Bay 12 Games Forum

Dead gods that is a long explanation. Let me condense it.

The dupe action targets a sphere. For every player with at least one non-auto ability with that sphere, one of their non-auto abilities with that sphere is copied.

The copy is both 1-Shot and Free.

Then the dupe action relocates itself to a random player who had an ability duped.

My other action (and its copy) share this relocation property, by the way.

Re: Tric. Sorry, I either missed or forgot your sphere claim. I'm just surprised your ability that manipulates the execution doesn't have the Vote sphere.

Do not dup any of Tric's spheres tonight, folks, and probably not in the future, that's probably not pro-town, I explain why deeper below.

TricMagic

Quote from: TricMagic on February 06, 2024, 08:28:18 am

One thing to note that the ones Toony makes are likely fakes to web's power, useless chunks of rock. So if they got traded as the real deal and web tried to use them, their action would just end up failing. As a balance, makes sense?

Not sure if you meant Toony, Tric?  And duping emeralds by the known FoU method can't be done, they don't have a sphere (that I know of) they cannot be duped that way.

Toonyman,
I believe you should explore what happens if you combine one item, with or without the artefact tag, with any of your abilities.  I do not know if you should share the answer, however before you try that you should probably find out if you risk turning your 'not movable' (as far as I know) abilities into something that can be traded, stolen, or otherwise moved around like any other item, or if you can know for sure that you can combine items into your abilities and just lose the item/artefact part (and be sure to check for both, because the artefact tag could have independent combinations with you).

My initial thoughts involved potentially setting up gives/trades of items with requests you consider combining them if you agree the combo seems pro-town.  This would be past N2 stuff though, and everything's contingent on this being fluff.  We gotta elim anti-town and I am not bribable.  All this cool item stuff, it's unfortunately a distraction or at best, except for those very few things that actually matter.

Imp Thoughts
The glass being used on dead qua, an honest report and cop stuff happening, that could be very important (not sure we have the tools to find the needed answers, but we could, or they could come into play).  I am 100% committed to that happening.

The Page in capable hands, if capable pro-town hands exist, and no other kills that pro-town controls being used tonight, is incredibly vital.  Sounds like pie in the sky to me, and NJW should have been rock solid on ideas that involve that page not going anywhere to allow it to work N3, especially.  Only way it works in non NJW hands N3 is if it's not working N2 because it moved D2 or N2.  That should not happen, though I was okay with it early D2.  That was not what NJW said should happen early D2 - NJW closed that door himself.  I'm upset hugely about that, in the same way I'm comfortable with EP not waffling on the idea of what I believe should be the benefits of EP actually using the glass himself N2, because that ensures nobody lies about what results EP gets, and any confusion EP can personally ask the mod about, and that I suggest this needs doing but not necessarily by me N2 though I ensure it happens N2 if the trade doesn't happen or if EP didn't agree to the trade.  We had discussion, agreement, and went from there, cool.  NJW has not one problem with holding the Page, or a single list presented and discussable, but a whole squirrel's nest of waffles.  I don't believe we can count on the Page in NJW's hands, though I'm grateful if we can and I am 100% committed to not doing anything that could cause a kill tonight.  Anyone who uses or allows a kill tonight is acting hella anti-town and should die for it, if NJW is not elim today.

I'm still probably/possibly eating that apple tonight, and apples are important items, yes.  No matter what, the one apple I know exists won't rot N2.


I am committed to not duping Tric's vote ability.  I urge everyone to carefully not dup it either.  Here's why:  Without a refill, if he uses it, that D we get 2 elims, but if we elim town, it is nearly 100% likely that both abilities refill.  And do all their effects, including what triggers them.

That means, if Tric uses it the next D - I don't think it's possible for Tric to only trigger one and not the other dup, because they fire on a phrase Tric says, not an action Tric takes.  Action, he could use Ability or Ability #2.  I don't think he can say in a way to use Ability or Ability #2, I think both reload together and fire together.  I also think it's 100% possible for Tric to trigger both together even if the ability could be triggered separately, and I think there's only anti-town benefit to duping Tric's ability, as it really weakens Tric's ability to use it in a selective pro-town way and increases the odds of an 'everyone dies in a couple days if not before' kinda way.  it would force Tric not to use his ability, or force the elim of up to 3 players should he ever refill then use it.

