Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 41

Author Topic: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode  (Read 97604 times)

Arcvasti

  • Bay Watcher
  • [IS_ALREADY_HERE] [FRIENDSHIPPER:HIGH]
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #15 on: May 31, 2014, 04:38:09 pm »

I might consider doing a Kobold LP at some point.

And that point is now. I'm going to be doing a semi-tutorial kobold fort, since kobolds are widely regarded as hard to play. You can find it here. I figured I'd link to it here rather then start a thread on the Masterwork board, since Meph has said he disaproves of that. This seems like a happy medium.
Logged
If you expect to live forever then you will never be disappointed.
Spooky Signature
To fix the horrid default colour scheme, follow the below steps:
Profile> Modify Profile> Look and Layout> Current Theme> (change)> Darkling

Alestance

  • Bay Watcher
  • [VILLAINOUS_THEMATIC: LIGHTBULBS]
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2014, 07:40:25 pm »

Playing around with Kobolds and there's a couple of things happening.

1: Kobolds will not take marked items to the garbage dump, and they refuse to store refuse in refuse stockpiles.

2: Sawdust ladles and sawdust bowls are being produced at the sawmill.
Logged

zach123b

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2014, 07:48:20 pm »

by default all forts start with not cleaning the outside, go to orders (o) then refuse (r) then outside (o) and they should start picking up stuff outside
if you want them to clean up vermin remains outside you have to turn that on in orders as well i believe

tools appear to be bugged this version  :-\
Logged
"IT'S WORLDGEN TIME!"
"No, Meph, No!"

Alestance

  • Bay Watcher
  • [VILLAINOUS_THEMATIC: LIGHTBULBS]
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2014, 07:54:12 pm »

by default all forts start with not cleaning the outside, go to orders (o) then refuse (r) then outside (o) and they should start picking up stuff outside
if you want them to clean up vermin remains outside you have to turn that on in orders as well i believe
Ah, thanks.

Incidentally, it seems Kobolds will save corpses by default also, which explains why corpses were being left inside of my huts on a previous camp.
Logged

jackfractal

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2014, 08:12:25 pm »

Playing around with Kobolds and there's a couple of things happening.

1: Kobolds will not take marked items to the garbage dump, and they refuse to store refuse in refuse stockpiles.

2: Sawdust ladles and sawdust bowls are being produced at the sawmill.

Hmm. The ladle and bowls made of sawdust seems to be related to the pottery bug that I noticed earlier. I was just trying to confirm if the bug happened in 4j, but I can't find an embark location with clay anywhere to test. :(
Logged

Alestance

  • Bay Watcher
  • [VILLAINOUS_THEMATIC: LIGHTBULBS]
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #20 on: May 31, 2014, 08:24:45 pm »

Hmm. The ladle and bowls made of sawdust seems to be related to the pottery bug that I noticed earlier. I was just trying to confirm if the bug happened in 4j, but I can't find an embark location with clay anywhere to test. :(

I can confirm that in 4j I DON'T get sawdust crafts. Just sawdust.
Logged

jackfractal

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #21 on: May 31, 2014, 09:24:39 pm »

Hmm... I can confirm that the problem with pottery doesn't happen in 4j either.

Methinks something broke the tools in 5.0/5.1

Logged

Alestance

  • Bay Watcher
  • [VILLAINOUS_THEMATIC: LIGHTBULBS]
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2014, 09:48:55 pm »

New bug(?). The merchants from my kobold's civ just vanished. I got three combat reports, and all of them regarded the merchant's dissipance into the aether.

So, now I have all of their junk clogging my trade depot.
Logged

Arcvasti

  • Bay Watcher
  • [IS_ALREADY_HERE] [FRIENDSHIPPER:HIGH]
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2014, 09:56:27 pm »

New bug(?). The merchants from my kobold's civ just vanished. I got three combat reports, and all of them regarded the merchant's dissipance into the aether.

So, now I have all of their junk clogging my trade depot.

They're still there. Just invisible. Air-Sign kobolds turn invisible when confronted with a threat. The liason's done that to me a bunch of times, but I've never had an entire caravan do it before.
Logged
If you expect to live forever then you will never be disappointed.
Spooky Signature
To fix the horrid default colour scheme, follow the below steps:
Profile> Modify Profile> Look and Layout> Current Theme> (change)> Darkling

jackfractal

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #24 on: June 01, 2014, 12:32:27 am »

OK, so, playing with 4j. I tried to build a base using stoneware bricks.

Turned out to be really tricky to get the task flow right.

So here's how I thought I should do it.

