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Author Topic: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.15 .exe available  (Read 34139 times)

getter77

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #45 on: October 16, 2012, 04:05:10 pm »

Error 404 Not Found on the latest .exe
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mendonca

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #46 on: October 16, 2012, 04:36:33 pm »

Error 404 Not Found on the latest .exe

Apologies, lazy link editing left an errant 'a' in there ... Oops ...

Should be fixed now.
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Neonivek

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #47 on: October 16, 2012, 05:00:41 pm »

The only other "Game over" I can think of that isn't just a different version of "You die" or "You run out of money"...

Is that the heros outright succeed and with world peace achieved they don't need you :P

Thus you are forced to close shop.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2012, 05:03:35 pm by Neonivek »
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The Rookie

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #48 on: October 16, 2012, 09:02:14 pm »

Looking good! been watching this for awhile. I'm also using python and libtcod as well for my roguelike. nice to see someone else is as well! Keep up the good work!

GalenEvil

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #49 on: October 20, 2012, 01:33:57 am »

fun game. Wish i knew what the leveling up does though heh. Small issue with crashing somewhat randomly:
Code: [Select]
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 8190, in <module>
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 3688, in pass_turn
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 1510, in hero_decision
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 1064, in sell_items
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 5907, in hero_sale
NameError: global name 'self' is not defined
Caused when trying to buy an item from a hero, saving before accepting any offers is the only way I can prevent losing any progression.
and

Code: [Select]
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 8193, in <module>
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 7458, in handle_keys
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 6026, in auction_house_welcome
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 6446, in auction_house_interface
TypeError: 'int' object is not subscriptable
I think this one was caused by opening up the auction house. It has only happened once though, so not sure how common the problem is.

Only other bug that I have seen is that sometimes an item will be listed for $0 in either a hero-sale or at a shop.
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Fun is Fun......Done is Done... or is that Done is !!FUN!!?
Quote from: Mr Frog
Digging's a lot like surgery, see -- you grab the sharp thing and then drive the sharp end of the sharp thing in as hard as you can and then stuff goes flying and then stuff falls out and then there's a big hole and you're done. I kinda wish there was more screaming, but rocks don't hurt so I guess it can't be helped.

mendonca

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #50 on: October 20, 2012, 02:56:40 am »

fun game. Wish i knew what the leveling up does though heh.

Thanks for playing!  :D

I kind of suspected the levelling up mechanic isn't really working at the minute - or that is, it's not very useful or transparent what it actually does.

Essentially, it enables you to view whether an item of a specific type is 'good' quality, or has an 'enchantment'. This can enable you to sell it on for more money (only problem is, only certain people will ALSO know about the quality of the item - so most people will only pay normal price for it anyway, unless they are faction-aligned and of a high enough level.)

Needs a bit of a re-work, to be honest.

The best thing it does for you now is give you an extra life when the monsters are trying to rip your shop down.

Small issue with crashing somewhat randomly:
Code: [Select]
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 8190, in <module>
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 3688, in pass_turn
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 1510, in hero_decision
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 1064, in sell_items
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 5907, in hero_sale
NameError: global name 'self' is not defined
Caused when trying to buy an item from a hero, saving before accepting any offers is the only way I can prevent losing any progression.
and

Code: [Select]
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 8193, in <module>
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 7458, in handle_keys
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 6026, in auction_house_welcome
  File "ahundredheroes.py", line 6446, in auction_house_interface
TypeError: 'int' object is not subscriptable
I think this one was caused by opening up the auction house. It has only happened once though, so not sure how common the problem is.

Only other bug that I have seen is that sometimes an item will be listed for $0 in either a hero-sale or at a shop.

Thanks for the reports! I'll have a look and see if I can figure out what is going on.
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coolio678

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #51 on: October 20, 2012, 09:35:07 pm »

looks cool! I just downloaded it, but I won't have enough time to play a round right now :P. Maybe tomorrow, if I can.

edit: it crashed, unfortunately. I forgot/ don't know how to get a report, but it happened when I accepted a heroes offer for a tunic, if that helps.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2012, 08:43:59 am by coolio678 »
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mendonca

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #52 on: October 21, 2012, 09:04:02 am »

looks cool! I just downloaded it, but I won't have enough time to play a round right now :P. Maybe tomorrow, if I can.

edit: it crashed, unfortunately. I forgot/ don't know how to get a report, but it happened when I accepted a heroes offer for a tunic, if that helps.
Ok cool, thanks for the report.

I've been doing most of my own testing without 'accepting offers', as it seemed fairly stable before and allows for an uninterrupted playthrough when I want to make it whizz through.

