Post by: piecewise on April 07, 2015, 08:55:19 pm
Post by: piecewise on April 07, 2015, 09:32:12 pm
Paris: 7 tokens for work with the wiki templates
Aoshi, sword: 10 tokens for work rendered so far.
Kri, Sy: 7 tokens for work rendered
Post by: syvarris on April 07, 2015, 11:09:03 pm
This is a great idea though.
Post by: Kriellya on April 07, 2015, 11:26:02 pm
Wait, what? I'm getting paid? Why? I do barely anything, certainly less than the other people. And I can't even spend tokens- they just get shoved into the team fund.
This is a great idea though.
We're under the impression that you update the wiki for Heph :P
I'm not sure what you're supposed to do with the tokens, though... XD
Post by: syvarris on April 07, 2015, 11:28:01 pm
I think Radio should get paid too, although he's technically the richest person in the game. He's done a lot of work on the wiki, not to mention everything he does as our leader/manager/idiot wrangler.
Post by: Empiricist on April 07, 2015, 11:32:25 pm
I'm not sure what you're supposed to do with the tokens, though... XDStockpile them and make it rain? :P
Post by: Kriellya on April 07, 2015, 11:34:08 pm
Well yeah, but that's minor. More bookkeeping than anything else.
I think Radio should get paid too, although he's technically the richest person in the game. He's done a lot of work on the wiki, not to mention everything he does as our leader/manager/idiot wrangler.
We discussed that while we were in IRC chatting about this, PW feels he's been appropriately compensated with ludicrous power for his contributions :P
(my words, not PW's)
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 07, 2015, 11:55:34 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 08, 2015, 02:44:48 am
Quote
And I can't even spend tokens- they just get shoved into the team fund.
Is that, like, official, or a figure of speech?
Quote
We discussed that while we were in IRC chatting about this, PW feels he's been appropriately compensated with ludicrous power for his contributions :P
(my words, not PW's)
Can hardly argue with that, though it'd have been nice if I could've been there when it was discussed. Still, might someone be able to show the chat logs? More out of curiosity than anything else.
Post by: Yoink on April 08, 2015, 02:49:41 am
Wait, what? I'm getting paid? Why? I do barely anything, certainly less than the other people. And I can't even spend tokens- they just get shoved into the team fund.You could give 'em to me! :D
This is a great idea though.
I'm your pal, right?
Post by: Kriellya on April 08, 2015, 02:59:13 am
QuoteWe discussed that while we were in IRC chatting about this, PW feels he's been appropriately compensated with ludicrous power for his contributions :PCan hardly argue with that, though it'd have been nice if I could've been there when it was discussed. Still, might someone be able to show the chat logs? More out of curiosity than anything else.
(my words, not PW's)
Sure, no problem. It was a pretty quick discussion, PW just popped in and started asking about who worked on the wiki
Spoiler: Random Wiki Talks (click to show/hide)
(Does that give us extra IC knowledge?)
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 08, 2015, 03:34:11 am
3 things come to mind:
1) pw, remmeber that if you have jobs, just post them on the team fund page and say how much they pay and what exactly you need. We already offer tokens for certain wiki jobs, remember?
2) I find it hilarious how we already keep track of a lot of crap like who goes on what mission, with lists and all, and pw doesn't even realize it. Maybe we should start trying to advertise such pages better?
3) we already kind of have a very easy way to track who does 'a lot' on the wiki: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Leaderboard
Surprised none of you brought it up. If that could be reset (EDIT: nope, it can't apparently), we can use it to track stuff a little, though of course certain things aren't decently reflected (eg the work it takes setting up a template). Also, looking into it, I just remembered I could set up custom awards, change the names of the existing ones, etc. Heh. Much fun could be had there.
Oh, and
Quote
Apr 07 19:33:02 <CaellathII> He's getting a bit overzealous since I was already helping set up Joker mission and he was trying to wrench it away from my dead hands.Nah man, just ensuring blops actually had the toys they'd need to do their mission... without completely bankrupting the fund (seriously, you guys wanted 50+ tokens worth in battle stims alone!)
In other wiki news: I've enabled polls now. Gonna try to post a new one on the home page from time to time. If people have a hilarious idea for a poll, pm it to me.
I also enabled blogs. Not sure if that'll ever be used, but it might be nice to have for some people.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 08, 2015, 04:03:12 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 08, 2015, 04:09:04 am
One handy wiki page: Wanted pages (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Special:WantedPages). Lists all pages that do not exist but are linked to. Easy way to see what is needed.
Good idea, gonna use that instead of our current (outdated) wanted page.
Post by: Caellath on April 08, 2015, 09:04:32 am
QuoteApr 07 19:33:02 <CaellathII> He's getting a bit overzealous since I was already helping set up Joker mission and he was trying to wrench it away from my dead hands.Nah man, just ensuring blops actually had the toys they'd need to do their mission... without completely bankrupting the fund (seriously, you guys wanted 50+ tokens worth in battle stims alone!)
Oh, but that is team fund-related and in those cases of course they have to seek you since you oversee it. I meant that for a moment it seemed you also wanted to organize Black Ops like you were doing to the other two teams. And in case you haven't noticed from the tone of the post, it wasn't a big deal.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 08, 2015, 09:07:00 am
QuoteApr 07 19:33:02 <CaellathII> He's getting a bit overzealous since I was already helping set up Joker mission and he was trying to wrench it away from my dead hands.Nah man, just ensuring blops actually had the toys they'd need to do their mission... without completely bankrupting the fund (seriously, you guys wanted 50+ tokens worth in battle stims alone!)
Oh, but that is team fund-related and in those cases of course they have to seek you since you oversee it. And in case you haven't noticed from the tone of the post, it wasn't a big deal.
I know, I was joking as well. I've got enough on my hand not to start interfering with your side of things (there's 20+ cats to herd right now).
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 08, 2015, 09:54:44 am
Is it possible to make "While still alive, this character is no longer part of the game, due to player inactivity." note as part of template?
Post by: piecewise on April 08, 2015, 10:50:40 am
Thanks, that helps!Huh, didn't know the achivements thing existed. Are those achievements easily gamed? Can you get a bunch of them with little effort, I mean?
3 things come to mind:
1) pw, remmeber that if you have jobs, just post them on the team fund page and say how much they pay and what exactly you need. We already offer tokens for certain wiki jobs, remember?
2) I find it hilarious how we already keep track of a lot of crap like who goes on what mission, with lists and all, and pw doesn't even realize it. Maybe we should start trying to advertise such pages better?
3) we already kind of have a very easy way to track who does 'a lot' on the wiki: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Leaderboard
Surprised none of you brought it up. If that could be reset (EDIT: nope, it can't apparently), we can use it to track stuff a little, though of course certain things aren't decently reflected (eg the work it takes setting up a template). Also, looking into it, I just remembered I could set up custom awards, change the names of the existing ones, etc. Heh. Much fun could be had there.
Oh, andQuoteApr 07 19:33:02 <CaellathII> He's getting a bit overzealous since I was already helping set up Joker mission and he was trying to wrench it away from my dead hands.Nah man, just ensuring blops actually had the toys they'd need to do their mission... without completely bankrupting the fund (seriously, you guys wanted 50+ tokens worth in battle stims alone!)
In other wiki news: I've enabled polls now. Gonna try to post a new one on the home page from time to time. If people have a hilarious idea for a poll, pm it to me.
I also enabled blogs. Not sure if that'll ever be used, but it might be nice to have for some people.
Also, do you want tokens? I figured you probably had access to enough that you wouldn't care much about a few more. But if you'd like a few thats fine too, I want to compensate people who are doing work.
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 08, 2015, 10:53:43 am
Most of the work I've done is at the old Nyars artifact page and the templates. Plus helping gather stuff like character descriptions and active character capabilities to help RC before the days of the wiki with my google doc and info post.
Not that active right now, beside some infrequent edits, updating my inventory and my work with templates.
In other news, I've changed the player character category to simply character (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Character), since there were some NPCs there as well. You could even put an entry for the armoury master and the doctor if you want and turn the one in the NPC page into a short description linking to the actual page.
The PC template now further autocategorizes people based on their status into various subcategories.
I was a bit agressive with marking people as Inactive, so I might have put some actually active people there. I believe the problem will be easily resolved once one of them posts.
There is the "NPC Character" category there to make the grammar nazis and syntax commies froth at the mouth.
It is interesting to note that we have more than 100 characters and more than a third of them are active.
There are also more than 20 dead... Let's see if we will double that number with this mission...
@Paris. Neat thing that character auto-categorization. I was thinking about it some time ago and was going to suggest it at some point of time.Sure. I'll just put it at the end.
Is it possible to make "While still alive, this character is no longer part of the game, due to player inactivity." note as part of template?
Templates at their basest form are nothing more than a way to save time and not having to copypaste. They literally just copy everything you put in them on the page, with the added bonus of being able to provide arguments for them.
More detailed explanation of the template autocategorization follows:
This is the end of the PC template
Code: (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Template:PC) [Select]
<includeonly>
{{#switch:{{{status|Unknown}}}
|Alive = [[Category:Active Character|{{PAGENAME}}]]
|Inactive = [[Category:Inactive Character|{{PAGENAME}}]]
|Dead = [[Category:Dead Character|{{PAGENAME}}]]
|Permadead = [[Category:Dead Character|{{PAGENAME}}]]
|KIA = [[Category:Dead Character|{{PAGENAME}}]]
|NPC = [[Category:NPC Character|{{PAGENAME}}]]
|[[Category:Character|{{PAGENAME}}]]
}}
</includeonly>
As you can see, it simply compares the status variable with a number of strings and puts them in the appropriate subcategory, defaulting to the parent category if it doesn't match any of the cases. Note that case (upper-case/lower-case) is important. The includeonly tag tells the wiki to only copypaste that part when the template is actually used, so that the template page itself is not be put in the Character category.
It works the same way for the information text:
Code: [Select]
{{#switch:{{{status|Unknown}}}
|Inactive = <b>While still alive, this character is no longer part of the game, due to player inactivity.</b>
|
}}
Feel free to change this to add more descriptions or subcategories.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 08, 2015, 11:09:54 am
Quote
Huh, didn't know the achivements thing existed. Are those achievements easily gamed? Can you get a bunch of them with little effort, I mean?
Only if you do stuff like intentionally making a lot of small edits, instead of going for efficiency (eg when fixing 3 spelling mistakes, doing it in 3 edits instead of 1). But as I said, I can't reset achievements, though you could use it to keep track of certain things for sure.
I think it'd be better if we thought of certain qualifications beforehand, like those jobs that now exist, for things that take a lot of work at once (eg writing a mission synopsis) and to try and track who does a lot of smaller edits (more 'maintenance work', like editing inventories). We should be careful though of not incentivising making a million small edits to get tokens. That way lies drama.
Then again, some work, like adding tags or categories, are by their nature lots of small edits (tedious work).
I'm not sure what people mean when they say I have a lot of tokens due to managing the team fund. I can't actually use those tokens for myself, they're for community use, and I try to get feedback before major decisions for it anyways. Maybe I could swindle a little, but then again, it's all in the open, so unless I steal it all and dare people to come after me from atop my armored mech, those aren't exactly 'mine'.
I won't complain if you think I don't deserve them, or that I've been adequately compensated already. But if I do get some, they will certainly be appreciated. I can always use them, that's for sure. The quest to OPness so horribly broken one has to be kicked from the game never ends!
Post by: piecewise on April 08, 2015, 11:24:55 am
That was my worry.QuoteHuh, didn't know the achivements thing existed. Are those achievements easily gamed? Can you get a bunch of them with little effort, I mean?
Only if you do stuff like intentionally making a lot of small edits, instead of going for efficiency (eg when fixing 3 spelling mistakes, doing it in 3 edits instead of 1). But as I said, I can't reset achievements, though you could use it to keep track of certain things for sure.
I think it'd be better if we thought of certain qualifications beforehand, like those jobs that now exist, for things that take a lot of work at once (eg writing a mission synopsis) and to try and track who does a lot of smaller edits (more 'maintenance work', like editing inventories). We should be careful though of not incentivising making a million small edits to get tokens. That way lies drama.
I'm not sure what people mean when they say I have a lot of tokens due to managing the team fund. I can't actually use those tokens for myself, they're for community use, and I try to get feedback before major decisions for it anyways. Maybe I could swindle a little, but then again, it's all in the open, so unless I steal it all and dare people to come after me from atop my armored mech, those aren't exactly 'mine'.
I won't complain if you think I don't deserve them, or that I've been adequately compensated already. But if I do get some, they will certainly be appreciated. I can always use them, that's for sure. The quest to OPness so horribly broken one has to be kicked from the game never ends!
In the end I'll probably just occasionally ask Sword what everyone has been doing and pay that way.
And fine, 3 tokens to you.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 08, 2015, 11:26:25 am
Quote
In the end I'll probably just occasionally ask Sword what everyone has been doing and pay that way.
And fine, 3 tokens to you.
That can work as well.
Also, much appreciated.
Post by: Tavik Toth on April 08, 2015, 02:00:57 pm
Post by: tryrar on April 08, 2015, 02:02:34 pm
Why am I marked as inactive?
Heyo tavik! Mind lending your APC to protect the squishy noobs on the ground mission? :P
Post by: Tavik Toth on April 08, 2015, 02:16:34 pm
Just don't blow it up or you will end up owning me 11 tokens.Why am I marked as inactive?
Heyo tavik! Mind lending your APC to protect the squishy noobs on the ground mission? :P
Also, stuck trying to figure out how to spread out the respec points. I did ask for help in the respec thread but it seems people missed it.
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 08, 2015, 02:26:21 pm
And I responded, asking you what kind of play-style you want out of your character. Conventional, Unconventional, Auxiliary? Swords? Pimp canes? Also, probably best to provide your answer in the appropriate thread.Just don't blow it up or you will end up owning me 11 tokens.Why am I marked as inactive?
Heyo tavik! Mind lending your APC to protect the squishy noobs on the ground mission? :P
Also, stuck trying to figure out how to spread out the respec points. I did ask for help in the respec thread but it seems people missed it.
You hadn't posted in a few days and you weren't going on any mission so I just marked you as inactive. Like I said, I was very aggressive with my marking, so anybody that hadn't posted an action in the last week or so and wasn't going on a mission was marked as inactive.
Post by: piecewise on April 08, 2015, 08:16:44 pm
For science
Post by: Xantalos on April 08, 2015, 08:59:52 pm
Post by: Execute/Dumbo.exe on April 09, 2015, 12:48:43 am
Hey people, would you mind tracking how many times someone uses an amp from this point on? Blue smoke too. And battle stim of any kind.Should there be an amp/drug use page on the ER wiki from now on? Or should a counter just be put up for each separate character page?
For science
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 09, 2015, 12:56:12 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 10, 2015, 12:10:54 pm
Post by: tryrar on April 10, 2015, 12:11:56 pm
Considering "everyone else" teams are rather far away from each other maybe Mission 20 page should be split into A and B pages? Thoughts?
Seems reasonable
Post by: Kriellya on April 10, 2015, 01:24:38 pm
Considering "everyone else" teams are rather far away from each other maybe Mission 20 page should be split into A and B pages? Thoughts?
Go for it.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 10, 2015, 01:27:38 pm
Post by: Caellath on April 10, 2015, 01:28:03 pm
Edit: damn fingers.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 10, 2015, 01:39:09 pm
Here's reminding people that if they're on archive binge then adding more flavor or information from the older missions to the wiki is a thing that's both useful for the wiki can nets you tokens if you're a newbie.
Very true, that's easy tokens to be earned at no risk.
I've been meaning to ask people though, should we lift the 'newbie' restriction for token earning for these jobs? I think it might stimulate some people who now fall out of the restrictions to write stuff.
Post by: Caellath on April 10, 2015, 03:04:38 pm
The wiki gnomes can also be judges for whenever we need to analyze quality vs quantity. Complete and humorous mission pages are certainly worthy extra brownie points.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 12, 2015, 08:06:46 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 12, 2015, 08:53:27 am
Post by: Kriellya on April 13, 2015, 06:05:01 pm
I'm redoing the Character Index this week, after the missions go out tomorrow.
PW: we already have pages for the missions setup, right here (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Current_Mission_Information), with direct links to the characters involved. These lists will not be impacted, and you should be able to reach any mission relevant character from there. The index should still be accessible during the edits, but no promises :P
Everyone: Here is my current plan for the reorg. First, I'm going to re-sort the Character Index into the following categories, in this order
- Current Mission, Separated out by individual mission or team
- On Ship
- Unassigned, new characters who have not yet been on mission
- Hepheastus, not that it matters too much :P
- Stasis, or currently inactive characters
- Dead
I will also work on the Completed Missions column, to make it more consistent, up-to-date, and useful. And to better show off Milno's accomplishments.
Please leave any comments or suggestions of things you'd like to see done to the Character Index now. New fields, different categories, etc.
Again, I'll begin edits on it this week, after the missions go out.
Post by: Comrade P. on April 14, 2015, 05:10:23 am
Post by: Xantalos on April 14, 2015, 05:38:27 am
Post by: Comrade P. on April 14, 2015, 05:39:47 am
I'd imagine it helps with picking people for missions if you just want a short overview of what the inmate is.
It should list notable skills then.
Post by: Xantalos on April 14, 2015, 05:45:33 am
Of course it's not my decision :P
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 07:37:22 am
Post by: Execute/Dumbo.exe on April 14, 2015, 07:40:30 am
Xan would be 'no no nononono no way no how don't even think about taking him,'.
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 07:57:50 am
I dunno, maybe. If you think that's the best way to usefully describe your character in a few words.
And if you are levelled high enough (+3 or +4) at your relevant skills, you could put them in your title, so you'd end up having things like "Master Wizard" or "Experienced Synthflesh Wizard Soldier"
Post by: Execute/Dumbo.exe on April 14, 2015, 08:44:36 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 10:54:11 am
HEY! LISTEN!
Remember when piecewise asked for a quick way to look at stats/skills/inventory? I was thinking, I could move those things into a separate subpage, something like "/Flint_Westwood/Inventory" (where I will put only the relevant part of my huge inventory so that it is easier to read quickly) and then anyone can copy them wherever they like by using "{{Flint_Westwood/Inventory}}". That way, all stats and skills and inventory for each character are in one page, but can be copied everywhere and I could make that quick reference for piecewise (probably as a sub-page for each mission, something like "/Mission 20/QR"). Would people object to this or should I go ahead and do it when I have some time?
Post by: Comrade P. on April 14, 2015, 11:00:50 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 11:23:49 am
Post by: Comrade P. on April 14, 2015, 11:25:30 am
Post by: Nikitian on April 14, 2015, 11:39:37 am
And if he ever needs to remember who the X is a particular reawakened from stasis dementia character (or how they look like, or anything like that), he could always check the character page proper instead of going for the cheatsheet.
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 12:03:33 pm
I edited my page quickly to show that:
The stats and skills are now there: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Flint_Westwood/SnS
And the original page only contains the following code in its place:
Quote from: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Flint_Westwood#Attributes
{{:Flint_Westwood/SnS}}But that can be used to create a duplicate in any other page. For example, look at how the stats and skills are now at the bottom of the sandbox page as well: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Einsteinian_Roulette_Wiki:Sandbox
And if I were to edit my stats and skills, all the copies would be automatically updated withing a few seconds.
Note to self: I could make them stand side by side and remove the divider to make them easier to read...
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 14, 2015, 12:09:08 pm
Stats
Skills
Inventory
Body modifications (basically robot arms/body, special dubstep arms)
What else?
Post by: Caellath on April 14, 2015, 12:21:39 pm
Of course the system changed and bonuses are handled differently, but he'll still consider that kind of stuff in a way or another. Oh, and the cheatsheet should say whether they're human, robo-body, synth-flesh or robo-body with human head. That kind of stuff.
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 12:57:52 pm
There should be two sections in the cheatsheet for ease of readability: Attributes and Inventory (unless you think mods and custom bodies should be a different section)
There's subpage <CharName>/Attr that holds the stats and skills. I will modify the template to make them stand next to each other, so that they fit in a single page. They should not have any titles so that they take up less space.
There's a subpage <CharName>/Inv that holds anything important the character has (smokes and things like that can go to the character's page (unless you think it should really contain everything)). The first lines/items in it should be about any status effects, then robobodies/genemods/docmods/suits/armour/alienstuff, followed by weapons, followed by everything else, preferably in order of importance.
Unless you think having two pages is overkill, in which case we can merge them in one page, something like <CharName>/Inf, in which case there should be titles for each page.
The cheatsheet will be in <MissionXX>/CS
I will make a template for the cheatsheet, something like {{CS|<CharName>|<PlayerName>}} that will put a title with the character's and player's name, a link to the character's page for further info and the data from the character's /Attr and /Inv subpages as well as titles for them (or /Inf, in which case the titles for each section should be in /Inf).
Agreement/Disagreement?
EDIT: And a template (or 2, one for inv, one for attr) for the character pages themselves. Perhaps the character page templates should link to the sub pages so that they are easier to find.
Post by: Kriellya on April 14, 2015, 01:32:33 pm
I'd been wondering about how to setup something like that myself, but I wasn't sure how to 'automate' the linking. Cause wikicode.
