Post by: Aklyon on May 07, 2012, 08:28:59 am
The game also features six classes (plus a seventh unspecialized class) based around three main stats: Strength, Intelligence, and Dexterity. There's the three main classes to cover the main attributes, then the mixed classes which cover attribute combinations. However, these classes aren't really set in stone, and it's entirely possible to have a Marauder (who is primarily strength based) to choose all dexterity or intelligence based skills. It would just take longer to get to the right nodes on the massive passives tree.
Guild (with a small stash!): Nist Akath, previously led by aristabulus, then by myself, and now once more Ari is leading it.
http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Vendor_recipes - Useful wiki page.
Spoiler: Old quote for predictive mode only (click to show/hide)
Post by: nenjin on May 07, 2012, 09:37:47 am
Post by: Meta on May 07, 2012, 09:52:00 am
Post by: Aklyon on May 07, 2012, 10:05:01 am
Post by: Ozyton on May 07, 2012, 05:10:51 pm
EDIT: The game also features six classes based around three main stats: Strength, Intelligence, and Dexterity. There's the three main classes to cover the main attributes, then the mixed classes which cover attribute combinations. My character was a templar, who is a strength/intelligence mix. However, these classes aren't really set in stone, and it's entirely possible to have a Marauder (who is primarily strength based) to choose all dexterity or intelligence based skills.
Post by: Aklyon on May 07, 2012, 05:24:38 pm
Post by: Alkhemia on May 07, 2012, 05:27:32 pm
Post by: Aklyon on May 08, 2012, 06:29:27 pm
Post by: Aklyon on May 11, 2012, 12:35:46 pm
Feel free to send me a a party invite or friend request or whatever until then, I'll probably be on most of the time until then as the Witch Aklyonix. Or after then, but I'll be playing a differently named guy then since the Shadow would be available to try out.
Also, has anyone caught anything good yet? (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/31109) :P
Post by: Ozyton on May 11, 2012, 04:47:10 pm
You can send group requests out of game?
Also, I hope that the skill path I'm going down won't make the game too difficult before I reach what I'm aiming for.
Post by: Aklyon on May 11, 2012, 04:54:09 pm
Post by: Bordellimies on May 11, 2012, 05:56:10 pm
Post by: Aklyon on May 11, 2012, 06:06:16 pm
Post by: Deon on May 11, 2012, 06:06:52 pm
Post by: Ozyton on May 11, 2012, 06:15:40 pm
Post by: Aklyon on May 11, 2012, 06:21:16 pm
40 minutes left until the open weekend =3Shadow is released right now, though~
Send a message thing @Atorek if you want to say something to mein Shadow.
Post by: Aklyon on May 11, 2012, 07:03:13 pm
Open Weekend is started.
Post by: Ozyton on May 11, 2012, 07:10:08 pm
Post by: Aklyon on May 11, 2012, 07:10:46 pm
And i wouldn't get to see the ridiculous chat of Open Weekend in hardcore.
Post by: Alkhemia on May 11, 2012, 07:50:36 pm
Post by: Deon on May 11, 2012, 08:21:20 pm
Post by: nenjin on May 12, 2012, 01:41:44 am
The area design style reminds me very much of Titan Quest, which I found kinda dull. But I like the gritty, primitive look of it. Uniques require some thinking about how to handle them, just like D2, but it feels a little bit more lethal. Playing Shadow right now and I'm just kiting things and throwing down traps, spamming some Ice Pulse, or I go in with dual daggers.
I keep going "Yeah I'd probably buy this" but then remind myself it's free to play. As a SP game/thing to do with friends for shits and giggles, I think it's pretty sweet all around, you seem to get a full Diablo experience in a F2P game. The fact everything is an instance except hubs really kind of ties the solo/mp thing together.
So yeah, thumbs up. It doesn't have the sheer production quality of D3, voice acting, ect.. and like Titan Quest I feel there's just a lot of repetitive open area...but unlike Titan Quest it seems to change looks and enemies more frequently. (Thank God.)
Post by: Bordellimies on May 12, 2012, 07:14:32 am
I'm liking it more than I thought I would. So many clever little things going on, from the skill gems that level up, to the flasks, to the way sockets work. It's really nice how the game has very few restrictions on what you can do.And it only has 2 acts now. There will most likely be more when it is released to open beta.
The area design style reminds me very much of Titan Quest, which I found kinda dull. But I like the gritty, primitive look of it. Uniques require some thinking about how to handle them, just like D2, but it feels a little bit more lethal. Playing Shadow right now and I'm just kiting things and throwing down traps, spamming some Ice Pulse, or I go in with dual daggers.
I keep going "Yeah I'd probably buy this" but then remind myself it's free to play. As a SP game/thing to do with friends for shits and giggles, I think it's pretty sweet all around, you seem to get a full Diablo experience in a F2P game. The fact everything is an instance except hubs really kind of ties the solo/mp thing together.
So yeah, thumbs up. It doesn't have the sheer production quality of D3, voice acting, ect.. and like Titan Quest I feel there's just a lot of repetitive open area...but unlike Titan Quest it seems to change looks and enemies more frequently. (Thank God.)
Post by: Aklyon on May 12, 2012, 08:25:28 am
Post by: Dariush on May 13, 2012, 10:25:10 am
Post by: ductape on May 13, 2012, 12:29:03 pm
Post by: Sirian on May 13, 2012, 12:33:02 pm
I probably won't play this.
Edit : also, the graphics are 3d but since the camera and terrain are pretty much like in Diablo 2, it feels like 2d graphics would have been a better choice.
Post by: Dakorma on May 14, 2012, 07:28:43 am
I've played a bit, not convinced. Sure they have some interesting mechanics, but overall i dunno, it feels clunky, unresponsive, bland.
I probably won't play this.
Edit : also, the graphics are 3d but since the camera and terrain are pretty much like in Diablo 2, it feels like 2d graphics would have been a better choice.
On the contrary, and denzi will probably love me being contrary here. I feel that 3d is the perfect choice, given that it's mostly there to support the shadows.
And the shadows in this are fucking amazing, this is the first 3D game I've ever played where the shadows just FELT right, and also didn't lag my system horribly. They aren't too hard, they aren't too soft, they are literally just there being insanely good mood enhancing shadows.
More than that, the random generation needed for this game, and it is quite well random, would require a much lower fidelity 2d style than seen in something like Planescape, or Icewind Dale (IE the only really pretty, high fidelity 2D games I've played.) More than that it would be much harder in 2D to do the fucking shadows seen in this game. Seriously they are amazing, and I keep dwelling on it, but they are fucking amazing and the first shadows that have ever looked and felt right. The game is at very least graphically competent, and I'd say it's one of the first 3D games I've ever played whose artists seem to have mastered a thing called pallete control(The other ones being, the first STALKER in the later sections, and The Void.) Which means the atmosphere is just astounding. I saw my first repeat tileset at the end of act 2, it was actually something that was only noticeable because we(me and denzi) had just been talking about how this game was like the polar opposite of diablo 2 and Titan Quest, and featured ridiculously little straight repeat tilesets.
As far as gameplay goes, I could see this game being hell with even the slightest amounts of lag. Though it's been surprisingly well behaved as my internet has been going all the way to the asylum for severe slovenly conduct as far as upload rates go. Something of note, if you are playing a melee class, you absolutely need some accuracy gear or passive skills otherwise you will miss half the time, making the game seem incredibly unresponsive as you just kind of swing for no damage or response. Also you will miss a lot at lower levels even taking accuracy passives and gear.
The final dungeon in the second act was ridiculous and it actually saw me and denzi running from a few fights to get to the next set of stairs. Not because the combat was too difficult, but because there was just SO much of it. Where as in other dungeons you'd get a chance for a breather and a chance for mana to regen. The manapots on my witch who has everything within reach of level 24 for mana regen and mana size, sat empty for the last half of the final dungeon. It was kind of a let down that they didn't have a final boss at the end of act 2 after the big show at the top of the pyramid, but beta is beta.
My hope for the future of this game is that they do the FtP model well, and don't go full content gating, or anything like that on release. Vanity and grind cutting time saving stuff like skins, armor dye, orbs, respecs for when you get stupid, things like that are fine. But never anything like a you don't get act 4 until you pay 12.95. I hated that in LotRO and DDO. I also hope they don't do a timer system like DFO(dungeon fighter online) or spiral knights.
Post by: Bordellimies on May 14, 2012, 12:19:42 pm
And yeah, the shadows are goddamn gorgeous.
Post by: freeformschooler on May 17, 2012, 12:08:21 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on May 17, 2012, 02:50:30 pm
Post by: Aklyon on May 17, 2012, 02:56:00 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on May 17, 2012, 03:04:32 pm
Post by: Deon on May 26, 2012, 02:04:11 am
The more I play this the more I'm drawn to a certain aspect of it: the difficulty. Mainly in that making the "wrong" choices for your character builds has an immediate instead of long-term effect if you're not prepared to handle it. I've done that with one character so far.You can easily respec though, so there's no way to "destroy" a character by long leveling. And you can try different builds on the same character too, it makes it very pleasing to me.
Meanwhile I've been playing hardcore only lately. Four characters so far. I've managed to survive until the end of Cruel difficulty with a ranger (level 34), my templar elemental assassin build survived to 25 and others were less lucky.
By the way, I love how my witch died.
I've picked Chaotic Inoculation (which gives you +80% energy shields but you get only 1 hp max). I was killing different monsters when I picked up unidentified flask.
*Many of you could have guessed what happened next*.
I pick that mana flask up, quickly identify it without reading its description, wear it. Next fight? Next fight I cast a few spells, drink from a flask and... A big RESURRECT button hovers in front of my face, good bye hardcore.
Yes, that flask had "takes 15% of restored mana from life" effect, how sweet :P. So a lesson for you folks: if you play CI witch, ALWAYS read item and flask effects before equipping/using them :D.
Post by: Aklyon on May 26, 2012, 06:33:41 am
Post by: Deon on May 26, 2012, 07:55:39 am
Kamikaze bosses are no joke. It was something around 1000 pure dmg :D.
Post by: dennislp3 on May 26, 2012, 12:08:04 pm
EDIT:
Pro tip: Don't play path of exile on hardcore when your room mate is streaming netflix/hulu
It causes massive lag that makes you lose characters (just lost my witch that I have had for about 2 months -.-)
Post by: Deon on May 26, 2012, 01:23:52 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/tkXLz.png) (http://i.imgur.com/tkXLz.png)
Post by: dennislp3 on May 26, 2012, 10:25:37 pm
Post by: Bordellimies on May 27, 2012, 05:08:11 am
Needless to say, I refuse to die to almost anything and I still deal tons of damage.
I also play a Templar Summoner, with Zombies, Skeletons and Dominating Blow. Unstable Minions and Necromantic Aegis, Wrath aura (lightning damage) and a rejuvenation totem. The zombies have also Added Lightning Damage and Melee Damage on Full life (Regen and energy shields help to keep this up) and my skeletons have Added Lightning Damage. It is quite cool too, especially with Vulnerability curse. Enemies that aren't resistant to lightning tend to fall quickly to my personal army.
Post by: dennislp3 on May 27, 2012, 08:07:17 am
Resolute technique + 6 endurance charges + uber regen...I was pretty much god....then I got stuck on a corner and died...great bug to have happen and get surrounded and pwned
Post by: ductape on May 27, 2012, 11:12:44 pm
I just hope my crash logs help this fix this eventually, but not sure how many times I want to restart to play this. wish it wasnt this way.
Post by: Deon on May 29, 2012, 03:03:43 pm
Well, closed beta :). They need to polish their engine.
Post by: Jay on May 29, 2012, 07:16:39 pm
A 460, barring other errors, is more than enough, though.
Are your graphics drivers up to date?
Is your graphics card overclocked? (A lot of cards come factory overclocked -- to this end I used to have a 470 that I had to manually underclock because it crashed itself whenever it did anything that put much load on)
Post by: dennislp3 on May 29, 2012, 07:29:39 pm
Post by: MrWiggles on May 29, 2012, 07:32:32 pm
Post by: ductape on May 29, 2012, 07:39:52 pm
At least every time it crashes it sends a report to them next time you start. With that in mind, i must have sent 20 or so reports ot them by now since I actually like the game enough to keep putting myself through it.
BTW, it would be nice to run with you guys in game sometime.
Post by: dennislp3 on May 29, 2012, 09:53:12 pm
I am EST and I play generally when I am not working (varies) as Gawnt in Hardcore mode right now
Post by: Vertigon on May 29, 2012, 10:26:28 pm
Post by: ductape on May 29, 2012, 10:29:22 pm
In-game name right now is Pewpies but I plant to start a new character for Hardcore, i was learning the ropes with him (Still dont think i learnt the ropes yet).
Post by: Aklyon on May 29, 2012, 11:02:07 pm
Post by: ductape on May 29, 2012, 11:40:47 pm
So yeah look for me as Pewpies or Prawnz
EDIT: Oh apparently AoF is out of the game for now but will return in a later update. No problem, still going to play Pawnz and respec later.
Post by: Aklyon on May 30, 2012, 01:16:08 pm
Post by: Rez on May 30, 2012, 07:31:04 pm
Post by: ductape on May 30, 2012, 10:02:23 pm
How did you manage to not notice AoF was out in 9.9? Basically the whole PoE forum (for a day or two) was posting about it, not entierly complaints, and it was mentioned specifically in the patch notes.
Mainly because i dont read those forums and also I started playing in 9.9 because before that, the graphics problems I have were even worse to the point of it being unplayable.
Post by: Aklyon on May 30, 2012, 10:08:31 pm
Also, the camera has a zoom-in function. That was added in one of the recent 9.9 patches according to the release notes on the launcher.
Post by: ductape on May 30, 2012, 10:20:49 pm
Im just hoping they get this solved by next release, since I am pretty sure this isnt a problem on my end.
Post by: Frostbite on May 31, 2012, 12:35:42 am
Post by: dennislp3 on May 31, 2012, 11:28:20 am
Post by: Aklyon on May 31, 2012, 11:30:37 am
Post by: Rose on June 08, 2012, 09:52:22 pm
Post by: Vherid on July 06, 2012, 12:49:32 am
I cried.
This game is too good.
Post by: fenrif on July 06, 2012, 12:51:32 am
I want to play it, stop with the beta allready!
Post by: Vherid on July 06, 2012, 12:52:08 am
What's up with this, is it still in closed beta?
I want to play it, stop with the beta allready!
Yeah, it's supposed to go into open beta Aug/Sep which will open up act 3.
Post by: Rose on July 06, 2012, 01:11:24 am
What's up with this, is it still in closed beta?
I want to play it, stop with the beta allready!
You can always pre-order. I did, even though I was already in it, so I could have 3 keys to give to friends. $10 will only get you 1 key, though.
Post by: Bordellimies on July 20, 2012, 01:36:35 pm
Here's some footage of the new map system the devs are working on.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97SskaQuijo&feature=g-u-u
In a nutshell: Monsters rarely drop special maps which can be used to spawn a special dungeon. These dungeons have random monsters in them with an end boss as well. The maps can be affected by currency items in same way as equipment can, to make the maps provide more items, and more challenge.
So a normal cave map can be upgraded into a map which is something like this:
+25% more loot
Enemies deal +60% damage as cold
You have permanent Elemental Weakness Curse
Enemies have +50% fire resistance
So yeah, really cool. End game stuff mainly though.
Post by: nenjin on July 20, 2012, 03:23:53 pm
Post by: Rose on July 20, 2012, 03:25:27 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on July 20, 2012, 07:44:21 pm
I can have a lil waif wielding a giant hammer and bonking people on the head with it.First off, I love the look of the system. It combines two of my favorite RPG systems into one game (the leveling/skill grid thing and the skill gems) and throws it into a really awesome looking world. Second, this image is awesome. At first it's a thin little girl, then she has a giant hammer, then *bonk*.
Post by: Rose on July 20, 2012, 09:26:37 pm
Spoiler: Sadly, once I got a higher level hammer, the head became smaller. (click to show/hide)
Post by: Rose on July 23, 2012, 11:26:13 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on July 27, 2012, 10:13:01 am
Post by: Aklyon on July 27, 2012, 10:20:58 am
Post by: Aoi on July 27, 2012, 07:22:37 pm
I'd join you Robin, but I can play this at times besides this weekend and I want to try out City of Steam, which is also having a weekend thing (but as an alpha test instead of a beta. Now with elves!)
...That explains why I kept thinking of 'Steam of Exile' whenever I was trying to look up Path of Exile recently. =P
Post by: Bluerobin on July 27, 2012, 07:42:56 pm
Edit: haha this poor website. It's being battered horribly... cycling between a 502 gateway error, a minimal site with just their twitter info, and the full site that crashes back to a 504 time out error before I can register my account. Apparently the game servers are just fine though, so when I get through I should be able to play.
Post by: Aklyon on July 27, 2012, 08:00:43 pm
Buy the pack with one of the Kiwis if you do though, Robin. They don't do much but its nice to have a little fluffy companion in the grimdark of Wraeclast.
For anyone interested, the City of Steam alpha starts in an hour.
Post by: Bluerobin on July 27, 2012, 11:50:32 pm
Post by: Aklyon on July 27, 2012, 11:55:30 pm
Or you could make some other characters to make use of your gems ;)
Post by: ductape on July 28, 2012, 12:02:54 am
Post by: Rose on July 28, 2012, 12:04:21 am
Post by: Kanil on July 28, 2012, 12:05:19 am
Post by: Bluerobin on July 28, 2012, 12:15:15 am
Post by: Rose on July 28, 2012, 12:17:11 am
Post by: Bluerobin on July 28, 2012, 12:26:20 am
Post by: Bordellimies on July 28, 2012, 02:43:03 am
I also have a necromancer in Cruel difficulty, and it is quite difficult there too. The minions deal high damage, but they won't last long. If I get stunlocked, I get gibbed easily too.
So yeah, expect the game to punish you later on.
Post by: Rose on July 28, 2012, 03:08:23 am
Post by: Bluerobin on July 28, 2012, 01:49:10 pm
Post by: Rose on July 28, 2012, 02:14:23 pm
Post by: Aklyon on July 28, 2012, 02:35:11 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on July 28, 2012, 04:22:04 pm
That's another question I had. Is there any death penalty if you're in the default league?
Post by: Kanil on July 28, 2012, 04:39:00 pm
In cruel and ruthless, it's presumably some number between 0 and 15 (possibly 5 and 10?)
Post by: Rose on July 28, 2012, 10:03:16 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/ojSVk.jpg)
Post by: Aklyon on September 09, 2012, 09:42:14 pm
Probably not perfect but relative skilldrasil build here. (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAQMBlhxlajLqueyQaVMlwL_LyGYSqO7iMvt17de5eLj3KaNGr_7zsEl9ootmthL64xmTDTEnnMtBHREPZkxMo1mqTXpxx_y9-6lxZ-ky1BfvGN4TayO-Fgm_0oOGG9qhqnwEBCMwZNKRJwquc3EDTmKMJ0rF0wrtJTJLtA7yLiGuO_a_f_fiZ2J6uhqdWbQL6q9z2Qkd2a129y6hCJm_SiZLGRHES7x50r5ppy5ZzkQN9URiFvLjGknwSXescStpgWlM1VlORtfWqHJM4zQJb0BPh4-7Cp2FDkXvYrvqlCpDudezZGVKbsHV8feSfc3_P3ojF-EUD_8opQ5lUWLc9XwvUYWcGa0=) Feel free to tell me if you think I should adjust it, I haven't the skillpoints to actually get all of that yet.
Patch notes here (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/49469), or see below spoiler.
Spoiler: Thy Patche Notes (click to show/hide)
Post by: Aklyon on September 11, 2012, 10:46:20 am
Post by: Bluerobin on September 11, 2012, 11:07:28 am
Post by: Aklyon on September 11, 2012, 11:52:35 am
Post by: Rose on September 11, 2012, 12:36:49 pm
The only thing i'd have a problem with is if I found a portal gem the day before open beta.This. Ohgod this.
That said, god damnit, I messed up my install, and now I have to re-download the whole everything.
Post by: nenjin on September 11, 2012, 12:46:12 pm
Post by: Aklyon on September 11, 2012, 12:47:28 pm
Spoiler: Minions! (click to show/hide)
Post by: Aklyon on November 08, 2012, 01:24:40 pm
Quote from: Most recent announcemet, PoE forums
It's likely that there will be a 0.9.13e patch before the weekend to update the Beta realm, if we can get it tested in time. Work on the 0.10.0 patch (which will be deployed in December when we enter Open Beta) is going well and an early version should be available for Alpha testers sometime next week.
Post by: Aklyon on November 17, 2012, 12:51:07 am
If anyone is interested in having it, PM me about it. Or post here I guess, it would break up my posts that way.
Post by: Robosaur on November 17, 2012, 01:18:37 am
LAME.
No bishounen male witch Q_Q
Post by: ragnar119 on November 27, 2012, 07:44:55 am
Post by: Aklyon on November 27, 2012, 09:21:08 am
Post by: Rose on November 27, 2012, 10:08:04 am
Post by: Aklyon on November 27, 2012, 10:40:49 am
Post by: Rose on November 27, 2012, 11:09:25 am
(http://i.imgur.com/JNNfe.png)
Post by: Aklyon on November 28, 2012, 11:01:30 am
This. (http://webcdn.pathofexile.com/public/PassiveSkillTree.0.10.0.jpg)
It is 25mb of picture.
Post by: Bluerobin on November 28, 2012, 01:19:23 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 28, 2012, 01:24:32 pm
Also, Firefox opened it on the first try, mr. chrome :P Even Opera opened it perfectly fine according to posts in the thread I got that from :P
Post by: anexiledone on November 28, 2012, 02:55:48 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 28, 2012, 02:58:54 pm
As awesome as that skill tree is, it's also my worst nightmare lol. So many ways to go...If you're dedicated to doing so, you can also run off and grab bits of the tree nowhere near your class' startpoint. Like the templar (near the mid-left) could just up and wander off to the ranger/shadow end of the tree on the far right.
Sorry if that made it worse :P
Post by: Bluerobin on November 28, 2012, 03:36:14 pm
Also, Firefox opened it on the first try, mr. chrome :P Even Opera opened it perfectly fine according to posts in the thread I got that from :PYeah I didn't realize it was an issue until I looked at the thread itself and saw a mention of Chrome not working.
Did they mention if there's going to be another character wipe between the open beta and the launch? I assumed there was going to be, but I haven't done the search myself.
Post by: ragnar119 on November 28, 2012, 03:38:35 pm
Also, Firefox opened it on the first try, mr. chrome :P Even Opera opened it perfectly fine according to posts in the thread I got that from :PYeah I didn't realize it was an issue until I looked at the thread itself and saw a mention of Chrome not working.
Did they mention if there's going to be another character wipe between the open beta and the launch? I assumed there was going to be, but I haven't done the search myself.
There will be only one more wipe, when the game hits open beta, after that no more wipes. Open beta is generally a soft release
Post by: ukulele on November 28, 2012, 04:11:55 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on November 28, 2012, 04:20:20 pm
There will be only one more wipe, when the game hits open beta, after that no more wipes. Open beta is generally a soft releaseOh perfect.
Post by: Aklyon on November 28, 2012, 05:06:51 pm
I had an eye on this for so long, finaly the time is coming!I can give you a closed beta key right now if you want, I have one leftover and it won't be much use afterwards. You could use it as a test or something, since while there is a wipe incoming, you keep all of your character names (unless you delete them after open beta starts, then it won't be reserved anymore))
Post by: Lord Snow on November 28, 2012, 05:12:34 pm
Aren't i supposed to get one, if you guys have one? :S
Post by: Aklyon on November 28, 2012, 05:14:56 pm
Post by: Aklyon on December 05, 2012, 09:48:05 am
Quote
Path of Exile entered Closed Beta in August of 2011. Since then, we've continually added features, content, and fixed bugs as we moved towards Open Beta. A few months ago, we estimated that we would enter Open Beta in December 2012. Although we believe that we can have the build ready by then, we've decided that it’s too dangerous to launch the Open Beta over the Christmas period and Southern Hemisphere summer holidays when many of our staff will be away.
We have therefore decided to enter Open Beta on January 23, 2013, US time. The final character wipe and deployment of patch 0.10.0 (including Act Three) will occur then.
In the meantime, we’ll ramp up the number of alpha testers, community events and beta keys given away.
We want the first few months of Open Beta to set the precedent that we react quickly to feedback on the game and add features/content that players want. We do not want everyone’s first experience with the game to be that nothing changes for a month. If any unexpected problems arose or the game became very popular in December, the support team wouldn't be at full strength to service the needs of all players.
Our development team have worked incredibly hard year-round and this will be their first break in a long time. For most of them, this is the only time they get to travel to see their families or not have to worry about the constant challenges we throw at them at work. Grinding Gear Games is not going to ask them to cancel their holidays. Instead, they’ll come back well-rested and just as eager as you to launch Open Beta.
The other advantage of the extra time is that Jonathan, Erik and I will do extra polishing and testing before the influx of Open Beta players. Between now and January, our Alpha testers will push the 0.10.0 patch to its limits. Their feedback is critical to making sure that the new content is ready for public consumption.
We understand that some community members may be disappointed with this news, and we’re very sorry that we have to adjust the date one final time. You've been patiently waiting for the Open Beta for over a year, and we want to make sure it’s just right. We strongly considered ignoring the dangers of a mid-December release, but in the end we decided that the extra safety would be worth the wait. We have only ever specified an exact date once before - when we entered Closed Beta on August 10, 2011 - and that deadline was met. We will be releasing the Open Beta on January 23, 2013 (US time).
We’ll probably be doing a small media trip in January to show the game to journalists in Los Angeles and San Francisco. If you’re a journalist in one of those cities and would like to talk to us, please get in touch!
What to do while you’re waiting?
Over Christmas we’ll be ramping up the number of events that we run for the community in preparation for the quantity we plan to run during Open Beta. If you enjoy participating in these events, you should find the schedule rewarding.
You may be pleased to hear that the current forum titles that you have received for purchasing supporter packs (such as "Supporter" or "Gold Supporter") will be not be available for people who have joined after the Closed Beta has ended. You’ll be able to keep those exclusive titles forever and display them to show that you were one of the early supporters of the game. We expect to have support for the paysafecard payment method before we enter Open Beta if all goes well.
Every day we’re going to send out 500 Closed Beta friend keys to random Beta users. If you receive one, give it to a friend to try out the game with you before Open Beta.
We’re also adding people to the list that we select Alpha users from. Many have applied so far, and we’re carefully reviewing the feedback and post history of the users to make sure they’re good candidates before we select them. If you’re interested in joining this list, please PM me. Note that the Alpha will still exist once we are in Open Beta as a place to test upcoming patches.
We've been working on Path of Exile for over six years now. I’m so excited that we’re getting close to the Open Beta release, and am really looking forward to the day we get to unleash it on the world.
Post by: XenoX on December 11, 2012, 04:00:42 pm
Post by: XenoX on December 12, 2012, 06:13:38 am
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on December 12, 2012, 09:56:39 pm
So I have another closed beta key. If you want it, speak up- I'll do a random.org drawing for it in about 24 hours.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: aristabulus on December 13, 2012, 10:23:04 pm
I'm content to wait, though, even if other keys come up, even if the asylum is still in my hair... ;) Mainly to avoid the wipe/reset when open beta starts.
Post by: Rose on December 14, 2012, 12:25:10 am
That said, it's a very different beast than Torchlight. if you take D2 as a basepoint for both of them, they each went in the opposite direction from it. Torchlight went the casual direction, while PoE went the opposite.
Post by: ragnar119 on December 14, 2012, 05:42:39 am
I'm hopeful for this game... D3 lost me before launch between always-online and no-mods. TL2 seemed promising, but they still haven't figured out how to write a stable savefile module. (wtf?)Umm, stable save file? What are you talking about man... just disable steam cloud sync mumbo jumbo, and you will not have any problems with that anymore and crapy steam save problems
I'm content to wait, though, even if other keys come up, even if the asylum is still in my hair... ;) Mainly to avoid the wipe/reset when open beta starts.
Post by: aristabulus on December 14, 2012, 01:28:37 pm
Umm, stable save file? What are you talking about man... just disable steam cloud sync mumbo jumbo, and you will not have any problems with that anymore and crappy steam save problems
There are more problems with TL2 than just Steam sync. Just because you haven't experienced them doesn't mean problems don't occur.
Game crashes that corrupt/disappear save files. Patches that corrupt/disappear save files. Quests that don't start/update/complete properly. Yeah yeah, I know, software is complex, and PCs can be a hassle because of all the possible hardware... There are gonna be bugs no matter what. However, any error that means what I accomplished just got erased, it doesn't really matter why it happens. My time just got wasted because of bad code somewhere in the game. Not acceptable, and not forgivable.
I got burned badly on TL1; after being open minded about TL1's stability (hourly crashes at times), I lost ~80 hours of playtime to a save file overwrite bug. Played for a while on my high level toon, then switched to a new guy. I finished up some quests there, went to switch back: surprise! you now have two copies of your new guy!!! (stopped playing TL1 after that) I got burned by TL2 also, but not quite as badly, because it happened early. The game crashed about 2 hours in on my first session, and I lost 3/4 of my progress. My only consolation is that it was a friend's copy, and my own money wasn't wasted.
Runic has garnered a lot of goodwill as The Scrappy Little Studio That Could, but I don't think they deserve it. It breaks my heart, really. I _want_ to like Runic; ideologically, I think they're approaching the gamedev thing from the right angle. Good looking games without chasing photo-realism, good price point, accessibility for modding, not wrapped up in totalitarian DRM. But their QA team needs to go back to Obsidian and stay there. :P
ANYWAYS.
To get back on thread-topic here, I'm interested to hear from the closed beta people about PoE's crafting... How is it? Robust and useful, I hope?
Post by: Rose on December 14, 2012, 04:20:59 pm
That said, much like the rest of the ways to get items, it's a gamble. You could use a single orb and end up with an epic sword of asskicking+1, or you can use up everything you've got and end up with something mediocre, at best.
Post by: Aklyon on December 14, 2012, 05:29:23 pm
Post by: aristabulus on December 14, 2012, 07:24:52 pm
Craftng in PoE is heavily meshed in with the currency items, and it works rather well.
That said, much like the rest of the ways to get items, it's a gamble. You could use a single orb and end up with an epic sword of asskicking+1, or you can use up everything you've got and end up with something mediocre, at best.
I remember doing some truly grindtastic things on Diablo 2 @ Bnet East for good crafting output... Using my 93Amazon with a truly absurd +gold rig (+1400% or so, iirc) to mow down cows, then gamble it all for high ilvl base items. THEN burn crazy stacks of gems and low runes going for a grand conjunction of useful rare affixes. The truly awesome output didn't come around often, but there were a few that were damn close to top end uniques, and a few others that were better than uniques for some quirky builds.
Tying crafting into the currency items seems like a good way to help keep the economy balanced... long term thinking on design. I approve. :)
Post by: Aklyon on December 17, 2012, 09:35:05 am
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on December 17, 2012, 02:46:58 pm
Post by: ragnar119 on December 17, 2012, 03:11:07 pm
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on December 17, 2012, 05:05:15 pm
Post by: ragnar119 on December 17, 2012, 06:44:00 pm
1. Take only items that you need, this is not TL2 or diablo , there is no gold, you have little space to carry items
2. If going to multiplayer the loot is shared between all the players in party (be careful with who you play)
3. Game is hard, get a lot of differences (health, energy shield, block, resistance, depending from how you will play)
4. Do research on the passive skill tree here http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree
Post by: Kanil on December 17, 2012, 06:51:55 pm
This thread will give you an idea on what kind of loot is worth keeping to vendor for currency. In particular, anything with quality can be sold for quality boosting items.
Post by: Aklyon on December 17, 2012, 06:57:14 pm
Continuing from ragnar:
5. White is not special. Blue is Magic. Yellow is Rare. Brown (or orange, it can look like either sometimes) is Unique. Green is for quest items.
6. Your stash is global between all of your characters, so don't worry if your epic melee guy finds a rare/unique completely useless for him.
7. You will need cold resistance to beat merveil, or a larger amount of luck instead.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on December 17, 2012, 07:50:37 pm
I enjoy this game already, though. The skills/slots and item upgrading and transforming is pretty damn neat.
Post by: Aklyon on December 17, 2012, 07:52:39 pm
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on December 17, 2012, 07:54:21 pm
You know, out of all of the descriptions I've heard in PoE, I think you're the first person to describe anything as 'cleric'.
Templar? He looks like a cleric, my bad.
Post by: Urist McBeanie on December 18, 2012, 02:40:30 pm
Let me know if you get one.
Post by: Hugehead on December 18, 2012, 04:37:32 pm
Post by: aristabulus on December 18, 2012, 08:06:07 pm
FRB6D-2R7L5-7D8Z3-6QRRJ
Looks like someone grabbed the first one, and didn't speak up about it... Tried to use it, PoE says it is invalid.
Post by: Urist McBeanie on December 18, 2012, 10:03:03 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 15, 2013, 11:24:58 pm
It'll be on their youtube channel friday if you want higher quality.
Post by: ragnar119 on January 16, 2013, 06:11:13 am
Post by: aristabulus on January 16, 2013, 10:33:15 am
The web DL is small (about 6 MB), allocates space for the actual data, and starts DLing game files. On my nothing special 4 year old XP box, the full client is about 4.5 GB. YMMV, depending on whether it trims the texture DLs to what the graphics card can handle.
Post by: PrimusRibbus on January 16, 2013, 07:57:31 pm
That said, I do have some concerns about the future of the game. Global chat currently talks more about Blizzard than it does about PoE. It seems like a large portion of the PoE playerbase plays the game because they want to stick it to Diablo 3, rather than because they like PoE. As evidenced by past games with communities who were excited for the game because they hated another game, it doesn't translate into lasting success.
I really hope GGG sees financial success from PoE, but I have a sinking feeling in my gut that the angry Blizzard fanboys with rose-colored nostalgia glasses are going jump ship within the next few months.
Post by: Aklyon on January 16, 2013, 08:13:37 pm
Post by: PrimusRibbus on January 16, 2013, 08:59:16 pm
D3 is like derails here: If people aren't talking, some bored (or troll) person will drag it back out and cause chat, though it'll be more complaints than anything.
I hope you're right! Thankfully they have the option to turn off Global/Trade with a click of a button so it's no skin off my back, but I really hope that the constant anger doesn't come to define the community.
Post by: Eagleon on January 16, 2013, 09:36:49 pm
Post by: Kanil on January 17, 2013, 12:32:55 am
D3 is like derails here: If people aren't talking, some bored (or troll) person will drag it back out and cause chat, though it'll be more complaints than anything.
I hope you're right! Thankfully they have the option to turn off Global/Trade with a click of a button so it's no skin off my back, but I really hope that the constant anger doesn't come to define the community.
Chat gets way better at higher levels, when you get out of the first global. I'm not sure when that happens now, but it used to be in act 2. By the time you're in the next difficulty, chat's pleasant enough.
Post by: Aklyon on January 17, 2013, 12:35:47 am
Post by: PrimusRibbus on January 17, 2013, 12:37:42 am
D3 is like derails here: If people aren't talking, some bored (or troll) person will drag it back out and cause chat, though it'll be more complaints than anything.
I hope you're right! Thankfully they have the option to turn off Global/Trade with a click of a button so it's no skin off my back, but I really hope that the constant anger doesn't come to define the community.
Chat gets way better at higher levels, when you get out of the first global. I'm not sure when that happens now, but it used to be in act 2. By the time you're in the next difficulty, chat's pleasant enough.
Unfortunately, all difficulties were combined into one global chat as of about two patches. It was a really bad change, in my opinion, and the in-game community suffered almost immediately. http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/64352/page/1 (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/64352/page/1)
HC chat is a lot better than Default chat, and I'm hoping that this means that the sub-communities within the more specialized leagues will continue this trend on release.
Post by: Kanil on January 17, 2013, 12:41:11 am
I haven't been on lately, with open beta so close on the horizon...
Well, hopefully they'll figure something out. The community that's around to actually play the game is pleasant enough, all they need to do is get it together.
Post by: Aklyon on January 17, 2013, 12:42:53 am
Post by: DemonOfWrath on January 17, 2013, 03:09:27 am
Edit: Oh and the changes that are apparantly going to happen to double totems which utterly wrecks a big chunk of my build as I use shock nova totems as extra damage/decoys and just one isn't even worth casting it's that useless.
Post by: 0cu on January 17, 2013, 05:03:35 am
Post by: Rose on January 17, 2013, 07:32:25 am
Post by: 0cu on January 17, 2013, 07:33:29 am
Post by: miljan on January 18, 2013, 06:23:24 pm
Post by: ragnar119 on January 22, 2013, 08:06:40 am
"In April 2012 we launched a crowdfunding campaign on our website where users can purchase Supporter Packs with prices ranging from $10 to $1000. So far the community has contributed US$2.2m to the development of the game. This support has allowed us to grow our team and to polish Act III to a level we are very proud of. Thank you so much for the generous support!"
Nice.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on January 22, 2013, 04:42:17 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 04:52:24 pm
Theres also Act 3 Ex, the small bits of Act 3 they didn't have time to finish up that they'll add later in the year.
Speaking of tomorrow, Relevant. (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/70299/)
Post by: Vicomt on January 22, 2013, 05:55:43 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 05:59:14 pm
Looking forward to playing this. I take it everyone's under NDA and can't give out any tips? ;)What NDA? ;)
Also, be more specific. Suggesting energy shield is not as helpful to marauder as it is to witch.
Post by: Neonivek on January 22, 2013, 06:01:15 pm
"No evasion" build for example. (Though I think the "Dodger" build is tougher)
As well there are certain vaguenesses. For example if you have an ability that says you don't get an attribute AND you have another that says you convert that attribute... what wins out?
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 06:03:19 pm
Post by: Neonivek on January 22, 2013, 06:15:23 pm
Some are insane yeah, and then some are just plain stupid. Like Chaos Inoculation + Blood Magic. Or CI + Eldritch Battery.
It is kinda why I predict respecs will have to be paid for with real life cash.
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 06:20:01 pm
The first one of those literally kills you (Use life for skills, yet only have 1 life and masses of energy shield), the second one because now you have no energy sheld and 1 life. There is not enough armor or evasion in the universe to save you from that.
Post by: aristabulus on January 22, 2013, 06:31:25 pm
Honestly the advanced builds in Path of Exile look NIGHTMARISH!
Nope, the transactions are going to be all cosmetic. You have 24 character slots, free respec points from some quests, and as many respec points as you can get orbs of regret (and the rare passives reset if the skilldrasil gets a notable enough change)
That's literally space for 4 specializations for each class. Even without vectors for respec, that allows plenty of room for experimenting, and growing a build organically that suits your personal style. So what if you flub a build and hit a brick wall... dump the decent loot into the stash, delete and begin again with the wisdom in-hand. :)
Post by: nenjin on January 22, 2013, 06:54:35 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 06:56:39 pm
Stash space on the otherhand, is shared between all characters in the same league. ALways nice to have more, you start with four pages of it. (stash uses the same inventory tetris as inventory, but with a lot more space)
Post by: Neonivek on January 22, 2013, 06:59:48 pm
Also, you can buy more character slots (or stash space tabs). I don't know why you need more unless you have 24 names ready, but you can.
Stash space on the otherhand, is shared between all characters in the same league. ALways nice to have more, you start with four pages of it. (stash uses the same inventory tetris as inventory, but with a lot more space)
As long as this doesn't go into Dungeon Fighter Online territory where stash space was actually what outright ended the game for you if you didn't pay up or use packmules.
Heck I'd still be playing that now if I didn't have that issue.
Post by: PrimusRibbus on January 22, 2013, 07:04:15 pm
Also, you can buy more character slots (or stash space tabs). I don't know why you need more unless you have 24 names ready, but you can.
Stash space on the otherhand, is shared between all characters in the same league. ALways nice to have more, you start with four pages of it. (stash uses the same inventory tetris as inventory, but with a lot more space)
As long as this doesn't go into Dungeon Fighter Online territory where stash space was actually what outright ended the game for you if you didn't pay up or use packmules.
Heck I'd still be playing that now if I didn't have that issue.
Stash space in PoE is generous to the point where I'm not sure if GGG intends to make money on stash sales (or perhaps they're banking on extreme hoarders getting addicted to packratting).
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 07:07:31 pm
Also, stuff like premium tabs (name/color it instead of it just being labeled with a number) and at some point public tabs (for trading stuff to people or showing off how
Post by: aristabulus on January 22, 2013, 07:29:52 pm
On other notes, are there clan/guild systems in the game already? Are we doin' a B12 group there, with or without in-game systems for it?
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 07:34:08 pm
There is also a working ignore list, which will probably need as much use as the servers tomorrow if doom-laden predictions about Global chat are correct.
Post by: Aklyon on January 22, 2013, 08:39:07 pm
Post by: Darkmere on January 23, 2013, 03:06:56 am
Post by: Vicomt on January 23, 2013, 03:10:40 am
Stash space in PoE is generous to the point where I'm not sure if GGG intends to make money on stash sales (or perhaps they're banking on extreme hoarders getting addicted to packratting).
This could be my downfall..... I have always been, and always will be, a packrat of the absurd kind.
Post by: Rose on January 23, 2013, 03:14:25 am
So, the site says "final Character wipe" and open beta tomorrow. Does that mean characters made under open beta carry over to the final release? Any words of advice for a brand newbie?
They have specifically stated that open beta characters will stay after full release.
Post by: aristabulus on January 23, 2013, 07:17:51 pm
Post by: Darkmere on January 23, 2013, 07:45:47 pm
It periodically times out with an error of "Can't find File X" and just... stops. Doesn't attempt to retry. Can't resume without closing the installer and doing an integrity check on everything. I'm not going to sit here and babysit the thing while it takes all my bandwidth... so...
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 23, 2013, 07:47:17 pm
What does 'Open Beta' exactly mean?
Does this mean it is F2P For people until release?
Does it mean it was intended for F2P at release and they were just waiting for Closed Beta to iron out the worst kinks before Open Beta?
Post by: Aklyon on January 23, 2013, 08:00:39 pm
And no, its not a limited F2P thing. Its F2P with a cosmetics shop, along with extra stash tabs if you so desire.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 23, 2013, 08:38:34 pm
Post by: Neonivek on January 23, 2013, 08:46:15 pm
Holy shit, why are all the F2P Games so amazing for the most part nowadays.
A LONG time ago people predicted that the microtransaction based MMO would completely overtake the old subscription model and essentially outdate it.
F2P games basically have an alternate payment plan.
Which to admit is oddly the ONLY time the "Casual effect" works in reverse. Since it is free to play BECAUSE there are soo many obsessive compusive people and soo many casuals. As well this has yet to fully backfire as even casuals are freekishly wary of "pay to win" games. So actually improving the game is there.
Mind you I will always have to compare the F2P model in terms of "improving the game" to the subscription model.
Afterall Dungeon Fighter Online has now JUST FINALLY finished filling in all its content... no wait it is still incomplete.
Though I am not sure if I should do Herald versus Herald. Afterall what game has EVER come close to the sheer almighty quality of City of Heros subscription model? Perhaps a more fair comparison is in order.
Post by: Frumple on January 23, 2013, 08:49:13 pm
Holy shit, why are all the F2P Games so amazing for the most part nowadays.Honey n'vinegar, brethren. The best (if perhaps not the most effective) way to get people to give you money is to do something impressive, and then make giving you that money as painless as possible, while giving them as few reasons not to as you can. Quality attracts financial quantity. Sometimes.
What you're seeing is a business model, one of several that's currently competing for a (still fairly) new market. One of my preferred business models, t'be honest :P
Anyway, in the process of downloading. Last time I tried (during the closed beta), the only computer I had access to couldn't run it. This'un's a bit more game capable, so... we'll see. Sometime tomorrow, when it finishes downloading.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 23, 2013, 08:50:57 pm
Post by: aristabulus on January 23, 2013, 09:21:10 pm
Out of curiosity, is this a slow-paced strategy type thing, a fast-paced action game, or a fast-paced-action-cram-strategy-in-somehow-game?
It's an action RPG, lots of Diablo 2 DNA involved... I personally haven't gotten deep enough to weigh in on matters of in-context strategy.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 23, 2013, 09:40:39 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 23, 2013, 10:44:04 pm
You had me at Diablo 2.Inventory tetris, shared stash, barter economy, massive customization, skills that can be modified by other linked skills. Do we need to continue with the D2 references? :)
Also, feel free to mention who you are ingame, the loot system is by no means the greatest but a party could be interesting every now or then.
Post by: aristabulus on January 23, 2013, 11:40:09 pm
Also, feel free to mention who you are ingame, the loot system is by no means the greatest but a party could be interesting every now or then.
I did a namegrab for each class, but they're all a bit verbose... is the friends list based on character names or account names?
Post by: Rose on January 23, 2013, 11:41:47 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 23, 2013, 11:44:01 pm
Post by: aristabulus on January 23, 2013, 11:53:09 pm
I couldn't remember what I named my barbarians way back when... so I came up with a new b12-homage name for my Marauder.
Urist_vonUristsson. :D
EDIT: I'm in Arizona, GMT-7 during the cold months. Likely to be on regularly in the evenings local times.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 24, 2013, 05:16:50 am
My account name is Facekillz058, though.
Post by: Deon on January 24, 2013, 05:37:14 am
Also I love my kiwi, but these new pets are cozy too. It's unfair that they made a cool fireball but not an ice spear effect. I want a frost skull!
Post by: Briggsy16 on January 24, 2013, 06:07:42 am
Loving this game.
Post by: lastverb on January 24, 2013, 07:22:08 am
Post by: BuriBuriZaemon on January 24, 2013, 07:39:31 am
Username is Elsior.
Post by: Rose on January 24, 2013, 08:15:12 am
Are chars separative for servers (euro, us)?No. Same characters on all servers
Post by: Meta on January 24, 2013, 09:34:12 am
We can only add people using their char's name. So please give the name of one of your characters.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 24, 2013, 09:38:34 am
What do the 2 main stats do?
I'm assuming other than the gear you can equip:
Strength buffs raw damage?
Dexterity/agility/whatever it's called in this game affects your hit chance/dodge chance and or critical hit chance?
Intelligence/Magic/what ever it is called in this game affects your maximum whatever spell resource is as well as spell damage?
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 09:43:39 am
Downloading as we speak. I always love playing paladin in this kind of games. Are they any good?Templar can be a very sturdy guy, afaik. Not as tough as marauder generally, but certainly harder to kill than the witch most of the time. He starts midway between the two on the passives skilldrasil.
Username is Elsior.
Strength, Dex, and Int all do two things, and also are requirements for their respective skill gem colors and certain pieces of gear.
Strength adds life and melee damage.
Dexterity improves evasion and accuracy
Intelligence boosts mana and energy shield
If you hover over the stat circles next to your character's startpoint you can see these as well.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 24, 2013, 09:51:47 am
Post by: ragnar119 on January 24, 2013, 10:02:48 am
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 10:05:54 am
Also, elsior we'd need a character name to add you/
Post by: Bluerobin on January 24, 2013, 10:26:12 am
Post by: Simmura McCrea on January 24, 2013, 11:56:10 am
Open Beta's main problem has been download speed, yeah. You can only hammer servers so much before it just causes everyone's speed to drop.Half a gig in the last 3 hours. Dear god.
Post by: Drakale on January 24, 2013, 01:09:24 pm
Diablo III suck in that way, every character of a class is essentially the same, since there is no cost to respec. It's especially aggravating since Diablo II had it right in the first place.
Post by: aristabulus on January 24, 2013, 01:49:09 pm
Open Beta's main problem has been download speed, yeah. You can only hammer servers so much before it just causes everyone's speed to drop.Half a gig in the last 3 hours. Dear god.
This is exactly why I did my main client DL a week ago. The only slowdown I've suffered was the little 8 MB hotfix they did for the act 3 boss... took 10-15 minutes, whereas the client and the main OB patch roared along near the peak of what my connection can handle.
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 02:10:33 pm
It doesn't work any differently, but it looks pretty awesome in comparison I'd say, now that I have the gem again to use. :)
Post by: Neonivek on January 24, 2013, 04:41:18 pm
That is... rather annoying.
Post by: nenjin on January 24, 2013, 04:45:32 pm
So basically as of right now I might as well uninstall this game since I am already behind everyone I could possibly play this with
That is... rather annoying.
You're always such a bundle of sunshine.
Post by: Neonivek on January 24, 2013, 04:46:43 pm
So basically as of right now I might as well uninstall this game since I am already behind everyone I could possibly play this with
That is... rather annoying.
You're always such a bundle of sunshine.
I am just a little mad that collapsing because of lack of sleep yesterday has pretty much punished me.
Post by: hemmingjay on January 24, 2013, 04:50:26 pm
Post by: Neonivek on January 24, 2013, 04:55:16 pm
People roll alts. I just did as a matter of fact. Also, random groups are just fine in this game.
They did that already. They now have all their alts at a level too high for me to catch up.
Post by: BuriBuriZaemon on January 24, 2013, 05:01:25 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 05:49:44 pm
All of them?People roll alts. I just did as a matter of fact. Also, random groups are just fine in this game.
They did that already. They now have all their alts at a level too high for me to catch up.
Because you can make a lot of alts with 24 character slots.
Post by: BuriBuriZaemon on January 24, 2013, 05:55:25 pm
Another popular build is Chaos Inoculation (CI) Cold Witch. CI gives your witch immunity to chaos damage and (not sure about this) 50% increase to Energy Shield, but set your max HP to 1. So yes you're a one hit wonder.
Thoughts?
Post by: aristabulus on January 24, 2013, 05:58:31 pm
People roll alts. I just did as a matter of fact. Also, random groups are just fine in this game.
They did that already. They now have all their alts at a level too high for me to catch up.
I haven't put more than a few hours in, because the game's not leaving anytime soon. My ranger is maybe L8, the rest are barely-made-it-to-town. By the time I turned in last night, there were announcements of first-at-L50 or so. I guess some folks called out sick, lol. But not all of us.
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 06:01:42 pm
1. its always been one of the longest slow-burners. It does great once you've gotten things far enough along, but until then its kinda slow.
2. zombie health got nerfed too much at the moment, so they're more fragile then they used to be by far.
As to CI, pay attention to the patch notes (or the 0.10.0 passives tree): CI no longer gives ES bonus. They didn't wipe the class forums along with the characters, so anything not updated since yesterday (or today) is either out of date, or at best will have a broken passive tree link.
Also, CI is more gear-dependant, since you have two sources of ES: Passives (including Intelligence), and gear. Th passives are percentage bonuses the majorty of th time, so if you got no ES, you're up the creek if you pick CI.
Post by: BuriBuriZaemon on January 24, 2013, 06:07:40 pm
The problem with Necro Witch right now is twofold:
1. its always been one of the longest slow-burners. It does great once you've gotten things far enough along, but until then its kinda slow.
2. zombie health got nerfed too much at the moment, so they're more fragile then they used to be by far.
As to CI, pay attention to the patch notes (or the 0.10.0 passives tree): CI no longer gives ES bonus.
Thanks for the info. Yes I got confused about the ES bonus status. I don't mind Necro Witch's slow start, I am just worried the gameplay will bore me to death because that's what I felt about Necromancer in Diablo 2. I will go CI Cold Witch for now.
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 06:09:33 pm
Post by: Rilder on January 24, 2013, 06:16:58 pm
Post by: hemmingjay on January 24, 2013, 06:39:43 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 07:09:54 pm
The way people have been going on about this you'd think it was the BESTEST GAME EVAR. However I just haven't been able to find much fun in it thus far. Maybe its cause I never played Diablo or something. I'll keep trying for a couple days but I expect this to be uninstalled by Monday.Everygame is the bestest game evar, that the whole point of hype :)
Aside from that, diablo-like ARPGs are like any other genre, not everyone likes them that much, but plenty of people do.
Post by: nenjin on January 24, 2013, 07:25:26 pm
The way people have been going on about this you'd think it was the BESTEST GAME EVAR. However I just haven't been able to find much fun in it thus far. Maybe its cause I never played Diablo or something. I'll keep trying for a couple days but I expect this to be uninstalled by Monday.
I think it has less to do with the overall bestness of the game...and more to do with the fact it's a Diablo clone that's free to play, and a) it doesn't completely suck b) it's not an abusive cash grab and c) they've thrown some interesting (to me) ideas in there, in a genre that as uncreative as FPS are.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 24, 2013, 08:55:10 pm
IGN: Jaylea
Post by: Deon on January 24, 2013, 10:00:40 pm
There is summon skeletons. They don't last very long and usually die in one hit until the gem levels some, but theres also a thing (in the cosmetics shop) to turn it into summon statues.Combine summon skeletons with exploding minions and you have walking bombs! Just put some support gems into it, and it's a viable summoner build.
It doesn't work any differently, but it looks pretty awesome in comparison I'd say, now that I have the gem again to use. :)
Post by: Deon on January 24, 2013, 10:02:19 pm
Downloading as we speak. I always love playing paladin in this kind of games. Are they any good?Templars are cool, I always play either as hammer+shield elemental templar or cold caster templar.
Username is Elsior.
The only problem is that they don't like skirts or pants. Pants are too mainstream for them. It looks a bit silly in heavy armor.
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 10:09:07 pm
Post by: Rose on January 24, 2013, 10:32:58 pm
Post by: WealthyRadish on January 24, 2013, 11:09:09 pm
I'm trying a ranger, working towards crit focus. Is that silly?
Post by: Valid_Dark on January 24, 2013, 11:42:05 pm
but if anyone wants to add me, account name : ValidDark
play hardcore only.
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2013, 11:43:41 pm
Post by: Frumple on January 25, 2013, 12:48:47 am
Any idea how poorly optimized an archer/summoner would be? Zombies make things surprisingly painless for the templar I just gave a go, even though magic in general seems hilaribad early on (guessing it takes off later or something?). Meatshields for the critter actually doing damage and is fairly flimsy is... tempting.
Anyway, just kind of fumbling around, enjoying things. Marauder, templar, ranger, so far. Regen-focused tank (so far, anyway), aiming for lightning blaster (though I currently have no idea what the zappy spells beyond spark [which sucks balls, so far] are >_>), and no clue (though loving poison arrow), respectively. Still on the first... act? I guess. Furthest dude's killed the giant crab thing in the cave. I'll meander more tomorrow.
Post by: Aklyon on January 25, 2013, 01:05:21 am
Other than that, theres lightning arrow (not too bad), Lightning Strike (ranged/melee weapon-based attack, seems to be in high demand in tradechat and is popular with templars), and Arc (chain lightning spell, pretty cool)
Archer/Summoner is pretty stretched out, depending on which way you're starting from. (Ranger needs to go through the middle or through shadow's area to find minion nodes and is going to need a lot of int help and a ton of mana help, Witch needs to go the inverse way down the tree with dex help, Shadow would need to go in both directions and might need a bit of stat help eventually. Templar has to cross the entire tree to get to bows unless I'm missing something in his nearby area, but is pretty close to the minions. Marauder Summon Archer is an absurd idea. Duelist I never really have tried, honestly. Eventually I'll make one.). Try planning it out on the passive tree on the website.
Post by: aristabulus on January 25, 2013, 02:10:58 am
Try planning it out on the passive tree on the website.
For the convenience of those who don't have it bookmarked already. Passive Skill Tree URL (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree)
I've been running into some hardware struggles, both mechanical and organic. Temperatures have been getting higher than I'd like while I run the game, though I haven't had any stability issues yet. (I'm just happy my 4 year old Frankenbox runs it decently otherwise) My mouse hand has been complaining sooner about the clickety-clicking too... So I'm gonna have to limit my play sessions, and plodding and methodical soloing when I do.
-----
I'll be available for trading with everyone, though. Currently using a L13 Ranger, Vyrin_Silentwind, interested in rare bows in the L12-L18 range.
I have a couple of decent rare shields [L8 w one green slot] and [L12 w one red slot] for token payment. A couple ID scrolls, some non-ID fragments, whatever.
If you're looking for things, let us all know so we can keep an eye out.
Post by: Valid_Dark on January 25, 2013, 03:22:15 am
you guys should join the steam gaming group, everyone that plays exile on there all play together whenever they can.
and it's easier to see / talk about creating new characters / setting up playing together through that group chat.
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/dwarfortress
join the group then join the chatroom.
Post by: Aklyon on January 25, 2013, 09:52:31 am
Post by: Frumple on January 25, 2013, 02:25:10 pm
For the convenience of those who don't have it bookmarked already. Passive Skill Tree URL (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree)Ah, useful. Came up with this. (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgIBAMwD2wWEBbUF-QiJC5ENjRAtEJcRDxmKGf4bARzcIXYi6iL0JT8o-iqYLOktgzB8MfoyfjKUOdQ_J0PSRARGcUjnUUdW-l1oX-FrJGvbbAtuqm89b55v8nNTdEF31HfXfRh90n8CfyuGzodBjb-PRpMlkyeVBZUglemXBprxm6GbtaCfoaSm4KcIp9Sr0q_rsTC0DLQatMW4k7-XwFTBM8M6xKLJPcpKyo_MvNDQ037ZC9nG2mTajdwV3Q3h2-LL5oHn6ujW6xTr7u4O73rwQvIe99f5M_lW-oD8xf7I) Basic concept was just to pick up as much +minion life stuff as possible (which turned out to be all of it), then as much bow stuff as possible (which turned out to be most of it). Let the minions tank while the ranger does the damage. Does there happen to be anything painfully obvious I'm missing that someone can eyeball and identify?
Post by: Aklyon on January 25, 2013, 03:37:39 pm
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 26, 2013, 02:25:39 pm
I keep DCing and can't seem to enter different areas.
Post by: Aklyon on January 26, 2013, 02:46:55 pm
Post by: aristabulus on January 26, 2013, 02:50:42 pm
I think most of it can be chalked up to "the first weekend after going open beta", really.
Post by: Aklyon on January 26, 2013, 02:52:11 pm
I'd forgotten it was saturday today >.>
Post by: Bluerobin on January 26, 2013, 09:50:21 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 26, 2013, 10:32:12 pm
Doing much better than I'd expected (especially Shock Nova, which hits incredibly hard once you get the spacing right most of the time, sometimes lightning is finicky and does less damage), though I really do need more mana if I'm going to keep clarity.
Post by: Rex_Nex on January 26, 2013, 10:53:22 pm
Post by: Rose on January 26, 2013, 10:57:48 pm
Post by: aristabulus on January 26, 2013, 11:58:02 pm
Has anybody picked up a mine gem? It's similar to traps, but you can only drop them under your feet, and you remote detonate them. I haven't managed to make them useful yet.
Tactically, I think the idea is that you plant a mine, fall back a bit, then detonate. It's the sort of thing that would be good for a bow ranger or witch... Keeps melee critters at a distance so they can get shot or be eaten by summons. The real trick will be hooking it up to the correct support gems for maximum effect.
Post by: Rose on January 27, 2013, 12:20:24 am
Post by: BuriBuriZaemon on January 27, 2013, 01:20:39 am
Meet Blood Magic life- and resist-stacking mace-wielding Ground Slam Marauder!
We should do Bay 12 Party!!
Post by: Specterspeck on January 27, 2013, 08:05:55 am
Post by: Aklyon on January 27, 2013, 08:15:11 am
Is there any trick to killing mervil? As an ice-focused witch I can barely make a dent on her.Cold resist (or dual sapphire rings) and bash on her with anything. Also Large mana flasks. Its more or less just needing to not get frozen in one spot and hitting her enough if you aren't using something more indirect like fire trap.
Also, not dying is good.
Post by: Specterspeck on January 27, 2013, 08:22:41 am
Is there any trick to killing mervil? As an ice-focused witch I can barely make a dent on her.Cold resist (or dual sapphire rings) and bash on her with anything. Also Large mana flasks. Its more or less just needing to not get frozen in one spot and hitting her enough if you aren't using something more indirect like fire trap.
Also, not dying is good.
Thanks for the quick reply, I'll try stacking cold resist next time. BTW my IGN's Tyvanny if anyone wants to hit me up for some grouping.
Post by: Kanil on January 27, 2013, 09:11:44 am
Post by: Aklyon on January 27, 2013, 05:18:36 pm
1. A lot of people
2. Breaking their servers.
Game is currently fully down while they fix the problems instead of it continuing to crash. From the announcements forum (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/78521):
Quote from: Chris
We're getting absolutely crushed under the number of players trying out Path of Exile, and this has manifested as a server crash that has been occurring hourly today. In addition, there is a very rare bug that caused some players to log in to accounts from other players. The scope of this bug is very limited (and in almost all cases, the players logged out without disturbing anything). Fixes for both are being worked on at the moment. Because the game experience is compromised and people are disconnected due to the crashes, we have turned the game servers off until they can be brought up in a more stable state. I will update this post as we go - it shouldn't be too long! Thanks again for your patience, and sorry about these launch issues. It's amazing to see such high demand for the game.
Edit: The bug where players log in to the wrong account only affected people queued on a login server where that login server had also crashed. We have a fix for this that we are implementing and will test/build/deploy soon.
Edit2: For those interested, player concurrency hit 69850 players before it was high enough to take down the realm. Also, the current server problems do not appear to be to do with the DDOS we endured on the weekend. These are scaling problems with our servers and software, so we can fix them.
Edit3: Jonathan has made a serverside patch for the accessing-wrong-account bug that we are manually applying to the realm at the moment. Thankfully the number of people affected looks small.
Last edited by Chris on January 27, 2013 5:18 PM EST
Post by: nenjin on January 27, 2013, 05:29:30 pm
About back to where I was in closed beta, just past the Prison.
There are a couple features of D3 I'd like them to incorporate.
-A way to warp to party members.
-Party member direction indicators in the main screen.
-Loot showing it's name for a few seconds after it drops.
Other than those I'm pretty pleased.
Post by: Aklyon on January 27, 2013, 05:31:13 pm
Post by: Patchouli on January 27, 2013, 05:36:02 pm
Post by: nenjin on January 27, 2013, 05:36:43 pm
Have you tried pressing Z at somepoint, nenjin? I'm pretty sure thats the 'toggle item names' button. Or you can hold Alt.
Yeah. I just forget to do it sometimes because not all items make obvious dropping noises or always have animation. It was a nice little feature, IMO, in D3. I ran the first part of the game with item names permanently showing, but it messed with clicking and cluttered up the screen. So I switched to the show items button, and ended up walking past a lot of stuff I didn't even know dropped.
Also, what is with loot drops? Are they player-only, unless they're those weird drops with timers? Seems like some lewt only I can see, some loot has timers, and then some loot we can both see, like the occasional rare magic item.
Lastly, class-specific abilities? Seems like all the skill gems I find or have offered to me, my friend gets the same list.
Post by: Aklyon on January 27, 2013, 05:40:41 pm
Class-specific abilities is mostly just based on stats (Clarity is great, but if you don't have high mana good luck supporting it, etc), though unless you're trading you need a specific character to get a specific gem. (Only templar and witch get offered Spark as a gem for the first or second quest, for example)
Update: The game servers are back up after the downtime. There are still some stability problems that they're investigating but the most critical problems are solved.
Post by: Neonivek on January 27, 2013, 05:45:28 pm
I wish they had a way to show what I spent my points on but I accidently did a ranger build.
Post by: Aklyon on January 27, 2013, 05:47:32 pm
I just UTTARLY ruined my character and it is hillariousClick on your character on the website (Or whichever one shows up, then click the right one), click on passive tree. Copy the massive link now in your address bar (after the page loads) here. An example (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgYAE54V5xa_XfJh4nBScNVzs34zh9uMNpmapJG299VP3nfrY_Br8-o=) using my shadow.
I wish they had a way to show what I spent my points on but I accidently did a ranger build.
Post by: nenjin on January 27, 2013, 05:54:37 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 27, 2013, 05:58:31 pm
So really class is just a matter of where you start in the skill web, and a couple other minor things like what gets offered when.Pretty much. Though you won't get all the gems just by getting far enough with one character, you wouldn't be able to use many of them unless you were a jack of all trades.
Post by: nenjin on January 27, 2013, 06:09:55 pm
Post by: Neonivek on January 27, 2013, 06:22:08 pm
Ohh well.
Viper Strike is oddly my strongest skill.
----
Fork is broken
Be VERY careful when you get it.
Post by: Vendayn on January 27, 2013, 06:49:59 pm
So really class is just a matter of where you start in the skill web, and a couple other minor things like what gets offered when.
Yeah, so its more like sandbox style almost. No class specific weapon/armor either. Having said that...there are definitely better paths to take. Like Witch...and I'm not really knowledgeable really...but...Witch starts very close to a lot of element magic passives, and very close to the best/one of the best, summoner talents. So, one could say they are better for a pure summoner or mage-like class. But, I don't really know how the other classes work...so it is all theory I guess.
Post by: Aklyon on January 27, 2013, 06:56:20 pm
Marauder is generally (but not always) the best at having the strength to bust out the most armored gear, and usually can get the most health regen.
Post by: Jar of Jam on January 28, 2013, 06:03:15 am
Fork is broken
Be VERY careful when you get it.
How broken is it ? I got it for my Ethereal Knives and there was nothing wrong with it in the 10.0c patch. Did 10.0d change something ?
Post by: Neonivek on January 28, 2013, 06:10:16 am
Like Explossive arrow.
So always check to see if the move works well with fork.
Post by: Trollheiming on January 28, 2013, 08:22:02 am
The four tabs don't come nearly close enough, and that's after just three days. This game is pay-to-keep-sanity.
Post by: Jar of Jam on January 28, 2013, 09:10:26 am
Make your lives easier, guys. Buy the premium tab pack.I'm at level 26 and so far I don't have any issues with stash space. One tab for currency and jewelry, one for rare weapons, one for rare armors.
The four tabs don't come nearly close enough, and that's after just three days. This game is pay-to-keep-sanity.
Post by: Kanil on January 28, 2013, 09:13:15 am
If you want to match rare names, then you'll need a whole ton of stash tabs, but at that point I think your sanity is long gone and no amount of microtransactions will bring it back.
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 09:32:28 am
Post by: yarr on January 28, 2013, 09:39:03 am
I probably died like 15 times already (playing hardcore) but I keep coming back :D
This game is what Diablo 3 should've been.
Post by: Trollheiming on January 28, 2013, 10:19:37 am
It depends on how much crap you keep. I've bought some more stash tabs, but I'm not using any of them yet. But it's early, just one char at L40.
If you want to match rare names, then you'll need a whole ton of stash tabs, but at that point I think your sanity is long gone and no amount of microtransactions will bring it back.
I've got tabs for MF, Gems, Craft, Craft Mats, Lowbie, Teens, Twenties, Thirties so far.
Playing hardcore, not having the right gear is unacceptable at any level, because I might start over at any moment. If I upgrade, the old gear goes into storage for later. So, I have a tab for witch and marauder gear sets for each decade of levels.
Then, what if a 25+ pandua ring drops. That could be a good ring with some luck and an orb of chance, so I store it in craft mats to try for a Sidhe later... Things build up quickly this way.
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 11:05:29 am
Post by: Trollheiming on January 28, 2013, 11:31:43 am
Well you didn't mention it was HC. Of course you slightly crazy people over there would use more stash space. :)
Getting the message that someone above rank 25 on the ladder has died is worth the price of entry, though. The entire chat goes crazy with people typing "RIP" and "RID" (rest in default) and saying other snarky comments.
Post by: ukulele on January 28, 2013, 11:52:05 am
Post by: Rose on January 28, 2013, 12:36:21 pm
How bout right now?
Post by: Trollheiming on January 28, 2013, 12:50:00 pm
Post by: Rose on January 28, 2013, 12:51:37 pm
I'm on there as Japa, and my character name will be PunchMcFistIII
Post by: nenjin on January 28, 2013, 12:51:55 pm
I have to say, I LOVE that they didn't do the bog standard "Act 2 is desert-themed." Granted, Act 2 of PoE is exactly like Act 3 of Diablo 2....but I cackled out loud when we stepped into the forest and were mobbed by BLOOD DRINKING MONKIES!!!
I'm in a love/hate place right now with gear. I love the fact there's several layers of game systems behind your gear options. I'm definitely not bored when I look over my gear, compared to D3 where I could tell at a glance whether I should give a shit or not. On the other hand, finding a good piece of gear with the right gem slots AND the right slot relationships kind of makes gearing well a crap shoot. I suppose the goal is for players to endlessly spend their time farming for the perfect piece of gear, or farming for mats to modify it in the perfect piece of gear?
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 12:53:08 pm
At least that what I think it is, one of the mods had said they were connected from singapore in global chat before.
Does Act 2 begin after the end of the Prison?Act 2 is directly after Merveil's death. Brutus is more of a major mid-act boss. If you hit U and see a new tab above the map, you're in a new act.
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 28, 2013, 04:52:31 pm
"Realm Restart in 10 Seconds"
NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE
Post by: Lord Snow on January 28, 2013, 04:54:57 pm
I already made it to market sewers before, but as i went back to try farming, the unique there rooted me and i got swarmed before i could log out :|
Now i'm doing a 180, from crit shadow (without equipment) to hp/armor marauder. That will be boring but hopefully saver and less stressing in NORMAL farming hehe
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 05:13:35 pm
Down to two monsters in the Fetid Pool on a new character.You can always just skip the fetid pool until later unless you want the respec points right now.
"Realm Restart in 10 Seconds"
NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE
Post by: hemmingjay on January 28, 2013, 05:16:52 pm
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 28, 2013, 06:08:47 pm
Does it cause 20 knives to be thrown?
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 06:12:32 pm
Post by: Facekillz058 on January 28, 2013, 06:14:14 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on January 28, 2013, 07:05:02 pm
Post by: Neonivek on January 28, 2013, 08:28:39 pm
It really cheapened the game for me and I don't even want to play it, but if I don't play it my friends won't play with me for a long time.
Post by: aristabulus on January 28, 2013, 09:07:31 pm
I think the part of the game that made me question the game's quality was the third act where enemies will suddenly either do "way too much unless you stacked defense in advance" or will "Hit automatically".
There's probably something in the formula that weighs {cLVL vs. mLVL} more than other factors; Diablo 2 was like that also.
Formulas aside... Take a look at your stats in the character pane. If those numbers suggest you should be faring better, and not fighting blue/yellow dudes that target your Achilles' Heel, then put in a bug report. It's entirely possible that the math behind the pixels is wonky.
Post by: Neonivek on January 28, 2013, 09:11:01 pm
I hear some people bring it as high as 90% just to be able to do those sections without a team.
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 09:31:01 pm
Post by: Neonivek on January 28, 2013, 09:35:35 pm
Evasion doesn't hold up in melee very well.
Post by: nenjin on January 28, 2013, 09:55:06 pm
Post by: Neonivek on January 28, 2013, 09:56:44 pm
It probably suffers the most from level differences, I'd suspect.
According to my friend Evasion is a useless avenue to go into right now because the game overnerfs it with each difficulty.
It is better, if you go full evasion, to get Iron Reflexes.
Though I HIGHLY suspect this will change. It hurts Rangers too much.
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 10:00:46 pm
Post by: Trollheiming on January 28, 2013, 11:44:49 pm
Evasion has always been somewhat of a odd defense. Armor reduces physical damage, ES eats damage for you before your health does (excepr for chaos damage, unless you have CI), both do that all the time (ES has to regenerate first though). Evasion is a chance to dodge.
Moreover, a mod in chat said that the more you dodge, the more likely you are to be hit next time. Some sort of "entropy factor" according to him. Even if you could dodge 100% it lowers with each miss till it hits.
Post by: Aklyon on January 28, 2013, 11:53:31 pm
Post by: Drakale on January 28, 2013, 11:58:31 pm
Evasion has always been somewhat of a odd defense. Armor reduces physical damage, ES eats damage for you before your health does (excepr for chaos damage, unless you have CI), both do that all the time (ES has to regenerate first though). Evasion is a chance to dodge.
Moreover, a mod in chat said that the more you dodge, the more likely you are to be hit next time. Some sort of "entropy factor" according to him. Even if you could dodge 100% it lowers with each miss till it hits.
I have been experimenting with that on my shadow archer, and my current strategy is to stand and shoot while tanking one or 2 melee attacks then move back and repeat. I barely get hit using this technique and it allow for longer shooting sprees. A bit more dangerous against freezing or lightning monster that can stun you, not taking chances with those.
Post by: KaelGotDwarves on January 30, 2013, 09:00:06 am
Add me, KaelGotRice.
Post by: miljan on January 30, 2013, 12:12:04 pm
Post by: ukulele on January 30, 2013, 01:47:47 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 30, 2013, 01:54:37 pm
Post by: Simmura McCrea on January 30, 2013, 02:35:13 pm
Post by: Aklyon on January 30, 2013, 03:02:55 pm
Or no bam if you avoid it.
Post by: KaelGotDwarves on January 30, 2013, 05:15:34 pm
http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMAAuMHYwj0EJcRDxEtFm8abCcLKPoqmCycMYhEBEZxSOdJsk25VcZXK1qRYqxqrGvbc1N5A3yDfRiCx4VgiECOvo9GkDOTJ5Ugm6GdrqFtpqynCKh9qsSwd7QMuJO_l8BUyT3MvM36z2XQ0NP71p3ZC-vu7IryHvfX-oD7Cf5J
Is what I'm currently aiming for, the most important thing was rushing Minion Instability on the upper left. When you have endless skeletons that explode, you win.
Required gems are Summon Skeletons/Raise zombies with Minion Life/Minion Damage support. Raise Spectre with Minion Life/Minion Damage Support. Clarity Aura. Additional, Curses like Enfeeble, Purity Aura, Discipline Aura. I don't like using spell totem like others do - 1: it reduces the health of your skeletons which makes them die faster and do less damage when they explode. 2: I like being able to spam-aim my skeletons on things that I want to die. Fast.
You are a godless killing machine that don't need no man. (Or to get anywhere near things that would kill you)
Post by: BuriBuriZaemon on January 30, 2013, 05:58:16 pm
Also I got the Necro unique amulet Sidhebreathe with better than average rolls:
Minion health +11% (meh)
Minion speed +14% (out of 15% max, yay)
Minion damage +14% (out of 15% max, yay)
Just need to get the unique boots!
Post by: KaelGotDwarves on January 30, 2013, 06:06:01 pm
Required gems are Summon Skeletons/Raise zombies with Minion Life/Minion Damage support. Raise Spectre with Minion Life/Minion Damage Support. Clarity Aura. Additional, Curses like Enfeeble, Purity Aura, Discipline Aura. I don't like using spell totem like others do - 1: it reduces the health of your skeletons which makes them die faster and do less damage when they explode. 2: I like being able to spam-aim my skeletons on things that I want to die. Fast.
Oh, if you get to act three and want to go shit all over everything including Vaal runs for rares/uniques, use Raise Spectre on the Giant Gladiator Statues in Act 3 Marketplace. They have THOUSANDS of hp, and make sure you use your transmutation orbs on flasks until you get one that heals minions. They will never die. It's so amazing to have two of them beating everyone's arse.
Post by: Aklyon on January 30, 2013, 06:07:19 pm
Post by: Tnx on January 30, 2013, 06:28:17 pm
http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMAAuMHYwj0EJcRDxEtFm8abCcLKPoqmCycMYhEBEZxSOdJsk25VcZXK1qRYqxqrGvbc1N5A3yDfRiCx4VgiECOvo9GkDOTJ5Ugm6GdrqFtpqynCKh9qsSwd7QMuJO_l8BUyT3MvM36z2XQ0NP71p3ZC-vu7IryHvfX-oD7Cf5J
Is what I'm currently aiming for, the most important thing was rushing Minion Instability on the upper left. When you have endless skeletons that explode, you win.
s on things that I want to die. Fast.
You can take out 4 8% life nodes and take the 3 8% life nodes and grab fitness which gives 10% life and 20 str (all on the left side near zealot's oath).
Post by: KaelGotDwarves on January 30, 2013, 07:38:41 pm
Post by: lordcooper on February 01, 2013, 08:06:36 am
Post by: Rose on February 01, 2013, 08:42:38 am
Passive skill tree build (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMB37CSwY6-ES18g836uJOnCBVQE8xP86pSUfnsy4P3HwKeoa-b6-4o-oLHQYd6uGz2Yqyhbdadtz7GrmbZtHMY1zS-guSQEYqv2mKUoGh02E3-CvJF52Ouk6ZXOuGI8Q==)
Using hammers and cold magic. I've gotten to level 10 in hardcore so far before lag murdered me, but with this I could be a significant tank.
Post by: aristabulus on February 19, 2013, 11:27:26 pm
I've been giving it a few hours a week, slowly slogging through quests. I've been diligently collecting superiors and rares, but haven't gotten farther than Act 2 Cruel... so nothing truly sexy for trade bait yet.
Post by: Rose on February 19, 2013, 11:30:31 pm
I'm currently in playthrough 2 beginning, but mainly because a lot of time was spent trying to play hardcore.
Post by: Aklyon on February 19, 2013, 11:31:59 pm
Like being somewhat sick and having too many books I want to read again. But soon.
Post by: miljan on February 20, 2013, 07:44:50 am
Post by: Aklyon on February 20, 2013, 09:17:17 am
Post by: nenjin on February 20, 2013, 09:52:34 am
Post by: Bluerobin on February 20, 2013, 10:31:34 am
My dual-claw shadow with a surprising amount of survivability from life and energy shield/evasion nodes blinking around with Flicker Strike and zooming through enemies with Whirling Blades is a lot of fun.
Post by: nenjin on February 20, 2013, 10:49:40 am
Post by: aristabulus on February 20, 2013, 02:37:25 pm
As for the gamedev angle, GGG has been laboring with a small handful of people for most of the years prior to OB. As I understand it, the staff didn't really expand until the last year or so prepping for OB, and it's still a small team in the grand scheme. They don't have Blizzard's war chest. They're just NZ indies making a thing.
Post by: nenjin on February 20, 2013, 02:47:40 pm
Post by: aristabulus on June 05, 2013, 02:11:58 pm
The verbose news post about the major changes can be found here (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/400347).
The terse patch notes can be found here (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/403446).
Post by: Aklyon on June 05, 2013, 02:46:01 pm
Post by: PrimusRibbus on June 05, 2013, 02:47:25 pm
Post by: Levi on June 05, 2013, 02:54:49 pm
Might just not be my kind of game though.
Post by: nenjin on June 05, 2013, 02:59:14 pm
Post by: aristabulus on June 05, 2013, 03:19:00 pm
Glad to hear about the rebalancing. Act 3 Cruel was just getting way too brutal, getting one shot every couple of minutes basically killed our play through.
