for a citation is something like that, alarm bells should be going off in your head.
Unless Gatestone has done something truly heinous such as blatantly lying or trying to defend pedophilia like Salon Magazine has, then what's the issue?The slippery slope is coated in industrial lubricant
Unless Gatestone has done something truly heinous such as blatantly lying
No, that was just me bashing Salon.Unless Gatestone has done something truly heinous such as blatantly lying or trying to defend pedophilia like Salon Magazine has, then what's the issue?The slippery slope is coated in industrial lubricant
Big English-language article about Helmut Schmidt, his life, and why he was so important to Germany and the Germans. (http://www.zeit.de/politik/2015-11/helmut-schmidt-obituary-politician-english)Getting some deja vu here
In more seriousness though, how do people feel in regards to breaking your own constitutional limits and going extralegal in times of crisis? Is it justifiable in certain cases as in natural disaster or crises as with Helmut or Obama?
Artikel 1
(1) Die Würde des Menschen ist unantastbar. Sie zu achten und zu schützen ist Verpflichtung aller staatlichen Gewalt.
(2) Das Deutsche Volk bekennt sich darum zu unverletzlichen und unveräußerlichen Menschenrechten als Grundlage jeder menschlichen Gemeinschaft, des Friedens und der Gerechtigkeit in der Welt.
(3) Die nachfolgenden Grundrechte binden Gesetzgebung, vollziehende Gewalt und Rechtsprechung als unmittelbar geltendes Recht.
(1) Human dignity is uninfringible. To act and defend it is the duty of all state force.
(2) Therefore the German people commit themselves to inviolable and inalienable human rights as foundation of all human community, of peace and of justice in the world.
(3) The following fundamental rights bind the legislative, the executive, and the judicial branch as directly applicable law.
You mean like how Lincoln suspended the writ of habeus corpus, declared martial law and burned down half of the south?
The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it.
Also, these days absolutely anything critical of Islam in any way is accused of Islamophobia, racism, and countless other meaningless buzzwords.And similarly anyone who shows any kind of sympathy for the refugees, decrees Islamization to be a buzzword and is of opinion Orban and his ilk are all bunch of shitheads is branded dirty liberal, filthy progy, stupid humanist or just plain old lefty. Gotta show both sides of the coin to keep the balance, mang.
and crippling European government budgets while they're at it.Honestly if I didn't have "no ruining other people's countries intentionally" as a rule in the OP I'd be seriously advocating Germany accept another few million in the next two years for being such racist shitbigolords under the anticipation that it'd finally snap and northern politics would become considerably easier without eurocrats confounding everyone everywhere.
Sweden to introduce border controls at noon
Someone has made a reasonably high-quality anti-immigration propaganda video and it's gone viral on both YouTube and dumpert.nl, apparently a popular video hosting site in the Netherlands. I'm rather impressed.Checki Gex?
This is the face of the new right, people. Like it or not, it's here to stay.The EU has proven Nigel right again, the EU has created the far right of the 21st century from Paris to Warsaw.
Sweden to introduce border controls at noonWill they actually enforce that?
http://www.thelocal.se/20151111/sweden-set-to-mount-border-checks
Bloody EU, creating refugees out of thin air to piss Sweden!Nah m8 enrich Sweden
Border controls equals the iron curtain now?Yeah I mean do these people even know what iron curtain is
Border controls equals the iron curtain now?Yeah I mean do these people even know what iron curtain is
it's not supposed to keep people out
it's to keep people in
like Trump's plan to coerce Mexico into building a giant wall with their own funds
Border controls equals the iron curtain now?Literally Hitler
I really don't understand why so few medium-sized and small companies do that already. It looks easy enough: Set up a shell cooperation somewhere, do a bit of paperwork - et voila! No more taxes!I suppose it's just a matter of ignorance innit, they don't have law to English translators working for them like Cafe Nero does
I really don't understand why so few medium-sized and small companies do that already. It looks easy enough: Set up a shell cooperation somewhere, do a bit of paperwork - et voila! No more taxes!What I understand, usually small entrepreneurs are held back from doing that because of the huge legal costs involved. Sleezy lawyers don't come cheap.
Before that the Roman Empire settled tribesmen into their lands hoping to fill the gaps in their ranks and tax coffers with warriors fleeing the Huns, for all the good it did them eaglephiles their lands were no longer theirs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZcDidn't watch it yet, but let me made some wild assumptions. The video will talk about or at least mention at some point:
RIIIIIIVEEEEERRSSSS OOOOOFFF BLOOOOOOOOOOOODYou speak as though you believe that terrorism and Islamism are no threat at all, and that Europe will quietly take every economic migrant out there without issue. You cannot dismiss out of hand an issue that's had tens of thousands of people protesting in the streets and that's driven very significant political change in multiple European countries. Do you think this is some kind of joke? Peoples' lives are being destroyed because their governments refuse to work in the interests of their own people.
/threadhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZcDidn't watch it yet, but let me made some wild assumptions. The video will talk about or at least mention at some point:
- Islamization
- cultural jihad
- European Christian values being under attack
- [insert stock footage of full-face veiled women]
- migrants which will out-baby the true Europeans in the baby wars
- migrants that will steal our money
- migrants that will steal our jobs
- Islamization
- terrorists
- [insert stock footage of angry young moslems rioting/throwing food on the ground/burning flag of any sorts]
- jewish conspiracy
- Islamization
- European crumbling under onslaught of foreign culture
- foreign culture that is not culture
- at one point point out "this is not about a race and we are not a racist BUT..."
