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Finally... => Forum Games and Roleplaying => Mafia => Topic started by: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

Title: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

Welcome to Beginner's Mafia XXXII!
Their Bark is Worse Than Their Byte

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Introduction

This version of the game is aimed specifically at players who are new to Mafia, or are still relatively inexperienced. Here, it's more about having fun and learning than anything else, so don't give up hope if you find yourself in a bad position!
This Beginners' Mafia will feature playing ICs. This means that two more experienced people will join in the game to help you guys out and will actually be playing in the game. They can also be scum too, so always stay suspicious!
The ICs will never lie to you about the game mechanics though, and will usually have a special IC voice to use when they want to teach you guys, since their goal will be to get you guys ready for a real Mafia game. Just because they're playing doesn't mean you can't learn!

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Gameplay and Concept

In Mafia, you are divided into two parts: 7 Town players and 2 Mafia players:

If you are Town, your goal is to lynch the Mafia. You do this by convincing others that one of the group is scum, and getting enough votes on them to lynch them.  The Town does not know who else is Town.

If you are Mafia, your goal is to kill off the Town until there is an equal number of them to you by getting them to lynch other Town or by killing them. You are given a kill each Night to kill any player in the game.  All the Mafia members know each other, and can communicate privately.

Each Day, everyone votes to lynch a player.  Vote for a player by posting their name in red.  You may change your vote at any time, remove your vote, or vote for No Lynch. Whoever has the most votes at the end of the day gets lynched, even if there is no majority. (Example: Nobody votes except for one guy, who votes Generic_Steve. Generic_Steve would get lynched). If you have a great deal of suspicion for someone, but don't want to vote for them just yet, point their name out in blue.

The Day will not end prematurely unless people vote to shorten the day. That is, there is no "hammer" in Beginner's Mafia, where X amount of votes (more than 50%) on a single person immediately ends the day with a lynch on that person. Some games do that, but not this one, and you would be explicitly informed in the rules if the hammer is active.

If there are tied votes for who gets lynched at the end of the day, the day ends in a no-lynch. (Two people vote for Generic_Steve, two people vote for Unassuming_Mary. Nobody gets lynched.) 

Each Night, you send in your actions. The cycle continues until one side wins. Days are 72 hours and nights are 24 hours. Weekends count for zero hours.

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Rules and Guidelines

• You may not PM other players other than the mod. The mafia will have a place to talk to themselves.
• Never edit your posts, even to fix typos!  If you make a mistake, just double post- it's permitted here. Violation of this rule can lead to deadly repercussions.  I recommend using the preview button every time you post.
• Never quote your role PM or any other PM sent to you by the mod.
• If you need more time to discuss, you may ask for an extension.  If more players ask for one than those who decline one, the day will be extended by 48 hours.
• There are no limit to the number of extensions allowed per day.
   
• Please don't forget about this game if you sign up! If you cannot continue playing, please ask for a replacement! I will prod you via PM if you do not post in 48 hours to remind you that this game exists!
• Note that a Mafia game usually takes a long time to finish: two weeks at least, and sometimes even longer than a month. Be ready for this.
• Upon receiving your second prod, you are forcibly replaced (Another player takes your place) or modkilled (removed from the game) for inactivity. Beware.
   
• Upon being killed, you are entitled to one "Bah!" post, but you are not allowed to post any game-related content. After your Bah post, you MUST NOT POST AGAIN unless you somehow come back to life (impossible in this setup) or replace back in (you must have been town to do this). Failure to comply with this rule can lead to a bad reputation amongst mods, and difficulty in joining other games.
• Never underestimate your importance, and always play to win!

In this setup, there are the possibility of extra roles. These roles are Cop and Doctor for Town, and Roleblocker and Godfather for Mafia.

• A Cop inspects any player at Night. They are told that player's alignment, but not their role.
• A Doctor may protect any player at Night. This stops that player from being killed.
• A Roleblocker stops an extra role from using an action. This stops Doctors and Cops but does nothing for Townies.
• Roleblockers do not actually discover if their attempts were successful or not; that would be too powerful because the roleblocker would know they found a town power role. It isn't an investigative role (the same goes for the Doctor)! The Mafia needs to find the town power roles the old-fashioned way: analyzing behavior and voting patterns.
• Townies do not receive a message if they were blocked by a Mafia Roleblocker. Only a Cop or a Doctor will receive a message.
   
• A Godfather, if investigated by a Cop, looks just like a normal Townie.

There is a 50% chance for any of these roles to show up. It is possible to end up with no extra roles.

Extensions require support from at least one of the players.  You may oppose extensions as well, which cancels out an extension request.  For example, if there were five players, with two requesting and two opposing, there would be no extension.  (2-2 = 0 of 5)

Along with opposing extensions, there is also the option to Shorten/End the Day. They work differently from extensions, 33% required to pass with no objections. Shortening the Day ends the Day makes the day end as quickly as I can process it. Due to the nature of these requests, they also act just like Counter-Extensions.

Please bold requests/opposition to extensions, and Mod/my name if you want to ask me a question in-thread.  (IE: Mod: I have a question!)

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Attendance Sheet

Players:

• Scelly9
• drakon136
• Dr.Phibes
• Tiruin
• MagmaMcFry
• Strategia
• Painiac

ICs:

• IronyOwl
• Dariush
• Non-playing Mafia IC: Darvi

Player Replacement Queue:

• BullDog

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Frequently Asked Questions

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

• Oh my god this game seems fun. But wait, what are the rules?
  This (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=39338.0) is a good Mafia tutorial, brought to you by the wise JoshuaFH. Heed his words. It isn't included here because it's rather too long for that.
• People are accusing me of being scum! I'm about to get lynched! What do I do?
  The first and most important order of business is not to give up.
  One, two votes isn't much. Even if someone's got a bandwagon on you and people are writing walls of accusations, do not lose hope. You can still turn this around, no matter how bleak it appears. Fight them with your own arguments, and search for people you may think are scum, and try to turn the votes against them. About the worst thing you can do is give up, whether you are town or scum; you are harming the town by making it lose another member, distracting them from hunts for the true scum, and worsening your own game as well.
  The other players have nothing against you: it's just how the game goes. Even if you foul it up and people yell at you for it, once the game is over we're all friends.
  There are still people who give up, saying things like "You'll all be sorry when you find out I'm just town afterwards!" and "I'm not even going to try, there no way to stop this". Don't be that guy. Not only is it rather selfish, it will simply deepen your grave. You have to get out of it with real, meat-laden arguments, and these empty threats and remarks will only make you appear more scummy.
• Do I have to post so much? I can't be bothered.
  Yes, you do. You have to be an active player to scumhunt effectively, and with a lurking playerbase you might as well just hand it to the scum. There is always something to say; even if someone said what you wanted to, say it anyways in your own words. Always ask questions, always observe.
  This is a very demanding game. If you don't have enough time, then perhaps you should look elsewhere.
• How do I even tell if someone's scum anyways?
  This is, in fact, a difficult question. The game involves a lot of observation, and often it's more about intuition.
  You can often tell with the help of the List of Common Scumtells, provided below, but don't make the mistake of overusing it. Not every accusal against you is an OMGUS, and not all attempts at logic are WIFOM.  If in doubt, always remember Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is crap. Don't take anything for granted.
• What's all this wine stuff that players keep talking about? Does Mafia cause alcoholism?
  They are likely referring to the concept of WIFOM. It's a name for the kind of circular reasoning that you'd find when scrutinising scum motives, and is described in the CEAs (Commonly Encountered Abbreviations) and Other Terminology Commonly Found in Bay12 Mafia below. It goes like this:
  
  A: Why didn't our most active player get killed? It would be the scum's goal to kill the most active players to remove accusal, wouldn't it? The only conclusion is that [active player] is scum!
  
  B: Or is it? What if the scum wants to keep the most active player to draw suspicion on him? The scum could then head the attack on this player, thus pushing themselves into a position of trust amongst the town! I've got my eye on you, A!
  
  A: No, that isn't right! Clearly, they would stay in the background, and the people who go for the bait like me would be attacked by the scum, thus making themselves appear insightful! B, how dare you do this to me!
  
  B: Or perhaps the scum would be someone voting for a person that isn't the subject of a bandwagon, thus appearing both inconspicuous and independent! [lurker], you are scum!
  
  As you can see here, both A and B are making wild speculations on the motives of the scum. Their votes and eyes are all over the place, and nothing is really getting done. It distracts from real scumhunting, which is seeing people play and making observations from that, not speculating on how people would or would not play.

---

Resources
Our own Bay12 Mafia tutorial (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=39338.0)
The Notable Games archive. Read a famous game from start to finish! Learn some Mafia history. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=64229.0)
The Mafiascum wiki. Lots of theory, terminology, and game analysis. (http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page)
An Interactive Flash tutorial by one of the Mafiascum.net people. Helpful visualization! (http://cataldo.freeshell.org/mafia/mafiascum04.swf)

Spoiler: Dakarian's Scumhunting Bible, reposted here for your convenience (click to show/hide)

A VERY rough sketch of how a scumhunt is done (to help those who aren't sure now).
Step 1: When you have no suspicions on anyone, pick someone at random (I MEAN random.. some use Random.org for this!), take a glance as their past posts, and talk to them, usually with a vote.  The goal is not to kill but to learn more about them.  The vote is a "Pressure Vote", simply used to make sure they don't ignore you.

Step 2: When someone feels 'off' to you: perhaps you disliked their answer, or maybe they scare you, or confuse you with their text.  Perhaps they look fine but your feelings or your gut says something is wrong. Perhaps you see them do one scumtell.  Don't ignore it: make them your target.  Attack them.  Tell them what bothers you about them.  Push them, harass them.  Tell them how scummy they are.  Ask them every question in the book.. and I mean EVERYTHING:

Litia: "You bother me.  Vote Dakarian!"

Dak: Meh.  Why?

Litia: "Because you bother me.  Why are you pushing me off as if it doesn't matter?"

Dak: "What? No, you just have nothing on me."

Litia: "You're voting for Vector.  why?"

Dak: "He looked scummy.."

Litia: "Vagueness is a scumtell!  "Scummy.. how is he scummy!"

Dak: "He just is.. you don't have a reason to go after me either."

Litia: "OMGUSing now Mr.Scum?  Being defensive?  You also didn't answer my question!"


Note, this is Step 2: Litia doesn't feel like she knows Dakarian is scum.. just had a 'feeling'.  She has no hard evidence, nothing real.  The questions are to add pressure.. make Dakarian crack and panic.  If you did it right, they WILL town or scum.  WHEN they do, you will be able to see more of their true self.  From there, decide if you can find them as scum for truth.  If you don't: pull out and go to your next suspect: if no one else is there, go back to Step 1.

If you do believe they are scum after that, Step 3:


Step 3: When you believe someone is scum, gather evidence.  Find every scum tell, every sign of their true motives.  Pull more from them.  DON'T LET GO!  Even if the town ignores you or even votes for you because of it, DO IT ANYWAY!  Push, push, PUSH, ***PUSH*** until you have solid proof of what they are.

If you can't find enough to prove them and run out of things to say, check one more time to see if you still feel he's scum, then pull back, look at others (Step 2) but be ready to go back to them at any time.  If your convinced and ready to kill them, Step 4

Step 4: Final step.  It's time to convince the town.  Show what you have.  Push the target so they show more scumminess.  Attack, but do it only to demonstrate to the town what you KNOW is true.  You aren't trying to argue with the mafia anymore.. you are trying to show the town why you are right and Mr.Mafia MUST be lynched.  If you are at this point, only 3 things can happen:

1.  The scum is lynched.
2. You are given so much information that you become CONVINCED that the target is town. (no less than CONVINCED.. doubt, maybe, 'perhaps' won't due)
3. You are dead.



That's how a basic scumhunt is done.  One last note on doubt:

Doubt is something that's ok to have but UGLY to show.  If you doubt or have second thoughts, DON'T DISPLAY IT.  If you think "He looks passive but I don't know..."  you SAY "You scum!  Stop being passive!!!"  If you think "He may have a good reason to attack guy really." say "Give me your reasons and stop being vague."

Doubt is something for yourself.  When you have doubt, go back and see if your original ideas still hold up.  If they do or if you find yourself saying "I'm not sure" then go back to the attack until you are sure.  This ain't the USA: we play by Guilty until Proven Innocent here.  Unless you can get yourself to believe they may be honest, keep the attack.

So doubt is ok to have if used right.. but the town does NOT need to hear it.  If you doubt, accuse anyway as if you know.  If you wonder, accuse as if you know it.  If you know the answer, ASK ANYWAY and let THEM answer.  Make them convince you they are town: don't do the job for them.


And that's scumhunting in a nutshell.  Everyone, try to figure out what Step you are on and work accordingly.  Note that you should be almost done Step 1 by the end of Day 1 (though some may be higher by then).  If you aren't, keep random voting and consider an Extension.

If you don't know WHAT you are.. you're in Step 1.  Get to random voting.

Last note: 'Not voting' should only be done when you are doing a quick look over everyone's past.  Otherwise, your vote and your attention should always be on SOMEONE, even if it is at random.

It's best for a lynch to be for a reason reason.. but it's better for someone to be lynched randomly than for no lynch to occur at all.

Spoiler: CEAs (Commonly Encountered Abbreviations) and Other Terminology Commonly Found in Bay12 Mafia (click to show/hide)

Alignment - Who you share a victory condition with. Town-aligned, Scum-aligned, or third party alignments.

Bandwagon - Multiple votes on a single person. Can be justified, or unjustified. Unjustified bandwagons are scummy. Joining bandwagons blindly or without reason is also scummy.

BM - Beginner's Mafia (Or, Bastard Mod, a Mafia game with a purposefully unreliable moderator, or misleading information)

Bus - (noun: the bus ; verb: bussing, throwing him/her under the bus) When a mafia member attacks another one in order to make themselves look like a loyal townie when his or her scumpartner gets lynched.

Cult - A group of players that share a win condition, know each other, and can communicate freely. They are generally a second type of scum, although rarely they can be town-aligned. Instead of a kill, they can recruit players into the cult. There is generally a cult leader, who is in charge of recruiting.

FoS - Finger of Suspicion, writing someone's name in blue signifies a great deal of suspicion. It's kind of like a fake-vote, or the threat of a vote. Good for getting attention.

FTD - Failure to Deliver, also known as Toaster's #1 Scumtell. The act of promising to post more information at a later time, and then failing to do so. A very difficult action to justify as town, because it means you are either lazy or lying, it is therefore seen as a pretty solid scumtell.

IC - Inexperienced Challenged, players who are too experienced to justify playing in a Beginner's Mafia, and act as mentors/guides for the Town or the Scum.

Lurking - Purposefully not posting, so that you have few or no posts that can be analyzed. Generally a good strategy for scum. However, has the danger of earning you prods, getting modkilled, or found out via Zathras' Lurkertracker. Lurking is different than simply being away or unavailable. A good way to tell if someone is lurking is to check their profile's last active time, and compare it to their last post.

LYLO - Lynch or Lose, a situation where Town only outnumbers Scum by a single person (e.g. 3 town vs. 2 scum). During LYLO, Town MUST lynch Scum or instantly lose.

Masons - A group of town-aligned players who know each other to be town-aligned. They can communicate with each other freely.

MYLO - Mislynch and Lose, a situation where Town outnumbers Scum by two people (4 town vs. 2 scum). During MYLO, if Town lynches Town, Scum will win after night-killing town, making it 2 town vs. 2 scum, which is an instant scum win.

NL - No Lynch, to choose to end the day without lynching anyone and see if any information is revealed in the night.

OMGUS - Oh My God U Suck, a vote on someone else simply because they voted or attacked you

PFP - Posting From Phone (or Profession), throwing up a short post to prove you aren't lurking, when you are too busy at the time to make a more complete post.

PL - Policy Lynch, lynching someone for reasons other than scumminess. Variants are Lynch All Lurkers, Lynch All Liars, etc. Also see: Org.

PPE - Pre-Post Edit, typically done when you go to either Preview or Post and notice that someone else has posted before you. PPE is shorthand for acknowledging the "Warning - You may wish to review your post" message.

RIA - Refuge in Audacity, acting really crazy or really scummy to make people think that you couldn't possibly be scum because of how crazy you are. This never works. Neither does sarcasm in general, really. If you want to be sarcastic, make it painfully obvious you are being sarcastic, with <sarcasm>fake sarcasm tags</sarcasm>. Even still, it's not a good idea, because Mafia is SERIOUS BUSINESS

Role - Also called Power Role, any special powers you have. Cops, doctors, roleblockers, and godfathers are examples of classic roles. Some roles are alignment-specific, some aren't, and some can be for any alignment.

Rolefishing - Any question or attempt to learn information about someone's role. Typically something done at the beginning of the game. Typically a scum move, because it is in scum's advantage to find and lynch powerful roles. Can be acceptable later in the game, or in special circumstances where it is beneficial for town to learn someone's role. The reason it is scummy is because the really powerful town roles want to stay hidden so they don't get lynched by scum, and bringing attention to them by rolefishing risks their secrecy.

RVS - Random Voting Stage, the early-early game, shortly after the game begins, where people randomly vote each other and ask each other different questions, trying to find any good reason to suspect someone.

Scum - Mafia, or someone who isn't aligned with the Town. The Informed Minority.

SK - Serial Killer, a third party role with a nightkill, and who is hostile to everyone.

Survivor - a third party role whose win condition requires that they be alive at the end of the game. Normal players can die and still win as long as their team as a whole wins, but a survivor must actually be alive at the end.

Third Party - an alignment that is independent of scum and town. Has a unique victory condition, and is typically a lone wolf type character.

Town - The anti-Scum. The uninformed majority.

Vanilla - Someone who doesn't have a power role. "Vanilla Town", "Vanilla Scum", etc.

WIFOM - Wine In Front Of Me, the circular reasoning that results from trying to determine the choices of an opponent who acted with full knowledge that his behavior would be subject to scrutiny.

Quote from: Princess Bride

"All right: where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right and who is dead."

"But it's so simple. All I have to do is divine from what I know of you. Are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet, or his enemy's?"

WoT - Wall of Text; a really really long post. Sometimes unavoidable, but generally you should try to keep them to a minimum. Sometimes scum use them to seem more active then they are.

Massclaim - When everyone starts roleclaiming, or saying they are a power role.

Spoiler: A List of Common Scumtells (click to show/hide)

(Thanks to IronyOwl for making the orig. version!)

Scumtells are things that someone does or says that imply that they're scum. Usually the reasoning is that it's bad or not productive for townies to do it, so it can be hard to distinguish signs of being scum from signs of being a noob. This is one of the reasons scum almost always win beginner's mafia games.

Note that scumtells are very very subjective; there's no simple way to distinguish a scumtell from a noobtell from being justified and/or lazy. Whether a justified, non-scummy version of a scumtell should still be called by its normal name varies from person to person. (Someone might describe their voting of someone who voted them as "not an OMGUS," other would say it's "a justified OMGUS" for instance)

In any case, common scumtells include:

Bandwagoning: Voting for whoever has the most votes or seems most likely to be lynched, despite having poor/no reasons or not wanting them lynched previously. It implies that you don't care who gets lynched, you just want someone gone, which is generally the case for scum.

OMGUSing: Short for Oh My God You Suck, by the way. Voting or otherwise applying pressure to whoever's voting you. It implies that you're really concerned about being pressured/lynched and want them to stop, which is more a scum thing. A townie would, in theory, be more open to the notion that their fellow townie is attempting to scumhunt at them, and less concerned about being found out.

Defending/Chainsawing: Defending just means what it sounds like: saying things to defend another player's actions or words. Chainsawing or chainsaw defending means attacking someone who's attacking another player in an attempt to get them to stop. The idea in both instances is that townies don't know if their fellow players are innocent or not, and hence have no real reason to defend them from legitimate persecution. Scum, on the other hand, know they're on a team and so are prone to not wanting their buddies found out or pressured.

Lurking: Not posting. Especially suspicious in the case of Active Lurking, which is trying to look active while not actually doing anything (posting frequently but with no substance, for instance). The idea in either case is that townies actually care about finding scum, and so should be doing things. Scum don't care, they just want some random guy lynched so they can kill someone at night.

Appearing Too Townie: There's no official name for this one, but being too concerned about your image; specifically avoiding things that might be seen as scumtells. The idea is that scum are very concerned about being found out, and so want to act nonscummy. Townies know they're not scum, so they're less concerned about LOOKING nonscummy and more concerned about finding scum.

Passiveness: This is when a person refuses, simply hasn't or seems reluctant to take a stance, such as lynches. Scum will be concerned about their image, and thus don't want to be seen supporting a town lynch or an attack on a town.

Backtracking: When a person changes their stance on a subject after stating it, such as supporting a lynch and after doing so claiming that they didn't do it. This is very suspicious, and is often a sign of scum wanting to retreat their position so as to be able to save their face.

Lying: Well this should be obvious, right? It happens when someone fakeclaims (says they're a cop/doc, but is just town for example), fabricates evidence and stuff like that.

Rolefishing: Trying to find powerroles (cop and doc in vanilla Mafia), often via questioning.

Quote from: Argembarger

Resigning yourself to being lynched.
Saying something like "there's no way for me to avoid being lynched so I won't bother trying"
Blackmailing the town, like "You can lynch me, but you'll be sorry when you see I was town all along!"
Voting yourself for any reason.

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If you're still confused, join anyhow and we'll teach you!

And if you have any other questions, just ask!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [0/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 19, 2012, 01:52:22 am

IN.
Last round sucked. Hopefully people play this time.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [0/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:54:02 am

I'll try to be vigilant about enforcing activity.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [0/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 19, 2012, 01:54:21 am

Also, you have people from previous rounds in your attendance.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 19, 2012, 02:38:27 am

Called the Scum IC-spot, so here I am.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [0/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 03:08:37 am

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 19, 2012, 01:54:21 am

Also, you have people from previous rounds in your attendance.

I see no such thing. (Shh!)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 19, 2012, 06:44:58 am

IN

Though, I expect to be pushed back in the replacement queue, I will be watching this earnestly.  ;D

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 19, 2012, 06:57:39 am

Town IC.

Er, that came out wrong.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 19, 2012, 06:59:32 am

Are you a knight, Dariush?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 19, 2012, 07:02:28 am

Fun fact: I was going to say "I'm a Knight Who Says 'Town IC'", but decided that it sounded a bit too cryptic and weird.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 19, 2012, 07:45:53 am

In.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 19, 2012, 12:18:01 pm

In.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 19, 2012, 12:26:52 pm

In.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 19, 2012, 12:29:35 pm

Long time no see.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 19, 2012, 12:39:52 pm

Duh, I had some problems with computer at the time. And then exams, and then work, and then I forgot about mafia...

... But now, I had got some homework with making internet page. So I thought, I should try making mafia page in my native language, it could be fun. So there, I want to learn some more about it. Hi there.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 19, 2012, 05:35:02 pm

I feel like I need a break from mafia, so I'm not going to IC this one.

I'll hover around though, and offer advice if I feel it's necessary, but for the most part, I'm going to hang back.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: drakon136 on March 19, 2012, 05:56:43 pm

IN!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 19, 2012, 06:16:57 pm

in

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 20, 2012, 01:17:55 am

And we're full of new players! We just need one more town IC and we can start.

Guess that means I should really write up that flavor now, eheh.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Bookthras on March 20, 2012, 01:24:32 am

Maybe just have one playing IC, and allow another newbie? Or why are two ICs required?

Also, for clarity, it's not "town IC", it's "playing IC"; they're not guaranteed to be town at all.

...but yeah, time to work on that flavour, we know you can bring it and make it fun. May this be a great game!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 20, 2012, 01:56:27 am

*cough* Willing to be pushed in the replacement queue if in case anyone else wants to join.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 20, 2012, 02:00:13 am

It's town IC inasmuch as they're predominantly concerned with offering the town advice. However, the distinction is important, yes.

As for why 2 ICs? That's how the first game I played was run, and I liked it. Barring serious opposition or people really wanting to have a shot, I'm not gonna change it.

Thanks for the support!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 20, 2012, 02:00:45 am

Tiruin: If someone else wants to join, I'll consider it, but unless otherwise noted it looks okay for now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Jim Groovester on March 20, 2012, 02:11:26 am

The two ICs are a legacy from the Mafiascum new player training game setup. It's also where the term Inexperienced Challenged originated. Pretty sure about that, but not completely.

I never found the logic of why having two of them was important. I assume it's just that having a redundancy of ICs allows for better teaching coverage. I can think of some good reasons myself why there should be two. Mostly, you can doubt the word of one guy who says he's experienced, but it's not so easy when there are two people telling you the same thing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 20, 2012, 02:35:03 am

Town IC's are also supposed to teach by example, which can be hard if the only one gets killed on N1 as they are likely to do.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 20, 2012, 02:37:11 am

Jim: Yeah, that's where the term came from. Not sure if that's where the number came from, but I'd believe it. It also allows for a diversity of opinions, to show that it isn't entirely hard and fast and that there are different ways to play. Well, beyond the basics, that is.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: IronyOwl on March 20, 2012, 02:49:48 am

I'd be willing to IC this game.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 20, 2012, 02:51:05 am

And that's two! Game will start tomorrow evening PST (take a shot).

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - One Town IC Needed [7/7, 1/2, 1/1]
Post by: Bookthras on March 20, 2012, 02:55:49 am

Quote from: Darvi on March 20, 2012, 02:35:03 am

Town IC's are also supposed to teach by example, which can be hard if the only one gets killed on N1 as they are likely to do.

That... makes a lot of sense, yes. If just one guy is helping the townies, the scum will get'im, but with two (and lesser chances of both being town) it's not so easy. Plus diversity of opinion, different schools of thought and all that. Yes.

Quote from: Think0028 on March 20, 2012, 02:51:05 am

And that's two! Game will start tomorrow evening PST (take a shot).

Yay! Good luck!

PS: Once the game starts, don't edit your posts! Ever!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Signups Open [1/7, 0/2, 0/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 20, 2012, 06:34:13 am

Quote from: drakon136 on March 19, 2012, 05:56:43 pm

IN!

For real this time?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Full! Starts Tuesday Evening PST [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: drakon136 on March 20, 2012, 04:54:37 pm

Yes, for real this time. Not my fault some asshole used my internet to download their crap and made me go over my monthly cap last game. :/

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - Full! Starts Tuesday Evening PST [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 21, 2012, 12:43:37 am

Day 1 has begun! It will end Friday 9:00 PM!

The 9 of you are moderators for the Labrador Canine Squad forums, better known as LCS. A popular game made by the Elf Fortress developer FroggyTwo, it has spun off with its own developers and its own forum on the Elf Fortress site. There's so much activity, however, that the moderator staff of 2 has recently been stepped up to 9.

Two days ago, much to everyone's befuddlement, the main help thread, some 50 pages long, was totally deleted. It was recreated after everyone assumed it was just database errors.

Yesterday, it was deleted again. No two ways about it, it's definitely sabotage now. But how to prove it? Only FroggyTwo has access to the IP and moderator action logs.

It was decided that they'd vote on someone to target each day, and force then to put up a post that will get them instantly banned. FroggyTwo, in the process of banning them, will naturally check their moderation activity to see what they did, and then everything will be cleared up.

Why can't we just ask him, you question?

Where's the fun in that?

*This game is based on a true story. Names, facts, and pretty much everything that involves Mafia have been fabricated to protect no one at all.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 12:50:20 am

Wow, seriously some douche was deleting treads? People can be so immature on Internet sometimes.

Dariush, why are you SCUMMMMMM?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 12:51:25 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 12:50:20 am

Wow, seriously some douche was deleting treads? People can be so immature on Internet sometimes.

Dariush, why are you SCUMMMMMM?

Why a useless question, Painiac?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: IronyOwl on March 21, 2012, 01:19:54 am

Greetings! I hope you are all ready to play some Mafia.

As you may be aware, I am an IC this game. This means that while I am a player, subject to the same rules and probabilities as all the rest of you, I'm also a more experienced player who's primary interest is in helping you play mafia better. This means that while I am not a flawless source of infinite wisdom, you can trust my advice to be fairly credible and well-intentioned, even if I happen to be scum.

As a consequence to this, you should probably listen when I have something to say.


So, let's get started, shall we? The most important part of Mafia is actually playing Mafia. This might sound fairly self-evident, but a lot of people tend to have trouble with it. If you find yourself waiting for something to happen, you should probably go out and make something happen. Passive, lurky play benefits scum. You don't want to benefit (or look like you want to benefit) scum, do you?

"But IronyOwl," you say, "I don't know how to catch scum!" Well, that's why you're here, isn't it? If you don't know what you're doing, ask and/or try anyway. Either way, an IC will be along shortly to explain what you should be doing and why.


So, without further ado, let's begin leading by example, shall we?



drakon136, let's say it's LYLO, and someone claims doctor. As you'll recall, BMs sometimes have a doctor in them and sometimes don't, but they're always town if so. Would you believe such a claim, and therefore by extension that the person making it is confirmed town? How would you feel towards people who advocated lynching them anyway? Avoiding lynching them despite reasons to do so?

Strategia, are you happy with your faction and role, or were you hoping for something different?

Dr.Phibes, what's your preferred playstyle? Do you have playstyles you really like or hate to see in other people? Are they dependent on circumstances, ie really liking lurky play in others when you're scum but hating it when you're town?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 21, 2012, 02:04:05 am

Trololol u mad bros?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:10:59 am

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 12:51:25 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 12:50:20 am

Wow, seriously some douche was deleting treads? People can be so immature on Internet sometimes.

Dariush, why are you SCUMMMMMM?

Why a useless question, Painiac?

Bah, it's not useless. I can check reaction with this question, so it's not useless.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Tiruin, what are your favourite scumtells and why?

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Argh, every IC has some kind of long-winded greeting except me. :( Oh well. I'm Dariush, and I'm extremely white and fluffy. Any interactions with me may will result in sanity, blood, limb and life loss.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 12:50:20 am

Wow, seriously some douche was deleting treads? People can be so immature on Internet sometimes.

Dariush, why are you SCUMMMMMM?

Congratulations, your very first post in the game and there are already two things wrong with it! First, roleplay is heavily discouraged around here. It shows that the roleplayer is far too relaxed, which probably means he's scum. Second, useless questions like that are EXTREMELY heavily discouraged around here. When asking any question, think: How does it help you find scum? What are you going to do depending on the answer? Or, alternately, if you're scum: Does it look like activelurking (i.e. technically being in game but contributing nothing to the discussion)? Does it allow you to continue an attack on a weak premise?

Since this is a BM, I'll answer: I'm not scum. But in any other game you'll be quickly given shit to eat for such a question (like is being done by Scelly, but on a higher scale).

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

Drakon, if you were scum, whom among the non-ICs would you prefer as your buddy and why?

Tiruin, whom against the non-ICs do you consider the best town player and why?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

{About flavor: That was a true story? Wow.} Requesting player list.

---

Ahh, I love my mornings. Waking up to every BM like so. (PPE Dariush)

MagmaMcFry: (Can we use a shortened name?) Favorite scumtells? Hmm, theres the OMGUS, but the effect and scumminess of such is determined by the timing and content of the post. There's also lurking, but honestly, part of meta comes here and RL checking. Lying seems right, gives people time to actually focus in game on who is telling what, especially in games where flavor has an effect.

Truly, all of them in the [Scumhunting Bible]. A scumtell is a scumtell.

How does this help you find scum?

IronyOwl: This is the first time (in recent games) that I've seen you as a BM IC. How are you prepared to correct each player's scumhunting/perspective and to aid them generally? Straight to the point posts, or in detail ideas?

drakon136: Let's say you're a cop, how would you determine your targets, saying that they are not on the lynching block? I.E. The most vague and not scummy, or the most scummy in terms of newbie-ness?

Painiac: Judging by your posts, pre-game and in-game, I see you have some knowledge of Mafia set down. Who, among all us players do you fear most as scum? Also, why the pointed question at Dariush?

Dr.Phibes: Let's say you are the doctor, day 1 has gone and went with a dead townie. Another has requested a replacement which would be filled the coming morn, while everyone else seems vague in the current time. Who would you protect? The replacement, or the random person and why?

Strategia: Let's say the date is LYLO, nothing but dead townies all the way and you are a vanilla townie with no lead at all. If someone that you haven't a clear read on claims cop and outlines his details along with stating that you are town and that there was one Mafia unveiled, would you lynch the uncovered Mafioso?

Dariush: Best town player in my view hm? Well, I would say Strategia, however he is the only one I've played with or viewed in the most recent BM/Mafia games so that would be biased. However I've never seen any of the others, so I'd say Strategia. He has experience, but his first game was only as a replacement.

Now, let's say you are scum. Who would you lay the NK on? A fanatically aggressive townie who draws most of the attention from everyone in his successful scumhunt, a replacement who has done his fair share of hunting or a random lurker who hasn't gained any attention and why?

Scelly9: Let's say you've read most of the Mafia games in this whole board and many of the players you're playing with have been in those games. Would you judge your RVS vote based on metagaming knowledge, something related to Mafia or just something else?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

The purpose of my questions was to have the ICs spit out some detailed information on people's known individual playstyles, so everyone has some kind of idea about how others behave and can direct their scumhunting based on who is behaving differently than they are described. Naturally, the "not behaving as they are described" can't be used as a scumtell, because for all we know you could just be lying about the playstyles, but if A notices an inconsistency between B's described and exhibited behavior, he can just start focusing his scumhunt on B. So essentially, the information you and IronyOwl give acts as a minor hunting aid for everyone.

Or at least it would, if you had actually given some information, instead of immediately starting to act the unhelpful jerk that you've been during the entire previous BM.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

MagmaMcFry: (Can we use a shortened name?) Favorite scumtells? Hmm, theres the OMGUS, but the effect and scumminess of such is determined by the timing and content of the post. There's also lurking, but honestly, part of meta comes here and RL checking. Lying seems right, gives people time to actually focus in game on who is telling what, especially in games where flavor has an effect.

Truly, all of them in the [Scumhunting Bible]. A scumtell is a scumtell.

How does this help you find scum?

Well, now I have some information on what kind of scumhunting to expect from you. Personally, I hate lurking as a scumtell, but that's probably because of the horrible, horrible last BM.
BTW: Call me McFry.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 10:35:25 am

Oh, and by the way:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush[...], which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 11:18:01 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 21, 2012, 01:19:54 am

Strategia, are you happy with your faction and role, or were you hoping for something different?

I didn't have any preference going into this game, so I'd be happy either way.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

Strategia: Let's say the date is LYLO, nothing but dead townies all the way and you are a vanilla townie with no lead at all. If someone that you haven't a clear read on claims cop and outlines his details along with stating that you are town and that there was one Mafia unveiled, would you lynch the uncovered Mafioso?

I'd take it with a grain of salt at least, re-read the thread to check the supposed cop's behaviour. Especially who they voted for, and why. If it's been dead townies all the way, and said cop was on board with most or all of those lynches, I don't think I'd believe it just on face value. I'd also check the posts of the supposed mafioso, if they seem scummier than the supposed cop then that would lend some credence to the latter's claims. I guess who I'd vote depended on how many people are left for LYLO, if it's just us three then it all depends on my re-read, if it's more (three townies vs. two mafia being the most conventional layout) then I'd also be taking other people into account of course.

---

And now for RVS.

Scelly, in this game, barring ICs, who would you want as your scumbuddy? Who would you not want as scumbuddy?

drakon, you are the Cop. Who would you inspect first (i.e. N1), an IC or a new player who's dropped some questionable scum/noobtells?

Phibes, you are scum and the game is at LYLO. Your scumbuddy has been catching a lot of flak throughout the game, but everyone thinks you're squeaky clean. Would you bus your scumbuddy? Would you vote first, right after the night ends, or would you wait until others have done so already?

Tiruin, red or blue?

Magma, red or blue?

Painiac, you have several votes on you. Do you defend yourself or point out someone else for them to vote?

IronyOwl, red or blue?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 11:31:28 am

Or

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 11:35:01 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:10:59 am

Bah, it's not useless. I can check reaction with this question, so it's not useless.

Technically I could "check reaction" with the question: "Do you like dinosaurs?" But it would still be useless.
So, Painiac, what did you get from his reply?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

Scelly9: Let's say you've read most of the Mafia games in this whole board and many of the players you're playing with have been in those games. Would you judge your RVS vote based on metagaming knowledge, something related to Mafia or just something else?

I would choose my RVS vote via Random.org. At least until someone does something other than what they normally do.

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 11:18:01 am

Scelly, in this game, barring ICs, who would you want as your scumbuddy? Who would you not want as scumbuddy?

I think if I where scum I would like Tiruin as my scumbuddy. He seems to have a bit of experience. Secondly, I would NOT want Painiac as my scumbuddy. Mostly because he just did something rather scummy in his very first post.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 12:09:00 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 11:18:01 am

Magma, red or blue?

Red.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 12:57:46 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

{About flavor: That was a true story? Wow.} Requesting player list.

---

Ahh, I love my mornings. Waking up to every BM like so. (PPE Dariush)

MagmaMcFry: (Can we use a shortened name?) Favorite scumtells? Hmm, theres the OMGUS, but the effect and scumminess of such is determined by the timing and content of the post. There's also lurking, but honestly, part of meta comes here and RL checking. Lying seems right, gives people time to actually focus in game on who is telling what, especially in games where flavor has an effect.

Truly, all of them in the [Scumhunting Bible]. A scumtell is a scumtell.


Dr.Phibes: Let's say you are the doctor, day 1 has gone and went with a dead townie. Another has requested a replacement which would be filled the coming morn, while everyone else seems vague in the current time. Who would you protect? The replacement, or the random person and why?

Is this some kind of test? Well the replacement is kinda a random guy too. He left beacuse he got a boring roll or beacuse he havent got the time to play. Its impossible for me to know which one is right. I would prolly look around a bit more on the day, then decied who i want to help. I think i would take a "random" person instead beacuse if it is an important town roll, then he cant do a night action and i think no one would do that. I think the scums would actully benefit if a new guy enters the game. So they have no intentions of killing him. Or maybe its a tactic fo the scums, so you think its just a townie. But i dont know :/

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 01:00:17 pm

Sry messed up the quote :(

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 12:50:20 am

Wow, seriously some douche was deleting treads? People can be so immature on Internet sometimes.

Dariush, why are you SCUMMMMMM?

Congratulations, your very first post in the game and there are already two things wrong with it! First, roleplay is heavily discouraged around here. It shows that the roleplayer is far too relaxed, which probably means he's scum.

Honestly, how you had seen in my post roleplaying? Think had wrote:

Quote from: Think0028 on March 21, 2012, 12:43:37 am

*This game is based on a true story.

and heavily suggested in flavortext that some sort of vandalism happened here on Bay12Forums, and I just commented on this thing out of curiosity. There wasn't any roleplay, and you should know that better.

Quote

Second, useless questions like that are EXTREMELY heavily discouraged around here. When asking any question, think: How does it help you find scum? What are you going to do depending on the answer?

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

I admit it's weak question, weak prod. But, if I would find it not useful, I can always ask second question.

So, Dariush. What you have to say about your weak OMGUS? Why you hadn't vote anybody yet (me, for example)?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

Painiac: Judging by your posts, pre-game and in-game, I see you have some knowledge of Mafia set down. Who, among all us players do you fear most as scum? Also, why the pointed question at Dariush?

I fear basically everybody. I don't know your playstyle, your scumtells can and probably will be heavily mixed with noobtells, and that's just WIFOM on the rabies. I do not want to jump into that shit willingly. I am gonna watch for a while, while going for much more reliable to read IC's. IC, if he is scum, will be pretty dangerous to town with his experience. If he's looking town, I will be more calm about approaching other players, because I have backup in town IC.

I had pointed my question at Dariush precisely because he's Dariush - he can be flippy-flappy about questions like that when he's scum.

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 11:18:01 am

Painiac, you have several votes on you. Do you defend yourself or point out someone else for them to vote?

Is that meta question, or game related? In game, I have just one vote, because that scum Dariush didn't bothered to vote me. He didn't voted anybody, to be explicit.

Well if that's meta question: you should do BOTH things. Pointing out at someone else is some sort of defence, after all, and brings more info for town to digest. Defending yourself is also important to some degree (too much defending and doing nothing means you are a scum), you have to respect attempts of other townies in scumhunting, and explain they are going for wrong targets.

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 11:35:01 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:10:59 am

Bah, it's not useless. I can check reaction with this question, so it's not useless.

Technically I could "check reaction" with the question: "Do you like dinosaurs?" But it would still be useless.
So, Painiac, what did you get from his reply?

Quote

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

This. And, I have to disagree, dinosaurs are not scummy. Direct question to scum ,,Why are you scum?" can yield interesting reactions.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

blah blah I am lazy give me info about others so I can hunt

NO, MAN, you should do your homework yourself. That's the mafia we are talking about, you should have your own hunches, and eventually confirm these with others. Don't be lazy passive dick, that's very anti-town. Also, FoS MagmaMcFry. Show me real scumhunting instead nagging Dariush like beggar for info. That's not purpose of IC's.

IronyOwl: Would you want vanilla role, or something more important in such light setting?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Quote

Since this is a BM, I'll answer: I'm not scum. But in any other game you'll be quickly given shit to eat for such a question (like is being done by Scelly, but on a higher scale).

How can we know your not a mafia? Just beacuse its a BM doesent mean you cant lie. I am watching you Dariush.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 02:37:52 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 11:35:01 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:10:59 am

Bah, it's not useless. I can check reaction with this question, so it's not useless.

Technically I could "check reaction" with the question: "Do you like dinosaurs?" But it would still be useless.
So, Painiac, what did you get from his reply?

Quote

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

This. And, I have to disagree, dinosaurs are not scummy. Direct question to scum ,,Why are you scum?" can yield interesting reactions.

I was not asking about dinosaurs. What did you get from your question?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Quote

Since this is a BM, I'll answer: I'm not scum. But in any other game you'll be quickly given shit to eat for such a question (like is being done by Scelly, but on a higher scale).

How can we know your not a mafia? Just beacuse its a BM doesent mean you cant lie. I am watching you Dariush.

Is that really your reason for suspecting Dariush? It's WIFOM, null tell, no info there.

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 02:37:52 pm

I was not asking about dinosaurs. What did you get from your question?

Quote

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

Gosh, watch what are you copying. Or you are too lazy to even bother?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:46:37 pm

And, Dr.Phibes, editing your posts is prohibited, you can get your ass served by mod for doing that. I can understand you was only editing quote tag, but use Preview before posting.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 21, 2012, 02:48:23 pm

Painiac is correct. Editing your posts is strictly verboten, even if it's badly formatted to the point of unreadability. Just post it again, no one will mind.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 02:51:25 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 02:37:52 pm

I was not asking about dinosaurs. What did you get from your question?

Quote

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

Gosh, watch what are you copying. Or you are too lazy to even bother?

My bad. I wrote that wrong. I meant to ask what you THOUGHT you where going to get from that question. I find its better to put random pressure on with a useful question. Rather than one that has no use other than pressure.

Painiac, if you where scum, who of the current players (IC's not included) would you like as scumbuddy?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:13:19 pm

You should watch some wuba games, he prods his target with such questions to the point target is irritiated, then hands out bricks of logic like there's no tommorow. Basically, I like clean pressure questions more. Scum can easily weasel out from question, if it's based on game know/how knowledge. No pressure, no gain.

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 02:51:25 pm

Painiac, if you where scum, who of the current players (IC's not included) would you like as scumbuddy?

Guh, I dunno. I don't have any knowledge about other players. Tiruin acts properly, you are acting properly, so maybe you two. I wouldn't want for sure MagmaMcFry, his attitude get's on my nerves. Strategia asks red or blue question three times, so she doesn't care about questions at all - good scumtell. But, probably newbietell. So, she can be attacked for that.

It's hard to tell just by this one game, and to be frank, I don't have time for reading BM's. If someone is townie, he may be acting naturally and easily, but will drop scumtells left and right when being scum. That's why one game isn't enough.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

blah blah I am lazy give me info about others so I can hunt

NO, MAN, you should do your homework yourself. That's the mafia we are talking about, you should have your own hunches, and eventually confirm these with others. Don't be lazy passive dick, that's very anti-town.

That's a very biased interpretation of my actions. Let's compare what you say I said with what I actually said.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

The purpose of my questions was to have the ICs spit out some detailed information on people's known individual playstyles, so everyone has some kind of idea about how others behave and can direct their scumhunting based on who is behaving differently than they are described. Naturally, the "not behaving as they are described" can't be used as a scumtell, because for all we know you could just be lying about the playstyles, but if A notices an inconsistency between B's described and exhibited behavior, he can just start focusing his scumhunt on B. So essentially, the information you and IronyOwl give acts as a minor hunting aid for everyone.

While I've looked at a few previous games myself, there are lots of reasons why I chose to ask the ICs to reiterate their knowledge about the players.
First, the ICs have played more games with this round's players, and should therefore have an accurate idea of most people's gameplay, more than I and others have read out of the previous games.
Second, there are two of them, and if one should decide to give biased information, then information between the two IC posts will differ and we will know that one of the ICs cannot be trusted.
Third, everybody can use the information given by the ICs. I suspect that not everybody will go through all of this group's previous games, so the information will help the players to form their own opinion. As I said before, the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells, so everybody will still have to scumhunt on their own, but with a little more guidance.
Fourth, it is not required to believe or even regard the given information. You are still free to suspect whomever you want.
Fifth, this is a test to see if the ICs are willing to cooperate with the town. Dariush has already failed this test big time, therefore my main suspicion rests on him.

Dariush, you have been constantly active on the forums for almost eight hours after I repeated my question, but you haven't answered it yet, which makes me even more suspicious. Now that I have given my reasons for asking this question, I will ask you one last time, and I expect you to swallow your pride (it doesn't belong in a Mafia game) and answer this question to everyone's fullest satisfaction. Which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 03:49:24 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:13:19 pm

Strategia asks red or blue question three times, so she doesn't care about questions at all - good scumtell. But, probably newbietell. So, she can be attacked for that.

I'm not a she. And the "red or blue" questions do have a purpose, if only for me. In fact, Painiac: red or blue?

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Fifth, this is a test to see if the ICs are willing to cooperate with the town. Dariush has already failed this test big time, therefore my main suspicion rests on him.

It isn't Dariush' job to point out targets for town. Also, on a meta level, ICs in general and Dariush in particular are less active in BMs than they are in other games, presumably to avoid what you're trying to do, newb town going after whoever the ICs suspect.

