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Dwarf Fortress => DF Modding => Mod Releases => Topic started by: Mediterraneo on April 08, 2017, 03:35:04 pm

Title: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on April 08, 2017, 03:35:04 pm
Rhenaya's Drow mod, updated for 44.12

Download the mod here (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=14103)


beta 0.9.0 is out! "Rushed Creatures Edition"

As Arkenor pointed out (thanks) some creatures were causing duplication bugs with creatures in other mods using Rhenaya's old files (Masterwork, to be specific). Changing the creatures names is going to prevent further duplications without asking other modders to touch their files.

I took this as a chance to revamp the creatures: now we have three kinds of rothen and three kinds of lizard where there was one, and I added a first draft of the Shriekers, Sword Spider and Cavvekan pets.

I added some reaction to roduce armor in full sets - something to help lazy players to inmerse themselves in the luxury-used drow way of doing things, relatively free of micromanagement when it is not needed.
But this is a rushed edition: I had 'almost ready' things in the works I talked about in a forum post, I felt to share them as they are as a start, there will be more developed versions of this.

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Spoiler: Credits (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Shub-Nullgurath on April 09, 2017, 02:47:28 am
Oh, I didn't realise that about Rhenaya, that's a real shame.

I was hoping to take a look at their stuff to include in my Underdark mod. Do you have a download for it?
Title: Re: Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on April 09, 2017, 07:00:37 am
Hello Shub-Nullgurath,

The link from which I took the files I worked on is this, at the DFFD: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=2176
It is written for the then latest version, 34.11. "It's the same files" of my work, what I had to rewrite is detailed in my "Med's readme". Everything I touched is marked clearly as so in my upload.
Those files include sprites from other authors, I'm trying to contact them too. Rhenaya's thread about this indicated Chariot (he is a user here, last active 19 of march CY) and Doctror_Nic and Flying Squirrel (a user here, last active 1 of april CY) posted graphical things on the same thread, I noticed them while adding the link to her original thread here, I was able to send a PM to two of them, not to Doctor_Nic yet, I'm still looking for him.

This is Rhenaya's mods page there: http://dffd.bay12games.com/who.php?id=554

To state it clearly: her work is her own, and if it is available to the community, please be welcome to use it without asking me.
I have no ties to her, nor any claim on her work.
My work - on this files or otherwise, and as small as some rewriting here and there may be- is available for unrestricted use within the community too, for as long as it is stays free and is not included in non-free products and packages, even if I get unactive and unreachable.
Take it, use it, cut it, build it.
My objective is making things easily available to everyone who wants them.

On shared use: I got to Rhenaya's work following searches on drow mods around. Meph's Masterwork mod for a while included these guys too, I think it was back to when Rhenaya updated them regularily but I may be wrong on this.
He may have news, ideas or more recent version of the files too.

Cheers, and keep up with your underdark work!
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Shub-Nullgurath on April 10, 2017, 10:19:22 am
I dropped you a message. If you've got a Discord jump in the channel in my signature.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Kat on April 10, 2017, 01:20:01 pm
Hello there, I'm glad someone has decided to try and update Rhen's drows for the latest version of DF.
I was trying to update things myself at the weekend, using elements from the elf profile to fill in the blanks that were needed, and had some success, after reading some of your posts.
I couldn't get the drow outcasts entity to work though, it crashed for some reason, so I had to cut them from the modded raws that I am using, to regain familiarity with DF after not playing it for a couple years.
Something that I've noticed, but which I've read seems to be an issue with the latest version of DF in general, was that I can't butcher goblins, or other sapient creatures? That was a bit of a surprise - in previous versions of Rhen's drow mod, I had a tendency to build quite the goblin leather industry and goblin bone craft industry.
Still getting used to things, but will keep an eye on this, to see how it develops.


by the way, you haven't included your latest link to your work, this one: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=12819
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Rekov on April 14, 2017, 09:21:07 pm
OMG I love you for doing this!
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on April 15, 2017, 06:11:24 am
Thanks Rekov!

Take also note of Shub-Nullgurath's work on the Underdark, I think he is working on his own drows too in these days.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Rekov on April 16, 2017, 12:44:21 am
He did mention civs. A long time ago I thought about creating an updated drow tileset but I'm such a bad pixel artist that I didn't get very far. I might give that another shot.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: vjmdhzgr on April 16, 2017, 11:48:46 am
Hello there, I'm glad someone has decided to try and update Rhen's drows for the latest version of DF.
I was trying to update things myself at the weekend, using elements from the elf profile to fill in the blanks that were needed, and had some success, after reading some of your posts.
I couldn't get the drow outcasts entity to work though, it crashed for some reason, so I had to cut them from the modded raws that I am using, to regain familiarity with DF after not playing it for a couple years.
Something that I've noticed, but which I've read seems to be an issue with the latest version of DF in general, was that I can't butcher goblins, or other sapient creatures? That was a bit of a surprise - in previous versions of Rhen's drow mod, I had a tendency to build quite the goblin leather industry and goblin bone craft industry.
Still getting used to things, but will keep an eye on this, to see how it develops.


