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How many want to keep this up in the next release?

Me
- 16 (23.2%)
Me!
- 53 (76.8%)

Total Members Voted: 68


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Author Topic: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.  (Read 268916 times)

Gnorm

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1530 on: August 11, 2013, 07:48:49 pm »

I have decided to put my artistry to use in creating a piece of fan-art. Below is my interpretation of an image of a treelord.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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WillowLuman

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1531 on: August 11, 2013, 10:29:41 pm »

I just go camping for 2 days...

Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.
My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right  :P

The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.

As far as why it's the better-than-steel equivalent, I'll admit I took a little creative liberty, but aside from the MAX_EDGE I wouldn't expect it to be -that- weird. Iridium is the second-densest element and second-most resistant to elastic strain, and is very hard. I intended for it to be excellent in armor and blunt weapons... perhaps I should nerf its effectiveness in blades, sort of like an anti-Adamantine--bluemetal gives you whiffle bats while Iridium gives you butterknives. Perhaps I should demand that bars of Iridium be alloyed with some other metal in a very low quantity (say, 10-20% alloy composition) before being worked? I'll admit that Iridium was kind of a bust due to being far more difficult to actually get than I had anticipated.
But if you're actually going the realistic route with Iridium (and not the fantasy-metal-with-cool-sounding-name-of-real-metal route), why not use something slightly more common, like Aluminum? People didn't even discover Iridium until 1803, and can barely even work it with modern technology.

Worldgen crashing is generally a bad sign though. There have been so many updates by now that I think we need to rectify this. I haven't changed my files much (except for a couple of extremely minor edits that I plan on integrating with my eventual second modding turn in the distant future), but anybody that has updates to make should probably, IN CHRONOLOGICAL ORDER OF TURNS, apply all fixes to their own files and then merge.
My upload on DFFD is in .zip format, and includes all the latest files and fixes. Unless you merged it with another version of the raws, there should be no crashes.

That's a really bad idea. Aeresium is not supposed to be weapons-grade. Would you make a creature that has a material weakness to lay pewter, for instance?

Why do you think I made it that large?  And through custom reactions and a custom workshop, lizardkin can make weapons from it.

The point is that you're not supposed to be able to make weapons out of it in the first place! It's not hard to define your own metal, give it an ore, and use that instead of modifying-but-not-really something that someone else did and perverting it for your own purposes. It's also much less unethical.
it does reduce the amount of pointless bloat metals and it is nice for Aeresium to have a purpose beyond a building material
"Poinless bloat metals"!? In DF!? That's what makes this game so great is the attention to detail. It's not "these are the tier 1-4 combat metals, and the 1 metal for jewelry to sell to vendors for GP," instead you can have 7 different metals as studs or spikes on your hammer, instead of just "gold." As long as they have different properties of any sort, non-combat metals are not pointless. We don't want minimalist bland, we want a game with tasty flavor!

Anyone fix the burning caravans yet?
my bug-fix turn may have. i fixed what was suspected to cause it, i am not sure if it is included in the later versions however.
we think it was coulsed by either the Alchemy RAWS or my doom coal lacking the [SPECIAL] tag. i did think it was funny.

this does give me and idea. we add a boiling stone to caravans that should boil as soon as they enter the map and after enough time for them to have reached the depo it transforms them into crazed saboteurs
Problem is, this would affect all caravans (and possibly your civilians) unless you made a civ specifically for this purpose, with the syndrome specific to them. But then why not just have them seige, instead of a predictable and easily destroyed caravan? People see the caravan from this civ, they put the depot in a deathtrap and the caravan offers no resistance whatsoever.
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sackhead

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1532 on: August 11, 2013, 11:55:26 pm »

Mm. Actually since iridium is supposed to be unobtainable without special means yet all civs have access to it and can trade for it, that IS a bit of a contradiction, nevermind the price. Consider making it [SPECIAL]?

By the way, is the apple tree reaction working for you at the lumber yard?