Post by: Nikitian on April 14, 2015, 01:33:55 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 14, 2015, 01:38:18 pm
If we are gonna be all nazi with inventory page, then it should have sub sections in order of importance like
==Genemods/Addons==
==Armor==
==Weapons==
==Other crap==
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 04:31:09 pm
Anyway, since it looks like there's no disagreement with the 2 part division, I'll start work on the templates and the cheat sheets for our current missions once I get back to my PC. The ones that maintain the inventories can decide how they want it to look, since they'll be doing most of the work anyway. "The ones that do the work should decide how the work should be done" I say.
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 14, 2015, 07:34:48 pm
Feedback welcome.
I'll work on making the other templates once I get some sleep.
Post by: Kriellya on April 14, 2015, 07:43:11 pm
I personally like Aoshi's inventory sorting, it will make it easier to find the immediately relevant Items. But I don't know if the template needs to have that setup encoded into it.
Post by: Kriellya on April 15, 2015, 05:08:28 am
One thing I notice is that with the new organization, the 'status' field is redundant. Any suggestions for a replacement field, a new utility, or should I just remove the column altogether?
For the Dead section, I'm thinking I'll remove the 'appearance' and 'status' columns, and add in a 'cause of death' column, like the missionless dead table below it. May remove the profession as well, but I feel like there is still some use in that when the character had been on a mission.
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/New_Character_Page
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 15, 2015, 07:02:56 am
Is there a reason why you remove bulletpoints? Something breaking up?
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 15, 2015, 07:35:52 am
Oh, I've also made the template make the letters slightly smaller than normal, once again in an attempt to try and fit as much as possible in the screen. If you think it makes it hard to read, just remove the
Quote from: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Template:CS
<div style="font-size:13px;">from the CS template.
Like I said before, I won't be using the cheat sheet too much. I'll probably only use it if I have to come up with a battle plan and want to remember what everyone is carrying. Piecewise will be using it and the other wiki people who do all that work (thank you, by the way) will be updating it. So if anyone should decide how it looks, it's them.
EDIT: Should I put location info right below the player name or is that unnecessary info? Or should that be at the inv or attr section?
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 15, 2015, 09:36:04 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 15, 2015, 10:53:07 am
Post by: swordsmith04 on April 15, 2015, 12:26:33 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 15, 2015, 01:41:56 pm
Post by: Kriellya on April 15, 2015, 01:49:27 pm
How about this room number and password thing? Record it on every character's page or on separate one? Or don't record it?
My plan is to not record it, or at least to not record the password. It depends on how PW responds to my action.
We may want to record the room #? I'm not sure.
Post by: swordsmith04 on April 15, 2015, 03:48:09 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 15, 2015, 07:54:15 pm
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_20_Gyromitra/CS
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_20_Snapdragon/CS
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_19/CS
I tried to keep only things that would be important for the mission in there.
I might have screwed something up while editing. Sorry if I messed up your page.
Tell me if there's something you think I should change. You're free to change the layout or anything else to whatever you think works best.
I'll send piecewise a PM to let him know about this.
Piecewise, if you're reading this, any feedback is welcome. Are the letters too small? Are there more things you want us to keep track of? Do you want to change anything?
If you notice anything wrong or want something changed while making a turn, just mention it in the turn with a [wiki] tag and someone should take care of it.
Post by: Toaster on April 16, 2015, 12:03:28 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on April 16, 2015, 04:22:58 am
Lars sold his MkIII, and the Raduga is inscribed. Everyone got a new MCP suit, right? He'd be wearing it.Okay then, I edited the page to reflect that.
Are your tokens right? Cause right now it shows 0.
Also, got the PEW inscribed with anything? And know how many coldplates you have for it?
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 16, 2015, 04:54:15 am
Lars sold his MkIII, and the Raduga is inscribed. Everyone got a new MCP suit, right? He'd be wearing it.Okay then, I edited the page to reflect that.
Are your tokens right? Cause right now it shows 0.
Also, got the PEW inscribed with anything? And know how many coldplates you have for it?
Yeah, he spent everything.
Post by: Toaster on April 16, 2015, 08:25:29 am
I never specifically inscribed the PEW. No idea; whatever the prototype package came with.
Post by: tryrar on April 17, 2015, 06:09:25 pm
Post by: Comrade P. on April 17, 2015, 06:15:21 pm
Post by: Kriellya on April 17, 2015, 08:04:23 pm
You can find the new version here: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/New_Character_Page
Looking for comments or last minute additions before it's good to copy over. I think it should be fine now.
My current complaint with it is that the re-org makes the status column seem redundant to me, especially for the stasis and dead categories. I can remove it altogether, or we can see if there is something else we'd like in a column.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 18, 2015, 05:18:43 am
I see we're organizing the teams by who is in what jeep. If I may make a suggestion, instead of "Team A, Team B" why not "Squad A, Squad B" to avoid confusing piecewise? So it would be "Team Snapdragon Squad A" for the first jeep for example.
Pw just wanted us to keep track who are in jeep and who are not. For obvious reasons.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 22, 2015, 05:23:45 am
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 25, 2015, 11:36:07 am
E: Never mind, I found it. Copied into Page of Mysteries.
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 28, 2015, 12:13:00 pm
Quote
Who would make the tastiest Armburgers?
Milno (the original)
19
STAN (quantity!)
4
Timmy (exquisitely eldritch)
7
The poll was created at 09:03 on April 8, 2015, and so far 30 people voted.
And as it turns out, the classic taste of Milno's Armburgers wins by a landslide! Sorry STAN, looks like you'll have to stick to singing and dancing.
New poll: how do you decide what to buy? And what kind of writing style do you prefer for armory entries? Vote now!
Post by: AoshimaMichio on April 28, 2015, 01:32:08 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 28, 2015, 01:36:23 pm
Second poll is missing option "Funny and informative".
Because then everybody just picks that, and we end up with either no new information to what people really prefer the most, or very bloated entries.
Post by: Nikitian on April 28, 2015, 02:10:38 pm
Why no "I'm a Tinker Veteran, I don't care." and "Wait, we have a wiki? I'm still using the list on the forum." options for the first poll? :P
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 28, 2015, 02:11:44 pm
Since it was apparently missed in Heph OOC thread, I'll ask it here:
Why no "I'm a Tinker Veteran, I don't care." and "Wait, we have a wiki? I'm still using the list on the forum." options for the first poll? :P
... Those were jokes, no? What with the smiley face and such?
Post by: Nikitian on April 28, 2015, 02:22:20 pm
At least, I could not remember the last time I browsed items or armory wiki pages for the sake of learning their contents - that with extensive memories of tinker tests and long discussions in Hephaestus OOC thread. And I had this feeling that Syv/Sean/maybe you might share that notion.
(That's what one gets for being an ER geek, I guess :P )
But the wiki search (which I occasionally use) gives the item pages first, so maybe I should pick that option, if any.
Post by: Parisbre56 on May 24, 2015, 06:26:18 pm
Oh, and I propose we name the salvage team "Team A(carpous)" and the other "Team B(ait)". Could also do the inverse for "Team A(lready dead)/A(lmost certain death)" and "Team B(arely salvageable)"
Irrelevant, but I think this is the first time in a long time that Steve is putting together a team on his own. I think the first time since the rebellion. Guess that's what happens when there's no active commanders available. And probably what will happen in the future if extraction goes badly.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on May 24, 2015, 07:16:31 pm
Post by: Kriellya on May 25, 2015, 03:57:41 am
I think we can outright replace sheeps on M19 cheat sheep page. Dead are dead and their useable inventory is gone.
Eh, I find it somewhat useful for record keeping to keep the cheat-sheets intact, even with dead characters.
My thought is, under the assumption that PW has something for the couple people going salvaging to *do* besides a corpse run, to add whoever's heading out there to the Mission 19 page, and then make a Mission 20 D(deflexula) page for the distraction mission, since it will start out together
Post by: Parisbre56 on May 25, 2015, 05:42:02 am
Post by: DoctorMcTaalik on May 31, 2015, 06:31:04 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on June 02, 2015, 12:51:21 pm
Post by: Kriellya on June 02, 2015, 02:39:19 pm
Oh, it's D'usse, isn't it... I'll go look into it. My solution is probably going to be to silently setup redirects for pages with quotes in the title.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on June 02, 2015, 03:17:48 pm
Post by: Kriellya on June 02, 2015, 03:43:11 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 02, 2015, 06:10:42 pm
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/%22Blind-right%22_Rimma_Vetrova?diff=prev&oldid=9507
that gets fixed when the page name is manually inserted here
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/index.php?title=%22Blind-right%22_Rimma_Vetrova&diff=9513&oldid=9507
PAGENAMEE should convert the page name to the correct format. At least, that's what I understood from what I read here
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:PAGENAMEE_encoding#PAGENAME
when I was creating the template.
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/%22Blind-right%22_Rimma_Vetrova/Inv
seems to work fine when I copy-paste it to my browser, and if you look at the link to the data page itself it displays fine too. Maybe templates require the names to be in a different format? One needs them percent encoded and the other HTML encoded? Is it better to use PAGENAME instead of PAGENAMEE? I don't know. I might try experimenting later.
Post by: Kriellya on June 02, 2015, 06:32:56 pm
Post by: Kriellya on June 02, 2015, 09:08:51 pm
Hmm. Ordinary {{PAGENAME}} seems to work correctly. So I guess it's expecting the input to be HTML encoded, at least for that parameter?
Whatever, we know in the future. I'll go update the New Character template, we'll see what breaks next.
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 16, 2015, 12:39:17 pm
Quote from: sourcepage
Alice
{{Sectionstart|sectionname}}
Foo
{{Sectionstart|sectionname2}}
Bar
{{Sectionend|sectionname}}
Baz
{{Sectionend|sectionname2}}
Bob
Quote from: dest code
{{Linksection|sourcepage|sectionname}}
Other text
{{Linksection|sourcepage|sectionname2}}
Quote from: dest
Foo
Bar
Other text
Bar
Baz
Do you think that's easier/better than having subpages and transcribing them whole? If yes, I can test it to make sure it works as advertised and write more instructions.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on June 16, 2015, 01:04:14 pm
Post by: Kriellya on June 16, 2015, 10:51:10 pm
It is probably is easier when everything is on same page, and reduces amount of necessary edits. And perhaps it permits more free formatting on Cheat Sheep pages.
Ditto this, though I had thought we had a concern with subsections in inventory? Maybe we just need to add a Locker subsection to the template, and have people shove crap they're not carrying in there.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on June 17, 2015, 07:55:36 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on June 17, 2015, 08:40:34 am
Post by: Comrade P. on June 17, 2015, 08:44:58 am
Stick it in the newbie guide?
I really think this is a right thing to do. I don't quite understand why it was placed on Stats and Skills page in the first place.
Post by: Kriellya on June 17, 2015, 10:16:26 am
Stick it in the newbie guide?
I really think this is a right thing to do. I don't quite understand why it was placed on Stats and Skills page in the first place.
It can be both places, you know :P
I hadn't noticed it wasn't in the newbie guide, that's not usually my editing sphere. I put it on the Stats/Skills pages when we made the tool
Post by: Comrade P. on June 17, 2015, 10:33:38 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 17, 2015, 08:35:08 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on June 17, 2015, 11:14:04 pm
Radio, if you're reading this, can you check if you can enable the Labeled Section Transclusion (https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion) plugin? It is needed to be able to copy parts of pages to other pages. I can implement a template that does the same job, but a) it won't be as good and b) no need to reinvent the wheel.
Is that a thing you can do in wikia? I don't think it is, at least, I can't find where I'd have to enable it.
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 18, 2015, 03:12:19 am
Radio, if you're reading this, can you check if you can enable the Labeled Section Transclusion (https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion) plugin? It is needed to be able to copy parts of pages to other pages. I can implement a template that does the same job, but a) it won't be as good and b) no need to reinvent the wheel.
Is that a thing you can do in wikia? I don't think it is, at least, I can't find where I'd have to enable it.
According to this: http://community.wikia.com/wiki/Help:Extensions
You have to contact wikia's staff and tell them to enable it: http://community.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Contact
They might ask you why you want it, but I don't see why they would have a problem with enabling it. Doesn't hurt to try, at least.
Post by: Radio Controlled on June 18, 2015, 05:07:48 am
Radio, if you're reading this, can you check if you can enable the Labeled Section Transclusion (https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion) plugin? It is needed to be able to copy parts of pages to other pages. I can implement a template that does the same job, but a) it won't be as good and b) no need to reinvent the wheel.
Is that a thing you can do in wikia? I don't think it is, at least, I can't find where I'd have to enable it.
According to this: http://community.wikia.com/wiki/Help:Extensions
You have to contact wikia's staff and tell them to enable it: http://community.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Contact
They might ask you why you want it, but I don't see why they would have a problem with enabling it. Doesn't hurt to try, at least.
Message send. I thought I was just not finding the extension due to search failure, but you were right, we'll have to ask them to enable it themselves. We'll see what we get.
Post by: Radio Controlled on June 19, 2015, 04:34:33 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 19, 2015, 06:07:28 am
I'll make a better check and change the templates to automatically mark stats and skills as sections when I get home.
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 19, 2015, 08:23:01 am
I am going to wait until Mission 20 is over (EDIT: So that I don't break things when they are needed), at which point I will edit the necessary templates and start editing all pages. I might start editing pages of people not on Mission 20 right now if I have some spare time.
If you want to see an example of how the modified templates and character pages will work, check the code at:
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_20_Snapdragon/CS#Flint_Westwood_.28Parisbre56.29 -> http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_20_Snapdragon/CS?action=edit§ion=3
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Flint_Westwood#Inventory -> http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Flint_Westwood?action=edit§ion=5
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Flint_Westwood#Attributes -> http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Flint_Westwood?action=edit§ion=13
So if you look at the code of the first link, this is what the CS template will look like after I edit it.
The next two links show how character pages will need to be like for this to work.
As always, suggestions/questions are welcome.
Post by: Kriellya on June 19, 2015, 06:00:40 pm
Then a whole bunch of flagging shit for deletion! Ready for some cleanup, RC? :P
Hmm, I wonder if this will solve the default template using the source editor...
Post by: Kriellya on June 19, 2015, 06:37:30 pm
Hmm, okay, I see that you said you couldn't do this. Any idea why?
Status also doesn't appear to be showing up?
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 19, 2015, 08:19:20 pm
Quote
Any idea why?I dunno, maybe to avoid some sort of infinite loop? Maybe templates do not transclude section tags? I have no idea. But this says they can't be used that way:
Quote from: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion
Section tags cannot themselves be transcluded in order to work on other pages. This means, for instance, that these tags cannot be embedded in a template using template parameters and parser functions. The #tag magic word does not work with section tags. #tag produces balanced tags, while the section tags uses singular tags. See task T39256.
Then, there's this:
Quote from: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion
{{#lsth:pagename|sectionX}}Which says that it's possible to transclude sections but they need to have headers (the ==Name== things) instead of <section begin=name />. So we could simple force everyone to have a single header for some of the things we want to copy (something like "all stats and skills sections must be in an ===Attributes=== header"). I haven't tried it, so don't take my word for it, but it might be possible to use it to transclude things inside templates.
Then there's this from the same page that says:
Quote from: Section ranges
These functions have an additional, optional argument to specify a section range; i.e. {{#lst:articleX|chapter1|chapter3}}, to include everything from the beginning of chapter 1 to the end of chapter 3. This allows using empty marker pairs to mark one end of the section, possibly in a template. A similar mechanism is currently used at the French Wikisource.Which says that it is possible to transclude a section if it is inside a template if you use it as part of a range. So you do something like put an empty section at the start of a page and then a second section inside the template and use it as the end of the range (or maybe you need to have another empty section at the end of the page, I dunno, again, I haven't tried it).
Quote
There was a typo in the section designator.I had it marked as start instead of begin, hadn't I? Keep confusing the two.
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 19, 2015, 10:24:18 pm
Spoiler: Not really relevant to the ER wiki, but more relevant to wikia in general (click to show/hide)
Post by: Kriellya on June 19, 2015, 10:55:29 pm
Template code here, we can make sure I didn't do something derpy --> http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/New_Character?action=edit
Post by: Radio Controlled on June 19, 2015, 11:11:59 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 20, 2015, 07:05:39 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on June 24, 2015, 07:35:54 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 24, 2015, 08:24:50 am
Just a though, since I'm in work right now and therefore can't do it myself: Armory Item template should include link back to Armory page, preferrably to the same section the item originates from (Con weapons link to Con section, Exo weapons to Exo section ect.). More than once I have found myself wanting that little helpful link.Sure. I can do that. Think it would be better to change it so that it links to the individual item using their anchors or just the category? Or I can do both by making the category in the infobox link to the appropriate section.
EDIT: Done. Did a double anchor in the AL template containing both the item name and the page it links to to ensure armory items that have one name but link to a page with another name can be returned to safely. Clicking the category name in the infobox now returns you to the category. Suggestions welcome.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on June 24, 2015, 10:21:52 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on June 29, 2015, 10:08:54 pm
I switched over the character pages to the new system.
For those of you who don't know what that means, then don't worry about it. Short version is that attributes and inventory are back in the same page now, instead of being in separate pages. Just check your pages and if I screwed something up, tell me so that I can fix it.
For those of you who do know what that means, your character pages should now have three sections that will be copied via the CS template to any CS pages: "sns", "status" and "inv"
Remember to keep the information in CS sections as small and easily readable as possible, with the most important info near the top, since they are supposed to be there mostly to help piecewise and thus should be easy to read through and find important info in.
Also remember that there can be multiple sections within the same page, meaning you can do something like this:Quote==Things in my hands==
<section begin=inv />
<section end=inv />
==Things in my pants==
<section begin=inv />
<section end=inv />
I've marked the old attr and inv pages for deletion for whenever Radio has some free time. Or he could just give Aoshima or some other frequent contributor administrator permissions (http://community.wikia.com/wiki/Help:User_rights#Administrators) so that he can help.
I also marked anyone I thought was inactive as inactive. I was a bit aggressive, so if I accidentally marked someone as inactive while they weren't, say so and I (or someone else) will correct it.
Post by: piecewise on July 01, 2015, 10:01:51 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 01, 2015, 10:22:04 am
Payment time. Who did I put in charge of keeping track of everyone's work again?
Nobody? What do you need to know?
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 01, 2015, 10:31:44 am
Syvarris mostly does bookkeeping in the Hephaestus page. And I think he and NAV put a lot of info about artefacts retrieved during missions in the wiki? EDIT EDIT: Or was that Nik and Nav?
And I just play around with templates, marking inactives, creating cheat sheets and editing everyone's pages to support cheat sheets.
Since nobody kept track of everyone, maybe
EDIT: Oh, and Kri does some of the new characters and maintains the character index, I think. Forgot about him.
Post by: swordsmith04 on July 01, 2015, 10:56:15 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 01, 2015, 01:08:48 pm
Post by: Slayer1557 on July 01, 2015, 01:28:32 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 01, 2015, 01:33:23 pm
Post by: swordsmith04 on July 01, 2015, 02:42:25 pm
Payment time. Who did I put in charge of keeping track of everyone's work again?
Me. Here's the data.
Between April 8th and June 30th, 1537 edits were made to the wiki:
Parisbre56 made more than 462 edits to the wiki, including a whole lot of fucking around with templates. :P Most of his edits were to character pages (54%). Per Paris' wish, I'll note that, ignoring the work on templates, the number of edits he made is closer to 200.
AoshimaMichio made 320 edits to the wiki. Most of his edits were on character pages (42%).
NAV made 214 edits to the wiki. Most of his edits were on character pages (48%).
Swordsmith04 made 202 edits to the wiki (which seems like a lot more than it feels like, but numbers do not lie!). Most of my edits were on inventories (53%).
Kriellya made 177 edits to the wiki. Most of Kri's edits were to character pages (70%).
Comrade P made 39 edits to the wiki. Caellath made 29 edits to the wiki. Radio Controlled made 23 edits to the wiki. Syvarris made 11 edits to the wiki, mostly for Heph. Nunzillor made 10 edits to the wiki.
The following users made less than 10 edits to the wiki:
Illgeo, DoctorMcTaalik, Nikitian, Dutrius, Harry Baldman, Gentlefish/Pufferfish, Toaster, Lenglon, NJW2000, Renegadelobster, Cinder/Objective, SeanMirrsen, spazyak, and Egan_BW.
Italicized names indicate users who contributed without an account but signed their names to their edits.
EDIT: Egan's name should've been italicized as well, fixed.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 01, 2015, 02:47:24 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 01, 2015, 02:51:13 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 01, 2015, 02:52:59 pm
Note that my contributions mostly involved repetitive work done on the character pages to make them work with the cheat sheet templates and only a small fraction of those was actually me adding useful things, so I don't think I should receive the same payment as sword, aoshima or nav who try their best to keep those inventories and statuses up to date for all players.
Don't you dare to say those templates are not useful.
Post by: swordsmith04 on July 01, 2015, 02:58:07 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 01, 2015, 03:05:39 pm
Post by: Slayer1557 on July 01, 2015, 04:31:42 pm
Spoilers are not needed in my opinion. Basically write what happened. A summary. If you mean for Mission Synopsis page, then maybe try to cram it into one or two short paragraphs. On actual mission page it can be more detailed, but not excessively so.Hmm... looking at the summaries as well, they seem pretty detailed already. I blame Radio Controlled. Wrangling me into this wiki stuff (Which I wouldn't mind doing as I read through the entire archive, don't think I don't enjoy this).
