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Finally... => Forum Games and Roleplaying => Mafia => Topic started by: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 11:18:10 am

Title: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 11:18:10 am

Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You

or

It's a Wonderful Mafia

The Reapers Game. 

A one week competition held on an alternate plane of existence call the UG or Underground

All Players enter for the same reason: The ultimate prize that awaits them at the end.

To enter they must give up the thing they hold most dear.

Any who survive until the end of the Game and win are rewarded. 

All who fail are Erased from existence completely.

Usually the Game lasts one week, a new mission being issued every day. 

This Game however, the rules are a bit different.

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Player List

• Hapah
• Deathsword
• Boltur
• Mr. Dwarfinton Geen
• FluffyBinLaden Dustylou2
• Borno
• Batman Wayne kingfisher1112

ICs

• Dariush
• Jim Groovester

Scum IC

• Shakerag

Replacements

• blackmagechill

Introduction

Welcome to Beginner's Mafia XXXV. As the title suggests, this game is for beginners. If you have no idea how to play or you have some experience but you're still not quite sure what to do, then this is the right place for you. If you sign up, your goal is onefold: Learn how to play the game of mafia. Since this is not an easy thing to do on your own and we wouldn't dream of forcing you to do it, you will be assisted by two 'inexperienced challenged' players, or ICs. The ICs are experienced players on the board who have signed up to help you learn. You can always trust that the advice they give is genuine, however, you can not always trust the IC, as they are players in the game and have the same likelihood of being scum as every other single player.

If this is your first time playing, keep in mind that games of forum mafia take several weeks, and can sometimes run longer than a month, and that you are expected to be able to play continuously through that time. If you can't anticipate being able to play for that long for whatever reason, then maybe the game of mafia isn't for you. But if it is, then welcome to the mafia subforum, and I hope you have a great time playing.

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Gameplay and Concept

The game of mafia has a simple concept. A large group of players known as the town plays against a smaller group of players known as the mafia. In this setup, there are nine players, with seven town and two mafia.

Before the game begins, each players is given a role and an alignment by the moderator. There are two alignments in this setup: Town and Mafia. The town outnumber the mafia, but each individual member of the town does not know the alignment of any of the other members. The mafia know the alignment of everyone on their team and they can discuss the game privately in a special mafia chat. The mafia has access to a nightkill that they may use in the Night phase, while the town occasionally has roles with abilities that are used during the night.

Once everyone has a role, the game begins in the Day phase. During the Day phase, players may discuss the game and each player has a vote that they cast publicly to lynch a player. At the end of the day after some predetermined amount of time, the player with the most votes is lynched. Lynching does two things: it reveals a player's role and alignment, and it removes a player from the game. Once lynched, a player is no longer allowed to post in the thread.

Once the day ends, the game proceeds to Night. During the Night, discussion is prohibited. The mafia team picks a target to nightkill. If available, any town power roles use their actions as well. At the end of the night, the target the mafia chose to nightkill has their role and alignment revealed, and that player is removed from the game in a similar way to being lynched. Once the night ends, the game proceeds to another Day.

Both teams win by eliminating the other. However, due to the nature of the teams, they win very differently. The town win by finding and lynching the mafia, while the mafia win by avoiding being lynched and nightkilling.

Potential Roles

Vanilla Townie - A member of the town with no special abilities.
Mafioso - A member of the mafia with no special abilities.
Cop (Town) - A cop may choose to inspect a single player during the night and learn that player's alignment.
Doctor (Town) - A doctor may choose a single player to protect during the night, preventing that player from being nightkilled.
Roleblocker (Mafia) - A roleblocker may choose a single player to block, preventing that player from performing his action.
Godfather (Mafia) - A godfather appears town to Cop inspections.

The only role that receives results in this setup is the Cop. All other roles are not informed if they were successful or not.

There is no limit to the number of Vanilla Townies or Mafiosos the game may have, but all other roles have a maximum of one.

Spoiler: Role PMs (click to show/hide)

Here is the list of potential role PMs. This is to discourage flavor claiming from confirming role.

Quote

Harrier Reaper (MAFIOSO)

You are a mid-ranking Reaper in the Games. Your job is simply to erase as many Players as possible, in this case all of them before they erase you.

Each night you and your team may choose a target to erase. (Each night, you and your team will select a player to nightkill, removing that player from play.)

You are SCUM. You win when the TOWN TEAM has as many or less players than the scum team. You may talk to your ally and scum IC in scum chat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16-V0XnYEZQ&feature=player_embedded).

Quote

Support Reaper (ROLEBLOCKER)

You are a low ranking Reaper in the Games; your job is to give players a hard time by creating barriers and setting challenges to pass them.  This game however, you have been assigned the task of eliminating all players alongside your partner.

Each night you may erect a barrier; trapping a player and preventing them from doing anything that night.  (Each night you may select a player. If they use an action during the night, you block them from performing the action.)

Additionally, you and your team may choose a target to erase. (Each night, you and your team will select a player to nightkill, removing that player from play.)

You are SCUM. You win when the TOWN TEAM has as many or less players than the scum team. You may talk to your ally and scum IC in scum chat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_9HzahFfkw&feature=related).

Quote

Koki Kariya (GODFATHER)

You are a mid-ranking harrier Reaper. Really, you could be an officer, but you turned down the promotion so you could laze about and enjoy life.

Since you never seem to do anything, anyone trying to determine whether you are a Reaper or Player comes to the conclusion that you are a Player. Never seeing you do anything that seems Reaper-ish, or really anything at all. (Should a Cop investigate you at night, you return the result of town alignment instead of mafia.)

Each night you and your team may choose a target to erase. (Each night, you and your team will select a player to nightkill, removing that player from play.)

You are SCUM. You win when the TOWN TEAM has as many or less players than the scum team. You may talk to your ally and scum IC in scum chat (http://t.co/ca31My7).

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Quote

Sanae Hanekoma (DOCTOR)

You were born on March 3, have a blood type of A, are a Pisces, a big gambler, and love the word "windfall" and the word "natto" gets your tummy rumbling.  What that isn’t good enough for you? 

Okay then, you are Sanae Hanekoma. Owner of the Wild Kat café down on Cat Street.  You keep an eye on the Game and make sure that nobody bends the rules, not that you have any real authority, but you do what you can to help out players here and there.

During each Night you may choose a target and prevent them from being Erased. (Each night, you may select a player. If they are targeted by the scum team for the nightkill, you prevent that player from dying.)

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Quote

Yoshiya “Joshua” Kiryu (COP)

You’re a strange boy who’s always had the power to see things that others couldn’t, including the UG and the Reaper’s Game held within.  As of such, you have built up an extensive knowledge of the Game and its workings.

During each Night you may choose a target and use your extensive knowledge of the UG to determine whether the person is a Player or a Reaper. (Each night you may inspect a player and learn their alignment.)

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Notes about the ICs

The ICs are here solely to teach new players how to play, but remember, they are also players in the game. This means they have the same chance to be scum as any other player and it is entirely possible for one IC or even both ICs to be scum. Regardless of their alignment, they are obligated to provide you with genuine advice, so that even if you don't trust the IC, you can trust the advice they give. Some ICs will use a special 'IC voice' to alert players that they are delivering honest, unfiltered advice, while some don't.

The ICs have the special privilege of being able to talk while dead. This is so that they can continue to give advice even if they are killed during the course of the game.

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Rules

• Voting - Votes are cast in red. Other colors may be ignored.
  • Phantom of the Library,
  • Vote Phantom of the Library,
  • Phantom,
  • POTL,
  • Vote Fan-dumb of the Lyeberries,
  • Phantom of the Scumbuckets,
  Are all acceptable ways to cast a vote if the target is clear enough.
  • If you want to remove your vote, you may put unvote in red text. You must explicitly state this.  It is possible to put the name of the player you were voting afterwards, but it is not recommended as it can lead to confusion.
• Death - When you are dead, you are prohibited from posting in the thread. You may make a single 'bah' post after you die, however, it must not contain any game-related information.
• PMs - PMs between players are prohibited. You may freely PM the moderator to ask game-related questions, however, what the moderator may reveal is limited.
  
  • Do not quote any direct correspondence with the moderator, including role PMs and rule-related queries.
• Edits - Editing posts is prohibited. Do not edit your post for any reason, even if your post comes out as a trainwreck of formatting, spelling, punctuation, and/or grammar. The preview button exists; use it.
• Replacements/Activity - If you find yourself unable to play, you may, and should, request a replacement. We may try to talk you out of it if it's for any other reason besides you not having enough time to play.
  • Prods may be requested for a player. If they have not posted in the thread within 24 hours, excluding weekends, they will be prodded.
  • If you stop playing my game altogether without notifying me, I will come looking for you.
  • Please be active. The greatest killer of beginner games is poor activity.
• Day/Night Length - Days will last 72 hours, excluding weekends. Nights will last 24 hours, or until all night actions are received.
• Extensions/Shortens - A player may vote for an extension to increase the length of the day. It requires >33% of the current number of players to request an extension for an extension to be granted. A player may also vote for a shorten. It requires >50% of the current number of players for a shorten to be granted. Extensions increase day length by 48 hours, while shortens will immediately end the day as soon as possible. There is no limit to the number of extensions that may be granted.
  • Votes for extension/shorten are done in boldface. Extend, Extension, Extend it up yo, Shorten it out y'all are acceptable ways to vote for an extension/shorten.
  • Extensions/shortens can be opposed by declaring opposition, and they count against the total number of votes for an extension/shorten. Extensions count as opposition to shortens and vice versa.
• External Participation - While the game is ongoing, if you are not a player, an IC, or a mod, refrain from posting in the thread. I know this won't stop some of you.
• Play to win! There is no hopeless situation, so don't ever give up. And remember, be bold! You learn nothing and you gain nothing by holding back.

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Resources and Guides


Our own Bay12 Mafia tutorial (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=39338.0)
The Notable Games archive. Read a famous game from start to finish! Learn some Mafia history. (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=64229.0)
The Mafiascum wiki. Lots of theory, terminology, and game analysis. (http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page)
An Interactive Flash tutorial by one of the Mafiascum.net people. Helpful visualization! (http://cataldo.freeshell.org/mafia/mafiascum04.swf)

Spoiler: Dakarian's Scumhunting Bible, reposted here for your convenience (click to show/hide)

A VERY rough sketch of how a scumhunt is done (to help those who aren't sure now).
Step 1: When you have no suspicions on anyone, pick someone at random (I MEAN random.. some use Random.org for this!), take a glance as their past posts, and talk to them, usually with a vote.  The goal is not to kill but to learn more about them.  The vote is a "Pressure Vote", simply used to make sure they don't ignore you.

Step 2: When someone feels 'off' to you: perhaps you disliked their answer, or maybe they scare you, or confuse you with their text.  Perhaps they look fine but your feelings or your gut says something is wrong. Perhaps you see them do one scumtell.  Don't ignore it: make them your target.  Attack them.  Tell them what bothers you about them.  Push them, harass them.  Tell them how scummy they are.  Ask them every question in the book.. and I mean EVERYTHING:

Litia: "You bother me.  Vote Dakarian!"

Dak: Meh.  Why?

Litia: "Because you bother me.  Why are you pushing me off as if it doesn't matter?"

Dak: "What? No, you just have nothing on me."

Litia: "You're voting for Vector.  why?"

Dak: "He looked scummy.."

Litia: "Vagueness is a scumtell!  "Scummy.. how is he scummy!"

Dak: "He just is.. you don't have a reason to go after me either."

Litia: "OMGUSing now Mr.Scum?  Being defensive?  You also didn't answer my question!"


Note, this is Step 2: Litia doesn't feel like she knows Dakarian is scum.. just had a 'feeling'.  She has no hard evidence, nothing real.  The questions are to add pressure.. make Dakarian crack and panic.  If you did it right, they WILL town or scum.  WHEN they do, you will be able to see more of their true self.  From there, decide if you can find them as scum for truth.  If you don't: pull out and go to your next suspect: if no one else is there, go back to Step 1.

If you do believe they are scum after that, Step 3:


Step 3: When you believe someone is scum, gather evidence.  Find every scum tell, every sign of their true motives.  Pull more from them.  DON'T LET GO!  Even if the town ignores you or even votes for you because of it, DO IT ANYWAY!  Push, push, PUSH, ***PUSH*** until you have solid proof of what they are.

If you can't find enough to prove them and run out of things to say, check one more time to see if you still feel he's scum, then pull back, look at others (Step 2) but be ready to go back to them at any time.  If your convinced and ready to kill them, Step 4

Step 4: Final step.  It's time to convince the town.  Show what you have.  Push the target so they show more scumminess.  Attack, but do it only to demonstrate to the town what you KNOW is true.  You aren't trying to argue with the mafia anymore.. you are trying to show the town why you are right and Mr.Mafia MUST be lynched.  If you are at this point, only 3 things can happen:

1.  The scum is lynched.
2. You are given so much information that you become CONVINCED that the target is town. (no less than CONVINCED.. doubt, maybe, 'perhaps' won't due)
3. You are dead.



That's how a basic scumhunt is done.  One last note on doubt:

Doubt is something that's ok to have but UGLY to show.  If you doubt or have second thoughts, DON'T DISPLAY IT.  If you think "He looks passive but I don't know..."  you SAY "You scum!  Stop being passive!!!"  If you think "He may have a good reason to attack guy really." say "Give me your reasons and stop being vague."

Doubt is something for yourself.  When you have doubt, go back and see if your original ideas still hold up.  If they do or if you find yourself saying "I'm not sure" then go back to the attack until you are sure.  This ain't the USA: we play by Guilty until Proven Innocent here.  Unless you can get yourself to believe they may be honest, keep the attack.

So doubt is ok to have if used right.. but the town does NOT need to hear it.  If you doubt, accuse anyway as if you know.  If you wonder, accuse as if you know it.  If you know the answer, ASK ANYWAY and let THEM answer.  Make them convince you they are town: don't do the job for them.


And that's scumhunting in a nutshell.  Everyone, try to figure out what Step you are on and work accordingly.  Note that you should be almost done Step 1 by the end of Day 1 (though some may be higher by then).  If you aren't, keep random voting and consider an Extension.

If you don't know WHAT you are.. you're in Step 1.  Get to random voting.

Last note: 'Not voting' should only be done when you are doing a quick look over everyone's past.  Otherwise, your vote and your attention should always be on SOMEONE, even if it is at random.

It's best for a lynch to be for a reason reason.. but it's better for someone to be lynched randomly than for no lynch to occur at all.

Spoiler: CEAs (Commonly Encountered Abbreviations) and Other Terminology Commonly Found in Bay12 Mafia (click to show/hide)

Alignment - Who you share a victory condition with. Town-aligned, Scum-aligned, or third party alignments.

Bandwagon - Multiple votes on a single person. Can be justified, or unjustified. Unjustified bandwagons are scummy. Joining bandwagons blindly or without reason is also scummy.

BM - Beginner's Mafia (Or, Bastard Mod, a Mafia game with a purposefully unreliable moderator, or misleading information)

Bus - (noun: the bus ; verb: bussing, throwing him/her under the bus) When a mafia member attacks another one in order to make themselves look like a loyal townie when his or her scumpartner gets lynched.

Cult - A group of players that share a win condition, know each other, and can communicate freely. They are generally a second type of scum, although rarely they can be town-aligned. Instead of a kill, they can recruit players into the cult. There is generally a cult leader, who is in charge of recruiting.

FoS - Finger of Suspicion, writing someone's name in blue signifies a great deal of suspicion. It's kind of like a fake-vote, or the threat of a vote. Good for getting attention.

FTD - Failure to Deliver, also known as Toaster's #1 Scumtell. The act of promising to post more information at a later time, and then failing to do so. A very difficult action to justify as town, because it means you are either lazy or lying, it is therefore seen as a pretty solid scumtell.

IC - Inexperienced Challenged, players who are too experienced to justify playing in a Beginner's Mafia, and act as mentors/guides for the Town or the Scum.

Lurking - Purposefully not posting, so that you have few or no posts that can be analyzed. Generally a good strategy for scum. However, has the danger of earning you prods, getting modkilled, or found out via Zathras' Lurkertracker. Lurking is different than simply being away or unavailable. A good way to tell if someone is lurking is to check their profile's last active time, and compare it to their last post.

LYLO - Lynch or Lose, a situation where Town only outnumbers Scum by a single person (e.g. 3 town vs. 2 scum). During LYLO, Town MUST lynch Scum or instantly lose.

Masons - A group of town-aligned players who know each other to be town-aligned. They can communicate with each other freely.

MYLO - Mislynch and Lose, a situation where Town outnumbers Scum by two people (4 town vs. 2 scum). During MYLO, if Town lynches Town, Scum will win after night-killing town, making it 2 town vs. 2 scum, which is an instant scum win.

NL - No Lynch, to choose to end the day without lynching anyone and see if any information is revealed in the night.

OMGUS - Oh My God U Suck, a vote on someone else simply because they voted or attacked you

PFP - Posting From Phone (or Profession), throwing up a short post to prove you aren't lurking, when you are too busy at the time to make a more complete post.

PL - Policy Lynch, lynching someone for reasons other than scumminess. Variants are Lynch All Lurkers, Lynch All Liars, etc. Also see: Org.

PPE - Pre-Post Edit, typically done when you go to either Preview or Post and notice that someone else has posted before you. PPE is shorthand for acknowledging the "Warning - You may wish to review your post" message.

RIA - Refuge in Audacity, acting really crazy or really scummy to make people think that you couldn't possibly be scum because of how crazy you are. This never works. Neither does sarcasm in general, really. If you want to be sarcastic, make it painfully obvious you are being sarcastic, with <sarcasm>fake sarcasm tags</sarcasm>. Even still, it's not a good idea, because Mafia is SERIOUS BUSINESS

Role - Also called Power Role, any special powers you have. Cops, doctors, roleblockers, and godfathers are examples of classic roles. Some roles are alignment-specific, some aren't, and some can be for any alignment.

Rolefishing - Any question or attempt to learn information about someone's role. Typically something done at the beginning of the game. Typically a scum move, because it is in scum's advantage to find and lynch powerful roles. Can be acceptable later in the game, or in special circumstances where it is beneficial for town to learn someone's role. The reason it is scummy is because the really powerful town roles want to stay hidden so they don't get lynched by scum, and bringing attention to them by rolefishing risks their secrecy.

RVS - Random Voting Stage, the early-early game, shortly after the game begins, where people randomly vote each other and ask each other different questions, trying to find any good reason to suspect someone.

Scum - Mafia, or someone who isn't aligned with the Town. The Informed Minority.

SK - Serial Killer, a third party role with a nightkill, and who is hostile to everyone.

Survivor - a third party role whose win condition requires that they be alive at the end of the game. Normal players can die and still win as long as their team as a whole wins, but a survivor must actually be alive at the end.

Third Party - an alignment that is independent of scum and town. Has a unique victory condition, and is typically a lone wolf type character.

Town - The anti-Scum. The uninformed majority.

Vanilla - Someone who doesn't have a power role. "Vanilla Town", "Vanilla Scum", etc.

WIFOM - Wine In Front Of Me, the circular reasoning that results from trying to determine the choices of an opponent who acted with full knowledge that his behavior would be subject to scrutiny.

Quote from: Princess Bride

"All right: where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right and who is dead."

"But it's so simple. All I have to do is divine from what I know of you. Are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet, or his enemy's?"

WoT - Wall of Text; a really really long post. Sometimes unavoidable, but generally you should try to keep them to a minimum. Sometimes scum use them to seem more active then they are.

Massclaim - When everyone starts roleclaiming, or saying they are a power role.

Spoiler: A List of Common Scumtells (click to show/hide)

(Thanks to IronyOwl for making the orig. version!)

Scumtells are things that someone does or says that imply that they're scum. Usually the reasoning is that it's bad or not productive for townies to do it, so it can be hard to distinguish signs of being scum from signs of being a noob. This is one of the reasons scum almost always win beginner's mafia games.

Note that scumtells are very very subjective; there's no simple way to distinguish a scumtell from a noobtell from being justified and/or lazy. Whether a justified, non-scummy version of a scumtell should still be called by its normal name varies from person to person. (Someone might describe their voting of someone who voted them as "not an OMGUS," other would say it's "a justified OMGUS" for instance)

In any case, common scumtells include:

Bandwagoning: Voting for whoever has the most votes or seems most likely to be lynched, despite having poor/no reasons or not wanting them lynched previously. It implies that you don't care who gets lynched, you just want someone gone, which is generally the case for scum.

OMGUSing: Short for Oh My God You Suck, by the way. Voting or otherwise applying pressure to whoever's voting you. It implies that you're really concerned about being pressured/lynched and want them to stop, which is more a scum thing. A townie would, in theory, be more open to the notion that their fellow townie is attempting to scumhunt at them, and less concerned about being found out.

Defending/Chainsawing: Defending just means what it sounds like: saying things to defend another player's actions or words. Chainsawing or chainsaw defending means attacking someone who's attacking another player in an attempt to get them to stop. The idea in both instances is that townies don't know if their fellow players are innocent or not, and hence have no real reason to defend them from legitimate persecution. Scum, on the other hand, know they're on a team and so are prone to not wanting their buddies found out or pressured.

Lurking: Not posting. Especially suspicious in the case of Active Lurking, which is trying to look active while not actually doing anything (posting frequently but with no substance, for instance). The idea in either case is that townies actually care about finding scum, and so should be doing things. Scum don't care, they just want some random guy lynched so they can kill someone at night.

Trying Too Hard To Appear Townie: There's no official name for this one, but being too concerned about your image; specifically avoiding things that might be seen as scumtells. The idea is that scum are very concerned about being found out, and so want to act nonscummy. Townies know they're not scum, so they're less concerned about LOOKING nonscummy and more concerned about finding scum.

Passiveness: This is when a person refuses, simply hasn't or seems reluctant to take a stance, such as lynches. Scum will be concerned about their image, and thus don't want to be seen supporting a town lynch or an attack on a town.

Backtracking: When a person changes their stance on a subject after stating it, such as supporting a lynch and after doing so claiming that they didn't do it. This is very suspicious, and is often a sign of scum wanting to retreat their position so as to be able to save their face.

Lying: Well this should be obvious, right? It happens when someone fakeclaims (says they're a cop/doc, but is just town for example), fabricates evidence and stuff like that.

Rolefishing: Trying to find powerroles (cop and doc in vanilla Mafia), often via questioning.

Quote from: Argembarger

Resigning yourself to being lynched.
Saying something like "there's no way for me to avoid being lynched so I won't bother trying"
Blackmailing the town, like "You can lynch me, but you'll be sorry when you see I was town all along!"
Voting yourself for any reason.

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Frequently Asked Questions

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

• Oh my god this game seems fun. But wait, what are the rules?
  This (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=39338.0) is a good Mafia tutorial, brought to you by the wise JoshuaFH. Heed his words. It isn't included here because it's rather too long for that.
• People are accusing me of being scum! I'm about to get lynched! What do I do?
  The first and most important order of business is not to give up.
  One, two votes isn't much. Even if someone's got a bandwagon on you and people are writing walls of accusations, do not lose hope. You can still turn this around, no matter how bleak it appears. Fight them with your own arguments, and search for people you may think are scum, and try to turn the votes against them. About the worst thing you can do is give up, whether you are town or scum; you are harming the town by making it lose another member, distracting them from hunts for the true scum, and worsening your own game as well.
  The other players have nothing against you: it's just how the game goes. Even if you foul it up and people yell at you for it, once the game is over we're all friends.
  There are still people who give up, saying things like "You'll all be sorry when you find out I'm just town afterwards!" and "I'm not even going to try, there no way to stop this". Don't be that guy. Not only is it rather selfish, it will simply deepen your grave. You have to get out of it with real, meat-laden arguments, and these empty threats and remarks will only make you appear more scummy.
• Do I have to post so much? I can't be bothered.
  Yes, you do. You have to be an active player to scumhunt effectively, and with a lurking playerbase you might as well just hand it to the scum. There is always something to say; even if someone said what you wanted to, say it anyways in your own words. Always ask questions, always observe.
  This is a very demanding game. If you don't have enough time, then perhaps you should look elsewhere.
• How do I even tell if someone's scum anyways?
  This is, in fact, a difficult question. The game involves a lot of observation, and often it's more about intuition.
  You can often tell with the help of the List of Common Scumtells, provided below, but don't make the mistake of overusing it. Not every accusal against you is an OMGUS, and not all attempts at logic are WIFOM.  If in doubt, always remember Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is crap. Don't take anything for granted.
• What's all this wine stuff that players keep talking about? Does Mafia cause alcoholism?
  They are likely referring to the concept of WIFOM. It's a name for the kind of circular reasoning that you'd find when scrutinising scum motives, and is described in the CEAs (Commonly Encountered Abbreviations) and Other Terminology Commonly Found in Bay12 Mafia below. It goes like this:
  
  A: Why didn't our most active player get killed? It would be the scum's goal to kill the most active players to remove accusal, wouldn't it? The only conclusion is that [active player] is scum!
  
  B: Or is it? What if the scum wants to keep the most active player to draw suspicion on him? The scum could then head the attack on this player, thus pushing themselves into a position of trust amongst the town! I've got my eye on you, A!
  
  A: No, that isn't right! Clearly, they would stay in the background, and the people who go for the bait like me would be attacked by the scum, thus making themselves appear insightful! B, how dare you do this to me!
  
  B: Or perhaps the scum would be someone voting for a person that isn't the subject of a bandwagon, thus appearing both inconspicuous and independent! [lurker], you are scum!
  
  As you can see here, both A and B are making wild speculations on the motives of the scum. Their votes and eyes are all over the place, and nothing is really getting done. It distracts from real scumhunting, which is seeing people play and making observations from that, not speculating on how people would or would not play.

---

Flavor text based off of Square Enix's The World Ends With You (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_World_Ends_with_You) All rights reserved yadda yadda. 
This is my first time modding and while I don't intend to make any mistakes, feel free to call me out if you see any.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 25, 2012, 11:19:46 am

I DEMAND SATISFACTION.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 11:31:28 am

I may in as town IC if you'll forgive my fuck-up several games ago and don't let Jim see this post. :)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 25, 2012, 11:37:32 am

In.

Maybe this time I won't dig my own grave.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:06:24 pm

Why all the depressed comments?  ENJOY THE MOMENT!

Quote from: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 11:31:28 am

I may in as town IC if you'll forgive my fuck-up several games ago and don't let Jim see this post. :)

I'm sorry, but I'll have to ask Jim or one of the more senior members for approval.  I think you deserve a second chance, but I don't know enough about the incident to make an official call.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 12:18:18 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:06:24 pm

Why all the depressed comments?  ENJOY THE MOMENT!

Quote from: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 11:31:28 am

I may in as town IC if you'll forgive my fuck-up several games ago and don't let Jim see this post. :)

I'm sorry, but I'll have to ask Jim or one of the more senior members for approval.  I think you deserve a second chance, but I don't know enough about the incident to make an official call.

...Two years and 1500 posts in the subforum and you don't consider me senior? I'LL MURDER YOU WITH A RUSTY SAW

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 25, 2012, 12:23:18 pm

No, Dar, go get the shovel that Shake is going to murder me with. Then frame him. The perfect crime.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:25:44 pm

Quote from: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 12:18:18 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:06:24 pm

Why all the depressed comments?  ENJOY THE MOMENT!

Quote from: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 11:31:28 am

I may in as town IC if you'll forgive my fuck-up several games ago and don't let Jim see this post. :)

I'm sorry, but I'll have to ask Jim or one of the more senior members for approval.  I think you deserve a second chance, but I don't know enough about the incident to make an official call.

...Two years and 1500 posts in the subforum and you don't consider me senior? I'LL MURDER YOU WITH A RUSTY SAW

More senior than me  :P

*Blocks saw with katana*

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on July 25, 2012, 12:28:27 pm

Mafia seems like a fun game so in!
And now i feel like playing TWEWY again. (i will get these damned dark planets this time i swear...)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Shakerag on July 25, 2012, 12:29:45 pm

Quote from: Hapah on July 25, 2012, 12:23:18 pm

No, Dar, go get the shovel that Shake is going to murder me with. Then frame him. The perfect crime.

I never said I was going to murder you.  You're redeemable yet.  I was just going to give you a good, solid whack upside the head.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:33:41 pm

Quote from: Boltur on July 25, 2012, 12:28:27 pm

Mafia seems like a fun game so in!
And now i feel like playing TWEWY again. (i will get these damned dark planets this time i swear...)

Welcome to the game and forums!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 12:34:50 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:25:44 pm

*Blocks saw with katana*

Katanas are notoriously fragile, while I have on my side a heavy-ass rusty piece of steel. So you are kinda fucked. :P

Quote from: Boltur on July 25, 2012, 12:28:27 pm

Mafia seems like a fun game so in!
And now i feel like playing TWEWY again. (i will get these damned dark planets this time i swear...)

Welcome. Never go in against a Sicilian when DEATH is on the line.

Er, wrong piece of advice. Nevermind.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:39:08 pm

Quote from: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 12:34:50 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:25:44 pm

*Blocks saw with katana*

Katanas are notoriously fragile, while I have on my side a heavy-ass rusty piece of steel. So you are kinda fucked. :P

Nonsense, everyone knows that Katanas are just better. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/KatanasAreJustBetter)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 12:44:56 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:39:08 pm

Quote from: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 12:34:50 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:25:44 pm

*Blocks saw with katana*

Katanas are notoriously fragile, while I have on my side a heavy-ass rusty piece of steel. So you are kinda fucked. :P

Nonsense, everyone knows that Katanas are just better. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/KatanasAreJustBetter)

Katanas are better? Well then rusty saws are just THE BEST.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: lordnincompoop on July 25, 2012, 02:12:16 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 12:06:24 pm

Quote from: Dariush on July 25, 2012, 11:31:28 am

I may in as town IC if you'll forgive my fuck-up several games ago and don't let Jim see this post. :)

I'm sorry, but I'll have to ask Jim or one of the more senior members for approval.  I think you deserve a second chance, but I don't know enough about the incident to make an official call.

I don't know how much authority you would attach to my seniority, but I'd be willing to vouch to Dariush if needed. There are very few players around right now as-is, and even without that factor, the position of IC isn't one that has such incredibly high standards that it bars players from applying for it simply for a cock-up.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on July 25, 2012, 04:26:55 pm

Only the most intimate of circlejerks.

Playing IC in, if this game doesn't start before Saturday. (I'll be unavailable starting Thursday through Saturday.)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Tiruin on July 25, 2012, 04:50:41 pm

Jim's back to ICing? (Heh, Icing.  :P)

Watching this and I guess I cannot in again.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Chaos Armor on July 25, 2012, 04:55:10 pm

Posting to watch and hopefully have me some of that awesome spectator popcorn that Phantom of the Library makes.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Shakerag on July 25, 2012, 05:03:16 pm

I'll take a shot at scum ICing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jervill on July 25, 2012, 05:16:38 pm

Posting to watch/spectate.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 25, 2012, 05:21:54 pm

In

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Scelly9 on July 25, 2012, 05:45:09 pm

Quote from: Jervill on July 25, 2012, 05:16:38 pm

Posting to watch/spectate.

Plush Wun!

(http://stores.wholesalecentral.com/Images/1QCVSVQ4_7514UJTAL9XA7MY_9WCZY/1113101054822.jpg)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: FluffyBinLaden on July 25, 2012, 07:01:33 pm

I would like to try my hand at this. First game of online Mafia, played several RL games (What's RL?).

Sooooo... newbscumming anyone? :D

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 25, 2012, 07:08:08 pm

Welcome aboard!

Have you read any of the other BM's?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Tiruin on July 25, 2012, 07:10:00 pm

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 25, 2012, 07:01:33 pm

I would like to try my hand at this. First game of online Mafia, played several RL games (What's RL?).

Sooooo... newbscumming anyone? :D

RL = Real life.  :P

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: FluffyBinLaden on July 25, 2012, 07:25:23 pm

Quote from: Tiruin on July 25, 2012, 07:10:00 pm

RL = Real life.  :P

That's only a myth.

Quote from: Hapah on July 25, 2012, 07:08:08 pm

Welcome aboard!

Have you read any of the other BM's?

I have, yes. :) Obviously that's still only a theoretical education, but hell, we'll see where it goes, aye?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 25, 2012, 08:30:18 pm

Good! Read up on the last one if you want to watch me make a damn fool of myself. At least I was right about FD. ~___~

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on July 26, 2012, 01:14:03 am

In.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Tiruin on July 26, 2012, 03:03:10 am

Quote from: Hapah on July 25, 2012, 08:30:18 pm

Good! Read up on the last one if you want to watch me make a damn fool of myself. At least I was right about FD. ~___~

Hapah is beast. Always good. Was just lucky.  :P

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 26, 2012, 11:17:28 am

Quote from: Jim Groovester on July 25, 2012, 04:26:55 pm

Only the most intimate of circlejerks.