Quote

Dariush, [...] and I expect you to swallow your pride (it doesn't belong in a Mafia game)

Okay, this honestly made me laugh. a.) You're wrong and b.) You're one to talk, Emperor McFry. (And yes I know that really has no bearing on this game.)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:57:52 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 03:49:24 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Fifth, this is a test to see if the ICs are willing to cooperate with the town. Dariush has already failed this test big time, therefore my main suspicion rests on him.

It isn't Dariush' job to point out targets for town.

It isn't my intention to have Dariush point out targets for town.

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 03:49:24 pm

Quote

Dariush, [...] and I expect you to swallow your pride (it doesn't belong in a Mafia game)

Okay, this honestly made me laugh. a.) You're wrong and b.) You're one to talk, Emperor McFry. (And yes I know that really has no bearing on this game.)

a) Tell me why I'm wrong. Give me any situation where it would be considered acceptable to deny an answer to a good question.
b) Hm, looks like I thought the same thing earlier already.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

Dariush, if we say you were a scum, who would be your first target and why?

MagmaMcFry, Its seems to me your just trying to find something that makes Dariush a bit suspicious so no one will suspect that you are a scum when you vote on him. You dont care who you votes on, but you want some solid info beacuse if you just said Dariush is fishy you would have been suspescted or maybe lynched by now. Or am i wrong?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 04:06:44 pm

Ironyowl. Let's assume for a second that you're scum. Do you think the fact that you're an IC would give you an advantage in remaining undetected?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:11:19 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells

You are stating it yourself, duh. You are stepping on thin ice of meta scumtells. Using information from other games isn't that bad, but VERY risky. You need to play with such person constantly, see several games where such person is scum or third party. WHILE such person stopped making easy mistakes due to being inexperienced. And you need time to digest your info. It's basically not worth the effort if player sucks at playing mafia. Not mentioning that these scumtells are subjective, and may mean nothing to anyone other. It's not solid argument. You shouldn't use these as your only excuse to lynch someone, that's just plain stupid.

And there you are, begging for nicely packed info, so you can START thinking. Your attitude as town is horrible. If you WANT to have some scumtells from BM's - read these yourself, do your own homework!

The best solution - do some real SCUMHUNTING!

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Dariush, I am crying because I didn't get my answer

People have life, live with it. And while we are at this, why are you so goddamn unproductive, scum?

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 03:49:24 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:13:19 pm

Strategia asks red or blue question three times, so she doesn't care about questions at all - good scumtell. But, probably newbietell. So, she can be attacked for that.

I'm not a she. And the "red or blue" questions do have a purpose, if only for me. In fact, Painiac: red or blue?

Sorry for that.

Red. Explain these purposes for me, Strategia.

Dr.Phibes, that was question for you.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

How can we know your not a mafia? Just beacuse its a BM doesent mean you cant lie. I am watching you Dariush.

Is that really your reason for suspecting Dariush? It's WIFOM, null tell, no info there.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:26:09 pm

Painiac, sry cant understand the short terms very well :( Explain what it means and i will answer.
On a side note, you said you were going to hang back and just watch a while. Have something you find interesting happaned or is 2 hours enough for chilling? Or did you just say that to drop suspicion on your aggresive play?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 04:35:48 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:57:52 pm

Tell me why I'm wrong. Give me any situation where it would be considered acceptable to deny an answer to a good question.

I was talking about "swallow your pride, it has no place in Mafia". Denying an answer to a good question is unacceptable, no argument there.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:11:19 pm

Red. Explain these purposes for me, Strategia.

That would invalidate the purpose of asking the question. Also, it has no immediate bearing on whether or not I vote someone.

---

Dr.Phibes: I still have an open question (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115697#msg3115697) for you.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 04:40:33 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

MagmaMcFry, Its seems to me your just trying to find something that makes Dariush a bit suspicious so no one will suspect that you are a scum when you vote on him. You dont care who you votes on, but you want some solid info beacuse if you just said Dariush is fishy you would have been suspescted or maybe lynched by now. Or am i wrong?

Nope, completely wrong. First, I already said that Dariush is fishy, and I've already given reasons why I think he is fishy. Now I'm pressuring him and trying to find displayable evidence that he is scum, because that's what I strongly suspect he is. If I find enough evidence, I'll display it to you and vote him, because then he's scum and scum should be lynched. On the other hand, if Dariush manages to convince me that he's town, I'll switch to someone else and pressure him instead. The fact that Dariush isn't posting here does not make it easier for me.
In short, I'm scumhunting.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:11:19 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells

You are stating it yourself, duh. You are stepping on thin ice of meta scumtells. Using information from other games isn't that bad, but VERY risky. You need to play with such person constantly, see several games where such person is scum or third party. WHILE such person stopped making easy mistakes due to being inexperienced. And you need time to digest your info. It's basically not worth the effort if player sucks at playing mafia. Not mentioning that these scumtells are subjective, and may mean nothing to anyone other. It's not solid argument. You shouldn't use these as your only excuse to lynch someone, that's just plain stupid.

As I told you before, the information is not for scumtells, but for helping you find your own opinion. You still have to find proof yourself. If you think it's useless, feel free to completely disregard it.

Quote

And there you are, begging for nicely packed info, so you can START thinking. Your attitude as town is horrible. If you WANT to have some scumtells from BM's - read these yourself, do your own homework!

As you can see, I'm doing a lot of thinking, even without info. Also, I've done my homework. If you can't believe that the information itself isn't just for me, then I can't help you with that.

Quote

The best solution - do some real SCUMHUNTING!

I'm scumhunting on Dariush, if you haven't noticed yet.

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Dariush, I am crying because I didn't get my answer

People have life, live with it.

Please stop modifying my posts, it looks like you want to badmouth me.
People have life, but Dariush has had time for this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=99297.msg3115523#msg3115523) and six others since I asked. Also, it would be relatively harmless if Dariush had ignored my question, but instead, he chose to give something totally unhelpful. And unhelpful is not good.

Quote

And while we are at this, why are you so goddamn unproductive, scum?

I have a suspicion and am following it. How have you been productive so far?

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 04:35:48 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:57:52 pm

Tell me why I'm wrong. Give me any situation where it would be considered acceptable to deny an answer to a good question.

I was talking about "swallow your pride, it has no place in Mafia". Denying an answer to a good question is unacceptable, no argument there.

Okay, then tell me why "swallow your pride, it has no place in Mafia" is wrong.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:46:38 pm

Strategia What do you mean with red or blue? should i pick one? If thats the case i go with blue.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:49:18 pm

WIFOM - Wine In Front Of Me, the circular reasoning that results from trying to determine the choices of an opponent who acted with full knowledge that his behavior would be subject to scrutiny.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9f3GSA9yfc

I just want to say that your reason for suspecting Dariush is argument, which means nothing. Because, if he's town, he would say ,,I am not scum", if he's scum, he would also say ,,I am not scum". Don't WIFOM yourself. If you see something, that you can't be certain of, just leave it be.

Your argument is so weak it looks like you are just splashing some mud on Dariush, just for having poor excuse for possible bandwagon in future or something like that.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:26:09 pm

On a side note, you said you were going to hang back and just watch a while. Have something you find interesting happaned or is 2 hours enough for chilling? Or did you just say that to drop suspicion on your aggresive play?

I just can't pass on such obvious scumminess MagmaMcFry displays.

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 04:35:48 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:11:19 pm

Red. Explain these purposes for me, Strategia.

That would invalidate the purpose of asking the question. Also, it has no immediate bearing on whether or not I vote someone.

Wat.

You just don't have any good excuse for these questions, scum. And if these questions do not have any immediate bearing on voting - why ask them?

Strategia.

MagmaMcFry, you had asked him two (?) question, he's not around now. Maybe try other targets?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 05:11:52 pm

Painiac, i just wanted to see hes reaction, its not that he said that he was not scum. I thought it was wierd for him to mark out that its BM and thats why he said "i am town" Just thought it to be odd.
You think mcfry is scum but you vote Strategia? Why? Strategia just asking questions. Feels like we will regret voting on him :/

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 05:13:18 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 04:40:33 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 04:35:48 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:57:52 pm

Tell me why I'm wrong. Give me any situation where it would be considered acceptable to deny an answer to a good question.

I was talking about "swallow your pride, it has no place in Mafia". Denying an answer to a good question is unacceptable, no argument there.

Okay, then tell me why "swallow your pride, it has no place in Mafia" is wrong.

I recall reading somewhere (I can't find it anymore, unfortunately, though I think Jim said it) that if you're looking for humility, the Mafia board is the wrong place to look. And it stands to reason, too; Mafia is not just a game of logic, it's a clash of personalities. If you know (or think you know) someone's scum, you're supposed to go after them with everything you've got. If everyone lets go of their pride, you're going to have a very boring game, with people holding back because they don't feel they're certain enough. You have to be proud of who you are, and proud of your team, to succeed at Mafia. Besides, if you know you're a good player (like e.g. webadict), you should take pride in that and use it to your advantage. I've seen at least one or two games that wuba played like a fiddle. If he was to "let go of his pride", he wouldn't be nearly as good as he is.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:46:38 pm

Strategia What do you mean with red or blue? should i pick one? If thats the case i go with blue.

Thanks for that, but that's not what I asked. Here it is;

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 11:18:01 am

Phibes, you are scum and the game is at LYLO. Your scumbuddy has been catching a lot of flak throughout the game, but everyone thinks you're squeaky clean. Would you bus your scumbuddy? Would you vote first, right after the night ends, or would you wait until others have done so already?

Make sure to read posts thoroughly, missing questions like this can cost you in the future. Especially when someone points it out to you, with a link.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:49:18 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 04:35:48 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:11:19 pm

Red. Explain these purposes for me, Strategia.

That would invalidate the purpose of asking the question. Also, it has no immediate bearing on whether or not I vote someone.

Wat.

You just don't have any good excuse for these questions, scum. And if these questions do not have any immediate bearing on voting - why ask them?

I have my reasons for asking them, and so far it's all lined up how I expected. There's no trap or value judgement or anything of the sort attached to the question. And if we were only supposed to ask questions that have an immediate bearing on voting, we'd basically be asking "So, are you scum?" of everyone, and RVS questions of the sort that are common around here wouldn't exist. The whole point of asking questions at all is to get a feeling for the player who answers them. Your vote is weak.

---

Tiruin, drakon, where are you?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: drakon136 on March 21, 2012, 05:22:39 pm

Was at school. Working on my post right now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 05:33:27 pm

StrategiaSry dident now it was a link xD
Well i wouldent just jump on the lynch train, but i would vote on him if it was solid evidence that he was a scum. And i would prolly be in the middle :)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 05:39:37 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 05:11:52 pm

Painiac, i just wanted to see hes reaction, its not that he said that he was not scum. I thought it was wierd for him to mark out that its BM and thats why he said "i am town" Just thought it to be odd.
You think mcfry is scum but you vote Strategia? Why? Strategia just asking questions. Feels like we will regret voting on him :/

Hmm, you have a good point about Dariush.

I can't tell if MagmaMcFry is being scum or newbie. I FoSed him for now. Strategia had denied answer to my question, while I was accusing him for spewing out questions without caring about them, which is scummy. It was deserving a vote.

But, I got nice logical answer, so unvote, vote Dariush. MagmaMcFry has some point, you kinda could answer to his question, and mine too while at this. I'm not accusing you of lurking or anything though, it would be stupid.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:45:01 pm

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:49:18 pm

MagmaMcFry, you had asked him two (?) question, he's not around now. Maybe try other targets?

Great idea, if I hadn't done that already. Here's a question I asked you earlier.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 04:40:33 pm

How have you been productive so far?

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 05:13:18 pm

I recall reading somewhere (I can't find it anymore, unfortunately, though I think Jim said it) that if you're looking for humility, the Mafia board is the wrong place to look. And it stands to reason, too; Mafia is not just a game of logic, it's a clash of personalities. If you know (or think you know) someone's scum, you're supposed to go after them with everything you've got. If everyone lets go of their pride, you're going to have a very boring game, with people holding back because they don't feel they're certain enough. You have to be proud of who you are, and proud of your team, to succeed at Mafia. Besides, if you know you're a good player (like e.g. webadict), you should take pride in that and use it to your advantage. I've seen at least one or two games that wuba played like a fiddle. If he was to "let go of his pride", he wouldn't be nearly as good as he is.

That's an interesting aspect, but I think you're talking about self-confidence, while I'm talking about the "hubris" part of pride. I use "pride" to mean "hubris" more often (Ancient Greek lessons FTW), and "swallow your self-confidence" hardly makes sense. Looks like a simple misunderstanding.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 05:58:07 pm

In my humble opinion, Strategia is very townie.

You started looking more like newbish town.

Scelly looks neutral. That would be perfect for scum. Needs more looking.

Dr.Phibes is newbie and is totally unreadable. It can be dangerous.

Dariush reply to my post and yours stinks of scum. Needs more looking.

That's my thoughts and products of my efforts so far.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 06:20:59 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:45:01 pm

That's an interesting aspect, but I think you're talking about self-confidence, while I'm talking about the "hubris" part of pride. I use "pride" to mean "hubris" more often (Ancient Greek lessons FTW), and "swallow your self-confidence" hardly makes sense. Looks like a simple misunderstanding.

The way I see it, this'd complement my previous point as well. People who are full of hubris make for entertaining games, and are more likely to slip up. If everyone swallowed their hubris, I imagine they'd be a lot more careful, which would make scumhunting harder.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 05:11:52 pm

You think mcfry is scum but you vote Strategia? Why? Strategia just asking questions. Feels like we will regret voting on him :/

Why?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 06:34:23 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 06:20:59 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:45:01 pm

That's an interesting aspect, but I think you're talking about self-confidence, while I'm talking about the "hubris" part of pride. I use "pride" to mean "hubris" more often (Ancient Greek lessons FTW), and "swallow your self-confidence" hardly makes sense. Looks like a simple misunderstanding.

The way I see it, this'd complement my previous point as well. People who are full of hubris make for entertaining games, and are more likely to slip up. If everyone swallowed their hubris, I imagine they'd be a lot more careful, which would make scumhunting harder.

Scum would be more careful, but everyone would contribute constructively, and scumhunting would become more organized and focused. People who do not contribute constructively are about the worst thing that can happen to a Mafia game IMO.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 06:34:56 pm

That said, good night.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: drakon136 on March 21, 2012, 07:12:07 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 21, 2012, 01:19:54 am

drakon136, let's say it's LYLO, and someone claims doctor. As you'll recall, BMs sometimes have a doctor in them and sometimes don't, but they're always town if so. Would you believe such a claim, and therefore by extension that the person making it is confirmed town? How would you feel towards people who advocated lynching them anyway? Avoiding lynching them despite reasons to do so?

It would depend. I'd go back and examine their previous behavior, noting any scumtells (minor or major scumtells) made on previous days. If they've seemed incredibly scummy for most of / part of the game, I wouldn't even consider believing them. If they haven't seemed too scummy, I'd likely believe them.

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Drakon, if you were scum, whom among the non-ICs would you prefer as your buddy and why?

Out of the non-ICs, I'd probably pick Tiruin. From what I've noticed, he is more experienced than most other players in this game.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

drakon136: Let's say you're a cop, how would you determine your targets, saying that they are not on the lynching block? I.E. The most vague and not scummy, or the most scummy in terms of newbie-ness?

Not quite sure what you mean by "in the terms of newbie-ness," but I'd inspect the most vague player first. Vagueness is a scumtell, and no matter how minor it is, a scumtell is a scumtell. People will almost always give off scumtells in posts, so I believe that even though a person doesn't seem very scummy, that in itself is often worthy of suspicion.

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 11:18:01 am

drakon, you are the Cop. Who would you inspect first (i.e. N1), an IC or a new player who's dropped some questionable scum/noobtells?

I'd first inspect an IC. IC's are much more experienced than most players in a BM, hence the title 'IC'. As they are more experienced, they are less prone to making mistakes and giving off scumtells, and people will often be less suspicious of them. Being an IC doesn't mean a person is immune to suspicion, or guaranteed to be town.

That's all I'll be able to do for today, as I have homework to catch up on.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 09:31:45 pm

FYI, I'll be at uni tomorrow, I'll probably be back at my computer in about sixteen, eighteen hours or so. My laptop's internet connection is dodgier than a level 30 Rogue, so I might or might not be able to come online before I'm home again. So don't expect me to reliably be able to answer (or, for that matter, ask) questions before that time.

---

Mod, I have a question that's been bugging me for a while. (It has nothing to do with the current game.) It's to do with the term Inexperienced Challenged. I know what's meant by it, but I cannot for the life of me figure out the syntax behind the phrase. I know it doesn't really matter, but it's just been driving me up the wall since I first came to this board.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 21, 2012, 09:39:58 pm

It's a joke that started long long ago, when political correctness was trendy. The idea was that instead of calling the experienced players a lot better than the new players, we would say they were just less inexperienced than the others, 'Inexperienced Challenged.' It's syntactically equivalent to 'developmentally challenged.'

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 22, 2012, 01:24:48 am

Votecount!

Tiruin [2]: Strategia, MagmaMcFry
Dariush [1]: Painiac
Painiac [1]: Scelly9
MagmaMcFry [1]: Tiruin
Strategia [1]: IronyOwl

Not Voting: Dariush, Dr.Phibes, drakon136

Day ends Friday!

---

New topic posted in the Labrador Canine Squad forums: Freakin' chihuahua scum.

My leader just got caught by an Arch-Chihuahua Death Squad member I was trying to seduce. Any tips for how to break out of the pound?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 22, 2012, 01:52:51 am

You can only try raiding the catacombs at this point now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 03:08:43 am

Dr.Phibes, you're kinda passive. Only answering questions, and asked questions to targets I had choose before. You can't do some research on your own? What are you thinking about other players, any impressions?

drakon136, I can understand you have school/RL, but could you try asking some questions later, instead of only aswering them?

Tiruin, what role would you enjoy more - scum, or townie?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

Tiruin:

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

Now, let's say you are scum. Who would you lay the NK on? A fanatically aggressive townie who draws most of the attention from everyone in his successful scumhunt, a replacement who has done his fair share of hunting or a random lurker who hasn't gained any attention and why?

If by 'successful scumhunt' you mean the townie is attacking actual scum, I would NK him and tunnel anyone attempting to stick the kill onto my buddy for trying to get results from NKs.

Magma McScum:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Please scumhunt for me, I am too lazy

So, I should 'spit out', as you say, all the traits and behavior of present people so you can sit back and lurk. Not cool, not cool at all.

Scummiac:

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Roleplaying

I hate it when games devolve into offtopic, and especially after the first post by some cretin, but for now I'll attempt to lower myself to your immeasurable depths of stupidity and explain it bit by bit.
Only moderators can delete threads.
There are a whopping two moderators on this forum, who happen to be brothers.
Can you guess whom am I talking about? Actually wait, don't strain your puny brain, I'll crack. It's Toady and Threetoe. The flavor isn't based on a true story. The note was a lie. What a twist.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

I admit it's weak question, weak prod. But, if I would find it not useful, I can always ask second question.

So, Dariush. What you have to say about your weak OMGUS? Why you hadn't vote anybody yet (me, for example)?

Gods, looks like I have to explain it in every BM I'm ICing in.

I am an IC. I have been playing Mafia here for about one and a half years and been in about 90% of games in that time. My goal is to teach you to play and to further this goal I'll disregard my actual wincon whatever that could be. I could easily tunnel anybody present (well, except IO and maaaaybe Tiruin) to lynch in no time, but instead I point out your mistakes, and when I do, you shut up and listen instead of crying foul.

'Judging reactions' never works, except maybe against newbies who'll panic regardless of aligment. You pulled that OMGUS accusation out of your ass because I didn't even attack you, let alone vote you. I vote whenever the fuck I want to, and taunting people 'why aren't you voting me' is yet another scumtell. What is that, fourth? Let's go over that again - roleplaying, useless question, bullshit claim about judging reactions, lying about OMGUS, taunting. Sorry, make that fifth. Nice going for just two posts, you sack of shit.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

I had pointed my question at Dariush precisely because he's Dariush - he can be flippy-flappy about questions like that when he's scum.

Wow, really. And you obviously have deep meta knowledge of my aligment-dependant behavior. How reassuring.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Show me real scumhunting instead nagging Dariush like beggar for info. That's not purpose of IC's.

Oooh, hypocrisy. First you attack me on bullshit accusation, then you chainsaw me. Make that six.

Dr.Scumes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Quote

Since this is a BM, I'll answer: I'm not scum. But in any other game you'll be quickly given shit to eat for such a question (like is being done by Scelly, but on a higher scale).

How can we know your not a mafia? Just beacuse its a BM doesent mean you cant lie. I am watching you Dariush.

You shitfucking sack of vomit. Even disregarding your edit, that is the most bullshit thing I've read in this thread, and beating Painiac in that regard took some work, I'll grant you that. Now, I'll try to explain why that is so, so people who care more about being good at this game than being a self-obsessed prick who can't admit that he's a newbie and listen to some advice may know what they should never do. 1) Yes, I can lie. However, there's no way I could answer that question that wouldn't exclude that possibility. Let's try that on you, you piece of shit.

Dr.Phibes, why are you SCUMMMMMMM?

And just you try to evade the question. Just you try.
2) That 'I'm watching you' serves no purpose whatsoever. You are supposed to watch everyone.
3) That 'How can we know you're not a mafia' is WIFOM of the worst quality. There's no way you can be sure of that. Now shut up and scumhunt. Also, learn to spell.
4) Well, I thought there would be more points, but I'll wait until you answer the first question. I'm not in a hurry.

Phew, I'm done with the first 50-post page. And there's so much more goatshit on the second one.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Scummiac:

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Is that really your reason for suspecting Dariush? It's WIFOM, null tell, no info there.

...You accused me of OMGUS because of the very same post, you know.

OH GOD THE HYPOCRISY IT BURNSSSSSSS

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Gosh, watch what are you copying. Or you are too lazy to even bother?

Why do you care about people's formatting errors? Do you think scum are more likely to commit them than townies?

Also, more accuse-then-chainsaw.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 05:58:07 pm

Dariush reply to my post and yours stinks of scum. Needs more looking.

I stink of scum after a whopping one post, most of which was IC stuff. Nice nose you have there. Maybe it's your brain that stinks from inside instead?

Scelly:

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 02:51:25 pm

Painiac, if you where scum, who of the current players (IC's not included) would you like as scumbuddy?

That would be all well and good if I didn't ask the very same question, with the very same exclusion of ICs. Why aren't you reading the thread?

Magma McScum:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Dariush, you have been constantly active on the forums for almost eight hours after I repeated my question, but you haven't answered it yet, which makes me even more suspicious. Now that I have given my reasons for asking this question, I will ask you one last time, and I expect you to swallow your pride (it doesn't belong in a Mafia game) and answer this question to everyone's fullest satisfaction. Which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum?

I already answered it and explained what I think about it in my previous post. You can go fuck yourself now.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 04:40:33 pm

People have life, but Dariush has had time for this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=99297.msg3115523#msg3115523) and six others since I asked. Also, it would be relatively harmless if Dariush had ignored my question, but instead, he chose to give something totally unhelpful. And unhelpful is not good.

Even ignoring the fact that writing up ideas for an RTD takes up far less effort than making a productive post in Mafia, your post was made almost 20 minutes after mine in that thread. If you're that intent of dragging up incriminating facts, check them first, you fucksucker.

Dr.Scummes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

Dariush, if we say you were a scum, who would be your first target and why?

Instead of me answering your question, let's examine two possibilities: 1) I answer, the guy I named dies. Next day you accuse me. 2) I answer, someone else dies. You say that I did that intentionally so you won't accuse me and accuse me because of it. This is utter bullshit WIFOM.

Dr.Phibes, what were you hoping to gain from my answer to the above question? And don't you dare answer something along the lines of 'your reaction'. Just don't you dare.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 11:07:07 am

Painiac, havent seen much of drakon123 or tiruin, strategia seems pretty cool to me and you are are the most active player around which tells me you really wanna catch some scums. I dont know why you all hate McFry, all he did was asking a question. To me Dariush is the most fishy guy here :/



Darisuh, Why so harsh? I posted later what i meant by the "i am not scum" part. And the, if you were a scum who would you kill and why? I felt you was being pressured, so if we say you are a scum who do you see as the biggest treath to you right now and why?

Dident you got mad beacuse Painiac wrote that to you? And now you are doing the exact samething? Well i am not a scum, but i dont need to adrees that this is a BM.

It seems to me you are just attacking players and saying nothing relavant. And the vote on me was just stupid, feels like you dont care who you votes on.

Dariush, i can imagine you next post... 

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

Wow, activity spike. Hooray. Responding to early comments.

PFP, will get back in a few hours

Also, PPE (Dr.Phibes)

---

Unvote, Vote Painiac: Both, actually. Attitude and perspective shifts between each, and I love playing perspective, helps keep the mind flowing.

Also, based on your recent posts, you seem very fast to give impressions on others, saying who is more townie (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116993#msg3116993) than the rest, despite it being an opinion. Like trying to tout your towniness by being this transparent? Showing it without pushing them further to affirm it? Hah! As of this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116249#msg3116249), you seem very aggravated on a simple vote on you by Dariush. It is RVS and I believe your questioning is going awry from reasoning.

Then you Quote Mine (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116653#msg3116653) on McFry? Oooooh, look at the bias that gives.

Also, tunnel (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116993#msg3116993) on Dariush based on his ONLY (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115108#msg3115108) post before that. Sure.

Strategia: Right (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116864#msg3116864) here. I had problems connecting earlier but be assured, I do not use RL excuses to get away from a Mafia game.

Dr.Phibes: A little bit of formatting and wording would help the general coherence of what you're trying to say. There is a "Preview" button for a purpose. The sloppy posts you give shows that you may not care what you put, just to post to show activity. Cut down on your smileys please.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Quote

Since this is a BM, I'll answer: I'm not scum. But in any other game you'll be quickly given shit to eat for such a question (like is being done by Scelly, but on a higher scale).

How can we know your not a mafia? Just beacuse its a BM doesent mean you cant lie. I am watching you Dariush.

Wow, off tangent question here. You can know by scumhunting.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 11:07:07 am

Painiac, havent seen much of drakon123 or tiruin, strategia seems pretty cool to me and you are are the most active player around which tells me you really wanna catch some scums...

Goodness, activity being the reason? Wow, good sir. Quantity =/= Scumhunting! Quality is! And in the same post you become a total hypocrite by reiterating the "I am not scum" part after saying the same of Dariush. Huh, sure, nice work being a truthful townie.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 11:07:07 am

Darisuh, Why so harsh? I posted later what i meant by the "i am not scum" part. And the, if you were a scum who would you kill and why? I felt you was being pressured, so if we say you are a scum who do you see as the biggest treath to you right now and why?

Dident you got mad beacuse Painiac wrote that to you? And now you are doing the exact samething? Well i am not a scum, but i dont need to adrees that this is a BM.

It seems to me you are just attacking players and saying nothing relavant. And the vote on me was just stupid, feels like you dont care who you votes on.

Goodness the reasoning is far below the understanding line. You're going against whatever you said earlier! I find relevant ideas in Dariush's post, just as I do yours, both semantically and grammatically. Whats with the "I don't need to address that this is a BM" thing, hm?

drakon136: Huh, post = answers and nothing to question others, are you satisfied with reading off everyone elses finds or are you going to do-it-yourself?

McFry: This (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116478#msg3116478). You already suspect Dariush out of the blue (heh, pun) based on one single post. What? If that was for pressure, paint it nicely in red.

Like I said, more is coming up later on! (Cursed blackout...)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 22, 2012, 12:05:52 pm

Quote from: Think0028 on March 21, 2012, 09:39:58 pm

It's a joke that started long long ago, when political correctness was trendy. The idea was that instead of calling the experienced players a lot better than the new players, we would say they were just less inexperienced than the others, 'Inexperienced Challenged.' It's syntactically equivalent to 'developmentally challenged.'

I see, that's quite hilarious actually. Thanks.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

Oh yeah, now it gets fun. :D

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

Strategia: Right (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116864#msg3116864) here. I had problems connecting earlier but be assured, I do not use RL excuses to get away from a Mafia game.

Ah, I was just wondering. There used to be relatively frequent blackouts where I live a few years ago as well, I know how much that sucks =/

Unvote.

---

Dr.Phibes:

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 06:20:59 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 05:11:52 pm

You think mcfry is scum but you vote Strategia? Why? Strategia just asking questions. Feels like we will regret voting on him :/

Why?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 12:13:58 pm

And...downing this just to clarify on the IC business before it goes right into the confusion hole on their purpose, guessing this pertains to all ICs, formatting is done by me to specify:

Quote from: Some helpful spiel from Jim Groovester, a previous BM IC

Now that the game has started and I am now responsible for teaching seven of you how to play a game, I will say the following first.

I will be a completely impartial source of advice that I will freely give at every opportunity, whether I am asked for it or I decide to give it on my own. You can trust that everything I have to say will be given in good faith, even if it comes at a personal cost to me in this game. If you do not listen to what I have to say, for any reason, you will severely hamper your ability to learn how to play the game. So, to reiterate,

Listen to what I tell you.

If you don't, then what's the point of me being here?

For those of you who don't know what to do, games usually start with the Random Vote Stage. You should pick a target randomly, vote them, and ask them a question. The sole purpose of this is to get conversation going when there would otherwise be no reason to do that. I'll start.

jaxler, let's say you're the Cop. You want to catch scum during the night with an inspection. What do you look for?

Ideally you should ask game related questions in the RVS. Asking what kind of flavor of ice cream is a player's favorite does absolutely nothing to help you find scum, which is your primary goal.

And because it bears repeating: Your primary goal is to find scum. Everything you do should help you towards that goal. And I do mean everything.

If you're scum, you will obviously have a different goal: Avoid detection until the end of the game. The best way to do this is to look like you are trying to find scum.

Since many of you are going to have no idea what to do and will mangle scumhunting in just about every possible way, it does you no good to hold back. So be bold, and just do the best you can. Ask lots of questions, try to get a good feel for how the game is played. I'll be there to help you when you go wrong.

Additionally, before anybody else does anything, I will stress the importance of activity. You should be as active as possible. A good guideline is to get one good post in a day, but if you can post productively more often than that it's generally a good idea to do so. As a player, town or scum, being active and visible is very much an asset, as you're out there making yourself readable, and this is considered a town quality. While there are very good personal benefits to being active, the reverse is detrimental to the whole game. Low activity makes games hard to play or outright kills them. This is fun for absolutely no one, so make a good effort and be active.

If you played a Beginner's Game before you probably recognize this spiel, but it's good all the same.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Spoiler: Evidence. (click to show/hide)

Oh hi there Dariush. Don't mind if I pull apart your posts.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

You should have told us that you were being cute and fluffy, because I sure didn't notice.

Quote

Magma McScum:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Please scumhunt for me, I am too lazy

So, I should 'spit out', as you say, all the traits and behavior of present people so you can sit back and lurk. Not cool, not cool at all.

I gave reasons why you should answer my question. You ignored them.

Quote

Scummiac:

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Roleplaying

I hate it when games devolve into offtopic, and especially after the first post by some cretin, but for now I'll attempt to lower myself to your immeasurable depths of stupidity and explain it bit by bit.
Only moderators can delete threads.
There are a whopping two moderators on this forum, who happen to be brothers.
Can you guess whom am I talking about? Actually wait, don't strain your puny brain, I'll crack. It's Toady and Threetoe. The flavor isn't based on a true story. The note was a lie. What a twist.

We talked about that already. You don't have to repeat that, unless you want your posts to appear larger.

Quote

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

I admit it's weak question, weak prod. But, if I would find it not useful, I can always ask second question.

So, Dariush. What you have to say about your weak OMGUS? Why you hadn't vote anybody yet (me, for example)?

Gods, looks like I have to explain it in every BM I'm ICing in.

I am an IC. I have been playing Mafia here for about one and a half years and been in about 90% of games in that time. My goal is to teach you to play and to further this goal I'll disregard my actual wincon whatever that could be. I could easily tunnel anybody present (well, except IO and maaaaybe Tiruin) to lynch in no time, but instead I point out your mistakes, and when I do, you shut up and listen instead of crying foul.

You didn't answer the question.

Quote

Dr.Scumes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Quote

Since this is a BM, I'll answer: I'm not scum. But in any other game you'll be quickly given shit to eat for such a question (like is being done by Scelly, but on a higher scale).

How can we know your not a mafia? Just beacuse its a BM doesent mean you cant lie. I am watching you Dariush.

You shitfucking sack of vomit. Even disregarding your edit, that is the most bullshit thing I've read in this thread, and beating Painiac in that regard took some work, I'll grant you that. Now, I'll try to explain why that is so, so people who care more about being good at this game than being a self-obsessed prick who can't admit that he's a newbie and listen to some advice may know what they should never do. 1) Yes, I can lie. However, there's no way I could answer that question that wouldn't exclude that possibility. Let's try that on you, you piece of shit.

Dr.Phibes, why are you SCUMMMMMMM?

And just you try to evade the question. Just you try.
2) That 'I'm watching you' serves no purpose whatsoever. You are supposed to watch everyone.
3) That 'How can we know you're not a mafia' is WIFOM of the worst quality. There's no way you can be sure of that. Now shut up and scumhunt. Also, learn to spell.
4) Well, I thought there would be more points, but I'll wait until you answer the first question. I'm not in a hurry.

We talked about this already as well.

Quote

And just you try to evade the question. Just you try.

I'll quote you on this later, okay?

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Gosh, watch what are you copying. Or you are too lazy to even bother?

Why do you care about people's formatting errors? Do you think scum are more likely to commit them than townies?

Also, more accuse-then-chainsaw.

The term "accuse-then-chainsaw" applies to your reaction equally well.

Quote

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 05:58:07 pm

Dariush reply to my post and yours stinks of scum. Needs more looking.

I stink of scum after a whopping one post, most of which was IC stuff. Nice nose you have there. Maybe it's your brain that stinks from inside instead?

Are you trying to tell him he's wrong? If so, that won't work, you have to show him. Also, way to overreact.

Quote

Magma McScum:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Dariush, you have been constantly active on the forums for almost eight hours after I repeated my question, but you haven't answered it yet, which makes me even more suspicious. Now that I have given my reasons for asking this question, I will ask you one last time, and I expect you to swallow your pride (it doesn't belong in a Mafia game) and answer this question to everyone's fullest satisfaction. Which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum?

I already answered it and explained what I think about it in my previous post. You can go fuck yourself now.

You evaded my question again. Remember how I wrote earlier that I wanted to quote you on something?

Quote

And just you try to evade the question. Just you try.

So you have the right to ask Dr. Phibes stupid questions and expect a good answer, and the right to answer my questions with, if I may use your words, bullshit? Looks like you have a severe case of double standards.

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 04:40:33 pm

People have life, but Dariush has had time for this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=99297.msg3115523#msg3115523) and six others since I asked. Also, it would be relatively harmless if Dariush had ignored my question, but instead, he chose to give something totally unhelpful. And unhelpful is not good.

Even ignoring the fact that writing up ideas for an RTD takes up far less effort than making a productive post in Mafia, your post was made almost 20 minutes after mine in that thread. If you're that intent of dragging up incriminating facts, check them first, you fucksucker.

If you're that intent on disproving my incriminating facts, check your counterstatements first. The post of mine you're referring to is already the post where I repeat my question. So you should have had no problems at all giving a coherent, precise and satisfactory answer the first time I asked.

Quote

Dr.Scummes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

Dariush, if we say you were a scum, who would be your first target and why?

Instead of me answering your question, let's examine two possibilities: 1) I answer, the guy I named dies. Next day you accuse me. 2) I answer, someone else dies. You say that I did that intentionally so you won't accuse me and accuse me because of it. This is utter bullshit WIFOM.

Dr.Phibes, what were you hoping to gain from my answer to the above question? And don't you dare answer something along the lines of 'your reaction'. Just don't you dare.

What if the truthful answer to your question is 'your reaction'?

---

Okay Dariush, let's look at what you did wrong so far.

1. Repeated voluntary cooperation refusal.

As you might remember, I have given many good reasons why you should answer the question I asked you. As you didn't answer my question like I suggested you do, you obviously disagree with all of the reasons.
To recap: Here are the reasons.

Quote

First, the ICs have played more games with this round's players, and should therefore have an accurate idea of most people's gameplay, more than I and others have read out of the previous games.
Second, there are two of them, and if one should decide to give biased information, then information between the two IC posts will differ and we will know that one of the ICs cannot be trusted.
Third, everybody can use the information given by the ICs. I suspect that not everybody will go through all of this group's previous games, so the information will help the players to form their own opinion. As I said before, the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells, so everybody will still have to scumhunt on their own, but with a little more guidance.
Fourth, it is not required to believe or even regard the given information. You are still free to suspect whomever you want.
Fifth, this is a test to see if the ICs are willing to cooperate with the town.

As you are of the opinion that these reasons suck, you should probably have reasons for thinking like this, therefore you should be able to tell us these reasons. Why do you disagree with all of the reasons I gave you?

2. Double standards.

Obviously you think you have some rights that others don't have, for example the right to expect an answer to a question asked by you, the right to withhold an answer to a question asked to you, or the right to bash a newbie repeatedly for doing something wrong (instead of just telling him). You'd explain that with an "I'm IC, I'm supposed to do that", but the only requirement for you to be an IC is to be helpful. You're seriously overstepping your boundaries in ways that allow you to stop people from hunting on you, but you don't need that, or do you?

3. Abusive behaviour.

You're well educated in the art of insulting people, as you have proven more than enough in your last two posts. The act of insulting people is not that bad by itself, but you obviously like to prefer insults over arguments. Hint: "Fucksack" is not a reason, and "You can go fuck yourself now" is not an answer. What makes it even worse is that you like to necro old and completed discussions for the sole purpose of insulting the person whose actions started the discussion. Looking at your last two posts, about 60% of their content are purely made of insults and repetitions of stuff that people already said earlier. The rest is made up of unfounded accusations that require the accused people's actions to be grossly misinterpreted for the accusation to even make sense.

Conclusion: Dariush.

---

PPE:

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

McFry: This (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116478#msg3116478). You already suspect Dariush out of the blue (heh, pun) based on one single post. What? If that was for pressure, paint it nicely in red.

Until now, it wasn't enough.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 12:26:44 pm

Tiruin,

Quote

its not that he said that he was not scum. I thought it was wierd for him to mark out that its BM and thats why he said "i am town" Just thought it to be odd.

Think i wrote pretty badly, i dident think it was bad of him saying he was not a scum, but that he adressed that its a BM.


Strategia, i thought it to be odd for a scum to be like you. It was more on guts than on facts.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 12:30:12 pm

Off topic
Tatruin, thanks! Need to improve my writing skills. Since i am not from a english speaking country.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 12:36:00 pm

Tiruin, silly me

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 22, 2012, 12:44:21 pm

Dr.Phibes:

(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s310/StrategiaInUltima/DotheyhavepreviewbuttoninWhat.png)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 12:47:29 pm

Yeah i get it. I do actully use the preview, yet it still looks horrible.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 01:53:07 pm

Woah, Dariush, you are flipping the fuck out so hard, because of weak accusation. You had stated that yourself, and I can agree. I was just making shitty arguments after all, to see your reaction.

Spoiler: To Dariush (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

Well, I can understand why scum would want naive town for enemy.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Scummiac:

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Roleplaying

I hate it when games devolve into offtopic, and especially after the first post by some cretin, but for now I'll attempt to lower myself to your immeasurable depths of stupidity and explain it bit by bit.
Only moderators can delete threads.
There are a whopping two moderators on this forum, who happen to be brothers.
Can you guess whom am I talking about? Actually wait, don't strain your puny brain, I'll crack. It's Toady and Threetoe. The flavor isn't based on a true story. The note was a lie. What a twist.

That was the reason why I was suprised. You know, because of that note I thought there was maybe more moderators before, and that incident could explain why there are only two mods now? That's why I wanted some clarification, because I didn't want believe it? Gosh, making one offtopic sentence at the start of game isn't the end of the world. I can understand Mafia is SERIOUS BUSINESS, but making little start joke is common. You are playing with humans, not robots. And, no, it's not roleplaying, it's just plain offtop. Which we should stop already.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

'Judging reactions' never works, except maybe against newbies who'll panic regardless of aligment. You pulled that OMGUS accusation out of your ass because I didn't even attack you, let alone vote you. I vote whenever the fuck I want to, and taunting people 'why aren't you voting me' is yet another scumtell. What is that, fourth? Let's go over that again - roleplaying, useless question, bullshit claim about judging reactions, lying about OMGUS, taunting. Sorry, make that fifth. Nice going for just two posts, you sack of shit.

Because, you know, if you suspect someone, and according to you I am spitting scumbuckets, you KINDA FoS them, if not voting. You are probably not doing anything with such ,,scum" as me, to avoid clean, nice OMGUS, which could be used against you.

Or you are aware that voting me at the start of game could stupidified town, and I would be lynched in no time because of IC suggestion. Hard to tell. And no, I am not roleplaying, just offtoping. It wasn't useless question, because I had got BIG reaction. Judging reactions is differently stated previous argument, so also no. (Congratulations for duplicating the same argument.) I hadn't stated it was OMGUS, just some sort of passive version. I didn't taunted you. Check, check, check, check, check, no argument left.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

I had pointed my question at Dariush precisely because he's Dariush - he can be flippy-flappy about questions like that when he's scum.

Wow, really. And you obviously have deep meta knowledge of my aligment-dependant behavior. How reassuring.

It's not like I had studied you thoroughly. Just several good players in other mafias had stated this, and I had used that. And now, I can agree with them - you had just EXPLODED here.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Show me real scumhunting instead nagging Dariush like beggar for info. That's not purpose of IC's.

Oooh, hypocrisy. First you attack me on bullshit accusation, then you chainsaw me. Make that six.

You should know well that chainsawing happens, when scum defends ANOTHER scum. You mistook me with your another scumbuddy?

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Dr.Phibes, why are you SCUMMMMMMM?

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooh, hypocrisy.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Gosh, watch what are you copying. Or you are too lazy to even bother?

Why do you care about people's formatting errors? Do you think scum are more likely to commit them than townies?

You are missing the point. Strategia has asked me question again, while copying my fucking ANSWER to it. And no, formatting errors makes you just look bad, not scummy.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 05:58:07 pm

Dariush reply to my post and yours stinks of scum. Needs more looking.

I stink of scum after a whopping one post, most of which was IC stuff. Nice nose you have there. Maybe it's your brain that stinks from inside instead?

,,Needs more looking" implies that I wasn't sure what I should think about you; townies may drop one or another scummy post while going for their target, it's just natural.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

Also, based on your recent posts, you seem very fast to give impressions on others, saying who is more townie (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116993#msg3116993) than the rest, despite it being an opinion.

It was answer to MagmaMcFry question: my first, fresh impression on game. It's not egraved in stone, and it can (and probably will) change soon. I wouldn't post my scumpics so early without McFry question, it's just unproductive.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

As of this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116249#msg3116249), you seem very aggravated on a simple vote on you by Dariush. It is RVS and I believe your questioning is going awry from reasoning.

I was voted by Scelly, not Dariush. Precisely, it was LACK of Dariush vote (or FoS), while he was calling me scummy which suprised me.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

Also, tunnel (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116993#msg3116993) on Dariush based on his ONLY (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115108#msg3115108) post before that. Sure.

I admit, I have problems with these. I had already learned one thing, though - when you see debate changing into pissing contest, it's probably two very aggresive townies.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Time to lay down the post! Unvote

McFry:
Wow. I was going to believe you're evidence there in that long spoiler list. Attacking every crucial detail on why Dariush is super Scum with an S. Not saying I'm defending him here but your understanding is damned. Do you bother reading your accuser's posts other than waiving them off like fluff? Well, we had all the time in the last two days to check if what is going on is true or not. It revolves around his not answering your question. Could you re-quote it please, for everyone to verify?

Spoiler: Because it seems you don't bother to give ample time for a re-read (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Oh hi there Dariush. Don't mind if I pull apart your posts.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

You should have told us that you were being cute and fluffy, because I sure didn't notice.

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Argh, every IC has some kind of long-winded greeting except me. Oh well. I'm Dariush, and I'm extremely white and fluffy. Any interactions with me may will result in sanity, blood, limb and life loss.

---

---

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 10:35:25 am

Oh, and by the way:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush[...], which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

---

---

And I cannot believe you repeated (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3118929#msg3118929) it again and again in your Evidence post. U tunnelin' bro?

Quote from: Truly biased

"I gave reasons why you should answer my question. You ignored them."

"You didn't answer the question."

"You evaded my question again. Remember how I wrote earlier that I wanted to quote you on something?"

"If you're that intent on disproving my incriminating facts, check your counterstatements first. The post of mine you're referring to is already the post where I repeat my question. So you should have had no problems at all giving a coherent, precise and satisfactory answer the first time I asked.
"

The hypocrisy is too much for mine eyes.

Restating!

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

Palm to the face.

Oh, P.S. McFry, if you're scumhunting Dariush like you said here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116765#msg3116765) then I'd truly wish you well. Other than being a hypocrite, that is. And not even spreading out the need for information once you "are sure" of who is scum. Or perchance, to read more on your pursuant?

Also, verging on non-mafia details is not good. Perfect for you to go on your lead though. Wacky Death Race is the best proof you can give to show Dariush is scum. Especially on the effort made in that off-topic post, it reflects, you know?

---

Scelly9 and drakon136: Get out here, both of you. Nothing to add to our delectable conversation now that nobody is questioning you? The sunlight is growing darker, where are your weapons? Lurking is not an option.

Alright, making it simple now, what do you make of the current squabble, hm?

IronyOwl: You're busy, I can tell. Where were you for most of the Day? You have a ton of questions to answer.

Painiac

Spoiler: Painiac (click to show/hide)

As of This (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116249#msg3116249) post, the use of OMGUS is truly faulty. One was, Dariush did not vote since then...

OH WAIT, you pointed that out in the same post!

Let me outline it in the simplest words: "OMGUS - Oh My God U Suck, a vote on someone else simply because they voted or attacked you."

Now, I'm not defending Dariush here, but I see you went all jumpy on his response with softball attacks that had no substantial basing. All your reasons from that post, until now are generally intangible in finding scum! Poor reasoning on your part, Painiac.

---

Here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116945#msg3116945) it seems you are content with your vote and are just giving away free, no-pressure questions to everyone else. "I'm not accusing you of lurking or anything though, it would be stupid." Nice work. Do you actually mean your questions and then back it's essence up with cushioning? How satisfied are you with your finds there, good chap? How can you be so damned sure that you've found scum without pushing him more?

