Post by: LordBucket on April 26, 2010, 11:13:51 am
This is an old T3 module that was presumed lost after the engine it was built for was abandoned. Recently some people have found old copies on their hard drives. However, so far no "final release" copy has turned up. The most recent version anyone has found is version .91, which so far as I can tell is missing about 6 months of development time from the final version, which was (I think V.93)
V091 is playable...if you don't mind working around bugs, and "implement me" messages from time to time.
How to get the game is described here:
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=55626.msg3907119#msg3907119
Some important bug workarounds are described here:
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=55626.60
If there is sufficient interest I may consider releasing up update patch that fixes the more inconvenient bugs.
Current notable bugs:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
(http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/2990/splash2.jpg)
Direct links to story posts
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Current stats:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It's time for a Let's Play of Dragonball T!
Dragonball T is a module for ToME3 (http://t-o-m-e.net). I'll be playing an unreleased development version which is slightly different than the current public release (http://modules.t-o-m-e.net/module.php?id=51).
DBT takes place mostly within the world of original Dragonball (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Ball), but it does contains some elements from Dragonball Z (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Ball#Dragon_Ball_Z). The ultimate goal in DBT is secret, and won't be revealed until we're well into the game. But to begin with we'll be playing an aspiring martial artist (probably) who wants to prove himself by winning the most prestigious tournament on the planet: the World Tournament. The only catch is that we've never actually studied any martial arts. So we might want to do that before we sign up for the tournament.
Note that DBT is a moderately harsh roguelike, and permadeath is extremely likely. I'll do what I can to stay alive, but few characters survive to the end-game.
First thing, character creation. I'll be putting as much as possible to vote, and generally following what people suggest. What we need are:
Name Suggest a name
Gender Male or female
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Basic character type
There are no "classes" in DBT, but rather, we'll design the character as we level by enrolling in classes and taking lessons at any of 8 basic schools, and with a dozen or so secluded masters and trainers. Generally speaking, there are
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Barehanded fighters
(http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/9616/gokuvt.jpg)
Fight with their hands.
Weapons fighters
(http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/8048/trunks2k.jpg)
Fight with weapons.
Chi practitioners
(http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/2636/vegetae.jpg)
Throw energy balls, generate visible battle auras, fly, etc. Usually these characters will start as either barehanded or weapons fighters, but it is not absolutely necessary. It just makes the game easier to do so, as one has to survive long enough to get access to the chi trainers.
Technomancers
(http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/7057/bulmasmall.jpg)
Build and use technology, aircraft, battle suits, lasers, etc. Usually these characters will start out as either weapons fighters or marksmen, but again, it's not strictly necessary to do so.
Character build - Schools
Builds are developed by studying at any combination of various martial arts schools. If you have preferences, specify them here. It will be a while before we need to worry about choosing masters to study with (Rosshi, Tsuru Seni'nin, Kami, etc.) so just focus on basic schools for now.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
General playstyle
Alternately, if you don't want to choose specific schools, simply specify generally a basic character type and what kind of playstyle you'd like to see: "Strong and tough" "Fast" "High armor/ hard to hit" etc.
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 26, 2010, 03:38:19 pm
Gender: Male
Type: Full on Technomancer!
Schools: Karate, Fencing, Sumo, Ballet
General Playstyle: Thick armor, bladed weapons.
Post by: Zangi on April 26, 2010, 04:31:39 pm
Schools: Kickboxing, Judo, Ninjutsu
General Playstyle:
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 26, 2010, 06:06:28 pm
I suppose Kickboxing is okay, but Karate is really our only good source of Strength and Block is good for the defensive part of my build.
Fencing will give us mastery of blades, and this added with the free attacks from Riposte makes up for having only one weapon. The speed'll also help us hit quickly and move better in our thick armor.
Judo gives dodge and a few skills we'll get elsewhere, whereas Sumo gives us a small Strength and Constitution bonus as well as two abilities. Immovability seems especially nice, as it should allow us to stand our ground and dish out some damage while our armor keeps us safe.
I rest my case and wait for comment.
Post by: Zangi on April 26, 2010, 06:11:07 pm
Don't care if its optimal for a Techno or not.
Post by: EuchreJack on April 26, 2010, 06:44:19 pm
Name: Iron Beard
Gender: Male
Type: Full on Technomancer!
Schools: Karate, Fencing, Sumo, Ballet
General Playstyle: Thick armor, bladed weapons.
A dwarf ballet dancer! I love it! Go Male, Ballet, Fencing, and Sumo. Karate's too cool for this character! I agree on the thick armor, but hammers might be even more funny. Go Pink and pretty!
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 26, 2010, 06:52:20 pm
Oh, I just picked whatever seemed decent enough for a barehanded fighter.
Don't care if its optimal for a Techno or not.
Yeah, I kind of got off track and explained my build inside and out.
But still, Ninjutsu seems a bad choice for either of our builds, and Judo seems pretty weak in comparison to the staying power of Sumo. Karate and Kickboxing is a much closer choice, I just prefer Karate as it gives Strength and Block, which is good for any melee character.
Fencing because I want blades. I'd prefer guns, but we can't go marksman in this LP.
A dwarf ballet dancer! I love it! Go Male, Ballet, Fencing, and Sumo. Karate's too cool for this character! I agree on the thick armor, but hammers might be even more funny. Go Pink and pretty!
We really need Karate for the Block and Strength, actually.
Post by: EuchreJack on April 26, 2010, 07:04:14 pm
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 26, 2010, 07:05:42 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on April 26, 2010, 08:49:06 pm
Post by: LordBucket on April 26, 2010, 09:34:49 pm
Quote from: Spartan 117
Ninjutsu probably isn't good except for Technomancers, ironically
Ninjutsu plays like a jack-of-all trades with some perks. What technomancers need most is usually stats, and Ninjutsu doesn't give any, so it's not usually the greatest combination. (EDIT: actually no...after double checking, ninjutsu does offer dexterity training, but so does ballet.) Ballet is actually the most common choice for technomancers because it gives two useful stats, and the fact that it offers no fighting or martial arts skills isn't usually a big deal.
Quote from: Spartan 117
Judo seems pretty weak in comparison to the staying power of Sumo
Both provide damage mitigation, but in a different way: Dodge from judo allows you to avoid attack, while high hitpoints from sumo allows you to take hits but just keep going. But are valid. Both work.
Judo-dancer-technomancer is actually a standard build, but sumo-dancer will also work. Both sumo and ballet give constitution, so that's redundant, but ballet gives dexterity, and sumo gives strength. So...by choosing sumo instead of judo, basically it means we'd be focusing on high damage-high health instead of high speed-high armor.
Quote
Block is good for the defensive part of my build.
Block only applies to barehanded fighters. Parry is used for weapons. You'll get parry with either Kung fu or Fencing. Though as a technomancer there won't be a lot of spare points for for it.
Quote
We really need Karate for the Block and Strength, actually.
Sumo gives strength, and block doesn't apply to weapons, so all karate gives that the others don't is martial arts skill, which technomancer don't hugely benefit from.
Quote
Kickboxing is okay, but Karate is really our only good source of Strength
Sumo gives strength, so no need to take karate for the strength training.
Post by: LordBucket on April 26, 2010, 09:35:46 pm
Post by: Earthquake Damage on April 26, 2010, 09:44:12 pm
Anyway, I'm voting in favor of a sumo ballerina, with or without other schools.
Post by: LordBucket on April 26, 2010, 10:23:17 pm
Is this a sign that development may resume in the foreseeable future?
Development is underway right now. DarkGod returned from his
Quote
The few TOME 3.x mods I tried some time back (1-2 years maybe?)
were all horribly incomplete
...well, mine were functional, until alpha18 broke them. :P
But there has already been an alpha19 since DarkGod came back, and Xandor is in charge of the T3 team now. In theory, the next release will be a beta release, though I don't have an ETA on that.
Quote
(as was the default TOME module IIRC)
The ToME3 module as it exists in its current form included with alpha19 has been formally abandoned. There will be a new ToME module, but I haven't been following development for it much. From what I've read it bears little resemblance to the ToME module included with the current alphas. Basically, it was totally scrapped and they started over.
Quote
Anyway, I'm voting in favor of a sumo ballerina, with or without other schools.
So three votes for the sumo-dancer.
Post by: Earthquake Damage on April 26, 2010, 10:28:50 pm
stuff
Good to hear. :)
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 26, 2010, 11:08:26 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on April 26, 2010, 11:40:53 pm
1) We get to laugh at the character even more as just being a fat dwarf in a skinny tutu*, as opposed to a cross-training quadathalon.
2) Even though everyone will be laughing at our character, the ability to destroy two more schools should make him strong!
*Fat come from Sumo, Dwarf come from name, skinny tutu comes from dancing, in case it was not obvious.
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 27, 2010, 12:01:47 am
AXE CRAZY SUMO DANCER IN PINK POWER ARMOR, YEAH!
Post by: LordBucket on April 27, 2010, 12:21:24 am
Quote
excluding fencing
We must have fencing
We probably want either fencing or kungfu if we're going to be use weapons. It's possible to weild weapons without a relevant skill, but if we want to actually hit anything...skill helps.
Quote
tutu
Tutus actually do exist in the game as a wearable item...so, yeah.
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 27, 2010, 01:02:14 am
It's my build, I get extra say.
Post by: EuchreJack on April 27, 2010, 01:31:19 am
We must have fencing so we can be...
AXE CRAZY SUMO DANCER IN PINK POWER ARMOR, YEAH!
Fencing!
It's my build, I get extra say.
Ok, I agree to fencing only on the condition that we all know "fencing" really means "craxy axe wielding skillz".
Post by: Mr.Person on April 27, 2010, 02:51:07 am
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 27, 2010, 03:28:38 am
I'll add my vote for a giant axe wielding guy who's trained in Sumo, Ballet, and Fencing. Something about a sumo with a giant axe who fences while wearing a leotard is hilarious. I'm not sure why.
A MK 6 Adamantine-layered powered leotard combat system. That is pink.
It also has an awesome sound system that plays death metal.
Post by: LordBucket on April 27, 2010, 08:38:00 am
Sumo-dancer-technomancer it is. Introducing, Urist Ironbeard:
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | How do you do. |
Pleasure to meet you, sir. Would you tell us a little about yourself?
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | I'm an engineer by trade, from Helmsline under the Gatal plains. Nice place. I miss the clammy air. Way too ventilated aboveground for my tastes. Bad for the lungs. |
Oh? Then may I ask what brings you to this part of the world?
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | A crummy map, that's what. Whatever miscreant drew this rotten thing must of been awfully sober. |
I see. Will you be staying long?
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Armok, I hope not. I just came to straighten out the fools at Kidneyspliced. Yet another newish outpost that lost its leader to some sort of "accident." Durned if I don't keep my own eyes open. At least, if I ever find the outpost. |
I'm sorry, but I think you're quite far gone from any dwarven outposts
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Yeah, I was startin' to guess that. Well, I see some sort of civilization up ahead. Stone buildings, roads...not dorf for sure, but they sure ain't elves neither. I'll stop and ask for directions. Maybe get a keg or two while I'm there. I haven't had a drink in so long, I can't even remember. Must of been five minutes, at least. |
Well, I certainly wish you luck.
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Thanks. You seem like a decent sort. For a human. |
Never before have I been showered in such lavish praise. I'm sure we'll be seeing each other again soon.
Post by: LordBucket on April 27, 2010, 09:00:14 am
In this episode we introduce:
The World Tournament Ticket Girl
| (http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/6879/avatarticketgirl.jpg) | HI!!!!! Don't hate me because I'm cheerful. |
Marcos, of Aru Village
| (http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/8486/avatarmarcos.jpg) | All our womenfolk have been kidnapped! Oh noes! |
Oolong...the terrible
| (http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/6664/avataroolong.jpg) | Grooowwrr!!!! I'm a scary monster and I bite and I'm lonely and I just really want to be loved please. Will you love me? Please? Just a little bit? |
From the journal of Urist Ironbeard 4 Obsidian It's been two weeks since I left the mountainhome. I was sent to take over administration for Kidneyspliced, the latest but certainly not the last outpost to have its outpost leader mysteriously drown in magma. In his bedroom. I'm not sure about these directions I was given to the new outpost. The cartographer clearly hadn't been getting enough booze if he expected anyone to understand them. Still though...I can't be too far from civilization. I've been seeing a lot of roads lately. They're built out of some sort of grainy black material I don't recognize. Interesting workmanship in them. Plain, straight and simple, but I don't see any creases between the blocks. It almost looks like they were poured instead of layed, but it's way too soft to have been magma. Well, new lands, new materials. 7 Obsidian I've arrived in the middle of a bustling surface city full of humans. Well, I think they're humans. Tall and gangly, but they speak strangely and wear clothing unlike any human I've seen. From the map I have the outpost should be very close. Maybe I should ask for directions. There's a rather large building ahead. I'll ask there.
