Bay 12 Games Forum

Finally... => Roll To Dodge => Forum Games and Roleplaying => Einsteinian Roulette => Topic started by: Ozarck on August 19, 2018, 08:43:21 am

Title: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on August 19, 2018, 08:43:21 am

I've been batting the idea of turning the Einsteinian Roulette game into a novel for a while.

So I am going to give it a shot. I am writing it up in this google doc (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1o_GY4hw5SbatnWlRByp4MT5nClbSE12TAwgoVRKg9to/edit?usp=sharing)

Feel free to stop by to post comments, and feel free to discuss all things novel related here in this thread.

PW's discord (https://discord.gg/YfEmeQ)

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Imic on August 22, 2018, 01:49:49 pm

  :o

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on January 21, 2019, 11:56:45 pm

been a while, but I am starting to add content again.

if you have a character in this game, this thread is a good place to describe them and anything you want me to take into account regarding them, including if you want your character left out of the book, or if you want their name changed or basically anything else you want me to pay attention to.

I won't promise i'll get it right, if I even get that far at all, but the more feedback I get, the more likely I will keep pushing through.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Leodanny on January 22, 2019, 01:38:40 pm

Can I be the proofreader?

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: NJW2000 on January 22, 2019, 01:46:33 pm

Any character I played was fundamentally a coward, though this sometimes forced them into acting recklessly in a way that could be mistaken for courage.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on January 22, 2019, 05:28:14 pm

Quote from: Leodanny on January 22, 2019, 01:38:40 pm

Can I be the proofreader?

Sure, proofread away. I hope others will as well. Bear in mind that I am not putting out a polished form any time soon. My first goal is to just get content - to write and write, even if it is bad or inconsistent. Hopefully it won't be terrible enough to require major reworks, but I'm sure there will be tons of editing to do.

Quote from: NJW2000 on January 22, 2019, 01:46:33 pm

Any character I played was fundamentally a coward, though this sometimes forced them into acting recklessly in a way that could be mistaken for courage.

thank you. I will keep this in mind.

---

Leodanny's request regarding proofreading reminds me that I should put out a sort of road map for how I plan to write.
This is a rough draft of that road map:

• Generic focus of the book.
  We've discussed three options for this: storycentric, character centric, and episodic. Each has it's positive and negative aspects.
  
  • episodic writing would preserve some of the mission oriented feel of the game, and would probably focus on the curiosities encountered and individual mission highlights over character or plot.
  • Character oriented focuses on the personalities involved and their development throughout the game. The trouble here is tat characters come and go, and I'd have to pick one or a few to be the central focus - probably Steve, Milno, and one or two other long term characters introduced later.
  • Story Mode gives the book a larger structure within to work and a flow - a sense of movement. Characters and curiosities, and some of the unique writing might fall to the side though. This is the method i intend to follow howver, as I feel it's the best framework for a novel of this kind. There will be important, major characters, and the missions will serve as the path through which those characters journey. It's more about degree of influence on the writing decisions rather than considering one aspect the absolute and the other aspects disposable.
• Important Themes
  this is basically just what kind of mood is the book setting
  
  • 'Moral' nature of the universe.
    The in game universe was a sort of dark grey, but with a strong undertone of hope. Things were falling apart, governments were corrupt or inept, people died in droves with little concern given to their lives at all. Yet, the protags fought through it all, often living in spite of the odds, or even in spite of reality itself, and something positive came out of the mouth of destruction. This is my interpretatuion anyway, and i hope to keep that flavor, though I personally tend toward a less dark themed universe.
  • level of absurdity.
    the game allowed, even encouraged a lot of silliness. I intend to tone this down a bit so the uninitiated reader can take the story and characters seriously. I do hope to keep the dark humor and some of the wackiness preserved though. I'd like th ebook to be funny, though I am not sure I'll be able to preserve that spontanious lighheartedness, and worry that my attempts at humor will fall flat. In the end, if how I handle the humor doesn't work, I'll probably lower the comedy value to keep it from being unpleasant, confusing, or tedious.
  • I had something here, but it has slipped my mind. I'll edit this in later if I remember.
• Writing Phases
  
  • outline the story and develop the characters
    this part is done, mostly.I'm more or less keeping the basic outline of the game's progression and the basic crew roster
  • get content written
    this is the stage We are currently on.
    
