Welcome to this crazy madness of a game. Players who sign up will publicly list two powers from the MafiaWiki (https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Category:Roles). These will then be randomized and handed out to the players and the mafia team randomly chosen. By the nature of the game, it's chaos. So I wonder how you will handle things.B3 is about to begin, and the end of the world ticks down. Are you ready?
Of Note, Mafia have a shared kill. Hammers ae in effect, and the days are 72 hours, not counting Sat/Sun on the weekends. Nights are 24 Hours or once all actions have been submitted, even if that action is to do nothing.
TricMagic has no responsibility for game balance. There will be no bastard rules or subtext.
Whenever a player is killed they will lose one of their abilities.
Please link URLs to the roles you pick, it saves time.
I did underline 3 Roles, not 2. So more craziness.Of course! I've amended my post.
[placeholder... role submissions forthcoming. As this will be my first game with this group I will ask how BM this is going to be before entering submissions, from what I have seen from casual perusal, you(plr) tend not to go too overboard with thing like TFPTSLBOIA, but how does this group (or really @Tricmagic as mod) feel about things like Miller, Watcher, Jester, Bus Driver, Investigator-With-Sanity-Issues, etc.?]Community wise, almost anything goes. Death Millers and such are confined to games explicitly labeled bastard-mod, and generally internal sanity effects are used rarely (things like being an Insane Cop), but external ones (like being a Miller or a Framer) can be more common.
I probably sign up for this eventually, but picking out three roles that haven't been chosen before is, like, work, which I don't want to do.^
I probably sign up for this eventually, but picking out three roles that haven't been chosen before is, like, work, which I don't want to do.^
Spoiler: Previous Roles (click to show/hide)
Which means that Fallacy, you've got to pick something other than Flagbearer as it was in the last game.
I probably sign up for this eventually, but picking out three rolesthat haven't been chosen beforeis, like, work, which I don't want to do.
Which means that Fallacy, you've got to pick something other than Flagbearer as it was in the last game.Ugggggh
I just realized Lazy doesn't work, uh...Lazy Tracker?The role modifiers should work, as there's a surplus of power roles anyway, but I guess it depends how Tric wants to run it.
Easy, 'Double' modifier allows two night action; double-voting is a day power. They don't interact.
A Double role may act twice each night (or Day in the case of a Day role).((Emphasis added))
A multivoter is not a Day Action. It is a Role Modifier.Easy, 'Double' modifier allows two night action; double-voting is a day power. They don't interact.Quote from: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=DoubleA Double role may act twice each night (or Day in the case of a Day role).((Emphasis added))
Doublevoter can be used as a role modifier or as a role in its own right. It allows the player to cast the equivalent of two votes.
((Emphasis added))QuoteDoublevoter can be used as a role modifier or as a role in its own right. It allows the player to cast the equivalent of two votes.
A vote is simply a quantifiable expression of the desire to eliminate a player. Each player (barring exceptions like Doublevoter) has one vote, which they may cast for players at will.
Given I've apparently caught a cold from someone, next week. Anyone got recommendations on which day?Nah, I just think a cutoff time for signups would force people to signup sooner.
KK.Given I've apparently caught a cold from someone, next week. Anyone got recommendations on which day?Nah, I just think a cutoff time for signups would force people to signup sooner.
Do, uh, Friday or something.
Voting isn't an action.QuoteA vote is simply a quantifiable expression of the desire to eliminate a player. Each player (barring exceptions like Doublevoter) has one vote, which they may cast for players at will.
Roles are not the same things as actions. Having a role doesn't necessarily grant an action.
I'd say its just a logical inference... 'Doubler-modifier' does just that, modifies a role to have its effect, twice. Since Double-Voter is definitely a role, I'm not sure what all the semantics about actions-vs-roles is, except blatant IIoA...No, it says that it acts twice. This is done through actions. Thus, a role with Day actions could act twice, but a role with two votes wouldn't gain additional votes.
obviously, the only true answer is "however the mod decides to do it". That said, to answer my own specific question, I'd say Triple-Vote, as 'Doubler' would double the extra vote the role provides. I could see a point for the doubling of total votes, but unless its >12player game, Quad-vote would be massively OP and broken.
No, it says that it acts twice. This is done through actions. Thus, a role with Day actions could act twice, but a role with two votes wouldn't gain additional votes.To add to that: Conceivably, there could be a day action that doubles your vote, and how that interacts with being used twice would depend on how it's written; but that's not how the standard doublevoter power works.
I'd say its just a logical inference... 'Doubler-modifier' does just that, modifies a role to have its effect, twice. Since Double-Voter is definitely a role, I'm not sure what all the semantics about actions-vs-roles is, except blatant IIoA...No, it says that it acts twice. This is done through actions. Thus, a role with Day actions could act twice, but a role with two votes wouldn't gain additional votes.
obviously, the only true answer is "however the mod decides to do it". That said, to answer my own specific question, I'd say Triple-Vote, as 'Doubler' would double the extra vote the role provides. I could see a point for the doubling of total votes, but unless its >12player game, Quad-vote would be massively OP and broken.
