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[vanatteveldt]

You can drain an aquifer using dfhack, I think it is the drainaquifer command. It does not drain 100% I think, but very close.

Obsidianizing is easy but requires a wide hole for a multi-z level aquifer as you lose a tile with every z-level. Also, I tend to mess up fluid amounts and have too much magma which takes a long time to vaporize, but you might be better at that.

I normally use the double slit method (http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Double-slit_method), it takes a fair amount of time and blocks, but you can pierce an arbitrary number of z levels straight down.

I don't know of a way to add civilizations either before or after embark, but I'm pretty far from being a guru.

[Marble_Nuts]

I just did exactly what I did for water, but magma just won't fill the cart even when submerged in 7/7 lava. Everything is operational AND magma safe (obsidian ftw)

Here are 2 screens

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Do I need to submerge my minecart in a 2z thick pool of 7/7 magma? Ain't one 7/7 enough? Also, whats the roller/ramp to climb ratio? I have 4 rollers here to climb 1z of upward ramp. How many ramps could I climb with 4?

[gchristopher]

One 7/7 tile of magma will always fill a stationary minecart. I haven't seen exactly what the criteria for filling a moving minecart might be. Others have guessed that it has to be moving slow enough.

I know that dropping a minecart straight down with no horizontal velocity or offset, onto a ramp with 7/7 magma will always fill the cart before it finishes rolling off the ramp.

What is your roller speed? Try it again with the first rollers set on lowest, then increase the speed once you've verified that the cart fills?

[blue emu]

Can a cart fill with Magma while rolling slowly down a ramp?

The next thing to test is to set up a J-bend of ramps, filled with 7/7 magma. Since unpressurized Magma (unlike water) will not rise higher than the outlet, the two columns of magma will be unequal, and it will only need to climb one ramp to get out.



In the above diagram, if the cart drops vertically into the first 7/7 magma/ramp tile, then rolls down seven tiles of 7/7 magma/ramp and immediately (ie: with no connecting horizontal corridor) up one tile of 7/7 magma/impulse-ramp, it should emerge fully loaded with magma... according to the numbers.

[Marble_Nuts]

I need to block a lava tile, but I have no idea on how to do a cave in that won't deconstruct when falling. If I want to change the roller speed, I must pump all lava  on the rollers. Since I haven't placed any magma safe floodgate, how do I block the lava tunnel?

[Brilliand]

I need to block a lava tile, but I have no idea on how to do a cave in that won't deconstruct when falling.

To do a cave-in that won't deconstruct when falling, drop a solid block of natural, unmined stone.  If you don't have any available, cast some with water and magma.

If you're trying to dam a river of magma, a simpler solution might be to just dump water on it (casting obsidian in place).

[Xob Ludosmbax]

Powered rollers and impulse ramps are unnecessary.  In my last fortress, I moved all of my magma around using a single steel minecart and an obsidian bridge, (although I'd probably use two bridges next time.)  You build a room with a pit that you can fill with magma and from which you can remove the magma (in this case, I used a bridge as an atom smasher.) 

In short, have dwarf place cart in pit.  Pull lever, allow pit to fill with magma.  Once cart is submerged, put lever on repeat to atom smash the magma.  Once you only have a bunch of 1/7 puddles, turn repeat off, making sure pit is sealed so that no new magma can enter.  Allow 1/7 puddles to evaporate so that you have access to the cart again. 

Dig a channel where you are going to place your magma smelter/furnace/etc.  Build a track stop next to it, set to dump into the new pit.  Designate a new hauling route (or re-use an existing one) to have a dwarf carry the cart to the track stop and dump the magma into the pit.  You only get 2 units of magma per cart, and magma buildings require 4 units to function, so you must repeat the process once. 

No screw pumps, no powered rollers, no long sections of track or ramps. 

[Brilliand]

Powered rollers and impulse ramps are unnecessary.  In my last fortress, I moved all of my magma around using a single steel minecart and an obsidian bridge, (although I'd probably use two bridges next time.)  You build a room with a pit that you can fill with magma and from which you can remove the magma (in this case, I used a bridge as an atom smasher.) 

In short, have dwarf place cart in pit.  Pull lever, allow pit to fill with magma.  Once cart is submerged, put lever on repeat to atom smash the magma.  Once you only have a bunch of 1/7 puddles, turn repeat off, making sure pit is sealed so that no new magma can enter.  Allow 1/7 puddles to evaporate so that you have access to the cart again. 

