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Author Topic: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?  (Read 2390 times)

kingu

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Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« on: August 05, 2014, 09:04:51 am »

Has anyone figured out how to tell if a dwarf is more or less likely to panic and flee in the face of danger? Is it just the bravery trait?
Will exposure to horror/danger increase or decrease the ability to keep composed? I want to make cold killing machines, not nervous wrecks.

Its seems very importand to chose the right dwarf for the early military when embarking in savage or evil biomes. Not to mention when the Gobbos comes calling.
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SeelenJägerTee

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2014, 09:54:44 am »

Discipline is a trainable skill and will increase the likelihood of the dwarf holding his ground.
However you should be aware of the fact, that there may or may not be penalties for a dwarf suffering from fear but standing due to discipline.
So they may or may not qualify as COLD killing machines.
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NobleNecromancer

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2014, 09:59:59 am »

Personality might play a part as well. For fighting dorfs look for those that are "brave in the face of danger".
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kingu

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2014, 12:31:38 pm »

Discipline is a trainable skill and will increase the likelihood of the dwarf holding his ground.
However you should be aware of the fact, that there may or may not be penalties for a dwarf suffering from fear but standing due to discipline.
So they may or may not qualify as COLD killing machines.

Personality might play a part as well. For fighting dorfs look for those that are "brave in the face of danger".

Yeah there has to be something more than discipline to it. In my current fort my military dwarfs are the ONLY ones that has any skill in discipline. Still there is a difference in cowardice/bravery amon my civilian dwarfs (all with skill 0 in discipline). Some will go to the refuse pile while others wont.

I even had a civilian dwarf beat some goblins to death with his bare hands while some of my military fled.
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cephalo

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2014, 01:38:13 pm »

Station your military at your refuse stockpile for a while to harden them up. I've had one fort so far in 40.x, and I found that in the first battles I had morale problems and a lot less so later on.
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kingu

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2014, 06:35:52 am »

Bravery definitely has some part in this. I sent some civilians to my refuse pile hauling corpses. 4 dwarfs got horrified. All with the lowest or second lowest level of bravery.
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Sergarr

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2014, 11:13:52 am »

Station your military at your refuse stockpile for a while to harden them up. I've had one fort so far in 40.x, and I found that in the first battles I had morale problems and a lot less so later on.
News flash: standing in the pile of dead people improve your morale over time. In DF only...
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neblime

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2014, 06:08:08 pm »

News flash: standing in the pile of dead people improve your morale over time. In DF only...
that is amazing

does "doesn't really care about anything anymore" and others on the spectrum make a difference?
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celem

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2014, 07:06:43 am »

I had thought that this system would be intended to take over from that mechanic.  But i've still seen those on thoughts in the newer versions i'm sure...

I think 'doesnt really care' is still used for resilience to bad thoughts generated by seeing deaths, discipline is the fear counter which is a different mechanism, scared dwarves dont get the same thoughts, they just run.  So they need Discipline not to be struck immobile by the sights they see, and indifference to weather the morale hits.

And my haulers are all dabbler/novice discipline thanks to 4 goblin skeletons on a trunk hauling route, once in a while one will freeze but its my least disciplined guys as a rule and skills are trickling in.
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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2014, 12:36:03 pm »

Personality might play a part as well. For fighting dorfs look for those that are "brave in the face of danger".
Yes. Personality plays a huge part. I had a miner who was brave in the face of danger singlehandedly repel an assault of elf bandits. The elves had metal equipment and were at least somewhat hardened warriors. My miner only had her copper pick and a wood buckler and grand master skill in mining, with no discipline or any fighting experience. She killed 9 of the 10 elves and never got scared. She didn't even start crying. After the battle she was listed as "getting used to tragedy."

Her miner buddy, who was "cowardly at the slightest hint of danger" or something similar, and had the same lack of combat experience and only skill in mining, lost his shit and got terrified after he cut an elf's lower body open and spilled his guts. He killed the elf and then ran away until the fight was over. Then multiple times while hauling the corpses he became terrified and just lay on the ground until he calmed down.
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kingu

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Re: Will Urist flee or stand and fight?
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2014, 02:36:15 pm »

Personality might play a part as well. For fighting dorfs look for those that are "brave in the face of danger".
Yes. Personality plays a huge part. I had a miner who was brave in the face of danger singlehandedly repel an assault of elf bandits. The elves had metal equipment and were at least somewhat hardened warriors. My miner only had her copper pick and a wood buckler and grand master skill in mining, with no discipline or any fighting experience. She killed 9 of the 10 elves and never got scared. She didn't even start crying. After the battle she was listed as "getting used to tragedy."

Her miner buddy, who was "cowardly at the slightest hint of danger" or something similar, and had the same lack of combat experience and only skill in mining, lost his shit and got terrified after he cut an elf's lower body open and spilled his guts. He killed the elf and then ran away until the fight was over. Then multiple times while hauling the corpses he became terrified and just lay on the ground until he calmed down.

Yes this "-whatever- in the face of danger" is the BRAVERY I was talking about. (see pesonality or traits or something in the wiki) 
It seems vital at least when it comes to dwarfs without discipline.

I wonder if one trumps the other and if so at what level
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