Bay 12 Games Forum

There should be vodka scented cologne to go along with the shampoo and hand sanitizer, to complete that I'm a hardcore alcoholic smell.

But also to get across that you care about your look, obviously.

The set would be called “High Functioning” if sold together.

I think you could consider taking a zero off as dividing by ten for every one, so depending on the number, it’s greater than zero but less than 1¢

I’m not sure what drew me to the game, I guess I like solving puzzles. I’ve been here on and off for years.

I joined a BM, got worked up and paranoid the ICs were scum and was promptly eliminated D1. My second game was a scum game with at least one of the same ICs which we romped, which was cool.

I think then my third game was an NQT game, in which I was a third party and allowed to choose my wincon, but I don’t think I did well. I think Tiruin insinuated everyone had a counter to my ability so I didn’t actually use it.

I wasn’t a nice person back then in games a lot of the time, which I regret. Trying to be nicer in games now.

Despite our games tending to be power heavy, I really prefer just being a good ol’ VT.

I think actually playing mafia has made me a little better at reading people irl, to some extent, at least in terms of figuring out their motives.

There may be some inklings of regret about that now. I’m not sure why FoU is going after Toony when his PoE includes a player (NJW) that other people have indicated they might vote for, and that I think I have a pretty good case on, and I’m his strongest townread. I mean, maybe the sheer ignorance of it all is a towntell? *clutches at straws*

My day has basically been that I was scumreading NJW, who was building a “case” on FoU, so I was reading FoU as town by association. Given my vociferous defense of FoU, I felt pretty confident NJW was scum. Now that FoU seems to be actively trying to get someone to hammer him, I’m a lot less confident in both those reads. I still think NJW is the more likely to be scum - I still think his case on FoU prior to FoU’s current musings is horrible - but… I don’t want to be in the hole FoU has dug for himself.

I’m now only pretty confident that FoU and NJW are not on the same team. As I say, my preference is to get rid of NJW, but I think either flip tells us a lot about the other player.

((We only have lasers on the chimera I thought?))

I find alcohol makes people less sentient, not more :p

Quote from: FallacyofUrist on September 05, 2022, 08:01:28 pm

Quote from: NJW2000 on September 05, 2022, 07:02:53 pm

Huh... careful with that ability, Knightwing. We may want to hold Tric captive a little. For glorious reeducation, if necessary.

What makes you think it's an ability? Unless I missed one of Knightwing's posts?

I thought he was the befriender, given he was claiming he could townconfirm himself, and there probably is a befriender because Tric is probably telling the truth.

The claim from Jim makes me reconsider that assumption.

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Not sure how I feel about the Jim thing... I guess it makes me want to keep him alive, as it's an incentive for scum to not nightkill me. And it's kind of confirmable. I guess it wouldn't make much sense to claim as mafia, at least. Probably Town.

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Max is correct, I haven't claimed anything yet. I don't think my role is going to give any deep insights into how this setup works, so probably not going to today.

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I did get why Hector and FoU might have been naturally talking about mafiakart racing... there was just something weird about the exchange.

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Briefly, reads:

Knightwing Town. Jim probably Town due to claim, absence of wolfish behaviour, fabulous entrance. Tric is third party and probably telling the truth.

I'm bad at reading Max. I guess I'll have a look at some of his scum games at some point today.

Can't tell with Toony... I find them quite difficult to read, and they're just very strong.
Max: what do you think of Toony this game - still leaning Town? Also, I remember Web once saying you had a theory about Toony's play - does that have any bearing on this game so far?

Hector has been focused on 3p and defending himself today - despite claim that daygame most important. Vote on me mostly unexplained, seems to be on the basis that I'm signalling mally. Nonetheless, didn't immediately go for killing the possibly town-recruitable third party Tric after the "lie" was exposed. Some gut sense that they actually believe in the reasonableness of their own points. Unsure.

