Bay 12 Games Forum
Other Projects => Curses => Topic started by: praguepride on March 08, 2010, 08:50:28 pm
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Help, I can't use any of my sleeper lawyers!?
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what version is it?
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Yes, a bit more specificity would be helpful.
But here is what I know:
Your lawyer sleeper has a chance of being activated that is equal to their infiltration. So if your lawyer has a 30% infiltration, that lawyer has a 30% chance of showing up to defend your liberal. Only exception is that seduced lovers will always show up to defend their lovers.
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Yes, a bit more specificity would be helpful.
But here is what I know:
Your lawyer sleeper has a chance of being activated that is equal to their infiltration. So if your lawyer has a 30% infiltration, that lawyer has a 30% chance of showing up to defend your liberal. Only exception is that seduced lovers will always show up to defend their lovers.
Just what I needed to hear. Had to post that quick before running out the door, but one of my dudes was going on trial (nothing major, just 4 counts of B&E and 11 counts of vandalism). I was like "ha, perfect case to try out my lawyers on" but then neither of them appeared to defend. So I thought "maybe if I do court-appointed" that would work? Nope, sentenced to death.
Then I tried "defend self" and still got sentenced to death. So, lawyers don't always show up. Good to know.
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Yes, a bit more specificity would be helpful.
But here is what I know:
Your lawyer sleeper has a chance of being activated that is equal to their infiltration. So if your lawyer has a 30% infiltration, that lawyer has a 30% chance of showing up to defend your liberal. Only exception is that seduced lovers will always show up to defend their lovers.
Just what I needed to hear. Had to post that quick before running out the door, but one of my dudes was going on trial (nothing major, just 4 counts of B&E and 11 counts of vandalism). I was like "ha, perfect case to try out my lawyers on" but then neither of them appeared to defend. So I thought "maybe if I do court-appointed" that would work? Nope, sentenced to death.
Then I tried "defend self" and still got sentenced to death. So, lawyers don't always show up. Good to know.
Conservative DP laws equal common death sentences.
EDIT: It just occured to me - why not replace the current, rather random system with a system where the sleeper lawyer will always be available but will charge a lot of money (not ACE amounts but still a lot) and the charge will quickly become nominal when the infiltration% goes up? Seduced would still be able to help their lover for free.
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I'm fine with the random judges as judges don't really get to pick their cases (I don't think so...) but the defendant should always be able to pick his lawyer.
Perhaps the lawyers are just under-lawyers and a new "super lawyer" called a Partner who would be available 100% of the time and have judge-like stats.
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I'm fine with the random judges as judges don't really get to pick their cases (I don't think so...) but the defendant should always be able to pick his lawyer.
Perhaps the lawyers are just under-lawyers and a new "super lawyer" called a Partner who would be available 100% of the time and have judge-like stats.
I think the problem is that the lawyers must avoid blowing their cover or losing respect in the Law Club (that exists, doesn't it?). The seduced can always make up some sentimental bullflop about a past relationship to avoid suspicion about criminal activities.
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Actually, there are these things called "defense lawyers" who always represent people accused of crimes, and nobody accuses them of being liberals. They're just greedy (ok, maybe they have some idealogical belief that helps them sleep at night, but everyone else just assumes they're greedy).
Thus, the system where the lawyer is guaranteed but charges an amount variable to the infultration would actually be very realistic, as the only two people who ever know how much a lawyer charges for a specific client are the client and the attorney.
But, then what happens when we have mulitiple lawyers?
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But, then what happens when we have mulitiple lawyers?
I've been wondering about this too. And as for defense lawyers, I still think it's a bit suspicious if the same guy always shows up to defend the liberal terrorists. After all, they could be somehow affiliated, and then come the FBI background checks and so on.
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Unless there's a conflict of interest lawyers need to defend clients. And lawyers live & die by their reputation, so it's acceptable for them to do their best.
Nobody accuses the ace attorny of being a liberal if you use him/her repeatedly. They're just doing their all-american job!
However, conservatives would expect the lawyer to charge an arm and a leg for their services though, so charging only $100 has to be covered out of their pocket or with creative book keeping.
So, here's my proposal, splitting lawyers up into 3 groups.
1) Lawyer: as now. Large random range of ability for law, probably something like 3-10. Has a random chance of showing up and defending you. This wouldn't be based off of their infiltration level but would just be random like with judges. Perhaps a 1/10 chance. However, after charging only $100, there's a chance they'll be discovered and fired from their job. This WOULD be based off of infiltration levels because their evil conservative bosses are more likely to investigate whiney liberals then up-standing conservatives.
2) Law Partner: One of the big men themselves. Always conservative and tricky to convert like Emeninent Scientists and Radio Personalities and other "top" recruits. However, they'd have much higher law skills (on par with judges) and would never risk being fired. They ARE the law office. Unfortunately, there would still be a random chance, perhaps with judges a 1/4 chance of being available for defense.
3) Defense Attorny: These guys would always be available to defend you, but their law skills would start very low, so maybe 3-5 range. Advantage is they're reliable and have the normal spread of alignments, but the disadvantage would be that they too risk being fired (although probably 1/2 the rate of regular lawyers) and they have the lowest starting stats of any of the legal council recruits.
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I like the system from a gameplay standpoint, but it is terribly unrealistic to say that defense attorneys, whose job it is day in and day out to go to court and defend people like the LCS members from criminal charges, are less competent than the standard lawyers, who may not even know where the courthouse is located.
I would change the defense attorneys to public defenders, and have them basically reflect an ongoing connection with the public defender's office.
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1) Lawyer: as now. Large random range of ability for law, probably something like 3-10. Has a random chance of showing up and defending you. This wouldn't be based off of their infiltration level but would just be random like with judges.
Judges are based on infiltration too, I had one sleeper judge with 100% infiltration and he "judged" all my 6 terrorists. It used to be so that you had to have 4 sleeper judges to always get one of them to "judge" your people but now a single 100% judge is enough.
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but it is terribly unrealistic to say that defense attorneys, whose job it is day in and day out to go to court and defend people like the LCS members from criminal charges, are less competent than the standard lawyers, who may not even know where the courthouse is located.
Less competent to a lawyer as in any person with a law degree, sure. But at least from the game perspective, all lawyers are trial lawyers. On that note, typically prosecution is a harder field then defense. Defense get the benefit of the doubt (innocent until proven guilty) and at least media portrays prosecutors as the "sharks" of the law world while defense are more of the "sheeps."
Not saying it's true in real life, but it's true in media. Plus for game balance purposes and all that jazz you can't have super skilled, always available lawyers on your side. So you trade off reliability for skill.
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the number and type of crimes shoud change who get sleepers on there case.
the higher up in the ranks the better there odds of geting a sleeper.
the founder aways get a sleeper if one truns up.
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Actually, I would have thought the defense vs. procecution issue would be viewed the opposite way. I think in the real world, defense attorneys are the ones who defend the rapist and serial killers, and the prosecutors put "the bad people" behind bars.
Also, prosecutors have a choice as to whether to proceed to trial, thus they usually only proceed if they think they will win. Defense is stuck with cases they probably will lose, and thus need far more skill to win.
The media never helps the accused, usually speaking as if the accused is already guilty.
Typical Headline: "Liberal X is standing trial for killing a police officer"
Notice the words "is accused" are not present. The headline speaks as if Liberal X is definitely commited the crime, and the trial is a formality.
I'd best finish with saying why your opinion is how I wish things were viewed. It is my belief that in order to protect the basic rights of all citizens, we need to protect the rights of the "worst". Thus defense attorneys are really defenders to the civil rights of everyone.