- "also, we are not nazis, we are just politically incorrect"
- EU is of the devil, we are being commanded from Brussels
- #NoTrueEuropeans
- [insert stock footage of grim looking skinheaded proud Aryan übermensch defenders of the Europe]
- some random quote from Qua'ran
- ISIS
- and last but not least, Islamization
I'll get back to you all in 20 mins, cheers.
edit: oh shit nevermind, 1 minute in and it's already apocalypse now, that dark brooding music oh shit my sides plz send help
edit2: close enough, forgot to add the "dirt rich fake refugees", "baby rapers everywhere", "libtards" and "Donald Trump" tag.
Peoples' lives are being destroyedPray tell, which people?
Even if all these nations literally emptied out and moved to Europe, they'd still only make up about 8% of the population of Europe.
10 million Syrian refugees in Germany?No. 10 mio from Syria and the rest of the Near East, the Middle East, Afghanistan, Afrika, the Balkans.
RIIIIIIVEEEEERRSSSS OOOOOFFF BLOOOOOOOOOOOODWHOOOOO'S GONNNAAA LIIIIIVE
"For all the good it did them?"The Gauls were brought in over the Rhine in unmanagable amounts in 405-6 and even after they were successfully settled the resulting loss of land and revenue contributed to their decline. Rome would die 6 decades later :D
The practice of accepting unwashed barbarians into the republic predated the empire by several generations. Most of Africa, Gaul, Britain, Asia Minor, Egypt and Palestine were brought into after the unwashed barbarians started getting uppity and becoming senators. So yeah, "all the good it did them" was Pax Romana and surviving for another five and a half centuries.
10 million Syrian refugees in Germany? What, is literally everyone in Syria trying to move to Germany now? Clear bullshit on the face of it.Hahahaha, you believe they're Syrian?
Earlier in 2014 amongst first time asylum seekers (http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/images/9/97/First_time_asylum_applicants_in_the_EU-28_by_citizenship%2C_Q2_2014_%E2%80%93_Q2_2015.png) the proportion of Syrians was around 10-15%, not accounting for second time asylum seekers, fake Syrians (https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/migrants-are-disguising-themselves-as-syrians-to-gain-entry-to-europe/2015/09/22/827c6026-5bd8-11e5-8475-781cc9851652_story.html), those coming by sea (http://www.economist.com/blogs/economist-explains/2015/09/economist-explains-4) nor immigrants who authorities fail to log. (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-24583286) Eurostat has 700,000 asylum seekers in total logged across the EU (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34131911) despite countries like Germany alone taking in 750,000 illegal immigrants yearly, set to rise to 800,000 - conservative estimates. Measuring by asylum applications only takes into account those who bother to apply for asylum and takes their word for it.By EU statistics the immigrants are coming from all over the world, everywhere from Sub-Saharan Africa, North Africa, the Middle East, Southern Asia and Eastern Asia (and also the Balkans)
There's also a problem in that the population growth of Germany has been extremely slow. If they'd had an influx of 10 million people over five years, they'd be the fastest growing nation on Earth. Just. Didn't. Happen.Immigrants in Germany swell to record high 11 million (http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/08/03/uk-europe-migrants-germany-idUKKCN0Q81WO20150803)
Anyway, short version. There are 742 million total Europeans, vs 22 million totalNo one in Eastern Europe, Western Europe, Southern Europe or Northern Europe is going to make a difference to the displacement Sweden and Germany has inflicted upon themselves. It is more like 80 million Germans and 9 million Swedes taking in mass immigration from the entire world. Swede statistics from 2011 (http://www.scb.se/Pages/TableAndChart____26041.aspx) show Swedes were already 85% and declining and that was before they had 4 years of immigration so hard even they panicked (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/12/refugee-crisis-sweden-introduces-border-checks) and tried to stop it. Germany will take longer, they do not know how many immigrants exactly they have taken and once all the old Germans have died they'll be moving down a lot from the 90% they were in 2010. Also even then, you will lose the cities first - all the Germans in the countryside will do nothing in the cities. Perhaps in that regard Sweden is most fucked because most of their country's Swedes live in the cities. But yeah it's by German statistics that it's risen to 1,500,000 yearly, still rising. The 10 million in 5 years thing is really quite conservative.Syriansimmigrants. Even if ALL theSyriansimmigrants decided to move to Europe, you're only looking at a 3% increase in total European nation population.