    • here it's more about taking the events of the game and interpreting them in a prose format. I'm less concerned about grammar and flow, character development and personality, or descriptions of the settings or technology/magic involved. I am mostly trying to a) get into the habit of adding to this text consistently, and b) trying to get the skeleton of the story set up. We can add the meat once the skeleton is there. of course, some bits of meat will come in this phase as well, but overall this phase is going to be bare bones.
    • with 27-30 missions, If I average one mission a month, we can expect this stage to take roughly 2 1/2 years.
  [li]Add the meat
  Some of this will undoubtedly be done well before I finish writing the skeleton of the story. As we go, I'm sure certain points of interest will catch the imagination and I'll sidetrack into soem character development, or setting stuff, or minor events. But hte primary meat filling part I intend to work on once we've gotten the bare bones of the story in. I'm not sure how well I'll stick to this separation, but that's okay, s long as content gets added.
• Review and reaction
  Once the main lines of the story are put togetehr and I've got a decent amount of content, I intend to take a break and have us all review what has gone in to this point. obviously we'll be reviewing and discussing along the way, but this will be the starting point for a more formal editing. We'll discuss what works and what doesn't, where we might need to make major changes (hopefully not TOO major) - what needs cut, what was left out, where astory arc needs refined, rewritten, or discarded, where a character needs more properly fleshed out (or properly skeletized).
  This stage will probably be a lot of work, and will feel much slower and less interesting than the content writing part (unless my pace remains as low as it has been). But this stage is pretty important and can make or break a work of fiction.
• mechanical editing
  Once all the major work is done, and only tweaks are left to the writing, we look at grammar, syntax, spelling, word choice, and so forth. Time to polish this ... work of art.
• ?
  Once all this is done, we consider what to do with this steaming pile of awesome. present it to a publisher? sell it in installments as a web novel? offer it for free, with donations accepted? bury it and never speak of it again? The possibilities are endless.

[/li]
[/list]

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Kedly on January 25, 2019, 12:50:06 am

Dude! Ozarck this is awesome!

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on January 25, 2019, 03:00:05 am

Thanks! that word of encouragement motivates me to add content! Gonna get to that tonight, at least a paragraph or two.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Radio Controlled on January 28, 2019, 03:36:13 am

“Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter."

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on January 28, 2019, 11:47:14 am

Well, okay, but the newsletter is mostly about pickles.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: TankKit on January 29, 2019, 08:15:00 am

Oh hey, this is still going on. Sweet.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on January 29, 2019, 08:50:37 am

Five and a half pages long so far. I'll add some tonight, after I sleep a bit. Feel free to check out the google doc and make comments. Bear in mind it is still very much 'in alpha' :P

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Xantalos on February 05, 2019, 01:45:52 am

w

whaaaaa

interest happen

I feel like if you're going to have any one character as the person we follow for most of the novel then Milno's probably the best option for that, he was pretty much the longest-serving PC, one of the only ones (or maybe the only one) to ever get to 10 missions completed, and had more of a character arc than most, one that ended up involving the Armory Master at that. Plus his dry snark and practicality make for a good fit with the wacky yet bleak tone of the ER-verse.

Though perhaps a good way to structure it would be having each mission follow one or more viewpoints depending on how many teams the participants were split up into, but focusing on the most influential character for each mission - ie perhaps Faith for the first mission since she did that bodysurfing thing, someone else for the next one, etc etc.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Leodanny on February 05, 2019, 01:30:59 pm

Ya mean Feyri?

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Xantalos on February 05, 2019, 02:06:42 pm

...yes. I never mixed those names up before, especially during important missions when it was probably a good idea to know people's names.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: NAV on February 05, 2019, 05:39:53 pm

You could focus on a different protagonist character for each mission, whoever had the most relevance there but hasn't been focused on yet.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on February 10, 2019, 07:07:03 am

Quote from: Xantalos on February 05, 2019, 01:45:52 am

w

whaaaaa

interest happen

I feel like if you're going to have any one character as the person we follow for most of the novel then Milno's probably the best option for that, he was pretty much the longest-serving PC, one of the only ones (or maybe the only one) to ever get to 10 missions completed, and had more of a character arc than most, one that ended up involving the Armory Master at that. Plus his dry snark and practicality make for a good fit with the wacky yet bleak tone of the ER-verse.

Though perhaps a good way to structure it would be having each mission follow one or more viewpoints depending on how many teams the participants were split up into, but focusing on the most influential character for each mission - ie perhaps Faith for the first mission since she did that bodysurfing thing, someone else for the next one, etc etc.

Milno was suggested as the main protag by someone else also (not by Caellath). I'm sure he'll figure prominently, especially early on, but he'll likely fade a bit into the background toward the end. I believe Caellath specifically held back with him toward the end so other people could have the limelight.

Also, currently I have the body surfing bit edited out, but Tiruin commented on that in Discord, with a touch of disappointment, so I might edit it back in. I'm trying not to be so wacky as to lose readers who are unaware of the story, butI should probably focus more on you guys' story than worrying about what some mythical reader might want.

