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Author Topic: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions  (Read 7931 times)

Metalax

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2013, 08:05:11 am »

I don't think anyone would argue against crossbows being perfectly fine for a ranged weapon for those classes, but it will almost always be inferior for an actual archer type.
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Girlinhat

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2013, 08:07:58 am »

The advantage of the crossbow is the Heavy Crossbow dealing 1d10 compared to a longbow's 1d8 and being Simple.  Simple weapons are always inferior to a Martial choice by virtue of being simple.

Neonivek

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2013, 11:07:05 am »

Crossbows tend to be the weapon you use if you aren't someone who uses ranged.

So the Wizard would use one.

In pathfinder though, because of the cantrip ability that I am thankful for, that usefulness is somewhat diminished but it is still useful.

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Simple weapons are always inferior to a Martial choice by virtue of being simple

There are exceptions but yeah that is generally true.

The worst weapons are Exotic weapons and even pathfinder doesn't balance them. Though the reason they are so "not worth it" has more to do with the fact that they are roleplay. They are always cultural based martial weapons. So while a Katana (assuming it isn't made into a bastard sword like some DMs handle it) is an exotic weapon in most settings, if it was based in Japan it would be martial.
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Girlinhat

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2013, 11:15:06 am »

There's actually some races/classes that are proficient with all exotic weapons but no martial weapons.

Most exotic weapons are functionally better in one role, but rather specialized, or racially based.  Dwarven Warax is better than a normal ax, but you need a feat or be a dwarf.  The Impact Hammer (I think is the name) gets improved sunder damage, but not many other bonuses.  Exotics are generally 'specialized' or 'racial'.

Neonivek

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2013, 11:20:59 am »

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There's actually some races/classes that are proficient with all exotic weapons but no martial weapons

That is incredibly silly. Not because they lack martial proficiency and can use some exotic weaponry but because they have "all exotic proficiency".

Quite literally that means they are proficient in fighting with a giant pair of scissors or a bladed hulahoop. That cannot be a natural class.

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Exotics are generally 'specialized' or 'racial'

A lot of them are just repeats of previous weapons. Sometimes sized up.
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Tobel

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2013, 04:11:07 pm »

So I was thinking my party might not wind up having much utility and a scout-ish character may be needed. Would it be worth going to half-elf and multiclass in fighter and rogue? I figure having the trap finding and class skills for bluff would be useful.
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Girlinhat

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2013, 04:35:36 pm »

Not a terrible idea.  If you take Rogue, then take Improved Initiative for sure, so you're more likely to attack foes who are flat-footed and therefor sneak attack!  You can also use that free Skill Focus on Perception and get about +11 to Perception rolls right off the bat.  If there's two things you want, it's Perception and Initiative!  Every character needs them, except maybe the healing cleric.

You might also drop the Skill Focus and instead get the Ancestral Arms racial trait, becoming proficient with the Elven Curved Blade (2-handed, 1d10, 18-20 x2) and take Weapon Finesse, because it DOES apply to the Elven Curved Blade, and later stack the Keen and Agile enhancements on it.

But then if you're into archery, the blade won't matter quite as much for that much investment...

Neonivek

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2013, 07:32:22 pm »

Isn't there a "Fighter Rogue" already in existence... hmmm... Let me check
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Grek

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2013, 07:33:25 pm »

So, one option which has tragically failed to be mentioned is Cleric. Consider:

-You have a D8 hit die, which translates to only 1 less HP per level than the fighter.
-If you cast Divine Favour (which you will because it's a 1st level spell), you effectively have full BaB.
-If you cast Abundant Ammunition, you get free ammo. Which is great if you're shooting arrows at people.
-If you pick a God who's favoured weapon is the Bow (ask your DM which to pick, this varies from setting to setting!), you are proficient with bows.
-Because you are a full spellcaster, you have utility out the wazoo.
-Because you're a cleric, you can heal people. Your party will thank you.
-If you want to do stealth/scouting, take the Trickery Domain and get all the stealth skills added to your skills list plus a bunch of stealth spells. Later on you get divinations and scrying for high level scouting.
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Culise

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2013, 11:19:25 pm »

But do we really want to go CoDzilla for this?  I mean, I can understand from an optimization standpoint the worth of using the Cleric to substitute for any party role, but it may depend on how the player wants to run the character.  Still, you're right that it's definitely worth bringing up so that the player can decide. 

If you're looking for Fighter/Rogue united class, I think the Scout may be what is nagging at the edge of your thoughts.  D8 Hit Dice, Base Attack Bonus progression equivalent to the Cleric, Skirmish class feature (Backstab counterpart: gain extra damage on attacks made if you move at least 10' to monsters vulnerable to critical hits), Trapfinding, free movement, and class skills in Search, Hide, and Sense Motive, but unfortunately not Open Locks.  That's the 3.5E version from Complete Adventurer; I think Pathfinder has a ported version as well, but I don't have the book it would be in. 
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Neonivek

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2013, 11:45:01 pm »

Pathfinder has a ported version... but in its case it looses trapfinding.
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Tobel

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #26 on: September 14, 2013, 02:51:59 pm »

So, one option which has tragically failed to be mentioned is Cleric.

While this does look good, I never play a twitchy finger class. It's just a personal flavor thing. I'm not trying to get the most optimized ranged build ever, I just want to make sure I'm doing enough damage and not skipping any important feats or enchantments while still having utility.

Speaking of, I know very little about enchantments with the exception of the +1, +2, etc enchants (sidenote: I can stack a +3 enchant with a longbow composite +3, correct?). What types of things should I not fail to get to improve my archer skills?
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Grek

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2013, 04:07:09 pm »

For magic bows, the very basics are as follows:
-Bonuses on your arrows and bonuses on your bow do not stack. You only get to apply the highest.
-Magic arrows have a 50% chance to break on a miss and a 100% chance to break on a hit.
-Because of this, you want to put all of your enchantments on your bow (which will not break) and use special materials to make your arrows (because it's cheaper for arrows).
-For example, it costs a thousand gold to outfit yourself with 60 diamond tipped arrows that ignore armour. Getting the same benefit from a bow requires you to pay a minimum of 50,000 gold to get a Bow of Brilliant Energy.
-Meanwhile, just getting a +1 on your archery so you can shoot ghosts will run out after 50 shots if you put the enchantment on the arrows, but lasts forever if you put it on the bow.
-Trick arrows, like the sleeping arrow, tripping arrow holy water arrow and so forth can be fun, but should not be a mainstay. They're too expensive.
-Whether you want to invest  in lots of special properties or lots of enhancement bonus depends on how available Greater Magic Weapon is. Normally you want lots of enhancement bonuses (so you can actually hit people), but GMW will turn any weapon you happen to be carrying into one with a level appropriate number of enhancement bonus. If you can get that cast on you easily enough there's no reason not to go hog wild with the special effects instead. Otherwise get the enhancement bonus.
-Regardless, Seeking is fairly vital, since it lets you ignore concealment. Concealment and cover are issues for archers, so not having to deal with them is wonderful. Other weapon enchantments are swell, but Seeking is the only one I'd call essential.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2013, 04:10:21 pm by Grek »
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Tobel

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2013, 08:37:12 pm »

Many thanks for the info Grek. I was exploring poisons as well and was surprised to find Drow poison so cheap. From what I understand that will knock out a target on contact right? Or is the fort save really easy?
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neotemplar

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Re: D&D 3.5 / Pathfinder questions
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2013, 08:47:24 pm »

As far as Drow poison, the issue there is that you have to get it from the Drow.  It shouldn't just be hanging out in any shop up on the surface.
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