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Trinimac

Malacath

Gork

Mork

Morgoth

Saruman

Bhall

Father Sky

[NRN_R_Sumo1]

Thanks for the report Wrex, you're certainly on to something, although I'll wait for Meph to touch base on whether it's OK for me to tinker with item_weapon_masterwork file.  Another related interesting arena test would be the MW dwarven Maul and Meteorhammer against standard Warhammer.

I also think there are a few edged weapons that have too long an edge by a factor of ~10, tomahawks and keris are the ones relevant to orcs, but there are others too..  Edit:  On second thought, maybe just those.  Smaller contact area and somewhat smaller penetration, to make them intermediate between sizes of dagger and sword.

Only thing is that clubs really shouldn't be multigrasp though, [TWO_HANDED:27500] is quite a low limit, like a machete or dagger. 

@ NRN:  Sorry you had trouble installing.  About your interesting orc, if he just had a "very strong" descriptor in game or a "Diamond" in therapist it means he's strong for a dreamwalker, but hopefully his stats quantitatively should be not over 1500? 

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

dreamwalker [PHYS_ATT_RANGE:STRENGTH:150:600:800:900:1000:1100:1500]
uruk [PHYS_ATT_RANGE:STRENGTH:3000:3500:3750:4000:4250:4500:5000]

Ah! that explains a lot thank you, that means I had both a 'very strong' for a uruk, as well as a 'very strong' for a dream walker.
Silly me 

The dream walker was diamonds across the board.

[Meph]

Some feedback about the mod:

A goblin caravan has arrived.
The orc caravan has arrived.

You should probably have a look at the entities, and see that the orc-allied races are not active in the same season, otherwise you go some seasons without caravans, and some season the races arrive at the same time.

The forum (according to the succession fort) seems to favor the Warhammer-style orc, with MOAR, WAAAGH and similar bad writing. Would you consider renaming a few things to better reflect this ? Instead of Katana and Dai-Katanas make them: Cutta and Big Cutta, or rename buildings, from Stonecutter to Stonecutta... same for profession names, armors and items in general. I know it would be a lot of work, and mostly you would have to make direct copies, change the name and add an _ORC to the ID, but it would definetly add flavor to it.   

[smakemupagus]

Goblins are definately active all seasons (since they are set up attack Dwarves in all seasons). 
I'll check on the others.

Goblin traders were just sort of an experiment anyway, I don't know what to do with them.  They just bring a few bars of metal, cloth, and a few cave turtles.  I've been trying to decide if it's really a problem that they're there all year, or if it's more like having a goblin ghetto on the fringe of your city.

I'm happy to pull in some Warhammer goodness, in a particular workshop or even a whole industry chain, but what I'm trying to do is more like draw fun stuff from Orcs in all kinds of different universes and try to bring them together.  The goal is that people have the tools in this mod to build Orthanc, or Orsinium, or the Pao Islands, or Ogrimmar, or ... um, whereever the orcs come from in WH ... without it actually being a total conversion to any one thing specifically. 

thing that sound good: 
* Add a berzerker mode "TO WAGGGGGH!!!" along with other type of warsongs
* Make the mass produced Factory weapons choppas etc... The Slag Pit already is by the way (don't want to mess with the artisan workshops though)
* renaming the Gateball field and reactions to Blood Bowl
* etc., give me specifics please

p.s. the bladed tankers with red red magma inside go fasta, i promise!!

[Meph]

I hit you so hard, your mother in Orsinium will start to bleed. Ha, good times.

But if thats the case, why do you give them japanese weapons ?

And I dont have to give you specificis, it is your mod, use your own creativity

[Wrex]

Orcs in the ES were renknowned for their craftsmanship, so an akaviri weapon seems like a natural fit, especially given  that orsinium is very close to akavir. There is also the fact that folded blades were not exclusive to the japanese.

[Arbinire]

Some feedback about the mod:

A goblin caravan has arrived.
The orc caravan has arrived.

You should probably have a look at the entities, and see that the orc-allied races are not active in the same season, otherwise you go some seasons without caravans, and some season the races arrive at the same time.

The forum (according to the succession fort) seems to favor the Warhammer-style orc, with MOAR, WAAAGH and similar bad writing. Would you consider renaming a few things to better reflect this ? Instead of Katana and Dai-Katanas make them: Cutta and Big Cutta, or rename buildings, from Stonecutter to Stonecutta... same for profession names, armors and items in general. I know it would be a lot of work, and mostly you would have to make direct copies, change the name and add an _ORC to the ID, but it would definetly add flavor to it.

Please for the love of all that is human, dwarven, and orcish, don't do this.  Or if you do, put it off till the Masterwork overhaul so it can be a plugin option.  I know I'm probably in a minority on these forums when it comes to this but I REALLY hate Warhammer depictions of Orcs.  The whole premise of the IP is over the top extreme racial stereotyping, which works in it's own setting, but there are enough mods on here that do this already.  This mod has really drawn me back into DF cause I really enjoy the idea that my fort can either be a noble shamanistic outpost, or an industrious war machine.  Honestly, I was thinking of asking Meph how to edit that embark message specifically to take out the Waaagh .