So what else might be useful? Maybe categorizing those random tidbits that PW gives us time to time? Like... a list of Xenos encountered/mentioned and any info on them. Or even stuff like when Jim was looking into animal-like Synthflesh bodies, just making pages for that and listing it out. What do you think? I would have to go back to repopulate it based on the stuff from before where I currently am in reading, but I could start cataloguing going forward.
List of epic fail [1] rolls? List of all injuries sustained? Suggestions are appreciated.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 01, 2015, 04:42:19 pm
Or listening at the ER talks and looking for something useful.
Post by: swordsmith04 on July 01, 2015, 04:54:12 pm
Since you're reading through the entire game already, could you keep an eye out for any information that isn't already on pages like the Artifact data (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Artifact_Data), Nyars boxes (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Nyars_boxes), Auxiliary tools (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Auxiliary_Tools), and NPC (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Non_Player_Characters) pages?
Post by: Slayer1557 on July 01, 2015, 06:05:00 pm
You might want to check that the page you're thinking of adding doesn't already exist; we've got a list of aliens here (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Races,_Governements,_Institutions_and_Organisations#Xenos), though that page is perhaps not the best place for them... :POf course I would check first. That page does have some of what I was thinking of. Just little things that show up either in missions, or VR sims, etc. I just got to Nyars, so I get all the joy of those things. :P
Since you're reading through the entire game already, could you keep an eye out for any information that isn't already on pages like the Artifact data (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Artifact_Data), Nyars boxes (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Nyars_boxes), Auxiliary tools (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Auxiliary_Tools), and NPC (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Non_Player_Characters) pages?
I'll see what I can do, but I'll run it by here before I make any crazy edits. Otherwise I'll just keep a log of stuff locally.
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 01, 2015, 06:23:52 pm
I blame Radio Controlled.
It's what all the cool kids do.
Post by: Egan_BW on July 01, 2015, 07:34:55 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 02, 2015, 02:23:57 pm
Asking because of this:
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Miyamoto_de_Bergerac?diff=10068
I am also watching this thread.You are inside the ARM Archives. The ARM logo glows gently above the front desk, and doors open onto a number of brightly-lit laboratories and computer rooms.
Somebody has spraypainted Egan_BW iz watchin onto a wall.
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 02, 2015, 02:25:29 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 02, 2015, 02:29:41 pm
I thought stim usage was tracked because of potential addiction chance and temporary malus after the bonus and such, and thus is reset after the mission? If not, feel free to change that back.I think it much like amp counter; every use is more opportunity for bad things. I'll restore it if Paris haven't done so yet.
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 02, 2015, 02:30:36 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 02, 2015, 02:37:15 pm
Don't just roll back the edit, there was other stuff in there as well. I'll ask pw, so we'll know for sure.Now you are just insulting me.
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 02, 2015, 02:51:38 pm
Don't just roll back the edit, there was other stuff in there as well. I'll ask pw, so we'll know for sure.Now you are just insulting me.
Damn right I am :P
Also, i added stuff from dead peeps to team fund, used best judgement as to whether it would be possible for equipment to be taken along or not (tokens are 'virtual' mostly, so those are always saved I think). If anyone has doubts, do say so.
EDIT: amp use and stil use is supposed to stay noted forever, said pw in pm.
Post by: piecewise on July 02, 2015, 03:36:42 pm
There's no standard or method to these payments, I'm just making it up by feel, before anyone tries to guess how edits relate to tokens etc.Payment time. Who did I put in charge of keeping track of everyone's work again?
Me. Here's the data.
Between April 8th and June 30th, 1537 edits were made to the wiki:
Parisbre56 made more than 462 edits to the wiki, including a whole lot of fucking around with templates. :P Most of his edits were to character pages (54%). Per Paris' wish, I'll note that, ignoring the work on templates, the number of edits he made is closer to 200.
AoshimaMichio made 320 edits to the wiki. Most of his edits were on character pages (42%).
NAV made 214 edits to the wiki. Most of his edits were on character pages (48%).
Swordsmith04 made 202 edits to the wiki (which seems like a lot more than it feels like, but numbers do not lie!). Most of my edits were on inventories (53%).
Kriellya made 177 edits to the wiki. Most of Kri's edits were to character pages (70%).
Comrade P made 39 edits to the wiki. Caellath made 29 edits to the wiki. Radio Controlled made 23 edits to the wiki. Syvarris made 11 edits to the wiki, mostly for Heph. Nunzillor made 10 edits to the wiki.
The following users made less than 10 edits to the wiki:
Illgeo, DoctorMcTaalik, Nikitian, Dutrius, Harry Baldman, Gentlefish/Pufferfish, Toaster, Lenglon, NJW2000, Renegadelobster, Cinder/Objective, SeanMirrsen, spazyak, and Egan_BW.
Italicized names indicate users who contributed without an account but signed their names to their edits.
EDIT: Egan's name should've been italicized as well, fixed.
Paris: 8
Aoshi: 7
Nav:6
Sword:6
Kri:5
Comrade,Cael, Radio, Sy and Nun: 1
Post by: Comrade P. on July 03, 2015, 03:11:57 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 03, 2015, 12:32:49 pm
Some people (I think it was Kriellya) have complained in the past about how unwieldy and hard to understand template code sometimes is. For those of you more familiar with programming, there's an alternative: Lua. It can be used to create templates and it can understand wikitext as well as the "sanitized" html tags allowed in wikia. And as a programming language, it's much easier to write in, as it has things like loops, iterating through tables, functions to handle strings, etc. as well as functions provided by wikia:
http://dev.wikia.com/wiki/Lua_reference_manual/Scribunto_libraries
http://dev.wikia.com/wiki/Lua_reference_manual/Standard_libraries
You can even invoke templates through it, so you can have lua, invoke a template, invoking lua, etc.
You can write lua code in our wiki, all you have to do is create a page in the namespace "Module:". For example, the one I used to test things: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Module:LuaTest
There are more interesting things with Lua in wikia, like the ability to have one lua page load lua code from other pages: http://dev.wikia.com/wiki/Lua_templating/Converting_Wikitext_templates#Switch_statements
You can see an example in the sandbox.
Just putting this out there, so that people know it's a possibility. If there is ever a need to radically change a template for some reason or write a new one, I'll probably do the core work in Lua and create a wrapper template written in wikitext for it so that it is easier to understand. I really don't feel there is need to rewrite the current templates (if it ain't broke, don't fix it).
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 03, 2015, 12:48:18 pm
I haven't messed with Lua for few years. Never really got into it much, but language itself isn't hard. Gotta check that some day.
Post by: Kriellya on July 03, 2015, 05:09:55 pm
I can totally do lua. Prepare for madness! :P
(I probably won't do anything until the next missions are off, but it would be pretty useful for centralizing and automating a few things)
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 03, 2015, 06:20:10 pm
Wait, we can lua? WOOOO!Great. More automation is always good. Just don't fall victim to this (https://xkcd.com/1319/).
I can totally do lua. Prepare for madness! :P
(I probably won't do anything until the next missions are off, but it would be pretty useful for centralizing and automating a few things)
I haven't finished reading the sources yet, but it looks like the (frame) object can do some fun stuff, like give you some control over the wikitext parser, give you the name of the page the script is used on, the arguments of the template used to call it, give you other pages... It's quite fun. I might use it in the armory page to fix a problem with the current template being unable to handle two Enhanced Capacity.
Only problem is that the documentation is a bit unclear if global variables are retained between #invokes of a script so you can do something like an autonumbering list by using multiple #invokes instead of one giant #invoke. I'll experiment with that later.
Here's some more sources:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Lua
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto/Lua_reference_manual
For less experimental and more immediate stuff, could you please provide a legend for what the symbols in Character Index (http://the http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Character_Index) mean? I mean get that the [num] means current mission and the
And another question. Any idea what the +1 next to the number of missions means in some of the PC pages?
Post by: swordsmith04 on July 03, 2015, 06:35:19 pm
And another question. Any idea what the +1 next to the number of missions means in some of the PC pages?That's for failed missions, I believe. From before 10 missions stopped being significant.
Post by: Kriellya on July 03, 2015, 08:47:09 pm
Ah, that's what that means. I had been wondering while I was checking some mission counts. Think we should merge those together?And another question. Any idea what the +1 next to the number of missions means in some of the PC pages?That's for failed missions, I believe. From before 10 missions stopped being significant.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 04, 2015, 01:37:08 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 04, 2015, 02:38:35 pm
Post by: Kriellya on July 04, 2015, 03:12:07 pm
If you have a good idea on what you'd like from the template, Paris or I can code it up.
Post by: Twinwolf on July 04, 2015, 03:14:49 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 04, 2015, 04:52:34 pm
We don't yet. I was having trouble thinking of a good way to display the tags in the template myself.I think he means something like the "new character" page, but for artefacts. I think there is nothing like that.
If you have a good idea on what you'd like from the template, Paris or I can code it up.
That said, yes, anything you want from templates, we can probably do it.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 05, 2015, 12:20:54 am
The Nyartifact template needs autocategorization, item name, code, and later when we have ideas what codes mean it could include autoparser to translate and suggest what the code means. Price maybe?
Post by: NAV on July 05, 2015, 11:17:25 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 05, 2015, 03:53:05 pm
There's some dead player's stuff in the team fund, shouldn't that go to the player market?
I'm waiting to see if we'll need any of it to equip people for this mission cycle.
Post by: Xantalos on July 06, 2015, 03:38:18 am
Any way to edit the title of an article?
Post by: Kriellya on July 06, 2015, 03:58:16 am
Aaaand that's why I don't try to do wiki stuff, because now my internet is exploding or something.
Any way to edit the title of an article?
Yes, it involves redirects and is kind of annoying and complicated. What would you like to change the title of?
Post by: Xantalos on July 06, 2015, 04:00:45 am
Post by: Kriellya on July 06, 2015, 04:15:26 am
Ah, I see, since it probably needs to involve all the links to that one particular page. I was gonna edit Xan's character page title to '"Vanessa Anagrid" (Xan)' to reflect on his new persona and to make sure it isn't as easily forgotten as the Dan Smith thing was, but if you don't wanna do it it's no trouble.
How did I know that's what you were up to :P The 'easiest' way to accomplish what you want is probably to change a few links to use the different name. In particular, since this is the main link to the character pages, change the Character Index link to display as 'Vanessa Anagrid' instead of Xan, and make sure that new missions use the new name. We can also add-in a redirect from Vanessa Anagrid to Xan's page, or rename Xan's page (Which does the reverse)
Both need to be done to 'change' how the name looks on the wiki fully, but the important one for your purposes is probably the displayed Names on the links.
Post by: Xantalos on July 06, 2015, 04:22:13 am
'Hmm, ah there's Vanessa. I wonder what her stats are OH MY GOD'
I could get to it eventually, probably tomorrow if I remember to.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 06, 2015, 07:39:44 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 06, 2015, 09:21:44 am
EDIT: If there are no disagreements, I'll create a new page with this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 06, 2015, 01:16:39 pm
I meant actual wiki template, but page template, such as New Character page, would be nice as well. We need more of those as well. From top of my head one for mission page, maybe another for cheat sheep page.I created a this:
The Nyartifact template needs autocategorization, item name, code, and later when we have ideas what codes mean it could include autoparser to translate and suggest what the code means. Price maybe?
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/New_Nyars_Artifact:_Nuclear_Dong
using this:
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Template:NewNyarsObject
which uses this:
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Module:Nyars
If I did anything wrong or if you have any idea of how to make it better, feel free to either tell me so I can fix it or to do it yourselves.
Post by: Kriellya on July 06, 2015, 01:56:08 pm
Redirecting is not that complicated. You just create a new page and use the redirect template in it. I can do that, if you want.
It's not that the act is complicated, so much as it *makes* things complicated, if you don't remember that you've done them. The two page solution is shiny, though.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 06, 2015, 02:02:01 pm
I meant actual wiki template, but page template, such as New Character page, would be nice as well. We need more of those as well. From top of my head one for mission page, maybe another for cheat sheep page.I created a this:
The Nyartifact template needs autocategorization, item name, code, and later when we have ideas what codes mean it could include autoparser to translate and suggest what the code means. Price maybe?
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/New_Nyars_Artifact:_Nuclear_Dong
using this:
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Template:NewNyarsObject
which uses this:
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Module:Nyars
If I did anything wrong or if you have any idea of how to make it better, feel free to either tell me so I can fix it or to do it yourselves.
Personally I think nyartifact page names should use official name of the artifact, in this case DECEITFUL IVORY. Because while nick names seems to stick (see deathcube), they might change. But on the other hand Nuclear Dong is very descriptive...
Post by: Xantalos on July 06, 2015, 02:36:20 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 06, 2015, 03:09:24 pm
If anyone has any objections or a better idea, then we can change it back later.
I might Labelled Section Transclude some parts of the new character to the old page, so that we don't have to update both.
Personally I think nyartifact page names should use official name of the artifact, in this case DECEITFUL IVORY. Because while nick names seems to stick (see deathcube), they might change. But on the other hand Nuclear Dong is very descriptive...Yeah, I was thinking that having an unnoficial name for objects would be best, since it would make finding them easier. You might not remember the name "DECEITFUL IVORY", but you might remember the name "Nuclear Dong". Same as NPC redirects to Non_Player_Character, to make finding it easier. A redirect can link the Nuclear Dong to its official name.
And like I say in the template, for objects that don't have a name, we can use the official name. If they ever get a name, then renaming the page is done with a single click (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Special:MovePage/New_Nyars_Artifact:_Nuclear_Dong) (and maybe a few extra clicks to resolve double redirects).
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 07, 2015, 12:00:06 am
Post by: Egan_BW on July 07, 2015, 01:55:25 am
Post by: Nikitian on July 13, 2015, 04:33:36 am
Furthermore, does the HMRC Pantheon belong to 'Background'? Sure, as cultural thing of the past, it is part of the background; but as a living faith of modern convicts, it feels more to the forefront of the story as player-driven thing - like, for example, Jim&Feyri's Medieval Tournament (which totally deserves a page of its own :P) or Notable Events. Maybe both 'Background' and some other category?
Post by: Devastator on July 13, 2015, 05:48:16 am
RC asked him, and didn't get an answer either way. I would ask him myself, but he's not been on IRC and I'm greedy enough not to go out of my way to steal tokens from myself.
So.. PW says you get 2, you think you should have gotten 5, so you give yourself five.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 13, 2015, 06:22:16 am
Can someone explain the category of 'Game' to me? It seems a little too all-encompassing (or ill-defined) to be meaningful, though I think I almost grok the idea behind it.
Furthermore, does the HMRC Pantheon belong to 'Background'? Sure, as cultural thing of the past, it is part of the background; but as a living faith of modern convicts, it feels more to the forefront of the story as player-driven thing - like, for example, Jim&Feyri's Medieval Tournament (which totally deserves a page of its own :P) or Notable Events. Maybe both 'Background' and some other category?
Categories are little iffy currently. They need to be reworked, especially "Game" and "Background". Those two are kind of dump-categories where everything else not in armory, characters or missions go.
RC asked him, and didn't get an answer either way. I would ask him myself, but he's not been on IRC and I'm greedy enough not to go out of my way to steal tokens from myself.
So.. PW says you get 2, you think you should have gotten 5, so you give yourself five.
Personally I think they too deserve same payment as Snapdragon rescuers which is why I haven't done anything about it. But on the other hand 5 tokens is baseline mission payment again, and rescuers didn't get full level up, then Snapdragon rescue team shouldn't get 5 tokens but rather two like Gyromitra rescue team did. But Snapdragon set precedent for getting out earlier.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 13, 2015, 06:23:50 am
And about categories, we could start by editing the category pages and putting a description of what's supposed to be there.
Post by: Devastator on July 13, 2015, 06:46:41 am
Secondly, PW is busy with the mission changeover, and under these circumstances, I don't think him not saying something about what is at best, a tertiary priority for him can justify overriding what he has already said about the matter.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 13, 2015, 09:00:05 am
I don't exactly agree with the course of action he chose, I would had kept posting actions until piecewise responded or stop posting actions and accept unfair payment because piecewise looked busy.
But I also won't take action that would result in essentially punishing the rescue team because their players did more and risked more for the mission.
And I feel that piecewise would agree with the fact they did more.
So unless he indicates he wants another solution to this problem, there's not much I can do about it. It's a moral conflict where every choice has a good chance of being wrong, so the best choice is to do nothing and have everyone remain content with the current situation which doesn't seem to be bothering anyone.
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 13, 2015, 09:31:07 am
Post by: Xantalos on July 13, 2015, 09:51:02 am
And every bit of debate was necessary :P
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 13, 2015, 10:08:39 am
Alright, give them 5. I'd actually prefer to just give the other team 2 instead, but their money is probably already spent.
Boom. That's how long it takes.
Post by: Kriellya on July 13, 2015, 12:46:39 pm
Post by: Twinwolf on July 13, 2015, 12:48:11 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 13, 2015, 12:54:27 pm
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Cthunkan
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Gestalt
EDIT: And also, I think Charisma is a physical stat? Since it's about how "cool" you are? You might want to ask piecewise about which of those are physical.
EDITEDIT: @Kriellya: Also, any idea about how you are planning to make the template work?
Post by: swordsmith04 on July 13, 2015, 01:02:31 pm
Post by: Kriellya on July 13, 2015, 01:08:06 pm
EDITEDIT: @Kriellya: Also, any idea about how you are planning to make the template work?
Made a 'left' and 'right' template, slammed the stats and skills template together, removed physical stats, and added the name of the controlling character above it. It makes a giant brick of black and green that will look *wonderful* on the cheat sheet :P
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 13, 2015, 01:16:31 pm
@Kriellya: Yeah, just took a quick look at it. It's not pretty, but it works. Might be better to make a physical attributes template to put in the centre of the top of the attribute section and then put the mental attributes below that, using something like
Code: [Select]
<div style="margin: auto;">{{physical}}</div>
<div style="clear:both;"></div>
<div style="float: left;">{{mental1}}</div><div style="float: right;">{{mental2}}</div>
etc.and other style markers to make sure they are in the right place. Just to remove the unnecessary information and the need for two templates that do basically the same thing.
Post by: Kriellya on July 13, 2015, 01:21:01 pm
I definitely like that idea, this was just the quick-and-dirty get the information on a page so people can see it answer. We can fiddle with the formatting as we go.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 13, 2015, 01:23:23 pm
All stats are considered physical.
But mind is both physical and metnal. Somehow.
So we keep the stats template and put it on the top of the attributes and also keep your monstrosity for mind and the skills.
EDIT: Wait, you already saw that, nevermind. Doing this from a phone is slow...
Post by: Kriellya on July 13, 2015, 01:32:31 pm
Wait, based on that: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=135884.msg6370639#msg6370639
All stats are considered physical.
But mind is both physical and metnal. Somehow.
So we keep the stats template and put it on the top of the attributes and also keep your monstrosity for mind and the skills.
yeah, just need to center the stats template, remove the attribute template.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 13, 2015, 01:47:18 pm
Code: [Select]
{| style="font-size: 14px; float: left; margin: 0 0 0em 0em; border: 0.5px solid limegreen; background: limegreen; padding: 1px 1px; color:green; text-align: left;" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="49.5%"Becomes this:Code: [Select]
{| style="font-size: 14px; float: {{{float|left}}}; margin: 0 0 0em 0em; border: 0.5px solid limegreen; background: limegreen; padding: 1px 1px; color:green; text-align: left;" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="49.5%"So then to centre it, the following should work, at least based on what I read:
Code: [Select]
<div style="margin: auto;">
{{NStats|float=none|etc}}
</div>
Post by: Kriellya on July 13, 2015, 03:52:46 pm
EDIT: Got it working. Float fights the margin system kind of hard. I ended up shoving the table into a centered box, and adding width as a parameter to the template, so I could tell it to take up all the space in the box. I might move those features into Skills, if we can think of a use for them.
Post by: Nikitian on July 14, 2015, 04:41:30 pm
I think it's time we start tallying the tinker royalties as Piecewise said. I'm up to looking through the recent purchases, and I'm currently contacting Piecewise on the matter of the more complex issues of this system like the ones brought up by RC.Quote"I'd like to get a few items please. Could I have a Monoatomic Razor, a blaster pistol, and a kilo of Aster-Ex with short range detonator please. And as many frag grenades as 1 token will buy me"Do I get a token from this?QuoteA universal chem thrower with an extra sticky goop canister (3+1 tokens) for civilians, trapping things I can't or don't want to kill and closing atmospheric breaches.And from this? Do I or Pancaek get a token? Maybe say we take turns getting a token from a chem thrower sale? And what about the purchase of the ammo?
