Post by: lordnincompoop on October 03, 2012, 04:02:34 pm
Mein Kampf: A Tale of Vainglourious Basterds
“Life does not forgive weakness.” – Adolf Hitler (17/02/1945)
“Life does not forgive weakness.” – Adolf Hitler (17/02/1945)
You are a spy. The year is 1942.
The war rages on faster and harder than ever. The people are weary from constant fighting and broken from the frequent air raids. The Allied front has suffered from millions of casualties. Soon, it seems, the Axis will break through and win for good.
You, one of the elite agents in your nation's secret service, are one of the key players in the Allied resistance against the ruthless Nazis. Tonight, you have been deployed on a covert mission of the utmost importance. Tonight, you may be the one to decide the outcome of this war.
It is to be done with little fanfare, no overt recognition; the lights shall remain off and the windows shuttered, and you shall leave quietly ere dawn. Before your departure, your fellow colleagues gather around you to celebrate this momentous occasion. They wish you heartfelt goodbyes, and though the atmosphere is one of staid appreciation – even happiness – a shadow hangs over you all as you dread- nay, you know that this departure shall not be reconciled with a merry return. The congratulations are many, and the condolences are equally so.
The briefing is quick and tense, but thorough. Though pressed for time, nobody dares risk a confusion that could cost millions of lives. You grab your pack, and take down your rifle from the rack. You put on your cap and gloves, grab a map, and prepare to step out into the cold night...
Introduction
Welcome to Mein Kampf: A Tale of Vainglourious Basterds, where the scum take the spotlight! This Mafia game aims to be novel, challenging, interesting, intellectually stimulating and, of course, delightfully, mischievously, uproariously fun. Though its mechanics are designed to be well-defined and coherent, this is not a vanilla game – in fact, I'd deem this setup to be quite experimental, so bear with me when you play. For any new players, I recommend you to have played at least a few games and read a few more. I highly suggest you stay active throughout the game! This is designed to be demanding and fast-paced.
I believe my pre-prepared flavour for this game is my best yet - it is, certainly, my longest yet. This has been on the backburner for the past year, morphing in and out of various forms. However, it is a bit verbose compared to most games. I apologise in advance to anyone who feels that my writing style is over-the-top, amateurish or dull to read; I agree with you fully on all counts, but you will, sadly, be given a lot of it.
As a player, you must keep your wits about you, your friends close by and your enemies even closer. Trust only your dearest friends, or nobody at all if possible, for you never know who may be a traitor in the camp, who the next target will be, and who will be the one to thrust their blade through the soft folds of skin and cloth on your exposed back...
Game Rules
Standard rules:
- All votes must be in red. Unvoting before voting again is not required, but appreciated. You may vote for No Lynch. You cannot conditional vote. The game is hammerless.
- Days and Nights both span 48 hours. Neither time span includes weekends. Nights may end earlier if all actions are in before the deadline. Days and nights end at 8PM GMT unless otherwise specified.
- Never edit your posts for any reason, including typos.
- Do not PM other players unless explicitly allowed. Players with private chat access will be given a topic on QuickTopic where they may post freely.
- Never quote any PM from the mod or any communication with them unless you are explicitly allowed to do so. You may give a general summary (for example, a roleclaim), but do not quote directly. Rulebreakers can and will be modkilled with prejudice.
- Any requests, questions or addressals made to the moderator that are not in bold will be ignored.
- You may ask for an extension or shorten by putting the respective word in bold. Extensions require 33% of players to agree minus any players opposing, and requires at least three players. Extends are for 24 hours. Shortens require at least 51% of players to agree, and will end the day as soon as it can be processed.
- Dead players may post one “bah post” to comment on their death, but it may not contain any relevant game information. After that, please do not post.
- Please make an effort to post at least once daily. If you do not post for 30 hours, you will be prodded. If I don’t hear from you within 24 more hours, you will be replaced and/or modkilled. This is slightly stricter than the normal lurking rule, but I'd like people to enjoy the game and not complain about lurkers.
- I, the moderator, will not lie to you.
- Never underestimate your importance, try to be respectfulto the other players and to the moderator, and always play to win!
Game specific rules – read these two if you won't read them all!
- On a no-lynch, no-vote or tie, the Nazis will choose a person to kill randomly.
- Each Day may last a maximum of 72 hours before the Nazis lose patience and force the day to end. No exceptions.
Attendance Sheet
Green-coloured names are wins.
Living Players:
- Toaster - Hilbert Hofmann, Spy
- Dariush - Wenzel Christian Freund, Spy
Powder MinerUrist Imiknorris - Eckehard Baumhauer, Spy- Hapah - Leo Leopold Schultze, Spy
- Shakerag - Arndt Reiner Sachs, Spy
Dead Players:
- blackmagechill - Dietrich Waldemar Schmidt, Spy
- TolyK - Vester Meine Schneider, Spy
- Deathsword - Ferdinand Meier, Spy
- Tiruin - Friedrich Gerig, Spy
Jim Groovesterzombie urist - Karl Dunst, Soviet Mastermind- IronyOwl - Anton Wechsler, Soviet Executioner
Post by: Jim Groovester on October 03, 2012, 04:16:05 pm
In.
Post by: Think0028 on October 03, 2012, 05:20:47 pm
Post by: Tiruin on October 03, 2012, 07:50:04 pm
In. THREE GAMES WHY NOTWhat he said!
In!
Questions:
>8pm GMT...meaning +0?
>Is this some sort of bastard game (despite the title :P)
>Is the moderator voteable?
>Can we know ahead of time how many factions are in-game?
>Is Russia included?
Post by: Toaster on October 03, 2012, 10:19:20 pm
In. THREE GAMES WHY NOT
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 04, 2012, 12:02:13 am
>8pm GMT...meaning +0?
Yes.
Post by: Dariush on October 04, 2012, 09:22:18 am
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 04, 2012, 01:30:24 pm
We'll need 6 more people. I'd contact Pandar, since he expressed interest when I first laid out this idea, but he seems too busy with his midterms to be here.
Post by: Hapah on October 04, 2012, 01:37:54 pm
Post by: Dariush on October 04, 2012, 02:00:14 pm
Is it just me, or has this forum really started to die down?People simply don't think anything except BYORs and Meph's stuff is worth their time anymore. :(
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on October 04, 2012, 02:02:37 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 04, 2012, 02:04:47 pm
Is it just me, or has this forum really started to die down?People simply don't think anything except BYORs and Meph's stuff is worth their time anymore. :(
I'd be interested to know where everyone who was around for WC I and II went.
Post by: Dariush on October 05, 2012, 04:01:13 am
I am here. The mortals don't matter.I'd be interested to know where everyone who was around for WC I and II went.Is it just me, or has this forum really started to die down?People simply don't think anything except BYORs and Meph's stuff is worth their time anymore. :(
Post by: IronyOwl on October 05, 2012, 04:50:09 pm
Post by: Tiruin on October 05, 2012, 07:28:15 pm
Interested, but unsure about joining two games at once. Yes, I'm aware that the trigamers are laughing at me. :II'm actually laughing at myself for joining in three games, but they will start slooowly given this rate. Please IN IronyOwl, please IN IronyOwl...
Post by: Dariush on October 06, 2012, 02:50:49 am
Interested, but unsure about joining two games at once. Yes, I'm aware that the trigamers are laughing at me. :IThey are not laughing at you. They are laughing IN YOUR FACE. Like this:
(http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/3720/frani.png) < AHAHAHA. AHHHHAHAHAHA.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 06, 2012, 04:08:23 pm
Interested, but unsure about joining two games at once. Yes, I'm aware that the trigamers are laughing at me. :I
At this rate, I'd say it's pretty safe to join.
Post by: kingfisher1112 on October 07, 2012, 06:04:39 am
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 07, 2012, 08:00:32 am
In.
Please read the OP before posting. This is not a game that is suitable for beginners.
Post by: Dariush on October 07, 2012, 08:32:59 am
Post by: kingfisher1112 on October 07, 2012, 08:59:49 am
Meh, I'll just watch then.
Post by: IronyOwl on October 07, 2012, 03:53:25 pm
Post by: TolyK on October 08, 2012, 11:02:02 am
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 08, 2012, 01:45:23 pm
I've never had this much trouble filling a proper game before; it's a refreshing, if somewhat worrying, change of pace. Usually, delays before Night 0 involve... Other reasons.
Post by: Dariush on October 08, 2012, 01:50:51 pm
We're gaining momentum - just four slots left to fill.Also, an advice from someone who actually managed to get a game off the ground in the current half-dead state of the subforum that wasn't a BYOR while not being Meph: don't start the game until you get at least one soul into 'potential replacement' list. Preferably two.
I've never had this much trouble filling a proper game before; it's a refreshing, if somewhat worrying, change of pace. Usually, delays before Night 0 involve... Other reasons.
Post by: zombie urist on October 08, 2012, 01:52:05 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on October 08, 2012, 03:35:49 pm
Post by: Mr.Zero on October 09, 2012, 07:08:21 am
Post by: Dariush on October 09, 2012, 07:11:43 am
Ehhh, i'd like to claim a place. If any are left.No.
Post by: Tiruin on October 09, 2012, 07:20:37 am
Ehhh, i'd like to claim a place. If any are left.Join the BM. :P
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 09, 2012, 10:38:52 am
Ehhh, i'd like to claim a place. If any are left.
I'm sorry, but unless you can prove that you have enough experience with forum mafia not to get overwhelmed here, I can't let you join.
...What is it about the first post that makes people unable to read it? Is it that daunting? Is it too long?
Post by: IronyOwl on October 09, 2012, 11:00:52 am
Post by: Dariush on October 09, 2012, 12:02:04 pm
I think the issue is that it's buried in a chunk of what looks like standard flavor/explanation text, so people tend to skim over it unless they're specifically reading everything.Nope. Even if you put relevant info as 0th point, bold it and make its font larger, people are still going to miss it. Coughrevolvermafiacough.
Post by: Powder Miner on October 10, 2012, 05:30:24 pm
Add a nice dose of bad player.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 14, 2012, 01:50:21 pm
Post by: Hapah on October 14, 2012, 03:19:00 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 19, 2012, 04:44:56 am
I'll likely need to cancel this if we don't get the final two players soonish.
Post by: Dariush on October 19, 2012, 05:14:22 am
Post by: Shakerag on October 19, 2012, 09:05:48 am
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 20, 2012, 08:58:43 am
Just one left.
Post by: Dariush on October 20, 2012, 10:18:54 am
I think you should check whether everyone is still alive. Think, for example, asked for a replacement in BYOR, so he may not be avalible for this game.
Post by: Think0028 on October 20, 2012, 01:15:14 pm
Post by: Tiruin on October 20, 2012, 10:49:51 pm
Out.:'(
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 21, 2012, 05:03:37 am
Post by: blackmagechill on October 21, 2012, 02:24:34 pm
Post by: Tiruin on October 21, 2012, 07:46:16 pm
/me is confused.
The winning team depends on the players.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 21, 2012, 11:46:25 pm
IN. I'm back from being away, and I think this is the game where I'm on the winning team and I genuinely contributed to the win.
This is a setup that hasn't been run before, FYI.
I don't feel very comfortable taking in someone for a game like this when that someone felt the need to go through a Beginner's Mafia so recently - nothing personal, just want to make sure you have enough experience to have a good time. Beggars can't be choosers, though, so I'll put you in.
If someone could vouch for your mojo, though, that'd be nice.
Post by: Jim Groovester on October 22, 2012, 02:22:21 am
The biggest thing with BMC is low activity.
Post by: blackmagechill on October 22, 2012, 12:28:14 pm
Post by: Dariush on October 22, 2012, 12:29:39 pm
Which won't be a problem this time, because I can't watch someone repeatedly shoot themselves in a foot and expect nobody to notice it.*cough*especially if that someone is you*cough*
Post by: blackmagechill on October 22, 2012, 12:48:48 pm
Post by: Dariush on October 22, 2012, 12:54:20 pm
Post by: Tiruin on October 22, 2012, 01:20:05 pm
We have one more slot left.
Post by: Teneb on October 22, 2012, 02:03:12 pm
We have one more slot left.
A slot I am claiming now.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 23, 2012, 12:15:29 am
I will be sending a confirmation request to everybody who has signed up. Please reply to this message if you want to stay on.
Post by: Powder Miner on October 23, 2012, 06:50:34 pm
BYOP2 was a complete clusterfuck (sorry PM, but there were WAAAAY too many killing roles)Yeah, I've kinda resolved not to host any more forum games or mafia games, or anything. I'm kind of the worst mod ever >.>
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 24, 2012, 12:33:40 am
BYOP2 was a complete clusterfuck (sorry PM, but there were WAAAAY too many killing roles), and Paranormal 21 was easily winnable if there hadn't been that DMB. If it had gotten toaster and Book (if I remember right you can pick one person to be killed by the DBM and Jim made sure it was Book after all that tunneling which was hilarious), we could've totally won that relying on Hapah's eagerness to lynch Tir and Mr.D not knowing his tells (he didn't at that point in time, I don't know if he's any better now). That whole game was a series of bad luck and too many DMBs.
As long as you stay active.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 24, 2012, 02:21:18 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 24, 2012, 02:26:14 pm
Night 0 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| blackmagechill | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 11 - | <cut for size> |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
[INSERT_FLAVOUR_HERE]
The Night will end Thursday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 25, 2012, 01:00:11 pm
Day 1 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| blackmagechill | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 11 - | <cut for size> |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The sun’s first glittering rays begin to break in the horizon, chasing the retreating night. Under the canopy of this ancient forest, however, a secret garden yet remains, sheltered under ponderous branches and delicate leaves. Feathery cyan mosses and curious vines caress the gnarled roots, idling in the sleepy darkness by the feet of these wrinkled giants, worn and weathered and old as the earth. The dawn light, a pale pigeon grey and still sleepy yet, peeks through the leaves to bathe the soft soil in cool shades of blues and greens. A wren, waking as the morning’s delight makes its approach, leaps into flight, floating gently in a sunbeam. She sings, with utter joy, to the trees and to the air, trembling the leaves and morning dew; the shade sings with her, and the leaves’ whispers turn to kissing. Perching upon a slender tree, her eyes, sparkling black gems, afire with curiosity, gaze upon the green meadows.
A deafening crack of gunfire crashes through the air – she escapes in an instant. Shouts in the camp in the clearing. The Kommandant paces along the rows of tents, kicking up mud as he goes. Towering above the sea of sodden ashen canvas and crude poles, he roars at the top of his lungs, words quaking the ground and echoing off the tree-trunks in the forest.
“Get up, get up, get up, you lazy imbeciles!”
The soldiers all rush out of their beds, throwing on their uniforms, running hurriedly out from the tents, forming neat rows and standing at attention; the senior officers march along each row, inspecting form, as the Kommandant continues shouting.
“We have reason to suspect that enemy spies have infiltrated our camp. Due to the critical nature of this mission, we must deal with them immediately before we go any further with the investigation.”
Whisperings amongst the soldiers. “Who could it be?” “How did they get in?”
“Silence!” The noise is cut short by a shrill scream – the rows stand stiffly at attention again.
“Officers,” he glances around, looking at the faces of each of his troops. “I shall make this very simple.”
Stepping toward a random soldier in the line, the Kommandant grabs him by the throat, dragging him up before the rows of tents and soldiers and throwing him onto the muddy ground beside him – he reaches inside his trench coat and pulls out a suppressed revolver and cocks the hammer and aims it at the soldier’s head in one smooth movement. “You were on watch last night. By letting hostiles into this camp, you have failed us. Tell me – where are the spies?”
“S- sor-”
A heavy, horrible thump and a scream as a kick is placed firmly between his legs. “Where are they?” he shrieks, spitting at the soldier.
“Please, I- I don’t kn-“
Roaring, he kicks him thrice again with his steel toed boots. Twice in the face; dark blood sprays with each impact onto the senior officers standing expressionless at each side. Running in thin streams from the soldier’s face and mouth as he struggles to rise to a sitting position, he coughs out a mist of rust onto the Kommandant’s black leather boot and into the wet mud – and once again in the stomach, with a loud cracking of ribs and a spurt as he vomits more blood. The soldier crumples to the ground.
“I said, where are the spies?” The Kommandant turns to face the unmoving rows. “I shall give you all ten seconds to tell me where the spies are, or this idiot dies.” He glares at them, challenging them to step forward. He aims his revolver.
“Ten.”
“Nine.”
“Eight.” No movement.
“Seven.”
“Six.”
“Five.” The whispering of leaves.
“Four.”
“Three.”
“Two.” A whimper from the ground.
“One.”
A moment of silence. “No?”
Frowning, the Kommandant pulls the trigger with a blast, streaking the ground red. The soldier’s head lies in pieces on the ground, small shards of sullied ivory and locks of hair scattered about the stained ground. His scalp has torn back to reveal the massive wound, pulsing weakly, spilling out. Without even a glance, he walks down the rows again before stopping up close in front of two soldiers and staring them in the eye. Wordlessly, he shoots them both in the forehead – the bodies fall backward against the tent wall, smearing the canvas as they slump down to the grass.
“Comrades, you have all disappointed me. The Führer will be upset to learn that his favourite unit has suffered such a lapse in strength and willpower. Let this be an example of what happens when you neglect your given duties, and never do so again. The 0th Division of the SS must live up to its honour.” He walks back to the front of the rows. “We will proceed thusly; you will all select someone from your ranks – the most suspicious one – each day. That person will be shot. If you all turn out to be even more weak-willed than this and cannot select a person to shoot, I will shoot someone. If you bicker amongst yourselves, I will shoot someone. If you hesitate, I will shoot someone. This process will repeat until we eliminate all four spies from this camp, or until all of you imbeciles have been shot.”
A pause.
“Do you all understand?” He shouts.
“Jawohl!”
“We will begin today. Gather here and begin the discussion.”
The Day will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Toaster on October 25, 2012, 01:21:13 pm
Jim: What lessons can you take from WC1 and 2 to apply to this game?
Hapah: Would you rather be a spy, a nazi, or a commie?
Shakerag: How bastardly do you expect this game to be?
Post by: TolyK on October 25, 2012, 01:42:19 pm
Powder Miner: Do you think our Kommandant did the right thing? What do you think about the setup of the game, and how do you think actions are going to be played?
Dariush: Do you plan to go against society, as usual? Or do you plan to find the infiltrators using more pacific methods?
Toaster: Hey, what exactly do you know about communists?
Tiruin: What do you think about the setup of this game? What do you think: will we be only voting and actioning, or will be also be walking around or such?
Post by: Toaster on October 25, 2012, 01:49:08 pm
Post by: Hapah on October 25, 2012, 01:51:59 pm
Toaster: Are commies 3rd party or something?
I guess Nazi, since I think I like playing town more than scum. Also, what's WC?
(and Sweet Jesus Titty Cinnamon, the flavor.)
PPE: wtf?
Post by: Toaster on October 25, 2012, 01:55:24 pm
WC is Witches' (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=89396.0) Coven (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=95082.0), a pair of awesome games. You should read them.
Post by: Hapah on October 25, 2012, 02:10:34 pm
Toaster: I could ask you the same. You said a commie or a spy; that tells me they aren't the same. Seems a logical extension to 3rd party if nazi is town and spy is scum.
And thanks for WC link, I'll try to have a look this evening.
Post by: Shakerag on October 25, 2012, 02:18:41 pm
Shakerag: How bastardly do you expect this game to be?Well, we've got four spies and eleven of us. From what little I know of standard balance, that seems a bit on the high side. I would *think* that could effectively rule out third-parties, but LNCP stated this is non-vanilla and even "experimental", so everything I just said could be completely off the mark. I'm guessing it's not going to be full-on bastard, but with a 4/7 split I'm thinking there will be at least a handful of unexpected things.
TolyK: What habit?
Jim: Do you expect overall flow of this game to be different due to a hard cap of 72 hours for each day?
Tiruin: You're a spy and it's N1. You can choose to be untargetable or use a roleblock. Which do you pick?
IronyOwl: What do you make of there being four spies in an eleven player game?
blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?
Post by: Teneb on October 25, 2012, 03:25:23 pm
BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?
Toaster: If you were a nazi and had a protect, how would you decide on whom to us it on?
Post by: blackmagechill on October 25, 2012, 05:10:52 pm
blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?HMM, that's a good question, along with a bit of rolefishing in there. Curious? I'd probably claim pretty early, because its in my best interest to not seem suspicious and not waste town inspects and/or lynches on myself. Early claiming also keeps people from calling you out on claiming to avoid a lynch after your scumbuddy got in trouble.
BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?I don't know if there are commies in this game or not (trade unionists maybe, but commies? That's a bit of an unfriendly term), so I guess I'm stuck being a Nazi. Siiiiiigh
DeathSword: What did you learn from your last BM game with me?
Hapah: Say your a vig with a kill that has a 25% chance to name you as the killer. When do you use, and how sure do you have to be to use it?
Tiruin: Is this the game that Hapah's right about you always being scum? Do you think your reputation will influence anyone's voting?
Shakerag: Who do you think the third party would be, if there is one? (I'm betting it's an homage to Inglorious Basterds if there is one)
Post by: Powder Miner on October 25, 2012, 06:31:46 pm
Powder Miner: Do you think our Kommandant did the right thing? What do you think about the setup of the game, and how do you think actions are going to be played?What do you hope to gain by asking a flavor question, in specific that one? You might as well ask "Are you scum?". Now, as for the setup of the game, I think it's going to make decisions rather rushed, we should be putting our effort into working quickly- and therefore we can't just RVS for a week and a half. We can't just go and ask silly questions. As for how actions play out, how would I know? I don't know your roles, just mine, so I can't possibly predict it. It seems more to me like you were asking about my role. I don't intend to tell you.
Blackmagechill
Why are you asking questions about previous games? What do you hope to accomplish from asking about something that will have very little to do this game, after all, roles are switched up between rounds.
Shakerag
Would you think a jester would be more likely to win in this format? What about other third parties? Do you think they will even appear?
Irony Owl
What is your opinion of doing classic RVS in this setup? Do you think we'll run out of time?
Post by: Toaster on October 25, 2012, 08:37:24 pm
Shakerag: How bastardly do you expect this game to be?... I'm thinking there will be at least a handful of unexpected things.
Do you consider that a good thing?
Deathsword:
Toaster: If you were a nazi and had a protect, how would you decide on whom to us it on?
I'd try to pick out someone I both thought was town and was also a priority kill target, to maximize chances that I did some good.
Post by: blackmagechill on October 25, 2012, 09:15:17 pm
BlackmagechillI know pretty well how the game works.
Why are you asking questions about previous games? What do you hope to accomplish from asking about something that will have very little to do this game, after all, roles are switched up between rounds.
Why is it such a big deal to ask questions about previous games, hmm? Deathsword does a lot in BM games, and I wanted to get a read on his definition of good play on his part, and Tir always being scum is mostly Hapah's joke.
I'm trying to get a pretext from how everyone else is reading things (specifically tells), and there's nothing to look into here but RVS.
Post by: Hapah on October 26, 2012, 01:02:21 am
Toaster: Why'd you drop the line of questioning?
Hapah: How do you think the game was affected (if at all) by having it start at night?If must've done something, or else it wouldn't have happened. Right? (I haven't had a chance to read WC1 yet, but I got far enough to know it started N0 too, so I dunno)
Quote from: BMC
Hapah: Say your a vig with a kill that has a 25% chance to name you as the killer. When do you use, and how sure do you have to be to use it?Wouldn't change a thing. If it was multi-use I'd use it every night, if it wasn't I'd hold onto it until I thought I was going to die.
Post by: IronyOwl on October 26, 2012, 01:31:56 am
Irony: What relevance does Godwin's Law have to this game?None. It's all Nazis all the time to begin with.
Shakerag:
IronyOwl: What do you make of there being four spies in an eleven player game?Not sure exactly. I agree that it means something wonky's going on, but whether that means a lot of power roles or a split scumteam or what I can't say.
blackmagechill:
I wouldn't tend to consider miller status rolefishing accusation worthy. Why so coy about this?blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?HMM, that's a good question, along with a bit of rolefishing in there. Curious? I'd probably claim pretty early, because its in my best interest to not seem suspicious and not waste town inspects and/or lynches on myself. Early claiming also keeps people from calling you out on claiming to avoid a lynch after your scumbuddy got in trouble.
Deathsword:
BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?What was the point of this question?
Powder Miner:
Irony OwlI think it's the only real way to progress.
What is your opinion of doing classic RVS in this setup? Do you think we'll run out of time?
We might run out of time, though I'd imagine it'd be more "making a hasty decision" than "running out of time," per se, but I don't see any real alternatives.
What do you hope to gain by asking a flavor question, in specific that one? You might as well ask "Are you scum?".Is there a reason you didn't answer it?
Post by: Jim Groovester on October 26, 2012, 01:52:27 am
Jim: What lessons can you take from WC1 and 2 to apply to this game?
That being scum is hard.
Let's go back to a time before we knew how bastardly LNCP actually was. I am, of course, referring to the signups to Witches' Coven I. Bright-eyed with the chance for a flavor-heavy, flavor-relevant game of immense detail, we all signed up, clueless of the perils we were to face, especially those who were to have the misfortune of rolling a witch, like me.
Witches were the scum team. They had abilities of various use, but no kill. Who did? Why, none other than a vigilante lumberjack, a sociopath wizard who sought his rogue golem, and the rogue golem who was powered by lynches. In a game of roughly twelve.
We did not stand a chance.
Let us then move forward to a time when we thought there was no way LNCP could be that bastardly again. I am, of course, referring to the signups to Witches' Coven II. Slightly unsettled about the difficulties imposed on the roles, but still greatly entertained by the flavor and detail, we all signed up, confident in our assumption that there was no way LNCP could be even more bastardly than before.
How wrong we were. Especially for those of us who had the misfortune of being scum. I was on the Elf team. The Elf team was a cult. A cult with a mole. A mole who was also a member of the Witch team.
That was fucking bullshit.
Point being, I am going to confidently assert that the scum team is most likely not the biggest threat to the town. I don't know what the composition of the rest of the threats to the town will be, but I think they're going to be significantly more threatening than the formal scum team.
Jim: Do you expect overall flow of this game to be different due to a hard cap of 72 hours for each day?
Oh, yeah.
Since we're all a bunch of busybodies who can't get anything done in less than a week.
I think we'll have to keep in mind that we'll need to make and get reads quick.
Dariush: Do you plan to go against society, as usual? Or do you plan to find the infiltrators using more pacific methods?
I prefer Atlantic methods myself.
Shakerag: Who do you think the third party would be, if there is one? (I'm betting it's an homage to Inglorious Basterds if there is one)
Speaking of Inglourious Basterds, I haven't seen the movie, but I'm going to ask you to speculate about its relevance to the game.
Deathsword, do you Heil Hitler every morning, noon, and night?
Powder Miner, as I recall, you were in a previous LNCP game, so I'm curious why you're questioning people regarding the importance of flavor.
Hapah, what do you think will be the relevance of flavor in this game, seeing as how this is your first go through an LNCP game?
Toaster, Day 1 flavor claims. Good idea or not? Keeping in mind that we did them in WCI & II.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 26, 2012, 03:16:33 am
| Jim Groovester | - 1 - | Toaster |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 1 - | Shakerag |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 1 - | TolyK |
| Hapah | - 1 - | Deathsword |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| blackmagechill | - 2 - | IronyOwl, Powder Miner |
| Deathsword | - 1 - | Jim Groovester |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 4 - | Tiruin, Dariush, Hapah, blackmagechill |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The Day will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Dariush on October 26, 2012, 05:23:32 am
Dariush: Do you plan to go against society, as usual? Or do you plan to find the infiltrators using more pacific methods?If by 'pacific methods' you mean 'the methods of natives inhabiting various small islands in the Pacific ocean', meaning 'eat them', then sure why not.
Where did you see rolefishing in there, if he's asking about a purely theoretical possibility of you being a miller?blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?HMM, that's a good question, along with a bit of rolefishing in there. Curious? I'd probably claim pretty early, because its in my best interest to not seem suspicious and not waste town inspects and/or lynches on myself. Early claiming also keeps people from calling you out on claiming to avoid a lynch after your scumbuddy got in trouble.
Why are you answering questions not directed at you?Dariush: Do you plan to go against society, as usual? Or do you plan to find the infiltrators using more pacific methods?
I prefer Atlantic methods myself.Shakerag: Who do you think the third party would be, if there is one? (I'm betting it's an homage to Inglorious Basterds if there is one)
Speaking of Inglourious Basterds, I haven't seen the movie, but I'm going to ask you to speculate about its relevance to the game.
Point being, I am going to confidently assert that the scum team is most likely not the biggest threat to the town. I don't know what the composition of the rest of the threats to the town will be, but I think they're going to be significantly more threatening than the formal scum team.OP explicitly states that there are four scum. That's over a third of the players. Why do you think a bunch of spies won't be the most important threat, Jim? Do you think that we are being lied to by the commander?
Post by: blackmagechill on October 26, 2012, 09:38:58 am
blackmagechill:I wouldn't tend to consider miller status rolefishing accusation worthy. Why so coy about this?blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?HMM, that's a good question, along with a bit of rolefishing in there. Curious? I'd probably claim pretty early, because its in my best interest to not seem suspicious and not waste town inspects and/or lynches on myself. Early claiming also keeps people from calling you out on claiming to avoid a lynch after your scumbuddy got in trouble.
Just generally being a coy person and an eagerness to get out of RVS, really. This is probably the worst stage in the game because it doesn't reveal much information unless noobscum cracks under a vote.
@Jim: The movie involved Brad Pitt leading a gang of sociopaths across Nazi Occupied France to commit as many war crimes as possible, and his victims were usually scalped or had swastikas carved into their foreheads. The better part of the group was killed in a bar fight in a basement after a british spy blew their cover by using the English three hand gesture (index, middle, ring) as opposed to the german one (index, middle, thumb) the remainder of the group blows up a movie theater with hitler in it.
So American SKs, or two teams of spies unable to contact each other. But most likely american SKs.
Post by: Toaster on October 26, 2012, 11:11:05 am
Toaster: Why'd you drop the line of questioning?
Because it was RVS crap getting nowhere.
Jim: What do you think the scum team is capable of, then? Any guesses as to the nature of the "real" threat?
Toaster, Day 1 flavor claims. Good idea or not? Keeping in mind that we did them in WCI & II.
Given that it helped catch out scum in at least one WC, I don't see it being a bad thing. I'm certainly not opposed.
Dariush: What are the implications of four spies in an eleven man game to you?
Post by: Tiruin on October 26, 2012, 11:34:17 am
And that epic flavor PM. Hold on.
Worst stage? Hmm.blackmagechill:I wouldn't tend to consider miller status rolefishing accusation worthy. Why so coy about this?blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?HMM, that's a good question, along with a bit of rolefishing in there. Curious? I'd probably claim pretty early, because its in my best interest to not seem suspicious and not waste town inspects and/or lynches on myself. Early claiming also keeps people from calling you out on claiming to avoid a lynch after your scumbuddy got in trouble.
Just generally being a coy person and an eagerness to get out of RVS, really. This is probably the worst stage in the game because it doesn't reveal much information unless noobscum cracks under a vote.
So what if 'noobscum' don't crack? What will you do then, BMC? On that note, why specifically the newbies, and why doesn't it reveal much information when it is the foundation of all other dialogue and interaction of a Mafia game?
Post by: Shakerag on October 26, 2012, 11:54:08 am
Post by: TolyK on October 26, 2012, 01:47:53 pm
TolyK: What habit?I typically don't typically try to aggressively, but it's a habit I need to break. So I'mma go push my questioned persons more this time around.
I asked to see if you would reply normally (instead of over-enthusiastically), which you technically did.Powder Miner: Do you think our Kommandant did the right thing? What do you think about the setup of the game, and how do you think actions are going to be played?What do you hope to gain by asking a flavor question, in specific that one? You might as well ask "Are you scum?". Now, as for the setup of the game, I think it's going to make decisions rather rushed, we should be putting our effort into working quickly- and therefore we can't just RVS for a week and a half. We can't just go and ask silly questions. As for how actions play out, how would I know? I don't know your roles, just mine, so I can't possibly predict it. It seems more to me like you were asking about my role. I don't intend to tell you.
I meant more about whether you thought there would be something such as gaining abilities or something like that. But that's a solid enough answer. Unvote
[/quote]Dariush: Do you plan to go against society, as usual? Or do you plan to find the infiltrators using more pacific methods?If by 'pacific methods' you mean 'the methods of natives inhabiting various small islands in the Pacific ocean', meaning 'eat them', then sure why not.
Uh... okay?
Har har. Why did you answer that question? Just for the joke?Dariush: Do you plan to go against society, as usual? Or do you plan to find the infiltrators using more pacific methods?I prefer Atlantic methods myself.
Post by: Teneb on October 26, 2012, 02:44:51 pm
Post by: Hapah on October 26, 2012, 03:18:37 pm
Quote from: Jim
Hapah, what do you think will be the relevance of flavor in this game, seeing as how this is your first go through an LNCP game?I'd guess very relevant. I get the feeling the information from flavor isn't going to be as cut-and-dry as it was in the last Paranormal (the game that pops to mind for me when I think of relevant flavor), but I'd bet it's going to play a part.
Suffice it to say, I've got no goddamn clue what I've gotten myself into, lol. On that note, if anyone has a word of advice based on previous LNCP games, I'm all ears. I can probably finish WC1 by the weekend, but it's a little different reading it after the fact than playing it, you know?
Dar: Regarding your questions to Jim in this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3729988#msg3729988) post, was it really worth questioning him about? One reply was a joke, and one was a request for information.
PPE: Do what you've gotta do, DS! Health before Mafia.
Post by: Powder Miner on October 26, 2012, 05:40:06 pm
I'm mostly just concerned about how much it'll achieve with the hard time limit.BlackmagechillI know pretty well how the game works.
Why are you asking questions about previous games? What do you hope to accomplish from asking about something that will have very little to do this game, after all, roles are switched up between rounds.
Why is it such a big deal to ask questions about previous games, hmm? Deathsword does a lot in BM games, and I wanted to get a read on his definition of good play on his part, and Tir always being scum is mostly Hapah's joke.
I'm trying to get a pretext from how everyone else is reading things (specifically tells), and there's nothing to look into here but RVS.
Because there's only one answer to the question and it frankly seems pointless to answer it. But if you really want an answer: Yes, he did the right thing.What do you hope to gain by asking a flavor question, in specific that one? You might as well ask "Are you scum?".Is there a reason you didn't answer it?
Powder Miner, as I recall, you were in a previous LNCP game, so I'm curious why you're questioning people regarding the importance of flavor.I was in WC2 which I left in the middle of before anything really happened. That said, there's a difference between a meaningful flavor question and, as TolyK put it, a reaction flavor question.
Post by: Tiruin on October 27, 2012, 06:26:43 am
Tiruin: What do you think about the setup of this game? What do you think: will we be only voting and actioning, or will be also be walking around or such?The setup is epic. Flavor mostly likely has an effect, and there are bastardly rules because this is...'experimental'. No newbies that is.
I have no idea what we'll be doing. So I'll just take a stroll here... but obviously we have to choose a person to die. We can't not choose nor can we be indecisive, or else the Mod will choose. By the looks of it, totally random if not.
Also, why do you want to take a stroll? Feeling like you'll get away with it, punk?
Anyway, if you had a one-shot night inspect, when would you use it and why?
Shakerag
Tiruin: You're a spy and it's N1. You can choose to be untargetable or use a roleblock. Which do you pick?Hmm, my choice most likely depends on how well I played the game. If untargetable - then I am unsure about my day game and may have messed up, or will have drawn attention to myself, or have a reputation among the mafia players. If roleblock, then no connection to day game other than the fact that I can mess with those silly Nazis.
So Roleblock.
...Why those two choices?
BMC
Tiruin: Is this the game that Hapah's right about you always being scum? Do you think your reputation will influence anyone's voting?