Painiac:

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

I fear basically everybody. I don't know your playstyle, your scumtells can and probably will be heavily mixed with noobtells, and that's just WIFOM on the rabies. I do not want to jump into that shit willingly. I am gonna watch for a while, while going for much more reliable to read IC's. IC, if he is scum, will be pretty dangerous to town with his experience. If he's looking town, I will be more calm about approaching other players, because I have backup in town IC.

I had pointed my question at Dariush precisely because he's Dariush - he can be flippy-flappy about questions like that when he's scum.

About your response to my question. It's like you've already confirmed what Dariush said (based on his only (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115108#msg3115108) post beforehand. Using weak Meta on his gaming and tunneling too.

Could you explain on how Dariush is flipping the [PROFANITY] so hard? And you do admit, making nonsensical arguments was your plan to catch scum all along?

P.S. Good work with that WIFOM in that spoiler. You labelled it "To Dariush" too. Amazing. Then blatantly chainsaw Dr.Phibes with Dariush's own quote. Hmm.

Quote from: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 01:53:07 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

Also, tunnel (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116993#msg3116993) on Dariush based on his ONLY (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115108#msg3115108) post before that. Sure.

I admit, I have problems with these. I had already learned one thing, though - when you see debate changing into pissing contest, it's probably two very aggresive townies.

So who are the two aggressive pissers than?

Dr.Phibes
I'll ask you something simple. Could you read my last post and could you answer Dariush's, Strategia's and my question?

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Dr.Scummes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

Dariush, if we say you were a scum, who would be your first target and why?

Instead of me answering your question, let's examine two possibilities: 1) I answer, the guy I named dies. Next day you accuse me. 2) I answer, someone else dies. You say that I did that intentionally so you won't accuse me and accuse me because of it. This is utter bullshit WIFOM.

Dr.Phibes, what were you hoping to gain from my answer to the above question? And don't you dare answer something along the lines of 'your reaction'. Just don't you dare.

Before you think of doing it, thanks for pointing this out.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 12:26:44 pm

Tiruin,

Quote

its not that he said that he was not scum. I thought it was wierd for him to mark out that its BM and thats why he said "i am town" Just thought it to be odd.

Think i wrote pretty badly, i dident think it was bad of him saying he was not a scum, but that he adressed that its a BM.


Strategia, i thought it to be odd for a scum to be like you. It was more on guts than on facts.

Why do you think this odd, give reasons after explanations. Try to at least complete your words, I tire of seeing mangled English  :-\, enough to make Strategia photoshop and point it out.

Also, why are you scum by the way?

Dariush: How goes the IC'ing? (Heh, Icing) On that note: who, now, do you think is the most scummy of the bunch?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Now, I'm not defending Dariush here, but I see you went all jumpy

If you had read my previous mafias, as you had suggested, you should know better I am FAR from being jumpy. And that phrasing is very funny, ,,I kinda not chainsawing you now, but i am chainsawing you". If you fear about your image so much, just lurk, scum.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116945#msg3116945) it seems you are content with your vote and are just giving away free, no-pressure questions to everyone else. "I'm not accusing you of lurking or anything though, it would be stupid." Nice work. Do you actually mean your questions and then back it's essence up with cushioning? How satisfied are you with your finds there, good chap? How can you be so damned sure that you've found scum without pushing him more?

Well, yeah, he was playing some Roll To Dodge or something, so he could answer. But, posting one (good) post daily is enough for me. I am not satisfied, I can't tell who is definite scum yet, or who is definite townie. That's said, your last question is just stupid. I hadn't called anybody besides Dariush a scum, and I am pushing him, precisely because I am NOT sure about him.

Your WIFOM about my post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116945#msg3116945) stinks of scum so much. You had interpreted my post in some sick sense for you, and your questions are just implying things HARD, SCUM.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Could you explain on how Dariush is flipping the [PROFANITY] so hard?

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

the first post by some cretin

I'll attempt to lower myself to your immeasurable depths of stupidity and explain it bit by bit.

You pulled that OMGUS accusation out of your ass

I vote whenever the fuck I want to

you sack of shit.

You shitfucking sack of vomit.

Let's try that on you, you piece of shit.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

OH GOD THE HYPOCRISY IT BURNSSSSSSS

Maybe it's your brain that stinks from inside instead?

You can go fuck yourself now.

check them first, you fucksucker.

You read his post, and couldn't say how much Dariush tone changed?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

And you do admit, making nonsensical arguments was your plan to catch scum all along?

If that works, then why not. It's not like I could think up any serious, logical argument from ONE post.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Then blatantly chainsaw Dr.Phibes with Dariush's own quote. Hmm.

I was irritiated when Dariush pulled out THE SAME SHIT as me, when he was screaming before that I am hipocryte, and my question is useless.

And you should know that chainsawing requires TWO scums. Are you willingly trying to tie me and Dr.Phibes? You have to be goddamn sure, if you want to pull out such argument. Oh, when you ARE scum, you know who is who...

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

So who are the two aggressive pissers than?

It would be me (obviously) and Dariush. But I'm not sure about Dariush yet.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

How goes the IC'ing? (Heh, Icing)

Aren't you too relaxed here scum?

Tiruin, FoS Dariush.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

Oh, Painiac, I'm sorry if I'm not well versed in your meta. You started out on me relying on my knowing how you play then attacking me because of it. Very jumpy voting there.

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

If you had read my previous mafias, as you had suggested, you should know better I am FAR from being jumpy.

And now implying such? Prove your case right here and right now. Past Mafias do not speak for you here. Starting your case, it is weak. Accusing me of lurking, WIFOM and ignoring what the meaning of my post is blatantly obvious. Overly aggressive too.

Obviously, I did read Dariush's post. His tone is the same as every damn BM he's played in. The bad-mouthing IC. Coming from the start, you exploded with horrendous grammar and quick typed RAEG back at him just because of, well, him trying to help (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116249#msg3116249) you as an IC. From where I see it, you do have trouble in specifying what exactly you want to say.

Quote from: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 01:53:07 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

Also, tunnel (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116993#msg3116993) on Dariush based on his ONLY (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115108#msg3115108) post before that. Sure.

I admit, I have problems with these. I had already learned one thing, though - when you see debate changing into pissing contest, it's probably two very aggresive townies.

Then:

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Then blatantly chainsaw Dr.Phibes with Dariush's own quote. Hmm.

I was irritiated when Dariush pulled out THE SAME SHIT as me, when he was screaming before that I am hipocryte, and my question is useless.

And you should know that chainsawing requires TWO scums. Are you willingly trying to tie me and Dr.Phibes? You have to be goddamn sure, if you want to pull out such argument. Oh, when you ARE scum, you know who is who...

A scumtell is a pointer, a lead. So you're trying to tout your townieness by saying this single statement right here that you are town? From where I've seen it, you aren't showing viable proof that you are actually town. Noise and rage there, my friend. What cause is there to be angry by what he says, even if it is completely useless according to your eye if you're innocent?

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

So who are the two aggressive pissers than?

It would be me (obviously) and Dariush. But I'm not sure about Dariush yet.

So let me answer your verbose quips with my own, show me true scumhunting and not posts filled with blind aggression and wrong reasoning. "Not sure about Dariush yet." Huh, perfect wording there, considering all you've said about him. This includes wrongly accusing him of OMGUS'ing, as stated in my post above.

On a note of that, complete attitude shift right there. Capitalizing off words to shout it out. against me

Actually answer me and everyone else this first, who are your top scumpicks and exactly why? I want to see them backed up by hard evidence here, not implied reasoning.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 06:02:36 am

EBWOP: Gah, mistake in formatting.

What I meant on the chainsaw on Dr.Phibes was that you (Painiac) is trying to stop Dr.Phibes from answering by shoving off

Quote from: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 01:53:07 pm

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Dr.Phibes, why are you SCUMMMMMMM?

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooh, hypocrisy.

Then saying

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

So who are the two aggressive pissers than?

It would be me (obviously) and Dariush. But I'm not sure about Dariush yet.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Right then, since everyone else seems to be doing it I've decided to make a protracted accusation as well. On Day 1 no less, quite unusual from what I've seen, especially for BMs.

First off, Unvote. And now to pick apart Painiac's posts.

---

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 03:10:59 am

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 12:51:25 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 12:50:20 am

Dariush, why are you SCUMMMMMM?

Why a useless question, Painiac?

Bah, it's not useless. I can check reaction with this question, so it's not useless.

Actually, Scelly is right. Let's examine two possible answers, shall we?
1.) "Why are you SCUMMM?" "I'm not." This is basically what any normal player would answer. Congratulations, you have learned nothing. Oh, and Dariush outright said this as well.
2.) "Why are you SCUMMM?" "That's a stupid question." Also basically what any normal player could answer, especially an IC, given that they're supposed to teach you how to scumhunt properly. Dariush, being Dariush, simply added profanity.

Furthermore, attacking an IC right out of the gate does not give off a very good signal. In general, what I've noticed is that ICs tend not to be as active as other players in BMs; hence, I assume, why IronyOwl is the least active player here. As ICs go, Dariush is one of the more active ones though, and also very visible and experienced. It would make perfect sense for scum to want to deny town this resource. (And the odds of the same IC being scum two games in a row is microscopic. Dariush was scum in BM XXXI (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=102408.msg3095876#msg3095876).)

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Second, useless questions like that are EXTREMELY heavily discouraged around here. When asking any question, think: How does it help you find scum? What are you going to do depending on the answer?

You are already twisting my post into roleplaying, and dismissing my question as useless. Something like very passive OMGUS... OH WAIT, I GOT REACTION HERE! Therefore, not useless.

I admit it's weak question, weak prod. But, if I would find it not useful, I can always ask second question.

So, Dariush. What you have to say about your weak OMGUS? Why you hadn't vote anybody yet (me, for example)?

IC'ing != OMGUSing. An OMGUS is an outright attack (i.e. a vote, or at the very least an FoS) on someone for basically no other reason than that they attacked you. Even then, an OMGUS is one of the more questionable scumtells. Dariush' job, being an IC, is to point out what you're doing wrong when scumhunting, which is what he's doing right here. This is in no way, shape or form an OMGUS; again, it's you attacking an IC for..... basically no reason at all.

Quote

I am gonna watch for a while, while going for much more reliable to read IC's. IC, if he is scum, will be pretty dangerous to town with his experience. If he's looking town, I will be more calm about approaching other players, because I have backup in town IC.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 12:13:58 pm

Quote from: Some helpful spiel from Jim Groovester, a previous BM IC

I will be a completely impartial source of advice that I will freely give at every opportunity, whether I am asked for it or I decide to give it on my own. You can trust that everything I have to say will be given in good faith, even if it comes at a personal cost to me in this game.

This goes for every IC, Dariush included. For an IC, their wincon comes secondary to their teaching role.

Quote

I had pointed my question at Dariush precisely because he's Dariush - he can be flippy-flappy about questions like that when he's scum.

Funny, what I've seen of Dariush completely lines up with his behaviour (and language) in this game.

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

blah blah I am lazy give me info about others so I can hunt

NO, MAN, you should do your homework yourself. That's the mafia we are talking about, you should have your own hunches, and eventually confirm these with others. Don't be lazy passive dick, that's very anti-town. Also, FoS MagmaMcFry. Show me real scumhunting instead nagging Dariush like beggar for info. That's not purpose of IC's.

In addition to not being a lazy passive dick, don't be a lazy aggressive dick either. (Trust me, I know this first-hand. I got myself lynched that way in BM XXX.) I also like how you're now arguing in Dariush' favour, and especially the bit about "that's not the purpose of ICs". This exchange seems strange and weak to me, almost like you're desperately trying to appear to argue with Magma, but really aren't.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:41:57 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Quote

Since this is a BM, I'll answer: I'm not scum. But in any other game you'll be quickly given shit to eat for such a question (like is being done by Scelly, but on a higher scale).

How can we know your not a mafia? Just beacuse its a BM doesent mean you cant lie. I am watching you Dariush.

Is that really your reason for suspecting Dariush? It's WIFOM, null tell, no info there.

Oh..... wow. Phibes' reason for suspecting Dariush is nulltell WIFOM, based on your own question? Wait, what was that sound I heard? Oh, right, that's your credibility flying out the window and making a rather ugly splat on the pavement.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:11:19 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells

You are stating it yourself, duh. You are stepping on thin ice of meta scumtells. Using information from other games isn't that bad, but VERY risky. You need to play with such person constantly, see several games where such person is scum or third party. WHILE such person stopped making easy mistakes due to being inexperienced. And you need time to digest your info. It's basically not worth the effort if player sucks at playing mafia. Not mentioning that these scumtells are subjective, and may mean nothing to anyone other. It's not solid argument. You shouldn't use these as your only excuse to lynch someone, that's just plain stupid.

Quote

I had pointed my question at Dariush precisely because he's Dariush - he can be flippy-flappy about questions like that when he's scum.

"You are stepping on the thin ice of meta scumtells" indeed. Oh dear, looks like your credibility is going down the storm drain after its big splat. Also, more meaningless exchange with McFry. Have I perchance stumbled upon your scumbuddy?

Quote

And there you are, begging for nicely packed info, so you can START thinking. Your attitude as town is horrible. If you WANT to have some scumtells from BM's - read these yourself, do your own homework!

The best solution - do some real SCUMHUNTING!

Exactly what I'd recommend you do yourself. You've been doing three things so far; going after Dariush for essentially no reason, having a wishy-washy back-and-forth with Magma, and asking lazy, meaningless questions of random people without following up on them. Oh, and a fourth thing; undercutting your own credibility.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 04:49:18 pm

I just want to say that your reason for suspecting Dariush is argument, which means nothing. Because, if he's town, he would say ,,I am not scum", if he's scum, he would also say ,,I am not scum". Don't WIFOM yourself. If you see something, that you can't be certain of, just leave it be.

Your argument is so weak it looks like you are just splashing some mud on Dariush, just for having poor excuse for possible bandwagon in future or something like that.

Oh dear oh dear. Pot, kettle, black, you know the drill.

Quote from: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 03:08:43 am

Dr.Phibes, you're kinda passive. Only answering questions, and asked questions to targets I had choose before. You can't do some research on your own? What are you thinking about other players, any impressions?

drakon136, I can understand you have school/RL, but could you try asking some questions later, instead of only aswering them?

Tiruin, what role would you enjoy more - scum, or townie?

And here's the lazy questions I mentioned two quotes ago. RVS questions at this stage? Really?

Quote from: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 01:53:07 pm

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

Well, I can understand why scum would want naive town for enemy.

Do they speak sarcasm in What? Also, if you're such an expert on Dariush' meta ("flippy-flappy on such questions when scum"), how come you're so incredibly surprised by Dariush hurling insults around like it's a competition?

Quote

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

'Judging reactions' never works, except maybe against newbies who'll panic regardless of aligment. You pulled that OMGUS accusation out of your ass because I didn't even attack you, let alone vote you. I vote whenever the fuck I want to, and taunting people 'why aren't you voting me' is yet another scumtell. What is that, fourth? Let's go over that again - roleplaying, useless question, bullshit claim about judging reactions, lying about OMGUS, taunting. Sorry, make that fifth. Nice going for just two posts, you sack of shit.

Because, you know, if you suspect someone, and according to you I am spitting scumbuckets, you KINDA FoS them, if not voting. You are probably not doing anything with such ,,scum" as me, to avoid clean, nice OMGUS, which could be used against you.

There's no such thing as a "nice, clean OMGUS". An OMGUS is a vague tell at best.

Quote

Or you are aware that voting me at the start of game could stupidified town, and I would be lynched in no time because of IC suggestion. Hard to tell. And no, I am not roleplaying, just offtoping. It wasn't useless question, because I had got BIG reaction. Judging reactions is differently stated previous argument, so also no. (Congratulations for duplicating the same argument.) I hadn't stated it was OMGUS, just some sort of passive version. I didn't taunted you. Check, check, check, check, check, no argument left.

Apart from the fact that I have no idea what you're saying in your first sentence, you outright stated Dariush was OMGUSing you a couple of quotes back. Vagueness, pointless aggression, and either backtracking or outright lying. Check, check, check, no argument left.

Quote

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 05:58:07 pm

Dariush reply to my post and yours stinks of scum. Needs more looking.

I stink of scum after a whopping one post, most of which was IC stuff. Nice nose you have there. Maybe it's your brain that stinks from inside instead?

,,Needs more looking" implies that I wasn't sure what I should think about you; townies may drop one or another scummy post while going for their target, it's just natural.

Well, let's see. You opened up by attacking Dariush. You pursued the attack with nothing to go on. You never seriously went after anyone else, focusing entirely on the one active IC. Doesn't look like you weren't sure what to think to me. Townies may drop the occasional scumtell, but you're just dripping scumminess in every post.

Quote

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 11:59:27 am

Also, tunnel (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116993#msg3116993) on Dariush based on his ONLY (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115108#msg3115108) post before that. Sure.

I admit, I have problems with these. I had already learned one thing, though - when you see debate changing into pissing contest, it's probably two very aggresive townies.

What a nice, transparent way of covering your ass.

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Now, I'm not defending Dariush here, but I see you went all jumpy

If you had read my previous mafias, as you had suggested, you should know better I am FAR from being jumpy. And that phrasing is very funny, ,,I kinda not chainsawing you now, but i am chainsawing you". If you fear about your image so much, just lurk, scum.

> in beginner's mafia
> implies to have meta
> is actually jumpy

Quote

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

And you do admit, making nonsensical arguments was your plan to catch scum all along?

If that works, then why not. It's not like I could think up any serious, logical argument from ONE post.

Wow. Just..... wow.

---

Painiac, I would like nothing better than to see scum like you hang. And even if you flip town, well, you're obstructive to actual scumhunting and hurting the town because of it so I still won't be sad to see you go. Bye bye now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:18:13 am

(Forgot to add this in my previous post.) Am I chainsawing Dariush? Maybe. But I'm doing it not for Dariush' sake, but because I just want to get rid of Painiac. He comes across as scummier than a duck pond to me, and even if he isn't, like I said, he's obstructive and a distraction, and is hurting the town because of it. Lynching townies is not automatically and unequivocally a bad thing; I wanted to get rid of Phibes because I couldn't get a read off him and he was being very passive, which made him obstructive as well. Re-reading the thread, however, convinced me that getting rid of Painiac would be even better. Either the air clears and normal scumhunting can take place on D2, or he flips scum.

---

Oh, by the way, since we now have a three-way tie (according to this piece of paper I have here where I've tracked voting since the last votecount), vote Extend so we don't end up with a no-lynch.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 07:19:37 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

Oh, Painiac, I'm sorry if I'm not well versed in your meta. You started out on me relying on my knowing how you play then attacking me because of it. Very jumpy voting there.

Man, that's just plain wrong. You were accusing me before of giving no-pressure questions, and when I had voted you to answer my questions, you are crying that I'm jumpy.

What's about meta, you say? I was acting so stupidly aggresive in my previous mafia I was basically kicked out from the game. That was some stupid ,,accomplisment" you don't see everyday.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

Starting your case, it is weak. Accusing me of lurking, WIFOM and ignoring what the meaning of my post is blatantly obvious. Overly aggressive too.

Twist my posts more, scum. I didn't accused you here of lurking, you had interpreted it that way. You were spewing out WIFOM, because you made some weird readings from my post.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116945#msg3116945) it seems you are (some blatant, WIFOM related accusations)

And you are crying because I am playing it aggresively? Hey, I am not insulting my every target like Dariush did. Asking questions is being aggresive to you?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

Coming from the start, you exploded with horrendous grammar and quick typed RAEG back at him just because of, well, him trying to help (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116249#msg3116249) you as an IC. From where I see it, you do have trouble in specifying what exactly you want to say.

Doing grammar mistakes left and right makes me scum? And you know, his roleplaying accusation was major asspull, so I didn't knew if he was REALLY trying to help me there.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

So you're trying to tout your townieness by saying this single statement right here that you are town? From where I've seen it, you aren't showing viable proof that you are actually town. Noise and rage there, my friend. What cause is there to be angry by what he says, even if it is completely useless according to your eye if you're innocent?

Err, you are saying yourself -Noise and rage, my friend. It is obvious that I am agressive according to you, so it's also obvious I am sorta in pissing contest. This doesn't mean at all I am town. Gratz for procuring false argumentation here.

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

I was irritiated when Dariush pulled out THE SAME SHIT as me, when he was screaming before that I am hipocryte, and my question is useless.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

On a note of that, complete attitude shift right there. Capitalizing off words to shout it out. against me

I don't plan to dring tea with possible scum?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

Actually answer me and everyone else this first, who are your top scumpicks and exactly why? I want to see them backed up by hard evidence here, not implied reasoning.

Are you seriously asking that so early in game? And you want nice, hard evidence? Some of players didn't even get into randomvoting.

Scelly9 and drakon136, because they are lurky. Drakon126 promised he would ask some questions, did nothing.
You, because your argumentation looks more like framing, instead of real scumhunt.

Uhh, I don't have time to answer your post Strategia, and I don't know if I will have connection later - posting from school, my own connection in house was dead at the morning.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 07:24:01 am

Extend.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 23, 2012, 07:45:43 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 11:07:07 am

vomit

You fucking piece of shit. Not only you ignored the entirety of my post, you actually had the guts to say that I didn't say anything useful, vote me and ignore the questions I specifically warned I'll have your ass for not answering. Honestly, regardless of your alignment, I hope to never see you again on this forum. You just don't care.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

And the odds of the same IC being scum two games in a row is microscopic. Dariush was scum in BM XXXI (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=102408.msg3095876#msg3095876).

Gambler's Fallacy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler%27s_Fallacy) is just that - a fallacy. Don't resort to it.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Dariush: How goes the IC'ing? (Heh, Icing) On that note: who, now, do you think is the most scummy of the bunch?

Dr. Phibes for giving a grand total of less than one fuck during the whole game. What did you hope to gain from the answer?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 09:35:40 am

Woah, Painiac. If you want to argue with me then let's do it right eh? First of all, I have no idea on how you did play Mafia before, if you're alluding to it based on how or why you were kicked out because of pure aggression. Obviously, protracting the fight doesn't help but I'm being straight to the point here. Now, aggression is the first expression implied from your posts as we cannot inherently convey what expressions we need to give off by text, but by analysis of wording and semantics. If not, then WHY BOTHER WITH THOSE CAPS? Alright, aggression - wrong term, being irritated - yes. Why are you irritated by my posts then?

And, I don't know if you're panicking right now, but you outright lied there.

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 07:19:37 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

Starting your case, it is weak. Accusing me of lurking, WIFOM and ignoring what the meaning of my post is blatantly obvious. Overly aggressive too.

Twist my posts more, scum. I didn't accused you here of lurking, you had interpreted it that way. You were spewing out WIFOM, because you made some weird readings from my post.

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Now, I'm not defending Dariush here, but I see you went all jumpy

If you had read my previous mafias, as you had suggested, you should know better I am FAR from being jumpy. And that phrasing is very funny, ,,I kinda not chainsawing you now, but i am chainsawing you". If you fear about your image so much, just lurk, scum.

Then to humor you, could you link those Mafias if you want them to stand as proof? I think I see the word "lurk" in this quote here and I think you are referring to me here. If not, then you made a big SNAFU with that. Oh, and I'll admit. I am crying excessively because of your aggression. Just as I type right now, my keyboard is wet with tears falling from my eyes.

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 07:19:37 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116945#msg3116945) it seems you are (some blatant, WIFOM related accusations)

And you are crying because I am playing it aggresively? Hey, I am not insulting my every target like Dariush did. Asking questions is being aggresive to you?

Or...wait, if you meant crying as in the verbal sense, then I am doing both. I'm glad that you can't hear me though. A pity, actually.

. . .

Seriously, the last sentence in the second quote is the only thing that is keeping me from outright voting you currently. A grievous mistake, but one that leans more on the newbie side than scum for me. You give advice for someone that, and I may guess, you suspect to be scum and what to do to save his own skin. (And just going out and pushing the word 'scum' in every accusation won't help much. It's like using salt to spice up your food, in every dish. It sort of dilutes your point rather than help in general.)

About those readings, I sown them with question marks that would help to clarify the matter, but you jumped before looking and went to conclusions. Asking questions and acting aggressive is not what makes you suspicious in my eye, nor do grammar mistakes make you scum, but it is the essence of your posts (or the quality and how you pass on meaning). Right now I've gained a lot of information on you.

I don't recall explicitly suggesting to have read your previous Mafias by the way, if I did say so, please quote it for me.

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 07:19:37 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 05:54:17 am

On a note of that, complete attitude shift right there. Capitalizing off words to shout it out. against me

I don't plan to dring tea with possible scum?

I can't parse what you're trying to say here. You're saying I'm spouting WIFOM or are you thirsty for some nice tea?

---

Mod: Timecount and Votecount?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 09:58:08 am

EBWOP: Great. The grammar has gone to my eyes. (No offense)

Cutting out the accusation of 'outright lying', replacing with 'implying'.

As in "And, I don't know if you're panicking right now, but you are implying it there."

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 10:01:18 am

IronyOwl, what do you have to say about all this so far?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 10:03:51 am

Extend too, if Strategia is to be believed (Not saying I don't trust your word, but the official votecount should be able to clarify it. Or Think's LurkerTracker...)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 10:41:38 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 10:03:51 am

Extend too, if Strategia is to be believed (Not saying I don't trust your word, but the official votecount should be able to clarify it. Or Think's LurkerTracker...)

I rechecked my list, it's actually a two-way tie, I forgot to remove McFry's vote for you. According to this, it's a tie between Dariush (by Phibes and McFry) and Painiac (by Scelly and me).

Speaking of which: Scelly, where are you?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 23, 2012, 11:28:30 am

Darisuh, I dont know what a did expect. Who i thought you would say was Painiac, i wanted to know, if we now say you were a scum. Who would you be most afraid of right now and why? I think its funny you dont want to answer any questions and everyone who suspects you must be scum.
Of course you allways answer i am not scum, but it was the way you said it, not that you said it. But hey if you dont answer me, why on earth should i answer you?
I do however have an other idea why you are so mad. You are mad beacuse you think we are all noobs (rightfully so), now that we think you are scum, you are so frustrated that we cant see the " real" answer. Is that somewhat true?

Tiruin, there is no way i would actully now what roll he have. I just simply think thats hes not a scum. You can call it a hunch ( i think).

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 23, 2012, 12:29:52 pm

Day ends 9:00 PM today. 1 request for extend, 2 more needed. Votecount coming in 2 hours.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:37:36 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Time to lay down the post! Unvote

McFry:
Wow. I was going to believe you're evidence there in that long spoiler list. Attacking every crucial detail on why Dariush is super Scum with an S. Not saying I'm defending him here but your understanding is damned. Do you bother reading your accuser's posts other than waiving them off like fluff? Well, we had all the time in the last two days to check if what is going on is true or not. It revolves around his not answering your question. Could you re-quote it please, for everyone to verify?

Spoiler: Because it seems you don't bother to give ample time for a re-read (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Oh hi there Dariush. Don't mind if I pull apart your posts.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

You should have told us that you were being cute and fluffy, because I sure didn't notice.

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Argh, every IC has some kind of long-winded greeting except me. Oh well. I'm Dariush, and I'm extremely white and fluffy. Any interactions with me may will result in sanity, blood, limb and life loss.

---

---

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 10:35:25 am

Oh, and by the way:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush[...], which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

---

---

And I cannot believe you repeated (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3118929#msg3118929) it again and again in your Evidence post. U tunnelin' bro?

Quote from: Truly biased

"I gave reasons why you should answer my question. You ignored them."

"You didn't answer the question."

"You evaded my question again. Remember how I wrote earlier that I wanted to quote you on something?"

"If you're that intent on disproving my incriminating facts, check your counterstatements first. The post of mine you're referring to is already the post where I repeat my question. So you should have had no problems at all giving a coherent, precise and satisfactory answer the first time I asked.
"

The hypocrisy is too much for mine eyes.

Restating!

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

Palm to the face.

Oh, P.S. McFry, if you're scumhunting Dariush like you said here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116765#msg3116765) then I'd truly wish you well. Other than being a hypocrite, that is. And not even spreading out the need for information once you "are sure" of who is scum. Or perchance, to read more on your pursuant?

Also, verging on non-mafia details is not good. Perfect for you to go on your lead though. Wacky Death Race is the best proof you can give to show Dariush is scum. Especially on the effort made in that off-topic post, it reflects, you know?

This... is a jumble of incoherent sentences that somehow includes a vote on me. Somewhere in the world you have made a grammar nazi cry. But for the sake of all our sanities, I will try to interpret what you're saying here to my best efforts.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Time to lay down the post! Unvote

McFry:
Wow. I was going to believe you're evidence there in that long spoiler list.

But now you're not believing my evidence any more. What made you do so?

Quote

Attacking every crucial detail on why Dariush is super Scum with an S.

Yes, that is my intention.

Quote

Not saying I'm defending him here but your understanding is damned.

Damned good? Damned bad? Damned stupid?
And why? Give a reason.

Quote

Do you bother reading your accuser's posts other than waiving them off like fluff?

Yes, I take people saying stuff seriously, and I greatly dislike when people say stupid things.

Quote

Well, we had all the time in the last two days to check if what is going on is true or not.

Yes, and I believe that what I said is true. If you don't, feel free to say so.

Quote

It revolves around his not answering your question.

It started out with that. Now it's much more, and it's being confirmed with every word that Dariush says.

Quote

Could you re-quote it please, for everyone to verify?

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Oh hi there Dariush. Don't mind if I pull apart your posts.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

You should have told us that you were being cute and fluffy, because I sure didn't notice.

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Argh, every IC has some kind of long-winded greeting except me. :( Oh well. I'm Dariush, and I'm extremely white and fluffy. Any interactions with me may will result in sanity, blood, limb and life loss.

This is an honest mistake on my part. I was trying to make a witty response here, but it looks like I forgot that Dariush did actually say so. Perhaps because it's not actually important to the game, so I forgot about it.

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 10:35:25 am

Oh, and by the way:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush[...], which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

As you could have guessed already when I asked the question, but should absolutely know by now, while this is logically correct, this is not an acceptable answer. Dariush clearly prefers being smartass to being helpful.

Quote

And I cannot believe you repeated (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3118929#msg3118929) it again and again in your Evidence post. U tunnelin' bro?

Actually, I'm not. While this certainly looks like confirmation bias, it is in fact not, as I have really only received positive confirmation. Dariush is showing again and again that he does not give a single goatfuck about being even moderately helpful. Even though the question has devolved to a formality now and is not actually helpful anymore, he is consistently refusing to comply in the knowledge that complying would have taken less effort than telling me that it's bullshit to comply. By now, I have given up on getting an answer to this question. (PPE: But I have asked him some follow-up questions, which he then proceeded to ignore).

Quote

Quote from: Truly biased

"I gave reasons why you should answer my question. You ignored them."

"You didn't answer the question."

"You evaded my question again. Remember how I wrote earlier that I wanted to quote you on something?"

"If you're that intent on disproving my incriminating facts, check your counterstatements first. The post of mine you're referring to is already the post where I repeat my question. So you should have had no problems at all giving a coherent, precise and satisfactory answer the first time I asked.
"

The hypocrisy is too much for mine eyes.

That's not even hypocrisy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypocrisy).

Quote

Restating!

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

Palm to the face.

You are good at restating. But what's your point? "Palm to the face" is not an argument.

Quote

Oh, P.S. McFry, if you're scumhunting Dariush like you said here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116765#msg3116765) then I'd truly wish you well.

Now am I doing like I said or not?

Quote

Other than being a hypocrite, that is.

Not.

Quote

And not even spreading out the need for information once you "are sure" of who is scum.

What? Spreading out the need for information? I'm already using all the information I can get from Dariush. Do you want me to ask Dariush the question again? Why don't you ask him this time? Perhaps he'll suddenly feel compelled to answer to you instead.

Quote

Or perchance, to read more on your pursuant?

Even more than I'm already doing?
And FYI, I won't use metascumtells as arguments, so you can't even know what I'm reading about.

Quote

Also, verging on non-mafia details is not good. Perfect for you to go on your lead though. Wacky Death Race is the best proof you can give to show Dariush is scum. Especially on the effort made in that off-topic post, it reflects, you know?

I'm verging on details that differentiate him from town. Also, what is a Wacky Death Race? I looked in the Mafiascum wiki, but I could't find it.
And what the hell reflects?

As far as I can understand, you're accusing me because 1) I'm having a successful scumhunt, 2) because I'm a hypocrite (which I'm not), and 3) because I failed a witty remark.
I mean, seriously. What the hell. Those must be the worst reasons ever for a vote. Shame on you, man. Shame on you.

---

Dariush, it's you again. Well, what do we have here.

Quote from: Dariush on March 23, 2012, 07:45:43 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 22, 2012, 11:07:07 am

vomit

You fucking piece of shit. Not only you ignored the entirety of my post, you actually had the guts to say that I didn't say anything useful, vote me and ignore the questions I specifically warned I'll have your ass for not answering. Honestly, regardless of your alignment, I hope to never see you again on this forum. You just don't care.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

And the odds of the same IC being scum two games in a row is microscopic. Dariush was scum in BM XXXI (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=102408.msg3095876#msg3095876).

Gambler's Fallacy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler%27s_Fallacy) is just that - a fallacy. Don't resort to it.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Dariush: How goes the IC'ing? (Heh, Icing) On that note: who, now, do you think is the most scummy of the bunch?

Dr. Phibes for giving a grand total of less than one fuck during the whole game. What did you hope to gain from the answer?

What do we have here? An insult, a filler, an answer and an overused and destructive counter-question.

I'll just put this here again.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

1. Repeated voluntary cooperation refusal.

As you might remember, I have given many good reasons why you should answer the question I asked you. As you didn't answer my question like I suggested you do, you obviously disagree with all of the reasons.
To recap: Here are the reasons.

Quote

First, the ICs have played more games with this round's players, and should therefore have an accurate idea of most people's gameplay, more than I and others have read out of the previous games.
Second, there are two of them, and if one should decide to give biased information, then information between the two IC posts will differ and we will know that one of the ICs cannot be trusted.
Third, everybody can use the information given by the ICs. I suspect that not everybody will go through all of this group's previous games, so the information will help the players to form their own opinion. As I said before, the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells, so everybody will still have to scumhunt on their own, but with a little more guidance.
Fourth, it is not required to believe or even regard the given information. You are still free to suspect whomever you want.
Fifth, this is a test to see if the ICs are willing to cooperate with the town.

As you are of the opinion that these reasons suck, you should probably have reasons for thinking like this, therefore you should be able to tell us these reasons. Why do you disagree with all of the reasons I gave you?

Note the question mark.
To quote you:

Quote

You fucking piece of shit. Not only you ignored the entirety of my post, you actually had the guts to [...] ignore the questions I specifically warned I'll have your ass for not answering.

Seriously. Double standards.

---

MOD: We already have three extends.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:40:11 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:18:13 am

vote Extend

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 07:24:01 am

Extend.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 10:03:51 am

Extend too

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 23, 2012, 12:41:39 pm

I can confirm the amount of extends. One by Strat, Painiac, and Tiruin each.

Aaaaand there  you go ninjaing me.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 12:44:38 pm

PPE: This used to be a list of quotes of the three extend votes, but since Magma and Darvi have already taken care of that, I removed it. However, if the tie is broken (either way) before the original day end, I withdraw my vote. My initial extend was meant to give more time to break the tie, so if the tie is already broken, there's no reason to extend anymore, for me at least.

---

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 23, 2012, 11:28:30 am

But hey if you dont answer me, why on earth should i answer you?

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 23, 2012, 11:28:30 am

dont answer me, why on earth should i answer you?

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 23, 2012, 11:28:30 am

why on earth should i answer you?

Maybe because that's how the game is played? And because refusing to answer questions is a massive scumtell? Oh, by the way, you're still my top vote once Painiac kicks the bucket. And I must say, you're not doing a very good job of convincing me not to.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 23, 2012, 12:54:16 pm

Strategia, Why dont you care if Dariush doesent answer questions? And why are you suspecting me? All i said was i dont think you are scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 12:58:07 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 23, 2012, 12:54:16 pm

Strategia, Why dont you care if Dariush doesent answer questions? And why are you suspecting me? All i said was i dont think you are scum.

I've seen Dariush answer his questions; and besides, he's an IC. You, on the other hand, are new. You're vague, which is a scumtell, and passive, which is a lesser scumtell. And outright saying "why should I answer your questions" is a really, really, really bad idea, especially if you make good on that.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 23, 2012, 01:24:03 pm

Fair enough, i can answer his question, but i think he should answer as well beacuse as you said not answering questions is a scumtell.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 03:51:42 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Actually, Scelly is right. Let's examine two possible answers, shall we?
1.) "Why are you SCUMMM?" "I'm not." This is basically what any normal player would answer. Congratulations, you have learned nothing. Oh, and Dariush outright said this as well.
2.) "Why are you SCUMMM?" "That's a stupid question." Also basically what any normal player could answer, especially an IC, given that they're supposed to teach you how to scumhunt properly. Dariush, being Dariush, simply added profanity.

That's true, normal answer would look like this. But Dariush answer was more ,,flavorful". It's really funny it's YOU who mentions this. Your ,,Red or Blue" question wasn't better (probably even worse), and these were answers YOU got. Most of these answers were of 1) style, I answered in 2) style. I had asked one such question, you had asked this, like, FIVE times?

Rest is just WIFOM. I could say that scum wouldn't attack IC directly in first post, because it would be plain stupid to argue with more experienced player. And being in such bad spotlight would lynch scum in no time. But that's also WIFOM. Oh, and that's Gambler Fallacy you are making there. If you were throwing coin and got tails 3 times, it will not warp a coin, it will not change laws of gravity, it will not spawn some miracle or whatever. Next throw will also have 50/50 chance. Chances of Dariush being scum aren't that microscopic as you would think. These chances are equal to me being scum, or you, or anyone else after all.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

IC'ing != OMGUSing. An OMGUS is an outright attack (i.e. a vote, or at the very least an FoS) on someone for basically no other reason than that they attacked you. Even then, an OMGUS is one of the more questionable scumtells. Dariush' job, being an IC, is to point out what you're doing wrong when scumhunting, which is what he's doing right here. This is in no way, shape or form an OMGUS; again, it's you attacking an IC for..... basically no reason at all.

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Something like very passive OMGUS...

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

very passive OMGUS

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

VERY PASSIVE

I know definition of OMGUS, thank you. I didn't say it was normal OMGUS. I did say it has looked like very passive OMGUS.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 22, 2012, 12:13:58 pm

Quote from: Some helpful spiel from Jim Groovester, a previous BM IC

I will be a completely impartial source of advice that I will freely give at every opportunity, whether I am asked for it or I decide to give it on my own. You can trust that everything I have to say will be given in good faith, even if it comes at a personal cost to me in this game.

This goes for every IC, Dariush included. For an IC, their wincon comes secondary to their teaching role.

If he wasn't insisting that I am roleplaying (I was offtoping), I would agree with your quote.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

In addition to not being a lazy passive dick, don't be a lazy aggressive dick either. (Trust me, I know this first-hand. I got myself lynched that way in BM XXX.) I also like how you're now arguing in Dariush' favour, and especially the bit about "that's not the purpose of ICs". This exchange seems strange and weak to me, almost like you're desperately trying to appear to argue with Magma, but really aren't.

whaaaaat
This argument seems strange and weak to me, almost like you're desperately trying to appear to argue with me, but really aren't.
Seriously, I am dumbfounded here. I know my main problem is too much aggresion. But, come on, he was spewning out such lazy bullshit I couldn't ignore him. It was necessary to show him that being THAT lazy is very, very bad and arrogant. Magma being town or scum wasn't important in that moment, to be frank.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Oh..... wow. Phibes' reason for suspecting Dariush is nulltell WIFOM, based on your own question? Wait, what was that sound I heard? Oh, right, that's your credibility flying out the window and making a rather ugly splat on the pavement.

Twist meaning of my question MOAR. I was never making argument ,,Dariush, you said you are town, therefore you may be scum!". Never. I was insisting from the very start that actual answer meant little to nothing for me, it was form of answer what I actually cared for. But, Dr.Phibes WAS doing such stupid WIFOM shit, on the other hand.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

"You are stepping on the thin ice of meta scumtells" indeed. Oh dear, looks like your credibility is going down the storm drain after its big splat. Also, more meaningless exchange with McFry. Have I perchance stumbled upon your scumbuddy?

Magma wanted to start with meta scumtells as his scumhunt basis, which was just plain wrong. I just throwed one, little question, while I was aware it will backfire at me if I will treat it too seriously.

Quote

he can be flippy-flappy

Quote

CAN (doesn't have to be!)

You said something about credibility? Your accusations are big steaming crap so far.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Exactly what I'd recommend you do yourself. You've been doing three things so far; going after Dariush for essentially no reason, having a wishy-washy back-and-forth with Magma, and asking lazy, meaningless questions of random people without following up on them. Oh, and a fourth thing; undercutting your own credibility.

Quote

Your shitty arguments tires me. Do you expect I would have nice and clean reason for scumhunting Dariush? No, it was RvS stage. It's obvious I would have little to no reason to scumhunt at anyone. What, I was supposed to lurk, and do nothing at all, while asking stupid ,,red or blue" question? Oh, and there you are, accusing me of asking lazy, meaningless questions. It's you, who undercuts your own credibility.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 03:08:43 am

Dr.Phibes, you're kinda passive. Only answering questions, and asked questions to targets I had choose before. You can't do some research on your own? What are you thinking about other players, any impressions?

drakon136, I can understand you have school/RL, but could you try asking some questions later, instead of only aswering them?

Tiruin, what role would you enjoy more - scum, or townie?

And here's the lazy questions I mentioned two quotes ago. RVS questions at this stage? Really?

From these three questions, only question to Tiruin could be classified as RvS question. Question to drakon126 was basically prodding him to do something more, instead of being lurky. And question to Dr. Phibes had similar goal, he was unproductive and unreadable. Making some shitty accusations? Really?

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 22, 2012, 01:53:07 pm

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

Well, I can understand why scum would want naive town for enemy.

Do they speak sarcasm in What? Also, if you're such an expert on Dariush' meta ("flippy-flappy on such questions when scum"), how come you're so incredibly surprised by Dariush hurling insults around like it's a competition?

whaaaaat
Where I am being suprised by Dariush actions? If you want to frame me with wild accusations, try better. Random quotes will not work.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

There's no such thing as a "nice, clean OMGUS". An OMGUS is a vague tell at best.

I have to repeat myself? By saying ,,nice, clean OMGUS", I meant it's book definition. While ,,very passive OMGUS" is slightly different. And no, it is scumtell, because it's not vague tell.

Quote

OMGUSing implies that you're really concerned about being pressured/lynched and want people to stop, which is more a scum thing.

That's some accomplishment, even twisting scumtell to match your crappy argument.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Apart from the fact that I have no idea what you're saying in your first sentence, you outright stated Dariush was OMGUSing you a couple of quotes back. Vagueness, pointless aggression, and either backtracking or outright lying. Check, check, check, no argument left.

You know, you had accused me several times... While not stating what are you accusing me for. Like, ,,I accuse you, because something!". And you are accusing me of being vague and outright lying, while being vague and outright lying! That's probably the crappiest argument I saw in this mafia.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Quote

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 05:58:07 pm

Dariush reply to my post and yours stinks of scum. Needs more looking.

I stink of scum after a whopping one post, most of which was IC stuff. Nice nose you have there. Maybe it's your brain that stinks from inside instead?

,,Needs more looking" implies that I wasn't sure what I should think about you; townies may drop one or another scummy post while going for their target, it's just natural.

Well, let's make some crappy bullshit arguments, derp

Your wild accusations are dripping scumminess. And nice argument you have here: ,,I think your posts are scummy, I don't have proof though, but you are scum!". Yeah.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 05:26:10 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Now, I'm not defending Dariush here, but I see you went all jumpy

If you had read my previous mafias, as you had suggested, you should know better I am FAR from being jumpy. And that phrasing is very funny, ,,I kinda not chainsawing you now, but i am chainsawing you". If you fear about your image so much, just lurk, scum.

> in beginner's mafia
> implies to have meta
> is actually jumpy

> implying

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Quote

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

And you do admit, making nonsensical arguments was your plan to catch scum all along?

If that works, then why not. It's not like I could think up any serious, logical argument from ONE post.

Wow. Just..... wow.

What, are you suprised that playing dirty may be effective? It is mafia, if your opponent is 100% scum, fabricating evidence and thinking up shit to lynch him is acceptable. But probably only in LYLO, though. You will look scummy when pulling such stunts in normal situation. And making shit arguments to see what reaction will be (townie will be VERY angry) can also work. But looks scummy.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

Painiac, I would like nothing better than to see scum like you hang. And even if you flip town, well, you're obstructive to actual scumhunting and hurting the town because of it so I still won't be sad to see you go. Bye bye now.

Bye bye my ass, scum. Don't be so relaxed, you hadn't lynched me yet. Strategia. I would like to see scummy, framing, making wild accusations ass like you hang. And what the hell you are saying? Even if I would be townie, it would be good lynching me? That's such stupid and anti-town proposition (backed up with crappy argument, of course) only scum would say. That's worse from any policy lynch.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 05:16:56 pm

Slight quote mess-up there. The vote you're casting won't show up on LurkerTracker if it's in a quote.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: IronyOwl on March 23, 2012, 06:15:18 pm

Extend. Very sorry about vanishing, but this does at least provide several important lessons.

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 10:01:18 am

IronyOwl, what do you have to say about all this so far?

I think I'm too burned out to give a better response, but:

Magma and Strategia seem to know what they're doing.

Painiac, Strategia, and Tiruin are veering into Wall of Text territory. This is a dangerous land, filled with arguments too lengthy for anyone to bother reading. They need to be prepared to summarize their arguments succinctly when they want to actually convince people.

Dr.Phibes seems to be struggling, but I think he's got a fair point on Dariush.



Magma:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I've played with Dariush, Tiruin, and maybe Strategia, not sure. Dariush tends to be full of bile and bad at explaining himself. Tiruin I seem to recall being enthusiastic but awkward in some fashion, but I don't really remember the details. Strategia I don't remember anything about, if indeed I've played with him before. In all cases, I'm not aware of any differences between their scum and town play.

I tend to be fairly wordy, and sometimes get sucked into useless walls of text. I try to follow my gut where possible, but more often end up dissecting posts to point out how scummy someone is (hence the tendency to dissect too thoroughly).