Dig a channel where you are going to place your magma smelter/furnace/etc.  Build a track stop next to it, set to dump into the new pit.  Designate a new hauling route (or re-use an existing one) to have a dwarf carry the cart to the track stop and dump the magma into the pit.  You only get 2 units of magma per cart, and magma buildings require 4 units to function, so you must repeat the process once. 

No screw pumps, no powered rollers, no long sections of track or ramps.

That's a really slow process, though...

[Veylon]

You can always do it with a bunch of minecarts in a pit. Alternatively or additionally, build a double-level chamber where the minecarts can sit on grates on the upper level and the atom-smashing happens down below. That would eliminate the evaporation phase.

[blue emu]

Powered rollers and impulse ramps are unnecessary.  In my last fortress, I moved all of my magma around using a single steel minecart and an obsidian bridge...

I want to build an unpowered, magma-based auto-cannon weapon system... for which your procedure is too slow by a factor of about 10,000-to-1.

I would like to see a rate of fire (per barrel) of several shots per minute, not several shots per year.

[Suoli]

I am told that a cart moving fast enough to overcome the viscosity of the magma and climb the exit ramp is also moving too fast to auto-load magma.

Actual testing is required.

I'm using an automated system based on impulse ramps to load and move magma around my current fort. No rollers, pumps or power required.



Empty minecarts enter from the left. They are accelerated with impulse ramps, climb up, fly over the empty space (covered by a hatch while the system is not in operation) and slam into the wall, losing all momentum in the process. Next, they drop into the magma reservoir, fill up and are slowly moved to the other end of the reservoir by the impulse ramps. This is where things get tricky.

Impulse ramps have just enough power to move the submerged cart vertically but they seem unable to accelerate the cart up the ramp at the end of the reservoir, no matter how many impulse ramps I lined up. The somewhat unintuitive but simple solution to this is to push it up with another cart. So, to recap:

1. Cart(1) drops into the magma, fills up, moves up to the ramp and stops.
2. Cart(2) drops into the magma, fills up, slams into cart(1) and stops.
3. Cart (1) gets pushed up the ramp by the force of the impact.
4. Cart (2) moves to where cart(1) used to be and stops.

I've had this system running non-stop for about an in-game month at a time, with no problems. Haven't tried it yet but I'm sure you could incorporate the cart stacking trick for a rapid firing version.

[blue emu]

Is there a reason why THIS won't work? :



A cart gains 4890 delta-v running down a ramp, and loses -4910 delta-v running up a ramp. It loses -500 delta-v per (level of magma - 1) per tile that it passes through... ie: -3000 delta-v per tile for 7/7 magma... so a set-up where the cart is dropped vertically onto the first of six descending 7/7 magma-filled ramps and then rolls up one 7/7 magma-filled ramp should allow it to exit with a cargo of magma PLUS:

(6 x 4890) - (1 x 4910) - (7 x 3000) = +3430 delta-v

... am I missing something?

[Suoli]

Is there a reason why THIS won't work? :



A cart gains 4890 delta-v running down a ramp, and loses -4910 delta-v running up a ramp. It loses -500 delta-v per (level of magma - 1) per tile that it passes through... ie: -3000 delta-v per tile for 7/7 magma... so a set-up where the cart is dropped vertically onto the first of six descending 7/7 magma-filled ramps and then rolls up one 7/7 magma-filled ramp should allow it to exit with a cargo of magma PLUS:

(6 x 4890) - (1 x 4910) - (7 x 3000) = +3430 delta-v

... am I missing something?

Well, I tried to push a submerged cart up a ramp with what was supposed to be a sufficient number of consequtive impulse ramps according to published information and calculations. Dwarf Fortress didn't seem to think much of my carefully researched equations. Testing is the only way to know for sure.

About that impulse ramp: I thought they only work when the output tile is on the same or lower z-level as the input tile?

[blue emu]

About that impulse ramp: I thought they only work when the output tile is on the same or lower z-level as the input tile?

The numerical calculation that I gave above assumes that it is a normal ramp, not an impulse ramp.

... but according to the published physics, it should cost 3010 delta-v to CLIMB an impulse ramp through 7/7 magma.

[Marble_Nuts]

The cart was not filling because he was going to fast through the magma. Considering -150 is deep as hell to set up power for rollers, I might just use impulse ramp for the filling zone and dwarf riding to boost it up to the forges near surface.

Would that work? Is it true that riding actually provide power to the cart so it can climb up ramps?