How do we know that the word “acts” in “acts twice” refers specifically to Mafia “Actions” and not to actions in the more general sense of the word?This isn't philosophy class. We're not debating the meaning of words. You're the one that needs to prove that those words mean what you say they mean because you'd be providing evidence if they did, which you've ceased to do. No evidence means your words mean nothing. And if your words are meaningless, they can be ignored as if you said nothing.
Night Actions, or Night Choices, are the role-related actions that players must send in and mods must accept. These range from Cops deciding who to investigate, to the Mafia deciding who they will send to kill whom, to X-Shot Commuters deciding whether they wish to use their action at all.
A Passive Role is one which has no ability to choose when or how to use their role abilities. Examples include Bulletproof, Bomb, and Lovers. Note that role modifiers such as X-Shot can sometimes change a passive role to an Active Role; this is known as an Activated role.
Its members post and vote like anyone else during the Day, and cannot act at Night without the help of power roles.A Townie can vote, or do you believe that a Townie is incapable of even the act of voting, posting, living, etc.?
...
"Townie" is a role designation for a pro-Town role that has no active ability.
<snip>
A Doublevoter is a Passive role. Your vote merely counts as two votes. If you were an activated Doublevoter, it is possible your vote could count as more, and thus a 1-Shot Doubler Doublevoter might get two or three or four votes, but we're not talking about that. We're talking about a Doubler Doublevoter, which could use two actions, but the act of voting is not in itself an action, on account of it not being an active role-related ability, as explained.
<snip>
Variations
Exactly how the double vote works is up to the moderator. Some examples include:
- A player may have two votes in play at a time, controlled with Vote: PLAYERNAME and Second Vote: PLAYERNAME.
- A player may cast a single vote, but it has the weight of two votes. If this is done, the moderator may explicitly list the vote twice, or just once. This is the variant listed in the Standard version, and it is a passive role.
- A player may cast a single vote inthread, but control an invisible second vote via PM. This is an untargeted active role.
It is not standardized whether a Doublevoter can change the number of votes required to eliminate. The Doublevoter is more powerful when the number of votes required to eliminate is based on the number of players in the game, rather than how many votes are in the game.
It is possible for a Doublevoter to simultaneously hammer two wagons if they are both at E-1 and the Doublevoter is on neither of them (and so is the only player not currently voting). What the moderator does in this scenario is not standardized simply because it's not a commonly plied strategy - if you're interested, contact your moderator to ask how they would handle such an occurrence.
A Doublevoter may lose their role abilities during ELo or MeLo.
How do we know that the word “acts” in “acts twice” refers specifically to Mafia “Actions” and not to actions in the more general sense of the word?This isn't philosophy class. We're not debating the meaning of words. You're the one that needs to prove that those words mean what you say they mean because you'd be providing evidence if they did, which you've ceased to do. No evidence means your words mean nothing. And if your words are meaningless, they can be ignored as if you said nothing.
Actually, worse. They can be used against you.
This is Mafia. Where's the evidence? Here's mine.
Acting (or action) is defined as using a role ability. Since Day is a modifier (https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Day_(modifier)), the following could be construed as the definition for action, since Day Actions and Night Actions can be assumed to differ only by their Phase:Quote from: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Night_ActionNight Actions, or Night Choices, are the role-related actions that players must send in and mods must accept. These range from Cops deciding who to investigate, to the Mafia deciding who they will send to kill whom, to X-Shot Commuters deciding whether they wish to use their action at all.Quote from: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=PassiveA Passive Role is one which has no ability to choose when or how to use their role abilities. Examples include Bulletproof, Bomb, and Lovers. Note that role modifiers such as X-Shot can sometimes change a passive role to an Active Role; this is known as an Activated role.
A Doublevoter is a Passive role. Your vote merely counts as two votes. If you were an activated Doublevoter, it is possible your vote could count as more, and thus a 1-Shot Doubler Doublevoter might get two or three or four votes, but we're not talking about that. We're talking about a Doubler Doublevoter, which could use two actions, but the act of voting is not in itself an action, on account of it not being an active role-related ability, as explained.
As furtherance of this, we can look at a Townie:Quote from: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=TownieIts members post and vote like anyone else during the Day, and cannot act at Night without the help of power roles.A Townie can vote, or do you believe that a Townie is incapable of even the act of voting, posting, living, etc.?
...
"Townie" is a role designation for a pro-Town role that has no active ability.
Thus, we can assume that voting does not fall into the category of acting in regards to your definition of Doubler, and thus, that acting/action refers to the set of role abilities that are actively used.
