Bay 12 Games Forum

Dwarf Fortress => DF Community Games & Stories => Topic started by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 06:31:11 am

Title: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 06:31:11 am
Now managed by Gwolfski (with thanks) (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=155674.msg6928286#msg6928286)

(http://orig10.deviantart.net/8215/f/2016/030/b/f/welcome_to_the_labyrinth_by_taowithit-d9pwtpe.png)

(http://img12.deviantart.net/1f6f/i/2016/030/e/4/the_city_of_light_y202_by_taowithit-d9pwln2.png)

This is a mad experiment for a version of "real time" multiplayer in Dwarf Fortress:  A multiple-tile embark is segregated into 1x1 embarks using a grid of roads.  Each 1x1 block of land will be called a "District" and left in pristine shape until claimed by a Player.  Players also must claim seven dwarves from among the local population pool as their "Founding seven" (each "Founding seven" will be put in a burrow so that they are held inside the boundaries of that Quarter.  Any children of those seven will be added to the burrow, allowing separated genealogies to develop as well.)   Once a District is claimed, then a copy of the save is downloaded and the Player plays out a year, excavating or building anything they like out of the resources that the District provides.  (Inter-quarter trading or resources will have to be role-played out, creating an ad-hoc market system between Players.)  Here's the beauty of the system: Once a year has been played, they upload the new save file using the chosen name of that district as the file name, then that becomes the blueprint for the version of the game running on my machine.  In this way, multiple Districts can be played out year after year, with the completed year save of the game on my machine updating every-one else when in-game Spring rolls around once again.

Migrants will become the inter-district workforce for hauling and building stuff with all other labors turned off (Unless they are chosen as a part of a new District's "Founding seven.")  Districts who also have the Mayor or another Noble as a Founding member of the District, have the power and authority to decide to leverage a tax on the other Districts.  Of course, every year after the first one, there will be an election for the position of Mayor in the forum polls, so everyone has the chance to have that position.

  Special Days   
Founder's Day:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Caravan Day:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  Latest Save   
27th Slate, Year 202 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11720) -"Phase 0" (Beginning of "Blueprint" stage, ends on Feb 3rd by noon, forum-time - extended to Feb 4th by midnight, forum time)
27th Slate, Year 202 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11702) -New Districts Founded-
City Population: 34
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  History 
Year 202
"The City of Light" founded by "The Great Road" of "The Merchants of Wood" (The last Dwarven civilization in the world)
Title: Interested in playing a district:
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 06:33:40 am
Players may begin claiming Districts (http://i.imgur.com/D2gl0lq.png) and posting their choices for starting dwarves on Saturday the 23rd at noon, forum time. 
Please post a "top ten" list of the dwarves you want by their names.  Dwarves that make it higher in Player's lists will be claimed by them, with ties going to whomever posts their list first.  Males, females, adults and children, all are allowed to be one of the seven that are District Founders.  Players will have until the 27th of January to post their list of possible Founders.  Those Districts that are able to fill the seven Founder's spots will then be able to play the year, while those still waiting for spots to be filled will be able to try again on the next Founder's Day (1st Day of spring).

Unless they're chosen to found another District, spouses and children will follow a chosen Founder as bonus members of a District, but given the choice between Founder parents, unclaimed children will follow their mothers.

Current Nobles
Expedition Leader: Miss Light Earthenfrost
Militia Commander: Mr Doren Netwebbed
Sherriff: Mr Zasit Knowingwind
Hammerer: Miss Eral Paddledhigh
Manager: Miss Light Dreamstorches
Chief Medical Dwarf: Mr Feb Wadepaint
Broker: Mrs Zasit Walledbowel
Book-keeper: Mrs Ast Dikecradle

Timeless Bob - Founder's District (P)
   District Founders:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Sanctume - "The Olive Grove" District  (F)
   District Founders:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Urdothor - Unnamed District R
   District Founders:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Gwolfski - Lakecastle District (G)
   District Founders:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Shofet - Lemducim District (L)
   District Founders:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Trade Deals
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 06:33:58 am
Legend:
Looking for...
Offer
Counter-offer
In Negotiation
Accepted

Year 202-203:

The Founder's District:
Use of 1 woodcutter to cut down the first tree in any Districts
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Lemducim District (L): The Willow on the west side between the pond and the road
Unnamed District R: I accept the offer given and would like the north-western most olive tree cut down
Unnamed District H: I accept the offer given and would like the Carambola Tree at the southern edge of my district, in the dead center with a piece of obsidian
Lakecastle District: I accept the offer given and any tree on my property will do.


1 anvil for sale to any District
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1 pick for sale to any District
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Unnamed District R:
Supplies needed!
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Prices Slashed
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Supplies needed!
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Cats needed!
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The Olive Grove District F:
Miners needed!
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Wooden Furniture for Sale
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Stone products needed: 2 mechanisms, stone blocks, querns, some raw stones, and excess logs felled in your property
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Stone products needed: 100 stone jugs
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Stone products needed: 100 stone pots
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

To Lelducim District: I offer a trade pact of stone supplies:
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1. Looking for obsidian stone boulders.
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

 2. Looking for wood logs to chop and haul.
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

 3. Looking for lake/pond as water source access.
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

 4. Looking kenaf plants, rice plants, rope reed, rat weed.  Looking for rights and access to gather plants from your district.
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Lemducim District:
Miners available for hire
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Mr. Feb Wadepaint for City Manager!
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Lakecastle District:

Offering to trade sheets and quires
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 20, 2016, 07:15:57 am
Im not too clear about the idea. Would two players be able to play thier districts the same year?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Bearskie on January 20, 2016, 08:06:15 am
that becomes the blueprint for the version of the game running on my machine.

This was the part that caught me. Err.. how?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 04:30:53 pm
OK, so here's an example:
There are 20 districts in this 4x5 embark.  All but one (P) are empty lots waiting to be claimed.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
(I'm going to call the claimed District P, "The City Founder's District".)

So, suppose we have three Players who have decided to claim empty lots: Say: District K, District L and District Q.
So I would save this game right after it announced it was Spring and upload the save file as a link on the first page under "Year <number> save". 
All the Players who had claimed a District would then immediately upload that file and post which seven previously unclaimed residents would be the "District Founders".  (Obviously, there might be some cross-over, so it would have to be that the person who posts their claim first gets that resident.)
NOW everyone plays their turn, only affecting the District that they claimed and saving the game once the one RL week is up, posting a link to that save in the forum. 

OK, so that's clear so far, but now, I'd upload all of the save files and on the original game save that I posted, I would make burrows in those three Districts, assigning the chosen seven for each one.  Then, using the other three save files as a "blueprint" for each District, I'd play through the turn on the original game, and post the resulting save file as "Year <number+1> save".  Everyone with a claimed District would then have a chance to play through another year on the new save, so that they can see what the other districts have done the year before. 

Players of adjacent Districts can choose to collaborate on a bridge maybe, or to join tunnels/sewers if they like, or they can just go it alone and see what happens.  Players could also barter and trade resources with each-other - wood for charcoal for metal smithing might be plentiful on an empty lot, who needs stone blocks or to be protected by the military of another District, so those Players could set up (and post) a inter-District trade agreement.  Players who miss the save posting deadline would just miss out on being a part of that year's update and their District (and the District's "founding seven") would become available to be claimed once again.  (Obviously, any trade agreements would fall through as well, which would make the Marketplace a bit of a risk, but would reward Players who were timely in posting their save files with greater trust from the other Districts.  All part of the game.  New Players would upload the latest save file, claim unclaimed Districts and if it's never been claimed before, go through the "claiming a founding seven" process too.

Access to the Trade Depot would be via a Broker that is protected from being chosen as one of the Founders.  Heck, we might make all the Noble positions like that - The Sheriff, Barons, ect... would all be free-range citizens, able to choose where they take their business, where they choose to sleep and where they choose to worship.  Their needs would be shared by every District in The City, and would make for some interesting RP in the Forum. Likewise, "strange moods" and the like.

Wash rinse, repeat.

The idea is that eventually, TWENTY Players will be able to upload a new save and affect the world every in-game year, rather than just one at a time (spaced about a year apart in RL).  Because of this, The City will dynamically grow and change.   There's also the "bloodlines" aspect to this:  If things go on long enough, the seven "Founders" of each District will marry and have kids. If those kids happen to marry into the families of other Districts, then Players could set up inheritances or dowries or whatever to simulate the changes in power for each District.  (All in fun.)

For fun, I'll be going into Legends mode and looking up the direct ancestors (mother, father, grandmother, grandfather, ect...) of each "District Founder" as well as what each family member was most famous for.  This is from a Medium sized world, 200 years old and with one surviving dwarven civilization.  The world map itself is one I set up in PerfectWorld, and is going to be used in an adventurer game I set up after The City has been going on for awhile.  (Quests for abducted children or stolen artifacts, maybe even a contest to see who can guide "The Tourist" as a companion unharmed from wherever he begins to The City.  I expect this world to be the host of many different games as each naturally runs its course, creating a rich and diverse Player-generated history.)

So far, the world is still in "The Age of Xun"
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 20, 2016, 05:13:54 pm
I'm interested.  I'll edit my thoughts in a bit.

I kinda tried something like this on my own, but this will make it definitely easier to micromanage with other player's input. 

Each embark tile is 48x48, so a 5 width x 4 height embark composes of 20 48x48 local map playable tiles. 

Referencing the image posted by TimelessBob, labelled with "districts":
ABCDE
FGHIJ
KLMNO
PQRST

Each district within its 48x48 tile boundary can have 11x11 "plots" in this formation: 
123
456
789

There is a 1-tile map edges that cannot be dig out. 
There is a 5 edge limit construction buildings from the edge. 

So it is possible to fit the following in a district this way:
1 tile map edge
3 tile map-edge road
2 tile dry moat / ditch
1 tile wall
11 tile Plot 1
1 tile wall
11 tile Plot 2
1 tile wall
11 tile Plot 3
1 tile wall
2 tile dry moat / ditch
3 tile inner road
= 48

However, this is not a perfect setup because depending on which edge you start the count from, the last district will have 1 less tiles. 
In order to keep the Plots sizes inside the District the same, the inner road on some will be 1 tile less.

--

So, trying to understand the rules.  It possible to go at it alone protecting that district.
3 plots of 11 wide + 4 walls => 33 + 4 = 37x37 wall perimeter.
There is enough room for a 2 wide moat. (37 + 2 on one side + 2 on the other side) = 41x41 area.
Add 3 wide roads on all side = 47x47
And finally add 1 wide map edge makes it within the 48x48 district boundary.

--

Now as far as resource what do the players divide / get?

1. Citizens and skills.
2. Natural Resource within boundary.
3. Migrants.

--

Trying to visualize how it goes, paraphrasing.

Year 0.  Timeless Bob kicks off District P with 7 founders, plus however many migrants come that first year.

And this example 3 players claim the adjacent districts: K, L and Q from this sub set formation:

KL
PQ


"Year 1 (main) save" becomes available.

A post detailing which migrants go to which district, and what resources are available in that district?

So we'll have for example we have 7 founders and 14 migrants:
Player K gets 1 founder, and 5 migrants: a b c d e
Player L gets 1 founder, and 5 migrants: f g h i j
and Player Q gets 1 founder, and 4 migrants: k l m n

Each player then plays their own copy of "Year 1 (main) save"

Player K
Player K load his copy of the game, and builds on that district using only the 1 founder, and 5 migrants: a b c d e.
And which ever resources he can get from that district.
Obviously, he needs a pick, at least 2 wood to make a training axe, and an anvil if it's available.

Now remember, Player K is only making a "blueprint" for this District.
1 game year done, Player K submits "Year 1 (Player K) save"

The same thing is done by Player L, and Player Q.

Any new migrants coming in is a bonus.
However, keep in mind that this blue print will be used by Timeless Bob to continue play on the Year 1 (main) save"
and using Year 1 (Player K) save" as blue print to build for that district;
and simultaneously following Player L and Player Q blue prints.

Once Timeless Bob is done, he uploads "Year 2 (main) save" which opens up more adjacent Districts for other players.

--

I am just not clear on how to share resources.

And I'm definite interested how citizen burrow actually works.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Klitri on January 20, 2016, 05:26:07 pm
Genius! PTW
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 06:51:57 pm
I'll answer you using italics:

I kinda tried something like this on my own, but this will make it definitely easier to micromanage with other player's input. 

Each embark tile is 48x48, so a 5 width x 4 height embark composes of 20 48x48 local map playable tiles. 

Referencing the image posted by TimelessBob, labelled with "districts":
ABCDE
FGHIJ
KLMNO
PQRST

Each district within its 48x48 tile boundary can have 11x11 "plots" in this formation: 
123
456
789

I suppose you could subdivide each district like that if you'd like to.  The Boundary Road (the border of the 4x5 embark) is 5-wide, but the ones inside the embark are only 3-wide, which makes each District 42x42 squares.  There is some variation on that: the bottom row of PQRST is 47 squares tall, and the column of AFKP is 47 squares wide (Yes, that means the Founder's District is 47x47, but they got there first and fudged things in their favor.)
There is a 1-tile map edges that cannot be dig out.  Already taken care of with the Boundary Road, this is not an issue for Districts
There is a 5 edge limit construction buildings from the edge.  Boundary Road takes care of this too.

So it is possible to fit the following in a district this way:
1 tile map edge
3 tile map-edge road
2 tile dry moat / ditch
1 tile wall
11 tile Plot 1
1 tile wall
11 tile Plot 2
1 tile wall
11 tile Plot 3
1 tile wall
2 tile dry moat / ditch
3 tile inner road
= 48

However, this is not a perfect setup because depending on which edge you start the count from, the last district will have 1 less tiles. 
In order to keep the Plots sizes inside the District the same, the inner road on some will be 1 tile less.
That's true if you are thinking about setting up roads between all plots as well, but that would be up to the District to choose to do so or not.

--

So, trying to understand the rules.  It possible to go at it alone protecting that district.
3 plots of 11 wide + 4 walls => 33 + 4 = 37x37 wall perimeter.
There is enough room for a 2 wide moat. (37 + 2 on one side + 2 on the other side) = 41x41 area.
Add 3 wide roads on all side = 47x47
And finally add 1 wide map edge makes it within the 48x48 district boundary. 42 x 42-ish district boundary.

--

Now as far as resource what do the players divide / get?

1. Citizens and skills. All the unclaimed Citizens will have their labors other than fetching/carrying and building turned off.  Only the special skills of the Claimed Citizens (the Founders of each District, their wives and children) will be available for each District.  However, these Founders will be put in a 42x42-ish burrow that covers their District so they stay inside those boundaries.  The only way this would change is if Players had already made a trade agreement for the specific skills of one of these dwarves, and the payment would then also be taken care of.
2. Natural Resource within boundary.
3. Migrants. These are the "Free range" citizens, who are available to build and transport stuff in every District as part of the base labor force.  Nobles would also be included in the "Free Range" section, but they may have their skills turned on to benefit any District, since they belong to the City as "public servants".

--

Trying to visualize how it goes, paraphrasing.

Year 0.  Timeless Bob kicks off District P with 7 founders, plus however many migrants come that first year.

And this example 3 players claim the adjacent districts: K, L and Q from this sub set formation:

KL
PQ


"Year 1 (main) save" becomes available.

A post detailing which migrants go to which district, and what resources are available in that district?

So we'll have for example we have 7 founders and 14 migrants:
Player K gets 1 founder, and 5 migrants: a b c d e
Player L gets 1 founder, and 5 migrants: f g h i j
and Player Q gets 1 founder, and 4 migrants: k l m n
No. 
7 founders, and at least 21 migrants (total population: 28)
Player K gets 7 of those 21 as "Founders of District K"
Player L gets 7 of those 21 as "Founders of District L"
Player Q gets 7 of those 21 as "Founders of District Q".

Since all of the population has been taken, there will be no "free range" citizens in the Main game that year.  However, there are more than 30 in the save file I used to make the embark right now, so that shouldn't be an issue.


Each player then plays their own copy of "Year 1 (main) save"

Player K
Player K load his copy of the game, and builds on that district using only the 1 founder, and 5 migrants: a b c d e.
And which ever resources he can get from that district. No, Player K uses the 7 Founders and whichever resources he can get from that District, plus whichever other resources and skills he's bartered for from other Players who are controlling other Districts.
Obviously, he needs a pick, at least 2 wood to make a training axe, and an anvil if it's available. Or if it's not available, he can trade with the district that does own these items for their use.  What he can trade is food production, wood, pasture for animals, ect... Whatever both Players agree is fair. For instance, Player K can trade a batch of 50 logs for the use of one of the woodcutters from District P to clear out certain trees, or can trade a future barrel of booze for a training axe that is already made in District P...

Now remember, Player K is only making a "blueprint" for this District.
1 game year done, Player K submits "Year 1 (Player K) save"

The same thing is done by Player L, and Player Q.

Any new migrants coming in is a bonus. They also will have all skills but carry/fetch and build turned off.
However, keep in mind that this blue print will be used by Timeless Bob to continue play on the Year 1 (main) save"
and using Year 1 (Player K) save" as blue print to build for that district;
and simultaneously following Player L and Player Q blue prints.

Once Timeless Bob is done, he uploads "Year 2 (main) save" which opens up more adjacent Districts for other players.
Any of the unclaimed Districts are up for grabs, I just used those three as an example, I could just as easily have used A, D and Q.  The roads are there to make each District able to be gotten to without fighting through underbrush or buildings.  A wall around a District would just keep everyone out who aren't scaling those walls or eventually tunneling in by agreement or via the Caverns.

--

I am just not clear on how to share resources.

And I'm definite interested how citizen burrow actually works.
The burrows would be for the Founding 7 (plus wives and children) of each District only.  They will extend all the way up and all the way down.  Everyone else will either be in their own District (in the case of Founders) or able to go wherever they wish.  I'll be naming each Burrow after the District name chosen by the Player. ("The Founder's District" is the name of the burrow that covers the area inside District P).  Resources in the District will be put in stockpiles that "give only to workshop" and "take only from workshop" to keep those resources from being carried off to another District.  When the Caravan comes along, each Player will be able to specify which goods they want taken to the Depot, and what they wish to trade for them.  I'll be handling each District's contributions a sale at a time in a first-posted, first traded manner.  Whatever they get will go back to the proper District before doing another sale.  In this way, not only Inter-district trade, but also trade with the rest of dwarvendom will be possible.

Think of each District as basically the same as a 1x1 embark with 7 dwarves starting out. The only difference is that immigrants can also become emigrants as they go where the work is and all the really interesting stuff gets to be done by the Founders and their families.

One other thing: While marriages and children can increase the number of people who are in a District's burrow, deaths can decrease that number too. Any District that has had all of their Founders family die out will become available once again.  Just the same as in Fort mode when the last citizen dies for whatever reason.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 07:28:13 pm
incidentally, since there will always be a finite number of "free range" citizens to do the grunt work, having them available to do that work might ITSELF be a resource that can be bartered and traded.  For instance, if I wanted to build this big temple to some god this year, I might pay the other Players resources I have stockpiled to not build things this turn, so that the workers will spend more time on my project.  Districts with Founding Family members who are unhappy might jump at the chance for them to "take a vacation" one year and get in some much needed socializing and general R&R.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2016, 09:02:09 pm
I'm interested in this. It sounds really fun.  :)

So, we could have districts specialize and create trade agreements then? Like, Maybe one group produces ample amounts of booze and one has excellent craftsdwarves, and they trade.

The issue here is that since we only have 1 district currently, where do we get pickaxes at the moment? Just trading with the Founders District, or?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Dunamisdeos on January 20, 2016, 09:11:14 pm
I do not have time to actually assist in this grand endeavor.

I would love to be dorfed in the centermost tile!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 09:25:20 pm
I'm interested in this. It sounds really fun.  :)

So, we could have districts specialize and create trade agreements then? Like, Maybe one group produces ample amounts of booze and one has excellent craftsdwarves, and they trade.

The issue here is that since we only have 1 district currently, where do we get pickaxes at the moment? Just trading with the Founders District, or?

Yes, you'll have to trade with the Founder's District for your initial things, but I have it on good authority that they will loan new Districts what they have already for the first year in exchange for the use of the Founding seven dwarves' skills at some later date.  A favor for a favor, you might say...
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 09:27:43 pm
I do not have time to actually assist in this grand endeavor.

I would love to be dorfed in the centermost tile!

So if someone sets up a District in the "H" or "M" spaces, you want a dwarf named after you?  I don't have a problem with that, but it will be up to whoever sets up those districts to allow it.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: chaotic skies on January 20, 2016, 09:29:37 pm
Actually, I was thinking about taking District H. For several reasons. Military may have something to do with it. Maybe.

Also, how do we decide upon releasing HFS upon the world?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2016, 09:33:43 pm
I'll go with R. I'll need to borrow supplies, but I think I'm going to build a farm district.

How do we do trading through the trade depot? Make requests?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 09:38:27 pm
Actually, I was thinking about taking District H. For several reasons. Military may have something to do with it. Maybe.

Also, how do we decide upon releasing HFS upon the world?

Ok, I'll set you up for District H.

If you decide to release the HFS in your district, you may experience sanctions from the other Districts.  Also, you may want to think about the fact that replacements to your District will come from whomever is still surviving from your Founding seven + family.  Releasing the HFS too soon could just make the entire embark a haunted and cursed city.  I can certainly see "Post-Apocalypse District Management" be a part of the game.  However, I hope the City has a chance of becoming a thriving metropolis before it's inevitable doom.  It could become the New Atlantis falling below the HFS rather than the waves...

and Urdothor gets District R. 
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2016, 09:49:06 pm
How do we do trading through the trade depot? Make requests and make offers? Or maybe when someone comes to trade at the trading depot, you post images of whats available and we make requests for goods?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 10:37:31 pm
When the Merchants arrive, I'll be pausing the game and sending out an updated save file so that everyone can see what they have to offer.  Districts can then post what they wish to trade and with which trade goods. I'll probably put the game on hold for a day or two while we wait for everyone's response, then continue on until Spring hits before sending out the new update.  I'll be doing the same for any caravans from other civs as well.  I can do the same when a were-creature or military force shows up too, so everyone can tell me how they want to respond.

I've updated the OP with the save file for the embark.  You'll notice that this is the basic save from before the Founder's District really gets started.  I'll be updating it with the seven dwarves each District is choosing.  I left the Nobles unfilled and retired the embark, so that when I un-retired it, all the Noble slots were chosen at random by the RNG.  All the dwarves have been grouped into families, each taking their name from the husband's paternal grandfather.  Single dwarfettes and dwarves are also named by their paternal grandfather.  I've added "Miss" to the single females and "Mr" to all the males, leaving out the "Mr" from male children, so Players will be able to see who is related to whom at a glance.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Cthulhu_Pakabol on January 20, 2016, 10:41:46 pm
Though I'm still a little unclear on exactly how it'll work, I'd like to throw in my lot. I'm not very good at fort mode, but hey, maybe it'll cause [fun]!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2016, 11:03:57 pm
I've updated the OP with the save file for the embark.  You'll notice that this is the basic save from before the Founder's District really gets started.  I'll be updating it with the seven dwarves each District is choosing.  I left the Nobles unfilled and retired the embark, so that when I un-retired it, all the Noble slots were chosen at random by the RNG.  All the dwarves have been grouped into families, each taking their name from the husband's paternal grandfather.  Single dwarfettes and dwarves are also named by their paternal grandfather.  I've added "Miss" to the single females and "Mr" to all the males, leaving out the "Mr" from male children, so Players will be able to see who is related to whom at a glance.

Is this so we can choose dwarves, and go ahead and start?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 11:04:43 pm
Also, you may note that there is a legendary bowyer named Mr Braidedtorments in the "free range" citizens: he made an artifact bow called "The Braided Torments", and as a reward for making an artifact, he gets to take the artifact's name as his own as well as keep the skill he gained from it.  Artifact makers will always be able to keep the skill they get from creating an artifact successfully.

Also, there happens to be this ghost hanging around - the unhappy spirit of one of the Founders.  He was attacked and slain by a were-civit who was then slain in turn.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 11:06:06 pm
Is this so we can choose dwarves, and go ahead and start?

Well, choose dwarves and set up trades with the others.  I'm using the Pheobus graphics pack bundled with the Lazy Newb Pack.

I haven't set a deadline yet, though, so go ahead and noodle around in the save if you like.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2016, 11:24:56 pm
I'll pick some dwarves, but I won't claim them yet so others have an equal chance too. I'll look at my chosen plot a bit though.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 20, 2016, 11:32:20 pm
Ok.  How about this:  Players have a chance to claim Districts and post their choices for starting dwarves on Saturday the 23rd at noon, forum time.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 20, 2016, 11:39:20 pm
That sounds fair. I agree with that.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 21, 2016, 05:57:00 am
Can we claim fewer founding dwarves, and get to seven later, picking from migrant waves?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 21, 2016, 06:04:49 am
Can we claim fewer founding dwarves, and get to seven later, picking from migrant waves?
Good question.  I'd say, no.  If you want to wait a year before claiming a District to see if there are better choices from the migrants that came in during that time, that would be acceptable, though.  The best part of this scheme is that even if there are nineteen different people set up to play a District, that means that there's an empty district waiting to be claimed next turn.  For a DF game, that's some huge availability!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 21, 2016, 06:31:47 am
I'd like to claim L for the record. This is going to be fun.  :)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 21, 2016, 10:24:50 am
My thoughts would be more a more conservative self-sufficient hermit-style approach. 

First
Definitely need at least 2 wood logs -> carpenter workshop, and training axe.
So 1 of 7 would be Carpenter + Wood Cutter. 
It will probably take 1 season to cut all the trees within a district.
With special attention to Olive trees.

Second
Depends on how one would acquire 1 pick, because we need to dig deep to uncover the district's hidden resources.
So 2 of 7 will be a Miner.

Third
The land looks green, so it is most advantageous to skill up Plant Gathering.  Hopefully there will be at least Olive trees, and the ability to gather cloth type seeds such a rope reed, helm, flax, or cotton.
So 3 of 7 will be a Herbalist + Brewer; and eventual Grower and Cook.