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 14, 2015, 04:59:36 pm
Post by: Egan_BW on July 14, 2015, 05:09:58 pm
Post by: Nikitian on July 14, 2015, 05:14:10 pm
Personally, I'd think 1-token items should only pay out a token per 2 (or 3) units sold. Aka I'd only get a token once another person buys a blistol. I'd say ammo either doesn't count, or uses the same method. As for collaborations, I'd say just let the participants figure it out on their own (I'm sure me and Pan will come to an agreement easily).I've asked him on collaborations, and no, I don't think that would cut it. Piecewise suggested very wisely an effective system that has one goal in mind: have Tinkerers design reasonably affordable designs, and no outlandish luxuries. What you suggest would effectively doom all 1-token items, with their authors consciously pushing them into 2-token category. No, for the sake of Scientific Advancement, you should get a whole token every time a blistol or its battery is purchased. That's how it works. Every tinkerer should be aspiring to achieve as much.
(You could make a case that 5-token/9-token/etc. items are better for their creators than 4-token/8-token/etc. ones, but there is but one problem: 4-token item would give the creator just the same amount of royalties as a 2-token or 1-token would - but guess how demand curve is sloped at those price levels; going as low as you can (rather than slightly higher) is very often the best idea out there, and, as I said, it is working as intended.)
Maybe keep a tally of player-made items bought and pay out at the end of the mission cycle?That could work, but maybe it could be easier to add the tokens just as we wiki the relevant piece of equipment and deduct the payment. Less things to constantly keep track of, I think.
Post by: Nikitian on July 14, 2015, 08:56:46 pm
A few questions about the 'successful Tinker design' royalties you introduced not long ago (25% off each purchase, rounded up):
1)Are those retroactive? That might take a little time, but is certainly doable (at least, say, since with the Hephaestus defense ending as cut-off date). I'd think it feels more right, since it was a period when no one really profited from their work (unlike earlier when prototypes were essentially gifts from Steve to the tinkerer), but you clearly might have a different reasoning in mind, so I'd like that clarified.
2)How do collaborative designs work in this regard? The latest being what culminated in Xan's body, with no less than three or four people throwing around ideas until Paris came to you with the final one. Who'd get paid were Medi-bodies armory-available and purchased by people?
3)How do derivative designs work in that regard? I can see two sub-variants here: a)when a trooper requests a custom variation on the design right from the Armory and simply gets it (e.g. Paris buying an oversized monosword, Corsair buying half-thick Milnoplate); b)when someone takes up an earlier design and improves upon it (or just brings it up-to-date) (e.g. syvarris modifying and updating Milnoplate; me making three distinct sub-exoskeleton variants back then)
To questions 2&3 a quick answer could probably be given in the form of "he who gets admitted as design author to the Armory gets all the royalties", thus pushing off the problem into IC plane (and making it Hephaestus Head of Engineering's headache instead of yours), but then I would like to ask you for guidelines.
4)How does the OOC design authorship relate to IC design authorship? Basically, who's the official author, the player or the character, and does a following character gain any tokens on behalf of designs invented earlier by the same player? (This arose from Tinker leaving the strict confines of IC and moving to OOC IRC, I'd say :P)
(e.g. Empiricist's previous character making the Aux-turret, and Pyro's previous character making the Sibilus gauss-rocket riflt; would their current characters get any tokens from the relevant purchases nowadays?)
1) If someone wants to dig back through and find all the times someone bought something, then sure.
2) Whoever submits it gets it but they can give out money to those who they think earned it as well.
3) Royalties is an option. A form of copy right is another. Beating up people who try to take your designs is a third. I'm not sure which I'm for more.
4) We'll go with Player. I assume this will take a while to make anyone money, so having it restricted to a single life is a bit too harsh.
So, I can draw the following conclusions:
1)It actually might be a good idea to have all tokens earned by a player-tinkerer tallied on a dedicated page, and then probably 'withdrawn' from account by their players regularly (whenever suitable by characters, so either on the Sword after/instead of going on missions, or on Hephaestus just whenever).
2)There might be drama and even shanking in the showers with the design authorship, so we should be extra cautious with that when unilaterally declaring the design creators on wiki
3)There's going to be hell of a Fun re-reading and picking out whenever a player-designed item was bought from the Armory, and we all know that someone (me, you, or maybe that guy out there) is eventually going to accomplish that, if only from boredom/to help the cause. ;D
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 15, 2015, 09:19:22 am
Quote
3) Royalties is an option. A form of copy right is another. Beating up people who try to take your designs is a third. I'm not sure which I'm for more.
We could go with 'let the players sort it out, and let pw or the council decide if they can't work out an agreement'.
Quote
3)There's going to be hell of a Fun re-reading and picking out whenever a player-designed item was bought from the Armory, and we all know that someone (me, you, or maybe that guy out there) is eventually going to accomplish that, if only from boredom/to help the cause. ;D
So, I take it you are officially volunteering then?
Quote
4) We'll go with Player. I assume this will take a while to make anyone money, so having it restricted to a single life is a bit too harsh.
I'd tie it to character personally, makes char death be more meaningful.
On that note, remember Miya's armor, exoskeleton, fuel and generator projects? The ones that are used in a lot of today's designs (assaultsuit, MCP-a (the exoskeleton, IIRC), heavy robobody, sharkmist armor, ...)? How about things like this? Maybe a system where, if a person uses components someone else designed (though in this case it's less 'designed', and more 'commissioned the research') this person gets paid a one-time sum for giving the 'right' to have his stuff used? Though this could lead to people not using the most current gen technology.
Post by: Nikitian on July 15, 2015, 10:13:09 am
So yes, I think we shouldn't focus that much on 'starting fresh' as, per his own words, it takes a lot of time to earn meaningful amounts of tokens, so even the past tinker effort deserves it, I believe.
Yeah, I think that's what we could do. Not sure on the Council, they always seem to have it for power-grabbing, but I think players could just fine sort it out between themselves. For instance, goop thrower is listed on the wiki as joint effort by you (RC) and Pancaek; so I put the design authorship at you both - and you jointly are going to get the tokens and then divide them between the two of you. Sounds good, right?
I am not not volunteering, then. :P I have a huge to-do list on wiki updates, but I might have eventually come to doing that - or you could ask a newbie or two to fish up all the instances a player-designed item was bought in the past (hint: there were not many) seeing as more and more newbie-token-earning missions have been completed from the list. Or someone (wiki principle) might do it out of sheer free time, eventually.
I could argue for character authorship, but then we've had OOC tinker for quite a while by now, and then Piecewise said it's better to be player-related than character-related. Sure, breaks immersion a bit, but is kinder to poor Tinkerers (who might easily die before their designs are rightly appreciated, and char death is very meaningful as is, at least for the long-runners).
Those projects... Well, I've thought about it, and I think the following should apply: The person (people, working jointly) who made the revision that got into the Armory deserve the tokens. Full stop.
They are the ones listed as the creators; every other idea that went into the thought-soup can rightfully be mentioned, but unless that person styles himself as a co-creator (the whole "community decide between themselves", right in action), he doesn't get much for it. Mostly because preliminary work is either done by scientists/ARESTE (like "Miya's" generators-armor-etc. :P), or are obsolete designs the author doesn't care to update (Milnoplate, I think, but I'll let syv and Caellath decide it between them). But your variant could also work.
(And what did you mean by "lead to people not using the most current gen technology"? Or did you mean the tinkerers themselves pay the original authors? That would have been abhorrent. The whole point of this is Steve pays us, and that eliminates any troubles with unfair tinker play. And anyway, I think any and all 'patent right' is anyway overridden by martial law of ARM, so we can do whatever, for the sake of this victory - all the while being ruled by the most powerful and important 'patent law' that so far works only here, unfortunately, chiefly because it's a game: 'not being a dick'. :) )
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 15, 2015, 10:20:11 am
Quote
If it cost 4 tokens, then yes, you do.
Well, that kinda throws a kink in the works I'd say.
Post by: Nikitian on July 15, 2015, 10:25:15 am
I just contacted him on that. It's terrible, and it's essentially against what he wanted to accomplish.QuoteIf it cost 4 tokens, then yes, you do.
Well, that kinda throws a kink in the works I'd say.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 15, 2015, 12:30:47 pm
Purpose of this was to collect all armors under one title, instead of having them scattered within Aux systems and Misc section. To make them easier to find. Battlesuits, assaultsuits and automanip projectors do not count as armor since they have too much other uses, and AoW is more weapon than armor.
I talked with Nik about this in IRC earlier and I figured to go ahead with it without waiting.
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 16, 2015, 11:11:05 am
I just contacted him on that. It's terrible, and it's essentially against what he wanted to accomplish.QuoteIf it cost 4 tokens, then yes, you do.
Well, that kinda throws a kink in the works I'd say.
Any news on this front?
Post by: Nikitian on July 16, 2015, 12:03:28 pm
All in all, it appears the chief problem is with 1-token items, because .25 of 1 token rounded up is 1 token, which is gaming the system and disliked by Piecewise; it appears that the rule is in effect for more expensive items, but that is still slightly muddy.
Post by: Hapah on July 16, 2015, 12:09:42 pm
Got a pm, confusing as usual, currently clarifying it further.I assumed round up in relation to royalties meant that if a quarter was "X.5" or more tokens, it went up to X+1 tokens instead of staying at X. And that items where a quarter were "X.0001" or "X.4" or whatever tokens stayed at X tokens.
All in all, it appears the chief problem is with 1-token items, because .25 of 1 token rounded up is 1 token, which is gaming the system and disliked by Piecewise; it appears that the rule is in effect for more expensive items, but that is still slightly muddy.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 16, 2015, 12:37:22 pm
Post by: Nikitian on July 16, 2015, 12:57:19 pm
It could be seen that way (although I'd describe that as simply 'rounding', because mathematica uses rounding that way by default), except Piecewise originally said that "we'll even round them up for you", so I'd assume it meant anything at X.Y (where Y>0) going to X+1, be Y=.4, .0001 or whatnot.Got a pm, confusing as usual, currently clarifying it further.I assumed round up in relation to royalties meant that if a quarter was "X.5" or more tokens, it went up to X+1 tokens instead of staying at X. And that items where a quarter were "X.0001" or "X.4" or whatever tokens stayed at X tokens.
All in all, it appears the chief problem is with 1-token items, because .25 of 1 token rounded up is 1 token, which is gaming the system and disliked by Piecewise; it appears that the rule is in effect for more expensive items, but that is still slightly muddy.
Maybe it's better to not round up or down at all then? Keep the decimal in the "account" and "withdraw" a non-decimal amount whenever the player can and wants to?Could be, and would be quite 'fair' in a way, but it doesn't quite do what Piecewise apparently wanted this system to do - force Tinkerers make cheaper items by design. That's what relies on the whole "round it all the way up" thing, going straight up from the lowest kinds of fractions. Even just regular rounding (if Y>=.5 then X+1, otherwise X) wouldn't achieve the desired effect.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 16, 2015, 01:47:22 pm
Either we have a system where everyone gets paid a set percentage of the price of the item with no rounding, where we have the problem that people might try to make items more expensive so they can get more money. But it might also lead to self-balancing in regards to usefulness, since items too expensive for their usefulness will never be bought. Essentially a capitalist approach, let the markets self-regulate.
Or we have a system where everyone gets paid a certain amount rounded up regardless of the price of the item, which might lead to exploits like the maker of a 1 token item buying it hundreds of times from the armoury and then selling it back or using it to make better guns that he sells to others for greater profit. On the other hand, piecewise is unlikely to allow an exploit like that.
Or we can have a system where there is a limit, where people get normal (decimal) returns for 1 token items and rounded up for all other sales (or some other variation of this), but this has the problem of removing the motivation for making items cost less than 2 tokens (or whichever price you use as limit).
If you want to go really complicated, you could make some sort of function where profit(low price)=high and profit(medium price)=medium and profit(high price)=low or something like that, which would make it more profitable in the long run to make useful low price items instead of useful high price items. But that would probably be a bit too complicated.
Each system has problems and there will always be problems with this entire concept, like for example bribing, that can lead to token inflation. There's no perfect system. Either way, we'll just have to trust piecewise's whackamole-based brand of balancing to deter people seeking to exploit the system. It's just a question of which benefits you prefer and which system you find less bad.
Post by: Nikitian on July 16, 2015, 02:21:36 pm
The point of "round it all up" system with is that it does not reward for more expensive items within the same rounding range, thus making - by the same "invisible hand of the market"-laws, which sorta work, sorta not, - it more profitable to try and get them cheaper within the same rounding range. However, in edge cases (where it is exactly divisible by chosen range number, in our case 4), the designer might want to add a token more, to get in the next category - however, with a a dividing number this large, it might actually be more profitable to still try and go a token down, gaining a greater amount of buyers - e.g., pricing an item at 3-token, rather 5-token level, for example.
Of course, this is an imperfect system, but one that has its merits. Plus it was introduced by Piecewise, so guess it has the additional upside of being to GM's liking.
On 1 token compensation for 1 token item: Here, I believe it could very easily be solved by an exception, or just Nyars coming down with his bat upon the cheater. However, more than that, Piecewise apparently finds the idea itself that whole 1 token of 1 token revenue goes to the tinkerer - as such, he introduced an additional rule, one that I'm trying to clarify.
Finally, on bribing: it can happen, but I think that we already loan tokens without expecting any profit. As such, any profit would only be the icing on the cake and, if anything, would liven up the inter-character economy.
Post by: Parisbre56 on July 16, 2015, 02:35:24 pm
I dunno, I'm a bit tired, maybe I'm not making sense.
Post by: Kriellya on July 16, 2015, 03:11:48 pm
The main advantage of the fractional-payout is that it rewards all prices in the same way. People can make their designs more expensive, but more expensive items are harder to buy.
If we want to keep prices generally cheaper, then what we may want is a capped payout in some way. There are a few ways we could cap the system. The one that actively drives prices lower (than a certain value) would be a cap per-sale. The idea is that you get 25% of the item or, say, 5 tokens, whichever is less. So, if you make a 16 token item, you get 4 per sale. If you make an item of 20 tokens or more, you get 5 per sale, no matter the price of the item. This drives people to avoid designing items that are significantly above the 20 token price point, as it makes the item harder to buy and doesn't get them any additional reward.
So in order to answer any of this, we need to know what exactly the functions of the system are (something we may need PW's input on, since it's his system)
Obviously, it's meant to reward tinkerers who design items the game needs and that players buy. But beyond that, does the system need to drive other behavior? Does it need to encourage them to make cheaper items, and how much cheaper? Does there need to be a cap on how much a player can earn, or how expensive a player item can be? Does it need to encourage particular price points? Etc. I don't really think these are questions anyone but PW (possibly with the council's help) can answer, since he's the one that needs to consider how he wants this aspect of his game to work.
Hint: The simplest is to not round. It has the fewest side effects :P
Post by: Nikitian on July 16, 2015, 03:26:31 pm
-snip-While I see your point, there is one very big problem with that idea. And that is:Good luck finding enough people to buy your item enough times for you to get away from fractions :P
Hint: The simplest is to not round. It has the fewest side effects :P
Anyway, I think Piecewise has more or less settled on the question, but I am looking forward to the final clarified edition of this system. ;)
Post by: Caellath on July 16, 2015, 03:26:43 pm
Things that are developed by a research team instead of the player are also a difficult point. Milno has several programs/upgrades in his suit, but a fair number were simply custom-built for him by the R&D development - he explained what he wanted, and in some cases paid a few tokens, which is similar to the case of the blaster pistol -, so would it be fair if he marketed them?
Post by: Radio Controlled on July 17, 2015, 07:05:05 am
-snip-While I see your point, there is one very big problem with that idea. And that is:Good luck finding enough people to buy your item enough times for you to get away from fractions :P
Hint: The simplest is to not round. It has the fewest side effects :P
Anyway, I think Piecewise has more or less settled on the question, but I am looking forward to the final clarified edition of this system. ;)
We've sold 3 blaster pistols now. Myabe I get a token once a fourth one is bought?
Post by: Ozarck on July 18, 2015, 03:10:35 am
Anyway. the link to the Mission 8 page seems broken. I need that page for teh edits. When I click the link, it sends me to a blank page without even the Wikia stuff at the top. can someone confirm or deny this? All hte other pages I have visited seem fine.
Wish me luck. 229 pages in this mission.
Post by: Comrade P. on July 18, 2015, 03:20:50 am
Wish me luck. 229 pages in this mission.
Just think about your pay. Precious precious token(s). AND a monthly bonus for Wiki editors by Piecewise!
Post by: AoshimaMichio on July 18, 2015, 03:46:24 am
Anyway. the link to the Mission 8 page seems broken. I need that page for teh edits. When I click the link, it sends me to a blank page without even the Wikia stuff at the top. can someone confirm or deny this? All hte other pages I have visited seem fine.
I can deny this. Works perfectly well for me. You can always try search function.
Post by: Ozarck on July 18, 2015, 04:12:40 am
Post by: Nikitian on July 19, 2015, 11:59:46 pm
So, 25% of each purchased player-designed item's price is rounded (all the way) up, and given to the Tinkerer. For 1-token items, there is a special case: since you'd be getting 1 token out of 1 (100% revenue) and that was judged unfair and unjustly by Piecewise, the Tinkerers are getting the token for every second 1-token item (50% revenue, same as with 2-token items).
Post by: Comrade P. on August 03, 2015, 10:06:36 am
Post by: swordsmith04 on August 03, 2015, 10:18:30 am
Post by: Comrade P. on August 03, 2015, 10:22:03 am
Post by: Comrade P. on August 07, 2015, 01:39:54 am
Would Wiki People mind if I made a page to keep track of Infinite Heavens, that one smaller game by PW? I'm losing track of party inventory, and a waitlist should be done.
Post by: Radio Controlled on August 07, 2015, 01:41:00 am
Post by: Comrade P. on August 07, 2015, 02:13:55 am
If you keep it on one page, I'm ok with it.
It shouldn't take any more than that. I'll go put it up.
Post by: Xantalos on August 07, 2015, 03:09:49 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on August 07, 2015, 03:18:44 am
Post by: Nikitian on August 07, 2015, 03:27:24 am
Maybe. Dunno.
Post by: Ozarck on August 07, 2015, 05:05:34 am
I've long wanted to suggest creating a dedicated 'Piecewise' page about our GM, to give some insight and understanding to new players, perhaps. Of course, it'd be very fourth-wall-breaking, though, which might be rather preferable to be avoided, but still very, ah, topical and worth interest.Make sure you address the mystery as to why the shuttles all have the call sign "Thundertron."
Maybe. Dunno.
Post by: Twinwolf on August 07, 2015, 07:24:30 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on August 07, 2015, 09:48:26 am
Post by: Nunzillor on August 07, 2015, 09:50:03 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on August 07, 2015, 09:52:56 am
Ah, but where's the crazy rambling about gods part?
In your head.
Post by: Radio Controlled on August 11, 2015, 05:44:53 am
Quote
How do you decide what to purchase?
I only read the general armory entries to decide which item is best.
9
I read the pages of individual items to decide which item is best.
19
I just pick whatever seems coolest or most popular.
2
The poll was created at 17:12 on April 28, 2015, and so far 30 people voted.
What kind of writing style do you prefer for Armory entries?
Informative
13
Entertaining/funny
21
The poll was created at 17:12 on April 28, 2015, and so far 34 people voted.
Also, made a small thing (5 minutes work editing an existing image, it probably shows):
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I'm thinking of maybe doing small contests where, for example, one can earn a token for the best propaganda poster, or for adding the best photo to a wiki page (to get it looking a bit better than just walls of text everywhere), or other such things. Thoughts? Good ideas for possible contests?
Post by: Nikitian on August 11, 2015, 07:40:14 am
A few tokens for ARM anthem, sung and recorded. Fewer but still a couple if just the lyrics.
Also, a one or two-token job to skim through the archives and find all instances of people buying player-designed items. Let's say one token from Mission 1 to Defense of Hephaestus and another one from post-Defense of Hephaestus to present day.
Personally, I am not sure that adding all the photos and images is best for the wiki. At least the walls of text look dignified; we probably don't want a bizarre carpet of images everywhere distracting and, far worse, disgusting the reader. Fan-art is fine exactly because it's rare and it's directly ER-themed; I fear the flood of barely-related and far-fetched images.
Post by: Radio Controlled on August 11, 2015, 08:02:25 am
As for pay, I kinda think that if someone wants to get paid from their designs, they should search it themselves! I mean, it's in their own best interest, and for 1 person to search for all the cases it happened would be a massive amount of posts to search (there's a lot of player designs already, and a lot of pw posts in the ship thread).
Post by: AoshimaMichio on August 11, 2015, 08:12:33 am
Also, a one or two-token job to skim through the archives and find all instances of people buying player-designed items. Let's say one token from Mission 1 to Defense of Hephaestus and another one from post-Defense of Hephaestus to present day.
2 tokens to skim through ~30000 posts? That's really not enough.
Post by: Ozarck on August 11, 2015, 08:25:35 am
Post by: Nikitian on August 11, 2015, 08:37:49 am
Mostly I'd agree, but RC already set a guideline with the Mission summaries tasks and their rewards, and I think those are actually more lengthy and difficult to do than just sifting through a single thread.Also, a one or two-token job to skim through the archives and find all instances of people buying player-designed items. Let's say one token from Mission 1 to Defense of Hephaestus and another one from post-Defense of Hephaestus to present day.
2 tokens to skim through ~30000 posts? That's really not enough.
And I really think we should do this in a centralised fashion, rather than let the tinker do the search himself. It's nearly the same amount of effort (the same posts to look through, anyway), and takes away the potential for abuse. As Piecewise put it, we all trust each other (maybe some don't, I dunno), but let's keep everything above reproach, shall we?