For a human she was unusually helpful, but the news was bad, and I needed a drink. Pocketing the brochure, I set out looking for a tavern to quench my thirst. I passed a few buildings, but no taverns. After wandering in circles for hours I finally gave up on finding any booze in the tournament area, and wandered to Aru Village to the west, where I was immediately set upon by a rather clingy looking human.
The Castle wasn't difficult to find. But things were not quite as Marcos explained. I found the village girls. There were parading around the castle like princesses, dressed up in fancy silk gowns and making up things for the servants to do. One of them even tried to tell me to remove a pea from under her matress. When I explained I was there to "rescue" her, she laughed and told me that all the women came to live a life of luxury instead of the life of a poor villager. Personally, I was more interested in them living the life of someone giving me a nice thick, chunky ale, so I figured I'd have to go see Oolong. I found him before long...crying in a corner.
The women returned to their village and their menial jobs, but they were so resentful about me getting them kicked out that I couldn't get the time of day in their village, let alone a drink. Instead, Marcos gave me some old +knife+ as a reward. Not bad for human craftsmanship, but I didn't see I'd get much use from it. I was here to recover an outpost, not fight anything. |
Post by: LordBucket on April 27, 2010, 09:07:08 am
We have our character, we've got a weapons....where do we go next?
The Shaolin Temple Looking for fellow dorfs. Since the Ticket Girl claims this "Krillan" character is one.
The Rabbit Hole. A basic beginner dungeon to pick up some experience and minor stuff.
The local sewers, which happen to be being used as a nuclear waste dump for a local chemical manufacturer.
Just wander around and kill random monsters to get some levels and talk to people and do some training.
Incidentally, here are our current stats:
Strength: 6
Intellect:14
Willpower:6
Dexterity: 6
Constitution: 14
Charisma: 10
Speed: 14
Hitpoints: 14
Armor: -2
MoveSpeed: +6
Equipment:
* knife (1 to 6)(+0, +5)
* Streetclothes(-1[5]
* Tennis shoes [1]
Left hand attack:
-7 to hit
1d6+1 damage
Right hand attack:
None
Post by: Zangi on April 27, 2010, 09:16:59 am
Look for fellow dorfs.
Post by: LordBucket on April 27, 2010, 09:20:04 am
dangerously smart for a dorf
He has to be to be a technomancer.
Post by: Earthquake Damage on April 27, 2010, 09:35:26 am
Post by: dwarfguy2 on April 27, 2010, 09:35:53 am
Post by: EuchreJack on April 27, 2010, 10:08:08 am
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 27, 2010, 03:24:53 pm
If he's not, we can beat him up.
Post by: cerapa on April 28, 2010, 12:49:10 pm
If he's not, we can beat him up.And take his booze.
Actually he might not have any booze. You know, so sober that he doesnt worship Armok.
Post by: LordBucket on April 28, 2010, 03:21:05 pm
Actually he might not have any booze.
Well, he is a shaolin monk, remember. :P
Post by: dwarfguy2 on April 28, 2010, 03:23:20 pm
Post by: LordBucket on April 28, 2010, 04:17:19 pm
i say we unequip all that we have and go straight
to the most difficult dungeon we have access to.
If we do, this will be one of the shortest Let's Plays of all time. I'm having a difficult enough time as it is trying to figure out how to keep him alive just going to the temple. It's a level 20 dungeon. We're level 5.
Fortunately he's run into some distractions along the way.
Post by: Earthquake Damage on April 28, 2010, 05:03:25 pm
i say we unequip all that we have and go straight to the most difficult dungeon we have access to.
Oh, you kidder, you!
Post by: LordBucket on April 28, 2010, 06:09:54 pm
In this episode, we introduce:
Miss Piiza:
| (http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/9506/avatarpiiza.jpg) | Hello! I'm the private secretary and herald of the infamous martial artist Mr. Satan! Yes, that's a theatrical stage name, in case you were wondering. Nobody's first name is "Mr." :P |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | ...umm, hi. |
10 Obsidian
After my stop in Aru Village, I returned to the World Tournament complex and followed the road north. Within a short time the clouds cleared and I was able to sethe mountains clearly in the distance. Scarcely a few miles down the road, however, I came upon an impressive, though somewhat gaudy-looking mansion. A number of people in strange white unforms were milling about outside, occassionally shouting at one another unintelligibly. Curious, I approached to investigate.
(http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/8625/satancity.jpg)
As I stared puzzled at the sign, one of the miscreants in white bowed at me, then let out a horrifying screech and tried to punch me in the face. I jumped back, just in time to avoid a bow and a kick from another. The crowd degenerated into a general brawl, with everyone punching and kicking and bowing at each other. As I tried to escape, one of the fellows with an orange belt knocked me off my feet with a kick to the chest. I scrambled to my feet and pulled out my knife, cautioning him away to no avail. After a few more swings at me I screamed and with all my might stuck him with my knife.
I think I even scratched him a little.
I'd never been much of a fighter. I'm an engineer. If we do our job, orcs never get inside the fortress, so we never have a chance to learn to fight. It's an ancient system and it works very well. But it wasn't going to help me here, and this knife wasn't helping much either. I needed a strategy. And thank Armok, after a few more failed attempts to stab him, a strategy presented itself. This poor fool was prancing about in some sort of crazy fighting stance with his knees horribly bent and his butt about 12 inches off the ground. It made him slow to move. I found that I could simply let him come at me, stab at him, step back and repeat. It took some time with my weak arm and lousy aim, but eventually I put him out of my misery.
Within several more minutes I had dispatched 10 of the fools. And I felt...stronger somehow. I had never killed before. And yet here were the corpses of ten humans at my feet as if I'd been training since 2d.
And yet through it all I was left wondering...why are they attacking me?
Inside, I found a red-headed woman speaking to a crowd of people in what appeared to be a trophy room.
Miss Piiza:
| (http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/9506/avatarpiiza.jpg) | Thank you, and welcome to Mr. Satan's training dojo! As you can see from this impressive collection of trophies, including all three from the previous three World Tournaments, Mr. Satan has proven himself many times over to be the strongest fighter in the world! |
So the human who owns this place is a fighter, huh? Must pay better in the human world. Most fighters I knew lived in the barracks. I was understandably skeptical of this "strongest fighter in the world" claim, but presumably the woman merely meant strongest human in the world. So that would make him about as strong as the average glass cutter. Still, for all their buffonery, skill was skill, and this "Mr Satan" fellow was clearly a Legendary human. No way anybody could afford a place this size if they weren't Legendary. Maybe I could learn a thing or two from him. But first I had some questions.
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | So what's with all the crazy guys in white standing outside attacking people? |
Miss Piiza:
| (http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/9506/avatarpiiza.jpg) | Oh, well...Mr. Satan is such a strong and famous fighter that he attracts a lot of fans. He only takes the strongest fighters so prospective students try to prove themselves worthy by defeating each other. |
That explained a lot. Well, I didn't have time to bash human heads now. Certainly not to "prove myself" to some silly human, even if he could teach me a useful trick or two. Right now I have an outpost to find.
Orinji Temple
(http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/7637/orinjitemple.jpg)
It took me some time to find the temple. Silly fools built the thing at the end of some silly road on top of the mountain instead of down inside it where it belonged. The place obviously wasn't built by dorfs but I thought maybe they embarked on a human city and tunneled down underneath it. Plus it was the only lead I had, so I went inside.
Except for a couple candles, it was both dark and quiet inside.
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Hellloooo?!?!?!? Anyone here? |
Silence.
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | ...ANYONE?!?!?! |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | ...umm, I'm here. I'm Krillan. Are you here to save us? |
So this was Krillan. Sickly looking fellow had his beard shaved off. Whatever happened here, it wasn't pretty.
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Yes, I was sent by the mountainhome to take charge until the end of the season. What happened here? |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | Oh, thank you! It was AWFUL! A pack of rival Taoist extremists came in and attacked the temple! Tha Abbot went into meditation, and I took them to my porn collection to distract- |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Wait...slow down. What's a Taoist? |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | Oh, right. Sorry. Taoists are peaceful philosophers who believe in inaction as a means of attaining harmony with the universe. |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | And they attacked your temple? |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | ...well, they looked like Taoists. So the Abbot and most of the monks went into meditation and left me here to deal with them so I offered to show them my porn collection to distract them, but they admonished me, saying it was improper for a monk to have porn, so they went down into the catacombs to go find it and I locked them in! I have the key, but the Abbot and most of the monks are down there with them! |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Temple. Monks. No beard. You're not a dorf, are you? |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | HEY! Just becaues I'm SHORT doesn't mean you need to be RUDE! |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Answer the question. Are you a dorf? |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | NO! I'm just...small boned. Yeah. Small boned. |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | You're a short human? |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | Yeah. Rub it in why don't you? You said you're here to help. So are you going to help or not? |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | What exactly do you want me to do? You've got the key. Go let them out. |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | But...there are probably a hundred of them down there! All with weapons and years of fighting experience! If I let them out they'll overrun the temple! |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | What? Fighters? I thought you said they were "peaceful" Taoists and that you're a bunch of monks? |
Krillan
| (http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/227/avatarkrillan.jpg) | Oh, well...yeah, but we're Shaolin monks and they're, well...I guess they're warrior Taoists. We all train our entire lives in the martial arts. |
Urist Ironbeard
| (http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/9073/avatardwarf.jpg) | Well, then I certainly can't help you. I'm not a fighter. I'm an engineer. Maybe I could redesign the temple to collapse on them and flood the world with magma, but a hundred armed and skilled fighters? No way. Nothing I can do. ...unless... |
Post by: LordBucket on April 28, 2010, 06:10:43 pm
Voting Time!
What shall Urist Ironbeard do next?
Return to the Satan Estate and try to get combat training with the Legendary human Mr. Satan.
Look for other underground locations that might be home to the dwarves.
Return to the World Tournament fairgrounds and explore and train there.
Incidentally, here are our current stats:
Strength: 6
Intellect:14
Willpower:6
Dexterity: 6
Constitution: 14
Charisma: 10
Speed: 14
Level 5
Exp: 102/150
Money: 600zn
Hitpoints: 70
Armor: -2
MoveSpeed: +6
Equipment:
* knife (1 to 6)(+0, +5)
* Streetclothes(-1[5]
* Tennis shoes [1]
Left hand attack:
-7 to hit
1d6+1 damage
Right hand attack:
None
Available Skillpoints 29
Post by: dwarfguy2 on April 28, 2010, 06:22:59 pm
Post by: LordBucket on April 28, 2010, 06:28:11 pm
GO WITH THE ORIGINAL PLAN AND MAKE THAT TRAP.
That would be out of the scope of the game. This is a Dragonball T Let's Play. Not a Dwarf Fortress Let's Play.
Post by: Earthquake Damage on April 28, 2010, 07:04:15 pm
Return to the World Tournament fairgrounds and explore and train there.
In true dwarf fashion, Urist should train at the local barracks (read: martial arts school), reaching Legendary status in, oh, about three weeks (seems to be the norm for wrestlers anyway :P ). As dodging is a far superior defense to charging foes than standing ground, he should start with whichever of the chosen schools (Ballet, I assume, as undwarvenly as it seems) benefits Dodging the most.
Why worry about charging foes? Because it looks like Urist will be facing primarily humans and similar opponents, and they're bigger than dwarves.
After he learns how to not die, Urist can move on to Sumo to showcase dwarven determination (read: stubbornness).
Post by: Spartan 117 on April 28, 2010, 09:37:51 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on April 29, 2010, 02:19:22 pm
Training is for wussy humans!
But whatever experience gained should go to ballet, 'cause it is funny.
Post by: dwarfguy2 on April 29, 2010, 02:19:49 pm
Post by: Nirur Torir on April 29, 2010, 03:02:48 pm
This is an oddly entertaining mod, despite me not being much of a Dragonball fan, and despite it being unfinished. I offer words of encouragement for the continuation of its development.
