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Author Topic: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode - Taking suggestions!  (Read 81056 times)

Splint

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #390 on: November 24, 2014, 10:52:15 pm »

Actually I think cobalt is slightly better than iron.

Eh, either way it's a nice shade of blue and comparable.

smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #391 on: November 25, 2014, 12:11:36 am »

-Decided I wanted some flachette guns. Out of curiosity, why does the goblin tinker need to work with Blowguns? It would be a bit less complicated/obtuse if he could just use a Brass Bar + Another Metal Bar + a Mechanism. While I am on that topic, which labor does the Tinker use, so that I can make sure I have the best orc for the job making the final weapons?

I dunno --  good question i guess.  I never really thought of it as obtuse ^^  I think in this case I like it as is, but it's quite easy for you to change the reagents if you prefer something else.

Tinker uses FORGE_WEAPON for gunsmithing, SMELT for smelting, MECHANICS for traps

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-I noticed that if you get masterwork stuff from the Freelancers or the Raiders, it credits the Orc who bought it or unloaded the ship as 'crafting' it. This is a pain in the ass if you intend to melt the damn thing for metal, as your guild/galley slave will get pissed off. No way you can stop those workshops from crediting a 'creator', is there?

Not that I know of.  --- edit:  You can use workshop profiles to choose an unskilled raider as the operator, to minimize the chance of getting good quality stuff, I suppose.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2014, 03:28:50 am by smakemupagus »
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smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #392 on: November 25, 2014, 12:21:05 am »

Yep, a bit better than iron, substantially worse than steel. 
   
[INORGANIC:COBALT]
   [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:METAL_TEMPLATE]
[SOLID_DENSITY:8890]
[IMPACT_YIELD:893000]
   [IMPACT_FRACTURE:1932000]
   [IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:427]
[SHEAR_YIELD:255000]
   [SHEAR_FRACTURE:552000]
   [SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:131]

[INORGANIC:IRON]
   [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:METAL_TEMPLATE]
[SOLID_DENSITY:7850]
[IMPACT_YIELD:542500]
   [IMPACT_FRACTURE:1085000]
   [IMPACT_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:319]
[SHEAR_YIELD:155000]
   [SHEAR_FRACTURE:310000]
   [SHEAR_STRAIN_AT_YIELD:189]

baldamundo

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #393 on: December 03, 2014, 11:24:18 am »

Hi :)

First of all, just wanted to express my appreciation for this mod and the orc mode in particular - been having a lot of fun (made a forum account just to post here, lol).


The only real trouble I've been having as orcs though, is I can't seem to work out how to do tree-farming. Planting wood stalks or acorns or fungiwood in farm plots seems to net me loads of saplings, but no actual wood, and I can't figure out what I'm supposed to do with the saplings. The only option seems to be burning them at the factory to get charcoal, but I've got plenty of coal already - what I really need is wood for making ash and supplying the raider's drydocks. Am I missing something?
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Boltgun

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #394 on: December 03, 2014, 11:41:38 am »

Is there a sawmill in your workshop menu? That's where you turn those into wood.
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Splint

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #395 on: December 03, 2014, 11:49:21 am »

Is there a sawmill in your workshop menu? That's where you turn those into wood.

Goblin sawmill shanty is whgere orcs do it actually (it can also batch produce storage items so long as there's metal available for fasteners.)

baldamundo

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #396 on: December 03, 2014, 12:27:27 pm »

Goblin sawmill shanty is whgere orcs do it actually (it can also batch produce storage items so long as there's metal available for fasteners.)

I tried that, but as far as I could tell it only had options for turning wood into wood planks, not for processing saplings into wood.
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Splint

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #397 on: December 03, 2014, 12:45:12 pm »

Goblin sawmill shanty is whgere orcs do it actually (it can also batch produce storage items so long as there's metal available for fasteners.)

I tried that, but as far as I could tell it only had options for turning wood into wood planks, not for processing saplings into wood.

Should have a workshop somewhere that can use the planks more efficiently than using single logs for stuff if that's what your getting at. I dont think they have one to just process them to raw wood otherwise.