A_Curious_Cat
Fallacy fallacy (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_fallacy).No wonder nobody ever believes my arguments
Fallacy fallacy (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_fallacy).No wonder nobody ever believes my arguments
This game we're in the thread for is apparently starting today. Not too late to sign up.
I'm putting my auto-mafia game into signups imminently, to start next week, either way.
Ok well the next game should be beginner friendly, with no advanced roles.
When game
WHEN GAME!When game
Scream it louder.
WHEN GAME
WHEN GAME!Hey, I put Gate of Dreams up. Now you need to do the same thing, just with less magical girls.
Gelatin is mixed. Any recommendations on when it should be taken out of the fridge?WHEN GAME!Hey, I put Gate of Dreams up. Now you need to do the same thing, just with less magical girls.
WHENNNN GAMEEE
Literally ASAP?Gelatin is mixed. Any recommendations on when it should be taken out of the fridge?WHEN GAME!Hey, I put Gate of Dreams up. Now you need to do the same thing, just with less magical girls.
WHENNNN GAMEEE
Before webadict asks, game will start tomorrow, and first day should go to Wednesday.Goodie!
Everything pretty much done, but a slight breather from auto-mafia as they discuss that game, then this starts.
WHEN GAME!Hey, I put Gate of Dreams up. Now you need to do the same thing, just with less magical girls.
WHENNNN GAMEEE
To this end... should we mass claim?Yes.
Yes.Sheesh talk about getting the short end of the stick.
I appear to be a Blocked Bus Driver with a Post Restriction.
So don't expect me to do anything.
What's your restriction, Max?Well, it has to do with what I just posted.
you can kill Max if you think it's warranted.Wow. Harsh.
To any town vigs/arsonists/poisoners/etc, don't lose us the game by firing wildly. Consider holding fire until we're clear of the unjester threat. You can target me if you really want, and if no one counterclaims, you can kill Max if you think it's warranted.I plan to shoot/burn/poison whoever I want! Who would like to die?
zemaj, I'm sure you have something interesting to say.
I think we should mass-claim in this game to increase the likelihood of town winning and to make my suffering end quicker, because I won't be allowed to leave this game until it's over.To this end... should we mass claim?Yes.
I appear to be a Blocked Bus Driver with a Post Restriction.
So don't expect me to do anything.
I oppose a mass-claim on D1... if I wanted to break a game, I'd play more DF, not mafia on the B12 forums.Screw not breaking the game its already broken.
I just read an interesting article about the stabilization in rates of food-allergy occurence (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3236463/), if that helps any.Great stuff! That is interesting, unvote. Especially the data about allergy reactions being higher among higher educated parents. I remember reading that peanut allergies are way less common in Israel where children are much more likely to be exposed to them at a young age.
I oppose a mass-claim on D1... if I wanted to break a game, I'd play more DF, not mafia on the B12 forums.Pretty sure any setup should be balanced around not being broken by a mass claim; ultimately the main guard against the game becoming boring is for players to not make it boring. I think collectively solving the power interactions helps turn it from a random stuff-happens, to a big puzzle. It doesn't make it unfair for scum, who still have some wiggle room, as only King for definite (and maybe Dark Creature) are confirmed scum. The main argument against not mass claiming is for punchy town roles who have some secret weapon that they want to hold back on using.
@notquiethere claim and ill claim as well.Can't say fairer than that. I'll see what a few more players do. But to make it fair, I've breadcrumbed my role somewhere.
Based on my role PM I received the Lazy, Strengthener, and Virgin roles. I am Town.pff
Based on my role PM I received the Lazy, Strengthener, and Virgin roles. I am Town.pff
... Fucking...
So dumb.
Fine. Let's do the dumb plan where we claim everything, on the condition that we immediately vote. And probably vote zemaj at that.
I'm the Fruit Festival. I'm also the Dark Creature. I refuse to claim my third role, because I'm not entirely sure what it is.
Are you fucking with me, or is this one of those weird scumplays?
Somebody should have the False modifer and not actually know their real role. I assume this will become apparent if everyone claimed.
Okay, let's play a different game here:
If I'm lying, does that make me scum?
No, you're jumping ahead a bit, let's wait just a second.Okay, let's play a different game here:
If I'm lying, does that make me scum?
Intrinsically? No. It does mean that you are not playing in the town's best interest by lying in-thread, though. As such, I am disinclined to believe you. But sell me on it. I'll listen.
You said you soft-claimed Zemaj. Maybe you were very subtle, but I'm not seeing it.
No, you're jumping ahead a bit, let's wait just a second.Okay, let's play a different game here:
If I'm lying, does that make me scum?
Intrinsically? No. It does mean that you are not playing in the town's best interest by lying in-thread, though. As such, I am disinclined to believe you. But sell me on it. I'll listen.
Next question:
If I'm not lying, does that make me scum?