Post by: LordBucket on April 29, 2010, 05:11:04 pm
I offer words of encouragement for the continuation of its development.
I'd actually like to, and this thread was inspired partially to help motivate me, but there are some silly things going on with the engine. It's not liking windows vista, and there are some really annoying graphical oddities going on with the past few alphas. There's a push going on now to fix the bugs and get it into beta, and if that happens I'd rather wait for it so I can develop without dealing with all the engine bugs.
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not being much of a Dragonball fan
I had never seen more than bits and pieces of episodes when I first started Dragonball T. After I did, I bought the entire series on DVD and sat down and watched it over a couple months. I was surprised by how good it is.
Unfortunately the vast majority of episodes aired on american tv are all from the Freiza saga, which is about 5 episodes worth of story spread out over 100 episodes and the rest filled with people screaming at each other. Overall Dragonball is both funny and clever. I don't know why only the filler episdes get shown.
Post by: Zangi on April 29, 2010, 07:36:53 pm
Post by: EuchreJack on April 30, 2010, 12:17:55 am
Also, where do we learn the "identify" skill, or whatever replaces this?
Post by: LordBucket on April 30, 2010, 01:23:58 am
firing guns doesn't work.
Not in the public release.
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"identify" skill, or whatever replaces this?
Items are identified by the skill that they're associated with, modified by intelligence. Weapons will generally require weapons skill, guns require marksmanship, armor will generally require martial arts skill. "Tech" items like gas masks, SCUBA gear, blueprints, etc. will require technology skill. Electronic weapons like tasers and stun batons are considered tech items for identification purposes.
If you examine an unidentified item in your inventory, the description will tell you what exactly you need to identify it. Press i to see your inventory, and then the letter of the item to examine it.
For example, a dobak requires a martial arts skill of 7 to identify. With 6 martial arts skill, and you won't know what the stats on a dobak are, but raise your skill to 7 and you will. Intelligence modifies the skill requirement for all items from a base of ten. For example, with 6 intelligence you'd actually need 11 martial arts skill to identify that dobak. With 14 int, you'd only need 3. Yes, intelliegence alone can be used to identify items that require skill you don't have. With 17 skill you'd identify that dobak even with no martial arts skill at all.
Intelligence can be increased through skillpoints by enrolling at the Robbins Institute. A limited number of points are also available by studying from time to time at the library. And of course, dragonball wishes can be used to do just about anything.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 27, 2012, 12:10:09 pm
Ok, I'm playing this again, and thought this might be a good place to ask questions.
Here is what I've got so far:
Can I profit from marrying Oblong?
How do I use the watch to tell time?
I've gotten stat reductions from traps, how do I remove the stat reductions?
What are these "EGO Weapons" that the help files keep refering to?
Post-Script: Reading my posts on this and the Bubble Gum Crisis LP leads me to one unescapable conclusion: I was downright obnoxious two years ago.
Post by: LordBucket on December 27, 2012, 09:39:12 pm
Can I profit from marrying Oblong?
...yes.
This is probably a more significant question than you realize.
Spoiler: small spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: big spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: terribly spoily but common knowledge amongst 'old school' DBT players (click to show/hide)
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How do I use the watch to tell time?
ctrl-T is the standard ToME command to display the current game time. If you do this while you have a watch equipped, you'll get a specific time rather than a general "It's morning/afternoon/dark/etc." Watches also allow you to know the time underground and indoors.
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I've gotten stat reductions from traps, how do I remove the stat reductions?
If I recall correctly, the effect is temporary. Zheng gui shui might be able to remove it immediately. Resting for 500-1000 turns will probably do it too.
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What are these "EGO Weapons" that the help files keep refering to?
Items that give bonuses above and beyond simple armor/to hit/damage bonuses. After being identified these items will have either a prefix or suffix indicting what they do. For example, "cleated shoes" give a speed bonus. "Dark clothing" gives a stealth bonus. A "high capacity" gun has greater ammo capacity. Note that not all ego items are beneficial, and not all ego items are exclusively good or bad. For example, "moldy" food can be straight up bad if you eat it, and a "poorly made" weapon gives a to hit penlty and cannot be used for riposte, whereas "weighted" clothing" is heavy and might apply an encumberance penalty but gives an xp bonus because it makes your training more difficult.
Note that the version you're probably playing suffers from an engine-related bug that prevents ego items from spawning under normal conditions. Don't mean to be a killjoy...but this is one of the major reasons why the game became unplayable. Ego items are the DBT version of "magic quality gear" and it's just not practical to survive the later dungeons without it.
Post by: Neonivek on December 27, 2012, 09:45:57 pm
Post by: Blaze on December 27, 2012, 09:56:18 pm
Post by: LordBucket on December 27, 2012, 10:17:34 pm
Question, Where can I get this? The links on the OP are dead.
...that's kind of complicated. It's a module for an engine that never made it out of alpha and was eventually abandoned. The engine author no longer makes it available on his website. I'm the author of DBT, but I lost the master copies of the last year or two of development due to a hard drive being wiped, lost, or destroyed.
The game was presumed "lost" until a few days ago somebody revived the Bubblegum Crisis thread here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=51369.75), and it turned out that a few bay12 players still had copies on their hard drives.
So...
There is an archive of T3 engine alphas here:
http://www.zaimoni.com/zaiband/Angband.ref/ToME/
Scroll down towards the bottom and you'll see files with names like tome300alphaXX. Those are the engine alphas. WHich version you want might vary depending on which version of which modules you're installing...but so far greatest success seems to be with alphas 18 and/or 19.
As for the module itself, people have been posting links to various modules and versions in the above thread. The most recent version of DBT that's come up so far is version .91, which (along with a bunch of other stuff) is available in this archive here:
http://www.mediafire.com/?g4r6a1p6hg3hlcy
A brief description for installing BGC (a different module) may be found here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=51369.msg3900696#msg3900696). The process for installing DBT will be similar.
Sorry if this is all a bit difficult. Again...these modules were presumed lost for years and it's only been in the past few days that people have been posting links to old copies. Also note that T3 was notoriously unreliable under some versions of windows. Personally, I've yet to get it working on my machine without at least some graphics oddities.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 28, 2012, 01:38:17 am
I was reading the helpfiles, and apparently I can get a house by being a technomancer instead of marriage. I'll fiddle around with it, but in case I can't get someone to technology 20, I thought I'd ask if it was true.
Post by: Blaze on December 28, 2012, 02:34:49 am
Post by: Freshmaniscoolman on December 28, 2012, 05:06:59 am
Post by: EuchreJack on December 28, 2012, 07:19:40 am
Also, how to I avoid/counteract throws? I had a character do quite well until the black belt threw him into a crowd of brown belts.
Also, I hate Lunch. I've usually been able to avoid her, but she's killed two of my better runs.
Post by: LordBucket on December 28, 2012, 09:40:22 pm
so that 100 pound ball really was a dragonball. Too bad I died. Very shortly after finding it, in fact.
Yes. Dragonballs are a trap that kill a lot of new players. Speed is a huge factor in character survivability because it not only controls movement speed relative to monsters, it also indirectly affects number of attacks everyone gets. If you pick up a dragonball and get hit with -12 speed, that means that a monster with a base speed can not only move over twice as fast as you, it means that once they're standing next to you they'll hit you twice per turn, except every fifth turn when they'll hit you three times. For example...with a little bad luck, you might get thrown by a black belt next to two brown belts. Quick check of monster stats, brown belts have a speed of +10. So with a -12 speed, it would be possible for them to each get three attacks to your one. 1d8 damage, so theoretical worst case, those two brown belts might hit you for 48 damage before you even get to move. Playing with negative speed is suicide.
If you find an early dragonball and you don't have a house...my advice is to abandon it. If you just leave it on the ground in any non-persistent map then leave, it can respawn again later.
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apparently I can get a house by being a technomancer instead of marriage
...if I remember this correctly...there are two options here. If you marry Buruma you get a house accessible form the world map just like the Oolong marriage house. If you become a technomancer (explained below) you gain item pickup and drop access to Dr. Brief's lab. So the "technomancy house" is different than the standard marriage house, but in a way it's better, though less organized since you have to physically move around and sort through piles to get what you want rather than choose from a list like in a house.
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Speaking of Technomancers, how does science relate to weapon difficulties, if at all?
Other classes have skills that help them hit better, but I'm
not sure if technomancy in and of itself helps.
Technology provides no hit bonus. It's not a combat skill.
As for "how it helps" we need to distinguish between technology skill and a full blown technomancer. Technomancy is a character class archetype. Technology skill just allows you to use tech items. General consensus amongst old school DBT players was that technomancers were viable, but sort of middle of the road in terms of power.
Think of it this way: DBT characters are defined on two axes: basic method of damage dealing (barehand, weapons or firearms) and "super powered enhancement" of which the choice is either chi or technology. You get get through the early game just by picking some combat styles and smashing your way through everything. But late game, if you want to be able to fly, to heal yourself, to travel through space to other planets, if you want to be able to deal with traps of bleed effects...you need either chi or technology to do it.
Low levels of technology skill will give you access to a lot of tools that enhance your survivability and generally make the game easier: laser pointers, metal detectors, the dragon radar, etc. Also a lot of misc stuff with combat utility: road flares, flame throwers, etc.
Next, there are a number of weapons that can only be used by characters with technology skill: tasers, stun batons, cattle prods, etc. While the above examples are usable by anyone with enough technology skill, weapons in this category require technology skill but actually use your weapons skill for to hit rolls. This is why most technomancers go weapons rather than barehand. (Or firearms, but they're bugged in your version.)
Finally...the "mother lode" is when you actually become a dedicated technomancer, which is a quest-chain driven event that becomes available by speaking to Dr. Briefs after you reach a technology skill of 20, and provided you haven't done anything especially nasty to Buruma. After completing the quest chain your class title changes to "Technomancer" and you gain the ability to create and enhance items via a disenchant/enchant mechanic. When you disassemble an item of a given ego or base type, you can learn how to make those items and/or apply that ego type to other items. So, for example...if you disassemble a studded piece of body armor, you can then apply studding to any suitable piece of armor you find from then forward. If you have only one stun baton, but two hands and the ability to dual wield, you can disassemble the stun baton to learn the recipe and build two to dual wield them. Then apply, for example, the high voltage ego type to them so they do additional stun damage. This allows you to always have the best "enchantments" on your gear. While one character who might be terribly dependent on armor, for example...might find himself in the position of having to choose between a piece of armor with low armor but good resistance values, a technomancer will just enhance the better piece of armor with the bonuses he wants.
Also, as a minor side benefit, technomancers get free use of a couple items that other characters would have to spend skill points to be able to use like motorcycles and airplanes.
It was also in the works to have technomancers be able to build upgradable power armor similar to what you see in bubblegum crisis. But that system was never finished.
Anyway, technomancy is somewhat crippled in the version you're playing because ego items don't spawn, so you'll have far fewer items to disassemble in order to learn recipes and you'll be completely dependent on blueprints for learning ego types. (Though I suppose that might be better than not being a technomancer and therefore not having access to ego items at all.)
So there you go. Technomancy is an alternative to chi training for late-game special abilities. But, even if you don't want to go full-on technomancer, an easy 5 or so points in technology skill is enough to allow you to use a lot useful items. Much past Mr Satan's estate, simply pouring points into armor and damage won't be enough to keep you alive. You'll need trap mitigation, healing, a way to deal with and dish out stun and blindness effects, etc. Technology training is easier to gain access to in the early game since all you need to do is find Buruma rather than navigate through mid to high level zones in order to get to chi trainers.
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how to I avoid/counteract throws?
If you want to become immune, the easiest method is to train sumo and learn the immovability trait. Body oil provides temporary immunity that lasts about a dozen turns (depending on speed) and is available for sale to anyone from the sumo school.
If you want to gain the ability to maneuver yourself better, there are lots of options: the jump ability to dance, chi flight and/or teleportation, the Nyoi-bo artifct from the Uranai-Baba quest chain...or even just train speed a lot. It doesn't matter as much when they throw you around if you can just run around them to where you want to go an hit them 2-3 times for every once they hit you.
Note that if the problem is that you're being thrown from the ring in the world tournament, the Nyoi-bo counts as a tool and will disqualify you.
