Bay 12 Games Forum

Wasn't escape from religious persecution one of the major motivators?  Friction between denominations and such.  I'm pretty fuzzy on it, but the way I understood it, pilgrims were sent over by their origin nations for the sake of financial gains.  Many of the pilgrims themselves went along with that for the sake of the religious freedom offered by a frontier.  Or maybe that's just among much other total nonsense I learned from public school history texts.

Some did, yeah, but it wasn't a majority, at least from what I remember. Most of the folks that came over from europe came to make money, flat out. Jamestown came before Plymouth, et al.

High school texts... misrepresented a lot. A hell of a lot. At least mine did. Very, very different picture than what I ended up digging up during college stuff and the (very) minor (fairly cursory) smattering of independent research I've done. Pilgrim this, pilgrim that, blah blah bullshit, mostly. Religious persecution of the "we're such assholes they're kicking us out" kind. Ignoring, y'know, all the other people and their reasons for coming over. Etc., so forth, so on. Misremembering a bit and indulging in a bit of hyperbole, but... yeah. High school stuff I was taught, at least, was frankly almost criminal in how poor a picture of history it painted

Ehn. I see a bit of a divide between "strongly religious" and "religious zealot". There were plenty of the latter, sure, but that's not what I've picked up most of the folks that came over really being about, y'know? Didn't come over for god, didn't go about doing things for god. Not beyond going through the motions, anyway. Place has pretty much always been about coinage uber alles, really. S'what brought people, and what drove people.

"I don't live in poverty, but sometimes I get the feeling that my nation has been conquered by imperialist foreigners. Our government and our media regularly tell us that the great threats to our nation are immigrants, religious zealots, and gun owners. Which I find strange, as this country was founded by a group of immigrant religious zealots with guns."

... immigration isn't exactly the word I'd use for what the Europeans did, since immigration doesn't usually involve wide scale murder or relocating the native population. Nor did most of them come over due to religious reasons.

There were plenty of guns, though. One out of three! Better than nothing. I guess.

Yeah... not 100% sure of the whole thing myself, but I think where your cognihiccup is occurring is with the "must have something colder" bit. You don't need something colder, per se, you just need a way to get the heat somewhere else, s'far as I'm aware. And we've got fancy ways of doing that, yeah. Wikipedia sometimes helps. Hopefully someone a bit more familiar with stuff can plain-language translate it a bit better.

Because everyone can afford a backyard...

Or even if they can, are living in an area that can support gardening without notable investment. If you've got to water, fertilize, etc., so forth, so on, it can pretty quickly cost more than what some retail joint's charging in order to try and kill competition. Least where I'm at, you've got to beat pricing that's usually coming in at <10c per ounce on a lot of (canned/dried/frozen) vegetables (including transportation on your end, if you're only grocery shopping once or twice a month and driving yourself), 12-13 cent/oz on the upper end. Even discounting the potential cost effect of the time investment gardening can take, that can get pretty hard to beat. As GG ninjas, yeah.

I mean, there's a reason these people are pricing like they are. Killing gardening is part of their business plan, just like killing mom and pops joints is. Even beyond that, there's pretty significant economies of scale to agriculture that makes back yard gardening considerably less cost efficient, in most situations. Think they're actually trying to work around that or somethin', but I've no clue how well (if) that's proceeding.

Why this guy?

Chance and circumstance. Just happened to be this time folks wanting to say something said something. Don't believe it's anything deeper than that.

CP was talking about the stigmatization of legit users, pengu.

And Siru, re: phrase in question, it's been used both ways, especially as it's been leveraged more aggressively. The means you referred to is generally what's used to push censorship... stuff like what's being discussed, to persuade people to allow a greater legal basis/less legal oversight on the varying means of privacy invasion. S'both ways of using children as an emotional lever to push whatever th'folks pushin' are after.

It's because of the way our eyes work.

... obviously, this means we must work toward fixing that. Proceeds from starbound can be funneled toward the "let our eyes see green stars" fund that probably doesn't yet exist.