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Messages - hector13

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586
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 18, 2023, 12:52:29 am »
Unvote

Right, I need to be clear that I’m still with Esteemed ToonyMan re:Esteemed EuchreJack, somewhat surprised the Esteemed sofanthiel wagon actually formed, but it was an effective means to get them out and posting, plus I do actually want to them to respond to at least my questions.

Basically I’m at the point where I can read the thread but not post too much (for the remainder of my night, yes, but not too much after) before the deadline, maybe a little bit in the afternoon tomorrow and for an uncertain period in the evening which may not overlap with the deadline, that depends on other people.

So yeah, I need to make my position known:

I would very much prefer Esteemed EuchreJack to be lynched, and I’m not wholly comfortable with an Esteemed sofanthiel lynch given that there are four or five other players who have just dissolved into the background too, but… hugely reluctant support would be given to it, though I’d be calling for an Esteemed EuchreJack lynch the entire time.

587
General Discussion / Re: Israel-Gaza/Palestine war thread
« on: December 17, 2023, 07:22:20 pm »
Have they changed the numbers recently? I thought the number of murdered by Hamas was 1200, plus the 250 hostages.

588
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 06:57:43 pm »
...Anyway, I would like to request that, if not too inconvenient, any chosen player not be hammered until number for hammer plummets down to seven, and upon day end, at time of execution, only be voted by seven players maximum.

As for why, it grants a benefit which will be obvious soon after we do that.

I should be less lazy it was literally their last post.

You did make it easier to find though.

Wasn’t it Esteemed Secretdorf that said they got benefits for doing vote counts at some point? Probably related to that.

589
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 06:50:16 pm »
Esteemed sofanthiel

Which player(s) do you consider to be most likely to be Town, and why?

Which player(s) do you consider to be most likely to be scum, and why?

Which player(s) do you most want more information from, and how are you going to go about doing that? My advice would be to pick one or two of them, vote them, ask them questions, and try to tie them down in your mind as town or scum.

You don’t need to solve the entire game on D1, but trying to solve one or two players is a good start.
Imp, Egan, and Toony all contributed to the crusade against pirates early in the game and before Fallacy's confirmation of their concerns.  A few posts ago, I was still skeptical about the existence of the marauders; now I'm inclined to trust the three fighters (they could potentially be a different scum team, considering that, based on my mental calculus, the number of pirates is also three, but I'm content with ridding this ship of any unrighteous sailors before delving in and exploring such possibilities).

Jack, on rather obvious grounds, and Max, for reasons most of my posts thus far have concentrated on.  I also recall someone specifying that another participant admitted to being a pirate, but I can't, for the life of me, find that message.  I'll be very thankful if anyone can point me to it, for I lack the concentration required to sift through the whole thread.

I doubt this one is a mystery; it's what I've been doing the entire game.

Could you talk us through the mental calculus of the highlighted part, please?

590
General Discussion / Re: Israel-Gaza/Palestine war thread
« on: December 17, 2023, 06:36:11 pm »
Well… they did shoot the three shirtless guys carrying a white flag with a message in Hebrew, killing two and wounding one, the one running back to safety, and then presumably shouting in Hebrew for help (the BBC articles I’ve read mention a shout for help in Hebrew) and then finishing the job when he comes out.

So… incompetence doesn’t really cover that.

591
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 06:22:20 pm »
Esteemed sofanthiel

Role name doesn't count.  Inspect doesn't count.  Not to me, and shouldn't much to you.  Alignment pirate, that matters.
So Jack and Toony are pirates, yet they both claim to not belong to the pirate alignment, which is itself separate from pirate roles?  Sorry if this has already been chewed up earlier, as I only recently became invested in the situation after Jack directed my attention to Fallay's clarification, which outright stated that pirates are scum.

It stated if Pirates exist as an alignment, they can only be scum. That’s not the same thing as confirming there are Pirates.



Esteemed Imp

Every existing scum team was informed that Pirates are Red, in a way that makes it obvious that Pirates and Mafia are equivalent.

If EuchreJack is honest about having access to that chat, then if it was a scum chat it would have the info about my ability in it.  Which would inform about Pirates and Mafia being a lot alike, even if the thing is handled in some 'there are no colors here' fashion.  It also removes all doubt.  Pirate is an alignment.  And a color red, but if you can't see the color, you see the word alignment.  I believe based on what I see and have been told, there is zero chance of confusion, period.  If EuchreJack can see that chat, and my ability is in there, EuchreJack could not have been confused about what Pirate means, even if he didn't think to ask.  It would have made him hesitate, I feel sure, to openly ask who wants to be a pirate.