These first 3 shold cover the basic needs of
Shelter (wood walls, beds, furniture, cups)
Militia Defense (miner's pick)
Food and Clothing (Herbalist and Grower and Kitchen)

Position 4, 5, 6, and 7 will focus on long term renewable resource such as:
Stone - obsidian casting
Glass or clay, after at least 1 magma-safe minecarts is traded for.
Animal: Fishing pond, or egg layer nest box.
Silk - if a web spewer is caught or traded for.

Yeah, notice there is no anvil?  I'm thinking of adding this for my own challenge, if a district can be self-sufficient without anvils.



Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Klitri on January 21, 2016, 08:06:50 pm
I suppose you want above ground buildings? It'd be quite incredible to see roads, skybridges, and eventually minecart skybridges delivering things across the city through the sky!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 21, 2016, 09:44:01 pm
I suppose you want above ground buildings? It'd be quite incredible to see roads, skybridges, and eventually minecart skybridges delivering things across the city through the sky!
Above-ground buildings would be a fun challenge, but the more usual dwarven delvings also would work.  I'll be building/digging the Founder's District on human scale except for the doorways, which means that when digging, I'll be either using the ramp or channel to dig 2 z-levels up or down, and all stairs will be in sets of two z-levels, vaulted ceilings and peaked roofs on little cottages as well.  When I render it in Armok Vision, it just looks more impressive like that.

I'd love to see the city grow up as well as down - that's part of the reason I embarked on a mostly flat terrain with a little mountain in one corner - so the sky would be tall enough for some impressive above-ground structures if that's what was wanted by a Player.  If both adjacent Districts agree to a joint project, i don't see why they couldn't build something over/under the road that divides the districts.  This could be lots of fun.  As the updates roll out, I'll be updating the version of DF I'm using for each year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 12:41:26 am
I suppose you want above ground buildings? It'd be quite incredible to see roads, skybridges, and eventually minecart skybridges delivering things across the city through the sky!
Above-ground buildings would be a fun challenge, but the more usual dwarven delvings also would work.  I'll be building/digging the Founder's District on human scale except for the doorways, which means that when digging, I'll be either using the ramp or channel to dig 2 z-levels up or down, and all stairs will be in sets of two z-levels, vaulted ceilings and peaked roofs on little cottages as well.  When I render it in Armok Vision, it just looks more impressive like that.

I'd love to see the city grow up as well as down - that part of the reason I embarked on a mostly flat terrain with a little mountain in one corner - so the sky would be tall enough for some impressive above-ground structures if that's what was wanted by a Player.  If both adjacent Districts agree to a joint project, i don't see why they couldn't build something over/under the road that divides the districts.  This could be lots of fun.  As the updates roll out, I'll be updating the version of DF I'm using for each year.

That sounds like it would be really cool. An actual dwarven city, extending up and down.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Gwolfski on January 22, 2016, 12:59:04 pm
could i get 'G'? I'll be able to play next week, so probably in the second year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 22, 2016, 01:29:02 pm
My preference is either District F or K.
How do I obtain:
2 logs
1 pick
and 1 anvil?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Dunamisdeos on January 22, 2016, 01:40:15 pm
Actually, I was thinking about taking District H. For several reasons. Military may have something to do with it. Maybe.

Also, how do we decide upon releasing HFS upon the world?

Ok, I'll set you up for District H.

If you decide to release the HFS in your district, you may experience sanctions from the other Districts.  Also, you may want to think about the fact that replacements to your District will come from whomever is still surviving from your Founding seven + family.  Releasing the HFS too soon could just make the entire embark a haunted and cursed city.  I can certainly see "Post-Apocalypse District Management" be a part of the game.  However, I hope the City has a chance of becoming a thriving metropolis before it's inevitable doom.  It could become the New Atlantis falling below the HFS rather than the waves...

and Urdothor gets District R.

How's about a dorf in district R? This is quite the grand undertaking. Lots of people have talked about doing it, but I don't remember seeing anyone making this kind of organized go at it.

I'm most interested to witness it!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 02:01:03 pm
How's about a dorf in district R? This is quite the grand undertaking. Lots of people have talked about doing it, but I don't remember seeing anyone making this kind of organized go at it.

I'm most interested to witness it!

Alright, I'll dorf you once we start. Name/occupation preference? I'm going for a farming industry specialization.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 22, 2016, 02:24:29 pm
I'm angling towards a traditional stone industry, and operating a gang of miners. They would be available for hire. As soon as I get more picks that is.

I'm not sure how many picks there are, but I won't need much excavated for year one, so I'd be happy to help out a neighbor if I could.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 22, 2016, 02:33:09 pm
Trying to get us district mayors to do some pre-planning.

Districts:
A B C D E
F G H I J
K L M N O
P Q R S T

G - Gwolfski
H - Chaotic Skies (military)
F or K - Sanctume (self-sufficient bunker)
L - Shofet (mining, stone quarry)
P - Timeless Bob (Main, Nobles)
R - Urdothor (farming)

--

Not knowing what initial resource other then 7 dwarves, and not know how what the logistics about food and drink, we can pretend the basic needs to food/drink is done.

Does that mean we need a way to make beds independent or get those from District P?

But since we're only doing a "blue print" the turn will focus more on building, digging, and figuring out layouts. 

Eventually, we will want safety / defense.  So I'm more keen on building z+0 wall, with z+1 fortification, with z+2 lip roof. And a redundant 2z 2-wide dry moat, and a bridge out to the road for inter-city trades.  Or we can volunteer / draft citizens to the military.

So depending on the building materials and tools available, the first year may require us all to worry about the initial food/drink and shelter building self-sufficient.

Or would it be more of a district just gathering raw resource and trade with District P's excess food and furnitures?  And eventually, focus on workshop for end-product trades?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Dunamisdeos on January 22, 2016, 02:44:20 pm
How's about a dorf in district R? This is quite the grand undertaking. Lots of people have talked about doing it, but I don't remember seeing anyone making this kind of organized go at it.

I'm most interested to witness it!

Alright, I'll dorf you once we start. Name/occupation preference? I'm going for a farming industry specialization.

Ahhh no wait I got confused I want to be a military dorf! This is important! I should be in district H. I'm sorry, I'm confused today. Please name him Mr. Beard. He should be an Axedwarf.

My wife, however, DOES request a dorf in district R. She says she should be named Eva, and should be a woodcutter or carpenter. Sorry again.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 02:47:38 pm
I'm not really sure. I think the Founder's District is lending out tools in return for favors? I don't know about food or drink, but I should have a farm and maybe brewing station set up by the end of the first year, if everything goes well. That should solve any needs for food relatively quickly.

How's about a dorf in district R? This is quite the grand undertaking. Lots of people have talked about doing it, but I don't remember seeing anyone making this kind of organized go at it.

I'm most interested to witness it!

Alright, I'll dorf you once we start. Name/occupation preference? I'm going for a farming industry specialization.

Ahhh no wait I got confused I want to be a military dorf! This is important! I should be in district H. I'm sorry, I'm confused today. Please name him Mr. Beard. He should be an Axedwarf.

My wife, however, DOES request a dorf in district R. She says she should be named Eva, and should be a woodcutter or carpenter. Sorry again.

Don't mention it. Eva. Alright, I shall remember that once we start.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 22, 2016, 03:22:45 pm
If anyone would like to request stone block production, or any stone works, please do so. I will be erecting a simple wall at first around my district for the first year, so I should have some excess.

I know were supposed to wait to claim, but I would really like the Feb couple. I'd gladly settle for whats left otherwise.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 05:20:21 pm
My preference is either District F or K.
How do I obtain:
2 logs
1 pick
and 1 anvil?

One of the nobles is, I think, a woodcutter, so your logs are taken care of.  However, The Founders can lend you one of their own to cut down a tree if that is not so, as a gesture of welcome to to the new District.

The Founders will sell you the anvil in exchange for three out of every five of whatever is shaped on it, and the option to buy it back first before it's sold to anyone else (like the caravan).  Furthermore, this deal remains with the anvil, so that if it's re-sold to another District, then that new District also must pay the Founders one in every five items shaped on it.

One of the nobles (the broker I think, or perhaps the manager), is a miner with a pick, so you can use their services in your district for "free".  The Founders also have another pick in their stockpiles, so if your offer is a good enough one, they may choose to sell or rent it to you.  Be aware, though, that this might begin a bidding war with the other Districts who might also want to own or rent the pick.

This is our initial offer.
Let the negotiations begin!

Both Districts F and K are still available, which one do you choose?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 05:41:46 pm
That's a thought... To make inter-district trading easier, we could just smelt a bunch of coins out of different metals and use those.  Relative rarity would make the conversion rate a cinch: If there were 3x as many aluminum coins and there are copper ones, then 3 Aluminum coins=1 Copper.  Likewise for other metals.  Anyway, then Districts could trade stuff by putting a price on them in various coins and people could trade goods with other Districts to get the coins to pay for stuff with other Districts... Each District could have a "treasury" where coins would be stored and we'd have a real economy.  Each year, I could update the "Treasury" of each District based on new or continuing Inter-District trade agreements.  Of course, various Districts could try to devalue a coin by making more of them, or increase the value of a coin by putting them in the treasury and refusing to use them...  Oh, it should be great fun.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 05:44:21 pm
That's a thought... To make inter-district trading easier, we could just smelt a bunch of coins out of different metals and use those.  Relative rarity would make the conversion rate a cinch: If there were 3x as many aluminum coins and there are copper ones, then 3 Aluminum coins=1 Copper.  Likewise for other metals.  Anyway, then Districts could trade stuff by putting a price on them in various coins and people could trade goods with other Districts to get the coins to pay for stuff with other Districts... Each District could have a "treasury" where coins would be stored and we'd have a real economy.  Each year, I could update the "Treasury" of each District based on new or continuing Inter-District trade agreements.  Of course, various Districts could try to devalue a coin by making more of them, or increase the value of a coin by putting them in the treasury and refusing to use them...  Oh, it should be great fun.

That does sound like a lot of fun. Bartering could still happen as well, as sometimes bartering is more worthwhile and valuable than coins.

I have a question regarding the stocks we currently have. What kinds of seeds did we embark with?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 05:54:24 pm
Actually, if you load up the save file and go to the stocks screen, you should be able to find out what's available directly.  I used the "Play Now" option.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 05:57:11 pm
could i get 'G'? I'll be able to play next week, so probably in the second year.

Tell you what:  if "G" is still available when year 203 begins, claim it then.  All part of the game.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 22, 2016, 06:01:29 pm
I shall choose District F, if you please.

I think I can wait out for an the anvil from the caravans.

A pick is definitely more important initially since the logs are free.

How much for would anvils cost? and picks?

It behooves the new mayors of the districts to coordinate to at least aim to obtain 1 pick and 1 anvil each.
If District P wants 3 out of 5 picks created in a rented anvil, that yields 2 usable.

We're looking to make at least 15 picks to avail 6 picks and provide at least 1 pick to each of the current roster of 5 new mayors:
1. Gwolfski
2. Chaotic Skies (military)
3. Sanctume (self-sufficient bunker)
4. Shofet (mining, stone quarry)
5. Urdothor (farming)

This assumes the miners find copper.
Obtaining anvil would be more difficult.  But I only want an anvil to make more pick.

--
So are there the current issues?
1. There exist 1 anvil for rent at the price of 3 out 5 items "fee".
2. The price of the anvil is unknown.  Although iron anvil normally goes for 100 urist, and steel costs 300 urist for most dwarven civs.
3. There are 2 picks available:
3a. A noble with a pick is a miner, so that's a shared free resource.
3b. A founder has a pick in a stockpile, open for bidding offers.

With my gathered information,
Shofet is the likely candidate to utilize the open bidding pick since Mr Shofet plans to pursue stone quarries.
I would hope that Mr Shofet can discover sooner what mineral riches can be found in the region.
One knowledge that I would like to know is if we have iron deposits in order to make more anvils.

--

I like the coin idea.  Just stick with 500 coin stacks because it's a hassle to split the coins--I mean it needs to wait for caravan to trade split and buy back.

I suggest using non-weapon grade alloys for coins, so there are a bit more use for lead, pewter.  Maybe make those common coins of equal value = 1.
Then double price for silver of gold blend alloys: gold rose, electrum, etc = 2. 

Aluminum is the most valuable "lightest" metal, and Platinum is the valuable "densest" metal (value 40 in the raws).
Silver, iron = 10
Steel = 20
Gold = 30 (edit, oops, it's 30 not 40.
The rest ranges from from 2 to 7.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 06:17:51 pm
Actually, if you load up the save file and go to the stocks screen, you should be able to find out what's available directly.  I used the "Play Now" option.

It tells me the number of seeds, 200? But not the type of seed, which is what I'm curious about.

Oh wait, cooking menu. Never mind then.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 06:26:38 pm
You could also do a quick scan of the food stockpile.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 06:30:40 pm
You could also do a quick scan of the food stockpile.

I completely didn't think of that, to be honest.

So, if I understand correctly, there is a noble with an axe and we are bargaining for picks?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 06:31:49 pm
As to the Anvil deal, I'm open to other offers.  3:5 is my high bid, negotiation means that you offer another bid if that price is too high, and we go back and forth until we meet up somewhere in the middle of those bids.  It's also called Haggling (http://wikitravel.org/en/How_to_haggle).  A thriving economy requires such skills.  This is especially true when resources and labor are in limited supply.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 06:48:27 pm
As to the Anvil deal, I'm open to other offers.  3:5 is my high bid, negotiation means that you offer another bid if that price is too high, and we go back and forth until we meet up somewhere in the middle of those bids.  It's also called Haggling (http://wikitravel.org/en/How_to_haggle).  A thriving economy requires such skills.  This is especially true when resources and labor are in limited supply.

I don't believe I'll require an anvil any time soon, I think I'll just trade for any goods I need made using one. But I do, at least for the moment, need to borrow a pickaxe and an axe. In return I'll fill a future favor of some kind.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: chaotic skies on January 22, 2016, 07:01:05 pm
I'll use the miner noble for now, until I find some useful ores, or until I have enough supplies to make a one-time trade for weapons and armor.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 07:03:30 pm
I set up a "Trade Deals" post in one of the "reserved" posts on the first page.  If everyone could use the color coding in the legends for their posts about trades, (like quoting a trade post then making a counter-offer in orange), I'll update it every year with the new stuff, or changes to old deals.  Think of this as an optional mini-game.  You can make and respond to deals if you want to affect the economy, or you can "hermit up" and just go it alone.  Both are just fine.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 07:07:56 pm
I set up a "Trade Deals" post in one of the "reserved" posts on the first page.  If everyone could use the color coding in the legends for their posts about trades, (like quoting a trade post then making a counter-offer in orange), I'll update it every year with the new stuff, or changes to old deals.  Think of this as an optional mini-game.  You can make and respond to deals if you want to affect the economy, or you can "hermit up" and just go it alone.  Both are just fine.

Maybe you should do a requests color as well, like a "Looking for:_______"
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 07:31:33 pm
I set up a "Trade Deals" post in one of the "reserved" posts on the first page.  If everyone could use the color coding in the legends for their posts about trades, (like quoting a trade post then making a counter-offer in orange), I'll update it every year with the new stuff, or changes to old deals.  Think of this as an optional mini-game.  You can make and respond to deals if you want to affect the economy, or you can "hermit up" and just go it alone.  Both are just fine.

Maybe you should do a requests color as well, like a "Looking for:_______"

Good idea: Lets use teal
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 22, 2016, 08:08:20 pm
So how does this work. Mrs Feb is the noble miner. She can't be chosen as a founder, but her husband can?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 08:47:32 pm
So how does this work. Mrs Feb is the noble miner. She can't be chosen as a founder, but her husband can?

Yes. If Mrs Feb ever loses the position to another dwarf later on, then she'd go be with her husband as a member of that District.  Any of Mr.& Mrs. Feb's kids would be considered a member of the District as well.  We don't have the rules for political appointments set up yet except as it comes to who can be a part of a District or not, so that's something we'll want to discuss in the future.  We'll make it part of the City Bylaws how long each elected noble can hold their position.  Titles of Nobility like Barons, Counts and Kings would, of course, be inheritable, but the rules for that inheritance are also not yet made.  Something else to decide as a group of Players, I think.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 22, 2016, 09:22:08 pm
I just as soon see her loose her position. Now.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 22, 2016, 09:28:35 pm
Ok, I loaded the save.

Which dorfs are available for the picking?

I kinda like the Ast family
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 22, 2016, 09:40:58 pm
I just as soon see her loose her position. Now.

Hmm.  Just checked, and it's Mr Feb who is the Chief Medical Dwarf.  I'm supposing that's who you were talking about?

OK, who would you see being his replacement as Chief Medical Dwarf?  She's not got any skill in Diagnosing anyway, so the city wouldn't lose a valuable doctor.
Once everyone puts their own candidates forward, I'll stick a poll up and we can vote to see who gets put into the office.  Any Dwarf can be a candidate for public service, including ones that normally are part of a District's founding family.  Those big bedrooms and private offices are something to aspire to.  (Well, there's also the "noble requirements" that everyone has to fulfill but that the noble's family District gets to keep as well...)
Edit: 26Jan16
Whomever controls the Mayor's position gets to appoint some of the other noble positions, like CMO, broker and book-keeper. Once the position is available, there will be an annual election for Mayor every in-game year.

Ok, I loaded the save.

Which dorfs are available for the picking?

I kinda like the Ast family

Every dwarf except the "Light" dwarves and anyone in a noble position (but just like Mrs Feb, those nobles can be voted out of office during the upcoming year.)  Looks like the position of Chief Medical Dwarf might become available very soon.

Actually, we have 5 people who want a District right now, and a current population of 33.  7 x 5 = 35, so maybe we make it that the nobles can be chosen as founders, but have the run of the city because they're public servants to the city?  That seems more logical.  We're still 2-short, in a first-posted, first claimed manner, one District will have to wait to be started until the next wave of migrants. (edit: nobles can be Founders, but can move around the city at will)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 22, 2016, 10:48:03 pm

Actually, we have 5 people who want a District right now, and a current population of 33.  7 x 5 = 35, so maybe we make it that the nobles can be chosen as founders, but have the run of the city because they're public servants to the city?  That seems more logical.  We're still 2-short, in a first-posted, first claimed manner, one District will have to wait to be started until the next wave of migrants.

Two things, One is that population including children, if not then someone could opt to take the children as a future gap filler.

Two, if not, can someone opt to take 5 dwarfs instead of 7?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Gwolfski on January 23, 2016, 07:27:52 am
suggestion: use http://dffd.bay12games.com/ for saves
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 23, 2016, 03:32:46 pm
Isn't it dwarf claiming day today?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: chaotic skies on January 23, 2016, 11:13:56 pm
Yeah, it is. Basically: *Bump*
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 23, 2016, 11:30:16 pm
Well I claim the Febs. I will fill my roster after everyone one else is done. I also would consider taking fewer than 7 if I can have another married couple.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 24, 2016, 04:16:14 pm
Maybe weather knocked out internet/power, or Timeless Bob got busy with life? Should we go ahead and claim while he's gone?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: chaotic skies on January 24, 2016, 04:52:35 pm
Yes, and while we're at it we should probably release HFS and put all the alcohol outside for the goblins, just because he left us alone.  ;D
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 24, 2016, 04:57:13 pm
Yes, and while we're at it we should probably release HFS and put all the alcohol outside for the goblins, just because he left us alone.  ;D

I was thinking we put the goblins inside with the alcohol.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: chaotic skies on January 24, 2016, 05:08:30 pm
Then we can't come back in, unless we kill the goblins. I like this idea!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 24, 2016, 07:17:29 pm
Lol. Just pick some dwarves guys. I think some folks might be holding off till there are more dwarves. So the sooner we start, the sooner we fill this city up. And commence the gobbo killin.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 24, 2016, 08:05:59 pm
I'm sorry guys, sudden house-guest alert took my weekend for a spin.  Looks like "The Febs" and "The Asts" have been taken, but nobody else?  Just list the top ten dwarfs you would like as Founders in the order of preference (most preferred first, ect...).  Whoever posts a dwarf first in their list, gets them.  Ties will go to whomever posted their list first in the forum.  The last five dwarves will have to be "Free range" until next week.  (I suppose the last person to post a list will get their top five unclaimed dwarves, with an option for the next two to come in a migrant wave, unless they want to wait a week to claim a District and take their choice of all the other migrants.)

Oh, I understand - yeah, I suppose children would be able to be Founders as well.  They're part of that 33 citizens.

As to the nobles, I'll be removing the ban on making them District Founders, I realize that was bad logic.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 24, 2016, 08:20:53 pm
suggestion: use http://dffd.bay12games.com/ for saves

Will do.  Forgot about this site for some strange reason...
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 24, 2016, 09:59:03 pm
Okay, so, top 10 8 and I'll take something else if someone really wants one of my choices:
1. Miss Sarvesh - Farmer
2. Mr Braidedtreason - Herbalist
3. Mrs Braidedtreason - Woodcutter
4. Mr Mestthos - Herbalist
5. Mr Lorbham - Herbalist
6. Mrs Lorbham - Herbalist
7, Miss Lorbham - Worthless Meat Sack Dwarven Baby
8. Mr Doren - Herbalist

Looking For...
2 Fisher Berries
5 Plump Helmet Spawn
10 Rat Weed Seeds
1 of Each of the following
Cave wheat seeds
Dimple Cup spawn
Pig tail seeds
Rock Nut
Rope Reed seeds
Sweet Pod seeds

Offer...
45% reduction of price on products for the next 3 years
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Arcvasti on January 24, 2016, 10:17:43 pm
dear god i have no idea how this would work at all

but it sounds fun

So I guess I'm tentatively IN, as soon as I can figure out exactly what is going on here.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 24, 2016, 10:22:51 pm
dear god i have no idea how this would work at all

but it sounds fun

So I guess I'm tentatively IN, as soon as I can figure out exactly what is going on here.
The way I understand it is we will all play a year to act as a blueprint for him, and he will follow that blueprint during the actual year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 24, 2016, 11:04:16 pm
1. Mrs. Feb Dabbleclasped - Miner
2. Mr. Feb Wadepaint - Mason/CMD
3. Feb Lulledcopper - Child of the above
4. Mr. Iton Packceilings - Fisherdwarf
5. Mrs. Iton Faintlantern - Miner
6. Mr. Uzol Manorswamp - Weaponsmith

Offer to buy the pick: Half the value of all stone goods produced for this year.

As for what tree I'd like cut, a willow tree. Epecially the one on the west side, in between the road and the pond.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Arcvasti on January 24, 2016, 11:42:00 pm
dear god i have no idea how this would work at all

but it sounds fun

So I guess I'm tentatively IN, as soon as I can figure out exactly what is going on here.
The way I understand it is we will all play a year to act as a blueprint for him, and he will follow that blueprint during the actual year.

Alright, I think I sort of get it now. That's going to interact weirdly with some things, like strange moods or invasions, but it sounds neat.



Alright. I'm claiming District I, the Library District

Dwarf listing will follow, I think. Assuming there's even enough space for me in the first full round, that is.

EDIT: Wait, what tileset is this using? That might be an important fact.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 12:26:18 am
dear god i have no idea how this would work at all

but it sounds fun

So I guess I'm tentatively IN, as soon as I can figure out exactly what is going on here.
The way I understand it is we will all play a year to act as a blueprint for him, and he will follow that blueprint during the actual year.

Alright, I think I sort of get it now. That's going to interact weirdly with some things, like strange moods or invasions, but it sounds neat.



Alright. I'm claiming District I, the Library District

Dwarf listing will follow, I think. Assuming there's even enough space for me in the first full round, that is.

EDIT: Wait, what tileset is this using? That might be an important fact.

Pheobus Tileset.

And in the event of an invasion, were-creature attack, merchants, "special mood" or noble requirement the game is paused, the update sent to this group, and all the District owners can then say how they want their District residents to react to that new event.  The original save is just the blueprint for buildings/excavations.

Also, you may notice that the population is 33, so at the moment, we're maxed out on District Founders. (Assuming no-one is unable to pick 7 available Founders and loses their District this year.)  Never fear, there will be more migrants soon!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 25, 2016, 01:51:54 am
I edited my above post a few times. Also Mrs. Braidedtreason is about to drop, in a week or two, at least from the save posted.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 02:06:40 am
I edited my above post a few times. Also Mrs. Braidedtreason is about to drop, in a week or two, at least from the save posted.
Wouldn't that be tragic?  (Of course, she might not...)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 02:35:47 am
Offer for pick: Half the value of all stone goods produced for this year.

Is this offer to purchase the pick, or to rent it for the year of 202-203?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 25, 2016, 04:03:10 am
To purchase the pick.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 04:21:26 am
To purchase the pick.
OK,
Counteroffer: "Value of... means: The total dorfbuck value of all things produced out of stone in District L for the year 202-203, divided by 2.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 25, 2016, 05:45:30 am
Deal.

Also I withdraw my complaint about Mr. Feb being a member of the nobility. It seems he's quite mad with power over others and demanding ceaseless toil from those around him. Who am I to argue with that? It will definately be interesting RPing that.

Going to call my district Lemducim
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 06:44:24 am
I made a claim and offer on the previous page Timeless Bob,
Noticed it on the board there. Nevermind.  :P

Edit: I will say on my offer that the number and type of seed can be negotiated.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urist Mc Dwarf on January 25, 2016, 10:01:51 am
PTW

This looks interesting
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 11:54:41 am
Do we start building yet?

With the Ast family (I don't remember what jobs they had), and the district F,
I need at least 1 training axe.

My initial survey shows the district has a bounty of mature olive trees, among a few tree cuttings.

My initial plans:
1. Chop non-olive trees for clearing and logs
2. Build above ground cabins for District F's citizens.
3. Create an olive tree gathering zone.
4. Gather plants to determine if there is above ground cloth plant: flax, cotton, hemp, or rope reeds?
5. Start above ground farm for cloth resource.
6. Make wood tools and resources: bucket, ash, lye, (wood pot?)
7. Harvest Olives; use Quern and Screw Press to obtain Olive Oil
8. Make soap from Olive Oil.

9. With the excess logs, I have options:
9a. Dedicate 1 citizen of District F to pursue Legendary Carpenter.  Build beds initially as I'm sure other districts will need this service.
Perhaps trade Districts for their unwanted logs; and return to them finished wood products such as *SUPERIOR* quality beds.
Although doors, tables, chairs, cabinets, and chest can be made of wood, I rather think conservatively and focus on using logs for beds, barrels, and ash/charcoal for when we wither make steel or clear glass (ash / potash).