Yeah, some of the noisier people in PoE's General Discussion have been using "Path of Life Nodes" as a pejorative. Based on my own experiences, I can't really argue with it. In spite of grabbing every node I could (with a Marauder) and favoring +life gear when possible, I kept running into a brick wall in Act 1 Merciless, just not enough HPs to quickly defeat an average mob. Act 3 Cruel wasn't a cakewalk either; lots of strategic running through areas, and picking my battles. Finishing Cruel was a huge meat-grinder, died dunno how many times. (Hardcore, with all those lag spikes? Hah! Fuhgeddaboudit.)
Before these changes were announced, I was considering a hiatus until winter. I suppose whether I do that depends on the details of how much the passives really changed.
Post by: Aklyon on October 04, 2013, 11:00:27 pm
-Scion class - Unlockable class, dead center of the passives tree. Daughter of a corrupt noble.
-More skills, including a couple that make white items useful (or magics, or rares, or if you're far too wealthy, uniques!)
-Act 3X, the extended and more properly finished version of Act 3. More lore and boss and areas and other nifty things like that.
-PVP that is not duels. (race-like tournaments and capture the flag)
-Guilds
-Apparently going to be on steam
Post by: aristabulus on October 05, 2013, 02:03:59 pm
My hardware is still on the fence for running the client well, so I won't be up for co-op, but I'm able to do some light trading for low level twink gear.
Post by: Rose on October 05, 2013, 02:19:23 pm
Post by: nenjin on October 05, 2013, 04:37:05 pm
Post by: Aklyon on October 05, 2013, 07:50:53 pm
Post by: aristabulus on October 22, 2013, 10:30:29 pm
The one big thing to discuss here would be the guild additions, which are quoted under the fold...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
So, anyone interested in doing a PoE B12 guild? I'm still on fire with schoolwork, but I think I'll be a little better off in a week or two, once the mid-term squeeze is done.
Post by: Ozyton on October 22, 2013, 10:48:01 pm
I could potentially give it a shot, never played this kinda game multiplayer before.
Post by: Aklyon on October 22, 2013, 11:00:17 pm
Post by: kcwong on October 23, 2013, 09:26:00 am
Post by: aristabulus on October 23, 2013, 09:44:30 am
If you haven't run the client in a while, it will be more like my guess of 2-3 GB, as there was a revision of arts assets a couple months ago.
Post by: Aklyon on October 23, 2013, 12:02:10 pm
Late Edit: Huzzah for optimizations. I can (likely) play act 3 to the end now.
Post by: kcwong on October 24, 2013, 11:20:40 am
Today it seems it's all settled and I can play again. Started a Scion in standard, to test the new gems. Animate Weapon is *very* powerful. 30 seconds duration, but there's no limit to how many you can have up at a time. You can only use it on identified weapons on the ground.
I raised 4 whites (2 with 10%+ quality) and 2 yellows (I didn't even read their description), and together with my 4 zombies, they destroyed Brutus in mere seconds.
Post by: Chattox on October 24, 2013, 05:16:54 pm
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on October 24, 2013, 05:17:43 pm
I've built insane characters, Glacial Hammer FTW.
Post by: Aklyon on October 24, 2013, 06:43:10 pm
Should we make a B12 guild?
Post by: kcwong on October 26, 2013, 05:08:06 am
There's only premium guild stash tab (50 GGG points) and guild member slots (100 GGG points for 10) in the store.
Guild members can donate points into the guild, and then only the guild master can purchase stuff. From what I've read, the master can set permission on the stash tabs on who can retrieve items. Officers can invite new members.
Maps have an alphabet associated; master can put 6 maps into the guild interface to create a guild prefix, which will appear in front of all guild members' names.
Edit: Players are making a list: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/547071
For now, it's basically a different friends list, with a guild chat (&) and shared stash.
Post by: Aklyon on October 26, 2013, 07:33:10 am
Post by: Chattox on October 26, 2013, 11:02:14 am
Post by: Aklyon on October 26, 2013, 11:05:12 am
For using Spectral Throw with a claw though, how does this (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgAA2E2UoNpiaHT56PKXm12omlpSSsg7KBmi5AgF0wOWbj1gQ4MJTDI_JypNFSAs6d0NW69OKimltkFqk9XtwA_STUZxtAyTJxzcf8YRlg5IpzTjhGND8uHC7LTFQFVvVwyNDUlBh7c-_gryRTrhplcxnm-eykrDOlYtrH8=) look guys?
Post by: Chattox on October 26, 2013, 11:56:36 am
Post by: TherosPherae on October 26, 2013, 12:33:15 pm
What is spectral throw? I hear people talking about it in the chat alone with flicker strike like they're the dogs bollocksIt's basically a spell that lets you throw your weapon and have it come back again, although it's augmentable to let you create multiple weapon copies 'n' shit. I'm guessing most people really love it because it's new, not because it's anything really special when compared to other skills.
Post by: Aklyon on October 26, 2013, 03:58:47 pm
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on October 26, 2013, 04:06:39 pm
Post by: nenjin on October 27, 2013, 03:53:33 am
Post by: nenjin on October 28, 2013, 09:54:06 am
Maybe it's just the comparison between last playing my Merciless character and then going to Normal but....
Oh my god she is a BEAST. I grabbed all the good passives around the center so she's a balanced spellcaster/melee atm....
And I'm just demolishing. Put her in mail (Armor/Energy Shield), have a crap load health regen, life on hit, clarity, increased duration and aoe, melee splash attached to Heavy Strike, Increased Projectile Speed for Spectral Weapon......(which actually not only makes it fly faster but also go FARTHER as well....), Ice Nova, Firestorm....
So basically every single one of my attacks is AoE. Bound to my left mouse button, AoE Heavy Strike just flattens whole packs of guys in one swing. Spectral Weapon chews through incoming waves like a lawn mower, flying so far I can hit mobs off screen in large numbers. Animate Weapon lets me have weapons following for up to 60 seconds at a time (in which case I can get about 6 of them going) Firestorm for when things get really out of hand....
I mean, she's like Joan of Arc on steroids, she does it all. Ranged, Melee, Magic, Tanking. Piety is in for a world of hurt.
I'm sure the honeymoon will end short once I start Cruel, but right now I don't think I've kicked this much ass with any character, not even my Life On Hit Cyclone Marauder. At this rate, I don't even feel like I want to play my Witch character anymore, other than for having a dedicated Fire Mage casting Firestorm. Kicking myself that I started my Scion in the Domination League, as it will be months before she can rejoin my other characters/play with my other friends.
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on October 28, 2013, 10:25:05 am
I downloaded it on Steam now that it's available, and made a new character. And damn, I am impressed with how far the game has come. Everything looks better, and the game is so damn responsive. It even handles lag fairly well, which is important for hardcore.
I mean, she's like Joan of Arc on steroids, she does it all. Ranged, Melee, Magic, Tanking. Piety is in for a world of hurt.
I may have to try the Scion; I don't know anything about her yet, but it's hard to break my addiction to speedy speedy bowgirl.
Post by: Aklyon on October 28, 2013, 11:09:55 am
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on October 28, 2013, 11:30:53 am
Also somewhat important for hardcore, Cognitive: /oos if you think you're desynced.
Is that option enabled again? I remember it being disabled due to server stress ages ago.
I haven't had that issue yet. I mostly play POE and similar ARPGs in short bursts nowadays, so that may be helping.
Post by: Astral on October 28, 2013, 02:09:25 pm
The only issue I've encountered so far is the lack of a Summon Skeleton or Spell Totem drop, so I may need to see if some friends have these, as my zombies die fairly quickly, and the revenant I grab can't last very long without something tanking for it.
Of course, I do have Wrath and more recently the Conductivity curse, which made things easier for a while, but I feel I need something that doesn't require corpses in order to tank for me better and progress a bit further, especially on boss fights.
Post by: Aklyon on October 28, 2013, 02:28:49 pm
Spell Totem, I have no idea where it is and if it drops or not.
Post by: aristabulus on October 28, 2013, 09:43:18 pm
Quote
Summon Skeletons is a fairly early quest reward, I think you get it from Brutus?
Yup, reward from Brutus for Templar/Shadow/Witch/Scion in Normal.
Quote
Spell Totem, I have no idea where it is and if it drops or not.
Available as a quest reward from Merveil in Cruel, for Templar/Shadow/Marauder/Witch/Scion.
Data grabbed from ze wiki on Curse's network (http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Quest_Rewards)... Standard caveats apply for a community-maintained wiki just after a major patch.
-----
Astral, which league are you in with your Witch? I have a tidy pile of stuff in Standard, I
The Median XL tones are not a coincidence.... Brother Laz was involved with some unique item stuff for sure, maybe more.
-----
Has anything happened on the guild discussion? Is we gonna do dis? :D?
Post by: Aklyon on October 28, 2013, 10:02:43 pm
Domination on the other hand, seems to really like dropping gems on me that I don't want ::)
Post by: kcwong on October 29, 2013, 12:07:47 am
You need character name instead of account name to add friends; recently I've been playing as Yves_TaleChaser, a Scion summoner.
Post by: Astral on October 29, 2013, 03:06:47 am
I had a point where I didn't notice the summon skeleton shrine nearby, and it kept spawning stuff on me until I died, noticed it as I was wondering what the hell happened.
I know I saw Summon Skeleton somewhere around the early levels, but I figured I'd do better with Firestorm, having some AoE to help my minions out. And I was mostly right, I think, because I wouldn't have made it past the Act 1 boss without a lot of kiting around a wall into my Firestorm.
I wouldn't worry about it too much at the moment though, as I've gotten into a Battlefield 4 obsession with the release. Maybe some other time.
Post by: Aklyon on October 29, 2013, 07:46:28 am
As for domination, I have very few things there, but Alterixia the Scion is there if you want backup. I'm Aklyon in standard.
Post by: kcwong on October 29, 2013, 08:25:23 am
I know I saw Summon Skeleton somewhere around the early levels, but I figured I'd do better with Firestorm, having some AoE to help my minions out. And I was mostly right, I think, because I wouldn't have made it past the Act 1 boss without a lot of kiting around a wall into my Firestorm.
Shock is the most powerful among the elemental statuses; it amplifies damage from all sources by 30% (was tuned down from 40% on release, but it's still awesome), and can be stacked 3 times. There's a notable called Static Blows in upper left that give you more chance to shock for all lightning attacks/spells you use.
Get Static Blows, use Arc and Spark with Elemental Proliferation, then your minions will do a lot more damage.
Post by: nenjin on October 29, 2013, 09:23:38 am
Post by: TherosPherae on October 29, 2013, 11:37:36 am
Shock is the most powerful among the elemental statuses; it amplifies damage from all sources by 30% (was tuned down from 40% on release, but it's still awesome), and can be stacked 3 times. There's a notable called Static Blows in upper left that give you more chance to shock for all lightning attacks/spells you use.That's.... debatable, really, depending on how you use your elemental effects. If you've got minions that are tanky enough to not die when a monster sneezes at them, then you're better off using Shock for more damage. If your minions have less health than a sandwich, however, a well-placed Freeze with Elemental Proliferation can disable an entire crowd of enemies so you and your undead friends can gnaw on them to your heart's content. And then there's Burning, which is pretty powerful on its own but not really worth mentioning for a summoner - it needs a pretty significant base damage to do much, and that usually entails linking stuff together solely for the sake of fire damage.
Get Static Blows, use Arc and Spark with Elemental Proliferation, then your minions will do a lot more damage.
...And then there's Poison, which is so rare it's not really worth mentioning, especially since I'm not quite sure if it actually counts as an elemental status effect.
Post by: kcwong on October 29, 2013, 11:56:49 am
Shock is the most powerful among the elemental statuses; it amplifies damage from all sources by 30% (was tuned down from 40% on release, but it's still awesome), and can be stacked 3 times. There's a notable called Static Blows in upper left that give you more chance to shock for all lightning attacks/spells you use.That's.... debatable, really, depending on how you use your elemental effects. If you've got minions that are tanky enough to not die when a monster sneezes at them, then you're better off using Shock for more damage. If your minions have less health than a sandwich, however, a well-placed Freeze with Elemental Proliferation can disable an entire crowd of enemies so you and your undead friends can gnaw on them to your heart's content. And then there's Burning, which is pretty powerful on its own but not really worth mentioning for a summoner - it needs a pretty significant base damage to do much, and that usually entails linking stuff together solely for the sake of fire damage.
Get Static Blows, use Arc and Spark with Elemental Proliferation, then your minions will do a lot more damage.
...And then there's Poison, which is so rare it's not really worth mentioning, especially since I'm not quite sure if it actually counts as an elemental status effect.
Chaos is indeed not an elemental damage, so Chaos resist is also not an element resist.
For a summoner, cold has the disadvantage of leaving no corpse sometimes. When you face yellow/orange packs dealing elemental damage, they can destroy a lot of your minions in a flash, and you don't want to be out of corpses.
Summoner in this game is a bit weaker at first, as your minions don't have much life. Once you've take some of those minion nodes they will be much tougher and can make good use of your shock stacks.
Necromantic Aegis is particularly good, if you use a shield with life regeneration and resists. Thanks to that, my two alchemist phantoms lasted the whole way from start to the end of act 3 sewers (all three of them), for example.
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on October 29, 2013, 12:02:41 pm
...And then there's Poison, which is so rare it's not really worth mentioning, especially since I'm not quite sure if it actually counts as an elemental status effect.
Poison is Chaos damage. As already almost mentioned by kcwong.
Post by: nenjin on October 29, 2013, 12:08:54 pm
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on October 29, 2013, 12:16:42 pm
Which it seems like most mobs are at least resistant to.
Yep, that's because it's so damn good they had to nerf it during beta. Multiple times. One of the main reasons is its ability to ignore energy shields.
Of note, Wiki says there are only 2 skills (poison arrow, viper strike) and 1 passive (addler's touch) that directly inflict Chaos. Otherwise, it's the support gem. Huh.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on October 29, 2013, 02:06:19 pm
For a summoner, cold has the disadvantage of leaving no corpse sometimes. When you face yellow/orange packs dealing elemental damage, they can destroy a lot of your minions in a flash, and you don't want to be out of corpses.
OTOH using cold makes life alot easier in many situations, for the same reason.
Post by: TherosPherae on October 29, 2013, 02:42:13 pm
Chaos is indeed not an elemental damage, so Chaos resist is also not an element resist.Oh yeah, I forgot that summoners actually need corpses. I thought they were just there for Detonate Dead and for those fuckin' bird-things to vomit at me. :P
For a summoner, cold has the disadvantage of leaving no corpse sometimes. When you face yellow/orange packs dealing elemental damage, they can destroy a lot of your minions in a flash, and you don't want to be out of corpses.
Summoner in this game is a bit weaker at first, as your minions don't have much life. Once you've take some of those minion nodes they will be much tougher and can make good use of your shock stacks.
Necromantic Aegis is particularly good, if you use a shield with life regeneration and resists. Thanks to that, my two alchemist phantoms lasted the whole way from start to the end of act 3 sewers (all three of them), for example.
Or unique converters, which tend to be pretty darn terrible with the exception of Ming's Heart.Which it seems like most mobs are at least resistant to.
Yep, that's because it's so damn good they had to nerf it during beta. Multiple times. One of the main reasons is its ability to ignore energy shields.
Of note, Wiki says there are only 2 skills (poison arrow, viper strike) and 1 passive (addler's touch) that directly inflict Chaos. Otherwise, it's the support gem. Huh.
Post by: Aklyon on October 29, 2013, 02:51:12 pm
Post by: BurnedToast on October 30, 2013, 12:23:22 am
It makes looting (which is about 75% of the point of a game like this) incredibly unsatisfying... oh look a yellow sword, I can't use it I'll.... vendor it for 3 of whatever this stupid blue scraps that I don't need... yay. A whole bag full of loot? Traded for... 1 identify scroll (and a teleport to town scroll costs 3 identify scrolls, trololol). Nice ring in the vendor I want? Too bad, it costs 2 orbs of odormancy and I have no idea where those come from.
I honestly don't see any upside at all and it really kills my interest.
Post by: Astral on October 30, 2013, 02:12:30 am
It does make things a bit more difficult in the trading game, because unless you figure out approximate currency values (3 identify scrolls = 1 town portal, etc) you could easily get ripped off. And with values listed more at bartering rates, where people charge what they want/need, you also have a better chance at getting a good deal than if someone was consulting the "10k gold going price" for whatever item or spell you're looking to nab.
Post by: Biowraith on October 30, 2013, 03:51:56 am
For inventory issues, I just drop everything except scrolls into my stash whenever I'm in town.
My only real complaints are that 1) as said, it confuses things a bit for trading, and 2) I get stuck in that "saving it for later" mode where I don't want to use any of my orbs of fanciness at e.g. level 40, because then I won't have them for my end-game gear at level 100 (ignoring the fact I'll probably alt too much to ever reach level 100).
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on October 30, 2013, 04:09:05 am
I honestly don't see any upside at all and it really kills my interest.
Not having to super duper delivery man packs of items back to a store for nonsensical uristite coinage kills the interest for you?
I think D3 might be more your thing. :)
Post by: Kanil on October 30, 2013, 07:04:23 am
'course, it then creates the problem of blowing all your currency on crafting something and getting fuck all for it, which can be pretty goddamn miserable.
Post by: aristabulus on October 30, 2013, 07:53:48 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I can't really speak to the trading concerns, as I've been playing self-found... Also, I threw a bit of money at stash tabs, so the way I use my ~20 tabs is a bit different than someone with only the default 4 tabs. That said, the organizing column is still useful even without a lot of spare space around it.
... and 2) I get stuck in that "saving it for later" mode where I don't want to use any of my orbs of fanciness at e.g. level 40, because then I won't have them for my end-game gear at level 100 (ignoring the fact I'll probably alt too much to ever reach level 100).
I tend to squirrel mine away too, don't feel bad. I don't hoard them for end-game, as I've only made it to A2 Merciless (and only with one character). I bust out the orbs whenever it feels like I'm taking too long to kill things, or I find rares with crappy mods but decent base stats that get serious consideration when compared to my current equipment. I've definitely poured more orbs into making weapons than anything else, with improving my sockets/links a close second.
I'm in... Domination, I think it is? ....
Then I'm of no help... I haven't even killed Brutus with my goofing-off Scion yet. :( Still dirt poor in Domination, and that may not change until the semester is over.
Post by: Biowraith on October 30, 2013, 09:05:35 am
I'm only at A1 Cruel (and only with one character) :p... and 2) I get stuck in that "saving it for later" mode where I don't want to use any of my orbs of fanciness at e.g. level 40, because then I won't have them for my end-game gear at level 100 (ignoring the fact I'll probably alt too much to ever reach level 100).
I tend to squirrel mine away too, don't feel bad. I don't hoard them for end-game, as I've only made it to A2 Merciless (and only with one character).
I've started using some of them a bit more though, since with all the selling-inventories-full-of-blues my alts have been doing, I ended up with 100+ orbs of transmutation and alteration. Chaos orbs, not quite so much.
Post by: Aklyon on October 30, 2013, 09:10:49 am
Post by: BurnedToast on October 30, 2013, 12:54:55 pm
I honestly don't see any upside at all and it really kills my interest.
Not having to super duper delivery man packs of items back to a store for nonsensical uristite coinage kills the interest for you?
I think D3 might be more your thing. :)
It's satisfying, in the same mindless way a "game" like cookie clicker is. I get to watch my gold number go up, and then eventually I get to trade it all for a nice new upgrade to make my other numbers go up.
It sure beats watching 99% of the loot drops be almost completely worthless, 0.5% giving me some orb or something I don't even know what to do with (if it's a barter system why can't I pick teleport scrolls instead of shards of whatever?) and 0.5% actually being upgrades.
Post by: Karkov on October 30, 2013, 01:24:33 pm
Also, just as a sort of funny story earlier today. Running through Act 1 Normal (Domination league) with a friend who actually had -5% item rarity because of a Unique Rapier he had. We're in voice chat and we run into Brutus' chambers where I just start saying "Bruuuutus, buuuuuuddy. Drop me a unique pls. Drop me a uniiiiique." Pretty much chanting this. Well, Brutus is a champ of a bro. Dropped me a Kaom's... Ring (forgot the exact name). My friend just starts freaking out. 10/10, would farm Brutus again.
Post by: nenjin on October 30, 2013, 01:36:57 pm
Quote
0.5% giving me some orb or something I don't even know what to do with
Reading is a fundamental part of playing the game.....
My only issue with the currency system is that you end up with a shit ton of Orbs of Transmutation, and late-game it becomes a crap shoot whether you'll roll the colors/# of slots you need so gear will work with your preferred build.
Although now that I know the Vendor Recipes, perhaps I can put that crap to use.
Post by: aristabulus on October 30, 2013, 02:05:51 pm
...
It sure beats watching 99% of the loot drops be almost completely worthless, 0.5% giving me some orb or something I don't even know what to do with (if it's a barter system why can't I pick teleport scrolls instead of shards of whatever?) and 0.5% actually being upgrades.
For the most part, grinding for orb-bits is no different than grinding for gold. Think of the ID fragments like silver coins. That would make ID scrolls like a half-crown gold, the portal scrolls a full-crown gold, transmute orbs like a 20-crown platinum, etc. They aren't shiny discs of metallic shininess, but they _do_ have value within the construct, and the low orbs do have a lot of utility once you have enough to use them in batches.
While the system isn't perfect, I understand why GGG set it up like that. GGG is taking the long view, and trying to make sure the economy doesn't suffer the money plagues recorded in digital history. By making the currency also be the crafting materials, the orb supply is constantly being balanced by usage. If something gets watered down enough to be "cheap", someone _will_ buy up all they can find and go on a crafting bender... oops, they aren't cheap anymore! ^_____^
My loot priority is usually rares+magics (for selling or squirreling), then superior whites (to boil down to A-Scraps and Whetstones), then maybe white junk if I'm low on IDs. Small white things like rings and belts always get picked up, to keep my ID deficit down. I go back to town as often as needed, which is sometimes every third mob if the RNG is feeling nice. Other times I go two or three maps between return trips. This is all with running as much Increased Item Quality as I can conveniently fit into my gear without shorting killing power or resists.
Post by: Aklyon on October 30, 2013, 03:59:38 pm
Post by: BurnedToast on October 30, 2013, 04:11:21 pm
Quote0.5% giving me some orb or something I don't even know what to do with
Reading is a fundamental part of playing the game.....
Ok, let me rephrase. I know what it does literally speaking, but say, an armor scrap. Upgrades armor. OK... so what does that mean? does it make the level higher? does it just make the stats better? should I save 100 of them and use them all at once to make an uber item? Who knows. I only have one and I'm not going to waste it experimenting, I'll just stock it away in my stash and forget about it.
For the most part, grinding for orb-bits is no different than grinding for gold. Think of the ID fragments like silver coins. That would make ID scrolls like a half-crown gold, the portal scrolls a full-crown gold, transmute orbs like a 20-crown platinum, etc. They aren't shiny discs of metallic shininess, but they _do_ have value within the construct, and the low orbs do have a lot of utility once you have enough to use them in batches.
While the system isn't perfect, I understand why GGG set it up like that. GGG is taking the long view, and trying to make sure the economy doesn't suffer the money plagues recorded in digital history. By making the currency also be the crafting materials, the orb supply is constantly being balanced by usage. If something gets watered down enough to be "cheap", someone _will_ buy up all they can find and go on a crafting bender... oops, they aren't cheap anymore! ^_____^
My loot priority is usually rares+magics (for selling or squirreling), then superior whites (to boil down to A-Scraps and Whetstones), then maybe white junk if I'm low on IDs. Small white things like rings and belts always get picked up, to keep my ID deficit down. I go back to town as often as needed, which is sometimes every third mob if the RNG is feeling nice. Other times I go two or three maps between return trips. This is all with running as much Increased Item Quality as I can conveniently fit into my gear without shorting killing power or resists.
Yes but the problem is... 99% of loot seems to give not even a whole identify scroll, but a scrap of one. Maybe this changes at higher level (or not?) but it's like getting 1 copper from the loot on noob beach... and then still getting 1 copper from the loot 10 levels later. It's just... meh. It solves the problem of long term economy inflation, sort of (not really since bots etc will eventually flood the market with orbs just like coins) but it does it in an incredibly unsatisfying way (at least to me).
Post by: aristabulus on October 30, 2013, 04:19:42 pm
Yes but the problem is... 99% of loot seems to give not even a whole identify scroll, but a scrap of one. Maybe this changes at higher level (or not?) ...
It does change, but mostly with how much IIQ (read: magic find) you can pack in safely. Once you're past the point of being dirt poor, it's not difficult to fill up on blues to flog off to the vendors.
Post by: Aklyon on October 30, 2013, 04:28:31 pm
Quality 20% items can be used for vendor recipes as well.
Also, IIQ is not in Domination or Nemesis leagues to see how IIR (extra item rarity) affects drops with no IIQ, except for I think the iiq on some uniques.
Post by: Kanil on October 30, 2013, 04:32:13 pm
I only pick up items that are 1. Quality, 2. Yellow/unique, 3. At least one of each color linked, 4. 6 sockets... (and I suppose 5-link and 6-links, but I've never seen those.)
Post by: ragnar119 on October 30, 2013, 04:33:14 pm
Yes but the problem is... 99% of loot seems to give not even a whole identify scroll, but a scrap of one. Maybe this changes at higher level (or not?) but it's like getting 1 copper from the loot on noob beach... and then still getting 1 copper from the loot 10 levels later. It's just... meh. It solves the problem of long term economy inflation, sort of (not really since bots etc will eventually flood the market with orbs just like coins) but it does it in an incredibly unsatisfying way (at least to me).
The game is actually telling you with it small inventory and getting scraps from white and magic items that you should not collect all the items, only the good ones. This is not a standard diablo like game, and it does some things different, and in fact it does it for better.
99% of loot you do not need to pic anyway, only the loot that is important for you, and the better ones that will actually give some good items when you sell them. You should know that different properties of items, and combination when selling can give you different currency/items.
Here is a list what items you can get when you sell them:
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/15223
Post by: ragnar119 on October 30, 2013, 04:36:00 pm
White items (almost) always give just one scroll fragment, because they don't want you to sweep clean entire areas and haul all that crap back to the vendor, because it's mostly crap. I don't know why it drops in the first place, but I safely ignore it.White items that has 6 sockets, or linked blue green and red and some other can also be sold to get some nice things
I only pick up items that are 1. Quality, 2. Yellow/unique, 3. At least one of each color linked, 4. 6 sockets... (and I suppose 5-link and 6-links, but I've never seen those.)
Post by: Aklyon on October 30, 2013, 04:36:42 pm
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on October 30, 2013, 04:42:39 pm
Also, I've learned that you need to (almost) have finished the game to play Scion. booo, I haven't gotten that far pre-release.
Oh well. My bowgirl is doing well, and now that I picked up piercing shots things have gotten almost easy. Nemesis/Hardcore, BRING IT VAAL!
Post by: Aklyon on October 30, 2013, 04:46:43 pm
Post by: Descan on October 31, 2013, 03:09:27 am
Anyway, I'm playing a Ranger, trying for a good-old-fashioned speedy crit-heavy dodger~
Then I might try a tanky necromancer templar, because I can. Are they summons for mage/archer skeletons and such? Something I can summon and can dish out damage while I'm taking the hits? That'd be nice~
Post by: Bormok, God of Mud on October 31, 2013, 04:33:42 am
Post by: kcwong on October 31, 2013, 07:51:21 am
From what I've seen, ranged minions are in short supply. There are Skeletons and Zombies which are melee, then there are Spectres which function like whatever corpse you animate did in life (think Revives from Diablo II), so Spectres can be ranged.
And boy, they are awesome. Link your summon spectre with LMP, faster cast, fork, chain and the likes. There are some notable candidates for spectres - act 3 tentacle miscreation, voidbearer, flame sentinel and the new devourer.
The snakes look good on paper but I find them too fragile, and they like to enter melee range before shooting. Having a Blackguard mage cast lightning thorns on your minions is pretty great too.
Post by: Aklyon on October 31, 2013, 08:13:42 am
Post by: nenjin on October 31, 2013, 09:06:00 am
Post by: Biowraith on October 31, 2013, 02:16:01 pm
I've been running a dual daggers Shadow, and since I've mostly been focusing on offense so far I've been relying on Whirling Blades as a sort of active defense (for those unfamiliar: it's basically a teleport type skill where you rush forward and damage anything in your path). Not just firing it once to get out of a sticky situation mind, but spamming it back and forth repeatedly as a standard tactic.
When it works, it's great, enemies die, I don't. Plus it's kinda fun visually, a sort of Nightcrawler-esque port fu: warp in, stabbity the annoying necromancer, then immediately warp over to the archers and stabbity them, then warp all over the melee guys in a blur.
But as I say the game doesn't seem to cope with it very well: despite my latency being consistently under 50ms, when I use Whirling Blades more than a once or twice in succession (and sometimes once or twice is enough) I guess I desync, because it stops registering hits on the enemies I 'whirl' over, and worse I start rubber banding something fierce and have died more than once due to warping out of danger, only for the game to throw me back into certain death (including one occasion where I narrowly escaped a horde of those suicide bomber guys, and the game helpfully rubberbanded me back into their midst right as they exploded).
I'm hoping this is just teething troubles and it'll improve with time, but from what I gather desyncing has been a long-standing problem, unrelated to individual connection quality, so I may have to shelf the Shadow :-\
Post by: Aklyon on October 31, 2013, 02:30:10 pm
Post by: Biowraith on October 31, 2013, 02:39:15 pm
Post by: Karkov on October 31, 2013, 02:44:30 pm
I miss the days of open beta, there wasn't as much desync back in those days. Or at least it didn't affect me or my friends nearly as much as it does nowadays.
Post by: Descan on October 31, 2013, 02:56:22 pm
Note to self: Get more health. >_>
Post by: Aklyon on October 31, 2013, 03:04:52 pm
...Either get more health or stack up on ES. Also have resists as much as you can.
Note to self: Get more health. >_>
Post by: Karkov on October 31, 2013, 03:39:17 pm
If you're playing a marauder, a fun build is to get tons of life, regen, and two Blood Magic support gems. At that point you practically have infinite mana (you use your own life for skills instead of mana), and can use two auras if you get one reduced mana gem (and level it up). It's been one of the more effective builds for me insofar, I've died about twice due to extenuating circumstances and I'm in Act 2 Cruel. Comparatively to my ranger who died about once per instance, unless I was in an area twelve levels below me (even then it was still pretty dodgy).
ES seems to be a really good alternative to strength stacking; haven't had the chance to mess with it yet but I've seen it in action.
Post by: Aklyon on October 31, 2013, 03:40:59 pm
Post by: Karkov on October 31, 2013, 03:49:35 pm
Post by: da dwarf lord on October 31, 2013, 04:28:58 pm
Post by: Karkov on October 31, 2013, 04:33:19 pm
Post by: aristabulus on October 31, 2013, 06:47:30 pm
...Either get more health or stack up on ES. Also have resists as much as you can.
Note to self: Get more health. >_>
Additionally, get magic flasks that suit how you play. Flask mods that have synergy with your style can be the difference between picking over drops and a respawn with expletives. I burn a lot of my early low orbs getting good flasks.
Post by: nenjin on October 31, 2013, 06:54:33 pm
And yes, resists. They're relevant on normal, even more so on higher difficulties. Good resists (50%+ on Normal) will spare you from getting almost instantly fragged by a ring of skeletal mages, those weird spitting lizard thingies, ect...
Post by: ragnar119 on October 31, 2013, 06:57:59 pm
I played the game first time in closed beta, than little after it went in open beta, and again now.
WHAT I LIKE:
-character customization: I think there is no need to explain this, it is just mind blowing and no arpg in diablo style have anything close to it. With implementation of the trigger gems, the game got one big additional layer of customization. And the core how its implemented makes it possible to add more and more things. Skill design is also impressive, mostly because of how you can make very interesting skills thanks to support gems. From a normal boring fireball to a multi chain bouncing one. A lot and lot of possibilities.
-graphic/art style: The art is very dark and grim and I like it. The end of act 3 has one of the most dark/sick atmosphere i played in a diablo style game. The texture quality, special effects of skills, shadows all this things actually look good. The item and armor are also not more boring as it was. Some skill look very impressive, especially the ones you can buy (shock spiders, cold hand and similar)
-itemization: the itemization is done in a very deep way.A lot of uniques have interesting designs that caters to different builds. You can make builds around some uniques. I still hope with the new proc gems implementation that we will see proc uniques in the future, would love that.
-boss fights: when i was in closed beta, the boss fight sucked. But now i must say, there are actually done really good. The act 2, piety and act 3 boss are done different and work really nice. Even the simple brutus or weawer fights are not that bad anymore (but merveil still sucks for a act boss).
-lore: the plot is nothing special. Its not good, but its also not that bad, but the thing that i am surprised, and that actually a lot reminds me about d2 is the lore. And there is a lot of it, you can read a lot of option lines from npcs, and if you use some new terms you will get new dialogue options. Love the new lore places that are in act 1 areas or act 3 library, and the best thing is almost all of them are voiced over. It is little hard to grasp it all, especially as not everything is told through same dialogue so you need to connect it yourself. The setting is also somewhat unique with actual explanation for gem use in the lore.
-sound/music: its good, nothing mind blowing. There are some new tracks before the act 3 boss fight that are really good, but the thing that is actually maybe little mind blowing is that the voice acting is very professional,and I am surprised by it as GGG after all is still indie.
-leagues/races: interesting concept that will make a place where GGG can test out new things. I am not interested in ladder that much, but small new rules in this leagues do make things interesting and little new
-PvP: not a fan of normal PvP, but capture the flag is actually really fun to play with friends. Its not something that will keep you playing only PvP, but it is a nice short break from normal PoE progresion, and as GGG said they will implement new mods, this may be first arpg where i will actually like PvP.
-small things I like: flask system, currency system, map system
WHAT I DONT LIKE:
-character customization: this may sound strange as i said a positive things about it, but there is a side that I am not a fan of. The way core customization is done is not that much of my liking. The problem i have is it depends too much from items you are wearing. Because how sockets, color and links work, it actually can hurt you more, and prevent you from making the build you want, and limit the customization in a way. Too much item depending compared to other arpgs. The only actually progression of your character not counting items is the passive tree, and that is too little for me. It also makes geting good items very hard as it needs to have sockets and links that you need.
-death animation/combat feel: The animation of character are ok, but actual reason why the combat can feel bland is lack of good death animations. I mean, when they implemented the new scavengers, with the more interesting death animation (that is actually best death animation in the whole game), the game punch and combat feel a lot better when fighting them. (a gore microtransaction is a must buy and does improve the combat feel a little). Also some skill animation when repeating do look bad, as the character is using same animation over and over and does not change it.
-dungeon/area design: The problem i have with this is it just feels bland mostly in act 1 and act 2. Act 3 just blows away first two acts, and you can see that GGG actually got more funds to develop it more. If first two acts where as diverse and interesting as the third the problem would be smaller. There is almost no reason to explore the huge areas (with implementation of rogue exiles its little better, but not that much). There are no random quest, events, secrets, points of interest (something like torchlight 2 did really good).
-economy: I do not care about economy, so this aspect of game is for me a negative one. The reason it is negative is because of economy the drop rates are tweaked and they are much lower compared to games like tochlight 2 or TQ. The game is more balanced around investing a lot more time to grind or to trade, and I dont like that. They have a system to change it, but at the moment GGG doesnt want to, but i hope in future they will see and change their mind the same way they did for party/individual loot.
-small things I dont like: always online/lag, some balance problems that are normal for all arpg, the game is little short event with addition with new areas in act 3.
With all that said i would give it 8. The game has improved a ton from closed and open beta, and i have no doubt it will continue to improve
Now maybe the biggest positive thing not directly related to the game are the devs. And they are actually one of the best devs i have followed. A lot of communication with their huge community (now its probably bigger than 3 million accounts) and a lot and lot of patches and updates. The game will also continue to be like in beta, new updates every few weeks, bigger balance and content additional every 4 months, new acts a year and so on.
The reaction of people and number playing it is also really good. On steam its every day from the release (for a week now) from 20k to 30k. GGG posted that peek was over 60 000 people, and around 50 000 on weekends and that is a lot. I am really glad that at least the release is huge success and hope it will continue like that.
Anyway will be playing the game in the future. Have around 30 characters made on two accounts, most of them are level 1 from closed beta (so i can have all the names xD) that are waiting for their build to be planed out xD.
Post by: Biowraith on October 31, 2013, 07:35:30 pm
I'm not really feeling the negative point about character customisation, but that may just be that I've not played long enough.
Death animation/combat feel is a bit of a mixed bag for me, e.g. I really like the cold shatter death effect, but there's a few others that feel kind of flat (in some cases I continue attacking for a few seconds, not realising a target is actually dead).
I'd like a bit more variety/flavour in the skills to cover other themes than the 3 elements - stuff like nature, shadow, etc. I suppose there's a certain elegance to the current setup, but as an altaholic I love variety on that front.
I definitely felt the itemisation point on my summoner witch - by the end of act 3 I was still using stuff from act 1, but I'm not sure how much of that was due to being a summoner build and so less gear dependent (and +minion gear apparently being in short supply in Normal difficulty).
My pet peeves are:
Desyncing/lag, especially since so far I've only been playing solo (so "shouldn't" have to deal with that sort of thing).
The map - I'd like an option to have it in the top corner, or to adjust the translucency (edit: possibly I can do that, despite it being a pet peeve I've not really investigated the options), as I find myself wanting it on all the time else I get a bit lost and/or try to run down dead ends too much, but on the other hand I don't really see or take in the action as much because my focus is on the overlaid map (so I miss a lot of the art and animations).
Zones resetting when you've not been in them a while - I'm guessing hardcore veteran players probably like this for whatever hardcore veteran reason, but it bugs me when I die far from a waypoint/portal and in addition to having to trek all the way back (which I accept as a penalty for dying without having set up a portal first) I find the area I have to trek back through has not just respawned, but completely re-randomised and re-fog-of-warred - I essentially have to play that level all over again to get back to where I was.
Overall I'm really liking it though. The character customisation is the obvious big draw, and I hope they expand it even further with new skill types, item types, and so forth. At this point I've probably spent as much time planning and tweaking builds as actually playing the game (despite not having experience of later difficulties to be able to plan properly).
Post by: Descan on October 31, 2013, 08:07:53 pm
Post by: Aklyon on October 31, 2013, 08:13:08 pm
And it you can't, you get more experience anyway.
Post by: nenjin on October 31, 2013, 08:19:35 pm
If you're not obsessed with maximizing your gear, it's not super frustrating. But it does come up. Where you've gotten a sweet weapon but it needs more slots, different colors and better links. Eventually you end up settling because you don't have the mats to try for more.
So there's part of customization that does feel like it's not entirely in your control, that you're at the mercy of.
Post by: kcwong on November 01, 2013, 12:09:29 am
Yeah, at least on paper, I find spectres pretty underwhelming.
Have you tried voidbearer and flame sentinel spectres? Raise two and you can proceed to melt faces.
And you can get more spectres from passives. It's up there with Static Blows.
Post by: TherosPherae on November 01, 2013, 01:05:54 am
Like I said, the late game becomes about farming for the right gear, and the crafting mats, to make it what you want.Well, I guess it sort of does, if you want to grind about a thousand times more. If you don't, endgame is all about finding shit you can offload to some other sucker for orbs, with which you can get (usually) worthwhile gear; since you can easily afford something better than you could roll with a chaos orb or two.
Also, I saw someone mention selling regrets and fusings to the vendor for alchs and chances earlier - I recommend you don't if you want to get the most out of your stuff. If trading with other players is anathema to you, go ahead; but otherwise you can usually find someone willing to give you a chaos for a regret or a couple fusings, making those orbs far more valuable than the alchs and chances you would get otherwise.
Post by: Karkov on November 01, 2013, 02:44:35 am
Zones take 15 minutes (unless its changed at release) to despawn. (side areas take less, but they are side areas.) Unless you have no waypoints nearby and no portal scrolls, barring superlag, you can almost always get back in 15 minutes.Zones last from 8-15 minutes. No I don't know why it's arbitrarily this way, and I also have no idea what determines how much gets what time. I assume main thoroughfares get 15 minutes and everything else gets 8 or some random number depending on how big the zone is.
And it you can't, you get more experience anyway.
However, a rather interesting fact is that if you hold control and click on the portal to a new instance (even on the waypoint map), you can actually create new instances right there. Really good for farming areas that you don't want to wait for the map to despawn on.
Post by: Biowraith on November 01, 2013, 02:51:49 am
Zones take 15 minutes (unless its changed at release) to despawn. (side areas take less, but they are side areas.) Unless you have no waypoints nearby and no portal scrolls, barring superlag, you can almost always get back in 15 minutes.For me it's mostly been when there's a level with a waypoint followed by one or more levels with no waypoint. If they're fairly large levels I can easily use up those 15 minutes exploring to find the exits of the waypoint-less level(s) and then some more trying to find the next waypoint (edit: and hey, I might go make a sandwich or something too), such that if I die far into that process it turns out the original waypoint level has reset. And if I'm really unlucky in exploring to rediscover the exit I sometimes find the waypoint-less level(s) have reset too.
And it you can't, you get more experience anyway.
Possibly I'm just not fast enough at getting through the levels. I do try to remember to set up portals at the start of each level, but if things are going well I can get caught up in bashing/blasting/stabbing heads and forget. It's not a huge problem, just an extra layer of frustration I'd rather do without.
Post by: kcwong on November 01, 2013, 09:23:06 am
Zones take 15 minutes (unless its changed at release) to despawn. (side areas take less, but they are side areas.) Unless you have no waypoints nearby and no portal scrolls, barring superlag, you can almost always get back in 15 minutes.Zones last from 8-15 minutes. No I don't know why it's arbitrarily this way, and I also have no idea what determines how much gets what time. I assume main thoroughfares get 15 minutes and everything else gets 8 or some random number depending on how big the zone is.
And it you can't, you get more experience anyway.
However, a rather interesting fact is that if you hold control and click on the portal to a new instance (even on the waypoint map), you can actually create new instances right there. Really good for farming areas that you don't want to wait for the map to despawn on.
You can also Ctrl-click when you return to town. That allows you to see which player is in which town instance, so you can meet up with your friends.
Post by: nenjin on November 01, 2013, 10:43:23 am
But then I went all kinds of stupid in the Catacombs. Suddenly jump 4 levels of enemy difficulty, added to them ALL being frost based, and me tired as shit, and I died three time in the same level.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on November 01, 2013, 10:50:34 am
Post by: Descan on November 01, 2013, 11:33:25 am
No, really. I learn better when I'm under stress like that.
Those fucking exploding squid caught me off guard, though. Nearly died to them, went into the red-character-glow type thingy. Like 40 out of 260 health.
Post by: Aklyon on November 01, 2013, 11:36:15 am
Post by: nenjin on November 01, 2013, 12:05:21 pm
Your light radius in dark areas is linked to your current health, btw. Theres a minimum, and also theres a new passive from release which links it to your ES instead.
Huh. That's a cool little something.
Post by: Descan on November 01, 2013, 12:23:10 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 01, 2013, 12:24:58 pm
Is there a command to stop your character in her tracks? Sometimes I misclick and she goes running off into danger.Hold down shift. (or whatever yo rebound that too)
Post by: Descan on November 01, 2013, 12:29:23 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 01, 2013, 12:37:36 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 02, 2013, 01:34:46 pm
EDIT: If I remember correctly (I probably don't), you can't rebind shift to anything else. I'm not so sure about that anymore, but it sounds like one of those things that's stuck forever. If you did somehow rebind it to something else though, you could always put back in Defaults and get shift back to working like shift, and then rebind everything else to your liking. All depends on how much you really don't want to run into the enemies.
Post by: Descan on November 02, 2013, 01:39:57 pm
On another note, Necrotank is viable! Especially with ancient guardian, put some useless rares on him and get some life-regen of some kind and he's a beast. I named him James.
'Course, that's with my new friend. I need a solo fucktastic build... Someone give me an idea of something really stupid I can try out~ :D
Post by: Karkov on November 02, 2013, 01:46:20 pm
Fun builds? Dunno, fun builds seem to get me stuck on Cruel half of the time. Useful builds are stacking all the life-ups and regens though. You go from being scared of everything to dashing around under Brutus' feet on Merciless.
Post by: Descan on November 02, 2013, 01:47:41 pm
I don't -care- about making them viable, I just wanna try stuff out~ With that massive skill tree and the active skill gems, it's so fucking flexible that I can't HELP but want to play around with it this way.
Post by: Karkov on November 02, 2013, 02:02:27 pm
Any Dex based build: Dodging is cool and all because it makes you miss taking damage. They're fun, green gems are usually the most interesting anyway (cyclone, viper strike, double strike, all the projectile stuff).
Intelligence builds: Can do summons or elemental damage stacking. Using Rain of Fire (or whatever it's named) is really awesome, especially when you crit. When you crit with that, every instance of damage you do (each fireball that drops on their head) will make the lovely crit sound effect and do the screen shake. Immensely satisfying. Stacking ES makes you kind of tanky, it's like adding health without actually adding health!
Strength builds: Not as fun, much more durable though. To me, they have the most late-game potential.
!!FUN!!: Anything with that Chaos Indoctrination (1 health, resistance to Chaos Damage), and possibly something that feeds all of your energy shield into your mana. Throw them both in the same build and you're probably a masochist or looking for getting the most amount of deaths ever.
Post by: cerapa on November 02, 2013, 02:11:06 pm
!!FUN!!: Anything with that Chaos Indoctrination (1 health, resistance to Chaos Damage), and possibly something that feeds all of your energy shield into your mana. Throw them both in the same build and you're probably a masochist or looking for getting the most amount of deaths ever.Chaos Inoculation + Eldritch Battery + Blood Magic
No health, no skills, no anything. Better up that evade and dodge.
Post by: Biowraith on November 02, 2013, 03:29:44 pm
A prime character for the Cast on Death support gem!!!FUN!!: Anything with that Chaos Indoctrination (1 health, resistance to Chaos Damage), and possibly something that feeds all of your energy shield into your mana. Throw them both in the same build and you're probably a masochist or looking for getting the most amount of deaths ever.Chaos Inoculation + Eldritch Battery + Blood Magic
No health, no skills, no anything. Better up that evade and dodge.
Post by: Karkov on November 02, 2013, 03:56:17 pm
A prime character for the Cast on Death support gem!!!FUN!!: Anything with that Chaos Indoctrination (1 health, resistance to Chaos Damage), and possibly something that feeds all of your energy shield into your mana. Throw them both in the same build and you're probably a masochist or looking for getting the most amount of deaths ever.Chaos Inoculation + Eldritch Battery + Blood Magic
No health, no skills, no anything. Better up that evade and dodge.
You know, you joke about that, but suddenly I realize that a character who is unafraid of death (read: doesn't care about EXP and has a Portal Gem) could probably put that and Molten Shell together, and maybe an extra couple of skills or something. That'd make a fantastic explosion! What else could we put on this guy to make him into the best suicider ever?
Spark? Firestorm?
Post by: ragnar119 on November 02, 2013, 04:43:19 pm
Post by: cerapa on November 02, 2013, 05:04:00 pm
Portal gem, so when you die you have a portal to go backThat's...
actually a viable use of the cast on death gem.
Post by: Aklyon on November 02, 2013, 05:36:28 pm
Descan, if you want to just try out builds, hardcore is hardly the place to do it, its easier to test things in domination. Otherwise you end up too focused on not dieing to get very far in cruel.
Post by: kcwong on November 03, 2013, 01:39:30 am
!!FUN!!: Anything with that Chaos Indoctrination (1 health, resistance to Chaos Damage), and possibly something that feeds all of your energy shield into your mana. Throw them both in the same build and you're probably a masochist or looking for getting the most amount of deaths ever.Chaos Inoculation + Eldritch Battery + Blood Magic
No health, no skills, no anything. Better up that evade and dodge.
Go do that! Buffer overflow the death counter. :D
Post by: Biowraith on November 03, 2013, 03:33:05 am
Post by: kcwong on November 03, 2013, 09:59:19 am
Post by: Chattox on November 03, 2013, 01:05:34 pm
We instantly restarted, he's going ranger after playing witch, and I'm going marauder after playing shadow. Any tips for passive builds? I'm aiming for a 2h tank, I think my friend wants high physical damage,
Post by: Aoi on November 03, 2013, 01:32:19 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 03, 2013, 01:34:42 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 03, 2013, 01:50:16 pm
2H tank is actually pretty viable; you're not as tanky as someone with a shield would be, but if you stack armor/resistances and life with regen, you can attach a blood magic gem to a skill and become some serious DPS as well.
I'm doing a Marauder 2H right now, so I can say it's pretty good. Got me to Act 3 Merciless so far. Just got Cast When Damage Taken, probably the best Support Gem in the game.
Post by: Descan on November 03, 2013, 02:29:53 pm
I've already died once and restarted, this time I rolled a good life-regen (3.5) amulet and some max-health items. So maybe I'll be able to do it! :D
Only problem is there's no "Avatar of Cold" keystone (yet!) and only one melee cold skill (glacial hammer, which DOES work with staves so it's cool)
Post by: Xardalas on November 03, 2013, 02:51:28 pm
Post by: Cthulhu on November 03, 2013, 04:31:53 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 03, 2013, 04:37:58 pm
It's actually possible to get a Unique off of Hillock, good luck with that though.
Post by: Descan on November 03, 2013, 04:53:24 pm
Everything else is random.
Post by: Aklyon on November 03, 2013, 05:05:33 pm
Post by: Descan on November 03, 2013, 05:09:58 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 03, 2013, 05:58:18 pm
33 deaths. No uniques.
Post by: Seriyu on November 03, 2013, 06:21:47 pm
It's a kind've bizzare neurosis I didn't discover I had until I played D2.
Also, while we're at little nitpicks with the game, is it still required to basically solely chase life nodes around the grid or is the game a little bit more forgiving with characters that aren't constantly getting as much health as possible now? It's been a while since I've played.
Post by: Karkov on November 03, 2013, 06:47:57 pm
On the topic of good modifiers: Life Leech and Mana Leech are good, but you only need about 2% to keep you alive. High armor and resistance values are really good. Weapons eventually can get a +% physical damage modifier that are great, and base health is really good if you're stacking life nodes. I have a friend who is determined to get himself killed via item rarity mods, which seems sorta like a waste to me.
Basically when I see an item, if it's a piece of armor I look for:
1) % increased armor(or whatever else)
2) Flat Health
3) Resistances
On weapons I usually look for:
1) % increased damage
2) Attack speed
3) Anything else.
Anything and everything else is gravy. Sockets can be fixed via Jeweller's, Chromatics, and Fusings. If it's a white and a tier above mine, I'll alchemy the thing if it's a good base (I'm probably going to stop that since I finally hit map drops). Uniques are good in situational or build use, but they're ridiculously difficult to get. I do any orb work I'm going to do on the item before I use Quality items on them; changing the orbs gets rid of quality on the item.
Hope that helps.
Post by: Seriyu on November 03, 2013, 07:18:49 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2013, 02:39:46 am
The need for resists is, like, insane now. If you don't have 60% across the board by mid Act 3, prepare for the hurt.
Post by: Cthulhu on November 04, 2013, 04:42:47 am
This passive skill "tree" is fucking crazy.
Post by: Astral on November 04, 2013, 05:58:24 am
http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgQBmSu9gavFR35lTYTZmy0XHVeXYEER1b6n0k3AD-_jY3A0kyXfG_qkGVjbU9-bg4TvdO1672BLBS1AoJ65IWASIF6Lz_i2QU4qKaU= (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgQBmSu9gavFR35lTYTZmy0XHVeXYEER1b6n0k3AD-_jY3A0kyXfG_qkGVjbU9-bg4TvdO1672BLBS1AoJ65IWASIF6Lz_i2QU4qKaU=)
Notable passives include Iron Reflexes, which gives the equivalent in armor for any evasion rating, while removing evasion bonuses from Dexterity (not as bad as it sounds; your mitigation goes through the roof, without having to worry about a varying chance to negate damage). Add that to the dual wield block portion, and you become fairly tanky, fairly quickly, with fast strike that, if geared correctly, return mana and life on each (double) hit. Later, you can pick up the skill that makes it so that you cannot evade (which you won't be anyway) but can never be stunned, with practically no detriment at that point.
I'm having a blast with my duelist so far, much easier to level than my summoner Witch, though I feel it's worthwhile to level her for the initial gearless farming person.
Post by: Facekillz058 on November 04, 2013, 06:00:27 am
Needless to say, everything died and I didn't.
Post by: Biowraith on November 04, 2013, 09:48:42 am
Currently his build is:
http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgQBBS0Y2x3oIWAl30CgQ-dHflPfWNtgS2VNbml07XTxeu-E2YTvmSubg565q8Wsr72BvqfAD8S40k3V-OSx
Gear obviously plays a big part of it too, but so far he's steamrolling through everything and is easily my most survivable character - it's rare that either health or mana drops below 80% for him, and he's facetanked all the bosses he's met.
Longer term I plan to continue to boost his tankiness - more life, armour, evasion, block, regen, leech, and some attack speed and physical damage where I can get it en route to the tanky stuff. I've got a couple possibly dumb (or at least sub-optimal) things I want to try with him - if it turns out they're stupid newbie mistakes I've got 6 more characters to fall back on :p
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 10:30:40 am
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2013, 10:33:46 am
Dual Strike + Life on Hit + Melee Splash = Love.
Quote
If you go into the game with the mindset of, "The Passive tree is for defense, my skills and gear are for damage," you'll probably do just fine.
Until you hit bosses and uniques in Cruel that take 5 minutes of uninterrupted DPS to kill. I'm not saying the Passive Tree shouldn't be relied on mostly for defense and stats to wear the gear you need.....but you shouldn't slouch on offense. That and I find that consistent weapon upgrades get slimmer and slimmer as time goes on, because your socket needs continue to get more specific.
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 10:54:39 am
Until you hit bosses and uniques in Cruel that take 5 minutes of uninterrupted DPS to kill.I admit, they're there, but with the extra regen/leech and stuff I don't have too many problems with them. If you get to the point where you're using one skill consistently (as I am), you don't have as many socket problems as you used to have, that and it's always possible to spend some currency items (fusing, chromatic, jewellers). My main attack has three supports, everything else I'm using is just extras. Getting a 4 socketed item isn't too hard, and can be done on all the pieces of armor. Having 5 or more sockets all linked is ridiculously rare anyway, and if you're not already using end-game equipment and have a 5 socket skill that you just can't live without, I think you sort of caged yourself in at that point.
My skills read like this right now:
Main attack: Cyclone (Green) + Blood Magic (Red) + Melee Damage (Red) + Reduced Mana (Red)
Secondary Fun Stuff: Cast When Damage Taken (Red) + Rejuvenation Totem (Red) + Molten Shell (Red) + Enduring Cry (Red)
Tertiary: Cast When Damage Taken (Red) + Vulnerability (Blue) + Ice Nova (Blue) (Ice Nova's pretty useless in this regard)
Auras: Reduced Mana (Red) + Vitality (Red) + Purity (Blue)
And then my boots are stuffed with stuff that doesn't even need to be linked. The hardest thing I have to get with that is a 4 socket, 3 link with one green and three red sockets. If you keep your setup simple, it's pretty easy to upgrade everytime without going broke. It's also fun to realize that you don't need to put attack gems on your weapons, they can be on your boots if you're into that. Whenever you're into end-game equipment (Kaom's Primacy or some ridiculously good Rare), it's better to start looking towards upgrading your main skill to unknown levels at that point. When I finally get my Kaom's, I'm going to use so many Jeweller's orbs that I won't have anything left trying to make it six socketed. As is right now though, everything's set up and can be easily replicated when I get a replacement.
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2013, 10:59:11 am
Post by: Cthulhu on November 04, 2013, 11:06:54 am
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 11:09:22 am
Kaom's Heart has no sockets, though.Kaom's Primacy, the axe, not the heart (though I could probably use that one too).
EDIT: Just as a visual, these (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgEBxthYY1BQjM_2SF8_Z5spLtSPud3vDny4PfzyL3uMG0WOv8EE3D0hVTH7EtkaPnloC2F4Db6KAdykGRv6Jd-E2W5pvqfSTcAPqW618uLqYSGE73Tteu9gSwUtxFgn1W6qSsg1kqxZiPHnY_4K8kU64aZXTeP-jzGetz5Bh_noxq48LUz_r2zFiny78B-iABRNBLMCcTrY7DgpTxo4p4SQVeQiGmwZhSSqNullTUd-q8U=) are my passives at level 68.
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2013, 11:22:58 am
for those who don't know, how evasion worked is if you had a 50% dodge chance... You have a 50/50 chance to dodge.
If you dodge then your dodge chance goes down, then it goes down again, and again until you are hit.
Post by: cerapa on November 04, 2013, 11:31:45 am
Did path of exile ever fix the dodge build problem?That's not a bug. If you are refering to this system:
for those who don't know, how evasion worked is if you had a 50% dodge chance... You have a 50/50 chance to dodge.
If you dodge then your dodge chance goes down, then it goes down again, and again until you are hit.
Quote
Evasion in PoE is not fully random.
Each entity in the world contains an 'evasion entropy' value, between 1 and 100. The higher this value is, the more likely they are to be hit by the next attack. The initial value is random.
Every time something attacks you, they calculate their chance to hit as a percentage. That value is added to your evasion entropy. If the result exceeds 100, you're hit, and 100 is subtracted from the value. If the value hasn't reached 100, you're not hit.
...
This is the mechanic by which streakiness is removed from evasion - it removes the possibility of failing to evade happening to come up several times in a row due to bad luck. Each attack has the correct chance to hit, and will hit you just as often as you'd expect in the average case using a purely random system, but the possibility of occasional but devastating non-average results - such as being hit by four consecutive attacks with only 10% chance to hit each - have been eliminated.
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2013, 11:33:09 am
Quote
That's not a bug
I never said it was a bug... it just KILLED the dodge set ups.
The bug is that it made one build useless several years ago.
Post by: cerapa on November 04, 2013, 11:39:13 am
You still get hit the same amount of times on average, you know.
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2013, 11:40:27 am
It helps low dodge but not high dodge.
But those are very specific builds.
Post by: cerapa on November 04, 2013, 11:42:41 am
There is no
Actually, there isn't even a
EDIT: Or are you talking about some undocumented feature?
EDIT2: Oh, you're talking about dodge, not evade. I completely forgot that they were different mechanics. Replace all mentions of dodge in my earlier posts with evade. Dodge should be completely random. I see no mention of it being weighted somehow in here (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/11707/filter-account-type/staff/page/10#p748465) or on the wiki.
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2013, 11:45:43 am
I had to change my build back in the day when I learned that my build was useless, so I changed to a armor from dodge... and it was a vast improvement.
Mostly because what was better? being hit 50% of the time and taking 90% damage? or being hit every single time but taking a fifth of the damage?
I don't know if it is fixed now.
Then again... later on physical damage isn't going to be what kills you. It is the cheapo lightning damage that murders the game's skill factor.
Post by: cerapa on November 04, 2013, 11:58:56 am
The reduction you were talking about simply does not exist. Are you talking about the evade chance formula vs armour damage reduction formula? Gonna have to do some math if you mean that.
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2013, 12:01:48 pm
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on November 04, 2013, 03:13:55 pm
I have only one way I enjoy playing - a speedy, dodgy ranger. No armor, no ES, just evasion+dodge+life+crit. The most useful skills I've found so far have been split shot+fork+pierce and rupture.
It doesn't matter how hard enemies hit if they can't hit me. It's not about the evasion, it's about the mobility. Can't touch me!
To be honest though, I've only had 1 post-release character run so far and I play exclusively on hardcore. I got really, really lazy in Ch. 3 and allowed a random powerful rare to get to me.
Never again. I WILL get into Merciless and Cruel with this build, screw all the hyped tanky tanks. My inspiration is Windrunner from DOTA 2.
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 03:19:29 pm
Never again. I WILL get into Merciless and Cruel with this build, screw all the hyped tanky tanks. My inspiration is Windrunner from DOTA 2.
"Your tiny featherless arrows can't hurt me, Sniper!"
Possibly the cutest character out of the DotA bunch by far. I wish you luck on the build. May your desync be low and your arrows fly true.
Post by: Cthulhu on November 04, 2013, 03:24:04 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on November 04, 2013, 03:26:57 pm
So what's this scion? Is it a class? Because I've never seen one and it's not in the character select.I haven't played in a while, but from what I read, Scion is a class you unlock by beating the game. They start at the center of the passive tree.
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 03:31:51 pm
The game says she's an advanced character, but it just doesn't want everyone taking Scions.
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on November 04, 2013, 03:32:50 pm
Never again. I WILL get into Merciless and Cruel with this build, screw all the hyped tanky tanks. My inspiration is Windrunner from DOTA 2.
"Your tiny featherless arrows can't hurt me, Sniper!"
Possibly the cutest character out of the DotA bunch by far. I wish you luck on the build. May your desync be low and your arrows fly true.
Much appreciated.
A note to anyone else trying out a bow build - most of your arrows will fly off the screen, until they hit something. Very few projectiles have a range limit - a notable example is poison arrow. What this means is you can freely shot arrows ahead if yourself and clear/engage waves from a safe distance.
This is actually why I like my Split Arrow+Fork+Pierce. The additional arrows will fly until an obstacle, and will devastate any groups. Once I have stable mana in late Ch. 2, I only see half of the enemies I kill.
Another nice trick is you can see a lot farther towards the "up" of the screen if you zoom all the way in. This way, you can get nice sniper shots at very distant enemies.
"Here, have an arrow!"
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2013, 04:00:44 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2013, 05:07:11 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 05:37:48 pm
On another note, did we ever decide if we wanted a Bay12 Guild or not?
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2013, 08:16:10 pm
So what's this scion? Is it a class? Because I've never seen one and it's not in the character select.THere is a cage in the Scepter of God (This cage is empty if you got into Cruel with a non-deleted character before release(because you already have the unlock), or if your party includes a Scion (because they have it unlocked)). You click it and the Scion is freed. Talk to her and now you can play as the scion.
@Karkov If people want to do something other than just ignore the topic, it would be known. But right now its a mystery.
Post by: Cthulhu on November 04, 2013, 08:23:54 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 08:28:08 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2013, 08:36:10 pm
Quote
I just beat Merveil. Dual strike seems to make a lot of these early bosses and rares kind of a joke. I also got a lifesteal gem on my Reave which basically makes me even more unkillable. I've only died once when the medicine chest island unique got a lucky freeze on me while a bunch of cannibals were hitting me.
Dual Strike FTW. Enjoy it while it lasts though, because without serious damage scaling, you don't do the DPS you need to against later bosses, because they'll force you to move or die and you don't get your DS awesomeness consistently applied. A lot of uniques even in normal eat melees for breakfast. (Gravidius comes to mind.) The trap you fall into is you can Dual Strike your way through an entire horde of normals and blues, to pulp the Yellow at the center. Up until Act 3, when suddenly trash stops dying so fast, a pack of blues becomes a serious threat and you end up surrounded.
Which is why I always try to keep a ranged AoE solution on hand. For Dex classes, a bow and Poison Arrow can do a ton of AoE damage with very little work, especially if you can maintain your attack speed between gear sets. Or you can just slap Firestorm on. (Man, Firestorm. I wish the skill wasn't as good as it is, because it ends up on every one of my characters.)
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2013, 08:44:20 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 08:53:11 pm
Firestorm is indeed awesome. One of the shrines in Domination even gives you it's effect (with additional burning ground) if you dive in and grab it.Yeah, the altar's version doesn't seem nearly as strong as if you were actually using the spell though. Damn shame, it's fun to be spinning through a group of blues with fire raining behind me.
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2013, 09:02:47 pm
Most hilarious one was a trio of the icy ground pulse one, I picked up all three in the ledge at once and they all went off together and just melted everything nearby until I was back down to 1 shrine's effect left...and maybe 1 or 2 enemies.
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2013, 10:28:08 pm
Post by: Karkov on November 04, 2013, 10:57:03 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 05, 2013, 12:05:16 am
(http://i.imgur.com/uDVFKHj.gif)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: kcwong on November 05, 2013, 01:07:09 am
This is actually why I like my Split Arrow+Fork+Pierce. The additional arrows will fly until an obstacle, and will devastate any groups. Once I have stable mana in late Ch. 2, I only see half of the enemies I kill.
However, Fork and Pierce won't happen simultaneously. If your arrow pierced, it won't fork. If it forked, it won't pierce. The game chooses one for you randomly. Same goes for Chain.
That means you took the damage penalty from both all the time, but only enjoy their effects half of the time. LMP/GMP may be a better option.
The Dominus Fight:
(http://i.imgur.com/uDVFKHj.gif)Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Karkov on November 05, 2013, 01:15:53 am
The Dominus Fight:
O:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Yeah that fight's a bastard: FINAL BOSS SPOILERS BELOW
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Only thing I forgot to mention, and this can be said to everyone: For each consecutive member of your team you gain 50% quantity of items, but enemies get 50% extra health for normal, 75% for cruel, and 100% extra health for merciless difficulties. Just remember that and then determine your own amount of time you want to spend wading through enemies.
Post by: kcwong on November 05, 2013, 08:34:41 am
The Dominus Fight:
O:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Yeah that fight's a bastard: FINAL BOSS SPOILERS BELOWSpoiler (click to show/hide)
Only thing I forgot to mention, and this can be said to everyone: For each consecutive member of your team you gain 50% quantity of items, but enemies get 50% extra health for normal, 75% for cruel, and 100% extra health for merciless difficulties. Just remember that and then determine your own amount of time you want to spend wading through enemies.
In the new leagues that quantity bonus is no longer true... because people used to get a screen full of white items, which is useless and silly. The bonus is tweaked to have more rarity and less quantity by adding more players. After 4 months of testing I think a tweaked version will be applied to Standard as well.
Post by: Aklyon on November 05, 2013, 08:55:50 am
Post by: Karkov on November 05, 2013, 11:29:50 am
Post by: CognitiveDissonance on November 05, 2013, 11:49:56 am
This is actually why I like my Split Arrow+Fork+Pierce. The additional arrows will fly until an obstacle, and will devastate any groups. Once I have stable mana in late Ch. 2, I only see half of the enemies I kill.
However, Fork and Pierce won't happen simultaneously. If your arrow pierced, it won't fork. If it forked, it won't pierce. The game chooses one for you randomly. Same goes for Chain.
That means you took the damage penalty from both all the time, but only enjoy their effects half of the time. LMP/GMP may be a better option.
Huh. I didn't know they didn't add up like this. I'm mostly okay with this, but I'll have to screw around with the set up.
I couldn't care less about LMP/GMP for bow attacks, though.
Post by: kcwong on November 05, 2013, 12:10:24 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 05, 2013, 06:53:17 pm
It's just the insane spike damage that guy can do, and/or getting caught in a zombi-splosion. Guess I'll go farm for some more resists before trying again.
I'm tempted to team up to beat him, but it's kind of a pride thing to accomplish it myself.
Special mentions for Temporal Chains, and I guess really any curse. It's so nice that bosses are at least partially vulnerable to them. Unlike so many games where they pitch debuffs as an option then all the important mobs are all LOLNOPE. Temporal Chains especially I like, because it's a slow that also increases the duration of any debuffs you put on people. Goes great with Firestorm and Ice Nova, either extending the burn or the freeze.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on November 05, 2013, 07:04:21 pm
Unlike so many games where they pitch debuffs as an option then all the important mobs are all LOLNOPE.
That's always been a pet peeve of mine. Playing Persona 4 and Chrono Trigger/Cross all last week game me a true hatred of useless 'debuffs' that only work on chaff units.
Post by: nenjin on November 05, 2013, 07:08:13 pm
Really though, any game that makes stuff immune to core game mechanics is a huge pet peeve of mine too. Why total immunity? Why not diminishing returns or some other interesting mechanic? Something is still better than nothing over a long enough timeline.
Post by: Karkov on November 05, 2013, 07:14:17 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 05, 2013, 07:28:12 pm
Quote
Map Bosses now have 60% reduced curse effect (up from 50%).
Act bosses now have 70% reduced curse effect (up from 40%).
Rogue Exiles now have 50% reduced curse effect (up from 0%).
Post by: Karkov on November 05, 2013, 07:35:57 pm
QuoteRogue Exiles now have 50% reduced curse effect (up from 0%).
Dear God, Xandro Blooddrinker is going to keep giving me hell even when I gear to fight him, isn't he?
For those of you who don't know ol' Xandro... Y'know, I had actually typed up a giant "here's what's gonna happen," but I think you guys would enjoy the surprise as much as I did.
Post by: Xardalas on November 06, 2013, 02:52:56 pm
Post by: Seriyu on November 06, 2013, 10:20:39 pm
Like, what's important to consider for a build? I know a lot of builds focus around a keystone skill, is there anything more then that?
Like say, if I were to go for iron reflexes or whatever the one that converts dodge rating into armor and then go entirely for two handed damage, would that be a good "example" of a build, or is there something I'm missing? I'm probably being incredibly confusing so I apologize in advance.
How do I make my own build, I guess is a good way to put it. I dislike just grabbing a cookie cutter build and going to town if I can help it.
(still patching but I intend to join the guild when I manage to get through that, as a side note)
Post by: nenjin on November 06, 2013, 10:39:51 pm
I tend to shoot for the 2nd tier abilities (the ones between the tiny nodes and the big skills with the orange text) and I seem to do alright. (Although I clearly need to start taking resists more seriously even in normal.) I try to go for clusters that have at least two things I want. And as long as I can take a mostly direct path to them, I make that my goal.
As for chasing life nodes....factor in where life exists relative to the path you want to take. Evaluate if you really want to spend x levels trying to reach that life node if it's not directly on the way to something else you want...or if you need to sacrifice one of your goals in the name of more life, now (since by the time you'll want it, you'll already be getting your ass kicked.)
Post by: Seriyu on November 06, 2013, 10:59:48 pm
Post by: Xardalas on November 06, 2013, 11:02:18 pm
Post by: Seriyu on November 06, 2013, 11:28:34 pm
Post by: Xardalas on November 07, 2013, 02:43:52 pm
Post by: Aoi on November 09, 2013, 01:48:25 pm
Post by: Seriyu on November 09, 2013, 06:03:48 pm
Also, I got a goldrim's leather cap, unique, from ole hillock. I hear this is super great? Is this true?
EDIT: Got in the guild.
Post by: nenjin on November 09, 2013, 07:08:22 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I can't help but cringe at the rock ballads for PoE. Also the community supporter credits runs like 20 minutes + :X
Post by: TherosPherae on November 09, 2013, 11:24:20 pm
Also, I got a goldrim's leather cap, unique, from ole hillock. I hear this is super great? Is this true?Indeed it is, it should easily hold well in your headpiece slot through Cruel difficulty.
Post by: Seriyu on November 09, 2013, 11:34:50 pm
Post by: Aoi on November 10, 2013, 01:58:15 am
4th 30+ Nemesis character I've lost in the last week to a rare monster with that explode-on-death trait.
Post by: nenjin on November 10, 2013, 05:35:30 am
(http://i.imgur.com/EED0k7Il.jpg)
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on November 10, 2013, 03:16:09 pm
4th 30+ Nemesis character I've lost in the last week to a rare monster with that explode-on-death trait.
The 'split' one is a total pain in the ass if the unique is a bigger monster. For melees this means you MUST be ready to nuke everything the second you kill the unique or get caught between them and die.
Post by: Aoi on November 10, 2013, 05:21:03 pm
4th 30+ Nemesis character I've lost in the last week to a rare monster with that explode-on-death trait.
The 'split' one is a total pain in the ass if the unique is a bigger monster. For melees this means you MUST be ready to nuke everything the second you kill the unique or get caught between them and die.
I always give my melee characters a backup weapon with leap slam for emergencies like that.
Post by: nenjin on November 12, 2013, 05:53:23 pm
I really hope you haven't been enjoying your Cast on Damage Taken gems too much.
Because it's getting the nerf stick taken to it. At max, it's going to take something like 2500 damage before it will proc. The gem that's supported by it can also not be a higher level than the CoDT gem itself.
The numbers make little sense to me. Even on my beefiest characters, I don't come anywhere near that kind of health.
Purity is also getting the nerf bat taken to it. Now it will only increase Maximum Resists. Three new resist gems have been added to the game to handle the three Elemental resists individually.
So if you were enjoying better resists while playing solo.....say g'bye to that too.
I think I've played enough PoE to say.....I hate their interpretation of how resists work. Resists in every ARPG are the end-game height test..."You must have X resists to proceed." Elemental damage and resists or the lack of them become how most games manage difficulty. So in order to play you have to shoehorn resists into your gear, or your build, somewhere.
Except in PoE, that's not enough. No, we need to NERF your base resists in higher difficulties, so you have to stack MORE resists to get the same benefit, requiring excellent gear or significant sacrifices. And once you hit Merciless? Guess what. Even THAT isn't enough, now you need extra maximum resists to get the damage down to a manageable level. It makes soloing at the higher levels just get insane, as your build and your gear end up trying to do 4 different things at once, and not doing any of them particularly well. Late game your choices feel like:
"There's damage, resists and HPs. Which one would you like?" When the truth is you need all three to not have significant fights take 10 minutes, and hinge on lag and/or 1 crucial misclick. There are Uniques in the Scepter of God that basically require you to cheese them with LOS because they're so incredibly nasty, and there is no avoiding their attacks.
I made it to Act 3 Merciless before they nerfed it to make it more beatable. But post-release, I'm worried that I won't even be able to get to Act 2 Merciless, the way Act 3 Cruel is shaping up.
Post by: Aklyon on November 12, 2013, 06:16:44 pm
The gem that's supported by it can also not be a higher level than the CoDT gem itself.The level requirement of the gems can't be higher than the one for CoDT, not the gem levels themselves.
Post by: nenjin on November 12, 2013, 06:38:32 pm
Post by: Descan on November 12, 2013, 08:01:30 pm
Post by: DemonOfWrath on November 12, 2013, 08:40:50 pm
Can't tell you how big a pain trying to run a glass cannon is, which SHOULD be a viable, if not terribly practical build option, and require a decent amount of skill and positioning to pull off, and it is in every other ARPG I've played, but not this one. For context, I played in closed beta, then quit for basically all of open beta, upon which I started releveling my glass cannon fireball witch. Only main differences in build are I've had to move from dual shock nova totems (those were fun, but took me ages to figure out how to make them work well) and manually raising minions, to skeleton totem which is much more boring but practical, although I'm at the point where I can experiment with other stuff to see what works.
And the game has changed significantly to make my life harder, mostly release stuff to be honest. Closed beta I could run maps no real problem, although I did run into a situation where a map boss had enough damage modifiers to 1-shot me with flicker strike which was pretty hilarious. So much of the new stuff in release takes a massive dump on my playstyle. Lightning thorns and those bubble minions in scepter are irritating as all hell, and don't get me started on the Dominus fight's last stage. Something seems off to me when the design of that fight includes "You should build your character to face-tank the final boss". Although I did find out in merciless that if I drag him all the way to the entrance of the arena then he becomes really easy since I don't have to worry about the rain or adds anymore, just make him face away from me with skeletons and hold the fireball button down. I won't say how many deaths that took to achieve though.
To be honest all the new stuff except the damn bubble mobs (they'd be fine too, if they didn't have their huge aoe long-range spell) is alright and after seeing them a bit I've found ways to deal with them without too much difficulty, it's just the dominus fight on top of that is so rediculous that it shows the devs need a wakeup call that there are multiple ways people want to build characters beyond what they consider.
Oh, and desync makes me cry. :'( I was really surprised to come back after a year and find it was just as bad, possibly worse.
Post by: TherosPherae on November 12, 2013, 09:50:59 pm
Purity is also getting the nerf bat taken to it. Now it will only increase Maximum Resists. Three new resist gems have been added to the game to handle the three Elemental resists individually.Other way around, actually. Purity will add to your normal resists until you hit 75%, then it'll stop adding unless you've got Elemental Adaptation, one of the other elemental resist auras, or a few certain uniques running. The new single-element auras are the ones that add to your maximum resistance, letting you go above 75% resistance to that specified element while adding a significant amount of resistance to that element to boot.
That said, I'm pretty sure the most-used one is going to be Purity of Lightning, because of a certain wonderful unique called Lightning Coil.
Post by: nenjin on November 12, 2013, 11:39:48 pm
Post by: Seriyu on November 14, 2013, 03:07:00 am
Life leech is so good, and I seem to have gotten it on a lot of gear, along with a life gain on hit support gem. I'm feeling unstoppable. I'm sure the Act II boss will show me how it's done, but until then I'm gonna be happy.
EDIT: Natch. Sparking mages in the chamber of sins, spark gets pretty rediculous in a small room. Oh well!
Post by: kcwong on November 14, 2013, 08:11:17 am
Post by: Seriyu on November 15, 2013, 02:52:53 am
Never assume it's a fluke kids!
Post by: nenjin on November 15, 2013, 10:36:48 am
Uhm, Diablo 2 had your base resists driven down by 75 points from each difficulty. Unless you meant something different.
If it were just a nerf I'd feel like that's alright. But with PoE then there's the cap too, and the skill points and gear traits to raise the cap.....and that's mostly what I don't like. There's like, a gameplay sub-system for resists, which are basically the one part of ARPGs I like the least. They're always something you have to sacrifice for, and they don't give you the enjoyment of your defenses like blocking, dodging, having more HP or more armor do. So PoE doubles down on a mechanical part of ARPGs that I wish was less important, and less extensive.
Post by: aristabulus on November 16, 2013, 12:25:57 pm
Uhm, Diablo 2 had your base resists driven down by 75 points from each difficulty. Unless you meant something different.
If it were just a nerf I'd feel like that's alright. But with PoE then there's the cap too, and the skill points and gear traits to raise the cap.....and that's mostly what I don't like. There's like, a gameplay sub-system for resists, which are basically the one part of ARPGs I like the least. They're always something you have to sacrifice for, and they don't give you the enjoyment of your defenses like blocking, dodging, having more HP or more armor do. So PoE doubles down on a mechanical part of ARPGs that I wish was less important, and less extensive.
For the record, Nightmare was -40 resist all, Hell was -100 resist all. You'd feel it if you had a negative value in a resist, but as long as you were moderately positive in everything it generally wasn't a big deal in D2; the way combat was structured + instant potion consumption didn't put a ton of focus on keeping your resists maxed.
I do agree that PoE has issues with how resists are used, but I think that's just a symptom for the underlying math of combat (which ties back into the balance issues DemonOfWrath spoke of), combined with potions that aren't instant unless you give up a lot of capacity.
-----
On other notes, anyone planning on doing race events? There are occasionally party-focused races; while it's unlikely that my schedule will allow for joining in, I thought I'd throw the idea onto the table for the greater good.