What?
| I've a reputation? | Spoiler (click to show/hide) |
I don't think reputation is something to believe in. What will influence others' voting is how you present your case - preferably legible, coherent and with a connection to the game you're playing. Reputation is fluff to me here.
Also, what's that about Hapah?
The question asked your choice, you answered if you knew commies were present or not. Then you sigh on being a Nazi? Mhmm...Why the sigh?BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?I don't know if there are commies in this game or not (trade unionists maybe, but commies? That's a bit of an unfriendly term), so I guess I'm stuck being a Nazi. Siiiiiigh
And on that note.
So American SKs, or two teams of spies unable to contact each other. But most likely american SKs.How does America factor in here?
Dariush:
ARE YOU GOING TO RAGE IN THE NAME OF OUR GLORIOUS FÜHRER?
Anyway, what do you think about probable no lynches or tie votes - would they help finding the spies if the Moderator chose the kill? Also, if you had a one-shot day kill, when would you use it as a spy?
Deathsword
Hapah: How do you think the game was affected (if at all) by having it start at night?Commie? Communists?
BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?
Toaster: If you were a nazi and had a protect, how would you decide on whom to us it on?
Where did you get that strange idea?
lordnincompoop: Is the Kommandant votable? Are you votable? Is everything you will be saying the truth, no bias present?
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 27, 2012, 07:12:21 am
lordnincompoop: Is the Kommandant votable? Are you votable?
I am not here to let you be lazy and passive.
Is everything you will be saying the truth, no bias present?
I have answered this already. Please try to read more carefully.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 27, 2012, 07:21:05 am
Jim Groovester has been prodded.
IronyOwl has been prodded.
The Day will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Dariush on October 27, 2012, 08:48:44 am
Dariush: What are the implications of four spies in an eleven man game to you?At first I thought that this would mean the scumteam has no kill or something like that. After making the previous post and thinking about it, I realized that it's just as likely that the information about the spies is incorrect.
ARE YOU GOING TO RAGE IN THE NAME OF OUR GLORIOUS FÜHRER?Heeeeeil no. I'm nazifficiently good at multitasking to scumhunt efficiently while raging. (gottdammit, I ran out of puns far too soon :()
Anyway, what do you think about probable no lynches or tie votes - would they help finding the spies if the Moderator chose the kill? Also, if you had a one-shot day kill, when would you use it as a spy?
I think that on a no-lynch for any reasons we would simply lose one (or maybe two) of our number at random. So no, not really useful. Also, I'd use the day-kill either ASAP or at LYLO (if it reveals me or something).
Dar: Regarding your questions to Jim in this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3729988#msg3729988) post, was it really worth questioning him about? One reply was a joke, and one was a request for information.What. Firstly, yes, that was worth questioning Jim about. RVS, remember? Any little thing is worth questioning about. Answering questions not directed at you is worth questioning at any time. Secondly, I don't care what his response contained. He answered questions which weren't asked to him. Isn't this a bit too early to get all chainy-sawwy, Hapah?
Post by: TolyK on October 27, 2012, 09:23:01 am
TolyKI'd probably use it the second night, since by then I'd likely already have suspects which I'd want to check, and wasting it the first night without much idea on who to use it for is not effective.Tiruin: What do you think about the setup of this game? What do you think: will we be only voting and actioning, or will be also be walking around or such?The setup is epic. Flavor mostly likely has an effect, and there are bastardly rules because this is...'experimental'. No newbies that is.
I have no idea what we'll be doing. So I'll just take a stroll here... but obviously we have to choose a person to die. We can't not choose nor can we be indecisive, or else the Mod will choose. By the looks of it, totally random if not.
Also, why do you want to take a stroll? Feeling like you'll get away with it, punk?
Anyway, if you had a one-shot night inspect, when would you use it and why?
Post by: Teneb on October 27, 2012, 10:16:20 am
First Unvote, since Hapah answered the question directed to him.
BMC:
DeathSword: What did you learn from your last BM game with me?That you lurk as scum.
No I don't. I often ask questions related to use of abilities, but not questions about previous games.BlackmagechillI know pretty well how the game works.
Why are you asking questions about previous games? What do you hope to accomplish from asking about something that will have very little to do this game, after all, roles are switched up between rounds.
Why is it such a big deal to ask questions about previous games, hmm? Deathsword does a lot in BM games, and I wanted to get a read on his definition of good play on his part, and Tir always being scum is mostly Hapah's joke.
I'm trying to get a pretext from how everyone else is reading things (specifically tells), and there's nothing to look into here but RVS.
IO:
Deathsword:RVS question. Also to see if BMC changed from the last time I was in a game with him.BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?What was the point of this question?
Jim:
Deathsword, do you Heil Hitler every morning, noon, and night?Why not just ask "Are you scum?" instead?
Tiruin:
DeathswordSee post #60 by Toaster.Hapah: How do you think the game was affected (if at all) by having it start at night?Commie? Communists?
BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?
Toaster: If you were a nazi and had a protect, how would you decide on whom to us it on?
Where did you get that strange idea?
Back to BMC:
What makes you so sure the reference to the movie at the thread title has anything to do with the presence of SKs, and American ones at that?blackmagechill:I wouldn't tend to consider miller status rolefishing accusation worthy. Why so coy about this?blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?HMM, that's a good question, along with a bit of rolefishing in there. Curious? I'd probably claim pretty early, because its in my best interest to not seem suspicious and not waste town inspects and/or lynches on myself. Early claiming also keeps people from calling you out on claiming to avoid a lynch after your scumbuddy got in trouble.
Just generally being a coy person and an eagerness to get out of RVS, really. This is probably the worst stage in the game because it doesn't reveal much information unless noobscum cracks under a vote.
@Jim: The movie involved Brad Pitt leading a gang of sociopaths across Nazi Occupied France to commit as many war crimes as possible, and his victims were usually scalped or had swastikas carved into their foreheads. The better part of the group was killed in a bar fight in a basement after a british spy blew their cover by using the English three hand gesture (index, middle, ring) as opposed to the german one (index, middle, thumb) the remainder of the group blows up a movie theater with hitler in it.
So American SKs, or two teams of spies unable to contact each other. But most likely american SKs.
Do you have any reason to be coy about claiming? Are you, perhaps, hiding something?
Post by: Jim Groovester on October 27, 2012, 06:22:20 pm
Har har. Why did you answer that question? Just for the joke?
Yes.
Why are you answering questions not directed at you?
For the sake of a joke.
Surely you're not a humorless ball of fury all the time.
OP explicitly states that there are four scum. That's over a third of the players. Why do you think a bunch of spies won't be the most important threat, Jim? Do you think that we are being lied to by the commander?
Because LNCP games are hard teachers and I've learned my lesson. If previous LNCP games are anything to by, blah blah blah I've already said this.
Of course, I could be wrong, and maybe this will be the game where LNCP plays the setup perfectly straight, and there are in fact, only four scum, no other third parties, up against the best Der Fuhrer has to offer.
I wouldn't bet on it though.
Powder Miner, as I recall, you were in a previous LNCP game, so I'm curious why you're questioning people regarding the importance of flavor.I was in WC2 which I left in the middle of before anything really happened. That said, there's a difference between a meaningful flavor question and, as TolyK put it, a reaction flavor question.
Which is...?
Jim:Deathsword, do you Heil Hitler every morning, noon, and night?Why not just ask "Are you scum?" instead?
But I didn't ask you if you were scum. I asked you if you were town.
I guess you forgot that you're supposed to be a Nazi.
I think I'll keep my vote on you.
Jim: What do you think the scum team is capable of, then? Any guesses as to the nature of the "real" threat?
I have no idea. Traditionally, LNCP scum teams are weak, so probably not much.
I couldn't even begin to speculate about what the 'real' threat could be.
Given that it helped catch out scum in at least one WC, I don't see it being a bad thing. I'm certainly not opposed.
Good.
Everyone, if you're a loyal Nazi, prove it. Time to flavor claim.
I am Karl Dunst, 0th SS Division Officer. I specialize in guerrilla warfare and unconventional tactics, and am described in my role PM as MacGuyver before MacGuyver. I approve of Hitler's policies, perhaps with not as much enthusiasm as some of my colleagues and peers. My wild escapades in previous assignments was met with skepticism, until they were verified by scouts sent to previous mission sites, leading to my induction into the 0th SS Division.
Post by: Powder Miner on October 27, 2012, 09:35:53 pm
A meaningful flavor question actually reaches into the flavor and analyzing it, asking a question, and determining something about the game from it. A reaction flavor quote is basically taking a flavor piece, throwing it at someone, and hoping they jump.Powder Miner, as I recall, you were in a previous LNCP game, so I'm curious why you're questioning people regarding the importance of flavor.I was in WC2 which I left in the middle of before anything really happened. That said, there's a difference between a meaningful flavor question and, as TolyK put it, a reaction flavor question.
Which is...?
Unvote because I forgot to earlier and because BMC answered.
I'm Eckehard Baumhauer, an older man who's lackluster on the physical front- but incredible as far as tactics go, hence being put on a noncombat mission such as this one. I had served in WWI, succeeding every strategic mission I was in. When Hitler came to power I joined the SS, and was quickly promoted here.
Post by: Tiruin on October 28, 2012, 12:04:45 am
Jim: Is there any reason why you're claiming?
Post by: Jim Groovester on October 28, 2012, 02:15:08 am
There is no cost to this move, except to the scumteam, which is why it's a good idea.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 28, 2012, 03:18:14 am
| Jim Groovester | - 1 - | Toaster |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Hapah |
| IronyOwl | - 1 - | Shakerag |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| blackmagechill | - 2 - | IronyOwl, Tiruin |
| Deathsword | - 1 - | Jim Groovester |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 5 - | Dariush, blackmagechill, TolyK, Deathsword, Powder Miner |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
Toaster has been prodded.
blackmagechill has been prodded.
Shakerag has been prodded.
Hapah has been prodded.
The Day will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: TolyK on October 28, 2012, 05:43:41 am
I am Vester Meine Schneider, a 0th SS Division Officer. I believe that the strong should take power. I've worked through the ranks of the SS and was noticed by the Führer. He asked me what I wanted to achieve, to which I replied that the strong should take power - this impressed him enough that he promoted me to the 0th SS. And here I am, helping the strong (such as myself and my nation) to take power.
Post by: Tiruin on October 28, 2012, 05:47:00 am
Toaster has been prodded.Oh dear.
blackmagechill has been prodded.
Shakerag has been prodded.
Hapah has been prodded.
@Jim: Reasonable, but I'm under the assumption that the spies have a coverstory behind their name, though. Trying to see all viewpoints of the idea other than lacking information.
I am Friedrich Gerig, a young Junior Officer in the 0th SS Division. I was born a poor man, knowing the fruits of hardship and toil by my ambition for greathood in the service of the Fatherland. Known to be a fiercely competitive and multitalented lad, I equate success to superiority in skill and might, thus I see most pursuits as a competition in life. Deep inside, I am an ambitious and insecure man, due to the treatment received at an early age, but learned to persevere and work through any hardship. It was this trait that drove me through a formalized education, and led me to service under the Führer's name in the military - The Führer and his commanders have placed me here for they recognize my talent, putting me in an environment that would befit my nature.
Powder Miner: So in short, you say that flavor has a role in questioning, other than what Jim said?
PPE: TolyK.
You just said that and you got yourself in here? Just like that?
Post by: TolyK on October 28, 2012, 06:04:53 am
Post by: Teneb on October 28, 2012, 08:59:51 am
I am Ferdinand Meier, 0th SS Division Officer. I am a member of the "old guard", a veteran of WW1 and one of the few soldier kept in the Deutsches Heer during the inter-war period. I was also one of the first members of the SS back when it was just a paramilitary guard for the Nazi party and took part in the creation of the 0th SS Division. Also am a zealous supporter of the Führer and his decisions.
Post by: Dariush on October 28, 2012, 10:35:10 am
LNCP STOP BEING BLIND LIKE WUBA.
HAPAH.
Oh really? Then pray explain, why the sudden change in attitude? You've never done so in previous games.Why are you answering questions not directed at you?For the sake of a joke.
Post by: Hapah on October 28, 2012, 12:17:00 pm
I am Leo Leopold Schultze, 0th SS Division Officer. I am a natural leader and rallier, and beloved by the men in my command. Whether it was in the military or elsewhere, everyone would instinctively trust me and rely on me for support, and my charisma and personal presence rallied those around me to my cause and served as a powerful voice. Being the eldest son of four children, I was long accustomed to being in the role of nurturer and guardian. In the military, I served as the emotional pillar on which many of your friends – and I made many friends, quickly – would lean on. During missions, I was invariably in charge – the shepherd, leading the flock. My commanders felt threatened by me, and sent me on the most dangerous missions, from which I always returned.
As a last resort, my commanders fabricated a case and reported me to the SS. Himmler himself intervened, and recruited me into the 0th.
Post by: blackmagechill on October 28, 2012, 02:29:40 pm
Worst stage? Hmm.Noobscum was probably the wrong word, badscum is probably a better choice. And Tir, what would you expect me to do in a mafia game? Look for tells, pressure on those tells, and then get the scum to reveal something incriminating. RVS isn't scum hunting, it's usually stupid questions (or when stupid questions are more likely to appear) that don't gain any real information.
So what if 'noobscum' don't crack? What will you do then, BMC? On that note, why specifically the newbies, and why doesn't it reveal much information when it is the foundation of all other dialogue and interaction of a Mafia game?
BMCIt's a reference to that BM game where you and Flying Dice were Scum and then you were scum in the next game, which led hapah to joke about you being scum in that one Roguelike game you and I were in.Tiruin: Is this the game that Hapah's right about you always being scum? Do you think your reputation will influence anyone's voting?
What?
I've a reputation?
I don't think reputation is something to believe in. What will influence others' voting is how you present your case - preferably legible, coherent and with a connection to the game you're playing. Reputation is fluff to me here.
Also, what's that about Hapah?
Playing town isn't as fun as playing scum, especially when there are four members to the scum team, and possibly SKs in a bastardly, "experimental" setup.snipThe question asked your choice, you answered if you knew commies were present or not. Then you sigh on being a Nazi? Mhmm...Why the sigh?
And on that note.The plot summary here shows they were essentially serial killers and american. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inglorious_Basterds)So American SKs, or two teams of spies unable to contact each other. But most likely american SKs.How does America factor in here?
What makes you so sure the reference to the movie at the thread title has anything to do with the presence of SKs, and American ones at that?Read the plot summary to the movie up there, it'd fit right into the movie plot. Seriously, google the material if you're wondering how it relates to the game.
Do you have any reason to be coy about claiming? Are you, perhaps, hiding something?
And I don't have anything to hide (and I have nothing hidden after I post my flavor claim below), I'm just looking at what could've been interpreted as rolefishing, and it was by me, even if only a little bit.
See, aren't we all glad to be out of RVS and have genuine suspicions?
Anyway, flavor claim below:
I am Agent Dietrich Waldemar Schmidt, 0th SS Division Officer. I infiltrate enemy camps for information gathering not by stealth or force, but by my natural charms. An ex-diplomat and a Don Juan-esque character, I have been using my skills in persuasion as my trade for the better part of my life. After being able to manipulate the staff at a German Embassy in a strategically significant country to reveal a gigantic amount of military secrets, the Fuhrer realized my important and brought me up to the 0th SS Division.
My mission is to extract a long forgotten artifact or piece of ancient technology in this very forest, although the briefing was very unspecific, and only those in high command have exact knowledge of this object.
@DeathSword: Oh, its oddly coy to be looking for signs of scummy behavior right out of the gate? I'm sorry, I guess I'll go back to asking people about their choices between two horribly flawed thought systems. What is wrong with looking for tells from the first few posts, and what, specifically with that off handed halfucasation (that's a portmanteau of half and accusation that I just made up, for clarity reasons)?
@Tiruin: What qualms do you have with claiming on D1? I'd claim miller early if it was my trait, much to your contempt it would seem. And why do you seem so eager to jump on me for all of the scummy things I've done, like pointing out what seemed like a minor tell, disliking being stuck as a vanilla member of the town (charisma is useless even in mafia it seems), and, and,.....oh wait.
It seems like I always attract waaaay too much stigma on D1.
Post by: Dariush on October 28, 2012, 02:37:23 pm
Noobscum was probably the wrong word, badscum is probably a better choice. And Tir, what would you expect me to do in a mafia game? Look for tells, pressure on those tells, and then get the scum to reveal something incriminating. RVS isn't scum hunting, it's usually stupid questions (or when stupid questions are more likely to appear) that don't gain any real information.You know, it's quite amusing to watch how you struggle to evade a direct question. Second time I ask, what was rolefishing about asking whether you would claim miller, BMC?
Post by: Tiruin on October 28, 2012, 02:56:41 pm
@Tiruin: What qualms do you have with claiming on D1? I'd claim miller early if it was my trait, much to your contempt it would seem. And why do you seem so eager to jump on me for all of the scummy things I've done, like pointing out what seemed like a minor tell, disliking being stuck as a vanilla member of the town (charisma is useless even in mafia it seems), and, and,.....oh wait.I call OMGUS.
It seems like I always attract waaaay too much stigma on D1.
Read my post first, handsome. What contempt do you see in my post? And what are you talking about by the bolded portions?
Also, how in the nine circles of hell are you thinking up the second portion? Jumpy jumpy there based on a single vote.
...
In the first day.
Easy for you to say, scumbag. Also easy to only depend on information more than anything else - because you know.Playing town isn't as fun as playing scum, especially when there are four members to the scum team, and possibly SKs in a bastardly, "experimental" setup.snipThe question asked your choice, you answered if you knew commies were present or not. Then you sigh on being a Nazi? Mhmm...Why the sigh?
I am Agent Dietrich Waldemar Schmidt, 0th SS Division Officer. I infiltrate enemy camps for information gathering not by stealth or force, but by my natural charms. An ex-diplomat and a Don Juan-esque character, I have been using my skills in persuasion as my trade for the better part of my life. After being able to manipulate the staff at a German Embassy in a strategically significant country to reveal a gigantic amount of military secrets, the Fuhrer realized my important and brought me up to the 0th SS Division.
My mission is to extract a long forgotten artifact or piece of ancient technology in this very forest, although the briefing was very unspecific, and only those in high command have exact knowledge of this object.
Because this here perfectly explains your presence here. Spy.
Post by: Teneb on October 28, 2012, 04:02:35 pm
I saw the movie, but how do you know there are SKs and the thread title isn't just that, a thread title? You are the only one here defending the possibility of SKs.What makes you so sure the reference to the movie at the thread title has anything to do with the presence of SKs, and American ones at that?Read the plot summary to the movie up there, it'd fit right into the movie plot. Seriously, google the material if you're wondering how it relates to the game.
Do you have any reason to be coy about claiming? Are you, perhaps, hiding something?
Quote
@DeathSword: Oh, its oddly coy to be looking for signs of scummy behavior right out of the gate? I'm sorry, I guess I'll go back to asking people about their choices between two horribly flawed thought systems. What is wrong with looking for tells from the first few posts, and what, specifically with that off handed halfucasation (that's a portmanteau of half and accusation that I just made up, for clarity reasons)?What is odd is that you are coy about it, as you said you were.
A quick look at [ur=http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/coyl]Wikitionary[/url] provided the following meaning to the word:
Quote
Reluctant to give details about something sensitiveSo, why are you coy?
Post by: blackmagechill on October 28, 2012, 04:47:41 pm
Because he was asking about roles fairly early, as if to gain information about my role.Noobscum was probably the wrong word, badscum is probably a better choice. And Tir, what would you expect me to do in a mafia game? Look for tells, pressure on those tells, and then get the scum to reveal something incriminating. RVS isn't scum hunting, it's usually stupid questions (or when stupid questions are more likely to appear) that don't gain any real information.You know, it's quite amusing to watch how you struggle to evade a direct question. Second time I ask, what was rolefishing about asking whether you would claim miller, BMC?
blackmagechill.
I call OMGUS.
I'd prefer to call it a pressure vote, but whatever you feel is necessary.
Read my post first, handsome. What contempt do you see in my post? And what are you talking about by the bolded portions?You are the only one who's gone this far into this line of questioning in a piss poor tunneling attempt based on my dislike of RVS, and playing vanilla town blows because you're powerless and you don't have any real power over fifty percent of the game (I'm not counting day abilities because they're weird), and the only real thing you can do is scumhunt which, while one of the more fun parts of the game, isn't as good as doing the roleblock that saved the cop.
You have picked that post and my dislike of RVS (the foundation of all other dialog and interaction) for the entire basis of your accusations against me.
Also, how in the nine circles of hell are you thinking up the second portion? Jumpy jumpy there based on a single vote.I'm not claiming you're jumpy in the sense that you've moved your vote around, I'm saying you're jumpy in the way that almost of all of your interactions have been towards me and claims of my terrible scumminess, because I have information, and some RVS/"why u ask about rolefishing" line of questioning. What information do I have that you don't?
do you think LCNP would tell the spy team "oh hey Deathsword and IronyOwl are serial killers too, so I'd kill them on D2 so they can get rid of people without you using your kill"? No, I don't think he would. I know there are four spies and some of the references are to material with including a whole bunch of american serial killers. If there was game run from some material based on D&D, wouldn't you speculate on what could show up if you weren't given a role list? I'm tossing out ideas, not alluding to some mystical list of the roles and alignments of everyone.
Easy for you to say, scumbag. Also easy to only depend on information more than anything else - because you know.Yes, I have the mystical Aryan god list of alignments and roles and I am thoroughly abusing it my arguements. What convinced you that I was absolutely certain of the fact that there were SKs? Was it the same post where I said there could be two scum teams that could be unable to communicate with each other, which was a bit referential to the source material? If you hadn't already guessed, those were ideas, not facts.
I'm going to stab you in the throat with the Spear of Destiny.snip
Because this here perfectly explains your presence here. Spy.
Post by: blackmagechill on October 28, 2012, 05:01:31 pm
BMCI'm not defending the possibility of SKs. In that same post (77, if you're interested), I tossed around the idea of two scum teams, but thought that SKs who were labeled as spies was probably more likely, because four people on a scum team is a whole lot.
I saw the movie, but how do you know there are SKs and the thread title isn't just that, a thread title? You are the only one here defending the possibility of SKs.
What is odd is that you are coy about it, as you said you were.I've been using that word wrong for quite a while it seems. I was thinking of it as being a bit more synonymous with shrewd or suspicious. I tossed out my flavor claim, and for those interested, I am a vanilla townie. My role and stuff is scattered throughout my posts, but, admittedly, still there.
A quick look at [ur=http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/coyl]Wikitionary[/url] provided the following meaning to the word:QuoteReluctant to give details about something sensitiveSo, why are you coy?
Dariush: What are you voting Hapah for? He was chainsawing for Jim, but just sticking his name in all caps in a vote post is a bit weird.
Tiruin: What bothered you so much about the flavor claim? (just a warning, I plan to extend this into a line of questioning in which I won't interact with anyone else other than RVS questions).
TolyK: Based on all of the activity up to this point, who would you inspect tonight?
DeathSword: Since you seem to be interested in my SK idea, do you think there are any third parties?
Errebody:: What did you receive as your mission?
Post by: Jim Groovester on October 28, 2012, 05:06:52 pm
Oh really? Then pray explain, why the sudden change in attitude? You've never done so in previous games.
You mean make a joke?
I've made plenty of jokes in games before. I guess you must be a humorless ball of fury all the time if you think I've never made a joke.
Because this here perfectly explains your presence here. Spy.
Actually, it doesn't. I don't follow what you're getting at.
I saw the movie, but how do you know there are SKs and the thread title isn't just that, a thread title? You are the only one here defending the possibility of SKs.
I guess you missed the part where I asked him about the movie and to speculate its relevance to the game.
You latched on hard to speculation. You took what BMC speculated and assumed that that was what he actually thought. Why did you do that?
Errebody:: What did you receive as your mission?
Find
Post by: Toaster on October 28, 2012, 10:17:33 pm
I'll put a real post in the morning, but flavor now:
I am Hilbert Hofmann, 0th SS Division Officer. I am an extremely driven person, because I am secretly very insecure. I was a fat wimpy nerd as a kid, but the teasing got me pissed off, which I funneled into incredible self-improvement. I drove myself to my limits, and graduated in math as the most in-shape person. I drove myself from the Freikorps through the regular army all the way to the 0th division through sheer will.
I'm a bit skeptical of how the unit is actually run, but I follow orders and seek to fulfill the mission. Speaking of, I'm here to find some sort of artifact or something, but only the highest command knows what we're actually after. I am still optimistic, though.
Post by: Tiruin on October 29, 2012, 01:42:09 am
Good thing you know what I'm talking about, because it really doesn't. I was waiting for his reaction to tell me more and decided to let the conclusion come from his viewpoint.Because this here perfectly explains your presence here. Spy.
Actually, it doesn't. I don't follow what you're getting at.
Quote it in its entirety, boy. Go ahead. For one who sees 'powerless' ideas, I see you're infatuated with the power of roles over the power of logic and thinking.Read my post first, handsome. What contempt do you see in my post? And what are you talking about by the bolded portions?You are the only one who's gone this far into this line of questioning in a piss poor tunneling attempt based on my dislike of RVS, and playing vanilla town blows because you're powerless and you don't have any real power over fifty percent of the game (I'm not counting day abilities because they're weird), and the only real thing you can do is scumhunt which, while one of the more fun parts of the game, isn't as good as doing the roleblock that saved the cop.
You have picked that post and my dislike of RVS (the foundation of all other dialog and interaction) for the entire basis of your accusations against me.
Trying to twist my words, or really misunderstanding sentence construction. I was referring to you by the adjective of 'Jumpy'. And no, you didn't say anything of the sort until now.Also, how in the nine circles of hell are you thinking up the second portion? Jumpy jumpy there based on a single vote.I'm not claiming you're jumpy in the sense that you've moved your vote around, I'm saying you're jumpy in the way that almost of all of your interactions have been towards me and claims of my terrible scumminess, because I have information, and some RVS/"why u ask about rolefishing" line of questioning. What information do I have that you don't?
do you think LCNP would tell the spy team "oh hey Deathsword and IronyOwl are serial killers too, so I'd kill them on D2 so they can get rid of people without you using your kill"? No, I don't think he would. I know there are four spies and some of the references are to material with including a whole bunch of american serial killers. If there was game run from some material based on D&D, wouldn't you speculate on what could show up if you weren't given a role list? I'm tossing out ideas, not alluding to some mystical list of the roles and alignments of everyone.
Also, what makes you think I'm tunneling on you? Next, why do you care so much about me focusing my attention on you?
Explain the second bolded part because I can't parse what you're saying. Why include IronyOwl?
Yeah, obviously they're ideas. What I was trying to ask was where you actually got those ideas - references or actual flavor. Also, I just looked at your post on SKs and decided to prod you on that, nothing more and nothing less.Easy for you to say, scumbag. Also easy to only depend on information more than anything else - because you know.Yes, I have the mystical Aryan god list of alignments and roles and I am thoroughly abusing it my arguements. What convinced you that I was absolutely certain of the fact that there were SKs? Was it the same post where I said there could be two scum teams that could be unable to communicate with each other, which was a bit referential to the source material? If you hadn't already guessed, those were ideas, not facts.
I tossed out my flavor claim, and for those interested, I am a vanilla townie. My role and stuff is scattered throughout my posts, but, admittedly, still there.You're denouncing your own role. Amazing.
Also on your question about me and flavor claims. Did. You. Read. My. Post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3736734#msg3736734)?
Why does it seem like you're looking at the possibilities of SKs more than the evident four?
My mission is to find more information regarding some vague sort of technology or artifact.
Post by: Tiruin on October 29, 2012, 01:58:21 am
Dariush: What are you voting Hapah for? He was chainsawing for Jim, but just sticking his name in all caps in a vote post is a bit weird.What chainsawing?
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 29, 2012, 08:00:22 am
| Jim Groovester | - 1 - | Toaster |
| Tiruin | - 1 - | blackmagechill |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Hapah |
| IronyOwl | - 1 - | Shakerag |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 1 - | Dariush |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| blackmagechill | - 2 - | IronyOwl, Tiruin |
| Deathsword | - 1 - | Jim Groovester |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 3 - | TolyK, Deathsword, Powder Miner |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
IronyOwl has been prodded a second time.
Shakerag has been prodded a second time.
Powder Miner has been prodded.
The Day will end today, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Dariush on October 29, 2012, 08:36:00 am
Because he was asking about roles fairly early, as if to gain information about my role....How can asking whether you would claim as a miller lead to him gaining information about your role?
Dariush: What are you voting Hapah for? He was chainsawing for Jim, but just sticking his name in all caps in a vote post is a bit weird....
I'm tired of this shit. You aren't reading the thread, cannot answer a simple question and a playing purely defensively, not even so much as addressing anybody who isn't attacking you in some way. Oh wait, I forgot, you sandwiched a rolefishing question to Tolyk in the middle of all your shit, which makes you a hypocrite as well. So yeah, BMC. You should appreciate the irony of noobscum getting busted on a simple question which you mentioned earlier.Dar: Regarding your questions to Jim in this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3729988#msg3729988) post, was it really worth questioning him about? One reply was a joke, and one was a request for information.What. Firstly, yes, that was worth questioning Jim about. RVS, remember? Any little thing is worth questioning about. Answering questions not directed at you is worth questioning at any time. Secondly, I don't care what his response contained. He answered questions which weren't asked to him. Isn't this a bit too early to get all chainy-sawwy, Hapah?
Post by: Teneb on October 29, 2012, 09:20:04 am
He is defending the idea of american SKs with quite a bit of conviction. Also kept claiming to be coy.I saw the movie, but how do you know there are SKs and the thread title isn't just that, a thread title? You are the only one here defending the possibility of SKs.
I guess you missed the part where I asked him about the movie and to speculate its relevance to the game.
You latched on hard to speculation. You took what BMC speculated and assumed that that was what he actually thought. Why did you do that?
BMC:
for those interested, I am a vanilla townie. My role and stuff is scattered throughout my posts, but, admittedly, still there.Why are you claiming your role now? Are you trying to make the kill-roles target someone else by saying you have no powers at all?
Quote
Dariush: What are you voting Hapah for? He was chainsawing for Jim, but just sticking his name in all caps in a vote post is a bit weird.How is Dariush chainsawing Hapah? And how is Hapah chainsawing Jim?
Quote
DeathSword: Since you seem to be interested in my SK idea, do you think there are any third parties?I am currently unsure if there are third parties or not. I couldn't find any indication on the flavour for it.
Quote
Errebody:: What did you receive as your mission?To track down a forgotten artifact or technology of some kind that the Führer believes to be key to winning the war.
Post by: Shakerag on October 29, 2012, 09:32:20 am
Post by: Tiruin on October 29, 2012, 09:56:46 am
Busy with mapmaking via GIMP and preparing for family stuff - Happy Halloween in advance you all!
=snip=So what's your mission, mien sniper?
BMC: For a vanilla townie, I'm surprised you're an Agent.
Post by: Toaster on October 29, 2012, 10:01:02 am
Tiruin:
I have no idea what we'll be doing. So I'll just take a stroll here... but obviously we have to choose a person to die. We can't not choose nor can we be indecisive, or else the Mod will choose. By the looks of it, totally random if not.
Also, why do you want to take a stroll? Feeling like you'll get away with it, punk?
What is this?
@Jim: Reasonable, but I'm under the assumption that the spies have a coverstory behind their name, though. Trying to see all viewpoints of the idea other than lacking information.
Why do you assume this? In WC1 and 2, the non-town players had an extremely brief cover given, but were forced to invent it, by and large. Why assume differently here?
Dariush:
Dariush: What are the implications of four spies in an eleven man game to you?At first I thought that this would mean the scumteam has no kill or something like that. After making the previous post and thinking about it, I realized that it's just as likely that the information about the spies is incorrect.
I, the moderator, will not lie to you.
Do you think that doesn't apply?
Dariush: What are you voting Hapah for? He was chainsawing for Jim, but just sticking his name in all caps in a vote post is a bit weird....
-snip-
...cannot answer a simple question...
Neither can you, apparently.
Jim: Why do you need my approval for a flavor claim?
BMC:
RVS isn't scum hunting
-snip-
@DeathSword: Oh, its oddly coy to be looking for signs of scummy behavior right out of the gate? I'm sorry, I guess I'll go back to asking people about their choices between two horribly flawed thought systems. What is wrong with looking for tells from the first few posts, and what, specifically with that off handed halfucasation (that's a portmanteau of half and accusation that I just made up, for clarity reasons)?
First, bullshit it isn't.
Second, you're contradicting yourself here. At first it isn't scumhunting, then suddenly you're looking for scummy behavior and tells.
@Tiruin: What qualms do you have with claiming on D1? I'd claim miller early if it was my trait, much to your contempt it would seem. And why do you seem so eager to jump on me for all of the scummy things I've done, like pointing out what seemed like a minor tell, disliking being stuck as a vanilla member of the town (charisma is useless even in mafia it seems), and, and,.....oh wait.
It seems like I always attract waaaay too much stigma on D1.
Maybe because you do scummy things; especially admitting you've done so.
I'm not claiming you're jumpy in the sense that you've moved your vote around, I'm saying you're jumpy in the way that almost of all of your interactions have been towards me and claims of my terrible scumminess, because I have information, and some RVS/"why u ask about rolefishing" line of questioning. What information do I have that you don't?
I don't think you and I have the same definition of jumpy.
((Shameless double post, I get away with it because I'm the only one who's being seriously questioned at this point)
-snip-
I've been using that word wrong for quite a while it seems. I was thinking of it as being a bit more synonymous with shrewd or suspicious. I tossed out my flavor claim, and for those interested, I am a vanilla townie. My role and stuff is scattered throughout my posts, but, admittedly, still there.
This falls under my definition of jumpy. Also, persecution complex because you think a couple votes have doomed you.
Tiruin: What bothered you so much about the flavor claim? (just a warning, I plan to extend this into a line of questioning in which I won't interact with anyone else other than RVS questions).
This is lazy, passive, and scummy. Intentionally tunneling someone, only defending self otherwise... you're not trying to hunt scum. You're trying not to get lynched. And that's what scum does.
Blackmagechill.
Post by: Dariush on October 29, 2012, 10:13:04 am
Dariush:The only information we have about the number of spies comes from flavor. I'm positive that doesn't count as 'moderator speaking'.Dariush: What are the implications of four spies in an eleven man game to you?At first I thought that this would mean the scumteam has no kill or something like that. After making the previous post and thinking about it, I realized that it's just as likely that the information about the spies is incorrect.I, the moderator, will not lie to you.
The vote was a pressure one. I wanted to know Hapah's reasons for the strange response (and I still want them).Neither can you, apparently.Dariush: What are you voting Hapah for? He was chainsawing for Jim, but just sticking his name in all caps in a vote post is a bit weird....
-snip-
...cannot answer a simple question...
Post by: Toaster on October 29, 2012, 10:14:31 am
The only information we have about the number of spies comes from flavor. I'm positive that doesn't count as 'moderator speaking'.
Fair enough.
The vote was a pressure one. I wanted to know Hapah's reasons for the strange response (and I still want them).
Why answer when I ask and not BMC?
Post by: IronyOwl on October 29, 2012, 10:20:51 am
blackmagechill:
This doesn't explain anything. You're dodging around whether you're a miller or not while claiming a hypothetical question counts as rolefishing. What about his question struck you as rolefishing, and why were you so jumpy about your miller status?blackmagechill:I wouldn't tend to consider miller status rolefishing accusation worthy. Why so coy about this?blackmagechill: If you were a miller, would you claim in your first post?HMM, that's a good question, along with a bit of rolefishing in there. Curious? I'd probably claim pretty early, because its in my best interest to not seem suspicious and not waste town inspects and/or lynches on myself. Early claiming also keeps people from calling you out on claiming to avoid a lynch after your scumbuddy got in trouble.
Just generally being a coy person and an eagerness to get out of RVS, really. This is probably the worst stage in the game because it doesn't reveal much information unless noobscum cracks under a vote.
What does any of this have to do with getting out of RVS quickly or how terrible it is?