*goes into thread*Yeah on the readability front just use paragraphs
*gets whacked by wall of text*
*goes into thread*Yeah on the readability front just use paragraphs
*gets whacked by wall of text*
The Gauls were brought in over the Rhine in unmanagable amounts in 405-6 and even after they were successfully settled the resulting loss of land and revenue contributed to their decline. Rome would die 6 decades later :D
Blame? Rome wasn't burnt in a day (except when the Vandals did it ha). It goes to show there is such thing as a successful immigration policy and what a failure looks like, five centuries of settlement and success was possible up until they brought in unmanageable amounts and then their lands were lost ^_^The Gauls were brought in over the Rhine in unmanagable amounts in 405-6 and even after they were successfully settled the resulting loss of land and revenue contributed to their decline. Rome would die 6 decades later :DSo after five centuries of successful immigration policies, you blame century six for all the problems. Or it could be the three hundred years of civil wars and the population declines...
the main problem with invaders was that they came in on their own terms and we not able to be disarmed and so asserted their autonomy in the empire.Blame? Rome wasn't burnt in a day (except when the Vandals did it ha). It goes to show there is such thing as a successful immigration policy and what a failure looks like, five centuries of settlement and success was possible up until they brought in unmanageable amounts and then their lands were lost ^_^The Gauls were brought in over the Rhine in unmanagable amounts in 405-6 and even after they were successfully settled the resulting loss of land and revenue contributed to their decline. Rome would die 6 decades later :DSo after five centuries of successful immigration policies, you blame century six for all the problems. Or it could be the three hundred years of civil wars and the population declines...
Again, if that Breton had not invited Angles and Saxons to Britain there'd have been no Anglo-Saxon Britain. If the Ottomans hadn't been invited to Western Europe to fight for the Byzantines there'd have been no great Turkish Empire of Europe. Or 1834, where as I've now just found out, the Mexicans tried to stop immigration from America but illegal immigration continued nonetheless - and at any rate their efforts were much too late, as Texans already outnumbered Mexicans at that point. The rest is history, Texas is USA clay now :D
Blame? Rome wasn't burnt in a day (except when the Vandals did it ha). It goes to show there is such thing as a successful immigration policy and what a failure looks like, five centuries of settlement and success was possible up until they brought in unmanageable amounts and then their lands were lost ^_^
If the Ottomans hadn't been invited to Western Europe to fight for the Byzantinesottomans?
Medieval scholars always said never ever hire mercenaries :DIf the Ottomans hadn't been invited to Western Europe to fight for the Byzantinesottomans?
especially dem moslems, right? still i'd like to know what your talkin aboutMedieval scholars always said never ever hire mercenaries :DIf the Ottomans hadn't been invited to Western Europe to fight for the Byzantinesottomans?
especially dem moslems, right? still i'd like to know what your talkin aboutI was gonna joke with you but then I realized that funding Al Qaeda and the other 'moderates' turned out swimmingly
especially dem moslems, right? still i'd like to know what your talkin aboutMedieval scholars always said never ever hire mercenaries :DIf the Ottomans hadn't been invited to Western Europe to fight for the Byzantinesottomans?
He's referring to European cultures/civilizations that ended when they hired large numbers of mercenaries to supplement their own flagging forces and wound up being assimilated into the mercenary populations culture. One of the primary examples is when the Mercians (I think it was Mercia at least, been a while since I read up on that) hired Saxons to fight Danish raiders and wound up with cross cultural assimilation turning the two groups into Anglo-Saxons, which went on to be the dominant culture of England.i know. i'm asking for clarification on one of the examples
He's using them as examples of smaller immigrant populations having large impacts on the culture of the area they migrate to.
Yeah I've literally never heard of Byzantium hiring Ottomans. Pretty sure it was a straight conquest by the Turks of a weakened Byzantium, not something about mercenaries.Yep. I have no idea what he's talking about, either. Even if you go one more and just look at Anatolian Turks in general (the Osmanli family only emerged in the 14th century, after the Turks had been present for a quarter-millenium), the Turks seized inner Anatolia by force of arms (remember Manzikert?). The only thing I can think of is that he's referring to the marriage of Orhan to Theodora and subsequent alliance, through which Theodora's brother (a pretender to the purple mantle and, briefly, a successful one) allowed the Turks to raid his enemies in Gallipoli and, from there, Thrace, but by that point the Ottomans were so strong and the Eastern Romans so weak from civil war that being "permitted" in rather than forcing their way in was in no way a practical distinction.
what the hell is going on?!
Edit : apparently, some of the shooters screamed "For Syria".
Edit : apparently, some of the shooters screamed "For Syria".
I get the feeling this may lead to a few problems with the Syrian Refugees.
Edit : apparently, some of the shooters screamed "For Syria".
I get the feeling this may lead to a few problems with the Syrian Refugees.
Dozens dead and hostages in Bataclan, a state of emergency in an "unprecedented terrorits attack"[sic] and it's darn those right wingers and anti-immigrants? Priorities are set well. 40 dead now and 60 hostages?Oh yeah, the right wingers and anti-immigrants will definetly pounce on that. Also, France just joined the coalition a few weeks ago.Edit : apparently, some of the shooters screamed "For Syria".I get the feeling this may lead to a few problems with the Syrian Refugees.
My first thought when I heard about that stuff is Mumbai, it sounds like the 'many places at once' strategy that I've heard was used in Mumbai.
Edit: And I think the Shingen thing just died, at least temporarily.
Henry Samuel reports:Well if it's what you want then it's what you get
According to BFMTV, one of the gunmen shouted: "It's for Syria" at Bataclan and Allahu Akbar.
There has been no official comment on motive.
So multiple attacks all over the globe, from iraq to lebanon in the last 24h and now france also.
This probaby needs its own thread.Welcome to Islamism m8
This is starting to sound like European 9/11, and the aftermath for this is going to be very, very bad...
Saying that this is more fuel for the islamophobic sentiment in France is completely reasonable and probably completely intended.