Playing IC in, if this game doesn't start before Saturday. (I'll be unavailable starting Thursday through Saturday.)

The game will start no earlier than Tuesday and no later than Friday of next week, assuming we have a final player by then. I will be unable to guaranteeing being here from Saturday through Thursday, although I may be able to start the game during such time.  I will be able to post for sure starting Thursday.

Glad to have you here!

Quote from: Chaos Armor on July 25, 2012, 04:55:10 pm

Posting to watch and hopefully have me some of that awesome spectator popcorn that Phantom of the Library makes.

Quote from: Scelly9 on July 25, 2012, 05:45:09 pm

Quote from: Jervill on July 25, 2012, 05:16:38 pm

Posting to watch/spectate.

Plush Wun!

http://stores.wholesalecentral.com/Images/1QCVSVQ4_7514UJTAL9XA7MY_9WCZY/1113101054822.jpg

Jeez with all you guys watching I'm going to run out of popcorn!

---

Spoiler: Dariush (click to show/hide)

The tribe has spoken.

You...




Will...





*Drumroll*






Be allowed to IC again.  However, should there be a repeat of last time, you will be replaced.  Remember, while we expect players to have a thick skin, we don't want their first experience here to be some guy being overtly hostile and driving them off.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 26, 2012, 11:23:22 am

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 26, 2012, 11:17:28 am

Be allowed to IC again.  However, should there be a repeat of last time, you will be replaced.  Remember, while we expect players to have a thick skin, we don't want their first experience here to be some guy being overtly hostile and driving them off.

Hey, it's an authentic experience. This way their little minds won't be broken at the sight of Book or Jim verbally dislodging their shit.  :P

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 26, 2012, 11:31:33 am

Quote from: Dariush on July 26, 2012, 11:23:22 am

This way their little minds won't be broken at the sight of Book or Jim verbally dislodging their shit.  :P

Oh gods, the image! Make it go away! Brain bleach! Brain bleach!

Sorry, I have to go poke out my mind's eye.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 26, 2012, 12:37:49 pm

Quote from: Bookthras on July 26, 2012, 11:31:33 am

Quote from: Dariush on July 26, 2012, 11:23:22 am

This way their little minds won't be broken at the sight of Book or Jim verbally dislodging their shit.  :P

Oh gods, the image! Make it go away! Brain bleach! Brain bleach!

Sorry, I have to go poke out my mind's eye.

Serves you right for not joining Revolver Mafia.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: ToonyMan on July 26, 2012, 02:00:01 pm

I have a feeling that's going to become a Dariush joke for a long time.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 26, 2012, 02:09:17 pm

Quote from: ToonyMan on July 26, 2012, 02:00:01 pm

I have a feeling that's going to become a Dariush joke for a long time.

Verbal shit dislocation or Revolver Mafia?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on July 26, 2012, 02:12:04 pm

Yes.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Toaster on July 26, 2012, 02:19:00 pm

At the same time.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Shakerag on July 26, 2012, 02:27:50 pm

Just a friendly reminder for all you nublings signed up and thinking of signing up:

Mafia games are really fucking long.  Case in point, the last beginner's game went a month and a half.  Please be responsible when signing up that you are willing to stick with a game like this for that long, and that you don't have periods of time in the upcoming month-ish where you will be unable to play for extended stretches.  Or, at least, make note of that way ahead of time. 

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: FluffyBinLaden on July 26, 2012, 02:41:47 pm

I have no plans at the moment. If I get some (Phhht, like that'll ever happen) I'll let you know.

*Whistles Johnny Cash's Ring of Fire* And now to figure out what the hell I just got myself into.  ;D

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Shakerag on July 26, 2012, 04:22:00 pm

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 26, 2012, 02:41:47 pm

I have no plans at the moment. If I get some (Phhht, like that'll ever happen) I'll let you know.

*Whistles Johnny Cash's Ring of Fire* And now to figure out what the hell I just got myself into.  ;D

A learning experience.  Possibly more, if you have a thin hide  :P

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Chaos Armor on July 26, 2012, 05:15:01 pm

Quote from: Shakerag on July 26, 2012, 02:27:50 pm

Just a friendly reminder for all you nublings signed up and thinking of signing up:

Mafia games are really fucking long.  Case in point, the last beginner's game went a month and a half.  Please be responsible when signing up that you are willing to stick with a game like this for that long, and that you don't have periods of time in the upcoming month-ish where you will be unable to play for extended stretches.  Or, at least, make note of that way ahead of time.

*Looks away, sheepishly*

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Tiruin on July 26, 2012, 10:57:11 pm

Quote from: Chaos Armor on July 26, 2012, 05:15:01 pm

Quote from: Shakerag on July 26, 2012, 02:27:50 pm

Just a friendly reminder for all you nublings signed up and thinking of signing up:

Mafia games are really fucking long.  Case in point, the last beginner's game went a month and a half.  Please be responsible when signing up that you are willing to stick with a game like this for that long, and that you don't have periods of time in the upcoming month-ish where you will be unable to play for extended stretches.  Or, at least, make note of that way ahead of time.

*Looks away, sheepishly*

/me buries his face in popcorn.

---

On that note, just to ask again:
In this BM, supposing we have one scum left and that scum can roleblock, is it possible to both roleblock and initiate the NK at the same time?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Shakerag on July 26, 2012, 11:02:22 pm

Yes.  I think it's generally the case that the last scum can both NK and use thier ability (if any) on the same night.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Toaster on July 26, 2012, 11:05:42 pm

That's a per-mod question.  I, for example, would not let both happen.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 26, 2012, 11:19:15 pm

I will state now that that will not be an option.  One scum does the killing, one (should the role exist) does the blocking.  Each person has one action per night, excepting special cases where there are rules or roles that allow that.  This being a BM, there are none.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Batman Wayne on July 26, 2012, 11:22:22 pm

In

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 26, 2012, 11:58:52 pm

And with Batman Wayne joining we have everyone we need.  Should anyone else wish to join, feel free to volunteer for the replacement list.  If someone is unable to finish the game for one reason or another you will join the game and take their place so it can continue.

The game will begin some day in-between Tuesday and Friday of next week, most likely later rather than sooner.


Remember, a game of mafia can take up more than a month, so if you aren't sure you'll be able to be here the entire time, please inform us. If it's going to be a certain date that you won't be available on just let everyone know ahead of time (trust me it's a whole lot easier than trying to explain afterwards that you weren't lurking), or if you will, say, be going to climb Mt. Everest or something similar starting on August 2nd, it might be a good idea to wait for the next BM, so long as there are players willing to play in them they will be held!

For reading material in the mean-time, I recommend reading Dakarian's Scumhunting Bible, found in the OP (actually, I a little bit more than highly recommend reading the entire first post, but you should read Dakarian's Scumhunting Bible at least twice) It's an invaluable guide for players on finding scum.

If you're having a hard time understanding the game from the text descriptions alone, be sure to look at the flash tutorial, it should at least clear the fog a little.

Now that that's all said, the only way to truly learn how to play the game is to play it! 

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 26, 2012, 11:59:14 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 26, 2012, 11:19:15 pm

I will state now that that will not be an option.  One scum does the killing, one (should the role exist) does the blocking.  Each person has one action per night, excepting special cases where there are rules or roles that allow that.  This being a BM, there are none.

Right. It is, as Toaster said, a question that depends on the Mod and game type, but in a standard vanilla game (like the BMs are supposed to be), one player can only perform one action per night: if there is one scum left with a blocking power, they can choose to kill or block, but not both. Good for Phantom for clarifying that.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 28, 2012, 05:24:15 am

Are there any spots left? I'm a complete noob.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on July 28, 2012, 05:34:26 am

Survey says...

Try again when somebody asks for a replacement. It's pretty much guaranteed that that'll happen.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on July 28, 2012, 10:54:32 am

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 28, 2012, 05:24:15 am

Are there any spots left? I'm a complete noob.

Quote from: Urist Imiknorris on July 28, 2012, 05:34:26 am

Survey says...

Try again when somebody asks for a replacement. It's pretty much guaranteed that that'll happen.

Yup, Should anyone drop out I will PM you and if you're available, you'll take their place.  See the post two posts above yours for advice on what to do in the meantime.




There has been a change in plans, in the interest of getting the game going as soon as possible, Bookthras has volunteered to help and he will begin the game on Sunday at 10PM CDT and manage it until I am available again on Thursday.
My apologies for not being able to be here, I was not expecting the roster to fill up so fast  :P

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: FluffyBinLaden on July 28, 2012, 02:20:04 pm

Sweet, sounds like a plan. Let it begin.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: zombie urist on July 28, 2012, 07:45:17 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 28, 2012, 05:24:15 am

Are there any spots left? I'm a complete noob.

Batman Wayne was banned. So you're in.  :D

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Tiruin on July 28, 2012, 11:07:01 pm

Bookthras and Phantom of The Library both running a game, Jim and Dariush as ICs with Shakerag as the scum IC...

Oooooh boy, this is gonna be one great game.

Requesting spoilspec?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 29, 2012, 02:18:51 am

Quote from: Tiruin on July 28, 2012, 11:07:01 pm

Bookthras and Phantom of The Library both running a game...
Oooooh boy, this is gonna be one great game.
Requesting spoilspec?

To be clear, it's only Phantom that's running the game. I just volunteered to mind the store for a couple of days while he's on holiday, since if we are full, starting sooner is better. I'll post vote counts, send PMs, that kind of thing, but it's Phantom's game (and he'll make any spoilspec or popcorn decisions when he's back).

But yes, I'm sure it's going to be a great game. Phantom has put together some kick-ass flavour and clearly has thought this out very carefully. I'll put up the opening post tomorrow when we're sure we have a full roster. Speaking of which:

Quote from: zombie urist on July 28, 2012, 07:45:17 pm

Batman Wayne was banned. So [kingfisher] you're in.  :D

I sent kingfisher1112 a PM to confirm if he's ready to start. If he is, then we have a full roster and tomorrow evening I'll send the role PMs and post the opening flavour that Phantom prepared.

If anyone wants to volunteer for the replacement queue, now is a good time. Kingfisher has first dibs on the spot vacated by Batman Wayne until, say, tomorrow 4:00PM forum time; if he hasn't responded by then, the spot will go to the next person in the replacement queue. If we have none, then the game start will wait until we have a full roster.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 29, 2012, 03:21:04 am

Ohlol, I was spot-on about not trusting Batman Wayne. I am so awesome.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 29, 2012, 08:06:18 am

Received PM, good to go!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 29, 2012, 01:53:13 pm

Excellent, thank you. Game will start tonight.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Chaos Armor on July 29, 2012, 02:09:37 pm

Good luck, everyone.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dustylou2 on July 29, 2012, 05:42:41 pm

I'll join the replacement queue. Until I'm needed, good luck everyone.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 29, 2012, 09:51:46 pm

Voices.  The rumble of cars.  The various sounds of the city push in around you from every side as if they intend to suffocate you.  You shake your head and look around.  Rising up above are the tall buildings that line the streets of Shibuya.  They form an impenetrable barrier closing off the world outside them and keeping...

But how can you be here?  The last thing you remember, you were…  No.  That’s not possible; otherwise you wouldn't be here at all.  You look around trying to make sense of all of this. Then, you notice something in your pocket. 

You reach in and pull it out.  The foreign object is a black pin decorated with a highly stylized skull.  You rub your finger over it, cleaning off an imaginary spot of dirt.  There seems to be something about the thing somethi¬–––
      Yaay, Popcorn!

I’d better hurry if I’m going to get there in time!      Should I wear my black dress or pink?
 I’ll murder him with a rusty saw!     n factorial! That’s the answer.

Why does no one hear speak Spanish?     

   I wonder if I’ll look silly wearing latex suit in public.
                     I can’t believe she’s finally coming over!      

Suddenly your head is crowded with voices.  Dozens upon dozens of voices each saying something different fill your head.  Are these people’s thoughts?  Before you can muse on this any longer, there comes a beep from your other pocket as your cell phone goes off.  You look at it to see a SMS message there from an unknown sender.

---

Mission:
Two Reapers have been disguised as Players for
the duration of this game and are hiding among
you.  Each “day” you may choose one person to
be Erased by popular vote.

---

---

Determine who the Reapers are and Erase them
and you win.

You have 72 hours until the first “day” end.
Failure will result in Erasure.

Note: The Conductor will be unavailable for
the first "day" sequence.  Spare Unit
Bookthras will serve as proxy.

---

Suddenly you feel a sharp pain on your hand and a series of numbers appears on your right hand. 

72:00:00

It slowly begins to count down.

71:59:58

You look up to see nine other people with the glowing marks on their hands.

---

Nine people stood around in a circle.  Seven eyed each other with suspicion.  Two watched like vultures.  All nine knew that their very existence was on the line.

YOU HAVE 72 HOURS

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 29, 2012, 10:21:44 pm

Accusations will start to fly and pain is sure to come as the group tries to determine who among them are the Reapers.  Suddenly, everyone stops as their phones ring out their various tones.

Quote

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {0}:      
[Deathsword] {0}:      
[Boltur] {0}:      
[Mr. Dwarfinton] {0}:   
[FluffyBinLaden] {0}:   
[Borno] {0}:      
[kingfisher1112] {0}:   
[Dariush] {0}:      
[Jim Groovester] {0}:   

72:00 hours remain.

---

Day 1 will end Wednesday ~10:00PM CDT.
Current extension requests: zero. Four requests needed to extend the day.

Game has started. Play fair and have fun.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 29, 2012, 10:24:33 pm

Alright, I suppose it's RVS time, so...

Hapah: If you could choose to be one of the two power roles, which would you pick? Why?

Borno: If you were the cop, how would you choose who to investigate?

FluffyBinLaden: If you were the doctor and were about to be lynched, would you roleclaim, or would you try to evade death in some other way?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 12:56:00 am

Now that the game has started and I am now responsible for teaching seven of you how to play a game, I will say the following first.

I will be a completely impartial source of advice that I will freely give at every opportunity, whether I am asked for it or I decide to give it on my own. You can trust that everything I have to say will be given in good faith, even if it comes at a personal cost to me in this game. If you do not listen to what I have to say, for any reason, you will severely hamper your ability to learn how to play the game. So, to reiterate,

Listen to what I tell you.

If you don't, then what's the point of me being here?

For those of you who don't know what to do, games usually start with the Random Vote Stage. You should pick a target randomly, vote them, and ask them a question. The sole purpose of this is to get conversation going when there would otherwise be no reason to do that. I'll start.

Boltur, let's say it's late in Day 1. The person about to be lynched is somebody you think is town, while your target is only a few votes away from being in the lead. Do you extend and try to change people's minds or do you wait and see what happens?

Ideally you should ask game related questions in the RVS. Asking what kind of flavor of ice cream is a player's favorite does absolutely nothing to help you find scum, which is your primary goal.

And because it bears repeating: Your primary goal is to find scum. Everything you do should help you towards that goal. And I do mean everything.

If you're scum, you will obviously have a different goal: Avoid detection until the end of the game. The best way to do this is to look like you are trying to find scum.

Since many of you are going to have no idea what to do and will mangle scumhunting in just about every possible way, it does you no good to hold back. So be bold, and just do the best you can. Ask lots of questions, try to get a good feel for how the game is played. I'll be there to help you when you go wrong.

Additionally, before anybody else does anything, I will stress the importance of activity. You should be as active as possible. A good guideline is to get one good post in a day, but if you can post productively more often than that it's generally a good idea to do so. As a player, town or scum, being active and visible is very much an asset, as you're out there making yourself readable, and this is considered a town quality. While there are very good personal benefits to being active, the reverse is detrimental to the whole game. Low activity makes games hard to play or outright kills them. This is fun for absolutely no one, so make a good effort and be active.

If you played a Beginner's Game before you probably recognize this spiel, but it's good all the same.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 01:20:38 am

Someone want to confess their fondness of lollipops,wings or pi before we start ?
I hope i'm doing it alright:

Mr.Dwarfinton: Do you think we will nab scum on first day ? Why/Why not ?

Deathsword: If your scum partner would do something utterly stupid today would you try to save him or not ?

Jim: I would probably extend and try to convince someone whose reasons are weak. On first day i think it would be harder to convince someone i guess but it's worth a try. I would do it (extending) for sure if voter focused only on some kind of single minor slip on excuse it's first day. Well at least that's what seemed pretty common in few mafia games i read.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on July 30, 2012, 02:26:05 am

Deathsword:
I'd probably inspect who I think is acting most scummy during the day, or if it was hard to tell, I'd chose someone who had been attacking me during the day.

kingfisher1112: If you were doctor, who would you protect out of a slightly scummy person who had claimed cop, or a person who hasn't claimed anything?

Hapah: If you were scum and your scum-buddy was gaining gaining suspicion, what would you do to try and deflect the heat?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 03:10:51 am

I would question them to see who was least scummy.
Jim, How do you like to determine who is scum in the first day?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on July 30, 2012, 03:59:46 am

kingfisher1112:Sorry, let me word that better.
If you were a doctor on N3, and there are two people you're considering protecting. The first one is a slightly scummy person who had claimed cop D2,  and person who hasn't claimed anything yet. Who do you protect?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 05:21:38 am

Well, the slightly scummy person. I have more to gain if he is what he says he is. Difficult question.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Shakerag on July 30, 2012, 08:32:26 am

[Go go scumteam!]

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 30, 2012, 08:38:04 am

Greetings, mortals. My name is Dariush. Don't be assholes and we'll get along just fine.

A point which certain assholes from several games ago missed: when I tell you that your question is bullshit or that you're doing it wrong, I'm not doing so to tunnell you, I'm doing so to fix your mistakes. Listening in those circumstances is highly recommended.

Point first, which applies to all BMs: people always put too much weight on roles and not enough weight on scumminess. Asking during RVS what would a person do under a set of exceedingly unlikely circumstances never helps anyone, and whoever you're asking this question can give any answer he wants without much repercussions. What you would want to do is ask such questions that make the answerer think about the answer and that can later be elaborated on. Don't expect someone to slip hilariously and reveal himself as scum, expect someone to be hesitant, abnormally vague or self-contradicting.

Also, be very vary of people who put a third RVS vote on someone or second vote while being exceptionally focused on the person they're voting. It is much easier for scum to maintain a vote they put on someone during RVS than to vote someone outside of RVS.

Borno, if you were scum, whom among the non-ICs would you like as your scummate?

Deathsword, if you were town, whom among the non-ICs would you most prefer on town side?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 10:10:33 am

Boltur:

Quote from: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 01:20:38 am

Deathsword: If your scum partner would do something utterly stupid today would you try to save him or not?

I wouldn't try to say anything in his defense, since that would attract attention. Wheter I'd bus him or not depends if the town has noticed his stupidity or not.

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on July 30, 2012, 08:38:04 am

Deathsword, if you were town, whom among the non-ICs would you most prefer on town side?

Borno.


kingfisher: What, to you, is the most scummy thing one can do?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 10:17:15 am

Deathsword: Nightkill. :) But seriously, jumping on a bandwagon without reason.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 30, 2012, 12:22:44 pm

Quote from: DS

Hapah: If you could choose to be one of the two power roles, which would you pick? Why?

Doc. Doctor is always useful, Cop is sometimes useful. And a false negative result on the Godfather (if there is a Godfather) would be really bad in a BM.

Quote from: borno

Hapah: If you were scum and your scum-buddy was gaining gaining suspicion, what would you do to try and deflect the heat?

Either make a stronger case on someone else (preferred), or try to poke holes in the case on my buddy. You don't want to be seen as springing to his defense.

Deathsword.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 02:37:21 pm

Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 10:10:33 am

Quote from: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 01:20:38 am

Deathsword: If your scum partner would do something utterly stupid today would you try to save him or not?

I wouldn't try to say anything in his defense, since that would attract attention. Wheter I'd bus him or not depends if the town has noticed his stupidity or not.

Don't you think it would be a big blow to your team especially on day 1 ? Other question : Would you rather want a doc or cop in game ?

kingfisher: Jumping on a bandwagon with a reason is alright ? What reason that would be ?

Hapah: Why so passive ?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 04:21:26 pm

Quote from: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 01:20:38 am

Mr.Dwarfinton: Do you think we will nab scum on first day ? Why/Why not ?

I don't believe we will because basically everyone is new.

Boltur: Whats the point of that question towards KF? A reason is a reason.
Kingfisher: If you had to kill someone as town how would you choose that person?
Deathsword: If your scum buddy was about to be lynched would you try to save him or would you let him get lynched? If you were town and someone you knew was a doctor was about to be lynched would you try to save that person, if so how?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 04:45:25 pm

Mr. Dwarfinton:

Quote from: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 04:21:26 pm

Deathsword: If your scum buddy was about to be lynched would you try to save him or would you let him get lynched? If you were town and someone you knew was a doctor was about to be lynched would you try to save that person, if so how?

In both situations I'd question those pressing for their lynch, trying to make them doubt their reasons.

Boltur:

Quote from: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 02:37:21 pm

Don't you think it would be a big blow to your team especially on day 1 ? Other question : Would you rather want a doc or cop in game?

Losing a teammate in day 1 is always a big blow to the team. I'd go for cop, if I could choose.

Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on July 30, 2012, 12:22:44 pm

Deathsword.

Yes? Do you have a question for me?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 04:50:16 pm

Quote from: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 01:20:38 am

Jim: I would probably extend and try to convince someone whose reasons are weak. On first day i think it would be harder to convince someone i guess but it's worth a try. I would do it (extending) for sure if voter focused only on some kind of single minor slip on excuse it's first day. Well at least that's what seemed pretty common in few mafia games i read.

Alright.

Let's shake up the scenario a bit. What would you do if you thought the person up for lynch was strongly town, and what would you do if you thought he was weakly town?

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 10:10:33 am

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on July 30, 2012, 08:38:04 am

Deathsword, if you were town, whom among the non-ICs would you most prefer on town side?

Borno.

Why?

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 03:10:51 am

Jim, How do you like to determine who is scum in the first day?

By scumhunting.

Spoiler: Is there any other way? (click to show/hide)

NO

Paying close attention to everything everyone says, asking questions about anything odd that comes up, doing selective rereads to examine a player, looking for inconsistencies, aggressively questioning people, trying to get them to slip up and do something revealing, are all excellent ways to find scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 05:06:01 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 04:50:16 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 10:10:33 am

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on July 30, 2012, 08:38:04 am

Deathsword, if you were town, whom among the non-ICs would you most prefer on town side?

Borno.

Why?

Mostly because of all the players here, he was the only one I played with. Hapah only joined the last BM after I was lynched, so I couldn't get any interaction with him.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 05:37:12 pm

Quote from: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 04:21:26 pm

I don't believe we will because basically everyone is new.

How the fact we're new at this makes it less likely to find scum ? And does it change your scumhunting plan for today somehow ?

Quote

Boltur: Whats the point of that question towards KF? A reason is a reason.

So you say all reasons are equal ? That's pretty silly assumption. Please explain that.

Jim: In the first case first i would make myself clear why i think someone is town and then reread the attackers post to make sure there's nothing fishy going on. If i would find anything inconsistent then well it's time to press that person a bit more. If i couldn't find anything like that i would probably ask the person with weakest reasons why he thinks it's enough and try to convince him otherwise. In the second situation i would probably let it go it's own way and just focus on someone who is most scummy to me. The problem in that on first day the line between major and minor mistake is pretty hard to describe.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 06:11:02 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 29, 2012, 10:24:33 pm

FluffyBinLaden: If you were the doctor and were about to be lynched, would you roleclaim, or would you try to evade death in some other way?

Well, Deathsword, I would attempt to evade death in some other way. Roleclaiming seems to me to be a rather dangerous thing when there's scum around. I also like being a private citizen, my profession is nobody's business.

So, why should I believe you ain't scum, boy?

Boltur: Because we're new means you'll find a scum? For shame. Why, do you think Deathsword's inexperience will betray him?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 30, 2012, 06:19:18 pm

Boltur: I bit off more than I can chew with being in 3 games at once.

Deathsword: Nope!

Fluffy: Why did you vote Deathsword?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 06:20:58 pm

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 06:11:02 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 29, 2012, 10:24:33 pm

FluffyBinLaden: If you were the doctor and were about to be lynched, would you roleclaim, or would you try to evade death in some other way?

Well, Deathsword, I would attempt to evade death in some other way. Roleclaiming seems to me to be a rather dangerous thing when there's scum around. I also like being a private citizen, my profession is nobody's business.

So, why should I believe you ain't scum, boy?

Boltur: Because we're new means you'll find a scum? For shame. Why, do you think Deathsword's inexperience will betray him?

Wait, you are voing me over a single RVS question? Are you serious?

How can you be so sure I am scum, and why do you seem to be so determined to convince Boltur I am scum when you haven't even stated any evidence of my "scummyness".

Also, if any part of your post was a joke/sarcasm, please state it instead of letting us figure it out.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 06:22:48 pm

Because I forgot to include it in my last post:
Unvote
FluffyBinLaden

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 06:42:06 pm

Uh, we're all less likely because we don't have as much as experience. I don't understand your reasoning behind asking these questions.
No, not all reasons are equal but I guess I read it as if you were saying that jumping on a bandwagon was bad regardless of the reason

Fluffy: Is your vote sarcastic or are you really angry that he voted you?
Hapah: What is your reason for Deathsword if you aren't even asking him a question?

Any person who is in charge: Can we get a vote count?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 06:43:39 pm

Quote from: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 06:42:06 pm

Fluffy: Is your vote sarcastic or are you really angry that he voted you?

Uh, I didn't vote him, I only asked him a question. In fact, if you read all the posts, you'll see no one voted him.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 06:55:48 pm

Well I'm stupid. It over an RVS vote so its still dumb.

Fluffy: Question still stands about voting DS.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 06:57:45 pm

Mr Dwarfinton, I would see who is the most active and intelligent.
Deathsword: Jumping on after careful examination of posts, determining who deserves your vote. Not HURR DURR ME TOO.
Deathsword, going on the offensive a bit. Please, tell me the reason.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 07:00:49 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 06:57:45 pm

Mr Dwarfinton, I would see who is the most active and intelligent.
Deathsword: Jumping on after careful examination of posts, determining who deserves your vote. Not HURR DURR ME TOO.
Deathsword, going on the offensive a bit. Please, tell me the reason.

I don't really understand the question. Tell you the reason of what exactly?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 07:02:00 pm

Nevermind.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 07:09:26 pm

So, as town, you would kill the most active and intelligent person?

Kingfisher

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 07:11:34 pm

Nope, nothing was sarcasm, and no, I'm not angry, I'm just probey. Throwing votes around to put pressure on is what you do, eh?

So, the pressure's on. I never accused you, I simply asked you to persuade me.

Remember, total scrub here, so when I get an idea, I just kinda throw it out.

Mr. Dwarfinton: You would kill Kingfisher, who is also just applying pressure and never even threatened to vote? Shaky...

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 07:15:27 pm

Did you read his reply? My question was how would he determine who to kill as town. He replied with a person who is active an intelligent.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 07:15:57 pm

I need to spellcheck more often.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 08:55:55 pm

FluffyBinLaden: Have you even read what I said?

Pressure votes tend to be thrown with a question. A REAL question. Not "prove to me you aren't scum!".

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 07:11:34 pm

Mr. Dwarfinton: You would kill Kingfisher, who is also just applying pressure and never even threatened to vote? Shaky...

So Mr. Dwarfinton questioning the logic behind kingfisher's answer while throwing a (what I assume to be) pressure vote= Mr Dwarfinton wanting to kill kingfisher.

I don't know what you are trying to do by throwing these accusations with no evidence or explanation, FluffyBinLaden, but it seems way too wierd for me.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on July 30, 2012, 09:04:16 pm

Unvote.
Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on July 30, 2012, 08:38:04 am

Borno, if you were scum, whom among the non-ICs would you like as your scummate?

I would probably want Hapah on my side, because he's probably the most experienced non-IC.

Deathsword: You don't have to vote to do an OMGUS.

Also, you do realize that I was scum in the last game, and that I was replaced halfway through?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on July 30, 2012, 09:08:13 pm

EBWODP:
Deathsword: I don't think you're voting him because he's throwing pressure onto him, but because he voted you.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 30, 2012, 09:22:34 pm

Borno: Yes, I do realise you were scum, and yes you were replaced not long into the game, but you still were the only I got to interact with that is now here.

I am voting him because his posts have been completely illogical. He appears to believe that scumhunting is simply accusing someone and sitting there. I even pointed it out in my last posts. Here, I'll show it:

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 06:20:58 pm

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 06:11:02 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 29, 2012, 10:24:33 pm

FluffyBinLaden: If you were the doctor and were about to be lynched, would you roleclaim, or would you try to evade death in some other way?

Well, Deathsword, I would attempt to evade death in some other way. Roleclaiming seems to me to be a rather dangerous thing when there's scum around. I also like being a private citizen, my profession is nobody's business.

So, why should I believe you ain't scum, boy?

Boltur: Because we're new means you'll find a scum? For shame. Why, do you think Deathsword's inexperience will betray him?

Wait, you are voing me over a single RVS question? Are you serious?

How can you be so sure I am scum, and why do you seem to be so determined to convince Boltur I am scum when you haven't even stated any evidence of my "scummyness".

Also, if any part of your post was a joke/sarcasm, please state it instead of letting us figure it out.

Please read the bolded part. While my first statement in that post does look like what an OMGUS would be, I believe that the rest of the post's content proves it is not an OMGUS.

In fact, he just answered my question and called me scum. And then claimed Dwarfinton was trying to kill kingfisher. Both with no evidence. I am voting because that seems very scummy to me. He doesn't even appear to have read more than the first line of my first answer to him.

ICs:Does a vote against an attacker within a post pointing out a flaw in said attacker's accusations classify as an OMGUS?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 10:01:55 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 06:57:45 pm

Mr Dwarfinton, I would see who is the most active and intelligent.
Deathsword: Jumping on after careful examination of posts, determining who deserves your vote. Not HURR DURR ME TOO.
Deathsword, going on the offensive a bit. Please, tell me the reason.

I have no idea what you're getting at here so it's time for me to stress one of my most frequent points in Beginner's Mafias:

The importance of communicating effectively.

You need to be able to communicate effectively. If you don't communicate effectively, then nobody knows what the hell you're talking about and then they won't listen to you, which is a travesty because your points on a particular target might be good or even dead fucking on. So you need to be able to state your points and questions as clearly as possible so that there's no ambiguity to what you mean and nobody has to wonder what you're talking about.

Conciseness is also a desirable quality. Forum mafia already sucks up a ton of time, so if you communicate clearly and concisely, then you reduce the time it takes to play the game and overall increases how convincing you are. Because who is easier to read? The person who makes a well thought, but horridly tangled and jumbled mess of needless rambling, or the person who says exactly what he means in as few sentences as possible?

Consider spacing out your paragraphs, quoting relevant portions of players' quotes that you're responding to, and using the preview button in order to improve clarity.

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 06:11:02 pm

So, why should I believe you ain't scum, boy?

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 07:11:34 pm

Nope, nothing was sarcasm, and no, I'm not angry, I'm just probey. Throwing votes around to put pressure on is what you do, eh?

So, the pressure's on. I never accused you, I simply asked you to persuade me.

I approve of probing targets to try and get information out of them, but I disapprove of placing the burden of innocence on your target. If you're scum, you can arbitrarily hold your vote on a player for as long as you want as he continually 'fails' to defend himself. That's too easy. If that were the case then it would take literally no effort to justify any vote.

Rather, it's up to you to provide convincing evidence that your target is scum. This is more difficult, but you've provided evidence of scumminess instead of lack of towniness, which is more direct and thereby more convincing. It also makes life more difficult for scum, since they actually have to put in effort to look like they're town. This increases the chance they might slip up and reveal themselves, which is always a good thing.

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 06:22:48 pm

Because I forgot to include it in my last post:
Unvote
FluffyBinLaden

Why go for the blue when you could go for the red?

You suspect him, so what's holding you back from turning your suspicions into a vote?

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 09:22:34 pm

ICs:Does a vote against an attacker within a post pointing out a flaw in said attacker's accusations classify as an OMGUS?

An OMGUS in its most technical definition is when you vote a player solely because they voted you.

If you have good reasons for your vote, then it's not an OMGUS regardless of whether a player voted you first. It will still get called an OMGUS, of course, but nobody really gives a shit about that.

OMGUSes are only really a concern if they happen in their strictest sense, in which case you're probably dealing with an incredibly inexperienced player who doesn't know what he's doing and in that case it doesn't really tell you much anyway.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 31, 2012, 02:50:09 am

Sorry Dwarfinton, I had just gotten up when I posted that. I thought the question said Mafia. Very sorry, I wish to avoid that in future. What I really meant was that I would find the most obviously scummy player, then check his interactions with other people. Again, sorry about that.