Powder Miner:
So, simpering yesmanship is the only answer here?Because there's only one answer to the question and it frankly seems pointless to answer it. But if you really want an answer: Yes, he did the right thing.What do you hope to gain by asking a flavor question, in specific that one? You might as well ask "Are you scum?".Is there a reason you didn't answer it?
Deathsword:
IO:I was more wondering why the options were Nazi or non-spy commie. What was that distinction supposed to accomplish?Deathsword:RVS question. Also to see if BMC changed from the last time I was in a game with him.BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?What was the point of this question?
Post by: Dariush on October 29, 2012, 10:38:14 am
Why answer when I ask and not BMC?When he initially asked the question, I thought that the answer was pretty much contained in the quote I gave him, but after you repeated his question I decided that it was not so and warranted an elaboration.
Way to bandwagon BMC for a single (stolen) reason, IO. Any other suspects?
Post by: Shakerag on October 29, 2012, 10:42:49 am
I am Arndt Reiner Sachs, 0th SS Division Officer.
I am one of the more senior officers in the 0th SS Division, but despite that I have not been given specific information as to what we're set out to find, and that greatly irks me. Despite being frustrated about the lack of information, I have great faith and trust in the Führer's vision for the future. I have a strong sense of principles which lead me to be very loyal to those whom I trust and my superiors. That, combined with a mind which is single-purposed and lacking in creativity, makes me an excellent fit for the military, sans espionage.
(I'm not sure that I necessarily agree with that, but that's what it says O_o)
Also, my mission is to find some forgotten artifact and/or technology in this forest.
Shakerag: Who do you think the third party would be, if there is one? (I'm betting it's an homage to Inglorious Basterds if there is one)I'm not familiar with the movie (book?), so I can't say on that regard. And, well, I'm not too sharp on my WWII history either, so if there was a third party ... maybe a solo Nazi defector?
ShakeragA jester would seem to be kind of out of place in this setting, given the flavor. However, if we did have one for whatever reason (also keeping in mind that I'm really unfamiliar with seeing a jester role in action), I'd say they have about as equal chances in this format as any other. I think third parties are unlikely based on my previous responses, but if there was any, I think it'd be along the lines of what I detailed above.
Would you think a jester would be more likely to win in this format? What about other third parties? Do you think they will even appear?
Shakerag:Yes. It's nice to see the ol' tried-and-true shaken up a bit every now and then. I think it keeps us on our toes.Shakerag: How bastardly do you expect this game to be?... I'm thinking there will be at least a handful of unexpected things.
Do you consider that a good thing?
ShakeragI tried to pick two semi-random things roughly equal in power to get a read on your thought process.Tiruin: You're a spy and it's N1. You can choose to be untargetable or use a roleblock. Which do you pick?Hmm, my choice most likely depends on how well I played the game. If untargetable - then I am unsure about my day game and may have messed up, or will have drawn attention to myself, or have a reputation among the mafia players. If roleblock, then no connection to day game other than the fact that I can mess with those silly Nazis.
So Roleblock.
...Why those two choices?
Unvote while I reread. I think that's all the questions directed at me for now.
Post by: Tiruin on October 29, 2012, 10:45:36 am
@First: My answer and snark to TolyK, (I mean, walk around when the Kommandant is watching? That was mostly to emphasize my question below that including my answer.)I have no idea what we'll be doing. So I'll just take a stroll here... but obviously we have to choose a person to die. We can't not choose nor can we be indecisive, or else the Mod will choose. By the looks of it, totally random if not.
Also, why do you want to take a stroll? Feeling like you'll get away with it, punk?
What is this?@Jim: Reasonable, but I'm under the assumption that the spies have a coverstory behind their name, though. Trying to see all viewpoints of the idea other than lacking information.
Why do you assume this? In WC1 and 2, the non-town players had an extremely brief cover given, but were forced to invent it, by and large. Why assume differently here?
@Second: I didn't read anything of LNCP's games [WC1 & 2 by the looks of it] and I'm not using any meta in my ideas. Also, since LNCP did state the exact number, I was under the assumption [blame classic spy novels instead of what people see as the reference material] that the infiltrators can't be compromised by...flavor. Cover stories//identity shift and all that.
PPE: Irony/Dariush/Shakerag
Dariush: Your mission as requested?
Post by: IronyOwl on October 29, 2012, 10:55:18 am
Way to bandwagon BMC for a single (stolen) reason, IO. Any other suspects?Way to not have any fucking idea what's going on. I'll give you a chance to go back and figure out where you went wrong and report back to me.
As for other suspects, no real ones.
Post by: Teneb on October 29, 2012, 11:14:17 am
Deathsword:At the time I thought, based on the questions of others, that commies would be the 3rd party. The question was basically: "would you rather be town or third party?".IO:I was more wondering why the options were Nazi or non-spy commie. What was that distinction supposed to accomplish?Deathsword:RVS question. Also to see if BMC changed from the last time I was in a game with him.BMC: If you could choose between being a commie or a nazi (but not a spy), which would you choose?What was the point of this question?
Post by: Tiruin on October 29, 2012, 11:25:14 am
What is going on here.
Post by: Dariush on October 29, 2012, 11:34:52 am
Dariush: Your mission as requested?Sorry, missed this the previous time. I'm tracking down some artefact in the forest.
Dariush:Ooh! Ooh! I know this one! Let me guess: you lurked the fuck out of this game, then came out of nowhere without as much as excusing yourself for your absence, bandwagoned the guy with the most votes on him for a single reason that you shamelessly stole from me and instead of admitting it you started playing tough-guy. Am I right?Way to bandwagon BMC for a single (stolen) reason, IO. Any other suspects?Way to not have any fucking idea what's going on. I'll give you a chance to go back and figure out where you went wrong and report back to me.
As for other suspects, no real ones.Just to confirm my words. Lazy, lurking, bandwagoning scum.
Post by: Shakerag on October 29, 2012, 11:41:23 am
Anyway, flavor claim below:blackmagechill: This smells like a fakeclaim. Why would you, a supposed loyal German, be manipulating staff at a German embassy for military secrets? Unless I'm understanding something incorrectly, that sounds fishy to me. Also something about being a diplomat and suddenly being plucked from that and put into the 0th SS? It looks like all the other flavor claims have solid backgrounds as to why we're in the military and then 0th SS, but your claim doesn't seem to fit.
I am Agent Dietrich Waldemar Schmidt, 0th SS Division Officer. I infiltrate enemy camps for information gathering not by stealth or force, but by my natural charms. An ex-diplomat and a Don Juan-esque character, I have been using my skills in persuasion as my trade for the better part of my life. After being able to manipulate the staff at a German Embassy in a strategically significant country to reveal a gigantic amount of military secrets, the Fuhrer realized my important and brought me up to the 0th SS Division.
My mission is to extract a long forgotten artifact or piece of ancient technology in this very forest, although the briefing was very unspecific, and only those in high command have exact knowledge of this object.
Post by: IronyOwl on October 29, 2012, 11:46:43 am
Nope! I was the very first person on BMC, for precisely the reasons I'm still on him. You stole my reasoning.Dariush:Ooh! Ooh! I know this one! Let me guess: you lurked the fuck out of this game, then came out of nowhere without as much as excusing yourself for your absence, bandwagoned the guy with the most votes on him for a single reason that you shamelessly stole from me and instead of admitting it you started playing tough-guy. Am I right?Way to bandwagon BMC for a single (stolen) reason, IO. Any other suspects?Way to not have any fucking idea what's going on. I'll give you a chance to go back and figure out where you went wrong and report back to me.
Admittedly, I have not been giving this game the attention it deserves.As for other suspects, no real ones.Just to confirm my words. Lazy, lurking, bandwagoning scum.
Post by: Powder Miner on October 29, 2012, 06:25:15 pm
Powder Miner: So in short, you say that flavor has a role in questioning, other than what Jim said?It can, yes. If someone screws up whilst claiming their flavor, they'll be very dead. As it is, BMC's screwed up, and I've found yet another hole in his claim.
I infiltrate enemy campsYes, I bet you do, blackmagechill. Much like our camp.
IronyOwl:
Yes, "simpering yesmanship" was the only way to answer that question, much like the question "Are you town?".
Post by: Tiruin on October 29, 2012, 10:11:48 pm
Ok...why are you voting BMC again?I infiltrate enemy campsYes, I bet you do, blackmagechill. Much like our camp.
Post by: lordnincompoop on October 30, 2012, 06:52:09 am
Night 1 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 1 - | blackmagechill |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Hapah |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| blackmagechill | - 6 - | IronyOwl, Tiruin, Dariush, Toaster, Shakerag, Powder Miner |
| Deathsword | - 1 - | Jim Groovester |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 2 - | TolyK, Deathsword, |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The Kommandant is bored.
Reclining atop a crate with his feet, outstretched, resting on another, he smokes a long cigarette. Nestled in the webbing of his fingers, he draws it to his mouth and takes a long drag, the ember at its ashen tip glowing hotter and brighter in reply – the smoke he would let escape through his nose in two slow jets, the grey tendrils writhing about it the air and grasping at nothings. Silvery clouds would build up on each side of his face – the fog of smoke would hide his features save for the cigarette's glowing tip, a lone mote of light at its centre.
His hand would, occasionally, appear from the cloud to flick some ashes onto the ground, then disappear again. When there was only a butt left, and the butt too small to be pinched, he would throw it onto the ground. There lay a few dozen already scattered about the ground, some trodden into the dirt, others fresher and perhaps still smouldering – skeletons strewn about, broken corpses crushed under the weight of a giant, resting, proud, victorious once again and amused, growing listless, feeling bored once again.
His eyes, veiled, stare at the commotion building in the centre of the camp. The rabble of boys had begun arguing almost immediately, and even now, with the sun coming down, they had lost none of their feverish energy.
He checked his watch. “Eight,” he muttered, rising with some reluctance. The time had come.
The group quietens as they see his approach. One by one, they turn to face him.
“Who will be shot?”
Silence.
“Who will be shot?” His voice hardens, his words chill the air.
The silence, frozen, stifles. The boys struggle for breath.
He glares at them, his jaw clenched. “Fine.” He draws his revolver, cocks it and-
The group suddenly erupts in hurried whispers, quiet argument. The Kommandant, amused, lowers his revolver. He picks up a whisper from the group – “Schmidt. Offizier Schmidt.” Eventually, the whisperings build up to a chorus of voices – and at its climax, he hears a voice speak the bottled wishes of the group, at last, “Schmidt! Kill Schmidt!”
A crack of gunfire. The Kommandant barely moved, but Dietrich Schmidt had already crumpled to the ground. His body still warm, blood still weakly pulsing, they rifled through his belongings, disheartened at first.
But then, they found it – a passport, cleverly hidden in a secret patch inside his trousers. It was American.
“We have killed a spy, but that is not enough. This mission is still compromised, and they are still here. We cannot continue with it until we are sure of their extinction. We will not continue the search for the artefact yet – go and rest now, in your tents. You will choose someone else to shoot tomorrow.”
The group disperses, leaving the Kommandant with the corpse and the passport. He opens it, flicking through it.
“ ‘Brett Parker’. Interesting name.”
Then he leaves, stuffing the leather booklet into his pocket.
Dietrich Waldemar "blackmagechill" Schmidt was lynched! He was a Spy.
The Night will end Thursday, 8PM GMT.
sorry about the lateness
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 01, 2012, 03:09:13 pm
Day 2 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 10 - | IronyOwl, Tiruin, Toaster, Toaster, Shakerag, Powder Miner, Jim Groovester, TolyK, Deathsword, Hapah |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
Today, the camp is quiet.
The soldiers’ spirits, shaken into silence, are still in shock at the deaths of yesterday morning, still horrified at the discovery of spies. This morning, they gather in solemn quiet; murmurs of suspicions and secret conference, yet to take full root in their hearts, spread amongst them - a blanket, not soft and comforting, but cold, suffocating, a rough, uncomfortable truth that they in their half-woken states struggle to kick away but simultaneously cling to and are wrapped in, a treacherous thought that will not let go.
The Kommandant, exiting his tent, much the same as yesterday, surveys the senior officers walking down the rows, checking for presence, hunting down deserters. When none are found, he nods, seemingly satisfied.
"I know that you are all shaken from yesterday's events.
"I know it is not easy to lose a fellow soldier in such a manner; I know how painful it is. We have lost three good men - some of the best, many would say. No amount of words can bring them back, but know that their deaths were not in vain. Know that they will be remembered, and mourned when the time comes."
He pauses.
"I remember, once when I was a younger commander, standing watch with one of the men who perished yesterday. It was a night shift, and a very quiet one; there was nobody awake but us in the camp, and up in the watch tower, we had nothing but each other, a pot of cold coffee and an old gas lamp to keep us company. I was glad it was him - we talked, happily, all night, about the world. He told me of his children, three girls, and I could see how his face lit up as he described each one to me; Helga, with the curly locks that fell gently around her shoulders, Kathrin with the cutest dimples and Heidrun, the boyish one with freckles on the face and scratches on her knees. His praise of them had no end, and with me, sitting there next to him, I could do nothing but listen and feel the joy, a reflection of a reflection of what he likely truly felt. He was a good man, and compassionate, and they will be missed sorely. All of them.
"As for the spy - yes, it is difficult to face the fact that one of your number was a traitor. In this unit, we try to keep close, brotherly bonds, and as such many of us knew him as a friend and as a fine comrade. We ate together, drank together, stood watch together, and we fought together. Though some of you are newer than others, less experienced, we have all shared a few years together, and doubtless that means something. If you are conflicted, do not fear; it is hard to break such bonds even in the light of deception.
"Do not forget your station here. You are the best that this nation has to offer - your hardships, then, will be all the more difficult. Though it may be difficult to grasp it, you must remember: The spies, though they act like our friends, and may have done so for long, are not our own. They would destroy us given the chance.
"Be brave, men and live up to the name of the 0th Division. We must find these spies."
The Day will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 02, 2012, 07:04:50 am
Post by: Tiruin on November 02, 2012, 07:15:32 am
Post by: TolyK on November 02, 2012, 07:51:02 am
Post by: Toaster on November 02, 2012, 08:12:56 am
Spoiler: Jim (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Powder (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: TolyK (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Tiruin (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Deathsword (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Dariush (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Hapah (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: BMC, Spy (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Toaster (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Irony (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Shakerag (click to show/hide)
Irony: How old is your character?
Shakerag: Why did you feel the need to mention you were bad at espionage?
Jim: Still waiting on an answer (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3740176#msg3740176).
Powder: That BMC vote looked lazy. Who is your top suspect now and why?
Post by: Dariush on November 02, 2012, 09:36:51 am
Hey PM, riddle me this: who's bandwagoning and bussing scum and is named Powder Miner?
Shakerag, you've done basically nothing for the entire game. Post #66 was RVS question, then came a claim, multiple answers to questions and a parroty BMC vote. What are your suspicions?
IO, I admit I forgot about you attacking BMC, but still you haven't done anything useful since #73, and even admit so. Same question.
Post by: Teneb on November 02, 2012, 04:33:47 pm
Tiruin: Based on BMC's flavour and flip (and since you were the one who accused him of being a spy over his flavour), what things on one's flavour would indicate them being a spy to you?
Post by: Shakerag on November 02, 2012, 05:18:55 pm
Post by: Jim Groovester on November 02, 2012, 07:25:54 pm
Jim: Why do you need my approval for a flavor claim?
I suppose I don't, really.
I did want to bring it up before going through with it, because Day 1 mass claims, even just for flavor, are risky ideas to bring up and go against habit for most mafia players. Cf. Tiruin's initial opposition to the mass flavor claim.
Yes, I bet you do, blackmagechill. Much like our camp.
Powder Miner, why are you lazily bandwagoning like a lazy bandwagoner?
Post by: Tiruin on November 02, 2012, 09:24:54 pm
So...about that attention.Admittedly, I have not been giving this game the attention it deserves.As for other suspects, no real ones.Just to confirm my words. Lazy, lurking, bandwagoning scum.
What are your reads on everyone?
Powder Miner
Ok...why are you voting BMC again?I infiltrate enemy campsYes, I bet you do, blackmagechill. Much like our camp.
Reasoning behind this vote?
How, exactly, did BMC screw up?Powder Miner: So in short, you say that flavor has a role in questioning, other than what Jim said?It can, yes. If someone screws up whilst claiming their flavor, they'll be very dead. As it is, BMC's screwed up, and I've found yet another hole in his claim.
Toaster
Irony: How old is your character?How does age matter?
Hapah
Quote
I am Leo Leopold Schultze, 0th SS Division Officer. I am a natural leader and rallier, and beloved by the men in my command. Whether it was in the military or elsewhere, everyone would instinctively trust me and rely on me for support, and my charisma and personal presence rallied those around me to my cause and served as a powerful voice. Being the eldest son of four children, I was long accustomed to being in the role of nurturer and guardian. In the military, I served as the emotional pillar on which many of your friends – and I made many friends, quickly – would lean on. During missions, I was invariably in charge – the shepherd, leading the flock. My commanders felt threatened by me, and sent me on the most dangerous missions, from which I always returned.
As a last resort, my commanders fabricated a case and reported me to the SS. Himmler himself intervened, and recruited me into the 0th.
"Your" friends?
Post by: Shakerag on November 03, 2012, 12:37:09 am
Shakerag, you've done basically nothing for the entire game. Post #66 was RVS question, then came a claim, multiple answers to questions and a parroty BMC vote. What are your suspicions?
Currently, none. At least, I think so. I think I need to reread. When I'm more sober, of course. It's been a ... rough day.
Shakerag: Why did you feel the need to mention you were bad at espionage?Because it was part of my flavor? And we were flavor claiming? Obviously you are insinuating that I included that part as some obvious ploy to state that there is no way I could possibly be a spy because I am including that "I am bad at espionage" as part of my flavor. However, it is truly the case that my flavor indeed said that. That part makes sense, but some of the rest of my flavor I had a mental "wtf" momen about.
Jim: Why does your vote on Pm look so much like Dariushes'? Do you have anything other than bandwagoning on him?
Post by: Tiruin on November 03, 2012, 01:22:22 am
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 03, 2012, 02:43:45 am
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Powder Miner | - 1 - | Jim Groovester, |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 10 - | IronyOwl, Tiruin, Toaster, Toaster, Shakerag, Powder Miner, TolyK, Deathsword, Hapah |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
IronyOwl is eligible for replacement.
Powder Miner is eligible for replacement.
Hapah has been prodded.
blackmagechill has been prodded.
The Day will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Tiruin on November 03, 2012, 04:51:50 am
...
Ok...what happened to Dariush.
Post by: Dariush on November 03, 2012, 05:15:58 am
Quote
Toaster, Toaster,Mod, please confirm that the votecount is correct.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 03, 2012, 06:04:25 am
QuoteToaster, Toaster,Mod, please confirm that the votecount is correct.
The votecount is correct.
Post by: IronyOwl on November 03, 2012, 06:19:04 am
IronyOwl:Why? What about the Commandant executing three people is so obviously correct that any disagreement whatsoever is tantamount to admitting to being scum?
Yes, "simpering yesmanship" was the only way to answer that question, much like the question "Are you town?".
Toaster:
Irony: How old is your character?Don't know. There were apparently "years" between schooling and the next war, so I'd guess reasonably young but not exactly fresh out of school.
Dariush:
IO, I admit I forgot about you attacking BMC, but still you haven't done anything useful since #73, and even admit so. Same question.By which you mean you forgot your vote was a bandwagon copy of mine?
I don't know what "same question" is supposed to mean.
Tiruin:
IronyOwlUhhh... uhhhh...Admittedly, I have not been giving this game the attention it deserves.So...about that attention.
What are your reads on everyone?
Dariush is being an imbecile but I've got a peculiar reason to suspect he's town.
Powder Miner I'm suspicious of for simpering yesmanship and his bandwagon at the end.
Deathsword I don't like for reasons I'll get into in a minute. I don't see how he could be BMC's scumbuddy after leaping on him that early and with that little provocation, but he still bugs me.
...working on the rest.
Deathsword:
What makes you so sure the reference to the movie at the thread title has anything to do with the presence of SKs, and American ones at that?Why did you completely and consistently miss that BMC was talking about SKs because he was asked about them? When, if ever, did you figure that part out, and why didn't you ever address it formally?
Do you have any reason to be coy about claiming? Are you, perhaps, hiding something?Were you trying to encourage him to roleclaim, here?
I am a member of the "old guard", a veteran of WW1 and one of the few soldier kept in the Deutsches Heer during the inter-war period.Did you PM mention the Deutsches Heer by name?
Why didn't you vote anyone outside RVS yesterday?
Hapah:
My commanders felt threatened by me, and sent me on the most dangerous missions, from which I always returned.This bit seems a bit grandiose and elaborate, doesn't it?
As a last resort, my commanders fabricated a case and reported me to the SS. Himmler himself intervened, and recruited me into the 0th.
Toaster, did you eat Dariush's vote?
Post by: Dariush on November 03, 2012, 06:32:25 am
By which you mean you forgot your vote was a bandwagon copy of mine?Uhhh...
You: Put an RVS question, disappear for eternity, come back, steal my case on BMC.
Me: Take BMC's answer to your question, construct a case across several posts (while you were still absent), watch as you steal my case.
Are you completely certain that it's me who is bandwagoning, you fucking shithole?
I don't know what "same question" is supposed to mean.Do you have eyes? The question that is literally two lines above yours. One of those lines is empty, by the way. What are your suspicions? And in addition, are you not reading anything that isn't explicitly addressed to you?
Dariush is being an imbecile but I've got a peculiar reason to suspect he's town....Really? An imbecile? Pray tell me how. Was it the extremely stupid decision to agree that some small part of what you're doing (asking a question that led to my case on BMC) isn't a sign of lurking, lazy, bandwagoning, bussing scum? It was the extremely stupid decision to agree that some small part of what you're doing (asking a question that led to my case on BMC) isn't a sign of lurking, lazy, bandwagoning, bussing scum, wasn't it.
And, just in case that my vote still somehow counts, but isn't displayed, IO.
Post by: Tiruin on November 03, 2012, 07:41:24 am
I- huh? So Dariush has lost his vote, but can be voted. Toaster, meanwhile, has somehow gained a vote (which looks like it replaced Dariush's spot OR stolen vote).QuoteToaster, Toaster,Mod, please confirm that the votecount is correct.
The votecount is correct.
...
Toaster: Do you know what happened to your vote?
Tiruin:Real life strikes again. D:IronyOwlUhhh... uhhhh...Admittedly, I have not been giving this game the attention it deserves.So...about that attention.
What are your reads on everyone?
Dariush is being an imbecile but I've got a peculiar reason to suspect he's town.
Powder Miner I'm suspicious of for simpering yesmanship and his bandwagon at the end.
Deathsword I don't like for reasons I'll get into in a minute. I don't see how he could be BMC's scumbuddy after leaping on him that early and with that little provocation, but he still bugs me.
...working on the rest.
About Dariush - how is being an imbecile related to being 'town'?
And, just in case that my vote still somehow counts, but isn't displayed, IO.Do I detect OMGUS on being called a Nazi Imbecile?
Did being called an imbecile need incite a reaction like that?
Post by: Tiruin on November 03, 2012, 07:44:41 am
Preview button. Must die.
Toaster: What happened to your vote?Welp. This should be fixed as the above.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 03, 2012, 08:16:54 am
Post by: Teneb on November 03, 2012, 10:40:21 am
Deathsword:I didn't. I kept asking him why he was so sure there was a SK, how he knew they were americans.What makes you so sure the reference to the movie at the thread title has anything to do with the presence of SKs, and American ones at that?Why did you completely and consistently miss that BMC was talking about SKs because he was asked about them? When, if ever, did you figure that part out, and why didn't you ever address it formally?
Quote
No, he claimed and then said he was coy. I questioned him on that.Do you have any reason to be coy about claiming? Are you, perhaps, hiding something?Were you trying to encourage him to roleclaim, here?
Quote
Yes, it did.I am a member of the "old guard", a veteran of WW1 and one of the few soldier kept in the Deutsches Heer during the inter-war period.Did you PM mention the Deutsches Heer by name?
Quote
Why didn't you vote anyone outside RVS yesterday?I was hoping that BMC would answer the questions I asked him before he was lynched. I think I could have aquired some more information from him had he answered.
Tiruin: Could you please answer the question I asked in my last post? (post #139)
Post by: Tiruin on November 03, 2012, 10:44:50 am
Small post, but I've been rather busy.
Tiruin: Based on BMC's flavour and flip (and since you were the one who accused him of being a spy over his flavour), what things on one's flavour would indicate them being a spy to you?
Well, the fact that he had 'Agent' as a title which deviated from the rest roused my suspicion so I decided to prod him on that, followed by inconsistency with knowledge (like incomplete reasoning and OP-ness with the role, but I'm not that well versed in WWII stuff so it was a hunch at first)
That is the single signifying detail I got there though.
Post by: Hapah on November 03, 2012, 12:44:35 pm
Tir:
"Your" friends?My mistake, should be "my".
IO:
Quote from: IO
Hapah:I guess? It is what it is, though. My role PM was awesome.My commanders felt threatened by me, and sent me on the most dangerous missions, from which I always returned.This bit seems a bit grandiose and elaborate, doesn't it?
As a last resort, my commanders fabricated a case and reported me to the SS. Himmler himself intervened, and recruited me into the 0th.
Toaster: Did you learn anything from gathering all the flavor together?
Post by: Jim Groovester on November 03, 2012, 09:19:59 pm
Urist Imiknorris has replaced Powder Miner.
Blergh.
Imiknorris, why did Powder Miner look like lazy bandwagoning scum? Is it because he was, and by extension, you are, lazy bandwagoning scum?
Jim: Why does your vote on Pm look so much like Dariushes'? Do you have anything other than bandwagoning on him?
Because I happen to share the same opinion about Powder Miner as he did for the same reason.
PM hasn't done much besides bandwagon for a horrible reason (and also get replaced), so no, not much else.
I- huh?
Is there a reason why Dariush missing his vote has you so flabbergasted?
I didn't. I kept asking him why he was so sure there was a SK, how he knew they were americans.
Holy shit I still can't believe this.
How the fuck are you so sure that he was speaking from a position of certainty rather than speculation?
Because it sure as hell looked like speculation to me, since I asked him to speculate about it.
Post by: Teneb on November 03, 2012, 09:39:42 pm
Which he then kept defending over and over again.I didn't. I kept asking him why he was so sure there was a SK, how he knew they were americans.
Holy shit I still can't believe this.
How the fuck are you so sure that he was speaking from a position of certainty rather than speculation?
Because it sure as hell looked like speculation to me, since I asked him to speculate about it.
Post by: Jim Groovester on November 03, 2012, 09:48:47 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 03, 2012, 10:30:15 pm
I'd assume he looked as such because he voted a popular target without presenting much substance behind it, and then got replaced for inactivity. If you're asking why he did that, ask him.Urist Imiknorris has replaced Powder Miner.
Blergh.
Imiknorris, why did Powder Miner look like lazy bandwagoning scum? Is it because he was, and by extension, you are, lazy bandwagoning scum?
Gonna read through the thread tomorrow morning.
Post by: Tiruin on November 03, 2012, 10:33:20 pm
Not flabbergasted, it's may way of formatting that I was surprised to see Toaster getting two votes, and Dariush having none yet being voteable. It (hopefully) answers another question - flavor doesn't count that much, as LNCP hasn't even hinted anything along the lines of vote or anything.I- huh?
Is there a reason why Dariush missing his vote has you so flabbergasted?
Quotes? And how defending?Which he then kept defending over and over again.I didn't. I kept asking him why he was so sure there was a SK, how he knew they were americans.
Holy shit I still can't believe this.
How the fuck are you so sure that he was speaking from a position of certainty rather than speculation?
Because it sure as hell looked like speculation to me, since I asked him to speculate about it.
PPE: O hai UI.
UI: What is your general take on this game and its set-up?
Jim: What were you expecting in your question to UI who hasn't said anything beforehand?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 04, 2012, 11:10:29 am
IronyOwl: When did you make your case, and when did Dariush steal it? Links, please.
Shakerag:
That part makes sense, but some of the rest of my flavor I had a mental "wtf" moment about.Examples, please.
Tiruin:
UI: What is your general take on this game and its set-up?I doubt all four spies are working together, as that would be somewhat broken in scum's favor. If they're opposing scumteams, that would require two blocked kills last night, which I find unlikely. So right now I'm running with the theory that there's a three-man team and a third party.
Post by: Tiruin on November 04, 2012, 11:21:14 am
So compared to what I've seen from WC2, comparing meta affects this game?UI: What is your general take on this game and its set-up?I doubt all four spies are working together, as that would be somewhat broken in scum's favor. If they're opposing scumteams, that would require two blocked kills last night, which I find unlikely. So right now I'm running with the theory that there's a three-man team and a third party.
Also, the third-party means...?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 04, 2012, 11:33:22 am
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 1 - | Deathsword |
| Toaster | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 2 - | Jim Groovester, IronyOwl |
| Hapah | - 1 - | Urist Imiknorris |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 5 - | Toaster, Toaster, Shakerag, TolyK, Hapah |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
TolyK has been prodded.
Toaster has been prodded.
Shakerag has been prodded.
The Day will end tomorrow, 8PM GMT.
Post by: TolyK on November 04, 2012, 02:52:45 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 04, 2012, 03:04:26 pm
Post.
I will not count this as activity if I need to throw you the second prod.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 04, 2012, 05:44:26 pm
Post.You first.
Post by: Toaster on November 04, 2012, 09:56:49 pm
Let's test on TolyK because he's being intentionally useless; curious if this is two votes or a double vote. TolyK, you can consider this a real vote until you actually do something instead of being a useless McUselessson.
Dariush: Did you get any vote-related flavor?
Irony: Fair enough on age.
Powder Miner:IronyOwl:Why? What about the Commandant executing three people is so obviously correct that any disagreement whatsoever is tantamount to admitting to being scum?
Yes, "simpering yesmanship" was the only way to answer that question, much like the question "Are you town?".
What does this mean?
Deathsword: Considering your question to Tiruin (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3752861#msg3752861), how important is finding scum via flavor in comparison to traditional scumhunting?
Tiruin:
ToasterIrony: How old is your character?How does age matter?
The way he described his claim, I wasn't sure how old he's claiming to be- someone humiliated by WWI probably wasn't six at the time. I want to make sure it's consistent. Being old in an elite military unit is unusual in my opinion, but it's not really something to base an attack on- Deathsword's claimed as a WWI vet, for example.
UI: If you think there's a three man team and a third party, which was BMC?
Hapah:
Toaster: Did you learn anything from gathering all the flavor together?
Nope, other than the question generated to Irony. But if I need to refer back to it, it's there.
Post by: Hapah on November 04, 2012, 11:51:45 pm
Hapah: Now that you're feeling better, who do you suspect? Why?I need to reread and see if anyone stuck up for BMC. The Powder Miner bandwagon thing is blown out of proportion a little bit, I think.
There is one thing that has been troubling me a little, though, and I'd like an opinion for those who have been in LNCP games before. I've been trying to put together what sort of non-spy enemies we face (if there are just the spies and townies I'll be surprised). What shape would a 3rd party be, and what do the spies want? My best guess at the moment is that we want to recover it, spies want to destroy/steal it, and any 3rd parties probably want to use it. I had that in mind when I was going back over Toaster's flavor list, and Tolyk's claim (below) makes me a little uneasy.
Quote from: Tolyk Flavor Claim
I am Vester Meine Schneider, a 0th SS Division Officer. I believe that the strong should take power. I've worked through the ranks of the SS and was noticed by the Führer. He asked me what I wanted to achieve, to which I replied that the strong should take power - this impressed him enough that he promoted me to the 0th SS. And here I am, helping the strong (such as myself and my nation) to take power.Normally I wouldn't give it another thought, but what I've read of WC1 and what others have said about how flavor-heavy and flavor-relevant LNCP games are gives me pause. If anyone would attempt to seize power for himself, it'd be someone like above. Should I be concerned about this? Do you think it's relevant?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 05, 2012, 12:27:57 am
UI: If you think there's a three man team and a third party, which was BMC?Insufficient data.
Hapah:
Toaster: Alright. (And yeah, good call on putting it all in one place; I do the same in some other games. I wonder if we can get all the full PMs together in one place at game end, if they're anything like mine they're extremely well-written.)Yes it is. Does it even count as a bandwagon if it's only two votes?Hapah: Now that you're feeling better, who do you suspect? Why?I need to reread and see if anyone stuck up for BMC. The Powder Miner bandwagon thing is blown out of proportion a little bit, I think.
Is sticking up for BMC the only thing you're looking for?
Tiruin:
So compared to what I've seen from WC2, comparing meta affects this game?No idea what you're asking, but I'll answer my best guess. Yes, I do feel comparing this to the mod's previous games is valid.
Quote
Also, the third-party means...?A spy who is not on a team with the other spies and presumably has a different goal. You know, the definition of third party.
Post by: Dariush on November 05, 2012, 03:16:50 am
Do I detect OMGUS on being called a Nazi Imbecile?Since when is a vote-that-probably-doesn't-count in response to a lazy scum calling me an imbecile without any reason while voting someone else is considered OMGUS?
Did being called an imbecile need incite a reaction like that?Yes, you scum.
Post by: Dariush on November 05, 2012, 03:20:02 am
Dariush: Did you get any vote-related flavor?Nope.
A spy who is not on a team with the other spies and presumably has a different goal. You know, the definition of third party.Why are you so certain the third party must be a spy?
Post.Because explanations, excuses, even a simple PFP or a 'No time, will post later' notices are for noobs, right?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 05, 2012, 07:45:18 am
a) Because my theory of a three-man team leaves one spy unaccounted for.A spy who is not on a team with the other spies and presumably has a different goal. You know, the definition of third party.Why are you so certain the third party must be a spy?
b) This is speculation, so certainty is not a thing.
Since when is a vote-that-probably-doesn't-count in response to a lazy scum calling me an imbecile without any reason while voting someone else is considered OMGUS?I agree with Tiruin on this one. Riddle me this, Batman: Despite having an actual case on IronyOwl, you cited the insult as your reason for voting him. Which is more important in your eyes, his bandwagon or the fact that he called you an imbecile?
Post by: Teneb on November 05, 2012, 08:54:03 am
Deathsword: Considering your question to Tiruin (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3752861#msg3752861), how important is finding scum via flavor in comparison to traditional scumhunting?Considering BMC's flavour, how it said he was good at infiltration, and his flip, I'd say that it might play a part in scumhunting. But I think traditional scumhunting is still going to be the main way of finding the spies.
Tiruin: I'll give you the quotes later today when I have more time.
Post by: Hapah on November 05, 2012, 10:18:56 am
UI: Not the only one; just the obvious one. I doubt I'll be that lucky, though.
Post by: Hapah on November 05, 2012, 11:00:51 am
I'll reread what I can and put up a vote, and a post, during lunch.
Post by: Shakerag on November 05, 2012, 11:01:16 am
@Shakerag: You can bandwagon with 2 votes? In addition, you can bandwagon with more than 2 days of ample time remaining?Okay, clearly I am not terribly clear when posting after drinking. What I was trying to say at that time was: "Jim - are you voting PM for any reason beyond stating that he (PM) is bandwagoning?"
Shakerag:Well, I mentioned some of it before. Like, why would having a single-focused, driven, yet uncreative mind be a very valuable trait in the military. I'd think having some amount of creativity would be good for being able to react dynamically in combat. (I will admit that I could be way off base here, not having any military experience personally.) Or why my flavor connects being very athletic in in my youth with joining the military and rising through the ranks as a "natural" course of action. (Again, not personally seeing the connection myself. Perhaps I am dense.)That part makes sense, but some of the rest of my flavor I had a mental "wtf" moment about.Examples, please.
I think that's all questions/directed comments. Re-reading and posting more on my next break.