10. I did not see any natural beehives.  If we do, then bee industry would be a fine side-gig since I will probably make a legendary Pressers and Millers.

--
So, I need stone to make mechanisms for the screw press, and querns.  But rather than go for self-sufficient, I think it will be more !fun! to rely on trades!

It is looking like Mr Shofet's district will have monopoly of stone which I could benefit from if he needs my long term end-products of soap, rare meals ingredients, clothing and paper products from cloth plants. 

To Mr. Shofet: I offer a trade pact of stone supplies: stone blocks,
25% total yield of Olive Soap Bars created this year, or until the walls and roof securing District F for stone resources and products.

-or-

1.Looking for stone products: 2 mechanisms, stone blocks, querns, some raw stones, and excess logs felled in your property
Offer *SUPERIOR* quality beds.

2. Looking for stone products: 100 stone jugs
Offer 1 Olive Oil Soap for each 100 stone jugs.

3. Looking for stone products: 100 stone pots
Offer 1 Olive Oil Soap for each 100 stone pots.

--

I would like a steady source for making jugs.  If we have source of Clay it would be good to eventually have a magma kiln near the surface.
Other than jugs, stone pots is what I want to use instead of using wood barrels/pots.

--

How are we handling the basic furniture?  As much as I like masterwork beds for all, it may be more reasonable to aim for an ≡EXCEPTIONAL≡ quality at most for non-nobles.  And a minimum of  *SUPERIOR* can be achieved in the first year I think, but this will result is a few junk--

shall I make a garbage chute atom-smasher first? or is that a District P service?

So the question is, who wants to pursue Legendary Carpenter skills by mass producing beds early on?  It behooves us to specialize this way early on while logs may be more abundant.
 
--

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Shofet on January 25, 2016, 12:59:05 pm
With the Lights cutting down a tree a district for free, you can make your training axe yourself.

I would support you taking over the wood business, Sanctume. I would gladly help supply you with blocks and pots, for a little soap, a few beds, and a stepladder. If you want to throw in some food that would be great. Keep in mind I will loose some production this year after paying for the pick, but I should be able to supply you with plenty of obsidian pots, jugs and blocks after this year.

I'm really interested to see this get off the ground. I imagine sobriety this first year will be higher than normal for most forts.

For the record I accept Sanctume trade pact. I aim to train up Mr. Feb as a mason, as well as one of the miners. The other miner, if I get them, will train mechanics. The fisherman Ill train as a stonecrafter. That leaves the weaponsmith to help out with food.

I know children can farm. I would really like to eventually try and experiment with having no adults with farming enabled, to see how much the kids farm, and how fast they train up at it. Also goes along with Feb Wadedpaint's penchant for forced labor._
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 01:21:49 pm
Sounds good Shofet, you got the stone industry focus, I can work on the wood, including preserving max zone area for olive tree growths. 

After this area, I have a strips of 7x7 walled / 5x5 indoor on one side, and a 5x5 walled or 3x3 indoors.  Plenty of room for outdoor farms and housing. 

Oh, nice, Obsidian block walls will be nice.   I'd gladly share what food I can make.

Or better yet, we can trade them for whoever is focusing on the food industry for lavish meals down the line.  I would argue that Lavish meals are more cost efficient since food is more base on numbers, Quantity.  Example.

Simple meals 2 items:
[5] plump helmet + [5] hen eggs + 1 food container = [10] plump helmet biscuit.
Regardless of Quality, this still yields 10 food items.

Lavish meals, 4 items:
[5] plump helmet + [5] hen eggs + [5] red spinach + [5] olive paste + 1 food container = [20] plump helmet roast.
Regardless of Quality, this still yields 20 food items, which is the sum of stacks of the each ingredients.

--

Now, I am wondering on actual game play during out blue print designs.

Do we create a burrow; add our citizens, then just work on our area?
But as far as needing / relying on trade resources, i.e. Mr Shofet's supply of stone blocks, obsidian pots and jugs, how or where do I get this during my game?

I suppose I can do burrow for Mr Shofet and add his citizens, then do a quick designation of dig quarry, make mason and crafts to mass produce just the items I need?

--

And with this train of thought, I would need to include to TimelessBob that I need xxxx obsidian blocks, xxx jugs, xxx stone pots etc.
But these too will be more a theoretical goal for what can be accomplished given the limited resource and skills of my district.

--

I did notice aluminum ores at district P.  I looks like we're going to have some valuable metal coins sooner in circulation.  Who's got the anvils?

And I wonder what minerals we have with obsidian boulders seems bountiful and messing up even a perfect 3x5 above ground farm plots.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Gwolfski on January 25, 2016, 01:41:30 pm
Right! claim G, and the following dorfs:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
only 5 i know, but whatever. i want a challenge!

Oh, and i accept graciously the offer of one tree cut down. Any one will do, just make sure it doesn't fall into a pond!.And nobody nicks it!

Oh, the anvil for sale. How about... 5000 dwarfbucks worth of goods given in the next 2 years? 2 years?


and a question: so, say the anvil offer is accepted, do i go ahead and take the anvil in my save game?
what about artifacts?

EDIT: name district lakecastle
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 01:45:15 pm
I made a claim post a day or so ago with my top 10 (I went with 8, couldn't think of any other specific dwarves) requests for dwarf founders. If no one else requests one of them then I shouldn't need to request others should I?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 02:34:46 pm
City Population: 33?  I think there's more, since the list in page 1 did not include the 7 or so founders? Anyway, list of citizens for out picking:

City Population: 33
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Now, I reorder them from my notes:

TimelessBob (District P, Founders)
1. Miss Light Dreamtorches
2. Mr Light Taughtlabored
3. Mr Light Laborspear
4. Mr Light Heatedlabored
5. Mr Light Justicepapaer
6. Mr Light Spirepaged (slain by were-civet, currently a ghost)

Sanctume (District F, gather plants, soap, carpenter)
1. Mr Ast Graverelic
2. Mrs Ast Dikecradle (current book-keeper)
3. Ast Blockadebolted

Shofet (District L, stone quarry)
1. Mr Feb Wadepaint (noble CMD)
2. Mrs Feb Dabbleclasp
3. Feb Lulledcopper

4. Mr Iton Packceilings
5. Mrs Iton Faintlantern
6. Miss Iton Glazedtwilights

Urdothor (District R, farming)
1. Miss Sarvesh Fountaingleamed

2. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed
3. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms

4. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows
5. Mrs Mestthos Laboredoil

7. Mr Lorbam Lancedstirred
8. Mrs Lorbam Blockadetwisted
9. Miss Lorbam Tonguetin
10. Lorbam Dikeankle
11. Miss Lorbam Udaredem

12. Mr Doren Inkspear
13. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Doren Chamberlashed
15. Miss Doren Holemine
16. Doren Postspread

Gwolfski (District G)
1. Mr Deduk Beasttrumpet
2. Mrs Deduk Minereleased
3. Miss Deduk Washedpaper
4. Miss Deduk Furnacestern

5. Mr Zasit Knowingwind
6. Mrs Zasit Walledbowel
7. Miss Eral Paddledhigh

Unclaimed
1. Mr Cilob Nettrot

2. Mr Uzol Manorswamp
3. Mrs Uzol Wringbust
4. Uzol Socketpapers

Districts of Interest / Intentions
1. Chaotic Skies (District H, military)
2.

Forumite Dwarfing Request
1. Dunamisdeos - wants to be a military dwarf (District H) as Mr Beard, axedwarf. With Mrs Eva, wood cutter or carpenter.

--

I'd gladly claim from Mr. Urdothor's list to complete my 7 citizens to be part of District F
2. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed
3. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms

4. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows
5. Mrs Mestthos Laboredoil

Which would still leave 7+ from your original list:

1. Miss Sarvesh Fountaingleamed

7. Mr Lorbam Lancedstirred
8. Mrs Lorbam Blockadetwisted
9. Miss Lorbam Tonguetin
10. Lorbam Dikeankle
11. Miss Lorbam Udaredem

12. Mr Doren Inkspear
13. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Doren Chamberlashed
15. Miss Doren Holemine
16. Doren Postspread

and the 4 Unclaimed if Mr Chaotic Skies forgoes recruiting and training militia this first year?

Am I right to understand that the whole family clan goes together?

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 02:44:39 pm
The 7 original founders are the ones Timeless Bob has. So that's 33?

I've only list eight as my top requests so, why are there 16 under my name? Relevant skill set I guess?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 02:54:40 pm
OK, Districts start with seven Dwarves, or they don't start.  Seven is the number and the number will be seven!

So, with that said, I want everyone who wishes to play a District this year to post a list of the Seven Dwarves they want to be their Founders, plus three more.  The deadline for this is noon on the 27th, forum time.

Once noon on the 27th has gone, I will be taking the first dwarf of every post and adding them to the claimed Districts, with ties going toward whomever has posted their list of dwarves first.  Second for the second and so on until either those Districts have 7 Founders, or there are no more Dwarves in anyone's list.

Under this system, Urdothor is guaranteed his starting 7 because he posted the list I requested (sort of) first. Because we have more potential Players than Dwarves right now, someone will be waiting for more Dwarves and starting on Founders Day of year 203 instead.

All Dwarves except for the 7 original Founders (and now, obviously Urodothor's starting seven) are available to be Founders, including Children and babies, but if children and babies aren't chosen, they'll follow their parents as "bonus citizens" of a District.  Unclaimed spouses will become "bonus citizens" the same way.  Obviously, unless special dispensation is made, spouses who are Founders of different Districts will become estranged and not produce any children, but that's part of the strategy of who you would like to put on your list of the Dwarves as District Founders, (plus 3 more just in case there's ties). 

There is a possibility that someone's draft list will contain more than three ties with someone else's draft list, which is why ties go to whomever posts first, because then the later Player can edit their draft list or get the person who posted before them to edit theirs instead via "persuasive argument" or possible promises of future payment.

This is why all the trade deals will Also be in negotiation until the 27th at least, because some deals will fall through because of the simple fact that those Districts weren't able to get seven dwarves to Found it that year in the first place.

I suppose if everyone's lists are posted quickly and there's coordination, then everyone will have their seven with no ties and we can get started earlier.

How to play the "Blueprint" game-play, you can just designate excavations and buildings and resources however you want, but know that your blueprint will probably be the ideal of what your District is hoping to achieve, and that you'll probably have to trade with other Districts during the week to get the resources you need to build your District the way you want it.    Another way is to burrow your dwarves in your area, and burrow the other dwarves in their areas, and try to get everyone else's Founders to do what they basically said they would do, then put all the other Founder dwarves in a burrow out of the way and let them starve - the pool of other people's Founders that you don't have trade agreements with. (Obviously, the wild card here is the unclaimed dwarves.  They'll work or loaf around according to their own whims and either speed the process up or be maddeningly slow.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Gwolfski on January 25, 2016, 02:58:08 pm
Gwolfski (District G)
1. Mr Deduk Beasttrumpet
2. Mrs Deduk Minereleased
3. Miss Deduk Washedpaper
4. Miss Deduk Furnacestern

5. Mr Zasit Knowingwind
6. Mrs Zasit Walledbowel
7. Miss Eral Paddledhigh

extras:
Doren Postspread
Mrs Uzol Wringbust
Uzol Socketpapers

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 03:00:10 pm
The 7 original founders are the ones Timeless Bob has. So that's 33?

I've only list eight as my top requests so, why are there 16 under my name? Relevant skill set I guess?

I think it's because they have kids, and you did not count them?
I think those without Mr or Miss or Mrs are kids.
Like the Ast family had 1 kid, and I counted it as 3 instead of 2. 

We're mostly blind going at this, so it's all good and fun.  Just think of you having a large family farm, kids gets to help harvest!

Edit:  Oh, actually, even though they have the same name "clan" they are unmarried adults and most likely get a different name in the future when they get married, or make an artifact.

So there's plenty of unclaimed resulting from you list.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 03:03:39 pm
Sanctume (District 9 F)

1. Mr Ast Graverelic
2. Mrs Ast Dikecradle
3.  Ast Blockadebolted

4. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed
5. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms

6. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows
7. Mrs Mestthos Laboredoil

Extras
1. Mr Uzol Manorswamp
2. Mrs Uzol Wringbust
3. Uzol Socketpapers
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 03:08:49 pm

I think it's because they have kids, and you did not count them?
I think those without Mr or Miss or Mrs are kids.
Like the Ast family had 1 kid, and I counted it as 3 instead of 2. 

We're mostly blind going at this, so it's all good and fun.  Just think of you having a large family farm, kids gets to help harvest!

I actually checked who was and wasn't a kid when posting. The different titles may signify parents/grandparents as well, I think? Like there was two adult males with the same name, so.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 03:11:57 pm
How to play the "Blueprint" game-play, you can just designate excavations and buildings and resources however you want, but know that your blueprint will probably be the ideal of what your District is hoping to achieve, and that you'll probably have to trade with other Districts during the week to get the resources you need to build your District the way you want it.    Another way is to burrow your dwarves in your area, and burrow the other dwarves in their areas, and try to get everyone else's Founders to do what they basically said they would do, then put all the other Founder dwarves in a burrow out of the way and let them starve - the pool of other people's Founders that you don't have trade agreements with. (Obviously, the wild card here is the unclaimed dwarves.  They'll work or loaf around according to their own whims and either speed the process up or be maddeningly slow.

So, everyone would be greatly assisted by screenshots then.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 03:16:30 pm

I think it's because they have kids, and you did not count them?
I think those without Mr or Miss or Mrs are kids.
Like the Ast family had 1 kid, and I counted it as 3 instead of 2. 

We're mostly blind going at this, so it's all good and fun.  Just think of you having a large family farm, kids gets to help harvest!

I actually checked who was and wasn't a kid when posting. The different titles may signify parents/grandparents as well, I think? Like there was two adult males with the same name, so.

Yep, I realize that and I was thinking the clan name as entire family unit -- all or nothing.

Since they are un-married adults, they are likely to have their own clan name after getting married / kids.

What's the prefixes?
Mr - married male?
Mrs - married female
Miss - single female
"Master, Mst, Msr? - single male?

or we can do
Lord, Lady for married couples, hehe.
Mr and Ms for singles.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 03:30:15 pm
Okay, so, top 10 8 and I'll take something else if someone really wants one of my choices:
1. Miss Sarvesh - Farmer

2. Mr Braidedtreason - Herbalist
3. Mrs Braidedtreason - Woodcutter

4. Mr Mestthos - Herbalist

5. Mr Lorbham - Herbalist
6. Mrs Lorbham - Herbalist
7, Miss Lorbham - Worthless Meat Sack Dwarven Baby
8. Mr Doren - Herbalist

Ok, I think I know where I got confused.  Too many names, to pick the remaining.

Based on Urdothor, and comparing to the list in the first page, which are available that I can include in my pick?

First page list.

Miss Sarvesh Fountaingleamed - matches 1 of Urdothor list

Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - matches 2
Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - matches 3

Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - matches 4
Mrs Mestthos Laboredoil - free, estranged if picked?

Mr Lorbam Lancedstirred - matches 5
Mrs Lorbam Blockadetwisted - matches 6
Lorbam Dikeankle (Dwarven Baby) - matches 7?

Miss Lorbam Tonguetin - free, single?
Miss Lorbam Udaredem - free, single?

Mr Doren Inkspear - matches 8
Mrs Doren Wondergilt - free, estranged if picked?

Doren Chamberlashed - free, unwanted child?
Doren Postspread - free, unwanted child?

Miss Doren Holemine - free, single?

edits...
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 03:37:50 pm
The 7 original founders are the ones Timeless Bob has. So that's 33?

I've only list eight as my top requests so, why are there 16 under my name? Relevant skill set I guess?

Oh crap, now I get it! 

The first page post.  It's is color coordinated on who are the founders (in green text), and the red text are non-founders.

I was copying and pasting the posts into notepad and so there is no green/red text so I counted each name as 1.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 03:40:37 pm
Ok, I think I know where I got confused.  Too many names, to pick the remaining.

Based on Urdothor, and comparing to the list in the first page, which are available that I can include in my pick?

First page list.

Miss Sarvesh Fountaingleamed - matches 1 of Urdothor list

Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - matches 2
Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - matches 3

Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - matches 4
Mrs Mestthos Laboredoil - free, estranged if picked?

Mr Lorbam Lancedstirred - matches 5
Mrs Lorbam Blockadetwisted - matches 6
Lorbam Dikeankle (Dwarven Baby) - matches 7?

Miss Lorbam Tonguetin - free, single?
Miss Lorbam Udaredem - free, single?

Mr Doren Inkspear - matches 8
Mrs Doren Wondergilt - free, estranged if picked?

Doren Chamberlashed - free, unwanted child?
Doren Postspread - free, unwanted child?

Miss Doren Holemine - free, single?

edits...

I totally didn't see the spouses that went with my picks. If it makes it easier I'll switch out my lower picks so no one becomes estranged and pulled apart. I only really want my first three picks so whomever else comes is fine. So, I'd be fine switching out anyone with a pairing I missed for a single dwarf, or the matching partner for some one I missed.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 03:43:13 pm
Naming pattern: <Title><surname><personal name>

Titles
Mr = Any adult male married or unmarried
Mrs = An adult female, married
Miss = Any unmarried female including female children
" " (no title) = Male babies or male children (obviously unmarried.)

Surnames
  Initially, these are taken from the first name of the Paternal Grandfather on the relationship screen for all adults.  Married female Dwarves will adopt the surname of their husbands, as will all of their children. (Obviously, children who have yet to immigrate to The City are assumed to have taken this name, and will be changed accordingly when/if they do immigrate.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
  However, whenever a citizen creates an artifact successfully, their surname changes to the reflect that accomplishment (As in the case of Mr and Mrs Braidedtorments.  Mr Braidedtorments created "The Braided Torments", an artifact bow, and when his surname changed, so did hers.)  Extra names won from being bad-ass are not considered surnames (ie: The Chances of Boarding" or whatever) - those stay only with that individual.

Personal Names
These are individual names that these dwarves have chosen for themselves.  While they're legally unchangeable in-game, RP in forums may have them prefer other nicknames.  Ex: "Hello, My name is Nettrot, of the Family Cilob, but my friends call me "Netty".
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 03:49:14 pm
Surnames
 
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

What you're saying is that this Count is effectively Attila the Hun in terms of children?

Edit: I hope for the sake of district population all the males breed that much.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 03:53:26 pm
I expect that eventually, The City will be populated by a combination of Old Dwarven Families, the Artifact Families and Everyone Else.  I'm not sure what I'll do with the Dwarves that immigrate who don't have a listed paternal grandfather.  Maybe I'll just give them a Title and leave their surnames blank.  They can be the adult orphans of our little society. They'll be the dwarves unconnected to any Family, who, like the original Founders, will choose a common Family name if they're chosen to be a Founder.  Maybe they'll use the name of their District as their family name too.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 03:56:02 pm
I expect that eventually, The City will be populated by a combination of Old Dwarven Families, the Artifact Families and Everyone Else.  I'm not sure what I'll do with the Dwarves that immigrate who don't have a listed paternal grandfather.  Maybe I'll just give them a Title and a personal name and leave their surnames blank.  They can be the adult orphans of our little society. They'll be the dwarves unconnected to any Family, who, like the original Founders, will choose a common Family name if they're chosen to be a Founder.  Maybe they'll use the name of their District as their family name too.

That reminds me, migrants are free to be used by everyone correct? So, the question is, where do they live exactly? Do the just mooch off everyone, do they live within the Founder's District? Could there be a Migrants district where they live till they're called upon?

Edit: So, since we've been divided into Districts, are we going to send a male and a female dwarf every year to fight in the Founder's District?  :P
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 04:02:22 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So it would be safe to say these picks should be:

Urdothor chooses
1. Miss Sarvesh Fountaingleamed

2. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed
3. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms

4. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows
5. Mrs Mestthos Laboredoil -

6. Mr Lorbam Lancedstirred
7. Mrs Lorbam Blockadetwisted
+ (unpicked bonus) Lorbam Dikeankle (Dwarven Baby)

Sanctume (District 9 F)

1. Mr Ast Graverelic
2. Mrs Ast Dikecradle
(unpicked bonus) Ast Blockadebolted (child as I last checked)

3. Mr Doren Inkspear
4. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
(unpicked bonus?) Doren Chamberlashed (child or single adult male)
(unpicked bonus?) Doren Postspread (child or single adult male)

5. Miss Doren Holemine

6. Miss Lorbam Tonguetin

7. Miss Lorbam Udaredem


Extra
1. Mr Uzol Manorswamp (Founder Candidate)
(unpicked) Mrs Uzol Wringbust (spouse)
(unpicked) Uzol Socketpapers (child?)

2.Mr Deduk Beasttrumpet
3. Mrs Deduk Minereleased
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 04:13:43 pm
I expect that eventually, The City will be populated by a combination of Old Dwarven Families, the Artifact Families and Everyone Else.  I'm not sure what I'll do with the Dwarves that immigrate who don't have a listed paternal grandfather.  Maybe I'll just give them a Title and a personal name and leave their surnames blank.  They can be the adult orphans of our little society. They'll be the dwarves unconnected to any Family, who, like the original Founders, will choose a common Family name if they're chosen to be a Founder.  Maybe they'll use the name of their District as their family name too.

That reminds me, migrants are free to be used by everyone correct? So, the question is, where do they live exactly? Do the just mooch off everyone, do they live within the Founder's District? Could there be a Migrants district where they live till they're called upon?

Edit: So, since we've been divided into Districts, are we going to send a male and a female dwarf every year to fight in the Founder's District?  :P

As a common resource, they are available to build and schlep (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=schlep&defid=459) for everyone (All other skills including "lever pulling" and "feed/bury injured dwarves" being turned off), but yes, they also mooch off of everyone and freely mingle in all of the various meeting places they're not specifically excluded from.  This means, of course, that if no-one decides to set up "worker housing" or even "public emergency bunkers" in one of the Districts, that these guys are liable to be butchered by the first were-creature or goblin/elvish army to attack.  However you guys want to play the game is fine with me.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 04:17:38 pm
As a common resource, they are available to build and schlep (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=schlep&defid=459) for everyone (All other skills including "lever pulling" and "feed/bury injured dwarves" being turned off), but yes, they also mooch off of everyone and freely mingle in all of the various meeting places they're not specifically excluded from.  This means, of course, that if no-one decides to set up "worker housing" or even "public emergency bunkers" in one of the Districts, that these guys are liable to be butchered by the first were-creature or goblin/elvish army to attack.  However you guys want to play the game is fine with me.

I might set up a big dorm style thing in the lower levels, since I need my soil levels. I should have an abundance of food, so it'll be alright I think.

The edit was a heavy-handed reference to a recent thing
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 04:24:32 pm
As a common resource, they are available to build and schlep (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=schlep&defid=459) for everyone (All other skills including "lever pulling" and "feed/bury injured dwarves" being turned off), but yes, they also mooch off of everyone and freely mingle in all of the various meeting places they're not specifically excluded from.  This means, of course, that if no-one decides to set up "worker housing" or even "public emergency bunkers" in one of the Districts, that these guys are liable to be butchered by the first were-creature or goblin/elvish army to attack.  However you guys want to play the game is fine with me.

I might set up a big dorm style thing in the lower levels, since I need my soil levels. I should have an abundance of food, so it'll be alright I think.

The edit was a heavy-handed reference to a recent thing

Interestingly enough, whomever chooses a Noble as one of their Founder will probably have to satisfy them with their room requirements, but might be statistically exempt from satisfying their demands, since odds are that the hammerer will "punish" a random person from another District if the demand is ignored.  Of course, with Mayoral elections depending on who in the City is the most popular, I expect it'll probably be an unclaimed Dwarf who gets it the first time around, unless a District specifically attempts to make one candidate VERY popular somehow... 

However, if that noble loses their position for some reason, then the rooms might be able to be rented to the District that gains that title of nobility, (since all nobles are going to be "free range".)  That might be a source of income for Districts who choose to do something like that.  Also, nobles from one District might choose to marry a Dwarf from another District by meeting them as a noble, which could eventually result in a multi-District interconnected family.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 04:46:37 pm
Since nobles and migrants are free range, I predict that the first mayor just may stay mayor since they'll have a lot of exposure to a lot of dwarves.

I believe would like to make an adjustment to my dwarf choices. The Lorbham baby is just a bonus since the child follows family, correct? So I would like to trade out Mr Doren, who would actually be my 7th, for Mrs Mestthos.

So, there was an offer for a free tree to be cut down correct...? Dunno what color to go with for this so, green?
I accept the offer given and would like the north-western most olive tree cut down (Will I do this myself during game-play?)

I would like to counter the offer for the pick, but I would instead like to briefly rent it, and then allow the Lemducim District to purchase it. My offer is 45% off all products produced for a period of 3 years, starting at any point chosen by the Founder's District.

I also recede my previous request for seeds.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 04:54:43 pm
Since nobles and migrants are free range, I predict that the first mayor just may stay mayor since they'll have a lot of exposure to a lot of dwarves.

I believe would like to make an adjustment to my dwarf choices. The Lorbham baby is just a bonus since the child follows family, correct? So I would like to trade out Mr Doren, who would actually be my 7th, for Mrs Mestthos.

So, there was an offer for a free tree to be cut down correct...? Dunno what color to go with for this so, green?
I accept the offer given and would like the north-western most olive tree cut down (Will I do this myself during game-play?)

I would like to counter the offer for the pick, but I would instead like to briefly rent it, and then allow the Lemducim District to purchase it. My offer is 45% off all products produced for a period of 3 years, starting at any point chosen by the Founder's District.

I also recede my previous request for seeds.

A child or spouse will follow family so long as it isn't specifically chosen as a Founder in another District.  I can imagine an unscrupulous Player specifically choosing a child of another District's Founder as a Founder, to hold as a hostage.  None of the other potential Players in this game would be that dirty of a bastard, right?  I'm just needlessly paranoid.  ;)

Of course, until they actually become members of a District, they're free to chosen...

Yes, you'd do this during your blue-print phase.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 04:58:33 pm
A child or spouse will follow family so long as it isn't specifically chosen as a Founder in another District.  I can imagine an unscrupulous Player specifically choosing a child of another District's Founder as a Founder, to hold as a hostage.  Of course, I might be a little bit of a bastard too, but...