Post by: Aklyon on November 16, 2013, 12:35:26 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 17, 2013, 04:47:37 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Completely negates all the adds in the fight. I imagine it's hell for casters, but for melee it was a godsend. I imagine this will be changed at some point, it's very exploitable.Post by: kcwong on November 17, 2013, 07:38:36 am
Last boss spoiler/tip:Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It would suck for casters in any case.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: nenjin on November 24, 2013, 05:06:45 am
Followed shortly (relatively speaking) after by this: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Silverbranch
Think it's time to start a summoner :D
Post by: Aoi on November 24, 2013, 12:03:35 pm
Farming in Act 1 Merciless tonight, I got this: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Queen%27s_Decree
Followed shortly (relatively speaking) after by this: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Silverbranch
Followed shortly by a spam of 'reeeeep' in chat, as is how most good drops are followed? =P
Post by: nenjin on November 24, 2013, 03:06:39 pm
Right now I'm face tanking everything short of large blue packs, Uniques and Rogue Exiles with Firestorm + Life Leech and IR, in all my IR gear. I can do that pretty much from the Twilight Strand to the Climb, avoiding side areas. Chaos is the only thing I have to specifically gear to resist now, as my base resists and gear take care of the elements for the most part. I've got 1000 HPs. And I'm only Level 61.
I got my ass handed to me by the Weaver, to the tune of about 30 deaths. But I learned her spiders eventually stop coming, after you kill.....I dunno, several hundred. I eventually beat that fight by hitting her and her minions off screen with Spectral Throw for like....20 minutes. Turns out when she's not surrounded by 50 spiders, she can be face tanked as well.
So while I know boss fights will be soul crushingly bad, and there's Uniques out there that will always just fuck your shit up (Brutus and his late game twin, because desyncs) Merciless is starting to seem pretty doable. Maybe I can finally get some maps.
Post by: aristabulus on November 24, 2013, 03:37:36 pm
...
I got my ass handed to me by the Weaver, to the tune of about 30 deaths. But I learned her spiders eventually stop coming, after you kill.....I dunno, several hundred. I eventually beat that fight by hitting her and her minions off screen with Spectral Throw for like....20 minutes. Turns out when she's not surrounded by 50 spiders, she can be face tanked as well.
...
The Weaver always has a nasty escort, sometimes nastier if the blue spiders' mods are synergistic. Doesn't matter what build I was using, that fight was always a hair-on-fire affair. :P
I played the 2 hour solo race this morning, and got instagibbed in Crossroads by a yellow bear with attack the speed aura flanked by a few blue bears with the speed mod. :( Shoulda quit when I got my 3 points instead of gunning for the fourth.
Post by: kcwong on November 25, 2013, 12:51:37 am
I think I've changed my opinion on the late game of PoE a little bit.
Right now I'm face tanking everything short of large blue packs, Uniques and Rogue Exiles with Firestorm + Life Leech and IR, in all my IR gear. I can do that pretty much from the Twilight Strand to the Climb, avoiding side areas. Chaos is the only thing I have to specifically gear to resist now, as my base resists and gear take care of the elements for the most part. I've got 1000 HPs. And I'm only Level 61.
I got my ass handed to me by the Weaver, to the tune of about 30 deaths. But I learned her spiders eventually stop coming, after you kill.....I dunno, several hundred. I eventually beat that fight by hitting her and her minions off screen with Spectral Throw for like....20 minutes. Turns out when she's not surrounded by 50 spiders, she can be face tanked as well.
So while I know boss fights will be soul crushingly bad, and there's Uniques out there that will always just fuck your shit up (Brutus and his late game twin, because desyncs) Merciless is starting to seem pretty doable. Maybe I can finally get some maps.
If you check the official forums or ask in global chat, you'll know that 1k life isn't considered a lot in merciless... as a melee you should have at least 2k. My Scion summoner at level 70 has nearly 2k life and ES.
With Iron Reflex, you are tanking all the hits coming your way... so having sufficient resists, armor (aim for 40% or more) and life is crucial.
With life leech, and the spider hoard are there to keep you healed. Life generation from leech is at 20% of your max life per second. The more life you have, the better life leech is.
If you take Vaal Pact, then life leech is instant. With a sufficiently hard-hitting attack, you can stay alive pretty easily... until you get viper strike charges, that is. Then you have to TP quickly, or die.
Post by: Aoi on November 25, 2013, 01:00:47 am
(Edit: Not trying to sound elitist; just wondering, since it sounds like most people here are primarily domination/standard. I'm only made it halfway through cruel on my best.)
Post by: nenjin on November 25, 2013, 02:30:49 am
http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Prismatic_Eclipse
3 green gems, and now Spectral Throw + Greater Multiple Projectiles + Projectile Speed truly is like a combine, 5 rows a never ending blades streaming over waves of guys....too bad you can't use Jewelers Orbs on Uniques, I'd love to cram more on this sword.
Although it does basically point out that Ethereal Knives is a shit skill next to Spectral Throw. It took just one mod to make Spectral Throw great. It takes at least 2 mods just to make Ethereal Knives remotely its counter part.
Post by: kcwong on November 25, 2013, 10:58:04 am
They have bots listening to global chat and make name lists. Once you say anything on global, you're done for. The "ding" purple text will annoy you every few minutes from then on. I don't even trade; I never post to trade chats. Just chit-chat and answering questions on global will get you spammed.
I've sent countless reports to GGG in past few months, and I am tired of doing so anymore. I sent an email telling them how annoyed and tired I am, and how disappointed I am in their reaction speed to the spamming.
I set my web site profile to private, and sent a list to GGG to rename all my characters.
Post by: aristabulus on January 16, 2014, 02:05:00 pm
I did some race events last season, not much else... Not terribly interested in getting on this race season, what with classes starting again for me next week.
I haven't been impressed with the extended Act 3 stuff. The new mechanics seem like a fistful of gauze lazily stapled to unhealthy systems. And the new mega-boss fight? Brutally awful optimization. I'm glad the only time I tangled with it was on a Merciless-grade character.
Post by: Aklyon on January 16, 2014, 02:21:16 pm
Post by: nenjin on January 16, 2014, 03:00:49 pm
Post by: Karkov on January 16, 2014, 03:23:09 pm
If you don't think it's that bad normally, you haven't made a cyclone marauder.
Post by: nenjin on January 16, 2014, 03:32:19 pm
That said, Storm Call is awesome and I think I like it more than Firestorm.
Post by: ragnar119 on January 16, 2014, 04:02:32 pm
Post by: dennislp3 on January 16, 2014, 04:15:36 pm
Post by: kcwong on January 17, 2014, 12:23:54 am
I still check everyday for daily sales and announcement though. BTW, Chris will be doing a live interview (by two forum members) tomorrow 9am NZ time on twitch.
Post by: Chattox on February 16, 2014, 06:49:17 am
Post by: nenjin on February 16, 2014, 10:24:43 am
Sacrifice of the Vaal (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/793831)
There's enough glam on it to indicate it's more than what've seen post-release so far. I.e a new skill gem or two, balance tweaks, a couple community made items and a new race type.
Post by: Karkov on February 17, 2014, 04:08:19 pm
Speaking of a big update....
Sacrifice of the Vaal (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/793831)
There's enough glam on it to indicate it's more than what've seen post-release so far. I.e a new skill gem or two, balance tweaks, a couple community made items and a new race type.
[sarcasm]Did they fix the desync issues yet?[/sarcasm]
Post by: nenjin on February 17, 2014, 04:12:19 pm
Post by: kcwong on February 17, 2014, 10:27:04 pm
No, and I'm starting to suspect they never will. I think it ultimately has to do with network latency compensation. Game can't figure out where shit should be so it just arbitrarily decides, to the detriment of high level players. Then again, I've watched it ghost around mobs in a completely obstruction free environment, so who the hell knows. That's really my only one gripe with the game, one I constantly forget I have until it happens.
There is no simple fix to desync. It's a physical limitation. It won't, and it can't go away, period.
Data takes this much time to travel from your end to server, vice versa. You either have the client stop responding waiting for data to arrive (that's how online games were written so many years ago, resulting in sucky player experience), or you have both client and server perform prediction (which makes fast-paced online action game possible) and synchronize periodically (which is rubber-banding, server correcting client about where things are).
You can only hope to make it less obvious to the players.
There is a giant thread about desync in the official forum, and GGG developers are kind enough to post a lot in there, explaining in detail what desync is and why there is no simple solution to it.
If you still think GGG is being stubborn and lazy about fixing desync, you need to go to read those.
Post by: Aklyon on February 17, 2014, 10:43:53 pm
Post by: aristabulus on February 17, 2014, 11:55:38 pm
It was enough not-fun for me that I burned myself off the game. Autosold and deleted everything. (sorry, fellow dorfs... no wealth redistribution this time)
Post by: kcwong on February 18, 2014, 12:21:57 am
I can acknowledge that the nature of the server/client relationship is gonna have some desync. What chaps my ass is how the server handles it. Going from "cautious steps, looking for things to plink" to "lol, you were really facegrinding that blue mob, for like 10 seconds! oh, btw, you're dead"... Several shades of not-fun. The game can be difficult and challenging without the surprise corpse mechanic. If I die because I got cocky, or misread a mob, sure, fine. Dead. If I die because of server shenanigans I cannot control, nor detect in time to not-die? That's bullshit.
It was enough not-fun for me that I burned myself off the game. Autosold and deleted everything. (sorry, fellow dorfs... no wealth redistribution this time)
That you'd be best to avoid online games with any real time action in it, because prediction is how things are done.
I'm using a Logitech mouse, so I have extra mouse buttons for macros. I mapped /oos to one and when playing I look for signs of or actions causing desync.
Signs:
Monster die here and loot appear there.
Minions acting weird - they are staring blankly into distance while enemies are nearby with direct path.
Actions:
I used a movement skill, like lightning warp and whirling blade.
I ran through the middle of a pack of monsters.
I ran through a narrow door way.
I was running for a while with quicksilver pot.
When I catch any of those, I quaff granite pot, stop causing further desync and use the macro button.
Post by: Biowraith on February 18, 2014, 01:59:33 am
That you'd be best to avoid online games with any real time action in itDisagree - you'd best avoid PoE maybe, but pretty much all of the other online games with real time action I've played recently this hasn't been an issue. I'll not speculate on why not or whether GGG "should" fix it in their game - I don't know nearly enough about it - but PoE is very much in the minority for it to be an issue to this extent.
Post by: kcwong on February 18, 2014, 02:16:15 am
That you'd be best to avoid online games with any real time action in itDisagree - you'd best avoid PoE maybe, but pretty much all of the other online games with real time action I've played recently this hasn't been an issue. I'll not speculate on why not or whether GGG "should" fix it in their game - I don't know nearly enough about it - but PoE is very much in the minority for it to be an issue to this extent.
Try Spiral Knights (SK). Desync is alive and well there too. Real time action, with narrow passages and monsters blocking your path just like PoE, so you get rubberbanded back and forth in exactly the same way.
Some games cut corners/make sacrifices to hide desync.
e.g. Turn off collision for terrain and have wide passages so even if client and server disagree, you often don't get stuck on terrain. PoE/SK keep terrain collision on so you can use those as a tactical option. You can hide behind walls to avoid ranged attacks for instance.
e.g. An attack will hit or not is already determined when the attack is initiated (vs. when the animation completes), so even if you move away quickly you still get hit, or in other words, exact position doesn't matter. PoE/SK allows you to use your own skill to dodge, but they have to know everythings' exact positions for that.
Post by: Biowraith on February 18, 2014, 02:46:35 am
Post by: kcwong on February 18, 2014, 03:06:46 am
I'm sure there's other games that have the same problem, all I was taking issue with was the statement that you'd best avoid online (edit: action) games in general - it's really only specific games you'd need to avoid.
And what I was saying was: They all desync. All of them. Some just cast a better illusion of not desync'ing, and to have that illusion they have to make some sacrifice.
Post by: aristabulus on February 18, 2014, 08:23:12 am
It was enough not-fun for me that I burned myself off the game. Autosold and deleted everything.(words)
Perhaps you missed this part. Soapboxing about how to fix desync at someone that has already moved on is myopic at best.
I do not suffer games that punish me for bad IO code that I did not write... Life is too short, and there are too many other ways to spend my time.
Post by: nenjin on February 18, 2014, 10:32:25 am
Quote from: kwong
*snip*
Going to have to agree with others. Only at the height of poor server performance in other games do I see the degree of rubber banding, teleportation and out right desyncs that I do in.....virtually every session of PoE. D3 may have and still lag, but it doesn't, for example, teleport me and/or my target halfway across the map. Basically, any time I encounter more than 1 mob, or a less than clear room configuration, it can happen. Which I'm guessing is related to server-side calcs, pathfinding, ect....and not just pure latency. I'm not claiming they don't care......but I am claiming their net code probably isn't as strong as it could be.
Like I said, I usually forget about it until it happens. But when you've been grinding for 30 minutes in merciless, and then the game bends you over and ****s you without warning and all that progress is gone, yeah, it doesn't endear me to GGG or their excuses. It's hard to take the high level gameplay or boss fights seriously. If the final boss had that level of desync problems, I most likely would have given up on PoE a long time ago. As it is, I pretty much give up on most bosses and resort to face tanking and a lot of lost experience. Because there's no way I'm going to actually try when the server will pull the rug out from underneath you.
Personally, they could save all their updates for the next six months and I wouldn't care, as long as they got the desyncs fixed.
Quote
Some just cast a better illusion of not desync'ing, and to have that illusion they have to make some sacrifice.
If that "illusion" results in fewer players arbitrarily dying, then who cares? Do it.
Post by: Descan on February 18, 2014, 11:41:08 am
Post by: Aklyon on February 18, 2014, 11:50:47 am
Although, whether or not that would overwhelm the desync complaints is another thing entirely.
Post by: Descan on February 18, 2014, 11:52:59 am
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on February 18, 2014, 03:51:32 pm
Post by: kcwong on February 18, 2014, 09:39:03 pm
I've had close calls with HC desync issues even with my extremely OP character. It's a very real issue, and only silly people think it's perfectly fine for server-side issues to influence your game.
Desycn is NOT a server side issue. It's a issue with time needed for data to travel between server and client. If you don't want server-side problems influencing your game you will have to play an offline game.
I don't know if people are even reading or understanding GGG's posts in desync thread.
Post by: nenjin on February 18, 2014, 09:54:10 pm
But since you have, answer me this. Why do I get desyncs fighting a single boss in a large room, because I use the pillar to block LOS and force him to move instead of attack? Why can I have 50 guys in a room with no desyncs when I'm outside of it, but the minute I step in I desync like crazy? Why can I be standing still and then during a desync, the game actually moves my character somewhere else? If the data is getting that mangled, there is a systemic problem.
If the issue is the time needed for the data to travel between server and client, then they need to optimize it further to send less data more often. At that cap? Then the data they're generating is too chunky. Again, my gut tells me its the pathfinding and LOS calcs serverside, based on where I've seen desyncs happen the most. Doesn't happen in the Dominus fight because the angles there are soft and there's lots of room to establish and keep LOS.
Whenever I die to a desync, it basically kills my motivation to play for the night. Especially at the higher levels when you can't just laugh off the penalty for dying, you have to plan around it if you want to get anywhere. And going three hours without dying only to have your legs cut out from under you by a desync is a massive FU, that they shouldn't be giving up on. My basic strategy is: farm an easy area with my loot gear on to gain actual levels, then put on my true gear and treat all the xp I'm earning as disposable. The ONLY reason I feel I have to play this way is the desyncs.
Post by: kcwong on February 19, 2014, 12:52:45 am
No, I haven't yet read it.
But since you have, answer me this. Why do I get desyncs fighting a single boss in a large room, because I use the pillar to block LOS and force him to move instead of attack? Why can I have 50 guys in a room with no desyncs when I'm outside of it, but the minute I step in I desync like crazy? Why can I be standing still and then during a desync, the game actually moves my character somewhere else? If the data is getting that mangled, there is a systemic problem.
The truth is you are desync'ed all the time. The game client is not at the same game state as server. It is not apparent to you because that's exactly what client-side prediction aims to do - make game play look responsive and real time, even though data has not arrived from server yet. It's the same on server-side; the simulation continues to run with or without data from the client. Both client and server uses prediction to continue to simulation while waiting for data to arrive. When data arrives they make adjustments to the game state to keep it more or less synchronized.
If you are on a big, flat and empty grassland, it doesn't matter if you are at (213,445) in client and (223,435) on server. You keep moving in client and server, and eventually when you stop moving, your location will synchronize on both ends. The client during all that time will provide you instantaneous feedback, moving your character as your input.
But if there are lots of trees and you are trying to hide behind them, then the difference in game state will be more apparent. In client you are moving right between two trees, but on server your position is actually 5 units to the left and you got blocked by the tree. In client you keep inputting commands for more actions; eventually both client and server catch the fact the game states are unrecoverable. So the client or server requests a resynchronization, server sends the full game state to client. Once the client get that, it snaps you and everything back, and at this point you think "Desync!" but the client is actually at the most synchronized state.
Some games hide desync by taking shortcuts. e.g.
- Not having narrow terrain, so your chance of getting stuck on something is much lower.
- Turning off collision check for some objects.
- The calculation of whether an attack hit or not is performed at the time when the attack is initiated. i.e. Vaal's hammer raised when you are in range = you are dead versus having the ability to run away before it lands.
Back to your case: Your desync could've been built up for some time. Then you start the fight with the boss (I'm assuming Brutus or Kole). You attempt to hide behind a wall, but due to the desync build-up, in server game state you are actually in front of the wall. So Brutus/Kole drags you in, your position rapidly changed. In server game state you are right up in the face with the boss, in client game state you are standing behind wall. Resynchronization ordered, server sends full state to client. You teleported to boss, probably dead shortly after as the game goes on despite of the resync, you got hit a few times already. At this time you think "Desync!".
The client-prediction technique is first in use by Duke Nukem 3D in 1996, and have been used by real time online games ever since. So I can't really give you a live example of what would happen if you don't use it. But basically the client would freeze up if data from server is delayed. You would press a key to attack... then nothing. Your character won't execute it until your input reaches the server and the server can get a response back to you. Which would suck for any real time games. That's what I meant with online real time equals to living with desync.
If the issue is the time needed for the data to travel between server and client, then they need to optimize it further to send less data more often. At that cap? Then the data they're generating is too chunky. Again, my gut tells me its the pathfinding and LOS calcs serverside, based on where I've seen desyncs happen the most. Doesn't happen in the Dominus fight because the angles there are soft and there's lots of room to establish and keep LOS.
With the client-prediction model, they are already sending less data more often. The time required for data to reach server and back (e.g. 200ms + 200ms), a real time game don't stand still to wait.
Server calculates how the enemies act, which is based on server's copy of your position. When resynchronization happens you get corrected to server's game state, which makes you think it's pathfinding/LoS related.
If you dare, you can try to run around in Dominus fight. Quaff a quicksilver and keep running through packs of monsters. You will gradually go out of sync, and a resync will happen. You will notice you and/or the monsters snap to different locations. Or do a Merveil run in normal so you don't have to die. Instead of fighting, just keep running around, through passages and monsters with quicksilver on.
Whenever I die to a desync, it basically kills my motivation to play for the night. Especially at the higher levels when you can't just laugh off the penalty for dying, you have to plan around it if you want to get anywhere. And going three hours without dying only to have your legs cut out from under you by a desync is a massive FU, that they shouldn't be giving up on.
I have my fair share of deaths from desync myself, on level 70+ characters.
Do what I suggested - use the /oos command when you catch a hint of a out-sync build up.
Post by: nenjin on February 19, 2014, 01:02:20 am
I'll have to try /oos, even though I think it's a slightly ridiculous work around to the issue. I can't really claim to have this problem in a lot of other games, except very sporadically. I knocked D3 for a lot of things, including lag, and sang PoE's praises above it. But this is one area where D3 at least behaves in a way that makes me feel like I'm being screwed less, because at least I can see the desync coming because there are other tells. In PoE, you get about 3 seconds of "wait, what?" before BLAM.
Post by: kcwong on February 19, 2014, 03:37:08 am
I basically do run around during the Dominus fight. Maybe not with QS, but I'm definitely not standing still.
I'll have to try /oos, even though I think it's a slightly ridiculous work around to the issue. I can't really claim to have this problem in a lot of other games, except very sporadically. I knocked D3 for a lot of things, including lag, and sang PoE's praises above it. But this is one area where D3 at least behaves in a way that makes me feel like I'm being screwed less, because at least I can see the desync coming because there are other tells. In PoE, you get about 3 seconds of "wait, what?" before BLAM.
Ah, running in the open area is different from running between obstacles. Try running figures of eight inside the crowd, and keep your eyes open for signs of resync!
I have not played D3, but according to others who did, D3 cut some corners by:
- Not having a lot of narrow places to navigate through
- Attacks hit a large area so accurate positioning is less important
- Monsters can pass through each other; this means monsters can freely go after where you are in both client/server game state. This should lead to less desync in monster positions, which in turn should let you know where they are more accurately.
Post by: miljan on February 19, 2014, 08:32:13 am
Generally the game is known for few things that are negative, its desinc as biggest one that will never change and trading simulator, that was never done before in a diablo like game (well d3 did it, but they saw it sucks so are moving away from it).
Post by: Aklyon on March 04, 2014, 08:42:59 am
Anyway, SotV isn't out yet, but they've posted mostly-completed patch notes (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/810698) for it for the interested.
Post by: nenjin on March 04, 2014, 10:40:42 am
Post by: aristabulus on March 05, 2014, 02:32:13 pm
They nerfed the fuck out out of Spectral Throw and the Scion tree :(
Of course they did. The Scion was given favorable balance as a draw when she was added @ Official Release... now that the newness has worn off, the nerf bat comes out.
Post by: nenjin on March 05, 2014, 02:46:59 pm
They nerfed the fuck out out of Spectral Throw and the Scion tree :(
Of course they did. The Scion was given favorable balance as a draw when she was added @ Official Release... now that the newness has worn off, the nerf bat comes out.
I found the nerf to the Circle of Health Values quite unfair. I'd bought almost all of it and I was nowhere near target health for Merciless. No idea where I'm going to make up the diff.
Post by: Aklyon on March 06, 2014, 12:18:00 am
We had a strongbox that explodes nearby corpses. I'd hit everything that popped out with flameblast, and suddenly I'm the only one in the cave except for the portal. :) :P
Post by: SharpKris on March 06, 2014, 07:12:36 am
Post by: kcwong on March 06, 2014, 08:36:36 am
(http://i.imgur.com/KkcGWyHl.png) (http://imgur.com/KkcGWyH)
Only one vaal gem from a vaal zone though.
Post by: dennislp3 on March 08, 2014, 04:18:14 pm
Post by: nenjin on March 08, 2014, 04:40:20 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on March 08, 2014, 04:55:31 pm
Post by: dennislp3 on March 08, 2014, 05:05:53 pm
Post by: nenjin on March 08, 2014, 05:35:22 pm
Post by: Rez on March 11, 2014, 01:44:44 pm
I'm sure it's been mentioned before, but use an autohotkey script for /oos. The syncing for PoE is just execrable; recently, I've been seeing 1/5 minute delays between syncs. That's the big reason I won't play hardcore (the other is that I'm too lazy to play with that risk and commitment).
The best vaal zone I've seen so far was in Sarn City (so Rema). It had contains 2 unique bosses and players are cursed with temporal chains.
Post by: Aklyon on March 11, 2014, 02:46:48 pm
I'm sure it's been mentioned before, but use an autohotkey script for /oos.Heres (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/41891911/PoE%20Sync.ahk) one I modified from one on the poe forums. Triggers on v, Hit F10 to pause it. Edit it to change the key used.
Post by: SharpKris on March 11, 2014, 03:07:15 pm
Post by: Seriyu on March 13, 2014, 05:44:04 am
While I'm here, can anyone offer some pointers on melee witches? What skills to shoot for and such? Really anything that needs to be mentioned, if anyone knows how they operate. I looked on the subreddit and found nothing, sooo yeah.
I feel like infernal blow/glacial hammer + a ranged magic skill to be safe would be ideal, but I really don't know a lot about how elemental damage operates in general.
And yes, I know this is probably a terrible idea that will result in no end of tears for me, but I have to be contrary with my ARPG builds or I'll die.
Post by: Aklyon on April 01, 2014, 02:49:52 pm
Post by: Levi on April 01, 2014, 02:51:33 pm
So I heard you like winning. (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/871214)
Haha, they were the perfect people to pull that off. :)
Post by: Jack_Bread on July 30, 2014, 09:29:26 pm
Here's the forum post: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/985043
SO MUCH HYPE
Post by: nenjin on July 30, 2014, 10:23:15 pm
Post by: Kanil on July 31, 2014, 08:04:37 am
Post by: kcwong on July 31, 2014, 08:22:44 am
Yes, you read that right, Caliga. Dominus is NOTHING compared to her.
Post by: boki on July 31, 2014, 11:24:07 am
Post by: Aklyon on July 31, 2014, 01:01:48 pm
But I've been through Normal difficulty many, many times because I like trying different builds. With a lot of gear that was probably crap, and not all the spell gems I could've used if I was playing optimally or whatever. But unless your build involves 'You need this unique or you will fail' kinds of gear (and if it does, you either really like the idea or its a very fragile build I'd say), I see no reason why you couldn't get through at least A2 normal with random blue gear, and up into Cruel as long as your gear was close enough to your level, and had a 3L somewhere you could use for support gems.
Trading before merciless as far as I'm concerned is just for collecting uniques (of which I have less than half a dozen), or for making it easier to have the gear you want to have for other experimental (or not so experimental) alts.
Post by: PrimusRibbus on July 31, 2014, 01:14:50 pm
Is the game still a huge trading crap and balance around economy, or did they change it? Hated d3 because of it, and for sure did not like PoE after i saw you need to trade to progress normal or invest 10x more time in grinding like free korean MMO crap.
Are you sure you aren't thinking of a different game? If anything, PoE has a problem of being able to blaze through the whole game in a couple days without much of any challenge.
Post by: boki on July 31, 2014, 02:09:46 pm
I am not talking about normal. You can play normal in d3 as same as in PoE. But when you hit high dif, end game/inferno drops become so bad that you need to trade to progress at all. So I guess from your posts nothing changed. There is a reason why people call the game path of trading and path of desync.
The huge problem that PoE has is that most important thing for GGG is the economy, and it directly hurts the game as they implemented bad mechanics because of it. I hated d3 for the same thing, but Blizzard understood that with their crappy d3 release and changed it in the expansion and moved away from AH and game balanced around AH. I guess nothing changed wiht PoE yet
Post by: Aklyon on July 31, 2014, 02:23:14 pm
Spoiler: Spoiler for unrelated rant (click to show/hide)
Post by: boki on July 31, 2014, 03:02:41 pm
If the end isn't hard, then whats the point of doing it instead of just picking your favorite place to fight in and doing whatever you want there instead? You've gotta have somewhere to try pushing towards, even if that place is evil and full of xp penalties and powerful mobs. Desync is a completely different topic to Merciless.Spoiler: Spoiler for unrelated rant (click to show/hide)
The end is not hard, it is time consuming if you do not trade. If you trade it is easy. They punish you with bad drop rates because they care to much about trading and economy. Trading in games like this should be one additional option, not the most important thing in the whole game.
Funny, I adore Path of Exile for what it did with the economy. Your currency is consumable, the gear you find has value based by individual, you always have a way to improve your gear. If you're minmaxing at the very highest levels, you may be in for a lot of trading, or if you're after very particular unique items or something, I could see it, but time's just as fair a means to get to an end as working the market is.
Thing is, your peers are your economy. There's no middleman auction house or interference by GGG. It's just you, the other players, whatever you have, and whatever the other wants.
There is no problem with people liking it. But i asked did it changed because i hate trading simulation in a game that is around killing monsters and getting loot from them. But i know it did not, so will not waste my time on it
Post by: nenjin on July 31, 2014, 03:07:19 pm
Post by: Sordid on July 31, 2014, 03:13:55 pm
Thing is, your peers are your economy. There's no middleman auction house.
You mean aside from poe.xyz.is, right? Which is pretty much exactly what the Diablo 3 auction house used to be before it was removed, only a lot less convenient.
Speaking desyncs, is it still a issue that requires a 3rd party workaround? I just don't have the patience for the PoE grind when I have to put up with that.
There's a 3rd party workaround? Desync is the reason I stopped playing PoE. I honestly don't get why it's even a thing. Other games of this genre don't have this problem, and PoE devs certainly aren't doofuses who have no idea what they're doing judging by the rest of the game.
Post by: nenjin on July 31, 2014, 03:17:26 pm
Speaking desyncs, is it still a issue that requires a 3rd party workaround? I just don't have the patience for the PoE grind when I have to put up with that.
There's a 3rd party workaround? Desync is the reason I stopped playing PoE. I honestly don't get why it's even a thing. Other games of this genre don't have this problem, and PoE devs certainly aren't doofuses who have no idea what they're doing judging by the rest of the game.
Well, by 3rd party I mean a macro to call an in-game function every 2 minutes or w/e.
Post by: Aklyon on July 31, 2014, 03:17:47 pm
There's a 3rd party workaround?Among other things, I have one linked in the OP. It uses autohotkey.
I consider that site as more like player interference/a price reference than an auction house. You can't buy things from it without also being ingame, among other things.Thing is, your peers are your economy. There's no middleman auction house.
You mean aside from poe.xyz.is, right? Which is pretty much exactly what the Diablo 3 auction house used to be before it was removed, only a lot less convenient.
Post by: Sordid on July 31, 2014, 03:27:14 pm
Among other things, I have one linked in the OP. It uses autohotkey.
Oh, right. That.
Quote
I consider that site as more like player interference/a price reference than an auction house. For one, you can't buy things from it.
Well yes, that's why I said it's a lot less convenient. The seller has to post the item in a shop thread, then the auction house site has to parse the thread to make the items available for searching, then you have to verify whether the item you want to buy is still available, and then you have to contact the seller and arrange the transaction. There are delays and problems when the site doesn't update in real-time and still shows items that have been removed from their threads, or when the seller doesn't have the item anymore but hasn't bothered to remove it from the shop thread, or when the seller isn't online to take part in the transaction, etc.
It's a lot of effort and a lot of wasted time on the part of a lot of people, the buyers, the sellers, and the owners of the auction house site, to arrive at a result that's very close to the D3 auction house; yet the D3 auction house seems to be universally detested and this inferior and inefficient workaround that attempts to emulate its functionality is praised. I honestly don't get it.
Call me a blasphemer and a heretic, but I prefer Diablo 3's approach. Both of them, actually. Make trading easy and efficient and secure, or make it outright impossible and compensate with very generous drop rates to make it possible to find your own gear. The PoE way is just obnoxious, IMO.
Post by: Aklyon on July 31, 2014, 03:41:13 pm
While I agree with you otherwise (a bartershop that doesn't rely on people being both online and responding to whispers would be very useful if I ever had a significant amount of currency, assuming its not overrun by bots with absurd amounts of currency on hand to perfect items and rip people off), that last part is just flatout a terrible idea unless they implemented it far better than CoS did.
Post by: Sordid on August 01, 2014, 09:27:40 am
Post by: Aklyon on August 01, 2014, 09:43:05 am
Quote
Masters as Vendors
Like regular NPCs, Masters can sell you items. Unlike normal vendors, the items sold by Masters change once per day (at midnight UTC). Each Master sells some general items and some aligned with his underlying class.
In our current build, the following items are added to the Master's vendor inventory at these reputation levels. This may change!
Level 1: A few unidentified magic items
Level 2: One unidentified rare item
Level 3: Some gems
Level 4: One magic item with a new powerful mod
Level 5: One identified rare item
Level 6: Stacks of currency at a slightly better exchange rate than the current vendors
Level 7: A level 60+ base item.
Level 8: A chance of a unique item (generally a common one, but very occasionally a rare one).
These are priced so that you don't want to buy everything in the shop each day from each vendor. You should check the vendor and buy the item if it's a good deal. For example, you wouldn't want to pay 5 Chaos Orbs for a Redbeak, but that'd be a great deal for a Dream Fragments.
Post by: boki on August 01, 2014, 11:10:10 am
Well Diablo 3 gets around the inability to trade with ridiculously generous drop rates. The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced PoE could really do with more generous drop rates as well. Increase the drop rates of uniques and currency by, say, an order of magnitude. Not only would this make the game much less dependent on trading and would make playing self-found much more viable, which in my mind would be a good thing, it would also make the currency items actually useful. The fact that currency items are also simultaneously crafting items is nothing short of brilliant, but unfortunately it all goes to waste because nobody actually uses them. Currently all anyone ever uses is transmutes, alts, augments, and the occasional yolo alch. The higher tiers are far too valuable to waste trying to RNG an item. If they were far more abundant and good items were far less costly, there would be a reason to actually try to craft your own gear with the high-tier currency items.
Not gonna happen because of this:
Quote
Path of Exile’s economy is the most important element of the game to us. It’s why we designed it to be played exclusively online.
I looked at the new crafting and I loled so hard. You will need to pay few chaos just to mod one item. Chaos that dont drop almost at all until you get to end game and where you need to farm for few of them in end game maps.
It's literally mind blowing that the game has this orbs for rolling mods, but they do not drop at all, and you will need to invest over 1000h to have something, and even than some people will never see something like Eternal Orb or Exalted Orb.
Disgusting how such a good ideas is destroyed because of the economy and bad drop rates.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on August 01, 2014, 11:12:14 am
Post by: Aklyon on August 01, 2014, 11:14:56 am
Post by: boki on August 01, 2014, 11:30:13 am
I've gotten plenty of Chaos orbs, but maybe that's because I actually play the game.
Yes, the same thing diablo fanboys said for d3 drop rates on release, and that you dont need to use AH, just to play the game and that drop rates are ok. Good thing that most people know that was not the case with d3, as same as most people know it for PoE. There is a reason why they call the game path of trade and why so many people want a self found league and game balanced around the player it self and not economy.
Post by: nenjin on August 01, 2014, 11:31:45 am
Post by: Sordid on August 01, 2014, 11:56:40 am
I've gotten plenty of Chaos orbs, but maybe that's because I actually play the game.
Yes, the same thing diablo fanboys said for d3 drop rates on release, and that you dont need to use AH, just to play the game and that drop rates are ok. Good thing that most people know that was not the case with d3, as same as most people know it for PoE. There is a reason why they call the game path of trade and why so many people want a self found league and game balanced around the player it self and not economy.
Yeah, I honestly don't give a shit about 'the economy', I just want to play the game on my own and actually be able to progress without having to farm for a thousand hours to get quasi-decent endgame gear. I already gave them $40 for supporter packs back in beta, but I'd pay that much again if that would get me a single-player version with increased drop rates that doesn't need to connect to their servers (thereby solving the desync problem, which really has no damn business existing if I'm the only person in the game).
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on August 01, 2014, 01:58:03 pm
I've gotten plenty of Chaos orbs, but maybe that's because I actually play the game.
Yes, the same thing diablo fanboys said for d3 drop rates on release, and that you dont need to use AH, just to play the game and that drop rates are ok. Good thing that most people know that was not the case with d3, as same as most people know it for PoE. There is a reason why they call the game path of trade and why so many people want a self found league and game balanced around the player it self and not economy.
Alrighty then
Post by: Bluerobin on August 01, 2014, 02:10:46 pm
Anyway, the next mini-expansion looks pretty neat. I'd stopped playing because of the desyncs (and the fact that my favorite type of build happens to trigger them a lot), but it looks like it'll be worth it to come back for that.
Post by: Aklyon on August 01, 2014, 02:14:49 pm
There is a reason why they call the game path of tradeI give negative fucks about whatever the mysterious 'they' call anything. This is the internet, you don't have to have a reason to do anything, just enough upvotes or other arbitrary support amount. (you don't even need that if all you want to do is essentially shout into the wind on tumblr or something) And then people either ignore it anyway or cause Drama (or trolling, which is less intersting) related to it with little in-between the two thats easily noticed.
Post by: nenjin on August 01, 2014, 02:17:35 pm
And I've made it all the way to the end of Merciless.
So I'm on the "Path of WAAAAAAAAAAHHHH" side of things, because trading is not necessary...unless you expect to get somewhere without actually playing the game. Gear modding is nice. It's not required.
Post by: Sordid on August 01, 2014, 03:03:02 pm
I've trade for exactly one one, and a couple of craftable items, just to see what dealing with people is like.
And I've made it all the way to the end of Merciless.
So I'm on the "Path of WAAAAAAAAAAHHHH" side of things, because trading is not necessary...unless you expect to get somewhere without actually playing the game. Gear modding is nice. It's not required.
And just what exactly is your definition of "actually playing the game", pray tell? How many hundreds of hours have you had to farm before you were strong enough to take on Merciless Dominus?
Also don't forget that Merciless Dominus is not in fact the end of the game. There's the Vaal map bosses now, which are apparently significantly tougher.
Post by: boki on August 01, 2014, 03:20:11 pm
Yeah, I honestly don't give a shit about 'the economy', I just want to play the game on my own and actually be able to progress without having to farm for a thousand hours to get quasi-decent endgame gear. I already gave them $40 for supporter packs back in beta, but I'd pay that much again if that would get me a single-player version with increased drop rates that doesn't need to connect to their servers (thereby solving the desync problem, which really has no damn business existing if I'm the only person in the game).I've gotten plenty of Chaos orbs, but maybe that's because I actually play the game.
Yes, the same thing diablo fanboys said for d3 drop rates on release, and that you dont need to use AH, just to play the game and that drop rates are ok. Good thing that most people know that was not the case with d3, as same as most people know it for PoE. There is a reason why they call the game path of trade and why so many people want a self found league and game balanced around the player it self and not economy.
Same. While I understand the always online thing as the game is f2p (but i would also love a offline mode, but at least here they have a valid excuse), i do not understand their focus on trading and economy for all players, the ones that like that and the ones that hate it. The game has league system and until i see a self found league where they do not make crappy drops because they are to scared that economy will get to big inflation i will not be touching it again.
I mean think of it, you play through normal, cruel and get to merc. dif. , and lets say how many chaos orb will you get till then, playing the whole game two times? 2, 3, maybe 4 if you are lucky..lol. And with that 4 orbs you cant do anything on your items and are best used to spam the chat and buy a item (good with new expansion at least you can actually put one mod on one item ::)). Its horrible design for self found players, or better said its not designed and balanced at all for them.
And not even talking about the wall you hit with end of merc. and mapping. And bad risk vs reword for something like killing bosses. God help us, if we would get some reword for killing hard map bosses, we would break the economy, we cannot have that in the game.
Post by: Sordid on August 01, 2014, 04:21:08 pm
I understand the always online thing as the game is f2p
I don't. I honestly don't. Could you explain it to me? I just don't see any logical connection between a game being free2play and the requirement for it to be always online. I can see it in a game you have to actually pay money for, sure, because there the always-on thing is DRM that prevents piracy. But PoE doesn't cost anything, so what's the point? What exactly are they trying to prevent people from doing by insisting on always-on? It can't be piracy, you can't pirate a game they're giving away for free. So what is it?
And even if GGG insist on it being connected to their servers, would it really kill them to at least make the game handle mob movement and hit detection and such locally when there's only one player in the game? Not only would that make it more pleasant to play for a significant portion of the player base, it would also lighten the load on their servers. It's a win-win. I understand that lag and desync happens when you're playing multiplayer, but it's beyond retarded that it happens when I'm playing alone.
Post by: boki on August 01, 2014, 04:36:35 pm
Agree about your other point that if you play alone they can have some thing done on local (actually, that should be done no matter if you play alone or in group). But you know what they will say, you can have map hack and cheat easier if its done on local (and that is true in a way).
Post by: Sordid on August 01, 2014, 05:00:10 pm
The reason why its always online is the hub area where other plays move around. You can see them having shiny things, and as that is their only income and actually in game marketing to make you also look at other character and buy cosmetics.
Okay, that does make a certain amount of sense, though not entirely. If it's just a matter of seeing others having shiny things, surely it wouldn't be difficult to program a bunch of bots to run around town and show them off in offline mode. I suspect it's also a question of making you want to have shiny things so that they can be seen and admired by others, in which case the bots wouldn't work. The flaw in that reasoning, in my mind, is that if I'm a solo player, I don't give a damn about others in the first place. In that case if I buy shiny things at all, it's because I want to look pretty to myself, and then the aforementioned bots would work fine to motivate me to purchase. Not to mention that I'd be willing to actually pay for the game, like I said, precisely to have these revenue-generating measures waived. I think GGG should rethink their business model a bit. Thanks for explaining, though. At least now I know what the reasoning behind it is, even if I don't agree with it.
Quote
Than there is again economy :"Path of Exile’s economy is the most important element of the game to us. It’s why we designed it to be played exclusively online"
Didn't Diablo 2 solve this issue more than ten years ago? IIRC you could make a battle.net-based character and participate in the economy or a local character for playing offline or over LAN. Again I feel GGG haven't quite thought this through. Or even looked at how it'd been tackled previously.
Quote
Agree about your other point that if you play alone they can have some thing done on local (actually, that should be done no matter if you play alone or in group). But you know what they will say, you can have map hack and cheat easier if its done on local (and that is true in a way).
That's probably true. I've never been a fan of this kind of carpet-bombing approach to misconduct prevention, though. Better to punish cheaters than limit and annoy everybody because somebody might cheat, IMO.
Post by: Aklyon on August 01, 2014, 05:11:53 pm
Post by: boki on August 01, 2014, 05:30:08 pm
Didn't Diablo 2 solve this issue more than ten years ago? IIRC you could make a battle.net-based character and participate in the economy or a local character for playing offline or over LAN. Again I feel GGG haven't quite thought this through. Or even looked at how it'd been tackled previously.
D2 was never designed with a working economy in the first place (PoE is actually the only arpg game i know that is from ground up designed to have a somewhat working economy and huge focus and balance around it, d3 was on beginning in a way but they changed it later). D2 economy is something that people made it them self with rune trading and similar. You could very easy farm and get a lot of highest level item uniques and sets that made the content in game easy. Blizzard changed that a little later when they added ubers so you need to farm for rune words so you can have some chance against them (it similar to atziri in PoE). But that is when a lot of dupes helped with that so people could get it easier.
That's probably true. I've never been a fan of this kind of carpet-bombing approach to misconduct prevention, though. Better to punish cheaters than limit and annoy everybody because somebody might cheat, IMO.
Yea, its like DRM for cheaters. All people are punished with the "DRM" so its harder for cheaters to cheat. I would much more prefer that they invested in cheat detection more than hurting the game play it self.
Post by: nenjin on August 01, 2014, 05:32:26 pm
Quote
And just what exactly is your definition of "actually playing the game", pray tell? How many hundreds of hours have you had to farm before you were strong enough to take on Merciless Dominus?
Maybe 16 hours of actual farming (i.e. finding the easiest, least threatening area to farm.) The rest of my time was spent methodically going through the whole game, every area and flinching away from nothing.
Post by: Aklyon on August 01, 2014, 05:45:06 pm
Don't mind me though, continue with whatever economic or desync-related argument boki has going.
Post by: Sordid on August 01, 2014, 06:41:13 pm
Didn't Diablo 2 solve this issue more than ten years ago? IIRC you could make a battle.net-based character and participate in the economy or a local character for playing offline or over LAN. Again I feel GGG haven't quite thought this through. Or even looked at how it'd been tackled previously.
D2 was never designed with a working economy in the first place (PoE is actually the only arpg game i know that is from ground up designed to have a somewhat working economy and huge focus and balance around it, d3 was on beginning in a way but they changed it later). D2 economy is something that people made it them self with rune trading and similar. You could very easy farm and get a lot of highest level item uniques and sets that made the content in game easy. Blizzard changed that a little later when they added ubers so you need to farm for rune words so you can have some chance against them (it similar to atziri in PoE). But that is when a lot of dupes helped with that so people could get it easier.
Well yes, but my point was that if the reason for the always-on thing was to protect the economy, giving people a completely separate offline version wouldn't compromise that because the offline version couldn't interact with the economy at all.
Though I do agree that D2 wasn't designed with an economy in mind in the first place and the rampant cheating didn't exactly help.
You know, a offline SP version would be nice, I'm not gonna argue against that. Most ARPGs seem to be based on singleplayer. But I've never thought of the onlineness as drm, since some games just are online games. Not in the way that AAA titles try to put it (the blatantly DRM method that backfires constantly as in Simcity, or in a less major-publisher way the way trendy has dungeon defenders eternity setup, with the new balancing and other things hidden behind servers that don't exactly hold up), it just is an online thing.
I disagree with that. Dark Souls, that is an online thing with its invasions and messages and ghosts and all that stuff. The quality of your experience is diminished if you play it offline. Not so with PoE. PoE doesn't have any of that, it's just an ordinary singleplayer/multiplayer ARPG that forces you to play online for no reason even when you're playing alone. It has no mechanics whatsoever that take advantage of being constantly online. As a solo player you wouldn't even know it's being played online if it weren't for the constant desync problems. The quality of your experience would not only not be any worse if you could play it offline, it would actually be increased. I think it's a damn shame that a game where the online aspect actually contributes significantly to the experience still allows you to play offline if you want, while a game where the online component serves as nothing but a detriment doesn't. One of these games is doing it wrong, IMO.
Post by: Mono124 on August 01, 2014, 07:22:18 pm
Post by: DemonOfWrath on August 02, 2014, 12:47:22 am
Before anyone jumps on me for that comment (I don't expect people to here, but I know for a fact if I said that on the official forums I'd be instantly dogpiled), my main character has been each time I've played a full glass-cannon fireball witch (hey, it's fun). Started in closed beta, had no real problems with that build once I'd played it a lot and I was probably the only high-ish level person doing such a thing, certainly the only one without minion totems (I used dual shock nova totems of all things, required some damn good positioning to use well). Running maps was a matter of knowing how to position, how to place totems correctly, how to advance safely, how to utilise all my spells and where one slip meant dead. And that's not counting some absurd things I ran across (flicker strike map boss that could 1-shot me was hilarious, I managed to kill him only dying once but that was damn hard). Wasn't easy, but enough experience meant I got good at doing all of that and eventually I could do most stuff without too much worry.
Skip forward ages to about when act 3X came out and I figure I'll jump into the game again (starting from scratch, same-ish build but I had to relent to skele totem since dual was no longer possible, thus my previous strategy was rendered invalid) and the shift in design was damn obvious. Non-expansion act 3 wasn't bad at all in that regard actually, Piety took a few goes before I figured out how to do her safely but overall it was fine. Act 3X and some of the new maps? That shit got rediculous. The new maps weren't that bad, except for boss areas full of mobs that you have to take a portal to, so it's basically a check of "can you survive being dropped into the middle of 20-ish enemies" which for a character designed to kite and not take hits means dead. But whatever, I can trade bad maps away, fine.
The real problem is a bunch of enemies introduced that force you to be in melee range (no, being a ranged character is not fun when you run into the bubble guys, it simply isn't) and others that punish you for trying to take the style of avoiding being hit rather than tanking the damage. The prime example of both of these being Dominus, the worst-designed fight I've ever seen because his final form is basically "you stand within my melee range or die in 2 seconds, btw my minions will swarm you as well and you can't run away from them this time because of blood rain". Like ugh, the only way I could beat that fight solo was to drag him down the stairs to the arena entrance by dying repeatedly, and then distract him to face the other way from you so I could actually attack without being swarmed from all directions.
That... was much rantier than I meant to make it, sorry, but I was pretty upset to see the balance with regards to character builds go so heavily towards "be tanky and melee or go away", when it didn't used to be anything like that.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 02, 2014, 12:52:17 am
Post by: nenjin on August 02, 2014, 03:18:12 am
*snip*
While I haven't played in a while, I will say: try playing melee. It is no cake walk. Exiles will make you wish you were never born, and some fights you're basically forced to eat multiple deaths to whittle a boss down because you can't DPS for shit while moving.
Post by: DemonOfWrath on August 02, 2014, 03:34:25 am
I'd rather eat deaths because I'm figuring out when I can get hits in than eat deaths because an encounter is designed to be nigh-impossible for the archetype I want to play.
Post by: Aklyon on August 02, 2014, 09:20:03 am
But that might just be me being terrible at melee in this game, since as far as i know, the problem has always been tankiness, not necessarily ranged vs melee. Thats why there was much excite in the Fosaken masters reveal thread when it was explained (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/985043/filter-account-type/staff#p8347761) there was less life nodes in that bit we could see of the new tree because there would be more life per level; which means less path of life nodes and more important things.
Post by: kcwong on August 02, 2014, 10:57:27 pm
1. It's tied to one of the Masters
2. You need to level him up to max to use the recipe
3. The level up process was described as a "multi-year" grind by Chris
4. It costs you 1500 fusings
I had hoped it would be based on how many fusings you've already applied, slowly increasing the odds. Instead we have this.
1. Path of Trading
2. It will take a player with other responsibilities (or other games to play) a very very long time to get 1500 fusings.
I'd like to keep trading to a minimum. ROLE PLAY! We are exiles on a very hostile island, we don't do window shopping all day, darn it.
Well, at least a Tabula Rasa dropped for me a few days ago - my first and only 6L.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 02, 2014, 11:05:09 pm
3. The level up process was described as a "multi-year" grind by ChrisWhat? Can you source that? That seems a bit ludicrous.
Post by: kcwong on August 02, 2014, 11:17:58 pm
3. The level up process was described as a "multi-year" grind by ChrisWhat? Can you source that? That seems a bit ludicrous.
Doh! I read it incorrectly. Chris said it isn't meant to be a multiyear grind; it's a challenge in 3-months leagues. So I guess access to the recipe is no problem; it's just the 1500 fusings.
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/985838 (search for the word "grind")
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 02, 2014, 11:33:35 pm
The cost is a bit much, but considering most people seem to take more than 1000 fusings to get a 6-link (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/501575), I suppose it's reasonable-ish? Note the last post of the page, however.
With the expansion, however, it's going to make using more that 1.5k fusings feel like an even bigger loss. It may become harder to buy fuses.
Post by: Micro102 on August 03, 2014, 12:13:13 am
Post by: TherosPherae on August 03, 2014, 03:36:42 am
Well, at least a Tabula Rasa dropped for me a few days ago - my first and only 6L.Protip: Vaal Orbs have a greater chance to give you a 6-link than fusings do, even if the base you're throwing them at has less than 6 sockets. So when you're leveling a character, it can be a very good (and very profitable) idea to throw Vaal Orbs at Armorer's strongboxes, since you're not likely to get a lot of useful stuff out of those anyways. Bonus points if you get a "mirrored" mod on the box, since you can actually get mirrored corrupted 6-links that way.
I started playing this, and am wondering what the point of playing this over and over is. It seems like you need to complete the game multiple times to get good loot, but why get the better loot? So you can beat a harder difficulty and get better loot? Is there any extra content past the first play through?
If by playing over and over, you're referring to the different difficulties; yes, there's extra high-end content for reaching the end of Merciless difficulty. It's a bit of a bitch to access, though, and it's not going to be extremely easy to clear unless you abuse trading and/or broken mechanics to high hell. And even then, if you're playing something silly like a Shockwave Totem build, there's no amount of gear strong enough to make that viable in the endgame.
If you're referring to how the game seems to be designed around playing multiple characters, then no; each character has the same storyline progression save a few different voice lines and a little bit of NPC dialog. There are lots of different, fun ways to powderize monsters, though. That's what keeps me coming back - the ability to pull up a passive tree and plan out a completely new character, go kill monsters with it, then do it again anywhere between two weeks and three hours later.
Also, as a sidenote, Minion Instability summoner is the silliest build I have ever played. If you're getting sick of hitting monsters with swords, daggers, axes, or whatever, try throwing exploding zombies at them. It's a hoot.
Post by: kcwong on August 03, 2014, 06:16:22 am
Protip: Vaal Orbs have a greater chance to give you a 6-link than fusings do, even if the base you're throwing them at has less than 6 sockets. So when you're leveling a character, it can be a very good (and very profitable) idea to throw Vaal Orbs at Armorer's strongboxes, since you're not likely to get a lot of useful stuff out of those anyways. Bonus points if you get a "mirrored" mod on the box, since you can actually get mirrored corrupted 6-links that way.
No such luck yet; but I do have 12 white sockets on me currently: Tabula Rasa + 3 corrupted items.
Also, as a sidenote, Minion Instability summoner is the silliest build I have ever played. If you're getting sick of hitting monsters with swords, daggers, axes, or whatever, try throwing exploding zombies at them. It's a hoot.
Summoners have the advantage of requiring little to no item to be able to survive. Killing speed may not be high at first and may be not as fast as other builds in late game, but everyone can make one very easily.
Make a beeline towards Minion Instability, get the right quest reward gems, grab nearby Static Blows for synergy, then go back and grab some life and defense nodes, and all minion nodes. It's a no-brainer character to make.
Plus, everyone gets a full passive tree reset in 20 days or so, when Forsaken Masters is released. Feel free to experiment!
Post by: Aklyon on August 03, 2014, 09:28:33 am
Post by: TherosPherae on August 03, 2014, 01:27:02 pm
Summoners have the advantage of requiring little to no item to be able to survive. Killing speed may not be high at first and may be not as fast as other builds in late game, but everyone can make one very easily....Static Blows? Really? I mean, I know that Wrath is a powerful aura, but I wouldn't think it's worth throwing points on Static Blows, especially when you can shock everything really easily with Arc anyways.
Make a beeline towards Minion Instability, get the right quest reward gems, grab nearby Static Blows for synergy, then go back and grab some life and defense nodes, and all minion nodes. It's a no-brainer character to make.
Plus, everyone gets a full passive tree reset in 20 days or so, when Forsaken Masters is released. Feel free to experiment!
Also, my current MI summoner is a little.... weird. It's meant to be a burn build of sorts - since the MI explosion is nothing but fire damage, you can get some really nice burns out of it. Prolif that around, and suddenly your zombies are actually walking napalm grenades! Or at least they are in theory - in practice, they've got a touch too much health in Cruel right now to die frequently enough to consistently set things on fire. Ah well, it's a work in progress.
And yeah, I use Summon Skeletons to keep my face from getting bashed in too much. It works as a great boss-nuke, too; not a whole lot can stand up to AoEing a pack of skeletons that explode in their face.
Post by: Aklyon on August 03, 2014, 01:38:24 pm
Have you tried using skeletons instead for consistant fire? They tend to die regardless of how hard they get hit, but they also don't make quite as hard explosions since they don't have the great health of the zombie.
Post by: Micro102 on August 03, 2014, 05:15:32 pm
Post by: TherosPherae on August 03, 2014, 07:32:01 pm
Static Blows shows up everywhere in witch builds afaik. People really seem to like throwing it on everything just to add a bit of shock chance.Yeah, they don't tend to burn enough from what I've seen. Alas.
Have you tried using skeletons instead for consistant fire? They tend to die regardless of how hard they get hit, but they also don't make quite as hard explosions since they don't have the great health of the zombie.
Post by: Aklyon on August 03, 2014, 07:41:37 pm
If I find an item with 4 linked sockets, how good would the stats have to be on a different item to outweigh the advantages of fully linked slots? Assume you have the gems for all the slots.Good enough to balance out the loss of the support gems, I'd say. A color-coordinated (not necessarily all one color, just what you need out of the 4L), enough-linked item is a very nice thing to have, especially for skills you want to support with things like blood magic gem or spell totem. (or minion supports).
Post by: kcwong on August 03, 2014, 09:39:18 pm
...Static Blows? Really? I mean, I know that Wrath is a powerful aura, but I wouldn't think it's worth throwing points on Static Blows, especially when you can shock everything really easily with Arc anyways.
My summoner was my first character; she was rebuilt multiple times as GGG gave us a full reset. Her current style is CI Summoner with Dual Totems.
Static Blows + 2 Storm Call totems = Triple shocked enemies everywhere = Much increased minion damage output.
Static Blows and Minion Instability are right on the path to +1 Spectre, so it doesn't hurt to grab it. Plus respec'ing out of both will only cost you two regrets, so even if you don't include them in your completed build, you can use them during level'ing.
Also, my current MI summoner is a little.... weird. It's meant to be a burn build of sorts - since the MI explosion is nothing but fire damage, you can get some really nice burns out of it. Prolif that around, and suddenly your zombies are actually walking napalm grenades! Or at least they are in theory - in practice, they've got a touch too much health in Cruel right now to die frequently enough to consistently set things on fire. Ah well, it's a work in progress.
And yeah, I use Summon Skeletons to keep my face from getting bashed in too much. It works as a great boss-nuke, too; not a whole lot can stand up to AoEing a pack of skeletons that explode in their face.
Unstable skeletons have one little problem - they have limited duration. If they disappear instead of getting killed, there will be no explosion.
If I find an item with 4 linked sockets, how good would the stats have to be on a different item to outweigh the advantages of fully linked slots? Assume you have the gems for all the slots.Good enough to balance out the loss of the support gems, I'd say. A color-coordinated (not necessarily all one color, just what you need out of the 4L), enough-linked item is a very nice thing to have, especially for skills you want to support with things like blood magic gem or spell totem. (or minion supports).
I swapped my 6S5L 500+ dodge armor to Tabula Rasa; defensively I lost:
- About 300 HP
- About 800 Armor (using Iron Reflexes), that's -2% of damage reduction
- About 20% Fire and Cold resists
But on the other hand I got a huge boost (+800 per second) in damage.
It was Incinerate + Added Lightning + Mana Leech + Life Leech + Lesser Multiple Projectiles. Being able to add Spell Echo changed everything.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 07, 2014, 01:12:46 pm
Armourmaster Haku (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/989414)
- Haku's missions seem to be "grab spirit; return to me." The spirit may give some sort of buff.
- He does armour crafting. Some mods: +35-64 maximum life (costs 3 chaos); +4-8% weapon elemental damage (costs 5 chaos); 55-68% increased armour (costs 3 alchs)
- His hideout's tileset is based on the Coast.
Upon reading some Reddit comments, there's possibility that Haku crafts defensive stats on armour(but ele damage?) while Catarina does caster stats, which leaves another master to put weapon stats on armour.
Vorici, Master Assassin (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8sTlXD0DV0)
- Vorici's mission may be based on attacking rogue exiles.
- He does socket crafting. Some mods: Six sockets (cost 350 jewellers); Six linked sockets (cost 1500 fuses); At least one red socket (cost 4 chroms)
- His hideout's tileset is based on the Slums.
Loremaster Elreon (http://www.gamespot.com/articles/exclusive-first-details-on-path-of-exiles-upcoming/1100-6421458/) (Gamespot link)
- Elreon's missions are based on defending relics from waves of monsters. The relics may also require a certain number of enemies to be killed near it and may also provide buffs.
- He seems to do jewelry crafting. Some mods: 1-2% mana leech (costs 2 chaos); 10-20% increased energy shield (cost 8 chaos)
- His hideout's tileset is based on the Library.
Catarina, Master of the Dead AND Rampage League (http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/747/feature/8783/page/1) (MMORPG.com link)
- Catarina's missions are based on killing certain enemies and bringing their raised corpse back to her. Possibly defending limb-towers, too?
- She seems to do intelligence armour crafting. Some mods: +26-30 intelligence (costs 5 alchs); +35-44 maximum mana (costs 5 alchs)
- Her hideout's tileset is based on Fellshrine Ruins.
Rampage league sounds fun as hell.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 10, 2014, 11:31:46 am
My skill tree is going full attack speed on a bow all the time. I'm only going to put points into other things when there's no other choice.
Gonna be fun :v
Post by: Aklyon on August 10, 2014, 11:41:59 am
I played this with webadict up to level 6 or so. It was pretty decently fun. :PBut what kind of bow skill to use that attack speed on? Rain of arrows works a bunch differently from poison arrow or ice shot, which are different from burning arrow, or explosive arrow.
My skill tree is going full attack speed on a bow all the time. I'm only going to put points into other things when there's no other choice.
Gonna be fun :v
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 10, 2014, 11:44:29 am
Post by: Skyrunner on August 10, 2014, 11:48:58 am
... back to the drawing board?
Edit: I do grab some of the Life & Evasion skills, and if I give up some projectile damage I could get more life nodes.
But what kind of bow skill to use that attack speed on? Rain of arrows works a bunch differently from poison arrow or ice shot, which are different from burning arrow, or explosive arrow.Split arrow? I have that and poison and arrow rain right now.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 10, 2014, 11:59:34 am
Also most PoE players will tell you your first character is doomed to fail.
With split arrow, try not to fall into the Split arrow > LMP > Fork/Chain trap. It works okay for the first difficulty, but afterwards, it falls off haaard.
Post by: Aklyon on August 10, 2014, 12:03:55 pm
Also, if you're using the skill tree on the site, you don't want to use every single point it gives you, thats the amount if you're at the max level. ~100 points is in the vicinity of level 80 I think, which is generally considered more realistic to reach. And like Jack_Bread said, theres gonig to be more life per level soon, so not as many passives would be taken up by it! (hopefully)
Post by: Skyrunner on August 10, 2014, 12:08:46 pm
Re:life--if I give up going for the big evasion ring I can get a lot more life nodes. Plus I have some life & evasion skill points. Maybe that'll be enough.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 10, 2014, 12:18:17 pm
Post by: boki on August 10, 2014, 01:30:16 pm
Welp, now you've gone and put doubt into me :( I hate failing a character build. Hate hate hate.
Re:life--if I give up going for the big evasion ring I can get a lot more life nodes. Plus I have some life & evasion skill points. Maybe that'll be enough.
Now its time to fuck up your build. When the expansion hits you will get a one time full respec so you can fix all the problems with your build
Post by: Rose on August 10, 2014, 02:17:45 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 10, 2014, 02:37:25 pm
I don't know weather to blame my build, or the spell itself, but firestorm is OP as all hell.This seems to be a running theme with spells I've used on my main character. Miniions had terrible AI, used them anyway. Still did alright. Then they updated that stuff a long while ago and now they work pretty well in general for me. Used firestorm all the time as my attack to help the minions, then arc came out. People complained arc was terrible, used it anyway, was fun. Now apparently arc is really good at something, and then you bring up an OP firestorm.
Aside from that though, Firestorm is just pretty nice in general I'd say.
Post by: nenjin on August 10, 2014, 02:40:32 pm
Anyways, it's all fun-and-games until enemies start soaking damage better in later difficulties. A lot of abilities seem a lot less OP when you can only use them for a second or two before you have to run away/kite.
Lower levels a lot of things are going to see OP that later don't...especially against some bosses.
Post by: Micro102 on August 10, 2014, 04:40:05 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 10, 2014, 04:56:17 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 13, 2014, 11:23:11 pm
The reworked skill tree has been released, but it's currently only viewable via third party tree readers. This link has a link to the download. (http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/2di6fi/discussion_tentative_120_passive_tree/)
There's a loooooot of crit added to the tree. All the life nodes have been nerfed, but keep in mind that they're giving you more life per level. It'd likely that 130% life from tree is the new 200% life.
This might be a new era of CI, too. I was able to get 190% increased energy shield + CI while also grabbing lightning damage nodes.
Hexmaster and Whispers of Doom have lost their keystone status, now they're notables. Whispers of Doom sit above and a bit to the left of the witch area and still gives its +1 curse. Hexmaster now sits above Conduit and gives 100% increased curse duration instead of the permanent curse thing.
They've also added a notable node to pretty much every cluster.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 13, 2014, 11:53:45 pm
Post by: Micro102 on August 14, 2014, 12:35:50 am
I'd love if a crit attack speed build would be viable. For bows.
What a coincidence, that's what I am currently trying to build on one of my characters. Sadly, all the AS stuff is either in the small bonuses or I just can't find the bigger nodes.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 14, 2014, 12:46:23 am
Here's the translated Garena Patch notes. (http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/2dfnar/garena_120_patch_notes_translated/cjp2uap)
Relevant bit: "Bows can now deal more damage. Additionally, some bows now have higher base critical chance."
Also, the skill tree I posted was actually outdated. It was posted by Mors, who has access to the alpha build of PoE and he assumed that his skill tree and the posted JSON data were similar. He was wrong, apparently. (http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/2difid/the_tree_posted_by_mors_isnt_up_to_date/) I'll post a download/link to the actual new tree when I comes up, if I can.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 14, 2014, 01:54:46 am
That's how I'm building right now, too. There's not many AS nodes, though.I'd love if a crit attack speed build would be viable. For bows.
What a coincidence, that's what I am currently trying to build on one of my characters. Sadly, all the AS stuff is either in the small bonuses or I just can't find the bigger nodes.
Post by: Mono124 on August 14, 2014, 02:01:34 am
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 14, 2014, 02:39:59 am
Spoiler: Tree link (click to show/hide)
The crit was an afterthought as I forgot that you wanted crit, too. I was able to get 130%+ life without crit and a bit higher attack speed.
I play a bit, but I'll be playing more when the expansion comes out. I made my own guild with my own friends, but they're so inactive I can add B12ers to it.
EDIT: PoE Builder (https://poebuilder.com/) is up to date, now. The icons are messed up, but it's still good.
Post by: Aklyon on August 14, 2014, 07:47:19 am
Post by: Skyrunner on August 14, 2014, 08:55:05 am
Here's a build attack speed/crit build I made with the outdated new skill tree:Interesting. I suppose I'll need to party with a tank to draw aggro if I want to not blow up in higher difficulties? :PHighlights: 117% life, 103% attack speed with bows, 272% increased critical strike chance with bows, 106% increase crit multiplier with bows.Spoiler: Tree link (click to show/hide)
The crit was an afterthought as I forgot that you wanted crit, too. I was able to get 130%+ life without crit and a bit higher attack speed.
I play a bit, but I'll be playing more when the expansion comes out. I made my own guild with my own friends, but they're so inactive I can add B12ers to it.
EDIT: PoE Builder (https://poebuilder.com/) is up to date, now. The icons are messed up, but it's still good.
(Your build does about 120 more dps than the other build I had that used 120 skill points and had 98% life. Pretty agreeable.)
(...Also, I used Harbringer Bow with no upgrades and a level 5 Split Arrow gem to compare DPS)
The new tree is pretty interesting. It greatly simplified the Acrobatics-Phase Acrobatics ring, and got rid of the HUGE Bow ring near the bottom. Bow Damage Increase nodes all got a buff from 12% to 15%.
I wonder, what's good about frenzy charges?
Post by: Micro102 on August 14, 2014, 02:47:19 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 14, 2014, 03:01:39 pm
They didn't get rid of the huge bow cluster, they just swapped its place with lethality, kinda. Lethality now sits where it previously was and the big bow cluster is to the right of the Ranger's frenzy charge.
As for what's good about frenzy charges: more attack speed. Every frenzy charge you have gives you 5% increased attack speed.
Also, the offline skill tree is correctly updated now, with working icons! Here. (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/994393)
EDIT: A new master has been revealed: Tora, Master of the Hunt. (http://massively.joystiq.com/2014/08/14/massively-exclusive-previewing-path-of-exiles-tora-master-of/)
She does bow crafting, her hideout tileset is like the Riverways, and her missions involve hunting beasts.
Also, the Beyond league has been announced as well!
Apparently, when you kill a bunch of monsters close to each other, a portal begins to form that summons extradimensional demons. As you kill more monsters by the portal, the portal gets larger and large, increasing the spawn rate and the difficulty of the monsters within. If it gets big enough, it summons a unique boss, it looks like. Sounds fun!
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 14, 2014, 09:28:38 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 15, 2014, 12:22:36 am
The first one could work. Personally, I get bored late into the league and I know that many others feel the same. However, it may be the impending end of the league that makes people lose interest. I don't think GGG would do that, as they don't seem to like putting out major updates(tree reworks, mini-expansions, etc...) in the middle of the temporary leagues.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 15, 2014, 12:47:15 am
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 15, 2014, 12:49:12 am
Quote
Path of Exile: Forsaken Masters will be released at 3pm on August 20 (US Pacific Time). This is midnight in the CEST timezone and 10am on August 21 in New Zealand.
Post by: Micro102 on August 16, 2014, 06:05:21 am
Post by: Aklyon on August 16, 2014, 08:05:33 am
Wait, so is this going to be a wipe or something?Dunno where you got that idea from. Its an expansion and a major skilldrasil update, so you get a free passive respec as usual along with the new leagues. Whatever extra effects it has for the garena server is irrelevant unless you're using that.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 18, 2014, 06:00:56 pm
Chris Wilson also shows us hideout decorating and a couple of missions from Vagan and Elreon.
You can see the master reveal and the preview here. (http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/08/18/final-hero-revealed-for-path-of-exile-forsaken-masters)
Post by: Sinistar on August 20, 2014, 10:16:14 am
Right now I'm choosing between templar (because the idea of ass-kicking grandpa really appeals to me; he may suffer from lack of dexterity I gather), duelist (agile melee fighter sounds neat; be he himself seems a bit douchy) and shadow (because killer extraordinaire? Why not; apparently kinda tough to play and I'm not much interested in using traps)
Any of the class offers noticeably less/more equipment/armor to use? I mean, I know equipment is not class restricted, but I'm speaking in terms of non-experimental, core-stat(s) centered builds. A quick glance at wiki tells me there's quite a selection of weapons and armor for everyone, but you know, still asking.
Post by: Rose on August 20, 2014, 10:28:40 am
Post by: nenjin on August 20, 2014, 10:29:02 am
Maybe go Maurauder? He's between the Templar and Duelist Trees, so he can go Str/Vit early on then swing down into tons of delicious DPS upgrades, or go up for yet more tankiness. Shadow puts you between Witch and Ranger, and you have to go quite a ways through the skill tree to get to anything really tanky. Shadow offers a lot of non-standard defensive options, which to date I've never really been impressed with.
Post by: Sinistar on August 20, 2014, 10:43:08 am
Weapons are varied as hell, though each class has an armor that's best suited to them.Yeah, that's what I though is the case. I was more interested if any class is really limited in their option, but I'm guessing no.
-snip-
Here's the funny thing - I don't actually feel like rolling a tanky, barbarian-like juggernaut on my first try. I know it's silly and this is based entirely on my personal preference. But maybe it's because barbarian was one of my favorite classes in Diablo 2 and now I don't want to go with the usual? Dunno. ???
As for unmentioned classes - necromancer was the other favorite class of mine in D2 but because I can't go full necro skill tree here (lack of useless bone walls makes me sad :P) I refuse to play the witch. As for ranger - funny how I almost always put bow-wielding classes on lowest-priority place on my list, but very often they tend to become one of my favorite classes...
Well, I guess I'm over-thinking this too much, but sack it, I'll keep thinking. Thanks both for the info so far. :)
Post by: kcwong on August 20, 2014, 10:49:56 am
Red is associated with strength, fire and armor.
Green is with dexterity, ice and dodge/evade.
Blue is with intelligence, lightning and energy shield.
So your class' starting position will tell you what their most natural options are.
You can go for a different options of course, provided that you plot an efficient path to grab sufficient nodes. My witch for example, is running Eldritch Battery (converts all your energy shield into mana), Mind over Matter (takes 30% damage with your mana) and Iron Reflex (converts all evade into armor). So she has a bit of all the defense nodes.
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 11:26:39 am
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on August 20, 2014, 11:30:39 am
Spoiler: A match made in heaven. (click to show/hide)
Also PTW.
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 11:35:27 am
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on August 20, 2014, 11:36:40 am
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 11:39:01 am
Post by: Sinistar on August 20, 2014, 11:39:06 am
Also remember the expansion comes out today, and the PoE site's skill tree doesn't update until the patch comes in ~5:30 hours. (however, other places like poebuilder have the skill tree more-or-less correctly already)Oh, right, that. I know about expansion, but I forgot they also tweaked skill tree a bit. Well, I guess I'll wait till tomorrow and think a bit more carefully what I want to roll.
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 12:12:27 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 20, 2014, 01:35:14 pm
Keep in mind that everyone has to build kind of tanky. With the new skill tree and the increased life per level(along with nerfed reflected damage), you need at least 150% life on tree, though you can get away with 130% or lower.
Also shadow doesn't seem all that hard to play anymore. I feel like his difficulty came from the weird start, which has been simplified to just choosing physical damage and elemental damage.
Post by: Sinistar on August 20, 2014, 02:10:40 pm
Not sure what I want to do with this (https://www.poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgYAsNii2cgUFr9qjPVvpn_tQbGztUg2PW1spzTAnOOEbIydqm9XRfRkr4o4Ff20xWKs1gePwUscjYH2_CaVkoCaF2qV0All8bt8IQMi6ujW53RLxM3q6xQRL-tjmZq29ysKvjoQe9sawQD1S91IuNkBCRGWDkhW6J-C4JVbr90N_MVW-u4Oo4r5YxXwBfmbJrLcCEk6s5AKXkWS8_rrm7WsR1FMykrDOuKAIJwZhussRZZ9W8HYqKKq-HpTYevPerIZMgFh4g==) other than 'Claws!' (maybe try Reave?), but I thought I'd link to it and see what you guys thought of it.So, apart from Reave, what skills would you use on this build? Frenzy? Puncture?
-snip-Ok, good to know. I leaning more and more towards shadow, took a bit closer look at his mines and traps and somehow I'm starting to like them... we'll see, I'll play around a bit with the builder and I'll decide.
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 02:17:18 pm
Honestly, I dunno. I only poke into melee occasionally (usually when something like this happens and I feel like doing something not-spellbased, and I haven't tried reave yet so I wanted to do that), so I was kinda hoping someone that knew more about melee skills would answer, heh. :)Not sure what I want to do with this (https://www.poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgYAsNii2cgUFr9qjPVvpn_tQbGztUg2PW1spzTAnOOEbIydqm9XRfRkr4o4Ff20xWKs1gePwUscjYH2_CaVkoCaF2qV0All8bt8IQMi6ujW53RLxM3q6xQRL-tjmZq29ysKvjoQe9sawQD1S91IuNkBCRGWDkhW6J-C4JVbr90N_MVW-u4Oo4r5YxXwBfmbJrLcCEk6s5AKXkWS8_rrm7WsR1FMykrDOuKAIJwZhussRZZ9W8HYqKKq-HpTYevPerIZMgFh4g==) other than 'Claws!' (maybe try Reave?), but I thought I'd link to it and see what you guys thought of it.So, apart from Reave, what skills would you use on this build? Frenzy? Puncture?
Post by: Bluerobin on August 20, 2014, 02:20:05 pm
That build only has +50% life, but it has +90% ES and a staggering +383% evasion, plus bonus flat evasion on top of that, so it wouldn't be as bad as it may look. I would probably pick up Ghost Reaver and Ondar's Guile though, since they're both close and would help out with survivability.
Edit: Maybe not Ghost Reaver, because I just remembered that claw change from life gain on hit to life leech as you get to higher levels and you'd lose most of your life healing (so chaos damage would probably be a pain). Also, there are a fair number of dual wielding block nodes around that might be worth picking up too.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 20, 2014, 02:26:14 pm
According to Reddit, this drops it from a hard-to-manage cool damage skill to purely utility.
Not sure what I want to do with this (https://www.poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgYAsNii2cgUFr9qjPVvpn_tQbGztUg2PW1spzTAnOOEbIydqm9XRfRkr4o4Ff20xWKs1gePwUscjYH2_CaVkoCaF2qV0All8bt8IQMi6ujW53RLxM3q6xQRL-tjmZq29ysKvjoQe9sawQD1S91IuNkBCRGWDkhW6J-C4JVbr90N_MVW-u4Oo4r5YxXwBfmbJrLcCEk6s5AKXkWS8_rrm7WsR1FMykrDOuKAIJwZhussRZZ9W8HYqKKq-HpTYevPerIZMgFh4g==) other than 'Claws!' (maybe try Reave?), but I thought I'd link to it and see what you guys thought of it.You're likely going to need more life than 58%. If you're going evasion you really need Ondar's Guile as that gives you ridiculous protection from projectiles attacks. Getting it makes Lunaris 3 not a pain in the ass. Also, Ondar's Guile makes reflect not a problem if you're playing a ranged attack build, like Spectral throw, which could work with your build.
Arcrobatics/Phase Acrobatics isn't entirely necessary, but it may be something to consider. Phase Acrobatics, especially, because you're likely to get gibbed by mobs with EK.
I recommend dropping the small nodes past some of the notables you took, like Void Barrier and Revenge of the Hunted. You can also drop the +30 strength nodes as you're not likely to need strength with that build. You can use the spare points to pick up the Scion's once-again-OP life wheel and some nearby life clusters, like Hired Killer and Profane Chemistry.
EDIT: Oh, here are the patch notes, anyway. (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/998489)
Here's a summary of the skill changes:
* Pretty much all the skills had their mana costs adjusted.
* Skills Reworked: Arctic Breath, Burning Arrow, Cold Snap, Critical Weakness, Cyclone(cannot be supported with multistrike), Detonate Dead, Reave, Viper Strike, Shockwave Totem(now spell damage), Warlord's Mark
* Skills buffed: Ball Lightning, Cleave, Flame Surge, Freezing Pulse, Glacial Cascade, Glacial Hammer, Ice Nova, Ice Shot, Ice Spear(doubled damage!!), Lightning Strike, Raise Spectre, Raise Zombie, Spark, Sweep, Summon Skeletons
* Skills nerfed: All curses, Anger, Arc, Clarity, Elemental Weakness, Enfeeble, Flameblast, Frenzy, Projectile Weakness, Searing Bond, Spectral Throw, Summon Raging Spirits, Vulnerability, Wrath
EDIT2: Half hour until patch hits... Hype!
I think I'll disband my friend-guild and make one for B12.
EDIT3: It's LIVE!! GOGOGOGO!
The stupid ALWAYS UPDATING Dota2 glitch prevented my Path from updated. ARRRGGG
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 20, 2014, 05:57:09 pm
I also disbanded my inactive guild and made a new one named Nist Akath! Whisper me in-game to join.
EDIT: Offline for the moment. You can also whisper Aklyon_ for an invite.
Post by: Elfeater on August 20, 2014, 07:39:52 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 07:51:16 pm
Where do you find Eleron?Somewhere!
Sorta-related, everyone but me has found haku in varying places according to global chat. (I found an alchemy orb on the coast instead. Not sure if impressed)
Edit: Hey, found Elreon. Storm call is not the best thing to use there.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 20, 2014, 08:05:54 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 08:12:07 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2014, 11:47:32 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 20, 2014, 11:52:28 pm
But yeah, server rip'd.
EDIT: oop, not a server death. It was just a hiccup. It's back on now, but I'm not going to be playing for the moment.
Post by: Kanil on August 21, 2014, 12:43:48 am
Edit: Phase two Merveil is also pretty bad. She can't damage me, but between her energy shield and her endless squid meatshields, I can't damage her. Meanwhile, the squid recharge my potions, so I don't even die of getting slowly worn down. Gave up after 20 minutes of killing squid for no XP. I guess she... wins?
