Bay 12 Games Forum
Other Projects => Other Games => Topic started by: Vendayn on September 14, 2011, 07:55:18 pm
-
So...anyone know of any ant based games?
On the bee based game thread (reason I'm posting a new thread is...I don't feel like it would be right to hi-jack the thread about ants, when thread is about bees)...the Antrush game was mentioned. I LOVE raising ants and studying them outside. I've been keeping ants since I was 12 or so, give or take a year...and now 23.
http://antrush.com/
So, going to make a list to see whatever ant games there might be. I don't currently have time to add links to them, but I'm sure you can find them on Google.
Sim Ant (probably most famous ant based game that I know of and the best one).
AntRush (which looks pretty similar to Sim Ant in a lot of ways, and with added multiplayer and more choices in "races" to select)
Ant War (not that great really, I think more aimed for little kids. It is nice, but gets boring fast. It is turn based, with a flat 2d screen, that you can't interact with)
Empire of the Ants (probably best looking ant game (3d too). But, not a very good implementation of one. It never really felt like an ant game, like Sim Ant did. More like an average RTS. Doesn't make it bad though)
Antzzz (think there was three Z's...it is a browser based ant game, but it is pretty good for what it is)
That is the list so far. With my opinions on each of them.
Any other ant games you guys may know of? I ask, because someone knew of AntRush, and even the ant forum I'm a part of never found that game. So, you guys seem to find those hidden gems of a game.
-
Dwarf Fortress hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
-
Dwarf Fortress hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Hmm, I'll have to try and look for it. I've never seen a Dwarf Fortress ant mod. But, to be honest, never actually thought to look.
-
Last I checked, it's not terribly difficult to either implement an ant civ or replace the dwarves with one. Might take a half-hour, I guess. Maybe an hour, tops.
-
I know 0 of modding, lol. But you can also add a queen that lays eggs that grow to ants? The worker ants digging seems easy enough, as Dwarves do that already. There would also be the soldier ants. And an ant colony usually has winged alates, as well that help their species spread. And depending on what type of ants, like Leaf-cutter ants grow fungus for food. Or Slave-making ants that can't do work themselves, but have other ants do it for them. And like AntRush, it has termites too. There are tons of variety of ants.
Replacing just the Dwarves with ants, wouldn't seem very ant-like to me. Would need to have a queen ant, eggs and everything else, too. But, since I'm no modder, I can't really do that. Unless there is already a mod for that.
-
I know 0 of modding, lol. But you can also add a queen that lays eggs that grow to ants? The worker ants digging seems easy enough, as Dwarves do that already. There would also be the soldier ants. And an ant colony usually has winged alates, as well that help their species spread. And depending on what type of ants, like Leaf-cutter ants grow fungus for food. Or Slave-making ants that can't do work themselves, but have other ants do it for them. And like AntRush, it has termites too. There are tons of variety of ants.
Replacing just the Dwarves with ants, wouldn't seem very ant-like to me. Would need to have a queen ant, eggs and everything else, too. But, since I'm no modder, I can't really do that. Unless there is already a mod for that.
regular ant=miner dwarf
soldier ant= sword/axe/whatever dwarf
winged ant= i dunno, but probably easy to implement too. maybe nobles of some sort
leaf cutter ant = lumberjack dwarf
queen = noble of course
fungus growing ant = farmer dwarf and plump helmets, durr
termites = goblins
spider = GCS
seems pretty easy to me.
-
SimAnts?
-
Sim Ant is actually a lot like Dwarf Fortress. Sort of.
-
I've encountered various other ant games over the years (I often find myself just trawling google for such things). You've posted the main ones I remember. I've played all of the ones in the OP: I actually own Empire of the Ants, which I agree is a sad affair (the novel on which it is based is fantastic however - in a Watership Down for ants sort of way); I did a review of AntRush over on TIGSource (http://www.tigsource.com/2008/07/27/antrush/); and I regularly play the SNES version of SimAnt on my phone.
Ah, there was a text-based German one that I encountered a good while ago (4-5 years, min). I don't recall it's name, but it played a bit like Ant War.
Command and Conquer: Red Alert actually had a hidden campaign where you fought giant ants (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUhjegdVUs8) à la B-Movies like Them! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcV78KE38J4)
More on the toy side of things there is also "Ant Life Studio (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzdD2onEE8A)," from Bandai, which is intended to act as a desk-top formicarium. I think it's only available in Japanese, but I don't imagine the interface would be too difficult to figure out. If only out of sheer novelty value (let alone my fanatic interest in ants), I personally would love to have this.