Tiruin:

Quote from: Tiruin on March 21, 2012, 06:27:08 am

IronyOwl: This is the first time (in recent games) that I've seen you as a BM IC. How are you prepared to correct each player's scumhunting/perspective and to aid them generally? Straight to the point posts, or in detail ideas?

Generally in detail ideas. I've never been a fan of convincing people to do things by rote mimicry and then explaining why they're doing it later. Thus, while I intend to be mindful of the fact that most newbies can't handle a three page document on the underlying principles of scumhunting, I'd much rather explain the principles than just tell them what to do.


Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 11:18:01 am

IronyOwl, red or blue?

Red.

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 05:13:18 pm

Tiruin, drakon, where are you?

Why'd you care about them but not me?


Painiac:

Quote from: Painiac on March 21, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

IronyOwl: Would you want vanilla role, or something more important in such light setting?

Generally speaking I'd like an important role, because hey, free role! And I have more confidence in my own target selection than most other peoples'.

In this particular case, ICs tend to be higher up the kill-list, so I might prefer someone who's more likely to be around for longer to have it instead, though.


Scelly9:

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 21, 2012, 04:06:44 pm

Ironyowl. Let's assume for a second that you're scum. Do you think the fact that you're an IC would give you an advantage in remaining undetected?

Yes and no, probably leaning more yes. People tend to have trouble suspecting ICs (not so much this game, but for obvious reasons), but since you'd have someone on the inside, as it were, I think your odds of finding me out would be better than normal.



Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Dr.Scummes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

Dariush, if we say you were a scum, who would be your first target and why?

Instead of me answering your question, let's examine two possibilities: 1) I answer, the guy I named dies. Next day you accuse me. 2) I answer, someone else dies. You say that I did that intentionally so you won't accuse me and accuse me because of it. This is utter bullshit WIFOM.

Dr.Phibes, what were you hoping to gain from my answer to the above question? And don't you dare answer something along the lines of 'your reaction'. Just don't you dare.

This was a perfectly valid attempt to get inside your head (or at least a rote imitation of such), and you blew it off in an overdefensive huff. I wanna know who you'd kill tonight as scum, because I wanna know who you're currently viewing as a threat and what your current take on a scum strategy would be. While you're at it, I'd like to know who you'd defend as a doc and inspect as a cop.

Finally, what I really wanna know is why you jumped straight to OH NO YOU DON'T IF I ANSWER THIS I'LL BE WALKING INTO YOUR TRAP in response. Are you that threatened by Dr.Phibes' dastardly ploy?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 23, 2012, 06:37:41 pm

Day extended to Monday!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 09:24:00 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 23, 2012, 06:15:18 pm

Painiac, Strategia, and Tiruin are veering into Wall of Text territory. This is a dangerous land, filled with arguments too lengthy for anyone to bother reading. They need to be prepared to summarize their arguments succinctly when they want to actually convince people.

I was bored at work, and I wanted to make sure that I wasn't spouting utter bullshit, so I decided to go over all of Painiac's posts so far for completeness' sake.

Quote

Strategia I don't remember anything about, if indeed I've played with him before.

I haven't played with you before, I've only been in BM XXX (and the replacement list for BM XXXI), and lurking in a handful of other games (such as BSER and Hammertime). Haven't posted in those though.

Quote

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 05:13:18 pm

Tiruin, drakon, where are you?

Why'd you care about them but not me?

My previous experience with ICs indicated that they tend, on the whole, to be very much less active than the new players themselves, so I didn't mind your inactivity at the time. (I may have checked your profile and saw your last post had been here, or I may be confused with someone else. My memory on such matters gets fuzzy sometimes.) My later question to you on "what do you think of the situation" was also my way of asking where you were.

---

(I'll summarise my arguments at the end of the post, so if you tl;dr you can skip this section and go straight there.)

Quote from: Painiac on March 23, 2012, 03:51:42 pm

It's really funny it's YOU who mentions this. Your ,,Red or Blue" question wasn't better (probably even worse), and these were answers YOU got.

All right, since it probably won't really work after this game anyway: The reason I asked those "red vs. blue" questions was to get a very broad, basic read on players' personalities through a very simple either-or question. Red = more emotional an impulsive, possibly aggressive, blue = more calm and careful, both in very broad strokes. Like I said, this had no immediate effect on my votes, but it did give me a rough idea of what to expect from the players I asked. And guess what? You said red, and you've been very impulsive and aggressive throughout this game so far. Phibes, for instance, said blue and is much more passive (though to the point of either absurdity or just not caring). Again, this has no immediate bearing on my votes, but it's a quick and easy way to get a broad read on someone.

Quote

Rest is just WIFOM. I could say that scum wouldn't attack IC directly in first post, because it would be plain stupid to argue with more experienced player. And being in such bad spotlight would lynch scum in no time. But that's also WIFOM. Oh, and that's Gambler Fallacy you are making there. If you were throwing coin and got tails 3 times, it will not warp a coin, it will not change laws of gravity, it will not spawn some miracle or whatever. Next throw will also have 50/50 chance. Chances of Dariush being scum aren't that microscopic as you would think. These chances are equal to me being scum, or you, or anyone else after all.

Eh, true. I'm not discounting the possibility that Dariush is scum, I'm just saying that I find it unlikely. As for attacking an IC right off the bat, yes it may be WIFOM but the way I see it is you trying to deny the town access to one of our ICs through a lynch. You say that you read some other games Dariush was in and have a slight read on his meta. I.e. you know he's, shall we say, rather abrasive. It's easy to paint that as scumminess to a bunch of newbies. And quite honestly, I wouldn't put it past Darvi to put you up to this, just to get under Dariush' skin (nothing personal Darvi).

Quote

I know definition of OMGUS, thank you. I didn't say it was normal OMGUS. I did say it has looked like very passive OMGUS.

There's no such thing. Your argument is void.

Assuming it isn't, and "looking like a very passive OMGUS" is a valid scumtell instead of an utterly vague nonsensical phrase, you look slightly like an experienced player, and this orange juice on my desk looks like it has a very slight green tinge under my desk lamp. But see, the thing is, you aren't some kind of Mafia legend, and my orange juice is just plain yellow, because looking very slightly like a passive something-or-other is a phrase with absolutely no validation whatsoever. Skyscrapers look very slightly like marshmallows. Someone sitting in their car with the engine off looks like a very passive driver. It has utterly no meaning.

Quote

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 07:09:10 am

"You are stepping on the thin ice of meta scumtells" indeed. Oh dear, looks like your credibility is going down the storm drain after its big splat. Also, more meaningless exchange with McFry. Have I perchance stumbled upon your scumbuddy?

Magma wanted to start with meta scumtells as his scumhunt basis, which was just plain wrong. I just throwed one, little question, while I was aware it will backfire at me if I will treat it too seriously.

Well hey, guess what? Your one little question is backfiring on you. Either it led you down a route of tunnel-vision, going after Dariush at the expense of scumhunting anybody else for the entire day (in which case you're an obstruction to scumhunting and I want you gone), or you knew full well what was going to happen and used it to goad Dariush with the intention of getting rid of him ASAP (in which case you're scum and I want you gone).

Quote

whaaaaat
Where I am being suprised by Dariush actions? If you want to frame me with wild accusations, try better. Random quotes will not work.

Maybe "surprised" wasn't the best choice of words. What I meant was how you were going after Dariush for, again, being Dariush. Hurling insults and being abrasive are not scumtells.

Quote

I have to repeat myself? By saying ,,nice, clean OMGUS", I meant it's book definition. While ,,very passive OMGUS" is slightly different.

If you really want a definition of "nice, clean OMGUS", I'd recommend looking at the tail end of your own post. And again, "very passive OMGUS" is not "slightly different", it doesn't exist.

Quote

You know, you had accused me several times... While not stating what are you accusing me for. Like, ,,I accuse you, because something!". And you are accusing me of being vague and outright lying, while being vague and outright lying! That's probably the crappiest argument I saw in this mafia.

I'm accusing you because you appear scummier with every post you make. Because your arguments are based on nothing. Because you're hurling vague non-entities around like they're some sort of all-telling scumslip. Because you're scum.

Quote

Your wild accusations are dripping scumminess. And nice argument you have here: ,,I think your posts are scummy, I don't have proof though, but you are scum!". Yeah.

Excuse me while I try to wrap my head around this stupidity. If you want proof, you've been dissecting it this whole post so far. As for wild accusations dripping scumminess; pot, meet kettle. Besides, forgive me for actually attempting proper scumhunting on D1 instead of relentlessly attacking one person right from the very first post with barely any regard for anyone else along the way. Oh that's right, I forgot, you don't actually need to scumhunt. It'd be rather hard to hunt yourself.

Quote

Bye bye my ass, scum. Don't be so relaxed, you hadn't lynched me yet. Strategia. I would like to see scummy, framing, making wild accusations ass like you hang. And what the hell you are saying? Even if I would be townie, it would be good lynching me? That's such stupid and anti-town proposition (backed up with crappy argument, of course) only scum would say. That's worse from any policy lynch.

So far, if there's anything I've noticed about myself when playing Mafia, it's that whenever I start to attack someone I tend to end my posts with a relaxed-seeming, sarcastic stinger along the lines of the "bye bye now" in here. And just because you haven't been lynched yet doesn't mean you won't be lynched in the future. And yes, lynching townies can be something other than entirely a bad thing. Look at Phibes; IIRC, you yourself said he was being vague and unreadable, and therefore dangerous. If Phibes got lynched, and flipped town, that means that he wasn't scum but just an idiot who distracted the town. Getting rid of scummy town helps clean the place up, and makes the actual scum easier to find. Therefore, even though I do believe you are scum, I want you gone no matter what.

---

Summary of my arguments against Painiac.

- He has been attacking only one target, and an IC at that, with any kind of force for the entire day, right from the get go (until now).
- His attacks on Dariush are based on bullshit.
- His tunnel-vision is hurting town scumhunting efforts.
- If he isn't scum, he's very scummy town, and needs to go as well.

Ergo; my vote stays firmly on Painiac.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 09:24:51 pm

Oh, by the way - Mod: what's the current votecount?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 10:49:31 pm

McFry

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:37:36 pm

This... is a jumble of incoherent sentences that somehow includes a vote on me. Somewhere in the world you have made a grammar nazi cry. But for the sake of all our sanities, I will try to interpret what you're saying here to my best efforts.

Incoherent? Compared to the rest of all your answers to everyone else and you call mine incoherent? Get to the point and answer them.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:37:36 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Time to lay down the post! Unvote

McFry:
Wow. I was going to believe you're evidence there in that long spoiler list.

But now you're not believing my evidence any more. What made you do so?

Judging by what I did post, you've missed the point.

Let me post up the core of my post to you and how you understood Dariush, including how you worded it.

Spoiler: Good thing there is a spoiler function to shorten (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:37:36 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

It revolves around his not answering your question.

It started out with that. Now it's much more, and it's being confirmed with every word that Dariush says.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:37:36 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Could you re-quote it please, for everyone to verify?

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Oh hi there Dariush. Don't mind if I pull apart your posts.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

You should have told us that you were being cute and fluffy, because I sure didn't notice.

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Argh, every IC has some kind of long-winded greeting except me. Oh well. I'm Dariush, and I'm extremely white and fluffy. Any interactions with me may will result in sanity, blood, limb and life loss.

This is an honest mistake on my part. I was trying to make a witty response here, but it looks like I forgot that Dariush did actually say so. Perhaps because it's not actually important to the game, so I forgot about it.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 10:35:25 am

Oh, and by the way:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush[...], which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

As you could have guessed already when I asked the question, but should absolutely know by now, while this is logically correct, this is not an acceptable answer. Dariush clearly prefers being smartass to being helpful.

Now, you last stated that "It is not an acceptable answer. Dariush clearly prefers being smartass to being helpful." Now think of this. He is an IC, ICs teach by their own post. Maybe 'How to deal with a smartass.' would clearly define his actions or 'How to keep your calm with a smartass goading you.'

So I get, you are attacking him not anymore because of his incompetent answer, but because he's acting like the worst IC ever? Let me tell you this, straight. Everyone has their own special way to teach and it is up to those under them to listen or not. Clearly, you are jumping on the 'hit smartass' wagon.

Other than that, how would that certain smartass know what you actually meant when all you stated afterwards is this:

Spoiler: Purpose (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

The purpose of my questions was to have the ICs spit out some detailed information on people's known individual playstyles, so everyone has some kind of idea about how others behave and can direct their scumhunting based on who is behaving differently than they are described. Naturally, the "not behaving as they are described" can't be used as a scumtell, because for all we know you could just be lying about the playstyles, but if A notices an inconsistency between B's described and exhibited behavior, he can just start focusing his scumhunt on B. So essentially, the information you and IronyOwl give acts as a minor hunting aid for everyone.

Or at least it would, if you had actually given some information, instead of immediately starting to act the unhelpful jerk that you've been during the entire previous BM.

What the-...Look at what your purpose exactly was, the ICs would be the ones to spout out how players play to know their playstyle?! How in the world would you derive scumhunting from that question? Playstyles change with every coming Mafia game, we live and we learn from our mistakes and ratify it on how we see fit. Mine can be as flexible as a hollow concrete block, if you want to know it!

Judging by that, you already received your answer! Did you say "It is not an acceptable answer." No. How would anyone imply such from that amalgam of words there?

Afterwards, you restate the same question without telling him what you need to know, not being straight to the point but too stubborn to even say that he answered it wrongly! No, you say "You haven't answered it yet." instead. How quaint is the mannerism of the one who complains on my grammar.

Spoiler: Compilation of useful links (click to show/hide)

Complete and utter restatement (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115569#msg3115569)
Depending on the ICs for info, here comes the "You haven't answered it yet" deal. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116478#msg3116478)
Stating Dariush "Denied" answering your question. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116587#msg3116587)
Nearing McFry's point, but not directly saying "I'm unhappy with Dariush's answer." (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116765#msg3116765)

Wow. This stretches on to...right now.

One (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3117077#msg3117077) thing I may ask. Where are your useful contributions to the scumhunt. It's been after an IC with a faulty foundation. Guess why most of the people here are saying re-quoting your words as something along the lines of "Please scumhunt for me, I am too lazy."

Spoiler: McFry. (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Magma McScum:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Dariush, you have been constantly active on the forums for almost eight hours after I repeated my question, but you haven't answered it yet, which makes me even more suspicious. Now that I have given my reasons for asking this question, I will ask you one last time, and I expect you to swallow your pride (it doesn't belong in a Mafia game) and answer this question to everyone's fullest satisfaction. Which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum?

I already answered it and explained what I think about it in my previous post. You can go fuck yourself now.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Okay Dariush, let's look at what you did wrong so far.

1. Repeated voluntary cooperation refusal.

As you might remember, I have given many good reasons why you should answer the question I asked you. As you didn't answer my question like I suggested you do, you obviously disagree with all of the reasons.
To recap: Here are the reasons.

Quote

First, the ICs have played more games with this round's players, and should therefore have an accurate idea of most people's gameplay, more than I and others have read out of the previous games.
Second, there are two of them, and if one should decide to give biased information, then information between the two IC posts will differ and we will know that one of the ICs cannot be trusted.
Third, everybody can use the information given by the ICs. I suspect that not everybody will go through all of this group's previous games, so the information will help the players to form their own opinion. As I said before, the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells, so everybody will still have to scumhunt on their own, but with a little more guidance.
Fourth, it is not required to believe or even regard the given information. You are still free to suspect whomever you want.
Fifth, this is a test to see if the ICs are willing to cooperate with the town.

As you are of the opinion that these reasons suck, you should probably have reasons for thinking like this, therefore you should be able to tell us these reasons. Why do you disagree with all of the reasons I gave you?

2. Double standards.

Obviously you think you have some rights that others don't have, for example the right to expect an answer to a question asked by you, the right to withhold an answer to a question asked to you, or the right to bash a newbie repeatedly for doing something wrong (instead of just telling him). You'd explain that with an "I'm IC, I'm supposed to do that", but the only requirement for you to be an IC is to be helpful. You're seriously overstepping your boundaries in ways that allow you to stop people from hunting on you, but you don't need that, or do you?

3. Abusive behaviour.

You're well educated in the art of insulting people, as you have proven more than enough in your last two posts. The act of insulting people is not that bad by itself, but you obviously like to prefer insults over arguments. Hint: "Fucksack" is not a reason, and "You can go fuck yourself now" is not an answer. What makes it even worse is that you like to necro old and completed discussions for the sole purpose of insulting the person whose actions started the discussion. Looking at your last two posts, about 60% of their content are purely made of insults and repetitions of stuff that people already said earlier. The rest is made up of unfounded accusations that require the accused people's actions to be grossly misinterpreted for the accusation to even make sense.

Your first sentence under the first reason states: "As you might remember, I have given many good reasons why you should answer the question I asked you." Coming from my eye, this is probably the worst way possible to give him reason to answer you, Sir.

"It is not an acceptable answer." and why it isn't could have been the best way to clear up this mess. If you had given that, I would've believed you against Dariush but you went on as vague as ever. I mean, after a good, thorough re-read, this backs up my vote on you! This just proves your own hypocrisy!

P.S. On 'Hypocrisy', I'm referring to your own belief on Dariush and his playstyle while you act in contradiction to your own. Your meaning was not clear yet you say that you've cleared it, thoroughly while beating down on Dariush. His purpose is to teach, winning is second-line to him.

On your idea on Wacky Death Race, that is the post that you've linked to. Out of Mafia. Duh.

Dammit McFry!

To reiterate what I meant by 'spreading information', you are only targeting Dariush out of his comments on your question. You've failed to target anyone else. So let's say Dariush turns out scum if he is lynched today, eh? Who will you target then?

Scelly9 and drakon136: Hello lurkers, I would like to know why both of you haven't said anything appropriately useful about the current situation. drakon136, you haven't given any tangible leads on you, preferring to give answers to everyone else.

---

---

Painiac: One question. Why the mixed-up voting?
Strategia: I answered 'Or' to your color question.
Mod: So...official votecount coming in two hours?
LurkerTracker: Thank you.

Quote from: Judging by Think's LurkerTracker

Scelly9 -
drakon136 -
Dr.Phibes - Dariush
Tiruin -
MagmaMcFry - Tiruin
Strategia - Paniac, IronyOwl
Painiac - Scelly9, Strategia
IronyOwl -
Dariush - MagmaMcFry,

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 24, 2012, 05:12:59 am

Tiruin, I have voted on Dariush.

Strategia, Am i really that passive? Just beacuse i dont post 2 pages of text doesent mean i dont write, i mean look at Drakon136 and scelly9.
It seems like no one even bother to read my posts lol, execpt Ironyowl. I have been writing questions and answering, but it gets a bit booring when i need to reapet myself over and over. Btw why did you vote on me in the first place? Beacuse i thought you were a townie?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 24, 2012, 08:41:55 am

Quote from: Unofficial vote count

Scelly9 -
drakon136 -
Dr.Phibes - Dariush
Tiruin -
MagmaMcFry - Tiruin
Strategia - Paniac, IronyOwl
Painiac - Scelly9, Strategia
IronyOwl -
Dariush - MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes

Um, Dr.Phibes, restate your question to Strategia. It's reasoning is truly off. You are referring to yourself there.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 24, 2012, 10:55:27 am

Sorry everyone, some minor personal problems prevented me from doing a votecount. All fixed now!
Votecount!

Dariush [2]: Dr.Phibes, MagmaMcFry
Painiac [2]: Scelly9, Strategia
MagmaMcFry [1]: Tiruin
Strategia [2]: IronyOwl, Painiac
Dr.Phibes [1]: Dariush

Not Voting: drakon136

Day ends Monday!

---

New topic posted in the Labrador Canine Squad forums: Are mail trucks supposed to be convertable?

I was testing out my pacifist barking run, and I noticed that at one point when I was sieged I accidentally converted a mailtruck. It's now ramming into things for the Labrador cause. Is this a bug?

The game also is extremely upset when I try to equip a collar on the mail truck.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 24, 2012, 09:24:59 pm

Ok, first off I am extremely sorry about disappearing. I sort of forgot about my FIRST robotics competition and found myself being dragged across half the state with no internet access. I'm gonna go back and start reading. Unfortunately I have a lot to catch up on.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 24, 2012, 11:52:38 pm

Ok, here's what I think of most of you.

Drakon: From your two posts, I have no idea.

Dariush: You're a tough read. On one hand, you are acting pretty scummy what with the ignoring and the extreme over-reacting. But on the other hand, you scream and yell at people normally.

Dr. Phibes: He appears to be trying to scum hunt but he doesn't seem to be doing a very good job. Dariush is tough to respond to, you need to keep cool but also aggressive enough that you get your questions answered. The "why should I answer you" comment, along with the resulting discussion, seemed to be more of a noobtell than a scum tell.

Irony: Same as Drakon, however from your few posts you seem to be quite helpful.

I'm gonna finish the rest tomorrow. I'm exhausted.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 25, 2012, 01:47:49 am

Um,  Mod Think. Painiac switched his vote to Strategia in his messed up post.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 25, 2012, 01:48:57 am

Fixed.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 25, 2012, 03:55:57 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 10:49:31 pm

Spoiler: Good thing there is a spoiler function to shorten (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:37:36 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

It revolves around his not answering your question.

It started out with that. Now it's much more, and it's being confirmed with every word that Dariush says.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 23, 2012, 12:37:36 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Could you re-quote it please, for everyone to verify?

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Oh hi there Dariush. Don't mind if I pull apart your posts.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

You should have told us that you were being cute and fluffy, because I sure didn't notice.

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Argh, every IC has some kind of long-winded greeting except me. Oh well. I'm Dariush, and I'm extremely white and fluffy. Any interactions with me may will result in sanity, blood, limb and life loss.

This is an honest mistake on my part. I was trying to make a witty response here, but it looks like I forgot that Dariush did actually say so. Perhaps because it's not actually important to the game, so I forgot about it.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 10:35:25 am

Oh, and by the way:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush[...], which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

As you could have guessed already when I asked the question, but should absolutely know by now, while this is logically correct, this is not an acceptable answer. Dariush clearly prefers being smartass to being helpful.

Now, you last stated that "It is not an acceptable answer. Dariush clearly prefers being smartass to being helpful." Now think of this. He is an IC, ICs teach by their own post. Maybe 'How to deal with a smartass.' would clearly define his actions or 'How to keep your calm with a smartass goading you.'

So you say that Dariush is being a smartass because he wants to teach me something. And I say (and you should agree) that the proper way to deal with a smartass is to attack him. And now you're attacking me for doing exactly what you say Dariush wants me to do. Do you see the problem here?

Quote

So I get, you are attacking him not anymore because of his incompetent answer, but because he's acting like the worst IC ever? Let me tell you this, straight. Everyone has their own special way to teach and it is up to those under them to listen or not. Clearly, you are jumping on the 'hit smartass' wagon.

I am attacking him because he's playing anti-town, including his repeated incompetent answer. Contrary to your opinion, it doesn't actually matter if he's acting or not.
Case 1: He's acting. Then I'll attack him because he wants me to learn that you attack unhelpful smartasses.
Case 2: He's not acting. Then I'll attack him because he's an unhelpful smartass.
The reasons differ, but the result is the same. Exactly the same.

Quote

Other than that, how would that certain smartass know what you actually meant when all you stated afterwards is this:

Spoiler: Purpose (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 07:22:26 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 21, 2012, 06:10:49 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 05:18:33 am

Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?

I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron. Now, what was the purpose of your questions?

The purpose of my questions was to have the ICs spit out some detailed information on people's known individual playstyles, so everyone has some kind of idea about how others behave and can direct their scumhunting based on who is behaving differently than they are described. Naturally, the "not behaving as they are described" can't be used as a scumtell, because for all we know you could just be lying about the playstyles, but if A notices an inconsistency between B's described and exhibited behavior, he can just start focusing his scumhunt on B. So essentially, the information you and IronyOwl give acts as a minor hunting aid for everyone.

Or at least it would, if you had actually given some information, instead of immediately starting to act the unhelpful jerk that you've been during the entire previous BM.

I wonder why you didn't notice that I expected him to give information, because it is the only reasonable explanation for restating my question. Or do you think I'm repeating the question just for fun?

But now you're contradicting yourself. First, you tell me that Dariush is only acting his part, which requires a decent level of intelligence. Now you tell me that you think Dariush didn't cooperate because he is too stupid to note that cooperation is expected from him. The only reasonable explanation I can come up with is that you expect Dariush to be acting that part as well.

Quote

What the-...Look at what your purpose exactly was, the ICs would be the ones to spout out how players play to know their playstyle?! How in the world would you derive scumhunting from that question? Playstyles change with every coming Mafia game, we live and we learn from our mistakes and ratify it on how we see fit. Mine can be as flexible as a hollow concrete block, if you want to know it!

As of this point, I've come to accept that the actual contents of an acceptable answer to my question are not actually helpful at all. Please take notice that this is my second day alive in all decent mafia games I've played in counted together, assuming that BM XXXI was decent, which I doubt.
Still, I asked my question not only because I believed that the answers would be helpful, but also to see how far the ICs were willing to cooperate, in this case to put an acceptable amount of effort into answering a question that is more extensive than the average RVS question. If you say that Dariush is excused from answering the question because it's useless, there is no shame at all in answering the question properly and then adding "Meta scumtells aren't as useful as you might believe".

Quote

Judging by that, you already received your answer! Did you say "It is not an acceptable answer." No. How would anyone imply such from that amalgam of words there?

How would you imply anything else from my "amalgam of words there" and walk away satisfied with your ability to imply? What possible other reason could I have to say that?

Quote

Afterwards, you restate the same question without telling him what you need to know, not being straight to the point but too stubborn to even say that he answered it wrongly! No, you say "You haven't answered it yet." instead. How quaint is the mannerism of the one who complains on my grammar.

Spoiler: Compilation of useful links (click to show/hide)

Complete and utter restatement (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115569#msg3115569)
Depending on the ICs for info, here comes the "You haven't answered it yet" deal. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116478#msg3116478)
Stating Dariush "Denied" answering your question. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116587#msg3116587)
Nearing McFry's point, but not directly saying "I'm unhappy with Dariush's answer." (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116765#msg3116765)

Wow. This stretches on to...right now.

I'm terribly sorry about only implying the word "acceptably". Also, the "denied answering" is a simple verbal mislearn. I am not a native english speaker, even if it might seem so. Please accept the term "refused to answer" instead.
In the future, I'll be extra careful not to do anything that you might interpret literally and then wonder why it doesn't make sense like that. In return, you will stop flipping out over everything that doesn't make sense if you don't read it in the knowledge that it has to make sense, otherwise I wouldn't have posted it. Deal? Deal.

Quote

One (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3117077#msg3117077) thing I may ask. Where are your useful contributions to the scumhunt.

My evidence against Dariush is right here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3118929#msg3118929).

Quote

It's been after an IC with a faulty foundation.

Faulty foundation? I'd use the term "faulty behavior". Is it wrong to go after a player who behaves wrongly? And the fact that he's an IC only matters because then his behaviour can't be dismissed as "newbie".

Quote

Guess why most of the people here are saying re-quoting your words as something along the lines of "Please scumhunt for me, I am too lazy."

Hmmm. Perhaps because they were of the opinion that an acceptable answer to my question is useless.

Quote

Spoiler: McFry. (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Magma McScum:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 21, 2012, 03:30:39 pm

Dariush, you have been constantly active on the forums for almost eight hours after I repeated my question, but you haven't answered it yet, which makes me even more suspicious. Now that I have given my reasons for asking this question, I will ask you one last time, and I expect you to swallow your pride (it doesn't belong in a Mafia game) and answer this question to everyone's fullest satisfaction. Which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum?

I already answered it and explained what I think about it in my previous post. You can go fuck yourself now.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 22, 2012, 12:17:51 pm

Okay Dariush, let's look at what you did wrong so far.

1. Repeated voluntary cooperation refusal.

As you might remember, I have given many good reasons why you should answer the question I asked you. As you didn't answer my question like I suggested you do, you obviously disagree with all of the reasons.
To recap: Here are the reasons.

Quote

First, the ICs have played more games with this round's players, and should therefore have an accurate idea of most people's gameplay, more than I and others have read out of the previous games.
Second, there are two of them, and if one should decide to give biased information, then information between the two IC posts will differ and we will know that one of the ICs cannot be trusted.
Third, everybody can use the information given by the ICs. I suspect that not everybody will go through all of this group's previous games, so the information will help the players to form their own opinion. As I said before, the information given by the ICs can't be used for scumtells, so everybody will still have to scumhunt on their own, but with a little more guidance.
Fourth, it is not required to believe or even regard the given information. You are still free to suspect whomever you want.
Fifth, this is a test to see if the ICs are willing to cooperate with the town.

As you are of the opinion that these reasons suck, you should probably have reasons for thinking like this, therefore you should be able to tell us these reasons. Why do you disagree with all of the reasons I gave you?

2. Double standards.

Obviously you think you have some rights that others don't have, for example the right to expect an answer to a question asked by you, the right to withhold an answer to a question asked to you, or the right to bash a newbie repeatedly for doing something wrong (instead of just telling him). You'd explain that with an "I'm IC, I'm supposed to do that", but the only requirement for you to be an IC is to be helpful. You're seriously overstepping your boundaries in ways that allow you to stop people from hunting on you, but you don't need that, or do you?

3. Abusive behaviour.

You're well educated in the art of insulting people, as you have proven more than enough in your last two posts. The act of insulting people is not that bad by itself, but you obviously like to prefer insults over arguments. Hint: "Fucksack" is not a reason, and "You can go fuck yourself now" is not an answer. What makes it even worse is that you like to necro old and completed discussions for the sole purpose of insulting the person whose actions started the discussion. Looking at your last two posts, about 60% of their content are purely made of insults and repetitions of stuff that people already said earlier. The rest is made up of unfounded accusations that require the accused people's actions to be grossly misinterpreted for the accusation to even make sense.

Your first sentence under the first reason states: "As you might remember, I have given many good reasons why you should answer the question I asked you." Coming from my eye, this is probably the worst way possible to give him reason to answer you, Sir.

I shouldn't even need to give him reasons to answer a question acceptably. The question by itself should suffice. I gave Dariush reasons to answer the question because I still wanted an acceptable answer, because I was still of the opinion that the answer would be useful.

Quote

"It is not an acceptable answer." and why it isn't could have been the best way to clear up this mess.

Oh, right, I forgot that you couldn't think farther than the text.
To recap:
My question was "Dariush and IronyOwl, which of this game's players have you played with/against before this game, and how do they play as town and scum? How do you play?".
Dariush said "I played with everyone except Painiac and Dr.Phibes. Everyone is a decent player. Except you. You are a self-obsessed moron.".
Let's see. The first part of the first question was answered satisfactorily. The second part of the first question is not "How good are they?", because that obviously doesn't help anyone. No, the second part of the question is "What is their playstyle?". Dariush gave an indication to my playstyle, but left out everyone else. And an answer to the second question was left out entirely, which, given your nitpicky attitude, should qualify for you as an unanswered question.

Quote

If you had given that, I would've believed you against Dariush

So you are essentially saying that my arguments against Dariush don't qualify because you think I'm scum. This 'because' is entirely unjustified and does not apply here. My points remain valid, it doesn't matter if I'm town or not. It looks like you're desperately looking for a reason not to vote Dariush.

Quote

P.S. On 'Hypocrisy', I'm referring to your own belief on Dariush and his playstyle while you act in contradiction to your own. Your meaning was not clear yet you say that you've cleared it, thoroughly while beating down on Dariush. His purpose is to teach, winning is second-line to him.

My meaning was not clear to you. Let's not get too general here.
Dariush is teaching me lots of stuff, like how to deal with smartasses. If winning is second-line to him, and if he's acting, like you say, then he's willing to lose in order to teach me this lesson. Then why aren't you letting him lose?

Quote

To reiterate what I meant by 'spreading information', you are only targeting Dariush out of his comments on your question. You've failed to target anyone else. So let's say Dariush turns out scum if he is lynched today, eh? Who will you target then?

You. Yes, you, Tiruin. Because you're currently defending Dariush like there's no tomorrow.

Let's see. You're saying that I shouldn't attack Dariush because he's trying to teach me something. You're saying that Dariush is being a jerk because he's acting. You're saying that Dariush is not listening because he doesn't understand the meaning of my words. And you're saying that if I'm scum, my arguments are invalid, and you want me to be scum so that my arguments are invalid and Dariush is innocent again.

How the hell do you know so much about Dariush? Why can't you let Dariush say this kind of stuff himself? Why do you feel that you're responsible for explaining Dariush's actions, and why are you giving Dariush permission to do anything he wants because he's just "acting"? Why do you want to disbelieve the accusations I am holding against Dariush? And most important of all: Why do you want to lynch me for that?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 25, 2012, 04:27:50 pm

McFry, it seems we've reached an impasse. You're reading too much into my statements, why is that? All these implications, going defensive and putting words into my mouth? Have I struck a nerve?

To shorten: You did not (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115212#msg3115212) specifically say that his answer was lacking or unacceptable. You pressed on as if he didn't (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115569#msg3115569) answer it and continued in the same manner in the proceeding posts.

Also, you say:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 25, 2012, 03:55:57 pm

The first part of the first question was answered satisfactorily. The second part of the first question is not "How good are they?", because that obviously doesn't help anyone. No, the second part of the question is "What is their playstyle?". Dariush gave an indication to my playstyle, but left out everyone else. And an answer to the second question was left out entirely, which, given your nitpicky attitude, should qualify for you as an unanswered question.

So, unanswered must mean? Yes, I am too dumb to look up the dictionary, or an internet dictionary to see what it means. I'm sure you can do that.

I don't know anything about Dariush at all. Irrelevant of the fact that he is an IC, you attacked him regardless of anything important, other than mis-wording intention. Most of what you say contradicts itself or is stated wrongly.

Also, I'm not voting for Dariush because he doesn't seem scummy at all, other than being a sack of RAEG. What reason should your arguments be invalid if you are scum? I never said that. You implied it from a fragment of a sentence there. I'm not responsible for Dariush's actions, but trying to see if you're actually going by reason: pushing and finding out your target, not relying on one single post to stand on for your only weapon against scum, your vote.

I've stated why I don't believe your accusations earlier, as you had the time to conjure all that text, I'm sure you may have at least skimmed through it.

Guess what a pressure vote does, scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 26, 2012, 07:52:57 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 23, 2012, 06:15:18 pm

Finally, what I really wanna know is why you jumped straight to OH NO YOU DON'T IF I ANSWER THIS I'LL BE WALKING INTO YOUR TRAP in response. Are you that threatened by Dr.Phibes' dastardly ploy?

Nah, I just refuse to answer rolefishing questions out of principle, especially if they come from certain shitfucking dicks. I wrote out the details so that sane people may get a lesson or two from it, those being Thou shalt not rolefish and Thou shalt not ask utterly pointleth questionth.

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 24, 2012, 11:52:38 pm

snip

I've mentioned it before and am going to mention it again - stating your opinion on every player isn't ever going to work, unless you're going for some risky gambit involving lying about opinions. Those you consider town will mentally cross you out of their field of vision while those you call someone scummy you'll be pressured to question or vote them. That my sound like a good thing, but if applied to more than one-two people at the time it'll be detrimental to the scumhunting because other people you're questioning will feel less pressured. It's even worse if your read on someone isn't correct. In short, don't do it.

Meanwhile Painiac because he's a different flavor of the same sack of shit.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 08:25:45 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 25, 2012, 04:27:50 pm

McFry, it seems we've reached an impasse. You're reading too much into my statements, why is that? All these implications, going defensive and putting words into my mouth? Have I struck a nerve?

I'm reading too much? I'm trying to find some sense in your words. And I'm attacking your arguments against me because they simply do not. And I'm telling you why I think that they do not so you can tell me how they do. And if you've struck a nerve, then it's the "Do I have to explain it all over again?" nerve.

Quote

To shorten: You did not (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115212#msg3115212) specifically say that his answer was lacking or unacceptable. You pressed on as if he didn't (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3115569#msg3115569) answer it and continued in the same manner in the proceeding posts.

From this statement I am reading that your point is that I'm being unfair to Dariush because I'm basing my arguments on "Dariush hasn't answered" instead of "Dariush hasn't answered well".
I have never, ever given an important argument against Dariush that wouldn't apply equally well, if not better, if you replaced the "Dariush hasn't answered" with an implied "Dariush hasn't answered well".

Quote

Also, you say:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 25, 2012, 03:55:57 pm

The first part of the first question was answered satisfactorily. The second part of the first question is not "How good are they?", because that obviously doesn't help anyone. No, the second part of the question is "What is their playstyle?". Dariush gave an indication to my playstyle, but left out everyone else. And an answer to the second question was left out entirely, which, given your nitpicky attitude, should qualify for you as an unanswered question.

So, unanswered must mean?

You forgot to finish your sentence there. Please complete it.

Quote

I don't know anything about Dariush at all. Irrelevant of the fact that he is an IC, you attacked him regardless of anything important, other than mis-wording intention. Most of what you say contradicts itself or is stated wrongly.

I attacked him because of something I found important. I can choose my own leads, thank you. Evidence is for you, leads are for me.

Quote

Also, I'm not voting for Dariush because he doesn't seem scummy at all, other than being a sack of RAEG. What reason should your arguments be invalid if you are scum? I never said that. You implied it from a fragment of a sentence there.

Let's see:

Quote

"It is not an acceptable answer." and why it isn't could have been the best way to clear up this mess. If you had given that, I would've believed you against Dariush

Case 1: This is supposed to be read literally. Then my actions are responsible for Dariush's behaviour, and it's my fault that Dariush is being completely unhelpful, and it's my fault that Dariush is posting filler material, and it's my fault that Dariush has double standards, and it's my fault that Dariush is not scumhunting. See the problem here?
Case 2: This is not supposed to be read literally. Then it has no place in an attack that is largely based on incorrect wording.

Quote

I'm not responsible for Dariush's actions, but trying to see if you're actually going by reason: pushing and finding out your target, not relying on one single post to stand on for your only weapon against scum, your vote.

So I'm not pushing hard enough? Look at it this way. I'm pushing Dariush as hard as I can. He won't answer. So I have to go with what he's posted by now. You can't accuse me for Dariush not giving more material.

Quote

I've stated why I don't believe your accusations earlier, as you had the time to conjure all that text, I'm sure you may have at least skimmed through it.

Then you should have no problem (with the possible exception of slight annoyance) restating it compactly, precisely and argument-based (with emphasis on "compactly, precisely and argument-based"), so everyone knows what you're talking about.

---

---

Quote from: Dariush on March 26, 2012, 07:52:57 am

Meanwhile Painiac because he's a different flavor of the same sack of shit.

I'd ask you for a better reason, but you aren't answering my questions anymore.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 26, 2012, 10:38:06 am

McFry: So you aren't trying to hunt him out? Relying on him not abjectly answering your question as your only scumtell? There are many other ways, and for me, you voted him our of IC-does-not-teach-well or out of emotion. If you are pressuring him, then what else are you doing but the line of "Hey Dariush, you haven't answered my question."

I mean, where is the effort there? If he hasn't answered your question, then press!

Whats with the confusion on what I meant there? You're posting for the sake of your image. Breaking every minute detail of my own statements against you including the hypothetical ones and giving answers to them all.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 08:25:45 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 26, 2012, 07:52:57 am

Meanwhile Painiac because he's a different flavor of the same sack of shit.

I'd ask you for a better reason, but you aren't answering my questions anymore.

So why is this stopping you? You return fire at me with enthusiasm, say that you are scumhunting your best at Dariush and then end it with this downtrodden reply?

Dariush:
You missed a lot of questions, directed at your possible future actions in a given position.

I would like to know how in the world you accuse Dr.Phibes of rolefishing.

Quote from: Dariush on March 26, 2012, 07:52:57 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 23, 2012, 06:15:18 pm

Finally, what I really wanna know is why you jumped straight to OH NO YOU DON'T IF I ANSWER THIS I'LL BE WALKING INTO YOUR TRAP in response. Are you that threatened by Dr.Phibes' dastardly ploy?

Nah, I just refuse to answer rolefishing questions out of principle, especially if they come from certain shitfucking dicks. I wrote out the details so that sane people may get a lesson or two from it, those being Thou shalt not rolefish and Thou shalt not ask utterly pointleth questionth.

You cut out the question part of IronyOwl which I would also like to know.

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 23, 2012, 06:15:18 pm

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Dr.Scummes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

Dariush, if we say you were a scum, who would be your first target and why?

Instead of me answering your question, let's examine two possibilities: 1) I answer, the guy I named dies. Next day you accuse me. 2) I answer, someone else dies. You say that I did that intentionally so you won't accuse me and accuse me because of it. This is utter bullshit WIFOM.

Dr.Phibes, what were you hoping to gain from my answer to the above question? And don't you dare answer something along the lines of 'your reaction'. Just don't you dare.

This was a perfectly valid attempt to get inside your head (or at least a rote imitation of such), and you blew it off in an overdefensive huff. I wanna know who you'd kill tonight as scum, because I wanna know who you're currently viewing as a threat and what your current take on a scum strategy would be. While you're at it, I'd like to know who you'd defend as a doc and inspect as a cop.

Where is the rolefishing here in Dr.Phibes question?

Also, why utter your own WIFOM of what scum may do? On that note, why answer that question in advance of what may happen other than saying what you would do straight to the point, as if you're interpreting scum to follow you?

This is a BM, why is it utterly useless to ask that question and what have you to lose by answering it?

Also, on something I've missed earlier.

Quote from: Dariush on March 23, 2012, 07:45:43 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 23, 2012, 03:27:16 am

who, now, do you think is the most scummy of the bunch?

Dr. Phibes for giving a grand total of less than one fuck during the whole game. What did you hope to gain from the answer?

I hoped to gain your viewpoint and how you interpreted the most scummy person. Simple.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 26, 2012, 10:40:09 am

Can we get a replacement for drakon?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 26, 2012, 10:55:46 am

Mod: Timecount and Votecount?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 11:57:54 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 26, 2012, 10:38:06 am

McFry: So you aren't trying to hunt him out? Relying on him not abjectly answering your question as your only scumtell? There are many other ways, and for me, you voted him our of IC-does-not-teach-well or out of emotion. If you are pressuring him, then what else are you doing but the line of "Hey Dariush, you haven't answered my question."

I mean, where is the effort there? If he hasn't answered your question, then press!

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 08:25:45 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 26, 2012, 07:52:57 am

Meanwhile Painiac because he's a different flavor of the same sack of shit.

I'd ask you for a better reason, but you aren't answering my questions anymore.

So why is this stopping you? You return fire at me with enthusiasm, say that you are scumhunting your best at Dariush and then end it with this downtrodden reply?

To be honest, I don't currently see any way of pressing him to an effect. I've already cast my vote on him, I'm asking him questions, I'm accusing him of stuff. He doesn't respond, he doesn't take a stance, he doesn't even try to clarify anything. It look like he's just waiting for me to give up. There are no new reasons that could cause other people to vote him without looking scummy themselves.

Wait. There is one other option I haven't thought of before. How about we all ask Dariush a question? Perhaps that can put enough pressure on him to answer at least one important question. In fact, we can all ask Dariush the same question. Then Dariush cannot possibly refuse an acceptable answer if he doesn't want to simultaneously kick everyone's balls at once.
For this, I'd need at least some people's cooperation, but I don't see why you shouldn't want to cooperate.

I think I have a very good question that Dariush should be able to answer, and I'll formulate it so that nobody can possibly misinterpret it:

Dariush, what aspects of Painiac's actions have led you to vote for him, and why do you think that they are enough to justify lynching Painiac?

Quote

Whats with the confusion on what I meant there? You're posting for the sake of your image. Breaking every minute detail of my own statements against you including the hypothetical ones and giving answers to them all.

Because I generally (including out of Mafia) don't like it when people have a different angle of view on a specific topic than me, so I start a conversation with the other person until both parties know about the other's view (including the reasons behind it) and our viewpoints are aligned. This generally involves heated yet rational discussion, copious amounts of explanation, and bouts of logic on both people's part. Some people think they don't have to argue with me (for example teachers), so I provoke them until they do. Note that I'm not arguing with them just to be correct, but to find out new aspects and viewpoints and to trade knowledge.

So when you started mistrusting my arguments against Dariush, I wanted to know why. And if I give logical arguments to back up my point of view, then other people normally either accept my arguments (which is rare) or give arguments supporting their own point of view, and the conversation continues until both agree on a third point of view somewhere in the middle.
Now I'm not sure yet if we're agreeing already, but we're definitely getting somewhere.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 11:59:51 am

Also, the OP rules say that one Extend is enough.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 12:02:28 pm

Because I want to know why Dariush wants to lynch Painiac, and because Scelly's vote is still an RVS vote.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 26, 2012, 12:22:52 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 12:02:28 pm

Because I want to know why Dariush wants to lynch Painiac, and because Scelly's vote is still an RVS vote.

Yeah me to, felt like Dariush just voted the person with the most votes, too save him self.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 27, 2012, 12:56:10 am

To prevent something bad happening while I am asleep. (And because I don't really suspect him all that much anymore) Unvote.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 27, 2012, 12:59:25 am

Day extended to Wednesday.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 27, 2012, 01:03:40 am

Votecount!

Dariush [2]: Dr.Phibes, MagmaMcFry
Painiac [2]: Strategia, Dariush
MagmaMcFry [1]: Tiruin
Strategia [2]: IronyOwl, Painiac

Not Voting: drakon136, Scelly9

drakon136 has been prodded. Day ends Monday!

---

New topic posted in the Labrador Canine Squad forums: Slight bug with the fire hydrant rights.

Even at Elite Labrador status, my dogs can't urinate on fire hydrants in front of the park, it causes panic since everyone's set as an innocent puppy. Shouldn't it be marked as a non-aggressive act at Elite Labrador?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 27, 2012, 01:05:59 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 26, 2012, 12:22:52 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 12:02:28 pm

Because I want to know why Dariush wants to lynch Painiac, and because Scelly's vote is still an RVS vote.

Yeah me to, felt like Dariush just voted the person with the most votes, too save him self.

What led you to this conclusion? Could you back it up with reasons of your own Dr.Phibes?

drakon136: You've been absent for most of the extended week, for most of the Mafia Day. Painiac has also been absent.

Why did we go along with that extension again?

