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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 3709775 times)

Eric Blank

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7200 on: July 29, 2013, 02:29:02 pm »

"Quit throwing my dirt, damnit! You're scaring the worms!"
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irdsm

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7201 on: July 30, 2013, 09:34:34 pm »

"Quit throwing my dirt, damnit! You're shattering my child's skull!"

Fixed that for ya
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WillowLuman

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7202 on: July 30, 2013, 09:35:20 pm »

I lol'd
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Toady One

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7203 on: August 01, 2013, 04:34:12 am »

Thanks to Valtam, Caldfir, monk12, King Mir, Putnam, MrWiggles, mastahcheese, Knight Otu, Matoro, Witty, LordBaal, Aseaheru, Mr S, hermes, Cruxador and anybody I missed for helping to answer questions.  I think it's the nature of the long-running release to have more and more of the questions be answerable as time goes on -- if your question isn't below, it was most likely addressed by somebody above.  There were more questions answered by other people than I answer myself, so don't forget to look!

Quote from: Eggman360
If an underground multi-tile tree is cut down, with one of its leaf tiles (or even branches)
touching a side or the cavern roof, will this stop a timber/cave-in situation?

I still haven't done it yet, but I think it'll force the whole tree down in too many rather than too few situations.  Trees are adjacent to other trees in a bunch of ways, and they need to go down in those cases since we don't have a nice way to do 45 degree angle trees and so on.  So I expect that even if you build a weird support system of constructed walls around a tree, designating it for chopping will still cause it to become not present (although it might not end up in a line on the ground).  We'll see.

Quote from: CaptainArchmage
Are we going to have designs for all the other underground trees, such as the tunnel tubes and blood thorns? Those don't seem to grow like normal mushrooms.

They use the standard tree parameters -- those are capable of producing (somewhat half-assed) saguaros, so we have some latitude.

Quote from: Maxmurder
Will fallen leaves be flammable? If so will they burn as if they were items or more like how grass currently burns?

They have some temperature trigger information, but I think it just wipes them away like some of the other residue with similar triggers.  I don't have things like piles of leaves burning, though we'll probably get there in time.

Quote
Quote from: Putnam
So I heard you have new raws.
Quote from: CaptainArchmage
Would you be able to provide us with the raw details once you've finalised elf retreats before the release? It would help modders get their stuff sorted out.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Quote from: CaptainArchmage
Now that combat has had a few changes and pulping is in, are weapons that deal mostly or entirely blunt damage, such as hammers, maces, ranged weapons, and ammunition in flight going to be more effective?

Pulping might help with that a bit, but skulls are more powerful now, not less.  I don't remember offhand what happened with blunt weapons though, if anything.  I know you can kick people to death, but it's not fast like a sword.

Quote from: Adrian
How do you decide the order of the arcs to work on?
Do you have everything planned out, or do you just start on whatever suits your fancy at that moment?

It's fruitless to plan it out at this point.  There are too many interconnections, and it never ends up working out these days, so we try not to predict.  Also, it's faster to work on something I'm motivated about, and that motivation can change, so it's not a bad thing when the plans change, mostly.  I do try to do the things that go before other things when I can.

Quote from: Cruxador
But how tall are they? By all logic trees that wide should be like a thousand Z-levels tall, but that sounds likely to cause technical issues. On the other hand, a tree that's not substantially taller than it is wide would be far too silly.

For the 30 tile wide trees, I was talking about the crown, not the trunk, if that's the issue.  They are still limited in size by the sky, and to save time I haven't changed that.  Other trees are more okay the way they are -- maple trees, for example, can be roughly equal in height and width, and mine are currently too tall compared to their width, if anything.  I would prefer to get the heights up in general, though, if practical, and some of the elf ones are definitely on the short side.

Quote from: Heph
Toady can we have some screenshots of the eleven retreats?

Tree cross section screenshots always look lousy.  I can never find one I'm happy with.

Quote from: CaptainArchmage
Now that elves produce nuts and fruit from trees, can dwarves also harvest these items?

Will we now be able to trade clear or crystal glass with the elves, if the wood components used are the grown ones?

Do elves use wagons now? You say "the caravan rolled in" in the devlog.

I haven't set up a new type of gathering for it.  Something might happen, but I'll probably require little constructions or something so they can reach.  Adventurers can reach up to pick things from under trees, but that doesn't seem right for fort mode.

They still assume the same things of you since they can't verify the wooden component used.

The elves don't use wagons.

