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[Puzzlemaker]

Yeah, body language counts for a ton.

[Kagus]

Except when you happen to be in a place where the body language is completely different from what you're used to.  Took me the longest time to figure out what the hell that head-waggling meant, and these people have no idea how to talk with their hands.

[Koji]

Humans, by and large, do not use utterances, except for crying, shouting, a few similar sounds, and a few VERY BASIC body language signs. Waving does not mean hello in every language, but standing up straight makes you look more confident no matter where you go (though in some cultures, overconfidence is not appreciated).

[Kagus]

If you believe that humans do not use utterances, you obviously have never heard my grandfather telling one of his dogs not to do something.

"Abthlagthlap!"

"Brukheheemrrm!"

"Apth!"

This is, oddly enough, genetic.  Both my father and I do it from time to time.

[umiman]

I had a neighbour who would communicate with his dogs with a series of escalating "no"s.

e.g:

no... No... NO... NOO!... NO!!!! NO! NO! NO!

And all the dogs I've had never needed verbal communication to understand what I wanted. I usually stared at my dogs and they'd go to the bath themselves (unfortunately, they wouldn't bathe themselves).

Koji: I'd like to extrapolate on your discourse. It is marginally correct, but I don't think it paints a good enough picture. I would believe humans have inbuilt, genetic meanings to certain actions. For example, the action of me pointing my finger. Even babies know that when another points a finger at something, it's a sign that you're pointing your finger at SOMETHING and that something is a point of attention.

However, do that on an animal and it's taken as a sign of aggression (you'll also probably end up with a bandaged finger). In this vein, the act of raising a hand (or anything really) is taken as a general greeting... with different levels of meanings behind them which are interpreted differently of course, but the basic idea is that it is still an acknowledgment of someone's presence.

I think you'll find that it is entirely possible to conduct yourself socially (ignoring sign language) without actual words. Even a grunt, an "oh", or a stare can carry complete conversations. Combined with all our other various actions (and we have a lot: arm scratching, tongue clicking, etc.), and we're set. Words merely help this process along.

[Kagus]

Hrrmph.

[Sylverone]

"Kobolds use utterances, which is what we call the sounds that animals use to communicate. Utterances are instinctual and are not learned. Two cats that have never seen another cat before could communicate (to the extent that cats can communicate) as soon as they were introduced to each other as easily as a pair of cats that had lived in a large group their entire lives."     -Koji (sorry Kagus)

Well naturally a dwarf would think this, while a kobold would know differently.  

Besides, what's your source of information? The kobolds you slaughtered at Deathhole? Well of course all you heard were instinctual utterances!

[ May 09, 2008: Message edited by: Sylverone ]

[Kagus]

Koji, not Kagus.

[Kalimar]

quote:Originally posted by Kagus:
<STRONG>Koji, not Kagus.</STRONG>

What did the head waggling mean? I saw it on a GE Portable EKG commercial not too long ago.

[Othob Rithol]

Not to betray myself as a cat lover, but I also think the statements concerning the use of utterances has an implied limit to the overall level feline (and extending to all other non-sapien) communication.

I (or my family) have had approx. 20 cats over the last 30-odd years, of which between 3 and 5 have lived in frequent (daily) proximity at any given time. Whereas multiple utterances do seem to be instinctual, and therefor shared by all but the most pedigreed (read inbred), I have also witnessed an increasingly defined set of social customs develop across so many generations.

If I really tried, I could make a witty connection to kobolds, but that would be rather droll.

[Kalimar]

quote:Originally posted by Othob Rithol:
<STRONG>Not to betray myself as a cat lover, but I also think the statements concerning the use of utterances has an implied limit to the overall level feline (and extending to all other non-sapien) communication.

I (or my family) have had approx. 20 cats over the last 30-odd years, of which between 3 and 5 have lived in frequent (daily) proximity at any given time. Whereas multiple utterances do seem to be instinctual, and therefor shared by all but the most pedigreed (read inbred), I have also witnessed an increasingly defined set of social customs develop across so many generations.

If I really tried, I could make a witty connection to kobolds, but that would be rather droll.</STRONG>

Any experiences with toxoplasmosis?

[Kagus]

quote:Originally posted by Kalimar:
<STRONG>

What did the head waggling mean? I saw it on a GE Portable EKG commercial not too long ago.</STRONG>

They do it instead of nodding.  Imagine it as side-to-side nodding of the head.  It's generally used as an affirmative, but it's often used just to further the conversation.

[Kalimar]

quote:Originally posted by Kagus:
<STRONG>

They do it instead of nodding.  Imagine it as side-to-side nodding of the head.  It's generally used as an affirmative, but it's often used just to further the conversation.</STRONG>

Strange. I wonder if they started this convention prior to, or after the British colonization.

[Lazer Bomb]

quote:Originally posted by FunnyMan:
<STRONG>

"What happened in 1048?"  "Jreengus occurred."</STRONG>

Please add this to the wiki quote archive, someone. Make it happen!