The issue is the child is a baby. I don't believe the baby can be detached from its mother all to easily. Either way, if I trade out then I'm at 7+1, with all my families intact.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Gwolfski on January 25, 2016, 05:00:32 pm
Gwolfski (District G) Name-Lakecastle
1. Mr Deduk Beasttrumpet
2. Mrs Deduk Minereleased
3. Miss Deduk Washedpaper
4. Miss Deduk Furnacestern
5. Mr Zasit Knowingwind
6. Mrs Zasit Walledbowel
7. Miss Eral Paddledhigh

extras:
Doren Postspread
Mrs Uzol Wringbust
Uzol Socketpapers

Oh, and i accept graciously the offer of one tree cut down. Any one will do, just make sure it doesn't fall into a pond!.And nobody nicks it!

Oh, the anvil for sale. How about... 500 dwarfbucks worth of goods given in the next 2 years? in addition to the terms stated?


and a question: so, say the anvil offer is accepted, do i go ahead and take the anvil in my save game?
what about artifacts?


Edit: you know the wood roads? can i deconstruct the one around my district and replace it with a different material?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 05:01:50 pm
Do I get the artifact bow that goes with Mr Braidedtreason, or no?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 05:04:52 pm
A child or spouse will follow family so long as it isn't specifically chosen as a Founder in another District.  I can imagine an unscrupulous Player specifically choosing a child of another District's Founder as a Founder, to hold as a hostage.  Of course, I might be a little bit of a bastard too, but...

The issue is the child is a baby. I don't believe the baby can be detached from its mother all to easily. Either way, if I trade out then I'm at 7+1, with all my families intact.

Right - so that baby would physically remain with the mother in the game, but would "legally" belong to a different District as one of their Founders.  This would mean that the infant Founder was able to freely leech off of his/her parent's District resources, but if as a child they made an artifact or something, that it would be owned by the baby's District and not the Mother's.  It would be a very shady.  Of course, that also means that when/if the baby becomes an adult, they would immediately move to that other District, after having been taken care of by their Parent's District for years and years.  It's really a form of resource theft...
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 05:36:14 pm
Gwolfski (District G) Name-Lakecastle
1. Mr Deduk Beasttrumpet
2. Mrs Deduk Minereleased
3. Miss Deduk Washedpaper
4. Miss Deduk Furnacestern
5. Mr Zasit Knowingwind
6. Mrs Zasit Walledbowel
7. Miss Eral Paddledhigh

extras:
Doren Postspread
Mrs Uzol Wringbust
Uzol Socketpapers

Oh, and i accept graciously the offer of one tree cut down. Any one will do, just make sure it doesn't fall into a pond!.And nobody nicks it!

Oh, the anvil for sale. How about... 500 dwarfbucks worth of goods given in the next 2 years? in addition to the terms stated?


and a question: so, say the anvil offer is accepted, do i go ahead and take the anvil in my save game?
what about artifacts?


Edit: you know the wood roads? can i deconstruct the one around my district and replace it with a different material?

Good catch!  The roads dividing up the Districts are owned by the City and are specifically there to facilitate transportation to the Depot, so upkeep of them would be controlled by whomever has the Broker as a member of their District.  Currently, That's Mrs Zasit Walledbowel.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 05:46:00 pm
Mrs Ast Dikecradle is the current book-keeper.  If she becomes a citizen of District F, she can still do her duties telecommuting away from The City.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Dunamisdeos on January 25, 2016, 05:54:26 pm
This is the most complex "megaproject" I have ever seen. I love this.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 05:58:56 pm
This is the most complex "megaproject" I have ever seen. I love this.

I'm already getting a vibe from the silence of the military district, "bring me your tribute, war is coming!"
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 06:12:59 pm
I'm already getting a vibe from the silence of the military district, "bring me your tribute, war is coming!"

If the military district wants to call a small-medium size draft in exchange for protection, I wouldn't be opposed to following it, personally.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: chaotic skies on January 25, 2016, 06:34:27 pm
Nah, I've been busy. But yeah, basically the "We're almost, but not quite mercenaries, give us things now" idea is what I was going for. But that comes later :P
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 06:38:13 pm
I'm already getting a vibe from the silence of the military district, "bring me your tribute, war is coming!"

If the military district wants to call a small-medium size draft in exchange for protection, I wouldn't be opposed to following it, personally.

I plan to have my farmers train with (training) spears during winter.  Once I get rock nuts / quarry bush, I will follow its growing season; Spring to Autumn, and a winter break!  Olive trees will probably be the same as pig tails, Summer and Autumn only.


Cool, my local militia should be at least have a chance not to get stabbed first.  Just need leather armor and helms to start with.
Nah, I've been busy. But yeah, basically the "We're almost, but not quite mercenaries, give us things now" idea is what I was going for. But that comes later :P
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 08:53:19 pm
Do I get the artifact bow that goes with Mr Braidedtreason, or no?

That's Mr Braidedtreason's bow, so it goes with him.  A "family heirloom" kind of thing.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 08:57:03 pm

That's Mr Braidedtreason's bow, so it goes with him.  A "family heirloom" kind of thing.

Too bad he's moving to a farming colony.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 09:05:27 pm
I would like to counter the offer for the pick, but I would instead like to briefly rent it, and then allow the Lemducim District to purchase it. My offer is 45% off all products produced for a period of 3 years, starting at any point chosen by the Founder's District.

Please define "brief" in the above offer.  Do you mean "after a certain digging project is completed" or "after year 202 is finished", or something else entirely?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 09:07:47 pm

That's Mr Braidedtreason's bow, so it goes with him.  A "family heirloom" kind of thing.

Too bad he's moving to a farming colony.

That's the thing about heirlooms, sometimes they wait around for just the right ancestor to come along. (Well, that or an estate sale, or possibly a thief...)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 09:12:37 pm
I would like to counter the offer for the pick, but I would instead like to briefly rent it, and then allow the Lemducim District to purchase it. My offer is 45% off all products produced for a period of 3 years, starting at any point chosen by the Founder's District.

Please define "brief" in the above offer.  Do you mean "after a certain digging project is completed" or "after year 202 is finished, or something else entirely?
Long enough to finish a project.

Spoiler: Details of Project (click to show/hide)

Edit: Basically the small amount of space I think I'll need for 7 dwarfs and some crops for a year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 25, 2016, 09:32:58 pm
How's about a dorf in district R? This is quite the grand undertaking. Lots of people have talked about doing it, but I don't remember seeing anyone making this kind of organized go at it.

I'm most interested to witness it!

Alright, I'll dorf you once we start. Name/occupation preference? I'm going for a farming industry specialization.

Ahhh no wait I got confused I want to be a military dorf! This is important! I should be in district H. I'm sorry, I'm confused today. Please name him Mr. Beard. He should be an Axedwarf.

My wife, however, DOES request a dorf in district R. She says she should be named Eva, and should be a woodcutter or carpenter. Sorry again.

Considering the naming conventions, you and your wife will have to understand that "Mr Beard" and "Eva" will be forum nicknames for named dwarves, and that since you guys want to be dorfed in different Districts, that the Players playing those Districts will have to be OK with those nicknames as well?  My main function for this game is to be the host that ties all the various elements together.  (Although, having my little dudes also be doing their thing is fun too.)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 25, 2016, 09:35:01 pm
Considering the naming conventions, you and your wife will have to understand that "Mr Beard" and "Eva" will be forum nicknames for named dwarves, and that since you guys want to be dorfed in different Districts, that the Players playing those Districts will have to be OK with those nicknames as well?  My main function for this game is to be the host that ties all the various elements together.  (Although, having my little dudes also be doing their thing is fun too.)

I'm fine with the nickname. Not sure about district H though. Is H chaotic_skies?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 25, 2016, 10:17:13 pm
TimelessBob, are you going to make a save with the burrows and citizens assigned to them so we know which once we have before building the blue print?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: chaotic skies on January 25, 2016, 11:31:12 pm
I guess I'm going to go with the last 7 available dwarves:
1. Mr Zasit Knowingwind
2. Mrs Zasit Walledbowel
3. Miss Eral Paddledhigh
4. Mr Deduk Beasttrumpet
5. Mrs Deduk Minereleased
6. Doren Postspread
7. Mr Cilob Nettrot

Looking For...
3 Plump Helmets
5 Plump Helmet Spawn
1 of Each of the following
Cave wheat seeds
Pig tail seeds
Rock Nut
Sweet Pod seeds

Offer...
45% reduction of price on anything for the next 3 years

Edit:
The tree I would prefer to be cut down is the Carambola Tree at the southern edge of my district, in the dead center. It has a piece of obsidian next to it.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 02:10:07 am
TimelessBob, are you going to make a save with the burrows and citizens assigned to them so we know which once we have before building the blue print?
I can do that, certainly.  I'll also be populating the empty numbered spaces under the District names with the Founder Dwarves, so that I can be reminded who goes where too.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 10:12:06 am
So who has the pick? 

Since I am unsure at this point on who will be my other citizens, I need to hire the services of miners to dig a few underground basement storage areas.

This should leave behind some extra stones to make onsite mechanisms, blocks and querns, and assortment of furnitures.

Speaking of furnitures, do other districts want wood dining sets (chairs and tables) suited for above-ground housing?  I would like to offer chairs, tables, cabinets, and chests of up to +FINE+ quality while District F's Carpenter practice his skills, in exchange for your extra logs that litter your districts.

The hauling of the logs will depend on the available free loaders haulers found in the City-Founders District.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 12:22:06 pm
So who has the pick? 

Since I am unsure at this point on who will be my other citizens, I need to hire the services of miners to dig a few underground basement storage areas.

This should leave behind some extra stones to make onsite mechanisms, blocks and querns, and assortment of furnitures.

Speaking of furnitures, do other districts want wood dining sets (chairs and tables) suited for above-ground housing?  I would like to offer chairs, tables, cabinets, and chests of up to +FINE+ quality while District F's Carpenter practice his skills, in exchange for your extra logs that litter your districts.

The hauling of the logs will depend on the available free loaders haulers found in the City-Founders District.
Looks like the "rental then buy" option is the highest so far for the pick. (So long as Leducim District still wants to buy it after District R is done with it.) In the spirit of good faith, I'll lower the buying price 3% for every day the pick is being used, so that the time left in the year will be pro-rated to cost the same rate as it would have for the full year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 01:11:50 pm
I think at this point, I can only guesstimate what I have for trade.

Mining basement may be done later when Caravan Day arrives.

Thinking about how this plays out: 

Phase 0. TimelessBob provides a Start Year x save.

Phase 1. We RP, trades, then play, and submit.
1. Screen shot dig layout.
2. List the build order; screen shot for furniture placements.
3. Note zone setup.
4. List citizen and corresponding labor enabled.
5. List build items - but here is where the estimates happen because my game play will differ from TimeBob's actual play.

Fast forward to end of 1 game year for us Blue Print players. 

Phase 2. TimelessBob plays the real game.
1.  Following our blue prints, builds, labors, etc.
2. Caravan Day happens, so this depends on whether the liaison starts a meeting or if the game was saved prior to the meeting.
TimelessBob provides a save.

Phase 3. Players peruse the current save.
1. If the game is saved prior to the liaison meeting request for next years items, we players can peruse our district's progress, our needs, and our stocks.
2. We can then request specific items from the liaison for next year.
3. And then we can unpause the game from our end and see what is available for trade and make offers for caravan trades.
4. We will have a better idea on our stock and RP, offer trades to other players.
5. We can even make screen shots for blue prints updated, or shift priorities for our districts.

Phase 4. TimelessBob resumes the game on his end
1. Use input from Phase 3 regarding trades from caravan and players.
2. Update to blue prints, if any.
3. Save at Founder's Day, 1st of Spring, and repeat to Phase 0.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 02:00:48 pm
I think at this point, I can only guesstimate what I have for trade.

Mining basement may be done later when Caravan Day arrives.

Thinking about how this plays out: 

Phase 0. TimelessBob provides a Start Year x save.

Phase 1. We RP, trades, then play, and submit.
1. Screen shot dig layout.
2. List the build order; screen shot for furniture placements.
3. Note zone setup.
4. List citizen and corresponding labor enabled.
5. List build items - but here is where the estimates happen because my game play will differ from TimelessBob's actual play.

Fast forward to end of 1 game year for us Blue Print players. 

Phase 2. TimelessBob plays the real game.
1.  Following our blue prints, builds, labors, etc.
2. Caravan Day happens, so this depends on whether the liaison starts a meeting or if the game was saved prior to the meeting.
TimelessBob provides a save.

Phase 3. Players peruse the current save.
1. If the game is saved prior to the liaison meeting request for next years items, we players can peruse our district's progress, our needs, and our stocks.
2. We can then request specific items from the liaison for next year.
3. And then we can unpause the game from our end and see what is available for trade and make offers for caravan trades.
4. We will have a better idea on our stock and RP, offer trades to other players.
5. We can even make screen shots for blue prints updated, or shift priorities for our districts.

Phase 4. TimelessBob resumes the game on his end
1. Use input from Phase 3 regarding trades from caravan and players.
2. Update to blue prints, if any.
3. Save at Founder's Day, 1st of Spring, and repeat to Phase 0.

That sounds about right, except for the annual election of a Mayor.  After I've posted the "Phase 0" save, every District that cares to do so can put forward their candidate for Mayor.  I'll take all the candidates, put them in a poll and voting will continue through the Blue-print period.  Whomever wins that year's election becomes the Mayor for that year in the "Real Game".  Obviously, this will have to wait until we have a population over 50, but when we do the person who is elected Mayor by the program will be the "Mayor pro tem" and hold the office until the next Founder's Day. (Whereupon we begin the annual poll cycle).

I've been thinking about this, and Nobles seem to always buy their titles in Fortress Mode (unless they inherit them).  When a Barony title does come up for revue, the District that has given the most to the Mountainhome will be the one that chooses who that Title goes to, whereupon it will become an inheritable title from then on.  Only Barons get to become Counts, though, so if/when a Baron is promoted to Count, the Barony Title will become open to the District that has given the most to the Mountainhome at that point. Likewise Dukedoms, and even if it becomes the Royal seat of power.

Obviously, the District that controls the Mayor, Baron, Count or Duke has powers of appointment (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Noble) over other noble positions during their time in power, so other Districts may wish to make side deals to place dwarves favorable to their interests in those positions.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 02:48:32 pm
1 anvil to rent
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 26, 2016, 02:55:35 pm
1 anvil to rent
Details:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
is that the samoe one?

If so, then accept for one year!

and cancel the other anvil thingy i made
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 03:04:53 pm
Oh man, won't it be tragic if my citizens goes insane from a strange mood and no access specific items?

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 03:46:34 pm
5000 dwarfbucks worth of goods given in the next 2 years?
I'll accept this, given the option that the Founder's District has the option of buying it back from the Lakecastle District for 2500 DB worth of goods if they ever choose to re-sell it.

OK, I see you backed out on the original deal, and accepted the rental instead.  I'll go change this on the "Trades" post.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Gwolfski on January 26, 2016, 03:48:57 pm
5000 dwarfbucks worth of goods given in the next 2 years?
I'll accept this, given the option that the Founder's District has the option of buying it back from the Lakecastle District for 2500 DB worth of goods if they ever choose to re-sell it.
accepted! btw, how do you measure DB of a single item?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 03:51:41 pm
5000 dwarfbucks worth of goods given in the next 2 years?
I'll accept this, given the option that the Founder's District has the option of buying it back from the Lakecastle District for 2500 DB worth of goods if they ever choose to re-sell it.
accepted! btw, how do you measure DB of a single item?

You need to have a broker enabled in the nobles position (which we do) who has "appraisal" at at least novice level.  Then an item will show its worth in Dorfbucks.

OK, so which deal did you want to accept?  The buy or the rent?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 26, 2016, 03:52:52 pm
The buy one.

edit: as in this one:3 out of 5 items made with the anvil + the option to buy it back first before its sold to any other District, or to the Caravan.
5,000 dwarfbucks of goods over the next 2 years
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 04:06:51 pm
The buy one.

edit: as in this one:3 out of 5 items made with the anvil + the option to buy it back first before its sold to any other District, or to the Caravan.
5,000 dwarfbucks of goods over the next 2 years

Huh.  I thought you meant 5000 DB in goods over the next 2 years + the option for a buy-back at 2500 DB's of goods instead of the original offer.  Are you adding the 5000... on top of the 3 in 5?  If so, I will accept with glee!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 04:11:07 pm
Also, I don't have a full roster for Shofet yet - I only have a list of 6 dwarves from him...

Actually, Sanctume: you added Mr Mestthos's wife to your roster and she isn't even living in The City right now.
These
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
are the dwarves living in The City. 
The posting order for a list of possible Founders is:
Urdothor
Sanctume (Both Braidedtreasons are taken, as well as Mr Mestthos, which means you only have 6 dwarves...
Gwolfski
Shofet only 6 though: still not complete
Chaotic_skies
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 04:15:41 pm
Also, I don't have a full roster for Shofet yet - I only have a list of 6 dwarves from him...

He can have the ghost dwarf. They sometimes do work.

Edit: Bad joke. My apologies.
So, whats the start date on this again?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 26, 2016, 04:27:53 pm
looking for 1 pickaxe-grade bar. Will repay with either a)another pickaxe or b)100DB worth of items.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 04:30:49 pm
Have we set a value on our currency yet?
Like a base value for the coins?
Or, are we doing it based on material value?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 04:38:46 pm
This was Shofet's post list.

1. Mrs. Feb Dabbleclasped - Miner
2. Mr. Feb Wadepaint - Mason/CMD
3. Feb Lulledcopper - Child of the above
4. Mr. Iton Packceilings - Fisherdwarf
5. Mrs. Iton Faintlantern - Miner
6. Mr. Uzol Manorswamp - Weaponsmith

Offer to buy the pick: Half the value of all stone goods produced for this year.

As for what tree I'd like cut, a willow tree. Epecially the one on the west side, in between the road and the pond.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 26, 2016, 04:41:36 pm
Have we set a value on our currency yet?
Like a base value for the coins?
Or, are we doing it based on material value?
good old Dorf Bucks
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 04:43:51 pm
Have we set a value on our currency yet?
Like a base value for the coins?
Or, are we doing it based on material value?
good old Dorf Bucks

Alright, because there was talk of coin usage before, and coins can be given any value in an economy like this, ya know.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Gwolfski on January 26, 2016, 04:44:40 pm
incidentally, since there will always be a finite number of "free range" citizens to do the grunt work, having them available to do that work might ITSELF be a resource that can be bartered and traded.  For instance, if I wanted to build this big temple to some god this year, I might pay the other Players resources I have stockpiled to not build things this turn, so that the workers will spend more time on my project.  Districts with Founding Family members who are unhappy might jump at the chance for them to "take a vacation" one year and get in some much needed socializing and general R&R.
could you 'kidnap' them? ie. lock the gates while they are in, have em build something, then release?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 04:55:10 pm
could you 'kidnap' them? ie. lock the gates while they are in, have em build something, then release?

But is it worth it to do that and put yourself in a bad position with the other players?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 05:02:45 pm
incidentally, since there will always be a finite number of "free range" citizens to do the grunt work, having them available to do that work might ITSELF be a resource that can be bartered and traded.  For instance, if I wanted to build this big temple to some god this year, I might pay the other Players resources I have stockpiled to not build things this turn, so that the workers will spend more time on my project.  Districts with Founding Family members who are unhappy might jump at the chance for them to "take a vacation" one year and get in some much needed socializing and general R&R.
could you 'kidnap' them? ie. lock the gates while they are in, have em build something, then release?

You can in your copy.  But remember you are only doing a blue print.  The actual result of your progress in you blue print game may not be completed in TimelessBob's "real" game.   Think of all the "fun" that can happen.  Maybe that free loader wood cutter dies from a cave-in falling log early.  Your blue print relied on that wood cutter's service, but it's gone in the "real" game which delays laying down the crucial building because the tree is still there, so a delay in your blue print. Or something like that. 

That's why I can't quite rely on the miner being available until I buy the items to at least be self-sufficient in terms of digging.

Although Shofet and Sanctume have a trade pact in place where Shofet provides blocks, and I provide some food and beds.

I plan to pursue Carpenter.  I am offering up to *SUPERIOR* quality beds in exchange to your extra logs while I use this time to practice my carpenter skills.
In "real game" I can see TimelessBob building my Carpenter Workshop order 30 beds.  I'd have a wood stockpile, and the free-loader haulers will mostly like use up the logs nearest my district in the west, and then gather more logs from other districts.  I don't know how he will control not sharing logs between all other 20 districts. 

Unless Wood hauling is disabled for all, and only enabled to those confined within it's district.  But 1 free loader hauler without Wood Hauling labor will just randomly pick up logs and drop off to nearest wood pile.



Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 05:08:41 pm
Have we set a value on our currency yet?
Like a base value for the coins?
Or, are we doing it based on material value?
good old Dorf Bucks

Alright, because there was talk of coin usage before, and coins can be given any value in an economy like this, ya know.

I think the coins can make the RP trading more fun.  It would be kinda cheesy to make the high value items such as masterful prepared meals that easily be worth an entire caravan. 

What if we think of the coins, say [500] aluminum coins as 1 favor between districts.  It can be that 1 iron bar, or a shipment (5 barrels of booze), or 1 bar of soap, or turtle shell that I need / want and have no means to obtain from the entire region.  Then my district will have a vault of some sort to store the District's treasure of [500] aluminum coins.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 05:11:30 pm
Reposting from page 10:

Also, I don't have a full roster for Shofet yet - I only have a list of 6 dwarves from him...

Actually, Sanctume: you added Mr Mestthos's wife to your roster and she isn't even living in The City right now.
These
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
are the dwarves living in The City. 
The posting order for a list of possible Founders is:
Urdothor
Sanctume (Both Braidedtreasons are taken, as well as Mr Mestthos, which means you only have 6 dwarves...)
Gwolfski
Chaotic_skies
Shofet only 6 though: still not complete
The people higher in the que have preference for the chosen dwarves because they posted a list of at least 7 before the others farther down the que.

Fortunately, deadline for picking your dwarves is tomorrow by noon, forum time, so you all have a chance to update your lists.

The legend i had at the top of that list had yellow be for dwarves living in the city, red for dwarves related who might immigrate to the City later, and green for the dwarves already spoken for.  I realize that the red dwarves should never have been included, as this has caused much confusion.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 05:18:59 pm
Reposting from page 10:

Also, I don't have a full roster for Shofet yet - I only have a list of 6 dwarves from him...

Actually, Sanctume: you added Mr Mestthos's wife to your roster and she isn't even living in The City right now.
These
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
are the dwarves living in The City. 
The posting order for a list of possible Founders is:
Urdothor
Sanctume (Both Braidedtreasons are taken, as well as Mr Mestthos, which means you only have 6 dwarves...)
Gwolfski
Chaotic_skies
Shofet only 6 though: still not complete
The people higher in the que have preference for the chosen dwarves because they posted a list of at least 7 before the others farther down the que.

Fortunately, deadline for picking your dwarves is tomorrow by noon, forum time, so you all have a chance to update your lists.

What do you currently have down for my picks?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 05:30:20 pm
Reposting from page 10:

Also, I don't have a full roster for Shofet yet - I only have a list of 6 dwarves from him...

Actually, Sanctume: you added Mr Mestthos's wife to your roster and she isn't even living in The City right now.
These
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
are the dwarves living in The City. 
The posting order for a list of possible Founders is:
Urdothor
Sanctume (Both Braidedtreasons are taken, as well as Mr Mestthos, which means you only have 6 dwarves...)
Gwolfski
Chaotic_skies
Shofet only 6 though: still not complete
The people higher in the que have preference for the chosen dwarves because they posted a list of at least 7 before the others farther down the que.

Fortunately, deadline for picking your dwarves is tomorrow by noon, forum time, so you all have a chance to update your lists.

Yeah, I'm confused now lol.  There's 33 in the list, and so 5 players (5x7) will mean 2 short.

However, do I understand it correctly that the Light family belong in District P already?

So that 33-6 (Light) = 27. 

27 citizens left for the picking between 5 districts?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 05:34:19 pm
Reposting from page 10:

Also, I don't have a full roster for Shofet yet - I only have a list of 6 dwarves from him...

Actually, Sanctume: you added Mr Mestthos's wife to your roster and she isn't even living in The City right now.
These
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
are the dwarves living in The City. 
The posting order for a list of possible Founders is:
Urdothor
Sanctume (Both Braidedtreasons are taken, as well as Mr Mestthos, which means you only have 6 dwarves...)
Gwolfski
Chaotic_skies
Shofet only 6 though: still not complete
The people higher in the que have preference for the chosen dwarves because they posted a list of at least 7 before the others farther down the que.

Fortunately, deadline for picking your dwarves is tomorrow by noon, forum time, so you all have a chance to update your lists.

Yeah, I'm confused now lol.  There's 33 in the list, and so 5 players (5x7) will mean 2 short.

However, do I understand it correctly that the Light family belong in District P already?

So that 33-6 (Light) = 27. 

27 citizens left for the picking between 5 districts?