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Also, I hate Lunch
I think in the version you're playing she's able to spawn anywhere. That was not the case in later versions. She's a level 15 unique. She's only supposed to spawn in mid-level overworld zones.
Workaround: when you see the sneeze notifications, leave the area and come back. I'm pretty sure Yamcha and Puar are the only hostile overworld uniques who persist through refreshes.
Post by: LordBucket on December 28, 2012, 09:57:53 pm
For some reason, the tiles aren't showing up right. Walls are just big black spaces, passable ground sometimes appears opaque (i.e. like walls), stairs up/down sometimes randomly appear and disappear and are always shifted one space to the left (Visually).
As mentioned above, t-engine is not very friendly with windows. The problem is that windows doesn't like showing high ascii characters which DBT makes extensive use of. You have three options:
1) Play the linux or mac versions. I think they don't have this problem.
2) Included in the windows release there are two executables: tome3.exe and tome3-sdl.exe. Try them both. One might work better for you than the other, though personally on my machine...the sdl version crashes instantly for some reason.
3) There is a workaround, but it requires a manual install and editing of game files. Do a manual install as described elsewhere. Then, open up data/dungeons/features.lua. There will be a list of every terrain type in the game. Do a search and replace to replace every instance of this:
display = strchar(127)
with this:
display = '#'
That will make all wall tiles display as # instead of black spots that move around.
Post by: LordBucket on December 28, 2012, 10:13:28 pm
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ego items
Huge, possible workaround, not extensively tested
Ok, so...lack of ego items renders the game not realistically playable much past level 20-30 or so. However, I may have found a solution. It seems suspiciously simple, but on casual testing it does allow ego items to spawn.
Make sure you've done a manual install as described elsewhere, then open up /scripts/object.lua
Look for this section:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Ego/arts chance
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--[[
function rand_obj.get_artifact_chance(obj_level, item_kind)
return 1 + rescale(obj_level, 100, 7)
end
function rand_obj.get_single_ego_chance(obj_level, item_kind, ego_info)
return 3 + rescale(obj_level, 100, 15)
end
function rand_obj.get_double_ego_chance(obj_level, item_kind, ego_info)
return 0
end
rand_obj.get_artifact_chance = function()
return 3 + (dun_level / 5)
end
rand_obj.get_single_ego_chance = function()
return 5 + (dun_level / 5)
end
rand_obj.get_double_ego_chance = function()
return 0
end
]]
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Flavours
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Remove the comments. Specifically these two lines:
--[[
and
]]
I vaguely remember there being something related to the engine and I think there was a good reason why these lines were commented out. Making this change might cause other problems that might be equally game breaking...it's just been so long since I've looked at this code and I don't really remember. However, uncommenting these lines does appear to allow ego items to spawn again, which combined with the above fix might restore the game to a relatively high degree of playability.
If there's interest, I'll consider looking into the firearms bug, since that's the only other major gamebreaking bug I think this version contains, but it only affects firearms which were never very popular.
Post by: LordBucket on December 28, 2012, 10:20:06 pm
Thanks.
Post by: Blaze on December 28, 2012, 10:40:50 pm
It turns out running the SDL version show up correctly (Though the high ASCII characters show up as colored boxes, which is fine), the issue is that I have no idea how to save. The non-SDL version autosaves on closing, the SDL one doesn't. Trying to open the "?"Help menu's command list just gives a "Commands.txt not found" or something to that effect.
Post by: LordBucket on December 29, 2012, 12:31:49 am
What's this "manual install" thing? I just put the DBT.team file into the module folder and it works.
Yes, that's easiest and works fine but it doesn't give you access to the game files. To do a manual install, rename the team file to give it a .zip extension, create a new directory inside game/modules, and unzip it into that directory.
Also...if you do a manual install like this, be sure to remove the .team file, or else there will be two copies of the module installed.
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issue is that I have no idea how to save.
ctrl x to save and exit.
Don't ask me why. That's the engine default command.
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Trying to open the "?"Help menu's command list just gives a "Commands.txt not found" or something to that effect.
Odd. Works fine for me. You're pressing ? to bring up the help menu then b to bring up the command list, yes? If so and it doesn't work for you, then first I'd suggest confirming that you're running the same version as the rest of us: V091. It should be listed in the middle of the screen in green on the splash screen when you first load your game.
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The non-SDL version autosaves on closing, the SDL one doesn't.
Not sure why that would be, but again...the SDL version crashes on startup on my computer. Try running the non-SDL version with the workarounds listed in the previous posts on this page. It will take a few minutes to do, but it greatly enhances game playability.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 29, 2012, 12:33:43 am
I'm not sure of the damage, but I suspect marriage is impossible.
She also disappears at random, but that might be working as intended (It's Burma after all).
And for those seeking Splinter as a master instructor: The dialog only works once, and requires 16 persuasion. So make sure you have all the skill points that you need for whatever you want to learn prior to talking to him. He teaches stealth and minor chi skills.
EDIT: Ok, it's not just Splinter. Master Roshi's training dialog also only works once. It might be a problem with all master trainers, I don't know.
Post by: Neonivek on December 29, 2012, 02:51:09 am
It seems like an oversight for that to not be included.
Post by: LordBucket on December 29, 2012, 05:03:53 am
Can you learn transformation?
It seems like an oversight for that to not be included.
begin rant
Some people are never happy.
No, you can't. Out of nearly 300 episodes, transformation was an ability only ever demonstrated by Oolong and Puar, both of whom were so completely minor characters that I'd be surprised if even one in ten people reading this thread could even name them.
Also keep in mind that they were both non-combatants, and the transformation ability itself had no combat utility because the user didn't gain strengths that might be implied by the assumed form. Here's a video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDKBeGRaPn4) of Oolong transforming into a huge, armored knight, but he gains no strength or durability in this form, and even things like a kid firing a slingshot and hot soup hurt him through the "armor" he's made.
No major character, no humans and no fighters ever learned the ability throughout all of Dragonball and Dragonball Z combined. Complaining that it's such an "oversight" seems like a serious overstatement to me.
Yes, it was considered. But how would you implement it? In the show the ability was basically cosmetic, but it allows you to change into anything. Do you understand the coding overhead involved with allowing a user to transform into "anything?" I went through that with the dragonballs. Looking through the scripts right now...the dragonball wishing code is 41k. But the dragonballs were a major part of the world and a recurring theme and it was worth the time to implement them properly.
Dragonball was a massive world created over decades of manga and anime and I spent 2 or 3 years working on recreating it. Spending large amounts of time on something that was such an insignificant part of the story for such a small time for two very minor characters and would have little game relevance even if it was done was not a priority with so many more interesting and useful things to do first.
Even as it is, unfinished, DBT features relatively minor things like the Emma Daio, Oolong, Puar, Lunch, a complicated Time Travel subplot involving Trunks, Uranai Baba, Ginkako and Kinkaku, Mai and Shuu, Ranfan, Nam, Bojack, Bacterium, Oopa and Bosa, a painstaking recreation of Korin's tower climb, Anton, Chapao, Caroni, Pirozuki, Miss Piiza in the role of Mr. Satan's secretary, Punter, Bubbles the Monkey, Umigame and Iruka, the bear thief, a complicated set of mutually exclusive subplots relating to the nature of the dragonballs and the nameks who created them, a quest chain involving ajisa plants on the planet Namek....and so ridiculously much more that even when I was actively working on it I would occasionally run into characters and quests and subplots that I'd forgotten I'd added to the game. There are characters in DBT who have more dialogue in the game as they do in the anime and when I open up the dialogue file alone in a word processor it tells me that it would be 240 pages of printed text.
Do you even recognize half this stuff I'm talking about? DBT has an entire quest chain about ajisa plants on the planet Namek. And most players never even made it off earth.
And you're complaining that I didn't include transformation?
end rant
Post by: LordBucket on December 29, 2012, 06:30:12 am
Also, Burma's dialog is broken in V.91.
I'm not sure of the damage, but I suspect marriage is impossible.
Taking a look, yes but after completing Find Buruma for Dr. Briefs her dialogue ends in a developer note, so it appears to be a clean break. I remember that, actually. She was completely fixed in later versions, but yeah...doesn't look like marrying her is possible in this version.
Hopefully somebody will turn up a more recent version. Going through this version I'm seeing a lot of things I'm completely certain were fixed or changed. The number V093 sticks out in my memory, but it's been years and I'm not entirely sure. Orinji Temple exists, so V091 is obviously a very late version...but I'm certain that Bulma, Shredder, firearms and a lot of other things were further along than they appear to be in V091. The firearms bug was especially memorable because they'd been working perfectly well for a year then there was one particular release (this one) where they were broken for some silly reason that I missed.
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She also disappears at random, but that might be working as intended (It's Burma after all).
That's correct functioning for her. Lunch, and a few other uniques work similarly. It's something like a 10% chance for one of them to appear any time you enter a new overland map.
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Master Roshi's training dialog also only works once.
Hmm, yeah. There's also a dialogue path before the Lonely Master quest that breaks the display. Though it does appear that you can train with him once, then save & exit and come back and the display corruptino recovers.
Suggestion: Turtle and Crane hermits are mutually exclusive. Quick check and Crane seems to work fine, so you could choose to train with him instead. The prerequisite quest is more difficult, but it doesn't require you to give up an npc, and with Bulma unmarryable, just training Crane allows you to avoid two bugs at once.
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It might be a problem with all master trainers, I don't know.
After some testing...Crane and Karin both seem to work ok. The Abbot, while his related quests appear to work perfectly well...appears to not be implemented as a chi trainer in this version. The quest chains that allow training with Shredder/Splinter appear to be pretty much unfinished and mangled in a couple places. Kami and the North Kaio's scripts both work, but for various other reasons I think you'd never be able to get to a point where they'd be willing to train you.
So...looks like Crane and Karin are the only functional chi trainers in V091.
Again...I guess we just hope somebody turns up with a more recent version. All of this stuff was working when I abandoned DBT. Minus a couple issues like in the previously mentioned workarounds, the game was pretty much completely functional up to the end of the Red Ribbon Army arc.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 29, 2012, 07:22:58 am
Here is what I've collected on them:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
On a related note, where/how do I train with Crane and Karin? I keep getting characters to the point where they max out on two schools, but die before level 20. Granted, I should probably just train at three schools, but some builds will max out prior to level 20 I imagine (some barehanded builds in particular seem to max out quickly).
Yeah, it would really be nice if somebody had a later version. Based on the date, I was quite busy when the later versions came out, so I'm sorry that I can't help any further. On the bright side, I'm getting better at the earlier stages of the game.
Post by: LordBucket on December 29, 2012, 09:29:10 am
where/how do I train with Crane
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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and Karin?
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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I keep getting characters to the point where they max
out on two schools, but die before level 20
Character build is a significant part of gameplay. You can't just make a character and level him. Some things work better than others.
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I should probably just train at three schools, but some builds will max out prior to
level 20 I imagine (some barehanded builds in particular seem to max out quickly).
The way I remember it, three school builds were generally more common, but it depends on what your goals are. The fewer schools you train at, the more schools you can destroy to increase your late-game skillcaps once you start getting dojo destroyer quests. But yeah...obviously you want to survive to get to that point too. Early game character design is generally a matter of prioritizing among armor, hit points, speed and damage. There's no easy way to get all of those without taking three schools, and even with three it's often a matter of choosing only three out of those four things to focus on for lack of skillpoints to invest in all four.
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some barehanded builds in particular seem to max out quickly
On barehand skill sure, but I think not having enough skillpoints is generally more of a problem than maxxing out and not being able to spend more. Remember that constitution increases your hit points, dexterity increases both your to hit and armor, and martial arts skill increases your to hit and makes life easier by increasing your ability to identify items.
In any case, some schools synergize together better than others. For example, if you want to go barehanded, karate gives blocking which increases your AC by an mount equal to your barehanded skill per each available hand, but kickboxing gives double attack which allows you to use each empty hand as a separate attack. And Judo gives access to the dodge skill which gives a raw AC bonus.
