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Messages - Frumple

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7711
General Discussion / Re: Things that made you go "WTF?" today o_O
« on: April 14, 2017, 06:36:12 pm »
Public transportation to the rescue? Kinda' makes me wonder if increasing access and use cuts down on transportation related incidents of a similar nature.

In other news, what the hell scope creep is supposed to be involved in game design not amateur auto repair. House person asks if I can put a fly wheel on engine, told everything would be ready just need that bit, I'm like, sure, I'll try (didn't even really know what the hell a fly wheel was, but whatever). Get out to work area. Engine 1 balanced not worth a shit on a cinder block on one side and stack of mismatched wood on the other, and in such a way the fly wheel cannot be put on due to cinder block. Not attached to mobile lift hook whatsit, not attached to ceiling thing of similar function, no sodding clue how to work engines, available chain not able to wrap around only engine even remotely ready to be worked on. Engine 2 still in packing crate. Go ask wtf do; informed then that engine ("everything ready") 2 is the one that needs the fly wheel. Thing still in packing crate. On floor. Multiple feet away from where the winch chain thing hangs, which is directly above engine 1 (the problem here becomes evident shortly thereafter). "Ready."

Okay. Bullshit this was ready, but okay. Get crate top off, packing wrap crap off engine 2, informed of sketchy as fuck method of getting engine hooked with chain (til: you hold hundreds of pounds of engine block up with two goddamn screws holding down a length of chain), okay, okay. Get length of chain screwed in, winch hook on length of chain (poorly, trying to wrap the winch chain around the small one a few times because gods fuck metal fatigue and projectile chain segments, not even once), start doing the lifty thing. Crate starts getting drug over. Obvious (to anyone that has basically any mechanics experience, i.e. not me) problem becomes obvious; engine 1 in way. Bullshit ensues, ultimately a different chain was wrapped around engine one, a mobile lift hauled over and hooked to chain, and the goddamn thing hauled up off its dismemberment waiting to happen foundation and moved enough out of the way to get engine 2 in place. Fucking finally, fly wheel mount place is accessible. Fly wheel gets put on, amazingly enough it actually is pretty easy once the goddamn engine is where it needs to be. Huzzah done.

Except no. House person says what about front fan thing, like I have any idea what the blue hell they're talking about. Nothing except fly wheel was mentioned. Find out apparently they intended to put on fan pulley thingjigger, too. Okay, someone is going to do this because house person is combination of impatient and functionally suicidal (dozens times, doctor says stop fucking trying to pick things up you old shit, old shit proceeds to intimate somehow between the two of us we're going to lift and move a fucking engine block by hand), despite there being zero actual need to hurry. Readjust chain on engine two because thing was inclined and like hell I'm going to try this with a bloody engine block literally aimed at my face. Pick up fan thing. Look at engine 2. Look at fan thing. Look more at engine 2. Look more at fan thing. Ask what the hell. Someone out there may have guessed problem: Engine 1 was not actually taken all the way apart. Entire fan housing mount whatever the hell was still attached. Zero goddam idea what the sodding hell to do, my whats are thoroughly fucked. House person totality of instructions, take this three prong screw claw thing and stick it in non-fan circle thing (pulley casing? No clue, already forgot from checking), then take clicky wrench thing and turn until it comes off. They leave to go eat. Instructions fail, arms give out long before circle thingy comes off, assuming that was actually how it comes off because it damn sure wasn't working. Have to stop, as nearing the continuing=hospital trip point.

Day mostly passes. Several hours later, come out, notice suicidal old shit is back, didn't bother to try to get my attention, and is doing something outside near working area. Bright side, they didn't kill themselves and apparently managed to get rest of fan thing off engine 1 and on engine 2 (maybe, assuming it's actually on right which I wouldn't know), so that was done. Not bright side, then gave mention of drive shaft thing, like I knew what the hell they were talking about (basically none of the work on this car has been done by me, mind you). Turns out they had picked up bolts for far end of drive shaft and memory screwed up enough they thought I had sodding anything to do with unscrewing the thing to begin with. I didn't even know where the hell that part of the machine was (turns out, bottom, and accessible from there... technically). So, okay. I'll try says I. Get bolts, small clicky wrench with proper head, go towards tail end of vehicle. Vehicle is on the goddamn ground (wheels where should be and all, mind). Out in grass. Prickly grass. But okay, will try. Turns out can't even fit goddamn head under the machine where it's at, bloody thing sunk into the ground somewhat. Scope creep 3, torpedoed. I can't goddamn do it. Have to get car up on ramps, is for other day.