by the way, you haven't included your latest link to your work, this one: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=12819
I think version 0.40 accidentally broke butchering intelligent creatures in fortress mode. Toady knows of the problem, but doesn't even know how he caused it and since it's not something you can do in vanilla he hasn't put much effort into figuring out how to fix it.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on April 19, 2017, 06:07:10 pm
Hello there, I'm glad someone has decided to try and update Rhen's drows for the latest version of DF.
I was trying to update things myself at the weekend, using elements from the elf profile to fill in the blanks that were needed, and had some success, after reading some of your posts.
I couldn't get the drow outcasts entity to work though, it crashed for some reason, so I had to cut them from the modded raws that I am using, to regain familiarity with DF after not playing it for a couple years.
Something that I've noticed, but which I've read seems to be an issue with the latest version of DF in general, was that I can't butcher goblins, or other sapient creatures? That was a bit of a surprise - in previous versions of Rhen's drow mod, I had a tendency to build quite the goblin leather industry and goblin bone craft industry.
Still getting used to things, but will keep an eye on this, to see how it develops.


by the way, you haven't included your latest link to your work, this one: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=12819

Hello there, thank you for pointing out the missing link!
I am not playing the mod enough I think, I didn't meet the deep drow yet, but I don't have crashes with them: are you using "my" file or are you modifying the original along the same lines?
On the goblin-butchering thing, I am not aware of workarounds to have it working: I'll add them to the files if I find out how.

On the scope of the project: don't expect much development on my part, I will go with the time I have available and as a total amateur.
I do not claim exclusivity on what I see as Rhenaya's work though: feel free to add, improve, suggest, propose changes to the files, to include in "my" pack or in your own version of it.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Kat on April 20, 2017, 03:38:21 pm
are you using "my" file or are you modifying the original along the same lines?

Modifying the originals, along similar lines. I saw that you got the drows to work, by changing their default site from dark fortress to detailed cave, so I put that into the things I was working with, and it runs fine.

but the odd thing I found was that the drow outcasts entity file would crash dwarf fortress when attempting to generate a new world. Errorlog didn't show anything though, so I was baffled as to why it was happening, so I removed it from the entity file, and it works.


Something else I did, was that I made at least one type of clothing for each body part [FORCED] rather than being [COMMON] or [UNCOMMON], because in several worlds that I generated, I found that the drow civilisation that I had, did not have the ability to make various bits of clothing - e.g. one world, i could not make anything other than war boots as footwear, instead of war boots (which are armour), socks, and normal boots.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on April 21, 2017, 09:52:25 am
That migh be a good idea, if problems arise with clothes.

On the non-working parts:
what worked to me was trying to re-write things "from scratch", or at least from outside the 34.11 environment of the mod.
I started with taking working bits -say, a layer bound animalmen entity from the vanilla files - and started modifying them in blocks.
Say, the values, or all the weapons, or all the jobs, or something. Each time generating a world to control if some error was there, "if it stopped working".
Another place to find errors would be comparing the relevant parts of the 43.05 and the 34.11 vanilla objects most similars to the ones you want to design and comparing it with some online diff checker - the first ones from googling will be good enough and free.
And it will tell you what tags you should study firsts in the wiki, to understand what changed and what needs to change in turn.

I hope this helps, I will take note of the clothes thing in next versions of this.


PS: Sorry for that "same lines", I did mean something like your "similar lines", a similar intent, a near idea, not anything - there was no intention of subtext there.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Dark Archon on May 23, 2017, 02:53:54 pm
For some reason, drow civs won't appear in the game: they have extremely low population, or have fallen. What may cause it?
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: ManuG on May 23, 2017, 03:51:51 pm
Are they around when you set the world generation's end to 25 years or so? Could be, that they don't have enough children to keep up with other races and get overrun i guess...
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Dark Archon on May 24, 2017, 12:49:20 pm
Are they around when you set the world generation's end to 25 years or so? Could be, that they don't have enough children to keep up with other races and get overrun i guess...
Yes, they exist in the history, but just die out. How do you make them have more babies, like normal elves do?
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Kat on May 29, 2017, 03:15:40 pm
I've also seen this happening, though I'm not using this particular drow mod.

I'm wondering if it has something to do with their ethics or values. As well as there not being many children, there's also not many marriages - as far as I can tell, the only married couples in my fortress are migrants who arrived married.  :-\

Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: ManuG on May 29, 2017, 05:06:46 pm
This seems to be the major problem - Drow as a race in their typical characteristics wouldn't be survivable in the long run. Another factor could be their underground start in the caverns. Many towns have frequently been "visited" by forgotten beasts. At least that's what my legend viewer says. I guess it's a combination of both: Less children and many dangers to deal with (including themselves xD).

