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Author Topic: Starbound - We have lift off.  (Read 943923 times)

Knight of Fools

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2265 on: August 06, 2013, 02:18:17 pm »

Like I said, I'm not too familiar with game development but I do have a basic understanding of software development.

I was just saying that I was expecting the process to be more along the lines of building the basic game and then adding things to it in order of priority as those things are finished. So after building the bare bones game you add a GUI, which opens the door to conversations (Which opens up quests), and inventory (Which opens up crafting and trading). You add features that are the most important and have the greatest number of important features dependent on them, focusing on one thing at a time per person.

What I understood from the conversation they just ran through and made everything, and now they have to glue it all together. If all they're doing is fine tuning, adding extra features, and making sure it doesn't explode, that's cool and I just misunderstood.


As for the x64 thing - It's nice for any game to be able to use x64, even if it's not strictly necessary by the scope of the game. I doubt Starbound will take up a massive amount of memory since you'll only be loading up one area at a time. Multiplayer may be different, and may be the entire reason they're building for x64. Even if that's not the case, just having the capability can avoid a lot of issues if they decide to expand on memory hungry features.
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Darkmere

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2266 on: August 06, 2013, 02:26:56 pm »

... source? My memory doesn't remember that being explicitly stated :-\

Yeah, I'm digging for it. I can find references to it (not by me) on the forums as early as Jan 19th, so it's an old post by now, probably on reddit or something. Still looking, though their lack of a search for all the updates makes me want to punch babies.

Unrelated, but it's come up in discussion in this thread recently:
The FTL jump loading screen animation. Confirmed that you can close the window and move about the ship when traveling.

Progression of ship size as you upgrade your vessel.

-- ah. Got it. Road map -> core mechanics -> Low-level world/entity storage.
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And then, they will be weaponized. Like everything in this game, from kittens to babies, everything is a potential device of murder.
So if baseless speculation is all we have, we might as well treat it like fact.

Frumple

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2267 on: August 06, 2013, 02:45:01 pm »

-- ah. Got it. Road map -> core mechanics -> Low-level world/entity storage.
Ah, there we go. Cheers Dark.

Y'know, I have actually been watching. Has the roadmap thing been being updated?
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Dakorma

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2268 on: August 06, 2013, 03:00:52 pm »

Like I said, I'm not too familiar with game development but I do have a basic understanding of software development.

I was just saying that I was expecting the process to be more along the lines of building the basic game and then adding things to it in order of priority as those things are finished. So after building the bare bones game you add a GUI, which opens the door to conversations (Which opens up quests), and inventory (Which opens up crafting and trading). You add features that are the most important and have the greatest number of important features dependent on them, focusing on one thing at a time per person.
What you are describing there is a programming process known as Procedural Programming, also called Imperative, where the program is going through the steps one by one basically. So everything basically requires everything else to run. This is a fine method of programming if you are careful, slow and methodical, if you want fast development, you go more object oriented.

What they are doing is basically this. From low level to high level.

Code the renderer class
--Includes standard functions like printing to the screen, refreshing it, etc, etc.


Code the "object" class
--Everything is an object, in the most likely case, in Minecraft air tiles are an object, but that's because minecraft is a voxel state machine, I'm betting that Starbound is as well. So in essence what they are doing here is laying the groundwork for the things that are rendered, but not relying on the renderer class for them to exist. Printing an object into the render stream is an example of functions here. Making sure an object is passable or impassable is also a function here.

Bunch more subclasses here things like physics and animation

Code the Item Class
--Includes the metadata of an item, things like generating metadata like, "This is an item of type gun, and ID 000f12bc. With background text, "I have had it with these motherfucking snakes in my motherfucking gun"" would be here. This doesn't include things like passing the item to the renderer, but instead the metadata is generally checked by the object class and then sent to the Renderer for rendering with proper gameplay data applied.

And so on. What this set up does is prevent conflicts where items have the same ID, or where item code relies on Object code which relies on render code, and then you change something in the renderer class and it causing everything to go tits up. Instead just the renderer goes tits up and you fix that and your code works. It also enables the use of multiple developers on a single project, before you'd basically have to sit down and read all of the changes to all the files, which may or may not have been written down, and required a flowchart to understand. Now you just split files off of each other, Oh, we have a file dedicated to each gui window, a file dedicated to the object class, a file dedicated to the renderer class, a file dedicated to the item class. So you just have people work on different files and it's basically fine. This is why in the earlier stages of something like a pre-rage ID engine demo, you literally just have John Carmack and maybe one other programmer Carmack trusts implicitly, working on it. Because it's faster and easier than having 20, in terms of the early stages.