I'll be following this thread closely, as I personally love ants and their ilk and wish they were used more frequently in games. Never has there been such a natural setup for an RTS as social insects like ants, bees/wasps/hornets, and termites. Empire of the Ants was unfortunately a poor attempt, plagued by buggy (haha?) gameplay and unrefined graphics, but I think the opportunity is still available for a full-scale RTS to be made using the concept.
-
Ant Attack (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4LLXE4rX28). From 1983, I think it holds up pretty well!
edit: Found an emulator (http://www.twinbee.org/hob/play.php?snap=antattack).
-
Ant Attack (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4LLXE4rX28). From 1983, I think it holds up pretty well!
edit: Found an emulator (http://www.twinbee.org/hob/play.php?snap=antattack).
Ah, this game.
There's also quite a few remakes, here: http://www.encho.me/antattack/
(Also, here's a larger version of yours: http://www.sandywhite.co.uk/fun/ants/)
-
Microsoft Ants! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpMAIalKXMk) was pretty fun back in its day.
-
Microsoft Ants! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpMAIalKXMk) was pretty fun back in its day.
For some reason, I always picture Microsoft Ants in my head whenever I saw Ancient Ants Adventure (http://sandbox.yoyogames.com/games/34591).
I mentioned Them! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Them!) in an earlier post, yet somehow managed to forget to mention It Came From the Desert! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It_Came_from_the_Desert)
If you have a Nintendo DS, there is Ant Nation (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5g9EjHrvPXM), which seems similar to SimAnt. There also appears to be a version for the Nintendo Wi (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBuJAEomopw)i.
On the mobile devices front, there are a bunch of "smash the ants" games that really aren't worth listing (as well as various ant wallpapers), but I did find an RTS/Tower Defense game for iPod Touch/iPhone/iPad called Ant Tower (http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/tower-ant/id418804934?mt=8), of which a video review showing gameplay can be seen, here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOt3AUr_ceI). There is also a second ant-related RTS on the iPad, called Ant Raid (http://prankentertainment.com/?page=games) (gameplay footage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkrWKem3RBw)).
-
Earth Defence Force 2017 seems to be primarily about ants. (EDF! EDF! EDF!)
-
Earth Defence Force 2017 seems to be primarily about ants. (EDF! EDF! EDF!)
True! I absolutely love that game. For those interested, the Earth Defense Force (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_Defense_Force_2017) (and Global Defense Force (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Defence_Force)) series is a Japanese series of third-person shooters that bring to mind B-movies with giant ants, spiders, robots, dinosaurs, you name it. EDF 2017 is available on the Xbox 360, and the newest title, EDF: Insect Armageddon, is available on both the 360 and PS3.
They are hectic fun.
-
Last I checked, it's not terribly difficult to either implement an ant civ or replace the dwarves with one. Might take a half-hour, I guess. Maybe an hour, tops.
guess what my next mod project for a game I haven't touched in half a year is.
AYUP.
-
Quite a lot of ant games I've never heard of. Thanks for sharing all these, guys. :) And nice review of AntRush, Alehkhs.
-
Zombies Ate My Neighbors had a few ant based levels. You don't play as them, obviously, but it was a great game nonetheless.
-
Last I checked, it's not terribly difficult to either implement an ant civ or replace the dwarves with one. Might take a half-hour, I guess. Maybe an hour, tops.
guess what my next mod project for a game I haven't touched in half a year is.
AYUP.
Sorry if this is a bit long, but this may help any modders that want to make an ant civilization.
So...
Plan to make an ant mod? That would be epic. Dwarf Fortress would be really awesome for an ant-based civilization. However, I think it should be different than just switching Dwarf characters with ants. Then it is just Dwarves with an ant skin. Doesn't seem that exciting, to me. Dwarves are fine, but I don't want to play a race that is just a re-skin. Just my personal opinion. Though, I guess to start with...that would probably be good enough. I think if the engine allows it, having the queen lay eggs and producing ants that way...would be more realistic. Not sure how Slave-making ants would work, since usually there isn't other civilizations on the same map. Unless I just haven't seen that. Which, another aspect of ant games...is having multiple colonies on the same map. Then taking them over, and (in Sim Ant) conquering nearby territories. Though, most ant games, they play as missions...which is a bummer, imo. I still want a modern ant game, that allows the spreading of your colonies...not mission based. Similar to that of Sim Ant, but maybe even on a more epic scale...since I'm sure with modern technology, it can be done.