FluffyBinLaden, you seem to be throwing some heavy accusations. I hate to be jumping on a bandwagon, but you appear to be very overt in your rallying efforts.

Jim: Thanks, you have been very helpful. Then again that is an IC's job.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 31, 2012, 11:38:33 am

Time marches on, and with it arguments, accusations, and gnashing of teeth. The recriminations pause momentarily, as suddenly everyone turns their attention to their phones ringing out their various tones.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {0}:
[Deathsword] {3}: borno, FluffyBinLaden, Hapah
[Boltur] {1}: Jim Groovester
[Mr. Dwarfinton] {1}: Boltur
[FluffyBinLaden] {2}: Deathsword, kingfisher1112
[borno] {1}: Dariush
[kingfisher1112] {1}: Mr. Dwarfinton
[Dariush] {0}:   
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {0}:
Replacement queue {1}: Dustylou2

35:30 hours remain.

---

Day 1 will end Wednesday ~10:00PM CDT.
Current extension requests: zero. Four requests needed to extend the day.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on July 31, 2012, 11:49:23 am

Quote from: FluffyBinLaden on July 30, 2012, 06:11:02 pm

Boltur: Because we're new means you'll find a scum? For shame. Why, do you think Deathsword's inexperience will betray him?

In answer to first part : Yes. I think it's easier to find newbie scum than be sure someone is newbie town. That works both ways of course as new town mistakes could be interpreted as scumtells but that is true for mafia in general. Why should i be ashamed of that ? And the second question is your job not mine. First tell me your arguments then i can see if they are sound. You have yet to say something that is supported by reality so get to it.

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 06:22:48 pm

Because I forgot to include it in my last post:
Unvote
FluffyBinLaden

What was your reason to do this ?  Unless that was mistake.

Quote from: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 06:42:06 pm

Uh, we're all less likely because we don't have as much as experience. I don't understand your reasoning behind asking these questions.
No, not all reasons are equal but I guess I read it as if you were saying that jumping on a bandwagon was bad regardless of the reason

Okay more precise question : When jumping on bandwagon is acceptable for you ?

Deathsword: Your opinion on Mr.Dwarfinton ?
Mr.Dwarfinton:: Your opinion on Deathsword ?

Kingfisher: Is rallying for support is something bad ? When or why ?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on July 31, 2012, 12:05:45 pm

This post contains generally useful (in my opinion) game-related information and is recommended reading for everyone, not just for those people whose mistakes I point out.

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 05:06:01 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 04:50:16 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 10:10:33 am

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on July 30, 2012, 08:38:04 am

Deathsword, if you were town, whom among the non-ICs would you most prefer on town side?

Borno.

Why?

Mostly because of all the players here, he was the only one I played with. Hapah only joined the last BM after I was lynched, so I couldn't get any interaction with him.

You are expected to explain this right away, without people having to ask you for clarification. Shrugging off a question like this would net you a raised eyebrow and a prod, doing so repeatedly will net you a vote and a lynch. Don't do it.

Quote from: Hapah on July 30, 2012, 06:19:18 pm

Deathsword: Nope!

This is bullshit. Very occasionally experienced people will try to pull off such 'Here, I voted you for no reason. What are you going to do about it?' gambit, and sometimes it will work. If you are reading this and aren't Book or Jim, you shouldn't do this. If you're scum, it will net you unwanted attention. If you are town, it won't help you catch scum. Most likely you'll get lynched if you pull this off. Don't do it.

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 09:22:34 pm

ICs:Does a vote against an attacker within a post pointing out a flaw in said attacker's accusations classify as an OMGUS?

What Jim said. A note from a pure meta standpoint: it is highly unrecommended to do so if you currently have the majority of the votes, since you will probably be bandwagoned by a combination of scum and lazy noobs going for an easy lynch (if you do not have the majority of votes, people will probably ignore you). Accusing someone of OMGUS is about the laziest and easiest thing scum can do to achieve a mislynch. If only one person is doing it, you can shift the attention to him and his empty case and get him lynched (or at the very least off your back). Otherwise you're in trouble.

Unvote meanwhile.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 31, 2012, 12:52:35 pm

Dar: Noted! I just saw this used for the first time very recently, and so I had to give it a go.

Fluffy: Can you please explain why you voted DS? I may have missed it; let me know if that's the case.

borno: Same as above.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 31, 2012, 01:23:31 pm

Quote from: Dariush on July 31, 2012, 12:05:45 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 05:06:01 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 04:50:16 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 10:10:33 am

Dariush:

Quote from: Dariush on July 30, 2012, 08:38:04 am

Deathsword, if you were town, whom among the non-ICs would you most prefer on town side?

Borno.

Why?

Mostly because of all the players here, he was the only one I played with. Hapah only joined the last BM after I was lynched, so I couldn't get any interaction with him.

You are expected to explain this right away, without people having to ask you for clarification. Shrugging off a question like this would net you a raised eyebrow and a prod, doing so repeatedly will net you a vote and a lynch. Don't do it.

I'll try to avoid this in the future.

Quote from: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 10:01:55 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 06:22:48 pm

Because I forgot to include it in my last post:
Unvote
FluffyBinLaden

Why go for the blue when you could go for the red?

You suspect him, so what's holding you back from turning your suspicions into a vote?

I was hoping he'd answer with a sane and logical post clarifying why he though I was scum. That didn't happen, so I voted him after that.

Quote from: Boltur on July 31, 2012, 11:49:23 am

Quote from: Deathsword on July 30, 2012, 06:22:48 pm

Because I forgot to include it in my last post:
Unvote
FluffyBinLaden

What was your reason to do this ?  Unless that was mistake.

Could you clarify? Are you asking me why I FoSed him (answered above) or why I unvoted and FoSed in a different post (as stated in the quote, I forgot to include them in the post directly above)?

Quote from: Boltur on July 31, 2012, 11:49:23 am

Deathsword: Your opinion on Mr.Dwarfinton ?

There isn't much to go on him at this point, except what looked like an attempt to deflect attention from KF by asking what was the point of your question. KF still has to answer your question, quote:

Quote from: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 02:37:21 pm

kingfisher: Jumping on a bandwagon with a reason is alright ? What reason that would be ?

So, kingfisher: Why is it that you didn't answer the question, instead trying to pretend it never happened?
Mr Dwarfinton: Why are you defending KF? Are you 100% sure he is town? Or are you two scumbuddies, and you are trying to protect him?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 31, 2012, 01:57:13 pm

How am I defending him? I simply asked what the point of the question was, he replied, I replied that I read it in a way that made me question the question.

Sorry about the fragment of a post I'm currently a bit busy. I'll make a longer post later today.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on July 31, 2012, 06:56:18 pm

Deathsword: With a good reason it's fine.

Boltur: When no reason is given. Again, if it is just 'Me Too' then I find that suspicious. Hey, it's just me.

IC's: Can we vote 'No Lynch' on the first day?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on July 31, 2012, 07:12:10 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 31, 2012, 06:56:18 pm

IC's: Can we vote 'No Lynch' on the first day?

I'm not an IC, but I once wrote a rant about nolynches on Day One that I think would be beneficial for this audience, so I quote it below. In brief, you can (i.e., it's a valid vote, and if it has majority no lynch will happen) but you shouldn't unless you have a very very good reason. Actual ICs will, of course, chime in with their own thoughts, and there are different considerations to be had in subsequent days; the below applies only for D1.

Quote from: Bookthras on May 08, 2012, 09:31:27 pm

Even in a game like this, or a role-heavy game like a BYOR, paranormal, or bastard, without a D1 lynch people will lack context for the conversation during the day, which is the very point of the day game. The information lost is not just the flip of a person, but who voted them, with what arguments, and forms the very foundation of how the town power roles will choose their night actions. Information is key, and timely information moreso. People flipping at the start of D2 is not nearly as useful, and a nolynch will result in people using their powers on whoever they were voting (if block/investigate) or a crapshoot for protections and the like, due to lack of context and closure.

A D1 no-lynch pretty much wastes all of D1 content, and gives scum a chance to NK/convert/whatever while town has to shoot in the dark. The amount of information lost is not small, but most importantly, you lose the opportunity to use it. N1 will never come again. Even if you learn the information later, you'll never get that night back, which scum got for free. Not good for town at all.

Quote from: Hapah on May 08, 2012, 07:22:06 pm

Also considering the fact that the D1 lynchee is almost always town (when was the last time anyone saw a scum hang D1?),

Not that rare. The very last game I played (Cybrid Mafia 3 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=104547.msg3146622#msg3146622)) we lynched scum D1. A couple games before that (Politibastard) as well, though that was a... different sort of game. I'm sure there are several others.

So sure, it doesn't happen that often, but it certainly does happen. Plus the possibility of a mislynch is built into the balance of the game. If there is going to be one, it's best for town that it happens sooner rather than later, so maximum information is provided early. It's never good, but a D1 no-lynch is worse.


Please disabuse yourself of the notion that a D1 no-lynch is good for town ever. Except in very narrow types of games where constant (not just D1) no-lynch can be used to break the setup (which is not the case here), whenever you think a D1 no-lynch is good because it's cautious, it's misapplied caution, and will hurt town much more than a possible mislynch would.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on July 31, 2012, 07:16:57 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 31, 2012, 06:56:18 pm

IC's: Can we vote 'No Lynch' on the first day?

Basically what Bookthras said. You can, but it's never a good idea.

Lynches are the town's primary means of investigation, and it's not a good idea to waste one with a no lynch.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on July 31, 2012, 07:36:44 pm

Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on July 31, 2012, 12:52:35 pm

borno: Can you please explain why you voted DS? I may have missed it; let me know if that's the case.

I am voting for him because of Fluffy's pressure vote, and to put on a little pressure myself. He seems to be handling it fine though, so unvote.

Dariush: What do you think about Fluffy, since he's using the exact same tactic that you advised Hapah not to do?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 31, 2012, 08:16:35 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 31, 2012, 06:56:18 pm

Deathsword: With a good reason it's fine.

Once more you DID NOT ANSWER THE QUESTION.

Quote from: Deathsword on July 31, 2012, 01:23:31 pm

Quote from: Boltur on July 30, 2012, 02:37:21 pm

kingfisher: Jumping on a bandwagon with a reason is alright ? What reason that would be ?

The bolded part.

Unvote
kingfisher, tell me, why are you trying so hard to avoid that question? Do you want to bandwagon someone?

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 31, 2012, 02:50:09 am

FluffyBinLaden, you seem to be throwing some heavy accusations. I hate to be jumping on a bandwagon, but you appear to be very overt in your rallying efforts.

Looks like you do, scum.

I have yet no idea if FBL is scum or just some insane newtown, but that there, that's a tell you dropped. Anything to say on that?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on July 31, 2012, 08:42:30 pm

Unvote.

Thanks Book!

borno: Alright. So you voted DS (the 3rd vote, mind you) and didn't question anyone else? Do you have any suspicions right now, no matter how thin?

DS: In post 82 you seem annoyed that Fluffy votes you over a single RVS question, but you don't seem to mind voting someone (me) with the very first post of the game. What's the distinction that makes your vote acceptable and his not?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on July 31, 2012, 10:24:19 pm

Hapah: That was just an RVS vote. I did not consider FBL's vote an RVS one since it had no (real) question at all.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on July 31, 2012, 11:51:03 pm

Hapah: Now that I've gone through the posts, I guess I suspect FBL, for voting Deathsword in what initially seemed like a pressure vote and then absolutely disappearing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on August 01, 2012, 12:59:35 am

Deathsword: Okay.

Book/PotL: Can we get a prod on Fluffy?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 01, 2012, 01:11:20 am

I'm going to request an extension since I haven't quite come across a player I think is scummy enough to lynch, and other games, mafia and otherwise, have been dominating my time.

Unvote, by the way.

Hapah, so what were you hoping to get out of your reasonless vote on Deathsword? And what did you get out of it?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on August 01, 2012, 01:26:19 am

Jim: Two things. First, I thought I might (emphasis on the might) catch someone being a little overzealous (borno and Fluffy both hopped on board rather easily). Second, it feels like it got the game going a lot faster. People aren't asking "What's your favorite ice cream?" or "Do you like turtles?"

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 01, 2012, 02:53:22 am

Deathsword: If he has acted scum, then that is a good reason. If he defends, another good reason. If he and someone else both have voted someone, then again, a good reason. Basic scumtells. The reason is subjective. I don't want to bandwagon anyone.
My vote still stands. FBL is certainly suspicious, and you seem just like a really good Town player. Or an even better mafia.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 01, 2012, 02:54:48 am

Whoops, also want an extension.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on August 01, 2012, 02:57:02 am

king: bold the request for extend like Jim did. I think it's a rules thing.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Tiruin on August 01, 2012, 03:00:59 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 01, 2012, 02:57:02 am

king: bold the request for extend like Jim did. I think it's a rules thing.

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 11:18:10 am

• Extensions/Shortens -
  • Votes for extension/shorten are done in boldface. Extend, Extension, Extend it up yo, Shorten it out y'all are acceptable ways to vote for an extension/shorten.
  • Extensions/shortens can be opposed by declaring opposition, and they count against the total number of votes for an extension/shorten. Extensions count as opposition to shortens and vice versa.

Yes they are.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on August 01, 2012, 03:01:41 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 01, 2012, 12:59:35 am

Book/PotL: Can we get a prod on Fluffy?

Prod sent. Requests for extensions noted. Kingfisher, for future reference, extension requests are only valid if bolded.

Two extension requests heard. Four are needed to extend the day 48 hours. Votecount will be posted later tonight or in the morning.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 01, 2012, 03:02:46 am

Extend

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on August 01, 2012, 05:07:41 am

Battle is, indeed, the most magnificent competition in which these identities can indulge. It brings out all that is best and removes all that is base. They wallow in it, live for it, become one with it.

....they stop wallowing for a second, their phones are ringing.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {0}:
[Deathsword] {1}: FluffyBinLaden
[Boltur] {0}:
[Mr. Dwarfinton] {1}: Boltur
[FluffyBinLaden] {2}: kingfisher1112, borno
[borno] {0}:
[kingfisher1112] {2}: Mr. Dwarfinton, Deathsword
[Dariush] {0}:   
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {3}: Jim Groovester, Dariush, Hapah
Replacement queue {1}: Dustylou2

20:15 hours remain.

---

Day 1 will end Wednesday ~10:00PM CDT.
Current extension requests: two (Jim Groovester, kingfisher1112). Four requests needed to extend the day.
Prods sent to all players who haven't posted in 24+ hours. Please be active.

The LurkerTracker is your friend: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on August 01, 2012, 06:04:28 am

Quote from: borno on July 31, 2012, 07:36:44 pm

Dariush: What do you think about Fluffy, since he's using the exact same tactic that you advised Hapah not to do?

I think that he actually did two fuck-ups at once, by bandwagoning DS and doing so without a real question, so that's why he gets my vote. (Fluffy) I have no idea how I missed that post. That was a fuck-up on my part.

DS, you are accusing two people of being scum simultaneously early in D1. Why did you switch your vote from FBL to KF, especially considering that the former's actions are much more damning than the latter's (at least in my eyes)?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on August 01, 2012, 09:18:33 am

First, extend.

Dariush: I switched my vote for two reasons: to ensure KF would answer the question and because I can't get any new data on FBL if he doesn't post.

KF: While I do not agree that there are good reasons to bandwagon (unless you are scum), at least you answered the question. So (unvote) my vote goes back FBL for now. However, you still said you were jumping on a bandwagon, despite your claims to hate it. If you hate bandwagons so much, why did you say you were joining one on FBL?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on August 01, 2012, 02:16:39 pm

Argh sorry for inactivity i got had more work than i hoped for few days.

Extend while i reread and make a post with some content

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on August 01, 2012, 03:02:28 pm

Four extension requests heard. Day has been extended 48 hours.

Day 1 will end Friday ~10:00PM CDT.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on August 01, 2012, 04:04:49 pm

Alright things that are still unclear or bother me in some way:

Borno: You seem to have no real mixed opinion on fluffy and while voting him you never adress him directly:

Quote from: borno on July 31, 2012, 07:36:44 pm

I am voting for him because of Fluffy's pressure vote, and to put on a little pressure myself.
...
What do you think about Fluffy, since he's using the exact same tactic that you advised Hapah not to do?

Here you say it was pressure vote and you made it clear you realize it was without a question yet this is not enough to make you vote for him or even question him.

Quote from: borno on July 31, 2012, 11:51:03 pm

Hapah: Now that I've gone through the posts, I guess I suspect FBL, for voting Deathsword in what initially seemed like a pressure vote and then absolutely disappearing.

And yet suddenly using the exact same facts you vote for him ? What happened that made you change your mind ? And why are you so reculant to state your own opinion on him instead quoting someone else ?

Mr.Dwarfinton:

Quote from: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 31, 2012, 01:57:13 pm

How am I defending him? I simply asked what the point of the question was, he replied, I replied that I read it in a way that made me question the question.

I belive attacking someone who accuses your buddy is called chainsawing. And being passive-agressive while doing it is still scummy.

Unvote
kingfisher:

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 01, 2012, 02:53:22 am

My vote still stands. FBL is certainly suspicious, and you seem just like a really good Town player. Or an even better mafia.

What's the meaning of the second sentence here ? How DS feeling like town to you influences FBL scumminess ? And buddying up is pretty suspicious tactic here i think. And i have a feeling you like to ignore my questions (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3490671#msg3490671) so i guess the vote should fix that.

Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 01, 2012, 09:18:33 am

Dariush: I switched my vote for two reasons: to ensure KF would answer the question and because I can't get any new data on FBL if he doesn't post.
...
So (unvote) my vote goes back FBL for now.

Why are you swapping it back now then ? You still question KF and FBL still made no post.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on August 01, 2012, 04:28:00 pm

Quote from: Boltur on August 01, 2012, 04:04:49 pm

Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 01, 2012, 09:18:33 am

Dariush: I switched my vote for two reasons: to ensure KF would answer the question and because I can't get any new data on FBL if he doesn't post.
...
So (unvote) my vote goes back FBL for now.

Why are you swapping it back now then ? You still question KF and FBL still made no post.

Because I believe that there is still more to be learned about all this. FBL's two posts have been the scummiest I've seen in my two games, but something about KF doesn't feel right. Aside from the inconsistencies in his arguments, of course. FoSed here to make it obvious that, despite the vote switch, he still has my suspicions. The extend should help, I hope.

Should have some more questions later when I've got some more time to think.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 01, 2012, 04:47:00 pm

FluffyBinLaden, I think it's time you made a reappearance.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 01, 2012, 04:28:00 pm

Because I believe that there is still more to be learned about all this. FBL's two posts have been the scummiest I've seen in my two games, but something about KF doesn't feel right. Aside from the inconsistencies in his arguments, of course. FoSed here to make it obvious that, despite the vote switch, he still has my suspicions. The extend should help, I hope.

Should have some more questions later when I've got some more time to think.

What inconsistencies are these?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on August 01, 2012, 05:53:10 pm

I didn't attack you. I asked you a question because I read a sentence a certain way.

I'm still a bit busy and I can't write a long post. I know I said I'd get a longer one in today, so sorry about not being able to do so. Hopefully I will be able to do stuff that doesn't just include popping in once a day to reply to a question.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on August 01, 2012, 05:55:54 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 01, 2012, 04:47:00 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 01, 2012, 04:28:00 pm

Because I believe that there is still more to be learned about all this. FBL's two posts have been the scummiest I've seen in my two games, but something about KF doesn't feel right. Aside from the inconsistencies in his arguments, of course. FoSed here to make it obvious that, despite the vote switch, he still has my suspicions. The extend should help, I hope.

Should have some more questions later when I've got some more time to think.

What inconsistencies are these?

As stated in my posts, he keeps saying how he hates bandwagons, yet he said more than once he'd join one "if the reasons are good enough". He even said he was bandwagonning FBL.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: borno on August 01, 2012, 06:23:39 pm

Boltur:

Quote from: Boltur on August 01, 2012, 04:04:49 pm

Borno: You seem to have no real mixed opinion on fluffy and while voting him you never adress him directly:

Quote from: borno on July 31, 2012, 07:36:44 pm

I am voting for him because of Fluffy's pressure vote, and to put on a little pressure myself.
...
What do you think about Fluffy, since he's using the exact same tactic that you advised Hapah not to do?

Here you say it was pressure vote and you made it clear you realize it was without a question yet this is not enough to make you vote for him or even question him.

Quote from: borno on July 31, 2012, 11:51:03 pm

Hapah: Now that I've gone through the posts, I guess I suspect FBL, for voting Deathsword in what initially seemed like a pressure vote and then absolutely disappearing.

And yet suddenly using the exact same facts you vote for him ? What happened that made you change your mind ? And why are you so reculant to state your own opinion on him instead quoting someone else ?

I have stated my opinion; He voted on DS with what I initially thought was just a pressure vote, but then he never took it off, making me think that it was a reasonless bandwagon.

DS: You seem to be changing your votes around a lot. If you think that FBL is scum, why do you keep changing your vote to other people?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on August 01, 2012, 06:47:26 pm

DS: So bandwagons are never acceptable? What if the evidence suggested is very compelling? I see that statement by KF being more honest than scummy.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 01, 2012, 10:20:01 pm

DS: I Hate them without reason. FBL has made a few fudge ups that make him suspicious. So I believe that he is scum.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 07:34:18 am

Alright i got enough of this.
Kingfisher are you intentionally ignoring me ? I looked back on your posts and i believe a lazy and passive town i thought you are is something completely else. You asked exactly one question this whole game and even that was noncommittal "How do you like to determine who is scum in the first day?" in your first post. You stated no suspicion towards anybody and your current vote for FBL is bandwagon vote in your own eyes! Buddying up? Check. Ignoring questions that force you to commit to the situation ? Check. Vague answers for the rest ? Check. You're just lying scum trying to lurk trough the first day! So answer my questions or hang. If i have not voted earlier i would do it now but this time you're not getting away with silence.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:10:11 am

Fine. What's the question?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:24:42 am

Quote from: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 07:34:18 am

Alright i got enough of this.
Kingfisher are you intentionally ignoring me ? I looked back on your posts and i believe a lazy and passive town i thought you are is something completely else. You asked exactly one question this whole game and even that was noncommittal "How do you like to determine who is scum in the first day?" in your first post. You stated no suspicion towards anybody and your current vote for FBL is bandwagon vote in your own eyes! Buddying up? Check. Ignoring questions that force you to commit to the situation ? Check. Vague answers for the rest ? Check. You're just lying scum trying to lurk trough the first day! So answer my questions or hang. If i have not voted earlier i would do it now but this time you're not getting away with silence.

Y'know what, no. I'm not going to be fricking passive. Buddying up? With who? I don't need to ask questions. I can look at other people's responses. How am I lurking? I have been pretty goddamn active. And screw what I said. It ain't a wagon in my eyes. I no longer see it as a wagon. It is a damn good vote against a lazy town or poor scum. Getting away with silence? Screw that. Ask any damn questions you want. I'm all ears.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on August 02, 2012, 09:15:47 am

Quote from: KF

-snip- I don't need to ask questions. -snip-

Dangerous words, KF. How will you catch scum if you don't ask them questions?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on August 02, 2012, 09:17:47 am

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:24:42 am

Quote from: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 07:34:18 am

Alright i got enough of this.
Kingfisher are you intentionally ignoring me ? I looked back on your posts and i believe a lazy and passive town i thought you are is something completely else. You asked exactly one question this whole game and even that was noncommittal "How do you like to determine who is scum in the first day?" in your first post. You stated no suspicion towards anybody and your current vote for FBL is bandwagon vote in your own eyes! Buddying up? Check. Ignoring questions that force you to commit to the situation ? Check. Vague answers for the rest ? Check. You're just lying scum trying to lurk trough the first day! So answer my questions or hang. If i have not voted earlier i would do it now but this time you're not getting away with silence.

Y'know what, no. I'm not going to be fricking passive. Buddying up? With who? I don't need to ask questions. I can look at other people's responses. How am I lurking? I have been pretty goddamn active. And screw what I said. It ain't a wagon in my eyes. I no longer see it as a wagon. It is a damn good vote against a lazy town or poor scum. Getting away with silence? Screw that. Ask any damn questions you want. I'm all ears.

Mafia games are all about asking people questions. You don't ask questions, you don't catch scum. You want proof, check the last BM, where I pretty much only asked a couple of questions and declared people scum.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 01, 2012, 10:20:01 pm

DS: I Hate them without reason. FBL has made a few fudge ups that make him suspicious. So I believe that he is scum.

If you believe someone is scum, you must question them. FBL appears to have stopped posting, so there really isn't much point in doing so until we get some activity by him, but with anyone you are suspicious of, you must ask questions.

Ninja'd by Hapah, damnit.

Quote from: borno on August 01, 2012, 06:23:39 pm

DS: You seem to be changing your votes around a lot. If you think that FBL is scum, why do you keep changing your vote to other people?

I answered this question a few posts before you asked this, reply #129 to be exact.

Quote from: Hapah on August 01, 2012, 06:47:26 pm

DS: So bandwagons are never acceptable? What if the evidence suggested is very compelling? I see that statement by KF being more honest than scummy.

I consider a bandwagon to be when a player votes for another (outside RVS) without actually doing some questioning or presenting evidence of their own, instead simply saying "I vote X, because he/she is scum".

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 09:29:37 am

DS: Who do you think is scum?

Hapah: Who do you think is scum?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: FluffyBinLaden on August 02, 2012, 10:52:06 am

Unvote Deathsword


Gentlemen, I apologize profusely. Life got busy, and I don't have the time to contribute. I do hope the game goes well.


Replacement Request

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dariush on August 02, 2012, 10:52:43 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 02, 2012, 09:15:47 am

Quote from: KF

-snip- I don't need to ask questions. -snip-

Dangerous words, KF. How will you catch scum if you don't ask them questions?

What he said. If this was a non-BM game, you would be a dead man walking after saying that.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:10:11 am

Fine. What's the question?

You're too rude. I know I'm not the nicest person around, but when I insult people, I usually do it either to make them crack or to publicly display my opinion of them. You're just snap at them for no reason.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 09:29:37 am

DS: Who do you think is scum?

Hapah: Who do you think is scum?

This is waaaaaay too lazy. So lazy, in fact, that I'm going to shift my vote to you, KF, just to point out how lazy you are. Ask real questions, not half-assed ones made up on the spot (and identical ones, to boot). Going into meta territory, I freely admit that only about 5% of questions asked actually help catch scum, but their main purpose is to provoke discussion.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on August 02, 2012, 11:09:52 am

Looks like FBL is out. So I guess this changes things a little.
Unvote
KF

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 12:12:04 pm

Unvote, vote Hapah.
You seem to be staying relatively silent on this discussion. Tell me, if you were doctor who would you be protecting?

DS: Care to tell me the reason why you've voted me?
Boltur: No, rallying for support is a good thing under certain circumstances. ( Read: You know he's scum, you're cop, things like that.)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on August 02, 2012, 12:26:55 pm

With the day extended, emotions run high. Arguments fly and consensus is elusive. They pause when their phones start chiming once again.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {1}: kingfisher1112
[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {0}:
[Mr. Dwarfinton] {0}:
[FluffyBinLaden] {1}: borno
[borno] {0}:
[kingfisher1112] {4}: Mr. Dwarfinton, Dariush, Boltur, Deathsword
[Dariush] {0}:   
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {3}: Jim Groovester, Hapah, FluffyBinLaden
Replacement queue {1}: Dustylou2

36:45 hours remain.

---

Day 1 will end Friday ~10:00PM CDT.
Current extension requests: zero. Four requests needed to extend the day.

FluffyBinLaden has requested a replacement. Notice sent to Dustylou2, once he confirms availability, I'll announce the replacement. The replacement queue is now empty, please post if you'd like to be added to the queue.

The LurkerTracker is your friend: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 02, 2012, 01:21:18 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:24:42 am

Quote from: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 07:34:18 am

Alright i got enough of this.
Kingfisher are you intentionally ignoring me ? I looked back on your posts and i believe a lazy and passive town i thought you are is something completely else. You asked exactly one question this whole game and even that was noncommittal "How do you like to determine who is scum in the first day?" in your first post. You stated no suspicion towards anybody and your current vote for FBL is bandwagon vote in your own eyes! Buddying up? Check. Ignoring questions that force you to commit to the situation ? Check. Vague answers for the rest ? Check. You're just lying scum trying to lurk trough the first day! So answer my questions or hang. If i have not voted earlier i would do it now but this time you're not getting away with silence.

Y'know what, no. I'm not going to be fricking passive. Buddying up? With who? I don't need to ask questions. I can look at other people's responses. How am I lurking? I have been pretty goddamn active. And screw what I said. It ain't a wagon in my eyes. I no longer see it as a wagon. It is a damn good vote against a lazy town or poor scum. Getting away with silence? Screw that. Ask any damn questions you want. I'm all ears.

There's the scum slip I've been looking for. Shakerag has advised you poorly or you haven't listened to his advice, because the cardinal rule when playing scum is to stay calm. Giving everyone a reaction like this to look at has given you away.

In any case, you're playing reactively to the flaws people have pointed out in you, when that's the way you should've been playing before. kingfisher1112.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Hapah on August 02, 2012, 01:25:00 pm

PFP

Jim, can you explain the second part of your last sentence? I don't quite understand it.(bolded)

Quote from: Jim

In any case, you're playing reactively to the flaws people have pointed out in you, when that's the way you should've been playing before.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 02, 2012, 01:43:00 pm

So kingfisher1112 has a sudden interest in asking questions, but this only comes after people vote him for it. He should have been asking questions all along. I did a quick check on his posts and the accusation that he wasn't asking question holds.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on August 02, 2012, 02:09:21 pm

Dustylou2 has replaced FluffyBinLaden.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on August 02, 2012, 02:12:58 pm

Dustylou2: What do you think of FBL's behaivour before you replaced him? Do you think there is any way to justify what he said?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 02, 2012, 03:11:59 pm

Hey everyone, glad to be here. Unfortunately, I'm going to be out of the house for a little bit, so I'll be back with actual content in around two hours.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 04:54:58 pm

Kingfisher:

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:10:11 am

Fine. What's the question?

It's your job to keep track of the game not mine. I guess scum would have the tendency to just skim over the thread because they do not need to find anything and just look like they're doing something.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:24:42 am

Quote from: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 07:34:18 am

---

Y'know what, no. I'm not going to be fricking passive. Buddying up? With who? I don't need to ask questions. I can look at other people's responses. How am I lurking? I have been pretty goddamn active. And screw what I said. It ain't a wagon in my eyes. I no longer see it as a wagon. It is a damn good vote against a lazy town or poor scum. Getting away with silence? Screw that. Ask any damn questions you want. I'm all ears.

Alright. At least you seem eager to defend yourself. Why so angry if i'm completely wrong ? Buddying: If you looked for my questions after my previous post you would know, now i suspect you just go with the flow not looking back. Not asking questions is only part of the problem here, you made no move to push the discussion forward. No suspicions,no disagreement,no pressure on anybody, simply going on and nodding is not a way to catch scum! And that's also why lurking is not the same thing as not posting. And no you can't just alter the past and change what you said. You're responsible for what you write so there is no "i take it back it's not what i wanted to write" here. Reasons why you did it would be fine but outright saying that you lied there ? That's bad. If i were to forget everything someone asks me to scumhunting would be impossible.You need to try harder than that to change my opinion.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 09:29:37 am

DS: Who do you think is scum?

Hapah: Who do you think is scum?

I have no words. I thought your previous post was made to mirror my accustions but this is pretty much why i had problem with your play in first place. Why these two ? Why now ?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 02, 2012, 05:42:39 pm

A much shorter time than usual after the last another message arrives.

---

Attention all Players,

The Conductor has returned and will
oversee the remainder of this Game.

Game Master Bookthras has performed
commendably in my absence and
deserves a round of applause.

28:30 hours remain.

---

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Heyo everyone!  I'm back!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Bookthras on August 02, 2012, 05:49:09 pm

Excellent, welcome back! It was my pleasure and quite fun. I especially liked your flavour and the roles, they were interesting and well fleshed out.

Dudes, continue having a great game!

_{[Book bows and exits, stage left.]}

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 07:06:39 pm

How much time is left?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 02, 2012, 07:16:34 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 07:06:39 pm

How much time is left?

Quote from: Bookthras on August 02, 2012, 12:26:55 pm

Day 1 will end Friday ~10:00PM CDT.

You have until the end of Friday.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 02, 2012, 07:40:04 pm

@Deathsword: I'm not really sure why FBL acted the way he did. He said that he'd played mafia IRL, maybe there it's less serious? The problem seems to be that he didn't get the memo that you have to actually provide support for your arguments.