Weirdsound

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #398 on: December 03, 2014, 01:23:10 pm »

Hi :)

First of all, just wanted to express my appreciation for this mod and the orc mode in particular - been having a lot of fun (made a forum account just to post here, lol).


The only real trouble I've been having as orcs though, is I can't seem to work out how to do tree-farming. Planting wood stalks or acorns or fungiwood in farm plots seems to net me loads of saplings, but no actual wood, and I can't figure out what I'm supposed to do with the saplings. The only option seems to be burning them at the factory to get charcoal, but I've got plenty of coal already - what I really need is wood for making ash and supplying the raider's drydocks. Am I missing something?

You can take care of the ash issue by making a Crematorium and burning stuff there. If you can keep clear of seiges, your hunters should bring in enough to burn while still having leftover bone to use elsewhere.

As for the Drydocks, unless you are after something specific you can get elsewhere, focus most of your raids on the elves and drow. Those raids can yield wood. Not quite enough to break even on average I think, but it makes a huge difference.
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smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #399 on: December 03, 2014, 03:39:21 pm »

Yeah it's by design that orcs only burn farmed trees.

Crematorium is a good source of ash, even if you only burn vermin, but especially if you are wiping out enemies you'll soon have plenty of extra body parts.

Goblin saw shanty to stretch wood supplies.
Kobold textile shanty for wood stalks to plywood.
You can make pulleys and cloth to make xebecs (less wood than longboats).
Iirc you can buy logs at the farm or general bazaar.

There are some barbarian looted techs that can help
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

baldamundo

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #400 on: December 04, 2014, 04:02:12 pm »

Yeah it's by design that orcs only burn farmed trees.
Is that just for game balance? I think slightly unintuitive otherwise.


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Crematorium is a good source of ash, even if you only burn vermin, but especially if you are wiping out enemies you'll soon have plenty of extra body parts.
Ah, thanks. I'd forgotten about that. Makes a big difference actually.



Another thing I was wondering - what are the relative advantages/disadvantages of the atlatl, blowgun, and bola thrower? I'm presuming bows are the most powerful at range and tomahawks the best in melee (at unleast until you get the dual-wield kits) but I'm not sure when or why to use the other ranged options.
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smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #401 on: December 04, 2014, 06:47:57 pm »

Yes, partly I think ironwood and steeloak are a bit imba when combined with orcs good ironbone and lamellar industry, and partly, that not everything has to be quite the same I think.  When I think of orcish arborists I picture the trees being felled into the factory pits of isengard ^^

Bows are generally all around best, most good ammo options, etc.  easy to get good bows at fletcher.

Tomahawks are best melee/ranged until warrior societies replace them, remain fine for civ militia

Atlatls are big, good against unarmored targets, and can make some special (blunt, eg) ammo at Sun & Stars

Guns and cannons are among best armor piercing but use brass, lead and steel (or cash)

Flachettes train gun skill and are OK and economical.  Basic blowguns are poor, upgrade to flachette gun at tinkerer asap

Bola are being phased out since they're a kobold signature weapon

Hope it helps!
« Last Edit: December 04, 2014, 06:55:38 pm by smakemupagus »
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Weirdsound

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #402 on: December 04, 2014, 07:08:17 pm »

Yes, partly I think ironbone and steeloak are a bit imba when combined with orcs good ironbone and lamellar industry, and partly, that not everything has to be quite the same I think.  When I think of orcish arborists I picture the trees being felled into the factory pits of isengard ^^

Is their some trick to getting easy shell or horn I am missing? With the lack of a sawmill for wood production, I feel that it is far easier to obtain a sustainable supply of Bonemetal than it is to start cranking out lamellar.
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baldamundo

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #403 on: December 04, 2014, 07:47:33 pm »

Yes, partly I think ironwood and steeloak are a bit imba when combined with orcs good ironbone and lamellar industry, and partly, that not everything has to be quite the same I think.  When I think of orcish arborists I picture the trees being felled into the factory pits of isengard ^^

Bows are generally all around best, most good ammo options, etc.  easy to get good bows at fletcher.