If you're going for a high armor build, it makes sense to take karate with judo because they'll both enhance your AC. And, since neither school gives a constitution bonus, you can take ballet for constitution and pick up the jumping skill in the process. Karate+Judo+Ballet is a strong combination if you want an extremely durable character. Quick check...at level 16, I'm able to make a character with with 71 AC while naked, +14 speed and 224 hp with karate+judo. Add generic, unenhanced trenchcoat and heavyweight from the shops I can get AC up to 111. +26 to hit with 1d20-4 base damage. Completing the ballet quest with those stats is difficult, but add a couple levels and better gear, and it should be easy, opening up ballet for constitution. Back in the day, I remember players using this build to get armor in the 200-300 range pretty easily. Note also that while this is a fairly slow to get powerful build...I'm trying it right now, and at +14 speed I can walk in circles around Honda's sumo ring without him ever touching me.
Alternately, you could study kickboxing for barehand skill and double attack, plus sumo for strength and constitution. Checking potentials right now...at level 16 I'm seeing a character with 20 strength, 34 constiutution, two empty-handed attacks for 1d20+10 damage each, with 544 hitpoints. Sumo also gives access to Tameshiwari and Immovability, both of which are cheap and useful abilities. Add in the slightly but acceptably skillpoint-inefficient speed training from kickboxing, and this is a viable two-school build. And by choosing high health over armor, you can take full advantage of the running bonus to speed without any real loss since you're not really trying to avoid hits anyway. It does suffer from low to-hit values, though and could possibly be improved by adding in kung fu for the martial arts and dexterity training.
And in all cases, you'll want to consider which abilities are or aren't available later from chi trainers. For example, like you note, Rosshi teaches Double Attack. So if you go karate+judo+Rosshi, you can learn both block and double attack. Whereas the crane hermit teaches blocking, so if you go kickboxing+sumo, you'll probably want to train with the crane hermit instead of Rosshi. And any build that takes sumo requires that your character be male, which excludes the possibility of marrying Oolong.
There are many viable options, and a lot of exclusions to consider. But, for simple barehanded builds, these two were the most popular back in the day.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 29, 2012, 10:37:48 pm
And from what you've said, apparently those who find a bride for Rosshi might also be able to either train twice, or possibly more.
Post by: LordBucket on December 29, 2012, 11:46:27 pm
Think I'll try a weapons build next. I remember them being generally easier to play.
What builds are you using?
Post by: LordBucket on December 30, 2012, 01:31:08 am
I've gotten stat reductions from traps, how do I remove the stat reductions?
Try the acupuncture clinic near the gym.
Also, anyone following this thread, please check the updated version of the opening post. Not sure if this is only a couple people interested, but if there's a huge resurgence of interest in these modules, I might be willing to consider supporting them again.
Though I'd really prefer that a more current version be found. I'm unlikely to be willing to rebuild the ~6 months worth of content that seems to be missing from V091.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 30, 2012, 02:04:24 am
Unfortunately, writing about a living roguelike character seems to condemn that character to death within two hours of posting. :P
EDIT: The curse is broken! Lady Elflor the Third lives! But now I've got another "problem". I just finished the Oblong matchmaking quest, and I've got 100,000 Zn. So, is there somewhere other than the main town that I can buy stuff? I guess I can afford to fly, but where too? Hm, maybe I'll visit that guy in the tower. Can I use an airplane to visit him?
Although, now that I know one way to complete the Oblong matchmaker quest, it won't be so hard in later runs to make this cash reward.
Also, is there another husband relatively accessible for my female character to marry?
New urgency to the above request: I found a dragonball.
Actually, I used my newfound wealth to encapsule the dragonball.
Post by: LordBucket on December 30, 2012, 04:11:19 am
is there another husband relatively accessible for my female character to marry?
New urgency to the above request: I found a dragonball.
Rosshi is one of the standard possible marriage partners. At a casual glance his marriage code appears to be in place, but I'm not certain whether it's possible to get to it given the errors in his dialogue. I'll look into it, but if you're in a hurry you can rent a hangar at the airport.
Also...I'm not totally certain, but I think artifacts never decay in persistent zones the way non-artifacts do over time. If you drop it at Rosshi's house, Pilaf's Castle, etc. I think it will stay there until you come back.
Related: to anticpate the question: in this version Videl appears to be the only functional marriage partner for men.
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is there somewhere other than the main town that I can buy stuff?
There are a couple money sinks in the game, but the WT zone is the only real "shopping area." One example: once Oolong sends the Aru villagers back home you can pay Joesphine to enhance your armor.
Of course, if the money is real burning a hole in your pockets, you could buy a capsule from capsule corp and use it to store your dragonball.
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I can afford to fly, but where too? Hm, maybe I'll visit that guy in the tower.
Can I use an airplane to visit him?
...probably. I think any form of flight will work, but there are much easier ways to climb the tower.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 30, 2012, 04:22:36 am
Sadly, this character died trying to take out the ninja master. Learned that a light source and sunglasses are needed when fighting ninja. Not a big deal because I left the sumo ring earlier while dueling Honda, so this character would never have been able to close all the schools anyways.
EDIT: Speaking of ninja, how does the throwing skill work?
Also speaking of ninja, how does the stealth skill work, when would it be useful, and generally how much stealth skill should I acquire?
Post by: LordBucket on December 30, 2012, 06:24:23 pm
how does the throwing skill work?
In this version, apparently it doesn't. Thrown items use positional targeting rather than to hit vs AC rolls. Throwing skill affects your chances of landed a thrown object on the tile you throw it to, where it discharges its effect.
However, looking at the code it seems that while the pathing is implemented, the thrown object itself simply vanishes on arrival and any damage done is delivered to the tile the player is standing on. The only way to use a thrown item to damage anything is to teleport on top of it, and you'll always hit it regardless of throwing skill.
Don't mean to be a downer...but last night I spent several hours playing, got a character as far as Muscle Tower, looking through the code as I played to see where things stand. Unfortunately, there's so much that's just not implemented in this version, I kind of feel like it's not worth bothering unless a more recent version turns up.
Sure, the game is technically playable up to probably level 30-40 or so, but there looks to be about 5 months worth of missing development time and some of what's missing is important stuff. I could pop out a quick easy patch for problems like the firearm bug, lunch spawning new low level zones, the dual wield /equipping flashlights strangeness, etc. But half the chi trainers are gone or non functional, technomancy is broken and there's probably 70-100k worth of quests and dialogue that just isn't there because it hadn't been made yet. Some of which involve fairly important quest chains. It would seriously take 50-100 or more hours of work to replace this stuff and I'm just not going to do that unless a huge swarm of players come though, and I don't really anticipate we'll get that.
I sent out some emails to some old players and posted to the T4 forums, but so far nobody has responded with a newer version. I'll let you know if anything turns up, and I'll answer any questions you have about the game as it is...but personally, knowing how much is missing, I'm heavily discouraged from trying to pick up the pieces starting from this version.
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how does the stealth skill work, when would it be useful,
and generally how much stealth skill should I acquire?
Stealth isn't useful enough to be worth putting points into.
Spoiler: irrelevant, but here's how stealth works (click to show/hide)
Only good reason to study ninjutsu in this version is for the ninja climbing claws. They allow you to travel over trees and mountains, which is admittedly very useful...but with stealth and throwing not working it's not really worth it. Especially since apparently the neither the ballet nor ninjutsu challenge quests are sufficiently implemented in this version to be completable. The ninjutsu challenge quest dungeon exists, but it is super crazy hard, and with technomancy not working there's no point trying to collect the power suits from it.
Actually, if you typically don't last long enough to reach training caps anyway, it would be worth putting a point training ninjustu just to get access to the climbing claws. Otherwise, I'd recommend always destroying it in this version. Though note that the ballet challenge quest appears to be uncompletable also, so if you study ballet you'll never be able to increase the training caps there and the Dojo Destroyer quest will also be incompletable. Though that's probably not a huge problem since the default ballet caps are reasonably high.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 30, 2012, 09:32:11 pm
*Scout builds are characters with high speed that only exist to tour the world and aren't meant to be viable...
Although their high speed makes them surprisingly effective, to the point where they sort of dominate my high score list despite being devised as expendable, lol. I'm still surprised that my Strength 6 Intelligence 6 character who failed to learn from both Rosshi and Splinter is near the top of my score list, of course her Speed 14 Charisma 14 helped.
Don't worry about updating this version of the game, or even patching. I'm having fun tinkering with it as is, and I'm quite happy just to learn what does exist rather than dwell on what doesn't. So don't worry about working on this version. If a better one comes up, great. If not, at least this is fun, for while.
I actually don't mind lunch's current spawning habits. Dedicated fighters can deal with her around when she spawns irregardless of location, provided she spawns nearby (and can treat the cuts she likes to give).
I was under the impression that throwing skill allowed the player to throw enemies. Guess I was far wrong on that one. Is it even possible for the player to throw enemies?
Another benefit of joining the ninja school is free poison. I haven't used it myself, but based on release notes it should double the damage of many weapons. That tips the scales in Ninjitsu's favor for many weapon builds.
Post by: LordBucket on December 31, 2012, 04:03:50 am
Scout
Out of curiosity, how much progress have you map figuring out how the world is laid out?
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I'm still surprised that my Strength 6 Intelligence 6 character who failed to learn from
both Rosshi and Splinter is near the top of my score list, of course her Speed 14 Charisma 14 helped.
Pretty much all of my characters start with 14 speed regardless of build. It's too useful to not have. Taken to the extreme...14 dex + 14 speed, set to run mode and a level 1 character can outrun and (theoretically kill too, but unlikely) a green belt. Even if you do 6 str 6 dex and 14 speed, get the knife from Marcos, it's possible to have an orange belt be your first kill at level 1 thereby jumping instantly to level 3 without spending any skillpoints. Though it requires a little dancing.
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I was under the impression that throwing skill allowed the player to throw enemies.
Is it even possible for the player to throw enemies?
For that you want the throwing ability rather than throwing skill, which appears to also not be implemented in this version.
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poison
I hadn't considered that. Checking...yes, poison appears to be fully implemented.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 31, 2012, 10:43:49 am
Since I can purchase swimming at level 1, and it appears the whole world is connected to the great body of water, I've seen every sector of the earth, although I haven't explored all the sites yet. 14 Speed isn't enough to outrun brown and black belts. And the Red Ribbon Army has guns.Scout
Out of curiosity, how much progress have you map figuring out how the world is laid out?
Below is my ramblings about stats, as I generally understand them.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: LordBucket on January 01, 2013, 12:59:07 am
I've never gotten a character to level 25
What's killing you? Completing Dojo Destroyer should put you in that ballpark. Yawara is easily defeatable by level 16, and once you beat one instructor the gains from that fight should leverage you enough to defeat most of the others. Jacque, Charleton and Hatsumi are the only difficult fights. And Ballet, I guess. But the dialogue surrounding that battle is too buggy to do anyway.
Also, don't forget the tournament. The first few rounds past the black belt aren't usually too bad and some of those fights will award thousands of xp. Between that and the trainers, if you can make it to anywhere in the 16-18 range, you should be able to get to 25-30 within ten minutes.
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usually play as a female
I think good arguments can be made either way, but in this particular version with its bugs and missing dialogue, women probably have it better overall. Though personally I find sumo to be a very good school regardless of build. The Oolong house is convenient, of course, but a sumo practitioner can generally carry around a dragonball without a speed penalty.
It's less critical in later versions where Bulma is available as a marriage partner. Marrying her does come with the disadvantage of making the dragon radar unavailable unless you're a technomancer...but in this version neither the dragon radar nor technomany work at all anyway.
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willpower will probably be vital at higher levels, but since I've never gotten
a character to level 25, it usually doesn't bother me too much.
Yes, I don't think willpower helps against anything much before Muscle Tower. And even from that point on it doesn't come up often. Unless you're a chi practitioner willpower is a good dump stat.
Spoiler: Super huge but completely irrelevant spoiler (click to show/hide)
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I usually reduce strength a bit
I generally use strength as a dump stat. Sure you'll sometimes do no damage, but that's not really a problem beyond the first 2-3 levels. Overall my starting stats usually look something like:
Str: 6 Wil: 6 Dex: 6
Con: 14: Chr: 14 Spd: 14
Int: 10
Occassionally I might take a few points out of charisma and put them into intelligence for the convenience factor. Technomancers pretty much need to start with 14 intelligence, but with technomancy not working in this version there's not much point in taking technology skill to 20.
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I'll frequently reduce charisma by one point. I usually shy away from more than that because charisma at certain levels is necessary for certain quests, and the buy-sell rate modifier is nothing to sneeze at.