@borno: I just finished reading through the thread, and you're pretty scummy. You start out quite focused on Deathsword, asking no one else questions outside of your RVS post. Then, when you get called on it, you hop onto the EasyLynchMobile and vote FBL without even asking him a question.  Finally, you disappear yourself, as you haven't posted in 26 hours. You seem to be doing little hunting of your own, merely grabbing at the scraps like a scum-covered vulture. When are you going to start hunting for real? Present your argument for your vote for everyone to see.

MOD: Can we get prods on Mr. D and borno please? They've been missing for over a day.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 02, 2012, 08:02:51 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 02, 2012, 07:40:04 pm

MOD: Can we get prods on Mr. D and borno please? They've been missing for over a day.

Prods have been sent.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Teneb on August 02, 2012, 08:18:34 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 03:10:51 am

I would question them to see who was least scummy.

While re-reading the thread I found this. This was your very first post. Tell me, what happened to make you change your mind and decide you could judge one's scummyness based on the questions of others?

Then there was this... thing.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 06:57:45 pm

Deathsword: Jumping on after careful examination of posts, determining who deserves your vote. Not HURR DURR ME TOO.
Deathsword, going on the offensive a bit. Please, tell me the reason.

I'm guessing Shakerag called you out on that, so that would explain the "nevermind" post shortly after.


Then there was this question by Mr D

Quote from: Mr. Dwarfinton on July 30, 2012, 04:21:26 pm

Kingfisher: If you had to kill someone as town how would you choose that person?

Which you then answered with:

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 06:57:45 pm

Mr Dwarfinton, I would see who is the most active and intelligent.

Why exactly do you wish to kill the most active and intelligent player as town? I'm quite sure that those two characteristics are not scummy. I think you slipped and answered as the scum you are. So, tell me, is lynching an active, intelligent and scumhunting player something you'd do as town?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:56:28 pm

For all your looking back, you still didn't read my post saying that I thought the question said mafia. Do you have selective eyesight?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Teneb on August 02, 2012, 09:13:54 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:56:28 pm

For all your looking back, you still didn't read my post saying that I thought the question said mafia. Do you have selective eyesight?

No, I think you said that in order to try to avoid suspicions.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 09:25:44 pm

No, I did it so I could appear less like a massive idiot.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

kingfisher:
You seem to be acting incredibly scummy. When Boltur called you out on your suspicious behaviour, you responded aggressively, as though you were tired of people questioning you. (Which, by the way, is what mafia is all about.)

Then you ask some lazy questions, and then vote Hapah just to divert attention from yourself, with your reason being because he hadn't posted in three hours.

Tell us, why were you so aggressive?

dustylou2:
I was quite focused on him because he voted FBL over, what, at the time, seemed like a simple pressure vote. But when he didn't post again, I got suspicious. I voted him because he had voted someone for no reason, with no question. That on its own wouldn't of warranted a vote; but then he disappeared straight after, which looked like scum putting a vote on someone and then not bothering to take it off, even when presented with arguments why to do so.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 11:16:30 pm

Well, I'm not tired of questioning, I'm tired of ' Oh, you didn't answer my question trawl through three pages to find it. ' It's usually when I sleep.
I asked questions anyway. That's what mafia is all about.
And it was late at night. I usually get angry when I'm tired. Being sick doesn't help either.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Hapah on August 03, 2012, 12:55:30 am

Book: Thanks!

PotL: Welcome back!

Jim, Dar: Why are you gentlemen hanging back? Just letting all us new guys get our legs?

Kingfisher: Man, I don't know what to make of you. The accidentally answering that one question from a scum point of view instead of town, I can understand that. I glossed over the "town" in that as well once I hit the word "kill". It's a little fishy, but hardly conclusive.

But this exchange? How does it make any sort of sense? Snips for brevity, and some bold emphasis mine. (I didn't include Jim's first post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3486982#msg3486982), but it's somewhat relevant)

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 30, 2012, 03:10:51 am

-snip-
Jim, How do you like to determine who is scum in the first day?

Quote from: Jim Groovester on July 30, 2012, 04:50:16 pm

-snip-
By scumhunting.

Spoiler: Is there any other way? (click to show/hide)

NO

Paying close attention to everything everyone says, asking questions about anything odd that comes up, doing selective rereads to examine a player, looking for inconsistencies, aggressively questioning people, trying to get them to slip up and do something revealing, are all excellent ways to find scum.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on July 31, 2012, 02:50:09 am

-snip-
Jim: Thanks, you have been very helpful. Then again that is an IC's job.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 08:24:42 am

-snip-
Y'know what, no. I'm not going to be fricking passive. Buddying up? With who? I don't need to ask questions. I can look at other people's responses. How am I lurking? I have been pretty goddamn active. And screw what I said. It ain't a wagon in my eyes. I no longer see it as a wagon. It is a damn good vote against a lazy town or poor scum. Getting away with silence? Screw that. Ask any damn questions you want. I'm all ears.

You ask Jim what seems like a request for advice. He gives the advice. You thank him for the advice. You then proceed to completely ignore said advice. What happened?

borno:

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

-snip-
dustylou2:
I was quite focused on him because he voted FBL over, what, at the time, seemed like a simple pressure vote. But when he didn't post again, I got suspicious. I voted him because he had voted someone for no reason, with no question. That on its own wouldn't of warranted a vote; but then he disappeared straight after, which looked like scum putting a vote on someone and then not bothering to take it off, even when presented with arguments why to do so.

Quote from: borno on July 30, 2012, 09:04:16 pm

-snip-
Deathsword: You don't have to vote to do an OMGUS.

Also, you do realize that I was scum in the last game, and that I was replaced halfway through?

You stated that this was because of Fluffy vote, and to "apply pressure". Who is to say that DS's vote was not a pressure vote?

Dar:

Quote from: Dariush on August 02, 2012, 10:52:43 am

You're too rude.

WHAT.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 03, 2012, 01:52:56 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 02, 2012, 09:13:54 pm

No, I think you said that in order to try to avoid suspicions.

People make mistakes. It happens even in mafia.

When there's an issue that's easily explained by a simple misunderstanding, that's usually what it is.

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

Tell us, why were you so aggressive?

Being aggressive isn't a scum tell. Aggressively pursuing targets, questioning them in a dogged manner, and so on, is usually a town tell.

However, I wouldn't call what kingfisher1112 did aggressive. I'm going to avoid further elaboration on why.

Point being, do not associate aggression with scumminess.

Also, can you explain your reasoning behind your vote on Deathsword (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3489264#msg3489264), followed by your vote on FluffyBinLaden (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3492459#msg3492459), followed by your vote on kingfisher1112 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3497306#msg3497306), and how it's not bandwagoning even though it really, really, uncannily looks like it?

Because it looks like you're joining whatever bandwagon is currently popular.

Quote from: Hapah on August 03, 2012, 12:55:30 am

Jim, Dar: Why are you gentlemen hanging back? Just letting all us new guys get our legs?

That's part of it. I do like to stand back sometimes and see what the players turn up if I go without popping in all the time and telling them what to do. Since I haven't had to pop in to correct people I'm mostly satisfied with what I see. (Early on I'm looking to see lots of activity and lots of questions. Later on, if I think they can handle it, I saddle them with more advanced stuff, like criticizing the reasons for their votes, telling them what to look for, etc.)

The rest of it is I've been watching the proceedings and I haven't come across too much I want to ask about.

I'll point out that it's very generous of you to provide me with an answer to the question you're asking. Why not just chop off the last half of this? It would be more pointed and aggressive. The way it is now provides me an incredibly easy out, because you've already provided me with the answer you're expecting, and all I have to do is nod my head and say yes and then you don't get any information out of it. Because it's true I have been hanging back, and that's definitely something worth asking about, but you lose the opportunity for good information by giving the answer away.

You're either demonstrating a lot of faith in your ICs, or you're lobbing them softballs, both of which are problematic.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 03, 2012, 02:14:49 am

Glad to see you're back, borno.

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

dustylou2:
I was quite focused on him because he voted FBL over, what, at the time, seemed like a simple pressure vote. But when he didn't post again, I got suspicious. I voted him because he had voted someone for no reason, with no question. That on its own wouldn't of warranted a vote; but then he disappeared straight after, which looked like scum putting a vote on someone and then not bothering to take it off, even when presented with arguments why to do so.

Could you clarify this a bit? The pronouns are bamboozling me.

kingfisher1112: OK, what? You ask no good questions (in fact stating that you don't need to!), ignore the advice of ICs, react to questioning with hostility, and contradict yourself on the issue of bandwagoning? The only reason I'm not voting you right now is because I think that there's a strong chance that you're simply new (I mean, it's a beginner mafia after all) and are completely mystified about what to do. If that's the case, remember that the ICs are here for a reason.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Dariush on August 03, 2012, 03:01:12 am

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

snip as though you were tired of people questioning you. (Which, by the way, is what mafia is all about.)

No, questions is not what the mafia is all about. Questions is what RVS is all about. The rest of the mafia is about figuring out scum.

KINGFISHER. DO NOT IGNORE ICS.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 11:16:30 pm

Well, I'm not tired of questioning, I'm tired of ' Oh, you didn't answer my question trawl through three pages to find it. ' It's usually when I sleep.

If you have to trawl through three pages to find questions addressed to you, you aren't giving the game sufficient attention. At the very fucking least you must glance over every single post at least once and note (and, hopefully, answer) questions directed at you.

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 02, 2012, 11:16:30 pm

I asked questions anyway. That's what mafia is all about.

You asked two shitty questions after being prompted to. And then aped an incorrect idea.

Quote from: Hapah on August 03, 2012, 12:55:30 am

Jim, Dar: Why are you gentlemen hanging back? Just letting all us new guys get our legs?

Mwuh? I wouldn't consider my level of activity 'hanging back'.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 03, 2012, 05:24:04 am

I'm so far up shit river that nothing can stop my lynch, so I'll give you guys some answers.

Dustylou: Yeah, I admit to doing all of these of these things. But some things need correction. I reacted to a question, not multiple questions with hostility. And the contradiction isn't a contradiction, I overrided it with my post. And I was never against bandwagoning, I was only against it without reason. And yeah, this is my first mafia. Ain't going so well.  :-[

But anyway, enough of that.

Deathsword: I was kinda backing off when we started, then i fell behind, which has resulted me getting into this.

Quote from: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 07:34:18 am

---

Y'know what, no. I'm not going to be fricking passive. Buddying up? With who? I don't need to ask questions. I can look at other people's responses. How am I lurking? I have been pretty goddamn active. And screw what I said. It ain't a wagon in my eyes. I no longer see it as a wagon. It is a damn good vote against a lazy town or poor scum. Getting away with silence? Screw that. Ask any damn questions you want. I'm all ears.
[/quote] Alright. At least you seem eager to defend yourself. Why so angry if i'm completely wrong ? Buddying: If you looked for my questions after my previous post you would know, now i suspect you just go with the flow not looking back. Not asking questions is only part of the problem here, you made no move to push the discussion forward. No suspicions,no disagreement,no pressure on anybody, simply going on and nodding is not a way to catch scum! And that's also why lurking is not the same thing as not posting. And no you can't just alter the past and change what you said. You're responsible for what you write so there is no "i take it back it's not what i wanted to write" here. Reasons why you did it would be fine but outright saying that you lied there ? That's bad. If i were to forget everything someone asks me to scumhunting would be impossible.You need to try harder than that to change my opinion.
[/quote]
Again, I was kinda angry because it was late a night. And I was putting pressure on FBL. Then he quit and I was clueless. I did not say I outright lying I was just saying ' That's not quite what I meant.' And I didn't simply forget, I simply wasn't reading as many questions as I should have.

Borno You seem really damn eager to get someone, ANYONE lynched. Looking back on your votes I can see something scummy. Please, tell me your reasonings for voting these people.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Dariush on August 03, 2012, 07:56:34 am

KINGFISHEEEEEEEEEER

Are you intentionally ignoring me?..

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 03, 2012, 08:09:31 am

What is it? Is it a question? An acknowledgement? What do you require?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Hapah on August 03, 2012, 10:41:57 am

Jim:

Quote from: Jim

Why not just chop off the last half of this? It would be more pointed and aggressive.

Velvet glove, iron fist. Put too sharp a point on it and people will see the line of attack; good information can be pulled from seemingly innocent questions. (And I didn't know if RL was catching up to you, but that doesn't appear to be the case)

Forgive me for not quoting the entire post, but you said this, emphasis mine.

Quote from: Jim

The rest of it is I've been watching the proceedings and I haven't come across too much I want to ask about.

You yourself said that aggressive questioning is a vital part of scumhunting, but you're willing to sit in the bleachers? I can understand taking the edge off of your questions so you don't tear us new guys limb from limb, but the fact that you (an IC) aren't practicing what you preach strikes me as a little odd.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Mr. Dwarfinton on August 03, 2012, 11:13:52 am

I apologize but I have been rather busy lately. Good luck with catching scum and such.

Replacement Request

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 03, 2012, 05:41:09 pm

Quote from: kingfisher1112 on August 03, 2012, 05:24:04 am

I'm so far up shit river that nothing can stop my lynch, so I'll give you guys some answers.

You should be answering questions anyway.

Not ignoring people goes a long way to not being lynched, you know.

Quote from: Hapah on August 03, 2012, 10:41:57 am

You yourself said that aggressive questioning is a vital part of scumhunting, but you're willing to sit in the bleachers? I can understand taking the edge off of your questions so you don't tear us new guys limb from limb, but the fact that you (an IC) aren't practicing what you preach strikes me as a little odd.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's the same thing every Beginner's Mafia. "Jim, you're doing a lot of ICing, but I don't see a lot of hunting out of you."

Early in the game, all I see is noob. It's impossible to differentiate between the things that make a player scum versus town when a player is unskilled, so much so that most BMs I spend virtually all of Day 1 getting people to shape up.

If there is something that comes along that I think is an actual scumtell, I don't hesitate to vote or ask about it, but this happens infrequently on Day 1 in most BMs. For me, anyway.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 03, 2012, 05:45:10 pm

Goodbye Mr. D, hope to see you again some other time.

borno: Reposting, since I think you missed it:

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 03, 2012, 02:14:49 am

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

dustylou2:
I was quite focused on him because he voted FBL over, what, at the time, seemed like a simple pressure vote. But when he didn't post again, I got suspicious. I voted him because he had voted someone for no reason, with no question. That on its own wouldn't of warranted a vote; but then he disappeared straight after, which looked like scum putting a vote on someone and then not bothering to take it off, even when presented with arguments why to do so.

Could you clarify this a bit? The pronouns are bamboozling me.

Boltur: Where have you vanished to? When you get back, summarize your case on kingfisher1112.

MOD: Prod Boltur?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 03, 2012, 07:22:12 pm

The message came as usual, though consensus seemed to have been reached, as the day drew to a close.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {1}: kingfisher1112
[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {0}:
[Mr. Dwarfinton] {0}:
[Dustylou2] {1}: borno
[borno] {0}:
[kingfisher1112] {7}: Mr. Dwarfinton, Dariush, Boltur, Deathsword, Jim Groovester, Hapah, borno
[Dariush] {0}:   
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {0}:
Replacement queue {0}:

2:46 hours remain.

---

Day 1 will end Friday ~10:00PM CDT.
Current extension requests: zero. Four requests needed to extend the day.

Mr. Dwarfinton has requested a replacement.  The replacement queue is empty, please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to be added.

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Boltur has been prodded as per request.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: borno on August 03, 2012, 08:20:08 pm

Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on August 03, 2012, 12:55:30 am

borno:

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

-snip-
dustylou2:
I was quite focused on him because he voted FBL over, what, at the time, seemed like a simple pressure vote. But when he didn't post again, I got suspicious. I voted him because he had voted someone for no reason, with no question. That on its own wouldn't of warranted a vote; but then he disappeared straight after, which looked like scum putting a vote on someone and then not bothering to take it off, even when presented with arguments why to do so.

Quote from: borno on July 30, 2012, 09:04:16 pm

-snip-
Deathsword: You don't have to vote to do an OMGUS.

Also, you do realize that I was scum in the last game, and that I was replaced halfway through?

You stated that this was because of Fluffy vote, and to "apply pressure". Who is to say that DS's vote was not a pressure vote?

In my eyes, Deathsword voted FBL because FBL had voted for him. However, Fluffy didn't post anything after that, nor did he take his vote off or at least explain it, even when he had plenty of reason to. So I shifted my vote to him. And if DS's vote was just for pressure, it didn't work, since Fluffy disappeared straight after that.

Jim:

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 03, 2012, 01:52:56 am

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

Tell us, why were you so aggressive?

Being aggressive isn't a scum tell. Aggressively pursuing targets, questioning them in a dogged manner, and so on, is usually a town tell.

However, I wouldn't call what kingfisher1112 did aggressive. I'm going to avoid further elaboration on why.

Point being, do not associate aggression with scumminess.

Also, can you explain your reasoning behind your vote on Deathsword (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3489264#msg3489264), followed by your vote on FluffyBinLaden (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3492459#msg3492459), followed by your vote on kingfisher1112 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3497306#msg3497306), and how it's not bandwagoning even though it really, really, uncannily looks like it?

Because it looks like you're joining whatever bandwagon is currently popular.

Like I have already said; I initially voted Deathsword because I thought he voted FBL because FBL had voted him. However, FBL didn't post again after that, leading me to be extremely suspicious of him. He looked like the kind of scum who puts a vote on someone and then lurks the rest of the game.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 03, 2012, 09:58:04 pm

So do you still suspect those players for the reasons you voted them?

Quote from: borno on August 03, 2012, 08:20:08 pm

He looked like the kind of scum who puts a vote on someone and then lurks the rest of the game.

What kind of scum does that?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 03, 2012, 11:05:43 pm

The conversation slowly ended as the last few numbers on the counters disappeared.  It was decided, kingfisher would be the one to be Erased this day. 

00:00:01

…

00:00:00

The timer reached zero at last, and right on cue a message arrived.

---

Attention all Players, the votes stand as follows:
[Hapah] {1}: kingfisher1112
[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {0}:
[Mr. Dwarfinton] {0}:
[Dustylou2] {1}: borno
[borno] {0}:
[kingfisher1112] {7}: Mr. Dwarfinton, Dariush, Boltur, Deathsword, Jim Groovester, Hapah, borno
[Dariush] {0}:   
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {0}:
Replacement queue {0}:

The day has ended and by popular consensus,
kingfisher shall be Erased.

---

Everyone looked at kingfisher. For the first time he seemed to realize that this truly was the end.

“Guys, listen to me, I’m not a Reaper, I swear!  If I disappear here then my parents… ”  He looked down at his hands, which like his feet were now quickly becoming transparent, “Oh god, oh god, no no no no, this can’t be happening!  WHYYYYYYYY!?” 

His body became more and more transparent with every moment until there was nothing left, his mouth disappeared last, still releasing its mournful cry, which continued even after there was nothing left of him to see. 

Slowly it faded away much as his body had and it was replaced by another noise.  The beeping of several cell phones. 

---

kingfisher has been erased. Regrettably,
I must inform you that he was a Player.

Two Reapers still lurk among you.

---

---

You will all now lose consciousness for
24 hours, during which time the Reapers
hiding among you will decide to Erase one
of you.

---

As soon as the final person finished reading the message, six of them fell over.

Two remained standing.

They began to whisper.

---

kingfisher1112 has been lynched he was vanilla town

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

The game has entered the night phase, no one may post during the night phase and the thread will be locked to ensure as such.

Please submit your actions for the night if you possess any via PM to me.

The night will end in 24 hours or when I receive all actions

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Sorry about the long delay in-between lock and post, net problems.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 06, 2012, 07:43:54 pm

You open your eyes to the sight of the blue sky overhead.   The sounds of the city are still present, but they seem far off.

You push yourself to your feet and look around.   Now instead of the buildings rising above you, they sit below.  From your perch atop the highest building in the city the people are but mere specks and their voices and the sounds of the city's traffic are indistinguishable from one another, blending into an incomprehensible murmur that lazily rises up to the top of the skyscraper. 

Even the sound of your phone beeping is easily louder.

---

Mission:
The same as yesterday, two
Reapers lie amongst you,
only now there are only five
of you.

---

---

Determine who the Reapers
are and Erase them and
you win.

You have 72 hours until the
second "day" end.

---

Once again you feel a sharp pain on your hand, and the counter appears.  Then something occurs to you.

Five players?

A quick glance around and you determine that Dariush is no longer among you.  It seems that he was simply a Player who had the misfortune of catching the Reapers attention.

---

Seven people stood in a circle. Much as they had done the day before, when there were nine of them. 

All seven breathed a sigh of relief that they had survived the first day.

Two started to think of who they were going to Erase next.

---

Dariush was erased in the Night, he was a Player (Vanilla Town)!

Day 2 will end Thursday 7:30 PM CDT

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

My apologies for the late day start, I'm having net problems at the moment and had to type this on a borrowed iPad.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 06, 2012, 08:15:13 pm

borno, posting this again to start off the day. Answer it this time.

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 03, 2012, 02:14:49 am

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

dustylou2:
I was quite focused on him because he voted FBL over, what, at the time, seemed like a simple pressure vote. But when he didn't post again, I got suspicious. I voted him because he had voted someone for no reason, with no question. That on its own wouldn't of warranted a vote; but then he disappeared straight after, which looked like scum putting a vote on someone and then not bothering to take it off, even when presented with arguments why to do so.

Could you clarify this a bit? The pronouns are bamboozling me.

Deathsword: kingfisher1112 flipped town. Who are you suspicious of now?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 06, 2012, 08:44:28 pm

borno, I want a response to my questions:

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 03, 2012, 09:58:04 pm

So do you still suspect those players for the reasons you voted them?

Quote from: borno on August 03, 2012, 08:20:08 pm

He looked like the kind of scum who puts a vote on someone and then lurks the rest of the game.

What kind of scum does that?

I ask this question because I don't think I've ever seen any scum put a reasonless vote on someone and disappear completely.

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

kingfisher:
You seem to be acting incredibly scummy.

Why say he seems to be acting scummy? Why not just call him incredibly scummy? Why add all these pointless qualifiers?

I'm not satisfied that you're not bandwagoning scum, and I will make a decision about voting you pending your responses.

Boltur:

Quote from: Boltur on August 02, 2012, 04:54:58 pm

I guess scum would have the tendency to just skim over the thread because they do not need to find anything and just look like they're doing something.

That's quite the assumption about scum play. Where did this assumption come from?

Everybody: The useful part about the lynch and the nightkill is that it gives you concrete information. You should look back at Dariush's and kingfisher1112's posts with the knowledge that they are town. Just because somebody flipped town doesn't mean they were right about their suspects, but at least you know they weren't trying to be duplicitous with what they were saying.

Until Day 2 starts ramping up I recommend everyone review Day 1 with the roleflips in mind to look for leads. This is what I did.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Geen on August 06, 2012, 10:45:21 pm

I'm in!

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: borno on August 07, 2012, 12:12:26 am

Dustylou2:

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 06, 2012, 08:15:13 pm

borno, posting this again to start off the day. Answer it this time.

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 03, 2012, 02:14:49 am

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

dustylou2:
I was quite focused on him because he voted FBL over, what, at the time, seemed like a simple pressure vote. But when he didn't post again, I got suspicious. I voted him because he had voted someone for no reason, with no question. That on its own wouldn't of warranted a vote; but then he disappeared straight after, which looked like scum putting a vote on someone and then not bothering to take it off, even when presented with arguments why to do so.

Could you clarify this a bit? The pronouns are bamboozling me.

I have already, more than twice. But I guess I should, for clarity's sake.
Initially, it looked like DS voted FBL over what seemed like a pressure vote. But then it turned out not to be a pressure vote, as FBL stopped posting after that. Thus, I switched my vote to him, as it looked like he was just lurking.

Jim:

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 06, 2012, 08:44:28 pm

borno, I want a response to my questions:

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 03, 2012, 09:58:04 pm

So do you still suspect those players for the reasons you voted them?

Quote from: borno on August 03, 2012, 08:20:08 pm

He looked like the kind of scum who puts a vote on someone and then lurks the rest of the game.

What kind of scum does that?

I ask this question because I don't think I've ever seen any scum put a reasonless vote on someone and disappear completely.

Well, I just think that this is a scummy thing to do. I've never seen anyone do this though, so perhaps I'm wrong.

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 06, 2012, 08:44:28 pm

Quote from: borno on August 02, 2012, 11:02:32 pm

kingfisher:
You seem to be acting incredibly scummy.

Why say he seems to be acting scummy? Why not just call him incredibly scummy? Why add all these pointless qualifiers?

I'm not satisfied that you're not bandwagoning scum, and I will make a decision about voting you pending your responses.

I don't know, I guess just to add pressure.
Does one word really matter that much?


I'm quite tired now, I'll read through the thread later.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Tiruin on August 07, 2012, 12:16:49 am

Quote from: Geen on August 06, 2012, 10:45:21 pm

I'm in!

You're replacing Mr. Dwarfinton?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 07, 2012, 12:33:56 am

Thank you borno. Unvote.


Geen: I'll question you as soon as Phantom makes you official, but until then, welcome to the game!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 07, 2012, 02:39:44 am

Using my 'bah' Post.
First, I would like to say that this was fantastic and fun. You guys are awesome, thanks.
And I hope the town wins, naturally. I can see where I went wrong really, but ultimately I hope that the town can sucsessfully use the skills that they investigated me with to catch the scum. Thank you and goodbye.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Dariush on August 07, 2012, 03:46:12 am

Nice move, scum. And by that I mean 'WHY THE HELL DID YOU KILL AN IC ON N1?!'.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Hapah on August 07, 2012, 09:42:58 am

Will try to squeeze in a reread today.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 07, 2012, 10:21:50 am

Geen has replaced Mr. Dwarfinton

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Teneb on August 07, 2012, 10:36:24 am

I'll re-read D1 as soon as I get time today, followed by a post.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Boltur on August 07, 2012, 02:58:51 pm

Sorry for my disappearance, i just got overwhelemd with stuff i needed to do and couldn't get to posting before day ended.

Jim: Scum have no real goal except survinvg the day so i guess following the thread is less important to them. They could probably only act when directly attacked or when they found an easy vote. So being passive seems like a good thing for a scum to do, that is if it is not done to the extreme.

Rereading now. Answers for yesterday questions and some conclusions next post.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Teneb on August 07, 2012, 05:48:42 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 06, 2012, 08:15:13 pm

Deathsword: kingfisher1112 flipped town. Who are you suspicious of now?

I think it's a bit too early to ask that, as I'm stil reviewing D1.

That said, I do have some suspicions, but until I get something solid I won't go around saying names.


Should have some questions later, I'm somewhat short on time right now.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 07, 2012, 06:54:28 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 07, 2012, 05:48:42 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 06, 2012, 08:15:13 pm

Deathsword: kingfisher1112 flipped town. Who are you suspicious of now?

I think it's a bit too early to ask that, as I'm stil reviewing D1.

That said, I do have some suspicions, but until I get something solid I won't go around saying names.


Should have some questions later, I'm somewhat short on time right now.

Alright, just remember Toaster's Number One Scumtell.


Geen: Again, welcome to the thread. After reading through, does anything strike you as particularly suspicious? Why? Also, have you played any games of Mafia before?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Hapah on August 07, 2012, 07:09:37 pm

Kingfisher: I hope you'll play again!

Jim, Deathsword: How certain were you that KF was scum going into the lynch?

Geen: Welcome! Have you had a chance to read any of the past Beginner's Mafia games? The rules are pretty similar to the real-life deal, but it's an entirely different sort of game.

Dusty: Why do you think borno "jumped on the EasyLynchMobile", as you put it?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 07, 2012, 07:45:22 pm

Quote from: borno on August 07, 2012, 12:12:26 am

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 06, 2012, 08:44:28 pm

Why say he seems to be acting scummy? Why not just call him incredibly scummy? Why add all these pointless qualifiers?

I don't know, I guess just to add pressure.
Does one word really matter that much?

In the grand scheme of things, not really. But it could indicate that you're hesitant to directly call somebody scum, which is a mistake new scum players make everyone once in a while.

What are your suspicions going into Day 2 and why are you taking so long to post them?

I also wanted to know if you suspected all the players you cast votes for during Day 1 for the same reasons you claimed.

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 07, 2012, 06:54:28 pm

Alright, just remember Toaster's Number One Scumtell.

Where did you learn about Toaster's Number One Scumtell?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 07, 2012, 05:48:42 pm

That said, I do have some suspicions, but until I get something solid I won't go around saying names.

What are you waiting for?

Quote from: Hapah on August 07, 2012, 07:09:37 pm

Jim, Deathsword: How certain were you that KF was scum going into the lynch?

Pretty certain.

My reasons for the vote are what I already listed: He had an emotional reaction and played in reaction to criticisms attached to people's votes. He looked a lot like panicky noob scum to me and I was very certain of my conclusion.

But I was wrong. Oh well. It happens.

Quote from: Dariush on August 07, 2012, 03:46:12 am

Nice move, scum. And by that I mean 'WHY THE HELL DID YOU KILL AN IC ON N1?!'.

It's our lot in life to be N1 kill targets.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 07, 2012, 08:12:32 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 07, 2012, 07:09:37 pm

Dusty: Why do you think borno "jumped on the EasyLynchMobile", as you put it?

I think he jumped on it because he doesn't care who gets lynched, as long as it isn't him or his scumbuddy. He's trying to slide through the day phase without doing any actual scumhunting.

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 07, 2012, 07:45:22 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 07, 2012, 06:54:28 pm

Alright, just remember Toaster's Number One Scumtell.

Where did you learn about Toaster's Number One Scumtell?

I learned about it from a few of the games I read through from these forums. It was either one of the paranormals or a BM. Am I correct in thinking that it's promising content and failing to deliver? If I'm wrong, correct me so I don't screw it up again.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 07, 2012, 09:34:13 pm

Yeah, that's Toaster's #1 Scumtell.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 07, 2012, 11:18:58 pm

The wind blew more swiftly above the city with nothing to block it or slow it down.  Were there any conversation it would have been drowned out, but no one had said much of anything yet, most were still trying to clear their minds of yesterday's frightening image and focus their thoughts on today's problem.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {0}:
[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {0}:
[Geen] {0}: Dustylou2
[Dustylou2] {0}:
[borno] {0}:
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {6}: Jim Groovester, borno, Geen, Boltur, Deathsword, Hapah
Replacement queue {0}:

---

Day 2 will end Thursday ~7:30 PM CDT
Current extension requests: zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

The replacement queue is empty, please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Hapah on August 07, 2012, 11:32:17 pm

Jim: Fair enough

Everyone Else: MOAR ACTIVITIES

Dusty: Do you have any insight as to why the person you replaced for did the same? (jumping on the easy lynch) He voted DS with no question attached.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 08, 2012, 01:54:11 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 07, 2012, 11:32:17 pm

Dusty: Do you have any insight as to why the person you replaced for did the same? (jumping on the easy lynch) He voted DS with no question attached.

Unfortunately, I can't read minds. My earlier explanation of Fluffy's behavior still stands - that he didn't quite understand the differences between RL and forum-style mafia, and that your arguments need a logical basis to be successful.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 08, 2012, 04:02:16 am

borno, why are you lurking?

You're around the forums. Why not here?

But activity in general is pretty low. Everybody, post. Don't make me come after you. You will not like it if I have to play Mafia Truant Officer.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Dariush on August 08, 2012, 04:14:57 am

Okay, okay, I'm posting, I'm posting. Happy?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 08, 2012, 04:30:26 am

Yes.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Teneb on August 08, 2012, 09:35:24 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 07, 2012, 07:09:37 pm

Jim, Deathsword: How certain were you that KF was scum going into the lynch?

Very. He made quite a few slips and at the end he looked like desperate scum to me.

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 07, 2012, 07:45:22 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 07, 2012, 05:48:42 pm

That said, I do have some suspicions, but until I get something solid I won't go around saying names.

What are you waiting for?

I like to back up my suspicions with either evidence or questions. You'll find both below.

Boltur: While examing D1, I've noticed a certain lack of scumhunting from you. When it comes to KF, all you did was ask him a weak question, and then accuse him when he failed to answer the question. You also called him out on his question after his rather angry answer, in which he asked two of the players attacking him (Hapah and myself) whom they though was scum.  Yet you asked something very similar not long before. You asked Mr Dwarfinton (your RVS vote) and myself (at the time with the greatest number of votes) what we thought of each other, and this question was asked after RVS ended. Were you trying to play us against each other? Maybe you were trying to look like you were scumhunting, when all you did was throw an RVS vote on Mr D and then jump on KF when he didn't answer a question. What do you have to say about your actions? After all, you claim that scum would go for an easy vote with a weak reason, and that is exactly what you did.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: blackmagechill on August 08, 2012, 11:13:46 am

Can I grab that replacement spot?
EDIT: Welp, missed geen's entry. I'll just wait for the next game I guess.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 07, 2012, 05:48:42 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 06, 2012, 08:15:13 pm

Deathsword: kingfisher1112 flipped town. Who are you suspicious of now?