CNN's saying that BMTV is saying at least 60 dead.They are busy in West Africa
I thought France was going to try to beef up intel and security after Charlie Hebdo? Also, I don't want to be that guy, but wouldn't France have at least stepped up efforts when they joined in the coalition? Especially after the Russian plane got bombed.
prepare for islamophobics as now it will be somewhat justified in the long run.
since these attacks aint going to stop these kind of beliefs will just expand.
i dont live in the us.in fact i saw islamophobia grow rather fast in south america after those fucks did shit at argentina.prepare for islamophobics as now it will be somewhat justified in the long run.
since these attacks aint going to stop these kind of beliefs will just expand.
Maybe that's exactly what the terrorists want, who the hell knows.
But yeah, you guys saw the rise in islamaphobia over here in the US after 9/11.
awake from this diversity shit and stop accepting more of those savages as refugees.
they don't assimilate nor respect any sort of western value.
nor do they hold morals along any sort of civilized standard.
enjoy also your welfare parasites.
and since they breed to around five kids or even more they can drain a lot of welfare funds and such.
Indeed. I am reminded of people claiming that there were no terrorists among the refugees and anyone claiming that was a paranoid xenophobe. Other things that've been said in their defense will probably not be taken quite so seriously anymore. All I can say is that I'm glad I'm not over there.Nothing confirmed yet, so we do not at all know who comitted it. Not that it'll matter.
Then again, maybe the thread needs an American hand to moderate it............................No matter how many die there is only one thing Leftists fear more than death: Being called a bigot
He's referring to European cultures/civilizations that ended when they hired large numbers of mercenaries to supplement their own flagging forces and wound up being assimilated into the mercenary populations culture. One of the primary examples is when the Mercians (I think it was Mercia at least, been a while since I read up on that) hired Saxons to fight Danish raiders and wound up with cross cultural assimilation turning the two groups into Anglo-Saxons, which went on to be the dominant culture of England.i know. i'm asking for clarification on one of the examples
He's using them as examples of smaller immigrant populations having large impacts on the culture of the area they migrate to.
Then again, maybe the thread needs an American hand to moderate it............................No matter how many die there is only one thing Leftists fear more than death: Being called a bigot
anyone want to create a french crisis thread?
Probably a good idea, yeah. I didn't want to make one because I thought maybe you guys in Europe would want to make the thread.close.im chilean and i have seen this diversity shit start to take hold here.awake from this diversity shit and stop accepting more of those savages as refugees.
they don't assimilate nor respect any sort of western value.
nor do they hold morals along any sort of civilized standard.
enjoy also your welfare parasites.
and since they breed to around five kids or even more they can drain a lot of welfare funds and such.
Then again, maybe the thread needs an American hand to moderate it............................
Edit: Oh you're Argentinian, nvm.
I think that was supposed to be at xxseuzxx?No
Oh yeah and if Palestinians were, either this means the attackers with Shia or they follow the Wahhabi sect where sinners are nonbeilievers even if they profess the Sunni faith, and therefore must be killed. Or perhaps the Khawarjites have been resurrected from the dead. Or it's indiscriminate attacks. Or Palestinians have not yet been confirmed as amongst the dead. Still open on that.
cant these people just live in a normal western way?
having their own beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others?
then if they show again that they cant why let em live in a civilized country after all?
if they flee from hellish landscapes and ruins why they start to do the same stuff that led to that ruins?
cant they just behave?
the time i asked such things to an afghan living in my country he started to tell me about some verses from their book.Oh yeah and if Palestinians were, either this means the attackers with Shia or they follow the Wahhabi sect where sinners are nonbeilievers even if they profess the Sunni faith, and therefore must be killed. Or perhaps the Khawarjites have been resurrected from the dead. Or it's indiscriminate attacks. Or Palestinians have not yet been confirmed as amongst the dead. Still open on that.
All that I've heard is that it was in or near a Palestinian refugee camp in Beirut and earlier today Hezbollah declared war on ISIS.
It's probably just the Middle East being a shifting maelstrom of who knows how many sides and factions.cant these people just live in a normal western way?
having their own beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others?
then if they show again that they cant why let em live in a civilized country after all?
if they flee from hellish landscapes and ruins why they start to do the same stuff that led to that ruins?
cant they just behave?
I don't know, why don't YOU ask them that.
cant these people just live in a normal western way?
having their own beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others?
then if they show again that they cant why let em live in a civilized country after all?
if they flee from hellish landscapes and ruins why they start to do the same stuff that led to that ruins?
cant they just behave?