If lying doesn't necessarily make me scum, and not lying definitely doesn't make me scum, then why are you instantly assuming that I'm scum?
Tric... did pretty much state that this is a bastard game.Why are you defending him?
Was it ever explicitly stated that there would be no duplicate roles assigned?
That did cross my mind but I dismissed it as being too tenuous! Consider that you could have been trying to soft-claim poisoner with that.You said you soft-claimed Zemaj. Maybe you were very subtle, but I'm not seeing it.
Really? I thought you got it right away... that was the bit about food allergies... look at the list of PRs, I think its a good connection. Subtle, maybe even easy to miss. Hence, a good soft-claim, imo.
Tric... did pretty much state that this is a bastard game.I thought the bastard elements were coming in through the actual roles like False (as insane roles on Bay12 are considered bastard). He explicitly said that each player got three roles each.
Was it ever explicitly stated that there would be no duplicate roles assigned?
Why are you defending him?Defending him? I'm not defending him at all.
Tric... did pretty much state that this is a bastard game.I thought the bastard elements were coming in through the actual roles like False (as insane roles on Bay12 are considered bastard). He explicitly said that each player got three roles each.
Was it ever explicitly stated that there would be no duplicate roles assigned?
Ordinarily 3rd party hunting is a bad sign, but actually we all lose if the Jester wins so I think our best bet is to vote out the Jester D1. We flip Zemaj or Web, and if they don't come up as Jester, we avoid NKing the other.
Each player gets three roles from the pool, yes. Nowhere was it said that the roles chosen couldn't be duplicates.You're either deliberately trying to sow confusion, or you have misread the mod. All roles have been randomised among the players with three each:
All Roles have been randomized, but which 3 roles you got are not in your PMs. Lore is different for all players.
(Even if it's obvious.
Yes that was literally what I said! I've bolded it for you. But in this game it's a bit different because the unjester is game ending. I still want to end scum, and if it becomes obvious who the King is, we should end the King first; and if the unjester is completely outed they might be safely ignored... but some role interaction or idiot player might still accidentally NK them, losing us the game.Ordinarily 3rd party hunting is a bad sign, but actually we all lose if the Jester wins so I think our best bet is to vote out the Jester D1. We flip Zemaj or Web, and if they don't come up as Jester, we avoid NKing the other.
In my experience, the players most fixated on third parties tend to be either mafia or third party themselves.
See the BYOR where I (scum) was totally convinced that heydude6 had to be a serial killer thanks to his murderguns role.
Zemaj + Fallacy are the scum team.I feel like that was suppose to be true, but wasn't.
FallacyEach player gets three roles from the pool, yes. Nowhere was it said that the roles chosen couldn't be duplicates.You're either deliberately trying to sow confusion, or you have misread the mod. All roles have been randomised among the players with three each:All Roles have been randomized, but which 3 roles you got are not in your PMs. Lore is different for all players.
(Even if it's obvious.
Flashbacks to Automafia.Zemaj + Fallacy are the scum team.I feel like that was suppose to be true, but wasn't.
Each player gets three roles from the pool, yes. Nowhere was it said that the roles chosen couldn't be duplicates.Okay, but that's not the issue. The issue is that his assumption was that because I claimed a role that he claimed, he automatically assumed I'm scum. It's really about whether his accusation is genuine or not, as opposed to anything else.
Right, but there's the possibility that Zemaj is Anti-Jester OR scum, both of which are viable votes. I don't think that's focusing on third party.Ordinarily 3rd party hunting is a bad sign, but actually we all lose if the Jester wins so I think our best bet is to vote out the Jester D1. We flip Zemaj or Web, and if they don't come up as Jester, we avoid NKing the other.
In my experience, the players most fixated on third parties tend to be either mafia or third party themselves.
See the BYOR where I (scum) was totally convinced that heydude6 had to be a serial killer thanks to his murderguns role.
Web is Jester:( I try, and I get called a Jester.
Ah. Yeah, that's a valid point.Each player gets three roles from the pool, yes. Nowhere was it said that the roles chosen couldn't be duplicates.Okay, but that's not the issue. The issue is that his assumption was that because I claimed a role that he claimed, he automatically assumed I'm scum. It's really about whether his accusation is genuine or not, as opposed to anything else.
I voted him because he didn't want to claim, and claiming one role doesn't claim the rest.
Right, but there's the possibility that Zemaj is Anti-Jester OR scum, both of which are viable votes. I don't think that's focusing on third party.Mm, NQT seems fairly fixated on the Jester in general, just going by the look of all his posts.
I claimed my role before you even posted, actually, and I'm not entirely sure where you soft-claimed Fruit Festival, so it'd be better to quote where that was instead of just saying that, so we can see exactly how you did so.
But, that makes me a hypocrite for not posting where I claimed Fruit Festival before you posted, but let's just chill a second and think about why that is, and it'll become obvious.