That said, I do have some suspicions, but until I get something solid I won't go around saying names.

Why you prefer not to reveal them if you have any ?

Borno: What do you learned from kingfisher death ?

Doustylou: Do you think we should try to gather information from night kill targets ? To what extent ?

Deathsword: What's "certain lack" ? I scumhunted or not ? Be more precise. Yes, my initial questions to kingfisher were not very content-heavy but his dodgy behavior was damning enough in my eyes to push harder. His answer was tailored to make us think he's town and while it was just mistake on his part as know now i interpreted it as scum defense. Not sure why you point it out. These questions i asked you and mr.D were to force the interaction between you two as i noticed you could be avoiding questioning each other which could indicate you are scumbuddies. Later i come to conclusion that looking for scum-teams before finding one scum is pretty useless so i gave up on that line of questioning. And there's nothing wrong with throwing a RVS vote and following by real one to me. You say my reasons for voting kingfisher were weak but what you made basis for a (i think) real vote is pretty weak itself. You completely disregard kingfisher's aggressive and nervous reaction which was the big thing back then. I admit that i got a bit too much focused only on the kingfisher yesterday and that's something i should avoid in future.

Hapah: Don't you think asking replacement for a reason of his predecessor actions is a bit futile ? Why not ?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 08, 2012, 03:31:21 pm

Deathsword: You said suspicions. Who else is suspicious?


Geen: Where are you? I still want my questions answered, and my vote is staying on you until they are.

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Doustylou: Do you think we should try to gather information from night kill targets ? To what extent ?

Absolutely not. There's no way to know the motives of the scum or the way they choose their targets. Did they use Random.org? Kill Dariush to get him off their backs? Kill him because he was on someone else's back, in an attempt to incriminate them? We can't know. Questions like this are classic WIFOM. Why are you trying to confuse us, Boltur?

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 08, 2012, 04:12:02 pm

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Doustylou: Do you think we should try to gather information from night kill targets ? To what extent ?

Gathering leads from the nightkill is pointless. You don't know what motives the scum had when they killed the target so guessing who performed it from that is impossible.

E.G., maybe Dariush was killed because he was onto someone. Maybe Dariush was killed because the scum want everyone to think that the person he was onto is scum. Or maybe it was because he's an IC.

You can't really know.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Hapah on August 08, 2012, 04:45:03 pm

Dusty: Thanks!

Boltur: Futile might be the wrong word, but I'll agree the question wasn't fair. He could have easily deflected it (he didn't) or attacked me for it (he didn't).

DS: Thanks!

Geem: Get in here!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Teneb on August 08, 2012, 05:09:33 pm

A more detailed response to Boltur will come later today, since my time is currently short, but to answer these two:

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 08, 2012, 03:31:21 pm

Deathsword: You said suspicions. Who else is suspicious?

At the time I was suspicious of more than one person. Boltur and Mr D. However with Mr D dropping out, I still have to get a "read", so to speak, on his replacement.

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 07, 2012, 05:48:42 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 06, 2012, 08:15:13 pm

Deathsword: kingfisher1112 flipped town. Who are you suspicious of now?

That said, I do have some suspicions, but until I get something solid I won't go around saying names.

Why you prefer not to reveal them if you have any ?

I did reveal them. It's you. Try to pay attention.


As I said above, a more detailed post will be coming later today, as long as my internet doesn't stop for no reason again.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Hapah on August 08, 2012, 09:07:47 pm

Extend.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 08, 2012, 10:50:52 pm

Remember what I said about how low activity kills games?

Get to posting people.

And borno, lurk more. Lurk lurk lurk lurk. Lurky lurkface.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: borno on August 08, 2012, 11:29:11 pm

Sorry for not posting, guys.

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Borno: What do you learned from kingfisher death ?

I learned that kingfisher was town, so now we have to see who may of acted to his downfall. However, almost all of us actively pursed him, so it is hard to gain much information.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2 [Replacements Needed!]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 08, 2012, 11:44:30 pm

Lurk lurk lurk.

What's this? A post?

It has no scumhunting so it doesn't count.

Lurk lurk lurk.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 09, 2012, 12:15:58 am

No one was sure what to say, so silence continued to grip the gathering atop the building.  Eventually a beeping broke the silence.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {1}: Boltur
[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {1}: Deathsword
[Geen] {1}: Dustylou2
[Dustylou2] {0}:
[borno] {1}: Jim Groovester
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {3}: Geen, Hapah, borno
Replacement queue {1}: blackmagechill

19:30 hours remain.

---

Day 2 will end Thursday ~7:30 PM CDT
Current extension requests: One. Three requests needed to extend the day.

We have someone in the replacement queue now, but we could always use more! Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)


Geen has been prodded.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 09, 2012, 11:44:49 am

Extend please, folks. We're sitting around on our collective asses.

borno: Jim's got a point, there isn't much to that post (not that mine have been masterpieces of scumhunting either, lately)

DS: Do you still think Boltur is scum? Your vote is still there, and I think he did a reasonably good job of explaining why he did what he did.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 09, 2012, 11:49:18 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 09, 2012, 11:44:49 am

DS: Do you still think Boltur is scum? Your vote is still there, and I think he did a reasonably good job of explaining why he did what he did.

Yes. I said I'd give a more detailed answer to it, but a combination of my internet failing causing me to lose my posts and me raging from said post losts have prevented me from doing that. I'll try again in a few hours when I am calmer, and, hopefuly, the internet more stable.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Dariush on August 09, 2012, 11:58:59 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 09, 2012, 11:49:18 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 09, 2012, 11:44:49 am

DS: Do you still think Boltur is scum? Your vote is still there, and I think he did a reasonably good job of explaining why he did what he did.

Yes. I said I'd give a more detailed answer to it, but a combination of my internet failing causing me to lose my posts and me raging from said post losts have prevented me from doing that. I'll try again in a few hours when I am calmer, and, hopefuly, the internet more stable.

Lazarus (https://addons.mozilla.org/En-us/firefox/addon/lazarus-form-recovery/), padawan. Use it.

If you use Firefox, that is. Otherwise you deserve everything you get and then a bit more.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 09, 2012, 12:12:47 pm

Quote from: Dariush on August 09, 2012, 11:58:59 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 09, 2012, 11:49:18 am

Quote from: Hapah on August 09, 2012, 11:44:49 am

DS: Do you still think Boltur is scum? Your vote is still there, and I think he did a reasonably good job of explaining why he did what he did.

Yes. I said I'd give a more detailed answer to it, but a combination of my internet failing causing me to lose my posts and me raging from said post losts have prevented me from doing that. I'll try again in a few hours when I am calmer, and, hopefuly, the internet more stable.

Lazarus (https://addons.mozilla.org/En-us/firefox/addon/lazarus-form-recovery/), padawan. Use it.

If you use Firefox, that is. Otherwise you deserve everything you get and then a bit more.

I do use Firefox, so thanks for linking to that.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 09, 2012, 03:30:52 pm

Extend because you're all lurking and that's not the way to play the game.

So how may times do I have to say it before you get your asses in gear?

Get to work, goddammit.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 09, 2012, 04:47:58 pm

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Deathsword: What's "certain lack" ? I scumhunted or not ? Be more precise. Yes, my initial questions to kingfisher were not very content-heavy but his dodgy behavior was damning enough in my eyes to push harder.

I'll be more blunt. I think you didn't scum-hunted at all. You say his dodgy behaivour was damning enough to push harder, yet you didn't push him aside from pointing out he did not answer that one question you asked.

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

And there's nothing wrong with throwing a RVS vote and following by real one to me.

There is if you provide no reasons as to why you are keeping the vote on the individual.

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

You say my reasons for voting kingfisher were weak but what you made basis for a (i think) real vote is pretty weak itself.

Okay, I'm confused here: are you saying my reasons for voting for you or KF are weak?

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

You completely disregard kingfisher's aggressive and nervous reaction which was the big thing back then.

I did not disregard that. In fact, that was what made me turn my attacks fully towards him in the first place. I do not know why you are saying that.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 09, 2012, 04:49:31 pm

Extend. Barely anything has been said today. It's a shame to let a game die from inactivity, especially one with such good flavor.


Geen hasn't been active for 2 days, so he's probably going to need to be replaced. Unvote.


Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 08, 2012, 05:09:33 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 08, 2012, 03:31:21 pm

Deathsword: You said suspicions. Who else is suspicious?

At the time I was suspicious of more than one person. Boltur and Mr D. However with Mr D dropping out, I still have to get a "read", so to speak, on his replacement.

Why exactly were you suspicious of Mr. D? Looking back through the thread, you've barely even spoken to him, and LurkerTracker says that you've never even FoSed him, let alone vote him.


Hapah: Who are you currently suspicious of?


borno, Boltur: Why haven't you been posting?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 09, 2012, 06:55:15 pm

The hours stretched onwards, seemingly endlessly, only occasionally broken by a muttered word.
Then the message came.  Is it possible for a beep to sound angry? 

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {1}: Boltur
[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {1}: Deathsword
[Geen] {0}:
[Dustylou2] {0}:
[borno] {1}: Jim Groovester
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {4}: Geen, Hapah, borno, Dustylou2
Replacement queue {1}: blackmagechill

I have not seen sufficient bickering yet today, so
I am giving you another 48 hours

67:30 hours remain.

Please do try to be more active, we wouldn't
want this to be a boring Game now would we?

---

Day 2 will end Monday ~7:30 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

We have someone in the replacement queue now, but we could always use more! Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)


A PM has been sent to blackmagechill, if he responds before Geen then he will replace in.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 09, 2012, 08:27:20 pm

Responded! Sorry, got a bit caught up in life, but it'll be fine from now on.
Hmm, not quite sure who to suspect... Must look at text harder!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: blackmagechill on August 10, 2012, 12:27:06 am

.... What the hell? Has everybody just decided that they're okay with whatever's happening and are going to roll with it?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 12:39:40 am

Dusty: Almost missed that! Currently, Deathsword. The net eating his post I can definitely believe, but the fact that he didn't go for the Extend when he admitted that his said his post explaining why he thought Boltur was still suspect. He did post again, but both failed to outline his case on Boltur and failed to push for the Extend. No smoking gun, but it's something. (I haven't had a chance to look into your claim concerning DS yet)

Geen: Step it up!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Boltur on August 10, 2012, 08:50:13 am

Sorry for the delay.

Quote from: Hapah on August 08, 2012, 04:45:03 pm

Boltur: Futile might be the wrong word, but I'll agree the question wasn't fair. He could have easily deflected it (he didn't) or attacked me for it (he didn't).

Alright, seems reasonable. Unvote

Dustylou&Jim about NK's: I asked that question to see if maybe there's something that i could have learned from NK as i couldn't find anything useful myself. You're probably right that it would bring more speculation than real information.I have not realized that it is something that should be avoided so thanks for that.

Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 08, 2012, 05:09:33 pm

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 07, 2012, 05:48:42 pm

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 06, 2012, 08:15:13 pm

Deathsword: kingfisher1112 flipped town. Who are you suspicious of now?

That said, I do have some suspicions, but until I get something solid I won't go around saying names.

Why you prefer not to reveal them if you have any ?

I did reveal them. It's you. Try to pay attention.

Stop lying. You revealed them after that. Why only promise if you could deliver your suspicions back then ?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 09, 2012, 04:47:58 pm

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Deathsword: What's "certain lack" ? I scumhunted or not ? Be more precise. Yes, my initial questions to kingfisher were not very content-heavy but his dodgy behavior was damning enough in my eyes to push harder.

I'll be more blunt. I think you didn't scum-hunted at all. You say his dodgy behaivour was damning enough to push harder, yet you didn't push him aside from pointing out he did not answer that one question you asked.

I disagree, i forced him to react and i believe what happened next wouldn't take place if i had not attacked him. His responses only reinforced my opinion and if questions asked by others wouldn't be enough and i have been able to post back then i would continue. I know that being absent is no excuse but

Quote

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

And there's nothing wrong with throwing a RVS vote and following by real one to me.

There is if you provide no reasons as to why you are keeping the vote on the individual.

Check post #153 for things i think were most damning aside from what Jim said few post before that about him asking questions when forced to do so. I felt no need to repeat that after him.

Quote

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

You say my reasons for voting kingfisher were weak but what you made basis for a (i think) real vote is pretty weak itself.

Okay, I'm confused here: are you saying my reasons for voting for you or KF are weak?

Yes. Seriously though i meant that i'm not seeing why are you voting me. Because i asked that double question ? Or because i have not scumhunted despite the fact that  kingfisher would not have lashed out in #138 if i did not attacked him. Or what ?

Quote

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

You completely disregard kingfisher's aggressive and nervous reaction which was the big thing back then.

I did not disregard that. In fact, that was what made me turn my attacks fully towards him in the first place. I do not know why you are saying that.

That's because i have no idea what were are you trying to accuse me of. So i tried to explain what i did yesterday.

This feels pretty hollow because i still have no idea why the hell are you voting me Deathsword. Make it clearer.

Borno: Are you content with current votes ? State your suspicions.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 10, 2012, 10:43:16 am

Small post because I am low on time. More comming later.

Quote from: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 12:39:40 am

Dusty: Almost missed that! Currently, Deathsword. The net eating his post I can definitely believe, but the fact that he didn't go for the Extend when he admitted that his said his post explaining why he thought Boltur was still suspect. He did post again, but both failed to outline his case on Boltur and failed to push for the Extend. No smoking gun, but it's something. (I haven't had a chance to look into your claim concerning DS yet)

Hapah, I didn't ask for an extend because there were already enough votes for an extend. It just wasn't necessary. How not asking for an extend when there are enough votes already is scummy?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 10:56:48 am

Two out of seven isn't enough for an Extend, and at the time of your first post it was only me pushing for the Extend. We didn't get the required three until Dusty AND Jim both voted for the Extend, Dusty's post coming after yours.

So there weren't enough votes, and you didn't vote for the Extend.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 10, 2012, 01:17:37 pm

Hmm... I agree, Deathsword feels a bit scummy to me...

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 01:20:11 pm

Geen: Why?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 10, 2012, 03:59:57 pm

May I suggest voting for borno for flagrant lurking, seeing as how he's playing RTD games instead of scumhunting like he fucking should be.

Quote from: Geen on August 10, 2012, 01:17:37 pm

Hmm... I agree, Deathsword feels a bit scummy to me...

Better work harder than that.

Passive observation is not scumhunting.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 04:13:19 pm

Maybe we can see if borno wants to sub out and let BMC in?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 10, 2012, 04:43:10 pm

Silence. 

Deafening silence.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {0}:
[Deathsword] {1}: Hapah
[Boltur] {1}: Deathsword
[Geen] {0}:
[Dustylou2] {0}:
[borno] {1}: Jim Groovester
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {4}: Geen, Boltur, borno, Dustylou2
Replacement queue {1}: blackmagechill

67:30 hours remain.

---

Day 2 will end Monday ~7:30 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

We have someone in the replacement queue now, but we could always use more! Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Is there a request for a prod on borno?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 04:47:22 pm

Prod him really hard. In the face. With a brick.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 10, 2012, 04:47:34 pm

Yes, prod that motherfucker.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 10, 2012, 04:51:39 pm

A cattle prod has been applied to borno

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 10, 2012, 04:55:26 pm

Geen: I still have questions I need you to answer. (Reply 195) Please give actual detail and reasoning.


I still need an answer from you too, Deathsword.


I don't think it needs to be said even more, but yes, Prod borno. So much. Mod-ninja'd.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 10, 2012, 06:07:31 pm

Dustylou2: I am going to assume the following question is the one I missed.

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 09, 2012, 04:49:31 pm

Why exactly were you suspicious of Mr. D? Looking back through the thread, you've barely even spoken to him, and LurkerTracker says that you've never even FoSed him, let alone vote him.

During D1, and while looking through it after N1, it seemd to me as if Mr D was buddying up with KF by trying to defend him from Boltur's demands to answer his question. Then he was replaced by Geen, who is now just sitting there doing nothing.

Also, stop just asking people whom they are suspicious of and hunt. In fact, who are you suspicious of? Why? And why are you being so passive?

Boltur:

Quote from: Boltur on August 10, 2012, 08:50:13 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 08, 2012, 05:09:33 pm

-quote pyramid-

Stop lying. You revealed them after that. Why only promise if you could deliver your suspicions back then ?

Tell me, where did I lie? I said I'd like my suspicions with questions and a vote. I voted and questioned you. Then you asked whom I was suspicious of, at which point I pointed out that I had just said I suspected (and still do) you. How is that a lie?

Quote from: Boltur on August 10, 2012, 08:50:13 am

I disagree, i forced him to react and i believe what happened next wouldn't take place if i had not attacked him. His responses only reinforced my opinion and if questions asked by others wouldn't be enough and i have been able to post back then i would continue.

While it was your demanding him to answer your question that caused him to panick, it doesn't excuse you from just sitting back and let other people pressure him for you.

Quote from: Boltur on August 10, 2012, 08:50:13 am

Yes. Seriously though i meant that i'm not seeing why are you voting me. Because i asked that double question ? Or because i have not scumhunted despite the fact that  kingfisher would not have lashed out in #138 if i did not attacked him. Or what ?

Just because he lashed at out at one question from you, doesn't mean you scumhunted. One question, and then prodding someone to anwer a question, doesn't equal scum-hunting. I am voting because I think you are scum that is trying to go unnoticed by asking as few questions as you can without exposing yourself. I believe I made my reasons for voting and suspecting you quite clear.

Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 10:56:48 am

Two out of seven isn't enough for an Extend, and at the time of your first post it was only me pushing for the Extend. We didn't get the required three until Dusty AND Jim both voted for the Extend, Dusty's post coming after yours.

So there weren't enough votes, and you didn't vote for the Extend.

There were still more than 18 hours left then, which, in my opinion, meant that there was enough time to decide if an extend would be actually needed or not.

It does, however, look like I misread that page. Your extend vote was indeed the first.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 10, 2012, 07:37:04 pm

It feels like he's trying to push us to kill each other to me.

Kay, I'll answer da questions, gimme a few minutes.
Ya, I have played mafia, first time IRL was when I was around 5, and it was called Werewolves but it was the same thing.

EDIT: Either that or he seems to want Boltur dead for suspecting him.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Shakerag on August 10, 2012, 08:05:29 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 10, 2012, 07:37:04 pm

It feels like he's trying to push us to kill each other to me.

Kay, I'll answer da questions, gimme a few minutes.
Ya, I have played mafia, first time IRL was when I was around 5, and it was called Werewolves but it was the same thing.

EDIT: Either that or he seems to want Boltur dead for suspecting him.

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on July 25, 2012, 11:18:10 am

Edits - Editing posts is prohibited. Do not edit your post for any reason, even if your post comes out as a trainwreck of formatting, spelling, punctuation, and/or grammar. The preview button exists; use it.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 10, 2012, 09:00:11 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 10, 2012, 07:37:04 pm

It feels like he's trying to push us to kill each other to me.

This is mafia, not a cuddlezone.

You can't win if you don't kill people. Wanting people dead is the norm.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 10, 2012, 09:50:31 pm

True. Hmm, any arguments for who to vote against?
Oh god, sorry! I was trying to avoid a doublepost.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 10, 2012, 10:27:35 pm

You can read the thread and peruse the arguments that players have made against each other. If you find one that is agreeable to you, you can vote with that player.

Or you can employ the vastly more preferable option of making an argument for yourself.

Nobody's going to spoonfeed you scumhunting and people will suspect you if you expect that to happen.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 10, 2012, 10:44:02 pm

Geen: I want you to read the rules which are found in this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3475143#msg3475143) post. 

A good number of mods would have had you mod-killed for editing your post in-game. This is a BM, so I'm going to be lenient and let you off with a warning, but you should read the entire OP before you do anything else.  Forum mafia is very different from RL mafia, the core concept is the same, but the execution is very different. 

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 11, 2012, 01:18:40 am

Shitshitshit sorry, was half-asleep, have had lots of caffeine now and actually have rules stored in brain.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: borno on August 11, 2012, 01:42:16 am

Sorry, I've had a friend over, and couldn't post while he was here.

Boltur:
You accuse DS of lying, but don't do anything about it? Usually lying is a pretty big scumtell. And instead of pushing him really hard on why he is voting for you, you politely ask why. It's as if you're afraid to draw attention to yourself.

Quote from: Boltur on August 10, 2012, 08:50:13 am

Borno: Are you content with current votes ? State your suspicions.

I am currently suspicious of you.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 11, 2012, 12:44:07 pm

Quote from: borno on August 11, 2012, 01:42:16 am

Sorry, I've had a friend over, and couldn't post while he was here.

Boltur:
You accuse DS of lying, but don't do anything about it? Usually lying is a pretty big scumtell. And instead of pushing him really hard on why he is voting for you, you politely ask why. It's as if you're afraid to draw attention to yourself.

Quote from: Boltur on August 10, 2012, 08:50:13 am

Borno: Are you content with current votes ? State your suspicions.

I am currently suspicious of you.

Wait, what if it's a set up to make them look like they're town but not actually kill each other and both are reapers? CONSPIRACY THEORY GO.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 11, 2012, 02:21:03 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 11, 2012, 12:44:07 pm

Wait, what if it's a set up to make them look like they're town but not actually kill each other and both are reapers? CONSPIRACY THEORY GO.

Geen, that is WIFOM. Also, try to take the game more seriously.

Quote from: Geen on August 10, 2012, 07:37:04 pm

Kay, I'll answer da questions, gimme a few minutes.

And the answers, where are they?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 11, 2012, 08:17:49 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 11, 2012, 12:44:07 pm

Wait, what if it's a set up to make them look like they're town but not actually kill each other and both are reapers? CONSPIRACY THEORY GO.

Or, what if their argument is genuine? BETCHA DIDN'T THINK OF THAT.

Have you even bothered to read the rest of the thread yet? You need to get on that. Like right now.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Dustylou2 on August 12, 2012, 03:12:25 am

Unfortunately, I don't have enough time to do mafia games any justice, due to RL circumstances. As such, Unvote and Request Replacement. This game has been really fun, and I'm sorry I have to do this. Hopefully I'll be able to play again, once RL sorts itself out.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 12, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Could I join the replacement line? I know I can't replace Dustylou2 because BMG is first, but otherwise, it would be great to have it.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 12, 2012, 08:09:16 pm

Silence. 

Deafening silence.

Stretching on, but near the end it seemed.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {0}:
[Deathsword] {1}: Hapah
[Boltur] {2}: Deathsword, Borno
[Geen] {0}:
[Dustylou2] {0}:
[borno] {1}: Jim Groovester
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {4}: Geen, Boltur, Dustylou2
Replacement queue {1}: blackmagechill, wsoxfan

23:30 hours remain.

---

Day 2 will end Monday ~7:30 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

We have someone in the replacement queue now, but we could always use more! Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Quote from: wsoxfan on August 12, 2012, 02:32:34 pm

Could I join the replacement line? I know I can't replace Dustylou2 because BMG is first, but otherwise, it would be great to have it.

Yep, you can never have enough replacements!

I have sent a PM to BMC, who will replace in for Dustylou2 unless he does not respond in twenty-four hours, in which case wsoxfan will get his place.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: blackmagechill on August 12, 2012, 11:26:52 pm

This has been a pretty lurky game so far. We need some more activity, everybody!

Geen: After flipping through the whole day, who do you think looks the scummiest, or at least the person who's jumping pretty hard on bandwagons? And where are those answers you promised? Toaster's number one right here.

borno: And what's scummy about Boltur? Telling somebody they're scummy does exactly fuck all if you don't have reasoning behind it.


Jim:Who's been doing the best scumhunting so far?

Hapah: What was your read on Dusty before he dropped out?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 12, 2012, 11:59:42 pm

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 12, 2012, 11:26:52 pm

Jim:Who's been doing the best scumhunting so far?

What's my opinion about who's doing well going to tell you about who's scum?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 13, 2012, 07:18:18 am

Come on, you lazy fuckers.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Tiruin on August 13, 2012, 07:29:19 am

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 13, 2012, 07:18:18 am

Come on, you lazy fuckers.

Translation:

Come on and post you newbies! You won't learn by keeping quiet!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 13, 2012, 08:42:10 am

I'm waiting for an answer from both Boltur and Geen, that are shamelessly lurking.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 08:42:19 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 10, 2012, 06:07:31 pm

Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 10:56:48 am

Two out of seven isn't enough for an Extend, and at the time of your first post it was only me pushing for the Extend. We didn't get the required three until Dusty AND Jim both voted for the Extend, Dusty's post coming after yours.

So there weren't enough votes, and you didn't vote for the Extend.

There were still more than 18 hours left then, which, in my opinion, meant that there was enough time to decide if an extend would be actually needed or not.

It does, however, look like I misread that page. Your extend vote was indeed the first.

But there weren't 18 more hours to go. At the time you said you'd post later, there were ~8 to go. When you did make a post directed at Boltur, there were somewhere in the neighborhood of 3 hours left.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 12:03:00 pm

Geen: You finished a reread yet?

BMC: I thought he was towny. If nothing else, he seemed to be pretty sharp for being new.

Boltur: Where are you at? Are you just going to let BMC and DS do you in like that?

I'm at work, and I'd really like some soul-crushing depression to get me through the day. Could someone fire up Lurkertracker and list the time since last post?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Dariush on August 13, 2012, 01:40:41 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 12:03:00 pm

I'm at work, and I'd really like some soul-crushing depression to get me through the day.

Huge oil companies are preventing ecology-friendly energy sources from taking off.

Actually, I hoped to drop by with advice from time to time, but with those amounts of lurking that proves to be pretty impossible. :(

Seriously, guys, you've got a problem if a dead guy posts more than you.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Boltur on August 13, 2012, 02:26:40 pm

Alright what i did is inexcusable but i'll try my best to not leave it like that.So let's get this thread going alright ?

And meanwhile : Borno because it's pretty obvious that you have no idea what are you trying to do.
Twenty minutes and i'm posting something with content for deathsword's accusations and more detailed case on borno.

Not sure if it's good idea or not but: Extend.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Boltur on August 13, 2012, 02:45:03 pm

Double post but whatever.

Deathsword:

Quote

Tell me, where did I lie? I said I'd like my suspicions with questions and a vote. I voted and questioned you. Then you asked whom I was suspicious of, at which point I pointed out that I had just said I suspected (and still do) you. How is that a lie?

First of all you in #194 you said you already have suspicions and until you get anything solid you won't say anything. Between this post and the post in which you voted me (#206)
i did not post so it's fair to assume you had no new data about me. So you could get it going back then. Why you didn't ? Why you waited for someone ? Also how you voting me and asking one question is questioning and me doing it yesterday with kingfisher is not ?

Quote

While it was your demanding him to answer your question that caused him to panick, it doesn't excuse you from just sitting back and let other people pressure him for you.

This i can't argue with. I fucked up hard then and again now. I'm not sure if mafia is just too demanding for me but i'll try to fix it.

Quote

Just because he lashed at out at one question from you, doesn't mean you scumhunted. One question, and then prodding someone to anwer a question, doesn't equal scum-hunting. I am voting because I think you are scum that is trying to go unnoticed by asking as few questions as you can without exposing yourself. I believe I made my reasons for voting and suspecting you quite clear.

Look above, why are you having double standards on scumhunting ? And if that's the main reason you vote me, why me over few other who were pretty passive D1 ?

Quote from: borno on August 11, 2012, 01:42:16 am

Boltur:
You accuse DS of lying, but don't do anything about it? Usually lying is a pretty big scumtell. And instead of pushing him really hard on why he is voting for you, you politely ask why. It's as if you're afraid to draw attention to yourself.

Quote from: Boltur on August 10, 2012, 08:50:13 am

Borno: Are you content with current votes ? State your suspicions.

I am currently suspicious of you.

You ask why i do not vote Deathsword ? It's pretty simple : he played good D1 and i believe he is just too much concerned in finding evidence that supports his theory instead of finding theory that fits the evidence. You on the other hand just jumped on the first vote you saw with what reason ? Because i'm not attacking deathsword. Why should i do it ? Are you suspecting him ? Why pushing back would be less striking ? And why you dodged my first question ? Are you content with current votes or not ?


Geen: Get your game together and tell us who you think is scum.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 13, 2012, 05:23:40 pm

Boltur:

Quote from: Boltur on August 13, 2012, 02:45:03 pm

Deathsword:

Quote

Tell me, where did I lie? I said I'd like my suspicions with questions and a vote. I voted and questioned you. Then you asked whom I was suspicious of, at which point I pointed out that I had just said I suspected (and still do) you. How is that a lie?

First of all you in #194 you said you already have suspicions and until you get anything solid you won't say anything. Between this post and the post in which you voted me (#206)
i did not post so it's fair to assume you had no new data about me. So you could get it going back then. Why you didn't ? Why you waited for someone ? Also how you voting me and asking one question is questioning and me doing it yesterday with kingfisher is not ?

I still do not agree with this. I said I'd state my suspicions when I had a question formulated. I then voted and asked you a question while saying I was suspicious of you. How is that waiting for anyone?

It's not the same thing because I didn't just ask one question and sat back.


I will, however, re-analize the whole game so far to see if I missed something. So, extend. Vote stays until I'm done.


Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 08:42:19 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 10, 2012, 06:07:31 pm

Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 10:56:48 am

Two out of seven isn't enough for an Extend, and at the time of your first post it was only me pushing for the Extend. We didn't get the required three until Dusty AND Jim both voted for the Extend, Dusty's post coming after yours.

So there weren't enough votes, and you didn't vote for the Extend.

There were still more than 18 hours left then, which, in my opinion, meant that there was enough time to decide if an extend would be actually needed or not.

It does, however, look like I misread that page. Your extend vote was indeed the first.

But there weren't 18 more hours to go. At the time you said you'd post later, there were ~8 to go. When you did make a post directed at Boltur, there were somewhere in the neighborhood of 3 hours left.

I was talking about when you first asked for an extend, which was when I made the decision to wait until I could decide wheter or not to extend. However, would you care to explain to me why asking or not for an extension makes one scummy? Are you using that simply so you can have something to vote me with?

Most of the others: Lurk some more.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 05:30:17 pm

PPE: I'm not really a fan of an extend unless someone has some pretty convincing arguments. I won't oppose it if you lot want one, but we've had a week with damn near nothing to show for it.

Boltur: Nothing wrong with a double post! But you did tie the vote, y'know.

So you think Deathsword is just misguided or barking up the wrong tree, but borno is genuinely scummy? Do I have that right? I ask because my reads were reversed, with DS being scummy and borno being misguided.

Deathsword: So you're waiting for answers from two people. What about the other four?

PPE: If you're going to put together an argument, do you really expect that everyone will be able to get on the forums, read it, digest it, and weigh in? In three hours, between this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3514222#msg3514222) post and end of day? It makes me think that you're less interested in trying to get people to see your point of view {vote was a tie at the time, wouldn't even have been a lynch} and more interested in posting for the sake of posting. And now you want an extend, when it's your neck on the line. Funny how that works.

Geen: Is this kind of Mafia still what you're used to? Are you glad you got into the beginner's game?

borno: Would you think Boltur was towny if he had been more hostile/angry when he claimed DS was lying?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 05:33:50 pm

Oh, I almost forgot! I'll be back to break a tie before day ends, if need be.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 13, 2012, 05:43:00 pm

Quickpost:

Hapah: My neck on the line? In case you haven't noticed, you are the only one voting for me. Are you trying to convince Boltur that your point of view is right by asking that question? If you think I am scum, where is your evidence? Because my vote on Boltur before the day was extended would have only resulted into a tie, not in a lynch. If I wanted a quick lynch, all I needed to do was to find some "reason" to vote for someone that was already being voted for. So, if you are so sure I am scum, go and question me some more, instead of just hitting the same "you didn't ask for extend!" button over and over again.

Oh, and why did you completly ignore Geen's crazed WIFOM, instead choosing to ask him softer questions? Trying to buddy up to him, scumbag?

Regarding your latest post that popped up as I was posting this: You are eager to lynch someone, aren't you?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 06:37:37 pm

Deathsword: Yeah, your neck on the line. At least someone is voting you now. Nobody has any evidence because nobody has done a goddamn thing. If Lurking was an Olympic event, this thread would take the gold.

Ties are good for scum! And I'll quit hitting the "You didn't extend!" button when you quit hitting the "You didn't scumhunt!" button.

And Geen is noob as hell, we both know it. There's no way he's scum.