Long story short. Maybe ten minute job stretches from around 8 AM to around five o'clock in the goddamn afternoon (with few hour break during noonish region because it's finally starting to creep up into mid day suicide temperature ranges and I was getting into kill myself range anyway), because shit kept getting added and "ready" was about as accurate as "made of raw diamond laced with magical unicorn spunk". Like, I know it's senility and cognitive degeneration, but good gods, how do you miss the mark on intended bit of work that hard? Not even angry, just incredulity all over the place. This is scope creep in the real world, apparently. I could have done without.

7712
General Discussion / Re: Limited Suffrage: Should Voting be a Right?
« on: April 14, 2017, 03:47:44 pm »
If they don't like it here they can leave.
Man, I know you know that's not actually true in practice, unless by leave you mean kill themselves. Relocation, especially on a national scale, is not exactly something you can just do, and for any number of people it's effectively becoming permanently homeless or outright committing suicide. Which is only a choice in a real damn technical sense.

Any case, the argument such as it is for non-citizens appears to be input. Citizens would get the vote cause they're citizens and dicking around with that probably isn't worth the effort. Non-citizens would get the vote if they're meeting the same responsibilities citizens ostensibly have (paying taxes, contributing to the economy, meeting some base level of civic investment, etc.). Basically making the argument that if you're giving money to the state and/or making it a better place, you should be allowed some degree of influence in how said money or effort is used.

Ain't so sure I agree with it, but I can kinda' understand it. Some rando living in another country that happened to be born in the US, that gives pretty much nothing to the country, not even living in it and the knock on effects of that, getting to vote when someone that's technically a non-citizen but been living here for decades (even if they're legal and trying for citizenship, buncha places have thoroughly fucked immigration processes where they could easily be trying for that long and not made it yet), paying taxes, contributing to the economy and so on and so forth, doesn't, is pretty sketchy on the face of it.

7713
Yeah... will note it again, so far as I've noticed if we're going to see nukes out of any non-minor actors, it's almost certainly going to be small yield (i.e. approaching that MOAB) and probably aimed specifically at military or insurgent targets. This, I wouldn't actually dismiss as a possibility, with the only likely candidates being russia or the US.

Russia potentially thinks it can get away with it (and they just might, with those qualifiers) and very well may be in a position to think it's worth the risk, particularly if the US and EU et al ramp things up in response to russian agitation or aggression.

The US, well, the US currently has the GOP at the head, and chunks of them have been courting the use of tactical scale nukes for at least a year or two now -- and trump has not exactly set himself staunchly against the possibility, not that it would have meant jack all if he had. Add on how much trouble the white house has been having on the administrative front and what that (and GOP and/or trump inclinations) is not terribly unlikely to mean regarding foreign relations, and the possibility of them deciding to drop a small one on, say, the development infrastructure of a thoroughly alienated Iran that's decided trumpian fuckery has gone far enough to say to hell with their agreements on their nuclear developments, is... not as small as I would like. Or something along those lines where the (near entirely) GOP aligned hawks decide to MOAB someone to similar effect, with shit breaking down from there.

7714
General Discussion / Re: Limited Suffrage: Should Voting be a Right?
« on: April 13, 2017, 06:48:08 pm »
Even this is unrealistic though, because the implementation of that standard could be manipulated. How and where is that class provided? I would say through schools, but that creates other problems. What happens if someone drops out of school before taking the class? What happens if someone is homeschooled? I don't think there's a fair way to restrict voting rights, even on a reasonable premise.
Y'know, there's a thought. Probably still a bad idea 'cause the ratio would slide up over time, but what if instead of your suffrage being hinged on that class, completing it (and sure, only completing it) marginally increased the weight of your vote? Very marginally, like .001% of a vote or something (which'd end up being somewhere over a three thousand votes, if the entire US population was able to vote), but a non-zero amount. Conceptually, that would still allow you to preference people with at least something of an inclination towards civic mindedness, while still making sure everyone has the vote, that the skew is small enough it's not really feasible cost wise to manipulate, and that there's very little functional effect if you don't do it, for whatever reason.

So far as class distribution goes, one idle thought would be to just crowd source the thing. Anyone that completes a course is immediately and unquestioningly certified to certify other individuals, with no limits on venue -- phone course, online, friggin' smoke signals, doesn't matter. No oversight, either -- if someone wants to sit down with a bud, have a drink in complete silence, and call it done, that's all good. Basically the entire point wouldn't be anything even remotely approaching a means test or meaningfully impactful on the vote, but instead be a way to incentivize people communicating with each other with political participation as a backdrop, and letting human psychology and social inclinations deal with the rest of it.