Edit: I bet it's the "detests romance" trait...
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Amostubal on May 29, 2017, 11:30:53 pm
Ptw

How is the work coming along... I'm interested in this since it was a part of MDF years ago.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: FrownTown on November 04, 2017, 06:26:58 am
Is this still being worked on? Tried using the mod, enjoyable when it works, but found that the Drow die out early on in worldgen every time. Is there a solution to this?
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Kat on December 18, 2017, 11:24:18 am
Playing again with my own modifications, and have noticed something using the latest dwarf therapist.

The Social-alt tab on dwarf therapist, shows something that might be important.

Now, as standard, the drow culture in Rhenaya's original entity files values Merriment at 30.

However, in the creature file, drow's cheer propensity is valued at 0/30/50, which tends to make serious drows.

This seems to be causing a personality conflict in the drows, which might be part of why they don't seem to survive worldgen often.

Maybe tweaking these values might help.

Also could try putting in a boost to romance in the creature personality file, see if that helps them get married more often.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: burrito25man on December 21, 2017, 01:19:34 pm
Hello there, I'm glad someone has decided to try and update Rhen's drows for the latest version of DF.
I was trying to update things myself at the weekend, using elements from the elf profile to fill in the blanks that were needed, and had some success, after reading some of your posts.
I couldn't get the drow outcasts entity to work though, it crashed for some reason, so I had to cut them from the modded raws that I am using, to regain familiarity with DF after not playing it for a couple years.
Something that I've noticed, but which I've read seems to be an issue with the latest version of DF in general, was that I can't butcher goblins, or other sapient creatures? That was a bit of a surprise - in previous versions of Rhen's drow mod, I had a tendency to build quite the goblin leather industry and goblin bone craft industry.
Still getting used to things, but will keep an eye on this, to see how it develops.


by the way, you haven't included your latest link to your work, this one: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=12819
I think version 0.40 accidentally broke butchering intelligent creatures in fortress mode. Toady knows of the problem, but doesn't even know how he caused it and since it's not something you can do in vanilla he hasn't put much effort into figuring out how to fix it.

I know this mod is established to be used without the use of dfhack, but if anyone is interested I wrote a script to get around the butchering issue. Link in my sig

Thanks guys! I love seeing this mod come back!
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on February 11, 2018, 12:36:50 pm
Ptw

How is the work coming along... I'm interested in this since it was a part of MDF years ago.

I went on a hiatus: DF is very immersive when I deal with it.
This begun as a "translation" of an old mod to the new versions, not a developing project. We will see if more things will come, if they don't don't get mad at me, but write them yourself, I will probably play them!!

Is this still being worked on? Tried using the mod, enjoyable when it works, but found that the Drow die out early on in worldgen every time. Is there a solution to this?

and:

Playing again with my own modifications, and have noticed something using the latest dwarf therapist.

The Social-alt tab on dwarf therapist, shows something that might be important.

Now, as standard, the drow culture in Rhenaya's original entity files values Merriment at 30.

However, in the creature file, drow's cheer propensity is valued at 0/30/50, which tends to make serious drows.

This seems to be causing a personality conflict in the drows, which might be part of why they don't seem to survive worldgen often.

Maybe tweaking these values might help.

Also could try putting in a boost to romance in the creature personality file, see if that helps them get married more often.


I like the way in which the forum found a problem and a possible solution too. Thank you Kat!
If I will be able to put a new version out, for 0.44, I will try to change something there - but I don't really know what I am doing, I'm a wannabe, a part time Dwarf Fortress player and less than that as a modder.

This also means also that if somebody else is going to push the work forward - both in a minimalist, "vanilla feel" way like I prefer, or in any direction they want - I will put a link to their threads on this one, to make it easier to find the versions we can, want and like to play.
Or go ahead an link it yourself here if you do have a file ready!


Cheers everybody.
Title: Re: [43.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on February 13, 2018, 02:09:01 am
Beta 0.4 is up!
You can find it here: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=13511 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=13511)

It is mostly just a translation, but I made some changes to the clothing - the drow should be more willing to dress and to produce clothes now - and to start address the small numbers the drow had after some years of worldgen, touching both the personality-values system as was suggested here and the settlement biomes pattern, which looked more relevant in my testing.
Let's see if this is an improvement.
Title: Re: [44.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: ManuG on February 21, 2018, 05:50:39 pm
Started a new World and it seems to work so far :) Drow civs rise again. I still got only a few married couples though. But at least they seem to get children pretty quick.
On the other hand the trolls don't get offspring now (until yet that means - i am still only a couple of years around in that new fort)

But i have to report a mistake in the noble description: It says, that the house overseer would handle the diplomats, but these only meet and talk with my Priestess.
So either the description is wrong, or the game doesn't recognise the nobles correctly.

Awesome work so far :) I'm really glad to have this mod updated to the latest version! I am looking forward to some Drow-Raids on all those other slave races :p
Title: Re: [44.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on March 03, 2018, 07:22:18 pm
Beta 0.5, the "Less is more edition" is out.


I am starting taking more and more 'artistic' decisions about this, so it is less of a simple translation and more of an interpretation of Rhenaya's work.
I still include the files needed to have it 'pure', but that's not anymore the only criterion. The other direction is the inmediate compatibility with other mods. I don't want to add to the "arms race" of metals (and bones) "almost as good" or "slightly better than" steel.
In this version I still have the "filological" translation added as a standalone alternative: copy either one of my two folders in your Dwarf Fortress folder.