And yeah, I am interested in lynching someone. Aren't you? I'll even take a probable mislynch if I have to, but I'm not letting this go to a no-lynch.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 07:03:00 pm

borno, because any lynch is better than no lynch. Would still prefer DS. I'll try to be back.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 13, 2012, 07:07:52 pm

The end drew near.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {0}:
[Deathsword] {1}: Hapah
[Boltur] {2}: Deathsword, borno
[Geen] {0}:
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[borno] {3}: Jim Groovester, boltur, Hapah
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {4}: Geen, blackmagechill
Replacement queue {1}:  wsoxfan

3:00 hours remain.

---

Day 2 will end Monday ~7:30 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Two. Three requests needed to extend the day.

We have someone in the replacement queue now, but we could always use more! Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

I've mod-extended the day by two and a half hours as I won't be able to write anything until then.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 13, 2012, 07:44:32 pm

I vote borno. Just re-read the whole thread, my scumdar is tingling. Seems a bit paranoid about accusations, I suspect scum.

RE: Question: Yeah, it's a bit different from what I'm used to, a bit harder because there's no facial expression or tell in text, but I think I can handle it. I guess I've been a bit lurky with my observation.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 13, 2012, 08:00:20 pm

Hapah: So, let me get this straight: First you say borno is misguided town, and now you vote him? Way to be scum.

Also, I won't stop calling people out on not scum-hunting because that is the only way to reliably catch scum, instead of just sitting there being passive and doing hipocrytical votes. Like you just did, right now.

You also say you'd love to lynch me, yet you made no real effort to. You are instead going for the easylynch, made even easier by Geen gleefuly jumping on without even caring to give a half-decent justification.

Speaking of Geen, how can you be so sure he isn't noobscum if he hasn't even answered your questions. Being a complete noob doesn't exclude one from being scum.

And no lynch can be better for the town than a near-confirmed mislynch. You are way too eager to lynch people. Even in the last BM you kept claiming that Mislynch > No Lynch.

Geen: Do you mind giving actual reasons on your vote on borno? And you mind answering all the questions asked at you?

BMC: Seriously, one post in the whole day? I know you replaced Dusty quite late in the day, but still.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 08:13:52 pm

I was going for a lynch. I don't think Boltur is scum, and there was only one other person with 2 votes. I'm not really convinced that borno is scum instead of misguided, but we need to lynch.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: blackmagechill on August 13, 2012, 10:05:50 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 08:13:52 pm

I was going for a lynch. I don't think Boltur is scum, and there was only one other person with 2 votes. I'm not really convinced that borno is scum instead of misguided, but we need to lynch.

You aren't supposed to aim for a lunch you're supposed to aim for a scum lynch. You're awfully eager to switch your vote to the bandwagon instead of the supposedly ever so scummy death sword. I feel like borno is resting on some pretty shitty and in some cases entirely hidden arguments, sure, but I'd like to know what he has to say to defend himself.
extend[\b]. This was a late PFP, so I'd like to get a better look at this tomorrow.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 13, 2012, 10:20:01 pm

The timers slowly counted downwards. Then, just as they were about to reach zero, the first two digits jumped up to forty eight.

The message came seconds later.

---

I am very disappointed in you,
what kind of Game is it if the
Players lose their nerve and
don't play?

I'm going to give you another
48 hours.

And you'd better use it.

---

The day has been extended until Wednesday, ~10 PM CDT.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 13, 2012, 10:42:52 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on August 13, 2012, 10:20:01 pm

I'm going to give you another
48 hours.

Blugh. Thanks, BMC.

Quote from: Geen on August 13, 2012, 07:44:32 pm

I vote borno. Just re-read the whole thread, my scumdar is tingling. Seems a bit paranoid about accusations, I suspect scum.

RE: Question: Yeah, it's a bit different from what I'm used to, a bit harder because there's no facial expression or tell in text, but I think I can handle it. I guess I've been a bit lurky with my observation.

Part of me telling you to reread the thread is that you should pick up on the sort of scumhunting that passes for par. I.E., somewhat lengthy, detailed posts.

Your count total for somewhat lengthy, detailed posts: 0.

You can start with your reasons for your vote. And make them good. And you might make an effort to ask some people some questions instead of spending your time answering them.

Quote from: Hapah on August 13, 2012, 06:37:37 pm

And Geen is noob as hell, we both know it. There's no way he's scum.

Experience has taught me otherwise.

Why say this? He can be nooby as hell and scum. To outright exclude the possibility that he's scum based on his noobishness is naive at best, scummy at worst.

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 13, 2012, 10:05:50 pm

You aren't supposed to aim for a lunch you're supposed to aim for a scum lynch. You're awfully eager to switch your vote to the bandwagon instead of the supposedly ever so scummy death sword. I feel like borno is resting on some pretty shitty and in some cases entirely hidden arguments, sure, but I'd like to know what he has to say to defend himself.
extend[\b]. This was a late PFP, so I'd like to get a better look at this tomorrow.

He's right, though. Any lynch is better than a no lynch, especially in role-light games like this. If the day's nearing an end and there's a tie, it's better for you to break the tie even if you'd rather be lynching someone else, as long as the target you chose is somewhere high on your scum list.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: borno on August 14, 2012, 01:07:35 am

Sorry guys, I have barely enough time to do one mafia, let alone two. I think I should request replacement and let the next person come in my place.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 14, 2012, 09:09:38 am

Jim: Sure it's a little naive, but I just don't see him as scum. What's your read on him (Geen)?

Two more days, huh? Deathsword.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 09:38:50 am

Replacement #1 ready as needed.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 14, 2012, 10:20:04 am

PotL should let you know if you're in or not, but I imagine you will be. I'd suggest reading what's been posted so far (and maybe another BM game, if you find the time) to get ready!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 14, 2012, 10:46:10 am

Unvote. Hapah.

Hapah, you keep claiming I am scum, yet your only accusation is related to that extend. You tried to lynch an individual you thought was town. You were passive for most of both days. You are doing something that is dangerously close to buddying with Geen, to the point he joined your vote with only the justification that he had "re-read" the thread.

I think I may have been at bit overzealous with my scumhunting when it came to Boltur. As he said, I tried to find evidence to fit my theory, not a theory that fit my evidence. Through D1, you (Hapah) mostly just sat back while others applied most of the pressure on KF, doing the same now on D2 when I attacked Boltur. Judging from that question-less vote back in the start of the game, you look like you have been trying to get me lynched since the start.

Well scum, what do you have to say now?


_{Nice last second save, BMC.}

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 14, 2012, 12:56:31 pm

Bah! Sorry if I suck at this, I'm used to just relying on seeing through bluffs. Also, I answered the questions a few pages back, and I just answered the other one!
I didn't vote for him because Hapah did! I'm just too lazy to quote anything :P. I'll re-read again and post in an hour or so with some quotes.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Sorry for a double post. Re-read a bit, then thought about more recent stuff. Still no quotes for now.
Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

On noobscum: They exist. Even if they are a n00b, they could still be scum. I remember one game (IRL) where a friend's six year old little sister won the game because nobody suspected her. I could be mafia, for all you guys know. So could anyone else.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Boltur on August 14, 2012, 03:57:12 pm

Deathsword:
#1
It's hard to argue with arbitrary point of scummy inactivity :/

Hapah:
#1
Yes that is correct. Why is this so suprising and why are you contradicting it against your own suspicions ? Why do you think DS is real scum then ?

Hapah:
#2
Uh what ? Why Geen cannot be scum ? That's pretty heavy assumption here even if you read him as town. How you think he would act as scum ?

Geen:
#1
How borno is paranoid about accusations ? More detail.

Jim:
#1
Your opinion on Geen ? And it's probably because you're an IC but i have a feeling i ignored the fact that you're also potential scum you too much.

Geen:
#2
Wait. Why his defense makes you more likely to be lynched ?  And you won't be on the recieving end ? Are you suggesting you're going to kill ? And it sounds like you don't care who will be lynched only that it's not you. That's not a towny attitude at all Geen!

wsoxfan/borno replacement: Most suspicious person ? Least suspicious person ? Opinion on noob scum argument ?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 14, 2012, 04:08:38 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Sorry for a double post. Re-read a bit, then thought about more recent stuff. Still no quotes for now.
Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

Geen: Please clarify the bolded part.

How can you backstab someone if you don't know they are in your team? Only scum know their team. And only scum can night kill (in BMs).


Do all BMs have this much lurking in D2? Because the last BM (my first) was also like that.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 14, 2012, 05:38:47 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 10:46:10 am

Hapah, you keep claiming I am scum, yet your only accusation is related to that extend.

And apparently your case on Boltur didn't have a rock-solid foundation either, or you wouldn't have changed it when Boltur said "You're wrong". What did you have on him, again? You didn't like his scumhunting?

Quote from: Deathsword

You tried to lynch an individual you thought was town.

Better than the alternative.

Quote from: Deathsword

You were passive for most of both days.

Fair enough point here; though I'm definitely not the worst.

Quote from: Deathsword

You are doing something that is dangerously close to buddying with Geen, to the point he joined your vote with only the justification that he had "re-read" the thread.

Buddying? Where? I said I didn't think he was scum because of how poorly he's played so far.

Quote from: Deathsword

I think I may have been at bit overzealous with my scumhunting when it came to Boltur. As he said, I tried to find evidence to fit my theory, not a theory that fit my evidence. Through D1, you (Hapah) mostly just sat back while others applied most of the pressure on KF,

There was very little to be gained from questioning someone who was, essentially, a walking corpse. It would have taken divine intervention to get him out of the noose. I wasn't as convinced of his scum-ness as some others, but there really wasn't an alternative.

Quote from: Deathsword

doing the same now on D2 when I attacked Boltur.

What?

Quote from: Deathsword

Judging from that question-less vote back in the start of the game, you look like you have been trying to get me lynched since the start.

You're really going to call me out for my first RVS "question" of the day? You thought this was compelling enough evidence to dredge up? What does it tell you?

Quote from: Deathsword

Well scum, what do you have to say now?

Here's what I've got to say.

As best I can tell, you've evaded the question of why you didn't vote for the extend when trying to make a case (I'm not going to let go of that until I get an answer, by the way).
I don't like the tone of your posts.
I think Boltur is town based less on a read of him and more because you are trying to get him lynched.
I think Geen is more likely town than scum because I doubt someone who is being coached by another player plus an IC could play as he has been playing.

I miss anything?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 14, 2012, 06:52:45 pm

Did you miss anything? Well, you didn't state why I am scum.

From what I've seen from all your posts, it would seem that I am the big bad scum and that should be obvious to everyone.

Not liking the tone of my posts? Not my problem. I'll be as agressive as I want.

You keep throwing soft questions at Geen, and yours are the only questions he answered.

Unlike you, I do not consider a no-lynch to be a bad thing on D2, especially when there are is no proof. Why didn't I extend? Because I am not desperate to lynch someone as you are.

I find lack of active scumhunting to be scummy, as should be obvious to anyone not lurking right now.

Clarification:

Quote from: Hapah

Quote from: Me

doing the same now on D2 when I attacked Boltur.

What?

You were passive during D1 when KF was being attacked, and you were passive once more in D2 when I was attacking Boltur. All you kept doing was go on about how I didn't extend and thus scum ([sarcasm]Oh no, I've been caught![/sarcasm]).

On a related note: I consider being passive as not actively hunting or pressuring, while still posting. I consider lurking to be complete lack of posts while being active on B12.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:33:36 pm

Oh! I see, this is different from what I'm used to. in the version I played, all scum would know who the other scum are.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:42:13 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 04:08:38 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Sorry for a double post. Re-read a bit, then thought about more recent stuff. Still no quotes for now.
Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

Geen: Please clarify the bolded part.

How can you backstab someone if you don't know they are in your team? Only scum know their team. And only scum can night kill (in BMs).
Wait, so scum DO know their team? Ah, then disregard my previous post. I was thinking more just nightkill your 'buddy' if any accusations of buddying up appear.


Do all BMs have this much lurking in D2? Because the last BM (my first) was also like that.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:43:31 pm

Oh god I fudged that so hard.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 08:31:28 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:33:36 pm

Oh! I see, this is different from what I'm used to. in the version I played, all scum would know who the other scum are.

...It's the same here.

EDIT: I hope PoTL confirms me soon. I want to get questioning.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 14, 2012, 09:52:35 pm

Slowly the silence began to break.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {1}: Deathsword
[Deathsword] {1}: Hapah
[Boltur] {1}: borno
[Geen] {0}:
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[wsoxfan] {3}: Jim Groovester, boltur, Geen
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {1}: blackmagechill
Replacement queue {1}: 

3:00 hours remain.

---

Day 2 will end Wednesday, ~10 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

The replacement queue is empty. Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

wsoxfan has replaced borno.

---

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:33:36 pm

Oh! I see, this is different from what I'm used to. in the version I played, all scum would know who the other scum are.

The scum do know each other's identities.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: blackmagechill on August 14, 2012, 09:53:39 pm

Geen:

Quote from: Geen on August 13, 2012, 07:44:32 pm

I vote borno. Just re-read the whole thread, my scumdar is tingling. Seems a bit paranoid about accusations, I suspect scum.

What is this shit? Are you just trying to dogpile borno so you can look town because everyone else said he scum? Or are you just jumping on a lurky townie? Considering the amount of reasoning in the post, I'd assume so. And

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Sorry for a double post. Re-read a bit, then thought about more recent stuff. Still no quotes for now.
Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

And how sure are you that You/Hapah are in possession of an NK? What'd make you think that you could manipulate the town to murder the other guy or that YOU could get him with an NK, HMM?

Hapah:

Quote from: Hapah on August 14, 2012, 09:09:38 am

Jim: Sure it's a little naive, but I just don't see him as scum. What's your read on him (Geen)?

Two more days, huh? Deathsword.

Noobishness is never a good reason to rule out scum.

And I love your case on Deathsword here, in this post. If you're going to vote someone for real, tangible reasons, then put your arguments together with the vote. You're just restating the vote anyway, you needed more content there (feel free to say you don't have much time or it's a PFP or a late post.

DeathSword:

Quote from: deathsword

Unlike you, I do not consider a no-lynch to be a bad thing on D2, especially when there are is no proof. Why didn't I extend? Because I am not desperate to lynch someone as you are.

How does an extend prove that he's desperate to lynch someone? It means he that he's not okay with a lynch of someone who didn't answer questions and could very well have had an important answer or arguement. I'm not say that borno did, I'm saying you can tell a sorta scummy guy from lurky town with the way they react, and you weren't willing to wait for that, which is pretty goddamn scummy to me. It looks like you want a lynch and don't care whoever it is.

And, furthermore, you were calling him out on not taking an extend earlier. Just what is your game, DeathSword?

And Nolynch is awful. What do we gain for information from a no lynch? That the scum were smart enough to kill  one of the members of town to get closer to their win condition? It's D2, we've already seen that. Maybe, just maybe, we should keep scumhunting on someone active enough to make slips and give tells.

@Hapah: Your not off the hook either, but I feel like you're on to something with Deathsword.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 14, 2012, 10:12:36 pm

Did I say he extended because he is desperate to lynch someone? I did not. I did say he is very eager to lynch.

And I did not call Hapah out on extending, he called me out on not extending.

Finally, my stance on no-lynch remains. You are entitled to your opinion, and I to mine. If we lynch a vanilla townie now, it's no big deal, after all it's still D2. If we lynch scum, that is great. What if borno was lynched and turned out to be, say, a doctor? We'd be in a much worse position. I refuse to lynch for the sake of lynching. If there is no consensus on someone being scum, then it's best not to lynch and see who the scum eliminate at night. One loss is always better than two.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 10:44:36 pm

Quote from: Boltur on August 14, 2012, 03:57:12 pm

wsoxfan replacement: Most suspicious person ? Least suspicious person ? Opinion on noob scum argument ?

Most Suspicious person? Hapah or Geen, for reasons that I'll get more into later in the post. I believe that Hapah could be scum because of his desire to lynch. So for know I'm FOSing Hapah

Least? probably Jim or boltur, because well, I haven't found anything against them.

Noob scum argument? I'm not entirely sure what the two sides of this argument is, but I find it entirely possible for a new player to be scum.
Now, onto questions:
Geen:

Quote from: Geen on August 13, 2012, 07:44:32 pm

I vote borno. Just re-read the whole thread, my scumdar is tingling. Seems a bit paranoid about accusations, I suspect scum.

RE: Question: Yeah, it's a bit different from what I'm used to, a bit harder because there's no facial expression or tell in text, but I think I can handle it. I guess I've been a bit lurky with my observation.

So you drop a vote for rather vague reasons-will you elaborate, or will you change your target?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 10:52:40 pm

Meant to include this in the last post but accidentally submitted it before.

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:33:36 pm

Oh! I see, this is different from what I'm used to. in the version I played, all scum would know who the other scum are.

Is this a roleclaim? Because that's what it feels like to me. Did you mean to do that? Because you say something that's covered in the OP, and throw in a statement that essentialy is claiming that you're not scum. So why was this needed to say?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 10:58:45 pm

This is a triple post, but whatever. More stuff against Geen.

A look through your posts shows that you considered Deathsword scummy, with no other explanation given. Then, you vote for Borno giving essentialy the same reason. You have not made one true scumhunting post in the entire thread. Do you feel that it's not needed to scumhunt?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 14, 2012, 11:51:13 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 14, 2012, 09:09:38 am

Jim: Sure it's a little naive, but I just don't see him as scum. What's your read on him (Geen)?

He reads noob. (PPE: And then I caught up with his latest few posts.)

Saying that your read on him isn't scum is one thing, but outright saying he can't be scum because of his noobishness is another.

Quote from: Boltur on August 14, 2012, 03:57:12 pm

Jim:
#1
Your opinion on Geen ? And it's probably because you're an IC but i have a feeling i ignored the fact that you're also potential scum you too much.

See my response to Hapah concerning the same question.

Also, good, you shouldn't ignore that I could be scum.

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 12:56:31 pm

Bah! Sorry if I suck at this, I'm used to just relying on seeing through bluffs. Also, I answered the questions a few pages back, and I just answered the other one!

No one cares if you suck, it only matters if you're trying.

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 12:56:31 pm

I didn't vote for him because Hapah did! I'm just too lazy to quote anything :P. I'll re-read again and post in an hour or so with some quotes.

Why does his vote matter where you put yours?

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Still no quotes for now.

You should use them, since they make understanding what you're getting at ten times easier.

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

So if you're not going to be on the receiving end, then that must mean you're on the performing end.

This sounds a lot like you just admitted you were scum.

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:33:36 pm

Oh! I see, this is different from what I'm used to. in the version I played, all scum would know who the other scum are.

RTFOP

Why do I keep getting the feeling that you haven't read the opening post or the rest of the thread in any amount of detail?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 10:12:36 pm

Did I say he extended because he is desperate to lynch someone? I did not. I did say he is very eager to lynch.

Wanting people dead is the norm.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 10:12:36 pm

Finally, my stance on no-lynch remains. You are entitled to your opinion, and I to mine. If we lynch a vanilla townie now, it's no big deal, after all it's still D2. If we lynch scum, that is great. What if borno was lynched and turned out to be, say, a doctor? We'd be in a much worse position. I refuse to lynch for the sake of lynching. If there is no consensus on someone being scum, then it's best not to lynch and see who the scum eliminate at night. One loss is always better than two.

I've already explained the merits of a lynch versus a no lynch so I don't know why you didn't pick up the lesson.

And power roles in role light games are usually so ineffective that worrying that a player could be the doctor as a reason not to lynch someone is not a concern.

Quote from: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 10:44:36 pm

I believe that Hapah could be scum because of his desire to lynch. So for know I'm FOSing Hapah

Wanting people dead is the norm.

/broken record

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 15, 2012, 12:27:12 am

F_ck this, Hapah. Too damn friendly, and I suspect is attempting to win over my favor for who knows what reason. And dammit, I did read it! I just misinterpreted what someone said! And about the whole betrayal thing, what I'm saying is that it seems fishy and being a town involved in fishiness ends in death.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 15, 2012, 12:33:23 am

QUOTES

QUOOOOOTES

QUOOOOOOOOOOOOOTES

They make life easier.

Quote from: Geen on August 15, 2012, 12:27:12 am

F_ck this, Hapah. Too damn friendly, and I suspect is attempting to win over my favor for who knows what reason.

Right. So he's made a grand total of zero (0) posts since your last post. Meanwhile, you have been grilled quite well over yours.

So what's stopping me from thinking that the reason you changed your vote is in reaction to the pressure you've received and not any change in mind about your suspects? Because that's a lot what it looks like.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 12:41:37 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 06:52:45 pm

Did you miss anything? Well, you didn't state why I am scum.

Because you're not interested in trying to convince others of your case, and the tone of your posts suggests that you are scum.

Quote from: DS

From what I've seen from all your posts, it would seem that I am the big bad scum and that should be obvious to everyone.

Quote from: DS

Not liking the tone of my posts? Not my problem. I'll be as agressive as I want.

You (happily) missed the point. It's not that I have a problem with aggressive postings. It's that I view holier-than-thou and/or condescending aggressive posts as a scumtell. Like these, for example.

Spoiler: These (click to show/hide)

Quote from: Deathsword on August 08, 2012, 05:09:33 pm

-snip-
I did reveal them. It's you. Try to pay attention.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 13, 2012, 05:43:00 pm

-snip-
Trying to buddy up to him, scumbag?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 10:46:10 am

-snip-
Well scum, what do you have to say now?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 06:52:45 pm

-snip-
Not liking the tone of my posts? Not my problem. I'll be as agressive as I want.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 06:52:45 pm

-snip-
[sarcasm]Oh no, I've been caught![/sarcasm]).

Quote from: DS

You keep throwing soft questions at Geen, and yours are the only questions he answered.

I don't have control over what questions the guy answers.

Quote from: DS

Unlike you, I do not consider a no-lynch to be a bad thing on D2, especially when there are is no proof. Why didn't I extend? Because I am not desperate to lynch someone as you are.

So you'd prefer a no-lynch to trying to convince anyone that your suspicions are correct? Why's that?

Quote from: DS

I find lack of active scumhunting to be scummy, as should be obvious to anyone not lurking right now.

Okay?

Will read all the new postings in the morning (glad to see a little activity, finally!)

PPE:
Geen: Jim's right, gotta make things easy for the audience. I learned that lesson early.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Geen on August 15, 2012, 01:43:44 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 15, 2012, 12:33:23 am

QUOTES

QUOOOOOTES

QUOOOOOOOOOOOOOTES

They make life easier.

Quote from: Geen on August 15, 2012, 12:27:12 am

F_ck this, Hapah. Too damn friendly, and I suspect is attempting to win over my favor for who knows what reason.

Right. So he's made a grand total of zero (0) posts since your last post. Meanwhile, you have been grilled quite well over yours.

So what's stopping me from thinking that the reason you changed your vote is in reaction to the pressure you've received and not any change in mind about your suspects? Because that's a lot what it looks like.

You've got a point. Witty retort/evidence pending...

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 15, 2012, 07:07:43 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 12:41:37 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 06:52:45 pm

Did you miss anything? Well, you didn't state why I am scum.

Because you're not interested in trying to convince others of your case, and the tone of your posts suggests that you are scum.

Nor are you, it'd seem. After all, you have no evidence and no case on me aside from my tone.

Quote from: Hapah

Quote from: DS

You keep throwing soft questions at Geen, and yours are the only questions he answered.

I don't have control over what questions the guy answers.

No, but you can control the questions you ask him.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 15, 2012, 07:12:21 pm

Jim: The problem I have with Hapah's overeagerness to lynch is that he doesn't seem to care who he lynches and long as they are lynched. Only trough pure luck would the town win by lynching for the sake of lynching in any game.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 15, 2012, 07:47:03 pm

02:31:59

...

The counter slowly ticked its way downwards and consensus had yet to be reached.

The silence had started to break, but would it end soon enough?

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {2}: Deathsword, Geen
[Deathsword] {2}: Hapah, blackmagechill
[Boltur] {0}:
[Geen] {1}: wsoxfan
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[wsoxfan] {2}: Jim Groovester, boltur
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {0}:
Replacement queue {0}: 

2:30 hours remain.

---

Day 2 will end Wednesday, ~10 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

The replacement queue is empty. Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 08:22:57 pm

Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 15, 2012, 07:07:43 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 12:41:37 am

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 06:52:45 pm

Did you miss anything? Well, you didn't state why I am scum.

Because you're not interested in trying to convince others of your case, and the tone of your posts suggests that you are scum.

Nor are you, it'd seem. After all, you have no evidence and no case on me aside from my tone.

What do you want? There's so few powers that waiting around for one of them to hit is suicide. I think you're acting like scum and talking like scum, so you're probably scum.

Quote from: DS

Quote from: Hapah

Quote from: DS

You keep throwing soft questions at Geen, and yours are the only questions he answered.

I don't have control over what questions the guy answers.

No, but you can control the questions you ask him.

Bloody lot of good it would do. He hasn't even answered the handful he's gotten.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 15, 2012, 07:12:21 pm

Jim: The problem I have with Hapah's overeagerness to lynch is that he doesn't seem to care who he lynches and long as they are lynched. Only trough pure luck would the town win by lynching for the sake of lynching in any game.

You talk like I just want to run around lynching without a care in the world. I don't enjoy mislynches, but it's necessary and preferable to lynching no one. I'd much rather lynch you, but if it's not an option then I'll have to try to lynch someone else. Fortunately, it's still an option.

Also, you didn't answer this.

Quote from: Hapah

So you'd prefer a no-lynch to trying to convince anyone that your suspicions are correct? Why's that?

I'll be back before day end to break the tie if I have to. You've got about an hour and a half to weigh in, folks!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 15, 2012, 09:15:22 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 08:22:57 pm

Also, you didn't answer this.

Quote from: Hapah

So you'd prefer a no-lynch to trying to convince anyone that your suspicions are correct? Why's that?

I didn't say that. I said absolutely nothing about convincing others, or that discussing lynching preferences take priority over convincing. Do not put words in my mouth. I've made my case on you, backing it with evidence; while you made you case on me without backing, aside from your claims of my tone-based scummyness.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 09:43:34 pm

You didn't say it, you did it. That's much more convincing.

Day ends in....15 minutes?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 15, 2012, 09:45:56 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 08:22:57 pm

I'll be back before day end to break the tie if I have to. You've got about an hour and a half to weigh in, folks!

SHIT. Yeah, I know how this is going down. Hapah will have to vote me(unless he's taking himself out, and I'm not planning on being petty and stalling since I'm not smelling major scum from either of the other players with two votes. So baring Jim or Boltur changing their vote, I'm fucked. Hard.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 09:49:21 pm

That's pretty much true, yeah. You could vote me or DS to break the tie, though: Your vote is currently on Geen. If you vote me, I won't tie it.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 09:55:35 pm

Five minutes. (Though a short notice before you lock for processing would be appreciated!)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 15, 2012, 09:58:58 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 09:43:34 pm

You didn't say it, you did it. That's much more convincing.

Day ends in....15 minutes?

You mind pointing out where I did that? If not now, at least on D3?


And wsoxfan, remember: if you vote for either Hapah or myself and either of us flips town, you'll have to be prepared to face some attention.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 15, 2012, 09:59:59 pm

Thread will be locked for processing in ~5 minutes, gotta finish something up real quick.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 10:00:11 pm

It might be when you didn't vote to extend when you supposedly had a case on Boltur.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 10:03:23 pm

God dammit. He won't even vote one of us to save himself.

Look how Deathsword tries to help you into the noose, mate.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 10:04:23 pm

Are self-votes valid?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 10:05:02 pm

wsoxfan. Please answer my question before locking, PotL.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 15, 2012, 10:06:21 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 10:04:23 pm

Are self-votes valid?

Self votes are valid.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Teneb on August 15, 2012, 10:07:28 pm

Frankly Hapah, I don't really expect to survive the night at this point, and I'd rather have him choose one of us. (and I sincerly hope he does). I do not believe he is scum, and it'd be a waste to see him die. If I could de-tie by voting Geen, I would. One thing occurred to me, however: why did Jim keep his vote on wsoxfan after he replaced borno? I guess that's something for tomorrow.


Damned ninjas. Post stays as it is.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 10:07:54 pm

Hapah. Consequences be damned!

DS and Jim. Look it over!

Take it easy folks! o7

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: wsoxfan on August 15, 2012, 10:10:10 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 15, 2012, 10:07:54 pm

Hapah. Consequences be damned!

DS and Jim. Look it over!

Take it easy folks! o7

:o :o :o
...I'm speechless.

Title: Re: Beginner's Mafia XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You D1: The Beat...er... Game, Is ON!
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 15, 2012, 10:47:16 pm

00:00:31

…

The last numbers slowly began to to fade away and it finally sunk in how close the end was.  Immediately, everyone began to yell at one another.

"Deathsword!" Yelled one camp.

"wsoxfan!  Hapah!" Yelled others.

...

00:00:05

...

"NO!"  Yelled Hapah and everyone turned around to look at him.  "I can't take it anymore, I can't see what happened to Deathsword yesterday happen to anyone else!  I've seen too many good people die for stupid reasons and if we don't choose anyone today, we might all be Erased!  Whoever's in charge of this d*** thing! ERASE ME!"

...

00:00:00

...

Everyone stared at Hapah in still terror as they awaited the inevitable.

Then the inevitable arrived.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Hapah] {3}: Deathsword, Geen, Hapah
[Deathsword] {1}: blackmagechill
[Boltur] {0}:
[Geen] {1}: wsoxfan
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[wsoxfan] {2}: Jim Groovester, boltur
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {0}:
Replacement queue {0}:

Not voting {0}:
Replacement queue {0}:

A most unusual circumstance, but an
interesting one none the less. By both
his own choice and popularconsensus,
Hapah will be erased.

---

"Heh, so this is how it ends." Hapah said mournfully as he looked down at his rapidly fading hands.  "And I was so looking forward to getting to see my daughter again.  At least she's grown up enough to take care of herself now." He stood up straight and, facing the group, gave a sharp salute.  "Erase those son-of-a-b****** for me will ya?"

And then, without a single other sound, he was gone.

---

Hapah has been erased. Regrettably,
I must inform you that he was a Player.

Two Reapers still lurk among you.

---

---

You will all now lose consciousness for
24 hours, during which time the Reapers
hiding among you will decide to Erase one
of you.

---

Everyone looked at one another, they knew what was about to happen.

Four people fell over.

Two remained standing.

They began to chuckle.

---

Hapah has been lynched, he was vanilla town

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

The game has entered the night phase, no one may post during the night phase and the thread will be locked to ensure as such.

Please submit your actions for the night if you possess any via PM to me.

The night will end in 24 hours or when I receive all actions

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 19, 2012, 08:24:25 pm

Once again, you open your eyes, above you is a darkened sky, looking as if it will start to snow at any moment.  Off to one side is a large mural of graffiti, dominated by a large stylized image of a cat.

♫Brain wave main wave, psycho got a high kick♫

Off in the distance someone sings along to the music pumping out of the boom box on their shoulder.  Other than that the only sounds are the occasional skater grinding by taking no notice of the greatly diminished group.

You look around yourself to see who was the Reaper’s victim this morning.  A glance around reveals that wsoxfan is no longer among the group. 
Everyone bows their heads in a moment of silence.

Which is interrupted by the now cruel sound of yours and others cell phones.

---

Mission:
The same as yesterday, only
now the stakes are higher two
Reapers lie amongst you,
only now there are only three
of you.  It will take complete
cooperation to find and eliminate
the Reapers this day.

---

---

Determine who the Reapers
are and Erase them and
you win.

You have 72 hours until the
third "day" end.

---

The usual sharp pain comes, followed by the timer’s appearance.

72:00:00

Seventy-two hours.  That might be all the time that remains for you.

---

Five people stand nervously around in a circle, each realizes that this might very well be the last thing they ever do. 

Two are prepared to make sure that it isn’t them.

---

wsoxfan was erased in the Night, he was a Player (Vanilla Town)!

Day 3 will end Wednesday 7:30 PM CDT

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

My apologies for the late day start, I was busy yesterday.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 19, 2012, 11:18:54 pm

It's now lylo, which stands for lynch or lose. The town must lynch scum on this day or else they will lose. So it's do or die time, and it therefore means it's time to step up your games. Look over the thread at the remaining people and ask lots of questions.

Boltur, when I look over the game I think you come in last in terms of activity, and if not, then you're still pretty low when it comes to that. Why are you so quiet?

Meanwhile, you also admitted to some fault a few times (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3523131#msg3523131). I don't care that you made a mistake, but why the repeat mention? It's almost like someone called you out on something legitimately scummy, but you're hoping admitting to the mistake will get people to ignore it.

blackmagechill, why didn't you respond to this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3521947#msg3521947)?

