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[Fluff]

The thread-tile doesn't explain this very well, so let me provide some detail:

At the start of my fortresses, when I have seven dwarves who can do this, that, and whatever, I find things fairly fun (not Fun.). When I want something new done, I just look to see who seems the least busy. Then I get a few migrant waves of 30 dorfs each, and end up with 40 idlers because I can't decide who should do what where.

What I'm considering for my next fortress is to keep dwarves in discrete groups (I might even make them into clans, and name them as such), in seperate areas/burrows/caves, and have different groups focus on different things (E.g. This clan shall keep bees, this one shall operate furnances, etc.). I'm mainly looking for suggestions on how I should set them up. Having an entire burrow just for dyeing, for example, might be a bit of a waste of space, but having just one burrow for everything plant-related might get a bit to pressured.

I think I'll have a few professions (miners, for example) be independant, and simply travel across the burrows as needed (Or possibly I'll alternate them across burrows on a monthly rota). I'm torn between establishing a clan for them military (and possibly trying to rp them into establishing dominance over the other clans), or having the various clans volunteer a few dorfs each.

Looking forward to hearing what anyone has to say about this.

[RanDomino]

They'll probably form relationships faster and mainly within their industry, which could mean a tantrum quickly spirals and knocks out an entire sector of the economy.  On the other hand it might only knock out that industry.

[Fluff]

I've never actually managed to create a single tantrum spiral. I feel a bit embarrased saying that. Perhaps this fortress design will fix that.

[AutomataKittay]

Most of my thoughts on reading is to advise on industrial organization, but I think it could be useful to take guidance from http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Labor for your first attempt at separating them by category and having only haulers, woodcutter and miners be wandering dwarves ( you would need some way to move supplies around! ) though military should be too, if only you could RP them as the arm of the fortress government.

I've adopted a basic form of organization in a few fortresses of around 4-9 speciality workers of each color with a 'representative' that have all of the color's labors enabled and specialized hauling for internal use. And around 1 'manager' ( not actual manager nobility, but it's a nickname I uses ) for every 10 workshops, whose only job is to haul everything, and do archiecture ( the latter because I can train them up to be purple, like noble ), which's more like 'advanced hauler' but kept aside so I don't accidentally choke flow for want of haulers.

Minecart would be very good for this also, to move supplies around with less haulers, and trying to process as much food as possible at the farming area so you don't have to deal with raw food seed everywhere.

[0cu]

I've never actually managed to create a single tantrum spiral. I feel a bit embarrased saying that. Perhaps this fortress design will fix that.

I haven't had any tantrum spirals ever, also. But I think it depends on the current population size, since I usually play with forts with about 100 dwarves.

[Nostril actor]

I usually do something a bit less extreme along these lines, however, right after the introduction of minecarts I set up a fort that worked completely on minecarts so that non-clanmate dwarves never had any interaction whatsoever. Each sector provided its own military and was seperated by at least 3 z-levels from the next. In the end it died when a noxious mist from the terrifying biome managed to get into my farming clan's sector through the machinery in the windmills, resulting in a slow painful death for everyone in the burrows below who's food minecarts sudennly decided to stop coming.

[XXSockXX]

They'll probably form relationships faster and mainly within their industry, which could mean a tantrum quickly spirals and knocks out an entire sector of the economy.  On the other hand it might only knock out that industry.

I generally find that relationships are really unproblematic, provided that the dwarfs are happy otherwise. In my fort with 440+ dwarfs everyone is friends with everybody. When three dwarfs died in a short period of time most dwarfs remained "ecstatic" and only a few had drops down to "quite content". There are also positive thoughts from relationships that stack with the other good thoughts, so there is no way this could turn into a tantrum spiral if the dwarfs are not very happy to begin with.

[Tally]

I've never actually managed to create a single tantrum spiral. I feel a bit embarrased saying that. Perhaps this fortress design will fix that.

Me neither, but I don't think I've really progressed a fortress far enough or taken enough risks with one for it to be a relevant issue.

I have, on the other hand, had a military dwarf throw several tantrums because I didn't have a couple pieces of my armor set finished for his replace clothing uniform. Apparently embarassment from being uncovered carries a lot of weight as a bad thought.



On a more relevant note, such a fortress design as this would actually be promising in both reducing tantrums and making their effects a lot more minimal.


Obviously, you want to keep some roles independent of burrows. This setup more than others will require dedicated haulers. Some roles that you may ignore more easily without realizing, as well, may be engravers, architects, and (depending upon how many siege engines you set up, if at all) siege operators. Also, if you haven't played with burrows before, turn off hauling jobs for the people being burrowed, otherwise you WILL get spammed with "Store Item In Stockpile cancelled: Job Item Inaccessible".


And for a few ideas off the top of my head: Make a lobby for your migrants to mingle in. This makes them all easy to sort out when you have time for them.
A heavily burrowed fortress will likely be separated a great deal by distance. Plan out a minecart system. Have a few dwarves handy with their role being only to push carts, especially if you have tracks that are unpowered.


