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Messages - Orangebottle

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1006
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 28, 2011, 11:35:18 pm »
Native:
He wasn't in Wild West Mafia.

I probably should've Unvoted in my last post. I'm too confused about too much.

Like why Crownoffire is being passive. And why he only started working on other suspicions when Irony prompted him to.

1007
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 28, 2011, 07:25:48 pm »
Orange, you need to think more and act less.
And he's right. Argh. NUKE has his own reasons for voting for a no lynch, and it's apparent that nothing I say or do is going to change that. He does something like this every game, regardless of team.

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If you think like NUKE for a second, do you think he would do that as scum?
Why would scumNUKE do this? Probably because he wants me to think he's town.

1008
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 28, 2011, 11:56:47 am »
What are you doing. I thought you were clever.
You must realise that someone who ends almost every sentence with a question mark is being overly passive and not expressing opinions of their own, which is a bad thing.
Hm. Good point, I hadn't thought of it that way.

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I believe it is a safe assumption. Scum have been lynched D1, but it is a rare occurrence.
Not that I think it is literally impossible to lynch scum D1, or even that it is prohibitively unlikely- I just think it is sufficiently unlikely that it makes sense to assume it won't happen, and act thereon (terms and conditions apply)
So, we shouldn't even try because there's a slightly increased chance we won't hit scum?

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I disagree for reasons previously stated:
Quote from: NUKE9.13
You earn little information from the death of a towny itself. At least, little valuable information. The process leading up to it, yes. I do not disagree. I am not advocating doing away with the process and ending the day right now with no one lynched; that would be stupid. I am merely objecting to the death at the end of the process.
For extra clarification: The dying part of the lynching process is pretty useless. The information you gain from that is also gained from NKs (to wit what other people's roles are like)
Mrh. I'm not entirely sure how to respond to this.

1009
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 28, 2011, 09:09:36 am »
Because Mr.Person does not have an affinity for the way I do things. Also, he is paranoid. Plus, none of that is for you, anyhow.
I didn't answer any of it. In the end, I'm still going to have to read through it to try and get a read on you.
Right now you read as a massive overreaction. Which is why I'm asking you questions.

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And my 2x WIFOM combo is fine. I know how not to get trapped. Because really, I'm not a moron. I don't think scum would directly engage in WIFOM as a solid defense for No Lynching. It's just... stupid. And you don't try to be stupid as scum. It's exactly what I would say/do in his position.
No, it isn't fine. Intelligence is not a measure of scumminess, webadict. Any of us could be scum, regardless of how smart or stupid we are. Action is a measure of scumminess, and voting for a no lynch is a scummy action, unless there's a damn good reason behind it. 

Using a lot of WIFOM is also a scummy action. Which is exactly what the bolded part is. Stop it.
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What would you do in his position?
I wouldn't be caught dead in his position as any team. :P
To answer your hypothetical, I'd  start scumhunting instead of pushing a no lynch and making myself look even scummier. Especially since I don't have an established meta of doing scummy bullshit on every day one ever to 'promote discussion'.

1010
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 28, 2011, 01:31:40 am »
Webadict:
You're just going to turn this into a massive shitfling between you and Person, aren't you? A good 90% of your post is insults. If we have to sift through all the crap you're throwing to find your answer, you're doing it wrong.

While I'm at it, why are you using DOUBLEWIFOM to say someone is town? That's faulty at best and blatant buddying at worst.

NUKE: Are you going to start boycotting question marks, now?????? How does using a lot of question marks make someone scum?????? Maybe they're just asking a lot of questions????????????????? How are question marks passive?????????

You missed my post back there, NUKE. How about a response?

1011
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 27, 2011, 06:12:17 pm »
I don't think we should lynch NUKE.
buddybuddybuddybuddybuddybuddybuddybuddybuddy
I don't care if it was a joke, stop buddying webadict.

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-If you assume (as I am doing) that whoever we lynch D1 is town, all the information we might get is also attained without killing them. The role-flip information is rather useless when the user is dead, and for a baseline of what other roles are like (allowing us to form expectations of the average role), NKs are just as effective.

Yes, but that is an assumption. An assumption based on evidence from previous games, but scum have been lynched on day one before.

 The NK actually gives less information, as unless an investigative role was right on the money, you have no idea who performed the kill. It could be the Mafia, an SK, or a vigilante. He could've targeted a PWV, or been targeted by a CPR doctor. While, with a mislynch, you have people who voted for the dead townie with questionable motive/arguments/accusations/whatever. You get their interactions with players from both. A lynch gives you a lot more to go off of than a night kill.