Quote
Quote from: Heph
Ok now we have grown stuff which is kinda cool. Will that include weapons?
Furthermore will these weapons be better then weapons carved out of wood?
Quote from: monk12
Why don't the "grown oak items" make the elves angry? Are they an elf-specific item type, like a "humane" way to make wood products (and if so, will judicious modding let players make "grown wood items?") Or do the elves distinguish between wood-for-crafts and wood-that's-people? Something else entirely?
Quote from: HugoLuman
The real question is, do civilizations remember their crafts now, or do elves just make special wooden stuff with a special token?
Quote from: Japa
Also, is it possible through modding to make our own grown wooden items?
Quote from: reality.auditor
To make sure: can we now sell any wooden item made by elves safely to elves? I hope it is framework stub, not some hack only for elves and only for "grown" items.

Will be some info in-game about what race made this particular item?
Quote from: DG
Will elves bring "grown" logs? If you process these logs (crafts, or decorations on other materials etc) will elves still recognise them as "grown"? I suspect that's not coverered and if so what's your guess on it eventually?

Weapons and logs, yeah, I'm pretty sure.  The grown items don't make elves angry because it is what elves do, shaping the items on the branch, and the only source of the items are the elves.  You can sell them back.  I haven't done anything with interactions or reactions, and I'm not sure when that'll happen.  Perhaps when it's a material property or when I need the interaction.  If you take a grown log and make something out of it, the elves will be angry -- perhaps they'll be able to tell later, but it isn't a material property yet so it can't carry over (and so they can't tell and don't trust you, in whatever temporary lore-space we are working in.  You are judged by the carvy marks).

Quote from: Japa
If we become friendly enough with the elves, will we ever be able to make trade agreements with them?

Yeah, I think that's a reasonably aspiration.  Once we have real trade agreements that are of actual interest to your fort it'll probably go in, with some specific goods/services of interest to either party.

Quote from: iceball3
Are there any future plans, decisions, or thought given in regarding of embassies, both of other nations in your fortress as well as your fortress in other nations?

We're just at the point of considering people hanging out in taverns and inns, so I think there's more of a chance of a diplomatic incidents before we get to any kind of formalized permanent diplomacy.  I haven't really thought about the latter.

Quote
Quote from: Dante
Is this the kind of thing which could reasonably be e.g. outsourced to the modding forum for players to do?
Quote from: Helgoland
What kind of work will you outsource to the community, and what stuff will you absoutely do yourself?

The tree density/color stuff is the existing example.  I'll probably be changing the plant growth format a bit to handle certain plants that come up, so I don't think it'd work at this early stage.  Somebody was talking about animal combat raws, and that's similar.  I'm not sure how I actually want to solve the existing problems.

Quote from: CaptainArchmage
With dwarf nobles being updated as in the devlog, does that mean we will be able to appoint a general from the king now, or a general will migrate with the king to your fortress?

Nah, that stuff isn't relevant at all yet, so I haven't looked at it.

Quote from: Ribs
Do you guys plan on making dwarven nobility a little more closed over time, where they'll work more like a caste, or will they always be a little more open. Meaning, will they ever keep certain positions more likely to be given to relatives of noble families? Will a noble's relative that is not going to inherit any titles like, say, a Duke's third son or daughter, start their own family branches and retain their and their descendent's rank as nobles over time retaining some of the perks of being part of nobility?   

I'm not sure how it'll end up.  If people ever start thinking about their family members, and they should, it'll probably end up that way without some outside moderating pressure on the numbers.  I guess that outside pressure on the numbers would be qualification or fame or whatever.  Hard to say what the equations'll be.

Quote from: Valtam
Now that forest fires became a real deal, are unlimited adventurer's campfires still avaliable? If they're not, are we getting firemaking as some sort of reaction, or maybe using Advance Interaction with some free-lying resources to do that?

I haven't done it yet.  The fire stuff is still there and still strange.

Quote
Quote from: Japa
Will we be able to make gardens in fort mode?
Quote from: Aseaheru
Think its called farmplots...

There's the issue of planting, and the issue of gathering plant growths vs. whole plants.  One of those optional items I'd like to get done.

Quote from: CaptainArchmage
Are we going to have underground roads connecting deep sites? What about underground tombs?

The underground tunnels mostly just run through the first layer with quite a bit of carving/bridging, and those can run right through plump helmet fields near the connections down to deep dwarf living areas etc.  I haven't handled the dead.

Quote from: FearfulJesuit
Do objects, like artifacts or books, get "inherited" from entity to entity as sites are conquered or things are pillaged, or do they always sort of belong to whoever made them?

There's no looting at this point, so stuff just stays in place.

Quote from: Puzzlemaker
How "alive" will a retired fortress be?  If you set up orders, burrows, patrols, etc, will the dwarves continue to obey them if you visit in adventurer mode?  If you retire then un-retire(?) a fortress, how much will be saved?

Reason I am asking is, how cool would it be to make a fortress, then visit there as a citizen from an enemy civ?

Or, even better, what about using the embark anywhere tool to start a fortress on top of an already existing fortress?  How would the game handle that?  Would it crash?

What if the civ you are part of is at war with the already-existing fortress's civ?  Could you have a "seige" if you did that?