Changes for Med's Less is More:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Cheers!

PS: looking at the creature files, I started wondering if the Quaggoth being shearable was or wasn't aleftover from them having been created starting from the Troll from standard_creature file. They still had "T" as their identifying letter in last Rhenaya's version and it could have been an oversight. Do anyone have a recorded instance, in any lore-original material, of Quaggoths sheared for wool? Either in novels or game manuals. I don't.
Title: Re: [44.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on March 07, 2018, 09:41:04 am
Started a new World and it seems to work so far :) Drow civs rise again. I still got only a few married couples though. But at least they seem to get children pretty quick.
On the other hand the trolls don't get offspring now (until yet that means - i am still only a couple of years around in that new fort)

But i have to report a mistake in the noble description: It says, that the house overseer would handle the diplomats, but these only meet and talk with my Priestess.
So either the description is wrong, or the game doesn't recognise the nobles correctly.

Awesome work so far :) I'm really glad to have this mod updated to the latest version! I am looking forward to some Drow-Raids on all those other slave races :p

Thanks for the love and the feedback ManuG, I will try to give it a look.

On the raids, we all have a lot of expectations!

EDIT: ManuG: I took a look at it, the priestess is clearly indicated in the raw as the responsible to talk with diplomats, but the outpost leader was identifyed as the responsible in the first presentation of the first version of this mod.
I think it is Working As Designed and Working as Intended too.
In Rhenaya's intentions I mean: the files were evolutioning after the writing of the first post, and I didn't touch the positions barring adding the caste provision to the already present gender ones - Quaggoth females appeared in stranges places in my games, a no-no for a drow society.
Rhenaya used to add to that post, without modyfying old text, leaving even small keyboard mishaps in place.
There are other changes to the positions too, in respect to that descritpion - mostly cosmetic.
THis is still for most part Rhenaya's mod, and I don't want to change things when I'm not 200% sure of what I am doing. In this case, to change the thing she had to remove the [RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS] tags from all of the layers of the expedition leader's successor - not something that happens by mistake.
To change "back" to match the description in that post you should open the entity_rhenaya_drow file (entity_rhenaya_drow_med5 in my last folder) in any basic text editor (not office word) and cut and past the line: [RESPONSIBILITY:RECEIVE_DIPLOMATS] getting it out of the Priestess space where it is and putting it in all of three other nobles: the Expedition Leader and its two successors, the Outpost Overseer and the House Overseer.
You could end the job doing the same with the two occupied site nobles too, the War Priest and the Forced Administrator.
The more I look at it, the more she did that on purpose, leaving that description obsolete but having a unique and flavory job organization between nobles.
I actually like this - and maybe I could provide a more recent description in the future for the first time player. But I am not likely to change it in the files to match that description.


Title: Re: [44.05] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on March 07, 2018, 09:57:53 am
0.6 is out!

You can get it here: http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=13511 (http://dffd.bay12games.com/file.php?id=13511)

Silence for a year, then three versions in a month!

This time, focus on the Quaggoth: I revamped them, far from Rhenaya's version but nearer to the lore in my opinion.
Smaller, fiercer, faster and more aggressive. They learn less quickly than dwarves (and elves) but faster than troll now - I'm thinking on giving them normal learning speed in some areas (hunting, fighting) to push them even more in those roles but not for now.
But the important part of their change is that "smaller". They were really too big.

The other creatures got some love too, they are now more strictly drow-friends. It should be more difficult for other evil civs to encounter and domesticate. The spiders in particular, but all of the animals too. The Riding Lizard is not Common Domestic anymore.
On the general creature side, I messed with the costs.
The petvalues of the creature was vary low, allowing very rich embarks. There is now the need to balance needs and choose.
Quaggoth are almost additional citizens; the drowspider's analogue in vanilla would cost 1250 points at embark and it is smaller and with less to offer; the Rothe costs as a cow and offers more too; the Riding Lizards more than double in size the Cave Toads-Monitor Lizards kind of beasts and were valued less than a Large Rat - I'm not talking of the Giant ones.
Drow animals, as everything drow, are very good.
They should cost as such, forcing the player to chose with true drow cunning what they seek at embark.

I hope you enjoy this!
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on November 07, 2018, 11:05:54 am
New update, 0.7

"Just some balancing stuff" they said. But the 0.7 version is out, "Reclaiming the metal" version.

Drows are back in Dark Fortresses, have their Mithril, Mithralsteel and Darklight Iron back by default (they were there as options before, with some problem to smelt Darklight Iron).

The dark elves have been tweaked again in their creatures - take a look at the readme.

The Quaggoth recieved a social nerf and a military boost - remember that you can equip them with animal-men sized stuff (Lion, Grizzly bear, Tapir, Python, Harp Seal men stuff will work)

More news in the readme!
Cheers everybody!
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Hellzs on December 07, 2018, 08:37:15 pm
so im new to DF only been playing for a couple of months now.