<3 ya Meph, and all the work you've done here, but MAN I really freakin' hate Warhammer .

As to problems I've come across so far(not caused by my own doing).  I have had orcs and goblins show up in the same initial autumn season, which wasn't a problem in and of itself, but I only had one Depot, and when the time came for both to leave, the walkers took all the goods and left, but the wagons and their drivers ended up staying at the Depot.  I've since made sure my embarks don't have orcs and goblins listed too near eachother on the embark screen, which has worked so far from keeping them from showing up at the same time.  Thought about setting up mutliple Depots, but that seems like it'd be hit or miss depending on which side of the map the traders come in on.

[smakemupagus]

Hmm, I've had multiple traders at the same time successfully before.  Is it possible that you trapped the wagons in by building traps?  Traps are impassable to wagons in the current DF.

[NRN_R_Sumo1]

Hmm, I've had multiple traders at the same time successfully before.  Is it possible that you trapped the wagons in by building traps?  Traps are impassable to wagons in the current DF.

Are cage traps included in that? If so I might need to seriously redesign my battle fields. 

[Wrex]

Yes. The traders just leave the wagon's behind though, and bring the goods anyway, so it's not an issue in my experience.

[Arbinire]

Hmm, I've had multiple traders at the same time successfully before.  Is it possible that you trapped the wagons in by building traps?  Traps are impassable to wagons in the current DF.

I didnt have any traps at all, and I even had a separate nook at my main gate specifically for the Depot which was a 9x9 "room" with the 5x5 depot dead center, a 5 tile wide "door" for the wagons to go through with the main gate also being 5 tiles wide.  Hadn't gotten my draw bridge up at that point, nor a moat channel dug yet.  The caravans showed up practically at the same time (within 1-3 seconds of eachother).

[Wrex]

Hrm, any way I can make the "make Makeshift armor" reactions target specific armour? No matter where I place the small armour, my orcs prefer to try to jury rig the iron chain mail I forged.

[smakemupagus]

Yep!  ... You can make an armor stockpile and set it to only accept "unusable" armor.  (this is a funny tag at the bottom of the screen, same way you turn off and on sand bags in a furniture pile.)  Optionally also set rules for materials and whatever else you want.  Then link that stockpile to the Slag Pit. 

Also remember to link up a coal stockpile if it's not a magma Pit.

It's a little harder to manage for weapons unfortunately, but you can still usually get by managing materials and quality.

[smakemupagus]

A goblin caravan has arrived.
The orc caravan has arrived.

They're spread out as much as they can be, there are just more trade partners than seasons (unless we revert to the original method of no outlander Orc and Goblin traders).  It's tied to the entity's ACTIVE_SEASON, they trade with us at the same time as they attack the Dwarves, which is why you get Goblins year round.

goblins in SPR SUM & AUT, fanatics in SPR, bandits in SUM, outlander Orcs in AUT, deepdrow in WIN.  Home civ in AUT.

[Meph]

It somehow feels like you should be trading with goblins, orcs and kobolds... maybe even drow, but definetly no dwarves, elves or humans. I would turn the evil versions of, and just keep the normal enemy races as friends. 1 for each season max.

Raising the size (actually the weight in grams, HA learnt something new) of the orcs would fit better, in my eyes. I can easily see orcs weighting 120-140kg, which would make it 120.000 size at least. Changing the skill learn rates a bit, give them faster combat learning, but slower engraving/masons/miners then dwarves, so people dont make too fancy underground fortresses.

I also made you a little something. Hope you like it

[smakemupagus]

It somehow feels like you should be trading with goblins, orcs and kobolds... maybe even drow, but definetly no dwarves, elves or humans. I would turn the evil versions of, and just keep the normal enemy races as friends. 1 for each season max.

OK, but the normal enemy races are in entity_default, and you asked me to restrict my meddling there
Remember if I fiddle with the seasons it also changes their attacks on the Dwarven fortresses, so we'd need to tie that in to the dwarf/orc toggle button (and I don't know how to make things toggleable yet)

So I think my plan is this: 
* Change goblins/orc/kobolds so that they send trade liason and only 1 per season.  In the future, maybe give them a few special trade goods
* Keep trade with Chaos races as an option (players can always not activate these civs if they don't want it, they are off by default after all) BUT go through and revise their ethics to be all different from one another as appropriate, maybe resulting in War as often as Trade.  Since they're all BABYSNATCHER anyway this has i think very little impact on Dwarf mode.
* Probably change my mind anyway when other people give feedback

Raising the size (actually the weight in grams, HA learnt something new) of the orcs would fit better, in my eyes. I can easily see orcs weighting 120-140kg, which would make it 120.000 size at least. Changing the skill learn rates a bit, give them faster combat learning, but slower engraving/masons/miners then dwarves, so people dont make too fancy underground fortresses.

Yeah, they might get a bit bigger, I don't want to overdo it though.  They're also very strong.  Agree with you on skill rates, I  leave mason alone, since that is actually used in above ground building a lot.  Their engravings are already seem to be kind of limited by their low creativity and etc ("This is an engraving of a square.  The square is the symbol of our civilization".)

I also made you a little something. Hope you like it

   Amazing!!!  THANKS