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Trinimac

Malacath

Gork

Mork

Morgoth

Saruman

Bhall

Father Sky

[Putnam]

non-fire-safe buildings dismantle upon being boiled upon

[smakemupagus]

>> non-fire-safe buildings dismantle upon being boiled upon

Makes sense, nevertheless is new behavior since the new DFHack, so it must be applying the boiling vapor to the building differently than before.  Do you know of a work around?

...

just to be sure, I fired up the MDF2f tutorial fort, a version just before the new syndrome.  there is a busy training room of 3 Bloodbowl pitches, 4 weight sets, 2 totem poles, all working away nonstop with knowledge stones and not dismantling, no xx damage xx on any of the wooden components either.  :-/

[Ahrimans Library Card]

@Sharpkris

Well, that's just like Armok. Huge explosion (Probably meant to kill off some Dwarves), and then you get his Axe and Armour.

[Nokao]

I think that is the correct behaviour ... on the other side, you want most of Orc buildings to be wood-doable.
Maybe you can change the item itself, or maybe you can make the explosion a feature

What do you say on my first orc underground fortress ?
It's just temporary, I'm waiting for your next stable release, and I'm just happy that I did help you find some bugs.

[Gamerlord]

Ah! I can't gen a world with all the evil ally races! Any help?

[smakemupagus]

Ah! I can't gen a world with all the evil ally races! Any help?

I got 3/4, no ashlanders ...

update, 2nd world gen, got Ashlanders too.  So, I've been getting them all in generic "Create New Worlds" medium/short/more civs.  It's a very crowded world, more than I would play a "real" game on:  All Meph's races except Orcs and Warlocks; all the evil allies; 2 or 3 Fortdef races too.

possibly related side note:  for now, you can also get the new blueprints from the Caravanserai and the Taiga orcish civ trader

>>>

p.s.  I think that Meph has diagnosed the workshop dismantling problem and it will be fixed next time MDF updates, but the issue he found is specific (as far as Orc Fort goes) to Knowledge stones, i.e. it only affects the Training buildings (weight set, bloodbowl, anatomical theatre).  I couldn't replicate the Totem pole dismantling in my test fort.

p.s.2.  confirmed the Totem pole *does* dismantle in Nakao's fort :O  I'm not sure what to make of that to be honest.
@Meph: Nakao's fort is MDF2h w/ OFort 1.02; in which the Totem pole syndrome is [MELTING_POINT:9000][BOILING_POINT:9005]
There are boulders of the syndrome stone in the rubble.

Same thing happened when I edited Knowledge stone to have BOILING_POINT 9100, boulders in the rubble.

p.s.3.  One final data point, again not that I know how to interpret it.
Test embark, straight MDF2h plus OF 1.21 BETA, no attempted changes to raws to fix the knowledge stones.  They're still super cold.

Play blood bowl - dismantles
dfhack> unload all
Play blood bowl - works fine, no dismantling
dfhack>  load all
Play blood bowl - dismantles

[smakemupagus]

What do you say on my first orc underground fortress ?

It's quite nice, I like the way you carved out to match the existing cavern contours; and how you use the old Pandashii keep as a turkey coop.  Not to mention the convenient short stairway to the Slade Fortress direct from your great meeting hall

You could make your crafting a lot more efficient by making more use of z-levels, and/or some smaller, more specific stockpiles.  It's kind of killing me to wait 5 minutes realtime for a voodoo doll to test the totem pole with Other than that it's nice.

[Nokao]

Thank you I'm trying to learn.

The stairway down to the HFS was a mistake, I wrote about it some posts ago, an "adamantine something" was in the "R" menu before discovering it.
Just going there (I tought it was a relic or something) I found an underground curious structure with many zombies in it.

This fortress is just temporary, I HAD to dig down just because I'm out of water. But I'm definitely waiting for your next stable version to play.
I'm also really happy that I learned well how to use the new WorkFlow functions, they are very powerful and makes DF easyer with less boring micro-management.

So, keep up the good work ! I want to play in a reality where things doesn't explode for no reason!

[smakemupagus]

I want to play in a reality where things doesn't explode for no reason!

lol, me too. 

The version you were playing with is, in principle, the old stable version, not the beta ^^  The bugs have to do with some way that our mods interact with the new DFHack, but it's not straightforward.  All I can do at this point is provide Meph with data, I have really no idea about this.

summary of my XX-findings-XX. 
1. Boiling point 700, no  DFHack:  Fine (maybe dangerous to dwarf, but building is OK)
2. Boiling point 700, yes DFHack:  Dismantles

3. Boiling point 7005, no  DFHack:  Fine
4. Boiling point 7005, yes DFHack:  Fine Building takes damage, dismantles after multiple uses

5. Boiling point 9005, no  DFHack:  Fine
6. Boiling point 9005, yes DFHack:  Dismantles, solid syndrome stone remains

I think that case 2 is our mistake, but the idea that case 4 is ok while case 6 dismantles points to a strangeness in DFHack (presumably autoSyndrome, but not verified unknown part, seems to be *not* related to autoSyndrome unless I am absolutely going crazy   unload autoSyndrome:  damage still happens). 

