Bay 12 Games Forum

Quote from: My Name is Immaterial on March 17, 2014, 11:30:14 am

Quote from: Tack on March 17, 2014, 11:20:01 am

Quote from: Arx on March 17, 2014, 11:16:58 am

Quote from: Yoink on March 17, 2014, 11:14:46 am

And thus, the Third World War began, as all the most powerful rulers of the various nations of Earth gathered together for a friendly game of Monopoly: International Edition.

I call dibs on the ship.

Thimble.

Dog.

Shoe.

That's one of them, right?

Hat. Hat is best.

Yo dawgs, I'm Avis and I'm replying to a bunch of ancient posts.

Avis: I get your disgust for Western oligarchs, but were things better in the rest of Ukraine? Or in Russia? It seems the 90's were pretty bleak all over the place.

Anyway, the kleptocracy is not the same thing as euro-integration. Those countries that did integrate and joined the EU are doing better than Russia or Ukraine that did not.

In Russia, they were actually worse: food shortages and all. Not a nice time in general. And the countries that did integrate into the EU had functioning economies to begin with: Ukraine, on the other hand, requires craptons of financial support that has to appear from somewhere. I don't see people lining up to pay, but I'm no expert on such things - this is me repeating stuff I have heard, just like the rest of you.

Avis-Mergulus, and one question. Why your so called "Crimean Government" behaves like an armed robber? With all that "nationalization" of Ukrainian Navy (the most expensive ships were built in Ukraine so even the "it's all Soviet" claim doesn't work) Ukrainian state-owned companies (Those where funded from the budget of  Ukraine, you know? ) and even private property owned by "the wrong people"?

I really want to hear your explanation why it is a righteous way to act

Look who's talking. Tell me, for how long does one have to beat an eastern communist deputy to get him to sign the repeal of the Regional Languages law? For some reason, nobody was bothered when the Rada unanimously - you know, even the absent and the socialist members - voted for all that shit you did in the recent period. What the hell are all those videos where rightist activists beat "titushki"? Are they all staged? Interesting it is, how many names Ukrainians have for Russians. "Moskali", "katsapy", now this one... heh.

Are you going to defend your position with photos of graffiti? If one takes the things that people write on the walls in Kiev for real... well, let's not talk about it.

But enough about you. "The most expensive ships built in Ukraine", I don't see what are you talking about: there's not a single ship on the Ukrainian Navy, such as it is, that was not built basing on Soviet projects. The famed Sagaidachny was started in 1990 as Kirov, and almost finished before it was stolen by occupants.  If Ukraine, by some strange chance, had to fight at sea, those ships would have sailed from Crimean ports, staffed by Crimean sailors. We have a right to them, more so than some twit in Kiev.

Ukrainian state-owned companies, funded from the budget of Ukraine, which included Crimean taxes as well. If those "state-owned companies" really did work for the good of the people of Crimea, then they have no right to go against the Crimean government.
And I will not be told of "wrong people" by folks who are twiddling their thumbs and contemplating lustration, having already jailed numerous innocents for allegedly "supporting the bloody regime of Yanukovich". Bloody regime my ass. You interesting people up west can never accept the fact that there are people other than you in Ukraine, and mark my words - when this is done, you'll be right. And then we will all be content.

"Recession hitting Russian economics", my ass. We've been in one since the nineties, we're used to it. You, however, less so, with how some people have been threatening to cut the gas to Europe - do you think it's gonna love you for this? - and having untold shittons of debt, which nobody is interested in holding off anymore. You are going to eat your boots sooner than I, and so there's not going to be a banquet. Shame.

"Most of the time" you did not have the government that the majority of Crimean voted for - you had snivelly bastard Kuchma and warty bastard Yuschenko with his paranoia and his hilarious fascist antics. Besides, I see a flaw in your logic here: if 75% of Crimeans voted for Yanukovich, whom you call pro-Russian (ha-ha), then why are you crying foul when the overwhelming majority of Crimeans votes to join Russia? Why so surprised?

Quote from: Avis-Mergulus on March 16, 2014, 04:34:58 pm

Sure as heck. The most noticeable aspect was that everything state- beginning with voting bulletins and ending with nameplates on schools and hospitals - got converted into Ukrainian. Russian in schools was demoted to secondary language - that in a region where 90+% of the population speaks it - and Ukrainian was instated in its place.

It's so funny how Russians cannot under any circumstances take what they've dished out to countless nations and peoples. The minute they're under serious threat from a nation powerful enough to subjugate them (see Mongols and Nazi Germany) it defines them in ways virtually nothing else can. When you were talking about the Russian language in schools I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

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And through all this, the bastards in the west - those same bastards who are now in government - told us that we were not "nationally conscious" enough, and that we needed to be more loyal to our country. Fuck them. We are.