I FIGURED OUT A BETTER WAY TO SAY THAT/NINJA EDIT: Object oriented programming basically helps prevent your code from tantrum spiraling.

Quote
What I understood from the conversation they just ran through and made everything, and now they have to glue it all together. If all they're doing is fine tuning, adding extra features, and making sure it doesn't explode, that's cool and I just misunderstood.


As for the x64 thing - It's nice for any game to be able to use x64, even if it's not strictly necessary by the scope of the game. I doubt Starbound will take up a massive amount of memory since you'll only be loading up one area at a time. Multiplayer may be different, and may be the entire reason they're building for x64. Even if that's not the case, just having the capability can avoid a lot of issues if they decide to expand on memory hungry features.

x64 is always good to have, especially in cases like Starbound where I hope at very least you will be able to set up some sort of auto miner on a planet and leave to explore another one.

Also road map was updated once from what I recall, then was basically abandoned as too hard to maintain. Can't find a source on that though, may have been an IRC chat.
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quinnr

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2269 on: August 06, 2013, 03:20:22 pm »

The people in this forum thread over at the Starbound forums keep up on all the changes, and update it in the first post with the things that have changed, updating once a month. Except...last time it was updated was in June. But it still is kind of easier to look through and see what has changed since then.
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Knight of Fools

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2270 on: August 06, 2013, 03:29:33 pm »


-snip-

I FIGURED OUT A BETTER WAY TO SAY THAT/NINJA EDIT: Object oriented programming basically helps prevent your code from tantrum spiraling.

Thanks. Even though I'll probably never get into game development I still find the process fascinating.
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Bitoru

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2271 on: August 06, 2013, 06:37:05 pm »

On the subject of Starbound, the latest lighting changes really made a difference in my opinion. Everything looks way more consistent.
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Dakorma

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2272 on: August 07, 2013, 07:11:54 pm »

On the subject of Starbound, the latest lighting changes really made a difference in my opinion. Everything looks way more consistent.

I'll believe it when I see it in motion, stuff like lighting quality is better judged in motion rather than in stills.

Personally I hope they have the same option that terraria had to disable to moving backgrounds, though, as terrarias implementations of them cause me severe nausea and motion sickness.
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ECrownofFire

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2273 on: August 07, 2013, 08:23:59 pm »

Although, considering that they're using B-trees to store world changes (and probably more lists/trees in other places), using x64 would actually increase the RAM requirements because pointers are larger than in x86 :P
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ECrownofFire

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2274 on: August 08, 2013, 10:25:36 am »

Double posting because why not and this topic needs more discussion.

New update has a few screenshots.

Tree animation sounds cool. Probably involves a bit of shaking, some falling leaves.
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miauw62

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2275 on: August 08, 2013, 10:43:44 am »

Is it just me or do all of the monsters we've seen so far look like they could be pokemon?

Also, buttantlers.
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miljan

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2276 on: August 08, 2013, 11:33:50 am »

Is it just me or do all of the monsters we've seen so far look like they could be pokemon?

Maybe only 90% look like pokemon :)
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Frumple

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2277 on: August 08, 2013, 11:37:46 am »

Eh, Dittos. Technically, ever single thing we've seen, monster or otherwise, could be a pokemon.

Beyond that, what doesn't look like it could be a pokemon these days The series has lasted long enough there's a fairly expansive sample size.
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Darkmere

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2278 on: August 08, 2013, 01:25:32 pm »

Is it just me or do all of the monsters we've seen so far look like they could be pokemon?

Cats driving robots. There was also a steam tank somewhere I think. And a lego-looking guy with jetpack arms.
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And then, they will be weaponized. Like everything in this game, from kittens to babies, everything is a potential device of murder.
So if baseless speculation is all we have, we might as well treat it like fact.

Niveras

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Re: Starbound - A flat yet infinite universe.
« Reply #2279 on: August 08, 2013, 04:26:55 pm »

Also, buttantlers.

I am envisioning a small insect-like version of the drummer from Metallica with bony, felt-covered appendages on his rear abdomen.
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