Also, very few ants actually use farming. Though, some do take care of aphids for honeydew. Most capture food that appears around their territory (insects, human dropped food and other scavenged foods). Harvester ants are primarily seed eaters. Then the most "famous" ant, that every ant keeper/Myrmecologist really enjoy, are Leafcutter ants. They are pretty much the only true "farmer" for ants, with growing fungus. If the fungus dies, then the whole colony dies with it. Though, a few lesser seen ants grow fungus, too. And some termites (don't remember the species), also grow fungus.
Not sure if all that would be hard to do, or not. Switching Dwarves to ants doesn't sound hard, but rather...lackluster. Especially if ants are born, just like Dwarves are. Then the caravan that supplies people, isn't very realistic. Other ant colonies would kill them, not reinforce them. But, maybe the caravans are only for Dwarves? I haven't played DF in a while and don't remember. The big part of an ants development is from egg to larvae to pupae, and then it ecloses (hatches). And in ant games...if the queen dies, the whole colony dies out. Though, that isn't entirely realistic (depending on the ant species). Some ants (and Subterranean termites always do this) produce a new queen (and king with Subterranean termites) to take her place. And actually, it is overpowered...but in reality...Subterranean termites produce thousands/hundreds of queens if their main queen dies. Subterranean termites actually BENEFIT from having their queen die. That is why it is pretty much impossible to get rid of them. Not to mention, the workers can turn into secondary reproductives too. However, the secondary reproductives are a lot smaller than the main queen. But, they lay a lot more eggs overall, due to there being so many. Also, termites are pretty much unbeatable in their underground tunnels. One thing about Antrush, is termites aren't really realistic. If the termites mud tunnels or if they are in wood, and they get exposed, they are at a really really big disadvantage. Ants own termites in open areas. It is no contest, the termites have no chance at all. However, due to the soldiers for termites...ants have a very hard time beating them, underground. Many species of termite soldiers also produce this goo, that injures ants and gets them stuck in it. There was a documentary of 20,000,000 (yes, 20 million) Driver ants (in Africa) attacking a termite mound, that only had 1,000,000 termites. Despite the termites being very vastly out numbered...the Driver ants were forced to retreat and with heavy losses. Gameplay wise, a bit overpowered though. Also, termites only eat wood. That doesn't sound hard to add for termites. Except that termite species I mentioned, that grows fungus. However, I don't know if they gather wood for it or not as well, or if they only gather plants for the fungus.
Though regarding ant queens, most colonies die out after the queen dies. Though, quite a few species do have multiple queened nests. But, for an ant mod...and since it is already possible in Dwarf Fortress..I think having multiple species (including at least one termite species, as termites and ants kind of go together well) of ants is a good way to go about it. One would need to do a lot of research on the species he chooses for the mod, as every species is different. Like Fire ants (Solenopsis invicta, the invasive Fire ant, would probably be too overpowered. Very few ants can beat them in nature. But Solenopsis xyloni are native to the US) have superior numbers. But they go through food, like crazy. Or Thief ants, that are the tiniest ant in North America...and they nest near larger ants, and steal their brood/food (to eat, not to enslave). There is Formica ants as well, that have superior chemical offense/defense. A larger ant, and depending on the Formica species...can even beat invasive ants.
There are TONS of ant species to choose from. So, I'll stop at Formica ants.
But here is my final thoughts. I think an ant mod needs to be more than Dwarves that are re-skinned to ants. Sure, a lot of the gameplay aspects are there...like digging a nest and what not. But, some things need to be changed. Workers should eclose from pupae. Or the queen being the main unit in-game, and having the colony slowly die out without her. It wouldn't be instant, as ants don't just magically die all of a sudden, when the queen dies. Species with multiple queens nullifies that. New "buildings" that are only able to be built underground (no ant actually nests on the surface, they are always either in the ground or in a few cases, wood)...like an egg hatchery room, or a food chamber (that is easy enough as that is already in-game), a queen's chamber where the queen stays, and never moves (unless being invaded) then ants evacuate a nest. Subterrean termites do build on the surface, though. Some make giant mounds (taller than any person) and build mud tunnels to a wood source. However, termite queens are much too fat to move, and it takes thousands of workers to...very slowly...move her. And any other "buildings" that make sense for ants. Actually buildings are the wrong term...as ants just dig chambers naturally. But, designations I think is what I'm looking for. Like a designation for an egg chamber, or a larvae chamber, or a pupae chamber...and so fourth.