Ive been using ☼Meph Tileset☼ and has became dependent only it for ease of play. i really want to drow but ive kind of hit a brick wall when trying to integrate it in to the set up. i was hoping someone could posable give pointer on how to make these to files/mods interact or if need be find a difrent tile set that it is more compatible with Rhenaya's Drow.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on December 17, 2018, 11:28:21 am
Hello Hellzs, welcome!

I am using Meph's tileset a lot lately, too. It is beautiful and easy to use.
I used a lot Peridexis Extant's launcher before.
I like launchers, launchers are good.

What problem do you have installing the mod in Meph's? I use that for playing 'my' (really Rhenaya's) drow.

To install in Meph's tileset (are we talking about this beauty, isn't it?: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161047.0 (ftp://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161047.0))
Simply get a fresh copy of it and unzip it where you want it.
Open it's folder: you will see the launcher and some folders, one of which is "Dwarf Fortress". Open this Dwarf Fortress folder too and leave it open.
Now unzip your "med's rhendrow 0.7 for 44.12" in a concenient spot. Open the resulting folder, and open the Rhenayas_Drow_Mod folder inside it too.
You will see two folders: "raw" and "data" copy both of them and paste them into the "Dwarf Fortress" folder of Meph's tileset.

That's it, you have the basic drow mod installed.
The drow won't appear in Meph's launcher descriptions, but you will be able to use them ingame, generate a new world for that as usual.
You could also add the contents of the other folder of the mod, Rhenayas_Titanium_Addon in the same way, to the same "Dwarf Fortress" folder.

To actually play with drow you have to select them at the embark.
The creature type of your civilization is seen at the embark screen, pressing Tab around until you get to the "Neibours" screen. The first neighbour creature is the creature type of the embark. You can change that (if it says "dwarves" for example) by going to the "Your Civilization" screen (always there at the embark, always pressing Tab). In this screen you can select (with + and -) the civilization you prefer to play. If the names of the civs are not conclusive to undestand what is what, you can use Tab to go back to the "Neighbours" screen to be sure you are chosing a drow civilization.

I hope that this helps you, feel free to ask if you have any other problem.

Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Hellzs on December 18, 2018, 06:21:36 am
Thank you Mediterraneo. I didn't realize that i was trying to use "Rhenaya's Drow for 44.05 beta 06" after trying different way of adding it to the file only to get stuck at the loading screen. i may had also for got to remove the data and raw file from the more for less file creating more problems unknowingly. i now feel kind of stupid not double checking any of this till you replied back.

being new i must ask if there are any other mods you suggest to help with the rather steep and murderous learning curve?
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on December 18, 2018, 08:40:34 am
It was confusing in that release, I hope this new one is easier to use - next ones will come without too many options, and hopefully with more intresting features
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Hellzs on December 21, 2018, 01:45:19 am
In one of Rhenaya's updates tot he mod

* new building "spidery" for spinners to produce silk thread out of the silkmilk
* sadly not properly tested yet :x

from what i can find there is no way to get silkmilk, was this removed or never finished and was forgotten over time and updates?
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on December 22, 2018, 08:19:30 pm
Hello Hellzs,

You made me check, I got scared: yes, the silk production chain is perfectly in function, silkmilk is where it should in the spiders' raws, the spiders are in place too, everything is fine.

You can milk your Giant Drowspiders as it should at the Farmer's Workshop - you will need a bucket for every use.
You should build a Spidery - you will need a mechanism
You should order at the Spidery to spin thread from silkmilk.

It works for me.

If your Farmer's Workshop are clogged with normal milk from other animals or with normal Drowspider's venom, try using burrows and a dedicated Farmer's Workshop only for the Giant Drowspiders.

EDIT: spelling and a clarification

EDIT 2:  Hellz was (sort of) right. Silkmilk production can get stuck sometimes, at least if you use dfhack labor managers (as I do).
If that happens:
put your milking on repeat; activate workflow; set workflow to produce "any milk" - any quantity will do, even the default one.
That should periodically force the labor to start, and it unlocked milk production for me in every occasion the problem happened.
When it happens, though, it appears to happen to milk too, so I'm quite sure it has not to do with silkmilk for itself, but possibly with the priority of the milking labors being low.
It didn't happen to me while not using dfhack (I seldom play without, I must admit) and I bet (but can't prove) that using the manager could help with the problem if it presents itself - it never did to me, but I do play (and test) with dfhack most of the time.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: SQman on December 24, 2018, 02:28:09 pm
First of all, I've played with this mod for quite a while now, and I gotta say it's fantastic. Thank you for keeping it up to date.
As a player, I can confirm that silkmilk reactions are working just fine.

Second, the [c] screen tells me I can't send raids without a leader, but not a single noble seems to count as a leader. If there's a token for this, it should be on the house priestess.

Third, a few tiny oversights:
-outpost administrator is called "outpot administrator"
-rothe give sheep milk
-giant drowspider venom is called "cave drow spider venom"
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on December 25, 2018, 06:44:54 pm
Thanks for the feedback SQman!