Quote from: NAV on February 05, 2019, 05:39:53 pm

You could focus on a different protagonist character for each mission, whoever had the most relevance there but hasn't been focused on yet.

This is a good idea, and one that I've toyed with a bit. I'll probably do a variation of this. Otherwise it will be a collection of short stories rather than a novel. Making it a collection of stories might not be the worst idea though.

Edit: Also, this first chapter has been rather experimental and I realize that I failed to do some planning before writing - I need to start doing outlines for hte chapters before I start, and I need to have some notes on the characters' persopnalities set up so I can keep each person consistent, and so that more of the player character's personality comes through rather than just my own.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Xantalos on February 10, 2019, 01:05:09 pm

...there's a discord?

Probably the wrong thing to catch in that reply.

As far as editing the overly-wacky actions and whatnot, I'd say that going that route with a lot of the on-ship stuff could safely be done, and random RP actions that never actually got run by piecewise, but actual processed actions in the game itself should probably be let in, at least so long as they weren't completely mission-irrelevant.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on February 10, 2019, 08:26:05 pm

Yeah, I should probably leave more in, and see how the overall feel of the story goes.

There's a discord, but it's not primarily for discussing the novel. it's PW's discord channel, for ... well, for us degenerates to hang out and be degenerate.
I don't currently have permissions to link an invite, but I can probably get one pretty quick.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Xantalos on February 10, 2019, 10:10:20 pm

Quote from: Ozarck on February 10, 2019, 08:26:05 pm

Yeah, I should probably leave more in, and see how the overall feel of the story goes.

There's a discord, but it's not primarily for discussing the novel. it's PW's discord channel, for ... well, for us degenerates to hang out and be degenerate.
I don't currently have permissions to link an invite, but I can probably get one pretty quick.

Well, it depends I think. Like on mission ... 12 or something, when we had to defend Hephaestus against the forces of the UWM and everyone got split up into 4 or 5-person squads but there were still well over 30 people participating at once (and probably multiple people doing secret actions - I know at the very least that I made my secret backup clone during the mission that I later used during the epilogue to become the enigmatic plague on sapient society that I eventually became), so some of the more extraneous stuff during missions like those could likely be cut or just happen offscreen, in order to form a more cohesive portrayal of events.

Ah, I see. That'd be up to the people in the discord itself, I think - I was fairly active in ER, but I haven't really substantially played in any other PW games save for Infinite Heavens post-epilogue. If they wanna let me in on that merit, then that'd be good, but if not, no biggie either. Mayhaps float the question to them, if that's alright? Can't promise that I'd be active in the actual chat ... at all, but eh. Mayhaps.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on February 10, 2019, 10:43:10 pm

Discord link

https://discord.gg/YfEmeQ (https://discord.gg/YfEmeQ)

I added it to the OP as well

There's no reason you should be excluded from the discord, Xan. They keep me around, and I'm objectively terrible.

As for extraneous stuff, yeah,, some things will undoubtedly be cut out for the sake of coherence and not getting bogged down in too much detail. Prominent PCs will likely get a little extra attention, especially as they affect the end game, so your secret clones will almost certainly be written in. I don't have access to game secrets - neither GM's secrets nor player secrets, so whatever of that people want in the book will need to be unveiled for me.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: syvarris on February 17, 2019, 09:43:24 pm

Huh.  This isn't dead.  Truth be told, I had been completely certain you were drunk or something when you made this thread, and that it'd quietly die pretty much as soon as you sobered up.  Guess not.  Uh.  Good luck, I guess, I certainly wouldn't have the will to complete a project like this.

One thing, I highly recommend that you pursue an episodic nature, following the missions.  Most missions had very clear plotlines, and obviously they had nice neat starts and finales.  It also just gives a very nice structure to the story; main arcs (missions), which would be more serious and focused, with short fluffier segments between to develop the characters (on ship bits).  It would have a pleasing tempo to it, if done well.

I also feel that you should really try to include most stuff that isn't just completely worthless, even if it's tonally inappropriate or jarring.  When you're done with the drafting in, uh, three years, the project will likely have evolved in a different direction.  Maybe it'll be more comedic, more tragic, certain characters will feel more or less important, or something else entirely--regardless, you'll have a better idea of what should be cut after you've reached that point.  You'll likely also have quite a bit of feedback from readers on what early parts they liked, and which they didn't, which will be invaluable.


...I can't resist asking.  What, if anything, will you do with Tinker?  I'd presume it'll fade into the background and become just a minor side-element that's mentioned offhandedly, but I'm curious all the same.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on February 18, 2019, 08:25:57 am

I had been batting around the idea of making ER into a novel for a while before i started this thread. I hesitated for a few reasons, including the same concern over having the resolve to finish it, eventually. It's a big task and I'm already much slower to write than I'd hoped to be by this point. But I'm dragging along nonetheless.
 