Everyone
So please nobody dup an ability that has a sphere that Tric listed off, because if that's the only ability Tric has, duping any of those spheres forces a dup of Tric's ability, with all the rest-of-game consequences of that.


TricMagic
Tric, I empower others, for all you're not empowered yet.  Among the fluffy things I can do with items (Sadly may not help us elim/kill anti-town, so its all fluff) is give the equivalent or fact of actions to others.  I'm really good at this; it's not a priority but if I really wanted to, I could probably set you up with the equivalent or fact of about 6 actions by start of D5.  I really doubt that's the most pro-town of possible things I can do - I don't intend to further that specific option tonight.  But you being unable to action probably isn't pro-town and you getting action-equivalents is on my list of reasonable things to cause to happen.  What I actually can do is hugely conditional based on how many players are alive, where items are, what items in play are, and other things, and it's very distracting, fun, and totally 'secondary' to me - not in 'secondary wincon' - in the fact that I don't see a single thing I can do to ensure we elim or kill anti-town, and that comes first.  But I can probably help make this game more fun for people, and maybe I can empower folks in very pro-town ways, I think that's the best use of my options.

Quote from: TricMagic on February 06, 2024, 08:29:55 am

Says the one who stole all my items.

About that, I didn't actually 'steal' them.  And unlike CM, me 'stealing' from someone is not indicative of what I think of their alignment.  I'm doing something pretty complicated when I 'appear to steal' and really it's more moving items around in some broad ways and doing other stuff too, if the other stuff is possible to do.  I'll reveal everything pro-town as we go along and I am 100% committed to not allowing confusion that will get people elim or allow scum to hide, but I have pro-town reasons to be unclear about what I am doing and how it works.  Judge me by the sum results of what I do, not any little part.  But, my 'theft' has the result of confirming the glass exists, how it works and gets night results (And shows everyone that if I 'steal' it, but you use it that night, your use happens), and puts it into a third set of hands to use N2 who confirms they agree to use it in a pro-town way N2.  I think this is a very pro-town path for that item's uses.  It sucks we have a probable pro-town person who gets no actions tonight.  I'll try to find a 'this is the most pro-town thing I can do' reason to get actions or options for actions back into Tric's control soon, but I cannot ensure that is happening N2.

I also like the East and Central portions of the Evergreen Reach, however the amount of consistent Wetness in the West feels off for me, so close to the 'Amit. I have an alternative that I'd suggest we slot into the Evergreen Reach.

Quote from: Western Evergreen Reach

Moving westward, the Reach is now at its lowest altitude. Trees are still present here, but restricted to the few hillocks and high points in this wide, flat basin. It is kept mostly dry and arid due to its proximity to the great 'Amit, but it experiences an annual flood that submerged almost the entire region. This is due to a combination of seasonal wet weather at Monsoon Point, meltwater from the Ice Wall, and the gradient of the region sending it all Westward, that makes the land exceptional fertile for crops and anything that can survive a periodic drowning.

Quote from: FallacyofUrist on February 05, 2024, 09:25:05 pm

His use of the Wishbone isn't confirmable this Night, though, so he theoretically could have killed. Unless there's some info about that going around that I missed.

Psst.  He seems a wishbone specialist.  There's a decent chance for him wishbone use could be a free action.  I have no idea.

We should all lift our hands automatically to our mouths to hide the smile we really should have when we try to figure out what someone did last night, successfully find one (or more) possible actions, and think 'job done'.

That could be true for some of you, I'm sorry.  Tric currently claims to have no possible actions, which... Wow.  Someone got hit with the short end of the CYOS sample-set or something.  So hard to believe.

Quote from: TricMagic on February 05, 2024, 05:51:12 pm

Honestly Crystal isn't going to get implicated as mafia at this point.

It's not about Crystal.

it's about tomorrow, if you and I are alive and Max flipped pro-town.  And I have scum on the table and a case and you have 'distrust' so you don't vote my case.

I don't give a fig for your 'distrust'.  Though I'll be grateful if you kill scum.  But if you don't, you risk town very, very, very badly.

I want your case.  It also helps if Max's not mafia anti-town.