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Messages - white-rabbit

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31
First release is out!

Is this going to be compatible with .47 alpha builds of dfhack?

Not yet. I just got the release working for the stable 0.44 build, only to find that it's out of date as of a few hours ago.  :'(

32
Do you intend to host any public servers for playtesting?

Not presently.

Is two simultaneous players the max right now, or are you just testing with two?

I'm testing it with three. I don't know how many players this system could handle but I don't see any reason to program in a particular limit.

33
Things are coming along nicely. Lethosar gave me some great advice on IRC which helped me fix the biggest problems I had. Now the gameplay so far seems very stable, but I would suggest saving frequently regardless. Almost everything works perfectly, but there are a handful of menus which are completely broken. Some goblins showed up in playtesting, so fixing the squad menu is the next task. The ability to hook up levers to things is also broken, and that would be quite helpful right now too.

seems like a perfect opportunity for social interaction with all the corona shutdowns going on.

I hope so. :)

It wouldn’t have to be at fortress speed, the skipping forwards in time just wouldn’t be controlled by the player(s) but a clock running at adventurer speed. Remember, adventurer mode is not only ”turn-based”, but has more ticks/day than fortress mode.
The issue is the controls, to not have the players being massacred while they are inputting detailed attacks, and syncing it up well so e.g. walking doesn’t have the wonkiness of weird delays.

Furthermore, from a technical standpoint, I'm fundamentally not sure how to even trick the game into having different players control different characters. So there are indeed a lot of issues. Making adventurer mode work well would require both a breakthrough in the the technical part (which seems plausible) and some creative thinking on how to adapt the turn-based gameplay for multiplayer while being restrained to what is a viable option technically. It's not unrealistic -- however, the reason I'm working on DF mode is because I figured out an easy way to make it work from a technical standpoint.

What happens if, for example, one player deconstructs a workshop while the other is in the Profile menu of that workshop? Is there a risk of game crashing or corrupting?

I suspect all sorts of similar scenarios need testing with unpaused menus.


What will happen instead here is that the player in the profile menu will suddenly get booted out. (Actually, it's possible they might end up in the profile menu of a different nearby workshop -- that's bad, and I should fix it, but at least it's not a gamestopping bug.) With what I'm doing, this type of scenario isn't possible to cause a crash. (Maybe I will soon regret these words.) That's not to say that there aren't scenarios which could cause a crash. So far, the only thing that has caused a crash was when the outpost liason came to visit and the game wasn't sure how to display the meeting screen to all three players -- that's been fixed now, although unlike any other screen, the meeting screen requires the players to coordinate. Hopefully I can come up with a better solution in the future for that particular screen.

A long term suggestion:
It would be neat if there could be restrictions on what each player can do. Like maybe each player is limited to a certain part of the embark, or to certain dwarves/squads. With some DFHackery and burrows, I bet we could have players running two hostile factions.

Yes, these ideas are good for after the basic implementation is working more solidly. The code so far is not too complicated, so it should hopefully be quite adaptable by anyone who wants to build a mod ontop of it. Regarding PvP specifically, I'm sceptical because I suspect there is a lot to untangle -- is it possible to get a squad from one side to target a squad from the other? Can we prevent dwarves from becoming friends with each other across the gap? In comparison, co-op seems like a natural extension, at least from the technical side of things.

34
What are the limits of what players can do without stepping on each other's toes?

I can't tell if opening the nobles menu is causing the game to pause or not.

The game does not pause when a menu is opened. It only pauses when someone presses the pause button or when the game pauses on its own. So far this mostly only causes problems in the view unit menu. (Trying to view Urist on his way from the caverns to the taverns is somewhat tricky. I'll have to special case this perhaps.) Other than that, so long as the players all have a good line of communication, like Discord, toe-stepping has been pretty minimal in my experience.

35
With DF hack I was able to install by pasting into my DF folder. With webfort am I building into a DF folder or am I building it and copying the build into the folder?

If you are building it yourself, then the process should be identical to DFhack. If you are using a prebuilt DFhack release, then you'll have to wait until someone (perhaps me...) makes such a release. I'm not sure exactly how to do that yet, though.

What version of DF does it work with? The last that I know for DF hack to work with is version 0.74.03

The same as the master branch of DFHack, which is 0.44.12-r3.

36
Are the dependencies for Webfort different than for DF hack?

So far, it depends on websocketpp. However, the source code is included as a git submodule, so this dependency is probably going to be invisible to the user. Perhaps I've misunderstood your question.

37
How much have you used it personally?

I've playtested it a couple times. I only started a few days ago. You could say it's a strange mood.