Post by: Sinistar on August 21, 2014, 01:33:29 am
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 21, 2014, 03:30:36 am
A few things I noticed weren't good with your tree. You don't have to take all the nodes in a cluster. Some nodes just aren't efficient to take, usually meaning accuracy and damage nodes. You can save a few points getting rid of superfluous accuracy/damage nodes. You also took a stun duration node at the Blunt Instrument cluster. That's droppable.
Also, you're taking some crit, but not a lot. I realize you just took every node relating to staves, but it isn't too good to go part way into crit. You have to go all or nothing with crit! If you go halfway, you're wasting skill points that could be best spent elsewhere. If you really want to go crit, I recommened grabbing all the staff crit nodes and make a skillgrimage to the right side of the tree, towards shadow.
Since left side of the tree has a hard time hitting things because of their low amount of dex nodes. Since you wouldn't want to invest partway into crit, it's best to grab Resolute Technique so you won't have to worry about grabbing accuracy from the tree or from gear.
Also, yes, most of your resistances should come from gear, so that whole cluster of resist by marauder isn't too good of an investment. An exception would be if you need a little bit extra resists to cap yourself while you're still looking for decent gear. Then you'd only want to drop a few points in resists that you can easily spec out of.
"Enemies cannot leech mana from you" is purely PvP. PvE enemies don't use mana. i would drop it.
Zealot's Oath is a weird keystone. Pretty much the only time it's worth grabbing is if you're a CI character that deals indirect damage, such as totems or traps. Then you're also going to need the life regen to back it up.
Finally, staves are hard to roll and, therefore, difficult to find good ones. They're in the awkward dual-class weapons that can be either spell based or physical damage based, like wands, daggers, and sceptres(I think). I don't want to discourage you from going staff, but it's something you should keep in mind.
I revised your tree if you'd like to see it. You could also take a crack at your own revisions, if you want.
EDIT: Oh, also there's a situational node you can take, by the way. If you're running staff with any AoE skill, like Molten strike or Sweep, you can spend a couple of points to get Amplify above the templar's life nodes.
Post by: Sinistar on August 21, 2014, 03:57:44 am
1. Yeah, 164% is above, but I wasn't sure if it's above enough but on the other hand it also felt like I'm going too far into marauder tree just to get those few additional %
2. Hmm, true, I took all the nodes in a cluster usually. I was a bit too click happy when it came to those. And I though both accuracy and damage were important so I usually clicked on them without second though again.
3. I actually thought I'm packing quite enough crit chance, hehe. My inexperience shows. But yeah, I fancy an idea of having a higher critical since from what I read staves have a little bonus in that department. EDIT: ah, I see now this Resolute technique. I was actually thinking about this one but decided to ignore it because I thought I'm better of with my (not so big apparently) crit bonus. Maybe I should forgo the crit idea and staves in general after all...
4. Resistance, mana leech, Zealoth's Oath - ok, got it.
5. I was in fact thinking about going with AoE skill on staves, primarily Sweep (+ glacial hammer for single targets), that's why I decided to roll with them. A bit daft decision, now it seems. EDIT: ESPECIALLY because I completely failed to notice that amplify node *facepalm*
But yeah, I'd love to see your revised tree. Always happy to learn.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 21, 2014, 04:05:20 am
Apparently this was a straight buff to bows, because my attack speed is 1.8 (up from 1.63) and my DPS is 280 (up from 240). o.o I feel so much stronger, too. I barely need to kite, just pew pew everyone to death with split arrow, and dps rare monsters to death.
I found a random strongbox and got a +20% quality armor from it along with 2 rares...
I got a Unique bow (
I also learned that vendor recipes are a thing today.
I feel guilty that I killed a bunch of mobs without my play buddy Webadict :p... now our level ups won't be in sync anymore. But I did pick up a rare glove that might be useful.
--- end Sky's PoE diary---
edit: Random note: I wonder if Barrage could somehow be used with Point Blank as a shotgun bow build along with projectile damage and crit :P
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 21, 2014, 04:20:45 am
Cool, that's some good info.Here you go: Link (https://poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgUAhMREcop0D1SpaBRNBLOiAPAfgW_Fip48r2yTB03YTP9Fjox2Otg8Lb057DjE9saut3IaOMQVJ-39MLc-1YunhEou_EusqhkuiI_-CpBV7URsFnKp2WE2uhrk8kXYvcAauUOHGXzZqXPynGqlOuE1kmaep6U5Dm6Xplf-j_rSLPv3vk3jMZ4XLzbpIVVk5-Nq5FFV1ptYgKQx-3_jXz_BBOOf9khr2ScvjM8U9u8OPfyGO1hjNI7G2P_TAeenMFbZFCDrCVBHCZYYkScg)
-snip-
But yeah, I'd love to see your revised tree. Always happy to learn.
One of the problems you're likely to encounter with this tree, though, is getting the int to wield your staves. I didn't want to discourage you, though. The first build I beat normal with was a staff templar and I think I did pretty much what you did, haha.
I'll be honest, though, I don't run crit too much, so I wasn't entirely sure. I recall being told I didn't have enough crit with, say, 200% increased crit chance.
On the topic of crit, here's a different version just for crit, if you're interested: Link (https://poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgUAhMREcop0D1SpaBRNBLOiAPAfgW_Fip48r2yTB03YTP9Fjox2Otg8Lb057DjE9rdyKU8aOMQVJ-3Vi4V95CKnhEou_Eu1BJBV7URsFmMLwBq5Q4cZE3G8mhb5Zp6npV6lQXKIOPrSyWf7i52KFy8dFDbpZOePRuNqVdaboVtZgKT315-0rJhYrjpYVcaD2wQHTLMtH1AwlSDB86Kjf8YPxBGWO3wOSAceuMpjQ13yoi6VLnDVUELw1YnTjDZJUXBSVUsqC2Hi8-q1SGsXvOrAVGpDJ6k=)
340% increased crit chance and 120% increased crit multiplier. Less life. Crit is a lot harder to gear, though.
I like that bows seem to have different sounds now--more of a metallic "ping!" instead of the wood-y "pew" it was before.Oooh, yes. I'm running a bow build as well and bows feel waaaay better early than they did before. I'm loving it! Also, that's an interesting build idea. You should give it a shot. :)
Apparently this was a straight buff to bows, because my attack speed is 1.8 (up from 1.63) and my DPS is 280 (up from 240). o.o I feel so much stronger, too. I barely need to kite, just pew pew everyone to death with split arrow, and dps rare monsters to death.
-snip-
--- end Sky's PoE diary---
edit: Random note: I wonder if Barrage could somehow be used with Point Blank as a shotgun bow build along with projectile damage and crit :P
Post by: Skyrunner on August 21, 2014, 04:33:51 am
And barrage drops fairly late in the game... like level 20.
Also how 2 solo play 2 hard @_@_@_@ (My lv30 ranger can solo because the current zone is lv26 and she has decent dps, but low level ones need to kite forever and it's stressful! D:)
... and I don't know which skill nodes to use for max barrage damage!
*excuses*
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 21, 2014, 04:41:12 am
For solo, remember to get defenses early, offense later. I like to grab nearby life nodes, then rush the hell out of Ondar's and Acrobatics before I hit Lunaris in normal. For bow/evasion builds, at least.
You build barrage like any normal physical bow build. Lots of bow physical damage, projectile damage, attack speed. Frenzy can be a nice pickup to if you can keep it up. Pierce may be fun, too. Crit, if you're willing to invest.
Like my build for a dual-axe-wielding cleave witch, it might be better to get settled in the new league before trying it, though.
Post by: Sinistar on August 21, 2014, 04:46:15 am
Here you go: Link (https://poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgUAhMREcop0D1SpaBRNBLOiAPAfgW_Fip48r2yTB03YTP9Fjox2Otg8Lb057DjE9saut3IaOMQVJ-39MLc-1YunhEou_EusqhkuiI_-CpBV7URsFnKp2WE2uhrk8kXYvcAauUOHGXzZqXPynGqlOuE1kmaep6U5Dm6Xplf-j_rSLPv3vk3jMZ4XLzbpIVVk5-Nq5FFV1ptYgKQx-3_jXz_BBOOf9khr2ScvjM8U9u8OPfyGO1hjNI7G2P_TAeenMFbZFCDrCVBHCZYYkScg)Thanks a lot! One question though - I see in both builds you put point in Sovereignty. I personally wasn't even considering using Auras, but should I? If I ignore them, maybe put a few point in intelligence beside that cluster (if I'm considering a no-crit build) as you said I might be a bit low on it, and/or even take the Amplify?
One of the problems you're likely to encounter with this tree, though, is getting the int to wield your staves. I didn't want to discourage you, though. The first build I beat normal with was a staff templar and I think I did pretty much what you did, haha.
I'll be honest, though, I don't run crit too much, so I wasn't entirely sure. I recall being told I didn't have enough crit with, say, 200% increased crit chance.
On the topic of crit, here's a different version just for crit, if you're interested: Link (https://poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgUAhMREcop0D1SpaBRNBLOiAPAfgW_Fip48r2yTB03YTP9Fjox2Otg8Lb057DjE9rdyKU8aOMQVJ-3Vi4V95CKnhEou_Eu1BJBV7URsFmMLwBq5Q4cZE3G8mhb5Zp6npV6lQXKIOPrSyWf7i52KFy8dFDbpZOePRuNqVdaboVtZgKT315-0rJhYrjpYVcaD2wQHTLMtH1AwlSDB86Kjf8YPxBGWO3wOSAceuMpjQ13yoi6VLnDVUELw1YnTjDZJUXBSVUsqC2Hi8-q1SGsXvOrAVGpDJ6k=)
340% increased crit chance and 120% increased crit multiplier. Less life. Crit is a lot harder to gear, though.
Well, other than that, I see at least my starting few decisions were decent. :P
Off to leveling up!
Post by: Skyrunner on August 21, 2014, 04:53:40 am
This early in the leagues, its difficult to find leveling uniques. It's weird going from "Goldrim on ALL my lowbies!" to "Pick up everything for wisdom scrolls."I'm not playing in the new league though. I'm in standard league... >_>
For solo, remember to get defenses early, offense later. I like to grab nearby life nodes, then rush the hell out of Ondar's and Acrobatics before I hit Lunaris in normal. For bow/evasion builds, at least.
You build barrage like any normal physical bow build. Lots of bow physical damage, projectile damage, attack speed. Frenzy can be a nice pickup to if you can keep it up. Pierce may be fun, too. Crit, if you're willing to invest.
Like my build for a dual-axe-wielding cleave witch, it might be better to get settled in the new league before trying it, though.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 21, 2014, 04:57:49 am
Clarity is a great early game aura, even if it has been nerfed. It has a flat mana reservation, unlike the other auras.
Anger and Wrath can fill out your damage quite nicely. Hatred is good if you have a lot of physical damage.
Grace is awesome for evasion/IR builds, but you're nowhere near those.
Determination looks good, but I hear its "eh" if you're not running IR + Grace.
Discipline can give you some extra EHP, but I wouldn't run it unless you're specced into some amount of ES or are using Eldritch Battery.
Purity of Elements/Fire/Ice/Lightning can fill out missing resists without having to dip into the tree.
Haste is alright. I wouldn't bother with Vitality.
The new skills Herald of Ice and Herald of Ash can also add to your dps, too.
You can run 1 aura without investing in reduced mana reservation(and without a reduced mana cost gem). You can drop them if you don't feel like you're going to be running more than 1 aura.
I feel I may have wrote too much, but I already wrote it, so its staying!
NINJAEDIT:
Oh... right, haha.-snip-I'm not playing in the new league though. I'm in standard league... >_>
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on August 21, 2014, 05:17:32 am
Also I've found all of my masters so far by doing what I usually do when there's nothing else to do, running the Ledge until my eyes bleed.
Post by: Sinistar on August 21, 2014, 08:43:28 am
I'm in rampage league and so far I managed to get 32x combo...not much, but I'm happy. I also met Loremaster, we kicked some righteous ass.
Post by: Aklyon on August 21, 2014, 09:08:53 am
A. Doesn't cost too much mana, gives awesome regen boost.
B. Costs too much mana, can't use the regen well.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 21, 2014, 09:29:03 am
Post by: kcwong on August 21, 2014, 09:30:37 am
Are those fixed now?
Edit: Seems fixed; I used the official skill tree (with the GreaseMonkey script to show total bonus), and compared it with PoEBuilder... everything seems fine now!
This will be my remade Incinerate Witch (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMB34rpAv6zVyu9gm0Z37CCECycSbIC4welK3gfxwj0wFS86mpDaxeVIMHzgh7bC6Kjf8Yc3JMn74j5N9fPSbG0DOq6DXxXySj6gsebtRmKLYP7CfbaGo-XBsSioSL0-KJAwzrKSlFMrEd9WypNFSAs6d0NW69OKimlGNt08YUyRnGDCW-e4YgdqhGWBx6VLvDVSVHBxewYcLvZEy9v-eivp_zFZ6CHdkp9QYe3Pv4K2L0ti1WuRKuPpg==)... further levels will probably go into more life nodes, armor, and elemental damage.
I wonder if dropping Static Blows will seriously lower my damage dealt... but even if I took the whole ring, it's still 5% less chance to shock than before. I'll try to stick to just an Added Lightning for now.
Hmm... maybe this (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMB34rpAv6zVyu9gm0Z37CCECycSbIC4welK3gfxwj0wFS86mpDaxeVIMHzgh7bC6Kjf8Yc3JMn74j5N9fPSbG0DOq6DXxXySj6gsebtRmKLYP7CfbaGo-XBsSioSL0-KJAwzrKSlFMrEd9WypNFSAs6d0NW69OKimlGNt08YUyRnGDCW-e4YgdqhGWBx6VLvDVSVHBxewYcLv56K-n_MVnoId2Sn1Bh7c-_grYvY-m9OlPr2e9NolEqw==) would be better. I do rely on shock stacks.
Post by: Levi on August 21, 2014, 02:38:12 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 21, 2014, 02:45:51 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 21, 2014, 04:08:09 pm
Clarity tends to go one of two ways, as far as I've tried:You really have to watch how you level it if you have a low mana pool. Don't forget you can vendor a gem + a scouring orb to lower the gem's level!
A. Doesn't cost too much mana, gives awesome regen boost.
B. Costs too much mana, can't use the regen well.
Did they improve the netcode out-of-sync stuff at all with the new update? I kinda got annoyed with baddies taking 37 arrows to the face without dying, then teleporting backwards last time I played.I feel its about the same, though yesterday was pretty good at not desyncing. Brutus is still the desync master, too, even without the pillars in his room...
-snip-Looks good. Could use a bit more life, though, but you might be alright with EB+MoM. You're right next to Ash, Frost, Storm and Inner Force, so it might be worth it to grab those.
You can also drop the added lightning gem if you can find yourself a Three Dragons.
EDIT: I want to make a build with this new sword.
(http://i.imgur.com/vqGUuR3.png)
Post by: Aklyon on August 21, 2014, 04:19:49 pm
Post by: Karkov on August 21, 2014, 04:25:03 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 21, 2014, 04:27:57 pm
Spoiler: imagespaaam (click to show/hide)
EDIT: Oh, I'm online right now. Whisper "OrinthologyTheSecond" for an invite to our guild!
Post by: Bluerobin on August 21, 2014, 04:36:36 pm
Post by: Sinistar on August 21, 2014, 04:57:48 pm
Was completely my mistake. My first "proper" boss fight, Brutus, went... ridiculously easy. Ran up to him, offered him a big bowl of Glacial Hammer goodness, he went belly down in few seconds.
Now, Merveil on the other hand... Well, I got cocky. I rushed her same way as Brutus, and despite seeing some of her abilities are taking away frightful amounts of my life, I though I'll just endure it and continue gulping down the sweet red stuff. This might work in Diablo, but not here.
anyways, went in for the second time, payed more attention to her attack patterns, beat her first form relatively easy. Her second form almost got me again few time (water column or-whats-it-called spam in confined spaces results in much FUN), but was victorious in the end.
Overall, I'm having a blast with PoE. Few desyncing problems, even got 2 crashes in last hour(s?), but still pretty fun.
The only thing that makes me rage is failing defend the shrine quest in last second.
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUetc.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 22, 2014, 03:02:49 am
It's been made the "find-a-master" channel. Also, if you find a master, you can announce it there(be sure to say something like, for example, "elreon a2n, in crypt") and get help for their mission.
I've found Vorici twice in a row, so far. Still need to get Tora, though... only found her once and a friend invited me to help her once, too.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 22, 2014, 07:14:13 am
(http://i.imgur.com/9OuWNqX.png)
Even though it's level 9, it has as much evasion as my current armor for level 35, a magic item. But the gem sockets aren't good for me (current armor has 4 linked greens) so yeah. I can't really use it, though I might use it if I make another character some time in the future.
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 07:25:20 am
I don't even have a bow character right now.
Post by: Sinistar on August 22, 2014, 08:15:21 am
(http://i.imgur.com/KDb2U7D.jpg)
Too bad my current rare gloves offer stats more to my liking. Oh well, I guess I'll just keep them if I ever make a shadow/duelist?
Just letting you guys know, if you want to find a master check out global channel 820 (you can switch global channels by typing "/global 820")I'll probably have to use outside help after all, so thanks for that. Been skipping all over 1st act today in hopes of finding Loremaster, but to no avail. Haku, on the other hand, was everywhere. Like, for instance, on both levels of that cave after the mud flats. So I went on to act 2 with intent of pushing the story forward, and I meet Loremaster in Dark Wood.
It's been made the "find-a-master" channel. Also, if you find a master, you can announce it there(be sure to say something like, for example, "elreon a2n, in crypt") and get help for their mission.
I've found Vorici twice in a row, so far. Still need to get Tora, though... only found her once and a friend invited me to help her once, too.
Turns out, his quests are even more crazy in act 2, dammit. :P
EDIT: scratch that, beat my first act 2 Loremaster quest. FUCK ME AM THE BEST
(actually, Storm call is a LOT more useful than I gave it credit for)
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 08:22:32 am
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on August 22, 2014, 08:56:26 am
Something Evil and I are currently sitting on; 2 Death's Harps, 2 Foxshades, an Asphyxia's Wrath, a Karui Ward, 2 Ignomons, 2 Limbsplits, a Facebreaker, a Maginord's Vise, 2 Hrimsorrows, a Hrimnor's Hymn, 2 Sidhebreaths, a Rat's Nest, a Rimegaze, a Skullhead, a Quillrain, a Cybil's Paw, a Queen's Decree, a Deidbell, a Belly of The Beast, a Three Dragons, a Blood Reaper, a Brightbeak, 2 Vall's Protectors, a Fairgraves' Tricorne, a Supreme Truth, an Ungil's Gauche, a Terminus Est, a Pyre, a Perandus Signet, a Forbidden Taste, a Cloak of Flame, a Shavronne's Pace, a Le Heup of All, a Goldwyrm, 2 Al Dhih's, a Last Resort, an Aurumvorax, a Redbeak, 2 Crests of Perandus, 2 Asenath's Gentle Touches, a Sadima's Touch, a Goldrim, a Deerstalker, an Ondar's Flight, a Slitherpinch, 2 Ondar's Clasps, a Blackheart, a Kaom's Sign, a Carcass Jack, and finally, a Lochtonial Caress.
I think that's about it.
I also think we spend too much time playing this game.
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 08:57:34 am
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on August 22, 2014, 08:57:56 am
Post by: Something Evil on August 22, 2014, 08:58:22 am
Edit:A year or so of sporadic play.
It's more like 3-4 months of actual consistent play.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on August 22, 2014, 09:51:41 am
Post by: Something Evil on August 22, 2014, 10:33:19 am
Were you using leap slam/infernal blow/GMP CoC spell spam?
Post by: Bluerobin on August 22, 2014, 12:05:40 pm
GGG does reccomend players use /oos autoscripts and external disconnect macros in HC for such instances.
That's the thing that frustrates me so much that I've only played 5 times since the Vaal expansion hit.
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 12:12:41 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 22, 2014, 01:53:57 pm
On the topic of uniques, I still haven't found one on Rampage and I just hit cruel. ;_;
Also, Ondar's Guile is part of the ultimate leveling set. If you can keep your ES up/get a decent amount of ES, the attack speed is really good. Though it gets frustrating past act 1, where the enemies start tearing through your ES.
Post by: Sordid on August 22, 2014, 02:16:27 pm
GGG does reccomend players use /oos autoscripts and external disconnect macros in HC for such instances.Why the hell don't they have an in-game thing for this? Why doesn't the game /ooc automatically every three seconds or so? IMO if the developer recommends the use of a third party tool to make their game playable, there's a serious problem.
Were you using leap slam/infernal blow/GMP CoC spell spam?
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 02:47:16 pm
Why doesn't the game /oos automatically every three seconds or so?Because you aren't constantly serious-desynced enough to need it (if you are I'm not sure how your connection is working in the first place), and that would effect server performance quite a bit I'd expect, resyncing everyone with every relevant instance every 3 seconds and wasting a lot work on people in towns who don't need it.
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on August 22, 2014, 03:47:34 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 03:54:08 pm
Post by: Sinistar on August 22, 2014, 04:18:57 pm
Still having fun though. Passed my 3td Loremaster mission and was pleasantly surprised at small but effective modification of original quest. And did I mention how neat the "currency" system is? Yep, great fun.
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 05:11:17 pm
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 22, 2014, 05:30:04 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/akST7ZQ.jpg)
I haven't encountered any "Unable to MapviewOfFile" things and I'm on a 32-bit system. I do occasionally get "Unable to something-something pid 32" while loading that's really annoying.
Post by: Something Evil on August 22, 2014, 07:14:40 pm
Also, those gloves look amazing.
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 08:49:06 pm
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/41891911/corrupted%20sidhebreath.png)
Post by: Sordid on August 22, 2014, 09:08:38 pm
Why doesn't the game /oos automatically every three seconds or so?
Because you aren't constantly serious-desynced enough to need it (if you are I'm not sure how your connection is working in the first place), and that would effect server performance quite a bit I'd expect, resyncing everyone with every relevant instance every 3 seconds and wasting a lot work on people in towns who don't need it.
The problem is that you very often don't know whether you're seriously desynced until you die from it. A hotkey only mitigates the problem, it doesn't solve it completely. To solve desync you'd have to keep resyncing periodically even when you don't need it because you don't know that you don't need it. And you have to resync often enough; make the interval too long and you can desync and die before the next resync happens. Would it affect server performance? Absolutely. Thought IMO I was actually pretty generous to the poor little servers with the 3 second interval, ideally I'd have the auto-resync run every second, or maybe even twice per second. Of course, at that point it just becomes a way of forcing the server to actually keep track of where shit is, which it damn well should have been doing in the first place. I don't understand why it's even a problem at all. The last game I vaguely recall having desync problems like this is Diablo 1 back in 1997. I don't think I've played an ARPG over the internet in the last decade that suffered from desync.
Of course, this would be easily solved by combining an automatic resync with another idea I posted a few pages back, namely handling movement and hit detection and things like that client-side when there's only one player in the game. I'm fairly sure solo players are a significant part of the player base, so switching them to offline mode when there's nobody else in the instance with them would free up a lot of server capacity that could then be used to auto-resync players who are actually playing in multiplayer.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 22, 2014, 09:37:34 pm
-snip-They have a large post on their Development Manifesto forum (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/889669) on this topic.
Personally, I don't really care. I've got a /oos macro and I've learned to identify when to use it. I've died to it, of course, but not in a while.
Post by: kcwong on August 22, 2014, 11:28:00 pm
I think this was pretty nice for the one of the two chaos I've gotten in rampage so far, considering how the game has dropped almost everything but a unique (minion life, summon skeletons, summon spectre, animate guardian, animate weapon) in what feels like my luck trying to nudge me into making a second summoner.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Aura is a bad vaal result, because you still need mana/reserve to cast it, and you cannot link a reduced mana to it. The implicit mana regeneration is one of Sidhebreath's good qualities, because early on you need to resummon a whole lot.
Trading in new leagues tend to be cheaper than standard, because standard got massive inflation. I'd say 2 chaos is expensive for that amulet...
In other news, turns out it will be a multi-year grind for people with a life outside of PoE...
Reputation needed for Level 8 (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1004446)
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2014, 11:38:42 pm
Post by: Sinistar on August 23, 2014, 01:28:45 am
Its not so much a directly 64-bit thing as it is a lack of memory thing as far as I remember; since the PoE executable is 32-bit according to task manager.Dunno, official post on forums said it, yes, is because the lack of memory, but it also said the easiest workaround is more than 4gigs of RAM so 64-bit OS basically. :(
Well, this usually happens to me only when I teleport with portal scroll from an instance to a town, might have to do something with that. I'll try that gc 2 command, see if it does anything to my Steam-bound client.
Post by: TwilightWalker on August 23, 2014, 05:21:34 am
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 23, 2014, 05:41:58 am
Anyway, Aklyon and I have been playing Rampage. I started a bay12 guild, but I haven't collected any other bay12ers in it other than Aklyon, yet...
Post by: Skyrunner on August 23, 2014, 07:06:14 am
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on August 23, 2014, 07:15:55 am
Post by: Sinistar on August 23, 2014, 10:56:44 am
On topic of guilds - I wouldn't mind joining one, but is there even a benefit in doing so? Also guilds are server bound, I'm guessing...
Post by: Aklyon on August 23, 2014, 11:15:40 am
As for guild advantages, theres a seperate guild stash for extra space (which is nonexistant by default, unless if the guild is given enough points to buy it by other guildfolk (only the leader can buy it however), or if the leader buys it themselves without contributions), and guild chat is not league-bound last time I'd heard about it on reddit. (Global and trade chat channels are restricted to each individual league, not that it makes them any easier to read :P)
Theres also some sort of [tag] you can make for the guild that involves spending particular maps to get particular letters in the particular order you particularly want them in, but you actually need people with spare maps to do that, so its not really relevant to us atm.
Post by: Sordid on August 23, 2014, 09:53:48 pm
-snip-
They have a large post on their Development Manifesto forum (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/889669) on this topic.
Personally, I don't really care. I've got a /oos macro and I've learned to identify when to use it. I've died to it, of course, but not in a while.
Yeah, I've read that a while ago. And again just now. What caught my eye in particular is this bit:
Quote
Our experimental changes so far attack the problem by causing more intelligent resyncs. There's a very tough trade-off between small frequent resyncs (which make the game feel jittery but it's kept in sync) vs less-frequent but larger teleports. Users have come to associate a resync with being out of sync, so updating them more frequently makes them feel like the sync is worse rather than better.
What I find interesting is that it doesn't say "we're trying to strike a balance between syncing often enough and keeping the server load low enough". That's what I'd always assumed was the crux of the issue. If you can just manually /oos at any time to make the server resync you, surely the easiest solution would be to just do it automatically? I always thought the reason they're not doing that is because it would stress the servers too much. But no, it seems the balance they're trying to strike is actually between keeping the game in sync and making sure things don't jump around on the screen too much. That's a point that's repeated several times through the post, and they even acknowledge that people a varying tolerance for the rubber-banding that occurs during a resync. So the question that comes to my mind is this: Why not let the player decide that balance? Just put a damn slider into the options menu, "resync aggressively (rubber-banding will occur frequently) - resync infrequently (severe desync will occur occasionally)". Sounds like an obvious solution to me.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 23, 2014, 09:57:50 pm
Post by: kcwong on August 23, 2014, 10:33:40 pm
Now that I have 101 pages I'm not inclined to play in temp. leagues... the features, if tested to be good, will eventually come to Standard anyway. And if I do play temp. leagues, I will try very hard to limit my hoarding to no more than 4 pages.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 23, 2014, 11:08:46 pm
Post by: Skyrunner on August 23, 2014, 11:14:13 pm
edit: I normally have 561 DPS, but with 4 stacks of Frenzy I get 910 dps. Pretty impressive o_o
Post by: Something Evil on August 24, 2014, 05:56:06 am
All the games I play have server issues today. League servers are kaput, PoE servers got ddosed...
edit: I normally have 561 DPS, but with 4 stacks of Frenzy I get 910 dps. Pretty impressive o_o
Yup, Frenzy is beastly if you can support the mana cost. I use it as an initiator on my poison arrow ranger and can gas entire rooms, it's pretty amusing.
Did they nerf Merciless Dominus recently? I ran in there today with a Rain of Arrows Ranger that wasn't able to get halfway through Act 3 before the patch and was struggling towards the end of it even after the patch, and to my surprise she only died once to Dominus (due to desync, naturally). I didn't expect to actually be able to kill him, I just wanted to get an idea how much stronger I'd have to become before I could take him. Not that I'm complaining or anything, I was just surprised. His cronies in particular went down extremely easily, to the point where I was so bewildered that I opened up the map to check that I was actually in Merciless. Did they nerf the fight or something?
Don't think so. Thing is, Dominus is the massive meta-breaker since you can't really just outgear the fight like with Piety or Merveil.
He will happily kill you with Touch of God if you lack the HP and resists and stand in the heavily telegraphed Big Attack (can't remember if it can actually crit), a moment of inattentiveness with his totems, getting zerged by suicide bombing mooks (what usually kills me) or any of the above combined with getting shocked by one of his ghosts. It's a tactically difficult fight meant for two or three people (tank, add clear, DPS) due to its mechanics, to the point where sometimes it boils down to chance alone.
Edit: if someone in Standard wants to keep an eye on naturally-occurring Forsaken Masters in the wild and get in on the action, or join daily quest farming runs, /global 820 is the place.
Post by: kcwong on August 24, 2014, 07:53:33 am
Don't think so. Thing is, Dominus is the massive meta-breaker since you can't really just outgear the fight like with Piety or Merveil.
He will happily kill you with Touch of God if you lack the HP and resists and stand in the heavily telegraphed Big Attack (can't remember if it can actually crit), a moment of inattentiveness with his totems, getting zerged by suicide bombing mooks (what usually kills me) or any of the above combined with getting shocked by one of his ghosts. It's a tactically difficult fight meant for two or three people (tank, add clear, DPS) due to its mechanics, to the point where sometimes it boils down to chance alone.
Edit: if someone in Standard wants to keep an eye on naturally-occurring Forsaken Masters in the wild and get in on the action, or join daily quest farming runs, /global 820 is the place.
My only problem with Dominus is that he's very likely to spam non-stop his lightning attack (the one with lots of demons crawling)... even with capped lightning resists, Master of Mind with Eldritch Battery, I still cannot stand too much inside it. I can drink a Topaz and face tank him, but that's only for a short while and twice per portal.
Post by: ragnar119 on August 24, 2014, 08:16:45 am
I really hoped that depending of item level the prices will scale, so people have more reason to use crafting while leveling and playing the game, and not use it only few time in end game when you get that good item.
The two new leagues are really nothing special, liked invasion a lot more, as it had much more diversity and better bosses, while in beyond I am fighting two same mobs that 90% drop only white items. The thing I like are the masters and the quests, they add little diversity, and also that you can buy gems from them. But there are also problems as to much grind that you will need to level them.
Post by: Elfeater on August 24, 2014, 09:43:55 am
Post by: Sordid on August 24, 2014, 12:12:49 pm
My only problem with Dominus is that he's very likely to spam non-stop his lightning attack (the one with lots of demons crawling)... even with capped lightning resists, Master of Mind with Eldritch Battery, I still cannot stand too much inside it. I can drink a Topaz and face tank him, but that's only for a short while and twice per portal.
That I found extremely easy to deal with with my Rain of Arrows Ranger, since I can just stand behind a wall in such a way that he hits the edge of the wall with the lightning ghosts; meanwhile, I can shoot a little off to the side of him and still hit him with the RoA AOE.
Post by: kcwong on August 25, 2014, 08:55:19 am
My only problem with Dominus is that he's very likely to spam non-stop his lightning attack (the one with lots of demons crawling)... even with capped lightning resists, Master of Mind with Eldritch Battery, I still cannot stand too much inside it. I can drink a Topaz and face tank him, but that's only for a short while and twice per portal.
That I found extremely easy to deal with with my Rain of Arrows Ranger, since I can just stand behind a wall in such a way that he hits the edge of the wall with the lightning ghosts; meanwhile, I can shoot a little off to the side of him and still hit him with the RoA AOE.
He's also easy with my summoner witch (with Vitality aura for my super zombies)... no such luck this time around as I'm an incinerate witch.
Going to find Zana now...
Post by: Skyrunner on August 26, 2014, 02:32:28 am
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 26, 2014, 03:59:03 am
Scion's specialty is being close to everything. She has the easiest time taking Eldritch Battery and Mind Over Matter, which is a pretty awesome defensive keystone combo. She also gets to her OP-again life wheel, too. Building her depends on what you're planning. Remember she's good at everything, but that makes her not optimal at everything, too. Jack of all trades, master of none.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 26, 2014, 04:05:39 am
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 26, 2014, 05:04:46 am
Post by: kcwong on August 26, 2014, 05:10:30 am
That doesn't help ;-; How am I supposed to build her? I have zero idea.
Take a look at the key nodes in the skill tree and pick your niche(s). You gotta focus in PoE or you will fail in higher difficulties.
Offensively, do you want to:
- Make use of critical hits?
- What kind of damage type? Physical, Chaos or Elemental?
- What kind of weapons? Each weapon type has a specific use. Swords are more accurate, axes hit hard, daggers crit., claws heal you on hit, etc.
- Which skill gem do you have in mind?
etc.
Defensively, do you want to:
- Use armor to soak physical damage?
- Use Iron Reflex or not?
- Use energy shield? With Chaos Inoculation perhaps?
- Evade with a sizable Life pool in case you got hit? Grab Acrobatics or not?
- Use leech to replenish your life, or your energy shield? Do you want leech to be instantaneous?
- Use Mind over Matter to soak damage?
etc.
Find your niches, then go to PoEBuilder.com and try to plot an efficient path to your key nodes. Plan it using 90 skill points - it will take you a very long time to get more than that. Then link us your build and we can give you some feedback.
Some guidelines:
- In general you want 4k+ effective life (ES + Life) to survive in end-game. 3k will do too if you don't plan to run the more difficult contents.
- You don't need to focus on getting damage nodes - it's not your first priority. Most of your damage will come from leveling skill gems.
- Evade must be paired with a sizable effective life pool. Otherwise end-game enemies will one-shot you.
- Resist nodes are not really needed - you can easily go over the cap even with -60% penalty in merciless. The ones that raise resistance cap however, are good, as elemental resists are a simple percentage reduction, the more you have, the more effective it is per point.
That said, do not expect to get it on first try... your first few characters will be your learning tool. They may be able to make it to mid-Cruel and then will have trouble progressing further. At that point, take off all their gear and start a new one. Using items you collected you should be able to progress faster this time, and make a better skill tree.
Keep your old failed characters around; GGG changed the tree heavily multiple times and gave us optional full tree resets. Your old characters may be saved in the future.
Post by: Skyrunner on August 26, 2014, 05:56:40 am
Post by: Aklyon on August 26, 2014, 09:10:12 am
That sounds suspiciously like a generic answer to whenever anyone posts a question like that.Well, Scion is the generic class. She is right in the center, with close-ish access to any direction but all of the major keystone nodes are at the edges of the tree, not near the center. So you need to know how you're getting to what you want to get to, or before that, deciding where you're going for in the first place and whether it will help to start as a scion or as a different class. Scion also gets an assortment of all three colors of skill gem for quest rewards.
Post by: debvon on August 26, 2014, 09:21:40 am
In all difficulties I had a pretty easy time of killing everything quickly. But in the higher difficulty I died instantly to pretty much everything. I could not solo Hailrake on tidal island no matter how much kiting I did. I just couldn't do it. I tried moving on and grinding in certain areas, but I was just taking too many hits and dying constantly. I even tried using different health potion types. Evasion just seemed shitty, or at least it seemed shitty the way I was using it. Was it ever buffed or what was I probably doing wrong?
Post by: Aklyon on August 26, 2014, 09:27:03 am
And evasion was terrible sometime ago. Its somewhat better now.
Post by: aristabulus on August 26, 2014, 09:39:15 am
... , iron reflexes. ..... Evasion just seemed shitty, or at least it seemed shitty the way I was using it. Was it ever buffed or what was I probably doing wrong?
Emphasis mine upon exactly what you did wrong. You turned all your evasion into armour on a class that is on the wrong side of the board to do so effectively.
-----
Since the last time I posted several months have passed, and I got a new video card. Once my summer class ended in late July, I fiddled around a bit before Forsaken Masters, was okay... the extra side dungeons were nice, but the Vaal gems had limited utility.
After Forsaken Masters, I've been suffering persistent performance issues. My ping goes to crap whenever the screen gets even a little busy, and I know it's not my hardware struggling this time; the legacy of freshman optimization continues! >_>
The hideout and extra crafting stuff seems decent, though I'll not ever get to mess with it myself... school comes first. I'm also not thrilled with the design-level choice of adding a reputation grind... I thought this was not supposed to be a mumorperger?
Post by: Aklyon on August 26, 2014, 09:44:58 am
Post by: aristabulus on August 26, 2014, 10:27:42 am
I've had no problems with ping on medium graphics and minimal shadows, summoner or otherwise. And on wireless at that, since its impractical to drag cable all the way up here.
I'm on medium, no shadows, and wireless. Ultimately, it's not important enough for me to fix... school owns me for the next 4 months.
Post by: debvon on August 26, 2014, 12:09:47 pm
... , iron reflexes. ..... Evasion just seemed shitty, or at least it seemed shitty the way I was using it. Was it ever buffed or what was I probably doing wrong?
Emphasis mine upon exactly what you did wrong. You turned all your evasion into armour on a class that is on the wrong side of the board to do so effectively.
I was going off of memory, I didn't take iron reflexes. Sorry. It was something else that increased evasion significantly. Is there one that turns all armour into evasion? If so that's the one. Needless to say I could get off a few swipes and blink, but if I got hit at all I'd just blow up.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on August 26, 2014, 01:21:10 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 26, 2014, 01:24:25 pm
I find evasion to be rather useless. Why should I dodge blows that I do not fear?Isn't that the flavor text for at least one keystone?
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on August 26, 2014, 01:26:00 pm
Post by: Aoi on August 26, 2014, 05:40:29 pm
I'm currently rocking this (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMAAW8EBw2NEJcRUBZvGmwbJRzcHRQdTx8CIvQkqiqYLUc1uTbFNulEBEZxSOdLrkyzTblca2vbbAttGX0YhEiFYIhAi3qQM5Mnna6mrKcIpyuqxLB3tAy_l8NtyT3MvNgk2QvZW9-K4vfjaukC7IryHvfX-oD60g==). (Short version, +summon, necromantic aegis, minion instability.)
Primary gems are:
Minion Life+Minion Damage+Zombies+Skeletons+Spectres+Melee Physical Damage
Raging Spirits+Reduced Mana Cost+Faster Casting
Spell Totem+Lightning Warp (Mostly for fun.)
Post by: Aklyon on August 26, 2014, 05:42:59 pm
Specifically for merc, idk. I haven't been there yet.
Post by: Jack_Bread on August 26, 2014, 05:52:26 pm
How are summoners in merciless nowadays?Summoners should be as good as they were before. Though, I'd probably drop Necromantic Aegis. Pretty much every summoner I see say that necromantic aegis is useless as your summons should be beefy enough to handle things and you would be pretty squishy without access to a shield.
I'm currently rocking this (http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMAAW8EBw2NEJcRUBZvGmwbJRzcHRQdTx8CIvQkqiqYLUc1uTbFNulEBEZxSOdLrkyzTblca2vbbAttGX0YhEiFYIhAi3qQM5Mnna6mrKcIpyuqxLB3tAy_l8NtyT3MvNgk2QvZW9-K4vfjaukC7IryHvfX-oD60g==). (Short version, +summon, necromantic aegis, minion instability.)
Primary gems are:
Minion Life+Minion Damage+Zombies+Skeletons+Spectres+Melee Physical Damage
Raging Spirits+Reduced Mana Cost+Faster Casting
Spell Totem+Lightning Warp (Mostly for fun.)
Post by: Micro102 on August 27, 2014, 10:26:04 am
Post by: Rez on August 31, 2014, 11:34:25 pm
Bear in mind that you're going to have a terrible time leveling some masters with a summoner, specifically Vorici. That's something to consider if a summoner is your first or primary character and you're not playing with a buddy lots of the time. If you're playing in Beyond, you're going to have to deal with being unable to control beyond spawns.
POE has doubled player population or something like that, so lots of lag issues are GGG's servers being crushed by prime-time load.
Post by: Elfeater on September 01, 2014, 12:11:46 am
Post by: Kanil on September 01, 2014, 12:12:17 am
Vagan, on the other hand... maybe it's just me, but that guy always hands me my ass.
Post by: Rez on September 01, 2014, 12:15:08 am
Post by: kcwong on September 01, 2014, 09:09:18 am
Vorici's quests aren't that hard. Just put some thought into it, and maybe desummon some stuff by deequipping it. Killing all the guards without killing the master is the only really tricky one.
Vagan, on the other hand... maybe it's just me, but that guy always hands me my ass.
Vorici's targets often have movement skills - shield charge, leap slam and the like. Sometimes they don't; I've met a summoner target once, but that don't happen very often. With some movement skills of your own, or just a quicksilver flask, it's pretty easy to separate the target from the guards.
Post by: Kanil on September 01, 2014, 09:52:40 pm
Anyone have any experience with animated guardians? If so, what kind of gear/mods/etc would you recommend for them?
Post by: Elfeater on September 01, 2014, 10:49:50 pm
Of course. But compared to "stand there until it's at 30% HP and then weapon swap twice" it's a bit harder.The only experience with guardians is creating Frank, or Steve, or some other generic name, and having me and my friend try to keep him alive as long as possible.
Anyone have any experience with animated guardians? If so, what kind of gear/mods/etc would you recommend for them?
Post by: Aklyon on September 02, 2014, 07:57:54 am
Though I've only tried a guardian in A1 normal.
Post by: Mictlantecuhtli on September 02, 2014, 09:48:43 am
The horror.
Post by: kcwong on September 02, 2014, 12:03:04 pm
You want ES gear and a claw weapon if you're expecting the guardian to survive, the ES gear so it can take extra hits and the claw so it has regeneration of somekind.
Though I've only tried a guardian in A1 normal.
The guardian AI is really bad... it rushes to enemies leaving you behind, which means it's gonna die. Seems to be the same AI as skeletons, which are designed as disposable units. Zombies on the other hand hang around you. Guardian really should switch to zombie AI.
Post by: Kanil on September 02, 2014, 04:38:25 pm
You want ES gear and a claw weapon if you're expecting the guardian to survive, the ES gear so it can take extra hits and the claw so it has regeneration of somekind.Claws are unnecessary -- minion passives provide 4% life leech and 2.5% regeneration. ES gear might be okay, but he's got 5000 HP, so you might not (or might!) need that last ~750. I think +life item mods might be pretty good though, I'd assume those stack with minion passives and the minion life support gem?
Though I've only tried a guardian in A1 normal.
Post by: Sinistar on September 03, 2014, 02:09:55 am
However.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Also, you've gotta LOVE when the game crashes just as Dominus is 2-3 strikes away from death (his 1st stage at least). :I
So I've been thinking - blood magic totem summoner marauder? (https://www.poebuilder.com/character/AAAAAgEA378Ucacwns1VtcEEjr8bRcbYXz8u_6IPUFBYYz38jM_2SO8OJy_jn6SsvJ8YkVBHFCD2rnhpSsT461jlo_Isp1orKhNZ86yqcqn3MuoYwxOHGWwW_Esn7fe-bpfynDa6GS63PsauPC3E9ti9_go1kv6PTeOmVzrh8kUaOKeEkFXAGviTjEYrthDM_od7IN7B5K1nWBnpy0MOFIY7FPZr2TSOU6UMXxynfLs62Ow4xYqiAPAfFE0CcQSz)
Still in the making though. I'd also like to throw some mace/endurance charge/stun skills in the mix, but I think I'm allocating my skills too wide as it is. Also, I took Ancestral Bond but I'm seriously questioning if it's worth it. The idea is I'd use Warlord's Mark + AoE damage totems, mace for single targets (I'm thinking mace + shield, but could go for 2H I guess...) then spend any endurance charges on Immortal Call. I was also thinking of using Shield Charge but with AB the only good it is is getting away from the crowd if necessary and generating endurance charges with appropriate gem... which is good enough I guess?
Anyone's opinion on how crazy/stupid this whole idea is?
edit:
Actually, seems like kills by totem(s) don't give life or charges (if I'd use Warlord's mark). Hmmm, gotta re-think that...
edit 2:
Also, this line from wiki:
Quote
Note that the totem casts the player's skill, meaning that the skill is paid for with the totem's mana (or life if it is affected by Blood Magic)If I am reading this right - "skills" in this context mean skills provided via "Skill totem" support gem? Shochwave/flame etc. totems do not use mana, right? Otherwise Bloodmagic on totems would be totally useless...
edit 3:
SO I've been looking at some dual flame totem + BM builds on official forums and seems like I'll need waaaaaay more intelligence points than originally planned. Not to mention focus, I think I really am stretching my skills too thin. Ugh, back to the drawing board I guess.
Post by: kcwong on September 03, 2014, 12:46:21 pm
At least I just level up last night, so nothing significant was lost.
Post by: Rez on September 04, 2014, 12:07:43 am
Sinistar, you figured it out. It sounds like your build was going to be all over the place and complicated. It's tempting to come up with complex builds or try to do too much with a single character. IMO, it's better to choose one or two cool things and do no more than that.
Make sure you read the text on the keystone passives carefully. 'You can't deal damage with your skills yourself' is a super important part of ancestral bond and why it isn't a no-brainer on any templar and marauder. Your totems and minions are your only damage source now, so your mace won't be any help against any targets. At least you didn't take Chaos Innoculation with bad ES gear in hardcore :D . I digress. Given you can't deal damage yourself, taking a two handed mace would be pretty pointless.
I never really considered making a brutally simple blood magic+hp character, but it actually sounds kind of interesting.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This is a build I found while looking at this blood magic totem thing. It sounds and looks like it works and is not expensive. It basically does the same thing yours does, but more efficient and taking advantage of fire nodes and shields.
Please do something like this and not the build I saw that took the '60% Less Mana Reserved' node without any reservation skills and had 2 andvarius and a bunch of near perfect GG gear. I don't even.
Ed: Another fun marauder build focuses on G. Slam and Heavy Strike for lulzy stun-locking and would work well for a blood magic build if you forgo using herald of ash. A good 2-hand mace and 140% stun threshold reduction will see you always stunning everything but the act-bosses. You've got stun, so you can build endurance charges easily, which helps your tank.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Here's an example tree for this build. You can easily get a bit more stun duration and damage if you sacrifice some of the out of the way (maybe inefficient) things I did to get more life on it. I cannot emphasize how funny this build is; how do you like bosses who can only perform their scripted actions? It also scales with parties, because stunning is calculated based on HP before party effects.
Post by: Sinistar on September 04, 2014, 02:01:39 am
I've recently discovered the joys of molten strikes and axes and now I'm all full of ideas how to make fire&axe based marauder bloodmancer becausewho cares about totems, right?
Dammit PoE! Why so many choices! I just wanna easy to figure, dull skill tree with linear progression! :P
Thnaks for suggestions though. Your stun heavy build seems like crazy fun indeed, might try this one in the end.
Post by: Jack_Bread on September 04, 2014, 02:09:38 am
Post by: Sinistar on September 04, 2014, 03:02:13 am
Also interesting to see how different (better?) it is from the one I had in mind.
I was thinking Iron Grip to maximize projectile damage, then again it's probably better to just stick to fire damage nodes and 2h weapon.
One question I forgot to ask though:
Make sure you read the text on the keystone passives carefully. 'You can't deal damage with your skills yourself' is a super important part of ancestral bond and why it isn't a no-brainer on any templar and marauder. Your totems and minions are your only damage source now, so your mace won't be any help against any targets.Wait, you are saying not even my normal, left-mouse-click attacks would do damage? I'm confused, wiki says you can't deal damage directly with skills and links that to gem page, but the next line says you can only deal damage with minions, traps/mines and totems.
So theoretically speaking, you take this keystone and then don't (have to) bash an enemy with your weapon ever again?
Post by: Rose on September 04, 2014, 04:21:53 am
Post by: Jack_Bread on September 04, 2014, 05:01:50 am
Huh. Now that's a funny coincidence indeed.
Also interesting to see how different (better?) it is from the one I had in mind.
I was thinking Iron Grip to maximize projectile damage, then again it's probably better to just stick to fire damage nodes and 2h weapon.
One question I forgot to ask though:
-ripquote-
Wait, you are saying not even my normal, left-mouse-click attacks would do damage? I'm confused, wiki says you can't deal damage directly with skills and links that to gem page, but the next line says you can only deal damage with minions, traps/mines and totems.
So theoretically speaking, you take this keystone and then don't (have to) bash an enemy with your weapon ever again?
Yep. You can only deal damage indirectly via totems, traps, or minions. Attacking or casting spells yourself won't deal any damage. You can still cull, funnily enough.
His build is focused more on the burn rather than the damage, which is a really different playstyle than what people normally do with molten strike.
As for Iron Grip, I would not recommend. Going out of the way to pick up the keystone isn't worth it unless you're really pumping your strength and you happen to be in the area of it. You'd get better mileage out of projectile, fire, and physical damage nodes, along with "physical damage with X melee weapon."
Here's a quick more "traditional" molten strike build. It used axe+shield, but it'd better with maces.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Chaos inoculation plus blood magic plus eldritch battery is winning combo.http://youtu.be/F-fl86WxNJs
Bonus: http://youtu.be/Zk0Ga4Ztze0
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on September 09, 2014, 04:00:58 pm
Spoiler: Maps are fun (click to show/hide)
Post by: kcwong on September 09, 2014, 08:37:58 pm
Got a Zana in the middle, who opened a level 67 map where we got one unique and map, then the last bosses of the original map exploded into the other ones.Spoiler: Maps are fun (click to show/hide)
Everybody loves a map-ception.
But those really aren't your most important loot; the maps are low level and the unique items not particularly useful (the shield's a PvP shield). Your real reward lies in reputation for Zana, and all the rares you've picked up. :)
Post by: Trevasaurus on September 10, 2014, 12:06:47 am
Post by: Sinistar on September 10, 2014, 12:29:57 am
Or is it not that important in the end?
Post by: kcwong on September 10, 2014, 01:42:58 am
Speaking of masters, which masters would you/did you invite to your hideout? Rabid ElreonxMarauder shipping aside, from what I understand Zana is pretty much a must?
Or is it not that important in the end?
Zana's good to be in your hideout because:
1. She sells maps. Sometimes no map drops and you will be stuck farming docks. Her inventory refreshes when you do her daily quest.
2. Her reputation progression is steeper than other masters.
3. She offers the best decorations.
4. She is hard to find - she can only show up inside maps; other masters can show up anywhere including maps.
Zana in hideout means a free map, which often comes with free exiles. Vorici means a free exile too.
You want masters in your hideout to level them fast or to refresh their inventories. Otherwise it won't matter much.
Post by: Rez on September 11, 2014, 09:40:44 pm
Post by: Sinistar on September 12, 2014, 03:13:35 am
Because I just recently discovered the joy of summoner exiles on cruel.
Spoiler: HA HA HEY GUYS ZOMBIE SPAM + MINION INSTABILITY HUH HUH? (click to show/hide)
Ah well.
So what about the spike shields? I've asked in global and got the answer indicating they are pretty useless, but still, you guys/gals know any build that would make them viable?
When I discovered them my first thought was I could use them on shadow because of the stats, but given how shadow is all evade AND spike shields give bonus evade it makes no f-ing sense to use a shield to deflect damage when you want to EVADE hits.
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on September 12, 2014, 05:13:12 am
Spiked shields are probably better for summoner builds using Necromantic Aegis.
Post by: Jack_Bread on September 12, 2014, 05:57:17 am
Also, keep in mind that damage blocked is damage not reflected, similar to evasion. It's bad, even with a full reflect build and those are bad, too. (As far as I'm aware)
Post by: kcwong on September 12, 2014, 01:03:46 pm
Well I might just give Vorici the bird for a while from now on. Or just... dunno, ignore all strongboxes with rouge exiles?
Because I just recently discovered the joy of summoner exiles on cruel.Spoiler: HA HA HEY GUYS ZOMBIE SPAM + MINION INSTABILITY HUH HUH? (click to show/hide)
Ah well.
She used to be even more damaging. You need either a long ranged attack (and constantly move away from her melee minions), or be able to single target attack. She has a cap to no. of minions, so by using movement skills you can have brief moments where she uses arc on you instead of re-summoning.
So what about the spike shields? I've asked in global and got the answer indicating they are pretty useless, but still, you guys/gals know any build that would make them viable?
When I discovered them my first thought was I could use them on shadow because of the stats, but given how shadow is all evade AND spike shields give bonus evade it makes no f-ing sense to use a shield to deflect damage when you want to EVADE hits.
There's an unique shield with 1-1000 damage reflect... that one is for PvP, giving your opponents a nasty surprise. Otherwise, they are not really useful.
Post by: Sinistar on September 12, 2014, 02:38:23 pm
Post by: Rez on September 12, 2014, 02:52:24 pm
Punishment was and probably is still awful.
My recommendation if you want to incorporate some kind of reflection into your build is to build use The Anvil and Tempest Shield while stacking block chance. It's not really a good source of damage, but regular phys damage enemies will kill themselves... slowly. Block is interesting by itself, though.
I built a mace and shield character in beta that had crappy attack and maxed block. It was very tanky against phys enemies, but weaker to bosses and spell packs. If I were to build another character using max block, I would build:
Searing Bond+Inc. Burning+Empower- Applies burning, does mediocre damage
Flamesurge+Fire Pen+Conc Effect+Spell Echo- This is your main damage, it is a very good melee range spell
CwDT+Enduring Cry+Immortal Call+Molten Shell- Invulnerability is the best tank
Tempest Shield+Flammability+Reduced Mana- +4% block and more fire pen. Lightning shield is worth about 10 points in the passive web for this build.
I'd want Cybil's Paw, The Anvil, and Rainbowstride. I was thinking about Rathpith, but it's even more expensive and makes Plated Defense less useful. The shield has to have 29% block to reach your new block rate cap of 78%. At 71, my tree would be something like this. The potential problems I can see are getting the dex for Cybil's, which isn't too hard, and having mana for Flame Surge with Spell Echo, which is solvable with this tree.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
There's an unique shield with 1-1000 damage reflect... that one is for PvP, giving your opponents a nasty surprise. Otherwise, they are not really useful.
Do people actually PvP seriously in PoE? I find it hard to believe anyone would bother, considering desync issues.
Post by: Jack_Bread on September 12, 2014, 03:16:04 pm
There's an unique shield with 1-1000 damage reflect... that one is for PvP, giving your opponents a nasty surprise. Otherwise, they are not really useful.
Do people actually PvP seriously in PoE? I find it hard to believe anyone would bother, considering desync issues.
They do. I hear that the PvP scene is slowly coming alive. Here's a PVPer AMA from Reddit if you're interested: http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/2fukda/pvp_ask_us_anything/
Post by: Rez on September 12, 2014, 03:27:23 pm
It makes me laugh more that people think skill is important in a game that will not relay your position on the server to your computer more than once every 20 seconds. Not buying it. You can be stunned/frozen and killed before you resync. It happens in PvE against monsters that are not built around abusing it. I guess 'wearing uniques that provide immunity' is skill.
w/e, if they enjoy it, good for them.
ed: Just to clarify.
I was being a bit hyperbolic. I'm pretty sure the server tries to sync your character position every 3-5 seconds. However, due to the way movement interact with other units, walls, and the syncing process, it very frequently can cascade to very big desyncs. The propensity of the system to desync when characters are using stuns and mobility skills lowers the skill ceiling and probably makes some builds totally nonviable. Just as an example, if you're certain you won't desync, you can dodge between piety's ice form arrows. Most of the time you just have to hide behind a pillar though.
That you can play around these technical problems is not really something I think should be lauded or used an excuse for them. I doubt GGG sat around their conference room and planned their game with the assumption of desyncs.
I want to be clear that I understand that programming is not easy and it may not even be possible to change this kind of thing. However, that doesn't mean we should pretend that it isn't bad for the experience. I'm pretty sure we can all think of people who would play PoE if desyncs weren't ubiquitous.
I was being facetious when I made the remark about wearing uniques, but it is indeed part of the skill of planning and executing a build. I just don't see that as all that important, given the nature of PvP; successful builds are copied, even by people who could never put together such a build by themselves. The idea that you can just throw all your currency at your PvP characters also excludes anyone who doesn't have the currency to get to an average gear cost which is probably several exalts. Exclusivity based on net worth and not skill is a bad thing for PvP in my mind.
Post by: Aklyon on December 12, 2014, 07:24:09 pm
Post by: aristabulus on December 19, 2014, 11:46:51 am
My current Torment league character is Darius_Faratine, if anyone wants to join us.
Post by: Aklyon on April 10, 2015, 11:34:24 am
Act 4, more gems, new kinds of gems, new items, improved u (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1215598)i bits (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1226349), apparently changes enough to require a beta. Jumping from v1.3 to v2.0.
Edit from article reading (http://www.gamepedia.com/news/688-path-of-exile-the-awakening): Netcode rewrite!
Post by: Ozyton on April 10, 2015, 01:13:12 pm
Post by: Levi on April 10, 2015, 01:42:11 pm
I got to admit, those AOE skill gems sound pretty fun too.
Post by: nenjin on April 10, 2015, 02:16:02 pm
Post by: Bluerobin on April 10, 2015, 07:22:10 pm
Netcode improvements would be a godsend. That was what irritated me the most about POE. Nothing like putting 50 arrows in a skeleton and then he teleports backwards and is back at full health.This is the main reason I stopped playing PoE. I'm so freaking excited to be able to play a melee build and not have desyncs. Holy crap I want PoE back in my life in a less frustrating way.
Post by: aristabulus on April 11, 2015, 10:43:05 pm
.....
*grunts* I'll believe the netcode improvements when I feel them... That said, I'll stay open minded.
I will reinstall my client tonight, putter around a little, tidy up stashes and whatnot. Even if I get into the new-beta, I probably won't be on a whole lot until spring semester is done... I have a lot of lab work to plow through, and not a lot of weeks left to do it.
I am easily reachable via b12 PM (they bounce to my email), if anyone wants to preemptively join Nist Akath ahead of the expansion. Darius_Faratine is still a valid character name, he's just in Standard now. The guild stash is small, but stocked with newbie twink gear for quick character starts. I also have a mish-mash of other gear in my personal stash I am willing to share.
Post by: nenjin on April 20, 2015, 10:09:43 am
And I was pleasantly surprised.
First off, they must have done an experience rebalance. Because getting XP in Merciless at Level 66 used to be like pulling teeth. A full clear in an area only a few levels lower than me would be a bar or two of XP. It was slow enough that the inevitable de-sync death would wipe out XP faster than you could safely earn it, and made me question why I was even bothering to try.
Now, the gradient seems a lot more forgiving. At 9 levels lower, XP was about as slow as I remember. But at less than 9 levels below me, the XP gain was much, much quicker. I actually gained a couple levels over the weekend, where I haven't leveled in PoE on my Scion for a long time.
And oh, my Scion, how I love her. Reckoning dropped for me which has basically completed my "Joan of Arc/Maiden of Blades" build.
http://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Nenjin/characters
Shield Charge with Melee Physical Damage will now wreck basically anything that isn't a champion in two hits. Reckoning fires off in every direction, so guys attacking my back are usually getting their ass kicked while I attack to my front. I've got Enduring Cry hooked up to Cast on Damage Taken, so I've got some passive damage mitigation set up too. Her other attacks are as awesome as they've always been.
I really like how my build is both thematically appropriate (a female paladin/knight), and has worked out very well for me in terms of gameplay.
Desyncs continue to be a thing, that still happen at the most perplexing time in addition to a) when there's more than 8 guys on the screen b) when you're in a narrow corridor or c) when I use Shield Charge. Combined with the fact that I don't have the resists I need for Mercliess yet, and most Vaal bosses are a guaranteed death. So I only try to do Vaal levels and bosses when I've just leveled and have no XP to lose.
But generally the game seems easier. After my respec I was dreading my first Merciless Exile fight, but it was surprisingly easy when it happened, and the next couple Exiles went down without a ton of problems either. It's still the case take taking a full hit from an elemental attack is almost assuredly a death sentence, but at least you can avoid them with pretty good success now, vs. in the past where it seems like Exile AI and speed, combined with the damage, meant you were pretty much always fucked.
The masters I'm sort of "eh" on, daily quests are not really my thing. But the Hideout is pretty cool, it's that nice bit of meta-gameplay that helps you live in a F2P game. And while I don't really have the gear to start using their crafting stuff to full advantage, I'm looking forward to doing so. It's also nice that the Forsaken Master missions can be approached in different ways and aren't all about slaughtering some guys (most are, but some are not.)
So generally, I've fallen in love with PoE again since difficulty seems to have been reduced and no longer actively makes me want to stop playing. No idea how long this fling will last this time, but it's strong enough I actually want to go back and play my other characters too.
Post by: Aklyon on April 20, 2015, 11:09:57 am
Post is here. (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1248531)
Post by: miljan on April 20, 2015, 02:15:28 pm
Post by: Aklyon on April 20, 2015, 02:21:03 pm
Post by: miljan on April 20, 2015, 02:27:06 pm
Quote from: Chris
"
We want our fights to have large swings of damage and to cause a rush of adrenaline in the player. If the game didn't allow you to drop instantly then we'd have to dumb down the fights so much. We've tried it.
In addition, it means that we're able to make hard boss fights that players can attrition if they choose to. If we had to design the act bosses so that players needed to kill them in one go without dying then they would be pushovers.
We have said this multiple times on the forum and in interviews before (as well as implementing the game to be that way) - our stance shouldn't be a surprise!
Quote from: Chris
I played hardcore d2 for many years. I pressed alt-F4 once every few days on average. I cannot imagine an Action RPG design where it's blocked. We discussed this heavily when designing PoE. I'd love to find a solution (because I agree it's bad in principle), but being able to "Nope" out of situations drastically changes a lot about the game.
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/536962/page/3
I mean, wtf is he talking about?
Post by: Aklyon on April 20, 2015, 02:37:22 pm
Post by: lijacote on April 20, 2015, 02:38:52 pm
The main devs of this game are extremely strange, and say some very stupid shit about how they balance this game. I was surprised that they literally balance the damage of mobs around people alt+f4 the game. I just found out about it few days ago. How dumb can you be to say something like that I dont know.Wow. I'm not sorry I stopped playing.
Post by: miljan on April 20, 2015, 02:46:23 pm
This is sounding a whole lot like stuff that only really matters to hardcore league, to be honest. I haven't had anywhere where I thought alt+f4 was worth the effort reloading the game for.
Doesnt matter really. But they thought process on how they design the game or tried to do it is something I see for the first time and its just dumb. I dont have any other word to use.
Post by: aristabulus on April 20, 2015, 03:40:08 pm
While I agree with the general sentiment that alt+F4-ing is kinda lame, it's a thing people actually do, so GGG would be foolish to not account for it while designing. To block the option would cause serious backlash; you can't just casually toss out genre conventions without having a good reason and/or something to fill the hole. To design for never needing it, you get a milquetoast game; all facerolling all the time is no fun.
The damage swing is a hassle sometimes, yeah. I've been alpha-striked by poison snakes in Act 2 more than once. Those leaping frog jerks in Upper Sceptre of God really chap my ass also. But I don't play Hardcore, and probably never will... I don't like to gamble with my sunk time-costs like that. The people that do actually use alt+F4 are hardcore, figuratively and literally, and maybe they actually need it.
...
The masters I'm sort of "eh" on, daily quests are not really my thing. But the Hideout is pretty cool, it's that nice bit of meta-gameplay that helps you live in a F2P game. And while I don't really have the gear to start using their crafting stuff to full advantage, I'm looking forward to doing so. It's also nice that the Forsaken Master missions can be approached in different ways and aren't all about slaughtering some guys (most are, but some are not.)
...
I'm not fond of the dailies either; it's a very MMO-ish way to go about it. I have found the crafting to be fairly useful, though. There are relatively cheap options to add +attribute or +resists to just about anything. (a small handful of transmutation, or augmentation) I used those to good effect in Torment to shore up my resists, and to make sure I was staying ahead of my skill gems' requirements.
I haven't done a single thing with decorating my Hideout, though supposedly I have a bunch of favour saved up with all the masters if I ever get around to it.
Post by: Aklyon on April 20, 2015, 03:50:41 pm
Post by: nenjin on April 20, 2015, 04:38:51 pm
My Elreon hideout is very simple, as far as decorations go. Its got those lit lamps that looked reasonably neat, and some crafting benches.
I like that space is functionally unlimited when it comes to decorating. Most games would be like "oh you get x slots for Y decorations." PoE is like "You wanna litter your hideout with debris? Go ahead and buy 1000 of them and stack them on top of each other, if you so choose." That's the kind of thing that will keep me playing for no real gameplay reason, is just to the ability to add until I'm satisfied.
Post by: kcwong on April 21, 2015, 11:31:49 am
If you have a stable and relatively low ping, you will benefit from that. I usually have around 50 ping to the Singapore gateway, so I will definitely use the new model.
I can finally try flicker/movement skill builds.
Post by: nenjin on April 21, 2015, 11:39:55 am
Post by: kcwong on April 29, 2015, 08:01:40 am
Post by: kcwong on April 30, 2015, 05:16:58 am
I'm surprised to learn that shotgun mechanics is removed completely; Lots of my standard characters will have to be rebuilt from scratch... I need to get my hands on some gems to see how they perform now. Incinerate, Tornado Shot, Freezing Pulse.
Post by: aristabulus on April 30, 2015, 05:58:51 am
*Bump* I got an extra beta key; anyone interested?
Yes please! :)
Post by: kcwong on April 30, 2015, 08:23:18 am
*Bump* I got an extra beta key; anyone interested?
Yes please! :)
I will send you a PM. :)
Post by: ragnar119 on April 30, 2015, 09:34:23 am
Act 4 is very short. And they will add only 3 more areas on release, so I think it will be the shortest of all the acts (maybe somewhat close to act 1 in beta), but most content rich.
Post by: aristabulus on April 30, 2015, 10:11:51 am
...
I will send you a PM. :)
Huzzah! Thanks. :)
I will set the client to DL while I'm on campus today, and give it a go when I get home. Do you want to join Nist Akath, kcwong?
...
Act 4 is very short. And they will add only 3 more areas on release, so I think it will be the shortest of all the acts (maybe somewhat close to act 1 in beta), but most content rich.
I wouldn't be surprised if they have some extra areas on the drawing board for a future minor expansion... it seems like a lot of the work on Awakening has been under-the-hood.
Post by: kcwong on April 30, 2015, 11:09:24 am
I will set the client to DL while I'm on campus today, and give it a go when I get home. Do you want to join Nist Akath, kcwong?
Is that DF's PoE guild? Sure! My character's name is "LoraonnaTheCursed".
You can copy your standard PoE's Content.ggpk to save time. Start the download from the Beta installation, stop it, replace Content.ggpk, and restart download. It will then only fill in the missing/different files (source: reddit).
Post by: Aklyon on April 30, 2015, 11:18:16 am
Post by: aristabulus on April 30, 2015, 12:18:03 pm
...
Is that DF's PoE guild? Sure! My character's name is "LoraonnaTheCursed".
You can copy your standard PoE's Content.ggpk to save time. Start the download from the Beta installation, stop it, replace Content.ggpk, and restart download. It will then only fill in the missing/different files (source: reddit).
Using up bandwidth is less of an issue, and I literally won't have time to do anything with it until tonight. I have a rough draft due today, and still a bit of work before it is even worthy of that title. :P Thanks anyway... it may be useful for others when/if they get in.
I sent a friend invite through the main client. Once you accept that, it should let me invite you to the guild. I have no idea if guild status carries over to the beta; we'll see later tonight.
Post by: aristabulus on May 01, 2015, 02:19:48 am
Fiddling around with the beta this evening... in the spirit of testing, I've been doing sidequests as I arrive to the areas instead of my usual (run through to Brutus/Merveil, then faceroll the sidequests after the fact).
I have no idea if this info will stay relevant, but I'm gonna list things I've noticed in no particular order.
-----
Act 1 waypoints have been moved around a bit. The mud flats WP is now in front the entrance to the medicine chest side area. The submerged passage WP is very near the mud flats door, and appears to be static now.
Submerged passage is one large area now. (no upper and lower) They made it a lot twistier; I hit a lot of dead ends.
Flasks have been improved across the board (so far). Mediums @ L3, Large @ L6, both giving more than they did before.
Early drops have been a riot of color. Plenty of sockets, plenty of links, and plenty of variety. I even have several chromatic orbs from selling trash.
The performance displays toggled by F1 have shrunk and changed position. They no longer overlay game data, and there's a third setting that only shows latency.
Latency in general has been very stable during combat @ about 100ms +-15ms. (In Tucson, AZ, 6Mbit connection, using the American gateway) There's been a couple minor pinches of desync so far.
A support gem is offered up prior to fighting Brutus, like it is prior to Merveil in the main game. Still got a post-kill reward, though the spread was very different than normal.
I have all my purchased stash tabs, but no guild status.
Chatters was slightly less of a jerk than normal.
I have not fiddled with the item filters yet, and probably won't until late Act 2.
Post by: kcwong on May 01, 2015, 07:33:51 am
A dubblepoaster is me!And I've got your friend invite - it carries over to BETA since we're using the same accounts.
Adding my observations after yours...
Act 1 waypoints have been moved around a bit. The mud flats WP is now in front the entrance to the medicine chest side area. The submerged passage WP is very near the mud flats door, and appears to be static now.They changed areas/WP in act 2 as well - now you have a WP in Riverways.
Submerged passage is one large area now. (no upper and lower) They made it a lot twistier; I hit a lot of dead ends.
Early drops have been a riot of color. Plenty of sockets, plenty of links, and plenty of variety. I even have several chromatic orbs from selling trash.I heard people say that drop rates are improved for the beta.
Latency in general has been very stable during combat @ about 100ms +-15ms. (In Tucson, AZ, 6Mbit connection, using the American gateway) There's been a couple minor pinches of desync so far.The network model change is not in beta. I got a near constant 50ms to Singapore server; sometimes it will speed up to 45.
A support gem is offered up prior to fighting Brutus, like it is prior to Merveil in the main game. Still got a post-kill reward, though the spread was very different than normal.They are reworking quest rewards; some are still placeholders. If you've been saving up those useless item quest rewards in the main game like me... good things will happen later. :P
Chatters was slightly less of a jerk than normal.Though it's full of trade spam, as usual.
I have not fiddled with the item filters yet, and probably won't until late Act 2.I have seen how it is programmed, I just have no clue about what I want to see. What I want to see changes over the course of the game anyway, so I'll need multiple filters that I can swap freely.
Post by: aristabulus on May 01, 2015, 11:12:49 am
...
They changed areas/WP in act 2 as well - now you have a WP in Riverways.
I just couldn't keep my eyes open after Brutus... long day. I should make it to Act 2 this evening.
I heard people say that drop rates are improved for the beta.
Yeah, I'd agree; the quantity and quality in Act 1 have been increased.
The network model change is not in beta. I got a near constant 50ms to Singapore server; sometimes it will speed up to 45.
I'm guessing the beta doesn't have a ton of traffic, so the pings are better even without the new netcode.
Chatters was slightly less of a jerk than normal.Though it's full of trade spam, as usual.
...I meant the Unique cold-based skeleton in Lower Prison. (his name is Chatters) He used to be a huge hassle, I usually avoid him.
Chat? Hahahahahah, it was on by default when I logged in, and within 10 seconds there was a D3 troll. Shut it off, and I never looked back.
Post by: kcwong on May 01, 2015, 11:46:31 am
...I meant the Unique cold-based skeleton in Lower Prison. (his name is Chatters) He used to be a huge hassle, I usually avoid him.
Chat? Hahahahahah, it was on by default when I logged in, and within 10 seconds there was a D3 troll. Shut it off, and I never looked back.
Doh!
I kept Global on, just switch to /2 where there are less trade spams. People link rare loot there so I like to have a peek.
Post by: Descan on May 01, 2015, 01:43:54 pm
Post by: nenjin on May 04, 2015, 11:07:00 pm
How. The. FUCK. Can they make high level content the way they do with the desyncs still being this bad. Undead mod on a map? Why not just make the description "You will be fucked in the ass every 40 seconds by desyncs. Enjoy your fucking map, jerkoff." The bosses....are unfucking believable in this regard. Knowing that mass amounts of mobs guarantee desyncs, what do they do? Make map end bosses puke out guys like they intentionally think forcing desyncs is some kind of end game challenge. FUCK YOU. Christ, I can't even run a circle around ONE FUCKING MOB without having the game desync, let alone the 60 they pile into a tiny room. Or me teleporting into a room I've never even walked into. How can your server side simulation be that fucking far off of what I'm doing!
Setting all that aside that I can't even fucking comprehend how you're supposed to beat some of these bosses without being so grossly overleveled you'd probably rather kill yourself than play this fucking game anymore. The boss of the Dungeon? Take the desyncs of the Warden and that fucking grab spear, add a new mob every 4 seconds to a tiny room, then cover half the floor in spikes periodically. I can't even....
Goddamnit, I've sunk hundreds of hours now to grind through this bullshit of an experience, carefully, agonizingly making my way through every level in Merciless because they still think a death penalty is appropriate in game with this fucked up of netcode. To finally be able to do something else than grind the goddamn campaign maps over and over again. And to find out EVERY GODDAMN BLUE MAP AND UP BECOMES A CLUSTERFUCK is almost too much for my sanity to handle.
This game would be amazing if their netcode weren't the equivalent of a drunken idiot smashing their hand with a hammer over and over again. "DERR CANT FIND POSITION, PUTTING EVERYTHING IN DA MIDDLE NOW. DDDDDEEEEERRRRRRPPPPPPPP." At least if the netcode were good, I could accept the death penalty, the tedious level scaling resulting in safe, ETERNAL fucking grinding, the horrendous penalties they layer on to increase difficulty, the stupid amounts of one-shot-kills you're subjected to, unbeatable elite nemesis mod combos....To do everything right, play conservatively, play slowly, to then be undone by a fucking desync, it's like, WHY SHOULD I FUCKING TORTURE MYSELF OVER YOUR FUCKING GAME IF I'M JUST GOING TO GET FUCKED ANYWAYS. WHY DO YOU KEEP PILING SHIT ON TO A GAME THAT CLEARLY CAN'T FUCKING HANDLE IT, MAKING THE HIGHER LEVEL GAMEPLAY NIGH ON IMPOSSIBLE, YOU FUCKING MORONS. You cannot tell the player the game requires leet timing and reflexes when your own servers have the timing and coordination of a goddamn six year old!
God fucking damnit GGG, hire whoever the fuck you need to, fire whoever the fuck you need to, just fix your motherfucking net code! Every time I come back to this game I fall in love again only to have it drive a stiletto heel of bullshit programming straight through my dick.
I was debating giving them some money for cosmetics for all the hours I've put in. But fuck it. Want my money? Fix your shitty fucking game first so it's not a goddam waste of my time to play it. Old skool harshness is great until it's supported by new skool lazy fucking coding.
Post by: aristabulus on May 04, 2015, 11:51:47 pm
(werds of ANNGGEERRR)
I feel ya, man. That's about where I was at late open beta (though I hadn't even made it to maps, then) when I trashed all my loot and uninstalled.
If the new netcode doesn't sort shit out, I may do so again... but stay gone for good.
Post by: kcwong on May 05, 2015, 02:58:47 am
For now there's all the usual tricks you can use the minimize desync, and keeping an eye for desync symptoms and use /oos macro. Don't join parties in another server.
Post by: kcwong on May 06, 2015, 08:21:27 am
Garena in a nutshell (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1260970)
With a priceless comic inside.
A thread about it in reddit (http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/2dj1qq/new_pet_dicovered_in_garena_120/)
Post by: Aklyon on May 06, 2015, 08:46:53 am
Post by: kcwong on May 06, 2015, 08:55:36 am
Is that supposed to be a digimon knockoff or something? Glad its contained away from the normal servers, anyway.
That's Garena's mascot. Definitely a Digimon knockoff.
Post by: nenjin on May 18, 2015, 09:06:25 pm
It's optional, and you can pick between it and the previous Predictive Sync, from the main menu. They said they've fixed a lot of bugs with Predictive Sync as well, and it works better than it ever has before. They recommend Deterministic Lock-step for people with <100ms latency to the server, and Predictive Sync for people with greater than that.
I'll probably take it for a spin tomorrow night.
Post by: aristabulus on May 18, 2015, 11:19:20 pm
I didn't change the network setting, so I was probably still on predictive... but it was a bedrock-solid 80ms the whole way. The spike for area change was greatly lessened also. I am very hopeful.
Now I gotta finish my last paper for the semester. Almost done! >_<
Post by: kcwong on May 19, 2015, 09:19:30 am
From announcement forum, there are issues with lockstep:
Dominating Blow
Vaal Cyclone
Flicker Strike (when using cooldown bypass)
When using cooldown bypass on other skills may also have issues
Also, Glacial Hammer may causes crash.
Time to try a cyclone build... or maybe not. I reached act 4 with a marauder and got chaos golem, was leveling a summoner to try that out. Time to do that again.
Post by: aristabulus on May 20, 2015, 01:55:14 pm
The skill gem vendoring looks to have very high utility, although I haven't bought anything yet. There's a nice spread of active skill gems, and a handful of decent support gems. It'll be nice to have the option of buying supports if they aren't dropping on their own.
Is there anyone else playing besides me, kcwong, and nenjin? Beta or normal, doesn't matter... sound off! :)
Post by: Aklyon on May 20, 2015, 02:47:54 pm
Post by: Kanil on May 20, 2015, 02:50:25 pm
Probably will play the beta when I get into it, and will play once it goes live for a while.
Post by: ragnar119 on May 20, 2015, 03:38:15 pm
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on May 20, 2015, 03:52:50 pm
Post by: Shadowlord on May 20, 2015, 04:00:46 pm
Fortunately they came back when I opted back out of the beta in Steam.
Post by: aristabulus on May 20, 2015, 08:19:14 pm
Apparently opting into "Awakening Beta" in Steam results in PoE forgetting all your settings. >:(
Fortunately they came back when I opted back out of the beta in Steam.
I've been using the standalone client, and the beta is a completely different install. That is likely also the case with PoE via Steam, though it's probably obscured.