And since you do this a lot in a bunch of other games,

READ THE FUCKING THREAD AND ANSWER EVERY QUESTION DIRECTED AT YOU

Deathsword, restate your final case on Hapah for me, since I'm having a hard time figuring out what the hell either of you are getting at in the final portion of Day 2.

Geen:

Quote from: Geen on August 15, 2012, 01:43:44 pm

You've got a point. Witty retort/evidence pending...

Where's your witty retort and evidence? You voted Hapah at the end of the day and never delivered on this. Oh, and you admitted I had a point that I had a point that you swapped your vote to Hapah in response to pressure. So tell me, how you are not scum, with an admission like that?

And then there was a whole mess of questions you just flat out ignored (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3526813#msg3526813).

Answer people's fucking questions and make them legible, goddammit.

---

So some people took my advice that any lynch was better than a no lynch to its logical extreme. While a bit shocking, I suppose it's understandable that this happened.

To clarify, here is the order of preferable lynches:

1. Target of vote
2. Any lynch
3. No lynch
4. Self-lynch

It doesn't really matter if you're town or scum, you have no reason whatsoever to vote yourself in this game. You never want to willingly off yourself. Make that the job of the scum team or the people voting you.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Dariush on August 20, 2012, 05:59:33 am

So, scum killed one of the ICs in the first night and the newest player in the second. Nice going, scum. And by that I mean 'what the fuck were you thinking'.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: blackmagechill on August 20, 2012, 08:52:48 am

@Jim: I swore I answered that one. I was asking you about Scumhunting because I wanted to see if there were any good examples to follow.

Oh, and to clarify on my last post where I accused deathsword about extend hypocrisy was a screw up on my part (#295, for those who care). I'm still wondering why a nolynch seemed like a good idea at all, and a bit concerned about not wanting to extend.

Geen: Start answering people's questions (preferably starting with mine) so that we can get something on you as far as a read and anything but scum too dumb to answer questions.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Hapah on August 20, 2012, 08:58:07 am

BAH POST

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Teneb on August 20, 2012, 10:40:07 am

Jim: My final case on Hapah was that he had voted on borno/wsoxfan while saying he thought he was town, kept accusing me of being scum simply because that I didn't ask for extend the first time D2 was about to end and because of the tone of my posts. To me it seemed he just wanted me dead while having no evidence to justify it.

Jim, why did you keep your vote on wsoxfan after he replaced borno?

Geen: Both BMC and Jim already said it, but where are the answers you promised? And what was this (3 quotes below), a scum claim?

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:33:36 pm

Oh! I see, this is different from what I'm used to. in the version I played, all scum would know who the other scum are.

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:42:13 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 04:08:38 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Sorry for a double post. Re-read a bit, then thought about more recent stuff. Still no quotes for now.
Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

Geen: Please clarify the bolded part.

How can you backstab someone if you don't know they are in your team? Only scum know their team. And only scum can night kill (in BMs).
Wait, so scum DO know their team? Ah, then disregard my previous post. I was thinking more just nightkill your 'buddy' if any accusations of buddying up appear.


Do all BMs have this much lurking in D2? Because the last BM (my first) was also like that.

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:43:31 pm

Oh god I fudged that so hard.

As I asked in the quote, clarify the bolded parts. And why did you say you fudged up? Because you slipped? It sure looks like it.
And why did you keep voting people, promising to say the reasons and never saying them?


BMC and Boltur: What are your top scumpicks now and why?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: blackmagechill on August 20, 2012, 02:07:38 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 20, 2012, 10:40:07 am

BMC: What are your top scumpicks now and why?

I'd say Geen is at number one because of his refusal to answer questions and that quote that looks a lot like he has an NK. If he'd answer some questions, I think that could shift, but, he's got quite a bit he has to answer to.

For Number two, I'd probably say you because you haven't told me why you are okay with a Nolynch at all. How much information does the town get from nolynch? None, that's how much. I agree with your caution about hapah and his lynch blood thirst, but how would a nolynch improve the situation? So you can read the NK to implicate someone? That sounds like you're trying to start Night Based WIFOM for people to fret over.

And for the third, it's a tie between boltur and Jim. I feel like boltur's lurkyness could be the result of lazy townie syndrome or because nobody else was posting, so then he didn't post and it sort of spiraled like that with everybody for a little while. I only say that Jim could be scum because it's weird that an IC would be alive this late in the game.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Geen on August 20, 2012, 02:09:17 pm

I'm not refusing! Everything I've been asked I answered! Also, I fudged BECAUSE I WROTE MY MESSAGE IN SOMONE ELSE'S QUOTE. Somehow.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Teneb on August 20, 2012, 03:15:09 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 20, 2012, 02:09:17 pm

I'm not refusing! Everything I've been asked I answered! Also, I fudged BECAUSE I WROTE MY MESSAGE IN SOMONE ELSE'S QUOTE. Somehow.

There are so many questions you have yet to answer that I could do a wall of text just by quoting them. Also, a quick examintion proves that the post from me you quoted is completely un-modified.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Teneb on August 20, 2012, 03:39:16 pm

Spoiler: Wall of text (click to show/hide)

Geen: Since I have too much time, here are all the questions asked at you:

Quote from: Dustylou2 on August 07, 2012, 06:54:28 pm

Geen: Again, welcome to the thread. After reading through, does anything strike you as particularly suspicious? Why? Also, have you played any games of Mafia before?

Outdated by now, but here anyway.

Quote from: Geen on August 10, 2012, 01:17:37 pm

Hmm... I agree, Deathsword feels a bit scummy to me...

Quote from: Hapah on August 10, 2012, 01:20:11 pm

Geen: Why?

You gave a very vague answer to this one (and I assume it was to this one, since you didn't even say to whom you were replying to) followed by WIFOM.

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 12, 2012, 11:26:52 pm

Geen: After flipping through the whole day, who do you think looks the scummiest, or at least the person who's jumping pretty hard on bandwagons? And where are those answers you promised? Toaster's number one right here.

Quote from: Boltur on August 13, 2012, 02:45:03 pm

Geen: Get your game together and tell us who you think is scum.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 13, 2012, 08:00:20 pm

Geen: Do you mind giving actual reasons on your vote on borno? And you mind answering all the questions asked at you?

Both are pretty much the same question.

Then you said this:

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 12:56:31 pm

Bah! Sorry if I suck at this, I'm used to just relying on seeing through bluffs. Also, I answered the questions a few pages back, and I just answered the other one!
I didn't vote for him because Hapah did! I'm just too lazy to quote anything . I'll re-read again and post in an hour or so with some quotes.

You answer only one or two questions, none of them quoted above. And then, only those asking if the game was like you thought it'd be. Do not lie.

Quote from: Boltur on August 14, 2012, 03:57:12 pm

Geen:
#1
How borno is paranoid about accusations ? More detail.

#2
Wait. Why his defense makes you more likely to be lynched ?  And you won't be on the recieving end ? Are you suggesting you're going to kill ? And it sounds like you don't care who will be lynched only that it's not you. That's not a towny attitude at all Geen!

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 04:08:38 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Sorry for a double post. Re-read a bit, then thought about more recent stuff. Still no quotes for now.
Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

Geen: Please clarify the bolded part.

How can you backstab someone if you don't know they are in your team? Only scum know their team. And only scum can night kill (in BMs).


Do all BMs have this much lurking in D2? Because the last BM (my first) was also like that.

Re-quoted, but relevant still.

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 14, 2012, 09:53:39 pm

Geen:

Quote from: Geen on August 13, 2012, 07:44:32 pm

I vote borno. Just re-read the whole thread, my scumdar is tingling. Seems a bit paranoid about accusations, I suspect scum.

What is this shit? Are you just trying to dogpile borno so you can look town because everyone else said he scum? Or are you just jumping on a lurky townie? Considering the amount of reasoning in the post, I'd assume so. And

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 01:13:58 pm

Sorry for a double post. Re-read a bit, then thought about more recent stuff. Still no quotes for now.
Hapah: Why the hell are you attempting to protect me? Are you trying to make it look like we're buddying up? This is mafia, one of us is going to backstab and get the other lynched or nightkilled. I'm not going to be on the receiving end, which I'm suspecting you want me to be on.Unvote.

And how sure are you that You/Hapah are in possession of an NK? What'd make you think that you could manipulate the town to murder the other guy or that YOU could get him with an NK, HMM?

Quote from: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 10:44:36 pm

Geen:

Quote from: Geen on August 13, 2012, 07:44:32 pm

I vote borno. Just re-read the whole thread, my scumdar is tingling. Seems a bit paranoid about accusations, I suspect scum.

RE: Question: Yeah, it's a bit different from what I'm used to, a bit harder because there's no facial expression or tell in text, but I think I can handle it. I guess I've been a bit lurky with my observation.

So you drop a vote for rather vague reasons-will you elaborate, or will you change your target?

Quote from: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 10:52:40 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 07:33:36 pm

Oh! I see, this is different from what I'm used to. in the version I played, all scum would know who the other scum are.

Is this a roleclaim? Because that's what it feels like to me. Did you mean to do that? Because you say something that's covered in the OP, and throw in a statement that essentialy is claiming that you're not scum. So why was this needed to say?

Quote from: wsoxfan on August 14, 2012, 10:58:45 pm

A look through your posts shows that you considered Deathsword scummy, with no other explanation given. Then, you vote for Borno giving essentialy the same reason. You have not made one true scumhunting post in the entire thread. Do you feel that it's not needed to scumhunt?

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 14, 2012, 11:51:13 pm

Quote from: Geen on August 14, 2012, 12:56:31 pm

I didn't vote for him because Hapah did! I'm just too lazy to quote anything . I'll re-read again and post in an hour or so with some quotes.

Why does his vote matter where you put yours?

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 15, 2012, 12:33:23 am

Quote from: Geen on August 15, 2012, 12:27:12 am

F_ck this, Hapah. Too damn friendly, and I suspect is attempting to win over my favor for who knows what reason.

Right. So he's made a grand total of zero (0) posts since your last post. Meanwhile, you have been grilled quite well over yours.

So what's stopping me from thinking that the reason you changed your vote is in reaction to the pressure you've received and not any change in mind about your suspects? Because that's a lot what it looks like.

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 19, 2012, 11:18:54 pm

Geen:

Quote from: Geen on August 15, 2012, 01:43:44 pm

You've got a point. Witty retort/evidence pending...

Also what I said in my post above.

BMC: I will answer your questions in another post.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: wsoxfan on August 20, 2012, 09:00:41 pm

Using my BAH post as a bit of a bump here-people, activity. Sucmhunt everyone and their mother. This is LYLO. You have to lynch correctly.

And with that, I'm out of here!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 20, 2012, 09:47:17 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 20, 2012, 10:40:07 am

Jim: My final case on Hapah was that he had voted on borno/wsoxfan while saying he thought he was town, kept accusing me of being scum simply because that I didn't ask for extend the first time D2 was about to end and because of the tone of my posts. To me it seemed he just wanted me dead while having no evidence to justify it.

He voted borno/wsoxfan to break the tie, or are you purposely ignoring that?

And I even made a statement about it, so I don't understand your problem with it.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 20, 2012, 10:40:07 am

Jim, why did you keep your vote on wsoxfan after he replaced borno?

Lack of a better target after he replaced in.

Players don't magically change alignment once they replace in, and while it's silly to think they can answer for everything their predecessor did, they still carry all the baggage that their predecessor left them.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 20, 2012, 03:39:16 pm

BMC: I will answer your questions in another post.

Why couldn't you answer them then and there?

Trawling through the thread for every post Geen didn't respond to takes time and it's basically completely unnecessary to any argument made against him except for emphasis. This is time you could've spent answering BMC's question.

So, what're you waiting for? Waiting for Scumdaddy Shakerag to tell you a good answer? Stall tactics at lylo are bullshit, and this is a stall tactic.

Quote from: Geen on August 20, 2012, 02:09:17 pm

I'm not refusing! Everything I've been asked I answered! Also, I fudged BECAUSE I WROTE MY MESSAGE IN SOMONE ELSE'S QUOTE. Somehow.

This is ridiculous.

See Deathsword's post. And go look at my post again, and why don't you try clicking on quote timestamps and the links therein, especially ones directed at you.

Because you stating you've answered everything is factually not true.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 20, 2012, 10:00:23 pm

Determined not to let Hapah's sacrifice go to waste, the group immediately leapt into action.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {0}:
[Geen] {2}: blackmagechill, Deathsword
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {3}: Jim Groovester, Boltur, Geen
Replacement queue {0}: 

48 hours remain.

---

Day 3 will end Wednesday, ~10 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

The replacement queue is empty. Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread. (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Boltur on August 21, 2012, 09:29:02 am

Got some connection issues yesterday sorry for not posting.

Jim:

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 19, 2012, 11:18:54 pm

Boltur, when I look over the game I think you come in last in terms of activity, and if not, then you're still pretty low when it comes to that. Why are you so quiet?

Meanwhile, you also admitted to some fault a few times (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.msg3523131#msg3523131). I don't care that you made a mistake, but why the repeat mention? It's almost like someone called you out on something legitimately scummy, but you're hoping admitting to the mistake will get people to ignore it.

I were talking about my dissapearing at D1 end back then and i'm not sure why acknowleding that would make people to ignore it. I just wanted to make it clear that i realize that i need to be more active. I don't see any reason to argue about my activity so i try to just go with it and ignoring it seemed rude. And trying to keep up with the game without randomly throwing questions around is harder than i thought.

Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 20, 2012, 10:40:07 am

BMC and Boltur: What are your top scumpicks now and why?

Well wsxofan turing out to be town made a mess of my previous look on the current situation so i need another reread to see who comes first but anyway: Geen is not making his situation look good especially in light of his yesterday vote on Hapah which looked like he tried too hard to find a reason to vote him, gave up and voted him out of some paranoia. On the other hand at the end of the day you thrown few interesting things , namely  your wsxofan vote-threat and the question you asked Jim already. The second one is interesting because in the same post you speculate about night results and maybe it's just me but planning tommorow's questioning is not something town can do without seeing the night results. In addition to that  BMC seemed strangely fine with day-end situation yesterday. If Jim is scum then i have no idea how to prove it.

Geen: Why are you so agitated about that then ? Stop flailing around , answer DS WoT questions/reminders and these : What made you keep your vote on Hapah yesterday ? What are you gonna do if something like yesterday happens at this day end ?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Teneb on August 21, 2012, 10:24:29 am

Extend. I am not feeling very well today and can barely concentrate, so I don't think I am able to participate in a satisfactory way. Sorry to leave any questions hanging.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: wsoxfan on August 21, 2012, 09:25:18 pm

Half a day without a post of scumhunting. This may be a thread record.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: blackmagechill on August 22, 2012, 06:26:04 am

Everyone's hunting, it's just that Geen refuses to answer questions.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Teneb on August 22, 2012, 07:14:15 am

I'm feeling somewhat better today, so to the answers I owe:

Boltur: Regarding the question I asked Jim at the start of this day: as I said at the end of D2 I thought the scum would try to NK me, so I didn't want to leave anything unsaid should that have happened.

BMC and Jim: I do not think I can give a satisfactory answer to both of you without roleclaiming, and since this is a BM and a lylo, I guess the time to try it would be now. I am the cop. I was hoping to get to mylo instead of lylo so I could get an extra inspect. My first inspect was borno/wsoxfan, which resulted, obviously by now, in town. That inspect, together with my reads on wsoxfan, was what caused me to try to avoid his lynch if possible. The second inspect was on you, Jim. It resulted in town, but you could, of course, be the godfather, so I'll try to avoid doing WIFOM on that. Thus, in short: I am the cop. Wanted no lynch to get an extra inspect. I don't expect everyone to believe me, but I don't really have anything to lose (except the game, of course).


Jim: How was there are a lack of a better target if Geen was doing his crap since about he entered the game?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 22, 2012, 03:38:55 pm

MOD: Prod Geen.

Quote from: Boltur on August 21, 2012, 09:29:02 am

I were talking about my dissapearing at D1 end back then and i'm not sure why acknowleding that would make people to ignore it. I just wanted to make it clear that i realize that i need to be more active. I don't see any reason to argue about my activity so i try to just go with it and ignoring it seemed rude. And trying to keep up with the game without randomly throwing questions around is harder than i thought.

I don't know about you, but I'm not randomly throwing around questions.

Throwing them around randomly suggests you don't actually care what the questions are or who they're directed towards, which says that you're not really interested in scumhunting at all. Ergo, you are scum.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 22, 2012, 07:14:15 am

BMC and Jim: I do not think I can give a satisfactory answer to both of you without roleclaiming, and since this is a BM and a lylo, I guess the time to try it would be now. I am the cop. I was hoping to get to mylo instead of lylo so I could get an extra inspect. My first inspect was borno/wsoxfan, which resulted, obviously by now, in town. That inspect, together with my reads on wsoxfan, was what caused me to try to avoid his lynch if possible. The second inspect was on you, Jim. It resulted in town, but you could, of course, be the godfather, so I'll try to avoid doing WIFOM on that. Thus, in short: I am the cop. Wanted no lynch to get an extra inspect. I don't expect everyone to believe me, but I don't really have anything to lose (except the game, of course).

Why those targets?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 22, 2012, 07:14:15 am

Jim: How was there are a lack of a better target if Geen was doing his crap since about he entered the game?

I dispute your suggestion that Geen was a better target than borno/wsoxfan after he was replaced. If you're going to suggest that I should have voted Geen, then I can ask you right back why you didn't swap your vote from Hapah to Geen if he was such a good target.

I still held my suspcion of borno even after wsoxfan was replaced, and as I already said previously (which you seemed to ignore) a player doesn't magically become less suspicious when he gets replaced.

Extend.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D3: Needs More Candy Cane
Post by: Teneb on August 22, 2012, 04:56:48 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 22, 2012, 03:38:55 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 22, 2012, 07:14:15 am

BMC and Jim: I do not think I can give a satisfactory answer to both of you without roleclaiming, and since this is a BM and a lylo, I guess the time to try it would be now. I am the cop. I was hoping to get to mylo instead of lylo so I could get an extra inspect. My first inspect was borno/wsoxfan, which resulted, obviously by now, in town. That inspect, together with my reads on wsoxfan, was what caused me to try to avoid his lynch if possible. The second inspect was on you, Jim. It resulted in town, but you could, of course, be the godfather, so I'll try to avoid doing WIFOM on that. Thus, in short: I am the cop. Wanted no lynch to get an extra inspect. I don't expect everyone to believe me, but I don't really have anything to lose (except the game, of course).

Why those targets?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 22, 2012, 07:14:15 am

Jim: How was there are a lack of a better target if Geen was doing his crap since about he entered the game?

I dispute your suggestion that Geen was a better target than borno/wsoxfan after he was replaced. If you're going to suggest that I should have voted Geen, then I can ask you right back why you didn't swap your vote from Hapah to Geen if he was such a good target.

I still held my suspcion of borno even after wsoxfan was replaced, and as I already said previously (which you seemed to ignore) a player doesn't magically become less suspicious when he gets replaced.

Extend.

Borno was chosen randomly. I investigated you this night because you are the (surviving) IC, you'd probably make the most dangerous scum among the players here.

While a player does not, indeed, become less suspicious by being replaced, you still did not really ask wsoxfan any questions. You just kept your vote on him. You also barely mentioned both Hapah's and my accusations against each other, commenting only as an IC on the whole lynching discussion instead. How can there be no better option if you didn't question anyone, instead voting on lurkers instead?

And why didn't I swap my vote to Geen? Because I though Hapah was scum and, frankly, far more dangerous as one than Geen could ever be.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 22, 2012, 07:57:41 pm

It's easy pushing a heavy object up the first few steps, after that, you tend to lose steam pretty quickly.  It was much the same with the group as their initial efforts slowly petered out and faded into silence again.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {0}:
[Geen] {2}: blackmagechill, Deathsword
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {3}: Jim Groovester, Boltur, Geen
Replacement queue {0}: 


Seeing as you all are just waiting on
one mute guy to answer instead of
actually playing the game, I'm giving
you another 48 hours.

Use it or I will be extremely displeased.

50:20:00 hours remain.

---

Day 3 will end Friday, ~10 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

The replacement queue is empty. Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread. (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 22, 2012, 03:38:55 pm

MOD: Prod Geen.

I did yesterday and he has failed to respond.  He is being put up for replacement.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 22, 2012, 08:05:24 pm

I like being in replacement queues... Is it too late to sign on to that?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Tiruin on August 23, 2012, 06:12:50 am

Quote from: Nerjin on August 22, 2012, 08:05:24 pm

I like being in replacement queues... Is it too late to sign on to that?

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on August 22, 2012, 07:57:41 pm

The replacement queue is empty. Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

. . .

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on August 22, 2012, 07:57:41 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 22, 2012, 03:38:55 pm

MOD: Prod Geen.

I did yesterday and he has failed to respond.  He is being put up for replacement.

Edit: BMC, bb code is right in the menu above the text box when you reply if you're linked here on an internet browser.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: blackmagechill on August 23, 2012, 06:45:24 am

@deathsword: I want to believe you about being the cop, but it still seems all to weird. You were to pushy for night, and while and extra inspect would've been useful to the town, a lynch would've been better. No lynches are never[\i] good,becuase who (other than a coP who lives through the night and scum) gains anything from it? Reading the NK is useless because you don't/can't know what the scum were thinking, but if you look at the arguments and votes from the lynch, you can pick out people who just coasted on a vote or didn't answer any important questions (among other scum tells). I don't like that no lynch idea and I don't like your claim. I would FoS you and unvote but this is a loooong PFP and I can't do bb code.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 23, 2012, 12:34:04 pm

Nerjin has replaced Geen

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 12:44:50 pm

Since it's Lynch or Lose I feel it neccesary to say that I'm the doc! I'm pretty sure that the votes carry over to me right? But yeah it's not me, I'm town.

I vote deathsword

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Dariush on August 23, 2012, 12:51:06 pm

Quote from: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 12:44:50 pm

Since it's Lynch or Lose I feel it neccesary to say that I'm the doc! I'm pretty sure that the votes carry over to me right? But yeah it's not me, I'm town.

I vote deathsword

You're doing it very, very wrong.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Dariush on August 23, 2012, 01:18:55 pm

To be more specific:

Quote from: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 12:44:50 pm

Since it's Lynch or Lose I feel it neccesary to say that I'm the doc!

Then you should claim whom you (or rather your predecessors) protected.

Quote from: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 12:44:50 pm

But yeah it's not me, I'm town.

Never ever say that. Anybody experienced in mafia will know that saying so is a nulltell (i.e. neither a scumtell nor a towntell), but such sayings are still the favourite of scum and easylynchers. Also, townies will look at you sideways and most probably lynch you because they'll reason that there's no reason for actual town to say that. ;)

Quote from: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 12:44:50 pm

I vote deathsword

And this is what prompted my initial comment. Absolutely never, under any circumstances, vote someone without explaining why. Even at RVS. And ESPECIALLY at LYLO.

And since I'm dead and can't give a flying fuck about editing my posts but don't want to do a triple post, one last note: yes, that was pretty bad for a first post, but don't despair. You came in too late for us ICs to give you a proper how-to, but it's still far from the worst I've seen (I'M LOOKING AT YOU, MAGMA MCFRY). The previous sentence doesn't mean you can abandon this game, though.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Teneb on August 23, 2012, 02:25:06 pm

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 23, 2012, 06:45:24 am

@deathsword: I want to believe you about being the cop, but it still seems all to weird. You were to pushy for night, and while and extra inspect would've been useful to the town, a lynch would've been better. No lynches are never[\i] good,becuase who (other than a coP who lives through the night and scum) gains anything from it? Reading the NK is useless because you don't/can't know what the scum were thinking, but if you look at the arguments and votes from the lynch, you can pick out people who just coasted on a vote or didn't answer any important questions (among other scum tells). I don't like that no lynch idea and I don't like your claim. I would FoS you and unvote but this is a loooong PFP and I can't do bb code.

My stance on no-lynching is from my own personal opinion. I'm not forcing anyone to agree with me. Also, you said it yoruself, a cop, a.k.a. ME, stands to gain from an extra night. If there was an extra night I'd have a 1 in 5 chance of finding scum, assuming there's a godfather. Without a godfather, it'd be 2 in 5 instead. Even a 1 in 5 chance is better than having to guess now.

Quote from: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 12:44:50 pm

Since it's Lynch or Lose I feel it neccesary to say that I'm the doc! I'm pretty sure that the votes carry over to me right? But yeah it's not me, I'm town.

I vote deathsword

Repeating what Dariush said, you need to back your claim with what actions you took at night. Also, REASONS BEHIND VOTE. Seriously, what's with people voting without saying why. You are pretty much repeating what Geen did.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 02:51:17 pm

Well to be honest I came in at the end of the game and haven't read through the whole thing yet. To be entirely frank I was hoping that'd get a bandwagon going so that the scum would just go for a kill there. Then the doctor thing was an attempt to let whoever lives [assuming that my ploy had gotten a mafia member] to survive the night and then get to a point where they could get the remaining guy. I don't think I'll be useful. To be entirely honest I just went with the first guy I saw.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 23, 2012, 09:50:01 pm

Your honesty is appreciated, your attitude towards the game is not.

Consider that everybody else has been attentively playing the game and paying attention for several weeks.

And then you replace in and basically make no effort at all. Thanks, bro.

Also, your plan was terrible, since you just made a giant scummy target of yourself, and the scum would be thanking you in scum chat for making lylo so easy for them.

Put some more effort into posting, please.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 22, 2012, 04:56:48 pm

While a player does not, indeed, become less suspicious by being replaced, you still did not really ask wsoxfan any questions. You just kept your vote on him. You also barely mentioned both Hapah's and my accusations against each other, commenting only as an IC on the whole lynching discussion instead. How can there be no better option if you didn't question anyone, instead voting on lurkers instead?

I held my suspicions over from borno to wsoxfan. What else was I supposed to do? Ask him a bunch of questions that didn't need asking? Like what his suspicions were? Oh, right, he delivered those before I could ask him about it. Why borno lurked so much? There's no way wsoxfan could've known the answer to that, so why bother asking?

I don't know why you care that I didn't have an opinion about yours and Hapah's cases. I commented where I thought was appropriate and I didn't really think Hapah was scummy and I didn't really think you were scummy. Should I have had an opinion different than what I did?

Quote from: Deathsword on August 22, 2012, 04:56:48 pm

And why didn't I swap my vote to Geen? Because I though Hapah was scum and, frankly, far more dangerous as one than Geen could ever be.

Why is how dangerous someone is as scum an issue?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 05:17:26 am

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 23, 2012, 09:50:01 pm

Your honesty is appreciated, your attitude towards the game is not.

[Why Nerjin is a bad person]

Put some more effort into posting, please.

You're right. Sorry about that. I'll have to read the entire thread when I get off of classes though. I'll see what I can't do when I get home. Thank you for the honest [if somewhat brutal] opinion.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 12:55:38 pm

Unvote until I have re-read the entire thread.

FOS Jim Groovester because while looking around the earlier something about him has sat wrong with me. I can't put my finger on it.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 01:53:14 pm

Okay read through the whole thing and let's put my thoughts to paper. Also not a lot to go on. Comparatively small amounts of posts.

My suspicions are as follows: [I will explain why in a moment]

Micro FOS: Blackmagechill, Jim Groovester [Will explain first]
Small FOS: Deathsword [Will explain second.]
Boltur [Will explain lastly]

For Blackmagechill and Jim Groovester I suspect them a little simply because they are not me. I figure that's important. I suspect Jim Groovester slightly more because Dariush, the other IC, was not scum. This is not conclusive enough for me to vote him however.

Deathsword:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 14, 2012, 10:12:36 pm

-Snip-
Finally, my stance on no-lynch remains. You are entitled to your opinion, and I to mine. If we lynch a vanilla townie now, it's no big deal, after all it's still D2. If we lynch scum, that is great. What if borno was lynched and turned out to be, say, a doctor? We'd be in a much worse position. I refuse to lynch for the sake of lynching. If there is no consensus on someone being scum, then it's best not to lynch and see who the scum eliminate at night. One loss is always better than two.

So what you are saying Deathsword is that No-lynch is good. If we’re not sure don’t lynch right? But wouldn’t that constantly result in No-lynch ever?

Also in D2 he said he would explain why he voted for Boltur but then claimed the internet ate it. I never saw him re-post his reasons. So I found him a little odd.

Boltur got my vote because he was inactive through most of it. Not as much scumhunting as I would have liked. That sort of threw up red flags.

Continuing on he accused DS of lying back in D2 but never did anything about it. Which culminated in him earning my vote.

I really wish I could have been here from the beginning. Maybe that'd have helped me not make a total ass out of myself.

Hopefully you fine gents will at least read the post and not just leave Geen [me] to die as you have. Regardless of how it has happened I thank you all for the chance to play [even a little] I hope the next BM will allow me to try a bit harder.

If anyone needs clarifications on these points, simply ask and I will deliver.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 24, 2012, 04:35:23 pm

Definitely much improved.

You still haven't stated what your protection targets were.

Boltur, where have you been? You can't lurk through lylo.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 04:49:05 pm

Trust me if I knew you would be the fourth to know. Original player, Geen, Myself, then you. I'll send the others a message and see what I can't find out though.

On a related subject, since it's now a tied vote does that mean I die?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 24, 2012, 04:54:18 pm

Don't PM the previous players, PM the mod.

Quote from: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 04:49:05 pm

On a related subject, since it's now a tied vote does that mean I die?

Depends on how well you make your case or not.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Teneb on August 24, 2012, 04:57:43 pm

Quote from: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 01:53:14 pm

So what you are saying Deathsword is that No-lynch is good. If we’re not sure don’t lynch right? But wouldn’t that constantly result in No-lynch ever?

We were quite sure in D1. It was a mislynch, of course, but at least we were certain.

Quote from: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 01:53:14 pm

Also in D2 he said he would explain why he voted for Boltur but then claimed the internet ate it. I never saw him re-post his reasons. So I found him a little odd.

What? I did deliver the reasons. I doubt that the other players wouldn't have called me out on that otherwise. Here, I'll quote it:

Quote from: Deathsword on August 09, 2012, 04:47:58 pm

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

Deathsword: What's "certain lack" ? I scumhunted or not ? Be more precise. Yes, my initial questions to kingfisher were not very content-heavy but his dodgy behavior was damning enough in my eyes to push harder.

I'll be more blunt. I think you didn't scum-hunted at all. You say his dodgy behaivour was damning enough to push harder, yet you didn't push him aside from pointing out he did not answer that one question you asked.

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

And there's nothing wrong with throwing a RVS vote and following by real one to me.

There is if you provide no reasons as to why you are keeping the vote on the individual.

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

You say my reasons for voting kingfisher were weak but what you made basis for a (i think) real vote is pretty weak itself.

Okay, I'm confused here: are you saying my reasons for voting for you or KF are weak?

Quote from: Boltur on August 08, 2012, 11:50:37 am

You completely disregard kingfisher's aggressive and nervous reaction which was the big thing back then.

I did not disregard that. In fact, that was what made me turn my attacks fully towards him in the first place. I do not know why you are saying that.

And this was only one of them.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 24, 2012, 04:59:43 pm

Too late for that mate. I'll re-PM them and apologize, followed by PMing the mod.

So you did. I apologize I must have missed that.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 24, 2012, 10:11:20 pm

Day mod-extended by 24 hours, something cropped up and I don't have the time to finish the day right now.

Day will end Monday ~10 PM CDT

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: wsoxfan on August 24, 2012, 10:17:24 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on August 24, 2012, 10:11:20 pm

Day mod-extended by 24 hours, something cropped up and I don't have the time to finish the day right now.

Day will end Monday ~10 PM CDT

(Do you mean Saturday?)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 25, 2012, 07:05:45 am

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 24, 2012, 04:35:23 pm

-snip-
You still haven't stated what your protection targets were.
-snip-

Day 1 Deathsword was protected. Day 2 no one was protected. Day 3 is yet to be determined.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 25, 2012, 02:20:15 pm

Quote from: wsoxfan on August 24, 2012, 10:17:24 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on August 24, 2012, 10:11:20 pm

Day mod-extended by 24 hours, something cropped up and I don't have the time to finish the day right now.

Day will end Monday ~10 PM CDT

(Do you mean Saturday?)

No time passes over the weekend.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: wsoxfan on August 26, 2012, 09:17:22 am

40 hours without a post of content. Its almost like you guys are content with a no-lynch on LYLO.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 11:27:48 am

No content? You sir are incorrect. I have worked as hard as I can with what I have to avoid a no-lynch. I know for a fact that Boltur is Mafia. He still hasn't voted. Lurking through a LYLO is pretty scummy. It's obviously him! I just hope Deathsword realizes this before he makes a mistake of keeping this thing tied.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 11:28:47 am

Mod, prod Boltur and blackmagechill. I don't care if it's the weekend.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 26, 2012, 11:34:11 am

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 11:28:47 am

Mod, prod Boltur and blackmagechill. I don't care if it's the weekend.