1. Acquire a source of clay.
2. Acquire a source of peat.
3. Build a clay oven and start the 'gather clay' task. This should slowly fill up both my peat and my clay stockpiles.
4. Build a screw press.
5. Set the screw press to compact the peat.
6. Build a smelter.
7. Set the smelter the turn the compact peat into coke.
8. Build a Pottery.
9. Set the pottery to shape clay bricks.
10. The pottery will detect greenware bricks and automatically dry them, so I can leave the 'shape clay bricks' task on repeat.
11. Set the clay oven to bake the dry bricks into stoneware bricks.
12. Build build build before the inevitable winter siege.

This didn't work. I think the fail points were with step 3 and step 10.

The 'gather clay' task wouldn't prioritize my peat source and my clay source evenly, even with a separate clay oven close to both with the gathering task on. I had to micromanage it, which sucked.

The brick drying task was also really spotty. I would end up with huge stockpiles of greenware bricks, a few 'leather hard' bricks, and some 'bone-dry' bricks. I am guessing that the 'leather hard' state is some kind of intermediary stage between the two but I have no idea how to go from greenware to leather-hard, and I can't tell if the leather-hard to bone-dry process was really working properly.

This seems overwhelmingly complex to me, even if it had worked. It requires four buildings, and somewhere along the line of thirty individual jobs to produce four bricks.

I have to be doing something wrong here, right?

Has anyone got this pipeline working efficiently before?

Right now, it seems my best bet is to use the raw clay for walls. I prefer using bricks, because bricks are lighter and don't take as long to haul, but the incredible amount of investment necessary to make clay bricks in Masterwork means that it just doesn't appear to be worth it.
Logged

Arcvasti

  • Bay Watcher
  • [IS_ALREADY_HERE] [FRIENDSHIPPER:HIGH]
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #25 on: June 01, 2014, 12:37:04 am »

Clay just isn't worth it ATM, even without weird bugs. Although stoneware is pretty valuable, so there's that. If you ARE doing the pottery thing, just use charcoal. Using peat makes it more time consuming and annoying.
Logged
If you expect to live forever then you will never be disappointed.
Spooky Signature
To fix the horrid default colour scheme, follow the below steps:
Profile> Modify Profile> Look and Layout> Current Theme> (change)> Darkling

Tenderroast

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #26 on: June 01, 2014, 01:38:44 am »

The problem with ALL TOOL ITEMS!

the problem isnt the file, the problem is the file is NOT extracting properly from the .7z archive. Pull it out manually.

The problem is the LAUNCHER. If you change tile sets, it changes the raws for item_tool to be a 5kb file.

THE FIX temporary at least

If you change tilesets, open the archive and manually extract ITEM_TOOL into your raws.
Logged

Innocent Dave

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #27 on: June 01, 2014, 02:03:20 am »

Has anyone got this pipeline working efficiently before?

I've tried making bricks in gnome mode, and you need to do two drying jobs for each brick before you can fire them.  The automatic queuing didn't seem to work, so I just checked back every now and then to check I still had two "dry" jobs on repeat after my one "shape" job.

I imagine the problem with gathering peat and clay at the same time is because the mod is pushing the limits of DF here - vanilla had only two types of gatherable soils (clay and sand), so just had seperate zones for each.  The addition of peat means one of those zones needs to do two separate things, but the engine still thinks they're basically the same.

I understand bricks and compact peat are both deliberately complex to balance out the supply of free materials.  You could easilly get it going once you've got manpower coming out your ears and some quantum stockpiles so you can just brute-force the amounts of materials, but it's probably not viable for early defences.

I understand you can gather, and then build with, dirt as well though, so perhaps a nice earth rampart will keep you alive long enough for bricks to start being produced?
Logged
Reaching one's life goal shouldn't come with a happy thought.  It should come with a sudden existential crisis.

razorback

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #28 on: June 01, 2014, 02:25:38 am »

The problem with ALL TOOL ITEMS!

the problem isnt the file, the problem is the file is NOT extracting properly from the .7z archive. Pull it out manually.

The problem is the LAUNCHER. If you change tile sets, it changes the raws for item_tool to be a 5kb file.

THE FIX temporary at least

If you change tilesets, open the archive and manually extract ITEM_TOOL into your raws.

... and i was just wondering why i had no issues at all^^


pottery:
i usually make two or three workshops.
one for shaping on repeat, second for drying automatically, third for independent drying (leather-hard to bone-dry)

Logged

jackfractal

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: ☼Kobolds☼ - Everything Kobold Mode
« Reply #29 on: June 01, 2014, 02:34:16 am »

Hmm.

That's disappointing. Thanks guys. I wanted my kobolds to make cute little circular adobe houses, but it doesn't look like it'll be worthwhile.

I get the point of making infinite-use items require more infrastructure, but the pottery thing has swung too far in the other direction. I mean, it is currently both cheaper and easier to build everything from glass, then from mud-bricks.

Not to mention bone or leather. Get a breeding stock of jack-rats up to about forty and you will never run out of bone or leather blocks. If you let them get up to sixty adults you'll need three butchers running constantly just to keep up.
Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 41