-----
If anyone wants in to Nist Akath, let me know! :)
Post by: Shadowlord on May 20, 2015, 08:42:29 pm
Post by: Aklyon on June 05, 2015, 06:51:07 am
Post by: nenjin on June 05, 2015, 09:04:40 am
Post by: Rex_Nex on June 05, 2015, 09:37:22 am
Glad to see this topic popped back up! I'm big into PoE right now, enjoying it a lot. My main is a lvl87 phys tornadoshot ranger, really enjoyable and very powerful. Not to mention cheap - other than my quiver, which is a 5 ex piece I'm borrowing from a friend, the rest of my gear probably only sums up to about 2 ex. I'm excited for the awakening, it'll get me trying new builds! :)
Post by: miljan on June 05, 2015, 12:26:54 pm
So apparently they reworked arctic armor in the beta and people are whining about it. Seemed like it would just drain all of your mana too quickly the last time I'd tried it, so was it actually that useful before?Arctic armor is one of the main defense spells most of caster used. You would go high manna regeneration so you can keep it up all the time. People are mainly complaining because the skill was somewhat unique with unique mechanics, now they made it more bland like another aura. Dont even need to make your build around it like the old AA. Generally i think a very bad change. They are really making some huge changes, bad and good, and I dont think the beta will be finished any time soon (no way in july) with so many huge changes in balance.
Post by: aristabulus on June 17, 2015, 05:42:53 pm
The big changes this time are leech, affixes, and status ailments. Anyone who wants to read at length can do so here (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1292315).
Post by: Aklyon on June 30, 2015, 04:45:57 pm
Also news about the next Challenge Leagues: Warband & Tempest. (https://www.pathofexile.com/theawakening/leagues)
Edit: Also apparently Phase Run is returning. Not like people have been asking for ages when its gonna show back up, nope.
Post by: nenjin on June 30, 2015, 05:14:46 pm
Post by: miljan on July 01, 2015, 04:04:30 am
I wonder if they'll give it back to the people who originally had it....No one had that game as they removed it before the open beta/wipe
Post by: nenjin on July 01, 2015, 10:48:15 am
I wonder if they'll give it back to the people who originally had it....No one had that game as they removed it before the open beta/wipe
Uh, I absolutely had one, because I played before all of that.
Post by: Aklyon on July 01, 2015, 11:39:31 am
Post by: miljan on July 01, 2015, 03:37:15 pm
Uh, I absolutely had one, because I played before all of that.
There was no Phase Run when the game went open beta. Phase run was in closed beta, but when PoE went open beta they wiped all items and characters. So the only time when you could had that gem was during closed beta before the wipe. And as no one had Phase Run after the game went open beta (as they removed it than) there is no need for them to return a gem to people that never could get it during the soft release.
Post by: aristabulus on July 01, 2015, 03:57:29 pm
Schoolwork permitting, I may get on this weekend after the last boss fight is added. Anyone else been playing?
Post by: nenjin on July 01, 2015, 04:11:54 pm
Post by: aristabulus on July 02, 2015, 07:47:00 am
I guess I know what I'm not doing before the 10th.
Post by: Shadowlord on July 02, 2015, 08:02:00 am
Post by: aristabulus on July 02, 2015, 08:07:47 am
Post by: Shadowlord on July 02, 2015, 08:11:27 am
Post by: aristabulus on July 02, 2015, 08:16:22 am
There's a wipe? Why is there a wipe? All my gems! And stuff! Eh. Not like I'm actually playing right now.
There will be a wipe of the beta with the final boss patch, then 4 days until release, then the beta realm ceases to be when the patch hits the live servers. The live servers will not ever be wiped again, according to Chris.
I did mention that in my initial FYI post today...
... There will also be a wipe, so that means 4 days of freshly wiped beta before beta is gone...
Post by: Shadowlord on July 02, 2015, 08:45:30 am
Post by: Aklyon on July 09, 2015, 08:23:54 pm
Actual patch notes to come later, apparently.
Post by: aristabulus on July 10, 2015, 01:46:10 am
If anyone has a few points laying about, you could donate them to the guild. Every 50 we muster gets us another communal stash tab. The twink gear seems to have gone untouched, so I'm gonna dial that back some and leave a tab functionally empty for quick trading/transfers in-guild.
Post by: nenjin on July 10, 2015, 09:27:23 am
Post by: aristabulus on July 10, 2015, 11:32:43 am
Probably try and replay as much of the game as I can with my Scion, so I can get through it to the new content.
With an existing character, you should be able to just access Act 4 in any difficulty you previously completed. That's how it was when the Act 3 extension was released.
Post by: nenjin on July 10, 2015, 11:39:51 am
Post by: Aklyon on July 10, 2015, 12:35:35 pm
Post by: Kanil on July 10, 2015, 12:47:43 pm
Post by: nenjin on July 12, 2015, 04:41:17 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Lockstep works pretty well, but you definitely feel it when either your connection has issues or their servers do. Had a good hour to two hours of noticeable hitching and chokey performance, and an instance of a couple minutes where I was regularly locking up. I figure that's the player rush and bugs they're still working through and it will improve over time.
Just curious, what's people's HP counts in the 70ish range? I'm starting to think I've been skimping on them.
Post by: aristabulus on July 12, 2015, 10:21:28 pm
I finished act 4 Normal (in Warbands) last night, and my experience of the last boss was similar to nenjin's spoiler block.
My lead up had me feeling pretty good; with a melee sword+board duelist, I facetanked Piety and Dominus... then got my ass handed to me repeatedly on the penultimate boss, and the last boss. Everything I hated about the Dominus fight when that was new, the A4 boss fight has in spades, and more. It was severely not fun, and I never want to fight that boss ever again.
My remembrance of the boss fights when they were act-enders and how they are now makes a stark contrast. I get that the last boss shouldn't be a pushover, but I feel like GGG might just be trolling their userbase.
I guess it really is still Path of Life Nodes.
I am not dancing this jig again. >_<
Post by: nenjin on July 12, 2015, 10:43:47 pm
Quote
I get that the last boss shouldn't be a pushover, but I feel like GGG might just be trolling their userbase.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It kills me because, aesthetically I've come to dig how PoE has continued to develop. There's a lot of cool ideas and execution in Awakening's story and environments too. But the higher level gameplay is the real Nightmare the game references. Watching an hour's worth of grinding go up in smoke after a death or two that took split seconds to occur just kills my desire to play.
Post by: kcwong on July 13, 2015, 08:34:12 am
QuoteI get that the last boss shouldn't be a pushover, but I feel like GGG might just be trolling their userbase.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It kills me because, aesthetically I've come to dig how PoE has continued to develop. There's a lot of cool ideas and execution in Awakening's story and environments too. But the higher level gameplay is the real Nightmare the game references. Watching an hour's worth of grinding go up in smoke after a death or two that took split seconds to occur just kills my desire to play.
It's been like that since it's first added in beta. People have been saying the chickens' physical damage is way overtuned yet it stays this way in release. My only way of surviving that was to play a summoner (SRS, Skeleton totem and Zombies); I felt my melee characters were doing 0.1% damage of what is required to clear that room (who's just fine in all other places).
In beta I asked global chat about how to survive that; the answer I got was to create new instance until I get a room full of those dogs instead of chickens.
Post by: Aklyon on July 22, 2015, 08:15:48 am
This is the entirety of the relevant news to the thread, unless you play in tempest league, which is also getting some adjustments, or warbands, which is just getting some drop increases.
Post by: Rex_Nex on July 22, 2015, 04:52:21 pm
Daresso and the entire arena sequence was done well enough that it feels like two-third of Act 4's budget was on him alone. Kaom's dream wasn't quite as good; the enemies were interesting (adoratotems ftw) and the boss fight is neat, but the areas themselves are really boring. It's like an endless jog through the Plains of Despair in Diablo 2's act 4. Give me something else to do other than walk down a path and click lore objects. My last complaint is that Act 4 is notably shorter than the previous acts, which screams "we ran out of time/budget".
I've been enjoying myself, currently have a Reave ranger and a Flame Totem templar, up to the early maps. Flame Totem is notoriously overpowered, but I honestly like my ranger more. The clearspeed is almost twice as fast, even with bad gear. The only issue is that Abyssus makes staying alive pretty difficult, and all the best ways to stay alive (Lightning Coil, Taste of Hate, etc) are super expensive in Warbands. Still, she attacks ~10 times per second (Really! I'm surprised the game doesn't bug out.), has full screen AoE, and whirling blades at this level of attackspeed is the best mobility skill in the game. Can go from one side of Dried Lake to the other in 7 seconds or so.
Post by: kcwong on July 25, 2015, 08:01:30 am
My email to GGG:
Quote
Hi GGG Support,
I use the Singapore gateway from Hong Kong. I'm not using WiFi, my ISP has an optic fiber to my desk and my top speed is 1T. The usual ping is close to 50ms and pretty stable.
I just went inside Belly of the Beast. Last time it bumped me off to Australia doubling my ping. This time I stayed in Singapore realm, so I finished all the mini-bosses and went into fight Malachai. The ping went up to 133. I checked that I was still in Singapore realm, so I thought I could do this.
I managed to finish the whole fight under that ping. Then I picked up the loot and noticed the ping kept shooting up. I portal back to down, checked that I was still in Singapore realm, but the ping didn't stop. It kept going up to several hundreds, and eventually, packet loss, and kicked me back to login screen.
I logged back in right away, but my portal was already gone (was this an evidence that my instance crashed?). I proceeded to sort the loot I managed to grab, and got kicked to login screen once more.
I did a WinMTR trace (SG.login.pathofexile.com) afterwards. The result is different from what I got last night, which was around 50. Now I got an average of 86.
*Snip screenshot*
There are multiple big threads in the forums about the same issue. Please tell Network Layer to fix their problems, and inform us on the official forum about the progress.
Since it's weekend I'll wait for a reply next Monday.
Post by: Aklyon on August 20, 2015, 07:45:17 pm
...also theres a whole lot of people who weren't expecting metamods that say they will prevent x would actually prevent x until removed with the remove master mods thing. Neither of these are actually news, but I thought I'd save time for anyone who for some weird reason looks here for poe news instead of their site. There was some fixes too.
Post by: kcwong on August 21, 2015, 08:47:39 am
...also theres a whole lot of people who weren't expecting metamods that say they will prevent x would actually prevent x until removed with the remove master mods thing. Neither of these are actually news, but I thought I'd save time for anyone who for some weird reason looks here for poe news instead of their site. There was some fixes too.
More details about that... the metamod didn't always work like that. Before a scouring orb will remove the meta mod as well. Then without being announced metamod will survive scouring.
And a big issue people have is that this secret was not well-known, but a certain guild profited much using this knowledge. A GGG staff is a member of that guild, and this guild also housed a number RMT users in the past (they were banned).
Post by: Neonivek on August 21, 2015, 08:52:12 am
Post by: Aklyon on August 21, 2015, 09:36:16 am
So is there still autohit enemies in this game? or did they finally remove them to put the skill back into the game?Hm?
Also from what I could tell kcwong, its not that the effect changed, its that no one bothered to experiment and tell people. And oh noes, someone succeeded in an ingame economy. Its not like all their success will just be dumped into standard eventually, where they won't make anything off it because theres already a dozen eimilar items. (or hardcore, but I couldn't be bothered to care about the league of permadeath if I tried)
Post by: Sergius on August 21, 2015, 10:33:54 am
Post by: kcwong on August 21, 2015, 11:30:37 am
So is there still autohit enemies in this game? or did they finally remove them to put the skill back into the game?Hm?
Also from what I could tell kcwong, its not that the effect changed, its that no one bothered to experiment and tell people. And oh noes, someone succeeded in an ingame economy. Its not like all their success will just be dumped into standard eventually, where they won't make anything off it because theres already a dozen eimilar items. (or hardcore, but I couldn't be bothered to care about the league of permadeath if I tried)
What I've read is that they made 27 mirrors and 20k exalts out of that kind of crafting... and what's fishy is that a GGG staff is in that very guild. No one knows about the metamod changed to work like that, until someone gloated about their new-found wealth.
I play self-found mostly, and have only bought 4 pieces of build-enabling uniques since I started playing in open beta. Which is to say I don't care about the in-game economy at all.
What I do care about is GGG staff's integrity... I am still waiting for GGG to respond to any of those threads.
Post by: Aklyon on August 21, 2015, 11:33:44 am
Post by: kcwong on August 22, 2015, 01:19:39 am
Also, this is the first time I heard about a GGG staff publicly playing with normal players. I would expect GGG staff to never inform anyone of their real identities... they should have their GGG staff account doing their jobs, and their own personal account that should never be linked to their staff status.
Post by: cerapa on August 22, 2015, 04:15:55 am
Bex's reply is about the recipe and economy, but one question remains: did GGG staff leak the information to his guildmates?
I think it would have been a fairly normal thing to test. Just add the metamod and scour, see if "can't be changed" is also "can't be removed". I don't see why it's a thing that needs leaking.
The problem AFAIK is that a person said that it didn't work. There was no change, it worked from the start and people lied about it. Not many people are going to waste their exalts on testing something that has already been said not to work.
EDIT: Hell, it's literally in the goddamn manifesto.
Quote
But someone says that this was changed in 2.0.0 to work differently?There wasn't a change. People are angry about something that didn't even happen.
This isn't true. We coded it with this intention, tested it, released it and players have been using it. We checked the code today and it hasn't changed during that year.
Please note that there is incentive for people to mislead others if they find a secret recipe or crafting trick.
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2015, 08:29:24 am
Post by: kcwong on August 22, 2015, 09:14:30 am
Are you expecting the staff play their own game in secret, kcwong? That would be stranger. And if they want to reveal themselves, then sounds like its up to them.
Yes, that's what I expect... kind of like a lottery where all the staff and their family members aren't allowed to participate.
They are definitely allowed to play the game in their own accounts, they can even buy supporter packs and micro-transactions. But this account would be discretely separate from their staff accounts.
If they like to mingle with the players, they can do so publicly in their staff accounts, or play normally with their personal accounts. They can even have multiple staff accounts, some for PR, some for testing and game master tasks.
Right now, we have a staff member in a player guild, and he's suspicious of playing favorites by leaking the information to his guildmates so they could profit a huge lot... in the scale of 20k exalted orbs. That's an ungodly amount of ex, I could never imagine anyone having that much in one place. My whole time of solo self found net me 7 ex. If you focus on Path of Trading, how about two thousands of ex? He still got 10 times more than that in a flash.
But if they keep it discrete, then this uproar would never have happened. Because *even IF he did* leak information, he did it under his personal account and we would perceive this like the 20% gem recipe: someone managed to find it and kept it secret, now it's out, and the whole community would use it.
Post by: Aklyon on August 22, 2015, 09:32:11 am
Post by: Aklyon on November 03, 2015, 11:54:44 am
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 03, 2015, 12:27:47 pm
Post by: MantisMan on November 03, 2015, 07:57:36 pm
I'm juggling too many games right now to add a new one, but I'm a little curious about how Path of Exile plays these days.
I just browsed the wiki for a bit to look at the class info, and that looks like what I remember. Playing the game felt a bit empty to me back then, though.
Post by: Aklyon on November 03, 2015, 08:28:07 pm
Mostly, it just plays better. Less lag (usually), no desync (if you have acceptable ping for lockstep mode), more things. More skills, more types of skills, gems you can craft and stick into the passive tree, Shrines (of the nondark kind) can show up, masters and their missions can show up, rogue exiles can show up and try to kill you, strongboxes replaced Large Chests (except these can show up all over the place, not just particular areas), and they've strewn lore all over the place. You can even listen to the lore without standing right next to it!
Post by: nenjin on November 03, 2015, 09:29:52 pm
The game really shines at higher levels though, IMO. That's when you've built out a skill tree, gotten a good variety of gems, can create whacky combos, have the resources to mod gear, level up Masters, run Maps, mod Maps, etc...
And there's just a wealth of supplemental content now. Shrines with great effects like from Diablo 2. Strong Boxes with random properties. Vaal Maps with random properties. Tormented Spirits. A personal hideout to decorate.
TBH, the game only really took with me after I found a character and build I liked. Then I was hooked. I just got done playing a month long stint of it, gaining several levels on Merciless and starting to dabble in running maps.
I've also come to appreciate the challenge of it. It can get unforgiving at higher levels, where your build, your skills and your timing all are what make the difference between leveling or not. It's got a Dark Souls like challenge for me where things are so ridiculously hard sometimes that, when you actualy win, it really feels like you earned it. On the other hand, a bad build can require a re-roll if you weren't taking things seriously until Cruel difficulty. And I've often been reduced to zerg rushing some story bosses or uniques, xp be damned, just so I can get past it.
All in all, I think it's a game where the appeal builds slower than a game like Diablo 3, but that offers interesting mechanics and a real challenge versus what is now essentially a high speed loot explosion 24/7 in that game.
Post by: PrimusRibbus on November 03, 2015, 10:10:03 pm
I remember messing around with this game for about a week, which must have been years ago by now. I think I was playing a Maurader, and I was getting annoyed at his inability to wear pants.
I'm juggling too many games right now to add a new one, but I'm a little curious about how Path of Exile plays these days.
I just browsed the wiki for a bit to look at the class info, and that looks like what I remember. Playing the game felt a bit empty to me back then, though.
I feel you. I occasionally check out the thread because PoE has long been on my "I need to give that a shot again" list.
Back towards the end of beta and early release I was playing with a crew of guys that I played D2 with way back in the day. After a couple weeks we collectively came to the decision that either there was something about PoE that turned us off that we just couldn't put our fingers on, or that we'd all grown out of the clicky-clicky-looty-dicky ARPG genre.
*sigh* It looks so good on paper.
Post by: miljan on November 04, 2015, 04:31:51 am
It has so much potential but is limited by some core problematic decisions of developers and also lack of money when they build their engine up as the combat is probably the worst aspect of the game compared to other arpg games.
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2015, 11:14:17 am
Gearing is also more interesting than D3, which has fallen into the trap of just giving everyone legendaries every run, so that even legendaries are basically garbage.
I don't blame anyone for not liking PoE, it's got plenty of visual and handling issues. But like I said, mechanically, I think it's the best ARPG on the market, AND it's F2P with basically zero restrictions, microtransactions or P2W junk.
What it really hurts on though is the time investment required. Especially in the late game.
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2015, 12:21:09 pm
Quote
None of that gives me cause to argue with anyone saying it's a great game. It has an incredible amount of depth and complexity, which is an increasingly rare thing nowadays. But for me it goes too far in the direction of inaccessibility. I feel as though to actually be 'good' at the game, I'd have to spend dozens of hours reading forum posts and guides, combined with a large amount of time doing things I actively dislike, like online trading (I've never been a fan of trading in games like this - I want to kill monsters, not be a merchant - and sites like d2jsp had a very detrimental effect on D2, in my opinion. I'd love to see a game like this where most gear people use is self-found).
FWIW, I've made it to level 80 with:
-No grouping.
-No trading.
-No reading the forums.
-Designing my own build.
Granted, there was a lot of trial and error in there and the passive resets are what prevented me from possibly locking myself into a bad build. But I think if *I* can succeed by dint of my own brains and skills and knowledge, PoE isn't that hard of a game. It can be unforgiving though, and a lot of my knowledge was hard earned. (Like, knowing how to balance resists vs. life vs. everything else is acquired knowledge.)
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2015, 12:55:53 pm
And I've made it to lv. 40ish twice, once by being stubborn with wanting to make a summoner as a summoner, and once guessing how to use frost blades and it mostly working out.
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2015, 01:18:52 pm
Quote
I'm surprised though - it sounds like you've almost been playing it as an offline game.
If I'm honest, I didn't have the confidence to group with merciless difficulty players running maps because I assumed I'd be a giant, flaming noob in their eyes. According to the math I will probably spend the next two years trying to grind to 100 solo, even before considering all the resources to roll higher level maps.
But yeah, I'm actually quite proud of myself for getting this far with no one's help at all. There are however some map bosses I simply can't fight if I don't want to lose XP. So I basically level up, get my xp bar zero'd out, then go do dangerous stuff. If dangerous stuff has been going well enough I've actually acquired some more XP, I go do something safer until I finish out the level, then go again.
PoE IS super intimidating to get into, but, it's doable without Dwarf Fortress levels of first-time-player research.
Post by: Levi on November 04, 2015, 02:13:51 pm
I'm not even sure exactly what it is that bores me so much.
Post by: ragnar119 on November 04, 2015, 02:18:36 pm
I generally play it every time new expansion (mini expansion) is released to around level 85 and at that point get bored and wait for next content update.
But as a person that doesnt like to trade you should know that PoE has the worst drop rates from all arpg out there, as they are balanced around trade and economy. So if you dont want to trade (or play in a guild) the only two options is to invest few times more in grinding or play a cookie cutter build.
I love the game, but also hate some aspect of the game so much (trade and not that good combat that is to simple with one skill spam).
Post by: boki on November 04, 2015, 02:22:37 pm
Everytime I got to play PoE I get super excited planning my build, but then I go to actually play the game and its ridiculously boring so I stop after a bit. :P
I'm not even sure exactly what it is that bores me so much.
Its probably because the game has one of the worst and dumb combat compared to other arpg games. Great complexity on paper, but it all falls apart with gameplay that is a borefest, even compared to crap like d3.
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2015, 02:40:36 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2015, 02:41:36 pm
Post by: boki on November 04, 2015, 02:51:57 pm
I do not understand why people come after PoE's combat so much. It is D2's combat, pretty much to a T. Yes, clicking on a mass of enemies does result in some sloppy combat but, I dunno. Seems like people expect an aRPG today to let you shoot lightning out of your ass in the first zone, ala D3's totally graphically overblown abilities.
No its not. And it has nothing to do with visuals. There was a huge reason to actually use more skill in d2 than in PoE. The higher the level you are in PoE, more boring the combat becomes. Even old d2 had more interesting combat with need to build your character around different elements so you can finish the game.
PoE literally has the worst combat mechanic of all arpg out there (its actually on level of d1, not d2), and it comes from core problems the game has, their sockets and passive tree, where the only thing you will do is put everything in one spam skill. And the combat is actually better on beginning when you can use different skills.
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2015, 02:54:49 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2015, 02:59:05 pm
...only one skill? Really. Because usually I end up with 2, maybe 3 skills that I use often. Sometimes a movement skill if theres space.
^
I find a lot of exaggerations when people talk about how bad they think PoE's combat is. My whole skill bar is full of stuff I use constantly, in addition to several passive abilities. An AOE melee attack with life leech, spectral swords for filling the screen at range, a shield charge for attack or avoidance, several war cries, an aura, and at least 3 passive defensive attacks.
What the game DOES allow you to do though, is build up one skill to broken levels. But everytime I think I've got a 1-size fits all solution to PoE, the game disabuses me of that idea.
Post by: boki on November 04, 2015, 03:05:01 pm
...only one skill? Really. Because usually I end up with 2, maybe 3 skills that I use often. Sometimes a movement skill if theres space.
Yes one skill. One dmg skill to say it better. And ton of auras, curses and similar buffs with almost every build. There are i think 3 or 4 builds that use more different type of attacks, but majority one dumb skill all the fucking time. Most of builds play the same way and feel the same. The game is balanced around you building around that one skill and spamming it. If you do anyhting else you hurt you build as the whole game is balanced around it, especially high end game maps or end game bosses like atziri.
Post by: boki on November 04, 2015, 05:20:42 pm
Specializing a character in D2 meant restricting yourself to pretty much one element. Sorceress? You pick one element. Necromancer? All you get is poison and magic- magic was the strong one though. Pally? Magic everything. Amazon? You're playing with lightning. Your gear was Enigma for your chestplate for teleporting on top of things in order to hammerfy them, your pet mercenary would get EBotDZ so he has two auras (two!), and the only quality gear is from a few ladder runewords or set items. If you're a pally, your other skill is an aura.
In fact, per character, the only real choices you had in element were 'are you using frozen orb or blizzard?' If you were going for particular loot or just an area with the max itemlevel, you'd have to pick one to work your elemental strength against- your fire sorc couldn't take the act 2 forgotten basement thinger, and your blizzard sorc couldn't take the act 3 sewer things. You had to play to one strength alone, unless you were a hammerdin, because then you play against everything.
So, to minmax, you've got 2-3 auras and one high damage skill in one element. I'm not sure how this is any different from your perception of PoE.
Actually this is not correct. You can not restrict your self to one element as you will not be able to finish the game because of the monster immunities (so you would with any class need min 2 type of attacks). Also you gear will not be enigma as getting that item means you would need to cheat or dupe as it was literally impossible to get it legit and craft, so a lot of people where using the hack tools to get it (i was one of them that run bot farms and later used the lag hack to duplicate items and resell them on RMT site, from where a lot of this duped items comed from as most people would never see them).
So, as said not same at all as you actually needed to use two type of attack to even do any dmg to monster that are imune
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2015, 05:51:58 pm
And seriously. You're criticizing PoE for one trick pony builds? Have you ever seen a Whirlwind Barb in D3? Or a Frog Witch Doctor? Or an ANYTHING Wizard?
I get you don't like what PoE does. I just don't think you're articulating what you dislike very well.
Post by: boki on November 04, 2015, 06:36:10 pm
And does either PoE or D3, or really any ARPG, do full immunities anymore? No, they don't. Because people hated them.
And seriously. You're criticizing PoE for one trick pony builds? Have you ever seen a Whirlwind Barb in D3? Or a Frog Witch Doctor? Or an ANYTHING Wizard?
I get you don't like what PoE does. I just don't think you're articulating what you dislike very well.
They dont, but other arpg games unlike PoE are moving away from one spam skill and actually implementing mechanics where you will go through different skill with different cool downs to do max dmg or replenish mana or other resources. That is not the case in POE, as the game is balanced around one skill. There is no need for sing target, as a 5 or 6 linked items will always do more dmg than single target. There is no need for multiple dmg skills as all skills are balanced around spamming with no cool downs.
The game is flowed with bad design and very simple gameplay at its core. I am criticizing PoE for literally making the game around one trick builds, balancing it around it. I criticizing it because it makes the game to much dumb and simple, and boring, in the thing that maters most, gameplay. You can have all the complexity in building your passive tree and items, when it all falls down to one spam skill and 90% of builds using some type of aura and curse with cast on dmg set up. And than some wander why people get bored with PoE and its combat.
I am not even gonna start to talk about abomination that is the focus on economy and trading in a arpg game.
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2015, 06:41:06 pm
In that for the first while in the game you will be happily making your character and the game might be tricky but you get the hang of it and are going through the game at a happy pace.
Then BLAM! suddenly the game pulls a completely new element that exists ONLY to tell you that you should have built your character the way they wanted to (Thanks... *Insert Roguelike here*)
I don't actually have any real ill will towards Path of Exile. Yet once lightning element came into play I sort of knew what game I was actually playing. It is a game of builds.
You get bored in Path of Exile because the proper way to play the game is for it to play itself. Your goal is to reach the point where your input matters the least.
The reason why Diablo 2 was MORE fun, in spite being the exact same game is because there was more to it then auto-pilot. Sure there was the Ice Element's "destroy everything" and the Barbarian's Whirlwind... But outside those you had to maneuver, retreat, take items... and stuff.
Post by: nenjin on November 04, 2015, 06:42:46 pm
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2015, 06:46:13 pm
Like I said. I've played since closed beta, with zero input from anyone but myself, with zero trading, created my own builds and been successful with them. I'm not sure why you're so hung up on everyone else's one trick pony builds, because that's not how I've played or succeeded at the game.
I'm not.
I think what everyone else is miffed about is ultimately the game is balanced AROUND these one trick pony builds.
I will say... That some builds though are unfairly specific if you want them to work.
Post by: Aklyon on November 04, 2015, 06:55:48 pm
Post by: Neonivek on November 04, 2015, 07:59:29 pm
So are you talking about atziri when you mean 'balanced around', or just merciless? Because one is optional and the other is a part of the game, and is not nearly as specific.
I am making it seems a lot worse then it actually is... But for some builds to function you have to basically memorize the path of often dozens of abilities scattered to the four corners of the earth (ok USUALLY not thaaat bad... Just three corners)
It is a mild miff at best. It isn't like they charge you for respecs anyhow.
Post by: nenjin on November 05, 2015, 12:06:50 am
Quote
PoE doesn't feel like autopilot, and it doesn't feel brainless, and there's a lot of builds that work and a lot of tools to make them work. Even playing a cold build, my frost snap/ice spear shadow has to do a lot of sidestepping, crowd management, careful initiation, and other matters of involvement.
And then you add in a Nemesis mod pack with something like Corrupting Blood or Storm Herald or whatever those bastards that summon the Blood Elemental Unique boss are, toss in a little health regen and life leech for them, and it's gone well beyond "spam one skill til you win."
Shit, half the Unique bosses in Merciless I have to do a hit and run strategy most of the time that ends up being a blend of 4 or 5 different skills in good, tight rotation in order to win. I really feel like I earn my wins in PoE, versus yet another mindless spam fest that is a GRift run in Diablo 3. It scratches the loot and mechanics itch ok, but provides no sense of challenge other than trying to max out your DPS, and Arcane Beam dodging.
Post by: boki on November 05, 2015, 10:11:03 am
Oh, Enigma got pulled in 1.13? Your argument is moot before that patch. Additionally, you'd shaft your build/build strength in the lategame if you specced into two elements, particularly on sorcs, where their goal was more the endgame than getting there, where you'd need the power of a build specialized with one skill or element. You'd finish the game just fine in a multiplayer environment, which is where your farming/bots/RWT would be applied anyways.
All the above argument is moot against hammerdins anyways, they're the epitome of one-trick, one skill pony, and that's why you used them in your bots. Y'sure weren't running sorcs against immunities or a WW barb against iron maiden in act 4.
I'unno. PoE doesn't feel like autopilot, and it doesn't feel brainless, and there's a lot of builds that work and a lot of tools to make them work. Even playing a cold build, my frost snap/ice spear shadow has to do a lot of sidestepping, crowd management, careful initiation, and other matters of involvement. It's not 'follow the gank-wagon' or 'you must go here to kill things because that's what your character does best.'
It's sort of like comparing Doom to Team Fortress 2 and being upset that TF2 doesn't have strafe running or wallrunning or hacks to make bridges you can cross under and soldiers are the cornerstone of every competitive team and never mind the super shotgun.
My arguments stand as enigma is not a problem. You do not shaft your build/build strength because you couldn't finish the game with one type of element attack. You will not be getting enigma or items that you need to make a hamerdin work in the first place (that also can not kill all monsters as there are magic imune ones). I mean, what are you even talking here about? When I run bots, i dont run them to play the game, but to sell to morons that would pay real money. The same morons that now pay items in POE, but unlike blizzard GGG seems to care more about that aspect as I was banned few times by now.
I mean you here talk about enigma and hamerdin builds like the items that you need to get to make them drop normally, but the drop rates is on level of having few mirror drops in PoE, it aint gonna happen without cheats. The thing I am talking about and you apparently confirmed with your post is that in d2 you could not play the game with using one elemental attack. For barbarian you would need to use Berserk (magical dmg attack) for all the monsters that have immunities or iron maiden. Four wizard you are going two elemental attack, fire, lightning or cold, or all three in most times. You will not be moving anywhere without them.
I know a lot of people cheated the shit out of the game, i did it mostly so i can famr for the $$$ , but the core game and how its designed is few time better than PoE ever will, from the simple fact you can not kill all the monster with holding your one button like in PoE. PoE is dumb and boring as arpg game, and even d2 that is 10 years old does a better job. While other games go away form spam one skill, PoE is fully embracing it, and its bad and very simple design. Its the core problem of the game that so many people find boring. The most important thing for a arpg game, combat in PoE is the worst. How complex the game is in building character, that much simple and dumb it is in its execution in the actual game.
And the most funny thing is, when people posted problems about the combat in closed beta and how the game is to much heavy on spam one skill, making the combat simple and boring, the hardcore poe players actually didnt want it to be more complex, they dont want to manage or have a reason to use different attack and similar, they want it simple, and apparently GGG is of same mindset, so I dont thing PoE will ever change for better with its core gameplay problems.
Post by: Aklyon on November 05, 2015, 10:15:37 am
When I run bots, i dont run them to play the game, but to sell to morons that would pay real money. The same morons that now pay items in POE, but unlike blizzard GGG seems to care more about that aspect as I was banned few times by now.Aha, so is this why you've been so intent on complaining about the game? Because GGG banned you more than once for bot nonsense? Too bad.
Post by: nenjin on November 05, 2015, 10:33:26 am
Post by: boki on November 05, 2015, 12:43:17 pm
When I run bots, i dont run them to play the game, but to sell to morons that would pay real money. The same morons that now pay items in POE, but unlike blizzard GGG seems to care more about that aspect as I was banned few times by now.Aha, so is this why you've been so intent on complaining about the game? Because GGG banned you more than once for bot nonsense? Too bad.
Umm, no. I said what is the problem with the game. Did someone banned me or not, doesnt matter, as I was banned from d2 and d3 also, but not as much often as POE (witch is good as GGG cares a lot more about their game). But again it doesnt matter, as I am not complaining about bans, but the problems the game has. I play games to have fun, I bot to earn $$$ on my other comp. That comp is used from arpg boting to MMO boting (from WoW, to d3 (when there was AH and RMAH), PoE and similar), or any other popular/easy way to earn cash from online games
Post by: Aklyon on November 05, 2015, 01:10:44 pm
The botting just makes you sound lame.
Post by: boki on November 05, 2015, 01:19:32 pm
You said the exact same argument whether we compared it to d2 or pointed out that you don't have to even pay attention to one trick ponies because they weren't the only thing possible, and then said that d2 was better because it did the same thing you complained about: Do one thing well only and kill you otherwise. If you play games to have fun, and you aren't having fun because of your immense apparent dislike of popular one trick ponies, then go play something else.
The botting just makes you sound lame.
What did i say what same argument, that in d2 you need to use more different attacks to kill monster, while in PoE that is not the case as you can spam one skill? Did you read what I wrote, because read it again as its obvious you didn't understand it good.
And yes, I am playing something else, not playing PoE anymore (except for boting), because I dont like the boring gameplay, I didnt said I still play the game. This is PoE thread, where people that like the game and dont like the game post about it if you didnt know. And i did exactly that, posted why i dont like the game (as you saw in this thread, several people posting similar problems the game has).
The boting is just a random thing not related to me playing games. It's just work, extra cash, nothing more.
Post by: Sinistar on November 05, 2015, 05:08:00 pm
Theeeeen again I only ever played it on normal. :P
So, let's talk about PoE - did new updates make sapper shadow any more sensible? Last time I asked iirc traps and mines were more of an addition to your main skill(s) rather than main themselves.
Actually, been thinking about getting back into PoE and I feel like skanking everyone, thinking what might work on shadow. Dunno what I'm looking for, but something... different, I guess.
Post by: Aklyon on November 05, 2015, 05:10:24 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 05, 2015, 06:38:14 pm
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 05, 2015, 08:25:44 pm
Mines are useless.
Post by: Aklyon on November 05, 2015, 08:38:09 pm
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on November 06, 2015, 03:07:40 am
Post by: Sinistar on November 06, 2015, 03:34:09 am
Not sure when you last played, but a) the shadow/hunter side of the tree seems to have plenty of trap passives and b) there are lots of support skills for traps these days, including turning other skills into traps.Steam says 11.11.2014 so not THAT long I guess...
Thanks for input, everyone though. I wasn't planning on using mines anyway, that need to manually trigger them seems like a hassle, hehe.
Say, what if I built a crit-heavy + traps shadow and put a CoC gem on some trap skill? Awesome/silly?
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 06, 2015, 09:25:33 am
Post by: Aklyon on November 06, 2015, 09:40:45 am
Post by: Sinistar on November 06, 2015, 09:51:05 am
OR, for that matter, whenever I crit with any attack skill. The way you two put it sounds like trap alone should first crit or something. I am confus. :S
But if I was thinking this right, for hitting a lot of enemies I was thinking of taking reave.
Post by: The Darkling Wolf on November 06, 2015, 09:54:13 am
Wait no, am I thinking this backwards again - if I put Cast on Critical hit support gem on a trap skill gem, would that not mean I shit trap out every time I crit when I hit someone with a basic attack?Cast on Critical will cast any linked spells when the linked attack scores a crit, pretty sure it just flat out won't work with traps.
OR, for that matter, whenever I crit with any attack skill. The way you two put it sounds like trap alone should first crit or something. I am confus. :S
But if I was thinking this right, for hitting a lot of enemies I was thinking of taking reave.
Post by: aristabulus on November 06, 2015, 12:49:20 pm
...
Cast on Critical will cast any linked spells when the linked attack scores a crit, pretty sure it just flat out won't work with traps.
The wiki info says traps should cast successfully from the CoC, as they are officially spells. Whether it centers on you or the target is the real question, and which of those you want depends on the attack skill.
Post by: Aklyon on November 06, 2015, 01:08:40 pm
The announcement for the expansion is sometime this month, while Darkshrine's running. Talisman leagues and 2.1.0 in Dec, after Darkshrine. 2.2.0 (the next expansion) Q1 next year, right after Talisman leagues end.
Post by: Sinistar on November 09, 2015, 06:19:37 pm
Anyways, I said sack it and rolled my first shadow. Gonna pick all trap skill, ALL of them.
Ok, maybe not the trap duration one, I want traps to go boom as soon as possible. And might skip trap crit too, doesn't seem worth it?
Speaking of things going boom, man do I love my fire traps. They truly make a satisfying BOOM when they go off. Apart from that, I'm also running with bear trap for single target dmg/utility stun, viper strike for sustained single target dmg and recently got whirling blades which is neat escape/sometimes-engage tool. Was thinking of picking assassin's mark + curse on hit somewhere down the road BUT things just got better - I so do like this. (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1475604)
No dual wielding for me, currently it's dagger/claw + (spiked) shield for melee, because my trap laying gets me often in the thick of groups and shields give you some bonus def. Might be unimportant later if I take some evasion nodes, but I like it for now. Besides, I'm also kinda preparing myself for this playstyle if I ever find Jaws of Agony. Anyways, I'm having fun and !!FUN!!.
Fire Nova Mine is cool...and still useless, because you have to stop and place it at your feet first. Wish it was a trap.What if you used trap support gem on it?
Post by: Aklyon on November 09, 2015, 06:26:22 pm
And if I used trap on it, wouldn't the trap just throw the mine? you'd have to manually trigger it anyways.
Post by: Sinistar on November 10, 2015, 01:19:26 am
As for that trap support gem - I dunno, never tested it myself. Wiki says it might work? But I might be just reading it wrong, wouldn't be the first time. :P
edit: mentioning assassin's mark in my last post, anyone has any opinion on power charges? Worth taking some charge duration etc. nodes in passive tree? Though I'm starting to think my build is going all over the place again, heh. I'm still not sure how much should I invest in crits, given I'm going trap strong. Maybe I'll just stack on evasion first.
Post by: Aklyon on November 12, 2015, 09:40:03 pm
Talisman (from what I can tell from the post and the little teaser) involves modding single monsters like the ghosts, but instead the monsters get attracted to them instead of dragging them around to the monsters. It also is talismans as in items. All talismans are corrupted by default and count as amulets (its not like that slot was already full of choices or anything... ::)). HC has a slightly different set of talismans than standard.
Lorewise, these are primeval Ezomyte things, and you can sacrifice them in sets of 5 at stone circles to provoke a fight for better tier of talisman. Or apparently just sac one of a rarity for a chance at a similar rarity? A set of tier-3s sacrificed invokes a portal to a new special boss, the Wolven King. Unsurprisingly if you'vd read this far, he has an even better talisman if you don't get murdered by him. It starts around 4pm EST/1pm pacific on the 11th of December.
In non-news, I've been having fun raining lightning around and on top of the burninated monsters Sinistar's been hitting with traps :)
Post by: Aklyon on November 20, 2015, 03:11:30 pm
Post by: Kanil on November 21, 2015, 04:45:57 am
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 21, 2015, 07:31:02 am
I feel like PoE not forcing the player's hand is something that's more an ideology than something that actually improves the gameplay. I've never thought "hey this is awesome my templar plays exactly like my witch does", but I have thought "it sucks that my templar plays exactly like my witch does".
Post by: Ehndras on November 21, 2015, 08:01:32 am
Post by: ragnar119 on November 21, 2015, 08:04:38 am
When it comes to sub classes them selves, I dont know why they didnt implement the passive tree that is shared for all second classes, similar tot heir main passive tree. But even than I dont see that much of a problem with current implementation.
Post by: ragnar119 on November 21, 2015, 08:06:18 am
Has the game been updated majorly as of late? I used to play this last year but it got boring.Yeah, it gets constantly updated every few months with smaller or bigger updates. They released a new act few months ago.
Post by: Kanil on November 21, 2015, 04:48:27 pm
I've never thought "hey this is awesome my templar plays exactly like my witch does", but I have thought "it sucks that my templar plays exactly like my witch does".
I've definitely thought "It's pretty awesome that I can use this build with a scion instead of a marauder" and am not looking forward to that no longer being the case.
Not that I consider all classes being largely identical to be desirable, but I consider it preferable to "you wanna play a non-witch necromancer? Get fucked."
Post by: Aklyon on November 21, 2015, 05:01:04 pm
Post by: Kanil on November 21, 2015, 06:03:59 pm
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 22, 2015, 01:51:24 am
https://youtu.be/DG6bShCdADk
Like I said, don't be worried about it. Build flexibility shouldn't be a big deal to you regardless, the diversity is what's important and is what's going to improve.
Post by: Aklyon on December 08, 2015, 02:01:28 pm
Also, they've booted up the markov patch noter (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1489523/page/1#p12154596) again :)
Post by: Rex_Nex on December 08, 2015, 04:51:13 pm
Overall my PA character, with only 4.6k HP, 2 PA links dedicated to MF, and all my gear packed full of IIR/IIQ ended up being more successful at practically everything. It was better for MFing low level maps, could dance around high level maps safer than the incinerator could tank them, and did atziri easier because PA is ridiculously good in that fight. The only thing Incinerate seemed to have going for it was how absolutely insane it is while leveling.
Post by: nenjin on December 08, 2015, 06:28:09 pm
Also some nice buffs for my summoner witch.
Post by: Aklyon on December 11, 2015, 12:12:36 am
Even if it isn't, ranged summon skeletons. Without vaal gem. :D
Post by: nenjin on December 11, 2015, 06:46:52 pm
Post by: Aklyon on December 11, 2015, 07:02:59 pm
Edit: And then a unique talisman out of nowhere, holy crap. Night's Hold, Black Maw Talisman. (http://i.imgur.com/9EjZWfS.jpg)
Post by: Aklyon on January 24, 2016, 07:39:43 pm
Post by: Azurestrike on January 25, 2016, 01:03:37 am
I usually play in the non-hardcore leagues cause my connection is very unreliable.
Post by: Aklyon on January 25, 2016, 01:55:42 am
Post by: kcwong on January 25, 2016, 09:40:20 am
Yes there is a guild, its Nist Akath. We've got a couple people in it still. There used to be a namelist but it got dropped at somepoint.
I take a look at the guild stash once in a while, seems everyone's too polite to do anything to it.
... except me. I was the one who made the "HI" back then. When the league ended I merged those orbs back into the main stash.
Post by: Aklyon on January 25, 2016, 09:54:20 am
Post by: aristabulus on January 25, 2016, 01:50:19 pm
As Aklyon said, the guild stash has been de facto asynchronous trading space, and it works well for that purpose. I'm not sure what else we can realistically do with it; PoE's guild system is rather bare-bones, with only three membership levels, and stash access being based on member level. I'd really like to see more features there, but I'm not holding my breath.
Post by: Aklyon on January 25, 2016, 02:00:35 pm
Post by: Aklyon on February 26, 2016, 10:48:43 am
Post by: nenjin on March 06, 2016, 05:01:20 pm
I did it on Normal without really paying any attention. When I tried it on Cruel, the dude was cranking out Merciless levels of damage and I eventually got killed when I decided it was a good idea to try and switch gems in the middle of the fight.
There's the 4 statues and when you hit them it strips the charges off Izaro that he's built up. But depending on when you do it...it has other effects on the future fights? I'd read that if you activate the statues too soon, he gets adds in the next fight.
All in all, I really dig the Labryinth. It's closer to what I've always thought games like this needed: internal dungeon design logic. Traps, secret rooms, keys, mysterious buff shrines: it's all quick nice.
Post by: ragnar119 on March 06, 2016, 06:11:14 pm
The only thing I do this dungeon is because of the new sublasses, otherwise i wouldn't touch it, and i hope they will separate in some way the class reward from the dungeon, because doing this crap 3 time for every character will be a pain in the ass. Making it optional content that is not needed for the sub classes unlock would be great from my perspective.
On other side the subclasses them selves are really nice and the new league with the random NPC selling good items, is really impressive, but I fear it will get cut out and not implemented in the main game because of trade centric balance and their shitty economy that is more important for devs than the actual game and its progression.
Post by: nenjin on March 06, 2016, 06:49:24 pm
Haven't gotten to the Merciless Labyrinth yet, so I'm curious what Monster level it is and if it'll be an alternative to map grind.
Overall I like the variety even if dodge traps makes things a little fiddly. The runs take too long though. One set of rooms with an end boss would be plenty. Having to do it x3 per each run is bleigh after a while.
Post by: Aklyon on March 06, 2016, 06:56:58 pm
As for me, I've enjoyed it. Theres interesting challenges and lots of loot in chests if you pick up the silver keys, and potential for a ton of loot at the end if you get multiple treasure keys. I'm playing a sunder/earthquake/dominating blow maurauder (with a geofri's baptism from cadiro), and it certainly had some challenge in normal lab, but I like it. Dominus felt easy in comparison.
Perandus league is also great, although if someone pins down a chaos-perandus coin ratio, it might be a bit worse. The coins are great as a special-use thing, but not so much for trading, they vary too much. I got that geofri's for 131 coins, but theres also stuff like this (http://i.imgur.com/C27U3h8.jpg) for an exorbitant price.
Post by: Rex_Nex on March 06, 2016, 08:19:54 pm
With that said, I think it's way too hard. The bosses are too tough; after starting A4C, I jumped into cruel Labyrinth to see how it was. I fought Argus for five minutes before I ran out of flask charges and died, and only got him down to half HP. There's no reason the Lab miniboss should have literally ten times the HP of Voll, hit almost as hard as Voll's windup attack, and speed around the room fast enough to catch you even on a quicksilver. I did manage to burn through both him and Izaro on normal, but I had to get way over leveled to do it. I'd be fine if the bosses posed this much of a challenge on Merciless, but not on Normal/Cruel. You can't set the area's ilvl to the same as dried lake and then make the bosses as hard as if it was 20 levels and a difficulty higher than you. Killing Cruel Izaro is like killing Merciless Malachai. It's a joke.
The traps are special to me. I'm not a huge fan of the waiting traps - the lava floor in particular is lame and poses no difficulty whatsoever - but I like the change of pace everything else provides. However, I think my #1 problem with traps is that they conflict horribly with predictive mode. It's like GGG just thought "okay fuck everyone who cant use lockstep" and implemented all these traps that you can and will get rubberbanded into and lose half your HP. I can see myself getting killed by desync every few lab runs. It's absurd.
The secret rooms behind hidden switches, talking with your guildies to pass on information about the different passages and hidden darkshrines, the loot explosions once you beat all of it, the lack of portals making every encounter and pickup actually matter, the little keys and powerups you can get to make the dungeon easier... it's all hugely fun to me.
Post by: nenjin on March 06, 2016, 08:32:58 pm
I think I can at least beat Izaro on Cruel if I can understand how the fights work. I probably could have? beat him last time if it wasn't 7am and I was a dumb ass. But if that's Cruel, Merciless won't even be worth the time to try, it will be such a ball buster to defeat Izaro and reach the end.
Likewise, until the Treasure Chests are pooping out piles of 70+ Items, Unqiues, Gems and other goodies, it doesn't seem like Argus is worth the time to fight for one measly Treasure Key.
Post by: Aklyon on March 06, 2016, 09:37:27 pm
Post by: nenjin on March 06, 2016, 10:29:24 pm
He's not impossible to avoid. With no armor movement penalty, some boot speed, Temporal Chains and Shield Charge, I was able to avoid him for his entire enrage duration.
Still took about 3 to 4 minutes to kill on him on Cruel but I guess? he takes less damage during enrage because I was surprised at how fast his health went down compared to normal even with having to stop every 15 seconds or so.
Got an artifact off him, 3rd for this run.
So I dunno. I'll evaluate Merciless when I get there. If I can beat Izaro...
Seems the trick to Izaro is to hit the last pillar right before he dies. Which is hard because he has approximately 1.2 bajllion HP.
Post by: nenjin on March 06, 2016, 11:38:09 pm
Got 6 artifacts out this run too. Took probably 2 hours but it was worth it to go through the whole Labyrinth. There really is a crap load of stuff in there.
edit
Go to finally finish off Malakai in Merciless, a death march of fights if ever there was one. For some reason even though I've killed his 3 henchmen before, it makes me do it again. So there's another 30 minutes of slogging through death marching bosses. Finally get to Malakai, fighting him and Piety is balls. More death marching. Finally get her killed. Am almost done with the first heart on Malakai when.....the server disconnects me.
Sign back in, and it wants me to kill Malakai's 3 assholes again.
Amazing how this game can wipe out any good will I have toward it within a scant 48 hour period. It made me do all of Act 4 on Normal and Cruel again too when I logged in to try Ascendancy, because hey I guess saving progress is for fucking MORONS. I swear every time I come back to this game, half of my time is spent replaying content they ever changed and revoked my progress, or the stupid game never saved it in the first place.
Guess I'll have to wait til next weekend for the hour + Malakai death march boss fights. ><
Post by: miljan on March 07, 2016, 07:04:00 am
On other side the subclasses them selves are really nice and the new league with the random NPC selling good items, is really impressive, but I fear it will get cut out and not implemented in the main game because of trade centric balance and their shitty economy that is more important for devs than the actual game and its progression.
Haha, you can dream only. GGG cares more about the economy than the game it self and their trade crap where they literally destroyed potentially a good arpg game with bad balance and mechanic that are there only to support the economy.
Also the even worst thing is that they put a in game mechanic for trading that the community was asking for so long, and you know what? They put it behind a pay wall. A core mechanic that should be there from the release of game (that is heavily balanced around trade) is behind a pay wall, and it is making the game extremely close to pay to win. The game is really slow going down hill with their direction.
Post by: Aklyon on March 07, 2016, 08:36:50 am
Haha, you can dream only. GGG cares more about the economy than the game it self and their trade crap where they literally destroyed potentially a good arpg game with bad balance and mechanic that are there only to support the economy.I think you're getting PoE mixed up with Eve or something, because your post makes no sense. If it was 'only about the trade', why would they wait 3 content expansions before improving any part of the trading?
Also, the improvement to premium stash tabs has literally changed next to nothing from the buyer's end. You still have to use an external site to get anything done in reasonable time, because trade chat does not exist in a usable state in any game. And you can still trade without it on both sides, like people have done since the closed beta, so you can take your p2w comment and eat it.
Unless you just came here to complain, and in that case why aren't you on reddit instead?
Post by: miljan on March 07, 2016, 09:11:34 am
No I am not mixing it with EVE. Its what GGG themselves said. The most important part of their game is the economy for them. In a fucking arpg game where most important part is to kill monster and from that get loot. They shit up the drop rates, implement a huge amount of currency sink behind RNG or huge prices only so the economy inflation does not go through roof.Haha, you can dream only. GGG cares more about the economy than the game it self and their trade crap where they literally destroyed potentially a good arpg game with bad balance and mechanic that are there only to support the economy.I think you're getting PoE mixed up with Eve or something, because your post makes no sense. If it was 'only about the trade', why would they wait 3 content expansions before improving any part of the trading?
Also, the improvement to premium stash tabs has literally changed next to nothing from the buyer's end. You still have to use an external site to get anything done in reasonable time, because trade chat does not exist in a usable state in any game. And you can still trade without it on both sides, like people have done since the closed beta, so you can take your p2w comment and eat it.
Unless you just came here to complain, and in that case why aren't you on reddit instead?
Also they waited for basic trading because community did it for them with 3rd party programs. If it was not the case, you would still trade with spamming the chat (where still majority the players still trade as they dont know anything about 3rd party programs because there nothing about it in the game it self)
Dont need to eat anything, the game is slowly moving and giving more and more benefits to people that pay real cash, and the fact that this basic mechanic is behind a pay wall says a lot that the game is going down hill. Putting things like this behind a pay wall is the worst thing they could do. In fact with instance trading that is coming they can no longer work around this trying to find some weak logic that because there are 3rd party programs its not pay to win.
Post by: nenjin on March 07, 2016, 11:10:23 am
Post by: Aklyon on March 07, 2016, 11:35:34 am
They didn't even specify trade (with public premium stash tabs only, cross-instance), they said trade (no qualifiers) between instances. The only reason I'm even paying much attention to trade at all is to see how the public tabs work, I'm not expecting to get anything that leads to uber gg BiS faceroll Malachai in merciless as a low-life MF melee witch paid benefit out of it like you're making it out to be, miljan. (although I would not be surprised if the seperate garena realm has that. I've heard nothing good about it the few times I've seen it mentioned.)
The trading improvement will make no difference in whether I make it to lv.80, or whether I find cool things, whether I get through a particular labyrinth layout or not, or whether cadiro tries to rip me off selling a unique for thousands of perandus coin or just another rare ring for 10 coins. At best I might get a few alts out of the tab's contents after it doesn't sell and I just vendor it all. I could get more than that just running around playing the game, ignoring trading completely.
Post by: miljan on March 07, 2016, 01:59:59 pm
pay to win...what? What object is there in game (with ingame effects beyond cosmetics) that is literally impossible to get without money? Everything that exists as a item that has been found is either in Standard or Hardcore, and may show up in Perandus via Cadiro too. You can find all of the normal items, the currently-existing legacy version items, and all of the non-league exclusive uniques there. And for the league exclusives there is Zana maps (depending on the currently available league modifiers), or if you insist on needing one now, right this moment, you can trade for it if someone is selling it.Is something possible or impossible to get in game doesnt matter. Game can be balance where things are hard to get without paying for items, but they can still drop, so that type of logic fails. Things that you can not get in game without paying are stash tabs, character slots and premium stashes. Every player gets 4 stash tabs and you can use them for items and transfer between characters, and character slots. Premium stashes where used for coloring and changing your text description. But with the new update they implemented indexing items for trade. PoE is the most competitive arpg game out there. If offers live leaderboards where people compete, including very often real rewards from different sponsors GGG gets. Now this is known that if you want to compete you will need to have more stash tabs as they do bring a very good benefits to players. The premium stash tabs make that even more obvious and worse, including that it limits the mechanic from other players. I dont know what we need to talk about here, there is nothing good in this. Putting in game mechanics of trade behind a pay wall is bad, no matter is the game competitive or not, but being competitive it just makes the things a lot worse.
They didn't even specify trade (with public premium stash tabs only, cross-instance), they said trade (no qualifiers) between instances. The only reason I'm even paying much attention to trade at all is to see how the public tabs work, I'm not expecting to get anything that leads to uber gg BiS faceroll Malachai in merciless as a low-life MF melee witch paid benefit out of it like you're making it out to be, miljan. (although I would not be surprised if the seperate garena realm has that. I've heard nothing good about it the few times I've seen it mentioned.)
The trading improvement will make no difference in whether I make it to lv.80, or whether I find cool things, whether I get through a particular labyrinth layout or not, or whether cadiro tries to rip me off selling a unique for thousands of perandus coin or just another rare ring for 10 coins. At best I might get a few alts out of the tab's contents after it doesn't sell and I just vendor it all. I could get more than that just running around playing the game, ignoring trading completely.
The implementation of the indexing of items is the first step in fully implementing the trading improvements. Instance trading will be directly tided to premium stashes because they can not work with normal ones as they do not offer same function of storing information on them (otherways you can have same functionality for all stash tabs, but GGG didnt want it to be implemented like that, probably because of wanting to sell them more for $$$). Having a automated trading will even more increase the pay to win elements in this game, as trading is essential part of the game, as the whole drop rates and progression is balanced around it. Is it possible to play without trade? Yes. Is the game balanced around not trading? No. You will need to invest a lot more time in farming making PoE one of the least rewording arpg on the market to this date, and only arpg that has such huge focus on economy.
Post by: nenjin on March 07, 2016, 04:13:14 pm
Suffice to say, 99% of their playerbase isn't going to give a shit and I'm not sure why anyone else should. If you've clocked even a fraction of time in PoE that I have and you still haven't spent a dime on it, you don't have the right to be upset. At all. I don't play competitively nor give a shit about any upper level gameplay. But after hundreds of hours, I felt like GGG earned their $20 or whatever completely affordable price they put on a non-essential part of the game.
Post by: miljan on March 07, 2016, 05:37:35 pm
For a game that has not charged a single dime for access, for you to now be upset because you have to shell out for a premium stash tab (fuck even I've bought them at this point) so you can get indexed trading...
Suffice to say, 99% of their playerbase isn't going to give a shit and I'm not sure why anyone else should. If you've clocked even a fraction of time in PoE that I have and you still haven't spent a dime on it, you don't have the right to be upset. At all. I don't play competitively nor give a shit about any upper level gameplay. But after hundreds of hours, I felt like GGG earned their $20 or whatever completely affordable price they put on a non-essential part of the game.
Dont want to disappoint you but majority of community already see the problem as there a lot of threads about this on the forum and reddit, where people do talk about the game going pay to win and trying to make suggestion how should GGG fix it (including bigger streamers). It is at the moment a little lost in the uproar because of the labyrinth problems, but it's very hot topic the moment GGG announce this crap.
Everyone has the right to be upset the moment GGG or any other developer implement any pay to win mechanic, and it doesnt matter did you pay a dime or not or is a game free to play or not. Implementing paywalls and pay to win crap no matter is the game sold or free is a bad fucking thing.
Post by: Aklyon on March 07, 2016, 06:09:15 pm
For a game that has not charged a single dime for access, for you to now be upset because you have to shell out for a premium stash tab (fuck even I've bought them at this point) so you can get indexed trading...They even have consistant sales on the stash tabs every two weeks or so, which makes them even cheaper to get.
Suffice to say, 99% of their playerbase isn't going to give a shit and I'm not sure why anyone else should. If you've clocked even a fraction of time in PoE that I have and you still haven't spent a dime on it, you don't have the right to be upset. At all. I don't play competitively nor give a shit about any upper level gameplay. But after hundreds of hours, I felt like GGG earned their $20 or whatever completely affordable price they put on a non-essential part of the game.
And miljan, the reddit gets in an uproar about anything, thats what subreddits do. Do try not to get 'majority of the community' and 'loudest shouting people' mixed up. And most of the uproar wasn't even about the stash tabs. It was worry about whether poe.trade would continue indexing shop threads (The answer was yes) when the new api is rather simpler to look through according to the exiletools dev. The rest of it is just complaints that ggg didn't turn one tab of everyone's into a premium tab for free, and while I saw one good argument for that (free advertising on what the premium tabs do), its mostly just people complaining about not getting free stuff in their free game when they already were able to use (less convenient, but no less free or effective) 3rd party tools for the exact same thing. You can keep shouting about nonexistant trade paywalls all you want, it doesn't make them more real.
Post by: nenjin on March 07, 2016, 06:30:35 pm
You're mad because their in-house system is going to require a paid feature so your life can be more convenient. There's still 3rd party web sites and tools that will do the job, for free.
GGG is one of the few F2P dev house that I think has truly struck by their "pay only if you want to" mantra. That they're in effect monetizing an add-on to the game by requiring it uses a piece of paid content is not out of line for a company that has given their entire game away for free for YEARS. I can appreciate people who are deep into trading feel like this is impinging on them, but if it is, it's doing it in just about the fairest way possible.
And seriously, if you've played the game enough to care to that point and you still haven't shelled out even a single additional stash tab...maybe kick them some money for once and suddenly, your problem has become a non-issue.
Post by: miljan on March 07, 2016, 06:41:22 pm
Post by: nenjin on March 07, 2016, 07:06:40 pm
Post by: aristabulus on March 07, 2016, 07:30:55 pm
Quote from: GGG-Jonathon
...(bold emphasis mine)
For quite some time now, users have relied on third party tools to create posts of their stash tabs in the Path of Exile trade forums. There were always a few problems with this approach, though.
The first is that it wasn't that user-friendly. Downloading a third-party application that you need to give your login credentials to rightly sets off alarm bells for many people. A lot more users just didn't find out about these tools or were not willing to put in the effort to use them.
The second is that it was really inefficient. The trade forums were never designed to be scraped by indexers, nor updated that frequently. As more and more users have been using that system we have been running into more and more scaling issues.
...
So the changes (as they relate to back-end) were meant to relieve pressure on the forums because of all the scraping; more data harvesting will go through the API, which has to be more efficient than loading innumerable forum threads just to check for changes.
From there, it is also reasonable to consider how the changes might enable fraudulent behaviour, and the server load that might come with it. (GGG keeps pretty hush-hush about what really happens in those trenches, but the little mentions infer that they are swift and merciless in dealing with shenanigans) Making the public tab thing not-available to churn-and-burn accounts nips the problem in the bud before it has a chance to flower.
Lastly...
Quote from: Ari's handpainted sign
Please do not feed the troll(s)
-----
On other notes... I got a Tabula Rasa from Cadiro, 80-something coin. Any ideas on what I should do with it? I'm not sure I want to splice it into my bog-standard lazy ranger build I'm playing right now.
Post by: Aklyon on March 07, 2016, 07:56:05 pm
Post by: aristabulus on March 07, 2016, 09:12:50 pm
Aside from 'make a character for it?' I could repay you for that in coins if you're feeling up to trading it instead, ari.
Yeah, the "make a character for it" was (supposed to be) implicit... but I'm not sure I have room in my brain to fiddle with a totally new-to-me build. Maybe a witch+elementalist? She could plan around the lack of stats from the body armour more easily, I think. I'd consider loaning the Tabula Rasa, but until one of us finds another (plausible+affordable @ Cadiro), I would like it back eventually.
Hell, I'm not really feeling my lazy ranger either, but it's a tolerable "I cannot brain anymore, but I'm not sleepy" time-filler.
So ready to be done with school. >_<
Post by: Aklyon on March 11, 2016, 06:35:36 pm
Quote
Izaro has been adjusted to be easier in Normal Difficulty. His life has been reduced by 20%. Izaro's Ground Slam and Radiant Slash now deal 10% less damage. The life of Gargoyles, Idols, Portals (Thresholds), Essences, Fonts and Lieutenants has been reduced by 20%. The Goddess of Justice's Mortar Barrage has been reduced by 20% damage, and she no longer uses Teleport. These changes only apply to Normal difficulty.The important bits of the patch. (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1612488)
Enabled the Perandus Manor map. This map can be sold by Cadiro in Tier 5 and above maps for 2500 coins. We hope you enjoy exploring its secrets!
Perandus Guardians that are revived will provide experience when slain for a second time. They stop granting experience when they've been revived two times.
Post by: kcwong on March 12, 2016, 12:27:45 pm
QuoteIzaro has been adjusted to be easier in Normal Difficulty. His life has been reduced by 20%. Izaro's Ground Slam and Radiant Slash now deal 10% less damage. The life of Gargoyles, Idols, Portals (Thresholds), Essences, Fonts and Lieutenants has been reduced by 20%. The Goddess of Justice's Mortar Barrage has been reduced by 20% damage, and she no longer uses Teleport. These changes only apply to Normal difficulty.The important bits of the patch. (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1612488)
Enabled the Perandus Manor map. This map can be sold by Cadiro in Tier 5 and above maps for 2500 coins. We hope you enjoy exploring its secrets!
Perandus Guardians that are revived will provide experience when slain for a second time. They stop granting experience when they've been revived two times.
I only ran the normal labyrinth once on my level 78 cyclone marauder. Trying to learn Izaro's mechanism this way is futile - he didn't do anything to me before dying.
What I did learn is labyrinth can be extremely dangerous for ES/CI characters. I ran into a long patch of floor spikes, it led me around for more than two screens, a long corridor at first, then zig-zag with those lever-knifes on the left, obstacles on the right, ending with some those gears-on-rails.
As life/regen based I tanked 4 hits easily with potions; a ES/CI would be dead for sure.
Post by: Aklyon on March 12, 2016, 12:49:11 pm
I haven't had an ci characters, but I also haven't had to use a flask more than once in the labyrinth itself rather than while fighting izaro (I also have not tried the cruel lab yet). When in doubt, quicksilver flask or lightning warp into a safer area.
Post by: boki on March 12, 2016, 02:19:06 pm
Post by: Aklyon on March 12, 2016, 02:22:19 pm
Post by: boki on March 12, 2016, 02:28:36 pm
Aren't you the person who bots things? I don't see why you'd be interested in a game you stopped following.I stopped booting some time ago as the population died out, so it was not worth anymore to run them. You don't see a reason why would I ask a question for a game that I stopped following. WTF? I asked because of it, duhh. If I was following it I would not ask as I would know the answer.....
Post by: Aklyon on March 12, 2016, 02:35:41 pm
You certainly can still do one skill if you want, as long as you don't include auras or heralds or curses or golems or trigger gems. All of those are pretty common and I'd consider as a second conglomerate skill, or you can do both and have a second skill for aoe, etc.
Post by: boki on March 12, 2016, 02:45:54 pm
Post by: Aklyon on March 12, 2016, 02:55:19 pm
Post by: boki on March 12, 2016, 03:06:43 pm
Post by: Rex_Nex on March 12, 2016, 03:14:12 pm
Post by: nenjin on March 12, 2016, 06:07:53 pm
His first form managed to one shot me with 50% damage mitigation, possibly more, and 3800 effective health.
Still I made level 80 in about 7 hours last night. Pretty happy about that.
Over all the game in Level 70 areas seems easier than the last time I played it. I'm face rolling virtually everything except bosses and most of them have given me no troubles (going to try a Dunes run to test the theory, because that boss has always been a bastard.) I'm taking way less damage because life leech seems to be dealing with 90% of it. I haven't met a Rogue Exile yet since the patch that has actually given me trouble. I didn't change my build much if at all after the Ascendancy reset other than to deal with the changes in nodes. Right now I'd say leveling at around 80 is the easiest and safest I've seen it in a long time.
Post by: TherosPherae on March 13, 2016, 04:05:14 am
Speaking of build diversity?Out of curiosity, why Templar with Hierophant over, say, a Trickster or Assassin Shadow (or a Scion, or a Ranger, or hell maybe even a Duelist) with an Iron Commander (http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Iron_Commander)? Stack dex, get the same totem-swarm, but with (probably) less fiddling.
Siege Ballista.
Templar.
Hierophant.
Ancestral Bond.
Four goddamn siege ballistas spewing chunky crit death. Romira's Banquet to build power charges with incinerate, Marylene's Fallacy for 240% crit strike multiplier. Ballistas always pierce, so Drillnock in quiver. Rat's Nest for headgear? Why not! No bow nodes for templar? Watch as three Lioneye's Falls change that! This build is grade-A bullshit and everything that's wrong with stupid builds, but holy crap it's the best thing, and it's supported by good ol' Perandus making expensive uniques accessible.
Admittedly, I'm weak (as always) on life nodes and punching up resistances is difficult because I have so many uniques (how do you say no to a perfect Aurseize?), but it works, of all things, it works and I'm clearing low-tier maps at level seventy. Eventually I need to replace Infractem (decent flat damage at level 53 or whatever it was) with some GG Harbinger Bow or maybe Chin Sol/Lioneye's Bow, but it's getting by. I dunno. It's a gear build for certain and there are things that work a lot better, I will not contest that. That it can be done is not proof that it should be done, but by it all, I've done it.
Oh, and since we're talking build diversity, I have two separate Templars going right now. Both use Storm Call + Orb of Storms, but otherwise their ascendancies make them vary wildly - one's a Hierophant who's going to rock a boatload of damage redirection to mana with Mind over Matter, Divine Guidance, and an Aylardex; the other's a crit-based Inquisitor who doesn't give a shit about your resistances. And they're both more or less working, at least for now, although the former is still very much in the leveling stages.
Post by: cerapa on March 13, 2016, 07:31:15 am
Marylene's Fallacy for 240% crit strike multiplier.
Marylene's fallacy is terrible dude. It has 40% less crit chance. As in, less not reduced. If you would normally have 100% crit, then with Marylene's you would have 60%. And that 40% that doesn't crit is even worse because it only deals 40% damage. The crit mult and culling strike does not make up for that.
Post by: Rex_Nex on March 13, 2016, 07:35:52 pm
Post by: nenjin on March 14, 2016, 11:32:42 am
All was going swimmingly until I decided to try Phantasmorgia without reading up on it first. Saw a Tormented Spirit out of the corner of my eye, proceeded toward him, then realized he possessed the Map boss. Death was instantaneous. I tried a couple more times just to be sure and because I really wanted the extra loot, but the damage he did was too insane. I was feeling bad about myself until I read up on Map Running and realized he's tuned way, way, way too high for his map tier.
My only regret is that I don't have more time in my day to do something other than run Maps. But after installing a loot filter and farming up about 20 maps, I'm happy as a clam and am looking forward to finally pushing through the 80s.
Post by: Sinistar on March 19, 2016, 05:59:19 pm
Dieing is another thing I can't decide on. On one hand, design of maps stays more or less the same, so you know what to expect and where to go, most of the time. But on the other hand, even with that knowledge you still have to invest more time than I'd like if you wanna get the keys and trinket. So resurrecting in town if you make one deadly mistake makes the whole experience a bit of a chore.
And Izario. Again, one one hand, I can appreciate a boss fight that makes your adrenaline flow. But on the other hand, I just can't shake the feeling that he is just a little bit cheap.
Then again, I have a nagging feeling my Scion build is just too glass cannon-y. But it's weird because, generally?, I have no problems with regular enemies or even bosses. But sometimes, I just get nuked by Perandus chests mobs. I don't remember dieing to regular mobs this league, but those guys? Lost count by now. Guess I have to invest in more evasion and/or life nodes? *shrug* Oh well, I am still having fun, for now.
Post by: nenjin on March 19, 2016, 06:08:49 pm
And chests are pretty much king of spike damage, at a time when few synergies are active. I basically don't open or re-roll the ones that freeze on opening, it can't be avoided and even on low end maps I still almost get ganked by them.
I'm currently on my way to 84 and still feeling pretty good. Going to invest in straight health and armor for the next few points then take another crack at Izaro Merciless. If I can get out of 1-shot territory I think I can beat him, eventually. I dunno I've read people beating him at like 74 but I don't think my reflexes or my internet are so finely tuned I can avoid instant death like that. I have to be able to stay alive while I whittle him down for minutes...after minutes...after minutes.
Does anyone know what % if any of his attacks are Chaos damage? Wiki is still pretty incomplete on hard details about the fight.
Post by: Rex_Nex on March 19, 2016, 08:20:25 pm
You gotta be careful though, one of his attacks is a windup into a ranged wavebeam. It can easily do 4.5k damage if you get unlucky. It doesn't look like chaos (it's probably phys), but it's something to keep in mind. It's probably going to be safer for you than it was for me since I was evasion, but then it's probably going to take you like five times longer to beat the fight if your char is the kind that needs to whittle things down.
Post by: nenjin on March 19, 2016, 09:38:30 pm
I know my HP is pretty low for face tanking so I'm going to be focusing on that. I also have gotten this far without taking my non-uniques very seriously and I know there's a ton of room to improve there. So I have plenty to do for the future. I already got Gladiator unlocked so I'm not in a huge rush for the last two Ascendancy points.
Post by: Sinistar on March 20, 2016, 03:01:43 am
Life Leech build? I find it causes me to vastly overestimate my actual tankiness. Sure I face tank hordes of guys and bosses. But spike damage? That just comes down to raw HP at the end of the day. Even with 50% physical reduction, up to like 62%, spell damage added on usually takes it way over the top.Actually no, no life leech what so ever, if you ignore any random "+x HP on enemy killed" I get occasionally on weapons. And if you don't count life gain on hit gem I have on my primary skill, frost blades. So yeah, I think I have to re-think my build. It's probably a good indicator to take a step back when your own DPS is higher than your HP. Well, at least that's something new to me.
And chests are pretty much king of spike damage, at a time when few synergies are active. I basically don't open or re-roll the ones that freeze on opening, it can't be avoided and even on low end maps I still almost get ganked by them.
As for chests - I can take normal, that is, non-Perandus one totally fine. I've got one decoy totem to support me and it works pretty nice. But Perandus? It happened to me in few fights I was doing ok-ish, putting down totem, kitting and whittling the guardians down, but one small misstep and I was nuked. Like, 1s nuked. :\
But as I said, this was kind of a wake up call that my build might be lacking. I think for the last 10 or so levels I was focused too much on getting +cold damage nodes and not nearly enough pure dex. Thinking now, maybe I should go just for pure +physical damage nodes, but that cold damage ring on the top of the tree was just to tempting. We'll see.
In my thoughts about the labyrinth I forgot to mention one thing though - I'd be lying if, for all the trouble it gave me, I wasn't compensated. Loot, damn. Even without beating Izaro, even without cleaning maps clear and going just for obvious caches and rare monsters, it still feels like rare output is significantly higher than normal (is it? DIdn't read patch notes, as usual). I can fill my inventory full with yellow before even reaching the trial. Recently, I got this (http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Queen%27s_Decree). I like it. No way to use it, currently, but that makes a 3rd or so item I have in my inventory right now that gives this or another bonus to minions. Maybe I should finally roll a summoner char...
Post by: Sinistar on March 29, 2016, 01:13:51 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/ztcv3ml.jpg)
It would have looked good on my Duelist. Eventually, at least, when the league ended. Speaking of Perandus league, I'm still raging occasionally at Perandus chests minions damage, Armok almighty I did Kaom without dieing OR even teleporting, with some difficulty but it was satisfying, but that "in-debt poacher" chest guardian? Man, she can 2-3 shot my Scion like it's nothing. And she did, multiple times. Granted, Kaom vs. that thing might not be a fair comparison what with all the different fight dynamics but I'd be really interested to hear how much DPS that poacher is supposed to be doing.
Also, guess Labyrinth is actually easier if you do it with a properly equipped and leveled char. Ran it few days ago with mentioned Duelist and man did I face-tank Izaro like a champ. He IS lvl. 50 and that was fight on normal but still, I'm really satisfied with how he turned out. Hitting full elemental res even before finishing Act 3 and still going strong, currently ~50% damage reduction, good HP and nice DPS... It's only current weakness is his DPS is aoe focused, while it does it job perfectly fine, I did fail Elreon's mission that had me destroy 5 or 6 (or was it 8??) corrupted relics and I managed only 4. Need heavy strike or something.
Also, turns out I really should have started reading patch notes. I thought you fight Izaro 3 times total, that is, one Aspirant's trial is one fight and that's it. If only. Good thing I didn't manage to beat him with my Scion, I would not be able to go through that punishment for 3 times in a row.:P
Also also, currency stash tab is now a thing. (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1629196) It's pretty neat.
Post by: nenjin on March 29, 2016, 01:31:43 pm
Holy shit. 15 Skeletons, 10 Zombies, 1 Chaos Golem and 4 Spectres on steroids.
And THEN you dump Vaal Summon Skeletons in for a total of 60! minions, each with at least +100% Life and Damage, and the Spectres at probably 200% for both. Add in a good Spectre mob with an all party buff (I like the Apes that give Frenzy charges, and the Hairy Bonecrushers that give themselves Endurance charges) and you have a nigh unstoppable army. Exploding for Fire damage and leaving a Caustic Cloud on death are the icing on an already delicious murder cake.
Fucking. Destroyed. Cruel and Merciless. Bosses disappear in a mass of minions and are stripped of their HP. Unique bosses? Pfha. Dominus? Didn't even see him, I kept him off screen while I nuked anything that came near me and the minions did all the work. Piety Human Form? Downed in 7 seconds.
Compared to playing a Melee character this shit is so easy. Sure I'm still a cupcake. Brutus dropped me in a second flat with those ground spikes. Kaom was a pain in the ass, I died several times. I had to do the Cruel Trial of Ascendancy about 4 times because Izaro kept killing me.
But compared to a 20+ minute hack-a-thon against bosses while playing melee, always under threat of being one-shot due to crits or lag, this is paradise. Almost makes me want to abandon my Scion as my main because honestly my Witch could probably clear higher levels maps that she can (Witch is 70, Scion is 85) in a fraction of the time.
It's like...I was playing late one night and realized I had completely spaced off thinking about something else for almost half the dungeon. I've never had that experience in PoE because inattention leads to you losing experience in Merciless. But the game is so easy playing as her that my mind is free to wander.
Post by: Sinistar on March 29, 2016, 01:56:42 pm
One thing I've found out though. I found myself lacking some direct damage skill that would support my zombie force, so at the beginning I was using fireball... Until I tried Summon Raging Spirit. I was told a while ago this skill is apparently *sunglasses* all the rage these days. Anyways, didn't pay much attention but boy oh BOY. This shit is intense. I'm pretty sure I downed Brutus in 4-5 seconds. It's enough to make me seriously consider making a new char centered just around SRS.
Try it, I dare you.
Post by: nenjin on March 29, 2016, 02:11:44 pm
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Plus Queen's Decree helps me with rocking that sweet tiny girl with big sword image I wanted to do for a while now.
I'll admit that, that daydream? It was about a kawaii desu~ web comic featuring the witch with a too-big animu sword riding Ghost Bears and having conversations with Ghost Apes, while all her skeletons and zombies stand around in the background looking derpy or reacting to what she does. I've never been a web comic guy or much of an animoo devotee but....well, I went there in my head for a solid 20 minutes before I remembered I'm playing PoE on Merciless.
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/nenjin - Link to her shizz.
Post by: Aklyon on March 29, 2016, 02:21:19 pm
Post by: nenjin on March 29, 2016, 02:32:01 pm
Between the challenge of the game, the still abysmal fidelity of movement skills and ridiculously overtuned bosses, melee is simply a chore to play. It's an entertaining! chore, because you're literally a couple seconds away from dying pretty much all the time so winning tough fights without dying feels good. But to be able to play PoE in Merciless without the constant threat of getting one-shotted, or not having to divide your time 9:1 between avoiding damage and dealing it, makes it feel like an entirely different game.
That said, it's pretty obvious the difficulty and experience curves changed massively after Awakening.
Post by: miljan on March 29, 2016, 03:15:28 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCUFHpat08
Post by: Sinistar on March 29, 2016, 03:28:20 pm
I'll admit that, that daydream? It was about a kawaii desu~ web comic featuring the witch with a too-big animu sword riding Ghost Bears and having conversations with Ghost Apes, while all her skeletons and zombies stand around in the background looking derpy or reacting to what she does. I've never been a web comic guy or much of an animoo devotee but....well, I went there in my head for a solid 20 minutes before I remembered I'm playing PoE on Merciless.Feel free to share the link to that comic.(http://i.imgur.com/kv7dN9l.gif)
That said, it's pretty obvious the difficulty and experience curves changed massively after Awakening.Also, as someone obviously less familiar with the game, I am quite interested about that. Do explain, if you feel like it. :)
Rant/Opinion on Currency and Public Stash Tabs: Path of Exile 2.2Been waiting for something like that. I'll check it tomorrow thought.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCUFHpat08
Post by: nenjin on March 29, 2016, 04:17:01 pm
Pre-Awakening, the XP differential was a lot steeper. (Being that there were only 3 acts to the main game instead of 4 now.)
