Bay 12 Games Forum

Hn... fair point. I can only imagine by then proper rock concerts will literally destroy planets and enslave all minds with hundreds of light years.

... jazz as the official music for a world wide (maybe even system or galaxy arm wide!) religion? S'got my vote.

What really makes a person, a person anyways, if a 12 month old child can't pass such a self-awareness test? Or perhaps a severely brain damaged adult human?

Both philosophy and the science that was born from it have been trying to answer that question since the BCs. We don't have an answer yet (Well, we have shittonnes of answers but nothing definitive. Same thing, really.). Behavioral tests are the best we can do, and will have to suffice, really, at least until we figure out some facsimile of telepathy.

The personhood of children or the brain damaged has actually been a long running battle, though. It's a question a lot of people really don't like being asked, huhuhu.

Well, say a computer is programmed as such to pass self-awareness tests at least as well as a dolphin, does that computer become a 'non human person'? Can you really point to a dolphin human and claim it understands the metaphysical concepts related to 'self' and deserves personhood because it can recognize its self in a mirror?

FTFY Considering a significant amount of humans don't even know what the blazes metaphysics are or actually have much of a self-reflective understanding of the self, well...

In any case, hell, sure, if a computer can pass the same self-awareness tests a dolphin can pass, it's as self aware as a dolphin. Self-awareness isn't the only qualifying point for person, though, non-human or otherwise.

I don't think statements about anti-choice people being "cruel" are actually true or helpful at all.  I'm pretty sure they don't actively enjoy inflicting harm upon people as the article seems to suggest.

Not to mention there's nothing saying you can't have crazy beliefs and yet have the power or influence to act on them.

Cruelty =/= sadism. That said... yeah, the ones leaning that way that I've met do, in fact, partake in a sort of vicious glee when they get through those cruel laws, so maybe there's a bit of both going on.

Article's main point was that calling them crazy dismisses the fact that they're working inside a coherent and directed plan and system -- it's just one that's malicious and cruel. They're being very systematic and logical in going about what they're going about, it's just working off some reprehensible axioms.

It's probably not helpful in the sense of meeting things half way, but it definitely strikes me as something that is helpful in the sense of identifying and preparing to counter what they're doing, instead of dismissing said actions and letting them go about it unnoticed.

On a personal bright side, I don't think I've called the social conservative groups insane before (barring specific examples that are actually demonstrable, bleh), just massively hypocritical and backwards (in a bad sense). If I have slipped up there, th'article reminded me to stop calling it crazy and start calling it what it is -- backwards and vicious

Anyway, totally in for default organ donation. I'm kinda' surprised there's people reporting trouble with it in the states, though. In Florida, it's mostly just a "Yes" answer (or a checked box, I forget which exactly) when you get your drivers license (or it might have been social security card, I'unno. Got both at same time.), at least where I'm at. Might be tougher in other places, I'unno.

mumblemumblemutter. Mont, can you just say what you're wanting to say instead of trying to win an argument by catching someone else in a moment of miscommunication?

Let your argument stand on its merits instead of the merits of other positions, et al.

Na, it is a cleaning agent. Specifically NH₃.

Mn? Yeah, I'm aware of what bleach is, heh. Well, there's more in common household bleach than ammonia, but that's usually part of it, iirc. Just thought ammonia was part of the leatherworking/fur treating process somehow. Probably misremembering, eh.

E: Though wikipedia's not immediately agreeing with that. Hrm. Maybe it was some industrial strength cleaner m'madre'd nicked off the school. Meh.

E2: Or maybe it was in relation to explosives that I remembered the bloody stuff from. Argh, 20-minutes till' 3 AM memory.

Ammonia, ammonia... is that leatherworking or something? Meat can be clothes, too.

Though some people have taken that a bit too far. Leather, furs... okay, sure. Actual slabs of meat -- even if it is delicious bacon -- is excessive. I also can't imagine it to be at all comfortable.