I'm sure Russia is big enough for all of you.

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I hope you are consistent in your support for gangs of nationalist bandits and one-culture states. Eat your heart out: I have lived in Crimea and I will live there again. You never have and never will, and yet you talk so much, one might think you're an expert.

And so commenceth the insufferable "You don't even live here, silly foreigner!" arguments.

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And that's good how? The Ukrainian oligarchy doesn't care for anything but its pockets, and the only "liberal" thing they're gonna do is promote laws that benefit those pockets. It's like the nineties all over again. You know, people here were enthusiastic about the Soviet Union falling, being friends and all with the West - and then it turned out it wasn't going to feed them. It isn't going to feed Ukraine either. And the people who suffer will not be the oligarchs.

You will notice at no point have I praised or expressed support for the people in government in Ukraine right now. I agree with their approach to the National question but I am a Socialist. I have no time for them or for the rightists that govern Russia and Belarus and will soon govern Crimea.

Quote from: Comrade P. on March 16, 2014, 04:38:49 pm

Okay. One thing I really missed - the Right Sector (or Pravy Sector, whatever you like) and current government are not the same guys. But the Right Sector is nationalist. I now recall that guy who was interviewed by BBC on Maidan (link was posted here earlier) - the one who said "One nation, one country, one leader. No, we won't do like Hitler, well, not like, maybe just a bit..."

Right Sector and Svoboda (the most junior partners in the coalition that governs Ukraine) are far-right and Nationalist. You are completely correct, and you could argue that the government in Ukraine is quite Nationalistic in their promotion of Ukrainian and so on, but they're really more Liberal than anything else.

1. And you, of course, know what "we Russians did to people", being so highly educated in matters historical. Countless Ukrainians fought for the Reds (you might want to read up on the classical literature of that period, Bulgakov's "White Guards" being the most prominent example), and unlike in modern Ukraine, Ukrainian was taught in schools in the Ukrainian SSR - my father has some rather extensive memories on the subject. It was never stamped out as Russian now is in Ukraine, and had protected status. Dual names for stuff and all. I don't know where you get your info - I get mine from people who were there and whom I trust. You may choose to trust me or not - I have nothing to gain by deceiving you. Whatever.

2. Yes, it is. That was the whole point.

3. You don't live here, silly foreigner. This discussion is basically you all comparing sources - and if of turns out you got your info from the same loudmouth on the telly, look, you're on the same side! I would laugh, but my eyes seem wet for some reason. If the argument is so insufferable, well, doh. Do you live here or not? That's right, you don't, but somehow you feel that you are as entitled to a say in the matter as people who do. Why?

4. "Rightists who govern Russia" has me smiling. Of course, for more than ten years, my country was a political corpse that could only shrug weakly and say "yes, yes" when the so-called free world wanted another war somewhere. And now it's not, and the very fact that Russia actually has national interests has you frothing with rage. Too late.
I don't know what kind of socialist you are if you agree that the language of such a significant sector of the population has no right to status. Not the kind I am used to for sure, but maybe it's for the best.

5. You say they are liberal. Please, clarify. In which economic or social sphere they are going to apply their liberalism? What do you mean when you say that the government in Kiev is liberal? It's not snark - I sincerely don't know what you mean.


Having written this wall of text, I'm off to happier things. Bye and all, will check back tomorrow.

((It could just come out of his tongue, pop out of his mouth?))

((That's what I meant.))



Ven smiles cheerily, then sets off for the tower at a leisurely pace.
- Glad we got that over with.

Quote from: Avis-Mergulus on March 16, 2014, 10:17:14 pm

-Shall I... hold the door open for you or something?

"Somebody needs to have that pistol ready to shoot right after the nanites are down. Don't know what that AI can do, so we better not give it long to react"

The body Anton currently inhabits shifts uneasily.
- I...don't have much expertise in firearms. Maybe somebody else..?

-Shall I... hold the door open for you or something?

Woo paintball! Love it. In response to some earlier questions, how painful it is depends on the ball grade - Stingers are fucking horrible to take, while softer ones don't really hurt unless they hit you in the fingers. That's bad - they swell like you won't believe.

Here in Russia, people also play strikeball - military sports with electric-driven guns that shoot plastic balls - and the really masochistic play hardball, which is the same but with air rifles. Do any of you have those games where you live?

Over here, a person who refuses to go down when shot is called a McLeod. It's recommended to shoot him in the face, repeatedly.

percussion that goes criminally untapped

Am I the only one who finds this humorous?

It was either here or the terrified thread.
I don't even know. I don't think I WANT to know.

Can't watch it from a tablet. What's it about?