Some of the dwarves on the list aren't in the City yet, so they aren't pickable and we've picked them, I think?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 05:34:35 pm
This is what I've got from everyone's picks:

  1. Miss Light Earthenfrost - TimelessBob
  2. Miss Light Dreamstorches - TimelessBob
  3. Mr Light Taughtlabored - TimelessBob
  4. Mr Light Laborspear - TimelessBob
  5. Mr Light Heatedlabored - TimelessBob
  6. Mr Light Justicepaper - TimelessBob
  7. Mr Doren Netwebbed
  8. Mr Doren Inkspear
  9. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
10. Doren Postspread (baby) - Gwolfski, chaotic_skies
11. Mr Lorbam Lancestirred - Urdothor
12. Mrs Lorbam Blockadetwisted - Urdothor
13. Miss Lorbam Rainedkeys (baby) - Urthodor
14. Mr Zasit Flickerracks
15. Mr Zasit Knowingwind - Gwolfski, chaotic_skies
16. Mrs Zasit Walledbowel - Gwolfski, chaotic_skies
17. Mr Deduk Beasttrumpet - Gwolfski, chaotic_skies
18. Mrs Deduk Minereleased - Gwolfski, chaotic_skies
19. Miss Sarvesh Fountaingleamed - Urdothor
20. Mr Ast Graverelic - Sanctume
21. Mrs Ast Dikecradle - Sanctume
22. Ast Blockadebolted (baby) - Sanctume
23. Mr Iton Packceilings - Shofet
24. Mrs Iton Faintlantern - Shofet
25. Mr Feb Wadepaint - Shofet
26. Mrs Feb Dabbleclasp - Shofet
27. Feb Lulledcopper (child) - Shofet
28. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - Urdothor, Sanctume
29. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - Urdothor, Sanctume
30. Mr Cilob Nettrot - chaotic_skies
31. Mr Uzol Manorswamp - Sanctume, Shofet
32. Miss Eral Paddledhigh - Gwolfski, chaotic_skies
33. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - Urdothor, Sanctume
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 05:54:52 pm
I shall claim these:
20. Mr Ast Graverelic - Sanctume
21. Mrs Ast Dikecradle - Sanctume
22. Ast Blockadebolted (baby) - Sanctume
 7. Mr Doren Netwebbed
 8. Mr Doren Inkspear
 9. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Mr Zasit Flickerracks

and please remove these:
28. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - Urdothor, Sanctume
29. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - Urdothor, Sanctume
31. Mr Uzol Manorswamp - Sanctume, Shofet
33. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - Urdothor, Sanctume

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 05:59:50 pm
I shall claim these:
20. Mr Ast Graverelic - Sanctume
21. Mrs Ast Dikecradle - Sanctume
22. Ast Blockadebolted (baby) - Sanctume
 7. Mr Doren Netwebbed
 8. Mr Doren Inkspear
 9. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Mr Zasit Flickerracks

and please remove these:
28. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - Urdothor, Sanctume
29. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - Urdothor, Sanctume
31. Mr Uzol Manorswamp - Sanctume, Shofet
33. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - Urdothor, Sanctume

Would you have more use for the couple with the artifact bow, the BraidedTreasons?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 06:04:55 pm
I plan to pursue Carpenter.  I am offering up to *SUPERIOR* quality beds in exchange to your extra logs while I use this time to practice my carpenter skills.
In "real game" I can see TimelessBob building my Carpenter Workshop order 30 beds.  I'd have a wood stockpile, and the free-loader haulers will mostly like use up the logs nearest my district in the west, and then gather more logs from other districts.  I don't know how he will control not sharing logs between all other 20 districts. 

Unless Wood hauling is disabled for all, and only enabled to those confined within it's district.  But 1 free loader hauler without Wood Hauling labor will just randomly pick up logs and drop off to nearest wood pile.

I was just going to keep track of how many logs came from felled trees in each District and limit the log-using jobs based on that.  We work with the medium we have.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 06:06:17 pm
I shall claim these:
20. Mr Ast Graverelic - Sanctume
21. Mrs Ast Dikecradle - Sanctume
22. Ast Blockadebolted (baby) - Sanctume
 7. Mr Doren Netwebbed
 8. Mr Doren Inkspear
 9. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Mr Zasit Flickerracks

and please remove these:
28. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - Urdothor, Sanctume
29. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - Urdothor, Sanctume
31. Mr Uzol Manorswamp - Sanctume, Shofet
33. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - Urdothor, Sanctume

Would you have more use for the couple with the artifact bow, the BraidedTreasons?

Probably, I plan to give my citizens winter breaks for military training.  I'd start with wood arrows--can we make those as a civ?  It would be interesting to depend on arrow ammo from the elves, or the left over gob sieges using arrows.

I'm open to any starters.  Soap making and gathering olive trees would not be that labor intensive in year 1.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Community Fortress) 42.04
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 06:10:15 pm
I plan to pursue Carpenter.  I am offering up to *SUPERIOR* quality beds in exchange to your extra logs while I use this time to practice my carpenter skills.
In "real game" I can see TimelessBob building my Carpenter Workshop order 30 beds.  I'd have a wood stockpile, and the free-loader haulers will mostly like use up the logs nearest my district in the west, and then gather more logs from other districts.  I don't know how he will control not sharing logs between all other 20 districts. 

Unless Wood hauling is disabled for all, and only enabled to those confined within it's district.  But 1 free loader hauler without Wood Hauling labor will just randomly pick up logs and drop off to nearest wood pile.

I was just going to keep track of how many logs came from felled trees in each District and limit the log-using jobs based on that.  We work with the medium we have.

It should not be micro-intensive in the first year since there are plenty of non-olive trees in my district that will be cut down.  The limiting factor is the size of wood stockpile.  2 5x10 will be a start, but as they deplete, 1 of those will be a 5x10 size building for my Lords, so a 50 log wood pile would be a decent "cap" so to speak.

I will wait to name my district as I read up more on its Founder's descriptions; and how the blue print goes.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 06:16:48 pm
I shall claim these:
20. Mr Ast Graverelic - Sanctume
21. Mrs Ast Dikecradle - Sanctume
22. Ast Blockadebolted (baby) - Sanctume
 7. Mr Doren Netwebbed
 8. Mr Doren Inkspear
 9. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Mr Zasit Flickerracks

and please remove these:
28. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - Urdothor, Sanctume
29. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - Urdothor, Sanctume
31. Mr Uzol Manorswamp - Sanctume, Shofet
33. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - Urdothor, Sanctume

Would you have more use for the couple with the artifact bow, the BraidedTreasons?

Probably, I plan to give my citizens winter breaks for military training.  I'd start with wood arrows--can we make those as a civ?  It would be interesting to depend on arrow ammo from the elves, or the left over gob sieges using arrows.

I'm open to any starters.  Soap making and gathering olive trees would not be that labor intensive in year 1.
Well, I could give you the couple and choose another 2 from the list, if you really want the Braidedtreasons
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: chaotic skies on January 26, 2016, 06:40:05 pm
Now that I look at it, me and Gwolf asked for the same people at the same time. I'll pass this year, and let Gwolf get started first. It's not like we need a big military yet anyway :P
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 06:43:50 pm
Now that I look at it, me and Gwolf asked for the same people at the same time. I'll pass this year, and let Gwolf get started first. It's not like we need a big military yet anyway :P
And if you wait till people get settled in, you'll have more resources to borrow starting out.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 26, 2016, 07:41:04 pm
I shall claim these:
20. Mr Ast Graverelic - Sanctume
21. Mrs Ast Dikecradle - Sanctume
22. Ast Blockadebolted (baby) - Sanctume
 7. Mr Doren Netwebbed
 8. Mr Doren Inkspear
 9. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Mr Zasit Flickerracks

and please remove these:
28. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - Urdothor, Sanctume
29. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - Urdothor, Sanctume
31. Mr Uzol Manorswamp - Sanctume, Shofet
33. Mr Mestthos Paddleglows - Urdothor, Sanctume

Would you have more use for the couple with the artifact bow, the BraidedTreasons?

Probably, I plan to give my citizens winter breaks for military training.  I'd start with wood arrows--can we make those as a civ?  It would be interesting to depend on arrow ammo from the elves, or the left over gob sieges using arrows.

I'm open to any starters.  Soap making and gathering olive trees would not be that labor intensive in year 1.
Well, I could give you the couple and choose another 2 from the list, if you really want the Braidedtreasons

That's ok with me.
So you want the Mr and Mrs Doren (whoever are the married couple)?
And I take the Mr and Mrs BraidedTreasons?

So Sanctume:
I shall claim these:
20. Mr Ast Graverelic - Sanctume
21. Mrs Ast Dikecradle - Sanctume
22. Ast Blockadebolted (baby) - Sanctume
 7. Mr Doren Netwebbed
8. Mr Doren Inkspear
 9. Mrs Doren Wondergilt
14. Mr Zasit Flickerracks
28. Mr Braidedtreason Pickhailed - Urdothor, Sanctume
29. Mrs Braidedtreason Hammerrooms - Urdothor, Sanctume

That works?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 26, 2016, 07:46:13 pm
That is correct.
So I now have the married Mr and Mrs Doren.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 26, 2016, 11:37:41 pm
Ok, I've updated the "citizens" list with a color coded list showing who picked whom, but that means that Gwolfski and Shofet are still each one dwarf short.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 27, 2016, 02:26:12 am
1. Mr Iton Packceilings
2. Mrs Iton Faintlantern
3. Mr Feb Wadepaint
4. Mrs Feb Dabbleclasp
5. Feb Lulledcopper (child)
6. Mr Uzol Manorswamp
7. Mr. Cilob Nettrot
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 27, 2016, 02:29:07 am
Ok, I've updated the "citizens" list with a color coded list showing who picked whom, but that means that Gwolfski and Shofet are still each one dwarf short.

well, he took it, so you either allow me to take only 6, or skip me.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 27, 2016, 02:45:30 am
I didn't care about having 7. I'll start with 6. I don't care at this point.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 27, 2016, 03:35:37 am
It's going to be important we breach the caverns for fungi farming, that will be my first priority.

Sanctume, would you be interested in cutting your trees for the year in my plot? I could really use some trees cleared, an I dont want a million logs everywhere.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 27, 2016, 04:22:37 am
eh, in the interests of having a good start to the game, I'll let shofet start with six.  Frankly, I had no idea that so many people were going to want to crowd in to the first year.  Shofet's 7th Founder is "A Disembodied Voice".

Of course, this also means that there won't be any unclaimed dwarves to fetch and carry things, nor to build things, until the next wave of migrants.  We may have to look at an extreme labor shortage for some time, if those new migrants get snatched up by new Players in the following years.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 27, 2016, 05:39:22 am
It's going to be important we breach the caverns for fungi farming, that will be my first priority.

I'm gonna breach them first, cause I need magma. until I get it, the dorfs will have to live in shacks.

@timeless bob, I don't think you notice me accepting the offer of the tree cut down. any one will do.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 27, 2016, 06:15:43 am
Gwolfski, why dont you just contract out my miners? I have two legendary miners, they get there faster. So on your 'blueprint' turn you could use them to mine out what you need, it will go faster, which means ill have more time to dig out my own hole, and anyone else that wants to contract me out. In return I only ask for access to your forges in the future, and a pick when you get the chance. Probably next year i imagine.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 27, 2016, 09:31:42 am
It's going to be important we breach the caverns for fungi farming, that will be my first priority.

Sanctume, would you be interested in cutting your trees for the year in my plot? I could really use some trees cleared, an I dont want a million logs everywhere.

Yes, I'd gladly cut down your trees and help haul the logs away.

I think in terms of the blue print, Sanctume and Shofet's district have this cooperation going on that we can add in our blue print.

1. I think game play wise for TimelessBob, he would just assign some "global" or non-burrowed peasant with wood cutter and wood hauling.

Are we allowed to design a quantum stockpile for wood?  My thinking is that it will not be a cheesy "7 tile feed + 1 minecart dumping in a 1 tile QSP" compact design.  But I was thinking of a rather 2 story building: A ramp going to the 2nd floor with the feeder, then a minecart dumping down a hole to the floor below where the 1-tile QSP is.  This 2z buiding will be 3x3 floor space, have walls and doors and roof.  It functions as QSP, but a bit more "designed" -- What do you all think?

2. Beds made from Sanctume's district, with an enabled "global" furniture hauler put pick up the bed and put it on a bed designation in Shofet's district. 
So, in the RP game we can say that's a trade agreement between district. 

3. On the other side of the trade pact, Sanctume's district needs mechanisms made from Shofet's.
How those 2 mechanism to build a screw press would most likely be done in game would be up to TimelessBob.

A some simple game play approach is to have a "global hauler / free loader" dwarfs doing such things: Item hauler.   

Then if the mechanisms don't arrive this year, we can RP blame TimelessBob the free loaders!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 27, 2016, 09:54:12 am
Yeah there will definately need to be some collaboration to figure out our blueprints. And in some respects we may end up including parts of of other players blueprints in our turns. I have a dwarf in mind to train mechanics, Mr. Iton.

I imagine any mining my dwarves are contracted out to do, I should dig out on my blueprint as well. This will help keep track of labor time used and available, and should be comparable to how long it takes on timeless bobs master blueprint
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 27, 2016, 09:55:05 am
eh, in the interests of having a good start to the game, I'll let shofet start with six.  Frankly, I had no idea that so many people were going to want to crowd in to the first year.  Shofet's 7th Founder is "A Disembodied Voice".

Of course, this also means that there won't be any unclaimed dwarves to fetch and carry things, nor to build things, until the next wave of migrants.  We may have to look at an extreme labor shortage for some time, if those new migrants get snatched up by new Players in the following years.

!SCIENCE! time. 

I see that everyone will have their design, and the "bottle neck," so to speak is the global labors / haulers for resource.

Issues:

1. Limited pick-axes.  For science, how long will 1 dabbling miner take to dig out 1z level of 42x42 size?
2. Eventually, that miner will need to take a break, or if no food around, will instead waste time hunting vermin, ha!
3. Now I am seeing some priority conflicts; and our blue prints may not progress much further if we still have this bottle-neck with limited pick-axes.

4. Now I'm not sure how TimelessBob will actually play it out.  But he will prioritize one thing or another.  Us player can probably influence this after the first round of blueprints are submitted.  For example, I can ask / vote / offer opinion that Shofet dig stone quarry and make xxx stone blocks first for walls.  And maybe Shofet and Gwolfski vote / offer opinion that digging for magma will be more lucrative sooner than walls.

5. Hunger and Thirsts issues.  You guys realize we have 0 in that disctrict, and being burrowed there, we have 0 access to food and drink or water?
Our design will need to have those basic: maybe 3 beds for a 7 pop, food pile, drink pile, maybe 2 to 3 sets of table for each 7.
1 Dwarf eat 2 meals per season = 8 per year; so need [8] prepared meals / raw food.
1 Dwarf drink up to 5 booze per season = 20 per year; so need [20] booze.

6. Now for logistics. If let's say I offer wood cutting services to Shofet also because I want to get his logs hauled to my district so I can skill up carpenter--this can happen "sooner" if Sanctume "woodcutter and wood hauler" is both a citizen of the 2 districts for this year's blue print.  That is to say, this is on top of the global free-loaders that cannot be relied on too much because they will have other hauling to do.  At the same time, let's say I want the stone cleared from my basements; I can either dedicate another of my citizen as stone hauler for Shofet; or enable both wood hauling and stone hauling.  Shofet can do the same thing. 

The science is we will not know how many haulers will progress in the clearing for that year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 27, 2016, 10:00:27 am
Gwolfski, why dont you just contract out my miners? I have two legendary miners, they get there faster. So on your 'blueprint' turn you could use them to mine out what you need, it will go faster, which means ill have more time to dig out my own hole, and anyone else that wants to contract me out. In return I only ask for access to your forges in the future, and a pick when you get the chance. Probably next year i imagine.

Interesting.  So thinking in gameplay for TimelessBob, he can use the digging priority designations and set Shofet's legendary miners to be a global citizen this year with only mining labor enabled, and their bedrooms in Shofet's district.

Shofet would make digs A B C in his district.  Gwolfski will have digs E F G in his.  Sanctume will have dig H in his.  For example, we all deem these priority, and do RP trades, etc.  Eventually, TimelessBob will have the final say on what digging priority for those based on our RP agreements. OR we might end with half-dug designs for that year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 27, 2016, 10:25:41 am
The first year or two is going to be the bottleneck for this I think. Once were all off the ground, or under it
we probably wont have to rely on each other so much.

Then the politics begin.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 27, 2016, 01:26:48 pm
Gwolfski, why dont you just contract out my miners? I have two legendary miners, they get there faster. So on your 'blueprint' turn you could use them to mine out what you need, it will go faster, which means ill have more time to dig out my own hole, and anyone else that wants to contract me out. In return I only ask for access to your forges in the future, and a pick when you get the chance. Probably next year i imagine.

right. i would like to hire.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 27, 2016, 01:45:03 pm
OK, I'm setting up the "phase 0" save right now with the basic Founders included in their burrows, minus the nobles (who are "global").  When I post that, you all may upload that save file and collaborate as much as you like.  Something you may want to think about, for those of you wishing to create an inter-dependent system, is privately sending each-other shorter update saves, possibly submitting a "joint blueprint" at the end of the in-game year.  (Which depends, of course, on how timely the various Players involved take care of their ends of the joint project.)

If you want to designate priorities of activity, then certainly RP that here in the Forum and I'll follow those when I play through the Collective-game. (The collection of all submitted blueprints.)

If you want to designate any of the Nobles from your district as an "item hauler", then their ability to move in between Districts becomes something to trade resources for.  Heck, the Founders may decide to do just that with the Nobles they control, in trade for other resources and skills.

I was just reading up on burrows, and it looks like my assumption that dwarves are confined to those areas is false.  The burrows only apply to workshop orders, and where resources are sourced for those orders (ie: only use resources in the same burrow as a workshop).  Where the dwarves go when they're at leisure is up to the game.  I think I'll designate the roads as "Restricted" traffic zones, and we can just imagine that the dwarves prefer to hang out in their Districts then not, but that they don't have to.

Contrariwise, if you guys would prefer that all of the dwarves are able to travel the map with impunity, but that the only ones that are specifically yours to control would be those seven plus any bonuses, who are there for the greater glorification of their Districts, then I'll change the game to suit, and place a "High" traffic designation on the roads instead.   
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 27, 2016, 02:35:09 pm
Sweet, no citizen burrow restrictions!  Let's all make a central tavern and party all the time!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 27, 2016, 02:49:54 pm
Sweet, no citizen burrow restrictions!  Let's all make a central tavern and party all the time!

OK, that's one vote for "move with impunity".
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 27, 2016, 02:58:22 pm
"Phase 0" (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11720) save is posted! (I'll be updating the "Latest save" right after this

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Arcvasti on January 27, 2016, 03:01:15 pm
Honestly, putting "Restricted" traffic designations won't do much more then gently guide the dwarves. I think we should give it a shot for the first save/year and if its terribly inconvenient we can switch afterwards.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 27, 2016, 03:08:02 pm
Honestly, putting "Restricted" traffic designations won't do much more then gently guide the dwarves. I think we should give it a shot for the first save/year and if its terribly inconvenient we can switch afterwards.

Yeah, we're kinda in uncharted waters here.  (At least I am), it'll be interesting to see what happens.  This one city may eventually house the entire population of the civ, which will be interesting from the "bloodline legacy" perspective too.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 27, 2016, 05:07:09 pm
Sweet, no citizen burrow restrictions!  Let's all make a central tavern and party all the time!

OK, that's one vote for "move with impunity".

On second thought, this may mess up a good estimate if my district's build order is feasable for the 1 year game span.

I mean, if I am focusing on non-mason labor, and build constructed walls and floors, I need to rely on Shofet's cranking out blocks.

I can do a quick dig and put like 4 mason shop to make blocks on repeat in my game;  but the "real" or Shofet's blueprint may have less mason shops.
So, my blue print shows a complete 2z wall, a 3z overhang, and roofed--but the real game may only able to finish 1z in the first year.

Having the burrow and citizen restrictions in place can at least make my blue print closer to an estimated time of completions of key constructions.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 27, 2016, 05:11:18 pm
This is why, as the updated turns are cranked out, you have the option of updating the blueprint plans, or you can also just go with what you planned out originally, no matter how long it takes.  I'm sure you'll get a feel for how fast the compiled game runs in relation to your blueprint games, so that you will be able to guesstimate how long a given project might take in "Real" years.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 27, 2016, 05:18:27 pm
I would like to cancel my looking for metal bar offer, as i have pickaxe services.

edit: I think, if the founders build stuff, stuff can commence swiftly.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 27, 2016, 11:52:19 pm
Alright I'm going to come up with a detailed plan, at least for production.

I think digging priority should go Gwolfski, myself, and then Sanctume, considering how crippled our industries will be until we strike the earth. We should go ahead and plan on breaking up year one into at least two blueprints.

I will post my first blue print shortly.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 28, 2016, 01:06:26 am
I would like to build above ground, but I rather not use logs now, then deconstruct later and use obsidian blocks.

I am guesstimating where Shofet will dig for his stone quarry and set mason shops there.
I think I did 2 miners + 3 mason/mechs.

My Mr Doren Netwebbed (Kiborshar) has Noble: Militia Commander now with 0 weapon/discipline, hehe.  I think he is resigning that position.

It's going to get weird trying to plan / build the layout design, and building temp facilities for basic beds, dine, food/cook and drink/brew--not just my district, but all other citizens.

Are we ok on Quantum Stockpiles?  I'm thinking of a feeder wood pile outside, then up a ramp into a roofed building, with a wood minecart to dump down inside my building 1-tile wood pile.

Good news, we have Kenaf plants which is both oil producing according to the wiki, and above ground cloth plant for either cloth or slurry/paper/sheet.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 28, 2016, 01:11:25 am
I would like to build above ground, but I rather not use logs now, then deconstruct later and use obsidian blocks.

I am guesstimating where Shofet will dig for his stone quarry and set mason shops there.
I think I did 2 miners + 3 mason/mechs.

My Mr Doren Netwebbed (Kiborshar) has Noble: Militia Commander now with 0 weapon/discipline, hehe.  I think he is resigning that position.

It's going to get weird trying to plan / build the layout design, and building temp facilities for basic beds, dine, food/cook and drink/brew--not just my district, but all other citizens.

Are we ok on Quantum Stockpiles?  I'm thinking of a feeder wood pile outside, then up a ramp into a roofed building, with a wood minecart to dump down inside my building 1-tile wood pile.

Good news, we have Kenaf plants which is both oil producing according to the wiki, and above ground cloth plant for either cloth or slurry/paper/sheet.

I like your quantum stockpile buildings idea.  Call them "resource silos" maybe.

However, I should point out that unless 2 or more Players decide to submit a "joint plan", that I'm just going to use the jobs/buildings/excavations that happened in their District for my compilation game.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 28, 2016, 02:49:13 am
I'm having difficulty getting the dwarves to do anything. I assigned mrs iton and mrs braidtreason to the light district so they could pick up equipment, and to the districts i wanted them to work in, but they just picked up their equipment. No mining done in Lakecastle or trees felled.

What am I doing wrong?

Edit: alright now there going, that was weird. It said they didn't have jobs.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 28, 2016, 03:16:02 am
We may need to forgo burrows for awhile. Mrs. Doren can't seek her baby, who has wandered off and is now slowly dieing from thirst.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 28, 2016, 04:07:58 am
The burrows will only use resources in the same burrow as the workshop, otherwise there's the "job cancelled" message.  I think that we may have to forgo burrows as well, since baby Doren shouldn't get so lost.

burrows are defined using "w".  Go ahead and delete them all in your blueprint games.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 28, 2016, 10:00:11 am
Some tips or notes as I played some last night.

1. I'm getting confused looking for my citizens because their nicknames are the similar.
And what is listed in the roster is the English version, but Dwarf Therapist list it with the Dwarvish names. 
So I end up making a squad and adding my citizens there (except kids), then use DT to sort by Squad.

2. I may be doing too much micro-managing, but I wanted to see how much wood I will have after I cut some initial trees.
So I forbid all stones and wood in District P until I have 0 items when I b-C-w.

3. It would be nice to say, I am only using Olive Wood for my wood silo building, but this may be too micro-intensive for TimelessBob because it's a hassle to select chopping olive trees outside my gather zone, then wait for the log to be finished, then start building. 

What do you think TimelessBob?  Would it be too micro-intensive for blue design to say use xxx wood for walls, xxx for floors, etc as far as logs go?

4. It's a rougher start for the empty district that is focused on building their initial basic needs: dig or construct bedrooms, dining; and food and drink sources.  But this issue will be gone (as discussed in the previous posts) without the current burrows so hungry/thirsty citizens will just take from District P.

--

@Shofet - Can I request an obsidian stone only pile feeding 1 or 2 mason shops that makes blocks on repeat?  So that I will just wait for the obsidian stone blocks to build my walls.  I think that even if the mason shops get cluttered, it will be better than dedicating block stockpiles. You can probably just make new mason shops, and put 10 suspended make blocks on the very cluttered shops.

@Gwolfski - I'm in District F, west to yours.  Can you zone your lakes as water source?  I may need to bucket brigade a few tiles on my surface so I can lay down unbroken-tiled farm plots.  Please include a water source zone in your blue print.

Who else are playing that I'm not familiar with?

Sanctume District F looks like will have the following resources, talk to me:
1. Carpenter & Wood Cutter & Wood Hauler -- so will gladly help cut and haul wood logs out of your district. 

2. Depending on how fast construction is, I may have (9 2x2) of (6 3x3) bedrooms set as "unassigned" that can function as public dorm in the first year until the walls are completed.

3. I have olive trees, so when I get my screw press in place, I'll have access to olive oil, and eventually olive soap.  I think there will be a byproduct of Olive Paste which is a solid food ingredient for cooking.  If someone is doing the kitchen, I'd gladly trade these.

4. It also looks like there is Kenaf plant which will be a boon for oil, cloth, and paper.  I suppose I can have a dedicated my miller and presser to make sheets for the Library.

5. As much as I want to dabble with Brewing, I may not have room to worry about storage beyond my needs.  Let me know if someone is pursuing the Booze.
Although I thought about making a smallish tavern, it's low priority in my wants / needs at the moment.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 28, 2016, 11:25:59 am
I played last night but was frustrated with the burrows. I'm going to give it another go without them, from the beginning.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 28, 2016, 11:47:11 am
I played last night but was frustrated with the burrows. I'm going to give it another go without them, from the beginning.

Yep, same here.  I'm driven insane to the point of not committing to laying down logs for my initial walls; or if I should wait for obsidian blocks made from Shofet's District. 

But I have to remember this is only a blue print.  So maybe I should not worry about the actual materials and just build this building layout with any available mats.  And then in my "blue print" specify that I want obsidian blocks used exclusively. 

And the same for digging.  I can't quite get settled in without a temp dwelling for that initial dig.

Maybe the goal for this (phase 1) first 3 seasons (until caravan) is to just design where my digs, and constructed floors and walls, workshops, furnitures, and stockpiles.

And I'll just assume food and drink are available, and the mining will be done, and the materials will be available. 

Any more details beyond this, will depend on the next "real" save after we turn in out initial design. 

I also should stop worrying how TimelessBob will bucket brigade that 1 or 2 obsidian tile on the surface that I need to muddy.  My game may just show a 3x5 with missing farm tiles due to stone floor / bouder, but my blue print will indicate it should be a whole 3x5 farm plot.  Makes sense?