If this is the case, why are you not bothered about Esteemed ToonyMan and Esteemed Egan_BW also claiming a red Pirate in their PM?



Esteemed The Canadian kitten

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Cool beans, you found someone you think is town, which can be as useful as finding someone you think is scum.

Can you do it with another player, possibly finding someone you think is scummy and trying to find evidence of why to convince us to agree?



Esteemed Maximum Spin

Oh, to be clear, I'm abundantly fine with that happening later, closer to day end, I just wanted to establish that I definitely want to break Secretdorf's condition from earlier at some point. I don't feel the need to convince you to vote right this second if you don't want to.

What was Esteemed Secretdorf’s condition that you want to break?



Esteemed Lenglon

Hector13: Thank you, that told me what I was interested in.

NP

592
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (18 / 18) - Day 1 - Daykills On The Table
« on: December 17, 2023, 05:38:32 pm »
Spoiler: spoiler for posts (click to show/hide)

This is Esteemed sofanthiel’s first post, RP’s a bit, answers some RVS, asks some RVS, drops an RVS vote on Esteemed Maximum Spin with… no real impetus to get him to respond.

Esteemed sofanthiel’s second post clarifies further their position, among other things:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Acknowledges they consider Esteemed Maximum Spin to be a good player, and the vote was for pressure despite not actually providing any pressure with a question or accusation.

His next two posts [1] [2] are to do with RTD, bit pointless.

I ask him about his vote, he responds:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Some paranoid throwing of shade  and some utter tosh about waiting until the end of the day for his first post RVS vote to actually get something useful - which I will readily accept I should have poked at more at the time, but got lost in my trying to catch up - and then saying that just… basically ignoring Esteemed Maximum Spin will be more useful than trying to engage with him?

Says he’s struggling with all the players here, which is fine. I find people saying that a little amusing since the number of players actually active and posting to keep track of isn’t that much more than a usual game, but I’m struggling with trying to figure out how to get the quiet ones involved too so *shrugs*

This brings us to today. Esteemed sofanthiel’s first post today is more of the same, votes Esteemed Maximum Spin again without anything else, though has put some effort into it since, while showing off their disengagement of the game by missing the posts in which Esteemed Lenglon and I provide some advice for Esteemed The Candian kitten to improve their hunting, before he expresses it further by woefully misunderstanding what Most Esteemed FallacyofUrist was saying about what the existence of a Pirate alignment would mean, despite it having been gone over by a few players before.

TL;DR I consider, based on your (disgusting! :p) policy of Lynch All Lurkers, Esteemed sofanthiel’s filler posts and apparent disengagement and misreading of what’s been happening have been more egregious than Esteemed The Canadian kitten’s almost complete absence until recently.

I haven’t really read anything since my last post.

593
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 04:44:18 pm »
Hector13: Please tell me why I should be voting Sofanthiel instead of Canadian.

I’ll work on this, I’m PFP and it’s a goddamn slog even without a post restriction.

594
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 04:43:10 pm »
You missed two fuck huge posts directed at another player who was being pressed because they were lurking. It shouldn’t take that much initiative to consider that it applies to you, too, even if you’re just skimming it.

595
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 04:22:17 pm »
Addendum because I’m not allowed a second to proof read: plus an apparent fascination with Esteemed Maximum Spin that hasn’t been explored at all.

596
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 04:17:57 pm »
All Most Esteemed FallacyofUrist has done is point out what was in the OP, and has been in the OP for however many weeks it took to get the game up and running. There has been no confirmation of the existence of Pirates outside of the players.

Okay, this repetition of hours-old talking points really gives me the impression that sofanthiel woke up, checked scumchat to get caught up, then started posting.

I get the same feeling. He asked about advice given to Esteemed The Canadian kitten, which was in the prior two posts to one he quoted with me voting him. That shows a lot of disengagement.

597
General Discussion / Re: Things that made you go "WTF?" today o_O
« on: December 17, 2023, 03:17:46 pm »
Yup, if your body is unable to retain hydration it’s… pretty bad. Hopefully it gets better soon.