So like, you'd do a 68 Map as a level 72 character and make.....like maybe half a bar. Now, I'm doing 68 maps at 85 and still making about that. And it only goes up from there. So if I do a 74 or 75 map, I'm making several bars of XP per run. Compared to Pre-Awakening, one death doing an easy map could set you back an entire day worth of effort. Now, at least sub-90, you lose an hour or two at most. Does wonders for your willingness to keep grinding at higher levels.
Secondly, enemies just seem a lot easier. That could be due to Ascendancy classes, reworked life leech or half a dozen other changes since before Awakening....but I noticed it immediately on logging in for my first run at Ascendancy. I was flattening map bosses with little risk compared to the last time I played.
Of course there's still plenty out there that will wreck your shit. But it seems like easy bosses and mob packs aren't as threatening as they used to be. As a standard scrub, it's never been easier to level at 80+ than it is now, at least from my point of view.
Post by: Rex_Nex on March 29, 2016, 04:35:26 pm
The only thing that was nerfed was farming extremely underleveled zones. Previously it was almost more efficient for an extremely high level char to level up to 100 in tier 1 maps than it was in mid or high tier maps, just because of how fast, safe, and cheaply they could do low tier zones. After Ascendency they dropped the minimum xp by half, so it's never more efficient to run zones that give you next to no xp.
Post by: Retropunch on March 29, 2016, 04:43:41 pm
Secondly, enemies just seem a lot easier. That could be due to Ascendancy classes, reworked life leech or half a dozen other changes since before Awakening....but I noticed it immediately on logging in for my first run at Ascendancy. I was flattening map bosses with little risk compared to the last time I played.
I've just come back to this after a really long time (way before Ascendancy) and it's so, so much easier. I think it mainly seems to be enemy life (or my damage) that's had a major overhaul, as I never really seemed to be able to just obliterate tons of enemies in one hit.
Quick question - do curses (or marks) stack?
Post by: nenjin on March 29, 2016, 04:57:51 pm
Rant/Opinion on Currency and Public Stash Tabs: Path of Exile 2.2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCUFHpat08
His argument is predicated on only a couple points:
-Trading is an advantage that everyone should partake in.
-Currency tabs and premium public tabs are QoL features that everyone needs because it facilitates trading.
My response would be:
-I've played the entire game, 300+ hours, without trading except once to get a gem before gem vendors were a thing. It's not a requirement. It helps, but it's not required.
-I've played this long without ever amassing more than 200 of any one currency. I imagine people that aren't 24/7 playing PoE take a while before they have so much currency they'd need a tab for it. True, once you hit the endgame in merciless, it's not unusual to spend hundreds and hundreds of different currencies on a single item to get the best possible results, and so a currency tab starts making a lot more sense. But I think that's for a minority of the player base who either a) play to that point or b) get so invested they're willing to dump all their currency into making the perfect item.
So basically I don't see it as a problem. The people who seem the most upset about it are, strangely, not the newest players or the lower level ones but the uber veterans who basically already have everything in great quantities and are worried on behalf of the rest of the playerbase. Personally by the time I'd hit the merciless end game I'd spent so much time with PoE I didn't mind spending to get QoL features.
When they put better hit detection or movement abilities actually activating the first time you click them instead of the 3rd, 4th or 10th time, behind a paywall then I'll get salty about paying for QoL features. For trading and making it convenient to store shit loads of currency, it simply isn't that relevant to how I play PoE for me to care.
Post by: miljan on March 29, 2016, 05:35:12 pm
Rant/Opinion on Currency and Public Stash Tabs: Path of Exile 2.2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dCUFHpat08
His argument is predicated on only a couple points:
-Trading is an advantage that everyone should partake in.
-Currency tabs and premium public tabs are QoL features that everyone needs because it facilitates trading.
My response would be:
-I've played the entire game, 300+ hours, without trading except once to get a gem before gem vendors were a thing. It's not a requirement. It helps, but it's not required.
-I've played this long without ever amassing more than 200 of any one currency. I imagine people that aren't 24/7 playing PoE take a while before they have so much currency they'd need a tab for it. True, once you hit the endgame in merciless, it's not unusual to spend hundreds and hundreds of different currencies on a single item to get the best possible results, and so a currency tab starts making a lot more sense. But I think that's for a minority of the player base who either a) play to that point or b) get so invested they're willing to dump all their currency into making the perfect item.
So basically I don't see it as a problem. The people who seem the most upset about it are, strangely, not the newest players or the lower level ones but the uber veterans who basically already have everything in great quantities and are worried on behalf of the rest of the playerbase. Personally by the time I'd hit the merciless end game I'd spent so much time with PoE I didn't mind spending to get QoL features.
When they put better hit detection or movement abilities actually activating the first time you click them instead of the 3rd, 4th or 10th time, behind a paywall then I'll get salty about paying for QoL features. For trading and making it convenient to store shit loads of currency, it simply isn't that relevant to how I play PoE for me to care.
Nothing wrong that you dont have problems with it, and that you are ready to invest a lot more time in farming to get at the same point where people that trade and use the tools that the game is designed and balanced around get to. But, you being ok with how you play doesnt make this less of a problem. You can play the most pay to win crap out there, and be ok with it, its still doesnt make it any better. The video is very good in pointing that GGG should not put QoL improvements behind a paywall, that are also indirectly pay to have benefit in this game. This are very worrying signs and first steps in wrong direction. I am surprised that they didn't put loot filter also behind a pay wall (knowing what they are doing now). Really not good. Hope this will be the last thing we see from them, but I somewhat doubt it.
Post by: nenjin on March 29, 2016, 05:52:15 pm
Be worried about the slippery slope, that's also fine and normal. But acting as though when the game went from 99% F2P to 95% F2P, it suddenly became P2W. That's disingenuous. They're not selling items for cash. They're not selling experience boosters. In the subset of players who trade their asses off to get the best gear for leagues, it's a game changer. For the average PoE player I don't think it is.
And then there's the guy that bought 90 fucking stash tabs and then balks that suddenly something actually worth the money (what he said he wants rather than $42 suits of armor) arrives and he's complaining because it's something worthwhile that has to be paid for?
In terms of QoL features within the context of PoE, this is minor. It benefits all players to have it, but it doesn't benefit all players equally. You and I will clearly disagree on what's part of PoE's core gameplay. Trading to me is not. To you it is. For me, this isn't adding some new feature that will change the lives of all players. For you it is.
Post by: nenjin on March 29, 2016, 11:57:27 pm
The end of Act 4 is just seriously balls. I've been taking a friend through the game, trying to get him into it. He was shell shocked after the Malacai fight, even on normal. Died 12 times (while I didn't die at all.) I'm pretty sure he won't be playing again any time soon. He was pretty much at a loss for words after the fight ended. I can't really blame him, I've been there.
Post by: Retropunch on March 30, 2016, 02:09:24 am
Nothing wrong that you dont have problems with it, and that you are ready to invest a lot more time in farming to get at the same point where people that trade and use the tools that the game is designed and balanced around get to. But, you being ok with how you play doesnt make this less of a problem. You can play the most pay to win crap out there, and be ok with it, its still doesnt make it any better. The video is very good in pointing that GGG should not put QoL improvements behind a paywall, that are also indirectly pay to have benefit in this game. This are very worrying signs and first steps in wrong direction. I am surprised that they didn't put loot filter also behind a pay wall (knowing what they are doing now). Really not good. Hope this will be the last thing we see from them, but I somewhat doubt it.
It's literally the smallest possible QoL improvement that you 100% can do without if you don't want to pay, and the fact that PoE is such an incredible and free experience means that I really can't fault them.
Sure, it could be a slippery slope, but this has no real impact on the game. I don't think PoE was 'designed or balanced around' having convenient tabs, it's just one of those things that helps if you want to have it. You can't win more by having more tabs.
Post by: miljan on March 30, 2016, 04:43:09 am
But it's not pay to win. It's "pay to win faster." Pain removal for cash is part of every single F2P out there, and PoE has only really caught up on that front.
Call it how every you want, but its paying with real money for in game benefit. Do you consider that pay to win or not, it's on you. I know there are people that consider things like exp boosts and item selling (if you can get them also in game ) not pay to win. And PoE becoming worse and getting on same level like other f2p games is not a thing to be proud of or to defend.
Be worried about the slippery slope, that's also fine and normal. But acting as though when the game went from 99% F2P to 95% F2P, it suddenly became P2W. That's disingenuous. They're not selling items for cash. They're not selling experience boosters. In the subset of players who trade their asses off to get the best gear for leagues, it's a game changer. For the average PoE player I don't think it is.
This is actually like selling items for cash and exp boosts for cash, but just indirectly. Person that pays money will have a lot easier time during trade and getting more currency (it was even talked about it in the video). With that currency you can get better items, and at the same time get faster exp compared to the person that doesnt pay for this benefits. This is a problem,. and its getting worse.
And then there's the guy that bought 90 fucking stash tabs and then balks that suddenly something actually worth the money (what he said he wants rather than $42 suits of armor) arrives and he's complaining because it's something worthwhile that has to be paid for?Normally that he is complaining about it. GGG can also start to directly sell items for cash, so people should not complain about that also that there is something worth to buy? I mean wtf man, you are trying here to defend GGG selling in game benefits for real cash and people complaining about it, because there is at least something worth buying ? And no matter how small you perceive them they are, or how shitty the other f2p games are(so PoE is catching up), it doesnt make this in anyway good.
In terms of QoL features within the context of PoE, this is minor. It benefits all players to have it, but it doesn't benefit all players equally. You and I will clearly disagree on what's part of PoE's core gameplay. Trading to me is not. To you it is. For me, this isn't adding some new feature that will change the lives of all players. For you it is.The problem with this is how developer made the game, and they themselves said its core part of the game and the most important part of POE, the economy (i guess you know better than them whats is core part or what not). You can limit your self not using the things how the game was designed and balanced, hack you can add additional limitation like use only blue items and similar if you find it fun, but the fact is, GGG designed the game and balanced it around you trading. Again, you can play the game however you want, its important that you have fun, but how you play, and how the game is designed and balanced are two different things.
Post by: nenjin on March 30, 2016, 10:25:34 am
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I know there are people that consider things like exp boosts and item selling (if you can get them also in game ) not pay to win.
Yeah, that's like Warframe. It treads the line for me. But since it's fair and balanced getting resources and what not (just grindy) it balances out.
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And PoE becoming worse and getting on same level like other f2p games is not a thing to be proud of or to defend.
Says the guy that has not yet paid a dime for PoE. You must be one of those guys who thinks F2P games must be 1000% all free, no charges or it's a scam.
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This is actually like selling items for cash and exp boosts for cash, but just indirectly. Person that pays money will have a lot easier time during trade and getting more currency (it was even talked about it in the video).
Yeah, I watched it. The trade obsessed guy says that more tabs = more winning. It's winning faster. He even said that in the video. It's not a binary "win/don't win." If you're so freaking obsessed about PoE and leagues that winning faster just equals winning, I don't know what to tell you, other than to maybe go outside and get some fresh air.
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With that currency you can get better items, and at the same time get faster exp compared to the person that doesnt pay for this benefits. This is a problem,. and its getting worse.
Because OMG, some guy is going to win the race league before you! SO UNFAIR BECAUSE HE HAS MORE CURRENCY SO HE TRADES MORE. Do you even see how that chain of logic is so specific to high-end PoE players that most of the player base won't, and don't, give a shit?
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I mean wtf man, you are trying here to defend GGG selling in game benefits for real cash and people complaining about it, because there is at least something worth buying ?
Dude, it's in his own words. "I'm sick of there being nothing but overpriced cosmetics to buy." Now he has something that isn't an overpriced cosmetic, and he's pissed because it costs money. You can't both have something "worth the money" that also isn't cosmetic. Anything that isn't cosmetic is an in-game benefit. Frankly, and I don't care how pro he is, he sounds like he's bitching just to bitch. He got exactly what he asked for and now he says it sucks. (But of course he already has the currency tab "because someone gifted it to me." Uh huh. The guy who bought 90 stash tabs was going to stand on principle for not getting a currency tab, but still got one anyways.) Stinks like BS to me.
I mean for FFS, stash tabs themselves are an in-game benefit. He "made his peace with that." Guess he's just going to have to "make his peace" with this too. This comes across as entitled fan bitching, draped in the guise of "Oh noes the slippery slopes of muh F2Ps."
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The problem with this is how developer made the game, and they themselves said its core part of the game and the most important part of POE, the economy (i guess you know better than them whats is core part or what not).
I don't. But I'm pretty sure the core part of the game is playing the game, not staring at poe.trade all day. As for whether they've said it's the most important part of PoE, I've never read that.
Post by: Aklyon on March 30, 2016, 10:38:38 am
Post by: miljan on March 30, 2016, 05:12:28 pm
Says the guy that has not yet paid a dime for PoE. You must be one of those guys who thinks F2P games must be 1000% all free, no charges or it's a scam.
Did someone payed or not, doesnt make his argument not correct or of less/bigger value. So yes I can say, as same as people that payed GGG are saying the same thing, like it or not. And i guess you dont have any arguments so the only thing you can post is this.
Yeah, I watched it. The trade obsessed guy says that more tabs = more winning. It's winning faster. He even said that in the video. It's not a binary "win/don't win." If you're so freaking obsessed about PoE and leagues that winning faster just equals winning, I don't know what to tell you, other than to maybe go outside and get some fresh air.
A game doesnt need to be binary win/dont win to be called pay to win. Not obsessed with anything, just posting facts. You on other hand to much obsessed with defending and trying to post crap like go out side. If you cant provide anything in your posts except troll like bates, than dont post. And also there is nothing that you can tell me, I am just explaining why POE is becoming worse and more pay to win.
Because OMG, some guy is going to win the race league before you! SO UNFAIR BECAUSE HE HAS MORE CURRENCY SO HE TRADES MORE. Do you even see how that chain of logic is so specific to high-end PoE players that most of the player base won't, and don't, give a shit?
Most player do give a shit, as it's obvious on the amount of post and problems about it on the forum, reddit, videos, including poe top streamers. Its good that you agree that this benefits do work as same as exp boosts and item selling. But again in your blind defend you are just posting nothing of value.
Dude, it's in his own words. "I'm sick of there being nothing but overpriced cosmetics to buy." Now he has something that isn't an overpriced cosmetic, and he's pissed because it costs money. You can't both have something "worth the money" that also isn't cosmetic. Anything that isn't cosmetic is an in-game benefit. Frankly, and I don't care how pro he is, he sounds like he's bitching just to bitch. He got exactly what he asked for and now he says it sucks. (But of course he already has the currency tab "because someone gifted it to me." Uh huh. The guy who bought 90 stash tabs was going to stand on principle for not getting a currency tab, but still got one anyways.) Stinks like BS to me.
I mean for FFS, stash tabs themselves are an in-game benefit. He "made his peace with that." Guess he's just going to have to "make his peace" with this too. This comes across as entitled fan bitching, draped in the guise of "Oh noes the slippery slopes of muh F2Ps."
He actually said that he would like to buy a set armor, but because it cost 40$ he does not consider it worth to buy as its to expensive. He is not pissed (it looks like you are more pissed trying to defend this with all caps lock letters and troll bates), he is just pointing out the problems with the implementation of this pay to have benefit and how its pay to win. So even the players that payed money and understands why this is not good and shares very similar thoughts and opinion on this like me. He didnt get what he was asking for (I suggest you to watch the video again as apparently you didn't understand it good if you got that conclusion), as he did not ask for pay to win and QoL behind a pay wall, but a better pricing for visual items, so they can be more worth the money. He comes as person that cares a lot more about the game than you, as he understands why this is bad and will not blindly defend things that are simply bad.
I don't. But I'm pretty sure the core part of the game is playing the game, not staring at poe.trade all day. As for whether they've said it's the most important part of PoE, I've never read that.GGG consider trading as playing the game if you didnt know.
There are more written posts about this and podcast where devs talk about it, but i would need more time to find them all. But this one was easy to find as I remember reading it back than:
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/55102
Quote
"Path of Exile’s economy is the most important element of the game to us"
A tip, less trying to defend something in ways like "go out side", you didnt pay so your opinion doesnt matter and similar crap, so you dont look like a blind fanboy. If you can not provide any counter argument to the point in the post, just say you disagree and move on.
Post by: Aklyon on March 30, 2016, 05:27:37 pm
If you can not provide any counter argument to the point in the post, just say you disagree and move on.The same could be said of you, who honestly has sounded like they've repeated the same thing repeatedly by now in defense of claiming p2w on anything GGG has done for trade improvements so far.
Post by: nenjin on March 30, 2016, 05:37:01 pm
Post by: miljan on March 30, 2016, 05:42:17 pm
No, it can not. I do not try to make opinions of others less important depending from did they pay or how much they payed, and especially don't post crap like go out more and similar. I provide information how and why the game is becoming more pay to win, with examples, including the video of people that can explain it a lot better.If you can not provide any counter argument to the point in the post, just say you disagree and move on.The same could be said of you, who honestly has sounded like they've repeated the same thing repeatedly by now in defense of claiming p2w on anything GGG has done for trade improvements so far.
Post by: nenjin on March 30, 2016, 10:19:16 pm
Did someone payed or not, doesnt make his argument not correct or of less/bigger value. So yes I can say, as same as people that payed GGG are saying the same thing, like it or not. And i guess you dont have any arguments so the only thing you can post is this.
I think it does, especially when you're going after the "justness" of the fees. I don't think people who don't intend to pay anything really have a stake in the conversation. You're complaining while also being non-contributing, and not even supporting the game. So yeah, compared to supporters, your opinion does mean less to me. If your opinions were sound, I wouldn't even be arguing with you. But they're not. They're buzzwords and butthurt, and you've not contributed yet to the game on top of it.
QuoteYeah, I watched it. The trade obsessed guy says that more tabs = more winning. It's winning faster. He even said that in the video. It's not a binary "win/don't win." If you're so freaking obsessed about PoE and leagues that winning faster just equals winning, I don't know what to tell you, other than to maybe go outside and get some fresh air.
A game doesnt need to be binary win/dont win to be called pay to win. Not obsessed with anything, just posting facts. You on other hand to much obsessed with defending and trying to post crap like go out side. If you cant provide anything in your posts except troll like bates, than dont post. And also there is nothing that you can tell me, I am just explaining why POE is becoming worse and more pay to win.
I say "go outside" because your objection to these things is completely out of proportion to what's been done. At which point I suggest going outside to get some perspective. As for me defending the game....I'm more defending it against you basically going to internet buzzwords to make your argument. P2W is easy to claim and it's totally subjective at this point. And PoE is, in the grand scheme of F2P games, the least P2W one out there by a long margin from what I've seen. Maybe you should factor that in before trying to tell me the "truth" from the mountain top. But instead you went "Nope! It's P2W and I'm not going to argue the point. Now agree with me that currency tabs are shit."
QuoteBecause OMG, some guy is going to win the race league before you! SO UNFAIR BECAUSE HE HAS MORE CURRENCY SO HE TRADES MORE. Do you even see how that chain of logic is so specific to high-end PoE players that most of the player base won't, and don't, give a shit?
Most player do give a shit, as it's obvious on the amount of post and problems about it on the forum, reddit, videos, including poe top streamers. Its good that you agree that this benefits do work as same as exp boosts and item selling. But again in your blind defend you are just posting nothing of value.
I've been reading the forums. I ain't seeing thread after thread about currency tabs. The PoE forums are full of salt, to boot, and using the forums as a basis for popular opinion has always been a mistake. We're both anecdotally assuming what the player base feels. But right now, if the entire playerbase were collectively losing their shit over it, I'd expect to see an explanation from GGG. I don't. I see more players continually complaining about Perandus and the Lab than I do about the trading situation (other than to say "About time" or "Nice fake Auction House GGG")or the currency stash tab. Maybe I don't know what to look for, but I know gaming forums well enough to know when the fanbase goes on the warpath. The PoE forums, that ain't.
Dude, it's in his own words. "I'm sick of there being nothing but overpriced cosmetics to buy." Now he has something that isn't an overpriced cosmetic, and he's pissed because it costs money. You can't both have something "worth the money" that also isn't cosmetic. Anything that isn't cosmetic is an in-game benefit. Frankly, and I don't care how pro he is, he sounds like he's bitching just to bitch. He got exactly what he asked for and now he says it sucks. (But of course he already has the currency tab "because someone gifted it to me." Uh huh. The guy who bought 90 stash tabs was going to stand on principle for not getting a currency tab, but still got one anyways.) Stinks like BS to me.
I mean for FFS, stash tabs themselves are an in-game benefit. He "made his peace with that." Guess he's just going to have to "make his peace" with this too. This comes across as entitled fan bitching, draped in the guise of "Oh noes the slippery slopes of muh F2Ps."
Quote
He actually said that he would like to buy a set armor, but because it cost 40$ he does not consider it worth to buy as its to expensive. He is not pissed (it looks like you are more pissed trying to defend this with all caps lock letters and troll bates), he is just pointing out the problems with the implementation of this pay to have benefit and how its pay to win. So even the players that payed money and understands why this is not good and shares very similar thoughts and opinion on this like me. He didnt get what he was asking for (I suggest you to watch the video again as apparently you didn't understand it good if you got that conclusion), as he did not ask for pay to win and QoL behind a pay wall, but a better pricing for visual items, so they can be more worth the money. He comes as person that cares a lot more about the game than you, as he understands why this is bad and will not blindly defend things that are simply bad.
Maybe you should watch the video again yourself. Because he was absolutely complaining about putting QoL behind a paywall, unless I'm misunderstanding what you wrote. But do go on telling me how wrong I am and "how much more he cares about the game than I do." For someone who acts like they don't care, you use the language of someone who is seriously butthurt about the game.
I don't. But I'm pretty sure the core part of the game is playing the game, not staring at poe.trade all day. As for whether they've said it's the most important part of PoE, I've never read that.
Quote
GGG consider trading as playing the game if you didnt know.
There are more written posts about this and podcast where devs talk about it, but i would need more time to find them all. But this one was easy to find as I remember reading it back than:
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/55102
Quote
"Path of Exile’s economy is the most important element of the game to us"
A tip, less trying to defend something in ways like "go out side", you didnt pay so your opinion doesnt matter and similar crap, so you dont look like a blind fanboy. If you can not provide any counter argument to the point in the post, just say you disagree and move on.
At least you provided a factual example this time. I stand corrected: GGG does consider trade the most important part of the game.
I still disagree with your overall take on it, but I'm not going to move on when you provide shit examples and one youtube video and say everyone else is wrong. You've got at least two people in the thread telling you you're being a twit about it. But maybe the whole world is just full of shit except for you, right? No way you're blowing this out of proportion, right? No way you and "all the pros who care about PoE so much" are just being overly butthurt, right? Even the guy on the video was level-headed enough to go "Let's assume GGG has a right to make profit." At least he wasn't accusing the game of going P2W, which is basically accusing the developers of being willful, greedy bastards. That's what I really object to. He's got fair points but, like I've seen saying, the highest end PoE players have a different experience than most people, are affected by this differently than most people, and are having a different reactions. His points are decent, but what mattered more to me is that he wasn't being a dick about them (up until the end when he got himself worked up.) And going "GGG is making their game P2W!111" is being a dick about it, to me. That's not fair to them and that's not fair to the game they've provided, to you, for free.
Whatever. Continue to be butthurt, and maybe quit, and I'll continue to enjoy the game as I have since closed beta. Might even buy a currency tab while I'm at it, because I actually support the game instead of just bitching and complaining about it. Might even start selling the three tabs worth of uniques I have sitting around for super cheap just so I can get rid of them. To me all these changes are nothing but advantages I don't feel the need to utilize right now.
The real reason I think GGG did things this way is: if they're going to put in a system where things can be automatically indexed and traded, they need to do something about bot nets and professional cash sellers. Since they don't have the power to actually stop them, the best they can do is earn their dollar on making it possible. Therefore, everything costs. You wanna run a bot net to sell PoE stuff? Well at least GGG is going to make the cost of a premium stash tabs and currency tabs off of it. It's not greed, it's a business reality for games like this. GGG has lots of controls for it already, but making those stash tabs publicly listed opens them up to a whole world of people abusing the system for their own ends. If they can't stop them (because farmers will pay whatever it takes to facilitate maximum trading, the costs do not scare them), the least they can do is profit some from it.
It sucks but that's life for F2P games.
Post by: Aklyon on April 01, 2016, 07:33:55 am
Post by: miljan on April 01, 2016, 05:33:57 pm
I think it does, especially when you're going after the "justness" of the fees. I don't think people who don't intend to pay anything really have a stake in the conversation. You're complaining while also being non-contributing, and not even supporting the game. So yeah, compared to supporters, your opinion does mean less to me. If your opinions were sound, I wouldn't even be arguing with you. But they're not. They're buzzwords and butthurt, and you've not contributed yet to the game on top of it.
I am not commenting "justness" of fees (did you eve read any of my posts at all?). Is something 100$ or 1$ i am not interested. People that dont have to pay anything do have a stake in the conversation. I mean you statment is so out of place, and says a lot about you. And anyone can post complain and problems the game has. Does he pay or not doesnt matter. Thankful people that also paid post same complaints. No buzzwords, just facts how the game works and the implementation of things.
P2W is not a subjective thing. It is defined from do you get benefits from paying real money compared to other people that don't. Yes this is F2P, and its not a excuse to have pay to win crap in it. And also fact is I do not complain about currency tabs. Complains are more about the trade system put behind a pay wall (I didnt post anything about currency tabs, so less assuming and more reading my posts), a system that is very important part of the game. Currency tabs are a lot less of a problems compared to trade stash tabs.
I say "go outside" because your objection to these things is completely out of proportion to what's been done. At which point I suggest going outside to get some perspective. As for me defending the game....I'm more defending it against you basically going to internet buzzwords to make your argument. P2W is easy to claim and it's totally subjective at this point. And PoE is, in the grand scheme of F2P games, the least P2W one out there by a long margin from what I've seen. Maybe you should factor that in before trying to tell me the "truth" from the mountain top. But instead you went "Nope! It's P2W and I'm not going to argue the point. Now agree with me that currency tabs are shit."
I've been reading the forums. I ain't seeing thread after thread about currency tabs. The PoE forums are full of salt, to boot, and using the forums as a basis for popular opinion has always been a mistake. We're both anecdotally assuming what the player base feels. But right now, if the entire playerbase were collectively losing their shit over it, I'd expect to see an explanation from GGG. I don't. I see more players continually complaining about Perandus and the Lab than I do about the trading situation (other than to say "About time" or "Nice fake Auction House GGG")or the currency stash tab. Maybe I don't know what to look for, but I know gaming forums well enough to know when the fanbase goes on the warpath. The PoE forums, that ain't.
No one here is talking about currency tabs, but trade tabs and mechanic put behind a pay wall, and forum was full of it when they announced it, and also popping often here and there, like few day ago when this video went live. We are assuming, but my assumption are at least based on the response of the community, both forum and popular streamers, while you on nothing. And also Poe forum are representation of the community, as same as streamers, reedit and similar. All of them are representation of the community. Trying to say it's not is just incorrect. And what community thinks is directly presented on the forums and other medias where players express their concerns.
Maybe you should watch the video again yourself. Because he was absolutely complaining about putting QoL behind a paywall, unless I'm misunderstanding what you wrote. But do go on telling me how wrong I am and "how much more he cares about the game than I do." For someone who acts like they don't care, you use the language of someone who is seriously butthurt about the game.
Yes he did complain about putting basic mechanics behind a pay wall. And that's what I said in my post. You even quote it here. "as he did not ask for pay to win and QoL behind a pay wall, but a better pricing for visual items" Not sure what you dont understand. I never said i don't care about the game (again wild assumptions), as apparently I got interested in the game after starting to comment on this thread..
At least you provided a factual example this time. I stand corrected: GGG does consider trade the most important part of the game.
I still disagree with your overall take on it, but I'm not going to move on when you provide shit examples and one youtube video and say everyone else is wrong. You've got at least two people in the thread telling you you're being a twit about it. But maybe the whole world is just full of shit except for you, right? No way you're blowing this out of proportion, right? No way you and "all the pros who care about PoE so much" are just being overly butthurt, right? Even the guy on the video was level-headed enough to go "Let's assume GGG has a right to make profit." At least he wasn't accusing the game of going P2W, which is basically accusing the developers of being willful, greedy bastards. That's what I really object to. He's got fair points but, like I've seen saying, the highest end PoE players have a different experience than most people, are affected by this differently than most people, and are having a different reactions. His points are decent, but what mattered more to me is that he wasn't being a dick about them (up until the end when he got himself worked up.) And going "GGG is making their game P2W!111" is being a dick about it, to me. That's not fair to them and that's not fair to the game they've provided, to you, for free.
Whatever. Continue to be butthurt, and maybe quit, and I'll continue to enjoy the game as I have since closed beta. Might even buy a currency tab while I'm at it, because I actually support the game instead of just bitching and complaining about it. Might even start selling the three tabs worth of uniques I have sitting around for super cheap just so I can get rid of them. To me all these changes are nothing but advantages I don't feel the need to utilize right now.
The real reason I think GGG did things this way is: if they're going to put in a system where things can be automatically indexed and traded, they need to do something about bot nets and professional cash sellers. Since they don't have the power to actually stop them, the best they can do is earn their dollar on making it possible. Therefore, everything costs. You wanna run a bot net to sell PoE stuff? Well at least GGG is going to make the cost of a premium stash tabs and currency tabs off of it. It's not greed, it's a business reality for games like this. GGG has lots of controls for it already, but making those stash tabs publicly listed opens them up to a whole world of people abusing the system for their own ends. If they can't stop them (because farmers will pay whatever it takes to facilitate maximum trading, the costs do not scare them), the least they can do is profit some from it.
It sucks but that's life for F2P games.
I proven factual examples in most of my post, you just dont like them so ignore them. Anyway again wild assumption of comparing two posts on this forum for whole world. Less troll bates and illogical reasoning. There was a uproar of the community when they released the paid stash tab changes. If the game is going in worse direction and more pay to win, no matter who the developer is and no matter is a game free to play, they should be called out on it. Please if you want to continue commenting be sure to read my post, and dont assume things in I guess lack of arguments.
The only good argument you made is about the bot thing so far. Anyway keep playing the game, not sure why you need to post about it and what you will buy, I guess you are too insecure in all this. But again you are acting like a very standard POE fanboy, and this post just confirms that.
Hey miljan. Happy April (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1638061) ;D
The sad thing is, I can expect GGG to implement crap like that in the game, as how much they focus on the economy part of the game.
Post by: ragnar119 on April 01, 2016, 05:47:42 pm
Post by: nenjin on April 01, 2016, 06:18:15 pm
Quote
I am not commenting "justness" of fees (did you eve read any of my posts at all?). Is something 100$ or 1$ i am not interested. People that dont have to pay anything do have a stake in the conversation. I mean you statment is so out of place, and says a lot about you. And anyone can post complain and problems the game has. Does he pay or not doesnt matter. Thankful people that also paid post same complaints. No buzzwords, just facts how the game works and the implementation of things
You can post and complain all you want. But I still believe your opinion carries less weight than actual supporters. Because you could disappear from the game as a non-contributor and it would have net zero effect on the game. The same can't be said for supporters whose contributions actually keep the game running.
If your opinions were sound instead of just reactionary, I wouldn't care if you pay or not. But just labeling it P2W when you have in fact paid zero is absurd. There are people like you in every F2P game, who want it all for free and object to anything which costs money, even cosmetics. Public stash tabs are a benefit to me, as a paying supporter. Why should I care what you think when you pay nothing and then endlessly complain and accuse the devs of being greedy? What is your stake in the game? At least a large number of players can say they care because they paid. You care because....you've gotten this far without paying a dime and you're terrified you actually may have to in the future? Boohoo, said everyone who has a job. Are you incapable of paying because of where you live? That I might understand. But if this is simply no one is going to watch your trade spam or use the "refuses to pay for public stash tab" website because virtually the whole playerbase moved on to something better....nope, not really feeling sorry for you or agreeing that the game is sliding inexorably toward P2W.
Quote
P2W is not a subjective thing. It is defined from do you get benefits from paying real money compared to other people that don't. Yes this is F2P, and its not a excuse to have pay to win crap in it. And also fact is I do not complain about currency tabs. Complains are more about the trade system put behind a pay wall (I didnt post anything about currency tabs, so less assuming and more reading my posts), a system that is very important part of the game. Currency tabs are a lot less of a problems compared to trade stash tabs.
Yes, it is subjective, because I haven't paid to win yet. It's especially not P2W to many people who actually have money and are willing to spend it to support the game. And even if I had paid nothing, I'd still not consider it P2W. I may be just some casual scrub in PoE but I doubt I'm alone in thinking this is, of all the things they could do, minor. And as I pointed out, maybe even necessary so GGG doesn't shoot themselves in the foot giving players what they asked for: better, easier trading. But there's no room for nuance when you just go "Game's going more P2W, GG GGG, I expect nothing less of you." Then you're just acting like an entitled brat.
The entire argument around trading reminds me of the same kind of complaints around mapping. People go "omg you can't sustain past Tier 11 mapping so broken." My response is..."So you farm some lower level maps or buy some Zana maps until you refill your pool. Big fucking deal." Much the same way top players go "omg if you don't trade you'll get nowhere ever" and I've gotten plenty of places in the game without trading a damn thing.
P2W is entirely in the eyes of the beholder. What matters is how much of the player base feels that way about it and quits playing because of it. Got some player numbers to show me.....?
Quote
We are assuming, but my assumption are at least based on the response of the community, both forum and popular streamers, while you on nothing. And also Poe forum are representation of the community, as same as streamers, reedit and similar. All of them are representation of the community. Trying to say it's not is just incorrect. And what community thinks is directly presented on the forums and other medias where players express their concerns.
And I guess someone that isn't a top PoE player or streamer or a name on Reddit isn't also part of the community? What about the part of community that thinks "the elites" are being giant babies about the whole thing? Oh I guess we don't count because we don't stream. Believe it or not, forums are not the most representative of any game's community. You act as though no one actually is ok with these changes, and there are plenty who are. Enough that I doubt anything will change and you won't even get an explanation from GGG because they don't think the 1% are truly representative of all the community either. Time will tell. Actually it already has. Their April Fool's joke says they're comfortable enough with what they did they can joke about it. (Hint: the joke is at your expense.)
Quote
Yes he did complain about putting basic mechanics behind a pay wall. And that's what I said in my post. You even quote it here. "as he did not ask for pay to win and QoL behind a pay wall, but a better pricing for visual items" Not sure what you dont understand. I never said i don't care about the game (again wild assumptions), as apparently I got interested in the game after starting to comment on this thread..
Yeah, just like I only now started seeing "elite" PoE players blow their tops about stuff, and not like I've been watching it happen year after year on the forums. Or like when I was seeing it 20 years ago when "elite" MMO guild personalities would fly off the handle when Everquest or WoW changed something. Outrage is nothing new. That's what players do; get outraged. At least back in the MMO days they actually had to pay for the right to just talk shit about the game they supposedly like. I'm not saying a dev can't be greedy, can't do something fatally stupid to their game. I've seen plenty of it. I just don't see it with PoE. Freaking out at them for finding a new revenue source that is this minor isn't fair. But you don't care about fair it seems.
When they start selling Exalts and Chaos for cash let me know, I'll grab a torch too. Or maybe not. Because I already play plenty of F2P games that sell damn near half the game in addition to letting you play for it and that shit doesn't really bother me either as long as I don't *need* to buy it. To me your "PoE is going P2W" is just kind of laughable.
If it means anything I wholeheartedly agree with you on one point: if they'd cut prices on cosmetics they'd make boatloads more money. That is the one thing about PoE's monetization of the game I've never understood.
Quote
I proven factual examples in most of my post, you just dont like them so ignore them.
You've presented two facts. That is a quote from GGG supporting what you said about the importance of trading to game, and identifying some top players who have problems with it. The rest is you stating an opinion and then telling me it's a fact. So no, I don't have to accept them because none of them are facts.
When you start showing me GGG graphs of falling player counts, falling purchases, absurd broken economies brought on public stash tabs (to the point a player like me would care), then I'll laud your facts and adjust my argument. There's nothing factual to respond to in much of what you said other than "GGG said this thing one time" and "some big names in PoE don't like it." Am I missing anything?
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There was a uproar of the community when they released the paid stash tab changes. If the game is going in worse direction and more pay to win, no matter who the developer is and no matter is a game free to play, they should be called out on it. Please if you want to continue commenting be sure to read my post, and dont assume things in I guess lack of arguments.
If you want to keep discussing this, quit trying to shove your interpretation of reality down my throat as fact. It's not. I can totally agree that we just disagree about what is P2W, how PoE needs to be played, whatever. But if you're just going to dig your heels in and assert that you know what reality is and I'm just blind and ignorant, don't bother. It ain't worth my time to read or your time to write.
Quote
Anyway keep playing the game, not sure why you need to post about it and what you will buy, I guess you are too insecure in all this. But again you are acting like a very standard POE fanboy, and this post just confirms that.
Well, thanks for finally tipping your hand. We're all just "scrubs" because we don't get "the truth" that "the elites on Youtube and reddit" do. Might want to go back and re-read your attitude about opinions and paying for the game, because you're essentially telling me my opinion and the opinions of standard players don't count, or count less, because we're not elite. Enjoy your hypocrisy.
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The sad thing is, I can expect GGG to implement crap like that in the game, as how much they focus on the economy part of the game.
Lol, you can't even take an April Fool's joke gracefully. Damn you're so salty.
Post by: Aklyon on April 01, 2016, 06:51:47 pm
P2W is entirely in the eyes of the beholder. What matters is how much of the player base feels that way about it and quits playing because of it. Got some player numbers to show me.....?As much as its interesting to read this big argument thats gone on, it all comes down to this in the end. Bring some stats or shush, miljan.
Post by: Sinistar on April 17, 2016, 02:19:43 am
Anyways, so I've been thinking about making ranger character... and I'm really interested in taking Pathfinder as an Ascendancy class later on. But the same thing that interests me also bugs me greatly - how to make this whole play-style around flasks even work?
If I understand the whole system correctly, some flask buffs only last while you are drinking them/recovering life or mana. So for instance using a life flask with "gains 20% attack speed while flask is active" buff would be most sensible when low on life so the buff stay as long as possible... Which leads me it would be better if I use mana flasks with a mana-hungry skill if I want to really capitalize on that effect, right? Or switch to blood magic or something.
At the same time, while skill should be power hungry, it should have great wave-clear so I can fill my flasks back up again as soon as possible... I need to strike some perfect balance between mana consumption vs. mana-from-flask regen. Flasks with slower recovery speed affix?
This may all seem as pretty obvious to some but I always play so I have as little mana related problems as possible so with this play-style I'm really threading a new grounds. Maybe I'm just over-thinking stuff? So my question is what would any of you people suggest for this. Which skill(s)? Ranged or melee? Some (non-ascendancy) skill nodes I should be specifically mindful of?
Post by: Aklyon on April 17, 2016, 08:30:47 am
Post by: TherosPherae on April 17, 2016, 01:02:40 pm
I don't know how you'd work it as a ranger, but if you need a mana-hungry skill, theres always dom blow.Dear lord don't play dom blow. It got dumped on in a recent patch, and it's still buggy when it comes to Bloodlines monsters. It'll just get you killed in the most frustrating ways.
Instead, just use utility flasks like Jade or Stibnite if you want to keep your buffs up. They only expire when their duration is finished, so you can keep stuff like Nature's Adrenaline and Master Herbalist up fairly consistently by just using those.
Post by: Aklyon on April 17, 2016, 01:08:55 pm
And if it was actually buggy with bloodlines monsters, they would've fixed it by now, and there would'nt have been a pre-ascendancy build that used it with srs effectively, they've had it mentioned to them plenty no doubt. The answer is bring another skill with you instead and not play in hardcore like a sane person.
Post by: TherosPherae on April 17, 2016, 07:15:33 pm
I did perfectly fine using dom blow as a backup to earthquake and sunder in the current league up to 55 before being distracted by other stuff thank you, and I wasn't describing it as a primary skill. I was describing it as a mana-hungry skill, which is has always and continues to be.Oh, my bad, I thought you referring to using it as a primary skill.
And if it was actually buggy with bloodlines monsters, they would've fixed it by now, and there would'nt have been a pre-ascendancy build that used it with srs effectively, they've had it mentioned to them plenty no doubt. The answer is bring another skill with you instead and not play in hardcore like a sane person.
Post by: Aklyon on April 17, 2016, 07:16:15 pm
Post by: Damiac on April 18, 2016, 10:47:52 am
1. When POE was announced and the F2P nature was being explained and discussed, the devs clearly stated "Path of Exile will have only COSMETIC microtransactions.
2. Much of the population of POE exists because they believed those claims. If it was announced at the beginning that some QOL gameplay features would be behind a paywall, less people would have started playing (I wouldn't have). The population of the game is a big part of its success.
3. Free players are contributing to the item economy, and many participate in trading despite the problems with trading in the game. Free players very much have a stake in any conversations about features, if there weren't free players, it would be a very empty game.
4. POE costs money to run. Free players aren't contributing money to run it. However, free players joined knowing this was the case, and we were told by the devs that the people who like to buy cosmetic things for their characters would cover it.
I don't care much about whether it's 'right' or 'wrong', I just care about whether I like the direction stuff is moving in, and if I dislike it enough, I'll stop playing. I don't like that one thing was said originally "Cosmetic cash items only" and now it's "Also QOL stuff". Especially when more and more currencies get added to the game, and they're only allowed to be stacked in small quantities. But pay 7.50 for a tab so you don't have to juggle them anymore!
That's not cosmetic. That's not seeing the slippery slope in the distance. We're there, they broke their original promise, and we'd be foolish not to assume it's going to get broken further. You might say all we have to lose is this game itself, but that's not entirely true. If we accept that "No P2W" and "You can buy in-game advantages" and "You can only buy cosmetic items" are all the same thing, we won't know in the future whether we need to break out the wallet to properly play a "free" game.
TLDR do what you want with your game, just don't lie about it.
Post by: Arbinire on April 18, 2016, 05:06:42 pm
Post by: Damiac on April 19, 2016, 10:54:51 am
I like dwarf fortress
I like dungeon crawl
I like toribash
Post by: cerapa on April 19, 2016, 11:19:09 am
Post by: Aklyon on April 19, 2016, 11:24:56 am
Post by: Damiac on April 19, 2016, 11:52:14 am
Toribash allows you to spend money to buy cosmetic upgrades.
Here's how they claimed the F2P model would work in POE, directly from their about page: http://www.pathofexile.com/about/
Quote
Completely free to download and play. Supported by ethical microtransactions.You'll notice nothing in the list above has the words 'stash' or 'tab' or 'Quality of Life'. Being able to trade faster, having more slots to store things, having to spend less time screwing around re-arranging your stash are all gameplay advantages. Small, yes, but in a game with limited time leagues, being able to trade faster and collect more items clearly offers an advantage.
Path of Exile is completely free to play - no upfront costs or monthly fees are required to enjoy 100% of the game content.
To fund the development and maintenance costs of the project, we plan to let players purchase aesthetic perks for their characters such as:
Additional character animations (for example, taunts or PvP victory animations)
Dyes and item skins
Alternate spell effects
Social pets
We will also offer some optional paid services such as:
Inter-realm/inter-account character transfers
Character renaming
You’ll notice nothing in the list above confers an actual gameplay advantage.
So yes, they lied. It's a good game. It's worth the price! But clearly they've already departed from their initial promise they used to reel in players who were wary of supposedly free to play games. Lying is lying. Feel free to make your own decision about whether you consider it worthwhile, but don't claim they haven't broken their promise.
Post by: Retropunch on April 19, 2016, 12:48:50 pm
You'll notice nothing in the list above has the words 'stash' or 'tab' or 'Quality of Life'. Being able to trade faster, having more slots to store things, having to spend less time screwing around re-arranging your stash are all gameplay advantages. Small, yes, but in a game with limited time leagues, being able to trade faster and collect more items clearly offers an advantage.
So yes, they lied. It's a good game. It's worth the price! But clearly they've already departed from their initial promise they used to reel in players who were wary of supposedly free to play games. Lying is lying. Feel free to make your own decision about whether you consider it worthwhile, but don't claim they haven't broken their promise.
Answer me this, if I was to play against another player of the same level as me, who had the same items and had played for the same time as me, but who bought every single thing PoE sold, would they have an advantage over me?
I get what you're saying about that there is an advantage by being able to store more stuff and trade more quickly, but you can already store LOADS and create alt accounts if you really, really need it. The portion of players this meaningfully affects is also absolutely tiny. I also understand the worries of a slippery slope, but until it actually has a tangible affect it's not an issue.
Post by: ragnar119 on April 19, 2016, 01:28:26 pm
Yes, they would have a advantage. I can explain it why. Person that has 10 stash tabs and premium stash tabs will have a better time with selling items compared to someone that has only 4 stash tabs. You would need to make multiple accounts to use more stash tabs (and switch between them and also you can not sell items from different accounts if you are not logged in), and that takes time. Time that you could invest in grinding on the ladder or for items. Overall person that has more stash tabs can sell more, collect more crafting recipes and have a advantage with currency, items and time compared to player of same level and time investment that doesnt have more stash tabs, premium ones and similar.You'll notice nothing in the list above has the words 'stash' or 'tab' or 'Quality of Life'. Being able to trade faster, having more slots to store things, having to spend less time screwing around re-arranging your stash are all gameplay advantages. Small, yes, but in a game with limited time leagues, being able to trade faster and collect more items clearly offers an advantage.
So yes, they lied. It's a good game. It's worth the price! But clearly they've already departed from their initial promise they used to reel in players who were wary of supposedly free to play games. Lying is lying. Feel free to make your own decision about whether you consider it worthwhile, but don't claim they haven't broken their promise.
Answer me this, if I was to play against another player of the same level as me, who had the same items and had played for the same time as me, but who bought every single thing PoE sold, would they have an advantage over me?
I get what you're saying about that there is an advantage by being able to store more stuff and trade more quickly, but you can already store LOADS and create alt accounts if you really, really need it. The portion of players this meaningfully affects is also absolutely tiny. I also understand the worries of a slippery slope, but until it actually has a tangible affect it's not an issue.
I think there is no doubt that there is a advantage in buying stash tabs and premium stahs tabs. The thing is, you dont need this things to complete the game, and if you do not compete, this is really not a problem. For me personally the bigger problem is premium stash tabs, because they put trading improvements behind them. And I really dont like where they are going with that, as important mechanics in game are put behind a paid feature (note I do have premium stash tabs). Chris from GGG said that they know they are walking on edge of a sword, and are considering giving everyone premium stash tabs that you can unlock if you get to late game (so that they prevent massive boting of low level characters). I think its important that they do not sell game mechanics and features.
Post by: Aklyon on April 19, 2016, 01:32:09 pm
The thing is, you dont need this things to complete the game, and if you do not compete, this is really not a problem.Then why are we having this argument again. We've gone in circles on this point for many posts.
Post by: ragnar119 on April 19, 2016, 01:39:11 pm
The thing is, you dont need this things to complete the game, and if you do not compete, this is really not a problem.Then why are we having this argument again. We've gone in circles on this point for many posts.
Because in this specific case we talked here do this payed feature give benefit to the player or not. Not can you complete the game without it. Can you complete the game without paying and does paying give you benefits are two separate things. Being able to finish the game without paying doesnt mean the game is not offering in game benefits to paying customers (uhh hope I wrote this correct).
Post by: Damiac on April 19, 2016, 03:29:28 pm
Answer me this, if I was to play against another player of the same level as me, who had the same items and had played for the same time as me, but who bought every single thing PoE sold, would they have an advantage over me?Your question has made a fundamentally flawed assumption that skips over the actual problem. That other player who played for the same amount of time as you, but bought everything PoE sold (and took advantage of them) would be higher level, and have more (or at least better) items. Because every time he gets back to his stash he just dumps stuff into his infinite tabs, and you have to pick and choose what to keep and throw away. Because when he created his character he had every unique item any character of his ever found, so he could build faster, but you only have a small selection of building uniques to choose from. Because when he trades he can use those premium stash tabs to get it done faster, but you have to do it the slow way.
Saying it's not a problem if you don't compete is like saying Pay to Win isn't a problem unless you try to win. Well... yeah...
I'm not saying this to trash the game. It's the fake free to play model I'm trying to trash.
Post by: kcwong on April 20, 2016, 04:18:44 am
Answer me this, if I was to play against another player of the same level as me, who had the same items and had played for the same time as me, but who bought every single thing PoE sold, would they have an advantage over me?Your question has made a fundamentally flawed assumption that skips over the actual problem. That other player who played for the same amount of time as you, but bought everything PoE sold (and took advantage of them) would be higher level, and have more (or at least better) items. Because every time he gets back to his stash he just dumps stuff into his infinite tabs, and you have to pick and choose what to keep and throw away. Because when he created his character he had every unique item any character of his ever found, so he could build faster, but you only have a small selection of building uniques to choose from. Because when he trades he can use those premium stash tabs to get it done faster, but you have to do it the slow way.
Saying it's not a problem if you don't compete is like saying Pay to Win isn't a problem unless you try to win. Well... yeah...
I'm not saying this to trash the game. It's the fake free to play model I'm trying to trash.
Huh? It's just paying for convenience.
You can freely register any amount of accounts, by making new free email accounts. Each of those accounts will give you 4 pages of stash and inventory of 24 character by default. If you need storage place, you can have as many as you want if you put some effort into it.
If you want mules for orbs, you simply need to mule over a few low level unique items and rush those characters a bit so they can trade orbs.
GGG stated before that they allow two instances of PoE running on a single computer, as long as both of them are controlled by human. Alt-tab and some notes keeping (make a spreadsheet?), and you have infinite stash space.
The same goes for the indexing premium tabs; it's just a convenient way to let your items to be found by indexer. Without premium tabs you can do so with a shop thread or a 3rd-party tool (called Procurement, IIRC).
A company got to earn money, paying for bling and convenience, it's 100% fine by me.
Post by: Damiac on April 20, 2016, 09:19:03 am
I get that they have to earn money. Maybe the aesthetic upgrades only cash shop they assured us of couldn't have worked. But if they've gone from only allowing players to buy bling, to now allowing players to buy convenience, they've betrayed their original "ethical f2p" vision.
POE is a good game that's 95% free to play or so, in my opinion. When you play it for free though, you certainly feel the borders of the free experience, when one character running through a single difficulty already has a full stash, and I know if I just paid 10$ or so I wouldn't have to play re-arrange the stash every time I want to store something new. I know I'd be spending a higher % of my time doing something fun instead of something tedious. Managing an excel spreadsheet is boring stuff I do at work, if it made no difference nobody would pay for the easier way.
They don't owe me anything, but I don't want them parading around this idea that they have invented this ethical free to play model that only allows aesthetic upgrades to be purchased. That is untrue, they engage in "fun pain", just not to the same degree as Zynga. And every time a new type of collectible item is introduced, with a low stack size, you have to wonder, is this to make the game more fun, or is this to push people to buy more stash space?(It's probably mostly for fun, but the suspicion will always be there)
I suppose everyone has a place they draw the line. To me, allowing 24 characters per account, and allowing you to purchase more was technically not aesthetic, but jeez, who needs more than 24 character slots? So that didn't bother me at all. After all, they do have to store those characters somewhere. But to have artificially low limits on stackable currency, then introduce a $7.50 stash tab that allows them to suddenly stack up to 5000 per slot is just creating a problem, then selling the solution. If the low stack sizes were intended somehow as a balance mechanism, then you're allowing people to buy an advantage by bypassing that limit(P2W). If it wasn't a balance mechanism, then why was the stack size so low in the first place(Fun Pain)?
I am not attacking anyone for playing this game. I play it! If you enjoy it, great! It's the best allegedly free game I've ever seen, as I said, it's fair to say it's 95% free to play, it's just really unfortunate that the original claim has been broken. I hate the idea of the industry moving toward this model where I can't just pay once for a game, then I have the game and I know they've made it the best experience they can. So I'm going to call a spade a spade, and you might say "well it's really just a tiny little spade" and I'll agree with you.
Post by: nenjin on April 20, 2016, 10:28:54 am
I won't disagree though that they've effectively doubled down on it with the last couple updates. But IMO, PoE has always been 95% F2P and that's still a better margin than virtually any other F2P game I've played.
Post by: Aklyon on April 20, 2016, 10:44:09 am
When you play it for free though, you certainly feel the borders of the free experience, when one character running through a single difficulty already has a full stash, and I know if I just paid 10$ or so I wouldn't have to play re-arrange the stash every time I want to store something new.Why are you holding on to every single non-white you pick up, thats dumb. Even small things like 'don't pick up large weapons you aren't going to use' will make stash tabs go a lot further, since the vendors give you alt and transmute shards for most anything and for the rest, more wisdom scrolls are good. By the time you want to pick up everything for chaos recipes, you either have space because you've figured out how to not suck at inventory management, or you have extra tabs to put them in.
So I'm going to call a spade a spade, and you might say "well it's really just a tiny little spade" and I'll agree with you.Well, ok then. But you people better be finished with all the stash tab complaining now. Its not interesting to read, much less repeatedly argue about at this point. Go bother reddit about it if you want.
Post by: Damiac on April 20, 2016, 01:35:40 pm
Why are you holding on to every single non-white you pick up, thats dumb. Even small things like 'don't pick up large weapons you aren't going to use' will make stash tabs go a lot further, since the vendors give you alt and transmute shards for most anything and for the rest, more wisdom scrolls are good. By the time you want to pick up everything for chaos recipes, you either have space because you've figured out how to not suck at inventory management, or you have extra tabs to put them in.
I'm not. I'm holding on to map shards, currencies, uniques, 1 set of rares for chaos recipe, some skill gems, etc. I don't bother trying to make sets of rares with the same name, I don't generally try to get full sets of item types, because I don't have the space.
But a player who owns more tabs doesn't have to worry about that does he? He can set up more vendor recipes, and hoard everything that might ever be useful. What do you call that? Oh yeah, an advantage. How do you get that advantage? By playing the game well? Oh no, you pay. Please don't invent a strawman, and insinuate I'd have to be stupid to use up my 4 stash tabs. I don't keep half the stuff I might someday want, because I have limited space. Every time I could have used one of those items I didn't keep, that's a disadvantage I wouldn't have if I bought a bunch of tabs. I've already lost out on a LOT of currency I would have had with infinite stash space.
But you people better be finished with all the stash tab complaining now. Its not interesting to read, much less repeatedly argue about at this point. Go bother reddit about it if you want.
Well, this is the first time I've brought it up here, and once the conversation peters out, I don't intend on bringing it up again. It wouldn't have gone on this long except people are trying to redefine words like aesthetic, free, and advantage.
Now... back to the game. Is it just me, or is the tooltip DPS for ball lightning just not even close? It's like it assumes it will only hit once per cast or something. I know tooltip DPS isn't usually terribly accurate, but ball lightning in particular just seems wildly incorrect, it seems to do at least 15 times what the tooltip says.
Post by: kcwong on April 27, 2016, 08:02:45 am
I hope GGG would consider more tabs like that... e.g. for cards and white maps. The map tab should have a scroll bar and visually show you how the maps upgrade.
Post by: Sinistar on April 30, 2016, 02:22:36 am
use utility flasks like Jade or Stibnite if you want to keep your buffs up.*facepalm*
Of course. So obvious. And here I was musing about using life/mana flasks.
Pathfinder-This helps too, thanks. I'm not the one to bother too much about trading for uniques or having a unique-centered build but who knows, maybe one day I'll dabble in that.
So as to not bump this thread just for the sake of replying to post I should reply to ages ago, here's a question - is it just me or is the sound in PoE ever since last few big patches a bit off in some cases? Specifically, when you create a new character, there's a guy in the background jelling at you ("Attention prisoners!...") and he used to sound, like, hundred times louder. Normal, NPC-speech like. Nowadays I really have to listen carefully to catch what he's saying. I'm guessing this is intentional, something that happened during last few patches when they also added a few extra dialogues to him (because I don't remember him saying different stuff before, but that could just be me)?
But what also bothers me I can't hear for shit your characters dialogue/taunt whenever you kill Malachai. So I'm starting to wonder if this is the game or if the problems are actually on my end, even though all the other sounds seem ok?
Post by: aristabulus on April 30, 2016, 06:31:02 am
...
But what also bothers me I can't hear for shit your characters dialogue/taunt whenever you kill Malachai. So I'm starting to wonder if this is the game or if the problems are actually on my end, even though all the other sounds seem ok?
In the sound options, there is a separate slider for dialogue. You should fiddle with that and do some tests before you go searching for a malfunction.
Post by: Aklyon on May 19, 2016, 07:01:45 pm
Quote
In this update, we're also streamlining the Trials of Ascendancy so that you only have to complete them once on each difficulty level per league.But yeah. Two extra ascendancy points if you beat map-laby Izaro. That'll probably make some things more OP.
Post by: ragnar119 on May 20, 2016, 07:06:06 am
The new league looks ok. Shame that the lab will stay the same, and they didnt change it. Fucking hate that part of the game, so will probably skip this league and see will they fix it for the next expansion.
Post by: ragnar119 on May 20, 2016, 03:49:48 pm
I'unno man, what's so bad about the league? For all purposes, the game was balanced without ascendancies in mind- you could do okay even without. The trials are being streamlined, and it doesn't even hurt to get a rush through the lab or to do it later than you need to.
It might still suck if you're an ES character, but I think that's being addressed pretty hard. You really don't have to spend a lot of time in it, and it'd be a shame to pass on the entire league just because it's still there.
Nothing bad about the league. Really like both the old one and the new one. The thing that is bad for me is the lab and that they put the core new part of character customization behind it. As was said by chris they will be balancing the game around it in future, and its already getting some balance passes for the expansion because with the ascendancies some build become very broken, so they will be nerfing some of the mechanics and skills.
Trials are same, you still need to do them all. It only matter if you play with more character per league, and as I play one character per league it still sucks, as still need to do them every new league. But the worst part is the lab, and the trap gameplay that I can not stand. Including the problems that you can not leave the zone, even if you want to sell items. I need to invest around 30 to 50 min to finish the lab from one go. Hack even stopped playing HC because of it.
I can try to ignore the lab, but than, it will be very hard to try out the build I would like to play, so in a way I need to do this part of the game few times, and it just burnes me out, as that part is really not fun to me :(.
Post by: Rex_Nex on May 20, 2016, 04:47:14 pm
As for Prophecy, it looks fine. It's like Perandus meets Darkshrine, which will be interesting. It's not going to blow my socks off, but I don't think GGG has ever made a league that has. At least it looks far more fun than Talisman, which was the most boring league I've yet played. On the other hand, I think the league combined with the general game improvements (dat performance, dose ascendancy classes, etc.) will keep my attention.
Post by: nenjin on May 20, 2016, 06:51:25 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 11, 2016, 04:03:17 pm
Prophecy is gonna stick around as a core game mechanic. (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1710256/page/1#p13554846) Like the others, its not going to be as common as it was in league. The people who
Mention in another post of largest-size hideouts being able to hold all of the masters.
Some new uniques. (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1708836)
New mods (or level of mod) on items. (http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1709716) Like that helmet with reduced mana reservation on it.
Post by: Kanil on August 11, 2016, 04:16:24 pm
The people who don't play challenge leagues and just stick around in standard for some reason ...
It takes some of us more than 3 months to see some of the game's content. 6 links would be a myth if I didn't play standard. Atziri too. Level 8 masters. Tier 4 lab. Etc.
Post by: Aklyon on August 11, 2016, 04:21:27 pm
Post by: Sordid on August 11, 2016, 07:18:56 pm
The people who don't play challenge leagues and just stick around in standard for some reason ...
It takes some of us more than 3 months to see some of the game's content. 6 links would be a myth if I didn't play standard. Atziri too. Level 8 masters. Tier 4 lab. Etc.
Not to mention that challenge leagues are basically beta tests of new features, which means those features are often imbalanced and always shoved into your face at every opportunity. Remember Invasion? Yeah, invasion bosses in every zone. With ridiculously overpowered abilities. In a hardcore league. What a great idea that was. Hmmm, I wonder why I don't play those... ::)
Post by: nenjin on August 11, 2016, 07:57:39 pm
I like PoE but I don't really like the amount of time it wants. I'm still, delusional I know, trying to level my main to max, just so I can see what the most I can get out of the build is. I do that in fits and starts when I decide I'm up for a little abuse and RAEG in my gaming. Sorta like deciding to play Dark Souls. Otherwise, leveling characters adnauseam even with items granted and what not just doesn't appeal to me. I get to come back to PoE every 6 months or so, play out the content that has piled up, get a little obsessed, eke out a couple levels and then go play something else.
Post by: Aklyon on August 11, 2016, 09:31:37 pm
And reminds me that my main is now actually quite a bit lower level than one of my newer characters. I should change that at some point.
Post by: Kanil on August 11, 2016, 10:24:46 pm
Post by: nenjin on August 11, 2016, 10:39:38 pm
Post by: Sordid on August 11, 2016, 10:48:15 pm
I like PoE but I don't really like the amount of time it wants.
Same. That's actually the reason why I've taken a very long hiatus from this game. I'm basically waiting for the devs to pull their heads out of their asses, realize that people have other things to do, and make respecing your skill points unlimited or at least an order of magnitude or two cheaper.
Post by: nenjin on August 11, 2016, 10:52:26 pm
I like PoE but I don't really like the amount of time it wants.
Same. That's actually the reason why I've taken a very long hiatus from this game. I'm basically waiting for the devs to pull their heads out of their asses, realize that people have other things to do, and make respecing your skill points unlimited or at least an order of magnitude or two cheaper.
Yeah that's a huge barrier to entry for a friend of mine too. He could get into it, but he hates that he's locked into sub-optimal build decisions as he's still learning the game. Play enough and it's not a problem (a respec always comes along) but he says that's not reliable enough for him to put serious time into the game. Can't honestly blame him. I probably had 40 hours in the game and three characters before I even began to have a clue.
Post by: Aklyon on August 11, 2016, 10:55:28 pm
Some of us might be slightly bitter about GGG repeatedly throwing content away. :PWould this happen to be related to talismans? :)
Post by: Sordid on August 11, 2016, 10:56:52 pm
Yeah that's a huge barrier to entry for a friend of mine too. He could get into it, but he hates that he's locked into sub-optimal build decisions as he's still learning the game. Play enough and it's not a problem (a respec always comes along) but he says that's not reliable enough for him to put serious time into the game. Can't honestly blame him. I probably had 40 hours in the game and three characters before I even began to have a clue.
Yep, all true. And it's not just suboptimal builds. Even if my build is good, I might want to try a radically different one later. I don't want to have to level a whole new character, though, and respecing eighty skill points is a bit pricey even for a long-time player.
Post by: Aklyon on August 12, 2016, 01:28:46 am
Practically you might as well just make a new character in that time unless you're taking a break, even tho its annoying. Especially with ascendancy points that cost multiple regrets each to respec.
Post by: Aklyon on August 12, 2016, 04:31:48 pm
Sounds neat, and the challenge league sounds crafty and full of interesting rares.
Post by: ragnar119 on August 12, 2016, 06:00:39 pm
Post by: Rex_Nex on August 12, 2016, 07:16:08 pm
The mechanics and expanded map pool that go along with it, on the other hand, is a very nice addition. Thirty new map layouts is a lot, and the ability to change the tier of the maps you get (even if only in the atlas) expands that even more. From what I can tell the new maps' generation algorithm works with varying heights, too, which makes the new map layouts visually much different from the old flat ones.
The league looks boring as sin, although we have even less info on that. I'm not much of a crafter, and being able to add a few powerful (but ultimately generic) mods to my equipment sounds like a joke of a league mechanic to me. That said, I heard some other people are interested, and it's not like we know all the details yet. Maybe the process to get those crafting essences is more involved and interesting than killing a random pack. I just doubt it. GGG usually release boring leagues alongside expansions so that people don't get overwhelmed.
Post by: TherosPherae on August 12, 2016, 11:42:34 pm
Hard to tell so far; details of how the atlas works are kinda vague. I'm sort of getting the feeling the atlas itself is not very interesting - from what I can tell, you just run the maps it tells you to & the boss in that map will have a high chance of dropping the next map in the chain. Once you hit the center you have a high chance of dropping a map containing one of the four minibosses, which I assume each drop 1/4 of the key needed to reach the main boss - good ol' davy jones. Despite all the theatrics, at the end of the day it's basically just "run maps in this order and you will get more map drops & a boss fight", which I dont think would keep me very interested.There's a bit more to it than that. There's also new endgame item bases which only drop in certain sections of the atlas; in one of the previews, Chris mentions that the Bone Helmet will only drop in maps that are in the 'graveyard' section of the atlas - I presume that the other high-end bases that have been shown off, like the Steel Ring and the EV/AR belt, will have similar restrictions.
Personally, I'm excited to (eventually) run a complete clusterfuck map with 8 corrupted mods, a bunch of extra mods from throwing currency at the atlas on top of that, and then a +5 level upgrade on top of that just in case everything wasn't enough of a mess already. Not sure how I feel about the upcoming league - it looks interesting from a crafting standpoint, but I don't know how much interest it'll generate since it seems from what I've seen so far that most of the interaction is locked to just using the crafting essences you get from the fight, rather than something like Ambush where you could throw currency at the boxes beforehand to reap more rewards afterwards.
Post by: ragnar119 on August 13, 2016, 08:00:02 am
The new league is just same as any other, again random special mobs like in talisman/perandus that you kill to get a new crafting item, that is nothing special, and again gamble. And the ones that are interesting will probably again be very hard to get They should have focused on improving the master crafting, than adding more option to gamble and crap to fill inventory .
I am guessing they couldnt do anything interesting this time, because they are focusing on act 5, and will probably wait for it release to go back to the game again. Even though i didnt like the labyrinth part of last mini expansion, as I hate the trap and more arcade style of gameplay and the need to to it 4 times for every character to unlock the classes fully, at least that addition was really new content, with new area, new boss with interesting mechanic and most importantly the new classes.
Post by: TherosPherae on August 15, 2016, 05:11:20 pm
Post by: nenjin on August 16, 2016, 01:40:18 am
Post by: Aklyon on August 16, 2016, 10:19:07 am
so I made a thing. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIe2XWhr1fE)Well, I guess I should take another look at mines. They didn't seem this good before.
Post by: kcwong on August 20, 2016, 05:25:31 am
so I made a thing. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIe2XWhr1fE)Well, I guess I should take another look at mines. They didn't seem this good before.
Very interesting!
The build is expensive though, needing two Essence Worm to keep the damage up and other pieces to make up for the lost resistances in the ring slots.
Post by: TherosPherae on August 20, 2016, 03:04:14 pm
It's... a bit expensive, yeah. I tinkered with a phys bow version in Prophecy, but haven't gotten it to quite the same level of capability (only have 5Ls lying around in Prophecy right now).so I made a thing. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIe2XWhr1fE)Well, I guess I should take another look at mines. They didn't seem this good before.
Very interesting!
The build is expensive though, needing two Essence Worm to keep the damage up and other pieces to make up for the lost resistances in the ring slots.
Post by: kcwong on August 30, 2016, 11:57:10 pm
It's... a bit expensive, yeah. I tinkered with a phys bow version in Prophecy, but haven't gotten it to quite the same level of capability (only have 5Ls lying around in Prophecy right now).so I made a thing. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIe2XWhr1fE)Well, I guess I should take another look at mines. They didn't seem this good before.
Very interesting!
The build is expensive though, needing two Essence Worm to keep the damage up and other pieces to make up for the lost resistances in the ring slots.
And now your build is ruined for single target... you can no longer bounce kinetic blast off your frost walls. :/
Quote
Frost Walls created by you or your allies are now no longer considered enemies for the purposes of projectile collision detection (your projectiles will not collide with your own Frost Wall). This intentionally fixes the exploit case where a player stacks many Frost Walls around a boss and uses a skill like Piercing Lightning Arrow to trigger an excessive amount of hits.
Post by: Aklyon on August 31, 2016, 12:10:54 am
Post by: TherosPherae on August 31, 2016, 01:27:16 am
Yep. Oh well, I've stupid builds aplenty planned for the next league.It's... a bit expensive, yeah. I tinkered with a phys bow version in Prophecy, but haven't gotten it to quite the same level of capability (only have 5Ls lying around in Prophecy right now).so I made a thing. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIe2XWhr1fE)Well, I guess I should take another look at mines. They didn't seem this good before.
Very interesting!
The build is expensive though, needing two Essence Worm to keep the damage up and other pieces to make up for the lost resistances in the ring slots.
And now your build is ruined for single target... you can no longer bounce kinetic blast off your frost walls. :/QuoteFrost Walls created by you or your allies are now no longer considered enemies for the purposes of projectile collision detection (your projectiles will not collide with your own Frost Wall). This intentionally fixes the exploit case where a player stacks many Frost Walls around a boss and uses a skill like Piercing Lightning Arrow to trigger an excessive amount of hits.
Post by: Rex_Nex on August 31, 2016, 04:44:21 am
Another skill I want to try is rolling flames fireball, but I need to look around to see whether its cheap enough to make sense as a league starter. Also have no clue what ascendancy to use since Elementalist got nerfed.
Post by: Aklyon on August 31, 2016, 07:23:46 am
Post by: Aklyon on September 08, 2016, 04:39:10 pm
As in, they now understand how to let go. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOy4bUXGAek)
Post by: Rex_Nex on September 08, 2016, 04:51:04 pm
Trying out essence drain + contagion instead. Having to cast two spells per pack (or every few packs, depending on how far it spreads) does limit its clearspeed, but otherwise it feels really powerful. I think the only thing that'll bug me is having rares drop items behind me & having to walk back if I want it.
Post by: Aklyon on September 08, 2016, 05:07:55 pm
Post by: Aklyon on September 08, 2016, 07:47:49 pm
Post by: Rex_Nex on September 10, 2016, 01:41:33 pm
Post by: kcwong on September 15, 2016, 07:03:42 am
One day we may have traps hiding under ice/burning ground/loads of particle effects. You will move and suddenly stop, wondering if you just lagged or did you got hit by a trap you simply cannot see, and before you realize your HP/ES has melted away because it's percentage damage per second.
Post by: Aklyon on September 15, 2016, 08:39:29 am
Post by: Rex_Nex on September 16, 2016, 11:51:57 am
Post by: nenjin on September 16, 2016, 12:09:23 pm
Post by: Rex_Nex on September 16, 2016, 12:20:41 pm
Some of Elreon's quests are fine, it's just that the "defend the relic" quest without the one-minute timer takes ages and the soul-feeding one is annoying to complete. I don't think either Elreon or Vorici really compare to how bad Catarina's are, though. They just seem badly executed (well, honestly, every master mission is...) - Catarina goes out of her way to be unfun in a way that seems almost intentional.
Post by: Aklyon on September 16, 2016, 06:38:40 pm
Fuck him and his randomly-impossible-for-your-build missions despite having the most useful bench.
Because for fucks sake man, you've seen what I did when i was running up to you, don't give me a precision assasination when I was clearly blowing everything the fuck up with flameblast on my way in. Its not going to end successfully and you'll sound pissed when it doesn't and give me no points.
Post by: Kanil on September 16, 2016, 07:25:47 pm
Post by: TherosPherae on September 17, 2016, 01:47:10 am
Cat herding is bad, but not as bad as Haku's back when desync was a thing. That seemed like it was intentionally made to fuck with the player.Also his good ol' 'rocks fall, everyone dies' missions that I'm pretty sure have been patched out at this point. May they rot in hell.
Post by: ragnar119 on September 17, 2016, 06:22:41 am
Post by: Rex_Nex on September 17, 2016, 02:29:13 pm
Like the new end game map layouts, especially as they are a lot more, how to say it 3d, on different layers. But they managed to make map progression worse than it was before. Even the buff to drops didnt help that much in one of the updates, especially as it's much more limiting than before.
Tell me about it. I currently have a stash tab full of white maps with nothing yellow or higher. I can't even sustain T1 maps long enough to get the T2s on the lines I need them for, let alone the T8/9 maps that a character my level should be farming in.
I think they need to cut the bonus from the atlas progression by 30-50% and increase map drop rates by that same amount. It feels miserable trying to sustain before you have 60+ maps completed on the atlas.
Post by: frostshotgg on October 17, 2016, 12:51:54 am
As far as atlas progression is compared to how it was before, I think it's a huge improvement. I've had no trouble staying in red maps once I got there, and I had a fairly smooth progression up to that point. If you try to run it SSF, you're going to have a horrible time if you miss a corner or two until Zana restocks enough to bail you out, but that's what trading is for. At this point, a chisel can buy you most regular maps up to tier 9 or 10. I've been hovering around tier 12 and 13, mostly because I've been farming 10-12s for xp. I've run a couple Chimeras but failed on them because I was missing a couple important uniques.
Post by: nenjin on October 17, 2016, 10:07:01 am
So when I accept that XP will always be shit and just run T1 and T2 maps, I end up building a pretty good cache of T3+ maps. I think you can sustain if you're willing to grind. Expecting to do Map Tier X once and get the next tier of map to keep going is a recipe for disappointment.
Also, an aside, fuck Labyrinth trials. Started getting the Uber Labyrinth trials and the fucking flame one is just bullshit. "Oh hey there, please run through a 1-tile wide serpentine corridor before the flames start up. Oh and enjoy never ending waves of respawns that clog the corridor, asshole."
Swear to God I've hit 90% EXP at level 85 like 3 times now before something fucking dumb ends up killing me.
Post by: frostshotgg on October 17, 2016, 11:18:57 am
Post by: nenjin on October 17, 2016, 11:41:10 am
Just need the levels so I can get the HP so I can actually take on Map Level 75+. ><
But yeah, Progression is easier at the start because everything is up. I can tell that around Tier 5 it probably starts getting frustrating to get lower tier drops.
Also, fuck the Crematorium boss. Having to flip 4 switches every 30 seconds or the fucker stands in fire and fully regens is fucking bullshit. Not everyone in PoE cranks out 4.2 million DPS spam with the click of a single button, you dicks.
Post by: Kanil on October 17, 2016, 11:58:35 am
Not everyone in PoE cranks out 4.2 million DPS spam with the click of a single button, you dicks.
You're not GGG's target audience, then. :P
Also, I've been running Crypt maps, which have a chance of dropping the 6 link Astral Plate div card. I haven't seen one of those, and figure they're probably rare enough that I'll never find a full set. I did find a 6 socket Astral Plate though, and thought I'd throw a couple stacks of fusings at it to see if I could 5L it. 29th fusing 6 linked it, my first ever. Suppose I don't need the div cards now...
Post by: Aklyon on October 17, 2016, 12:11:11 pm
Post by: frostshotgg on October 17, 2016, 12:20:01 pm
Gratz on the 6L Kanil, it's just a shame you got it a few levels below ilvl84. Still, you can throw a few greeds at it and get it to be near perfect.
EDIT: For what it's worth, Celestial Justicars sell for 7 or 8 chaos a pop. You could finish a set later to get an ilvl 84 astral plate and use that later. At the same time, it's probably more worth your while to get a unique chest.
Post by: Kanil on October 17, 2016, 12:39:24 pm
You could try selling them for chaos.
I didn't even find one, which kinda amuses me. I can't find 1/6th of the item through drops, but got super lucky with crafting it myself.
Gratz on the 6L Kanil, it's just a shame you got it a few levels below ilvl84. Still, you can throw a few greeds at it and get it to be near perfect.
Yeah, it's not ideal, but ilvl 84 is a lot of mapping away. I wouldn't be surprised if I don't get there before the league ends, that's T15 bosses and stuff.
Post by: nenjin on October 17, 2016, 01:27:15 pm
Sometimes it seems like PoE is not built for "complete builds." As in, what succeeds is a set of uniques that forgoes considerations like HP and Armor.
Or maybe it's still just that playing melee in PoE is still 4x harder and more dangerous than any other build.
Post by: Shadowlord on October 17, 2016, 02:03:51 pm
* It sent me back to the starting city on a harder difficulty level or w/e. I was like "So the story ends here, then?" and stopped playing.
Post by: Aklyon on October 17, 2016, 02:14:39 pm
Post by: nenjin on October 17, 2016, 02:29:55 pm
I've played PoE. I've finished* PoE. And I don't understand 90% of what y'all are saying.
* It sent me back to the starting city on a harder difficulty level or w/e. I was like "So the story ends here, then?" and stopped playing.
The full game doesn't even begin until you've beaten it twice. Normal difficulty is, in a sense, an agonizingly long tutorial about how to play the game.
Post by: Aklyon on October 17, 2016, 02:44:11 pm
Post by: Bormok, God of Mud on October 17, 2016, 02:46:56 pm
Or maybe it's still just that playing melee in PoE is still 4x harder and more dangerous than any other build.
Yeah, melee isn't in the best spot.
Post by: ragnar119 on October 17, 2016, 02:51:49 pm
I've played PoE. I've finished* PoE. And I don't understand 90% of what y'all are saying.
* It sent me back to the starting city on a harder difficulty level or w/e. I was like "So the story ends here, then?" and stopped playing.
Dont worry, if you dont care about mindless grinding, you finished 90% of all the content in the game. All additional content past that point is mostly reused one.
Post by: Aklyon on October 17, 2016, 02:53:49 pm
...which you could say about basically all the ARPGs, tbh. The genre really likes its loot.I've played PoE. I've finished* PoE. And I don't understand 90% of what y'all are saying.
* It sent me back to the starting city on a harder difficulty level or w/e. I was like "So the story ends here, then?" and stopped playing.
Dont worry, if you dont care about mindless grinding, you finished 90% of all the content in the game. All additional content past that point is mostly reused one.
Post by: ragnar119 on October 17, 2016, 02:55:49 pm
...which you could say about basically all the ARPGs, tbh. The genre really likes its loot.I've played PoE. I've finished* PoE. And I don't understand 90% of what y'all are saying.
* It sent me back to the starting city on a harder difficulty level or w/e. I was like "So the story ends here, then?" and stopped playing.
Dont worry, if you dont care about mindless grinding, you finished 90% of all the content in the game. All additional content past that point is mostly reused one.
Yea, thats why people that dont care about that part of the game can stop playing after they finish the manin story once, as they are not missing anything important.
Post by: Rex_Nex on October 17, 2016, 03:07:52 pm
Post by: frostshotgg on October 17, 2016, 03:08:47 pm
Post by: Retropunch on October 17, 2016, 03:19:34 pm
That being said, PoE is a really good game to get back into after a break. I've completed it from scratch about 4 times now, starting a new game after every big content drop.