Yes, charisma is fairly important in DBT. I don't usually like to start with less than 12. If I remember correctly, 20 is the highest requirement for any dialogue option, and there are several very good things that open up at 16, but 14 will get you through the game and 12 is close enough to 14 that one can pick up a piece of charisma enhancing gear and never have to pay skillpoints to increase it. Charisma, intelligence and willpower are expensive to raise and you don't want to get stuck having to use dragonball wishes on stuff like that.
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For non-technologist builds, I usually reduce intelligence a bit, since I can increase intelligence gradually from the library.
If I need points for other things, I sometimes reduce dexterity by one, simply because dexterity seems to be the easiest stat to increase by schools. I'm usually lerry to reduce it any further because it regulates to-hits and negates enemy hits.
Evaluating the value of dexterity is kind of complicated. Yes...it does regulate a lot, but as you say, it's one of the easier attributes to increase. Apart from the trap evasion bonus, everything dexterity gives you you can get from other skills. Also, if you're using run movement mode, while dexterity will give you a small speed boost, the AC bonus it gives you is reduced compared to normal movement mode. I personally find the convenience of starting with 10 intelligence greater than the numerical bonuses of starting with 10 dexterity, so I routinely use dex as a dump stat.
If my math is correct, it would look something like this:
10 int 6 dex
-4 AC
-4 to hit
6 int 10 dex
All identify requirements increased by 4
+1 speed while running
Again, it's a bit more complicated than that, but in general if I'm playing a character build that needs dexterity, it's cheaper to buy dexterity than it is to buy intelligence, and to get those extra 4 points from the library would take 20 character levels. That's a long time. Granted, not everybody needs intelligence. But it's a convenience thing. The game is just easier to play if you have it. Only a very few character builds can identify all item types, and it falls on intelligence to make up the difference.
As for dexterity, ultimately, there are two types of characters who care about dexterity:
* Characters who absolutely need dexterity for training unlocks. For example, kung fu fighters who need dex to unlock weapons training and judo fighters who need it to unlock speed.
* Characters who, for one reason or another, would prefer more armor over the convenience of easier identify. Notably, there's a specific build that when done properly, makes you completely unhittable by the vast majority of all melee attacks in the game. That particular build is dependent on (amongst other things) having a high dexterity. And by the middle game, even if you're not going for full hit immunity, having high armor adds a good deal of survivability and dexterity gives you a reasonable compromise alternative to having to invest in martial arts skill in order to get your hit bonus high enough to hit anything. You don't want to be a sumo barehanded fighter who didn't take kungfu or a fencing weapons fighter who didn't take ballet, and end up unable to hit anything because of it. So the choice is basically either martial arts for to hit and the convenience of easy armor identification, or dexterity for to hit and armor. It's possible to go no AC + high health, but no martial arts skill + no dexterity means that by the early middle part of the game most uniques will chew you to pieces because you can't hit them.
For characters who do invest in martial arts skill, I find that dexterity is nice to have...but there just aren't enough skillpoints to go around to invest very much in it.
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I also get the strength and intelligence increases from these
facilities more often due to starting with memberships purchased
Library and gym training availability is based on total character levels, not when you started. One training is allowed per 5 character levels, with a freebie at level 1. If you sign up at level 1, you can study/workout once right away. Then at level 5 you can do it again. But if you sign up at level 5, you can study/workout twice right away. Sign up at level 100 and you can do all your study/workout sessions at once with no net loss.
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male characters only have one item of +2 charisma that they can easily acquire.
Crocodile skin boots, mirrored shades, tuxedos, silk gloves and flight jackets all give charisma boosts of varying amounts and can be worn be men. All of those except the tux and flight jacket are common drops in Mr Satan's estate. Also, if you've applied the ego item workaround described elsewhere, most clothing types can pick up the designer type which gives them a charisma bonus. Though even with the fix I notice that sometimes ego types get applied in name only, but provide no show no actual bonus when you examine them.
Post by: LordBucket on January 01, 2013, 02:55:20 am
dexterity
Whoops...missed the obvious: dexterity also provides a bonus to avoiding monster throws. That's not insignificant, since so many monsters can throw. Related, I'm looking at the formula now. Chance for a monster to throw you is computed as so:
If you're in immovability mode, they cannot throw you. Period.
Otherwise, add dexterity + dodge. This is your evade chance.
If you're currently under the effects of body oil, then for each piece of body armor or cape that you're not wearing (exposed oily flesh is slippy) add +25 to your evade chance.
Monster rolls 1-100 and adds three times the level of their throwing skill. If they get equal to or above your evade, they succesfully throw you.
For example, black belts have level 2 throwing skill. So if you have dexterity 10 and dodge zero, they roll 1d100+6 and have to get 10 or higher. They'll succeed 97% of the time.
Whereas Honda has level 4 throwing skill. So if you have 20 dexterity and 20 dodge, he'll roll 1d100+12 and have to get 40 or higher. He'll succeed 73% of the time. But take off your shirt and cape and oil yourself up and he'll succeed only 43% of the time.
So, yet another thing that dexterity helps with. But you'd need to spend a lot of points to notice the difference.
Post by: EuchreJack on January 01, 2013, 03:40:28 am
Crocodile skin boots, mirrored shades, tuxedos, silk gloves and flight jackets all give charisma boosts of varying amounts and can be worn be men. All of those except the tux and flight jacket are common drops in Mr Satan's estate. Also, if you've applied the ego item workaround described elsewhere, most clothing types can pick up the designer type which gives them a charisma bonus. Though even with the fix I notice that sometimes ego types get applied in name only, but provide no show no actual bonus when you examine them.
I was actually refering to the costs of the items. A tuxedo is over 1000 Zn, whereas a tutu is 300 (less if you can find a lower-quality version, which is often the case). My male has to find or buy the crocodile skin boots (they cost around 2000 Zn), whereas the high heels give the exact same charisma boost and every female character gets them by default (and males can't even wear high heels). Since those are the items that discriminate based on gender, you can see how males have it harder than females.
Although, I too will pick male character just because I want to learn at the Sumo school. It really is a good school, and the total immunity to throws is a sweet ability to learn prior to fighting black belts.
I tend to die mostly from my inexperience with the mod, especially around level 16 and up. I've never faced the tournament foes, so I wasn't sure of which foes to face at what levels. I still haven't fought all the schools. I once died in Satan's Estate just because I didn't run away when health was low (I've found cockiness is deadly in every game with permadeath, lol).
The reason I rate dexterity higher than constitution is because I personally prefer not to get hit than to have a large reservour of hitpoint to take hits from. The reason I prefer to avoid hits (or take less damage when I do get hit) is because reliance on hitpoints to soak damage means more time spent recharging hitpoints. And I sometimes find that dungeons don't give me the chance to recharge. So if some foe get to my character before my hitpoints recharge, my survival odds are higher if I've got a dodge character instead of a hitpoint one.
Thanks for the data on enemy throws. Honda in particular is quite deadly with his throws.
A couple things I'm confused about:
1) Healing in general. I know the first aid skill exists, and acupuncture is possible to level up, but what do they do? Is there any sort of instant-heal methods?
2) You've mentioned techonmancy as broken. I'm not certain what you mean by that. I understand that deconstructing items is not functioning. I also understand that to be a big deal, as it allows you to learn how to make items and enhancements to items. But what else is broken about it? I've also noticed that the Chi power that allows travel between worlds is gone (based upon the help files saying it's broken and the fact that the guy who is suppose to train interplanet teleport was mentioned as impossible to meet), so I'm assuming that technomancy is the only way to leave Earth (unless I can somehow swipe a spaceship from someone [helpfiles mention somebody else has a spaceship], but I somehow doubt non-technologically inclined characters will be able to operate it).
Also, I'm wondering if our discussion about this game should perhaps be moved to a topic in "Other Games", since we're no longer discussing a "Let's Play". But if you want justification for keeping this topic open as is, we're both discussing different ways of playing this game, so "playing with your buddies" is certainly occuring.
Post by: Neonivek on January 01, 2013, 03:50:07 am
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Some people are never happy.
No, you can't. Out of nearly 300 episodes, transformation was an ability only ever demonstrated by Oolong and Puar, both of whom were so completely minor characters that I'd be surprised if even one in ten people reading this thread could even name them.
Also keep in mind that they were both non-combatants, and the transformation ability itself had no combat utility because the user didn't gain strengths that might be implied by the assumed form. Here's a video of Oolong transforming into a huge, armored knight, but he gains no strength or durability in this form, and even things like a kid firing a slingshot and hot soup hurt him through the "armor" he's made.
No major character, no humans and no fighters ever learned the ability throughout all of Dragonball and Dragonball Z combined. Complaining that it's such an "oversight" seems like a serious overstatement to me.
Yes, it was considered. But how would you implement it? In the show the ability was basically cosmetic, but it allows you to change into anything. Do you understand the coding overhead involved with allowing a user to transform into "anything?" I went through that with the dragonballs. Looking through the scripts right now...the dragonball wishing code is 41k. But the dragonballs were a major part of the world and a recurring theme and it was worth the time to implement them properly.
It gave them abilities that they did not have such as Oolong's rocket form which did in fact give him super flying speed as well it was clear that there are other utilities such as gaining razor edges. (In fact in one episode they considered using Oolong to move Goku to another location very quickly but found that he couldn't hold his weight)
It just feels like an oversight to make a game based on mostly Dragonball and not to include the obvious cool ability right there. Given that the Ninja turtles with their own martial arts included in the game, and a few other features I don't want to spoil.
As well "What could you use it on?" is answered right there. It doesn't "Increase" your abilities it just rearranges it. Boom! perfect mechanics, an ability that allows you to rearrange your abilities and gain other ones, and that is just one use I grabbed at the top of my head.
You don't have to even give fully fleshed out forms. They easily could have been generic to represent a wide variety of possible ones... Or just given a very limited set that you had to learn at a 1 for 1 basis. It could also be where you take "abilities" that cost attribute points into your new form. I am clearly pulling this out of my butt but I have demonstrated that "Transformation" isn't really something as hard as you may be thinking.
The reason it was never added is rather simple. They never added it. I doubt there are other reasons.
As for never happy, you would be surprised at what feature actually hooked me on this (until I couldn't continue through the game because I sucked at it).
Post by: EuchreJack on January 01, 2013, 04:17:46 am
you would be surprised at what feature actually hooked me on this (until I couldn't continue through the game because I sucked at it).
If you don't mind my guessing, I'm going to say you liked the marriage mechanic.
Post by: Neonivek on January 01, 2013, 04:19:44 am
you would be surprised at what feature actually hooked me on this (until I couldn't continue through the game because I sucked at it).
If you don't mind my guessing, I'm going to say you liked the marriage mechanic.
Nope.
Close though.
Besides Marriage mechanics tend to be lackluster in every game that included it EVER! Even Harvest Moon.
Post by: Hanzoku on January 01, 2013, 04:20:50 am
As an aside, what you're requesting would lead to such broken power gaming that it wouldn't be implemented simply because of that. The ability to completely ignore having to build your character in a certain way because you can just swap all your stats around as you desire is... broken.
Post by: EuchreJack on January 01, 2013, 04:27:39 am
you would be surprised at what feature actually hooked me on this (until I couldn't continue through the game because I sucked at it).
If you don't mind my guessing, I'm going to say you liked the marriage mechanic.
Nope.
Close though.
Besides Marriage mechanics tend to be lackluster in every game that included it EVER! Even Harvest Moon.
Since I'm close, I'm curious what feature actually hooked you.
As for Marriage mechanics, yeah I agree. I remember how upset I became with Elona once I realized that having my Orc marry a Bear didn't produce an Orc/Bear hybrid, but just let me transfer my stuff to a new character. And I love how the independent, hardworking women of the Harvest Moon saga were content to sit around the house and complain about the character staying out late once they got married. However, if you really want a game that focuses on forming strategic marriages, you should give the Crusader Kings series a try (in fact, the first game is perhaps better because you can use your wife as a talented advisor, wheras the second game mostly killed that feature for honestly unknown reasons).
Post by: Neonivek on January 01, 2013, 04:48:04 am
Post by: LordBucket on January 01, 2013, 07:55:50 am
1) Healing in general. I know the first aid skill exists, and acupuncture is
possible to level up, but what do they do? Is there any sort of instant-heal methods?
* First aid and blood coagulant stop only bleeding (Be sure to have some way of dealing with bleeds before you go to Muscle Tower, or else you may occasionally step on traps that do ~500 damage before you stop bleeding.)