At this stage, prefer FoU over Hector. Partly because, as Hector rightly points out, the weirdness I've seen was mostly on FoU's side, and partly because Hector has made some posts that do inspire confidence. On the other hand:

Dubious signalling theory aside, FoU doesn't look great. Stuff like this - claims we're still in RVS when we're patently not, and pre-emptively threatens/justifies going after players for their votes on FoU. Their next post talks about scumhunting without, again, actually doing any. Bad in itself, also doesn't line up with FoU's townplay from what I remember, though I haven't played with them much.

I wouldn't say they're activelurking, but I would say a lot of their posts do very little to potentially advance the game. Their first five posts this game, say, have a lot of questions and observations but basically nothing interesting.

Yeah, FallacyofUrist seems like a good choice.

I think you’re scum because you’re rolling out this cookie cutter scum hunting nonsense that I was focusing on third parties, despite - and I hate having to repeat myself but it’s relevant to the case - the recruitable third party claim being the first significant thing in the game, the game having a weird context to it in having fewer than 9 players but more than 7, meaning an uncertain number of scum which prompted speculation on the alignment distribution which logically had to involve the claim that Tric made.

Further, I provided major context in my town-meta for my distaste of third parties with the linked post from the MafiaKart game, which parallels this game with the early third-party claim and the attempts by Tric to make it seem as though he’d be a boon for town (WHICH IS EXACTLY HOW FOU FRAMED IT IN THE MAFIAKART GAME HE THREW IN HIS THIRD-PARTY LOT WITH THE MAFIA) but you conveniently ignore that - and I hate saying this too - in bad faith, despite me also saying it’s something that weighs on my mind from time to time. We’re all shaped by our experiences, so why does that very significant mafia experience not count in a game with a weird number of players, an uncertain number of scum, a recruitable third party, and two different claims on how to deal with it in Jim’s befriend and Toony’s psych ability?

This leads me into how the various factions may deal with the third-party. We know Tric was mistaken in his assertion he stays in the game once he achieves his wincon, and we know of two claims on how to deal with him: Jim’s befriend would allow Tric to achieve his wincon or kills him, thus removing him from the game which really only aids scum, and Toony’s psych which would make Tric town. Jim has claimed that in order for Tric to be befriended he would have to target you, which links you and Jim together as a possible scum team, in addition to his also harping on about cookie-cutter scum slips like focusing on third parties.

Another factor in you being scum is in what I see (and have explained in my previous handful of posts) is the weak “10-4” that initially made you interested in Fallacy’s possible scumminess, but not as a member of the scum team proper, but as a mally. You cannot possibly paint FoU as mally and then try to say they’re the main threat to town. If there’s two scum, and a mally, and a third party, town are dead if we miselim today (8 players, 2 scum, 1 scum tp, 1 neutral tp, 4 town) that’s a loss for town, barring any abilities that kept town from losing. Consequently, if we assume a mally, there’s 1 scum, and killing them will win the game for town, assuming no other weirdness, so why are you building a case against FoU, the foundation of which he was signaling as a mally?

Given that you and Max are the only two players who appear to be seriously considering the possibility of a mally, that links you two. Tenuously, sure, but still.

Regardless, the common denominator in these pairings is NJW.

A further issue I have with NJW’s case against FoU is his assertion FoU isn’t scumhunting, which also applies to Jim, it also applies to Knightwing, arguably also to Max, and it probably also applies to me, at least prior to this post. Consequently, the only thing FoU has done differently is the “weirdness”, which is not a scumtell as far as I’m aware.

I also don’t like how he made himself seem like he was the one stopping a possible mally signal the scum team… when he was the one to point out the “signals”.

TL;dr NJW is focusing on someone he thinks is the mally which, if it exists, would likely only have a single member scum team to win with, and his case against FoU is based on “weirdness” which is NAI if the lack of scumhunting is applied between all the other players not scumhunting.

Anyway. FoU needs to get their finger out. While I don’t think you’re scum, I don’t want to have stuck my neck out and you just blend in to the background, even if a significant part of the reason for me thinking you’re not scum is that NJW is.

That shouldn’t affect the DoJ thing, hopefully. There’s the House investigation into it, that would be promptly stopped.