Mod: Painiac has his vote on Strategia  :P. It's in his last messed up quote-post.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 27, 2012, 01:49:36 am

Bloody... I should really make something that lets me hard-set someone as having made a vote, as this is getting silly.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on March 27, 2012, 04:43:06 am

Well, you can just ask Painiac to vote Strategia again. And your votecount post says Monday. And awesome flavor.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 27, 2012, 09:03:24 am

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 27, 2012, 12:56:10 am

To prevent something bad happening while I am asleep. (And because I don't really suspect him all that much anymore) Unvote.

Thank you for putting us back on a three-way tie, Scelly. How about another Extend until the tie is broken again.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 27, 2012, 01:47:28 pm

Also, I too think it'd be good to bring in a replacement for drakon.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: drakon136 on March 27, 2012, 05:58:20 pm

:/ Every time I join a mafia game, suddenly lots of important stuff to do. Sorry about being so inactive guys.

Requesting replacement.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 27, 2012, 06:43:24 pm

BullDog will replace drakon136.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/
Post by: BullDog on March 27, 2012, 06:54:22 pm

Here I am! I'm busy right now, but I'll review the day and post later.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 27, 2012, 08:41:22 pm

:I

Great, nothing new from drakon.

Hi Bulldog!

Is this your first time in a BM, have you thoroughly read the rules and the FAQ?

Regardless, if you were a cop, who would you investigate tonight and why would you do so? If you were scum, what would be your general motive behind a NK?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/
Post by: BullDog on March 27, 2012, 08:41:22 pm

Whew.

We don't have enough info.

Scelly, please post more when you get a chance. You have hardly posted so far. Give us your thoughts.

Painiac. You have changed your vote over and over. I got the feeling from my quick review that you didn't care who was lynched in the end, and now you're absent. I think it's best that you're lynched, as your seem scumy to me and if you come up for replacement, we may never catch you.

I hope we get more info tomorrow, as nobody seems outstandingly scumy to me now. I should also have more time then...

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/
Post by: BullDog on March 27, 2012, 09:16:18 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 27, 2012, 08:41:22 pm

:I

Great, nothing new from drakon.

Hi Bulldog!

Is this your first time in a BM, have you thoroughly read the rules and the FAQ?

Regardless, if you were a cop, who would you investigate tonight and why would you do so? If you were scum, what would be your general motive behind a NK?

Sorry, I missed this.
Yes, it is my first time, and yes I have read the rules and faq.
I am busy however, and not sure I can do a good job of playing.
I would investigate MagmaMcFry or you, because I'm having a hard time reading both of you.
I think my motive if scum would be to remove the best player who is not an IC. For that would have people wondering why the ICs are alive, and may help scum win.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 28, 2012, 08:02:54 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 27, 2012, 08:41:22 pm

If you were scum, what would be your general motive behind a NK?

Funny this alomst like my question to Darisuh. Soooo, i think he should answer my question as well.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 08:42:43 am

Almost, but not quite.

Now answer it.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 08:52:39 am

EBWOP:

Great. Avatar changing before my eyes.

Wrong directed question.

But: Dariush, you've been lurking all this time. All the extended, two day time. Answer our 'pointless' questions please.

Also, Dr.Phibes:

Quote from: Tiruin on March 27, 2012, 01:05:59 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 26, 2012, 12:22:52 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 12:02:28 pm

Because I want to know why Dariush wants to lynch Painiac, and because Scelly's vote is still an RVS vote.

Yeah me to, felt like Dariush just voted the person with the most votes, too save him self.

What led you to this conclusion? Could you back it up with reasons of your own Dr.Phibes?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 28, 2012, 09:47:08 am

Okay, I'm back from wasting time in Cogmind and Tribes.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 08:52:39 am

But: Dariush, you've been lurking all this time. All the extended, two day time. Answer our 'pointless' questions please.

Sure. Which ones?

Scelly, since your disappearance you have made whopping three game-related posts, two of them being one-liners and one being a lazyass massread. Whom do you suspect and why?

Those two scumass guys: I voted Painiac because he's scum alongside Dr.Scummes, but my vote on him will do the world more good. Unlike you, I vote people I actually suspect instead of people who are giving me advice.

Tiruin, why did you feel the need to ask the newly replaced-in guy an RVS question?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 28, 2012, 10:08:51 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 08:52:39 am

Also, Dr.Phibes:

Quote from: Tiruin on March 27, 2012, 01:05:59 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 26, 2012, 12:22:52 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 12:02:28 pm

Because I want to know why Dariush wants to lynch Painiac, and because Scelly's vote is still an RVS vote.

Yeah me to, felt like Dariush just voted the person with the most votes, too save him self.

What led you to this conclusion? Could you back it up with reasons of your own Dr.Phibes?

He voted me and told everyone i was the scummiest person here yet he switched vote to Painiac without really say why. I felt he did that just to save himself. So i wanted to now why he switched.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 28, 2012, 11:19:09 am

Votecount!

Dariush [3]: Dr.Phibes, MagmaMcFry, Tiruin
Painiac [3]: Strategia, Dariush, BullDog
Strategia [2]: IronyOwl, Painiac

Not Voting: Scelly9

Day ends today!

---

New topic posted in the Labrador Canine Squad forums: Version 4.54.1 released

Hey everyone! I spent the weekend crushing some bugs that popped up in the new version. Here's a small changelist:

• New armor added! Dog sweaters provide resistance to biting.
• Game actually winnable now: small bug made it impossible for certain chihuahuas to be removed from the Kennel of Representatives.
• Reduced the chance of success of making a sad puppy dog face to escape from dog catchers.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 11:41:30 am

@Dariush (I asked an RVS question to him, even if it is near the end of Day 1, to know part of his supposed attitude, maybe discern what I can from it).


The one IronyOwl asked. The one I asked, Dr.Phibes' then even the one McFry asked.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 26, 2012, 10:38:06 am

Dariush:
You missed a lot of questions, directed at your possible future actions in a given position.

I would like to know how in the world you accuse Dr.Phibes of rolefishing.

Quote from: Dariush on March 26, 2012, 07:52:57 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 23, 2012, 06:15:18 pm

Finally, what I really wanna know is why you jumped straight to OH NO YOU DON'T IF I ANSWER THIS I'LL BE WALKING INTO YOUR TRAP in response. Are you that threatened by Dr.Phibes' dastardly ploy?

Nah, I just refuse to answer rolefishing questions out of principle, especially if they come from certain shitfucking dicks. I wrote out the details so that sane people may get a lesson or two from it, those being Thou shalt not rolefish and Thou shalt not ask utterly pointleth questionth.

You cut out the question part of IronyOwl which I would also like to know.

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 23, 2012, 06:15:18 pm

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 09:14:51 am

Dr.Scummes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 04:00:42 pm

Dariush, if we say you were a scum, who would be your first target and why?

=Snip=

This was a perfectly valid attempt to get inside your head (or at least a rote imitation of such), and you blew it off in an overdefensive huff. I wanna know who you'd kill tonight as scum, because I wanna know who you're currently viewing as a threat and what your current take on a scum strategy would be. While you're at it, I'd like to know who you'd defend as a doc and inspect as a cop.

Where is the rolefishing here in Dr.Phibes question?

Also, why utter your own WIFOM of what scum may do? On that note, why answer that question in advance of what may happen other than saying what you would do straight to the point, as if you're interpreting scum to follow you?

This is a BM, why is it utterly useless to ask that question and what have you to lose by answering it?

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 11:57:54 am

Dariush, what aspects of Painiac's actions have led you to vote for him, and why do you think that they are enough to justify lynching Painiac?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 11:44:04 am

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 27, 2012, 12:56:10 am

...I don't really suspect him all that much anymore) Unvote.

Scelly9: Why, exactly do you not suspect him all that much anymore?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 28, 2012, 11:51:07 am

Quote from: Strategia on March 27, 2012, 09:03:24 am

How about another Extend until the tie is broken again.

So D1 has already lasted more than a week, mostly filled with frantic activity and (attempts at) scumhunting..... That has got to be some kind of record, somewhere.

---

Scelly, I have three questions for you.
1.) Where the hell are you? Why aren't you, well, doing anything in here? If it's because of RL issues that prevent you from participating, could you at least say so and ask for a replacement?
2.) Why did you restore the tie? At this stage, any lynch is better than no lynch, which is what's going to happen unless;
3.) Why the HELL aren't you voting?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 28, 2012, 12:43:41 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 11:44:04 am

Scelly9: Why, exactly do you not suspect him all that much anymore?

Because he was my RVS vote. I hadn't really had time to go through the thread and didn't want him lynched because of my random vote. I have re-read the thread and he does in fact seem rather scummy.

Quote from: Strategia on March 28, 2012, 11:51:07 am

Scelly, I have three questions for you.
1.) Where the hell are you? Why aren't you, well, doing anything in here? If it's because of RL issues that prevent you from participating, could you at least say so and ask for a replacement?
2.) Why did you restore the tie? At this stage, any lynch is better than no lynch, which is what's going to happen unless;
3.) Why the HELL aren't you voting?

1.) Attack of the RL. I've been really busy lately.
2.) Because I did not feel that he should be lynched at the time. It was a random vote and I hadn't had a chance to read the thread.
3.) See 1.

Quote from: Dariush on March 28, 2012, 09:47:08 am

Scelly, since your disappearance you have made whopping three game-related posts, two of them being one-liners and one being a lazyass massread. Whom do you suspect and why?

I currently suspect Painiac. His arguments are weak at best and it appears he has disappeared now that his arguments have been shot down.

Painiac, where are you?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 28, 2012, 12:53:36 pm

Strategia: This is actually pretty normal for BM games for D1 to last a while, as people who drop out immediately are replaced, beginners get used to questioning, and people feel things out.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 29, 2012, 12:26:10 am

Quote from: Think0028 on March 28, 2012, 12:53:36 pm

Strategia: This is actually pretty normal for BM games for D1 to last a while, as people who drop out immediately are replaced, beginners get used to questioning, and people feel things out.

Well, true, but D1s that get to page 12, filled with back-and-forth walls of text and at least partially thought-out scum accusations left and right, that's gotta be something unusual.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 29, 2012, 12:36:29 am

Day extended due to replacement and no opposition to extend request. Day ends Friday.

Strategia: Let me dig around. This is not the worst by far.

Beginner's Mafia XXIX: 16 pages, 9 days for D1.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 29, 2012, 12:54:12 am

Quote from: Think0028 on March 29, 2012, 12:36:29 am

Strategia: Let me dig around. This is not the worst by far.

Beginner's Mafia XXIX: 16 pages, 9 days for D1.

I stand corrected. Although Friday will mean we'll at least match the 9 days.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Darvi on March 29, 2012, 01:18:36 am

You silly people and your 15 posts per page settings.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: IronyOwl on March 29, 2012, 07:00:10 am

So, I appear to have vanished completely instead of helping you all play mafia. My apologies for that.

Unvote. I'm having a great deal of difficulty focusing on this game, unfortunately.


Strategia, could you please summarize your case on Painiac?

Painiac, could you please summarize your case on Strategia?

Dariush, what's going on? Where am I? What do you think of the people voting you?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 29, 2012, 07:42:16 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 29, 2012, 07:00:10 am

Strategia, could you please summarize your case on Painiac?

Quote from: Strategia on March 23, 2012, 09:24:00 pm

Summary of my arguments against Painiac.

- He has been attacking only one target, and an IC at that, with any kind of force for the entire day, right from the get go (until now).
- His attacks on Dariush are based on bullshit.
- His tunnel-vision is hurting town scumhunting efforts.
- If he isn't scum, he's very scummy town, and needs to go as well.

Ergo; my vote stays firmly on Painiac.

To clarify my first point; Painiac's opening statement was deeply flawed, Dariush called him out on it, and Painiac pursued Dariush basically for IC'ing from then on. Also, he has only been laying into Dariush, until I started calling him out on it, at which point he voted Tiruin for some reason and then voted me.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 29, 2012, 08:19:42 am

Ugh. I think it's already past the deadline.

Dariush hasn't replied with those needed answers.

Paniac has gone inactive for five whole days.

. . .

This is normal for a BM?  :'(

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on March 29, 2012, 09:17:27 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 29, 2012, 08:19:42 am

Ugh. I think it's already past the deadline.

Quote from: Think0028 on March 29, 2012, 12:36:29 am

Day extended due to replacement and no opposition to extend request. Day ends Friday.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/
Post by: BullDog on March 29, 2012, 09:19:17 am

Ugh, it's like everything decided to happen at once in RL. I'm can't guarantee activity for a while, so I have to request replacement.
It's so stupid that I have to drop out right after getting in. :'(

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 29, 2012, 09:34:37 am

Quote from: Urist Imiknorris on March 29, 2012, 09:17:27 am

Quote from: Tiruin on March 29, 2012, 08:19:42 am

Ugh. I think it's already past the deadline.

Quote from: Think0028 on March 29, 2012, 12:36:29 am

Day extended due to replacement and no opposition to extend request. Day ends Friday.

I'm blind...

Well, at least the two posters on the New Player's thread will have a chance, as I think Painiac might be replaced? Either way, he has a lot of explaining to do.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dariush on March 29, 2012, 10:28:48 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on March 29, 2012, 07:00:10 am

Dariush, what's going on? Where am I? What do you think of the people voting you?

Dunno, in hell, respectively 66% chance of being scum,  66% chance of being scum, probably town.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 11:41:30 am

I would like to know how in the world you accuse Dr.Phibes of rolefishing.

By typing on my keyboard 'D,r,.,S,c,u,m,m,e,s, ,y,o,u, ,a,r,e, ,a, ,r,o,l,e,f,i,s,h,i,n,g, ,p,i,e,c,e, ,o,f, ,s,h,i,t'. With my fingers.
Oh, you mean my reasons. I already explained them. Asking whom somebody would NK is that bad practice, even if the term 'rolefishing' doesn't exactly apply. I guess this would be 'asking a question with intention to tunnel the answerer depending on the answer'. 'Rolefishing' is shorter, so why not use it.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 11:41:30 am

You cut out the question part of IronyOwl which I would also like to know.

Oh, I thought that question was rhetorical. As someone said, 'Only stupid people fear nothing' or something along those lines, so yeah, I am moooortally terrified of him.

Quote from: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 11:41:30 am

This was a perfectly valid attempt to get inside your head (or at least a rote imitation of such), and you blew it off in an overdefensive huff. I wanna know who you'd kill tonight as scum, because I wanna know who you're currently viewing as a threat and what your current take on a scum strategy would be. While you're at it, I'd like to know who you'd defend as a doc and inspect as a cop.

Well, if I was in a good mood, I'd probably kill either Scummiac or Dr.Scummes (whoever of them isn't scum) to let town scumhunt without those bleating assholes in their way, but since I am not in a good mood, I'd kill either you, Urist or Irony because people with even a smallest bit of experience are more of a threat than newbies or the Three Cretins™. Do you want my current take on scum strategy as it is right now of how would I strategize as scum?

Quote from: Tiruin on March 28, 2012, 11:41:30 am

Also, why utter your own WIFOM of what scum may do? On that note, why answer that question in advance of what may happen other than saying what you would do straight to the point, as if you're interpreting scum to follow you?

This is a BM, why is it utterly useless to ask that question and what have you to lose by answering it?

My remark was not WIFOM since I outlined what would scum do with my answer. Yes, this is a BM, and my plain answer wouldn't have helped anyone. Outlining why this is a bad idea would.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 11:57:54 am

Dariush, what aspects of Painiac's actions have led you to vote for him, and why do you think that they are enough to justify lynching Painiac?

He managed to single me out as 'stinking of scum' after a whopping one post made by me which mostly consisted of pointing out mistakes, overreacted horrifically and then things got worse.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on March 29, 2012, 11:46:48 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 29, 2012, 10:28:48 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 11:57:54 am

Dariush, what aspects of Painiac's actions have led you to vote for him, and why do you think that they are enough to justify lynching Painiac?

He managed to single me out as 'stinking of scum' after a whopping one post made by me which mostly consisted of pointing out mistakes, overreacted horrifically and then things got worse.

*Cough* Hypocrite

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 29, 2012, 12:06:02 pm

Quote from: Dariush on March 29, 2012, 10:28:48 am

but since I am not in a good mood, I'd kill either you, Urist or Irony because people with even a smallest bit of experience are more of a threat than newbies or the Three Cretins™.

There's no Urist in this game. Imiknorris is posting as an outsider.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 29, 2012, 11:46:48 am

Quote from: Dariush on March 29, 2012, 10:28:48 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on March 26, 2012, 11:57:54 am

Dariush, what aspects of Painiac's actions have led you to vote for him, and why do you think that they are enough to justify lynching Painiac?

He managed to single me out as 'stinking of scum' after a whopping one post made by me which mostly consisted of pointing out mistakes, overreacted horrifically and then things got worse.

*Cough* Hypocrite

Painiac first. You? A close second.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 29, 2012, 12:11:20 pm

PPE: Strategia

Phibes

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 29, 2012, 11:46:48 am

*Cough* Hypocrite

Explain how? In your own words or with quotes.

Scelly9:

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 28, 2012, 12:43:41 pm

Quote from: Dariush on March 28, 2012, 09:47:08 am

Scelly, since your disappearance you have made whopping three game-related posts, two of them being one-liners and one being a lazyass massread. Whom do you suspect and why?

I currently suspect Painiac. His arguments are weak at best and it appears he has disappeared now that his arguments have been shot down.

Painiac, where are you?

How weak is *weak*? What exactly do you see in his arguments that make them so?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 30, 2012, 07:35:19 pm

Wow. So much for being a hub of activity. Mod, timecount?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 30, 2012, 10:26:06 pm

Huh, both my targets for questioning fail to reply yet are active.

Quote from: Strategia on March 30, 2012, 07:35:19 pm

Wow. So much for being a hub of activity.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Strategia on March 31, 2012, 07:49:17 pm

*chirp*chirp*chirp*

.....hello? Mod? Anyone?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Scelly9 on March 31, 2012, 07:55:18 pm

The day was over yesterday.....

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Tiruin on March 31, 2012, 09:12:21 pm

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 31, 2012, 07:55:18 pm

The day was over yesterday.....

It was, but you were active long before that. :I

Anyway, yes, this should have ended.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: IronyOwl on March 31, 2012, 09:24:01 pm

This is shameful and I feel ashamed.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 31, 2012, 09:58:29 pm

Sorry everyone, I fell ill yesterday and have only been able to come back to the forums today. Day has in fact ended.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on March 31, 2012, 10:02:55 pm

The day is over!

It's been decided that Painiac is to be permabanned! For what offense, you might ask?

For the offense of posting spoilers for Weight Change 3!

Unfortunately, FroggyTwo mentions nothing about abuses of mod power in the subsequent ban message. Seems like he was innocent after all.

Painiac has been lynched! He was town!

Power roles, mafia, send me your actions.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N1 - I Am The Very Model of a Moderator [8/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 02, 2012, 01:23:22 am

Day 2 has begun! It ends Wednesday!

As the moderators log in once more, they find two events of note that happened over the weekend.

1) Tiruin's account has been mysteriously deleted, and his IP address permabanned.

2) FroggyTwo sent a PM asking who banned his IP address from the forums. Seems Tiruin was his little brother. While the affair is sorted out promptly, Tiruin is still unable to access the boards anymore, and FroggyTwo, due to some familial conflict, is unwilling to restore his access.

Ah well, back to work!

Tiruin has died! He was the cop!

Many apologies for my unprofessional tardiness last day. I fell sick Thursday evening and in an unrelated accident had a quite painful short-term foot injury. I've since recovered, thankfully.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 02, 2012, 02:25:51 am

TROLOLOL.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Tiruin on April 02, 2012, 06:48:03 am

Darvi. It was you! >:(

Spoiler: The Flavor of a Moderator! (Flavor Bah!) (click to show/hide)

Tiruin strode down the Oaken stairs, whistling a merry tune and turned right to check the clock. 12Am, Midnight. Perfect.

He went back up the stairs and slowly opened the door, checking to hear any signs or sounds of other people. There were none. With a smile, he snuck up to the opened laptop and double clicked Mozilla Fyrefox, navigating to the safehome of Baytwelve.


Welcome, Guest

---

---

Please login or register.

Username:FroggyTwo
Password: **-
Minutes to stay logged in: 3153600
Always stay logged in: ✔
. . .
Your account has been banned.

"Oh S-..."

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 09:44:37 am

Nothing has changed except the majority was wrong on Painiac, so my vote is still on Darisuh.

Darisuh, why did you vote on Painiac when you said i was the most scummy in this game? You know, dont bother answer beacuse i know you have problems with that. I will make this alot easier for you and answer it myself. Beacuse you are scum, you suspected me beacuse you thought i would be an easy target, but when your ass was on deep water you quickly changed to Painiac. You have done nothing productive and are the worst IC EVER. You are just suspecting those who suspect you wich feels like a scumtell to me. Inb4 you vote me, why am i scum? Would actually be nice if you answerd that question. If you do however vote me you either suck at scumhunting or you are scum. Even if you are a town you should stop think you are the best mafia player in the world, knowing whos scum and whos not, beacuse you clearly dont know. Off topic, why is roleplaying so bad? doesnt Book do it all the time?



I have an idea to. We all know Tiruin didnt think Darisuh was scum, maybe he said to Darisuh he was the cop and then Darisuh killed him? Just thinking out loud.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Tiruin on April 02, 2012, 09:51:57 am

Not to interrupt but-...

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 09:44:37 am

I have an idea to. We all know Tiruin didnt think Darisuh was scum, maybe he said to Darisuh he was the cop and then Darisuh killed him? Just thinking out loud.

Ouch.

Quote from: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

You may not PM other players other than the mod.

Also, Book does it because it is in the context of the specific Mafia game. Take Cybrid Mafia for example, RP'ing is needed.

You cannot RP in the BM, as here you learn the basics of mafia. Flavor is flavor.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 10:06:21 am

Quote from: Tiruin on April 02, 2012, 09:51:57 am

Not to interrupt but-...

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 09:44:37 am

I have an idea to. We all know Tiruin didnt think Darisuh was scum, maybe he said to Darisuh he was the cop and then Darisuh killed him? Just thinking out loud.

Ouch.

Quote from: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

You may not PM other players other than the mod.

Also, Book does it because it is in the context of the specific Mafia game. Take Cybrid Mafia for example, RP'ing is needed.

You cannot RP in the BM, as here you learn the basics of mafia. Flavor is flavor.

Okey, sry for that one...

Can you please explain more about the ouch part? Or maybe you shouldnt, that ouch meant something like, i was out of track.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Tiruin on April 02, 2012, 10:07:54 am

You cannot get answers out of those who are dead/non-playing. They will not answer if it is related to the game.

That was a side-comment. Do not think about what I've said anymore. Please.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 02, 2012, 10:24:00 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 09:44:37 am

Darisuh, why did you vote on Painiac when you said i was the most scummy in this game? You know, dont bother answer beacuse i know you have problems with that. I will make this alot easier for you and answer it myself. Beacuse you are scum, you suspected me beacuse you thought i would be an easy target, but when your ass was on deep water you quickly changed to Painiac. You have done nothing productive and are the worst IC EVER. You are just suspecting those who suspect you wich feels like a scumtell to me. Inb4 you vote me, why am i scum? Would actually be nice if you answerd that question. If you do however vote me you either suck at scumhunting or you are scum. Even if you are a town you should stop think you are the best mafia player in the world, knowing whos scum and whos not, beacuse you clearly dont know. Off topic, why is roleplaying so bad? doesnt Book do it all the time?

That is the most incoherent, illogical pile of drivel I have seen in a while, Dr.Phibes.

Quote

I have an idea to. We all know Tiruin didnt think Darisuh was scum, maybe he said to Darisuh he was the cop and then Darisuh killed him? Just thinking out loud.

Then again, this sentence indicates that you have absolutely no idea of how Mafia works, on a very basic level. Given that you've already displayed your ignorance several times before, I kinda doubt that Darvi is telling you to do this, so you may just be a massively incompetent noobish newbie, rather than scum. But since you're still dripping scum like you just took a swim in the duck pond, I'll keep my vote on you for now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 11:49:42 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 02, 2012, 10:24:00 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 09:44:37 am

Darisuh, why did you vote on Painiac when you said i was the most scummy in this game? You know, dont bother answer beacuse i know you have problems with that. I will make this alot easier for you and answer it myself. Beacuse you are scum, you suspected me beacuse you thought i would be an easy target, but when your ass was on deep water you quickly changed to Painiac. You have done nothing productive and are the worst IC EVER. You are just suspecting those who suspect you wich feels like a scumtell to me. Inb4 you vote me, why am i scum? Would actually be nice if you answerd that question. If you do however vote me you either suck at scumhunting or you are scum. Even if you are a town you should stop think you are the best mafia player in the world, knowing whos scum and whos not, beacuse you clearly dont know. Off topic, why is roleplaying so bad? doesnt Book do it all the time?

That is the most incoherent, illogical pile of drivel I have seen in a while, Dr.Phibes.

Quote

I have an idea to. We all know Tiruin didnt think Darisuh was scum, maybe he said to Darisuh he was the cop and then Darisuh killed him? Just thinking out loud.

Then again, this sentence indicates that you have absolutely no idea of how Mafia works, on a very basic level. Given that you've already displayed your ignorance several times before, I kinda doubt that Darvi is telling you to do this, so you may just be a massively incompetent noobish newbie, rather than scum. But since you're still dripping scum like you just took a swim in the duck pond, I'll keep my vote on you for now.

Well the last thing is kinda wrong suspcting me for. I said thinking out loud, i could just have kept it to myself, but shared it just to see what people thought.

Strategia, How can you have so wrong? I dont know how to defend myself against baseless accusations, so you will prolly never take that vote down. But have it your way, dont really care if i die. Cant really do much, i write really bad and are noob, you guys dont really listen of what i have to say in the first place.

Strategia, why do you defend Dariush all the time?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dariush on April 02, 2012, 12:09:46 pm

If you call me Darisuh one more time I'll stop being cute and fluffy and become a murderous maniac.

Note that I said that I considered you two equally scummy. But yes, now you are the most scummy, Dr.Phibes. (also nice fail at taunting)

Oh, and on the IC thing. I tried to be my usual helpful IC-self (as I've been doing and succeeding for... three BMs, if memory serves me correctly), but you three assfuckers barged in and decided to play wiseasses. Since Tiruin and (probably) Strategia don't need leading by the hand anymore and Bulldog has only replaced in, I don't see why I should be a good Samaritan.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 12:13:16 pm

Quote from: Dariush on April 02, 2012, 12:09:46 pm

If you call me Darisuh one more time I'll stop being cute and fluffy and become a murderous maniac.

Note that I said that I considered you two equally scummy. But yes, now you are the most scummy, Dr.Phibes. (also nice fail at taunting)

Oh, and on the IC thing. I tried to be my usual helpful IC-self (as I've been doing and succeeding for... three BMs, if memory serves me correctly), but you three assfuckers barged in and decided to play wiseasses. Since Tiruin and (probably) Strategia don't need leading by the hand anymore and Bulldog has only replaced in, I don't see why I should be a good Samaritan.

Dariush

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 12:33:08 pm

Quote from: Dariush on April 02, 2012, 12:09:46 pm

If you call me Darisuh one more time I'll stop being cute and fluffy and become a murderous maniac.

Note that I said that I considered you two equally scummy. But yes, now you are the most scummy, Dr.Phibes. (also nice fail at taunting)

Oh, and on the IC thing. I tried to be my usual helpful IC-self (as I've been doing and succeeding for... three BMs, if memory serves me correctly), but you three assfuckers barged in and decided to play wiseasses. Since Tiruin and (probably) Strategia don't need leading by the hand anymore and Bulldog has only replaced in, I don't see why I should be a good Samaritan.

(Fail! Happened to click post instead of preview)
Darisuh, There you did it again. You voted on me beacuse i suspect you. Both of you just votes on me beacuse what i wrote was bad, you havent really said why you both voted on me except " Herp derp hes SCUMMM". And what! Taunting you? I was simpply telling the truth. I said it before, you are either terrible at scumhunting or scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 02, 2012, 12:54:14 pm

Dariush, since the beginning of this game, you have done absolutely no coherent scumhunting. All you're doing is "ICing" in your own twisted way (overreacting, insulting and being hypocritical), answering questions (or not), and voting people for washy reasons. You are expected to play this game. You are not a non-playing IC. Play the damn game.

Also, "You are scummy" is not the same as "I don't like you". You are repeatedly failing to notice the difference. Also, "You are scummy" is not a good reason. I think you are able to be more specific. I also think that you were able to be more specific the whole time. But if you had been more specific, people would have noticed sooner that your "reasons" are complete and utter "I vote you because I hate you" bullshit.

IronyOwl, I expect you to do something too. You are also not a non-playing IC, and this game should be of at least some importance to you. If you can't play, ask to be replaced. If you can play, then don't hold back, we'll learn something.

Scelly9, you're also not contributing. During the last BM you were substantially more active, stating your opinion even if you didn't have something important to say.

---

---

Dr.Phibes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 10:06:21 am

Quote from: Tiruin on April 02, 2012, 09:51:57 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 09:44:37 am

I have an idea to. We all know Tiruin didnt think Darisuh was scum, maybe he said to Darisuh he was the cop and then Darisuh killed him? Just thinking out loud.

Ouch.

Can you please explain more about the ouch part? Or maybe you shouldnt, that ouch meant something like, i was out of track.

You may not PM other players other than the mod:

Quote from: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

You may not PM other players other than the mod.

This means that if Tiruin told Dariush that he was a cop, then we would have seen it. All game-related discussion must be held in this thread or scumchat/deadchat.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 11:49:42 am

Well the last thing is kinda wrong suspcting me for. I said thinking out loud, i could just have kept it to myself, but shared it just to see what people thought.

Yes, the last thing is not a reason to suspect you for, but it shows that you don't fully understand the game's rules. Have some rules. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3107257#msg3107257)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 02, 2012, 01:11:38 pm

Quote from: Dariush on April 02, 2012, 12:09:46 pm

If you call me Darisuh one more time I'll stop being cute and fluffy and become a murderous maniac.

Okay, who gave him a time machine?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 02, 2012, 02:10:06 pm

I will.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 02, 2012, 02:51:54 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 11:49:42 am

Well the last thing is kinda wrong suspcting me for. I said thinking out loud, i could just have kept it to myself, but shared it just to see what people thought.

That's the part I meant that was more a noobtell of tremendous intensity. As several others have noted before me, players cannot communicate with one another. Also, your attempt to read the nightkill is facepalmingly atrocious, it stands to WIFOM as WIFOM stands to actual scumhunting.

Quote

Strategia, How can you have so wrong? I dont know how to defend myself against baseless accusations, so you will prolly never take that vote down. But have it your way, dont really care if i die. Cant really do much, i write really bad and are noob, you guys dont really listen of what i have to say in the first place.

.....okay then, I don't really have much of anything to say here.

Quote

Strategia, why do you defend Dariush all the time?

Because I took a meta standpoint and approached this like a Beginners' Mafia, rather than just any other regular game of Mafia. If this had been any other game of Mafia, I wouldn't have given two shits about Painiac's opener, nor his constant pursuit of Dariush. But since this is a BM, and Dariush is one of the two ICs the town might have, and an active one at that, while scum always has a private IC, Painiac's attempts to railroad Dariush right from the start looked like an attack on the town where they're most vulnerable. Furthermore, like I said, Dariush never really passes up an opportunity to call those opposed to him "goatfuckers" and the like, so I thought there was an entirely realistic possibility that Darvi was urging the scum to intentionally aggravate Dariush, thus confusing noobtown and leading them to vote Dariush and why am I laying out my suspicions right here where the scum can read them.

It's always important to take note of the particular type of Mafia game you're in, and adjust your play accordingly. Therefore, since this is a BM, I play it like a BM, which is why I chainsawed Painiac - not because he was going after Dariush the player, but because he was going after Dariush the IC.

Although I did start to get some doubts as to Painiac's scumminess towards the end of D1, I really just wanted that phase to be over with, and I really did want Painiac out of the way. So far, I want you, Dr.Phibes, out of the way as well, which is why I'm voting you; however, as the day develops, I may switch targets to someone else. Truth be told, I was considering opening up a line of investigation into Tiruin on D2, since he's more experienced than anyone here other than the BMs, but since Tiruin flipped cop during the nightkill (I strongly suspect he was cleared out precisely because of his experience) that's now a moot point.

For the time being, I'll observe everyone else, reply to any questions and ask any questions that come to mind. I have no intention to stop scumhunting. I'll definitely be paying attention to Magma and Dariush, at least. I'm also planning to do a re-read of D1 to see if I've missed anything and maybe develop some further suspicions based on what I find.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 02, 2012, 03:22:36 pm

Dr. Phibes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 02, 2012, 09:44:37 am

I have an idea to. We all know Tiruin didnt think Darisuh was scum, maybe he said to Darisuh he was the cop and then Darisuh killed him? Just thinking out loud.

As others have mentioned, this isn't possible. Even if it was, however, it'd be bad logic.

WIFOM is attempting to guess at someone's reasoning and motivations when they know you'll be guessing at their reasoning and motivations. The result is an infinite circle of:

He'd want to do this...
...but he'd know I'd know that, so he'd do the opposite to throw me for a loop...
...but he'd know I'd be expecting him to throw me for a loop, so he'd just do the most obvious thing...
...but he'd know I'd know he was trying to double-fake me out, so he'd do the exact opposite again...

and so on and so forth. What's more, often it's not even as simple as that- someone could have a completely different line of reasoning than you're thinking they do, meaning your speculation is worthless from the very start.

In the example you just gave, for instance, you were thinking in terms of Tiruin's role as it relates to Dariush. But what if Tiruin wasn't killed because he was a cop? What if he was killed because he was a good player, or suspected or didn't suspect a specific person? If you start off thinking "Hey, scum would want to do this" and you're wrong, you never even make it into the pointless "but he'd know that I'd know that he knew that I knew" loop and are wrong and pointless from the very start.


Thus, unless you have a damned good reason otherwise, do not attempt to read into nightkills. It may seem tempting, but there's really too many variables to get any kind of a meaningful answer out of it.



McFry:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 02, 2012, 12:54:14 pm

IronyOwl, I expect you to do something too. You are also not a non-playing IC, and this game should be of at least some importance to you. If you can't play, ask to be replaced. If you can play, then don't hold back, we'll learn something.

I know, this is terrible.



Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on April 02, 2012, 02:51:54 pm

Because I took a meta standpoint and approached this like a Beginners' Mafia, rather than just any other regular game of Mafia. If this had been any other game of Mafia, I wouldn't have given two shits about Painiac's opener, nor his constant pursuit of Dariush. But since this is a BM, and Dariush is one of the two ICs the town might have, and an active one at that, while scum always has a private IC, Painiac's attempts to railroad Dariush right from the start looked like an attack on the town where they're most vulnerable. Furthermore, like I said, Dariush never really passes up an opportunity to call those opposed to him "goatfuckers" and the like, so I thought there was an entirely realistic possibility that Darvi was urging the scum to intentionally aggravate Dariush, thus confusing noobtown and leading them to vote Dariush and why am I laying out my suspicions right here where the scum can read them.

It's always important to take note of the particular type of Mafia game you're in, and adjust your play accordingly. Therefore, since this is a BM, I play it like a BM, which is why I chainsawed Painiac - not because he was going after Dariush the player, but because he was going after Dariush the IC.

But what made you think Dariush wasn't scum? Or rather, what made you think Painiac's opener was a malicious attempt on a town IC, and not something else?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 02, 2012, 07:03:35 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 02, 2012, 03:22:36 pm

But what made you think Dariush wasn't scum? Or rather, what made you think Painiac's opener was a malicious attempt on a town IC, and not something else?

I'm not sure about Dariush, like I said I'll be looking closely at what he's posted so far and I may start questioning him as well. As for Painiac's opener, I didn't particularly think much of it at the time; note that I only started to go after Painiac here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3121473#msg3121473), and I'd already gone through RVS and hounded Phibes for a bit. In the end, it wasn't just the opener itself that stuck with me; it was the way he handled it. He seemed to be goading Dariush, and that, with his announcement (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3116249#msg3116249) that he had at least some insight into Dariush' meta, seemed a little off. It looked like Painiac was deliberately trying to get Dariush to explode, then shout "LOOK! SCUM!" to confuse the noobtown and make them think that foul language is somehow a scumtell.

As for why I think it's a deliberate attempt at a town IC, well, apart from admittedly falling for the gambler's fallacy (as Dariush himself pointed out), like I said, Dariush is an active IC, and it doesn't take a whole lot of research to find out that he's prone to colourful verbiage, especially when confronted with apparent stupidity and/or outright baiting. It would thus be easy to set up a situation where Dariush goes off like a firework, a situation which the scum could easily exploit to get Dariush lynched. Because ICs are supposed to be neutral when IC'ing, even scum ICs can help town scumhunt (and scum ICs could play noobtown like a fiddle and have them lynch whoever they want; since Dariush has explicitly refused to point out targets on several occasions, I consider this a point in his favour). Town ICs are scum magnets, because with (active) ICs gone, scum has a much easier time muddying the waters and winning the game. I've seen several references in earlier BMs to this tendency of ICs to die either at the end of D1 or during N1; therefore, Painiac's single-minded pursuit of Dariush, which led to a minor bandwagon, looked like a(n admittedly clumsily handled) scum ploy to me.

However, Painiac flipping town and Tiruin getting brutally murdered means that there is a level playing field of sorts. I'll be taking a good look at everyone who was active D1 (Dariush, Phibes and Magma), and hopefully I'll also get more information out of Scelly and Bulldog, oh wait, doing a quick re-read to see if I missed anyone revealed this

Quote from: BullDog on March 29, 2012, 09:19:17 am

Ugh, it's like everything decided to happen at once in RL. I'm can't guarantee activity for a while, so I have to request replacement.
It's so stupid that I have to drop out right after getting in. :'(

Mod, can we get a replacement or a modkill here?

Anyway, to summarise I'll basically try to look into everyone who's still playing. Although I stand by my position of getting rid of Phibes, I'm not actually entirely sure he's scum or just incredibly nooby, laconic newbtown, so I'll happily lynch someone else if I think I've found proper scum. If I don't, well, sucks to be Phibes then because I'll still want him gone. My order of preference goes "Pretty sure they're scum -> Phibes -> might be scum, not sure -> pretty sure they're town". And tbqh, Phibes hasn't really done much to lower his position on that list.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 03, 2012, 02:26:18 am

zomara0292 has replaced in for BullDog. Day ends Wednesday.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on April 03, 2012, 02:31:41 am

Votecount!

Dr.Phibes [2]: Strategia, Dariush
Dariush [2]: MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes

Not Voting: Scelly9, IronyOwl, zomara0292

Day ends Wednesday!

---

New topic posted in the Labrador Canine Squad forums: Proposed mod for the game: Cats

We have labradors and chihuahuas, why not expand the animal axis to also include calico cats? They could strike and swing the issues away from whoever currently has an advantage, and could in time become a third enemy you have to fight for representation. Maybe add new issues, like fair distribution of the treats?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end. As a new guy, I don't want to make my first choice a bad one. But for the sake of continuing the questioning,
Phibes why did you feel the need to answer your own question and not leave at least a second for Dariush to defend himself?

Dariush, what is it that Phibes has against you? I don't quite get it.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 03, 2012, 08:37:07 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end. As a new guy, I don't want to make my first choice a bad one. But for the sake of continuing the questioning,
Phibes why did you feel the need to answer your own question and not leave at least a second for Dariush to defend himself?

Dariush, what is it that Phibes has against you? I don't quite get it.

Not going to be like that, but have you read all the posts? Well, he never answer my questions. Thats why a answered it for him, but however he is free to answer me anytime. Sadly, i doubt he will and if he do answer me he would probably just dodge it and give me a question.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 09:50:26 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 03, 2012, 08:37:07 am

Not going to be like that, but have you read all the posts? Well, he never answer my questions. Thats why a answered it for him, but however he is free to answer me anytime. Sadly, i doubt he will and if he do answer me he would probably just dodge it and give me a question.

To tell the truth, I drifted in and out. My attention span is quite short today.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on April 04, 2012, 12:03:23 am

Votecount!

Dr.Phibes [2]: Strategia, Dariush
Dariush [2]: MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes

Not Voting: Scelly9, IronyOwl, zomara0292

Day ends Wednesday!

---

...

That's weird. No one posted a new thread in the LCS forums today? At all?

I blame the chihuahuas. Freakin' chihuahuas.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 04, 2012, 01:44:16 am

Also, everyone that isn't zomara or Dr.Phibes is officially prodded. If none of you post within 24 hours, then you will all be forcibly replaced.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 08:47:58 am

I'm here, and I still vote Dariush. Extend.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dariush on April 04, 2012, 11:40:07 am

Having a shitty week at school. Activity is correspondingly shitty.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end. As a new guy, I don't want to make my first choice a bad one. But for the sake of continuing the questioning,
Phibes why did you feel the need to answer your own question and not leave at least a second for Dariush to defend himself?

Dariush, what is it that Phibes has against you? I don't quite get it.

Firstly, FoSing before voting is generally seen as highly passive and noncommital (especially from those who are being FoSed), since the lack of a vote puts less pressure into the FoS. It's kinda hard to explain, but in general it should be avoided. Secondly, FoSing the same people is pointless and, if anything, does the opposite effect due to those being FoSed perceiving you as less of a threat due to you not using FoSes properly. Thirdly, withholding the vote is a bad idea because you may easily miss the deadline, but if you do vote you can change it to a more scummy target whenever you want easily.

To answer your question, Dr.Scummes has against me the complete and blinding vomitshitfucking idiocy on his part that may only come from either: 1) a complete lack of a brain; 2) being retarded to such an extent that certain species of flies may be considered geniuses compared to him; 3) having the bladder in place of the brain and the anus in place of his mouth so he can only spew utter bullshit however much he tries to do otherwise. Not that he would want to. Due to being unable to want otherwise. Due to having a bladder in place of his brain.

Okay, I got kinda carried away there.

Seriously though, I don't know what he has against me. And have no way of knowing, really.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 11:54:41 am

Quote from: Dariush on April 04, 2012, 11:40:07 am

I don't know what he has against me. And have no way of knowing, really.

You could try asking him. Or looking at your behaviour. Or reading through the thread.

Quote from: Dariush on April 04, 2012, 11:40:07 am

Okay, I got kinda carried away there.

You should sig that, so it appears in all your posts.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 04, 2012, 12:05:49 pm

I am also here, I just didn't have a whole lot I wanted to say/ask. Also, since we have a tie and three people aren't voting, Extend.

---

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 03, 2012, 08:37:07 am

Not going to be like that, but have you read all the posts? Well, he never answer my questions. Thats why a answered it for him, but however he is free to answer me anytime. Sadly, i doubt he will and if he do answer me he would probably just dodge it and give me a question.

That's why you keep asking and pushing. Answering your own questions is one of the worst things you could do in Mafia, apart from voting yourself or outing yourself as scum, since it contributes absolutely nothing to scumhunting.

So why don't you keep asking? Why don't you push? Why are you so lazy that you just don't bother anymore? See, this is part of the reason why I'm voting you - you contribute nothing to scumhunting, which, fyi, actively helps scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 12:16:21 pm

Strategia does have a point. This is my first game, and, thus far, the only things I can think of that will help a scum, which are what I am using in my scum hinting, is pointing fingers at random, throwing back questions with suspicion without even attempting to answer the question, or dogging specific persons without letup. On little to no cause(grounds?), that is.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 12:18:49 pm

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end.

Also, I am still voting. Just trying to gather as much information before I do so.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Shakerag on April 04, 2012, 12:27:02 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 11:54:41 am

Quote from: Dariush on April 04, 2012, 11:40:07 am

Okay, I got kinda carried away there.

You should sig that, so it appears in all your posts.

Bah hah hah!  So absolutely sigged.  >_>  I'll go now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 04, 2012, 12:50:45 pm

Extend.


Magma:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 08:47:58 am

I'm here, and I still vote Dariush. Extend.

Who's your second scumpick?


Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on April 04, 2012, 11:40:07 am

Having a shitty week at school. Activity is correspondingly shitty.

Yet you're not voting to extend. Why not?

Quote from: Dariush on April 04, 2012, 11:40:07 am

Okay, I got kinda carried away there.

Seriously though, I don't know what he has against me. And have no way of knowing, really.

These two might be more of an answer than you think. Maybe he's voting you for being foul-mouthed, passive scum with no interest in doing anything but plenty of time to rant elaborately in place of anything constructive? If I'm reading this correctly, for instance, you don't even know what your top scumpick's case on you is, but it's either the primary or only thing you're willing to lynch him for. Do you even have a second scumpick, now that Painiac's gone?


Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on April 04, 2012, 12:05:49 pm

I am also here, I just didn't have a whole lot I wanted to say/ask. Also, since we have a tie and three people aren't voting, Extend.

I thought you said you were going to continue scumhunting, though. In light of not scumhunting, doesn't this post:

Spoiler: Post (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Strategia on April 02, 2012, 02:51:54 pm

For the time being, I'll observe everyone else, reply to any questions and ask any questions that come to mind. I have no intention to stop scumhunting. I'll definitely be paying attention to Magma and Dariush, at least. I'm also planning to do a re-read of D1 to see if I've missed anything and maybe develop some further suspicions based on what I find.

seem a bit like trying to let everyone know you'll be activelurking but that's okay and they should ignore that?



Phibes, second scumpick? If you're positive you want to lynch Dariush today, why not get started on finding more scum? Sitting on your hands with a vote isn't usually any better than sitting on your hands without one, especially when your case is less "I'm positive he's scum because of this and this" and more "He won't answer questions so I can't tell if he's scum."


zomara: Don't forget a vote's use as pressure and statement of intent. Why is it you don't want to vote a suspect until you're sure? When do you think you'll be ready?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 01:00:57 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 04, 2012, 12:50:45 pm

zomara: Don't forget a vote's use as pressure and statement of intent. Why is it you don't want to vote a suspect until you're sure? When do you think you'll be ready?

I present, to your eye of suspicion, this one and only fact that might keep me from getting lynched my first day. I am new at this, and have been familiar with this type of forum gaming for less than a week. If you were throwing yourself into a situation, would you not wait and watch and see were to turn, first, before casting yourself to the ever undecided waves of change?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 01:07:43 pm

Man, that came out better than I though.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Scelly9 on April 04, 2012, 01:36:19 pm

I'm still here. Life has been hell, I'll post later today.

Extend

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Strategia:

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 04, 2012, 12:50:45 pm

Magma:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 08:47:58 am

I'm here, and I still vote Dariush. Extend.