Post by: Teneb on November 05, 2012, 01:33:10 pm
Spoiler: BMC acting with what looks like anger when answering my question (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 05, 2012, 01:38:36 pm
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 1 - | Deathsword |
| Toaster | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Urist Imiknorris |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 2 - | Toaster, Toaster |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 2 - | Jim Groovester, IronyOwl |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 3 - | Shakerag, TolyK, Hapah |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
TolyK has been prodded.
Jim Groovester has been prodded.
IronyOwl has been prodded.
The Day will end in 1.5 hours.
Post by: TolyK on November 05, 2012, 02:11:03 pm
I have no idea what's going on with the vote count.Okay then. As I don't quite grasp the situation yet, I'll start with questions concerning me.
Let's test on TolyK because he's being intentionally useless; curious if this is two votes or a double vote. TolyK, you can consider this a real vote until you actually do something instead of being a useless McUselessson.
There is one thing that has been troubling me a little, though, and I'd like an opinion for those who have been in LNCP games before. I've been trying to put together what sort of non-spy enemies we face (if there are just the spies and townies I'll be surprised). What shape would a 3rd party be, and what do the spies want? My best guess at the moment is that we want to recover it, spies want to destroy/steal it, and any 3rd parties probably want to use it. I had that in mind when I was going back over Toaster's flavor list, and Tolyk's claim (below) makes me a little uneasy.That's actually an interesting point, but that's just my ideology - it's why I support the Nazi party. My flavor also said that I was fit to take leadership of the unit, and my success here would help me do that.Quote from: Tolyk Flavor ClaimI am Vester Meine Schneider, a 0th SS Division Officer. I believe that the strong should take power. I've worked through the ranks of the SS and was noticed by the Führer. He asked me what I wanted to achieve, to which I replied that the strong should take power - this impressed him enough that he promoted me to the 0th SS. And here I am, helping the strong (such as myself and my nation) to take power.Normally I wouldn't give it another thought, but what I've read of WC1 and what others have said about how flavor-heavy and flavor-relevant LNCP games are gives me pause. If anyone would attempt to seize power for himself, it'd be someone like above. Should I be concerned about this? Do you think it's relevant?
About there being 3 spies and and a third party spy - what goal would the third party spy have? Would it be like a serial killer - kill everyone else? Or would it be to take the technology for himself?
It seems like a tie? Hm. Why are people voting Imiknorris?
Post by: TolyK on November 05, 2012, 02:17:35 pm
Dariush, as UI pointed out, is still being his unhelpful self.
Post by: Hapah on November 05, 2012, 02:18:44 pm
My vote, though, will rest on Tolyk. His flavor makes me nervous, and he doesn't have a real post for the day (a little pot and kettle on that last one, I know). I can only make the lynch on UI or Tolyk, and given that UI just replaced in and appears to be active the choice is an easy one.
This no-extends thing is really killing us, LNCP.
PPE: And then Tolyk posts. ~____~
I'll be checking the thread every five minutes or so to catch any new developments or answer questions.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 05, 2012, 02:27:41 pm
Post by: TolyK on November 05, 2012, 02:28:16 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 05, 2012, 02:35:16 pm
Extend.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 05, 2012, 02:37:29 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 05, 2012, 02:54:45 pm
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 1 - | Deathsword |
| Toaster | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| Dariush | - 2 - | Urist Imiknorris, TolyK |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 3 - | Toaster, Toaster, Hapah |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 2 - | Jim Groovester, IronyOwl |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 1 - | Shakerag |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 3 - | TolyK, Hapah, Urist Imiknorris |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The Day has been extended to Tuesday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Dariush on November 05, 2012, 02:58:02 pm
I agree with Tiruin on this one. Riddle me this, Batman: Despite having an actual case on IronyOwl, you cited the insult as your reason for voting him. Which is more important in your eyes, his bandwagon or the fact that he called you an imbecile?Did I cite it instead of my case? No, what I did was point out that he called me an imbecile without any supportive arguments, in addition to all the crap he did earlier.
Right, he replaced Powder Miner, who was acting scummy before (bandwagoning mostly), so it makes sense. He's still defending himself from that, though UI is more cool about it.You are absent for several days straight, insult everyone by the 'Post' post and now the best you can do is say I'm being 'unhelpful', thus safely discarding absolutely everything I've done so far, and deciding this is the single scummiest thing that happened in the game so far? Yay, we've found our third scum.
Dariush, as UI pointed out, is still being his unhelpful self.
Post by: TolyK on November 05, 2012, 03:11:05 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 05, 2012, 03:19:27 pm
The correct answer is yes, it is. Practically the definition of the "Oh My God U Suck" vote. You voted him in response to his personal insult. You don't even have the excuse of an ad hominem attack, because he said he was reading you as town at the same time.
TolyK: Bullshit. Dariush is always unhelpful, as you yourself admitted. So why are you voting him for it?
Deathsword: How much do you suspect Tiruin?
Post by: Teneb on November 05, 2012, 03:25:22 pm
As you wish.Are you serious? Are just going to be apathic towards the game by posting things such as "Post" and the quote above?
If you are not going to play the game, TolyK, and instead insist with this apathy, then maybe you should think about what you are doing here.
PPE: UI: My gut feeling says not to trust him, but I can't find anything that would indicate him being scum. Currently waiting to see what he has to say about my answer to him a few posts back.
Post by: Jim Groovester on November 05, 2012, 03:57:49 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 05, 2012, 05:08:52 pm
Dariush is being an imbecile but I've got a peculiar reason to suspect he's town.Which would be...?
Toaster: So somehow Dariush lost his vote and you seem to have ended up with it and you have no idea how that happened? Forgive me if I come across as a little bit skeptical. Did you get any overnight message that would possibly indicate a clue?
TolyK: Elaborate on how exactly you're feeling Dariush is being unhelpful. Also, are you a jester or something? Because it looks like you're not taking this terribly seriously.
Post by: Hapah on November 05, 2012, 07:36:38 pm
Tolyk:
As you wish.What is this?
Post by: Tiruin on November 05, 2012, 08:41:07 pm
Unvote.
Will return in ~3 hours as busy @ work.
Post by: Toaster on November 05, 2012, 10:35:14 pm
Hapah:
Toaster: What do you plan to do, now that you know you have a doublevote? Is it permanent?
Business as usual, I guess. No idea if it's permanent.
My vote, though, will rest on Tolyk. His flavor makes me nervous, and he doesn't have a real post for the day (a little pot and kettle on that last one, I know). I can only make the lynch on UI or Tolyk, and given that UI just replaced in and appears to be active the choice is an easy one.
Would either of those make him voteworthy on its own?
Shakerag:
Did you get any overnight message that would possibly indicate a clue?
Nope.
Deathsword:
Toaster:Deathsword: Considering your question to Tiruin (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3752861#msg3752861), how important is finding scum via flavor in comparison to traditional scumhunting?Considering BMC's flavour, how it said he was good at infiltration, and his flip, I'd say that it might play a part in scumhunting. But I think traditional scumhunting is still going to be the main way of finding the spies.
Okay.
Given Tiruin answered your question, is he still voteworthy?
Urist I:
Hapah: Now that you're feeling better, who do you suspect? Why?
Was this vote more than pressure?
Since TolyK acts like he wants to hang, he can go ahead and do so.
TolyK: Why are you voting Dariush for being "unhelpful" while you continue to do the same thing?
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 12:48:50 am
Okay, so it's a doublevote.What else did you see it could have been?
Also, Why does one name in red = two counts in the votecount?
Deathsword
PPE: UI: My gut feeling says not to trust him, but I can't find anything that would indicate him being scum. Currently waiting to see what he has to say about my answer to him a few posts back.Why should you trust me? To humor my question, why shouldn't you?
TolyK
Right, he replaced Powder Miner, who was acting scummy before (bandwagoning mostly), so it makes sense. He's still defending himself from that, though UI is more cool about it.Define unhelpful - if it relates to the person's mannerisms, it doesn't necessarily say they are scum (so says me from playing with Dariush a lot).
Dariush, as UI pointed out, is still being his unhelpful self.
It seems like a tie? Hm. Why are people voting Imiknorris?Why are you so concerned about him?
Post by: Jim Groovester on November 06, 2012, 01:40:27 am
Tiruin:The quotes you asked. Spoiled to keep it organized.Spoiler: BMC acting with what looks like anger when answering my question (click to show/hide)
The latter two spoilers have nothing to do with the first two. How do these quotes support the idea that BMC was defending his speculation as if that was what he actually thought?
Maybe because they don't, and you were just making crap up.
Right, he replaced Powder Miner, who was acting scummy before (bandwagoning mostly), so it makes sense. He's still defending himself from that, though UI is more cool about it.
Dariush, as UI pointed out, is still being his unhelpful self.
The hell for?
That was damned lazy of you.
As you wish.
As you wish.
TolyK.
Post by: TolyK on November 06, 2012, 04:22:43 am
Now, let's look at the responses. So far I count 5 votes.
My vote, though, will rest on Tolyk. His flavor makes me nervous, and he doesn't have a real post for the day (a little pot and kettle on that last one, I know). I can only make the lynch on UI or Tolyk, and given that UI just replaced in and appears to be active the choice is an easy one.No questions to me, just a solid argument.
{third vote}
TolyK: Bullshit. Dariush is always unhelpful, as you yourself admitted. So why are you voting him for it?I'm not even sure. What would a sniper be doing with a bottle of perfume?
"Post" was a bad joke. "As you wish" was to Dariush.As you wish.Are you serious? Are just going to be apathic towards the game by posting things such as "Post" and the quote above?
If you are not going to play the game, TolyK, and instead insist with this apathy, then maybe you should think about what you are doing here.
{fourth vote}
TolyK: Elaborate on how exactly you're feeling Dariush is being unhelpful. Also, are you a jester or something? Because it looks like you're not taking this terribly seriously.I wasn't able to look much through it, but I read how he was voting someone for insulting him - that gets you nowhere. No, I'm not actually, that would be odd in this situation.
{didn't vote}
Tolyk:{didn't vote}As you wish.What is this?
Since TolyK acts like he wants to hang, he can go ahead and do so.Can't really answer that, because I was away for oog reasons, and now I don't quite know what is going on - I grabbed the first straw I saw.
TolyK: Why are you voting Dariush for being "unhelpful" while you continue to do the same thing?
{first to vote, has 2 votes}
TolyK1. Answered this above.Right, he replaced Powder Miner, who was acting scummy before (bandwagoning mostly), so it makes sense. He's still defending himself from that, though UI is more cool about it.Define unhelpful - if it relates to the person's mannerisms, it doesn't necessarily say they are scum (so says me from playing with Dariush a lot).
Dariush, as UI pointed out, is still being his unhelpful self.It seems like a tie? Hm. Why are people voting Imiknorris?Why are you so concerned about him?
2. I wasn't concerned about him, I was concerned about why people were voting him - whether it was based on something or not.
{didn't vote}
That was lazy of me, I agree. I couldn't find anything fast other than this.Right, he replaced Powder Miner, who was acting scummy before (bandwagoning mostly), so it makes sense. He's still defending himself from that, though UI is more cool about it.
Dariush, as UI pointed out, is still being his unhelpful self.
The hell for?
That was damned lazy of you.As you wish.
As you wish.
TolyK.
{fifth vote}
Hm. I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 06:11:52 am
Wat.TolyK: Bullshit. Dariush is always unhelpful, as you yourself admitted. So why are you voting him for it?I'm not even sure. What would a sniper be doing with a bottle of perfume?
He had perfume? How do you know this?...
Quote
"Post" was a bad joke. "As you wish" was to Dariush.Why do you joke at this time? Wait, worded that wrong. Why do you joke when LNCP was being very serious?
Also...just what are you getting at by your last sentences?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 06, 2012, 07:22:28 am
Urist I:Not really. It was an incentive for him to get his head back in the game.Hapah: Now that you're feeling better, who do you suspect? Why?
Was this vote more than pressure?
Jim:
That was damned lazy of you.(http://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-bandwagon.gif)As you wish.
As you wish.
TolyK.
That's what, the second time today you've made a lazy vote with the exact same justification as a previous voter?
TolyK:
Target practice? Although where did you get the bottle of perfume?TolyK: Bullshit. Dariush is always unhelpful, as you yourself admitted. So why are you voting him for it?I'm not even sure. What would a sniper be doing with a bottle of perfume?
Quote
No, I'm not actually, that would be odd in this situation.There's a situation where taking a game of Mafia seriously would look odd? Also, why do you care about looking odd?
Quote
Hm. I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.What sort of information were you expecting?
Post by: Hapah on November 06, 2012, 10:25:45 am
Post by: Dariush on November 06, 2012, 10:49:03 am
Dariush: I meant when you were defending your vote to Tiruin. You could easily have said "I had an actual case on him you gaping shitlord, can't you read" but instead you asked if voting him, and I quote, "in response to a lazy scum calling me an imbecile without any reason," was an OMGUS.Wrong. Tiruin specifically asked about it being OMGUS in response to an insult. I specifically answered that my 'vote' in response to the insult wasn't an OMGUS. My 'vote' also was in response to the other crap IO did, but I didn't bring it up because the initial question didn't concern it.
The correct answer is yes, it is. Practically the definition of the "Oh My God U Suck" vote. You voted him in response to his personal insult. You don't even have the excuse of an ad hominem attack, because he said he was reading you as town at the same time.'Excuse of an ad hominem attack'? How does that even work.
Oh wow, this is fun!Is that an attempt at 'I tried to imitate Nuke by intentionally being scummy as all fuck and then magically discovered scum by analyzing how people voted me' gambit I see?
vomit
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 10:52:27 am
Is that an attempt at 'I tried to imitate Nuke by intentionally being scummy as all fuck and then magically discovered scum by analyzing how people voted me' gambit I see?Explain?
Post by: Toaster on November 06, 2012, 11:01:12 am
ToasterOkay, so it's a doublevote.What else did you see it could have been?
Also, Why does one name in red = two counts in the votecount?
You pretty much answered your own question- I didn't know if the votes were separate or together.
TolyK: Are you seriously trying to pass your crap off as the Solifuge Strategy (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=93940.msg2652402#msg2652402)? (PPE: Hi Dariush! Why yes, I believe it is.)
Here's the thing- even if you're being honest about your intentions (I doubt it) you still say that...
I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.
Okay. Where's your replacement hunting then? Nowhere? You just post your lame attempt at a phony hunt then go twiddle your thumbs. Scum move.
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 11:22:23 am
Okay. Where's your replacement hunting then? Nowhere? You just post your lame attempt at a phony hunt then go twiddle your thumbs. Scum move.Why are you talking about UI in relation to TolyK's large post of numbers, one-sided replies and curly brackets?
@TolyK: I don't see where your 'See above' relates to Dariush and if you're using the power of inferring to give me an idea of what you're saying, then why not just say it with the usual brevity?
Spoiler: On a really unrelated note... (click to show/hide)
Post by: Toaster on November 06, 2012, 11:32:32 am
And where did I mention UI?
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 11:36:25 am
Also...Replacement = UI? I guess he's doing some kind of scumhunting in his reply there, but...
When one spots perfume in an SS camp...
Post by: Toaster on November 06, 2012, 11:47:42 am
Speaking of all he's doing, when I said "replacement scumhunting," I meant actual scumhunting to replace for his failed attempt to hunt scum via acting like an idiot. Nothing to do with game replacement.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 06, 2012, 12:05:56 pm
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| Dariush | - 2 - | Urist Imiknorris, TolyK |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 5 - | Toaster, Toaster, Hapah, Jim Groovester, Deathsword |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 1 - | IronyOwl |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 1 - | Shakerag |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The Day will end in 3 hours.
Post by: Hapah on November 06, 2012, 12:13:51 pm
Quote from: Toaster
Would either of those make him voteworthy on its own?Don't know, but he was the better of two bad choices: I'll lynch someone who I've got some flavor concerns about and is relatively inactive over someone who I've got no read on and is active.
I do want to know what he was going on about with that perfume, though. Is he going through people's pockets while they sleep?
Post by: TolyK on November 06, 2012, 12:40:03 pm
TolyK: Why are you counting votes- wait, why are you pointing out who voted you and who didn't when addressing them?I'm pointing that out to see if there's a pattern.Wat.TolyK: Bullshit. Dariush is always unhelpful, as you yourself admitted. So why are you voting him for it?I'm not even sure. What would a sniper be doing with a bottle of perfume?
He had perfume? How do you know this?...Quote"Post" was a bad joke. "As you wish" was to Dariush.Why do you joke at this time? Wait, worded that wrong. Why do you joke when LNCP was being very serious?
Also...just what are you getting at by your last sentences?
I visited Dariush.
And I don't know about the last part.
TolyK:I got it from Dariush.Target practice? Although where did you get the bottle of perfume?TolyK: Bullshit. Dariush is always unhelpful, as you yourself admitted. So why are you voting him for it?I'm not even sure. What would a sniper be doing with a bottle of perfume?
Quote from: UI
I don't quite understand this question, sorry.QuoteNo, I'm not actually, that would be odd in this situation.There's a situation where taking a game of Mafia seriously would look odd? Also, why do you care about looking odd?
Quote from: UI
Not quite sure. I was expecting people to jump at me in waves, like vultures at a dead animal.QuoteHm. I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.What sort of information were you expecting?
What's all this about perfume, Tolyk?Answered above.
Something like that, except at first it was unintentional. Now what are you doing with a bottle of sweet-smelling liquid?Oh wow, this is fun!Is that an attempt at 'I tried to imitate Nuke by intentionally being scummy as all fuck and then magically discovered scum by analyzing how people voted me' gambit I see?
vomit
TolyK: Are you seriously trying to pass your crap off as the Solifuge Strategy (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=93940.msg2652402#msg2652402)? (PPE: Hi Dariush! Why yes, I believe it is.)Err, ? Much information. I'm still being barraged by a bunch of questions.
Here's the thing- even if you're being honest about your intentions (I doubt it) you still say that...I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.
Okay. Where's your replacement hunting then? Nowhere? You just post your lame attempt at a phony hunt then go twiddle your thumbs. Scum move.
@TolyK: I don't see where your 'See above' relates to Dariush and if you're using the power of inferring to give me an idea of what you're saying, then why not just say it with the usual brevity?What? Can I please have a post number as I'm a bit pressed for time here.
I do want to know what he was going on about with that perfume, though. Is he going through people's pockets while they sleep?Possibly I'm looking for clues on who's a killer?
Bluh. So many questions, so little time.
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 12:44:00 pm
Bluh. So many questions, so little time.You should've thought about that before you went all vague.
Thanks for evading why you were asked about that vote, those curly brackets, and whatever I wanted from your 'last sentences'
Hm. I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.
What were you doing?
Why the claim?TolyK: Why are you counting votes- wait, why are you pointing out who voted you and who didn't when addressing them?I'm pointing that out to see if there's a pattern.Wat.TolyK: Bullshit. Dariush is always unhelpful, as you yourself admitted. So why are you voting him for it?I'm not even sure. What would a sniper be doing with a bottle of perfume?
He had perfume? How do you know this?...Quote"Post" was a bad joke. "As you wish" was to Dariush.Why do you joke at this time? Wait, worded that wrong. Why do you joke when LNCP was being very serious?
Also...just what are you getting at by your last sentences?
I visited Dariush.
And I don't know about the last part.
Post by: TolyK on November 06, 2012, 12:51:17 pm
Which vote? Curly brackets were to keep track of vote-times for me. Which last sentences? (quotes or post numbers help)
I'm not quite sure what I was doing, mostly getting information for later analysis. I think I went too far though. :P
Why? Because, if I die, it could be useful information to Town, though I'm not sure. And how do you know I'm not lying, by the way? That's the thing - you don't. I'm testing Dariush.
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 12:57:18 pm
Oh wow, this is fun!Yeah.
Now, let's look at the responses. So far I count 5 votes.
[Body of post...Body of post]
Hm. I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.
Too. Much. Text. Yep.And how will you prove this with a soft question to Dariush? Where did you explicitly think you were going too far. Quote it now that I've done my quote.
Which vote? Curly brackets were to keep track of vote-times for me. Which last sentences? (quotes or post numbers help)
I'm not quite sure what I was doing, mostly getting information for later analysis. I think I went too far though. :P
Why? Because, if I die, it could be useful information to Town, though I'm not sure. And how do you know I'm not lying, by the way? That's the thing - you don't. I'm testing Dariush.
Post by: Shakerag on November 06, 2012, 12:58:40 pm
TolyK: I can't remember if this was answered and I don't have time to double-check, but why visit Dariush? Did you actually get an alignment from this "visit"?
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 01:01:42 pm
PFP, god I wish we had another extend, but ... why are we lynching a (role?)cop?Let me continue...
...tracker?...watcher?...item-finder-that-is-perhaps-a-role?...thief?...experiment-that-LNCP-got...
Why this role, specifically, Shakerag? If perfume = yes, then why cop?
Spoiler: On another related, but as an OOC joke (click to show/hide)
PFP, god I wish we had another extend, but ... why are we lynching a (role?)cop?On that note:
TolyK: I can't remember if this was answered and I don't have time to double-check, but why visit Dariush? Did you actually get an alignment from this "visit"?
Why Dariush of all the targets?
Post by: TolyK on November 06, 2012, 01:08:38 pm
The last sentence about "didn't get quite information"? It's because I haven't found all too much, but I have some hunches now.Oh wow, this is fun!Yeah.
Now, let's look at the responses. So far I count 5 votes.
[Body of post...Body of post]
Hm. I'll be honest and say that I didn't quite get much information from that.Too. Much. Text. Yep.And how will you prove this with a soft question to Dariush? Where did you explicitly think you were going too far. Quote it now that I've done my quote.
Which vote? Curly brackets were to keep track of vote-times for me. Which last sentences? (quotes or post numbers help)
I'm not quite sure what I was doing, mostly getting information for later analysis. I think I went too far though. :P
Why? Because, if I die, it could be useful information to Town, though I'm not sure. And how do you know I'm not lying, by the way? That's the thing - you don't. I'm testing Dariush.
I didn't say I was going to prove anything.
I thought I was going too far after I said "As you wish". But can't change anything now, right?
PFP, god I wish we had another extend, but ... why are we lynching a (role?)cop?Not an alignment, just flavor. Dariush - random.
TolyK: I can't remember if this was answered and I don't have time to double-check, but why visit Dariush? Did you actually get an alignment from this "visit"?
And why me - I slipped, then decided to slide with it.
Ahahaha (hey, that's my style :( )Spoiler: On another related, but as an OOC joke (click to show/hide)
Quote
On that note:Because, the dice decided. Almost literally.
Why Dariush of all the targets?
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 01:19:12 pm
So...you were referring to the joke @ last sentence here?[...]The last sentence about "didn't get quite information"? It's because I haven't found all too much, but I have some hunches now.
I didn't say I was going to prove anything.
I thought I was going too far after I said "As you wish". But can't change anything now, right?
And I can infer as much from the line of 'didn't get [...]information'. This is what I'm asking out. What information are you aiming for - and what have you found? What are your hunches, and why are you begging me to ask that question so you can explain?
PFP, god I wish we had another extend, but ... why are we lynching a (role?)cop?Not an alignment, just flavor. Dariush - random.
TolyK: I can't remember if this was answered and I don't have time to double-check, but why visit Dariush? Did you actually get an alignment from this "visit"?
And why me - I slipped, then decided to slide with it.
[/quote]
Damn honest scum. Slip =...what now?
Because, the dice decided. Almost literally.What is this. You rolled a 1dwhatever and assigned values to the people?!
Randomness?!
...
So you used your action, for lack of a word, at Dariush just because of dice. No other reason?
Post by: Hapah on November 06, 2012, 01:24:56 pm
Off to vote, might be back before day end. Tolyk, can you tell us anything else about the perfume?
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 01:26:41 pm
Off to vote, might be back before day end. Tolyk, can you tell us anything else about the perfume?More reasonably, anything else you've found in your assumed search?
Post by: TolyK on November 06, 2012, 01:30:20 pm
I'm actually not begging you to ask any question, I'd rather you not ask my any so that I don't use too much time on that.
No other reason, because I was unsure to who to flavor-inspect.
Also, why the hell are you not voting me?
Not really. Nothing in his hat, didn't check his coat. This stuff was in a vial though. I placed it back. It looked clear. That's about it.Off to vote, might be back before day end. Tolyk, can you tell us anything else about the perfume?More reasonably, anything else you've found in your assumed search?
Post by: Tiruin on November 06, 2012, 01:36:56 pm
Tiruin: Town can slip, can't they? Not because they have anything to hide, but because they word something differently.Thank you for evading what you actually gleaned from your insidious vote-count-post-{}.
I'm actually not begging you to ask any question, I'd rather you not ask my any so that I don't use too much time on that.
So you won't miss it.So...you were referring to the joke @ last sentence here?[...]The last sentence about "didn't get quite information"? It's because I haven't found all too much, but I have some hunches now.
I didn't say I was going to prove anything.
I thought I was going too far after I said "As you wish". But can't change anything now, right?
And I can infer as much from the line of 'didn't get [...]information'. This is what I'm asking out. What information are you aiming for - and what have you found? What are your hunches, and why are you begging me to ask that question so you can explain?
Also, why the hell are you not voting me?Why the interest in where my vote lies? Why do you love yourself so much as to ask me to vote you?
So what, that's it? You just...what, snuck into his tent and examined his whole inside, looked around and *poof* vial? Perfume. Clear. Vial. That's it? You saw clear liquid...boom, general term named 'nothing'.Not really. Nothing in his hat, didn't check his coat. This stuff was in a vial though. I placed it back. It looked clear. That's about it.Off to vote, might be back before day end. Tolyk, can you tell us anything else about the perfume?More reasonably, anything else you've found in your assumed search?
...The only thing I can glean is you smelled some man's personal liquid that is presumably aromatic [the word is aroma, not the chemical term because I'm using the word 'perfume'...though that could work both ways. Perfume can mean anything affecting the olfactory sense.]
Smells so much like something made up on the fly.
Post by: TolyK on November 06, 2012, 01:47:27 pm
And I can infer as much from the line of 'didn't get [...]information'. This is what I'm asking out. What information are you aiming for - and what have you found? What are your hunchesI was aiming for patterns in the votes, also in the reactions. People looking for "easy targets".
So far, I'm seeing Jim's and Deathsword's using others' arguments. Everyone else answered more or less adequately. I still don't understand Hapah's flavor-fright.
It just seems like you're specifically staying off the bandwagon so that folks don't accuse you later. Slightly.Also, why the hell are you not voting me?Why the interest in where my vote lies? Why do you love yourself so much as to ask me to vote you?
Quote
No, it smells sweet. And I'm on the ground, thank you very much. I never really liked planes.So what, that's it? You just...what, snuck into his tent and examined his whole inside, looked around and *poof* vial? Perfume. Clear. Vial. That's it? You saw clear liquid...boom, general term named 'nothing'.Not really. Nothing in his hat, didn't check his coat. This stuff was in a vial though. I placed it back. It looked clear. That's about it.Off to vote, might be back before day end. Tolyk, can you tell us anything else about the perfume?More reasonably, anything else you've found in your assumed search?
...The only thing I can glean is you smelled some man's personal liquid that is presumably aromatic [the word is aroma, not the chemical term because I'm using the word 'perfume'...though that could work both ways. Perfume can mean anything affecting the olfactory sense.]
Smells so much like something made up on the fly.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 06, 2012, 04:09:27 pm
Night 2 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| Dariush | - 2 - | Urist Imiknorris, TolyK |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 5 - | Toaster, Toaster, Hapah, Jim Groovester, Deathsword |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 1 - | IronyOwl |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| Deathsword | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 1 - | Shakerag |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
There was to be no escape.
The soldiers, which had been corralled into the central pit, had realised this. Their Kommandant was serious, and they would all die by his hand if they tried to escape. He paid no heed to the value of this Division - only that the spies needed to be eliminated, and eliminated quickly. The soldiers began serious discussion of who the spy could be, bolstered by the success they were met with the day before.
Now, however, dusk approaches. As the sun begins to die in the horizon, bleeding out across the sky in its crimson colours, diluted, turned grey by drizzling rain, so too does their hope begin to wane. The Kommandant, sheltered under a canvas sheet from the merciless torrents, crushes his last cigarette between his thumb and forefinger against the sodden wood of a storage crate.
He stands, thrusting his heavy boots into the mud.
The air becomes breathless in an instant. The world seems to freeze, time stopped in its tracks. Slowly, infinitely slowly, their heads turn to gaze upon him - and the Kommandant, fearless, fearsome, crashes ahead through curtains of suspended raindrops. Their words, half-spoken, lie still in their mouths - and their tongues, though they may move, make no sound. The Kommandant carries on with massive steps, muffled in the void.
He speaks; shrill tones that break the silence and the trance. “Who,” he begins, “have you chosen?”
The soldiers glance at each other. A few whispers, but they seem certain. One speaks up.
“Vester.” The cry rings true. The others nod in unison.
The Kommandant nods, as well. Moving into the crowd, he takes hold of the man by his collar with an enormous hand, lifting him up level to glare at him. With a few steps, he moves out of the dispersing crowd.
He throws him down to the ground, and almost playful, he kicks at him, with his mud-splattered boots to roll him about like a pig on the ground in the rain. He draws his pistol out of his jacket with a sure, familiar stroke - the silenced revolver of blackened steel. He places a boot firmly on the man’s chest - the sticky mud beneath the treads soaks into his jacket, and the iron, ominous weight of the black boot presses against his chest.
“I will give you one chance to reveal yourself. If you do, I may let you live.” The pistol dangles, almost casually, above his face.
“I am not a spy!” The man’s response is met immediately with a stomp on his chest, the boot bearing down on him like a hammer. Dissatisfied, he lifts his foot, and once more, leaning into it for strength, he pushes it down - this time, with a muffled crack. The man’s mouth, pursed hard, would still say nothing. The man’s eyes glared weakly at him from below.
The Kommandant slips his foot of the man’s chest. Raising it behind him, high, he throws the heavy weight into his side with a dull echo - a single heavy stroke from a massive drum, punctuated by a grunt, low and quiet, from the body lying on the ground. His voice, breathless, screaming a single word, pierces the thundering rain about them. “Well?”
“Fuck you!” The voice comes back with surprising strength. “Fuck you,” he shouts again, “I won’t betray them!”
The Kommandant kicks again, indiscriminately - when he hears a yelp of pain break through, he smiles, momentarily, through the scowl - roaring, “Is this what you want, then?” And again he kicks, as if to punctuate, “Do you want to die?” A kick, a crunch.
The process takes hours. When he finishes, placing his final kick, feverish, panting, frantic, the body had already been beaten beyond recognition and lay still, already cold. His gun he still clutched in his hand, unused. The sun had already set; the rain, stopped; the air had grown freezing, and it was dark. He exhaled, spent, gazing into the starless sky. Returning his revolver to his jacket, he rips open what remains of the body’s black uniform - now mostly brown and red from caked mud and blood - and searches it. Finding nothing, he digs through the trousers before prying off the boots from the pale corpse and shaking them - a small booklet drops onto the ground.
He picks it up and leafs through it - on it, emblazoned on the front, are the coat of arms of the United Kingdom. He raises it high into the air for all to see - the other soldiers, who were mostly sitting, eyes averted, now stand, gathering close.
“This man was a spy. Arthur Owens, his passport says. Good work.”
He pockets it and leaves the others with the body.
Vester Meine "TolyK" Schneider was lynched! He was a Spy.
The Night will end Friday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 09, 2012, 05:32:24 pm
Day 3 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| Jim Groovester | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 8 - | Shakerag, Toaster, Dariush, Hapah, Jim Groovester, IronyOwl, Urist Imiknorris, Tiruin |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The third day dawns.
Everyone, now, fears for their lives. The first days, though finding spies was a serious task, few gave the Kommandant's threats about disbanding the entire Division and starting anew much consideration. Now, however, it seemed to them a very real possibility.
Rain falls when they step out nervously into the clearing, a chorus of drums filling the air with a low, rhythmic pitter-patter. The men, slouched, dressed in sodden blacks, marching for a funeral-to-be and faces dark as death itself, approach the blood-stained centre of the camp, trudging through the sticky mud with black boots in single file. Today, the camp is silent save for the rain - though in part because no-one wants to break the silence by being the first to speak, all the words they had to say had already been spoken.
Today, they woke but dead men; they had left the camp already.
It was a small surprise, then, when Ferdinand could not be found among them. Then, a quick search revealed him close to the edge of the camp; throat slit, pale as porcelain save for a single line at his neck, bright crimson red - all the brighter for his whiteness. His shirt, stained red, was only lightly ruffled. There were no tears or rips; his death, it seems, was gentle.
Two men lift the body, bringing it back to camp. Placing it in the open, another pair goes through its pockets, looking for clues.
"The spies strike back." The Kommandant, gazing over the body, takes a last drag from the stub of his cigarette, then throws it away. "They're threatened." He seems to smile.
"It means that we are making progress. This will be over soon enough. We will begin again for today, then-"
"Kommandant!" One of the soldiers that searched the body approaches him, and hands him another booklet.
He leafs through it - turning each page, his face slowly shifts from a faint smile to a frown, and finally, a scowl. "This… This is French. 'Édouard Herriot'."
The soldiers, still silent, turn toward him. He glares at them, for a few moments.
"...Well? What are you waiting for? For the spies to come and shoot you?"
Ferdinand "Deathsword" Meier was killed! He was a Spy.
The Day will end Tuesday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 09, 2012, 05:36:14 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 09, 2012, 05:44:40 pm
Also, today is the 9th.
Jim, let's talk about your activity. Day 1 you entirely ignored BMC, save to answer his question about wincons. Why? You were also voting Deathsword the entire day, despite barely pressuring him. Again, why? Day 2, you toss a lazy vote on PM and, when I replaced him, cast a lazy bandwagon on TolyK. For the third time, why?
Post by: Shakerag on November 09, 2012, 06:19:33 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 09, 2012, 11:46:48 pm
Post by: Tiruin on November 10, 2012, 12:08:46 am
PFP - Largely expect to see me Monday.^
Extend
Question still holds to Shakerag - Why'd you believe the cop-thing and why exactly, Cop?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 11, 2012, 04:32:12 am
IronyOwl has been prodded.
Jim Groovester has been prodded.
Dariush has been prodded.
Post by: Dariush on November 11, 2012, 08:10:41 am
Extend.
Hey Shakerag, let's play a game. I'll quote all your posts during the ENTIRE game and then we'll decide whether you're an activelurking scum or not. Deal? Let's see:
#66 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3728059#msg3728059) - RVS.
#80 - PFP.
PFP, may be too busy to post today.#115 - PFP.
PFP, I thought weekends didn't count. I'm here, give me time to read what transpired over said weekend.#122 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3740284#msg3740284) - claim after everyone else did, answering questions.
#128 - sixth vote on BMC for bullshit reason.
#140 - PFP.Anyway, flavor claim below:blackmagechill: This smells like a fakeclaim. Why would you, a supposed loyal German, be manipulating staff at a German embassy for military secrets? Unless I'm understanding something incorrectly, that sounds fishy to me. Also something about being a diplomat and suddenly being plucked from that and put into the 0th SS? It looks like all the other flavor claims have solid backgrounds as to why we're in the military and then 0th SS, but your claim doesn't seem to fit.
I am Agent Dietrich Waldemar Schmidt, 0th SS Division Officer. I infiltrate enemy camps for information gathering not by stealth or force, but by my natural charms. An ex-diplomat and a Don Juan-esque character, I have been using my skills in persuasion as my trade for the better part of my life. After being able to manipulate the staff at a German Embassy in a strategically significant country to reveal a gigantic amount of military secrets, the Fuhrer realized my important and brought me up to the 0th SS Division.
My mission is to extract a long forgotten artifact or piece of ancient technology in this very forest, although the briefing was very unspecific, and only those in high command have exact knowledge of this object.
PFP - Post coming tonight.#143 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3754219#msg3754219) - answering questions.
#177 (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3760534#msg3760534) - answering questions.
#193 - holy crap, the closest you've come to a real post during the ENTIRE FUCKING GAME.
#216 - two pointless questions.Dariush is being an imbecile but I've got a peculiar reason to suspect he's town.Which would be...?
