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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 2498524 times)

Farmerbob

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1665 on: April 26, 2012, 03:22:56 pm »

hrm...

Quote
The carts currently fill up with liquid when they are in a liquid square.

Are there plans to attach pond filling to cart-available actions?

Put a loop of rail in to connect a cistern with a rail line running through it with a pond you want to keep full?  Allow the cart to move through the water to fill, then dump water in the pond?

Can this be implemented with Magma for Magma ponds? *grin*
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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1666 on: April 26, 2012, 03:44:38 pm »

What happens to a magma filled minecart that passes under a waterfall? Does the minecart break? If obsidian is formed, can it be removed from the minecart?

Amusingly enough, if a liquid is a content of a minecart instead of an actual liquid on the map, it may be possible to put magma and water in the same cart without interaction until Toady actually specifically codes it in.

Until you dump the cart, then fun ensues.

Or crash a water cart and magma cart at cart destroying speeds in the air above a goblin/elf/etc.


As to the cart symbol, perhaps an inverted bed or jug?
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Cobbler89

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1667 on: April 26, 2012, 04:15:26 pm »

Will it be possible to water farms using minecarts via some kind of pond-like mechanism? Or will all the DF players likely start purposely crashing minecarts full of water in the area they wish to irrigate? (You know we're considering the possibility.)
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monk12

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1668 on: April 26, 2012, 04:22:24 pm »

What happens to a magma filled minecart that passes under a waterfall? Does the minecart break? If obsidian is formed, can it be removed from the minecart?

Amusingly enough, if a liquid is a content of a minecart instead of an actual liquid on the map, it may be possible to put magma and water in the same cart without interaction until Toady actually specifically codes it in.

Until you dump the cart, then fun ensues.

Or crash a water cart and magma cart at cart destroying speeds in the air above a goblin/elf/etc.


As to the cart symbol, perhaps an inverted bed or jug?

He means if Water and Magma are handled as contaminants instead of Flow tiles, similar to how the contents of buckets work right now. If spilling a cart doesn't turn them back into Flow tiles you'd end up with smears of magma and puddles of water that dorfs would try to clean up. This is an entirely likely outcome, since going further would probably require the long-awaited Liquid rewrite and the code for water/lye buckets is already in the game.

BroCookie

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1669 on: April 26, 2012, 07:52:58 pm »

hrm...

Quote
The carts currently fill up with liquid when they are in a liquid square.

Are there plans to attach pond filling to cart-available actions?

Put a loop of rail in to connect a cistern with a rail line running through it with a pond you want to keep full?  Allow the cart to move through the water to fill, then dump water in the pond?

Can this be implemented with Magma for Magma ponds? *grin*


So how do we think dumping/removal of liquids in carts could be handled?

My initial thoughts are of a constructed (but not powered) tile with a mechanism that tips the cart without stopping it, emptying it's contents in a direction. This would allow automated filling of ponds/magma ponds and seems pretty intuitive. It could also work with the brake tile, so you could have a "stop and dump" action, but then you would have to get the cart started again.*

Of course an alternative is manual/dwarf labour action to empty a cart in a location. This is a neater option for carts that have been accidentally filled, to avoid a situation where, like buckets, they cannot be used for other purposes until emptied. Although this makes me think of dwarves scooping magma out of a cart with their hands.


*Which is another area i'm unclear as to how it's going to work, do dwarves have to manually push a cart stopped on a brake tile? I know they are not combined brake/booster tiles, but can, for instance, other carts jump-start a stopped cart? Or does simply releasing the brake let the cart on it's way?
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Greiger

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1670 on: April 26, 2012, 08:02:35 pm »

Toady did mention that Newton's cradles work so I imagine a cart can bump another cart off a stopper with enough force.
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Farmerbob

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1671 on: April 26, 2012, 08:31:57 pm »

hrm...

Quote
The carts currently fill up with liquid when they are in a liquid square.

Are there plans to attach pond filling to cart-available actions?

Put a loop of rail in to connect a cistern with a rail line running through it with a pond you want to keep full?  Allow the cart to move through the water to fill, then dump water in the pond?

Can this be implemented with Magma for Magma ponds? *grin*


So how do we think dumping/removal of liquids in carts could be handled?

My initial thoughts are of a constructed (but not powered) tile with a mechanism that tips the cart without stopping it, emptying it's contents in a direction. This would allow automated filling of ponds/magma ponds and seems pretty intuitive. It could also work with the brake tile, so you could have a "stop and dump" action, but then you would have to get the cart started again.*

Of course an alternative is manual/dwarf labour action to empty a cart in a location. This is a neater option for carts that have been accidentally filled, to avoid a situation where, like buckets, they cannot be used for other purposes until emptied. Although this makes me think of dwarves scooping magma out of a cart with their hands.


*Which is another area i'm unclear as to how it's going to work, do dwarves have to manually push a cart stopped on a brake tile? I know they are not combined brake/booster tiles, but can, for instance, other carts jump-start a stopped cart? Or does simply releasing the brake let the cart on it's way?

Unloading railcars is actually a very simple process.  Loading them is more complex.  Most bulk railcars are unloaded with gravity feed in some way shape or form, dwarves would likely use levers and screws to open flaps at the bottom of railcars or open valves to allow materials to fall out of the cars.
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MrWiggles

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1672 on: April 26, 2012, 09:24:51 pm »

hrm...

Quote
The carts currently fill up with liquid when they are in a liquid square.

Are there plans to attach pond filling to cart-available actions?

Can this be implemented with Magma for Magma ponds? *grin*

Will it be possible to water farms using minecarts via some kind of pond-like mechanism?

Quote from: Dev Log
...but the future of that depends on it being given a use through the hauling interface and having carts being empty-able so they can be reused later.
I'm gonna go with, yes.


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MaximumZero

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1673 on: April 26, 2012, 10:42:21 pm »

Does the filling and emptying of minecarts mean that weirdness with buckets will be resolved?
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MrWiggles

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1674 on: April 26, 2012, 10:47:09 pm »

Does the filling and emptying of minecarts mean that weirdness with buckets will be resolved?
Are you talking about the Lye issues?

And also, Toady seem to have implied Minecarts and Cages are more directly related, since working Dorfs jumping out of Minecarts could lead to more active creatures in cages.
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MaximumZero

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1675 on: April 27, 2012, 02:17:01 am »

The lye/water issues, yes. You know, buckets full of stuff that can't be used.
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Cruxador

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1676 on: April 27, 2012, 02:53:48 am »

The lye/water issues, yes. You know, buckets full of stuff that can't be used.
Do you mean the bug that was resolved on the 16th and is mentioned on the dev log?
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blake77

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1677 on: April 27, 2012, 04:22:00 am »

Projectiles can now move in parabolic arcs. So does this mean that height will increase projectile distance?
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Himmelblau

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1678 on: April 27, 2012, 05:04:06 am »

Projectiles can now move in parabolic arcs. So does this mean that height will increase projectile distance?
If by projectiles you are referring to airborne minecarts and units, then yes, probably they will fly further if launched from higher.

Other projectiles will not move parabolically in the upcoming release.
Quote
I've put off updating the rest of the projectiles to have parabolic paths because I don't want to lose time dealing with adv mode targeting etc.
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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1679 on: April 27, 2012, 12:34:31 pm »

Since adamantine is so light, will adamantine minecarts be able to "float" on the surface of water? Like act as odd boats? :P Or does DF not have a concept of surface tension or bouyancy?

Lord knows, though, if it doesn't, it's probably best not adding since liquids hurts FPS already.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2012, 12:41:05 pm by RabblerouserGT »
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