* Acupuncture fixes all "conditions." Stat loss, bleed, fear, blind, slow, stun, poison, etc. The delay effect described in the item description is not implemented, so don't worry about that. Use is instant.
* Zheng gu shui causes you to regenerate. Quick check...looks like 3hp every turn until the effect wears off.
* Senzu beans will instantly heal/cure anything and everything short of death. Get them from Karin.
* Chi regeneration (ability not skill) restores a variable number of hp/turn based on your settings limited only by how much chi you can feed it. However, it appears that no trainer in the game teaches it. It should be possible to learn it by using a dragonball wish.
* Chi healing instantly restores hit points in adjustable increments of 100, but Kami is the only trainer. Unfortunately he's not easily accessible in the current version because the Nyoi-bo is unobtainable, and even if you do get to him, it's probably unrealistic to convince him Mr. Popo to let you see him unless you're at least level 40 or have released Demon King Piccolo. Of course, you could always use a dragonball wish to learn chi healing instead of training it.
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You've mentioned techonmancy as broken.
what else is broken about it?
What works:
* Disassembly
* Sewing kits (though Joesephine's store is bugged and she won't sell them to you. But they're easy to find.)
* Learning recipes, both via blueprint and disassembly
* Basic construction of electronics and stuff
What kind of works, sort of:
* Some recipes apear to be bugged. Maybe. The first time I tried it, it failed on me. But I've checked again since, and I've yet to see the error I got the first time I tried it.
What doesn't work at all:
* Viewing recipes once they've been learned. This means that while you can learn recipes and build things...you can't actually see what materials you need. Note that recipes are randomized for every character, so you can't just look up what materials you need. You'd pretty much need to figure out what types of material something needs and just carry a whole bunch of them and hope for the best.
* Ego enhancement: this is the most important part of technomancy. Being able to disassemble batteries and turn the parts into, for example...a megaphone...just isn't very useful. The real point of technomancy is to allow you to, for example, disassemble a studded shirt to learn how to make studding, then apply the studded enhancement to all your other armor to give you huge resistance. Or, learn the high capacity enhance from one item, then make all your flame throwers, megphone, laser pointers etc all high capacity rather than having to get lucky and find these things already enhanced.
Speaking of which...have you applied the ego item workaround described here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=55626.msg3909637#msg3909637)? If you haven't, I highly recommend it.
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rate dexterity higher than constitution is because I personally prefer not
to get hit than to have a large reservour of hitpoint to take hits from.
That's a valid strategy, but note that it will work more or less well depending on where you are. Firearms and explosives ignore AC and their damage is only reduced by resistance. So, armor that might make you nearly immune to damage in Mr Satan's estate isn't going to help you much in Muscle Tower.
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I've also noticed that the Chi power that allows travel between worlds is gone (based upon the help files saying it's broken and the fact that the guy who is suppose to train interplanet teleport was mentioned as impossible to meet),
travel between worlds is gone
Interplanetary teleportation is not the only way for a chi practitioner to travel between planets. It's just faster.
As for technomancy, since it turns out it does work after all, I've tested via debug mode and yes, I was able to build a spaceship. However, there appears to be a very silly bug that prevents spaceships from traveling through space.
So yes, there are several valid to get off world that appear to work just fine. Don't read the following spoiler unless you want to be spoiled:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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I'm wondering if our discussion about this game should perhaps be moved to a
topic in "Other Games", since we're no longer discussing a "Let's Play".
I'm toying with the idea of releasing an unofficial V091a branch that fixes a couple minor problems. If I do, I'll make a new topic for it. How about give me a list of the half a dozen or so bugs you'd most like to see fixed, and if they're easy fixes I'll consider it.
Post by: LordBucket on January 01, 2013, 08:06:16 am
It just feels like an oversight to make a game based on mostly Dragonball
and not to include the obvious cool ability right there.
It was not an oversight. It was deliberately considered and the decision was made to not include it. Just like, for example, the decision was made to not allow Boss rabbit to turn the player into a carrot. If you don't like that, *shrug* I'm over it.
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you would be surprised at what feature actually hooked me on this (until I couldn't continue through the game because I sucked at it).
...actually...
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Lets just say that the feature is rather transparent.
...that was my first guess as soon as you said it. During the peak of DBT I had one player in particular who very specifically went out of his way to invoke that particular condition as a character build choice.
Post by: Neonivek on January 01, 2013, 03:02:18 pm
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the decision was made to not allow Boss rabbit to turn the player into a carrot
Wait what!?! :-\
They at least gave him something thematic to replace that I hope.
The more I hear about this mod the less impressive it seems.
Post by: Alkhemia on January 01, 2013, 03:25:51 pm
ouch that pretty harshQuotethe decision was made to not allow Boss rabbit to turn the player into a carrot
Wait what!?! :-\
They at least gave him something thematic to replace that I hope.
The more I hear about this mod the less impressive it seems.
Post by: Neonivek on January 01, 2013, 04:06:40 pm
As otherwise what I said would just be distant critique but I am getting responses that suggests I am striking close to home.
Which had I known I would have more then tempered my statements.
Post by: Alkhemia on January 01, 2013, 04:18:28 pm
I am getting the impression that Lord Bucket made this game/mod.ya LordBucket made the mod not sure why he/she stop though.
As otherwise what I said would just be distant critique but I am getting responses that suggests I am striking close to home.
Which had I known I would have more then tempered my statements.
Post by: Neonivek on January 01, 2013, 04:20:15 pm
I appologise for the way in which I criticised the game.
Post by: Hanzoku on January 01, 2013, 04:41:40 pm
I think it's a lot like Aurora - LordBucket chose to create the Dragonball world to play around with, and allowed other people to also play along. However, he's also the creator of this world, and if something is too difficult to implement given its rarity in the world, it didn't get implemented. It also sounds like this project was not fully completed, and the most available version is several builds back from the last build he did create.
Post by: Neonivek on January 01, 2013, 04:45:25 pm
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I don't know, 'you're arguing with the mod's creator' was sort of unsubtle
No I really didn't know. I got hints with how Lord Bucket responded but I chose to ignore it since it could have just been someone who really liked the mod hating anyone who voices even the slightest bit of disapointment or disapproval (which is common).
Post by: Toady Two on January 02, 2013, 06:35:00 am
Quotethe decision was made to not allow Boss rabbit to turn the player into a carrot
Wait what!?! :-\
They at least gave him something thematic to replace that I hope.
The more I hear about this mod the less impressive it seems.
I hope you are being sarcastic here.
Post by: Alkhemia on January 02, 2013, 07:12:18 am
Post by: EuchreJack on January 02, 2013, 01:19:39 pm
EDIT: Unable to test, she disappeared before I could find her.
Taking things out of capsules also seems broken, athough my character has no science skills.
I've "died" at level 29, and am at North Kai's planet. Unfortunately, I don't know any jokes, and I can't leave (exit stairs are broken, I think). I decided to "suicide" the character, because I wanted the character to go into the high score instead of wizarding.
Also, I was reading the various notes, and came upon Dr. Gero granting the player Android Enhancements. Is that implemented? I'm assuming he's in the Red Ribbon Army Camp.
I also noticed that one can possibly gain Dragon Balls by killing friendlies. I can't find the command to attack friendlies.
Speaking of Dragon Balls, I had two dragon ball sixes. On a related note, items placed in the house are identified.
Post by: LordBucket on January 03, 2013, 03:50:35 am
Speaking of Dragon Balls, I had two dragon ball sixes.
Known bug. Was never fixed even in the final release. It shouldn't interfere with summoning the dragon. Checking the code...you only need seven dragonballs. It doesn't care which.
Given the amount of effort it would take to fix this and that it doesn't interfere with gameplay, I'm not going to worry about it.
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items placed in the house are identified.
Engine limitation. Nothing I can do about that.
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I can't find the command to attack friendlies.
Hmm. Looks bugged in this version. Help files say that - and + are "force specify attack" but they appear to not work. I'm able to use technology items and chi attacks to cause damage to friendlies, but they don't become hostile like they're supposed to. I suppose if you just want to kill them, use ranged tools and abilities and they'll just stand there and let you.
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aking things out of capsules also seems broken, athough my character has no science skills.
Works fine for me. Though encapsulated items don't properly label themselves as encapsulated. Testing it now...I 'u'se a capsule, it queries me for an object, I choose the set of streetclothes in my inventory, it correctly tells me that the item has been encapsulated, I check inventory and the capsule is gone and the clothes now weight .1 pounds (though it should say it's encapsulated and it doesn't), I try to 'w'ear an item and choose the streetclothes and it tells me I have to remove it from the capsule first, I 'u'se item, and it correctly gives me the streetclothes as an option, I select the streetclothes and it asks me if I want to remove it from the capsule, I say 'y'es and the streetclothes once again weigh 5 pounds and the capsule has been returned to my inventory.
What's the problem?
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at North Kai's planet
I don't know any jokes
There are multiple solutions. The easiest one is...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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I can't leave (exit stairs are broken, I think).
I remember that bug. I'll see what I can do about it.
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Also, I was reading the various notes, and came upon Dr. Gero granting the
player Android Enhancements. Is that implemented?
Dr. Gero is in the game, but his dialogue appears to be unfinished and it looks like enhancements are not accessible.
However, he's part of the Android arc, which occurs after finishing all Red Ribbon Army zones. Unless you can find a way to trigger the Trunks' time travel quest line...which appears to be disabled in this version for some reason...the only way to even see Dr. Gero's lab is to finish the RRA arc, which involves clearing some level 40+ dungeons.
Not much after that is implemented. If you can kill Commander Red, that's pretty much the end of the game right now.
The game progression is:
Rabbit Hole (Levels 1-5)
Sewers (Levels 5-9)
Mr. Satan's Estate (Levels 10-15)
Ninja Warehouse (Level 15-21)
Dojo Destroyer quest (Levels 20-23)
Orinji Temple (Levels 17-23)
Muscle Tower (levels 21-26)
Namek (Levels 24-50)
Uranai Baba's House (Levels 25-26)
Underwater Caverns (levels 31-36)
Pilaf's Fortress (Levels 33-40) (Not implemented in this version)
RRA Supreme headquarters (Levels 40-46)
The Volcano (Levels 46-50)
Dr. Gero's Lab (Levels 80-100) (It's there, partially implemented...but if you get here you've already beat the game.
Though the above numbers are stated dungeons levels rather than what you'd necessarily actually do while playing. For example, personally I've been playing a bit since V091 resufaced, and I routinely skip the sewers and Orinji temple, and I typically avoid challenging Jaqcque, Charleton and Hatsumi at their stated levels. And whatever levels you are when you are, you're probably going to gain closer to 10 levels by the time you've finished it. Progression will vary a lot depending on build and how familiar you are with the game, but personally, my mine has typically been more like this:
Levels 1-5: Kill orange belts in town
Levels 5-16: Mr Satan's Estate
Levels 16-28: Do Dojo Destroyer and World Tournament fights
Levels 28 until I die: Muscle Tower
Muscle Tower seems to be really hard in this version. It's a low to mid 20s zone, but it's been killing me even at levels around 30. But I've been doing it without using senzu, so that's probably the problem. There also appears to be a bug that prevents headgear from granting blindness immunity, which is very inconvenient. I'll take a look at that.
Post by: EuchreJack on January 03, 2013, 10:41:00 am
Items being identified when placed in the house certainly isn't a bad thing. The items stay unidentified when they're removed, so it doesn't allow the selling of unidentified items: It just lets the user see what their options are. I call it a perk of home ownership. :P
Specificially, I has an error when I tried to uncapsule the capsule boat that I bought at capsule corp. Could be my lack of sailing skill?
Thanks for the help on the North Kai.
For Muscle Tower, I was thinking of equiping an infantry helmet and flak jacket. From what I can see, it would give me 70% ballistic resistance. I was already using a character with high constitution, and that seemed to help a lot. I might also have my next character learn accupuncture prior to visiting Muscle Tower, so I can cure blindness instantly. I've also had luck just attacking blindly: Most of the early enemies still insist on attacking in melee, so I can still kill kill kill even when blind.
Also, I'd like to mention for the other readers of this forum that Muscle Tower is the stand-alone RRA HQ, the one accessable by land. I didn't figure that out until I had a character save and exit while in Muscle Tower.