Of course, hilariously, I'm in the reversed position and you somehow don't see that, but my reason for voting you was because you didn't claim after I posted not wanting to claim, because I wanted to see who else was against it. I actually believe that it's entirely possible for you to also be Fruit Festival, because it's a stupid thing to counterclaim, which actually explains a bit about why you wouldn't want to claim.
So, is any of what I'm saying incorrect?
Each player gets three roles from the pool, yes. Nowhere was it said that the roles chosen couldn't be duplicates.Okay, but that's not the issue. The issue is that his assumption was that because I claimed a role that he claimed, he automatically assumed I'm scum. It's really about whether his accusation is genuine or not, as opposed to anything else.
I voted him because he didn't want to claim, and claiming one role doesn't claim the rest.Right, but there's the possibility that Zemaj is Anti-Jester OR scum, both of which are viable votes. I don't think that's focusing on third party.Ordinarily 3rd party hunting is a bad sign, but actually we all lose if the Jester wins so I think our best bet is to vote out the Jester D1. We flip Zemaj or Web, and if they don't come up as Jester, we avoid NKing the other.
In my experience, the players most fixated on third parties tend to be either mafia or third party themselves.
See the BYOR where I (scum) was totally convinced that heydude6 had to be a serial killer thanks to his murderguns role.
Each player gets three roles from the pool, yes. Nowhere was it said that the roles chosen couldn't be duplicates.Okay, but that's not the issue. The issue is that his assumption was that because I claimed a role that he claimed, he automatically assumed I'm scum. It's really about whether his accusation is genuine or not, as opposed to anything else.
I voted him because he didn't want to claim, and claiming one role doesn't claim the rest.
Kind of want to shoot zemaj at least.
The evasiveness to directly answering questions was present in Automafia.
Zemaj, does your flavor mention fruit?
Spoiler: Zemaj, not game related (click to show/hide)
Note for your list though, Fallacy is explicitly claiming Hidden, there's no other way his role would work with only Enchantress revealed.I know, but I decided only to count what people explicitly said.
Jim Groovester: Strong Lazy Virgin. And in the game, some roles.
Fluffe9911Eh? Did nqt post his roles while I wasnt looking?
To any town vigs/arsonists/poisoners/etc, don't lose us the game by firing wildly. Consider holding fire until we're clear of the unjester threat. You can target me if you really want, and if no one counterclaims, you can kill Max if you think it's warranted.I plan to shoot/burn/poison whoever I want! Who would like to die?
Kind of want to shoot zemaj at least.
The evasiveness to directly answering questions was present in Automafia.
sorry, which direct questions did I refuse to answer? The one where I could only answer with the responses webadict dictated? If its standard for you to let others put words in your mouth, I'm not sure how this works....
Max
Through POE, I've basically figured out the roles, so I personally no longer need a mass claim. Note for your list though, Fallacy is explicitly claiming Hidden, there's no other way his role would work with only Enchantress revealed.
- Jim Groovester: Strong Lazy Virgin. And in the game, some roles.
Jim Groovester: Strong Lazy Virgin. And in the game, some roles.Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Fluffe, do you have 1, 2, or 3 known roles?Fluffe9911Eh? Did nqt post his roles while I wasnt looking?
Cool.These people can't be the Jester:
Who do I vote?
Somebody should have the False modifer and not actually know their real role. I assume this will become apparent if everyone claimed.
Max on Zemaj, getting rid of fruit festival (why? because it's annoying? But it'll stop the N1 kill, so why does Max want to get rid?)Wait, it works on kills?
Max on Zemaj, getting rid of fruit festival (why? because it's annoying? But it'll stop the N1 kill, so why does Max want to get rid?)Wait, it works on kills?
Fruit Festival is a role that allows you to replace all actions that night with a Fruit Vendor action. An action with multiple targets will each turn into their own Fruit Vendor action.
Also, NQT, web: At the very least, that's not how False normally works. A False role according to the wiki Tric's using just doesn't do anything, it doesn't pretend to be a different role.Yeah that's why I confused myself. But Web's right, Tric does appear to say otherwise in our chat.
never mind, I guess? posting anyway.
Max, I should note it seems from our flavour that the co-worker is coming from my role. Web is most likely False + Something masquerading as Fruit + Dark Creature or something masquerading as dark creature.Yeah, I suspected this, since it seemed most likely that all roles are used. Still, I included it as a possibility for completeness. I guess I should have written that he could also be "False?", though.
I don't really get the purpose of this action. It only very tenuously precommits you to the claim. You could easily have prepared lots of fakeclaims and hidden them in different ways — this one would even have worked equally well for Parrot, Post Restriction, Creature, and Conduit if you wanted to be one of them.Spoiler: For completeness, this was the crumb (click to show/hide)
Fluffe, do you have 1, 2, or 3 known roles?3
How fucking bizarre that I know that NQT is lying with information that I know he has because we're Coworkers.False can appear as another role, yes. Or it could be 0% on a known role. RNG.