Toaster: So somehow Dariush lost his vote and you seem to have ended up with it and you have no idea how that happened? Forgive me if I come across as a little bit skeptical. Did you get any overnight message that would possibly indicate a clue?
TolyK: Elaborate on how exactly you're feeling Dariush is being unhelpful. Also, are you a jester or something? Because it looks like you're not taking this terribly seriously.
PFP, god I wish we had another extend, but ... why are we lynching a (role?)cop?#229 - PFP.
TolyK: I can't remember if this was answered and I don't have time to double-check, but why visit Dariush? Did you actually get an alignment from this "visit"?
PFP - May post tonight, otherwise largely expect to see me Monday.
You haven't done ANYTHING this game. I am not even exaggerating here. Out of ELEVEN posts IN THE ENTIRE FUCKING GAME four were PFPs, one was RVS, three were purely reactionary, one was a bandwagon and one contained idiotic questions. I... I have no words. Just go die.
Also, I've got two theories. First theory: Kommandant. Second theory: LNCP intentionally made all the, frankly, weakest players spies so that everyone else would be distracted from the real, as of yet unknown threat. IO is still probably lying scum, but even he pales in comparison to Shakerag.
Post by: Tiruin on November 11, 2012, 09:28:27 am
Also, I've got two theories. First theory: Kommandant. Second theory: LNCP intentionally made all the, frankly, weakest players spies so that everyone else would be distracted from the real, as of yet unknown threat. IO is still probably lying scum, but even he pales in comparison to Shakerag.Dariush. I don't even, your theories.
First:
lordnincompoop: Is the Kommandant votable? Are you votable?
I am not here to let you be lazy and passive.Is everything you will be saying the truth, no bias present?
I have answered this already. Please try to read more carefully.
Second: Wat.
How are you assuming our 'weak' (that comes off as a partial general insult, just so you know) players are spies from...what. THREE deaths? You could say 'two scumteams' or 'flavor info is misleading' but then you end up with a...what?
What is this 'unknown threat' of which you speak, mein sniper? What is your deal with IO without any basis in that post there?
And why do you have perfume as TolyK said?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 11, 2012, 09:37:46 am
| Jim Groovester | - 1 - | Urist Imiknorris |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 6 - | Shakerag, Toaster, Dariush, Hapah, Jim Groovester, IronyOwl, |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 2 - | Tiruin, Dariush |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The Day will end Tuesday, 8PM GMT.
You need one more vote to Extend.
lordnincompoop: Is the Kommandant votable? Are you votable?
I am not here to let you be lazy and passive.
Tiruin, since you seem to have misinterpreted this: I don't look down upon experimentation. This game, if you will remember, is unorthodox.
I do get annoyed, however, when people ask me questions to things they could easily try out or ask repeatedly about things that they know I would not reveal.
EDIT: Corrections.
Post by: Dariush on November 11, 2012, 09:40:17 am
First:This doesn't look like a 'No' to me.lordnincompoop: Is the Kommandant votable? Are you votable?I am not here to let you be lazy and passive.
Second: Wat.How about... because they flipped spies? Is that not sufficient grounds for suspecting that they may oh I dunno possibly be spies?
How are you assuming our 'weak' (that comes off as a partial general insult, just so you know) players are spies from...what. THREE deaths? You could say 'two scumteams' or 'flavor info is misleading' but then you end up with a...what?
What is this 'unknown threat' of which you speak, mein sniper?Are you an idiot? How can I tell you what is this unknown threat if it is unknown?
What is your deal with IO without any basis in that post there?...Really? Did you simply not read the entire game between about the time IO came back from the lurk-o-session and my last post of D2?
And why do you have perfume as TolyK said?I don't. Or at least my PM doesn't mention it.
PPE'd by LNCP.
Post by: Tiruin on November 11, 2012, 10:36:26 am
Not exactly. From where I see it, you've voted IronyOwl because he called you an imbecile while not focusing on the additional 'crap' you state he got on you. Every other post is an answer to others' questions.What is your deal with IO without any basis in that post there?...Really? Did you simply not read the entire game between about the time IO came back from the lurk-o-session and my last post of D2?
What makes it different now? Also,
I was asking you on what your take was on what unknown was.What is this 'unknown threat' of which you speak, mein sniper?Are you an idiot? How can I tell you what is this unknown threat if it is unknown?And why do you have perfume as TolyK said?I don't. Or at least my PM doesn't mention it.
And what was that about possibility on having perfume?
Post by: Tiruin on November 11, 2012, 10:39:32 am
Yeah, sorry about this. As I've recently discovered, my comprehension in English is poorer than what I rate myself as.lordnincompoop: Is the Kommandant votable? Are you votable?
I am not here to let you be lazy and passive.
Tiruin, since you seem to have misinterpreted this: I don't look down upon experimentation. This game, if you will remember, is unorthodox.
I do get annoyed, however, when people ask me questions to things they could easily try out or ask repeatedly about things that they know I would not reveal.
Assumptions. I thought you were saying 'no' in a general manner and discarded you saying otherwise.
And one last thing @ Dar:
You're judging via the flips as a generality?
Post by: Hapah on November 11, 2012, 08:54:11 pm
Does anyone else find it unusual that DS was found, throat slit, at the edge of the camp? Think about it.
At first I thought maybe he was killed in his sleep and his body dragged to the edge of the camp. That doesn't really make sense, though: Why would someone kill DS in his sleep and them move him, but not bother to hide the corpse? There were no signs of a struggle (which I originally thought meant sleep-kill, but that doesn't work), which I think means he knew his attacker, maybe? And he was killed and left where he fell. How else can it be explained? You'd think even if a vigi got the drop on him there'd be some signs of struggle.
Any ideas? Maybe the 4th Spy is a turncoat/3rd party? Maybe there are different spy factions?
Post by: Hapah on November 11, 2012, 08:59:02 pm
LNCP: Were there any tracks in the mud leading up to DS's corpse? Not bootprints, something that would be left by his body or legs dragging.
Post by: Toaster on November 11, 2012, 10:57:12 pm
Urist I: Why open up on D3 about activity when you had a different case on a different person D2?
More tomorrow- need to get a couple questions (and a vote test) out tonight. Also, this.
Not Voting - 2 - TolyK, Deathsword
Heh. Looks like they were too scared to bus.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 11, 2012, 11:08:24 pm
Urist I: Why open up on D3 about activity when you had a different case on a different person D2?Because I reread over the night and I'm stupid. The meat of Dariush's case came from the same post as the insult (I had thought that Dariush's case had come first, but he didn't do anything about it until he was insulted).
Dariush:
Also, I've got two theories. First theory: Kommandant. Second theory: LNCP intentionally made all the, frankly, weakest players spies so that everyone else would be distracted from the real, as of yet unknown threat.Your second theory is shit, for one very simple reason: replacements.
Mod: Why would the Kommandant refer to "spies" (plural) in the D3 opener when three of the four are dead?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 12, 2012, 12:44:43 am
EBWOP
LNCP: Were there any tracks in the mud leading up to DS's corpse? Not bootprints, something that would be left by his body or legs dragging.
No.
Post by: Tiruin on November 12, 2012, 02:01:00 am
Dariush: Why didn't you renew your Shakerag vote?
Hey Shakerag,[...]@Toaster: Huh?
Hapah: You believe flavor plays a lead into figuring out the killer? What does mud have to do with this? (It's a real sunny day.)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 12, 2012, 02:38:44 am
| Jim Groovester | - 1 - | Urist Imiknorris |
| Tiruin | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 2 - | Tiruin, Toaster |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| TolyK | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 5 - | Shakerag, Dariush, Hapah, Jim Groovester, IronyOwl, |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 2 - | Tiruin, Dariush |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
Jim Groovester has requested replacement.
The Day will end tomorrow, 8PM GMT.
You need one more vote to Extend.
Post by: Tiruin on November 12, 2012, 03:39:32 am
Jim Groovester has requested replacement.Mmm...math seems to have gotten him D:
Extend
Post by: IronyOwl on November 12, 2012, 07:29:49 am
Back, sorta.This is an interesting observation, though.
Does anyone else find it unusual that DS was found, throat slit, at the edge of the camp? Think about it.
At first I thought maybe he was killed in his sleep and his body dragged to the edge of the camp. That doesn't really make sense, though: Why would someone kill DS in his sleep and them move him, but not bother to hide the corpse? There were no signs of a struggle (which I originally thought meant sleep-kill, but that doesn't work), which I think means he knew his attacker, maybe? And he was killed and left where he fell. How else can it be explained? You'd think even if a vigi got the drop on him there'd be some signs of struggle.
Any ideas? Maybe the 4th Spy is a turncoat/3rd party? Maybe there are different spy factions?
What interests me most is what he was doing on the edge of camp in the first place. Spy shenanigans, or could that have been related to the thing we're searching for?
Post by: Dariush on November 12, 2012, 08:20:01 am
Dariush:Nope. What I think that move was going to accomplish was to hasten the spies' demise, not to ensure that all four die before any townies do so.Also, I've got two theories. First theory: Kommandant. Second theory: LNCP intentionally made all the, frankly, weakest players spies so that everyone else would be distracted from the real, as of yet unknown threat.Your second theory is shit, for one very simple reason: replacements.
Dariush: Why didn't you renew your Shakerag vote?Because I didn't notice that voting for a non-votable entity counts as an unvote. Shakerag.
Oh, so you indeed did not read anything. In the very same post I accuse him for calling me an imbecile out of nowhere I accuse him of lying about me stealing his BMC case and intentionally not reading posts. Did you see that?Not exactly. From where I see it, you've voted IronyOwl because he called you an imbecile while not focusing on the additional 'crap' you state he got on you. Every other post is an answer to others' questions.What is your deal with IO without any basis in that post there?...Really? Did you simply not read the entire game between about the time IO came back from the lurk-o-session and my last post of D2?
What makes it different now?I'm developing a habit of doing a reread at the beginning of each day. I did that and noticed that at times I completely forgot that Shakerag was even in the game, his activity levels were that low. Simultaneously I considered that my vote on him would be more immediatly productive than on IO, thus my switch.
What I suspect is that the artefact mentioned in the flavor is actually playing a role in what's happening. I.e. we have a watcher whose goal is to delay the lynch of spies for as long as possible, so we would be distracted from the artefact.I was asking you on what your take was on what unknown was.What is this 'unknown threat' of which you speak, mein sniper?Are you an idiot? How can I tell you what is this unknown threat if it is unknown?And why do you have perfume as TolyK said?I don't. Or at least my PM doesn't mention it.
And what was that about possibility on having perfume?
And I may possibly have perfume because my PM doesn't mention its absence either.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 12, 2012, 08:23:41 am
Post by: Tiruin on November 12, 2012, 10:36:39 am
Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
Dariush:
Really...what? You vote the Kommandant and use that as an excuse to...scumhunt? How exactly is no reply from the Kommandant point out scum?
So you didn't bother to ask the Mod if he made a mistake in votecount and reinstated this?Dariush: Why didn't you renew your Shakerag vote?Because I didn't notice that voting for a non-votable entity counts as an unvote. Shakerag.
Uhh.
What I suspect is that the artefact mentioned in the flavor is actually playing a role in what's happening. I.e. we have a watcher whose goal is to delay the lynch of spies for as long as possible, so we would be distracted from the artefact.What artefact are you talking about? How do spies get in this pattern which needs to...not be lynched?
And I may possibly have perfume because my PM doesn't mention its absence either.
Post by: Dariush on November 12, 2012, 10:51:21 am
There's a flipped spy among us? What?What.
Oh.
OH.
Really...what? You vote the Kommandant and use that as an excuse to...scumhunt? How exactly is no reply from the Kommandant point out scum?What. I voted the Kommandant to see whether it's possible. It turned out to be not so, so I reverted to my previous target.
He jotted down my vote of Kommandant as an unvote. That means he saw it. I don't understand what you're getting at.So you didn't bother to ask the Mod if he made a mistake in votecount and reinstated this?Dariush: Why didn't you renew your Shakerag vote?Because I didn't notice that voting for a non-votable entity counts as an unvote. Shakerag.
Uhh.
You are kidding me, right? The artefact which we were sent here to recover. Oh wait, not you, because you're scum who forgot your own supposed mission. And your second question makes no sense.What I suspect is that the artefact mentioned in the flavor is actually playing a role in what's happening. I.e. we have a watcher whose goal is to delay the lynch of spies for as long as possible, so we would be distracted from the artefact.What artefact are you talking about? How do spies get in this pattern which needs to...not be lynched?
And I may possibly have perfume because my PM doesn't mention its absence either.
Post by: Tiruin on November 12, 2012, 11:18:30 am
But you're speaking of the artefact as if you know more about it. @second: I was referring to the watcher-idea you had. And you giving a subtle inference on a limited number of days -You are kidding me, right? The artefact which we were sent here to recover. Oh wait, not you, because you're scum who forgot your own supposed mission. And your second question makes no sense.What I suspect is that the artefact mentioned in the flavor is actually playing a role in what's happening. I.e. we have a watcher whose goal is to delay the lynch of spies for as long as possible, so we would be distracted from the artefact.What artefact are you talking about? How do spies get in this pattern which needs to...not be lynched?
And I may possibly have perfume because my PM doesn't mention its absence either.
What is this 'Watcher' of which you suspect?
It goes off from your theory.
Also, I've got two theories. First theory: Kommandant. Second theory: LNCP intentionally made all the, frankly, weakest players spies so that everyone else would be distracted from the real, as of yet unknown threat. IO is still probably lying scum, but even he pales in comparison to Shakerag.
Post by: Dariush on November 12, 2012, 11:47:00 am
I said I suspect that artefact has something to do with the setup. I'm not certain of it. This is merely my guess.
I said I suspect that there is a watcher. As in a role. Hint: a watcher is someone who needs to survive n days. I'm not certain of it. This is merely my guess.
It's quite amusing to watch how you cling to the theories as if they're solid statements while carefully gleaning over your own slips. Here, I'll remind you:
What the fuck was up with the surprise?There's a flipped spy among us? What?What.
Oh.
OH.
Is the G.I.Joe imitation all you have to say about this thing? Or are you intending to continue flinging shit at me to see what sticks?Really...what? You vote the Kommandant and use that as an excuse to...scumhunt? How exactly is no reply from the Kommandant point out scum?What. I voted the Kommandant to see whether it's possible. It turned out to be not so, so I reverted to my previous target.He jotted down my vote of Kommandant as an unvote. That means he saw it. I don't understand what you're getting at.So you didn't bother to ask the Mod if he made a mistake in votecount and reinstated this?Dariush: Why didn't you renew your Shakerag vote?Because I didn't notice that voting for a non-votable entity counts as an unvote. Shakerag.
Uhh.
Answering questions would also be a nice plus.Not exactly. From where I see it, you've voted IronyOwl because he called you an imbecile while not focusing on the additional 'crap' you state he got on you. Every other post is an answer to others' questions.Oh, so you indeed did not read anything. In the very same post I accuse him for calling me an imbecile out of nowhere I accuse him of lying about me stealing his BMC case and intentionally not reading posts. Did you see that?
Post by: Hapah on November 12, 2012, 12:42:23 pm
Quote from: Dar
And I may possibly have perfume because my PM doesn't mention its absence either.So ask LNCP and confirm, then.
Something strange is going on, but something resembling a plan is starting to come together in my head. I'll try to post it during lunch.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 12, 2012, 01:31:49 pm
Yes, there is. As a matter of fact, all three dead players flipped spy, including the one whose "inspect" you're using as a case. Why weren't you paying attention to their roleflips?Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 12, 2012, 02:03:50 pm
Shakerag has been prodded.
The Day has been extended to Wednesday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Hapah on November 12, 2012, 02:37:47 pm
Starting to put it all together. I wonder if flavor is as important as it seems? If so, damn this is a well-made game. I do have another question, though.
LNCP/Kommandant: Was there blood on Deathsword's hands? His death was "gentle", I know, but this will be useful information to me.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 12, 2012, 02:38:52 pm
LNCP: Was there blood on Deathsword's hands? His death was "gentle", I know, but this will be useful information to me.
No.
Post by: zombie urist on November 12, 2012, 02:39:10 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 12, 2012, 02:44:08 pm
Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
Know what I think? I think there are two teams of spies, and Tiruin's on one of them. No one of Tiruin's team has flipped, which why, in his head, no spies have flipped... despite EVERY PLAYER so far having flipped spy. That's not oversight- that's thinking about the game from a scum perspective.
Also,
You're judging via the flips as a generality?
You're a dirty liar, since you mentioned them previously.
@Jim: Reasonable, but I'm under the assumption that the spies have a coverstory behind their name, though. Trying to see all viewpoints of the idea other than lacking information.
Stands to reason, then, that you'd know what spies get instead of checking back in to other LNCP games.
Post by: Dariush on November 12, 2012, 03:05:29 pm
So ask LNCP and confirm, then.He said I don't have any perfume. Oh well, a scum was lying. What a surprise.
Know what I think? I think there are two teams of spies, and Tiruin's on one of them. No one of Tiruin's team has flipped, which why, in his head, no spies have flipped... despite EVERY PLAYER so far having flipped spy. That's not oversight- that's thinking about the game from a scum perspective.That's some... convoluted logic. If anything, he should be on the Allied-spy team (I'm assuming that the fourth one is a Russian), so that would explain that in his mind no spies aka his enemies flipped.
Do you think that both teams consist of spies? If yes, how would you estimate their sizes?
Post by: Toaster on November 12, 2012, 04:12:51 pm
I smell Dariush. What does he smell like?
Dariush: I'm not sure what else the other team would be, but I assume some flavor of spy- why else would he be derp about who flips what?
I'm guessing either a standard size team plus a smaller secret team (Tiruin being the latter) or two equal sized teams with contradictory goals- I like the latter idea better.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 12, 2012, 04:16:30 pm
I'm guessing either a standard size team plus a smaller secret team (Tiruin being the latter) or two equal sized teams with contradictory goals- I like the latter idea better.You do? That would mean six spies in an eleven player game, considering your previous theory that none of Tiruin's buddies have flipped.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 12, 2012, 04:16:53 pm
I smell Dariush. What does he smell like?
You can't take actions during the Day; the Kommandant is watching!
Post by: Toaster on November 12, 2012, 04:20:32 pm
LNCP: Does that mean nobody has a day action?
Welcome to Mein Kampf: A Tale of Vainglourious Basterds, where the scum take the spotlight! This Mafia game aims to be novel, challenging, interesting, intellectually stimulating and, of course, delightfully, mischievously, uproariously fun. Though its mechanics are designed to be well-defined and coherent, this is not a vanilla game – in fact, I'd deem this setup to be quite experimental, so bear with me when you play.
UI: The above bolded bits have to mean something. If we assume for a second that there is more than one scum team, then assuming they don't have a standard kill (given only one night kill so far) then that doesn't seem quite so farfetched.
Post by: Tiruin on November 12, 2012, 04:55:43 pm
Tiruin:One cannot use sarcasm in pinpointing my suspect, am I correct? I left out using the word, Dariush in lieu of doing this.Yes, there is. As a matter of fact, all three dead players flipped spy, including the one whose "inspect" you're using as a case. Why weren't you paying attention to their roleflips?Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
Tiruin:...Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
Know what I think? I think there are two teams of spies, and Tiruin's on one of them. No one of Tiruin's team has flipped, which why, in his head, no spies have flipped... despite EVERY PLAYER so far having flipped spy. That's not oversight- that's thinking about the game from a scum perspective.
How are you even concluding this? I can't see how this works, even in your metaphorical state of 'my mind'. Explain.
@Jim: Reasonable, but I'm under the assumption that the spies have a coverstory behind their name, though. Trying to see all viewpoints of the idea other than lacking information.
Stands to reason, then, that you'd know what spies get instead of checking back in to other LNCP games.
[/quote]
Let me tell you this. I didn't read the past LNCP games for "clues" or "hints" but I'm using real-world ideology and intuition in trying to solve this. Would a spy come into camp, unprepared even in their cover? Why are you jumping to conclusions along with UI? Heck, I'm even thinking they brought those cyanide pills to kill themselves - falsified given the death-by-boot.
Seeing the flavorclaims - I'm guessing such by referring to the already-dead, and those that have stated their information and background. Our mission states something along the lines of an artifact, I'm looking over the process of how the flavor was matched up and the person's dossier.
Let's pick TolyK for example - claimed a cop, the only deviant so far from the three dead. Was found out to be a Spy. Did you think that I'd buy him being a Cop just like that even when he claimed 'perfume' in that kind of weak proposition against Dariush? No. I'm under the assumption that he used his team's power (UI says it was specifically an inspect) as a coverstory for his own hide with such a weak push against Dariush.
Lastly:
Dariush: I'm not sure what else the other team would be, but I assume some flavor of spy- why else would he be derp about who flips what?Where did I derp, and how did you classify those groupings of yours because they're...confusing.
I'm guessing either a standard size team plus a smaller secret team (Tiruin being the latter) or two equal sized teams with contradictory goals- I like the latter idea better.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 12, 2012, 05:09:23 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 12, 2012, 06:01:25 pm
When I asked you that you were still rabbiting on about perfume. That's what I was talking about. You were using TolyK's inspect as if it had any weight after he flipped scum. Why are you doing that? Why are you taking the spy at his word?Tiruin:One cannot use sarcasm in pinpointing my suspect, am I correct? I left out using the word, Dariush in lieu of doing this.Yes, there is. As a matter of fact, all three dead players flipped spy, including the one whose "inspect" you're using as a case. Why weren't you paying attention to their roleflips?Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
Quote
Would a spy come into camp, unprepared even in their cover? Why are you jumping to conclusions along with UI?Witches, wizards, golems, and elves came into town in LNCP's past games with a bare-bones backstory that they had to improvise details for.
And what conclusions am I jumping to?
Quote
Let's pick TolyK for example - claimed a cop, the only deviant so far from the three dead. Was found out to be a Spy. Did you think that I'd buy him being a Cop just like that even when he claimed 'perfume' in that kind of weak proposition against Dariush?And yet you kept asking about it even after TolyK was known to be a spy.
Quote
No. I'm under the assumption that he used his team's power (UI says it was specifically an inspect) as a coverstory for his own hide with such a weak push against Dariush.That's so stupid. Of course you don't buy TolyK being a cop. Obviously
Also, I use inspect as a catch-all term for any investigative ability.
Toaster:
UI: The above bolded bits have to mean something. If we assume for a second that there is more than one scum team, then assuming they don't have a standard kill (given only one night kill so far) then that doesn't seem quite so farfetched.So when the Kommandant said there were four spies, he was wrong?
Mod: You've already said you won't lie to us, but can the flavor lie to us?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 12, 2012, 06:09:48 pm
Mod: You've already said you won't lie to us, but can the flavor lie to us?
You may take my word as truth, but that rule does not apply to other characters in-game.
I saw that edit.
Post by: Hapah on November 12, 2012, 07:39:21 pm
Quote from: UI
So when the Kommandant said there were four spies, he was wrong?It's possible the Kommandant had (has?) incomplete or faulty intel. Considering how much I love not getting shot in the face, I'm just going to hold the course until we manage to get 4 spies and then see where the Kommandant goes from there.
Mod: You've already said you won't lie to us, but can the flavor lie to us?
Concerning Tir's spy confusion: It is a very interesting observation.
Quote from: The OP
Welcome to Mein Kampf: A Tale of Vainglourious Basterds, where the scum take the spotlight! This Mafia game aims to be novel, challenging, interesting, intellectually stimulating and, of course, delightfully, mischievously, uproariously fun. Though its mechanics are designed to be well-defined and coherent, this is not a vanilla game – in fact, I'd deem this setup to be quite experimental, so bear with me when you play.No kidding on that bolded part, LNCP.
I'm a bit surprised that no-one has tried to tease apart what the flavor means; I gather it's rather important. I've a theory of what happened to Deathsword, and I'd like to play an episode of CSI:Nazi Camp for all of you to that end. I hope that you will find my observations interesting: I think it will be difficult to win if we cannot even interpret the events transpiring around us. It might be a bit long, but I think it flows well enough.
Now, Deathsword's death. He was found, throat slit, on the edge of the camp. As I have stated before, I believe he was killed there and left where he fell: There are no indications that the body was moved (tracks in the mud from a dragged corpse), and I cannot see why someone would kill him elsewhere and then dump him on the edge of the camp without attempting to hide the body. Plus, the risks of moving the corpse would be non-trivial: What do you say if a guard catches you dragging a man's corpse through the camp?
Next, there were no signs of a struggle. No tears in the clothes, no defensive wounds, and perhaps most damning there wasn't even in any blood on DS's hands. You would at least expect him to clutch a hand to his throat if he was aware when attacked, yes? But that didn't happen. Considering that there are no obvious signs of trauma to DS's body, this leads me to believe that Deathsword was likely drugged before his throat was slit.
Now, think for a moment. Ask yourself "What drug would someone use to quickly and easily incapacitate a target?" When I asked myself this question, the thing that immediately popped into my head was Chloroform (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloroform). And right there, in the intro, is this (bolded for emphasis): "Chloroform is an organic compound with formula CHCl3. It is one of the four chloromethanes.[1] The colorless, sweet-smelling, dense liquid is a trihalomethane, and is considered somewhat hazardous. Several million tons are produced annually as a precursor to Teflon and refrigerants, but its use for refrigerants is being phased out.[1]"
Do I have your attention yet?
Tolyk claimed that he found a vial of a colorless, sweet-smelling liquid in Dar's equipment (he said it was something similar to perfume, though why anyone would keep perfume in a vial is beyond me). As Tolyk was a spy we obviously cannot take his claim at face value, but I'm glad he claimed what he did (it was my "a-HA!" moment). It might be that Dar has chloroform. It could also be that Tolyk or one of his co-conspirators has chloroform, and Tolyk could have used this information to fake the inspect/investigation and frame Dar. The one thing of which I am reasonably certain is that some sort of incapacitating drug is involved, and chloroform fits the information given quite well. It makes everything work: Deathsword either left his tent of his own accord or was coaxed out by a trusted figure. Once on the outskirts of the camp, he was ambushed (either through stealth or treachery) with chloroform, likely a rag over the mouth. While he may have resisted (hence the ruffled shirt, likely the assailant had one hand over DS's mouth and the other around his neck), his struggle would have been futile. Once incapacitated, he was put down and his throat quietly slit to finish the job: The drugs ensure no screams or shouts, no struggle, no marks or blood at all left on the assailant. It makes the entire process so clean.
TL;DR - I believe that if we can find chloroform or another incapacitating drug, we can likely find DS's killer, though whether it is a vigilante or spy treachery I cannot say.
To that end, I would like to relay my theory to the Kommandant and request that he dispatch someone to our medical supplies (medical tent?), if possible, to
-Confirm that we are missing no drugs with characteristics similar to chloroform
-Gather information about who, if anyone, was treated with drugs similar to chloroform in the last few days
Day's been extended until Wednesday, so we have a little time. Thoughts?
Post by: Shakerag on November 13, 2012, 12:13:43 am
Okay ... so D1 flavor says there are four spies ... and three are dead, but one of those three died in the night. So that would have to mean either multiple scumteams or a vig (or maybe both). Each of the three dead spies was from a different country. I suppose it's possible we could have something silly like 4 1-man scumteams. Or maybe 2 1-man and 1 2-man team.
Tiruin: I swear it takes me half a dozen reads to understand what you're asking me sometimes. Why'd I believe him? Because it felt like an earnest "Oh shit better drop my results before I get lynched" sort of thing. Why'd I specify (role)cop? I tend to mentally lump all investigative-ish roles together in my head as "cop". I think I read recently somewhere on here someone else does the same thing. I don't think I've ever seen some kind of thief role, and things like watcher/tracker didn't occur to me. Seemed like TolyK was claiming some kind of rolecop to me. Plus, he said he "visited" Dariush. I know it could be looked at from any angle, but my mind said "cop" when I read it.
Dariush: I'm activelurking town, bitchtits. Get it straight. But, yes, I think I know how IronyOwl feels some games now. Also, that was totally not a bullshit reason on BMC. You offend me, good sir. His background story totally stuck out compared to the rest of ours. Tell me I'm wrong.
But, in all seriousness, I've been really fucking busy with RL, plus ICing on top of that. So, yeah, I'm having a not so fresh feeling in this game.
Also:
First theory: Kommandant. Second theory: LNCP intentionally made all the, frankly, weakest players spies so that everyone else would be distracted from the real, as of yet unknown threat.I can't help but think "u mad about your terribad scummates, bro?"
Know what I think? I think there are two teams of spies, and Tiruin's on one of them. No one of Tiruin's team has flipped, which why, in his head, no spies have flipped... despite EVERY PLAYER so far having flipped spy. That's not oversight- that's thinking about the game from a scum perspective.I was starting to think the same thing reading through the day. What say you about that, Tiruin?
Hapah: I'm having trouble disagreeing with your detectivorizing. If TolyK really was some kind of spy rolecop (maybe extra abilities aren't being shown in the roleflips?), and he did find such a thing on Dariush ... then Dariush is either scum or a vig.
I'll be back in 12 hours-ish.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 01:47:27 am
Hapah: I'm having trouble disagreeing with your detectivorizing.My chemistry lessons tell me that chloroform was a reasonable chemical being used in warfare both as a medicinal aid, as an anesthetic or as an offensive weapon - usually people who needed medical aid were given liquor to dull the sense of pain. Nevertheless, his CSI-style is pretty impressive, and reasonable now that you think about it.
Hapah:
I love how people think I'm stupid enough to consider giving a clue that, from a spy perspective, none of my team have flipped and are assuming that I've slipped as speaking such.
Hey Toaster, stop twisting my words, would you?
UI:
Exactly six. Why that?I'm guessing either a standard size team plus a smaller secret team (Tiruin being the latter) or two equal sized teams with contradictory goals- I like the latter idea better.You do? That would mean six spies in an eleven player game, considering your previous theory that none of Tiruin's buddies have flipped.
On those questions, is it just because the one who asked them - a spy - mean that they shouldn't be continued regardless?
QuoteNo. I'm under the assumption that he used his team's power (UI says it was specifically an inspect) as a coverstory for his own hide with such a weak push against Dariush.That's so stupid. Of course you don't buy TolyK being a cop. Obviouslyhe made shit up to save his asshis whole team is a cop! So very stupid, and you're assuming it while completely disregarding the much simpler and more likely assumption.
Also, I am stupid damnit, just so you don't have to repeat it in every single paragraph you address to me. But answer me this, regardless of anything I said earlier if you won't listen. Do you think I would make such a move as to do what you suspect - ie, "No flip because they aren't on my team - borrowing from Toaster's idea"? Someone said something about perfume - sweet smelling liquid. If or if not, TolyK was just gibbering or pulling something from behind his back, it seems relevant to research found (Chloroform). Judging by what that said, Dariush was the one that killed Deathsword if
I'm betting either vig, or opposite teams here. And on that note, The Kommandant spoke of getting recently infiltrated, but what about sleeper agents? It seems like a viable conclusion. The spy team won't kill their own with the fatality rate like this.
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 02:00:00 am
I haven't put a lot of thought into reads; I couldn't put the Deathsword problem down until I'd figured it out. I will be very interested to see if my request to the Kommandant bears fruit, though. I also just noticed that Tolyk's spy faction (if there are multiple factions) had at least two others besides himself left at the time of his death, as he shouted out "I won’t betray them!” before he was beaten to death. Just another piece of info in this big puzzle.
I'm thinking there are multiple spy factions, if only because I doubt there is any way we'd be so lucky as to go 3 for 3 on kills (and one being a vigi or spykill, at that). Sorry that I don't have much in the way of individual suspicions, but I do feel like I contributed something today! I'll give a read tomorrow and see if I can't come up with reads.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 13, 2012, 04:03:42 am
| zombie urist | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 3 - | Urist Imiknorris, Toaster, Shakerag |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 1 - | Dariush |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 3 - | Hapah, zombie urist, IronyOwl, |
| No Lynch | - 0 - |
zombie urist has replaced Jim Groovester.
The Day will end tomorrow, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 05:03:18 am
Votecount:
zombie urist - 0 - Tiruin - 2 - Urist Imiknorris, Toaster Toaster - 0 - Dariush - 1 - Tiruin IronyOwl - 0 - TolyK - 0 - Urist Imiknorris - 0 - Hapah - 0 - Shakerag - 1 - Dariush - Not Voting - 4 - Shakerag, Hapah, zombie urist, IronyOwl, No Lynch - 0 -
zombie urist has replaced Jim Groovester.
The Day will end tomorrow, 8PM GMT.
zombie urist - 0 - Tiruin - 2 - Urist Imiknorris, Toaster Toaster - 0 - Dariush - 1 - Tiruin IronyOwl - 0 - TolyK - 0 - Urist Imiknorris - 0 - Hapah - 0 - Shakerag - 1 - Dariush - Not Voting - 4 - Shakerag, Hapah, zombie urist, IronyOwl, No Lynch - 0 -
Um.
TolyK - 0 -
Mod: Am I seeing right?
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 06:53:42 am
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 13, 2012, 07:00:46 am
Mod: Am I seeing right?
Yes. That's a mistake.
You do not need to quote the same post three times.
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 09:52:04 am
Kommandant: Relay my theory to the Kommandant. Request that he dispatch someone to our medical supplies (medical tent?), if possible, to
-Confirm that we are missing no drugs with characteristics similar to chloroform
-Gather information about who, if anyone, was treated with drugs similar to chloroform in the last few days
Post by: Toaster on November 13, 2012, 10:48:39 am
UI:
Toaster:UI: The above bolded bits have to mean something. If we assume for a second that there is more than one scum team, then assuming they don't have a standard kill (given only one night kill so far) then that doesn't seem quite so farfetched.So when the Kommandant said there were four spies, he was wrong?
I'd say it's a distinct possibility.
Hapah: You seem awfully interested in rooting out someone who could be a vig. If Dariush did kill Deathsword, would you vote him over it?
Shakerag:
Hapah: I'm having trouble disagreeing with your detectivorizing. If TolyK really was some kind of spy rolecop (maybe extra abilities aren't being shown in the roleflips?), and he did find such a thing on Dariush ... then Dariush is either scum or a vig.
So which is he? You're pointing the finger at him anyway- mad that he killed your buddy?
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 10:55:22 am
Tiruin: That's a nice wall of text, but you failed to (as far as I can tell) address my main point: that the reason that you didn't realize that spies had flipped is that none of your spy buddies had flipped. If that's wrong, please tell me why you missed it.I didn't miss it. Misunderstanding what I typed there? I'm getting the feeling like something is up with your sudden shift of viewpoint since you voted me.
By my wording, I had hoped to convey that I was using sarcasm as my vote was on Dariush - implying what I posted above to his case.Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
Though, I still don't get how you concluded that far-off idea. Let me try to sum it up: You thought I talked about flips pertaining to spies - guessing that the three dead are non-buddies of your suspect, thus arriving at your idea that I'm a spy and the dead aren't on my team - and based on that, thinking I had said out loud that...I'm scum by reasoning with the flips.
...That doesn't make any logical sense. Why the reasoning there?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 13, 2012, 11:04:06 am
Kommandant: Relay my theory to the Kommandant. Request that he dispatch someone to our medical supplies (medical tent?), if possible, to
-Confirm that we are missing no drugs with characteristics similar to chloroform
-Gather information about who, if anyone, was treated with drugs similar to chloroform in the last few days
Invalid action.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 11:06:35 am
Post by: Toaster on November 13, 2012, 11:09:54 am
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 11:15:52 am
Now that I think back, I had never thought that he was referring to TolyK then, as the last thing I saw was him swearing at Dariush and continued along that line of thought.
Post by: Shakerag on November 13, 2012, 11:29:54 am
Votecount:Confirm correct?
Tiruin - 2 - Urist Imiknorris, Toaster, Shakerag
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 13, 2012, 11:40:22 am
Votecount:Confirm correct?
Tiruin - 2 - Urist Imiknorris, Toaster, Shakerag
Confirmed incorrect.
Today is not my day.
