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There’s a journo in the UK called Max Steel

Find some horses on the plain, use ‘em to start the beginnings of a massive army!

Quote from: hector13 on February 03, 2019, 01:35:49 pm

You were transported to target yourself.

Here's the problem: what if I targeted Pavellius? The transport wouldn't change that. I'm confirmed as having been transported, but nobody can confirm as to whether I did what I say I did.

Well I made a bit of a silly mistake then.

You didn't visit Pavellius.

piratejoe

Quote from: hector13 on February 03, 2019, 12:10:43 pm

The only claimed roleblock was on Leodanny last night, which is a significant difference.

How do we know for a fact the mafia have either a framer or a consigliere?

I wasn't role blocked, you obviously weren't role blocked seeing how you killed Pavellius, I'm quite sure Icy would have claimed if he was role blocked...To be honest, Heydude could actually be a Consort if he actually accidentally targeted himself due to the transporter...

I know, that was my point.

Quote from: hector13 on February 03, 2019, 12:10:43 pm

Right, you found the scum team but you're not voting for either of them. You also waited until the latter half of D2 to inform us of that, despite it being pretty clear what happened between Leodanny/IcyTea/heydude.

This is the easiest claim to make given the information we have available, and it conveniently allows you to either "clear" your scum partner or mislead the town into thinking the townie is your scum partner. Notable in that it allows you to significantly change your reads list without too much hassle, too.

Equally so, I'm still bottom of the list, despite you apparently having incontrovertible proof (from your perspective) that heydude is scum, 'cause he visited himself and scum visited heydude.

I'm going to address the last part of this first, you do realize that, with the info available to me and that I have stated, you are the Mafioso, and their for the killing roll.

Yes, because I've pointed that out a number of times already :p

As for why I took so long is quite simple, I thought that, considering there was already a spy, and that spy died, it would make people believe that I might be lying about my role and just dismiss me as an easy scum lynch when I'm in fact town. If there is an issue with that, or if thats against the meta of this game, well, it's my second game, sorry. Lastly, how is this the easiest claim to make? The other spy is dead, the chances of there being yet another spy are less then you think. If I was trying to mislead people I would have claimed literally anything but the role that died yesterday.

If you are what role you say you are, you don't worry about it because it's obviously plausible, 'cause you are that role.

It's the easiest fakeclaim because the abilities of the role are easily gleaned. We know Pavellius was visited by scum, allowing you to claim you know scum visited Pavellius. We know two players claimed to be transported, and we know that heydude claimed to have visited IcyTea and was redirected to himself, which you have claimed prompted a "heydude was visited by scum" message.

Quote from: hector13 on February 03, 2019, 12:10:43 pm

Scum are also making strategies, using the information available of them to influence town to make a poor decision.

Case in point: piratejoe. He knows he messed up by not realizing earlier that only he or I could have performed the nightkill, now he's trying to dig his way out of that hole by implicating someone else with the information available in the thread.

I mean, it wasn't really a realization earlier that 'only you or I could have night killed' and more I didn't have time to actually be here for the latter half of the day up until yesterday. Still, I feel like mentioning that, I actually stated a plausible role, you have yet to do such a thing, and honestly, the argument of 'I don't want to have the mafia come after me' doesn't count at this point as we are in a Lynch or Lose situation. Anyway, hector13 nothing personal, you already know my reasons.

The first thing I stated right at the start is that Transporters stop scum from winning. We're not in LyLo, but it would be wise to kill scum.

The reason I haven't claimed is because we're guarenteed another night, and I want the scum to know I can mess them up. I've softclaimed some things already, but I might decide to block them. Maybe even shoot them. Perhaps I'll just defend their targets, or redirect their attacks someplace.

I don't care if mafia come after me, or maybe I just want them to think that.

I suppose, to be fair, if they're clever enough they already know what I am... but why take the risk and allow them to plan their way around what I can do?

Quote from: hector13 on February 03, 2019, 01:16:02 pm

What makes you say I trust you?

That you believe me without question when I say my action failed due to self-target (an unconfirmable claim), and thus assume I couldn't have performed the nightkill.

It's confirmed by two other players. Well, one, really, but they're basically confirmed town.

You were transported to target yourself. You're not dead, so you can't kill people. The same can be said of heydude.

Thus, from my perspective, piratejoe killed Pavellius.

One of you and heydude is scum. I don't trust that you're not trying to bus your partner, but I can't discount the potential piratejoe is bussing his.

Now then, I have a few things to say here, part of it being related to Hector13. This was after quite a good deal of thought and thinking about the information I have. Now, to start things off, with the transporter being confirmed by three people, at least one of them has to be town, and I highly doubt that Leo just got lucky and picked the right person as the other person transported, so that means Leo should not under any circumstance be lynched. Now, Hector13 claims that with Heydude and Icy transported, then that means I did the night kill, because clearly he didn't, there is an issue with this line of logic, you see, this is under the assumption that the transporter role blocks anyone they transport (which isn't true last I checked) and also means that the only thing Hector13 has as a defense is his own word of mouth and in reality he is just as likely at being the actually culprit using that assumption as I am. Thinking about all of the facts here, I'm fairly certain Hector13 himself isn't going to back down, and him making the first shot gives him an advantage, unfortunately.