On your points:
third of all, you are definitely right.
Version 0.8 to be released when ready will have your corrections in, thank you. That part is (and actually was, I promise!) already corrected

Second: I think that the problem could be with the lack of on site [RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY] and [RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_GOALS] tokens on [SITE] positions.
I agree that both should be tried on the House Priestess.
With those modification I was able to designate a raid - tomorrow I will check more thoroughly, assigning squads and seeing if they actually go.

First: thanks for the support and help!

These changes might warrant a closer and smaller 0.8 release than I thought - I am playing with some ideas but we will see if it matures on me.

EDIT: Ok, I was still awake in the night so I quickly packed a 0.7b version, with the corrections SQman pointed as needed, one that he didn't point out and the House Priestess tweaks that should be permitting full use of the raid feature.

EDIT2: Well, while I am still the last poster, I added a new update, 0.7c, with my first tileset added to the ones designed for Rhenaya back in the day: more will follow, updating the mod's looks to the 32x32 age.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on January 17, 2019, 04:11:22 pm
0.8 out, with 32x32 pixel full profession tilesets for the drow and sets for all of the creatures in the mod.
Also, new reactions for easier venom, and some tweak on Quaggoth rage proneness (now they should rage out sometime) and on the creature availability: less surface stuff clogging the drow roster.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Vordak on January 17, 2019, 04:50:05 pm
I think with your talent and great productivity it is necessary to do not an alternative to one civ of elves, but different tribes-kind. In a sense, your version and the version based on ferric elves are not mutually exclusive.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on January 18, 2019, 02:14:16 pm
Hello Vordak!

Thanks for the compliments, they are worth a lot coming from you!
I'm sure you recognized your swords (whole and in pieces) and weapons, and color palettes all around "my" elves (and quaggoths, and driders...) Let me take the occasion to publicly thank you for your work too, and for being so helpful and sharing to newbies asking questions to you, it was a big help for me.

I totally agree, nothing is mutually exclusive!
I feel that I need to work on these drow personality a bit more: more creatures, some magic, their goddess and her demons... ...while I learn how to, trying to copy from the best as I did with your graphic, and Meph's and ObsidianSoul's and Denzi's).

The one thing that worries me is the productivity, lol, I should have less time now that the holydays are well over. At least I hope so... ;)
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Kat on January 19, 2019, 03:42:31 pm
It's really nice to see this is still being worked on, and seems to work well with the current version of DF.

It's really good for there to be multiple kinds of civilisation entities for the different races - I've been doing a bit of that for my own stuff, different types of human civilisations for temperate & tropical biomes, with different weapon and clothing fashions, that kind of thing.

I recently had a thought for my own personal modifications, related to how foreign scholars and such often come to visit the libraries that my drow build. Elf scholars and entertainers and so on. My thought being that these citizens, if they drink particular drow beverages, might be transformed from an elf to a drow, and thus eligible to marry a natural drow. I'm not really familiar with a lot of the background for drow, so don't know if that's something that features there or not.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on January 22, 2019, 10:12:00 am
Actually Kat, there is something about elves being transformed in drow in some parts of the source material!
It is usually linked to curses linked to evil acts, if I remember correctly, but things can be adapted for different medias.
Dungeons and dragons as a medium to tell stories has clearer ideas of where to put their characters in an ethical scale than dwarf fortress has, I think
So maybe dwarf fortress could work with different ideas too.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: bernard2012 on February 20, 2019, 11:21:18 pm
When one of my animals spotted a unicorn thief; as soon I click on the unicorn my game crash. Are unicorns suppose to be stealing let alone being a empire.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Arkenor on February 25, 2019, 03:43:44 am
Using your mod with Masterwork, some of your creatures are making their Succubus pet-adding scripts freak out (which stopped when I deactivated succubi), and also making the dfhack exportlegends script crash (before and after I deactivated Succubi), and try as I might I cannot figure out why. I don't really care about the wellbeing of the succubi, but the exportlegends not working is a bit pesky.

I split your creatures into separate files to see who was responsible, and it is the Drider, the Drow Spider, the Giant Drow Spider, and, heartbreakingly, the Rothe.
The Drow themselves, the Quaggoth, and the Riding Lizards are fine.

The error messages aren't super helpful, talking about not being able to read "Cannot read field vector<caste_raw>.1:index out of bounds." but after experimentation with swapping Llama caste section into the Rothe, I'm not convinced it's actually  the caste data that's at fault.

At any rate, it's all a bit above my paygrade, and I hope someone more knowledgeable can solve the mystery.

Edit: OK, that mystery was in fact incredibly obvious. Meph had added some of Rhenaya's creatures to Masterwork, and kept the same IDs which presumably was confusing the heck out of all manner of things.





@Bernard2012 From my investigations through the Drow mod files, trying to solve my issues, I am almost certain that it does not turn unicorns into thieves. Was it maybe being used as a mount by a thief? I've never seen a mounted thief, and it seems counter-productive for sneaking, but could be possible. No idea why it crashed you.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: SQman on February 25, 2019, 06:02:55 am
When one of my animals spotted a unicorn thief; as soon I click on the unicorn my game crash. Are unicorns suppose to be stealing let alone being a empire.