And finally, there's not really that many player designs. I've collected them all into a single category on the wiki:
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Player-Designed_Item
21 design, so far. That's actually less than a fifth or tenth of Armory items (original list, provided by Piecewise, I mean).
A couple are probably missing, but a good estimate is that those weren't ever purchased. Not even each of these have been purchased, despite their official list inclusion!
Post by: Comrade P. on August 11, 2015, 09:49:53 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on August 11, 2015, 10:11:38 am
Post by: Nikitian on August 11, 2015, 04:24:01 pm
Ozarck recently did a batch of mission synopsis's and summaries, and we agreed he'd get 5 tokens for it, because he told me how much work it was, and on reflection 1 token didn't seem enough. I might also change the reward for other mission summary jobs. Also, I ruled that one can claim the tokens when wanted, and that they're tied to the player, not char, to prevent people doing a lot of work and then loosing their reward due to char death.Ah, then the reward should probably be increased accordingly. And wasn't that basically decided by Piecewise? Because I do remember talking to him about it, and him making that decision about player-claimed rewards, not character-claimed. Granted, the "deposit" approach of the reward collection was discussed by us here, not declared by him.
I still believe that doing this in a centralised fashion is far more efficient and proper than "each to his own" tinker-project reclaiming. I'm probably eventually going around to do it, but the amount of missions under the belt would probably prevent me from claiming any sort of reward (if it is ever offered), so I'm stalling off to let someone new earn the tokens.
Post by: Ozarck on August 11, 2015, 09:06:30 pm
Post by: Twinwolf on August 13, 2015, 12:18:58 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on August 14, 2015, 09:54:55 am
Post by: Ozarck on August 15, 2015, 02:42:02 am
1) many of the entries have no additional information on their individual pages - the information they do have is simply a copy of the main armory page info.
2) the main page is getting quite long.
I have three suggestions I'd like a little discussion on
1) maybe make the armory main page a true index, and remove all the redundant info, leaving that info on the individual pages.
2) create sub-pages for the various categories: conventional, uncon, exotic, aux, implants, medical, etc. (or larger categories such as weapons, armor, body, and systems.)
3) Whether keeping the armory as one page or breaking it into categories, instead of moving all the information to the individual pages, eliminate individual pages, as they contain no additional info.
My half formed opinion:
The first option makes the Armory into a category page, which abstracts all the information about the items. This abstraction means people wold have to click on every individual page to find out anything. Perhaps better would be to streamline descriptions on the main page and flesh out the description on the individual pages. (for example, what cartridges are available for the elemental infuser?)
The second option seems better, breaking the information into more manageable chunks. thus, a person with exotic skill is not wasting time scrolling through conventional weapons (I know, the contents link at the top does that too).
The third option makes adding object specific information more cumbersome, cluttering up the main page, while eliminating a lot of redundant pages.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on August 15, 2015, 03:09:44 am
I've noticed two things lately about the armory page.1. Mostly because there isn't much meaningful information to add. We kind of do have a policy to keep special stuff of each item on individual pages rather than clutter armory page.
1) many of the entries have no additional information on their individual pages - the information they do have is simply a copy of the main armory page info.
2) the main page is getting quite long.
2. Very true, and cluttered.
I have three suggestions I'd like a little discussion on1. Some pruning is needed, I agree with that. However I think it should contain a little more than just name of each item.
1) maybe make the armory main page a true index, and remove all the redundant info, leaving that info on the individual pages.
2) create sub-pages for the various categories: conventional, uncon, exotic, aux, implants, medical, etc. (or larger categories such as weapons, armor, body, and systems.)
3) Whether keeping the armory as one page or breaking it into categories, instead of moving all the information to the individual pages, eliminate individual pages, as they contain no additional info.
2. I don't think this is a good idea. It just leaves things even more scattered, hidden behind multiple links. You kinda defeated point of this with noting existance of TOC.
3. What?
As the poll earlier pointed out, most of people prefer reading individual item pages rather than actual armory page. Taking this in consideration I think it would be good idea to reduce amount of information on Armory page. Reduce information in armory to name, price and extremely concise information. Such as:
2 - Gauss Rifle - Shoots various types of ferrous metal slugs.
Post by: Ozarck on August 15, 2015, 03:41:54 am
there isn't much meaningful information to add. We kind of do have a policy to keep special stuff of each item on individual pages rather than clutter armory page.most people prefer to read the individual item descriptions. Frankly, I find clicking on individual item pages to be a waste of time, nine out of ten.3) Whether keeping the armory as one page or breaking it into categories, instead of moving all the information to the individual pages, eliminate individual pages, as they contain no additional info.3. What?there isn't much meaningful information to add.As the poll earlier pointed out, most of people prefer reading individual item pages rather than actual armory page.
I hardly think it would create a labyrinthine challenge for people to wade through with a map, compass, and decoder ring. It would take the various categories and give each it's own space, removing clutter from the main page and giving the subpages more elbow room to work with.2) create sub-pages for the various categories: conventional, uncon, exotic, aux, implants, medical, etc. (or larger categories such as weapons, armor, body, and systems.)2. I don't think this is a good idea. It just leaves things even more scattered, hidden behind multiple links. You kinda defeated point of this with noting existance of TOC.
Taking this in consideration I think it would be good idea to reduce amount of information on Armory page. Reduce information in armory to name, price and extremely concise information. Such as:I'm not opposed to streamlining the main page like this, but I don't see a problem with doing it the other way either.
2 - Gauss Rifle - Shoots various types of ferrous metal slugs.
Post by: Nikitian on August 15, 2015, 05:00:12 am
What needs to be done, however, is splitting the Armory page into the actual official Armory list and extended "All the assorted crap" list for obsolete & niche items. For example, all the helmet bits (which should be actual full suits, but no one cared to investigate them in full) could be moved away from 'Armor' section, making for better readability and ease of use. Same goes for now-obsolete Tinker Projects (such as, as we discussed with the creator, Mythril Penetrator-designs); same goes for Mk I and Mk II, Civic Defender's Longcoat; etc.
To be honest, the only thing that has stopped me from splitting off that second page, to this day, is the trouble of coming up with a suitable name page for this 'Backroom Armory'. (Which is, to think of it, a nice title on its own, funny enough. )
Post by: Twinwolf on August 15, 2015, 09:05:03 am
Post by: Ozarck on August 15, 2015, 10:19:07 am
Actually, I think it is fine as it currently is, since it imitates the original style of Piecewise's Armory list, and we want to preserve it."We" do? Why? Who?
Post by: Nikitian on August 15, 2015, 11:04:49 am
My assertion might have come a little too strong, but I do believe in it, and I think I am not alone in this. Especially since the Piecewise-style armory item descriptions won the vote by large, and this might be related. (*grumble grumble* Speaking of votes, why didn't they include "I don't use the Armory page(s) on the wiki" vote option as I recommended... *grumble grumble*)
Actually, this might be the key to the distinction. Keep the Armory list descriptions funny and cool (and maybe not that long - just a few sentences, no more than a single paragraph), and get technical in the individual item pages. It sort of accomplishes the idea of:
2 - Gauss Rifle - Shoots various types of ferrous metal slugs.only by preserving the enjoyable traditions of ER.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on August 15, 2015, 11:36:17 am
This is one of the best descriptions in armory, if not the best. Short, funny and very descriptive.
Edit: Now that I looked at armory once again with open eyes I see there's a lot of clean-up waiting to be done. Gah, maybe tomorrow...
Post by: Nikitian on August 15, 2015, 11:55:13 am
15 - Megaton Charge - Take a fucking guess.Yeah, but it's one-of-a-kind, and the biggest punch of it is made through the previous repeated descriptions of our nukes, each shorter than previous and more to the point, culminating in this gem. Without them, when taken alone, it isn't quite as funny, and is just plain rude without reason. It's the magic of the 'story' the Armory list weaves that breathes brilliant radiance into this single most concise description. ;)
This is one of the best descriptions in armory, if not the best. Short, funny and very descriptive.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on August 15, 2015, 12:39:33 pm
Post by: Ozarck on August 16, 2015, 01:55:26 am
Brevity is the soul of wit, as they say. Stories aren't damaged by chapter breaks. And this kind of serial descriptive reduction would still flourish in a chapter-oriented style - though not in a "make the main page all one sentence descriptions" style.15 - Megaton Charge - Take a fucking guess.Yeah, but it's one-of-a-kind, and the biggest punch of it is made through the previous repeated descriptions of our nukes, each shorter than previous and more to the point, culminating in this gem. Without them, when taken alone, it isn't quite as funny, and is just plain rude without reason. It's the magic of the 'story' the Armory list weaves that breathes brilliant radiance into this single most concise description. ;)
This is one of the best descriptions in armory, if not the best. Short, funny and very descriptive.
Post by: Nikitian on August 16, 2015, 02:46:46 am
I agree; however, while story isn't damaged by chapter breaks, it is damaged by discontinuity - if all the descriptions are shut away onto separate pages, the order and the amount of them one reads is reduced greatly, resulting in lacking impact. It's the difference between splitting the story into chapters in the same book and into short stories each in its own separate book: few would have the patience and interest to get through them all (to say nothing of doing it 'in the correct order') if they are not under the same cover; as a result, the overall story suffers.Brevity is the soul of wit, as they say. Stories aren't damaged by chapter breaks. And this kind of serial descriptive reduction would still flourish in a chapter-oriented style - though not in a "make the main page all one sentence descriptions" style.15 - Megaton Charge - Take a fucking guess.Yeah, but it's one-of-a-kind, and the biggest punch of it is made through the previous repeated descriptions of our nukes, each shorter than previous and more to the point, culminating in this gem. Without them, when taken alone, it isn't quite as funny, and is just plain rude without reason. It's the magic of the 'story' the Armory list weaves that breathes brilliant radiance into this single most concise description. ;)
This is one of the best descriptions in armory, if not the best. Short, funny and very descriptive.
Post by: NAV on August 16, 2015, 03:01:59 am
Post by: Ozarck on August 16, 2015, 03:48:25 am
You may be right. However, down to it, the list can still be made far shorter than it currently is, without much loss, isn't it? As I said, let's keep only the 'official' Armory-provisioned items there, and it'll do just fine.I agree; however, while story isn't damaged by chapter breaks, it is damaged by discontinuity - if all the descriptions are shut away onto separate pages, the order and the amount of them one reads is reduced greatly, resulting in lacking impact. It's the difference between splitting the story into chapters in the same book and into short stories each in its own separate book: few would have the patience and interest to get through them all (to say nothing of doing it 'in the correct order') if they are not under the same cover; as a result, the overall story suffers.
Brevity is the soul of wit, as they say. Stories aren't damaged by chapter breaks. And this kind of serial descriptive reduction would still flourish in a chapter-oriented style - though not in a "make the main page all one sentence descriptions" style.
[/quote]
I think the only items for which one needs to hop from one 'chapter' to a previous one to understand anything are the Exotic Brain Amps, which need information from the Uncon Math Amps to be understood. And there is no reason this should be, excluding "preserving history." And I think that is a weak reason not to change the exotic descriptions to be self contained. After all, the GM did release this information to a group of people in order for it all to be amassed, edited, improved, and coordinated. No sense in having all these mostly intelligent beings working on information if not to improve upon things. I mean, if Steve wants the Armory list to be partial, vague, and unhelpful, that's one thing ...
Post by: Radio Controlled on August 16, 2015, 03:55:43 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on August 16, 2015, 03:57:28 am
When you're trying to buy something, first you need to look at the available items, see what does what, quickly change from item to item, etc. That's much easier to do when all the important info are in the same page. Having the descriptions also be funny makes that process more fun and the items easier to remember.
Plus all those other reasons Nik used, which I don't have time to list.
Post by: Xantalos on August 16, 2015, 04:11:36 am
Or has that been suggested already.
Post by: Parisbre56 on August 16, 2015, 04:16:01 am
What if we had a main armory page with the items having short descriptions that are funny and say what they do there, and links to seperate pages that go into more detail?I thought that was more or less what Nik was suggesting, unless I misunderstood something. Put all nonstandard armory items in a sperate page and put most special info in the armory items in their own page and just leave something like "more functions/ammo available" or "see page for details" in the armory page.
Or has that been suggested already.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on August 16, 2015, 09:20:01 am
Post by: renegadelobster on August 16, 2015, 10:05:56 am
Example: 10 pounds of scrap metal, duct tape, Milno brand Pokin' PolesTM, Cartographer, old AM Tinker projects, May's .45 pistol.
Post by: Nikitian on August 16, 2015, 02:36:37 pm
Now this raises a question: What counts as non-standard?That's easy: everything except latest GM-provided Armory list and all the "approved for Armory inclusion" items. There's a reason I was 'redundant' in declaring many items already in circulation as armory-approved - exactly for this situation in the future. Just as well, of course, I am going to approve any already commonly used currently non-standard (non-obsolete) items.
Now, what counts as 'obsolete' is a much more tricky question, of course: for example, Mk I&II should be obsolete by now, whereas battlesuits are fielded alongside assaultsuits, apparently (for now, at least). And then there's blaster weaponry and laser weaponry, the former making the latter quite obsolete... in some ways.
Hephaestus will tackle this question (I am waiting for Syvarris's and/or PyroDesu's return and counsel to start working on that) in due time.
Finally, while technically true, I don't think zero-cost "Misc" items are worth consideration here - Piecewise did a fine job collectively dumping them all behind an all-encompassing zero-item-long "Misc Category", and that might work for us just as well, to save space and reduce clutter - whether it goes on 'standard' items page or 'non-standard' one. At best we can give a few examples... perhaps even, on the "Misc"-item page (i.e. that ?-token single entry in the category, that currently has no item page of its own - we could put to good use that one).
Post by: Parisbre56 on August 27, 2015, 02:10:09 pm
Post by: NAV on August 27, 2015, 02:18:12 pm
Post by: Twinwolf on August 30, 2015, 04:02:15 pm
Post by: NAV on September 03, 2015, 11:41:52 pm
Alright, I still can't get the wiki to cooperate, so I think it might be best for someone else to do the synopsis and summaries for missions 23-25. The summary I wrote for 23 should be a bit back in the OOC, if that helps.I think you mean 13, not 23.
Mission 13 already has a summary on the wiki, so I'm not sure what should be done.
@Swordsmith04 Are you sure you should be botting characters before confirmed necessary?
Post by: Twinwolf on September 04, 2015, 09:26:51 am
Post by: swordsmith04 on September 04, 2015, 09:51:29 am
@Swordsmith04 Are you sure you should be botting characters before confirmed necessary?The default result is getting stuck in a robobody. Keeping/reacquiring a fleshy body is something they have to request, and I'm assuming they'll have to pay tokens, since their previous bodies were damaged on the cellular scale.
I wasn't going through and switching everyone over to robobodies, though. That was just two-edits-in-one while I was wikiing levelups.
Post by: Nikitian on September 04, 2015, 10:42:32 am
And I don't think that cellular damage would result in absolutely necessary robotification, unless it's extreme - we have those extremely good artificial stem-cell stand-ins (not fleshknitter; 'slowly recuperate in infirmary conditions' stuff, don't remember the name). It appears, though, that it's been quite some time since people spent time in healing tanks instead of going on missions right away...
Post by: Comrade P. on September 04, 2015, 11:02:52 am
I hereby state that should my current character suffer major physical damage on M24 and other missions to come, she should be put into infirmary to restore her organic body.
signed, Comrade P.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on September 04, 2015, 12:31:50 pm
Post by: NAV on September 04, 2015, 12:37:16 pm
I meant 13-15, my mistake.Yeah. I found your summary for mission 13 back in the OOC thread, and it is good, but mission 13 already has a summary on the wiki. So I'm not sure where I should put it.
Post by: Ozarck on September 04, 2015, 09:18:39 pm
Additionally, Twinwolf, if you still want the token, go ahead and do the other two and post them here. I'll transfer them over to the wiki. Make sure you note any edits to existing material.
Post by: NAV on September 04, 2015, 09:27:17 pm
I just finished reading mission 13. Holy shit, that might have been the most perfectly executed mission in ARM- or HMRC for that matter- history. Basically nothing went wrong.
Summary written up, thoughts?Spoiler: Summary (click to show/hide)
Post by: Ozarck on September 04, 2015, 10:19:47 pm
Twinwolf, again, if you are interested, maybe review the synopsis for M13 and see if it can be edited/expanded a bit, send in your write-up here, and do the same for 14 and 15, taking care to note any edits of the current text, so I don't have to when transferring your stuff. We'll get you your token :D I'll posit to R_C that your summary qualifies, even if not used.
Post by: Parisbre56 on September 10, 2015, 12:47:50 pm
Post by: Nunzillor on September 10, 2015, 01:27:13 pm
Post by: Nikitian on September 10, 2015, 01:30:08 pm
Post by: Nunzillor on September 10, 2015, 01:32:44 pm
Edit: Potion #50 was on the Player Market and marked as being sold (I bought it) by the Team Fund from a dead character's inventory, but I see it now in Taddok's inventory. Does anyone know what the deal is with that?
Post by: AoshimaMichio on September 10, 2015, 02:52:36 pm
Guess he bought it?
Post by: NAV on September 10, 2015, 02:57:19 pm
Post by: Nunzillor on September 10, 2015, 02:59:41 pm
Edit: I couldn't find the very last emergency kit, so you guys can keep it. Enjoy!
Post by: Comrade P. on September 25, 2015, 10:32:10 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on September 25, 2015, 10:38:00 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on September 25, 2015, 04:22:56 pm
We add {{delete:reason}} or something simialar on the extra page.
Then presumably, I delete those pages sometime in the future. Should really get around to that when I get to a real computer again...
Post by: Parisbre56 on September 25, 2015, 04:30:07 pm
We add {{delete:reason}} or something simialar on the extra page.
Then presumably, I delete those pages sometime in the future. Should really get around to that when I get to a real computer again...
Just one thing: Check if deleting a page also deletes its history. If it does, then it might be better to not delete them to preserve their history record. At least for inventory and status pages.
Edit: And you can always give someone else higher privileges if you can't do it. As creator of the wiki you'll always have highest rank, but you can always give someone else higher rank (don't remember the rank names right now, writing from phone) so that they can delete pages and do other stiff like that. Someone like swordsmith or navagator or aoshima could do it.
Post by: Radio Controlled on September 25, 2015, 04:36:02 pm
We add {{delete:reason}} or something simialar on the extra page.
Then presumably, I delete those pages sometime in the future. Should really get around to that when I get to a real computer again...
Just one thing: Check if deleting a page also deletes its history. If it does, then it might be better to not delete them to preserve their history record. At least for inventory and status pages.
Yeah, one reason I've been wary of deleting is the fear that something we could still need/want later might get accidentally lost, while just letting pages marked for deletion sit there doesn't really get in anyone's way. Though it's less tidy I guess.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on September 25, 2015, 04:53:40 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on September 26, 2015, 04:05:32 pm
Hide "Points assigned" and "Enchanted capacity" columns and add a "Level up" checkbox controlling their visibility. And maybe add max and min values for "Initial level" fields to prevent changing them beyond permitted. Perhaps control those limits through the same checkbox?
And highlight more when numbers don't match. Bigger font, bold, colors...
Post by: Parisbre56 on September 26, 2015, 04:41:23 pm
Just haven't really had much motivation to do that instead of other things. But it would be a good opportunity to get some practice with php/HTML/CSS/JavaScript.
If you have any more suggestions, please share them. I'll try to make a small list with all the features I and other people want and post it here for poet review when I get back to my PC
Post by: Hapah on September 28, 2015, 07:20:58 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on September 29, 2015, 01:10:34 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on September 29, 2015, 02:40:58 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on September 29, 2015, 03:06:01 pm
I must say, those colors hurt my eyes...Really? I love them. But it's just my personal preference. I'll make the grayscale version the default one and add a button to change to the one I like.
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 01, 2015, 04:38:58 pm
I must say, those colors hurt my eyes...How about now? (http://parisbre56-phpexperiment.rhcloud.com/character_creation.html)
It's got a toggle button that selects either the white or the black style by changing the class of the body, with the default style being the white one. It saves the chosen style in a cookie so that you don't need to change it every time you visit the page. And you can easily add more styles via css (and adding them to a switch statement in the javascript part), if anyone wants to do that for whatever reason.
Post by: Nikitian on October 01, 2015, 08:23:46 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on October 02, 2015, 12:55:41 am
But Anompalous Planetoid? That one popped up into my eyes.
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 02, 2015, 07:16:21 am
Yeah, better now.Yeah, there were a lot of spelling mistakes. I passed it through a spell checker. I'll continue with splitting it up to a Character Creation page and Level Up page.
But Anompalous Planetoid? That one popped up into my eyes.
Post by: Ozarck on October 02, 2015, 07:25:38 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 02, 2015, 07:44:55 am
on my monitor, both the white and the black are a little intense. Black is a bit better though. Could just be me, too. I am a little light sensitive.I don't know, I'm going with what I like and I'm not a really artistic person. My expertise in colours extends in "black is a nice colour, green is a nice colour, so putting two nice colours together will make something nice". Plus, the black and green reminds me of my first computer monitor, a big bulky thing that could only show black and green, which is also what Steve's green voice reminds me of.