I made no assumption regarding the transporter roleblocking anyone. They both targeted each other, and they were both transported to target themselves, meaning they both have actions that don't kill, else one of 'em would be dead.

I also pointed out I was by no means cleared in anyone else's eyes after I voted you, because I sat in the privileged position of apparently being the only town member unmolested in the night. Thus, with Leodanny transporting IcyTea and heydude, and neither of them being dead, the only person capable of killing is me or piratejoe.

I feel it is important to mention, seeing how no one did yet, that considering the only attempted role block last night was on the transporter, we know for a fact that the Mafia have either a Framer or a Consigliere, unless of course, Pavellius or they just didn't do anything at night, but I highly doubt that.

The only claimed roleblock was on Leodanny last night, which is a significant difference.

How do we know for a fact the mafia have either a framer or a consigliere?

What I mean by sledge hammer to this is basically stating my roll and then stating everything I know. I really can't do anything other than point out scummy behavior unless I go overt, or just try and hint at what I know. Though at this point I'm probably stuck doing the whole Sledge hammer mode anyway because the mafia would know something is up and honestly, if I don't put what I know on the table now, Town might lose. To put it quite simply, the mafia last night obviously visited Pavellius, but they also visited Heydude6. I know this because I have the grave misfortune of being the second spy which really doesn't help my case. Either way, this means that they were targeting you, Icy, instead of Heydude6. Now, because I highly doubt the mafia's Consig or Framer would visit a member of their team willingly, I'm dead certain you are town. So, I believe that the Consig visited their mafia buddy, and the Scum are Heydude6 and Hector13. Now, I'd prove to you that I'm spy because I bugged you, but because you stated you were transported and no one else visited you last night, I cant actually say anything everyone dosen't already know other than you would have been visited by someone else if it wasn't for the transporter. With all of this info on the table, I think you can see now why I wasn't too keen to just go overt and put all the cards on the table...

Right, you found the scum team but you're not voting for either of them. You also waited until the latter half of D2 to inform us of that, despite it being pretty clear what happened between Leodanny/IcyTea/heydude.

This is the easiest claim to make given the information we have available, and it conveniently allows you to either "clear" your scum partner or mislead the town into thinking the townie is your scum partner. Notable in that it allows you to significantly change your reads list without too much hassle, too.

Equally so, I'm still bottom of the list, despite you apparently having incontrovertible proof (from your perspective) that heydude is scum, 'cause he visited himself and scum visited heydude.

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Okay, I'm willing to see how this plays out between you, for now. I appreciate you have to present what you're doing as masterful town plan, but it's also what scum would be doing at this point.

Tell me, then, what town would be doing at this point. Not making strategies? Not using what little reliable information they have? Not taking into account that two of their three possible suspects are scum?

Scum are also making strategies, using the information available of them to influence town to make a poor decision.

Case in point: piratejoe. He knows he messed up by not realising earlier that only he or I could have performed the nightkill, now he's trying to dig his way out of that hole by implicating someone else with the information available in the thread.

Quote from: hector13 on February 03, 2019, 02:39:19 am

Why so evasive? You claim your action failed, but you're very insistent on hearing other folks' actions prior to making your own move. Trying to figure out roles...?

In this setup with these roles alive and Leodanny confirmed, conflicting claims are inevitable. If I claim now, I'll catch one scum. If others claim first, I'll catch both.

Yeah, and you also outed a crucial role for scum to target, and you did some bizarre jiggery-pokery with your vote at the end of D1.

This also conflicts with what you said in the next part; no claim is wholly implausible, yet claims are going to conflict. There are 5 players and 7 potential role claims to make. If claims conflict, scum are being bold.

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so you can make an educated guess at what you can and can't fakeclaim?

I did the math; this motive would make no sense. There is no wholly implausible claim, but any claim is necessarily countered so nothing is "safe", either.

False. The more information you have prior to you making your claim, the safer the claim you make will be, as scum. PPE: especially since you allude to that yourself in your "addendum 2" post.

Quote from: hector13 on February 03, 2019, 03:08:20 am

If you and IcyTea are claiming to have been transported, neither of you performed the night kill.

Only if heydude was originally targeting me. Targeting someone else, he still could have performed it.

PPE:

Addendum 2:
heydude: when you say who you targeted, don't say what you did.
hector: if you're town, and I'm not, you know which set of roles heydude is in if he's town. I'd like you to ask him for his results after he tells who he targeted.

I feel heydude will already provide us with that sans my asking, considering you've already mentioned it.

PPE2: never mind.

So, heydude presumably isn't the mafioso, else he'd be dead, presumably. Considering you were both targeting each other, I look forward to your arguments.

I, for one, am horribly insulted, or something to that effect, yessirree. Broken inside!

... though I guess I've always been that way

also, what is the smiley ":DD" from? I instinctively typed it and I have no idea where it's from.

Quote from: hector13 on February 02, 2019, 02:39:49 pm

Quote from: scriver on February 02, 2019, 08:43:09 am

I don't think that's supposed to be a penis.

But that is a penis.

It has two eyes.

...Does yours not?

Don’t you try to body shame me, mate. I’ll bite you with my shin teeth.