NQT, you literally know that's how False works because that's exactly how False was explained IN OUR COWORKER CHAT.
@TricMagic, would False show up as a duplicate of another role?
Also, TricMagic, which roles are explicitly an alignment?
Ok read through all the posts now im the Mysterious (Conduit) Janitor Parrot anyway I gotta do school stuff so ill be activish in like a couple of hoursI don't think you can be.
No Roles are alignment indicative. It is entirely possible to have a Townie Antisocial that wins town the game if night-killed. RNG.So now you tell us the unjester isn't necessarily 3p?... well, we narrowed it down anyway, so too late for that.
I don't think you can be.Janitor is acting more of a modifier than a proper role if that helps your confusion any.
Nobody has two role slots outstanding. If Fallacy is the Antisocial Unjester, who's Hidden? If Zemaj is and lying about being fruity, who's False? Presumably notquitethere knows webadict isn't lying about his role, and presumably webadict knows notquitethere isn't lying about his. All the other claims were made early enough and fit together, so I think it's most likely you just picked those roles off my list.
Hold up, I might have posted this morning with a fuzzy recollection. OK unvote, it looks like I totally misread Tric's reply in our co-worker chat (sent late night NQT-time) and that is confirmed to be how it works.
I should always re-read things in the morning... this is like a lesser version of that robot pirate catgirl misreading incident all over again. I just get into a manic posting frenzy sometimes and need to slow my roll.
Web's right, we're co-workers. That comes from my role. I'm also the poisoner and the governor, so I can't be the jester or King. Your move Fluffe.
Ok read through all the posts now im the Mysterious (Conduit) Janitor Parrot anyway I gotta do school stuff so ill be activish in like a couple of hoursI believe the pious doge.
Janitor is acting more of a modifier than a proper role if that helps your confusion any.That doesn't help, no.
BTW: That would make the other of webadict or zemaj the King. In that case, we need to know whether lynching a Hidden player reveals the full role; if so, we should lynch Fallacy to reveal his role, telling us which of the two has the False role. Then we know to lynch the other one.Janitor is acting more of a modifier than a proper role if that helps your confusion any.That doesn't help, no.
Unless I'm misunderstanding how roles are apportioned, in which case I invite TricMagic to correct me, you'd have needed to counterclaim at least one claim in play in order to open a role slot on some player.
I do see one possible exception, though - if False falsifies the player's entire role, either zemaj or webadict is a False Antisocial Unjester, the other one is the real Fruitfucker, and Fallacy is a Hidden Arsonist or Hidden Dork. Is that possible, Tric?
Janitor is acting more of a modifier than a proper role if that helps your confusion any.That doesn't help, no.
Unless I'm misunderstanding how roles are apportioned, in which case I invite TricMagic to correct me, you'd have needed to counterclaim at least one claim in play in order to open a role slot on some player.
I do see one possible exception, though - if False falsifies the player's entire role, either zemaj or webadict is a False Antisocial Unjester, the other one is the real Fruitfucker, and Fallacy is a Hidden Arsonist or Hidden Dork. Is that possible, Tric?
No one has counterclaimed these and I guessed this combo earlier:Ok read through all the posts now im the Mysterious (Conduit) Janitor Parrot anyway I gotta do school stuff so ill be activish in like a couple of hoursI don't think you can be.
(my bet is the flavour is a weird vulture)
BTW: That would make the other of webadict or zemaj the King. In that case, we need to know whether lynching a Hidden player reveals the full role; if so, we should lynch Fallacy to reveal his role, telling us which of the two has the False role. Then we know to lynch the other one.Yes Zemaj in particular has a unclaimed role element which he is being obscure about, and so might be King (or scum, loaning a safe claim to a King partner, as Max has suggested).
False wouldn't modify the entire role in that case, just one aspect of it.All right.
Another possibility I just thought of: If Fallacy is a Hidden Fruit Festival, and one of Zemaj or webadict is a False King appearing to be a Fruit Festival,It should also work if the non-fruit element is the false one that Fallacy has as Hidden, but that contradicts what notquitethere claimed.
To be clear, all I know for certain about Web is that he is my co-worker but isn't the owner of the co-worker role. From private discussion, he appeared to have only two known roles. He could have faked that, but if so he did so quite convincingly. I think it most likely he has the false role. He could have been workshopping a claim to sell to me with his scum buddy, of course.Co-workers usually know each other's roles, so you're confirming this is not the case here?
Co-workers usually know each other's roles, so you're confirming this is not the case here?Correct, we just share a chat. I don't know his role or alignment. He claimed his role to me way before he claimed in the thread, so I'm a bit more inclined to believe it.