That's preciousyet said afghan had a porn background on his phone..
cant these people just live in a normal western way?
having their own beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others?
then if they show again that they cant why let em live in a civilized country after all?
if they flee from hellish landscapes and ruins why they start to do the same stuff that led to that ruins?
cant they just behave?
why when i say this kind of thing im labeled as a rightwing nutjob?cant these people just live in a normal western way?
having their own beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others?
then if they show again that they cant why let em live in a civilized country after all?
if they flee from hellish landscapes and ruins why they start to do the same stuff that led to that ruins?
cant they just behave?
they are not running from some evil monster, hostile aliens or natural disaster. they are all part of the same culture, only difference between the one emigrating and the one staying is that those emigrating are having the short stick in their country. the mindset is not "abroad we can be free", but "abroad we have a chance to be the top of the chain"
cant these people just live in a normal western way?
having their own beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others?
then if they show again that they cant why let em live in a civilized country after all?
if they flee from hellish landscapes and ruins why they start to do the same stuff that led to that ruins?
cant they just behave?
they are not running from some evil monster, hostile aliens or natural disaster. they are all part of the same culture, only difference between the one emigrating and the one staying is that those emigrating are having the short stick in their country. the mindset is not "abroad we can be free", but "abroad we have a chance to be the top of the chain"
why when i say this kind of thing im labeled as a rightwing nutjob?cant these people just live in a normal western way?
having their own beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others?
then if they show again that they cant why let em live in a civilized country after all?
if they flee from hellish landscapes and ruins why they start to do the same stuff that led to that ruins?
cant they just behave?
they are not running from some evil monster, hostile aliens or natural disaster. they are all part of the same culture, only difference between the one emigrating and the one staying is that those emigrating are having the short stick in their country. the mindset is not "abroad we can be free", but "abroad we have a chance to be the top of the chain"
cant they accept that not all people accept or like these diversity programs and such?
nor all westerns like this political correctness thing?
The conspiracy part was at mijan, who IS a conspiracy theorist, not you xxseuzxx, sorry.
Okay, you two take your conspiracy theorist islamophobia to another forum, preferrably.M8 where I live it's easy to find street preachers for ISIS, they infiltrated the schools and our Unis keep putting up Jihadists (http://www.eastlondonadvertiser.co.uk/news/education/former_islamic_radical_claims_talk_of_jihad_common_at_queen_mary_university_friday_prayer_1_4182318) to lead prayers.
why when i say this kind of thing im labeled as a rightwing nutjob?Denial of reality comes easy with buzzwords
cant they accept that not all people accept or like these diversity programs and such?That's the bizarre thing too. A lot of the ebil nazis in Europe just wanted selective migration where they could actually control who went in and at what quantities, but instead there had to be zero controls until it spiraled out of control. Germany and Sweden's last ditch efforts to control who comes in now? It is closing the stable doors after the horses have bolted off.
nor all westerns like this political correctness thing?I haven't found many urban Westerners not into political correctness, mostly only immigrants who are politically incorrect because no one can call them racist ^_^
Also you know, there's Islamists killing people in Paris right now. Smjjames, you are American yes? Live in America? If yes to both, you don't live with Muslims at all
only with "so tolerant omg wow" people who couldn't squish flies if they wanted to but can't because their vegan diet lacks strength.
It can't be a conspiracy when it's in the open, and I said it before - the only thing leftists fear more than death is being called a bigot. I won't shut down discussion on Islam for Islamophobia because every criticism of Islam is Islamophobic. Everyone gets a say, even Sinistarr walls of text :P
there is the thing about being nice towards people and don't talking in not so nice ways about some issues.Okay, you two take your conspiracy theorist islamophobia to another forum, preferrably.M8 where I live it's easy to find street preachers for ISIS, they infiltrated the schools and our Unis keep putting up Jihadists (http://www.eastlondonadvertiser.co.uk/news/education/former_islamic_radical_claims_talk_of_jihad_common_at_queen_mary_university_friday_prayer_1_4182318) to lead prayers.
Also you know, there's Islamists killing people in Paris right now. Smjjames, you are American yes? Live in America? If yes to both, you don't live with Muslims at all, only with "so tolerant omg wow" people who couldn't squish flies if they wanted to but can't because their vegan diet lacks strength. It can't be a conspiracy when it's in the open, and I said it before - the only thing leftists fear more than death is being called a bigot. I won't shut down discussion on Islam for Islamophobia because every criticism of Islam is Islamophobic. Everyone gets a say, even Sinistarr walls of text :Pwhy when i say this kind of thing im labeled as a rightwing nutjob?Denial of reality comes easy with buzzwordscant they accept that not all people accept or like these diversity programs and such?That's the bizarre thing too. A lot of the ebil nazis in Europe just wanted selective migration where they could actually control who went in and at what quantities, but instead there had to be zero controls until it spiraled out of control. Germany and Sweden's last ditch efforts to control who comes in now? It is closing the stable doors after the horses have bolted off.nor all westerns like this political correctness thing?I haven't found many urban Westerners not into political correctness, mostly only immigrants who are politically incorrect because no one can call them racist ^_^
Eh? You're British I think, right? *throws all manner of meaty American foods at Mijan*
The conspiracy part was at mijan, who IS a conspiracy theorist, not you xxseuzxx, sorry.
At me? What is conspiracy about what i said? I see people getting killed, guess by who?
The thing is, the groups that are doing this are not fleeing from hellish landscapes and ruins. They are on purpose infiltrating to do dmg and shit like that
Eh? You're British I think, right? *throws all manner of meaty American foods at Mijan*
I do like meat, but not american junk food :). They poisoned us enough, no need for more
I meant this bit because obviously that can't be true for ALL of them.
I meant this bit because obviously that can't be true for ALL of them.
And where did i use word all or anything that implies that? Just said the group that do this things are not the groups that are running from war.