Prod has been sent.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: wsoxfan on August 26, 2012, 11:45:27 am

Quote from: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 11:27:48 am

No content? You sir are incorrect. I have worked as hard as I can with what I have to avoid a no-lynch. I know for a fact that Boltur is Mafia. He still hasn't voted. Lurking through a LYLO is pretty scummy. It's obviously him! I just hope Deathsword realizes this before he makes a mistake of keeping this thing tied.

Whoops, missed your post about the targets that the doctor choose. However, I can simply change what I said to 24 hours and it would be correct.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: blackmagechill on August 26, 2012, 12:34:57 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 11:28:47 am

Mod, prod Boltur and blackmagechill. I don't care if it's the weekend.

I had to set this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=115387.15) up, and there wasn't much actiivity and I sort of lost steam after Geen's replace.

Nerjin:

Quote from: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 11:27:48 am

I know for a fact that Boltur is Mafia. He still hasn't voted. Lurking through a LYLO is pretty scummy. It's obviously him! I just hope Deathsword realizes this before he makes a mistake of keeping this thing tied.

You know Boltur is scum, hmm? I guess they'd notify you in a scum role pm, wouldn't they? Just what in the hell makes you so sure? And as far as boltur goes, where is he?

Quote from: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 12:44:50 pm

Since it's Lynch or Lose I feel it neccesary to say that I'm the doc! I'm pretty sure that the votes carry over to me right? But yeah it's not me, I'm town.

I vote deathsword

For some weird reason, I don't believe you. Just saying "I'm the doc" and yeah I'm totally not scum seems like utter bullshit, even for someone who's new to the game.

Quote from: Nerjin on August 23, 2012, 02:51:17 pm

Well to be honest I came in at the end of the game and haven't read through the whole thing yet. To be entirely frank I was hoping that'd get a bandwagon going so that the scum would just go for a kill there. Then the doctor thing was an attempt to let whoever lives [assuming that my ploy had gotten a mafia member] to survive the night and then get to a point where they could get the remaining guy. I don't think I'll be useful. To be entirely honest I just went with the first guy I saw.

So you admitted your vote was horseshit and you were trying to start a bandwagon. Yeah, I think you could've been lying when you said you were town, Nerjin.

Boltur: Tell me what you think about the claims and who you think is the scummiest. And preferably, vote someone, because it's Lylo.

Jim: Do you think either of them are fakeclaiming? What about the nolynch thing that Deathsword has going?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 01:32:54 pm

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 26, 2012, 12:34:57 pm

I had to set this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=115387.15) up, and there wasn't much actiivity and I sort of lost steam after Geen's replace.

A perfect excuse.

No, wait. It isn't. Why does it take prodding for you to participate at lylo? Maybe because up until just now you didn't need to, because you were already on the path to a win.

You look a lot like lazy scum. Maybe it's because you are lazy scum?

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 26, 2012, 12:34:57 pm

So you admitted your vote was horseshit and you were trying to start a bandwagon. Yeah, I think you could've been lying when you said you were town, Nerjin.

Look, more laziness.

Those were his literal first efforts. Do you have anything to say about, oh, everything he did afterward?

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 26, 2012, 12:34:57 pm

Jim: Do you think either of them are fakeclaiming? What about the nolynch thing that Deathsword has going?

It's possible but dangerous. Both of their claims are consistent with how they and their predecessors have played so far, but that doesn't mean their claims are real. I can't make my mind up so I'm mostly ignoring their claims in favor of looking at their play.

I don't give a shit about Deathsword's opinion on no lynches. He obviously doesn't like mine, so whatever.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Teneb on August 26, 2012, 01:48:09 pm

Nerjin:

Quote from: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 11:27:48 am

No content? You sir are incorrect. I have worked as hard as I can with what I have to avoid a no-lynch. I know for a fact that Boltur is Mafia. He still hasn't voted. Lurking through a LYLO is pretty scummy. It's obviously him! I just hope Deathsword realizes this before he makes a mistake of keeping this thing tied.

Okay, first of all: how can you be 100% sure Boltur is scum? The only way one can be so sure is through a positive inspect, and that can only be performed by a cop. And why are you trying so hard to convince me to change my vote?

BMC: It looks like you lost steam far before Geen dropped out. You did quite a bit of lurking on D2 as well.

Boltur: Lurk lurk lurk.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Dariush on August 26, 2012, 01:50:42 pm

Damn, it's so painfully obvious who's scum now. Even more painful is that I can't point out how blatantly, absolutely obvious that is until the game ends (and no, PotL didn't tell me). :'(

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 02:02:28 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 26, 2012, 01:48:09 pm

And why are you trying so hard to convince me to change my vote?

Seriously?

What kind of stupid question is that?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 26, 2012, 02:16:35 pm

Time seemed to stand still as the group finally leapt into action.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Deathsword] {0}:
[Boltur] {2}: Jim Groovester, Nerjin
[Nerjin] {2}: Deathsword, blackmagechill
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {1}: Boltur
Replacement queue {0}: 

31:40:00 hours remain.

---

Day 3 will end Monday, ~10 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

The replacement queue is empty. Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread. (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: zombie urist on August 26, 2012, 02:29:44 pm

Don't think Boltur's voting for himself.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Teneb on August 26, 2012, 02:30:01 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 02:02:28 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 26, 2012, 01:48:09 pm

And why are you trying so hard to convince me to change my vote?

Seriously?

What kind of stupid question is that?

If you read his post you'll see that he wants me to move my vote. Not you, not BMC, me.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 26, 2012, 02:41:40 pm

Quote from: zombie urist on August 26, 2012, 02:29:44 pm

Don't think Boltur's voting for himself.

Derp, thanks

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 02:52:56 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 26, 2012, 02:30:01 pm

If you read his post you'll see that he wants me to move my vote. Not you, not BMC, me.

But I'm not voting him. It's also lylo. And the game is tied. Why is it so weird that someone would want you to change your vote.

I guess you're also as perfectly fine with a tie as BMC is.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Teneb on August 26, 2012, 02:56:15 pm

I'll say this now, then: I will change my vote if there is a tie at the end of the day, since no-lynches are useless in lylo (except for scum victory). I do still wish to know why Nerjin dropped my name specifically.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 03:50:42 pm

Wouldn't you rather see Nerjin lynched? If anything, you should be demanding that I change my vote if it comes down to a tie.

You must think you have the game in the bag if casual tie breaking is no big deal for you. Not to mention tie breaking away from your top suspect.

You're scum. Deathsword.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 08:09:59 pm

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 26, 2012, 12:34:57 pm

-snip-

Quote from: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 11:27:48 am

I know for a fact that Boltur is Mafia. He still hasn't voted. Lurking through a LYLO is pretty scummy. It's obviously him! I just hope Deathsword realizes this before he makes a mistake of keeping this thing tied.

You know Boltur is scum, hmm? I guess they'd notify you in a scum role pm, wouldn't they? Just what in the hell makes you so sure? And as far as boltur goes, where is he?

So… Why would I place blame on another scum if I were scum in a LYLO? That would just accomplish the same thing as if I were lynched anyway. BUT it would also draw attention to my supposed Scum-buddy.

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 26, 2012, 12:34:57 pm

For some weird reason, I don't believe you. Just saying "I'm the doc" and yeah I'm totally not scum seems like utter bullshit, even for someone who's new to the game.

So you are saying that me panicking in the first post I’ve ever made while I’m two votes down for death is scummy and not just a new player’s reaction to pressure? I’ll be honest it was a stupid move. I won’t deny that. Is it hard to believe that I panicked under the circumstances though?

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 26, 2012, 12:34:57 pm

So you admitted your vote was horseshit and you were trying to start a bandwagon. Yeah, I think you could've been lying when you said you were town, Nerjin.

Yes I did admit that. Like I said I panicked. I’m not a seasoned veteran. Nor did I have a long build up period to this sort of stress. I got dropped in, like I said, at a VERY bad place to be. I panicked. So I did the first thing that came to mind that might have saved my life.

I think I’ve been pretty nice about answering your questions, would you mind answering one of mine?
Why were you so content NOT to vote earlier?
If you would allow me to answer my own question? I think it’s because you’re scum. You knew that Geen wasn’t. So you just sat back and watched as the fireworks flew. You figured since a non-scum was already on the block that you could just sit back on your scummy hind-quarters and watch the victory roll in!

Quote from: Deathsword on August 26, 2012, 02:56:15 pm

I'll say this now, then: I will change my vote if there is a tie at the end of the day, since no-lynches are useless in lylo (except for scum victory). I do still wish to know why Nerjin dropped my name specifically.

I said you in particular because you were more active. BMC didn’t pop in at all until just now. You were still sort of active. I figured speaking to a suspect was better than pleading with a brick wall.

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 03:50:42 pm

[reason Jim is changing his vote.]

You're scum. Deathsword.

First of all this bodes badly for me. Second of all I don’t really see your reasoning. Sure he’s calm. But he’s not on the chopping block. That seems to be a bit light as far as evidence goes. Mind if I ask for more evidence before I change my mind on him?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 10:26:34 pm

Quote from: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 08:09:59 pm

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 26, 2012, 03:50:42 pm

[reason Jim is changing his vote.]

You're scum. Deathsword.

First of all this bodes badly for me.

But this is lylo. A tie bodes equally badly for you, because if you're town then you lose either way whether you are lynched or there's no lynch at all.

Quote from: Nerjin on August 26, 2012, 08:09:59 pm

Second of all I don’t really see your reasoning. Sure he’s calm. But he’s not on the chopping block. That seems to be a bit light as far as evidence goes. Mind if I ask for more evidence before I change my mind on him?

It's not because he's calm or anything like that, it's that he's not concerned about winning from a town perspective.

He's voting you, so ostensibly, you're his top suspect. He should be trying to get you lynched, because if he were town then he'd be of the opinion that you're the way to go to get to Day 4.

Instead, he actually doesn't care, since he's perfectly cool with voting Boltur at the last minute if there's a tie, because...? In order for him voting Boltur at the last minute to even start remotely making sense, he has to have some seriously good reasons to think Boltur is scum. I have not seen these reasons. Have you?

He responded to my accusation that he doesn't care about a tie happening in exactly the worst way possible. Instead of trying to promote his own target (the town way), he assured me that he'd break the tie by voting Boltur. What the fuck? How can he be cool with that? How is he supposed to win by not voting his top suspect? How is he supposed to win if his top suspect doesn't get lynched? That doesn't make a lick of goddamn sense if he's town.

It, of course, makes tons of sense if he's scum. Scum are none too picky about who gets lynched and think ties are pretty decent too. What he said just screams scum at me at the top of its lungs, which is why I changed my vote instantly to him.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 27, 2012, 12:24:59 pm

Holy heck that does make a lot of sense now that I think about it! I think I'll have to agree with you.

Deathsword do you have any rebuttal to that?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 27, 2012, 03:28:24 pm

Don't bother answering an accusation, just lurk until the day's over! The lazy scum way!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Teneb on August 27, 2012, 05:12:39 pm

Would you rather have me leave it tied Jim, so the scum can NK and win?

Sure, Nerjin is my top suspect based on how his predecessors acted, but I'd rather take a random chance at lynching scum that making sure the scumteam wins with a tie. Did I say I was going to move my vote to untie? I could simply unvote and that'd take care of that.

And do not accuse me of lurking, I simply didn't have enough time today to focus on posting here.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 27, 2012, 05:32:51 pm

That does make some sense... unvote Boltur

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - D2: Things Are Looking Down
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 27, 2012, 05:38:33 pm

The last few hours slowly dripped away as the few survivors debated who would be the next to go.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Deathsword] {0}: Jim Groovester
[Boltur] {2}: , Nerjin
[Nerjin] {2}: Deathsword, blackmagechill
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

Not voting {1}: Boltur
Replacement queue {0}: 

4:22:00 hours remain.

---

Day 3 will end Monday, ~10 PM CDT
Current extension requests: Zero. Three requests needed to extend the day.

The replacement queue is empty. Please post in the thread or PM me if you'd like to sign up!

The LurkerTracker is a wondrous thing: Tracker for this thread. (http://think0028.com/lurkertracker.py?sort=post&url=http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=113813.120)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Nerjin on August 27, 2012, 05:53:26 pm

Extend

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 27, 2012, 08:13:50 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 27, 2012, 05:12:39 pm

Would you rather have me leave it tied Jim, so the scum can NK and win?

I'd rather you try and lynch your top suspect.

Which you are not doing.

Quote from: Deathsword on August 27, 2012, 05:12:39 pm

Sure, Nerjin is my top suspect based on how his predecessors acted, but I'd rather take a random chance at lynching scum that making sure the scumteam wins with a tie. Did I say I was going to move my vote to untie? I could simply unvote and that'd take care of that.

Unvoting is even worse! It accomplishes even less than voting someone you don't suspect! It's a complete forfeiture of your power to win as town at lylo!

You would not give that up as easily or willingly as you are if you were actually town.

It's gratingly obvious how much you don't give a shit about actually lynching scum at lylo.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You - Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 27, 2012, 11:31:57 pm

00:00:10

The last few seconds slowly slipped away and the day came to and end, would the group see another?

The answer to the unspoken question came in the form of the ringing of their cell phones.

---

Attention all Players, the votes currently
stand as follows

[Deathsword] {1}: Jim Groovester
[Boltur] {1}: , Nerjin
[Nerjin] {2}: Deathsword, blackmagechill
[blackmagechill] {0}:
[Jim Groovester] {0}:

---

"It's decided then." Came a voice from behind. 

The entire group span around as one and stared at the figure standing there.  A tall man in snazzy clothing and shades, he held an air of power about him.

"I am the Conductor," the man said and held one of his hands out. "And it seems that you have chosen Nerjin to be the one to be Erased today.  I have decided to take care of the matter personally."

Immediately an object in his hand flashed and a large red serpent seemed to grow out of it, flying towards Nerjin.

"Alright, boss," He said, "If that's the way it's gonna be I ain't going to argue."

A split second before the serpent reached him, there was a bright flash of light.  The serpent sat there looking confused as a few white feathers floated down over.  There was no trace of Nerjin left.

The Conductor looked slightly miffed and, with a small gesture, Erased the serpent, which disappeared in a flash of static.  He turned around and a Reaper dressed in red flew down in front of him.

"Ah, Shakerag, I'll leave you to deal with the remaining Players, there's no hope of them winning now."

"Yes sir."  The Reaper replied with what could have been a grin obscured by the bandanna that covered his mouth.  He turned around to face the group, only to discover that Deathsword had already disappeared, leaving only three people standing there.

Jim looked at blackmagechill, then Boltur and the terrible truth came to light. Both grabbed hold of an arm each and forced him to the wall. 

Shakerag slowly walked forward, tossing a pin up in the air and catching it as he advanced. 

"So this is how it ends, eh old friend?"

"You b******!" Jim yelled, "Why are you one of them?!"

"I like existing, that's why." Shakerag replied and took a step back.  Then, a large bear with tattoo-like arms appeared in front of him.  The creature then tore into Jim with savage fury, it's claws leaving transparent patches instead of bloody gashes.  Slowly, it tore Jim to pieces as he swore vehemently, the last "F*** YOU" echoing on long after his mouth had disappeared.

"And that's the end," Shakerag said, "Who wants ramen?"

---

Nerjin was Erased, he was: Sanae Hanekoma (Doctor)!

Quote

Sanae Hanekoma (DOCTOR)

You were born on March 3, have a blood type of A, are a Pisces, a big gambler, and love the word "windfall" and the word "natto" gets your tummy rumbling.  What that isn’t good enough for you? 

Okay then, you are Sanae Hanekoma. Owner of the Wild Kat café down on Cat Street.  You keep an eye on the Game and make sure that nobody bends the rules, not that you have any real authority, but you do what you can to help out players here and there.

During each Night you may choose a target and prevent them from being Erased. (Each night, you may select a player. If they are targeted by the scum team for the nightkill, you prevent that player from dying.)

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

The Town has lost!

The Reapers, blackmagechill, and Boltur have Won!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 27, 2012, 11:35:40 pm

Okay, before the Role and Action revelations, I would like to make an admission and give you my sincere apology. 

During Night 2, I incorrectly processed the Doctor's Night Action.  Midway through the Day Geen sent a PM saying that he wanted to protect borno, however, during the day borno was replaced by wsoxfan.  At the end of the Night when I was processing the Night actions, I thought that it was blackmagechill who had replaced borno, and thusly wsoxfan was killed even though he should have been protected. 

I can not say how sorry I am that I messed this up, I only realized it shortly after Nerjin replaced in when I was going back over Night actions.

Again, you have my sincere apologies.  The next time I mod a game, I will keep a Word or notepad document and keep track of all replacements and Night actions on there instead of relying on my PM box, which got much more cluttered than I thought it would.

---

Role PMs

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Jim Groovester:

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Dariush:

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Hapah:

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

wsoxfan:

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

kingfisher1112:

Quote

Player (VANILLA TOWN)

You are a Player in the Reapers Game, you gave up the one thing that is most precious to you to enter and obtain the ultimate prize waiting for you at the end.  However, fail and you will be Erased from existence completely.

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Deathsword

Quote

Yoshiya “Joshua” Kiryu (COP)

You’re a strange boy who’s always had the power to see things that others couldn’t, including the UG and the Reaper’s Game held within.  As of such, you have built up an extensive knowledge of the Game and its workings.

During each Night you may choose a target and use your extensive knowledge of the UG to determine whether the person is a Player or a Reaper. (Each night you may inspect a player and learn their alignment.)

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Nerjin:

Quote

Sanae Hanekoma (DOCTOR)

You were born on March 3, have a blood type of A, are a Pisces, a big gambler, and love the word "windfall" and the word "natto" gets your tummy rumbling.  What that isn’t good enough for you? 

Okay then, you are Sanae Hanekoma. Owner of the Wild Kat café down on Cat Street.  You keep an eye on the Game and make sure that nobody bends the rules, not that you have any real authority, but you do what you can to help out players here and there.

During each Night you may choose a target and prevent them from being Erased. (Each night, you may select a player. If they are targeted by the scum team for the nightkill, you prevent that player from dying.)

You are TOWN. You win when the SCUM TEAM is eliminated.

Boltur:

Quote

Harrier Reaper (MAFIOSO)

You are a mid-ranking Reaper in the Games. Your job is simply to erase as many Players as possible, in this case all of them before they erase you.

Each night you and your team may choose a target to erase. (Each night, you and your team will select a player to nightkill, removing that player from play.)

You are SCUM. You win when the TOWN TEAM has as many or less players than the scum team. You may talk to your ally and scum IC in reaper chat (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/fKR9ViEZHjmSU).

blackmagechill:

Quote

Support Reaper (ROLEBLOCKER)

You are a low ranking Reaper in the Games; your job is to give players a hard time by creating barriers and setting challenges to pass them.  This game however, you have been assigned the task of eliminating all players alongside your partner.

Each night you may erect a barrier; trapping a player and preventing them from doing anything that night.  (Each night you may select a player. If they use an action during the night, you block them from performing the action.)

Additionally, you and your team may choose a target to erase. (Each night, you and your team will select a player to nightkill, removing that player from play.)

You are SCUM. You win when the TOWN TEAM has as many or less players than the scum team. You may talk to your ally and scum IC in reaper chat (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/fKR9ViEZHjmS).

Spoiler: Night 1 Actions and PMs (click to show/hide)

Dustylou2: Roleblock Hapah.

Boltur: Kill Dariush.

Mr. Dwarfinton: Protect Deathsword

Deathsword: Inspect borno

Quote from: Phantom of The Library

As everyone falls to the ground around you, you follow suit, pretending to sleep as hands pick you up and move you to a new location.  As soon as the coast is clear you begin to wander the streets.  Soon you find borno sitting fast asleep behind a trash can.  A close look reveals that he is actually fast asleep.  Nope, no chance he's a Reaper.   

Satisfied, you return to the spot you were laid down at and decide to take a nap.

borno is Town

Dariush's Death PM:

Quote from: Phantom of The Library

You fall asleep with all the others, but are rudely awakened by a wolf with strange claws tearing out your throat.  You attempt to fight it off, but it becomes apparent that it's hopeless as the spots its claws and teeth rake over slowly begin to disappear. 

All to quickly it is over.

http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/5EjczsKymt8E2

Spoiler: Night 2 Actions and PMs (click to show/hide)

Boltur: Kill wsoxfan

blackmagechill: Roleblock Jim

Geen: Protect borno (wsoxfan)
(Again, I can't say how sorry I am)

Deathsword: Inspect Jim Groovester

Quote from: Phantom of The Library

Once again you pretend to fall asleep with the rest of the group.  This time you feel someone grab ahold of you underneath your arms and jump off the side of the building, swooping towards the ground.  You feel he's going a little fast, so you tweak the air around you a bit to slow him down just before you.  He seems disoriented for a moment, then recovers and drags you over to the side of a trash can. 

The moment he leaves you climb to your feet and brush a few bits of dirt off of your clothes.  You then wander around the streets for a while, grabbing a bite to eat.  Eventually you find Jim passed out on top of Bienvido Dog with a half eaten taco and the remains of a hot dog wrapper next to him, looks like the Reaper in charge of transporting him felt like grabbing a bite to eat.  You check over him.  Nope, nothing Reaper-ish about him, looks like he's a Player.

You walk down and out into the streets grabbing a hot dog on the way.  Eventually you reach the trash can where you're supposed to be sleeping for the night.  You carefully lean up against the wall and decide to comply.

Jim is Town

wsoxfan's Death PM:

Quote from: Phantom of The Library

You sleep peacefully dreaming of puppies. 

Soft puppies, warm puppies. 

Suddenly you are rudely torn from your wonderful dream to see the maw of a wolf with tattoo-like markings upon it bearing down upon you. It tears savagely into you leaving transparent patches instead of gore wear its teeth and tattoo-like claws strike your skin. 

In no time at all you are gone completely. (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/5EjczsKymt8E2)

Reaperchat (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/fKR9ViEZHjmSU)

Deadchat (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/5EjczsKymt8E2)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- D3: Needs More Candy Cane [Replacement Needed]
Post by: Shakerag on August 27, 2012, 11:43:03 pm

FOR FUCK'S SAKE COULD WE HAVE ALL LURKED SOME MORE HERE

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 28, 2012, 12:53:13 am

Blargh.

Lurking kills games. Don't do it. It's the same problem every fucking time.

I think this is the second Beginner's Mafia where I've inadvertently advised people away from actions that would result in a town victory, or at least a scum lynch. Sometimes you feel pretty stupid as an IC.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: wsoxfan on August 28, 2012, 12:59:43 am

Congrats, scum(if you're still active). Also, goddammit PoTL! I could have lived and not have been yelled at for my posts encouraging people to post! >:( ;)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Shakerag on August 28, 2012, 03:00:06 am

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 02, 2012, 01:21:18 pm

There's the scum slip I've been looking for. Shakerag has advised you poorly or you haven't listened to his advice, because the cardinal rule when playing scum is to stay calm. Giving everyone a reaction like this to look at has given you away.

In any case, you're playing reactively to the flaws people have pointed out in you, when that's the way you should've been playing before. kingfisher1112.

<_<

Quote from: Jim Groovester on August 20, 2012, 09:47:17 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 20, 2012, 03:39:16 pm

BMC: I will answer your questions in another post.

Why couldn't you answer them then and there?

Trawling through the thread for every post Geen didn't respond to takes time and it's basically completely unnecessary to any argument made against him except for emphasis. This is time you could've spent answering BMC's question.

So, what're you waiting for? Waiting for Scumdaddy Shakerag to tell you a good answer? Stall tactics at lylo are bullshit, and this is a stall tactic.

>_>

Anyway, if Boltur and BMC show up again, they should feel very, very badly about themselves.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Nerjin on August 28, 2012, 03:47:45 am

Might have lost but I had fun playing. I eagerly look forward to the next beginner's mafia. Also, I KNEW IT! I told you it was Boltur!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Dariush on August 28, 2012, 04:19:14 am

Huh. I thought DS was scum because of the bandwagon on Geen that last day.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 28, 2012, 06:03:00 am

I was suspicious of DS the whole time. Better luck next time town.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: kingfisher1112 on August 28, 2012, 06:05:52 am

Also, fucking lurking. I reckon I did a good job making the game active with my stupidity, scum tells, and general lynchability.  :P

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Teneb on August 28, 2012, 10:19:23 am

Ugh, lurker scum.

I guess I messed up in the last day with that tie-breaking thing.

Should I go for another BM or try a real game?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Shakerag on August 28, 2012, 10:46:22 am

Also:  Jim alive at LYLO?  And not scum?  What is this world coming to.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Hapah on August 28, 2012, 10:47:08 am

My reads were totally wrong. DAMN I'm good.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on August 28, 2012, 11:04:27 am

Quote from: Shakerag on August 28, 2012, 10:46:22 am

Also:  Jim alive at LYLO?  And not scum?  What is this world coming to.

It's coming to WIFOM.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: zombie urist on August 28, 2012, 12:06:23 pm

Quote from: Shakerag

Man, if anyone was here to care about what I type, they'd see that it looks like you could argue, possibly easily, for a Jim-Nerjin scumteam.
Oh well. Please god don't let an extend happen.

I actually thought Jim and Nerjin were the scumteam.  :-\

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: wsoxfan on August 28, 2012, 01:30:15 pm

I was able to figure out the scumteam (granted, with the definite knowledge that DS was the Cop). So again, god DAMMIT PoTL!

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Hapah on August 28, 2012, 01:37:13 pm

It happens. And I'll wager PotL won't make that mistake again!

In a way, I'm almost glad it happened! Lets the next game start faster, and better it happen in a BM than a normal game.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Nerjin on August 28, 2012, 03:27:51 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 28, 2012, 01:37:13 pm

It happens. And I'll wager PotL won't make that mistake again!

In a way, I'm almost glad it happened! Lets the next game start faster, and better it happen in a BM than a normal game.

I agree.

On another note, does anyone know how long it usually is until the next game?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Hapah on August 28, 2012, 03:42:55 pm

I think Tir's bouncing the flavor/setup/whatever off Jim, so I'd imagine it'll go into signups later today, or maybe tomorrow at the latest.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 28, 2012, 04:17:14 pm

Quote from: Deathsword on August 28, 2012, 10:19:23 am

Should I go for another BM or try a real game?

I think you're ready if you want to move on to other game.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: blackmagechill on August 28, 2012, 07:32:38 pm

I went to make a post and I saw there were two hours left in the day and Jim was the only one online who had voted for an extend so I called it quits and tallied it up to a victory.

Good stuff, bad stuff? Was I obvious, not so obvious?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: wsoxfan on August 28, 2012, 07:40:44 pm

Quote from: blackmagechill on August 28, 2012, 07:32:38 pm

I went to make a post and I saw there were two hours left in the day and Jim was the only one online who had voted for an extend so I called it quits and tallied it up to a victory.

Good stuff, bad stuff? Was I obvious, not so obvious?

on the obvious-I figured out that you and Boltur were the scumteam after I realized that you two had essentially never communicated. For the Good and Bad, see Book's assessment in post 94 of the reaperchat for what I think of it.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Jim Groovester on August 28, 2012, 07:41:43 pm

You'd do better if you posted more.

By which I mean to say, if you had posted more I would have been pretty much clueless that you were scum.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 28, 2012, 09:46:52 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 28, 2012, 01:37:13 pm

It happens. And I'll wager PotL won't make that mistake again!

You can say that again... -_-

If I do, I want Shakerag to mail me the shovel so as I can beat myself vigorously over the head with it.


On that subject, other than my screw up, how do you think I did my first time modding?

Any suggestions on things I could do better?


Opinions on the Flavor?  Too much, too little, to verbose, to out there, just right?

Had anyone actually heard of The World Ends With You before this?  How do you think it served as a source for flavor?  I took a few liberties, but overall, I think the setting worked out well, but I'm not sure how much sense it would make to someone who had never played the game before.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Shakerag on August 28, 2012, 09:49:12 pm

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on August 28, 2012, 09:46:52 pm

Quote from: Hapah on August 28, 2012, 01:37:13 pm

It happens. And I'll wager PotL won't make that mistake again!

You can say that again... -_-

If I do, I want Shakerag to mail me the shovel so as I can beat myself vigorously over the head with it.


On that subject, other than my screw up, how do you think I did my first time modding?

Any suggestions on things I could do better?


Opinions on the Flavor?  Too much, too little, to verbose, to out there, just right?

Had anyone actually heard of The World Ends With You before this?  How do you think it served as a source for flavor?  I took a few liberties, but overall, I think the setting worked out well, but I'm not sure how much sense it would make to someone who had never played the game before.

*brandishes shovel*

In order:

Seemed to do fine.
Not screw up.
Excellent flavor.
Yes, fit well.  I noticed the "liberties", but I think you did it justice.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on August 28, 2012, 09:50:29 pm

When did the shovel thing start happening?

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Chaos Armor on August 28, 2012, 09:54:33 pm

Quote from: Urist Imiknorris on August 28, 2012, 09:50:29 pm

When did the shovel thing start happening?

Here:

Quote from: Shakerag on July 25, 2012, 09:25:18 am

Alright Hapah, give me your address.  I'm showing up at your house with a shovel. 

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Hapah on August 28, 2012, 11:12:19 pm

It started when I tunneled Shake to death to lose the game for town in BM XXIV.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Tiruin on August 28, 2012, 11:19:19 pm

Just conferring with PoTL with a few tidbits before (probably) getting it (BM XXXVI) ready.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Bookthras on August 29, 2012, 06:08:09 am

Quote from: Phantom of The Library on August 28, 2012, 09:46:52 pm

a) On that subject, other than my screw up, how do you think I did my first time modding?
b) Any suggestions on things I could do better?
c) Opinions on the Flavor?  Too much, too little, to verbose, to out there, just right? Had anyone actually heard of The World Ends With You before this?

Mostly, what Shakerag said. To expand a bit:

a) You did well, the game was loads of fun; the screw up was unfortunate but learning by doing means I'm sure it won't happen again (I screwed up on my first game too, and I'll never make the same mistake again). Thank you for giving me the chance to help for a bit in the beginning, I had a lot of fun, and I was very impressed by how you had it all clearly thought through and laid out from the start, all flavour written, chats made, roles rolled and so on; that was all great and showed diligence and foresight. The framework for this game was really well done.

b) I would suggest (to all game hosts & ICs, not just you) to be more proactive regarding prods & replacements. Boltur should have been prodded and replaced even if no one requested it, and BMC should have felt a boot in the butt more than once. You are the mod, you know who is posting or not, so don't wait for people to complain -- just prod the bastard. There are other schools of thought, but I think lurking kills games, and your role as mod (or IC) is to do all you can to prevent it or resolve it.

c) As I said over PM, I'm not myself familiar with the setting, but your flavour was well written, consistent, interesting, and gave a good framework for most roles and phases. I liked it a lot, and I am always appreciative of good flavour. Games need good flavour! It helps make games memorable, rather than roles and wincons and whatnot being a mere plot device. It was great this game, verbose and distinctive enough to make a difference and be appreciated, and I hope to see more good flavour from you when future opportunities come.

As for the game in general, it was well played by many, and enjoyable to follow. I hope to see the active players (on thread and on deadchat) on future games. I think the town worked hard enough to deserve at least the small victory of lynching one of the scum, and to be denied it by apathy was unfair. A shame that life ain't fair and all that... (but don't get me started on how lurking sucks and kills games; just be more active, please)

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Shakerag on August 29, 2012, 08:53:34 am

PotL:  Fun fact - I put in a mix CD I had made this morning because I wanted to listen to some Erasure (which, now that I think of it, is funny given the game's theme), and I realized I had TWEWY soundtrack on the same CD. 

And, yeah, everything Bookthras said.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Shakerag on August 29, 2012, 08:54:45 am

PotL:  Fun fact - I put in a mix CD I had made this morning because I wanted to listen to some Erasure (which, now that I think of it, is funny given the game's theme), and I realized I had TWEWY soundtrack on the same CD. 

And, yeah, everything Bookthras said.

Title: Re: BM XXXV: The Mafia Ends With You- Game Over! Reapers Victorious! (Scum Win)
Post by: Phantom of The Library on August 30, 2012, 07:36:28 pm

Thanks to both of you for the input, I'll be sure to keep it in mind!

Quote from: Shakerag on August 29, 2012, 08:54:45 am

PotL:  Fun fact - I put in a mix CD I had made this morning because I wanted to listen to some Erasure (which, now that I think of it, is funny given the game's theme), and I realized I had TWEWY soundtrack on the same CD. 

Heh, now that is just awesome and ironic.