Bay 12 Games Forum

Wow, You are at about the level of Nw_Kohaku, when it comes to writing walls of text. Still interesting reading, but I don't agree with some of it. For example I don't share Your general enthusiasm about economy that we have today, growth, and technological development. You also seem very found of emergent systems, and free market, and hate anything planned. I think a little planning doesn't hurt and can smoothen economic cycles.

About that game. I was thinking about borrowing it for a week-long LARP with many games. Sounds fun and different. There are still some areas, I don't understand, tough. Namely, the goods creation. Everyone can create goods (like different kinds of sweets (which the king provides)) (self employed, or company) per turn, but not actual money. Then they trade that among themselves using monopoly money. Is this correct? Why won't this create oversupply of goods over say 10 turns? If I understand correctly, any leftover money can be exchanged for chocolate at the end (or even during play), but it seems, that spending it on goods in game gives you more stuff to eat. Is this also correct? If I were ever to try and play with it, I need to understand such things. I also intend on using cheap stuff, no more than 3$ worth of food pere person during the entire game. If I don't do it, I still want to understand, how the mechanisc for that game works exactly. 

About "Money as debt". That movie did rise some good points about injustice of our monetary system. Also about impossibility of perpetual growth economy, which is simply not sustainable. And why usury is the cancer of humanity.

About jamming trade routes / ports. This can totally happen. A way to model this would be to make a cap on how much stuff can be transfered. Overflowing causes increased latency, and cost. Over time capacity of a road or port can be increased by governments using money from fees from traders using them.

Toady One said something about the supply and demand model, he was using either in one of front page posts, or DF talk. I dont remember whre exactly. Oh well, we'll wait and see. 

All of my metalworking moods have had adamantine as their base item since I've refined it, but other moods haven't. In addition, for parts other than the base item, other metals will be accepted, even for metalworking moods. I'm not sure if adamantine wafers are actually considered "metal bars" as such, since I've not had anyone take adamantine for a decoration, though that could just be due to the fact that all my hundreds of metals are in one stockpile.

This. My posessed metalworker made a funobtanium flask decorated with funobtanium. The rest of them make stuff like rock grates decorated with gems.

If you manage to mine a whole level of funobtanium spire, and there is no hole in it, levels above should be perfectly safe to mine. Uhm, probably.

Pretty sure you can make a GCS slowing turret (Dwarf Fortress : Tower Defense edition ?!) with good use of locked doors and fortifications, but it's going to be destroyed by archers or trolls.

What if you make a very long route, that is door leads to the fortress, which has way outside? Archers would still kill it, tough. Hm, these magma drowning traps seem the best, even tough they take much time and labour to make.

I haven't used cave crocodiles yet, only dogs, lions, tigers, bears, and whatever random animals I stumbled upon. They all sucked versus goblins, even elephants. I finally learned how to train good military (with or without DRs), so I'll probably ditch animal husbandry altogether (save for tomcats, and whatever else is usefull in kitty towers). 

Cheesemakers make good haulers. I also adopted a habbit of enabling many jobs, like furnance operating, cheesemaking, butchery, tanning, masonry (requires setting masonry workshop profiles to Proficient+ skill), and others. This makes a responsive task force.

Artifact cotton candy ring, mencacing with spikes of cotton candy, studded with cotton caandy, etc. It only wastes cotton candy and raises fort value.
It narrowly edges out an arifact cotton candy warhammer.

In my lastest fort some possesed idiot made funobtanium flask decorated with funobtanium. If I wanted to waste it on flasks, I could have easilly gotten 6. Fortunately my map has like 2k of it, and I already processed over 200, so not such a big deal, but still.

As for Dwarf labor involved in making roasts, most of the time I don't even have to farm. I just buy all food from caravans. It gets hauled to nearby stockpiles and turned into booze and roasts. I have a booze stockpile close to kitchen, so some roasts end up as quite large stacks. Even after factoring in overzealous butchering animal husbandry, cheesemaking and occasional farming or plant gathering, this is not much effort compared to say, selling junk goblinite and crafts.

The way I see it, people complain about roast prices, because of the way they are calculated. Each ingredient gets quality modifier for how finely it is minced, the four are added together, multiplied by quality multiplier for the whole meal, and then by sum of stack sizes. IMO a good way to change this, would be to have 1 quality modifier for the meal itself, and count each ingredient as decoration, so rather than something like (10 *minced1 *base_price1 + 10 *minced2 *base_price2 + 10 *minced3 *base_price3 + 10 *minced4 *base_price4) *quality *stack_sum we would have: (10 *minced1 *base_price1 + 10 *minced2 *base_price2 + 10 *minced3 *base_price3 + 10 *minced4 *base_price4 + roast_base_price *quality) *stack_sum

I'm not sure, it all the 10s are there, I just assumed basic prices for decorations are 10. Removing them from meals would further reduce prices.

OFC there still would be cloth, and glass serrated disk industry.

Caravans seem to get larger over time, so I guess giving them profit helps.

While I can buy all I need with goblin trash, rock crafts / mugs / instruments / toys, large gems and such, I preffer selling meals. I only recently discovered 's' button in 'g' trade depot menu, and it made me happy. Works for mechanism too, so I can mass obsidian or flux mechanisms, and sell anything under exceptional. I can also just make whatever I need at the moment, and melt/sell anything low quality.

In my previous forts, I used to control the amount of crafts produced, but with meals I no longer need to bother. I can just buy all food from caravan, set still and lavish meals on repeat, and have everything I need to buy from caravans. More time to focus on building projects or whatever I find fun.

To me barrels of blood and ichtor are the most useless. Caravans bring them, so they take up caravan space and clutter trading interface. I can't do anything usefull with them. Refuse, espeacially vermin and sapient corpses are also irritating. They need to be hauled to a big refuse stockpile, and just take up space and hauling time. Rotten food makes irritating miasma. Non-metal golbinite is just a lot of hauling, and trading. These are the most useless to me.

War animals and other pets suck at combat, and do some pathfiniding. While animals (including grazers and cats) have some uses, I'm beginning to think, It's better to just butcher them than to breed and train them.

After I discovered "s" button in trade menu, and can trade "mecha"nisms and "roast"s, I also have no need for crafts, stone or otherwise. As for cloth and mechanisms and siege engine parts, I find it prudent to mass produce what I need, and dump anything non-exeptional on caravans. I'm slowly moving towards buying whatever I need with a few =roast=s, so I'll probably adopt atom-smashing trahs rather than selling it.