Not directly, no (to the living with muslims), but I've known a few and not ALL muslims are bad, okay, that's a fact.Yeah and I know great Muslims too, the issue of whether they're good or bad people is compounded with the issue of Islamism. Very friendly ISIS supporters are very good people willing to do bad things for reasons that are good to them. Their ideal society does not have room for your progressive ideals, to say the least.
Eh? You're British I think, right? *throws all manner of meaty American foods at Loud Whispers* Your troll insults need work dude.It is not a troll insult, it is a joke. People don't know what the meaning of trolling is.
Come on, have I ever shown signs of being a bigot? You do have a point on the everybody gets a say though.Hahaha of course you have not, you have always made great pains to show your tolerance, even after beheadings have made a surprise reappearance in France. I'm just wondering how much of what you say is signalling, calling for people to leave or requesting """"""American"""""" """"""moderation"""""" sounds like reddit-tier parodies
All that I've heard is that it was in or near a Palestinian refugee camp in Beirut and earlier today Hezbollah declared war on ISIS.
It's probably just the Middle East being a shifting maelstrom of who knows how many sides and factions.
Eh? You're British I think, right? *throws all manner of meaty American foods at Loud Whispers* Your troll insults need work dude.It is not a troll insult, it is a joke. People don't know what the meaning of trolling is.
Come on, have I ever shown signs of being a bigot? You do have a point on the everybody gets a say though.Hahaha of course you have not, you have always made great pains to show your tolerance, even after beheadings have made a surprise reappearance in France. I'm just wondering how much of what you say is signalling, calling for people to leave or requesting """"""American"""""" """"""moderation"""""" sounds like reddit-tier parodies
Anyways world leader reactions:
“My thoughts in these hours are with the victims of these apparently terrorist attacks, their relatives, and all people in Paris,” Ms. Merkel said in a statement. “The German government is in contact with the French government and has expressed the sympathy and solidarity of the people in Germany.” (http://www.wsj.com/articles/merkel-deeply-shocked-by-paris-attacks-1447456784)
'Those who think that they can terrorize the people of France or the values that they stand for are wrong,' US President Obama says in a hastily arranged appearance before reporters at the White House (http://www.rappler.com/world/regions/europe/112722-world-leaders-obama-condemn-paris-attacks)
"I am shocked by events in Paris tonight. Our thoughts and prayers are with the French people. We will do whatever we can to help." Said David Cameron. (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34816571)
Who set Calais on fire?Spoiler (click to show/hide)
The Calais fire may or may not be actually happening; I haven't seen any reliable sources that have verified it.
A French government emergency plan shows an accident at the site could lead to the 'risk of intoxication, fire and explosions' because the chemicals used at the plant are 'inflammable, toxic to humans and toxic to the environment.' (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3315969/Jungle-2-camp-Calais-littered-ASBESTOS-blocks-6-000-migrants-using-weigh-tents.html)Well that could explain it if it happened.
Buddhism's starting to get violent people in it in half decent quantities. You get violent shitelords everywhere.I won't be worrying about Burmese Buddhists bumming me arse for at least a hundred years
The Calais fire may or may not be actually happening; I haven't seen any reliable sources that have verified it.QuoteA French government emergency plan shows an accident at the site could lead to the 'risk of intoxication, fire and explosions' because the chemicals used at the plant are 'inflammable, toxic to humans and toxic to the environment.' (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3315969/Jungle-2-camp-Calais-littered-ASBESTOS-blocks-6-000-migrants-using-weigh-tents.html)Well that could explain it if it happened.
You get violent shitelords everywhere.
The Calais fire may or may not be actually happening; I haven't seen any reliable sources that have verified it.QuoteA French government emergency plan shows an accident at the site could lead to the 'risk of intoxication, fire and explosions' because the chemicals used at the plant are 'inflammable, toxic to humans and toxic to the environment.' (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3315969/Jungle-2-camp-Calais-littered-ASBESTOS-blocks-6-000-migrants-using-weigh-tents.html)Well that could explain it if it happened.
Wait, I thought absestos was banned in Europe? Well, obviously it isn't.
I don't think I ever made a remark when beheadings made a surprise reappearence in France, or do you mean Charlie Hebdo?Yeah between you calling people Islamaphobes who should leave this forum and twitterati doing the #ALLLIVESMATTER of Islamism apologeticism I don't buy it :P
Also, the American Moderation thing was jokingly sarcastic since I thought xxseuzxx was European. I wasn't being serious.
Got a news link on that? A quick google news search didn't come up with anything.It's on twitter, I am waiting on reliable news source so it could be fake.
Wait, I thought absestos was banned in Europe? Well, obviously it isn't.It is banned, illegal immigrants don't follow the law (not exactly the first law they've broken)
It's the fact you said it as if Islam's the only 'religion of peace' with violent members. I was pointing out they're all over the damn place.You get violent shitelords everywhere.
While we're at it, #AllLivesMatter
There's a serious and specific problem but it's uncomfortable so let's blow smoke about extremists in every religion.
not all of them.but still a sizable amount of these people behave in such ways that promote discrimination towards them.The conspiracy part was at mijan, who IS a conspiracy theorist, not you xxseuzxx, sorry.
At me? What is conspiracy about what i said? I see people getting killed, guess by who?
