Bay 12 Games Forum

That was consistent. Documents count as big-shiny-things nowadays. Grab as much paperwork as can in passing and ditch.

Didn't we agree that gun laws don't affect crime, so no point in this argument?

I see your strawman, and raise you a stop, s'il vous plais.

You specifically questioned defense; when people have guns for defense in their home, it is generally for defense from home invasion. Most of the folks doing so never use the weapon for such. Some do, quite rarely. It's irrelevant to actual crime rates why people have weapons in their home for defense -- "makes them feel safer" is sufficient, in that case, if they are storing the weapon for defense.

It's also a very strongly reasonable position: Peoples lives have, in reality, been saved and home invasions prevented due to in-house gun storage. That resonates very strongly with gun owners. Yes, it's possible that there may be a statistics-level net malus involved (though quite strongly indicated to be very small, if it exists), but you asked for peoples reasons, not the statistics-level impact.

And yes, I'm entirely aware how that can be taken too far -- there are, in fact, laws against booby trapping a home.

The real question would be this:

As for the options, even given A, why is the small decrease in accidental shootings from implementing B (i.e. restricting owners rights, which it would be if you implemented that in the states) an acceptable solution? You would almost certainly have better results by better educating your firearm owners.

E: Minor apologizes for tone, by the way. Headache, so I'm a bit brusque when I'm vaguely attempting to actually think.

More along the lines of it doesn't (seem ot have) have a strong effect on homicide, and that there's other, much stronger influences (Quick E: At least in Washington DC).

What would be really interesting would be stats on gun regulation and accidental (or negligent, if one prefers) shootings. I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that, though. I've never heard that kind of thing brought up in the various raging furors that fired up around the gun control issue.

Ehn, don't take it as representative. Family and a lot of people I interact with are poor and/or have lived in bad areas regularly, as well as being gun owners -- there's some criminal element involved, as well (There's more than one felon in or known to the family). Most people in the US, especially those edging toward middle class and up, wouldn't have even remotely been likely to run into the same situation repeatedly.

But yeah, the lower end of the US's society can get pretty shitty for a first world country. Still a lot better than a lot of places in the world, but bad is still bad.

E: If we're talking news-worthy, though, there was an elderly fellow that shot and killed a home invader in my area within the last year or so that made the news. It's another one of those anecdotal it-does-happen things, but yeah.

Well I would feel slightly safer with people walking around with bows instead. The fact that they are more clearly visible is better from the start.

Man, I'unno. Most arrow wounds are a helluva lot more dangerous (and damaging and painful) than bullet wounds, at least the ones that aren't immediately lethal. Gunshot's more likely to immediately kill, arrow's more likely to frak you right the blazes up if you survive.

Also crossbows. They've got concealable crossbows.

Seriously, what is with that? People say guns are used to deter criminals, then they hide them inside a jacket? Their is a reason that the police keep theirs clearly on display at all times.

They pull knife, you pull gun, they run fook away. Yes, I actually have met a few people that has had that happen. S'not exactly common, but it happens.

There's also the whole 'chance of gun' thing. The effectiveness of that as a deterrent is probably unquantifiable, but it's one of the common points offered to the deterrent thing.

Honestly, it looks like it's just someone's webpage, just... strange. There's a links page in there, near the bottom.

All in all, that's very... uh, interesting. Where'd you find it, New Guy?

So... Does that make me entitles to own a functioning tank?
Well not me, but the American version of me?

Pretty sure there's at least a few privately owned tanks in the US. Regulated straight to hell and obviously not road legal, but they're out there.