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 28, 2016, 12:14:56 pm
Im probably going to bite the bullet and resort to the tried and true 'wooden shack' approach. I want to dig a quarry pit and put a obsidian ceiling over it, but i think that will just have to wait.

Is there anyway the Light district would let me have access to both picks for this year, if my miners dig for them as well?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 28, 2016, 12:47:43 pm
Im probably going to bite the bullet and resort to the tried and true 'wooden shack' approach. I want to dig a quarry pit and put a obsidian ceiling over it, but i think that will just have to wait.

Is there anyway the Light district would let me have access to both picks for this year, if my miners dig for them as well?

I can get ya two picks, for the reasonable price of a favor later on!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 28, 2016, 12:56:38 pm
Btw, who gets to use the 2 picks this first 3 seasons?

In my game, I enabled miner on the 2 highest miner skills (Shofet's) and let them dig his initial quarry to set mason shops. 

Obviously that is biased towards my needs for blocks. 

And I understand that portion of my game (Shofet's District) is not part of my the blue print.

I am putting a priority to that because I rather not deconstruct log walls and risk collapses later when I can wait a bit for blocks.

Basically, my OCD prevents me from doing a wood shack walls initially, and rather wait for stone blocks because it seems to be fairly accessible.

Maybe, I, Shofet, and Gwolfski and others can post a screen shot of the initial diggings.

Would it be more feasable to say dig 3z of 11x11 in my District, build a mason shop there and make stone blocks out of those for my use? 

Likewise, the other players do the same--and I can mimic those digs in my save and see if those 2 miners can dig them all within the 3 seasons?

And at least give some indication on what can be completed in those 3 seasons.

I'm using 3 seasons as estimate before the caravan, in which time I have a better idea what I can use to trade for my own digging tools, etc?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 28, 2016, 01:05:20 pm
Im probably going to bite the bullet and resort to the tried and true 'wooden shack' approach. I want to dig a quarry pit and put a obsidian ceiling over it, but i think that will just have to wait.

Is there anyway the Light district would let me have access to both picks for this year, if my miners dig for them as well?

I can get ya two picks, for the reasonable price of a favor later on!

Here's an idea for those "favors" 
I see there's plenty of aluminum.  Let's say TimelessBob plays it like a Dungeon Master, and distributes 4 starting  [500] Aluminum coins to each player.
We can then use these [500] coin stacks as "favor" in terms of trade, or do something.  I'm just thinking of hoarding these coins in my district's treasure vault. :D

But you get the idea I hope, for fun. Coins are value-less in game, but we're doing Dwarven Economy, and it will eventually place some sort of value to it. 

So Gwolfski has control of the pick(s) these year? 
Can I asked for your service to dig some basement space for me?

Looking for basement digging services
I offer 6 *quality* beds.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 28, 2016, 01:26:48 pm
well, i got the priority in terms of miner hire, but ill set up a forgr industry pretty soon!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 28, 2016, 03:20:50 pm
I'm going to play the Founders as a "necessary jobs at a premium" workforce.  Whatever you gents don't figure out for yourselves in terms of basic needs, the Founders will pitch in and take care of if they're able, charging that District for the "service". (All role-played of course.)  Looks like burrows are going to be more of a pain in the ass than a contribution to the game, so let's do away with them permanently.

This being the "blueprint" stage, specifying what wood is used for building should be alright - I can just count how many olive logs come from each chopped tree and when they make it to a nearby stockpile, select only olive logs up to the same number for building.  It all comes down to careful book-keeping on some paper outside the game itself.

Coins will certainly soon become valuable as resources become more easily predictable in relation to each-other.  The trick is to create a cycle of needs, coins are a good indication of where the economy hits a snag, because they'll flow along with transactions until there's more going in than coming out.  Of course, this damming of currency is often freed up by trading them in large quantities for luxury goods which have no real use other than to be aesthetically pleasing and to confer some form of social legitimacy via "display of wealth".  Personally, I see currency as a way to trade for resources not yet available - they're basically "IOU" notes and are only really useful when whomever is giving the implied promise to trade the resources the currency is standing in for is known with a certainty that they can do so.  I believe that's called "strong currency".  When things are a bit more risky, and there's a chance that inflation will devalue the amount of future resources that a coin will be able to be traded for in the future, then there's usually less trust that the currency is worth holding onto, and people will trade it immediately for whatever limited resources are available, often then driving the price of whatever's left sky high.  With stuff that can rot or rust, its better to have coins that don't rot or rust in order to get them when you need them.  Likewise bulky items like furniture, because not everyone will have the space to store them.

Most MMO's cheat by creating "gold generators" and "gold sinks" that create money and then destroy it via Player interaction.  The amount of currency per person in a given game remains roughly the same, no matter how many people are playing it, and as a consequence, prices remain fixed.  Our experiment here will be one where the only way to remove currency from the system will be to melt it down into bars once more.  (Using labor, time and resources to do so.) 

The Founders have already sold the anvil to the Lakecastle district, so it seems that until another anvil is bought from the caravan, that they are going to be the only ones capable of smithing coins.  Considering they're also the ones who will be hiring themselves out as a mining team, I think the Founders will request that the price of the anvil be paid over the next 2 years in aluminum coins. However many Aluminum coins are created in that period will equal 5000DB, and that will create the worth of each coin in inter-district trade value. I think 10 stacks of coins will do nicely: 5000 coins will make each one worth 1DB in trade.  Whenever a District wishes to trade using a resource they don't yet have, they'll be able to borrow the appropriate amount of currency from the Founder's Bank to cover the cost and the Founder's Bank will only charge a small fee to provide this service.

As the game progresses, I see other types of metal becoming different denominations of currency as needed for ease of trade.  For instance, if someone is hoarding all the aluminum coins and as a result, there aren't enough coins to go around, then trading those hoarders a stack of 5DB or even 10DB coins might free up enough of the 1DB coins that there's enough to let trade flow freely again, but that will also mean that the sum total of DB able to be traded has increased past 5000, so the individual worth of each coin will be less. (Yay, inflation!)  To deflate the number of DB in circulation, either those 5 and 10DB coins are removed from trade by exchanging them for goods then storing them away or destroying enough currency that only 5000DB of it remain (which means someone loses that wealth, which sucks unless you're an MMO "gold sink" NPC.)

We may find that we'll eventually need more money in circulation anyway, which might make the aluminum 1DB coin worth 1/100 of a DB after awhile, like what's happened to the American Penny.

Oh, this will be very interesting.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 28, 2016, 04:20:46 pm
I'm walling myself off now, so yeah. no problem for me. i starve, my business!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 28, 2016, 04:41:53 pm
I'm walling myself off now, so yeah. no problem for me. i starve, my business!
Interesting. I'll be interested to see how that works with your miners also accepting jobs from others to dig stuff out in other Districts.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 28, 2016, 04:50:58 pm
I never hired miners out to anyone...
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 28, 2016, 04:55:30 pm
I never hired miners out to anyone...

Haha, suicide diggers. I can see TimelessBob now burrowing Gwolfski's diggers preventing them from raiding other's food and booze stock, then watching each of the them hunt for vermin in between digs.  Gwolfski has the lakes so they will be ok in terms of drinks.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 28, 2016, 05:17:14 pm
I never hired miners out to anyone...

My mistake.  I'm also in the middle of organizing a Human Fox Hunt in RL and got a bit mixed up.  Carry on!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 28, 2016, 06:29:47 pm
Sorry I was absent yesterday. The game has started, I believe? I shall get on with it then!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 28, 2016, 09:51:51 pm
Dang-it, the Light food haulers took away my plants from my stock piles! 

And between red spinach, and date palm flower stalks, none of these are brewables. 

I need some initial seeds / plants for brewables: fisher berry, rice, rat weed, and rope reed.

@Shofet: Do you want me to mass chop the trees, and gather plants from your district?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 29, 2016, 09:40:00 am
Summer came with all sorts of fun.  A were-lizard shows up nearest District P where everyone was hungry and thirsty and no bed.
I at least created 2 training spears and shields and created a military squad with Mr. Ast and Mr Zasit and manage to kill the were lizard.

The reports did not show any other damage except for 1 casualty. However, next month, one of the kids from the migration wave turned were-lizard, and over half the pop died including my 2 militia.

Autumn came, and I quickly had to make a depot so I can see what the caravan has for trade.

Lessons learned by me:
1. Burrows messed up a lot of things.  I have a kitchen with plenty of cookable food and barrels, but zero lavish meals were created.
2. Booze despite on repeat, have fruits and barrels, zero were made.
3. Zero mining is really crippling
4. Little to no self-sufficient infra-structure for the non-citizens of my district is a bother to focusing on my blue print.
5. I don't why I did not consider the obsidian already existing in District P (Light), because I forbid them in the beginning to get a more accurate count of how many trees I have after my initial cut trees designations.  Anyway, I could have at least used these stones to make querns and mechanisms for screw press sooner.  And maybe even stone blocks.

6. I would demand at least 1 pick-axe for each district.  I mean, sure we can do with 2 log-> training axe+carpenter to make more logs if there are trees.  Waiting for anvil from caravan is a doable challenge.  But I rarely seen any "0-pick, 0-anvil challenge" and a more acceptable challenge is a "1-pick challenge" given that there is 3 logs from disassembling the wagon +2 animals.

7. A water source, even a small-ish late on the district would be helpful.  But I chose an unbroken flat land to maximize tree farming, and my citizens were thirsty because there was little brewable plants , and harvestable fruits did not happen until summer.

8. Step Ladders should not be included in any stockpile because haulers will take it away on occasions, and leave the herbalist stranded up on trees gather fruits.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 29, 2016, 04:47:12 pm
Sounds like a good political platform:
"As Mayor, I promise that there will be a pick-axe for every District! No longer will you need to wait for another to dig what you wish for yourself!"

Also, I might make something clearer:  Since this is a blueprint, you're welcome to save-scum or re-start any time you like in that game.  This will give you information you don't normally get in DF games, like where ore deposits are, where the various caves are and the ability to que needful things up better the next round through, including deleting all of the burrows if that makes things easier.  By the time you post your blue-print, you'll have a pretty good idea what that year probably has in store for everyone, but what you won't know is exactly how everyone else decides to deal with it.  That uncertainty, and the measures you guys take to insure against it is what will shape The City here in the first few years.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 29, 2016, 05:30:24 pm
Yeah, I plan to restart from the first save, and re-make the military squads so I can sort by district citizens (except the kids), then save this for save-scumming.

I still want to test burrow only for my citizens as this will give me a more accurate speed of construction.

I got my screen shot plans of 2 buildings I want, but I will probably switch their priority build order. 

--
District F will be named "The Olive Grove" [TOG]

[TOG] 1. Looking for obsidian stone boulders.
Offering log furniture (bed, cabinet, chest, barrel, door, table, or chair)

[TOG] 2. Looking for wood logs to chop and haul.
Offering tree cutting services and wood hauling to clear off your district

[TOG] 3. Looking for lake/pond as water source access.
Offering 1 barrel of booze per season of access

[TOG] 4. Looking kenaf plants, rice plants, rope reed, rat weed.  Looking for rights and access to gather plants from your district.
Offering 1 barrel of prepared food, lavish meals per season

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on January 29, 2016, 06:11:47 pm
question: could you use soem of the unclaimed didtricts to pick plants/ fish?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 29, 2016, 06:42:25 pm
question: could you use some of the unclaimed districts to pick plants/ fish?

Good question.  Those Districts haven't been claimed by anybody else, so they're just empty lots right now...

I'm going to say, yes.  Anything that doesn't remove a limited resource from an unclaimed District (I'm including lumbering here, since wood can produce permanent furniture) should be able to be harvested.

Good idea.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 29, 2016, 10:35:40 pm
@ Sanctume, yes go ahead and clear as much lumber as possible. Im going to assign a few of my own dwarves to plant gathering, im assuming in the final cut they will gather with your guys and the founders and food will be shared. At least initially.

I keep telling myself we just need to get past the first year.

Also, are humans and elves in range?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 29, 2016, 10:48:30 pm
My lavish meals are getting stolen by District P's haulers, lol. 

I'll leave it up to TimelessBob to handle how much those prepared lavish meals when it comes to Caravan day.

I think between Shofet and Sanctume's plant gather power, we will have plenty of prepared meals between us to buy needed caravan items.

Although I still prefer to use stone blocks for my buildings, I will leave that up to TimelessBob.

The only things I have not done so far is dig since I am unsure if that can be done in the first 3 seasons, so doing above ground rooms takes longer to get dorm, dining, and bedrooms up.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 30, 2016, 06:35:59 pm
Found out something interesting about the cosmology of the world that The City is a part of: The sun rises in the south-west and sets in the south-east.  I literally arcs through only the southern sky, so all shadows point northward.  Likewise, the moon.  It's because The City is situated so far to the north of The Labyrinth.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on January 30, 2016, 09:54:43 pm
I have a save I want to upload, but I'm having difficulties with dwarf depot. Do I have to compress the file first?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on January 30, 2016, 10:00:04 pm
When is the first blueprint due?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on January 31, 2016, 12:03:56 am
I have a save I want to upload, but I'm having difficulties with dwarf depot. Do I have to compress the file first?

Probably, there is a max file size limited for dffd
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on January 31, 2016, 01:04:32 am
1-year blueprints are due next Wednesday,  (the 3rd of February) by noon forum time.  Whatever you have, save the file and compress it (I use the freeware 7-zip (http://www.7-zip.org/) utility myself), then post it by that time.  Whatever you've done to your District in that save is what I will be using as the blueprint for your District in that year.  (If you don't post a blueprint save-game, that nothing gets done at that District that year, and it becomes an available District again for other Players.  However, even if you post a save where nothing has been done in your District, you'll remain in control of it for the next time.  On the other side of the scale, if you post a save where ten years of play has created this elaborate building and tunnel system, then I'll be using that instead as the blue-print, and however much of that elaborate plan gets completed, that's where it will be in the next save-game.  A Player can choose to submit the same elaborate file for the next ten in-game years, and I'll continue building and excavating it as much as the miners and builder's allow.  Just so long as the Player continues submitting a save each time Founder's Day comes around again. in the Forum Game.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on February 01, 2016, 11:00:11 pm
The Save File: Wanderland y202 The Olive Grove.7z (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11728)

The Olive Grove (District F) (imgur album) (http://imgur.com/a/alGNT)

It is now the 1st of Granite in the year 203.  One year has passed in The Olive Grove district.
(http://i.imgur.com/cYtJlWP.png)

Citizens

Our Military
`Mr Ast' Mondulzaneg, "`Mr Ast' Graverelic", militia captain   
He is married to `Mrs Ast' Dikecradle and has one child:  `Ast' Blockadebolted.
He is eighty-two years old, born on the 27th of Timber in the year 121. 

`Mr Zasit' Nelasled, "`Mr Zasit' Flickerracks", Wrestler   
He is a bachelor.
He is ninety-three years old, born on the 22nd of Slate in the year 110. 
(http://i.imgur.com/gPE9xFL.png)

The Bookkeeper
`Mrs Ast' Imusharban, "`Mrs Ast' Dikecradle", bookkeeper   
She is married to `Mr Ast' Graverelic and has one child:  `Ast' Blockadebolted.
She is eighty-one years old, born on the 16th of Malachite in the year 122. 
(http://i.imgur.com/LBtJf39.png)

The Child
`Ast' Medtobalath, "`Ast' Blockadebolted", Dwarven Child   
He is the son of `Mrs Ast' Dikecradle and `Mr Ast' Graverelic.  He is a worshipper of Medtob and a worshipper of The Leafy Pass. 
He is two years old, born on the 3rd of Galena in the year 201. 
(http://i.imgur.com/D5mcq3A.png)

The Carpenter
`Mr Doren' Kiborshar, "`Mr Doren' Netwebbed", Administrator,   
He is a bachelor.  He is a worshipper of Lun the Cavern of Bejeweling, a worshipper of The Rumor of Knots, a worshipper of Ubbul, a worshipper of The Celebrated Butterfly of Plates and a dubious worshipper of Thukkan. 
He is forty-six years old, born on the 2nd of Opal in the year 157.
(http://i.imgur.com/tXBgdPU.png)

The Farmer
`Mr Braidedtreason' Tekkudilun, "`Mr Braidedtreason' Pickhailed", Herbalist   
He is married to `Mrs Braidedtreason' Hammerrooms and has one child:  Kol Problemwhipped.  He is a worshipper of Immast Fairsaviors. 
He is eighteen years old, born on the 22nd of Opal in the year 185. 
(http://i.imgur.com/XsPfIgW.png)

The Farmer's Wife
`Mrs Braidedtreason' Nilmosus, "`Mrs Braidedtreason' Hammerrooms", Administrator,
She is married to `Mr Braidedtreason' Pickhailed and has one child:  Kol Problemwhipped. 
She is twenty-one years old, born on the 18th of Sandstone in the year 182. 
(http://i.imgur.com/alQ4UNN.png)

The Blue print
The Olive Grove is mostly a preserved gathering zone for olive trees, cambola trees, and date palms.  There are also rice plants, kenaf plants, and passion fruit vines that locally grow.
(http://i.imgur.com/m2W6ot7.png)

Main Hall
The first priority in construction is the main hall with a 4 bed dormitory, 6 table set dining room, food stocks and food preparation workshops.
(http://i.imgur.com/nbMY3Uj.png)

The Northeast Farm
The second priority would be the preparation of above ground farm lands in the northeast.
(http://i.imgur.com/hRAzawx.png)

The Wood Silo
The third construction project is the wood silo located in the southeast.
(http://i.imgur.com/nKGq4HA.png)

The Wood Workshop
The next construction project is the wood workshop building consisting of the single wood stockpile, carpenter, carftdwarf shop, and wood furnace in the first floor.  Ashery and Soap Maker in the second floor.
(http://i.imgur.com/1IZ7iVN.png)

The Barracks
The next construction is a simple enclosure of the barracks that is under the open skies.
(http://i.imgur.com/pYkbLpj.png)

The Farm Roof
The northeast farm roof is constructed next and completed by late autumn..
(http://i.imgur.com/mjyPn2H.png)

The Bedroom Apartments
The first 4 bedroom apartments on the first floor are constructed next that begins in early winter.
This is followed by the next 4 bedrooms on the second floor and roofed, as well as adding a temporary simple office for the book-keeper, Mrs Ast.
(http://i.imgur.com/DbFyW06.png)

The Olive Grove, Wall and Moat
The remainder of winter consists of the first wall around the grove, as well as the 5 remaining bedroom walls.  The second floor walls are still under construction by the end of the year 1.
(http://i.imgur.com/6LXO5qR.png)
(http://i.imgur.com/jI5XvbB.png)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on February 02, 2016, 05:07:33 pm
can i post my save game about 12 hrs later than the deadline? cos i wont have aces to decent internet untill then
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 02, 2016, 05:11:02 pm
can i post my save game about 12 hrs later than the deadline? cos i wont have aces to decent internet untill then

I can push back the deadline, sure.  Everyone else gets to have the new deadline too, if they want it.
I'll start the combined game on Friday the 5th, using whatever save games have been posted by midnight forum time on Thursday the 4th.

shofet: try using 7-zip (http://www.7-zip.org/) to compress your save game, then upload that compressed file to dffd.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on February 02, 2016, 05:22:09 pm
and, word of advice, always try to use the .zip format. easier for everyone to open it.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on February 02, 2016, 05:31:37 pm
My first game ended with a were-lizard killing over half the pop.

I save scummed once, and this time no were-lizard, but I did sorta planned with a military. 2 of my citizens in my district, and 10 in the District P.

I only had 1 carpenter shop initially, but there was a weapon and armor stock pile in P, so somehow my 2 guys were training wrestling instead of any melee (uniform was set to individual melee choice).

Something else is screwy with burrow as there were no lavish prepared meals created despite having all that available to make in my district.  So, there was little stuff I can trade.  Mostly wood cups and the training weapons traded ok. 

I end up using a bone carver to make bone shell (turtle pond shells): gauntlets, helms and leggings.   Used leather to make 2 armor, high boots, and cloak.  Still had no weapon, so I did not bother trying to setup a forge.  There were mining picks: copper 44, iron 220, decorated bronze picks cost more than the iron, and 1 steel pick at 700+. 

I dug out 2 levels of that square chuck of rock in P, carved matchstick bedrooms, and even furnished it for the rest of the pop.  Made a quick still, kitchen, dininig, and food stock inside with 2 stone doors.

Fortunately, no were-lizard attack, so my last save went peaceful.

I did have to make a depot when the merchant show up.

I made 4 masons in P and had 2 make blocks on repeat--this seems to satisfy my need for blocks that I can safely estimate that I can use stone blocks for flooring instead of logs.  I ran out of logs after consuming both my District and Shofet's district tree cuttings.  I used over 200 logs for flooring.

I did not really min-max my citizens to specific jobs, except for Mr Doren the carpenter.  Focused on farming labors and a few wood crafting.

I could not quite figure out how I got kenaf seeds for planting.  It's either it was milled.  Is the Farmer's Workshop Plant Processing work on above ground cloth plants?  Because I have kenaf threads.  I am waiting for mining pick before I do excavations in my district, as I want to set up a kenaf -> clothing / paper workshops in the future.

Also, anyone know if there are issues regarding to multiple tavern / library / temple locations?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on February 02, 2016, 05:34:05 pm
and, word of advice, always try to use the .zip format. easier for everyone to open it.

I just followed TimelessBob's use of 7-zip. 

I can upload a regular zip (compressed folder in Windows) too if needed.  Please let me know.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: High tyrol on February 02, 2016, 09:13:44 pm
ptw
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 03, 2016, 06:32:59 am
and, word of advice, always try to use the .zip format. easier for everyone to open it.

I just followed TimelessBob's use of 7-zip. 

I can upload a regular zip (compressed folder in Windows) too if needed.  Please let me know.

No need.  Your file unzipped just fine.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on February 04, 2016, 04:58:31 pm
http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11741

I played till fall. I probably dug out too much. Priority to should go to the other districts for mining. Getting the bridge up is priority one in my district.

 Here are my orders.

Assign mining, stonecrafting and engraving to Mrs. Iton. Deactivate all gathering besides stone.
Assign mining, masonry, architecture and engraving to Mrs. Feb. Deactivate all gathering besides stone.
Assign Masonry to Mr. Feb. Deactivate all gathering besides stone. Deactivate metalcrafting, armorsmithing.
Assign Mechanics to Mr. Iton. Deactivate all gathering besides stone.
Assign plant gathering to Mr. Uzol

I create two stonepiles, one with everything except obsidian, one only obsidian. Mr. Iton is ordered to make mechanisms from the non obsidian pile all year, switching to obsidian if neccesary. Mr. Feb gets to work making obsidian blocks. If Mrs. Feb gets down time she should also have a workshop to make obsidian blocks with. Mrs. Iton should spend all of her downtime creating obsidian stonepots. Mr. Uzol can assist Olivegrove and be a general hauler.

Priority for my dwarves is getting Olivegrove secured and to dig for magma forges for Lakecastle.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on February 04, 2016, 05:00:26 pm
there is only one cavern layer, 120 levels below the surface!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on February 04, 2016, 05:59:57 pm
there is only one cavern layer, 120 levels below the surface!!!!!!!!

Wow that's deep.  So, definitely magma-safe minecarts filled with magma and bring up to the surface sounds like a good idea when we have magma-safe metals. What kind of metals did you find?

IIRC, District P (City of Light or Founder's District?) is just one outdoor warehouse.  I can't wait to see what amenities will be made there: tavern, grand dining hall, dorms or rooms, kitchens?

Speaking of kitchens, I'm curious how multiple dining rooms will behave specially when food stockpiles can be all over.

I'm concerned that if lavish meals aren't available, we may not have enough to trade for any picks and anvils from the caravan. 

I bet if Mr Shofet makes batches of obsidian cups, their trade value will be 3x more than wood cup.  We want at least 1 pick and 1 anvil for each district.  Well, there's plenty of mechanisms too, just in case.


Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Gwolfski on February 04, 2016, 06:29:57 pm
well, i built tavern, library, found zinc and gold. there also is aluminum. Staircse is deep as hell

save: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11743

ill get the description around 8-9am GMT time.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 04, 2016, 06:46:02 pm
OK!  Well done, you guys!  Once Urdothor posts his save (or midnight rolls around), then I'll get started on the Combined Game.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on February 04, 2016, 06:54:58 pm
Sorry I'm a little behind everyone. Been a really bad week for playing.  :-\

Should have my save up before the deadline, completed or not.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on February 04, 2016, 07:20:06 pm
The staircase I dug down to the caverns in Lemducim should be the very last thing dug. I would also consider deactivating hauling when you breach, as their our blowguns and blowdarts littering the place.

There seems to be an excess amount of candy as well! And a road through the caverns on the western side going north to south. The road actually cuts through a candy spire. Pretty neat. I propose a future goal of patching the tunnel road, and establing a trade depot with access to the deep road, as a departure point for merchants and visitors in time of siege or danger. Or because their elves.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 04, 2016, 07:40:08 pm
The staircase I dug down to the caverns in Lemducim should be the very last thing dug. I would also consider deactivating hauling when you breach, as their our blowguns and blowdarts littering the place.

There seems to be an excess amount of candy as well! And a road through the caverns on the western side going north to south. The road actually cuts through a candy spire. Pretty neat. I propose a future goal of patching the tunnel road, and establing a trade depot with access to the deep road, as a departure point for merchants and visitors in time of siege or danger. Or because their elves.

The City of Lights is directly adjacent to the northernmost Dwarven Fortress from worldgen.  The group that founded The City of Lights is named "The Great Road" for this very reason.  The fact that the road cuts through a candy spire is pretty neat, I agree.  Perhaps The City will self-segregate into "Uptown" and "Downtown"with "The Suburbs" somewhere in the middle.  (Perhaps not, but it's an interesting concept.)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 04, 2016, 07:45:45 pm
Sorry I'm a little behind everyone. Been a really bad week for playing.  :-\

Should have my save up before the deadline, completed or not.

So long as you have something posted before the deadline, don't worry about how complete it is or not.  All part of the game.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Shofet on February 04, 2016, 08:27:57 pm
@ Sanctume, if your down for it, you could designate a basement level in the obsidian to be dug out, and I could base myself there for the turn. We could ignore my district for the turn, and in return my dwarves could work and hunker down in your district. This would make it alot easier to secure our dwarves this first year.