Your criticism is very welcome. Here's a summary of what might be good, simple fixes to add at this point that have come up so far and are unimplemented
1. Remove IS_STONE from the variety of coal that is supposed to explode, so civilizations don't even have a chance of making their goods out of it. Should not affect layering.
2. Add [SPECIAL] to iridium
3. Formics should have access nest boxes (StL will probably provide the exact code)
4. Mamaphint naming fixes so they don't have visible civilian professions

-- unless the author objects. It's pretty hard to tell who is idling and who's gone at this point so let's just make it a policy to fix what seems like an obvious bug ASAP and discuss later if needed? Let me know if I forgot something.

Also yeah, as that implies, once you stop reading this thread your content may be bugfixed freely, because that's the only way it could be bugfixed if you do. Common sense since there's no intellectual property legal issues here. :P

I'm also roughly calling language and spelling fixes and balance fixes bugfixes because a game does not need to be glitchy to be broken.

no objections
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kopout

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1533 on: August 12, 2013, 09:35:35 am »

I just go camping for 2 days...

Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.
My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right  :P

The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.
True. As I thought about it over the weekend I realized that, being a transformation, carving coconuts would cure any wound. Missing a lung, an arm, and the use of your legs? go carve a coconut!

I think I'd rather go the "tool with specific reactions" root.
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...although I've been having so much fun failing at this I just about forgot what my original aim was.

kopout

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1534 on: August 12, 2013, 09:50:46 am »

lumberyards seem to be useless
This is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.

Excuse my dumb question but... uh, why was it changed? That not only breaks rules but also apparently the reaction then. Seems like a somewhat bad move.
You would need to ask hugo to be sure but I think it was to fix a minor bug were the error log kept geting "unrecognized workshop token ' " or some such. I don't know why it was complaining about an ' there wasn't one but it looks like, maybe, the game dosn't like to have underscors in the workshop tokens  :-\
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"Karl Marx: Family jewels"
"Everyone's equally less rich than me!"
Quote from: Lezard
...although I've been having so much fun failing at this I just about forgot what my original aim was.

Halfling

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1535 on: August 12, 2013, 10:10:53 am »

I just go camping for 2 days...

Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.
My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right  :P

The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.
True. As I thought about it over the weekend I realized that, being a transformation, carving coconuts would cure any wound. Missing a lung, an arm, and the use of your legs? go carve a coconut!

I think I'd rather go the "tool with specific reactions" root.

Wouldn't the boulder model, or making them pieces of lumber, or thinking up something else entirely be more sensible? It's still going to be a huge pain in the long run to enable both the tool and coconut tool reactions on all races, and you will need a new reaction for every single thing.

lumberyards seem to be useless
This is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.

Excuse my dumb question but... uh, why was it changed? That not only breaks rules but also apparently the reaction then. Seems like a somewhat bad move.
You would need to ask hugo to be sure but I think it was to fix a minor bug were the error log kept geting "unrecognized workshop token ' " or some such. I don't know why it was complaining about an ' there wasn't one but it looks like, maybe, the game dosn't like to have underscors in the workshop tokens  :-\

First, assume the reasonable, that the game does not have a special undocumented way to process particular characters in names of objects of particular type, because that's the sensible thing to do. If there is an error like that, it's much more likely incorrect token usage like always. That will help even if you don't remember the first custom vanilla workshop is called SOAP_MAKER :P

kopout

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1536 on: August 12, 2013, 10:42:24 am »

Thinking about it a bit more, using reality-bending body transformation syndromes and a separate creature that only exists as a transformation like that just to process a fruit may be slightly frivolous though.
My philosophy is that if the workaround isn't completly unhinged and questonably nessicary you arn't doing it right  :P

The more completely unhinged and unnecessary a workaround, the more bugs it's liable to cause.
True. As I thought about it over the weekend I realized that, being a transformation, carving coconuts would cure any wound. Missing a lung, an arm, and the use of your legs? go carve a coconut!

I think I'd rather go the "tool with specific reactions" root.