This sounds very much like a raw duplication issue, but this mod shouldn't cause those even with other mods. Were you playing with any other mods?
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on February 27, 2019, 10:30:51 am
@Arkenor

Hello Arkenor, and thanks for investing time in discovering what's working and what's not here.
Meph's Masterwork once included Rhenaya's work, there may be some duplications.
As I am working on some creatures' revamp, I hope to be able to prevent at least some of those duplications by changing the files - Riding Lizards were Giant Lizards in Rhenaya's old files, I changed the name because of the appearence of the giant animal variations.
She choose a single creature to represent surface-ghost and deep rothe, as she chose one for both the four legged and two legged riding lizards versions. She used had the drow use the common domestic animals and there was no mean to tailor the creature considered domestic by each civilization back then.
There are now means to do so, and in the next version I will include some more underdark creature: that will be useful for this because separating the rothe in surface-ghost-deep rothen will result in differently named files for each of them, preventing conflicts with other mods still using the original Rhenaya's files, without needing any work on the other modder's part nor on the final user.
Thank you for both identifying a problem and finding a solution (that also goes in a direction I was already going!)
Changing at least the the names of the spider too could be rather easy, I will see if that's the best - for now I was struck considering how to best fill of meat the shrieker (represented as creatures) and to make the sword spiders able to hurt their enemies with their swords.

I have no idea about how to tackle Succubus's scripts though, maybe you can ask Boltgun himself both on its succubus thread in the Masterwork forum page or in the general modding forum, he has another one for its standalone Succubus version. It is a while I don't play his mod with drow in it, I must admit, and I never played succubus in Masterwork.

@SQman and @Bernard2012
I really don't know what the issue can be with the unicorn: if you are playing with vanilla files and this mod only, the unicorn should not be an item thief, nor spawn 'empires'. This mod doesn't touch vanilla files, including the creature_standard.txt file that relates to unicorns.
Thanks for lending a hand SQman!
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on March 01, 2019, 06:36:31 am
Also: version 0.9.0 is out, rushed a bit to let you see what I was saying about the creatures in the last post.

In the near and not so near future, I'd like to add some more creatures, some class system for the clerical powers (and other 'drow' things), some more reaction for dressing outfits, a new building, the goddess Lolth herself, dangerous rituals, some graphical improvement on the plant and objects too...

But don't know when, if and in what measure I will be able to deliver - but I'm working on learning how to.

In the mean time, getting to a final version of the shriekers and sword spiders will be a priority, as well as cleaning up the files and giving them a more readable order.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Arkenor on March 02, 2019, 09:59:16 am
@Arkenor

I have no idea about how to tackle Succubus's scripts though, maybe you can ask Boltgun himself both on its succubus thread in the Masterwork forum page or in the general modding forum, he has another one for its standalone Succubus version. It is a while I don't play his mod with drow in it, I must admit, and I never played succubus in Masterwork.


Those script errors went away once I pruned the duplicate creature entries, so you should be good. Except I think you're still doubling up with Meph on RHENAYAS_DRIDER. Though that could be a result of all the moving things around I did! The new animals look awesome.

I'm using a modified good version of the drow for the surface entity, the Moon Drow, based on the followers of Eilistraee from the Forgotten Realms, as I wanted a Winter trading partner and there's already plenty of folks trying to kill me in Masterwork :D. I had a vague recollection of another major mod repurposing Rhenaya's drow in this way (Possibly Legends of the Forlorn?).It's always lovely to see them arrive :D The regular evil ones are limited to a subterranean threat. Here, if they're any use to you or someone else.    https://www.dropbox.com/s/wclsksa8wuxjznz/moon%20drow.zip?dl=0
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on March 05, 2019, 09:55:41 pm
@Arkenor, thanks!
I will take a look to the moon drow, I will try to steal what I can ehm, take inspiration from you!
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Arkenor on March 06, 2019, 12:14:05 pm
It's mostly borrowed from you anyway. I just changed their ethics and personalities. Gave them appropriate spheres for followers of Ellistraee (Moon, Sky, Song, Dance, Beauty and Mercy). Lost the Driders. They kept spiders, but are happy to use them as beasts of burden. Still got the Quaggoth and animal men, but they're free rather than slaves. And added a few buildings and reactions from Masterwork. The Gemforge and gemcutter in particular struck me as appropriate.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on March 11, 2019, 05:31:13 pm
snip

"I" have a fricking submod! Celebration!!!  :D 8)
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Hellzs on October 13, 2020, 12:57:40 am
Been a while since I was on here, thought I would drop by to see if your still keeping this up to date and if your have thoughts about the steam update.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: SeiggrainHart on October 26, 2020, 05:11:49 pm
Yes, I too would like to know if this is up-to date as I've been thinking of adding Drow/Dark Elves to my own mod...
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Hellzs on October 27, 2020, 11:36:41 pm
He could be taking a brake from the forms
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Mediterraneo on November 15, 2020, 11:17:07 am
Been a while since I was on here, thought I would drop by to see if your still keeping this up to date and if your have thoughts about the steam update.