Who's your second scumpick?

My favourite scumtell is people not being constructively active when they could be. Dariush is not constructively active at all, but he's clearly in this thread frequently.
Currently, my second scumpick is Scelly. He's posting in the forum games forum for about 10 hours non-stop every day. Last BM, he had a completely different attitude that even made him get NK'd on N1 (I know that reading the NK is WIFOM, but I don't think that he would have even been considered as NK if he'd shown his current behaviour in the last BM). His behaviour clearly doesn't match up, and it has no reason not to, since he obviously has lots of time on his hands.

Zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 01:00:57 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 04, 2012, 12:50:45 pm

zomara: Don't forget a vote's use as pressure and statement of intent. Why is it you don't want to vote a suspect until you're sure? When do you think you'll be ready?

I present, to your eye of suspicion, this one and only fact that might keep me from getting lynched my first day. I am new at this, and have been familiar with this type of forum gaming for less than a week. If you were throwing yourself into a situation, would you not wait and watch and see were to turn, first, before casting yourself to the ever undecided waves of change?

You can change your vote anytime you want. So it does not hurt at all to just vote somebody for pressure, and vote somebody else later because he's more suspicious. RVS is all about this, and even though you can't just choose your vote randomly at this stage, you can at least indicate who you currently find suspicious, and you can do it with a vote to apply pressure. Just like IronyOwl said.
IronyOwl's an IC, you can trust him in this situation. Now vote somebody.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 01:07:43 pm

Man, that came out better than I though.

Why is your own image so important to you? You're not voting because you think it could look bad on you if you do (even though you should vote). You're explaining your actions with newbieness, yet you do nothing to correct your actions, instead you're congratulating yourself on your relatively well-written posts (that show that you are a newb). Do you remember this:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end. As a new guy, I don't want to make my first choice a bad one.

That was your first choice, and it was a bad one.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 02:04:24 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end. As a new guy, I don't want to make my first choice a bad one.

That was your first choice, and it was a bad one.

Hmmm. . . . . . . Point, well, taken. Give me a moment to go through this and I will vote. . . . . . someone.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 04, 2012, 02:14:52 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 04, 2012, 12:50:45 pm

I thought you said you were going to continue scumhunting, though. In light of not scumhunting, doesn't this post:

Spoiler: Post (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Strategia on April 02, 2012, 02:51:54 pm

For the time being, I'll observe everyone else, reply to any questions and ask any questions that come to mind. I have no intention to stop scumhunting. I'll definitely be paying attention to Magma and Dariush, at least. I'm also planning to do a re-read of D1 to see if I've missed anything and maybe develop some further suspicions based on what I find.

seem a bit like trying to let everyone know you'll be activelurking but that's okay and they should ignore that?

I had uni yesterday and slept all day today. Between that post and my previous one, there were a grand total of six player posts. Busy RL and low activity = not a whole lot to react to. I'm also still doing the re-read. I'm starting to develop some further suspicions, but nothing concrete yet. Once it's done, I'll fire off more questions and/or accusations.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 02:26:41 pm

Dariush. But only because, all I have read points him out to be a major dick. I don't really have much more concrete reason than that. It all follows Dr.P's train of thought.

Phibes:
You don't mind if I call you that, do you?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 04, 2012, 02:34:05 pm

zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 01:00:57 pm

I present, to your eye of suspicion, this one and only fact that might keep me from getting lynched my first day.

So, you've got one thing, which will probably fit neatly within a few sentences, and one thing only that might prevent you from being immediately lynched, which you'd like to express now in a desperate attempt to not get lynched.

This seems awfully desperate and scummy for someone with only one vote. If you were leading in votes, or I had some serious fuckup on you, or if I had even given you some serious reason to think I was dead-set on lynching you regardless, I could maybe see jumping to "Er, before you lynch me, consider the following:"

As it stands, though, it seems a lot like you're expecting to get lynched for some reason, which reads a lot like the usual "I'm scum, therefore IO's found me out, therefore play Noob Card to Not Die." Otherwise I don't see why you'd be so jumpy, or explain your noobishness in such a... well, I don't know, but something about it seems off. Prepared, almost? It's a fairly formal, elaborate explanation for what basically amounts to "Oh that, I'm a noob so please don't kill me."


Also, if nothing else I believe this adequately displays the power a vote can have. At least, I hope you wouldn't have responded that way to just the questions; I'd have probably called for your lynch immediately for something like that.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 01:00:57 pm

I am new at this, and have been familiar with this type of forum gaming for less than a week. If you were throwing yourself into a situation, would you not wait and watch and see were to turn, first, before casting yourself to the ever undecided waves of change?

As McFry has mentioned, we're over the drop site so get out of the plane. Yeah, maybe you'll land on a tree. That'll teach you to land on trees less next time, which is more than you're going to learn peering cautiously at said trees.

More specifically, playing all passively isn't going to help you learn unless you intend to learn to play passively, which is a bad idea. It's a lot more instructive to jump out, do stuff, and then hopefully be informed of where you were wrong than tiptoe out and hope the next step keeps revealing itself.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 04, 2012, 02:26:41 pm

Dariush. But only because, all I have read points him out to be a major dick. I don't really have much more concrete reason than that. It all follows Dr.P's train of thought.

Phibes:
You don't mind if I call you that, do you?

Nobadwrong. Are you trying to hunt scum or hunt dicks? Because if your only case on Dariush is "He's a dick," you're not hunting scum, you're hunting dicks.

Also, copying Dr.P's train of thought is generally a bad thing, because it implies you're just pointing at someone else's case and saying "Yeah, that." Which in turn implies that you don't care about hunting scum and are being lazy scum yourself. At the very least, you should really explain Dr.P's train of thought in more detail, so we know that it's either something you came up with on your own that happens to be the same, or something you think makes a lot of sense for the following reasons.

Finally, you should be actively hunting, not just voting. I know you've got a question out to Dariush or somesuch, but you still don't look like you're getting a good read on the situation or anyone in it. Don't you have questions? Don't you have people you want to know more about?




McFry:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Strategia:
My favourite scumtell is people not being constructively active when they could be. Dariush is not constructively active at all, but he's clearly in this thread frequently.
Currently, my second scumpick is Scelly. He's posting in the forum games forum for about 10 hours non-stop every day. Last BM, he had a completely different attitude that even made him get NK'd on N1 (I know that reading the NK is WIFOM, but I don't think that he would have even been considered as NK if he'd shown his current behaviour in the last BM). His behaviour clearly doesn't match up, and it has no reason not to, since he obviously has lots of time on his hands.

I tend to be wary of meta/activity tells like this, but I still like where you're going with it. I know you've been questioning Dariush a bunch, but haven't noticed what's come of it; has anything? I'm less certain I've seen you questioning Scelly, so I'm curious what your read on him other than lurking is.

Also I am not Strategia. Why'd you say I was Strategia?

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

My favourite scumtell is people not being constructively active when they could be. Dariush is not constructively active at all, but he's clearly in this thread frequently.
Currently, my second scumpick is Scelly. He's posting in the forum games forum for about 10 hours non-stop every day. Last BM, he had a completely different attitude that even made him get NK'd on N1 (I know that reading the NK is WIFOM, but I don't think that he would have even been considered as NK if he'd shown his current behaviour in the last BM). His behaviour clearly doesn't match up, and it has no reason not to, since he obviously has lots of time on his hands.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

You can change your vote anytime you want. So it does not hurt at all to just vote somebody for pressure, and vote somebody else later because he's more suspicious. RVS is all about this, and even though you can't just choose your vote randomly at this stage, you can at least indicate who you currently find suspicious, and you can do it with a vote to apply pressure. Just like IronyOwl said.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Why is your own image so important to you? You're not voting because you think it could look bad on you if you do (even though you should vote). You're explaining your actions with newbieness, yet you do nothing to correct your actions, instead you're congratulating yourself on your relatively well-written posts (that show that you are a newb).

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Do you remember this:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end. As a new guy, I don't want to make my first choice a bad one.

That was your first choice, and it was a bad one.

I'm becoming less and less convinced you needed another BM. I'm not even sure I would suspect Darvi of feeding you these.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 03:24:06 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 04, 2012, 02:34:05 pm

McFry:

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Strategia:
My favourite scumtell is people not being constructively active when they could be. Dariush is not constructively active at all, but he's clearly in this thread frequently.
Currently, my second scumpick is Scelly. He's posting in the forum games forum for about 10 hours non-stop every day. Last BM, he had a completely different attitude that even made him get NK'd on N1 (I know that reading the NK is WIFOM, but I don't think that he would have even been considered as NK if he'd shown his current behaviour in the last BM). His behaviour clearly doesn't match up, and it has no reason not to, since he obviously has lots of time on his hands.

I tend to be wary of meta/activity tells like this, but I still like where you're going with it. I know you've been questioning Dariush a bunch, but haven't noticed what's come of it; has anything? I'm less certain I've seen you questioning Scelly, so I'm curious what your read on him other than lurking is.

Questioning Dariush has repeatedly led to unsatisfying and poorly-reasoned answers (if any), even when good reasons were expected.
My current read on Scelly is only lurking, but that's more than I have against anyone else (with the obvious exception of Dariush).

Quote

Also I am not Strategia. Why'd you say I was Strategia?

I'm very sorry, I tend to mess up names and birthdays. Please continue considering yourself addressed, IronyOwl.

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

My favourite scumtell is people not being constructively active when they could be. Dariush is not constructively active at all, but he's clearly in this thread frequently.
Currently, my second scumpick is Scelly. He's posting in the forum games forum for about 10 hours non-stop every day. Last BM, he had a completely different attitude that even made him get NK'd on N1 (I know that reading the NK is WIFOM, but I don't think that he would have even been considered as NK if he'd shown his current behaviour in the last BM). His behaviour clearly doesn't match up, and it has no reason not to, since he obviously has lots of time on his hands.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

You can change your vote anytime you want. So it does not hurt at all to just vote somebody for pressure, and vote somebody else later because he's more suspicious. RVS is all about this, and even though you can't just choose your vote randomly at this stage, you can at least indicate who you currently find suspicious, and you can do it with a vote to apply pressure. Just like IronyOwl said.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Why is your own image so important to you? You're not voting because you think it could look bad on you if you do (even though you should vote). You're explaining your actions with newbieness, yet you do nothing to correct your actions, instead you're congratulating yourself on your relatively well-written posts (that show that you are a newb).

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Do you remember this:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 03, 2012, 07:12:17 am

I would care to withhold my vote to the very end. As a new guy, I don't want to make my first choice a bad one.

That was your first choice, and it was a bad one.

I'm becoming less and less convinced you needed another BM.

Thank you very much.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Scelly9 on April 04, 2012, 08:25:41 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 04, 2012, 01:54:25 pm

Currently, my second scumpick is Scelly. He's posting in the forum games forum for about 10 hours non-stop every day. Last BM, he had a completely different attitude that even made him get NK'd on N1 (I know that reading the NK is WIFOM, but I don't think that he would have even been considered as NK if he'd shown his current behavior in the last BM). His behavior clearly doesn't match up, and it has no reason not to, since he obviously has lots of time on his hands.

Yeah, sorry about that. The reason that I post a lot in other games but not a lot in this one is because most of my posts in other games are one-liner things that I don't really have to think about. Mafia is a game that requires a lot more thinking than others. As for the difference in styles from last game to this one, I'm having a hard time concentrating on this game for some reason. It may have something to do with the fact that I'm doing Script Frenzy and that is leeching my will to write.

Zomara, is there any reason you have for voting Dariush other than "He's an asshole"? Also, why do you see the need to congratulate yourself?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 04, 2012, 10:09:21 pm

Day extended to Friday.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dariush on April 05, 2012, 06:13:21 am

DICKHUNTING

Zomara, you read my post and took it exactly the wrong way. I didn't say you should vote anyone at all for the sake of voting. However bad not voting is, it is still better than voting people purely because they took their glorious stand across the putrid walls of fucking inpenetrable assfucking imbecility embodied in the shitfaces of McScum, Dr.Scummes and Scummiac and much better than voting someone for a stupid reason in a one-line post, not asking them (or anybody else for that matter) any questions and immediatly disappearing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 09:35:36 am

Hmm. . . . It does look like I have made some major mistakes, haven't I?

Quote from: Scelly9 on April 04, 2012, 08:25:41 pm

Zomara, is there any reason you have for voting Dariush other than "He's an asshole"? Also, why do you see the need to congratulate yourself?

No, no I don't have much reasoning aside from that. I also don't h ave much more of a reason to suspect anyone of you other than the meta fact that this game is still running. But now I am left with an even bigger issue. I don't think I can retract my vote.

Also, to answer your second question, I have always viewed the need for words to accurately describe the point I am to bring across as important. I felt that that post did what I wanted it to do. Of course, the end results proved otherwise. Can't say much more than that.

Quote from: Dariush on April 05, 2012, 06:13:21 am

DICKHUNTING

Zomara, you read my post and took it exactly the wrong way. I didn't say you should vote anyone at all for the sake of voting. However bad not voting is, it is still better than voting people purely because they took their glorious stand across the putrid walls of fucking inpenetrable assfucking imbecility embodied in the shitfaces of McScum, Dr.Scummes and Scummiac and much better than voting someone for a stupid reason in a one-line post, not asking them (or anybody else for that matter) any questions and immediatly disappearing.

I am feeling mixed signals now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 05, 2012, 11:30:42 am

Scelly9:

You're piling excuses upon excuses:

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 24, 2012, 09:24:59 pm

Ok, first off I am extremely sorry about disappearing. I sort of forgot about my FIRST robotics competition and found myself being dragged across half the state with no internet access. I'm gonna go back and start reading. Unfortunately I have a lot to catch up on.

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 24, 2012, 11:52:38 pm

I'm gonna finish the rest tomorrow. I'm exhausted.

Quote from: Scelly9 on April 04, 2012, 01:36:19 pm

I'm still here. Life has been hell, I'll post later today.

Quote from: Scelly9 on April 04, 2012, 08:25:41 pm

I'm having a hard time concentrating on this game for some reason. It may have something to do with the fact that I'm doing Script Frenzy and that is leeching my will to write.

Look at that. You say you have RL issues that prevent you from participating. And you do not tire of saying so. You knew that Script Frenzy (http://www.scriptfrenzy.org/) was coming up. And although you probably didn't expect that much of a toll on your activity, you now have this toll. Script Frenzy will go on for a whole damn month, and you can't expect your situation to clear up before it's over. Until then, you won't be able to participate.

Now my point is that even in the face of this overwhelming amount of absentness, you do not ask for a replacement. Are you really as absent as you claim to be? Because if so, you should have asked for a replacement long ago already:

Quote from: Scelly9 on March 28, 2012, 12:43:41 pm

Quote from: Strategia on March 28, 2012, 11:51:07 am

Scelly, I have three questions for you.
1.) Where the hell are you? Why aren't you, well, doing anything in here? If it's because of RL issues that prevent you from participating, could you at least say so and ask for a replacement? [...]

1.) Attack of the RL. I've been really busy lately.

There. Strategia is asking you to switch out, should you be too busy. You are saying that you're too busy, yet you don't switch out. This and your further behaviour tells me that you're expecting us to let you stay in town even though you won't do anything. Something is very, very wrong here, Scelly.


Zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 09:35:36 am

But now I am left with an even bigger issue. I don't think I can retract my vote.

Why do you think that? What do you expect to happen if you change your vote? How is it bad for you? Why is that an issue that you need to tell us about?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 11:39:47 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 09:35:36 am

But now I am left with an even bigger issue. I don't think I can retract my vote.

Why do you think that? What do you expect to happen if you change your vote? How is it bad for you? Why is that an issue that you need to tell us about?
[/quote]

It was a decision made hastily. A bad one, at that, according to you guys. And I don't expect changing my vote will change much more that who is at risk of being removed. Its bad in my opinion because it shows a lack of foresight and careful thought. I tell you all because its the only way I can think of relevantly continuing the conversation so I can do some active scumhunting of my own.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Scelly9 on April 05, 2012, 12:06:26 pm

Replacement Please

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dariush on April 05, 2012, 01:17:47 pm

Zomara, your posts are absolutely, utterly devoid of content. All you've done since getting in was make a reasonless vote and spend many posts philosophizing. Please do something useful.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 03:16:57 pm

In that case, Dariush, or whom ever else cares to answer, what would be considered content?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 05, 2012, 04:28:33 pm

Scelly:

Quote from: Scelly9 on April 05, 2012, 12:06:26 pm

Replacement Please

That went fast. Extend so we can have a look at the replacement.


Zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 11:39:47 am

And I don't expect changing my vote will change much more that who is at risk of being removed.

Currently, 3 votes are on Dariush, 2 are on DrPhibes and 2 are on you (I could be mistaken. Mod: Votecount please). Without your vote it's a three-way tie.

Quote

Its bad in my opinion because it shows a lack of foresight and careful thought.

Then foresee and think carefully next time instead of complaining about it. You can't change your behaviour by complaining.

Quote

I tell you all because its the only way I can think of relevantly continuing the conversation so I can do some active scumhunting of my own.

You could for example (re)read this thread, find some odd behaviour that hasn't been noticed yet, and point that out, demanding an explanation. You could also back up your vote with some evidence, or change your vote and base the change on reasons.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 03:16:57 pm

In that case, Dariush, or whom ever else cares to answer, what would be considered content?

I'd say that active content would be scumhunting and its results, basically the kind of stuff that Dariush is also failing to display.


Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on April 05, 2012, 01:17:47 pm

Zomara, your posts are absolutely, utterly devoid of content. All you've done since getting in was make a reasonless vote and spend many posts philosophizing. Please do something useful.

Dariush, your posts are absolutely, utterly devoid of content. All you've done since getting in was make some OMGUS votes and spend many posts ICing and being a stuck-up smartass. Please do something useful. Hypocrite.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 05, 2012, 10:34:40 pm

Extend.

zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 03:16:57 pm

In that case, Dariush, or whom ever else cares to answer, what would be considered content?

Who do you think is scum?

Content is anything that answers the above question. Usually it takes the form of questions aimed at examining behavior and getting inside someone's head. If you have no suspects, grab someone and try to figure them out.


Dr.Phibes, I still want to know who you suspect other than Dariush and why you're not doing anything about them.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on April 06, 2012, 02:31:05 am

Votecount! Searching for a replacement for Scelly9 now.

Dr.Phibes [2]: Strategia, Dariush
Dariush [3]: MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, zomara0292
zomara0292 [2]: Irony Owl, Scelly9

Day extended! Day ends Monday!

---

Well! Looks like the LCS forums picked up in activity. Wonder what happened that caused everyone to disappear?

... Oh, the beta for the new Globe of Gibbing expansion started a few days ago. Well then.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Darvi on April 06, 2012, 02:57:07 am

Quote from: Think0028 on April 06, 2012, 02:31:05 am

... Oh, the beta for the new Globe of Gibbing expansion started a few days ago. Well then.

You know you have a problem when you're both the best equipped warlock on your realm and possibly the most cash in the entire realmpool.

Dammit mom.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 07, 2012, 04:46:48 pm

Good thing you guys make the most of that extension.

Wait, you're not? Well damn.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 07, 2012, 04:55:02 pm

I'm here. Just... mainly waiting on Phibes and Strategia. And zomara. I guess waiting is a bad strategy, but it is the weekend.


PHIBES, I'm still waiting on your answer to my question.

STRATEGIA, I'm still waiting on that content you promised.

ZOMARA, I'm still waiting on that content you were supposedly interested in producing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 07, 2012, 05:04:46 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 07, 2012, 04:55:02 pm

ZOMARA, I'm still waiting on that content you were supposedly interested in producing.

Ok then. IronyOwl, I hope you don't mind me using you to test this out. Why do you think I am scum?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 07, 2012, 07:55:35 pm

zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 07, 2012, 05:04:46 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 07, 2012, 04:55:02 pm

ZOMARA, I'm still waiting on that content you were supposedly interested in producing.

Ok then. IronyOwl, I hope you don't mind me using you to test this out. Why do you think I am scum?

You're passive and jumpy, like you know you've done something wrong and are waiting for people to find out about it, and you don't seem especially interested in finding scum. That sounds like a scum mindset to me.

As an example, upon being voted for the very first time you began scrambling to tell us all that you're a noob to avoid being lynched. As another example, your one and only suspicion is Dariush for "being a dick," and you've even openly admitted to stealing the reasoning from someone else on that.



Also DARIUSH, where the fuck are you? The noobs are about to lynch your ass, and you don't have anything to say to stop them? And don't give me this "I tried to be helpful but they're wiseasses" shit, as an IC it's in your job description to deal with wiseass, smartass, dumbass, and/or assass noobs.

Plus, I find your case on McFry weak as fuck, by which I mean I don't know what it is but think he's town. Get in here and convince me he's scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 07, 2012, 08:33:44 pm

It's surprisingly hard for me to get any kind of reads from D1, given that two of the most active players got killed, McFry and Dariush were wall-of-texting back and forth, Phibes is an idiot, and drakon and Scelly got replaced (well, drakon got replaced twice, and Scelly still needs a replacement, so between them they've both been replaced).

Dariush, would it be possible for you to get over yourself, calm down and stop calling the newbs goatfuckers (as amusing as it is, it's making it harder to get a read on anyone)? Why are they scum? Why aren't you scum?

McFry, beyond refusing to answer a question (which wasn't a really good one anyway IMO), and calling the newbs goatfuckers, why is Dariush scum? Besides Dariush, who do you think is scum, and why?

zomara, what made you jump on the Dariush bandwagon, other than his colourful language?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dariush on April 08, 2012, 06:00:00 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 07, 2012, 07:55:35 pm

Also DARIUSH, where the fuck are you? The noobs are about to lynch your ass, and you don't have anything to say to stop them? And don't give me this "I tried to be helpful but they're wiseasses" shit, as an IC it's in your job description to deal with wiseass, smartass, dumbass, and/or assass noobs.

Plus, I find your case on McFry weak as fuck, by which I mean I don't know what it is but think he's town. Get in here and convince me he's scum.

But I did try to be helpful! They just didn't listen!!!

Now seriously, what are the cases on me? Zomara admitted he voted me because he slanderously thinks I'm a dick, Dr.Scummes got his brains fucked with a shovel when he said I'm scum because I answered 'I'm not scum' to Scummiac's 'Why are you scum(m)?' question and McScum, alternately known as (verbatim) The Grand Emperor Of Shit And Fucking Vomit... uhhhh....

McScum, remind me why exactly are you voting me? All you mentioned is 'I'm doing no coherent scumhunting'. By that, I assume, you mean that your caved-in brain is just unable to comprehend the depth of my efforts. The alternative, of course, is that you're very, very stupid scum. Did you even read my points against Scummes's utter bullfuckshitty assgoatfuckbrainless vomiteyefucking imbecility on D1, especially about him watching me with those shit-covered eyes?

Quote from: Strategia on April 07, 2012, 08:33:44 pm

Dariush, would it be possible for you to get over yourself, calm down and stop calling the newbs goatfuckers (as amusing as it is, it's making it harder to get a read on anyone)? Why are they scum? Why aren't you scum?

I didn't call anybody a goatfucker this game. Not a soul. Sure, I mentioned assgoatfuckbrainlessness, but that just isn't the same.
Scummes is scum because I became certain of his scummitude after his 'how do I know you're not scum' post, then he ignored a post detailing why that's bullshit, voted me for no reason whatsoever and then things got worse. The Grand Fuckshit is scum because of his lazyass question, extreme overreaction to my answer, and then things got worse.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 08, 2012, 06:05:04 am

Quote from: Dariush on April 08, 2012, 06:00:00 am

And Fucking Vomit

Please keep your fetishes out of the game, 'mkay?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 08, 2012, 07:50:58 am

Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on April 07, 2012, 08:33:44 pm

McFry, beyond refusing to answer a question (which wasn't a really good one anyway IMO), and calling the newbs goatfuckers, why is Dariush scum?

Refusing to answer a question is not really a scumtell, but it provided my original motivation to attack Dariush. Calling the newbs goatfuckers is also not a scumtell, I'd rather call it a dicktell. No, my main arguments against Dariush are currently:

(1) He is not scumhunting coherently and originally any more. His posts are made solely of ICing, answering selected questions, insulting people and copying other people's attacks. Looks nice, but doesn't help.

(2) He is voting people for absolutely stupid reasons. He voted Painiac for "being a different flavor of the same sack of shit". He later voted Dr. Phibes for this:

Quote from: Dariush on March 29, 2012, 10:28:48 am

He managed to single me out as 'stinking of scum' after a whopping one post made by me which mostly consisted of pointing out mistakes, overreacted horrifically and then things got worse.

We had to force these reasons out of him, and to be frank, they suck, and they wouldn't even satisfy Dariush himself if someone other than Dariush had given them.

(3) He is attacking people for doing stuff that he is also doing. I don't know what he intends to do with this, but I do know that if he really means what he says, then he should be voting himself.

All in all, his actions are illogical, nonconstructive, self-centered and hypocritical. I know that some of you find it hard to believe that Dariush would do this kind of stuff whether he's scum or not, but as you can see, he's doing this kind of stuff, so you should get over your disbelief and try to reason why the hell he would do that. Dariush is being scummier than anyone else here, scummier than people would expect even a scumteam Dariush to behave. Why then should we think he's town?

Quote

Besides Dariush, who do you think is scum, and why?

Besides Dariush, I am still suspicious of Scelly because of his lurking, and now I'm suspicious of Zomara because of his overreaction in a way that can be explained best by assuming that Zomara is newbscum.



PPE:

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on April 08, 2012, 06:00:00 am

McScum, remind me why exactly are you voting me?

See above.

Quote

All you mentioned is 'I'm doing no coherent scumhunting'.

I mentioned lots more than that earlier already.

Quote

By that, I assume, you mean that your caved-in brain is just unable to comprehend the depth of my efforts. The alternative, of course, is that you're very, very stupid scum.

So I'm either stupid town or stupid scum, therefore I'm stupid. Assuming you are able to comprehend the depth of your efforts yourself, then you can just tell me what your efforts are. Keep it simple, because I'm stupid, remember?

Quote

Did you even read my points against Scummes's utter bullfuckshitty assgoatfuckbrainless vomiteyefucking imbecility on D1, especially about him watching me with those shit-covered eyes?

Great. You're attacking Dr. Phibes because he's a newb. I'd dismissed that as ICing already, but you obviously think that that counts as scumhunting. Well, I don't. Dariush, please summarize your case against Dr. Phibes.

Quote

Scummes is scum because I became certain of his scummitude after his 'how do I know you're not scum' post, then he ignored a post detailing why that's bullshit, voted me for no reason whatsoever and then things got worse. The Grand Fuckshit is scum because of his lazyass question, extreme overreaction to my answer, and then things got worse.

No, Dariush. That's not reasons. Your argumentation against Dr. Phibes has some serious mixups on the concepts of "newb", "scum" and "stupid". Your "argumentation" against me is just non sequitur. Dariush, absolutely nothing in there implies that I'm more likely to be scum. Your "because" is just plain wrong there.

And as long as you write "and then things got worse" instead of explaining how things got worse (for me or for you?), there is absolutely no way anybody at all can follow your reasoning (assuming you have one).


Oh, and by the way:

Quote from: Dariush on April 08, 2012, 06:00:00 am

I didn't call anybody a goatfucker this game. Not a soul.

Quote from: Dariush on March 22, 2012, 08:47:39 am

Oooooh. Here I was being all cute and fluffy, hoping for several similarly cute and fluffy, wide-eyed and agreeable newbies, and instead I find a bunch of self-important tight-assed goatfuckers. Well then, let's play rough.

Liar.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 08, 2012, 09:22:06 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 07, 2012, 08:33:44 pm

zomara, what made you jump on the Dariush bandwagon, other than his colourful language?

Pressure. Pressure to make a vote instead of waiting on solid information, of which I am not learning how to hunt for, and the fact that there was a bandwagon for him. it was honestly a choice (to me) between him and Phibes (still hasn't answered my question or whether or not he is OK with me calling him that.), of which I made at random. But I digress. Back to the questioning.

Dariush, can you please, for the sake of me being able to have a better understanding, explain to me why you are not a scum?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 08, 2012, 09:34:42 am

EBWOP: Name mess-up. Again.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 08, 2012, 07:50:58 am

He later voted Dr. Phibes for this:

should be
"Later, he gave the following reasons for voting Painiac:".

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 09, 2012, 02:13:06 am

borno has replaced Scelly9.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 09, 2012, 03:56:35 am

zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 08, 2012, 09:22:06 am

Dariush, can you please, for the sake of me being able to have a better understanding, explain to me why you are not a scum?

This is mostly useless, for a number of reasons.

First of all, it's pretty tame and slow. If all you've got is one question, that is more or less waiting for a general explanation from someone, you should probably branch out more in the meantime. Ideally asking him something more insightful would be even better, though in this particular case getting insightful answers out of him is going to be difficult.

Secondly, "Why are you not scum?" is a meaningless question. It's vague, generic, and lazy; they're not going to have a good reason why they're not scum until you explain why they would be scum, meaning you may as well skip it and directly ask why he's doing scummy things or not doing townie things instead.

Plus, if you don't actually have anything he should or shouldn't be doing, it's basically a halfassed way to give him a trick question in order to lynch him regardless of answer, which is an obvious scum move.


As an example, how about you answer the same question? zomara, why aren't you scum? Do you think your answer to this question is helping me understand whether you're scum or not? Did you have to refer to earlier posts to figure out what the hell I even mean?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 09, 2012, 10:53:12 am

Sorry guys! I am on a vacation, and i thought i would have access to internet the whole time... But no. Well i have just for today and maybe tomarrow. Will come home on thursday. Wanted you all to know, again i am sorry. Going to check what everyone have written the time i was gone. 

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 09, 2012, 03:34:40 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 09, 2012, 03:56:35 am

Spoiler: In oh so many words: "You asked a horrid question." (click to show/hide)

zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 08, 2012, 09:22:06 am

Dariush, can you please, for the sake of me being able to have a better understanding, explain to me why you are not a scum?

This is mostly useless, for a number of reasons.

First of all, it's pretty tame and slow. If all you've got is one question, that is more or less waiting for a general explanation from someone, you should probably branch out more in the meantime. Ideally asking him something more insightful would be even better, though in this particular case getting insightful answers out of him is going to be difficult.

Secondly, "Why are you not scum?" is a meaningless question. It's vague, generic, and lazy; they're not going to have a good reason why they're not scum until you explain why they would be scum, meaning you may as well skip it and directly ask why he's doing scummy things or not doing townie things instead.

Plus, if you don't actually have anything he should or shouldn't be doing, it's basically a halfassed way to give him a trick question in order to lynch him regardless of answer, which is an obvious scum move.


As an example, how about you answer the same question? zomara, why aren't you scum? Do you think your answer to this question is helping me understand whether you're scum or not? Did you have to refer to earlier posts to figure out what the hell I even mean?

OK then, lets try asking this again.
Dariush, why did you vote on Painiac being lynched before?

IronyOwl , is this a better question? Or am I still missing the point?
Also, was one of those questions at the end really a question or a point you were trying to make?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 09, 2012, 04:50:36 pm

zomara:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 09, 2012, 03:34:40 pm

OK then, lets try asking this again.
Dariush, why did you vote on Painiac being lynched before?

IronyOwl , is this a better question? Or am I still missing the point?
Also, was one of those questions at the end really a question or a point you were trying to make?

Yes, much better.

Both. I'd like to hear your answers on them, but more for your benefit than mine.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 09, 2012, 05:09:10 pm

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 09, 2012, 03:56:35 am

zomara:
As an example, how about you answer the same question? zomara, why aren't you scum?

I can't answer that question in a way that wont instantly point to me being scum because of the fact that any way I answer that question, the details of it can be called into question. Those questions, of which,  I can give evidence for, but doing so would go against the rules of the game. Specifically:

Quote from: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

Never quote your role PM or any other PM sent to you by the mod.

. . . . . I see what you mean now.

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 09, 2012, 03:56:35 am

zomara:
Do you think your answer to this question is helping me understand whether you're scum or not?

No. Its a completely biased question by its in game nature.

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 09, 2012, 03:56:35 am

zomara:
Did you have to refer to earlier posts to figure out what the hell I even mean?

No, but I did refer to earlier posts just to come up with the one I did afterwards.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: borno on April 09, 2012, 07:25:37 pm

Strategia,

Quote from: Strategia on March 21, 2012, 06:20:59 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on March 21, 2012, 05:11:52 pm

You think mcfry is scum but you vote Strategia? Why? Strategia just asking questions. Feels like we will regret voting on him :/

Why?

I see this as a chainsaw defence done by Dr.Phibes, and then a quickly-made cover-up by you. Tell me, Strategia, are you voting for Dr.Phibes just because he is making no sense with his writings? Or is it because he is a bad scumbuddy?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: borno on April 09, 2012, 07:47:10 pm

EBWOP:

Unvote, Vote Strategia.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 09, 2012, 08:18:40 pm

Don't worry, you don't have to explicitly unvote. Just vote and I'll handle the rest.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: Think0028 on April 09, 2012, 08:22:13 pm

Votecount!

Dr.Phibes [2]: Strategia, Dariush
Dariush [3]: MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, zomara0292
zomara0292 [1]: Irony Owl
Strategia [1]: borno

Day ends Monday, today!

---

Man! Is anyone else playing Dai-3-Ji Ultra Mecha Combat P4 Hakaihen? I've been playing it for the last week and it's been amazing!

No? Anyone heard of it? No? Aww...

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 10, 2012, 04:48:31 pm

Quote from: borno on April 09, 2012, 07:25:37 pm

Strategia,

I see this as a chainsaw defence done by Dr.Phibes, and then a quickly-made cover-up by you. Tell me, Strategia, are you voting for Dr.Phibes just because he is making no sense with his writings? Or is it because he is a bad scumbuddy?

Take a good look at the thread. Re-read the posts Phibes and I posted. Where have we ever agreed on..... well, anything? I've wanted Phibes gone since before the end of D1. He's non-constructive, vague and disinterested, and doesn't appear to care much about the game. In the quote, I just asked Phibes why he thought voting me was a regrettable decision - it's a weird and out-of-place thing to say. I just wanted him to give his reason for saying that, which is quite literally what you do in Mafia.

Even if he was my scumbuddy, why the hell would I want to get rid of him? There's only two scum total in this game, and with two town kills, one of whom's the cop, scum has a rather advantageous position. Besides, why would scum ever want to get rid of other scum, outside of bussing a suspicious scumbuddy who's under heavy fire?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 10, 2012, 06:00:12 pm

Ironyowl, I am starting to suspect Zomora. It feels Zomora is using i am noob to much and the miss quote feels intentionally.

Borno, what did you expect Strategia to answer on that question?

zomara, you could have pressured anyone and yet you jumped directly on a bandwagon. What made Dariush scummier than me? Beacuse you clearly said you had a choice between one of ous. He, an IC and me a newbie that cant spell and yet you take my side, why? Do you have any grounds on your vote except pressure and the fact hes a dick? Felt like you just randomly choose wich bandwagon to join.
Yes you can call me Phibes!

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 08, 2012, 09:22:06 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 07, 2012, 08:33:44 pm

zomara, what made you jump on the Dariush bandwagon, other than his colourful language?

Pressure. Pressure to make a vote instead of waiting on solid information, of which I am not learning how to hunt for, and the fact that there was a bandwagon for him. it was honestly a choice (to me) between him and Phibes (still hasn't answered my question or whether or not he is OK with me calling him that.), of which I made at random. But I digress. Back to the questioning.

Dariush, can you please, for the sake of me being able to have a better understanding, explain to me why you are not a scum?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 10, 2012, 06:31:55 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 10, 2012, 06:00:12 pm

. . . Felt like you just randomly choose wich bandwagon to join. . .

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 08, 2012, 09:22:06 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 07, 2012, 08:33:44 pm

zomara, what made you jump on the Dariush bandwagon, other than his colourful language?

. . .
it was honestly a choice . . . of which I made at random. . .

Just for the sake of it. . . I think I did chose at random

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: borno on April 11, 2012, 12:00:03 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 10, 2012, 06:00:12 pm

Borno, what did you expect Strategia to answer on that question?

Mostly for him to sum up why he is voting for you, and partly because it's like RVS for me. I still need to learn things about your strategy, because I have just been thrown into the game without any knowledge of the people I'm playing with. It would be much easier to ask questions myself instead of re-reading the thread until I understand how you play.

Quote from: Strategia on April 10, 2012, 04:48:31 pm

Quote from: borno on April 09, 2012, 07:25:37 pm

Strategia,

I see this as a chainsaw defence done by Dr.Phibes, and then a quickly-made cover-up by you. Tell me, Strategia, are you voting for Dr.Phibes just because he is making no sense with his writings? Or is it because he is a bad scumbuddy?

Take a good look at the thread. Re-read the posts Phibes and I posted. Where have we ever agreed on..... well, anything? I've wanted Phibes gone since before the end of D1. He's non-constructive, vague and disinterested, and doesn't appear to care much about the game. In the quote, I just asked Phibes why he thought voting me was a regrettable decision - it's a weird and out-of-place thing to say. I just wanted him to give his reason for saying that, which is quite literally what you do in Mafia.

Even if he was my scumbuddy, why the hell would I want to get rid of him? There's only two scum total in this game, and with two town kills, one of whom's the cop, scum has a rather advantageous position. Besides, why would scum ever want to get rid of other scum, outside of bussing a suspicious scumbuddy who's under heavy fire?

You could be getting rid of him because most people find him very scummy, and voting for him would get suspicions off of you. Other then that, I find this plausible.

Unvote, Vote zomara. Zomara, why are you always using your newbie-ness as an excuse? Wouldn't it be better to defend yourself directly rather then trying to mix up noobtells with scumtells?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 11, 2012, 01:49:30 am

The day is over! Technically, the day has been over for 24 hours, but details!


Next on the banning block is Dariush. He is forced to put up a post containing (fake) personal information, for which he is swiftly permabanned.

Unfortunately, once again it's a swing and a miss. FroggyTwo found nothing in his investigation.

Dariush has been lynched! He was town!

Power roles, Mafia, send me your actions.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 11, 2012, 02:09:33 am

Took long enough.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: Dariush on April 11, 2012, 07:10:57 am

Fun fact: apart from the me obviously stopping caring about the game after my first post, I tried to see how far I can get by RiAing. For the entirety of the game I read none of Scummes's, Scummiac's or McScum's (and, closer to the end, zomara's) posts unless my attention was specifically called to some question directed to me. Also, insulting the fuck out of those cretins was fabulous. Too bad I ran out of fresh ideas by the end. :(

[/bah]

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 11, 2012, 07:12:06 am

You hush.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 13, 2012, 10:27:36 am

Hmmm. . . . . unexpected outcome. Was not worth the risk. Sorry.

Quote from: borno on April 11, 2012, 12:00:03 am

Unvote, Vote zomara. Zomara, why are you always using your newbie-ness as an excuse? Wouldn't it be better to defend yourself directly rather then trying to mix up noobtells with scumtells?

I was, and am learning how to properly defend myself. At this point in time, I am not using my lack of knowledge as an excuse for errors that I make, rather, I am using it as a way to correct my mistakes and improve my technique in finding scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: Tiruin on April 13, 2012, 10:32:52 am

*Cough*ItisNight*Cough*

((Threads must be locked at night. Sorry zomara, but there is no official confirmation that day has returned. Nobody can post at Night in a BM.))

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 13, 2012, 03:48:50 pm

To be fair, nights usually don't last this long either. Presumably either scum is dragging its feet on the kills, or Think has been too preoccupied to process Night and start the Day.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 13, 2012, 03:54:44 pm

Scum already made their decision to kill Think. Welp.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 13, 2012, 03:56:08 pm

Quote from: Darvi on April 13, 2012, 03:54:44 pm

Scum already made their decision to kill Think. Welp.

Clever bastards...

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 14, 2012, 09:48:48 pm

Hi, all!

Day 3 has begun! IronyOwl's account was deleted last night, and his email account was used to sign up for political mailing lists! He was town!

Day ends Wednesday!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - N2 - Dariush, Tutor, has died! [6/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 14, 2012, 09:52:08 pm

Alright then. Both of your incompetent tutors are dead now, meaning it's time for you all to step up and find yourselves some scum. Or some townies to frame as scum, as the case may be.

Anyway, I'm dead now, but I'm still an IC. This means that while I can't comment on specifics, I can continue to offer advice.

Good luck.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Spoiler: RAGE (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Dariush on April 11, 2012, 07:10:57 am

Fun fact: apart from the me obviously stopping caring about the game after my first post, I tried to see how far I can get by RiAing. For the entirety of the game I read none of Scummes's, Scummiac's or McScum's (and, closer to the end, zomara's) posts unless my attention was specifically called to some question directed to me. Also, insulting the fuck out of those cretins was fabulous. Too bad I ran out of fresh ideas by the end.

What the fuck. Dariush just ragequit a BM. I repeat: Dariush just ragequit a BM. Where he was IC and townie. After his first post. Because he was attacked by three newbs. Newbs which he should have expected to have to deal with, because he was an IC. In a BM. But no, he couldn't cope with being pressured by three newbs. Instead he decided to abuse his IC status to spend two weeks insulting them. He seriously broke the game by acting a sore loser and an abusive dick, and he thought it was fun. This behaviour is absolutely horrifying and has absolutely no place in a BM.

I'm probably speaking in favor of all future Bay12 Mafia newbs when I request that Dariush shouldn't be allowed to IC anymore.

---

My vote goes to Zomara. Sticking his hands up even before people started pointing virtual finger pistols at him is in my opinion a scumtell in the rough tellness vicinity of explaining your actions with "But Darvi told me so": Newbtown wouldn't even think of doing that. And even though we can help him get better by saying that he shouldn't do that, we can't let him get away with it.

Zomara, look at this:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 09, 2012, 03:34:40 pm

OK then, lets try asking this again.
Dariush, why did you vote on Painiac being lynched before?

You asked this question when Monday was almost over. Dariush was (theoretically) going to be lynched in about four hours, yet you didn't Extend to give Dariush time to answer the question. The vote you had on Dariush was still based on "he's a dick". You obviously didn't care whether Dariush answered or not.


Borno, your first action in this thread was to vote Strategia for obscure reasons. I'm kinda missing an introduction.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Jim Groovester on April 15, 2012, 06:36:08 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Spoiler: RAGE (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Dariush on April 11, 2012, 07:10:57 am

Fun fact: apart from the me obviously stopping caring about the game after my first post, I tried to see how far I can get by RiAing. For the entirety of the game I read none of Scummes's, Scummiac's or McScum's (and, closer to the end, zomara's) posts unless my attention was specifically called to some question directed to me. Also, insulting the fuck out of those cretins was fabulous. Too bad I ran out of fresh ideas by the end.

What the fuck. Dariush just ragequit a BM. I repeat: Dariush just ragequit a BM. Where he was IC and townie. After his first post. Because he was attacked by three newbs. Newbs which he should have expected to have to deal with, because he was an IC. In a BM. But no, he couldn't cope with being pressured by three newbs. Instead he decided to abuse his IC status to spend two weeks insulting them. He seriously broke the game by acting a sore loser and an abusive dick, and he thought it was fun. This behaviour is absolutely horrifying and has absolutely no place in a BM.

I'm probably speaking in favor of all future Bay12 Mafia newbs when I request that Dariush shouldn't be allowed to IC anymore.

Focus on the game. Bring up whatever issues you have after it's over.

This goes for everybody. If you're not trying to finish the game strong then you're missing the point of being in a Beginner's Mafia.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 16, 2012, 07:00:32 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Zomara, look at this:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 09, 2012, 03:34:40 pm

OK then, lets try asking this again.
Dariush, why did you vote on Painiac being lynched before?

You asked this question when Monday was almost over. Dariush was (theoretically) going to be lynched in about four hours, yet you didn't Extend to give Dariush time to answer the question. The vote you had on Dariush was still based on "he's a dick". You obviously didn't care whether Dariush answered or not.

I am not going to say that this was a weak argument, because you caught something I did that apparently matters. I will remember to join the group in asking for an extension next time, but I think you are missing a question. Not just an accusing finger.

Would you please ask me a question, Jim?
Do, you mind if i call you Jim? And, for that matter, where were you when I started?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 16, 2012, 07:15:08 am

Jim's not playing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 16, 2012, 07:16:06 am

So confused.

Can I get a list of who is left?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Tiruin on April 16, 2012, 07:30:29 am

Everyone on the first page, Minus me, IronyOwl and Dariush and Painiac.

Also, a note. This is LYLO. A crucial part in the game, where town will lose if they get their lynch wrong. Currently, no scum have been caught. We are down to 3 townies and 2 Mafiosos.
    * Scelly9
    * drakon136
    * Dr.Phibes
    * Tiruin
    * MagmaMcFry
    * Strategia
    * Painiac
The ones without strikethroughs are still alive and playing. The others who are in a strikethrough cannot talk as they're dead. (Sorry)

Analyze the past day's posts of people, look at their motives and don't be afraid to push.

If I could quote Jim's spiel

Quote from: Jim's Spiel

Now that the game has started and I am now responsible for teaching seven of you how to play a game, I will say the following first.

I will be a completely impartial source of advice that I will freely give at every opportunity, whether I am asked for it or I decide to give it on my own. You can trust that everything I have to say will be given in good faith, even if it comes at a personal cost to me in this game. If you do not listen to what I have to say, for any reason, you will severely hamper your ability to learn how to play the game. So, to reiterate,

Listen to what I tell you.

If you don't, then what's the point of me being here?

For those of you who don't know what to do, games usually start with the Random Vote Stage. You should pick a target randomly, vote them, and ask them a question. The sole purpose of this is to get conversation going when there would otherwise be no reason to do that. I'll start.

jaxler, let's say you're the Cop. You want to catch scum during the night with an inspection. What do you look for?

Ideally you should ask game related questions in the RVS. Asking what kind of flavor of ice cream is a player's favorite does absolutely nothing to help you find scum, which is your primary goal.

And because it bears repeating: Your primary goal is to find scum. Everything you do should help you towards that goal. And I do mean everything.

If you're scum, you will obviously have a different goal: Avoid detection until the end of the game. The best way to do this is to look like you are trying to find scum.

Since many of you are going to have no idea what to do and will mangle scumhunting in just about every possible way, it does you no good to hold back. So be bold, and just do the best you can. Ask lots of questions, try to get a good feel for how the game is played. I'll be there to help you when you go wrong.