How fucking bizarre that I know that NQT is lying with information that I know he has because we're Coworkers.
NQT, you literally know that's how False works because that's exactly how False was explained IN OUR COWORKER CHAT.
@TricMagic, would False show up as a duplicate of another role?
Hold up, I might have posted this morning with a fuzzy recollection. OK unvote, it looks like I totally misread Tric's reply in our co-worker chat (sent late night NQT-time) and that is confirmed to be how it works.
I should always re-read things in the morning... this is like a lesser version of that robot pirate catgirl misreading incident all over again. I just get into a manic posting frenzy sometimes and need to slow my roll.
Web's right, we're co-workers. That comes from my role. I'm also the poisoner and the governor, so I can't be the jester or King. Your move Fluffe.
Max on Zemaj, getting rid of fruit festival (why? because it's annoying? But it'll stop the N1 kill, so why does Max want to get rid?)Wait, it works on kills?
I assume so! Here's what mafia wiki says:QuoteFruit Festival is a role that allows you to replace all actions that night with a Fruit Vendor action. An action with multiple targets will each turn into their own Fruit Vendor action.
I'm guessing it's one-shot.If someone has the Strong role due to Jim strengthening them, they would still act, but it probably wouldn't line up to make anyone strong before N1, unless Jim's action is a day power.Also, NQT, web: At the very least, that's not how False normally works. A False role according to the wiki Tric's using just doesn't do anything, it doesn't pretend to be a different role.Yeah that's why I confused myself. But Web's right, Tric does appear to say otherwise in our chat.
never mind, I guess? posting anyway.
Max, I should note it seems from our flavour that the co-worker is coming from my role. Web is most likely False + Something masquerading as Fruit + Dark Creature or something masquerading as dark creature.Spoiler: For completeness, this was the crumb (click to show/hide)
I don't really get the purpose of this action. It only very tenuously precommits you to the claim. You could easily have prepared lots of fakeclaims and hidden them in different ways — this one would even have worked equally well for Parrot, Post Restriction, Creature, and Conduit if you wanted to be one of them.Spoiler: For completeness, this was the crumb (click to show/hide)
You could equally have used the first paragraph's T and E, or the last paragraph's B, or...
Ok read through all the posts now im the Mysterious (Conduit) Janitor Parrot anyway I gotta do school stuff so ill be activish in like a couple of hoursI don't think you can be.
Nobody has two role slots outstanding. If Fallacy is the Antisocial Unjester, who's Hidden? If Zemaj is and lying about being fruity, who's False? Presumably notquitethere knows webadict isn't lying about his role, and presumably webadict knows notquitethere isn't lying about his.
Tric has essentially confirmed that Web is fake-fruit, real dark creature.No one has counterclaimed these and I guessed this combo earlier:Ok read through all the posts now im the Mysterious (Conduit) Janitor Parrot anyway I gotta do school stuff so ill be activish in like a couple of hoursI don't think you can be.(my bet is the flavour is a weird vulture)
(Vulture = Janitor: destroy bodies + parrot, weird = mysterious conduit)
So either:
2. Fluffe is lying: one of his claimed roles is Fallacy's hidden role, and one of his claimed roles is Web's faked role, and he is the unjester
3. Hidden works differently to how we assume and Fallacy is somehow the unjesterBTW: That would make the other of webadict or zemaj the King. In that case, we need to know whether lynching a Hidden player reveals the full role; if so, we should lynch Fallacy to reveal his role, telling us which of the two has the False role. Then we know to lynch the other one.Yes Zemaj in particular has a unclaimed role element which he is being obscure about, and so might be King (or scum, loaning a safe claim to a King partner, as Max has suggested).
Zemaj, would you be able to paraphrase your flavour text?
I mean, it was obviously FoU and Web. I don't know why these games exist the previous one was just as broken and I cared just as much.Let's get Fluffe the wiiiiiin
Anyway, shooting from the hip, Web is Jester, Zemaj + Fallacy are the scum team. GG everyone.
What are you even talking about NQT?Really? I mean, it's my fault for signing up to a low-info Tric game where he doesn't even list possible wincons in the OP, but I'd be disappointed to learn that the mafia win just by shooting the one person who wants to be shot.
We want Town to lose. That's our wincon.
So what, this comes down to who the real Fruitfucker is when not even the player themselves know? Awesome.Sign up for BYOR 16 and I promise to never make this a fucking decision ever!
So what, this comes down to who the real Fruitfucker is when not even the player themselves know? Awesome.Yes.
Regardless, I'm the King, you should be voting me. I'm even the Dark Creature and Poisoner.No, I’m the King. You’re the Enchantress. All other roles subject to debate.
Setups without claim space may as well be Mountainous.This we can agree on. The first step to fix this setup would be to get each player to submit 3 roles and give them 2, to give plenty of wiggle room for fake claims.