Hello everybody: I'm still doing something on this every now and then, but definitely less then before - I have nothing to say about the steam release yet, I am less active here than I was.
The thing I wanted to improve was the class/positions system, we will see if and when it will be ready.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Hellzs on November 28, 2020, 10:55:06 pm
sweet! overjoyed to hear that your still working on it and i fully  understand taking it easy with DF since your can blink and get burned out with the game/forms/mod updates.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: SQman on July 23, 2021, 03:40:27 am
It's been some time since Mediterraneo was last active, so I've been thinking, would it be okay if I made and posted an unofficial update? Mediterraneo did a good job maintaining the mod, but it still needs some balancing and tidying up.

Here's what I would do:

Drow creature:
-reduce the size of all castes to 60k,
-do away with natural skills, and replace them with slightly increased learn speed for certain skills

Other creatures:
-make spiders into proper pets, but also make their meat cause long-lasting debuffs to drow, maybe even a small chance to turn into a drider
-review sizes. Rothe should be smaller than cow, but larger than sheep; pack lizard should be huge but slow-growing,
-make blade spider chitin sharp;
-remove shriekers from pet list; I always found immobile pets a bit wonky;
-add scorrow, an alternative curse that turns drow into scorpion monsters;
-make spider venom a bit more potent; maybe cause more bleeding;
-albino drider castes;

Items:
-remove most of the drow items and replace them with vanilla ones;
-add a smaller version of the two-handed sword usable by drow and dwarves;
-buff the scourge of fangs a bit (?);
-turn the pair of katars into a single katar item

Interactions:
-nerf faerie fire A LOT;
-dancing lights for rothe (?);
-make cursed drow turn into driders of appropriate caste;

Entity:
-see if drow still have trouble expanding, and fix it;
-make trolls never appear in drow civs. This is because trolls don't have value, and to promote the use of quaggoths;
-fix the matriarch positions so there are three instead of four;
-do something with the high matriarch position. It just doesn't really fit thematically;
-add more spheres so drow names are more varied;

My update would be a substantial nerf to the drow in fort mode, but that's what they deserve.

Should I so this? It may go against Rhenaya's or Mediterraneo's vision in some way, but I will explicitly say that this is by no mean a official release. Besides, the link in the first post will still be there.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Enemy post on July 23, 2021, 12:53:10 pm
I wouldn't mind it. I just like that people have been keeping Rhenaya's work alive for so long.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: Kat on August 01, 2021, 03:01:07 am
-albino drider castes;

-remove most of the drow items and replace them with vanilla ones;
-add a smaller version of the two-handed sword usable by drow and dwarves;

-see if drow still have trouble expanding, and fix it;
-make trolls never appear in drow civs.

albino driders ? Interesting...

There are a lot of drow weapons that I've never used, either from Rhenaya's original.
What I've thought of though, is something that I've done in my own modding efforts - split entities into different groups based on biomes, and allocate some, but not all, of the items to them. Like... I made the human civ into 3 civs, and changed their biomes, so you'd get a temperate human civ, a tropical one etc. And then restricted human turbans and scimitars to the tropical one, for example. So that there'd be variation in the kinds of human civs that you'd encounter.
Perhaps something similar could be done there. Split the drow entity into biome variants, and give some weapons to one drow civ, different weapons to another.

The expansion thing, I thought was solved ? it was to do with their biome preferences ? Unfortunately, subterranean preferences don't work too well, so what I did in my own changes, was to change their biome prefs to those of dwarfs, and then the drow civs would endure and expand. Possibly not ideally fitting with the lore, but it does at least work with the current mechanics.

Trolls, yeah. I've not been able to understand yet, how the animal restrictions work, and how to stop e.g. goblins from having drow lizards. So sorting that out would be good.
Title: Re: [44.12] Rhenaya's Drow, updated
Post by: SQman on August 03, 2021, 12:18:22 pm
Albino driders are no big deal, just recolored castes for albino drow to turn into when they eat too much spider meat.

I don't want to make any more civs right now. Sure, there are the scorpion-worshipping jungle drow of Eberron, though I don't think they are worth inserting into the mod.
The weapons are good as they are, but there's no need to specify that they are drow-made, same for clothes.

Goblins use animals from the first cavern layer and the evil ones. Lizards are evil for some reason. I'll remove the EVIL tokens so goblins don't bring lizards anymore. Same for spiders and quaggoths. Drow should be able to use either only drow pets, or cave pets other than trolls. Beak dogs don't fit drow all that well.

Expansion problems might have been fixed, I don't know for sure. Once I finish working on entities, I'll do some test runs. Meanwhile:

Spoiler: Changes so far: (click to show/hide)

Stay tuned for more info on Rhenaya's Drow, unofficial branch! Coming soon in a separate thread once it's ready for release.