This is about all I can suggest. I haven't tried a heavily burrowed system before, and I probably won't until I become a little more familiar with the mechanics of power systems and minecarts. Burrowing the essentials of a metal industry helps a ton with keeping your military stocked though, if nothing else!

[misko27]

I've never actually managed to create a single tantrum spiral. I feel a bit embarrased saying that. Perhaps this fortress design will fix that.

I haven't had any tantrum spirals ever, also. But I think it depends on the current population size, since I usually play with forts with about 100 dwarves.

Oh wow, really? Hell, i've had crippling spirals at 50 or so. I've never even heard of someone who's never had one.

[zubb2]

I've never actually managed to create a single tantrum spiral. I feel a bit embarrased saying that. Perhaps this fortress design will fix that.

I haven't had any tantrum spirals ever, also. But I think it depends on the current population size, since I usually play with forts with about 100 dwarves.

Oh wow, really? Hell, i've had crippling spirals at 50 or so. I've never even heard of someone who's never had one.

Yeah I have no idea how you dont have dwarves killing each other  at least monthly.

[Loud Whispers]

I've never actually managed to create a single tantrum spiral. I feel a bit embarrased saying that. Perhaps this fortress design will fix that.

I haven't had any tantrum spirals ever, also. But I think it depends on the current population size, since I usually play with forts with about 100 dwarves.

Oh wow, really? Hell, i've had crippling spirals at 50 or so. I've never even heard of someone who's never had one.

Yeah I have no idea how you dont have dwarves killing each other  at least monthly.

Large forts where no one is capable of making friends due to the akwardly large distances involved.

[0cu]

My forts aren't that large. I'm more the man to keep areas as small as possible and I am a perfectionist about that.

My best fort so far existed for more than 6 years and even after a massive onslaught by a goblin siege mounting cave crocodiles and crawlers in the courtyard which killed about 25 of my macedwarves, the rest of the fort just kept going on.

I usually keep my dwarves specialized (exlusive masons/carpenters/smiths and so on) and try to keep them busy. The rest of the fort is my hauling force, about 30-40 female dwarves. The male get to become soldiers.

Worked for me so far. My current fort is aiming for 200 dwarves, maybe I'll experience a tantrum spiral.

[Findulidas]

I've never actually managed to create a single tantrum spiral. I feel a bit embarrased saying that. Perhaps this fortress design will fix that.

Its about playing on a dangerous setting or doing something Fun.

I had a massive tantrum spiral when I tried to mine through the aquifier layers by exposing them to the surface which was freezing, thereby creating ice walls which stopped the flow of water. Unfortunately dwarves are retards so when they channeled downwards they often ended up walking in the same channel (despite me trying to stop them in several diffrent ways like making the whole layer restricted) this caused the to instantly die when the water that poured in froze. Lost about 25 dwarves like that and about 10 picks. This caused a massive spiral among most of the dwarves which had very little to do but make friends above.

[SixOfSpades]

+1 for the ranks of those who've never had a tantrum spiral. The 2 keys are to keep your dwarves happy (each of my dwarves except the duke & his girlfriend has a 5x5 workshop & a 10-tile bedroom, complete with table, chair, coffer, cabinet, armor rack, & weapon stand, and the walls are all solid marble) and busy (my population is only 50, and they're constantly occupied with a megaproject--the other day, I saw that my armorsmith, who's been in the fort some 15 years doesn't know anybody: not even a single Passing Acquiantance).

As far as fort design, I have to say that it seems that separate forts, each individually self-sufficient, seems to make a lot more sense than segregating by industry. While I agree that it's much more dorfy to set up a horribly complicated and accident-prone minecart system to circulate vital supplies, having standalone population centers is far more secure. Once you set up a "core" that handles things like trading with merchants, surface wood/livestock, and dropping raw materials to each of the "pods," never more shall you fear thieves, invasions, vampires, syndromes, tantrum spirals, or even loyalty cascades.

[moki]

I've had a few tantrum spirals, but only in forts where I didn't care for happiness at all. 150 dwarves and 10 beds near the workshops, military on duty all year round and a general shortage of everything that makes dwarves happy are a good way to provoke them. A dead pet or spouse is one of the most common starting points and a psychotic hammerer in conjunction with stupid mandates also helps.

I also don't like having idlers, but I don't find it problematic to give everyone a job. There are a few skilled specialists for farming, mining, metalworking and crafts while everybody else (that's the hordes of useless fish dissectors and soap makers) get to do masonry, engraving, butchery, smelting and basically every task where skill level is not important. In my current fort of 160 dwarves there are rarely more than 10 idlers and if the number ever goes up, I just start the next megaproject. A whole palace can be built in weeks with 50 masons, 10 churning out stone blocks 24/7 and the rest building. If you prefer to stay underground, a few more miners may be useful, but it's basically the same.

As for your idea... go for it. You'll need careful planning with burrows, but it's quite possible as long as you keep the professions separated. If there are metalsmithing tasks in the beekeeper's burrow, you'll just get a lot of job cancellations and in the end nothing gets done. Dwarf Therapist is an absolute necessity in a fort like this.
Having the military as separate class the basically controls the whole fortress is a great idea. RP-wise it's a kind of police state or prison colony. I think, an idea like that has great potential.