7715
Probably would get more difficult, though, or allowed ID chosen in part because of the relative difficulties to obtain (if not at first, then as time goes on and people pay less attention). It's fairly common when it's possible to leverage that sort of thing towards whatever goal the people managing the leverage has (and it can be all sorts, mind you -- politicians, corporations, criminal organizations that manage to obtain influence, looking to make sure they have good recruiting grounds, extremists looking to prey on the desperate or have something to point to for propaganda purposes, etc., etc., etc.).

Though yeah, it is uncommon* that someone does not have any sort of identification whatsoever. Which is why when you see stuff like that go through -- if it doesn't start that way outright -- the sorts of identification that are accepted don't fall particularly comfortably under that "whatsoever" label :-\

Mostly ends up being one of those things that, in an ideal world without all the first and second+ order problems involved, it might actually manage to be a useful tool for identifying a targeted group. Obvious thing being obvious, this isn't an ideal world. It's something that's ripe for corruption and abuse, even when it does manage any gains toward that identification process.

* Mind, uncommon isn't even remotely unknown, still. You'd have to weigh that in consideration, too, whether hitting the groups where it does happen (if not commonly, then at least enough to be notable -- and don't forget to tally up the consequences beyond the immediate effect on said groups) is actually worth whatever you're getting out of it and/or isn't going to just make things worse on the net, however little.

7716
... problem being that catches a lot more people than immigrants, and there's kinda' consequences to treating entire ethnicities as suspected criminals. When you consider that most governments that have reached the point of casually allowing racial profiling either aren't exactly going to make IDs easy to get (or replace, should it come to that) even for citizens or will end up that way in relatively short order, then what you consider "not too much to ask" very rapidly actually does start becoming too much to ask for a fair number of your population* -- and on the heels of that you're going to have a lovely thing called selective enforcement start flapping its wings around, with a nice side order of the occasional "lost" papers that somehow never make it from whoever you give them to, to the courts. Add on that's about the fastest way to nuke the possibility of collaboration between even legal immigrant populations (who are going to be constantly and persistently harassed in the face of legal support for the power being considered) and your law enforcement agencies, and you get to toss a substantial spike in much, much more impactful crime on top of it, too. Along with a fair chunk of other junk. Usually just... not something you want to court allowing. Whatever gains you may make,** your country is going to be paying for in ways that either outweigh them immediately or pretty much inevitably will. Shit's just kinda' heavily abusable, and really, really not something you want your country to let fly.

Basically one of those issues where common sense is just sorta' wrong. On a single, isolated case it might look like it pans out, but in aggregate the effects of allowing that sort of blanket "just pull them over and demand ID" behavior start undermining the goal. Sometimes even if the goal is just less foreigners, since it kneecaps a number of the possible means of identifying and approaching ones undesired for whatever reason. And all that isn't getting into the problems related to giving police forces the ability to abuse the power and just say, "Well, they looked/sounded/whatever foreign" to justify harassing people and the host of other abuses a maliciously inclined officer can indulge in, or gods know what else I'm forgetting. Bad juju all around.

* You can see it in the US, if you want an example pretty close in nature, that just so happens to also have a tendency of being directed at minority populations. Part of the way voter disenfranchisement efforts play out is mandating ID that certain demographics are either less likely to have (drivers license for urban folks in areas with decent public transportation, as a very much non-exhaustive example), or face disproportionate expense (when targeted demographics often enough are already in rough times financially) to obtain or replace.
** And they're very much not guaranteed, because again, check the above -- cooperation with immigrant populations legal and not helps quite a bit with catching folks who are doing stuff of significantly more substantial note than not being here with papers. You turn every single member of the population into a suspected criminal and that cooperation both stops and often enough turns into active resistance.

7717
General Discussion / Re: Things that made you go "WTF?" today o_O
« on: April 13, 2017, 03:37:29 pm »
@Refresher courses: Most schools I've seen do have refresher courses of one sort or another. They just tend to be somewhat derogatory in title patterns. Remedial something or other, stuff like that. Intro classes can work about the same way. Occasionally you'll find local outreach stuff, too -- libraries hosting tutoring or study whatsits intended for adults, that kind of thing. Job outreach junk also tends to be fairly likely to have connections to something or another along those lines. Basically it's not all that unlikely that there's local resources of one sort or another floating around... increasingly there's online stuff, too -- free online courses (pretty sure there's actually a thread for that somewhere back in GD's depths, school or library associated stuff, and so on.

And maybe, Arx? I remember there were folks talking about it, but there's zero chance anything is going to jog my memory as to the details. Can recall there was at least passing mention of fairly stand-alone chemicals (maybe diluted?), but that's it. Was sometime last year, and my memory's not nearly what it was a year or two before that, heh.