Additionally, before anybody else does anything, I will stress the importance of activity. You should be as active as possible. A good guideline is to get one good post in a day, but if you can post productively more often than that it's generally a good idea to do so. As a player, town or scum, being active and visible is very much an asset, as you're out there making yourself readable, and this is considered a town quality. While there are very good personal benefits to being active, the reverse is detrimental to the whole game. Low activity makes games hard to play or outright kills them. This is fun for absolutely no one, so make a good effort and be active.

If you played a Beginner's Game before you probably recognize this spiel, but it's good all the same.

Good luck Players.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 16, 2012, 04:31:29 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Spoiler: RAGE (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Dariush on April 11, 2012, 07:10:57 am

Fun fact: apart from the me obviously stopping caring about the game after my first post, I tried to see how far I can get by RiAing. For the entirety of the game I read none of Scummes's, Scummiac's or McScum's (and, closer to the end, zomara's) posts unless my attention was specifically called to some question directed to me. Also, insulting the fuck out of those cretins was fabulous. Too bad I ran out of fresh ideas by the end.

What the fuck. Dariush just ragequit a BM. I repeat: Dariush just ragequit a BM. Where he was IC and townie. After his first post. Because he was attacked by three newbs. Newbs which he should have expected to have to deal with, because he was an IC. In a BM. But no, he couldn't cope with being pressured by three newbs. Instead he decided to abuse his IC status to spend two weeks insulting them. He seriously broke the game by acting a sore loser and an abusive dick, and he thought it was fun. This behaviour is absolutely horrifying and has absolutely no place in a BM.

I'm probably speaking in favor of all future Bay12 Mafia newbs when I request that Dariush shouldn't be allowed to IC anymore.

Consider it Dealing with Disruptive Players 101. You dabbled in teaching it yourself a bit as well, in BM XXXI.

---

So we're now left with McFry, Phibes, zomara, borno and me. Ohhh fucknuggets. I haven't been able to get a read on McFry yet, Phibes appears to be an idiot, and zomara and borno are fairly fresh, borno especially. zomara's going after Dariush right after joining, for no particular reason, kind of raises an alarm bell. Then again, I still don't know about McFry either - he's been going after Dariush too.

Giving the thread a quick do-over, on D1 Scelly provided the tipping vote on Painiac, but McFry and zomara (and zomara's predecessors) were awfully insistent on lynching Dariush. (As was Phibes.) borno made a couple of safe votes towards the end of D2, which, other than providing plenty of WIFOMfodder, doesn't say anything about his alignment.

Going down the list again, we've got someone I don't trust, someone I don't like, two fresh replacements and me. Since no-one besides me appears to be still interested in getting rid of Dr.Idiot, I'll put him on the back burner for now. (Burn baby burn.) I'm gonna go with "more competent = more dangerous", unless I get a scum vibe from someone else, and vote MagmaMcFry for now.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 17, 2012, 07:11:18 pm

Wow, activity hasn't reduced so much as dropped off a cliff into an eerie glowing pit, hasn't it?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Shakerag on April 17, 2012, 09:45:08 pm

ICs and/or Mod needed in Beginner's Mafia XXXII, stat!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Jim Groovester on April 17, 2012, 10:44:20 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on April 15, 2012, 06:36:08 am

If you're not trying to finish the game strong then you're missing the point of being in a Beginner's Mafia.

So apparently a lot of you are missing the point of being in a Beginner's Mafia.

Lylo is a hell of time to decide to stop playing the game. A single player who doesn't participate in lylo guarantees a town loss. Imagine the results if there are more.

Get to work. You've got a whole game to look through. Not knowing what to do is no excuse.

Don't make me come and badger all of you again. You'll like it less and less each time.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 17, 2012, 10:46:36 pm

IF YOU ARE TOWN, YOU NEED TO READ THIS. If you are scum, you need to read this as well, so you can look like and foil town.


It is now LYLO, which means LYNCH OR LOSE. This rather bluntly means that if you don't lynch scum right now, YOU LOSE THE GAME.


But that's not all. It's LYLO because there's only one more town left than there is scum. Meaning that not only do you have to find scum to win, but town has to vote UNANIMOUSLY in order to overpower scum. Obviously, scum might or might not be so obvious as to both vote the same person, but this should underline how ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL it is that every last one of you gets your shit together. If you're sitting there hoping something will show up or someone else will do things for you, YOU ARE LOSING THE GAME FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR TEAM.

Every last one of you needs to get in here and remind yourself that you, personally, are a full third of the Town at this point. What do you think is going to happen if a third of your team isn't willing to do anything? That's right, you're going to lose.


Scelly9, you are a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get moving.

drakon136, you are a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get moving.

Dr. Phibes, you are a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get moving.

Magma McFry, you are a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get moving.

Strategia, you are a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get moving.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 18, 2012, 01:29:49 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 16, 2012, 07:00:32 am

I will remember to join the group in asking for an extension next time,

Which group? Why do you have to join a group anyway?

Quote

but I think you are missing a question. Not just an accusing finger.

I couldn't find a sufficiently constructive and non-WIFOM related follow-up question. Do you need a question from me?

Quote

Would you please ask me a question, Jim?

Okay, that's just incredibly lazy. You're forcing people to ask you questions so you can look more active. But answering questions isn't being active.

Zomara: Who do you find the most scummy, and why haven't you voted him yet?

Quote from: Strategia on April 16, 2012, 04:31:29 pm

I'm gonna go with "more competent = more dangerous", unless I get a scum vibe from someone else, and vote MagmaMcFry for now.

Thank you, I guess?



Extend. Borno and DrPhibes still have some talking and voting to do.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 18, 2012, 07:11:55 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 18, 2012, 01:29:49 am

Which group? Why do you have to join a group anyway?

answered on the bottom

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 18, 2012, 01:29:49 am

I couldn't find a sufficiently constructive and non-WIFOM related follow-up question. Do you need a question from me?

I think I just got. . . . . . . four from you, actually, so, thank you.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 18, 2012, 01:29:49 am

Okay, that's just incredibly lazy. You're forcing people to ask you questions so you can look more active. But answering questions isn't being active.

Zomara: Who do you find the most scummy, and why haven't you voted him yet?

I am kinda stuck on that question. I don't really have someone to point a finger at yet. Even looking for scumtells, I have little to no information to work with. Or maybe I am looking for the wrong things. Or maybe I am not looking hard enough.

Coming up with questions, on the other hand, is a lot harder than it looks. You should know. You are coming up with them yourself.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 18, 2012, 01:29:49 am

Extend. Borno and DrPhibes still have some talking and voting to do.

This would be the up and starting group that I was talking about. The one asking for an Extension. By the way. Extend the day, please.

---

On to the question:
Strategia, what was the purpose of your 'red or blue?' questions far earlier?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

Extend.

Going to stay firm on zomara as my lead suspect.

zomara, maybe you are a noob to mafia, but you are familiar to the forum and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious. Btw, who do you think is the best player in this game?


Strategia, did you vote on magma just beacuse hes competent? Or beacuse you cant lynch me? I think its easier to get rid of me than him. Can you explain in more detail why you want him out?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 18, 2012, 10:23:08 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

zomara, maybe you are a noob to mafia, but you are familiar to the forum and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

Could you point me to my error? I don't see it myself.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

who do you think is the best player in this game?

right now I say its between Strategia, who so easily threw off the question of "red" or "blue" and McFry, who has not at all pinged on my radar. No offense to you.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Scelly9 on April 18, 2012, 10:48:13 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 17, 2012, 10:46:36 pm

Scelly9, you are a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get moving.

Please note I'm not playing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 18, 2012, 10:58:14 am

Nah, see, he wrote that post weeks ago but forgot to edit it when he finally posted it.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 10:58:42 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 18, 2012, 10:23:08 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

zomara, maybe you are a noob to mafia, but you are familiar to the forum and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

Could you point me to my error? I don't see it myself.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

who do you think is the best player in this game?

right now I say its between Strategia, who so easily threw off the question of "red" or "blue" and McFry, who has not at all pinged on my radar. No offense to you.

Found it, page 16. Cant qoute it beacuse it fucks the whole post up. If there is no mess-up i apoligies, it must be my computer fucking with me.

However this is not why i suspect you (maybe a little). I wrote last day why.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 18, 2012, 10:59:30 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 10:58:42 am

Found it, page 16.

Out of 6?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 18, 2012, 07:11:55 am

Strategia, what was the purpose of your 'red or blue?' questions far earlier?

It's an indicator, and it helps me get a feel for the player. That's it. It's a neutral question that has no immediate bearing on my vote.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

[...] and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

Oh the hypocrisy, it burnsss

Quote

Strategia, did you vote on magma just beacuse hes competent? Or beacuse you cant lynch me? I think its easier to get rid of me than him. Can you explain in more detail why you want him out?

I haven't been able to get a good read off of either one of you so far. Therefore, I decided to go for the one who appeared most competent. But you're right, getting rid of McFry would be hard. I'm not going to unvote for now, but we'll see.

On the other hand, looking at the posts on this day so far, I'm starting to think that you and McFry together are the scumteam. I haven't been able to get a read off either one of you, and all your targets so far have been killed. Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch. Your stupidity could easily be an act, at least partially. McFry appears competent enough to have been targeted by scum, but so far that appears almost entirely absent. It was him who tried to paint Dariush as scum on D1, and you happily went along with it, flying under the radar.

zomara mostly appears newbish, especially since he just replaced in. borno hasn't said much of anything yet. You two are, however, active and working together to achieve a newblynch. I'm not even going to put this as a question; MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, you are SCUMMMMM.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 18, 2012, 11:35:03 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 10:58:42 am

Found it, page 16.

As did I, thanks to you. I wounder how it escaped my notice.

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

It's an indicator, and it helps me get a feel for the player. That's it. It's a neutral question that has no immediate bearing on my vote.

I personally don't see how, but I am sure you know what to look for in the reply. Care to teach that technique to me after we are done with this game? Its. . . . . . different. Makes me want to know it for some reason.

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch.

That hurt me quite a bit. Am I really that easy to pin as a lynching target?

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

zomara mostly appears newbish, especially since he just replaced in. borno hasn't said much of anything yet. You two are, however, active and working together to achieve a newblynch. I'm not even going to put this as a question; MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, you are SCUMMMMM.

That's quite a harsh accusation. I think I will go though and see if I can find anything more solid to back it up. Or disprove it, if the case may be.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 11:40:36 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

[...] and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

Oh the hypocrisy, it burnsss

Quote

Strategia, did you vote on magma just beacuse hes competent? Or beacuse you cant lynch me? I think its easier to get rid of me than him. Can you explain in more detail why you want him out?

I haven't been able to get a good read off of either one of you so far. Therefore, I decided to go for the one who appeared most competent. But you're right, getting rid of McFry would be hard. I'm not going to unvote for now, but we'll see.

On the other hand, looking at the posts on this day so far, I'm starting to think that you and McFry together are the scumteam. I haven't been able to get a read off either one of you, and all your targets so far have been killed. Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch. Your stupidity could easily be an act, at least partially. McFry appears competent enough to have been targeted by scum, but so far that appears almost entirely absent. It was him who tried to paint Dariush as scum on D1, and you happily went along with it, flying under the radar.

zomara mostly appears newbish, especially since he just replaced in. borno hasn't said much of anything yet. You two are, however, active and working together to achieve a newblynch. I'm not even going to put this as a question; MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, you are SCUMMMMM.

Why? He have 1000 posts. This is the first time ever writing on this forum for me.
Wtf, all my targets so far have been killed? My only target was Dariush, yes he died but so did Painiac and i didnt suspct him. YOU did, should i suspect you becuse of that? And is the table flipped now? i suspected zomora then borno came and atlast magma voted him. So first its magma pulling the strings and now its me? Or is that our master plan?!?!?!??!?! *DUN* *DUN* *DUUUHHH* Your reason have far to many variables. Again if you are so sure, why do you still vote on magma? Its doesent matter who of ous you kill and like i said i am a far easier alternative, right?

Is it just me or this WIFOM?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 18, 2012, 12:24:40 pm

Dr.Phibes:

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

zomara, maybe you are a noob to mafia, but you are familiar to the forum and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

How the hell would messing up votes make people more likely to be scum?

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 11:39:47 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 09:35:36 am

But now I am left with an even bigger issue. I don't think I can retract my vote.

Why do you think that? What do you expect to happen if you change your vote? How is it bad for you? Why is that an issue that you need to tell us about?
[/quote]

If this is what you mean, then watch this:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 11:39:47 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 05, 2012, 09:35:36 am

But now I am left with an even bigger issue. I don't think I can retract my vote.

Why do you think that? What do you expect to happen if you change your vote? How is it bad for you? Why is that an issue that you need to tell us about?

Zomara just accidentally deleted the [quote] tag. That's not suspicious, and that's not a reason to vote people.


Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

McFry [...] tried to paint Dariush as scum on D1

Careful there, you just totally skipped the the part where you consider that I simply attacked Dariush because he was being scummy. Now rewind for a bit and consider that before skipping to biased conclusions. Naturally you have an instinctive suspicion against people who lynch people who turn out to be town, and that's because scum generally tries to lynch town. Now you're making two wrong turns here:
1) You think that the opposite also applies, namely that people who try to lynch town are generally scum. That's not true and you know it. Just look at Painiac.
2) You think that if I attacked Dariush and he was town, then I attacked Dariush knowing that he was town. That's called hindsight bias, and you would probably never have considered that I would have a reason for attacking Dariush other that he was being extremely Scummy if Dariush had turned out to be scum. I find my accusations against Dariush completely appropriate, and I still think that Dariush was being insanely scummy. Remember: Dariush thinks so too. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=105022.msg3183436#msg3183436)

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

McFry appears competent enough to have been targeted by scum, but so far that appears almost entirely absent.

That is the worst application of WIFOM I have ever seen.

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

On the other hand, looking at the posts on this day so far, I'm starting to think that you and McFry together are the scumteam. I haven't been able to get a read off either one of you, and all your targets so far have been killed. Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch. Your stupidity could easily be an act, at least partially. McFry appears competent enough to have been targeted by scum, but so far that appears almost entirely absent. It was him who tried to paint Dariush as scum on D1, and you happily went along with it, flying under the radar.

Look what you've just proved: If Phibes and I are the scumteam, then our actions make sense.

Allow me to make a counterstatement: If Phibes and I are not the scumteam, then our actions make sense.

Do you see the problem here? Both statements are true, so the fact that my actions make sense does not imply anything at all. You've got a suspicion, and you're blindly following it. You're reading all of our posts believing that we are scum, and you continue holding onto your theory because nothing disproves it. What you fail to notice is that there is also no evidence for your theory. That's called confirmation bias, and you should snap out of it immediately.

Consider this a free lesson in rationality. If you don't understand that, then you haven't read enough Harry Potter fanfiction.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 12:51:43 pm

I was building on what i said earlier, it feels like hes defending him self with noobines and it seems hes trying to hard to look like a noob. However i felt it odd for him to just vote Dariush like that.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 18, 2012, 02:05:17 pm

Quote from: Scelly9 on April 18, 2012, 10:48:13 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 17, 2012, 10:46:36 pm

Scelly9, you are a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get moving.

Please note I'm not playing.

I blame Tiruin completely. Who probably blames Think in turn.


borno, apologies for missing you. You are now a full one third of your team or trying to act like it. Get in here and get moving.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 18, 2012, 07:11:55 am

I am kinda stuck on that question. I don't really have someone to point a finger at yet. Even looking for scumtells, I have little to no information to work with. Or maybe I am looking for the wrong things. Or maybe I am not looking hard enough.

Coming up with questions, on the other hand, is a lot harder than it looks. You should know. You are coming up with them yourself.

A simple way to consider scumhunting is to attempt to get a read on everyone or someone, rather than explicitly trying to determine if they're scum or not. Trying to figure out someone's motivations and behavior in general is sometimes easier and more natural than attempting to determine if they're being deceptive or acting.

Also, when in doubt, attempt to generate new information, rather than sifting through old. Old data can be helpful, but trying to examine it with successively finer and finer-toothed combs is usually not productive.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 18, 2012, 02:40:05 pm

Day extended to Thursday because now people are actually posting. Votecount later today.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: drakon136 on April 18, 2012, 06:29:28 pm

Quote from: drakon136 on March 27, 2012, 05:58:20 pm

:/ Every time I join a mafia game, suddenly lots of important stuff to do. Sorry about being so inactive guys.

Requesting replacement.

That was from D1. Stop yelling at me when I'm not even in the game.

(Personally, I blame Think for not updating the player list in the OP.)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 18, 2012, 06:43:05 pm

Quote from: drakon136 on April 18, 2012, 06:29:28 pm

Quote from: drakon136 on March 27, 2012, 05:58:20 pm

:/ Every time I join a mafia game, suddenly lots of important stuff to do. Sorry about being so inactive guys.

Requesting replacement.

That was from D1. Stop yelling at me when I'm not even in the game.

(Personally, I blame Think for not updating the player list in the OP.)

I am bad at this.


zomara, you know the drill.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 19, 2012, 12:51:07 am

Votecount! I'll pretend I didn't hear those slanders! (Sorry about that. One of those things I never get around to.)

Zomara [2]: Dr. Phibes, MagmaMcFry
MagmaMcFry [1]: Strategia

Not voting: borno, Zomara.

Day ends tomorrow!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: borno on April 19, 2012, 01:04:45 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Borno, your first action in this thread was to vote Strategia for obscure reasons. I'm kinda missing an introduction.

What do you mean by an introduction? My play-style? As this is my first Mafia, I'm developing a strategy as I go on. But, if you don't think that is an acceptable answer, to analyze  peoples' posts and find scumtells from them, like anyone else would.
Magma, what were you trying to gain from this question?

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 11:40:36 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

[...] and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

Oh the hypocrisy, it burnsss

Quote

Strategia, did you vote on magma just beacuse hes competent? Or beacuse you cant lynch me? I think its easier to get rid of me than him. Can you explain in more detail why you want him out?

I haven't been able to get a good read off of either one of you so far. Therefore, I decided to go for the one who appeared most competent. But you're right, getting rid of McFry would be hard. I'm not going to unvote for now, but we'll see.

On the other hand, looking at the posts on this day so far, I'm starting to think that you and McFry together are the scumteam. I haven't been able to get a read off either one of you, and all your targets so far have been killed. Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch. Your stupidity could easily be an act, at least partially. McFry appears competent enough to have been targeted by scum, but so far that appears almost entirely absent. It was him who tried to paint Dariush as scum on D1, and you happily went along with it, flying under the radar.

zomara mostly appears newbish, especially since he just replaced in. borno hasn't said much of anything yet. You two are, however, active and working together to achieve a newblynch. I'm not even going to put this as a question; MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, you are SCUMMMMM.

Why? He have 1000 posts. This is the first time ever writing on this forum for me.
Wtf, all my targets so far have been killed? My only target was Dariush, yes he died but so did Painiac and i didnt suspct him. YOU did, should i suspect you becuse of that? And is the table flipped now? i suspected zomora then borno came and atlast magma voted him. So first its magma pulling the strings and now its me? Or is that our master plan?!?!?!??!?! *DUN* *DUN* *DUUUHHH* Your reason have far to many variables. Again if you are so sure, why do you still vote on magma? Its doesent matter who of ous you kill and like i said i am a far easier alternative, right?

Is it just me or this WIFOM?

This seems much too relaxed for town.
Tell me, Dr.Phibes, Why are you chainsawing Magma so fiercely? Have you realized that if you don't do anything soon, you will get lynched, and tried to pin the blame on Magma?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 01:30:58 am

Quote from: borno on April 19, 2012, 01:04:45 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Borno, your first action in this thread was to vote Strategia for obscure reasons. I'm kinda missing an introduction.

What do you mean by an introduction? My play-style? As this is my first Mafia, I'm developing a strategy as I go on. But, if you don't think that is an acceptable answer, to analyze  peoples' posts and find scumtells from them, like anyone else would.
Magma, what were you trying to gain from this question?

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 11:40:36 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

[...] and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

Oh the hypocrisy, it burnsss

Quote

Strategia, did you vote on magma just beacuse hes competent? Or beacuse you cant lynch me? I think its easier to get rid of me than him. Can you explain in more detail why you want him out?

I haven't been able to get a good read off of either one of you so far. Therefore, I decided to go for the one who appeared most competent. But you're right, getting rid of McFry would be hard. I'm not going to unvote for now, but we'll see.

On the other hand, looking at the posts on this day so far, I'm starting to think that you and McFry together are the scumteam. I haven't been able to get a read off either one of you, and all your targets so far have been killed. Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch. Your stupidity could easily be an act, at least partially. McFry appears competent enough to have been targeted by scum, but so far that appears almost entirely absent. It was him who tried to paint Dariush as scum on D1, and you happily went along with it, flying under the radar.

zomara mostly appears newbish, especially since he just replaced in. borno hasn't said much of anything yet. You two are, however, active and working together to achieve a newblynch. I'm not even going to put this as a question; MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, you are SCUMMMMM.

Why? He have 1000 posts. This is the first time ever writing on this forum for me.
Wtf, all my targets so far have been killed? My only target was Dariush, yes he died but so did Painiac and i didnt suspct him. YOU did, should i suspect you becuse of that? And is the table flipped now? i suspected zomora then borno came and atlast magma voted him. So first its magma pulling the strings and now its me? Or is that our master plan?!?!?!??!?! *DUN* *DUN* *DUUUHHH* Your reason have far to many variables. Again if you are so sure, why do you still vote on magma? Its doesent matter who of ous you kill and like i said i am a far easier alternative, right?

Is it just me or this WIFOM?

This seems much too relaxed for town.
Tell me, Dr.Phibes, Why are you chainsawing Magma so fiercely? Have you realized that if you don't do anything soon, you will get lynched, and tried to pin the blame on Magma?

Pin the blame on Magma? Just how did you jump to this accusation? I think Magma is the best player in this game, dont know why strategia is voting him. I thought voting on Magma just beacuse hes good is pretty weak. Wanted to want more why he voted on him, hes reply is filled with baseless accusations. Did you read the post or am i missing something? Wait, relaxed? Explain why?

Borno, why do you not suspct Strategia anymore? Or zomora? You tend to switch targets much.

Please, can someone explain the word chainsawing?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 01:34:20 am

Extend

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 19, 2012, 03:55:41 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 01:30:58 am

Please, can someone explain the word chainsawing?

Chainsawing means attacking someone to defend whoever that person is attacking. In other words, if Player B is attacking Player C, and Player A begins attacking Player B, seemingly to defend Player C, Player A is chainsawing Player C.

It's a tricky accusation, because there's often a lot of legitimate reasons to attack someone who just so happens to be attacking someone else, or who's attacking someone else poorly, but the theory behind it is fairly obvious- scum want to defend their buddies and get into town's good graces, so they might attack someone who's attacking their scumbuddy or who's messing with someone they want to butter up.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: borno on April 19, 2012, 05:29:01 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 01:30:58 am

Quote from: borno on April 19, 2012, 01:04:45 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Borno, your first action in this thread was to vote Strategia for obscure reasons. I'm kinda missing an introduction.

What do you mean by an introduction? My play-style? As this is my first Mafia, I'm developing a strategy as I go on. But, if you don't think that is an acceptable answer, to analyze  peoples' posts and find scumtells from them, like anyone else would.
Magma, what were you trying to gain from this question?

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 11:40:36 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 09:57:33 am

[...] and messing up quotes feels pretty suspicious.

Oh the hypocrisy, it burnsss

Quote

Strategia, did you vote on magma just beacuse hes competent? Or beacuse you cant lynch me? I think its easier to get rid of me than him. Can you explain in more detail why you want him out?

I haven't been able to get a good read off of either one of you so far. Therefore, I decided to go for the one who appeared most competent. But you're right, getting rid of McFry would be hard. I'm not going to unvote for now, but we'll see.

On the other hand, looking at the posts on this day so far, I'm starting to think that you and McFry together are the scumteam. I haven't been able to get a read off either one of you, and all your targets so far have been killed. Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch. Your stupidity could easily be an act, at least partially. McFry appears competent enough to have been targeted by scum, but so far that appears almost entirely absent. It was him who tried to paint Dariush as scum on D1, and you happily went along with it, flying under the radar.

zomara mostly appears newbish, especially since he just replaced in. borno hasn't said much of anything yet. You two are, however, active and working together to achieve a newblynch. I'm not even going to put this as a question; MagmaMcFry, Dr.Phibes, you are SCUMMMMM.

Why? He have 1000 posts. This is the first time ever writing on this forum for me.
Wtf, all my targets so far have been killed? My only target was Dariush, yes he died but so did Painiac and i didnt suspct him. YOU did, should i suspect you becuse of that? And is the table flipped now? i suspected zomora then borno came and atlast magma voted him. So first its magma pulling the strings and now its me? Or is that our master plan?!?!?!??!?! *DUN* *DUN* *DUUUHHH* Your reason have far to many variables. Again if you are so sure, why do you still vote on magma? Its doesent matter who of ous you kill and like i said i am a far easier alternative, right?

Is it just me or this WIFOM?

This seems much too relaxed for town.
Tell me, Dr.Phibes, Why are you chainsawing Magma so fiercely? Have you realized that if you don't do anything soon, you will get lynched, and tried to pin the blame on Magma?

Pin the blame on Magma? Just how did you jump to this accusation? I think Magma is the best player in this game, dont know why strategia is voting him. I thought voting on Magma just beacuse hes good is pretty weak. Wanted to want more why he voted on him, hes reply is filled with baseless accusations. Did you read the post or am i missing something? Wait, relaxed? Explain why?

Borno, why do you not suspct Strategia anymore? Or zomora? You tend to switch targets much.

Please, can someone explain the word chainsawing?

Sorry, By 'Pin the blame on magma' I meant 'Subtly pin the vote on magma'. I could of voted for magma or you, but because your  posts seem more scummy, I voted for you. And remember: I am thrown in straight in the game, without a feel for your strategy, as I explained a few posts ago. I am switching votes around so I can get some answers out of you to get a feel for your strategy. I actually still suspect them, but not enough to vote. As for why I am saying that you appear relaxed, it is because of the bolded part of your text. Serious players don't use *'s, and everyone should be serious, as it is LYLO.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

Quote from: borno on April 19, 2012, 05:29:01 am

Serious players don't use *'s, and everyone should be serious, as it is LYLO.

He is making a pretty descent point.

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 09:43:25 am

Quote from: borno on April 19, 2012, 01:04:45 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 15, 2012, 05:46:34 am

Borno, your first action in this thread was to vote Strategia for obscure reasons. I'm kinda missing an introduction.

What do you mean by an introduction? My play-style? As this is my first Mafia, I'm developing a strategy as I go on. But, if you don't think that is an acceptable answer, to analyze  peoples' posts and find scumtells from them, like anyone else would.
Magma, what were you trying to gain from this question?

Well, I was sort of expecting something like "Hi, I'm new here. I reread the thread and found out the following:". Just saying.

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 19, 2012, 03:55:41 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 01:30:58 am

Please, can someone explain the word chainsawing?

Chainsawing means attacking someone to defend whoever that person is attacking. In other words, if Player B is attacking Player C, and Player A begins attacking Player B, seemingly to defend Player C, Player A is chainsawing Player C.

Isn't Player A chainsawing Player B then?

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Excuse me? That's really quite sad. It's the kind of wrong thinking that Strategia's doing already. You've found a possible reason for our actions, but it's still only a possibility until you manage to rule out all other possible explanations, or at least all the likely ones. Did you perchance consider that Phibes and I voted Dariush and you simply because he and you were being scummy? Strategia's irrational bullshit is seriously messing up your thought process.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:19:05 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

Quote from: borno on April 19, 2012, 05:29:01 am

Serious players don't use *'s, and everyone should be serious, as it is LYLO.

He is making a pretty descent point.

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Yes, everyone should be serious beacuse its LYLO, but saying serious players dont use *s is subjective. dont know but i just thought hes accusations was silly. So i was a little silly back.


zomora, you can say the same thing about you and Strategia, (or not you, but you character, bulldog voted same as strategia, you didnt the first day, but we will come to that later and know your following him again, not you your character) I actually think it is more suspicious if we have 2 players voting same as Strategia than me voting same as magma beacuse the chance that 2 players follows Strategias voting blindly, when they have the same character is more than fucking suspicious! Ah yeah, when zomora actually didnt vote same as Strategia, but if my theory is right they new Dariush wasnt scum and its better to have a noob who cant spell than an IC running around. Plus they didnt want to vote same all the time, but now we are back. Btw this leaves ous with 3 noobs and 2 more experienced players, the fact that 2 noobs would be mafia are unlikly beacuse the mafia havent picked blindly and they have succeded going under our radar the whole time, its a long shot to think 2 noobs would have gotten this far. Thats why one of the more experienced players must be mafia and that leaves ous with Magma and Strategia. My money goes on Strategia beacuse i am pretty convinced Magma is a good boy. Really i dont even need to convince borno, the satisfaction i will get when i am right will be enough. Unvote, vote Strategia

I do however want to win, so borno if you still think i am scum and think like me, there most be a experianced mafia as well. Who do you think is most scummy?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 10:34:31 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:19:05 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

Quote from: borno on April 19, 2012, 05:29:01 am

Serious players don't use *'s, and everyone should be serious, as it is LYLO.

He is making a pretty descent point.

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Yes, everyone should be serious beacuse its LYLO, but saying serious players dont use *s is subjective. dont know but i just thought hes accusations was silly. So i was a little silly back.

Well, that eases my suspicion on you a tiny bit. But only a bit.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:19:05 am

My money goes on Strategia beacuse i am pretty convinced Magma is a good boy.

Care to share your evidence in Magma being town?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 10:41:17 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 10:34:31 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:19:05 am

My money goes on Strategia beacuse i am pretty convinced Magma is a good boy.

Care to share your evidence in Magma being town?

Care to share your evidence in me being scum?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:41:32 am

Extend

Well, the only evidence is that i am the only one defending him and beacuse i am not scum and borno is not trying. It is really our word against yours.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 10:57:09 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 10:41:17 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 10:34:31 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:19:05 am

My money goes on Strategia beacuse i am pretty convinced Magma is a good boy.

Care to share your evidence in Magma being town?

Care to share your evidence in me being scum?

I thought I did, but, in case you accidentallypassed over it, here is the quote:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Its not the strongest evidence in the world, but it IS evidence.

Also, for the sake of giving you time to convince me that I am wrong, Extend.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 11:08:27 am

Well, technichly we voted the same person twice and then i voted you (he went along) The thing is, with you and Strategia its always Strategia strating all the votes and like i said earlier, he is the better player so its makes sense you do as he says.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 11:40:05 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 10:57:09 am

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 10:41:17 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 10:34:31 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:19:05 am

My money goes on Strategia beacuse i am pretty convinced Magma is a good boy.

Care to share your evidence in Magma being town?

Care to share your evidence in me being scum?

I thought I did, but, in case you accidentallypassed over it, here is the quote:

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Its not the strongest evidence in the world, but it IS evidence.

I commented on that already. You seem to have skipped over that.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 09:43:25 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Excuse me? That's really quite sad. It's the kind of wrong thinking that Strategia's doing already. You've found a possible reason for our actions, but it's still only a possibility until you manage to rule out all other possible explanations, or at least all the likely ones. Did you perchance consider that Phibes and I voted Dariush and you simply because he and you were being scummy? Strategia's irrational bullshit is seriously messing up your thought process.

See?

Now tell me why it's scummy that Phibes and I think alike, especially considering the situation that Dariush put us in.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 19, 2012, 02:59:30 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 09:43:25 am

Quote from: IronyOwl on April 19, 2012, 03:55:41 am

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 01:30:58 am

Please, can someone explain the word chainsawing?

Chainsawing means attacking someone to defend whoever that person is attacking. In other words, if Player B is attacking Player C, and Player A begins attacking Player B, seemingly to defend Player C, Player A is chainsawing Player C.

Isn't Player A chainsawing Player B then?

More often I've seen it used relative to the player they're defending, not the player they're attacking. I realize the visual image is a bit odd in that case.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 19, 2012, 03:02:51 pm

Makes more sense if one replaces "chainsawing" with "chainsaw defending", as in, defending somebody. With a chainsaw.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 03:09:32 pm

Where is Strategia and borno?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 19, 2012, 03:10:54 pm

Borno posted less than half a day ago. No need to be concerned about his presence or lack thereof.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 19, 2012, 11:09:46 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 03:09:32 pm

Where is Strategia and borno?

Working on a post now. Been kinda busy IRL.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 20, 2012, 02:09:36 pm

Day extended to Monday.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 20, 2012, 02:19:51 pm

I will be away from home until then. May not be able to post.
EXTEND (lack ability to bold)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Pranz on April 20, 2012, 03:00:54 pm

Extend



EDIT: sry, Dr.Phibes here, from a friends computer, accidentally posted from his acc.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: borno on April 20, 2012, 04:38:34 pm

I am rather busy now too. Will post in a few hours.

Extend.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 20, 2012, 05:54:02 pm

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 18, 2012, 11:35:03 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

It's an indicator, and it helps me get a feel for the player. That's it. It's a neutral question that has no immediate bearing on my vote.

I personally don't see how, but I am sure you know what to look for in the reply. Care to teach that technique to me after we are done with this game? Its. . . . . . different. Makes me want to know it for some reason.

Remind me to PM you when the game ends.

Quote

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

Today, you're both voting for zomara, a fairly easy lynch.

That hurt me quite a bit. Am I really that easy to pin as a lynching target?

You're new to Mafia and new to this game, while Magma, Phibes and me have been in it from the beginning, and Magma and me have been in BMs before. Both you and borno, when you just joined, were thrown into a game in progress with existing "relationships" between the players (as in, suspicion and such), and both of you have been throwing votes around trying to get a grip on the situation. That makes it easier to paint you or borno as scum, and you're more active. I think that's why they voted you.

Quote

Quote from: Strategia on April 18, 2012, 11:02:33 am

zomara mostly appears newbish, especially since he just replaced in.

Just to clarify this bit, there's a difference between "newb" and "noob". "Newb" means "new", "noob" is, well..... noob. I'm not calling you a noob, just a newb. FYI.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 18, 2012, 11:40:36 am

Wtf, all my targets so far have been killed? My only target was Dariush, yes he died but so did Painiac and i didnt suspct him. YOU did, should i suspect you becuse of that?

Again, note how I only started laying into Painiac after going through RVS and pressuring others, until I thought I had a scumread. I said right on D1 that you appeared off to me, and I'm not the only one who couldn't get a read on Magma. You two, on the other hand, were rather eagerly going after Dariush. And you've been sticking together ever since.

Quote

And is the table flipped now? i suspected zomora then borno came and atlast magma voted him. So first its magma pulling the strings and now its me? Or is that our master plan?!?!?!??!?!

"Voting first" doesn't mean pulling the strings. If anything, Darvi's the one doing the string-pulling. You're attacking me on a point I didn't even make. Think about how that looks for a bit. No, please, just think about it.

Quote

*DUN* *DUN* *DUUUHHH* Your reason have far to many variables. Again if you are so sure, why do you still vote on magma? Its doesent matter who of ous you kill and like i said i am a far easier alternative, right?

You appear to have missed the point where I said that "more competent = more dangerous", which is why I decided to vote Magma in the first place. If you're going after two scum, I consider it better to go after the better one first, 'cause he's got a better chance of turning suspicion away from himself the longer he's left alive.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 18, 2012, 12:24:40 pm

Look what you've just proved: If Phibes and I are the scumteam, then our actions make sense.

Allow me to make a counterstatement: If Phibes and I are not the scumteam, then our actions make sense.

Do you see the problem here? Both statements are true, so the fact that my actions make sense does not imply anything at all. You've got a suspicion, and you're blindly following it. You're reading all of our posts believing that we are scum, and you continue holding onto your theory because nothing disproves it. What you fail to notice is that there is also no evidence for your theory. That's called confirmation bias, and you should snap out of it immediately.

Good scum's actions always make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be good scum. Right now there's precious little evidence for any theory, and the rampant replacements aren't making it any easier to acquire - you can't really expect zomara or borno to know exactly what drove their predecessors in earlier posts. I've always vacillated between considering Phibes scum or just an idiot, but right now, scum makes more and more sense, and I've never been able to get a read off you, which automatically made you suspicious.

Quote

Consider this a free lesson in rationality. If you don't understand that, then you haven't read enough Harry Potter fanfiction.

I don't quite get this. Are you referring to a specific work? The only HP fan-works I know about are My Immortal and HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. (Blame TV Tropes.)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 09:43:25 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Excuse me? That's really quite sad. It's the kind of wrong thinking that Strategia's doing already. You've found a possible reason for our actions, but it's still only a possibility until you manage to rule out all other possible explanations, or at least all the likely ones. Did you perchance consider that Phibes and I voted Dariush and you simply because he and you were being scummy? Strategia's irrational bullshit is seriously messing up your thought process.

This isn't Sherlock Holmes, and we don't have all the time in the world. Right now, having a possible reason and a possible theory is better than having nothing at all. And zomara's right; once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is enemy action, to quote Ian Fleming.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 19, 2012, 10:19:05 am

zomora, you can say the same thing about you and Strategia, (or not you, but you character, bulldog voted same as strategia, you didnt the first day, but we will come to that later and know your following him again, not you your character) I actually think it is more suspicious if we have 2 players voting same as Strategia than me voting same as magma beacuse the chance that 2 players follows Strategias voting blindly, when they have the same character is more than fucking suspicious! Ah yeah, when zomora actually didnt vote same as Strategia, but if my theory is right they new Dariush wasnt scum and its better to have a noob who cant spell than an IC running around. Plus they didnt want to vote same all the time, but now we are back. Btw this leaves ous with 3 noobs and 2 more experienced players, the fact that 2 noobs would be mafia are unlikly beacuse the mafia havent picked blindly and they have succeded going under our radar the whole time, its a long shot to think 2 noobs would have gotten this far. Thats why one of the more experienced players must be mafia and that leaves ous with Magma and Strategia. My money goes on Strategia beacuse i am pretty convinced Magma is a good boy. Really i dont even need to convince borno, the satisfaction i will get when i am right will be enough. Unvote, vote Strategia

Eugh, lrn2punctuation. I can barely parse this. Okay, I'll try and take it apart for analysis.

Quote

zomora, you can say the same thing about you and Strategia, (or not you, but you character, bulldog voted same as strategia, you didnt the first day, but we will come to that later and know your following him again, not you your character) I actually think it is more suspicious if we have 2 players voting same as Strategia than me voting same as magma beacuse the chance that 2 players follows Strategias voting blindly, when they have the same character is more than fucking suspicious!

Just FYI, this sentence is waaay too long and rambling. Anyway. So people voting with me is more suspicious than you voting with Magma? Is that just because I've been snapping at your heels this entire time?

Quote

Ah yeah, when zomora actually didnt vote same as Strategia, but if my theory is right they new Dariush wasnt scum and its better to have a noob who cant spell than an IC running around. Plus they didnt want to vote same all the time, but now we are back.

So now zomara suddenly isn't following me blindly? As far as knowing Dariush wasn't scum and having newbs around is better than ICs, I don't even know what you're trying to say. Are you just panicking now and throwing every thought you have on here in a desperate attempt to divert suspicion to me? You should know that panicking when under attack is not exactly a towntell.

Quote

Btw this leaves ous with 3 noobs and 2 more experienced players, the fact that 2 noobs would be mafia are unlikly beacuse the mafia havent picked blindly and they have succeded going under our radar the whole time, its a long shot to think 2 noobs would have gotten this far. Thats why one of the more experienced players must be mafia and that leaves ous with Magma and Strategia. My money goes on Strategia beacuse i am pretty convinced Magma is a good boy.

See, this is the problem with your supposed theory. Scum don't get to choose who's scum. (Cults can, but they don't exist in BMs.) Everyone is equally likely to be scum at the start of the game. And you're right about at least one of the scum being more experienced - that would be vague and unreadable Magma, and you would be his newbie lapdog.

Quote

Really i dont even need to convince borno, the satisfaction i will get when i am right will be enough.

So your counterargument is..... "I'm right and you're not"? You don't even need to convince borno? Dear gods man, that kind of arrogance does not reflect well on you, both as a character in the game as well as in general. I mean, if you were someone on the level of Dariush or webadict, it would make some kind of sense, but on you it just looks bad.

---

I'll be out of the country until Tuesday, so I doubt I'll make it back in time for the Monday deadline. (Although knowing this game I'll probably be well on time for when the day ends on wednesday :P)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 21, 2012, 04:43:29 am

Read the whole post... The last part.
Where did i say you can choose whos scum? I said you havent picked your targets blindly.
Its seems you are just dodging what i am saying. First, Dariush was suspicious, he even admited that he didnt care and started trolling in the beginning. So that me and Magma suspected him is not that wrong. Your forgetting there are others in the game that voted him. Yeah, Magma switched votes sometimes, but i am new so i didnt really switch target much and beacuse i thought Dariush was scummy i voted him. You cant say it was three times, beacuse it was the same person TWICE! And he didnt even try to convince any of ous that he wasnt scum. I am not panicking beacuse you "suspect" me, why should i? you are not even voting on me. I am panicking beacuse i know i am right and its soo hard to prove it, but i said why earlier. If you cared to read the post, you would have found that i wrote that two people that are following you is more "suspicious" than if i vote same as Magma two times. This is beacuse they have the same role. I must admit i am not 100 procent sure on zomora but i am 100 procent certian its you!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 21, 2012, 06:43:02 am

Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on April 20, 2012, 05:54:02 pm

You appear to have missed the point where I said that "more competent = more dangerous", which is why I decided to vote Magma in the first place. If you're going after two scum, I consider it better to go after the better one first, 'cause he's got a better chance of turning suspicion away from himself the longer he's left alive.

Aha. You vote me because "more competent = more dangerous". That must mean that "more dangerous = more scum". But this is wrong. You said it yourself:

Quote

Scum don't get to choose who's scum.

If I were scum, then I'd be very dangerous scum, and it would be good for town to lynch me first. But if I were town and I got lynched, what would happen then? We'd lose, that's what. Essentially, you're voting for me so town has a better position on D4 if it comes to D4. But that does not increase the chances of us reaching D4, and that's exactly what we should be doing.

May I suggest that you vote zomara instead? Because we've got some actual strong evidence that zomara is scum: Zomara entered this game on D2, and for the whole rest of D2 he was much more interested in keeping his own image clean than in scumhunting, let's call this weerd (sic) for the sake of my argument. Now let's look at the options:

What is the likelihood that zomara would be weerd if he was scum? Low to medium, considering he would be newbscum.
Now the more important part: What is the likelihood that zomara would be weerd if he was town? Very, very low. The mentality just wouldn't fit.

See the point? The likelihood that Zomara is scum has drastically increased because Zomara was being weerd, and that's because Zomara being town is not a plausible explanation for Zomara being weerd. So go and vote Zomara now, instead of running around shouting the logical equivalent of "This is a theory, therefore it must be correct".

Quote

Good scum's actions always make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be good scum.

Good town's actions always make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be good town. Stop being biased, Strategia.

Quote

I've never been able to get a read off you, which automatically made you suspicious.

Please define your concept of "read". Because if it's the same as mine, then your statement is just wrong.

Quote

Quote

Consider this a free lesson in rationality. If you don't understand that, then you haven't read enough Harry Potter fanfiction.

I don't quite get this. Are you referring to a specific work? The only HP fan-works I know about are My Immortal and HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. (Blame TV Tropes.)

Yes, I'm referring to a specific work, but for the sake of you not vanishing from this thread (yes, it's that awesome), I'll only give you a link after this game is over.

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 09:43:25 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Excuse me? That's really quite sad. It's the kind of wrong thinking that Strategia's doing already. You've found a possible reason for our actions, but it's still only a possibility until you manage to rule out all other possible explanations, or at least all the likely ones. Did you perchance consider that Phibes and I voted Dariush and you simply because he and you were being scummy? Strategia's irrational bullshit is seriously messing up your thought process.

This isn't Sherlock Holmes, and we don't have all the time in the world. Right now, having a possible reason and a possible theory is better than having nothing at all.

At the beginning of the game you have 36 possible theories, each one corresponding to a certain scumteam. Your goal is to make the amount of plausible theories as small as possible. Not by ignoring certain possibilities, but by reducing their plausibility.

Quote

And zomara's right; once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is enemy action, to quote Ian Fleming.

I still fail to see why this applies here.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Spinal_Taper on April 21, 2012, 02:25:37 pm

I'd like to play eventually.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: borno on April 21, 2012, 05:09:27 pm

Sorry I was gone guys. Anyway,
Strategia, Zomara, I looked over all of your recent arguments. In them you are not just being stupid, but you are relying on false arguments because you can't find any real ones! You're voting for magma and not Dr.Phibes because voting Dr.Phibes would be more suspicious!

Strategia, Zomara, why are you SCCCUUUUMMM?!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 21, 2012, 09:49:00 pm

Quote from: borno on April 21, 2012, 05:09:27 pm

Strategia, Zomara, why are you SCCCUUUUMMM?!

You do realize that question is biased, right. And, if you want proof to my reasoning of suspecting magma and phobes, give me 24 hours to get to a computer so i can compile it all in one long winded post.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

I am having trouble finding all the post with the votes in them, but I did happen to notice this:

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment one (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 21, 2012, 06:43:02 am

Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on April 20, 2012, 05:54:02 pm

You appear to have missed the point where I said that "more competent = more dangerous", which is why I decided to vote Magma in the first place. If you're going after two scum, I consider it better to go after the better one first, 'cause he's got a better chance of turning suspicion away from himself the longer he's left alive.

Aha. You vote me because "more competent = more dangerous". That must mean that "more dangerous = more scum". But this is wrong. You said it yourself:

Quote

Scum don't get to choose who's scum.

Quote

If I were scum, then I'd be very dangerous scum, and it would be good for town to lynch me first. But if I were town and I got lynched, what would happen then? We'd lose, that's what. Essentially, you're voting for me so town has a better position on D4 if it comes to D4. But that does not increase the chances of us reaching D4, and that's exactly what we should be doing.

First I think I can actually see what he means by "more competent = more dangerous". Correct me if I am wrong, but a more competent scum can hide himself as town quite easily, allowing him to survive longer and kill more town.

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment two (click to show/hide)

Quote

If I were scum, then I'd be very dangerous scum, and it would be good for town to lynch me first. But if I were town and I got lynched, what would happen then? We'd lose, that's what. Essentially, you're voting for me so town has a better position on D4 if it comes to D4. But that does not increase the chances of us reaching D4, and that's exactly what we should be doing.