I meant this bit because obviously that can't be true for ALL of them.The thing is, the groups that are doing this are not fleeing from hellish landscapes and ruins. They are on purpose infiltrating to do dmg and shit like that
Eh? You're British I think, right? *throws all manner of meaty American foods at Mijan*
I do like meat, but not american junk food :). They poisoned us enough, no need for more
I thought I was quoting you initially, was actually meant at Loud Whispers, sorry man. *offers a peace burrito*
lol.
Idk, locals in Calais (http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/592671/Calais-fires-ferry-workers-strike-Eurotunnel-services-block-road-port) are always setting fire to things and rioting, regardless of religion. The message is that if white/christians etc did this, nobody would make a link to their race or religion, but if a non white/non christian does we take the same act as evidence that their race/religion is somehow more suspect than the white people in France who riot and set fire to things. And you gotta admit, the refugees probably learned from the French how effective setting fire to things and rioting actually is.What are you talking about one of the national stereotypes of the French is that they won't bloody work because they're too busy setting things on fire and going on strike
Also, the headlines seem to be that the refugee camp itself is on fire. People usually don't set themselves on fire when they are in a position of power.
never has one spoken truth here with 0 regard for this diversity curse placed upon modern Europeans.Idk, locals in Calais (http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/592671/Calais-fires-ferry-workers-strike-Eurotunnel-services-block-road-port) are always setting fire to things and rioting, regardless of religion. The message is that if white/christians etc did this, nobody would make a link to their race or religion, but if a non white/non christian does we take the same act as evidence that their race/religion is somehow more suspect than the white people in France who riot and set fire to things. And you gotta admit, the refugees probably learned from the French how effective setting fire to things and rioting actually is.What are you talking about one of the national stereotypes of the French is that they won't bloody work because they're too busy setting things on fire and going on strike
Also, the headlines seem to be that the refugee camp itself is on fire. People usually don't set themselves on fire when they are in a position of power.
Did you even forget when the Germans blamed the Greeks for laziness when they bankrupted?
This is exactly the apologetics that lets Islamism grow more powerful because it has no resistance and progressive parties can't bend over backwards enough for Islamism because Muslims aren't white and that is good ;P
I am heavily associating you with the people who could literally watch a video of Lee Rigby being beheaded by a man calling himself a soldier of Allah and then bury their head in the sands. How many people have been killed today by people shouting Allahu Akbar? You think everyone would be "gee I don't want to live under Shariah and I'm awfully disgruntled that my friends have just been dismembered but it's ok the killers were blond haired americans"?
I swear your people would have a tiger eat one leg because a lion might eat the other
No, but it came across that way (at least to me)It's the fact you said it as if Islam's the only 'religion of peace' with violent members. I was pointing out they're all over the damn place.You get violent shitelords everywhere.
While we're at it, #AllLivesMatter
There's a serious and specific problem but it's uncomfortable so let's blow smoke about extremists in every religion.
I didn't say that though. And it's still blowing smoke. This is a conversation about what was almost certainly (Assuming it's not confirmed already, Hollande says they know who did it and where they're from) Islamists, continuing a trend of such attacks on various scales.
Evidently there's miscommunication going on. I then went defensive because, quite honestly, your response was horribly dismissive of me.
Maybe it was. I hear that line a lot, I don't think it contributes to conversations and I think it deflects discussion on the issue. To me it's exactly like the all lives matter (http://chainsawsuit.com/comic/2014/12/08/all-things-considered/) thing. A truism people use to smokescreen an uncomfortable reality.
So yeah, it probably did come off as dismissive.
Well, sure. Abstract concepts can't hold a religion; I'd be rather terrified if they could.
Also, the headlines seem to be that the refugee camp itself is on fire. People usually don't set themselves on fire when they are in a position of power. But considering how the camp has gone up in flames it was clearly a massive fire risk to begin with, and it's just as likely this was a fuck up and not a specific campaign. Without news reports of a riot to go with the fire, we really can't say it was a deliberate thing. People usually do that to bring attention to their plight. Just burning down the camp then saying nothing about it is not the way protest works. And people don't tend to just burn down their own dwellings for the lulz.
Well depending on what definition of terrorism you're using it's right. I personally use terrorism as a strategy as my definition, since the terrorist label seems fitting for civilian mass murderers attacking in a certain way even if their motives are apolitical or irreligious. Without getting too sidetracked, it's right - but it feels wrong because it's deflecting blame from the ideology and the ideologists whose motives lie behind the attack. It'd be like saying genocide has no race right after the Armenian genocide.-snip-That feels...
I'm not sure, they're stating something obvious, but it feels wrong somehow.
I'm kinda getting a SJW vibe from it.-snip-That feels...
I'm not sure, they're stating something obvious, but it feels wrong somehow.
Yeah, I think that's the issue.I'm kinda getting a SJW vibe from it.-snip-That feels...
I'm not sure, they're stating something obvious, but it feels wrong somehow.
Hmm... I wonder if there's anyone blaming terrorism on white heterosexual men yet?
If this doesn't result in a 10-20% increase in Front National support, and a 5-10% increase in anti-immigration parties across Europe, I'd be astounded.Le Pen is leading presidential polls. You don't fuck around with demographics without being smart, when you do people die. Another great success for uncontrolled immigration, where both immigrants and europeans feel that politicians prioritize the other over the other
Might finally result in some sanity about who is accepted and who is shown the door.
