Bay 12 Games Forum
Dwarf Fortress => DF Dwarf Mode Discussion => Topic started by: GoombaGeek on August 08, 2012, 10:41:13 am
-
So, I noticed while building a perimeter wall around my fort that, while walls have to be at least 5 squares away from the edge, bridges can go right up to the edge. If they open towards the edge, you now have a way to seal everything that doesn't fly out of your map.
But this seems pretty fundamental, so is this common knowledge?
In case you're interested, here is my design for the wall:
*edge*
*empty space between edge and wall*
╥ ╥
║ ║
^OO╨OO^OO╨OO
This is the example for the north side of the map. The traps are cage traps (for wildlife collection - giant red pandas!) but could be replaced with whatever you want. As for the bridges, they're all hooked up to the same lever and raise towards the wall. So, depending on whether the lever is pulled or not, you'll have everything that isn't [FLIER] or [TRAPAVOID] freely walking in OR in your cage/weapon traps.
I'm just more interested in the bridge thing - it sounds like the most exploity thing yet :P
-
Yup, it's been on the wiki for quite some time. It occasionally comes up in caravan airlock threads. Still, even old knowledge is fresh for new people on the boards :).
-
Back in 40d when magma did not flow off the edge of the map you could make a magma moat right at the edge of the map.
In the current build magma does flow off the edge of the map, but you have always been able to build drawbridges to the edge of the map. A retracted drawbridge acts just like a wall.
Its great for sealing off the entire map. If you leave only a narrow gap you can force all invaders, migrants, and caravans to appear anywhere you want them to, so you can be waiting for them.
I prefer to station my entire military there to greet them. No tricks, no traps, no fortifications. Just an open, empty field and glorious, honorable hand to hand combat.
-
A retracted drawbridge acts just like a wall.
I think you meant a raised drawbridge :).
-
Err, yes, raised drawbridge.
-
But this seems pretty fundamental, so is this common knowledge?
It's been in the wiki for a while, I think it's under exploits
-
No tricks, no traps, no fortifications.
Except for the 'raised bridge lets you build a wall where you're not normally allowed to trick' ;)
-
No tricks, no traps, no fortifications.
Except for the 'raised bridge lets you build a wall where you're not normally allowed to trick' ;)
That just forces them to confront my military directly, head on, all goblins vs all dwarves at the same time.
It actually gives a significant advantage to the goblin invaders, since there can be 150 or more goblins plus mounts all together in the same area, all fighting my dwarves.
-
No tricks, no traps, no fortifications.
Except for the 'raised bridge lets you build a wall where you're not normally allowed to trick' ;)
That just forces them to confront my military directly, head on, all goblins vs all dwarves at the same time.
It actually gives a significant advantage to the goblin invaders, since there can be 150 or more goblins plus mounts all together in the same area, all fighting my dwarves.
Erm, no. Gobbo invasions are capped at 4 squads.
-
Erm, no. Gobbo invasions are capped at 4 squads.
Really? I remember getting huge goblin invasions. Also goblins with war mounts are very common, and they may bring squads of trolls or other creatures in addition to goblin squads.
Also I've got like 5 different copies of goblin civilizations in the entities file, so they all tend to show up at the same time for lots of fun.
-
That just forces them to confront my military directly, head on, all goblins vs all dwarves at the same time.
It actually gives a significant advantage to the goblin invaders, since there can be 150 or more goblins plus mounts all together in the same area, all fighting my dwarves.
I'd give the advantage to the Dwarves. The goblins don't get to choose their fight, the first thing they do when they arrive is get greeted at by a large Dorf army when their reserves haven't even shown up yet.
-
I don't use bridges to seal off the entire map, I just use them to seal off the trade entrance. Two bridges perpendicular to the edge, the third wall is just a regular wall, five tiles wide, and the whole thing is sealed over with floor tiles. An enemy has to show up on one of the three accessible tiles to get into the fort that way, so, at most, three enemies and their mounts can get in, and they have to make it past all the war beasts and the main barracks to do it. Everyone else is free to roam around the map, but they aren't getting into my fort until I let them in, in a controlled fashion.
I do this because I hate the mechanics of "I'm on your map now, anything that happens to me is your fault" but I like the fun of random woodcutters, hunters and fisherdwarves getting jumped by ambushes, and the excitement of "Goblin siege on the horizon! Get everyone inside, NOW!" So this gives merchants a safe way into my fort, without walling off the fun.
-
Yeah its one of the biggest exploits mext to making unlimited metal from bolts.
But if you want a surefire way to make your entire map a carveable obsidian wasteland/labyrinth, it makes for great casts.
-
Erm, no. Gobbo invasions are capped at 4 squads.
Really? I remember getting huge goblin invasions. Also goblins with war mounts are very common, and they may bring squads of trolls or other creatures in addition to goblin squads.
Also I've got like 5 different copies of goblin civilizations in the entities file, so they all tend to show up at the same time for lots of fun.
Having done extensive testing in this particular area, I can say with confidence:
If the siege has goblins only, the maximum is 5 squads, or 80 goblins total. 15 common soldiers + 1 squad leader, per squad. As well, even with multiple goblin civs (I too have done this) only one civ at a time will siege. I've never seen more than one civ at a siege.
I have, however, seen civs siege back to back. Once the first group of 80 is wiped out/driven off, the second can and will immediately siege. (with a new, separate "a vile force of darkness ... " ) In that case, there may be a brief period of time where the fleeing goblins and the new siege are on the map concurrently, but the fleeing goblins will simply path off the map, and are not involved in the hostilities.
-
Yes, it is known. A 30 second search of the wiki found it under Bridges (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Bridges#Raising_and_Retracting_Bridges) and Security Design (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Security_design#Defending_the_edge)...
A search on these forums would have found many more references.
The real trick is handling ramps on the map edge. You can construct floors or cast obsidian to get the flat surfaces to build bridges on.