Probably will start again at the next version drop
Post by: ragnar119 on October 17, 2016, 03:22:19 pm
I don't think saying maps are "reused content" really makes much sense. They reuse textures and assets, sure, but almost all the maps are very different from anything in the storyline post-Atlas. Very unique bosses, very unique layouts, very unique visuals. One of the major pushes this expansion was to stop reusing content.They are not unique bosses or unique visuals. They are the same assets from the game (i think there are around 3 to 4 really unique bosses with new assets after you finish normal). The major push in expansion is not to stop reusing the same content, but to reuse it in better way. A lot of content in PoE as said by devs is reused content in clever ways so they can make a lot of it for cheap. Person that doesnt care about grind really will not miss anything as most of the game is shown in the first difficulty.
The funny thing is, to get to the point when you actually see new content like atziri or shaper fight, you will need ot grind a lot, especially if you don't care about trade (as its horribly implemented in the game), and just want to play the game.
Post by: miljan on October 17, 2016, 03:34:31 pm
Add to that their horrible balance around trading in late game, and not even having normal trading tools in game. You will not be missing on anything that much if you stop after finishing normal. In fact its best to stop near end game, as all the problems with the game, bad game mechanics and balance start to show the closer you are to end game
Post by: nenjin on October 17, 2016, 04:12:06 pm
The game also gets a lot worse the higher the difficulty you are. It becomes huge one skill spam fest where you stack attack/cast speed and kill whole screen in seconds.
Add to that their horrible balance around trading in late game, and not even having normal trading tools in game. You will not be missing on anything that much if you stop after finishing normal.
Or you TRY to get the game to that point, anyways.
This has been my rub with PoE for a long time. I like the skills I like. I built a character thematically, and have played it all the way to Level 85. But when I watch PoE videos.....yeah. There's nothing thematic about a lot of builds. It's "how do I exploit a certain combination of gems, support gems, attack/cast speed and effects from Uniques until I break the game and force GGG to do something about it."
It's to the point you have people running around in Tabula Rasa at Level 90 because it's a White 6L, not because it has good stats. And it seems like a lot of the time PoE is dev'd against these one-trick pony builds, not against you know, just average builds. It's why iLvl 35 stuff is still viable in the end game as long as it has some super broken interaction with your other skills or gear.
So for example, I could not even begin to dial the old Jungle Valley map, with the spider boss. Was just tuned wwaaaaaaayyyyyy to high, so that blue packs of spiders were possibly the nastiest thing in the room, and if you could not dump out 50,000 with one skill activation, you were pretty much just fucked cause you couldn't stand there and DPS the way your build typically works. It's even more aggravating in straight up 1v1 boss fights where the boss is up your ass 59 seconds out of every minute. And if your DPS in that one second isn't outstanding....prepare either for a 30 minute fight of maximum tediousness, or death marching on the boss and zeroing out your XP just to beat them. Which makes trying to make progress through maps AND gain levels a total pain in the ass.
Post by: Folly on October 17, 2016, 04:29:51 pm
Has any of this changed?
Post by: Aklyon on October 17, 2016, 04:39:42 pm
The game also gets a lot worse the higher the difficulty you are. It becomes huge one skill spam fest where you stack attack/cast speed and kill whole screen in seconds.Well, it was a nice few posts. And now heres miljan to make it sound terrible like he tends to do.
Add to that their horrible balance around trading in late game, and not even having normal trading tools in game. You will not be missing on anything that much if you stop after finishing normal. In fact its best to stop near end game, as all the problems with the game, bad game mechanics and balance start to show the closer you are to end game
Anyway, I've been playing with occultist caustic arrow/ED/wither because I'd never actually used CA for more than 3 levels before. Aside from it getting steadily better at tanking hits as I pick up more ES & Soul Strike quiver in merc, it has been possibly the slowest thing I've tried thats actually usable. Its certainly not meta (neither very fast nor is it flask-laden pathfinder CI BV nonsense, nor is it the Deadeye tornado shot mines (https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/57tmjb/esc_doomfletch_tornado_shots_with_a_hint_of_mine/) that do similar things to theros' build without relying on frost wall), and it needs more than one button for bosses.
But its a non-caster selfcast build thats fun, and I'm fine with that. I'm sure it can do some maps at the least.
When I stopped playing PoE, my big issue was that progressing from mid to late game absolutely required using specific classes with very specific skill selections, exploiting specific unique items which were almost impossible to obtain without trading, which in turn required using external marketplaces because there was no in-game marketplace.if by late game you mean 'high-tier maps', its changed a bit but not super much, you still need to have actual decent gear or uniques to beat up things in red maps. If you mean 'get to maps, or at least dried lake', you don't need any uniques at all to do so unless your build just simply does not work without them (ex. shav's on builds relying on their ES but not going CI and don't have huge chaos res, not simply "it works better with x y z but if you have good rares instead you're still perfectly fine, but slower/less bursty/etc"), especially not in essence league. Just find, craft, use essences on items, or trade for good enough rares once you get into merc and find you have no resists worth speaking of.
Has any of this changed?
And the only clas that people don't like much right now is scion, because her ascendancy is weird and the others do most things better just from being more focused.
Post by: Kanil on October 18, 2016, 01:40:03 am
They are not unique bosses or unique visuals. They are the same assets from the game (i think there are around 3 to 4 really unique bosses with new assets after you finish normal).Depends on whether you consider the "unique" part of the content to be the asset or the gameplay. Shock and Horror looks just like every other sea witch squid lady, but the fight itself is a lot different than anything you're going to find in normal.
Post by: miljan on October 18, 2016, 04:33:53 am
The game also gets a lot worse the higher the difficulty you are. It becomes huge one skill spam fest where you stack attack/cast speed and kill whole screen in seconds.Well, it was a nice few posts. And now heres miljan to make it sound terrible like he tends to do.
Add to that their horrible balance around trading in late game, and not even having normal trading tools in game. You will not be missing on anything that much if you stop after finishing normal. In fact its best to stop near end game, as all the problems with the game, bad game mechanics and balance start to show the closer you are to end game
What the hack is the point of this part of your post? I mean if you are such a big fanboy and can not stand people talking about the problems with POE, than just keep away from forums and play the game. No need to post crap like this.
Anyway, they announced a AH like version for chinese POE release. And chris commented that they are looking in implementing parts of it in vanilla servers that will not be 100% same as in china. So at last it looks like we will see a fix to this problem in near future
Post by: Kanil on October 18, 2016, 05:11:43 am
Anyway, they announced a AH like version for chinese POE release. And chris commented that they are looking in implementing parts of it in vanilla servers that will not be 100% same as in china.
Really? That seems like an extremely bizarre thing to make region specific.
Post by: miljan on October 18, 2016, 05:45:52 am
Anyway, they announced a AH like version for chinese POE release. And chris commented that they are looking in implementing parts of it in vanilla servers that will not be 100% same as in china.
Really? That seems like an extremely bizarre thing to make region specific.
Not really. The separated realms/servers had different rules. Taiwan servers had things like pay to respect your character with real money, self found leagues with balanced drops around players and not trade, and similar that where not present in GGG vanilla servers.
They hired David Brevik (one of the main developers of original diablo 1 and 2) as a consultant for the china release.
Post by: aristabulus on October 18, 2016, 06:14:20 am
...
Anyway, they announced a AH like version for chinese POE release. And chris commented that they are looking in implementing parts of it in vanilla servers that will not be 100% same as in china. So at last it looks like we will see a fix to this problem in near future
(citation needed)
Prop up your statement with a verifiable link, or don't speak of it again.
....
Well, it was a nice few posts. And now heres miljan to make it sound terrible like he tends to do.
What the hack is the point of this part of your post? I mean if you are such a big fanboy and can not stand people talking about the problems with POE, than just keep away from forums and play the game. No need to post crap like this.
...
The last time you came around, it was with a bag of vitriol harvested from a subreddit and a thickskulled twitch-tard... you've already flipped the bozo bit for most of us here, methinks. Also, calling someone a fanboy because they think your opinion holds little to no value isn't helping.
There is plenty of criticism for PoE in this thread, from many people. There are plenty of well-reasoned things to be miffed about; end-game design caters to the ultra-hardcore, performance issues that keep cropping up every time a new large patch hits, most of the new content for the last year+ has been a rolling remix of the building blocks previously already in the game.
If you have genuine discussion to bring, without buzzwords / bullshit / propaganda, then we welcome it. If you're gonna keep banging on about stash tabs being P2W + GGG is the Anti-Christ for incentivizing people to use a feature that stops a de facto semi-DDoS of their forums (or a similarly odd hill to die on), then please go back to reddit.
-----
...
Really? That seems like an extremely bizarre thing to make region specific.
The Chinese game market has a whole bunch of quirks, which makes it difficult to simply drop in western games as-is.
The best recent example I've heard about is EVE; the Chinese-only server have crazy amounts of P2W stuff, and the outcomes of nullsec wars are major betting/gambling events.
Post by: miljan on October 18, 2016, 06:31:07 am
First i will speak and post how much I want. If you have problems with it go away from the forum in your little bubble....
Anyway, they announced a AH like version for chinese POE release. And chris commented that they are looking in implementing parts of it in vanilla servers that will not be 100% same as in china. So at last it looks like we will see a fix to this problem in near future
(citation needed)
Prop up your statement with a verifiable link, or don't speak of it again.
Second here is the link
https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/581hox/ingame_auction_house_in_poe_chinese_beta/
No, i just call people fanboy when i see posts like the ones posted by that person and yours. And I did point out pay to win mechanics in PoE and stand behind it, but did not bring it up here in any way (you did lol). Yea, keep calling thickskulled twitch-tard people that dont agree with you, and that are actually hosts of POE podcast and do constant interviews with devs for community and are big content creators of POE.
The last time you came around, it was with a bag of vitriol harvested from a subreddit and a thickskulled twitch-tard... you've already flipped the bozo bit for most of us here, methinks. Also, calling someone a fanboy because they think your opinion holds little to no value isn't helping.
There is plenty of criticism for PoE in this thread, from many people. There are plenty of well-reasoned things to be miffed about; end-game design caters to the ultra-hardcore, performance issues that keep cropping up every time a new large patch hits, most of the new content for the last year+ has been a rolling remix of the building blocks previously already in the game.
If you have genuine discussion to bring, without buzzwords / bullshit / propaganda, then we welcome it. If you're gonna keep banging on about stash tabs being P2W + GGG is the Anti-Christ for incentivizing people to use a feature that stops a de facto semi-DDoS of their forums (or a similarly odd hill to die on), then please go back to reddit.
No buzzword, just simple arguments. You should read your own posts and stop posting crap (for your own sake) if you do not agree with other people, because calling something propaganda or buzzwords because you dont agree with it is laughable.
Post by: nenjin on October 18, 2016, 09:38:45 am
Quote
performance issues that keep cropping up every time a new large patch hits
On this note, has anyone noticed that when you log in for the first time in a day that your connection is absolute shit? Like usually I log in, go straight to my Hideout and go straight to a Master Daily mission. Under normal working conditions this takes less than 30 seconds.
But when I log in for the first time, it hangs at reaching my hideout. Then it hangs at loading into the Master's zone. Then it will probably? load the zone...then lock up for a good 45 seconds before booting me to the login screen. When I reconnect, everything is hunky dory.
Normally I wouldn't mention it but this has been a repeatable thing over the last week of PoE I've been playing.
Post by: Aklyon on October 18, 2016, 10:03:03 am
Post by: Toady One on October 18, 2016, 11:12:09 am
Post by: Bormok, God of Mud on October 18, 2016, 12:04:15 pm
Quoteperformance issues that keep cropping up every time a new large patch hits
On this note, has anyone noticed that when you log in for the first time in a day that your connection is absolute shit? Like usually I log in, go straight to my Hideout and go straight to a Master Daily mission. Under normal working conditions this takes less than 30 seconds.
But when I log in for the first time, it hangs at reaching my hideout. Then it hangs at loading into the Master's zone. Then it will probably? load the zone...then lock up for a good 45 seconds before booting me to the login screen. When I reconnect, everything is hunky dory.
Normally I wouldn't mention it but this has been a repeatable thing over the last week of PoE I've been playing.
I've noticed this as well, in particular it hangs when I use each of my skills for the first time.
Post by: Damiac on October 18, 2016, 12:22:20 pm
Please cool off the name-calling etc. a bit in here.
This is why this is the best place on the internet. Toady is the best mod ever.
Post by: aristabulus on October 18, 2016, 02:55:04 pm
Quoteperformance issues that keep cropping up every time a new large patch hits
On this note, has anyone noticed that when you log in for the first time in a day that your connection is absolute shit? ...
I haven't been playing lately, because the first day I went to kick the tires on Atlas of Worlds, I got performance dips anytime the screen got a little busy, rubberbanded twice (and died once from it). I more-or-less finished the map I was on, then uninstalled.
I am hopeful for the theoretical improvements from the DX11 version, but I won't actually try until Act 5 is out. If the performance improves, I'll at least play through to the end of Act 5 Normal... where the story has gotten to will determine whether I stick around.
I suppose if/how they retune Malachai's fight will factor in also. If he morphs into a near-faceroll fight (the way Piety and Dominus did before him), no points will be won with me.
It to me sounds like while they got what they wanted (a sorta-AH), it sounds like rubbish compared to poe.trade. Its hard enough to find a decent ring in a single stashtab full of rings/amulets, trying to do that in a giant pile of them with no sorting? Nope.
I find it a bit obnoxious that we have to go to a third party site for tolerable trading conditions. I mean, I get why GGG is reluctant to put in an auction house; trading turns into an ugly numbers game, both for buyers and sellers. It also kinda bootstraps RMTers, which never helps the health of a game. A tough nut to crack, for sure.
Post by: nenjin on October 18, 2016, 07:05:01 pm
FWIW, when I clear past these weird connection issues (I assume GGG is doing some sort of queue system), most of my night is problem free after that. There's some weird latency spikes at around 3am to 6am (when I uh, should be asleep) but I assume that's just server maintenance and the # of servers in the clusters going down.
So generally since Lockstep, I'd call PoE's performance "good" overall, with some quirkness.
That said, I don't have a build that generates lag and I know that's not true for everyone.
Quote
I suppose if/how they retune Malachai's fight will factor in also. If he morphs into a near-faceroll fight (the way Piety and Dominus did before him), no points will be won with me.
I'd expect these fights to get tuned down, hopefully. Merciless Dominus doesn't even really bother me anymore, as tedious a fight as it is. What I REALLY hope for that is you don't have to kill three goddamn bosses every time you want to go fight Malachai. That fight is bad enough already without having another 20 minutes added on to the front of it, and the risk of a total reset if you DC.
Post by: Kjara on October 18, 2016, 08:36:29 pm
Post by: frostshotgg on October 18, 2016, 10:44:39 pm
Post by: nenjin on October 18, 2016, 10:49:07 pm
Post by: Shadowlord on October 18, 2016, 11:23:52 pm
Like Kjara said, a large amount (but not all) of freezes and startup lag come from loading. Part of this is due to how horribly the game stores it's data, which is mostly as one humongous file, the ggpk. This is made worse by the way it patches, which leads to a lot of empty space in the ggpk. You can fix this, slightly, by using the ggpk defrag tool (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/28060)
"Note for Steam Users: Don't use this."
How odd.
Post by: Aklyon on October 18, 2016, 11:36:22 pm
Post by: nenjin on October 18, 2016, 11:37:35 pm
Post by: frostshotgg on October 18, 2016, 11:39:11 pm
It doesn't work on the steam version because steam has it's own way of managing the ggpk. Not sure exactly how.
Post by: aristabulus on October 18, 2016, 11:52:06 pm
Were you trying to play at or near release? Because it's an almost universal truth these days that Day 0, 1 and maybe 2 are generally just shit for performance.
...
I didn't take notes, but I feel like it was about a week and a half after launch. I was expecting the first few days to be a mess; by the time I got around to it, a numbered fix-patch and a few hotfixes had gone out.
Quote from: nenjin
QuoteI suppose if/how they retune Malachai's fight will factor in also. If he morphs into a near-faceroll fight (the way Piety and Dominus did before him), no points will be won with me.
I'd expect these fights to get tuned down, hopefully. Merciless Dominus doesn't even really bother me anymore, as tedious a fight as it is. What I REALLY hope for that is you don't have to kill three goddamn bosses every time you want to go fight Malachai. That fight is bad enough already without having another 20 minutes added on to the front of it, and the risk of a total reset if you DC.
Tuned down is one thing... tuned down to faceroll territory is quite another. I get that GGG wants the difficulty-ender boss to be a challenge, but the stark contrast isn't warming my heart for their design methods.
-----
I personally haven't used the ggpk defragger, but it'll be a while before that's relevant for me. Once Act 5 is released, I'll be working from a fresh install.
Post by: miljan on October 19, 2016, 05:13:47 am
https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/5874hx/actual_in_game_tutorialwiki/
And also Revive Coins for china part
http://imgur.com/gallery/pyva8
For the lag on beginning there is a command you can add somewhere (i think its --noasync to the shortcut icon), so the game works like before when it tries to load all the assets on the start of the game (the start of the game will take longer but there will be no lag/frezes when you are in the game)
Post by: Aklyon on October 19, 2016, 07:50:29 am
The coins just sound like generic mmo cashshop fodder though, and I wouldn't be surprised if they pulled that from the garena realm for the chinese one.
Thanks for the china news, miljan.
Post by: nenjin on October 19, 2016, 10:14:19 am
Post by: Kazagarth on November 14, 2016, 05:15:30 pm
I didn't like Diablo 3 as much (though they are finally making a Necromancer class, which will make the game playable at least for me) and didn't really like Torchlight 2 either.
A lot of my friends always talk about Path of Exile, but never actually gone in and downloaded it.
Post by: Retropunch on November 14, 2016, 05:28:47 pm
As someone who loved Diablo 2 (mostly because the Necromancer was amazing). Would Path of Exile be worth getting into? I don't mind grindy games, as it gives something to work toward.
I didn't like Diablo 3 as much (though they are finally making a Necromancer class, which will make the game playable at least for me) and didn't really like Torchlight 2 either.
A lot of my friends always talk about Path of Exile, but never actually gone in and downloaded it.
I'd say it's pretty much as close to Diablo 2 as you can get without being Diablo 2. It's the Diablo 3 we never got, and it's really, really awesome - couldn't recommend it enough to a fellow D2 fan. The multiplayer is solid too if you're into that, but it's a fun game on it's own. It doesn't really have a necromancer analogue, but the Witch is pretty close. You'll find the skill system (you find skills or get them a quest reward rather than just level up and get them) a bit strange at first, but it honestly works very well later down the line - bare with it.
It's also probably the best free game ever made.
MINOR CAVEAT: There's a lot of end game stuff for superfans which you either love or hate. I never got into it as I can't grind that much, and I don't find much fun in trying to put together a set of armour over 30 hours. It doesn't interfere with the main game too much, it's just something to remember when people start ranting on about maxing whatever build and you're feeling a bit lost.
Post by: ragnar119 on November 14, 2016, 05:30:32 pm
As someone who loved Diablo 2 (mostly because the Necromancer was amazing). Would Path of Exile be worth getting into? I don't mind grindy games, as it gives something to work toward.
I didn't like Diablo 3 as much (though they are finally making a Necromancer class, which will make the game playable at least for me) and didn't really like Torchlight 2 either.
A lot of my friends always talk about Path of Exile, but never actually gone in and downloaded it.
There is still no d2 necromancer like class in any arpg game out there. Having a army of around 30 permanent summons following you was so fun and relaxing (some would even say boring, but I loved it).
If you are searching for necromancer like feel in PoE you will not find one like what d2 had, but there is a summoner. You will not have a huge number of mobs (max permanent ones around 10), and there is a problem with your units not able to block enemies because of small unit collision and AI of your minions but also enemies. But the game is free and a good one so, its worth a try.
You should also check Grim Dawn. Generally PoE, Grim Dawn and D3 are the 3 big arpg games out there, and every one of them is somewhat unique and does something different.
Post by: Kazagarth on November 14, 2016, 05:35:07 pm
I'll have to download it this weekend and give it a try. :) It looks really involved, especially for a free game.
Post by: miljan on November 14, 2016, 05:36:13 pm
As someone who loved Diablo 2 (mostly because the Necromancer was amazing). Would Path of Exile be worth getting into? I don't mind grindy games, as it gives something to work toward.
I didn't like Diablo 3 as much (though they are finally making a Necromancer class, which will make the game playable at least for me) and didn't really like Torchlight 2 either.
A lot of my friends always talk about Path of Exile, but never actually gone in and downloaded it.
If you want diablo 2 like game, you should get grim dawn, as it is the closest game to diablo out there. POE is also good, but it also has a lot of core problems.
Post by: Retropunch on November 14, 2016, 06:04:24 pm
Grim Dawn is very much like Titan Quest (made by the same guys I think) and whilst that's good, it does feel a bit clunky somehow. It also doesn't have quite the same sort of level of atmosphere or polish that PoE has, and the story is a bit meh. By that, I mean that PoE seems like a bit more of an adventure (Acts, just like D2) whereas GD is just a bit of a slog through swamps or deserts.
Great game though, but PoE is much more D2-like in my opinion. I'd also say PoE has more of a necromancer option than GD does
Post by: Retropunch on November 14, 2016, 06:34:56 pm
PoE has developed a huge and complex item system - crafting and combining special items that can manipulate your loot (by adding sockets to it, for example), which in turn affects your skills. People sometimes joke that the actual game is the trading aspect, and the combat is a minigame. I wouldn't go that far, but... I laud PoE for its depth, but ultimately I found that many of its most innovative systems end up detracting from the actual meat of the game.
By comparison, Grim Dawn is in some ways more simple, and definitely less focused on multiplayer, but it's much more similar to Diablo 2 in my opinion. There are skill trees for each class, the combat feels much more responsive, and you spend much more of your time actually playing the game rather than messing with your inventory or looking things up on external websites . The biggest flaw I've found is that it's too long - each act is about a third longer than it needs to be - and there's consequently an issue with pacing.
I think that's what my caveat was meant to express. Path of Exile CAN get into a min-maxing inventory management nightmare, but I honestly just ignored all that completely - I never looked anything up (other than a cursory look through the wiki at different classes and whatever, like I normally would for any game) and I just didn't worry about it all - I just used the skills that I wanted. Yeah, I used some of the orbs to change socket colours, but it never felt a burden or complex. I wouldn't say (at a basic level) that it's any more complex than the gem system in Diablo 2, only that you're sometimes limited in what skills you can use based on loot.
I don't find GD very snappy somehow - I guess I never had lag problems with PoE, but PoE felt more fast paced and sort of 'visceral' whereas GD feels a bit more like one of the older D2 clones.
It's all about personal preference, and whilst I love both, I just feel that PoE captures the D2 atmosphere and play style much better (even if it does have some different mechanics), whereas Grim Dawn is TQ:mk2.
Post by: Aklyon on November 14, 2016, 07:02:20 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 15, 2016, 01:27:22 am
Quote
There is still no d2 necromancer like class in any arpg game out there. Having a army of around 30 permanent summons following you was so fun and relaxing (some would even say boring, but I loved it).
I'm going to have to say this isn't true.
I've got an 82 Witch/Necromancer.
10 Permanent Zombies rocking Fortify/Poison/Multistrike.
4 Permanent Spectres with Dmg/Life.
1 Permanent Fire Golem for kicks.
Up to 15 Skeletons that are temporary...but I can drop a totem where I want to resummon them and they last like 45 seconds on their own.
All my minions explode at 20% life for damage, and then leave a poisonous cloud behind. All of them have Minion Life/Damage out the wazoo.
Add on to that a AoE Fire Damage buff for them, a corpse generating ability that leaves a poisonous cloud, a corpse exploding ability that gives all my minions Chaos damage, Resists, Energy Shield....
And then my actual primary attack ability which, because I have a decent unique for it, Firestorm with Flammability Curse on it.
And if I choose to use Vaal Summon Skeletons....We're talking upwards of 60 minions on screen. (Granted half of those are temporary.)
....And people say PoE doesn't have a Necromancer analog :P. My Witch is easily as fun and enjoyable as my D2 Necromancer. I have so many beefy pets that I die 95% of the time before any of my minions.
---
I really like PoE. I have plenty of issues with it too but they're outweighed by the positives. The challenge is both a like and a dislike. It feels gratifying to overcome challenges in PoE (especially if your build is just average as compared to completely broken.) Having a build come together that you own and you're constantly optimizing feels really gratifying. Beyond the build there's so many layers and additions to gameplay that, even when I'm not raking in upgrades at the end game I always feel like I've gotten something for my time. Currency, mainly, especially for those hard to upgrade items. But also a steady stream of Unique items I've still not plumbed the depths of, any one the potential basis for a whole new character.
The game does straddle the edge of frustrating at times, and you have to burn your hand repeatedly on the stove to learn what is too risky to attempt. Some people find that a big turn off. As mentioned, your first character will probably find themselves pretty outclassed in the end game, and while it's quicker to level a second one than the first, you still have to play the fucking game x3 over again. (Not to mention do the Labyrinth and beat Izaro 4 times to fully unlock your Ascendancy, something half of PoE players seem to hate.)
I'd argue all that time is sort of well spent though, since you have to put a lot of time in to PoE to a) learn b) progress c) experiment d) amass enough currency to do what you want and e) gear up.
I've played the game completely solo so far and played with 99% self found gear. People make a lot of noise about PoE being about trading but I've largely ignored it. Not trading has slowed me down considerably, sure, but I don't have to spend time on sorting drops for sellability, checking prices, haggling, flipping, blah blah blah, and I've still had a good time. About the only thing not trading does other than restrict you to self-found upgrades is preclude high end gear crafting and gear customization. I don't know if that bleeding edge of optimal gear is required for the absolute end game or not, but I'm not too worried about it.
As for trading, this weekend I finally made a stash tab public so I can sell off some of the duplicate uniques I've amassed. I can't bring myself to vendor them, even though I look at what they go for in the standard league and it's practically what you can get from a vendor most of the time...
Not grouping also makes the grind to 100 truly, truly agonizingly slow. Also something I'm ok with it, because I play at a snail's pace anyways.
All that said, the real question for if someone will like PoE is: whether lag and losing experience are two things they can deal with. The lag is less of a problem than it was in the past (POE is not a game that's friendly to so-so internet connections IMO). Dying however, especially due to said lag, can be a real demotivater in the end game if your build struggles, because it takes a lot of time played to continue leveling up by that point and dying even once a night consistently can set you back a long ways. For some people that's too much to handle, on top of PoE's um.....zeal for difficulty. (I'm talking a game whose mechanics can freely create monsters that are nearly impossible to kill beyond a certain point. (Love those fucking Summoner + Soul Eater + Regen Rares ><) If you want a mountain to climb for free though, PoE offers it. A mountain covered in blood and spikes and eye-wateringly expensive cosmetic microtransactions.
The style of PoE is a lot like Titan Quest. Angling for realism and grit over flash and being stylized. It can come across as a little drab sometimes, and due to cosmetics being the game's only real cash cow other than stash tabs, your character ends up looking as fugly as the rest of the game unless you're willing to shell out. The story....it frames the world alright but I've never really been in love with it. It holds together ok but around Act III it goes off the rails IMO. I liked the game more when it was about being a scrappy exile trying to serve on this crazy island full of cannibals....before it goes into apocalyptic/demonic matters of import. Still, the game's got a vibe and an atmosphere to match how brutal gameplay can be.
It's a game I can safely come back to year in, year out and pick up where I left off and spend only what I want to. Sort of like Warframe, it's a great F2P solo game where you get out of it what you put into it.
(Just dinged 87 on my Ascendant tonight too! That only took two solid weekends :P)
Post by: frostshotgg on November 15, 2016, 05:52:32 am
The other two "summoner" skills are much more fun to play, although impermanent. Summon Raging Spirits basically locks you in place to build up your army which lasts for a whole 10 seconds or less, but does really damn good damage and if something comes after you you can always just leap away. Animate Weapons is like playing Katamari with minions. At the start of every area you have no damage and then you kill a couple things and animate the weapons they drop, and snowball from there. Then you finish the map and do it all again the next one.
Post by: ragnar119 on November 15, 2016, 10:58:46 am
QuoteThere is still no d2 necromancer like class in any arpg game out there. Having a army of around 30 permanent summons following you was so fun and relaxing (some would even say boring, but I loved it).
I'm going to have to say this isn't true.
Must disagree. While 15 summons is a nice number, the gameplay and feel is nothing like d2, and numbers are also lacking. Having vaal skelies and totems (that you need constantly to recast) have very short life, and they act very different than other summons, as they will not follow you, unlike lets say Revive from d2 where mobs last 3 min and will go where you go. The bigger problem is mobs AI and the engine of the game. The closest thing I saw to d2 necromancer was torchlight 2 modded and titan quest also with mods. But thats only in numbers you control, as the gamplay and feel is still different. Maybe the best summoner is actually from different d2 mods that I played few years ago.
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 15, 2016, 11:43:03 am
That's not to say summoners dont need serious help, or that raise zombie compares to D2's raise skeleton, but D2 would crash before hitting anywhere remotely near PoE's achievable minion count.
Post by: ragnar119 on November 15, 2016, 12:50:33 pm
Is Dominating Blow not similar enough to D2's Revive? Revive summoned up to 20 monsters that barely follow you and lasted 3 minutes. Dominating Blow can summon a (theoretically) infinite number of monsters that follow you for up to 1.5 minutes. It's not a direct analogue, but you know. I think criticizing PoE's minion count is a little weird when you can have ~20 permanent minions and hundreds of temporary minions.No, different type of mechanic, as Dominating Blow is for melee class, or what you had with paladin from d2. But as I said the problem is not about Revive (i just compared that type of skill to PoE summons that are on timer) but having a huge number of permanent summons. The max you can have i think is 16 or 15 permanent summons, while in d2 i had at one time 30+ (and that is after the nerf). Normally that number is important, as having a full blown army and forming a front line is very hard to happen with PoE as there is collision problems, AI problem of summons and similar.
That's not to say summoners dont need serious help, or that raise zombie compares to D2's raise skeleton, but D2 would crash before hitting anywhere remotely near PoE's achievable minion count.
Also about that d2 crash i guess you never tried to play one of d2 mods with over 100 summons in the game. Trust me d2 is a lot more stable than PoE and can survive a lot more as its old game with 2d graphics and offline at the same time.
Post by: boki on November 15, 2016, 01:08:04 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 15, 2016, 02:34:51 pm
I stopped using Vaal Summon Skeletons though because it was too hard to keep using it in boss fights. That's more or less my philosophy on builds these days. "Does it function the same during a boss fight as when farming? No? Abandon it." So many things I've tried in the last few days seem good until you try them against a boss and they don't work. Like Endurance Charge on Melee Stun. Great for cleaning up trash and farming. Completely useless against a boss due to their astronomically high HP preventing the stun from ever occurring. Icebite etc...great against trash when things are actually dieing. Useless in a protracted boss fight with a sprinkling of adds.
Quote
PoE is very strange hybrid of Diablo, Final Fantasy and random MMOs.
How is it like Final Fantasy?
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 15, 2016, 02:45:19 pm
Also about that d2 crash i guess you never tried to play one of d2 mods with over 100 summons in the game. Trust me d2 is a lot more stable than PoE and can survive a lot more as its old game with 2d graphics and offline at the same time.
As a huge D2 Median player back in the day, I did. Having a lot of summons wouldn't necessarily crash the game, but once too many sprites/effects were on the screen D2 would stop drawing models altogether to avoid freezing/crashing. Playing in places like median's Tran Athulua with a summoner would mean you'd spend half the time fighting invisible mobs while the screen was covered in effects that strobe in and out of existence as D2 decided whether or not there was too much to draw. Even several high-density vanilla areas had this problem, especially in multiplayer. The secret cow level was more like the invisible cow level if you played in a party.
Important to note here that we're talking "over 100" in Diablo, but "several hundred" in PoE. It wouldn't be a good build, but you could feasibly make a character that summons half a thousand minions. Your framerate would take a hit, but for the most part PoE is completely capable of those kinds of numbers. Good luck doing that in modded diablo, let alone vanilla. PoE's minion problem is entirely an AI/balance/QoL issue, there's nothing wrong with the minion count.
(http://How is it like Final Fantasy?)
Quote
How is it like Final Fantasy?
He probably means skill gems and the skill tree being similar to a number of FF games. Nothing else is remotely close to a FF game, though.
Post by: Damiac on November 15, 2016, 03:09:42 pm
But there's something about the aesthetics, the movement, the monsters, and the fairly close zoom that makes it feel like I have barely any idea what's actually going on onscreen most of the time.
I felt a lot more in control in D2. I could actually click a mob with a fair degree of precision, and if you put a melee skill on right click, the game was kind enough to attack the nearest mob to where you right clicked, rather than the ground. In POE it just feels like I walk around until there are enemies, then I'm basically just spamming attacks in their general direction and running around like a madman to avoid projectiles and what not.
I also really miss something from D2 that is just a shame not to be in POE. In D2 I could use my scroll wheel to change the RMB skill between any favorites I had set up. In POE I can't do that, and having to press qwert for those attacks sucks. Seriously, it makes my wrist sore just thinking about reaching over to that t button.
Post by: frostshotgg on November 15, 2016, 03:50:27 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 15, 2016, 04:10:15 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 15, 2016, 07:57:03 pm
I generally go for multiple projectile casters or like Incinerators for spectres, to get synergy with Flammability.
Post by: nenjin on November 19, 2016, 05:23:36 pm
It's things like this that make me realize I'm basically playing Hard/Impossible mode PoE, with my shitty skills and non-double dipping build I deliberately choose to use.
It's like....there's two ways to play PoE it feels like. You can obey the meta and just cram in whatever its about.....or you can play by what feels interesting to you and probably struggle mightily at some point. Things like elemental damage conversion and double dipping versus physical damage (which IMO just doesn't fucking scale at all anymore compared to Elemental/Chaos/DoT.) I could probably drop Cleave (lel) right now for Blade Flurry and with a little rework vastly increase my clear times and survivability. It just doesn't seem fun though to give up on what I've been doing on this character for what's new. Clearing faster doesn't seem worth the loss of flavor and identity, which honestly are maybe the most important thing to me in PoE. I wanna use a sword and shield and wade in to combat. I don't want to shoot green and black tendrils across the whole screen and kill shit, as gratifying as it might be to be that strong, and trivialize a game that I've let torment me for years.
So I'll continue to do as I have done: ignore the meta or anything new really and pursue this build as I've played it so far. Maybe one day they'll actually get around to enhancing melee instead of just dropping a skill that embraces the current meta and calls itself melee.
It's not that I completely hate what I don't opt to do in PoE....it just takes so much time to do anything that, when I have to choose between "Keeping playing your veteran character that you've been climbing a mountain with for years due to an ineffective but flavorful solo build" and "start a new character that obeys the meta" I almost always choose the former. I'd maybe even like to build an entire character around Blade Flurry. I just don't have the time, nor does it appeal to me in the same way that being challenged on my actual melee character does.
Post by: Aklyon on November 19, 2016, 11:16:58 pm
Meanwhile, you have posts like this (https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/5drl2t/ziggyd_a_rambling_review_of_the_new_skills_blight/da6vlcr/) having to explain to people that a skill based on burning things with lasers actually needs more than just excessive grand spectrums to be effective.
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 20, 2016, 12:49:46 am
Blight is just really bad. I see what they were attempting to do - a simple chaos leveling gem to take you to merciless - but it's possibly the most boring gem in the game. Even disregarding the pitiful damage, the skill is the complete antithesis of PoE; a nearly unalterable skill gem utilizing two damage types (degen, chaos) that each ignore a portion of combat mechanics. No matter how they fudge the numbers, I don't see a way for Blight to ever be anything other than a waste of development time.
Blade Flurry is funny to me because it's basically just magic missiles. There's nothin' wrong with PoE having this flavor of magic missiles, but it seems like a slap in the face to make it a melee gem. It's magic missiles. The fact this is what melee skills need to be to compete with ranged spells is sad.
Post by: frostshotgg on November 20, 2016, 01:09:15 am
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 29, 2016, 08:59:14 pm
Breaches look a bit "eh", but I'll enjoy it more than Essence league just because it's (mostly) a combat/loot league, not a crafting league.
Essence league was a complete dud for me; not only is crafting boring, but I couldn't bring myself to bother crafting anything lategame due to the costs and I never managed to roll anything useful while leveling. Basically just got a pretty looking rainbow stash tab and a bunch of junk before realizing I'd be better off selling them than trying to make anything remotely useful. Some of the essence-holding rares made for tough/fun fights, but the hyper HP inflation on them made for some bad experiences on my slower (worse) builds.
Patch itself looks fine, although the big balance changes (Ancestral Warchief nerfs, Blade Vortex nerfs) are the kind we need to see in action to judge. I think Blade Flurry got out way, way too easy, and I'm not happy that nothing was done to address poison/bleed/ignite's complete dominance over the meta. On the other hand, the nerfs to flask charge generation are going to help shake things up a bit. BV's flask charge generation in particular was completely decimated.
My guess: Bladeflurry Raider league, with a resurgence of Elementalist builds.
Post by: Aklyon on November 29, 2016, 11:32:53 pm
Post by: Aklyon on November 29, 2016, 11:50:52 pm
If i don't see any golemancer builds show up i will be very surprised.
Post by: nenjin on November 30, 2016, 12:19:36 am
Quote
Flame Golem's damage has been increased by 200%.
Holy sheet. And I get three of those now? My summoner just got a huge buff from that.
Quote
Melee Skeletons from the Summon Skeletons skill now deal 25% more damage. Summon Skeletons and Vaal Summon Skeletons skills now have a cast time of 0.8 seconds, down from 1 second.
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Raise Spectre now grants +30% elemental resistances to its minions.
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Totems and all other minions now have 40% elemental resistance and 20% chaos resistance. This also includes minions that didn't have resistances previously, like wolves.
Between all those buffs, my minions are all now way more durable, and they were durable as fuck in the 1st tier of maps. All in all my Summoner just got way tougher.
Quote
The "of Frenzy", "of Endurance" and "of Power" mods will no longer appear, as they could cause performance issues in areas with many monsters.
Doh. Those were my go-to safe mods to roll on lower level maps. :(
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Many monsters in end-game maps have been rebalanced, fixing cases where they did too little damage.
Lel.
Several totem buffs too, looks like a nice survivability buff.
Also no mention for the buff to melee range and targeting and all that stuff? It won't bring melee into parity with ranged but at least maybe melee won't be so fucking sucky to play now, chasing mobs around with your damn cursor so much.
I can see GGG tried to sort of hit the biggest complaints on the forums: Blade Flurry, Melee and Minions. Kinda excited to check all this out. And I guess maybe buy another stash tab for Essences. :X
Post by: frostshotgg on November 30, 2016, 12:23:16 am
Post by: Aklyon on November 30, 2016, 01:16:03 am
...if you use some combination that results in +2 golems, yes. Like dual clayshaper. They have not buffed the default golem limit. I probably should've pointed that out first.QuoteFlame Golem's damage has been increased by 200%.
Holy sheet. And I get three of those now?
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 30, 2016, 03:22:13 am
They could be a pretty decent 3l/4l on an elementalist, but I have my doubts about whether or not the golems themselves will do much of anything in high tier maps if you don't scale them or grab 3/4 with clayshapers (which you certainly wont want to do if you're playing something like flameblast elementalist). Even with 200% damage, they're competing with skills that clear a screen in a couple frames.
Post by: ragnar119 on November 30, 2016, 05:40:12 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: sjm9876 on November 30, 2016, 09:12:50 am
But yeah, golem buffs are nice. Still might not be top tier build, but if it's viable for more content then I'm not going to object :P
Post by: Aklyon on November 30, 2016, 01:31:00 pm
Also Rex, I drop spectres into 'if space available' links. Zombies, skeletotem, and other summoner things like auras take priority until the ghosts get some form of persistance. They're too finicky as-is.
Post by: Rex_Nex on December 01, 2016, 12:15:06 am
Also Rex, I drop spectres into 'if space available' links. Zombies, skeletotem, and other summoner things like auras take priority until the ghosts get some form of persistance. They're too finicky as-is.
Really surprised you use skeletotem! Most people won't touch summons without spectres, just because zombos have like a third of the clearspeed of flame sentinel spectres. But hey, if it works, it works!
More importantly though, ziggy showed off a possible golemancer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrBakQUxEDM) build capable of basically all the content using flame golems+zombies. I didnt expect there to be a jewel that alters the AI of the golems, but apparently there's a new one that makes them extremely aggressive. Having them attacking constantly like SRS instead of wandering around mid-combat like they do now makes them more than serviceable.
Post by: Aklyon on December 01, 2016, 01:07:08 am
Don't give a damn about clearspeed, don't even look in the direction of yonder flask-bullshit pathfinder meta (rip flask on crit). Just smash the enemy before you with minions!
Its practically the only build I have at this point which hasn't changed a bit other than the occasional improvement or gem sockets problem. If I want to go fast, I play something else like LW mines. Summoner is not for of fast. Summoner is for minion armies, and penta-golem shenanigans is exactly what I was hoping for from that video. Aggressive golems is a bigger buff than tge rest, but not needing elementalist is a bonus.
Post by: nenjin on December 01, 2016, 10:35:41 am
And it's weird....after about an hour of that, I go back to my Scion. It may be slow as balls to play but I dunno, I feel like I'm actually earning the right to level with her. Everything else is so trivial easy by comparison. My only true complaint is that my scion can't handle all boss mechanics, where my summoner generally can because they have the DPS to make it less of an issue. (I'm looking at you, Crematorium boss.)
Post by: kcwong on December 03, 2016, 08:52:22 am
I was trying a summoner again (ES/HP SRS), since all those buffs. Reached normal act 3 and I realized she's not going to do well with breaches... I guess it's time to reroll.
Post by: Aklyon on December 03, 2016, 10:25:00 am
Post by: Aklyon on February 14, 2017, 04:39:01 pm
Its because we're actually getting 6 new acts. (https://www.pathofexile.com/oriath)
ZiggyD also has a video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cf6Ha-R7taA) about the new stuff.
Also since I might as well point it out while I'm bumping the thread, Nist Akath (the guild we've had for b12 and friends of b12 for quite a bit) has a discord (https://discord.gg/zfrHjtf) now for talking about poe stuff or other stuff.
Post by: Rex_Nex on February 14, 2017, 05:14:09 pm
PoE community is super hype about this, and for good reason! Largest expansion ever, by several orders of magnitude.
Post by: Kanil on February 14, 2017, 05:45:19 pm
No more extra difficulties?
Although the last half sounds like it's rehashing the first half again. I suppose it's "different", but... hm...
Post by: Retropunch on February 14, 2017, 06:14:23 pm
Wow.
No more extra difficulties?
Although the last half sounds like it's rehashing the first half again. I suppose it's "different", but... hm...
Looks pretty different - from the video there looks to be quite a lot of new areas and monsters - apparently some were not finished models yet either.
I'm pretty excited - I loved playing through the 'story' part of it, but get super bored by just endless grinding of maps I've already done. This'll definitely hook me in for another run through!
Post by: Aklyon on February 14, 2017, 07:35:53 pm
Yeah, six through ten is a re-hash of everything you did in the first four, and the consequences thereto.You could be thematic and do an old bow build instead of siege ballista! :p
I, for one, am PUMPED. Like, holy shit. Word is the temporary league coming is the Legacy League, which also recycles all the previous leagues in a mix-and-match format. It's gonna be so cool.
Someone stop me from playing Siege Ballista again.
maybe i'll do mf caustic arrow
Post by: nenjin on February 14, 2017, 08:31:39 pm
Not wild about a couple of the proposed boss mechanics (Oh great, more Piety beam.) But there's time still.
I dunno, the playing out of new features was enough to overcome the repetitiveness of leveling new characters for me. So not much changes for me other than new content.
But one has to wonder, with so much new stuff, if they're going to focus on quantity over quality. I can see why the Essence League was poopooed, it's pretty much micro grind treadmill crap. And the power of the gods seems to be firmly in that realm. (Oh boy, 8% damage resistance for sitting still for 4 seconds...I guess if stuff like that allows for anything, it's stripping weaker supporting elements out of your build because it's covered by X in Ascendancy or Y in Power of the Gods.)
Post by: aristabulus on February 14, 2017, 08:36:47 pm
Spoiler: cut for scroll suppression (click to show/hide)
Mechanically, I can't really say I'm thrilled or surprised with the cruising altitude view of design choices. Path of Exile: Super Turbo Remix Edition is basically what I've come to expect, based on what they've actually done since late beta.
Spoiler: scroll cut 2 (click to show/hide)
I feel like multiple behind-the-scenes things are happening with the whole six-acts-at-once bit...
Spoiler: scroll cut 3 (click to show/hide)
Most of my actual questions at this point are pretty minor, and all boil down to the proper details re: the refactoring of existing content/rewards.
Most quest rewards are easy enough to move around; bandit bonuses are the only big question mark.
Labyrinth access... just cut it down to three passes? Seems the simplest solution. Get 3 pips on normal initial access, 3 pips from Act 8 (Act 3 revisit), and 2 from Endgame Labyrinth from maps.
When are maps going to be available? My guess is Act 8, with maybe a small adjustment to effective area levels, no other major changes. (maybe 6-10 new mid+ tier maps, remixes with the new tilesets)
How are low-level / high-level prophecies going to be keyed without difficulties as delimiters?
Post by: frostshotgg on February 15, 2017, 01:28:12 am
Post by: Descan on February 15, 2017, 01:49:06 am
Post by: Aklyon on February 15, 2017, 02:00:38 am
Huh, they're getting rid of difficulty levels? Hm.It'll still be roughly the same amount of areas you need to get through to get to end-game maps (10 acts instead of 4*3 acts), but with less repeats and more new stuff.
Post by: Retropunch on February 15, 2017, 05:20:42 am
Yeah I love that idea - I just never really enjoyed traipsing through the same map (even if randomised layout) a number of times to level up. Sure, it might only be 50% new areas, but it looks to me like even the areas you've previously visited will have completely new enemies and mechanics in place, so even those won't be too samey.Huh, they're getting rid of difficulty levels? Hm.It'll still be roughly the same amount of areas you need to get through to get to end-game maps (10 acts instead of 4*3 acts), but with less repeats and more new stuff.
I also imagine that it'll allow them to build upon the 10 acts with feedback - the devs have always said 10 acts was their end goal, so having that as a fixed distance to work within will probably help improve quality. Maybe they'll say that act 7 is too samey and revamp it a lot, or that they need to add more new mechanics to flesh it out.
Post by: ragnar119 on February 15, 2017, 01:20:07 pm
Post by: nenjin on February 15, 2017, 01:21:02 pm
If this will do anything, I think for players who did the Malachai fight and went "there's no fucking way I'm ever doing that again" they may actually be encouraged to keep playing.
Until they run into the next nut-destroying boss, that is.
Post by: Retropunch on February 16, 2017, 12:55:12 pm
PoE has a problem of samey-ness and low quality (in terms of variation), high volume content. So for me, calling it a new act and putting some voice actors and new bosses in isn't really going to change anything for me, the wool is too thin to cover my eyes that much.
PoE is never going to escape that no matter what they do - it's what Diablo clones do.
That being said, PoE is an engaging sorta grind (it's free to play, you can mix up a lot of abilities and it has a nice level/loot treadmill) - I think this will help it feel slightly less stale. Yeah, it's still a grind, but just a bit less of a stale grind.
Post by: nenjin on February 16, 2017, 01:04:11 pm
Although I suppose they tried to do something novel with the Labyrinth and traps and at least a good chunk of the fanbase loathed it. So I guess that's what you get for trying to break the mold.
Post by: aristabulus on February 16, 2017, 04:22:44 pm
...
If this will do anything, I think for players who did the Malachai fight and went "there's no fucking way I'm ever doing that again" they may actually be encouraged to keep playing.
Until they run into the next nut-destroying boss, that is.
Yeah, that's about where I am. Malachai is a bullshit fight on a postage stamp, but almost tolerable in normal Act 4 because he's not tuned to stupidly-deadly. His clone in Primordial Pool Map isn't actually that bad; the arena is big enough that you can almost 100% disengage by running to the far side.
I actually got around to trying Aztiri for the first time, not long ago... SUPER-bullshit fight, worse than Malachai. I'm not likely to try again anytime soon.
I suspect the risen gods will be the Remix Edition, and I'm not happy with the notion. At least I'll only have to do each once. :/
...
Although I suppose they tried to do something novel with the Labyrinth and traps and at least a good chunk of the fanbase loathed it. So I guess that's what you get for trying to break the mold.
I feel like there are two things that soured the labyrinth for most folks. Numero Uno being that when it was new, the networking situation was still rough, so losing progress to a latency blip felt unreasonably punitive and very "do it again, stupid." (Nelson laugh optional) By the time networking improved, people's feelings about labyrinth were already anchored. Dos: Izaro is a super-duper bullshit fight when he's similar level to your toon. Actually beating him without hella grind means sandbagging 15 or 20 levels before you fight.
-----
And since it went hot while I was typing: Legacy League details (https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1834597).
Post by: Aklyon on February 16, 2017, 04:23:07 pm
Leaguestones and Reliquaries. The latter's map item drops rarely and holds shinier versions of legacy uniques, like 991% facebreakers.
Post by: frostshotgg on February 16, 2017, 07:51:40 pm
Malachai is the worst boss in the game design wise, by a very, very large margin. He suffers from the usual "Absurd anti-melee mechanics in a cramped arena to force you into melee" that many of the bad bosses do, but turned up to 15 on a 10 point scale, then has a lot of other issues on top of that. Let's go down the list.
- Horribly, horribly cramped arena
- One shot slam
- Degen ground that covers the arena
- More floaty degen things that stack with the other degen
- No downtime to recover
- Horrible hitboxes on everything
- Unavoidable damage
Post by: nenjin on February 16, 2017, 08:22:05 pm
Still, I think the Piety fight preceding that in some ways is a worse fight. I hate the mandatory "and now you must run X fast in Y pattern or die instantly" mechanics. You can flask through a couple of those but that's it, and you're fighting in a damn closet by comparison to pretty much all boss fights, where spawns at the start actively get in your way.
Which is why I'm not thrilled to see that attack make a return at all. That attack might actually be worse in a larger room than a smaller one.
Post by: aristabulus on February 16, 2017, 08:33:34 pm
Atziri is nowhere near as bullshit of a fight as Malachai. She has a large barrier of knowledge before you can run her (Mirrors and immunities in split phase say hi), but once you can she's pretty damn fair.
...
I dunno, having to look up detailed spoilers (or wasting rare tokens repeatedly on observation/lemming runs) so you can know what tells to look for is still bad. Different flavour, same orifice.
re: Malachai details, yeah, that all sums up what I hate about it.... can't see what the hell is going on half the time, and even if you can, good luck having somewhere to run to. :/
I know how to the Malachai fight "right" but as a melee without broken damage it takes. For. Fucking. Ever. Extended periods of just running around waiting for shit to disappear. ...
My recollection of my 2H Melee duelist basically mirrors that. Didn't die quite as much because he was very passively tanky, but it took a long time to get good damage windows.
Post by: nenjin on February 16, 2017, 08:40:13 pm
Post by: frostshotgg on February 16, 2017, 08:49:06 pm
As it is, Atziri is fairly benign. The Vaals are entirely fair game, they're a boss you've fought before with maybe one new attack that's a skill the player has access to. The Trio is pretty visually obvious what each of them does. Atziri herself has a lot of really well telegraphed stuff that gives you plenty of time to react like flameblasts and stormcalls. The one part that's not great is the split phase but at some point you're going to learn by trial-and-error what each of them do, and as long as you don't immediately go full ham and try to kill them, you get a chance to read the mods on each of them that tell you immunities and that the mirror one reflects.
Post by: Kanil on February 17, 2017, 03:52:50 am
Still, I think the Piety fight preceding that in some ways is a worse fight. I hate the mandatory "and now you must run X fast in Y pattern or die instantly" mechanics. You can flask through a couple of those but that's it, and you're fighting in a damn closet by comparison to pretty much all boss fights, where spawns at the start actively get in your way.
I personally don't mind Piety's whirling death beam. I just hate that she has so much HP that you end up seeing it a dozen times.
I suppose that's typical for PoE, the bosses go on way too damn long. Actually, the more I think about it, for a game where big numbers=difficulty, I kinda like Piety's whirling death beam, because it's different. Not quite Vaal Oversoul actually enjoyable boss fight different, but it's something.
Post by: Aklyon on February 28, 2017, 11:17:58 pm
Also, they may or maynot have finally fixed the perandus mobs of laggy doom.
Post by: nenjin on March 08, 2017, 08:07:16 pm
And it's pretty damn good, even after all the nerfs. Superior to most melee skills on its face, anyways. It'd actually compliment my Scion's build, it just I dunno...feels cheap as hell after I got that far with just the classic melee skills.
Anyways, my Shadow is Energy Shield/EVA. I know, I know. The meta says I'm a fool and I'll get wrekt'd scrub. So far though, sub Level 80 it's been totally doable. Yeah, there are some nasty one shots out there, and for all the trash people talk about Armor, when you have none and take a hit on your health it's fuckin scary. But in general good reactions and judgment can make it work. I was dreading Izaro Merciless and it's true, his mortar blasts will pretty much kill you (I'm 2.8k Life/1.3k ES something right now) in one barrage with any amount of damage missing or curse debuffs on you or whatever. But supplement with a little fortify, enduring cry....and you make up the difference pretty well. I more or less had Izaro beat the first time I fought him. Then I proceeded to get disconnected about 4 times, 20 minutes apart, from the Lab despite having rock solid latency. Then GGG brought the realm down to replace a database and tanked another run. Then I DC'd again. >< After like 3 goddamn hours of trying to beat Izaro Merciless, mostly through no fault of my own, I finally beat it. Guess he must have rolled the "Shit Servers" mod that day.
Really enjoying my Shadow more than I expected. It's the first character I made in PoE back in Open Beta and I haven't been back to him in years. But after playing a heavy shield tank for long, it's kind of liberating to not only do a shit load of damage but also not have to stand and deliver for it to happen.
Post by: nenjin on May 24, 2017, 05:42:39 pm
Spoiler: Witness the nerf! (click to show/hide)
You can spot the ES/CI build players right now in the manfiesto thread by how hard they're freaking out. Personally, having never played ES/CI (just a poor man's ES build for my Witch), I'm looking forward to someone else feeling the pain of life builds like I do right now. I still predict it will outperform life builds, but now at least I don't have to hear about people face rolling content that face rolls me, like I'm the asshole for not playing ES/CI.
Post by: frostshotgg on May 24, 2017, 07:14:33 pm
Post by: Aklyon on May 24, 2017, 08:47:54 pm
Post by: nenjin on August 04, 2017, 01:35:08 pm
Post by: RoguelikeRazuka on August 07, 2017, 07:36:00 am
I used to play PoE on a regular basis in 2013-2014, when I tried to learn things via following various builds made by other people for various characters and play styles, and trying to gather valuable or useful information from reading their guides and playing their builds, but that failed.
Post by: nenjin on August 07, 2017, 10:41:25 am
So yeah, I'd say it's totally viable if you have the time to put in to it, and are willing to table or shelve a character until the right gear is available to them.
RE: Fall of Oriath. What a mess for standard players. The entire expansion was already beaten when I logged in. They took away a large chunk of my skill points and locked them behind dumb side quests. So upon logging in and spending 30 mins remapping skill points, I just had to go each one of the acts, collect my rewards for the main quests and run some low level crap to get my missing points back, so I could end the expansion exactly where I started. What fun, what thrills.
So I have no idea what happened in the story. I ran down a couple of the story bosses just to see them, smooshed them and kinda went "meh." Talked to some of the story characters before I found myself scrolling through their dialog without paying any real attention. Mostly I was just jumping from act to act with no real sense of why, and little ability to care.
So thanks GGG. Always appreciate the standard love. I know their attitude is "Just make a league character bruh and replay the game for the 40th time!" but I can't be fucking assed. Also, the entire story seems pretentious as fuck. Even more so than the rest of PoE. I get who Sin and Innocence are, I just don't get why they take up so much of the story and their dialog with each other is particularly abominable. At least with the other characters in the story there was a direct connection between why they're opening their mouths and the game you're playing. Sin is literally just there to be a writer's mouthpiece (because of course "you can't harvest the power of the gods yourself so let me create a NPC tag along who does it for you") and it's not even a particularly good one. Also, why does it feel like every other normal human NPC in PoE is a sailor, a ship's captain or a smuggler? We got those two new smuggler characters that show up in all acts with, I swear, some of the cringiest voice acting PoE has ever offered. The chick in particular makes me feel like I need to take a bath after listening to her talk.
The gods too, who are supposed to be ya know, bad ass gods? Barely get any treatment other than "Hey go kill this guy." One of them doesn't even have a quest per se that I could find. I noticed there was a zone I hadn't explored after clearing the FoO and found the boss there, that I retroactively got a reward for after defeating. Their models aren't that amazing and some are even recycled assets, nor are their fights that cool. The areas don't feel like they're under their sway at all, they're gods in name only. Oh and one of the new Pantheon bosses straight up DCs you from the server at the same point in his fight, every time.
I've tolerated PoE's writing and story up until now but even I don't have the patience for FoO's self-indulgent tripe. The whole thing has MAGNUM OPUS stamped across it in 40 foot high letters, only it isn't that good.
All in all, I'm underwhelmed by FoO. Other than the new tilesets and a couple of new enemies, it mostly feels like recycled trash regurgitated into another 5 acts. I wasn't expecting the moon, but about the freshest thing in the expansion to me is the enemies who now launch an attack when they die by default, or the changes to Volatile Blooded enemies. The Pantheon System seems like a joke, yet another extension to the mapping system with a non-scaling pay off that most end game players will have wrapped up in a month.
I like the continuity now of kill Malachai --> watch Oriath Burn --> kill the gods --> become the Ascendant Emperor. That's a nice personal story arc for your character. But that's about the only fluff I find interesting in the whole mess.
Also this league seems like one of the laziest. An entire league to farm for shards of existing currency, or shards for new some currency that, other than the Mirror of Kalandara or w/e, seems mostly like junk.
If there is one silver lining to me in FoO, it's that the difficulty curve in PoE is now finally feels reasonable. I had exactly zero troubles with any of the major fights (I didn't fight Kitava so, maybe she's as ridiculous as pre-FoO Malachi was.) Granted my main is pretty OP for story content but still. I was expecting some GGG style difficulty spikes and didn't find them. Which I'm happy about. I feel like the real ball breaking content should be in the end game anyways, not in the lead up to the end game.
Post by: Kanil on August 07, 2017, 03:52:51 pm
If there is one silver lining to me in FoO, it's that the difficulty curve in PoE is now finally feels reasonable. I had exactly zero troubles with any of the major fights (I didn't fight Kitava so, maybe she's as ridiculous as pre-FoO Malachi was.) Granted my main is pretty OP for story content but still. I was expecting some GGG style difficulty spikes and didn't find them. Which I'm happy about. I feel like the real ball breaking content should be in the end game anyways, not in the lead up to the end game.
The amount of times I got instagibbed by the bosses playing through acts 7-10 is really the opposite of this experience, and is easily my least favorite part of the expansion.
That the game drops maps, gives me a map device, and then tells me "go bury Kitava in your corpses first" adds to my frustration. To think Merciless Act 4 was an upgrade, if for no other reason than that you didn't have to actually bother with it.
At least I don't have to do it again any time soon.
Also, considering how much I dislike act 4, act 9 is actually reasonably enjoyable. This surprised me.
Post by: nenjin on August 07, 2017, 03:58:48 pm
I mean, I expected some of these bosses to give me a run for my money like map bosses do, but the level scaling ensured that didn't/wouldn't happen I guess. I've just been so used to get kicked in the dick by new GGG bosses that I guess I was surprised when I didn't see it here. I really should go fight Kitava though just so I can see how bad she is. I thought Malachai was the pinnacle of BS boss fights, I wonder if they topped him.
Post by: Aklyon on August 07, 2017, 04:08:26 pm
Post by: Retropunch on August 07, 2017, 05:26:19 pm
Post by: Retropunch on August 07, 2017, 05:50:54 pm
The Vaal side areas? They're still in. They're not a big step away from regular content, but they're still there.
I'll agree on Harbinger being a really weak league mechanic. The new orbs are nifty, but too sparse to use with any frequency. As an encounter, it's a lot more subdued than ambush or breach, but for the average character that isn't crushing content, it's pretty good. I'm not all that bothered given that we get it in the face of 3.0 and so doesn't really distract players from the new stuff, but I'll definitely hope for something more engaging next time around.
Ahh I've not seen any and I'm at the end of act 3 - I'm sure they used to be way, way more prevalent. Good to know they're around somewhere though.
Re: Harbringers - as I mentioned, I'm absolutely a casual with this (having played through twice before, but basically just to the story end and that's it over about 4 years) and I absolutely roflstomp them. I've never found them even slightly more difficult than average mobs which has meant it's been a bit disappointing. Dropping a few shards is nice, but it's just sorta like a random enemy with a guaranteed drop rather than an 'event'.
I'll keep progressing and see what happens I guess!
Post by: frostshotgg on August 07, 2017, 06:59:31 pm
Post by: Aklyon on August 07, 2017, 09:16:42 pm
Post by: nenjin on August 07, 2017, 09:18:16 pm
If they'd taken the time to allow standard players to actually experience the content, I might have a revised and better opinion. But since GGG doesn't give a fuck about standard beyond wiping out or changing what they need to keep us in synch with the latest game changes, I don't feel very bad about shitting all over it. They don't get to pat themselves on the back for how sweeping and glorious and epic FoO is when they didn't make the effort to make sure this symphony of story writing wasn't presented to their most marginalized group as a disjointed, broken piece of shit you're supposed to skip through.
For me I expected an epic struggle with the gods and what I got was a lot of side drama that had little to do with the player, and more lame semi-jokey sidequests simply to get my skill points back. Again, I felt like someone was writing at me rather than to me with a lot of the new content. I've gotten engaged with PoE lore previously, even come to like the world a bit. But what was supposed to be about your triumph over ALL the gods turned into some sort of weird weepy drama with an emo dude with angel wings with a flawlessly cultured British accent. I'm sure someone will be like "but the duality, the symbolism, the reversal!" but it doesn't really make it good or interesting. It's not like they haven't done this whole thing already with Solaris/Lunaris, did they really need to bash this cliche over the head again so aggressively? I wanted enemies to hate, and eventually, gods to throw down. Getting Piety was cool. Getting Dominus and Malachai was cool. Beating Izaro and becoming as awesome as the Emperors was cool. But what I got in FoO was a lot of awkward, stilted dialog from a character I've never met before and have no reason to care about, and no real way to experience anything to come to an appreciation of it other than tediously regrinding my way through it all. I got a lot of flashy bosses I was supposed to care about beating but who I never even had to fight.
Maybe it's because I've had to face every act boss as the "end game" boss that suddenly having all these new bosses scattered around the game fails to make me feel anything for them. The God especially. Yeesh, talk about underdelivering.
Post by: Aklyon on August 07, 2017, 09:40:04 pm
Other than strip levels off your character to make it fit the level of A5 content (lol, good luck justifying that to anyone above 60 in standard) or some sort of standard-specific level scaling system on top of the new content, I'm not sure how they'd actually replace 2 difficulties of repeated content with 6 acts of mixed new/old content without screwing up the league that only changes when the game itself changes around it, nenjin.
Post by: nenjin on August 07, 2017, 10:46:59 pm
I feel like programmatically they could have come up with a better solution to this but didn't leave themselves the time and, as they often do, hand waved a bad solution and standard bore the brunt of it. Shit I'd almost rather have ground through the expansion entirely to reclaim my points just like everyone else, and actually be invested, than just to have the expansion treated like it didn't matter to my account. This isn't the first time these kinds of issues have cropped up for std players and I'm just annoyed that, this time, it came with basically needing to restart the game to appreciate anything besides the zones and the Pantheon buff in the update. I've never had to do that in PoE to appreciate a content addition, and it's irritating to be told that's my only recourse now. (I don't want to replay the whole game again even if it has a new structure. I've played enough Acts 1 - 4 to last me a life time.)
Quote
I'm not sure how they'd actually replace 2 difficulties of repeated content with 6 acts of mixed new/old content without screwing up the league that only changes when the game itself changes around it, nenjin.
How has any other game solved this issue? Shit, you play Warframe. How many retroactive bullshitty things have we had to go through over the years, because we've put tons of hours in and suddenly they introduce a newbie tutorial and lock some new (or existing!) features to it? We do the content......and then it's done. When they reworked the Solar System the last time so it's all progression unlocks, what did we see when we were in there? We had access to everything but we still had to do the objectives and unlock the relays. They skipped the dumb stuff like "Build a Mastery Rank 5 weapon" by applying our progress, because there's not much to experience in building something from a blueprint. But still made us fill out the missing objectives and unlock the relays, which was like the big key note feature of that update to the system. The story, you might almost say.
How PoE treated std players in the FoO update I think speaks to their continued weakness on the backend of the game, that they still run in to problems like this. This is like the third time in my memory my standard progression has gotten all fucky because of something they've done. That's why they love leagues so fucking much, honestly. They work with a set of assumptions that anything that is a problem in a previous build with characters can just get flushed with the new league and re-written, we're it not for those DAMNED standard players. So we'll just jank with their data. Why can't they just fuck off and play leagues, so we don't have to write sound code! This is the first time, however, where I feel like I've ever missed out on anything as a standard player, where I actually felt my sense of entitlement flare up. They care so little I couldn't even walk through the story on my standard character.
Shit, one new column in the character database, "Act4Vet", True/False. If true, you get no skill points for the quest you completed, and the game skips the reward window on quest completion. If false, it's a post 3.0 character, and shit works as normal. The solution they came up with seems far, far less sensible. No one would have cared they weren't getting rewards for 90% of the quests. Hell they could have swapped in books of regret if they really thought getting rewarded was that important part of the process. Clearly not since most of the rewards for me in the expansion was just relcaiming my existing points (and about 10 respec points or so.)
In the end I just can't thumbs up an expansion which didn't seem to want me to play it as a standard character. I hate that this distinction even exists in PoE and all the drama it causes, and I don't really have anyone to blame except GGG.
Post by: RoguelikeRazuka on August 28, 2017, 11:27:40 am
Here's the best version of the tree I've been able to come up with so far (link to poeplanner) :
https://tinyurl.com/ybelh4cx
PS I don't think my 85 lvl tree is too hard to complete, for I had no significant problems getting to 86 lvl with my Flame Totem templar, having only to do 1-2 tier maps and the boiling lake until he reached some 75 lvl, now at 86 lvl he scores 199% max life and 400% increased dmg for totems, though the dmg output is a bit sucky (being somewhere 8900 fire dps).
Post by: Aklyon on August 28, 2017, 11:35:55 am
Post by: frostshotgg on August 28, 2017, 12:40:15 pm
I would suggest something closer to this: www.poeurl.com/bvJS
You basically just build along the tree towards the ranger starting wheels, grab those then start working up to the shadow damage over time stuff. Grab all the life goodies near scion when you start to feel squishy, and grab the jewel sockets as you find or buy good jewels. Get the deadeye ascendency after cruel lab and occultist after merc. If/when you do uber lab, grab the path of ranger and drop the two points bridging scion to vaal pact. As you get more levels past 85, fill out the Revenge of the Hunted wheel, and pick up the curse wheel you're already at.
Post by: RoguelikeRazuka on August 29, 2017, 08:19:07 am
I decided to leave out IR and the nodes near the duelist start as you suggested and go for both Acrobatics and Phase Acrobatics. I also had to give up Kraityn (for his favour is not very beneficial to me anyway) and take the 2 passive skill points instead. I tried my best getting as many jewel sockets on this build as I could, but as of now I haven't any jewels that would fit my build, neither I can afford these at the moment anyway, so it's not a big priority to me right now, but I could respec some evasion nodes aroud Reflexes (they're not allocated in the linked version) and get two jewels sockets whenever the need to do so comes up.
As for the suggestion to pick Scion rather than Ranger, you see I've started a Ranger some time ago (currently at lvl 22) and now I'm just too lazy to do that part of the game again, and I like Ranger better.
current version of my passive tree is here:
https://tinyurl.com/y8xmy5et
Now the problem concerning me most is the questionable 'sustainability' of the build, for I couldn't come up with a solution that would provide me decent life and mana leech/regen.
And what does Attack Damage refer to, exactly? For example Coldhearted Calculation gives me 12% increased Attack Damage, does it mean damage dealt when you hit, so it's not very useful to my Caustic Arrow ranger focused on dealing damage overtime?
Post by: Aklyon on August 29, 2017, 10:25:13 am
Post by: RoguelikeRazuka on September 03, 2017, 02:24:54 pm
Sad, I really enjoyed playing this build for the most part, but I'm affarid I will have give it up for the time being and seek for something different.
Post by: Rex_Nex on September 03, 2017, 11:14:54 pm
Post by: Aklyon on September 04, 2017, 11:47:41 am
Yeah, Caustic Arrow sadly doesn't scale at all. It never did all that much damage, but then they made it even worse shortly after 2.0 because of its popularity. It's one of those skills that has been completely outclassed by another, namely Essence Drain (+Contagion). I cant think of a skill with lower damage output, even something like Searing Bond has several orders of magnitude more damage.I managed to use Caustic Arrow with Soul Strike quiver (pre-nerf) occultist just fine previously. I believe I had something like 7k dot?
ED/Contagion very much outclasses it though, simply due to it being much easier to find spell damage than chaos/dot/projectile damage.
Elemental hit is practically the rock bottomest of rock bottoms, though. Everything is better than it, especially its improved version, wild strike.
Post by: nenjin on September 04, 2017, 11:15:21 pm
League is kind of a drag though. Once you get over the novelty of having no currency of back up gear, it's like a solid 30 hours (for me at least) to get the point you do enough challenges to get the first league MTX. The challenges are arranged so you pretty much have to beat the game to qualify for anything. Was hoping I could get some of those sweet league uniques to take back to my standard characters too but it looks like they're gated behind some end-level currency thing in Harbinger. Meh. At least I know how long it takes me to do all 10 acts if I spend an entire weekend doing it.
Post by: frostshotgg on September 04, 2017, 11:28:34 pm
Post by: nenjin on September 04, 2017, 11:40:14 pm
More it's just - I'm not a fan of re-leveling characters in aRPGs. I didn't like it in D2, D3 or here. So it feels like a chore. Secondly, I look at how many hours I spent on a character I might throw away, when I could have been leveling my standard toons. I don't trade so I can't shoot through the league and get teh broken drops so....league feels like me spinning my wheels for the most part.
Except for those sweet partial currency shards though. Oohhhh lawdy, such content.
Post by: Aklyon on September 05, 2017, 01:50:25 am
Post by: frostshotgg on September 05, 2017, 03:11:25 am
Post by: RoguelikeRazuka on September 08, 2017, 09:45:26 am
here's my best attempt:
https://tinyurl.com/y83pqhdj
Please note that my tree is built taking into constideration that I have neither crit gear nor currency to afford it, so I tried to grab as many % increased Critical Strike Chance nodes as I could, probably wasting some passive skills points for no particular benefit (in case I do have some crit pieces, like Maligaro's Virtuosity and Rat's Nest).
Post by: nenjin on September 08, 2017, 10:10:12 am
Post by: Aklyon on September 08, 2017, 10:31:31 am
Post by: RoguelikeRazuka on September 08, 2017, 03:26:06 pm
https://tinyurl.com/yab7adq2
less Crit Chance and thus less damage, but more Evasion.
By the way it occurred to me that I actually could use a shield instead of a second claw, which would give me more evasion, life and resistances (at the cost of a notable dps amount, again) in case I manage to find a good shield, and some 20% block chance (~10% more in comparison with the dual claw version) in addition to dodge and evasion is also nice, more survivability that is. What do you think?
PS does Curse on Hit Support have to be linked with a curse gem AND an attack gem in order to work?
Post by: nenjin on September 08, 2017, 04:18:58 pm
PS does Curse on Hit Support have to be linked with a curse gem AND an attack gem in order to work?
Yes.
Post by: Aklyon on September 08, 2017, 05:24:58 pm
Post by: frostshotgg on September 09, 2017, 04:39:40 pm
Post by: nenjin on September 09, 2017, 05:47:49 pm
Post by: frostshotgg on September 09, 2017, 06:48:24 pm
Post by: kcwong on September 19, 2017, 05:00:56 am
I also have a ton of skill gems and leveling uniques that would be useful for new players.
Post by: aristabulus on September 19, 2017, 09:20:57 am
Do we have any rules regarding the guild stash? And one of the tab is someone's name, so I'm reluctant to take/put anything.
I also have a ton of skill gems and leveling uniques that would be useful for new players.
I'm not seeing a tab with someone's name on it... maybe that's a parsing error? or are you in hardcore?
I've got 7 showing Harbinger softcore: Gear - Rares - Flasks - Other - Uniques Uno (spanish 1) - Uniques Dos (spanish 2) - Add Only Storage
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For the levelling uniques, go ahead and toss 'em in where they'll fit, depending on how much you have to deposit. If that's not enough, ping me here on b12 with a PM and we'll figure something out.
Gems... unless they're special in some way (drop-only (https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/List_of_drop-only_gems), +quality, or levelled beyond L14) you shouldn't deposit them, or even hold onto them. Between Siosa and Lilly, most gems are easier to simply purchase when you need them.
For general rules on the stash, it boils down to "don't be a jerk." Drop off useful things when you can, grab what you need, but don't make any executive decisions around space use unless there's a proper issue with fullness. With 7 guild tabs we didn't even come close to maxxing out in the front half of Harbinger, when more people were active.
Post by: kcwong on September 19, 2017, 08:10:04 pm
I'm not seeing a tab with someone's name on it... maybe that's a parsing error? or are you in hardcore?
I've got 7 showing Harbinger softcore: Gear - Rares - Flasks - Other - Uniques Uno (spanish 1) - Uniques Dos (spanish 2) - Add Only Storage
Ah, forgot to mention I'm in Standard. I play too little to start over again and again, I have some unique items I'd like to be able to use.
Gems... unless they're special in some way (drop-only (https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/List_of_drop-only_gems), +quality, or levelled beyond L14) you shouldn't deposit them, or even hold onto them. Between Siosa and Lilly, most gems are easier to simply purchase when you need them.
I'm hopeless about this - a size 1 crystal thingy, so pretty, I can't resist picking them up <3
I sort my gems alphabetically - in a lot of premium pages. Active skills I have one row of each, save 3 spaces for Vaal version, good support gems I have two rows, all these gems in various levels so I always have some low and high level to choose from.
For general rules on the stash, it boils down to "don't be a jerk." Drop off useful things when you can, grab what you need, but don't make any executive decisions around space use unless there's a proper issue with fullness. With 7 guild tabs we didn't even come close to maxxing out in the front half of Harbinger, when more people were active.
But say if I take an unique item - is it a loan or can I keep it forever? This is complicated because of no. of sockets and links, and socket colors. I could take something to test for 5 minutes and destroy someone's build because I removed all the off-colors.
Post by: Aklyon on September 19, 2017, 08:54:26 pm
Post by: aristabulus on September 19, 2017, 09:05:49 pm
kcwong, I feel your pain on the skill gems, I really do. It took a _lot_ of effort to break my old habits... but I got there. Now, I manage to keep the gems down to a quarter of my Misc Neat Things tab; just the noteworthy stuff I mentioned before.
Post by: kcwong on September 28, 2017, 02:50:55 am
yeah... anything I put in the guild stash I fully expect to never see again.
kcwong, I feel your pain on the skill gems, I really do. It took a _lot_ of effort to break my old habits... but I got there. Now, I manage to keep the gems down to a quarter of my Misc Neat Things tab; just the noteworthy stuff I mentioned before.
I keep picking them up because there are new gems added... without consulting wiki I won't recognize them all, and without access to my stash I don't know how much I already have. My goal is to make sure I have enough number of each gem when I use them. I try to skip non-quality, really old gems for now.
I have 7 (1 of them quad) tabs for generic loot which I quickly dump things in to sort out later... and I have 5 other tabs for quickly dumping gems, 1 for quality gems and 1 for vaal gems.
Because I don't like to trade, I have 3 tabs to do chaos recipe as well. And I buy Masters' unique items, bro-deal or not.
Post by: nenjin on September 28, 2017, 09:46:21 am
It's honestly a hold over behavior from when you couldn't buy gems off NPC vendors. Now I think I could honestly just dump half of them. But it's nice to have lvl 1 gems around since buying them from vendors tends to bring them leveled to 9 or something. So it's still slightly more convenient for me to collect gems than buy them as needed.
Post by: cerapa on September 28, 2017, 01:20:22 pm
Post by: Aklyon on September 28, 2017, 08:42:05 pm
Post by: kcwong on September 28, 2017, 10:42:36 pm
Ayup, the A6 gem vendor sells all level 1 gems.
I didn't notice that O_o I assumed vendor gem inventory level as you do.
** This is the sound of my 30+ alphabetically ordered gem tabs collapsing **
Post by: nenjin on September 28, 2017, 10:45:34 pm
Post by: Aklyon on September 29, 2017, 02:58:25 pm
Post by: kcwong on October 01, 2017, 02:27:56 am
Post by: Jopax on November 17, 2017, 06:12:03 am
Basically the Shaper is fighting another eldritch entity over the control of the atlas, each doing their own messed up shit to it. Buncha new maps, some new skills, new items and cool item mods that come from the shaper and the elder thing itself (seems mostly like the new mods add support gem effects to socketed stuff, which might lead to some cool things and possibly reduce the value of 6l items).
Drops in about 20 days on the 8th.
Also there's two events running atm, turmoil and mayhem next week, got some cool rewards for reaching a certain level, but more than that, the fact that every area has random map-like mods applied makes it pretty damn entertaining, plus it seems that drop rates are super high (getting an exalt in 3 days after not getting one in 3 years :V). Turmoil lasts 'till tommorrow tho and it's the one that lets you keep whatever you get, mayhem is a bit too extreme and would likely crash the economy of standard for a long while so that one gets wiped on end.
Post by: nenjin on November 17, 2017, 11:22:54 am
Post by: Jopax on November 17, 2017, 11:31:25 am
Post by: Jopax on February 15, 2018, 04:35:49 pm
Trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPyyo8_Ndyo&feature=youtu.be)
Info (https://www.pathofexile.com/bestiary)
Short of it is Pokemon/Monster Hunter league with new NPC dude, buncha uniques getting fated upgrades, uber elder and reworked ascendancies. Comes out 2nd of March.