Thoughts on Ghost Weapons:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: LordBucket on January 04, 2013, 12:32:44 am
As long as the Dragonball work, I and everyone else should be happy.
Well, most I've managed to find in a single game is four, but short of playing through an entire game, so far as I can tell, they do work. They drop normally, and all the scripts seem just fine when I execute them in debug mode. Shenron shows up, whines at me then grants my wish. Though the wishing code is a bit less refined in this version that it was in later versions. Just be sure to ask him for advice rather than just jumping in. You only get three attempts at a properly phrased wish before he gets annoyed and leaves.
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I has an error when I tried to uncapsule the capsule boat that I bought
at capsule corp. Could be my lack of sailing skill?
Looks like there are several unrelated bugs at work here. I've improved handling in my local copy in case we release a patch, but it's still not perfect.
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infantry helmet and flak jacket. From what I can see, it would give me 70% ballistic resistance.
...oh, I see. I've been shopping at the gun store, not the military surplus store. No wonder I couldn't get any ballistic armor. Yes, that should increase survivability immensely.
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might also have my next character learn accupuncture prior to visiting Muscle Tower, so I can cure blindness instantly. I've also had luck just attacking blindly: Most of the early enemies still insist on attacking in melee, so I can still kill kill kill even when blind.
Yes, that will probably help, since blindness immunity doesn't seem to be working.
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Muscle Tower is the stand-alone RRA HQ, the one accessable by land.
...well, yes. The one surrounding by snow and mountains rather than the one surrounded by missile turrets.
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Thoughts on Ghost Weapons:
Yes, that will work. Also, confirmed just now that artifacts carried on death stay with you in the afterlife. Anyway, it would be less of an issue except that for some reason regular artifacts don't seem to drop in this version. There's a bunch of artifact gear you've never seen. Only dragonballs and quest-related artifacts seem to be dropping.
Post by: Neonivek on January 04, 2013, 04:03:39 am
In that ghosts had no real limitations put on them.
Post by: gimlet on January 06, 2013, 03:46:35 pm
Post by: LordBucket on January 06, 2013, 04:00:59 pm
Once you lose in the World Tournament that's it right?
Yes, one loss and you lose the Tournament. Re-entering in subsequent years is not implemented. But on the bright side, you don't die.
The tourny, of course, is really just a plot hook. It's not important to the overall game so don't stress too much if you lose.
Post by: LordBucket on January 07, 2013, 01:32:30 am
http://web.archive.org/web/20090427104318/http://wiki.t-o-m-e.net/Modules/Dragon_Ball_T
http://web.archive.org/web/20090330074858/http://wiki.t-o-m-e.net/Modules/Dragon_Ball_T/Useful_Tips
http://web.archive.org/web/20090330062744/http://wiki.t-o-m-e.net/Modules/Dragon_Ball_T/Spoliers_and_Gathered_Lore
I'd advise against taking anything on those pages as fact, but I see a couple tidbits that are relevant, and that people are unlikely to discover on their own. For example...the fan lady doesn't appear in V.91, but there's mention of the martial arts sushi eating ability, discussion of alternate Dr Briefs paths, and some other possibly useful things.
Post by: darkshaed on December 06, 2013, 10:40:20 pm
Post by: LordBucket on December 11, 2013, 12:37:05 pm
Lord Bucket, just wanted to thank you for making this module, I've been looking for a way
to play this for ages. Its one of my favorite roguelikes. Thanks
And it was a fun time in my life, building it. I miss it. I'll try to answer questions if you have them, but as described elsewhere in the thread the engine was abandoned and the final ~six months worth of development were lost. I don't have a more recent version than the V.91 that's floating around out there, which unfortunately has some fairly game-breaking bugs, several missing important quest chains, pretty much all of planet Namek is gone, and two out of three of the higher tier character development trees are inaccessible.
If you'd like to play for nostalgia reasons, your first hurdle is going to be getting T3 to actually run on a modern computer. V.91 of the module is for T3 alpha 18. The SDL implementation was unfinished when the engine was abandoned, and the windows releases were notoriously unreliable towards the end. If you don't have a linux system, your next best bet would be I think windows 98/2000/XP. T3 on more recent versions of windows tends to render high ascii characters invisibly. There should be two executables. A tome.exe and a tome-sdl.exe. Try them both, see which one works better. The invisible terrain problem can be improved by worked around by manually editing the terrain feature list to use 7 bit ascii only.
Once you get around that, your next hurdle is going to be that firearms is broken by a stupid bug, technomancy was not finished in V.91, and half of the chi trainers are either broken or missing for various reason. So you're pretty much reduced to playing a generic, unenhanced barehanded or weapons fighter. Also, the dance/ninjutsu quest trees are broken. So...a kungfu based weapons build or either sumo/high health or judo/dodge based barehanded build will get you up to level 20 to 30 or so. If you want to invest in chi, Roshi, Kami and the North Kaio are all broken and the Abbot doesn't spawn correctly after the temple is cleared, but Crane hermit and Korin should both be fine. I think Splinter is broken, but you might check Shredder. He might train you if you can manage to talk to him. It's probably safer to not bother with Chi though and simply invest your points in melee. I recommend taking technology to level 3-7 or so to get access to basic tools to make up for the missing skill trees. It should help. Doing all that, and carefully avoiding talking to Roshi, Bulma, Pilaf, any of the TMNT characters and probably a couple others with broken dialogue, and you can probably play through to Orinji Temple. After that, you'll pretty much hit a wall once you reach Muscle Tower because alpha 18 broke ego items so there's no way to resist status effects. You might try taking up acupuncture and healing yourself a lot, but I just don't think it's realistic to play even much into the middle part of the game.
Post by: EuchreJack on December 25, 2013, 04:17:19 pm
Let us know if you create anything else, LordBucket!
I'd disagree on not talking to Roshi or Pilaf. At the very least, players should kill Pilaf when they have a place to store dragonballs, as he usually drops one. Roshi can safely be spoken with once, and has a vital skill for barehanded characters. The key is to find the file which lists Roshi's skills and make sure you have all the skillpoints you need prior to speaking with him.
Same with Splinter, you can speak with him once and then it's broken.
Also, only challenging dance is broken. Challenging ninja is only slightly broken (shades should protect against the ninja master's blinding attack, but don't, so half the fight you'll spend stumbling around blindly in a room filled with traps, but you can challenge him successfully).
Lots of fun, can at least try to kill off as many school masters as possible. 8)
Post by: EuchreJack on December 25, 2013, 09:28:32 pm
I can't find the command to attack friendlies.
Hmm. Looks bugged in this version. Help files say that - and + are "force specify attack" but they appear to not work. I'm able to use technology items and chi attacks to cause damage to friendlies, but they don't become hostile like they're supposed to. I suppose if you just want to kill them, use ranged tools and abilities and they'll just stand there and let you.
It's actually not bugged: I found the command to attack friendlies. Press "=" to access options, then under "Dragonball T Options" the very first thing is "Never Attack Friendlies". Just turn that off, and you can kill friendlies by walking into them and confirming.
Post by: Zireael on November 07, 2014, 02:31:14 pm
Post by: LordBucket on November 08, 2014, 07:28:01 pm
Any chance of seeing that remade for ToME 4?
No. I invested years into T3 modules, the T3 wiki, writing T3 module developer guides, answering forum questions about T3, generally working with and communicating with people about T3, and if you look around the web you might even find some scans of fliers that I had printed and distributed with the convention swag bags at Anime LA.
Then DarkGod started releasing alphas that completely screwed up the engine, broke a bunch of things that had been working for ages, and after we'd spent about six months continuing development for those new releases assuming the problems would eventually be fixed, one day he announced T4.
So he then strung us along for another six months, continually insisting that T3 development would continue, asking several of us to pitch in and help, until eventually I was working on the official T3 module itself. Then eventually with a great big 'fuck you' to all of us it was totally abandoned, the wiki and over a year's worth of documentation we'd made vanished without warning, the modules site was taken down without any backups made, and I was left with half functional modules I'd invested years of my time into for an engine that was less functional than it would have been if he's simply let it go and told us he was abandoning it in the first place rather than continually stringing us along with increasingly buggy releases.
So he apologized, because he knew how badly he'd screwed us over.
Meanwhile, I'd invested literally thousands of hours over three years learning, developing for and supporting an engine that was abandoned in bad condition.
I have no reason to invest myself into his latest project.
I have occasionally, over the years, considering porting Dragonball Tto adobe flash and releasing it on a games portal. But at this late date, Oculus Rift is probably coming out next year, we're going to be gaming in VR soon...I feel like it's a bit late in the game to be developing 2d roguelikes.
I enjoyed working on DBT. It was a lot of fun, and it would have ended up being the de facto flagship game of the engine. Certainly more people played it over the years than ever played the official ToME3 module. I enjoyed working on Bubblgegum Crisis, with its crazy three-dimensional highway system and fully dynamically generated mission content. I enjoyed working on Zombie Horror, my T3 submission to one year's seven-day-roguelike contest, a game that was terrifying, with thematic music that adapted as elements in the game changed, and quite possibly the most epic and memorable boss fight* of the roguelike genre. And I enjoyed working on BAMBIS: Beautiful Alien Merchant Babes in Space, which was a NSFW roguelike datesim based on TradeWars 2002.
I had a lot of fun with T3.
But...it's done. It's gone. Most of what I did with it won't even run on modern operating systems. And the last six months and couple versions of DBT were forever lost when DarkGod not having kept a backup of the modules site was followed on my end by a hard drive wipe of the last remaining copy.
Spoiler: * (click to show/hide)
Post by: EuchreJack on November 12, 2014, 10:11:07 pm
Otherwise, we understand. Still fun to boot these up from time-to-time.
Post by: darkshaed on June 30, 2023, 05:00:49 pm
Any chance of seeing that remade for ToME 4?
No. I invested years into T3 modules, the T3 wiki, writing T3 module developer guides, answering forum questions about T3, generally working with and communicating with people about T3, and if you look around the web you might even find some scans of fliers that I had printed and distributed with the convention swag bags at Anime LA.
Then DarkGod started releasing alphas that completely screwed up the engine, broke a bunch of things that had been working for ages, and after we'd spent about six months continuing development for those new releases assuming the problems would eventually be fixed, one day he announced T4.
So he then strung us along for another six months, continually insisting that T3 development would continue, asking several of us to pitch in and help, until eventually I was working on the official T3 module itself. Then eventually with a great big 'fuck you' to all of us it was totally abandoned, the wiki and over a year's worth of documentation we'd made vanished without warning, the modules site was taken down without any backups made, and I was left with half functional modules I'd invested years of my time into for an engine that was less functional than it would have been if he's simply let it go and told us he was abandoning it in the first place rather than continually stringing us along with increasingly buggy releases.
So he apologized, because he knew how badly he'd screwed us over.
Meanwhile, I'd invested literally thousands of hours over three years learning, developing for and supporting an engine that was abandoned in bad condition.
I have no reason to invest myself into his latest project.
I have occasionally, over the years, considering porting Dragonball Tto adobe flash and releasing it on a games portal. But at this late date, Oculus Rift is probably coming out next year, we're going to be gaming in VR soon...I feel like it's a bit late in the game to be developing 2d roguelikes.
I enjoyed working on DBT. It was a lot of fun, and it would have ended up being the de facto flagship game of the engine. Certainly more people played it over the years than ever played the official ToME3 module. I enjoyed working on Bubblgegum Crisis, with its crazy three-dimensional highway system and fully dynamically generated mission content. I enjoyed working on Zombie Horror, my T3 submission to one year's seven-day-roguelike contest, a game that was terrifying, with thematic music that adapted as elements in the game changed, and quite possibly the most epic and memorable boss fight* of the roguelike genre. And I enjoyed working on BAMBIS: Beautiful Alien Merchant Babes in Space, which was a NSFW roguelike datesim based on TradeWars 2002.
I had a lot of fun with T3.
But...it's done. It's gone. Most of what I did with it won't even run on modern operating systems. And the last six months and couple versions of DBT were forever lost when DarkGod not having kept a backup of the modules site was followed on my end by a hard drive wipe of the last remaining copy.Spoiler: * (click to show/hide)
Been almost 10 years and I still think about your dragon ball T module. Did you ever port it somewhere else?
Post by: EuchreJack on July 01, 2023, 12:38:06 am
I also occasionally think about this game/mod as well.