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-This is the Power Role Problem. When to reveal? Ideally, not until said reveal will end the game in victory for the town. However, I believe that in most games, a guilty investigation result is always worth revealing. Less significant information, not always, but people don't need to reveal information to act upon it. Every vote counts, and a cop who knows someone is innocent not voting for that person could swing the balance in their favour. Conversely, a cop who knows someone is probably guilty can make a case with additional confidence, increasing its strength and swinging the balance against them.
If that person is acting scummy enough, they should be lynched anyway because they could be a godfather.

Urist. Mind your own business. I play as I play, and I have no meta on Andrew. I'd FoS you, if defending others wasn't within your meta.

Andrew. I'll give you a hint. It has something to do with your color choice.

Nuke. Fuck you as well.

PFP, no electricity, battery officially 'low'.

I don't see how color choice has anything to do with Andrew being scum. Unless you want to explain it to me, stop trying to be Org and play the damn game.

1012
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 27, 2011, 01:56:18 pm »
You don't seem the least bit upset over accomplishing nothing, OrangeBottle. Nor following up your questioning with something useful.

And quit being an idiot. Of course I'm not fully ready to lynch TolyK. I'm just shoving him around a bit.
Of course I'm not upset. What do you expect me to do, run around screaming in rage because a large argument I had ended up doing nothing? I fail to see how that moves me on the scumminess scale, so I assume this is a pressure vote.

No Lynch. Proposing this D1- does this really make me scum? Why would I, as scum, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would I, as town, propose this course of action? Does this seem likely? In what situation would this, from a town perspective, actually be the right thing to do? Does this seem likely?
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Orangebottle
To a degree, the same response as to MBP. To a lesser degree, though, because I get the impression that you have at the very least briefly considered what I have asked MBP to consider.
One thing you have been accosting me over: Apparently I am advocating doing nothing. I do not recall this happening. When did this happen. Have I, am I, doing nothing? I do not believe so. No Lynch does not preclude people from talking. It does not preclude people from spilling their scumguts all over the place. However, it does mean no one dies at the end.
I believe that D1 lynches often hit the wrong people. Even when one is really quite certain. In... what was it? Totem? I proposed just lynching someone at random, because it would have a higher chance of hitting scum than a well-thought out lynch. I would propose the same here, but for fear that we might lose someone interesting. (Totem, being a Meph game, was liable to be less chaotic than this one. Also I was scum and wanted everyone dead ASAP)
I could answer a number of these questions, but they look like WIFOM and I'd like to know why you're using them.
We would still miss out on the information we get from the lynch, getting information from the night kill is almost always WIFOM, and confirming things beyond kills recquires a lot of claiming which only provides the scum with very valuable targets for possible roleblocking/killing/etc.
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LYNCH THE LURKERS!
ALSO LYNCH WEBADICT BECAUSE HE IS ALWAYS SCUM PAST N1 RIGHT?
Lovely.
I don't think we should lynch NUKE.
This does seem to be in line with his meta as either side. Not sure I'm ready to remove my vote just for that, though.


1013
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 27, 2011, 01:27:40 am »
MBP, please don't copypasta.

Also, what the fudge are you two arguing over? Because you guys both sound completely ridiculous.
What started as me telling MBP to not ask ridiculous RVS questions snowballed into some huge shitfling. It gave everyone plenty to look at, though.

If he wants to continue it, he can. If he can find something to go off of.

Webadict: Why is TolyK scum again? Because of bad word choice?
It gave nobody anything, actually. It'll likely be completely ignored.

And, partially. Of the quoted post, his word choice was bad. In other posts, however, I find his word choice to be contrived and non-confrontational.
...
I was expecting something more.
And you're fully ready to lynch him over poor word choice?

1014
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 27, 2011, 12:02:45 am »
MBP, please don't copypasta.

Also, what the fudge are you two arguing over? Because you guys both sound completely ridiculous.
What started as me telling MBP to not ask ridiculous RVS questions snowballed into some huge shitfling. It gave everyone plenty to look at, though.

If he wants to continue it, he can. If he can find something to go off of.

Webadict: Why is TolyK scum again? Because of bad word choice?