7718
*nudges the apocalypse clock a little closer to midnight* I ain't sayin' it is, but we might not be able to rule out a maybe.

7719
If by hardly comparable you mean exactly inside the range of a Davy Crockett, which explode for something in the region of 10-20 tons of TNT... think that was ninja'd, anyway. Suffice it that it's a explosive power that's very much comparable to low end nukes.

Interestingly (?) some GOP politicians stumped with using tac nukes (i.e. as small as possible) on certain national actors, such as Iran. Similarly, Trump questioned publicly why nukes were effectively off the table, and iirc Putin has expressed willingness to go that far (if perhaps not further into full power nukes) as well.

... won't lie, now that y'all bring that up and I start think about it, the use of a MOAB suddenly seems potentially rather more ominous. Because if this is a prelude towards desensitizing the population regarding very heavy ordinance as a build up to using nuclear for limited military engagements...

7720
Other Games / Re: Tome 4: Tales of Maj'Eyal
« on: April 13, 2017, 11:51:08 am »
Forget exactly how that interacts with typing, but obvious goals are dragons, horrors, or undead. On top of humanoid that covers most of the nastier stuff in the game.

7721
General Discussion / Re: Things that made you go "WTF?" today o_O
« on: April 13, 2017, 11:45:58 am »
... man, I wish my memory was working better, or I paid better attention back in that hole in the wall hardware store or something. There's apparently a couple of non-gas options that work pretty well, I just can't remember what they were (and, being fair, I think one of them may have been mildly illegal). Might be worth it to poke around shops that carry stuff, see it they happen to have a recommendation or two. Do remember it might be worth spraying a line around the house with the regular stuff, too. Sometimes the things are coming in from outside more than they're managing an indoor infestation.

In personal wtf news, apparently richard strauss's Don Juan gives me a headache. Something about the damn thing sounds like it was inspired by like a half dozen or more major composers. Which translates into every handful of seconds there's another bit of music that sounds like it came from some other song, which gives the sound memory all kinds of metaphonical headaches. Sequential musical blue balls or something. It's a decent piece of music but bloody hell.

7722
Other Games / Re: SALES Thread
« on: April 13, 2017, 06:13:08 am »
I mean... it's not like there's not precedent. Steam has been selling censored porn games for a while now. Some of them don't even call for an age check as per certain violent games, iirc. All this proposed official nude mod stuff would have to do is sell the material on a different site.

7723
General Discussion / Re: Limited Suffrage: Should Voting be a Right?
« on: April 12, 2017, 08:38:29 pm »
Yeah... like I said, conceptually I can see it. Practically, I guaran-damn-tee you that the second we did you would start seeing education curriculum failing (more) in fairly specific ways (probably on top of a handful of others as a smokescreen) in a number of areas, along with the oddest sorts of logistical difficulties in certain places that just happened to make that test a complete pain in the ass to get to or take for some folks. I'd probably recommend just cutting down on requirements for immigrants instead, heh.

7724
General Discussion / Re: Limited Suffrage: Should Voting be a Right?
« on: April 12, 2017, 08:21:37 pm »
Yeeaah, making voting rights be reliant on anything that's particularly manipulatable (e.g. everything except stuff like over an age line) is basically asking for trouble. Conceptually it might be good in a sort of ideal world, but practically you're ceding disproportionate amounts of power to whoever can figure out how to leverage the requirement in their favor. US actually has a pretty blatantly obvious one; we allow disenfranchisement for criminal record, and in part (though only in part, mind) because of that there's a number of crimes not nearly of a magnitude or impact to warrant that, that are on the books, fairly well enforced, and often enough tailored to disproportionately hit specific demographics in one manner or another.

If you had, say, military service be it, you can pretty much guarantee that there's going to be an odd trend in who's taking the most casualties, or exactly how the instruction is handled, or cultural/legal/etc. rules tailored subtly and not to drum folks with undesired political likelihoods out of the military and subsequently out of political power, or etc., so forth, so on. Some kind of means test? Language structure that favors a particular culture or demographic, specific subjects likely to be fairly unfamiliar for certain sorts, and suchlike. Basically just kind of a mess.

... that said, I could see some degree of limitation based on stake holder significance. Stateside we already do that, with specific districts voting for their own representatives, local/county ordinances, etc. It's something you should keep a careful eye on, because if there's anything locals are terrible at it's identifying when shit they're doing isn't as local as they think, but it's a useful tool for keeping on top of ground level nuance.

7725
But the night is dark and full of viruses.
Or slightly sub-par emulators.
It is, but there's exactly one that works vaguely like you want it to, so...

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