Post by: Dariush on November 13, 2012, 12:21:43 pm
snipThat post is so mind-bogglingly stupid that I had to reread it twice. You are taking a flipped spy at his words, specifically the part that he found a perfume in my tent which I don't have, then proceed to decide that it somehow means that it is chloroform, of all things, because... uh, why? Because DS didn't struggle? So pressing a chloroformed cloth to one's mouth isn't going to provoke the struggle? I don't even have words to describe how atrociously far-fetched this is.
vomitYou're such a cretin I want to cry bloody tears. You admit to activelurking, jump on the bandwagon, agree with just about everyone without ever expressing actual opinions, OMGUS me after suddenly believing Hapah's idiotic theory and again forgetting the fact that Tolyk was a spy. I actually intended that vote to be pressure to cause you to finally shit an actual post after all this time, but it looks like all you're able to do is bandwagon and vomit.
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 01:15:24 pm
Quote from: LNCP
Invalid action.It can't ever be easy, can it?
Dar: Alright then, smartass. Since my idea is "mind-bogglingly stupid" and "atrociously far-fetched", let's hear yours. You tell me exactly how a man ends up throat slit, with no defensive wounds or signs of reaction, and no signs of being moved, on the edge of the camp. Let's hear it.
Post by: Dariush on November 13, 2012, 02:07:40 pm
Hey look, I've thought for literally several seconds and came with three asspull theories already, not one of which relies on a spy's claim! That's already more than you can say for yourself!
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 02:12:05 pm
Post by: zombie urist on November 13, 2012, 02:23:50 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 02:47:26 pm
Welcome aboard ZU.
Dar:
1.) And there wouldn't be an struggle? Is your assassin nine feet tall? He must be, to be able to slit the man's throat and pin both arms to keep DS from struggling.
2.) To what end? Makes no sense.
3.) Really?
Spoiler: Hey look, it's Dar (click to show/hide)
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 13, 2012, 04:16:09 pm
Exactly six. Why that?Six minimum.
On those questions, is it just because the one who asked them - a spy - mean that they shouldn't be continued regardless?
And yes, I am suggesting that information provided by an untrustworthy source is untrustworthy.
Quote
Do you think I would make such a move as to do what you suspect - ie, "No flip because they aren't on my team - borrowing from Toaster's idea"?What do you want me to think? Because that's not what I think. I think you ignored his flip because it doesn't matter to you. I think you're a third party. Notice, that D1 when everybody was asked what their purpose here was, you were the only one not to answer "Find some lost artifact or something." Yours appears to have an addition:
My mission is to find more information regarding some vague sort of technology or artifact.
Now that I think back, I had never thought that he was referring to TolyK then, as the last thing I saw was him swearing at Dariush and continued along that line of thought.What. That is the lamest excuse. Dariush wasn't dead, and thus hadn't roleflipped.
Hapah: I don't think I've ever seen you this confrontational.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 04:19:57 pm
And...doesn't that go along the line of 'find'? I'm not a third-party.QuoteDo you think I would make such a move as to do what you suspect - ie, "No flip because they aren't on my team - borrowing from Toaster's idea"?What do you want me to think? Because that's not what I think. I think you ignored his flip because it doesn't matter to you. I think you're a third party. Notice, that D1 when everybody was asked what their purpose here was, you were the only one not to answer "Find some lost artifact or something." Yours appears to have an addition:My mission is to find more information regarding some vague sort of technology or artifact.
Post by: Toaster on November 13, 2012, 04:38:01 pm
I was using UI's context as my springboard.
Now that I think back, I had never thought that he was referring to TolyK then, as the last thing I saw was him swearing at Dariush and continued along that line of thought.
Then who were you thinking of, then?
The more you try to explain this, the less I understand it.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 04:39:15 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 13, 2012, 04:41:40 pm
And...doesn't that go along the line of 'find'? I'm not a third-party.
It goes along the line of 'gather intelligence' a lot better.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 04:43:19 pm
So what are your cases on me other than those assumed differences?
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 04:44:28 pm
UI: Of course I'm confrontational. I have laid out what I believe to be a very probable description of how Deathsword ended up where he did how he did, and Dar's rebuttal was "No, it was a trained assassin Stretch Armstrong alien that decided to carry a corpse through a camp full of the most professional soldiers on the face of the planet". It makes no damn sense, and I can't believe that the flavor was put here just because it's tasty, it's too well-done and consistent. It was put here to help us figure out what the hell is going on. What do you expect me to do?
The way I see it, it's the word of a confirmed spy against Tir's suspected slip. I don't like either case, personally. I think there are more than four spies, but I can't figure out the shapes of the two teams; trying to figure out the motives of a Spy when you don't know how the teams are set up is dangerous. While I believe my theory to be correct, it's an open question as to whether Dar actually has chloroform as claimed by Tolyk, and I don't see an easy path to confirm the information one way or the other.
Tir: I'm PFP, so humor me if you've already been asked this. In the simplest language possible, describe how you managed to not realize that all deaths so far were of Spies. This is what happened, isn't it?
Post by: Toaster on November 13, 2012, 04:55:02 pm
So would you prefer I not explain it, and await the flip instead?
Well, no, but with that attitude I'm much more inclined to see you hang.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 04:57:30 pm
Tir: I'm PFP, so humor me if you've already been asked this. In the simplest language possible, describe how you managed to not realize that all deaths so far were of Spies. This is what happened, isn't it?I'm unsure whether I fail at restating something correctly or not.
I know that all the deaths are spies. Period. I am not blind to refute otherwise, because it was stated in BOLD by the MOD. Whatever was said that they were of any other type is all but speculation done by others on my words, subtly changing the meaning of what I intend to say.
I'm just getting the feeling that I'm being voted on poor wording and...nitpicking - Shakerag seems to be bandwagoning on that third vote, but given the current activity I'm not even sure anymore.
Not enough Extends for the day, and I won't be here to defend myself otherwise.
Mostly RL. It's not going too well, and I'm not getting what angle you're coming from - poor wording or...what?So would you prefer I not explain it, and await the flip instead?
Well, no, but with that attitude I'm much more inclined to see you hang.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 13, 2012, 04:59:35 pm
So what are your cases on me other than those assumed differences?You mean other than that and you trusting a flipped spy?
Toaster: He means that when I asked why he was trusting the words of a flipped spy, he assumed I meant Dariush, despite the fact that Dariush wasn't a flipped spy.
Post by: Toaster on November 13, 2012, 05:00:35 pm
PPE: Urist I: I didn't ask you. Is Tiruin your buddy too?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 13, 2012, 05:03:08 pm
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 05:05:47 pm
Trust is different from using the information given from anyone - spy or not. He explicitly said 'sweet-smelling liquid', something which does have a realistic match (other than, say, he found something specific and attempted to blame it on Dariush > not something I think would strike TolyK's fancy, as he was being vague, then presumed something as it went on). While it may be a convoluted lie, I'm finding it weird that you (and by reason, Toaster), don't try to pursue other points but starting with the weakest ones possible. What's wrong with using the information given? Can you prove otherwise?So what are your cases on me other than those assumed differences?You mean other than that and you trusting a flipped spy?
PPE: Urist I: I didn't ask you. Is Tiruin your buddy too?What in the world.
Tiruin: So answer the question then.I did. :/
Tiruin:The very person I voted? The one outlined in that post, right there. Dariush.I was using UI's context as my springboard.
Now that I think back, I had never thought that he was referring to TolyK then, as the last thing I saw was him swearing at Dariush and continued along that line of thought.
Then who were you thinking of, then?
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 05:11:04 pm
Thanks Tir; busy atm so can't go digging for old posts
Post by: IronyOwl on November 13, 2012, 10:21:07 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 10:22:41 pm
(I'm working on my reread at the moment, actually)
Post by: IronyOwl on November 13, 2012, 10:23:34 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 10:33:57 pm
Should also remind everyone that the game is on GMT, so it'll end around noon-ish Wednesday for those of us in the US.
Post by: zombie urist on November 13, 2012, 10:40:08 pm
Dariush's scenario's are all less likely and I don't really agree with some of his arguments.
Tiruin's posts are just hard to understand as usual, but I don't really see anything terribly scummy.
I have a slight gut reaction to UI's recent exchange with Toaster, but not much.
Shakerag and IO have been kinda lurky.
The Kommandant knows there are 4 spies and we have seen 3 spies flip, one from each of USA, UK, and FR.
Some people have mentioned the possibility of multiple scum teams, though I don't think we've collectively agreed how many teams there are.
Post by: Tiruin on November 13, 2012, 11:34:27 pm
So...
8pm GMT factors in to 4am GMT +8. Seems like I'll be able to make a few sparing posts later on.
And nobody else is doing that extend, or did I miss the last one? :/
Post by: Hapah on November 13, 2012, 11:38:12 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 13, 2012, 11:55:56 pm
Unvote Tiruin.
Let's go to Shakerag then since he's scum trying to figure out who killed his scumbuddy Deathsword.
Post by: Hapah on November 14, 2012, 01:55:05 am
I'm going to put my vote on Tiruin, though I'd love to know where the hell Toaster's shift to Shake came from. I can't follow it. Apologies for the delay; RL came up and I wanted to reread the day. Made a pot of coffee just so I could finish this damn thing.
IO and Shake have just lurked for most of the day, the former more than the latter. ZU is new (and Jim didn't join us this day), so nothing there. UI and Toaster have been needling Tiruin for four pages, but it's been the bulk of our content for the day. (PPE: And Toaster's shift to Shake seems a little funny, but it's probably just because I'm tired and can't fit the pieces together)
The whole Tiruin....thing started with either this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3781061#msg3781061) post, or maybe this (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3784346#msg3784346) post. The first post appears to be a reply to Dar's oddball theory that the spy team is stacked with "weak" players, and I see nothing suspicious about it. The second one does confuse me, though. And his posts go off the rails after that point, in a way: I've got to read some of the stuff after that two or three times to figure out what he's getting at. I still can't find out how Tir came up with what he did, but apparently Toaster sees the answer.
Dar's had some really oddball theories and tried to dismiss my (imo) very well-crafted argument by pulling things out of his ass. I can't say I much care for it.
For what it's worth, I think Tolyk did come into contact with Chloroform, likely through an "inspect" on someone (Question to others: Are LNCP inspect results usually fuzzy like Tolyk's was, or are they explicit?). I don't think he knew what he had found. If he was going to try to pin it on someone and knew what it was he would have been more explicit. It's possible that one of his buddies has (had?) Chloroform and he completely faked the inspect, but if that's the case it was very clever of him to put it out there the way he did. The open question is whether or not you can trust that a Spy targeted who he said he did, and if chloroform is as damning as I made it out to be.
And I've one last suggestion for everyone (though this one is admittedly a stretch, and we probably won't even need it. I need to go to bed, lol). Kommandant says there are four spies. If we lynch a spy today and Kommandant says "Good work, we got all the spies, let's get on with the mission", you can bet your ass I'm going along with it. He's a large man with a large-caliber handgun and a larger temper, and I don't want to end up on the wrong side of any of them. We can try to work the teams out amongst ourselves, but as far as I'm concerned Kommandant is always right, because he has a gun. Be careful, is all I'm trying to say.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 14, 2012, 02:24:17 am
| zombie urist | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 3 - | Urist Imiknorris, Shakerag, Hapah |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 2 - | Dariush, Toaster |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 2 - | zombie urist, IronyOwl |
| No Lynch | - 0 - |
IronyOwl has been prodded.
The Day has been modextended to Thursday, 8PM GMT.
I wanted to give zombie urist a little extra time because of the replace. There are no more Extends left for this Day.
Post by: zombie urist on November 14, 2012, 03:51:11 am
Hapah what are your reasons for your vote on Tiruin? So far I can only see that his posts are confusing, but TBH there not too unusual for him.
Toaster can you show where does it look like Shakerag is trying to find out who killed DS?
UI please summarize your case on Tiruin.
Dariush your ideas are really implausible. Seriously LNCP purposefully giving scum roles to weak players? I agree with Hapah's arguments more than yours.
Tiruin can you please summurize your case on Dariush.
Post by: IronyOwl on November 14, 2012, 06:35:57 am
For what it's worth, I think Tolyk did come into contact with Chloroform, likely through an "inspect" on someone (Question to others: Are LNCP inspect results usually fuzzy like Tolyk's was, or are they explicit?). I don't think he knew what he had found. If he was going to try to pin it on someone and knew what it was he would have been more explicit. It's possible that one of his buddies has (had?) Chloroform and he completely faked the inspect, but if that's the case it was very clever of him to put it out there the way he did. The open question is whether or not you can trust that a Spy targeted who he said he did, and if chloroform is as damning as I made it out to be.I have not been able to reread enough to find anything about chloroform. Is this related to the "perfume" someone found?
And I've one last suggestion for everyone (though this one is admittedly a stretch, and we probably won't even need it. I need to go to bed, lol). Kommandant says there are four spies. If we lynch a spy today and Kommandant says "Good work, we got all the spies, let's get on with the mission", you can bet your ass I'm going along with it. He's a large man with a large-caliber handgun and a larger temper, and I don't want to end up on the wrong side of any of them. We can try to work the teams out amongst ourselves, but as far as I'm concerned Kommandant is always right, because he has a gun. Be careful, is all I'm trying to say.What exactly are you saying here? Do you think there's more than four spies, but we should act like there aren't?
Post by: Dariush on November 14, 2012, 07:27:09 am
1.) And there wouldn't be an struggle? Is your assassin nine feet tall? He must be, to be able to slit the man's throat and pin both arms to keep DS from struggling.1) No, he would be able to slit a man's throat so that he'd bleed out too fast to be able to do anything about it.
2.) To what end? Makes no sense.
3.) Really?
2) ...So the corpse wouldn't be found? That's pretty obvious, really.
3) Ya rly.
Also, nice twisting of my words in the next post.
Dariush your ideas are really implausible. Seriously LNCP purposefully giving scum roles to weak players? I agree with Hapah's arguments more than yours.So, connecting a FLIPPED SPY BECAUSE I REALLY CAN'T STRESS THIS ENOUGH's supposed discovery of a sweet-smelling liquid in my tent with chloroform that also happens to be sweet-smelling and colourless (both of which are obviously extremely unique characteristics) with the fact that DS didn't struggle when he was killed makes more sense than an obvious explanation of the unprecedented ratio of scum-to-town deaths?
Tiruin's posts are just hard to understand as usual, but I don't really see anything terribly scummy.Ignoring all flips so far and then backtracking and horribly twisting own words doesn't qualify as 'terribly scummy' anymore?
Shakerag and IO have been kinda lurky.Eleven posts in the entire game, four of which are PFPs blahblah I said all this before is 'kinda lurky'?
Are you sure you've been reading the correct game?
Post by: Hapah on November 14, 2012, 10:35:49 am
I have not been able to reread enough to find anything about chloroform. Is this related to the "perfume" someone found?Correct. Tolyk (a now-confirmed Spy, so, y'know. Grain of salt.) claimed he found a vial of a sweet-smelling liquid which he guessed might be perfume. I played CSI: Nazi Camp with that information and the conditions surrounding DS's death to determine that it was probably chloroform or a similar drug(this post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3786009#msg3786009))
What exactly are you saying here? Do you think there's more than four spies, but we should act like there aren't?All I know is Kommandant has a gun and a temper, and isn't afraid to use either. If he says there are four spies, I'm not going to correct him. What you do is your business. The more I think about it the more I think it's irrelevant, but I was tired and it made perfect sense.
Dar: If I stretched your words, it wasn't by much. And I still think your answers are crap.
Post by: Toaster on November 14, 2012, 11:09:03 am
I didn't count votes- I was half falling at that point.
Shakerag I covered here (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3787656#msg3787656). He's far too interested in finding out who killed Deathsword (a spy) and seeing him gone, regardless of the alignment of the killer. He tipped his hand by FoSing Dariush, his main suspect of that. I'm pretty confident now that Shakerag is a teammate of Deathsword and he is seeking revenge.
Zombie U: The above paragraph should answer your question.
Post by: Shakerag on November 14, 2012, 11:47:18 am
Tiruin's feeling less scummy to me for now, the more I look at it. I think it's more of a ... language barrier thing.
TolyK may have been a spy, but I think his information *may* be legit regardless. I have an investigative power myself.
N1: Visited Jim. Found an old, well used compass in a coat pocket. Poor lighting didn't allow me to see much more than it was a compass.
N2: Visited Toaster. Didn't find anything in his coat. Faintly noticed a sweet smell apparently coming from his face. Found a leather case in his back pocket, but had to put it back and leave before I could check it out.
If TolyK was telling the truth about Dariush having a vial of a clear, sweet smelling liquid (that could very possibly be chloroform), and I happened to notice a sweet smell about Toaster's face ... that makes me think Dariush is quite likely a roleblocker. Assuming TolyK was being truthful, of course.
Although, that makes me wonder ... since TolyK was a spy, why did he have an inspect? He could have made what he said up, but it seems to collaborate with what I've found ...
Toaster: Why exactly do you think I'm aligned with Deathsword again? Quite frankly, I'm rather lost myself at this moment in time, so I'm not even sure *I* know what I'm doing here. Frankly, it seems like Hapah is showing way more effort in the "track down who killed Deathsword" thing than I am.
@279: I have no buddies to kill, therefore I cannot be mad about it. At that point in time, things seemed to be indicating that Dariush may have a night kill. Generally, that's going to paint him as either scum or a vig. Since there was the possibility of him being scum (although, apparently he would have had to have killed a spy he didn't know about somehow), I FoSed him. Now I'm inclined to think that Dariush may not have a killing role, however. I think roleblockers are frequently scum, but it's certainly possible for town to have a roleblocker as well.
Also, what's in your leather case?
Hapah: What you make of this new information in regards to your theorycrafting?
Also, I'm wondering now if the spies don't know who each other are. Would it be odd for a spy team to have three nationalities on it like that?
Post by: Hapah on November 14, 2012, 12:05:56 pm
Let me think on it for a bit.
Post by: Tiruin on November 14, 2012, 12:06:43 pm
Quote
The Day has been modextended to Thursday, 8PM GMT.
OH YES! THANK YOU!
@Hapah: Those two things you linked are unconnected. The response in relation to LNCP's words was affected by what I saw in other games - the statement to Dariush there was based on him judging full Spy flips to the current situation. On that second link - I presume you're talking about my statement on the artefact?
He did state it played a role in our position right now. It does, in a way that we're all tied to it in the current idea (but we're focusing on the living, present targets. Not something we only have vague details about), but I got lost on how it related to our current situation - different from the idea that it feels like it is tied to the roles. I'm not sure if this is worded right due to fatigue, but I'm saying that his way of saying the artifact feels like it plays of a more definite role than just flavor. Pointing the artifact out, or anything affected by it, as the unknown threat mentioned earlier. (correct if gotten (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3784160#msg3784160) wrong - bottom of link)
On your idea if Spy or No Spy - what if the game continues after four Spies have been killed? Given the Experimental case of this game, what would you expect to happen?
Tiruin can you please summurize your case on Dariush.> Overreaction to being called an imbecile and actually suspecting the person who called him such - focusing on the imbecile part other than calling the rest of the post which carried it, crap.
> Ambiguous statement regarding the response to Hapah's question on the death - pulled out from hammerspace and made obviously such. Not serious with the idea. While this does seem more like a meta tell than a scumtell, his opinions (inserting a scummy comment in most of his presumed targets' cases ; pointing out someone twisting words, without giving the evidence) say otherwise.
Spoiler: More on that point (click to show/hide)
IronyOwl: RL been holding you up?
Anyway: TolyK's (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3764069#msg3764069) statement on sweet-smelling liquid after stating perfume.
PPE: Shakerag/Hapah
So I take it, investigate-styled actions are rendered vague and flavory other than being point-blank and direct?
Although, that makes me wonder ... since TolyK was a spy, why did he have an inspect? He could have made what he said up, but it seems to collaborate with what I've found ...You mean he shares the idea of sweet-smelling liquids? And what do you think of his idea of shifting straight from perfume to specifically a sweet-smelling liquid (out of all ways to describe perfume) - coincidence or...?
Toaster:[...]Roleblocker whatnow? Where did a roleblocker appear in this equation?
@279: I have no buddies to kill, therefore I cannot be mad about it. At that point in time, things seemed to be indicating that Dariush may have a night kill. Generally, that's going to paint him as either scum or a vig. Since there was the possibility of him being scum (although, apparently he would have had to have killed a spy he didn't know about somehow), I FoSed him. Now I'm inclined to think that Dariush may not have a killing role, however. I think roleblockers are frequently scum, but it's certainly possible for town to have a roleblocker as well.
Also, what's in your leather case?
Toaster: Did you do...anything with your face? Meaning, did you know if you've been visited?
And what were you thinking on asking UI a question such as:
PPE: Urist I: I didn't ask you. Is Tiruin your buddy too?upon being answered 'no.'
Tiruin [...] more of a ... language barrier thing.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Hapah on November 14, 2012, 03:33:25 pm
Quote from: Tir
On your idea if Spy or No Spy - what if the game continues after four Spies have been killed? Given the Experimental case of this game, what would you expect to happen?I imagine we'll get down to business and start trying to find the artifact/tech, once the Kommandant is satisfied that the Spy threat has been dealt with. Maybe we'll even get told some info about it, if we're lucky. Beyond that, I don't really know.
Shake: Very interesting. I'll go through it bit by bit, but I don't have time to hit everything.
Quote from: Shake
TolyK may have been a spy, but I think his information *may* be legit regardless. I have an investigative power myself.I tend to agree with the first point, at least. I think he did inspect someone and relayed the information he found, though I can't be certain that he visited who he said he did. Also, why claim now? Does the fact that the last person to claim an inspect turned out to be a Spy and was hanged for his trouble worry you at all?
Quote from: Shake
N1: Visited Jim. Found an old, well used compass in a coat pocket. Poor lighting didn't allow me to see much more than it was a compass.Jim claimed that he specialized in guerrilla warfare (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3735304#msg3735304). I could imagine a compass being an almost vital piece of equipment for someone who was regularly behind enemy lines, so I guess this might be a mark in his favor? Thoughts?
Quote from: Shake
N2: Visited Toaster. Didn't find anything in his coat. Faintly noticed a sweet smell apparently coming from his face. Found a leather case in his back pocket, but had to put it back and leave before I could check it out.Now this is interesting, if true. I'm hoping Toaster can confirm that something happened to him N2. What made you leave, Shake?
Quote from: Shake
I think roleblockers are frequently scum, but it's certainly possible for town to have a roleblocker as well.If roleblocks are happening via chloroform, I'm inclined to think the blocker would more likely be town than scum, in this case (but I need to give it some more thought). The reason that immediately jumps to mind is that I've no idea why a spy would knock someone out like that and then let him live; it'd be a very easy and clean kill, I think. The fact that the person was completely defenseless but not killed suggests to me that the drugger doesn't want to throw away good men on a hunch, which would mean the drugger is probably town.
Could also be that chloroform doubles as a block and some sort of super-inspect, since whoever you drugged would be dead to the world (I feel like I'm on pretty shaky footing with this bit, though). Was Toaster sleeping really soundly? Do you have any idea?
Post by: Shakerag on November 14, 2012, 04:09:19 pm
Also, why claim now? Does the fact that the last person to claim an inspect turned out to be a Spy and was hanged for his trouble worry you at all?Mostly because I feel pretty lost in this game, so I figured throwing out the info I gathered could only help overall. Maybe someone will piece together something I missed (or will have additional information to shed light on what I found out). I'm not terribly concerned, because in my experience it's awfully damn rare for scum to have an investigative role. That's the one thing that makes me wonder about TolyK's claim. But then LNCP has indicated that this game will be unusual, so I'm not sure what to think.
Quote
Jim claimed that he specialized in guerrilla warfare (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3735304#msg3735304). I could imagine a compass being an almost vital piece of equipment for someone who was regularly behind enemy lines, so I guess this might be a mark in his favor? Thoughts?Looking back at his flavor, that seems like it would fit, yes. Although, to be fair, if we found out it was an American-made compass or something ...
Quote
Now this is interesting, if true. I'm hoping Toaster can confirm that something happened to him N2. What made you leave, Shake?According to my PM, I "heard something outside" and apparently decided it was time to leave.
Quote
Was Toaster sleeping really soundly? Do you have any idea?My PM didn't state one way or another. Given that I was leaning in close to his face and I patted him down to find the leather case without him waking, I'd guess so.
Tiruin:
You mean he shares the idea of sweet-smelling liquids? And what do you think of his idea of shifting straight from perfume to specifically a sweet-smelling liquid (out of all ways to describe perfume) - coincidence or...?Well, TolyK claims to have found a sweet smelling liquid on Dariush. I apparently noticed as a significant detail that Toaster's face smelled "sweet". Sure, it could be coincidence, but I thought it was noteworthy enough to mention. I'm not well versed in perfumes (and I have no idea to the extent that TolyK is knowledgeable about them either), so I'm not sure if calling a sweet-smelling liquid a "perfume" is a large stretch or not.
Quote
Roleblocker whatnow? Where did a roleblocker appear in this equation?Well, going off what Hapah has deduced, I assume the sweet smell on Toaster was from chloroform, and given that Toaster isn't dead, one might conclude he was knocked out. What kind of role would fit an action where someone got knocked out for the night? Roleblocker.
Post by: Toaster on November 14, 2012, 04:19:53 pm
Hapah: I'm having trouble disagreeing with your detectivorizing. If TolyK really was some kind of spy rolecop (maybe extra abilities aren't being shown in the roleflips?), and he did find such a thing on Dariush ... then Dariush is either scum or a vig.
This right here is what I have issue with. You're saying Dariush is, by deduction, either scum or a vig. There are two issues. One, you're not offering any opinions or insight as to which you think it is. Two, you're pointing your FoS at him, meaning you're condemning him. This is tipping your hand- you suspect he's killed Deathsword and, crucially, you take offense. The only reason you'd take offense is if Deathsword is your scumbuddy. Ergo, you are scum.
Hapah is just investigating in general- you're jumping to a conclusion.
As for the case, it's my Iron Cross. I keep it with me at all times to remind myself that I'm doing a good job for the German cause, and my efforts are not in vain nor unrecognized. I need this affirmation to keep down my insecurity.
Tiruin: I wasn't told I was blocked, given a sweet-smelling liquid, or anything of the sort.
I object in general to people answering questions for others, especially when it comes to explaining words or motives.
Post by: zombie urist on November 14, 2012, 08:02:18 pm
I am also going to believe Shakerag's claim as I do in fact have a compass. Since Toaster denies being given a sweet smelling liquid, either Shakerag is lying about inspecting him or Toaster is about being drugged. Another interesting thing I picked up on is that Toaster tried to smell someone else. The kicker however is that Toaster does admit to having a leather case, where he keeps his Iron Cross. I find it strange that one would keep a badge in a case instead of proudly displaying it on one's uniform.
If roleblocks are happening via chloroform, I'm inclined to think the blocker would more likely be town than scum, in this case (but I need to give it some more thought). The reason that immediately jumps to mind is that I've no idea why a spy would knock someone out like that and then let him live; it'd be a very easy and clean kill, I think. The fact that the person was completely defenseless but not killed suggests to me that the drugger doesn't want to throw away good men on a hunch, which would mean the drugger is probably town.This is very WIFOM-y.
Could also be that chloroform doubles as a block and some sort of super-inspect, since whoever you drugged would be dead to the world (I feel like I'm on pretty shaky footing with this bit, though). Was Toaster sleeping really soundly? Do you have any idea?
Post by: Hapah on November 14, 2012, 08:23:16 pm
Quote from: Shake
Looking back at his flavor, that seems like it would fit, yes. Although, to be fair, if we found out it was an American-made compass or something ...True enough. I did a quick search and couldn't find much of interest. I do wonder how you'd tell where a compass was made, though: unless it had something descriptive on there like a company name or "Made in X" it'd just be a circle with N/S/E/W on it and a needle.
Quote from: Shake
My PM didn't state one way or another. Given that I was leaning in close to his face and I patted him down to find the leather case without him waking, I'd guess so.I wonder if you would've found the case if he hadn't been drugged.
PPE:
ZU: Good to know about the compass. I would point out that it's possible Toaster was drugged while he slept (I've no idea what the aftereffects of chloroform would be). Though your observation about the Iron Cross is a valid one, I think.
Quote from: ZU
This is very WIFOM-y.Fair enough, though I think the second bit of the stuff you quoted is moreso than the first bit. Figured I'd at least get it out there.
Post by: Tiruin on November 14, 2012, 08:47:05 pm
Query for you claimed role-doers: What did you do N0?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 14, 2012, 09:27:48 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 14, 2012, 10:46:32 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 15, 2012, 08:17:37 am
| zombie urist | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 2 - | Urist Imiknorris, Hapah |
| Toaster | - 1 - | zombie urist |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 2 - | Dariush, Toaster |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 2 - | IronyOwl, Shakerag |
| No Lynch | - 0 - |
The Day will end in 7 hours.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 15, 2012, 08:48:12 am
Post by: Dariush on November 15, 2012, 09:25:29 am
TolyK may have been a spy, but I think his information *may* be legit regardless. I have an investigative power myself.His information may be legit because you're a spy with flavor inspect? Is that what you're saying?
Quote
> Overreaction to being called an imbecile and actually suspecting the person who called him such - focusing on the imbecile part other than calling the rest of the post which carried it, crap.A lie. You asked about the imbecile part, I answered about this part. I stated numerous times that my case isn't focused solely on this fact, but you chose to ignore me. Scum.
Quote
> Ambiguous statement regarding the response to Hapah's question on the death - pulled out from hammerspace and made obviously such. Not serious with the idea. While this does seem more like a meta tell than a scumtell, his opinions (inserting a scummy comment in most of his presumed targets' cases ; pointing out someone twisting words, without giving the evidence) say otherwise.Hapah specifically answered for my theories which don't involve chloroform. I gave him what he asked for.
Quote
> Theory regarding the Spies - newbies? Forced role giving? Trying to Outthink the GM...Trying to crack the puzzle or thinking up explanations for strange events is scummy now?
ZU, stop ignoring me, you fuckhole.
Also, since it's a tie, I can't say I really see any problem with Tiruin hanging. He spent the day lying, ignoring repetitions of the same retorts to his bullshit accusations and twisting everyone's words, including his own.
Post by: Tiruin on November 15, 2012, 09:26:29 am
Also, since it's a tie, I can't say I really see any problem with Tiruin hanging. He spent the day lying, ignoring repetitions of the same retorts to his bullshit accusations and twisting everyone's words, including his own.Hello scumbag.
Can you quote and link them.
Post by: Dariush on November 15, 2012, 09:35:55 am
PPE: Very well. Here, I scroll to the top of the page and quote your first post there:
First you expressed surprise at the spy flip matter. Then you said that you do, in fact, know that,Tir: I'm PFP, so humor me if you've already been asked this. In the simplest language possible, describe how you managed to not realize that all deaths so far were of Spies. This is what happened, isn't it?I'm unsure whether I fail at restating something correctly or not.
I know that all the deaths are spies. Period. I am not blind to refute otherwise, because it was stated in BOLD by the MOD. Whatever was said that they were of any other type is all but speculation done by others on my words, subtly changing the meaning of what I intend to say.
I'm just getting the feeling that I'm being voted on poor wording and...nitpicking - Shakerag seems to be bandwagoning on that third vote, but given the current activity I'm not even sure anymore.
Quote
because it was stated in BOLD by the MOD. Then you claim poor wording on your part. You never actually answer Hapah's question about why you expressed surprise.
Post by: Tiruin on November 15, 2012, 09:41:45 am
Hapah didn't ask about surprise, he was making sure what he was thinking was correct. Quote, in full and without quote mining.
Where, surprise. Explain, how.
Post by: Dariush on November 15, 2012, 09:59:29 am
Surprise:
Now tell me that it wasn't surprise. I dare, I double dare you, motherfucker. Just tell me it wasn't surprise one more goddamn time.Tiruin: Why are you taking the words of a flipped spy at face value?There's a flipped spy among us? What?
Oh.
OH.
And the vote shift was caused by a tie, you dumbfuck. Lynching a scummy piece of shit like you is infinitely more preferable to risking not reaching a decision by the time Kommandant demands one.
Post by: Tiruin on November 15, 2012, 10:06:06 am
Go ahead Dariush, call me all the names in the world which suits your trash talking tongue. I'm a damned thrice motherfucker who knows not the meaning or usage of your useless expletives.
Yeah, you goad me on, boy. Hit me with whatever shit you have up your messed up ass.
If you'd have missed what I said. I was trying SARCASM.
Think of it this way, everything you say - including all the expletives - is proven true if I had reacted under your claim. A really stupid way.
If that was surprise:
> I'd be posting blind - ignoring the whole Mod's post, including all the flips.
> In relation to what else I said, you'd be pushing a dead point which I already refuted on grounds of SARCASM.
> I'd be as stupid as hell. I believe your ego is mightily proud now?
Now, I'd ask why you're pushing that matter again. If I say it isn't surprise - its a lie, why?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 15, 2012, 10:12:27 am
Mod: Would someone know they were blocked if they didn't perform an action?
Assuming a standard roleblock (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Roleblocker), and no modifiers relevant to the situation present (powers/abilities/misc), no.
Post by: Dariush on November 15, 2012, 10:24:06 am
If that was surprise:So now it's sarcasm? Earlier it was just 'poor wording'. Also, good job covering up your scumslips with 'I couldn't have done that because it's stupid' arguments and ignoring Pulp fiction references.
> I'd be posting blind - ignoring the whole Mod's post, including all the flips.
> In relation to what else I said, you'd be pushing a dead point which I already refuted on grounds of SARCASM.
> I'd be as stupid as hell. I believe your ego is mightily proud now?
Post by: Tiruin on November 15, 2012, 10:26:27 am
I believe you missed that post (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117245.msg3785485;topicseen#msg3785485)?
Post by: zombie urist on November 15, 2012, 01:12:11 pm
So, connecting a FLIPPED SPY BECAUSE I REALLY CAN'T STRESS THIS ENOUGH's supposed discovery of a sweet-smelling liquid in my tent with chloroform that also happens to be sweet-smelling and colourless (both of which are obviously extremely unique characteristics) with the fact that DS didn't struggle when he was killed makes more sense than an obvious explanation of the unprecedented ratio of scum-to-town deaths?Yes.
...
Ignoring all flips so far and then backtracking and horribly twisting own words doesn't qualify as 'terribly scummy' anymore?
...
Eleven posts in the entire game, four of which are PFPs blahblah I said all this before is 'kinda lurky'?
...
Are you sure you've been reading the correct game?
Don't really see it.
Yes.
Yes.
Also I love how you changed your vote right before day end.
Post by: Tiruin on November 15, 2012, 01:55:11 pm
Post by: Dariush on November 15, 2012, 02:08:33 pm
As for that post, it doesn't matter. At the post I quoted earlier, you distinctly said that it was 'bad wording'. I pointed this out numerous times to you. You ignored everything. Just because you called your vomit sarcasm earlier doesn't change it.
Also I love how you changed your vote right before day end.Do the words 'tie', 'tie-breaking' and 'non-commital, lazy scum who doesn't read the thread and answers questions with one-word throwaway shit' mean anything to you?
Post by: Tiruin on November 15, 2012, 02:11:25 pm
As for that post, it doesn't matter. At the post I quoted earlier, you distinctly said that it was 'bad wording'. I pointed this out numerous times to you. You ignored everything. Just because you called your vomit sarcasm earlier doesn't change it.The best excuse in the world to keep your vote on me.
Stubbornness in the face of obviousness.
Post by: Dariush on November 15, 2012, 02:23:08 pm
The best excuse in the world to keep your vote on me.Obviousness? Of what? Of you being scum? Yes, it is there.
Stubbornness in the face of obviousness.