Creating 5 settlements with 2 picks is just a little too ridiculous in one year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Urdothor on February 04, 2016, 08:46:17 pm
Nearing the end of the first year and I have one request for trade.
Cats.

Edit: My stockpiles were full of vermin most of the time, and I want a cat or two to help keep it clear.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 04, 2016, 09:46:25 pm
Alright you guys, double-check the trade screen (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=155674.msg6750706#msg6750706) and be sure to make your trade deals final before the end of the turn.  All the ones currently marked in Green are the ones that I'll be using, all the others aren't finalized and will be disregarded.  (I'll leave them up until the Combined Game has completed a year, but I won't use any that haven't been finalized.)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 04, 2016, 11:13:04 pm
I accept the founders districts counter offer on the picks, though I implore the unamed district to allow my miners to dig out his excavations for expediency.

I will handle any stone good production needed by Olivegrove for this turn, be it blocks, mechanisms, etc.

I will also offer 3 free stone mechanisms of unknown value to any district for support in Mr. Febs bid to become manager. If approved by the city council, Mr. Feb would resign his post as CMD.

Mr. Feb runs on a platform of being a selfless dwarf, focused on the success and prosperity of the City as a whole.

Edit: deactivated a few more labors on Mr. Feb
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Urdothor on February 04, 2016, 11:26:35 pm
I accept the founders districts counter offer on the picks, though I implore the unnamed district to allow my miners to dig out his excavations for expediency.

That would be me, correct?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 04, 2016, 11:38:36 pm
Yes.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Urdothor on February 04, 2016, 11:47:34 pm
Yes.

Well, As I haven't carved out much, that works for me. I accept having Shofet's miners do my mining

Haven't finished my year, but I have 1 more small thing left and I'll be done.

Edit: Uploading it as we speak, may take a little bit of time.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on February 05, 2016, 12:36:31 am
@ Sanctume, if your down for it, you could designate a basement level in the obsidian to be dug out, and I could base myself there for the turn. We could ignore my district for the turn, and in return my dwarves could work and hunker down in your district. This would make it alot easier to secure our dwarves this first year.

Creating 5 settlements with 2 picks is just a little too ridiculous in one year.

You're welcome to claim the 4 2x3 bedrooms I designated on the 2nd floor, assuming those first 8 bedrooms are constructed by winter.

Can you make some obsidian swords too?  That will be better than training spear/axe/swords
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Urdothor on February 05, 2016, 12:51:16 am
http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11744 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11744)
That's my turn.
I gave all my dwarves all the same skills.
~All the Hauling
~All the Wood Using/Crafting skills(carpentry, wood cutting, etc)
~All the Farming skills
~Brewing and Food Skills
~All skills related to the creation and acquirement of plant foods

First thing is to let Shofet carve out the hallway and the first room, and create a stock pile there.
Begin gathering plants on low priority
Carve out the next room, and craft training axes from the wood of the first tree the founders cut down.
Begin chopping down trees starting from the north.
Channel down and create the first farm plot, and build a wood ceiling over it.
Carve out the last 2 rooms, 1 as a stockpile, one as a meeting area.
Build the wall around the entrance
Build a kitchen and a still
Craft barrels from the wood
Start producing meals and alcohol
Plant seeds of passion fruit vine, rice, and fisher berry in the farm.

Edit: I didn't do quite as much as the others did, but I haven't had as much time this week. I only went through into fall. I didn't end up needing anything else yet though, so, this should work, mostly.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 05, 2016, 01:20:36 am
My main concern is my dwarves safety. I played through 3 times, and twice a were showed up. My save had like 4 dead, but none of them were mine, except for uzol the weaponsmith, who mooded and went insane.

So since none of it screwed with the blueprint, i chugged along. Not really feeling like risking it. Besides, I have 4 adults who all have too much work to build a secure place for themselves this year.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 05, 2016, 01:22:43 am
http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11744 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11744)
That's my turn.
I gave all my dwarves all the same skills.
~All the Hauling
~All the Wood Using/Crafting skills(carpentry, wood cutting, etc)
~All the Farming skills
~Brewing and Food Skills
~All skills related to the creation and acquirement of plant foods

First thing is to let Shofet carve out the hallway and the first room, and create a stock pile there.
Begin gathering plants on low priority
Carve out the next room, and craft training axes from the wood of the first tree the founders cut down.
Begin chopping down trees starting from the north.
Channel down and create the first farm plot, and build a wood ceiling over it.
Carve out the last 2 rooms, 1 as a stockpile, one as a meeting area.
Build the wall around the entrance
Build a kitchen and a still
Craft barrels from the wood
Start producing meals and alcohol
Plant seeds of passion fruit vine, rice, and fisher berry in the farm.

Edit: I didn't do quite as much as the others did, but I haven't had as much time this week. I only went through into fall. I didn't end up needing anything else yet though, so, this should work, mostly.

Bravo!  Ok, so now I'll be looking over each save and writing down a master-list of the jobs that need to be done, including their various stated priorities.
I'll also be keeping running lists of the resources sourced from and consumed by each District as I play through the Combined Game using that master list of jobs. As I play through it, I'll post updates and maybe even Armok-vision shots of each new development until we reach a stopping place (were-creature attack, merchants, special mood, ect...), where I'll then post the updated game file and the various Districts will be able to decide how to respond.

Did we ever choose who got to be nicknamed "Mr Beard" and "Eva"?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Urdothor on February 05, 2016, 01:25:04 am
Mrs Lorbam was going to be Eva, and Mr. Beard was moved into another district, District H I believe? The military district.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 05, 2016, 03:51:40 am
Tenable all wood and crafts and farm on the yellow guy, mining stone working and metalworkingand mechanic on the grey one. Then enable fishing farming on everyone rslse. Everyone has healthcare.

Please make sure the inn and library have the same names.

Mining : Mine out the basements and the stairs down to the forge room first. Then dig everything else. Don't dig the big open pit.

Trade: I traded 4 zinc bars and a spiked wood ball for a bronze bar and copper axe. Then I made a bronze pick. I ordered lots of sand bags too.

Make 3 zinc crafts for the anvil payment.

Also, make every instrument that can be zinc, bone or wood. Also makes cups. The masons is linked to an obsidian only stockpile

There's a dormitory in the inn basement. The kitchen makes easy meals every now and again. The farm plot is see to rope reed and ratweed. There is a millstone that makes slurry, which are pressed into sheets. Is there anything else needed for books?

Also, please extend the stairs to cavern layer. But seal it off immediately.

Mind the lava pit.



Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 05, 2016, 08:41:27 am
The ore of zinc, sphalerite, is magma proof. I'm going to be spamming sphalerite mechanisms. Considering my supply of obsidian is limited.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 05, 2016, 07:11:28 pm
@ Sanctume, if your down for it, you could designate a basement level in the obsidian to be dug out, and I could base myself there for the turn. We could ignore my district for the turn, and in return my dwarves could work and hunker down in your district. This would make it alot easier to secure our dwarves this first year.

Creating 5 settlements with 2 picks is just a little too ridiculous in one year.

You're welcome to claim the 4 2x3 bedrooms I designated on the 2nd floor, assuming those first 8 bedrooms are constructed by winter.

Can you make some obsidian swords too?  That will be better than training spear/axe/swords

So, is this the current agreement?  Am I disregarding the Lemducim blueprint for this year?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Arcvasti on February 05, 2016, 09:29:58 pm
Is there anything else needed for books?

You need either book bindings or scroll rollers made from most any substance and then thread for books only.



Well crap, now I'm having a hard time finding a gimmick for my district since there's already a library in place. Eh, whatever.

Current idea is having a hospital adjoining the library and have my scholars teach students which end of a scalpel is the sharp one and writing medical texts about which organs dwarves don't actually need[All the liver does, for example, is store the soul, and it can get nasty when the soul gets infected and you have to operate]. I don't THINK we have a major medical focused district yet, or even really a hospital set up.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Blueprint phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 05, 2016, 09:56:10 pm
Is there anything else needed for books?

You need either book bindings or scroll rollers made from most any substance and then thread for books only.



Well crap, now I'm having a hard time finding a gimmick for my district since there's already a library in place. Eh, whatever.

Current idea is having a hospital adjoining the library and have my scholars teach students which end of a scalpel is the sharp one and writing medical texts about which organs dwarves don't actually need[All the liver does, for example, is store the soul, and it can get nasty when the soul gets infected and you have to operate]. I don't THINK we have a major medical focused district yet, or even really a hospital set up.

Nope, no hospital yet.  A teaching hospital is a wonderful idea!  I might suggest that there be cells for captured specimens of were-creature too.  (Research potential to finding the cure for lycanthropy.)  Having more than one library in a City isn't necessarily a bad thing - one could be a legal library, the other a private one for medical staff only...  All sorts of fun.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus
Post by: Sanctume on February 05, 2016, 10:16:23 pm
@ Sanctume, if your down for it, you could designate a basement level in the obsidian to be dug out, and I could base myself there for the turn. We could ignore my district for the turn, and in return my dwarves could work and hunker down in your district. This would make it alot easier to secure our dwarves this first year.

Creating 5 settlements with 2 picks is just a little too ridiculous in one year.

You're welcome to claim the 4 2x3 bedrooms I designated on the 2nd floor, assuming those first 8 bedrooms are constructed by winter.

Can you make some obsidian swords too?  That will be better than training spear/axe/swords

So, is this the current agreement?  Am I disregarding the Lemducim blueprint for this year?

It seems so, since there is a shortage of picks, until we get more from the caravan.

Can Shofet's masons work on the stones in the Founder's District? you have plenty there. :)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 05, 2016, 11:18:14 pm
Yes ignore Lemducim this turn.
Title: Who owns a finished good?
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 07, 2016, 03:14:30 am
With Lemducim excavating other District's minerals this turn, but offering for Mr Feb's bid to become City Manager to buy votes with stone mechanisms, an interesting economic issue has presented itself:  Who owns a finished good?  Is it the District who provides the raw material without explicitly charging for it, or is it the District that produces the item out of that raw material?

I'm leaning toward this: Unless a District specifically sells the raw material out of their District, that it's considered part of that District's "raw wealth".  If another District volunteers to work that raw material into a finished good without attempting to transfer ownership of the raw material to their District first, then the finished good is still owned by the original owners who have just gotten work done as a philanthropic gesture from another District.  However, in the case of unwanted wealth, such as too many stones or logs, a District may offer to allow other Districts to come and take away the unwanted material "for free", and as such will lose ownership of that raw material from the moment it's carted off.

This is particularly interesting when looking at the Lemducim/Olive Grove combined turn: Whatever stone goods the Lemducim District produces during the next year, they'll still owe the Founder's District 50% the value of.  If, however, the mineral rights of the minerals from the Olive Grove District remain with them, then all the furniture and soap that the Lemducim District promised to trade for those goods would be in trade for items they already own.  If, however, Lemducim gains ownership of those finished goods through the act of converting them from raw materials, the Olive Grove District is paying both raw materials AND finished goods for the Lemducim finished goods. (With Lemducim supplying only the labor and time needed to convert the raw resources into finished goods.  Is this a fair trade?)

This choice will have interesting ramifications on who holds the wealth in the City: If a metalworker can gain ownership of a bar of metal simply by turning it into an item, or a jeweler gain ownership of a raw gem simply by cutting the jewel or gain ownership of a finished good simply by encrusting it with jewels, then the economic structure of The City will certainly become a different system.   Only when an item is no longer able to be improved would it become "stable wealth" (ie: not able to have its ownership unilaterally shifted).


(Incidentally, the position of City Manager is appointed by the Mayor or the Expedition Leader if no Mayor is yet elected. The Expedition Leader, Miss Light Earthenfrost, has no problem with Mr Feb stepping down as Chief Medical Dwarf and replacing Miss Light Dreamstorches, so long as Mr Light Justicepaper replaces Mr Feb as CMD. However, she will listen to the advice of the City Council in case they have other ideas.)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 07, 2016, 04:01:53 am
I was thinking about this myself. I think the raw resources of a district are that districts resources, even after being processed, unless an agreement is reached. So here is a new, sweeping proposal.

Considering I am now not digging in my disctrict this year, I would propose that whatever stone products Olivegrove need be mined and crafted by my dwarves, from Olivegrove district. I also offer all my lumber to Olivegrove, in return for room, board, and any non obsidian stone mine out this turn in Olivegrove.

I would also like to request everyone I dig for pledge as few stones in turn, so the dwarves of Lemducim may generate some wealth for themsleves this year. That should pay for the picks as well as leave something over for next year.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Urdothor on February 07, 2016, 04:23:24 am
I would also like to request everyone I dig for pledge as few stones in turn, so the dwarves of Lemducim may generate some wealth for themsleves this year. That should pay for the picks as well as leave something over for next year.
District R (I should name it eventually), will not be digging into stone this year, but I will pledge food and alcohol for when you start up.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 07, 2016, 06:21:40 am
Or the founders could defer payment until sometime next year for the picks.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 07, 2016, 11:51:07 am
Oooh, it's the "value" from creating supply and demand; or perceived scarcity versus abundance. 

Let's look at lumber.
The trees are finite for cutting "within" 1 district. 
Cutting it all will create abundance.
But the trees growth date makes it renewable, but in a scarce rate.

See, the value to obtain a pick-axe is very high initially because it is scarce at 2 quantity. 
So, I can see us selling, trading the abundant trees (or other natural resources) found in our district. 
But this is just raw materials.

Now let's look at Finished Goods.   
I did an auto-repeat in making beds, barrels, cabinets, doors, training axes, shields; and other handful of tools.  The quality for beds I had at most *SUPERIOR* quality and ≡EXCEPTIONAL≡ nor ☼MASTERWORK☼ yet.  Let's look at beds as non-trading items and more RP items. The quality factor will create that scarcity demands initially until Mr Doren's Carpenter skills becomes higher--at which point, it will look like superior and exceptional qualities are common, and masterworks are rare.

My points:
Raw materials has value.
Time to gather and haul the raw materials has value.
Skills to process has value.
Quality of Finished of goods has value.

Mr Doren who I want to gain carpenter skills will need more Raw wood to skill up. 
I rather make carpenter items out of raw wood, than use wood flooring for more experience skill points.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 07, 2016, 02:23:38 pm
might is suggest workshop [P]rofiles? at least set them for my workshops so only my dwarves can use them
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 08, 2016, 01:37:03 am
might is suggest workshop [P]rofiles? at least set them for my workshops so only my dwarves can use them

Good idea.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 08, 2016, 01:59:11 am
also, appologies for my butchered wtiting. I hate autocorrect, and use a phonewith a tiny screen.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 08, 2016, 04:48:26 am
I've been reading up on economic theory...  :o  My head is swimming, but I think I've come across how currency in our City might be applied to an actual value.  The whole idea behind straight barter is something that economists call "a coincidence of needs".  Basically, two people with needs for the resources the other has, decide on a trade of those resources so that both needs are satisfied.  If one person needs more or a particular resource than the other needs the resource that's offered, the one with the greater need will trade more of their resource to fulfill the need they have, resulting in a basic "market price".  The problem with a straight barter system is that sometimes the person with a specific need will not have the correct resources to trade with the person who has the needed resources, so no trade would occur, leading to the need going unfulfilled.  So, in a straight barter system, people would attempt to stock up on basic needs like food or salt, which everybody needed and barter those necessities for whatever other resources they needed. 

These stockpiles of basic necessities were difficult to trade and re-trade, however, which led to the creation of "promissory notes" in the form of coins. Coins were used as a more easily carried version of those basic necessities, and could be exchanged for those necessities by anyone who wished to gain those necessities from someone who had them.

Quote
Bartering has several problems, most notably that it requires a "coincidence of wants". For example, if a wheat farmer needs what a fruit farmer produces, a direct swap is impossible as seasonal fruit would spoil before the grain harvest. A solution is to trade fruit for wheat indirectly through a third, "intermediate", commodity: the fruit is exchanged for the intermediate commodity when the fruit ripens. If this intermediate commodity doesn't perish and is reliably in demand throughout the year (e.g. copper, gold, or wine) then it can be exchanged for wheat after the harvest. The function of the intermediate commodity as a store-of-value can be standardized into a widespread commodity money, reducing the coincidence of wants problem. By overcoming the limitations of simple barter, a commodity money makes the market in all other commodities more liquid.

Many cultures around the world eventually developed the use of commodity money. Ancient China, Africa, and India used cowry shells. Trade in Japan's feudal system was based on the koku – a unit of rice. The shekel was an ancient unit of weight and currency. The first usage of the term came from Mesopotamia circa 3000 BC and referred to a specific weight of barley, which related other values in a metric such as silver, bronze, copper etc. A barley/shekel was originally both a unit of currency and a unit of weight.[65]

Wherever trade is common, barter systems usually lead quite rapidly to several key goods being imbued with monetary properties[citation needed]. In the early British colony of New South Wales, rum emerged quite soon after settlement as the most monetary of goods. When a nation is without a currency it commonly adopts a foreign currency. In prisons where conventional money is prohibited, it is quite common for cigarettes to take on a monetary quality. Contrary to popular belief, precious metals have rarely been used outside of large societies. Gold, in particular, is sufficiently scarce that it has only been used as a currency for a few relatively brief periods in history.

~Wikipedia

So, what we might use as the basis for value is exchange for a necessary base good: The Wood Log

I like Sanctume's idea of making a Wood Log the basis against which the standard of value and money is based, which would make the unharvested value of a tree an actual investment, since having less wood circulating around in trade would make each log worth more in exchange for goods, but ONLY if a District had a scarcity of wood relative to its needs for that wood. (Which wouldn't be the case if a District was able to harvest trees from unassigned Districts.  Doing so would actually devalue the harvested District, making certain ones also more valuable than others for future development plans.) 

The Civ name is "The Merchants of Wood", so that also ties in nicely, which is cool.

Another idea would be to make wooden barrels of booze be the inter-district trade goods instead, with the various quality levels of booze creating the variation of coinage value, based on the happiness of the dwarves who would drink it.  This would also work as trade-in value of decorated barrels to the Districts producing booze:
We could call it "The Booze Standard".
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2016, 05:19:49 am
We could call it "The Booze Standard".
So glad I built my still.

But, I like the idea of making wood, or booze, as our center of trading. It certainly saves the trouble of all a lot of future promises in regards to services and goods and such.

On another note, does anyone take issue with me stealing the bees from their district's hives next year?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 08, 2016, 05:27:19 am
Trade with the Mountainhome would still involve gaining other items relative to the "dwarfbuck" value of that item traded, so I think what's needed is that the goods that the Outpost Liason said they need as part of the export agreement is the ONLY trade goods they'll accept when they come around again the next year, (obviously an RP when I play the Combined Game.)  Since there is no year 202 export agreement in effect yet, Districts would be free to trade whatever they wanted to the Caravan this year (202).
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 08, 2016, 09:54:56 am
We could call it "The Booze Standard".
So glad I built my still.

But, I like the idea of making wood, or booze, as our center of trading. It certainly saves the trouble of all a lot of future promises in regards to services and goods and such.

On another note, does anyone take issue with me stealing the bees from their district's hives next year?

Was there any beehive that spawned?  I did not recall.  I did saw an ant colony. 

Anyway, there still is a bug that it will require exactly 1 dwarf to do beehive labor, otherwise, one or all becomes stuck waiting for the beehive to be ready for collection. 

I think it would be "fair" to get RP compensated for 1 jug of honey or 1 barrel of mead for every 2 transferred hives out of a a district.  Meaning, 1st spawn cost 1 production item (honey or mead), and 2nd is to the beekeeper's profits.

There's a max of 40 hives, sounds fun!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 08, 2016, 10:18:25 am
The Civ name is "The Merchants of Wood", so that also ties in nicely, which is cool.

Another idea would be to make wooden barrels of booze be the inter-district trade goods instead, with the various quality levels of booze creating the variation of coinage value, based on the happiness of the dwarves who would drink it.  This would also work as trade-in value of decorated barrels to the Districts producing booze:
We could call it "The Booze Standard".

Just some thoughts. 

1. Booze in wood barrels = currency
2. Wood barrels are "in"
3. Wood pots are a "no"?  Booze in wood pots is fake currency.
4. Stone pots are "no"? except for lignite or jet because those materials pots are lighter than wood barrels. Booze in stone pots is fake currency
5. Metal barrels are "in"
6. Booze in metal barrels = currency.  I'd say "more" value as metal sources is finite, but are more in quantity initially but more labor intensive to retrieve. 

Wood as a resource.
1. Let's say there are 100 trees per district, x20 = 2,000 trees.
2. Average of 5 logs per cut trees = 10,000 possible "barrels" initially. 
3. Depending on sapling growth rate, let's say 10 trees grow / district / year, x20 = 200 trees x 5 logs = 1,000 possible "barrels" currency added annually.

My point is that wood are a resource is abundant at first, but becomes scarce when harvested without regard, so there is a built in "keep the future" in mind investment.  The re-growth rate of trees makes it an ideal source of currency.  And this does not include cavern trees, or underground fungus tree farms.

Compare to metal as resource.
1. There are more metals (assume) in an embark map spanning many z-levels.
2. These metal ores are finite that once all of it are mined out, it's is all gone. 
3. But it also takes time to convert the ores into multiple bars; and into barrels.

Metals to make into barrels as form of currency would be a finite source to inflate or deflate the value of wood currency.

I can see it at now when the first batch of gold barrels are introduced.  "I'd trade you 10 wood barrel booze for that 1 gold barrel booze!"  Then years later, then gold barrels are common, the trade will be back to 1:1 ratio.


Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 08, 2016, 10:22:00 am
Trade with the Mountainhome would still involve gaining other items relative to the "dwarfbuck" value of that item traded, so I think what's needed is that the goods that the Outpost Liason said they need as part of the export agreement is the ONLY trade goods they'll accept when they come around again the next year, (obviously an RP when I play the Combined Game.)  Since there is no year 202 export agreement in effect yet, Districts would be free to trade whatever they wanted to the Caravan this year (202).

Ooh, I like this.  It can circumvent the cheesy strats of trading prepared meals, and other overpriced goods such as mechanisms and weapon traps.

It's actually more legit to make obsidian crafts (mugs) as obsidian is 3x the value of other normal stones.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 08, 2016, 11:23:44 am
Trade with the Mountainhome would still involve gaining other items relative to the "dwarfbuck" value of that item traded, so I think what's needed is that the goods that the Outpost Liason said they need as part of the export agreement is the ONLY trade goods they'll accept when they come around again the next year, (obviously an RP when I play the Combined Game.)  Since there is no year 202 export agreement in effect yet, Districts would be free to trade whatever they wanted to the Caravan this year (202).

Ooh, I like this.  It can circumvent the cheesy strats of trading prepared meals, and other overpriced goods such as mechanisms and weapon traps.

It's actually more legit to make obsidian crafts (mugs) as obsidian is 3x the value of other normal stones.

Ill keep that in kind.

What is the ratio for wood logs to booze barrels?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 08, 2016, 12:21:34 pm
1 log= 1 barrel.
1 plant = 5booze units.
1 barrel can hold 30 (I think)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 08, 2016, 01:53:10 pm
1 log= 1 barrel.
1 plant = 5booze units.
1 barrel can hold 30 (I think)

Yes, I think 1 barrel holds 30 drink units.

However the mechanics of brewing is based on stacks of plants.
The harvest is 0-6 plant + 0-3 potashed, so the max plant stack is [9] plump helmet for example. 
Now the still is a straight [1] plump helmet = [5] dwarven wine process.

If there is a stack [9] plump helmet = [45] dwarven wine.  However, only [30] dwarven wine can fit in a barrel.  A job will require another barrel to be filled with the remainder, so [9] plump helmet = 1 barrel with [30] dwarven wine, and 1 barrel with [15] dwarven wine.

Booze is stored the same way in pots.  30 max booze units per container, even though pots has a capacity of 60.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 08, 2016, 04:52:56 pm
We could have "rations of booze" as the currency, and require they be in barrels and not pots. (Because of arbitrary.)  There's also the bit where you trade the Mountainhome for barrels of booze, which becomes an influx of currency from outside the City too. Just a knee-jerk thought.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 08, 2016, 05:08:35 pm
Offering to trade sheets and quires , prices to be discussed.

oh, timelessbob, please make a couple of scroll rollers too for me.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 08, 2016, 05:27:21 pm
We could have "rations of booze" as the currency, and require they be in barrels and not pots. (Because of arbitrary.)  There's also the bit where you trade the Mountainhome for barrels of booze, which becomes an influx of currency from outside the City too. Just a knee-jerk thought.

Should be doable via stock pile (barrels) and (plants) feeding into Still, and (drink) take from Still--then Profile that Still per District/Brewers. 

Suppose District F, G, and H have Still on their lot.

District F:
#33 (stockpile) Food: Plant: Plump Helmet give to Still#51
#34 Furniture: Barrels give to Still#51
#35 Food: Drinks take from Still#51

District G and H will have a similar setup.

TimelessBob issues a manager 30 Make Brew jobs, and it should split 10 jobs each on those Still.
This would in theory make barrels of booze and place them in each district.

The citizens drinks 4 to 5 times per season, so only required 20 booze units per year.  However, we can't control where Urist will take that booze from.
I can imagine 10 children drinking from the same District's booze pile, lol.

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 08, 2016, 06:16:57 pm
We could have "rations of booze" as the currency, and require they be in barrels and not pots. (Because of arbitrary.)  There's also the bit where you trade the Mountainhome for barrels of booze, which becomes an influx of currency from outside the City too. Just a knee-jerk thought.

Should be doable via stock pile (barrels) and (plants) feeding into Still, and (drink) take from Still--then Profile that Still per District/Brewers. 

Suppose District F, G, and H have Still on their lot.

District F:
#33 (stockpile) Food: Plant: Plump Helmet give to Still#51
#34 Furniture: Barrels give to Still#51
#35 Food: Drinks take from Still#51

District G and H will have a similar setup.

TimelessBob issues a manager 30 Make Brew jobs, and it should split 10 jobs each on those Still.
This would in theory make barrels of booze and place them in each district.

The citizens drinks 4 to 5 times per season, so only required 20 booze units per year.  However, we can't control where Urist will take that booze from.
I can imagine 10 children drinking from the same District's booze pile, lol.