598
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 02:05:23 am »
Let’s see if we can summon someone else, bearing in mind we expect follow through on the advice, Esteemed The Canadian kitten.

Esteemed sofanthiel, at the risk of falling into the same behaviour I did in the Supernatural game Esteemed EuchreJack linked, perhaps you’d like to join us and follow the advice Esteemed Lenglon and I gave Esteemed The Canadian kitten?

599
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 01:58:00 am »
[...]

The best way to avoid Lynch All Lurkers, thus, is to not be the person with the least posts. Yes, I will accept that lurking is anti-town, but anti-town doesn’t necessarily equal scum. Lynch All Lurkers is a horribly flawed way of lynching if your goal is to lynch scum.

I’m with Esteemed ToonyMan: Esteemed EuchreJack has made himself look like scum, and if he flips town it’s going to provide information about a bunch of players, and that fact alone makes him an infinitely better lynch than a lurker.
What do we learn if EuchreJack flips Town?  I'd argue we learned nothing.  We learn that same lesson every time EuchreJack acts like this and we vote him out.  We vote for EuchreJack because we can't dig a little deeper.  We vote for EuchreJack because he does things without putting as much thought into it as he should.  We vote EuchreJack and accept the results, in spite of how insane that sounds.  Because it will happen again.

Personally, I would be okay with flipping EuchreJack if, assuming he turned Town, you, Imp, and ToonyMan were directly tied to his fate.  Not because it would be good for Town, but because it would be good for you.  But, that won't happen.  You would accept that EuchreJack shouldn't have done the things that he did.  And I can prove it because you posted this when TricMagic died:
He literally asked for it. Could’ve done with one a bit more informative, but it looks like it was a problem in need of an answer anyway.
Every problem can be solved with death, but the game can't be won by killing everyone.

Well there’s not really much to say about the rest of it because you’re probably right, and from your perspective coloured perhaps by the things you have claimed.

The problem I’m having is that Esteemed ToonyMan is also right, coloured by his own perspective. His perspective is backed up by two other players though, all of whom have independently claimed that Pirates are Red among other things, like Millers and Mafia being Red and other colours of alignment.




Esteemed The Canadian kitten

You’re here, the idea isn’t to clear yourself (necessarily) but engage more with the game. 18 players is a lot, consider the following, though you’ve already answered one part:

Which player(s) do you consider to be most likely to be Town, and why?

Which player(s) do you consider to be most likely to be scum, and why?

Which player(s) do you most want more information from, and how are you going to go about doing that? My advice would be to pick one or two of them, vote them, ask them questions, and try to tie them down in your mind as town or scum.

You don’t need to solve the entire game on D1, but trying to solve one or two players is a good start.

600
Mafia / Re: FBYOR 6 (17 / 18) - Day 1 - Shots Fired
« on: December 17, 2023, 12:23:46 am »
[...]

The best way to avoid Lynch All Lurkers, thus, is to not be the person with the least posts. Yes, I will accept that lurking is anti-town, but anti-town doesn’t necessarily equal scum. Lynch All Lurkers is a horribly flawed way of lynching if your goal is to lynch scum.

I’m with Esteemed ToonyMan: Esteemed EuchreJack has made himself look like scum, and if he flips town it’s going to provide information about a bunch of players, and that fact alone makes him an infinitely better lynch than a lurker.
What do we learn if EuchreJack flips Town?  I'd argue we learned nothing.  We learn that same lesson every time EuchreJack acts like this and we vote him out.  We vote for EuchreJack because we can't dig a little deeper.  We vote for EuchreJack because he does things without putting as much thought into it as he should.  We vote EuchreJack and accept the results, in spite of how insane that sounds.  Because it will happen again.

Personally, I would be okay with flipping EuchreJack if, assuming he turned Town, you, Imp, and ToonyMan were directly tied to his fate.  Not because it would be good for Town, but because it would be good for you.  But, that won't happen.  You would accept that EuchreJack shouldn't have done the things that he did.  And I can prove it because you posted this when TricMagic died:
He literally asked for it. Could’ve done with one a bit more informative, but it looks like it was a problem in need of an answer anyway.
Every problem can be solved with death, but the game can't be won by killing everyone.
It depends what you mean by “directly tied to his fate”. I’ve taken a position and I stand by it, if that gets me lynched, so be it, hopefully it proves informative for the rest of the town.

I’ll try to respond to the rest later, posting in between doing other things.

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