I mean, do you really expect me to exclaim 'Oh, woe unto me! How wrong I was!' and tie the vote back minutes before the day end, especially after all the random shit you threw at me to get my vote off you? I mean, stalling? By not posting for THREE HOURS? Really?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 15, 2012, 02:52:50 pm
Night 3 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| zombie urist | - 0 - | |
| Tiruin | - 3 - | Urist Imiknorris, Hapah, Dariush |
| Toaster | - 1 - | zombie urist |
| Dariush | - 1 - | Tiruin |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 1 - | Toaster |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 2 - | IronyOwl, Shakerag |
| No Lynch | - 0 - |
The soldiers begin to argue further. This day, a glimmer of hope begins to shine out - four spies, counted the Kommandant, and three down. They had only to find one more; the rest (they hoped) would be spared. Their mission would continue anew. Words found strength, even into the approaching night - though the darkness enveloped them, and though the great night and its alien cries surrounded them, the camp, its fires and its warmth shone through like a beacon in the storm.
The Kommandant had sat with a pack of cigarettes off to the edge in his rain-shelter, watching them solemnly. The smoke, heavy and sluggish in the rainy air, clung low to the ground and sought refuge near him, surrounding him in a grey, sticky mist continually renewed by the lit flames, burning softly. In silent study, he plucks the softly glowing cigarette with his left hand, holding his revolver in his right, turning it idly about it his hand. He checked his watch.
No, not yet.
The soldiers continue, talk on as the night deepens. Eventually, calculating that the moment had arrived, the Kommandant raises his gun.
The blast rings clear through the camp. They fall silent, awaiting the Kommandant’s words. He approaches, wordlessly - the revolver lies tucked in the pocket of his long black coat, and drawing the last wafts of black smoke from the ashen stub, he flicks it onto the ground. His boots dig into the ground as he strides toward them.
“Who is it?” A simple question - everyone understood what he meant.
“Friedrich.” The answer is prompt, unhesitant. The crowd disperses to reveal him, frozen to the earth.
The next few moments proceeded quickly. The Kommandant closed in, and stood before the man so close that he could smell his breath as the giant glared down into his eyes. Raising the end of the black silencer to the man's chin, he pulled the trigger, unflinchingly, letting the now-limp body fall into the mud.
When the others regain their composure, he is already cleaning off his gun, motioning for two soldiers to search the body.
After a few moments, they silently present him with another passport. Holstering his revolver somewhere in his jacket, he takes it and leafs through it, quickly - and with a smile, he brandishes the miniature photograph for all to see.
“Good work. This is a British passport; his real name was Brian Cleeve.”
A sigh of relief fills the air. The ordeal is over.
“We have killed all the spies, now. Rest for tonight, and celebrate, if you want to. We will continue with the mission tomorrow.”
Friedrich “Tiruin” Gerig was lynched! He was a Spy.
The Night will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 18, 2012, 10:58:26 am
Day 4 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| zombie urist | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 7 - | Shakerag, Toaster, zombie urist, Urist Imiknorris, Hapah, Hapah, Dariush |
| No Lynch | - 0 - |
The day dawns with new, vibrant energy. The soldiers, now purified, the camp purged of its demons, awaken with smiles on their faces and bright eyes - bright for the first time in three days.
They don their uniforms, have breakfast, merrily, and with much talk, and step outside for their morning drill before the work of the day would begin. Though the exercise is strenuous, they do it eagerly, savouring the return to activity. With the sun high and bright in the sky, the heavens cloudless and long last, they gather in the centre of the camp, awaiting instruction.
The Kommandant appears from within a tent, dressed in his usual long black coat. Again, today, he frowns as he solemnly approaches the men - and they, seeing his graveness, quieten.
“Last night, I received ill news. More spies have snuck into the camp - we will not be resuming the mission today. The men who have stood watch last night have been dealt with, and we will repeat what we did yesterday. Understood?”
Nervous laughs creep across the ranks, confused smiles - but the Kommandant says nothing. Eventually, unable to bear the silence, one of the soldiers ask, “Surely, this must be a joke, sir? Did we not kill all of the spies?”
And, as if to demonstrate his intentions, the Kommandant unholsters his revolver from inside his jacket, and fires a shot at him with pinpoint accuracy. He crumples to the ground.
“Does anyone else wish to comment?”
Silence. The air grows cold - a chill wind blows through the clearing.
“Begin.”
The Day will end Wednesday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 18, 2012, 12:10:57 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 18, 2012, 08:11:15 pm
Irony, same question to you.
Hapah: Why do you have an extra vote today?
Post by: IronyOwl on November 18, 2012, 08:14:02 pm
Irony, same question to you.Because I could not figure out what the hell was going on.
Post by: Hapah on November 18, 2012, 10:28:00 pm
Hapah: Why do you have an extra vote today?Probably for the same reason you had it D1 (D2? I think it was you with the double vote, wasn't it?) I've even got an idea of how it might work, but I haven't convinced myself yet. Need to do a little research.
Hapah. You seem to have predicted this, more or less. That's odd.The pieces are all there, you just have to put them together. I'm happy that my educated guesses seem to be pretty close to the mark so far, though!
Post by: zombie urist on November 19, 2012, 02:18:40 am
ZU: You expect me to be wearing a medal... in a combat zone... on a secret mission... while I'm sleeping?I forgot this earlier, but even though I'm not familiar with military procedures and proper medal maintenance, but I highly doubt that a leather case is the proper way to store a medal.
Probably for the same reason you had it D1 (D2? I think it was you with the double vote, wasn't it?) I've even got an idea of how it might work, but I haven't convinced myself yet. Need to do a little research.Wanna share?
Post by: Dariush on November 19, 2012, 03:33:45 am
Hapah. You seem to have predicted this, more or less. That's odd....What? Where did you see it? Also, any other... suspicions besides Hapah, IO?
ZU, you still haven't answered my questions. Why is breaking a tie suspicious to you? Do you have any suspicions now that Toaster's case of medalincasetitis is resolved?
Post by: Hapah on November 19, 2012, 10:35:28 am
Quote from: ZU
Wanna share?I think it's just a role; and I've a guess how it would work. Not sure that it's important, but I can run it out if you want.
I am disturbed by the D4 opener, though.
Quote from: Kommandant
“Last night, I received ill news. More spies have snuck into the camp - we will not be resuming the mission today. The men who have stood watch last night have been dealt with, and we will repeat what we did yesterday. Understood?”This tells us that the spies arrived last night. Gentlemen, we've all been here for at least three days already. I suppose it's possible guards saw one of us coming and going doing spy stuff, but why they'd risk it last night is beyond me.
LNCP: Confirm D4 opening flavor is correct?
Post by: Shakerag on November 19, 2012, 10:43:38 am
I was just saying that his information seemed to collaborate with my information is all. It might have been lucky coincidence, it might not have been. I think we can stop speculating on this though.TolyK may have been a spy, but I think his information *may* be legit regardless. I have an investigative power myself.His information may be legit because you're a spy with flavor inspect? Is that what you're saying?
Also, Shakerag/Hapah: Toaster, who was supposedly chloroform'd according to your theories, doesn't know it. Don't you think that he of all people would notice the sweet smell supposedly coming from his face?On one hand, possibly not, if the smell had disappated by the time he woke. On the other hand, flavor is as flavor does. If Toaster was roleblocked, and the mechanics of the game state you don't know if you've been blocked, then the flavor would reflect that. Regardless of whether or not it would make sense to notice a smell on one's person.
Shakerag, as per yesterday. Why didn't you vote yesterday?What IronyOwl said. Didn't know what was going on, my vote wouldn't have changed anything at day end anyway, and while I didn't have a real case on Tiruin, I had a niggling gut feeling about him being scum, so didn't mind if he got lynched.
However, I can give you all some solid info for today. I investigated Dariush last night and confirmed he had a sweet, but not strongly-scented vial of liquid on his person. My flavor seemed to indicate that this was not, in fact, perfume. Didn't say it was chloroform either, but there you have it.
Of course, that's not enough to vote Dariush by itself. On the other hand, the French passport for an "Antoine Campagner" hidden in a hollowed out book in Dariush's stuff *is* a good enough reason to vote for the filthy spy.
Post by: Dariush on November 19, 2012, 10:59:22 am
Oh wait, you are not. Besides the fact that your 'findings' are incorrect.
1) Suddenly your third inspect reveals the target's name;
2) Everyone dead so far had their passport on their body and not in their things;
3) Did you really have had enough time to search every single book in my belongings after claiming to only having enough time/lighting for a cursory search of the two previous targets?
Oh, and completely coincidentally it is MYLO. The best time for a fakeclaim. Sooo... yeah, you're pretty much lying scum, Shakerag.
Post by: Toaster on November 19, 2012, 11:01:29 am
Oh, and completely coincidentally it is MYLO. The best time for a fakeclaim. Sooo... yeah, you're pretty much lying scum, Shakerag.
What makes you say this is MYLO?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 19, 2012, 12:19:24 pm
Dariush: You do realize that Shakerag's claim was confirmed by ZU and Toaster yestorday, right? Also, I too am curious about the MyLo point.
Shakerag: Why inspect Dariush?
Post by: Dariush on November 19, 2012, 12:32:47 pm
Dariush:Because there cannot be four spies, as they would already have won. Therefore, it is at most three. Most probably it is three. If there are no vigs and we mislynch, tomorrow there'll be either six or five people (depending on whether the new spies have a kill), three of which will be spies. Thus, the only circumstance in which this wouldn't be MYLO is if it's two spies, which is unlikely in my opinion.Oh, and completely coincidentally it is MYLO. The best time for a fakeclaim. Sooo... yeah, you're pretty much lying scum, Shakerag.
What makes you say this is MYLO?
Dariush: You do realize that Shakerag's claim was confirmed by ZU and Toaster yestorday, right? Also, I too am curious about the MyLo point.I don't doubt that he has an inspect. I do doubt (or rather am completely certain in the opposite) that he either did not inspect me tonight or lied about his results.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 19, 2012, 01:03:33 pm
Because there cannot be four spies, as they would already have won. Therefore, it is at most three. Most probably it is three.If by "most probably" you mean "no chance at all" then yes. Notice that the only people who have died so far have been spies. Quite simply, the town has a perfect record of lynching spies, and the killer has a perfect record of killing them. And now you're suggesting that most probably the mod would force us into a situation where we have to choose correctly again today or we lose anyway despite a flawless game so far? Bullshit. This game may be bastardy, but if it's anywhere near that imbalanced I will
Post by: Toaster on November 19, 2012, 01:10:16 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 19, 2012, 01:45:44 pm
LNCP: Confirm D4 opening flavor is correct?
Confirmed correct.
Post by: zombie urist on November 19, 2012, 02:04:38 pm
This is the most blatant chainsaw ever. Tie breaking isn't suspicious, but the fact that it happened so close to day end was. Yes. DariushHapah. You seem to have predicted this, more or less. That's odd....What? Where did you see it? Also, any other... suspicions besides Hapah, IO?
ZU, you still haven't answered my questions. Why is breaking a tie suspicious to you? Do you have any suspicions now that Toaster's case of medalincasetitis is resolved?
I think it's just a role; and I've a guess how it would work. Not sure that it's important, but I can run it out if you want.Sure why not.
Also I find it pretty funny that Toaster and UI just repeated each other twice.
Post by: Dariush on November 19, 2012, 03:08:30 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 19, 2012, 03:26:12 pm
Post by: Dariush on November 20, 2012, 11:02:04 am
Tie breaking isn't suspicious, but the fact that it happened so close to day end was. Yes. DariushWait what? Breaking ties close to the day end is suspicious? WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK. Also, attacking someone for a resonless vote isn't chainsawing. Also also, obvious bandwagon is obvious.
Dariush: So you're saying... what? Overnight three people suddenly decided they were no longer honest, hard working Germans and suddenly developed a hankering for either hamburgers, fish and chips, or croissants?Actually, I thought that the spies killed watchmen and took over their identities. This would explain both the influx of spies and the disappearance of the guards. What's your take on this, anyway? What would you say about the number of new spies?
Post by: Toaster on November 20, 2012, 12:16:44 pm
“Last night, I received ill news. More spies have snuck into the camp - we will not be resuming the mission today. The men who have stood watch last night have been dealt with, and we will repeat what we did yesterday. Understood?”
You could even say...
You don't seem to care much for the words of our Kommandant
Unless, of course, you're trying to imply the Kommandant is a spy.
I say either there's a cult (not likely) or that the Kommandant had bad info to begin with (most likely).
Post by: Hapah on November 20, 2012, 12:36:30 pm
Is the forum going nuts for anyone else? I have to refresh 4 or 5 times before anything will come up.
Extend. FYI, I won't have internet from Wednesday evening until sometime Saturday most likely.
Post by: Dariush on November 20, 2012, 01:44:35 pm
...Then I completely forgot about the existence of shifts and the schedule of who's supposed to be watching when. Gah.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 20, 2012, 02:19:29 pm
| zombie urist | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 3 - | zombie urist, Urist Imiknorris, Shakerag, |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 2 - | Dariush, Toaster |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 2 - | Hapah, Hapah |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 1 - | Hapah |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The Day will end Wednesday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 20, 2012, 02:19:49 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 20, 2012, 03:39:51 pm
The Day has been modextended to Thurday, 8PM GMT due to forum technical issues.
Start posting more!
Post by: Toaster on November 20, 2012, 04:26:46 pm
Dariush. One day you'll learn to fakeclaim.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 20, 2012, 09:34:21 pm
...Then I completely forgot about the existence of shifts and the schedule of who's supposed to be watching when. Gah.These exist?
Post by: zombie urist on November 20, 2012, 11:11:43 pm
Wait what? Breaking ties close to the day end is suspicious? WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK. Also, attacking someone for a reasonless vote isn't chainsawing. Also also, obvious bandwagon is obvious.You had plenty of time to break the tie. Also, IO put a reason which Hapah himself confirmed. Also also, I voted you for completely different reasons.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 12:48:16 am
Post by: Dariush on November 21, 2012, 08:26:37 am
Also, IO is the killer. The only kill so far was on the night when I didn't block him. Also he has a passport written in English, as does Shakerag.
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 08:50:57 am
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 09:14:00 am
My gut tells me that the best thing possible right now would be to vote UI for reasons unexplained.You might want to explain them.
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 10:14:23 am
1) Suddenly your third inspect reveals the target's name;1 - Don't ask me how my inspect works. Maybe it's because you've been inspected before, maybe it gets more detailed with each use. Unorthodox game, remember?
2) Everyone dead so far had their passport on their body and not in their things;
3) Did you really have had enough time to search every single book in my belongings after claiming to only having enough time/lighting for a cursory search of the two previous targets?
Oh, and completely coincidentally it is MYLO. The best time for a fakeclaim. Sooo... yeah, you're pretty much lying scum, Shakerag.
2 - Maybe you decided to hide yours after seeing the other dead spies.
3 - Flavor didn't indicate searching through many books. Just one.
4 - Way to pull MYLO out of your ass.
Shakerag: Why inspect Dariush?Didn't have a better target for inspect, and thought it would be interesting to see if I could confirm if TolyK inspected Dariush or not.
My gut tells me that the best thing possible right now would be to vote UI for reasons unexplained.So wait ... you're basically claiming you blocked IO N1 and N3, and then somehow inspected both IO and me N2? Either you have a super fantastic role, are being fed info from your scumbuddy, or are making shit up out of whole cloth.
Also, IO is the killer. The only kill so far was on the night when I didn't block him. Also he has a passport written in English, as does Shakerag.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 11:35:17 am
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 12:21:30 pm
My gut tells me that the best thing possible right now would be to vote UI for reasons unexplained.All I know is my gut says maybe. And wtf.
Also, IO is the killer. The only kill so far was on the night when I didn't block him. Also he has a passport written in English, as does Shakerag.
You have a lot of explaining to do.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 01:56:11 pm
Urist Imiknorris. Urist Imiknorris.
Now, first things first. I am a Spy. Dar is also a Spy. If you're a Nazi, well, I suppose you don't need to read any farther, lol. If you're not a Nazi (and I'm damn sure at least one of you lot isn't) then please keep reading.
I have been forced into this rather unfortunate position by necessity. With Dar managing to attract votes from every damn person in the game, and IO (who I do believe is the killer of Deathsword, FYI) having me as a primary suspect, we decided we'd have slightly better odds with my hairbrain scheme than from me trying to asspull a case on someone. If nothing else, it's a hell of a lot more interesting, lol.
Today, I have been blessed with two votes. I believe (but am not certain) that UI is the one who grants the doublevote, and so must be eliminated if we are to have a chance of victory. Me and Dar have three votes between us today; we need four to achieve the necessary lynch today. This is why I have turned to you, Spy in the audience. I need your help.
Whoever you are, I would ask you to look at your wincon. I can't quote mine lest I be modkilled, obviously, but really look at it. I would like to believe that it is similar to mine. If it is, I do not believe that our win conditions are mutually exclusive. You can ask LNCP for clarification, but I imagine it will be frustratingly vague.
If you have read this far, thank you. During WWII the nations opposed to Germany and the Axis were known collectively as the Allies. I would like to think that we can be allies, here: A victory here for the US is a victory for Britain, a victory for France. We are not enemies, not foes. I hope that you will stand with us when you are needed most.
I will be leaving for the holidays in four, maybe four and a half hours. I do not expect to have internet until sometime Saturday, at the earliest. I will do my best to answer any questions asked before I leave, and I apologize that it took so long to get this out.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 02:10:43 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 02:12:36 pm
Post by: Dariush on November 21, 2012, 02:15:14 pm
Welcome to Bastard Supernatural II: Nazi Edition. Shakerag and IO are the Brits, and I am really damn surprised that they're not the three-man team considering IronyOwl's kill.And you just sat on this information? Way to go. Do you possess any knowledge regarding the double vote? Is Toaster on the same team as you?
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 02:29:43 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 21, 2012, 02:32:42 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 02:34:50 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 02:41:47 pm
I figured it out by process of elimination. I knew everybody was scum after Deathsword died. Likewise, I also knew the killer was British because it sure as hell wasn't us who killed him. I knew you were French when Tiruin flipped British. I knew Shakerag was British when he went after you. ZU and Toaster are my fellow Americans, and Toaster is the vote thief who can give the vote to anyone or just make it go away. He can even steal his own vote, but either ZU or I have to help him and if either of us are blocked it fails.
Like I said, welcome to Bastard Supernatural II: Nazi Edition.
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 02:43:27 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 02:50:05 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 02:52:10 pm
I was indeed blocked N2, BTW. No idea why nobody put two and two together there.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 02:52:44 pm
Also you hadn't indicated suspicion of any of us.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 03:01:51 pm
UI: Why are you voting a Brit?
Post by: Dariush on November 21, 2012, 03:06:48 pm
I was indeed blocked N2, BTW. No idea why nobody put two and two together there.Actually, I thought you (or rather I didn't know it was you) could only use it every two nights or something.
Also, now I see no problem with voting IO.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 03:10:16 pm
UI: Why are you voting a Brit?I'm voting the guy with the kill and hoping the answer isn't "Shoot the Kommandant."
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 03:11:35 pm
UI: Why are you voting a Brit?
Why are you voting an American?
So if everyone is a spy, what's the win condition? Is it possible that the way to win is for everyone to vote No-Lynch, thus signifying our solidarity in opposing the Kommandant? We're soldiers- we should have weapons.
Post by: Dariush on November 21, 2012, 03:14:57 pm
So if everyone is a spy, what's the win condition? Is it possible that the way to win is for everyone to vote No-Lynch, thus signifying our solidarity in opposing the Kommandant? We're soldiers- we should have weapons.Huh, I didn't think of it. No lynch. Might as well block IO tonight.
Why the huge empty space?
Also, what if it's all a huge simulation? The fact that only a select few participate in the whole game out of the ton of people who should be in the camp and the fact that a sudden addition of twelve new people went unnoticed makes me suspect that it's some kind of training or a game.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 03:24:09 pm
Quote from: Toaster
Is it possible that the way to win is for everyone to vote No-Lynch, thus signifying our solidarity in opposing the Kommandant?Doubtful. The rules say that on a No-Lynch someone is killed randomly, and also that the mod will never lie. If the rule that the mod can't lie is a lie, well. This will be my first and last LNCP game if that's the case, lol.
Quote from: Dar
Also, what if it's all a huge simulation? The fact that only a select few participate in the whole game out of the ton of people who should be in the camp and the fact that a sudden addition of twelve new people went unnoticed makes me suspect that it's some kind of training or a game.The game only had 11. Food for thought, all the same. What would we even do?
UI, Toaster, ZU: So did you lot sneak in N0? I guess you're the group that got found out?
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 21, 2012, 03:27:28 pm
| zombie urist | - 0 - | |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 3 - | zombie urist, Shakerag, Toaster |
| IronyOwl | - 1 - | Urist Imiknorris |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 2 - | Hapah, Hapah |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 0 - | |
| No Lynch | - 1 - | Dariush |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 1 - | Hapah |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The Day will end Thursday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 04:11:13 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 04:15:21 pm
Everyone: Full claim time. Actions, results, and teammates.
Extend
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 04:18:08 pm
Forgot to do that.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 21, 2012, 04:23:37 pm
Any change of a mod-extension, on account of the game needing a replacement and the holiday? I'm having a blast, but I simply can't play between now and Saturday.
I'm considering it, but at the same time, I'm not enjoying the idea of giving everyone four more unplanned days. I could temporarily lock this game and resume it next week Sunday 8PM GMT (meaning the Day would end on Monday or Tuesday at the latest, though it's going to be a terrible week for me), if people think it's sorely needed.
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 04:25:18 pm
Vote No Lynch
I have a vote steal. I can take a vote from anyone and give it to anyone else or make it disappear.
I, along with UI, ZU, and the late BMC are Americans.
N1 I gave Dariush's vote to myself
N2 I tried to give Tiruin's vote to Hapah, but was blocked.
N3 I gave Irony's vote to Hapah.
--
Locking the game for a bit is a great way to kill it.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 04:26:29 pm
Shake: Can you at least confirm that you are a Brit?
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 04:28:13 pm
Shake: I'm short on time and we've much to figure out. What's the oddity that you see?
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 04:29:10 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 04:30:13 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 04:31:12 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 21, 2012, 04:34:14 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 04:34:27 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 04:35:51 pm
PPE There's one vote opposed. Looks like I've got about two hours to figure this out, lol.
Shake: I'm short on time and we've much to figure out. What's the oddity that you see?
I want to see zombie urist claim. Info I have contradicts what's been stated so far.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 04:40:08 pm
I have no abilities other than chat access.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 04:43:47 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 04:45:27 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 04:53:53 pm
I'm a Brit, along with the deceased TolyK, Tiruin, and ... zombie urist. Who is also apparently an American. I do have an inspect, and it was me who investigated Dariush N1, not TolyK. I have reported my results faithfully. Outside of my previously claimed N1 inspect, of course.
So, to confirm:
•
•Toaster - American
•Dariush - French
•IronyOwl - ??
•
•Hapah - French
•Shakerag - Brit
Also, who blocked Toaster N2, then? Dariush said he was blocking IO ...
Investigate:
N0 - Couldn't action.
N1 - Dariush, found vial of clear, sweet-smelling liquid.
N2 - Toaster, had sweet smell on his face, leather case in back pocket.
N3 - Dariush, found vial again, confirmed not perfume, not a strong smell, French passport found
My issue with Jim/zu is that he apparently did not let either team he was on know about that fact.
If Jim/zu is on the same team as Toaster and UI, then I'm wondering why he (Jim( was advocating investigating Toaster N2. Also, zu stated he was setting up Toaster so one of us could jump on him.
So IO is unclaimed by any team, and zu is on two, but he/Jim have made some actions that would seem ... detrimental to one or both of his teams.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:01:50 pm
Quote by me from Americhat: "ZU, are you trying to make us look bad?"
So ZU's a cheat and nobody's claiming IO. And here I was wondering how TolyK got that inspect result without your team having two inspects.
Suggestion: Lynch zombie urist, block+votesteal IronyOwl, lynch him tomorrow.
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:13:15 pm
I'm a Russian with IO. IO has a kill, I have access to all chats.
My win-con is to find the mysterious source of power in the woods.
We can win with any team.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:15:09 pm
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:15:49 pm
My contigency plan was to get Toaster/IU lynched today, kill the other one tonight, lynch Shakerag tomorrow and win with Dariush/Hapah.
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:16:43 pm
I can still be the deciding factor on which team wins.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:18:38 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 05:18:50 pm
Spoiler: This is me right now (click to show/hide)
ZU and IO might be on the same team.
PPE: FUCKING SHIT. The hell do we do now?
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:19:20 pm
Since the Kommandant says there are 3 spies left, I recommend lynching Shakerag today.
IO kills Toaster tonight.
Dariush blocks Toaster.
Tomorrow Hapah/Dariush/IO/ZU lynches UI.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 05:20:34 pm
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:21:08 pm
If you guys lynch me Toaster's double vote will overpower Dariush's roleblock.
And don't forget I can still see your scumchats.
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:21:56 pm
This plan guarantees a French victory.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:23:43 pm
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:24:28 pm
Since the game isn't over yet, I dunno.
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 05:24:48 pm
Hmm. My wincon doesn't really seem to indicate eliminating anyone other than Nazis. And securing the artifact/technology thing. So ...
Toaster/UI: Can you confirm Jim was listed in your initial chat as a teammate?
Dariush/Hapah: Ditto?
PPE: DIAF zombie urist
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:25:27 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:26:20 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 05:31:56 pm
Russia was an allied nation too. :(
Technically, he has a point. The game is set in 1942, and Russia allied with the UK in 1941.
So ... either only one country's team is supposed to win ... or ... what? We all no-lynch and overpower the rest of the soldiers?
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:33:45 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:35:47 pm
I'm pretty sure they're the same as mine - cooperate with our fellows to eliminate our foes. The Russians want the thingy, and I'm willing to bet everyone else is here to mess up the mission of finding the thingy.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 05:38:17 pm
Russia was an allied nation too. :(Yeah, you were allied. And then you started killing your allies. I knew I was on the right track with my CSI train of thought.
Shake: Confirmed.
UI: Agreed.
Kommandant wants spies? Let's give him some fucking Russian spies. That shit will look great, yeah? Reports of new spies infiltrating, flip Spies from a new faction.
Here's what we should do. Lynch ZU (maybe even Shorten? Thoughts?). Lock down IO. Lynch IO tomorrow. If they do both flip Russian as they should, we'll go from there. I'd just sit on my hands that next night, if I was you: no reason to give the Kommandant any ideas that something is going on. And then, hopefully, we can get on with the mission at the start of D6 and win.
Sound like a plan?
PPE: Don't quote your wincon directly, per the OP. Summaries are okay though. I tap-danced around mine earlier, but it's about the same. Getting the thingy is a plus per the flavor.
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 05:41:28 pm
Brits, Frenchmen: What are you guys' wincons?
I'm pretty sure they're the same as mine - cooperate with our fellows to eliminate our foes. The Russians want the thingy, and I'm willing to bet everyone else is here to mess up the mission of finding the thingy.
That sounds like an accurate approximation of my wincon. Flavor says to basically find out info on what Nazis are searching for and anything else of importance. Recovering artifact is a bonus. Eliminate Nazis, no survivors.
So ... if none of us actually are Nazis ... who exactly are the "foes" in our wincons?
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:42:00 pm
My 'fake' wincons were all to locate the power, so give me any BS there.
I was playing to my win-con. I did what was necessary. I tried to evenly kill all 3 teams, which might have been a mistake in hindsight.Russia was an allied nation too. :(Yeah, you were allied. And then you started killing your allies. I knew I was on the right track with my CSI train of thought.
I can guarantee you the power source.
Anyways I probably won't be able to post anymore until tongiht.
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 05:42:55 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 05:45:17 pm
Here's what we should do. Lynch ZU (maybe even Shorten? Thoughts?). Lock down IO. Lynch IO tomorrow. If they do both flip Russian as they should, we'll go from there. I'd just sit on my hands that next night, if I was you: no reason to give the Kommandant any ideas that something is going on. And then, hopefully, we can get on with the mission at the start of D6 and win.Agreed. Seems like ZU has a different wincon from us, so I'm betting him and IO don't actually win with any other team.
Sound like a plan?
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:45:41 pm
I'd be fine with shortening provided everyone will be back here for D5.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 05:49:02 pm
There's also the outside chance that LNCP might decide that we've "won" right here to save us going through the motions, but I doubt it.
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 05:51:13 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 21, 2012, 05:57:59 pm
| zombie urist | - 4 - | Urist Imiknorris, Hapah, Hapah, Shakerag, |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 0 - | |
| No Lynch | - 3 - | Dariush, Toaster, zombie urist |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 1 - | Shakerag |
The Day will end Friday, 8PM GMT.
Three more requests are needed to Shorten.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 05:59:18 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 05:59:25 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 21, 2012, 06:01:27 pm
Everyone, did your pre-game flavor indicate the presence of Jim/zu? Because it seems like he was at a meeting with everyone on my team.
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 06:02:55 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 21, 2012, 06:05:26 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 06:06:13 pm
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 06:06:32 pm
Post by: zombie urist on November 21, 2012, 06:07:24 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 21, 2012, 06:07:43 pm
PPE That would explain it
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 06:31:15 pm
Oh well. Shorten. I'll steal IO's vote tonight- Dariush, I hope you block him.
Post by: Toaster on November 21, 2012, 06:33:02 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 21, 2012, 06:35:11 pm
I'll get to this when I can.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 22, 2012, 03:26:10 pm
Night 4 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| zombie urist | - 4 - | Urist Imiknorris, Hapah, Hapah, Shakerag, |
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 0 - | |
| No Lynch | - 3 - | Dariush, Toaster, zombie urist |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 4 - | Shakerag, Hapah, Urist Imiknorris, Toaster |
Night had already fallen, and the stars were out.
The rain fell about them in great surges, an insistent electric thrum that blanketed the forest. Surrounded by the gnarled giants, dark and black in the dimness of the dying dusk, in moments brightly illuminated, ghostly silhouettes starkly painted against the fiery white light of exploding lightning, stand the two men, the Kommandant and the Fated, motionless in the heart of darkness, thronged by silent watchers.
The soldiers had deliberated long. They were angry, and united, unanimous in their desire to kill, tonight when the Kommandant had come. There was no hesitation when they named their target: Karl Dunst. The traitor, they whispered amongst themselves, the turncoat. They spat at him as he was drawn out of the crowd, into the cold open. He shivered, drew his coat tight around him, as the Kommandant unholstered his revolver with a muffled click from within his jacket.
And there they stood, facing each other. The others had quietened, then begun moving, fidgeting out of nervousness in the suddenly still air, then stopped, frozen, as the cold emanated from the two in the middle of the clearing. They gazed upon one another in silence.
Here they still stand, timeless, motionless. The unceasing curtains of rain buffet them both, and drench the watchers - soon, they shiver, too cold, too wet. The pair remains - resolute, indomitable.
Then, as if he had enough, Karl lowers his gaze, then shuts his eyes. The air cracks as a single shot is loosened, and he falls to the ground.
Before the Kommandant can say the word, the others come toward the body to search it - he watches them in silence. Triumphantly, one of them takes out a Soviet passport and papers, as well as a handful of small pages of notes in cryptic, unreadable Cyrillic. The Kommandant, approaching them now, takes the passport and papers and leafs through them. After staring for several moments at a page in the passport, he holds it up in the air.
“Good work. We have killed a spy. This passport is for Nikolai Ivanovich Kuznetsov.”
“Now, retire to your tents for the night. We’ll begin anew tomorrow.” He looks them over for a while before walking off, sheltering himself from the rain under the wide lapels of his trenchcoat.
Karl “zombie urist” Dunst was lynched! He was a Soviet Mastermind.
The Night will end Monday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 24, 2012, 09:59:02 am
Day 5 Has Begun!
Votecount:
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 0 - | |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 6 - | Urist Imiknorris, Hapah, Shakerag, Dariush, Toaster, Toaster |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 0 - |
The soldiers are ushered out into the camp, just before the break of dawn. The forest, still blue in the sleepy twilight, yawns and sighs, its leaves whispering its slow, quiet speech. The air today is brisk, and leafy, hinting at a coming autumn despite the leaves, a mellow turquoise green early in the day.
The Kommandant strides out from his tent, rubbing what little sleep there was last night from his eyes and adjusting his great coat. He approaches the empty centre of the clearing with the others, lighting a cigarette.
He takes one or two drags before beginning. “Here we are, at the fifth day. Men, consider yourselves fortunate for having been effective at eliminating the spies so far. We should not be far from properly resuming the mission.” The men look at each other, but say nothing. The Kommandant paces around the edge of the grass, gazing into the remaining men’s eyes. “You are the Führer’s elite. We will be expected to return successful, not with our tails between our legs. Understand the necessity of this.” He shivers a little in the morning cold - he draws his coat closer around him and takes a long drag from the cigarette. “I expect you’re all familiar with the proceedings. You will discuss until sundown, and by then, whether or not you have a suspect ready, we will eliminate one person from our camp.”
“You may begin,” he says, before walking away to watch from a distance.
Halfway, however, he pauses and turns. “There’s some coffee over there,” he points. “It’s cold, though.”
The Day will end Wednesday, 8PM GMT.
Post by: Dariush on November 24, 2012, 10:07:27 am
Post by: Dariush on November 24, 2012, 10:11:17 am
Toaster, what are you going to do tonight if the game isn't over by then?
Post by: Toaster on November 24, 2012, 12:09:52 pm
Dariush: I feel almost certain it will be- ZU is the first person to flip with a role other than "Spy." Other than that, I hadn't really thought about it. Probably reread and jack a vote from somebody, because it means victory hasn't been achieved yet. (And probably be blocked by you.)
I am curious what our inspectors have turned up. Obviously I successfully stole Irony's vote.
Post by: Hapah on November 24, 2012, 07:13:07 pm
Toaster, you forgot to put down your second vote.
Thinking in advance, I'd ask everyone to sit on their hands if (when) IO flips Soviet. I'm rather paranoid, though.
Post by: IronyOwl on November 24, 2012, 09:48:01 pm
To start with, yes, I'm a Soviet Executioner. I don't think that means what you think it means, though.
Basically, our mission was to retrieve the artifact for ourselves. Trouble is, we weren't informed of how to do that; there didn't seem to be anything we can manipulate flavor-wise, so we were mostly left with a combination of the Kommandant's game and sort of waiting around. Or at least, Jim was; ZU decided that the only possible explanation was that we needed to dispose of some people, and thus began his far more aggressive, antagonistic play in that direction. His play for French loyalty at the end was more desperation than certainty that wiping out two other teams was the answer, but he'd been entertaining it as a possibility prior to that.
So with that out of the way, I think lynching me today is a bad idea. For one thing, I'm the only one with a gun; that might come in handy later, especially if the Kommandant isn't satisfied with four more spies either.
For another, you know I'm not openly antagonistic. Jim told me all your roles D1; I knew Dariush was a roleblocker, and I knew he was targeting me. I didn't bother killing him, even though he was openly antagonistic towards me, because I didn't think removing him would be productive to anything. If I was scum, there really wouldn't be any reason to leave that kind of a liability alive. The only player I did (successfully) kill, in fact, was Deathsword, and that only because I figured he'd get himself lynched at some point so I might as well speed things along a bit.
For a third thing, my lynch is lazy and you know it. Granted, ZU was a traitor to pretty much all of you- but Jim wasn't. That wasn't anything innate in ZU's role, that was him deciding to take a far more aggressive stance. Otherwise, all you've got is that Soviets are different and you're terrified of kills.
IronyOwl.Incidentally, you've seemed awfully nervous even for scum. Are you that terrified of night actions, even with my kill disabled?
Toaster, you forgot to put down your second vote.
Thinking in advance, I'd ask everyone to sit on their hands if (when) IO flips Soviet. I'm rather paranoid, though.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 24, 2012, 09:52:27 pm
My question is why Jim didn't say anything to anyone else.
Post by: Dariush on November 25, 2012, 04:11:57 am
Post by: Toaster on November 25, 2012, 02:20:36 pm
Toaster, you forgot to put down your second vote.
I don't need to- it goes automatically.
Waiting for Shakerag to chime in, but I seriously doubt he'll say anything that'll change my mind. (Also, for the record, that case he found had my syringes for the double vote power.)