There are two scum and 7 town in a BM game with one lynch and on night attack. That mean, if all scum can survive two days 4 people are out. Which is what we have now. with only five players left and no scum scum found. If they last one more day with both scum, that's two more town gone. That leave one town and two scum. Scum can go ahead an reveal themselves right then and there because town is outnumbered and cant do anything.
By taking out one scum There will be two town and one scum left in the game.
Taking all that into account, IF what I believe is correct, It would be easy to see who the other scum is because there woulds only be one scum left who had been defending the other. If you have that train of though then you would have to look for who had been defending who. That would be [Magma and Phibes] and [Strategia and I]. That means if I am lynched and I am scum, that leave Strategia as the next logical choice, or vice versa. That also means that, if Magma is Lynched and is scum, then that leaves Phibes as the next logical choice. This fact was made evident to me by Borno's comment:

Quote from: borno on April 21, 2012, 05:09:27 pm

Strategia, Zomara, why are you SCCCUUUUMMM?!

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment Three (click to show/hide)

Quote

May I suggest that you vote zomara instead? Because we've got some actual strong evidence that zomara is scum: Zomara entered this game on D2, and for the whole rest of D2 he was much more interested in keeping his own image clean than in scumhunting, let's call this weerd (sic) for the sake of my argument. Now let's look at the options:

What is the likelihood that zomara would be weerd if he was scum? Low to medium, considering he would be newbscum.
Now the more important part: What is the likelihood that zomara would be weerd if he was town? Very, very low. The mentality just wouldn't fit.

See the point? The likelihood that Zomara is scum has drastically increased because Zomara was being weerd, and that's because Zomara being town is not a plausible explanation for Zomara being weerd. So go and vote Zomara now, instead of running around shouting the logical equivalent of "This is a theory, therefore it must be correct".

I am going to go ahead and dispel this by mentioning the person that I regrettably got lynched. Dariush. He was a horrid and mean player, so I didn't think twice about voting for him. That is because of the fact that he was, and I quote, "weerd". Lynching him, though, proved that he was town. that means your theory of "weerd"= town is incorrect.

the above only applies if "weerd"=weird

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment four (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Strategia on April 20, 2012, 05:54:02 pm

Good scum's actions always make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be good scum.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 21, 2012, 06:43:02 am

Good town's actions always make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be good town. Stop being biased, Strategia.

You are both wrong. Nether always makes sense because both would be, by nature, trying to find (or "find") scum or keep enough suspicion off of them to do something productive, i.e. trying to find (or "find") scum. That in itself is a scum tell to most, because it makes too much sense.

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment Five (click to show/hide)

Quote

I've never been able to get a read off you, which automatically made you suspicious.

Quote

Please define your concept of "read". Because if it's the same as mine, then your statement is just wrong.

I am sure it is obvious what he means by "read". Its a tell to gauge how scummy a person might be. You, more often than not, read on the lowest part of that gauge. The "Town" part. Because, to Town, everyone is supposed to seem somewhat scummy at least, you stand out like a mountain in Florida. But, for the sake of understanding, what is your concept of "read", Magma?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Quote

Quote

Quote

Consider this a free lesson in rationality. If you don't understand that, then you haven't read enough Harry Potter fanfiction.

I don't quite get this. Are you referring to a specific work? The only HP fan-works I know about are My Immortal and HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. (Blame TV Tropes.)

Quote

Yes, I'm referring to a specific work, but for the sake of you not vanishing from this thread (yes, it's that awesome), I'll only give you a link after this game is over.

Not going to touch this with a AID's infested rapestick.

Spoiler:  Phoenix Wright moment 6 (click to show/hide)

Quote

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 09:43:25 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Excuse me? That's really quite sad. It's the kind of wrong thinking that Strategia's doing already. You've found a possible reason for our actions, but it's still only a possibility until you manage to rule out all other possible explanations, or at least all the likely ones. Did you perchance consider that Phibes and I voted Dariush and you simply because he and you were being scummy? Strategia's irrational bullshit is seriously messing up your thought process.

This isn't Sherlock Holmes, and we don't have all the time in the world. Right now, having a possible reason and a possible theory is better than having nothing at all.

At the beginning of the game you have 36 possible theories, each one corresponding to a certain scumteam. Your goal is to make the amount of plausible theories as small as possible. Not by ignoring certain possibilities, but by reducing their plausibility.

I know nothing of those possible theories. Care to list them for me?

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment 7 (click to show/hide)

Quote

Quote

And zomara's right; once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is enemy action, to quote Ian Fleming.

I still fail to see why this applies here.

Its evidence OF the theories purpose. The reason it hold any water is because of that truth.

---

There is also this:

Quote

Really i dont even need to convince borno, the satisfaction i will get when i am right will be enough.

The only way you would or should not need to convince anyone is if they are scum and working with you, which makes you scum. I am sure that is not what you are aiming at, but that is what, to me, it seemed like you were saying.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:32:18 am

I forgot to mention:
1. Following
moment one and two, the most obvious two people who should be under question are Magma and Strategia.
2. My hypocrocy moments. I was not fully serious.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 22, 2012, 01:17:24 pm

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment one (click to show/hide)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 21, 2012, 06:43:02 am

Strategia:

Quote from: Strategia on April 20, 2012, 05:54:02 pm

You appear to have missed the point where I said that "more competent = more dangerous", which is why I decided to vote Magma in the first place. If you're going after two scum, I consider it better to go after the better one first, 'cause he's got a better chance of turning suspicion away from himself the longer he's left alive.

Aha. You vote me because "more competent = more dangerous". That must mean that "more dangerous = more scum". But this is wrong. You said it yourself:

Quote

Scum don't get to choose who's scum.

Quote

If I were scum, then I'd be very dangerous scum, and it would be good for town to lynch me first. But if I were town and I got lynched, what would happen then? We'd lose, that's what. Essentially, you're voting for me so town has a better position on D4 if it comes to D4. But that does not increase the chances of us reaching D4, and that's exactly what we should be doing.

First I think I can actually see what he means by "more competent = more dangerous". Correct me if I am wrong, but a more competent scum can hide himself as town quite easily, allowing him to survive longer and kill more town.

Nope, your statements are totally correct, and more competent people are obviously also more dangerous. But the point I'm making here is that competence is not a scumtell, and neither is dangerousness. So essentially Strat voted me for reasons that don't translate to scumtells.

Quote

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment two (click to show/hide)

Quote

If I were scum, then I'd be very dangerous scum, and it would be good for town to lynch me first. But if I were town and I got lynched, what would happen then? We'd lose, that's what. Essentially, you're voting for me so town has a better position on D4 if it comes to D4. But that does not increase the chances of us reaching D4, and that's exactly what we should be doing.

There are two scum and 7 town in a BM game with one lynch and on night attack. That mean, if all scum can survive two days 4 people are out. Which is what we have now. with only five players left and no scum scum found. If they last one more day with both scum, that's two more town gone. That leave one town and two scum. Scum can go ahead an reveal themselves right then and there because town is outnumbered and cant do anything.
By taking out one scum There will be two town and one scum left in the game.
Taking all that into account, IF what I believe is correct, It would be easy to see who the other scum is because there woulds only be one scum left who had been defending the other. If you have that train of though then you would have to look for who had been defending who. That would be [Magma and Phibes] and [Strategia and I]. That means if I am lynched and I am scum, that leave Strategia as the next logical choice, or vice versa. That also means that, if Magma is Lynched and is scum, then that leaves Phibes as the next logical choice. This fact was made evident to me by Borno's comment:

Quote from: borno on April 21, 2012, 05:09:27 pm

Strategia, Zomara, why are you SCCCUUUUMMM?!

Great, you know how Mafia works. Now what was your point there? And how has Borno's comment shown you that?

Quote

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment Three (click to show/hide)

Quote

May I suggest that you vote zomara instead? Because we've got some actual strong evidence that zomara is scum: Zomara entered this game on D2, and for the whole rest of D2 he was much more interested in keeping his own image clean than in scumhunting, let's call this weerd (sic) for the sake of my argument. Now let's look at the options:

What is the likelihood that zomara would be weerd if he was scum? Low to medium, considering he would be newbscum.
Now the more important part: What is the likelihood that zomara would be weerd if he was town? Very, very low. The mentality just wouldn't fit.

See the point? The likelihood that Zomara is scum has drastically increased because Zomara was being weerd, and that's because Zomara being town is not a plausible explanation for Zomara being weerd. So go and vote Zomara now, instead of running around shouting the logical equivalent of "This is a theory, therefore it must be correct".

I am going to go ahead and dispel this by mentioning the person that I regrettably got lynched. Dariush. He was a horrid and mean player, so I didn't think twice about voting for him. That is because of the fact that he was, and I quote, "weerd". Lynching him, though, proved that he was town. that means your theory of "weerd"= town is incorrect.

the above only applies if "weerd"=weird

First of all, "weerd" != "weird". I know how to spell "weird", thank you very much. I simply created a new word ("weerd") and defined it to refer to the behaviour you were showing on D2, and I did that so I didn't have to type "much more interested in keeping his own image clean than in scumhunting" every time I meant that. Call it a macro if you want to.

Now let's define "dikk" to refer to Dariush's behaviour in this game. Note that "dikk" != "dick". I voted for Dariush because he was a dikk and because Dariush being a dikk can't be explained by Dariush being sane town.

My premises that lead to the conclusion "Dariush is very likely scum" were:
1) Dariush is very likely sane.
2) Dariush is being a dikk.
3) Sane dikks are very likely scum.
These premises are all completely reasonable, and Dariush was very likely to be scum from an observer's point of view. The fact that Dariush was still town doesn't disprove my reasoning, it merely shows that Dariush was insane.

Now let's apply this to you:

1) You are very likely sane.
2) You are being weerd.
3) Sane weerd people are very likely scum.

Conclusion: You are very likely scum.

And don't you dare be insane as well.

Quote

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment four (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Strategia on April 20, 2012, 05:54:02 pm

Good scum's actions always make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be good scum.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 21, 2012, 06:43:02 am

Good town's actions always make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be good town. Stop being biased, Strategia.

You are both wrong. Nether always makes sense because both would be, by nature, trying to find (or "find") scum or keep enough suspicion off of them to do something productive, i.e. trying to find (or "find") scum. That in itself is a scum tell to most, because it makes too much sense.

How can stuff make too much sense? How can scumhunting not make sense? How is making sense a scumtell?

Quote

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment Five (click to show/hide)

Quote

I've never been able to get a read off you, which automatically made you suspicious.

Quote

Please define your concept of "read". Because if it's the same as mine, then your statement is just wrong.

I am sure it is obvious what he means by "read". Its a tell to gauge how scummy a person might be. You, more often than not, read on the lowest part of that gauge. The "Town" part. Because, to Town, everyone is supposed to seem somewhat scummy at least, you stand out like a mountain in Florida. But, for the sake of understanding, what is your concept of "read", Magma?

My concept of "read" is the same as the one you just described: It's a tell to gauge how scummy a person might be.

Now if I just understood that correctly, you just voted me because I'm the least scummy. I don't know what kind of contortions the logical part of your brain must be going through, but I know for sure that the logical part of my brain just started crying.

Quote

Spoiler:  Phoenix Wright moment 6 (click to show/hide)

Quote

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 19, 2012, 09:43:25 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 19, 2012, 08:58:51 am

I also decided to do a bit of back tracking on my own and both Dr.Phibes and MagmaMcFry seem to have voted for the same person each day's end. if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern. That leads me to believe both of you might be scum. With that in mind, I vote MagmaMcFry.

Excuse me? That's really quite sad. It's the kind of wrong thinking that Strategia's doing already. You've found a possible reason for our actions, but it's still only a possibility until you manage to rule out all other possible explanations, or at least all the likely ones. Did you perchance consider that Phibes and I voted Dariush and you simply because he and you were being scummy? Strategia's irrational bullshit is seriously messing up your thought process.

This isn't Sherlock Holmes, and we don't have all the time in the world. Right now, having a possible reason and a possible theory is better than having nothing at all.

At the beginning of the game you have 36 possible theories, each one corresponding to a certain scumteam. Your goal is to make the amount of plausible theories as small as possible. Not by ignoring certain possibilities, but by reducing their plausibility.

I know nothing of those possible theories. Care to list them for me?

Spoiler: List (click to show/hide)

Theory 1: Scelly and drakon are the scumteam.
Theory 2: Scelly and Phibes are the scumteam.
Theory 3: Scelly and Tiruin are the scumteam.
Theory 4: Scelly and McFry are the scumteam.
Theory 5: Scelly and Strat are the scumteam.
Theory 6: Scelly and Painiac are the scumteam.
Theory 7: Scelly and Irony are the scumteam.
Theory 8: Scelly and Dariush are the scumteam.
Theory 9: drakon and Phibes are the scumteam.
Theory 10: drakon and Tiruin are the scumteam.
Theory 11: drakon and McFry are the scumteam.
Theory 12: drakon and Strat are the scumteam.
Theory 13: drakon and Painiac are the scumteam.
Theory 14: drakon and Irony are the scumteam.
Theory 15: drakon and Dariush are the scumteam.
Theory 16: Phibes and Tiruin are the scumteam.
Theory 17: Phibes and McFry are the scumteam.
Theory 18: Phibes and Strat are the scumteam.
Theory 19: Phibes and Painiac are the scumteam.
Theory 20: Phibes and Irony are the scumteam.
Theory 21: Phibes and Dariush are the scumteam.
Theory 22: Tiruin and McFry are the scumteam.
Theory 23: Tiruin and Strat are the scumteam.
Theory 24: Tiruin and Painiac are the scumteam.
Theory 25: Tiruin and Irony are the scumteam.
Theory 26: Tiruin and Dariush are the scumteam.
Theory 27: McFry and Strat are the scumteam.
Theory 28: McFry and Painiac are the scumteam.
Theory 29: McFry and Irony are the scumteam.
Theory 30: McFry and Dariush are the scumteam.
Theory 31: Strat and Painiac are the scumteam.
Theory 32: Strat and Irony are the scumteam.
Theory 33: Strat and Dariush are the scumteam.
Theory 34: Painiac and Irony are the scumteam.
Theory 35: Painiac and Dariush are the scumteam.
Theory 36: Irony and Dariush are the scumteam.

Quote

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment 7 (click to show/hide)

Quote

Quote

And zomara's right; once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is enemy action, to quote Ian Fleming.

I still fail to see why this applies here.

Its evidence OF the theories purpose. The reason it hold any water is because of that truth.

My point is that it's NOT any evidence whatsoever AGAINST any other theory, because other theories can explain this coincidence equally well.

Spoiler: Tomorrow's headlines (click to show/hide)

   ACE ATTORNEY COMMITS SUICIDE
   "Idiot abused my name"

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 22, 2012, 03:44:02 pm

I think we can rule out borno as scum, beacuse when it was a tie between zomora and magma borno choose to vote me instead of finishing the game. I will know change back my vote on zomora. I chaged my vote in the first place beacuse i thought it would be easier to prove it was Strategia, but seeing Borno came to his senses i dont need too anymore.
unvote, zomora

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 22, 2012, 03:48:22 pm

Omg hahahahahaha, The last part in Magmas text, holy fuck!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 05:42:47 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 22, 2012, 01:17:24 pm

First of all, "weerd" != "weird". I know how to spell "weird", thank you very much. I simply created a new word ("weerd") and defined it to refer to the behaviour you were showing on D2, and I did that so I didn't have to type "much more interested in keeping his own image clean than in scumhunting" every time I meant that. Call it a macro if you want to.

Now let's define "dikk" to refer to Dariush's behaviour in this game. Note that "dikk" != "dick". I voted for Dariush because he was a dikk and because Dariush being a dikk can't be explained by Dariush being sane town.

My premises that lead to the conclusion "Dariush is very likely scum" were:
1) Dariush is very likely sane.
2) Dariush is being a dikk.
3) Sane dikks are very likely scum.
These premises are all completely reasonable, and Dariush was very likely to be scum from an observer's point of view. The fact that Dariush was still town doesn't disprove my reasoning, it merely shows that Dariush was insane.

Now let's apply this to you:

1) You are very likely sane.
2) You are being weerd.
3) Sane weerd people are very likely scum.

Conclusion: You are very likely scum.

Isn't that already a set scumtell?

Quote from: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

Appearing Too Townie: There's no official name for this one, but being too concerned about your image; specifically avoiding things that might be seen as scumtells. The idea is that scum are very concerned about being found out, and so want to act nonscummy. Townies know they're not scum, so they're less concerned about LOOKING nonscummy and more concerned about finding scum.

Which is a coincidence because:

Quote

Now if I just understood that correctly, you just voted me because I'm the least scummy. . . .

It fits that scumtell.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 22, 2012, 01:17:24 pm

How can stuff make too much sense? How can scumhunting not make sense? How is making sense a scumtell?

And answers that question.

---

Quote

Quote

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment two (click to show/hide)

Quote

If I were scum, then I'd be very dangerous scum, and it would be good for town to lynch me first. But if I were town and I got lynched, what would happen then? We'd lose, that's what. Essentially, you're voting for me so town has a better position on D4 if it comes to D4. But that does not increase the chances of us reaching D4, and that's exactly what we should be doing.

There are two scum and 7 town in a BM game with one lynch and on night attack. That mean, if all scum can survive two days 4 people are out. Which is what we have now. with only five players left and no scum scum found. If they last one more day with both scum, that's two more town gone. That leave one town and two scum. Scum can go ahead an reveal themselves right then and there because town is outnumbered and cant do anything.
By taking out one scum There will be two town and one scum left in the game.
Taking all that into account, IF what I believe is correct, It would be easy to see who the other scum is because there woulds only be one scum left who had been defending the other. If you have that train of though then you would have to look for who had been defending who. That would be [Magma and Phibes] and [Strategia and I]. That means if I am lynched and I am scum, that leave Strategia as the next logical choice, or vice versa. That also means that, if Magma is Lynched and is scum, then that leaves Phibes as the next logical choice. This fact was made evident to me by Borno's comment:

Quote from: borno on April 21, 2012, 05:09:27 pm

Strategia, Zomara, why are you SCCCUUUUMMM?!

Great, you know how Mafia works. Now what was your point there? And how has Borno's comment shown you that?

It showed me that I should not just focus on who is scum, but also focusing on who are apart of the scum team. Taking myself out of the equation, it doesn't leave many people.
Plus, looking into the fact that there is likely at least one competent scum:

Quote

That means if I am lynched and I am scum, that leave Strategia as the next logical choice, or vice versa. That also means that, if Magma is Lynched and is scum, then that leaves Phibes as the next logical choice.

That means that it is nether I, nor Borno, nor Phibes that should be checked, but you and Strate. . . . . whatever his name is.

Spoiler: Idea to prove my point (click to show/hide)

 lets have a NL. If they make a night kill, then They will likely (I dont know if they have to) chose a town. From there, we will be easily able to tell who it is. and it will give us a day 4. Or a draw.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 22, 2012, 06:39:08 pm

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 05:42:47 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 22, 2012, 01:17:24 pm

First of all, "weerd" != "weird". I know how to spell "weird", thank you very much. I simply created a new word ("weerd") and defined it to refer to the behaviour you were showing on D2, and I did that so I didn't have to type "much more interested in keeping his own image clean than in scumhunting" every time I meant that. Call it a macro if you want to.

Now let's define "dikk" to refer to Dariush's behaviour in this game. Note that "dikk" != "dick". I voted for Dariush because he was a dikk and because Dariush being a dikk can't be explained by Dariush being sane town.

My premises that lead to the conclusion "Dariush is very likely scum" were:
1) Dariush is very likely sane.
2) Dariush is being a dikk.
3) Sane dikks are very likely scum.
These premises are all completely reasonable, and Dariush was very likely to be scum from an observer's point of view. The fact that Dariush was still town doesn't disprove my reasoning, it merely shows that Dariush was insane.

Now let's apply this to you:

1) You are very likely sane.
2) You are being weerd.
3) Sane weerd people are very likely scum.

Conclusion: You are very likely scum.

Isn't that already a set scumtell?

Quote from: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

Appearing Too Townie: There's no official name for this one, but being too concerned about your image; specifically avoiding things that might be seen as scumtells. The idea is that scum are very concerned about being found out, and so want to act nonscummy. Townies know they're not scum, so they're less concerned about LOOKING nonscummy and more concerned about finding scum.

There you have it. "Weerd" is already an officially recognized scumtell.

Quote

Which is a coincidence because:

Quote

Now if I just understood that correctly, you just voted me because I'm the least scummy. . . .

It fits that scumtell.

No it doesn't. It might fit the scumtell's title (assuming there is such a thing as "too towny"), but it does not fit its description. The description is the exact same thing as what I called "weerd", and the title is just misleading. A better title for this scumtell would be "Caring about appearing towny". You have to understand the reasoning behind a scumtell before you can apply it. Looks like you just looked at the title.

Quote

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 22, 2012, 01:17:24 pm

How can stuff make too much sense? How can scumhunting not make sense? How is making sense a scumtell?

And answers that question.

No it doesn't.

Quote

Quote

Quote

Spoiler: Phoenix Wright moment two (click to show/hide)

Quote

If I were scum, then I'd be very dangerous scum, and it would be good for town to lynch me first. But if I were town and I got lynched, what would happen then? We'd lose, that's what. Essentially, you're voting for me so town has a better position on D4 if it comes to D4. But that does not increase the chances of us reaching D4, and that's exactly what we should be doing.

There are two scum and 7 town in a BM game with one lynch and on night attack. That mean, if all scum can survive two days 4 people are out. Which is what we have now. with only five players left and no scum scum found. If they last one more day with both scum, that's two more town gone. That leave one town and two scum. Scum can go ahead an reveal themselves right then and there because town is outnumbered and cant do anything.
By taking out one scum There will be two town and one scum left in the game.
Taking all that into account, IF what I believe is correct, It would be easy to see who the other scum is because there woulds only be one scum left who had been defending the other. If you have that train of though then you would have to look for who had been defending who. That would be [Magma and Phibes] and [Strategia and I]. That means if I am lynched and I am scum, that leave Strategia as the next logical choice, or vice versa. That also means that, if Magma is Lynched and is scum, then that leaves Phibes as the next logical choice. This fact was made evident to me by Borno's comment:

Quote from: borno on April 21, 2012, 05:09:27 pm

Strategia, Zomara, why are you SCCCUUUUMMM?!

Great, you know how Mafia works. Now what was your point there? And how has Borno's comment shown you that?

It showed me that I should not just focus on who is scum, but also focusing on who are apart of the scum team. Taking myself out of the equation, it doesn't leave many people.
Plus, looking into the fact that there is likely at least one competent scum:

Quote

That means if I am lynched and I am scum, that leave Strategia as the next logical choice, or vice versa. That also means that, if Magma is Lynched and is scum, then that leaves Phibes as the next logical choice.

Aha. So you're saying that the scumteam is either me/Phibes or you/Strategia because two teams seem to have formed. Great job, you know what to do on D4. Can we focus on D3 for now?

Quote

That means that it is nether I, nor Borno, nor Phibes that should be checked, but you and Strate. . . . . whatever his name is.

Excusez-moi? Do you want to stop being investigated? Let's assume that either me/Phibes or you/Strat are the scumteam. We can find out who is the scumteam by investigating all four of us. Why should we restrict ourselves to the two people who, as you say, are better in being/playing town? No, my friend. I've caught half of the scumteam, and I won't let go.

Quote

Spoiler: Idea to prove my point (click to show/hide)

 lets have a NL. If they make a night kill, then They will likely (I dont know if they have to) chose a town. From there, we will be easily able to tell who it is. and it will give us a day 4. Or a draw.

Oh god no. LYLO is called LYLO for a reason: If you don't lynch scum, you lose. Let's say that D3 ends with no-lynch and D4 starts with two scum and two town. Then scum can simply both vote a townie, and since town doesn't have a majority, they can't lynch scum. Therefore, scum is impossible to lynch and has won. Draws don't exist in BMs.
The only possibility to survive after a no-lynch on LYLO is to have the doctor save correctly on N3, assuming a doctor exists, and then we're in the same situation as before. So a no-lynch on LYLO is completely stupid.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 23, 2012, 05:11:30 am

It's time for an IC WALL OF TEXT!~ Yaaaaaaaay!~


Broken into spoilers for readability. I hope that helps and not hurts.

Spoiler: Part One (click to show/hide)

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

First I think I can actually see what he means by "more competent = more dangerous". Correct me if I am wrong, but a more competent scum can hide himself as town quite easily, allowing him to survive longer and kill more town.

You are not hunting competent people. You are hunting scum. Hunting competent scum is even better, but only if it's actually both parts.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

Taking all that into account, IF what I believe is correct, It would be easy to see who the other scum is because there woulds only be one scum left who had been defending the other.

WIFOM is attempting to guess at the motivations and actions of people who know you're attempting to figure out their motivations and actions. Assuming that scum will or won't do something is generally not sound; you need specific evidence in that direction.

Also, defending is not limited to scum on scum. It can also be a form of buddying, which is frequently used to get into a townie's good graces, and depending on your definition, can also cover legitimate chainsawing (that is, attacking someone for a poor attack, not to defend their target) or genuine observation in someone's favor.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

You are both wrong. Nether always makes sense because both would be, by nature, trying to find (or "find") scum or keep enough suspicion off of them to do something productive, i.e. trying to find (or "find") scum. That in itself is a scum tell to most, because it makes too much sense.

Attempting to find scum is generally not seen as a scumtell.

Spoiler: Part Two (click to show/hide)

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

I am sure it is obvious what he means by "read". Its a tell to gauge how scummy a person might be. You, more often than not, read on the lowest part of that gauge. The "Town" part. Because, to Town, everyone is supposed to seem somewhat scummy at least, you stand out like a mountain in Florida.

Quote from: Think0028 on March 19, 2012, 01:13:36 am

Appearing Too Townie: There's no official name for this one, but being too concerned about your image; specifically avoiding things that might be seen as scumtells. The idea is that scum are very concerned about being found out, and so want to act nonscummy. Townies know they're not scum, so they're less concerned about LOOKING nonscummy and more concerned about finding scum.

I take personal credit for poorly naming this one. Do note that the tell regards concern with appearance, especially at the cost of effectiveness, not merely towniness.

Appearing too towny is not, by itself, a scumtell, because there really isn't a point at which someone's so townlike they must be scum. There is, however, a point at which they're so concerned with appearing townlike that they might be scum.

A decent analogy might be to assume you're attempting to catch liars amongst honest people. There is no point at which someone's so honest they're actually a liar, but there is a point at which they're doing so much to look honest that they're probably a liar in disguise, not a genuinely honest person who wants everyone to know about it.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

if I remember correctly, once is a coincidence, twice is suspicious, but, today making the third time, three times is a pattern.

Do note that this is a very loose, often incorrect rule of thumb; it should not be applied to complex situations without proper reasoning. It also involves issues of WIFOM.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

This isn't Sherlock Holmes, and we don't have all the time in the world. Right now, having a possible reason and a possible theory is better than having nothing at all.

While you can never be absolutely certain of anything, it is important to ensure that your best guess is indeed your best guess, not merely a possibility you've decided to run with.

Spoiler: Part Three (click to show/hide)

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

The only way you would or should not need to convince anyone is if they are scum and working with you, which makes you scum. I am sure that is not what you are aiming at, but that is what, to me, it seemed like you were saying.

Convincing other townies is actually often a vital skill in actually accomplishing anything. Without a majority vote, your target isn't going to get lynched, after all. It's not especially uncommon for one or two people to validly suspect someone who later turns out to be scum, but simply be utterly unable to turn that suspicion into a coherent, convincing argument for why anyone else should think they're scum.

It's also not especially uncommon for people to get themselves lynched screaming incoherently that someone is scum for very poorly worded reasons. Sadly, in many cases both are town.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 22, 2012, 03:44:02 pm

I think we can rule out borno as scum, beacuse when it was a tie between zomora and magma borno choose to vote me instead of finishing the game.

Do note that scum is attempting to act like town, and so while there are a handful of situations (primarily ones where they win instantly with no chance of town response) where scum would have no reason not to act a certain way, almost any other instance is potentially risky and thus involves WIFOM.

Also note that in some cases, incompetence, mistakes, or other issues can create odd results. Simply put, assuming the scumteam is perfectly competent is usually not a sound thing to do.

Spoiler: Part Four (click to show/hide)

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 05:42:47 pm

It showed me that I should not just focus on who is scum, but also focusing on who are apart of the scum team.

While this is true, locking yourself into specific thought patterns can be dangerous. It's possible for two scum members to not interact in a meaningfully suspicious way, for instance, but still show scumtells on their own.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

Plus, looking into the fact that there is likely at least one competent scum:

Making assumptions about the competence of the scumteam is generally not wise, as in most cases you've got no real way to tell.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 22, 2012, 10:20:33 am

lets have a NL. If they make a night kill, then They will likely (I dont know if they have to) chose a town. From there, we will be easily able to tell who it is. and it will give us a day 4. Or a draw.

This is actually a valid strategy for MYLO- Mislynch and Lose, a situation where town have two more members than scum, meaning if they lynch town, scum nightkill and then win; but if they nolynch, scum nightkill and they go to LYLO with one fewer suspect.

For LYLO- Lynch or Lose, where town has one more member than scum, the name is quite accurate- town has no choice but to lynch successfully or lose on the spot.

Also note that there is no such thing as a tie in mafia (barring a few bizarre exceptions with strange gametypes). There are sometimes factions or individuals who aren't scum or town, and whose win conditions thus aren't necessarily mutually exclusive with everyone else's, but not in a Beginner's Mafia.

Please note that this does not appear to be particularly LYLO-ish activity levels; aside from Magma and zomara, nobody seems to have much to say.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 23, 2012, 05:35:00 am

Sorry i cant see any reasons for a scum not to end the game and win. It is just stupid to do as Borno if he actually is scum.

Irony, i think everyone agrees it is Strategia and zomora, so what can we do? Except wating for them to say something?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Darvi on April 23, 2012, 05:37:53 am

Scum can't just "end the game". This game doesn't have hammers.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 23, 2012, 08:05:43 am

That may be true, but almost everytime we had finished voting the day ended.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Tiruin on April 23, 2012, 08:19:49 am

=/

Quote from: Think0028

The Day will not end prematurely unless people vote to shorten the day. That is, there is no "hammer" in Beginner's Mafia, where X amount of votes (more than 50%) on a single person immediately ends the day with a lynch on that person. Some games do that, but not this one, and you would be explicitly informed in the rules if the hammer is active.

If there are tied votes for who gets lynched at the end of the day, the day ends in a no-lynch. (Two people vote for Generic_Steve, two people vote for Unassuming_Mary. Nobody gets lynched.)

Each Night, you send in your actions. The cycle continues until one side wins. Days are 72 hours and nights are 24 hours. Weekends count for zero hours.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Strategia on April 23, 2012, 11:14:58 am

I found free wifi. After a quick browse through what's been posted since I left, I'm switching to borno and Phibes as the most likely scumteam. I'll do a more thorough read and reply when I'm back home tomorrow. PFP, you see.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 23, 2012, 11:36:45 am

Extend.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Dr.Phibes on April 23, 2012, 02:30:06 pm

Strategia, like changing suspects much? Why do you suspect everyone except zomora?

Extend(can we even extend if everyone have voted?)

I seriously wonder why people think it is borno, especially Strategia, he thought it was me and Magma and know he think it is me and borno? Still using the voting as hes defence, he could have "ended" last week, but instead he voted me and if you think we are scum team that makes it even stranger.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 23, 2012, 04:43:27 pm

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 23, 2012, 08:05:43 am

That may be true, but almost everytime we had finished voting the day ended.

Game end and total votes have no bearing on each other. Sometimes 14-player games lynch people on 3 votes, because it beats out all the other 2-vote ties and people not voting at all or still voting someone they just slightly suspect.

You can generally find when the day is scheduled to end in the latest votecount.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 23, 2012, 02:30:06 pm

Extend(can we even extend if everyone have voted?)

Votes are not a static, permanent statement of your final decision.

So yes, you may vote to Extend even when all players are currently voting someone. In fact, it's often seen as suspicious if someone isn't voting anyone when the day's supposed to be ending, since it implies that they don't have any real suspects.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 23, 2012, 05:35:00 am

Sorry i cant see any reasons for a scum not to end the game and win. It is just stupid to do as Borno if he actually is scum.

As Darvi has pointed out, there is no way to instantly end the game in a BM, meaning any attempt to win for scum has some element of risk to it. This makes it very risky to attempt to infer alignment from any particular actions or lack thereof.

This isn't to say it's impossible to infer someone as more or less townlike from their actions, but it's WIFOM, because you'd have to know exactly what they're thinking for that train of logic to work.

Quote from: Dr.Phibes on April 23, 2012, 05:35:00 am

Irony, i think everyone agrees it is Strategia and zomora, so what can we do? Except wating for them to say something?

If you're absolutely certain, you may vote to Shorten. Do remember that town needs a unanimous decision to overcome a scum vote block at this stage of the game (which, again, scum might or might not create), and that the entire game rests on your decision here. A mislynch results in town losing, so you should be very, very certain before intentionally rushing the lynch.

Also bear in mind that there is always more information to be collected. Investigating players you don't believe are scum but have poor reads on, for instance, can be a productive way to confirm or reconsider your current suspicions.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 24, 2012, 01:35:09 am

Votecount!
zomara0292 [3]: Dr.Phibes, MagmaMcFry, borno
Dr.Phibes [1]: Strategia
MagmaMcFry [1]: zomara0292
Day extended to Wednesday. Now need at least 3 people in order to extend.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 08:02:57 am

Just to make sure I am looking through this correctly, I am the replacement of who's replacement?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Tiruin on April 24, 2012, 08:05:56 am

drakon136 > Bulldog > zomara0292

There is a search option.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 08:11:55 am

Quote from: Tiruin on April 24, 2012, 08:05:56 am

drakon136 > Bulldog > zomara0292

There is a search option.

Thanks. And sorry. I once again pulling myself into something I aught not. As in pulling out my ultra-super fine comb through this hells nappy hair of information for the last three days trying to find what it is that Strategia must have, and to see if Magma (or was it Phibes) has any truth in the fact that my predecessors voted along with him, and, if he is, the reasoning behind them doing so. I am also doing the same with magma and phibes. yah.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 08:53:17 am

OK. I need a way to severly shorten down what I need to read and focus on something specified towards scum hunting.

Phibes, Magama, Borno, and Strategia, please list who you think is town and why? I would prefer it if you use quotes from what they have said in the past, to back up your argument/point.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 24, 2012, 12:55:05 pm

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 08:53:17 am

OK. I need a way to severly shorten down what I need to read and focus on something specified towards scum hunting.

Phibes, Magama, Borno, and Strategia, please list who you think is town and why? I would prefer it if you use quotes from what they have said in the past, to back up your argument/point.

I'm town, and I can't prove that. You're not town, and I proved that already. Phibes, borno and Strat are essentially identical in behavior IMO, with subtle differences in only grammar, opinion and activity level. I've found no strong scumtells in their statements yet.


Now why are you asking us four to reread the thread, while you're sitting there waiting for us to finish? Why do you need us to give you information in nice prepared chunks? Why don't you look through the thread yourself? Are you just too lazy or do you have a better reason? Also, why are you asking us to show how people are town (you can't show that)? Finally, would you find your demands reasonable if I would be asking them from you?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 01:30:02 pm

Yes, actualy, becuase I have been doing it for the last couple of days.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 24, 2012, 01:44:17 pm

Which question was that the answer of, and what about the other questions?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 04:12:59 pm

reply to that will have to wait until tomorrow. EXTEND(bold)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: IronyOwl on April 25, 2012, 01:15:20 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 08:11:55 am

Thanks. And sorry.

It's alright. I had difficulty hunting down who you were/used to be also; the search function didn't like any of the questions I asked it.

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 08:11:55 am

As in pulling out my ultra-super fine comb through this hells nappy hair of information for the last three days trying to find what it is that Strategia must have, and to see if Magma (or was it Phibes) has any truth in the fact that my predecessors voted along with him, and, if he is, the reasoning behind them doing so. I am also doing the same with magma and phibes. yah.

Not all information is necessarily relevant. If you're having trouble focusing on everything at once, don't focus on everything at once. If nothing else, you can pursue one or two leads or quandaries at a time, rather than trying to process everything at the same time.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 25, 2012, 04:42:16 am

Quote from: Strategia on April 23, 2012, 11:14:58 am

I found free wifi. After a quick browse through what's been posted since I left, I'm switching to borno and Phibes as the most likely scumteam. I'll do a more thorough read and reply when I'm back home tomorrow. PFP, you see.

Strategia, where are you?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D2 - Looks Like The Cop ... Just Croaked [7/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 25, 2012, 07:58:35 am

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 04:12:59 pm

reply to that will have to wait until tomorrow. EXTEND(bold)

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 24, 2012, 12:55:05 pm

Quote from: zomara0292 on April 24, 2012, 08:53:17 am

OK. I need a way to severly shorten down what I need to read and focus on something specified towards scum hunting.

Phibes, Magama, Borno, and Strategia, please list who you think is town and why? I would prefer it if you use quotes from what they have said in the past, to back up your argument/point.

I'm town, and I can't prove that. You're not town, and I proved that already. Phibes, borno and Strat are essentially identical in behavior IMO, with subtle differences in only grammar, opinion and activity level. I've found no strong scumtells in their statements yet.


Now why are you asking us four to reread the thread, while you're sitting there waiting for us to finish? Why do you need us to give you information in nice prepared chunks? Why don't you look through the thread yourself? Are you just too lazy or do you have a better reason? Also, why are you asking us to show how people are town (you can't show that)? Finally, would you find your demands reasonable if I would be asking them from you?

Quote

Now why are you asking us four to reread the thread, while you're sitting there waiting for us to finish?

I am not just sitting and waiting. I am pulling together my on proof ow who I think is town and why.

Quote

Why do you need us to give you information in nice prepared chunks?

So that we can carefully examine each others viewpoints.

Quote

Why don't you look through the thread yourself?

  I am and have been.

Quote

Are you just too lazy or do you have a better reason?

Yes I am lazy, by nature, but, I am not a mind reader. I can not tell why you think things. if I could, I would be able to tell everyone who was scum right now.

Quote

Also, why are you asking us to show how people are town (you can't show that)?

I am not asking you to show who is town and who isn't. I am asking why you think Y and Z are town.

Quote

Finally, would you find your demands reasonable if I would be asking them from you?

I do think it is a difficult thing to do, but I don't think it is impossible. That is why I asked and am doing it myself.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D1 - Who Moderates the Moderators? Me [7/7, 2/2, 1/1]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 25, 2012, 09:48:03 am

Quote from: Think0028 on March 28, 2012, 11:19:09 am

Votecount!

Dariush [3]: Dr.Phibes, MagmaMcFry, Tiruin
Painiac [3]: Strategia, Dariush, BullDog
Strategia [2]: IronyOwl, Painiac

Not Voting: Scelly9

Day ends today!

---

WOrst crtap came up. Leaving for the reast of the week.
New topic posted in the Labrador Canine Squad forums: Version 4.54.1 released

Hey everyone! I spent the weekend crushing some bugs that popped up in the new version. Here's a small changelist:

• New armor added! Dog sweaters provide resistance to biting.
• Game actually winnable now: small bug made it impossible for certain chihuahuas to be removed from the Kennel of Representatives.
• Reduced the chance of success of making a sad puppy dog face to escape from dog catchers.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: zomara0292 on April 25, 2012, 09:49:17 am

Worst crap came up. Leaving for the rest of the week.
Sorry for the mist post.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 26, 2012, 01:48:49 am

The game is over!


Zomara has been banned! He was town!

Well, 4 people left. And there were definitely two trolls.

Magma and Borno seize this golden opportunity to ban all the other mods! With their newfound dictatorial control, they turn the board into a haven of trolling and despair. The LCS community has been destroyed, permanently.

borno and Magma, Scum, have won!
Deadchat
http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/2vk3wnhJBQC (http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/2vk3wnhJBQC)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: Think0028 on April 26, 2012, 01:49:50 am

Scumchat will be posted shortly: lost the link among my bookmarks.

ICs, feedback?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Darvi on April 26, 2012, 01:55:31 am

Posting this to piss off Magma (http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/xFRw9L5cjCxe).

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 26, 2012, 01:57:52 am

Darvi, stop ninjametatrolling.

Strategia: http://hpmor.com/ (http://hpmor.com/). Read it.

Also, I have the sudden urge to apologize for winning.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: IronyOwl on April 26, 2012, 04:39:52 am

Damn it. I was sure it was zomara and, to a lesser extent, Strategia. D: Another example of the dangers of assigning teams!

McFry's definitely ready to join a real game, and in all likelihood be one of the better players in it.

zomara needs to stop swimming in wine and outwitting himself, and spend more time scumhunting and trying to figure people out the traditional way. Notice, for instance, that his entire thing about how McFry and Phibes must be scum together because they voted the same person three times was completely wrong, all while he lacked any real reads on anyone on their own merits ("McFry is scum because this is a scummy thing he keeps doing.")


I'll go back over the game and give more detailed comments later, but all in all everyone did fairly well. The constant replaces probably complicated things as well, and I wasn't nearly as helpful as I should have been.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Darvi on April 26, 2012, 04:44:04 am

Also, circular logic abound. "McFry is scum because he did that thing that he did because he's scum."

Correct scumpick for all the wrong reasons.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Darvi on April 26, 2012, 05:02:13 am

Hmm i guess it's also time for me to make the next BM.

I'll try to whip up an OP as fast as I can.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Tiruin on April 26, 2012, 05:36:51 am

Well, Bah. I'm never able to play well as town anything.

Good game, scum. Good game, all.

Eagerly awaiting BM XXXIII with tears.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Tiruin on April 26, 2012, 05:40:13 am

Re-read scum chat.

I am the worst townie ever.  :'(

Edit: Dariush hasn't answered about his actions, and that is what is still going on my mind. How does one teach, by RiA?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 26, 2012, 06:06:04 am

One doesn't.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Jim Groovester on April 26, 2012, 12:47:59 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on April 26, 2012, 05:40:13 am

Edit: Dariush hasn't answered about his actions, and that is what is still going on my mind. How does one teach, by RiA?

It's been handled. Dariush will not be an IC in future Beginner's Mafias.

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 26, 2012, 06:06:04 am

One doesn't.

Regardless of what Dariush did, you made sport out of excessively and abusively bashing him and provoking him, and then demand he take it sitting down because he was an IC. This is not the sort of way I appreciate my ICs being treated, and it's not any way I want to see any player being treated in games elsewhere on the subforum.

Don't be a dick.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 26, 2012, 02:55:09 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on April 26, 2012, 12:47:59 pm

Regardless of what Dariush did, you made sport out of excessively and abusively bashing him and provoking him, and then demand he take it sitting down because he was an IC. This is not the sort of way I appreciate my ICs being treated, and it's not any way I want to see any player being treated in games elsewhere on the subforum.

Don't be a dick.

I was merely trying to win the game, and psychologically exploiting Dariush seemed like a good strategy. My intent was solely to win this game, never to mentally harm Dariush, and I sincerely apologize for any lasting damage I might have caused in the process (not that I'd expect there to be any). But this is Mafia we're talking about, right? Are you seriously saying that I shouldn't have attacked Dariush that hard? Do you want me to go easy on your ICs? People don't play Mafia to exchange pleasantries, and it won't be fun if I can't play at my full strength. Perhaps it will please you to know that I don't show this behaviour outside of Mafia, but you can't place any restrictions on how I behave in a Mafia game (although you may feel free to attack my behaviour in-game). Okay?

Also, it's kinda ironic when you say that I shouldn't abuse the abusive guy.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Shakerag on April 26, 2012, 03:24:45 pm

Quote from: MagmaMcFry on April 26, 2012, 02:55:09 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on April 26, 2012, 12:47:59 pm

Regardless of what Dariush did, you made sport out of excessively and abusively bashing him and provoking him, and then demand he take it sitting down because he was an IC. This is not the sort of way I appreciate my ICs being treated, and it's not any way I want to see any player being treated in games elsewhere on the subforum.

Don't be a dick.

I was merely trying to win the game, and psychologically exploiting Dariush seemed like a good strategy. My intent was solely to win this game, never to mentally harm Dariush, and I sincerely apologize for any lasting damage I might have caused in the process (not that I'd expect there to be any). But this is Mafia we're talking about, right? Are you seriously saying that I shouldn't have attacked Dariush that hard? Do you want me to go easy on your ICs? People don't play Mafia to exchange pleasantries, and it won't be fun if I can't play at my full strength. Perhaps it will please you to know that I don't show this behaviour outside of Mafia, but you can't place any restrictions on how I behave in a Mafia game (although you may feel free to attack my behaviour in-game). Okay?

Also, it's kinda ironic when you say that I shouldn't abuse the abusive guy.

I have my doubts that you (or anyone, really) could mentally harm Dariush. 

Having said that, and without doing a full re-read of the thread, I have difficulty pinning much blame on Magma here.  As I recall from keeping up with this game, Dariush was much more ... colorful and provoking in his speech. 

And ... [okay, I've rewitten this several times, so I'll just cut it to the bone] as something for everyone to keep in mind for the future, one can play aggressively and "not hold back" without having to delve into heavy insults and personal attacks.  This kind of game can make you act like an asshole at times, but let's try and be civil assholes, mm?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Darvi on April 26, 2012, 03:36:51 pm

Quote from: Shakerag on April 26, 2012, 03:24:45 pm

This kind of game can make you act like an asshole at times, but let's try and be civil assholes, mm?

When am I not?

Okay, when I drop the civility, but otherwise...

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 26, 2012, 04:15:32 pm

Quote from: Shakerag on April 26, 2012, 03:24:45 pm

I have my doubts that you (or anyone, really) could mentally harm Dariush. 

I have them too.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on April 26, 2012, 04:20:48 pm

Dariush's ego is bulletproof. His problem is that he lets it get in the way of playing well.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - D3 - I Think The Mod Doesn't Know Irony [5/9]
Post by: MagmaMcFry on April 30, 2012, 03:48:49 pm

Something I almost forgot about:

Hey Strategia,

Quote from: Strategia on April 23, 2012, 11:14:58 am

I'm switching to borno and Phibes as the most likely scumteam.

how come?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXII - E3 - Game Over - Scum Victory
Post by: Tiruin on April 30, 2012, 10:00:47 pm

As this is bump'd, I'd say Strategia and the rest of the town had a good play!

Turned the tables later in Day 3 though, that was good work.