I might very well switch to an episodic structure for the framework of the story. it's almost going to do that naturally on it's own anyway - most of the action will be concentrated within the missions, which mostly happened one at a time anyway, up until close to the end.

After having written as 'much' as I have, I agree that including material, even if it's somewhat out of place, is better. As you say, easier to edit out alter than to add in.

I hadn't really thought about tinker as a separate entity to be attended, really. I figured I'd just include it as it affected the characters involved - like, if someone improved or designed a weapon or item, it would get a mention. And Hephaestus would be a thing, I'm sure. Worldbuilding-wise, it seems significant. So, yeah, there would be an R&D department once that came into play.

As for armor thickness testing and long chains of debates and discussions ... well, if it amused some of hte players, I could add a lot of that as an appendix or something.

One other major thing I am considering is opening up the writing effort so that others can contribute more than simple edits. I started with just myself as able to add content for a few reasons, but I've always been open to the idea of content coming from others, at least to an extent. after all, it WAS a group game, and I was not a major player except in one aborted mission.

Thank you for your encouragement and interest. I do plan on adding some content over the next couple nights. Hopefully I'll be finished with the very rough draft of Chapter 1 by Wednesday or so. Maybe get started on chapter two this weekend.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Eschar on June 04, 2019, 02:08:34 pm

PTW. I want to read this.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on June 11, 2019, 12:27:03 am

good to know! I'll try to start working on chapter two soon. It's gonna be slow going unless i quit my job or something, though.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Tylui on April 30, 2020, 04:39:46 pm

Poooooke.

EDIT: An extra 'o' for each 2-months that passed since last update. I really hope you find the passion for this project again <3

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Eschar on April 30, 2020, 06:19:26 pm

What or who is "Tinker"?

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Radio Controlled on April 30, 2020, 06:25:28 pm

We do not use that word around here anymore, this is a safe space.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Eschar on April 30, 2020, 06:42:09 pm

Okay. Why? And why will it be only a fragment of the book?

Tinker tinker little star...

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: NAV on April 30, 2020, 08:21:48 pm

Do you want to read a novel, or some sort of deranged disjointed technical manual full of bad ideas, most of which never come close to leaving the drawing board?

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Devastator on April 30, 2020, 10:07:54 pm

Tinker was designed for the sole purpose of entertaining people who'd rather not interact with the game, by tasking them with the goal of escalating the degree of advantage beyond the extant; that of a modern infantry platoon versus two guys with fire-hardened spears.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Yoink on April 30, 2020, 10:14:55 pm

'Member Charro's blade-tophat?   

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Radio Controlled on May 01, 2020, 05:51:34 am

Quote from: Yoink on April 30, 2020, 10:14:55 pm

'Member Charro's blade-tophat?   

I imagine it looked something like this:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/DeliciousWellmadeFoal-size_restricted.gif)

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on May 01, 2020, 06:43:09 am

Quote from: Tylui on April 30, 2020, 04:39:46 pm

Poooooke.

EDIT: An extra 'o' for each 2-months that passed since last update. I really hope you find the passion for this project again <3

Hmm, hah. hooo. Okay I'll give it a go this weekend. I have a 3 day weekend so I could get a few paragraphs in.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Xantalos on May 01, 2020, 07:25:25 pm

I never went into Tinker but I honestly have to give piecewise retroactive admiration for somehow keeping up with all the ridiculous shit that went on in there.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Eschar on May 01, 2020, 08:43:40 pm

Quote from: NAV on April 30, 2020, 08:21:48 pm

Do you want to read a novel, or some sort of deranged disjointed technical manual full of bad ideas, most of which never come close to leaving the drawing board?

Don't threaten me with a good time!

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on June 02, 2020, 07:36:41 am

(https://imgur.com/EWf8AoZ.png)

I have written about four paragraphs this morning. I hope to wrap this chapter up today and open up chapter two. Ah, but I'll still need to do the on ship stuff. Maybe call that intermission, or something.

So I hope to finish up the first mission and open up the on ship intermission.
I'm considering letting one or more others edit the doc as well, for grammar and possibly for style or to add details (like who says what whe nI write a bunch of dialogue without distinguishing between people, or giving Steve a consistent font and style, separate from the others.).

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: NAV on June 02, 2020, 05:49:59 pm

If dialogue is copied directly from the game, then this book will have a strange dialogue style with characters exchanging monologues back and forth during gunfights and other fast paced situations.

Title: Re: E_R Novel in the works
Post by: Ozarck on June 02, 2020, 05:53:06 pm

It's not, though I base the dialogue off the game dialogue. If I ever get enough of this written to be worthwhile there will be a lot of editing to do.