If you have a better idea, then I can either give you access to the CSS file so that you can create whatever style you like, or, if you're using firefox, you can right click on the page, press inspect element, select the <body> tag and then mess with the CSS properties on the right until you get what you want and then post those here so I can add them as a style.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on October 02, 2015, 08:15:09 am
Here (http://sirlancelot.pp.fi/ER/ERStyles.css).
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 02, 2015, 06:39:31 pm
One color scheme I like is Darkling theme of the forum. I have css for it somewhere...Done.
Here (http://sirlancelot.pp.fi/ER/ERStyles.css).
Post by: AoshimaMichio on October 03, 2015, 12:54:37 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 04, 2015, 02:33:15 pm
Also, while doing that, I noticed that the PC template still says "Reason assigned to HMRC". I could add some sort of flag that toggles from HMRC to ARM and defaults to HMRC. Or I could change it to something more universal, like "Reason for being in the ARM" or "Reason for being on the Sword". Or drop it altogether and say it should be part of the Personal Information section. Any ideas?
Post by: Comrade P. on October 04, 2015, 02:41:56 pm
Also, while doing that, I noticed that the PC template still says "Reason assigned to HMRC". I could add some sort of flag that toggles from HMRC to ARM and defaults to HMRC. Or I could change it to something more universal, like "Reason for being in the ARM" or "Reason for being on the Sword". Or drop it altogether and say it should be part of the Personal Information section. Any ideas?
Personally, since we're ARM now, I think that line in character profile is obsolete - revolutionaries are historically very diverse in their backgrounds, even if majority of them happen to have common background. If with HMRC you could just name crime committed by or attributed to the character, it is not that easy to put a reason for a revolutionary into one line. So I support you in your initiative to merge it with bio.
Also, I'd make these big red ERROR reports smaller. I think red does good enough job of highlighting those.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on October 04, 2015, 03:00:35 pm
Skill level doesn't seem to change with points assigned. I assume you know this already.
And text boxes vary wildly in length.
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 04, 2015, 03:44:52 pm
And text boxes vary wildly in length.What do you mean?
Do you think it would look better if they were in something like a table, so they all had equal width?
Or is doing something simple like putting a linebreak after HMRC or putting the label above large textboxes all that's required?
Not going to work on that right now either way, just trying to understand.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on October 04, 2015, 11:45:09 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 05, 2015, 08:49:46 pm
Post by: Ozarck on October 06, 2015, 05:22:27 pm
I'm done with the new character page (http://parisbre56-phpexperiment.rhcloud.com/new_character.html). I tested it a bit and it looks fine. If anybody finds any problems, yell at me.I see no real problems on a cursory examination. How would you feel about switching the toggle between HMRC and ARM from a drop down to a radio button toggle?
Asiggned to HMRC O
Joined Arm O
Because [text box]
You're doing good work. Cheers!
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 06, 2015, 06:06:22 pm
And thank you. If it works well, I'll see about changing the links in the wiki and asking piecewise to change the one in the... I don't even remember where it is, but I think there's a link in the OOC thread? The on ship thread? Somewhere stickied, anyway.
In other news, I created a simple php script to get stat and skill data from character pages, but no matter what I did, it would not work. I spent half a day trying to fix that before I realised that wikia had banned the server's IP for some reason. Gah, so annoying, sometimes the simplest things do not cross my mind.
I temporarily solved the problem by using a public proxy, but those things are not very stable or quick, so I'll need a better solution. Anybody knows of any good proxies? Otherwise, I'll see if I can set up a proxy in my home and pass the wiki pages through it to the server. Or maybe contacting wikia and getting them to unban the server.
Post by: DoctorMcTaalik on October 06, 2015, 06:22:12 pm
Post by: Moopli on October 08, 2015, 01:28:01 pm
http://api.wikia.com/wiki/Quick_Start
If so, use the API and you should be golden.
If you are using the API though, then my advice is void. Good luck!
Looking through the docs, I don't see anything that lets you edit wiki pages, there's no authentication systems or API keys. So if you want to edit pages you're SOL, sadly.
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/api.php
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/api/v1/
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 08, 2015, 01:51:21 pm
I need to check what's going on with the cloud's IPs and see if wikia has a list of banned IPs somewhere. Because I was denied access the moment I tried to run the script, while at home and on the cloud using a proxy it worked fine every time. So it can't be something I did, unless I did something very wrong.
And I haven't bothered with the API yet because I'm not looking for large amounts of data or metadata, I just need to dump an HTML table from the character page to the user's JavaScript (I need the PHP script to bypass CORS protection). I'm just focusing on making a working prototype and learning how the API works for something so simple seemed like a waste of time. Maybe in the future, if I want to add some sort of drop down menu that gets its input from the character category, I'll learn how to use the API to get that data.
Post by: Moopli on October 08, 2015, 02:46:15 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 08, 2015, 03:56:12 pm
So to bypass that, I create a PHP script that runs on the rhcloud server and outputs the HTML of the requested character page. And because that PHP script is in the same domain, the rhcloud domain, its output can be accessed by the JavaScript in the client's browser.
It's very rudimentary right now, it just uses cURL to imitate a Firefox browser and copies the contents of the entire page without processing them. And because it passes the data through a public proxy to bypass the IP ban, it's really slow.
Post by: Moopli on October 08, 2015, 04:18:54 pm
Post by: Nunzillor on October 10, 2015, 01:35:43 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on October 10, 2015, 03:57:00 am
Post by: Nunzillor on October 10, 2015, 05:11:26 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on October 28, 2015, 06:34:04 am
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Artifact_Data
This page, but more updated, could serve that purpose.
Relevant data on that page is kind of lost in sea of other information. And purpose of that Artifact Data is more to provide list of things not researched yet, or so I believe was the original idea. I was thinking something along Weapons Statistics (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Weapon_Statistics) page. It would result duplicate data, but... Hmm, I don't know...
It would be nice to able to link directly to the used material. For example all blueradite references in blaster weapons pages so people would quickly find out what kind of stuff blueradite is.
Post by: syvarris on November 01, 2015, 04:41:42 pm
I'm wondering if I should remove my mention entirely, or just the question mark. The former seems better, because Cael should probably be paid the royalties, and having two designers listed would be confusing.
Thoughts?
Post by: renegadelobster on November 01, 2015, 04:49:05 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on November 01, 2015, 05:12:29 pm
Post by: syvarris on November 01, 2015, 05:14:51 pm
Unrelated: Can I remove the civic defender's longcoat from the armory? It's completely inferior to the sharksuit, and people have been buying it in preference. I'd have already done it, except I designed the sharksuit, and therefore might be unknowingly biased.
Post by: Radio Controlled on November 01, 2015, 05:25:13 pm
As for the second, perhaps just add a tag saying it's outdated and replaced by sharksuit? People might still want it for rp reasons ("I think it looks cooler." Or "I don't trust sharkmist nanobots.")
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 01, 2015, 11:53:06 pm
Post by: NAV on November 02, 2015, 02:01:52 pm
Post by: Nikitian on November 02, 2015, 03:27:41 pm
I think the (HMRC) and (ARM) designations serve that purpose fine. My main concern is token payments--Removing the question mark makes it ambiguous who gets paid when it's bought.
Unrelated: Can I remove the civic defender's longcoat from the armory? It's completely inferior to the sharksuit, and people have been buying it in preference. I'd have already done it, except I designed the sharksuit, and therefore might be unknowingly biased.
My intention was to split off a second "Armory" page (Back of the Armory? Custom and Rare Stuff? Something like that) and to move there any and all entries that have not been explicitly approved for Armory inclusion (or didn't come as part of Piecewise-approved item list). That would deal with Civic Defender's longcoat, as well as a large number of other obscure things.
(Then the cull of 'old approved items' would slowly follow, figuring out straight replacements and removing the officially now-obsolete items (Mk I, Mk II, etc.). )
I simply didn't have enough time to do such a large change on my own, so I put the idea on hold for now.
I'd say you put in enough effort to deserve credit, both for the armory mention and getting tokens from a sale. You'd have to make an agreement with cael of course, but far as I see you actually did a lo of the work with working out prices and such.
I agree. Perhaps we could have Piecewise allow full dividends to all people who participated in (consecutive) creation of an item in a major enough way? (Judged by some neutral third party. Maybe even have the Council do it, or some other committee. )
I don't think the rules for being payed for player designed items are on the wiki yet. Can someone please tell me what they are or link me to them? I'm planning on putting them on the Tinker page, but if there's a better place let me know.Uh, it's 25% of the item's price, rounded up (except for 1-token items, for them it's 1 token per 2 items sold, to avoid abuse).
(Another thing I've planned to add to the wiki, but never followed through (except for the category of player-made designs for easy reference). Sorry.)
Post by: syvarris on November 02, 2015, 11:35:54 pm
Is it understandable? I tried to make the wording unambiguous.
@Nik
I didn't know we'd changed to 1-for-2. I don't really see how it prevents abuse, considering you can still sell two one token items back for two tokens. Also, 1-for-2 makes keeping track of when someone gets paid harder. What if one person buys a 1 token item, and then someone else buys it too a couple of months later? Who'll remember?
I still think we should just give fractional tokens, which are unusable and untradable until they become full tokens--like how partial bars from melting work in DF.
Post by: Nikitian on November 02, 2015, 11:52:36 pm
I didn't know we'd changed to 1-for-2. I don't really see how it prevents abuse, considering you can still sell two one token items back for two tokens. Also, 1-for-2 makes keeping track of when someone gets paid harder. What if one person buys a 1 token item, and then someone else buys it too a couple of months later? Who'll remember?Well, that is rules abuse by intention, and it gets prevented by Nyars bat. Before that, I was talking about 'honest' abuse and skewered results - or rather, that Piecewise couldn't accept that, so this was the best deal that could have been brokered (it puts the output of 1-token items to the same rate as 2-token ones - 50% return on item price).
I still think we should just give fractional tokens, which are unusable and untradable until they become full tokens--like how partial bars from melting work in DF.
And the rules are generous as the are and non-fractional because it's not really expected that more than one item would ever be sold; judging by diversity of ARM arsenal, things vary a lot. Of course, some items might be more popular, but the bottom line are the unpopular ones, and treating them fairly. (While, of course, incentivising - not requiring - to create 'popular' items which are sold well.)
As a system, it's a more or less fair one towards what it tries to accomplish, and that's what matters, I guess. Any system would've been mixed blessing here.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 04, 2015, 01:45:00 am
Potion 1: (NAV) Used, but effect not recorded
Potion 6 (RenegadeLobster): Status unknown
Potion 12 (Xantalos): Status unknown
I can't be arsed to comb through threads to find out what happened to those (because I'm supposed to be working). And what potion was that one Beirus used and caused his permanent flaming ironman transformation?
Post by: renegadelobster on November 04, 2015, 01:46:03 am
Post by: Xantalos on November 04, 2015, 03:04:57 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 04, 2015, 04:40:58 am
My potion got swallowed up in my blobbiness when I went full DAN. I'm not sure if I have it still.
That was when Doctor ate you? He also ate your tokens if I recall correctly, so the potion might be in Doctor's posession.
Post by: Xantalos on November 04, 2015, 05:20:24 am
But yeah he probably has the potion.
Post by: NAV on November 04, 2015, 09:00:43 am
Post by: tryrar on November 25, 2015, 04:18:58 pm
Post by: NAV on November 25, 2015, 04:34:36 pm
Wander into the briefing room(after I make a trip to the armory to get my exo replacement, and refills on ammo and a couple extra clips with the cash from M22 I'll be receiving any moment now :P) since we're gearing up for the Hep mission.That may or may not be worth it depending on what the Heph guys decide to give you. Also I have no idea how much you're getting paid so hard to say"wiki" when there's no real data.
Sibilus mags are 4 tokens each. How about we assume you bought 1 mag, and only used half your ammo on the digging? Does that sound alright?
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 28, 2015, 05:32:41 pm
Post by: tryrar on November 28, 2015, 05:49:10 pm
It seems this is the reason:Wander into the briefing room(after I make a trip to the armory to get my exo replacement, and refills on ammo and a couple extra clips with the cash from M22 I'll be receiving any moment now :P) since we're gearing up for the Hep mission.That may or may not be worth it depending on what the Heph guys decide to give you. Also I have no idea how much you're getting paid so hard to say"wiki" when there's no real data.
Sibilus mags are 4 tokens each. How about we assume you bought 1 mag, and only used half your ammo on the digging? Does that sound alright?
Sounds about right
Post by: Radio Controlled on November 28, 2015, 07:12:47 pm
Post by: Ozarck on November 28, 2015, 07:46:40 pm
Hey RC, confirm Ozarck's pay for writing mission synopsis and summary for M6 and M9B.that's 6 through 9b.
as in 6, 7, 8, 9a and 9b.
...
I say this only because of the pay scale. Those five missions were a lot of pages, compared to the other newb job mission sets, and got paid accordingly. So if someone asks why five for this set and not five for that one, and "Ozarck got 5 for two missions" ... well, here's the answer :P
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 29, 2015, 05:30:42 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on November 29, 2015, 05:34:19 am
Reminds me I should really update the jobs one of these days. Quite a few missions need write-ups, for starters. And the main page could maybe use some more lay-out, kinda blobby now.
And need to make a new poll. Hmm...
Post by: Ozarck on November 29, 2015, 09:43:10 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on November 29, 2015, 05:16:11 pm
Post by: Ozarck on November 29, 2015, 08:19:44 pm
This week, If you like, I'll (try to) look at the wiki and see which missions have which needs, in my limited understanding, and offer a payment plan.
I wound up with about one token per 250 pages? I think?
Which would mean that one mission set with about 250 pages spread over 4-5 missions (50 pages per mission) and needing 3-5 synopses and 3-5 summaries would pay about one token. I'd weight missions needing synopses more heavily than those needing only summaries. Simple edits could pay one token per ten synopses clarified and formatted, with the assumption that the editor is already familiar with the mission and need not read the whole thing in order to do the work.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 30, 2015, 12:32:32 am
Post by: Aigre Excalibur on November 30, 2015, 12:41:25 am
Post by: Ozarck on November 30, 2015, 08:50:44 am
Define page. 10 posts? 25? 50?I was on 15 ppp. Forum default. hmm Either way, take the sum of pages found in missions 6 through 9b and divide by five.
Spoiler: maths (click to show/hide)
Also, Aoshima, feel free to verify with PW / the rest of the team, but Dester is probably the lead for M26, since he acted in that role throughout almost the entirety of M23, with the blessing of PW and support of the crew. And add Saint to the M26 roster, though we haven't met him IC yet. He's been accepted ooc.
Aigre, how it works is this: there are several sets of missions that have incomplete pages on the wiki. What we have done in the past is claim one of the sets of missions via discussion with Radio_Controlled, who oversees this activity. He confirms, and then you get to work. You read the mission, and edit the relevant wiki articles, adding or modifying the summaries (the short, one or two paragraph descriptions) found on the main "Mission Synopsis" page, and then edit or add the synopsis, found on the page for that individual mission.
Suggested things to include in the synopsis: mission goal, arrival, introduce any major npcs, a walkthrough of the major actions taken
Spoiler: trivia (click to show/hide)
Post by: Radio Controlled on November 30, 2015, 09:00:25 am
And yeah, Ozarck's got the right idea about what goes into a mission's write-up. You can always look at past missions to get an idea for what goes in and style and such.
EDIT: Made a list: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Team_Fund
Also, made it official that anyone can do these jobs. If newbies want something specifically, I'll have to think of something else.
Post by: Aigre Excalibur on November 30, 2015, 09:43:59 am
Post by: Ozarck on November 30, 2015, 10:06:48 am
I am interested in, but not calling dibs on, m10 and m11.
Post by: Nikitian on November 30, 2015, 10:29:13 am
Also, for some reason M21 was removed from "Current Mission Information" and considered 'closed'. While I can understand the sentiment (the thread is closed, the mission is officially over), our little Limbo adventure still needs a page and a cheatsheet (so far, I've been using M21's one, but it is missing Xael), and I think appending this "continuation of the story" to M21 and bringing it back to active missions list would be much easier than inventing a new mission number and copying almost everything over from M21 page&cheatsheet.
We're still alive there yet (even if ARM doesn't know it IC yet)! Our final fates deserve being scribed down and remembered! :P
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 30, 2015, 01:33:22 pm
Define page. 10 posts? 25? 50?I was on 15 ppp. Forum default. hmm Either way, take the sum of pages found in missions 6 through 9b and divide by five.Spoiler: maths (click to show/hide)
Also, Aoshima, feel free to verify with PW / the rest of the team, but Dester is probably the lead for M26, since he acted in that role throughout almost the entirety of M23, with the blessing of PW and support of the crew. And add Saint to the M26 roster, though we haven't met him IC yet. He's been accepted ooc.
Funny thing about that. When I start editing the page in classic mode and write [[Saint, the wiki offers me Milno instead. Well, he is a saint, but anyway. Actually, even the wiki search bar does the same thing.
Post by: Parisbre56 on November 30, 2015, 01:37:09 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on November 30, 2015, 01:48:32 pm
Post by: Ozarck on November 30, 2015, 05:07:17 pm
This link will also get you there (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Steve_Saint)
Nikitian, M21 is done. You are all talking about a double level up at teh end of your journeys Through the Angles. You are now on M21L (for limbo) or something like that. I don't recall that the first team into M2 got a double level up for being rescued by the second team sent in after them. And since you guys have opted to run your Adventures in Oddspace concurrent with M25, I'd saya second wiki page would be appropriate.
Post by: Nikitian on November 30, 2015, 06:11:16 pm
M21L is a fine mission designation if you ask me. Just let's see what our mighty ARM leadership has to say on using non-standard mission indices. ;)
Post by: Parisbre56 on November 30, 2015, 07:02:12 pm
Post by: Maegil on December 03, 2015, 01:20:28 pm
I've been advised to repost this here, for Radio_Controlled:Thank you for the work. Make sure to post about it in the archives thread and I'll give you some tokens for it.
I've done the summary for mission 10 and posted it on the wiki (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_10) (a native speaker review to hunt for grammar problems would be in order). It took me almost every free hour of four days to get it done - even the advanced search filter is nigh useless, so I had to read from from post #669 to #2024, 1356 posts in total across 90 standard forum pages from waking up from stasis to extraction, and there's still 108 pages worth of Mission 11 to be done to earn ONE token.
Nope, it's too much, it becomes obvious why you don't get many volunteers like that, and chances are that the undone summaries pile is only going to get bigger...
May I suggest that you pay instead when mission summaries are completed, at a rate of 1 token for each 1000 posts (and fractions, to make the longer missions and multiple tasks* more appetizing)? Also, while someone might not be willing to create 10 new armory pages for one token, they might do 3 or 4 for 0.1 each to complete a full token along with a summary's remainder. That should make the effort more worthwhile and increase the amount of volunteers to flesh up the wiki.
*e.g. this 1356 posts summary would be worth 1.356 tokens, paying out 1 token and accumulating the 0.356 remainder with the next summary.
BTW, I'm also getting started on mission 11.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 03, 2015, 02:11:51 pm
Also, I'm not sure why it took that long. Sure, it's a lot of posts, but since you can normally ignore most that aren't pw's, I thought it was manageable (99% is rp chatter or ooc stuff). 30 pages (at 50ppp) is what I used as a vague target. Next to that, quite a few pages already have some content on them, so that can save some work as well. Finally, I recently proposed the '1token/30pages' thing in here, and nobody really seemed to object to it then. I might revise the pay rate sometime in the future, but I'll keep it like it is for now (after all, these are just about the only tokens one can earn without any danger to his character and can be claimed whenever you want).
Post by: Maegil on December 03, 2015, 03:22:29 pm
Yet, I still stand by my suggestion to increase the payments and allow fractions to increase the tasks' appeal to possible volunteers.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 03, 2015, 03:42:58 pm
Also, for M10, you missed the whole part about what Faith did inside the palace (her pm's were posted in a thread later on: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=108083.msg4567195#msg4567195). Also, nobody apart from Faith ever saw the
Post by: Maegil on December 03, 2015, 03:53:57 pm
Maybe for the first, but no to the second, I ain't got no time for fractions.
Also, for M10, you missed the whole part about what Faith did inside the palace (her pm's were posted in a thread later on: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=108083.msg4567195#msg4567195). Also, nobody apart from Faith ever saw theRadiatorRadiant one, the one who fell from the building was a High Guard.
Ok, I'm on it.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 03, 2015, 04:01:06 pm
Thoughts?
By the way Maegil, don't forget to also take a look at the synopsis for M10 and 11 in the mission synopsis overview page.
Post by: syvarris on December 03, 2015, 08:07:41 pm
I think a the best tone would be IC, as it precludes stuff like "How to abuse PW's limited attention and memory for fun and profit", and lets characters actually pull out the ARM trooper field guide to say "But it said to do this in the guide!". Then again, an OOC guide would be good just for etiquette; For instance, a lot of people miss the fact that PW prefers actions to be consolidated, and dislikes highly complex conditionals.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 04, 2015, 12:29:20 pm
I noticed the status of m22 was changed from "minor failure/minor victory" to just minor victory. Remembering the earlier discussion about the mission's (lack of?) succes though, we could use a poll to see what the majority thinks. Or should we just leave it?