1015
Other Games / Re: How did you last die?
« on: November 26, 2011, 10:05:30 pm »
I flew as hard and as fast as I could, stopping only to throw a glowing ball of ruby light at my opponent. When I had left him safely behind, I began casting a spell of recall. In the midst of my casting, a massive red thing composed mostly of claws, teeth, and glowing green eyes charged from the brush nearby and devoured me whole.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1016
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 26, 2011, 09:57:17 pm »
Indeed. Yet the whole point is that it was RVS. RVS. RVS.RVS. Jsut waiting for it to sink in your head. RVS.RVS. Should be fine now i hope.
RVS does not excuse terrible questions. Have you played a beginner's game before? Apparently not, because you would've seen something like this:
Ideally you should ask game related questions in the RVS. Asking what kind of flavor of ice cream is a player's favorite does absolutely nothing to help you find scum, which is your primary goal.

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Oh hey, he wrote bussing instead of tunneling. I should disregard that it's pretty evident what he mean, and also that he did wrote tunneling 2 times elsewhere.
No, it really isn't.

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Insult ? Nah. They are more remarks. And as in the quote, yes, stupidity makes me angry. Thus the remarks.
An insult by any other name...

Would still be an insult.

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Well if they are so numerous why cant you even find one and post it, we have plenty of time. Please be cooperative, i can't wait to see what you will come up with.
Find one? Ok.
Where are these 'fallacious argument' you keep referring to?
There's one. One relevant question. Want more? I have dozens waiting.

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And finally, stating the blatantly oblivious, especially when it has been stated earlier, does not count as being active. Parroting since you failed to add anything remotely relevant. Nolynching is a loss of a day ? Golly jeepers, i would never have guessed it. Except i did.
So, what? Are you accusing me of active lurking now? That's what it looks like.

1017
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 26, 2011, 09:13:41 pm »
Except that he did exactly that, voting for a Nolynch. You are tunneling, but it's hardly as bad as going no-lynch, and staying ground, on day 1. You arguments are dumb sure, but they are not detrimental to town. Pushing for a nolynch is, big time. Actually, you don't seem to creeped out by this, while it's one of the big scumtell you can get.
I'm voting for NUKE right now. And I'm supposed to be the dumb/blind one. Right.
Does this mean that lynching you isn't detrimental to the town? How nice.

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Random vote does anything to you ? How is that less relevant than asking someone what color they prefer ? How about you get your head out your ass and actually look at what is happening around
I'm pretty sure I've told people asking those sorts of questions to ask relevant questions. Oh, wait, look! I have!

Spoiler: Oh look, some proof! (click to show/hide)
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Possibly since nobody is caring about you right now, since Nuke is focus center at the moment.Blatant stupidity are continuing to say that you should be my top pick since you are a bussing idiot, while Nuke is voting Nolynch, a pretty scummy move. Just so you can understand it, since understanding don't seem to be easy for you Nolynch is scummier than tunneling in my opinion. Faulty reasoning, all your shit on rvs. Frankly, you are the only one caring about that.
Do you even know what bussing means? And yes, I do care that people aren't asking RVS questions that have the potential to be useful.
How is a person's favorite color, the name of their dog, the type of car they drive, or favorite flavor of ice cream supposed to help you figure out if they're scum or not?

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You don't have to believe me, but i'm not really angry. Sure, reading your arguments make me feel dumber each time, but i get over it. Then I just chuckle softly
Because happy people fill their posts with insults directed at the person making them happy. Right.

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Care to show me wich one ? I seem to have missed those elusive relevant questions.
It's not just one. There are many questions I have asked that are relevant to the game, and I'm not going to quote all of them.

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Just pointing some nice Parroting skillz
...Parroting what, exactly?

1018
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 26, 2011, 07:35:34 pm »
Oh hey orange,  almost did not see you there under the flow of bullshit exiting your mouth ( or typing pad thing, whatever). A quick copy paste and maybe you will stop being a douche and actually understand stuff.
Yes, I'm the douche. I've been insulting you the whole time and calling you an ignorant sonofabitch who doesn't know the first thing about the game.

Wait. No I haven't. Shut up.

Quote from: OrangeBottle
Quote from: MBP
is question was how my RVS question would help catch scum, the answer being of course they wont do much, since they are RVS, He then proceeded to blindingly point at me for dodging is (useless) question. basically, looks to me like beginning scum trying to show he's working hard for town, yet coming waaaaaay short.
If you think I'm newscum, why are you voting for NUKE?

Because he is scummier than you ? Maybe since he seriously offered to no-lynch, and is explication was less than stellar ? You are not the center of the game, kiddo
Really? Because according to you, I'm someone who is making shit up to lynch you, says nothing but bullshit accusations, and is working really really hard to look like town but ends up looking like newscum and pissing you off. And NUKE simply voted for a no lynch. From your perspective, how am I not the scummiest thing on the planet right now?