The people to immigrate there will be thinking 'Much better than back home!', and of course that'll be lost on the next generations because they've grown up without a previous, worse living to compare it to in some comparatively less wealthy and less stable area, but beyond that, what's causing it? If it was just that you'd be seeing the native populations constantly coming up and staging uprisings...They never lost their superior heritage and they want to create the Ummah
Is there some desire to claim back their heritage or something?
Poor economic success and social exclusion, mostly. It's a recipe for disaster, and preventing it from happening should be a major priority for the rest of Europe. I don't expect that any preventative measures will be taken, anti-immigration parties being how they are, but one can always hope.Here's betting that the guys that did it are second generation immigrants. Those, especially considering how disaffected the French second/third generation immigrants tend to be, are the biggest worry.I'm wondering what's causing the disaffection?
The people to immigrate there will be thinking 'Much better than back home!', and of course that'll be lost on the next generations because they've grown up without a previous, worse living to compare it to in some comparatively less wealthy and less stable area, but beyond that, what's causing it? If it was just that you'd be seeing the native populations constantly coming up and staging uprisings...
Is there some desire to claim back their heritage or something?
snipThe French were already getting ready to send the De Gaulle to the Middle East. I doubt that this will do anything to change those plans. I doubt that they'll do anything beyond air strikes and perhaps some special forces stuff.
A nice dream, that enlightened westerners can merely share their prosperity with immigrants and they will turn out to be nice westerners. It makes sense, every terrorist attack becomes Europe's fault for not being tolerant and progressive enough.Is there some desire to claim back their heritage or something?Poor economic success and social exclusion, mostly. It's a recipe for disaster, and preventing it from happening should be a major priority for the rest of Europe. I don't expect that any preventative measures will be taken, anti-immigration parties being how they are, but one can always hope.
"Our ISIS fighters come from various backgrounds"Which is why my hopes for Westerners are very slim, because so many of them cling so tightly to oppression narratives that they literally cannot see what is right in front of them even as it kills them.
Yep, you got ones like Nasser Muthana who was a med student, Abu Hussain al Britani who was a hacker, Abu Taubah who was a London student and convert, Abu Bakr Al Khurassani who was a business student, Khalil al-Britani who was a failure who fucked up his GCSEs, Abu Usamah al-Eritri who was an estate agent with biomed degrees, Umm Layth who was privately educated in Scotland (most expensive education outside of London), Zubair Nur who was a petroleum geology student, Mohammed Ismail an English convert from coventry who went to Syria with two friends but came back alone e.t.c.
Estimates on the low end say 700 ISIS fighters, higher end 1,500 or more, check out them profiles if you're interested. (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32026985)
So yeah, looks like this could turn into the European 9/11.Useless platitudes with pointless hopes from someone whose nation will never take action.
Do you guys think France will now go to war in Syria? If they do, I hope Germany shows some solidarity and sends along the Bundeswehr. We've done jack shit for so long, and those killed and wounded in Paris were among those who paid the prize: It's time to own up to our mistakes.
I'd also like to remark that I'm disgusted by the xenophobes in this thread, but that goes without saying. If your reaction to some 150 people being killed is 'kick out dem goat-fuckers' you're not someone whose hand I'd shake. Show some Goaddamn respect - if not to the millions of Syrians, Iraqis etc whose lives have been destroyed, then at least for the victims of the Paris attacks.Show some respect? To the Syrians and Iraqis murdered by Islamists or the Parisians murdered by Islamists?
So yeah, looks like this could turn into the European 9/11.Useless platitudes with pointless hopes from someone whose nation will never take action.
Do you guys think France will now go to war in Syria? If they do, I hope Germany shows some solidarity and sends along the Bundeswehr. We've done jack shit for so long, and those killed and wounded in Paris were among those who paid the prize: It's time to own up to our mistakes.I'd also like to remark that I'm disgusted by the xenophobes in this thread, but that goes without saying. If your reaction to some 150 people being killed is 'kick out dem goat-fuckers' you're not someone whose hand I'd shake. Show some Goaddamn respect - if not to the millions of Syrians, Iraqis etc whose lives have been destroyed, then at least for the victims of the Paris attacks.Show some respect? To the Syrians and Iraqis murdered by Islamists or the Parisians murdered by Islamists?
You're respecting them by shaking hands with the men who murdered them and the sons who will murder them?
Who let them into Europe?
I think people need to amplify their chill right now. This is a rough day for a lot of people, no need to inflame the rhetoric further.I've been amplifying my chill plenty the past weeks and months - I've said hardly a word about the rampant nationalism, xenophobia, and outright racism that's become the standard here. I've avoided insulting people, I've avoided ranting. But seeing these folks piss on the victims' graves before they've even been dug is too much. It's the people who don't even pause for breath between taking note of the attacks and carrying on their same old tune who make me ashamed to be European right now.
Yeah, there's a reason I haven't really posted in here beyond a PTW.I think people need to amplify their chill right now. This is a rough day for a lot of people, no need to inflame the rhetoric further.I've been amplifying my chill plenty the past weeks and months - I've said hardly a word about the rampant nationalism, xenophobia, and outright racism that's become the standard here. I've avoided insulting people, I've avoided ranting. But seeing these folks piss on the victims' graves before they've even been dug is too much. It's the people who don't even pause for breath between taking note of the attacks and carrying on their same old tune who make me ashamed to be European right now.