This is where political popularity could be paid for, I think: those candidates who wish to be considered for Mayor might also be bartenders in a drinking establishment, stocked with high quality swill.  They'd naturally make friends with all the other dwarves who partied there, but the cost of that would be that the drink stocks might diminish rapidly.  It would be a whole new take on "political parties".
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Urdothor on February 08, 2016, 11:40:39 pm
Was there any beehive that spawned?  I did not recall.  I did saw an ant colony. 

Anyway, there still is a bug that it will require exactly 1 dwarf to do beehive labor, otherwise, one or all becomes stuck waiting for the beehive to be ready for collection. 

I think it would be "fair" to get RP compensated for 1 jug of honey or 1 barrel of mead for every 2 transferred hives out of a a district.  Meaning, 1st spawn cost 1 production item (honey or mead), and 2nd is to the beekeeper's profits.

There's a max of 40 hives, sounds fun!

There were about 4ish on my play through. I intend to grab a couple and expand them out into a rather large mead making facility. Since I'm farming, I thought I would involve myself in other "farming" industries, beekeeping, conversion of food to meals, etc. Not as a mainstay or anything, but as a sort of vertical expansion.
Title: 21st Felsite, Year 202 -Combined game update-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 06:18:34 am
The Founders send their congratulations to Mrs. Braidedtreasons, who has given birth to a healthy baby girl named "Miss Trumpetbud" today. 
I'm sure The Olive Grove District is proud  to also welcome to their district, the first native-born citizen of the City of Lights.

All Districts are busily chopping down trees and excavating their first forays into the earth, but the Founders have found themselves stretched to the limit, since none of the other Districts want to build any of their own structures, (and there is no "migrant labor" yet to help ease the workload.  I'm sure things will get better when the first migrants come drifting in from the Mountainhomes.
Title: 23rd of Hematite, Year 202: Combined game update
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 07:03:56 am
Please join the Founders in welcoming the first migrants to our soon to be fair and prosperous city. We have plenty of work for you!

The stone supply to The Olive Grove District has been a bit of a bottleneck since the Lemducim mining squad abandoned their plans to excavate their District in favor of helping TOG,
but the Z -1 and Z-2 excavations have helped supply the Lemducim masons with obsidian boulders at last and soon the first walls will be laid.

Unnamed District R is a favorite meeting spot for those few times that citizens have the time to take a rest.  The calm loamy dimness is a cool respite from work under the hot sun, and there is anticipation in the air as the District R stills and kitchen begin to prepare their brews and meals.

The heavy lumbering at Lakecastle District is about complete, allowing the miners to begin excavating that District as well.  In the mean time, the walls and floors of a building seems to be sprouting up in one corner - maybe it will soon offer a challenge to District R's delights...

Title: Re: 23rd of Hematite, year 202: Combined game update
Post by: Urdothor on February 10, 2016, 09:48:03 am
Unnamed District R is a favorite meeting spot for those few times that citizens have the time to take a rest.  The calm loamy dimness is a cool respite from work under the hot sun, and there is anticipation in the air as the District R stills and kitchen begin to prepare their brews and meals.

*mutters* Free-loaders

Glad to see everythings in the city is coming along nicely.  :)

Edit: If a district makes a tavern and has people petition for citizenship is it up to that district, the Founders district, or a council of districts? Also, will they be considered as migrants or district citizens?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 10, 2016, 10:37:51 am
Person who's tavern it is, I think
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 10, 2016, 10:46:39 am
You take tavern guests, you feed them.

Question, Mr Braidedtreason made that artifact bow; does he need arrows as opposed to bolts to use it for hunting / archery training?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 10, 2016, 11:04:41 am
Yes. Though I beleive were at war with the elves, and the humans may never show.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 12:54:47 pm
Yes. Though I believe were at war with the elves, and the humans may never show.

I suppose the arrows you need may have to be harvested from Elven invaders, their grown-wood arrows being turned against their creators.
Oh what twisted treachery! 
Oh, what Braided Treason...

It'll be interesting to see who survives the probable were-creature attack, seeing as we don't have a militia yet, other than our Militia Commander, Mr. Ast, who is more title than warrior.
I wouldn't mind seeing Mr and Mrs Braidedtreason, (and their newly born son when he grows up), becoming a stalwart family of Farmer-gaurdians, taking up either bow or hoe with equal skill as the situation demands.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 10, 2016, 01:22:22 pm
The possiblity of the were-attack was the reason I set up a barracks and set the males in my district: Mr Ast and Mr Zasit. 

I was not sure how to obtain Bow ammo, so I left Mr BraidedTreason doing farmwork instead of training for now.
If it's too much trouble, can probably make a weapontrap furniture with the artifact bow as some sort of display furniture; and the practice with a crossbow instead.

Hunting for meat and bone bolts would be a means to sustain training ammo needs; but let's see what we can get from the caravan first.
Title: Re: 23rd of Hematite, year 202: Combined game update
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 01:33:46 pm
...

If a district makes a tavern and has people petition for citizenship is it up to that district, the Founders district, or a council of districts? Also, will they be considered as migrants or district citizens?

After weighing the pros and cons, I'm going to say that the District who has the highest ranking Noble as a member will get to approve citizenship requests, and if granted, the new citizen will become a member of any District willing to pay the "application fee", or become a "free range" migrant if no District wants them.

This is how I see this happening:
1. Visitor applies for citizenship at some Inn
2. Game update file posted to the forum along with an announcement of the application
3. Player whose District was applied in takes a look at the applicant in the updated save game (while anyone who wishes to does also by uploading the save file.)
4. Player decides whether or not to sell that application to the District containing the next higher Noble than is in their District (Mayor->Baron->Count->Duke->ect...)
5. Player attempts to sell the application to the Player with the next higher Noble.
6. If sale is accepted, but that Noble is not the highest one in the City, the cycle repeats from step 4.  However, if the person who bought the application is the highest ranking Noble in the City, then they decide whether to grant the request or not.
7. The Player who granted citizenship then can decide to auction off the membership of the new citizen to other Districts in order to attempt to recoup their investment, or they can decide to just eat the price and have the new citizen become a member of their District instead.
8. If offered for auction, the price of the new citizen's "application fee" must be met or exceeded.  Otherwise, the citizen is deemed not worth their fee, and they become "free range" instead.  (Making the granting of the request a bit of a gamble.)   
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 01:55:11 pm
The possiblity of the were-attack was the reason I set up a barracks and set the males in my district: Mr Ast and Mr Zasit. 

I was not sure how to obtain Bow ammo, so I left Mr BraidedTreason doing farmwork instead of training for now.
If it's too much trouble, can probably make a weapontrap furniture with the artifact bow as some sort of display furniture; and the practice with a crossbow instead.

Hunting for meat and bone bolts would be a means to sustain training ammo needs; but let's see what we can get from the caravan first.

The barracks aren't built yet, but once they are, I'll set up Mr Ast and Mr. Zasit to training in them on the schedule from your blueprint.  Is the squad name the same as you want them to be in the Combined Game, or will you want to be changing it to something else when the squad is set up?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 10, 2016, 02:38:11 pm
Considering were going the wood route, can Mrs. Iton make obsidian mugs in her down time.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 10, 2016, 02:40:51 pm
...

If a district makes a tavern and has people petition for citizenship is it up to that district, the Founders district, or a council of districts? Also, will they be considered as migrants or district citizens?

After weighing the pros and cons, I'm going to say that the District who has the highest ranking Noble as a member will get to approve citizenship requests, and if granted, the new citizen will become a member of any District willing to pay the "application fee", or become a "free range" migrant if no District wants them.

This is how I see this happening:
1. Visitor applies for citizenship at some Inn
2. Game update file posted to the forum along with an announcement of the application
3. Player whose District was applied in takes a look at the applicant in the updated save game (while anyone who wishes to does also by uploading the save file.)
4. Player decides whether or not to sell that application to the District containing the next higher Noble than is in their District (Mayor->Baron->Count->Duke->ect...)
5. Player attempts to sell the application to the Player with the next higher Noble.
6. If sale is accepted, but that Noble is not the highest one in the City, the cycle repeats from step 4.  However, if the person who bought the application is the highest ranking Noble in the City, then they decide whether to grant the request or not.
7. The Player who granted citizenship then can decide to auction off the membership of the new citizen to other Districts in order to attempt to recoup their investment, or they can decide to just eat the price and have the new citizen become a member of their District instead.
8. If offered for auction, the price of the new citizen's "application fee" must be met or exceeded.  Otherwise, the citizen is deemed not worth their fee, and they become "free range" instead.  (Making the granting of the request a bit of a gamble.)   

Me no understand!

So if you gate an applicant, everyone has to agree or what? wouldn't it be easier that just the player who owns the tavern has to beproducing enough food booze for them, if they accept?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 02:58:31 pm
...

If a district makes a tavern and has people petition for citizenship is it up to that district, the Founders district, or a council of districts? Also, will they be considered as migrants or district citizens?

After weighing the pros and cons, I'm going to say that the District who has the highest ranking Noble as a member will get to approve citizenship requests, and if granted, the new citizen will become a member of any District willing to pay the "application fee", or become a "free range" migrant if no District wants them.

This is how I see this happening:
1. Visitor applies for citizenship at some Inn
2. Game update file posted to the forum along with an announcement of the application
3. Player whose District was applied in takes a look at the applicant in the updated save game (while anyone who wishes to does also by uploading the save file.)
4. Player decides whether or not to sell that application to the District containing the next higher Noble than is in their District (Mayor->Baron->Count->Duke->ect...)
5. Player attempts to sell the application to the Player with the next higher Noble.
6. If sale is accepted, but that Noble is not the highest one in the City, the cycle repeats from step 4.  However, if the person who bought the application is the highest ranking Noble in the City, then they decide whether to grant the request or not.
7. The Player who granted citizenship then can decide to auction off the membership of the new citizen to other Districts in order to attempt to recoup their investment, or they can decide to just eat the price and have the new citizen become a member of their District instead.
8. If offered for auction, the price of the new citizen's "application fee" must be met or exceeded.  Otherwise, the citizen is deemed not worth their fee, and they become "free range" instead.  (Making the granting of the request a bit of a gamble.)   

Me no understand!

So if you gate an applicant, everyone has to agree or what? wouldn't it be easier that just the player who owns the tavern has to beproducing enough food booze for them, if they accept?
Ok, so suppose you "gate" an applicant, and your District also has the Mayor as a member of it.  If the Mayor is the highest ranked noble in the City, you get to choose whether to accept or deny this individual that citizenship.  If there's a Baron in some other District, then your Mayor doesn't get to choose, but your District can benefit from "selling" that citizenship application to the District with the Baron in it.  Now the Baron gets to choose whether to make this individual a citizen or not, because they're the highest noble.

Now, suppose there's no Baron yet, and you as the Mayor don't want to immediately just make the individual a member of your District: (Maybe they're an elvish minstrel and elves killed your parents or whatever), then you can still get some benefit from auctioning this new citizen off to another District.  If the auction goes well, your District is richer and the other District gets a new citizen.  If, however, nobody wants to pay the minimum of what you spent buying the application (in the Mayor's case it would be no cost at all), then the elfish minstrel becomes a "free range" laborer, and is able to be picked up as a District Founder by a new Player.

It would be simpler to just say >poof< new citizen!, yes, but these little dynamic mini-games within the context of the bigger one are what will make the City really feel alive, because it keeps the Players active within the decision loop.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: LordPorkins on February 10, 2016, 03:14:47 pm
...... Hows about we have the dried ears of elves as currency? conveiniantly sized, non-reproducible, and we aint using them For anything else !
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 10, 2016, 03:35:01 pm
but he still lives in the inn, doesnt he?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 03:50:49 pm
but he still lives in the inn, doesnt he?

Is that how it works?  Hmm.  I guess then he'd be paying that Inn a rental stipend from the District that owns him, or will own him as a "free range" migrant.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 10, 2016, 04:12:56 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

this might help. so lets say if they are only visitin (renting a room) Its up to the owner of the inn. but if it is long-term/civilanship petition, then it is the method you have.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 10, 2016, 04:42:17 pm
A good reason to dig ramps all the way to the cavern, and build an inn there.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 10, 2016, 05:07:38 pm
Next to the tunnel road!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on February 10, 2016, 05:11:38 pm
We have a tunnel road?

I read that you can butcher those accepted citizens.  Human biscuits anyone?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 10, 2016, 05:17:16 pm
We have a tunnel road?

I read that you can butcher those accepted citizens.  Human biscuits anyone?

It runs north to south on your side of the map.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 10, 2016, 06:54:42 pm
Can we move to 42.06? It would solve the no humans most likely.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.04 Phoebus -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 10, 2016, 08:32:07 pm
Can we move to 42.06? It would solve the no humans most likely.
I'm using the LNP so, I'll check if they're up to 42.06 yet.
I have a feeling we'll be getting humans sooner or later - the closest human civ is on the other side of the Dwarven one, next to a goblin civ.  Their tower might be one of the reasons The Merchants of Wood are still around.

There's the LNP for 42.05 so that's what I'm using for year 202.  I'll update the game as we continue, which will be interesting, as the new features will slowly implement with it as it ages.  Very cool.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 12, 2016, 05:54:16 pm
and instability
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 28, 2016, 04:19:36 pm
rumbling from the deeps......


BUMP!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on February 28, 2016, 10:12:08 pm
Sorry guys, my laptop bit the dust a few days ago and its been an interesting internet-less week since then. 
Fortunately, all the "blueprint" save files and the original "main game" file is waiting right here in this forum for me to upload.
Unfortunately, I'll need to start over from scratch getting it all together, so the history as it stands may need some re-writing. 

No worries, we're good to go!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on February 29, 2016, 02:30:38 am
It's okay, just checking this isn't forgotten/abondoned.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Shofet on February 29, 2016, 03:13:29 am
Pleased to see this isn't dead.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Dustin on March 02, 2016, 08:57:47 pm
ok so quick question that i have, what happens if someone releases a little FUN?
would everyone near get wiped out or what?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on March 02, 2016, 09:15:11 pm
ok so quick question that i have, what happens if someone releases a little FUN?
would everyone near get wiped out or what?

That's been asked before, actually, a few pages back.  "The City" as a post-apocalypse scenario is certainly viable, but I'd like to see it get built up a bit more before "The Fall", because then the tragedy and anti-FUN measures can be that much more piquant.  If everybody gets entirely wiped out, then I set up a different game where people attempt to retrieve <insert artifact here> from the Doomed City, or set it up as some other aspect of a series of mini-games.  This game-world is ripe for re-play on a number of fronts.

I mean, suppose the humans arrive as an invasion of a zombie horde, and a District decides to turn the Circus loose on them to break the siege, but another District has, in secret, built a magma pump stack to break the siege instead, so that flaming zombies are now fighting the denizens of the Circus amid the ruins and abandoned structures of the previously thriving over-world City.  Meanwhile, the count of Forgotten Beasts roaming the pretty much open Underworld just keeps mounting, and the surviving members of each District slowly go mad from terror, loss and special moods...  Sounds like loads of fun, and what an amazing story.  Maybe one District's Dwarves find a way to somehow build a safe passage out of the ruin of the City (Or somehow improbably defeat all odds and become the sole survivors, initiating a "Rise After the Fall", tough as nails and lucky as a deck full of jokers...)

but first, The City needs to grow a little.  The Districts need to build up and dig down, so that they fully realize their potentials as mini-principalities within the larger framework of The City and The Merchants of Wood themselves.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Isngrim on March 04, 2016, 03:05:03 pm
Hey, I wouldn't mind joining in when there is some migrants,District M if nobody has taken it.
i think i'll focus on machinery and siege-craft.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Dustin on March 06, 2016, 04:28:07 pm
ok i guess ill come in too, and there is inter principality trading?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Dustin on March 06, 2016, 04:29:05 pm
because as i figure, i will be mostly trading for things, and what not, so yay
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Diamond on March 07, 2016, 09:18:07 am
Can someone please explain how this works in few words?
Each player uploads a yearly save, and then "host" manually copies whatever they did on his own "central" save, with probably different results?
What is the "blueprint" constantly mentioned?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on March 07, 2016, 10:35:55 am
Can someone please explain how this works in few words?
Each player uploads a yearly save, and then "host" manually copies whatever they did on his own "central" save, with probably different results?
What is the "blueprint" constantly mentioned?

(Phase 1) The host (TimelessBob) plays the "live game" then uploads the save, let's call this Founder's Day (spring has arrived.)

(Phase 2) We players (furumite participants), play the save for 1 year.  Whatever we build (buildings or items) will be uniquely to our own save games we call "blueprints".  We also mix some roleplaying here in the forum, and share plans, trade for equipment--all in theory.

(Phase 3) The host looks at each of the players' blue prints, then plays the "live game" trying to build as close to each of the blueprints as possible."

(Phase 4). A caravans arrives, we call this "Trade Day", the host makes a save of the live game available so we the players can see the progress, and also gain knowledge of the available resources (wood, stone, metals, anvil, picks, weapons, etc.).  We the players roleplay for items the caravan brought.  Post out thoughts, plan changes, and trade proposals to both caravan and with other player districts.


(Phase 5). The host reads our interactions, plans, trade proposals, agreements, and continue the "live game" trying to incorporate those info into the game.  When spring arrives, go back to Phase 1.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on March 07, 2016, 10:38:26 am
You make a fortress in your square. You upload the save. Timeless bob attempts to replicate what you built in the main save.

Edit NVM
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on March 07, 2016, 12:36:47 pm
I also stop the game and post a save when an army invades, someone gets an artifact trigger, kobolds attempt to steal stuff, a visitor arrives, someone dies, etc... (Basically, anything that might change the way people want their "blueprints" followed.) 

For instance, suppose a "now you know why you fear the night" creature arrives while I'm playing through the live game.  I immediately will pause the game, save it, zip it, post the save to dffd and link to that here in the forum, with a short description of what's going on and what day it is in-game.  Everyone who has a District (or is Dorfed) responds to that if they want (downloading the save to see how everything is going).  Those who wish to change what their dwarves are already doing then post their response.  Once everyone has responded or a week has gone past, I gather all the responses and incorporate that into the game, playing it through until the next instance.  Back and forth until the in-game year is done.


I just figured out what would stop the game so that I will post for responses: anything that would normally pause the game + dwarf deaths
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Person on March 31, 2016, 05:38:13 pm
I can't believe it took me this long to find out about this. I'll be reading through the thread shortly. I actually did something a bit like this on my own in an older version, and it rapidly became a micromanagement problem. Lasted a good 2-3 years though, which is better than most of my games. Suffice to say that this is interesting enough that I might join in at some point. In other words, posting to watch.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on March 31, 2016, 05:40:03 pm
I think this is dead.... I'm feeling ambitious lately, so might take this up, if its dead, @Bob, no hard feelings, i understand this can get pretty time-consuming
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Person on March 31, 2016, 05:53:07 pm
Oh wow, its been 3 weeks eh? Not sure why I didn't notice that. I usually pay more attention to dates.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on March 31, 2016, 06:23:46 pm
I think this is dead.... I'm feeling ambitious lately, so might take this up, if its dead, @Bob, no hard feelings, i understand this can get pretty time-consuming

Sorry guys, life is really busy.  If any of you want to take on the hosting of the combined game, please do.  I give it into your possibly capable hands.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 01, 2016, 04:44:15 am
I will try. do you have a save you were playing?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on April 01, 2016, 10:19:12 am
I'll post it, along with all the info I'd collected on each District.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 01, 2016, 11:44:01 am
thanks.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on April 02, 2016, 02:33:05 pm
Save file from 28th of Hematite, year 202 (includes "combined phase" pics and files)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 03, 2016, 01:10:02 pm
I want to get this out straight away. THis will be slow! I plan on doing weekly updates. I probably wont get any work done till next week. And dont expect innovative upwrites. I am doing this not becaus eof my ability of fortress managiung, but because this cant die. So there.

tl;dr : It will go slowly, please dont get mad at me.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on April 03, 2016, 11:38:56 pm
understandable.  good luck, have fun
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 10, 2016, 04:55:08 pm
Right, this weekend got no work, but I have a few comments/questions


Since the founder's district is meant to be timeless bobs, will you upload your proposal?

The rule for visitors is simplified for simplessness sake: It is up to the owner of the tavern whether to accept or not, the owner feeds the fellow and if the fellow applies for residency and they accept, the fellow will be a part of that district

I will inevitably leer to more care for my district, please notify me if you see so

And last, Reallife will get in the way. It is 11 pm, i didnt study for mondays tests and i get up at 6:30 am. so yeah, my life is not sane.

STRAWBERRIES!

Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 10, 2016, 04:58:08 pm
THis post will have the rules and turns and stuff!



(http://orig10.deviantart.net/8215/f/2016/030/b/f/welcome_to_the_labyrinth_by_taowithit-d9pwtpe.png)

(http://img12.deviantart.net/1f6f/i/2016/030/e/4/the_city_of_light_y202_by_taowithit-d9pwln2.png)

This is a mad experiment for a version of "real time" multiplayer in Dwarf Fortress:  A multiple-tile embark is segregated into 1x1 embarks using a grid of roads.  Each 1x1 block of land will be called a "District" and left in pristine shape until claimed by a Player.  Players also must claim seven dwarves from among the local population pool as their "Founding seven" (each "Founding seven" will be put in a burrow so that they are held inside the boundaries of that Quarter.  Any children of those seven will be added to the burrow, allowing separated genealogies to develop as well.)   Once a District is claimed, then a copy of the save is downloaded and the Player plays out a year, excavating or building anything they like out of the resources that the District provides.  (Inter-quarter trading or resources will have to be role-played out, creating an ad-hoc market system between Players.)  Here's the beauty of the system: Once a year has been played, they upload the new save file using the chosen name of that district as the file name, then that becomes the blueprint for the version of the game running on my machine.  In this way, multiple Districts can be played out year after year, with the completed year save of the game on my machine updating every-one else when in-game Spring rolls around once again.

Migrants will become the inter-district workforce for hauling and building stuff with all other labors turned off (Unless they are chosen as a part of a new District's "Founding seven.")  Districts who also have the Mayor or another Noble as a Founding member of the District, have the power and authority to decide to leverage a tax on the other Districts.  Of course, every year after the first one, there will be an election for the position of Mayor in the forum polls, so everyone has the chance to have that position.

  Special Days   
Founder's Day:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Caravan Day:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  Latest Save   
27th Slate, Year 202 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11720) -"Phase 0" (Beginning of "Blueprint" stage, ends on Feb 3rd by noon, forum-time - extended to Feb 4th by midnight, forum time)
27th Slate, Year 202 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=11702) -New Districts Founded-
City Population: 34
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  History 
Year 202
"The City of Light" founded by "The Great Road" of "The Merchants of Wood" (The last Dwarven civilization in the world)


Title: Thanks, Gwolfski!
Post by: Timeless Bob on April 10, 2016, 11:20:46 pm
The front page now links to your post.

Formatting tricks:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 11, 2016, 12:28:59 am
This post is unnecessary.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Urdothor on April 13, 2016, 01:13:52 am
Glad this is being continued.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Dunamisdeos on April 15, 2016, 03:25:06 pm
This is a super cool idea and I approve mightily.

Hope it continues, even if it is slow.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 15, 2016, 04:59:30 pm
This is a super cool idea and I approve mightily.

Hope it continues, even if it is slow.

It will continue, but slowly. On weekends.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 18, 2016, 02:04:10 am
I spent most of my spare time trying to safely run 10 instances of DF without corrupting anything, melting my RAM and initiating nuclear fusion in my processor. I was mildly successful.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: snow dwarf on April 18, 2016, 06:29:01 am
I think it would be easier to read this if you would start another thread.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 18, 2016, 09:37:15 am
It'll be easier to read if I start getting stuff domestic
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on April 25, 2016, 01:38:17 pm
I managed to lock my other game CDs away! Progress shall occur!

Just looked at all the stuff bundled with main save. How time-saving. I wish I saw it 2 hours ago...
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: NEANDERTHAL on May 09, 2016, 11:11:51 pm
Posting to watch.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on May 10, 2016, 02:30:54 am
I'm sorry, I keep forgetting, I'll have update by end of week
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on May 22, 2016, 10:55:57 am
ACTUAL PROGRESS IS HAPPENING!

Tavern full of dwarves + werelizard=?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on May 22, 2016, 02:22:39 pm
Lol, one district sealed full of were-leezerds!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on May 22, 2016, 02:42:04 pm
3 serious injuries, 1 infection, 1 tavern of blood-covered dwarves dancing. There is a werelizard corpse just in front of the tavern. I'm gonna cast obsidian into the floor of the tavern and engrave the event!
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on May 22, 2016, 02:45:33 pm
Ah, it is the formation of the were-lizard cultists!  Seal them away and train them all in the military arts, because as were-creatures, they are the answer to any army of darkness or necro invasion that may occur.  Oh, The City is blessed indeed! (I wonder which deity created the first were-lizard?  They should become the patron of this new military force.)
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on May 22, 2016, 02:47:55 pm
Ah, it is the formation of the were-lizard cultists!  Seal them away and train them all in the military arts, because as were-creatures, they are the answer to any army of darkness or necro invasion that may occur.  Oh, The City is blessed indeed! (I wonder which deity created the first were-lizard?  They should become the patron of this new military force.)

you mean cultist.

i'm gonna build them a cinnabar tower. Also, mr light made an artifact wooden door. Good. it'll keep the ''cultist'' in check.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on May 22, 2016, 02:52:52 pm
Any criminals or captives could be consigned to the Crimson Tower for "re-education". An "air lock" with a cage hooked to a lever might be just the thing for introducing them to the new environment.
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on May 22, 2016, 02:54:24 pm
Hehehe....
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Timeless Bob on May 22, 2016, 03:07:59 pm
Why does "Cultists of the Crimson Tower" sound so much like a DnD adventure module?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on June 09, 2016, 05:48:38 am
Well, I'm getting back to this now. Olive grove, your building is mostly done. Just adding furniture. Any requests?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Sanctume on June 09, 2016, 08:35:40 am
The Olive Grove requests we mash them olives and make olive oil soaps.

Are we safe from were-infestations?
Title: Re: "The City" (Multiplayer-ish Dwarven Economy) 42.05 LNP -Combined game phase-
Post by: Gwolfski on June 09, 2016, 08:41:10 am
soap is going to be made.

We have cointained the were-thingy. I think it was a kangaroo.