Quote from: MBP
Quote from: OrangeBottle
My question wasn't useless. I was trying to get you to ask actual questions instead of stuff like,"Hey Orange, what would you do if the sky were suddenly green?". That doesn't help you catch scum. You then dodged the question by not answering it at all and calling me a hypocrite.
If your goal was for me to stop RVS-ing and ask actual question, why not actually say so ? Again with the dodging the question. I answered earlier, it was RVS. That post was posted 5 minute after the start of the game, are you blind ?
Apparently you still don't understand.
You were asking stuff like:
How did you feel about understanding that this question is actually useless ?
That isn't even an RVS question. It's completely irrelevant. I wanted you to ask better, more relevant RVS questions, as opposed to terrible crap like this.

Quote from: MBP
Quote from: OrangeBottle
Quote from: MBP
Urist: I always fight tooth and nail, especially when faux-town idiots use faulty reasoning or blatant stupidity as their arguments. Thus my reaction to orange. Ain't Ad Hominem if it's true, dear.
I never voted for you. I don't remember calling you scum. I said your RVS questions were terrible. You just got all worked up about it.

Agreed, but then again I hate when peole are stupid around me. You hit that button pretty well.
I'd like to know where my 'faulty reasoning' and 'blatanty stupidity' are. You seem to be the only person who thinks that.

Quote from: MBP
Quote from: OrangeBottle
Quote from: MBP
As for now, my vote will stay on Nuke, since Nolynch day 1 is counterproductive. I am aware that myslinch chances are high, but a free day is too much of a gift to scum and especially third parties.

So you have someone you think is obvnewscum, but you're voting for someone who has boycotting RVS and being pretty scummy on day one as their meta? Makes me think that the only reason you're calling me scum is to get me off your back.
Hahaha oh wow. Actually, i call you scum since you seem so intent on using fallacious argument and willfull ignorance to get people to agree with you. You can stay on my back all you want, you are only proving yourself a fool, and it's entertaining. And now point by point !
If it's so entertaining, why are you so angry? Where are these 'fallacious argument' you keep referring to?


Quote from: OrangeBottle
-Dodging my question, and Urist's.
Quote from: MBP
Urist i admit had valid point and they have been adressed. On yourself, if you could ask actually relevant question then I would answer them. No luck on that front so far.
Most, if not all of my questions have been relevant to this game. Even my RVS questions.

Quote from: OrangeBottle
-Not voting for the person he thinks is most suspicious.
Quote from: MBP
Except it's what i'm doing. Duh
Refer to my above point, NUKE vs OB in scumminess.

Quote from: OrangeBottle
-Overreacting to a simple question.
Quote from: MBP
You may have to point me which question it would be, from my view it's illogism/blatant disregard for fact that get me worked up.
Pow.
Quote from: OrangeBottle
-Many useless RVS questions.
Quote from: MBP
Nice way to end the list. Guess you needed a little padding ? You should have plenty of material, since some are still on the RVS

Quote from: MBP
Quote from: OrangeBottle
It seems like a waste of a day to no lynch. That's what it seems like to me.

Any other insight, oh master ? This was high caliber play, right there.
That wasn't even directed at you. I was expressing my opinion to NUKE.

Your formatting is awful. It was hard to tell whether you said something or I said something. I've separated it out, for everyone else.

1019
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - Signups closed! [18/18]
« on: November 26, 2011, 05:08:36 pm »
Also, a hypothetical scenario: you're driving around the town, when suddenly a traffic light appears. Which colour is the light currently lit?
Almost didn't notice this.
Another awful RVS question. Is this supposed to be a joke? Seriously guys, stop asking shit like this.

Jack: Heh but i did find those questions stupid. Powder was not a question, jsut a demand to stop stupid question. I'm okay with that, it was RVS anyway back then.
That doesn't excuse ignoring them.

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as for Orange bottle, can't remember any real question from him. Sure, he spewed random shit saying my question were dumb then showed that he know the concept of RVS, wich i find disengenuous. I'll indulge you anyway
Urist, and also Powder : How did you feel about understanding that this question is actually useless ?
How many 3rd parties?
How are you going to catch scum with those?