I suspect I have introduced a bug after adding in the 'PlayerName' variable in lieu of a fixed name but I'll see if I can hunt it down and confirm.
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Neonivek

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #53 on: October 22, 2012, 01:37:03 am »

Heros sure have no self-preservation sense.

"Dang, I am wounded... I am several floors too deep... but must keep going!"

Not that, that is inaccurate for many heros. Take away plot armor or secret mentor protecting them from the shadows and a lot of heros would pretty much be dead now.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2012, 01:39:23 am by Neonivek »
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GalenEvil

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #54 on: October 22, 2012, 03:20:25 am »

Yarr... Lost a lvl 4 hero that I was cultivating by constantly sending them and only them on dungeon dives for lootz and they went down to lvl 15 of a dungeon, got badly wounded by some trolls, and then went further down to lvl 19 of this dungeon before being all "screw this I'm leaving" then got ganked on the way back up -____- that ticked me off since I had paid out 200 to the hero before they would accept the mission.

Is the only option to pay the hero before the mission? Or does a post-mission payout option come about if you get to a high enough level?
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Fun is Fun......Done is Done... or is that Done is !!FUN!!?
Quote from: Mr Frog
Digging's a lot like surgery, see -- you grab the sharp thing and then drive the sharp end of the sharp thing in as hard as you can and then stuff goes flying and then stuff falls out and then there's a big hole and you're done. I kinda wish there was more screaming, but rocks don't hurt so I guess it can't be helped.

mendonca

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #55 on: October 22, 2012, 04:13:29 am »

Yarr... Lost a lvl 4 hero that I was cultivating by constantly sending them and only them on dungeon dives for lootz and they went down to lvl 15 of a dungeon, got badly wounded by some trolls, and then went further down to lvl 19 of this dungeon before being all "screw this I'm leaving" then got ganked on the way back up -____- that ticked me off since I had paid out 200 to the hero before they would accept the mission.

Is the only option to pay the hero before the mission? Or does a post-mission payout option come about if you get to a high enough level?

This isn't implemented yet, unfortunately. The starter position was to try and have a certain element of risk in offering contracts in the first place, and I have only really balanced it on level 1 dungeons and level 1 heroes (lots of starting and restarting - not so much extended playing). I don't think I've seen a level 4 hero in the more recent iterations of this game ...  :)

A post mission payout option sounds reasonable, though, especially when you have worked a lot on your relationship with that particular hero.

Just as a thought, would you prefer to see this tied in to your own level, have it as an option for everyone, or perhaps even tied in to your relationship with the Hero? It certainly seems likely that if you have already engaged the same hero in a number of contracts, they would be far more willing to take you on your word.

At present although you can't really see it, you are building a relationship with all the heroes with certain actions. I just need to work on how that gets implemented.

I could see post-payment being more expensive (perhaps the same level as now? - Are you finding you are sufficiently rewarded with the item haul in general, or do you often feel short-changed?)

It probably needs more nuanced mechanics, and a more transparent 'negotiation' method to boot (how does the player know, for instance, what a reasonable cost for a contract is - especially for sending people to higher level dungeons/monsters?)

Thanks for the feedback - I'll give it some thought ... there is certainly a lot I can afford to do with the contracts to make them more fun.

And I snagged the 'Hero_Sale' bug - One in four times (hence the random nature of it) it was trying to write a random note in the hero journal (a little comment on the purchase e.g. 'My daughter has always wanted one of those.') but referencing the wrong thing to write it to ...

Quote from: Neonivek
Heros sure have no self-preservation sense.

I think I'll tweak the logic for the heroes a little to make them exit the dungeon quicker, also probably make them descend slower. It's just a probability tweak for now, but it will suffice until I do a more extensive rewrite of the dungeon-hero interaction code. Just noticed a 'bruised' hero has a 25% chance to 'descend' ... this probably explains why they are going so deep when they probably shouldn't ...

I'm looking forward to tackling this rewrite, as it opens up all the hero perks and quirks and I also want to use this chance to get the heroes to start using their scrolls and stuff, and more hero-hero interaction. I don't think I have the design quite ready in my head yet, though.
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GalenEvil

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #56 on: October 22, 2012, 04:37:11 am »

As far as ROI it's a hit and miss venture as it should be with paying up front. Right now my collected stats are showing a 15-20% chance of hero death and thus 0% ROI, about 50% of the remaining is between 75 and 100% ROI (meaning I am pretty much getting what I paid for), and the remainder is between 101 and 200% ROI. It's pretty useful as is for being Pay Up Front.