Tomahawks are best melee/ranged until warrior societies replace them, remain fine for civ militia

Atlatls are big, good against unarmored targets, and can make some special (blunt, eg) ammo at Sun & Stars

Guns and cannons are among best armor piercing but use brass, lead and steel (or cash)

Flachettes train gun skill and are OK and economical.  Basic blowguns are poor, upgrade to flachette gun at tinkerer asap

Bola are being phased out since they're a kobold signature weapon

Hope it helps!

Yeah, that's very helpful thanks! :)
Still a little unclear on the role of atlatls though - are they better than bows against unarmoured? Maybe a good weapon for hunters or arming militia against cavern critters?

Also, some mad genius in my fort just made an artefact 'blaster musket' - is that different from a normal musket?


And one last ranged weapon question - I'm guessing the 'magestaffs' are the ranged Dreamwalker option and the 'sigilblade' for melee?
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smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Orcs☼ - Everything Orc Mode
« Reply #404 on: December 05, 2014, 12:37:29 pm »

Is their some trick to getting easy shell or horn I am missing? With the lack of a sawmill for wood production, I feel that it is far easier to obtain a sustainable supply of Bonemetal than it is to start cranking out lamellar.

Well, nothing at all against ironbone, but just to play advocate -- If you're near a pond there's turtles for shell, and my forts tend to be stocked pretty well with both Aurochs and invaders' dead hoof-animals like unicorns, horses, and deer.  A full lamellar suit should take quite a few less pieces of material to craft than full ironbone too, and ironbone requires fuel.

edit:  Also, just to mention again, our version of wood farming is Kobold Textile Hut -> Strip Wood Stalks.  It's just one of those things that developed separately in orc mode vs. dwarf mode.  Better than trees in many ways, the yield is not 100% and a lot of the wood is scrap quality, but they grow fast year round, use as much as you need and distill the rest into stalk whiskey.  To me it's a little non-intuitive when I play dwarf mode and it's not there ;)

Still a little unclear on the role of atlatls though - are they better than bows against unarmoured? Maybe a good weapon for hunters or arming militia against cavern critters?

The javelins are bigger and heavier than arrows so, they deal more grevious wounds when they do penetrate armor.  This balance works out best when you're facing large, squishy creatures.  For example there was a version when Dwarves and drow used to invade with VCCs pretty regularly and javelins were great then.  In an evil biome I'll generally have a Sun & Stars temple since I'll want morningstars anyway, so i'll have a squad of hammerhead javelin armed atlists if i can spare the electrum, the intended purpose there is crushing rather than chopping up undead. 

For cavern patrols i don't really like the base atlatl or bow, because they're helpless at melee, but Falcon warriors (spear and atlatl) seem to be quite good for it.  Dragon warriors (composite bow and katana) is too, but the dragon kit is quite a bit harder to craft a full squad worth of gear.

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Also, some mad genius in my fort just made an artefact 'blaster musket' - is that different from a normal musket?

An artifact blaster should be a pretty good weapon.  That's a new weapon that orcs can normally make only from a complex industry depending on gnomish high tech, metallurgy,and other foreign crafts; it uses gunner skill but fires magic missiles.  It's not actually better than a Destroyer's or Gnarled Magestaff at firing missiles, the advantage is just that Corsairs and other gunners can use it, who I figure are more likely to be highly skilled.  If you don't have a Heavy Weapons Armory and a gnomish labor cell cranking out diodes, your Arcane Forge can make ammo for him.  Since it's quite hard to craft i haven't had a chance to test yet -- i'm interested how it goes. 

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And one last ranged weapon question - I'm guessing the 'magestaffs' are the ranged Dreamwalker option and the 'sigilblade' for melee?

The main difference is the spell they teach the wielder.  The Sundering sigilblade is the most melee oriented, a dreamwalker or mage wielding it can cast Weakness to orichalcum & bloodsteel on enemies.  The Destroyer's magestaff gives a ranged, sometimes-paralyzing attack.  Bloodcurse causes heavy bleeding, acts as combo damage & debuff.  Grappling Ivy is a disabling spell. 

They also give access to the two different classes of enchanted ammo that have the chance to impart magical effects.  Start with agony for bladeshards and poisonivy for staves, both are safe to friendly fire even at melee range.  Some of the spell ammo can be dangerous (corpse explosion, arctic gale).
« Last Edit: December 05, 2014, 01:48:00 pm by smakemupagus »
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