Post by: Parisbre56 on December 04, 2015, 12:41:56 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 04, 2015, 01:36:04 pm
Post by: NAV on December 04, 2015, 10:45:39 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: syvarris on December 05, 2015, 08:51:00 pm
You could improve your loadout by selling the damn thing and buying something else with the money you get. Seriously!
...Oh, yeah, I came here to ask why we have a wiki page titled "World History", which details the timeline of human civilization. It's a useful page, but the name seems somewhat misleading, considering that the page starts by saying when humans left their world.
Post by: Egan_BW on December 05, 2015, 09:25:14 pm
Post by: NAV on December 05, 2015, 09:36:06 pm
I'm not entirely sure your assessment is correct. As Egan said, VR testing doesn't always line up with field effectiveness, which the Sibilus has been quite effective at so far. And blaster weapons are so overpowered its hardly worth comparing anything else to them. Also the overcharge is definitely an advantage, remember that broken equipment gets repaired after missions so getting more power with a chance to break your weapon is still worth it.
I don't see what your problem is with the "world history" pages title. It means world as in "the material universe or all that exists; everything", not as in "the earth, together with all of its countries, peoples, and natural features".
Screw it, I edited Yancy's page. I'll undo the edit on the very small chance that it was wrong.
Post by: syvarris on December 05, 2015, 09:43:29 pm
Or, hell, let's say that ammo won't ever be tracked, and somebody makes special rounds for the Sibilus. Do you want three free tokens?
@NAV
Technically it isn't wrong, but it seems very strange to use 'world' as a synonym for 'universe', especially as it's also a synonym for 'planet', and more commonly used that way--especially in sci-fi settings, where there are multiple worlds.
Post by: Ozarck on December 05, 2015, 10:46:46 pm
In most sci-fi that I read, there are multiple planets, maybe even many "worlds." But to discuss the metanarrative of the whole series, game system, or what have you, "world history" is a fairly typical useage. Especially because the word "history" brings the term into the human (or sapient being) sphere, and leans the term "world" more toward the sociopolitical definition.
Post by: syvarris on December 05, 2015, 11:03:57 pm
I still think that something non-ambiguous would be a better title, like "setting history".
Post by: Parisbre56 on December 05, 2015, 11:09:21 pm
Post by: syvarris on December 05, 2015, 11:29:11 pm
Post by: NAV on December 06, 2015, 12:21:36 am
I do agree with you that the sibilus is less powerful and should be moved out of the main armoury. That doesn't mean no one should ever use it.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 06, 2015, 07:33:33 am
Quote
Where do you prefer pictures of equipment one can buy to be?
Next to their armory entry on the armory index page itself.
0
On their own page, not in the general armory index.
14
On both the general armory index and their own page.
13
The poll was created at 14:59 on August 14, 2015, and so far 27 people voted.
So, by a narrow margin, it seems vox populi wants pictures to be on an item's own page, not the general index. I'm surprised we have so many voters (might there be multiple votes from the same people? It's certainly easy enough to do that, by accident even), but more engagement can only be a good thing, right? So, if anyone wanted to remove the pics in the armory page and stick 'em on the respective item pages, feel free.
And a new poll!
Quote
How do you think mission 22 (the one with the Arbiter) should be described on page?
Minor failure.
0
Minor success.
0
Minor failure/minor success (neutral).
0
I don't know, we should ask PW/Steve what he thinks, and use that.
0
The poll was created at 12:33 on December 6, 2015, and so far 0 people voted.
Added new jobs: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Team_Fund
Tell me what you guys think, if the pay scheme is good, and if you have more ideas.
Post by: Nikitian on December 06, 2015, 08:21:54 am
Edit: Oh dear, this is no longer true! Huzzah!
Also, as the tradition goes, RC's wiki polls are too restrictive in options to the point where I cannot pick the preferred option. I mean, what if I think it was a major success (a whole Arbiter was slain!)? What if I were Devastator-like in views and considered the mission a failure (a whole colony was destroyed!)? :)
It's forlorn hope to ask, but - could you please add the "major X" options on the poll? In order not to alienate those with stronger opinions on the matter.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 06, 2015, 08:32:56 am
Post by: Devastator on December 06, 2015, 08:34:36 am
Only Devestator thought that was a failure, if I remember correctly. And seeing the page's history, he was the one that marked it as a success while I was editing the page. So I don't see much point in voting for it. But if you think it's worth it, sure, do a poll. Or just ask piecewise, since it's his opinion that matters in the end. Or just remove it altogether. It's not like every mission has to be marked as success or failure.
I changed that because that was the consensus, not because it's what I think. Also, as a case of point, it was a friendly colony that was destroyed, you didn't finish exploring its ruins, and nobody saw the avatar die.
Same for the Haebi orbital mission, but that one I let stand because it freed a galaxy-wide threat, and that seems to be one possible criteria for failure. If it's simply consensus, that one's a success too.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 06, 2015, 08:37:37 am
Post by: Devastator on December 06, 2015, 09:00:05 am
Well, you can vote now, and we can do another vote for the Heabi space mission i the future if needed. (Though the Heabi ground missions were a complete success I'd say, so there's that.)
Yeah, the ground mission was fine.
Post by: Ozarck on December 06, 2015, 09:24:33 am
Same with all the guides really. they are not newb jobs for sure. And as for the comprehensiveness, you should at least pay 2 tokens for those, in particluar the anomaly exploration and artifact testing and tinkering guides.
Except, most tinkering is done by a fixed, known set of people. Perhaps an apprenticeship program would work better in that situation.
A brief guide on medicine could possibly be done for one token's worth of work. It seems straightforward enough, now that kickboxing hasd become a less frequent method of healing.
Same with the ooc guide to making good posts for PW. that seems straightforward enough for one token. "All actions in one post. be clear and concise. Check for spelling errors and please consider not posting on phones which don't have punctuation marks. Conditional actions are okay, but try not to have R_C's trademark Walls of Text ..."
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 06, 2015, 09:28:27 am
Also, my walls are by far not the worst ones! :P
I actually do try to shorten them or limit myself when I can, but sometimes there's just no way to effectively communicate a message without some explanation. Maybe it's because I often have to organize things that my wallness factor is rather high? Then again, I fully expect pw to punish me whenever he gets sick of it, and I can roll with the punches most of the time, so it's all good.
Post by: Moopli on December 06, 2015, 02:22:27 pm
I think I could do a good job of drastically cutting down on all the prose, but since that's a rather radical proposition I figured I'd provide some advance warning.
Need some input:
- Giving tips on stat/skill distribution, yay or nay (I lean very strongly to a yay on this one but I could be convinced otherwise)
- Roleplaying a character with a Cha penalty like they're an eloquent, convincing leader, yay or nay? Ie, do we approve? Jim, frex, was a very charismatic and lovable dude who ran around with a Cha penalty, and Miya oughta have had a level or two in Cha from the get-go given how he actually managed to herd cats somewhat; so it's always seemed to me like it's a window-dressing stat and nothing more.
Post by: Ozarck on December 06, 2015, 02:28:43 pm
Check again, jobs are open for all now, not just newbs.I knew that the jobs were open to all. I think the jobs that would best be handled by senior players should be marked as such. or perhaps should have poll threads to determine what advice would be best put in a brief tutorial. That kind of thing.
Also, my walls are by far not the worst ones! :P
I actually do try to shorten them or limit myself when I can, but sometimes there's just no way to effectively communicate a message without some explanation. Maybe it's because I often have to organize things that my wallness factor is rather high? Then again, I fully expect pw to punish me whenever he gets sick of it, and I can roll with the punches most of the time, so it's all good.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 06, 2015, 03:51:25 pm
Check again, jobs are open for all now, not just newbs.I knew that the jobs were open to all. I think the jobs that would best be handled by senior players should be marked as such. or perhaps should have poll threads to determine what advice would be best put in a brief tutorial. That kind of thing.
Also, my walls are by far not the worst ones! :P
I actually do try to shorten them or limit myself when I can, but sometimes there's just no way to effectively communicate a message without some explanation. Maybe it's because I often have to organize things that my wallness factor is rather high? Then again, I fully expect pw to punish me whenever he gets sick of it, and I can roll with the punches most of the time, so it's all good.
Eh, I dunno, a long time lurker might still be able to write good guides despite not actually having played the game. My idea was to have the community here have some input as to whether or not a guide would be deemed 'good enough' to warrant payment (though I'd keep the executive decision on that of course, in case it's not unanimous). The person writing the thing could then go around asking people for what content should or shouldn't be there.
So I'm eyeing the newb guide, seeing as I am a newb that has mostly managed to absorb the important advice but still remembers what the newb guide didn't help with.
I think I could do a good job of drastically cutting down on all the prose, but since that's a rather radical proposition I figured I'd provide some advance warning.
Need some input:
- Giving tips on stat/skill distribution, yay or nay (I lean very strongly to a yay on this one but I could be convinced otherwise)
- Roleplaying a character with a Cha penalty like they're an eloquent, convincing leader, yay or nay? Ie, do we approve? Jim, frex, was a very charismatic and lovable dude who ran around with a Cha penalty, and Miya oughta have had a level or two in Cha from the get-go given how he actually managed to herd cats somewhat; so it's always seemed to me like it's a window-dressing stat and nothing more.
For the first, maybe we could stick that on the 'stats and skills' page, and mention that this info is there on the newbie page? For the second, yeaaah, it's kind of a longstanding problem, where we don't force people to roleplay according to their charisma scores. I'd say something like that is up to the gm though, and when pw wants he could still start rolling for char more in npc interactions.
Maybe we should stick the story summary on a separate page, and drop a link in the newbie section? Or hide it behind a spoiler so it doesn't take up half the page?
Post by: Nikitian on December 06, 2015, 04:15:38 pm
And, frankly, I'd say Jim is a counter-argument here. Yes, he had high Charisma, but I remember him mostly a bit lonely and interacting with people only when forced to (with a few notable exceptions); maybe even grumpy and gloomy a bit (because of his constant forays into the realms of existential doubt and also because of having to stand up to power, to lead and to rule - out of necessity, not interest). But he had large Charisma because it was necessary for some of the best amps, not because he was the most social and eloquent person out there. Maybe his emoticons were extra cute? :D
(The above in no way diminishes that he was cool and, as one of the Bastards, remained a living legend for most of us. Also, it's just my personal memory of the character.)
Which reminds me - Charisma, in a way, is also a stat used to subconsciously understand biology of a person (or an organical being) - based on how organo-amps require it to operate, while the correspoding organo-manips (yes, they exist, I've asked PW sometime ago) require Med instead (or rather, required before the manipulators 2.0 were introduced - not sure about now).
Post by: Parisbre56 on December 06, 2015, 05:23:33 pm
Delete a few pages and cut them apart if it looks like it's needed. Or just remove the bulk of the non-essential data from them and put it in secondary pages.
The armory is probably the one that needs that kind of thong the most. Cut it into categories and then have a section with the most commonly used items in those pages. Then transclude those "most commonly used" items into the main armory page.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on December 16, 2015, 09:00:06 am
Post by: NAV on December 16, 2015, 06:50:32 pm
Post by: syvarris on December 29, 2015, 03:23:04 pm
I really don't want to redo it to account for proper level distribution and death type, but also don't think it's terribly accurate or helpful without that being done. :\
Post by: AoshimaMichio on December 29, 2015, 03:40:37 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 29, 2015, 03:41:27 pm
Either way, I do think it's interesting info. If we keep it maintained, then after the next few missions we'll be more easily able to objectively assess if vet (and overall) deaths have indeed increased. And it's not like more statistics are a bad thing. That said, if you don't wanna bother with it, don't feel obliged to, it was just an idea. Do as you feel is best.
Post by: Ozarck on December 29, 2015, 04:10:46 pm
Post by: syvarris on December 29, 2015, 06:26:34 pm
The page could really be made a lot better, but I'm gonna try and figure out how to make those black-and-green tables before fixing it; Those would work really well for it.
Post by: Parisbre56 on December 29, 2015, 08:44:42 pm
No. Bad Paris. I'm already busy, I don't need to give myself more work. I'm already late for my inactive character purge on the wik anyway, if I'm going to do anything I should do that.
Don't mind me, just convincing myself out of doing some work.
Post by: Radio Controlled on December 30, 2015, 02:41:39 am
Paris, don't sweat it, arguing oneself out of work is a time honored tradition. Hell, I'm doing it right now (nooo, I don't need to get to studying just yet, there's ER posts to make).
Post by: AoshimaMichio on January 12, 2016, 03:28:07 pm
((There's a note on the wiki saying that probes which travel for awhile in null universes are lost. Where did that information come from? I haven't found any PW post saying that.))
Ozarck should know since he's the one who made that edit.
Post by: swordsmith04 on January 16, 2016, 12:30:39 pm
So, with the above in mind, here's the data for wiki contributions between July 1st and January 15th:
NAV made 761 edits to the wiki; they received 6 tokens for 214 edits last time.
AoshimaMichio made 467 edits to the wiki; he received 7 tokens for 320 edits last time.
Parisbre56 made 263 edits to the wiki; he received 8 tokens for 462/~200 plus templates edits last time.
Radio Controlled made 166 edits to the wiki; he received 1 token for 23 edits last time.
Nikitian made 137 edits to the wiki; he received no tokens for 5 edits last time.
Comrade P made 134 edits (74 of which for The Infinite Heavens) to the wiki; he received 1 token for 39 edits last time.
Swordsmith04 made 108 edits to the wiki; I received 6 tokens for 202 edits last time.
Kriellya made 53 edits to the wiki. Syvarris made 31 edits to the wiki. Nunzillor made 24 edits to the wiki. Caellath made 23 edits to the wiki. Dutrius made 15 edits to the wiki. Spazyak made 11 edits to the wiki. Ozarck made 11 edits to the wiki.
The following users made less than 10 edits to the wiki:
SeanMirrsen, Unholy_Pariah, Maegil, Illgeo, Moopli, Egan_BW, Aigre, and FunVake.
Also of note is an IP address which has made 12 edits since October 9th. Most of these edits were to Tek or Lordpunch's pages, so I'm assuming that's you, Nunzillor. If so, that boosts you to 36 edits.
[Previous Payment Record] (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=149970.msg6348123#msg6348123)
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 16, 2016, 12:37:48 pm
Post by: swordsmith04 on January 16, 2016, 12:45:49 pm
And yes, I volunteered when PW asked for someone to do it, a little over a year ago now. It's technically every mission cycle, but this one was kind of screwed up by new missions starting before the original missions had all ended. In any case, 21-23 have all ended now, so that's done with. I'll just count M26 as part of the next mission cycle, or something.
Post by: Ozarck on January 17, 2016, 03:41:11 pm
Post by: swordsmith04 on January 17, 2016, 04:37:40 pm
Quote from: IRC
20:21:50 <Swordsmith04> Piecewise, I mentioned this in my on-ship action, but in case you skipped over that: I did up the wiki gnome data for this mission cycle over in the wiki thread, so you can do gnome payments whenever.
20:23:23 <Piecewise> sword, do you have an idea how much everyone should be paid?
20:23:30 <Piecewise> I put someone in charge of that, I forget who
20:24:10 <Swordsmith04> ...You put me in charge of gathering the data, and decided yourself roughly how much it was worth last time. I included comparisons to previous pay, this time.
20:32:33 <Piecewise> Sword: Ok. So you've got the data for that set out?
20:32:47 <Swordsmith04> Right here: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=149970.msg6740974#msg6740974
20:32:52 <Piecewise> THanks
20:35:59 <Piecewise> Sword. Nav gets fucking 16 tokens
20:36:09 <Piecewise> Aoshima gets 10
20:36:23 <Piecewise> Paris gets 5
20:36:36 <Piecewise> Radio gets 3
20:36:44 <Piecewise> Nik gets 3
20:37:03 <Piecewise> Comrade gets 5, since he's helping out extra with IH
20:37:19 <Piecewise> You get 4
20:37:26 <Piecewise> Kri 2
20:37:28 <Piecewise> Sy 1
20:37:30 <Piecewise> Nun 1
20:37:33 <Piecewise> Cael 1
20:37:35 <Piecewise> Dut 1
20:37:40 <Piecewise> Spaz 1
20:37:44 <Piecewise> ozark 1
20:37:48 <Piecewise> No one else anything
20:37:56 <Swordsmith04> Gotcha. I'll start adding those now.
20:38:01 <Piecewise> Thank you sir
20:38:03 <Oz> Neat! Thank you, Evil overlord!
20:38:14 <Nav> Wow thanks!20:38:17 <Piecewise> (give yourself an extra one, under the table for your work here swordy)(This line was never here, move along citizen)
Post by: NAV on January 18, 2016, 11:02:01 am
I propose we create a page titled "Main armory", and add only the best and most useful stuff to that page. Then we leave the old armory page exactly as it is but rename it to "Expanded Armory" or similar.
This requires deciding what items are worth going in the main armour, which should be a community effort. We should start with CON and work our way down.
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 18, 2016, 11:08:00 am
Post by: Nikitian on January 18, 2016, 11:38:23 am
Second, while I endorse the idea of getting the community feedback on this, ICly, I believe, this is part of Hephaestus Head of Engineering duties. There is already a precedent for declaring equipment obsolete and replacing it, so I believe there shouldn't be any troubles on that part.
Third, I am not sure what to do with all the "space magic" items, as they are supposedly "restricted" now. Shall we move them on to a third separate page, something like "Restricted Armory Equipment"? Or just rubber-stamp every such entry in the Armory with [RESTRICTED] and call it a day?
Fourth, the only thing that has stopped me so far was that the templates are tied to the armory page specifically, and I couldn't create a proper duplicate for the "Back of the Armory" page, or however we'd call it. Paris, could you help us with this?
...Hmmm. Maurice is back to the Sword and is in actual comm range with Hephaestus. RC, you wouldn't call it "meta" now to fulfil my long-neglected duties? ;)
Post by: NAV on January 18, 2016, 11:44:15 am
I think that origin tech should have a third separate page.
Looks like we do need Paris or someone as skilled to come to the rescue.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on January 18, 2016, 12:18:48 pm
Post by: Nikitian on January 18, 2016, 12:26:20 pm
Right now, both variants are possible, I believe. But we'd need to act soon if we decide to do so.
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 18, 2016, 12:53:58 pm
Quote
I think that origin tech should have a third separate page.Personally, I think I'd prefer that we try not to make too many redundant pages, a single backlog armory where we dump all the outdated or extremely niche or Origin stuff seems better to me. Keep things at least a little more coherent/straightforward. But if most people would like it separate, that's fine enough as well.
Quote
I'll fish it out and tidy up ASAP, when I have the time, but given what Piecewise said - should we get into frenzy and complete the Armory revamp before everyone goes off to buying stuff (maybe even advise to hold off a little), or let them do it with the old list for now, and introduce the changes afterwards?
Right now, both variants are possible, I believe. But we'd need to act soon if we decide to do so.
I'd say we do it slow and right. The armory page as is has served us well up till now, it'll do for a little while more I think.
Quote
Second, while I endorse the idea of getting the community feedback on this, ICly, I believe, this is part of Hephaestus Head of Engineering duties. There is already a precedent for declaring equipment obsolete and replacing it, so I believe there shouldn't be any troubles on that part.I think this is something that might be better done communally, since the armory wiki page should primarily function for the players who need to look up things they wanna buy. That said, I don't think there'll be much discussion over the most obvious things.
Quote
...Hmmm. Maurice is back to the Sword and is in actual comm range with Hephaestus. RC, you wouldn't call it "meta" now to fulfil my long-neglected duties? ;)
Such as? I kinda imagined the trial would happen quickly after the mission debrief (are we ever getting that?), but I don't think it'll be a big problem (though that's hard to say without knwing what kind of things you're referring to).
Post by: NAV on January 18, 2016, 12:57:58 pm
I think it would be less confusing to have separate pages for recommended things, things that aren't recommended but you can still buy, and things that just don't fucking work anymore. Rather than grouping those last two into one page.QuoteI think that origin tech should have a third separate page.Personally, I think I'd prefer that we try not to make too many redundant pages, a single backlog armory where we dump all the outdated or extremely niche or Origin stuff seems better to me. Keep things at least a little more coherent/straightforward. But if most people would like it separate, that's fine enough as well.
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 18, 2016, 01:01:33 pm
Oh yeah, I can see the reasoning, I personally just prefer the former. We'll see what the others think, kay?I think it would be less confusing to have separate pages for recommended things, things that aren't recommended but you can still buy, and things that just don't fucking work anymore. Rather than grouping those last two into one page.QuoteI think that origin tech should have a third separate page.Personally, I think I'd prefer that we try not to make too many redundant pages, a single backlog armory where we dump all the outdated or extremely niche or Origin stuff seems better to me. Keep things at least a little more coherent/straightforward. But if most people would like it separate, that's fine enough as well.
Post by: Nikitian on January 18, 2016, 01:17:03 pm
QuoteI'll fish it out and tidy up ASAP, when I have the time, but given what Piecewise said - should we get into frenzy and complete the Armory revamp before everyone goes off to buying stuff (maybe even advise to hold off a little), or let them do it with the old list for now, and introduce the changes afterwards?
Right now, both variants are possible, I believe. But we'd need to act soon if we decide to do so.
I'd say we do it slow and right. The armory page as is has served us well up till now, it'll do for a little while more I think.