Post by: Hapah on November 25, 2012, 03:14:30 pm
Quote from: IO
Incidentally, you've seemed awfully nervous even for scum. Are you that terrified of night actions, even with my kill disabled?Of course I'm nervous. And I'm not scared of night actions (barring yours, of course), I'm scared of some guard seeing someone running about in the night and the Kommandant declaring that we still have a Spy problem. I think taking no action when you flip is the safest course of action, but I'm very doubtful I'll get everyone (or maybe even anyone) on board. I just don't see what we'd have to gain running around this next night.
My vote stays on you, IO, but we've got a couple of days to kill. If you think you shouldn't be lynched, what course of action do you suggest? I don't think a no-lynch will work (per the rules, and the Kommandant's opening today reinforces it). What would you have us do?
Post by: Shakerag on November 26, 2012, 09:59:06 am
Okay, I'm back amongst the living.Toaster, you forgot to put down your second vote.
I don't need to- it goes automatically.
Waiting for Shakerag to chime in, but I seriously doubt he'll say anything that'll change my mind. (Also, for the record, that case he found had my syringes for the double vote power.)
What I found from inspecting IronyOwl: Found a knife, no maker's marks on it, can't tell how old it is. Blade and handle seem to come from different knives. Clean and well cared for. Also found a small leather case. Small syringe and three sharp needles inside. Also has a small corked vial, label torn off, half full of a clear liquid. Did not smell it.
Post by: Toaster on November 26, 2012, 10:23:52 am
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 26, 2012, 10:38:50 am
So basically ZU could talk to everyone and IO could do everything?
Post by: Hapah on November 27, 2012, 10:48:53 am
Post by: Dariush on November 27, 2012, 11:01:46 am
Post by: Hapah on November 27, 2012, 11:07:23 am
Shorten.
Post by: Shakerag on November 27, 2012, 11:15:10 am
He's made like fifteen posts since last posting here. There's no point in waiting, IMO.I concur. Shorten
Post by: Toaster on November 27, 2012, 11:23:48 am
Shorten
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 27, 2012, 11:25:43 am
Post by: Hapah on November 27, 2012, 11:29:16 am
Post by: IronyOwl on November 27, 2012, 12:35:06 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 27, 2012, 12:40:50 pm
It isn't actually shortened yet, IO (esp. because I think UI is opposed). You can still speak your piece if you have time.
Post by: IronyOwl on November 27, 2012, 01:07:08 pm
Oppose Shorten.
UI:
Oppose Shorten.I believe there were three things going on here.
My question is why Jim didn't say anything to anyone else.
One, he presumably considered me more his "real" partner than any of his other three sets of scumbuddies, as I suppose his roleflip implies.
Two, he was still bitter and wary about previous LNCP games, notably the one where he was an elf with no kill and a mole on his team. He didn't fully trust me at first either, which made me a little suspicious until he told me about his position.
Finally, neither of us knew how we were supposed to win, so even if none of you were moles or a "real" scumteam proper, he didn't want to go around blabbing all his secrets to everyone unless there was a good reason for it.
IronyOwl.Why did this seem like a reasonable assumption to you?
So basically ZU could talk to everyone and IO could do everything?
Dariush:
Appeal to emotion, blackmail, attempt to win our sympathy by admitting to not killing a known roleblocker, bullshit explanation regarding DS kill... Nah, I'm not buying it. If you're telling the truth and are indeed the only one among the 'elite' division with a gun, that'll make you the most dangerous among us after (if) we kill Kommandant. Your team proved to be antagonistic by not claiming your knowledge (that everyone is a spy) outright.Not buying what?
And not claiming that everyone was a spy wasn't antagonistic; we didn't know how the game was supposed to be played or won, and so didn't feel like blabbing everything all at once. Your team started to suspect the same and didn't claim it until your necks were in the noose, after all.
Hapah:
Inspects, for one. What makes you think night actions might be related to spy activity and not anything else? What makes you think this activity is only an issue after I've flipped?Quote from: IOIncidentally, you've seemed awfully nervous even for scum. Are you that terrified of night actions, even with my kill disabled?Of course I'm nervous. And I'm not scared of night actions (barring yours, of course), I'm scared of some guard seeing someone running about in the night and the Kommandant declaring that we still have a Spy problem. I think taking no action when you flip is the safest course of action, but I'm very doubtful I'll get everyone (or maybe even anyone) on board. I just don't see what we'd have to gain running around this next night.
My vote stays on you, IO, but we've got a couple of days to kill. If you think you shouldn't be lynched, what course of action do you suggest? I don't think a no-lynch will work (per the rules, and the Kommandant's opening today reinforces it). What would you have us do?
Less sure on what we should do instead, though a no-lynch might at least be an interesting experiment. The fact that there's specific, explicit mechanics for it might just be LNCP trying to improve the pace of the game, or it could be meaningful in some way.
Shakerag:
Okay, I'm back amongst the living.And?
What I found from inspecting IronyOwl: Found a knife, no maker's marks on it, can't tell how old it is. Blade and handle seem to come from different knives. Clean and well cared for. Also found a small leather case. Small syringe and three sharp needles inside. Also has a small corked vial, label torn off, half full of a clear liquid. Did not smell it.
Toaster:
So he's a killer and probably a blocker too. Yeah, doesn't change my desire to hang him.No. The syringes are for knocking the target out so I can drag them to the edge of camp to knife them open.
Why does being a killer like I already claimed not change your desire to hang me?
Post by: Hapah on November 27, 2012, 01:21:20 pm
Quote from: IO
What makes you think night actions might be related to spy activity and not anything else? What makes you think this activity is only an issue after I've flipped?We've all claimed Spy, and ZU confirmed all the teams. And it's an issue if after you flip if the Kommandant says that we got all the Spies, and then someone mucks it all up by stalking around in the night when they're not supposed to and gets spotted. If Kommandant says we killed all the spies, I really don't want to give him a reason to think he might be mistaken.
(You'll also noticed Kommandant's tone has relaxed since yesterday. That's why I think he'll say we got them all after one more flip)
Quote from: IO
Less sure on what we should do instead, though a no-lynch might at least be an interesting experiment. The fact that there's specific, explicit mechanics for it might just be LNCP trying to improve the pace of the game, or it could be meaningful in some way.A no-lynch would be an interesting experiment in what happens when you get shot in the face.
Quote from: The OP
Unless you think LNCP would explicitly state that he wouldn't lie to us, and then lie to us anyway, a no-lynch is a random lynch. And I think you're a much better option than a random lynch.
- I, the moderator, will not lie to you.
- On a no-lynch, no-vote or tie, the Nazis will choose a person to kill randomly.
Post by: Toaster on November 27, 2012, 01:26:33 pm
Toaster:So he's a killer and probably a blocker too. Yeah, doesn't change my desire to hang him.No. The syringes are for knocking the target out so I can drag them to the edge of camp to knife them open.
Why does being a killer like I already claimed not change your desire to hang me?
Why would it change it? You're part of the informed minority which, as I've been lead to believe playing Mafia this two and a half years (Seriously? Damn.), is a Bad Thing.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 27, 2012, 01:53:33 pm
Because you had a vial like Dariush and syringes like Toaster.IronyOwl.Why did this seem like a reasonable assumption to you?
So basically ZU could talk to everyone and IO could do everything?
Post by: Hapah on November 27, 2012, 03:12:19 pm
IO: How were there no drag marks when you moved DS? And how did you not get spotted?
Post by: IronyOwl on November 27, 2012, 03:45:13 pm
PFPI don't see how this addresses the question. You're pulling this suspicion out of nowhere (and have had it before now) without explaining why, specifically, it's night actions after I've been lynched that you think might muck things up.Quote from: IOWhat makes you think night actions might be related to spy activity and not anything else? What makes you think this activity is only an issue after I've flipped?We've all claimed Spy, and ZU confirmed all the teams. And it's an issue if after you flip if the Kommandant says that we got all the Spies, and then someone mucks it all up by stalking around in the night when they're not supposed to and gets spotted. If Kommandant says we killed all the spies, I really don't want to give him a reason to think he might be mistaken.
(You'll also noticed Kommandant's tone has relaxed since yesterday. That's why I think he'll say we got them all after one more flip)This is an interesting point, but what makes you say that would have to be my flip? Why do you think we got word of more spies after the first four?
It's not necessarily just a random lynch, though. In fact, if some of your special abilities apply it's not even truly random or impossible to nolynch, is it?Quote from: IOLess sure on what we should do instead, though a no-lynch might at least be an interesting experiment. The fact that there's specific, explicit mechanics for it might just be LNCP trying to improve the pace of the game, or it could be meaningful in some way.A no-lynch would be an interesting experiment in what happens when you get shot in the face.Quote from: The OPUnless you think LNCP would explicitly state that he wouldn't lie to us, and then lie to us anyway, a no-lynch is a random lynch. And I think you're a much better option than a random lynch.
- I, the moderator, will not lie to you.
- On a no-lynch, no-vote or tie, the Nazis will choose a person to kill randomly.
PFPI carried him out carefully. Not sure exactly why I wasn't spotted, but it's presumably related to the reasons no power roles get spotted.
IO: How were there no drag marks when you moved DS? And how did you not get spotted?
Toaster:
Irony:What were you waiting on Shakerag for, then? You certainly made it sound significant.Toaster:So he's a killer and probably a blocker too. Yeah, doesn't change my desire to hang him.No. The syringes are for knocking the target out so I can drag them to the edge of camp to knife them open.
Why does being a killer like I already claimed not change your desire to hang me?
Why would it change it? You're part of the informed minority which, as I've been lead to believe playing Mafia this two and a half years (Seriously? Damn.), is a Bad Thing.
And I'd remind you that this is a bastard game, and that I'm not much more informed than any of you are.
UI:
Because you had a vial like Dariush and syringes like Toaster.Oh. That makes sense.
Post by: Toaster on November 27, 2012, 03:56:02 pm
Toaster:Irony:What were you waiting on Shakerag for, then? You certainly made it sound significant.Toaster:So he's a killer and probably a blocker too. Yeah, doesn't change my desire to hang him.No. The syringes are for knocking the target out so I can drag them to the edge of camp to knife them open.
Why does being a killer like I already claimed not change your desire to hang me?
Why would it change it? You're part of the informed minority which, as I've been lead to believe playing Mafia this two and a half years (Seriously? Damn.), is a Bad Thing.
Bullshit.
Waiting for Shakerag to chime in, but I seriously doubt he'll say anything that'll change my mind.
Oh yeah, super significant there.
And I'd remind you that this is a bastard game, and that I'm not much more informed than any of you are.
Also bullshit. You were teamed with a guy who was in on all the chats and therefore knew everyone was a spy. Why didn't he give out that info ahead of time? Because you're antagonistic to all of us.
Third count of bullshit is your failure to vote anyone or provide any real alternate explanation to what's going on, but by now it's really irrelevant since you're 100% bad, horrible, evil scum.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 27, 2012, 03:56:47 pm
And I'd remind you that this is a bastard game, and that I'm not much more informed than any of you are.You knew everyone was spies from the beginning, bro.
Post by: Hapah on November 27, 2012, 04:03:46 pm
Quote from: IO
I don't see how this addresses the question. You're pulling this suspicion out of nowhere (and have had it before now) without explaining why, specifically, it's night actions after I've been lynched that you think might muck things up.Got the Spies, good work everyone -> Why was someone out of their tent when they weren't supposed to be? -> Must be more spies up to no good. It's probably groundless, but I'm the paranoid sort.
Quote from: IO
This is an interesting point, but what makes you say that would have to be my flip? Why do you think we got word of more spies after the first four?Might not have to be your flip. But why would we lynch anyone else? You've already claimed a gun, which means you could take the artifact from us by force and/or kill us all in the endgame (I'm sure there's a better way to phrase that but I'm PFP)
And I don't know why there were more spies spotted. Maybe as a vehicle to keep the game moving, maybe someone was actually spotted by the guards coming and going. I really don't know.
Quote from: IO
It's not necessarily just a random lynch, though. In fact, if some of your special abilities apply it's not even truly random or impossible to nolynch, is it?
[/quote
It's not necessarily just a random lynch, though. In fact, if some of your special abilities apply it's not even truly random or impossible to nolynch, is it?
[/quote
I don't see what this has to do with anything. A nolynch is, at best, an attempted random lynch, since you want to split hairs.
PPE
UI, Toaster: Yeah, he did know. He didn't even volunteer the information before I put it all in the middle with the Spy claim, he just wanted to be sure he wasn't part of the claim. It's scummy as hell. (Dunno if he actively tried to dissuade me or not, can go back and read the chat after work)
Post by: IronyOwl on November 27, 2012, 09:05:14 pm
Also bullshit. You were teamed with a guy who was in on all the chats and therefore knew everyone was a spy. Why didn't he give out that info ahead of time? Because you're antagonistic to all of us.
You knew everyone was spies from the beginning, bro.But not the significance of that information. We didn't, and still don't, know what everyone being a spy means. Are there turncoats embedded within each scumgroup? Is this a cagematch between spy groups?
If you had been in our positions, what would you have done? Claimed it immediately and then hoped the setup could be cracked just like that? Better yet, what would you have advocated doing if we had claimed it? Nolynched repeatedly? Picked a side to gang up on? Lynched the Commies because you're out of other ideas?
Toaster:
Bullshit.I meant here. Why spell it out like that if its only significance is that it's not a miracle?So he's a killer and probably a blocker too. Yeah, doesn't change my desire to hang him.
Oh yeah, super significant there.
Third count of bullshit is your failure to vote anyone or provide any real alternate explanation to what's going on, but by now it's really irrelevant since you're 100% bad, horrible, evil scum.Probably because I have no more idea what's going on than you do at this point, and unlike you, I haven't got an easy target to lazily bandwagon.
That said, if you'd really like my opinion and are determined to be this lazy, I'd advocate lynching Toaster today, seeing as it's the last chance to do so before his team controls 3/5s of the vote. Barring Dariush blocking him, of course, but that's apparently not very comforting regarding me running around shooting people.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:06:58 pm
Night 5 Has Begun!
The Allied Spies (British, French, American) Have Won!
The Allied Spies (British, French, American) Have Won!
Votecount:
| Toaster | - 0 - | |
| Dariush | - 0 - | |
| IronyOwl | - 6 - | Toaster, Toaster, Hapah, Shakerag, Dariush, Urist Imiknorris |
| Urist Imiknorris | - 0 - | |
| Hapah | - 0 - | |
| Shakerag | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Not Voting | - 0 - | |
| No Lynch | - 0 - | |
| - | ||
| Extend | - 0 - | |
| Shorten | - 4 - | Dariush, Hapah, Shakerag, Toaster, Urist Imiknorris (Oppose), IronyOwl (Oppose) |
[Note: Mouseover text is used for dialogue.]
“So, who have you chosen?” The Kommandant comes forward, makes his point.
It would soon be dark, and the void would close in on them; in the last few grey hours of twilit night the soldiers were reduced to mere shades in the grimy gloom, shadows cast against the soft smoulder of the dying campfire. The chill built up, and became biting now, at once numbing and piercingly sharp; in the murky blue haze, the soldiers, who had left their coats by the fire to dry, shiver, wracked by long shuddering waves of tremulous fear and frost. They rub their hands and frail fingers, red and swollen, squeezing them, trying in vain to caress life back into the raw flesh, rubbing leathery palms together and beating their feet on the ground. The rain had ceased today, in a fortunate turn of events - the waning storm had now settled onto the ground in a silky fog.
They see him approaching - at first, he too is but a shadow; simply a silhouette, a darker pigeon-grey in the snowy mist. As he comes close, he gains form and definite visage, then stands before them in his full, stark against the blurred landscape - pale and tall, imperial, imposing, skin almost bone-white in comparison to the slick black coat, his gaunt features fixed in a contemptuous glare.
“Who have you chosen?”
The soldiers look at each other. They stand in silence, then say, in a firm voice, “Anton Wechsler.”
He looks at them for a moment, a stub nestled between the webbing of his fingers. The soldiers return the gaze, expectantly. After an exchange of glances, the Kommandant, wordlessly, striding into the group, pulls Anton out with a firm grasp on his arm. Dragged away, Anton stumbles at first, nervous, before regaining his footing and looking up at the giant leading him on. The Kommandant pulls his revolver out, cocks it. He whispers something to the fated soldier, out of earshot of the others.
Then, in a mighty bellow, raising his black revolver high in the air, he thunders a foreign command: “Товарищи! К оружию! К оружию! Окружите союзных шпионы - не допустить ни одного побега!”
At once, the other soldiers begin to move. Marching with sudden swiftness, they scatter away from the unfortunate five in a wide ring, materialising pistols from hidden holsters; in the space of a few seconds, the spies are neatly encircled, each one of the dozens of soldiers locked in perfect aim at an American, French or British head through the mist. The spies, pale and terrified and wholly unarmed, slowly raise their hands into the air.
“Наша миссия подошла к концу. Теперь пришло время, чтобы убить этих собак.” Anton sneers at them in the distance, beside the giant - the laughter is cold, dispassionate. He nods to Anton and says, “Товарищ генера́л-лейтена́нт, вы хотели бы взять на себя командование сейчас?”
Anton smiles. Slowly, he raises a finger at the spies, trapped and helpless - “Убить их всех.”
Harsh cracks of gunfire echo throughout the tree-tops.
* * *
Quigley falls and smashes into the mossy earth. When he stands up again with a grunt, he touches his cheek to find a new cut - drawing his fingers away to see a neat line of blood drawn across his fingertips, he grunts again, gruffly, and brushes it off on this trousers. The spies trudge on quietly through the darkness and the undergrowth, batting away low branches and constantly looking about, watching for signs of life, civilisation - and Russians. The trees seem to close around them, and the vegetation, growing denser and more dangerous for each step they take, threatens to lead them astray.
Eventually, the group slows down - Quigley is the first to stop, leaning against the trunk of a tree to catch his breath. He slumps down onto the ground, resting his head against its knotted bark; the others, unsure whether to leave him or stay, hesitate.
“Let’s stay here for a moment. We must’ve walked for hours, now, and there’s been no sign of the Russians. Just...” He pauses. “Just give me a moment.”
The others sit, tired themselves, reclining against tree-trunks or lying on leaves.
For a moment, silence pervades the forest - looking up, the bright face of the moon, cheerily round, shines through the ashen-grey clouds to light the forest in a ghostly blue shimmer.
Alexander sighs, and gazes at the sky. The stars twinkle at them in the distance - a patchwork of white motes of light, glittering gaily as nebulous wisps of smoke drift by. “Will we ever find our way out of this forest? Is there even anything here?”
“The nearest town is tens of miles from the camp. It’ll take us a few days to get there - perhaps more. If aren’t discovered, or mistaken for deserters, then we might have a chance to get to Denmark, then Sweden, then back to America - or Britain. Even so, we have no money; it would be difficult to arrange transport. The chances are slim.”
Silence again; sombre, mournful.
Then, suddenly, François looks up at them. “But friends, at least we have our lives.”
All at once, a peal of quiet laughter breaks into the air; the tone is nervous, but honest - and thoroughly thankful. Yes, at least there was that.
Anton “IronyOwl” Wechsler was lynched! He was a Soviet Executioner.
The Allied (American, British, French) Spies have won.
The game is over.
This is the time to discuss the events of the game and offer valuable critique!
Post by: zombie urist on November 28, 2012, 05:16:14 pm
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:23:16 pm
Spoiler: Quicktopic Links (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Action Log (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:27:51 pm
Spoiler: Dariush's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:28:32 pm
Spoiler: Hapah's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:29:31 pm
Spoiler: Deathsword's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:30:18 pm
Spoiler: Shakerag's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:30:52 pm
Spoiler: TolyK's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:31:32 pm
Spoiler: Tiruin's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:31:58 pm
Spoiler: Toaster's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:32:41 pm
Spoiler: blackmagechill's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:33:27 pm
Spoiler: Powder Miner's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:34:06 pm
Spoiler: IronyOwl's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:34:47 pm
Spoiler: Jim Groovester's Role PM (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:35:25 pm
Spoiler: Jim Groovester's Cover Role PM for the French (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:36:04 pm
Spoiler: Jim Groovester's Cover Role PM for the British (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:36:37 pm
Spoiler: Jim Groovester's Cover Role PM for the Americans (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:42:41 pm
Spoiler: N1 - IronyOwl (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N1 - Dariush (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N1 - Toaster (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N1 - Shakerag (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N2 - IronyOwl (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N2 - Dariush (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N2 - Toaster (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N2 - Shakerag (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N3 - Dariush (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N3 - Toaster (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N3 - Shakerag (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N4 - Dariush (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N4 - Toaster (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: N4 - Shakerag (click to show/hide)
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 05:43:50 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 28, 2012, 06:06:49 pm
The flavor.
Did the game play out how you thought it would, LNCP? What flavor clues did we miss?
EDIT: Oh yeah. Did you hand-pick Jim for the mastermind, or did he random into it?
Post by: Leafsnail on November 28, 2012, 06:09:24 pm
Post by: Shakerag on November 28, 2012, 06:15:42 pm
Excellent flavor, LNCP.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 06:29:10 pm
That's the game concept, really, in a nutshell. The experimental part of the setup was to see just how long it would take for the players to realise that their entire world was staged (which, sadly, never truly happened despite the spy win) and begin progressing to the real game, and then how long it would take (or even if) for them to uncover the third secret layer to the game added by the artifact mentioned in every role PM - I've chosen to leave just that part obscured. As RedWarrior0 described it: "The rough concept is absolutely nuts and hilarious."
This is strictly a one-off game; I won't be doing Mein Kampf again or any spin-offs because after this one, it has lost the element of surprise.
I was slightly disappointed in how slow the Allied Spy players were in understanding the nature of the situation. I suppose that was because everyone got stuck in the scum-mentality and looked out primarily for their own faction's win.
There were clues to the false nature of the Nazi camp peppered everywhere in the flavour - as this is a mostly historically accurate Mafia game (and yes, used real-world and not movie logic), if you noticed any of these, they weren't due to me being lazy research-wise.
Possibly the most prominent such hint was the Kommandant's silenced revolver - a thoughtful person would have (I hoped) realised that such a thing isn't that common, and a gun-wise person might even have known that most revolvers can't be silenced due to their mechanisms, and Googled it. As it happens to be, the only WWII-era silenced revolver known to exist is the Nagant M1895 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagant_M1895), a Soviet revolver with an unusual gas-seal system to enable silencing.
Another was the Kommandant's heavy use of the word "Comrade". Another was the Soviet Mastermind shaking hands with even the guards on-duty in the British flavourtext (supposed to be evocative of the Communist everyone-is-equal ideology, though I'm not sure how well that went). Another one which may have been picked up by some was the contrived nature of the mission the agents received. There were a massive bunch more, but I can't remember them - if you're interested in these, feel free to comb through the text!
I'm also slightly disappointed by the fact that nobody bothered to Google their characters, cover or otherwise. Where I could, I used real-life spies and double agents as a basis for the characters - for TolyK (Arthur Owens) and Tiruin (Brian Cleeve), for example, I used many of the real-life person's events in your PMs. Nikolai Ivanovich Kuznetsov was a real spy who worked with Nazi stuff, albeit not a double agent. Aleksandr Langfang was a real Lieutenant-General who worked in the NKVD in our setting period.
I know I wrote myself into a corner by using Russians instead of Axis nations as the opposition - I hope I covered that hole with the rationale for this trap given in the Soviets' flavour (Soviet Russia trying to cover their asses entering the war), but in retrospect, it would've been more streamlined had the Russians been Italians or Japanese.
I'd like to give some postgame props to Hapah for playing the investigator, which really helped the game go. He correctly surmised that the vial was chloroform, and not perfume: Chloroform is a colourless liquid with a distinctive but weak sweet smell, and in real life, it takes several long minutes to take effect (which is why Shakerag felt nothing sniffing that bottle). Shakerag was fortunate enough to be within ~2 hours of Toaster's roleblock to smell the chloroform that had wetted his face (not perfume this time either) by seeing the slight sheen on his face that would have been present had this occurred in real life that specific night.
I haven't been following the game but I must say this is a really interesting setup. It's clearly a tough game for scum but that's made up for by the fact that all the other players wrongly thought that they were the informed minority. The mastermind in particular had a hilariously difficult job, but could probably win provided he prevented the truth of the setup from coming out.
Thank you - I'm honoured. :)
I didn't really know how to make it easier for the Soviets, to be honest. I considered giving them more powers, such as a nightkill for the Mastermind, but both Meph and RedWarrior discouraged me from that - I don't know if any setup-related finagling would have helped besides choosing experienced players as they, again, advised (which I did, by the way).
Jim had a different strategy in mind endgame - I do wonder what would have happened had he stayed on.
EDIT: Corrected incomplete sentence.
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 28, 2012, 06:43:59 pm
Post by: Hapah on November 28, 2012, 06:45:44 pm
Quote from: LNCP
Possibly the most prominent such hint was the Kommandant's silenced revolver - a thoughtful person would have (I hoped) realised that such a thing isn't that common, and a gun-wise person might even have known that most revolvers can't be silenced due to their mechanisms, and Googled it. As it happens to be, the only WWII-era silenced revolver known to exist is the Nagant M1895, a Soviet revolver with an unusual gas-seal system to enable silencing.Aw, damnit. I thought that silenced meant something else along the lines of subdued or non-reflective, as Kommandant's gun was described as being loud or deafening more than once, I think. I don't think I would have followed the information through to the end, though.
Quote from: LNCP
I'd like to give some postgame props to Hapah for playing the investigator, which really helped the game go.<3
Post by: Leafsnail on November 28, 2012, 06:54:39 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 28, 2012, 07:13:47 pm
By the way, Jim, this was also my gift to you for what happened in the second Witches' Coven.What about me?
Post by: zombie urist on November 28, 2012, 07:30:43 pm
My endgame plan (up until I got lynched) was basically to lynch Dariush, convince Toaster to give me the double vote and then have IO kill him, and then lynch IU or Shakerag. Then we would have gone the next day 2:1:1:1, which probably would have given us the win, since I was on all three teams.
A backup plan I had was to lynch Shakerag, then have IO kill whoever got the doubled vote for the rest of the game, leaving us with a distinct advantage.
After UI claimed, I considered the option of telling the USA and FR teams that UI was full of shit vs full claiming.
Then Hapah and Shakerag both claimed I was on their team also and that plan got fucked. >:(
My last hope was that Hapah and Dariush would go along with the plan I outlined, but they didn't and that was that. :(
I'm still not sure whether eliminating one team completely would have been a better strategy than to chip at each team. It definitely would have made it easier to round up the fake claims.
Post by: Leafsnail on November 28, 2012, 07:37:20 pm
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 28, 2012, 08:07:13 pm
Post by: Toaster on November 28, 2012, 08:35:51 pm
Quote
On further consideration, I expect one of you is actually a filthy traitorous scumbag and not on our side at all.
Bastard.
Called it.
Quite the enjoyable game! Reading for more detail now.
Post by: Jim Groovester on November 28, 2012, 09:36:54 pm
By the way, Jim, this was also my gift to you for what happened in the second Witches' Coven.
Thanks, bro. I was really excited about this game, but I couldn't keep up with four games, one of which had four different miniature mafia games inside it, and maths at the same time, so I had to replace out else I would have gone crazy.
The end game strategy LNCP alluded to was the following: Ultimately, the success of the Russian team depended on everyone not knowing what the hell was really going on until it was too late. This was always going to be a losing battle, since everyone was going to became extremely curious when a spy flipped that wasn't on their team. So early on, I started thinking about how I would deal with it when I was discovered.
The lie would go something like this: That I am a superspy, and that I'm a German double agent on behalf of the Allies in addition to being an embedded spy in every single team. The reason that we were all out here is that secrets were being leaked to the Germans from each of our teams, and that after making the Allies aware of this, their heavy-handed response to the intelligence leaks was to send everyone involved on a suicide mission. I would try to sell that on each team there was a German double agent, and that if we could discover the identities of the double agents and eliminate them, we could get the artifact or whatever and escape with our lives. To lend credence to what I was saying, I would have brought up Where Eagles Dare (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Where_Eagles_Dare), for its emphasis on secret agents and double agents and super secret double agents, and said that this game was sort of that movie but in the extreme. I also would have immediately bussed IronyOwl for not being on any team.
I have no idea if it would have worked or not, but that's what my plan was. By posing as a sort of friendly quadruple agent instead of a hostile one, I think my chances of successfully not dying might have been higher in the short term, but after a certain point I think I would have been on the chopping block anyway.
Regardless, fun game.
Post by: Leafsnail on November 28, 2012, 09:41:28 pm
The easiest way to boost the scum would be to remove roleflips, but that would probably push it too far in the other direction.
Post by: Toaster on November 28, 2012, 10:02:43 pm
I'll say it again- not knowing ahead of time that my vote steal would be obvious like that was a nasty surprise. I'm used to games where votecounts just show the obvious voting.
Quote from: Dariush
And ZU, please stop being an idiot and attacking the single least lynchable person possible (Toaster).
<3
Quote from: Dariush
I think that Toaster is about the only non-spy in the game.
Where'd that come from?
Post by: zombie urist on November 28, 2012, 10:58:07 pm
I also considered claiming multi-spy in the various chats, but I didn't think anyone would buy it. Its also kinda strange to claim such a thing that late into the game.
If the claims didn't start pouring out, I considered asking Shakerag to claim IO as being part of his team.
This game might be really !!fun!! on IRC.
Post by: Tiruin on November 29, 2012, 12:26:48 am
I did google Brian Cleeve, but then attributed everything darn else to flavor! Even re-read my own PM flavor four times to imagine the situation (yes, this is me and flavor.) and I totally missed the references! Yes, even the vial of sweet smelling liquid. Hapah cornered the idea.
...There goes my History and Chemistry lessons.
That was awesome LNCP. Awesome in the way that people will be attributing to this game in the future when they reference [STUFF].
Post by: Hapah on November 29, 2012, 01:41:08 am
A+ work, LNCP. My first game with you, and I'm be a liar if I said it wasn't damn enjoyable.
(And I didn't even pick up on half the damned clues and I still felt like a clever bastard! Shows what I know, lol)
Post by: Tiruin on November 29, 2012, 01:50:34 am
Post by: lordnincompoop on November 29, 2012, 01:54:54 am
I'll say it again- not knowing ahead of time that my vote steal would be obvious like that was a nasty surprise. I'm used to games where votecounts just show the obvious voting.
Yeah, sorry about that. I couldn't find much precedent.
Post by: IronyOwl on November 29, 2012, 04:26:44 am
The main issue to me, though, was the flips. With every single lynch or kill turning up a Spy, it was pretty much impossible for everyone not to figure out what was going on eventually.
I think this was also a major flaw in your intent with this game- there wasn't enough fiddly stuff to figure out the "real" game, nor was doing so necessary to win. All they had to do was figure out that everyone was a spy, notice that Allied spies being "enemies" didn't make much sense, and lynch the odd factors, which was almost exactly what they did do. Changing Soviets to Italians or something wouldn't have hurt anything in this case, but it would have been totally counterproductive to the puzzle element.
Post by: Toaster on November 29, 2012, 08:43:53 am
I recall the Kommandant saying Comrade at least once, but I didn't draw any conclusions from it.
Also, ZU was a bit right on one thing- if I was a proper German with an Iron Cross, I would have been displaying it proudly, even on the battlefield. I did a little research and found that German soldiers indeed would wear them pretty much all the time. It was considered an honor, and a sign of "this guy knows what's up- listen to him." Apparently no one checked up on it, and no idea if I should have worn it sleeping.
Post by: Dariush on November 29, 2012, 08:53:22 am
I considered you non-spy, Toaster, because you were behaving the least scummy.
I hate myself for guessing the existence of a double agent, but thinking it was DS and not Jim/ZU. :(
Also, the flavor hints were far too obscure. It is a bit extreme - fitting a single reference to a silenced Kommandant's revolver (which I didn't spot, by the way. Along with other hints :() among literally pages and pages of flavor, then hoping we would become suspicious and discover that it could only be a russian-made one.
I didn't really like the game. It was obvious everyone else was focusing on survival instead of actually solving the puzzle. I figured everything out on D2, but was afraid to claim for fear of people simply lynching me. :(
Also also, now I'll never be able to trust my teammates in a bastard game ever again. Meeeh.
Edit:
Quote from: IO
I hate it when ignoring and lynching me wins people the game. D:<Best mafia quote ever.
Post by: Urist Imiknorris on November 29, 2012, 09:12:47 am
Also also, now I'll never be able to trust my teammates in a bastard game ever again. Meeeh.I've felt this way for a while.
Post by: Hapah on November 29, 2012, 10:51:33 am
Post by: TolyK on November 29, 2012, 11:05:06 am
And good game, that was fun (to read at least, not to say play a bit :P)
Post by: Leafsnail on November 29, 2012, 11:13:34 am
Also also, now I'll never be able to trust my teammates in a bastard game ever again. Meeeh.This is what moderator guarantees are for.
Post by: RedWarrior0 on November 29, 2012, 03:23:36 pm
Post by: Bookthras on November 29, 2012, 09:39:39 pm
I didn't follow this game at all, partly because I was busy elsewhere and partly because I was slightly miffed he jumped in stealing Cybrid VI's (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=117192.0) thunder without checking with the games threshold thread first. But that was then. In retrospective, I wish I had played closer attention or tried to join this game... I didn't know at the time you'd actually try to make a historically accurate WWII game! Man, I wish I knew that then.
Possibly the most prominent such hint was the Kommandant's silenced revolver [...] As it happens to be, the only WWII-era silenced revolver known to exist is the Nagant M1895 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagant_M1895), a Soviet revolver with an unusual gas-seal system to enable silencing.As soon as I read this, my first impulse was to reply: "Nuh-uh! You forgot the Welrod! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welrod)" But that's a pistol, not a revolver, yes? (plus British instead of Russian and clearly a covert weapon, so it wouldn't help the setting)
Where I could, I used real-life spies and double agents as a basis for the characters - for TolyK (Arthur Owens) and Tiruin (Brian Cleeve), for example, I used many of the real-life person's events in your PMs. Nikolai Ivanovich Kuznetsov was a real spy who worked with Nazi stuff, albeit not a double agent. Aleksandr Langfang was a real Lieutenant-General who worked in the NKVD in our setting period.GODDAMMIT! Yeah, I can see how some people could miss those clues, but... yeah, hindsight 20/20 and whatever.
He correctly surmised that the vial was chloroform, and not perfume: Chloroform is a colourless liquid with a distinctive but weak sweet smell, and in real life,That was pretty fucking obscure, at least skimming the game post-spoilers, though I see how it's within the realm of possibility for a sufficiently engaged and attentive player to work it out... Kudos to Hapah for figuring it out, but I still think Owens and Kuznetsov were clearer clues. I would have totally missed the chloroform bit.
I don't think you'd be able to survive as a claimed quadruple agent. It just screams "I AM THE BASTARD SCUM".
I think this was also a major flaw in your intent with this game- there wasn't enough fiddly stuff to figure out the "real" game, nor was doing so necessary to win. All they had to do was figure out that everyone was a spy, notice that Allied spies being "enemies" didn't make much sense, and lynch the odd factors, which was almost exactly what they did do. Changing Soviets to Italians or something wouldn't have hurt anything in this case, but it would have been totally counterproductive to the puzzle element.They are also right though, I think. The "several pseudo-'scum' teams" thing has been done to death, as in the last Bastard Supernatural, GG's Resurrection++ and a few others. I like puzzles and I like bastards and weird setups, but I hope the next one is not one where the mod is a vote target or "everyone is scum" is the main clue. That gets old.
In short: Great game. I wish I paid closer attention, I wish you had started a week earlier or two weeks later, and I hope next time you post on the Games Threshold (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=45016.0) thread before opening up for sign ups. Not doing so makes you look like a douche and shows indifference to others who also may be planning games. But yeah, great game, awesome flavour, and I wish I had played it.
Post by: Leafsnail on November 29, 2012, 09:49:27 pm