They don't understand much about fortress stuff in adventure mode.  They should remember where they live, but they won't follow orders.  It wouldn't make sense anyway, mostly, with the time difference.  I'm trying to save as much as possible with un-retire, but I'm not sure what I'll get away with.  It's not a resolved issue.

If you visit from an enemy civ, you'll get the enemy soldier treatment -- which is still a little up in the air, due to all the AI changes, but they'll know you aren't good news.

I have no idea how the game will react to the bad embark.

Do they go to war?  I'm not sure that ever happens.  There's no code for that siege in any case, if I remember.

Quote from: Pie Maker
Now that burning trees have been implemented, will wooden constructions share a similar fate?

Nope.  It didn't end up being directly related, though it might end up that way later on.
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sackhead

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7204 on: August 01, 2013, 05:36:04 am »

thanks for the answers
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DwarfOfTheLand

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7205 on: August 01, 2013, 05:47:35 am »

Toady, as if this isn't asked enough, what's the ETA on the next release?

Anyone that knows can answer however.
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Inarius

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7206 on: August 01, 2013, 06:29:39 am »

Toady, as if this isn't asked enough, what's the ETA on the next release?

Anyone that knows can answer however.

The reply is that it will be release when it will be done. It's impossible to know how long some things take to be fixed, sometimes it goes very fast, sometimes a single problem is very long because of all the interconnections.


Edit : By the way, if you want to talk to Toady, use the green color, please. It's simplier for him, and for us.
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DwarfOfTheLand

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7207 on: August 01, 2013, 07:00:21 am »

Quote
The reply is that it will be release when it will be done. It's impossible to know how long some things take to be fixed, sometimes it goes very fast, sometimes a single problem is very long because of all the interconnections.


Edit : By the way, if you want to talk to Toady, use the green color, please. It's simplier for him, and for us.

Ah, okay. I never really talk to the developers, anyway. This is really the first time.
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Knight Otu

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7208 on: August 01, 2013, 07:04:09 am »

Thanks for the answers, Toady! :)
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Inarius

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7209 on: August 01, 2013, 07:19:31 am »

Quote
The reply is that it will be release when it will be done. It's impossible to know how long some things take to be fixed, sometimes it goes very fast, sometimes a single problem is very long because of all the interconnections.


Edit : By the way, if you want to talk to Toady, use the green color, please. It's simplier for him, and for us.

Ah, okay. I never really talk to the developers, anyway. This is really the first time.


No problem ! There is also someone who told it to me the first time I asked. Of course everybody want to know the release date...but I think Toady would like to know it, too.
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LordBaal

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7210 on: August 01, 2013, 08:26:23 am »

And even him doesn't know yet.
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Mesa

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7211 on: August 01, 2013, 08:41:28 am »

And so DF2013 continues to be the most delayed Dwarf Fortress version to date.
Wonder if we'll get it this year or should be start talking about DF2014?
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Puzzlemaker

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7212 on: August 01, 2013, 10:03:39 am »

Ah, nice.  I wasn't talking about an official "siege", I was basically asking if the enemy Civ's dwarves would be hostile to you.

It would be really cool to be able to make a fortress, set up traps and all sorts of stuff, then embark as an enemy civ on top of it.  It would be a neat way to have a community fortress, one guys makes a fort and the other guy has to get to the keep inside of it in a certain in-game time limit, or something like that.  Maybe even passing the save back and forth, switching fortresses each time.  Would be pretty cool IMHO.
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Bronze Dog

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7213 on: August 01, 2013, 10:40:03 am »

Ah, nice.  I wasn't talking about an official "siege", I was basically asking if the enemy Civ's dwarves would be hostile to you.

It would be really cool to be able to make a fortress, set up traps and all sorts of stuff, then embark as an enemy civ on top of it.  It would be a neat way to have a community fortress, one guys makes a fort and the other guy has to get to the keep inside of it in a certain in-game time limit, or something like that.  Maybe even passing the save back and forth, switching fortresses each time.  Would be pretty cool IMHO.
If we're going pie-in-the-sky dreams, it'd be really cool as a real time versus mode.

That aside, I remember an idea I thought of a long time ago that's probably going to be more workable:

Fortress player places an artifact in a secure location in his fortress, sets up traps, lever puzzles, and such to protect it. He then abandons/retires fortress and hands the save to an adventurer player. Adventurer player attempts to retrieve the artifact and escape in one piece.
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LordBaal

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #7214 on: August 01, 2013, 11:12:01 am »

I think that would be plausible on, let's start calling it that, DF 2014.

Everyone knows that dwarves fear the number 13, henceforth we will not see a 2013 release.
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I'm curious as to how a tank would evolve. Would it climb out of the primordial ooze wiggling it's track-nubs, feeding on smaller jeeps before crawling onto the shore having evolved proper treds?
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