Actually, I believe it's in a very sorry state right now, especially because of the lack of the AM in the kiosk, but that's me. And yeah, anyway going to cut up on the number of crap as we move on to elsewhere. Just supposed we could do that before we moved on for a change.
I think it would be less confusing to have separate pages for recommended things, things that aren't recommended but you can still buy, and things that just don't fucking work anymore. Rather than grouping those last two into one page.QuoteI think that origin tech should have a third separate page.Personally, I think I'd prefer that we try not to make too many redundant pages, a single backlog armory where we dump all the outdated or extremely niche or Origin stuff seems better to me. Keep things at least a little more coherent/straightforward. But if most people would like it separate, that's fine enough as well.
To be honest, since Armory is theoretically an official list of thinks produced/supplied/approved by Hephaestus, I'd keep everything on the page, but mark the older and less recommended items as such. Eventually, I'd hope to replace all "outdated" weapons with up-to-date "modern" ones - with the Tinker effort shaped and pointed at the most glaring cases.
Actually, my discussion with Syvarris contained some internal "ratings" of various weapons - perhaps we should actually keep those to help newcomers with choosing the equipment? With the disclaimer about certain degree of subjectiveness of a such system, of course.
QuoteSecond, while I endorse the idea of getting the community feedback on this, ICly, I believe, this is part of Hephaestus Head of Engineering duties. There is already a precedent for declaring equipment obsolete and replacing it, so I believe there shouldn't be any troubles on that part.I think this is something that might be better done communally, since the armory wiki page should primarily function for the players who need to look up things they wanna buy. That said, I don't think there'll be much discussion over the most obvious things.
Except it's by default that everything on the Armory page is endorsed by Hephaestus and produced. Which often isn't the case, really, and I would really like to deal away with that ambiguity.
And, to be honest, I think that the recommendations and "outdatedness" of items should be decided by the hardcore tinkerers, as they are most likely to see which things are
(And, well, that reason is why I initially consulted with Syv in the first place. :P )
Post by: Parisbre56 on January 18, 2016, 02:06:42 pm
Fourth, the only thing that has stopped me so far was that the templates are tied to the armory page specifically, and I couldn't create a proper duplicate for the "Back of the Armory" page, or however we'd call it. Paris, could you help us with this?The AL template (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Template:AL) isn't tied to the current Armory page in any way. You can use it anywhere.
The Armory Item infobox template (http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Template:Armory_Item) has been modified. It now has the "armory" field which should point to the name of the intended Armory page. If left empty, it defaults to the current Armory page, so that it doesn't break old pages.
If you think it's better/less work to make it default to another value, then it's easy to change that. For example, if you want to change it to Expanded_Armory, you can change every occurrence of
Code: [Select]
{{{armory|Armory}}}toCode: [Select]
{{{armory|Expanded_Armory}}}in the template code.EDIT: @Aoshima: In order to prevent people from executing arbitrary code, wikitext is heavily sanitized. There's very little you can do in terms of javascript or even custom html. It might be better to just make your own page in a separate host and parse the data in the wiki to it.
I'd do it myself, but the current host I use for my stat calculator webpage is banned from wikia. That's why I couldn't get the levelup page to work, because I couldn't extract the stats from the wiki page. And I don't have enough time to go find a new free host.
EDIT2: If you want to add armoury items to different categories depending on which armoury they belong, I can do that. Just tell me which category you want me to make it point at.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on January 18, 2016, 02:17:41 pm
Post by: syvarris on January 18, 2016, 02:39:46 pm
Same for all the items which were supposed to be AM-made. Can we still obtain longcoats, or reactor tech helmets, or all the other random clutter items? If so, they go in the "available, but not recommended" list. If not, they go in the "unavailable" list.
As to who gets to decide what exactly is outdated, and what relative grades are, I partially agree with Nik; it's not a question that should be asked in OOC, because most people don't really know much about the actual effectiveness of armory equipment. However, I don't think it's just us that are qualified to make good decisions--Radio, Paris, most people who post in Heph OOC, all you guys know your stuff.
Lastly, I think this is pretty clear, but it's been a massive barrier the last few times this discussion came up: I don't think we need to remove items from the armory outright. Only items which are literally impossible to get should be removed, while all the obtainable
Post by: Parisbre56 on January 18, 2016, 04:02:07 pm
It's not that they banned the IP because of what I was doing, you don't have to worry about that. The administrator I contacted seemed OK with it. But he said there was an attack made from the cloud this IP belonged to, so they decided to perma-ban the entire cloud. A bit of an overreaction if you ask me, but I don't know much about servers and even less about JavaScript and HTML, so it's not like my opinion matters.
@syv: Why delete anything? Space is cheap. Just shove it somewhere out of the way, like clothing in a teenager's room.
Post by: Gentlefish on January 18, 2016, 04:18:24 pm
Post by: syvarris on January 18, 2016, 04:26:06 pm
Deleting things? I was trying to make it super clear that I don't think we need to delete anything. I was saying even the stuff which is literally impossible to obtain should be moved to an armory page specifically dedicated to stuff which is literally impossible to obtain.
The way I see it, we should have three pages: The first, containing only things deemed to be good purchases, and possibly things which fill unoccupied roles. The second would contain all items which are redundant, inferior, or excessively niche. The third would contain everything which, regardless of its value, is impossible to obtain under normal circumstances. Nothing would be deleted from the wiki, just moved to a different page.
Post by: Parisbre56 on January 18, 2016, 05:01:44 pm
Post by: syvarris on January 18, 2016, 11:51:59 pm
Armor spoiler doesn't include assaultsuits, but I'd grade them as MODERN/A++. I might be biased there, though. :P
Spoiler: Conventional Weapons (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Armors (click to show/hide)
Post by: NAV on January 19, 2016, 12:34:14 am
I would call the gauss rifle a B though its still outdated.
The laser rifle and cutting laser could be made relevant and useful again if they used generators instead of batteries for the same price. There's still nothing better for slicing through things. Makes a very good secondary/backup/utility weapon when generator powered.
Of course it would be even better to make the FEL weapons cheaper.
The multifunction power gauntlet is misplaced into the entirely wrong section. Its not even a weapon. It would be a useful utility/versatility device if it wasn't so incredibly overpriced for the package it offers.
Why does the gungnir electrolaser use a tesla sabre. It could use a spark gap for so much cheaper. and why does it cost a token to duct tape them together. And why is it only compatible with a laser rifle it should be a kit to turn any laser into a lightning gun.
The Longcoat as a standalone armour is obviously bad. It might still have some niche use for layering over other armours.
I would add in "Milnoplate helmet" MODERN/A+
Its the cheapest best thing to protect you from permadeath.
Post by: Egan_BW on January 19, 2016, 02:22:11 am
Post by: AoshimaMichio on January 19, 2016, 02:29:09 am
Hand laser still isn't quite Obsolete, it has infinite battery for a whole token less than the Red Hand. :PInfinite generator yes, but it overheats in mere three seconds.
Post by: Egan_BW on January 19, 2016, 02:35:30 am
Post by: NAV on January 19, 2016, 02:45:33 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 19, 2016, 04:13:00 am
The hand laser has trouble getting through a Mk1 suit. Its barely even worth calling a weapon.One of the cool things about it though is that it is one of the few things in ER you can remake in real life by taping a laser pointer to a glove.
Post by: Maegil on January 19, 2016, 11:31:07 am
The hand laser has trouble getting through a Mk1 suit. Its barely even worth calling a weapon.Sounds more like a laser scalpel than a weapon... Since it's got its own generator, couldn't it also be used as a defibrillator/heart attack inducer against unarmoured persons?
Post by: Nikitian on January 20, 2016, 12:53:55 pm
As usual, public input on the discussed issues is highly requested.
Spoiler: Discussion, in chrological order (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Uncon (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Exo (click to show/hide)
Post by: Nunzillor on January 20, 2016, 01:20:03 pm
Edit: if anyone has a moment, can I get their opinion on the Infinite Multitool? How does it compare to just getting "assorted tools" from Fred, which are free?
Post by: AoshimaMichio on January 20, 2016, 01:23:10 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on January 20, 2016, 02:49:04 pm
Quote
But probably best moved to Aux section, as such (where, say, the Cutting Torch resides).I think things should be categorized depending on what is commonly rolled to use them. So if that thing uses Uncon, it should be Uncon.
Quote
Funny enough, I think this is the only amp ever that might be obsolete - because of the Dominator one, of course. Unless this one has its specific uses (in which case it is strictly niche), it is unfortunately outclassed.The Connector, Overrider and Dominator each have things they're good at and things they're bad at, even though they all manipulate biology. More details can be found on their specific page.
Do we have anything mind-control-ish or anything that could be used by someone with Charisma that isn't exotic?
Post by: NAV on January 20, 2016, 02:52:33 pm
Well the problem is it doesn't commonly roll with anything. Attacking with it? Strength/dex. Using it as a tool? Handi/Aux/Med. Attacking with it in a particularly fancy way? Maybe uncon. It's difficult to classify. I'm not opposed to it being moved to aux.QuoteBut probably best moved to Aux section, as such (where, say, the Cutting Torch resides).I think things should be categorized depending on what is commonly rolled to use them. So if that thing uses Uncon, it should be Uncon.
Post by: Parisbre56 on January 20, 2016, 02:57:46 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on January 20, 2016, 03:04:55 pm
It is subjected to armor thickness questions, therefore it is armor.Well the problem is it doesn't commonly roll with anything. Attacking with it? Strength/dex. Using it as a tool? Handi/Aux/Med. Attacking with it in a particularly fancy way? Maybe uncon. It's difficult to classify. I'm not opposed to it being moved to aux.QuoteBut probably best moved to Aux section, as such (where, say, the Cutting Torch resides).I think things should be categorized depending on what is commonly rolled to use them. So if that thing uses Uncon, it should be Uncon.
Post by: Parisbre56 on January 20, 2016, 03:12:59 pm
The names of items in the Armory are not displayed on mobile devices. I have no idea how to fix that...Fixed. It was a result of me experimenting with categorizing templates themselves with wikia's new system. Apparently wikia doesn't bother to display Navigation-related templates in its mobile skin. So I categorized it as Data instead.
Edit: if anyone has a moment, can I get their opinion on the Infinite Multitool? How does it compare to just getting "assorted tools" from Fred, which are free?
About the second thing, it's only advantage is probably that you can't get piecewise to say "you don't have tool X", since you're supposed to have every non-electrical tool, if I understand it correctly. So it's perfect for handiwork or even just regular mission work, especially blops mission work or other long term missions (although we'll probably not see many of those). Of course, it has the disadvantage that you can't throw it like wrench. :P But if you're buying it, then you're probably into Handiwork, so you could probably solve that problem. :P
Post by: NAV on January 20, 2016, 03:16:05 pm
Wasn't it meant to be like a replacement for kinamps? I thought that would make it use Uncon for attacks. Especially if you put some fancy morphing attacks in there.It started as a sort of kinamp replacement, but it morphed into something completely different during development. The exo using version is much more similar to a kinamp, but uses exo (cause you move it and change it with your mind).
Edit: PW did say power tools use uncon before, so about half the pimpknuckle modes should use uncon as well then.
Post by: Nikitian on January 21, 2016, 01:04:10 am
Theoretically, they should be Handiwork, but since there is no such category (and Aux overlaps with Handi use somewhat, say, when one is "doctoring" robots), I propose to move them to Auxiliary Systems section.
(This is in regards to the multitool pimp-bundle. The Exo variant is torn somewhere between Exo and (I assume) Uncon sections (as an Exo-based-shapeshifting melee weapon). Just as the Ghost Blade, so no real trouble here.)
Post by: NAV on January 21, 2016, 01:17:09 am
Post by: Nikitian on January 21, 2016, 01:31:12 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 26, 2016, 03:35:21 am
Quote
What kind of mission would you like to do next?
Something military with lots of murder
8
Something weird and alien
10
Something diplomatic and maybe violent if you mess up
4
Something completely different
1
I have no opinion
2
I'll tell you in the OOC thread.
0
The poll was created at 07:30 on January 16, 2016, and so far 25 people voted.
Removing poll, these were the results.
Post by: Xantalos on January 26, 2016, 03:47:26 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 26, 2016, 03:48:25 am
Say Radio, have you finalized the M24 pay yet? I don't mean to be overly pushy, I just need to know who I'm going to borrow from (unless you're generous to me for some unexplained reason).
Waiting for response from pw. Thought he'd answer yesterday, but no dice.
Post by: Xantalos on January 26, 2016, 03:49:53 am
Post by: Parisbre56 on January 28, 2016, 01:06:27 pm
Post by: Gentlefish on January 28, 2016, 10:03:06 pm
Mostly listing the known abilities of the arm. My personal favorite is the wiggle.
Post by: Radio Controlled on February 02, 2016, 12:35:28 pm
Quote
How long do you want ER to run?
3 mission cycles/1 year is fine by me.
7
3 years or so, as it was meant before the Lurker.
0
Let's run ER forever! Or just for a lot more years.
11
I don't care if it ends right now, it's long due.
0
The poll was created at 11:15 on January 19, 2016, and so far 18 people voted.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on February 02, 2016, 12:44:20 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on February 02, 2016, 12:45:27 pm
Post by: Comrade P. on February 02, 2016, 01:04:25 pm
Post by: Egan_BW on February 02, 2016, 01:08:11 pm
Post by: Nikitian on February 02, 2016, 01:50:42 pm
Personally, I've switched my opinion on the matter several times, but I see no practical reason why it couldn't run further if Piecewise gets a number of helping hands to smooth over his predicted lack of time.
(And ayup, it's served its purpose fully as it was brought up with Piecewise as an argument that people still want more of ER, by large part. That's when he brought the news of the future lack of time for ER, and that's when the matters of assistants were first discussed. All in all, Syvarris in charge of Tinker thread (and Tinker thread alive and well again, and Poke as a separate thread) are direct results of that poll. ;) )
Post by: Parisbre56 on February 02, 2016, 03:03:01 pm
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_22#Mission_Summary
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Mission_24#Mission_Summary
as per the previous agreement with RC.
Also bought equipment at the prices previously discussed with piecewise.
Please notify me about any problems.
Post by: Nunzillor on February 03, 2016, 10:06:14 pm
Edit: never mind. I'll assume both.
Post by: Ozarck on February 04, 2016, 08:01:37 am
It's still ER if it's a HMRC-descendent unit of people doing things for ever-snarky, ever-Northern-Green-speaking Steve. :PAssuming Steve makes the transfer between universes.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on February 05, 2016, 01:46:07 pm
Actually I think I poke it to see if I can do it myself.
Post by: Parisbre56 on February 05, 2016, 02:01:33 pm
We have now/soon two retired characters. Me thinks PC template needs to keep eye on new status value.If I remember correctly, it's just a switch statement. You can easily add whatever values you want in it.
Actually I think I poke it to see if I can do it myself.
Or just tell me whatever values you need and I'll add them myself.
Post by: spazyak on February 05, 2016, 02:08:40 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on February 05, 2016, 02:10:37 pm
Post by: Parisbre56 on February 05, 2016, 02:12:19 pm
Wohoo, I did it. Now we possibly need separate category for retired characters. How is that done?The category is automatically created when pages are added to it.
Then you optionally navigate to the category and add a short description.
Post by: Parisbre56 on February 05, 2016, 02:15:02 pm
Post by: AoshimaMichio on February 05, 2016, 02:17:21 pm
Post by: Xantalos on February 17, 2016, 11:47:57 pm
Say wiki gnome people, I've a question for you. How much does it cost to do respec of stats? I'm asking because I'm currently trying to do so and I'm basing my prices off of Unholy's recent procedure, which put it at 1 token per 5 points moved about. Would that be alright?Mayhaps here would be a better place to ask?
Before you say ask PW, he asked me to ask you folk.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on February 17, 2016, 11:54:10 pm
Post by: Xantalos on February 18, 2016, 12:16:23 am
Not that more cost would've stopped this, of course. Just inconvenienced me a tad more.
Post by: Parisbre56 on February 18, 2016, 05:25:28 am
Post by: Radio Controlled on February 20, 2016, 06:24:17 am
Quote
Dubley SteptimusCould people in general, when they add tokens from a tinker armory purchase, add a link to the post where the purchase was made, to make it easier to keep track of things? Like so:
edited by Navagator 2 days ago diff
Summary: Token from tinkering
Quote
Miyamoto de BergeracOr some other way to track which purchases' royalties were payed out yet and which not.
edited by Radio Controlled diff
Summary: money (almost) from sale: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=108083.msg6784059#msg6784059
Also:
Quote
Vanessa AnagridThis is the actual change (copypasting this doesn't really work well though, so better look yourself: http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Vanessa_Anagrid?diff=13423&oldid=13179)
edited by A Wikia contributor 1 day ago diff
Summary: Unwieldy stat changes - represented the cell control mod by putting another enhanced +1 in - Xan
Quote
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Does this all work out? I think 4 tokens were used to bring 15 points from exo to med, and 5 points from fate to med. That all checks out I think. But then there's the 10 token cellular control genemod
Quote
Is this even usable for a robot person? Does 'mind' count as a physical stat? Finally, it says you can move a +1 around, so shouldn't that mean another stat should be getting a malus? And since the only other physical stat with a bonus in is end at +1, doesn't that mean end is now at 0? And does that have an influence on the genemod limit (meaning 1 genemod wouldn't be functional anymore maybe? I have no idea).Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Post by: Xantalos on February 20, 2016, 01:12:17 pm
I had an additional 5 points in Mind that I moved to Med to make up the difference.
Post by: AoshimaMichio on May 24, 2016, 11:00:10 am
I have boring life.
Post by: Parisbre56 on May 24, 2016, 12:17:27 pm
I have boring life.I disagree. Imagine this as your conversation starter:
Other: "Anyway, that's my story. What about you? What do you do in your spare time?"
Ao: "I'm an accountant."
O: "Hehe, no, I meant what are your hobbies, what do you do for fun?"
A: "I told you. I'm an accountant."
O: "For real?"
A: "Yep."
O: "You're not kidding me."
A: "Nope."
O: "Ookay... Why?"
A: "Ah, because you see, I'm not just any accountant. I'm a space accountant!"
O: "Hah. Okay. I've got to bite. What's a space accountant? You do accounting in zero-G?"
A: "Oh, no. You see, I keep track of the funds and inventory of an intergalactic terrorist organization (although we prefer the term freedom fighters).”
O: "...wat"
A: "Oh, yes! And they give me these little plastic casino chips if I do well, which I can exchange for all sorts of cool things. I've got my eyes on a nuclear mortar launcher or maybe some human brains! It's going to be so much fun!"
O: *blank stare*
A: *smiles obliviously*
...
*5 minutes later*
Man with giant butterfly net: "Now, now, just stay calm-"
A: ”No! Where are you taking me? I don't want to go! I'm telling the truth I tell you!"
See? Interesting.
Post by: piecewise on May 25, 2016, 09:37:22 am
Who did what? I have a guy for keeping track of that.
Who did what?
Post by: AoshimaMichio on May 25, 2016, 12:10:09 pm
Wiki contributions between January 16th and May 25th:
AoshimaMichio made 434 edits to the wiki; they received 10 tokens for 467 edits last time.
NAV made 285 edits to the wiki; they received 16 tokens for 761 edits last time.
Nunzillor/ZBridges made 138 edits to the wiki; they received 1 tokens for 24 edits last time.
swordsmith04 made 108 edits to the wiki; they received 4 tokens for 108 edits last time.
RadioControlled made 60 edits to the wiki; they received 3 tokens for 166 edits last time.
Paris made 51 edits to the wiki; they received 5 tokens for 263 edits last time.
Nikitian made 30 edits to the wiki; they received 3 tokens for 137 edits last time.
Comrade P. made 18 edits to the wiki; they received 5 tokens for 134 edits last time.
syvarris made 10 edits to the wiki. Caellath made 10 edits to the wiki. Ozarck made 9 edits to the wiki. spatzy made 9 edits to the wiki. Maegil made 6 edits to the wiki. Egan_BW made 6 edits to the wiki. Moopli made 4 edits to the wiki. renegadelobster made 4 edits to the wiki. Harry Baldman made 2 edits to the wiki. chaoticskies made 1 edit to the wiki. Lenglon made 1 edit to the wiki.
Spatzy needs to make an account. He got too many IP's to keep track of.
[Previous Payment Record] (http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=149970.msg6740974#msg6740974)
Post by: Radio Controlled on June 03, 2016, 04:49:01 am
-If anyone needs anything in terms of mission equipment, say so now before the mission starts.
-Removed most of the mission gear from the previous mission from people's inventories.
-Left coms pack with Miya. Wanted to take one along anyways, though if someone else needs one or would prefer to hang on to it do say so. M28 could probably use them as well.
-Left the small cameras with Flint, they could be useful. If someone else would like them, again just say so.
We have the two gunnerbots (one of which was senselessly vandalized :O ) which I'll assign to M29 later if nobody else wants them, or there's good arguments against. Same for the pack of scout eyes. Anyone on M29 who'd like them? If not I'll just assign them to Miya for the time being.
Post by: spazyak on June 11, 2016, 12:59:31 pm
Post by: spazyak on June 28, 2016, 10:28:01 pm
Post by: Radio Controlled on March 18, 2017, 02:45:52 pm
Spoiler (click to show/hide)