For Post-mission payouts to work well I think it would need to be: a) relationship as well as hero level based, and b) negotiable if the returned lootz aren't up to standards.
A1) Relationship due to the hero needing to trust that you will have the money you say you will have when they return
A2) Level based so that the hero will be sufficiently leveled to afford to go deep diving to get enough items to be worth a high price.
B1) Negotiable in case they either find way more loot or way less / no loot than asked for.

Items could also have further inherent value to them as loot even if the hero has no clue what they are:
- Things the hero knows he/she will never use are undervalued
- Things the hero uses already and has few of are overvalued
- Things the hero uses but has a lot of are neutrally valued
- Spellbooks could have a higher inherent value to the hero just because they are generally high priced merchandise (had a $95 book given to me with a lot of other stuff on a $50 contract ^_^)

Oh yeah, the negotiation of contracts should definitely be tied in with the player's level. Getting better at retail generally means being a better salesman / negotiator as you go along so it makes sense for it to work in that manner.

I think the best hero I saw was a level 5 hero, but I think he just got really lucky since we kept the dungeons really low leveled and he was just wearing a tunic and a kitchen knife -_- He would have been so much better if he had just stopped by my shop every now and then!

Also, as a shameless plug: I do AI work and would be interested in helping out if you need any help. I work in C# mostly right now, but I can give help and pseudocode if you require.
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Fun is Fun......Done is Done... or is that Done is !!FUN!!?
Quote from: Mr Frog
Digging's a lot like surgery, see -- you grab the sharp thing and then drive the sharp end of the sharp thing in as hard as you can and then stuff goes flying and then stuff falls out and then there's a big hole and you're done. I kinda wish there was more screaming, but rocks don't hurt so I guess it can't be helped.

mendonca

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #57 on: October 23, 2012, 05:10:25 am »

Thanks again for the feedback.

It's interesting to see that the contracts seem to be balanced around-about okay, and they are some very nice thoughts to file away for when I approach the contracts in a bit more detail.

Help, particularly in the field of AI, sounds awesome. Something that I have not even tried to approach properly yet, apart from giving the little people a load of things to think about (and then having them not consider much of it). Thanks!

Interestingly, in the 'dev' version, making the heroes behave much more sanely leads to an almost inevitable death of all the dungeons (they are no longer getting the regular influx of monsters associated with hero death). I now need to rebalance things to make sure that doesn't happen.

Ignoring all that difficult thinky stuff, I made the messages come out in pretty colours and gave the Player the ability to 'Tout' for business. You can 'Call Over' any hero (from the individual Hero screen) that is engaging in retail-based activities (the thinking being that you go in to another shop and ask them over to yours, at a penalty to individual reputation with that Hero).

They also pay a small bed-rent if they stay in your shop overnight, and they earn a 'wage' when they are outta town (ostensibly so they have some cash to spend when they return - a most noticeable issue when a hero has been 'raised' - and subsequently has lost all their equipment.)
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Neonivek

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #58 on: October 23, 2012, 06:42:36 am »

Quote
Interestingly, in the 'dev' version, making the heroes behave much more sanely leads to an almost inevitable death of all the dungeons (they are no longer getting the regular influx of monsters associated with hero death). I now need to rebalance things to make sure that doesn't happen.

I think that is perfectly fine early in the game as a sort of grace period before dungeons become truely vicious.

One thing I have thought about but doesn't work, simply because heros don't stockpile and this game is about owning a shop, is the possibility of buying up houses. So when a hero who lives in them dies you simply take all their things. Or I guess earn rent.
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mendonca

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Re: 100 Heroes - A roguelike(like?) in development - v0.10 .exe available
« Reply #59 on: October 23, 2012, 08:21:54 am »

Quote from: Neonivek
I think that is perfectly fine early in the game as a sort of grace period before dungeons become truely vicious.

I tend to agree, but with the current dungeon development mechanic, they will never get the chance to become 'strong'. I suppose this could warrant a more developed 'Enemy Strategic Path' to ensure that this doesn't remain true.

... is the possibility of buying up houses. So when a hero who lives in them dies you simply take all their things. Or I guess earn rent.

I had never thought about that. I'm not averse to it (in fact I quite like the idea) - But I'm thinking it should be something slightly more involved than a simple 'buy once - claim rent forever - big payday on death' thing to be a worthwhile game mechanic to explore.

It would need some reasonable downsides I think, aside from just asking for an up-front payment, to make it more interesting 'in-play'. Hmm. Certainly warrants more thought, and would give me something to do with all that real-estate kicking about in town (they are supposed to be for 'rat-cellars', but I've never quite got round to implementing them ...)
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