Wouldn't the boulder model, or making them pieces of lumber, or thinking up something else entirely be more sensible? It's still going to be a huge pain in the long run to enable both the tool and coconut tool reactions on all races, and you will need a new reaction for every single thing.

The boulder model didn't work in my tests ( I could try making it stone but then it would be used for all the things rocks are inclugding mechanisums, rock pots, and such) and if I make it lumber then the game will try making coconut shell bukets, axes, bukalers, and beds. At the moment I have it prity much working (though unpolished) with the shells being a type of tool and being used in two special reactions ( make crafts and make intraments). A reaction with this item tag as the product  [CRAFTS] will randomly produce a craft from the crafts list. Realy, you only need three reactions, cocnut shell crafts, coconut shell instraments (cloppers!) and coconut shell bras (if thats ok).

What we might be able to get away with is having it make a boulder that is useless but the material it self has a REACTION_CLASS that makes it used in the make instraments/crafts/bras reactions. what that would do is remove the tool step from the equation and oppen up forwards compatability with other shelled plants if some one whated to make them in the future.
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"Karl Marx: Family jewels"
"Everyone's equally less rich than me!"
Quote from: Lezard
...although I've been having so much fun failing at this I just about forgot what my original aim was.

Halfling

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1537 on: August 12, 2013, 12:35:31 pm »

You don't need any reaction class for that though. Just make the coconut shell producing reaction produce a GLOB made of coconut shell (not usable for anything without special reactions) and make the reactions to make coconut shell stuff request a glob made of coconut shell. That way you don't have the coconut shell tool. Personally I thought a coconut shell bucket or jug might be cool.

I'm fine with coconut shell bras personally :P

WillowLuman

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1538 on: August 12, 2013, 02:06:44 pm »

Isn't there a token that stops a product from having a quality modifier? But whatever works, works.

lumberyards seem to be useless
This is because the name was changed from LUMBERYARD_KPT to just LUMBERYARD in the work shop raws but not in the reaction raws. You can either change it back in the workshop raws (this causes a harmless error in the error log that doesn't seem to effect the in game building)or change each of the reactions.

Excuse my dumb question but... uh, why was it changed? That not only breaks rules but also apparently the reaction then. Seems like a somewhat bad move.
You would need to ask hugo to be sure but I think it was to fix a minor bug were the error log kept geting "unrecognized workshop token ' " or some such. I don't know why it was complaining about an ' there wasn't one but it looks like, maybe, the game dosn't like to have underscors in the workshop tokens  :-\

I think it was already "Lumberyard" when I got it, but the error I saw was that one of the tiles of the workshop was specified as ']', which confused the game because it though that was a closing bracket in the raw line. This is what caused it to think there was an apostrophe, because unless you put a character in single quotes, the game only recognizes the numerical id's of characters as tiles.
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Gnorm

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1539 on: August 12, 2013, 10:40:11 pm »

Who is going to take the next play-turn? I am eager to see how others play in this new version.
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sackhead

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1540 on: August 13, 2013, 12:01:26 am »

me i am just starting now
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WillowLuman

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1541 on: August 13, 2013, 12:02:32 am »

Try and embark with some mountain tiles on your map, so you can encounter some of my more interesting creatures.
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sackhead

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1542 on: August 13, 2013, 01:08:10 am »

cool i will embark again i gened my world to be rely mountainous with lots of cliffs so this should be fun
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WillowLuman

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1543 on: August 13, 2013, 01:22:51 am »

Not so mountainous you need DFhack to embark, mind. Just so that you see mountain critters. But you'll want at least 1 other biome in there, or it might be a bit boring.
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kopout

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Re: DF from scratch: The entirely player-made universe succession.
« Reply #1544 on: August 13, 2013, 10:50:48 am »

Its all over but the display issues with the coconuts!
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"Karl Marx: Family jewels"
"Everyone's equally less rich than me!"
Quote from: Lezard
...although I've been having so much fun failing at this I just about forgot what my original aim was.
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