Then there should be food that "drops" on the ground in large piles or whatever...or insects that pose a danger. Like spiders are a dangerous enemy to single ants, but a lot of ants can take them down. Or just insects that don't pose a thread, but ants can kill for food. Or for Leafcutter ants (gotta have them), they only harvest plants to grow their fungus. Plants are pretty much already done...and fungus I guess is too. But the way farms work in DF, isn't the same as how a fungus farm works. Fungus farms need to be continually fed new leaves or flower petals. And fungus doesn't grow on plots, but they take up a huge chamber, and it slowly grows. Sometimes the fungus dies for some reason (usually when it is first started), and then the colony dies with it. But, maybe that isn't possible in DF, so if that is the case, I guess plots would have to do.
There is a lot of good stuff one can do with ant "civilizations"...just not sure how much is possible in a DF engine. However, the basic mechanics in DF really fit an ant/termite colony mod...especially the digging aspect of it, and some other stuff. I just don't see how changing Dwarves to ants would work 100%...unless the mechanic is already in-game for ant "races", to lay eggs and act like a proper ant colony. Among other stuff. That, and ants (unlike AntRush) don't build buildings on the surface, or buildings at all (like ants have no need for workshops). They just build chambers like Dwarves do, and designate areas for different uses. Also, a lot of ants (maybe even most) lay scent trails to food. Desert species don't actually tend to do that, though. Then some ants form lines to different areas. A lot of ants don't randomly go all over the place, like how Dwarves work in-game. Like if an ant is farming aphids (not a lot of ants actually do that), they form lines going up a tree/plant and take care of the aphids for the honeydew. Not just aphids either, that is just a good example. However, I don't think there are giant trees/plants in the game that can actually be climbed on. It could work like AntRush...have a stump of a tree, and then one level up, is a new area...with food or whatever. Then it simulates ants going up into the tree. That is already easily available in Dwarf Fortress, as it has many levels. That seems easy to put in.
But yes, I am running out of time to continue with an "outline" of an ant mod. So, I may add more later. Or someone else can chime in. However, it may be really easy to just switch Dwarves with ants...but that seems lame to me. I want proper ants, not Dwarf cloned ants. If I want to play Dwarves, I can already do that. No point in playing something that would play exactly the same. But I want to play actual ants, with the same feeling of ants. I'm not a big fan of playing a "race" that is exactly like another "race", but re-skinned. That is just my feeling of it. Sure like mentioned, sounds really easy to switch Dwarves with ants...but seems kind of weak. I want eggs to be laid by the queen and the eggs develop like an ant colony, and at least some of the other features I suggested. Or maybe entirely different features if anyone comes up with better ones.
-
A TRUE ant mod for DF would be grand. A termite mod as well (Have soldier class ooze the anti-ant goo).
-
Some ants grow "ant rice" (a kind of grass), so there is surface farming.
I don't think metamorphosis works in DF (yet), but egglaying by one rare, large queen caste among males and different varieties neuter is possible.
You need a nest box, though, and you have to micro it a bit so they don't mark the eggs as food.
Stingers work.
Acid sprays (of a fashion, causes contact necrosis or bleeding) are possible too, if you want to be carpenter ants.
I don't thing jumping is in, so no trap-jaw ant somersaults for you.
Flying castes among non-flying should work, but playable races avoid flying wherever possible, I think.
I think you can even make non-inteligent soldiers with natural military skills and built-in weapons and armour (their mandibles, their plating, etc.). These could even (if I remember correctly) be made war/hunting trainable or butchered if food gets low, but would only do peasant default jobs I think. (or none?)
I think you would still need a tool to dig with/cut trees though.
-
I think you would still need a tool to dig with/cut trees though.
Make the workers the only class that can use tools, and make the tool absolutely useless for combat (E.G. heavy as a feather and sharp as cloth)
-
Sorry for being a necromancer, but I just found this thread and I wanted to note that I'm more or less working on what you are talking about.
Some of the things written here I hadn't even thought of so thank you for all the input ;)
Summing up: My Formicarium will stretch reality a little in that over the course of a game we will unlock abilities of more then one ant-species and add them to the played hive.
Also I put a lot more effort into simulating the ecosystem then Sim Ant, writing lots of code for plants (they have genes too), the thing I'm working on currently is the day-night-cycle which obviously affects photosythesis and therefore plant-growth ;)
Anyway here's my bay12-forums-thread: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=145261.0
And our website (with an early video): www.formicarium.org