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is question was how my RVS question would help catch scum, the answer being of course they wont do much, since they are RVS, He then proceeded to blindingly point at me for dodging is (useless) question. basically, looks to me like beginning scum trying to show he's working hard for town, yet coming waaaaaay short.
If you think I'm newscum, why are you voting for NUKE?
My question wasn't useless. I was trying to get you to ask actual questions instead of stuff like,"Hey Orange, what would you do if the sky were suddenly green?". That doesn't help you catch scum. You then dodged the question by not answering it at all and calling me a hypocrite.

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Urist: I always fight tooth and nail, especially when faux-town idiots use faulty reasoning or blatant stupidity as their arguments. Thus my reaction to orange. Ain't Ad Hominem if it's true, dear.
I never voted for you. I don't remember calling you scum. I said your RVS questions were terrible. You just got all worked up about it.
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As for now, my vote will stay on Nuke, since Nolynch day 1 is counterproductive. I am aware that myslinch chances are high, but a free day is too much of a gift to scum and especially third parties.
So you have someone you think is obvnewscum, but you're voting for someone who has boycotting RVS and being pretty scummy on day one as their meta? Makes me think that the only reason you're calling me scum is to get me off your back.
-Dodging my question, and Urist's.
-Not voting for the person he thinks is most suspicious.
-Overreacting to a simple question.
-Many useless RVS questions.
The list gets larger and larger.


This is odd, because it somewhat contradicts your 'cautious play'. Did you even consider those possibilities?
No, you mentioning them is the first time I considered these possibilities [/sarcasm]

I have cautiously analysed what I know. This is obviously very little. At this point in time, with no better targets to go after, and the RVS still going strong, I am inclined to give weight to the theory that given the large number of players the chance of there being no useful investigative roles is quite low, and that the potential information gained from night actions would offset the information lost by not lynching someone, provided that one also takes into consideration that D1 lynches do not hit scum reliably. Also, one assumes that everyone has sent in an entertaining picture and has an entertaining role to go with it, so it seems like such a waste to lynch them before they get to have any fun. Thus, No Lynch.
It seems like a waste of a day to no lynch. That's what it seems like to me.

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Speaking of which, Andrew425- You're scum and everyone knows it. Now crack like an egg and spill out the scumjuices.

PPE: Powder Miner STOP RVSING. DO SOMETHING USEFUL.
Interesting. What made you choose Andrew? Or were you just RVSing like you're telling Powder Miner not to?

1020
Mafia / Re: Bring Your Own Picture Mafia - A Day in the Art Museum [Day 1]
« on: November 26, 2011, 02:09:52 pm »
...Cute.
Also very vague.
May I have an actual answer, please?
Very well.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
In summary, I intend to act cautiously.
Thank you.

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Quote from: Orangebottle
No lynch
I'm not amused,NUKE. Not amused at all. Are you trying to say that the entire game is pointless? Why don't you want us doing anything?
I was promot-
Quote from: Orangebottle
Hidden abbr tags!
Daaaaang. Am I so predictable?
Yes. :P
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On a more serious note:

Can't decide if this is incredibly audacious , or just jestering. No lynch especially, care to explain how it would be a good idea ?

Lets go Nuke
The level of chaos is unknown, and there are a lot of players. Which is to say, we have no idea what to expect. The possibility that the town has a glut of investigative roles is valid. A D1 no lynch, then, is not as foolish a course of action as it normally is in games where the structure is well known, and we can expect lynchings to have a useful effect.
D1 lynches being essentially random, it may be better not to risk killing a useful towny who might otherwise have identified a member of the scumteam in the night.
Conversely, there's a possibility that we have no investigative roles. Or perhaps we have weak, or %chance investigative roles? We could also hit scum on day one. You're also ignoring that the scum/third parties probably have kills, which would kill off random people anyway. They could also be a Cult instead of a Mafia. Which means they would be converting instead of killing, which is undeniably worse.

This is odd, because it somewhat contradicts your 'cautious play'. Did you even consider those possibilities? Also, why wouldn't lynches have a useful effect in this game?

First!
Alright, Wuba, how do you think flavor will be thrown around?
Why do I care?
Answer the question please. Me no like dodgy.
And how does this question help you find scum?
Was just wondering, since flavor can have a large effect on play/roleguess. (i.e. demon as town? blasphemy!)
Considering that the flavor seems to be "random pictures from the internet collected and put in a museum suddenly come to life", I don't think there's much of a way to guess roles from that. I still don't see how that helps you hunt scum. Guessing at roles in an obviously not-flavor-heavy game is stupid, especially at this point because we have such little information to go off of regarding them.

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