Bay 12 Games Forum

I should really commit that to memory- been a pain trying to tap into the red stuff when I can't get a nice wide spot.

Back to the topic though, if you are transporting the stuff up a long ways for convenient forges anything you do is going to cut the magma off from crabs and such on those higher z levels. You only need the slightest concern at the original opening and if you're using gears and such to power a pump then it is easy to just wall the whole thing in.

In cases where the stuff is already at an acceptable height I make a nice lattice to fill then slap down my forges with the solid blocks covering the channel down into it. I like the idea that there could be a giant molten crab prowling around below my forge area adding his heat to the process, and I'd even intentionally cause that to happen if it didn't take so long to coordinate that sort of thing.

Df makes sure that you have certain representative herds of animals on the map all the time. There's no particular delay after you kill them, but you won't have a new group pop up so long as the old one is on the map somewhere. I'm not sure if you can kill all but one and not get the next batch but the pitting non-murdered flightless owls method is definitely the only long term solution.

*They may trigger the next batch if you capture them in cages-

So a little horizontal a little vertical, however the vein goes?

The new images display well enough.

So is a blind shaft vertical but not open to the surface?

Clay and marble were usually quarried rather than mined. (That is, they just dug the entire top of the site off and then dug a pit down into the material.)

Coal mining is a good example of underground digging with a mostly horizontal orebody. Google "longwall mining" to get some diagrams on one way that works.

Also the Wikipedia article on underground mining is pretty good and has several diagrams of different techniques and mine features.

Well actually one of the links here (probably my one about roman mining) mentioned clay mining. The galleries were smaller so miners had to lay on their backs to dig.

Longwall mining gave some better results but I'm going to need awhile to sort through the terminology.

I got some historical date with how Chinese ancient mine working which can date back to 12th century B.C. But it will be a lot of work to translate them. I will make a short brief with one of them. A famous one is Aeruginous Mountain ancient copper mine at Daye County, Hubei Province. It's a deep mine into the mountain, and it's not just produce copper, but iron, cobalt, gold and silver.

They used shaft, level shaft(gallery), blind shaft, and inclined shaft. It also used a kind of tool to determine what rich the mineral is at that point. (washing/flowing the ore down with water to check). And using premade wooden structure to support the shaft/drift. (60cm x 60cm to 110cm or 130cm). And using pulley to lift the raw ore. And there are some blind shaft was used to collect the excessive underground water or rains. And dumping shaft to fill the useless rocks/leftover. There are theories that it either dig from the side of the hill and then dig down, or dig down then branched out with levels of galleries.

And when the ore is transferred to the surface, it will be melt right away into ingot or processed minerals before transporting else where.

http://203.68.243.199/cpedia/Content.asp?ID=69486

What is a blind shaft? All my searches just turn up some movie.

Well, due to geology training i can map out veins for minerals, most of the damn work was blasting and knocking on the walls to hear any echoing in the walls.

so what do you need?

Well I haven't actually seen any explicit description of how a gallery runs through veins. If there is evidence of several veins of desired material do you send out shafts after each one? Mine one out then start a shaft at whatever point is close to the next? Send out numerous shafts in parallel? Judging by longwall mining people don't ever quite do a grid but if I interpreted the pictures correctly they like to make two galleries next to each other (one way traffic?) with periodic access punched between them.

It seems at least that they never mined completely blind but aside from retreat mining how do you get at material that's past the walls of the gallery? I assume that making them too wide risks a collapse and obviously there are at least some materials distributed in a way that's wider than you would want to make the gallery.

Heh...I had to look up "Aeruginous"...never knew that was a word. I'm assuming that's Tonglushan? Better translation might be "Green Copper Mountain" (it's referring to verdigris, the greenish patina that forms on copper. Think Statue of Liberty.)

To be honest, prior to the industrial age and the steam engine, mines just weren't very extensive. It took a tremendous amount of man-hours to cut into a mountain, and the technology and engineering hadn't developed to allow bracing of tunnels that went very deep (either horizontally or vertically). Most mines were enlarged natural caves, or were relatively shallow by modern methods. You have to remember that this was an age before geology as a science or ground-penetrating radar or any of that sort of thing. If there was a mine, it was because somebody could tell from the surface that there was something work digging out. Which meant at least part of the vein was shallow or even exposed. And often it was more effective to strip mine/quarry it out rather than messing about with tunnels.

That's part of why I don't want to base my perception of old mines on things like the wikipedia articles about coal mining.

So like one shaft and one or two galleries going off of it about as far as you could expect a line of dudes to hand off buckets of water, whether or not water was actually an issue in that particular mine? I read that a few went on for a kilometer or more but I don't know if that's just one gallery now why they wouldn't branch it or if there are particular distances they'd want to keep between galleries in less sturdy rock.

The article about Medieval mining says that around 1200 or so a lot of the shallow mines dried up so they started putting more effort into getting below the water table and such. Were these mines more extensive at all or just kind of the same thing but into areas with difficult water and circulation conditions?

I followed the rabbit hole to roman deep vein mining
http://www.unc.edu/~duncan/personal/roman_mining/deep-vein_mining.htm

This actually tells me a whole lot of the basics, though I guess I'd need to know the geology of mineral deposits to understand how the galleries come off of the shaft.

The Welsh resource I can't really navigate. I run into a lot of abstracts I guess but can't tell what goes where really.

Anyone feel like I shouldn't learn and do this in python?

It looks like most of the open zelda stuff just kind of goes for like one dungeon or less. As such I think I won't worry about trying to make any of what I'm doing interface with that.