38
I have been thinking about starting to stream DF. Do you think that this would run fast enough for a multiplayer DF stream?

So far during testing it's been lightning fast. The main problem is latency. If a client is on the opposite side of the planet from the host, they will see a 2×ping delay between when they input a key (e.g. scroll up) and when they see the result. Fortunately, dwarf fortress doesn't generally require lightning-fast response times, even in the UI, so I would reckon it would be decently well-playable even with low triple-digit ping. This is all speculation, as I haven't done any science. So far I've tried playing it at a distance of a few hundred km and it's been fine.

Oh, and, this should go without saying, but the game itself is not going to run faster than vanilla dwarf fortress does on the host's machine.

A Question: Is this compatible with DF-hack?

Actually, it's made with DF-hack. I have not yet tested compatibility with any other modules; however, I would imagine most things should work fine. The web browser front-end leans on a version of TWBT (Text Will Be Text) from six years ago, since I forked from webfort which itself forked from TWBT circa 2014. This means that (currently) players can have three different tilesets (main map, text, and overworld/minimap), but there isn't z-level-overlaying yet. Creature graphics aren't even supported! Hopefully I can at least get TWBT support up to the modern day, but that's not as high priority as ironing out some of the current wrinkles with my implementation.

39
    "Why must the cancer of multiplayer afflict everything?"/u/JesterHell

    DFPlex is a plugin for DFHack which introduces simultaneous, real-time online co-op to fortress mode: each player has their own independent view, cursor, menus, etc. so nobody has to wrestle for control. It's a fork of webfort, so players join just by connecting from their web browser.

    Demonstrations
    Demo video, courtesy of  BLindiRL, flabort, and Kruggsmash.

    Try it out online right now. There are two options currently:
    • This site will host a dwarf fortress server for you as a paid service, and also offers a demo (linked).
    • courtesy of Hexa from the Dwarf Fortress Discord. Note: this server seems to have a pretty high latency, especially for those outside of Europe. Expect it to take a while to connect, and the UI to be a bit laggy. You can reasonably expect hosting your own server to be smoother. If the server is online, dwarves will be visible here: Join

    Another demonstration:

    Spoiler: "Two players (video)" (click to show/hide)

    (If the gif in the spoiler is too wide or doesn't play, here are imgur links: screen 1, screen 2)


    Features
    • Play fortress mode with your friends! No need to hotseat -- you can actually play simultaneously now. For example, two players might be designating areas to dig while a third is issuing build orders on the manager screen.
    • Play fortress mode alone, but with multiple screens into your fortress.
    • Going into a menu no longer pauses the game. (This is customizable in dfplex.txt, but highly recommended because otherwise the game will rarely progress if more than one player is playing.)
    Please save regularly (enable seasonal autosave!) and follow the install + set-up instructions after downloading.


    DFPlex v0.2.1: Download, compatible with DF + DFHack 0.47.04-r1.
    (For compatibility with other versions, compile from source at your own risk. Build instructions. Make sure to download exactly these versions!)

    You can also use this site to host a server for you instead of setting the hack up yourself.

    Buy a coffee: Bay12 · Me


    Installation Instructions
    Please carefully follow these basic set-up instructions.
    • You need an existing dwarf fortress + DFHack 0.47.04-r1 installation.
    • Download the appropriate zip from the link above and extract it into your df/dfhack installation, respecting the directory structure.
    • Make sure to have only the line enable dfplex in your dfhack.init and no other lines, because dfplex is incompatible with many other utilities.
    • After launching the game, connect from your web browser to your computer at http://localhost:8000/. (You can configure this in dfplex.txt). Warning: several users have reported problems using Chrome. Please try another browser. (Firefox version 72.01 is known to work fine.)
    • If errors occur which block you from making progress with your fortress, try pressing the backslash key (\) to disable multiplexing as a last resort workaround. See "troubleshooting" below for more advice.

    For your convenience, flbr has created a Windows batch script that downloads and assembles a fresh df/dfhack/dfplex installation. If you decide to use that script, please report technical difficulties during set-up to that thread, not this one. Caveat: as of 2021-02, some users are reporting this script no longer functions. Update: as of 2021-04, there may be a working version of the script here? I haven't tested this, so I give no promises that this works.


    Spoiler: "Troubleshooting" (click to show/hide)

    Spoiler: "Bug reports" (click to show/hide)

    Spoiler: "Feature requests" (click to show/hide)

    I'm not sure how to do adventurer mode yet. Warmist seems to have arena mode working already.

    Suggestions and questions are welcome. Please submit bug reports here or on github. Do not submit bug reports about interoperability issues with other plugins -- however, you may submit requests for compatability with specific plugins.[/list]

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