This setup could've been better with a lot of decision, but we are here now, this is our life, and the only way to stop it is by voting me.Setups without claim space may as well be Mountainous.This we can agree on. The first step to fix this setup would be to get each player to submit 3 roles and give them 2, to give plenty of wiggle room for fake claims.
HatHats...hats.....hate.....haatatatsta
I'm glad my decision to not think about this game very hard has been vindicated.Thinking is for chumps!
I'm glad my decision to not think about this game very hard has been vindicated.I made a spreadsheet :'( :'( :'(
I think I am no good at role madness games like this. Bring 1 will at least benefit, I suppose. If I even run it after this.
(No more zany open setups, Bay12 forum has progressed beyond the need for it.)
I played with a group that had a 'No D1 claims' rule. It didn't work well, usually, but this game may have benefited from something like that. Need to have a way to make it so that open-setup cannot just be hacked/broken by over-sharing info and PoE. "Players can claim no more than 1 role (per day?)" might workThat's the dumbest rule ever and I will personally murder and cannibalize anyone who recommends it.
The Town could actively choose to fuck around for two Days, and I still think they would have a decent chance of winning.Prove it
:OThe Town could actively choose to fuck around for two Days, and I still think they would have a decent chance of winning.Prove it
Hatless
Fluffe must be the anti-Jester, as the last claimant. Fallacy and Web must know that he fakeclaimed (or maybe Fallacy really has hidden and doesn't know about one of the elements), Zemaj is a janitor and doesn't know it because he can't discern the flavour.Ya do know not a single person has counterclaimed a single one of my roles right? And the only reason im the last claimant is cause you took a entire day to claim your roles when my criteria for claiming was you doing exactly that?
Also I just realised it's also the janitor that makes this a bastard: hoping for flip info is pointless when the janitor is cleaning away bodies.
How fucking bizarre that I know that NQT is lying with information that I know he has because we're Coworkers.False can appear as another role, yes. Or it could be 0% on a known role. RNG.
NQT, you literally know that's how False works because that's exactly how False was explained IN OUR COWORKER CHAT.
@TricMagic, would False show up as a duplicate of another role?
Also, TricMagic, which roles are explicitly an alignment?
No Roles are alignment indicative. It is entirely possible to have a Townie Antisocial that wins town the game if night-killed. RNG.
It's day 1, Part 2, electric boogaloo. Let's stop playing silly buggers and just get rid of Fallacy this time.
You're putting more thought into this than necessary. We mafiakilled Fluffe, so I'm okay with voting out Max so he'll stop doing that.
Also, Fluffe is lying because FoU was the killer.
Somebody tell me what to do to make a permanent stalemate in this game.Do absolutely nothing and continuously hammer no execute
Because while having winners and losers and things eventually ending is nice, things lasting forever is better.
I'm the King of the Pirates.You sure are Toony!
I have no night action.This is the greatest shitpost I've ever seen.
For you see.
I'm made of wood, how did that happen? Yohoho, took a bite of Tree-Tree.
So, I didn't Fruit Festival last night, opting for an Arsonist action, which went through.Interesting. Who did you target?
So, I didn't Fruit Festival last night, opting for an Arsonist action, which went through.Interesting. Who did you target?
I have no night action.
For you see.
I'm made of wood, how did that happen? Yohoho, took a bite of Tree-Tree.
you seemed the most into the idea of just calling it of the town. If it got you, its less liability for town, since you may have just not posted again.I wanted to quit when I thought NQT was giving up, but when I saw that he wasn't actually lynched (I don't actually remember what roles do by name, okay) I changed my mind.
Seriously, though, if you're taking this game seriously, you clearly do not understand this game because this game was fucked from the beginning, and you should literally just vote randomly or bandwagon as fast as possible to end the game, because any amount of effort put into this game above that is wasted, and I say that in the nicest possible way.
Sorry Max for not being clearer when I self-voted. I never give up.Thanks, I now know all the roles in the game. Although I was right in my assumptions anyway.
I tried poisoning scum, but my action was blocked.
Normally I'd absolutely do my best to play in good faith.Yeah, I did the math and it was nearly mathematically impossible for scum to win, regardless of all other conditions.
I think I agree with web, though. This game was broken from the start.
I don't think any path to victory existed for the scum (us), thanks to the nigh-nonexistent claim space.
Which reminds me, uhhh, Toony, pass me a memeSmee? Smee smee. Smee smee smee.
I'm something of a scientist myself.Normally I'd absolutely do my best to play in good faith.Yeah, I did the math and it was nearly mathematically impossible for scum to win, regardless of all other conditions.
I think I agree with web, though. This game was broken from the start.
I don't think any path to victory existed for the scum (us), thanks to the nigh-nonexistent claim space.
Seriously, though, if you're taking this game seriously
Anyway, Toony/Jim, if you want the game to end, you can vote me, I'm the King.