All tests on buildings with wood or bone components, [HEATDAM_POINT:10250][COLDDAM_POINT:9900]; in the case of dismantles it seems the wood/bone is indeed lost.

[Mystic]

So... I started a new fortress with the latest version. Everything seemed to be going well until the first taiga orc caravan rolled up...
I'm not sure what happened, but within seconds, my wooden trade depot was gone, and a fire was spreading across the map.

Admittedly, I have had this before, but that was with warlock caravans, usually because one of the merchants would raise a severed toe which happened to be sitting near the Depot, and the others would subsequently freak out and nuke the surrounding area.

The one bonus to this situation is that I got all the surviving goods free of charge, one of which I think may be the source of the problem: A caged Hellfire Landmine. I've never actually used any of the landmines or turrets, but that seems like it might be the most likely culprit. But I would have thought that the landmine would be destroyed if it went off? Also, I didn't think they could go off while still inside cages, and particularly when there weren't any non-friendly creatures (that I could see) anywhere near it.

Oh well, at least next year I'll be able to get everything I could possibly ever want by selling these +rose gold scimitars+ and -gold picks- back to the dim sods that made them...

Edit: But random explosions are the essence of !!Fun!! :p

[smakemupagus]

Every exploding depot I've seen since a long time has had either Warlocks just like you describe, or there has been a hellfire landmine cage left over in the rubble. 

But it is hard to confirm that hellfire mines are the root cause, certainly after the fact.  It hasn't happened to me so I haven't seen it first hand.  Like you said it seems strange/impossible that the landmine could do anything from inside a cage.  I guess, no "Hellfire mine starts to glow with inner fire" in your combat report?  I think that Caged Hot creatures (magmahounds) can set things on fire just from passive temperature, but Hellfire mines are not hot.

I don't think that landmines are specifically destroyed when they attack, other than that (when outside a cage) they are as likely as anything else to get blown up.

[Nokao]

Ok, so the problem is DFhack3 with DFhack2 developed mod.

Well, just think about it for the next pack, what is done is done

bye

p.s. this is why I play with "harder everything" ON but "harder learning" OFF, it's very easy to die for small reasons, I lost many legendary dwarfes that was just mining or smelting ore. So now I just use workers as slaves, and I put in a safe place nobles and in barraks top-military units that MUST not work and have to die on the battlefield.

[Mystic]

Combat logs were blank, and if there -was- anything else, I don't think it survived... Ah well, if you figure out, let me know.
The one thing this mod has taught me is that wooden Trade Depots do not last long 

Also, one of my orcs was set alight by firebirds, then proceeded to loaf around for a few months in a foul mood, not because she was smouldering, but because she had no clothes. A while later she was put out by a passing rainstorm... She's not particularly tough or anything, and I didn't turn temperature off, so I really have no idea how she managed to emerge completely unscathed. The last time this happened was in the old version, and the poor little guy died in about a second...

Excuse all the posts, don't get me wrong, I'm still loving the mod, and I'm laughing myself silly at the chaos caused by necromantic traders, firebreathing wildlife and exploding Depots. In fact, I think this is the most I've enjoyed dwarf fortress in a long time.

[smakemupagus]

1.22
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=6732

* Tinkerer can [PERMITTED_REACTION:MINERAL_OIL_ORC]
* Sapper's weapons can use any oil, not just mineral oil
* bugfix, Boreal plants grow in TUNDRA (autumn and winter), not GLACIER
* hotfix attempt for buildings damaged by magic - remove wood and bone buildmats from all bldgs with magic/music/knowledge
   * totem pole = ironbone
   * stone circle = firesafe blocks, no wood
   * icecrystal sanctum = silver and iron, no blocks
   * anatomical theatre = firesafe everything
   * bloodbowl pitch = firesafe blocks, no wood
   * weight set = firesafe bucket and blocks
   * buccaneer's tavern = firesafe blocks; no barrels
   * treesinger's pagoda = firesafe blocks, 1 mithril statue; no seeds etc.

Maybe there will be a more elegant fix some day, but I did this so that I can continue to test the new stuff, just figured I would share it.

>>

@ Mystic:   glad you're having fun!  You had some good luck with the firebird, one just vaporized my Druid

[Gamerlord]

Cab this be put onto an existing save folder?