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Author Topic: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?  (Read 6261 times)

Panando

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Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« on: May 31, 2014, 11:54:41 pm »

So in one of my forts I had a pretty special mayor. Like most mayors, he was useless, unlike most mayors he was also literally a cripple, soon after been voted into office, a Giant Peace Faced Lovebird (or something like that) shook him around by the face a bit and after that he had lost his ability to grasp. But he remained mayor, and I later made him Baron too. But why he made such a great noble, is he never made a single demand or mandate, never heard a single peep out of him. It made me wonder if somehow the ability to grasp, as it is required for doing any kind of work (even being a broker) is also required for issuing mandates (maybe they need it in writing), my current fort has a very demanding mayor (although all his demands relate to buckets), happily he's already pretty useless, so I will remove his hands FOR SCIENCE and see if he becomes a more reasonable leader.
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escondida

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2014, 12:40:54 am »

I mean, it's never a bad thing to torment dorfs for, uh, science (yeah, science, that's it), but generally mandates have more to do with the dwarf's preferences. If there are no items a demand-making noble particularly likes, they won't mandate the construction of anything. If they do have object preferences, they'll mandate them to death.
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Kreydurst

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2014, 01:40:23 am »

but generally mandates have more to do with the dwarf's preferences.

3 Anvils, every damn time. I hated my first mayor.

ANVIL THIS ANVIL THAT, GOD DAMN DWARF WE HAVE NO METAL LEFT IN THE MINES LET ALONE TREES TO BURN INTO CHARCOAL! God I hated him.
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Gigaz

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2014, 07:10:45 am »

You can still melt old anvils and turn them into new anvils.

The worst demands are craft items because you can not just make earrings, you must make crafts and every once in a while an earring will be produced.
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Larix

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2014, 07:54:25 am »

Anvils are still annoying since they take three bars to make and only give one back when melting; and they can only be made from three materials, only one of which (iron) can _possibly_ be abundant - if you're on the right type of embark.

I daresay toys, musical instruments and large gems are even worse preferences than crafts - while crafts are produced 1-3 per job, averaging two, toys and instruments are produced single, and large gems are only realistically producable on-demand by cutting up glass: rough gems have such little chance of being cut to large gems that you're unlikely to fulfill a three-gem mandate if you mine and cut nonstop; if you have little glass to work with (no sand, little fuel), large gem mandates become a good reason to put a baron in the way of an accident.

In addition, export bans are less disruptive with crafts - you can exclude only earrings or only bracelets in stockpile menus while leaving rings and figurines allowed for storage, but you can only exclude "instruments" and "toys" as blanket type without differentiation between subtypes for easy handling of the flutes your mayor doesn't care about while keeping hold of the precious, precious piccolos.
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Porpoisepower

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2014, 11:12:48 am »

Happy Nobles don't generate a whole lot of demands... just make sure their accommodations exceed the "requirements"
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Quietust

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2014, 11:30:19 am »

Happy Nobles don't generate a whole lot of demands...
Since when?

[edit] I'm looking at a disassembly of the relevant code right now, and happiness is not a factor when making new mandates or demands.

These are the criteria:
* Hasn't made a mandate/demand lately
* Isn't dead, hasn't left the map, isn't a projectile, and isn't caged
* Isn't insane (or in the middle of a mood)
* Isn't incapacitated (unconscious, webbed, or paralyzed)
* Isn't nauseated, winded, stunned, dizzy, or feverish
* Isn't bleeding
* Has a soul
* Is a member of your fortress

« Last Edit: June 02, 2014, 11:43:28 am by Quietust »
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greycat

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2014, 11:58:48 am »

* ... isn't a projectile, and isn't caged

Hmmmm.
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Enemy post

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2014, 12:00:37 pm »

Happy Nobles don't generate a whole lot of demands...
Since when?

[edit] I'm looking at a disassembly of the relevant code right now, and happiness is not a factor when making new mandates or demands.

These are the criteria:
* Hasn't made a mandate/demand lately
* Isn't dead, hasn't left the map, isn't a projectile, and isn't caged
* Isn't insane (or in the middle of a mood)
* Isn't incapacitated (unconscious, webbed, or paralyzed)
* Isn't nauseated, winded, stunned, dizzy, or feverish
* Isn't bleeding
* Has a soul
* Is a member of your fortress
Maybe the lovebird paralyzed Panando's mayor? Also, the non-lethal methods of stopping mandates sound...Fun. Is there any way to perpetually inflict one of those conditions on them?
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squidgen

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2014, 12:05:49 pm »

Cave spider bites cause dizzyness that never ends. That could work.
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Enemy post

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2014, 12:09:46 pm »

So how do we insure the spider bites the noble?
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cikulisu

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2014, 12:13:45 pm »

Happy Nobles don't generate a whole lot of demands...
Since when?

[edit] I'm looking at a disassembly of the relevant code right now, and happiness is not a factor when making new mandates or demands.

These are the criteria:
* Hasn't made a mandate/demand lately
* Isn't dead, hasn't left the map, isn't a projectile, and isn't caged
* Isn't insane (or in the middle of a mood)
* Isn't incapacitated (unconscious, webbed, or paralyzed)
* Isn't nauseated, winded, stunned, dizzy, or feverish
* Isn't bleeding
* Has a soul
* Is a member of your fortress

"isn't a projectile"

this seems oddly specific.


i wonder why?
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Mr Space Cat

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2014, 12:19:06 pm »

"isn't a projectile"
this seems oddly specific.
i wonder why?
Probably when the dwarf is flying/falling through the air, the game considers them a projectile? Like, if a bronze colossus punched your mayor and the force of the blow sent him flying over a huge 20 zlvl cliff, the mayor wouldn't be able to mandate anything as he's falling those 20 zlvls.
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Quietust

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2014, 12:20:19 pm »

"isn't a projectile"
this seems oddly specific.
i wonder why?
Probably when the dwarf is flying/falling through the air, the game considers them a projectile? Like, if a bronze colossus punched your mayor and the force of the blow sent him flying over a huge 20 zlvl cliff, the mayor wouldn't be able to mandate anything as he's falling those 20 zlvls.
Correct - there are lots of places where this same check is done, so it's not surprising that it happens here as well.
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jcochran

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Re: Remove noble's hands = no more demands?
« Reply #14 on: June 02, 2014, 12:34:34 pm »

Maybe the lovebird paralyzed Panando's mayor? Also, the non-lethal methods of stopping mandates sound...Fun. Is there any way to perpetually inflict one of those conditions on them?

Well, caging the mayor ought to be fairly simple. At worst, send him or her on an errand that happens to path though a webbed cage. Then you can build the cage holding the mayor in the middle of the dinning hall so his or her admirers can enjoy his or her august presence.

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