I just hope that whatever they do they don't nerf the poets pen (tho that's pretty much a given considering how bloody broken the thing is) because a dual poets build is stupid fun from level 12 until whenever you stop playing it.
Post by: nenjin on February 15, 2018, 04:50:35 pm
They'll also probably roll out their graphics update, which fades out terrain that obstructs your view of your character, officially bringing PoE visual tech up to 2002.
Finally started leveling a Ranger. Ppfffffttt. This shit is a joke. After years of playing only melees, then graduating to casters, now playing a legit ranged build with good uniques is like......now I can understand how people shred at T12 map in 3 minutes. The power difference between ranged and melee, just based on attack speed alone, is kind of sickening. Who needs HP and damage mitigation when most of the things you fight are dead before they even enter your screen.
The real question I have is: will Scion actually get some attention when it comes to the reworked Ascendancies, or if she'll just get another shit-ass grab bag of random half-abilities.
Post by: Rex_Nex on May 10, 2018, 07:32:05 pm
Lots of skill gem changes to go alongside it, with the most notable being a totally reworked Vaal skill system. Vaal gems themselves now provide both the Vaal and standard version of the skill, are substantially more powerful, but cannot accrue their own souls. This means you have super powerful vaal skills that will also benefit from all the links you'd use for your standard gem, but you have to be more picky about when you use them.
Post by: nenjin on May 10, 2018, 08:38:30 pm
Quote
Lots of skill gem changes to go alongside it, with the most notable being a totally reworked Vaal skill system. Vaal gems themselves now provide both the Vaal and standard version of the skill, are substantially more powerful, but cannot accrue their own souls. This means you have super powerful vaal skills that will also benefit from all the links you'd use for your standard gem, but you have to be more picky about when you use them.
Oh man, this means I can run 50 summons again on my Necromancer without feeling like I'm wasting a skill gem slot. This shit is gonna be sssssiiiiiiiiiccccccckkkkkkk.
Post by: Aoi on May 11, 2018, 12:41:05 pm
.....now I can understand how people shred at T12 map in 3 minutes.
I run a noob minion build and can do T12s in about 5 minutes. Which is twice what you said, but I think is pretty solid for a build that has its most expensive componnent be an ancient Tabula Rasa. (Yeah, it's been a long time since I last played... I believe it was HC Domination league where I dropped it in the Cliffs, and promptly died against the... jailer guy.)
I've seen melee builds plow waaaay ahead of me, but I suspect they'rre also way more expensive.
Post by: aristabulus on May 11, 2018, 05:36:43 pm
...
I run a noob minion build and can do T12s in about 5 minutes. ...
I've been doing a cheap-ass summoner as my league starter for the last few leagues, and I get to about T10 maps on 99% solo self found gear. I typically buy a Dream Fragments (the anti-freeze ring, 1c) and a Perandus Blazon (item quantity and stats belt, 1c) strictly for convenience, and just let my wealth accrue. It's niyce, varry varrry niyce. /borat
I can tear through maps that fast, but usually only do so for Zana missions; normally I like picking up all the things, otherwise. ;)
-----
It's been a while since I've posted in this thread, so a guild update is probably in order.
Nist Akath is still a thing that exists. I'm officially the leader these days, as I've been playing PoE more steadily than Aklyon. Realistically, that just means I'm the one that sets up and organizes the guild stash when it needs that. Guild business is generally still handled by tribunal/consensus among officers, and it's really rare things ever have to get that formal.
We're still a laid-back cats-herding-cats sort of situation, but always willing to welcome new folks with open arms.
Post by: Aklyon on May 11, 2018, 06:03:01 pm
Post by: aristabulus on May 11, 2018, 06:19:43 pm
I think the most formal thing that happened recently was just on if we'd try to accumulate rings for a loreweave to sell and split the chaos from or not.
Yeah, and that amounted to a bit of Actual Discussion, then nothing happened because cats-herding-cats. :P (which is okay, really, because the Loreweave prices cratered as soon as the surprise wore off)
-----
Bestiary league frustrated me in a lot of ways... targeting the dudes with the correct net timing was a hassle (especially with all the adds), and the fancy captures just didn't show up often enough. My consolation prize was that kill or capture, the bestiary dudes generated a lot of rares, which worked out nicely for my wealth strategy.
I'm hopeful for the Incursion league. The time travel angle is kinda absurd, but the game design bits look solid... feels a lot like "build your own labyrinth" with a side of the timer race from breachstone realms. It also seems like the league content will be frequent enough to not feel bad if you bungle a run occasionally.
Post by: Jopax on May 12, 2018, 05:23:25 am
Atm I'm faffing about in the flashback event, trying random dumb builds like lightning strike witch.
Looking forward to incursion because scaling dungeons like the lab are pretty fun and I'd love to see more of them, especially if there's not much rng fuckery involved with accessing them. I'm not sure if I'll be able to play much tho since I start working next week, so here's hoping it's recieved well and goes to core afterwards.
Post by: frostshotgg on May 12, 2018, 06:05:10 am
At the end of the day, the mechanic was just out of place in the game, and even fully developed it would still be really awkward. I do hope the pokedex returns as a when you kill it get the doodle and such, that was super neat and is probably easy enough to add as a random flavor element.
Post by: Aoi on May 12, 2018, 11:37:44 am
Nist Akath is still a thing that exists. I'm officially the leader these days, as I've been playing PoE more steadily than Aklyon. Realistically, that just means I'm the one that sets up and organizes the guild stash when it needs that. Guild business is generally still handled by tribunal/consensus among officers, and it's really rare things ever have to get that formal.
Sure, why not. I think I'm still in Order of Armok... last seen in November 2013. :o
Post by: aristabulus on May 12, 2018, 03:45:14 pm
...
Sure, why not. I think I'm still in Order of Armok... last seen in November 2013. :o
Sent you a PM with guild info.
Post by: Rex_Nex on May 15, 2018, 08:32:41 pm
Bestiary was just essence with extra tedium, but I spent a lot of time on it. I like slow leagues where people don't have as easy access to humongous amounts of wealth. Hopefully the next time they try a slow league like this, it's actually enjoyable to interact with.
Post by: nenjin on May 15, 2018, 11:56:46 pm
Quote
This is probably the fastest build in the game too, so I can't imagine how it feels to do on something less minmaxed for xp/h.
In a word: Sisyphean. But when you play SSF a little bit at a time throughout the year in the same league, I dunno, there's never any end to content I haven't seen.
Post by: nenjin on June 01, 2018, 01:34:07 pm
Chris Wilson assures fans that nothing will change, that Tencent won't meddle in the development of PoE.
He might even be right. But as one youtuber commented: "Will players change how they choose to support PoE since they know the money is no longer going to a small indie dev team, but to the largest multinational media, tech and game company in the world?"
For me, with my level of involvement with PoE, this isn't a big deal. But I can easily see people who have invested deeply in PoE feeling that GGG has sold out, and traded in their independence for a big fat payday. It might also lend credence to the belief that Wilson and team may try moving on to a different game, leaving PoE with a maintenance staff and a few people to dev new content.
Time will tell I guess. I've played PoE for a long time, so if suddenly went down the Chinese P2W microtransaction shitter or something, I'd live.
Post by: Jopax on June 01, 2018, 01:52:42 pm
As far as possible buyers go, tencent is probably one of the better ones if you look at their other titles since they mostly fuck about with the chinese version while leaving the western one in pretty good dev control (biggest example of this would be LoL, which has one of the better F2P models out there).
Still, the hardcore backers have been alienated by this, not sure what they'll do without their regular core of supporters buying several hundred dollar packs on a regular basis. And I think it's pretty obvious they'll be doing another game in the near future, PoE is rather old and bloated at this point, starting fresh with everything they've learned over its dev cycle would be the smart thing to do, tho I doubt they'd just up and stop supporting it out of the blue, or anytime soon.
Anyways, incursion is live, get to mass murdering those vaal builders folks :D
Post by: Aoi on June 01, 2018, 01:56:26 pm
As far as possible buyers go, tencent is probably one of the better ones if you look at their other titles since they mostly fuck about with the chinese version while leaving the western one in pretty good dev control (biggest example of this would be LoL, which has one of the better F2P models out there).
I find that to be a rather interesting assessment, from a non-LoL person... For a while, PoE chat was filled with people talking about how it'll go straight downhill like LoL did, once Tencent acquired it.
Post by: Retropunch on June 01, 2018, 02:17:54 pm
I'm not a LoL fan so I don't know how annoying/awful that was, but I do know that PoE is a completely different beast, and I can't imagine they can make it any less casual than it already is. I also doubt - very strongly - they'll mess around with the microtransactions and make them have anything other than a cosmetic impact, as it's at the core of PoEs model. It'd wreck the economy if they started allowing people to buy stuff, and I'm sure they'd know that going in.
All that being said, I can imagine they might focus ongoing development around PvP as that's their main thing. I can see them making ranked PvP a big thing, and trying to e-sports it a bit. I can't imagine it'd impact on the main game too much, but it might change the focus of development away from solo play stuff.
Post by: Jopax on June 01, 2018, 02:23:54 pm
ninja edit:
They haven't really jacked the prices of champions as much as they've made the IP (or whatever it's called now) gains a bit less consistent, which was mitigated by chances of getting champion shards from the boxes which would make getting a particular champion way cheaper. So it became less consistent and a bit gamblier but overall the grind was mostly the same. They also enabled getting skins and shit for free trough the same system which was cool.
Also I wouldn't say it got anymore competitive, maybe the ranked play, but that was always a cesspit of idiots taking the whole thing way too seriously and personally. Nothing stopping folks from playing the more relaxed unranked mode afaik.
Post by: nenjin on June 01, 2018, 03:46:16 pm
But leagues are the meat and potatoes of PoE. If they started suffering do a change of focus and resources for GGG, I think it would have direct impact on PoE's continued popularity.
Post by: Retropunch on June 01, 2018, 04:12:33 pm
Well if GGG did move on to something else, I'm pretty sure the quality of regular league content would decline. (Depending on who you ask, maybe that's not possible :P)
But leagues are the meat and potatoes of PoE. If they started suffering do a change of focus and resources for GGG, I think it would have direct impact on PoE's continued popularity.
I agree to a point, but I think leagues are mostly important for long term players - which is important overall, but there's a hell of a lot of content (like an insane amount) for those coming to it fresh/who aren't hardcore fans.
However, I would very much imagine that they'll combine leagues with more PvP focused play. It would be an easy (and pretty obvious) move to have a sort of Dark Souls type invasion of other players as a league. Add to that a bit of ranking, and it'd get in a whole host of new players that are interested in ganking.
Post by: nenjin on June 01, 2018, 04:24:57 pm
Post by: Jopax on June 02, 2018, 03:13:56 am
PoE already has (albeit poorly implemented) PvP that's barely played by anyone, forcing something similar on the rest of the playerbase would be a bad idea.
Post by: Rex_Nex on June 06, 2018, 02:13:53 am
I'm really curious whether or not they plan on keeping the mechanic around after the league. The norm would be to add it in its entirely and reduce the spawn chance from every zone to every 10 zones or so, but I don't think the mechanic would work at all after that. Having to go 110 maps on average to open a single temple would make the entire system unusable, but you can't reduce the number of incursions required or players won't have any chance to modify the temple.
Post by: Jopax on June 06, 2018, 03:05:22 am
So if they want to introduce it to the core game they'll probably have to cut the returns from it quite a bit (which is fine imo, as long as the t3 rooms are a guarantee of something good like they are now). Ideally I'd love to see her as a regular or map only master whose daily was a single incursion, that way you'd be guaranteed a run every ten days or so even if you almost never met her in maps.
Post by: Rex_Nex on August 10, 2018, 01:39:57 am
Not too keen on the whole cart-guiding aspect, but an infinite dungeon with infinite difficulty is something PoE really needed. I think it's pretty important for the game to have something that challenges your build regardless of how overtuned it is, and mining far enough down will be a way to do that. I want to see what their take on rewards is, though; I do want a reason to keep pushing my build and the difficulty of the dungeon, but I also know infinitely scaling rewards is a really easy way to destroy the economy.
Post by: Damiac on August 10, 2018, 04:01:42 pm
I dunno, maybe that "missing something" feeling means they're doing something right, and I should spend money to make it better, but I will never spend money on a free game, it would ruin it for me.
Post by: Descan on August 10, 2018, 04:03:37 pm
Post by: nenjin on August 10, 2018, 05:02:51 pm
Quote
I always feel like they keep adding crap to keep my stash overstuffed, to tempt me to buy more slots.
This is their primary monetization strategy. Whales buying cosmetic supporter packs for hundreds of dollars every major update can only take you so far. The currency system IS there to facilitate microtransactions from the non-whale crowd, it's true.
But a perspective from someone with thousands of hours in game and maybe a couple hundred dollars in it since beta:
-There is so much content, between different classes to play and builds and what not, that after a few hundred hours I felt they were owed SOMETHING.
-There are only three MUST HAVE purchases to keep you on par with the average POE player:
1. Currency Stash Tab.
2. Map Stash Tab.
3. 4 Premium Stash tabs to augment the starting amount you get.
I think all that will run you about $40? With those three you can pretty much hold everything as long as you're not a hoarder. Most of my extra stash tabs are there to hold junk Uniques that I can't bring myself to vendor. Every once in a while one of them will sell for peanuts from my public stash tab. So that's really my own dysfunction causing me to spend more on PoE than I actually need.
The thing about POE is character and gear options get deeper and more interesting the longer you play, IMO. Many currencies do not appear or becomes relevant until the mid-to-end game, and many of the "content flourishes" that have been added to the standard league over the years really get in to full swing near the end game. There's always SOMETHING to look forward to it in a map, whether that's an Abyss, Tormented Spirit, Breach, Rogue Exiles, Unique Chests, etc and so forth. Can't blame anyone for feeling the game is "missing something" but I'd also argue those people may not have invested the time to really plumb the depths of optimizing their character, their build or their gear.
Post by: frostshotgg on August 10, 2018, 05:06:31 pm
Post by: Rex_Nex on August 10, 2018, 06:17:45 pm
I will never spend money on a free game, it would ruin it for me.
Yeah, they absolutely do add in a lot of items seemingly just to take up space. I can't really blame them, and I expect you don't either, but going into every F2P game with a "I refuse to spent a cent on this" mindset can be really bad. Some games absolutely will just keep guzzling money in order for you to keep enjoying them (and your mindset is pretty important there), but there's other games like PoE where you put in ten or twenty bucks once and are almost never pestered into buying anything ever again. The only ones who're being suckered out of their wallets are the whales spending $100+ on sets of lowpoly wings and plastic armor.
PoE is also something that doesn't feel like a free game to me, which makes me feel a lot better about putting a few dollars into it.
Post by: Retropunch on August 12, 2018, 10:14:27 am
Every so often I come back to this game, but it never manages to grab me. The setting and plot are just horrible, but it's not as if Diablo 2 won any oscars, and I hated parts of that game too. It just feels like it's missing something, and at the same time, to properly make currency and build your character, you have to collect certain items, keep going back to town and selling stuff, and filling up your stash. I always feel like they keep adding crap to keep my stash overstuffed, to tempt me to buy more slots. This was obviously not a concern in diablo 2, although there was limited storage, you couldn't spend more money to get more (Unless you wanted to buy another copy of the game I guess). It felt like you were given the amount you were supposed to have.
I dunno, maybe that "missing something" feeling means they're doing something right, and I should spend money to make it better, but I will never spend money on a free game, it would ruin it for me.
I've played PoE on and off for years (I do about one 'full run' per year) and I've never spent a penny on it and have never seen the need. The only thing that 'alters' game play is buying tabs for the stash, and I honestly don't see how you can fill it up unless you hoard everything special you see or you're wanting to put in enough time to be a 'major' player (and if that's the case then £10-20 really isn't much for the amount of time you're spending). They never pressure you into getting anything, and you don't really alter gameplay by paying.
I have to agree with Rex_Nex that your mindset on it feels a bit off on this one - so many games I'd agree with you on the 'f2p model sucks', but this one is a bit different. Maybe it's just not for you though - I don't get MOBAs even though I love all the 'parts' to them. I love 4x games but don't like Civ, etc. etc.
Post by: Damiac on August 12, 2018, 10:52:08 am
I play MWO as well, according to steam I have 1000 hours in it. I've got tons and tons of mechs and bays, but again, I would never spend a penny, or suddenly the game would be ruined for me. If I spend money on a game, it's like it owes me something, expectations are higher. MWO has no plot, obviously, and it's quite repetitive, but I don't feel the same way about it for some reason.
My issues with the F2P model are my own, and like you say, there's a difference between loot boxes and powerups, and extra stash tabs.
Post by: Retropunch on August 12, 2018, 04:39:54 pm
Yeah, it's definitely me, I don't blame GGG for making the game the way it is. The weird part is how difficult it is to express what exactly it is that keeps this game from being one of my favorites, when it checks all the right boxes....
I play MWO as well, according to steam I have 1000 hours in it. I've got tons and tons of mechs and bays, but again, I would never spend a penny, or suddenly the game would be ruined for me....
I think PoE has to be viewed as slightly different to something like Diablo - PoE is all about creating and advancing a 'build'. It's not really about the story (although it's serviceable enough) or anything like that, it's all about creating that build. So it all comes down to how much you like theory crafting and working towards that goal. It's amazing some of the combos that you can make, because you can get stuff to trigger off other stuff and just end up ramping up the DPS to ridiculous, screen clearing levels.
In so far as spending money ruining games, I find that kinda difficult to understand. The expectations are higher if you pay for something, but if you're already put in 1000 hours in it, how is your expectation really going to change? You're not suddenly going to say 'actually, this game is terrible because I bought a cheap extra mechbay' or whatever.
Mostly though, I feel it's a bit unfair on the developers - they're obviously trying to make a living and for the good F2P games they're not trying to 'trick' you or give you pay2win. If you're spending 1000's of hours on something don't you feel that they've deserved some of your hard earned cash? It seems like a weird excuse to just not pay for what you're getting. Any game that pretends to be free but then gates progress with cash should be rightly deprived of money, but if you can play the whole game without forking out a penny, I don't see how it can be 'ruined'.
Another way to look at it - if you spend £/$10 on it, it's about a quarter the cost of a normal game - is the 1000 hours you put into MWO equal enjoyment to at least quarter of a full priced normal game?
Post by: Rex_Nex on September 01, 2018, 01:57:15 am
Post by: Jopax on November 13, 2018, 03:26:29 pm
Infodump (https://www.pathofexile.com/betrayal)
tl:dr
They're reworking how masters work, rolling Delve, Incursion and even Bestiary into the core game and the new expansion is themed around dismantling a thaumaturgical mafia trough what looks suspiciously Shadow of Mordor-like mechanics with interrogations, assasinations, betrayals, ambushes and whatnot, all working towards getting the right people into the right place in order to murder them and take all their shit.
Also new skills and stuff.
Edit:
I'm sure it's simply a coincidence but calling the league Betrayal and the mob you gotta take down the Immortal Syndicate seems a bit on the nose considering some recent news XD
Post by: cerapa on November 14, 2018, 02:43:22 pm
I'm sure it's simply a coincidence but calling the league Betrayal and the mob you gotta take down the Immortal Syndicate seems a bit on the nose considering some recent news XD
They were considering naming it Immortal in October while in development, but decided to go for Betrayal instead. (https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/9wshh7/path_of_exile_betrayal_league/e9mywt1/)
Post by: Retropunch on November 15, 2018, 04:02:50 am
More than anything though, I'm glad that they're making more sort of procedural generated story to fill it out - it'll certainly help with the replays.
Post by: Apodaca on November 15, 2018, 05:38:41 am
New Noocube results update (https://www.villagevoice.com/2022/01/17/noocube-review/) looks really good, and it's great that they're listening to the player base. The masters were pretty rubbish, and one of the few weak links.
More than anything though, I'm glad that they're making more sort of procedural generated story to fill it out - it'll certainly help with the replays.
I'm so hyped up for the Betrayal update. Seems to have a decent amount of depth to it so it doesn't look like it's going to be just a big grind and nothing else.
Post by: Retropunch on November 15, 2018, 02:36:06 pm
I'm so hyped up for the Betrayal update. Seems to have a decent amount of depth to it so it doesn't look like it's going to be just a big grind and nothing else.
Agreed, I can't really get into 'grind for the sake of more numbers' anymore - it can be really cathartic to just smash stuff up and get great loot, but I need *something* to keep me going beyond that. This seems just that - any more additional story they can add is great.
I really hope they keep going down this route of sort of adding more side stories - not just side quests, but sort of full separate quests in the same world. It'd be a really different sort of mechanic - not quite MMORPG style as it'd be a lot more cohesive, and not general RPG type of 'side quests that build you up for the main quest' but sort of...completely separate full quests that all merge together a bit.
Post by: Sirian on November 16, 2018, 05:14:13 am
I can tell you one thing : the jokes about having or not having phones are never ending on the global chat. Seems like PoE is benefiting greatly from the Diablo debacle.
Anyways, I'm not hoping for much viability but I'll still try to make a semi-functional build based on the Duelist-Slayer. We'll see how it goes. Mostly I just want to learn enough to get build ideas for a next character.
So far my biggest discovery was that I could vastly improve my survivability in Delve if I kept jumping in place (mobs don't attack while you're airborne).
Post by: Jopax on November 16, 2018, 05:51:53 am
That said, the Slayer is one of the tankier classes, mostly because he gets crazy good sustain trough his ascendancy (life leech doesn't stop at full hp, which essentially means you get over-regen of sorts making jumping back from big hits super quick. Which skill are you mainly using though? There's some pretty good ones for 2-handing, even if they all kinda pale in comparison with dual-wield/statsticking when it comes to damage output.
Post by: nenjin on November 16, 2018, 10:42:08 am
I've started a new character, having some fun discovering the game mechanics (I've played before but didn't go very far).
I can tell you one thing : the jokes about having or not having phones are never ending on the global chat. Seems like PoE is benefiting greatly from the Diablo debacle.
Anyways, I'm not hoping for much viability but I'll still try to make a semi-functional build based on the Duelist-Slayer. We'll see how it goes. Mostly I just want to learn enough to get build ideas for a next character.
So far my biggest discovery was that I could vastly improve my survivability in Delve if I kept jumping in place (mobs don't attack while you're airborne).
Here's my take:
Most builds work up through the end of the game. They may struggle a little in some boss fights or in the Labyrinth, but by and large almost any build will get you to the end of the game. Real build viability is how deeply can you make it in to maps. Do you struggle to do enough DPS, or are you such a glass cannon that you're getting one-shot. For your first build I'd just do what feels natural. Focus on getting a large HP pool, and tweak things as you go along and get better drops or a unique you can combo with. If you set the bar as "I wanna do max tier maps and kill the Shaper etc...." many builds either can't get there or take a long time to get the gear they need to make their build work. So I wouldn't worry about that too much as you're playing. Just enjoy the ride. End game PoE is its own thing.
Post by: Sirian on November 16, 2018, 01:29:47 pm
Which skill are you mainly using though? There's some pretty good ones for 2-handing, even if they all kinda pale in comparison with dual-wield/statsticking when it comes to damage output.
Right now (lvl 29), since I'm using 2h swords, I'm using mostly Cleave (+life gain on hit support) for aoe and Heavy Strike (+ruthless & maim supports) for single target.
I also have Leap slam for mobility and surviving encirclements in Delve. Oh and I have Vaal double strike (+chance to bleed support) that I use on bosses.
My biggest issue is that I'm constantly much above the level of my gear, and if I go to same-level depths in Delve to get better gear, I just explode due to...my shitty gear. I stomp through the normal campaign though. I'm trying to go for life leeching so I took the Vaal Pact and the Mana leech / Life leech passives.
Post by: Jopax on November 16, 2018, 01:47:02 pm
Also VP is a bit of a trap early on since you probably won't be leeching that much, if at all (life gain on hit isn't the same as life leech so VP does nothing for it) compared to the regen that will probably save you more than once (especially if you took any of the bigger nodes that give you % of max HP regen as well as %max HP).
In general, try and get atleast 1k hp every three or so acts as well as keeping your resists capped, tho this will probably only matter in the second part of the campaign after the res penalty kicks in and the mobs/bosses become a bit more dangerous.
Post by: Flying Dice on November 18, 2018, 12:02:52 am
The specific line is "Recover 0.5% of your maximum life per poison affecting enemies you kill."
VP explicitly only stops passive regeneration, and TD should be classed as part of the "on-hit/on-kill" element of life recovery and is phrased in the same generic way as health flasks (which are now not blocked by VP), but I wanted to see if anyone knew from experience whether that's actually the case before I start popping regrets to test it.
Post by: Teneb on November 18, 2018, 08:01:08 am
Am I just screwed and will have to make a new character?
Post by: Flying Dice on November 18, 2018, 10:52:12 am
Since we're talking builds, I'm currently running into a problem that while my character can just melt through enemies... even a basic attack from a boss (or merely getting attacked by a few regulars for a couple of seconds) results in instant death. Here's a link to my build (http://www.poeurl.com/b8va).I'm a newbie to poe, but that's pretty self-evident even to me. You've only got +18% increased maximum life. Most level 90-96 builds have +150%-200% as a bare minimum and would take more if they could. You also only, so far as I can tell, have Art of the Gladiator (+24%evasion/armor) for your other defense layers. Not even a second node of +%evasion or armor, and not a single Ele Res node. That is beyond squishy.
Am I just screwed and will have to make a new character?
For reference, the assassin I'm using right now, that I think is way too squishy, has (at lv.62) +100% max life, +98% evasion, and +29% to all three ele res. My target for if I eventually take it to lv100 in standard is +185% health, +190% evasion, Acrobatics, and -3% ele res after the curses. And I still think that's way too squishy and could use more defensive layers, but I can't fit them and still have the stuff I need for the build to DPS properly.
Grab those +%life/evasion/armor nodes right at the start of your tree. Grab the ones around Golem's Blood. Grab Thick Skin. Maybe grab Weathered Hunter. You're the second-closest class to Sentinel & the +18% res nodes, and to the massive block of life around Constitution, beeline to those. I don't know exactly what you want to do with the build, but whatever direction you build towards, grab the relevant defensive nodes. As I understand it, aside from a handful of essentials depending on what you're doing, every build prioritizes stacking defensive layers to avoid popping like soap bubbles. For a more damage-oriented class you might still pop against some bosses and rares, but at-level ordinary mobs shouldn't even remotely be a threat.
Post by: Mini on November 18, 2018, 11:14:52 am
Since we're talking builds, I'm currently running into a problem that while my character can just melt through enemies... even a basic attack from a boss (or merely getting attacked by a few regulars for a couple of seconds) results in instant death. Here's a link to my build (http://www.poeurl.com/b8va).You have only 18% increased life from the tree, that's the obvious place to start. There's the other starting node, with +14 life, as well as two sets of nodes you can start getting immediately, once including Golem Blood, and the other including Thick Skin. Grabbing all of both of those will bring you up to 31% increased, which is a bit better, although you will still want more, particularly as you level up. I generally see life builds go towards the Constitution circle/rectangle/whatever shape it is now, where there is a large cluster of life nodes (for a total of 49% increased). It looks like you are going to be dual-wielding swords, in which case there is the wheel on the right of the tree with Herbalism on the way, for another 20% and better life flasks, and the wheel on the left with Barbarism and Juggernaut nearby, and Bloodless along the way. Heart of the Warrior is another good node, in front of the Marauder start, and there are quite a few other good nodes over there too. Note that obviously you can't get every node on the tree, so you'll have to consider trade-offs.
Am I just screwed and will have to make a new character?
tl;dr: you need to get more increased life, of which there is a bit directly nearby. You can probably continue as (optionally using a few re-spec points) by going for those immediately and not neglecting it in the future.
Post by: Teneb on November 18, 2018, 11:44:13 am
EDIT: After spending my 7 respec points I'm somewhat more survivable (though not by a lot) now. Probably would be best to start over, but might as well wait for the Betryal league for that.
Meanwhile, I'm making do by using flasks to pump up my evasion.
Post by: Flying Dice on November 18, 2018, 12:24:20 pm
Post by: Teneb on November 18, 2018, 12:31:40 pm
TBH there's nothing wrong with continuing to play Delve while it lasts. Good experience for your next build and you can still aim for the challenge rewards.That character's an old one from Abyss league. Stopped for a while and returned recently.
To be fair, I think the situation got as bad as it did as a consequence of my anxiety, which I was sort-of in denial until rather recently. Seeing huge sprawling webs of choices like PoE's skill tree causes me to sometimes lock down... resulting in me picking whatever seems more attractive at the moment ("more damage!").
Post by: Flying Dice on November 18, 2018, 01:32:43 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 18, 2018, 02:49:22 pm
So it's a balance but I'd definitely start prioritizing HP over everything if you're feeling the damage before you've finished the game. It's way easier to do it now then be in early or mid tier maps and realize you need another 40% increased max life or w/e.
Post by: Flying Dice on November 18, 2018, 05:45:34 pm
Post by: aristabulus on November 19, 2018, 04:14:30 pm
The balancing act with sulphite was a lot easier to manage after I made a couple secondary tunnels, as I reaped a lot of extra azurite on the way and didn't need to fluff up my light radius or darkness resist. With a cap of 29k now, I mostly let it fill and delve when I want.
If anyone wants or needs help, Delve or Standard, I can be available for most things. Map boss backup, lab runs, challenge hunting, etc. I also tend to have a lot of stuff laying about, so I may be able to help with gear upgrades.
-----
Nist Akath (Wraeclast chapter) is still a thing that exists. Little has changed since last time... I am still nominally at the helm, but it's a cats-herding-cats situation as usual. No attendance or participation requirements, but if you fall to the bottom of the roster you're in danger of a no-hard-feelings kick to make room for fresh blood. (not as dire as it sounds, last trimming was people that hadn't logged in for a year)
To find me, the IG names to search for are:
Saoirse_of_Sarn
Cameron_of_Oriath
b12 PMs are also okay, as they echo to my email; I do poke my nose in here semi-regularly, but I don't log in unless I have a reason.
-----
Has anyone formed thoughts about the new private leagues? It can be set up to do a guild-SSF type experience, though guild membership isn't strictly required, just an invitation to the private league. I was thinking it might be nice to see how far the group can get in the first month or two of Betrayal on our own finds, sharing and helping each other.
Post by: Jopax on December 03, 2018, 07:51:53 pm
f for dual-wielding melee builds.
It's really funny tho, people complain that statsticks are stupid and OP and should be dealt with so GGG goes 'hmmm, what's the best way to completely misinterpret this complaint, hmmmm' and completely kill them in case of melee skills while leaving the equally, if not moreso problematic issue of statsticks for casters completely untouched :V
Post by: nenjin on December 03, 2018, 09:37:18 pm
Quote
Initially this change was explored as a way to make it easier for casters to use Eldritch Battery to solve mana issues. One major issue standing in the way Eldritch Battery being effective is that it doesn't work very well on it's own, needing something like Zealot's Oath to go along with it.
You know what I rarely if ever see? Ineffective melee shit cherry picked and fixed. :\
Post by: Sirian on December 04, 2018, 01:56:50 pm
Melee is definitely in a pretty sour place, yeah. I'm a little tempted to roll out a Tectonic Strike Facebreaker Juggernaut (or something) with The Eternal Apple as a shield to belt out Abyssal Cries. That is, if my toaster of a laptop can run PoE...
Yea, definitely, I was playing with "Path of Building" earlier and I was shocked when I realized that even with the gear of my dreams I would be capped at a few hundred thousands of DPS (and much less with realistic gear). Meanwhile the ranged builds are in the millions of DPS with realistic gear...
Still, I'm pretty hyped for Betrayal. Only 3 days to go !
Post by: Flying Dice on December 04, 2018, 04:33:59 pm
Melee is definitely in a pretty sour place, yeah. I'm a little tempted to roll out a Tectonic Strike Facebreaker Juggernaut (or something) with The Eternal Apple as a shield to belt out Abyssal Cries. That is, if my toaster of a laptop can run PoE...
Yea, definitely, I was playing with "Path of Building" earlier and I was shocked when I realized that even with the gear of my dreams I would be capped at a few hundred thousands of DPS (and much less with realistic gear). Meanwhile the ranged builds are in the millions of DPS with realistic gear...
Still, I'm pretty hyped for Betrayal. Only 3 days to go !
Remember most of those are ele conversion builds that only have millions of paper DPS, their real DPS is much lower against anything with resists (i.e. bosses).
Post by: Flying Dice on December 05, 2018, 08:13:15 am
Post by: Jopax on December 05, 2018, 08:37:26 am
Anyways, patch notes out, it's a fucking bloodbath. Statsticks have been gutted, halved possible roll values, some uniques got shat on (rip quill rain), molten strike got a bit of a hit, as did totem hierophant.
Meanwhile, poets pen still untouched, if anything, it got easier to get since there's another div card set for it.
Still have no idea what I'll be playing tho, might give summoners another try, but I barely got trough the story last time I tried it, was thinking arc totems, and while still strong I'm not sure I'd be willing to faff about min-maxing them properly. Or I might just go back to a trapper, last attemt was kinda cut short due to rl stuff, it's a fun enough starter.
Post by: Flying Dice on December 05, 2018, 08:47:26 pm
Post by: Aoi on December 05, 2018, 09:55:10 pm
Welp. Just got around to reading the notes. RIP, Zerphi's.
Post by: Retropunch on December 18, 2018, 04:49:07 am
I've got to say, PoE has sort of turned a corner in terms of loot-em-ups. As much as I enjoyed Diablo/Grim Dawn/older-PoE, after finishing the main quest of each game I quickly got bored. Even when PoE first moved to the 10 act structure it just felt like playing it all over again with a few minor tweaks.
Now with the pantheon, delve, betrayal stuff and ascendancy there's so, so much to do and I'm very impressed.
They're having a stash sale at the moment - for anyone who's on the fence about microtransactions I bought the currency tab and it's really, really useful. Definitely not necessary, but a nice addition if you're thinking of playing a lot.
Post by: Flying Dice on December 18, 2018, 07:20:57 am
Post by: nenjin on December 18, 2018, 12:46:58 pm
Currency, 1x premium, and map tabs are both the recommended starter buy and absolutely necessary if you plan to play the game much, TBH. The others you can make do without, but having to juggle currency and maps around or not being able to list items for sale is crippling.
+1. Map and currency stash tab are an absolute must for anyone planning to play beyond the end of the campaign. Because fuck juggling currency and Max 20 stacks. Premium stash tabs are optional, unless you want to have a public stash tab to sell stuff. If you've got a character in the standard league you're playing, public stash tabs aren't really necessary, the economy there is fucked for the most part.
Post by: Retropunch on December 18, 2018, 02:21:59 pm
Currency, 1x premium, and map tabs are both the recommended starter buy and absolutely necessary if you plan to play the game much, TBH. The others you can make do without, but having to juggle currency and maps around or not being able to list items for sale is crippling.
I'm at the end game now and it is very helpful but I wouldn't say it's absolutely necessary (unless you like hording) for sort of 'normal' play - I wouldn't want people to get the idea that it's freemium or anything like that. I'm sure it does become more important the more you play and build stuff up, but I don't think it ruins the experience not having them.
All that being said, if you're putting 100+ hours into something then paying the £/$4 for a currency and map tab is hardly asking a lot.
Post by: nenjin on December 18, 2018, 03:12:24 pm
That said.....the way they drive sales is by creating new shit to fill up your stash tab. It's not an immediate problem but if you play through enough expansions you'll experience it.
Post by: frostshotgg on December 18, 2018, 04:38:05 pm
Post by: Aoi on December 19, 2018, 12:48:38 am
(I'm pretty sure he overpaid me, too.)
Post by: Flying Dice on December 19, 2018, 01:26:06 am
That's always been my rationale. I've gotten so much time out of PoE for free that $5 to make my life better seems like a pittance.At least they added the scarabs to the fragment tab, that's a small step in the right direction.
That said.....the way they drive sales is by creating new shit to fill up your stash tab. It's not an immediate problem but if you play through enough expansions you'll experience it.
Still not buying one of those though.
Post by: Retropunch on December 19, 2018, 08:59:00 am
I'd say for serious long-term play, 1x currency and 1x premium tab are entirely non-optional. Map tab is huge comfort, but you can live without it. Currency tab means you don't have to play the "Hope a bot trading X for chaos isn't afk" game and accepting constant losses from bit that traders skim off the top is rough, and premium tab lets you actually participate in the economy. You can exist with one of the 3rd party programs that run a forum thread or whatever if you get serious big money drops, but it's absolutely miserable and I can't recommend a premium tab enough.
I suppose it depends what your long term play looks like - PoE is SO much harder without trading, but if you don't want to get involved with trading then neither of those tabs are really necessary. It's only with trading that it really becomes a necessity (although currency is useful anyway), and some people are really against trading. I've got a friend who plays a lot of PoE and hates trading - says that it cheapens the experience of getting a good drop and he's reluctant to play with me as all my stuff is way better.
I sort of agree to an extent. Now I'm not really as bothered about that moment when you get JUST what you were after and more about getting a few dozen good deals to let me buy what I want - way less of a rush really.
Post by: Jopax on December 19, 2018, 09:07:19 am
Tho I will say that the current league is about the most SSF friendly to date, simply because there's so many sources of good and semi-deterministic items, as well as several kinds of crafting systems that it's not too far from a trade league if you know what you're doing.
Fuck the way you get crafting recipes for sockets tho, tying it to specific delve encounters is kinda shit, especially since they still haven't realised that RNG gating content is a shit move that ends up fucking over people a lot of the time.
Post by: JimboM12 on December 19, 2018, 09:13:08 am
Im still a summoning templar on my main who has since dropped from whatever league i made him in to standard. Still fun to command armies of minions. Some of the new support gems are legit for this build too.
In the current betrayal league, im running a on hit cast scion with ancestral support so i nuke entire groups.
Post by: Retropunch on December 19, 2018, 09:59:52 am
Main issue with going SSF is that the game has not been designed with such play in mind, they just added the thing in as an afterthought and haven't bothered touching it since. Additionally, they don't want to increase the quant/rarity of drops in SSF because you can always migrate to a regular league, which is kind of a dumb reasoning imo but whatever, their game, their rules.
Tho I will say that the current league is about the most SSF friendly to date, simply because there's so many sources of good and semi-deterministic items, as well as several kinds of crafting systems that it's not too far from a trade league if you know what you're doing.
Fuck the way you get crafting recipes for sockets tho, tying it to specific delve encounters is kinda shit, especially since they still haven't realised that RNG gating content is a shit move that ends up fucking over people a lot of the time.
Yeah I'd prefer if they kept SSF completely separate and upped the drops - probably better to just lower the cost on everything instead but something to make it a bit more in line with everyone else's experience.
Post by: Rince Wind on December 19, 2018, 10:19:36 am
Wow i havent played this in a while. I like that baal gems now also grant the base version of their spells.
facepalm
And I thought that was just as a hint about the original, a qol feature. So...I will use my vaal gems more now, thanks!
Post by: Retropunch on December 19, 2018, 10:41:55 am
Annoyingly, you can't use them in the same quick slot - I'd like it if I could do the normal version until the vaal version charges up.Wow i havent played this in a while. I like that baal gems now also grant the base version of their spells.
facepalm
And I thought that was just as a hint about the original, a qol feature. So...I will use my vaal gems more now, thanks!
Post by: Sirian on December 19, 2018, 03:38:22 pm
It's also a nice change of pace from farming, I list my stuff and alt-tab until the PMs start coming in. Then when things quiet down I close shop and go back to farming ^^
Post by: Retropunch on December 19, 2018, 03:43:45 pm
I've started selling stuff and it's actually nice. I feel like some sort of shopkeeper.
It's also a nice change of pace from farming, I list my stuff and alt-tab until the PMs start coming in. Then when things quiet down I close shop and go back to farming ^^
Yeah I never really did it much before this league - the occasional high value unique or some high quality gems but nothing else really. It can be enjoyable, especially when you're getting currency you need for stuff you know you'll never use.
Post by: Doomblade187 on December 19, 2018, 05:16:11 pm
Post by: Retropunch on December 19, 2018, 05:41:02 pm
Just started out on this game, any tips for a Witch?
It depends what you're looking to do; summoning or sorcerer style blaster? You can do a bit of both, but PoE rewards specialising a lot.
You don't need to get into the realms of the end-game builds which are built around one skill, but you should decide what sort of 'magic' you want to use as you want to build up as many synergies as you can. Check out https://poeplanner.com and decide what sort of element/thing you want to go into - picking an element and focusing on it is a good way to become quite powerful - there are few enemies that are completely resistant to any element (and you can take passives/use curses that let you ignore those resistances).
As such, you'll want to focus on some attack skills (an aoe and a one for big single enemies) and then think about a curse and some sort of defensive skill.
Let us know what sort of Witch you want to play and I'm sure we can help more.
Post by: nenjin on December 19, 2018, 05:48:15 pm
Summoner is the easiest and most straight forward build to pull off for Witch, IMO. The gems are readily available, and the uniques you want to to kick your build in to overdrive are cheap and relatively common. (At least on Standard, I think I have like 3 copies of the Bones of Ulnar or w/e those boots are called.)
Spell slingy Witch, by comparison, requires a little more thought and gear to pull off.
Post by: JimboM12 on December 19, 2018, 05:50:31 pm
so, large amounts of summons (around 8 zombies, 2 spectres (ghost copy of enemies), 1 golem (or 1 of each element), an animated guardian (a copy of your own character that can use gear, so they get pretty powerful), potentially up to 10 skeletons (or an army of like, 32 with the vaal gem) and many others.
as a summoning templar, i think im going to use the one aura ascendency class for them that gives auras and stuff.
Post by: Flying Dice on December 19, 2018, 08:34:04 pm
Just started out on this game, any tips for a Witch?Don't focus on class. Class is largely irrelevant apart from which passive keystones are easy to reach and which ascendancies you can access. Figure out what sort of build (i.e. which core attack/spell skill/skills) you want, then pick a class that complements that.
Witch tends to fall into three groupings. All minion builds want to go Necromancer. All CI builds, cold damage builds, chaos damage builds, and curse builds want to go Occultist (this is almost always CI+one or two of the others). All ele damage/ele conversion builds not involving cold DoTs want Elementalist.
Annoyingly, you can't use them in the same quick slot - I'd like it if I could do the normal version until the vaal version charges up.Wow i havent played this in a while. I like that baal gems now also grant the base version of their spells.
facepalm
And I thought that was just as a hint about the original, a qol feature. So...I will use my vaal gems more now, thanks!
TBH I'd rather not. Vaal skills frequently have different purposes than their base skills, or need to be applied in different ways--take Vaal Cold Snap, the core skill is a targeted AoE that you drop and forget, while the Vaal skill is a damage aura.
Post by: Ozyton on December 19, 2018, 09:57:28 pm
I would look it up myself but I wouldn't even know where to start.
Post by: Sirian on December 20, 2018, 04:46:41 am
Seeing this topic again has me curious. I only played act 1 of PoE a long time ago around when it was first released and I don't really have much experience in ARPGs in general. Since you're talking about new players, I was curious if there's something in the game and if it would actually be viable. I played a bit of Torchlight 2 and was enjoying a build that used a two handed hammer and AOE slam attacks to do damage and debuffs... is there something like that in this game? I know there's a skill you can get early in the game called Glacial Hammer but that only hits a single enemy. It was cool freezing enemies like that, so a frost AoE would be what I'm looking for. (E: Also, I kinda like being tanky more than glass cannon sort...?)
I would look it up myself but I wouldn't even know where to start.
Ice crash maybe ? you can check here : https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Skill_gem#Active_Skills (https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Skill_gem#Active_Skills)
But you can also use a non-cold skill and have part of the damage converted/added to cold with auras, support gems, items, etc. Or use your single target skill and give it AOE with the "Melee Splash Support" gem.
Post by: Ozyton on December 21, 2018, 09:56:17 pm
Of course, still haven't decided if I'm going to try playing again yet, I just got something else to keep me occupied, but the itch to try again might come up at some point.
(Also, melee splash glacial hammer sounds pretty rad)
(Juggernaut seems cool too. So many options...)
Post by: Rex_Nex on December 22, 2018, 01:35:49 pm
The only time you might have trouble with stats is if you are playing a single attribute aligned class (marauder, witch, ranger) and go with skills that require heavy investment in both of your opposite attributes. Using an int aligned spell like Arc while protecting yourself with a dex aligned aura like Grace can be hard to achieve on a Marauder, for example. Any other class could manage it, though :)
Post by: JimboM12 on December 23, 2018, 09:41:31 pm
Post by: nenjin on December 24, 2018, 12:04:06 am
Post by: Retropunch on December 24, 2018, 11:00:59 am
Skill stat requirements do tend to align with their element, but it's not very noticeable and, for the most part, every character can get enough stats for every skill without sacrifice. I wouldn't be concerned about using cold skills with a Templar - Glacial Hammer, for example, was originally built for Templar.
BE AWARE. If you have attribute granting gear (especially in stats you're not really levelling e.g dex for a Templar) you can end up levelling up skill gems past what you can manage without the gear - keeping you tied to that piece of gear until you find a dex boost from else where. Just something to be aware if you're starting out.
Post by: Aklyon on December 24, 2018, 06:00:50 pm
Post by: JimboM12 on December 26, 2018, 12:47:07 am
You don't even need ancestral call tbh, melee splash multistrike dom blow with herald of purity running is pretty much the same thing and aims the latter strikes for you. Throw in some zombies for bonus meat shields and a golem of choice.
i did that change and i threw in herald of thunder, war banner and stone golem. herald of thunder and war banner increase my damage and my minions damage, provide an aura for my guardian passives and more mana reservation. i only use dom blow and shock brand, which are very mana efficient.
in turn, as a guardian, i have a passive which provides 15% of reserved mana as mana shield to myself and nearby allies.
and i stone golem purely for the self-hp regen.
Post by: Ozyton on January 03, 2019, 04:55:06 pm
I also noticed that I pretty much haven't needed to use mana or healing potions except near the start of the game (and in some surprise situations with a really hard hitting special enemy). I wonder if the game is easier or if this build is really that tanky... or maybe I'm just overlevelled... It seems most people play the game by nyooming past a majority of the enemies but I have a habit of killing everything that comes at me. I'm not really in any rush.
Post by: Retropunch on January 03, 2019, 05:28:13 pm
Figured I'd post a little update since I started playing. I'm in Act 3 now, last time I played I didn't get beyond the start of Act 2. I'm following a build guide I saw on youtube that looked interesting. Tectonic Slam is actually pretty much the exact same skill as the one I was thinking of from Torchlight 2 except it goes in front of you instead of all around, but it still feels really good to use. It even uses charges similar to engineer from TL2, but right now my only method of getting them is from the warcry.
I also noticed that I pretty much haven't needed to use mana or healing potions except near the start of the game (and in some surprise situations with a really hard hitting special enemy). I wonder if the game is easier or if this build is really that tanky... or maybe I'm just overlevelled... It seems most people play the game by nyooming past a majority of the enemies but I have a habit of killing everything that comes at me. I'm not really in any rush.
Later on you get some skill gems that give you a chance to get a charge when another skill is used - they usually work well enough that you don't have to bother with using another skill for it. I'm not sure when exactly you get them, but I'm sure it'll be soon.
Mana potions probably won't be necessary for a long time if you're not spell casting however you'll probably start to use healing ones more of as you progress further through the game. That being said, mostly the difficulty for PoE is a bit binary - it's either easy and you're waltzing through everything or you're really struggling and spamming all your flasks constantly. Whilst that sounds like bad game design, it's more to do with if you're prepared you are and how well you've designed your build rather than just rocky difficulty.
Post by: nenjin on January 03, 2019, 05:34:46 pm
Figured I'd post a little update since I started playing. I'm in Act 3 now, last time I played I didn't get beyond the start of Act 2. I'm following a build guide I saw on youtube that looked interesting. Tectonic Slam is actually pretty much the exact same skill as the one I was thinking of from Torchlight 2 except it goes in front of you instead of all around, but it still feels really good to use. It even uses charges similar to engineer from TL2, but right now my only method of getting them is from the warcry.
I also noticed that I pretty much haven't needed to use mana or healing potions except near the start of the game (and in some surprise situations with a really hard hitting special enemy). I wonder if the game is easier or if this build is really that tanky... or maybe I'm just overlevelled... It seems most people play the game by nyooming past a majority of the enemies but I have a habit of killing everything that comes at me. I'm not really in any rush.
It really depends. When your DPS is so high you vaporize most enemies before they stand a chance of killing you, there's no reason to have a ton of health potions. If you watch the L33+ streamers, they'll have maybe 1. And the other 4 will all be buff flasks.
However if your build ISN'T that hot, you will need at least a couple health pots. If your build has no real effective health regen (life on hit, life on kill, life leech, regen/sec, various healing from Warcries or consuming charges of this that and the other thing, etc...) you have no real way of regaining health. Which for most enemies in the game, prior to the final act, isn't a big deal.
But the last....few bosses in the campaign, and most bosses in end game maps, do a fuck load of damage. I'm talking, even on my tankiest character with the most HP and damage mitigation, a good crit will, if not kill me outright, take 90% of my health.
That's when you need health potions.
And the higher you get in maps, and the more dense the enemy packs get and the higher their monster level gets, that damage can also all add up very, very quickly. I'd say around T9 maps, the total spike damage from a pack of Champion enemies can easily be as dangerous as some boss attacks. More so, depending on the specific enemy in question.
So like most things in PoE it's a matter of the balance of your build. Fuck loads of damage and little HP or damage mitigation? Chances are you won't survive many late game hits to even get the chance to use a health potion. On the other hand, damage not so hot but a shit load of mitigation and HP? Chances are you will need those health potions as you chip away at high life enemies and bosses, because even with a crap load of HP, PoE on average tends towards dishing out a lot of hurt at the higher levels.
Bottomline: don't judge the performance of your build or the balance of the game until you've beaten it. Because almost all PoE players get a rude awakening around the 80% to 90% completion mark of the campaign. Enemy damage goes up up up, and health goes up, and many build are not prepared for the sudden spike. Which is why the best advice for new PoE players is to focus on a big life pool, because it makes that transition from the campaign to the end game a little less painful (or demoralizing, depending on how far out of whack your build is.) Many people just max out damage through the whole game because they don't see the danger or the challenge of enemies, and then *BOOP*, they cross this magical line in the campaign where the enemies are closer to end game difficulty and they suddenly go "my build is fucked."
FWIW, when you run into Kitava for the first time, that should be your signal that the game is shifting gears and going to get harder. If you find the first Kitava fight difficult in the slightest, start planning on re-prioritizing your build based on what didn't go well. (Was getting one shot, swarmed by normal mobs and slain, fight took 10 minutes because your damage was so low, etc...) If you breeze through the first Kitava fight with no real problems, just pay attention to the kind of hits you start taking from later bosses. Because by the time you fight Kitava the 2nd time, you'll basically be at starting map enemy difficulty, and if you're struggling there.....it will only get harder.
Post by: Jopax on February 19, 2019, 05:11:22 pm
From the trailer, reverse breaches and more build-a-dungeon shenanigans. Also more crafting it seems, neat!
Edit:
Also new supporter packs, I thought my love of the shaper portal would last forever, but that goddamn sunspire minx just had to walk in and twirl that stunning eclipse shaped ass :V
Post by: Retropunch on February 21, 2019, 11:37:35 am
Post by: nenjin on February 21, 2019, 11:44:13 am
Post by: Rex_Nex on February 26, 2019, 02:14:52 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: ragnar119 on February 26, 2019, 03:06:11 pm
Post by: aristabulus on February 27, 2019, 10:33:33 pm
... and also torchlight frontiers alpha so a lot of arpg games to play.
Just for the record, that's Perfect World flogging the IP off to a vassal studio; Runic got shut down after PW shovelware'd Hob into release.
-----
Betrayal was merely okay for me. I spent a lot of time avoiding it in maps, as the gank factor was just too high; got my Betrayal flavoured challenges done by grinding A9 Foothills. Some of the rewards were neat, but it took a lot of fiddling to set up a safehouse with good rewards. And that Catarina fight can go die in a manure fire. I beat her with a jugg, so I was never really in danger of dying... but I couldn't tell what the hell was going on for most of the fight.
I chafed at the time costs with the new order around dailies, as it meant running 5 maps to do all my masters, instead of X wee side areas plus a freebie map from Zana. There were also some issues around dailies landing on maps I didn't have in SSF; my summoner lost the momentum of first league week to that curse.
I spent most of the league selectively targeting content to sort out challenges and keep my login time moderate. I suspect that problem will only magnify with Betrayal going core and having Another New System for the next league.
-----
The Wraeclast outpost of Nist Akath is still puttering along... same ol' cats-herding-cats situation. PM me or Aklyon if you're interested.
Post by: ragnar119 on February 28, 2019, 05:49:40 am
Yes and no. The studio Echra that is making TLF was formed from some of runic people during their development of Hobs, including Max Schaefer, Matt Uelmen , also a lot of people from blizzard north that worked on diablo 2 (over 10 people are from blizzard north)... and also torchlight frontiers alpha so a lot of arpg games to play.
Just for the record, that's Perfect World flogging the IP off to a vassal studio; Runic got shut down after PW shovelware'd Hob into release.
Post by: Jopax on March 09, 2019, 02:25:37 pm
New skills are a blast to play early on, not sure how much lategame viable but we'll see. Storm burst feels like a fun to use lightning tendrils, has nice range and the channel isn't too much of an issue as a second or two is enough to clear most packs. Divine Ire on the other hand is amazing, the clear is reasonable with a single stage of less than a second charging clears most things and multiple stages chunking bosses in a very satisfying manner. The gameplay isn't as dynamic as most of the clear speed meta monsters out there but that isn't much of an issue for me.
League itself is somewhat confusing to explain and to get into, but once you play around a bit with it, it becomes fairly intuitive for the most part, with a few problematic spots from time to time. The short of it is, maps before maps, every zone you can talk to cavas and do a quick run trough a fragment to activate the spots, if you activate even one you get to keep the shard as a puzzle piece of sorts (up to 10, which is kinda low imo). You don't need to pick up shit as it drops out at the end kinda like incursions and clearing things isn't that important anyways, especially early on when you're missing damage, by mid story it's fairly easy to activate all the nodes and clear most of the map before it collapses on you. You then take these puzzle pieces and arrange them in the nexus to create further chains that you can run for the loot they have, or, more importantly to get to randomly spawning nodes on the board that have extra loot kinda like Delve nodes do. It's about as quick or as slow as you want it to for the most part since pieces once set have several charges before they turn into the race against the collapse runs (and even then, you usually have enough time to clear some packs before it dies on you).
Overall, fairly enjoyable so far, we'll see how it keeps my interest once betrayal bullshit gets introduced in act9 and the various masters start vying for my time come maps.
Post by: Rex_Nex on March 16, 2019, 09:38:04 pm
This is my first time really putting time into a league that has all the new masters and mechanics enabled, so that's the main attraction to me. Delves and Incursions are a ton of fun!
Post by: Retropunch on March 17, 2019, 04:38:22 am
I'm not having much fun with the Memory Nexus. The in-map memory fragments are kind of fun to run, they remind me a lot of Incursions, just longer and with less rewards. The actual Nexus is very boring to me. I'm also having a rough time with maps this league, haven't been able to get past T4/5 maps and I've run a couple hundred. Super unlucky, I suppose.
This is my first time really putting time into a league that has all the new masters and mechanics enabled, so that's the main attraction to me. Delves and Incursions are a ton of fun!
Yeah I don't think it's one of their best leagues. I've found that you've got to chain up a considerable amount of modifiers (which end on a square with the synthesised chests) to get some good rewards. I'm also not really a fan of the fading mechanic - so many times I've gotten trapped and it's felt a bit unfair. Still, it's always nice to have something else to have a go with.
Post by: MrRoboto75 on March 17, 2019, 01:57:34 pm
Though TBH I've just started playing the game altogether in this league.
Post by: Jopax on March 17, 2019, 04:45:08 pm
The nexus can be a mess but I've had some fun puzzling the thing out, as before, a nice change of pace from the mindless grind.
Divine Ire still going strong tho, not sure how much I'll stick with the league in the end but I might take this build to shaper finally (got fairly close in delve but sorta lost interest at 3 fragments collected)
Post by: MrRoboto75 on March 17, 2019, 07:00:17 pm
I'm pulling 1.6k DPS according to the game, and the totems roughly match that. But I'm lacking a good bit of HP and defense. Resists are near max but I only have armor and 1.4k HP. I just started act five.
Post by: Jopax on March 26, 2019, 07:35:18 am
It's been almost a month since the league started, if they haven't fixed this shit by now, I doubt they will anytime soon.
It's a shame too since my alt bane witch has been pretty fun to play.
Post by: ukulele on April 01, 2019, 07:09:32 pm
Been playing and my potato PC does stutter with betrayal assasionation atempts, but i never got a DC, crash or antything like that.
Post by: Jopax on April 02, 2019, 04:14:14 am
Maybe it'll get fixed sometime down the line or maybe PoE isn't playable on my laptop anymore, I don't particularly care anymore, Grim Dawn is just as fun and doesn't have these issues (nor does your survival depend on your latency).
Post by: Jopax on May 21, 2019, 04:28:27 pm
tl;dr
New league looks nice, but more importantly a YUGE rework of pretty much all melee combat, both on the player side and on the mob side. Hits now conform to their animations and dodging them is much easier. Targeting was reworked, so there's no more namelock. Bunch of new skills, one of them is a fucking dash which even has functionality simialr to the dodge from DS3 in terms of how it's directionality works. Rework of how some of the damage types work (physical is stunny, elemental is less stunny), rework of the accuracy and evasion mechanics. There's also animation cancelling, so it's become way closer to something like DS in terms of how the combat works.
Basically, holy crap so much crazy new stuff. And it will all be for nothing if the betrayal lag hasn't been fixed yet :V
Post by: Rex_Nex on May 21, 2019, 06:03:25 pm
I'm also really excited about the new jewels, which is weird because individual items have never done that to me:
(https://i.imgur.com/pP56PsF.png)
So the way this works is that it replaces your passive skills with different ones within the radius of the jewel. The nodes you get are random, but they're indicated by the flavor text on the jewel - the "5173 sacrificed" in the example is the seed value for the replacement nodes. I'm assuming that there's not only vaal versions of the tree, but that the other unannounced jewels work in the same fashion. The economy around items like this seems like a bit of a nightmare (for starters, how are you going to know if your jewel is good and worth trading without having access to every possible jewel slot it could be in to check?), but the actual impact of this is like nothing we've seen before. Customizable trees? Yes, please!
Post by: nenjin on May 22, 2019, 09:34:19 am
Post by: Retropunch on May 23, 2019, 02:46:42 pm
Really looking forward to a melee overhaul, although I have to say that I wish there was a way to sort of...skip the early quests. I don't know if I can face going through all of the drudgery of finding rhoa nests and all that.
Post by: Jopax on June 08, 2019, 09:20:55 am
The league itself is pretty fun, unless it crashes when interacting with the obelisks, which seems to vary between people, but for me it's been about a third of obelisk activations that crashed the game. So overall I'd say it's pretty nice but give it a few days maybe until they iron out most of the bugs, or if you don't mind skipping the league mechanic for now and just playing with the cool new shit until it's fixed.
Post by: Retropunch on June 09, 2019, 11:29:08 am
Got to say I haven't found the Melee changes amazing - it's a solid improvement for bosses/bigger enemies as you can actually dodge their attacks now, and the whole 'all melee attacks hit enemies in arc' sounds good in practice, but I'm not sure in reality.
The arc can sometimes be a bit inconsistent, and that stacks with accuracy as well which means your damage can vary quite a lot. It also seems that melee is a bit slower now (or maybe much more reliant on attack speed?). All it means is that area of effect/multi strike skills are still better, but that single target skills sometimes hit adjacent enemies.
Overall, it just doesn't make that much of a difference in a game all about spamming and chaining skills for screen clearing. I'm sure it's made a few pure melee builds a bit more viable and it has made boss fights slightly more interesting, but it's not as game changing as I thought it might be.
Post by: Rex_Nex on June 09, 2019, 02:25:24 pm
They also buffed rare monsters' HP by about 50%, and it feels really bad. I think it was the wrong decision. Even as a veteran player who is playing a decent build with reasonable enough luck with weapon drops, killing some of these while leveling took eons, and the rewards for doing so just aren't there. Spending several minutes chipping away at Stinkhuge the Evertanky and being rewarded with a nothing but a blue pair of mittens and a dozen white mobs worth of XP is not worth my time.
Post by: Retropunch on June 11, 2019, 04:39:40 pm
I'm a bit torn on the melee. On one hand, the whole "you hit every monster your weapon swings through" wasn't at all impactful. On the other hand, the monster re-balance felt really good in Act 1, and I hope they finish up the rest of the acts in the same fashion. I also feel like a lot of the small tweaks worked out really well to bring the early game up to date - melee attacks don't feel like I'm hitting with a wet noodle anymore, dash and leap slam make the first few acts really engaging, and overall I just think that a new player is going to find a lot more to like.
They also buffed rare monsters' HP by about 50%, and it feels really bad. I think it was the wrong decision. Even as a veteran player who is playing a decent build with reasonable enough luck with weapon drops, killing some of these while leveling took eons, and the rewards for doing so just aren't there. Spending several minutes chipping away at Stinkhuge the Evertanky and being rewarded with a nothing but a blue pair of mittens and a dozen white mobs worth of XP is not worth my time.
Melee definitely feels better, I just think it was a bit over-hyped.
I actually don't mind the buff to rare monsters - sometimes they had so little health I wouldn't even notice them. Now once I've zapped the rest of the screen they're still hanging about and getting in my face a bit more. It's my big problem with PoE - it's either way too easy and you just zoom through or you hit a wall and end up dying 50 times in a row - not syaing this fixes the problem, just might help make the curve a bit better.
Post by: Jopax on August 20, 2019, 04:09:59 pm
Post by: nenjin on August 20, 2019, 04:15:35 pm
Post by: Jopax on August 20, 2019, 04:28:47 pm
Also changes and buffs to assasin are welcome since it's one of my favourite classes.
Post by: Rex_Nex on August 31, 2019, 06:10:01 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 16, 2019, 01:59:50 am
It certainly looks better. If a bit all too familiar. Not going to lie, looking back at all I've accumulated in PoE it feels weird to walk away from it all. Makes me glad I didn't go apeshit on the MTX. Also makes me wonder if GGG is going to work the monetization even deeper in to PoE 2 than it already is in PoE.
Post by: IWishIWereSarah on November 16, 2019, 06:15:12 am
not Path of exile 2.
Post by: nenjin on November 16, 2019, 06:24:00 am
Post by: Folly on November 16, 2019, 06:40:26 am
"We're using the same engine and graphics and spells as Path of exile, but there is a new campaign, what should we name it ?"
not Path of exile 2.
Graphics engine is getting a complete overhaul, as is the skill tree.
Plenty of other games have built sequels using the exact same engine as the previous game, and many of them reused far more assets than PoE2 will. I'm willing to let them have this one.
Post by: Teneb on November 16, 2019, 07:57:17 am
Apparently it comes out in 2021. Next month we'll get Metamorphosis League and the Conquerors of the Atlas sort-of-expansion.
Post by: Jopax on November 16, 2019, 11:04:50 am
Metamorph league looks pretty sick too. First we had pokemon league and now it's a combiner wars league. I wonder which 90's anime they're gonna crib from next. I hope it's gonna be Sailor Moon tbh, random schoolgirl encounters that power up into super boss fights would be pretty dope.
Post by: Aoi on November 19, 2019, 01:18:57 am
Reusing assets is one thing, but I'd at least do some unimportant but obvious changes to the UI or something so it's immediately evident you're looking at something different.
Post by: DemonOfWrath on November 19, 2019, 02:39:00 am
Is it a true sequel just run through the same engine/launcher?
Is it just a different set of acts that get you to the same endgame stuff as PoE1?
It looks half expansion half sequel and yeah.
Post by: Jopax on November 19, 2019, 11:45:17 am
Tho, to be fair calling it PoE2 is a bit strange since it's more of an expansion of the existing game (a fairly massive one but still not exactly a completely separate sequel in the traditional sense)
Post by: Aoi on November 19, 2019, 02:08:10 pm
Sure, but why would they change the UI if it works as is? Furthermore if it's all going to be unified by the endgame it'd be strange to be using one UI and then having to switch to a different one once you get to endgame. Visually it is similar but I think that's more because it retains the style while improving on the graphics themselves in minor ways for the most part. Also most of the differences will be mechanical in the end since it'll be changing the way skill gems work in a fairly fundamental way, which then will effect items and builds themselves.
Tho, to be fair calling it PoE2 is a bit strange since it's more of an expansion of the existing game (a fairly massive one but still not exactly a completely separate sequel in the traditional sense)
Pretty much the same reason why there are superficial cosmetic tweaks to cars every years... so they look different and you can tell that something has changed since the last iteration. I literally couldn't tell that it was actually supposed to be a different product and thought it was a joke/hopeful video until I remembered there was supposed to be some con or something late this year (followed by some additional verification which cemented it). It's easier to sell the idea if it looks like something new is happening.
Though... it's all supposed to be unified by endgame? Like PoE rolls straight into PoE2? That would make a lot more sense, but makes it seem even more like an expansion than a sequel. Which makes this whole thing kind of weird for other reasons.
Eh, whatever; it's earned enough goodwill from me to see where it lands when it finally drops, in either case.
Edit: Fixed an open tag.
Post by: Jopax on November 19, 2019, 02:24:22 pm
And you misunderstood it. PoE will lead to maps, PoE2 will lead to maps. It's pretty much gonna be another story campaign that's gonna lead to you the same endgame thing. And sure, 1.5 or whatever might be more accurate than calling it PoE2 but imo this is a great way for them to explore the world and bring in great amounts of new content without abandoning the old one or forcing people to choose one over the other. Five years later we might get PoE3 which is just gonna be another big-ass story arc that ties into the same game and revamps some of the core mechanics to make the whole thing more interesting and fresh for everyone involved.
Post by: Kanil on November 19, 2019, 05:49:08 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 19, 2019, 06:34:12 pm
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don't see anything different
Having played PoE since beta.....I immediately saw the graphical update, the model quality, the animation quality. Particularly on the monsters.
The UI I assume is a beta UI. It's the POE UI only shittier, none of the flourish, which tells me its still under development.
PoE vs. PoE2.....I don't see it as that confusing. A new engine means a higher level of graphical quality. With all that, why not take the time to remedy some structural design flaws in the gearing and skill tree? And if you're going to do that, why not create a new campaign as well. Yeah, granted, they're reusing more than I would have expected. As soon as I saw a relatively upgraded version of a Devourer I kinda knew.....they're going to make this as cost effective as possible.
But with it being 20 years after Kitava's defeat, it is a new storyline. (Not sure where they plan to go with it seeing as the "threat" in PoE has morphed and changed over time. The Beast was supposed to be the reason gems exist, and Wraeclast is all fucky, and after defeating it that the whole bit about why Wraeclast is the way it is got buried under all these additions: the other cultural factions, Izaro, Gods, The Elder and The Shaper.)
So maybe the storyline will get back to the root causes of Wraeclast's problems. I'm not too hung up on PoE's story but they're moving it forward enough that I don't think of this as an expansion.
To me, PoE 2 makes sense from GGG's perspective. PoE's engine can't support expanding the game much further IMO. It can't handle higher graphical fidelity, it can't put more enemies on the screen, and the can't add any more cinematic features either. (My fucking system locks up every time the Immortal Syndicate shows up because it's having to load all their dialog in real time.) So they need a new engine. But they don't want to redo the last 10+ years of content they've developed as far as assets go. Redesigning the core game systems is a lot less labor intensive than literally redoing all the Unique models and textures, or all the monsters. I remember a long, long time back when spell effects like auras were simplified to reduce their performance impact. I have a feeling a lot of PoE assets exist in much higher quality but were deliberately throttled back for the sake of performance. So it's possible higher quality versions of stuff have existed for a while, just waiting for a new engine so they could be put in play.
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I suspect all the things I don't like about the original are still going to be present in this version.
I suspect you are right. The minute I saw the Witch gameplay it felt like they're not deviating from how they think an aRPG should play. PoE 2 will probably continue to go on being very grindy, being very focused on build execution rather than build flexibility, and it's probably always going to be about finding quality by churning through absolute metric shittons of quantity.
I can only hope they find a way to unify melee and ranged combat in PoE2 though. There is simply no comparison between old style Diablo hack 'n slash gameplay, and the fucking fireworks display most aRPGs today have become. You just cannot kill faster than someone lighting up the whole screen at the click of a button (which is what end game PoE builds aspire to) AND the enemies are designed to be instant death if they actually touch you. So melee isn't viable anymore on a couple fronts, and hasn't been for many, many years. Their changes and fixes helped make melee less galling to play but it never actually brought the two playstyles anywhere near in balance.
Their solution to this in PoE2 seems to be "make flashier looking melee-esqe abilities with bigger hitboxes." That one shot of a guy morphing into an animal mid-leap reminded very, very strongly about how I felt about monks in Diablo 3. MINO. (Melee In Name Only.) Maybe that will do the trick, but I kinda doubt it will ever be more effective than a quad shotting archer whose arrows do all this fruity shit as soon as they touch an enemy.
But maybe this is also a chance for them to address the power imbalance as well, by slowing down ranged gameplay, dialing back the overall obsession with attack speed that makes most high level PoE gameplay look like you're watching Youtube at 2x speed. I think there's always been a secret preference for ranged in PoE (or a secret fear of making melee too effective) and I hope they really try to bring the two in to parity with each other in the sequel.
Post by: Rex_Nex on November 19, 2019, 06:36:29 pm
Post by: nenjin on November 19, 2019, 06:48:40 pm
I wonder if they'll change that approach, and realize they can drive more sales with cheaper prices than banking on a player dropping hundreds of dollars every time they do a new season. It's clearly worked so far, it's kept them afloat. But I think it's contributed to PoE feeling like a game for wonks rather than for a general audience. Between the complexity and the price of MTX, many people I know couldn't get in to PoE where there were more straightfoward, better performing aRPGs on the market.
Or....will they double down on what's worked previously. Devaluing the purchases of previous backers by changing pricing schemes would be a gamble. As is manipulating the currency economy even more, to say.....halve the sizes of all currency stacks from PoE to PoE 2 in an effort to get people to buy currency stash tabs. Or altering currency stash tabs to hold less total amounts than before. Or cutting down on the # of slots in a vanilla stash tab, from 12x12 to 11x11 or 10x10......There's all sorts of ways they could try to fuck with the formula. PoE I felt like has always toed the P2W line because inventory space in its relation to currency is so central to playing the game. It's not a +5 Sword of Owning you're paying for, it's the inventory space to eventually one day make a +5 Sword of Owning. It's pain removal and FOMO and all this other shit that has been a definite turn off to many people I've tried to get in to PoE. It's less obvious PW2 than them trying to sell you a +5 Sword of Owning in the first 30 minutes of the game. It's a bit more insidious, in that you get well in to the game before you realize the structure of MTX and how they relate to gameplay. Maybe that's a fair exchange, or maybe it's a bait and switch. That comes down to the actual player.
My wakeup moment came when I did the math on Orbs of Fusing and realized if I wanted to make a 6-Link at the crafting bench, I would have to devote over half of an entire stash tab JUST TO Orbs of Fusing. And then you see that you can buy a tab that makes that limitation non-existent and realize you're not actually be given a reasonable choice here.
And that's TOTALLY separate from everything you don't have to pay for looking like shit while everything that makes you look cool coming with an insane price tag. ($25, on average, for a whole set of cosmetics.)
So yeah. I can't blame anyone for being turned off by that taken as a whole. PoE has happily plodded on in their model for a long time, and I'm interested to see, given the chance to change, what they're willing to risk, what they're willing to make better, and what they're willing to turn the screws even further on. Are they going to take hints and philosophies from their friends in the East?
Post by: Kanil on November 19, 2019, 07:47:01 pm
Well, that heavily depends on what you didn't like about the original.
The single biggest issue I had was how all the difficulty of the game was found in the bosses. The trash mobs were really quite trash, and existed solely to waste a bit of your time and drop loot. I don't know if that's just a fundamental part of ARPGs in 2019, but I recently replayed through Diablo 2 for the first time in many years, and greatly enjoyed how challenging and engaging it was to merely progress through each area... really with emphasis on "engaging", compared to PoE where progressing through an area involves right clicking a couple of times and then walking forward and not really caring until you meet up with a boss.
Post by: nenjin on November 19, 2019, 08:17:42 pm
And then you get a lag spike, or a random crit, and you're dead.
Only in the last year have I built characters strong enough to trash every boss I've run into....and none of the characters I've made that stand a chance against end game bosses are melee. Not a one. You can't face tank because the fights are designed to punish face tanking. You can avoid, but if your damage is not stellar, or you don't have minions dealing damage and taunting while you move around, it's a race of attrition. Right now on my Necromancer I just sic my minions on the boss and focus 100% of my attention just avoiding all the AOEs, projectiles and adds that current bosses throw at you. And only if I fuck that up do I die. But on my scion or my shadow or my marauder.....you basically get to swing once or twice then you have to move or you're dead. For a low DPS tank, PoE boss fights feel almost impossible. And if you CAN face tank.....you're looking at a solid 3 to 4 minutes of hacking away at a boss that can't kill you. For melee it's like your choices are a) never be able to deal damage for fear or dying or b) never have an interesting boss fight. (One of the Elder bosses I remember quite clearly puts a burn on you that does 100% of your life in damage in about....1.5 seconds. Shit like that is just fucking stupid.)
Based on some of the stuff I've seen from PoE 2, maybe they've learned something there. That you can't fill the screen with things that will deal 80% of a player's life in one hit but looks like a shitty little elemental effects. That telegraphing damage is really, really, really fucking important if you want your boss fights to feel fair. Unfortunately, I kind of doubt it. GGG seems to love their boss fights now including mandatory "do this or you die instantly" phases. If you're lucky they're just movement and skill checks. If you're unlucky, it's something they just throw it out without warning.
Post by: Jopax on June 03, 2020, 10:45:50 am
Yeah so after TD league we're getting Harvest Moon league it seems :V
Gotta say tho, I like their willingness to experiment with wildly different ideas to shake up the core gameplay loop which can get stale after a while (tho that might be my 1500+ hours talking). Delirium was kinda fine but I also kinda dropped it once I hit maps, the passive tree changes were a great addition and I'm glad they're staying tho.
Other than that, uh, yeah, PoE, still chugging along with no signs of stopping, which, considering the poor offering of ARPGS these days (Wolcen lol) is kind of nice to see.
Post by: IWishIWereSarah on June 04, 2020, 01:54:57 am
Post by: Minstrel on June 04, 2020, 05:48:24 pm
Post by: IWishIWereSarah on June 07, 2020, 07:25:19 am
There are multiple tiers of seeds (at least 3 tiers), and you only get tier 1 seeds from normal gameplay.
You get tier 2 seed from killing monsters spawned from tier 1 plants (so from tier 1 seeds), and so on.
Better recipes (exalt-like recipes) will only be rewarded from high tier plants.
so, if it's anything like previous league, anybody ho doesn't make it to level 90+ and has stuff that already costs exalts won't get any good recipe from their plants, because they won't be high tier enough :/
Post by: Jopax on September 08, 2020, 03:59:45 am
Highlights include the new replica uniques (you take a regular unique and fudge one of the things it does, already some interesting stuff like a new shroud that's basically just 6 abyssal sockets) and alternate quality skill/support gems (basically they change what quality does to a gem, multiple variants for every single gem it seems, they cite something like 900+ new variants)
Other than that, seems interesting, another massive change of pace league it seems, probably will be janky at first but it has potential to be interesting I guess.
Tho, again, I'm not sure how much PoE can hold my interest anymore, seems that for the past year all I've been able to do is get to maps and get annoyed by the new atlas progression and kinda stop playing afterwards.
Post by: Niveras on September 08, 2020, 06:36:58 am
Quote
Tho, again, I'm not sure how much PoE can hold my interest anymore, seems that for the past year all I've been able to do is get to maps and get annoyed by the new atlas progression and kinda stop playing afterwards.
I can maintain my desire to get up to Sirus. And then lose to him 4 or 5 times (each repeat attempt probably taking 100 maps, but I could be exaggerating - whatever it is, it's a lot of fucking work just to constantly lose) and get discouraged. Can't never be assed to level up a new build that might be able to handle him better.
Had a similar issue with Uber Elder - could get to him but never beat him, then say "fuck it" because I obviously suck too much at a game where people can apparently do the final boss at fucking level 32 (reaching maps then intentionally de-leveling through a vendor recipe).
Even Harvest league, while well received overall, between the RNG of getting the right crafts and not being able to wrap wrap my brain around what I had to do to use them properly, I got discouraged from not being able to do anything in what should have been the easiest most OP league yet.
Post by: Aoi on September 08, 2020, 07:36:21 am
QuoteTho, again, I'm not sure how much PoE can hold my interest anymore, seems that for the past year all I've been able to do is get to maps and get annoyed by the new atlas progression and kinda stop playing afterwards.
I can maintain my desire to get up to Sirus. And then lose to him 4 or 5 times (each repeat attempt probably taking 100 maps, but I could be exaggerating - whatever it is, it's a lot of fucking work just to constantly lose) and get discouraged. Can't never be assed to level up a new build that might be able to handle him better.
Had a similar issue with Uber Elder - could get to him but never beat him, then say "fuck it" because I obviously suck too much at a game where people can apparently do the final boss at fucking level 32 (reaching maps then intentionally de-leveling through a vendor recipe).
Even Harvest league, while well received overall, between the RNG of getting the right crafts and not being able to wrap wrap my brain around what I had to do to use them properly, I got discouraged from not being able to do anything in what should have been the easiest most OP league yet.
Each Sirus attempt takes 24-40 maps, plus a little overhead for RNG. In comparison, the current uberElder takes a minimum of 16 and has tradable keys, so you could just shortcut the entire process or swap keys around if you keep getting the same ones. And the Heart of the Grove fight... takes a minimum of 100 maps, personally run, cannot be done in groups (other than the host), cannot be accelerated, and for the first few weeks had a known hard-showstopper bug.
I find the current Sirus/Conqueror atlas to be a vast improvement for gameplay over the Elder/Shaper War for the Atlas edition (though the latter was more dynamic) once you have it completed. The major advantage is that sustain is vastly improved (anecdotal), you have a lot more freedom to choose what maps to run (all regions are now high tier and advance content), and the Favorite system helps with keeping maps you like available and ones you don't like minimized (assuming you don't do something dumb with it, like I did for a while).
Post by: Jopax on September 08, 2020, 06:06:18 pm
And atleast in my case, when the grind is as long and at times frustrating as the endgame is, having a clear goal always present is a pretty big deal.